Who was it that had the cost-per-batch projection graph? If they're still around, can they do an update on whether they did hit the break-even point ever?

I think minus start-up equipment costs, if you include things like sanitizer (amortized over many batches), bottle caps, mesh bag replacements every so often, etc, I'm probably right around $1 per bottle for most batches, maybe slightly more. If I did straight 2-row, grew the hops myself, and only used US-05, I could probably get it down under $0.50 per bottle I think, but then what's the point?

Who was it that had the cost-per-batch projection graph? If they're still around, can they do an update on whether they did hit the break-even point ever?

I did it. I got caught up with Life and didn't end up keeping track of my subsequent batches, unfortunately (or doing many subsequent batches!). I had only done it as a curiosity anyway - I don't do this to save money; I do it because it's fun. The graph just proved that it wasn't just a money-loser. I still buy the occasional six pack from the store, especially since most of the grocery stores around here have build-your-own six packs now.

When I was consuming more beer (~25 years ago) I signed up for a business license (trivial in AK) and purchased hops and malt in bulk. If you could get enough people to go in you could get a ton of 2-Row delivered for about $.25 per lb. Minimum order was a ton. My bill for the consumables for 10 gal batch was about $10. You have to brew quite a bit to make that reasonable - we were brewing nearly every weekend.

A new brewery that just opened near me (actually owned by the guy that runs my LHBS) which plans to offer home brewers access to entire 50lb. sacks of grain at the "bulk" price. Once that's available, I should be able to cut my per-batch cost down quite a bit if I keep a sack of 2-row and a sack of pilsner on hand.

If you get into homebrewing because you think you'll save money vs buying craft beer, you're getting into homebrewing for the wrong reasons. You really don't save money over craft beer, but you DO get the satisfaction of knowing you're drinking a beer YOU made, making what you like, etc.. and at least I think brewing is enjoyable. Plus, all the cool stuff you can do with your beers...

That all being said I just opened one of my chocolate cherry stouts that I bottled ~2 weeks ago. Last week the carbonation wasn't right, and there wasn't much head. MUCH better now.

A new brewery that just opened near me (actually owned by the guy that runs my LHBS) which plans to offer home brewers access to entire 50lb. sacks of grain at the "bulk" price. Once that's available, I should be able to cut my per-batch cost down quite a bit if I keep a sack of 2-row and a sack of pilsner on hand.

I'm paying about $1.30/lb on 50s. It varies a little depending what you get - e.g., Rahr Pils is cheaper than imported Belgian Pils.

A new brewery that just opened near me (actually owned by the guy that runs my LHBS) which plans to offer home brewers access to entire 50lb. sacks of grain at the "bulk" price. Once that's available, I should be able to cut my per-batch cost down quite a bit if I keep a sack of 2-row and a sack of pilsner on hand.

I'm paying about $1.30/lb on 50s. It varies a little depending what you get - e.g., Rahr Pils is cheaper than imported Belgian Pils.

You should be able to get base malts a lot cheaper than that if you're buying direct from a brewery (and they aren't upcharging). I'm paying 32-36 for base sacks and 65-80 for specialty when buying from my friend, but he's only charging me his cost on the grain.

That's via local homebrew supply store. I think that kind of connection requires a friend at a brewery. Most places wouldn't be willing to take orders for a random stranger.

The beauty of brewpubs and microbreweries? They are small enough that it's easy to go in and make friends with them. Ask for a private tour (bring some friends), ask a lot of intelligent, informed questions. Attend their tastings. Ask more questions. Make your face known.

I know several places that would be more than happy to add a couple of extra items to their bulk orders to help out an aspiring homebrewer.

In the grand scheme of things, I don't mind paying the mark up. I like having a big homebrew supply store in state. It's handy to be able to hop online and order a random keg fitting and have it on my doorstep inside 24 hours without shelling out for overnight shipping.

I think my "steam Bock" experiment is a bust. After 3 months of cellaring, I've had one bottle with a strong band aid flavor, and another that wasn't band aids, but still wasn't good. I'll keep letting them sit until I need the bottles to see if they improve, but I'll probably end up dumping them.

I'm pretty sure band-aid flavor is an infection. I doubt that gets any better, unless it was only that bottle.

I'm catching up on this thread after a while of not reading, but someone had a question about the no mash out double batch sparge method a few pages back. I've been using that method with good success for a while.

Before the sweet wort is drained from the mash and the grain is rinsed (sparged) of the residual sugars, many brewers perform a mashout. Mashout is the term for raising the temperature of the mash to 170°F prior to lautering. This step stops all of the enzyme action (preserving your fermentable sugar profile) and makes the grainbed and wort more fluid. For most mashes with a ratio of 1.5-2 quarts of water per pound of grain, the mashout is not needed. The grainbed will be loose enough to flow well. For a thicker mash, or a mash composed of more than 25% of wheat or oats, a mashout may be needed to prevent a Set Mash/Stuck Sparge. This is when the grain bed plugs up and no liquid will flow through it. A mashout helps prevent this by making the sugars more fluid; like the difference between warm and cold honey. The mashout step can be done using external heat or by adding hot water according to the multi-rest infusion calculations. (See chapter 16.) A lot of homebrewers tend to skip the mashout step for most mashes with no consequences.

There are chemistry reasons for mashout, but they don't impact small batches like what we brew. When you're brewing on a brewery scale, mashout is absolutely necessary due to the amount of time where the wort is still in contact with the grain. I mash for 60 minutes, I'm usually all ready to boil within 20 more.

So on May 5 I bottled a pretty simple ale where I undershot my OG (only got 1.039), fermented for 2 weeks with US-05 in the low 60s, and it tasted pretty clean at bottle time. I would like to serve a bottle to a friend on Friday (so just under 2 weeks after bottling) since it's a batch he was interested in. If I put a bottle in the fridge on Friday morning, what are the chances that it will 1) be carbonated properly, 2) taste good.

I figure since it's a low gravity beer, and US-05 is pretty clean anyway, even though it's green it should still be mostly drinkable, right? Or am I doing the beer a disservice by serving it so early?

2 weeks should be fine for a beer of that gravity, and I'd expect it to be finished carbonating by then. That's how long I would wait to taste my beers back when I bottle conditioned them. It might get better if left longer, but it certainly won't be bad.

So I brewed a partial mash NZ IPA (all NZ hops) this weekend and it was my first time using the US-05 yeast. Its always cheaper than the equivalent Wyeast pack, and is just a dry yeast. What is the alcohol tolerance and attenuation for this stuff?

So I brewed a partial mash NZ IPA (all NZ hops) this weekend and it was my first time using the US-05 yeast. Its always cheaper than the equivalent Wyeast pack, and is just a dry yeast. What is the alcohol tolerance and attenuation for this stuff?

Officially 80% attenuation and 12% alcohol tolerance. Unofficial reports have put the attenuation much higher than that for certain mutant batches a few years ago. It's almost the same strain as Wyeast 1056 or White Labs WLP001, but I think there's been a little genetic drift over the years.

I've done 5 batches with US-05 and have gotten attenuation ranging from 77% to 87% (although the 87% was a honey ale). 80% is realistic.

So I brewed a partial mash NZ IPA (all NZ hops) this weekend and it was my first time using the US-05 yeast. Its always cheaper than the equivalent Wyeast pack, and is just a dry yeast. What is the alcohol tolerance and attenuation for this stuff?

Officially 80% attenuation and 12% alcohol tolerance. Unofficial reports have put the attenuation much higher than that for certain mutant batches a few years ago. It's almost the same strain as Wyeast 1056 or White Labs WLP001, but I think there's been a little genetic drift over the years.

I've done 5 batches with US-05 and have gotten attenuation ranging from 77% to 87% (although the 87% was a honey ale). 80% is realistic.

Awesome, I think my OG was only 1.062 so I'm aiming for a 6.5% ABV when its all said and done. Which doesn't sound like it should be all that hard to accomplish. And NZ hops smell so god damned delicious. I am thinking of ordering more before they sell out.

Does anyone have any wisdom to impart on thick vs thin mashes? I do BIAB with a sort-of-sparge (bag in a colander perched over a bucket, I dump 1 gallon of room temp water over the bag and collect the runnings in the bucket. I've had some batches with good efficiency, and some with bad efficiency, and looking at my notes, it does look like the closer I am to 2qts of water per lb of grain, the better my efficiency is.

I know 1.25qt/lb is supposed to be standard. What sort of side-effects am I looking at for a thin mash?

So I brewed a partial mash NZ IPA (all NZ hops) this weekend and it was my first time using the US-05 yeast. Its always cheaper than the equivalent Wyeast pack, and is just a dry yeast. What is the alcohol tolerance and attenuation for this stuff?

Officially 80% attenuation and 12% alcohol tolerance. Unofficial reports have put the attenuation much higher than that for certain mutant batches a few years ago. It's almost the same strain as Wyeast 1056 or White Labs WLP001, but I think there's been a little genetic drift over the years.

I've done 5 batches with US-05 and have gotten attenuation ranging from 77% to 87% (although the 87% was a honey ale). 80% is realistic.

Is there any appreciable difference between using a dry yeast and not?

Does anyone have any wisdom to impart on thick vs thin mashes? I do BIAB with a sort-of-sparge (bag in a colander perched over a bucket, I dump 1 gallon of room temp water over the bag and collect the runnings in the bucket. I've had some batches with good efficiency, and some with bad efficiency, and looking at my notes, it does look like the closer I am to 2qts of water per lb of grain, the better my efficiency is.

I know 1.25qt/lb is supposed to be standard. What sort of side-effects am I looking at for a thin mash?

Running a mash that is too thin may raise the pH to undesirable levels, which can extract tannins from the grain husks. If you haven't noticed any tannins in your beer, you're probably OK though. It really depends on your brewing water and grain bill how thin you can go without running into problems. Increasing the mash water implies a corresponding reduction in sparge water, which can actually reduce your efficiency, though that evidently has not been an issue for you, possibly due to your BIAB sparge not really extracting much anyway. And, while it can raise the mash pH, it actually lowers the sparge pH, and sparging is when the pH is most likely to rise to tannin extraction levels.

Is there any appreciable difference between using a dry yeast and not?

I don't think so. I always use US-05 for my IPAs (and lots of my other beers, too) and have never had an issue with it. The quality of dry yeasts is much better these days than it used to be. I certainly wouldn't pay 3-4x as much for a vial WLP001.

I think the primary benefit of liquid yeasts at this point is that they have a lot more strains available.

Is there any appreciable difference between using a dry yeast and not?

I don't think so. I always use US-05 for my IPAs (and lots of my other beers, too) and have never had an issue with it. The quality of dry yeasts is much better these days than it used to be. I certainly wouldn't pay 3-4x as much for a vial WLP001.

I think the primary benefit of liquid yeasts at this point is that they have a lot more strains available.

Yeah. If you want flavor contributions from the yeast, liquid gives way more options. The difference isn't quite that steep around here though. US-05 is ~$3 and WLP001 is ~$6.

I generally assume 75% efficiency when planning. With a 2qt/lb ratio I've been getting around that. When my water/grain ratio drops, I get closer to 60%.

I actually don't change how much my sparge is, I just adjust how much top-off water is needed. Is that bad?

Usually I have 4 gallons of spring water in 1 gallon jugs. I have 2-2.5 gallons of strike water (so two jugs plus part of a third), add ~5lb of grain, let the bag drain after the mash, sparge with 1 gallon (the 4th jug). Towards the end of the mash, I boil the remainder of the third gallon off to the side, and then after sparging I add the additional boiling water until my pot is at about the 3 gallon mark (usually a little higher).

So increasing the water during the mash reduces the amount of boiling water added to the wort at boil time, and has no impact on the amount of water I use to sparge.

1) I sparge with room temp water. Should I be heating it up to 160 instead?

Sparge with ~175 degree water

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2) I might be sparging too quickly. I literally just pour the gallon of water out of the jug over the bag and let it drip into the bucket.

Best results if you slowly run the sparge water into the top of your mash tun while slowly draining the wort of the bottom. If you can manage it you would like this process to last 30 min. These two things should improve your efficiency

I generally assume 75% efficiency when planning. With a 2qt/lb ratio I've been getting around that. When my water/grain ratio drops, I get closer to 60%.

I actually don't change how much my sparge is, I just adjust how much top-off water is needed. Is that bad?

Usually I have 4 gallons of spring water in 1 gallon jugs. I have 2-2.5 gallons of strike water (so two jugs plus part of a third), add ~5lb of grain, let the bag drain after the mash, sparge with 1 gallon (the 4th jug). Towards the end of the mash, I boil the remainder of the third gallon off to the side, and then after sparging I add the additional boiling water until my pot is at about the 3 gallon mark (usually a little higher).

So increasing the water during the mash reduces the amount of boiling water added to the wort at boil time, and has no impact on the amount of water I use to sparge.

You may as well sparge to target your entire boil volume - you might sqeeze out a few more efficiency points. This is what I do when I batch sparge - I target 6.5 gallons to boil, so if I collect 3 gallons from the mash runoff, I sparge with 3.5 gallons.

Quote:

1) I sparge with room temp water. Should I be heating it up to 160 instead?

Yes - I would definitely heat the sparge water. Some people claim it doesn't matter, but everything is more soluble at higher temps, so it stands to reason you'll rinse out more sugars with hotter water. Don't go over 170 F though.

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2) I might be sparging too quickly. I literally just pour the gallon of water out of the jug over the bag and let it drip into the bucket.

Going slower would probably help too. Getting the water to really integrate with the grain would be better, though I'm not sure how you'd do that in a BIAB system.

I transferred my Kiwi IPA on thursday. It is now being dry hopped with Moteuka and Wakatu hops for two weeks.

We tested the gravity and the final was 1.014, so I ended up with a roughly 6.3% ABV IPA. And when I type this, I say this with great reticence as I LOVE my hops, I added an additional 3 oz's of Nelson Sauvin in with the boil..but it was damn hoppy, might be TOO hoppy. I really hope it mellows out during these next few weeks of dry hopping and bottle conditioning.

Thanks to the stupidity of government, it was recently discovered that taking homebrew out of your home is illegal in the state of Iowa. To the legislatures credit, they quickly stepped up and passed a law legalizing the practice of sharing homebrew in the public space. Of course, they couldn't make it an immediate change, so on July 1st one of my favorite craft bars is doing a "Prohibition is over (again)" celebration of homebrew in Iowa. The owner asked if I'd make something to share as part of an event he's planning, so am brewing yet another variation on my Wheat Wine DIPA today. I'm playing more and more with different base malts and mash rests, so decided to really have fun with this batch.

This is a very non-traditional style. It actually was my first homebrew I created, before I knew anything about recipe construction, and yet it somehow worked. It started as an American Wheat extract recipe that I simply doubled up all the ingredients on, and then hopped it like a west coast pale. It had (and still has) a nice balance of grapefruit citrus flora and malty background, a balance I personally love. I've moved farther away from the 50/50 or 60/40 wheat barley splits that are to standard, so it's probably not even fair to call it a wheat wine anymore, but I shall anyways.

The 6-Row is there (vs 2-row) for the diastatic power to assist in breaking down the long chain sugars in the wheat malt. I've read so much conflicting information on wheat extraction that I'd just prefer to make sure I cover my bases when brewing them AG. The Golden Promise provides a nice sweet mouthfeel in the finish of beers, and well I've really liked using it and Maris Otter as my base malts lately. The cara because I like the color and hint of carmelization it brings. When I came up with the recipe though it was just because of the color. Happy accidents.

The hops have changed over time, though I've settled on a Columbus/Amarillo/Cascade procession with equal amounts at each stage (for five gallons I used between 2 and 3oz each). And then of course AA2 for a very clean finish and neutral profile.

I'll be doing a 3 step mash on this, a protein rest in the 120-125 range, then both a beta and alpha rest stage before sparging. As I don't really want excessive carmelization, these will be infusion steps not decoction, so I'm starting with a rather thick mash and moving towards the thinner side as I go. 1.25 qts/lb at the beginning moving towards 2 for the alpha rest. It makes for a long brew day, but hopefully something worth the effort at the end.

I have a strange brew on my hands. My Wee Heavy was a standard brew, but I way under primed it and it didn't carbonate. I ended up popping every bottle, dumping in a little bit of boiled sugar water, and then recapping them. I sanitized everything as best I could.

Most bottles have been a pretty standard Scottish ale, but every couple of bottles I get a weird one. Two of the bottles have tasted like a dubbel (nice raisin and plum notes), I had one that was close to a Newcastle, and last night I had one that was toasty like a stout. I don't know what to make of it. I didn't mislabel the bottles, and while the dubbel could be yeast left over in the bottle from a previous batch, the stout has me stumped.

I transferred my Kiwi IPA on thursday. It is now being dry hopped with Moteuka and Wakatu hops for two weeks.

We tested the gravity and the final was 1.014, so I ended up with a roughly 6.3% ABV IPA. And when I type this, I say this with great reticence as I LOVE my hops, I added an additional 3 oz's of Nelson Sauvin in with the boil..but it was damn hoppy, might be TOO hoppy. I really hope it mellows out during these next few weeks of dry hopping and bottle conditioning.

Bottled my IPA last thursday. It did mellow out a lot and it was pretty citrusy but in a very different way from using maybe Centennial or Cascade hops. I thought I tasted a bit of bubblegum, but not in the spoiled way, but in a "thats a damn weird hop" kinda way. It'll be good after it gets some carbonation.

Since I do 2.5 gallon batches, I usually use a Wyeast smackpack and pitch directly instead of using a starter. Yesterday I brewed a dubbel (1.060 OG) and pitched a packet of Wyeast 1214 about 4 hours after smacking. It had swelled a little bit, but admittedly not as much as I'm used to from a smack pack. For the first 36 hours, there was basically no activity. Now, I'm finally seeing a very thin layer of foam on the top of the carboy, and a very gradual bubble in the airlock.

The last time I made this recipe, the fermentation took off like a rocket and the exhaust out of the airlock smelled great. The current airlock exhaust is odorless. What should I expect the results of the slower initial fermentation to be?

Since I do 2.5 gallon batches, I usually use a Wyeast smackpack and pitch directly instead of using a starter. Yesterday I brewed a dubbel (1.060 OG) and pitched a packet of Wyeast 1214 about 4 hours after smacking. It had swelled a little bit, but admittedly not as much as I'm used to from a smack pack. For the first 36 hours, there was basically no activity. Now, I'm finally seeing a very thin layer of foam on the top of the carboy, and a very gradual bubble in the airlock.

The last time I made this recipe, the fermentation took off like a rocket and the exhaust out of the airlock smelled great. The current airlock exhaust is odorless. What should I expect the results of the slower initial fermentation to be?

This is why I prefer white labs. The smack pack exists mostly as a proof...there's not truly enough food in the smack pack to overcome the inherent Cell count disadvantage of liquid, but you are rarely prepared for it when they don't proof. White labs you can see the yeasts freshness by color at least. The only foolproof way is to do proper starters. As with any fermentation, the life will persevere for your beer but expect some surprises. Basically any fermentation issue can occur with low pitch. Even a normal beer. But nutrient and oxygen levels really need to be strong.