noah_ther wrote:Dude... that shiz was CRAZY!! I saw everything and the guy never touched Ronin. If anything I think Ronin took it too far... I think SOMEBODY was "living his gimmick". Yeah I understand he's a heel, but guys like Super Dragon are apparently known for that kind of stuff, Ronin tryin' to become SD Jr. by doing the same is just weird. I think Mighty Morphin Ronin Ranger just went a little too far and was waiting for the fan to do anything that might give him any kind of possible opening for whoopin' him. Besides, I agree that fans should be able to say what they want to the wrestlers if the wrestlers can say what they want to the fans. I saw Ronin spit on one fan a few shows ago, the big Aussie dude I think.

Look, in pro sports if a fan is heckling an athlete and he goes into the stand to push him, punch him, or pour coke on him, he's suspended and fined. Granted, PWG isn't MLB or the NBA, but still there is a line. I can tell you that the fan didn't touch Ronin and waving your hat to get the water off of it and brushing it against someone's arm doesn't necessitate you gettin' all UFC on someone. I dunno, I love PWG and all, but too many fans are just giving all the wrestlers a free pass for anything they do now. Like, don't boo a wrestler b/c then he can physically acost you. Don't boo a wrestler or throw a hat near him because he can douse you with water and punch you in the eye. Geeez. I guess if things don't happen to YOU then you shouldn't care right? I mean, if Super Dragon or Ronin decided to actually pull down their pants and piss on a fan who is booing them then it's justified right?

Eh, who am I kidding, I guess if no one cares about kickin' a handicapped girl's wheel chair, no one cares if Ronin goes shoot fighting on a fan. Then again...CHris Hero is the MAN, that fool came out of no where and i SWEAR he had that dude in a Cobra Clutch to kick him out of the gym.

I have to whole heartedly agree with noah_ther. Ronin seems to be acting like a mini Super Dragon. If you pay attention to how Ronin treats Nemesis in the ring it's very simliar to how Super Dragon treates Davey. Nemesis is slapped around and scolded just like Davey. Poor guys, I know of a shelter they can go to.

Ronin spit at an audience member, kicked a a lady in her wheelchair, and now physically got involve with an audience member. I would not be surprised if "Fred' did not return. I recall the incident when Steen made the racial remarks and after geting some heat, PWG issued an official apology. PWG can apologize or at least talk about what the line is between a shoot and a work. So I know PWG can issues apologies. I'm not sure if they will with this one since they may or may not side with Ronin to protect their employees.

After seeing one guy get soda thrown at him by Super Dragon and seeing the guy next to me get spit on by Ronin, I'm sad to say that I feel silent. I no longer feel comfortable to express my feelings against these heels. Heels are suppose to be booed at. Can I boo at someone without being scared I'm going to get slapped around?

On a legal standpoint, it's definetly assault and battery. I'm sorry to hear Fred got a swollen jaw. Fred is at fault for heckling. I'm not sure if he touched Ronin. If he did, then yes, he has to claim some responsibility. If he didn't then he's not at fault. However, Ronin should carry the responsibility weight. He represents PWG, he gets paid by us, and there should be no way for audience members to be scared for putting a heel over by heckling.

noah_ther wrote:Dude... that shiz was CRAZY!! I saw everything and the guy never touched Ronin. If anything I think Ronin took it too far... I think SOMEBODY was "living his gimmick". Yeah I understand he's a heel, but guys like Super Dragon are apparently known for that kind of stuff, Ronin tryin' to become SD Jr. by doing the same is just weird. I think Mighty Morphin Ronin Ranger just went a little too far and was waiting for the fan to do anything that might give him any kind of possible opening for whoopin' him. Besides, I agree that fans should be able to say what they want to the wrestlers if the wrestlers can say what they want to the fans. I saw Ronin spit on one fan a few shows ago, the big Aussie dude I think.

Look, in pro sports if a fan is heckling an athlete and he goes into the stand to push him, punch him, or pour coke on him, he's suspended and fined. Granted, PWG isn't MLB or the NBA, but still there is a line. I can tell you that the fan didn't touch Ronin and waving your hat to get the water off of it and brushing it against someone's arm doesn't necessitate you gettin' all UFC on someone. I dunno, I love PWG and all, but too many fans are just giving all the wrestlers a free pass for anything they do now. Like, don't boo a wrestler b/c then he can physically acost you. Don't boo a wrestler or throw a hat near him because he can douse you with water and punch you in the eye. Geeez. I guess if things don't happen to YOU then you shouldn't care right? I mean, if Super Dragon or Ronin decided to actually pull down their pants and piss on a fan who is booing them then it's justified right?

Eh, who am I kidding, I guess if no one cares about kickin' a handicapped girl's wheel chair, no one cares if Ronin goes shoot fighting on a fan. Then again...CHris Hero is the MAN, that fool came out of no where and i SWEAR he had that dude in a Cobra Clutch to kick him out of the gym.

Beautiful post. I think >95% of the fans feel like you do but anytime someone says something controversial around here they get attacked by 2 or 3 vocal posters. I can only speculate but I think some of the people who think it is ok only say those things because they want the wrestlers to like them and be their friends. Sorta like wrestler groupies.

Ok, as someone who saw something I think I should comment. First of all, any blame being placed on Ronin should not be placed at all. I was sitting in the section on the left near the light rig and entrance way and got a clear view of what happend. What happend was Ronin was acting like a heel, some fan tried to act tough, he got what was coming to him. Ronin's actions at first came off as comedy, but the guy slapped him first and Ronin barely slapped him hard enough to do any damage and didn't even get many hits in on the guy. If the guy got a swollen jaw, he's either a big time pussy or he got fucked up on the way home because there is no way Ronin did enough to do that much damage to the guy. Also, the guy looked like his was either drunk or high on drugs.

And the stuff being brought up in this thread makes me sick of being a PWG fan. I've been going to shows for a long time and fans have always had good times and such, but now there seems to be a hybrid core of jackasses in the crowd and people who bitch and complain on this board. All this talk about being afraid to boo in nonsense. People boo Ronin and Dragon, but there have been no incidents like this until a fan did something to a wrestler. Lately, fans have become more annoying and more arrogant when shouting stupid shit and have been trying to make themselves parts of the shows.

Another funny thing here is how fans are coming on complaining about wrestlers acting a certain way to fans(which isn't even a real issue, it's just crybabies being overdramatic over spilled milk) yet they're the same people who go around making up shit about wrestlers and start topics dedicated trying to ALIENATE FANS from coming to shows because of the way they dress or act. It's threads like these that make me hate a lot of the fans on this board and people at shows who would rather make themselves the show at the expense of the hard work people like Dragon, Disco, Joey, Scott, Topgun, and Excalibur put into this company just so they can give you fans the best shows possible to enjoy only for all that to mean nothing because you people would rather bitch about stupid shit like wrestlers trying to defend themselves from fans who attack them. I think from now on I'm going to just buy DVDs rather than going to live shows and to have to deal with you people anymore.

You people bitch about Ronin, but his actions where nothing compared to the shit Bruiser Brody did or the stuff that goes on in Mexico or that has gone on in Japan.

One more point I have to make:

Then again...CHris Hero is the MAN, that fool came out of no where and i SWEAR he had that dude in a Cobra Clutch to kick him out of the gym.

This is funny. Chris Hero is the man for taking action, yet you condem Ronin in the same post for taking much needed action. On a side note, Chris Hero also beat up a fan last week after the fan tried to act tough and crossed the line. Bravo to Ronin and Chris Hero for being upstanding citizens in the professional wrestling world.

This isn't going to be resolved any time soon. I actually wish they had taped this for PWG and shown it on the website like RoH does. Everyone has different accounts and to me it looked like he might have hit Ronin with his hat or he was trying to shake the water off his hat onto Ronin. Either way, Ronin had ample opportunity to walk away. The fan shouldn't have thrown his hat at Ronin and if he did, should not have walked to the ring to get it. Ronin shouldn't have provoked him and to ME it didn't look like "defending himself" more like, "teaching him a lesson". There is an unwritten rule about this kinda stuff that maybe should be written. My take is that neither party is at 100% fault but just because you get in the ring doesn't mean all your actions are automatically absolved when you are at a show. I love going to shows, but there comes a time when you have to wonder when you as a fan cross the line. Is it booing? Is it standing up to boo, is it standing up and booing a wrestler when he walks by? Fact of the matter is, these guys get paid, making them "professionals" and there is no reason for a "professional" to physically attack a "customer". Because I don't think a hat swipe and a full on face pummeling is the same. Ronin straight clocked that dude when he wasn't looking to fight then jumped on him and kept punching him. I'mma give Ronin Ranger the benefit of the doubt and say it was just a bad case of momentary rage but we'll see what the "Hey Kool Aid" ranger does in a month.

Oh and as far as homeboy who doesn't want to rob us of his prescence at another show? Wow, that sucks... I feel this empty place in my soul now where you won't be at the show anymore.

Oh...and Chris Hero never took a swing at the guy, he was the only guy to step in to break it up. There goes Hero again, to save us citizens from a Mighty Morphin ass whoopin'. Looks like Ronin found his cheap heat now... like he needed it. I think a better response to booing him is to just sit down and not react at all or just turn your back on him. Now THAT would suck as a heel, just zero reaction.

Well all appreciate the wrestlers and owners, we just don't appreciate a big Red butt whoopin'.

SoCalAndy wrote:You're obviously retarded because what Ronin did was nowhere near a "full on face pummeling" and the hat thing was not ever a "swipe". Hell, Ronin didn't even get any clean shots in on the guy's face.

If you want an example of a real beatdown, I'll give you one. Now this right here is an example of a real beatdown. What Ronin did was nothing compared to that as Ronin barely did anything to the guy.

Damn, what's up with PWG fans calling everyone retarded? I mean an IQ of 65 is normal right? Right?? It was a hat swipe and Ronin got one good shot at the dude then tackled him and laid in some blows, not like Mike Tyson Punchout or anything but a few decent ones. Hmmm... maybe Ronin should use that as his next gimmick? Have a big Black X on his stomach and wear a crown. But I digress. I think it's cute when you ask me if I want a real beatdown though. I love idle threats on Indy message boards. But I tell you what, we can "discuss" this over at the MTV tapings if you're going, I'll bring my nunchucks and bo staff...cuz' i'm pretty good with a bo staff. Point being, yes Ronin could have gone all Fit Finlay on him but even the one punch was just more than I think was needed when he could have walked away. But damn, that dude got HELLA jacked in that video, that one guy looked like a slightly chubbier D-von Dudley in that video...damn Brutha D-von.

oh damn just re-read socal andy's post and just realized it wasn't a threat to give me a beatdown, u were just showin' me the video...whoops my bad. Damn, watchin' wrestling really DOES make people more violent. But I would really love to see a shoot fight of pwg fans outside the JCC one day, let's say "Hardy Fan" vs "Indiana Tard Boy", winner gets their own interview segment with Bosh and Lost on the next dvd.

noah_ther wrote:But I would really love to see a shoot fight of pwg fans outside the JCC one day, let's say "Hardy Fan" vs "Indiana Tard Boy", winner gets their own interview segment with Bosh and Lost on the next dvd.

noah_ther wrote:oh damn just re-read socal andy's post and just realized it wasn't a threat to give me a beatdown, u were just showin' me the video...whoops my bad. Damn, watchin' wrestling really DOES make people more violent.

Man, I guess I should have skipped the trip to Vegas for the Super Bowl and attended "When Wrestler's Attack!!!" instead. I'm certainly no puss, and I have no problem with stupid fans getting shown up at shows, but actually PUNCHING a fan is idiotic. In the day, guys like Freddie Blassie used to get battery acid poured on them, batteries thrown at them and in Blassie's case, STABBED!! They didn't punch fans. So you fans that want to take your indy idol worship to the extreme by defending a bottom level mid-carder are in the wrong. Who did what first is completely irrelevant, you don't attack the fans, period. Especially when you are Ronin? Who? Exactly... Don't be a dick, walk away and be a bigger man. Goddamn.

HeartPunch33 wrote:Man, I guess I should have skipped the trip to Vegas for the Super Bowl and attended "When Wrestler's Attack!!!" instead. I'm certainly no puss, and I have no problem with stupid fans getting shown up at shows, but actually PUNCHING a fan is idiotic. In the day, guys like Freddie Blassie used to get battery acid poured on them, batteries thrown at them and in Blassie's case, STABBED!! They didn't punch fans. So you fans that want to take your indy idol worship to the extreme by defending a bottom level mid-carder are in the wrong. Who did what first is completely irrelevant, you don't attack the fans, period. Especially when you are Ronin? Who? Exactly... Don't be a dick, walk away and be a bigger man. Goddamn.

The fan hit Ronin first. I was filming on the hard cam and had a clear view on the LCD. The fan hit Ronin first and Ronin reacted within his rights.

As for people being afraid to boo which is what I've heard commented in this thread...

...thats just idiotic. Everyone needs to realize that the wrestlers will not attack you in any way unless you do so to them first. I've had occassions where some of the guys will shove me around, but thats because they know me, and they know that I'm cool with it.

In regards to the jackasses that are starting to attend, I agree. At this past show I had a hard time filming because I was holding back the urge to tell all the guys sitting in the back sections next to me to "shut the fuck up and show a little respect." If you are paying 20 bucks to come and see a wrestling show why do you insist on talking through the whole thing and not paying attention? I understand if you want to hassle the wrestlers & boo them, but some people are very serious when they try to bitch out the wrestlers. They literally try to start fights but most of them are a bunch of pussies and too afraid to start a fight themselves. As for the drunks. I've had to deal with a lot of drunk people at the shows causing problems or who are gonna cause problems. Everyone should give a thanks to Andrew's dad. Back during the Astonishing X-Mas Guerrilla Warfare match he grabbed a chair out of a drunk fans hands as he was about to throw/swing it at Dragon. All through the rest of the match this drunk A-hole kept on muttering about how he wanted to punch Dragon.

One issue with PWG becoming more and more popular is that it is attracting a lot of fans who really don't have a lot of respect or sympathy for the wrestlers and as a result we got shit like this Ronin situation.

HeartPunch33 wrote:Man, I guess I should have skipped the trip to Vegas for the Super Bowl and attended "When Wrestler's Attack!!!" instead. I'm certainly no puss, and I have no problem with stupid fans getting shown up at shows, but actually PUNCHING a fan is idiotic. In the day, guys like Freddie Blassie used to get battery acid poured on them, batteries thrown at them and in Blassie's case, STABBED!! They didn't punch fans. So you fans that want to take your indy idol worship to the extreme by defending a bottom level mid-carder are in the wrong. Who did what first is completely irrelevant, you don't attack the fans, period. Especially when you are Ronin? Who? Exactly... Don't be a dick, walk away and be a bigger man. Goddamn.

They were filming that scene?? DOPE!! Put that on the next DVD as an extra and i swear I'll buy 2 copies. Either that or post that on the main page so we can put all of this speculation to rest. Cuz' my vantage point I saw a hat swipe and that was all, if someone saw the dude punch of actually slap him with his hand... then that's less borderline.

Damn it people...don't you see what's happening? We're talking about Ronin now on the board. He's going to get legitimate heat now and a crowd reaction? Because once you start giving Ronin a legit reaction...that my friends, is when the terrorists win.

Or not.

All I know is, this was probably just a set up by the Kool Aid ranger to turn mega heel and maybe...just... maybe get out of the opening match cycle he's been stuck in and get a 2nd match spot. But I do gotta admit... that ring gear is an actual upgrade, but not by much. Btw, SoCalAndy, watching that video makes me wanna go out and punch a 12 year old now...thanks alot. Just hopefully not the 12 year old Joey Ryan is dating at the time.

Someone mentioned Ronin punched the fan in the face when he wasn't looking or something to that effect, but Ronin really more like gave him a stiff slap and then was on top of him punching him but not in the face. Point is the fan was wrong for what he did and Ronin was within his rights. People should not be afraid to boo wrestlers, its fine to boo and heckle but if you get physical then expect repercussions.