Horror story......
- page 6

A cause for concern. Thank God most places do thorough background checks........
Albany/Schenectady, NY... Read More

Nov 16, '02

Basline..

I agree. It's time to.....

Nov 16, '02

Susy, I referred you to the original bills. We already discussed this. You already made your concern, and I answered that concern with the reference to the law. You might read the Acts in their entirety. Let's move on, shall we? I think you're posting so fast that you aren't taking the time to really read the laws. That's OK, we all get passionate about our points of view.

Peace!

Nov 16, '02

Youda, one last comment before this thread takes its turn, and that is that your reference to the law wasn't adequate with what we were really referring to. Edited to clarify: Tracy and I are concerned with illegally gaining access to one's files. There is no law currently that allows for that, and nothing in your link demonstrates this - as it is illegal. IF the Homeland Security Bill is a reality - THEN you could argue, but until then, it's illegal. Plain and simple.

Last edit by Susy K on Nov 16, '02

Nov 16, '02

I have heard on the local news that this nurse not only downloaded the kiddie porn, but then in turn posted it on his own website. The National Clearinghouse for missing and exploited children routinely surfs the web looking for kiddie porn, hence that is how he was caught - when they saw it, they reported it to the police.

Innocent until proven guilty? I dont see how he could explain that away, it seems fairly cut and dry to me. A person could not MISTAKENLY post it to their own website......

I worked with this nurse in 2000, and I would NEVER, EVER, EVER have guessed this about him. He was always a good nurse, and everyone liked working with him. I guess that goes to prove you cannot ever be sure about ANYONE....

Nov 16, '02

Originally posted by Susy K Heather,

Scary. That could happen to MY husband. Sorry, but having files of child porn on your computer is not indicative of pedophila, in my opinion.

No, but passing it on to others as it states in the article sure does indicate that he knew what he was downloading and was sharing it with other freaks who were interested in it. Doesn't sound like "accidental downloading" to me. And sorry, but if downloading porn on your computer puts you in the precarious position of possibly being targeted for being a pedophile, then why do it?

Nov 16, '02

Originally posted by lgflamini@msn.c And sorry, but if downloading porn on your computer puts you in the precarious position of possibly being targeted for being a pedophile, then why do it?

Because we're not pedophiles, we don't run a website with links to kiddie porn, and currently the law protects us from someone hacking into our webserver which is NOT publicly displayed, and viewing our files. And also, it's our right to download porn if we choose.

Besides, that's like stating that we realize that being Muslim may make you possibly being targeted for terrorism, so why practice Muslim? I don't agree with that position.

In effect, if this nurse went to a website and downloaded kiddie porn, and also ran a public website in which he was sharing files, then that is legit in catching him. But until we knew that information, it was scary to think that someone may have illegally obtained access to his computer.

Nov 16, '02

That is exactly the point I was trying to make earlier on this thread. To quote myself: " The authorities that are working on this particular case are experts in their field. They know the difference between someone inadvertanly getting someithing off a newsgroup and someone who is doing FTP through thier own computer program and uploading files to a server or newsgroup on the internet." FTP is file transfer protocol and is when you upload pictures, documents, and other items directly from your computer files onto a server and is used for updating web sites. It is done manually and intentionally. They wouldn't have arrested this guy if they didn't have the evidence to nail him.

To Suzy K, In light of these times and technological capabilities of our government, I think you are playing with fire. Doing things that others find offensive in our society comes with risks. Laws change and when they do, the authorities like to make examples out of someone. You have said too much imo already right here on this BB. I have no qualms about what you do in the privacy of your home and expect the same level of privacy in my own home. BUT, when you do certain activities that would be questionable by society, you are outwardly allowing yourself to be at risk. In other words, don't do it on the front lawn and if you do, then expect the possible consequences. To maintain your privacy, you must protect yourself by being diligent in hiding your activities from others. Posting on BB's, using FTP, the internet, and even newsgroups, email, use of cell phones, and even your wireless phone in your own home are not private activities and you should not believe the law would stand behind you when the activity includes things that are illegal. Please don't think I'm attacking you, b/c that is not my intention. Only trying to give you a different point of view and imo, a valid warning.

Nov 16, '02

Originally posted by Susy K Because we're not pedophiles, we don't run a website with links to kiddie porn, and currently the law protects us from someone hacking into our webserver which is NOT publicly displayed, and viewing our files. And also, it's our right to download porn if we choose.

Besides, that's like stating that we realize that being Muslim may make you possibly being targeted for terrorism, so why practice Muslim? I don't agree with that position.

No offense, but I don't equate someone's affinity for porn to a choice in religious practice. Also, it's hard to make an argument in regard to one's right to PRIVACY in relation downloading porn while discussing it openly on a PUBLIC message board. If you're not afraid to discuss it here, then why do you care who accesses your porn activity? Not a judgement thing, but my feeling is that if you're not doing anything questionable, then who cares what Big Brother sees? I understand that it's one's right to look at porn, but it's a form of entertainment- why is it SO important to adamently defend it? If you have to defend your form of entertainment so vehemently, doesn't it lead you to question why it's so great? Go buy porn at the magazine rack if privacy is such an issue.

Nov 16, '02

I don't care who accesses my porn activity, and I don't care that I discuss it HERE. That is my choice to post this information publically. I am referring to HACKING, illegally, into my computer and viewing its contents. And THAT is not "doing it on my front lawn" as another poster suggested.

Hacking is illegal. We can't hack into Citibank's server and obtain financial info; we can't hack into school's servers and obtain student records. THIS is what I was referring to. If I have my files viewable and accessible by the PUBLIC, on a public forum or on a public website - that's one thing. But the difference is, if you HACK into my computer, via the back door, that is illegal and any information you obtain via that means is/should be invalid. So, I wasn't questioning the information obtained about this guy, I was concerned on HOW it was obtained.

Currently, as it stands, even if I HAD kiddie porn on my server, the point is no one can access those files and see that activity without doing so illegally. So I am not concerned about my discussion about it here.

This really is a pretty simple concept, IMHO. For the same reason you can't enter my home and go through my bookshelf, and then use that information against me, is the same reason you can't enter my server, go through my files and use that information against me. What is there not to understand?

This is not about the validity of porn. This is not about the problem with child porn. This was about a concern that a few of us had about governmental agencies HACKING into our computers at will. It is no different than entering your home without a search warrant and just cause.

Last edit by Susy K on Nov 16, '02

Nov 16, '02

Originally posted by lgflamini@msn.c No offense, but I don't equate someone's affinity for porn to a choice in religious practice.

You missed the point entirely. You asked why would someone do anything that could possibly align them with unscrupulous behavior or practices, and that rationale I don't agree with. That would very well be the same thing as telling people not to outwardly practice Muslim because of the possibly of the alignment it has with terrorism, as of late. That is what I was trying to say.

Nov 16, '02

Suzy K,
To clarify: I don't care who accesses my porn activity, and I don't care that I discuss it HERE. That is my choice to post this information publically. I am referring to HACKING, illegally, into my computer and viewing its contents. And THAT is not "doing it on my front lawn" as another poster suggested.
I was referring to the use of newsgroups. Not someone hacking into your system.
And I gotta ask, Do you own your own server?

Nov 16, '02

Susy, again no offence intended; you have a naive belief that your "privacy" protects you from discovery when engaging in criminal activity; or that law enforcement cannot use whatever means available to investigate criminal activity such as child pornography.

I have referred you to the actual legislation and asked you to read it in its entirety. Since you have not done this, I will post it here so that your mistaken ideas can be clarified for others.

HR 850, Security And Freedom through Encryption (SAFE) Act makes it illegal to attempt to hide criminal activity on computers through the use of encryption or any other means. This law also gives law enforcement the power and authority to intercept or investigate, search and seize such material, and allows the use of any criminal material to be used as evidence to prosecute the offender.

HR 3494, Protection of Children From Sexual Predators Act of 1998, makes a duty to report by any ISP that obtains knowledge of facts or circumstances from which a violation of child pornography laws. Although I would not attempt to interpret the laws, your admission of storing child pornography on this BB could make allnurses required to report you to the appropriate law enforcement agencies.

HR 4123 states, `(a) Any person who--

`(1) knowingly mails, or transports or ships in interstate or foreign commerce by any means, including by computer, any child pornography ;

`(2) knowingly receives or distributes--

`(A) any child pornography that has been mailed, or shipped or transported in interstate or foreign commerce by any means, including by computer; or

`(B) any material that contains child pornography that has been mailed, or shipped or transported in interstate or foreign commerce by any means, including by computer;

And further . . .

`(B) knowingly possesses 3 or more books, magazines, periodicals, films, videotapes, or other material which contain any visual depiction of child pornography , or any book, magazine, periodical, film, videotape, computer disk, or any other material that contains 3 or more images of child pornography that has been mailed, or shipped or transported in interstate or foreign commerce by any means, including by computer, or that was produced using materials that have been mailed, or shipped or transported in interstate or foreign commerce by any means, including by computer,

And, you should pay particular attention to SEC. 7. PRIVACY PROTECTION ACT AMENDMENTS which ammends that Act to make exceptions to your privacy if the offense involves the production, possession, receipt, mailing, sale, distribution, shipment, or transportation of child pornography , the sexual exploitation of children, or the sale or purchase of children under section 2251, 2251A, 2252, 2252A, or 2252B of title 18, United States Code'; and

(2) in subsection (b)(1), by inserting before the parenthesis at the end the following: `, or if the offense involves the production, possession, receipt, mailing, sale, distribution, shipment, or transportation of child pornography , the sexual exploitation of children, or the sale or purchase of children under section 2251, 2251A, 2252, 2252A, or 2252B of title 18, United States Code'.

And you have violated the statutes if you . . .Sec. 2252B. Certain activities relating to material depicting the sexual exploitation of minors

`(a) Any person who--

`(1) knowingly mails, or transports or ships in interstate or foreign commerce by any means, including by computer, any visual depiction, if such visual depiction has been created, adapted, or modified to appear that an identifiable minor is engaged in sexually explicit conduct;

`(2) knowingly receives or distributes any visual depiction or any material that contains a visual depiction that has been mailed, or shipped or transported in interstate or foreign commerce by any means, including by computer, if such visual depiction has been created, adapted, or modified to appear that an identifiable minor is engaged in sexually explicit conduct;

`(3) knowingly reproduces any visual depiction for distribution through the mails, or in interstate or foreign commerce by any means, including by computer, if such visual depiction has been created, adapted, or modified to appear that an identifiable minor is engaged in sexually explicit conduct;

Again, Susy, I would encourage you to educate yourself before attempting to argue a point. To summarize, your "entertainment" whether done in the privacy of your own home or on the front lawn, if it includes criminal activity, your "privacy" is not protected. As with any criminal activity, even a Hacker who stumbles upon your cache of porn, and who reports that to law enforcement and has reason to believe a crime is being committed, and an investigation ensues, I'm sure you could sue the hacker in civil court for violating your "privacy" but you would still go to jail. BTW: the minimum sentence is 15 years.

Originally posted by woundnurse Had my son (hes over 18), a few months ago use my computer and guess what he down loaded. I got it cleaned up but still receive very x-rated e-mails on a daily basis... Not fun but only way I can think to eliminate is to change my e-mail address... needless to say son is not allowed to use computer

Would hate to think someone thinks I'm asking for this "stuff". PS most don't have ways to get off their lists either.....

justa tip..even if they offer a link to go to, or offer the option of sending an email to take you off of their lists, all that does is confirm that they have a valid email address....
also, those emails may not be connected to your sons activities....
it's pornspam...don't know anyone who hasn't gotten it...