Post-DS9 Cardassia

[LEFT]Any thoughts on what happened to the Cardassian Empire after the war? Did the Federation send relief supplies to a reforming civilian government? Did the Klingons/Romulans feel entitled to a chunk of their former territory? AFAIK, this was never adressed on screen.
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Basically, I'd assume that the Klingons would want a piece of that planet, after having gone to all the trouble with conquering Cardassian wars in the past conflicts. Never mind how poor in resources or full of potential insurgents, the world/system would be a prize of prestige for them. Romulans might be less passionate about it, withdrawing to behind their Neutral Zone once again and waiting for Nemesis to happen. Unless they wanted a base close to the wormhole, that is. But perhaps the wormhole no longer is open for traffic, as part of the peace stipulations?

The Federation would have every incentive to try and help the natives, and to form an alliance or offer membership candidacy. That would probably continue even if Cardassia decided to again go for something else than a civilian government.

Not that this is canon, but Star Trek Bridge Commander suggests that Cardassia was left alone to rebuild, but the allies were allowed the ability to search their freighters and vessels at their discretion. Re-arming of Cardassia's military was expressely forbidden. Seems like we're going in a circle here if you get my drift...

Well, I'd imagine they'd be treated in a manner similar to the way Germany and Japan were treated after WWII.

Let them rebuild, but on a very short leash for a while, until they could be trusted to work and play well with others.

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This seems logical.

The Federation would have every incentive to try and help the natives, and to form an alliance or offer membership candidacy. That would probably continue even if Cardassia decided to again go for something else than a civilian government.

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Doubtful. This would alienate the Bajorans and hurt the Federation's position with regard to using the Wormhole. It would also make it more difficult to talk the Bajorans into joining the Federation at some point in the future.

Hmm...I find it hard to see the Cardassians being too pleased with a Klingon presence in their territory. That would have to be even worse than a Federation presence in their book: you've got that unprovoked war that STARTED the whole mess in the first place (pre-Dominion) not to mention the Septimus III attack which was a wholesale slaughter. (Yes, I know the Cardassians have committed atrocities too but knowing them, they'd be MASSIVELY pissed if it was against them.)

Hmm...I find it hard to see the Cardassians being too pleased with a Klingon presence in their territory. That would have to be even worse than a Federation presence in their book: you've got that unprovoked war that STARTED the whole mess in the first place (pre-Dominion) not to mention the Septimus III attack which was a wholesale slaughter. (Yes, I know the Cardassians have committed atrocities too but knowing them, they'd be MASSIVELY pissed if it was against them.)

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I'm tempted to agree RE: the Klingons.
It's never properly addressed on screen but to all intents and purposes, it was the Klingons that gave the Dominion their foothold in the Alpha Quadrant. Granted, Martok was a changeling, but even so, Gowron and the rest of the High Council must shoulder some of the blame. If they hadn't launched their ill advised war on Cardassia it is unliekly Dukat would have been able or even willing to negotiate with the Dominion and give them a permanent base in the AQ.

I think this fact may well be exploited by several sides in any post-war territory or power division. The Romulans in particular would likely use it to limit the Klingons' share of the conquered territories as much as possible.

To me it cuts to an even bigger issue: is it me, or has the Federation got a habit of making and excusing some pretty shady allies? They say you can judge a man by the company he keeps--and same for a government...

And here's something. Why does everybody assume that the Cardassian Union would be divvied up among the winners like spoils of war? What if they decided to try an approach more like Afghanistan or Iraq instead? (Seriously, NO debates about real-world effectiveness of said approach. Be mature.)

I haven't read it in a while but I believe that "A Stitch in Time" by Andrew Robinson goes into a little detail about post-Cardassia. It also gives some good back ground on Garak.

Kev

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If the UFP wanted to avoid another Kerensky/Weimar situation, they'd get aid in there and more importantly, de-Obsidian the Cardassian culture. Then again, there might be Cardassian interest in the Prophets. From a pragmatic Cardassian POV, the Bajorans' gods won the fight.

I would say that post-Cardassia would be like Europe after WWII, and that the Federation and the rest of the Alpha Quadrant powers would be better served creating a Marshall Plan for Cardassia to rebuild. After all, Cardassia waged war because it was resource-poor, so by helping rebuild, you stave off the reasons for Cardassia to go to war. A bit of wishful thinking, but I don't think a partition of Cardassian space would be in anyone's best interest. -- RR

I haven't read it in a while but I believe that "A Stitch in Time" by Andrew Robinson goes into a little detail about post-Cardassia. It also gives some good back ground on Garak.

Kev

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Also pretty sure one of the novels, I think it was Section 31 novel with Bashir mentions that the union was divided up between the powers as he has to enter the Romulan controlled area to hunt down the bad guys.

I haven't read it in a while but I believe that "A Stitch in Time" by Andrew Robinson goes into a little detail about post-Cardassia. It also gives some good back ground on Garak.

Kev

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Also pretty sure one of the novels, I think it was Section 31 novel with Bashir mentions that the union was divided up between the powers as he has to enter the Romulan controlled area to hunt down the bad guys.

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Yikes...that's definitely not a good move on the part of the Federation. Not just because of the Romulans' prior record, but the whole divvying-up move--are they ASKING for later trouble or what??

Yikes... spliting up their territory! I almost think the Cardassians have been victimized in DS9. I mean... they only allied with the Dominion after feeling helpless (thank you Eddington, thank you Martok, thank you Gowron). And to make matters worse, the Dominion tries to exterminate them! Why are the Cardassians hated so much? All this crap made me kind of root for them at the beginning of the Dominion war..

Yikes... spliting up their territory! I almost think the Cardassians have been victimized in DS9. I mean... they only allied with the Dominion after feeling helpless (thank you Eddington, thank you Martok, thank you Gowron). And to make matters worse, the Dominion tries to exterminate them! Why are the Cardassians hated so much? All this crap made me kind of root for them at the beginning of the Dominion war..

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I think the problem is their government, and what it's warped (most) of their society into. That's what makes them so hated and feared. While we occasionally caught glimpses of another side of them (Daro, Natima Lang, Tekeny Ghemor, etc.), before the rebellion, there wasn't much representation of anything else to them but cold, arrogant, ruthless, "honorless" SOBs.

One of the first cracks in that facade, as far as the entire society is concerned, was the Klingon attack right when they were starting to pull things together into a form that might be a little better than before. That's when I first started getting really annoyed with the way they were being treated. They reform and get invaded for it. Talk about "no good deed going unpunished"...

Just had a quick look at the first few chapters of Abyss and the Section 31 guy makes a mention of "former Cardassian holdings" and Bashir corrects him, calling them "protectorates" set up by the Feds, Klings and Roms to protect Cardassian territory until the Cardassians can resume control.

Had a look over at MemoryBeta to see what they had from the non-canon sources and was surprised that they only had a little bit. Thought they would have more from the DS9 relaunch but only Stitch in Time gets a mention in their article on Cardassian history.

Doubtful. This would alienate the Bajorans and hurt the Federation's position with regard to using the Wormhole. It would also make it more difficult to talk the Bajorans into joining the Federation at some point in the future.

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Well the Bajorans were fairly quick to come up with a peace agreement with Cardassia. Plus an important Bajoran office (CO of DS9 no less) did help the Cardassians.

I doubt the Federation would offer membership anytime soon but I could see them helping the Cardassians with relief efforts, etc. I doubt Bajor would have a problem with that and suspect that DS9 would be instrumental in this also.

One of the first cracks in that facade, as far as the entire society is concerned, was the Klingon attack right when they were starting to pull things together into a form that might be a little better than before. That's when I first started getting really annoyed with the way they were being treated. They reform and get invaded for it. Talk about "no good deed going unpunished"...

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Yeah, it got to the point that I actually wanted to see the Cardassian / Dominion alliance win... or at least beat the Klingons (I guess they had to go through the Feds first). I felt like the rest of the Alpha Quadrant kind of deserved it. No race should be invaded for trying to reform. Then the writers shot them again when the Dominion tried to exterminate them for standing up for themselves. I don't know what happens after the war, but I think the Federation would actually help them rebuild. Looking at the actions of Cardassians like Damar and Garak, and then finally acknowledging that it was the fault of the Klingons and Maquis for having them (as Sisko put it) "run into the arms of the Dominion." Seriously, the Alpha Quadrant powers need to do a serious self-check. Plus, rebuilding will help them get some insight into Cardassian culture to sqush the stereotype that they are all militaristic xenophobic boneheads.

I wouldn't go so far as to say the Alpha Quadrant powers deserved the deaths that came to them--I mean, that's the same as suggesting the Cardassians deserved to have billions of their people killed because of what their governments did.

We rarely got to see a credible dissent within the Federation, either. Most of the time, the dissenters were shown as loony or violent. (Alixis, Eddington, Cartwright, Section 31, need I continue?) To see someone fundamentally disagree with Federation policy and be taken seriously as a character--that's not something I think I ever saw. You never saw a conservative that was treated as anything but a stumbling block, a blockhead, or an enemy: kind of the Cardassian problem in inverse. And THAT is pretty chilling considering the Federation was supposed to be a democracy.

To me it cuts to an even bigger issue: is it me, or has the Federation got a habit of making and excusing some pretty shady allies? They say you can judge a man by the company he keeps--and same for a government...

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Well, it's not like they have a lot of options. Consider the powers that surround them -- the Klingon Empire, the Romulan Star Empire, the Cardassian Union, the Ferengi Alliance, the Tzenkethi Coalition, the Breen Confederacy, the Gorn Hegemony, the Tholian Assembly, the Talarian Republic. Frankly, the Federation doesn't have a lot of nice folks to make friends with -- the closest would be the Ferengi Alliance.

And besides the point, peaceful and friendly relations are certainly better than antagonistic relations. The Federation ends up in a better position in terms of its security, and it then has the opportunity to influence the internal politics of allied societies so that they're less, well, evil. The Ferengi Alliance began instituting Federation-style reforms within 11 years of making first contact with the UFP; the last two Klingon Chancellors were installed by Federation Starfleet officers... Etc.