from the you'll-take-this-improved-user-experience-and-like-it dept

Mozilla has angered a significant chunk of the non-profit's userbase by announcing that they'll be implementing ads. More specifically, Mozilla says that the non-profit is developing something they're calling "Directory Tiles," which will present new Firefox users with sponsored thumbnails (aka ads) alongside of recommended or frequently-visited websites in the new tabs page of the browser. Visually the shift is minor; that page will go from something like this, to something more like this. It's also worth noting up front that it's a "feature" that users will be able to rather easily turn off with the push of one button.A Mozilla blog post explains the new effort as such:

"Directory Tiles will...suggest pre-packaged content for first-time users. Some of these tile placements will be from the Mozilla ecosystem, some will be popular websites in a given geographic location, and some will be sponsored content from hand-picked partners to help support Mozilla’s pursuit of our mission. The sponsored tiles will be clearly labeled as such, while still leading to content we think users will enjoy."

The change isn't very exciting, it's not very major, and can be easily disabled. So why are a lot of Firefox users annoyed? It appears that a lot of the problems start with Mozilla being intent on refusing to call the ads what they are, while insisting the changes are somehow a great innovation in browsing. Mozilla's general counsel Denelle Dixon-Thayer, for example, tells CNET that the company is tired of being a "window into the web" -- insisting that these ads (without calling them ads) will bring more value to the end user:

"We wanted to get away from being this window into the web that doesn't bring value," to users, she said. "We looked at it from the perspective of how much value are we bringing to the user? We're not focused on bringing the most revenue into Mozilla," she said."

"Late last year it made a big hire in former kbs+ Ventures chief Darren Herman, who joined as VP, content services, who will lead Mozilla's ad and content efforts. "Mozilla is moving from a dumb window to the internet to a smart agent on behalf of the user, putting the user first," Mr. Herman said."

Except you threw a few paid ads on a launch window, you didn't revolutionize recombinant gene technology. The kind of rhetoric Mozilla's using is the sort you'd expect from a cable company, which love to insist that the new $5 monthly fee on your bill isn't to make money, it's to "improve the customer experience." Mozilla is a nonprofit organization, and for more than seven years around 85% of their funding has come from Google for being the browser's default search engine. While most people wouldn't fault them for wanting to have a broader revenue stream, refusing to call a spade a spade clearly isn't helping the sales pitch.

I really wish PR people didn't always consider everyone else to be brain-damaged morons, if they'd just come out and said 'We're including ads in the empty slots that show up when you open a new tab, you can disable them if you want to', people might have been annoyed, but it probably wouldn't have been seen as a big deal.

Trying to pass it off as a benefit to the person using the browser though, as though people enjoy ads and they should be thanking Mozilla for including this feature... 'condescending' would seem to fit quite nicely there, the assumption that people are too stupid to be able to understand what's being foisted on them, and so need to have it 'explained' to them in a more agreeable manner.

If it were content that consisted exclusively of non-sponsered/paid for stuff, like popular local searches, things related to your recent searches, or well rated websites/restaurants and stuff, I could understand calling it a directory tile. But since it will contain sponsored content, it becomes advertising and should be called such. Just my 2 cents.

“dumb window”

“Maybe we shouldn’t even call it a browser anymore,” Mozilla’s VP of Firefox engineering Jonathan Nightingale told me a few days ago. “‘Browser’ is really an antiquated word. People don’t really browse all that much anymore.” Instead, he argues, we now mostly use our browsers to access sophisticated web apps, web-based productivity tools and social networks.

Firefox alternative...

Just thought I'd throw this out there, there is an excellent Mozilla style browser based on Webkit that is committed to being non-intrusive and ad free that I use, called Qupzilla. It's available for every OS, be you Windows, Linux, Mac or BSD (Haiku OS/BeOS even!). http://www.qupzilla.com/download If you're dissatisfied with Mozilla, it's worth a look for sure, I use it as my every day browser with no issues and it has a very Netscape-y vibe (in a good way).

Re: Firefox alternative...

Thank you for listing the equivalent in a browser, BSD32X. For a good while I turned off Firefox's updater. Mainly because every 6 weeks they were turning out a new update and continually kept breaking the add ons and extenstions.

If there is one thing I hate with a passion it's ads. Slipping it in with a button to turn it off is ok but it's not likely to end there. One day will come the update that has no button with no way to go back.

If Mozilla thinks for one minute I won't abandon their browser over ads, then they got a show and tell coming and I will certainly and unequivocally show them exactly what I think of this 'innovation'.

Mozilla's legal counsel says Mozilla wants to bring "more value" to the user instead of being just a window to the internet?

First, the "value" is only the value of ad revenue that Mozilla will receive. Second, that's all the web browser is, a window to the internet. To pretend it's anything but that is just deluding yourself.

Second, I plan to ditch Firefox the first chance I get. Time to start looking for a different web browser. Guess it's back to Internet Explorer or even Opera.

This sounds like Windows 8 to me. With Windows 8 and the Metro interface, Microsoft forgot that their users valued the desktop in previous versions of Windows and the casual touchscreen users that Microsoft was courting didn't want a Windows product anyway. And so Windows 8.1 seeks to rectify that and Microsoft fired the guy responsible for the Windows 8 fiasco.

Does Mozilla not realize that people like Firefox because it's a dumb window into the internet? If I want ads and curated content suggestions, I'll install the annoying Ask toolbar and all the other junk that is already optional (and opt-in).

"Facebook Effect"

I think to a large degree it's the result of the "Facebook Effect" - now that there's proof that no matter how invasive the advertising or how audacious the privacy violations, a company can still make money hand-over-fist and not suffer a major user exodus because most users are idiots who either don't know or don't care.

Re:

Dumping firefox over something like this and moving back to IE... that's like ditching a pair of shoes because they're a little too tight in one point, and going back to a pair with several massive holes in the soles, the 'solution' is very much worse than the problem.

Re: Re:

That's the thing, though, there are a TON of solutions. Not all of them as are OS independent as Qupzilla which I already mentioned, Midori http://midori-browser.org/download/choose/ , Amaya http://www.w3.org/Amaya/User/BinDist.html , NetSurfhttp://www.netsurf-browser.org/ and many others. Some aim to be more lightweight than others and are less fully featured of course, but there is a FireFox alternative right for almost all hardware/OS combinations.

Re: Re: Re:

Sorry, trying post from my phone and had a few errors (I'm not sure as to how to edit my comments here, I tried google and looking for a FAQ to no avail). That should have read:That's the thing, though, there are a TON of solutions. Not all of them are as OS independent as Qupzilla which I already mentioned, Midori http://midori-browser.org/download/choose/ , Amaya http://www.w3.org/Amaya/User/BinDist.html , NetSurf http://www.netsurf-browser.org/ and many others are available. Some aim to be more lightweight than others and are less fully featured of course, but there is a FireFox alternative right for almost all hardware/OS combinations.

Re: Re: Re:

True, dropping Firefox over something like this I can understand(even if personally such an actions seems to be a bit overkill), it's just replacing it with IE of all browsers seems like a rather counter-productive move, replacing one problem with an even bigger one.

why is it when people dont want something, companies ignore them, after stating they wont get it, to suddenly start forcing people to get it? then the companies wonder why people get pissed and stop using them. amazing!!

One of the most important things about the internet is that it's "dumb", or "neutral" as it's called nowadays. I'm shocked that a Mozilla exec would talk as if a lack of neutrality was somehow a positive thing, considering they're usually pro-consumer on issues.

I've been considering switching browsers for a while. Maybe an open-source Chromium-based browser that supports TamperMonkey. (Although now I want to look into those browsers BSD32x posted as well.)

Better than being in bed with Google

If it means they can secure some funding and it doesnt result in intrusive data mining and bombarding Firefox users with ads then i think its ok. It might eventually enable them to sever their ties with the Advertising Kraken who is thoroughly EVIL.

Re:

It's a perfectly reasonable work hypothesis, corroborated by the majority of election results in "modern" democracies and a number of other mass behaviors. At any rate, it's the raison d'ętre of PR in the first place. They have as little motivation to assume differently as the Pope has to consider Christ a myth. And they don't need to rely on faith here, anyway.

I hope "real" window companies don't also start with this sort of crap. "Pella is moving from a dumb window to the outside world to a smart agent on behalf of the user, putting the user first, with our new 'HUD Tiles' on the glass. Imagine seeing the weather forecast on the glass while you're looking out at the snowstorm. Delightful!"

Sometimes you gotta wonder how "execs" can say (or type) such stupid things and keep a straight face!? (Well, I suppose we don't know if they kept a straight face or not...)

Re: Re: Re: Re: Re:

Depends on which one we're talking about, the thing to remember about these open source browsers is that they all are designed to fulfill different niches. Qupzilla can absolutely, though, because it has AdBlock built in to the browser. AdBlock allows you to block 3rd party lists which accomplishes the same goal as Ghostery, take this guide from GitHub:"Now that AdBlock supports 3rd party lists and this looks like the same can be achieved with some special subscription...A special subscription might be

So configuring AdBlock properly takes careof it and Ghostery. If you go into the tools menu of the browser, you can disable javascript (either totally or for select sites) and also control your cookies settings (so in my case I filter tracking cookies and delete all cookies on close). For me, I run Self Destructing Cookies, Ghostery, NoScript and AdBlock Plus if I have to use a MoZilla browser (at work for instance), so it takes care of everything I want to do. Now, because Qupzilla and Midori are both based on WebKit, they can also use plugins built for that framework as well.

So the long answer is that you can achieve the same thing with those browsers, it will just take some legwork on your part to research how to accomplish it depending on which one you pick. I'm not familiar with all of the plugins you've listed, but if there is no equivalent, just file a request for whatever function it grants you on the GitHub page for Qupzilla or whichever one you choose; this is how these browsers get improved, and it takes a wide variety of people using them to make sure they can do everything that these plug ins accomplish.

Re: Re: Re: Re: Re:

Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re:

There's nothing particularly wrong with Ice Weasel, but it's very bloated and slows down like the older Firefox releases had been doing. A lot of people have also raised concerns about it being vulnerable due to the age of the software (but then you could say that about all of Debian). Personally, I like a leaner, faster browser so Qupzilla is right for me. Not to mention I use KDE for my desktop, and since it's written in Qt it's a much smoother experience. It's also a great option for anyone on older hardware too, I convinced my aunt to let me switch her to Linux Lite since she is still on XP (her PC is a Pentium 4 from 2003), and Qupzilla ran great while Firefox with add ons struggled to keep up.

Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re:

Well, I will check out that Qupzilla.

In case you care:I am running Adblock+ with the privacy list and more importantly the ElementHiding expansion which allows you to block any part of a website that you consider a waste of bandwidth with one click (for example the entire right sidebar, the navigation head and the stuff between posts and comments here on techdirt)No ghosteryRequest policy blocks ALL third party content (including stuff like cdn) unless you whitelist itFor cookie managment I use AskForSanitize and BetterPrivacy.

Greasemonkey an Stylish (or in my case the less popular NoSquint) are there to beat websites into submission.Greasemonky allows you to locally run custom scripts on any site (that can be something simple like attaching ?useskin=monobook to every wikipedia url or something complex like deviant art ripper which allows you to download the whole gallery of any artist with one click)Stylish/NoSquint allows you to change the appearance of any website, so if some design genius thinks white text on black looks good I can quickly change it to black on white before my eyes bleed.

And DownThemAll is basically a sophisticated Downloadmanager (mass downloading, pause and continue...) and usually is faster than even well seeded torrents.

So this and a quick english-german dictionary, a converter for moron to metric and chacheviewer are what I consider essential.

Re:

It's opt-out, until it isn't.

On the other hand, it's open-source, after all. If you don't like the code you can change it. Even if you don't have the knowledge or tools to recompile it so the ads aren't there, someone will. There will be some sort of addon or recompiled version that turns off this "feature" within two days of its release. In the worst case scenario, if they completely go against everything they stand for and try to redo the licensing to prevent modifications, the old versions will still have the old licensing and so they really can't prevent people from using modified old version.

Not a single thing that began as ad-free, in the entire history of humankind, was ever improved by having ads added to it. Nothing. Whatsoever.

Oh sure, it starts simple, but I think we all know these ads will only become more common and more intrusive. It seems to be the ultimate fate of even the noblest of companies to fall into the corrupting influence of "we need to make more money".

Mozilla has lost its way

They've spent a ridiculous amount of time screwing with the Firefox UI -- which was perfectly fine -- instead of realizing that the primary needs for browser users are:

1. standards compliance2. security3. privacy4. performance

It's ridiculous that the functionality of AdBlock, NoScript, Ghostery, HTTPS Everywhere, Beef Taco, Calomel SSL Validation, and other add-ons aren't integrated into Firefox. The Mozilla Foundation should have long since negotiated agreements with the developers of those to subsume their functionality into Firefox (and Thunderbird, where appropriate). Instead, they've engaged in endless tinkering with the UI, and now in forcing filthy advertising down the throats of users.

This is similar to what Canonical has done in trying to force advertising and spyware on Ubuntu users. The arrogance and hubris of both is astonishing.

Oh Mozilla, why did you let me down?

To say I was disappointed by Mozilla's "sponsored content" approach is an understatement.

Just like I want net neutrality for my internet service provider, I want the essentially equivalent feature in my web browser. My browser is a tool for me to get onto the internet and find the content *I* want, not what some other company has paid to put in front of me.

In all the dust-up the last year about how unprotected we are with so much of our online activities, owing to government surveillance, advertiser and big data tracking, criminal activity and rampant corporatism, the fact that Mozilla was a trusted provider of an essential product and understood the issues was comforting. No more.

Mozilla has picked exactly the worst time possible to start selling out its users' online autonomy. I can't believe I wasted money giving the Mozilla Foundation any money through the years, if this is how they repay my loyalty. Where was MY sponsored content? Oh yeah, I paid NOT to have that but yet here they are going back on the promises made to get my donations.

Went and posted there last night. It was held up for moderation. I see it is gone today as they are apparently very sensitive over the issue of dissatisfaction. It was not approved.

This was the post I made that will give you an indication of just how sensitive they are over it. ----------------------- Content creators… why that is exactly what they call ads in other places. So thank you for the warning. You see, I HATE ADS WITH A PASSION. For the now, I have turned off the updating system to Firefox and as a backup have downloaded a browser based on the Mozilla browser called qupzilla.

I say this straight up, go to ads I can’t turn off and I am a gone pecan. I’ve stayed with Firefox for a long long time. But I will drop it like a hot potato should it turn to ads.-----------------------

Yeah, they are very aware of just what they are doing, why, and fancy words won't cover up the attempt no matter how bad they wish it to float over.

Re: Oh Mozilla, why did you let me down?

One other point:

Mozilla GV Denelle Dixon-Thayer: "We wanted to get away from being this window into the web that doesn't bring value," to users...."

Doesn't bring value? If Dixon-Thayer can't see the value in a browser that does what the user wants only, and not what the developer and its advertising clients want instead of the user, then she's the wrong person to be speaking on behalf of Mozilla. Frankly, it's moronic to not acknowledge the value of just being that "window into the web". When she puts it like that, what could be more *fundamental*? That's the very reason it needs to be free of corporatism and favored content.

Real Value

Re: "Facebook Effect"

uh huh...i can't remember if i related this story here: got hit by two vehicles, did the insurance thing, gave them all the accident report info...*then*, i get a message on my cellyphone, and an email, that said 'Oh, we need more info on the other accident parties, please call, urgent, blah blah blah...'call the number anxious to make sure nothing is holding up getting my truck repaired, etc; and it is TOTALLY some marketing bullshit trick... when i smoosh button 2, NO, i don't want your retarded local discount card, thinking it would take me to a real claims adjuster, no, it takes me to another sales pitch, 'are you sure you don't want this offer, blah blah blah...', when i smoosh 2, NO again, it says, 'oh, this line is only for people who accept the offer, good bye', and hangs up ON ME...so, there WAS NO OTHER INFO you bastards really needed ? you were just using me as a marketing sucker ? ? ? fuckers...so, i sends a nastygram to insurance HQ, and they send an auto-response thanking me for me email, and -oh- 'by the way, we still need critical accident info from you, please call this number...'yes, it was the same scam number for the same marketing bullshit i was just writing them about...

IF ONLY korporations WERE real people we could put a noose around their korporate necks and hang them until dead, Dead, DEAD ! ! !

Re: Fiduciary duty

Re: adding ads on ad ons

This is another reason I am sticking with Qupzilla. After the Chrome extension fiasco (where they can be sold without notice), the more I think about how Qupzilla relies on its integrated ad block and built in cookies/javascript features, the better off I think I am. Even if you use a freed Firefox clone like IceWeasel, if that happens it becomes a wasted effort as soon as you install add ons. Unless you have to install more add ons to remove the ads from the other add ons, because that sure isn't a recipe for a bloated mess of code.

Everything has its rise and fall.I use firefox and end up having to find addons just to make it the way I want it to be and all because of their lame developers.And those guys do not care one bit about what they are doing.Soon Firefox is going to be another Chrome which I do not enjoy using.When that new Australis thing comes I will end up dumping Firefox and going to one of those open source variants.There are many things to try out there.I think I should give this qupzilla a look.

phony outrage

What it really proves is that there are a great number of people (especially on the internet) ready at the drop of a hat to express outrage over any change whatever, no matter how insignificant. This is really the least intrusive means of introducing ads to a service I have ever seen, and you can turn it off with one click?! Oh, those fucking money-grubbing bastards! I'm switching to Chrome immediately! Wait... What?

Re: kenichi tanaka

And people wonder why I don't want to update Firefox. With every new version, it gets further and further away from what attracted me to it in the first place.

This whole thing reminds me of the DivX codec bundle. The official DivX codec download also included their custom media player and the Google Toolbar. The devs swore up and down that they were only including it because they thought it was great and that everyone should have it. Finally, after much nagging, they admitted that they were getting kickbacks from Google for including it.

Kind of makes me wonder when the installer for Firefox is going to also include Google Chrome. Everything else on the net now tries to get you to install it...

Re:

Re:

I understand what you are saying, but this is Mozilla Firefox, I expect most of their user base uses Microsoft, so...*

"...if they'd just come out and said 'We're including ads in the empty slots that show up when you open a new tab, you can disable them if you want to', people might have been annoyed, but it probably wouldn't have been seen as a big deal."

That is how I first heard it and my reaction to it.

What I am not clear on is if my nine most visited sites that are there now are going to be gone or is this only after new installs and cache flushes type of deal?

Re: Re:

For the record, in case someone finds this discussion later on:

This is apparently only for when the "most visited sites" tiles haven't been populated yet. The reasoning is that pre-chosen tiles are more likely to be useful, or otherwise desirable, than blank, empty tiles. People who already have enough "most visited sites" data to have populated all of the tiles shouldn't see any change.

Even for new users, it will reportedly replace the default tiles (including the sponsored ones) with your "most visited sites" once you've used the browser long enough that the internal calculation that judges what sites are "most visited" has enough data to do its work. I'd intuitively expect this to be a dynamic, every-time-you-use-the-program, ongoing calculation, but instead it apparently happens only after 30 days.

The moment Firefox version 26 was released, I jumped ship to Pale Moon and didn't look back.

It's depressing to hear that Mozilla is making its star browser worse with each update. If you can switch over to the many available Firefox alternatives, don't waste time. Once you do, any crap updates that Mozilla keeps applying to its browser (and they've been doing this for a LONG time) will no longer be a problem.

download mozilla firefox

Upgrade version of Firefox is really hard to use easily . Because after few moments that browser automatically crash . i tried to install there firebug and imacros add on but failed and failed when i tried with old version of Mozilla then i successfully added add on download mozilla firefox