posted at 1:20 pm on February 13, 2012 by Ed Morrissey

The Obama White House tried defusing the controversy over its HHS mandate last Friday by revving up their PR machine to claim that shifting the communication responsibility from religious-organization employers to the insurance companies for the mandated no-cost contraception and abortifacient coverage would address the concerns of those whose religions forbid the use of such products and services. Some of the usual suspects claimed to have been satisfied with the “accommodation,” such as E. J. Dionne, but for the most part, those arguments fell on deaf ears. The Wall Street Journal reports that 48 hours after the White House announcement — made without any consultation with those objecting to the HHS mandate — Roman Catholic churches across the nation echoed with blasts from the pulpit over the arrogance of Obama’s action:

At masses across the country Sunday, Roman Catholic priests blasted the Obama administration’s compromise on contraceptive insurance coverage, a sign the White House’s backtrack late last week did little to defuse the controversy. …

At St. Brendan Church in San Francisco, the Rev. Michael Quinn compared the church’s opposition to the contraceptive rules to the civil-rights fight waged by 1950s activist Rosa Parks, who refused to give her seat up to a white man on a bus. “I believe this is our Rosa Parks moment,” Father Quinn told more than 200 parishioners on Sunday. “This is our moment to say this is wrong.”

Archbishop Thomas Wenski of Miami said that while he appreciated Mr. Obama’s attempt to strike a compromise, it doesn’t go far enough.

“A legislative remedy to this overreaching and unprecedented incursion of state power into the domain of religious freedom and the rights of conscience is still necessary,” he said in a statement.

“By what authority does the President of the United States seek to impose this immoral policy?” Bishop Thomas J. Tobin of Providence, R.I., asked in a statement. “This is the United States, not North Korea.”

Three years ago, Notre Dame University provided Obama a platform to speak to Catholics and awarded him an honorary degree. Yesterday, the faculty at the Catholic university — which would be subject to the mandate — gave him the third degree instead, excoriating Obama for a “grave violation of religious freedom”:

Twenty-five Notre Dame faculty members–led by the university’s top ethics expert, and including some of the school’s most eminent scholars–have signed a statement declaring that President Barack Obama’s latest version of his administration’s mandate that all health insurance plans in the United States must cover sterilizations and all FDA-approved contraceptives, including those that cause abortions, is “a grave violation of religious freedom and cannot stand.”

The statement—put out on the letterhead of the University of Notre Dame Law School–is also signed by leading scholars from other major American colleges and universities, including Princeton, Harvard, Stanford, Georgetown, Brigham Young, Yeshiva and Wheaton College.

Prof. Carter Snead, a professor of law at Notre Dame, was one of the lead organizers of the statement, which was published on his official law school letterhead. Notre Dame’s top ethics expert, Snead serves as director of the university’s Center for Ethics and Culture, a position to which he was appointed by Father John Jenkins, the president of Notre Dame.

In 2009, Father Jenkins awarded President Barack Obama an honorary Notre Dame law degree. …

“This so-called ‘accommodation’ changes nothing of moral substance and fails to remove the assault on religious liberty and the rights of conscience which gave rise to the controversy,” they said. “It is certainly no compromise. The reason for the original bipartisan uproar was the administration’s insistence that religious employers, be they institutions or individuals, provide insurance that covered services they regard as gravely immoral and unjust. Under the new rule, the government still coerces religious institutions and individuals to purchase insurance policies that include the very same services.”

I’d hate to tell Notre Dame I told you so, but in fact a number of Catholics, myself included, did warn Notre Dame in 2009 about inviting Obama to deliver that commencement speech. My objection was specific to the honorary law degree Notre Dame awarded Obama for that appearance, a jarring decision given Obama’s previous attacks on the Catholic Church’s positions on life, especially in the Illinois Senate. Now the same law school that awarded Obama a law school degree is shocked, shocked to find that Obama thinks he can arrogate to himself the power to dictate to religious organizations that they have to facilitate actions which are forbidden by their core doctrinal values.

New Hampshire’s House Republicans plan to take on the Obama administration’s Department of Health and Human Services Monday by passing a non-binding resolution condemning the department’s new rule mandating religious institutions provide health coverage that includes free birth control.

NH Journal has learned House Speaker William O’Brien, who identifies himself as a constitutionalist, is incensed at the Obama rule because he believes it violates the First Amendment to the Constitution.

House Resolution 29 “calls upon the United States Department of Health and Human Services to cease its unconstitutional course of action, and to rescind this rule immediately; and the House further calls upon the members of New Hampshire’s congressional delegation to undertake whatever actions are necessary to ensure that this goal is promptly achieved.”

If the White House thought they had defused the situation on Friday, they were very much mistaken. The same political problem exists today, only with the extra dollop of arrogance from an administration that calculated an “accommodation” without bothering to consult their erstwhile allies in the Catholic Church and its organizations.

Blowback

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From the sermon at my Lutheran (Missouri Synod) church on Sunday. The emphasis was on the God given blessing of work and that it is the individuals’, not the government’s, responsibility to share the blessings of his/her work with those who cannot (rather than will not) work. The pastor used 1 Samuel 8 to demonstrate this, but God speaking through Samuel says so much more about giving over our personal liberty to the government –

6 But when they said, “Give us a king to lead us,” this displeased Samuel; so he prayed to the LORD. 7 And the LORD told him: “Listen to all that the people are saying to you; it is not you they have rejected, but they have rejected me as their king. 8 As they have done from the day I brought them up out of Egypt until this day, forsaking me and serving other gods, so they are doing to you. 9 Now listen to them; but warn them solemnly and let them know what the king who will reign over them will claim as his rights.” emphasis mine

10 Samuel told all the words of the LORD to the people who were asking him for a king. 11 He said, “This is what the king who will reign over you will claim as his rights: He will take your sons and make them serve with his chariots and horses, and they will run in front of his chariots. 12 Some he will assign to be commanders of thousands and commanders of fifties, and others to plow his ground and reap his harvest, and still others to make weapons of war and equipment for his chariots. 13 He will take your daughters to be perfumers and cooks and bakers. 14 He will take the best of your fields and vineyards and olive groves and give them to his attendants. 15 He will take a tenth of your grain and of your vintage and give it to his officials and attendants. 16 Your male and female servants and the best of your cattle[c] and donkeys he will take for his own use. 17 He will take a tenth of your flocks, and you yourselves will become his slaves. 18 When that day comes, you will cry out for relief from the king you have chosen, but the LORD will not answer you in that day.”

Not every Catholic believes that taking birth control pills amounts to a sin against humanity. Perhaps that was true 2000 years ago when the world population was insignificant, but not so today.

bayam on February 13, 2012 at 2:12 PM

Again, the argument here isn’t about the morality or immorality of using contraceptives. The Catholic Church has long held that contraception and abortion violate its belief that life begins at the moment of conception. Whether Obama agrees or disagrees is irrelevant, the Church’s position isn’t open for discussion. What this is about is a direct assault by the president on the freedom of religion guaranteed in the 1st Amendment.

Not every Catholic believes that taking birth control pills amounts to a sin against humanity. Perhaps that was true 2000 years ago when the world population was insignificant, but not so today.

bayam on February 13, 2012 at 2:12 PM

They had birth control pills 2,000 years ago? Wow, who would have thought…

mr.blacksheep on February 13, 2012 at 2:14 PM

Yes, you follow the irony. The early church preached the virtues of abstinence except when engaged in procreation intended to grow a family- as there was no viable birth control option. It was a pre-modern form of family planning.

Look at history. Socialists tolerate religions until Socialism is fully entrenched, then religion is either crushed or becomes the mouth of the state.

Religious people in the U.S. have turned a blind eye and actually supported Socialism because Socialism heavily campaigns on serving the poor, comforting the widows, and caring for the downtrodden.

No Socialist regime has ever actually carried out those promises once in office. The Democratic Party has made itself the ‘image’ of being for those less fortunate. How many poor and underpriveleged, other than a token group paraded before the media, has the Democratic Party actually helped to a better life?

Socialism has finally become mainstream in America, and the masses are drinking the coolaid. God help the Constitution because Obama and cronies are determined to destroy Freedom.

If Obama gets a second term I believe that he will unleash ALL his plans through every means, fair or foul, to bring the U.S. to Socialism. No president has ever misused the departments, especially DOJ and HHS, as this president has. I can’t imagine what he will do in a second term!

Now the same law school that awarded Obama a law school degree is shocked, shocked to find that Obama thinks he can arrogate to himself the power to dictate to religious organizations that they have to facilitate actions which are forbidden by their core doctrinal values.

Look, ND. You’ve been betrayed. You’ve been played for suckers. You let that guy in, aborted your principles, and now he’s giving you the shiv in the ribs. Who is surprised? Rescind his degree.

What this is about is a direct assault by the president on the freedom of religion guaranteed in the 1st Amendment.

Trafalgar on February 13, 2012 at 2:21 PM

I respect your opinion but have trouble understanding how that’s the case unless women are forced to take birth control pills. The rule has no such provision.
It seems to me the Catholic Church believes it has the right to impose its values upon all its employee, including those who are not Catholic.

It seems to me the Catholic Church believes it has the right to impose its values upon all its employee, including those who are not Catholic.

bayam on February 13, 2012 at 2:26 PM

Exactly. Plus this is a ginned up controversy. Catholics are (ostensbily) against the death penalty. Where is the outrage when Catholics are forced to contribute taxes to a state that uses state funds to execute people?

It seems to me the Catholic Church believes it has the right to impose its values upon all its employee, including those who are not Catholic.

bayam on February 13, 2012 at 2:26 PM

The Catholic Church has already made it very clear to it’s non-Catholic employees that they are free to use any kind of contraception they want to, and use the morning after pill if they want (although obviously they’d counsel them not to if given the chance). All they are saying is that it violates Catholic faith to provide contraception and they won’t do it. If the employee wants it they can go get it somewhere else. The Obama administration is trying to dictate to the Catholic Church that it violate its own beliefs, and that is an attack on religious freedom.

Exactly. Plus this is a ginned up controversy. Catholics are (ostensbily) against the death penalty. Where is the outrage when Catholics are forced to contribute taxes to a state that uses state funds to execute people?

cjw79 on February 13, 2012 at 2:32 PM

Strawman alert. The Catholic Church does oppose the death penalty (in most cases), the Church itself is tax exempt and recognizes that individual Catholics do not have the right to refuse to pay lawful taxes.

I respect your opinion but have trouble understanding how that’s the case unless women are forced to take birth control pills. The rule has no such provision.

It seems to me the Catholic Church believes it has the right to impose its values upon all its employee, including those who are not Catholic.

bayam on February 13, 2012 at 2:26 PM

You’re distorting the issue. You sound like a Lefty when you do that. The Church has always believed that articial contraception is morally wrong…a sin. The Church has a right to believe that regardless of how many individuals share that belief, including all those who identify as Catholics. If contraception is a sin then the Church cannot support its use or a government mechanism that encourages its use. It certainly cannot allow itself to be coerced into compliance because then the moral force would be lost. The government does not have the right to force the Catholic Church to violate its own doctrines. Individuals have free will and can choose to follow the teachings or reject them. The Church, however, cannot condone it.

Where is the outrage when Catholics are forced to contribute taxes to a state that uses state funds to execute people?

cjw79 on February 13, 2012 at 2:32 PM

I love those “where is the outrage” questions? They seem to seek consistency in positions, as if consistency were the mother of all virtues.

Try this one, “Where is the outrage in the WH to the president’s position?” I mean, the guy got an honorary degree from these people, they rolled out the red carpet for him, many of them voted for him and here he is trampling all over their beliefs. If he was a houseguest, then he just dropped trou and delivered a steaming deuce on the nun’s coffee table. Talk about rude and inconsiderate…you’d think that some of his minions around would be ashamed of his actions.

I am a Catholic who did NOT vote for BHO in 08 and neither did most of my southern Catholic friends. Having said that I was furious with Notre Dame for inviting this fool to speak at the university a few years ago. I hope all these idiots are now realizing what a dangerous man our current President is and help to soundly defeat him in November. If not look for a huge amount of Catholic hospitals to start shutting their doors. Couple that with Obamacare and you can see the storm that is coming. Vote this guy out of office folks or America is toast.

It seems to me the Catholic Church believes it has the right to impose its values upon all its employee, including those who are not Catholic.

bayam on February 13, 2012 at 2:26 PM

It seems to me Hussein+Jarret believe they have the right to impose their values upon all their employers, specially those who are not Muslim
( American taxpayers are their employers ,
in case they didn’t teach you that in MMU)

If not look for a huge amount of Catholic hospitals to start shutting their doors. Couple that with Obamacare and you can see the storm that is coming. Vote this guy out of office folks or America is toast.

It seems to me the Catholic Church believes it has the right to impose its values upon all its employee, including those who are not Catholic.

bayam on February 13, 2012 at 2:26 PM

Imagine a company setting standards, and expecting their employees to follow that standard…why I have never heard of such a thing.
Do you think if Obama’s press secretary started quoting Fox News, and stating that he feels they are right in their assessment of Obama, that he would be allowed to keep his job?
Do you think that if the budget director said he thought Obama’s economic policies were flawed and doomed to fail, would keep his job?
Of course not…the reason you choose to work for a company is because of the companies charter, you are choosing to work for the company, it’s your choice.
Don’t like it, don’t like them? Don’t sign on…

The Church has always believed that articial contraception is morally wrong…a sin

By the word “always”, you mean the Church preached abstinence as a form of family planning before birth control existed.

You’ll also find that the Bible forbid pork consumption at a time when humanity did not realize that thoroughly cooking pork would kill trichinosis rendering it safe to eat. People fail to recognize that many early Church tenants were grounded in very practical human wellness issues, and that some of those issues have changed in nature over time.

If not look for a huge amount of Catholic hospitals to start shutting their doors. Couple that with Obamacare and you can see the storm that is coming. Vote this guy out of office folks or America is toast.

neyney on February 13, 2012 at 2:40 PM

Not just Catholic hospitals. As I’ve posted before, the Baptists are also against this mandate because it includes provisions for requiring self-abortion drugs (morning after pills). As a denomination, Baptists run more than a few large health systems and they self-insure. They too will have no choice but to shutter services if this affront to our Constitution stands.

But most importantly, this is not a Catholic thing, a Baptist thing, or even a Christian thing. This is a First Amendment thing and the way the administration is trying to hijack the Constitution is chilling. If they get away with this mandate, what is stopping them from deciding that they can outlaw guns despite the Second Amendment in the name of public safety?

People fail to recognize that many early Church tenants were grounded in very practical human wellness issues, and that some of those issues have changed in nature over time.

bayam on February 13, 2012 at 2:48 PM

That may or may not be true but the faith still holds contraception and more importantly abortion a sin. It isn’t your place to decide that those who hold to the tenets of their faith should be called ignorant fools because “issues have changed in nature over time.”

In other words, things are not necessarily moral just because so snotty know-it-all has deemed contraception okay because we’ve figured out you need to make sure pork is well cooked.

By the word “always”, you mean the Church preached abstinence as a form of family planning before birth control existed.

That’s your distortion. You’re obviously not an expert and it shows from the statements you make.

You’ll also find that the Bible forbid pork consumption at a time when humanity did not realize that thoroughly cooking pork would kill trichinosis rendering it safe to eat.

Not particularly relevant but since you mentioned it, do you think the government has a right to force Jewish and Islamic institutions to provide pork on demand?

People fail to recognize that many early Church tenants were grounded in very practical human wellness issues, and that some of those issues have changed in nature over time.

bayam on February 13, 2012 at 2:48 PM

And you fail to understand that this is not the issue we’re dealing with here. The Church deals with spiritual and moral issues as well as physical “wellness” issues. You’re not obligated to either believe the Church’s teaching or even understand them. Whether you agree with it or not the Church has a right to its doctrines and the government has no right to force the Church to conform to a political agenda.

What this is about is a direct assault by the president on the freedom of religion guaranteed in the 1st Amendment.

Trafalgar on February 13, 2012 at 2:21 PM

I respect your opinion but have trouble understanding how that’s the case unless women are forced to take birth control pills. The rule has no such provision.
It seems to me the Catholic Church believes it has the right to impose its values upon all its employee, including those who are not Catholic.

bayam on February 13, 2012 at 2:26 PM

No, the Catholic Church is not trying to impose its values upon non-Catholic employees. It doesn’t want to be FORCED TO PAY for someone’s contraceptives.

I respect your opinion but have trouble understanding how that’s the case unless women are forced to take birth control pills. The rule has no such provision.
It seems to me the Catholic Church believes it has the right to impose its values upon all its employee, including those who are not Catholic.

bayam on February 13, 2012 at 2:26 PM

Buy me a pizza — or else you will be imposing your view upon me that I am not allowed to eat a pizza.

Not every Catholic believes that taking birth control pills amounts to a sin against humanity. Perhaps that was true 2000 years ago when the world population was insignificant, but not so today.

bayam on February 13, 2012 at 2:12 PM

And your point is? It doesn’t matter how many Catholics believe it or not. It is still Catholic teaching that it is an intrinsic evil, this is a fact that is not dependent on the number of people who believe it. If 90% of people start believing that the earth is a cube, will it make it so?

People fail to recognize that many early Church tenants were grounded in very practical human wellness issues, and that some of those issues have changed in nature over time.

bayam on February 13, 2012 at 2:48 PM

And your point, relative to this discussion, is what? Eating pork has nothing to do with this. The Church has always believed in the sanctity of human life, and that is not going to change, even though Obama thinks he can dictate it.

BTW when trying to lecture to practicing Catholics about their Church and its teachings and beliefs, a good starting place would be to understand that we have tenets, not tenants.

Is this, the Notre Dame faculty that scandalized the Church of Rome by honoring the most anti-Catholic pro abortion president in history -a man that as a senator in Illinois demanded infanticide be the law of that land?

New Hampshire’s House Republicans plan to take on the Obama administration’s Department of Health and Human Services Monday by passing a non-binding resolution condemning the department’s new rule mandating religious institutions provide health coverage that includes free birth control.

My didn’t anyone inform them that New Hampshire just passed such a law itself-news came out last week?

I was thinking of the outrage and violence that would happen if obama mandated that muslim hospitals pay for birth control, sterilizations and morning after abortion pills.

However,I realized that there aren’t any muslim hospitals. They are too busy beheading infidels, beating and subjugating their women, enforcing their sharia law and blowing up anyone that might actually try to build something that might help people.

hospitals do make great places to blow up the maximun number of infidels in one setting as well as hiding when your enemy is shooting at you.

People fail to recognize that many early Church tenants were grounded in very practical human wellness issues, and that some of those issues have changed in nature over time.

bayam on February 13, 2012 at 2:48 PM

That’s all fine and good. And irrelevant.

Some (most?) religions TODAY do not believe in birth control. Forcing religions to provide birth control to their employees is a violation of religious freedom. Now you can argue that religious freedom is not reason enough to not force everyone to provide birth control. But claiming that because once upon a time churches did something that Obama would approve of is ridiculous.

The Catholic Church has no grounds to stand on – they should be FORCED to accept this because …

THEY endorsed ObamaCare.

If the Church wants to, at this late date, REVERSE their practice of taking a “big government” stand each and every time they’ve had an opportunity to do so in my lifetime (that’s 50 years) … then I’ll stand with them.

But they will not. They will cry like little bitties because their lovely Obama FOOLED them.

When were they crying when the government was taking my taxdollars involuntarily and using them to fund educational programs in Africa to teach uncircumsized African men how to wash their tally whackers?

Seriously Catholic Church – you’ve never had a pair – so don’t expect us to come to your rescue at this point.

And by the way – I was baptized Catholic and probably identify more closely with that church than any other.

Wow! Angry much? Why is it that you think the Catholic Church should stand up for your 2nd Amendment rights? Why do you need them to? What the Catholic Church is standing up for in this case is its right to practice its religion without government interference or imposition of rules while go against its fundamental beliefs.

WTF? Who cares if the Catholic Church has their religious freedom violated?

HondaV65 on February 13, 2012 at 3:15 PM

So you only defend the rights of groups you like; and are good with the government oppressing and removing the civil rights of people and groups you dislike?

Interesting; Castro does the same thing. People who agree with him on every single point? They have rights… you disagree, you lose rights.

I guess supporting a Constitution is hard, support a Dictatorship style set of rights is easier… congratulations on being clear where you stand. You’ll only defend rights of people who agree with you on every topic.

Why do I suspect you won’t defend anyone’s rights but yours with that rule?

You’re talking like a troll. Do you not understand that this issue is not simply defending the Catholic Church but the 1st Amendment? Obama’s target is the Church but the ramifications of this assault on the 1st Amendment are much broader than that.

It seems to me the Catholic Church believes it has the right to impose its values upon all its employee, including those who are not Catholic.

bayam on February 13, 2012 at 2:26 PM

No. The Catholic church is not saying their employees can’t use birth control. The Catholic Church is saying the Catholic Church shouldn’t have to pay for birth control because it violates their beliefs. The employees are certainly permitted to pay for their own birth control if they want to use it.

It is Obama who believes he has the right to impose his values on the country.

(By the way, I’m pro-choice, because IMO the government has no business getting involved in these decisions. I don’t want to force my position on anyone else, and I don’t want the government forcing someone else’s beliefs on me.)

I don’t understand how our country got to the point where if the government or employer didn’t provide something, a person was too helpless to get it for him or herself. Why can’t a person buy his or her own condoms or birth control pills? Why can this only be obtained through an employer?

Not every Catholic believes that taking birth control pills amounts to a sin against humanity. Perhaps that was true 2000 years ago when the world population was insignificant, but not so today.

bayam on February 13, 2012 at 2:12 PM

The issue is not whether birth control is moral or not, or whether some Catholics take birth control or not; the issue is that the government SHALL NOT MAKE ANY LAW PROHIBITING THE FREE EXERCISE OF RELIGION. Whether you think this is okay or not is immaterial; if practicing people of faith find this to be untenable with their faith, then their objection is important enough to fall under a First Amendment protection from this mandate.

You should be horrified to see this bald powergrab from Washington. This is horrifying, unprecedented, and further proof that the populace of the United States does not value their freedom and is having it stolen from them. Woe is us.

But you go and sit in your little Catholic pew on Sunday and listen to that Priest as he rants against Obama – and then you realize that the Catholic Church has BACKED every single big government welfare program for the last 50 years – INCLUDING OBAMACARE.

A Republican should add an amendment to a bill that forces PETA members to provide free fur coats to all their employees. Let the MSM/Democrats tell us why this would be a dumb idea.

angryed on February 13, 2012 at 3:12 PM

and leather shoes for all children-they shouldn’t have to go barefoot. And Mosques should have to hold weekly pork barbecues for the homeless and Orthodox synagogues should have to buy everyone bacon cheeseburgers.

But I’m just as horrified by ObamaCare – which the Catholic Church endorsed.

I’m also horrified by Fast and Furious – which no one will do a damn thing about.

I’m also horrified that this administration thinks it’s okay to intimidate voters – as long as they are white and the ones doing the intimidating are black.

I’m horrified about a lot of things but …

I haven’t heard the Catholic Church speak out against any one of those other things I’m horrified about. In fact – the church was a willing co-conspirator in the passage of ObamaCare – if that had not passed, then their rights would not be in violation right now.

We got other problems – I’m not worried about the Catholic Church and its own SELF-CREATED ones.

Let ‘em squirm. Hell – something like 80% or more of the Catholics in this nation actively practice birth control anyway.

Not like they have a complete “handle” on this isse – with the government OR their congregation.

HondaV65 on February 13, 2012 at 3:24 PM

Whether “something like 80% or more” Catholics (a number I suspect you just pulled from a nether orifice), use contraception is not the debate here. The debate is over whether the government can force a church, in this case the Catholic Church, to perform activities which run counter to its core beliefs. The 1st Amendment says that it can’t.

something like 80% or more of the Catholics in this nation actively practice birth control anyway.

Please….. you’re argument’s getting thin. As a practicing Catholic I can say you haven’t been in the pews lately, and it seems (I’m guessing, I’m not stating from certainty like you) you carry a deep resentment on the Catholic orthidoxy.

So they shouldn’t have been stupid. So what?

You ever do something stupid?

Did you realize your mistake and try to correct it, or did you sit on you hands and say, “well, life’s tough, I’ll keep doing something stupid.”

So if you never did anything stupid, I guess keep on speaking.

“But as they persisted asking him, he stood up and he said to them, ‘He among you who is without sin, let him first cast a stone upon her.’” John 8:7

something like 80% or more of the Catholics in this nation actively practice birth control anyway.

Sorry….. bad post….

Please….. you’re argument’s getting thin. As a practicing Catholic I can say you haven’t been in the pews lately, and it seems (I’m guessing, I’m not stating from certainty like you) you carry a deep resentment on the Catholic orthidoxy.

So they shouldn’t have been stupid. So what?

You ever do something stupid?

Did you realize your mistake and try to correct it, or did you sit on you hands and say, “well, life’s tough, I’ll keep doing something stupid.”

So if you never did anything stupid, I guess keep on speaking.

“But as they persisted asking him, he stood up and he said to them, ‘He among you who is without sin, let him first cast a stone upon her.’” John 8:7

The Catholic Church made the bed – let ‘em sleep in it. Elections have consequences folks. Backing big government legislation has consequences. They endorsed ObamaCare and now find themselves violated by it.

Yes I did – I put my arm in an ENERGIZED AN/SPA-25 radar repeater once … and I touched something metallic.

IT KNOCKED MY D*** IN THE DIRT.

Stupidity has consequences – and I’ve paid for every act of stupidity I’ve ever committed. I’ve never tried to escape the consequences of my own stupidity.

The Catholic Church had an opportunity to voice their opposition to ObamaCare – they didn’t. In fact, by omission – they ENDORSED ObamaCare because everyone who spoke out in the Church spoke FOR ObamaCare.

So they can deal with the consequences – I’m not pi$$ing my pants to help them out.

I respect your opinion but have trouble understanding how that’s the case unless women are forced to take birth control pills. The rule has no such provision.
It seems to me the Catholic Church believes it has the right to impose its values upon all its employee, including those who are not Catholic.

bayam on February 13, 2012 at 2:26 PM

Bayam,

How is the Roman Catholic Church imposing Her beliefs on non-Catholics who work in Her institutions? Is the Church saying that if non-Catholics or Catholics who work for one of Her institutions the Church will kill them? tax them? prosecute them? persecute them?

Is the Church barring any one individual who works for one of Her institutions from using his/her own money to buy his/her contraceptive wants? Is the Church saying that if you buy contraceptives the Church will not give you your wages, your salary?

Please explain in detail how what you are saying makes any sense!

The Church is not imposing Her values on no one. You on the other and this Obama administration are imposing your values on the Church. You are forcing the Church to break one of its teachings, tenants, dogmas and buy services from health insurance companies which will give contraceptives for free.

But they have no problems with their congregation’s hard earned money being involuntarily TAKEN from them to fund abortions by Planned Parenthood?

Look man – the Catholic Church has some sorry priorities. They lost this fight a long time ago – when they refused to fight it and they embraced big, overwhelming, all-seeing, all-knowing, all-taking government. Again – they made this bed – let ‘em sleep in it.

Personally – I’m more concerned about Brian Terry losing his life to the guns of Fast and Furious. Brian Terry wasn’t complicent in that program like the Catholic Church was with ObamaCare.

Let me ask you a question. Set aside for now your anti-Catholic ranting and think about this. If the government came along and said they don’t like some of the stuff you’ve been writing on Hot Air, it upsets some people, so they’ve decided that in order for you to post on any blogs from now on you can only make comments that are favorable to the government or which promote government programs, even programs which are morally repugnant to you. If you fail to do and say what the government tells you, you will be heavily fined.

Are you ok with this? You seem to suggest that the government can do this to the Catholic Church, so why shouldn’t they be able to do it to you? I doubt it very much and probably because you value your 1st Amendment right to free speech. Why then can’t you see that the Catholic Church has a 1st Amendment right not to have the government interfere with the practice of their religion? Or do you get to pick and chose which parts of the 1st Amendment apply to you and not to others?

It seems to me the Catholic Church believes it has the right to impose its values upon all its employee, including those who are not Catholic.

bayam on February 13, 2012 at 2:26 PM

Bayam,

By the way, companies do this all the time. If you choose to work for a company, the company imposes their values on you. You have to be at work at the time they tell you. You have to leave work when they say so. Sick time, vacation time is on their terms and values. etc., etc., etc., etc. When you CHOOSE to work for a company, organization, non-for-profit or any type of institution you are also choosing to follow their value. If you do not like it you have the FREEDOM to quit and find an organization that matches with your values.

It is obvious to anyone with a brain that the Obama administration and you believe that you have the right to impose your immoral values upon all of your fellow citizens to the point that you want people to cover for your sexual needs.

Personally – I’m more concerned about Brian Terry losing his life to the guns of Fast and Furious. Brian Terry wasn’t complicent in that program like the Catholic Church was with ObamaCare.

HondaV65 on February 13, 2012 at 3:47 PM

Well, sorry, not all of us Catholics agreed with the Church with Obamacare. And just because SOME, not all, in the Church supported Obamacare it does not mean that all of us must now take a step back and stay silent when our Freedom of Religion is being violated.

This affects many more religious denominations than only Catholics. This also affects small business individuals who believe contraceptives are immoral, wrong, etc. I personally know quite a few doctors who through study believe that contraceptives are a very dangerous procedures/medication and they are FAR from being Catholic or religious. However, since they run a small business, a physicians office, they are being forced to go against their morality, against what they scientificly know.

This is the Obama administration appeasing Planned Parenthood, NOW, NARAL and the rest of the incredibly evil, blood thirsty abortion industry.

By the word “always”, you mean the Church preached abstinence as a form of family planning before birth control existed.

You’ll also find that the Bible forbid pork consumption at a time when humanity did not realize that thoroughly cooking pork would kill trichinosis rendering it safe to eat. People fail to recognize that many early Church tenants were grounded in very practical human wellness issues, and that some of those issues have changed in nature over time.

bayam on February 13, 2012 at 2:48 PM

Bayam,

and your point is that government has the righ to the Roman Catholic Church that She needs to change Her dogmas, tenants, teachings? unsure where you are going with your argument above other than to tell us you disagree with Her teachings and because you disagree with Her you feel government has the right to impose on the Church the government’s and your morals.

They had birth control pills 2,000 years ago? Wow, who would have thought…

No, they didn’t have the pill, but they had contraceptive devices and they certainly had abortifacients, including silphium.

The Catholic Church is the oldest institution on the planet. It’s been there, done that. It watched the Roman Empire collapse, the rise and fall of nations–and it knows in its bones what works to the moral benefit of mankind and what doesn’t. And even before Christian theologians came on the scene, Roman stoic philosophers rejected abortion and contraceptive devices which they recognized were harmful to society, encouraging moral dissolution generally. Read Seneca or Cicero. This is not a new argument, it’s as old as civilization.

Family planning is not the sole result of such usage. It’s everything else that the pill enables that’s problematic–the sexual revolution generally. This is what Obama seeks to force the Church to accept by fiat.

Well, sorry, not all of us Catholics agreed with the Church with Obamacare. And just because SOME, not all, in the Church supported Obamacare

Cpt. Kirk on February 13, 2012 at 3:55 PM

Your religious leaders surely supported it.

Name ONE that spoke out against the final version of the bill. The only time the church voiced disapproval for the abomination that is ObamaCare is when there was a provision to federally fund abortions. Once that was removed … or once it was “removed” to their satisfaction – they voiced no opposition whatsoever and even some came right out and endorsed it – saying, effectively … “that universal healthcare is a charitable act by the government”.

Now – I feel sorry for you Catholics who supported your leaders – who sold you down this path of losing your religious freedoms. However, you aren’t totally blameless – since the majority of you DID vote for Obama in 2008. Not that voting for McCain would have made that much difference though either.

If Catholics are serious – let them put ONE MILLION CATHOLICS into Washington, DC to protest this because …

The TEA PARTY did exactly that a couple of years ago – and fought tooth and nail to protect the Catholic Church’s right to religious freedom by OPPOSING OBAMACARE.

The Church – SUPPORTED OBAMACARE – and now that it’s been FORCED on us (with their help, mind you) – they want to complain because it’s taking away their religious liberty?

Pfft! The legislation THEY SUPPORTED took away basically ALL OF MY LIBERTY.