I have "Officially" gotten tired of some of this GS pumping and Mavs bashing in the same posts. :mad: :mad: :mad: :mad: :mad:

Line up all the players and coaches of GS, and get in line for this as* whooping this year by the Mavs and the Mavs fans!!!!!!

I guarantee the Mavs environment at the games against GS will be something special this year.

The gloves are off, and I will step up and do my part at the Mavs home games against GS to make them regret KNOCKING the Mavs out of the playoffs.

F-U-C-* anyone else that supports GS as well. You cant be a Mavs fan and a GS fan. The two dont work!!!! Either you are with us (Mavs) or against us (Mavs)?????????

The Mavs won 67 games last season and I dont want to take anything away from that. Dirk won the MVP as well, and there is nothing anyone can do about that. Anyone that wants to discount what the Mavs did in the regular season can go to "HELL"!!!!!!

Give respect where it is due. The Mavs won 67 games in this modern era in one season. This is a feat for the ages. Rather the Mavs lost in the 1st round or in the finals, the results are the same...There was only one champion this season and it was SA. SA escaped from having to play the Mavs, but it is all good, because we live to play another season. I still think SA won one too many games against the Mavs last season, so SA has something coming for their As* as well. There will be no escape for any team this season, including GS....

F-word GS players/coaches!!!!!!!!!

MFFL!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

DevinFuture

09-11-2007, 11:42 AM

FREEEEEEEE-DOM!!!!!!!!!

Underdog

09-11-2007, 12:08 PM

For some reason the homers around here seem to make more sense than the haters...

Oh, maybe it's because there's a lot more to love about this team than there is to hate...

Dtownsfinest

09-11-2007, 12:26 PM

How come you can't be a Warriors and Mavs fan? Not a fan of the Warriors but I do have more than one team I like to see do well.

rabbitproof

09-11-2007, 12:30 PM

calling the f-word "f-word" kind takes the venom out of it... but yes, f-word gs.

ballin_boi

09-11-2007, 01:19 PM

B.Diddy can suck my sweet n sour asian nuts!
S Jax will take my whole eggroll up his ass
and Nelson can watch while J**king off!

fluid.forty.one

09-11-2007, 02:00 PM

The only thing I don't understand about chums pessimism towards the mavs is his homeristic optimism I see from him towards the cowboys.

Cowboys haven't done crap in the playoffs lately either. And mavs have a better regular season team too. Mavs are better in basketball than Cowboys are in football.. but somehow the mavs get a lot more heat than the boys.

ty

09-11-2007, 03:48 PM

The only thing I don't understand about chums pessimism towards the mavs is his homeristic optimism I see from him towards the cowboys.

Cowboys haven't done crap in the playoffs lately either. And mavs have a better regular season team too. Mavs are better in basketball than Cowboys are in football.. but somehow the mavs get a lot more heat than the boys.

Think about it. What if the Cowboys went to the Super Bowl two years ago, had a decent 21 point lead, then fell apart and lost in the 4th quarter.

Then imagine last year they had a 14-15 win season and lose in the the first round/wildcard (which they actually did).

I would be freaking pissed.

fluid.forty.one

09-11-2007, 03:53 PM

Well it's a new season. I'm just saying the constant pessimism is getting really old, and it's not very fanlike.

It's not like we can, as fans, change the outcome of what's going to happen.. so I just don't see the point of always being negative about everything.

u2sarajevo

09-11-2007, 04:00 PM

Well it's a new season. I'm just saying the constant pessimism is getting really old, and it's not very fanlike.

It's not like we can, as fans, change the outcome of what's going to happen.. so I just don't see the point of always being negative about everything.I think it's more a point of pointing out the failings of a certain high profile owner than it is being negative about the Mavericks.

It's the best of both worlds... cause if you have that attitude you are "allowed" to support your home team and be gleeful inside when something goes wrong. It's the sport equivalent to having your cake and eating it too.

And this thread is dismally unfortunate.

ty

09-11-2007, 04:43 PM

Well it's a new season. I'm just saying the constant pessimism is getting really old, and it's not very fanlike.

It's not like we can, as fans, change the outcome of what's going to happen.. so I just don't see the point of always being negative about everything.

Imagine this thread if it had all optimists. Discussion would be horrible. I'm glad there's a good mix of pessimists and optimists on the board. It keeps it interesting and keeps me coming back.

Underdog

09-11-2007, 04:53 PM

Imagine this thread if it had all optimists. Discussion would be horrible. I'm glad there's a good mix of pessimists and optimists on the board. It keeps it interesting and keeps me coming back.

Yeah, but what happens when pessimism becomes an I-hate-Cuban bitchfest on EVERY thread?

I believe it was the Webber/P.J. Brown thread that got the fire started for this thread... Somehow it turned from "do we want/will we get Webber/Brown?" to the tired old "Cuban/Nellie/67 Wins" discussion that has tarnished every thread on this board since the offseason began...

Seriously, I'm beginning to think that certain members of this forum can't function sexually without bringing up "Nellie vs. Cuban" at least once a day... :rolleyes:

alby

09-11-2007, 08:42 PM

It's not pessimism when all you state is that the Mavericks decided to stand pat this offseason after CLEARLY having their weaknesses exposed during two of the most crucial points in this franchise's history.

NO, their weaknesses do not only come out against the Warriors, open your eyes.

Weaknesses are weaknesses. Please don't tell me other teams around the league won't attack the Mavericks knowing better about their downfalls as a basketball team now.

Underdog

09-11-2007, 09:04 PM

It's not pessimism when all you state is that the Mavericks decided to stand pat this offseason after CLEARLY having their weaknesses exposed during two of the most crucial points in this franchise's history.

NO, their weaknesses do not only come out against the Warriors, open your eyes.

Weaknesses are weaknesses. Please don't tell me other teams around the league won't attack the Mavericks knowing better about their downfalls as a basketball team now.

NAME that weakness...

(what - 67 wins? no low post? mark cuban???)

We didn't lose either of those series the same way... So, what is this "single weakness" you're referring to? Just put it into words, because I don't understand this abstract concept that you're trying to convey... WHAT, exactly, was exposed?

u2sarajevo

09-11-2007, 09:06 PM

NAME that weakness...*raises hand*

Injury to your starting Center?

Underdog

09-11-2007, 09:10 PM

*raises hand*

Injury to your starting Center?

Funny, I kind of remember "Erika" Dampier owning Shaq during some of those games in the Miami series... ;)

chumdawg

09-11-2007, 09:54 PM

For me personally, I just hate hearing the "67 wins" mantra repeated over and over as incontrovertible evidence that the Mavs were the best team in the league last year. It seems like any time someone wants to talk about weaknesses the Mavs may have--or ways they might improve, as another way of looking at it--there is always someone coming around soon to say "67," as if it means that the Mavs are perfect and don't need to do a damn thing. Oh, and when the obvious flies back at them--that the Mavs bowed out in the first round--it's always "one team." Geez.

If you will recall, there were statistical studies last year--yes, we went over them repeatedly on this board--that suggested the Mavs were overachieving with their win-loss record. What happened was that they won an extraordinary number of close ball games. The Spurs of last year actually looked better statistically, but the Mavs eked out more close wins.

So either the Mavs had a bit of luck on their side in the win-loss column, or they had a powerful and rare ability to win close games. The body of statistical evidence would claim the former, and Mavs fans of course would claim the latter. But here's the deal. The Mavs had a chance to put this rare power to the test in the postseason, specifically in Game Four against the Warriors. They didn't pull out that close game. I think you will remember Dirk's comments about that game. Being down 3-1 was deadly, and he knew it. When the Mavs most needed this ability of theirs to win close games at a statistically improbably rate, it didn't happen.

Their statistical "expected wins" last year was 61. If you want to use last year's performance as an argument about how good the Mavs were then or are now, THIS is the number you should be using. When you cite this "67" mantra, you really aren't considering the whole picture. It grates me when people don't realize this.

And this "one team" mantra? Tell it to San Antonio. Tell it to Phoenix. Look, I'm not really pessimistic about the Mavs on the whole. Rather, I believe that the Mavs are in a class of teams that includes San Antonio and Phoenix and probably another couple teams who could slide in there. I also know that the Mavs are vulnerable to losing against teams they shouldn't lose to, like Miami and Golden State. If that had happened just once, I might dismiss it as a fluke--though I still wouldn't be happy about it and I would tend to want answers. When it happens twice in a row, though, I tend to think that "fluke" is a little less likely an answer, and I want explanations even more.

I want for the Mavericks to win. I want it very much. What bothers me is that I think that maybe, just maybe, the Mavs think they are better than they are. (I *know* that plenty of fans on this board think they are better than they are.) That attitude is an engraved invitation for disaster. I remember Donald Carter saying that the biggest mistake the Mavs made, when they came within a hair's breadth of a championship in 1988, was to stand pat going forward. And I know that Dirk Nowitzki is not going be around forever. These are the years that the Mavs should be going "all in" to win a title. It's right there for the taking. This is as good a chance as they will ever get. So to see them "upgrade" by retaining George and adding Jones and Bass...well, it doesn't convince me.

I have "Officially" gotten tired of some of this GS pumping and Mavs bashing in the same posts. :mad: :mad: :mad: :mad: :mad:

Line up all the players and coaches of GS, and get in line for this as* whooping this year by the Mavs and the Mavs fans!!!!!!

I guarantee the Mavs environment at the games against GS will be something special this year.

The gloves are off, and I will step up and do my part at the Mavs home games against GS to make them regret KNOCKING the Mavs out of the playoffs.

F-U-C-* anyone else that supports GS as well. You cant be a Mavs fan and a GS fan. The two dont work!!!! Either you are with us (Mavs) or against us (Mavs)?????????

The Mavs won 67 games last season and I dont want to take anything away from that. Dirk won the MVP as well, and there is nothing anyone can do about that. Anyone that wants to discount what the Mavs did in the regular season can go to "HELL"!!!!!!

Give respect where it is due. The Mavs won 67 games in this modern era in one season. This is a feat for the ages. Rather the Mavs lost in the 1st round or in the finals, the results are the same...There was only one champion this season and it was SA. SA escaped from having to play the Mavs, but it is all good, because we live to play another season. I still think SA won one too many games against the Mavs last season, so SA has something coming for their As* as well. There will be no escape for any team this season, including GS....

F-word GS players/coaches!!!!!!!!!

MFFL!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Im with you on this one Silk!! MFFL!!!

Underdog

09-11-2007, 10:48 PM

For me personally, I just hate hearing the "67 wins" mantra repeated over and over as incontrovertible evidence that the Mavs were the best team in the league last year. It seems like any time someone wants to talk about weaknesses the Mavs may have--or ways they might improve, as another way of looking at it--there is always someone coming around soon to say "67," as if it means that the Mavs are perfect and don't need to do a damn thing. Oh, and when the obvious flies back at them--that the Mavs bowed out in the first round--it's always "one team." Geez.

If you will recall, there were statistical studies last year--yes, we went over them repeatedly on this board--that suggested the Mavs were overachieving with their win-loss record. What happened was that they won an extraordinary number of close ball games. The Spurs of last year actually looked better statistically, but the Mavs eked out more close wins.

So either the Mavs had a bit of luck on their side in the win-loss column, or they had a powerful and rare ability to win close games. The body of statistical evidence would claim the former, and Mavs fans of course would claim the latter. But here's the deal. The Mavs had a chance to put this rare power to the test in the postseason, specifically in Game Four against the Warriors. They didn't pull out that close game. I think you will remember Dirk's comments about that game. Being down 3-1 was deadly, and he knew it. When the Mavs most needed this ability of theirs to win close games at a statistically improbably rate, it didn't happen.

Their statistical "expected wins" last year was 61. If you want to use last year's performance as an argument about how good the Mavs were then or are now, THIS is the number you should be using. When you cite this "67" mantra, you really aren't considering the whole picture. It grates me when people don't realize this.

And this "one team" mantra? Tell it to San Antonio. Tell it to Phoenix. Look, I'm not really pessimistic about the Mavs on the whole. Rather, I believe that the Mavs are in a class of teams that includes San Antonio and Phoenix and probably another couple teams who could slide in there. I also know that the Mavs are vulnerable to losing against teams they shouldn't lose to, like Miami and Golden State. If that had happened just once, I might dismiss it as a fluke--though I still wouldn't be happy about it and I would tend to want answers. When it happens twice in a row, though, I tend to think that "fluke" is a little less likely an answer, and I want explanations even more.

I want for the Mavericks to win. I want it very much. What bothers me is that I think that maybe, just maybe, the Mavs think they are better than they are. (I *know* that plenty of fans on this board think they are better than they are.) That attitude is an engraved invitation for disaster. I remember Donald Carter saying that the biggest mistake the Mavs made, when they came within a hair's breadth of a championship in 1988, was to stand pat going forward. And I know that Dirk Nowitzki is not going be around forever. These are the years that the Mavs should be going "all in" to win a title. It's right there for the taking. This is as good a chance as they will ever get. So to see them "upgrade" by retaining George and adding Jones and Bass...well, it doesn't convince me.

Your statistics are twisted... What the hell does a PROJECTED 61 win season have to do with an ACTUAL 67 win season? Where do you get this nonsense? Is this Basketball 501???

Statistics can't dunk... Statistics don't get injured... Actually, statistics don't do much of anything but frame an argument exactly how you'd like it to be framed...

And yes, only ONE team could consistently beat us last season - your precious statistics prove that...

Maybe you'd enjoy this team a bit more if you approached the game with your heart, rather than your head...

alby

09-11-2007, 11:08 PM

What makes people who critique their beloved teams no longer "fans for life"? As far as weaknesses are concerned, I would list some of those out, but there will always be those who have the ability to twist my words and somehow turn them into strengths. That's just how life works sometimes I guess. The thing I love about Dallas fans is that we love our team and are so passionate with every win and loss, it's almost like life and death with some of us. However, we are probably the only fans in the NBA who act the way we do. Remember, we have not won one single thing yet. We don't really have a place to whine about what others think about us or what Dallas deserves or how much exposure one of our players should receive, we haven't earned anything as of right now.

Go Mavs.

We will probably win between 53-60 games in 07/08 which in comparison to the majority of the other teams in the league, is damn good and I am grateful for that. But, how many games will we eventually win during the real season? That is what I'm worried about, people argue that only one team in the NBA wins it each year, so it's not that big of a letdown when Dallas isn't the one at the top of the mountain at the end of the season. However, I truly feel that we should have had one maybe two championships in the last 5 years. This includes the Kobe/Shaq reign in which they lost to the Pistons with four future hall of famers. I just feel that the braintrust of the Mavs are wasting away one of the greatest basketball talents to ever grace an NBA court away by not giving him the best team the front office can give him. It really shouldn't be this difficult for Dirk. But I really don't want to get into that.. anyways, I hope we improve enough defensively, offensively, our coaching, etc to win the entire thing this year so everyone can just shut up. I rather be remembered as being the Dallas Cowboys and not the Buffalo Bills, but hey, that's just me. We can do it.

Underdog

09-11-2007, 11:22 PM

what makes people who are criticizing their beloved teams no longer "fans for life"?

Funny, I can't find anywhere in this thread where anyone made that assertion...

I rather be the cowboys than the buffalo bills

Yeah, we're neither right now...

mavsgirl56

09-11-2007, 11:41 PM

I have "Officially" gotten tired of some of this GS pumping and Mavs bashing in the same posts. :mad: :mad: :mad: :mad: :mad:

Line up all the players and coaches of GS, and get in line for this as* whooping this year by the Mavs and the Mavs fans!!!!!!

I guarantee the Mavs environment at the games against GS will be something special this year.

The gloves are off, and I will step up and do my part at the Mavs home games against GS to make them regret KNOCKING the Mavs out of the playoffs.

F-U-C-* anyone else that supports GS as well. You cant be a Mavs fan and a GS fan. The two dont work!!!! Either you are with us (Mavs) or against us (Mavs)?????????

The Mavs won 67 games last season and I dont want to take anything away from that. Dirk won the MVP as well, and there is nothing anyone can do about that. Anyone that wants to discount what the Mavs did in the regular season can go to "HELL"!!!!!!

Give respect where it is due. The Mavs won 67 games in this modern era in one season. This is a feat for the ages. Rather the Mavs lost in the 1st round or in the finals, the results are the same...There was only one champion this season and it was SA. SA escaped from having to play the Mavs, but it is all good, because we live to play another season. I still think SA won one too many games against the Mavs last season, so SA has something coming for their As* as well. There will be no escape for any team this season, including GS....

F-word GS players/coaches!!!!!!!!!

MFFL!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
Right on sister or brother !!! F'em all......GO MAVS !!!! MFFL in good times and in bad !!! And this year, it's aaaaaaaaallllllll gonnna be good times !!!! GO Dirk, Jet, Josh, Devin, Damp, Diop And EVERYBODY ELSE- LET'S KICK SOME ASS AND TAKE SOME NAMES !!
I can't wait for the season to start....WOOOO HOOOO>>>>GOOOOOOO MAVS!!!!

chumdawg

09-11-2007, 11:42 PM

Your statistics are twisted... What the hell does a PROJECTED 61 win season have to do with an ACTUAL 67 win season? Where do you get this nonsense? Is this Basketball 501???It's not "Basketball 501." It's a statistical model that was formed taking into account decades of NBA basketball and is generally recognized as being a legitimate and reliable measure of performance.

And see, the thing is, if the Mavs had indeed won 61 last year, you wouldn't hear a hue and cry of "But, but, but...we won 61 games!" We won 60 back in '03. We had the best record in the league that year, or at least tied for it. But you sure didn't hear a lot of people saying that since we had the best record we also had the best team. Again, if the Mavs had won 61 last year and still did what they did in the playoffs, do you think that most everyone would feel as though they were the hands-down best team in the league (better than the Spurs, even) and simply got a bad break in the playoffs? You should stop and think about that for a while.

Statistics can't dunk... Statistics don't get injured... Actually, statistics don't do much of anything but frame an argument exactly how you'd like it to be framed...Well, buddy, I try to use statistics honestly. The irony, of course, is that 67-15 is also a statistic.

And yes, only ONE team could consistently beat us last season - your precious statistics prove that...What exactly do you mean by that? Do you mean that the Mavs would have beaten the Spurs in the playoffs if it had come to that? Or the Suns? Think about that "ONE team" argument means. My ears hear it is saying that if Golden State didn't make the playoffs the Mavs would necessarily be the champs right now. My friend, that is going to be a difficult proposition for you to support.

Maybe you'd enjoy this team a bit more if you approached the game with your heart, rather than your head...I wouldn't even bother ranting if my heart wasn't in it. I hate this idea that if you support the Mavs, which I do, you must necessarily believe that they are the best team in the league...that they were beaten by the "ONE team" that could beat them...that they were robbed by the refs...that by winning "67" games they should have been granted a title. That's bullshit. Truth is, I do NOT think the Mavs are necessarily the best team in the league. I think they are in a group with the best of them, though. And I think that if they can make improvements they will have a chance to come out on top. A chance, mind you.

The minute I start thinking that only David Stern or the Golden State Warriors can keep our team from winning a title is the minute I *do* start thinking with my head and not my heart--but thinking very, very naively.

Flacolaco

09-11-2007, 11:53 PM

You know, in golf you can follow one mans entire career, rather than a team. If that's what you're in to. Just one fat man.

Just a suggestion.

Underdog

09-12-2007, 12:10 AM

It's not "Basketball 501." It's a statistical model that was formed taking into account decades of NBA basketball and is generally recognized as being a legitimate and reliable measure of performance.

And see, the thing is, if the Mavs had indeed won 61 last year, you wouldn't hear a hue and cry of "But, but, but...we won 61 games!" We won 60 back in '03. We had the best record in the league that year, or at least tied for it. But you sure didn't hear a lot of people saying that since we had the best record we also had the best team. Again, if the Mavs had won 61 last year and still did what they did in the playoffs, do you think that most everyone would feel as though they were the hands-down best team in the league (better than the Spurs, even) and simply got a bad break in the playoffs? You should stop and think about that for a while.

Well, buddy, I try to use statistics honestly. The irony, of course, is that 67-15 is also a statistic.

What exactly do you mean by that? Do you mean that the Mavs would have beaten the Spurs in the playoffs if it had come to that? Or the Suns? Think about that "ONE team" argument means. My ears hear it is saying that if Golden State didn't make the playoffs the Mavs would necessarily be the champs right now. My friend, that is going to be a difficult proposition for you to support.

I wouldn't even bother ranting if my heart wasn't in it. I hate this idea that if you support the Mavs, which I do, you must necessarily believe that they are the best team in the league...that they were beaten by the "ONE team" that could beat them...that they were robbed by the refs...that by winning "67" games they should have been granted a title. That's bullshit. Truth is, I do NOT think the Mavs are necessarily the best team in the league. I think they are in a group with the best of them, though. And I think that if they can make improvements they will have a chance to come out on top. A chance, mind you.

The minute I start thinking that only David Stern or the Golden State Warriors can keep our team from winning a title is the minute I *do* start thinking with my head and not my heart--but thinking very, very naively.

It's not that we won 67 games, it's how we won 67 games...

You mentioned our uncanny ability to finish out close games - well, that's something we had problems with before... Those are the types of improvements that make the 67 wins relevant... Not the number itself, but how the number was achieved...

I don't think anyone believes that we should have won the title last year simply because we had a bunch of wins in the regular season... But I do think it's safe to say that if we could beat the Spurs & Suns in the regular season, then we could have done it in the playoffs... Nobody can answer that with certainty because we didn't get the chance, but I do know that Golden State beat us, then beat us, then beat us some more... The same can't be said for any other team in the NBA last season...

On another note, I honestly don't think we could have won it all last year based on this observation: Avery pushed his team (especially Dirk) too hard in the regular season and it started to show after the All-Star break, then ultimately defeated us in the playoffs... It was a novice coaching mistake, one that I believe Avery can learn from... The only roster change that could fix this deficiency is a new coach - not a low post game, or a pass-first point guard, or Kevin Garnett...

Avery realizes his mistake and next season will be his opportunity to prove that he can step up his game as a head coach... The Mavs have the raw talent, but even the best players are useless when they're too tired to run down the court...

(and for the record, I think you're one of the smarter posters on this site - I just get sick of hearing about Cuban/Nellie/Nash all the time... As I said in another thread several months back: that's your shtick... Keep on ruffling those feathers!) ;)

chumdawg

09-12-2007, 12:29 AM

Fair enough, UD. I agree that it will be interesting to see how AJ manages this regular season. He had the foot down all last year. I don't think that is necessarily a mistake, in and of itself, but it may well have been. The truth is that this team coasted for at least a month coming into the playoffs, and it appeared to hurt them in the worst way. Certainly balancing that sort of thing is a delicate task. Another year of experience should help him along those lines.

fluid.forty.one

09-12-2007, 04:15 AM

You know, in golf you can follow one mans entire career, rather than a team. If that's what you're in to. Just one fat man.

Just a suggestion.

ha

alby

09-12-2007, 07:53 AM

Imagine if the Mavericks didn't coast during that last month and really pushed for 70 wins. A first round loss after 70 wins woulda been terrible lol. Let's just sit here and hope the pieces fall right into place and the stars are aligned for the Mavericks to win the championship. However, last year was a pretty good opportunity IMO, Goldenstate in the first round then Houston/Utah in the second then Phoenix/SanAntonio in the third. That to me, is probably the best road any Western Conference team can have. At least we wouldn't have had to play the 2 or 3 seed in the second round. Anyways, although we have beaten them before, we are 1-1 against Phoenix in the playoffs and 1-2 against San Antonio in the playoffs.

alby

09-12-2007, 07:55 AM

The only thing I don't understand about chums pessimism towards the mavs is his homeristic optimism I see from him towards the cowboys.

Cowboys haven't done crap in the playoffs lately either. And mavs have a better regular season team too. Mavs are better in basketball than Cowboys are in football.. but somehow the mavs get a lot more heat than the boys.

Lol, yeah Chum--why are you such a cowboys optimist?

ty

09-12-2007, 11:53 AM

Cowboys fans are a different breed.

Dirkadirkastan

09-12-2007, 05:38 PM

For the last time Chum, "67 wins" isn't intended to mean "we're the best". It's intended to counter people who say we really really suck.

61 win teams who don't make it past the first round should really look at themselves in the mirror

Underdog

09-12-2007, 11:18 PM

61 win teams who don't make it past the first round should really look at themselves in the mirror

I think you've mentioned something to that effect once or twice before...

Maybe you need new material?

alby

09-12-2007, 11:20 PM

every argument ive made, you've replied with the same ones right back...

what are you trying to say?

ty

09-13-2007, 10:36 AM

every argument ive made, you've replied with the same ones right back...

what are you trying to say?

He obviously doesn't think a 61 win team that doesn't make it past the first round needs to look at itself in the mirror. Looks like he'd rather not "look in the mirror", but go the "underdog" route. Such a fitting member name.

Silk Smoov

09-13-2007, 11:06 AM

61 win teams who don't make it past the first round should really look at themselves in the mirror

Thats more internal, than external. I would say that this team needs a little soul searching in order to win a title. I think this is what SA did last year, but even then it did not help them against the Mavs ;)

ty

09-13-2007, 11:08 AM

That more internal, than external. I would say that this team needs a little soul searching in order to win a title. I think this is what SA did last year, but even then it did not help them against the Mavs ;)

Probably what Dirk did all summer in the Outback.

DevinFuture

09-13-2007, 11:11 AM

I agree that "61 win teams who don't make it past the first round should really look at themselves in the mirror".
But I take it is a matter of course that this team did so.
Just because they haven't made any moves that fans or the media thought were big enough doesn't mean the organization didn't do a self-evaluation.
They must think they stand a good chance to win with what they have now. They might be wrong about that, it's true. But it's not impossible that they're right.

To anyone who thinks that the Mavs should have made more or bigger moves this offseason to address deficiencies than they did:

What would be a measure of Mavs success this season that would lead you to reevaluate your postion and say "huh. Maybe they were right to keep the team intact?" Is a title the only thing that would make you think that? What if the Mavs lose in 7 in the Western Conference Finals this season? Are you still going to maintain that they should have made a major change this past offseason? 61-teams that lose int he first round of the playoffs do indeed need to look at themselves in the mirror. But they also have more to lose by blowing up the team than do 45 win teams that just barely made the playoffs. Making major changes is a risk when you have a 61-win team, and even if you do think it best to break it up to try to improve, you don't want to throw away what makes the team already quite good.

Silk Smoov

09-13-2007, 11:34 AM

Probably what Dirk did all summer in the Outback.

I truly believe that as well. I think the Mavs just need to look internally at themselves and hopefully they will find the answer. I believe in the Mavs players/coaches, but I think they need to believe in themselves more. Maybe it is time to be more arrogant on/off the court. Put a little swagger in their step. I think this would go a long way in the end. MAYBE too many times, we were too modest in our success. Lets put a chip on our shoulder, and force teams to deal with it. I think that could put a big fire under this team. Just a thought, but I do think it would work out for the best. Lets start hitting teams in the mouth early and often. Lets become borderline dirty as well. We need to send messages to all the 2 guards in the league about coming into the lane. A clear message like that will go a long way in the playoffs. Just ask MJ ;)

mary

09-14-2007, 08:36 AM

Less You.

Silk Smoov

09-14-2007, 08:41 AM

You too...

Underdog

09-14-2007, 09:20 AM

I truly believe that as well. I think the Mavs just need to look internally at themselves and hopefully they will find the answer. I believe in the Mavs players/coaches, but I think they need to believe in themselves more. Maybe it is time to be more arrogant on/off the court. Put a little swagger in their step. I think this would go a long way in the end. MAYBE too many times, we were too modest in our success. Lets put a chip on our shoulder, and force teams to deal with it. I think that could put a big fire under this team. Just a thought, but I do think it would work out for the best. Lets start hitting teams in the mouth early and often. Lets become borderline dirty as well. We need to send messages to all the 2 guards in the league about coming into the lane. A clear message like that will go a long way in the playoffs. Just ask MJ ;)

I think you forget that MJ was immune to the refs... Ask DWade how the Mavs fare when they put more "swagger" into their step...

enervate

09-15-2007, 08:25 AM

This is an awesome thread... I have nothing to add to it but I wanted to be in it... :D

Silk Smoov

09-15-2007, 08:59 AM

I think you forget that MJ was immune to the refs... Ask DWade how the Mavs fare when they put more "swagger" into their step...

MJ got immunity after the Pistons beat the shi* out of him for two straight years in the Eastern Conference Finals in the late 80's. That is the MJ that I am talking about. They nearly killed MJ in those two series. Seriously, the put a hurting on him and Pippen physically and mentally. Are you old enough to remember "The Jordan Rule"? That is what I am talking about..

alby

09-15-2007, 09:21 AM

The NBA was a different league in the 80s-early 90s.

Underdog

09-15-2007, 10:11 AM

MJ got immunity after the Pistons beat the shi* out of him for two straight years in the Eastern Conference Finals in the late 80's. That is the MJ that I am talking about. They nearly killed MJ in those two series. Seriously, the put a hurting on him and Pippen physically and mentally. Are you old enough to remember "The Jordan Rule"? That is what I am talking about..

Yeah, I remember the "Jordan rule" - the Bad Boys were my team of the 80s, so I loved seeing them trounce that shoe-toting primadonna... :D

You're kind of supporting my point though: a "foul-prone" Jordan couldn't beat the no-name Pistons with all the swagger in the world, so what good is it going to do for Nowitzki? It seems like refs treat Dirk like a second-rate star at the foul line in certain matchups (hell, does anyone else on the Mavs get the "Jordan rule" called in their favor? Does Josh have to sell more shoes before he can consistently earn trips to the charity stripe? For that matter, are shoe sales why DWade got to go to the line more than the entire Mavs squad during at least one game of the Finals?)

Then again (read: I'm going to contradict myself), these Mavs remind me of the 80s Pistons as far as how much star power & respect they get (or don't get) from the rest of the NBA/media/refs... It might do them a bit of good to shut their critics up with a more physical game... Not that I want to see a Bill Lambier out there beating people up, but nice guys don't win rings in this game - just ask Bruce Bowen! ;)

Darth Ape

09-16-2007, 08:34 AM

Getting beat by Golden State is like getting raped. It's inevitable. So quit complaining and sit back and enjoy it.

EricaLubarsky

09-16-2007, 10:01 AM

Getting beat by Golden State is like getting raped. It's inevitable. So quit complaining and sit back and enjoy it.
like a Darth Ape post.

chumdawg

09-16-2007, 11:44 AM

like a Darth Ape post.You said it.

fluid.forty.one

09-16-2007, 11:45 AM

lol "The Jordan Rule" isn't referring to special calls made for jordan, it's a set of defensive strategies the Pistons used against him.

Silk Smoov

09-17-2007, 08:14 AM

I think you forget that MJ was immune to the refs... Ask DWade how the Mavs fare when they put more "swagger" into their step...

Yeah, he was but that was after the "Jordan Rules". Pistons used to beat the shi* out of MJ and Pippen. Pistons established the "Jordan Rules" in order to keep Jordan out of the lane. It worked for two straight years in the Eastern Conference Finals. The Mavs should adapt the same type of rules for all players that come into the lane.

alby

09-17-2007, 09:54 AM

the mavericks don't have a bill lambier or dennis rodman or one of the best defensive guards of all time, joe dumars... totally different teams