Thursday, November 03, 2005

The word around town was that the Hummers weren't moving. It looked like high gas prices and a White House reversal on fuel conservation meant that fewer "W" bumper stickers would find their exposed sticky sides mating gloriously with the smooth rear bumper of an H2, somewhere between the tow loop and the access hole for a Class 3 hitch.We were skeptical at first. Sources can be unreliable, but the scuttlebutt was that inventory had been building for months now and the local Hummer dealer had panicked. He had begun storing his Hummer inventory at an undisclosed location, far from the dealer showroom so as not to spook jittery, prospective buyers with the mounting number of unsold H2s and H3s.

When an anonymous caller phoned in with the location, we were off. "The rear parking lot of the Hyatt Westlake Plaza Hotel", he said, just before the line went dead.

TMTGM investigative sleuths Erik Ustin and Ray Pizzuti grabbed your still somewhat skeptical editor, and after stopping at Human Resources to pick up a few "half-off at Togo's" coupons we scurried past security, through the main entrance, and out to the parking lot.

A security guard spotted us and yelled, "Hey you three, stop right there!"

"One of you didn't scan out! Get back here and run your badge past the scanner again and make sure it beeps this time!"

ooo

OK, we're not sure where this was headed or how long and how silly it would be enroute, so we'll just get to it. The Hummer dealer in this part of Southern California is apparently having trouble moving his merchandise. After a row of Hummers was spotted behind the Hyatt Hotel, three of us went on a reconnaissance mission to find out more. Here's the first picture we snapped:

Click to enlarge

Doesn't look like much - about 25 H3s in the far corner of the parking lot, and the next aisle over was pretty much the same. But then when we came around the corner we saw this:

Click to enlarge ... really, click it

That's a lot of Hummers, all H3s, lined up neatly waiting for someone to take them home and love them. Looking to the right there were more, so we walked all the way down to the end of the row and snapped this picture:

Click to enlarge ... now here, we will insist - click it and make it bigger

That's the same view as the previous picture, just taken from about 30 Hummers further down to the right. Behind this hotel were about 150 Hummers - about 80 in this row alone - almost all H3s, along with eight or ten original H1s.

A police car drove by slowly - surely he wondered why we were taking pictures and laughing, but then he looked closer, recognized the unthreatening physiques of three software engineers, spotted our badges, and quickly lost interest.

Someone from the dealership pulled in with another H3, so we wandered over and asked how business was these days. He said something about hurricanes and gas prices, then we asked where the H2s were. He said, "They're at the other lot".

Hmmm...

Thrilled and amused as we were, we'd only learned part of the story. After getting directions we proceeded to lot #2, while placing a few quick bets with an over/under quickly set at 60. The thinking here was that the despite looking like a Jeep Cherokee on steroids, the H3s were about $20K less expensive than the H2s and had respectable fuel economy (16 city / 19 highway is what the sticker said) - maybe the dealer had just placed a very large, poorly timed order, a few months back.

Surely the H2 inventory was under control.

Pulling into lot #2, the "under" looked liked it would be the clear winner - forty, fifty tops, from the first looks of it:

Click to enlarge ... this one's up to you

Then we walked down to the end of the aisle to see this:

Click to enlarge ... go for it

That's about fifty H2s on the left, and a bit of congestion in the middle as the Hummers appear to be entering the lot at a rate far exceeding the rate at which they leave. After walking down to the end of this aisle we spied another aisle of about the same length stretching around the corner:

Click to enlarge ... again, we will insist, make it bigger

When the counting was done, there were about 150 H2s in lot #2, for a grand total of around three hundred Hummers, just looking for someone to love them. In the above picture notice the attendant and the red 5-gallon gas cans - based on a brief conversation with this young man, we didn't sense any love from him.

Apparently the thrill of driving Hummers back and forth between the remote storage lot and the dealer showroom wears off quickly, as each round trip requires that another five gallons of fuel be dispensed in order to ensure a complete round trip.

We've talked about SUVs in these pages before, having developed a California SUV Fill Up Index which we then updated as gas prices in this area hit $2.80 and then $2.90 per gallon. What a person drives or how much fuel they consume matters little to us, so long as they leave some gas at the pumps for others and don't run us over on the freeway.

The reason that the story of rapidly rising Hummer inventory is so interesting and so amusing, is that America's most ostentatious Sport Utility Vehicle, the Hummer SUV, is a metaphor for America in the world today - overweight, overpriced, inefficient, and unloved.

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UPDATE (11/5/2005 - 7:35 AM PST):

As discussed in the comments section, the following statement is incorrect:

"Apparently the thrill of driving Hummers back and forth between the remote storage lot and the dealer showroom wears off quickly, as each round trip requires that another five gallons of fuel be dispensed in order to ensure a complete round trip."

The remote lots are between one and two miles from the showroom, so five gallons of gas would provide many round trips for both an H2 and H3. It's not clear why the thrill had worn off - it had something to do with the gas cans.

An update to this story will be posted later today and a link will be provided here.

GM seems to get some things wrong:GM to boost Hummer H3, Truck OutputDETROIT (Reuters) - General Motors Corp. on Thursday said it will invest about $20 million in its Shreveport, Louisiana, truck assembly plant to increase production of the Hummer H3 sport utility vehicle and Chevrolet Colorado and GMC Canyon mid-size pickups.The plant will add a third production shift to its paint shop in the first quarter of 2006 to prepare for increased production, the world's largest automaker said.Sales of the Colorado and Canyon have fallen steadily over the last three months, with Colorado sales slumping 41.7 percent in October and Canyon sales off 33.1 percent.Still, on a year-to-date basis, Colorado sales have risen 17.6 percent while Canyon sales have soared 42.6 percent.GM's total recent investments in Shreveport for all three vehicles top more than $1 billion, the company said in a statement.

I'm seeing much the same thing when I drive around the westside and valley past the "offsite lots" used by many of the dealers. The ones at the Santa Monica Airport are full, as is also the case over at Van Nuys.

The lines at the local "cheap" gas station are still very long as well. In the past, you didn't see as many westsiders lining up to save a few percent. At $3 per gallon for premium, that small differential is apparently worth it.

I find it ironic that GM can find a market for these things, maybe not now, while telling me that there is no market for an electric vehicle for my daily driving.So, if I WANT TO drive a 4-8mpg vehicle I can. But if I WANT TO drive an electric/alternative fuel vehicle, I have to build my own.

I always get off on how "Hummer" has been longtime gay sex slang for licking another guy's butthole, and the dorks you see driving them are all a bunch of fat, mustachioed homophobes who listen to Sean Hannity!!!

Very nice, I hate it when I see a 90 pound lady with bleach blond hair and a huge 5 carat diamond driving in 2 lanes talking on her cell phone while drinking a mohca from starbucks on the way to work. It's so 1998.

Thanks for my best laugh of the day, if not the week or month. I have a friend that bought an H3 and I've told him it's ugly and ostentatious, but to each their own. They apparently can barely afford their other bills, yet they bought a car that was close to 30k. Durrrrr.

A perfect place for the H@...sitting in a parking lot. Maybe the posers that buy them realied just how useless a 6000 pound Tahoe really is...go anywhere? Yeah, RIGHT! Maybe the H3 has some capablity, but the H2 is one of the biggest jokes in the off-road world.

You would think these gentlemen would maybe take the route of trying to get rid of them to other places instead of hiding them. what a waste of time and effort. i hope someone got fired for the screw up.

I always get off on how "Hummer" has been longtime gay sex slang for licking another guy's butthole, and the dorks you see driving them are all a bunch of fat, mustachioed homophobes who listen to Sean Hannity!!!

I hate to burst your bubble, but you've got your sex slang confused. Licking someone's butthole is called a rimmer, not a hummer... and it's not just gay men who do such things. A hummer is slang for head. Again, not limited to gay men.

I hate Hummers and everything they stand for (which is exurbia, fat overweight Americans who don't believe in responsibility, a materialistic and consumerist society who buys 10 room houses for 2 people, believes in wanton wasting, and doesnt' save for retirement and expects the gov't to bail them out)

I know they are selling around here, and each time I see one I make sure the driver can see my middle finger as they pass by acting like they own the whole road.

Great post. I laughed out how bizarre this scene looked, then I cried when I realized- either way- we're all going to have to absorb the costs of so many gas guzzling-inspired peoples out there. Shame on our America for excess!

Wow, another blog used for blatent misinformation. Its about a mile from the dealer to the lot. There are of course a lot of car dealers in the Thousand Oaks Auto Mall, many of which use those parking lots to store cars at. I worked at the building in picture one for 4 years. Also, over the last few years, the TO Auto Mall has been undergoing massive construction, which dealership rebuilds and facelifts, taking away lots previoulsy used for storage.

Obviously you dont live anywhere near Thousand Oaks/Westlake Village! This is a very wealthy town and H2's and large SUV's are the norm around here.

You should really find out the facts before posting rants like this to people that would otherwise not have local knowlege of the area to know any better than the deception coming through your keyboard.

I mean, I surfed over to one of the sites you link to, and they showed a bunch of pictures of people sticking their middle fingers out and pointing them at their hummers.

On Remulak, sticking your middle finger out at someone is a sign of love and respect.

So, I guess you must be trying to say that everybody loves and respects the hummer, and to comment on how Greenspan has done such a great job of making them so affordable for everyone to buy, own and drive.

If this really is inventory that the dealer can't move, how much do you want to bet it gets torched by some nameless "ecoterrorist" and the insurance company pays off the dealer to get out the mess they go themselves into.

"And yet when it really hits the fan, who ya' gonna' call? That's right: The United States. And we'll probably deliver the relief supplies in HUMMVEES."

And your point is? Humvees are perfectly fine for use as a military vehicle where no other cars can get thru. How does that have anything to do with them being completely idiotic for everyday civilian driving?

Just drove over to the Hyatt Regency. Sure enough, 250 Hummers, 170 Infinitis, and 45 Hondas. But when I talked to the office workers there and the ground staff, they told me that the lot has been used to hold inventory for over a year, and there's no more or less there than usual. They just bring cars and trucks there, move them to the dealer lot when they get low on that model or need a particular color/option package for a sale, and repeat with new deliveries. Nothing sinister, nothing that indicates any inventory problems today. Each worker from the office building (which houses tech firms and a brokerage office, not dealership employees) told me the same thing.

And by the way, the hotel is just around the corner and over the freeway from the auto mall. Only about a mile trip.

A Bummer For The Hummer Sales are way down Can GM make its hulk less of a gas hog and comfier inside?

Last summer, the Hummer H2 was the hottest thing on four wheels. Buyers eager to get the hulking, militaristic sport-utility vehicle waited months to take delivery and even paid dealers as much as $10,000 on top of theHummer H2 $48,000 sticker price. With profits topping $20,000 per H2, General Motors Corp. (GM ) looked downright clairvoyant for buying the Hummer brand from military contractor AM General Corp. in late 1999. The H2 was a bona fide hit.

Not anymore. Now it looks as if the big beast is starting to lose momentum just as GM is set to start production on its equally pricey pickup version, the H2 SUT, which is due out in June. Plagued by complaints about its abominable fuel economy, cheap interiors, and tiny cabin, the H2 saw sales tumble 33% in January over the previous year, the fifth straight month of declines. In October, GM even cut production. "Selling a Hummer was the easiest job in America," says Los Angeles dealer Howard Drake. "Now it's way harder."

Has Hummer lost its mojo? Not yet, but GM has its work cut out for it. Once on track to sell 40,000 units a year, the auto maker looks headed to move just 30,000 this year. Inventory has risen to 68 days' worth of vehicles -- about average for the industry, but almost triple what dealers carried a year ago. GM is counting heavily on the launch of the smaller, $28,000 to $35,000 H3 next year to boost annual sales to 100,000. To get there, the H3 -- which debuted as a pickup concept in December at the Los Angeles auto show but will appear in '05 as an SUV -- will have to trade on more than combat-truck styling and a macho image.

$50 EVERY 320 MILES. Taking the Hummer mainstream won't be easy. Even when sales were hot, customers had complaints. In a J.D. Power & Associates Initial Quality Survey taken last year, the H2 ranked near the bottom. The biggest gripe: While no one bought a Hummer for the sake of its thrifty gas mileage, its 11 to 13 miles per gallon was even worse than expected. Brian Walters, senior director of vehicle research for J.D. Power, said the firm spoke to owners who bought their Hummers in the fall of 2002. By the time the survey was taken in March, 2003, gas prices had spiked to $1.70 per gallon, forcing H2 owners to shell out more than $50 every 320 miles.

STUCK FOR SPACE. The Hummer's lack of creature comforts is another problem. In a Power study of vehicle appeal conducted last fall, the H2 ranked slightly below average among luxury SUVs. Owners dinged it for having poor rear-window visibility, cheap workmanship inside, and scarce passenger and cargo space. The H2 seats five comfortably, but fitting in a sixth person means squeezing into a jump seat next to the spare tire. And that takes up all of the storage space. Competing luxury SUVs such as the Range Rover, Lincoln Navigator, and Cadillac Escalade are nicer inside and usually have more room.

That's why, for GM, making future Hummers more practical is key. Hummer marketing director Michael C. DiGiovanni says the H2's interior will get a little sprucing up when the SUT comes out, and the H3 will be more plush, too. To improve gas mileage, next year's H3 will use a five-cylinder engine rather than a V8 -- though that will mean less power. As for the gas-guzzling H2, GM may around 2008 have in place a hybrid-electric system and a technology called displacement-on-demand, which saves gas by shutting down four of the engine's eight cylinders when it's cruising at highway speeds.

With sales falling, a year is a long time to wait for the new H3. In the meantime, DiGiovanni is hoping the H2 SUT will provide a lift; the pickup version may seem smaller and a little less menacing to buyers turned off by the size of the H2 SUV. Then with the H3's rollout next year, GM is hoping to attract a whole new class of drivers, including those under 40 for whom the brand has special appeal. The trick will be to tame the Hummer without losing its rugged personality.

What better way to encourage the production of the vehicle you intend to use in New World Order/Project for a New American Century military invasions than to offer a tax credit for 6000-pound vehicles that renders the vehicle almost free with a trade-in?

Unfortunately for the Bush cabal, "you can lead a horse to water, but you can't make him put gas in it." (I think that's a Bush quote.)

GM: Mr. Money Bags Uncle Sam, we 'lost' money because of the hurricane and the bad economy. Something like 12 BILLION DOLLARS and we need this 'deduction'... *wink* *wink*

Bush sez: 'We have to help these patriotic companies that are 'losing' *wink* *wink* money because of the hurricanes. Give them 5 BILLION DOLLARS for every ONE BILLION they lost due to the *wink* *wink* hurricanes... They 'deserve it'.. *wink* *wink*

GM ends up with 75 BILLION DOLLARS, a fat (H-U-G-E) government contract to 'up armor' these homeless Hummers and 35 MILLION (more) children are tossed off the school 'lunch' program, 55 MILLION (more) people are kicked off the food stamp program, 30 MILLION (more) seniors are kicked out of Medicare and 1.5 MILLION (more) soldiers in the military lose their healthcare, their 'combat pay', three quarters of their already sub-standard pension and the 'hard working' congress people get a raise...

It amazes me how much glee the self righteous do-gooders derive from their hope that an American company is falling on hard times. All this because they don't like one of their products. Tens of thousands of people and their families depend on these jobs. These are folks just like you and me. I hope you sniveling little malcontents are proud of yourselves. I'm just glad to live in a country where we have so many choices. I think the Hummer is rather silly myself but would defend to the death their right to buy them, just I would your right to drive your stupid little gutless hybrids. I'll stick with my Corvette. Now you can all hate me for that too. Have fun with it and enjoy wallowing in your envy of those who have something better to do with their lives than to whine about everything.

Think how many jobs could be created by building the fuel-efficient cars that people are on wait-lists to buy. Hybrids can't be made fast enough and alternative fuel vehicles--especially if economies of scale can make each one cheaper--would make a RESPONSIBLE car company a lot of money. The Japanese and Germans will once again (as they did in the 70s and 80s) wipe out the Big Three. At least they build their cars in the USA, now, so Americans will still have jobs.

This is just disgusting. The genius Thomas Friedman was right, if Toyota took over GM, America would once again be beautiful, Americans in the south would be employed with great jobs, and millions of retires in the north can be given these hummers to live in as mobile homes. Talk about the ol' switch-a-roo.

As we blog, Toyota is showing how capable, full framed off road vehicles can be made fuel efficient. Just look at the Land Cruiser, it gets 13/17 mpg city/highway. Compare that to the 16/20 for the H3 and you can save ... shit ... Thomas help ... your formula that says "Toyota = everything good and GM = everything bad" is NOT TRUE!

Wow, what a website full of autofellatic ninnies. Before you get upset at me, I'm just a proud H3 owner (I also have a few other big assed 4x4s) that's a homophobicfuelwastingneedledickedinsecure person. Hey you pocket protector wearing greasy headed treehuggin' doofuses, if you think electric cars are the answer, have you ever thought of what would happen if your dream came true? Who's gonna build all these power plants? The nation's already tapped out for power because YOU ninnies say no to nukes and coal. 80% of the nation's power is being made with natural gas. Do you have any idea as to how perilous a position this puts us in?

This blog is completely fallacious blog is so utterly ridiculous and tended to by such ignorant and intolerant left wing dweebs and is nothing but wishful thinking.

Shoot, I think I'll trade up to an H1 Alpha. You can watch the lane in front of you from underneath my axles.

I am laughing, I am in the Middle East (Government Employee) where gas is around 70 cents a gallon, guess what ALL THEY DRIVE HERE IS, TAHOE's, HUMMERS, SUBURBANS, EXPEDITIONS and any big American, German and Japanese SUV. Actually it is safer here because they drive like crazy. I just gave away my Ford F-150 ( I just ordered a Ford Escape Hybrid). We need to stop depending on this Middle East oil. They have us by the balls with it. They don't care either and they still hate us here. We need to wake up before our third language will be Isalm.

This is funny! I laugh at gas guzzlers. Anyhow, this post belongs on another website, "The Mess that Katrina Made". Katrina drove up energy prices.

Unfortunately, your conclusion stinks. The hummer is a lousy metaphor for America. For inefficient, consider GDP. America ranks high http://www.bls.gov/fls/flsgdp.pdfFor unloved, try talking to people in other countries instead of relying what get's in the headlines of biased media.

For overpriced, consider cost-of-living, NYC is not even in the top 10 world wide http://www.finfacts.com/costofliving.htm.

So the price of gas went up because a lot of "gasoline factories" became stranded due to a natural disaster.

As a result, vehicles that use lots of gas are selling more slowly than normal.

This, you conclude, is a sign that the US economy is in the tank.

Milton Friedman you guys ain't.

Here's another view, based not on voodoo, but on actual knowledge:

Dealers ORDER vehicles from manufacturers, just like the grocery store or the shoe store. Manufacturers don't just jam them down your throat. Not how it works (which you'd know if you had any clue how the world really functions)

So if this dealer has this many vehicles, it's because he ORDERED them. Now, it's entirely possible that the manufacturer discounted them because THEY had a huge surplus, and the dealer made a longer term investment than normal based on very favorable pricing, we just don't know.

But inventory is bought, and this dealer bought those cars on purpose. I know this whole real-world econimics thing is tough for idiots who look at a bunch of cars and figure it means a despearate dealer, but it's a lot more likely it's just a dealer with a lot of cash laying in some inventory at a good rate.

Not to belabor the point the last guy made, but you guys also don't seem to realize how cars end up on dealer lots.

Dealers do not pay for those cars. The cars are financed, either through GMAC or through a bank. It's called "Inventory Financing" (IF) and it's also done at appliance and furniture stores.

So when you drive by a car dealer and look at the cars sitting there, usually none of them (the new ones anyway) belong to him. They belong to a financial institution.

The dealer in those pictures does not "own" those cars. GMAC does. And when manufacturers want to offload inventory, they offer favorable terms, usually something like 6 or even 9 months interest free. (all dealers pay is interest, never principle - they pay they don't pay that until the car is sold).

If you guys really think this dealer has had ten million dollars worth of cars he didn't want and couldn't sell shipped and billed to him by GM you just don't know squat.

This is simply about the wonders of the market and individual consumers responding to changing conditions. The market is working as it should. American consumers are responding in a very intelligent, rational, thoughtful fashion.

What about all those lots with hybrids flying off of them, where dealers can't keep enough of them in stock?

The guys that I feel for are the ones who bought their Hummers last year...think of the discounts available when the dealer is trying to move 300 of these things. The guy with the 2004 model probable paid about $10,000 more than he needed to.

Yes, GM is an American company...but they are building more and more plants in Mexico thus taking jobs away from Americans. It is the "foreign" brands who are in fact building plants in the USA. Take a look at Nissan in Smyrna TN, etc etc...

Lots of comments about free market forces etc. We don't really have free market forces at work because the tax we pay that goes toward road maintenance, national energy infrastructure, and pollution abatement is based on our incomes rather than our usage of our roads. A free market system would have users contribute toward these items based strictly on the impact and usage that they individually account for. Some countries roll all of these costs into their $/gallon of fuel.

If someone wants to drive a Hummer, let 'em...its a free country. But make sure that said owner is paying for their full impact

Big deal. Go check the Verizon parking lot at the corner of TO and Lakeview Canyon. That's the off-site parking for the Honda dealership. They all have off-site parking when they have large inventory. It's not a sign of the apocalypse.

The reason H2s aren't selling is because they're a STUPID vehicle, designed for people who have a lot of money, self-esteem issues, and a lack of common sense. With the exception of trust fund babies and the Hollywood crowd, you don't get the kind of money required to buy an H2 if you're an insecure idiot. I guess, in SoCal at least, the insecure idiot Hollywood/trust fund crowd is saturated.

Tim (the blog owner) said:"each round trip requires that another five gallons of fuel be dispensed in order to ensure a complete round trip"

is incorrect - five gallons would cover many round trips, and we stand corrected on that count.

This was a case of not doing the math and going right for the joke.

One notes that one of the wonders of blogs on the internets, Editor Tim, is that they can be easily edited to fix little mistakes like this. One also wonders why you have not done so, and left your correction buried in the comments. An update to the article is called for here...

>>>>It amazes me how much glee the self righteous do-gooders derive from their hope that an American company is falling on hard times. All this because they don't like one of their products. Tens of thousands of people and their families depend on these jobs. These are folks just like you and me. I hope you sniveling little malcontents are proud of yourselves. I'm just glad to live in a country where we have so many choices. I think the Hummer is rather silly myself but would defend to the death their right to buy them, just I would your right to drive your stupid little gutless hybrids. I'll stick with my Corvette. Now you can all hate me for that too. Have fun with it and enjoy wallowing in your envy of those who have something better to do with their lives than to whine about everything.

right on, these people are idiots. Gm leads many segments in fuel economy, and they sell big trucks just like everyone else. I woundn't buy a hummer either but I would never bash GM because they offer it. If they didn't fill this market demand someone else would.

Uh,...it's just an automotive vehicle, you meatheads, not some overarching metaphor of any signifigance. Many of the people in this forum, and perhaps the authors, have waaaaay toooooo much time on their hands. Get a life.

To say that this is a metaphor for America is more a reflection of you and your attitude about it, than it is some Great Statement of Truth. People aren't buying Hummers? I'd say that's more a reflection of the market reaching its limit regarding what we're willing to pay for gas.

But hey, while saying that might be more rooted in fact, it's also less likely to make you feel important for having written it.

what matt said. i'm a staunch conservative 'W' supporter and i think the hummers were and are a ridiculous toy for balding old guys or young guys with a military complex, but too lacking to actually enlist. it's not a sign of America, it's a sign of a small number of American's excess and then the inevitable rejection of that excess.

This dealer has closer to 400 Hummers. Go to http://www.hummerofthousandoaks.com/en_US/ and search for new Hummers without entering any data. 20 pages of results with 20 vehicles on each page, mostly H2's.

Another possible explanation for all this is that Hummers are selling extremely well, on the order of several hundred per week for this dealer. In that case, having an inventory of 300+ Hummers seems entirely reasonable. This would also be in line with GM increasing production of Hummers.

The H2 has nothing in common with the H1 other the brand name. The H2 is a total piece of shit: it's a basically a Chevy Suburban with a bunch of outer body work that makes it look kinda/sorta like a Humvee if you squint at it and you've never seen a real Humvee before. It's a crappy SUV even by civilian standards: you'd be a complete idiot to try to take it off-roading. (It does, however, get better mileage than the H1.)

Don't worry: the only urban pacification mission the H2 is suited for is picking up groceries.

The H2 has nothing in common with the H1 other the brand name. The H2 is a total piece of shit: it's a basically a Chevy Suburban with a bunch of outer body work that makes it look kinda/sorta like a Humvee if you squint at it and you've never seen a real Humvee before. It's a crappy SUV even by civilian standards: you'd be a complete idiot to try to take it off-roading. (It does, however, get better mileage than the H1.)

Don't worry: the only urban pacification mission the H2 is suited for is picking up groceries.

An economist in the late, great Soviet Union pointed to American supermarkets stocked to the ceiling with food as a sign of American poverty. His point, somewhat like yours, is that all that food was stacked up in the stores because people couldn't afford to buy it. Russia's empty shelves on the other hand...

"The H2 has nothing in common with the H1 other the brand name. The H2 is a total piece of shit: it's a basically a Chevy Suburban with a bunch of outer body work that makes it look kinda/sorta like a Humvee if you squint at it and you've never seen a real Humvee before. It's a crappy SUV even by civilian standards: you'd be a complete idiot to try to take it off-roading. (It does, however, get better mileage than the H1.)"

Except that the Suburban is considered one of the best SUVs around. By CR, JD Power and every consumer evaluation.

our h2 gets about 12 mpg avg! not great, no. but consider that suburbans, tahoes, landcruisers, all full-size pickups, etc get the same or worse, one can't help but draw conclusions as to why the h2 gets singled out and targeted. i think its a simple case of penis envy. sorry boys mine is bigger than yours!

The REASON the hummer was a "cash cow" was because bushie gave anyone who wanted one a great big ol tax write-off for it, and he was SUPPOSED to be buddies witht he oil bigs and keep fuel affordable. HA! Jokes on us, I guess! G.M. nearly insolvent, blames financial hole on retirement plans and thier med. coverage. COULD IT BE that it is just a huge poorly run corporation?

Based on the comments posted here (showing that GM is stockpiling vehicles and that these lots are normally this full), it looks like you 3 software engineers aren't that good at investigative blogging after all. Maybe you should go back to your day jobs.

I heard about this advertising scheme on a another blog, that gives away free computers. It sounded like a scam, but after I googled it, it was legitmiate. You have to sign up for an offer from one the sponser companies. I did the free credit report one and canceled before the free trial time was up. Here's the link, check it out.

The H3 does seem to sell well for some reason. Probably because it's new and in range of an average buyer's credit IMHO. H2 sales, though, are way down. Like down around 50%.

GM's main problem is not their SUV's. They have committed too much to them instead of having a variety of RWD cars. Their big problem is perception and resale value of their midsize sedans like the Malibu. The Camry, Accord, Avalon and newer Hyundai cars have been eating up this market share.

When are local authorities going to start enforcing the law? In most municipalities, trucks over a certain weight are prohibited from streets unless they are making a delivery. Ironically, that weight limit is usually lower than where a typical Hummer tips the scale.

Detroit has succesfully lobbied to have these obesities classified as trucks to avoid safety standards. Since they are trucks, and their registrations will confirm that they are, how come the local authorities are not actively ticketing Hummer, Escalde, Excursion, and other similar vehicles for BREAKING THE LAW?

When will people demand that their local governments start enforcing the law?

Most of you are not going to want to know this, but according to Automotive News, Hummer sales were UP 120.8% last month (Oct.), more than every other brand in the industry. By comparison, sales of Toyota - maker of the hybrid Prius - were up 5.2% for the same period.

I don't doubt that Hummer sales are way up because of the H3, but that's just taking away sales from other SUVs. Unfortunately for GM, a lot of that diversion is doubtlessly from the Tahoe, and perhaps the H2. Oops.

SUV sales will probably creep up over the next few months, now that gas is a good bit cheaper ($2.65 on Los Angeles' West Side), but they're never going to recover the market share they've lost.

DETROIT, Nov 3 (Reuters) - General Motors on Thursday said it will invest about $20 million in its Schreveport, Louisiana, truck assembly plant to increase production of the Hummer H3 sport utility vehicle...

General Motors Corp. -- facing an abysmal drop-off in auto sales,critical labor discussions through the weekend and a high-pressureearnings announcement on Monday -- will kick off yet another round ofdiscounts today.

How automaker is sweetening the potGeneral Motors Corp. is picking up the incentives in a new program to beannounced today. Customers:

• Will be offered a $500 gas card with the purchase of a 2006 mid- orfull-sized SUV, like the GMC Yukon.

• Who already lease a GM product will be able to get out of theircontracts, expiring between Nov. 1 and April 30, as much as six monthsearly this month.

• Will be offered an additional $500 on existing rebates for 2006full-sized pickups such as the Chevrolet Silverado and GMC Sierra. That brings the total to about $3,000 on some versions of the pickups.

Source: GM dealers

Several auto dealers told the Free Press that GM will begin offeringconsumers $500 gas cards on SUVs and a lease pull-ahead program, amongother deals. The end of the wildly popular Employee Discount forEveryone program at the end of September, combined with rising gasprices, caused auto sales to collapse at the beginning of October.

While dealers report that some new GM products, such as the Hummer H3SUV and Chevrolet HHR crossover, are runaway hits, retail sales of GMcars and trucks were down 57% in the first nine days of October,compared to the same period of 2004, the Power Information Network,headquartered in Westlake Village, Calif., reported Friday.

"This is a more dramatic change than we've seen in the recent past," TomLibby, senior director of industry analysis at PIN, said. "There'sreally sort of a lull here after the extravaganza over the summer."

GM lost $1.4 billion in the first six months of 2005, and it's slated toannounce its third-quarter results on Monday. Analysts expect theworld's largest automaker to lose another $450 million in theJuly-September period.

In order to return to profitability, GM needs to sell vehicles at aprice that more than covers the cost to build them. When the automakercontinues to discount vehicles, its need to cut costs, such as laborexpenses, grows.

So as GM seeks to boost sales with the new discounts today, it also willbe negotiating through the weekend with the UAW on cutting GM's$5.6-billion annual health care costs.

Initial offers fall short

GM initially sought to slash $2 billion annually in its health carecosts, and the union responded by saying it could provide $200 millionto $400 million at best within the UAW contract, the Free Presspreviously reported.

Sales of GM products were down 1.3% for the year through September,compared to the same period a year ago. With sales on a downward trendin October, the automaker was under pressure to try another incentiveprogram to prod consumers into showrooms.

"Where the fuck are you going in this? Really. Where, exactly, is itthat you live? Unless your ass is positioned atop a mountain somewhere(a MOUNTAIN....not at the TOP of your STREET) this monstrosity iscompletely worthless. Just go out and buy a fucking tractor trailer. Forshit sake, they probably get the same gas mileage."

A few years back I did a study of traffic deaths, and the interesting facts are that people die more in small cars under 2,200 lbs for some simple rules of physics. Most deaths are single car accidents where the driver leaves the lane and hits a tree, pole, bridge, parked card, ... anything stationary at the time. Why do people die in little cars, not enough metal in the fenders and frame to absorb the impact energy gracefully, resulting in the people suffering remarkably higher G forces in the impact, and having much higher injuries as a result. Passenger compartment integrity is also compromised much more, resulting in crushing injuries. Small adults, children, and infants suffer more. You might as well be riding a bicycle or motorcycle for the protection that some small cars offer.

The best way to describe those that advocate these little tiny cars, are baby killers, child killers, as it's damn hard to keep your family safe in one when that accident finally happens that you proudly have avoided for so long.

Taking your argument to its logical conclusion, are you suggesting GM buy up the rights to the M1-A1 and produce a "civilian version" of that? Minus the main armament of course (although I guess the 7.62mm M240 might be included as part of a special "road survival" package).

regarding the 120.8% increase in h3 sales for a single month, in most cases, monthly changes are statistically insignificant for one reason or another - incentives, the month of the year, and maybe especially with a new product - now, it sounds like the H3 is doing well, but it's also probably cannibalizing other GM products in the same price range and it's a relatively small part of that new market - The H2 cash cow appears to be about dead, and they have a new entry that's made a big splash for people who probably lusted after the H2 but couldn't stomach the $60K - it's too early to tell how the H3 will do, but right now it probably looks a whole lot better than a lot of other SUVs

So... instead of putting a chicken in every pot, why not put a Hummer in every household in the mid east ? Those folks would always find gas, lots of rugged road rallies, and they'd be too busy to lob rockets

I have never seen a bunch of narrow minded, jealous idiots. I own a H2 and love it. I drive it because I want to. I drive it because I can afford to. It's paid for and gets better mileage than my previous Yukon.

Envious to own a Hummer H2? I think not. I could walk into a Hummer dealership tomorrow and drive one home...there are plenty to choose from right now. It's not an issue of being able to pay for it. I just don't want one.

I could care less if you drive a Hummer H2 or a tank for that matter. Go buy the biggest goddamn F350 dually to drive 10 miles on highways back and forth to work. Drive what you want and I'll drive what I want.

BUT I don't need you rubbing it in my face that you have a "Hummer" and are so cool because of it. I don't want you tailgating me on the highway because you feel so big and bad. I also don't want to hear bitching about how $2.20/gal gas is causing you great financial pain while standing in line at Starbucks eagerly paying $4 for a tall mocha.

You are right, Hummers aren't much worse than the Expedition, Tahoe, Yukon, F250s, etc. It's a lot more ostentatious. No one buys a Hummer to off-road. You are buying it only to make a fashion statement. Buying a Hummer makes no financial sense. If you were really concerned about off-road, you'd buy a Z71 Tahoe for $15,000 less with a smaller engine that gets 3+ MPG over the Hummer engine.

You must feel that way too if you feel obligated to come online and defend the H2. You can cut down the vehicle I drive (minivan) but I could care less and I don't feel obligated to defend it either. At least I have possession of a title which is more than most Hummer buyers can say.

Avian flu is a direct byproduct of the American obsession with gas guzzling SUV's and as such has engendered the world Jihadist movement. When, inevitably, international Jihadism combines with avian flu we will surely see Karl Rove cornered by judicial fiat.

No, I don't feel the need to slam the fact that you drive a minivan. If that's what works for you, then more power to you.

I'm not offended by what anyone drives. What I am offended by is why so many posts on here are picking soley on the H2... eg. flipping drivers off. WTF?

I don't think I'm "so cool" as you put it. That's what I want to drive so I do, I personally don't care if someone thinks I'm cool for driving it.

I don't bitch about the price of gas because if I don't like it, I can drive my vette that gets over 25 mpg on the highway.

I don't drink mochas and I don't tailgate you or anyone on the highway (unless you're in the left lane driving under the speedlimit... and then, I don't care what I'm in)

My arguement was simply this. If the treehuggers (and they're entitled to their opinions, no matter how narrow-minded) want to flip off vehicles that only get 11-12mpg, then flip off every mom in a excursion or tahoe. Don't pick on just hummer owners.

Anonymous said... if you can't see something so obvious as why the H2 is in a class by itself, nothing anyone can ever say to you would make any difference

Please, enlighten me. Since it's on a suburban chassis with a few extra goodies and different sheetmetal, it's basically the same vehicle. So please, tell me why it's in a class by itself. I'm willing to listen.

Imagine where the world could be if those of you who bitch and moan actually spent your time focused on issues that really could make a difference, instead of on Hummer’s and the people that drive them. Ponder the thought. -HIHummer

First, amazing post, great work.I was originally thinking that you were making too much of the issue, but the number of vehicles turned me around. I work in Property Management and we lease lot space to several dealerships for off site storage, Nissan, Chrysler, Ford, Subaru, Lexus and Acura and not one of those dealers has 300 vehicles in storage, and we're in suburban New York.

I guess the bubble burst. But Hummers (H2 and H3) never made any sense to me. Both are built on GM platforms, the Tahoe and Trailblazer, and their abilities off road are not the same as the H1 Humvee, even if they are slightly better than the vehicles they are based on.

They are status symbols pure and simple. Very few owners will ever take them off road. So there may be something to the "penis extension" jokes. GM needs to rethink Hummer, get some Diesels for these trucks and then tune them for reasonable fuel economy and the ability to run on bio diesel.

Why do Hummer drivers think people are jealous of them? Jealous of backing up and not being able to see a 5 ft person directly behind the car? Jealous of a 0-60 that isn't faster than a civic? Jealous of paying 100 bucks per fillup? Jealous of not being able to pass anyone? You wanna get behind me and intimidate? You better get the Lingenfelter package. Hah hah...good luck. I hear a sound...the sound of money falling out of your pocket. Lemme check the time....time for you to buy some gas!

Yeah, h2's and h3's suck. Nobody ever takes them off-road. Just as good as a tahoe or suburban. You guys really don't know anything about these vehicles and their capabilities do you? Garbage in, garbage out...

So the Wholesale Inventory discussion will be about Dunkin Doughnuts futures, right?

Well, at least you are getting back to talking autos again on Thursay when you talk about the Trade (the Nisson spinoff similiar to Scion) Balance. Trade also has some really popular models that you have already talked about named "Deficit," "Embargo," "In," "Secret," "Mark," and how could you forget their beautiful luxury model the "Scantia"? These models don't seem to have helped Nisson's bottom line though.

Oh great, now that the wherabouts of 300 hummers are known the Earth Liberation Organization or the like will know where to go for their next bonfire.Me thinks they should ship them to Iraq for the troops to drive in their off time!

This is GREAT NEWS! With unemployment rising, industrial production dropping, interest rates rising, housing dropping, bankrupcies rising, savings dropping etc etc etc AND General Motors ramping production of Hummers I am WAY looking forward to getting one ... for about 50 bucks and using it for a chicken coop out behind my barn. Luxury condos for me layers.

2)Too wide, most trails have tight spots with rocks, trees or brush.3)Too long, long vehicles drag their bellies on humps.

4)Poor Gas mileage, most 4 wheeling is done at a few miles an hour, 8 cylinders sucking gas at idle speeds is a disadvantage.

5)Too expensive to scratch up.

The bottom line is this is a girly mans car; it is the best 4x4 for the last ¼ mile on the way to the ski slopes. There is a reason most off road clubs are filled with wranglers, sammies, and Toyota trucks.

1. Irrelevent.2. Just getting from A to B as cheap as possible (paid-off car)3. Only if I'm afraid I'll get mugged.4. Garage when able. It's no ones business what I drive.5. It would certainly bother me. I'd put the car in the ditch before hitting someone else.6. A.7. No8. 3 9. It doesn't pay to care about anyone but yourself in todays' self-centered society =)

Love the questions though, I'm sure most Hummer owners would have opposite answers of me.

Never read so many prejudiced a$$hole comments in my life. You self-proclaimed "enlightened" folks need to start worrying about your own back-yard and leave others to their own mistakes. The market is making them pay for their bad judgement instead of some ingnoramous regulator making the decision for them (and the rest of us too). Same goes for health care and retirement.

if you spent a fraction of the energy you spend on bashin Hummer, you would actualy might be living a life, but you wont, cuz you will just go on wasting your time about this comment and any other comment that supports Hummer...

who cares, besides you (tho no one cares what you think)what others want to buy or what their mpg rating is.. you seriously need to reconsider your the direction of your life...

if you can.. work at growin up.. dont worry about growin up yet, just get goin in that direction.. its a start...

The reason foreign gas prices are so much higher is the taxes added to support a socialist society.Dont like gas prices? Quit having a nanny government that gives handouts to every worthless lazy person in the country.

the trucks are prolly jus there for a dealership thats gonna sell em later. the gm pay what we pay is a the reason. just around my house theres around 100 hondas parked behind a store waiting to be sold. this has nothing to do with gas prices.

I still think you anti Hummer doinks are clueless. You go ahead and drive a POS hybrid. It leaves more gas for my Hummer! Get this Einsteins, since the oil's a finite resource, if you don't burn it doing something that YOU want to do, the Chinese will. My grandkids might not know what in the heck gasoline is regardless, at least I'll be able to tell them what fun I had. Booyah!

I own a bummer, It is full of flaws. Cheap parts, poor quality materials, and an incompatent service program. They cant even fix the stupid thing. The service dept. in my area used caulk to seal a leak around the third brake light. The repair is visible and you can see someones finger prints smeard on the plastic. What a joke. I paid $55,000 for junk. I would love to get national news coverage on this. I'll even give up the vehicle for this purpose, any takers? I'll check back.

"Fuel here is the equivalent of ~$7.50 a gallon based upon £ to $ exchange rate. Our Government is very greedy, however, taking 80% of that ~$7.50. Sigh."

But LPG is less than half that, and I get 100% discount on Ken's congestion charge, a 1900GBP p.a. saving. Laughing all the way to the bank in my LPG Berlingo, which probably has better passenger space, accessibility, visibility and luggage space than an H3 anyway :-)

The most logical comment I've read here is the comment on electric vehicles and what it takes to power them. Let's see, we should burn coal to make electricity, right? Naw, coal is bad. Strip mining and smokestacks are bad for the environment. Nuclear power? Oh no, not that! We'll all die of radiation! Hydroelectric? Naw, that will further foul up the rivers that are the natural resources of our country! Tidal generation? Naw, the folks that pay 10x normal prices for their coastal homes don't want their view messed up - they'd rather buy a Prius to park in their 8000 sq ft home and flip off Hummer drivers while they pay $800/month in utility bills to keep the AC running at 68 degrees and the wine cold. Wind power? Yeah, wind is free, so I’ll buy a windmill to generate electricity for my car. But wait, I can’t let it be any taller than my privacy fence ‘cause it’ll lower your property values. Solar? I’ll need to cut down all the trees in my yard so I can have a panel large enough to charge my car, but that’ll be OK, right?

Funny how electric car proponents think that because the beloved electric car can run without gasoline, it's infinitely better for the environment than a gas powered vehicle. The last info I had suggested that the BEST electric power plants in the world were about 60% efficient at producing power (taking into account losses in delivery to your recharging unit). The numbers I've seen for the electric motors in the electric cars are no more than about 45% efficient. This says that an electric car is about 27% efficient at converting raw energy into vehicular motion. Regular gas motor with the SAME performance capability is about 25% efficient, so your electric car is only about 2% better. To quote an old add, 'Where's the beef??".

While I'm in full rant mode........

Hybrids - now there's a good plan! Let's make the car heavier than it should be due to batteries and electric motors, claim 50+ MPG on the window (when it only gets 40 at best in the real world) and proclaim it's a gift from the gods. There are TONS of cars in the world that get a REAL 40+MPG - some are gasoline, but most are diesel powered. No extra electric motors to deal with 5 years down the road when they crap out. No batteries that eventually die and pollute the world with their internal chemicals. Wonder what's worse? Battery chemicals from 100000 Prius’ in the landfills and water, or tailpipe emissions from a H2 getting 12MPG?

Most auto companies will tell you that the tailpipe emissions on new cars are SAFER to breath than the ambient air in L.A. Can't stand living in this horrible, wasteful world and wanna end it all? Don't plan on locking yourself in your garage with your rotton neighbor’s new H2 running. Yea, it'll work, but only because the vehicle will use up all the oxygen, but not because of anything that comes out of the tailpipe!

Wanna complain about something? Complain that diesel fuel is CHEAPER to produce than gasoline, yet it's >20% more expensive at the pump! Complain that governments on the coasts are making diesel cars almost impossible to produce profitably in the US due to emissions regulations, yet our European friends buy diesels in 40+% of their cars (and seem to have a way to manage emissions).

In general, Electric vehicles are stupid. We don't have enough electrical plants, and no one wants a new one in their back yard, and if anyone would look at the big picture, they'd see that they aren't really that efficient. Gas/hybrids in passenger cars are today's darlings because of a silly UNREALISTIC EPA number on the window sticker and the need for egomaniac greenies to pound their chest and point to their Prius and say "LOOK WHAT I'M DOING TO SAVE THE WORLD!" How's that any better than a person who buys a Hummer to 'be seen' or to feel good about themselves? To me, it's not a bit different.

I don't hear anyone clamoring for Diesel hybrids, yet in some low-volume vehicles, they actually make a bit of sense in the near term until we find a better way to power vehicles. Why aren’t the greenies applauding companies like GM for making Diesel/Hybrid powertrains for buses like the ones in use in Seattle and other places? The fleet of 300 hybrid buses in operation around the country save more fuel in a year than the combined annual savings of 50000+ hybrid passenger cars on the road today. Problem is, no one gets off by telling their friends they rode a hybrid bus to work and that it's helping save fuel. If you really think the hybrid concept is cool, push your elected officials for more of these buses in metro areas, and by all means, buy a Prius or some other hybrid car. Turn your AC off at home, turn your heat down a few degrees, hook a generator to your treadmill and GIVE the extra electricity to the power company. Just quit driving your Prius 80 miles round trip to work and back, then slam a H2 owner that drives 12 miles round trip. You both use a gallon of fuel!

Ultimately, folks need to get off their high horses and stop criticizing anyone who uses decision criteria different than theirs to choose anything – a place to live, a career, a religion, a vehicle…... Just because it's not what you think is right for you, doesn't mean it's not right for ANYONE to have! This is America. Land of the FREE….That freedom includes being free to choose what ever they want within their means so long as it doesn’t infringe on someone else’s freedom. Hummer drivers don't infringe on anyone's freedoms just because they drive an Hummer. They aren't stealing fuel from you. If they want to spend more $ per mile than you and they can afford it, let 'em.

Let's leave these wacko hippies to themselves. That's what a lot of democrats are doing already. This blog and so many others attract polarized minds. Many here are nuts left and nuts right.

One car point and I'm gone (can't hardly see through the purple haze and leaky lava lamp goo). Who cares what GM does with their cars when the lots are full? Has GM hit any home runs with any GM cars ever? Post it! Blast me with facts. It should take a long while. Buy a Toyota 4Runner and you'll be set for your soccer mom, off-roading, towing, one passenger life.

If nobody ever found out what kind of car you drive would this be good, bad, or irrelevant?irrelevant

Does driving your car need to make you feel better or are you just trying to get from A to B?It needs to make me feel better

Do you sometimes look around to see if anyone is looking at you when you get in and out of your car?I never look around, but others call out to me :P

Do you like to leave your car in the driveway so people can see it or would you rather put it in a garage?definitely garage, keeps it clean, and less danger to the car

Would it bother you if somebody died because your car crushed them in an accident, or is it their fault because they were driving too small of a car?not many cars are smaller than mine :)

Would it be better if A) Everyone had the same height car. or B) Your car is taller than almost of the others on the road so you can see over them and they can look up at you.better if everyone else's is much taller than mine; I can then run circles around them 24/7

Do you ever take your car off road?dear god no

How many empty seats are there in your car on most days?3; lighter car, faster acceleration

For the most part, do you really care about anyone other than yourself?really depends, like I do move over for (motor)cyclists, but for those cellphone-using-SUVs, I like to lead them into turns much faster than they can ever take them, and see them drop their phone and panic

Oh, I drive a MINI, because I don't need to compensate for any shortcomings. ;)

I'll admit that I used to be a car guy.....mostly sporty cars and definitely with manual transmissions. But now I only drive SUVs. What happened? Simple--I live just north of New York City and the roads are clogged with traffic from dawn 'til dusk. Driving a sporty car is no fun around here anymore. When I'm sitting stuck in traffic, I enjoy the commanding view of the road that you get with an SUV. That's just one simple reason that I'm now an SUV guy now.

Don't even get me started on all the other benefits of SUVs. I'll be driving home from Home Depot with a load of lumber in a foot of snow.....

To the anonymous poster on November 05, 2005 3:25 AM: I agree, in that it is essential for us to reduce our dependance on mideast oil----however, you sounded really smart and intelligent, until showed you exposed your ignorance-----Islam is a religion, not a language you moron.

I don't know how people can say the H2 is not good at offroading when they don't own one. I have a H2 and take it off road all the time, there are lots of us that do. Check out www.sincityh2.com if you don't believe me. There are lots of pictures and video of what a H2 can do.... It is amazing.

If you don't want a Hummer don't buy one - but PLEASE stop trying to dictate to everybody what we should or should not drive.

Believe it or not there are those of us that ENJOY what we drive.

I personally take issue with people that drive FOREIGN brand cars that are putting Americans out of work. Yes, some of them are now "Made in America" but the corporate cash goes back overseas to corporate headquarters. We're just stupid Americans and can't see we are slowly being controlled by their companies. It's just a matter of time.

If you want to promote anything - promote buying American based manufacturing - to save your own job.

Hey liberals! Your JEALOUSY is showing! The reason you don't like Hummers is because you are all too damn lazy to do the WORK that it takes to EARN the money to buy one. Of course you put down Hummers. You've lived off the taxpayers (oh yeah, that's us, the conservatives you work for a living) and handouts from your mommy and daddy your entire lives. Move to Europe where you can smoke pot and be worthless on someone else's dime. YOU are the reason gas is so expensive because your stupid, unelected judges block us from exploring in Alaska and offshore. YOU are the reason for all the bums, druggies, and murdered children in the USA. Quit your complaining about OUR cars, that we worked for and paid for.

It is so sad that folks who probably couldn't afford the gas for a civic are always putting down on people who have more than they do. Let me guess, all you people who hate hummers are the same people who loved Gore, cant wait to vote for Billary, love PETA and Greenpeace, and want to hold hands and sing around a campfire...so sad. Oh, and for the person who said

all of you peple showing the finger to h3 and h2's are just morons. the h2 averages about 14 mpg while the h3 averages 18, this is way more than what my Nissan titan or F150 give me. I think is just envy that drives you guys, If someone likes an h3 or an h2 and can afford it, why not. If you can only afford a vw rabbit or a chevy aveo though shit. Now if you guys want to continue your stupidity, i think you should do it to every suv and full size truck.

there is too much division and anger among Americans. I blame politicians and the media for that. We need to have open minds, insightful thought, the ability to think for ourselves and avoid letting politicians and the media hand us all of their crap all of the time. I mean that for ALL of them, no one side in particular. It's at the point where Americans are at war amongst themselves.It's really unfortunate. I don't own a Hummer, but I'm not offended by people who do. I see it as a good thing because it supports American jobs. I live in Pasadena, California and there are really very few Hummers on the road. One of my girlfriends has one. I don't know if people who drive them necessarly think they look "cool". I have a feeling that this is just a vehicle that appeals to a certain bunch of people because it has an extremely different sort of a look than other vehicles on the road. It's different, nothing more. Some people don't understand it because to them, this truck just looks hideous. We are lucky to live in America where we have the freedom to think for ourselves and do most of the things we want to do. I won't slam other people or make fun of them because they like something I don't like. I support their right to make choices.