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Re: Flacco deal has apparently been finalized!

Joe helped the Ravens with his contract signing, where's all the stories about how he helped the Ravens be able to re-sign other players. Oh yea, his name is Flacco, not br or brady. Joe is a team player and a damn good one at that.

Re: Flacco deal has apparently been finalized!

Originally Posted by lovefootball

Joe helped the Ravens with his contract signing, where's all the stories about how he helped the Ravens be able to re-sign other players. Oh yea, his name is Flacco, not br or brady. Joe is a team player and a damn good one at that.

It's true that the structure of the contract has low cap hits early on, but this contract structure also works for Flacco too. The cap hits in 2016, 2017, and 2018 are huge. That means that this contract will have to be renegotiated in 2016. But by then, Aaron Rodgers, Cam Newton, and Matt Ryan will have signed new deals that could be higher then what was paid to Flacco. Flacco will have all kinds of leverage in 2016 to get an even bigger contract from the Ravens to alleviate their immediate cap hit. That is why I started the thread about the Ravens drafting and developing a QB to be ready to start by 2016 to give the Ravens some leverage in those negotiations with Flacco.

Re: Flacco deal has apparently been finalized!

Basically, Joe helped them with low cap numbers first 3 years. In return, he's holding ALL the cards in Year 4 for an extension.

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“When I think of a Baltimore Raven - we go in there, we take your lunch box, we take your sandwich, we take your juice box, we take your applesauce, and we take your spork and we break it. And we leave you with an empty lunch. That’s the Baltimore Raven way.” - Steve Smith Sr.

Re: Flacco deal has apparently been finalized!

Basically, Joe helped them with low cap numbers first 3 years. In return, he's holding ALL the cards in Year 4 for an extension.

I don't think players necessarily care about the cap numbers, and I don't think the Ravens feel like Joe did them any favors with the structure of the deal.

The fact remains he's essentially fully guaranteed ~$62 million in his pocket for the next 3 years, regardless of how Pat Moriarty has structured the contract.

Now, his agent knows year 4 is when something will have to be done by the Ravens which does give leverage to Flacco, but why would Flacco not do an extension with extra years to defer the big cap numbers until the back-end of that contract just like his current deal. Flacco will only be 31 when it's time for the Ravens to renegotiate this deal.

The real cap problem will come, maybe, as it did with Ray Lewis, if Flacco plays out his 3rd contract into like 36-38 year old seasons. But QB is different than MLB and that potential problem is a decade away

Re: Flacco deal has apparently been finalized!

Originally Posted by LC_Ravens_87

Now, his agent knows year 4 is when something will have to be done by the Ravens which does give leverage to Flacco, but why would Flacco not do an extension with extra years to defer the big cap numbers until the back-end of that contract just like his current deal. Flacco will only be 31 when it's time for the Ravens to renegotiate this deal.

The real cap problem will come, maybe, as it did with Ray Lewis, if Flacco plays out his 3rd contract into like 36-38 year old seasons. But QB is different than MLB and that potential problem is a decade away

By 2016, Aaron Rodgers, Cam Newton, and Matt Ryan will have new contracts that might exceed Flacco's contract. Flacco would probably agree to an extension to alleviate the immediate cap hit, but at what cost? Say he says that he wants to be paid more than Aaron Rodgers from 2016 going forward? That deal would dwarf his current deal in just three years. The Ravens had zero leverage in this round of negotiations, because they did not have a viable alternative option to Flacco. The Ravens now have three years to draft and develop another QB, so that they are not in the same negotiating position in 2016. Plus, they could use a legit back-up QB anyway in case Flacco gets hurt.

Re: Flacco deal has apparently been finalized!

Originally Posted by Dirt1

By 2016, Aaron Rodgers, Cam Newton, and Matt Ryan will have new contracts that might exceed Flacco's contract. Flacco would probably agree to an extension to alleviate the immediate cap hit, but at what cost? Say he says that he wants to be paid more than Aaron Rodgers from 2016 going forward? That deal would dwarf his current deal in just three years. The Ravens had zero leverage in this round of negotiations, because they did not have a viable alternative option to Flacco. The Ravens now have three years to draft and develop another QB, so that they are not in the same negotiating position in 2016. Plus, they could use a legit back-up QB anyway in case Flacco gets hurt.

I follow you, and I think that while Flacco has started every game so far, getting young blood at the QB position is never a bad idea. Matt Cassell worked out pretty well for the Pats.

But what I am saying is that the Ravens just gave him a contract where they (i) had zero leverage; (ii) effectively couldn't use the franchise tag; and (iii) made him the "highest paid" QB in the game. And they still were able to do it on fairly cap friendly terms for the first 3 years.

Why won't they be able to do it again in 3 years, when the situation appears like it will be largely the same...I suppose the difference is that they will owe a hugggggggggggeeee number in year 4 whereas this offseason they were on the hook for nada...

but is he going to want to play behind a crappy O-line or whatever and depress his value and/or get hurt in year 4 and 5 right before he comes up for his last big contract at age 33?

Re: Flacco deal has apparently been finalized!

Ravens win another SB or 2 in those first 3 years, it will be money well spent. Flacco will continue to quietly win more games then losses, going to post season again, and winning one or more in post season. Not a SB dynasty, but a most wins dynasty while Flacco is here. I'll take it.

Re: Flacco deal has apparently been finalized!

I follow you, and I think that while Flacco has started every game so far, getting young blood at the QB position is never a bad idea. Matt Cassell worked out pretty well for the Pats.

But what I am saying is that the Ravens just gave him a contract where they (i) had zero leverage; (ii) effectively couldn't use the franchise tag; and (iii) made him the "highest paid" QB in the game. And they still were able to do it on fairly cap friendly terms for the first 3 years.

Why won't they be able to do it again in 3 years, when the situation appears like it will be largely the same...I suppose the difference is that they will owe a hugggggggggggeeee number in year 4 whereas this offseason they were on the hook for nada...

but is he going to want to play behind a crappy O-line or whatever and depress his value and/or get hurt in year 4 and 5 right before he comes up for his last big contract at age 33?

I think Flacco is going to want to get paid big time again in 2016, because that might be his last big contract. I just want them to spend a 3rd or 4th round pick either this year or next year on a QB that has a legit chance of developing into a starting caliber QB by 2016. Similar to what the Redskins and Patriots did with Cousins and Mallet respectively. Then, the Ravens could renegotiate Flacco's deal with a realistic fall-back position. This year, Flacco knew the Ravens had nowhere else to go, so they had to pay him what he wanted. Rodgers might sign a crazy deal in the $150M range in a year or two. I am not looking forward to the prospect of Flacco making a similar demand in 2016. At some point, giving players such huge contracts catches up with a team.

Re: Flacco deal has apparently been finalized!

I just don't see why he and Linta won't do what they did in this negotiation the next time.

The biggest risk to me is level of performance by Joe. They've made the playoffs all these years and won the Super Bowl with a QB position paid below top market value. Which has allowed them obviously to spend more broadly on more positions at above market value

Are they going to be able to restructure the entire resource allocation of the team and remain where they are? Time will tell, but simple math will make this franchise rise and fall that much more on the right arm of #5.

Re: Flacco deal has apparently been finalized!

Originally Posted by LC_Ravens_87

I just don't see why he and Linta won't do what they did in this negotiation the next time.

The biggest risk to me is level of performance by Joe. They've made the playoffs all these years and won the Super Bowl with a QB position paid below top market value. Which has allowed them obviously to spend more broadly on more positions at above market value

Are they going to be able to restructure the entire resource allocation of the team and remain where they are? Time will tell, but simple math will make this franchise rise and fall that much more on the right arm of #5.

I am sure that Flacco and Linta will be willing to restructure Flacco's deal in 2016 to "help the Ravens out". That is, for an additional $60M guaranteed. We will see if the Ravens will be ok with that, and what if anything they will do to strengthen their negotiating position between now and then.