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From the Erudite Pennsylvania Lefty (EPL) comes another demo of 'falling on the sword':

First, there is little question in my mind that the voices of the man and woman are voice overs. The tonal quality of their recorded comments is completely different from the tonal quality of the voices of the counselors, suggesting both a different microphone and a different recording environment.

Second, If you ignore the comments by the couple, the comments by the workers become much harder to criticize.

The question, in my mind, is whether or not the tapes are fabricated with questions and comments by the couple that are different from those shown in the films. I'm not stating this as a conclusion. In fact, my more devilish side sort of hopes the tapes are real. However, if they are real, the producer should be able to provide an unedited version without voice overs. I suspect that is something that will not surface quickly and, if it does, will not find its way onto FOX unless it is part of a legal settlement for libel.

How reminiscent this is of the accusations by the right when Dan Rather was reporting his tripe about Bush...AND THE LEFT HAD A COW!!! We were, of course, accused of beating the messenger.

Now the 'messenger' has film for corroberation...you know like that sting of Marion Barry when he was caught.... but the EPL is positive it is phoney.

Are you also part of the cabal of believers that 9/11 was an inside job?

Tell me how often you are willing to be wounded for this batch of corrupt hoodlums/gangsters/& thugs before you come to your senses? I doubt you ever will. My guess is, had you been in DC at the time of Barry's re-election run, you would have been championing him as well.

As stated earlier, you are beyond hope. I can only wish you will live long enough to see what it is you and your ilk have done to this nation. As you continue to fight for the shredding of the US Constitution by your incredulous blind support of the fascism being exercised by this current batch of CZARS and their almighty leader, just remember, your grandchildren will be holding you responsible for their plight in the ensuing years. Must make you proud.

UB

When the one you love becomes a memory, that memory becomes a treasure.

From the Erudite Pennsylvania Lefty (EPL) comes another demo of 'falling on the sword':

First, there is little question in my mind that the voices of the man and woman are voice overs. The tonal quality of their recorded comments is completely different from the tonal quality of the voices of the counselors, suggesting both a different microphone and a different recording environment.

Second, If you ignore the comments by the couple, the comments by the workers become much harder to criticize.

The question, in my mind, is whether or not the tapes are fabricated with questions and comments by the couple that are different from those shown in the films. I'm not stating this as a conclusion. In fact, my more devilish side sort of hopes the tapes are real. However, if they are real, the producer should be able to provide an unedited version without voice overs. I suspect that is something that will not surface quickly and, if it does, will not find its way onto FOX unless it is part of a legal settlement for libel.

How reminiscent this is of the accusations by the right when Dan Rather was reporting his tripe about Bush...AND THE LEFT HAD A COW!!! We were, of course, accused of beating the messenger.

Now the 'messenger' has film for corroberation...you know like that sting of Marion Barry when he was caught.... but the EPL is positive it is phoney.

Are you also part of the cabal of believers that 9/11 was an inside job?

Tell me how often you are willing to be wounded for this batch of corrupt hoodlums/gangsters/& thugs before you come to your senses? I doubt you ever will. My guess is, had you been in DC at the time of Barry's re-election run, you would have been championing him as well.

As stated earlier, you are beyond hope. I can only wish you will live long enough to see what it is you and your ilk have done to this nation. As you continue to fight for the shredding of the US Constitution by your incredulous blind support of the fascism being exercised by this current batch of CZARS and their almighty leader, just remember, your grandchildren will be holding you responsible for their plight in the ensuing years. Must make you proud.

UB

UB,

Did you actually watch/listen to the tapes? I could care less about ACORN and got a kick out of the films, as I noted when they first was reported. However, my comments stand. I believe they are suspect. It would be pretty easy to prove their authenticity. I doubt that the producer will do that but would love to see it happen. Personally, I doubt that you care whether the tapes are honest or not as long as they skewer an organization you hate.

ACORN is just another great big boogeyman for the right to keep the base rallied. Nice little witch hunt or stellar investigative reporting depending on your point of view. If laws are broken, hold them accountable.

If they are so powerful, could someone point to the legislation that they have ever influenced in Congress, the political candidates that seek or get their endorsement, or how much they spend on lobbying annually? As Jeff pointed out, the organization has been around for almost 40 years. Answering these questions should be easy. Then, for kicks, let's compare their record on influencing policy to other organizations and compare their power.

And ACORN is getting $8 billion in porkulus money. Bend over here comes the change!

Bob,

Can you point to any authoritative source for that statement (e.g. legislation mentioning ACORN or Federal grants received)? As far as I can determine, and Road Kill says he found the same, there is absolutely no basis for a lie that has circulated widely in conservative blogs and talk shows.

ACORN is talking about suing FOX and the two film makers for manufacturing the scenes. FOX says they had nothing to do with making the film. The traditional blogs that vet these films seem to be silent. Further, although ACORN claims the films are untrue, the first response was the firing of the folks....first in Baltimore and now in Washington.

Film of another site (New York) was made available today. The report is that there are even more cities to come.

I frankly hope the FOX News folks are really quick. Their lawyers should be at the courthouse this morning filing a counter-claim. That way ACORN can't withdraw the suit when FOX News files the discovery motions.

So Jeff do you approve of prostitution, pay for sex with underage girls, aiding undocumented aliens and tax evasion and lying on legal documents ? All this advice from a organization that receives federal money?

ACORN is just another great big boogeyman for the right to keep the base rallied. Nice little witch hunt or stellar investigative reporting depending on your point of view. If laws are broken, hold them accountable.

If they are so powerful, could someone point to the legislation that they have ever influenced in Congress, the political candidates that seek or get their endorsement, or how much they spend on lobbying annually? As Jeff pointed out, the organization has been around for almost 40 years. Answering these questions should be easy. Then, for kicks, let's compare their record on influencing policy to other organizations and compare their power.

ACORN is talking about suing FOX and the two film makers for manufacturing the scenes. FOX says they had nothing to do with making the film. The traditional blogs that vet these films seem to be silent. Further, although ACORN claims the films are untrue, the first response was the firing of the folks....first in Baltimore and now in Washington.

Film of another site (New York) was made available today. The report is that there are even more cities to come.

I frankly hope the FOX News folks are really quick. Their lawyers should be at the courthouse this morning filing a counter-claim. That way ACORN can't withdraw the suit when FOX News files the discovery motions.

Eric

On the New York tape, it is very clear that the tax adviser is talking about filing tax returns to report income from prostitution and vehicles that would allow the prostitute to pay the cost of the mortgage to her boyfriend while concealing the relationship between them. There is no indication in the tape that there was any discussion of underage girls or illegal aliens. It also seems that the advice given was legal and consistent with tax code. As a matter of interest, am I the only one who believes that prostitutes should pay income taxes and that a legitimate tax adviser should tell them how to do this legally? Just asking.

In what ways specifically did they influence this election compared to other organizations? I know that they had voter turn out campaigns like many other organizations. Is that their big influence? Has it been quantified and compared to previous years? Voter registration and getting out the vote efforts, is that it? You do know that political parties and many other organizations have a long history of these efforts.

What about the other questions I asked. You have done some research on the organization. Who are their lobbyists in DC? How much do they spend? What is their policy agenda for this legislative session? What legislation are they proposing and influencing? What politicians are seeking their endorsement or are they fundraising for? What government positions do their former lobbyists hold and visa versa? If they are so politically powerful at a national level they must have a clear record on these things.