A while back, this story was all over the news. A woman claimed that a family stiffed her on a tip and left a note on the receipt saying that it was because they did not agree with her life style. She is a member of the LGBT community.

I think it was vile of her to try to pull such a stunt thinking that the family would never fire back. Plus, since when did not tipping or not giving a certain amount become a crime? Quite recently I went to lunch with a friend and between the two of us we had exactly fifty dollars. When we got the bill for forty five dollars we gave the fifty and told the waitress to keep the change. She rolled her eyes at us and said, "thanks a lot," clearly sarcastically as though five dollars wasn't enough of a tip. We could have easily gone to McDonald's instead and used that five dollars for lunch for both of us.

Sure the wait staff in some places work hard, but in an establishment where the wait staff is paid a salary, isn't it over the top to feel that they are entitled to a certain amount of money from customers who are just as hard working as they are?

I read about this a couple places today. If it's proven, and it appears it has been, that the customers did in fact leave a tip and the note was written by the waitress... she may end up in jail. She received money from people who bought her story and sent her money. That makes it fraudulent.

This issue in general, the sob story (if proven false) of being denied a tip because she was gay is different than the topic of tips vs wages/salary.

The bigger issue is the waitress manufacturing a story for financial gain. Anytime some other asshole denies a tip to someone for being gay or black or whatever.. it will be viewed with skepticism now. She should have to pay full restitution to anyone that sent her money, apologize to the couple that DID tip her, and lose her job. I know I wouldn't want her to be my server. She's a grifter. I mean, she had to print two copies of the merchant copy, pre thought scheme. Make a false statement on one, then actually use the other to actually process the meal plus tip!!

edit... if it is proven that the couple DID write the note and stiff the waitress, they deserve all the ridicule and scorn they get for being assholes.

When the debate is lost, slander becomes the tool of the loser. Socrates

Joined: 10/30/2013Posts: 1,043Location: Hogwarts School of Witchcraft and Wizardry, United

We in Britain find it hilarious that it is almost madatory to tip in America. The TV Pressenter Stephen Fry tells a story about how he was chased down the street by a waiter because he didn't tip. This is ludicrous. Why should we tip if we feel the service is inadequate? If someone chased me down the street, I'd deck them. If a member of waiting staff rolled their eyes at me for the tip I gave, I tell them to give me the tip back and that I want to speak to their manager to complain. When I feel I hve been given good service, I tip well, but not until then.

Also, Americans are offended if a tip is not 20%??? L O L.The Doctor

~ "Oh, now what's this, then? I love this. A big, flashy-lighty thing. That's what brought me here. Big, flashy-lighty things have got me written all over them. Not actually, but give me time... and a crayon.”

~ “I'd forgotten not all victories are about saving the universe.”

~ “900 years of time and space and I’ve never met anyone who wasn’t important.”

~ “I am, and always will be, the optimist. The hoper of far-flung hopes, and the dreamer of improbable dreams.”

We in Britain find it hilarious that it is almost madatory to tip in America. The TV Pressenter Stephen Fry tells a story about how he was chased down the street by a waiter because he didn't tip. This is ludicrous. Why should we tip if we feel the service is inadequate? If someone chased me down the street, I'd deck them. If a member of waiting staff rolled their eyes at me for the tip I gave, I tell them to give me the tip back and that I want to speak to their manager to complain. When I feel I hve been given good service, I tip well, but not until then.

Also, Americans are offended if a tip is not 20%??? L O L.

If the service was terrible you should do what I do and leave 20p or something... Then if they look at you weird or anything you can say "oh I didn't want you to think I forgot to tip and I'm the rude one, your service was just appalling" ... Smile and walk out

My sister and I both agreed from the beginning that this was fake. The reason is because not too long ago a server at a red lobster did something similar. In that case, they had a handwriting analysis done and confirmed that the person whose receipt it was did not write the offensive note.

I ALWAYS tip and if the service is crap, I tip a few pennies. I did that once when the lady forgot my food while the other six people already dug into their meals.

I worked food service from busboy to owner with 75 employees and have done it all. Tipping is totally up to the customers. I have walked out of places when I found out they had a minimum required tip. THAT pissed the Matre'd off big time.

True or false, one or the other party is absolutely wrong. If the waitress lied it's fraud and she should be punished. If the waitress told the truth the customer is a bigoted asshole and should be shunned.

My oldest son, 54 now, is gay and one of the better men I know.

My middle brother, 66 now, is an Oklahoma, Bible Banging, Born Again Baptist and I want to kick him in his crotch sometimes for what he says. He is my brother though so I love him too.

My understanding is that the server was angry because the family said "oh your not a Dan."

Petty response on her end ... Saddest part is she is a Marine.

According to the customers, who at this point have more credibility, they only said/thought that because when the hostess sat them, they were told "your server for tonight is Dan". Simple misunderstanding and nothing more than a friendly comment.. "hey, you're not a Dan." The couple could be lying about that but at this point I believe them instead of the waitress. Her reactions and answers to a reporter's questions convinced me it was a total lie. She was caught and had no explanations.

Even if the couple's comment did piss her off, that's no reason to do what she did. If she were really pissed at them, she should/could have done something to them or their food. Not bilk innocent people with a made up story of bigotry that benefits herself.

When the debate is lost, slander becomes the tool of the loser. Socrates

I saw an interview where she said that she would have spit in their food if they hadn't had kids with them. That's just disgusting to me, especially since it's been proved that she had in fact been tipped and the note was fake. For a waitress to say they would have put their bodily fluids into someone else's food on national television and still be working in a restaurant and handling more people's food is disturbing.

I don't go out to eat often, but next time I do, it won't be to the Gallop Asian Bistro. If a dentist said they would spit in the mouthwash of a rude person or a doctor said that they would have spit in a rude patient's medication I'm pretty sure they would be fired or loose their license or something.

I think it was vile of her to try to pull such a stunt thinking that the family would never fire back. Plus, since when did not tipping or not giving a certain amount become a crime? Quite recently I went to lunch with a friend and between the two of us we had exactly fifty dollars. When we got the bill for forty five dollars we gave the fifty and told the waitress to keep the change. She rolled her eyes at us and said, "thanks a lot," clearly sarcastically as though five dollars wasn't enough of a tip. We could have easily gone to McDonald's instead and used that five dollars for lunch for both of us.

Sure the wait staff in some places work hard, but in an establishment where the wait staff is paid a salary, isn't it over the top to feel that they are entitled to a certain amount of money from customers who are just as hard working as they are?

The tipped wage in my state is $2.13, I don't know any restaurants that pay servers a salary. I really don't get people who spend over $20 for lunch without a second thought, yet balk when it is time to leave a tip. 15%-20% is standard for average service, but of course it's not mandatory, and you shouldn't get a bad attitude from the server over the amount. Sometimes generous folks make up for the cheapskates (or British person ).

The waitress in this story though should obviously be fired and seek treatment, she sounds mentally unstable.

I think the real problem is that most diners don't really get that servers' pay is so criminally low, and that tips - minimum 15% tipping - barely get most servers to minimum wage. There are no other low-end jobs that are so dependent on the 'kindness' of a constant stream of strangers judging every aspect of your job performance. I wasn't fully cognizant of it until late into my 20's. Unless a restaurant says "no tipping" or unless a server has been actively offensive (which has never happened to me), I always leave a real tip.

That said this particular server, the emerging evidence seems to indicate, made a false accusation, and hurt herself, and anyone else who might _actually_ get stiffed out of bigotry.

According to the customers, who at this point have more credibility, they only said/thought that because when the hostess sat them, they were told "your server for tonight is Dan". Simple misunderstanding and nothing more than a friendly comment.. "hey, you're not a Dan." The couple could be lying about that but at this point I believe them instead of the waitress. Her reactions and answers to a reporter's questions convinced me it was a total lie. She was caught and had no explanations.

I agree with you 100%. The back story was there but the forum posters above me were not getting the gist of why she would have ever been mad in the first place. Did she over react? Oh yes. Am I defending her at all? Not in the least. I just wanted to interject a little "point" into the board in hopes that it might keep everyone from wanting to roll Ms. Danya through the coals.

When she can't handle questions from the reporter and the restaurant isn't producing the document it becomes more tell-tale. Thanks for pointing out the facts, I should have taken the time to flush them all out for everyone in an attempt to help those that don't read the article but only the headline.

Joined: 10/30/2013Posts: 1,043Location: Hogwarts School of Witchcraft and Wizardry, United

I find it incredible that America, supposedly the super power of the world doesnt have a national minimum wage and is happy for places to employ people whlith the idea that they can under pay them because tips will make up the shortfall. That is disgusting and disgraceful in any developed country. I still wont tip unless the service and food justify it. If a waiter badgered me for a tip he'd get his head bitten off big time.The Doctor

~ "Oh, now what's this, then? I love this. A big, flashy-lighty thing. That's what brought me here. Big, flashy-lighty things have got me written all over them. Not actually, but give me time... and a crayon.”

~ “I'd forgotten not all victories are about saving the universe.”

~ “900 years of time and space and I’ve never met anyone who wasn’t important.”

~ “I am, and always will be, the optimist. The hoper of far-flung hopes, and the dreamer of improbable dreams.”

I find it incredible that America, supposedly the super power of the world doesnt have a national minimum wage and is happy for places to employ people whlith the idea that they can under pay them because tips will make up the shortfall. That is disgusting and disgraceful in any developed country. I still wont tip unless the service and food justify it. If a waiter badgered me for a tip he'd get his head bitten off big time.

I honestly think that the above belong to another thread.

Anywayyy.. In America, as I assume you mean the US of A. The national (Federal) minimum wage right now is $7.25 per hour. The highest minimum wage as of now is $9.19 per hour in the state of Washington. If it’s too little or too much that is another matter but there’s a national minimum wage.

There are just a few states with varied minimum wages, as a result of different internal reasons. But also over a third of the US with wages higher than the minimum.

The point is that it is a big country, with many laws, rules and way of lives. It should not be compared with any single nation. An European Nation for example could be just as big as a single US state.. just putting things in the right perspective. Apple vs apples, not watermelons.

Jam_Wil_Mac wrote:

I still wont tip unless the service and food justify it. If a waiter badgered me for a tip he'd get his head bitten off big time.

Forgive me as I could be wrong, but the above statement suggest me of maybe a difficulty in pleasing. Also, if the food was not to your liking it could be that it was different from your expectation or if it was justifiably bad.. it was not the waiter fault... It's however your call to tip as you please. I usually tips more that the appropriate. It feels damn good! Try it. Lets not even talk of when you go back and the waiter recognizes you, but the reason that I do it and started doing it.. it was because it feels good.

Also, as I discuss the order with the waiter I find that some nice and relaxed words go a long way.. If I'm serious the waiter gets stiff.

=================================================

Now back to the thread. The person is an attention seeker and it backfired as it should, and it is happened before.. so, she does not learn her lessons. The result? The “non tipping” patrons came out and proved also with the credit card statement that they left $18 tip.. and guess what? Now, they are suing the establishment… NOW THAT’S AN ISSUE THAT YOU COULD ARGUE ABOUT. USA’s SUING INJUSTICE

Be Well.

Choose n Practice Happiness

Life is simple; we are what we eat and what we read. Talk is superfluous.

I find it incredible that America, supposedly the super power of the world doesnt have a national minimum wage and is happy for places to employ people whlith the idea that they can under pay them because tips will make up the shortfall. That is disgusting and disgraceful in any developed country. I still wont tip unless the service and food justify it. If a waiter badgered me for a tip he'd get his head bitten off big time.

Do your homework Jam. There is a national minimum wage in the USA and some states have imposed an even higher minimum wage. Many but not all wait staff people can easily make much more with their tips. A very large percentage do not report all of their tips and get some tax free income. Wait staff people work a very hard job and should always be tipped unless they did something awful to you. I always like to tip higher than is expected, unless they provide substandard service, in which I leave just 15%. The vast majority of people who work as wait staff are honest, hardworking, and they are just getting by. Some at more upscale restaurants actually make a higher than average income.

Why this person would lie is anyone's guess. Maybe she is an attention seeker? Maybe she didn't like the customer's lifestyle? But whatever it is, the customer seems to be able to back up their claim that they left a tip and did not leave the note. The restaurant and server haven't adequately supported her claim. There are bad apples everywhere and from every group. We should just form an opinion on someone for their individual character.

People who know her and have worked with her have been saying that they weren't surprised it was a lie. Apparently she's done outrageous things for attention on the job in the past like faking cancer for tips and sympathy.

I find it incredible that America, supposedly the super power of the world doesnt have a national minimum wage and is happy for places to employ people whlith the idea that they can under pay them because tips will make up the shortfall. That is disgusting and disgraceful in any developed country. I still wont tip unless the service and food justify it. If a waiter badgered me for a tip he'd get his head bitten off big time.

Here in Ontario, Canada, we have a minimum wage but they actually made it lower for servers precisely because they figure they will make up the difference in tips. Some FB friends and I were discussing this recently and agree that they should get the same minimum as everyone else regardless of tipping since they are taxed on the tips anyway (assuming they report them honestly).

The other issue that's come up here (not sure about other jurisdictions) is pooling. Tips go into a pool and are distributed such that your server gets some, but so do the cook, busboys, etc. The further problem we had in Ontario (not sure if it's been addressed, yet, but it was under discussion) was that in some places that do this, the manager or owner would take a skim before dividing up the pool. With credit card tips, the credit fee would also get deducted from the tip in some cases (apparently, I haven't seen this one myself). All of these result in the server getting less of the tip which makes the fact that they get a lower minimum wage BASED ON GETTING TIPS even more problematic.

It seems odd that something as simple as tipping is a social/political issue but it is.

One of my favorite, and most viewed, stories. Bill and his daughter-in-law Becky relieve their sexual frustration with a steamy summer fling.

I find it incredible that America, supposedly the super power of the world doesnt have a national minimum wage and is happy for places to employ people whlith the idea that they can under pay them because tips will make up the shortfall. That is disgusting and disgraceful in any developed country. I still wont tip unless the service and food justify it. If a waiter badgered me for a tip he'd get his head bitten off big time.

Now that we've cleared up the fact that there is, in fact, a national minimum wage, and that it is lower for service industry workers, all I can say is that there are two ways of looking at it. One way is to pay a "livable wage" to all service industry employees and reduce the tip culture dramatically, since employees no longer depend on them to live on. My understanding is that all or most of Europe is set up this way, but correct me if I'm wrong. The other way is to set a baseline (admittedly, almost nothing) wage and let the worker earn whatever he can in tips.

Personally, it works out much better for me to earn my money off of straight cash exchange then it would be if I was suddenly given an hourly wage and expected to suffice off of it. I know it's a complicated issue, and even outside of the service industry, the minimum wage isn't nearly high enough to support somebody, much less their family too. But if I'm given a straight-up choice? Please, please don't try to give me a "liveable wage". Let me earn my tips; I'm doing very, very well with that.

Joined: 10/19/2009Posts: 5,833Location: Right here on Lush Stories..., United States

Mazza wrote:

Wow, I saw this posted on FB the other day - I didn't know this was a stunt - whatever did she hope to achieve?

Well...she got her name in the national news alright...though not in quite the way she intended, I'm sure...I have a feeling she won't be trying that trick again anytime soon though...You know you want it, you know you need it bad...get it now on Amazon.com...Lush Erotica, an Anthology of Award Winning Sex Stories

Joined: 10/30/2013Posts: 1,043Location: Hogwarts School of Witchcraft and Wizardry, United

I must a humble retraction. I was under the impression that the USA had no minimum wage. I was incorrect and foolish to make an assumption purely because I had never heard of such a thing.I am not in the habit of making rash assumptions and I apologise for doing so here.

However, my issue is not with tiping or even how much one should tip, it is the principle of waiting staff expecting a tip. Now that I know they have a minimum wage to support them I find this even more rude, presuptuous and insulting. A waiter/waitress will get a tip from me if their work has deserved it. I always try to be polite, as my grandfather would've kicked mybutt if i hadn't been, some waiting staff are not great at customer service. I have worked as a waiter and it can be a thankless job, but it is not overly difficult. The Doctor

~ "Oh, now what's this, then? I love this. A big, flashy-lighty thing. That's what brought me here. Big, flashy-lighty things have got me written all over them. Not actually, but give me time... and a crayon.”

~ “I'd forgotten not all victories are about saving the universe.”

~ “900 years of time and space and I’ve never met anyone who wasn’t important.”

~ “I am, and always will be, the optimist. The hoper of far-flung hopes, and the dreamer of improbable dreams.”

Sometimes generous folks make up for the cheapskates (or British person

It's not that the British are cheapskates particularly, it's just that tipping here is seen as a reward for particularly good service, rather than an automatic thing, culturally it's not the same as in the US. And, if you are in a job where tipping makes up part of your wages, then (in my opinion) you should work for that extra cash rather than just expect it.

I tend to tip, as generously as is fair, or I can afford, IF the service is good and if it's outstanding, I'll leave the best tip I can.

I know that service sector jobs like this tend not to be very well paid, but there is a reason for that, they are the sort of job that you can go into with no qualifications, or work part time to fit in with studies, family, to supplement your income or whatever - you don't need a degree or specific qualifications to do it. People who work in these sorts of jobs often do it as a stopgap, rather than a career choice. So, in my experience, you get a lot of people in this line of work who are doing it out of necessity rather than choice (well, you know what I mean, it's their choice to do it, but they'd probably be doing something else). That's not to say of course that you can't carve out an excellent and enjoyable career in this field, of course, but what I'm getting at is that there are a lot of people doing this sort of thing who don't want to be and quite often, that's sadly reflected in their attitude.

Although the wages are low, the hours are long and you're often hard at work whilst others are out enjoying themselves, they ARE choosing to do that job and they ARE being paid (albeit badly) for it. If they do it especially well, then they will be tipped and probably be able to earn a decent enough wage, not to mention the fact that you're much more likely to enjoy what you're doing.

I worked in pubs and clubs for many years - some paid quite well, others not so much - I had good bosses and shitty ones, great colleagues and not so great, but I usually at the very least doubled my wages in tips. Why? Because I was bloody good at it and worked incredibly hard. I was attentive to the customers, could add up orders in my head, was efficient and friendly. It didn't matter that I had no intention of doing it for the rest of my life, I made sure that when I was at work, I was doing it to the very best of my ability and my tips more than reflected that.

As with any job that you deal with the public, you will always get eejits - that's just life, but generally speaking, your attitude will win out and the good will outweigh the bad.

If I'm in a restaurant and the service is good, then I will always tip - even if the food isn't so wonderful, because the tip is for the server, not the chef. Even if I have a complaint, I will still give a tip if they deal with any problems properly.

What I have come across over here though, are restaurants who do not give the tips to the staff, or "pool" the tips and split them between all of the staff, which seems unfair to me, given that the servers are the ones who actually earn them.

@keoloke - I think JWM's post was absolutely relevant in this thread...

I must a humble retraction. I was under the impression that the USA had no minimum wage. I was incorrect and foolish to make an assumption purely because I had never heard of such a thing.I am not in the habit of making rash assumptions and I apologise for doing so here.

However, my issue is not with tiping or even how much one should tip, it is the principle of waiting staff expecting a tip. Now that I know they have a minimum wage to support them I find this even more rude, presuptuous and insulting. A waiter/waitress will get a tip from me if their work has deserved it. I always try to be polite, as my grandfather would've kicked mybutt if i hadn't been, some waiting staff are not great at customer service. I have worked as a waiter and it can be a thankless job, but it is not overly difficult.

Are you purposely missing the point? Yes, there is a national minimum wage, but as it's been pointed out a few times above, it is much lower for wait staff. Their wage is usually about $2-2.50 an hour. It is certainly not a wage you can live on, so they depend on tips to make a living. Why is that so difficult to understand???

It's absolutely disgusting if she made this up, and I'm so happy that the family stepped up and said something if it actually is false.

Now that I know they have a minimum wage to support them I find this even more rude, presuptuous and insulting.

Insulting how?

Do you think $2.13/hour is a sustainable wage? Do you really feel like you've done your part by tipping nothing and that they'll somehow make it on that paltry wage? Your profile shows you to be from the UK. I'll presume that it takes more than 2.13/hour for you to live there. We can criticize the system all we want, and it's ripe for criticism for sure, but the system being what it is: how it is rude, insulting, or presumptuous to expect a tip? Unless you're a selfish sociopath with no concern for others, you understand and accept that as part of the unwritten social contract: if you're going to go out for a meal, or a drink, the gratuity is going to be part of the overall cost. Otherwise, it must mean that you're either a jerk or are unable to afford it, thus you stay home.

Of course, the extreme examples- such as the lady who inspired this thread, or people who are genuine assholes to customers- are not what we're discussing. I've stiffed a waitstaffer once in my life. Believe me when I tell you, they deserved that and more. But standard service, or even sub-standard, as everyone has bad days: you still tip. Besides being part of the deal, it's simple compassion for fellow humans. If the system works better in your part of the world, I commend it.

Do you think $2.13/hour is a sustainable wage? Do you really feel like it's you've done your part by tipping nothing and that they'll somehow make it on the paltry wage? Your profile shows you to be from the UK. I'll presume that it takes more than 2.15/hour for you to live there. We can criticize the system all we want, and it's ripe for criticism for sure, but the system being what it is: how it is rude, insulting, or presumptuous to expect a tip? Unless you're a selfish sociopath with no concern for others, you understand and accept that as part of the unwritten social contract: if you're going to go out for a meal, or a drink, the gratuity is going to be part of the overall cost. Otherwise, it must mean that you're either a jerk or are unable to afford it, thus you stay home.

I'm curious, does that mean if you can't afford to leave what is considered an acceptable or generous tip you should stay home? When I was in college, my roommates and I were flat broke but we had the night out jar, we would save up and every month we would treat ourselves to a meal out maybe every 2 months, sometimes we wouldn't have enough to leave more than a $2 tip on a meal. That didn't mean we didn't want to, we couldn't afford it, so by the reasoning above, we should have stayed in our dorm rooms and not gone out at all since all we could pay for was the food minus a big tip?

I'm curious, does that mean if you can't afford to leave what is considered an acceptable or generous tip you should stay home? When I was in college, my roommates and I were flat broke but we had the night out jar, we would save up and every month we would treat ourselves to a meal out maybe every 2 months, sometimes we wouldn't have enough to leave more than a $2 tip on a meal. That didn't mean we didn't want to, we couldn't afford it, so by the reasoning above, we should have stayed in our dorm rooms and not gone out at all since all we could pay for was the food minus a big tip?

As a service industry worker, I'm probably biased more than most on this, but yes, I'd say avoid eating out if you can only do it at the expense of a reasonable gratuity for the waitstaff. Poverty isn't a good thing to pay forward, but a miniscule or non-existent tip kind of does that, unfortunately.

Of course, that presumes that the place you eat is a traditional table service establishment. Plenty of good stuff can be found via counter service, which despite often presenting tip jars, does not really behoove the customer to tip a particular amount (or at all).

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