The really stupid thing is, if he would only drop the role he is playing, we'd all accept him as an equal as he is "one of us" too. I am wondering if he is really acting true to himself, or just asking as he thinks he has to because he is a BK. Or so he says.

Please give a short description of your interest in joining this forum.: I have been associated with Raj Yoga since 1985, and have only quite recently come to learn of the PBKs and this forum, which i find a great place to get deeper insights into all things Gyani, and hear input from many sides. I find this most healthy, stimulating, and informative, and hope this continues for some time to come.

fluffy bunny wrote:The really stupid thing is, if he would only drop the role he is playing, we'd all accept him as an equal as he is "one of us" too. I am wondering if he is really acting true to himself, or just asking as he thinks he has to because he is a BK. Or so he says.

An interesting point fluffy Bhai. I know myself i have to look very carefully within, to see what i really feel when certain "information" emerges, or charges are leveled against anything i believe in. Am i simply acting or re-acting to protect my stance be it right or wrong; or am i acknowledging, and carefully checking to see if there is any truth or value in what is being said. It can feel disloyal to do this and lacking in faith; but i believe if one is not carefully re-checking their belief system as they go along, you end up becoming a robotic automaton, just acting without intellect and discernment.

Roy wrote:Am i simply acting or re-acting to protect my stance be it right or wrong; or am i acknowledging, and carefully checking to see if there is any truth or value in what is being said ...

What you write is as true about a skeptical point of view such as my own ... which is why I avoid taking an absolute position to all this.

I think being able to admit that one does not know or cannot 'know' (... admit it is all just down to faith ...) is a good starting point.

The accurate use of words is something I feel very strongly about, e.g. "acceptance via repetition" versus "understanding". There's very little to no understanding in the BKs, it's all about repetition, acceptance and conformity ... and some people like to put themselves in the position of being the 'conformity police', suppressing people and keeping everyone's thoughts the same, "Don't think ... don't question ...".

The best one can do is predict probability on the basis of past actions, and learn to see the intention not the action.

It's bad to become sucked in by old sanskars, or non-BK values and sentiments, like class, snobbery, untouchability etc but that is the feeling I get from, and memories I have, of some of the BK leaders ... but then, I am "the lowest of the low" so I suppose I should expect it.

Time will tell. I might make to 2036 to see what happens ... on the basis of probability, I predict the BKs will change it to "2036 to 2046". I think if they had any integrity, they would have to draw a line at some point and admit they were wrong long beforehand.

Please give a short description of your interest in joining this forum.: I have been associated with Raj Yoga since 1985, and have only quite recently come to learn of the PBKs and this forum, which i find a great place to get deeper insights into all things Gyani, and hear input from many sides. I find this most healthy, stimulating, and informative, and hope this continues for some time to come.

fluffy bunny wrote:Time will tell. I might make to 2036 to see what happens ... on the basis of probability, I predict the BKs will change it to "2036 to 2046". I think if they had any integrity, they would have to draw a line at some point and admit they were wrong long beforehand.

I suppose if the BKs admit there was no Shiva mentioned until or around or after 1950, then they could spin it to say 2050. (I understand people are now saying that although Shiva was not mentioned, his influence was there, just the Om Mandli were too dumb or wrapped up in Lekhraj Kirpalani's ego trip to notice it for 14 years.

As regards mbbhat ... pots cannot call kettles black/people who live in glass houses shouldn't throw stones ... which is the lesson I am trying to teach him.

For as many grains of dirt he can find on the PBKs, there's a mountain on the BKs. It's not a winning strategy. Until the BKs get their own house in order, no ones going to take a BK seriously.

Please give a short description of your interest in joining this forum.: I have been associated with Raj Yoga since 1985, and have only quite recently come to learn of the PBKs and this forum, which i find a great place to get deeper insights into all things Gyani, and hear input from many sides. I find this most healthy, stimulating, and informative, and hope this continues for some time to come.

fluffy bunny wrote:I suppose if the BKs admit there was no Shiva mentioned until or around or after 1950, then they could spin it to say 2050. (I understand people are now saying that although Shiva was not mentioned, his influence was there, just the Om Mandli were too dumb or wrapped up in Lekhraj Kirpalani's ego trip to notice it for 14 years.

I think there is truth in this... they were too wrapped up believing that Dada Lekhraj was Prajapati God Brahma, and thus doing the shooting of making Krishna(Brahma Baba) the God of the Gita... also, by placing his name(Pitashri) in front of ShivBaba's in the Murli. That's pretty rude imo :D , and reveals the powerful Bhakti sanskars of BK souls that still plague them to this day; with their huge pictures of Brahma Baba hung on their walls, not to mention the "Dadi trinity" hung beside it. ShivBaba has clarified in advance knowledge, that the first 40 years of the Confluence Age are the night path; and that day only begins when the Sun of Knowledge rises in 1976; the year of Revelation of the Father. The BKs continue to prefer the night though; so they keep their curtains closed. :D

In all "wars" people from all sides have stopped and met in the middle of the battlefield and realised that they are all the same and how futile the war is.

It's interesting that the BKs essentially glorify war and use the language and archetypes of war rather than pacifism. Lekhraj Kirpalani still speaks to his "Army" in Abu as if he was some kind of military commander. Even the way the BKs treat PBKs is like some enemy army, e.g. kidnapping PBK "soldiers" and interrogating them, beating them if they need to.

And when you raise such issue, the likes of mbbhat is just silent ... ethics don't matter to them, it's not even "victory" they want ... its conquest. Just like the Mughals.

Please give a short description of your interest in joining this forum.: I have been associated with Raj Yoga since 1985, and have only quite recently come to learn of the PBKs and this forum, which i find a great place to get deeper insights into all things Gyani, and hear input from many sides. I find this most healthy, stimulating, and informative, and hope this continues for some time to come.

Please give a short description of your interest in joining this forum.: I have been associated with Raj Yoga since 1985, and have only quite recently come to learn of the PBKs and this forum, which i find a great place to get deeper insights into all things Gyani, and hear input from many sides. I find this most healthy, stimulating, and informative, and hope this continues for some time to come.

fluffy bunny wrote:Well ... not *their* history books actually. I think you mean real history books written by real historians and academics from real universities. We know what the BKs are like when it comes to history.

However good you are, however wise you are, however much effort you make ... without challenging the foundations of the BKWSU, and helping resolve all the problems within, you are standing on a mountain of garbage to make your points. That is why they will never have much power.

There's no satisfaction in being "King of the Heap", if the heap is made out of garbage. And throw as much garbage as you like, no ones going thank you for it.

Please give a short description of your interest in joining this forum.: I am a Bk and a writer. I have been benefited a lot by the knowledge given in BK institution. I also have materials written totally on logic without BK knowledge. Anyone can get them as attachments for free by email.

How does God ShivBaba reveal himself?
Does HE first come and take the 7 days basic-Gyan from another soul...asks queries about Gyan...reads the Murlis for 3 years...makes an Advance Course and literature(compiling points under different headings)...then starts explaining the Murlis and then demands a letter of faith from the students.(stating that he is practical Chariot Bhagwan-ShivBaba)...is this the way God ShivBaba reveals himself in front of his children in Sangamyug ?..let each pbk ask himself.

Please give a short description of your interest in joining this forum.: I have been associated with Raj Yoga since 1985, and have only quite recently come to learn of the PBKs and this forum, which i find a great place to get deeper insights into all things Gyani, and hear input from many sides. I find this most healthy, stimulating, and informative, and hope this continues for some time to come.

shivsena wrote:How does God ShivBaba reveal himself?
Does HE first come and take the 7 days basic-Gyan from another soul...asks queries about Gyan...reads the Murlis for 3 years...makes an Advance Course and literature(compiling points under different headings)...then starts explaining the Murlis and then demands a letter of faith from the students.(stating that he is practical Chariot Bhagwan-ShivBaba)...is this the way God ShivBaba reveals himself in front of his children in Sangamyug ?..let each pbk ask himself.

Yes exactly Shivsena Bhai! But Shiv and Shankar are two separate beings not one... it feels like your viewpoint is part of the shooting for combining Shiv and Shankar, as you do not differentiate between the two. One is the Ocean of Knowledge, Father Shiv; and the other is the Sun of Knowledge Father, Shankar; who shines the brightest at revelation, once the eclipse of the moon of knowledge mother, Brahma Baba Krishna has finally passed by; when he becomes Vishnu at the end.
“Hadn’t Shankar existed (in practical corporeal form), they wouldn’t have combined us(Trinetri Shiva and Brahma Baba Krishna the Moon of Knowledge mother) with Shankar. They prepared the picture (in Bhakti marg of Lord Shiva, or Shiv-Shankar) that means they combined Me(Shiv) with Shankar. They call him Shiva-Shankar Mahadev (on the path of Bhakti), hence Mahadev(Shankar) becomes the greater one (during the Confluence Age... i.e. the no 1 child of Father Shiv, the one who completely emulates His incorporeal stage at the end)." [Mu 26.06.76; 16.02.73]

"Although the body (of Prajapita-Ram aka Shankar) may be small, but if he is clever in knowledge (no 1), then it is felt that he is going to become a great person in the future." [Mu 03.05.73]

"Elder brother is always treated as Father. Here everything depends on knowledge. Whoever has more knowledge is supposed to be elder. Although he (Prajapita-Shankar) may be young (he was only 34 in 1976) , but if he is clever in knowledge (no 1), then we think that he is going to become Vishwanath(Lord of the Universe, or World Emperor Shri Narayan of the Confluence Age)." [ Mu 03.05.76]

"God is one. It is said that his child also is one. Among the three deities of Trimurti, Shankar is the eldest(most knowledgeable)." [Mu 10.02.72]

"Shankar is called Dev-Dev-Mahadev, because Shankar is next to Shiva(i.e. the no 1 child who emulates his incorporeal stage completely at the end)." [Mu 29.09.97]

"Now the Sun of Knowledge (Shankar aka Prajapita-Ram) has left the corporeal world (i.e. he begins churning the knowledge in the Murlis from 1969, a process that goes on until 1976) and is standing in the subtle avaykt world (as a result of this process making his intellect subtle)." [Av 16.07.69]

"Two years remain out of 10 years (since ShivBaba spoke of the destruction of the old world)... soon (in 1976) it is the end of the Iron Age (within the mind and intellect of Shankar aka Prajapita-Ram)." [Av 04.02.74]

“The last bomb (of knowledge), is (the bomb) of the Revelation of the Father (through Shankar aka Prajapita-Ram). Whoever sees, whoever comes in (direct) contact (with the Father) and listens... let this voice come from them that the Father has arrived, the task of the direct Almighty Authority is going on. The last powerful bomb, i.e., the revelation of the Supreme Soul(Prajapita-Ram) has not yet begun… The teacher is the direct (embodied) Almighty. The Sun of Knowledge has risen in the corporeal world... but this (fact) is still incognito (and unknown to the majority of Brahmins, whilst the Moon of Knowledge, Brahma Baba Krishna, has yet to become complete - Brahma so Vishnu)... Through this last bomb, the Father will be revealed amongst every one (of the Brahmins, and then the outside world). The Father of the World(Vishvapita aka Prajapita-Shankar) will be clearly visible in the (Confluence Age) world (first of all).” [Av 28.12.78]

"Finally, they(the Brahmins of the Confluence Age) have all understood (led by Brahma Baba's realisation about this issue, when he finally becomes Vishnu at the end), that this (advance) Gyan (or the True Gita) has been given by Parampita Paramata (Shiv), through Prajapita Brahma(Shankar).” [Mu 19.05.64]

"Supreme Soul Shiv through Prajapita(Brahma aka Shankar), transforms the Night of Brahma into the Day of Brahma." [Mu 27.02.74]

"Now it's Brahma's night. So it is night for Brahma(Baba Krishna) also, is not it? Then, when he becomes Vishnu (at the end, before the Mahabharata War commences), it will be day (i.e. the Sun of Knowledge is finally visible to all the Brahmins of the Confluence Age)." [Mu 15.10.77]

There is contradiction in the terms used here.
Is there any pbk who is seeking truth? If they seek the truth can they remain as pbk?

shivsena wrote:then demands a letter of faith from the students.(stating that he is practical Chariot Bhagwan-ShivBaba)...is this the way God ShivBaba reveals himself in front of his children in Sangamyug ?..let each PBK ask himself.

Once they give in writing that they are blind followers, where is the question of seeking truth?
Satya.