Welcome to the Piano World Piano ForumsOver 2.5 million posts about pianos, digital pianos, and all types of keyboard instruments
Join the World's Largest Community of Piano Lovers
(it's free)
It's Fun to Play the Piano ... Please Pass It On!

jscomposer
500 Post Club Member
Registered: 10/27/08
Posts: 537
Loc: The Boogie Down

I'm using Pianoteq, so I'm in no rush to get either. But I did play them side-by-side a couple weeks ago. My impressions...

They both sound fantastic. I doubt I could pick a winner based on sound. I think the Kawai had a little better (longer) sustain though.

They both feel great. On the Roland, it really feels like you're throwing a hammer, whereas the Kawai feels more like a simple lever (albeit exceptionally smooth). The escapement gimmick in the Roland is more convincing. It's more pronounced the lighter you play. Kawai's escapement gimmick is hardly noticeable even with the lightest touch. Some might prefer it that way, but I'm just saying the Roland has more realistic escapement feel. The Kawai has a more realistic bottoming of the key. It's soft and smooth like on an acoustic grand. Not that Roland's key bottom is hard, just not quite as sweet as Kawai's.

Neither had a realistic gradation of the action. The bass notes were relatively light, and the high notes were relatively heavy. There was definitely gradation, just not enough. Again, a lot of people prefer a more even action, but it's not an accurate representation of an acoustic grand action. Aside from gradation, the Kawai's action is smoother and more consistent from key-to-key.

Repeats are easier/more realistic on the Roland, and not because it's lighter, but because the keys don't have to travel as far as they do on the Kawai in order to repeat. I was pleasantly surprised that Roland finally fixed the "silent replay" issue, and very disappointed that Kawai STILL hasn't remedied it.

I felt the Roland had realistic late pedaling (playing a chord staccato and pressing the pedal just afterwards to catch some sustain). On other digitals I've played, there's a lot of forgiveness. On the Roland, the interval between letting off the key and hitting the sustain pedal is pretty narrow, as it is on an acoustic. Unfortunately, I didn't try this on the Kawai to compare.

Thanks for posting your views on this as I have been looking at getting one of these two instruments. Just out of curiousity, have you changed your tune at all regarding the Numa Nero midi controller? I still hear mixed opinions about this controller...

I'm using Pianoteq, so I'm in no rush to get either. But I did play them side-by-side a couple weeks ago. My impressions...

They both sound fantastic. I doubt I could pick a winner based on sound. I think the Kawai had a little better (longer) sustain though.

They both feel great. On the Roland, it really feels like you're throwing a hammer, whereas the Kawai feels more like a simple lever (albeit exceptionally smooth). The escapement gimmick in the Roland is more convincing. It's more pronounced the lighter you play. Kawai's escapement gimmick is hardly noticeable even with the lightest touch. Some might prefer it that way, but I'm just saying the Roland has more realistic escapement feel. The Kawai has a more realistic bottoming of the key. It's soft and smooth like on an acoustic grand. Not that Roland's key bottom is hard, just not quite as sweet as Kawai's.

Neither had a realistic gradation of the action. The bass notes were relatively light, and the high notes were relatively heavy. There was definitely gradation, just not enough. Again, a lot of people prefer a more even action, but it's not an accurate representation of an acoustic grand action. Aside from gradation, the Kawai's action is smoother and more consistent from key-to-key.

Repeats are easier/more realistic on the Roland, and not because it's lighter, but because the keys don't have to travel as far as they do on the Kawai in order to repeat. I was pleasantly surprised that Roland finally fixed the

I owned the RD-700NX briefly, and owned the RD-700GXF, which played and sounded nearly identical to the RD-700NX (which is why I didn't keep the NX for very long), and I've just played the MP10 for a while, so I can chime in here.

Both actions, the PHA III and RM3 Wooden are probably the best overall keyboard actions as far as duplicating a real acoustic, however, the RM3 to me is really in another class. It's wooden hammers are as long as Kawai's own grand pianos. When I played the MP10 this past Saturday, I played it back and forth with the Kawai RX-7 semi-concert grand, and the MP10 was very close in feel, even a little heavier. I felt the grading was very well done, but even on the real grands, the difference isn't that much from top to bottom.

Sound wise, I think the RD-700NX has the edge. The MP10 sounds really wonderful, but I found it to not have as nice of a decay as the Rolands, but the dynamic range seemed to be as good, if not even better than the Rolands. Perhaps that's attributable to the RM3 action.

I'll have an MP10 soon as it (and the CA63/CA93) is hands down the closest thing to a grand piano in touch that I've played in a DP. That's the thing with these things, touch and tone is so subjective.

_________________________
Yamaha AvantGrand N1Nord Piano 2

"Be who you are and say how you feel. Because those who mind don't matter, and those who matter don't mind." - Dr. Seuss

jscomposer
500 Post Club Member
Registered: 10/27/08
Posts: 537
Loc: The Boogie Down

Originally Posted By: Providence

Hi Joshua,

Thanks for posting your views on this as I have been looking at getting one of these two instruments. Just out of curiousity, have you changed your tune at all regarding the Numa Nero midi controller? I still hear mixed opinions about this controller...

N

If it still has mixed reviews, then no. Someone on Pianoteq's forum has one and absolutely loves it, despite still running into flaws and finding workarounds. Not a terribly good endorsement IMHO.

Try to find one in a store. If you like it, and it works to your satisfaction, then by all means. I'd still prefer an MP10 or RD-700X though, for the internal sounds, 3 pedal jacks, and service support.

Yeah, you should make a video where you pipe the sound directly into an interface, instead of playing through speakers and then recording through a mic. There's no reason for any pure digital piano clip to sound bad on youtube.

I'll have an MP10 soon as it (and the CA63/CA93) is hands down the closest thing to a grand piano in touch that I've played in a DP. That's the thing with these things, touch and tone is so subjective.

Zac, what do you think of the MP10 action compared to the AvantGrands? I wasn't sure if you intended to include them in the quoted assessment.