Dell uses inmates to recycle computer equipment

There were protests on Thursday during the Consumer Electronics Show, in Las Vegas, as a result of the company's use of prison inmates to recycle computer equipment and Dell's overall recycling record. The inmates are used in association with the recycling part of the Dell Exchange program which offers other ways to part with old computer equipment besides recycling. The only fee the consumer pays for the recycling program is the cost of shipping the equipment. In return the consumer receives a 10% discount at the Dell Software and Peripheral website.

The Silicon Valley Toxics Coalition organized the protest in which some of the protesters dressed in prison uniforms. The coalition believes Dell is not serious about its recycling program. Furthermore, the coalition contends that the reason Dell uses inmates to recycle the equipment is because they are not protected under Occupational Health and Safety Administration (OSHA) guidelines. Bryant Hilton, a spokesperson for Dell, contends the inmates work in full compliance of OSHA standards.

BRIAN'S OPINION
I think the Silicon Valley Toxics Coalition needs to work on its message here. On one hand they want to protest Dell's recycling record. I agree the rate at which computers are becoming obsolete is staggering and as a result computer equipment creates a huge disposal issue especially at the rate the equipment fills up landfills. This being said, why would you then turn around and knock the only program the company has to recycle equipment? If anything the coalition should be supporting it and doing what they can to help the company promote use of the program. The 10% discount Dell offers for consumers who recycle equipment and its financial support of the program is a smart move by the company. What has the coalition done to promote recycling except dress up like idiots and paint stupid signs?

Dell uses prison inmates to recycle computers. Who really cares who does it? The state uses inmates to make license plates — are they at fault? I can't remember the last time someone protested the use of inmates for license plates. This is probably because the practice saves the state money and in return saves people from paying more taxes. The same should hold true with Dell. I am sure that Dell is paying the prison for the services which in turn save government costs. Again, it saves taxpayer money. Dell saves money. As a taxpayer I save money. Heck, let's get HP and Gateway in on this practice.

USER COMMENTS 60 comment(s)

recycling computers(8:52am EST Mon Jan 13 2003)Well I agree with Dell's use of prison inmates. First off, it saves the environment and landfills from the toxicity, and keeps landfills down to a minimum. Second off, it saves on tax payers pockets in numerous ways including on government spent garbage disposal. Third off, maybe it will change the inmates minds on doing crime. It also keeps them occupied which decreases the risk of riots. Way to go Dell. – by Ryan

Hey, “The Sixties” are over!(8:54am EST Mon Jan 13 2003)These neo-hippies need to take a hike, probably to Seattle. That way, they can commune with their anti-WTO pals.

Hey hey, ho ho, dipshit protests have to go!

– by DeafDude

Flowerchildren(9:28am EST Mon Jan 13 2003)I hate hippies… – by JJ

Must Disagree! Prison Labor Hurts all!(9:32am EST Mon Jan 13 2003)Contrary to Brian's opinion there is a whole movement against prisons as a whole and, within that, prison labor (see ). The last Critical Resistance conference had over 3000 attendees… pretty good for a cuase that no one cares about, no?

The problems with prison labor are multiple:

1) No labor protections. We would not want workers exposed to the same chemicals we dont want in landfills. No OSHA, no minimum wage protection, no unions, no right to strike.

2) Unfair competition with “regular” labor. What kinds of labor can't be done with prison labor? Heck — some programs even have prisoners doing janitorial work outside of prisons. Its not like its some kind of training program either — they can't get jobs doing the same work outside of prison because they are all inside the prison now. Prisoners don't just make license plates anymore — they now do everything from answer the customer service phone for AT&T, to make bras for Victoria's secret, to package software for Microsoft. Where will it end? as long as you can pay a prisoner $1/hr to do something you'd pay somebody else more, no job is safe.

cont'd below – by Steven F.

part 2(9:33am EST Mon Jan 13 2003)3) 1 & 2 create a visicous cycle. The first jobs to go are the few manfacturing jobs that are left in the USA. These are the jobs that used to go to the less educated in society and provide for their families. Now that those jobs are gone (down the street to the prison that is), where are those people supposed to find work? How do they feed their families? Like it or not this creates more poverty, and in turn more crime. The result: more prisoners to work for less money — and a cycle that begins again.

Read the whole case at the protesters' website: url:

And in reply to Ryan — i hope you seriously do not beleive that work is a deterrent to crime. That has got to be the most ridiculous statement i have read in some time. There are very few people in this world who do not want to work — most of them are rich and white — hardly the profile of the people in jail. – by Steven F.

In central Texas I saw people protest San Antonio for using water from the Edwards Aquifer. I then saw the same group of people protest the city of San Marcos for using water from the San Marcos river (which is fed from the aquifer). So these people didn't want the city pumping water from the aquifer, yet they did not want anyone using the water when it came out on its own, and all of these people drank water. My point is that people will protest just to protest, nothing is good enough for them. I'd hold a rally to protest, but that would be counter productive.

If I see another save the *____* protest, I'm going to go postal. – by ArcherB

Hippies piss me off…(9:36am EST Mon Jan 13 2003)Why don't they go down and protest at the DMV because inmates are making license plates. I believe working with metals and huge pressing machines are a little more dangerous than dismantelling a computer.

Some friends and I go up to our state prison and play the basketball team there. (They obviously can't come to our gym!) Let me tell you from talking to those guys that doing some sort of technical labor is enjoyable, almost. Hey they make furniture, metal workings, and some even write software.

Isn't ANY recycling program a good program. Sure it might need improvements, but the fact that they actually have one in place is a good thing. I don't see Sears giving me a discount for my old fridge or Best Buy letting me have a price cut for my old black and white TV. – by Cartman

Go Dell!(9:37am EST Mon Jan 13 2003)Anthing that keeps crimanals working is good in my book better then raping each other like the normally do. – by Ben

Re: Steven F.(9:43am EST Mon Jan 13 2003)“There are very few people in this world who do not want to work — most of them are rich and white — hardly the profile of the people in jail.”

Get over it. Not all white people are rich. Not all rich people are white. As a white person who works, I take issue with your racist statements.

100% of all rich people either worked hard all of their lives, inherited, or won the lottery. Very few people inherit of win the lottery. I'm sick and tired of people thinking that those who make more than 70k a year are filthy rich white people who speak with a brittish accent, eat caviar have buttlers and maids and DON'T WORK FOR A LIVING.Prison labor is a great idea. It helps out joe taxpayer and puts prisoners to work paying for their free ride on the state's dime!– by ArcherB

no hippy fan here but…(9:44am EST Mon Jan 13 2003)those old computers have some wicked nasty chemicals in them and who knows how indepth the recycling is… its a questionable move. anyways who buys dell anyways? we have a IBM/HP shop… – by next362″

Who cares(9:44am EST Mon Jan 13 2003)I say the they can work the criminals and not give them anything, We feed them daily so they eat and sleep and cause troubles. They are there for a reason they are useless to society so if we cant Kill them we might as well put them to work! If they dont like it there is always the suicide solution which is probably still way to humane a way to die compared to what the majority of them has done to others. – by Workem Hard

re: Workem Hard(9:50am EST Mon Jan 13 2003)they should be paying the prison for the labor use as long as its a public prison (not a privatly owned). – by next362″

These people are criminals…(9:57am EST Mon Jan 13 2003)So I would have to disagree with the protest statements. While I do think we populate our jails (mostly with drug offenders), if someone raped my sister, I don't want to just use $30,000/year of tax payer money to give him food and a bed – I want him to earn that money in the most disgusting manner possible. OSHA standards are silly anyway, and small businesses often don't have to comply, so these criminals are not getting an aweful treatment. The criminals should not get any wage at all, much less minimum wage. Maybe the work should possible count towards the chance of some day getting a parole hearing.And as far as it taking the work from real workers… When real workers do work such as make license plates, the same protestors show up and say that that kind of work is not fit for workers. I'm pretty happy knowing that my brother's summer job will never be making license plates, because that's just not an option (unless he goes to jail… Hmmm). – by Mike

I've got an idea…(10:17am EST Mon Jan 13 2003)Let's stop using prisoners for labor all together. I say we tear down all the prisons, and rebuild luxury condos for them to live in. They should get free cable, broadband, porn, movies, stereo equipment, large screen TVs, high-end computers, laptops, cell phones, spas, pools, saunas, and all “free” people should have to donate their girlfriends, wives, daughters, etc. on at least a weekly basis for sexual services to be rendered to them without question.

Have any of these ultra-liberals realized that WE'RE TALKING ABOUT PRISONERS HERE!!!! This is SUPPOSED to be PUNISHMENT for these a$$holes! Quit yer whinning and go get a job, you panzies. – by Noob Saibot

re. Steven's F's comments…(10:26am EST Mon Jan 13 2003)These low skill jobs that inmates do aren't hurting our economy. Open up the paper and look at all the low end jobs that are STILL out there.

There are all kinds of government grants and low interest loans for those that want a college education. There is no reason that low income people cannot go to a community college and better themselves if they have the will to do something about the job(s) they have and the way they live. – by HIV

Re: HIV(10:41am EST Mon Jan 13 2003)You're absolutely right. These same people, however, would just assume vote in people that will raise the minimum wage through the roof. That way, they reason, they don't have to work as hard for the same money anymore.

What they don't realize is that inflation shortly catches up and this “extra” money is now gone. So, all the hard working people who don't settle for minimum wage suffer because the money they have and are earning isn't worth as much as it used to be. Plus, the minimum wage earners are back where they started. So, they just vote for another increase in minimum wage.

Minimum wage will be the dagger in the heart of our economy, not Republicans or even George Bush. Damn, people are stupid… – by Noob Saibot

Please, send them to me. (10:52am EST Mon Jan 13 2003)I'd like up to 680 million PCs over the next 5 years. The average PC out there is 500+Ghz, and you guys can't figure out why I buy off lease. Silicon Valley Toxics Coalition message is perfect as it got you and every other media to pomote it's cause for the price of some jumpsuits.I am always pleased to see the work prisoners do when they are working at State and National Parks. State and federal governments should continue to use prisoners for forestry, cleanup and firewood type jobs. NAFTA has cost the US economy a lot. Now, Bush wants investors not to pay taxes on dividends. Phillips has sent 1100 flat panel display jobs from my metro this year alone to Mexico. My area lost close to 10,000 jobs to NAFTA this year. – by tech

they broke the law(11:24am EST Mon Jan 13 2003)prisoners took away someone else's rights by either stealing from them or killing someone so why do they have more rights than the people who were violated by them – by some guy

Order Centers Too(11:37am EST Mon Jan 13 2003)I wonder if those hippies are complaining about prisoners that answer phones and take orders for mail order catalogues. Having a telephone headset in contact with your ear all day can't be much less toxic than disassembling computers. It's not like those guys are forced to eat the capacitors and batteries. If they are doing any desoldering, OSHA makes them use a respirator or provide the work area with a fume hood. – by RCAman

Thanks to the(12:02pm EST Mon Jan 13 2003)Clinton Administration, I no longer have to compete with prisoners for my school grants. I'm all for any kind of rehabilitation of prisoners. Has anyone here ever attempted to recycle a computer on their own? I do every day and once I'm down to just a bad motherboard or other plug-in circuit board, that's as far as I can go. Sure the metal cases get taken to a metal recycler, I take the stupid leaky Ni-Cad batteries and throw 'em in a can which I take to Circuit City when it gets full. I'm not sure what they do with 'em if anything but at least they make the attempt to ease my environmental conscience. Plastics end up in the landfill. Hell, I don't even know what to do with my consumer plastics! I think they all end up in landfills anyway. So here, recycling computer components which still work and putting them together into cheap computers for sale, I'm destroying the economy for the PC marketplace. They're forced to compete with me and I'm forced to compete with them. I took some computer parts to the city dump the other day when those parts were actually getting picked up and guess what? The truck had prison logos all over it. Good. Good for them.– by PRFunky

1) Prisoners took away someone's rights — Wrong! The majority of prisoners are in jail for drug possession — not for violating someone's rights.

2) That i said the rich dont work or all white. Wrong! In refuting the claim that work is a deterrent to crime, I said the majority of people who don't desire to have a work are rich and white. I beleive jsut about every human alive has a desire to work — to occupy ones mind, interact with others, and to create.

3) To everybody trying to sound academic, get off it. You guys know squat about econ — minimum wage is not hurting the economy. Thats elementary econ theory not econ fact — read some real econ, some econometric journals, factor in social costs, than get back to me. Even republicans support EITC credits which are nothing more than raising the minimum wage by having the gov't foot the bill.

– by Steven F.

Maybe compete with China now(12:05pm EST Mon Jan 13 2003)Hey Steven F maybe we can compete with China now. I'll bet even they have to pay their employees more than $1/hr. Let's drive China out of the manufacturing sector by using prison inmates!!! KEWL. I like it. ) – by Pok

Yikes! pt2(12:23pm EST Mon Jan 13 2003)Side note:4) Bush Economics = good economics — Dumb! How is it that a short term economic stimulus package takes 10 years to phase in? Its trickle down economics all over again — based on the economic concept of a “Laffer Curve” that has never been empirically demonstrated.

Back to prisons–5) Prisons are for punishment — wrong! Has anyone ever seen a state have a Department of Punishment? No — its a Department of Corrections, and a Rehabilitation Facility — corrections (correction = fix) has a stated goal of rehabilitating people, politics pushes the issue of retribution.

6) Since there are still some low skilled jobs still available, prison labor isn't hurting the low skilled worker — Wrong! there are about 2 million prisoners now in US jails, even if each fo them took a job, there woudl be some jobs left in the US. However, taht does not mean that those jobs exiting the free economy did not come at some cost to those not in prison. (Of course this will not be 1:1, since you can “buy” more prison labor for the $)

Fact is the national unemployment rate is about 8% now and in the poorest inner cities its usually triple the national rate. Those same handful of poorest districts are where the majority of prisoners come from. factor in too that teh way unemployment is calc'd –they dont count ya if ya not looking for a job –and you can see just how hard it is to get a job in some places in the US.

Re: HIV(12:28pm EST Mon Jan 13 2003)Hey HIV — one last thing i left out —

All these “programs,” loans etc dont exist anymore. In the 90s numerous laws were passed that ban those convicted of felonies for recieving federal financial aid, living in public hosuing, and recieving most of these “second chance” “benefits”.

– by Steven F.

re: PRFunky(12:44pm EST Mon Jan 13 2003)I recycle PCs by buying off lease PCs and keeping them in use. I use the cycles to run a small DP business. I got rid of my last 486s this year. I just throw them in the dumpster. Even though we wipe the HDs, one of my employees puts a spike though them (I don't encourage it, but what he does on his own time is his business). Corps could donate newer eqiupment to schools. – by tech

This is dumb(12:51pm EST Mon Jan 13 2003)OK, I'm as liberal is it gets.

BUT

I don't get the point of these protests. Suddenly liberals are anti-recycling? Or is it the prison-labor issue? Why should I give a rats ass if some con has to work 14 hours days taking my old Dell apart so it can be recylcled.

I say, go Dell go! – by Stupid protesters

re: Steven F(1:09pm EST Mon Jan 13 2003)

Unemployment is 6%, not 8%.

Your “most people who don't want to work are rich and white” comment still comes across as racist.

Minimum wage does offer social benefits, but it has several negative aspects too. Maybe you should read some “real econ”. This is argued in the journals on both sides.

And It's not even that I disagree with your side of the arguement. It has some merit. But it is definately not the black and white picture that you paint it to be. – by Regular Joe

Firewood?(1:13pm EST Mon Jan 13 2003)You mean to tell me that Prisoners are the ones who Cut my Firewood? I have wonder who and how how they do that (ok I know you can do it with Chainsaws and that they that comes down). Hmm wonder if I can get some killers for next weekend? – by Just a Dude….

against prisons?(1:14pm EST Mon Jan 13 2003)Ok…so the next time they arrest a serial killer for raping murdering and then eating his victims, well just call you up and he can serve his sentence in your guest room!

I call bullshit..

Prisons are, like many things, a neccessary evil. some people are good by nature, and need no laws. some people are bad, and will commit crimes no matter the punishment. but then there is that large body in the middle, that threat of punishment is the only reason they dont comit crimes. thats why we need prisons, and why prisons must never be comfortable places. we need them to keep that middle group of would be criminals following the law.– by the warden

Steven F(1:17pm EST Mon Jan 13 2003) = idiot

It's people like that who have screwed up this country.

– by patriot

StevenF = Retard(1:22pm EST Mon Jan 13 2003)4) Bush Economics = good economics — Dumb! How is it that a short term economic stimulus package takes 10 years to phase in? Its trickle down economics all over again — based on the economic concept of a “Laffer Curve” that has never been empirically demonstrated.

Wrong: economic cycles historically for the US run in 10 year increments. Regan-onmics as it was so popularly named set the economy up for the incredible boom we saw in the late 90's. Clinton just showed up when it all hit and took all the credit, a lot like his entire political career. Now we are feeling the effects of a Democratic white house after 10 years.

An easy solution: donate the old computers to student organizations starting in our most depressed school districts across the nation. The corporations could get a tax write off.

Then, teach the students how to piece together useable computers so the schools with no computers would have something in their schools to teach with. They could learn and use linux which does not necessarily need a great deal of computing power and is FREE by golly. The students in turn learn marketable skills which in effect would reduce our prison population.

Too easy AGAIN, yawn..

Hey Steven, bet I know what the 'F' is for.. – by Geekzilla

StevenF need to be lynched!(1:42pm EST Mon Jan 13 2003)If you are trying to piss people off with incompatence you came to the right place. From your rantings, you sound like you need to run for the presidential primarys for the democratic party. You would have a great base for scaring minorities and old people into voting for you Bashing white people, minnimum wage statements, 8% unemployment….Do you want to try and scare people into thinking martians will come down from outerspace and rape their automobiles too???? – by Geek Consortium

Re: Geekzilla(1:46pm EST Mon Jan 13 2003)

Any policy that puts us trillions of dollars in debt is not a good policy. That will have more negative long term effects than anything Clinton did. And the economic cycle isn't a republican vs. democrat issue. The cycle will exist regardless of the policies in place.

It's a good thing we've got the two extremes, though. Nobody likes to argue for moderation. – by Regular Joe

Shank(1:55pm EST Mon Jan 13 2003)I wonder what sort of weapons those prisoners can make out of old dells?…

Prison Labor = Frightening Precedent(2:44pm EST Mon Jan 13 2003)The more I think about this, the more disturbing it gets. The drug war is currently being used to create long prison terms for many thousands of people, most of them poor and not well educated. Then, these people are being used as a source of cheap labor for our corporations. Is anyone else bothered by that? If you are poor and uneducated and are in the wrong place at the wrong time: forced servitude. At the same time, maybe taking jobs away from average Americans.

This is the same with the lax immigration laws which are killing this country. Illegal immigrants get in, do the harshest work for cheap (cleaning out silos in meat-packing plants) and are often injured and killed accidentally. Since they are in the US illegally, it's not reported. Such jobs should go to higher paid American citizens who are protected by OSHA. Maybe the jobs could even by made safer so that people aren't constantly being injured and killed doing them.

Don't build any more prisons – by Kirk

Steven F(3:02pm EST Mon Jan 13 2003)= patriot

please everyone, just keep your heads in the sand and all the bad stuff that happens to he poor will never effect you. – by please_read

Re: Issues(3:07pm EST Mon Jan 13 2003)

I agree that we're jailing too many people. I think that over half of the people in prison are there for drug possesion (I don't know the actual figure). Most of these are people who are only injuring themselves and don't present a real threat to anyone else. But I think that's a different issue than prison labor. They're certainly related, but I think it's a different arguement.

Same with immigration. Although I don't have a problem with immigrants. If I were in a country that offered me little or no chance to work to raise a family, I'd probably try to find a way into a country that let me work too. Maybe I'm just naive in my belief that free market is the best long term solution.

I don't think free market applies to prisons, though. Maybe if the prisoners were given a choice of work? Otherwise, I agree. It sounds a little like slave labor.

-“Kill them all and let God sort them out” – by Regular Joe

Regular Joe(3:19pm EST Mon Jan 13 2003)Incorrect.

Running a deficit historically has always preceeded economic growth along with high unemployment. – by Geekzilla

Re:Stephen F.(3:27pm EST Mon Jan 13 2003)“””It's people like that who have screwed up this country.”””- by patriot

-patriot, that's pretty weak, at least back up your ad hominem with some kind of information so we can take your post seriously :P

———————————–—–Re: Stephen F.

“””1) Prisoners took away someone's rights — Wrong! The majority of prisoners are in jail for drug possession — not for violating someone's rights.”””

– Not so. According to the Bureau of Justice Statistics, drug crimes only make up about 20% of the inmate population.

“””2) That i said the rich dont work or all white. Wrong! In refuting the claim that work is a deterrent to crime, I said the majority of people who don't desire to have a work are rich and white. I beleive jsut about every human alive has a desire to work — to occupy ones mind, interact with others, and to create.”””– Uhhh..where the hell are you gettitng your info from? you say white people don't want to work?? ROFL, this just makes you come of as racist, you didn't refute shit!———————————-All that aside, I don't really agree with Dell using prison labor for their programs. Dell should hire a 3rd party company that they actually have to PAY to do the recycling. The intent seems to be good (recycling) but i have a hard time accepting that Dell should profit off of near-free labour. – by BenTheWorm

Totally Agree with Steven F.(3:43pm EST Mon Jan 13 2003)The temptation for the corporations to use this cheap labour source is too great. Sure it may save tax payers now, but You can bet that corporate lobby/pressure groups are going to push the judicial system to more convictions, which would yield more cheap labour, and since in these cases the gov't is picking up more than 70% of this check, it results in a loss of tax payers dollars, more people in prison, and fewer jobs… – by See the Full Picture

StevenF(3:54pm EST Mon Jan 13 2003)Come talk to me when one of these SOB hurt one of your family or kill one of your kids or sell your kids the drugs they overdose on. Then we will see how you feel about treating them right! – by Workem Hard

Workem Hard(3:58pm EST Mon Jan 13 2003)It's nice of you to lump every one in prison into the same category…Shheeeesh I'm glad I don't live in the U.S. The country is rapidly becoming a 3rd world Nation. – by 1st world country

I Take part of it back…(4:03pm EST Mon Jan 13 2003)I apologize for the comment about who doesnt want to work. I was pissed that someone would make the outragrous claim that work in prison would deter crime. 'twas a lack of judgement on my part.

To Geek Consortium, while we're on the subject of bad jusdgement I'll ignore your comment about lynching — especially given the horrific history of lynching in the US.

Are you an American Indian? If not then you are an immigrant or the decendent of immigrants.

America is made of immigrants, those from 200 years ago as well as those from 2 years ago, from all nationalities, colors, religions, etc.

“We arrive on different ships but we're all in the same boat now.” M.L. King – by mutt

Geekzilla(4:56pm EST Mon Jan 13 2003)

I didn't say that incurring a deficit was a bad thing. It has more to do with the size of the deficit. How much do you want to pass on to future generations? We can live well today and screw our grandkids.

And is unemployment a good thing?Other possible products of large deficits:Increased interest rates (long term)Lower real income (short term)More susceptible to other country's economic fluctuations

So don't get me wrong. I think there are times when running a deficit is beneficial. But there are a lot of negative effects too, especially with the rampant spending of the Reagan era.

– by Regular Joe

Mutt(5:04pm EST Mon Jan 13 2003)

Actually, I'm 1/8th. But I don't think that really counts since I don't attend any tribal functions.

But I'm not really sure if you're taking issue with something I said or if you just wanted to tell me that my ancestors were immigrants. – by Regular Joe

hippies(5:07pm EST Mon Jan 13 2003)hippies everywhere.They want to save the world, but all they do is smoke pot and smell funny! – by Cartman

exploitation of prisoners = bad(10:34pm EST Mon Jan 13 2003)personally, I think prisoners should be assigned work, to pay for their upkeep and to keep them occupied. now, I don't claim to know how much they are paid. but the idea that private corporations can make use of them – probably paying them below minimum wage – for labor is highly disturbing. labor assigned by the state is fine, since the state isn't doing this for profit. Dell is. also, this 'hang them high' attitude is disgusting. some of those prisoners – SOME, not all – would not have committed their crimes had they been in a different walk of life. perhaps if you had been born poor, and faced an economic system that made primarily poor-paying, low-benefit jobs available, you might get desperate. think about it. had you had the misfortune of having different parents, you could be in jail. and that ignores white-collar crime. remember the Ford Pinto? the car had a defective fuel tank, which caused it to explode during collisions. I forget the statistics, but several hundred people died during the car's service life, and probably more were maimed. the defect could have been fixed for $5.08 per car, but Ford stalled repeatedly. although they eventually recalled the Pintos (under demand from the Dept of Transportation). they had the moral duty, and certainly the means, to fix the cars, but they did not. justice means that all their management who were culpable in this incident would be imprisoned for life, without possibility of parole. if we wanted some sort of poetic justice, we might burn them at the stake. I think we all know what their punishment was: nothing. they got to keep their blood-stained profits.so, think about all that before you make asinine comments about prisoners and hippies. – by Weiwen

Bleeding Hearts get no oxygen to their brains(11:17am EST Wed Jan 15 2003)Boneheads?

Steve F and anyone who agrees with him is a bonehead.

Boneheads think that drug possession does not effect society.Hey numb nuts think about the crimes involved for these losers to have drugs… BIG DUH!!!!

Prisoners are individuals who chose NOT to agree with society's rules to a better living. Therefore they do not get the benefits of society. The whole purpose of jail is to deter crime. It is supposed to be a miserable place to be, not someplace that is a Clubhouse for the less fortunate.

By the fact that we can send many prisoners out in the heat and cold to do jobs like clean the highways allows us to reduce the costs of labor with hazard pay and stuff like that…. So no maybe 50 guys won't make 25 bux an hour to clean the roads… but the prisoners earn their keep and I save some money in taxes.

You commit a crime you have a debt to pay to society for the trial and your incarceration. It is not free for us and should not be free for them.

And as far as this argument that they are born into a situation that forces them to commit a crime. BS. They have the choice at any moment to decide, do I walk into this store with a gun? Do I kill this guy because he keyed my homey's car, do I stab this kid because he owes me $50 for some crack and isn't paying?

You make your choice and you are held accountable. It is the way you keep things right in society.

Some funny stuff-Give them hard labor and leave telemarketing to people outside the walls. In fact why not just use them for lab rats this way PETA could stop complaining. The prisoners could try out the latest makeups and let's see if they develop cancer of the mouth.

Give prisoners of Death Row injections of chemicals and see what happens. Think of the money it could save. They die of something horrible, who cares, they were going soon anyway.

May Dell make Millions more! – by Capitalist Pig

Why are people against OSHA?(10:16am EST Sun Apr 06 2003)Why are people against OSHA in the first place?