Yes, sorry. Given the time of night my writing was not up to scratch. I meant that all old designs being revamped should be WR and QSF including the Limiteds.

+1 I'm with you there, Dan. Producing a range of DSLRs that are all WR, and even cheap WR kit lenses, while not upgrading the existing good lenses to be WR seems totally idiotic to me. I would have thought that these should sell at least as well as the Limiteds do now, and I'm sure there are many of us who are unwilling and/or unable to pay out for, and/or carry, the completely new huge lenses with huge prices, however good they might be.

Philip

Yes, especially as the DFA100WR is such an amazing lens. It has image quality, build quality, weather resistance, light weight, small size, and more! If they did that with the HD Limiteds I'd be out there buying them instead of second hand DA Limiteds. Regards,
Dan

One has to bear in mind that many who might buy any new ones are likely to already have one of the old ones. At around £700-£1400 per lens it would be an enormous outlay to upgrade them all and would be a huge gamble. It wouldn't really make sense to rush into doing them all. John K

Where does £700-£1400 come from? The SRS prices for the current HD DA Limiteds range from £359 for the 40mm to £567 for the 20-40 zoom. The latter is already WR, so why would it be suggested that prices of WR versions of the others (and including the the FA50 and FA35) would be beyond that range? Only the FA31 and FA77 WR would be justified in being that expensive, as they are now.

Producing a range of DSLRs that are all WR, and even cheap WR kit lenses, while not upgrading the existing good lenses to be WR seems totally idiotic to me. I would have thought that these should sell at least as well as the Limiteds do now, and I'm sure there are many of us who are unwilling and/or unable to pay out for, and/or carry, the completely new huge lenses with huge prices, however good they might be.

Philip

....and how much will a redesign of an existing lens eg. 31mm LTD, need to sell for to cover the development and tooling costs ? A lot more than the current price. Peter

MrB wrote: Where does £700-£1400 come from? The SRS prices for the current HD DA Limiteds range from £359 for the 40mm to £567 for the 20-40 zoom. The latter is already WR, so why would it be suggested that prices of WR versions of the others (and including the the FA50 and FA35) would be beyond that range? Only the FA31 and FA77 WR would be justified in being that expensive, as they are now.

Philip

I thought I was being optimistic and admit just a guestimate. Most of the new quality lenses seem to start at a four figure sum,. The new 50mm f1.4 went from a circa £300 lens to a £1200 lens. Admittedly it was a redesign but people are asking for a redesign of the whole range where some of the existing ones start north of £700 already. The HD PENTAX-FA 35mm f/2 lens seems to be coming in at around double the current model so what would one expect a new FA 31, 43, 77, 85* etc to start at?
(Edit: An HD DFA* 85mm f1.4 is on the latest roadmap for release this year.) John K

MrB wrote: Where does £700-£1400 come from? The SRS prices for the current HD DA Limiteds range from £359 for the 40mm to £567 for the 20-40 zoom. The latter is already WR, so why would it be suggested that prices of WR versions of the others (and including the the FA50 and FA35) would be beyond that range? Only the FA31 and FA77 WR would be justified in being that expensive, as they are now.

Philip

I thought I was being optimistic and admit just a guestimate. Most of the new quality lenses seem to start at a four figure sum,. The new 50mm f1.4 went from a circa £300 lens to a £1200 lens. Admittedly it was a redesign but people are asking for a redesign of the whole range where some of the existing ones start north of £700 already. The HD PENTAX-FA 35mm f/2 lens seems to be coming in at around double the current model so what would one expect a new FA 31, 43, 77, 85* etc to start at?
(Edit: An HD DFA* 85mm f1.4 is on the latest roadmap for release this year.)

The new version of the FA 35mm f2 is around £70 more than the old one at current SRS prices. And remember these are being designed for the full frame DSLRs with large sensors so owners (like myself) do not necessarily own the older ones. Another point is that a criticism generally of the K1 and K1 mk2 is the small number of new lenses available, and that the older lenses do not compare well with newer offerings; upgrading is a relatively quick and easy way to address these criticisms.

Another point is that a criticism generally of the K1 and K1 mk2 is the small number of new lenses available, and that the older lenses do not compare well with newer offerings; upgrading is a relatively quick and easy way to address these criticisms.

All recent modern lenses (or revamp in case of 35mm). What are the complainants missing ?

Plus the criticism of older lenses not comparing well with newer ones, just needs a search of the various Pentax forums to show that is not the case. On a bench test, yes perhaps they lack, but with a real subject in front of them they perform as good as they did on film. Have a look at glamour photographer "Le Rolls" over at the pentaxforums.com He exclusively uses the FA* 85mm 1.4 with the K1 Peter

Another point is that a criticism generally of the K1 and K1 mk2 is the small number of new lenses available, and that the older lenses do not compare well with newer offerings; upgrading is a relatively quick and easy way to address these criticisms.

All recent modern lenses (or revamp in case of 35mm). What are the complainants missing ?

Plus the criticism of older lenses not comparing well with newer ones, just needs a search of the various Pentax forums to show that is not the case. On a bench test, yes perhaps they lack, but with a real subject in front of them they perform as good as they did on film. Have a look at glamour photographer "Le Rolls" over at the pentaxforums.com He exclusively uses the FA* 85mm 1.4 with the K1

Producing a range of DSLRs that are all WR, and even cheap WR kit lenses, while not upgrading the existing good lenses to be WR seems totally idiotic to me. I would have thought that these should sell at least as well as the Limiteds do now, and I'm sure there are many of us who are unwilling and/or unable to pay out for, and/or carry, the completely new huge lenses with huge prices, however good they might be.

Philip

....and how much will a redesign of an existing lens eg. 31mm LTD, need to sell for to cover the development and tooling costs ? A lot more than the current price.

I have no idea but, having had a quick scan through the US Forum database for lenses that have been upgraded to WR in the past while retaining their optical design, I would guess that it should add no more than about 25% to the launch retail price of the revamped lens compared with the price of the current model. And the price could probably soon come back down, as we have seen happening for new lenses launched during recent years.

I think it would be great to be able to aim for a setup such as the KP + HD DA 20-40Ltd WR + HD DA 15Ltd WR + HD DA 70Ltd WR.

Another point is that a criticism generally of the K1 and K1 mk2 is the small number of new lenses available, and that the older lenses do not compare well with newer offerings; upgrading is a relatively quick and easy way to address these criticisms.

All recent modern lenses (or revamp in case of 35mm). What are the complainants missing ?

Plus the criticism of older lenses not comparing well with newer ones, just needs a search of the various Pentax forums to show that is not the case. On a bench test, yes perhaps they lack, but with a real subject in front of them they perform as good as they did on film. Have a look at glamour photographer "Le Rolls" over at the pentaxforums.com He exclusively uses the FA* 85mm 1.4 with the K1

I am not saying the criticism is right, but that is the perception and I have seen reviews where the cameras are rated as excellent but buyers are warned that the native and third party lens range is very limited compared to other brands so would be better looking elsewhere for FF options. Nikon and Canon for instance have far more FF lenses than APS-C lenses but no one compares the smaller format unfavourably to the Pentax offerings.

I am not saying the criticism is right, but that is the perception and I have seen reviews where the cameras are rated as excellent but buyers are warned that the native and third party lens range is very limited compared to other brands so would be better looking elsewhere for FF options.

I think this comes down to the reviewers who in general will have limited experience of Pentax as a brand. They are correct to say that 3rd party lenses are limited compared the two big name brands, but neglect to add that the vast range of lenses that Pentax have made since the 1970's are compatible including FA; FA*; and LTD range.

If a reviewer really thinks that the new lenses I listed are not enough to satisfy anyone thinking of getting a Pentax, they are not writing a balanced review.

But perhaps this is where Pentax are at fault in relying too heavily on their loyal Japanese base and not enough on trying to attract new users. Given the current state of the DSLR market a change in direction is not a decision to be taken lightly. Peter