30886, RE: then why not just take 'Black' out the equation?Posted by Cre8, Wed May-11-05 06:59 PM

>>Considering the undertable rules set against blacks (i.e.>>higher bank loan interest rates, low education funding &>>failure set-ups) it honestly does not make sense to have>open>>discussions with those that set the rules. If anything we>need>>to have close knit discussions with those that played by the>>rules and still won.>>Openly discussing and attacking the blatantly racist rules of>the past is what got them dismantled. What persists are>continuing personal and group prejudices that aren't expressly>codified but are passed subtly amongst the ruling group in>discussions amongst themselves. Inserting the truth into their>discussions is more effective than repeating the truth amongst>ourselves. >>For instance: We can internally discuss how to solidify you>financial life to the point that you deserve the best interest>rates on a loan. If the loan officer still thinks you don't>deserve the best rate, only bc of prejudices passed around his>group, all of our coaching is useless.

And see this is what I'm tryna get at. If the loan officer tells me no and tells my white neighbor yes, I'll be ready to holla racism, HOWEVER if the same loan officer that told me no tells my black neighbor yes, I'll be more open to finding out why I didn't get the loan and asking my black neighbor how did they go about getting theirs. Granted that sounds bogus, but I'm able to rule out a lot of bs when discussing issue that may be race related...talking to a white person about how they got their loan will only help so much and if after applying the same effort I don't get positive results, I can validate my race cry, but why, just to prove the establishment is racist? I don't have time for that shit, so it would suit me best to push that aside and ask someone who perhaps got over that hurdle in advance so I can do the same. Therefore if my effort is shot I know its me and therefore will work on me...not trying to get some civilrights law suit going. Funny thing is that back in the day, Blacks could only turn to blacks for constructive info and we owned more then than we do now. Why is that?>>> Thats not to say we can't hold healthy>>conversations on the basics of the game with others, but to>>openly discuss how we plan to make 'it' work for US (BLACK>>FOLKS) is social suicide. >>I believe there's a standard formula for success here .. i.e.>the people that are successful here (financially, socially,>etc) tend to do the same things, even wen they come from>different cultures. Maybe there's a black spin on it, but I>have a feeling it'll mostly be the same as what everyone else>has done. >The Black Spin is what I'm aiming for, because I've already come to the realization that my skin color will be a factor at some point, why would I ignore it?

>Now, much of our community would consider that "selling out".>But truth be told, the other groups that come here (and many>of us look to as examples for maintaining their heritage AND>succeeding) are the biggest "sellouts" in this nation. Think>about it... >>+They left their "hood" for our deluxe country on the>west-side (of the earth). >+Sure, they keep some of their old traditions but they>invariably change their bahavior to fit in better. >+They kick some money home but nothing really improves at home>(that's why they stay here). >+And though some people are proud of their accomplishments,>many are jealous that they're still stuck in the hood they>grew up in. >What exactly would we consider "selling out"?

>If the hood does improve, thouggh, it's invariably through the>hard work of those that were still at home uplifting>themselves. Eventually that starts to attract their countrymen>back (see Ethiopia, India, Korea) bc they now feel their>country is moving in the same direction they are.>>Examples are out there, yet we're supposed to sit with>blinders on and re-invent the wheel.>No bodies talking about re-inventing the wheel, but about seeing and understanding whats out there and NOT being afraid to discuss that info and most of all the info from your own community amongst those that make up your community. Theres no need to go searching for information outside your community when their are folks right next door setting positive examples. That's like driven to some white burbs for a pair of shoes when the Black owned store around the corner has the same shoe for a lessor price.

>>Sad to say but we are the bottom barrel, even if those on>top>>were to give positive insight, they are NOT going to risk>>loosing their top spot to help our black asses along. If>>anything, you should question what the person offering>insight>>stands to loose/gain and what has inspired them to>contribute>>in the first place.>>Despite the fact many people feel it is, this does not have to>be a zero sum game. I mean, there are some teams or companies>where it's everybody for themselves but that's not how the>whole or even most of the corporate world acts. >U can't be serious. There's not a company I know who's top execs are willing to give fair play to ground workers. A good example is the United Airlines issue. They'd rather pay pilots minimum wage w/ only dental benefits if they can continue living it up while supplying passengers with video game equipment on flights...hell them bastards aren't even willing to better the safety of planes for fear of cost and loosing their plush lifestyles. Ha, and you think the US could give more of a damn?

>To extend the analogy, everyone doesn't look at our upliftment>as their downfall. I will admit there are those that do but>they are slowly fading away.>It aint fading fast enough. Drugs are still a heavy issue in the Black community, not to mention other things. It continues to exist in our communities for the sole purpose of control and its just as vivid today as it was in the 80's. We've just learned to adapt.

>>Also I have yet to hear any white person offer significant>>insight on bettering the black community that did not better>>them more, and most times that 'good' insight only left us>>leaning on them for more.>>Do correct me if I'm wrong.>>I can't account for your experiences. The only white people I>know that comment on the black community to me are those that>are already deep in the black community... and they're usually>saying the same things other black people are saying.

Well who are these white folks, do they have the power to ignitiate action and have they or are they just throwing out more opinions?What do you consider 'deep in the black community'? Are you saying they were born and raised in Black communities, intermarried? and just how black is the community if there's a multiple number of whites within it? Would that be considered a mixed or multicultural community?

We could be talking about solutions for our communities...but instead we're discussing rather or not to include somebody else in a discussion we have yet to even parttake in...sad.

Answer back if you like, I'll read but this tail chancing needs to end.