If nothing else, this will show us what 4th century Christians believed about the man who sold the Messiah for thirty pieces of silver. The canonical gospels state that Judas committed suicide shortly after pointing out Jesus to the soldiers; this wouldn't give enough time for Judas himself write the gospel.

Interests:Pretty much I like to hang in paranormal websites...watch movies...go on ghosthunts...been doing tha paranormal thang for now like a year and 9 months...that's our team in the photo above...I'm tha guy in tha red shirt!!

I truly doubt this will change the way Christians view the long held belief of the final days and hours of Christ. Perhaps Judas was all part of the big plan from the beggining. With out him would Jesus have been turned over to the Romans when he was? Maybe not right then, but plans were in the works to remove Jesus from the public eye for quite a while because of the way he spoke against certain leaders and traditions held sacred by those who profited by them.

Of course Judas was part of the plan -- what's supposed to be such a shock about that. That's the way we were taught in Catholic School 40 years ago, that Judas had to do what he did, for the prophacies to come true, and the plan to be realized. Ya'll think God didn't know what was gonna happen.

Of course Judas was part of the plan -- what's supposed to be such a shock about that. That's the way we were taught in Catholic School 40 years ago, that Judas had to do what he did, for the prophacies to come true, and the plan to be realized. Ya'll think God didn't know what was gonna happen.

Well, that depends. Some members don't believe in God, some members consider the events as recorded in the Bible to be orchestrated in the hands of the Romans as opposed to ancient Judaic prophecy regarding the Messiah, some consider other, more wild theories. And some, like you, view it all on pure faith.

I'm with Aloha. Considering how long Judas himself lasted after the arrest of Jesus, the Book of Judas would more likely be how others viewed him and his role in the life of Jesus as opposed to being written by him (such as the Gospel of Luke). I think really that this particular book would fall under the Gnostic heading, along with the Book of Mary Magdaline, and the Gospel of Thomas. Interesting, thought provoking, a window into early Christianity prior to the various gatherings in which the Bible was put together, and a window into different concepts of the faith and the teachings of Jesus.

I'd heard about this- something to do with those who originally followed the gospel believing that they should be as sinfull as possible in this life so that they could be forgiven all the more in the next?
Not sure how accurate that is...

The point which I should first wish to understand is whether the pious or holy is beloved by the gods because it is holy, or holy because it is beloved of the gods.

I'd heard about this- something to do with those who originally followed the gospel believing that they should be as sinfull as possible in this life so that they could be forgiven all the more in the next?Not sure how accurate that is...

Hmmm...I'm not really familar with that line of thought in early Christianity, but given what I do know about the various sects that were in exisistance, honestly it wouldn't surprise me in the least to find a group that believed just that.

And if I recall aright.....it was that very kind of thought that compelled the early Church Fathers to 'phase out" things like reincarnation (which was believed by several Pre-Christian European peoples).

I agree with aloha, when exactly did Judas have the time to write a gospel? Anyway, I have no doubt that it was a karmic transaction and something meant for balancing. Do not forget that god loves Judas as much as god loves you and Jesus has completely forgiven Judas and is in complete understanding as to why this occured.

WASHINGTON — An ancient manuscript rediscovered after 1,700 years may shed new light on the relationship between Jesus and Judas, the disciple who betrayed him.

Rather than the traitor as Judas is portrayed in the New Testament, this document — The Gospel of Judas — indicates that he acted at the request of Jesus to help him shed his earthly body.

"Let a vigorous debate on the significance of this fascinating ancient text begin," the Rev. Donald Senior, president of the Catholic Theological Union of Chicago, said Thursday.

Senior expressed doubt that the new gospel will rival the New Testament, but allowed that opinions are likely to differ on it.

The text helps show the diversity of beliefs in early Christianity, added Marvin Meyer, professor of Bible studies at Chapman University in Orange, Calif.

Elaine Pagels, a professor of religion at Princeton University, commented that "the people who loved, circulated and wrote down these gospels did not think they were heretics."

The papyrus manuscript, probably written around 300 A.D. in Coptic script, is a copy of an earlier Greek manuscript, said Terry Garcia of the National Geographic Society, which made the manuscript public.

It was discovered in the desert in Egypt in the 1970s and has now been authenticated by carbon dating and studied and translated by biblical scholars, National Geographic announced.

Unlike the four gospels in the Bible, this text indicates that Judas betrayed Jesus at Jesus' request.

The text begins "the secret account of the revelation that Jesus spoke in conversation with Judas Iscariot.''

The key passage comes when Jesus tells Judas "you will exceed all of them. For you will sacrifice the man that clothed me.''

This indicates that Judas would help liberate the spiritual self by helping Jesus get rid of his physical flesh, the scholars said.

The manuscript was first mentioned in a treatise around 180 A.D. by a bishop, Irenaeus of Lyon, in what is now France. The bishop denounced the manuscript as differing from mainstream Christianity and said it produced a fictitious story.

There were several gospels in circulation at the time in addition to the four in the Bible. When those gospels were denounced, it was thought that believers hid them away.

The gospel of Judas was kept by a group called the Gnostics, who believed that the way to salvation was through secret knowledge given by Jesus to his inner circle.

National Geographic said the author of the gospel of Judas believed that Judas Iscariot alone understood the true significance of Jesus' teachings.

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Posted 08 April 2006 - 11:45 AM

As I understand it, all of the gospels were written long after the deaths of the apostles. They came from oral traditions, so this could well be a gospel of Judas. What I remember reading is that Judas was actually a rich man when he left his life to follow Jesus. And that thirty pieces of silver was actually not very much money. It was the 'reward' you had to take. If you refuse to accept the money, then it could be construed that you are giving false information. I always wondered why Judas was vilifiled for turning in Jesus, when Simon Peter denied knowing him to the Romans in the garden. My mother said that Judas' real sin was suicide, not turning over Jesus. Suicide is the only unforgivable sin because it is a total lack of faith - you don't believe in God enough to trust that He will take care of you in all things. Of course, we don't even really know that he did commit suicide. The early Church had a habit of removing or changing things to suit their purpose. There is archeologic proof that there were women priests in the beginning of Christianity, but for some reason, women became persona non grata. This may be because in Pagan religions, the God-force is usually female, and those Christian leaders may have wanted to distance themselve from Pagans in this way. And if the man in power hated women, like Hitler hated Jews for instance, he could have just decided that all women are bad, and that if women have any kind of power they must be stopped at all costs.

"Never wrestle with a pig. All you get is dirty and the pig has all the fun." ~ Anon.

Interests:Needlework, including counted cross stitch and knitting, reading, dogs, triking (trikes are three wheeled motorcycled if you didn't know) and flower gardening. That is besides the paranormal...

Posted 10 April 2006 - 09:06 AM

Did anyone watch this last night on National Geographic Channel? What did you think?

I found it interesting that this is a genuine Coptic document, and how it really did end up to be a power struggle between sects. I didn't know that there were that many different Christian sects in the beginning.

"Never wrestle with a pig. All you get is dirty and the pig has all the fun." ~ Anon.