Xbox One Dev: 'We Have Just As Many Pre-order Numbers As PS4', Details Snapping Feature

"Remember how Sony boasted about having excellent pre-order numbers for the PlayStation 4, boasting roughly 1 million pre-orders before launch? Till now, we haven't learnt too much about how the pre-order numbers for the Xbox One are looking like."
(Xbox One)

I don't understand why people Disagree with you about anything and vote bubble down only because you say that you like the Xbox One. If those guys are watching this comment,Then I must tell you one thing:You are just immature.

Seriously? I know you aren't defending Sony and their proprietary accessories? I can't even charge my damn PSPGO because I misplaced the charger. Then on top of that, UMD? Memory sticks? Memory stick duos? Man the list goes on....stop acting as if Sony is some religion that you worship and they don't practice consumer greed tactics. How else do you think they will get their company back into the positive. Meanwhile Microsofts financial numbers are in the GREEN. You fanboys are hilarious..

The Xbox developer could be right. People have access to the available statistics, from several retailers. However, everyone seems to forget that Microsoft has its own retail stores. Combine the pre-order numbers from MS retail stores with other retailers and the numbers could truly match the PS4 pre-order numbers.

@stuna: What do you mean by "What has that got to do with anything?" No one knows how much pre-orders goes through Microsoft's retail stores. And if we don't know, how can we come up with an accurate number of the overall Xbox One pre-orders?

Yes, Sony has its own online store, but what's your point?

This website is lacking intelligence on the part of several users such as yourself.

Instead of trying to act like you told me something I as well as others don't know try re-reading my comment the way it's written! Everyone knows Microsoft have their own stores, just like everyone knows that Sony has their own stores/online stores! So my questions still remains how is this solely benefiting Microsoft!?

@stuna: Is there something wrong with your thinking process? This is not about the benefits of the stores. Sony has its store, that's true. However, Sony announced its pre-order numbers, Microsoft did not. So at this point folks can only go by the numbers they have for retail outlets such as Amazon etc, but they will not have close to the full numbers unless they know how much pre-orders went through Microsoft's retail stores.

The above is all I'm trying to say, why are you making it so difficult to understand?

To be fair to the developer's comment, he did just say that MS has at least "over 1 million" units. He never really said that they were neck and neck with Sony or that he was privy to Sony's pre-order sales.

A lot of people don't realize that developers actually do have access to those numbers if they are high enough up in the food chain. Publishers certainly know how many consoles are expected to sell by now. It's how they make decisions on which systems to support. If this guy is a MS studio developer, it's unlikely he would know, but it isn't unheard of for developers to talk to one another, and sometimes information gets around. I've been in developer forums, and they talk about stuff sometimes.

"As per this reply, the dev stated, “When I saw reports of Sony having a million or 1.5 million pre-orders for the PS4, I didn’t even think twice about it. We’re not disclosing pre-order numbers at the moment for accounting reasons but I know for a fact we have just as many. Don’t be bogged by published statistics. At the end of all this, what matters is the games you want to play."

This anonymous developer is absolutely right that games are what matters, not sales. Having said that, Microsoft spent the last generation making a big deal out of their sales numbers, so I'm pretty skeptical that they're keeping them confidential this time for "accounting reasons." Yeah, right.

What the heck kind of logic is that? MS is being bashed left and right in the media and in game forms every day. They have been on nothing but the defensive since the XB1 announcement. Don't tell me that if XB1 had "just as many" pre-orders as PS4 that MS would be shouting it from the rooftops... They don't need to give exact numbers (Sony hasn't), but if they were even close, there would be some announcement from Major Nelson or some other MS PR team member.

@n4rc, even well estabilished things may fall. Just in September, the PS3 outsold the 360 in the US in years! One could say, this means nothing, but haven't you noticed that MS' PR machine has been working overtime since?

So right you are, Notice how MS orignilly talked meta scores and sales to the end user, no more meta scores and the recent figured had them claiming shipped.

The " I know for a fact" thing is making me cringe because I hate it when people say "fact" like it makes the argument true no matter how much opinion is used. It is not a fact, it is his opinion with the knowledge he has, which wouldn't include Sony's preorder numbers. The only thing that is known is that as of gamescom ps4 preorders were over 1 million, Microsoft did not give them out. Ms thumped its chest through the first4 years of the current gen, we know them better to believe they would hold back.

Great news for Microsoft if the pre order numbers are true, but the consensus is people saying other wise through word of mouth or online survey in favor of the PS4. So I can't see how they can be even steven unless the consumers are lying.

What I have seen though are people on various sites cancelling their PS4 preorders and going to Xbox One as to them Xbox One has the launch games.

I'm getting both so I don't really care but it is an interesting thing going on. There are people out there that are waiting on the PS4 to get more games before they buy. That will come, but to them, it's a preorder cancel for launch day.

I believe random internet polls are meaningless as well. Strange, I don't often agree with you.

HOWEVER, when every internet poll tends to come back with the same result it does start to lend credence to what the results are. When additional reports surface about the ratio's between the console pre-orders that back up the results of those polls, it does give those polls more credence. When forums and social media outlets are generally in favor in the same ratios as those polls, it does lend weight to what those polls are saying.

Also, it's a fallacy that every internet poll is set up to allow unlimited voting. Quite a few use IP to limit the number of times you can vote. I know there are crazy people out there, but why would anyone, particularly a 12 year old, sit there masking their IP to vote enough times to change the weight of those polls so drastically?

Lets look at the facts - PS4 is much higher at all online sellers on their most sold list then the xbox one. - many retailers have come out stating that the ps4 sales are significantly higher then xbox one

Roughly half jumped shipped over the lifetime of the console, and there was nothing tying them to the same console brand previously, unless you think BC is important.

This generation, people value their account and friends. The connected gamer is what gave MS a huge edge, and I expect that same player base doesn't have an issue with the DRM and only care about playing online.

So no, each new generation is no longer a clean state when you are invested!

In addition, online is where MS has their cloud for dedicated servers and gamers will know this as evident by even first party games for Sony going P2P.

Yes, every generation is a clean slate. The beginning of this one is proof of that. No one cared about their Live accounts when Microsoft tried their restrictive DRM and always-online connection. No one cared about cloud power, or Kinect, or any of that B.S. and they still don't. It's about value for the money, and the Nintendo Wii proved that affordability always wins out initially.

"In addition, online is where MS has their cloud for dedicated servers and gamers will know this as evident by even first party games for Sony going P2P."

Put the pamphlet away and read some actual facts. No Sony first party game is going P2P. The very idea that the PS3 had more dedicated servers than the Xbox 360, and yet somehow the PS4 is going P2P is absolutely ludicrous. I wouldn't expect you to understand, given your paycheck, but the links are out there for you to read instead of taking Gozer's word for it.

MS won't capture the Wii market. The Wii market has moved away from consoles. They are fickle and are now into mobile phone gaming, not Kinect. And if you enjoy the idea of Microsoft dropping off support for core games as they go for the Wii market, then you have low standards and are the reason Microsoft can get away with all the anti-consumer, anti-gamer practices their hearts desire.

Dragonknight is the perfect example of whats wrong with this site. People should be bubbled down for spreading misinformation.

"Put the pamphlet away and read some actual facts. No Sony first party game is going P2P. The very idea that the PS3 had more dedicated servers than the Xbox 360, and yet somehow the PS4 is going P2P is absolutely ludicrous. I wouldn't expect you to understand, given your paycheck, but the links are out there for you to read instead of taking Gozer's word for it."

Either you are gullible, or you know that you are lying, but KZ 4 will be P2P. You were suckered by that crap Sony put out a while back. KZ 2 and 3 were also P2P. Are Sony gamers really this misinformed?

See that? An actual article. What does the title say? "Killzone: Shadow Fall boasts dedicated servers."

Oh damn, did I just shove fact in your face? Yeah, yeah I did. Oh but wait, there's more.

"DragonKnight, did you even read the story? It says 'Killzone Shadow Fall has dedicated servers hosted in various regions around the world. These servers do not run the logic of the game' therefore it's P2P."

"This means that people with slower Internet connections will have a better (keyword “better”) time playing the game than if matches were player-hosted."

Oh look at that, the matches AREN'T player hosted? Bu..bu..but that's what P2P is. So... if the matches aren't player hosted, how can it be P2P?

Yeah, you can shut up now. You just signed up to defend Xbox fanboyism? Way to be productive bud. It's more likely you are an Xbox fanboy whose account was bubbled down to 1, and since Xbox fanboys care so much about bubbles you had to make a new account using a proxy.

Reading between the lines, i.e. making bullsh*t up. The trademark of an Xbox fanboy.

KZ:SF has no player hosting. By definition that means it's NOT P2P. Feel free to ignore basic facts all you want to, but the fact that you're using language like "suckered" and "read between the lines" in the face of verbatim quotes from the developers themselves just proves that you're an Xbox fanboy desperately looking for something to make the PS4 look bad because the Xbox One has been hammered for so long.

And on top of it all, you're trying to censor me by appealing to the mods when nothing I've said goes against commenting rules, you just don't like what I have to say and you're going to attempt to "tell on me" to shut me up. Feel free to, but you'll get nowhere. The mods have better things to do than to cater to crying dupe accounts looking to steer the site in the direction of a particular brand.

wow, did the mods really just ban me because Im exposing the lies that are being spread about KZs servers?

You are quite angry Dragon.

Dragon, do you even know what a dedicated server is? You obviously dont. You have NO CLUE!

" However, the servers will only act as a hub between different game clients and any game logic will not be hosted on the servers"

Can you understand that statement? That came from GG.

This quote also came from them

"with only a very small portion of the game logic (i.e. mission/scoring logic) running on the ‘session master’, one PS4 in the game selected for its connection quality.

There you have it, straight from Boltjes mouth. KZ SF is really P2p.

Why is it only N4G users that think they are getting dedis? This is quite amusing. That link you posted from destructiod, go read the user comments, they all seem to understand its P2P but for some reason N4G doesnt.

Why are you scoffing at me for appealing to the mods to clean this site up? If people are posting blatant lies they should be bubbled down!

Shadow fail will have a proxy system to tunnel through NATs, what it will not have is dedicated servers.

In all the articles you listed they described a match making system and proxy system. But the actual game host will still be on a PS4 somewhere, and when that player quits you will still have to do host migration.... People will still be able to use lag switches. You still have the problem of your game being hosted on a home ISP, rather than in a data center somewhere.

You have failed DragonKnight, you are an utter failure, on this topic.

@The dupe accounts saying the same thing and B1663r: Let's say for the sake of argument that anyone thought you were right, you're not (no player hosting means not P2P), but let's say you were. Is Killzone the only Sony first party game coming out? Oh it's not? Oh but you know for certain that every PS4 game is going to be P2P now right? Oh you don't? So why are you trying to spread the FUD that they will be?

You couldn't be more wrong. There are no dedicated servers for Killzone Shadowfall. It's a glorified P2P system without any centralized server to properly coordinate XYZ and bullet trajectory.

From the Developer:

"Killzone Shadow Fall has dedicated servers hosted in various regions around the world. These servers do not run the logic of the game – they only act as a hub between the clients, forwarding network traffic from one player in game to all other players in game. This allows people with a slower connection or strict firewall settings to play without issues. Almost all logic relating to you (e.g. moving, shooting and taking damage) runs on your local PS4, with only a very small portion of the game logic (i.e. mission/scoring logic) running on the ‘session master’, one PS4 in the game selected for its connection quality."

""Killzone Shadow Fall has dedicated servers hosted in various regions around the world. These servers do not run the logic of the game – they only act as a hub between the clients, forwarding network traffic from one player in game to all other players in game. This allows people with a slower connection or strict firewall settings to play without issues.""

The "dedicated" server isn't their to process logic in game, so it's main goal is to forward traffic i.e. proxy server. KZ Shadowfall is still P2P with an extra hop to another computer just like how there are multiple hops on many computers before it reaches the next peer.

You can call it dedicated server if you want, but it ain't going to prevent the usual problems with P2P, which is cheaters, lagging and so on.

""Almost all logic relating to you (e.g. moving, shooting and taking damage) runs on your local PS4, with only a very small portion of the game logic (i.e. mission/scoring logic) running on the ‘session master’, one PS4 in the game selected for its connection quality.""

Take note of the last sentence straight from your very own source!

Session master on ONE PS4 based on CONNECTION QUALITY!!!

Wouldn't have to worry about it, if it was *real* dedicated server as per the definition of a gamer, not a computer scientist!

This is just Sony's marketing muscle at it, by hiding and misinforming their customers.

Xbox 360 > PS3 Xbox One < PS4 (I my opinion.) Brand loyalty is for morons who are unable to think for themselves. Gamers will get whatever platform is best for games (In my opinion, PS4, in others it could be Xbone.)

It comes to the games, a console cant do shit without games, idk why people always scream their opinions XBO>PS4 or PS4>XBO or N64>PS1 or XBOX>PS2, to all of those people like that, stick a sock in you mouth, games is what make it or break it.

In my opinion, after a full generation, Xbox 360 and PS3 are pretty much equal. They're both good for different things. PS3 has a certain type of game on it and 360 has a certain type of game on it, then you have the multiplats on both.

This gen will likely work out the same, but we really won't know for several years to come.

Things like XBL/ PSN profiles (trophies, friends list, etc.) only affect the decisions of about 20% of people who buy these consoles. The other 80% are either flat out casuals or people just looking for the next system to play their favorite FPS/ sports titles on. What affects their decision is pretty much price, and PS4 has that one (except in Brazil, wtf...). M$'s only strong market is the US, and brand loyalty is virtually nonexistent here. People will buy what's cheaper. Only a few will actually care about losing their XBL profiles.

Where the hell are you getting your made up statistics from? I'd say more and more people are interested in keeping their friends list/etc now more than ever, you can't compare PS2 and people jumping ship to other consoles when the 360 came out because there was no eco-system, no community to tie people in. Now there is, and a lot of people enjoy it regardless.

And lack of brand loyalty in the US? Tell that to the millions of iPhones sold every year, and then that are later upgraded a year or 2 later.

If I look at the people I know who own a 360 and pa3 only a few have said they are going to get a Xbox one or pa4 on the next 12 to 18 months as the games they like are still on the 360 and pa3 as they wanted games like gta5, cod ghosts, bf4, FIFA 14 etc.

I dint think the pre orders on both consoles and sales of both consoles in the 1st 18 months will be a high as people on here think.

Look at the psv, 3ds and wiiu none of them have hit the ground running it was only 12 months in the 3ds sales picked up. The psv is still having issues even though on here when the psv was announced it was going to walk all over the 3ds. The wiiu is now only starting to show signs of improving sales after so big name games.

I don't think anyone can really say which console will sell the most over the next 5 years as no one really knows its up to Sony, Microsoft and Nintendo to create the console and game advertisements to generate the sales.

Well pre-orders don't mean anything anyways to be honest, pre-orders aren't SOLD numbers, so I don't know why people get in a big huff about them, I know a lot of people who pre-ordered both consoles and waited out to see more features and games and then cancelled the ones they weren't interested in.

PS Vita is a handheld coming into the market at a bad time. Nintendo dominates the handheld market. The PS Vita needed to show why it is necessary to have it but it failed. Now, with the PS4, we can see what Sony was planning with the PS Vita. We just couldn't see it with the PS3. The 3DS offers absolutely nothing new other than 3D which any people didn't care for. There is no real separation between the 3DS and the DSi. That is why both of these units did not sell well at the jump. The Wii U just had a shitty reveal and PR team. MS should have learned from Nintendo's mistakes. People, casual gamers, the ones who made the Wii so successful didn't know the Wii U was a separate console. They thought it was a new controller for the Wii. Also, the stock in stores was horrible. They sold out, yeah, but they gave stores minimal stock and didn't replace it for weeks on end. So, if the people can't see it they won't buy it.

I remember when the 360 launched. I had ZERO interest in getting it. I was happy with my xbox/PS2. There was still good games coming out for both systems.

Fast Forward.....I can honestly say Im ready for new systems...it has been a long 8 years. GTA5 just releasing is keeping me playing current gen. But there is nothing else out I want.

BUT I do want to play BF4 on next gen....64 players is very appealing to me!! So this will be my first Launch system. And I am VERY excited!!!

Just how I waited last gen you will have allot waiting to make that move. We are what is called first adopters. I wonder if the long 8 year gap will have or is having more people going next gen instead of waiting?

The pre-order sales are an interesting way to see how the systems are faring with the general populace of hardcore gamers, but is nowhere near good enough to say how the system will do in it's lifetime.

Sony is greedy as well. They just hid it better. The whole DRM debacle wasn't just in Microsoft's plans. Sony had wanted to do it too bit changed their approach after MS got beat up over it. That's why Sony had two different presentations prepared for the PS4 reveal. One person on my friends list switched to the Sony camp. Everyone else is staying. I believe it's because they like Live and the community. I like that as well but I could fond myself getting used to PSN. It's like switching to a new school. But the thing that keeps me loyal to microsoft is the games but mainly it's the controller. I loved all there controllers except for the one made for the Jaegers of Pacific Rim. The s controller was the one that made me fall for the xbox. Then the 360 controller was just plain amazing and with the improvements on the XB1 controller, I'm sure I'm going to be head over heels for that one.

i agree with you dude..but why does every positive xbx article cause insecurity among many ps fans?they jump to the forums and start waging war even when it has nothing to do with the ps4...if this was a positive ps4 article it would be all praise and glory also if this was a negative xbx article it would be a true story..why the insecurity?....i listened to the latest joystick episode today and its so sad how sony fans behave..a ps fanboy ended his friendship with another guy after many failed attempts to stop his friend from preordering an xbox one..its so petty, pathetic and miserable..especially given the fact that nothing fanboys say or do will stop the millions of gamers from getting an xbx one ..nothing you guys say will stop it from selling out and becoming a huge sucess...fanboys need to grow up and deal with their insecurities...fanboys on n4g ,neogaf and the likes make up just a tiny fraction of gamers worldwide(casual and hardcore )..and most casual gamers dont even care aboutfanboy wars.they dont even know it exists....anyways ill say it again..congrats to ms for turning things around this quickly.

Oh please. As if anyone with half a brain wouldn't know that if Microsoft had as many, or more, pre-order numbers as Sony they would be shouting it from the rooftops 3 times a day every single day for a month. Now all of a sudden Microsoft, who needs all the good PR they can get, decided to become bashful and use an anonymous developer saying "yeah, we have the same numbers but I can't give you an exact figure because the accounting department would have my head if I did."

"As per this reply, the dev stated, “When I saw reports of Sony having a million or 1.5 million pre-orders for the PS4, I didn’t even think twice about it. We’re not disclosing pre-order numbers at the moment for accounting reasons but I know for a fact we have just as many. Don’t be bogged by published statistics. At the end of all this, what matters is the games you want to play."

Well, I'm guessing this is total bull. If stats are not important then let's see if your game sells only 100K, and not millions like GTA5, will you still be saying what matters is the games you want to play ? Anonymous Dev, please shut the F*** up.

"I'm an anonymous dev for MS and we have as much pre orders as the PS4, I would love to tell you the numbers but the accounting team would have my neck for doing so, even though I'm posting as an anonymous source and there chances of tracing my comment back to me would be slim to none. So yea we have as much as Sony."

in your dreams, at my place first xbox one, at my sister´s first xbox one, everyone i know thats buying a console will go xbox one.Why? because they´re all parents, they all have kids, and even those ps inclined will buy xbox because of kinect and party games/family games. i dont know what you, console so called hardcores, that to me means jack, cause a real hardcore gamer spends thowsands on hi end pc parts and not on a console, think about gaming evolution, but i see microsoft is either going after nintendo casual gamers/and all other types of gamers, and sony first going after the core audience, believing their army of fans will influence others........WRONG!!!! the inverse is more to happen!!! ex: my sisters husbend is a cronic ps fan from the days of first psx, today he as an xbox one preordered because of their children and kinect, maybe later hes getting both......till then xbox games may change that

@raptor you dont have to agree, its just my vision of things, by the way you put things, a launch line up must be in the thousands count. each console will have at launch barelly 10 games , at least the most known ones. i wrote about all generation period not at launch window, bye

Microsoft as a whole and throughout its history as a company has always Offered Less and Charged More. They then overcompensate with a heavy marketing blitz.

I don't see this strategy playing out the same again. I can also add...Many people I know bought an xb360 because it was the first out and there was no other choice, this time they have no interest in buying an XBO.

Also, look at the global economy. People have less to spend and XBO is priced higher while offering weaker hardware. Yes they have a few exclusives (Up front) however we all know that this is their strategy. They taper off on exclusives as time goes on.

Don't you find it odd that all of Microsoft's exclusives (Minus Forza) are done by 3rd parties? Even their holy grail (Bungie) left them. I wonder why? Why are Indies so in love with Sony? These are the kind of questions you need to ask yourself so you can vote with your dollars into the right camp, which will lead to expansion of the market and innovative new titles. Not a company simply trying to absorb any profit they can and do as little as possible.

If a company really wanted to INNOVATE in a market space they would directly INVEST into that market, which they don't. Meanwhile SONY has build a LARGE (larger then Nintendo and M$ combined) first party gang of studios to develop titles. Sony has long-term vision while Microsoft is simply trying to eat they rewards short-term and hold market with advertising long term.

Am I the only one who see things like this? I'm interested in your opinions.

MS is going after the casual market. I said it once and I say it again that is where the money is. Both companies are after the money. You guys act like Sony's is in the business because they love gamers.

I don't see what the Ps4 can offer on a family level. I am still plan on buying a Ps4 but the casual market is where growth lies. Don't underestimate the power of family entertainment. If the Wii would have been a more powerful system things would have been alot different in the industry today.

^^^ you didn't take into other considerations such as Walmart, Target, Microsoft stores and Website, Toys'R Us, GameStop, etc. All orders don't have to come from Amazon. you don't rely on one site to sell all your consoles even if it's a huge retailer. spread out the merchandize

amazon.com is the WORLD'S largest online shopping website. you can get a general idea of how well something is going to do by amazon alone. you know why? 'cause people would rather sit on their asses and have things delivered to their door, and not have to line up for hours to get something. QFT.

In the interest of clarifying "where I stand" I'm buying both consoles on launch day.

Now that's that is out of the way, I don't buy that for one second.

As we saw with the PS3/360 era, Microsoft will use any and all situations to brag about sales. They're big on them --particularly U.S. sales. They've shown us that. If their pre-order numbers were as big as Sony's we have substantial evidence, based on history and fact, to support the B.S. claim here.

Claiming they won't disclose because of "accounting reasons" looks and sounds like a total lie to me. Microsoft has never been shy about handing out numbers when the numbers work in their favor.

I'm excited about Xbox One. I'll be there day one to buy it, but I don't buy this for one second. They've shown too much to the contrary for me to buy a conveniently timed bit of shyness on sales figures on the part of Microsoft because of "accounting reasons".

Not really spooked. We're just calling bullshit. There's so little evidence that points to Xbox One having similar pre-order numbers as PS4, while there's a huge amount of evidence showing that PS4 is going to sell crazy numbers this holiday season.

if microsoft had the same preorder numbers as sony, trust me they will make a big fuss about it. reason being they would come out and say consumers see the value proposition of kinect added on and a higher price.

MS needs to stop trying to compare the X1 to the PS4 directly. They need to stop presenting things in terms of how it relates to Sony. Penello is bad about this.

MS is really being messy with their marketing and PR this time around, and since the 180's everything they've done is coming across as damage control instead of touting new features that should be presented with a new console. The only real line they continue to tout since the reveal is the power of the cloud as a unique selling point, and many people are extremely skeptical of it.

I still have to reiterate here that M$ has said on numerous occassions that they've had the number 1 selling console for the 7th gen. They know their fans care more about "teh salez" and "teh profitz" than anything, so at this point I'm sure they'll say just about anything to keep them happy. Ignorance is bliss after all.

Also, not to mention this is an anonymous dev. Something tells me he doesn't exactly have access to M$'s actual numbers, unless he were an M$ first party, in which case, he wouldn't be anonymous now, would he? Since M$ has yet to say anything, this statement is pretty much bullshit. Just some random idiot trying to appease the fanboys because M$ can't do it themselves, because they know the truth.

I'm just gonna throw one last point out there. There are still stories of the PS4 selling out a retailers around the world all the time. People in some won't even have the chance to buy them until early 2014 because of the huge backlog of people. We've only heard stories like this for the XBone from a select few retailers here in the US and the UK. Even then, it's still possible to find one, if you look. PS4 is gone.

Based on Microsoft's history of boasting, this anonymous source that won't be exact on the numbers for "accounting reasons" is being called out for lying because Microsoft would never be shy about announcing, publicly, that their pre-order numbers match or exceed those of the PS4. Therefore, this article is at the very best speculation, but in reality complete bullsh*t.

**EDIT** Confirmed X1 developer based on what the site says. And even if true, it still doesn't add up. Microsoft are not shy about being in an equal or better position than anyone else. They never have been and this "anonymous dev" expects us to believe they are now all of a sudden? Sorry but no.

They're hating because they don't want Microsoft to beat Sony. However, I imagine some of them, like myself, don't want Microsoft rewarded for what they would have done to the industry, had Sony and Nintendo not been there to stand their ground.

awesome news.....im happy with all the positive xbx news of late..right from e3 the odds were against ms and the xbx one..it was like everyone wanted it to fail and it was really sad but see how things have changed and all turned around in a few months even with the 599price tag its good to see the xbx one beating the odds..theyve dropped some unecesary policies along the way and focused on the consoles strengths i.e the games, its services and what the future holds ..thumbs up to the entire xbx team....great job guys....great job.

The odds have been against MS since their shitty reveal, if I'm being honest. Hell, the odds were against them prior to that, when they stopped releasing anything but Halo and Forza(excluding abhorrent Kinect titles because I want to retain my sanity). It sped up with the rumors about the DRM, went full strength at the game-less XB1 reveal, and has remained in the negative ever since.

Have they gained some traction? Sure. But it's far from enough to have reversed everything they've lost. And to make matters worse, there's been continuing bad news, like the scaled back launch and delay of Kinect voice controls, among others.

And then there's this, which is pretty much confirmed to be untrue by sheer evidence to the contrary: no matter what source you use, no matter the region, PS4 pre-order numbers have pretty well dwarfed those of the XB1.

The start of the eighth generation for Microsoft has been a train wreck after which the first responders have lost their lives(Mattrick) or done even more damage(Penello) in the process of rescuing the victims(XB1).

I certainly hope they continue to improve upon their current offering, but if too many people like you are truly saying "Job well done" when they've so thoroughly BOTCHED said job, I don't know how much more improvement Microsoft will be encouraged to make.

Why do you think that is? I have a feeling you'll say fan boys, but I have to ask you, were MS struggles early on because of fan boys? If you believe so then why did none of the MS fans(not fan boys) support the system causing MS to do numerous 180's.

I was here after the reveal. There was a hugely apparent lack of MS defenders on these forums for well over a month. It's not something I would have expected, and thought there would be a huge influx of MS fan boys trying to defend what MS did...but there was only a few...quite literally.

That perception you have of "everyone wanted it to fail" has to be for a reason. People's perceptions of the machine, and thusly wanting it to fail had to originate somewhere, and I highly doubt even a massive influx of Sony fan boy hate could sway that perception to such a degree among the masses.

hahaha this is a 100% lie. just look at the preorder numbers for games in the US, the one territory where MS should be winning and they are still losing. http://www.vgchartz.com/pre... Xbox One: 844,000 games preordered Call of Duty Ghosts Battlefield 4 Assassins 4 Forza 5 Dead Rising 3 Ryse Madden 25 Playstation 4: 1,100,000 games preordered Call of Duty Ghosts Battlefield 4 Killzone Shadow Fall Assassins 4 Madden 25 Knack Now factor in Europe and Japan where Playstation dominates, ya no way Xbox has just as many preorders.

The biggest issue both console vendors have is supply (Heck, even the Wii U sold out for a few weeks last year). There is no doubt there is high demand for both consoles since they are both sold out for pre-order.

The winner and loser of total sales this holiday will be based on how many consoles they can get onto retail shelves. That is a manufacturing and distribution issue, not a consumer preference issue.

When two consoles are closely matched there is only one major deciding factor and that my friends is price. Price is king and that more than anything will put the ps4 ahead. It wont be until feb/march 2014 till we know the true extent but it will be marked.

If the two were closely matched, yes the price would play a factor BUT it isn't the major factor. When you buy a fridge or a washing machine, you're going to use it for a solid 8 years or so. So if you were comparing to similar fridges/washing machines, you'd see which one will be more beneficial in the long run.

So relating this to consoles,it's actually not the price which determines which you'd get. You don't want to buy the cheaper console if you're not going to enjoy it, because you're stuck with it for 10 years. So if the Xbox One suits your tastes, you wouldn't mind spending another $100. Think of it more like an investment. If it's the PS4 you, then by all means buy it because it's cheaper and most importantly, it's what you'll enjoy for the next 10 years.

Have you had one of those moments where you've bought the cheaper alternative, only to use it and think "damn, should have spent that extra $__"? Well yeah, it's similar to that, except that in this case, it's more preference rather than power. ( Yes to all those thinking I'm a Xbox fanboy, I'm saying the PS4 is more powerful).

So to sum it all up, it's not actually the price, but more 'which you'd enjoy more in the long run'.

But these aren't necessary appliances. They're video game consoles. And, as such, they're frequently looked at by the general populace as toys.

The average parent or grandparent isn't going to care much about the difference in features. They're going to look at the price. Outside of that, they may look for a specific game to be sure it's on a given console.

That's it.

As for gamers, if they're not fanboys, then they'll take quite bit into consideration, like the price, the power, the company behind the product(how well do they support their consoles, do they screw their customers over, etc), and consider what their friends might also get. An objective gamer with money might get both. An objective gamer with only so much to spend would probably get a PS4.

If they're basing their choice on "which you'd enjoy more in the long run," the length of time Sony supports their consoles would be a point in their favor. So, too, would their wide number of exclusives and willingness to take risks on new IPs.

Of course, liking a specific franchise can impact this, as you obviously wouldn't be getting Halo on the PS4. But if you have no preference for any particular IP, then you'd find yourself with a PS4.

Some people will buy a console for the entertainment features, others for only games, others price, and still others will buy it as a family device because they can't justify a $400-500 purchase for one member of the family only.