Why is it you continualy derail fred's threads with your Nance question? Obviously he is too smart to answer you. The way I see it if Fred says " Nance's is a good handicapper"---your answer will be to call him a liar yadda yadda yadda...if Fred says "Nance sucks" you will bust his balls about selling his picks etc. He can't win. Why not move on sir?

Why is it you continualy derail fred's threads with your Nance question? Obviously he is too smart to answer you. The way I see it if Fred says " Nance's is a good handicapper"---your answer will be to call him a liar yadda yadda yadda...if Fred says "Nance sucks" you will bust his balls about selling his picks etc. He can't win. Why not move on sir?

Burton as well as the rest of us bash Freddy because he says that the *** is the site. He, however, doesn't post there and posts here. Also, Freddy was Dan's *** in the past. I hope this helps.

Why is it you continualy derail fred's threads with your Nance question? Obviously he is too smart to answer you. The way I see it if Fred says " Nance's is a good handicapper"---your answer will be to call him a liar yadda yadda yadda...if Fred says "Nance sucks" you will bust his balls about selling his picks etc. He can't win. Why not move on sir?

Yet to hear any remorse. Only a topic yesterday telling everyone how great his friend pigland from the slop is. And again how they have more "real" people Case nailed it earlier. Its all pretty well deserved.

Why is it you continualy derail fred's threads with your Nance question? Obviously he is too smart to answer you. The way I see it if Fred says " Nance's is a good handicapper"---your answer will be to call him a liar yadda yadda yadda...if Fred says "Nance sucks" you will bust his balls about selling his picks etc. He can't win. Why not move on sir?

All good points.But you know what could happen if he answers?He could be honest with all of us.Wouldn't that be nice sir?

On a related note, being that this is a "tout" discussion, maybe I am missing something here. The best handicappers in the country, professional gamblers, etc.--people who make their living from their own skills and gambling . . . well, that's just it . . . they make money gambling on their own selections. They do not make money, supplement their income, have a motivation of the betterment of the sport, look to help people, to have pools impacted (they often have too much of an impact on pools themselves), or anything of the like BY SELLING THEIR SELECTIONS. Thus, what are we actually talking about here?

That said, let's look at another issue. Specifically, with Dan Nance as a tout. Let's note here we are talking about a $5 tout and let's cut the BS about him "wanting to help people" or "wanting to help the sport"---he's a out and out, outright liar and everyone knows it. Let him allegedly keep betting off-shore. Yeah, right.

Anyway, the $5 whore, I mean tout---the guy was in the game as a face in the crowd trainer back in the 80's. For what, about 15 minutes? The guy was barely around long enough for a cup of coffee, right? 5 years? 10 years? Let's not count the time he allegedly had horses with other trainers or the when they had 7 starts in a year or something like that.

So here's my point---how much does Dan really know about today's game? Ratings are one thing, but he proclaims all this knowledge about the sport, horses, rigging, people he knows in the game, etc. He hasn't been in the game for what, 20 years? What about all of the new equipment, training regimens and techniques, new trainers, drivers, etc. He knows what he knows by watching all this on TV? Reading some trade magazine? Does he even know Ross Croghan? Does he know who he is or just having read his name in a program somewhere? Most of the people in this game are beyond the scope of a moron like Dan Nance.

Involved in the sport? Are you kidding me? Either you are IN this game or you are OUT of the game.

1) regular of *** who defends it to this day2) won't answer any questions I give him, even about handicapping3) knocks this site rught and left while promoting a cesspool4)knocks my handicapping on a regular basis even when I win (okay, this one is personal)

1) regular of *** who defends it to this day2) won't answer any questions I give him, even about handicapping3) knocks this site rught and left while promoting a cesspool4)knocks my handicapping on a regular basis even when I win (okay, this one is personal)

should I go on?

Notice the icons...I believe I have made my feelings about FBT abundantly clear.

Listen, Dan Nance backed down and skated away from every single challenge at the other site. He was nothing more than a whimp. He's a punk of course, but a whimp as well.

If a tout wants to sell, peddle, or whatever you want to call it, and bring attention to themselves--then they should expect to be called out. Either you step up or . . . well, we all know the rest. If a guy doesn't want to step up, that says something. Actually, it says a lot. Volumes. It says everything.

Listen, Dan Nance backed down and skated away from every single challenge at the other site. He was nothing more than a whimp. He's a punk of course, but a whimp as well.

If a tout wants to sell, peddle, or whatever you want to call it, and bring attention to themselves--then they should expect to be called out. Either you step up or . . . well, we all know the rest. If a guy doesn't want to step up, that says something. Actually, it says a lot. Volumes. It says everything.

I post my picks on just about every Friday/Saturday for the BigM.I encourage others to use that thread to post their picks.We usually trade notes and pat eachother on the back if we do well.None of us is what you would call a pro.I've had hot streaks and cold streaks.Last year I was terrible.The year before, pretty good.Last year I hit a pick four for around $1,100.Fred said nothing.That's fine.He doesn't have to.A few weeks later I hit one for $103.Now that's not some huge payoff.But......I only listed one horse in each race. (a $2 wager)Thats a 50-1 payoff.I had it five times.Not too bad.But along comes Fred.He makes fun of my winnings.I'm paraphrasing, but it was something along the lines of "he doesn't play for peanuts like that."I explained my wager.He still gave me some crap.What kind of handicapper denigrates a 50-1 winning wager?Answer: One who's not very good.

My mission was never to bash him.I just wanted a few questions answered so I could understand where this guy was coming from.All I got was BS.He made his snide remarks about my picks after I asked him some questions.Its called passive/aggressive.I'm an upfront guy.I don't beat around the bush.I'm happy he gets free programs from pigface.Programs must cost a lot when you're only making $5.

Case, I think you have done enough to be a memeber in good standing. Seriously, I don't mind reading someone's selections, but how can anyone take the plays of a one time *** of Dan's and put their money down. Also his reasoning is incoherent more times than not.

Case, I think you have done enough to be a memeber in good standing. Seriously, I don't mind reading someone's selections, but how can anyone take the plays of a one time *** of Dan's and put their money down. Also his reasoning is incoherent more times than not.

Ok. I'm glad I'm a memeber. I would hate to be on the outside looking in. When was the last time that he had a winner? Also, I'm not real big on his choice for the top harness site..