My goal is to inform potential law school students and applicants of the ugly realities of attending law school. DO NOT ATTEND UNLESS: (1) YOU GET INTO A TOP 8 LAW SCHOOL ON SCHOLARSHIP; (2) YOU GET A FULL-TUITION SCHOLARSHIP TO ATTEND; (3) YOU HAVE EMPLOYMENT AS AN ATTORNEY SECURED THROUGH A RELATIVE OR CLOSE FRIEND; OR (4) YOU ARE FULLY AWARE BEFOREHAND THAT YOUR HUGE INVESTMENT IN TIME, ENERGY, AND MONEY DOES NOT, IN ANY WAY, GUARANTEE A JOB AS AN ATTORNEY OR IN THE LEGAL INDUSTRY.

Thursday, June 2, 2011

Nauseating, Noxious Dung Pile: Second Tier Northeastern University School of Law

Tuition: For the 2011-2012 school year, a full-time Northeastern law student will pay $42,061 in tuition. In comparison, full-time Boston University law students will be charged $41,780, for the 2011-2012 academic year. The school is ranked 22nd by Pussy Bob Morse.Full-time law students at 27th-rated Boston College will pay $41,590 in tuition, for the same school year. Hell, second-ranked Harvard Law charged $45,450 in tuition, for 2010-2011. Yes, as a student at Northeastern Law, you are receiving one hell of a deal, huh?!?! Total Cost of Attendance: The school estimates that 12 month living expenses and other costs, in addition to tuition and fees, will bring the COA to $69,948 - for the 2011-2012 academic year. Imagine the salary that you will need to earn, in order to achieve a positive return on this “investment.”

Ranking:Seeing that Northeastern University School of Law charges more than 22nd ranked BU and 27th-rated BC, surely the school must be ranked pretty high, right?!?! Well…according to the emergency reserve of toilet paper known as US “News” & World Report, this school is rated as the 71st greatest, most fantastic and wondrous law school in the United States. What a unique honor, as it only shares this distinction with five other commodes: Loyola-Chicago; University of Kentucky; UNLV; University of Oklahoma; and University of Pittsburgh.

Supposed Employment Placement Rate: On the “Quick Facts” page, the school claims the following: “The Cooperative Legal Education Program significantly contributes to our placement success. Almost 40 percent of Northeastern law students accept post-graduate employment offers with a former co-op employe. In the class of 2010, 92 percent secured employment within six months of graduation.”

Yeah, sure it was - and Salma Hayek just massaged my torso with her bare breasts. The sewage pit has the nerve to assert that 92% of its 2010 grads were employed within six months! Then again, maybe these JDs jumped at the chance to sell insurance, teach grade school and tend bar.

Average Law School Indebtedness:USN&WR lists the average law student indebtedness - for those members of the Northeastern JD Class of 2010 who incurred debt for law school - as $113,081. A mere 86 percent of this sewage pit’s 2010 graduating class took on such toxic debt. Prospective law students: this figure DOES NOT take undergrad debt into account.

Administrator Pay: Surprisingly, no member of the law faculty made the highest-compensated list at this dung heap. On page 46 of Northeastern University’s 2009 Form 990, you can see that university president Joseph Aoun made $912,983 in TOTAL COMPENSATION -for 2008. Meanwhile, students and graduates will be left holding the non-dischargeable bill - and MANY will be unable to find decent jobs. Yet “higher education” is the key to success, right?!?!

“A good sense of humor is likewise essential. All applicants must be barred in Massachusetts and have reliable transportation. The salary range is between $30,000 and $40,000, depending upon work experience, and comes with other standard benefits including health insurance and paid vacation.”

Still not dissuaded from going to law school in Boston, cretin?! Check out this ad:

“Seeking an attorney with an opportunity for a permanant position with court experience. 90 day inhouse review. Compensation $300.00 pending mutual satisfaction.

Location: CambridgeCompensation: $300 per week”

See how lucrative the field of law can be, Lemming?!?! Surely, $30K-$40K per year will go very far in the Boston area, correct?! By the way, the desperate soul who typed up the second attorney job ad misspelled “permanent” and “in-house.”

NaTTTional JUri$TTT magazine – and my old its CEO Jack CriTTenden – ranked this cesspool as one of the best public interest law schools in the country. Yes, because making $35K per year is going to help one pay off his $130K NON-DISCHARGEABLE student loan bill, isn't it?!?!

Conclusion: Good luck competing against JDs from Harvard, Boston College and Boston University. Furthermore, you are located in a city with six damn law schools!! Do you think that the Commonwealth of Taxachusetts requires such a yearly influx of additional lawyers?!?! Again, you DO NOT need to take out an additional $115K-$165K in non-dischargeable debt to go into “public service.” Any school that charges such grotesque sums - and tells YOU to go into low-paying positions - while the university president makes more than $912K per year is a festering, foul pile of waste!!

I was in Santiago, Chile recently. I was at an international cafe and overheard an American couple talk with a local. The American male told the local something to the effect of: "In America, people pay large sums of money to attend gulags and then leave the gulag with a lifetime of monetary debt." The local asked: "How can that be? What is the name of such gulag?" The American female responded: "Northeastern law." True story.

All of these higher education institutions get away with THEFT because of student loans. Cut the flow of government dollars and a true innovative and efficient market will emerge because higher education will finally feel pressure to deliver. Call and/or write to Representative and tell them to stop student loans. These loans worked OK initially, but now, after decades, they are only corrupting the system and promoting waste. We need student loan reform where all these loan are PRIVATE and eligible to be MODIFIED during BANKRUPTCY.

1) Question: How is it that the average debt is only $113K if it costs at least $210K to go to school and live? Unless you have many students with no debt because of wealthy folks, $113K sounds way too low.

2) Comment: Please stop insulting dung by comparing these schools to dung. Dung never actively went out to try and scam anyone. Dung is just a by-product of us eating. Law school is a whole separate story.

I've said it before, I'll say it again - all these jackasses (Congress) need to do is pass a law that says in effect: if you [colleges and universities] want to continue to receive federal monies in the form of loans to students, then you MUST NOT increase tuitions above some fixed annual percentage (possibly fixed to inflation). So if inflation is 3%, then Congress could mandate that schools could not increase tuition above this percentage for the upcoming year. As we all know, however, this proposed rule could always be subject to manipulation. Ask yourself, do you trust the government to report accurate employment statistics? Clearly, the answer is no. Similarly, would you trust the government to report accurate inflation statistics? Obviously, this model needs some modification, but I believe it would be a step in the right direction.

Have fun at crap hole Northeastern World Traveling Law Student With No Practical Life Experience. Hope you're enjoying your summer fanning your balls in Panama.

I hope you law school lemmings read these posts very carefully as your financial futures are at stake. Unless you use your amazing networking skills, write on to law review, kick ass in moot court and then possibly get a job in the exciting field of insurance defense. There, you will be defending negligent drivers for rear ending greedy plaintiffs that want $$$$$ for their neck and back strain/sprain. In the world of ID, you will take over 50 depositions per year. You will draft answers, motion to compel, motion in limine, try a bunch of 10k cases. You will bill 2000 hrs per year or work as a salaried employee of an in house firm for one of the big carriers. Your boss will be a high school grad claims adjuster who will tell you what the case is worth. These are your prospects coming out of a school like this. Insurance defender extraordinaire.

I went to northeastern for graduate school, not law. I wouldn't send my kid there. It's definitely overpriced. Don't let that stupid co-op argument sway you. You have to spend an additional year at NU and, if memory serves correctly, I believe you have to PAY for that co-op year. So in effect, you have to pay for five (5) years as an undergraduate, albeit one that supposedly gets a co-op internship. In this day and age, that is no bargain, particularly when you're paying (using your figures above) and additional $51,000 for the privilege of having an internship. That's just plain ridiculous in my view. In addition, Northeastern isn't that well regarded in Boston relative to the other local schools. It ain't Harvard, MIT, BU or BC. It's a step below those schools vis-a-vis reputation, but slightly better than Tufts. That being said, it is not worth the price of admission. Unless you are a rich MF'er with money to burn, go to a state school for undergrad., do well and then spend your money on a good graduate school that will hopefully open up more doors.

"The World Traveling Law Student", our globetrotting friend who lives frugally without a cell phone, but has complete internet access throughout Panama, would find it an honor and a privilege to fork out to this loo of a school. So the place does have its fans, I guess.

Northeastern Law School is a piece of shit and that is being kind. I wouldn't send my kid here if it came with a weekly BJ.

Why do shitholes like NU get away with charging more than BC or BU? Because they can. Rich parents will foot the bill so their son or daughter can become a member of this esteemed profession. Poor schlubs that don't know any better will apply because they think they're gonna make bank. It's that simple. You guys and girls are doing a public service with these blogs.

I love how these toilets of law advertise their wonderful public interest programs. Public interest law sounds like such a noble thing. I am sure that many people apply to law schools with the belief that, 2nd 3rd or 4th tier degree in hand, they will become the next Ralph Nader or Erin Brokovich. I am sure that the fantasy of bringing major corporations down, or keeping the evil, intrusive government at bay tantalizes many law school applicants who consign themselves to debt servitude for the rest of their productive lives to chase the belief that they will use their degrees to save the world.

Then there is reality. Public interest law pays shit. You can make more waiting tables or tending bar. For the most part, you won't be saving the world. You will be helping lots of people who are too dumb to avoid creating problems for themselves. They will ignore your advice, and make their own situations worse and then blame you for not saving them from themselves. You will experience the pleasure of representing people who tell you 30% of the truth, leaving all the damning details out. You may even get to explain to someone that, yes, the landlord actually can evict you for blasting away with the stereo 18 hours a day.

If you are really interested in public interest law, here's what you can do to work out your need to save the world without going into six figure debt: Just go sit around the lobby of your local Social Security office a few times a week for several hours. You will see the people you will be working with as a public interest lawyer. Observe them carefully. After a while, it should sink in that public interest law isn't the noble, heroic thing the law schools make it sound like. If you are not deterred, then just go volunteer somewhere. You'll get the same result without the debt.

Similarly, if you have the notion that you would like to obtain a law degree to get into International Law (another fantasy the law schools love to propagate), instead just subscribe to the Economist and watch the BBC World News every night. Its as close as you will ever get to practicing International Law, and again you can save the six figure debt.

I disagree with you wholeheartedly about public interest law, coming from both a corporate law and legal aid background. Legal aid salary ranges from an entry level of 45K to 90K on average (not counting the ED pay) and apart from taking on cases, most often the agency also conducts systemic advocacy and targeted litigation. I have also have a few friends practicing international law in Europe and Asia and thoroughly enjoy it - you're right there aren't that many jobs in that area, but it really boils on the skills and background of the individual.

Your comments could translate to any profession - if one is stuck in the middle, it is hard. These days any liberal arts college education can get one into debt and the returns are suspect.

I love this Northeastern Law review. Funny how my Rutgers Labor Studies professor never mentions this stuff! And the point about rich student-families applies here! (She is one.)I did not get in (applied late, was wait-listed). But with what I know now, good! But screw that beeyotch, she lied about my reference letter --and I would up seeing it. So she can go F-herself and understand she's one of the reasons why RU won't see a copper penny from me. Fuck Northeastern and fuck Rutgers University! Big time!!

International Law is for foreign students who got a place in the class to show the world your 4th tier crapper is diverse, got a scholarship, and who go work for some foreign non profit or their home government upon graduation with their salary being paid for by american government subsidies.

Foreign "students" are masters at manipulating the american educational system while american citizens are pushed further down the ladder. Example number one...Barry Soebarkah.

One thing I dont miss about law school is listening to the kids say:

" I want to practice International Law" (arrogant asshat kid whose either not american or whose dad is half mexican and he wants to make it easier for those illegals to get the justice his dad did not)

"I want to practice Environmental Law"(liberal chicks who dont shave before class or liberal fags who think the world is polluted and they will fix it because they will get a law degree despite having a history degree from some liberal Univ of State School)

"I want to practice corporate law"(Really hot chicks who know they will get a job with some firm or as in house counsel because they act all sexy and sultry and wear those form fitting paralegal fuck me pants to class or they think because they managed a Jewelry outlet at the mall while in college...or the arrogant dude who wears a tie to most classes and whose dad could not get past District Manager at IBM and who thinks his kid is god because he got in to Northeastern law)

"I want to practice public interest law"(Fools who have no idea that their law school loans must actually be paid back and that $1,000.00 scholarship they got from their hometown NAACP is not going to mean much or that they actually have to deal with the people in society who know how to take and give nothing to society. Once they realize that telling the world you want to help the poor, illegal immigrants, and section 8 housing rats, wont get them fame and a paycheck just because they hate Republicans and work for no money while their debt load rises, they get on disability themselves for psychological problems)

When I was a senior in college I was in the school's prelaw lemming society. Admissions reps from University of South Carolina and NE came to one meeting. I could understand USC visiting us because they were nearby, but NE puzzled me. Their school was like 1500 miles away lol wtf were they doing here?

The woman from that school bragged about NE's strong public interest programs. Apparently NE is a leader in public interest law. Public interest this, public interest that. Tuition was like 35k/year at the time.

The lemmings asked a bunch of stupid questions. I then asked the NE rep why the school, which billed itself as a public service institution, charged so much money for tuition. The rep fumbled some answer about how running a law school was expensive. Her response was crap, especially since the USC woman earlier described their 12,000 instate tuition rate. My prelaw advisor stared daggers at me. After the session she pulled me aside and said I should not come to any future prelaw meetings unless I made more "constructive" comments.

I had no idea about scamblogs at the time. I thought I was hot shit because of my T20 acceptance. Little did I know that basically made me the best of the losers (but still a loser)

Where is the TTT or TTTT that charges 10K-15K per year in tuition, and relies on adjunct practitioners as faculty rather than tenured teach-from-the-caselaw-book layabouts with six figure salaries?

Kids could actually graduate from such a school with some inkling of how to practice law and without a debt load that poisons the rest of their lives. And then the school could talk credibly about public interest and public service without sounding like stinking Stadler-style hypocrites.

Because like grad school, the institution exists for the instructors and their overlords, not the students.

Let's face it everyone; the only way law school will reform is when the bubble bursts and the clunker schools and the fatass Stadlers sink to the bottom of the sea. With the law schools will also go a lot of good colleges and those shitbucket for-profits and sleazy tech schools. As my father would say it'll be "a fuckin' mess", but the cancer will be expelled from the body.

@7:11 - Totally agree with your assessment. All these people that think they're going to get a law job in International law or environmental law are 100% deluding themselves. These practices ares, except for a very very select few, will have no chance at these types of jobs. You have better odds winding up as a divorce attorney than getting a job (even an unpaid internship) as a international or environmental lawyer. Good luck suckers.

In the final analysis, law schools exist for the benefit of "law professors" and administrators, not for the students.

http://www.austlii.edu.au/au/journals/LegEdDig/2004/56.html

"Law schools, as institutions, do not encourage broad faculty mentoring in the sense described above. They do not hire people willing to do it, and they do not reward it should it occur anyhow. Why not? Law schools are run primarily for the benefit of law professors — not for the benefit of law students, not for the benefit of the legal community, and most certainly not for the benefit of the public at large. Law schools are run primarily by law professors and former law professors, who generally consider that arrangement to be benign, and certainly do not wish to change it.

Law professors are a self-perpetuating elite, chosen in overwhelming part for a single skill, the ability to do well consistently on law school examinations and preferably ones taken at elite ‘national’ law schools. Once they are hired, law professors are rewarded primarily for scholarship. Most law professors are not familiar with the ever-increasing literature documenting the extreme levels of mental illness and substance abuse that develop among law students while in law school. Many law professors do not like the practice of law, and consistently denigrate it to their students. Many law professors do not like practising lawyers, and consistently denigrate them to their students. Many law professors tried to practise law, but were not very good at it, which results, unconsciously or otherwise, in more venomous criticisms of the profession and its practitioners than would otherwise be the case."

This article appeared in Volume 45 of the South Texas Law Review, pages 753-812, in 2004. For those lemmings who require correct Bluebook citation: Robert P. Schuwerk, The Law Professor as Fiduciary: What Duties Do We Owe to Our Students, 45 S. Tex. L. Rev. 753 (2004).

At the time of publication, Schuwerk was a "law professor" at the University of Houston Law Center.

http://www.law.uh.edu/faculty/main.asp?PID=41

Actually, he still "teaches" law at this commode. In the article above, he admits that law schools are run for the benefit of professors – and many of them do not like the actual practice of law. This is due to the fact that most of them could not handle a real job. From the comfort/safe confines of academia, these swine can mock legal practitioners. How many of us saw “law professors” engage in exactly this behavior?

Imagine if American medical and dental schools were run by aloof “scholars.” How does paying “professors” to research and draft 83 page law review articles on 17th century property law benefit future lawyers?!?!

I commented a few months ago about a kid I met at the car wash. The kid is in his early to mid 20s, making a lot of money and driving a 6 series BMW. He operates a bedbug detection and removal company. His operation has expanded and he landed a contract with a national hotel chain. If this kid had gone to law school, he would be a destitute punk. Today, he is a productive and industrious member of society. Law school not only kills dreams, it slays ingenuity.

Northeastern grads don't have a shot in fuck against Hahvard, BC or BU. No shot. You how nando talks about Lauren Graham. He has a better chance of banging her in the ass than these poor grads have at landing Biglaw.

^ I somewhat disagree. As I mentioned in a prior post above, Northeastern Law doesn't rank as well as these schools, but that doesn't make you unemployable. Now if you're talking about NESL, WNEC and the majority of Suffolk grads, then yes, you're essentially unemployable, particularly the two former schools. I've known some NU Law grads to place well, but just not nearly as well as the Harvard/BC/BU crowd.

"Imagine if American medical and dental schools were run by aloof “scholars.”"

It kills me. Med schools are run by practicing, accomplished physicians. B-schools are taught by wealthy, successful businessmen and women. Law school is taught by biglaw burnouts if you're lucky. Usually, the buttholes went from law school to clerkship straight into academia

Look at the “generosity” of this stink pit. As you can see, this toilet awarded full-tuition scholarships to 0.2% of students, for 2005-2006. Furthermore, the sewage drain provided half-tuition scholarships to 6.1 percent of its students, for the same school year. I wonder how many of these students maintained their offers, after grades were sent out.

Take a look at NYT reporter David Segal’s stinging analysis of law school merit scholarships. The problem is that MANY law students will lose their scholarships - as they are unable to maintain the required GPA - but soldier on to the end. Apparently, these morons would rather shoulder the burden of huge student loan debt - rather than quit law school.

Who wouldn’t admire that spirit and determination?!?! Yeah, when you graduate from a piece of trash such as Northeastern University School of Law - and end up as a hostess at Appleby’s - I’m sure your customers and co-workerswill be impressed with your tenacity, persistence and extensive “education.”

Let’s take a look at NorTThea$tern Univer$iTTy’s Poverty Law & Practice Clinic. How many of these JDs will end up as future poverty clinic clients?!?!

“This clinic represents community-based organizations that seek to give poor people a powerful voice for self-determination. These poor people’s organizations empower their members on issues of housing, work and welfare. Organizational goals are pursued through community education, individual and group advocacy.”

Poor people do not have much of a voice in this oligarchy, Ass-Clown. Sure, they may write letters to the editor, occasionally email their moronic “representatives” and call into talk radio programs. In the end, elected and appointed officials look out for themselves. Which means that they will continue to suck corporate ass, evade the truth, and talk in meaningless platitudes.

Quit playing on the naivete and idealism of young people. To you do-gooders: you ARE NOT going to change the world - or enact “social justice.” Hell, you may help change a local housing ordinance. You might even pass legislation that (ostensibly) helps poor people. Keep in mind that these laws are often not enforced. Oh well, you can try to pass an even “stronger” bill next year, right?!?!

In the final analysis, anything short of arming the homeless will not bring much substantive change. Even if you managed to supply homeless men with guns, the professionally-trained thugs known as police officers will then have some live shooting practice. The powerful remain firmly in control. Sleep well, chump.

When I was at Northeastern for Grad school (not law), I recall being in an auditorium waiting for some seminar to finish up so I could study (sometimes I studied in such places). In any event, while waiting, it became apparent that the seminar was about the high cost of attending Northeastern (for undergrad) and there were a number of students that were making the argument that the school was not doing enough to keep tuition down to a reasonable level and basically these students were relaying their stories about how they had to work multiple jobs, blah, blah, while attending school. I was sitting in the back row and there were a number of what looked like senior administrators (possibly deans) making all sorts of sarcastic statements to the moderator (and among themselves) about the "woe is me" students. This happened over 10 years ago, but this incident really struck a nerve with me and made me realize that Northeastern could give a rat's ass about you as a student. Bottom line - they just want your money. All those fat cat administrators sitting in the back row clearly showed me that they didn't have the interests of the students at heart. Even though I am an alum, I would not recommend anyone going to this school. This place just wants to suck as much money out of you as possible.

7:02 - yep, that's the case with all universities. They don't give a shit about the student's success. They don't care if you land a job in your field, or that you make more than $10-$12 an hour.

They just want your fucking money. That's all. They'd be happy to teach basketweaving if students were willing to take out $50K+ to major in such shit. Administrators want corporate exec pay without any of the stresses of QE reports, pissed off shareholders. Plus the funds are guaranteed by the federal loan system. (State schools get money from the state and feds.)

Take a look at this nonsense, for a moment. This pile of being is referred to as the Northeastern University School of Law Strategic Plan. As you would expect from a bunch of academic lightweights, this purported “plan” is filled with meaningless platitudes.

Common themes of this 11 page document include: “social justice,” “the transformative power of law,” “social disparities,” “social change,” et al. On page 5 of the PDF, head down to the third substantive paragraph.

“We seek to enroll students who are diverse, passionate, curious, energetic, tolerant, compassionate, smart and hardworking. Key variables for recruitment and admission include post-college experience and maturity as well as prior academic achievement and all types of diversity. We are committed to providing opportunities to pursue the law to members of minority groups that are underrepresented in our profession. Our success will be measured by our ability to consistently enroll classes that meet this broad range of goals. To achieve these goals, we must continue to seek the support of donors who will provide scholarship assistance to those students who would otherwise be unable to attend the School of Law.”

Yes, and when those minority students are unable to land legal employment, will the school work with them to find jobs in social service agencies - making $12-$15 an hour?!?! Will the commode highlight these low-income graduates as examples of “successful outcomes”?!

“Once recruited, we will nurture these students to become the great lawyers they are capable of being. In addition to a strong academic and experiential program, we will maintain and create administrative and faculty support structures that promote individual success, nurture collaboration, encourage experimentation and a willingness to take on new challenges, and engender cross-cultural understanding. We will bring the world into our community through speakers, programs and a diverse student group, including international students, and we will provide opportunities for students in interdisciplinary and culturally diverse settings outside of the walls of the law school.”

Do you really want a sewer of law to “nurture” you?! We are not talking about a lioness providing for and feeding her cubs, ass-monkey.

The school is clearly playing on the idealism of many young college graduates. The reality is that the law is NOT a vehicle for “transformative change.” The legal system was designed for the benefit of the elite. They may occasionally throw us plebeians a bone, so that we can shut up. However, in the end, the law serves the rulers. Sometimes, you will see an amendment to a statute, or a decent case outcome. But the “lawmakers” seek to maintain the status quo, i.e. they will serve their corporate masters - at any cost.

Northeastern University Sewer of Law charges its students more than Boston University or Boston College, yet they EXPECT their graduates to engage in “public service” work. This is appalling and disgusting. If the “professors” and administrators of this dung heap demand this of their graduates, then let these pigs lead by example. For instance, why should “law professors” make well into the six figures - for teaching archaic drivel?

I was hoping this blog would cover this piece of shit law school. The porkers charge near Ivy league prices and the studnets face TTT job prospects.

If any higher ed policymakers are reading this, do you dunderheads see the results of federal student loans? Maybe you should be more discriminating. And not fully protect private lenders from the risk normally involved in lending some 18 year old fuck $50K for an art history degree from Ponderosa State.

A few weeks ago, a couple of people made comments about Barack Obama (a.k.a Barry Soetoro). I am convinced more each day that Obama is a puppet of the offshore banking cartels and military industrial complex. How is this relevant to law school or student loans? Well, I believe that when Obama says "more education is key," he purposely wants the younger generation to become enslaved to student loans so that they are broken in spirit and incapable of standing up to the abuses being perpetrated against the American populace by our own "government." I saw HBO's "Too Big to Fail" and I was appalled at how wrong the producers got it. They made people like Geitner, Bernanke and Paulson to be heroes that saved our economy. Folks, these people (and Alan Greenspan) DESTROYED our economy. Their allegiance is to the Federal Reserve, which is not a government agency and is privately owned by the Warburgs, Lazards, Rockefellers, Rothschilds and Lehman Brothers (the real owners are not bankrupt) of the world. Wake up before your country is taken away from you for good.

When I was looking at undergrad colleges back in the late 80s, Northeastern's acceptance rate was a whopping 80%. They take anyone. I can't imagine the law school is any different. It makes NYLS look like a tought school to get into.

@3:02 "I believe that when Obama says "more education is key," he purposely wants the younger generation to become enslaved to student loans so that they are broken in spirit and incapable of standing up to the abuses being perpetrated against the American populace by our own 'government.'"

An indebted populace is a compliant populace. I am in agreement with you. This is by design. Remember when Greenspan was promoting ARMS and basically telling everyone to go buy a house. Yes! He talked about the advantages of Adjustable Rate Mortgages, which is plain old insanity. Now we have the same thing going on with Obama. Everyone should know that MORE education is not the correct answer. The jobs just don't exist, but we're led to believe that if we pay more money for more education that somehow all our problems will fade away. That is becoming a fallacy in this day and age. Just wait, we're going to have a generation of people in student loan default and the government will come to our "rescue" as long as we're willing to stay in line and keep us under control. In essence, this is all about control.

You hit the nail on the head. It is all about keeping us under control. Our Bill of Rights are non-existent as a result of the Patriot Act, which was the goal of the false flag, stand down 9/11 operation. In Arizona, a vet was shot multiple times for having a licensed gun. In Indiana, the State Supreme Court ruled that the Police can enter your house for any or no reason at all. Obama can now declare you an enemy of the State and order your execution without a judge, jury or trial. How the fuck did this happen? Anyway, Obama is not the enemy, he is merely an errand boy. The people that control the Federal Reserve are the real threat. I fear America is already lost. It is up to the current generation to turn the tide but with all these student loans and the susceptibility to fall for the higher education scam, can we save the America that Washington and Jefferson established?

Trying to put the pieces together, maybe the reason why the government want to get/keep everyone in debt is so launch a new currency. And let's say that it has the inflationary effect of doubling your money, i.e., for every greenback you get 2 equivalents. Thus, if you owe $100,000 in student loans, now maybe you will only have to pay back $50,000 in "real" terms. Continuing with the story, so now we have indebted homeowners, indebted students, etc. I'm sure they would be in favor of a new currency if it allowed you to pay off your debts with half the effort required.

5:15 is on the money. If you owe $150K of debt that cannot be wiped away then you're gonna be compliant. You will not rock the boat at work. (You need the job, even if working for complete small-minded assholes).

If you somehow get on IBR you will make damn sure to stay at your crappy job. No matter what happens there. You don't want to run the risk of re-payimg your shit for 25 years instead of 10.

Does the government keep people in debt? You borrowed the money. People need to stop relying on the government and educate themselves about why it does or does not make sense to borrow the money. With all the information out there, you have to be a fool to go to a crappy law school. If you do it, its on you.

The government is like a loan shark. The best thing to do is stay away from them when it comes to money. They will gladly own you.

This problem will only be solved when applications to law school drop significantly. The alternatives of a shit insurance or other sales job dont give kids all that much hope so they roll the dice. Most gamblers lose but people get tired of not progressing in life.

As long as we keep allowing illegal aliens in to this country, law schools will continue to flourish. Think about it.

The joke is on all these newly minted lawyers and law students. There are many foreigners that are making bank as "notarios" in New York City alone. These notarios don't pay bar association fees, are not required to do pro bono work, do not have to take useless CLE classes, are not subject to ethic rules yet make a better living than most lawyers without wasting 3 years in law school or carrying non-dischargeable debt.

9:05 asked the question, not 8:30. I just never heard of the phrase Notarios before, but with the little additional information, it sounds limited to Immigration practice only, which the federal immigration rules allow, to wit: non-attorneys can practice in immigration. I don't know why that is the case, but take it up with the feds. If it impacted other areas of law, then I would be much more inclined to contact the state bar re: unauthorized practice of law. Hell, even Painter could practice in immigration law if he so desired.

I think it is a bit naive to believe that "notarios" only operate in immigration. They also work in bankruptcy but they are known as petition preparers. Also, they draft "do it yourself" divorce and civil complaints. Local authorities don't go after these people for various reasons. For example, immigration notarios are hardly prosecuted because their work or lack of diligence often times gets immigrants deported and this is what ICE and DHS wants. In bankruptcy, notarios lack of skill often leads to trustees recovering assets and filing for abuse dismissals, which in turn justifies a higher budget for the UST office from the DOJ. So you see, the government benefits from the proliferation of notario types. But God forbid you are a lawyer and you fuck up a case, the Ethics Board will be all over your ass, auditing your books and trying to disbar you. The point is, I think notarios have it easier to make a living as a "paralawyer" than a real lawyer has in eking out a living as a lousy lawyer.

" The problem is that MANY law students will lose their scholarships - as they are unable to maintain the required GPA - but soldier on to the end. "June 4, 2011 1:52 PM

Indeed. Kids, if you take NO OTHER LESSON from these hallowed scamblogs, let it be thus: if your First Year grades at one of these non-elite "schools" is sub-par, drop the hell out. Repeat: DROP THE HELL OUT.

With sub-par First Year grades from one of these dumpsters, you will actually be better off without the non-elite JD than with it, absent serious and valuable contacts, experiences and connections to the legal community. The reason for this is that, barring such contacts, experiences and connections, you will be forced back into the non-law employment world, which despises the JD and is highly suspicious of people who have JD's and don't practice law. Remember, unlike any other degree in existence, the JD comes with a unique set of negatives.

Shills, trolls and apologists please withhold your anecdotes of exceptional success, as we know they exist. Rather, these scamblogs try to give these unfortunate young lemmings a realistic picture of the immense ODDS against them when attending such toilets of law, in this roulette-wheel "profession."

PS: Obama-haters, give it a rest. EVERY SINGLE POLITICIAN out there, with the possible exception of perhaps some of the Tea-Party types, hypes "higher education" as the cure to all ills. Republican, Democrat, Male, Female, White, Black, Hispanic--all politicians (almost all) bleat the same nonsense to the kids about "higher education" per se being valuable and a must to attain, without regard to major or field or pursuit. Period. They all do.

I am not an Obama hater but he must think you are stupid for buying the "I ordered a hit on Osama Bin Laden" narrative or the birth certificate that didn't exist two years ago but magically appeared last month in Hawaii's Registry of Vital Statistics storyline. Do you also believe in Toucan Sam? You are right that republicans and democrats are equally evil but Obama is no game changer and he is simply a manchurian candidate for the elite powers. If you are such an Obama lover, please name one thing he has done for Black people? And please don't say equal wages for women or Obamacare.

I agree with 12:50. Obama is a puppet of the elite as have been most presidents over the past half century (with the exception of JFK, but we know where that got him). The older I get, the more I believe that things don't just happen, they are planned well in advance. As lawyers, I think it behooves us to keep a critical eye on the government and not trust anything they say at face value. Ask why is such information being presented to me "at this time." What purpose is the government trying to achieve by presenting such information, etc. This country is being dismantled by the power elite on purpose. Then again, Bush would caution you not to believe in all them conspiracy theories. Dumb down the people so they can't think for themselves or send them to school at exorbitant debt so that while they might be able to think critically, we will own their ass due to high debt. Open your eyes people.

This nation is in the shitter. We went from an industrial production country to a service industry economy and now in the age of Obama, we find ourselves in the McJobs economy. Yes folks, last month, McDonalds was credited for over half of the hiring of our nation. How does Obama show his gratitude? He carves out a healthcare exemption for McDonalds. The local burger joint has to get health insurance for its workers under Obamacare but not McDonalds or GE. These politicians have hijacked this nation to deliver it to the elite power base. Obama is a spinless and narcisitic puppet. I am not a birther but I have to ask myself why has Obama spent millions to hide his birth and school records. What is he hiding? Is he hiding the fact that he is a muslim? Is he hiding that he received financial aid in college as a foreign student? What is Barry Soetoro hiding?

On May 4, 2011, former Biglaw associate Will Meyerhofer wrote the following:

“No one likes a quitter,” she quipped, exhaling a cloud of toxins.

Uh…huh. Except there’s a proviso in that statement – a “carve-out” in the contract language – covering the quitting of something self-destructive. Like smoking.

Or a pointless march through law school.

I’d like to speak in defense of quitting, and quitters.

Quitting can be about more than stopping whatever you’re doing. It can be about waking up and asking yourself if what you’re doing makes sense and is worth continuing.

If you’re plugging away dutifully through the legal education process with no real idea why – it might be time to quit.

Does this mean I’m seriously advising young law students all over the country to give up and drop out – simply abandon their legal education mid-way through?

Yes.

I am prescribing a mass exodus from law schools. A semi-mass exodus might do the trick.

Tune in. Turn on. Drop out.

If you don’t know why you’re there – and you’re not sure what you’re getting yourself into – if you’re not at a top school, or even if you are, and your grades are a little iffy, and likely to stay that way – then please, get out. Today. Before you spend another cent.

The legal education scam works because it follows two key rules of all successful Ponzi schemes:

First, it plays to your greed. You dig your own hole because you’re in it for the money.

Second, it keeps you distracted. You never realize you’re getting fleeced.”

If you are attending a non-elite law school – and your FIRST SEMESTER grades do not place you in the top ten percent – then drop out IMMEDIATLEY! (Hell, graduating near the top of the class at a commode does not guarantee a legal job.) Also, if you want to see this man’s analysis on why a law degree is not versatile, then head to this link:

And don't let all those law professors schmooze you telling you you're the best thing since sliced bread. They are obviously biased; they want you to continue to stay in school because their salaries are dependent on such. I'm sure there are many well-meaning professors, but many of them have never seen the inside of a courtroom or even a law firm - particularly all those smarmy ivy grads that went from the hallowed halls of Harvard directly into a prestigious clerkship and back to cozy academia.

I don't give a RAT'S ASS if Obama offends your delicate personal sensibilities or anyone else's . My point ( and believe me, I am unimpressed with him as well) is that he is NO DIFFERENT IN ANY SIGNIFICANT WAY from the vast, vast majority of politicians who also tout "higher education". Can you possibly grasp that complex concept, that one may make that simple observation without being an Obama "fan"?

here is part of Meyerhofer's article on why a JD does not open doors, it closes them:

"I was trying to get a job in the marketing department of a major online bookseller.

I got lucky. The guy who hired me was a former banker...

He was willing, as an ex-banker, to understand how badly I wanted to be an ex-lawyer, and I sweetened the pot by taking a 45% pay cut and doing my own legal work (which saved him about half his departmental budget.)

I also begged, and came very close to breaking down in tears. It isn’t easy convincing someone in the real world to hire a lawyer.

A year later I tried to get a friend – another burnt-out lawyer – into a job in my department. I took his resume to the head of HR.

She looked at me, uncomprehending.

“This guy’s a lawyer,” she said, like it tasted bad.

I flashed a winning grin. “C’mon Brenda,” (HR people are always named Brenda and have big hair.) “A year ago I showed up here with the same exact resume and I got hired.”

She didn’t smile.

“I wouldn’t have hired you with this resume.”

Then I realized why it took my boss so long to finalize my hire. He fought for me, and ended up pulling rank to get past HR.

Fucking awesome eh? You spend 200k on a piece of paper which totally SLAMS the fucking door shut on non-law jobs. The vast majority of law grads who do well outside of law have prior work experience or skills. Unfortunately, a lot of times the stigma of the JD trumps even that.

A few months ago I read a sad story online. A guy was making just under 90k/year as an engineer. He had a wife, savings, and a house, but he wanted more. The poor fucker went to law school, thinking he would become a shit hot IP attorney.

I repeat, the guy left a 90k job to attend law school. This wasn't your typical liberal arts mouth-breather, the man had a respectable career.

You know how this ends. ShitHot IP Esq. couldn't find a job after law school. Apparently patent law is flooded too. His wife left him. She took the house. No engineering firm would touch him because of the JD; he may as well have put "Convicted Pedophile" on his resume. The guy eventually found a shitlaw job paying 35k and is supposedly suicidal.

As an unemployed patent attorney, take it from me - the market's flooded unless you have exceptional credentials. I know many individuals that were also laid off recently - some with over 6 years of patent experience. They couldn't get a job, in-house or otherwise. It's a rough market nowadays since everyone and their grandma wanted to be an IP attorney. Now the market is flooded. Good luck.

Nand is a fraud and a liar. The legal market is growing not shrinking. It was one of the few professions not affected by the poor economy. Law school is a great investment, and frankly, I think they should charge more. Most lawyers go on the earn 250 K plus, so they can easily afford to take out loans for law school.

However there is a small percentage of law grads that are unemployed, but they are a true rarity. I currently attend UDC, and am about to start my 3L in the fall. I haven't worried about lining up employment, because that can all easily be taken care up after I pass the bar. Something Nando FAILED to do.

You have made 195 visits to this site, since February 18, 2011. In that time, you have claimed to be a "law professor" at the University of the District of Columbia; a 2008 law graduate of American University Commode of Law now making $120K as a Biglaw attorney; a graduate of various TTTs now working for the criminals and financial thugs at Goldman Sachs.

YOU HAVE BEEN EXPOSED AS A LYING COCKROACH, ON THIS BLOG, SEVERAL TIMES. I have flushed your face down the toilet dozens of times. Yet, you keep coming back for more.

I'm not sure why you're article is so negative and mean-spirited but as a current graduate student at Harvard, I must remind you that there are HLS grads making $30k per year too. I also personally know two attorneys who graduated from Suffolk and Northeastern who currently work as associates at two major firms in Boston. You need to remember that sometimes raw talent, and great networking skills will outshine a lucrative alma mater. Boston is a great place to go to school regardless if you don't get into Harvard, BC, or MIT. (I know MIT doesn't have a JD program but I included them because its a pretigious institution)

Objective

This blog is maintained by a graduate of a third tier law school. My goal is to educate prospective law students about the perils of obtaining a legal education. There are many pitfalls - the debt load, the oversupply of lawyers, the fact that there are not enough legal jobs to satisfy nearly 45,000 annual law graduates, and the reality that the majority of law school graduates will end up with low-paying jobs upon completion of their "legal studies."