Well I'll say this. I didn't see hundreds of seats empty at the Philly show. And on top of that, something was weird at the box office. I was standing at the door next to the ticket office for an hour or so before they opened the doors. Two different people walked up to the ticket window when I first took my place in line and asked if tickets for the show were still available. The ticket lady said 'no it's sold out.'
Then right before they opened the doors a few last minute people asked about tickets and were told they were still available. I first hand witnessed the transaction. Made me feel bad for the people who had asked earlier and were told the show was sold out. They missed an awesome show.

Well I'll say this. I didn't see hundreds of seats empty at the Philly show. And on top of that, something was weird at the box office. I was standing at the door next to the ticket office for an hour or so before they opened the doors. Two different people walked up to the ticket window when I first took my place in line and asked if tickets for the show were still available. The ticket lady said 'no it's sold out.' Then right before they opened the doors a few last minute people asked about tickets and were told they were still available. I first hand witnessed the transaction. Made me feel bad for the people who had asked earlier and were told the show was sold out. They missed an awesome show.

Probably all part of the fucking Ticketmaster online scam. Holding good seats for "ticket services" (scalpers) etc... and screwing the real fans every possible chance they get.

For instance... I recently went online day of sale for RHCP. My daughter wanted to go. 10am comes.... I log on to TM web site and 1 min after 10 the only seats left are second level in the back of the arena. THEN 2 hours later a whole shit load of the BEST SEATS are on eBay thru the scumbag "services". Foul play??? FUCK YES!!!

Ticketmaster is a fucking horrible company. FUCK THEM!!! SCUM!!

_________________Make your checks payable to QUENTIN ROBERT DeNAMELAND, Greatest Living Philostopher Known to Mankind.

Yes, that's common Trenny. Also common these days are the ticketmaster practices where they hold and 'sell' a number of tix to pre-designated clients, like jaypfunk is speaking of. some they hold for the venue, some they hold for the booking agent, some for the artist, some for promo purposes (whether booking, venue or ticket providers).
The way I understand it, or [full disclosure] what I've been able to figure out from anecdotes here and there, ticketmaster/clear channel etc, booking agents, the artists and the venues all have to work together to get what they want. It all depends on the 'workability' of the various contracts made between these organizations.
Ticketmaster/clear channel want to sell tickets. They also know you have to spend money to make money. But they want to be able to spend as little as possible and make as much as possible by the end of the day. One of the methods is holding tix for day-of-show sale. But here the ticket makers aren't directly involved with their dispersal at the day-of-the-show. It's the venue employees who usually do that or possibly the booking agent reps taking/selling tix. Though even these people are SUPPOSED to know their responsbilities in the contracts between the main actors -- the venue, the bookies, the artist, and ticketmaster -- they don't always know, say, the 'when' of the dispersal of whichever tix.
Another method apparently, is the ticket makers holding tix and their designates selling them on ebay or wherever they can get the biggest bang for the buck. didn't I see some of these for zpz? I'd be curious to see who they might be or, that is, for whom.
It may be ticketmasters flunkies doing this for themselves as jayp called attention to. I'd also like to see relevant legal definitions of this stuff. But I'm a nerd like that.
I don't have anything nice to say about ticketmaster or clear channel and the rest. 'Ass-licking shill-sellers' comes to mind. I especially vomit a little everytime I see the 'processing fee'. I've often wondered who's 'health care' bill I'm payin for

The Detroit facility is outdoor, with both reserved pavilion seating and lawn seats. I don't know if the capacity includes the lawn, but I bet it does. Who the hell wants to sit on the lawn when zpz plays?

_________________Everytime we picked a booger we'd flip it on this one winduh. Every night we'd contribute, 2, 3, 4 boogers. We had to use a putty knife, man, to get them damn things off the winduh. There was some goober ones that weren't even hard...

TicketAsster SUCKS. Your screwed either way you go. Buy tickets for face value the moment tickets go on sale in end up with shit seats in the rafters, or pay out the ass for good seats being held by 'ticket brokers.'

I'll be honest, I went the ticket broker way for the Philly show. Paid a lot, but got great seats.
I talked to the guy beside me and asked him about his tickets. Same deal as me. I also talked to the people in front of me. Ticket broker tickets too.

There's no more 'luck of the draw.' Reserved seating started as a 'safety' idea and has turned into typical American Over-Capitiatlism.
No wonder general admission shows are few and far between. You can't make as much money off of it. And people wonder why fans don't go out to see more bands live.

But by the looks of things, the vast majority of the fans there were Michiganians.

That would be "Michigander."

Good to know.

sdurgin wrote:

This former Wolverine is in CA now so was able to be part of the general admission crowd to LA and SF. Hope they add local kick off date to fall tour.

If this tour has return engagements later this year (probably in November) for the above mentioned markets, they'll most likely be scheduled at The Fillmore in San Francisco (1,300) and at The Mayan Theater (1,400) or the House Of Blues (1,100) in LA...

Well I'll say this. I didn't see hundreds of seats empty at the Philly show. And on top of that, something was weird at the box office. I was standing at the door next to the ticket office for an hour or so before they opened the doors. Two different people walked up to the ticket window when I first took my place in line and asked if tickets for the show were still available. The ticket lady said 'no it's sold out.' Then right before they opened the doors a few last minute people asked about tickets and were told they were still available. I first hand witnessed the transaction. Made me feel bad for the people who had asked earlier and were told the show was sold out. They missed an awesome show.

Probably all part of the fucking Ticketmaster online scam. Holding good seats for "ticket services" (scalpers) etc... and screwing the real fans every possible chance they get.

For instance... I recently went online day of sale for RHCP. My daughter wanted to go. 10am comes.... I log on to TM web site and 1 min after 10 the only seats left are second level in the back of the arena. THEN 2 hours later a whole shit load of the BEST SEATS are on eBay thru the scumbag "services". Foul play??? FUCK YES!!!

Ticketmaster is a fucking horrible company. FUCK THEM!!! SCUM!!

Yeah Man, same shit happened to me when I got tickets for The Beacon gig. I got 1 ticket to begin with, it was lower balcony, then I had to buy a nother single, which was orch left seating. So I kept the orch and sold lower balc. The point is, why didn't I get the better seat earlier as opposed too later?

WHAT'S HAPPENED TO BROADWAY?
WHERE'S IT GONE, ALL THE GLITTER?
THE 'HEART' AND THE 'SOUL'
THE PATTER?
THE PITTER?

The more I think about it, I can't get my mind wrapped around the attendence figures above and the fact that the morning of the Philly show there was a sign taped up at the ticket office stating that the ZPZ show was sold out. There's roughly a 300 or so ticket differnce between the attendance figures and the capacity. So that leads to my question of 'how much money did the ZPZ tour get screwed out of by Ticketmaster?

The more I think about it, I can't get my mind wrapped around the attendence figures above and the fact that the morning of the Philly show there was a sign taped up at the ticket office stating that the ZPZ show was sold out. There's roughly a 300 or so ticket differnce between the attendance figures and the capacity. So that leads to my question of 'how much money did the ZPZ tour get screwed out of by Ticketmaster?

VIP/comp tickets are held by promoters & artists for concerts all the time. And if they don't get used, they get thrown back into the pot and hence are available to the public..

I'd be the last person to defend Ticketmaster. However, I had really great seats for ZPZ in Chicago, about 20 feet away from Dweezil in the center. I did it the old fashioned way: I sat at the computer the moment tickets became available and bought 2. So, apparently, there are moments in time when one can actually get good seats independently. Of course, there were several rows in front of me, and I doubt those folks all got their seats the same way.....

_________________Everytime we picked a booger we'd flip it on this one winduh. Every night we'd contribute, 2, 3, 4 boogers. We had to use a putty knife, man, to get them damn things off the winduh. There was some goober ones that weren't even hard...

get up at 4 am the day zappa tickets go on sale
hitch-hike down to the box office
get in line
fire up the chillum
wait in line
fire up the chillum some more
wait in line
break out the pipe, fire it up
wait in line
smoke a few joints
wait some more
box office opens; buy tickets, pay cash, no service charge
go home & sleep

get up at 4 am the day zappa tickets go on salehitch-hike down to the box officeget in linefire up the chillumwait in linefire up the chillum some morewait in linebreak out the pipe, fire it upwait in linesmoke a few jointswait some morebox office opens; buy tickets, pay cash, no service chargego home & sleep

1. In a 3,000+ capacity theater, I do not think the naked eye can see less than 400 empty seats, unless those empty seats are bunched together. They were most likely scattered throughout the entire venue.

2. To my knowledge, FZ sold out three shows at the same venue in 1988. That's around 9,200 tickets at an average ticket price of around $16-$17. Now, since 10% of the audience, at the most, will come back to multiple shows in the same market on the same tour if there are no return engagements, that means that around 8,600 people saw FZ live at the Tower in '88. So, 8,600 tickets divided by 3.2 = basically 2,700 tickets. Or $16.50 multiplied by 3.2 = basically $53 (the basic average ticket price of the Philly show last month).

get up at 4 am the day zappa tickets go on salehitch-hike down to the box officeget in linefire up the chillumwait in linefire up the chillum some morewait in linebreak out the pipe, fire it upwait in linesmoke a few jointswait some morebox office opens; buy tickets, pay cash, no service chargego home & sleep

ROTFLMAO!

In college, we would have ticket lines that lasted sometimes several weeks. You'd have to orchestrate 24/7 coverage in line not to lose your place. Once, for a Jethro Tull show, we had someone in line continuously for a month.

That's the type of thing college students can pull off. Now? NO FUCKIN' WAY!

_________________Everytime we picked a booger we'd flip it on this one winduh. Every night we'd contribute, 2, 3, 4 boogers. We had to use a putty knife, man, to get them damn things off the winduh. There was some goober ones that weren't even hard...

I don't believe the Philly show figure is incorrect. For two reasons:1. In a 3,000+ capacity theater, I do not think the naked eye can see less than 400 empty seats, unless those empty seats are bunched together. They were most likely scattered throughout the entire venue.

There were not 400 empty seats at the Tower. No way. I was there. You weren't.

I don't believe the Philly show figure is incorrect. For two reasons:1. In a 3,000+ capacity theater, I do not think the naked eye can see less than 400 empty seats, unless those empty seats are bunched together. They were most likely scattered throughout the entire venue.

There were not 400 empty seats at the Tower. No way. I was there. You weren't.

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