What freaks me most is ... these are adults. Yet, they are still looking for approval. I'm just aghast at some of the things they can't seem to figure out.

This has always been why I've felt so sorry for, and try to take it easy on people of faith, especially when it's apparent it's deeply ingrained from childhood. It's difficult for me to take them at their word when they say they are fulfilled... I think they have a hard time convincing themselves, as well.
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Imagine going out for a walk and continually looking to someone for approval before each step is taken... how can you possibly notice the scenery, let alone fully enjoy it? There is the life of a devout Theist.

A new type of thinking is essential if mankind is to survive and move to higher levels. ~ Albert Einstein

Patrick Coffin is the host of a radio show on Catholic radio, and that's his website. I considered calling in and asking why anyone would bother with his advice, but it's not a question that I actually care to get the answer to. It is something to consider, though... why would anyone ask an "expert" these questions when they believe they can talk directly to God? Why not just cut out the middleman? God could supposedly answer any question a person could have and will never be wrong, unlike the apologists.

We know the answer... it's because God doesn't answer shit.

My girlfriend is mad at me. Perhaps I shouldn't have tried cooking a stick in her non-stick pan.

(28-08-2012 10:27 AM)kim Wrote: What freaks me most is ... these are adults. Yet, they are still looking for approval. I'm just aghast at some of the things they can't seem to figure out.

This has always been why I've felt so sorry for, and try to take it easy on people of faith, especially when it's apparent it's deeply ingrained from childhood. It's difficult for me to take them at their word when they say they are fulfilled... I think they have a hard time convincing themselves, as well.
*
Imagine going out for a walk and continually looking to someone for approval before each step is taken... how can you possibly notice the scenery, let alone fully enjoy it? There is the life of a devout Theist.

Ya, I used to be very impatient, with beliebers. The deprogramming process is really a fairly complex one. I like these two vids, as they visually portray the "graceful degradation", in network theory. There is no one piece, that destroys or maintains the whole.

My deprogramming was actually advanced most strongly, by someone who is seen as an eminent Theist philosopher.

Insufferable know-it-all. God has a plan for us. Please stop screwing it up with your prayers.

"well the most obvious reason we didn't evolve from apes, is that we have souls, and they don't".

I mean, what can you say to that sort of stupidity.

I say soothingly "good lion, good lion, backing away, backing away" while casually reaching around to my back to see if I remembered to bring the tranquilizer darts.

(28-08-2012 10:37 AM)Bucky Ball Wrote: My deprogramming was actually advanced most strongly, by someone who is seen as an eminent Theist philosopher.

I've said it before and I'll say it again. There is no machinery as efficient at turning out atheists as a parochial education. ... And you wanna give us a name Fullerene or you just gonna leave us hanging.

"well the most obvious reason we didn't evolve from apes, is that we have souls, and they don't".

I mean, what can you say to that sort of stupidity.

I say soothingly "good lion, good lion, backing away, backing away" while casually reaching around to my back to see if I remembered to bring the tranquilizer darts.

(28-08-2012 10:37 AM)Bucky Ball Wrote: My deprogramming was actually advanced most strongly, by someone who is seen as an eminent Theist philosopher.

I've said it before and I'll say it again. There is no machinery as efficient at turning out atheists as a parochial education. ... And you wanna give us a name Fullerene or you just gonna leave us hanging.

Oh. Sorry. I've thrown it out a lot. It's Martin Buber. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Martin_Buber
Theists, (and especially Catholics) are always talking about his most famous book, "I and Thou", and I usually say, "oh well I'm surprised to hear you recommend that, have you read his other book, 'Good and Evil' " ? (I don't think they would be recommending it, if they understood the other book, destroys their universe completely to little bits). Usually, I get, "doh". Then I say, you should. The first 1/2 is a him "doing some psalms", but Part 2, is stunning. It was my introduction to a real scholar examining the text of the garden myth in Genesis. It changed my life. I will never look at it the same again. It hit like a ton of bricks.. he is so right on. It led to me looking at all the other (Sumerian/Babylonian) mythical origins of that culture. Then if I am talking to a Christian, I ask if they've read Paul Tillich. (the famous Existentialist/Theologiant). He picks right up where Buber leaves off. Buber assumes god, but I think Tillich may have been a secret agnostic/atheist, who kept his mouth shut for occupational reasons. He had a really nice job, and I'm sure he couldn't say what he thought. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Paul_Tillich . I've only read part of the Courage to Be, and when I saw he was saying the same stuff Buber was, I quit. His sermon collections are published, (The Eternal Now, etc), which I have read, and he almost never mentions gods or Jeebus. He's an Existentialist, concerned with practicalities. They're easy to read, and short. He actually has something to say, unlike most "semonizers". He's quite intelligent, actually.

Insufferable know-it-all. God has a plan for us. Please stop screwing it up with your prayers.

Why is anyone surprised by this level of cluelessness on the part of the laity? I remember listening to the Dr. Ruth show in the 80s and being shocked by some of the extremely dumb and blatantly obvious questions people would call in with. If the general populace is too dumb to figure out natural human sexuality, of course they can't get their heads around obscure dogma, designed specifically to confuse and mislead the sheeple.

On a related note, has anyone seen the Intelligence Squared debate from 2009, "The Catholic Church: a force for good or evil in the world" with Christopher Hitchens and Stephen Fry debating the no effin way side? One of the audience members asked why women can't be priests and the half-wit on the other side, a Brit MP who changed teams from the Anglicans to the Catholics when the Anglicans wanted to ordain women and homosexuals, answered, "because women cannot stand at the point of consecration." Umm, sweetie...you did not answer the question. You just spouted inane doctrine. And who said women can't stand there? I bet a man told you that.

Bury me with my guns on, so when I reach the other side - I can show him what it feels like to die.
Bury me with my guns on, so when I'm cast out of the sky, I can shoot the devil right between the eyes.