These people all get paid more per hour, then employees, much more. Do they lose their right to purchase Individual Pension Plans? This lamentation of the fallen seems to be coming from peeps that are likely to see client money walk out the door.

Liquidate the business and the house and call her a day. There is more than one way to skin a cat…. The fact that small business creates most jobs is irrelevant, their sole interest is getting re-elected.

They have tapped into a broad source of voters who have little financial knowledge and even fewer assets. Those who have worked hard, given up much in their personal lives and prospered are the new bad guys.

Their clarion call of tax the rich resonates with this group and that is what matters to this PM. What will resonate is if their doctor reduces his hours or packs up and moves to the US.

There is a sweet spot that has to be found. Nore would you if you were smart, hardworking and ambitious. Bolsheviks at the wheel.

This will be so fun to watch. Time is short, if any. The ones acclaiming it, enjoy you MF. As for me, never again. There has to be the perception of hope.

Hope that one can get ahead. Cuz if you spend all your time and energy trying to keep up …. The income sprinkling practice is nonsensical, and is rampant in the physician community, and it needs to end.

Good on Morneau for finally addressing this. And some facts on doctors going to the United States: Recent data CFHI and CIHI says that there is net in-migration of physicians, and that there are at least ten applicants for every spot in medical school.

There will be no shortage of physicians…in fact, the bigger problem is that we are training too many, and cannot afford the ones we have, who are increasingly a female Hedden et al, , b working fewer productive hours Hedden et al, , and c struggling to find sufficient employment, particularly in specialties that are resource and equipment intensive RCPSC, Killing off the corporation structure is the first step in making physicians employees, and dispensing with fee-for-service, an unaccountable and wasteful system that provides no accountability and rewards volume, instead of quality.

I hope this is the direction that the feds are looking to go. More likely one man corps contributing the same value to the economy at a significantly lower tax burden.

She could have chosen to run her business here but who in their right mind would want to pay Canadian taxes. These changes are going to result in huge layoffs in the legal profession.

Lucky me, I get to do this for free! Lets see how they do in the polls in the next year with imploding housing sales and rising interest rates.

Looking at the number of people who are happy about these tax changes — it is no surprise that Trudeau and his divisive politics get a majority.

They are hoping divisive class and religious politics gets them the majority again. Simple math is hard to understand for most folks. I cannot wait for the day when some politician with guts gets ride of defined benefit plans for all Government workers because the tax payers just cannot afford it.

I hope these same jokers lose their jobs when their small business employer wants to reduce expenses. Then you can test out the free money program that has been instituted.

Combine these changes with the increase in minimum wage in Ontario and a lot of employees are going to have a shock when their employer reduces their hours or number of employees.

Then you can be happy about the changes that you are cheering on right now. Everything goes in a circle and every action has an equal and opposite reaction.

Why get upside with no downside ii what about my reward for close to 7 years of not taking pay. We have become a society of populists, run by majority state of mind.

I guess the way I should think about it is should be cup half full: I am not an entrepreneur in Canada, but I have already decided that after selling my company I will not start one in Canada given the tax and general privileges and protections for employees.

This is not a slight at the people of Canada, but more the competitiveness of the employee population and the laws that define and restrict employer obligations and actions.

Anonymous posters tend to be so disingenuous. Amazing that the Liberals have managed in a such a short time, to start a class war against small business owners.

The government driving cashless society they want it all! Before they are called poor operators etc. Some ran their companies for years grinding 10 to 12 hours a day and had jobs for 35 people.

Where can I start work at 20 and retire at 40 and collect my defined benefit pension? Incorporated 30 years ago and tried to set aside money for retirement.

In the process of shutting her down. Incentive to continue just not there anymorneau. You should be thankful the contractor gave a person of your intellect a job due to which you and family if you had anyone dependent on you could survive.

So instead of calling the contractor names be thankful you are in a position to post your pitiful thoughts on this blog. You lament that doctors are working less productive hours.

What do you think will be the effect of having punitive tax levels? I can tell you that for me personally, it means I will work less.

Simply not worth the sacrifice of time from my family and other interests for 41 cents on the dollar. The only thing a sane person can do is work less and spend less and do most jobs around your house yourself rather than hire someone with after tax dollars.

I am a 41 year old doctor in my prime and while producing less healthcare is bad for the system and decreasing my spending is bad for the economy it is good for my life balance.

I guess I should thank Mourneau because this will be enough to cause me to cut back to the minimum I need to provide a decent life for my family — most of which is not money and — and stay below the top marginal tax rate.

They have to raise the money somehow. Why not target small business!! The physician response will be predictable. Get used to it. ANY color coming to govern will be confronted with the prospect of gov default.

Harper gave the hint with the TFSA. The ONLY vehicle to ensure some pension — if only used properly. Is the collective fault of an irresponsible plebe check out the RE ownership percentage in the population AND its leaders.

What you see…are the consequences. All you have to and can do is to acknowledge the situation and act acordingly. So stop whining that gov does this and that… Gov is broke and desperate.

They will rob everybody blind until there is nothing to rob. Why you people think are you are so different??? This , my friends…is ALL you can do.

Swearing Morneau is useless. Nobody but NBA players retire at Teachers for example start at about 25 and retire at Some cops do better since they can start earlier.

Clearly they are not paying enough! One lady is a single mom with two kids that go to local public school.

Well when you cannot just add a buck or two to the giant middle class, like in times gone by because of free trade and the will to destroy the middle class.

We will tax those who are left. Yeah people who have money. Income is income……tax everyone the same. That is what is fair and what it looks like is being done here.

Having said that, the rewards to running a successful business are more than just financial as well, regardless of the tax rate.

In the interests of full disclosure I lean so far to the right that I often walk in a circle, but, I voted for Trudeau simply because he said he would legalize weed.

I make 26k a year and work full time physical labour…. I hate myself and I want to die. Unfortunately T2 is still riding high in the polls despite his obviously moronic nature.

The problem with giving a person who has never held a real job in his life and was born with a silver spoon is that said person assumes that anyone successful has reached that stage by doing the same as himself — NOTHING.

Canada is just getting a dose of what Ontario has endured for many many years and by the time these clowns are done, the hole will be so big that we will not be able to get out.

So easy to buy votes in Canada. Average annual revenue was MM. Receivable from Canada Inc. Co-owner of Canada Ltd. Vice-President of Canada Ltd.

President of Canada Inc. Several years ago Garth said that K people were going to retire every year for many years. Now you have your answer.

Someone draw me a map as to how they will get paid without jacking up taxes. No sympathy whatsoever for the banker, finance, or quasi-government-employee types doctors who are going to be subjected to tax fairness under these proposals.

Morneau has my support in implementing tax fairness. The tax system is severely flawed if, by employing an fancy accountant or fancy tax lawyers, one can structure their affairs to reduce tax.

The Canadian economy desperately needs tax fairness so that employment opportunities can be increased for all, not just a select few in a few specific sectors that have the ability to exploit the loopholes.

Accounting firms claim the measures will likely reduce employment. Did you just make that benefit up? If the work needs to get done, then the employers will hire people to do it.

A fair tax system may very well create even more economic growth, which will improve both demand and supply. Working harder, from the perspective of a small business owner, might mean expanding a business, investing in technology, employing more people presuming they can be productively employed.

There is little evidence to suggest that high tax rates cause people to work less hard. Taxes are the price we all pay to live in a civilized society.

You want roads and infrastructure? Be happy you can pay taxes to get them. The IT people doing this are middle class. Under six figs is usual, and corps like the big six banks force them to incorporate, so as not to have to hire them onto pensionable jobs.

There is a ton of risk, no employment security, no benefits. It does seem like an overreach into classes of people that are purportedly supposed to benefit.

Personally, I gave up my doctoral level career to do books for a spousal business, bc the income was better than university teaching, and there was no daycare available in the GTA at the time.

Minor detail, the Great Canadian Daycare Debacle, still not fixed despite blowing a lot of hot air. Women should have choices and flexibility.

This is a Liberal viewpoint, imo. I am not in favour of income sprinkling when the spouse does not work. If I was the one handing out the money I would not want my money misused.

Bwts, one has to be careful that the spirit of small business is not killed as they are the engine of an economy. The leaders have to give incentives to encourage small business not abuse them to extinction like with more taxes.

This is another reason why T2 should not be in power as he does not understand how the economy grows and blossom. Gordon Campbell 8 years; Christy Clark 8 years.

And small businesses have been closing and leaving the province for about that time. And our economy has been on the hot housing market.

That tells you everything about the Liberals. Will never vote for a Liberal and did not vote for T2 and never will. Nor will vote for Conservative.

Both the same control freaks. He says it again. In fact once we finish with Downsview Park. Camera pans around the room. Guy in a suit reads a paper: I think a lot of the voters came from legalizing marijuana and that is how T2 got in.

Language alphabets are symbols to express ourselves…. But sometimes, even they fall short of expression…. So dear readers I like to use additional symbols for expressing my views:.

Kick his effing Butt in the next election. It is not true that Canadian Tax payers heavily subsidize doctor training after medical school.

At worse, residents may actually be saving tax payers money. I mean, why would hospital doctors who can work be willing to work the graveyard shift without substantial increase to benefits?

As a civil servant police officer do you know how much my wife has had to sacrifice for all the crap I bring home from work?

So cry me a river Garth. Ambulance drivers wives, soldiers wives, teachers wives, the list goes on and on. When you mortgage your house to buy a cop car, let me know.

The thread is about financial risk. Thank you for your service, though. The real financial con job is the government regulators who allow systematic front-running of orders to buy or sell stocks, bonds, and derivatives by the likes of those computerized pirates called High Frequency Traders.

They are in nasty cahoots with the so-called prestigious exchanges and the alternative trading venues — all with the goal of draining capital from the people who actually put their capital at real risk.

Billions and billions of dollars of wealth is drained every year from all of us through our pension funds and our investment portfolios.

There are people who net benefit from taxpayer money and people who net pay taxes. To appease the large voting population of benefiters, the government overspends on pet projects.

To pay for this they need to increase taxes to the payers. The wealthy elite are untouchable because they include Justin and Morneau and their friends and people and the large corporations they control that donate to politicians.

So they tax the working, upper middle class eg. Eventually the upper middle class shrinks as taxes are a major disincentives to work.

The government still needs more money as the growing number of benefiters want more benefits and the shrinking number of payers stop working as much.

We need to tax things we want less of in society eg. If Bill and Justin truly want to address the wealth gap, tax inheritances. Taxing entrepreneurs and professionals is simply a tax grab built on the politics of tax warfare.

Corporations in Canada pay half the income tax actual people do. Thats also far less than us companies pay. The profits are are then reinvested in the operation or paid out to the shareholders, who pay tax on it.

Morneau an email but wondering who else I can CC on it for some extra oompf?!? Most Canadian business people are honest and pay there taxes as laid out by the government tax system 50 years ago.

The planned changes will result in and force many deals to go underground and the result will be very little tax gain for the government.

I will Fix your toilet do you need an invoice or cash. As I pointed out earlier, there is no shortage of very qualified people wanting to get into Canadian medical schools.

So no matter how much they might hate me saying so, Canadian doctors are civil servants and the only difference is how they are get paid.

So no tax breaks for them. Bonafide entrepreneurs deserve the tax breaks — they are getting screwed as the government goes after the more egregious examples of tax evasion.

Not on a full pension. Or maybe she started at Either way, I have no pension so in working to What part of creating something out of nothing do you not understand?

Is that what you are really trying to say? As a result, lack of past enforcement incentivized game-playing. In structuring corporate and personal taxation.

As long as the economy kept on moving upward, enough people continued to get fattened up. Over-heated economies yield high velocities of money.

Lack of enforcement or correction emboldens…. There will be collateral damage, to be sure. But there always is… Wrong place at the wrong time.

Not wearing any clothes when the tide goes out. A dollar short and a day late. This will crush some people.

It was also, conversely, open up a new set of opportunities, as the landscape changes. There has to be a reward for taking a risk and working hard.

I sent Bill another email. Amazing that they do reply back in time. If you stay civil. There seems to be a few people on here that have never incorporated or run a company.

They seem to be pretty knowledgeable about how once one is incorporated one can dodge, lie, steal their way to prosperity by cheating the CRA.

I know of other docs GPs who work 4 days a week. I knew they were going to be a dangerous lot with their demographic dominance.

I have no idea what the plan should be now, but I will do what I can to pass this assault on my finances directly to my local economy through austerity in my household and knock out about k of discretionary spending.

There needs to be proper feedback so that the idiots who voted for these guys who are willing to execute the postmodern agenda can feel the pain as the malicious consequences of their agenda take hold.

This is happening so much faster than I thought. God help those of us who earn our living the risky way when the next crisis rolls ashore while the liberals are torpedoeing small business at the same time they are running 30 billion dollar deficits.

Your comment is awaiting moderation. August 27, at 9: Ok I think I am not there yet. Just read the comments being posted here. Clearly class warfare is on the horizon.

Hating the wealthy and successful among us is a long time cherished Canadian value. Not really surprising Accountants are against the change, they will likely lose business.

We all pay too much anyway. So, what if your small business is a corporation? Do these new rules only apply to sole proprietors and partnerships?

It worked out for them… they now employ thousands of people, stimulate the economy to no end. Thousands of small business across the country are no different… just smaller, local, growing and hiring.

To the police officer who argued his wife has to put up with his stress. Remember police pensions are some of the most generous in Canada… the incorporated professional has none.

Taxing a business owner like a police officer makes little sense if the goal is equitable taxation. You are flat out wrong.

The Canadian taxpayer heavily subsidizes the cost of physician education. That is a pretty heavy subsidy. You are also wrong about wages for residents.

You are also wrong about what hospital management would do without residents. More providers who offer services at a lower cost are the answer.

The evidence convincingly shows that NPs can do the same work as a GP at far lower cost. Thanks for taking some of these morons back-of-the-envelopes calculations to task.

Moved the whole operation to Taipei, cheaper to operate, less taxes, less rent, access to more consumers, more profitable, less headache and without commies after me!

Lucky I stayed a dual citizenship, my kids will continue living here as they still need English and fresh air, after that goodbye.

I wish luck to Canadian people and their government, they are nice people but many will see themselves turn into Cuban or venesuelean unfortunates within a decade or two.

We, however in Asia will be just fine. There is a lot of political pressure here to make it more difficult to get these visas. If you go the H1B route, you have to contend with the massive lottery in place.

Not every applicant is guaranteed an H1B. You could spend years just getting one of those, if at all. Is that on average? Have you actually achieved US permanent residency?

They are, along with other public sector union members, the biggest opportunists around. California, Ontario, Illinois etc are in deep financial straights because of their ilk.

I suggest you check out what they can make in California. Farming, fishing, and natural resource extraction are all far more dangerous.

Thank a farmer who feeds you, not a public sector union member who racks up his pension to obscene levels by claiming tons of pointless overtime.

Thank you once again for showcasing to the world, and especially to our neighbours down south, how a glorious, progressive and forward-thinking nation built on social justice, gender parity and carbon taxes thrives.

We dodged the GFC. Our housing market is insatiable. Our cities are world class and everyone wants to find refuge here.

Nothing can stop us now. How about they tax the middle class LESS! It scares me how many geniuses approves of this! Try 2x or 3x that.

No contractor that I know of takes cheques who even uses them these days or credit cards. Contractors are paid in cash.

A friend ran an aesthetic studio for years. Yup, facials, pedis, etc, all expensed on company credit cards. It is not the critic who counts; not the man who points out how the strong man stumbles, or where the doer of deeds could have done them better.

The credit belongs to the man who is actually in the arena, whose face is marred by dust and sweat and blood; who strives valiantly; who errs, who comes short again and again, because there is no effort without error and shortcoming; but who does actually strive to do the deeds; who knows great enthusiasms, the great devotions; who spends himself in a worthy cause; who at the best knows in the end the triumph of high achievement, and who at the worst, if he fails, at least fails while daring greatly, so that his place shall never be with those cold and timid souls who neither know victory nor defeat.

The squeeze is on for Canadians. More and more all the time. This is also getting more and more interesting. There is many very clever people out there.

Accountants complaining about their clients being unfairly treated. That is a laugh. Talk about unbiased opinion.

I praised Bill for having the guts to put things correctly with a level playing field. Who do you think pays for all our wonderful social programs!!!

As for making it look like the entrepreneur is making minimum wage like his employees, some are making much more so screw that argument.

You have holes in every one of your points and it shows. A strong middle class is key. Corporate loop holes do not make a level playing field.

Any consulting contract with federal or provincial governments, either direct or through an authorized agency specially these that require RFQ and RFP requires by law incorporation as independent consultant.

This comes with lawyers fees, independent liability insurance, lots of liability actually, provision of tools at own expenses etc.

The same for doctors and professional corporations. The additional expenses and nature of these Businesses as well as the lack of benefits requires incorporation.

The very suggestion that corporations are established in order to avoid taxes are laughable and Bill M knows it. The disturbing part is that they go beyond that, they want to tell the owners of small private corporations to whom and how much to pay in salaries.

Bill M and Trudope buddies. There is no increase in taxes for stock options again not to distress Bill M and Trudope buddies. Mister fairness does not say a word about the lack of capital gains taxes on private residences.

As for the general lie-beral depending on handouts public: That will be outsourced to big companies Like the one that screwed the Obama Care health site a big Canadian company due to lack of competence so they were booted out and Accenture had to fix the miss.

Other people not in a corporate holding situation, but just a regular cottage owner must rent the cottage, take out a business license, do all the proper accounting for the rental in order to get just a few legitimate costs tax reduced.

Mir ray is finally levelling the tax field. The families within corporate writeoffs get way too much money compared to to families not within that particular structure.

Not sure why people get so excited over this. Canada is a socialist wasteland. Anyone with ambition goes to the USA.

Never has never will. Disgusted to see the disdain of some posters trolls applauding the upcoming tax grab.

A big side effect will be the talented leaving and the underground economy growing. You do realize that we are already taxed to the hilt with income, property and sales taxes.

Self-employed people generate and pay plenty of tax already. A lot of hand wringing, drooling, jealous readers coming out of the woodwork to comment on this post.

You are a accountant in the U. Remember who accountants are working for. Not the average Joe. By federal law, all accountants have as their primary client the CRA, not the taxpayer.

This is why tax lawyers are thriving, since only they can promise confidentiality and a duty of care.

Perhaps the tax rate for all small business owners ought to be lowered. However, keeping in tax loopholes creates two classes of people: It seems in total opposition to conservative values to say that people who are less scrupulous ought to be taxed less.

If what you really want is to promote people to get into small business, then create a specific small business tax deduction and incentivize creating small businesses rather than lying on your taxes.

Years ago in Copenhagen on business, I asked some quite wealthy acquaintances why there were so few expensive vehicles there. They all loved cars and a few had vintage cars in their garages.

Both sides of this debate are whiners. Sure, there are tax loophole cheats a-plenty. But there are also lazy, unambitious weed-monkeys a-plenty.

Any economic system based solely on greed will ultimately fail. The only solution is the same one that I started with on this blog many years ago: Stop electing banker puppets.

Everything else is noise. Who is it borrowing from? Why are these questions never asked and therefore never answered? Well, I know why.

Loose thousands of jobs, and votes. Liberals need to look in the mirror. You are the problem. Smokey has Right idea. Sell everything, leave observe from the beach.

Wife and I are thinking about it. Year end in September. Accountant and I will long discussions. Could someone smarter than me clear up a simple question:.

If they do go ahead and tax investment income on retained corporate earnings… does this apply to new investments only after , or ALL investments held by the corporation, past and future?

By the time the lawyer gets the file the damage has already been done. The tax filings are the tax filings.

The CRA has those. Most people cannot do sophisticated tax filings using lawyers alone. Accordingly, once the CRA is on to you you are as good as screwed.

The government has stiffled big business ….. Where are we all going to work? And if they do well …. The nay Sayers all have the same opportunity …..

Most small business owners do not make a ton of money. So a few tax perks here and there sometimes keep them from giving up. Doctors represent less than.

You have to create and environment that spawns creativity and NEW business ….. It is sad to read the comments here and understand that some mindless brainwashed government serfs think that I am a tax cheat for doing so.

Makes me think of the advertising pictures I seen in the bank depositing cash — declaring my income no less yesterday of all the mindless hipsters celebrating debt.

Plus, a nurse practitioner will work 40 hours a week. Anything overtime is paid at time and a half. I would say 80 hours is the average.

You are wasting your time. The corrupted headstrong lie-berals have already decided on this one. They are intentionally arrogant, part of the game folks, part of the game to show you the upper middle class your place.

Caleb Landry on But if you make times more than they take home watch out: She did not get back a penny of that money. I know a lot of other teachers who complain about having to spend their own money on classroom supplies too.

Can the ambulance driver mortgage his house to get over PTSD too? Because I know a couple of them that would consider it.

The big money is. Wake up folks, ya think the next election matters? Spend your time wisely on work arounds. Try and stay one step ahead. Earnings are worth less due to never ending tax increases.

Houses are worth less due to price killing measures. Everything you buy today will be cheaper tomorrow. This seems to be what happens when interest rates rise.

I think a possible workaround to continue sharing income with your spouse is to divorce and then remarry. Most Family and divorce law would would allow the spouse to take ownership of half the business.

He does have some strong qualities. Try it for yourself then…. I am buckling down to try and pull the fat from the fire for my retirement. I have a bunch of carry forward RRSP room and with some fancy footwork, this might work.

Brave and uninformed opinion here. I am keeping my powder dry for a while as the markets will slide, in particular the Dow. Much of what we have seen in terms of its gains since November 8 are due only to the Trump Bump and his proclaimed legislative agenda.

First and foremost was the lowering of corporate taxes. He will fail completely on all of his legislative initiatives and folks are waking up to that.

With lack of restraint of the public purse by any party, will this not lead to crankiness about how much one has to pay for it? Lack of confidence in a leader and their policies does not yield in a desire to pay more taxes.

As much as I like Trudeau for his socially progressive ideas, electing a former teacher was a mistake. Trudeau had everything handed to him via his father.

Just a suggestion Garth. By the way JAKE, higher taxation is going to get worse, not just in Canada, but everywhere in the G-7, and it has nothing to do with political party , and everything to do macro economics.

At some point revenues will have to catch up to expenditures, then presto, you have appropriate levels of taxation.

Canada is from public servants and for public servants. It is a communist country where entrepreneurs were allowed to setup shops. Jake — Cool story, bro.

Canada looks more like a developing country. We do low end outsourced functions for multi-national corporations, and we sell resources, but besides that its not like we have a bunch of multi-national corporations based here.

Corporations that already play within the rules will not affected. Sorry Garth, everyone should pay their equal share. Imagine if that happened to your paycheque, or if your RRSPs were suddenly made taxable.

The biggest issue with these proposed changes is that once government singles out a group for alleged fiscal benefits, they are opening the proverbial box of Pandora.

How more changes will be coming? Who would expand an existing business let alone start a new business with the very real threat of a government looking for ways to increase taxation on the profits of that business?

Not every single Province doing their own thing. The physicians, nurses and staff would be paid according to a set federal tariff.

ALL Doctors are paid from one single employer as it is now. Why give them the option to setup a corporation to avoid taxation.

Just pay the Docs their fair wage according to a competitive pay scale. The Feds are just creating more problems with their proposed tax changes.

This could have been addressed allot quieter and within the group of tax payers who are affected by this. One bright spot for you guys..

So each year the government decides to give each other generous salary increases. But the only people that have money to tax to pay for those increases, are the government workers and subcontractors.

Do you know why average Canadians decide to quit being wage slaves to major corporations and the government? This reminds me of the same change the Conservatives did where they allowed income splitting for households where one spouse earns the lion share of the income.

The Liberals were quick to remove that when they got into power but now they are bringing back the much less palatable version where everyone gets taxed!

Like everyone on here, I want a fair solution and I saw the equity in the way the Cons did it. I feel like that was a simpler and better approach.

This solution is too complicated and over-reliant on bureaucracy. One of the biggest shorts in history currently developing down in California.

Not sure if people can see this. There is no way in this universe that they can ever make even a dime of profit. There is just no way.

The most massive tech wreck in the last 20 years is spinning up into the mother of all crashes. Typical right wing cheapskate ahole. Yes, I have a corp.

I do split income with wife, who is taking care of home but she had to give up her job so now there is a spot in the market for someone else to take it.

We are considering she will go and work again if we have to pay more taxes. It is a nonsense proposal from this government. You are right — I conflated residents with hospitalist physicians and that was a mistake.

There is no comparison between NPs and residents. Totally different setups, roles, and responsibilities.

They have woefully underestimated how many people this will effect, and consequently woefully underestimated the effect on the economy.

This will be a burden on far more than just the professionals, doctors, lawyers, accountants, as they have currently predicted. To act on this scale without knowing the impact that it will have just shows an incompetence that no Canadian Government before them had, with regards to taxation.

Because contractors and small businesses do not have pensions, etc. This was both legal and intentional. Now the government is suddenly saying that they are going to tax those incorporations at the highest marginal personal tax rates.

Your retirement savings would be effectively decreased by a little more than half. That is why entrepreneurs, professionals, and contractors are understandably upset.

I derive great satisfaction from the fact that I have not paid income tax in Canada in many years and never will again. What I find bizarre is the Stockholm-Syndrome weirdos actually applauding this.

How pathetic and frightened does your life have to be to think that trying to take from the bold so the mediocre can prosper, is a positive thing?

But when a government is overspending by tens of billions a year, they can look elsewhere for their spending money, thanks.

You have my sympathies. This will not end well for the government or the country. Smoking Man nailed it: They just leave, find ways to overcome the measures, or stop trying.

Just come out of the closet, already! I am a partner in a small incorporated business in the U. S and planning to remarry soon. To all other small business owners who bemoan the unfairness of it all, take a good look around.

There are so many young people trying to stitch together a life working 2 or 3 part time jobs, in areas where prices have gone through the roof.

They have zero chance of ever getting ahead. Ask yourself, you miserly AND ignorant few, where you would rather live, in the U.

S or in Switzerland, Sweden, Denmark? There is tremendous social cost if you choose the U. And remember, too, that the lower federal and state tax is often recouped through higher property taxes.

By all means, move to the U. S and enjoy living in a country with a death penalty, private prisons and a national debt that is unsustainable and consider the consequences.

I have no issue with them making more — but if I cannot sprinkle my income among my kids and spouse, nobody should.

Such a load of crap on here today. I left years ago….. In the past ten years alone I have been in Texas and Thailand…fantastic lifestyle.

I have lost friends and relatives over pool shots and beach resorts. Life is so much better elsewhere…. I going to Malta next….. Thank you Garth for highlighting the lack of consultation and for raising the awareness.

I sent a message to Bill. Imagine an announcement few year down the road, some other schmuck maybe the same one comes on TV one evening and says:.

It is gone folks. Depends what you mean by arbitrary. If you mean that the Government did not think this out then I disagree….

If you mean that it was arbitrary by virtue of the fact that there was insufficient public debate then I think that is a fair point. The Libs likely saw an easy win with voters and wanted this implemented quickly to avoid the angry lobbying of those with vested interests…..

You are one smart boomer kid. I have my own business with employees and most businesses I know run on small margins. As I said before every action has a reaction.

Same like — a lot of companies laid off workers and never hired them back afterwards. Time will tell but I have already let go 2 employees.

Makes the other people work harder if they want to keep their jobs. You are living a pipe dream if you think more taxation and cost for businesses is going to make business owners take more risk in order to keep their existing lifestyle.

From all the comments on this topic — the conclusion that I draw from the people who are happy with T2 and Morneu is that they are jealous that their employers are making a lot more money than them so yes — go ahead and tax them more but do not have the guts or the capability to start their own ventures would rather stay an employee while hoping that they make same as what their employer does.

As an employee, you need businesses and employers around or you will be out of a job. So think twice before hoping that your employer makes less money because that petty mindset will cost you dear in the long run.

Maybe Garth can run a poll here -would you hire T2. I did hear he dances pretty well at the events. Does the strategy of setting up a separate family management company to pay your children add a little extra complexity to the strategy?

But no more complexity than having to withhold and submit payroll tax. And if you have multiple children, the cost savings can be significant.

Is this an aggressive tax strategy? Remember, the tax courts agree that individuals have the right to strategically use the tax code to their advantage and lower their tax burden.

The key is to have a qualified tax strategist set up the plan and show you the rules to follow. Then, as long as you document everything carefully, there is nothing to fear when using legitimate tax strategies.

These are the people Mike on Switzerland, Sweden, Danmark, Germany all have family taxation. Only person who employee that front desk and nurse is the clinic owner.

Clinic owners are small or big business in real. But is employed by clinic owner. Keep hearing that Dr. These are real people.

The more liberal the society the less we say that. In some cases it is simply unacceptable to say that so we never do. No shelter from the rain in this hermit hovel.

Taxation is the opposite of that. Other people need it more than you. The more liberal the government, the more money they will transfer from those that can to those who need with the ultimate left leaning form of government being communism from each according to their ability to each according to their need.

Communist societies usually have little to no production of goods because why bother if the government is just going to take everything you produce and give it to those in need?

So the question is always how much can we force the hermit to become civilized and give away some of her stuff to those in need?

The principle breaks down of course if you have a hermit who is a global citizen, with an education recognized around the world and who is very mobile.

Nice try…but YOU missed the point. Sweden has very high income tax, as does Switzerland, Germany, etc…all civilized societies.

There is a lot of political pressure here to make it more difficult to get these visas. If you go the H1B route, you have to contend with the massive lottery in place.

Not every applicant is guaranteed an H1B. You could spend years just getting one of those, if at all. Is that on average? Have you actually achieved US permanent residency?

They are, along with other public sector union members, the biggest opportunists around. California, Ontario, Illinois etc are in deep financial straights because of their ilk.

I suggest you check out what they can make in California. Farming, fishing, and natural resource extraction are all far more dangerous. Thank a farmer who feeds you, not a public sector union member who racks up his pension to obscene levels by claiming tons of pointless overtime.

Thank you once again for showcasing to the world, and especially to our neighbours down south, how a glorious, progressive and forward-thinking nation built on social justice, gender parity and carbon taxes thrives.

We dodged the GFC. Our housing market is insatiable. Our cities are world class and everyone wants to find refuge here. Nothing can stop us now. How about they tax the middle class LESS!

It scares me how many geniuses approves of this! Try 2x or 3x that. No contractor that I know of takes cheques who even uses them these days or credit cards.

Contractors are paid in cash. A friend ran an aesthetic studio for years. Yup, facials, pedis, etc, all expensed on company credit cards.

It is not the critic who counts; not the man who points out how the strong man stumbles, or where the doer of deeds could have done them better.

The credit belongs to the man who is actually in the arena, whose face is marred by dust and sweat and blood; who strives valiantly; who errs, who comes short again and again, because there is no effort without error and shortcoming; but who does actually strive to do the deeds; who knows great enthusiasms, the great devotions; who spends himself in a worthy cause; who at the best knows in the end the triumph of high achievement, and who at the worst, if he fails, at least fails while daring greatly, so that his place shall never be with those cold and timid souls who neither know victory nor defeat.

The squeeze is on for Canadians. More and more all the time. This is also getting more and more interesting. There is many very clever people out there.

Accountants complaining about their clients being unfairly treated. That is a laugh. Talk about unbiased opinion. I praised Bill for having the guts to put things correctly with a level playing field.

Who do you think pays for all our wonderful social programs!!! As for making it look like the entrepreneur is making minimum wage like his employees, some are making much more so screw that argument.

You have holes in every one of your points and it shows. A strong middle class is key. Corporate loop holes do not make a level playing field.

Any consulting contract with federal or provincial governments, either direct or through an authorized agency specially these that require RFQ and RFP requires by law incorporation as independent consultant.

This comes with lawyers fees, independent liability insurance, lots of liability actually, provision of tools at own expenses etc.

The same for doctors and professional corporations. The additional expenses and nature of these Businesses as well as the lack of benefits requires incorporation.

The very suggestion that corporations are established in order to avoid taxes are laughable and Bill M knows it.

The disturbing part is that they go beyond that, they want to tell the owners of small private corporations to whom and how much to pay in salaries.

Bill M and Trudope buddies. There is no increase in taxes for stock options again not to distress Bill M and Trudope buddies. Mister fairness does not say a word about the lack of capital gains taxes on private residences.

As for the general lie-beral depending on handouts public: That will be outsourced to big companies Like the one that screwed the Obama Care health site a big Canadian company due to lack of competence so they were booted out and Accenture had to fix the miss.

Other people not in a corporate holding situation, but just a regular cottage owner must rent the cottage, take out a business license, do all the proper accounting for the rental in order to get just a few legitimate costs tax reduced.

Mir ray is finally levelling the tax field. The families within corporate writeoffs get way too much money compared to to families not within that particular structure.

Not sure why people get so excited over this. Canada is a socialist wasteland. Anyone with ambition goes to the USA. Never has never will. Disgusted to see the disdain of some posters trolls applauding the upcoming tax grab.

A big side effect will be the talented leaving and the underground economy growing. You do realize that we are already taxed to the hilt with income, property and sales taxes.

Self-employed people generate and pay plenty of tax already. A lot of hand wringing, drooling, jealous readers coming out of the woodwork to comment on this post.

You are a accountant in the U. Remember who accountants are working for. Not the average Joe. By federal law, all accountants have as their primary client the CRA, not the taxpayer.

This is why tax lawyers are thriving, since only they can promise confidentiality and a duty of care. Perhaps the tax rate for all small business owners ought to be lowered.

However, keeping in tax loopholes creates two classes of people: It seems in total opposition to conservative values to say that people who are less scrupulous ought to be taxed less.

If what you really want is to promote people to get into small business, then create a specific small business tax deduction and incentivize creating small businesses rather than lying on your taxes.

Years ago in Copenhagen on business, I asked some quite wealthy acquaintances why there were so few expensive vehicles there.

They all loved cars and a few had vintage cars in their garages. Both sides of this debate are whiners. Sure, there are tax loophole cheats a-plenty.

But there are also lazy, unambitious weed-monkeys a-plenty. Any economic system based solely on greed will ultimately fail. The only solution is the same one that I started with on this blog many years ago: Stop electing banker puppets.

Everything else is noise. Who is it borrowing from? Why are these questions never asked and therefore never answered? Well, I know why.

Loose thousands of jobs, and votes. Liberals need to look in the mirror. You are the problem. Smokey has Right idea. Sell everything, leave observe from the beach.

Wife and I are thinking about it. Year end in September. Accountant and I will long discussions. Could someone smarter than me clear up a simple question:.

If they do go ahead and tax investment income on retained corporate earnings… does this apply to new investments only after , or ALL investments held by the corporation, past and future?

By the time the lawyer gets the file the damage has already been done. The tax filings are the tax filings.

The CRA has those. Most people cannot do sophisticated tax filings using lawyers alone. Accordingly, once the CRA is on to you you are as good as screwed.

The government has stiffled big business ….. Where are we all going to work? And if they do well …. The nay Sayers all have the same opportunity …..

Most small business owners do not make a ton of money. So a few tax perks here and there sometimes keep them from giving up. Doctors represent less than.

You have to create and environment that spawns creativity and NEW business ….. It is sad to read the comments here and understand that some mindless brainwashed government serfs think that I am a tax cheat for doing so.

Makes me think of the advertising pictures I seen in the bank depositing cash — declaring my income no less yesterday of all the mindless hipsters celebrating debt.

Plus, a nurse practitioner will work 40 hours a week. Anything overtime is paid at time and a half. I would say 80 hours is the average.

You are wasting your time. The corrupted headstrong lie-berals have already decided on this one. They are intentionally arrogant, part of the game folks, part of the game to show you the upper middle class your place.

Caleb Landry on But if you make times more than they take home watch out: She did not get back a penny of that money. I know a lot of other teachers who complain about having to spend their own money on classroom supplies too.

Can the ambulance driver mortgage his house to get over PTSD too? Because I know a couple of them that would consider it.

The big money is. Wake up folks, ya think the next election matters? Spend your time wisely on work arounds. Try and stay one step ahead.

Earnings are worth less due to never ending tax increases. Houses are worth less due to price killing measures.

Everything you buy today will be cheaper tomorrow. This seems to be what happens when interest rates rise. I think a possible workaround to continue sharing income with your spouse is to divorce and then remarry.

Most Family and divorce law would would allow the spouse to take ownership of half the business. He does have some strong qualities.

Try it for yourself then…. I am buckling down to try and pull the fat from the fire for my retirement. I have a bunch of carry forward RRSP room and with some fancy footwork, this might work.

Brave and uninformed opinion here. I am keeping my powder dry for a while as the markets will slide, in particular the Dow.

Much of what we have seen in terms of its gains since November 8 are due only to the Trump Bump and his proclaimed legislative agenda.

First and foremost was the lowering of corporate taxes. He will fail completely on all of his legislative initiatives and folks are waking up to that.

With lack of restraint of the public purse by any party, will this not lead to crankiness about how much one has to pay for it?

Lack of confidence in a leader and their policies does not yield in a desire to pay more taxes. As much as I like Trudeau for his socially progressive ideas, electing a former teacher was a mistake.

Trudeau had everything handed to him via his father. Just a suggestion Garth. By the way JAKE, higher taxation is going to get worse, not just in Canada, but everywhere in the G-7, and it has nothing to do with political party , and everything to do macro economics.

At some point revenues will have to catch up to expenditures, then presto, you have appropriate levels of taxation. Canada is from public servants and for public servants.

It is a communist country where entrepreneurs were allowed to setup shops. Jake — Cool story, bro.

Canada looks more like a developing country. We do low end outsourced functions for multi-national corporations, and we sell resources, but besides that its not like we have a bunch of multi-national corporations based here.

Corporations that already play within the rules will not affected. Sorry Garth, everyone should pay their equal share. Imagine if that happened to your paycheque, or if your RRSPs were suddenly made taxable.

The biggest issue with these proposed changes is that once government singles out a group for alleged fiscal benefits, they are opening the proverbial box of Pandora.

How more changes will be coming? Who would expand an existing business let alone start a new business with the very real threat of a government looking for ways to increase taxation on the profits of that business?

Not every single Province doing their own thing. The physicians, nurses and staff would be paid according to a set federal tariff.

ALL Doctors are paid from one single employer as it is now. Why give them the option to setup a corporation to avoid taxation. Just pay the Docs their fair wage according to a competitive pay scale.

The Feds are just creating more problems with their proposed tax changes. This could have been addressed allot quieter and within the group of tax payers who are affected by this.

One bright spot for you guys.. So each year the government decides to give each other generous salary increases. But the only people that have money to tax to pay for those increases, are the government workers and subcontractors.

Do you know why average Canadians decide to quit being wage slaves to major corporations and the government? This reminds me of the same change the Conservatives did where they allowed income splitting for households where one spouse earns the lion share of the income.

The Liberals were quick to remove that when they got into power but now they are bringing back the much less palatable version where everyone gets taxed!

Like everyone on here, I want a fair solution and I saw the equity in the way the Cons did it. I feel like that was a simpler and better approach.

This solution is too complicated and over-reliant on bureaucracy. One of the biggest shorts in history currently developing down in California.

Not sure if people can see this. There is no way in this universe that they can ever make even a dime of profit.

There is just no way. The most massive tech wreck in the last 20 years is spinning up into the mother of all crashes. Typical right wing cheapskate ahole.

Yes, I have a corp. I do split income with wife, who is taking care of home but she had to give up her job so now there is a spot in the market for someone else to take it.

We are considering she will go and work again if we have to pay more taxes. It is a nonsense proposal from this government.

You are right — I conflated residents with hospitalist physicians and that was a mistake. There is no comparison between NPs and residents.

Totally different setups, roles, and responsibilities. They have woefully underestimated how many people this will effect, and consequently woefully underestimated the effect on the economy.

This will be a burden on far more than just the professionals, doctors, lawyers, accountants, as they have currently predicted. To act on this scale without knowing the impact that it will have just shows an incompetence that no Canadian Government before them had, with regards to taxation.

Because contractors and small businesses do not have pensions, etc. This was both legal and intentional. Now the government is suddenly saying that they are going to tax those incorporations at the highest marginal personal tax rates.

Your retirement savings would be effectively decreased by a little more than half. That is why entrepreneurs, professionals, and contractors are understandably upset.

I derive great satisfaction from the fact that I have not paid income tax in Canada in many years and never will again.

What I find bizarre is the Stockholm-Syndrome weirdos actually applauding this. How pathetic and frightened does your life have to be to think that trying to take from the bold so the mediocre can prosper, is a positive thing?

But when a government is overspending by tens of billions a year, they can look elsewhere for their spending money, thanks.

You have my sympathies. This will not end well for the government or the country. Smoking Man nailed it: They just leave, find ways to overcome the measures, or stop trying.

Just come out of the closet, already! I am a partner in a small incorporated business in the U. S and planning to remarry soon.

To all other small business owners who bemoan the unfairness of it all, take a good look around. There are so many young people trying to stitch together a life working 2 or 3 part time jobs, in areas where prices have gone through the roof.

They have zero chance of ever getting ahead. Ask yourself, you miserly AND ignorant few, where you would rather live, in the U.

S or in Switzerland, Sweden, Denmark? There is tremendous social cost if you choose the U. And remember, too, that the lower federal and state tax is often recouped through higher property taxes.

By all means, move to the U. S and enjoy living in a country with a death penalty, private prisons and a national debt that is unsustainable and consider the consequences.

I have no issue with them making more — but if I cannot sprinkle my income among my kids and spouse, nobody should. Such a load of crap on here today.

I left years ago….. In the past ten years alone I have been in Texas and Thailand…fantastic lifestyle. I have lost friends and relatives over pool shots and beach resorts.

Life is so much better elsewhere…. I going to Malta next….. Thank you Garth for highlighting the lack of consultation and for raising the awareness.

I sent a message to Bill. Imagine an announcement few year down the road, some other schmuck maybe the same one comes on TV one evening and says:.

It is gone folks. Depends what you mean by arbitrary. If you mean that the Government did not think this out then I disagree….

If you mean that it was arbitrary by virtue of the fact that there was insufficient public debate then I think that is a fair point.

The Libs likely saw an easy win with voters and wanted this implemented quickly to avoid the angry lobbying of those with vested interests….. You are one smart boomer kid.

I have my own business with employees and most businesses I know run on small margins. As I said before every action has a reaction. Same like — a lot of companies laid off workers and never hired them back afterwards.

Time will tell but I have already let go 2 employees. Makes the other people work harder if they want to keep their jobs.

You are living a pipe dream if you think more taxation and cost for businesses is going to make business owners take more risk in order to keep their existing lifestyle.

From all the comments on this topic — the conclusion that I draw from the people who are happy with T2 and Morneu is that they are jealous that their employers are making a lot more money than them so yes — go ahead and tax them more but do not have the guts or the capability to start their own ventures would rather stay an employee while hoping that they make same as what their employer does.

As an employee, you need businesses and employers around or you will be out of a job. So think twice before hoping that your employer makes less money because that petty mindset will cost you dear in the long run.

Maybe Garth can run a poll here -would you hire T2. I did hear he dances pretty well at the events. Does the strategy of setting up a separate family management company to pay your children add a little extra complexity to the strategy?

But no more complexity than having to withhold and submit payroll tax. And if you have multiple children, the cost savings can be significant.

Is this an aggressive tax strategy? Remember, the tax courts agree that individuals have the right to strategically use the tax code to their advantage and lower their tax burden.

The key is to have a qualified tax strategist set up the plan and show you the rules to follow. Then, as long as you document everything carefully, there is nothing to fear when using legitimate tax strategies.

These are the people Mike on Switzerland, Sweden, Danmark, Germany all have family taxation. Only person who employee that front desk and nurse is the clinic owner.

Clinic owners are small or big business in real. But is employed by clinic owner. Keep hearing that Dr. These are real people.

The more liberal the society the less we say that. In some cases it is simply unacceptable to say that so we never do.

No shelter from the rain in this hermit hovel. Taxation is the opposite of that. Other people need it more than you. The more liberal the government, the more money they will transfer from those that can to those who need with the ultimate left leaning form of government being communism from each according to their ability to each according to their need.

Communist societies usually have little to no production of goods because why bother if the government is just going to take everything you produce and give it to those in need?

So the question is always how much can we force the hermit to become civilized and give away some of her stuff to those in need? The principle breaks down of course if you have a hermit who is a global citizen, with an education recognized around the world and who is very mobile.

Nice try…but YOU missed the point. Sweden has very high income tax, as does Switzerland, Germany, etc…all civilized societies.

Those who want to avoid fair taxation by moving to a third world country, like the U. S, have to be prepared for all of the social ills that go along with being an unjust society, including their abominable health care system.

If your taxes are low and your food is cheap, where you choose to live, someone is getting screwed over and that could easily show up in crime stats, social unrest.

My guess is the opposite. Why work so much, when you keep less. If Trump can ever get lower business taxes passed or anything for that matter why would a company want to operate in Canada with a rising tax burden?

Just hoping when it blows up someone will actually be able to pay me. The options pricing is nutty. By my calculations, the product cannot be produced for under around 60K US per unit.

This is going to blow sky high. Receptionists are employed by clinic owner, not doctor. Maybe one off, but mostly the clinic owner- not doctor.

If you dont know how it works, dont comment. I personally know people who work in the system, including clinic owners who are real businesses i agree and should get all tax benefits of running business.

But not individual doctors who just exploit it. They are not small businesses. There is not fair taxation. Fair is subjective and I won;t accept it when it comes from you or Bill M.

There is just taxation, i. Switzerland has very low taxes. It is a capitalist country. Top health care in the world.

The nicest place on earth is not BC but Switzerland. Germany has higher taxes for individuals but much lower for families.

Education is free, you have excellent health care, good pension, nobody works on the weekend, laid back culture where drinking beer in public is not a crime.

Denmark is expensive with highest taxes but again you get everything you need. For none of the 3 countries above I have not heard about a single case where: A smart person can not complete university 2.

Retirement is mission impossible as is health care how are these waiting times working in Ontario?

People live in glass condos, moldy basements. Just a thought… ————————— You are so dumb. So if I wait a long time in line at the DMW for my renewal sticker, reducing the pay of the staff that services me will make them work harder??

What clinics are you talking about? If you work at a hospital as a doctor, you have salary. Many family doctors have nurses.

Both are quite entertaining. The Northern Circus is all about love, love , love, peace and pass me that joint! All the time your wallet is being raped by some smiling circus clown who will do selfies with you while he is screwing you.

At the same time your asking yourself WTF did I actually vote for this clown! The Southern Circus is all about hate, hate, hate war, and pass me that ammo!

This orange coloured clown smiles a lot and tells you lies while you can actually see the truth behind him in living colour.

When the truth behind him contradicts his lies he just lies more and smiles. Either way they are both scary circuses.

I call it out. My close friend is a doctor single so no chance of family paychecks, is all for Morneau rules. He has no receptionist on his payroll.

None of the doctors in the clinic he works has any receptionist on their payroll. And we will be the biggest producer and exporter of transgender washrooms in the world, pretty good Business Eh?

My stance on the hiring of T2: He would not get pass the resume pile and will get tossed aside. Too full of himself. I think living under union protection and off taxpayers money may have affected what happens in the real world.

I would suggest be forceful so that they give you the true answer. Tell them that you thieves are just not paying your fair share of taxes.

Make sure that the prescription receipt is signed off at the end. I think T3 has more than enough qualification and experience to be hired as a quality tester QA for the weed companies.

I burst out laughing. Spouses that never stepped foot in the office. Hundreds of thousands of unreported income. Yeah, they took a lot of risk and worked long, profitless hours to get started.

They earned their millions, but a spade is a cheating spade and this legislation will claw some of that back. Hey wait a minute.

Maybe this is part of nafta. We get the illegal immigants and refugees from the usa and they get our doctors lawyers and anyone else who has any ambition to succeed from us?

Trudeaus negotiating skills are showing…. Was it that good ol Maggie Thatcher that said something like the thing about others people money is that eventually you run out of it?

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