Well, this post is either going to flame me, or spark a nice discussion. Whichever, it is something I want to get off of my chest.

Does anyone remember when urethane was king, folks talking about "2 o'clock" pin positions, or the "4:30 drilling" or stuff like that? I always wondered how the ball knew what to do with an absolute pin position; everyone's track and PAP were different, but I was made to believe that a 4:30 pin would be early and smooth.My eyes never believed it, but the brain was sold.

RICO has been around for a bit now, since 2008 according to the article on bowlingknowledge.info. (check it out here: http://bowlingknowledge.info/index.php? ... &Itemid=47 )If you fix the drill angle for a ball at 45*, you will, by definition, create a variable VAL angle from customer to customer. In addition, when dealing with a symmetric core, the initial drill angle is irrelevant, anyway. Another variable, not defined by the "layout guide" is the Pin to PAP distance.

This drilling setup is somewhat of a sham. It will be an early rolling layout for asymmetrical balls, but really, there is no magic "pin in the palm" layout without hard numbers (coordinates, VAL angle values, pin to pap distances, etc.)

Want an early rolling, smooth ball? Grab an asymmetric ball, draw a 45* angle. Decide how much forward roll you want (longer pin to pap distances), or if you want to retain tilt longer (shorter pin to pap distances, ie. 4" or less). Pay attention to the VAL angle-- make it 60 to 80*. There. A full recipe for an early rolling, smooth reaction for speed dominant or rev challenged players who need something to start up on longer or flatter patterns.

Let's quit talking about RICO like it's a one-size-fits-all layout, where all you need is a 45* drill angle, and the pin in the center of the palm.

I'd be willing to bet dollars to donuts that someone out there has had a ball laid out like that, and it was a dud, while his buddy's ball, laid out the same way, was a monster. Now you know why.

Thanks to JustinWi for putting up enough information for me to finally wrap my head around this.

Now-Flame or discussion. Am I full of shist or what are your observations?

I have drilled a few Rico layouts for myself and for a few others bowlers all are happy with the balls reactions on THS. So for me the jury is out on this one. I am a high speed low rev guy and I have a Track 300C a PinK Panther and a Tabo all with Rico drills on them and they are players for me. I have 2 slow speed cranker that each one has one ball drilled Rico and they like them. The rest of my stuff is duel angle with a wiki fit that I am about to try Mo's performance fit on to increase my revs. To rico or not to rico that is the question. My Motiv balls are drilled with Justins help and I have no desire to drill one of these balls Rico. I believe that with different cores and shells each ball has a different look and ajusting the layout to get the look from each ball that works for each person is the better way to go.

I'm not questioning the performance of any ball, but if you were to use the dual angle method to map you Rico balls, and did the same for the guys you know who also have Rico balls, I'd be willing to bet that the numbers aren't the same at all, and most likely a wide enough variance so as to prove my point.

Rico should not drive you so nuts but the guys that write that they have their guy drill their ball pin under or over my ring cg kicked out to the rt or left 1 inch or more and a balance hole . then they write a review that means nothing because they hate this ball

I will certainly agree with that, too! Same principle applies. People want to boil concepts down so much and apply them so broadly. What ever happened to American scholarship? When did it become cool to be ignorant, and not cool to know your stuff?

Probably about the time yelling "Nerd!" became funny in the movies. I thought that maybe the only good thing to come out of the 9/11 tragedy was the death of snarkiness and cynicism, but they seem to be making a comeback.

mick, i have a friend who thinks rico layouts are "money" as we call it. i had one drilled that way and it was as good as a plastic ball. couldnt even get it to wiggle. unfortunately i am one of those pin here, cg there bowlers because i dont have a shop who does the dual angles. so i have Justin help me with layouts, he takes a picture of the layout on a blank drill drawn up and i drill it as i see it in the picture he sends....cant better yourself if you dont have the tools to do so =/

"Rico's are vague depending on PAPs, but my suggestion is 15 / 5 / 50 with a P4 hole for symmetricals. I wouldn't do it on an asym. because regular "Dual Angle" layouts are so precise and accurate for asyms." - Mo Pinel

"A small drilling angle combined with a less flaring pin and a VAL angle that placed the pin just above the fingers is how I get Rico reaction with more hit and no chance of flaring over a hole." - Mo Pinel

The RICO layout was first used at the Mini Eliminator for rev dominant players to combat the high amount of friction. The layout has a different measurement for every player so the results are unpredictable. With a VAL angle often in excess of 90* the second transition often doesn't happen, making the ball never hit the roll phase and therefore not reaching a point of maximum carry. Because of my rev dominance I could potentially make use of the layout on friction, but it is very condition specific. I tried it on a QZ2 and couldn't carry the 7 pin 85% of the time.

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