Go to page

Go to page

EOS M50

Everybody's situation is different, but for me, the opportunity cost of waiting for Canon to flesh out its video/hybrid system was simply not worth it. Thus, I went over to Sony in late 2017 from Panasonic/Olympus in the MILC space. I didn't move over prior to that because Sony wasn't quite there with their mark ii bodies. That was a year and a half ago. Since then, Canon didn't disappoint (to my benefit) and it has relatively stayed true to its conservative roots (in the EOS R and RP). Given Canon's CEO predictions of a 50% drop of the camera market in the following 2 years and Canon's financial reports stating a transition into marketing and distribution vs R&D, I'm not sure they are interested in catching up for bragging rights. They are more interested in catering to the consumer/entry level market like Rebels, Instant print cameras, etc. which is their most volatile market group considering the fast paced development of multi-camera array smartphones and contribution to their overwhelming market share. In addition, there doesn't seem to be any more releases in the MILC space from Canon in 2019, so those looking for product in that space will have to wait for 2020. By then, I would have generated revenue with Sony product for more than 2.5 years assuming I don't upgrade one of my bodies to the A7Siii. It would be quite some time even after that for Canon to completely displace them in the MILC space forcing them to sell or abandon.... At that point, some of the feature parity between Canon and its competitors would more than likely be partially achieved, and moving to Canon would be more palatable to me for video/hybrid work and the depreciation on the Sony equipment on the used market acceptable.

EOS 80D

I'm thinking that that 24-240 consumer super-zoom will be out in a couple of months, and will be sold as a kit with the RP, perhaps with a discount in December. Hopefully, it's light and sharp (as sharp as a 24-240 zoom can be anyway). Superzooms are somewhat of a compromise.

EOS 7D MK II

Add to that 95% of those complaining about 4K are clueless on how to do a decent video production. Shots of the grand kids crawling around is not something to waste 4K anything on. How many consumers do video with their camera anyway and then how many truly use it in the proper way. Even vloggers could do without 4K as it is viewed on cell phones 90% so there is no value to it. If you want quality 4K then get a quality video camera, learn how to actually make a decent video then you will see the Sony et al are a waste of money anyway.

4K TVs are everywhere in the USA; many computer and even the latest smartphone displays are greater than HD (revealing the resolution limitations of HD footage); and most video work is shot in 4K even when finishing in HD, to make use of the greater resolution to reframe and to enhance quality; also, many pros and prosumers need and want a hybrid camera that does stills and video; and, to top it off, many corporate productions are shot on Sony FS7s and the matching A7 series is used for a ton of gimbal work. All this goes without mentioning any future proofing benefits of shooting in 4K.

Beware of cats with laser eyes!

I'm thinking that that 24-240 consumer super-zoom will be out in a couple of months, and will be sold as a kit with the RP, perhaps with a discount in December. Hopefully, it's light and sharp (as sharp as a 24-240 zoom can be anyway). Superzooms are somewhat of a compromise.

I post too Much on Here!!

4K TVs are everywhere in the USA; many computer and even the latest smartphone displays are greater than HD (revealing the resolution limitations of HD footage); and most video work is shot in 4K even when finishing in HD, to make use of the greater resolution to reframe and to enhance quality; also, many pros and prosumers need and want a hybrid camera that does stills and video; and, to top it off, many corporate productions are shot on Sony FS7s and the matching A7 series is used for a ton of gimbal work. All this goes without mentioning any future proofing benefits of shooting in 4K.

By accounts on this forum, Canon either lacks 4K or their implementation makes Canon ILCs useless for 4K capture. Yet Canon continues to sell more ILCs than any other manufacturer, all of whom, according to the accounts on this forum, have much better 4K offerings.

So the answer to your question is either that the majority of ILC buyers are clueless, or those on this forum pounding on the importance of 4K are clueless. If you’re wondering which answer is correct, here’s a hint: it’s the one supported by data, not the one supported by your opinion.

EOS RP

4K TVs are everywhere in the USA; many computer and even the latest smartphone displays are greater than HD (revealing the resolution limitations of HD footage); and most video work is shot in 4K even when finishing in HD, to make use of the greater resolution to reframe and to enhance quality; also, many pros and prosumers need and want a hybrid camera that does stills and video; and, to top it off, many corporate productions are shot on Sony FS7s and the matching A7 series is used for a ton of gimbal work. All this goes without mentioning any future proofing benefits of shooting in 4K.

His point is that producing decent video is much more than pressing a record button on a video camera. You also need to be director, cutter, and all the other specalist finishing a professional video. For these professionals 4k60p enabled cameras are surely the right thing. But they are producing decent videos in a team. People filming their family affairs or vloggers never do anything of thes professional work thats more than only recording the video. These people are glad if they manage to cut their footage in a more or less professional way and going to present it to their family once a year.
Sure also these amateurs want to have 4k because they also have a 4k TV. But then there are other choices for them than Canon if they can't afford a 5DMIV or 1DXII.

Are all these Hybrid DSLR/Video Cameras really be used in professional productions as main cameras? Is it really so important to have two things combined in one where none of both things is done 100% right. Something is missing in each offer regardless if Fuji, Panasonic, Sony or who else. Professionals are way better equipped with products build solely for one purpose. DSLR/DSLM for stills and Vdeo rigs for video.

EOS 5D SR

As a long time participant in this forum, it is amusing to see the trajectory of "must have" features that people claim Canon lacks and that they feel are holding them back. Believe it or not, people used to complain that Canon's sensors had too many megapixels and couldn't compete with Nikon on noise. Then for several years there was the great dynamic range lens cap shot debate. It seems like the big things lately have been 4K, 60 fps and IBIS. The encouraging thing is that with each new season, the "failure" of Canon that gets people so riled up on this forum becomes more and more obscure features that have little interest to most photographers.

And, through it all, Canon keeps outselling the competition.

My only comment on the subject of this thread is that if Canon has a number of new products coming down the pipeline in 2019, they better hurry, because the year is already into its fourth month.

EOS RP

His point is that producing decent video is much more than pressing a record button on a video camera. You also need to be director, cutter, and all the other specalist finishing a professional video. For these professionals 4k60p enabled cameras are surely the right thing. But they are producing decent videos in a team. People filming their family affairs or vloggers never do anything of thes professional work thats more than only recording the video. These people are glad if they manage to cut their footage in a more or less professional way and going to present it to their family once a year.
Sure also these amateurs want to have 4k because they also have a 4k TV. But then there are other choices for them than Canon if they can't afford a 5DMIV or 1DXII.

Are all these Hybrid DSLR/Video Cameras really be used in professional productions as main cameras? Is it really so important to have two things combined in one where none of both things is done 100% right. Something is missing in each offer regardless if Fuji, Panasonic, Sony or who else. Professionals are way better equipped with products build solely for one purpose. DSLR/DSLM for stills and Vdeo rigs for video.

Not everyone creating professional video is on a large production crew and creating long form video. One or two man band crews are far more common and are producing 15-120 second pieces. Internal production within corporate communication and marketing departments is where hybrids are king. Yeah, they'll still have a C200 or Sony flavor around or contract a free lancer with those cameras for some projects, but a lot of the grunt work is on hybrids.

EOS 7D MK II

By accounts on this forum, Canon either lacks 4K or their implementation makes Canon ILCs useless for 4K capture. Yet Canon continues to sell more ILCs than any other manufacturer, all of whom, according to the accounts on this forum, have much better 4K offerings.

So the answer to your question is either that the majority of ILC buyers are clueless, or those on this forum pounding on the importance of 4K are clueless. If you’re wondering which answer is correct, here’s a hint: it’s the one supported by data, not the one supported by your opinion.

Sometimes it's difficult to see things from a video perspective when you're a photographer or vice-versa. It's also difficult on this forum for people to separate the sales issue and "might makes right" from the discussion of how/what/why video features are important and what makes a great stills/video hybrid camera.

No matter who sells more cameras, if you do some research and try to see things from a MILC video features perspective, you'll see that my points cannot be disputed.

EOS 5D SR

Just talking aesthetics, 4K is an abomination. I do not like my actors looking like they are playing dress-up in my living room. Instead of being transported to another world, the ultra high resolution of 4K dooms us to watching ordinary (although better looking than average) people play acting, stripped of all sense of mystery or drama. I know it is unrealistic to expect his, but I truly wish movie theaters would resist the 4K/8K craze. I would like to have at least one refuge for viewing films as an art.

I post too Much on Here!!

Just talking aesthetics, 4K is an abomination. I do not like my actors looking like they are playing dress-up in my living room. Instead of being transported to another world, the ultra high resolution of 4K dooms us to watching ordinary (although better looking than average) people play acting, stripped of all sense of mystery or drama. I know it is unrealistic to expect his, but I truly wish movie theaters would resist the 4K/8K craze. I would like to have at least one refuge for viewing films as an art.

EOS 7D MK II

His point is that producing decent video is much more than pressing a record button on a video camera. You also need to be director, cutter, and all the other specalist finishing a professional video. For these professionals 4k60p enabled cameras are surely the right thing. But they are producing decent videos in a team. People filming their family affairs or vloggers never do anything of thes professional work thats more than only recording the video. These people are glad if they manage to cut their footage in a more or less professional way and going to present it to their family once a year.
Sure also these amateurs want to have 4k because they also have a 4k TV. But then there are other choices for them than Canon if they can't afford a 5DMIV or 1DXII.

Are all these Hybrid DSLR/Video Cameras really be used in professional productions as main cameras? Is it really so important to have two things combined in one where none of both things is done 100% right. Something is missing in each offer regardless if Fuji, Panasonic, Sony or who else. Professionals are way better equipped with products build solely for one purpose. DSLR/DSLM for stills and Vdeo rigs for video.

No, I got his point, which was that 4K video is overrated and not important in stills/video hybrid cameras. I simply disagree. And it's also incorrect to imply that MILCs are not used for professional video work. The Sony A7 series is a very popular camera to see on independent and corporate film sets here in New York.

No one is disputing that it takes talent and skill to make a good video- that goes without saying.

Maybe they have to: While I am amateur and really satisfied with M50 and EF-M 32 + all the good EF lenses I have ... EOS R and EOS RP aren't too interesting for me as a long term investment. I think this is valid for a lot of users who want to be open for next step in technical quality.

If i were in the urgent need for a FF mirrorless I would not see Canon as the first address when it comes to technical specifications - the openness of the Canon management makes it easier for me to wait for the big thing I am expecting from Canon.
For a long term investment I would like to have 2 stops more DR / less noise, IBIS, very good FF 4k 30fps, while not sacrificing ergonomics and color/texture reproduction quality.

EOS RP

There are situations where 5D IV/EOS R recovery isn't enough. Noisy shadow and require bracketing. Even Sony A7RIII users require luminosity mask. This is not amateurs but pro landscape photographer.

Canon 5D IV is a very capable camera doing most paid assignments from landscape to wedding. Same goes for all the lenses already existed. We only want better sensor, newer RF lenses, or eyeAF because most of us are gear heads. If I'm strictly about buying gears require for the job, those gears already existed and no need to spend extra money on newer camera with better ISO, DR, eyeAF, newer lenses chasing diminish return on our new purchase. None of clients will notice.

I post too Much on Here!!

Sometimes it's difficult to see things from a video perspective when you're a photographer or vice-versa. It's also difficult on this forum for people to separate the sales issue and "might makes right" from the discussion of how/what/why video features are important and what makes a great stills/video hybrid camera.

No matter who sells more cameras, if you do some research and try to see things from a MILC video features perspective, you'll see that my points cannot be disputed.

I’m not disputing the merit of your points regarding uses of 4K, merely stating that they are not relevant to the majority. I’m more than happy to debate the merits of the bokeh on my 600/4L IS II, but I recognize that the majority of the market doesn’t give a hoot about such a niche lens.

The point you were arguing against was essentially that ‘4K doesn’t matter to most people’, and the sales data support that point quite effectively.

EOS 80D

I’m not disputing the merit of your points regarding uses of 4K, merely stating that they are not relevant to the majority. I’m more than happy to debate the merits of the bokeh on my 600/4L IS II, but I recognize that the majority of the market doesn’t give a hoot about such a niche lens.

The point you were arguing against was essentially that ‘4K doesn’t matter to most people’, and the sales data support that point quite effectively.

And even the people who claim that it matters to them... still hang out here complaining about their Canon gear instead of making the much-threatened jump to Sonikon or Fujympus. They'd still rather shoot Canon with all its supposed failings than the brands with the impressive spec sheets. Or they don't shoot Canon and still hang out here, which makes me wonder about their motivations.