On 12/08/2011, at 1:06 AM, Craig Weinberg whatsons...@gmail.com wrote:
Sure, muscles will contract for any old material that can conduct an
electric current. A muscle doesn't require a high level conversation
with the brain's cells to react. We can move in our sleep when we
aren't

On 11 Aug 2011, at 19:24, meekerdb wrote:
On 8/11/2011 7:14 AM, Stathis Papaioannou wrote:
In any case, I have made the thought experiment simpler by *assuming*
that the replacement component is mechanically equivalent to the
biological tissue. We can imagine that it is a black box animated

On 11 Aug 2011, at 14:16, Craig Weinberg wrote:
On Aug 11, 1:14 am, Stathis Papaioannou stath...@gmail.com wrote:
The conclusion is that such a device is
impossible because it leads to conceptual difficulties.
Consciousness itself leads to conceptual difficulties. Except for the
fact that

On 11 Aug 2011, at 08:55, Stephen P. King wrote:
On 8/11/2011 1:14 AM, Stathis Papaioannou wrote:
On Thu, Aug 11, 2011 at 1:20 PM, Stephen P. Kingstephe...@charter.net
wrote:
Please explain what would you think would happen if you replaced
part
of your brain with an unconscious

On Aug 12, 4:21 am, Stathis Papaioannou stath...@gmail.com wrote:
On 12/08/2011, at 1:06 AM, Craig Weinberg whatsons...@gmail.com wrote:
Sure, muscles will contract for any old material that can conduct an
electric current. A muscle doesn't require a high level conversation
with the

On Aug 12, 5:05 am, Bruno Marchal marc...@ulb.ac.be wrote:
On 11 Aug 2011, at 08:55, Stephen P. King wrote:
What special sauce? Why is it ok to assume that consciousness is
something special that can only occur is special circumstances? Why
not consider that possibility that it is

On 8/12/2011 2:00 AM, Bruno Marchal wrote:
On 11 Aug 2011, at 19:24, meekerdb wrote:
On 8/11/2011 7:14 AM, Stathis Papaioannou wrote:
In any case, I have made the thought experiment simpler by*assuming*
that the replacement component is mechanically equivalent to the
biological tissue. We

On 11.08.2011 22:46 meekerdb said the following:
On 8/11/2011 1:04 PM, Evgenii Rudnyi wrote:
...
I would say now that consciousness is conscious perception. The
main problem in my view though is who follows the narrative. Does
your theory answer such a question?
I'd say You do, there's no

On 12.08.2011 00:00 Craig Weinberg said the following:
On Aug 11, 4:04 pm, Evgenii Rudnyiuse...@rudnyi.ru wrote:
I would say now that consciousness is conscious perception. The
main problem in my view though is who follows the narrative. Does
your theory answer such a question?
Just as an

On 8/12/2011 11:00 AM, Evgenii Rudnyi wrote:
On 11.08.2011 22:46 meekerdb said the following:
On 8/11/2011 1:04 PM, Evgenii Rudnyi wrote:
...
I would say now that consciousness is conscious perception. The
main problem in my view though is who follows the narrative. Does
your theory answer

On Aug 12, 2:00 pm, Evgenii Rudnyi use...@rudnyi.ru wrote:
This the point that I do not understand. The question is here more what
exactly is the observer in my body. Presumably it is the brain. Then it
first constructs the world that I observe, than it observes the
constructed world. It is

On 12.08.2011 20:40 meekerdb said the following:
On 8/12/2011 11:00 AM, Evgenii Rudnyi wrote:
On 11.08.2011 22:46 meekerdb said the following:
On 8/11/2011 1:04 PM, Evgenii Rudnyi wrote:
...
I would say now that consciousness is conscious perception.
The main problem in my view though is

On 12.08.2011 20:47 Craig Weinberg said the following:
On Aug 12, 2:00 pm, Evgenii Rudnyiuse...@rudnyi.ru wrote:
This the point that I do not understand. The question is here more
what exactly is the observer in my body. Presumably it is the
brain. Then it first constructs the world that I

Dear Pilar,
as your fellow Not-English-Mothertongue guy. I point to the*incompleteness
* in this language:* Nothing - EXISTS not.* It isn't. But it is bad
English to write:
* Why 'is-not' nothing?* so we have a discussion point. In my
(non-IndoEuropean) mothertongue the question is exactly

On Aug 12, 3:41 pm, Evgenii Rudnyi use...@rudnyi.ru wrote:
It would be interesting to see how do you know this. Some revelation or
something else?
I don't know it, I just think that it could be the case. If you can
fully and finally reject the proposition that your own experiences
could be

What is there? Everything! So what isn't there? Nothing!
--- Norm Levitt, after Quine
On 8/12/2011 1:02 PM, John Mikes wrote:
Dear Pilar,
as your fellow Not-English-Mothertongue guy. I point to the*
incompleteness* in this language:*/ Nothing - _EXISTS_ not./* It
isn't. But it

Dear John, thank you for the feedback. My comments below..
On Fri, Aug 12, 2011 at 4:02 PM, John Mikes jami...@gmail.com wrote:
Dear Pilar,
as your fellow Not-English-Mothertongue guy. I point to the*incompleteness
* in this language:* Nothing - EXISTS not.* It isn't. But it is bad

On 8/12/2011 2:08 PM, Pilar Morales wrote:
I see you take it for granted that the Universe was born. Was it
indeed? Maybe OUR universe was, but I speak about the World
(Multiverse, none of them necessarily identical in any sense) in
which we inhabit a pretty simple one with

Brent,
Is it possible that zero could have negative charge, positive charge, and
neutral charge?
Which reminds me, why is it that the photon doesn't have an anti-particle
other than itself? It makes no sense to me that Bosons for the most part
don't have antimatter equivalents. I would think that

On 8/12/2011 4:33 PM, Pilar Morales wrote:
I was following the conversation on consciousness and life and was
trying to find out if there's a relationship between the number of
Bosons and Fermions in living organisms (as units and as parts of
larger more complex organisms) versus their ratio

On Aug 12, 8:28 pm, Pilar Morales pilarmorales...@gmail.com wrote:
gravitation and magnetism are manifestations of the same force,
just different reactions to interactions.
I think that is the case also. To me it seems possible that gravity,
like time, is not a true primitive phenomenon, but

On 8/12/2011 5:28 PM, Pilar Morales wrote:
Brent,
Is it possible that zero could have negative charge, positive charge,
and neutral charge?
Zero is the cardinality of the empty set. It's not part of the physical
world.
Which reminds me, why is it that the photon doesn't have an

On Aug 12, 9:55 pm, meekerdb meeke...@verizon.net wrote:
Photons don't carry charge. If they did they'd interact with other
photons and we wouldn't be able to see anything.
Would you say that what we see is photons? Even in our dreams?
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Are you the kind of person who knows math?
http://videosift.com/video/Miss-USA-2011-Should-Math-Be-Taught-In-Schools
Brent
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On Fri, Aug 12, 2011 at 3:22 PM, meekerdb meeke...@verizon.net wrote:
John Searle claims to be a physicalist but he believes that if
part of your brain is replaced by a functionally identical computer
chip your behaviour will remain the same but your consciousness will
fade away.

On Aug 12, 11:18 pm, Stathis Papaioannou stath...@gmail.com wrote:
Noticing is distributed, but the parts of the brain are
interconnected. Visual perception occurs in the visual cortex, then
the information may be sent to the limbic system causing an emotional
reaction to what is seen and the

On Fri, Aug 12, 2011 at 9:55 PM, meekerdb meeke...@verizon.net wrote:
On 8/12/2011 5:28 PM, Pilar Morales wrote:
or a magnetron, which to me, gravitation and magnetism are manifestations
of the same force, just different reactions to interactions.
Andre Sakharov wrote a famous paper that

On 8/12/2011 7:01 PM, Craig Weinberg wrote:
On Aug 12, 9:55 pm, meekerdbmeeke...@verizon.net wrote:
Photons don't carry charge. If they did they'd interact with other
photons and we wouldn't be able to see anything.
Would you say that what we see is photons? Even in our dreams?

On Aug 13, 12:26 am, meekerdb meeke...@verizon.net wrote:
On 8/12/2011 7:01 PM, Craig Weinberg wrote: On Aug 12, 9:55 pm,
meekerdbmeeke...@verizon.net wrote:
Photons don't carry charge. If they did they'd interact with other
photons and we wouldn't be able to see anything.
Would you

On 8/12/2011 8:18 PM, Stathis Papaioannou wrote:
It can be noticed separately in that hemisphere but if it is not
communicated it will be a separate consciousness.
I think we have almost converged to agreement here. If the AI part
communicates to the brain hemisphere just as the brain