I've been wanting to bring more attention to this topic for a while, seeing it's pretty dead ever since the new years.

I believe that map props are a VERY important thing for the quality of maps, and would help a huge amount. No modern FPS I know of uses maps made only out of BSP, since detailing a map with BSP is very hard to do properly from my experience with it.

The props I believe to be most necessary are wall / floor / ceiling panels, doors and windows, tunnels and bridges, then other architectures like sci-fi computer tables and objects.

I also believe that outdoor props are very necessary as well! We have too few outdoor maps (and by outdoor I mean terrain only, with optional architecture and buildings). The only good ones I know of are Morphed's Arboria package, which includes some good trees, bushes, and other outdoor models. He used them in Arahia, and I'm trying to use them on a map of my own that I'm planning. They're very good in my opinion, and should certainly not be lost.

I looked for a few screenshots from other games, that show what a huge difference map models can make (as well as the design of map props that I'd personally suggest). Here they are:

And lastly, some from a map in my favorite shooter (alongside Xonotic), UT2004. One of the most detailed maps I know from it. Keep in mind UT2004 was RELEASED around 2004, meaning that such detail existed for it 7 years ago. Xonotic still lacks it for its own maps however.

Guys, never, never, ever try to follow the UT3 artstyle or try to implement anything similar to that.

ATM it's the best in-game graphics and art ever created, and I don't think anybody will surpass it in the foreseeable future. If you wonder what the hell I'm saying here - go play UT3, you'll see it. The art is a result of a collaborative effort of many highest-class artists that spent a few years (at least one year, but come think of it! a year!) creating it.

Trying to follow UT3 will lead you to nowhere. Same as chasing mirages.

Regardless of the fact that trying to copy what others have done, when it comes to art, is a)looked down upon and b)is destructive for the artist in the person that does it. Hope you understand what I mean.

This might look like a rant but... the very moment I saw that UT3 screenie I couldn't resist posting this.

I disagree because those screenshots are from UT2003 (or maybe UT2004), not UT3. I personally use UT2003 as the standard for what xonotic maps should look like specifically because it is the best example of what smart props and textures can achieve without per-pixel lighting, tessellation and real time soft shadows. Study those screenshots and learn from them.

I disagree because those screenshots are from UT2003 (or maybe UT2004), not UT3. I personally use UT2003 as the standard for what xonotic maps should look like specifically because it is the best example of what smart props and textures can achieve without per-pixel lighting, tessellation and real time soft shadows. Study those screenshots and learn from them.

The screenshot with the UDamage *is* UT3. The one with the violet light.

Well, UT2 had human graphics, probably something similar can be done. But not UT3.

And then, you seem to have a logic fallacy here. I was talking about Ut3. You said you disagree because it's UT2. If you're a coder, you might want to revise the way you think or express your thoughts.
BTW, is UT 2004 style the official style for Xonotic? I.e. maps of a style different from this one will not be accepted.

I personally think you underestimate the Xonotic team. They might not be able to get to UT3 graphics quickly, but given time they will be able to surpass even that. They have already made Ultra Nexuiz Graphics look bad compared to the Normal graphics in Xonotic, you just have to be patient with open source projects such as Xonotic

The strength in open source projects is that even if the Xonotic team were to separate, there can always be some other team that can continue the project. Thus in a sense open source projects are immortal in their development. While the UT3 graphics will stay constant, Xonotic will continue to be developed into a better and better game forever.

I'm talking about the *resources*, such as Models (especially Vehicles & Weapons & Players), Textures & Maps. This is it. Believe me, it's tens of human work-years (you know what I mean, not sure about the word though.)

The effects you can recreate, sure, as UT3 ran with DX9 (which corresponds to OpenGL 2?) and OpenGL 2 is available even in the open source video drivers nowadays.

Another thing you could do, regarding the engine, is move to OGl3/4, if you have the necessary time and manpower. That would be nice. Make OGl3/4 the only engine available. That will increase the requirements level by a few tiers, but in order to succeed you need to break compat and make non-popular decisions sometimes.

ATM it's the best in-game graphics and art ever created, and I don't think anybody will surpass it in the foreseeable future. If you wonder what the hell I'm saying here - go play UT3, you'll see it. The art is a result of a collaborative effort of many highest-class artists that spent a few years (at least one year, but come think of it! a year!) creating it.

Trying to follow UT3 will lead you to nowhere. Same as chasing mirages.

Regardless of the fact that trying to copy what others have done, when it comes to art, is a)looked down upon and b)is destructive for the artist in the person that does it. Hope you understand what I mean.

This might look like a rant but... the very moment I saw that UT3 screenie I couldn't resist posting this.

I disagree. As much as I'm not someone contributing to models & textures (since they're not my expertise), I have a clear ambition to help Xonotic get to the level most commercial shooters are at today. IMO, it's the only open source FPS game that has a high chance to get there anytime soon, even if it would take a lot of work.

Although I don't have too many expectations on the side of new models and textures (given that few people are making them, as I haven't seen many new ones ever since Xonotic was born), I will keep hope that in a few years, Xonotic will dare to challenge UT3... visually and with gameplay alike.

So yes, I do suggest to "follow UT3 style as well" personally. Because I see it as the best aim to try getting Xonotic as far as possible. Maybe once we brake a given barrier (if we do), Xonotic might even become a small internet phenomenon for an year or so... like UT did when it was released.

I've never played UT but from the screens posted they seem far to grungy for my preferance, possibly excepting the first one.

IMHO Xonotic is aiming more for Tron: Legacy style. Erebus and Nyx certainly look it, and personally I like it. Cube0wL was doing something with light-up panels as the player steps on them, which fit this very well too. The glowmod on the weapons Taoki did ( ) also look it. I have future plans for a map with this style to some extent.
/offtopic

LJHutch: I don't know much about exporting shaders and materials, but it would be cool if you could but the screen shader on the screen (it goes with a camera entity, acts like a one way warpzone).

<Samual> I am the most unprofessional developer ever
<bluez> halogene, you make awesome music, but you have no clue about ctf.
<Halogene> I didn't know mappers include some mysterious waypoints so members of the BOT clan can navigate a map?
<divVerent> if you don't pay for a premium account, your movement speed is limited to 100qu/s

(07-01-2011, 09:21 AM)LJFHutch Wrote: Working on a TV screen and speakers based on some concept art I did a while back:

And the model (apart from the screen it is untextured):

Very good! Should replace the ones in Techassault IMO. Nice work... hope they will be in soon

Just one problem with the screen: I don't know if an entity can be turned into a screen / warpzone. Currently, the surface of the screen needs to be BSP, and func_screen / func_warpzone. The model would need to be misc_gamemodel or misc_model.