Battle Subway Discussion & Ranking Hall~ Now With Singles Team Building Guide!

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Battle Subway Discussion & Ranking Hall~ Now With Singles Team Building Guide!

Welcome to the Battle Subway discussion thread and Ranking Hall! There are a
few rules that you should be aware of before you start posting.

1. All SppF rules apply2. When posting about your current exploits in the Subway, please have at least
a few sentences. Posts like "I got pwnd by Excadril crithax whaaa?!?!" are
not acceptable and infractions will be given.3: Please don't post your record unless you've reached 60+ battles. 4: Include the team(s) you used when posting a record streak.5: When posting a record streak, please try to include some sort of proof,
such as a battle video or photograph. This is more for people with larger streaks
but it still wouldn't hurt.6: DO NOT post your team in this thread to be rated. RMT's belong in
their own threads.7: Only the Super Train records are accepted, as they go up continuously.

Ask for help with movesets, synergy, EV's or pretty much anything you can think
of. Post movesets that you think would be useful in the subway, or post about your
latest accomplishment. Here are a few useful links that may be of some use to you,
along with lists of threatening items/moves/abilities that can hinder your streak.

Before we get into the guide, I'd like to make a point. EV spreads are necessary if you're looking to make a good streak. The AI uses EV spreads, and so should you. If you don't know about IV's or EV's I suggest you read a few guides before diving deep into the Subway.

The first thing you want to do is select a lead. Leads should usually do 1 of 2 things depending on the type of team you want to use. The first type, I like to call a speed team, for obvious reasons.

A speed team's purpose is to KO everything as fast as possible with little trouble. Your Pokemon should always have a high Spe and Atk/SpA stats. Things like Gengar/Garchomp/Salamence/Lati@s/Starmie/Jolteon etc. fit well thanks to great stats and pretty diverse movepools.

The second type of team is based on set-up sweepers. Your lead should be able to cripple the opponent to the point that is basically useless. There are a few ways to do it, you can either use the TrickScarf strategy, the stat killer or a combination of both. The TrickScarf strategy uses a Pokemon with the move Trick to lock the opponent into 1 attack, but also gives it a x1.5 speed boost. This strategy was kinda nerfed in gen. 5, with the AI being smart enough to switch out when attacks are useless, but it's still effective. Stat killing is an incredible way to set up a sweeper. You basically reduce the opponent's stats to the point that it is useless. Once you're done with your selected method, switch to your sweeper, boost to +6 and sweep. Remember, KOing the opponents lead isn't the idea here, so your lead(s) may not have/need any attacking moves.

The Spe EV's still put her above Garchomp3 while scarfed and she sits at 157 Spe without it, letting her beat Moltres and Roserade. Charm is used to shut down Garchomp and other fast physical threats. Flash makes sure you get hit as little as possible. Trick is not always the first move you'll use, if you're facing Chomp with this set up for instance, you would immediately start to Charm.

Wow, Shuckle is so stupid good. Who knew it could do more than one thing? He starts out with Power Split to deplete attacking power and if it's a special attacker he can use Struggle Bug to cause even more problems. Gastro Acid lets me deal with things like the Regi's/Metagross with Clear Body or anything with Keen Eye. Rest is there to hopefully allow him to do two or more of these things. I went with max HP and Def simply because he has a way to lower SpA even further, while he can only rely on Power
Split to deal with physical attackers.

My second stat killer. After getting crapped on by Shuckle, most things aren't going to be doing much damage, so Recover gives me a great chance to Flash them down to -6. I like the idea of Bulldoze, as it could allow slower pokemon to set up a Sub before being attacked. Substitute is thrown in there as an option for hax protection as I Flash, but I'm just not sure which would be optimal. Sticky Hold keeps Trick users from destroying the strategy. The EV's are copy-pasta from X-Act for max defensive potential.

Synergy should also be taken into account when selecting a lead. It will help you in selecting the other members of your team. A lack of weaknesses isn't necessarily a necessity, but you should try to keep them somewhat manageable. For instance, you don't want something like Exeggutor for a lead (for more than one reason).

The next step is choosing your sweeper(s). It is possible to go with 2 stat killers and one sweeper if that's what you'd prefer. Using this method leaves you with few attacking options, but if you choose a suitable Pokemon it can be very successful.

A typical set up sweeper will carry at least 2 things: Substitute and a boosting move. I'll cover the standard booster first.

When I say standard booster, I'm referring to Pokemon that use 1 set up move (Dragon Dance/Swords Dance/Nasty Plot/Quiver Dance etc. ). Good candidates would include Salamence/Dragonite/Volcarona/Toxicroak/Lati@s/Scizor/Lucario and so on. The basic idea is to come in on the weakened opponent, get behind a Substitute, boost to +6 and sweep. Substitute will make sure you don't get ruined by status effects or random crits, it's pretty much 100% necessary so keep that in mind.

The second type of booster is called Pseudo-Invincible. This is when a Pokemon uses moves like Curse in conjunction with Amnesia. When fully set up you have +6 in Atk/Def/SpD, and behind a Sub you can basically take no damage. Couple this with Leftovers and you'll be back to full HP long before your Sub is broken. Other move combos besides Curse/Amnesia are available as well. Calm Mind and Iron Defense/Acid Armor allow you to go the special route if you prefer. Good examples of Pseudo-Invincible Pokemon are Registeel/Lucario/Snorlax/Gastrodon/Reuniclus/Chandelure etc.

Flash Cannon is the chosen move since nothing is immune to it. This is usually necessary so you don't have switch out a fully set up Pokemon. For instance, Snorlax should use Crunch, since nothing is immune to dark type attacks.

In conclusion I'd like to say something short about threats. You should always look for things that can threaten you, and prepare accordingly. Take the Latias from earlier for example. I made sure she outsped all Garchomp since he can OHKO and possibly stop a streak dead. Take a look around the database sometimes and look for things that could cause you problems, even having a slight idea will help you deal with it more easily. Being familiar with your team and it's weaknesses is the best way to be successful.

As far as most research suggests, there are no DW abilities in the Battle Subway. Although I’m a bit curious about one of the Serperior’s who’s Leaf Storm seemed to be getting stronger or getting an extremely abnormal amount of Crits.

Will there be some sort of example version of how we should post our teams/winning records? I got to around ~120 about a month back, but I’m not sure how much info to write about, war stories, items, ect.

Current MM Method Target:

Black FC: 3568 1812 9876

nidoking_omega Theory: Mime Jr. is a good Baton Passer. Verdict: True. Supporting Evidence: It has hands. Therefore it can hold a baton. It can also pass the baton because of its hands. Therefore, if it doesn't drop the baton, it is a good baton passer.KoopaBros4Lyfe: Exactly, it's hands down the best BPer in the game.lil_BowWow: yea, I'd like to see ninjask or jolteon try to hold a baton.

My lead. That is its position mainly because it was part of a different team in the past, one which needed it to barrel past key threats in order to start stalling. I think the set is pretty standard. Opted not to use Superpower as I haven't had many instances where I needed a strong Fighting move in exchange for -1 Atk and Def.

My special Water, Omastar. It has a Focus Sash because Lord knows it needs it against everything. You'd be surprised how many supposedly fast Pokemon like to have 0 Spe EVs in the Subway, making me go first and then hitting me at -1 bulk. Also, my SpD is terrible. Anyway, Ice + Ground is great neutral coverage, and Surf is STAB. The Spe EVs are necessary, allowing me to outspeed all non-Scarved Pokemon with the exception of max Spe Accelgor.

Defensive powerhouse. No Sub because I felt as if Power Whip was too important, which it kind of has been. Everything else is straightforward.

I can't currently provide a pic, so sadface to that. But I did end up at 62 wins...I can't recall what beat me, but it was probably a Suicune...never in my life have I had Ice Beam freeze me in so many different matches, and without me ever thawing out. I mean, I know it's supposed to be haxy, but good Lord, why only that one specific sort of hax? Ugh. Anyway, that's it from me. I might try out a new team soon, but meh.

EDIT: Seriously, screw Suicune. Just lost to another one, and really early too. And why? Because it froze me on the switch. >__< I need a Terrakion...

Thinking about posting a team in the 5th Gen IGRMT sub-forum? Be sure to read the rules before proceeding. Are you looking to have only one Pokemon rated? Then check out our Single Rate Thread for movesets and help. Thanks!

Will there be some sort of example version of how we should post our teams/winning records? I got to around ~120 about a month back, but I’m not sure how much info to write about, war stories, items, ect.

A spoiler is probably the best way to go. Just post your team and
moves EV's etc, the number of the last battle you won and your
name. Warstories don't need to be novels or anything, but just a
quick wrap-up of your loss/win.

Originally Posted by Kerech

Shuckle, my man, you need some link updates, lol. This is the current BS list. All the names and moves and items are updated now. And here are the speed tiers. Woot.

Thanks dude, I'll add them in.

Edit: Added you to the board.

Edit2: Added a skeleton for record posts to the OP, it's in the
spoiler which you should use as well. Kerech's post is a good
example of how your post should look.

Focus Sash/potential Sturdy Pokemon. Seriously, working around those is a pain. Though that list would be fairly huge.

Thinking about posting a team in the 5th Gen IGRMT sub-forum? Be sure to read the rules before proceeding. Are you looking to have only one Pokemon rated? Then check out our Single Rate Thread for movesets and help. Thanks!

My current 2 teams for the subway have at least 3 perfect IV's in
the necessary stats. Perfect IV's aren't completely necessary, but
it'll help you when doing damage calcs for offenses and make
sure your defenses can take as much as possible.

Edit: Added the newly formatted Leaderboard and the
threatening moves/items/abilities spoilers to the OP. I'll be
finishing up the rest of them tonight and I'll get them added.

Edit2: Finished and added the list of Taunt users, also
compiled a list of PKMN that have the Sturdy and Prankster
abilities.

Originally Posted by Me

IIRC, abilities aren't set, so keep in mind that the PKMN
with Sturdy have the possibility of having their other ability as well.

Anyone know if this is correct? If not, does anyone know how to
find out without actually battling them and checking against the
movesets/trainer?

I'm at 42 wins with my sandstorm team atm, I'm just doing a bit of tweaking before I challenge it again. I'll have to be prepared for the Subway Boss!

Hey Serebii, how you doing? Not sure how many of you guys from way back are out there, but just to let you know that I'm back, though I'm not sure how regularly I'll be on. Thanks for everything, and I hope I can continue to enjoy my time here!

I added a spoiler for pHazers (Haze/Roar/Whirlwind/Dragon Tail) since
I had a bit more free time than I thought. If anyone can think of anything
else along those lines that should be noted, let me know.

Tried Dragon Claw first. It sucked. +1 Outrage destroys everything. I even 2 hit KO'd a Steelix with it!!! Yache berry is because Dragonite is my savior in a pinch so he needs to be able to save me in any situation including against ice types plus it allows you to setup against many Pokemon that carry ice type moves.

Notes: Legendary trainers are a pain in my rear part. Articuno and Cresselia are so damn bulky + they have recovery. Had to switch like 10 times just to keep my rain up and KO the hail+roost Articuno. Curse Ferrothorn also destroys this team.

Lost: Because I don't pay attention. Zoroark disguised as a Gyrados. Didn't notice the lack of intimidate. Politoed used HP electric, Zoroark used Sword Dance. Zoroark used sucker punch to OHKO Politoed next turn. I didn't switch because I couldn't risk switching into a +2 Night Slash.
Then I made a terrible misplay and sent in Ludicolo instead of Dragonite. Ludicolo got OHKO by +2 sucker punch! Dragonite finished off Zoroark and lost to a Stone edge from the real Gyrados.
2 misplays there. Should have sent in Dragonite before Ludicolo (Do damage calcs before making key moves!) and should have Dragon Danced against Zoroark.

Spoiler:- Not related to streak:

What's the minimum rank for the wifi subway record? 60+ could be Rank 8 or 9.

Got the doubles Trophy with a tweaked version of this team + Toxicroak and stopped at 49. Will continue eventually and post streak if I make it to 60 but honestly doubles and singles aren't all that fun. I might try some gimmicky doubles teams after I lose.

Going for the Multi Trophy wih Trainer. It's been the most challenging and fun one so far. Hilda chooses decent Pokemon most of the time but I lmao at the stupid moves she makes

How do you breed 3+ perfect IVs? Is the easiest way to get all 6 power items playing through the normal train 6 times? I plan to re-breed my entire team with at least 3 perfect IVs in their necessary stats.

Credit to Beck for the RNG userbar.
As of August 18th 2012, I resigned as a CG leader.

Tried Dragon Claw first. It sucked. +1 Outrage destroys everything. I even 2 hit KO'd a Steelix with it!!! Yache berry is because Dragonite is my savior in a pinch so he needs to be able to save me in any situation including against ice types plus it allows you to setup against many Pokemon that carry ice type moves.

Notes: Legendary trainers are a pain in my rear part. Articuno and Cresselia are so damn bulky + they have recovery. Had to switch like 10 times just to keep my rain up and KO the hail+roost Articuno. Curse Ferrothorn also destroys this team.

Lost: Because I don't pay attention. Zoroark disguised as a Gyrados. Didn't notice the lack of intimidate. Politoed used HP electric, Zoroark used Sword Dance. Zoroark used sucker punch to OHKO Politoed next turn. I didn't switch because I couldn't risk switching into a +2 Night Slash.
Then I made a terrible misplay and sent in Ludicolo instead of Dragonite. Ludicolo got OHKO by +2 sucker punch! Dragonite finished off Zoroark and lost to a Stone edge from the real Gyrados.
2 misplays there. Should have sent in Dragonite before Ludicolo (Do damage calcs before making key moves!) and should have Dragon Danced against Zoroark.

Spoiler:- Not related to streak:

What's the minimum rank for the wifi subway record? 60+ could be Rank 8 or 9.

Got the doubles Trophy with a tweaked version of this team + Toxicroak and stopped at 49. Will continue eventually and post streak if I make it to 60 but honestly doubles and singles aren't all that fun. I might try some gimmicky doubles teams after I lose.

Going for the Multi Trophy wih Trainer. It's been the most challenging and fun one so far. Hilda chooses decent Pokemon most of the time but I lmao at the stupid moves she makes

how do you tell what the power of your hidden power is, do you use that formula thing or is there an easier way?

If you can't work out the formula, then you'll have to do some painful trial-and-error; take the HP user and another one of your Pokemon into double grass, and then spam HP on your teammate. Then use a damage calculator to approximate the power range for your move. Then spam it on other teammates to see if you can refine your search.

That sounds like an annoying method, but it's the only alternative I can think of atm.

EDIT: 3+ perfect IV breeding, without RNGing, has always been fairly annoying and time-consuming. If you only want 3, then you would need the parents to have as many perfect shared IVs as possible. One parent should hold a Power Item, and then you just breed until you inherit the maximum IVs from the parents (which is 3, iirc). Anything more will require a lot of luck and patience, I've found.

Thinking about posting a team in the 5th Gen IGRMT sub-forum? Be sure to read the rules before proceeding. Are you looking to have only one Pokemon rated? Then check out our Single Rate Thread for movesets and help. Thanks!

Just saying, but seeing all these sweeping teams w/ Speed boosting abilities (Swift Swim, Clorophyll, Speed Boost) You only need 130 Speed to outspeed Scarf Manetric, the fastest thing in the subway. Running any more is pointless, except if you want to save yourself from other Speed boosting sweepers.

Last edited by Vandslaux; 29th June 2011 at 12:58 AM.

Credit to Beck for the RNG userbar.
As of August 18th 2012, I resigned as a CG leader.