The National Football League informed the Chiefs on Thursday that QB Matt Cassel has been named the AFC Offensive Player of the Month for November.

Cassel is just the second Chiefs quarterback to ever win the honor, joining QB Steve DeBerg who did it in September of ’90. Cassel is the first Chiefs player to be named AFC Player of the Month since RB Larry Johnson in December/January of the 2005 season.

Cassel (6-4, 230) completed 90 of 144 passes (62.5%) for 1,111 yards with 12 TDs and only one INT for a 111.2 passer rating in November. His 12 TD passes led the league during the month, while his passer rating ranked third in the NFL over that span. He has recorded three straight games with a 100.0+ rating and produced a pair of games with four TD passes in November. Cassel threw for a career-high 469 yards at Denver (12/5). He currently leads the NFL with a 6.81 TD percentage (min. 250 attempts) on the season. Cassel also has a +18 touchdown-to-interception differential, the second-best mark in the NFL.

Cassel's November numbers: 90 of 144 (62.5%) for 1,111 yards with 12 TDs and only 1 INT (111.2 rating). 12 TDs were an NFL high.

Mr. Plow

12-02-2010, 08:55 AM

Must be a mistake....can we get a recount?

loochy

12-02-2010, 08:56 AM

This surely means that he is as good as Manning, Rivers, and Brees.

Also, this means that he is a lock for the HOF when he finishes up his career.

Hammock Parties

12-02-2010, 08:56 AM

http://i33.tinypic.com/2a6wp5i.jpg

SPchief

12-02-2010, 08:56 AM

Lets see if he can win offensive player of the year before we are convinced

Stinger

12-02-2010, 08:57 AM

QB MATT CASSEL NAMED AFC OFFENSIVE PLAYER OF THE MONTH

By PR Staff

Cassel is just the second Chiefs quarterback to ever win the honor

The National Football League informed the Chiefs on Thursday that QB Matt Cassel has been named the AFC Offensive Player of the Month for November.

Cassel is just the second Chiefs quarterback to ever win the honor, joining QB Steve DeBerg who did it in September of ’90. Cassel is the first Chiefs player to be named AFC Player of the Month since RB Larry Johnson in December/January of the 2005 season.

Cassel (6-4, 230) completed 90 of 144 passes (62.5%) for 1,111 yards with 12 TDs and only one INT for a 111.2 passer rating in November. His 12 TD passes led the league during the month, while his passer rating ranked third in the NFL over that span. He has recorded three straight games with a 100.0+ rating and produced a pair of games with four TD passes in November. Cassel threw for a career-high 469 yards at Denver (12/5). He currently leads the NFL with a 6.81 TD percentage (min. 250 attempts) on the season. Cassel also has a +18 touchdown-to-interception differential, the second-best mark in the NFL.

It's funny to watch the Cassel haters continue to find reasons to justify their stubbornness.

Face it guys, he is having a good year. The Chiefs will pay the retention bonus in the offseason, and he IS the quarterback here now.

B2chiefsfan

12-02-2010, 09:01 AM

HATERS!!!!!!!!!!ROFLROFLROFL

Reerun_KC

12-02-2010, 09:02 AM

This thread just sent me to the microwave to insert some popcorn...

This is going to be a beat down...

stevieray

12-02-2010, 09:03 AM

I guess the NFL doesn't go by the "so, they played 'crappy' teams" theme.

Good for Matt. Confidence builder.

Dave Lane

12-02-2010, 09:04 AM

This is totally wrong and unacceptable. Everyone knows Mark Castle is the suck.

Speaking of that where did all those Cassel sucks Avatars go? OTWP I'm looking at you.

philfree

12-02-2010, 09:05 AM

Lets see if he can win offensive player of the year before we are convinced

No he's got to do it for a decade before I allow myself to fall into this trap. :harumph:

PhilFree:arrow:

TheGuardian

12-02-2010, 09:05 AM

Stats don't count

He didn't play San Diego this month

He did it in garbage time (see stats don't count again)

There wasn't a quality win in there

Voting must be fucked up

Rausch

12-02-2010, 09:06 AM

I guess the NFL doesn't go by the "so, they played 'crappy' teams" theme.

Good for Matt. Confidence builder.

When you watch the highlights you see something we haven't seen a lot of this season: Casshole hitting his WR's in stride. Instead of Bowe having to stop and jump, or stop and come back, he's able to keep running and make YAC.

For whatever reason he looks like he's finally comfortable with Bowe...

When you watch the highlights you see something we haven't seen a lot of this season: Casshole hitting his WR's in stride. Instead of Bowe having to stop and jump, or stop and come back, he's able to keep running and make YAC.

For whatever reason he looks like he's finally comfortable with Bowe...Bowe always jumping to make a circus catch was his problem, and lack of concentration. Now that's he staying on the ground, he's a load when the ball hits his hands.

not every pass is gonna be perfect, it's up to the WR to adjust to an errant throw.

I also think they've been putting in the time, and it's paying off.

Hammock Parties

12-02-2010, 09:10 AM

Even the most ardent homer has to admit that it's amusing that 1/3 of Cassel's TD production and nearly 1/2 his yards for this awesome month came in garbage time against the Denver Broncos.

Kind of puts a damper on the whole thing.

the Talking Can

12-02-2010, 09:12 AM

hell does freeze over.....in case you were wondering

Congrats, Matty, you son of a gun....lol

Chief DJBrad

12-02-2010, 09:12 AM

I AM IN SHOCK!I knew his stats were good but this is huge!Still has much to prove but he has come a long way.He has to win the division to be an elite quarterback and I think he will.I have supported and bitched it's time to go for broke!!

Rausch

12-02-2010, 09:12 AM

I think the only thing worse than having to read posts by memyselfpassiveaggressivejihadbroad is having to read a thread full of people as bitter and cynical as myself...

loochy

12-02-2010, 09:12 AM

Even the most ardent homer has to admit that it's amusing that 1/3 of Cassel's production for his awesome month came in garbage time against the Denver Broncos.

Kind of puts a damper on the whole thing.

Didn't you see the whole conversation in the other thread? Apparently that wasn't garbage time.

Earthling

12-02-2010, 09:14 AM

Grats to Cassel ! Personally I'm lovin' it ! :thumb:

Earthling

12-02-2010, 09:15 AM

I think the only thing worse than having to read posts by memyselfpassiveaggressivejihadbroad is having to read a thread full of people as bitter and cynical as myself...

ROFL This cracked me up.

Stinger

12-02-2010, 09:16 AM

Cassel's November numbers: 90 of 144 (62.5%) for 1,111 yards with 12 TDs and only 1 INT (111.2 rating). 12 TDs were an NFL high.

http://twitter.com/ChiefsPR

Deberg_1990

12-02-2010, 09:16 AM

Cassel is just the second Chiefs quarterback to ever win the honor, joining QB Steve DeBerg who did it in September of ’90.

Thats pretty telling of how KC QB's have performed overall in 20 years.

BigMeatballDave

12-02-2010, 09:19 AM

Awesome. Lets hope it continues.

Earthling

12-02-2010, 09:22 AM

Even the most ardent homer has to admit that it's amusing that 1/3 of Cassel's TD production and nearly 1/2 his yards for this awesome month came in garbage time against the Denver Broncos.

Kind of puts a damper on the whole thing.

That was one week out of four for the month. Not dampening a bit to me...

ReynardMuldrake

12-02-2010, 09:23 AM

That is badass. Congrats Matt!

Kerberos

12-02-2010, 09:25 AM

Grats to Cassel ! Personally I'm lovin' it ! :thumb:

McCassel?

Earthling

12-02-2010, 09:28 AM

McCassel?

LOl

Hammock Parties

12-02-2010, 09:28 AM

So NASA finds a new life form and Cassel wins AFC Player of the Month on the same day.

Coincidence?

TheGuardian

12-02-2010, 09:29 AM

McCassel?

Dude.

That's gotta be his new nickname......

Hog's Gone Fishin

12-02-2010, 09:29 AM

I guess the NFL doesn't go by the "so, they played 'crappy' teams" theme.

Good for Matt. Confidence builder.

Good comment. We need his confidence high.

DJ's left nut

12-02-2010, 09:29 AM

<----- Tips cap

He's had a very strong month.

That's his first, though. As has been noted, it gives you cause for hope, not celebration.

cabletech94

12-02-2010, 09:30 AM

So NASA finds a new life form and Cassel wins AFC Player of the Month on the same day.

Coincidence?

touche'.

and congrats on your impending 100000. may god have mercy on your soul.

Earthling

12-02-2010, 09:31 AM

So NASA finds a new life form and Cassel wins AFC Player of the Month on the same day.

Coincidence?

When NASA can find a new life form on a consistant basis I'll start to be impressed !

Hog's Gone Fishin

12-02-2010, 09:31 AM

So NASA finds a new life form and Cassel wins AFC Player of the Month on the same day.

Coincidence?

Good point ! I wonder if Cassel was abducted by Aliens a month ago and probed in the anus which gave him newly found pocket awareness and the ability to hit a receiver in stride..

Coogs

12-02-2010, 09:32 AM

Well done MC! :toast:

Keep it up! :thumb:

TheGuardian

12-02-2010, 09:32 AM

<----- Tips cap

He's had a very strong month.

That's his first, though. As has been noted, it gives you cause for hope, not celebration.

Your opinion. The rest of us can do what we want.

loochy

12-02-2010, 09:32 AM

When NASA can find a new life form on a consistant basis I'll start to be impressed !

Yeah, the life they found was on a garbage planet, so it doesn't count. Let's see them find life on a big planet like Jupiter, where it REALLY counts.

Earthling

12-02-2010, 09:33 AM

Yeah, the life they found was on a garbage planet, so it doesn't count. Let's see them find life on a big planet like Jupiter, where it REALLY counts.

ROFLROFL

Rausch

12-02-2010, 09:36 AM

Awesome. Lets hope it continues.

Fuck hope.

Hope is for 4-12 seasons.

Hope is for Detroit and Arizona fans.

BELIEF is the reward for holding on to hope for so long.

DJ's left nut

12-02-2010, 09:39 AM

Your opinion. The rest of us can do what we want.

No shit?

And here I thought my word was law 'round these parts.

Frazod

12-02-2010, 09:39 AM

Awesome. :rockon:

Mr. Laz

12-02-2010, 09:47 AM

w00t!

BigChiefTablet

12-02-2010, 09:57 AM

Some bitter fans around here. Have some class and quit pissing all over his improvement.

KChiefs1

12-02-2010, 10:01 AM

Jump on the bandwagon haters!

Sofa King

12-02-2010, 10:06 AM

lol. the homers are coming out in full swing in this thread.

Hammock Parties

12-02-2010, 10:08 AM

Little known fact: Cassel won AFC Shitbag of the Month 4 times last season.

Pestilence

12-02-2010, 10:12 AM

<----- Tips cap

He's had a very strong month.

That's his first, though. As has been noted, it gives you cause for hope, not celebration.

This.

Good job Matt. Now prove me completely wrong and keep it up.

Earthling

12-02-2010, 10:13 AM

Little known fact: Cassel won AFC Shitbag of the Month 4 times last season.

That makes this current accomplishment even more spectacular !! :thumb:

doomy3

12-02-2010, 10:19 AM

Very well deserved.

Frosty

12-02-2010, 10:19 AM

See? Cassel is offensive and this proves it.

:)

King_Chief_Fan

12-02-2010, 10:23 AM

Even the most ardent homer has to admit that it's amusing that 1/3 of Cassel's TD production and nearly 1/2 his yards for this awesome month came in garbage time against the Denver Broncos.

Kind of puts a damper on the whole thing.

really pisses you off now that you continue to be exposed as full of BS and that you have no idea of what you claim. ROFL

Hammock Parties

12-02-2010, 10:26 AM

really pisses you off now that you continue to be exposed as full of BS and that you have no idea of what you claim. ROFL

How about the fact that the Chiefs were 2-2 during this month?

Cassel's best statistical month = .500 record against four teams with losing records?

STATS ARE FOR LOSERS

King_Chief_Fan

12-02-2010, 10:27 AM

STATS ARE FOR LOSERS

including your stats?

Earthling

12-02-2010, 10:30 AM

including your stats?

ROFLROFL:thumb:

Frazod

12-02-2010, 10:30 AM

including your stats?

Good Lord - he's going to break 100,000 today. Damn.

And that doesn't even count the posts from his mults.

memyselfI

12-02-2010, 10:31 AM

LIKE!!! Now make it happen again.

King_Chief_Fan

12-02-2010, 10:32 AM

Good Lord - he's going to break 100,000 today. Damn.

And that doesn't even count the posts from his mults.

I only give him credit for the great videos he prepares. The rest of his posts are rambling BS.
That means he probably only has a couple of hundred that are worth anything.

siberian khatru

12-02-2010, 10:34 AM

STATS ARE FOR LOSERS

His improved play is deeper than just good stats. He has been consistently accurate, has gone through his reads, is staying in the pocket and making throws (except when he takes off at the appropriate times) ... hell, he's even making the right audibles. He's been doing things that he didn't do well, or couldn't do consistently, in the past.

All of that is conducive to continued success. Keep it up, Matty. I am cautiously optimistic, but reserve the right to flame his ass if he shits the bed down the stretch. :)

HC_Chief

12-02-2010, 10:36 AM

Well deserved (though IMO Bowe deserved it more; not taking anything from Cassel: Bowe was just that freaking good).

Fish

12-02-2010, 10:38 AM

Congrats Matt. I wish I had more hope that your bad days are behind you. But you have shown improvement in many areas. That's a start. Keep it up.

Go Chiefs!

Deberg_1990

12-02-2010, 10:39 AM

That means he probably only has a couple of hundred that are worth anything.

you give him too much credit. Id say its more like a few dozen.

KCUnited

12-02-2010, 10:40 AM

Just wait til he gets McCluster back!

Rausch

12-02-2010, 10:42 AM

Good Lord - he's going to break 100,000 today. Damn.

And that doesn't even count the posts from his mults.

True.

And that also doesn't take into account a number of posts that were deleted/discounted over the years not only to bannings but whatever happened when we all lost some posts with whatever database/server/etc issues.

Had the fucker directed his OCD and mild neurosis at something productive he'd have cured cancer by now and be working on the patent for the AIDS vaccine...

ForeverChiefs58

12-02-2010, 10:42 AM

Did they do the voting in Florida? kidding.
Congrats on the QB and team confidence builder. He has played the last couple games like a true franchise QB. Funny how Pioli can go from foolish move to genious in a month, hope he can do the same for Tyson Jackson.

Detoxing

12-02-2010, 10:43 AM

His improved play is deeper than just good stats. He has been consistently accurate, has gone through his reads, is staying in the pocket and making throws (except when he takes off at the appropriate times) ... hell, he's even making the right audibles. He's been doing things that he didn't do well, or couldn't do consistently, in the past.

All of that is conducive to continued success. Keep it up, Matty. I am cautiously optimistic, but reserve the right to flame his ass if he shits the bed down the stretch. :)

Good post but a waste. He sucks from the Teet of Hamas and even fucks that up. His football evaluation is some of the worst on the board.

TheGuardian

12-02-2010, 10:46 AM

How about the fact that the Chiefs were 2-2 during this month?

Cassel's best statistical month = .500 record against four teams with losing records?

STATS ARE FOR LOSERS

How'd the defense play in that time?

Seriously man. Get some water for all that salt.

Jive Ass

12-02-2010, 10:52 AM

This is pretty pathetic to read half of the posts on here saying that this award is jack squat and that he doesn't deserve it. Be happy for the guy. There's obviously a new chemistry developing (note the -ing) and if it continues then this serves as a confidence builder which is something everyone can use every once in a while.

Let him have his cake and eat it, too. It's not like we've got anything to lose in this especially with Denver and SD coming up. We need all the confidence we can get, and this only lends respect from the rest of the team. Comradery shouldn't be underestimated at this point. And no, I'm not a huge proponent of Cassel, but we can't deny the fact that he's shown up to play as of late. Who's to say he can't do more?

crazycoffey

12-02-2010, 11:05 AM

Did they do the voting in Florida? kidding.
Congrats on the QB and team confidence builder. He has played the last couple games like a true franchise QB. Funny how Pioli can go from foolish move to genious in a month, hope he can do the same for Tyson Jackson.

when I first read this, I thought you were memememeeeeeeee for a few seconds, scared me.

Rexx

12-02-2010, 11:17 AM

This should have went to Bowe. He has posted monster numbers over the last month. Either way, been a while since this is happened...so definitely a good sign.

LaChapelle

12-02-2010, 11:26 AM

Let Cassel be your codpiece

Pawnmower

12-02-2010, 11:26 AM

Speaking of that where did all those Cassel sucks Avatars go?

They went to the same place as their Pride, Credibility and Respect went.

CoMoChief

12-02-2010, 11:41 AM

While this team IS getting better, and Cassel is getting better, I think we're all in for a rude awakening next year when we have to play a schedule that's 100x harder than the one this year. (If we win our division this year).

BUT, that's next year. I think the Chiefs this season have done a good job of proving their no longer at the bottom of the league anymore. Their young stars are starting to shine. We should be able to build on this and continue to get better and hopefully become an AFC powerhouse for the next 5-7 years or perhaps longer. I like what Haley is doing. I think he's a good coach, learning on the job. I can't remember the last time a HC has had an approval rating this high since...well Marty I guess. At times DV had a high approval rating when our offense was putting oup 30+ ppg, but we also couldn't stop anyone. Romeo/Weis/Haley have this team gelling before our eyes. What the Chiefs have proved this season is that they can beat the bad teams now.

I still think their a mediocre team at best. But you have to crawl before you can walk, and walk before you can run. This team is heading in the right direction. You can't find too many people in KC that doesn't like what Haley is doing with this team.

LaChapelle

12-02-2010, 11:43 AM

The 49ers were suppose to be all powerful
and the Raiders a push over

KCtotheSB

12-02-2010, 11:46 AM

Congratulations to Matt! I was trying to keep on top of who might win this award for the AFC. I figure it would have been Bowe with Cassel getting an outside look. I suppose the one delivering the passes is more important in the NFL's view.

Anyways, great stuff. Now do it again.

DJ's left nut

12-02-2010, 11:51 AM

While this team IS getting better, and Cassel is getting better, I think we're all in for a rude awakening next year when we have to play a schedule that's 100x harder than the one this year. (If we win our division this year).

BUT, that's next year. I think the Chiefs this season have done a good job of proving their no longer at the bottom of the league anymore. Their young stars are starting to shine. We should be able to build on this and continue to get better and hopefully become an AFC powerhouse for the next 5-7 years or perhaps longer. I like what Haley is doing. I think he's a good coach, learning on the job. I can't remember the last time a HC has had an approval rating this high since...well Marty I guess. At times DV had a high approval rating when our offense was putting oup 30+ ppg, but we also couldn't stop anyone. Romeo/Weis/Haley have this team gelling before our eyes. What the Chiefs have proved this season is that they can beat the bad teams now.

I still think their a mediocre team at best. But you have to crawl before you can walk, and walk before you can run. This team is heading in the right direction. You can't find too many people in KC that doesn't like what Haley is doing with this team.

That NFC North has the look of a paper tiger to me.

Chicago isn't as good as their record, Minn is a mess and will rebuild next year, Detroit will improve but the defense is still bad and who knows what will come of Stafford's shoulder?

The Packers are the power of that division and even still, they can be beaten by a team that plays smart football.

If the Chiefs continue to improve incrimentally, they'll be okay against that schedule next year. It won't be as easy as this one, but it won't be a massacre either.

BigMeatballDave

12-02-2010, 11:56 AM

While this team IS getting better, and Cassel is getting better, I think we're all in for a rude awakening next year when we have to play a schedule that's 100x harder than the one this year. (If we win our division this year).

[quote=CoMoChief;7217805]While this team IS getting better, and Cassel is getting better, I think we're all in for a rude awakening next year when we have to play a schedule that's 100x harder than the one this year. (If we win our division this year).

Why is Sandy Eggo on this list? We get to play them x2 even if we go 0-16.

CoMoChief

12-02-2010, 12:54 PM

[quote=CoMoChief;7217805]While this team IS getting better, and Cassel is getting better, I think we're all in for a rude awakening next year when we have to play a schedule that's 100x harder than the one this year. (If we win our division this year).

Why is Sandy Eggo on this list? We get to play them x2 even if we go 0-16.

Well I'm just sayin....that just adds to the list of potential tough teams we would have to play next year.

MahiMike

12-02-2010, 12:59 PM

Wow. And he did it without a splint on his pinky finger handing off to Christian Okoye!

alpha_omega

12-02-2010, 01:00 PM

Good for him! Now, if he can be the OPOTM for December we'll be in good shape.

This is truly a bizarro world away from what we saw earlier in the season.

LaChapelle

12-02-2010, 01:00 PM

What if both Charger games
are before Halloween

Pawnmower

12-02-2010, 01:01 PM

[QUOTE=KCHawg;7217904]

Well I'm just sayin....that just adds to the list of potential tough teams we would have to play next year.

It doesn't really matter what our schedule is since most of the schedule will be the same for every single AFC W team...

We just have to do better than all the other AFC W teams.

Valiant

12-02-2010, 01:03 PM

Still not on board. But he has been playing great.

Only him playing well in the playoffs will change my opinion. Or a great game in sd with the diviison on the line. We are paying him like a franchise qb, I want see it when it matters.

Still he is playing well beyond my expectations of him this season.

Pants

12-02-2010, 01:05 PM

Still not on board. But he has been playing great.

Only him playing well in the playoffs will change my opinion. Or a great game in sd with the diviison on the line. We are paying him like a franchise qb, I want see it when it matters.

Still he is playing well beyond my expectations of him this season.

OMG YOUR JUST HOPEING HE FAILS SO YOU CAN GLOAT AND SAY HOW RITE U R!!1!

Pitt Gorilla

12-02-2010, 01:21 PM

When NASA can find a new life form on a consistant basis I'll start to be impressed !I lol'd.

Pawnmower

12-02-2010, 01:26 PM

He's had a very strong month.

No it has only been two weeks. "Anyone who knows anything about football can see that"

LOLLLOL

Jack

12-02-2010, 01:29 PM

I wonder which political affiliation the haters ascribe to?

My guess is democrats.

DaneMcCloud

12-02-2010, 01:55 PM

I wonder which political affiliation the haters ascribe to?

My guess is democrats.

For an old man, you're fucking dumb

CrazyHorse

12-02-2010, 01:59 PM

Still not on board. But he has been playing great.

Only him playing well in the playoffs will change my opinion. Or a great game in sd with the diviison on the line. We are paying him like a franchise qb, I want see it when it matters.

Still he is playing well beyond my expectations of him this season.

Let me get this straight. He is playing better than you expected him to, but you just cant "get on board" with that?

You know it takes a team to get in the playoffs. It also takes a team to win in the playoffs. Just like it takes a team for him to play well in November like he has.

You guys are soooo invested in your pissing and moaning about him you have fogotten to make any sense. Your credibility would be better if you had just kept your mouth shut in this instance.

Would it help if I told you that you have already been proven wrong and no matter what happens in the future with Cassel wont change that? The moaners have been cracking all month on him while he carved out the AFC player of the month for himself. That makes you wrong. Nothing that happens next month with make you right.

Can you get on baord with that?

Valiant

12-02-2010, 02:18 PM

Let me get this straight. He is playing better than you expected him to, but you just cant "get on board" with that?

You know it takes a team to get in the playoffs. It also takes a team to win in the playoffs. Just like it takes a team for him to play well in November like he has.

You guys are soooo invested in your pissing and moaning about him you have fogotten to make any sense. Your credibility would be better if you had just kept your mouth shut in this instance.

Would it help if I told you that you have already been proven wrong and no matter what happens in the future with Cassel wont change that? The moaners have been cracking all month on him while he carved out the AFC player of the month for himself. That makes you wrong. Nothing that happens next month with make you right.

Can you get on baord with that?

And he if goes into a four game slump costs us four losses with 6ints then what? Sorry it seems unlike you I am not a bandwagon jumper. He needs to play at this level for awhile and against great teams for it to be norm and not the exception.

And cassel can do great and the team still lose. That would not be on him but someone else. Seems you are one of the few that take fan to fanatical. No one blamed trent when the d was bad. Still does not take away from the facts. Cassel has played the past few weeks out of his mind. Though against some bad teams. Needs to do it against good teams or in the playoffs to counter his stigma of the 2009 season.

Or like you ride the cassel train from the last four games.

Pants

12-02-2010, 02:19 PM

And he if goes into a four game slump costs us four losses with 6ints then what? Sorry it seems unlike you I am not a bandwagon jumper. He needs to play at this level for awhile and against great teams for it to be norm and not the exception.

And cassel can do great and the team still lose. That would not be on him but someone else. Seems you are one of the few that take fan to fanatical. No one blamed trent when the d was bad. Still does not take away from the facts. Cassel has played the past few weeks out of his mind. Though against some bad teams. Needs to do it against good teams or in the playoffs to counter his stigma of the 2009 season.

Or like you ride the cassel train from the last four games.

Pretty much any rational fan should feel at this point. Great post, man.

BigMeatballDave

12-02-2010, 02:26 PM

I wonder which political affiliation the haters ascribe to?

My guess is democrats.How stupid. For the record, I consider myself a moderate, but tend to lean to the right on several issues.

CrazyHorse

12-02-2010, 02:32 PM

And he if goes into a four game slump costs us four losses with 6ints then what? Sorry it seems unlike you I am not a bandwagon jumper. He needs to play at this level for awhile and against great teams for it to be norm and not the exception.

And cassel can do great and the team still lose. That would not be on him but someone else. Seems you are one of the few that take fan to fanatical. No one blamed trent when the d was bad. Still does not take away from the facts. Cassel has played the past few weeks out of his mind. Though against some bad teams. Needs to do it against good teams or in the playoffs to counter his stigma of the 2009 season.

Or like you ride the cassel train from the last four games.

What bandwagon am I on? You dont know squirt. You just throw it out there like you know my position. Thats a knee jerk reaction. Which in this case like many cases makes you look foolish.

If he has four bad games then he has 4 bad games. My opinion will be the same as it is now. It still hasn't changed. I am in the "let the guy develop" camp. Have been since the beginning. Not pissing and whining with each mistake or glorifying every good play. I thought he was a victim of circumstance last season with the coaching changes and the O line play. I was right about that. I thought that if he started to regain confidence in the O line he may start to look like the QB we saw in NE. Looks like I might be right about that. But we shall see.

As for your post I was simply pointing out how hypocritical it was. How you say he's playing better that you expect but you still cant give the guy a fucking break. Nothing you said in your response has clarified that. So you're still coming off foolish. IMO

Chief3188

12-02-2010, 02:32 PM

I have been pretty harsh on Cassel and I think we all had good reason. He was playing with terrible pocket prescense, his accuracy beyond 15 yards was pathetic, he stared down his WR's etc........

While he has played some soft defenses this month anyone who has watched him has to admit that everything about his game has improved from game to game this month. Now before this month I don't think so but this month he seems to really be finding a groove and if playing these cream puff defenses can get him enough rapport, timing and confidence to compete with the bigger dogs then I think we will all be happy but until we see it happen some of us are going to hold off on the Cassel parade.

Just like most of us didn't trash Cassel right from the minute he was acquired but after terrible performance after terrible performance ( What really got most of us was the end of last season how his performance seemed to get worse as our rushing game and the offense around him seemed to improve ), it is going to take a little time with consistency of his current performance for us to buy into anything.

CrazyHorse

12-02-2010, 02:35 PM

Pretty much any rational fan should feel at this point. Great post, man.

hypocrite does not equal rational.

But Its easy to see how invested you are in your hate. Its all good. Im just different. I dont hate a single player for the Chiefs.

I also dot stomp my feet throwing a fit on opinion of players on a forum. That way, I can enjoy it when a player improves. Now thats rational, if you ask me.

Pants

12-02-2010, 02:39 PM

hypocrite does not equal rational.

But Its easy to see how invested you are in your hate. Its all good. Im just different. I dont hate a single player for the Chiefs.

I also dot stomp my feet throwing a fit on opinion of players on a forum. That way, I can enjoy it when a player improves. Now thats rational, if you ask me.

Please point to the post where I have ever thrown a fit? I was frustrated with Cassel at times, like any other fan, that much is certainly true. I will, however, give you my left pinky if you can guarantee me that the Cassel we saw against AZ and SEA is the real Cassel.

It just irritates me when idiots claim I hate a player and will always hate and I want to see him fail to be proven wrong, Words can not describe how idiot that stance is.

CrazyHorse

12-02-2010, 02:40 PM

I have been pretty harsh on Cassel and I think we all had good reason. He was playing with terrible pocket prescense, his accuracy beyond 15 yards was pathetic, he stared down his WR's etc........

While he has played some soft defenses this month anyone who has watched him has to admit that everything about his game has improved from game to game this month. Now before this month I don't think so but this month he seems to really be finding a groove and if playing these cream puff defenses can get him enough rapport, timing and confidence to compete with the bigger dogs then I think we will all be happy but until we see it happen some of us are going to hold off on the Cassel parade.

Just like most of us didn't trash Cassel right from the minute he was acquired but after terrible performance after terrible performance ( What really got most of us was the end of last season how his performance seemed to get worse as our rushing game and the offense around him seemed to improve ), it is going to take a little time with consistency of his current performance for us to buy into anything.

He played like a QB with a bad line and little NFL experience. He played just like he should have ben playing. The question was, would he improve? I was willing to wait and see. While many had taken a few games and evaluated him to the point where there was no upside, he was maxed out and would never amount to anything.

My position was that those people didn';t know shit about what tghey were looking at. I was right about that. Because now, those people are sitting in my position. A wait and see position. Maybe he's not maxed out, maybe he is. One thing is for sure, the know it alls have STFU.

Chief3188

12-02-2010, 02:40 PM

hypocrite does not equal rational.

But Its easy to see how invested you are in your hate. Its all good. Im just different. I dont hate a single player for the Chiefs.

I also dot stomp my feet throwing a fit on opinion of players on a forum. That way, I can enjoy it when a player improves. Now thats rational, if you ask me.

Its not that they hate the player himself ( Excluding Larry Johnson when that douchebag was here ), but hate the way he plays. Are we not allowed to do that?

I don't hate a single player on the Chiefs either but then again I don't know a single player on the Chiefs personally so who knows :)

Chief3188

12-02-2010, 02:47 PM

He played like a QB with a bad line and little NFL experience. He played just like he should have ben playing. The question was, would he improve? I was willing to wait and see. While many had taken a few games and evaluated him to the point where there was no upside, he was maxed out and would never amount to anything.

My position was that those people didn';t know shit about what tghey were looking at. I was right about that. Because now, those people are sitting in my position. A wait and see position. Maybe he's not maxed out, maybe he is. One thing is for sure, the know it alls have STFU.

A few games? I think a season and a half for a QB his age regardless of playing experience can usually be a good judge of where he was heading.

But it also did not explain why he was playing so bad towards the end of last season and this season as the offense improved around him. I mean come on he was throwing passes in the dirt or over the heads on screens and players 5 yards away from him. To most of us that is something a rookie can usually do and accuracy is rarely learned this far into ones career as a QB.

But I think any red blooded Chiefs fan is hoping we were all wrong and that this is the new and improved Cassel that we can depend on from now on but it is a little early for any of us to judge as of yet. But if anything it has got quite a few of us second guessing our original opinions and I for one would be ecstatic to have been such an idiot about him.

I guess I can just understand the skeptics point of view. Hell even Bono had a few good games for us.

CrazyHorse

12-02-2010, 02:48 PM

Please point to the post where I have ever thrown a fit? I was frustrated with Cassel at times, like any other fan, that much is certainly true. I will, however, give you my left pinky if you can guarantee me that the Cassel we saw against AZ and SEA is the real Cassel.

It just irritates me when idiots claim I hate a player and will always hate and I want to see him fail to be proven wrong, Words can not describe how idiot that stance is.

You intimated that any rational fan takes the stance where even though Cassel is playing better than expected, he hasn't earned some credibility as a QB. You said that position is a "great post, man". That intimates hate toward the player. You wanted me to answer your question. I've done that. Now answer mine. How much love have you given him since playing well, compared to the hate you slung when he played poorly?

If all you do is talk bad about a player, I consider it hating on him. You may say you struggle to find words explaining how idiotic that is. I say the word reasonable describes it pretty well. Idiotic is misplaced.

Pants

12-02-2010, 02:49 PM

A few games? I think a season and a half for a QB his age regardless of playing experience can usually be a good judge of where he was heading.

But it also did not explain why he was playing so bad towards the end of last season and this season as the offense improved around him. I mean come on he was throwing passes in the dirt or over the heads on screens and players 5 yards away from him. To most of us that is something a rookie can usually do and accuracy is rarely learned this far into ones career as a QB.

But I think any red blooded Chiefs fan is hoping we were all wrong and that this is the new and improved Cassel that we can depend on from now on but it is a little early for any of us to judge as of yet. But if anything it has got quite a few of us second guessing our original opinions and I for one would be ecstatic to have been such an idiot about him.

I guess I can just understand the skeptics point of view. Hell even Bono had a few good games for us.

Exactly.

Pants

12-02-2010, 02:54 PM

You intimated that any rational fan takes the stance where even though Cassel is playing better than expected, he hasn't earned some credibility as a QB. You said that position is a "great post, man". That intimates hate toward the player. You wanted me to answer your question. I've done that. Now answer mine. How much love have you given him since playing well, compared to the hate you slung when he played poorly?

If all you do is talk bad about a player, I consider it hating on him. You may say you struggle to find words explaining how idiotic that is. I say the word reasonable describes it pretty well. Idiotic is misplaced.

I have given him more love than hate, that's for sure. Go ahead and go read my posts. Click on my user name and do "Find all post by Pants".

That's not even the point. In your mind saying a player is not playing well is equivalent to hating him. How do you not see how ****ing stupid that is? I wanted Cassel to succeed more than anything when we acquired him. I never piled on when people were screaming how bad of a trade it was. I waited a year. I cringed during the games and I cringed at the gifs pointing out how truly atrocious he was at being a QB. I waited another month. After that, I felt like I had the right to express how disgruntled I was.

My first post after the AZ game was praising him.

I hope this opens your eyes a little because you're sounding like an idiot.

CrazyHorse

12-02-2010, 02:56 PM

A few games? I think a season and a half for a QB his age regardless of playing experience can usually be a good judge of where he was heading.

But it also did not explain why he was playing so bad towards the end of last season and this season as the offense improved around him. I mean come on he was throwing passes in the dirt or over the heads on screens and players 5 yards away from him. To most of us that is something a rookie can usually do and accuracy is rarely learned this far into ones career as a QB.

But I think any red blooded Chiefs fan is hoping we were all wrong and that this is the new and improved Cassel that we can depend on from now on but it is a little early for any of us to judge as of yet. But if anything it has got quite a few of us second guessing our original opinions and I for one would be ecstatic to have been such an idiot about him.

I guess I can just understand the skeptics point of view. Hell even Bono had a few good games for us.

I can understand a skeptic too. At times I am one. Im mainly talking about the way people handle themselves and how it turns into being right is more important than good play.

It would appear you are not one of those people. You have every right to your opinion as do I. We are both guilty of being skeptics. Nothing wrong with that.

Can we agree that Cassels improvement is not only on him? But the O line is better and the players around him are playing better as well. Imagine if Bowe drops half those TD passes this year. Many would blame Cassel for the loss in those intances. I dont. I look at the whole picture.

I have looked at the whole picture all along. Not just one guy to blame it on. Bt doing that, I havent been as critical on Cassel. But I definately have seen the things he needs to improve on. Trying too hard being his biggest problem.

beach tribe

12-02-2010, 02:56 PM

A few games? I think a season and a half for a QB his age regardless of playing experience can usually be a good judge of where he was heading.

But it also did not explain why he was playing so bad towards the end of last season and this season as the offense improved around him. I mean come on he was throwing passes in the dirt or over the heads on screens and players 5 yards away from him. To most of us that is something a rookie can usually do and accuracy is rarely learned this far into ones career as a QB.

But I think any red blooded Chiefs fan is hoping we were all wrong and that this is the new and improved Cassel that we can depend on from now on but it is a little early for any of us to judge as of yet. But if anything it has got quite a few of us second guessing our original opinions and I for one would be ecstatic to have been such an idiot about him.

I guess I can just understand the skeptics point of view. Hell even Bono had a few good games for us.

It all comes down to his performance, under pressure. Basically his poise.
He has looked a 1000 times more confident.
I stated that he was shell shocked from all the failed protections last season, and questioned whether he would ever recover from it. It looks as though he is recovering, and his poise is returning. I still want to see how he responds when someone brings serious consistent pressure on him, but at this point, I honestly think he's going to keep improving, but that's just my opinion. Having not gotten on the filed at all in college, he basically has as much on field experience as a college QB in his senior season. I definitely think he can continue to improve, and man i hope I'm right.

It all comes down to his performance, under pressure. Basically his poise.
He has looked a 1000 times more confident.
I stated that he was shell shocked from all the failed protections last season, and questioned whether he would ever recover from it. It looks as though he is recovering, and his poise is returning. I still want to see how he responds when someone brings serious consistent pressure on him, but at this point, I honestly think he's going to keep improving, but that's just my opinion. Having not gotten on the filed at all in college, he basically has as much on field experience as a college QB in his senior season. I definitely think he can continue to improve, and man i hope I'm right.

I hope you're right too, man. And yeah, you've been saying all along how it all depends on his confidence level, seems like so far your theory is being proven right.

beach tribe

12-02-2010, 03:00 PM

I can understand a skeptic too. At times I am one. Im mainly talking about the way people handle themselves and how it turns into being right is more important than good play.

It would appear you are not one of those people. You have every right to your opinion as do I. We are both guilty of being skeptics. Nothing wrong with that.

Can we agree that Cassels improvement is not only on him? But the O line is better and the players around him are playing better as well. Imagine if Bowe drops half those TD passes this year. Many would blame Cassel for the loss in those intances. I dont. I look at the whole picture.

I have looked at the whole picture all along. Not just one guy to blame it on. Bt doing that, I havent been as critical on Cassel. But I definately have seen the things he needs to improve on. Trying too hard being his biggest problem.
QBs ALWAYS take way more of the blame than they should around here, and I'm positive that the improvement of the players around him has has a lot to do with it, but it's easy to see that the most improved player is Matt himself.

CrazyHorse

12-02-2010, 03:04 PM

I have given him more love than hate, that's for sure. Go ahead and go read my posts. Click on my user name and do "Find all post by Pants".

That's not even the point. In your mind saying a player is not playing well is equivalent to hating him. How do you not see how ****ing stupid that is? I wanted Cassel to succeed more than anything when we acquired him. I never piled on when people were screaming how bad of a trade it was. I waited a year. I cringed during the games and I cringed at the gifs pointing out how truly atrocious he was at being a QB. I waited another month. After that, I felt like I had the right to express how disgruntled I was.

My first post after the AZ game was praising him.

I hope this opens your eyes a little because you're sounding like an idiot.

I never said that saying a player is not playing well = hate. I dont believe that at all. That is stupid. For you to read that into my post is stupid.

The only reason I sound like an idiot is because you are reading shit into a post that isnt there. The main reason I dont post much here. Too much of a fuckin circle jerk. Just like this. Explaining away points that arent even there.;

TheGuardian

12-02-2010, 03:09 PM

A few games? I think a season and a half for a QB his age regardless of playing experience can usually be a good judge of where he was heading.

But it also did not explain why he was playing so bad towards the end of last season and this season as the offense improved around him. I mean come on he was throwing passes in the dirt or over the heads on screens and players 5 yards away from him. To most of us that is something a rookie can usually do and accuracy is rarely learned this far into ones career as a QB.

But I think any red blooded Chiefs fan is hoping we were all wrong and that this is the new and improved Cassel that we can depend on from now on but it is a little early for any of us to judge as of yet. But if anything it has got quite a few of us second guessing our original opinions and I for one would be ecstatic to have been such an idiot about him.

I guess I can just understand the skeptics point of view. Hell even Bono had a few good games for us.

Matt Ryan wasn't so hot last year either. His second year starting. Lots of QB's have ebb's and flows to their career if they play long enough.

Who gives a fuck what happened last season? He's not playing like that anymore. I can't believe people keep bringing up last season.

Pawnmower

12-02-2010, 03:27 PM

And he if goes into a four game slump costs us four losses with 6ints then what? Sorry it seems unlike you I am not a bandwagon jumper. He needs to play at this level for awhile and against great teams.....

Oh I see...After he plays at this level a while against great teams THEN you will jump on the bandwagon?

To me THAT is bandwagon. Bandwagon = Jumping onto the train that everyone else is ALREADY on.

Your Kudos that you will give to him at that point are going to be rather late and meaningless and drowned out in the cacophony of so many other retarded hypocrites / fair weather fans.

dirk digler

12-02-2010, 03:34 PM

Oh I see...After he plays at this level a while against great teams THEN you will jump on the bandwagon?

To me THAT is bandwagon. Bandwagon = Jumping onto the train that everyone else is ALREADY on.

Your Kudos that you will give to him at that point are going to be rather late and meaningless and drowned out in the cacophony of so many other retarded hypocrites / fair weather fans.

I am thinking like many of us we want to see a larger sample size than 2 games in a row. We have seen him play 22 games of average to below average QB play so maybe everyone should hold off on all the accolades.

Pants

12-02-2010, 03:35 PM

Oh I see...After he plays at this level a while against great teams THEN you will jump on the bandwagon?

To me THAT is bandwagon. Bandwagon = Jumping onto the train that everyone else is ALREADY on.

Your Kudos that you will give to him at that point are going to be rather late and meaningless and drowned out in the cacophony of so many other retarded hypocrites / fair weather fans.

Fairweather fans wouldn't give a **** about Cassel. Fairweather fans gave up on the Chiefs in 2007. There are no fairweather fans on Chiefsplanet, ****tard.

Chief3188

12-02-2010, 03:36 PM

Matt Ryan wasn't so hot last year either. His second year starting. Lots of QB's have ebb's and flows to their career if they play long enough.

Who gives a **** what happened last season? He's not playing like that anymore. I can't believe people keep bringing up last season.

You might want to work on reading a little more. I stated how he was playing this season as well. Right now your hardcore pro Cassel can do no wrong stance is talking about the ebbs and flows of one month of awesome play against crappy defenses.

I give a shit what happens every season, I don't know about you.

Chief3188

12-02-2010, 03:40 PM

It all comes down to his performance, under pressure. Basically his poise.
He has looked a 1000 times more confident.
I stated that he was shell shocked from all the failed protections last season, and questioned whether he would ever recover from it. It looks as though he is recovering, and his poise is returning. I still want to see how he responds when someone brings serious consistent pressure on him, but at this point, I honestly think he's going to keep improving, but that's just my opinion. Having not gotten on the filed at all in college, he basically has as much on field experience as a college QB in his senior season. I definitely think he can continue to improve, and man i hope I'm right.

I hope you are right as well because we will find out how he can do under pressure in 2 weeks. Providing we win this week next week will see just how clutch he can be and if our team as a whole is ready to take the division crown.

Pawnmower

12-02-2010, 03:44 PM

I am thinking like many of us we want to see a larger sample size than 2 games in a row. We have seen him play 22 games of average to below average QB play so maybe everyone should hold off on all the accolades.

The only accolade he has received is player of the month. If you want to hold off on your praise of him go right ahead. Not sure what other accolades you're talking about.

He has played well all season long, the people like you that claim he has only had 2 good games in a row are badly mistaken. He has been fairly consistent all season. Of course there have been ups and downs, like any player will have but if you draw a line through all of the dots you will see that the line is pointing up and has been from game 1.

But you feel free to hold off on giving him praise, I'm sure he will be all broken up to hear that some douche on the internet wants to see more out of him this season.

Chief3188

12-02-2010, 03:46 PM

I can understand a skeptic too. At times I am one. Im mainly talking about the way people handle themselves and how it turns into being right is more important than good play.

It would appear you are not one of those people. You have every right to your opinion as do I. We are both guilty of being skeptics. Nothing wrong with that.

Can we agree that Cassels improvement is not only on him? But the O line is better and the players around him are playing better as well. Imagine if Bowe drops half those TD passes this year. Many would blame Cassel for the loss in those intances. I dont. I look at the whole picture.

I have looked at the whole picture all along. Not just one guy to blame it on. Bt doing that, I havent been as critical on Cassel. But I definately have seen the things he needs to improve on. Trying too hard being his biggest problem.

I think there is only a few fans on here that are like that and most of us know who they are.

I think Cassel's improvement of the last month is mostly on him as our offense has already improved going back to the end of last season and into this year. Well I think we can throw Bowe into the mix as well :)

I have looked at the whole picture as well and going by history some of the things he needed to improve on such as accuracy on short passes and going thru his reads coupled with the length of time he had as a starter had many of us more than worried and more like looking for a next QB by watching Saturday games. I don't think that was unfair of us by how he was playing but if people are not pleased with how he has played these last few games then they are just hating to be stubborn on their already dug out opinions.

Frankie

12-02-2010, 05:16 PM

His improved play is deeper than just good stats. He has been consistently accurate, has gone through his reads, is staying in the pocket and making throws (except when he takes off at the appropriate times) ... hell, he's even making the right audibles. He's been doing things that he didn't do well, or couldn't do consistently, in the past.

All of that is conducive to continued success. Keep it up, Matty. I am cautiously optimistic, but reserve the right to flame his ass if he shits the bed down the stretch. :)

Feels good, doesn't it, that for the first time in decades the Chiefs might have a coaching staff that can DEVELOP a QB.

Frankie

12-02-2010, 05:17 PM

Well deserved (though IMO Bowe deserved it more; not taking anything from Cassel: Bowe was just that freaking good).

Maybe Tucker has quietly been a good enough 2 to take some pressure off Bowe?

Frankie

12-02-2010, 05:20 PM

Did they do the voting in Florida? kidding.
Congrats on the QB and team confidence builder. He has played the last couple games like a true franchise QB. Funny how Pioli can go from foolish move to genious in a month, hope he can do the same for Tyson Jackson.

That would be super awesome making my crow quite delicious.

Chiefs Pantalones

12-02-2010, 05:21 PM

Matt Cassel named AFC Offensive Player of the Month; 1st #Chiefs QB since Steve Deberg in Sept. 1990 to win the honor.

The National Football League informed the Chiefs on Thursday that QB Matt Cassel has been named the AFC Offensive Player of the Month for November.

Cassel is just the second Chiefs quarterback to ever win the honor, joining QB Steve DeBerg who did it in September of ’90. Cassel is the first Chiefs player to be named AFC Player of the Month since RB Larry Johnson in December/January of the 2005 season.

Cassel (6-4, 230) completed 90 of 144 passes (62.5%) for 1,111 yards with 12 TDs and only one INT for a 111.2 passer rating in November. His 12 TD passes led the league during the month, while his passer rating ranked third in the NFL over that span. He has recorded three straight games with a 100.0+ rating and produced a pair of games with four TD passes in November. Cassel threw for a career-high 469 yards at Denver (12/5). He currently leads the NFL with a 6.81 TD percentage (min. 250 attempts) on the season. Cassel also has a +18 touchdown-to-interception differential, the second-best mark in the NFL.

Cassel's November numbers: 90 of 144 (62.5%) for 1,111 yards with 12 TDs and only 1 INT (111.2 rating). 12 TDs were an NFL high.

Great job, Matt! Keep it up!

Frankie

12-02-2010, 05:24 PM

While this team IS getting better, and Cassel is getting better, I think we're all in for a rude awakening next year when we have to play a schedule that's 100x harder than the one this year. (If we win our division this year).

Green Bay
Chicago
Minnesota
New England
Indianapolis
Baltimore
New York Jets
San Diego (x2)
If we make as much progress next year as we did this year, maybe THOSE teams should worry about us having them on our schedule.

DaneMcCloud

12-02-2010, 05:24 PM

He has played well all season long, the people like you that claim he has only had 2 good games in a row are badly mistaken.

This is unequivocally false.

He did not "play well" against San Diego or Cleveland. He had issues with both Houston and Indy, was directly responsible for 10 points against Denver and threw a back-breaking interception against Oakland.

That said, his level of play has been excellent the past two weeks and it's possible that he's turned a corner.

But to state that he's played "well" all year is a fallacy.

Frankie

12-02-2010, 05:30 PM

OMG YOUR JUST HOPEING HE FAILS SO YOU CAN GLOAT AND SAY HOW RITE U R!!1!

He did not "play well" against San Diego or Cleveland. He had issues with both Houston and Indy, was directly responsible for 10 points against Denver and threw a back-breaking interception against Oakland.

That said, his level of play has been excellent the past two weeks and it's possible that he's turned a corner.

But to state that he's played "well" all year is a fallacy.

Yeah, He's looked really rough for a good part of the season. the only thing he was really doing right at times, was not turning the ball over. He's looking like a field Fn General right now tho.

MichaelH

12-02-2010, 05:55 PM

He sucks. < Chiefs Planet >

KurtCobain

12-02-2010, 06:29 PM

I hope he comes alive in the next few games posting 4+ TDs in all of them and wins MVP.

Hootie

12-02-2010, 06:32 PM

I hope he comes alive in the next few games posting 4+ TDs in all of them and wins MVP.

42 and 4 with a 12-4 team and a #2 seed would be a pretty good resume...

and that would be the cherry on top for this season, lol

KChiefs1

12-02-2010, 06:50 PM

Just wait til he gets McCluster back!

People have overlooked this fact...Cassel has been developing without Dexter even in the lineup...going to be fun to watch with McCluster back.

KCSupersized

12-02-2010, 06:55 PM

Good for him, and the Chiefs. It's nice to see them get some positive publicity.

HemiEd

12-02-2010, 07:02 PM

Didn't you see the whole conversation in the other thread? Apparently that wasn't garbage time.
It was in fact garbage time, almost a practice session against a prevent defense.

But, if that is what it took to get Cassel what he needed, to make the improvements he has exhibited the last two games, it was more than worth it.

We can only hope it continues, and if it does the future is brighter for this team than we could have imagined only 3 weeks ago.

Saul Good

12-02-2010, 07:02 PM

I hope you are right as well because we will find out how he can do under pressure in 2 weeks. Providing we win this week next week will see just how clutch he can be and if our team as a whole is ready to take the division crown.

I've heard a lot of people say similar things, and it doesn't make sense (not to pick on you). After the Denver loss, the Chiefs had a 1 game lead over the red-hot Chargers. It's hard to figure that the Chargers are going to lose more than 1 game the rest of the year, so each game since the Broncos game has been critical. He's been at his best in the two games since then.

Saul Good

12-02-2010, 07:04 PM

It was in fact garbage time, almost a practice session against a prevent defense.

But, if that is what it took to get Cassel what he needed, to make the improvements he has exhibited the last two games, it was more than worth it.

We can only hope it continues, and if it does the future is brighter for this team than we could have imagined only 3 weeks ago.

BS. A prevent defense is designed to force turnovers and prevent TD passes while allowing yards. Cassel threw 4 TDs and 0 INTs.

bevischief

12-02-2010, 07:10 PM

Let see what he does the rest of month...

KurtCobain

12-02-2010, 07:11 PM

I would take a bullet for Matt Cassel. Not a big one, but still....

Marcellus

12-02-2010, 07:42 PM

I would take a bullet for Matt Cassel. Not a big one, but still....

Just a couple pellets not all the buckshot?

Pawnmower

12-02-2010, 07:55 PM

This is unequivocally false.

He did not "play well" against San Diego or Cleveland. He had issues with both Houston and Indy, was directly responsible for 10 points against Denver and threw a back-breaking interception against Oakland.

That said, his level of play has been excellent the past two weeks and it's possible that he's turned a corner.

But to state that he's played "well" all year is a fallacy.

You convieniently left out the fact that I said he has had ups and downs like any player...

Notice that I didn't say IN EVERY SINGLE GAME....I said all season, and I went on to elaborate but you didn't quote that part.

Besides that "playing well" is subjective so you can't say it is "unequivocal" or a "fallacy" since those terms are not applicable to a subjective word. Perhaps you should look up the words you use (like fallacy) beofre you start spewing them out to try and sound smarter than you are.

kysirsoze

12-02-2010, 08:00 PM

Good for Matt! Glad to see his recent play get some recognition.

Still, I think it's interesting that all of the "I told you so" folks are just as insufferable when they're right as all the "haters" supposedly are.

As a Cassel critic, I am incredibly happy with his performance and would like nothing more than to see him continue to improve and play well. I think there are very few anti-Cassel posters who wouldn't agree with that.

OK. This thread is full of posts by "Homers" and "Haters." I'd say both extremes are inappropriate. Things are happening in shades of grey and Cassel is still a work in progress. We can all unite in the hope that the work will pan out someday soon and solve our QB problem while saving us from having to spend a high draft choice on a one.

dirk digler

12-02-2010, 08:24 PM

The only accolade he has received is player of the month. If you want to hold off on your praise of him go right ahead. Not sure what other accolades you're talking about.

He has played well all season long, the people like you that claim he has only had 2 good games in a row are badly mistaken. He has been fairly consistent all season. Of course there have been ups and downs, like any player will have but if you draw a line through all of the dots you will see that the line is pointing up and has been from game 1.

But you feel free to hold off on giving him praise, I'm sure he will be all broken up to hear that some douche on the internet wants to see more out of him this season.

I am talking about the people on here that seem to think he has finally become a franchise QB. I am hopeful that happens but he has 5 games left and one big game at San Diego for the division to prove me and the other "haters" wrong.

Pawnmower

12-02-2010, 08:25 PM

OK. This thread is full of posts by "Homers" and "Haters." I'd say both extremes are inappropriate.

While I agree that extremes are inappropriate and wrong usually, I don't see many people taking the extreme homer position on Matt Castle (he is the best ever....he is a GREAT QB....he is a future HoF'er...etc..)

Only on Chiefs Planet is saying the guy has had a good season and giving him props for this award being a "homer."

Pawnmower

12-02-2010, 08:31 PM

I am talking about the people on here that seem to think he has finally become a franchise QB. I am hopeful that happens but he has 5 games left and one big game at San Diego for the division to prove me and the other "haters" wrong.

Well, I would love to sit here and say I believe we can win that game 100% in SD. I don't know what the odds will be, but they have to be fairly low. There is a decent chance that Matty even has a bad game...(away game, playoff atmosphere, great defense....season on the line etc...)...

So if you are going to use this one game (@SD) to judge him....if you are going to make 'making the playoffs' this season a criteria for you to be able to get behind Cassel I personally think the odds are fairly slim that you will. Maybe 25-33%? Not ridiculously slim, but something like 2 or 3 to 1.

Anyhow, I have already seen enough (for me) to want to get behind Cassel and want him as our QB for now and next season. I think that if playoffs are your 'deciding factor' that might have to wait until next December or the December following. Especially if you are talking about getting into the playoffs with a chance to win.

Like it or not our team is still a season or two away from this.

cdcox

12-02-2010, 08:36 PM

He has played well all season long, the people like you that claim he has only had 2 good games in a row are badly mistaken. He has been fairly consistent all season. Of course there have been ups and downs, like any player will have but if you draw a line through all of the dots you will see that the line is pointing up and has been from game 1.

His play other than the last two games has been for the most part below the standard I have for a starting QB. If you think he has been fine before the last two games, you have a much different standard than I do.

dirk digler

12-02-2010, 08:42 PM

Well, I would love to sit here and say I believe we can win that game 100% in SD. I don't know what the odds will be, but they have to be fairly low. There is a decent chance that Matty even has a bad game...(away game, playoff atmosphere, great defense....season on the line etc...)...

So if you are going to use this one game (@SD) to judge him....if you are going to make 'making the playoffs' this season a criteria for you to be able to get behind Cassel I personally think the odds are fairly slim that you will. Maybe 25-33%? Not ridiculously slim, but something like 2 or 3 to 1.

Anyhow, I have already seen enough (for me) to want to get behind Cassel and want him as our QB for now and next season. I think that if playoffs are your 'deciding factor' that might have to wait until next December or the December following. Especially if you are talking about getting into the playoffs with a chance to win.

Like it or not our team is still a season or two away from this.

Pawnmower I will be honest with you, I obviously want to win every game left but to be honest I would rather see Cassel keep improving regardless of the outcome. If he goes out this week or next week or the rest of the season and plays like he has been and even if we lose I will be disappointed but at least I will feel better going into next season. If he comes out and shits the bed and plays like he has earlier in the season then we are fucked.

Saul Good

12-02-2010, 08:42 PM

I am talking about the people on here that seem to think he has finally become a franchise QB. I am hopeful that happens but he has 5 games left and one big game at San Diego for the division to prove me and the other "haters" wrong.

Find one person who has said that Cassel is a franchise QB. I'm not saying that nobody has, but I don't recall seeing it happen. I have seen plenty of people make absolute arguments the other way, though.

Pawnmower

12-02-2010, 08:44 PM

His play other than the last two games has been for the most part below the standard I have for a starting QB. If you think he has been fine before the last two games, you have a much different standard than I do.

I'm gonna only point out those three games just to prove you wrong 100%. Those are games where almost anyone could agree he played 'well.' In my opnion there are more games in which he played well, but maybe my 'well' is different from yours. (or 'fine' or whatever word you want to use)

I think the problem might be with your definition of the word 'well.' In any case you are incorrect, Matty played some games 'well' long before two weeks ago.

TheGuardian

12-02-2010, 08:49 PM

I have been saying all along that you can spot the dumbasses simply by looking at who says "let's see him do it in San Diego". A season is not one game. A guy isn't good or bad or great or awful based on 1 game. Even Barry Sanders had games where he got his shit pushed in. Doesn't mean he wasn't one of the best of all time.

This is why that is happening. Because it's going to be incredibly difficult for cassel, or any QB, to go on the road to SD and play at a really high level against their defense at home. So the Cassel haters know this, and they will say "let him do it against San Diego" knowing that it will be incredibly difficult to do. So when he doesn't have some great game, they will show up and say "see, he didn't do it. he sucks".

If he does do it, they will simply revert back to "well that's good, but he need to do that week in and week out now".

I hate these fucktards.

dirk digler

12-02-2010, 08:57 PM

Find one person who has said that Cassel is a franchise QB. I'm not saying that nobody has, but I don't recall seeing it happen. I have seen plenty of people make absolute arguments the other way, though.

Cassel is a Franchise QB and I'll fight anyone who says otherwise.

;)

Pawnmower

12-02-2010, 09:00 PM

Pawnmower I will be honest with you, I obviously want to win every game left but to be honest I would rather see Cassel keep improving regardless of the outcome. If he goes out this week or next week or the rest of the season and plays like he has been and even if we lose I will be disappointed but at least I will feel better going into next season. If he comes out and shits the bed and plays like he has earlier in the season then we are ****ed.

I agree with the 1st part of what you said 100% (everything before the underline)

It is a matter of opinion, but for the most part I don't think Cassel has shit the bed this season....I know it is just my opinion but in our losses I don't think Cassel was the main reason for the L's. Could he have played better, of course. Main reason for the loss in all 4 games? No. Not hardly. So I have to suspect that if we lose in SD he won't be the main reason for the L. Even if he is, a couple of bad games is pretty standard for any QB every season....

To claim at this point in the season that 1) if we do not make the playoffs or 2) if Cassel shits the bed in SD that 'Cassel sucks' or that he hasn't progressed massively is still wrong, IMO.

dirk digler

12-02-2010, 09:02 PM

I have been saying all along that you can spot the dumbasses simply by looking at who says "let's see him do it in San Diego". A season is not one game. A guy isn't good or bad or great or awful based on 1 game. Even Barry Sanders had games where he got his shit pushed in. Doesn't mean he wasn't one of the best of all time.

This is why that is happening. Because it's going to be incredibly difficult for cassel, or any QB, to go on the road to SD and play at a really high level against their defense at home. So the Cassel haters know this, and they will say "let him do it against San Diego" knowing that it will be incredibly difficult to do. So when he doesn't have some great game, they will show up and say "see, he didn't do it. he sucks".

If he does do it, they will simply revert back to "well that's good, but he need to do that week in and week out now".

I hate these fucktards.

That is because it is the biggest game in our season. If we are going to win he is going to have to show up and play well. Big time QB's show up in big time games.

That is because it is the biggest game in our season. If we are going to win he is going to have to show up and play well. Big time QB's show up in big time games.

The problem with your argument is no one is saying that he is 'Big Time' yet.

This won't just be the biggest game in our season. For many of the Chiefs it will be the biggest NFL game of their careers thus far. For Matty it will be one of (if not THE) biggest game of his life.

Please think about that.

BigMeatballDave

12-02-2010, 09:07 PM

I have been saying all along that you can spot the dumbasses simply by looking at who says "let's see him do it in San Diego". A season is not one game. A guy isn't good or bad or great or awful based on 1 game. Even Barry Sanders had games where he got his shit pushed in. Doesn't mean he wasn't one of the best of all time.

This is why that is happening. Because it's going to be incredibly difficult for cassel, or any QB, to go on the road to SD and play at a really high level against their defense at home. So the Cassel haters know this, and they will say "let him do it against San Diego" knowing that it will be incredibly difficult to do. So when he doesn't have some great game, they will show up and say "see, he didn't do it. he sucks".

If he does do it, they will simply revert back to "well that's good, but he need to do that week in and week out now".

I hate these fucktards.The point is, he needs to play well in a pressure situation. This is want you want and need to win in this league. If he is truely 'the guy', he must come thru. That game will basically be a playoff game.

dirk digler

12-02-2010, 09:08 PM

To claim at this point in the season that 1) if we do not make the playoffs or 2) if Cassel shits the bed in SD that 'Cassel sucks' or that he hasn't progressed massively is still wrong, IMO.

I wasn't talking about just the SD game I am talking about the remaining 5 games starting this Sunday. If we lose the Donkey game the SD game means nothing.

Pawnmower

12-02-2010, 09:09 PM

I wasn't talking about just the SD game I am talking about the remaining 5 games starting this Sunday. If we lose the Donkey game the SD game means nothing.

We're not losing the donkey game.

You heard it here 1st.

Reaper16

12-02-2010, 09:14 PM

BS. A prevent defense is designed to force turnovers and prevent TD passes while allowing yards.
Incorrect. A prevent defense is designed to make as much clock run out as possible by lettting the underneath completions happen while preventing yards from being gained in huge chunks.

'Hamas' Jenkins

12-02-2010, 09:21 PM

For as much trolling and shit as Saul Good talks, he literally does not know the most basic things about football.

stevieray

12-02-2010, 09:25 PM

Find one person who has said that Cassel is a franchise QB. I'm not saying that nobody has, but I don't recall seeing it happen. I have seen plenty of people make absolute arguments the other way, though.
...the bipolarism of it all is astounding & annoying...all offseason all we heard is how much we were gonna suck, how Cassel sucked, how he was NEVER EVER going to be a franchise, or a"legit" or "real" QB.

He was constantly compared to other "franchise" QBs. Held to that standard mainly based on contract (stupid), expected to perform at their level in his second year and third OC, even though he'd ALREADY been proclaimed a bust.

Five, six wins tops, set the franchise back, yadyadayada ad nausem. Run defense starts strong, and ever since has pretty much been given the benefit of the doubt, to the ridiculous example Cassel lost at Houston and Denver even though those two games combined for eight CONSECUTIVE TD's. Lost @ Oakland and Indy, even though he made the throws that were needed for victory, yet the wr gets a pass for dropping the game winning ball.

plays well enough to lead the division, yet his accomplishments aren't due to him..but others. garbage time, bad teams blahblahblah. Same QB proclaimed a bust, has good play marginalized by nit picking. well, if he can do it in THIS game or same busted QB has only done "it" for two games, and if that fake QB can win a playoff game, THEN Il'll believe in him...rest of team, free pass...or at least the benefit of the doubt to improve, yet he doesn't have the same freedom. he succeeds, it's not REAL..it might just be a fluke...gotta wait to see if the invalid QB can do it week in and week out agaisnt better teams, regardless that other QB's don't and never will. good QB's and good teams get beat by mediocre and subpar teams every season.

It's insane...and it's pretty damn funny watching fans tear down their own player for being awarded and recognized...lke a rival fan would.

"Hope"... the most overused strawman in these conversations.. well, I hope i'm wrong..I hope he succeeds.....BS. look the word up..things saidi about Cassel don't resemble hope at all...you can't desire something while trying to destroy it anyway you can, then sit around and wait for it to be something great....and then be pissed when it's not.

I personally think he's gonna continue to make people eat their words. Mainly because of skills, dedication, perserverance, heart, desire and competitiveness...

SAUTO

12-02-2010, 09:27 PM

;) ttc=sarcasm
Posted via Mobile Device

cdcox

12-02-2010, 09:28 PM

The problem with your argument is no one is saying that he is 'Big Time' yet.

Bull crap.

We've had MVP talk (of the league!).

We've had plenty of people saying all the doubters were wrong and they were right. How can that statement be made unless they consider that Cassel has arrived? Obviously the jury is still out.

SAUTO

12-02-2010, 09:30 PM

good post stevie spot on
Posted via Mobile Device

Pawnmower

12-02-2010, 09:31 PM

The point is, he needs to play well in a pressure situation. This is want you want and need to win in this league. If he is truely 'the guy', he must come thru.

This is false logic. He might not come through in this game. That doesn't mean he isn't 'the guy' necessarily.

SAUTO

12-02-2010, 09:32 PM

Bull crap. We've had MVP talk (of the league!). We've had plenty of people saying all the doubters were wrong and they were right. How can that statement be made unless they consider that Cassel has arrived? Obviously the jury is still out. didnt the media bring up mvp?
Posted via Mobile Device

'Hamas' Jenkins

12-02-2010, 09:33 PM

I'm glad that Cassel played well enough to get this distinction, and over the past two weeks, he has played well enough to earn it, but the bullshit of this is the conflation that people who have said the same thing for almost two years are somehow bipolar.

Let's put it this way: Show me you're a franchise QB, Matt, don't tell me about your work ethic and your heart, and all that other bullshit that everyone who loved high school football had. Show us your talent.

For the last two weeks, he's done a decent job of showing that. But there are a number of horrible, horrible QBs who have had great months, or even good years. The standard of proof is so low around here it's mind boggling. Yes, we get it, your last boyfriend was a crackhead who beat you and raped your kittens. It doesn't mean the alocholic with bacne is Prince Charming.

Pawnmower

12-02-2010, 09:33 PM

Bull crap.

We've had MVP talk (of the league!).

We've had plenty of people saying all the doubters were wrong and they were right. How can that statement be made unless they consider that Cassel has arrived? Obviously the jury is still out.

I would say 'bull crap' to you sir. No one is saying he is a "big time QB" yet. You can point out an exception or two, but that doesn't make the rule.

You can find a couple people who will say anything, but that doesn't mean they represent the majority. The VAST majority of Chiefs Fans or NFL Fans would NOT proclaim Matty a "Big Time" QB just yet.

cdcox

12-02-2010, 09:34 PM

This is false logic. He might not come through in this game. That doesn't mean he isn't 'the guy' necessarily.

What you say is true. But eventually he has to consistently play well against the best teams to be 'the guy'. Until he does this, he isn't 'the guy' yet.

cdcox

12-02-2010, 09:35 PM

didnt the media bring up mvp?
Posted via Mobile Device

If they did, they're idiots. He isn't even the MVP of the team.

BigMeatballDave

12-02-2010, 09:36 PM

This is false logic. He might not come through in this game. That doesn't mean he isn't 'the guy' necessarily.Funny. Myself and others have been accused of moving the goalpost. This is exactly what you're doing here. Except, you're moving them in.

Pawnmower

12-02-2010, 09:36 PM

The standard of proof is so low around here it's mind boggling.

If you want to use that argument you need to think it through 1st. There were WAY more people who were saying Matty would suck this season than he would be good. Where were your demands for proof then?

Please if you are going to preach about proof, think about it 1st.

'Hamas' Jenkins

12-02-2010, 09:37 PM

If you want to use that argument you need to think it through 1st. There were WAY more people who were saying Matty would suck this season than he would be good. Where were your demands for proof then?

Please if you are going to preach about proof, think about it 1st.

The 16 previous games? The first several of this season? OTAs? Minicamps? Preseason?

Do you put Drano in your neti pot?

cdcox

12-02-2010, 09:38 PM

I would say 'bull crap' to you sir. No one is saying he is a "big time QB" yet. You can point out an exception or two, but that doesn't make the rule.

You can find a couple people who will say anything, but that doesn't mean they represent the majority. The VAST majority of Chiefs Fans or NFL Fans would NOT proclaim Matty a "Big Time" QB just yet.

JASONSAUTO goes on your list of an exception or two?

Pawnmower

12-02-2010, 09:38 PM

Funny. Myself and others have been accused of moving the goalpost. This is exactly what you're doing here. Except, you're moving them in.

Oh really? I am not the one saying how getting to the playoffs is the standard by which I will measure Matty.

I have said since APRIL that I don't think we will make the playoffs.

Did you think we were gonna make the playoffs back in April?

It is people who NOW claim that the standard is 'making the playoffs' who have moved the goalposts.

My standards have not changed since April.

BigMeatballDave

12-02-2010, 09:40 PM

Do you put Drano in your neti pot?:LOL:

Pawnmower

12-02-2010, 09:41 PM

The 16 previous games? The first several of this season? OTAs? Minicamps? Preseason?

Do you put Drano in your neti pot?

Circular Logic. I did not think the previous 16 games were an indication (proof) of Matty's potential back in April. I argued this and was berated for suggesting that perhaps there were ALSO other flaws with this team that prevented Matty from performing up to his potential.

If you thought the previous 16 games were proof, then obviously you were WRONG. Weren't you?

'Hamas' Jenkins

12-02-2010, 09:44 PM

Circular Logic. I did not think the previous 16 games were an indication (proof) of Matty's potential back in April. I argued this and was berated for suggesting that perhaps there were ALSO other flaws with this team that prevented Matty from performing up to his potential.

If you thought the previous 16 games were proof, then obviously you were WRONG. Weren't you?

You don't even know what a tautology is. Although past results do not indicate future performance, they are a far more accurate indicator than "I hope he does b/c of the Arrowhead."

Furthermore, you lose your logical fallacy playing card, because you aren't even smart enough to realize that you are using an extremely small sample size to validate an entire player's career.

20 games and two offseasons? Makes sense. 2 games? Fuck off.

SAUTO

12-02-2010, 09:44 PM

JASONSAUTO goes on your list of an exception or two? link from the last 2 months?
Posted via Mobile Device

Pawnmower

12-02-2010, 09:46 PM

JASONSAUTO goes on your list of an exception or two?

I have no idea but if he claims that Matty is a "Big Time" Qb already, then yes he is an exception.

Let me explain this to you slowly, because clearly you are stupid.

When most believe one thing....that is the majority.

Those who believe something else are the exceptions.

Most people would not call Matt Cassel a "Big Time NFL QB" , those who do are the exception.

I hope that clears it up for you, but perhaps you should go to

http://www.wonderlandcamp.org/about.htm

If you still don't get it.

SAUTO

12-02-2010, 09:47 PM

If they did, they're idiots. He isn't even the MVP of the team. thatp where that talk came from. and ftr i think its silly at this point but that could change
Posted via Mobile Device

cdcox

12-02-2010, 09:47 PM

link from the last 2 months?
Posted via Mobile Device

Okay, misunderstood your post, you are off the list.

Pawnmower

12-02-2010, 09:48 PM

You don't even know what a tautology is. Although past results do not indicate future performance, they are a far more accurate indicator than "I hope he does b/c of the Arrowhead."

Furthermore, you lose your logical fallacy playing card, because you aren't even smart enough to realize that you are using an extremely small sample size to validate an entire player's career.

20 games and two offseasons? Makes sense. 2 games? **** off.

You can throw out all the big words you want but it doesnt make you any less WRONG. I am not the one who had to show any burden of proof, as I was not making the claims that 'Cassel Sucks.'

Whatever proof you used, no matter how good YOU thought the evidence was.....You were still wrong.

Matt Castle does not suck, your analysis of the evidence does. When will you get that?

cdcox

12-02-2010, 09:50 PM

I have no idea but if he claims that Matty is a "Big Time" Qb already, then yes he is an exception.

Let me explain this to you slowly, because clearly you are stupid.

When most believe one thing....that is the majority.

Those who believe something else are the exceptions.

Most people would not call Matt Cassel a "Big Time NFL QB" , those who do are the exception.

I hope that clears it up for you, but perhaps you should go to

http://www.wonderlandcamp.org/about.htm

If you still don't get it.

I know what an exception is.

But you said "an exception or two." That means less than 3 people.

Pawnmower

12-02-2010, 09:52 PM

I know what an exception is.

But you said an exception or two. That means less than 3 people.

You realize you are a total fucking tool, right?

'Hamas' Jenkins

12-02-2010, 09:53 PM

You can throw out all the big words you want but it doesnt make you any less WRONG. I am not the one who had to show any burden of proof, as I was not making the claims that 'Cassel Sucks.'

Whatever proof you used, no matter how good YOU thought the evidence was.....You were still wrong.

Matt Castle does not suck, your analysis of the evidence does. When will you get that?

My analysis of the evidence? The guy has played 2.5 solid games against a prevent defense (on one of the worst D's in the NFL) and two of the worst defenses in the NFL period, and not crowning his ass means I'm analyzing the evidence incorrectly?

I'm not going to apologize for the fact that you lack the mental acumen to understand even the most basic premises.

Here's one:

Average hitters often have a week where they hit .460 or maybe a month where they hit .380 and have 6 HR. Are they Albert Pujols? No.

It's that fucking simple.

Pawnmower

12-02-2010, 09:54 PM

My analysis of the evidence? The guy has played 2.5 solid games against a prevent defense (on one of the worst D's in the NFL) and two of the worst defenses in the NFL period, and not crowning his ass means I'm analyzing the evidence incorrectly?

What are my claims you disagree with? When did I ever say I was crowning him? Again you resort to logically flawed arguments because you fail.

All I said was he doesn't suck. I said this back in April and I am saying it now.

Do you disagree?

'Hamas' Jenkins

12-02-2010, 09:58 PM

What are my claims you disagree with? When did I ever say I was crowning him? Again you resort to logically flawed arguments because you fail.

All I said was he doesn't suck. I said this back in April and I am saying it now.

Do you disagree?

Actually, if you are to be believed, you claimed he would be good.

Yes, I disagree that he's a good QB. Is he playing like a good QB right now? Yes. Did Jake Delhomme once do that for an entire playoff run? Yes.

Do you get it now?

cdcox

12-02-2010, 10:02 PM

You realize you are a total ****ing tool, right?

So let me get this straight. You give me a big long post about what an exception is and call me stupid. Then I point out that you had quantified the number of exceptions and thus your lecture to me about what an exception is was completely out of line. Now I am the tool? Where did I call you stupid or any other name?

dirk digler

12-02-2010, 10:03 PM

...the bipolarism of it all is astounding & annoying...all offseason all we heard is how much we were gonna suck, how Cassel sucked, how he was NEVER EVER going to be a franchise, or a"legit" or "real" QB.
..

For the record I never blamed him for the Houston loss that was all on the D and Bowe is responsible for the loss at Oakland not Cassel.

Pawnmower

12-02-2010, 10:06 PM

Actually, if you are to be believed, you claimed he would be good.

Yes, I disagree that he's a good QB. Is he playing like a good QB right now? Yes. Did Jake Delhomme once do that for an entire playoff run? Yes.

Do you get it now?

Yes, I get that you were wrong. I do not believe I claimed he would be 'good.' Certainly I didn't think he would play even this well....so I can't claim I knew this would happen.

So I understand you still do not think he can be a good QB. Your 'evidence' and your 'proof' somehow tells you this.

That is your opinion and I can't argue with it. From what I have seen in this 2nd season of Matty as a Chief is that I think he can be a good QB. I think he has what it takes to lead the team to the playoffs in the next year or two.

If he can take his game up a notch by consistently increasing his accuracy just a little (even 2-3 percent, say to 63%, and do better on 3rd downs) I believe he can be a pro-bowl QB, which we will want to hang onto for years.

Pawnmower

12-02-2010, 10:09 PM

So let me get this straight.

No, let me get this straight....You didn't understand what an exception was so I explained it to you. Then you cherry picked my words "one or two" and once again mistakenly got the idea that more than two exceptions somehow nullifies a rule. You know full well when I said "one or two" that I did not mean exactly two. Now you are acting outraged. You know full well that if you found more than two people who agreed gravity did not exist, that they would STILL be the exception. You know this yet you continue to be a douche bag. THAT is why you are a tool.

TheGuardian

12-02-2010, 10:14 PM

This 2.5 games bullshit is really getting old.

The guy threw 22 td's and 4 picks in 2.5 games?

Really?

cdcox

12-02-2010, 10:15 PM

No, let me get this straight....You didn't understand what an exception was so I explained it to you. Then you cherry picked my words "one or two" and once again mistakenly got the idea that more than two exceptions somehow nullifies a rule. You know full well when I said "one or two" that I did not mean exactly two. Now you are acting outraged. You know full well that if you found more than two people who agreed gravity did not exist, that they would STILL be the exception. You know this yet you continue to be a douche bag. THAT is why you are a tool.

We weren't arguing if people who think Cassel had made it big time were exceptions, we were arguing about how many there were. You said there were one or two exceptions. I think there are more than that. And I still haven't called you any names or insulted you.

Pawnmower

12-02-2010, 10:18 PM

We weren't arguing if people who think Cassel had made it big time were exceptions, we were arguing about how many there were. You said there were one or two exceptions. I think there are more than that. And I still haven't called you any names or insulted you.

Yes, actually we WERE arguing about whether people thought he was 'big time' or not. The fact that you are being evasive, trying to suggest that all of these people somehow claim he is 'big time' or MVP and that it is 'bullcrap' that people do not consider him bigtime..... and then go back and deny that is what you meant is insulting. It is a waste of both of our times.

dirk digler

12-02-2010, 10:28 PM

This 2.5 games bullshit is really getting old.

The guy threw 22 td's and 4 picks in 2.5 games?

Really?

First 8 games = 12 TD's
Last 2.5 games = 10 TD's

'Hamas' Jenkins

12-02-2010, 10:29 PM

This 2.5 games bullshit is really getting old.

The guy threw 22 td's and 4 picks in 2.5 games?

Really?

Why do stats matter when discussing Matt Cassel but not matter when discussing a linebacker?

Why do stats matter when discussing Matt Cassel but not matter when discussing a linebacker?

Who said stats didn't matter? Just curious....I mean theyre not everything but even for a linebacker there are stats that matter.

cdcox

12-02-2010, 10:34 PM

This 2.5 games bullshit is really getting old.

The guy threw 22 td's and 4 picks in 2.5 games?

Really?

Over the season he is 21st in completion percentage.
Over the season he is 18th in yards per attempt.
Over the season he is 19th in total yards.

Do these stats count?

Pawnmower

12-02-2010, 10:35 PM

Over the season he is 21st in completion percentage.
Over the season he is 18th in yards per attempt.
Over the season he is 19th in total yards.

Do these stats count?

Yes, they do....and so do all of the other ones...that you conveniently failed to mention. Why would you fail to mention them? I dunno maybe because you are a dishonest douche.

Craqhead

12-02-2010, 10:37 PM

When you watch the highlights you see something we haven't seen a lot of this season: Casshole hitting his WR's in stride. Instead of Bowe having to stop and jump, or stop and come back, he's able to keep running and make YAC.

I believe it was during the first half of the Oakland game that bwana, who is one of the handful of posters that is universally respected on the board, asked (paraphrasing), "Where are the Cassel nut lickers now?" because the dude was playing like shit.

Cassel himself said in an interview this week that the Denver game inspired a great deal of confidence in the passing game.

So, yes, we've been watching a turnaround for the past 2.5 weeks, as it applies to Cassel.

cdcox

12-02-2010, 10:38 PM

Yes, they do....and so do all of the other ones...that you conveniently failed to mention. Why would you fail to mention them? I dunno maybe because you are a dishonest douche.

Because they were in the post I quoted?

DeezNutz

12-02-2010, 10:38 PM

Yes, they do....and so do all of the other ones...that you conveniently failed to mention. Why would you fail to mention them? I dunno maybe because you are a dishonest douche.

Laughable.

I believe you're the first to make this claim about cd. But you're right. The hundreds (thousands?) of other members are wrong.

ChiefsCountry

12-02-2010, 10:39 PM

You know what stat matters - that "W" in the standings box. Right now Cassel is getting it done. But I want those "W" in January when it really counts. Keep playing like last two weeks and it will come. Play like he did previous and we are bitching about losing the first playoff game.

SenselessChiefsFan

12-02-2010, 10:39 PM

How about the fact that the Chiefs were 2-2 during this month?

Cassel's best statistical month = .500 record against four teams with losing records?

STATS ARE FOR LOSERS

So is it better to put up great numbers or win games....cause through the first seven games.... I kinda got the impression that winning wasn't that important.

Pawnmower

12-02-2010, 10:40 PM

So, yes, we've been watching a turnaround for the past 2.5 weeks, as it applies to Cassel.

You're right, weeks 3, 6 and 7 do not exist. He hasn't been learning and growing. This shouldn't be possible (to learn and grow). No one couldve ever seen this. He hasn't been steadily improving with ups and downs, he just all of a sudden over the last 2.5 games because a different person by some kind of miracle. It is a miracle, that is the only explanation as to why the Haters were so WRONG about this. Yes...Keep repeating it.

Pawnmower

12-02-2010, 10:42 PM

Laughable.

I believe you're the first to make this claim about cd. But you're right. The hundreds (thousands?) of other members are wrong.

Its at LEAST twice he is being intellectually dishonest in this thread.

I quoted him both times. I will let others read the thread and come to their own conclusions.

Maybe it was just a coincidence...

DeezNutz

12-02-2010, 10:43 PM

You're right, weeks 3, 6 and 7 do not exist. He hasn't been learning and growing. This shouldn't be possible (to learn and grow). No one couldve ever seen this. He hasn't been steadily improving with ups and downs, he just all of a sudden over the last 2.5 games because a different person by some kind of miracle. It is a miracle, that is the only explanation as to why the Haters were so WRONG about this. Yes...Keep repeating it.

I appreciate your use of a proper noun. And I imagine that many will continue to repeat it because he'd been mediocre-average for the vast majority of the year.

Denver provided the felix culpa. 7 on 7 in a "real" game seems to have provided the confidence that Cassel needed. What this suggests, and where many of his critics will be proven wrong if this trend continues, is that he had the necessary skill set to be a high-quality QB, not simply a game manager.

Pawnmower

12-02-2010, 10:47 PM

I appreciate your use of a proper noun. And I imagine that many will continue to repeat it because he'd been mediocre-average for the vast majority of the year.

Even that is more than many expected.....In any case it is true he has had ups and downs...Whether all of the ups are in the last 2.5 weeks is some matter of debate, but I personally have hopes that the 'Updog' will be showing up the majority of games. Hope! Joy in watching the Chiefs play!

I haven't had that in so long.

DeezNutz

12-02-2010, 10:48 PM

Even that is more than many expected.....In any case it is true he has had ups and downs...Whether all of the ups are in the last 2.5 weeks is some matter of debate, but I personally have hopes that the 'Updog' will be showing up the majority of games. Hope! Joy in watching the Chiefs play!

I haven't had that in so long.

We have common ground here.

Pants

12-02-2010, 10:48 PM

HOLY FUCK.

Pawntard is simply unbelievable.

LMAO

TheGuardian

12-02-2010, 10:55 PM

Over the season he is 21st in completion percentage.
Over the season he is 18th in yards per attempt.
Over the season he is 19th in total yards.

Do these stats count?

Boy it'd be tougher to cherry pick stats than you just did wouldn't it?

But fine, let's play.

Peyton Manning is 21st in yards per attempt
Sanchize is 23rd
Matt Ryan is 25th

His completion % over the last 8 games is 62.5%. Again, this isn't a 2.5 game thing. He's improved over the course of the season at a pretty steady curve.

cdcox

12-02-2010, 10:56 PM

Its at LEAST twice he is being intellectually dishonest in this thread.

I quoted him both times. I will let others read the thread and come to their own conclusions.

Maybe it was just a coincidence...

Please explain my intellectual dishonesty. It is a common statement that Cassel has played exceptionally well the last 2.5 games. No one disagrees with this assessment. Many believe that a 2.5 game sample is very small and still honestly hold skepticism. TheGuardian sought to expand the time period of Matt Cassel's excellence by selectively quoting one state, namely his TD to INT ratio. In reply to TheGuardian, I offered some other stats that that showed that Matt Cassel's entire season may not be as stellar as TheGuardian presented.

Three questions.

Was TheGuardian's selective quoting of the TD to INT ratio intellectually honest?
Please explain why my quotation of counter evidence was intellectually dishonest?
Was it intellectually honest for you to call me out, without calling out TheGuardian?

DeezNutz

12-02-2010, 11:03 PM

If you put more stock in advanced statistics, Cassel ranks 11th in DYAR and 12th in DVOA.

Admittedly, this is much better than many thought possible from him, but this shows that he's far from a franchise QB.

DVOA is probably the more important statistic. Top 5, in this order:
Brady
Rivers
Roethlisberger
Rodgers
Orton

P. Manning is 11th. Obviously, this shows that stats must be coupled with common sense.

http://www.footballoutsiders.com/stats/qb

Frankie

12-02-2010, 11:03 PM

While I agree that extremes are inappropriate and wrong usually, I don't see many people taking the extreme homer position on Matt Castle (he is the best ever....he is a GREAT QB....he is a future HoF'er...etc..)

Only on Chiefs Planet is saying the guy has had a good season and giving him props for this award being a "homer."

I don't disagree. I admit the "haters" have acted more extreme. But there are a few here who have fallen in love with Cassel now. And I caution against that until we see more consistency in his performance.

BossChief

12-02-2010, 11:06 PM

No it has only been two weeks. "Anyone who knows anything about football can see that"

LOLLLOL
I dont think anyone is saying it is ONLY 2 weeks.

BUT

Before the last two weeks, he didnt show poise under pressure, accuracy, ability to go through his reads consistently, ability to slide in the pocket to avoid pressure, ability to throw past 10 yards with ANY accuracy...etc.

"fix the quarterback"

In the video someone posted from the Seattle game, Haley said "kids becoming a quarterback" indicating that even the head coach didnt think he was one till fairly recently.

I could go on and on...

I have been saying all along that you can spot the dumbasses simply by looking at who says "let's see him do it in San Diego". A season is not one game. A guy isn't good or bad or great or awful based on 1 game.

I hate these ****tards.
Then you can surely put me in the group of "fucktards" because I think that game will be absolutely HUGE in how I gauge how much progress he has made.

The thing with that game is that it will likely show us in great detail what we will get from the guy once his level of play needs to raise for us to be a team that is more than a one and done in THE PLAYOFFS...you know, what all this is about? That is the type of game Cassel needs to step up in and show that he has that in him if we are to have a good chance at being the team we have all been waiting soooo long for.

In the playoffs, you dont see teams like the 2010 Arizona Cardinals...you have to play on the road against hot teams with good defenses. Once you are on that platform, you need to show you are deserving of being there and then and only then are you considered a "contender"

It is entirely possible for Cassel to fulfill what many of us want to see in a game that we ultimately lose as well.

When we need him to make a few plays in that game, he needs to step up.

Pure and simple.

This post makes me want to hand off to Jones up the gut on 3rd and 8.

I believe it was during the first half of the Oakland game that bwana, who is one of the handful of posters that is universally respected on the board, asked (paraphrasing), "Where are the Cassel nut lickers now?" because the dude was playing like shit.

Cassel himself said in an interview this week that the Denver game inspired a great deal of confidence in the passing game.

So, yes, we've been watching a turnaround for the past 2.5 weeks, as it applies to Cassel.

It is entirely possible that was the first time that harness had been taken off Cassel this year and he was able to play his game.

Thats what I want to believe, anyway.

Pawnmower

12-02-2010, 11:06 PM

Please explain my intellectual dishonesty.

-----

Three questions.

Was TheGuardian's selective quoting of the TD to INT ratio intellectually honest?
Please explain why my quotation of counter evidence was intellectually dishonest?
Was it intellectually honest for you to call me out, without calling out TheGuardian?

This is getting really old, but here goes:

Your intellectual dishonesty in this thread was trying to use the exception to prove the general rule wrong......and then even after having it explained to you...you 'fake' like you don't get it. Like finding 3 people who claim gravity doesn't exist would somehow 'prove' it. You damn well KNOW the consensus, the VAST consensus is not that Matty is a 'big time' QB yet you said "BULL CRAP!!" to me when I tried to point this out. That is dishonest. Then, you cherry picked a bunch of stats for some reason...and they all happened to be stats which are not in favor of Cassel being a good QB. Why? I have no idea...But it is dishonest nonetheless.

I'm not sure what youre referring to about guardian bringing up TD:INT ratio, I will have to go back and look. But yes, you are correct if someone were to say Matt Cassel is the Bestest QB evar and here is why: blah blah......And then only mention the good stats....That is dishonest.

Believe me I wouldn't hesitate to call anyone out on 'forgetting' or not mentioning stats when it is convienient. Or worse yet, saying stats do not matter in X case but do in Y case...

I think our misunderstanding comes from the fact that you replied to a comment I was making to someone else (initially). If you go all the way back to where you said "BULL CRAP!" to what I was saying, and then look at my quote you will see I was talking to someone else.

cdcox

12-02-2010, 11:07 PM

Boy it'd be tougher to cherry pick stats than you just did wouldn't it?

But fine, let's play.

Peyton Manning is 21st in yards per attempt
Sanchize is 23rd
Matt Ryan is 25th

His completion % over the last 8 games is 62.5%. Again, this isn't a 2.5 game thing. He's improved over the course of the season at a pretty steady curve.

You picked your cherries first (TD to INT stats). I was just showing you that there were other cherries that weren't so pretty.

He's played great the last 2.5 games.

He was very erratic before then, having some good games and some bad games. Even in his relatively clean stat games, he had some very bad throws at very bad times. Some of those bad throws hurt our chances of winning certain games.

He has made progress this season. I'm waiting to see more consistency over longer periods of time against some stronger competition before I get all gooey about him.

Pants

12-02-2010, 11:10 PM

This is getting really old, but here goes:

Your intellectual dishonesty in this thread was trying to use the exception to prove the general rule wrong......and then even after having it explained to you...you 'fake' like you don't get it. Like finding 3 people who claim gravity doesn't exist would somehow 'prove' it. You damn well the consensus, the VAST consensus is not that Matty is a 'big time' QB yet you said "BULL CRAP!!" to me when I tried to point this out. That is dishonest. Then, you cherry picked a bunch of stats for some reason...and they all happened to be stats which are not in favor of Cassel being a good QB. Why? I have no idea...But it is dishonest nonetheless.

I'm not sure what youre referring to about guardian bringing up TD:INT ratio, I will have to go back and look. But yes, you are correct if someone were to say Matt Cassel is the Bestest QB evar and here is why: blah blah......And then only mention the good stats....That is dishonest.

Believe me I wouldn't hesitate to call anyone out on 'forgetting' or not mentioning stats when it is convienient. Or worse yet, saying stats do not matter in X case but do in Y case...

I think our misunderstanding comes from the fact that you replied to a comment I was making to someone else (initially). If you go all the way back to where you said "BULL CRAP!" to what I was saying, and then look at my quote you will see I was talking to someone else.

You're not sure what he's referring to when he actually quoted TheGuardian's post? Mmmkay.

Pawnmower

12-02-2010, 11:10 PM

Before the last two weeks, he didnt show poise under pressure, accuracy, ability to go through his reads consistently, ability to slide in the pocket to avoid pressure, ability to throw past 10 yards with ANY accuracy...etc.

I just do not agree with you here. I think we have seen flashes of these things in games as early as game 3. I can only speak for myself, but over the 1st 3 games I could already tell that he had much more poise under pressure than last season....Also I think he has had some decent throws of 10+ much farther back than 3 weeks ago. I really don't understand the need to claim that this all suddenly started 2.5 weeks ago.......Is it that hard for peopel to admit they were wrong?

stevieray

12-02-2010, 11:17 PM

Is it that hard for peopel to admit they were wrong?
...as soon as the QB they claimed wouldn't amount to shit wins the SB....

Pawnmower

12-02-2010, 11:18 PM

...as soon as the QB they claimed wouldn't amount to shit wins the SB....

LOL ohhhhh I see so thats where the goalpost will be headed next?

Interesting.

cdcox

12-02-2010, 11:18 PM

This is getting really old, but here goes:

Your intellectual dishonesty in this thread was trying to use the exception to prove the general rule wrong......and then even after having it explained to you...you 'fake' like you don't get it. Like finding 3 people who claim gravity doesn't exist would somehow 'prove' it. You damn well the consensus, the VAST consensus is not that Matty is a 'big time' QB yet you said "BULL CRAP!!" to me when I tried to point this out. That is dishonest. Then, you cherry picked a bunch of stats for some reason...and they all happened to be stats which are not in favor of Cassel being a good QB. Why? I have no idea...But it is dishonest nonetheless.

I'm not sure what youre referring to about guardian bringing up TD:INT ratio, I will have to go back and look. But yes, you are correct if someone were to say Matt Cassel is the Bestest QB evar and here is why: blah blah......And then only mention the good stats....That is dishonest.

Believe me I wouldn't hesitate to call anyone out on 'forgetting' or not mentioning stats when it is convienient. Or worse yet, saying stats do not matter in X case but do in Y case...

I think our misunderstanding comes from the fact that you replied to a comment I was making to someone else (initially). If you go all the way back to where you said "BULL CRAP!" to what I was saying, and then look at my quote you will see I was talking to someone else.

You said "no one" was saying Cassel was great.

That brought out my "bull crap" because I take words very literally. "No one" means no one. There are several posters that have been posting the last few days that all the doubters were wrong about Cassel. When we caution that a few games against weak teams doesn't prove that he's great we get told we are wrong again. So how can the doubters be wrong unless Cassel's already developed into a great QB?

Pants

12-02-2010, 11:19 PM

...as soon as the QB they claimed wouldn't amount to shit wins the SB....

Comon, stevie, everybody has admitted that he has played well the last 2 games. People want him to succeed. Everyone is ready to get behind him. But to say he played well the whole season would be a lie.

BossChief

12-02-2010, 11:19 PM

I just do not agree with you here. I think we have seen flashes of these things in games as early as game 3. I can only speak for myself, but over the 1st 3 games I could already tell that he had much more poise under pressure than last season....Also I think he has had some decent throws of 10+ much farther back than 3 weeks ago. I really don't understand the need to claim that this all suddenly started 2.5 weeks ago.......Is it that hard for peopel to admit they were wrong?

Dude, he LITERALLY had NO poise under pressure last year and I was one of the first here to point out in the early games that he had taken some of the first hits while throwing the ball (even though the passes were well off the mark) that doesnt mean he had "poise"

Poise, to me anyway, is when you are under pressure and slide to utilize your blocking while keeping your eyes on your reads trying to find the open man and you find a way to deliver an accurate pass in that situation...giving your team a chance to negate the pass rush. Peyton Manning and Tom Brady thrive by doing this game in and game out.

Hopefully, Cassel CONTINUES to show this feature of his game that has IMO only truly surfaced these last 2 or 3 games.

dirk digler

12-02-2010, 11:20 PM

I just do not agree with you here. I think we have seen flashes of these things in games as early as game 3. I can only speak for myself, but over the 1st 3 games I could already tell that he had much more poise under pressure than last season....Also I think he has had some decent throws of 10+ much farther back than 3 weeks ago. I really don't understand the need to claim that this all suddenly started 2.5 weeks ago.......Is it that hard for peopel to admit they were wrong?

Just watching him early in the season he would make 2-3 good throws a game and then stink it up the rest of the game. I don't know if you would call that a flash. For example one of the games you cited, Jacksonsville, he made a couple of TD's passes (the 2nd one was a miracle catch by Bowe who was wide the fuck open and Cassel about threw it out of bounds) but he only completed 13 passes for the whole game. I didn't walk away from that game thinking Cassel showed me anything.

stevieray

12-02-2010, 11:21 PM

LOL ohhhhh I see so thats where the goalpost will be headed next?

Interesting.

well, that's the goal, and that's what's expected of your overpaid fraud franchise QB, the losing your team HC and executive of the right fifty three tree are supposed to do in year 2.

are you new here?

Pawnmower

12-02-2010, 11:22 PM

You said "no one" was saying Cassel was great.

That brought out my "bull crap" because I take words very literally.

That is why I thought you were being intellectually dishonest....I know it is hard to communicate through text, and in person we would not have these kinds of difficulties...But I was not being literal when I said no one...

As I said, you can find exceptions to everything...but they don't make the rule...

I apologize for not being clear, and will try to keep this in mind and be more literal.

BossChief

12-02-2010, 11:23 PM

...as soon as the QB they claimed wouldn't amount to shit wins the SB....
Bullshit.

I have started AT LEAST 5 thread THIS YEAR praising Cassel.

Also, for the record, WINNING THE SUPERBOWL IS WHAT THIS IS ALL ABOUT
LOL ohhhhh I see so thats where the goalpost will be headed next?

Interesting.

I think part of this ongoing debate is due to some of us having different unrealistic expectations and others having the bar set so low that they think Cassel has a good game when he throws for 125 yards in a loss.

cdcox

12-02-2010, 11:24 PM

Is it that hard for peopel to admit they were wrong?

My objection to Cassel has always been that he won't develop into a big time QB. Therefore, I can't be wrong about him until he develops into a big time QB. You keep saying that he isn't there yet and no one is claiming that he has. It seems very inconsistent for you to want me to admit I am wrong, even when you agree that he hasn't arrived yet.

Pawnmower

12-02-2010, 11:25 PM

You said "no one" So how can the doubters be wrong unless Cassel's already developed into a great QB?

Well, if someone 'doubts' Cassel can be a GREAT QB, they can't be wrong yet, but might be some day.

If someone doubted that he could be a Good QB, they appear to be wrong.

If someone doubted that he could be an average QB they are wrong for sure.

IMO he has proven he has the tools to be a good QB......but "GReat?"

That is a huge leap...generally hardly anyone (I would say no one, but I don't want to start a huge argument) thinks he is a great QB already.

BossChief

12-02-2010, 11:26 PM

Its funny how vocal some of the people in this thread are being...didnt hear a peep from them when Cassel was the reason we yelled at the TV during games not too long ago, now its all like "I told you so"

DaneMcCloud

12-02-2010, 11:26 PM

well, that's the goal, and that's what's expected of your overpaid fraud franchise QB, the losing your team HC and executive of the right fifty three tree are supposed to do in year 2.

are you new here?

Talk about "Strawman".

:rolleyes:

If Matt Cassel didn't cost a 2nd round pick and $28 million dollars over the course of 32 games, I'm pretty sure that the expectations would be much lower.

I know those things don't matter to you because you live your life as a shrine to the Hunts and the Chiefs but they do matter to others.

Not that you give a fuck.

stevieray

12-02-2010, 11:26 PM

Comon, stevie, everybody has admitted that he has played well the last 2 games. People want him to succeed. Everyone is ready to get behind him. But to say he played well the whole season would be a lie.

well enough for first in the division through 11 games, in his second year.

Pawnmower

12-02-2010, 11:29 PM

My objection to Cassel has always been that he won't develop into a big time QB. Therefore, I can't be wrong about him until he develops into a big time QB. You keep saying that he isn't there yet and no one is claiming that he has. It seems very inconsistent for you to want me to admit I am wrong, even when you agree that he hasn't arrived yet.

I don't know where you ever got that I want you to admit you are wrong, the only thing I ever said was 'no one thinks he is a big time QB yet' and you took me EXTREMELY literally....when what I meant by no one was 'practically no one'...

I don't want you to be wrong...I think you are misunderstanding me somehow...My main argument about the word 'big time' was with someone else.

stevieray

12-02-2010, 11:29 PM

Talk about "Strawman".

because you live your life as a shrine to the Hunts and the Chiefs

irony, laugh at thyself.

DaneMcCloud

12-02-2010, 11:30 PM

irony, laugh at thyself.

I'll keep this simple because your intellect requires that I speak in small words and concepts: