Karen Rile, alongside her daughter Lauren Rile Smith, started Cleaver in 2012. Based in Philadelphia, this mother-daughter team has a long history in the literary world. Lauren's poetry has appeared in Apiary, The Philadelphia Inquirer, Cross Connect, and Verbatim, among others. Karen is the author of the novel "Winter Music" and numerous works of fiction and creative nonfiction. Her writing has appeared in literary magazines such as The Southern Review, American Writing, Creative Nonfiction, and Apiary. Her work has been listed amongst The Best American Short Stories. Karen writes articles and essays for publications including The San Francisco Chronicle, The New York Times, and The Philadelphia Inquirer.

Interview by Brianne M. Kohl

If you could only use five words, how would you describe the aesthetic of Cleaver?

Elegant, quirky, playful, serious, cutting-edge. That was six words for the price of five!

What does the word “Thwack” mean to you?

In our lexicon, “thwack”, like “cleaver” is Janus word. (And what is a “Janus word”? It’s an auto-antonym, something that means itself and its opposite.) We began using “thwack” when we constructed the Cleaver site. It’s a multipurpose, handy onomatopoeia that signifies the sound of something being joined, or chopped apart. “Thwack” implies action.

Can you talk a little bit about the origin of Cleaver? How did you get started and what made you want to start a literary journal?

For many years, ever since she was a child reading Cricket and Stone Soup, my oldest daughter Lauren and I planned to start a literary magazine. But after researching the challenges of distributing an independent print publication, we put the project on hold because we preferred to focus our energy on creating and editing a magazine, rather than worrying about distribution. In late 2012, over winter break, we realized that we had the design skills to create a viable web-based publication with the potential to engage many more readers and writers than we would have been able to with print. Both of us have been in the writing community for a long time – she is a poet and I’m a fiction writer--and we had many peer connections. So we launched the project.

Our first issue, in February 2013, was a mini “all-flash” preview issue, and we drew from our network of writer-friends and colleagues to put it together. Our first full issue launched a month later, in March. We are a quarterly literary magazine, publishing in March, June, September, and December. We still solicit a few pieces for every issue, but most of the work we publish now comes directly from submissions received through Submittable. After a few months, began publishing book reviews and craft essays in addition to the quarterly content of short stories, flash, creative nonfiction, poetry, graphic narrative and artwork. We have some new projects up our sleeves, including an advice column written by our in-house ethicist that will launch in mid-April, and an audio project that we plan to unveil later this year.

What is your editorial process? What does your average week look like?

To prepare our quarterly literary issues, we work in twelve week cycles. At the beginning of the cycle, most of our energy is spent reading submissions. We use Submittable as our submissions manager, a platform which enables our staff of editors and readers to discuss and vote on submissions in a centralized place. We read submissions continually throughout the year; if a piece is not accepted or rejected immediately, it is often held over for consideration for a later issue. We sometimes request revisions from submitters before accepting a piece. Once a submission is accepted, we go into a second editorial process, always in communication with the writer. As we draw closer to each issue launch, we direct a lot of attention to proofreading and copy editing. We try to have the eyes of at least 3 proofreaders on a piece before launch day. Every contributor receives a proof link for their piece a few weeks before the issue launch so they can double-check their work. At this point they also have an opportunity to update their bio or make minor changes in the text.

I am the webmaster for Cleaver, which means that I do all of the design and upkeep on the site. This allows us to keep our costs down, and also allows us to respond quickly to any editorial changes or corrections that might come up (even the occasional missing comma that is discovered, horrors, after publication.) As for what an average week is like: that’s a complex question and varies according to which staff member is involved. Some of our staff only reads submissions; some only proofread and copy edit. Many do both, so their tasks will be different depending on what part of the cycle we are in. I work very long hours while uploading material for an issue to the site. One of the most time-consuming tasks for me is to find an image to complement the text for each literary contribution. I try to find a Creative Commons licensed image; when that isn’t possible, I purchase a stock photo.

That’s the quarterly lit issue. But there is a lot more going on at Cleaver: Our book reviews section, which is updated frequently, focuses on new books from small and indie presses. We cover fiction, nonfiction, poetry, graphic narratives, and YA/children’s books. We also publish craft essays, and will soon launch a advice and ethics column (“Ask June”.) Later this year we plan to launch a radio play project, and an audio project for poetry.

What is the most frustrating thing about running a literary journal?

I haven’t found this endeavor frustrating at all, except in the most minor and transient ways: for example, a software glitch that sends me down tech support rabbit holes. Or sometimes I have trouble locating the perfect image for a poem, despite hours of searching (but then I always find one.) Sometimes we get submissions from writers who have not actually read the magazine and assume, because of our name, that we publish genre horror stories or cooking articles. But that is more amusing than frustrating. Mostly I’m continually amazed by the generosity and goodwill of our staff and our contributors.

We have no secrets. We’re looking for work that is specifically detailed, precisely written, polished, authentic.

You have released thirteen issues so far. How has Cleaver evolved since issue 1?

On a surface level, we have slowly refined the magazine’s visual presentation while preserving its architecture and feel. There are so many different ways to set up a literary magazine! When we were designing Cleaver we went for an aesthetic that is similar to a print magazine, in terms of having the issue’s contents as the landing page, and organizing our literary content into discrete issues. Since then we’ve added features, and worked to make our constantly increasing archives organized and accessible for readers. We’ve evolved a lot as a community – we have a large, all-volunteer staff, including interns, and we have many frequently contributing book reviewers. Sometimes the writers we publish in our literary issues come back asking to write book reviews, or to help out with editing, and we’re thrilled to have them. Our book review editors are an invaluable part of the staff. They are responsible for selecting the books for review, distributing them to the review writers, and working with the writers to create essay-style reviews of new works from small and indie presses. We are one of the few presses that reviews poetry chapbooks.

You state on your site that emerging artists are “young (under 30) or those of any age who are still in the early stages of their career” Why do you think it is important to focus on and call special attention to the emerging artist?

From the start, Lauren and I felt it was important to include both established and emerging writers. We think a mix of voices is exciting, and we feel that, as a community, writers need to nurture and encourage newcomers to the craft. Our emerging artists include young teenagers and also adults who are coming to creative writing later in life. In addition to publishing works by new writers in our literary issue, we also feature reviews by both new and established critics. Our youngest reviewers are still in college. Our book review editors are wonderful mentors who work extensively with younger writers (and with our more seasoned writers, too). They don’t just edit the work: they shepherd them through as many revisions as necessary. We believe that this kind of labor-intensive mentorship is crucial for developing writers. For some of these new reviewers, Cleaver is their first byline and their first step towards building a portfolio. We’ve published first-time writers who later go on to writer for major publications. One of our young writers was recently “discovered” by the New York Times Book Review during a Google search that turned up her Cleaver review, and has gone on to publish for them and other major book sections.

Do you have a wish list you use to approach each new issue? Or, themes you’d like to explore?

We give some attention to seasonal cues, and the zeitgeist. So, for example, a wintry poem is likely to be placed in December, rather than June. A 9/11 story will probably show up in September. And we also look towards the works we have accepted and see themes beginning to emerge. We sometimes move an accepted piece to a different issue because we think it will resonate better there. But, as of now, we don’t do themed issues. Our process for selection is somewhat loose and intuitive.

What journals other than Cleaver do you love to read?

Lauren served on the editorial staff of APR for many years, so of course we love that. And locally (we are in Philadelphia) favorites are Apiary, Painted Bride Quarterly, and Philadelphia Stories. One Story has a great concept. We have so many favorites. When we were designing Cleaver we paid special attention to the way journals present themselves online and found so many inspiring examples of digital magazines. One that stuck out to us for its clean, accessible design is Superstition Review.

How important is social media in reaching new readership and promoting your magazine? How proactive do you like your writers to be in terms of promotion?

We find that quite a lot of new readers find us through social media, generally Facebook and Twitter, but also through Tumblr and other platforms. We love it when our writers are proactive, sharing their work and others, but we don’t sit around waiting for them. We post a daily story-of-the-day (or poem) from back issues on Facebook and Twitter, and we encourage our writers to let us know about their books so we can promote those, too. Many new readers come to us through old-fashioned Google searches, or from bloggers who mention Cleaver. We also get a healthy percentage of readers through university and college teachers who assign Cleaver stories or essays to their students.

If you find a piece that hums but is not perfect, how far along are you willing to get into the editing process?

Every issue contains pieces that have been through multiple revisions – real revisions, not just line-edits. But we have a limit to our bandwidth and we choose these “almost perfect” stories carefully. Sometimes a story comes to us that needs a lot more work and we have to let it go even though we can see its promise. We encourage writers to send us their most polished work, but once we accept a piece, we are committed to whatever work it takes to bring it to its fullest potential.

What super secret tips do you have for writers submitting to Cleaver?

We have no secrets. We’re looking for work that is specifically detailed, precisely written, polished, authentic. But our tastes are eclectic.

Do you submit your writers for national awards? If so, which ones?

We submit for every award that we are aware of and are eligible for. To date, we have received recognition from The Pushcart Prize, The Best American Essays, The Best Small Fictions (a flash award), and plain china, a magazine that re-publishes work by undergraduate writers.

How often do you look at a writer's bio when considering a submission? How much importance do you put on credentials, previous publications and MFA’s?

We don’t pay much attention to credentials. I can’t speak for all readers on our staff, but I generally don’t glance at the bios during my first reading unless there’s some compelling reason to. The bios become important later when we are trying to identify who might be an emerging writer.

Is there anything about Cleaver you want people to know that we haven’t covered already?

I should mention that we are very grateful to receive partial support from The Philadelphia Cultural Fund and Kelly Writers House at the University of Pennsylvania (where I teach creative writing) as well as the occasional kind-hearted donor.

Also, while Lauren continues as a senior editor at Cleaver, she is stepping down as poetry editor, after laying a fantastic groundwork. She has her hands full (literally, of trapeze and other apparatus) as the founder and director of Tangle Movement Arts, an all-female circus arts company that mixes traditional circus with theater, dance, and live music, and with her full-time job as the Rare Materials coordinator at the Kislak Center for Special Collections at UPENN. Our new poetry editor will Matthew Girolami, who has been serving as poetry reviews editor for the past three years. He’s fantastic young poet--about to begin the Iowa Writers Workshop--and we are excited for him to bring his vision and wonderful editorial skills to the literary issues.

Brianne M. Kohl's short stories have appeared in several publications including The Masters Review, The Stoneslide Corrective, Literary Mama, The Bohemyth, Coup D'Etat, and 94 Creations. In addition, she has published several tips articles at The Review Review. To see all of her publications and awards, visit her at www.briannekohl.com. Follow her on twitter: twitter.com/BrianneKohl