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That the complainers were not "the office juniors" does mean my earlier comment of "It is older powerful men who have mostly written the laws and apply them, so to what extent is the law still stacked in their favour and women are expected to put up with their actions?" not applicable in this case.

No, of course I didn't mean that. Just clarifying the circumstances, and the unlikelihood that none of these women could apparently bring herself to communicate any indication that these minor invasions of personal space were unwelcome, before (years later and having continued to work with Salmond apparently happily) running to the police describing them as sexual assaults.

However, apart from the "sleepy cuddle" thing, there were defence witnesses to give a very different picture of what happened from the complainants'. One can write at length about the unacceptable behaviour of men in general, but if the particular man in question didn't actually do any of it, it's fairly irrelevant.

__________________"The way we vote will depend, ultimately, on whether we are persuaded to hope or to fear." - Aonghas MacNeacail, June 2012.

This may or may not be relevant to the case, but have you had much contact with Sturgeon? If so, what sort of a person does she seem to be when the cameras aren't turned on?

I have only interacted personally with Sturgeon once, and I didn't like her.

I am coming to the realisation that I always saw her as a performance, an carefully crafted production tailored to the audience she was facing. I assumed that behind the performance was a genuine human being who was as committed to the SNP's raison d'etre as anyone in the rank and file, presumably more committed.

However, over the past year, and to some extent since late 2017, I have been taking note of her lies and policy failures and pursuit of her pet agendas despite widespread unease and representations for her to think again. I think we are looking at somoene who is batting for the other team, and I wonder for how long that has been the case.

__________________"The way we vote will depend, ultimately, on whether we are persuaded to hope or to fear." - Aonghas MacNeacail, June 2012.

However, over the past year, and to some extent since late 2017, I have been taking note of her lies and policy failures and pursuit of her pet agendas despite widespread unease and representations for her to think again. I think we are looking at somoene who is batting for the other team, and I wonder for how long that has been the case.

I am not entirely closed to the idea, shall we say. And the way she's carrying on right now with her lockstep and her "four nations strategy" and her deference to the utterly murderous policies coming out of Westminster (all the while with a media presence that garners her an amazing satisfaction rating), while all she's doing is managing to be marginally less crap to pacify the domestic market while not actually doing anything that will annoy Westminster is not exactly reassuring me.

A genuinely independence-supporting First Minister could have capitalised on so many chances since 2015 and she has passed on every one of them. Right now she's ignoring all the powers she has that would allow her to protect Scotland from this virus. She's going along with a strategy that is killing thousands and not even making the point that her hands are tied by the union and the devolution settlement and without these she could do so much more. She clearly knows what has to be done to contain the virus, she's been talking about it for a couple of weeks so people think she's doing something, but actually nothing is being done. It's completely bizarre.

__________________"The way we vote will depend, ultimately, on whether we are persuaded to hope or to fear." - Aonghas MacNeacail, June 2012.

I am not entirely closed to the idea, shall we say. And the way she's carrying on right now with her lockstep and her "four nations strategy" and her deference to the utterly murderous policies coming out of Westminster (all the while with a media presence that garners her an amazing satisfaction rating), while all she's doing is managing to be marginally less crap to pacify the domestic market while not actually doing anything that will annoy Westminster is not exactly reassuring me.

A genuinely independence-supporting First Minister could have capitalised on so many chances since 2015 and she has passed on every one of them. Right now she's ignoring all the powers she has that would allow her to protect Scotland from this virus. She's going along with a strategy that is killing thousands and not even making the point that her hands are tied by the union and the devolution settlement and without these she could do so much more. She clearly knows what has to be done to contain the virus, she's been talking about it for a couple of weeks so people think she's doing something, but actually nothing is being done. It's completely bizarre.

Maybe... but I generally tend to think a combination of risk-aversion and incompetence (I.e. “Theresa May syndrome “) is more likely than willful sabotage.

That's also possible as regards her appalling coronavirus response of course, I agree.

I haven’t been following closely, but the one statement from her I saw regarding Covid-19 was a beacon of common sense compared with what has been coming out of 10 Downing Street.

__________________The whole problem with the world is that fools and fanatics are always so certain of themselves, and wiser people so full of doubts.Bertrand Russell
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Join the JREF Folders ! Team 13232Ezekiel 23:20

I am not entirely closed to the idea, shall we say. And the way she's carrying on right now with her lockstep and her "four nations strategy" and her deference to the utterly murderous policies coming out of Westminster (all the while with a media presence that garners her an amazing satisfaction rating), while all she's doing is managing to be marginally less crap to pacify the domestic market while not actually doing anything that will annoy Westminster is not exactly reassuring me.

A genuinely independence-supporting First Minister could have capitalised on so many chances since 2015 and she has passed on every one of them. Right now she's ignoring all the powers she has that would allow her to protect Scotland from this virus. She's going along with a strategy that is killing thousands and not even making the point that her hands are tied by the union and the devolution settlement and without these she could do so much more. She clearly knows what has to be done to contain the virus, she's been talking about it for a couple of weeks so people think she's doing something, but actually nothing is being done. It's completely bizarre.

Iacta alia est. At this point there is nothing different that NS can do. The SNP government has been in charge of health for many years. They have had a pandemic plan in place and seem to have been no more effective in providing PPE than in England, Wales or elsewhere in Europe. Testing was no better either. This is neither praise nor blame. It seems little different whether you are pro or anti Union (either UK or EU), French or British, socialist or non-socialist. In reality anticipation was no better. TSG response to the lessons of Silver Swan was no better than Westminster was to Cygnus.

Now there is nothing that Sturgeon can do that is any better than anyone else can do. There are no murderous policies - this is gross exaggeration. To be clear murderous policies are putting people in to concentration camps, clearing cities and sending people to labour in the country side like Mao or the Khmer Rouge. Pragmatically issues around stockpiling PPE, ventilators, and testing resources needed to have been addressed years ago. Immediately the most that could have been done by TSG would have been to lock down a few days earlier, but given the outbreak in Scotland is 2 weeks behind London that is not that likely.

Mmm. Perhaps you aren't aware of the original plan for dealing with the epidemic, which was fully endorsed by Sturgeon and which may still be in play to some extent. This goes a lot further than a shortage of PPE and ventilators.

__________________"The way we vote will depend, ultimately, on whether we are persuaded to hope or to fear." - Aonghas MacNeacail, June 2012.

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