This link provides information into all the "dangerous dogs", breeds and regulations, bylaws and bans across the country...

cutelittlemako

June 8th, 2004, 09:54 AM

I'm taking an administrative Law class right now and we just studdied this case called Phaneuf vs. Corporation du Village de St-Hugues (from Quebec), that is about discrimination against dogs over 35 pounds. I was a municipal by-law that stated that all dogs over 35 pounds were to be muselled at all times in the city. In that particular case, only one person in the township had to obey this rule, he had two dogs over 35 pounds. The court ruled that it was discrimination, and invalidated the bylaw. So I wonder how they can put bans on breeds like this and not be accused of breed discrimination.

sammiec

June 8th, 2004, 10:12 AM

I think a case like that is a little different. I mean to muzzle all dogs over 35lbs is viewed to be a bit ridiculous because no one is afarid of those beautiful golden reterievers, or those wonderful yellow labs.... (sacarsim, just to make a point).... but those vicious and horrible masstifs, pitbulls and boxers. They MUST be muzzled or banned because they are causing all the bites and dog attacks....we all know that, you can't escape it, it's everywhere you look. People have been conditioned to believe that these animals are the culprits and should be punished....this very well could pass with enough supporters....
I was in the WalMart parking lot on Friday evening. I was sitting in the car with my precious pitbull waiting for my friend to come back... this lady walks up to the window where my dog is enjoying the breeze and says "killer dog"... it's because of this conditioning that you have those kind of people. She never met the dog, first time she's seen her ever, but that didn't stop her from assuming that all pitbulls are the same. They are all vicious and evil and will bite your head off as soon as they smell you....
And no, I didn't comment to the lady, I didn't think it would be appropriate start yelling at her as she walked away - then of course I would be a "typical" pitbull owner, just as vile as the dog...

Chany

June 8th, 2004, 11:48 AM

I don't feel that banning certain breeds are going to solve anything. New breeds from different countries will just start showing up more and more.
I read that article from the link sammiec provided. I have a hard time believing that lawyer who's dog killed Courtney Temple ( and no not just because he's a lawyer, cmt ;) ) But he did state that his dog had bit or attacked (can't remember which) other dogs before, but had never shown aggression to kids. So again here is an irresponsible owner :mad: and a child paid for that with her life. :mad:
I like Saskatchewans legislation it doesn't matter what the breed is and at least the owners can get fined $10,000. Maybe if more people had to pay that there would be more resposible owners.
We had to put down a dog when our kids were young because of his aggression, and it was never to us. We didn't wait for a child to get bit to do it either. He was a small dog :( but he didn't like other dogs or certain people. He did nip the ankles of 3 friends of ours and he was very strong for being small. We knew the potential was there and we didn't want to take that chance. It was a very difficult decision but something we had to do.He once jumped through our screen door at another dog. I don't know why some dogs can go like that and the next one is as gentle as a lamb?

cmt489

June 8th, 2004, 12:01 PM

Thanks for thinking of me Chany... LOL!! :D

It is true - irresponsible ownership is what makes people react the way that they do to these breeds. On the other hand, IMHO, until we can mandate who is a "responsible enough" owner to own some of these dogs that have greater "potential" to be vicious, it is very difficult to get the public to stop reacting in this way (and no, I am not supporting breed banning before anyone gets upset reading this).

Let's face it, we all see VERY BAD owners everyday - most times society is just lucky that these people have easy going dogs. When these owners get dogs with potential to do harm the problems begin. The reality of the situation is that only those who want to improve will become educated and these are not the people that we need to target with the learning to be a responsible owner campaigns - they will seek out the help, read the literature, talk to owners, etc. The people that are the worst offenders and are the most in need of help are those who either refuse to seek it or take it. Sadly, no matter how many campaigns for responsible ownership are put on, these people will not be reached.... :( :( :mad:

Michelle

Chany

June 8th, 2004, 12:17 PM

Maybe we can't mandate who is a responsible owner but maybe we could mandate certain training they have to have before getting certain dogs, and training they have to get together after too! If no papers then seriously big fine!! Maybe certain breeds should only be bred by certain breeders otherwise big fines to owners and where they got the dog from.
Since Abbey's breed is probably considered "dangerous" it wouldn't have bothered me to have to take training to get her. Just think the government could open up a whole new avenue of tax revenue!! :D

wAggie

June 9th, 2004, 12:23 AM

I guess, I hope, my friend's got the wrong information.... :confused:

I'll see what he says next time I see him.

as for your small dog, Chany... what breed was it?

my friend's aunt's 4 pound Chihuahua bit another dog in obedience school.... "luckily" the instructor didn't see this, and the dog barely passed the class! He attacks anyone coming in and leaving the house. The aunt believes he's like this because she spoils him so much... I think it may have more to do w breeding... :eek: :eek:

daisy18216

June 10th, 2004, 06:05 PM

I'm not trying to start an argument I'm just trying to make a point, and if I happen to offend anyone, I'll apologize now, Sorry.

Everyone is always bad mouthing and harassing the pit bulls, mastiffs, gsd, rotties, and other large breeds to be the vicious ones, BUT what about the small breeds like the chihuhuas, bichon frise (sp?) and peke just to name a few.

the smaller breeds are more vicious and likely to bit than the bigger larger breeds.

I'm a pit bull, pit bull mix, and gsd owner and I am a very responisble owner. I also have small children and these dogs would Never think of hurting my 2 legged babies. But my neighbor has a bichon frise and that darn, small little thing growls at my kids all the time.

So why isn't anyone ever saying how vicious the small breeds are?? :confused:

Sorry to all you small breeds dog owners out there, I really don't have anything against small dogs, but I just don't understand why it's always the large breeds that are the vicious ones.

mona_b

June 10th, 2004, 10:33 PM

It's not really the point of them being vicious,it's the damage that is caused by the larger breeds then the smaller one.

Any dog,be it large or small will bite.But the majority of damage is done by the bigger breeds.

Just pointing that out.... :D

chico2

June 11th, 2004, 07:37 AM

Yes,that's the BIG difference,how many times have we read"Woman mauled to death by vicious Chihuahua" :eek:
In a townhouse-complex across the street from my house,there must be 50 pit-bulls,most units are occupied by young people sharing and the big draw is the complex allows dogs.
Don't get me wrong,I am not against it and there has been no problems,that I know of.
In one Unit especially I am a bit concerned,they have a habit of just opening the door and let the dogs out one by one to do their thing on the lawn in the morning,no leash.They have 3 very well trained pitts and one beautiful Doberman.
I am just expecting one day to see some unsuspecting dog-walker pass by just as they let their dogs out and there will be trouble.
It is also a very busy street and I am concerned the dogs might just dash across one day,how much should you trust your dog to listen and obey?
Also,the fact that,a woman who walks her Husky about that same time can hardly hold her dog and a pit-bull running towards her,would give her the scare of her life no matter how well behaved the pitt is.
We do have a poop/scoop and leash law here,but I have yet to see one of the young men scoop any poop :D
I have talked about these dogs and their owners before and I do like to watch them,the owner of the Doberman and one blueish/grey APT walks them to the park on one leash that splits to hold two dogs and it's a sight to behold,very good looking dogs.They all take their dogs for walks,only in the morning do they let them out loose to do their business one,by one...and it worries me.

mastifflover

June 11th, 2004, 10:15 AM

I have to agree with the comment about small dogs. You are also right that they have not mauled a person to death and no one in the media is interested in dogs that bite if they don't do severe damage to another dog or human. I own an English Mastiff and used to have a Neapolitan as well and these are big boys, but they are and were never aggressive. I have had my dogs bit on more that one occassion by these small dogs and the owners actually think it is funny my dogs never retaliated no matter how many times this happened. What if my dog retalitated my dog would be deemed vicious and they would be the victim. Not fair and I am a little sick of it I really feel these breed bans are a little ridiculous since responsible pet owners are the ones who will be affected. The idiots who make these dogs fight and become aggressive are still going to do it and are not going to abide by the laws. You can tell by how well the gun registry worked dont you see the criminals lining up to register their guns. I personally would never muzzle dog law or no law. I don't think you should be able to make someone muzzle a dog if they have done nothing to deserve it.

glasslass

June 11th, 2004, 06:26 PM

You've hit it right on the head - the irresponsible owners are the biggest problem, not the breed of dog. Even when an owner is trying to be responsible, things can happen with any breed. Approx. 25 years ago my 13yo toy poodle bit a 7yo child who required 7 stitches at the emergency room. We were camping with a large group and we were sitting around the campfire with our chairs close together in a large ring. Because my dog was upset by several large dogs wandering around loose and from being teased earlier in the evening by several of the guys when a hot dog fell off the grill, I kept him on a leash, on my lap, with my arms around him. He had never bitten anyone before. One of the other dogs approached and he started to growl. The little girl sitting next to us dropped to her knees and put her hands on either side of his muzzle and her nose up to his nose to try to shush him. He was startled and bit her lip. It was over before I even realized it was happening. In retrospect, I should have stayed with him in the camper when I knew he was upset. I just never dreamed there was any chance of him biting anyone. Fortunately, her parents witnessed the entire event. We had his vaccination certificate with us and we all went to the emergency together. This is how we all met and they are among our best friends today. We paid the deductible at emergency. Over the years, our dog "sponsored" their daughter for school walk-a-thons and we sent a baby rosebuds arrangement from our dog when she had eye surgery several years later. The point I'm making is that any breed will bite under the right circumstances no matter how responsible the owner tries to be. The odds when an owner is irresponsible are how many times greater? And the damage from the bite is proportional to the size of the dog, but even toy breeds can do a lot of damage.

Chany

June 12th, 2004, 10:19 AM

Waggie, sorry it took so long for me to answer. :rolleyes: Our dog was a heinz 57 model. I think terrier was about the only thing I could see in him.
But man was he ever a strong little bugger! :( it was only last year around here when obedience classes were finally offerred. I use my "Dog training for Dummies" book now faithfully for my pups. ;)

wAggie

June 12th, 2004, 08:29 PM

daamn...

hey, I messed around w the "puppies for dummies" back in the day... ;) lol