WWI Digest 1053
Topics covered in this issue include:
1) Re: PC-10 lovers, watch.
by bshatzer@orednet.org (Bill Shatzer)
2) Re: Woodman scans (only for people who have requested scans)
by "Tom Werner Hansen"
3) DH-10
by "Peter Crow" <888444222@email.msn.com>
4) Joey Udet's Limos / welcome to new list member
by Pedro e Francisca Soares
5) Re: Joey Udet's Limos / welcome to new list member
by Bob Pearson
6) Re: DH-10
by Charles Hart
7) Re: Joey Udet's Limos / welcome to new list member
by Bob Pearson
8) Re: Udet's mounts
by Bob Pearson
9) Re: Profiles and other books
by Aidrian Bridgeman-Sutton
10) Re: Rivets?
by Aidrian Bridgeman-Sutton
11) Re: Miles off topic
by Geoff Smith
12) Re: Woodman scans (only for people who have requested scans)
by Geoff Smith
13) VCR Alert!1 - WWI Films -U.S .only
by MACFARB@aol.com
14) RE: Miles off topic
by Shane Weier
15) RE: DH-10
by Shane Weier
16) Re: Rivets?
by Geoff Smith
17) Re: DH-10
by "Peter Crow" <888444222@email.msn.com>
18) Re: SVA, (was Re: Whippet)
by Matthew Zivich
19) Re: VCR Alert!1 - WWI Films -U.S .only
by Matthew Zivich
20) pounce wheels wasRe: SVA, (was Re: Whippet)
by KarrArt@aol.com
21) WWI Films
by Charles Hart
22) Re: DH-10
by BStett3770@aol.com
23) Re: DH-10
by Charles Hart
24) Re: Whippet (was RE: Rivets?)
by "Charles Duckworth"
25) RE: DH-10
by Shane Weier
26) Re: Whippet (was RE: Rivets?)
by "Leonard Endy"
27) Re: Work in progress
by REwing@aol.com
28) Re: PC-10 lovers, watch.
by REwing@aol.com
29) Tapes
by Shane Weier
30) Re: Udet's mounts
by Joey Valenciano
31) Re: Joey Udet's Limos / welcome to new list member
by Joey Valenciano
32) Re: AEG G.4 details
by Joey Valenciano
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Date: Thu, 4 Jun 1998 08:51:42 -0700 (PDT)
From: bshatzer@orednet.org (Bill Shatzer)
To: wwi
Subject: Re: PC-10 lovers, watch.
Message-ID: <199806041551.IAA07398@ednet1.orednet.org>
Tom writes:
>Are there any kits of the DH 10 available?
SFAIK, jest the old Aurora/K&B 1/48 - a kit with some problems
but probably usable.
Aurora DH-10s, expecially the last issue, are not particularly
sought after with the collector types and are generally
available at less than collector's prices.
If you are willing to look a bit, you could probably find
one for $20 or less.
CHeers and all,
--
Bill Shatzer - bshatzer@orednet.org
------------------------------
Date: Thu, 4 Jun 1998 18:08:30 +0200
From: "Tom Werner Hansen"
To:
Subject: Re: Woodman scans (only for people who have requested scans)
Message-ID: <199806041606.SAA08862@d1o211.telia.com>
Sorry to bother you all again with this.
I sent out the pictures for Woodman 1, but some bounced. I don't know
whose. If anybody has asked for scans and not received any, call me back,
and I'll recheck your addresses.
Tom
------------------------------
Date: Thu, 4 Jun 1998 10:14:23 -0700
From: "Peter Crow" <888444222@email.msn.com>
To:
Subject: DH-10
Message-ID: <001001bd8fdc$3ab724a0$dd16fed0@default>
>Are there any kits of the DH 10 available?
>
>Tom
There was a vacuform in 1/72 of a DH-10 from a company called "Morning
Star"... I built this about 3 years ago and thought it was a pretty good
kit..Fine scribing with nice detail, metal parts, fair decals.. How accurate
it is I don't know, but I was happy with the over-all look.. Whether or not
its still available, don't have a clue...Used the magazine you cited as my
main reference...
Peter Crow
------------------------------
Date: Thu, 4 Jun 1998 18:12:13 +0200
From: Pedro e Francisca Soares
To: "'ww1 modeling list'"
Subject: Joey Udet's Limos / welcome to new list member
Message-ID: <01BD8FE4.FFB96EE0@fei1-p16.telepac.pt>
First of all a warm welcome to the new member who rides the same limo as =
Joey.
(I downloaded my mail from another puter at work, and I forgot to save =
the messages so please excuse me for not addressing you by your name)
Now Joey,
I don't know if this helps but the articles from Airfix magazine on the =
DR1 that Graham so kindly provided us with mentions a limo flown by your =
alter ego, that I couldn't find on your list.
I quote:
"Drawing 7 shows a marking applied to the DR1 which Lt. Ernst Udet flew =
when appointed to Jasta 10, it being a monogram based on his =
fianc=E9es's name, Lola, and one which he carried in some form on all =
his aircraft. From available photographs it was, in this case, crudely =
applied as a line drawing and was probably done hastily in chalk, a =
practice used by both sides on occasion. No other details of this =
aircraft are available but it was apparently finished in the standard =
manner with all relevant stencils clearly marked."
HTH
Pedro
------------------------------
Date: Thu, 4 Jun 1998 10:39:37 -0700
From: Bob Pearson
To: WW1 Mailing list
Subject: Re: Joey Udet's Limos / welcome to new list member
Message-ID: <17393779703072@KAIEN.COM>
Pedro,
I have seen this Dr.I before and it has been mentioned that the crudely
drawn 'Lo' was applied as a guide so the painter could see just exactly Udet
wanted it to look like. In a sililiar vein there are photos of a (34 Sqn ?)
RE8 that also has a chalked '18' on it preparatory to its being filled in.
Regards,
Bob Pearson
----------
> From: Pedro e Francisca Soares
> First of all a warm welcome to the new member who rides the same limo as =
> Joey.
>
> (I downloaded my mail from another puter at work, and I forgot to save =
> the messages so please excuse me for not addressing you by your name)
>
> Now Joey,
>
> I don't know if this helps but the articles from Airfix magazine on the =
> DR1 that Graham so kindly provided us with mentions a limo flown by your =
> alter ego, that I couldn't find on your list.
>
> I quote:
>
> "Drawing 7 shows a marking applied to the DR1 which Lt. Ernst Udet flew =
> when appointed to Jasta 10, it being a monogram based on his =
> fianc=E9es's name, Lola, and one which he carried in some form on all =
> his aircraft. From available photographs it was, in this case, crudely =
> applied as a line drawing and was probably done hastily in chalk, a =
> practice used by both sides on occasion. No other details of this =
> aircraft are available but it was apparently finished in the standard =
> manner with all relevant stencils clearly marked."
>
> HTH
>
>
> Pedro
------------------------------
Date: Thu, 4 Jun 1998 11:46:15 -0700
From: Charles Hart
To: wwi
Subject: Re: DH-10
Message-ID:
>>Are there any kits of the DH 10 available?
>>
>>Tom
>
> There was a vacuform in 1/72 of a DH-10 from a company called "Morning
>Star"... I built this about 3 years ago and thought it was a pretty good
>kit..Fine scribing with nice detail, metal parts, fair decals.. How accurate
>it is I don't know, but I was happy with the over-all look.. Whether or not
>its still available, don't have a clue...Used the magazine you cited as my
>main reference...
>
>Peter Crow
Don't forget that there is also the venerable Aurora DH-10 kit from oh
so long ago. At least now there is a decent reference for this machine
with drawings in the form of a Datafile.
FWIW anyone have one of these vac DH-10s to sell or trade. I've never
seen one.
Charles
hartc@spot.colorado.edu
------------------------------
Date: Thu, 4 Jun 1998 10:50:13 -0700
From: Bob Pearson
To: WW1 Mailing list
Subject: Re: Joey Udet's Limos / welcome to new list member
Message-ID: <17501363103131@KAIEN.COM>
Me again,
According to Alex Imrie's Fokker Triplane book this was Udet's final Dr.I
593/17 in mid-June 1918. He also says that it had a large white chevron on
the tailplane and no additional acces panels on the forward fuselage
Bob
----------
> From: Bob Pearson
> To: WW1 Mailing list
> Subject: Re: Joey Udet's Limos / welcome to new list member
>
> Pedro,
>
> I have seen this Dr.I before and it has been mentioned that the crudely
> drawn 'Lo' was applied as a guide so the painter could see just exactly
Udet
> wanted it to look like. In a sililiar vein there are photos of a (34 Sqn
?)
> RE8 that also has a chalked '18' on it preparatory to its being filled
in.
>
> Regards,
> Bob Pearson
>
> ----------
> > From: Pedro e Francisca Soares
>
> > First of all a warm welcome to the new member who rides the same limo as
=
> > Joey.
> >
> > (I downloaded my mail from another puter at work, and I forgot to save =
> > the messages so please excuse me for not addressing you by your name)
> >
> > Now Joey,
> >
> > I don't know if this helps but the articles from Airfix magazine on the
=
> > DR1 that Graham so kindly provided us with mentions a limo flown by your
=
> > alter ego, that I couldn't find on your list.
> >
> > I quote:
> >
> > "Drawing 7 shows a marking applied to the DR1 which Lt. Ernst Udet flew
=
> > when appointed to Jasta 10, it being a monogram based on his =
> > fianc=E9es's name, Lola, and one which he carried in some form on all =
> > his aircraft. From available photographs it was, in this case, crudely =
> > applied as a line drawing and was probably done hastily in chalk, a =
> > practice used by both sides on occasion. No other details of this =
> > aircraft are available but it was apparently finished in the standard =
> > manner with all relevant stencils clearly marked."
> >
> > HTH
> >
> >
> > Pedro
>
------------------------------
Date: Thu, 4 Jun 1998 11:01:23 -0700
From: Bob Pearson
To: WW1 Mailing list
Subject: Re: Udet's mounts
Message-ID: <18012364503193@KAIEN.COM>
Greetings all,,
I originally just filed Joey's list of Udet's machines away for future
reference, but after the last message about Udet's Dr.Is, I took a look at
the list. In addition to 593/17 that I mentioned last time, one correction
is the serial of the ex-Kirchstein machine, it should be Dr.I 586/17 (w/n
2256)
Regards,
Bob Pearson
Apologies to Sandy, and I'll try to find something PC10 to mention next :-)
----------
> From: Joey Valenciano
> * Dr.I
> - (1516/17, Jasta 4, , red "LO" on fuselage, blk/wht diag stripes on top
> wing, fuselage & horiz tail, ex-Kirchstein machine).
------------------------------
Date: Fri, 05 Jun 1998 07:42:12 -0700
From: Aidrian Bridgeman-Sutton
To: wwi
Subject: Re: Profiles and other books
Message-ID: <357803C4.5A04@connectorsystems.co.nz>
Allan Wright wrote:
>
> Adrian - where are these for sale? You didn't say.....
>
I hate it when I do that.
http://www.kentnet.co.uk/fsfish/aviation.htm
Humble Apologies from your incompetent correspondent
/a
------------------------------
Date: Fri, 05 Jun 1998 07:50:15 -0700
From: Aidrian Bridgeman-Sutton
To: wwi
Subject: Re: Rivets?
Message-ID: <357805A7.6811@connectorsystems.co.nz>
> Ummmm - yet another way to do it. I don't have a drill press, but could
> get access to one. I like the idea of makig 2 holes for spacing......
Looks as if I'll be able to get access toa scanner this weekend-there's
an article from a railway mag by a fellow NZer on just this subject,
includingattipfor making hex-head bolts.
Drop me a line off list if you want copies - there's also something in
the filing system about making louvres from the same man, one Paul
Berntsen.
Paul is one of the top modellers in NZ- the articles deal with tools for
metalworking, but plastic should work in a similar manner.
Aidrian
------------------------------
Date: Thu, 4 Jun 1998 17:07:16 -0400
From: Geoff Smith
To: "INTERNET:wwi@pease1.sr.unh.edu"
Subject: Re: Miles off topic
Message-ID: <199806041707_MC2-3F3C-6AA5@compuserve.com>
Tom wrote,
>I would be happy if you found the article by Ian Huntley on ww1 roundel
>colours that somebody referred to last week.
So would I.
> That one must have come out
>after I stopped taking SAM regularly.
And after I did too, sorry.
> If so I'll consider your straying
f>rom the straight and narrow as a momentary lapse.
Oops.
Geoff
------------------------------
Date: Thu, 4 Jun 1998 17:07:21 -0400
From: Geoff Smith
To: "INTERNET:wwi@pease1.sr.unh.edu"
Subject: Re: Woodman scans (only for people who have requested scans)
Message-ID: <199806041708_MC2-3F3C-6AA8@compuserve.com>
>I don't know
>whose. If anybody has asked for scans and not received any, call me back=
,
>and I'll recheck your addresses.
Guess who. (Probably my punishment)
------------------------------
Date: Thu, 4 Jun 1998 17:09:16 EDT
From: MACFARB@aol.com
To: wwi
Subject: VCR Alert!1 - WWI Films -U.S .only
Message-ID:
Starting tonight ,around midnight EST ,American Movie Classics (AMC) will
show war films all weekends. They will show them in chronological order
,starting with silent films dealing with WW1. First : "The Little American "
(1917),"The Lost Battalion" (1919) "What Price Glory "(the original film
directed by Raoul Walsh from 1926) ,"Wings" (the first Oscar -Best Picture
of 1927) ,"Barbed Wire"w/ Pola Negri (1927), "Hell's Angels"(1930) "The Road
To Glory" w/Frederic March(1936) and three showings of the RESTORED "All Quiet
On the Western Front" (1929).Most of these films except "All Quiet.... " are
rarely shown on US TV ,especially the silents.
------------------------------
Date: Fri, 5 Jun 1998 07:33:48 +1000
From: Shane Weier
To: wwi
Subject: RE: Miles off topic
Message-ID: <199806042200.IAA13552@mimmon.mim.com.au>
Maybe not the right one....
>I would be happy if you found the article by Ian Huntley on ww1 roundel
>colours that somebody referred to last week. That one must have come
out
>after I stopped taking SAM regularly. If so I'll consider your straying
>from the straight and narrow as a momentary lapse.
... but my database says Oct 84, Ian Huntley column, RAF Roundel colours
and proportions.
If *I* can find it, and if it's the right one....
Shane
------------------------------
Date: Fri, 5 Jun 1998 07:37:40 +1000
From: Shane Weier
To: wwi
Subject: RE: DH-10
Message-ID: <199806042200.IAA13553@mimmon.mim.com.au>
Hi,
> There was a vacuform in 1/72 of a DH-10 from a company called
"Morning
>Star"... I built this about 3 years ago and thought it was a pretty
good
>kit..Fine scribing with nice detail, metal parts, fair decals.. How
accurate
>it is I don't know, but I was happy with the over-all look.. Whether or
not
>its still available, don't have a clue...Used the magazine you cited as
my
>main reference...
I think the company was "Eastern Star"
Reviews in SAM, SMI at the time were all positive. I think the kit is
also mentioned in the datafile listing
Shane
------------------------------
Date: Thu, 4 Jun 1998 17:47:57 -0400
From: Geoff Smith
To: "INTERNET:wwi@pease1.sr.unh.edu"
Subject: Re: Rivets?
Message-ID: <199806041748_MC2-3F38-2D62@compuserve.com>
Aidrian conveniently wrote:
>Looks as if I'll be able to get access toa scanner this weekend-there's
>an article from a railway mag by a fellow NZer on just this subject,
>includingattipfor making hex-head bolts.
>Drop me a line off list if you want copies - there's also something in
>the filing system about making louvres from the same man, one Paul
>Berntsen. =
>Paul is one of the top modellers in NZ- the articles deal with tools for=
>metalworking, but plastic should work in a similar manner.
Aidrian,
I've just spent a couple of hours going through MRJ for the article on
louvres for Ernest, without finding it. Any chance you could let E have a=
copy of that? There's also one about electro-plating the rivets on but of=
course the part has to be metal.
I agree with your assessment of Paul but would add that railway modellers=
don't come much better anywhere.
Regards,
Geoff
------------------------------
Date: Thu, 4 Jun 1998 15:56:43 -0700
From: "Peter Crow" <888444222@email.msn.com>
To:
Subject: Re: DH-10
Message-ID: <001001bd900c$0d255680$6416fed0@default>
>I think the company was "Eastern Star"
>
>Reviews in SAM, SMI at the time were all positive. I think the kit is
>also mentioned in the datafile listing
>
>Shane
>
Yes thats what happens as you get older, dazed & confused... Your right
Shane.. must have been thinking of some Custer movie...
Peter
------------------------------
Date: Thu, 4 Jun 1998 19:26:15 -0400 (EDT)
From: Matthew Zivich
To: Multiple recipients of list
Subject: Re: SVA, (was Re: Whippet)
Message-ID:
FWIW: there is a tool called a pounce wheel available that is a small
spiked wheel attached to a handle. The spiked wheels come in different
sizes for differences in spacing between the spikes,
and are used for transferring designs, enlarging, etc. Consult your local
art supply dealer.
Matt Z.
On Thu, 4 Jun 1998, Ernest Thomas wrote:
> David Laws wrote:
> >
> > OR
> >
> > rivits can be done by using a suitably spaced old watch cog set in a
> > small handle like a pizza cutter- Lay out your rivit patterns on 5 thou
> > card and skin the model with the marked sheet ( a'la Harry Woodman )
> >
> > DAVID
>
> Glad you mentioned that. I've been toying with the idea of marking off
> the staples/nails on the SVA fuselage skin and thought that might be the
> best approach. Any comments from one who has done this? Could one of the
> guys with a scaleing ruler give me some rough idea of what the spacing
> shoud be in 1/48(ish). And should I sharpen the teeth on the cog?
>
> E.
>
------------------------------
Date: Thu, 4 Jun 1998 19:33:31 -0400 (EDT)
From: Matthew Zivich
To: Multiple recipients of list
Subject: Re: VCR Alert!1 - WWI Films -U.S .only
Message-ID:
Speaking of WWI films has anyone in the States had a chance to see the
recent, highly acclaimed French film, "Capitaine Conan"? It's supposed to
be about a group of French shock troops behind enemy lines. I'm still
waiting for it to come this way. Matt Z.
On Thu, 4 Jun 1998 MACFARB@aol.com wrote:
> Starting tonight ,around midnight EST ,American Movie Classics (AMC) will
> show war films all weekends. They will show them in chronological order
> ,starting with silent films dealing with WW1. First : "The Little American "
> (1917),"The Lost Battalion" (1919) "What Price Glory "(the original film
> directed by Raoul Walsh from 1926) ,"Wings" (the first Oscar -Best Picture
> of 1927) ,"Barbed Wire"w/ Pola Negri (1927), "Hell's Angels"(1930) "The Road
> To Glory" w/Frederic March(1936) and three showings of the RESTORED "All Quiet
> On the Western Front" (1929).Most of these films except "All Quiet.... " are
> rarely shown on US TV ,especially the silents.
>
------------------------------
Date: Thu, 4 Jun 1998 19:42:12 EDT
From: KarrArt@aol.com
To: wwi
Subject: pounce wheels wasRe: SVA, (was Re: Whippet)
Message-ID: <95a884fd.357730d5@aol.com>
In a message dated 98-06-04 19:27:12 EDT, you write:
<< FWIW: there is a tool called a pounce wheel available that is a small
spiked wheel attached to a handle. The spiked wheels come in different
sizes for differences in spacing between the spikes,
and are used for transferring designs, enlarging, etc. Consult your local
art supply dealer. >>
I bought a set of pounce wheels several years ago from, I believe, the Micro
Mark catalog. To my dismay, the little pointy sharp things were rectangular in
section- they made tiny rectangularly shaped embossings rather than round.
I've been too lazy to try and file them to a round shape.( that's a lot of
minuscule spiky doo-dads)
Robert K.
------------------------------
Date: Thu, 4 Jun 1998 17:54:47 -0700
From: Charles Hart
To: wwi
Subject: WWI Films
Message-ID:
>Speaking of WWI films has anyone in the States had a chance to see the
>recent, highly acclaimed French film, "Capitaine Conan"? It's supposed to
>be about a group of French shock troops behind enemy lines. I'm still
>waiting for it to come this way. Matt Z.
>
Sadly, I missed a chance to see this a couple of months back. It is
about a group of French soldiers fighting in the Balkans in 1919. We all
know the guns weren't completely silent after 11/11/18. You might need to
check your local, independently owned video store, one that specializes in
a large inventory of films and more obscure titles.
Charles
hartc@spot.colorado.edu
------------------------------
Date: Thu, 4 Jun 1998 19:54:34 EDT
From: BStett3770@aol.com
To: wwi
Subject: Re: DH-10
Message-ID:
Hi Gang
1/72 DH-10 kit was a Vacform by Eastern Star - They are out of porduction.
Masters were by the late Joe Chuppic.
Keep Modeling
Barry
Rosemont Hobby
www.swiftsite.com/rosemonthobby
------------------------------
Date: Thu, 4 Jun 1998 18:05:40 -0700
From: Charles Hart
To: wwi
Subject: Re: DH-10
Message-ID:
>Hi Gang
>
>1/72 DH-10 kit was a Vacform by Eastern Star - They are out of porduction.
>Masters were by the late Joe Chuppic.
>
>Keep Modeling
>Barry
>Rosemont Hobby
>www.swiftsite.com/rosemonthobby
When did Joe Chuppic (Chubbock ??) pass away ? All WW I modelers who
remember the dry years of WW I modeling during the late '70s and 80s owe
him a substantial debt of gratitude. He did many of the Formaplane vac
masters.
Charles
hartc@spot.colorado.edu
------------------------------
Date: Thu, 4 Jun 1998 19:51:42 -0500
From: "Charles Duckworth"
To:
Subject: Re: Whippet (was RE: Rivets?)
Message-ID: <199806050049.TAA24492@mail.primary.net>
> Horrible kit? As I plan on getting it, how is it horrible. Anyone else
have
> any comments on the Emhar Whippet?
Bob, I built one and used Model Cellar track links plus adding storage
boxes along the back of the personnel compartment. Added White/red/white
ID stripes, weathered with airbrush and inks and it came out a nice model
obviously IMO.
Charlie
------------------------------
Date: Fri, 5 Jun 1998 11:14:13 +1000
From: Shane Weier
To: wwi
Subject: RE: DH-10
Message-ID: <199806050130.LAA17083@mimmon.mim.com.au>
Hi all,
>>1/72 DH-10 kit was a Vacform by Eastern Star - They are out of
porduction.
>>Masters were by the late Joe Chuppic.
> When did Joe Chuppic (Chubbock ??) pass away ? All WW I modelers
who
>remember the dry years of WW I modeling during the late '70s and 80s
owe
>him a substantial debt of gratitude. He did many of the Formaplane vac
>masters.
Unless I've completely lost it, Jock also did some/all of the excellent
Libramodels vacs (espec the DH-5)
Shane
------------------------------
Date: Fri, 05 Jun 1998 02:04:20 GMT
From: "Leonard Endy"
To: wwi
Subject: Re: Whippet (was RE: Rivets?)
Message-ID: <357751c9.7429500@legend.firstsaga.com>
On Thu, 4 Jun 1998 20:52:21 -0400, you wrote:
>Bob, I built one and used Model Cellar track links plus adding storage
>boxes along the back of the personnel compartment. Added White/red/white
>ID stripes, weathered with airbrush and inks and it came out a nice model
>obviously IMO.
Charlie, how were the Model Cellar links to work with ? I recently
picked up this kit and was considering replacing the molded tracks
supplie with the kit.
Len
------------------------------
Date: Fri, 5 Jun 1998 00:55:19 EDT
From: REwing@aol.com
To: wwi
Subject: Re: Work in progress
Message-ID:
In a message dated 6/3/98 11:22:56 PM Pacific Daylight Time,
joeyval@philonline.com writes:
<< I'm onto the Sierra Walfisch again. I'm dryfitting the major parts right
now. Does anyone have this kit? I could post a few tips.>>
I would like some tips.
<< ...I'm fiddling with the Sierra AEG G.IV. If anyone has this one, I could
post some tips about it too. I also discovered a way to make fuselage joins
really strong.>>
I could use some tips here also. You could post off-list if no one else is
interested. ;^}
I may get to both of these some day...
TIA
-Rick-
------------------------------
Date: Fri, 5 Jun 1998 01:02:50 EDT
From: REwing@aol.com
To: wwi
Subject: Re: PC-10 lovers, watch.
Message-ID: <55110d07.35777bfc@aol.com>
In a message dated 6/4/98 8:39:07 AM Pacific Daylight Time,
tomwerner.hansen@of.telia.no writes:
<< If anybody's interested I'll run it through the scanner and send you the
text.
I would like some scans, please.
<>
I have the old Aurora kit, that I picked up at a show for $10 USD.
------------------------------
Date: Fri, 5 Jun 1998 15:22:38 +1000
From: Shane Weier
To: "'wwi'"
Subject: Tapes
Message-ID: <199806050538.PAA20215@mimmon.mim.com.au>
Oh band of Brothers (and sisters, if there are any lurking)
Please forgive me this stirring up of an old subject, but we have many a
new member and some may have useful insights and others may learn
something.
And *I* need to learn something.
I know why they put tapes on the wing ribs, and I've looked at vast
numbers of photos to decide if, and where tapes were used on ailerons.
But the last project I had which needed tapes had a painted tail, and
the current one doesn't, so I ask:
Were tapes used over the tailplane, elevators, fin and rudder (or any
part or combination) of the Halberstadt Cl.II ?
I don't have the datafile for this machine, and would appreciate any
enlightenment I can get from the list (BTW, the evr helpful Ken Hagerup
has filled me in on *wing rib* tapes).
I'd also like to throw open the opportunity for anyone to expound their
own idea of a "Unifying Theory of Rib Tapes" if he feels so brave !!
Was it common or uncommon practice in general, for some types or
manufacturers? Does it vary by country? By period? Or are we stuck with
"Check your references"? (And if you have none, ask the list :-)
Regards
Shane
------------------------------
Date: Fri, 05 Jun 1998 11:26:03 +0800
From: Joey Valenciano
To: wwi
Subject: Re: Udet's mounts
Message-ID: <3.0.1.32.19980605112603.006a0494@philonline.com.ph>
>one correction
>is the serial of the ex-Kirchstein machine, it should be Dr.I 586/17 (w/n
>2256)
The list has now been corrected. Thanks Bob.
*********************************************************************
Joey Valenciano WW1 modeller, teacher, jazz musician,
joeyval@philonline.com. sitarist
Metro-Manila, Philippines
"The more you know, the more you don't know."
*********************************************************************
------------------------------
Date: Fri, 05 Jun 1998 11:31:05 +0800
From: Joey Valenciano
To: wwi
Subject: Re: Joey Udet's Limos / welcome to new list member
Message-ID: <3.0.1.32.19980605113105.006a0494@philonline.com.ph>
>According to Alex Imrie's Fokker Triplane book this was Udet's final Dr.I
>593/17 in mid-June 1918. He also says that it had a large white chevron on
>the tailplane and no additional acces panels on the forward fuselage
Any photos of this a/c besides photo #14 in the Flying Circus Special? What
colour was the "LO!"?
*********************************************************************
Joey Valenciano WW1 modeller, teacher, jazz musician,
joeyval@philonline.com. sitarist
Metro-Manila, Philippines
"The more you know, the more you don't know."
*********************************************************************
------------------------------
Date: Fri, 05 Jun 1998 14:23:38 +0800
From: Joey Valenciano
To: wwi
Subject: Re: AEG G.4 details
Message-ID: <3.0.1.32.19980605142338.006a0494@philonline.com.ph>
Hi all,
Can anyone help out a bit more here?
>I mentioned to another list member just recently that Alex
>Imrie's "Pictorial History of the German Air Service 1914-1918" has a
>cracking shot down into the front office of an AEG G-type.
>
>There is a band like a cummerbund (don't know what you call this westwards
>- its the tummy band on a dinner jacket (tuxedo) that covers the braces
>(suspenders?) buttons!).
>This runs around the inside of the curved nose of the beast with about a
>dozen bombs all stacked in behind it pointing up.
At the moment, what I have are:
AEG G.IV DATAFILE:
photo#11 - taken from the rear peeking into rear gunner's position. Can see
a front wall, no evidence of a tunnel, it may be lower than what can be seen.
photo#20 - about the same position and quality as photo#11.
photo#31 - upended plane showing belly. Shows trapdoor opening, you can
take a peak at the opening to the rear gunner's position. The AEG G.IV,
then had a gun tunnel similar to the Gotha (although much smaller). Also
bomb rack openings are shown.
photo#34 - similar position to #31. You can see how the cellon covered
trapdoor opens, also bomb rack openings are shown.
photo#45 - similar to #11, still can't see tunnel to cockpit.
photo#59 - taken from rear gunner's position, looking down the tunnel into
the cockpit, and onto the forward gun position. Strange flooring
arrangement. Is that the backrest of a collapsible seat there?
photo#62 - taken from the front, peeking into front gunner's position and
cockpit. Too dark to see details in front gunner's position but it
definitely has a gun ring. Cockpit, you can see top of the entrance of the
tunnel to the rear gunner. Top of well upholstered pilot's seat can be seen
as well.
photo#63 - similar to #63 few details can be dark behind the gun ring.
There is a gun ring.
photo#74&75 - left side of cockpit. Pilot's seat and control wheel clearly
shown. Did the AEG have dual controls? The right side looks like it has a
control stick but no wheel.
photo#83 - taken from the rear/above. Front wall of rear MG position can be
seen. It seems to be open on it's lower half and almost along the entire
width, very different opening shape compared to corresponding opening to
cockpit seen in photo#62.
Top forward fuselage view in Ian Stair's drawings show the rear gunner to
have his seat on the rear right (partially blocking acess to the tunnel) no
evidence of bomb racks on either side of fuselage wall, the cockpit having
a pilot's seat (no collapsible seat on right?), front gunner's seat is
centrally mounted (tunnel to cockpit would be difficult to access? The
underside drawing shows position of MG trapdoor (logically positioned
behind rear gunner's position), and bomb racks on either side of rear MG
position.
HARLEYFORD "RECON/BOMBERS" BOOK:
page186 - lowest shot shows trapdoor from rear gunners postion, w/ gun
mounted on floor to shoot through trapdoor. Upper gun mount seems to be
attached to a tube that runs sideways. Partial view of side bomb racks (how
were the bombs held in place?
page188 - shows gun mount and rear fuselage decking as seen from rear
gunner's position. This time, the mount is attached to a rail that runs
along the rear and sides of the position.
AVIATION AWARDS OF IMPERIAL GERMANY IN WWI, VOL.IV:
page35 - front gunners position as viewed from above right. No gun ring but
a rail as in Harleyford page188. Fuselage opening is somewhat parabolic in
shape. Round foldup stool clearly visible and mounted to the left (clearing
entry through the tunnel, if it is there), 7 12.5 kg bombs pointing
downwards along the left wall and 2 visible on front wall, caption says
that 18 could be carried in the front cockpit, bombs are totally in view
and not boxed in like in Harleyford page186, there seems to be a low small
framework that keeps the bombs upright. Did this plane have bomb opening
cut into the floor or did the front gunner drop them over the side? I see
many photos of planes with a round opening under the nose. Is this possible
and opening through which the bombs could be dropped? Or, could the bombs
have been slid forward along the "rack" and dropping as they got to the
front central hole?
Comments anyone?
I may have to start stealing ideas from the Gotha Datafile Special. :-(
*********************************************************************
Joey Valenciano WW1 modeller, teacher, jazz musician,
joeyval@philonline.com. sitarist
Metro-Manila, Philippines
"The more you know, the more you don't know."
*********************************************************************
------------------------------
End of WWI Digest 1053
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