Because Ernie, in alpine caves the water never warms up because it is usually snowmelt and the caves ambient temps out here are usually in the 30- low 40's. Usually wet alpine caves are done in winter when all the water is frozen and the sumps are at their lowest. In spring and summer the caves are high water or in full flood, alpine caving is usually August till before the snow begins to melt, and many of them are fed by permanent snow fields. And many alpine caves have ice in them all year long.

That is why we are skiing 14 miles into Scapegoat Mountain this January to head up the river gallery and see what we can find. The last winter trip was 40yrs ago and they walked through dry passage which the rest of the year is a flowing river, only to be stopped because they had earlier that summer cut their rope at water level, and since the water was gone their ropes were well above their heads and out of reach... Needless to say the rigging has been changed.

Same goes for Idaho. We have more mountains than potatoes in Idaho and one of the more sporting river caves in the Northwest which at one time (60's) was a contender for the deepest cave in America, Papoose Cave at -831ft deep. Rumours abound of others and I am looking for more as well! Like this gem that I spotted a few weeks ago but cant figure if im going down to it or up to it...

If someone is going to be on the MT / WY border doing this dive, I have another project very close by that would also require a dive. I've been resurveying in Tongue River Cave for the past few years, just for the heck of it - it's on the East slope of the Bighorn Mountains. Pretty interesting stream flows through the cave, and the upstream end is a sump where water bubbles up out of a large hole. I heard rumors of this dive being done many years ago, but haven't seen any sort of data, sketch, map or anything to indicate someone actually did it. It would be nice to do this to get a sense of what's on the other side, if there's interest to kill two birds with one stone.

Dan, from what you wrote, you're saying that you're the lone surveyor? Anyway, what's Bob Montgomery think of this possibility? Isn't Tongue River Cave near the river there...or do I have my caves mixed up?

Ernie,The cave is indeed right near Tongue River, just up the canyon from Dayton. I think the stream inside has been dye traced to the river itself. I started a re-survey project in there with members of the Paha Sapa Grotto years ago. I've talked with Bob on a couple of occasions, and I don't think he knows anything about the sump other than it might have been dived at some point in the past. As far as potential goes, the upstream surface sink for the cave is 2 miles to the South of the cave sump and about 900 feet higher in elevation....good possibilities in between....

Well, I believe you've got some communications going on with some divers from the Portland, OR area, so good luck on this. Keep us up-to-date when you finally get going. It should be interesting to follow-through on.

Just for anyone else's situational awareness, I have been talking to some of the crew here, and Chrissy Richards, Peter Norris (Vancouver, BC) and I will be stopping by here on the way back from Convention next summer to take a look at this sump. Hopefully it will work out to be interesting.

gindling wrote:After pumping well over 6,000 gallons of water out of a sump to not have it lower at all, we are in need of a diver. The sump is located in a 40ft pit at the base of a 50ft cliff and is 200ft from the parking area, easy access. The water level does not fluctuate over the year except at high flood when the water gets pushed 70ft vertically up the pit and into the canyon. The cave is located near the Wyoming/Montana border if there are any divers interested. Over 2,000ft of limestone above the cave. We would really like to know what is on the other side.