It's very hard to listen to brexitereers make it up as the go and never be challenged about their obvious lies on msm, and never get called out on it. Fantasties about trading on wto rules since the 70s and other garbage about the Norway option are some of the clangers I heard this morning. It's complicated stuff but a one day crash course would surely be enough to challenge the spoofers.

While out driving I tuned into BBC radio 2 where they were having a general chat about Brexit options, one caller said the Norway option was out as the EU makes them charge £12 for a pint there.

Humanity is probably due a cull anyway.

Tony Connelly's Brexit Republic podcast looked at the Norway+ option last week. In a radical move, rather than interviewing various heads of the Tory Party Medusa, and allowing it to argue with itself, he had spoken to Norway's representative to EFTA. Has anybody else even thought of asking them what they would think?

Turns out, they have quite a lot of thoughts on the matter. And they are not sure they want the UK barging into their little club-on-the-edge-of-a-club. For a start, the UK would be the big beast in the room, making Norway and co. hostages to UK-EU tensions. And, because EFTA operates collectively, any member can veto a new agreement between EFTA-EU. Who would welcome eurosceptics on those terms?

They also discussed how Lichtenstein exercised its right to opt out of free movement of people using an arcane clause in the EFTA-EU treaty. The implication was that Lichtenstein had a reasonable case that free movement would cause disproportionate social and economic effects on its tiny state, but that the UK would be hard-pressed to make the same case. Some of the Norway+ champions reckon they can have the good bits of Norway, a bit of the Lichtenstein opt-out, with a slice of Swiss independence to make free trade deals with the rest of the world.

Also, an interesting footnote: the EU is reviewing its relationships with the Swiss so will want to seem rigid and tough in its negotiations with the UK i.e. they are extra reluctant to reopen the deal when it fails next week. Bottom line: the UK has been rubbish at understanding the other side of the table because its own side has been such a mess.

There was a Labour MP interviewed on Sky News this evening who was still trotting out the "EU needs us to buy their cars" line. He thinks May got a lousy deal and the UK just needs to march back over to Brussels and threaten to leave without a deal if they don't what they want.

_________________"Prediction is very difficult, especially about the future" – Niels Bohr

Norway Plus, the increasingly touted cross-party plan for the UK to leave the EU, but join Norway in a free trade trade area inside the EU single market, has been rejected by senior Norwegian politicians and business as “neither in Norway nor the UK’s interest”. The UK would need Norway’s permission to join its EFTA club.

The rejection is a blow to an influential cross-party group led by the Tory MP Nick Boles with private cabinet support that is looking for a Plan B if, as expected, Theresa May’s deal is rejected by MPs next Tuesday....

Explaining Norway’s fear of the UK joining the Efta club she said: “The three countries in Efta have to agree on all the regulations coming from the EU so if one country vetoes something we all have to veto which means that if the UK enters the Efta platform and starts to veto regulations that we want, this will affect not just the UK but also us as well. Part of the success we have had with this EEA agreement is for the last 25 years is that we do accept the rules and regulations that do come out of the EU, mostly because it is in our interest.

“If as I understand UK politicians do not want to be ruled by regulations coming from other countries, why would they accept a country with 38,000 citizens like Lichtenstein being able to veto regulations that the UK wants. That would be the reality.”....

Norway Plus, the increasingly touted cross-party plan for the UK to leave the EU, but join Norway in a free trade trade area inside the EU single market, has been rejected by senior Norwegian politicians and business as “neither in Norway nor the UK’s interest”. The UK would need Norway’s permission to join its EFTA club.

The rejection is a blow to an influential cross-party group led by the Tory MP Nick Boles with private cabinet support that is looking for a Plan B if, as expected, Theresa May’s deal is rejected by MPs next Tuesday....

Explaining Norway’s fear of the UK joining the Efta club she said: “The three countries in Efta have to agree on all the regulations coming from the EU so if one country vetoes something we all have to veto which means that if the UK enters the Efta platform and starts to veto regulations that we want, this will affect not just the UK but also us as well. Part of the success we have had with this EEA agreement is for the last 25 years is that we do accept the rules and regulations that do come out of the EU, mostly because it is in our interest.

“If as I understand UK politicians do not want to be ruled by regulations coming from other countries, why would they accept a country with 38,000 citizens like Lichtenstein being able to veto regulations that the UK wants. That would be the reality.”....

So much for 'they are mad for herring ' agreementAs a number of informed commentators have points out its near impossible for the UK to get to a Norway plus from their current position. They would have to go back in time and approach the EEA/EFTA countries and engage in detailed discussions to see if was even possible. But the thicko Brexiteers still think its easy to leave the EU and negotiate a FTA. Maybe they should learn to walk before they can run

There was a Labour MP interviewed on Sky News this evening who was still trotting out the "EU needs us to buy their cars" line. He thinks May got a lousy deal and the UK just needs to march back over to Brussels and threaten to leave without a deal if they don't what they want.

Jeffrey Donaldson DUP on the Pat Kenny show this morning was still using the 'car buying' line

Priti Patel says the threat of starvation in Ireland should be used as leverage to go back to Brussels.

Do millions have to starve in Britain for them to finally understand how millions starved in Ireland under direct London rule?

Even for a Tory politician, I didn't think a statement could be possibly true. I had to Google it to make sure.

It's gormless for sure, but it is the same uninterrupted Westminster sovereignty that induced starvation in Ireland that prosecutes Brexit now. Phil Hogan's reply cuts to the heart of it.

Quote:

EU commissioner for agriculture Phil Hogan has criticised a Tory MP’s threat to use possible post-Brexit food shortages in Ireland as leverage to secure a better deal, saying it would lead to “the starvation of the British people”.