A Morning Walk in Badger

[Devotee:] Because of Gurudeva, by his kind mercy, we are able to receive
Krsna consciousness. At the time of death, should we think about Gurudeva
or should we think about Krsna?

[Srila Narayana Maharaja:] At the time of death, Sri Krsna. Gurudeva
and the entire world are there in Krsna. Do you understand? The entire
world, Gurudeva, all Sri Krsna's associates, and everything else are
in Krsna. Remember Sri Krsna but also His power  both the gopis
and Srimati Radhika. This was told to us by Srila Rupa Gosvami.

["The devotee should always think of Krsna within himself and should
choose a very dear devotee who is a servitor of Krsna in Vrndavana.
One should co nstantly engage in topics about that servitor and his
loving relationship with Krsna, and one should live in Vrndavana. If
one is physically unable to go to Vrndavana, he should mentally live
there." (Caitanya-caritamrta, Madhya 22.160)]

[Unto those great souls who have implicit faith in both the Lord
and the spiritual master, all the imports of Vedic knowledge are automatically
revealed. (Svetasvatara Upanisad 6.23)]

Krsna's holy name is non-different from Krsna. So does it follow that
we should have the same faith in the name of Gurudeva?

[Srila Narayana Maharaja:] You can, but here in this verse, "Yasy
a deve para-bhaktir, yatha deve tatha gurau," this has been told
for the Supreme Lord and Guru. The holy name has no mention here, but
you should always chant with great attraction, affection and attachment
for the holy name.

[Brajanath dasa:] Gurudeva, he is saying, that since Krsna's holy name
is non-different from Krsna, can we think of 'deve' (God) as 'nama'
(His name).

[Srila Narayana Maharaja:] You can think in that way, but it is not
stated in this verse.

[Devotee:] How can we increase our faith in Guru and Krsna?

[Srila Narayana Maharaja:] I am telling so much  so much 
about this in my classes. First become detached. Be in the renounced
order (sannyasa). Not only be in the renounced order, but follow what
I am telling in these classes [June 14-18, 2006]. Remember all the examples
(of the twenty-four siksa-gurus) that were told by Dattatreya. Give
up everything  all worldly desire for wife, child ren and everything
else. Give your heart, mind and everything you possess to Guru and Krsna.
Then everything will be alright.

[Jayanta Krsna dasa:] Some have the opinion that there is always prema
in the jiva, and some say there is initially no prema, but the seed
or potentiality to develop and receive prema is there. What is the established
philosophical truth?

[Srila Narayana Maharaja:] Prema is there, but like a seed.

[Sripad Madhava Maharaja:] Not manifested, but in a latent position.

[Srila Narayana Maharaja:] Just as everything about a tree is present
in its seed  the tree, its flowers, its leaves and everything
else  so krsna-prema is present in the soul of the living entity,
but in a latent position. That prema will first appear as sraddha (initial
faith), then nistha (firm faith), then ruci (relish), and in this way
it will gradually grow.

[Those who worship the demigods will take birth among the demigods;
those who worship the ancestors go to the ancestors; those who worship
ghosts and spirits will take birth among such beings; and those who
worship Me will live with Me. (Bhagavad-gita 9.25)]

Here, Krsna is indicating that one goes to the place of the object of
ones worship. So if someone worships a pure devotee of Sri Krsna, what
will be his result? Suppose his bhakti towards Sri Krsna is not very
developed.

[Srila Narayana Maharaja:] Sometimes, the mercy of sadhu-sanga (association
with a self-realized soul) is superior to the mercy of Sri Krsna Himself.
I have told you that it is the madhyama-adhikari (intermediate devotee)
who comes to us. He realizes our position  that we are suffering.
Lord Krsna is not aware of this, because He is always drowning in the
ocea n of prema. The uttama-bhagavata (topmost devotee) also does not
know whether or not we are suffering. Srila Sukadeva Gosvami will not
be aware. However, a madhyama-adhikari  Gurudeva  is here
in this world. He knows about us and his sadhu-sanga is for us.

[Devotee:] The residents of Goloka have no consciousness towards the
suffering of the jivas (living entities). You said that only a madhyama-adhikari
can understand the suffering of the jivas in the material world. Can
we then understand that the uttama-bhagavata associates (nitya-siddhas)
*[see endnote 1] come here for preaching, and here he acts like a madhyama
devotee and is aware of our suffering? Or, do only sadhana-siddha or
krpa-siddha *[see endnote 2] devotees come here from the spiritual world
to act like madhyama-adhikaris?

[Madhava Maharaja:] Srila Rupa Gosvamipada is an eternal associate in
Gokoka-Vrndavana. Does he not come? Srila Sanatana Gosvamipada does
not come? They do not preach here?

[Srila Narayana Maharaja:] They may come when Lord Krsna comes, and
sometimes Krsna sends them or Srimati Radhika sends them. She sent Her
associate Gopa-kumara.

An example of a sadhana-siddha devotee is Sri Narada Gosvami. He had
realized the nature of this world after some births, and now he has
become Sri Krsna's associate. So he knows; he can come and help us.
Otherwise, how could he have initiated Dhruva, Prahlada, Valmiki, Vyasa
and so many others?

[Raghunatha Bhatta dasa:] So should the disciple see Sri Guru as nitya-siddha,
sadhana-siddha or krpa-siddha?

[Srila Narayana Maharaja:] They should think he is siddha  an
nitya parikara (eternal associate). Even if he is madhyama-adhikari,
the disciple should regard him as he regards Krsna: yasya deve para
bhaktir yatha deve tatha gurau. (Svetasvatara Upanisad 6.23) Always
remember this.

[Madhava Maharaja:] Otherwise they cannot advance.

[Srila Narayana Maharaja:] If you see like this, Krsna will help you.

[Devotee:] Lord Krsna and His paraphernalia are non-different. He and
His maha-prasada are non-different. Yet, I have heard that krsna-prasadam
can become affected by a living entity's karma or consciousness? How
is it possible? For example, I've heard that if we eat prasadam from
the plate of another conditioned soul, we can be affected by the second
person's karma or consciousness. How is that possible that prasada 
which is Krsna Himself  can be contaminated in that way?

[Srila Narayana Maharaja:] Padmanabha, what is your idea about what
he is saying?

"Persons who are not very highly elevated in pious activities cannot
believe in the remnants of food of the Supreme Personality of Godhead,
nor in Govinda, the holy na me of the Lord, nor in the Vaisnavas."
(Skanda-purana)]

If a person doesn't have enough svalpa-punya, meaning pious activities
from previous lives, he will not have full faith in maha-prasadam. In
Jagannatha Puri, devotees understand there that Lord Jagannatha's maha-prasadam
is completely transcendental, even if it is touched by the mouth of
a dog and it falls on the ground. If a person properly understands maha-prasadam,
he will not hesitate to eat those remnants. It depends on the person's
faith.

I can give an example. There was a disciple of our Srila Prabhupada
Bhaktivedanta Svami Maharaja who liked to eat maha-prasadam that was
three or four days old. He didn't want to throw anything away. And not
only that; he was also forcing the other devotees to eat it. He wrote
a letter about this to Prabhupada and Prabhupada replied that it is
a matter of faith. Srila Raghunatha dasa Gosvami had the highest faith.
He was taking the maha-prasadam that even th e cows wouldn't eat because
it was so rotten. He was washing it and eating that, but he was tasting
it as nectar. In fact, Mahaprabhu Himself came and stole that from his
hand, and He was overwhelmed in ecstasy by eating it. So it depends
on the person's actual deep faith.

[Srila Narayana Maharaja:] Another example is Sri Narada Rsi. In his
previous birth he once took the prasadam remnants of the Four Kumaras
with their permission  from their leaf plates  and after
that, all his impurities were washed away. He said, "I received
rati (transcendental ecstasy) at once."

[Sugata dasa:] During our Prabhupada's time, we had farm projects all
over the country . He wanted us not only just to live in our asrama,
but to grow our own food, make our own cloth, and use bullock carts
instead of cars and tractors. That was a long time ago, and things have
changed. What is your vision for the New Vraja village community in
the long run? Do you want the devotees there to have a modern life with
modern jobs and modern things, or should they go back to simple, old
village life, and not be dependent on the Western civilization?

[Srila Narayana Maharaja:] A bullock cart will not do. You cannot preach
here and there by bullock cart. If Srila Bhaktivedanta Swami Maharaja
and I would have used only bullock carts, could we have come?

[Devotees:] No

[Srila Narayana Maharaja:] Srila Prabhupada Bhaktisiddhanta Sarasvati
Thakura also said that we should take advantage of what the scientists
are inventing and engage those things in preaching.

[Sugata dasa:] Yes, but this is a different thing. Our Srila Prabhupada
said the same thing you are saying  to use things for Krsna. But
he also had a long term vision of communities engaging in an old, traditional
lifestyle, with activities like making ones own food, cloth and milk,
and being self-sufficient.

[Srila Narayan a Maharaja:] How much will you do? If you are going to
be cultivating the field for making grains and making your cloth, when
will you do bhajana?

[Sugata dasa:] Srila Maharaja, sometimes at Gita-Nagari where I did
service, our bhajana was just farming  from four in the morning
until twelve midnight. But for our Srila Prabhupada this was preaching.
It was daivi-varnasrama. This was his preaching.

[Srila Narayana Maharaja:] He did this for those who were not so qualified.
It was for them.

[Sugata dasa:] Yes, this is the thing.

[Srila Narayana Maharaja:] They can go to the grhastha-asrama (they
can be householders), they can cultivate the land, they can make their
cloth and they can perform other activities of that nature. But when
they will advance by sadhu-sanga, they will think that this is a waste
of time. We should not waste a moment. Better to beg something and spend
the entire day like Srila Raghunatha dasa Gosvami.

[Sugata dasa:] So preaching is the essence; preaching is the important
thing.

[Srila Narayana Maharaja:] Yes.

[Devotee:] My parents are both Prabhupada's disciples, and it seems
that the older they get, the further they seem removed from Krsna. I
was wondering if there is something you can tell me  something
that I can do to help them come back.

[Srila Narayana Maharaja:] This is due to lack of sadhu-sanga 
association with pure devotees. If your parents would have come here,
they would have been inspired again. I think it will be best if they
associate with sadhus and hear hari-katha. You can make arrangements
that sadhus may go to your house and speak hari-katha. Or, your parents
can go to that place where hari-katha is going on.

[Rasasindhu dasa:] We have heard from you about many renounced persons,
including Srila Raghunatha dasa Gosvami. When young Raghunatha wanted
to leave his family, Mahaprabhu told him, "Na hao vatula 
don't be crazy." And then He said, "krame krame paya loka
bhava-sindhu-kula."

[Be patient and return home. Don't be a crazy fellow. By and by you
will be able to cross the ocean of material existence. (Caitanya-caritamrta
16.237)]

[Rasasindhu dasa:] It seems that the path of bhakti is very gradual
and slow, but we see that Srila Raghunatha dasa Gosvami left his family
very soon  a short time after receiving Mahaprabhu's instructions.
How is it possible?

[Srila Narayana Maharaja:] He is a nitya-siddha parikara, an eternal
associate of Sri Sri Radha and Krsna. He is eternally Rati-manjari,
so for him it was possible. Mahaprabhu also left His own house and everything
connected with it. He is the Supreme Lord Krsna Himself. What is possible
for the Lord and His pure devotee i s not possible for you and others.

Mahaprabhu had told him, "First be qualified, and then give up
material activities." This is the purpose of varna-asrama. If you
have given up household life without being qualified to do so, you will
again remember the same thing and return there. So we should first be
qualified and then give up the grhastha-asrama. Be qualified while in
grhastha-asrama. All the verses in Sri Upadesamrta have been told for
grhasthas. After practicing bhakti according to the verses therein,
you will become renounced. This is the process.

[A sober person who can tolerate the urge to speak, the minds
demands, the actions of anger and the urges of the tongue, belly and
genitals is qualified to make disciples all over the world. (Sri
Upadesamrta, verse 1)]

[Sripad Srauti Maharaja:] Srila Bhaktisiddhanta Sarasvati Thakura said
that if we put our Gurudeva in our heart, have him travelling and walking
and sitting there, then the Supreme Personality of Godhead will appear
there also. So what is the process of putting Guru in the heart?

[Srila Narayana Maharaja:] Gurudeva is always with you. So you can

[Sripad Srauti Maharaja:] But he is outside.

[Srila Narayana Maharaja:] It is very hard to keep Krsna in the heart
because we have not seen Him. We have never had His association. We
are simply serving Him according to what we know from Gurudeva. But
Gurudeva is personally coming to you. You see him walking

[Sripad Srauti Maharaja:] How can we put Guru in the heart? Once, when
I had just arrived from Europe to attend your Vyasa-puja festival in
Alachua, I opened the door of your car. I was very happy and I told
you, "Oh Gurudeva, you see? I have come to see you ." And
you said, "You should put me in your heart."

[Srila Narayana Maharaja:] Yes

[Sripad Srauti Maharaja:] So how to do it?

[Srila Narayana Maharaja:] You can always remember him, his mercy and
his glorification. I can remember how my Gurudeva is so glorious. I
can continually remember his qualities.

[Sripad Padmanabha Maharaja:] Suppose Gurudeva gives sannyasa to some
person, knowing that the person was not so qualified, but he wanted
to utilize the person for his mission. An example of this is our Srila
Prabhupada AC Bhaktivedanta Swami Maharaja. He gave sannyasa to so many
persons, knowing that they were not qualified.

He even said on one occasion, "I am giving you sannyasa even though
you are unqualified. Actually it is like in war time. I am giving you
battle commission. I am giving you this, and it is possible that in
the future you may fall down." And then our Prabhupada said, "Bu
t it will be a glorious death." On the battle field, when a soldier
dies it is a glorious death, because he tried. Now some persons are
using this argument and saying, "Oh, Gurudeva gave sannyasa to
this person, and then he fell down. Since he wasn't qualified, there
is no harm that he fell down and gave up his sannyasa.

[Srila Narayana Maharaja:] No, no, no. This is not good. You should
not think like this. Gurudeva has kindly, mercifully, given that person
a chance, and that person should utilize the chance. Sri Caitanya Mahaprabhu
also gave a chance without a person's qualification, and Gurudeva also
sometimes does this. Srila Bhaktivedanta Swami Maharaja gave sannyasa
to so many. He knew that most of them were not qualified, and that is
why he did not give any of them Vedic sannyasa names. [*Endnotes 1 and
2: In Vaisnava philosophy there are three ways for perfection-namely,
sadhana-siddha, perfection attained by executing devotiona l service
according to the rules and regulations; nitya-siddha, eternal perfection
attained by never forgetting Krsna at any time; and krpa-siddha, perfection
attained by the mercy of the spiritual master or another Vaisnava. Kaviraja
Gosvami here stresses krpa-siddha, perfection by the mercy of superior
authorities. (Caitanya-caritamrta Adi-lila, 8.5)]

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