Does the FBI and Justice Department "Deep State" Need a Colonoscopy/Body Cavity Search?

With all of the breaking news revelations about questionable staffing and sharp political bias within the Clinton E-mail Investigation and now the Russian Interference Investigation, should the FBI and Justice Department "Deep State" get a full body cavity search? I have a feeling that it is coming.

I don't think that the "Deep State" consists of front-line FBI agents. It's Washington DC lawyers/suits who are placed in positions of extreme power and tend to stay within the agency from administration to administration. They hire their buddies of the same political affiliation and exchange highly political communications at work, which undermine the political neutrality of the Bureau. The integrity of that level within the FBI needs to be restored.

UDBaby

12-07-2017 06:20 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Fudd
(Post 523880)

I don't think that the "Deep State" consists of front-line FBI agents. It's Washington DC lawyers/suits who are placed in positions of extreme power and tend to stay within the agency from administration to administration. They hire their buddies of the same political affiliation and exchange highly political communications at work, which undermine the political neutrality of the Bureau. The integrity of that level within the FBI needs to be restored.

Ah yes, the ole Deep State theory...

Fudd, you'll forgive me for adding my $.02 about your preferred beverages, but a change wouldn't be the worst thing. You never can tell what "they" are slipping into the Kool-Aid when you're not watching.

cralford

12-07-2017 09:13 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by UDBaby
(Post 523925)

Ah yes, the ole Deep State theory...

Fudd, you'll forgive me for adding my $.02 about your preferred beverages, but a change wouldn't be the worst thing. You never can tell what "they" are slipping into the Kool-Aid when you're not watching.

Did you really expect to get an unbiased opinion from Christopher Wray. That like asking my Mother if I am a good boy :)

Why do you change "gross negligence" to "extremely careless". After all CNN says any Thesaurus will tell you they are pretty darn close.

Do you really think they are the same in a legal case? If they are the same, why change it?

Why do you charge Flynn for lying to the FBI and not charge Hillary's girlfriends for lying to the same FBI agent. Why was Hillary not sworn in during her interview with this FBI Special agent? She was under no obligation to tell the truth. Come to think of it, why was Hillary not charged? Could it be that his wife idolizes her and belongs to ever club and pro-Hillary group there is.

This man had no business being involved in either investigation.

If you do not think you can question the FBI, you are a fool. The same as you can question the President of our Country you can peacefully question anyone or group that is in charge of your liberties and freedom. If you do not believe so, you do not deserve it.

I just found this. Wray confirmed at Thursday’s hearing that “gross negligence” is a key legal standard for potential criminal consequences. I just wonder if Peter Strzok's FBI Lawyer girlfriend was aware of this before he changed it??????? Just curious!

Fudd

12-07-2017 09:27 PM

I'm just saying that when you find a bunch of suspicious activity by the FBI, like the Clinton investigation produced, and then you find e-mails suggesting that very key FBI investigators may have been very politically invested in certain outcomes, an investigation is in order. This could have been avoided had a one-sided partisan group had not been assembled by Mueller. He had a chance to play it straight. Now, with what has been leaked, we have to know what is really going on. I know you guys are interested in pursuing the truth, because you have repeatedly told me that. I also know, that if there is nothing to hide, there will be full disclosure. I have also heard this repeatedly here. The FBI and Mueller have nothing to fear if they have done nothing wrong. So I am confident that you will all agree with me. Make America Great Again! Restore the integrity and reputation of the FBI again! Cavity Search! Don't stop until you touch the back of his teeth!

Fudd

12-07-2017 11:29 PM

Time to get acquainted with Bruce Ohr, Justice Dept Associate Attorney General, who met with Christopher Steele and Glenn Simpson (fusion GPS, who hired Steele with Democratic Party money). Steele produced the infamous "Russian Dossier". They had some interestingly timed meetings.:popcorn:

I don't want to bore you with the details. I am sure you will discover the significance of this over the next month or so.

Swampy Meadows

12-08-2017 09:21 AM

Robert Mueller inserted a clause in Flynn's plea that says even if he gets a presidential pardon, local and state governments can charge him, a move that castrated Trump's pardon powers:

The field agents are good cops. Ethical and have no political motivations whatsoever. You know what 99% of the FBI isn't involved in? Political hack investigations in DC.

Yes....the upper echelon that is investigating the SWAP needs more than an colonoscopy...they need an enema of epic proportions. They are the ones responsible for the public display of incompetence...not the 99% of field agents.

ud69

12-08-2017 10:07 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Swampy Meadows
(Post 523984)

Robert Mueller inserted a clause in Flynn's plea that says even if he gets a presidential pardon, local and state governments can charge him, a move that castrated Trump's pardon powers:

Swampy -not only did you swing and miss again, I think you have been neutered by the U.S. Constitution as well. The pardon power of the president has never applied to state crimes - Mueller notwithstanding.

Constitution of the United States - Article 2 Section 2 Clause 1

"The President shall be Commander in Chief of the Army and Navy of the United States, and of the Militia of the several States, when called into the actual Service of the United States; he may require the Opinion, in writing, of the principal Officer in each of the executive Departments, upon any Subject relating to the Duties of their respective Offices, and he shall have Power to grant Reprieves and Pardons for Offenses against the United States, except in Cases of Impeachment."

shocka43

12-08-2017 10:15 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Swampy Meadows
(Post 523984)

Robert Mueller inserted a clause in Flynn's plea that says even if he gets a presidential pardon, local and state governments can charge him, a move that castrated Trump's pardon powers:

You are on drugs if you think any local municipal or local district court is going to do anything to Flynn...even if he were pardoned.

Instead of doing your typical line of "reporting" by simply inserting web links with no significance, think about what you are posting.

Flynn was hit with lying to the FBI. Not some state or local cop. Therefore, there is no charge on a state or local level that is prosecuted. None. Only a federal charge that has to be handled by federal prosecutors.

Second, go find me a state or local or ordinance that states who a presidential candidate can or can't talk to during a campaign.

Logan act...violation of federal statute. Lying to the FBI...violation of federal statute.

Trump can't "obstruct justice" by pardoning someone in order to obstruct an investigation against himself. You can only pardon someone who was convicted of a crime against the United States. Therefore, the only "castration" is the fact Trump can't pardon someone when it interferes with the right of the government to investigate Trump.

Please do yourself a favor and do some homework before you get all warm and fuzzy inside and post a link.

Why do you charge Flynn for lying to the FBI and not charge Hillary's girlfriends for lying to the same FBI agent. Why was Hillary not sworn in during her interview with this FBI Special agent? She was under no obligation to tell the truth. Come to think of it, why was Hillary not charged? Could it be that his wife idolizes her and belongs to ever club and pro-Hillary group there is.

This man had no business being involved in either investigation.

If you do not think you can question the FBI, you are a fool. The same as you can question the President of our Country you can peacefully question anyone or group that is in charge of your liberties and freedom. If you do not believe so, you do not deserve it.

I just found this. Wray confirmed at Thursday’s hearing that “gross negligence” is a key legal standard for potential criminal consequences. I just wonder if Peter Strzok's FBI Lawyer girlfriend was aware of this before he changed it??????? Just curious!

Guess you missed my point.

Rolling out a legit criticism of the FBI and any of its operatives under the Limbaugh/Bannon Deep State banner is a steaming pile of B.S. intended to undermine any institutions, and individuals in them, that don't swallow hook line and sinker.

Its dangerous, divisive and destructive to actively and relentlessly promote public distrust for the institutions that have preserved our fragile democracy while keeping it relatively free of violent insurrection as a matter of accepted political process.

Every institution will have its FUBAR moments and its FUBAR bureaucrats. What's happening now is a movement to discredit all of it, under the noxious nonsense of Deep State, and whatever Rush and the rest of the insurgents can dream up, locked safely behind the mote, fat arses perched on piles of blood $$$.

Deep State....geez.:whiteflag:

Fudd

12-08-2017 12:50 PM

If you don't like the term "Deep State", maybe you can think of them as political objectors to the administration embedded in the bureaucracy who actively work against the Presidents policies.

Maybe that will make you feel better.

Anyhow, sunshine is the best disinfectant. Let the sun shine in....

TA111

12-08-2017 12:53 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Swampy Meadows
(Post 523999)

When I want credible info I always rely on a website called "Hot Air."

The only other websites reporting this are The Washington Examiner, Washington Times, something called Lucianne and of course, Faux News.

Nice try.

Wow. Must be nice to live in a state of delusion. Are you denying that Bruce Ohr, assoc Deputy Atty General, knew of the now debunked dossier? Congressional committees have already stated this as fact. You really need to get out more.

UDBaby

12-08-2017 01:30 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Fudd
(Post 524030)

If you don't like the term "Deep State", maybe you can think of them as political objectors to the administration embedded in the bureaucracy who actively work against the Presidents policies.

Maybe that will make you feel better.

Anyhow, sunshine is the best disinfectant. Let the sun shine in....

Yep Fuddy....let it shine all the way in and around ('cept I don' think "the donald" is gonna like that...)

Seems to me that you only like when the sun shines through the narrow prism of your own political bias. Not so much when its shining on the other dog's arse, despite best attempts to pull down the shades.

Just watch how hard "they're" gonna start pulling on the blinds in trying to discredit Mueller et. al.

The Koch Brothers are represented in Congress by Kansas Sen. Pat Roberts -- he's been pushing to add language to the tax bill that would give the Kochs & other billionaires a special tax cut when they funnel cash to dark money groups:

The Koch Brothers are represented in Congress by Kansas Sen. Pat Roberts -- he's been pushing to add language to the tax bill that would give the Kochs & other billionaires a special tax cut when they funnel cash to dark money groups:

Its dangerous, divisive and destructive to actively and relentlessly promote public distrust for the institutions that have preserved our fragile democracy while keeping it relatively free of violent insurrection as a matter of accepted political process.

Every institution will have its FUBAR moments and its FUBAR bureaucrats. What's happening now is a movement to discredit all of it, under the noxious nonsense of Deep State, and whatever Rush and the rest of the insurgents can dream up, locked safely behind the mote, fat arses perched on piles of blood $$$.

Deep State....geez.:whiteflag:

I don't really think I missed your point. I disagree with your point. I agree that the majority of the FBI agents are good people and will do what their leaders ask them to do.

The problem with the FBI leadership right now is they do not believe they are to be held to the same laws as others are. FBI Director Wray knew Special Agent Strzok was a bad agent 6 months ago but never gave that knowledge to Congress until it just leaked out.

As Wray stated when pressed, there is a difference criminally between gross negligence and extremely careless but he would not cop to it. He said he would let the people decide. No, it was not up to the people to decide it was up to the courts to decide.

I will not repeat the obvious bias with Huma Abedin and Cheryl Mills lies to the FBI.

Your firms reputation starts with leadership. In this case it is the FBI. It is my opinion that probably 30% or more of the upper echelon of the FBI needs to be eliminated and possibly charged.

UDBaby

12-08-2017 03:00 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by cralford
(Post 524050)

I don't really think I missed your point.....

It is my opinion that probably 30% or more of the upper echelon of the FBI needs to be eliminated and possibly charged.

Yes, you did.

My opinion is that the substantive basis for your opinion about the FBI has nothing to do with a supposed, "Deep State," or the recently contrived narrative by the Rush Bannon Gas Bags, which are hellbent on discrediting otherwise distinguished and historically useful U.S. institutions.

shocka43

12-08-2017 03:32 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by UDBaby
(Post 524054)

Yes, you did.

My opinion is that the substantive basis for your opinion about the FBI has nothing to do with a supposed, "Deep State," or the recently contrived narrative by the Rush Bannon Gas Bags, which are hellbent on discrediting otherwise distinguished and historically useful U.S. institutions.

Definitely historically useful...but the discrediting comes from within thanks to Comey.

Swampy Meadows

12-08-2017 05:23 PM

Former Congressman and Conservative radio talk show host Joe Walsh slams Fox News and Republicans for ‘despicable’ attacks on Mueller: ‘Bullsh*t’

I'm not sure what you guys are arguing. Are you saying there are no "Deep State" individuals (as I described in my above post) working within the government against Trump and his policies? Or are you arguing that those individuals exist, but that they should be allowed to work against the administration, sometimes illegally, without consequence?

I think that everyone is respectful of different political views, but if you are going to carry your personal politics into your government job, you don't belong there. Especially, if you are expected to remain non-partisan as part of your job description like in the Justice Department or Federal Law Enforcement.

I am constantly disappointed by some of the things I hear during this upheaval. I keep hearing people say that we need to have trust in important government agencies like the FBI and Justice Department. I agree that it is very desirable for the good of the country, but it is not a need. I believe that we need to have the trust in them that they demonstrate that they deserve. If we have a situation where we have evidence that corruption is rampant in certain areas, we need to distrust them until they prove that the problem has been addressed. We have seen time and time again that if we put blind trust in our government, we will be taken advantage of, and the country will be worse off for it. We need to be vigilant. It's part of healthy democracy.

The FBI and Justice Department have not distinguished themselves during the Clinton and Russia investigations. Evidence is mounting. Worse is coming. I think it may have already passed the point of deniability. If you know where the legitimate remaining media exists, you are going to be 1-2 days ahead of the rest of the MSM on this stuff. If you are only watching MSNBC or CNN, you are going to get precious few of the important developments until it is too late. In that respect, they really are like fake news. And then there is the purely fake stuff that they are generating. That is fake news too. Notice how many of Swampy's posts contain information that gets retracted 24 hours later. That is not news. It's propaganda.

Fudd

12-09-2017 09:52 AM

Here is the latest on the Mueller team. I keep hearing that there is much more to come.

“You’ve got Donald Trump being persecuted by Hillary Clinton’s fan club—that’s inequitable,” Rep. Matt Gaetz, R-Fla., a member of the House Judiciary Committee, told Fox News on Friday. “Many of the members of Mueller’s team donated to the Clinton campaign. We have a lot of highly qualified federal prosecutors in the Justice Department and we could have found a bunch of them who didn’t donate to either candidate. But that didn’t occur, and that’s troubling.”

UACFlyer

12-09-2017 11:05 AM

Opinions and subshine

Two things:

1. Everyone has opinions, biases, etc,....Judges, lawyers, jurists,....but decent, honorable people are able to control their personal biases and carry out their responsibilities.

That goes for Mueller. No one knows exactly what he thinks of DJT. But, prior to his appointment Mueller was held in the highest regard. I believe he has the Country in his mind, not the President. And I think Mueller will do the very best job he can regardless of his personal feelings. To replace him and his team now would send this investigation back to square one. That is not in the Country's interest.

Note, Mueller got rid of the FBI guy several months ago...when his investigation was in an early stage.

2. Now for the "sunshine" Fudd is so fond of mentioning. This entire investigation occurred precisely because the drapes were drawn blocking the sunshine from illuminating and disinfecting any and all aspects of the affairs of Trump and his team re Russian connections.

Every so often a tear in the drapes would occur allowing the sunshine to get through. And every one of those times the sunshine exposed suspect Russian dealings that the Trump team had not revealed before.

It's true that, so far, no evidence of (significant) wrong doing has been revealed. That's good for Trump and the Country. But it's been like pulling teeth to get the Trump gang to be forthcoming. No one knows why that is. The question that is asked over and over is, "Why"...."Why are they acting as if they are covering something up if there has been no illegal collusion, no illegal financial dealings", etc.

Months ago Krauthammer remarked that it looks like "a cover-up of a non-crime". He's right. It still does.

Bat'71

12-09-2017 12:53 PM

Good Gawd...this drum beat by the major Media outlets to undermine the legitimacy of this Administration is off the charts. If the Russians wanted to truly disrupt our Democratic Republic (which they do) they couldn't have done a better job than what's been transpiring. With all the dots leading to the BHO Admininistration's complicity in all this crap (much of it highly questionable in legality), Mueller's previous position and his "investigators" in the Clinton probe and the deep connections between the Belt Way Media and Democratic operatives, how the heck can anyone rely on the reportage, the leaks and the investigation itself. If it walks like a duck and talks like a duck, then it's a duck...this is nothing more than a quite palace coup that wants to exclude any exculpatory evidenece and common sense and overthrow the new policies of the new Administration. People are getting fed up with all the innuendo and biased reporting.

Plus, Gawd forbid, the Media reports anything other than the freak show in D.C. about the "Ruskies" and the election...it's a farce, IMHO. There is nary a word about the routing of ISIS, the improving economy, the reduction in illegal immigration, the real pivot of our forces to East Asia and the decline in our military capabilities under the BHO and the Budget resolutions that drastically cut our tactical and defense capabilities.

BTW, when you simply "trust" your government institutions without proper oversight, you wind up with the VA health care system, a rouge IRS, the Arms running scandal to Mexican drug lords, an activist, biased and inept EPA, a potential KGB wanna be and, last but not least, the DMV.

UACFlyer

12-09-2017 01:08 PM

Right, Bat, but,...

Quote:

Originally Posted by Bat'71
(Post 524151)

Good Gawd...this drum beat by the major Media outlets to undermine the legitimacy of this Administration is off the charts. If the Russians wanted to truly disrupt our Democratic Republic (which they do) they couldn't have done a better job than what's been transpiring. With all the dots leading to the BHO Admininistration's complicity in all this crap (much of it highly questionable in legality), Mueller's previous position and his "investigators" in the Clinton probe and the deep connections between the Belt Way Media and Democratic operatives, how the heck can anyone rely on the reportage, the leaks and the investigation itself. If it walks like a duck and talks like a duck, then it's a duck...this is nothing more than a quite palace coup that wants to exclude any exculpatory evidenece and common sense and overthrow the new policies of the new Administration. People are getting fed up with all the innuendo and biased reporting.

Plus, Gawd forbid, the Media reports anything other than the freak show in D.C. about the "Ruskies" and the election...it's a farce, IMHO. There is nary a word about the routing of ISIS, the improving economy, the reduction in illegal immigration, the real pivot of our forces to East Asia and the decline in our military capabilities under the BHO and the Budget resolutions that drastically cut our tactical and defense capabilities.

BTW, when you simply "trust" your government institutions without proper oversight, you wind up with the VA health care system, a rouge IRS, the Arms running scandal to Mexican drug lords, an activist, biased and inept EPA, a potential KGB wanna be and, last but not least, the DMV.

All true, Bat. But you cannot deny that Trump and crew have poured fuel on this fire from day one. "Concealment" has been the entire playbook of Trump.....from the tax returns "nobody cares about" to the firing of Comey "because of the Russian investigation"...which is what the President said. And it's been drip, drip, drip from the beginning.

Every single contact with Russians has oozed out over months...never voluntarily provided by the Trump camp. You know that Bat. The entire gang might be entirely innocent of any significant wrong doing. But, Bat, they have not and are not acting that way. As Ignatius in his column pointed out (asked), "Why are they acting this way?" "What is the President so afraid might emerge?"

Bat, these are legitimate questions by fair-minded people. People who want the whole thing to end so we can focus on important things that Trump is trying to accomplish. It's the Trump people themselves that are preventing this from happening by way of their guilty-appearing behavior. If they haven't done anything wrong why are they...all of them... behaving as if they have?

Bat'71

12-09-2017 02:05 PM

Fairness, IMHO, includes looking at both sides, UAC. Where was all this concern about the Fusion GPS opposition research with the Russians through an ex-MI 6 agent, the DNC refusing FBI access to it's hacked e-mails, the BHO Administration unmasking of contacts and other nefarious activities on the part of the Dems? Where was all this concern about transparancy with the BHO Iran nuclear deal, the removal of the advanced radar systems in Poland, the IRS obstruction of conservative group fund raising efforts, the Mexican gun running, Bill's $500K for giving some BS speech in Moscow, yada, yada, yada.

Ya know, if you can't have confidential meetings with people, especially when it may involve some horse trading, there is no sense in having a meeting. Please do me a favor, name only a few instances where any Administration, dating to FDR, was open and transparant about meetings with the Russians, the Chinese or any other adversary. This is not new territory...it's just glammed up to look like something nefarious and, IMHO, looks pretty darn juvenile.

UACFlyer

12-09-2017 03:11 PM

A look at both paragraphs...

Quote:

Originally Posted by Bat'71
(Post 524158)

Fairness, IMHO, includes looking at both sides, UAC. Where was all this concern about the Fusion GPS opposition research with the Russians through an ex-MI 6 agent, the DNC refusing FBI access to it's hacked e-mails, the BHO Administration unmasking of contacts and other nefarious activities on the part of the Dems? Where was all this concern about transparancy with the BHO Iran nuclear deal, the removal of the advanced radar systems in Poland, the IRS obstruction of conservative group fund raising efforts, the Mexican gun running, Bill's $500K for giving some BS speech in Moscow, yada, yada, yada.

Ya know, if you can't have confidential meetings with people, especially when it may involve some horse trading, there is no sense in having a meeting. Please do me a favor, name only a few instances where any Administration, dating to FDR, was open and transparant about meetings with the Russians, the Chinese or any other adversary. This is not new territory...it's just glammed up to look like something nefarious and, IMHO, looks pretty darn juvenile.

Bat, everything you point out in para 1 is accurate and reasonable. But, it's pretty much along the lines of....Johnny, when caught doing something wrong uses as his defense, "Well look at what Joe did, that was worse and he wasn't punished". "This isn't fair".

Obama is not president. Clinton is not president. Trump is the president. One of the reason he may be in hot water is that he surrounded himself with a bunch of amateurs who went about serious government business the same way they conducted their real estate business....badly.

Re the second paragraph, you are correct, every administration has conducted confidential meetings, had confidential, informal meetings with foreign counterparts. That's necessary. But, I'll bet those meetings covered the waterfront, involving many countries.

The Trump team, well before it was an "administration" has been connected with Russians and/or their interests....through the campaign, the transition and after the inauguration. Every effort was made to conceal these contacts...and/or to dilute the nature until more and more information leaked out. It was odd. Having contacts with China would be more understandable in light of the NK matter.

It was always Russia. And what started the media and people's focus and interest was the strange manner in which DJT always spoke about Russia and Putin, starting in the campaign when no one (incl DJT) believed he had a chance of winning the nomination. And it never stopped.

Then after the election when the Russian investigations began the President spoke to every senior administration official having any possible connection to the investigation requesting that they do anything they can to shut down the investigation. You know that, Bat.

The matter came to a head with the firing of Comey, which the President said in an interview was prompted by the way Comey was handling the Russian investigation. Trump has been obsesses with this issue, Bat,...to his own detriment. And no one appears to know why. So, is it surprising that people think Trump must be hiding something? Of course not.

Back to Ignatius again: The President may very well be obsessed with hiding something...but the "something" may not be illegal. Ignatius posed a question: "What is the President so afraid of..?" There is no doubt that he is afraid of certain things emerging. But, there is no indication of illegality.

Trump is not an ordinary guy by any measure. He is very proud, vain, self-absorbed and recoils at even minor slights and what he perceives as offenses. It would not surprise me at all if what the President fears will emerge is evidence that he is not good businessman and that his businesses have not been well run and are not on a sound financial footing. That sort of thing he would find intolerable, in my opinion.

Recall, when the single page of a tax return was mailed to the NY Times the focus was on the fact that he didn't pay any taxes. He said, "That's because I'm smart". But I recall a piece by an accountant who said that the tax issue was insignificant. The real info from that return, although it was only for one year, is that it reflected a business in shambles. And a few years ago DJT Jr. said himself that the Trump enterprise could only borrow from Russia and that their debt was largely Russian. That does not sound like a well run business enterprise does it, Bat? It may well be that revelation of a debt-ridden business enterprise with years of poor management decisions is what DJT fears most....rather than illegalities. Whatever, actions speak louder than words (I heard that somewhere)...and the President's actions re Russia are the basis of the media and public focus on Russia.

Media bias, a sleazy FBI and past Obama/Clinton behavior just divert attention away from the central issue of Mueller's investigation. What has been and is going on with Russia. Legal? Illegal? Unethical? Embarrassing? Nothing at all?

Let Mueller finish quickly.

Bat'71

12-09-2017 03:46 PM

Look, I admit Trump was not the ideal candidate and was not my cup of tea. But you and I have been around the block a few times, UAC, and quite frankly all I see coming out of all this is an attempt to disrupt his Administration and get him impeached on some trumped-up (no pun intended) charges that in other Administrations would never have seen the light of day. Yeah, Trump can be embarrassing and he doesn't know when to shut up at times, but he is being an effective Executive, has aligned good senior cabinet officers that know what they're doing, and changing things up a bit...IMHO, that's pretty refreshing and good to see. . With all the "unmasking" that was going on in the later part of 2016, the surveillance of the Trump campaign and the multiple leaks coming out of the "investigations" on the Hill and by the IC, If there was "any there, there" it sure would have come out by now, don'tcha think? This thing stinks to high heaven and is so disingenuous and one-sided to be insulting to most people. IMHO,the Liberal Left lost a "gimme" and they just can't figure it out or get over it.

Fudd

12-09-2017 05:36 PM

Imagine if you will that Obama had been investigated and surveilled based on flimsy opposition research by Republicans that found it's way to anti-Obama FBI agents and that an entire investigative team of Republican and Bush doners and backers was assembled to investigate him. Imagine that leaks emerged that showed anti-Obama feelings among the investigators.

What would the reaction be to that?

Answer honestly please.

UACFlyer

12-09-2017 06:30 PM

All good points

Quote:

Originally Posted by Bat'71
(Post 524176)

Look, I admit Trump was not the ideal candidate and was not my cup of tea. But you and I have been around the block a few times, UAC, and quite frankly all I see coming out of all this is an attempt to disrupt his Administration and get him impeached on some trumped-up (no pun intended) charges that in other Administrations would never have seen the light of day. Yeah, Trump can be embarrassing and he doesn't know when to shut up at times, but he is being an effective Executive, has aligned good senior cabinet officers that know what they're doing, and changing things up a bit...IMHO, that's pretty refreshing and good to see. . With all the "unmasking" that was going on in the later part of 2016, the surveillance of the Trump campaign and the multiple leaks coming out of the "investigations" on the Hill and by the IC, If there was "any there, there" it sure would have come out by now, don'tcha think? This thing stinks to high heaven and is so disingenuous and one-sided to be insulting to most people. IMHO,the Liberal Left lost a "gimme" and they just can't figure it out or get over it.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Fudd
(Post 524256)

Imagine if you will that Obama had been investigated and surveilled based on flimsy opposition research by Republicans that found it's way to anti-Obama FBI agents and that an entire investigative team of Republican and Bush doners and backers was assembled to investigate him. Imagine that leaks emerged that showed anti-Obama feelings among the investigators.

What would the reaction be to that?

Answer honestly please.

The stench from the Obama administration and Clinton campaign is far stronger than anything we've seen from Trump. But, you'll have to admit he makes himself a juicy target....with his mouth, his off-the-wall temperament and his penchant for secrecy. Obama and Clinton were slick operators and Donald is not....he lets it all hang out; and it ain't pretty.

Whatever, in spite of all the flack Mueller is getting, I believe his career has been very impressive and that he is an honest man..and he's a Republican. When named to his post he received bipartisan support you'll recall. I think that he will put the Country first and try to wrap this up ASAP. He knows the longer it drags out the Country and administration suffers.

One last point: Re Trump's penchant for secrecy....in the context of his run to the WH it started with the tax return issue. Trumpsters "trumpeted" that they don't matter, that no one cares. At least one person cared a great deal, Donald Trump. He never once issued a coherent explanation for why he was refusing to reveal his returns. Indeed, his promises to reveal them were unequivocal. But, he never did...for which there is a good reason that Mueller may reveal. Consider this: What will DJT's supporters say if the returns contain information, that if known, would have prevented his election?

I know what they'll say: "Doesn't matter...still better than Clinton". And they may be right.

Fudd

12-09-2017 07:00 PM

A big mouth or a juicy target is no excuse for malpractice in the Justice Department and activism/partisan politics within the FBI. The President was elected by the nation because of his big mouth, ass-kicking attitude and determination to drain the corrupt swamp of Washington DC. If there are partisan officials within the government who cannot go along with his agenda and want to undermine it at any cost, they should face the consequences. They always have the option to resign. We did not elect them or ask them to steer our government.

The President's bombastic style might actually be the key to draining the Swamp. His political opponents are so enraged by it that they do foolish things in response, betraying corrupt bias that might have otherwise gone unnoticed and under the radar. I feel like that is happening to the FBI right now. The spotlight is on deep-staters who thought they could fight a war from behind the curtain. They disliked Trump so much that they did stupid things that drew attention to themselves. IMO, there continues to be a complete underestimation of Trump by his opponents. The guy never rolls over. He is the anti-Jeb!

Fudd

12-09-2017 10:59 PM

Does anyone know what the rules would be if the Intelligence Committee would find FBI officials "in contempt"? Does it have any teeth? How can they be held accountable? If they continue to refuse to disclose information to Congress, what mechanism can force them to disclose?

I'm just curious as to where the true accountability of the FBI and Justice Department lies. Who investigates their conduct and what would be the mechanism for them to face justice if they have broken laws?

Avid Flyer

12-10-2017 06:16 AM

Hillary did not need to be swore in, she already was via article six of the US Constitution.

In a nutshell anyone taking the oath of office is officially sworn in when in their official capacity of elected or appointed office. Includes law enforcement, politicals, etc.

Article six, not the sixth amendant.

Fudd

12-10-2017 01:45 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Avid Flyer
(Post 524364)

Hillary did not need to be swore in, she already was via article six of the US Constitution.

In a nutshell anyone taking the oath of office is officially sworn in when in their official capacity of elected or appointed office. Includes law enforcement, politicals, etc.

Article six, not the sixth amendant.

Hillary was interviewed when she was a private citizen running for office, correct?

Avid Flyer

12-10-2017 03:27 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Fudd
(Post 524395)

Hillary was interviewed when she was a private citizen running for office, correct?

Yes but the interview was regarding her issues I'll call it as a political office holder, still obligatory regarding her official capacity.

They won't use it against her as there is an unwritten agreement in the judicial circles not to enter it in court records as it would open Pandora box, and empty DC entirely. But just the same it is there if any brave soul were to use it.

shocka43

12-10-2017 08:03 PM

UAC...you mention the tax return thing again and trying to stir it up stating "secrecy".

We discussed it previously...it doesn't matter. He released them and it shows he took advantage of the legal tax code, there is fallout. He puts them out there and it shows business bankruptcy, there is fallout. He could have nothing shifty with a single return, and simply due to the financial benefits a person in his field gets, it looks shifty and the left starts a S-storm.

It flat out doesn't matter to the left no matter what is released, which is why the right says their release doesn't matter.

So...HRC gets elected and she releases hers...do you think that all of her corrupt and potential illegal loophole income funneled through the Clinton Foundation sparks any controversy with the left? Hell no it doesn't.

Bat'71

12-11-2017 09:20 AM

I realize that this may get the teeth a-grinding of some of our more liberal, progressives on UD Pride because it's from Swamp's favorite network (Faux News...right Swamp?...still makes me laugh coming from you), but Joe diGenova has some very good points to make about Comey, the FBI and the whole investigation into both sides of the investigation. It's about a five minute clip, but touches on things we have been discussing.https://pjmedia.com/video/former-us-...t-cop-america/

So now, texts from the time period of the 2016 election are emerging between Peter Strzok and Lisa Page, both former members of Muellers investigative team. "F Trump". "Omg [Trump's] an idiot." "He's awful" "Oooh, TURN IT ON, TURN IT ON!!! THE DO*CHEBAGS ARE ABOUT TO COME OUT". There is worse.

Also in March, Page seems to be concerned about whether the things they say about Mr. Trump can be found out. "So look, you say we can text on that phone when we talk about Hillary because it cant be traced," she wrote.

So, there is talk about moving their conversations about Hillary to an untraceable form of communication, so that they won't be "found out". What ramifications does this have on investigations that they were involved in? If there is nothing to hide, why hide it?

Are these the best non-partisan lawyers that Mueller could find? Think about everything that Strzok has been involved in regarding both the Hillary and Russian investigations. How can we trust that he was impartial and did not steer these "investigations". Conflict of interest.

Rosenstein is the one who brought the circus to town. Why would he want to shut it down?

With the texts that have been released today, there is no way that the investigation does not get investigated now. Why was none of this disclosed to Congress when they demanded the information? This has become more incestuous than a party thrown by Caligula.

Just confirmed that the Justice Department invited reporters over to DOJ last night to look at the Strzok/Page texts — and report them out — in case they did not leak in time for Rosenstein's hearing today.

I'm becoming more convinced that there is going to be a deep body cavity search of the DOJ.

TA111

12-13-2017 05:35 PM

I can't believe the texts from the FBI employees involved in these investigations. One came out today where they stated "Clinton has to win" the election. Are you kidding me? And these are the fools who were investigating Clinton's illegal email server. This is really disgusting.

Fudd

12-13-2017 05:37 PM

Take a look at this test from Peter Strzok to Lisa Page:

Text is dated August 15, 2016

Quote:

“I want to believe the path you threw out for consideration in [deputy FBI director Andrew McCabe’s] office that there's no way he gets elected -- but I'm afraid we can't take that risk. It's like an insurance policy in the unlikely event you die before you're 40…”

Doesn't it make you wonder what his insurance policy was? Are the doubters beginning to believe in the "deep state"?

Fudd

12-13-2017 05:39 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by TA111
(Post 524849)

I can't believe the texts from the FBI employees involved in these investigations. One came out today where they stated "Clinton has to win" the election. Are you kidding me? And these are the fools who were investigating Clinton's illegal email server. This is really disgusting.

It's more corrupt than anyone ever imagined. We were all stupified by the findings of the Comey press conference and his conclusion. It makes sense now. Just look behind the curtain at the real thoughts of the "investigators".

ClaytonFlyerFan

12-13-2017 06:29 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Swampy Meadows
(Post 524844)

And here is the crack reporting done by FoxNews.com. It's like "Where's Waldo" trying to find the AL Senatorial election coverage:

This post is complete Bull****. I was on Fox news site about 345 today before leaving the office, the top half dozen stories were no different then than what they are now at 515 pm, all about the election. Someone photo shopped this as a sick joke (are you stooping to this level now?), and of course all the libs are believing it to be true.

Bat'71

12-13-2017 06:53 PM

It's not worth reading anything "Milhouse" Posts any more. It used to be good for comic relief or seeing how off the charts his fevered brain could go, but life's too short to suffer fools like him generously. Gee, I wish we had a "Wedgie" emoticon.

TA111

12-13-2017 06:56 PM

http://www.nationalreview.com/articl...p-coincidences
Great article on the many conflicts and bias among the FBI investigators in these probes. After reading these facts there is no question that Mueller's investigation is completely compromised. In the legal world we are required to avoid the appearance of impropriety. In this case there is far more than just an appearance.

ClaytonFlyerFan

12-13-2017 07:13 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Bat'71
(Post 524865)

It's not worth reading anything "Milhouse" Posts any more. It used to be good for comic relief or seeing how off the charts his fevered brain could go, but life's too short to suffer fools like him generously. Gee, I wish we had a "Wedgie" emoticon.

Oh I agree, but "Millhouse" posted an outright lie with the Fox News cover page, so I felt the urge to call him out on it.

Millhouse never did answer the question of mine on the other thread when I asked him if he remembers meeting me at a Flyers game? We very well could have been in the same picture.

It is obvious that when CNN canned his butt due to Fox News, at the time the new kid on the block dominating the ratings, he now carries a deep rooted grudge against Fox.

Swampy Meadows

12-13-2017 07:55 PM

ClaytonFlyerFan: The screen grab I posted of the Faux News website was taken from a Tweet by as of 11:45 am by Matthew Gertz as found here:

So it looks like you were the one telling the outright lie, Ace.Posted via Mobile Device

Fudd

12-13-2017 08:06 PM

Swampy, what does your post have to do with the DOJ and their scheduled colonoscopy? It seems like random noise on this thread. Can't you start a thread where you can put all of these random links and screenshots?

Fudd

12-13-2017 08:32 PM

How about this little exchange between DOJ Page and Strzok?:

Quote:

Page – And maybe you’re meant to stay where you are because you’re meant to protect the country from that menace. To that end comma, read this:

Strzok – Thanks. It’s absolutely true that we’re both very fortunate. And of course I’ll try and approach it that way. I just know it will be tough at times. I can protect our country at many levels, not sure if that helps

He can protect our country at many levels? What? This is the unbiased DOJ? He is on a mission to protect the country from voting in Trump?

One DOJ lawyer, who has his fingers in both investigations is on a mission to protect the country from Trump voters who he says he can smell at Walmart? This guy should be sweeping the floor at Walmart next week.

This is the DOJ that I am expected to have blind faith in? This guy was moved to HR after this was discovered. Isn't HR supposed to be the center of integrity within the department? This is exactly what I expect to find anymore when we go turning over stones within the government. This is why the Federal Government needs to be smaller and weaker. This one guy thinks he can counteract millions of voters by abusing his position. And he can when he is allowed secrecy and insulation from oversight. He is the poster child for the "deep state" or "shadow government", whatever you prefer to call it. How can he not have been fired? Because this is how the bureaucracy protects itself. This guy was going to protect our country from it's own voting.

Did someone once tell me that it is dangerous to hold our intelligence agencies accountable? They have brought this upon themselves. It's up to us to demand it be disinfected.

Swampy Meadows

12-13-2017 08:35 PM

Fudd: It was a response to Bat ‘71’s post where he calls reporters from CNN, MSNBC, NYT and WaPo “hacks” and demonstrated the attempt by Faux News to bury what was for them some very bad news, which is the textbook definition of “hack” journalismPosted via Mobile Device

cj

12-13-2017 10:09 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Fudd
(Post 524876)

Swampy, what does your post have to do with the DOJ and their scheduled colonoscopy? It seems like random noise on this thread. Can't you start a thread where you can put all of these random links and screenshots?

I set up a thread just for Swampy and someone closed it. Hmmmmmm.

ClaytonFlyerFan

12-13-2017 10:38 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Swampy Meadows
(Post 524873)

ClaytonFlyerFan: The screen grab I posted of the Faux News website was taken from a Tweet by as of 11:45 am by Matthew Gertz as found here:

So it looks like you were the one telling the outright lie, Ace.Posted via Mobile Device

Google is my friend, unlike the 3 minutes I just spent looking this crap up

Matthew Gertz- Media Matters for America ????

LMFAO- second paragraph of the profile of this scam for a 501c clearly states their mission is to dispute anything Fox News or Rush Limbaugh says. Why the hell do they even have or get 501c status?????

Following the list of donors makes me want to puke

and don't call me ACE

EDIT UPDATE- I was on Fox early morning too, 615 AM or so to see election results, and page was plastered with news then too. Only reason I quoted times I did in original post was based on timing of your post. Nice try!
Gertz = FAKE NEWS

Swampy Meadows

12-13-2017 11:05 PM

It's a freakiin' screen grab. What does him working for a 501c have to do with a simple screen grab, other than you don't like who supports it?

How does that prove anything?

It doesn't.

He didn't need to doctor the screen grab, the page spoke for itself.

ClaytonFlyerFan

12-13-2017 11:10 PM

IT WAS NOT A SCREEN GRAB! He is a freaking liberal clown who makes his living making up FAKE news trashing Fox. Pretty much says that right on the web site of his 501c (other than the word Fake) THIS WAS A FAKE PICTURE!

Swampy Meadows

12-13-2017 11:13 PM

Sorry you need to show your work. Where does it say he altered it? Like I said he didn’t have to—it spoke for itself.Posted via Mobile Device

ClaytonFlyerFan

12-13-2017 11:16 PM

Oh I forgot, it was on the internet so it has to be true in your mind.

shocka43

12-13-2017 11:26 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by ClaytonFlyerFan
(Post 524903)

Oh I forgot, it was on the internet so it has to be true in your mind.

Bus is really short.

cralford

12-13-2017 11:34 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Swampy Meadows
(Post 524899)

It's a freakiin' screen grab. What does him working for a 501c have to do with a simple screen grab, other than you don't like who supports it?

How does that prove anything?

It doesn't.

He didn't need to doctor the screen grab, the page spoke for itself.

Did you actually consider going to Fox news to verify this simple screen grab Ace Reporter?

Fudd

12-13-2017 11:58 PM

Deputy FBI Director Andrew McCabe.

Keep an eye on this guy. It seems like all roads lead to him in this anti-Trump movement within the DOJ. His wife received $700,000 from Hillary allies for her Virginia State Senate run. I think he was the one responsible for placing Strzok on the Russia investigative team. He also demoted Ohr only one day before the news broke about his failure to disclose meetings with Fusion GPS, who paid for the Trump Dossier, and for whom his wife worked.

It sounds like one of the more ****ing conversations about "an insurance policy" if Trump wins happened in "Andrews office". It is not confirmed, but it sounds like that might have been referring to Andrew McCabes office.

He is being pursued to testify before Congress.

Like I said, this situation just keeps getting more incestuous. It's a complicated web of conflicts of interest and anti-Trump activism. If you are being overwhelmed by the number of people in this web and all of the signs of corruption, don't be ashamed. This is the Swamp.

ud2

12-14-2017 12:04 AM

I just went to www.foxnews.com now, Jones and Moore are front and center at the very top of the page, they are the lead story.

ud2

12-14-2017 12:09 AM

I would like Mueller to tell us how much longer this is going to take. This has been a long wait.

zmz723

12-14-2017 12:19 AM

As I posted in a different thread:

We're looking at an international criminal real estate, money-laundering, computer-hacking, election-tampering conspiracy involving people at the highest levels of business and government. Totally something that a competent prosecutor should approach with a "narrow" net and wrap up in a couple months.

This stuff takes time.

Fudd

12-14-2017 07:37 AM

Because Swampy is unhappy with Fox News and their webpage, let us review what they just served us up this week, that somehow has been overlooked by every other mainstream news outlet in the United States.

Hannity, the most despised man in America by the alt-left, outside of Trump himself, just broke the news on what is really going on within the DOJ and FBI concerning the Hillary and Trump investigations. We now know that DOJ investigators were basically plotting against Trump and his rise to power.

Without his investigative work, we would be completely unaware of what is happening within the walls of the DOJ and the rest of the fake media would be happy to ignore it.

Reflect on this for a while. Come to peace with it. There is a lot more to come. There will more stories with this gravity coming, from the same journalist. How can only one single media guy dredge all of this up? It's because the rest of the media stopped being media years ago. They have become political organizations who only promote a single political agenda and willfully ignore stories that do not match their agenda.

Bat'71

12-14-2017 09:26 AM

As an aside, I'd like someone at UD Pride to figure out why I get blocked periodically from giving Green Pips (I've never given a Red one BTW) and I'm told that I don't have the privilege to "thank" others for their "Posts". This has happened to me in the past and is starting up again with a vengenece. Something stinks, IMHO

shocka43

12-14-2017 11:07 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Bat'71
(Post 524925)

As an aside, I'd like someone at UD Pride to figure out why I get blocked periodically from giving Green Pips (I've never given a Red one BTW) and I'm told that I don't have the privilege to "thank" others for their "Posts". This has happened to me in the past and is starting up again with a vengenece. Something stinks, IMHO

Send Chris a PM. May be the best place to get clarification and maybe a solution.

"Trump's" DOJ, as you call it doesnt have to undermine Mueller's investigation, The Dem hacks Strzok, Page and Ohr have already compromised the investigation with their blatant bias and hate.

Swampy Meadows

12-14-2017 11:59 AM

Former AG Eric Holder tweets:

Speaking on behalf of the vast majority of the American people, Republicans in Congress be forewarned:any attempt to remove Bob Mueller will not be tolerated.These are BS attacks on him/his staff that are blatantly political-designed to hide the real wrongdoing. Country not party

Fudd

12-14-2017 12:53 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Swampy Meadows
(Post 524971)

Former AG Eric Holder tweets:

Speaking on behalf of the vast majority of the American people, Republicans in Congress be forewarned:any attempt to remove Bob Mueller will not be tolerated.These are BS attacks on him/his staff that are blatantly political-designed to hide the real wrongdoing. Country not party

Dear Eric Holder, the DOJ and FBI are bringing this upon themselves. This is not manufactured by anyone other than the people within those walls. The rest of us are just spectators to this trainwreck. Comey once tweeted, "Justice is flowing like a river." Maybe he was right.

shocka43

12-14-2017 01:07 PM

Hahahahahaha....Eric Holder....such a stand up guy with so much integrity....

JimBo

12-14-2017 01:31 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by shocka43
(Post 524987)

Hahahahahaha....Eric Holder....such a stand up guy with so much integrity....

No kidding, the biggest activist who has ever held the position of Attorney General of the United States. Holder demonstrated on multiple occasions that ideology trumped the law during his time as AG. The clown has zero credibility.

shocka43

12-14-2017 02:58 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by JimBo
(Post 524989)

No kidding, the biggest activist who has ever held the position of Attorney General of the United States. Holder demonstrated on multiple occasions that ideology trumped the law during his time as AG. The clown has zero credibility.

Might as well toss Loretta in there.

UACFlyer

12-14-2017 03:04 PM

Disturbing

Quote:

Originally Posted by Fudd
(Post 524912)

Deputy FBI Director Andrew McCabe.

Keep an eye on this guy. It seems like all roads lead to him in this anti-Trump movement within the DOJ. His wife received $700,000 from Hillary allies for her Virginia State Senate run. I think he was the one responsible for placing Strzok on the Russia investigative team. He also demoted Ohr only one day before the news broke about his failure to disclose meetings with Fusion GPS, who paid for the Trump Dossier, and for whom his wife worked.

It sounds like one of the more ****ing conversations about "an insurance policy" if Trump wins happened in "Andrews office". It is not confirmed, but it sounds like that might have been referring to Andrew McCabes office.

He is being pursued to testify before Congress.

Like I said, this situation just keeps getting more incestuous. It's a complicated web of conflicts of interest and anti-Trump activism. If you are being overwhelmed by the number of people in this web and all of the signs of corruption, don't be ashamed. This is the Swamp.

For sure, the stuff that's been found in FBI exec staff e-mails is disturbing...as is the info above. Why are these guys so dumb as to put things like that in e-mails?

In two words, UAC...arrogance and hubris. C'mon, they're the smartest guys in the world...they're with the FBI and above reproach. Us poor schlubs are expected to get in line and take their word for it.
Ya know, at the end of the day, these bozos have done a helluva lot of damage, so that even if they find anything at all, half the country won't believe them or the Media. What a crying shame.

Fudd

12-14-2017 06:56 PM

I think that I read 400 texts of 10,000 have been released so far. There is a long, long way to go.