It's a real shame for our country so many people are uninformed. Conservatives know they're misinformed and they don't care; no amount of information that contradicts their beliefs is going to make them change their minds. It's the independent, low-infor-mation voters who decide elections, and evidently, they're buying into the GOP lies. That's not good for our country. I feel sorry for young people. They don't have much of a future to look forward to.

Last edited by dbp on March 13th, 2014, 5:10 pm, edited 1 time in total.

dbp wrote:It's a real shame for our country so many people are uninformed. Conservatives know they're misinformed and they don't care; no amount of information that contradicts their beliefs is going to make them change their minds. It's the independent, thinking voters who decide elections, and evidently, they're buying into the GOP lies. That's not good for our country. I feel sorry for young people. They don't have much of a future to look forward to.

Yeah - "If you like your plan you can keep your plan" was just our imagination.

Why is Bammie delaying 42 separate provisions of law if this law is soooooooo great?

I know they don't fit on a bumper sticker - you'll actually have to READ these.

How quaint, the Heritage Foundation offering a replacement for their own original plan after it was adopted by the other party.

FTR, ACA is the closest we'll ever get to a free market alternative. It opened the market to new participants and providers, but health care still remains out of reach for millions. The only viable solution is a single payer plan that removes the insurance industry which only serves to drive up costs.

During times of universal deceit, telling the truth becomes a revolutionary act.Eric Arthur Blair (a.k.a. George Orwell)

Blue Nation wrote:It's a little easier to despise the GOP every day. They can't get any nastier than they've been since about 1994. Why would anyone care what they have to say?

Yes because freedom of choice without the government dictating how we should live and exactly how we should think is a nasty thing to you liberals who can't stand people improving their own lives. Liberals think its disgusting to work your way to what you want and can't believe they get resistance when they want to take the fruits of someones labor and give it to those that won't. Just horrible.

Greg Woods wrote:Will one of you Obamiacs tell us why if Obamcare is soooooooo wonderful, Emperor Bammie has used his Imperial Pen to issue waiver after waiver after waiver and why he has unilateral changed the law delaying the implementation of 42 separate provisions of this Glorious and wondrous law?

Can't speak for Obamiacs, but it's because it's a long way from perfect and Republicans wouldn't even consider a single payer plan, but it's a lot better than what we had. Similar to the way the majority feel about this administration compared with the last one.

During times of universal deceit, telling the truth becomes a revolutionary act.Eric Arthur Blair (a.k.a. George Orwell)

Blue Nation wrote:It's a little easier to despise the GOP every day. They can't get any nastier than they've been since about 1994. Why would anyone care what they have to say?

A lot of people wouldn't know what to think if they weren't told. That's evident from a lot of the posts here. They just regurgitate what Republicans and right-wing pundits tell them to think.

"Religion is an insult to human dignity. With or without religion, good people can behave well and bad people can do evil; but for good people to do evil — that takes religion."~ Steven Weinberg - Nobel laureate in Physics.

Blue Nation wrote:It's a little easier to despise the GOP every day. They can't get any nastier than they've been since about 1994. Why would anyone care what they have to say?

Yes because freedom of choice without the government dictating how we should live and exactly how we should think is a nasty thing to you liberals who can't stand people improving their own lives. Liberals think its disgusting to work your way to what you want and can't believe they get resistance when they want to take the fruits of someones labor and give it to those that won't. Just horrible.

Is that what we think? Far from it. We believe in work and self-reliance as much as anyone, but we also believe in the social contract as a means of protecting the least fortunate among us. We think the social contract ought to include healthcare, as it does in every other modern country. It's a simple moral question in addition to an economic one. Healthier people tend to be happier and more productive.

This country can easily afford the ACA; it can't afford to let the GOP reverse the progress already made.

Greg Woods wrote:Will one of you Obamiacs tell us why if Obamcare is soooooooo wonderful, Emperor Bammie has used his Imperial Pen to issue waiver after waiver after waiver and why he has unilateral changed the law delaying the implementation of 42 separate provisions of this Glorious and wondrous law?

Can't speak for Obamiacs, but it's because it's a long way from perfect and Republicans wouldn't even consider a single payer plan, but it's a lot better than what we had. Similar to the way the majority feel about this administration compared with the last one.

A registered Republican that believes this administration is better than the last one? Based on Obama's polling numbers I guess the majority doesn't feels that way. In addition I have a difficult time believing a registered Republican would consider putting the nation's health insurance in the hands of the government as being a good idea. I guess people can call themselves what ever they want.

Last edited by jgd777 on March 13th, 2014, 5:01 pm, edited 1 time in total.

"Our Constitution was made only for a moral and religious people. It is wholly inadequate to the government of any other." Oct 11 1798John Adams (Nation's 2nd President)

dbp wrote:It's a real shame for our country so many people are uninformed. *snip* I feel sorry for young people. They don't have much of a future to look forward to.

I agree. I wonder how many people see that Obamacare is yet another government action that maintains the lifestyle of the Baby Boomers at the expense of the Millennials...

The ACA will reduce that national debt by about a trillion dollars in twenty years. It will spare the millennials the indignity of going bankrupt because of medical bills or dying too soon because the care they need is out of reach. The baby boomers never had it so good.

I know they don't fit on a bumper sticker - you'll actually have to READ these.

"Bammie" is a blatantly racist term. You should be banned from posting.

"Religion is an insult to human dignity. With or without religion, good people can behave well and bad people can do evil; but for good people to do evil — that takes religion."~ Steven Weinberg - Nobel laureate in Physics.

I know they don't fit on a bumper sticker - you'll actually have to READ these.

How quaint, the Heritage Foundation offering a replacement for their own original plan after it was adopted by the other party.

FTR, ACA is the closest we'll ever get to a free market alternative. It opened the market to new participants and providers, but health care still remains out of reach for millions.

A free market is the economic expression of freedom. It means the sellers are free to sell what they want to the buyers, and buyers are free to purchase what they want from the sellers. A government that mandates what must be bought and sold, such as through Obamacare, is the destruction of that freedom.

The only viable solution is a single payer plan that removes the insurance industry which only serves to drive up costs.

A single payer system is, by definition, a government created and protected monopoly. And as a monopoly, it would have no incentive to control costs.

Last edited by artdeco on March 13th, 2014, 5:09 pm, edited 1 time in total.

“I'm not a dictator.” -- Barack Obama, March 2013“As a president, I can do whatever I want.” -- Barack Obama, February 2014

artdeco wrote:A single payer system is, by definition, a government created and protected monopoly. And as a monopoly, it would have no incentive to control costs.

Medicare is a single-payer system and operates at a 4% overhead. Some insurance companies operate at a 20% overhead.

Conservative logic is an oxymoron.

"Religion is an insult to human dignity. With or without religion, good people can behave well and bad people can do evil; but for good people to do evil — that takes religion."~ Steven Weinberg - Nobel laureate in Physics.

Blue Nation wrote:It's a little easier to despise the GOP every day. They can't get any nastier than they've been since about 1994. Why would anyone care what they have to say?

Yes; personal attacks, insults, "hate" and "despise" are ever the reactions of liberals' to all who dare to disagree with them. Any reasoned argument is out of the question.

Man, you can't be serious. The hate oozing from you people on the Right never lets up.

The words "hate" and "despise" are almost exclusive to the vocabulary of the left. As for the Right, disagreeing with another's ideology and policies does not conflate with hatred. You are wrong.

Ok, now you're just lying. You people are hilarious!

Well, according to you, I hate. I despise. And now I'm a liar.Just for laughs, what in the post to which you just responded do you think is a lie?You are validating my observation about the reaction of liberals to all who disagree with them.

I know they don't fit on a bumper sticker - you'll actually have to READ these.

How quaint, the Heritage Foundation offering a replacement for their own original plan after it was adopted by the other party.

FTR, ACA is the closest we'll ever get to a free market alternative. It opened the market to new participants and providers, but health care still remains out of reach for millions. The only viable solution is a single payer plan that removes the insurance industry which only serves to drive up costs.

A "free market" isn't based on forced participation.

Being forced into a market instead of having the choice to make of your own volition, the choice to participate or not, is the antithesis of a free market.

"The only people who don't want to disclose the truth are people with something to hide." (Barack Obama August 21, 2010)

Blue Nation wrote:It's a little easier to despise the GOP every day. They can't get any nastier than they've been since about 1994. Why would anyone care what they have to say?

Yes because freedom of choice without the government dictating how we should live and exactly how we should think is a nasty thing to you liberals who can't stand people improving their own lives. Liberals think its disgusting to work your way to what you want and can't believe they get resistance when they want to take the fruits of someones labor and give it to those that won't. Just horrible.

Is that what we think? Far from it. We believe in work and self-reliance as much as anyone, but we also believe in the social contract as a means of protecting the least fortunate among us. We think the social contract ought to include healthcare, as it does in every other modern country. It's a simple moral question in addition to an economic one. Healthier people tend to be happier and more productive.

This country can easily afford the ACA; it can't afford to let the GOP reverse the progress already made.

You also seem to believe that you have some superior right to force other people to live the way you want them to live instead of allowing them to live the way they choose to live.

This is not the first time in history this has happened, it has never resulted in a good ending and I rather doubt this will be the first time it it does.

"The only people who don't want to disclose the truth are people with something to hide." (Barack Obama August 21, 2010)

artdeco wrote:A single payer system is, by definition, a government created and protected monopoly. And as a monopoly, it would have no incentive to control costs.

Medicare is a single-payer system and operates at a 4% overhead. Some insurance companies operate at a 20% overhead.

Conservative logic is an oxymoron.

Medicare is not a single payer system, with Medicare the only one who are entitle to benefits have contributed to the program. Single payer is just another welfare program financed by "some" so "all" can enjoy the benefits.

BTW that 4% overhead, commonly referenced by liberals, does not include the 50 to 80 billion dollars in fraudulent claims, and waste that is lost every year. You also fail to mention Medicare denies a larger percentage of claims than any major private health insurance company.

"Our Constitution was made only for a moral and religious people. It is wholly inadequate to the government of any other." Oct 11 1798John Adams (Nation's 2nd President)

Blue Nation wrote:It's a little easier to despise the GOP every day. They can't get any nastier than they've been since about 1994. Why would anyone care what they have to say?

Yes because freedom of choice without the government dictating how we should live and exactly how we should think is a nasty thing to you liberals who can't stand people improving their own lives. Liberals think its disgusting to work your way to what you want and can't believe they get resistance when they want to take the fruits of someones labor and give it to those that won't. Just horrible.

Is that what we think? Far from it. We believe in work and self-reliance as much as anyone, but we also believe in the social contract as a means of protecting the least fortunate among us. We think the social contract ought to include healthcare, as it does in every other modern country. It's a simple moral question in addition to an economic one. Healthier people tend to be happier and more productive.

This country can easily afford the ACA; it can't afford to let the GOP reverse the progress already made.

"Social contract". In every contract I've seen, all parties involved have certain obligations to each other.

So, what are the contractual obligations of the receivers, the "least fortunate among us", in exchange for the benefits that the rest of us are supposed to provide them?

“I'm not a dictator.” -- Barack Obama, March 2013“As a president, I can do whatever I want.” -- Barack Obama, February 2014