Whenever I see him talk it's like he just snorted a line of cocaine off Chris Berman's ass.

Dunit35

03-06-2006, 05:32 PM

He's tiny and can't play zone to save his life. I think we'd have better options.

If he can't play zone than no thanks. I would rather go for a DT than a CB.

jidar

03-06-2006, 05:39 PM

speed helps obviously, but there is a lot more to playing CB.

Mr. Laz

03-06-2006, 05:51 PM

speed helps obviously, but there is a lot more to playing CB.

who said he was just speed?

T. Hill Fact: Tied the Clemson record for passes defended in a season when he had 21 in 2004.

Years Lettered: 2002,03,04 Bowl Participation: Reserve running back in the 2002 Tangerine Bowl against Texas Tech and starting cornerback in the 2004 Peach Bowl against #6 Tennessee. Fall 2005 Depth Chart Position: First-team cornerback Overview: Listed as the seventh-best cornerback in the nation by Lindy's in its 2005 preseason issue...16th-best cornerback in the nation by Phil Steele...preseason first-team All-ACC selection by Lindy's and Street & Smith...preseason second-team All-ACC by Athlon and Phil Steele...third in the nation in passes defended (21) in the 11 games in 2004...Honorable Mention All-ACC defensive back in 2004...set the Clemson record for pass breakups and tied the record for passes defended in a season ...had twice as many passes defended as any other Tiger and led the ACC in that category...

joins Jamaal Fudge as the only active Tigers entering their third year as a starter; he started on the 2003 team as a cornerback...began his career as a running back, a position he played as a first-year freshman when he red-shirted (2001) and in 2002...one of a few players in recent years to have a 100-yard rushing game and intercept a pass over his career...has had an accomplished track career at Clemson, one highlighted in the 2003-04 academic year when he won the ACC title in the 60m indoors (6.73) and the 100m outdoors (10.29); Olympic Gold Medalist Shawn Crawford (1999-00) had been the last Tiger to do that double in the same academic year, and Hill was just the seventh Clemson track athlete in school history to win both speed events in the same year...competed in limited fashion indoors and outdoors this past year, as he spent more time on football...competed for Clemson's outdoor ACC Championship track team in the spring of 2004...started every game in 2004 and each of the last 20 over two years...has started 22 of the last 24 games, including each of the last 20 over two years...has played in 37 games in a row over three years, joining Jamaal Fudge and David Dunham as the only active Tigers to play in every game the last three years...has 89 tackles over the last two years and 28 pass breakups, eighth most in Tiger history...veteran of 1,591 plays in his career, including 1,462 on defense and 129 on offense...has 30 career passes defended, more than any other active Tiger...has at least one tackle in 24 straight games...named Clemson's most improved player in 2003 and 2004, only the second Tiger in history to win the award in consecutive years. 2004: Had 13 of his 21 passes defended in the last five games...had a career-high-tying four pass breakups in victories over #10 Miami (FL) and South

Carolina...defended on Miami's (FL) last play in overtime to clinch the victory for the Tigers...had two tackles for loss, including a sack, in the Georgia Tech game...had a season-high eight tackles in the win over N.C. State, including six first hits...had eight tackles and three pass breakups at Florida State...had three pass breakups in the win over Maryland...recipient of the Hustle Award for the Tiger defense...played at least 44 snaps in every game and averaged 71.3 plays per game...on the field for 95 percent of the snaps...had at least two tackles in all 11 games...a big reason Clemson finished the year 12th in the nation in pass efficiency defense. 2003: Started 11 of the 13 games and played 678 snaps...had seven pass breakups and two interceptions...had two pass breakups against #6 Tennessee in the Peach Bowl...finished with nine passes defended...had thefts against #24 Virginia and #3 Florida State...named Clemson's Defensive Player-of-the-Game against Florida State by the Clemson coaching staff...set the tone for the game against the Seminoles with an interception on their second drive; also had a caused fumble and a pass deflection that saved a touchdown; had four tackles in playing all 69 defensive snaps that game; earned ACC Defensive Back-of-the-Week honors for that performance...a big reason Clemson's pass defense was much improved...consistent on defense; he had between two and four tackles in each of the last 10 games...had two tackles and an interception against #24 Virginia; the interception ended Virginia's final chance to kick a game-winning field goal in regulation; the interception sent the game to overtime, which Clemson won 30-27...had 37 tackles for the year, but 34 were first hits; so he made some big tackles out on the "island" as a cornerback...started every game, but the Middle Tennessee and Georgia Tech games...started each of the last nine games...honored as Defensive Rookie-of-the-Year by the Tiger coaches. 2002: Clemson's third-leading rusher as a freshman with 225 yards on 42 carries...led all Tiger running backs in yards per carry (5.4)...Clemson's leading rusher in the Tangerine Bowl against Texas Tech...scored two touchdowns, one on a 32-yard run at Virginia and one on a nine-yard run at North Carolina...had his best game at North Carolina when he had 105 yards on 14 rushes...one of just two 100-yard games by Tiger running backs...joined Bernard Rambert in becoming the first Tiger combo to go over 100 yards in the same game since Raymond Priester and Kelton Dunnican did it in 1996 at Virginia...had 10 carries for 43 yards against Ball State in his first significant outing; he played 18 snaps in that game...had three rushes for 43 yards at Virginia, the 32-yard touchdown run came on Clemson's last possession of the first half...had 24 of his 42 carries against Ball State and North Carolina...carried the ball in eight of the 13 games; he played in every game on special teams...played 129 snaps overall in the 13 games, including a season-high 34 snaps against Texas Tech. 2001: Red-shirted as a running back...had an outstanding spring, capped by a 13-carry, 50-yard rushing effort in the 2002 Spring Game at Riggs Field...switched his jersey number from #13 to #8 at the conclusion of spring practice. Track (2003-04): Outdoor - ACC outdoor 100m champion and indoor 60m champion...a big contributor to Clemson's 2004 outdoor ACC team title...NCAA Outdoor Qualifier in the 100m, 200m, and 4x100m relay...Outdoor ACC Champion & All-ACC in the 100m dash...Outdoor ACC Champion & All-ACC in the 4x100m relay...recorded a time of 10.27 in the preliminaries of the 100m, tying his season-best mark...member of the Tigers' ACC Champion 4x100m relay team, running second leg...Indoor - Won the ACC Championship in the 60m dash with a time of 6.73. Track (2002-03): Outdoor - Ran the second leg of the Tigers' 4x100m relay team that posted a season-best time (39.69) at the NCAA meet...at the Georgia Tech Invitational, he ran a season-best 10.48 in the 100m...member of the Tigers' ACC Championship 4x100m relay team that posted a regional-qualifying time of 40.20...Indoor - Posted a season-best time of 6.77 in the 60m at the Maryland Invitational to win the event. Track (2001-02): Outdoor - Red-shirted...Indoor - Recorded a season-best time of 6.94 in the preliminaries of the 60m at the Virginia Tech Challenge. Before Clemson: All-state selection as a junior and senior...All-Lowcountry as a junior and senior...Region 7-AA team selection as a junior and senior...all-area by Orangeburg Times & Democrat as a junior and senior...ranked as the #12 player in South Carolina by Mickey Plyler...ranked as #16 player in South Carolina by SuperPrep...rushed for 1,445 yards and 16 touchdowns in just seven games as a senior...played in the South Carolina North-South All-Star game in Myrtle Beach...a CBS.Sportsline.com All-American...All-American according to Prep Star...outstanding track athlete who was the Lowcountry Track Athlete-of-the-Year as a junior...was the 100-meter state champion as a junior with a time of 10.51...High School Sports Report Track Athlete-of-the-Year as a junior...second in the state in the 200m at the AA level as a junior; he had a time of 21.4...400m champion at the state AA meet as a junior with a time of 49.0...also on the state track championship 4X100m relay team...his high school team won the state team title at the AA level his junior season...played for Bryan Mahan...chose Clemson over Auburn, North Carolina, and South Carolina...born John Tye Hill on June 3, 1982...majoring in human resource development.

Valiant

03-06-2006, 06:05 PM

Your thoughts?

No, would rather spend all our picks on the front seven thru draft and FA...

You can afford average CB's with a great pass rush...

Halfcan

03-06-2006, 07:09 PM

His high shcool team won when he was a junior-I'm sold.

Frankie

03-06-2006, 07:10 PM

I like him. But I like Tamba more.

TEX

03-06-2006, 07:38 PM

No, would rather spend all our picks on the front seven thru draft and FA...

You can afford average CB's with a great pass rush...

You know that's so true on both sides of the ball. You build from the line back and NOT the other way around.

Maybe, except had the CHIEFS drafted who he suggested the past 10 years, they would have definately drafted better. :hmmm:

ChiefsCountry

03-06-2006, 08:22 PM

I would like the DE from Boston College.

Husky4506

03-06-2006, 08:29 PM

uh Chad Jackson. He is gonna be real good real fast

beer bacon

03-06-2006, 08:34 PM

uh Chad Jackson. He is gonna be real good real fast

Why?

Husky4506

03-06-2006, 08:38 PM

WHY? Cause ez eddie is a solid reciever but he no #1. Chad can make plays not only is he big but he can fly. We need a big physical wideout.

Mr. Kotter

03-06-2006, 08:41 PM

maybe ... he fast and quick

his change of direction is better than anyone we have on the roster right now.

several guys might be there at #20 for us imo

tye hill
micheal huff
tamba hali
manny lawson
brodrick bunkley

If Huff is there, he'll be wearing Red 'n Gold. But he won't be....

Course, that's what I said last year about DJ. :)

Tribal Warfare

03-06-2006, 08:56 PM

BAA Huff, Hali , Bunkley , Hill, in that order.

Herm said" average corners can be disguised, but upfront is were the gamechangers are" in his interview with Rich Eisen after Rich asking him which position KC needs help more DB or the DL.

dj56dt58

03-06-2006, 09:09 PM

He's tiny and can't play zone to save his life. I think we'd have better options.
Anyone should be able to learn to play zone with a good secondary coach.

Cormac

03-07-2006, 07:27 AM

Herm said" average corners can be disguised, but upfront is were the gamechangers are" in his interview with Rich Eisen after Rich asking him which position KC needs help more DB or the DL.

:clap:

I'm beginning to warm to Herm.

htismaqe

03-07-2006, 07:31 AM

With Hill's performance at the combine, he could likely be the 2nd DB taken in the draft. I don't think he falls to 20.

Mr. Kotter

03-07-2006, 07:34 AM

Anyone should be able to learn to play zone with a good secondary coach.

Anyone can "play"--the question is do they have the speed, athletic ability, and, most importantly, instincts to make plays? Guess which one Warfield lacked most of the time? It's why Herm understood he's expendable.

TW's point is great: "Herm said" average corners can be disguised, but upfront is were the gamechangers are" in his interview with Rich Eisen after Rich asking him which position KC needs help more DB or the DL"... it is what we have forgotten the past 4-5 years.

I don't care who your corners are, if you consistently give the QB and WRs an extra 1-2 seconds to get "open".....even best CBs in the league are gonna get roasted over the course of the season.

We need pressure, or at least the consistent threat of serious pressure, on every passing play. And since 2000 or so, we simply haven't had it.

KC Jones

03-07-2006, 07:43 AM

Whenever I see him talk it's like he just snorted a line of cocaine off Chris Berman's ass.

:banghead:

:cuss: Damn you for putting that visual in my head! For now on keep your homo fantasies to yourself!

:mad:

jspchief

03-07-2006, 07:43 AM

I think Hill is a good CB prospect, but don't expect him to be great in his first year. He's slow to react in zone coverage, seemingly always a half step behind.

Rookie CBs rarely play well as starters, and I think Hill will be a downgrade from Warfield in his first year.

May be a great CB down the road, but I don't think he makes an immediate impact.

htismaqe

03-07-2006, 07:48 AM

I'd rather see us take Huff, Hali, or a DT and try to plug the CB spot.

ROYC75

03-07-2006, 08:03 AM

I'm all for Huff, but I'll be suprised to see him there when we pick.

I bet we go DT in the 1st rd.

htismaqe

03-07-2006, 08:04 AM

I'm all for Huff, but I'll be suprised to see him there when we pick.

I bet we go DT in the 1st rd.

I don't see Huff surviving to #20, either. I think some teams will tag him as a CB.

If we're looking at BAA, I don't see how we can take a DT at #20, there just aren't any that don't have question marks.

I think if the best safeties and ends are gone when we pick, we look to trade down for someone like Bunkley.

Frankie

03-07-2006, 08:27 AM

Chad can make plays not only is he big but he can fly. We need a big physical wideout.That would be Clark Kent.

Mr. Laz

03-07-2006, 10:10 AM

With Hill's performance at the combine, he could likely be the 2nd DB taken in the draft. I don't think he falls to 20.
I don't see Huff surviving to #20, either. I think some teams will tag him as a CB.

what does that make the top 30 athletes gone before we pick at 20 now??

htismaqe

03-07-2006, 10:25 AM

what does that make the top 30 athletes gone before we pick at 20 now??

You gonna be a dumbass and try to lump me in with someone else?

I think Huff and Hill will go before we pick. Huff will likely go in the top 10. There's 19 picks before us.

Mr. Laz

03-07-2006, 10:48 AM

You gonna be a dumbass

well ... ya

htismaqe

03-07-2006, 10:51 AM

well ... ya

ROFL

Tribal Warfare

03-07-2006, 01:46 PM

The general consensus is Huff, Hali, Bunkley, Hill

I would take Hali or Bunkley, because Huff would be gone by at worst #15 pick

royr17

03-08-2006, 05:19 AM

I'll tell u what, I really like that cornerback from South Carolina, forgot what his name is.

I also really like there safety too.

royr17

03-08-2006, 05:22 AM

I like Cornerback Jonathan Josepeh from South Carolina and Safety Ko Simpson

Frankie

03-08-2006, 08:34 AM

I like Cornerback Jonathan Josepeh from South Carolina and Safety Ko Simpson
Why? Rich Scanlon can play both positions. At the same time!

A CB has a learning curve of 2 or so years. Hill has the talent to immediately be our #2 CB. Add in the learning curve and he could be our Hasty for the next decade.

DT/DE are two of the easiest positions to play and good talent can be had at either in the 2nd round.

Hill and Huff, for the Chiefs, are just like DJ last year. If either are there, we'd be hard-pressed to pick someone else. It's just not probable that they will be.

That being said, Tamba Hali has a chance to be our Neil Smith for the next decade. He'd be hard to pass up as well.

ck_IN

03-08-2006, 08:51 AM

<i>Tamba Hali has a chance to be our Neil Smith</i>

If Hill and Bunkley are gone then I'd jump all over Hali. Hali on one end with Allen on the other would give a great pass rush.

However I'd take Hill because I think he has the ability to jump slants and 3 step routes that teams use when they do face a pass rush.

Bunkley is just an inside monster and would allow us to cut Sims rather then continue to waste time on him.

jspchief

03-08-2006, 09:00 AM

However I'd take Hill because I think he has the ability to jump slants and 3 step routes that teams use when they do face a pass rush.

Not in zone. I watched a whole video segment on Hill and his zone play. He's slow to react. He was always a step behind in his decision to commit. That's something that would likely improve with increased awareness/confidence, but for now, he's not a great zone CB.

I still wouldn't mind having him. I just don't think he'd be all that effective in his first year,

Jimmy Williams? Really? He insists he is a S, yet he'll be drafted in the 1st by somebody as a CB. With the arrogant attitude he's already showing, you really want to take that on? BTW, I assume you don't mean Mario or Deangelo Williams.

Aside from JW, I'm in full agreement with you list. I have a hard time seeing your 2nd round choices being available @56. 54? Yet it always seems to happen every year, somebody graded as 1st round talent slides deep into the 2nd round.

Chiefnj

03-08-2006, 09:14 AM

Jimmy Williams? Really? He insists he is a S, yet he'll be drafted in the 1st by somebody as a CB. With the arrogant attitude he's already showing, you really want to take that on? BTW, I assume you don't mean Mario or Deangelo Williams.

Aside from JW, I'm in full agreement with you list. I have a hard time seeing your 2nd round choices being available @56. Yet it always seems to happen every year, somebody graded as 1st round talent slides deep into the 2nd round.

I'd take Williams as a safety with the #20 pick. If the Chiefs are going to go to a cover 2 they could use someone like him. I don't have a problem with a DB with an arrogant attitude. It's done well for guys like Reed and Taylor.

I don't have any 2nd round choices. The second list was my second tier 1st round picks.

ct

03-08-2006, 11:12 AM

I'd take Williams as a safety with the #20 pick. If the Chiefs are going to go to a cover 2 they could use someone like him. I don't have a problem with a DB with an arrogant attitude. It's done well for guys like Reed and Taylor.

I don't have any 2nd round choices. The second list was my second tier 1st round picks.

I'm cool with JW at Safety, but is he? That's why I'd pass.

I should have looked a bit closer at your list, just made the assumption your 2nd list was 2nd round wish list. My bad... Bunkley and McNeil I'd move back a bit to select in the 1st, but preferably not @20. It takes 2 to tango, so if there's nobody willing, we'll have not choice. I don't see Lawson as a fit at all, seems like he should be OLB in a 3-4.

Tribal Warfare

03-08-2006, 12:06 PM

I'm cool with JW at Safety, but is he? That's why I'd pass.

I should have looked a bit closer at your list, just made the assumption your 2nd list was 2nd round wish list. My bad... Bunkley and McNeil I'd move back a bit to select in the 1st, but preferably not @20. It takes 2 to tango, so if there's nobody willing, we'll have not choice. I don't see
Lawson as a fit at all, seems like he should be OLB in a 3-4.

I'd take Bunkley or Hali at 20, but if their gone I'd trade down then get Hill or Watson

Chiefnj

03-08-2006, 12:49 PM

I'm cool with JW at Safety, but is he? That's why I'd pass.

I should have looked a bit closer at your list, just made the assumption your 2nd list was 2nd round wish list. My bad... Bunkley and McNeil I'd move back a bit to select in the 1st, but preferably not @20. It takes 2 to tango, so if there's nobody willing, we'll have not choice. I don't see Lawson as a fit at all, seems like he should be OLB in a 3-4.

I'm throwing Lawson in because of what Gun/HE said in the article a week or so. It seems like they want Bell to be a one hand down pass rusher. If their answer to the poor pass rush is moving a LB type player to the front, then I think Lawson would be the guy to do it. Bell didn't seem that fast last year and he didn't seem willing to hit. If that is the scheme, then I wouldn't mind drafting a player who can execute it.

ct

03-08-2006, 01:00 PM

I'm throwing Lawson in because of what Gun/HE said in the article a week or so. It seems like they want Bell to be a one hand down pass rusher. If their answer to the poor pass rush is moving a LB type player to the front, then I think Lawson would be the guy to do it. Bell didn't seem that fast last year and he didn't seem willing to hit. If that is the scheme, then I wouldn't mind drafting a player who can execute it.

Can't disagree with that! I didn't even consider that.

Mr. Laz

03-08-2006, 04:11 PM

I'm throwing Lawson in because of what Gun/HE said in the article a week or so. It seems like they want Bell to be a one hand down pass rusher. If their answer to the poor pass rush is moving a LB type player to the front, then I think Lawson would be the guy to do it. Bell didn't seem that fast last year and he didn't seem willing to hit. If that is the scheme, then I wouldn't mind drafting a player who can execute it.

whens the last time we had a "special use" guy and made him productive?

buddha

03-08-2006, 04:56 PM

I would go defensive line in the first round if I were in KC's situation. If somebody like Huff fell to them, I'd reconsider because he is too good to pass up. Otherwise, let's build up the front seven early and often on draft day.

htismaqe

03-08-2006, 05:08 PM

whens the last time we had a "special use" guy and made him productive?

Derrick Thomas...

Mr. Laz

03-08-2006, 05:35 PM

Derrick Thomas...

and Bill cowher was his defensive coord for his 1st 5 years or so and gunther wasn't on board until 1995.

htismaqe

03-08-2006, 05:50 PM

and Bill cowher was his defensive coord for his 1st 5 years or so and gunther wasn't on board until 1995.

Very, VERY true.

In fact, his worst year's were under Gunther.

milkman

03-08-2006, 06:29 PM

Very, VERY true.

In fact, his worst year's were under Gunther.

Agreed.

I thought Gunt probably cost DT 20 to 25 career sacks with his Picassoesque genius.

the Talking Can

03-08-2006, 06:54 PM

I just wanted to agree with everyone saying that Gunther is a knuckle dragging moron....I agree