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Re: Trading "The Cuban Missile"

I just don't think the Marlins would give him up.
I'd love to see the Reds trade Frazier and either Bailey or Chapman for Machado, but I doubt the Orioles would even consider it.

Smart teams make the right move even if it doesn't sit well with it's fan base, look at the Colts as an example, they pissed off 90% of their fan base when they released Peyton Manning, and look at how it turned out. Trading Chapman is the only smart move, but Walt ain't got the guts to do it....

Re: Trading "The Cuban Missile"

I'd say the Rolen deal was pretty gutsy.

I think it's more that Walt won't make a deal just to make a deal...if there's something out there that he feels improves the team more now than it hurts it down the road, he'll do...if it hurts down the road more than it helps now, he won't.

Re: Trading "The Cuban Missile"

Re: Trading "The Cuban Missile"

Originally Posted by dwyerbrg

I'd say the Rolen deal was pretty gutsy.

I think it's more that Walt won't make a deal just to make a deal...if there's something out there that he feels improves the team more now than it hurts it down the road, he'll do...if it hurts down the road more than it helps now, he won't.

How was it "gutsy"? There were no major Reds players involved going to Toronto. To trade Chapman means you made a mistake in signing him AND you misused his talent during his time here. That is what I am talking about, admit your mistakes, trade from your strenght and get what you need.

Re: Trading "The Cuban Missile"

Originally Posted by Johnny Fan

How was it "gutsy"? There were no major Reds players involved going to Toronto. To trade Chapman means you made a mistake in signing him AND you misused his talent during his time here. That is what I am talking about, admit your mistakes, trade from your strenght and get what you need.

Encarnacion sure did turn into a major player. I bet the Reds would like to have him back.

Re: Trading "The Cuban Missile"

Originally Posted by Johnny Fan

How was it "gutsy"? There were no major Reds players involved going to Toronto. To trade Chapman means you made a mistake in signing him AND you misused his talent during his time here. That is what I am talking about, admit your mistakes, trade from your strenght and get what you need.

I think it was "gutsy" because it was the exact opposite type of trade one would expect from a non-contender. Zack Stewart was supposed to turn into a good pitcher and Roenicke was supposed to be the next good reliever. That's gutsy t me.

If you're talking about trading from your strength and getting what you need, then you definitely look into trading him since pitching is a definite strength. I disagree with you when you say trading him means you made a mistake in signing him. I disagree that he's been misused...if he was a starter, he'd likely still be in AAA at this point...definitely not this rotation.

Likes:

Re: Trading "The Cuban Missile"

Originally Posted by xsteve1

Encarnacion sure did turn into a major player. I bet the Reds would like to have him back.

Encarnacion's ship had sailed in Cincy...remember he was placed on waivers and didn't get claimed. One of those deals where you say good riddance and he turned into a player. I think a lot of his success has to do with him not having to worry about defense at 3B.

Re: Trading "The Cuban Missile"

Originally Posted by Johnny Fan

How was it "gutsy"? There were no major Reds players involved going to Toronto. To trade Chapman means you made a mistake in signing him AND you misused his talent during his time here. That is what I am talking about, admit your mistakes, trade from your strenght and get what you need.

Definitely wouldn't be considered a mistake to sign Chapman if we traded him. We have gotten three great years from him. I also think his greatest value is as a starter, but that doesn't mean we haven't got production from him. If he was traded, the Reds would also be getting another asset for him. So to this point, it has been a great signing.

Re: Trading "The Cuban Missile"

Originally Posted by Goose

Definitely wouldn't be considered a mistake to sign Chapman if we traded him. We have gotten three great years from him. I also think his greatest value is as a starter, but that doesn't mean we haven't got production from him. If he was traded, the Reds would also be getting another asset for him. So to this point, it has been a great signing.

Re: Trading "The Cuban Missile"

Originally Posted by vottofan4life

Chapman for Trumbo or Cespedes with the trade expanding if it needs to. Fills our left field gap for multiple years.

Cespedes?

You do understand Billy Beane runs the A's, right? This is a guy that does not value relievers at all. When his closers get expensive, he either trades them or lets their contract run out. He would never trade his young 5 tool player for a closer. NEVER.

Re: Trading "The Cuban Missile"

Re: Trading "The Cuban Missile"

If Lorenzen can somehow find a way to fast track it to the majors by mid season next year then I could see the reds trading chapman at the deadline but there is no other scenario in which I see us giving up a vital part of our pen without adding something to our pen from within the organization....

I don't think there is any chance that Lorenzen fast tracks it here that soon.....but he is the one piece that makes chapman somewhat expendable. Trading chapman would give us those much needed pieces that would make this team scary good. Scratch that, scary great is what we would be if we could add a all star LF.....Lorenzen has sure been pushed through the system and he makes progress at each stop.

Re: Trading "The Cuban Missile"

This particular deal is, of course, unlikely because it's impossible to predict this stuff, but the deal below is the type of deal the Reds need to make for Chapman IMO. Big dollar guys probably aren't realistic.

Dodgers add another big dollar star (and Chapman's dollars go way up next year). The Reds stick Pederson in CF with Hamilton in AAA continuing his development. Van Slyke takes Heisey's spot on the bench. Gordon becomes the UI who may provide some challenge to Cozart and adds a lot of speed off the bench at a minimum. Garcia adds a lefty who can help in 2014. Some of the savings goes to re-sign Parra. 2014 Pen

Hoover CL
Broxton
Parra (L)
Lecure
Simon
Marshall/Garcia (L)
Partch

Lorenzen makes an impact at some point and guys like Corcino, Crabbe, Rogers, etc, will be in AAA. Stephenson will be the 6th starter behind Latos, Bailey, Cueto, Leake and Cingrani. Carlos Contreras might be a sleeper to make in impact at some point in 2014 as well. IMO, this is clearly the depth area where the Reds can address the budget while filling holes at the same time.

"All I can tell them is pick a good one and sock it." --BABE RUTH

Having better players makes "the right time" or "the big hit" happen a lot more often. PLUS PLUS

Re: Trading "The Cuban Missile"

Originally Posted by mth123

This particular deal is, of course, unlikely because it's impossible to predict this stuff, but the deal below is the type of deal the Reds need to make for Chapman IMO. Big dollar guys probably aren't realistic.

Dodgers add another big dollar star (and Chapman's dollars go way up next year). The Reds stick Pederson in CF with Hamilton in AAA continuing his development. Van Slyke takes Heisey's spot on the bench. Gordon becomes the UI who may provide some challenge to Cozart and adds a lot of speed off the bench at a minimum. Garcia adds a lefty who can help in 2014. Some of the savings goes to re-sign Parra. 2014 Pen

Hoover CL
Broxton
Parra (L)
Lecure
Simon
Marshall/Garcia (L)
Partch

Lorenzen makes an impact at some point and guys like Corcino, Crabbe, Rogers, etc, will be in AAA. Stephenson will be the 6th starter behind Latos, Bailey, Cueto, Leake and Cingrani. Carlos Contreras might be a sleeper to make in impact at some point in 2014 as well. IMO, this is clearly the depth area where the Reds can address the budget while filling holes at the same time.

I have no problem trading Chapman, but not for spare parts that could be picked up off the waiver wire. He's an impact player. Reds need impact player(s) back for him.

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