Yea. He trolls around looking for new victims w different handles. He pretends to be cool for a week or so, then attacks you out of nowhere. Did it to me a couple of times. Usually over the Palmer thing. I can pick him out right away now tho. Because he tries to make you look stupid to win his debate. Argues like a child calling you stupid and dumb and clueless and weak and a woman and shlt w circular logic that is impossible to argue with. He states obvious facts then claims you disagree w him. Hes a friggin sociopath. Nobody else does that here, not even brown stains.

Yeah, it’s cool to have debates in here that are with people that don’t resort to name calling and all that jazz…
Like we had a mini debate going about Nnamdi yesterday with Snbg…and I don’t remember one name calling…

hwnrdr

We were really good in 85 too. Had the only defense to rival the Bears in that era.

Yup…and I think we lost to NE that year, right?

J Hill

Let’s throw a bomb on every down…

——————————————————————————–

LOL

WRs better get in shape.

0ak r8rs

DJ Johnny Says:
July 22nd, 2013 at 3:26 pm
We heard so much about “when Al dies or quits we will get back on top. Just wait till the old man goes. Things will be so much different”

Things appear to be much worse in so many ways.

The state of the franchise financially. The roster. Tarps.

One thing I was certain would improve is the media coverage, analysis and opinion.

It seems even THAT has plummeted to ridiculously low levels.

Al is gone and as it stands right now NOTHING has gotten better. New computers for scouts and fresh carpeting doesn’t count….or less penalites. Who gives a crap about that when you’re 4-12?

I really expected more after Al’s passing.

@@@@@@@

I’d like to see more and faster progress as well. But realistically it takes more than 18 months to fix two decades of mess. It wasn’t just the contracts and the trades and the drafts. It was the whole mindset. Gonna take another year or two. It is what it is.

nycraider

gonna be really interesting in here when the blame Al game can no longer be used.

Charlie

NYC

You refer to excuses as opposed to our reality from 2003 through 2011.
45-99 over that span finishing at $30 million over the cap with no draft picks. 9-46 against playoff teams during that time losing by an average score of 30-13.
Drafting guys like JR and McClain who are out of football by the age of 24 while paying exorbitant summs of money to Turdell Sands and the like.
(Hardly the good old days).

You think anyone can come in and fix in two years what was created over nine dreadful seasons.

How long did it take Carroll and Shanahan to get back to the playoffs during their new starts with far less obstacles in front of them than what faced the Raiders at the end of the 2011 season? (Answer 3 seasons).

The new regime has been on the job for about 18 months.
This is a minimum 3 year rebuild to return to the playoffs.

“Yea. He trolls around looking for new victims w different handles. He pretends to be cool for a week or so, then attacks you out of nowhere. Did it to me a couple of times. Usually over the Palmer thing. I can pick him out right away now tho. Because he tries to make you look stupid to win his debate. Argues like a child calling you stupid and dumb and clueless and weak and a woman and shlt w circular logic that is impossible to argue with. He states obvious facts then claims you disagree w him. Hes a friggin sociopath. Nobody else does that here, not even brown stains.

Yeah, it’s cool to have debates in here that are with people that don’t resort to name calling and all that jazz…
Like we had a mini debate going about Nnamdi yesterday with Snbg…and I don’t remember one name calling…”

Yeah Oak and I have had a few hard core debates but we are cool we respect each other and I think that’s the defining difference between us and the trolls.

“gonna be really interesting in here when the blame Al game can no longer be used.”

I have to agree with you here that card has been played so often its worn out…I think its time to wean RM from that teet.

Charlie

Guest

That 83′ team was the best Raider team ever IMO.

I agree with you that the level of consistent success started in the late 60’s when we drfated Upshaw.

Those teams through the seventies were very good and very consistent.
We had two problems during that era. The Steelers and Dolphins. Otherwise we have more than 3 titles.

Charlie

OAKR8’s

Agreed. See my 3607 post.

How some can expect a quick turnaround given our reality is beyond me.

I admire Mr. Davis and what he accomplished during his lifetime but the last 9 seasons were a total disaster.

0ak r8rs

Hwnrdr Says:
July 23rd, 2013 at 6:56 am
We were really good in 85 too. Had the only defense to rival the Bears in that era.

Yup…and I think we lost to NE that year, right?

@@@@@

Yea. Another one of those superbowls that could have been for us. A lot of people thought we were better than Chicago that year. Honestly tho, that 85 Chicago defense was the best I’ve ever seen. Better than the ravens defense that knocked us out in 2001.

nycraider

Charlie, you twist and weave your way into one excuse after another. This regime has had 2 full off seasons to right the wrongs.We seen many NFL franchises rebuild in 1 or 2 years. If your expectation is getting 50 million under the salary cap for 2014 is enough then so be it. 2014 no excuses,..agreed?
I look forward to seeing Hayden suit up for training camp like our management team said he would. I look forward to seeing the gems of reggie’s 2013 draft. I look forward to the experts being wrong that Reggie has put together the worst DL and LB crew in the NFL, then the 2nd to worst QB and WRs core currently ranked.
This is your last year you will be able to blame Al for everything. Start working on your new excuses.

guest123

That 83′ team was the best Raider team ever IMO.

*******

@ Charlie,

that may be so, but my favorite Raiders team was the 79 team. they did what no one said a team could do. win a super bowl as a wildcard team.

0ak r8rs

This blog would be no fun without the debate. I love it. Almost addicted to it I have to admit. But it doesn’t change my way of life or event day. It’s football. And it’s important. But it’s not worth name calling (most of the time, haha) and it shouldn’t ruin your day or even your moment. But if we all agreed about everything this blog would be just one big boring hug fest. And that would be pointless.

hwnrdr

3614.guest123 Says:
July 23rd, 2013 at 7:21 am
That 83′ team was the best Raider team ever IMO.

*******

@ Charlie,

that may be so, but my favorite Raiders team was the 79 team. they did what no one said a team could do. win a super bowl as a wildcard team.

That was 1980…and my fave team was 76! But yeah, that 80 team exceeded my expectations!

Marks hair

still no story? fuuuuck… come on cork!

Charlie

NYC

I agree that I would hope we would be in the playoffs by 2014. If that is accomplished IMO it would be the single best reconstruction in the history of the NFL IN THE CAP era.

There is a stark contrast to what I call our reality and what you refer to as excuses.

As I have said on many posts, I admire Mr. Davis for what he did for the Raiders, the AFL and the game of football during his lifetime.
I have also supported with FACTS the disaster the new regime faced at the end of 2011 regarding player contracts with no offset language, our lack of roster talent and draft picks, a medeival scouting department responsible for JR and McClain, $30 million over the cap etc. etc.

There has never been a franchise in this level of disarray during the cap era in the history of the NFL.

I would love a quick return to respectability as much as anyone on this blog. I have been a fan for longer than most. The barriers to a quick turn around are simply too significant for that to happen in less than 3 years IMO.

Dr. Hunter S. Thompson

Reggie’s reputation is toast.

FIRE REGGIE NOW.

Charlie

Guest and Hwndr

Those were the days that forged my belief in building winning footbal teams with the Oline and your front seven.

We were able to bring in guys like Bobby Chandler, Jim Plunkett, Dwayne O’Steen, Kenny King, Burgess Owens at the skill spots and DB and win titles.

Raiderfusion Says:
July 23rd, 2013 at 5:15 am
GDog and DJJohnny: Your mentality, the old mentality like Als was the problem, and why the Raiders for the last 10yrs was arguably the worst team in all of sports.
For years Al brought in overpriced talent that didn’t perform the way we needed them to,because they were never held accountable. When the Raiders were great they always had Ron Wolf as a steadying hand next to Al where Al could have someone to bounce his ideas off of, and reason him out of the unsound ones. Bringing in Sap or Seymour, giving huge contracts to Kelly, Rout among others. Mark Davis has signed one of Ron Wolf’s proteges to fix this fricking mess. We have to believe RM is righting the ship to go the distance. RM had no money or picks to do anything, he will now have both to move forward with. GIVE HIM TIME!
You have no faith in RM, but you had all the faith in the world in Al who did nothing but destroy the best football franchise of the prior 30 years. Have courage boys RN will get it done the right way.
RediaR, youu’re the only one who made any sense in that blog response #3560.

@@@@

Ditto to all of that. Except DJ being a hater in #3560. It’s pretty clear he loves this team. Just frustrated I think. Consistent championship teams don’t just fall from the sky. And I’m not interested in a “one an done” strategy either like the Fish. We’ve suffered through below mediocrity for basically two decades. I’d consider it worth it I’d we were competitive for the next decade or two. Starting w some quality showings this year.

“There has never been a franchise in this level of disarray during the cap era in the history of the NFL.”

That is true BUT expansion teams have made the playoffs after 2 or 3 years and I would say that is a more difficult task than a full on rebuild by a team that has been around for decades IMO.

Charlie

HST

Welcome back.

Could you at least change the font in your posts?

willy91137

What the hell have they done to the blog I have a hell time trying to find IT

ElkGRaider

Charlie…

All depends on QB play. We can break down positions and talent but with no above average qb (minimum), there is no return to greatness. (i.e. Jason Campbell 8-8 seasons that somehow get glorified)

Dr. Hunter S. Thompson

Reggie has turned the Raiders into an expansion team.

0-16.

FIRE REGGIE NOW.

Marks hair

suck cork.. u totally suck.

0ak r8rs

Silverandblack666 Says:
July 23rd, 2013 at 7:39 am
“There has never been a franchise in this level of disarray during the cap era in the history of the NFL.”

That is true BUT expansion teams have made the playoffs after 2 or 3 years and I would say that is a more difficult task than a full on rebuild by a team that has been around for decades IMO.

@@@@@@

Still making our point tho. Those expansion teams (Carolina specifically you may be talking about) were solid for a couple of years. But they didn’t maintain it. They didn’t have the depth or the base to maintain anything. Jacksonville and Carolina r two of the worst teams in the league right now. And have been for years.

ElkGRaider

Nycraider Says:
July 23rd, 2013 at 7:19 am
Charlie, you twist and weave your way into one excuse after another. This regime has had 2 full off seasons to right the wrongs.We seen many NFL franchises rebuild in 1 or 2 years. If your expectation is getting 50 million under the salary cap for 2014 is enough then so be it. 2014 no excuses,..agreed?
I look forward to seeing Hayden suit up for training camp like our management team said he would. I look forward to seeing the gems of reggie’s 2013 draft. I look forward to the experts being wrong that Reggie has put together the worst DL and LB crew in the NFL, then the 2nd to worst QB and WRs core currently ranked.
This is your last year you will be able to blame Al for everything. Start working on your new excuses.
————-

one day till camp and I still can’t blog… fu cork and jerry. just quit, you don’t care about your job

nycraider

In all due respect killing Al for drafting Jamarcus and McClain is so uncalled for. Many many experts and semis in here supported the Jamarcus pick at the time. You can blame Al for not hiring the right coaches to develop jamarcus i guess. But not the pick
When Mcclain was drafted many in here including Jerry Mac supported the pick. in fact that years draft was rated the best in the NFL after that rookie class completed year 1.
To me, it was Al’s consistent coaching changes and letting gruden go that hurt our franchise.
Criticizing these picks is just piling on.

Lets not go patting Reggie on the back for cutting huge salaries and replacing them with second tier less expensive players.

Which means he is relying on “Good coaching” to build a winner. This is where a lot of us get concerned.

Ultimately Reggie will be judged by the talent he brings here and how that talent preforms on Sunday. Which is why the DJ Hayden pick is so controversial!

Charlie

SnB666

The cap was introduced in 1994.
The Panthers were the most succesful start up in the history of the game.

Below is what the Panthers and Jaguars were given:

“The 1995 National Football League Expansion Draft was held on February 15, 1995.[1] The two new expansion teams, the Carolina Panthers and the Jacksonville Jaguars alternated picks from lists of unprotected players from existing franchises. Existing NFL teams made six players available,[2] and the new teams were required to pick a minimum of 30 and a maximum of 42 players. Each time one of the expansion franchises selected a player from an existing team, that team was then permitted to remove a remaining player from its list of available players.

In addition to these draft picks, the Panthers received the first pick in the 1995 NFL Draft, and the Jaguars were given the second pick.

That is a far cry better than being over the cap by $30 million with player contracts with no offset language and no draft picks.

Even with the quick success, the Panthers faded very quickly.

“The Panthers managed only a 7–9 finish in 1997 and slipped to 4–12 in 1998, leading to the firing of Capers as the team’s head coach.[8] The Panthers hired former San Francisco 49ers coach George Seifert to replace Capers, and Seifert led the team to an 8–8 record in 1999, his first season. However, the Panthers finished 7–9 in 2000 and fell to 1–15 in 2001, winning their first game but losing their last 15. The Panthers fired Seifert after the season.[11]”

Not a sustainable model.

nycraider

ElkGRaider Says:
July 23rd, 2013 at 7:48 am
Nycraider Says:
July 23rd, 2013 at 7:19 am
Charlie, you twist and weave your way into one excuse after another. This regime has had 2 full off seasons to right the wrongs.We seen many NFL franchises rebuild in 1 or 2 years. If your expectation is getting 50 million under the salary cap for 2014 is enough then so be it. 2014 no excuses,..agreed?
I look forward to seeing Hayden suit up for training camp like our management team said he would. I look forward to seeing the gems of reggie’s 2013 draft. I look forward to the experts being wrong that Reggie has put together the worst DL and LB crew in the NFL, then the 2nd to worst QB and WRs core currently ranked.
This is your last year you will be able to blame Al for everything. Start working on your new excuses.
————-

Please put your expectations in wins and losses. Not some subjective “worst crews” bullish!t…
——————
unless we get lightning in a bottle in tp6 or dmac being healthly again we are in for another4-6 win season. Now whats your prediction

Charlie

Oak R8

Right again. See my 3633 post.

nycraider

How many franchises that have long term success do it without an all pro type QB.

I’m asking what you believe would be a successful year. Me? 7 wins. It’s a lot easier to judge a regime that way…

Charlie

NYC

I agree with your point about an All Pro QB but he will not flourish behind anything but a very solid OLine that can also run the ball and bring a balanced attack against a good defense.

It is why the Raiders of the past were so consistently successful.

Hall of Fame level Oline and very good front seven play.

That is the reason for my constant hope to upgrade the Oline with high round picks. I assure you Plunkett won two Super Bowls because he was finally able to throw the ball with Oakland as opposed to running for his life in NE and SF.

nycraider

Charlie, not sure if the downfall was the actual picks or coaching staff choices or combination.. But its 2013 , and Al had no influence on Reggie’s draft this year. Al did not trade down and get mocked by the phins owner and then with our 1st pick take the biggest risk in the draft who was rated by a good amount of teams as a second round draft pick.
Once again, I look forward to see the gems of reggie’s 2013 draft. I look forward to seeing Hayden suit up and play like management said he would.
i understand that if the raiders dont win in 2013, many like yourself feel its still Al’s fault. Thats a position that maybe we will never see eye to eye on. However, Reggie’s 2013 draft is his to own, his pick of hayden is his to own, and next year Al Davis is no longer an excuse. I am hoping that Reggie wins GM of the year, I just would like to see more than his ability to cut salary before admiring the job he’s done. Time will reveal all.

nycraider

ElkGRaider Says:
July 23rd, 2013 at 8:10 am
Nyc…

I’m asking what you believe would be a successful year. Me? 7 wins. It’s a lot easier to judge a regim
——————-
We are close. a successful year for me is to get back to 8-8 with all that cap space next year.

theghostronin79

Time will reveal all.

============

That’s exactly right……. And why anyone is jumping to snap conclusions about ANYTHING, is really beyond me. It’s a little unreasonable I think.

0ak r8rs

Nycraider Says:
July 23rd, 2013 at 7:53 am
In all due respect killing Al for drafting Jamarcus and McClain is so uncalled for. Many many experts and semis in here supported the Jamarcus pick at the time. You can blame Al for not hiring the right coaches to develop jamarcus i guess. But not the pick
When Mcclain was drafted many in here including Jerry Mac supported the pick. in fact that years draft was rated the best in the NFL after that rookie class completed year 1.
To me, it was Al’s consistent coaching changes and letting gruden go that hurt our franchise.
Criticizing these picks is just piling on.

@@@@@@

I blame him for both. Both had work ethic and attitude questions prior to being drafted. JaWalrus more than McClown. As usual, Al ignored these red flags and drafted simply on athletic ability and need. Its true that alot of people thought mcclown was a good pick, not nearly as consensus a pick as jawalrus. He didn’t draft football players. He didn’t sign football players either. I consider every pick and signing of Reggie’s as being Reggie’s fault or credit. I consider everyone of Al’s moves the same. If you’re in charge, it’s on you. Period.

DJ Johnny

nycraider Says:
July 23rd, 2013 at 7:53 am
In all due respect killing Al for drafting Jamarcus and McClain is so uncalled for. Many many experts and semis in here supported the Jamarcus pick at the time. You can blame Al for not hiring the right coaches to develop jamarcus i guess. But not the pick
When Mcclain was drafted many in here including Jerry Mac supported the pick. in fact that years draft was rated the best in the NFL after that rookie class completed year 1.
To me, it was Al’s consistent coaching changes and letting gruden go that hurt our franchise.
Criticizing these picks is just piling on.
—
Ask the SB champion Ravens where they had Jamarcus on their board. Ask draft expert Mel Kiper Jr. if he didn’t call Russell “the next Elway”. Al gets too much crap for that pick. Hindsight is easy. Same with McClain.

The problem with Russell lies in how he was handled once he was drafted imo, and of course he himself is to blame.

When u look at what Al got for Gruden…a coach who was looking to get out anyway, I don’t see how you don’t make that deal.

Al got like 8 mill in cash…2 1st rounders and 2 2nd rounders. Imo, it’s what he did with that windfall that is in question..not the trade itself.

DJ Johnny

Oakr8rs says: “I consider every pick and signing of Reggie’s as being Reggie’s fault or credit. I consider everyone of Al’s moves the same. If you’re in charge, it’s on you. Period.”
—
You can’t argue that. Last night Kell got all nasty with me for suggesting there comes a time when everything isn’t Al’s fault. When is that time?

For as much as Kell was getting hammered about his personal life…relentlessly…it’s no wonder it put him in a foul mood.

I never saw why some go after him so heavy without a break.

Must be stuff that predates my arrival here.

0ak r8rs

I look forward to the experts being wrong that Reggie has put together the worst DL and LB crew in the NFL, then

@@@@@

Did someone actually say we have the worst LB crew in the league? I could see them saying that when it comes to DL, particularly where pass rush is concerned. But we r light years ahead of last year’s LB crew. Burris started like 13 games as a 5th round rookie last year. He may not see more than 20 snaps a game this year. I’m not disputing some talking head said that. But I think he would be wrong. Either that or the other 31 teams ALL did better w LBs than us? I just don’t buy that.

0ak r8rs

When u look at what Al got for Gruden…a coach who was looking to get out anyway, I don’t see how you don’t make that deal.

Al got like 8 mill in cash…2 1st rounders and 2 2nd rounders. Imo, it’s what he did with that windfall that is in question..not the trade itself.

@@@@@

We probably shouldn’t mention what Al did w those picks. Disastrous. As usual.