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Re: problems with our 4 day old....

How are things going? Yes, some weight loss is NORMAL, up to 5-7% (Some sources say up to 10%) of birth weight. That is why the rule of thumb for a baby doing well is BACK to birth weight by 10-14 days. Was there ever another weight check done after the birth weight check? Baby may well have lost more than that but and is now in an upswing.

I am sorry but I am not getting something-does baby EVER latch and nurse-at all? Or is it all just pumping and cup feeding? (Brilliant you are cup feeding btw, Jack Newman has a nice video on that is you are still unsure about doing it. It does show the mom with her breasts exposed so, just fyi. http://www.nbci.ca/index.php?option=...id=6&Itemid=13

If you are went to a meeting or a 'class' led by an LC, that may be very helpful, of course, but that is not a La Leche League meeting, unless your local LLL Group does something a bit unusual, which is possible. But generally, LLL meetings are led by LLL Leaders, who are breastfeeding peer support volunteers. Some Leaders are LCs, just as some are nurses, doctors, or any other profession. But as Leaders, we offer mother to mother (or father) support, and usually I will let a dad attend a meeting if the other mothers there are in agreement and dad is willing to step out if neccesary. But that is my personal thing, not all Leaders would do that. Some Groups have couples meetings also.

I just think it would be helpful for your wife (or you) to talk to a Leader. You guys have alot going for you, your support of mom & baby is amazing. But you both need some reassurance and support.

If you want a book, I strongly suggest The Womanly Art of Breastfeeding (8th edition, 2010.) This edition is the first breastfeeding book to become a bestseller, and for good reason. This book is written for the new mom (or dad) & the info in there is all based on scientific evidence & very up to date-frankly much more up to date than much of the info even availble online. The book is at online sellers (Amazon etc.) brick and motar bookstores, Whole Foods & other health food stores around here carries it, your library may have it.

Re: problems with our 4 day old....

Originally Posted by @llli*lllmeg

How are things going? Yes, some weight loss is NORMAL, up to 5-7% (Some sources say up to 10%) of birth weight. That is why the rule of thumb for a baby doing well is BACK to birth weight by 10-14 days. Was there ever another weight check done after the birth weight check? Baby may well have lost more than that but and is now in an upswing.

The only check we had was discharge day. He was 7 12 then. That was Friday. Monday he was 7 9.5

I am sorry but I am not getting something-does baby EVER latch and nurse-at all? Or is it all just pumping and cup feeding? (Brilliant you are cup feeding btw, Jack Newman has a nice video on that is you are still unsure about doing it. It does show the mom with her breasts exposed so, just fyi. http://www.nbci.ca/index.php?option=...id=6&Itemid=13

Yes he has. He seems to do it when there are people there to "help" but its only for a few moments.

If you are went to a meeting or a 'class' led by an LC, that may be very helpful, of course, but that is not a La Leche League meeting, unless your local LLL Group does something a bit unusual, which is possible. But generally, LLL meetings are led by LLL Leaders, who are breastfeeding peer support volunteers. Some Leaders are LCs, just as some are nurses, doctors, or any other profession. But as Leaders, we offer mother to mother (or father) support, and usually I will let a dad attend a meeting if the other mothers there are in agreement and dad is willing to step out if neccesary. But that is my personal thing, not all Leaders would do that. Some Groups have couples meetings also.

The class I was not allowed to attend was @ the hospital. She was in the class with 4 othe women and the attention given was not what she needed. The LC gave her a sheild, seemed to help. He didnt go ape crazy like normal. The LC also used a small tube to i guess "trick" him with some formula while she tried to nurse him. She didnt find the whole experience pleasing.

We were going to goto a LLL meeting that is for couples, but by the time dinner was done and he was fed, she needed to pump, it was looking like it was going to be to late. That night was really hard for her. She tried to feed and yeah, didn't happen.

I just think it would be helpful for your wife (or you) to talk to a Leader. You guys have alot going for you, your support of mom & baby is amazing. But you both need some reassurance and support.

I'm going to make another call to another leader. I called one but she has not called me back. I'd really like my wife to meet up with some other women for support.

If you want a book, I strongly suggest The Womanly Art of Breastfeeding (8th edition, 2010.) This edition is the first breastfeeding book to become a bestseller, and for good reason. This book is written for the new mom (or dad) & the info in there is all based on scientific evidence & very up to date-frankly much more up to date than much of the info even availble online. The book is at online sellers (Amazon etc.) brick and motar bookstores, Whole Foods & other health food stores around here carries it, your library may have it.

I will look for it

On a side note...we did have a vist by a IBCLC last night. She stayed with us for about 3 hours and I think helped. Wife seems a little overwhelmed by it all. Today is her 1st day doing everything on her own. Seeing everything on paper for feedings, pump times and other stuff..wow. They tried to get him to nurse yesterday, he put up a fight and didn't help much. Nothing seems wrong with mom or baby, he just has to learn. Shes pumping 2 - 3 oz in 15 min (total). So we know the milk is there. It was suggested to feed him 1oz 1st then try the breast twice a day and see what happens. If he takes it, great, if not, just let him and mom calm down and we'll try again.

Wife called me and is extremly tired. Getting up every couple hours to feed/pump is a lot of work. But I Told her that that is all she needs to worry about. Feed him and yourself. I'll do what I can with the other stuff around the house when I get home.

So fingers crossed...

1st Time mom to a health baby boy
Trying to learn how to and keep it up with
Hubby has my back

Re: problems with our 4 day old....

Originally Posted by @llli*ajnkat

he seems to have a very short transition time between the levels. we caught it at the lip smacking when laying down.....still a scream fest.

Mine was like this, too, and it was really frustrating, but he seemed to be calmer after the first week or so. It will get better (as will the arm-flailing) as you learn to interpret his moods, and as he grows out of being such a sleepy newborn. In the meantime, I was putting mine on the breast immediately after changing, to try to bypass some screaming. Maybe that would help?

I hope things are going a little better for y'all today, and that the learning curve is getting easier.

Re: problems with our 4 day old....

ajinkat, I sent you a PM.

There is no doubt the first couple of weeks are usually the hardest, even when everything is going well. Baby not latching well, and mom needing to pump so much & feed can certainly feel extremely overwhelming. Usually, once baby is latching and nursing well at the breast, life gets soooo much better, very quickly. But how does that happen? It depends so much on what is going on with baby and why he is not latching.

As far as catching baby before he gets frantic, it is perfectly OK for your wife to offer to nurse baby whenever she wants. There is no reason to wait for any hunger 'signs.' Many babies latch & nurse best when in a drowsy or otherwise relaxed state. Also, mom can keep trying different positions and latch tricks id she wants. Often somethign that did not work at all two days ago will work great today.

Re: problems with our 4 day old....

I second the breastfriend pillow, I also have the deluxe and LOVE it. In fact, I love it so much, I ran out and bought a second one after I purchased and loved the first one. I had the boppy which helped a little, but after I tried the breastfriend I rarely if ever used the boppy again. I have two of the breastfriend pillows though, because I like to have one in the house and one in the car. (they get different "dirt" in the house and in the car/around town! lol haha). I also like to have a "third" cover for one being in the wash, and one being on the pillow especially the beginning months are more "dirty" then latter months. At least I have found-more milk leaks out and all kinds of things!).

Any way, I also find using a nipple shield to "teach" babies has helped me a lot.

That being said, with the hands, a LLL leader can kind of teach her how to hold the hands out of the way. I know one of my local leaders covers that topic at least twice a month, as we have two meetings a month. I have noticed other groups don't talk about this so much though. But, the leader of the group I currently go to has 8 children and one set were twins, so she's really gone through it all with babies. What she suggest, and what I kind of came up with even before her suggesting is, you kind of pin one arm down with their body (put baby on it's side, so it's using it's own body to pin that bottom arm down), and then use your upper arm (the arm that would naturally be on top of baby, not the one closest to it's head, but the one closest to it's feet) to hold that other arm down. She always demos this with a fake boob (it's hilarious!) and a doll. Please call your local LLL leader and ask for them to come out ASAP to help!

I also find with a baby who is really upset, if I am pinning their arms down, along with patting their back (the same pattern and hardness as you would when burping them) this kind of calms mine down enough to see the nipple and take it. Do all this while trying to hold the nipple out there like a sandwich! This is why the pillow is so helpful, the brestfriend pillow stays in one place and never needs to be adjusted and moved and what not. Which with a squirmy baby and you are trying to pin down arms, pat their back, and hold a nipple like a sandwich, you just can't handle adjusting a pillow too! lol (the boppy is always sliding all around! And constantly needing to be adjusted!).

Re: problems with our 4 day old....

Meg...thank you.

she LOVES the pillow. She put it on and the 1st thing she said was "this thing is amazing!" I laughed.

Well tomorrow makes him 2 weeks old. She is still pumping (lots, like 3-6oz in 15 min). She tries to BF him when she can. He seams to be tolerating it a little bit more. We've had to use bottles, playtex natural something or other. Its got a very slow nipple but a wide one. Kind of hoping that if the flow is slow he'll like it from the tap better. Wide nipple to help him open his mouth a bit.

Sleepless nights are kicking her butt, mine too sometimes. I think he'll learn, but its wearing her out and is thinking about EP'ing...but she loves it when he does BF. I told her I'll support what ever she wants to do but I know it would mean a lot if he would learn.

1st Time mom to a health baby boy
Trying to learn how to and keep it up with
Hubby has my back

Re: problems with our 4 day old....

I have all of the respect in the world for EP mamas. I only pumped 5 days a week at work when I worked full time. I would never ever want to EP if I could nurse and nursing was even a glimmer of possibility. Oh noooooooooo. Pumping. I hated it! I did it. I'd do it again, but I would never ever want to EP.

He's still really young. The hours are long, but the months are short. As for sleepless nights, what about cosleeping? I hope your wife is napping when he is during the day! There's a reason that's a cliche.

Glad she likes the pillow. She could come on the forums. I bet it would be very helpful for her!

Christine
Baby Girl Born 2/17/10 to her two mommies
BF from day one. I looked up one day and realized I'm nursing a toddler!

Re: problems with our 4 day old....

Please, please don't EP. It is a million times harder than BFing.

BFing eventually gets easier. EPing NEVER does. You have to pump 120 minutes every single day! 8 times a day for the first 12 weeks to establish a base so you have a supply for the next year. This seems to be the failing point for most moms who try to EP. They don't pump enough in the early weeks.

The getting up at night...worse when EPing. Then you still have to feed the baby. I guarantee you guys are tired because she is pumping. We were not nearly as tired with our other kids as we have been with our fourth baby!! And the difference is the pumping. Normally, I nurse, DH sleeps, and I doze through the feedings.

And now...I pump 4 times a day, but it takes me at least 30 minutes every time . And with a mobile baby, it is SUPER hard to EP. He gets into things. He messes with the pump. The logistics of going anywhere are challenging.

EPing is so difficult that I am STILL trying to nurse my baby, who is 11 months old. I normally BF for the recommended two years, but the thought of pumping that long makes me want to scream. That is another downside to EPing. ... Babies are generally not fed breastmilk as long as they might have been had mom nursed. and there is no research on how pumping affects the milk.

One visit from an LC is not enough. Get them to come back out. Go see another. This is worth it. It really is.

Re: problems with our 4 day old....

If you can, find an LLL meeting that she can go to every week. The in-person support, the network of other Mom's, will be worth their weight in gold. Exclusively pumping is so much harder than breast feeding. I to Mom's that manage it. It drove me crazy when I was pumping for DD1 (which I only did because I had thought I was supposed to). Heck, I think I only pumped maybe 5 bags of milk total for DD2 I hated it so much. It took me 8 weeks to get over the hump with DD1. It was like coming out of a dense fog into the sunlight. It was SO WORTH IT. Please, get more professional help, consistently.