jack1974 wrote:I've always thought, if it's not hard, why not offer players the option to play the games how they want?

Which I had said about before (and my apologies for getting off-topic; this won't be about a dating sim) : In the upcoming Loren games, as well as any other future RPGs (*but especially the Loren ones, since to me it would seem good for business for WW), why not have an option in the main menu as to whether or not grinding-specific areas would be available?

*I say esp. for the Loren ones since the original Loren had such an therefore players who are into grindin might be upset if it wasn't an option--I mean it as something that would seem to be the best business decision. (Unless of course such would be too much difficulty in terms of coding and such.)

To get the imo best girl in the game (well, and the teacher) the main character required 100 in scholastic skill which was hard to do. Different level of skill gave access to different girls and entirely different storyline.

Another classic, Doukyuusei, didn't have stats system, but in that game one needed to be at the right time in the right place to meet girls, i.e. explore the (quite extensive) city and find out a girl's hobbies and interests.

What people think about the choices system?
I am thinking for future games to get rid of the "right choice that rewards relationship points". I mean, I know it's commonly used in games, and I have used it a lot too (and for more games I will still use this system).

But for example both in Undead Lily, Amber's and in the Dingirra game we're using this system. In practice each character has some variables/stats (could be hidden or not, have to decide) that the player changes with the answers and that will impact the endings.
In Amber is quite obvoius: beside being more "light" or "dark" yourself, you can also change a character's attitude towards dark or light. So there are in practice 4 variants: Dark+, Dark, Light, Light+.

Then, based on those values, 4 different endings for each character. This way it's not like there's a "right" ending. There are of course some "good" ones and some bad (the dark are almost all bad though one with Ruby maybe... ahem, no spoilers).
But I think the player this way is more encouraged to explore and adds replay value. If there's a right choice, why the player should try other ones, or other paths? there's no incentive, except for player's curiosity.

I think that's a neat idea. It opens up picking the obviously-not-correct-but-looks-hilarious answer without having to just save and reload immediately afterwards. And I think it actually makes the choices more meaningful. Instead of "you must play your character like this to win", you have some flexibility on the actions and choices your character makes.

The problem with getting rid of right choices when it comes to romance is that if you get rid of them how will you decide with who the protagonist will end up with? You could potentially make mix of the two, some right wrong choices that decide who protagonist ends up with and others that don't have right and wrong option, true in such case you would need to add something other that those choices effect, like dark light endings in Amber because if choices don't affect anything then there is no much point to having a choice. I guess you could make so that who you talk the most decide who you end up with in love and make a confrontation/jealousy scene in case you have equal points with more love interests and for choices to only affect something like witch ending you get with that LI but if one ending is bad and other good then you would still in a way have a right wrong choice. I guess you could also make choices so that choose between supporting one LI or the other so there is no right wrong choice just choice between one LI or the other this is also a common choice system in VNs, what I like about this format is that there is more events in witch more then one LI are present witch I prefer over all events being between just the protagonist and one LI and in this case you get to hear a response of LI that you don't support in that event.

So to sum it up my opinion on changing a choices system depends on what you want to replace it with.

There will still be relationship. I am only removing the "right choice", not the relationship value idea.
In Amber for example, you can go out on dates, and that will increase relationships.
In other games, you could simply choose who you want to spend time with. Since "relationship" in those games is just a way to measure how much a character likes you, it's mostly used to get the "old" good/bad endings.
But if there are no more "good / bad endings", the relationship value can also be replaced/removed. You simply end up with the character you spend more time with.

In practice players choose with their action. You always spend time with Amukiki in camp talk? then it's obvious you like him. You spend time with 2 or more characters? nothing changes vs the old system, you are presented with a choice at a certain point of the story (the infamous jealousy scenes or something) that will force you to pick one (unless there's an harem ending option ).

So I don't think the relationship value must always be present. You can imagine a GUI with the portrait and:
old method
Amukiki: relationship 75%
new method
Amukiki: dominant 40% submissive 60% =>you'd get the submissive ending at this point if the game ended

(I am using Amukiki just as example, doesn't mean that Loren will use the new system).

Oh now I get what you mean, in that case I am looking forward to the new system, it does sound very good.

Oh but why do you say infamous jealousy scenes, do people dislike them!? I myself love jealousy scenes as I am a big fan of love triangles, love squares and all other love geometry I would love if there where more of them in WW games.