KD may have been luck, but was Westrbook, Harden and Ibaka? At some point you have to acknowledge that the man knows what he is doing.

He's no dumby, and he tries his best, like all other GMs, but he's not the talent evaluator and negotiating genius he's being anointed as, by some. He has his hits, and his misses. He didn't seem to "know what he's doing" when he signed Ibaka (great shot blocker, but what else?) to the big $$$, knowing he wouldn't also be able to keep Harden. Then gives Harden up for 3 bit pieces.

Harden is a star, he needed his own team. He got far more for him than we did for Bosh.

As for questioning his talent evaluation? He has built a perennial playoff powerhouse mostly through the draft. I don't get why anyone thinks they have the right to shit on this man. He is a top GM in the league period.

In other words. The only GM's who tank are the ones who are lazy and don't want to build their team the smart way. Ujiri is a very smart guy, he's not going to tank. He knows how to build a team by maneuvering and swapping pieces that fit into the puzzle.

Sixers tank was textbook. Boston quality tank also. Think I could have lived with us losing one more game a year ago to take Barnes also. Tanking is definitely not always bad, and can be an efficient way to rebuild quickly.

That being said, not in favour of us tanking this year. I'd prefer to see what we have, and would view a playoff spot as progress.

Although the moratorium is lifted on July 11th, it seems that the dust is settling a bit (as other teams are signing their players, etc). I'm willing to accept tanking so I'll have to wait and see if the Gay / Derozan or both, falls to the ground via a trade / salary dump. Did I mention I love the Hansbrough signing?

“The saving of our world from pending doom will come, not through the complacent adjustment of the conforming majority, but through the creative maladjustment of a nonconforming minority.” - Martin Luther King

I see it being really difficult to do a proper tank. I also see it being really difficult to win 2 playoff games... Unless Ujiri can pull something magical out of his nethercrack, I think it's going to be 2015 before we can really get off the treadmill in either direction.

"We only have one rule on this team. What is that rule? E.L.E. That's right's, E.L.E, and what does E.L.E. stand for? EVERYBODY LOVE EVERYBODY. Right there up on the wall, because this isn't just a basketball team, this is a lifestyle. ~ Jackie Moon

I see it being really difficult to do a proper tank. I also see it being really difficult to win 2 playoff games... Unless Ujiri can pull something magical out of his nethercrack, I think it's going to be 2015 before we can really get off the treadmill in either direction.

Agreed. It's difficult also because we've just come off 5 years of losing. Usually tanking comes when the team has an aging group of players, or sees a downward spiral ahead, and accelerates it by selling players for valuable assets and draft picks. I think the problem here is that we've just got so many overpaid players that it's just way harder to find the perfect trade partners to do an instant rebuild. I have to give kudos for the Bargnani trade, that was fantastic. But you literally need to do 2-3 more similar deals to get it completely righted.

He's no dumby, and he tries his best, like all other GMs, but he's not the talent evaluator and negotiating genius he's being anointed as, by some. He has his hits, and his misses. He didn't seem to "know what he's doing" when he signed Ibaka (great shot blocker, but what else?) to the big $$$, knowing he wouldn't also be able to keep Harden. Then gives Harden up for 3 bit pieces.

Serge Ibaka:

ws/48 of .181 PER 19.4 WP .222

led the league in blocked shots, 4th in fg%

shot 35% from 3 and 47% from 16-23ft and a ts% over .600

all for 12.3 mil a year

Ibaka was an excellent deal.

Presti's deal of Harden was a lot more complicated than not evaluating his talent properly or being a bad negotiator. OKC couldn't afford to keep Harden, was still in a position to win now, while young enough to be a contender well into the future. The deal solved OKC's financial issues, gave them a replacement player for the short term and potential replacements long term.

Interesting fun fact about OKC last year. They had their best winning % ever, their best ORTG ever and their best DRTG ever. As a franchise, one would have to go back to 1994 through 1996 to find winning% and O/Drtgs as good as they had in 2012-13.

As much as I'm sure Presti had no interest in dealing Harden, the team still continued to improve despite that deal, while having more financial flexibility. It was a rare good deal for both teams.

Tank Talk SO Ridiculous

Preface: I am not a fan of tanking in the least. I think it cheapens the sport and I wish it wasn't an option. However, recent events have forced me to re-examine my view of this.

Part A: No Tank You

Cleveland: is looking to acquire Andrew Bynum and other moves show this is a team that is interested in winning now. Their GM has announced that they do not want to be in the lottery any longer.

Boston: Has sent strong signals that they are not interested in tanking but rather retooling around Rondo/Bradley/Green/Sully/

Bucks: Not interested in tanking. They are looking to acquire Teague or keep Jennings. Signed OJ Mayo and they still have Ilyasova and Sanders to provide an inside out punch from the 4/5 position.

Atlanta: Does not appear interested in the tank is going out of its way to gain talent...and until they drop Horford no tank is happening there. Oh and the adding of Millsap suggests more second round playoff exits for Atlanta

Washington: Wall/Beal/Porter is a young group that will start climbing the ladder this season, tanking will not sit well with a soon to be extended John Wall.

Portland: Will be taking a significant stride this year as their PG takes another leap.

Hornets: with a healthy AD, and adding all Jrue Holiday no longer want a piece of this sweet sweet 14 draft class.

Detroit: When they signed Josh Smith it was a pretty good indication that they were done losing. They are now looking to climb the ladder as well

Charlotte: signing Al Jefferson has Charlotte primed to move into the dreaded 7 - 11 category, unless they follow that up with other moves.

The following are teams that see the writing on the wall and finally blow it up and tank.

Denver: They lost...Iggy, Masai, Karl...among others... They have the pieces right now to be another 7 - 11 team. I think they might be taking the view that the 7 - 11 is a ladder and not a well. could go either way.

Dallas: For the second straight year they have failed to sign a single big name. Dirk is getting older and Calderon is their big FA get. Word is they are still on the hunt, and so I will not place them in the tank train yet but they gotta pull off something and soon or else it becomes a very real possibility.

Part D - Organic Growth Year (We love that phrase don't we fellas?)

Orlando, with Tobias Harris, Oladipo, Nicholson, and Vuvecic they look like a promising team on the rise. I think they truly are looking to get better this year and they have four very good pieces to do it with. I expect them to be a 7 - 11 team as well (probably closer to 11) but where as Denver might be looking down a well, Orlando does appear to have a ladder in front of them.

Utah: Out of the shadow of Millsap and Jefferson, Kanter and Favors now have a big chance to shine. Much like Orlando though this is going to be a step up the ladder kind of year. I see them having about the same result as Portland did last year with a young talented PG learning (fucking up a lot) his way into the league. This will likely put them as high as ten and low as 12 in the west.

Sacramento: substitute names with Orlando and same deal. 7 - 11 will be a ladder for them. They have a serious head coach now and it they will competitive. I'd say they land right outside the playoffs in 10th

Part E - Enemy Armor Incoming! Tank Alert

Philly: The only team in the league that I can see is so obviously tanking it hurts, is Philadephia. Traded an All Star for a guy coming off ANOTHER ACL injury. He does have huge upside but likely won't start getting noticed until the end of the season.

Part F - I Seriously Don't Know What The Fuck They Are Doing

Phoenix - ?????????????? retankibuilding? tanktooling? getting worse through the draft? collecting assets? They got Eric Bledsoe to start...maybe...Channing Frye has heart issues, Marcin Gortat doesn't wanna be there. They picked up twins for fun. Kendall Marshall is now a 3rd sting lottery pick??? Someone else can take a crack at this one.

Which brings us to the Raptors....

PG - doesn't make team mates better
SG - Can't shoot 7 million dollar player making 10
SF - Can't shoot 12 million dollar player making 20
PF - No back to the basket low post threat - gotta backup wearing a starter hat.
C - well 1 out of 5 ain't bad!

Our ceiling with this current group is a second round playoff exit. Which I would love to watch. Believe me...it would be a thing of beauty to watch important games being won. However. If we are only truly racing one team to the bottom, and there are 5 guys that could raise you to another level... I hate to say it but I maybe, just maybe I could be talked into tanking.

While an interesting post, why do you decimate a young team that has not had a chance to play a full season to have a 25% chance to get a player like Wiggins.

Even if we play to lose and beat the odds to select Wiggins....how many years are we away to get back to where we may be today. Even Lebron had to be surrounded by other great players to win a championship.

While an interesting post, why do you decimate a young team that has not had a chance to play a full season to have a 25% chance to get a player like Wiggins.

Even if we play to lose and beat the odds to select Wiggins....how many years are we away to get back to where we may be today. Even Lebron had to be surrounded by other great players to win a championship.

Dude the team was 11 games under .500 last year. We're not breaking up a 55 win team on a whim here. Patching together a 30-35 win team is not exactly hard... We could probably do it next summer even if we stripped everything down this year.

While an interesting post, why do you decimate a young team that has not had a chance to play a full season to have a 25% chance to get a player like Wiggins.

Even if we play to lose and beat the odds to select Wiggins....how many years are we away to get back to where we may be today. Even Lebron had to be surrounded by other great players to win a championship.

First its not just about getting Wiggins. I think this is absolutely imperitive to any 'tanking' debate. Wiggins, at this point in time, just happens to be the pinnacle/ideal/optimal reward for tanking. There are numerous other highly sought after draft picks coming up, and should all else fail (or something else change/become available while the team is tanking) a high 1st round draft pick is always a very valuable commodity. As a bonus, assuming the tank is done 'right', it should also add additional cheap/young players and additional cap space (I will say though, doing it 'right' is a rather loose term).

Secondly, where the Raptors are is a rather easy place to get to. Even if we assume that the Raps are a playoff bound team, over half the league makes the playoffs every year. If we look at were Toronto is record wise (34 wins), thats an extremely easy point to get to.

That said, it will most likely take numerous years to rebuild. However, the difference is its done with the purpose of increasing the Raptors ceiling. Giving the team what should be a greater opportunity to become a contender, than the proverbial 7-11/mediocre/treadmill (or whatever label one wants to use) that they stand at today and what looks like the near future.

Because it isn't just about Wiggins for me. There are, according to experts, 5 Franchise guys in this draft. So if we play bad enough we have a 100% chance of landing a franchise player.

I don't believe for a second that there are 5 franchise guys in this draft. I think there is a lot of hyperbole. The 2012 draft was supposed to be amazing as well and it's been pretty meh so far. Guys are already slipping in the 2014 mock draft and the college season hasn't yet begun.

But I'm swinging my stance on the tank/anti-tank debate and would prefer to start over with a new GM that actually has a vision. Draft picks (especially high lottery picks) are very good assets (probably the best next to a superstar but there are only 3/4 of those to go around).

High picks can land you very good super-star caliber type players.. either by attracting a superstar to play with that high pick (like Paul in LAC) or by trading those picks to get a really good player (like Harden in Houston or Allen in Boston).

Since the team is heading towards mediocrity (7-11) it's best to get high value assets now as opposed to later.

Harden is a star, he needed his own team. He got far more for him than we did for Bosh.

As for questioning his talent evaluation? He has built a perennial playoff powerhouse mostly through the draft. I don't get why anyone thinks they have the right to shit on this man. He is a top GM in the league period.

I didn't shit on him. I said he makes mistakes too, in reference to your reverence of him, period.