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My local group refuses to allow me to run D20 Future (3rd Edition) because they hate the rules, so I'm looking for an alternative. I heard about this game called Starfinder and I wondered if anyone here might have experience with the setting.

A few questions:

D20 Future had rules for running different Teirs. How does Starfinder handle the question of different technology levels?

How fluid is the system, is it simple to use? Is it based off a D20 System, or is it more akin to something else?

Togusa wrote:My local group refuses to allow me to run D20 Future (3rd Edition) because they hate the rules, so I'm looking for an alternative. I heard about this game called Starfinder and I wondered if anyone here might have experience with the setting.

A few questions:

D20 Future had rules for running different Teirs. How does Starfinder handle the question of different technology levels?

How fluid is the system, is it simple to use? Is it based off a D20 System, or is it more akin to something else?

How does its skill system function?

It doesn't have different tech levels. However, more advanced/powerful weapons cost more and can house more enchantments. Basically, your equipment is limited by level and wealth, and the GM can control wealth fairly easily. If you've played Pathfinder or D&D, it's pretty similar - high tech is incredibly expensive.

System wise, it's D20, not much changes. Spellcasters have 6 levels of spells instead of nine, and ranged combat is more emphasized than physical, because guns.

Skills are basically the same as Pathfinder/D&D3.0/3.5 - skill ranks included, with relevant skills like Computer, Engineering and Pilot added.

Togusa wrote:My local group refuses to allow me to run D20 Future (3rd Edition) because they hate the rules, so I'm looking for an alternative. I heard about this game called Starfinder and I wondered if anyone here might have experience with the setting.

A few questions:

D20 Future had rules for running different Teirs. How does Starfinder handle the question of different technology levels?

How fluid is the system, is it simple to use? Is it based off a D20 System, or is it more akin to something else?

How does its skill system function?

It doesn't have different tech levels. However, more advanced/powerful weapons cost more and can house more enchantments. Basically, your equipment is limited by level and wealth, and the GM can control wealth fairly easily. If you've played Pathfinder or D&D, it's pretty similar - high tech is incredibly expensive.

System wise, it's D20, not much changes. Spellcasters have 6 levels of spells instead of nine, and ranged combat is more emphasized than physical, because guns.

Skills are basically the same as Pathfinder/D&D3.0/3.5 - skill ranks included, with relevant skills like Computer, Engineering and Pilot added.

The only thing I don't like is the focus on "magic." But I might be able to just cut that out.

Togusa wrote:My local group refuses to allow me to run D20 Future (3rd Edition) because they hate the rules, so I'm looking for an alternative. I heard about this game called Starfinder and I wondered if anyone here might have experience with the setting.

A few questions:

D20 Future had rules for running different Teirs. How does Starfinder handle the question of different technology levels?

How fluid is the system, is it simple to use? Is it based off a D20 System, or is it more akin to something else?

How does its skill system function?

It doesn't have different tech levels. However, more advanced/powerful weapons cost more and can house more enchantments. Basically, your equipment is limited by level and wealth, and the GM can control wealth fairly easily. If you've played Pathfinder or D&D, it's pretty similar - high tech is incredibly expensive.

System wise, it's D20, not much changes. Spellcasters have 6 levels of spells instead of nine, and ranged combat is more emphasized than physical, because guns.

Skills are basically the same as Pathfinder/D&D3.0/3.5 - skill ranks included, with relevant skills like Computer, Engineering and Pilot added.

The only thing I don't like is the focus on "magic." But I might be able to just cut that out.

Thanks!

Either dont let players pick those classes or call them psionc abilities. Or just steal the psionic classes from pathfinder.

These are my opinions. This is how I feel. Others may feel differently. This needs to be stated for some reason.

As mentioned above, Starfinder is simply Pathfinder in space, and Pathfinder was created as an extension of D&D's 3.5 era (D&D's peak, in my opinion) after it moved onto other editions. Which is why i permanently quit D&D and happily graduated to Pathfinder.

And as a big sci-fi fan (and believer in Paizo since they clearly shared my love for D&D 3.5 enough to revive it and explore its continued evolution) i tried out Starfinder as soon as it came out and have been playing it ever since.

So yes, Starfinder is literally D&D in space, plain and simple. Just add spaceship combat, some new mechanics for tech and shooting, and aliens, etc. But the skills, tech, and any other system-related stuff is simply the same as D20 D&D and Pathfinder.

All you need is the Core Rulebook, and optionally one of the adventure modules if you don't want to come up with something of your own.
All-around solid game.

Extras: the Alien Archive is just a monster manual, so fun but not necessary. The Armory, on the other hand, is pretty meaty by adding a lot of cool new equipment and expands some classes. Again not necessary, but definitely filled with substance.

A GM I know was very fond of Pathfinder and eagerly awaited the release of Starfinder. He preordered books and ran a campaign the moment it released. He ran that campaign for a year.

As of two weeks ago, he told me that if you want to run a starfinder, just run a pathfinder in space. There are significant issues with Starfinder that he hopes will be resolved in 2nd edition but for now, Pathfinder with space stuff is better.

Starfinder would have been a fantastic system if it had just stuck with space and technology. But no, they had to add in magic. Let's just say there are a lot of interesting and inconsistent rules interactions. For example, Token Spells, basically cantrips, say you can slowly move a light bulk object. Bulk in the game concerns itself with the weight and unwieldiness of an item. Well guess what. In space, there is not 'weight', only mass. So I argued that in the big boss fight where we suddenly turned off the gravity, I should be able to use my token spell that allows no saving throw, magic resistance, or requires a skill check or attack roll, to rotate the big bad guy so that his back is to us, and because he isn't close to a hand hold or has any kind of "jet pack", I should be able to keep him in place for the full duration of the spell.

Similarly, star ship combat is measured in hexes, but no size is given for the hexes... it's very, very abstract. This is no Full Thrust or Star Fleet Battles style combat. I will say they did a great job using crew, so that each party member can actually do something that affects the combat.

Basically, as others have said, it's Pathfinder... in space. There is nothing unique here, except the weapons are far more deadly. "Here, let me hit you with my Ultraserrated Longsword that does 8d10 damage and on a crit, you'll take 6d6 bleed damage." And that's a pretty tame melee weapon. Armor class is split between an Energy and Kinetic Armor Class, and it's relatively easy to get a 25+ AC in both. Pazio had to introduce item levels to rate the... effectiveness? Dangerousness of items, and give a strong warning about allowing characters to have items above their level. I'm like "OK, we have this futuristic, high technology culture with guns that throw black holes, but I can't have one because I'm only level 3? What can I use? Oh, a Lazergun that does 1d8 damage. Hmm...."

There is a lot of potential in the system, but it needs a lot more work, and far too much is left up to the GM to fix. I'd give it a pass until 2nd ed.

Kara Sloan shoots through Time and Design Space for a Negative Play Experience

Tamwulf wrote:Starfinder would have been a fantastic system if it had just stuck with space and technology. But no, they had to add in magic. Let's just say there are a lot of interesting and inconsistent rules interactions. For example, Token Spells, basically cantrips, say you can slowly move a light bulk object. Bulk in the game concerns itself with the weight and unwieldiness of an item. Well guess what. In space, there is not 'weight', only mass. So I argued that in the big boss fight where we suddenly turned off the gravity, I should be able to use my token spell that allows no saving throw, magic resistance, or requires a skill check or attack roll, to rotate the big bad guy so that his back is to us, and because he isn't close to a hand hold or has any kind of "jet pack", I should be able to keep him in place for the full duration of the spell.

Similarly, star ship combat is measured in hexes, but no size is given for the hexes... it's very, very abstract. This is no Full Thrust or Star Fleet Battles style combat. I will say they did a great job using crew, so that each party member can actually do something that affects the combat.

Basically, as others have said, it's Pathfinder... in space. There is nothing unique here, except the weapons are far more deadly. "Here, let me hit you with my Ultraserrated Longsword that does 8d10 damage and on a crit, you'll take 6d6 bleed damage." And that's a pretty tame melee weapon. Armor class is split between an Energy and Kinetic Armor Class, and it's relatively easy to get a 25+ AC in both. Pazio had to introduce item levels to rate the... effectiveness? Dangerousness of items, and give a strong warning about allowing characters to have items above their level. I'm like "OK, we have this futuristic, high technology culture with guns that throw black holes, but I can't have one because I'm only level 3? What can I use? Oh, a Lazergun that does 1d8 damage. Hmm...."

There is a lot of potential in the system, but it needs a lot more work, and far too much is left up to the GM to fix. I'd give it a pass until 2nd ed.

Stuff like this shouldn't be too big a problem for our group, we use the rules more like a set of optional guidelines, not as 100% must be followed. Thanks all! I'm going to check this out!

I tried Starfinder and the best way to describe it would be as a Science Fantasy rpg and NOT scifi. It really did feel like playing D&D in the future/space and not in a good way for me as I was expecting a fully fleshed out scifi game. Firing your futuristic plasma weapon is mechanically no different than firing a bow and all that future tech gives you no additional options for the most part. Things like burst fire, indirect, or semi/full auto fire for example that you'd expect to find in a modern setting RPG are largely absent except from a select few (usually "heavy") weapons. After GMing for two sessions after playing in one (and as the only player willing to do so), we called it quits.

In the month since, I've seen the armoury book that just came out and it did introduce a few additional options for modern/scifi combat basics like bipods/tripods and more but it's too little, too late for us. I really enjoyed the look of the alien races and armor in it (moreso than any scifi universe I've been introduced to since Mass Effect just prior to the release of the 3rd game in that trilogy) but, despite the open beta, it felt like a half assed port of Pathfinder into space. The reuse of the actual Pathfinder Universe (Golarion and its races and magic) hand waved into the distant future didn't help with that either. If you're OK with D&D3.85 in space then I'd say definitely look it up.

Here is my first impression (literally after the first game where I wasn't GM yet) if you want to read a lengthier version of the above.