The Chase LoungeA discussion forum dedicated to the HBO series The Sopranos and creator David Chase2019-05-31T22:36:50-05:00https://thechaselounge.net/app.php/feed2019-05-31T22:36:50-05:002019-05-31T22:36:50-05:00https://thechaselounge.net/viewtopic.php?t=3027&p=29318#p29318First, the idea that Tony would resort to murder over his debt to Hesh is explicitly raised throughout the episode. 1. Tony mentions to Hesh that all his key guys are "murderers." (11:22 in DVD) 2. Hesh suggests to Eli that Tony might kill him rather than pay the debt (Scene at 20:50). 3. Hesh is concerned about Renata's safety as well (Scene at 30:47). 4. Tony is concerned only with how it will "look" if he doesn't pay Hesh---morality is not factoring into his decision (32:29).

Now the less obvious clues:

1. We see horses and horse heads throughout Hesh's house. These seem to reference the horse-head scene in Godfather 1. In Godfather 1, the Corleones had someone cut the head off Woltz's horse, sneak into his house, and put it in his bed. This scene established the horse head as a symbol of the mafia's callousness and sinister tactics.

There are parallels between Woltz and Hesh: both are Jewish, rich through entertainment, and love horses. We see several horse statues/pictures in Hesh's house. But more importantly, there is a specific emphasis on horse heads in Hesh's house. There is a small one on the table between Hesh and Tony when they sit down at 10:37, and another is to Tony's left in the foreground. In the same scene, when we see close-ups of Hesh, a horse statue is behind him, with the horse's head protruding out behind Hesh's. Later, we see a horse head statue over Hesh's right shoulder when he's reading, before Tony and Bobby come to his door (30:47). In the final scene, when Tony drops off the money, there is: (1) a horse head statue in the foreground, (2) a horse statue to Hesh's right, where the head is emphasized by the reflecting light; and (3) when we get a close up of Hesh, we can see the head of a horse statue protruding from behind his right shoulder.

The Godfather reference suggests that Tony may have had someone sneak into Hesh's house to kill him. There is circumstantial evidence to support this. 1. Tony knows the house well enough to give instructions; we've seen him there multiple times throughout the show. 2. We see Hesh sleeps with a glass of water next to his bed (13:17). This could be used to poison him. 3. The unexplained meeting with Carlo (41:49), immediately after Tony loses $100k on the Eagles/Dolphins game. What were they discussing? 4. Tony just lost again on the Mavericks/Spurs game---he must be down BIG at this point---in the scene immediately preceding the one where Hesh finds Renata dead. 5. As Tony leaves Hesh's house at the end of the episode, the door doesn't shut properly, suggesting that it's not secure and that the house is easy to break into.

2. There are allusions in "Chasing It" to the Season 1 Episode "Nobody Knows Anything" (NKA). This is important because in NKA, Sil and Tony joke that they would kill someone rather than pay off a $30k gambling debt (but are they joking?). The allusions to NKA in Chasing It: 1. In Chasing It, Carm tells Tony he goes about life as though there isn't a piano hanging over his head. In NKA, at the Soprano's house party, we learn that the Sopranos are moving their piano because AJ doesn't use it, and Tony has to move it; in the next scene, we see Tony tell Melfi that he feels as though there is a safe hanging over his head---a sense of "pending doom". 2. In Chasing It, we see Tony get physical with Carm, and she ends up throwing a vase at him; in NKA, Makazian tells Tony at the brothel that when he was a kid, his dad would hit his mom and his mom would inevitably throw the closest thing she could find at him. 3. In Chasing It, we see Tony leave Carlo outside the pork store after an unexplained meeting---this scene is shot from across the street; in NKA, we see Paulie watching Pussy leave Tony, Chris, and Sil outside the pork store after an unexplained meeting---this scene is also shot from across the street. (Also, when Paulie pulls up to Pussy, he blows his horn, which plays the Godfather theme (see discussion of the Godfather above)).

In sum, there is a good deal of evidence suggesting that Tony had a hand in Renata's death. Now some people would say: Why would Tony kill Renata AND pay Hesh? It could be that Tony attempted to kill Hesh, but accidentally killed Renata. Specifically, Tony could have sent someone to Hesh's house to poison him, but that Renata was poisoned instead---it's not far fetched that she would drink from the cup next to her and Hesh's bed. (Later in the same season, we see another botched murder attempt: Tony's crew ends up killing the innocent Ukrainians instead of Phil.)

I don't claim that Tony DEFINITELY killed Renata. I think the writers wanted this to be ambiguous. In NKA (a fitting title), we wonder: Is Pussy a rat? We don't know (at least not then). In Chasing It, we wonder: Was Renata's death random or planned? We don't know. Further, this latter question parallels another question that is raised in "Chasing It" in combination with "Kennedy and Heidi": Is Tony's gambling luck random or planned? (Logically speaking, it's of course random, but while Tony is tripping on peyote, he "sees" that it is planned by "something else").

Chasing It, and its ambiguous ending, is typical of David Chase. So much so that I suspect that the title of the episode, Chasing It, is actually a reference to Chase himself.

The Sopranos made a lot of references to the John F. Kennedy assassination. This is because JFK was a good guy who was assassinated by The Illuminati/The Cabal/The DeepState. The Bushes, the Clintons, and the Obamas, are all part of the evil Illuminati/Cabal group. In season 6 of The Sopranos there were a lot of references to George W. Bush allowing terrorists to escape. This is true. The Bushes, the Clintons, and the Obamas are very evil people. They have funded terrorism world-wide.

Donald J. Trump is a good guy, and who the illuminati has tried to assassinate, but he is being protected. The mainstream media is FAKE NEWS. THE MAINSTREAM MEDIA is controlled by the Illuminati. Most of them are filthy liars.

Donald J. Trump, working with Qanon, and with good people everywhere, is literally saving our world.

(I also don't believe that David Chase mentions Donald Trump in the most significant, final episode of The Sopranos, "Made in America" as just purely a coincidence).

I believe that our World has been saved from The Cabal/ Illuminati/ DeepState by many Heroes and Saints, and we will have a Beautiful, Brave New World after all of these evil people are arrested, and hence (I believe) David Chase's new Sopranos Film Title is symbolic to this fact:

Michael Gandolfini playing a young Tony Soprano is a big test for him.How is it going to work if Tony was born in 1959, and the Newark riots were in 1967? Michael Gandolfini is about 19 years old. Presumably he will be playing an older teenager after the riots ?

I'm guessing they will do more than one film or maybe it will be like a mini series.

]]>2019-01-24T06:23:09-05:002019-01-24T06:23:09-05:00https://thechaselounge.net/viewtopic.php?t=3002&p=29310#p29310How is it going to work if Tony was born in 1959, and the Newark riots were in 1967? Michael Gandolfini is about 19 years old. Presumably he will be playing an older teenager after the riots ?

Hi, Thanks for the reply.Yes that's the one. I posted link above as well. A good watch, great to see. And can I compliment you on this wonderful forum you've created. I'm a huge fan and have watched the Box sets more than I can remember. I've travelled from Europe to do the tour in NJ too which was so amazing.

]]>2019-01-09T01:50:12-05:002019-01-09T01:50:12-05:00https://thechaselounge.net/viewtopic.php?t=3023&p=29304#p29304I'm not sure I'd have thought of the anniversary without media reminders since I didn't personally start watching the show until they did a marathon review of the first two seasons on HBO in late December of 2000. Life changed after that very swiftly.

Not sure if the site will see much activity or not, but I I'd love it if a few old timers breeze back in to say hi. Just seeing your name on a post here made my day.:-)

And thanks for the link to the Rolling Stone article. I dunno. All this nostalgia may inspire me to watch the show again. I haven't seen an episode since 2009. Jeez. Ten years!