Missed four field goals last year, three of them were blocked. 3 for 3 from 40-49. 2 for 4 from 50+. Lifetime 59% from 50+. And he didn't cost any picks, nor count against the team for future compensatory picks.

Naismith wrote:Missed four field goals last year, three of them were blocked. 3 for 3 from 40-49. 2 for 4 from 50+. Lifetime 59% from 50+. And he didn't cost any picks, nor count against the team for future compensatory picks.

Naismith wrote:Missed four field goals last year, three of them were blocked. 3 for 3 from 40-49. 2 for 4 from 50+. Lifetime 59% from 50+. And he didn't cost any picks, nor count against the team for future compensatory picks.

Bruce Allen: "I think it's safe to say that with Dexter Jackson, I made a 2nd round pick in Tampa that it'll be hard to out-suck."Jason Licht: "Did you trade up for him?"Bruce Allen: "No, actually, we traded back."Jason Licht: "Hold my beer, this **** is going to blow your mind."

Bruce Allen: "I think it's safe to say that with Dexter Jackson, I made a 2nd round pick in Tampa that it'll be hard to out-suck."Jason Licht: "Did you trade up for him?"Bruce Allen: "No, actually, we traded back."Jason Licht: "Hold my beer, this **** is going to blow your mind."

In Allen's defense, I feel confident that they were staring at Desean Jackson pretty hard. Then when he went off the board, they panicked a bit. Still dumb, but Dexter wasn't plan A.

MJW wrote:Bruce Allen: "I think it's safe to say that with Dexter Jackson, I made a 2nd round pick in Tampa that it'll be hard to out-suck."Jason Licht: "Did you trade up for him?"Bruce Allen: "No, actually, we traded back."Jason Licht: "Hold my beer, this **** is going to blow your mind."

In Allen's defense, I feel confident that they were staring at Desean Jackson pretty hard. Then when he went off the board, they panicked a bit. Still dumb, but Dexter wasn't plan A.

I'm of the opinion that a front office should use that whole February-April window to prepare for such possibilities (along with every other possibility), but I do understand your point. Aguayo was Licht's Plan A. That is different in some ways.

In Allen's defense, I feel confident that they were staring at Desean Jackson pretty hard. Then when he went off the board, they panicked a bit. Still dumb, but Dexter wasn't plan A.

I'm of the opinion that a front office should use that whole February-April window to prepare for such possibilities (along with every other possibility), but I do understand your point. Aguayo was Licht's Plan A. That is different in some ways.

And if he was who he was at FSU and was our Janakowski for 10+ years everyone thinks it's a smart move. It was a risk. I'm hoping Roberto makes good on it.

Well, Gostkowski wasn't part of the discussion. People love to point out how you can address the kicking situation for a long time, as if the only way to do that is drafting a player, like you can't keep an undrafted player for a long time. If the Bucs had kept Matt Bryant for 10+ years, that would have addressed the 10+ year issue that people seem to think is important without using any picks. For whatever reason, Janikowski's long tenure of mediocrity is held up as some sort of desirable result.

But since you brought him up. Using a fourth round pick on a guy isn't nearly the same as trading two picks so you can use a second round pick on a kicker. My philosophy is always that once you get to day three of the draft, position mostly doesn't matter. If Gostkowski or Aguayo or whoever is the highest rated player on your board and the one you think has a most chance to make/improve your team, go for it. So while I still would never pick a kicker because of the ease of acquiring one, it's a lot better use of draft assets using one day three pick on one. I, personally, think it's a mistake but not nearly as egregious of a mistake as what the Bucs did.

Well, Gostkowski wasn't part of the discussion. People love to point out how you can address the kicking situation for a long time, as if the only way to do that is drafting a player, like you can't keep an undrafted player for a long time. If the Bucs had kept Matt Bryant for 10+ years, that would have addressed the 10+ year issue that people seem to think is important without using any picks. For whatever reason, Janikowski's long tenure of mediocrity is held up as some sort of desirable result.

But since you brought him up. Using a fourth round pick on a guy isn't nearly the same as trading two picks so you can use a second round pick on a kicker. My philosophy is always that once you get to day three of the draft, position mostly doesn't matter. If Gostkowski or Aguayo or whoever is the highest rated player on your board and the one you think has a most chance to make/improve your team, go for it. So while I still would never pick a kicker because of the ease of acquiring one, it's a lot better use of draft assets using one day three pick on one. I, personally, think it's a mistake but not nearly as egregious of a mistake as what the Bucs did.

You went from "you don't need to invest picks at all" to "once you get to day 3, it's okay". Got it.

Damn Nick Folk is still playing? That's a name I haven't heard in a while. Looking at his stats it looks like he's still got it. I'm fully in favor of bringing in competition for Aguayo. I'm willing to forget that rookie year so long as he doesn't play like that again. If he does it again then we need to cut our losses.

Bootz2004 wrote:You went from "you don't need to invest picks at all" to "once you get to day 3, it's okay". Got it.

Apparently I am too complex for you.

No, you don't need to invest a pick to have a very good kicker and the majority of top kickers were acquired as free agents. Yes, I think drafting a kicker in any round is a mistake. Yes, I think it makes far more sense and is far more palatable to draft a kicker on day three than it does to trade two picks so you can draft one in the second round.

In simple math terms:

Acquiring a free agent kicker > using a day three pick to acquire a kicker > using a day two/multiple picks to acquire a kicker.