Paul: “Hamas was encouraged and really started by Israel”

posted at 1:40 pm on December 27, 2011 by Ed Morrissey

Not long ago, Newt Gingrich got into some trouble for claiming that the Palestinians are an “invented people,” although there is some basis for that statement, as prior to the British Mandate there was no such official designation for “Palestine” — and the British clearly included present-day Jordan as a major part of “Palestine” in the mandate. Another Republican candidate offered a history lesson on the Israeli-Palestinian conflict in 2009, a moment recalled by Jeff Dunetz in this clip from the House floor. In it, we discover that Israel “started” Hamas as a counterweight to Yasser Arafat, or something, and manages to blame the CIA for radicalizing Muslims and the US for supplying weapons and funds that “kill Palestinians”:

This may be why Paul doesn’t get a lot of support from his own party in Iowa or New Hampshire, as Byron York reports today:

In a hotly-contested Republican race, it appears that only about half of Paul’s supporters are Republicans. In Iowa, according to Rasmussen, just 51 percent of Paul supporters consider themselves Republicans. In New Hampshire, the number is 56 percent, according to Andrew Smith, head of the University of New Hampshire poll.

The same New Hampshire survey found that 87 percent of the people who support Romney consider themselves Republicans. For Newt Gingrich, it’s 85 percent.

So who is supporting Paul? In New Hampshire, Paul is the choice of just 13 percent of Republicans, according to the new poll, while he is the favorite of 36 percent of independents and 26 percent of Democrats who intend to vote in the primary. Paul leads in both non-Republican categories.

“Paul is doing the best job of getting those people who aren’t really Republicans but say they’re going to vote in the Republican primary,” explains Smith. Among that group are libertarians, dissatisfied independents and Democrats who are “trying to throw a monkey wrench in the campaign by voting for someone who is more philosophically extreme,” says Smith.

So who started Hamas? Was it really Israel? Er … no, not really, and the suggestion that Israel wanted Hamas as a counterweight to the PLO is simply ludicrous. Hamas developed from a network of Muslim Brotherhood charities in Gaza in the mid-1980s. The Muslim Brotherhood was one of the most notorious of anti-Israeli organizations in the region, formed in the 1920s in opposition to the collapse of the Caliphate and the British Mandate that followed. At the founding of Hamas, it called for “jihad” to seize Israel and create an Islamist state from the Jordan River to the Mediterranean Sea. They formed in direct opposition to the PLO (now called Fatah in the Palestinian Authority government), to some extent because Yasser Arafat was negotiating with Israel, albeit in bad faith while trying to drum up financial and political support in the West. Hamas gets its funding from Iran, hardly a disinterested third party in this conflict — and the main engine of radicalizing Muslims, eclipsing the Muslim Brotherhood ever since the Iranian revolution of 1979.

Paul only gets one thing substantially correct in this speech, which is that the US screwed up by pushing for an election in Gaza while Hamas had such a strong hold on the territory. We did warn, however, that we would not work with terrorists in a Gaza government, and after the unilateral Israeli withdrawal in 2005 it would have been difficult to argue against elections in Gaza. “Imposing” democracy in this case ended up backfiring, as it legitimized Hamas to some extent and made it more difficult to fight against their terrorism. But that’s a far cry from claiming that Israel started Hamas, a statement that is so nutty that it should be by itself disqualifying for voters looking to select the next Republican nominee.

Update: A few people have e-mailed me this opinion piece from the WSJ in 2009 as “proof” that corroborates Paul’s claims. It doesn’t back up Paul’s claim that Israel “started” Hamas, and it really doesn’t make the case that Israel encouraged the formation of Hamas, either. The closest it comes is this:

“Hamas, to my great regret, is Israel’s creation,” says Mr. Cohen, a Tunisian-born Jew who worked in Gaza for more than two decades. Responsible for religious affairs in the region until 1994, Mr. Cohen watched the Islamist movement take shape, muscle aside secular Palestinian rivals and then morph into what is today Hamas, a militant group that is sworn to Israel’s destruction.

Instead of trying to curb Gaza’s Islamists from the outset, says Mr. Cohen, Israel for years tolerated and, in some cases, encouraged them as a counterweight to the secular nationalists of the Palestine Liberation Organization and its dominant faction, Yasser Arafat’s Fatah. Israel cooperated with a crippled, half-blind cleric named Sheikh Ahmed Yassin, even as he was laying the foundations for what would become Hamas. Sheikh Yassin continues to inspire militants today; during the recent war in Gaza, Hamas fighters confronted Israeli troops with “Yassins,” primitive rocket-propelled grenades named in honor of the cleric.

How did Israel “encourage” Hamas? By keeping tabs on it, as any intel service would have done:

Instead, Israel’s military-led administration in Gaza looked favorably on the paraplegic cleric, who set up a wide network of schools, clinics, a library and kindergartens. Sheikh Yassin formed the Islamist group Mujama al-Islamiya, which was officially recognized by Israel as a charity and then, in 1979, as an association. Israel also endorsed the establishment of the Islamic University of Gaza, which it now regards as a hotbed of militancy. The university was one of the first targets hit by Israeli warplanes in the recent war.

Brig. General Yosef Kastel, Gaza’s Israeli governor at the time, is too ill to comment, says his wife. But Brig. Gen. Yitzhak Segev, who took over as governor in Gaza in late 1979, says he had no illusions about Sheikh Yassin’s long-term intentions or the perils of political Islam. As Israel’s former military attache in Iran, he’d watched Islamic fervor topple the Shah. However, in Gaza, says Mr. Segev, “our main enemy was Fatah,” and the cleric “was still 100% peaceful” towards Israel. Former officials say Israel was also at the time wary of being viewed as an enemy of Islam.

Mr. Segev says he had regular contact with Sheikh Yassin, in part to keep an eye on him. He visited his mosque and met the cleric around a dozen times. It was illegal at the time for Israelis to meet anyone from the PLO. Mr. Segev later arranged for the cleric to be taken to Israel for hospital treatment. “We had no problems with him,” he says.

In other words, people want to “credit” Israel for creating Hamas because they didn’t oppose the establishment of (then) non-violent social charities. Later, in 1987, the Muslim Brotherhood formed these charities into Hamas, which adopted violent jihad and the destruction of Israel as the key goals of its charter. Israel didn’t stop it and continued for a brief time to maintain its contacts with the group until it launched an intifada, but that’s not the same thing as “creating Hamas,” or even “encouraging Hamas.”

Madam Speaker, I rise in opposition to this resolution, not because I am taking sides and picking who the bad guys are and who the good guys are, but I’m looking at this more from the angle of being a United States citizen, an American, and I think resolutions like this really do great harm to us. In many ways what is happening in the Middle East, and in particular with Gaza right now, we have some moral responsibility for both sides, because we provide help in funding for both Arab nations and Israel. And so we definitely have a moral responsibility. And especially now today, the weapons being used to kill so many Palestinians are American weapons and American funds essentially are being used for this.

But there is a political liability which I think is something that we fail to look at because too often there is so much blowback from our intervention in areas that we shouldn’t be involved in. Hamas, if you look at the history, you will find that Hamas was encouraged and actually started by Israel because they wanted Hamas to counteract Yasir Arafat. You say, Well, yeah, it was better then and served its purpose, but we didn’t want Hamas to do this. So then we, as Americans, say, Well, we have such a good system;
we’re going to impose this on the world. We’re going to invade Iraq and teach people how to be democrats. We want free elections. So we encouraged the Palestinians to have a free election. They do, and they elect Hamas.

So we first, indirectly and directly through Israel, helped establish Hamas. Then we have an election where Hamas becomes dominant then we have to kill them. It just doesn’t make sense. During the 1980s, we were allied with Osama bin Laden and we were contending with the Soviets. It was at that time our CIA thought it was good if we radicalize the Muslim world. So we finance the Madrassas school to radicalize the Muslims in order to compete with the Soviets. There is too much blowback.

There are a lot of reasons why we should oppose this resolution. It’s not in the interest of the United States, it is not in the interest of Israel either. I strongly oppose H. Res. 34, which was rushed to the floor with almost no prior notice and without consideration by the House Foreign Affairs Committee. The resolution clearly takes one side in a conflict that has nothing to do with the United States or U.S. interests. I am concerned that the weapons currently being used by Israel against the Palestinians in Gaza are made in America and paid for by American taxpayers. What will adopting this resolution do to the perception of the United States in the Muslim and Arab world? What kind of blowback
might we see from this? What moral responsibility do we have for the violence in Israel and Gaza after having provided so much military support to one side?

As an opponent of all violence, I am appalled by the practice of lobbing homemade rockets into Israel from Gaza. I am only grateful that, because of the primitive nature of these weapons, there have been so few casualties among innocent Israelis. But I am also appalled by the longstanding Israeli blockade of Gaza–a cruel act of war–and the tremendous loss of life that has resulted from the latest Israeli attack that started last month. There are now an estimated 700 dead Palestinians, most of whom are civilians. Many innocent children are among the dead. While the shooting of rockets into Israel is inexcusable, the violent actions of some people in Gaza does not justify killing Palestinians on this scale. Such collective punishment is immoral. At the very least, the U.S. Congress should not be loudly proclaiming its support for the Israeli government’s actions in Gaza.

Madam Speaker, this resolution will do nothing to reduce the fighting and bloodshed in the Middle East. The resolution in fact will lead the U.S. to become further involved in this conflict, promising “vigorous support and unwavering commitment to the welfare, security, and survival of Israel as a Jewish and democratic state.” Is it really in the interest of the United States to guarantee the survival of any foreign country? I believe it would be better to focus on the security and survival of the United States, the Constitution of which my colleagues and I swore to defend just this week at the beginning of the 111th Congress. I urge my colleagues to reject this resolution.

Blowback

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Paul also has claimed Gaza was/is a “Concentration camp”, that Israel was “Starving” Palestinians in Gaza(a lie the Red Cross rebutted) and in his book Liberty Defined, Paul praises Jimmy Carter and his book, “Peace not Apartheid”

A brief history of Hamas, the Islamic militant group that is in the incoming majority of the PA

— 1970s-1980s: Begins as offshoot of Egypt’s Muslim Brotherhood. Israel supported early growth as a counterbalance to Yasser Arafat’s Palestine Liberation Organization. Early activity concentrated on social and community issues.
— December 1987: Hamas officially forms as group days after outbreak of first Palestinian uprising against Israeli occupation. Group targets Israeli soldiers and civilians in war to establish Islamic theocracy in Israel, West Bank and Gaza.

These supposed “Palestinians” are just a conglomeration of arabs/muslims that no other arab country wants. They are the undesirable troublemakers of the region, and are a breeding ground for genocidal hatred.

This man scares the daylights out of me! He is on the same playing field as bho seems to be in regard to Israel? If Bibi and Israel thought they have problems now with bho, just look out if the worm is elected!
L

Instead of trying to curb Gaza’s Islamists from the outset, says Mr. Cohen, Israel for years tolerated and, in some cases, encouraged them as a counterweight to the secular nationalists of the Palestine Liberation Organization and its dominant faction, Yasser Arafat’s Fatah. Israel cooperated with a crippled, half-blind cleric named Sheikh Ahmed Yassin, even as he was laying the foundations for what would become Hamas. Sheikh Yassin continues to inspire militants today; during the recent war in Gaza, Hamas fighters confronted Israeli troops with “Yassins,” primitive rocket-propelled grenades named in honor of the cleric.

The Israelis did provide support (money and freedom to operate)to Hamas and other groups as opposition to the secular PLO. That is not a crazy assertion. That’s a fact but when this support was taking place Hamas and the other groups hadn’t become sophisticated terror groups that they became. It’s not much different from the US support for the Mujihadeen. They were useful at pone point in time and adversaries in another.

RP is nuts. Even with some of his ok ideas, he comes across as nuts. Crazy uncle. Go back to the basement.

Palestine – no Arabs/Muslims actually WANT a sovereign state of Palestine. That would remove from the table one of the biggest “crimes” against the “Palestinians.” There are, however, seemingly endless other issues to keep them full of angst. They find offense in everything, from everyone – including their own.

But there is something bitterly ironic in Israel’s support for Fatah against Hamas—and it should be a lesson to governments everywhere that meddle in other states’ affairs. In the past, Israel supported Hamas against Fatah. Indeed, in the 1970s and 80s, Israel played a not insignificant role in encouraging Hamas’s emergence in the belief that such an Islamist group might help rupture support for the mass nationalist movement of Fatah

Could the Republican field possibly be any worse? What a cruel joke that with the worst president ever in office, one even worse than Carter, we have this worthless clown posse running …makes one just want to weep!

I think Paul may be wrong with his direct accusations about Israel but he’s certainly on the green so to speak.

First, MI6 and later the CIA played a prominent role in the development of the Muslim Brotherhood as an effective weapon against brewing Arab nationalism as seen with the Nasser movement in Egypt. The west did not like the fact that maverick individuals like Nasser were freezing the Anglo-American empire out from energy resources and key waterway access in the Middle East.

Name one other true conservative in the top of the pack. Paul has stood by his principals through the years and is the only individual to truly want a smaller government. I can follow his line on thinking in this issue and don’t see an issue with it. Now you will label me as nuts as well, but you want conservative govenment yet continually vote for people that will not give it to you. That is called “stuck on stupid”.

1. US should not take sides between the moral and immoral, or between the good and the bad

2. Ron Paul is ignorant of pretty much all history, even recent history

3. Ron Paul does not think Jews have a right to defend themselves from terrorist attacks from Gaza.

OK, so he has right to those positions and that ignorance … so what is the big deal??

georgealbert on December 27, 2011 at 1:55 PM

Agree. At the risk of much derision by other HAers, it reminds me of the history of Hitler. I think RP actually believes this stuff (his own view of the world, that is). He is delusional. Hitler was pure evil, yes – but also delusional in his world view. The delusion came first, and formed the worldview that he put into action. RP is delusional…But the good thing is, RP certainly isn’t charismatic. Actually, he doesn’t seem to be capable of a complete, coherent thought put forth verbally.

Israel did view Hamas as a viable counter-balance to Fatah in the beginning. That ugly wench Hanan Ashwari was screaming about this years ago. And why Bush pushed to allow Hamas in the Gaza elections and why Israel accepted … I have no idea. Bush had “democracy” rotting his brain.

This says nothing about Paul’s overall position, but just the Hamas angle.

Interesting sidepoint:
It was 212 (213) Hamas people whom Israel had ejected to Lebanon back in ’91 or so. They camped out on the Lebanese border with something like 250 international “journalists” who recorded their plight. Meanwhile, Kuwait had unceremoniously ousted over 400,000 palis from Kuwait after the first Gulf War because they had been rabid Saddam supporters (as all the palis were, both times). No one even made mention of the Kuwaiti ejection, but the poor, widdle 200 hamas folks got front page press for months.

First, MI6 and later the CIA played a prominent role in the development of the Muslim Brotherhood as an effective weapon against brewing Arab nationalism as seen with the Nasser movement in Egypt.
Pitchforker on December 27, 2011 at 2:00 PM

You are a conspiracy nut who hates the US military… Everything you write here should carry a disclaimer.

The Islamists get enough support from the current administration and the Democrats in general. The last thing we need is a loony old dingbat who thinks the Jooos are the source of all evil and that the Muslims are our friends.

If he’s so in love with the Muslims, why don’t he and Jimmah Carter form a pact and go over there to live in their society? That way they could stop irritating the rest of us.

Ed,
Its interesting to note you completely side-stepped the issue of the U.S. supplying weapons to Israel directly, as well as substantial financial aid which funds their own weapons programs.
Weapons systems they create with substantial financial and technological aid, which they then sell to countries which directly threaten American soldiers.

Its interesting to note you completely side-stepped the issue of the U.S. supplying weapons to Israel directly, as well as substantial financial aid which funds their own weapons programs
Some of which are awesome and which we make extensive use of especially in the field of electronics.

Weapons systems they create with substantial financial and technological aid, which they then sell to countries which directly threaten American soldiers.

KMC1 on December 27, 2011 at 2:16 PM

Finding this little bit a tad hard to believe. Got any proof of Israel arming the enemies of the US?

Dr. Paul needs someone to prepare his statements. Maybe he does already, but the message doesn’t seem to be communicated clearly to the average ‘merican voter…

Clearly he’s on the fringe of the right when it comes to foreign policy. And his comments on 09/11 are troubling. So let me ask the following rhetorical questions: Do Americans really think that Israel needs our help? Why doesn’t anybody talk about the thousands of Arabs (ie former Palestinians) integrated and living peacefully in Israeli society? Is knowing about a possible terrorist attack on 09/11 and not preventing it the same as causing it? Why do we think that humans want democracy in places where theocracy/tribal leaders are the norm?

Dr. Paul seems to be trying to answer these questions, but his answers are wrapped in language of anti-Semitism and conspiracy theories.

What do you have to ingest to subscribe to the “victim is guilty” mindset?

If all of the Jews in the Middle East were exterminated, the “Palestinians” and other Islamic nuts would be trying to exterminate Christians, and each other. (Hmm, they’re doing that now.)

I guess those Coptic Christians are responsible for the growth of the MB in Egypt. And how about those Nigerian Catholics, they are surely responsible for the violence in that country.

After all, one of Christ’s foremost tenants was to kill or tax anyone who didn’t convert to Christianity, wasn’t it?

CrazyGene on December 27, 2011 at 2:13 PM

Our intelligence services for years has been supporting questionable organizations for short-term national interest as well as PERSONAL gain. Let’s not try to play coy. The creation of the Mujaheddin in Afghanistan to combat the Soviets. The Muslim Brotherhood used to incite resistance against the Shah in Iran. The Ba’athists in Iraq to be pitted against Khomeini and the Iranians. The best laid plans of mice and men often go awry………..

Secondly, I’m not an apologist for Muslim extremism, however, certain policies are uniting these savages under a common banner. That is not a trend I’d like to see.

Yeah. Some of his “ideas” are ok, but amount to a the proverbial broken clock…it’s all the other bat$h1t crazy stuff that is the problem. (Almost said it worries me, but it honestly doesn’t – he is the poster child for the Unelectable…for POTUS that is…since enough of his constituents are apparently similarly nuts, electing him to office multiple times…who’s crazy now?)

Our intelligence services for years has been supporting questionable organizations for short-term national interest as well as PERSONAL gain. Let’s not try to play coy. The creation of the Mujaheddin in Afghanistan to combat the Soviets. The Muslim Brotherhood used to incite resistance against the Shah in Iran. The Ba’athists in Iraq to be pitted against Khomeini and the Iranians. The best laid plans of mice and men often go awry………..

Secondly, I’m not an apologist for Muslim extremism, however, certain policies are uniting these savages under a common banner. That is not a trend I’d like to see.

Pitchforker on December 27, 2011 at 2:24 PM

So you are “not an apologist for Muslim extremism”, yet you take the position that we created with the CIA and MI6 and we are uniting it… Yeah, it sounds like you are an apologist to me. Islamic terrorism has existed for 1400 years. Was that the CIA’s fault back then as well?

Comparing the people who serve in the US military to Nazis or the Soviets and drawing moral equivalencies to the terrorists they are fighting equals hate and ignorance.

V7_Sport on December 27, 2011 at 2:19 PM

So you’re saying that highly regimented, cohesive chain of command is impervious to the slide that the Nazis and Soviets succumbed to? Then why did we have U.S. troops patrolling the New Orleans area post Katrina and thus violating Posse Comitatus? Were they just following orders or they didn’t think their oath out fully?

Was that your comment about their electronics? You messed up the quote I think.

Why is it good to create these jobs in Israel, instead of the U.S.? Would it not be a better, more intelligent solution to create this knowledge base in the United States instead?? If Israel wanted the capability, we could then SELL it to them, rather than prop up a bunch of high tech jobs in another country. Another country, incidentally, which sells their technology to other countries, who can then use it against tue U.S..

And please tell me you don’t just blindly jump into any conversation about Israel without knowing anything about them??? Are you seriously not aware of their weapons sales, globally???? Really???

Because I’ll tell ya what; if China ever decides they’ve had enough of Taiwan’s little seperatist movement, we’re going to lose a lot of good men and women because of Israel. And it soumds like you’re not even aware the danger exists.

So you are “not an apologist for Muslim extremism”, yet you take the position that we created with the CIA and MI6 and we are uniting it… Yeah, it sounds like you are an apologist to me. Islamic terrorism has existed for 1400 years. Was that the CIA’s fault back then as well?

V7_Sport on December 27, 2011 at 2:28 PM

Muslim extremism goes back to the 13th century when the Turks destroyed and enslaved the Christian Serb empire. I agree with you. With that said, I’m not a fan of manipulating unstable people like this and not expecting some sort of boomerang effect. You’re heard the old saying, “Mess with the bull and get the horns?”

In related news — I see…Islamist Extremists Only Start Fires.Egypt’s richest library goes up in smoke, destroying up to 200,000 books of incomparable historical value; this loss to humanity is indescribable.

Mutnodjmet on December 27, 2011 at 2:23 PM

Too had these people never heard of the Internet. Wouod have been tough to burn 200k ebooks.

I will vote for anybody who uses the term “Senile Old Coot” to this idiots face.

xxessw on December 27, 2011 at 1:49 PM

Too bad due to our PC culture that we can’t do that. Just imagine the outcry over the lack of respect and decorum if someone actually said that to Rumpelstiltskin! Of course the ridiculous double standard is that people would have this selective moral outrage while completely ignoring RuPaul’s incendiary Blame America First nonsense!

Back in 2008, Rudy had a great moment in a debate when he put RuPaul in his place saying that he usually hears such nonsense from the left and demanded an apology from RuPaul for blaming America for 9/11.

During the last debate, Bachmann called out RuPaul and completely schooled him on the issues, even mentioning that it’s in the Iranian Constitution to spreak jihad!

Why is it good to create these jobs in Israel, instead of the U.S.? Would it not be a better, more intelligent solution to create this knowledge base in the United States instead??

Sure, but we need the best we can buy *now*. And btw we do create some excellent weapons tech that we do sell to very suspect countries (ahem Pakistan).

The thing is, if a friendly country has the better tech option and we need it now – we should buy it now. Worry about beating them at their own tech game at the same time, but tactical imperatives come first.

And please tell me you don’t just blindly jump into any conversation about Israel without knowing anything about them??? Are you seriously not aware of their weapons sales, globally???? Really???

I have a passing acquaintance with the global marketplace, yes. You’re trying to make a point here – make it.

Because I’ll tell ya what; if China ever decides they’ve had enough of Taiwan’s little seperatist movement, we’re going to lose a lot of good men and women because of Israel. And it soumds like you’re not even aware the danger exists.

Hamas grew out of the ideology and practice of the Islamic fundamentalist Muslim Brotherhood movement that arose in Egypt in the 1920s and it was legally registered in Israel in 1978 by Sheikh Ahmed Yassin, the movement’s spiritual leader, as an Islamic Association by the name Al-Mujamma Al Islami. Initially, the organization followed the Muslim Brotherhood’s model of acting primarily as a social welfare agency that catered especially to the Palestinian refugees in the Gaza Strip and, over time, developed a good reputation for improving the lives of Palestinians. Hamas also exerted its influence through the mosques. Today, Hamas is intimitately tied to the Islamic regimes in Syria and Iran.

In August 1988, Hamas published the Islamic Covenant, which makes clear the organization is opposed to Israel’s existence in any form. It states that “there is no solution for the Palestinian question except through jihad (holy war).” The group warns that any Muslim who leaves “the circle of struggle with Zionism” is guilty of “high treason.” Hamas’ platform calls for the creation of an Islamic republic in Palestine that would replace Israel. Muslims should “raise the banner of Allah over every inch of Palestine,” it says.

Hamas stresses jihad as the sole and immediate means to solve the problem of Palestine. Hamas aims to create an Islamic state in all of Palestine. The immediate means to achieve this goal is the escalation of the armed struggle, and ultimately jihad, with the participation not only of Palestinian Muslims but of the entire Islamic world.

Hamas’ violent activities are run by two central departments, which were established before the intifada. One is Hamas’ military arm, created in 1982 in Gaza by Sheikh Ahmed Yassin. In the early 1980′s, the group began amassing arms for use against Israel. After it was uncovered in 1984, Yassin was imprisoned. He was freed as part of a 1985 prisoner exchange between Israel and PFLP-GC leader Ahmed Jibril.

A second Hamas arm called the Majd was created by Yassin in 1986 to monitor Arabs deemed to be “collaborating” with Israel or failing to follow Islamic doctrine. In 1988, a similar Hamas operation began in the West Bank.

The national guard patrolling the streets at the request of the governor is not a violation of the Posse Comitatus act, regardless of what Alex Jones told you.

V7_Sport on December 27, 2011 at 2:34 PM

You’re not entirely right.
Under Article I, Section 8, Clause 15 of the Constitution, the National Guard – considered a state militia – is authorized to “execute the laws of the Union and suppress Insurrections and repel Invasion.” The Constitution says nothing about dispatching the military to fight domestic crime, a task usually undertaken by local law enforcement.

So who is supporting Paul? In New Hampshire, Paul is the choice of just 13 percent of Republicans, according to the new poll, while he is the favorite of 36 percent of independents and 26 percent of Democrats who intend to vote in the primary. Paul leads in both non-Republican categories.

This is a major problem. Allowing Independents and Democrats to vote in a Republican primary turns it into a joke.

Why this is allowed is moronic.

If you want to vote in a party primary have the backbone to register with that party ahead of time (NOT ON THE SAME DAY).

We shouldn’t be giving wepons or money to any country in the middle east and that includes Israel. Let Israel and the muzzies have the fight they are so desperately spoiling for and then cut a deal with whoever rises from the ashes.

You’re not entirely right.
Under Article I, Section 8, Clause 15 of the Constitution, the National Guard – considered a state militia – is authorized to “execute the laws of the Union and suppress Insurrections and repel Invasion.” The Constitution says nothing about dispatching the military to fight domestic crime, a task usually undertaken by local law enforcement.

Pitchforker on December 27, 2011 at 2:42 PM

Hello…”authorized to “execute the laws of the Union”. The act itself states that the state government is allowed to use federal recourses to maintain “law and order”. Yeah, Alex Jones let you and the rest of his clinical paranoiac audience down.
Regardless, this little factoid is irrelevant to you comparing our troops actions in Iraq and Afghanistan to the actions of the Nazis.

Sure, but we need the best we can buy *now*. And btw we do create some excellent weapons tech that we do sell to very suspect countries (ahem Pakistan).

The thing is, if a friendly country has the better tech option and we need it now – we should buy it now. Worry about beating them at their own tech game at the same time, but tactical imperatives come first.

I have a passing acquaintance with the global marketplace, yes. You’re trying to make a point here – make it.

Please back them one up with facts.

CorporatePiggy on December

Your argument is circular. The reason we would need it “now” is because we outsourced and subsidized the capability to begin with.

And you’re failing to differentiate between the U.S. selling weapons and our “ally” doing it. You’re also not comparing apples to apples, since the “customer base” is different. Its not a moral equivalency test as you’re trying to make it out to be.

And in regards to your “passing knowledge” – if you’re too lazy to use google thats your own problem. I did state FACTS when I told you Israel sells weapons to our enemies. You not being aware of this FACT, does not implicate MY truthfulness. So project all you want, but you’re the one in this discussion who’s short on facts.