CNN poll: Government’s focus should be on legalizing illegals, not border security

posted at 11:21 am on February 7, 2014 by Allahpundit

No one thinks mass deportation is feasible. Hardly anyone’s suggesting it anymore. The consensus position among alleged “hardliners” these days is simply to nail down measurable improvements in policing for illegal immigration, especially measures like E-Verify aimed at deterring illegals who’ve already made it past the border, as a prerequisite to the eventual legalization that everyone knows is coming. The goal at this point is to prevent future amnesties, not derail the one whose headlights are right in front of us. As such, tacking on deportation to a question like this is like tacking on something to the legalization part about offering illegals citizenship “immediately, no questions asked.” No one’s suggesting that either, but I guarantee you’ll see the numbers for legalization dip if you toss that red herring out there. If anything, the noteworthy bit in the data above is the trendline: There was a sharp turnaround between 2011 and 2012, probably because the contrast between the candidates’ positions in the election that year — Obama de facto legalizing DREAMers by executive rule versus Romney calling for self-deportation of illegals — hardened the issue in partisan terms.

The interesting numbers in the CNN poll don’t come from the dopey deportation question, they come from the follow-up. People were asked whether they support legalizing illegals with a path to citizenship or legalizing them with a permanent bar to citizenship. That’s a red herring too insofar as Boehner’s principles don’t prohibit citizenship for illegals; all they say is that there’ll be no specially created path. Illegals might (and surely will) still be eligible for the citizenship process under existing law. But the question is valuable anyway, I think, because it gives you a glimpse at how the GOP’s big legalization sellout, which is designed to dazzle voters with a show of moderation, will be received once Democrats start demagoing the hell out of it. Result: The public overwhelmingly supports legalization with eventual citizenship, 81/17, and overwhelmingly opposes legalization that prohibits citizenship, 35/62. (Weird footnote: The 18-34 group shows the highest level of support in both questions among age demographics.) If the GOP’s going to embrace amnesty, they’d better swallow hard and start emphasizing that citizenship is in the cards for illegals under their plan, no matter how much that might irritate their base. No sense selling out if you’re not going to get a pat on the head for it from your target audience.

Since we’re talking the GOP and immigration politics, here’s another juicy poll out today. Beltway Republicans have warned border hawks forever that they should emulate Texas Republicans on this issue; both Dubya and Rick Perry have had fabulous electoral success in the state by taking a milder view of immigration reform than the conservative base. If you want to turn the electoral tide nationally among Latino voters, the Texas model is the one to follow. Here’s what Gallup found when they compared Latinos in Texas to Latinos nationwide:

Nationally, Latinos split 51/21 between Democrats and Republicans; in Texas, it’s 46/27, although as you can see, the Texas GOP has gained a few points over the past five years while the national party has actually lost ground slightly. No doubt dour views among Latinos of the national GOP have hurt the Texas state party too. There’s only so much Bush and Perry can do on their own. The Texas numbers would doubtless be higher if the national party’s image improved. But how much higher? The great conundrum in deciding whether to sell out on amnesty in Congress is gauging what sort of increase the GOP can expect over, say, the next 20 years in its share of the Latino vote. What’s their ceiling, realistically? 45 percent? 40? 35? Texas, a state governed by immigration-friendly Republicans for nearly 20 years, is a byword for “economic success” in America at this point — and the GOP still can’t do better than 27 percent among Latinos there? That suggests a low vote-share ceiling, not a high one.

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Well, I don’t know how much of that happens, but those worries are some of the reasons we avoid Unionlandia as much as possible. I don’t have enough experience with unions to have a valid opinion about them, but I definitely hate the union ‘thug’ aspect that is always rumored to occur with government jobs.

There are companies in the trades that illegals congregate that play by the rules, but with lower wages comes lower bids and the law abiding owner is out of certain contracts.

HillC Liver Spot on February 7, 2014 at 3:43 PM

I’m assuming you mean the other companies play by the rules, and not the illegals, because illegal means they aren’t following rules.

Those companies that may lose out on jobs to illegals have the most to benefit from immigration enforcement. One way the RNC could potentially get the public on board with enforcement is by turning the popular liberal talking points regarding jobs overseas. Make it very clear that there are jobs in the United States, but that the left has allowed to be filled by illegal workers. The hardest part there would be to make clear it is the fault of the left without demonizing companies that may unknowingly have illegal workers on their projects.

There are companies in the trades that illegals congregate that play by the rules, but with lower wages comes lower bids and the law abiding owner is out of certain contracts.

HillC Liver Spot on February 7, 2014 at 3:43 PM

I’m assuming you mean the other companies play by the rules, and not the illegals, because illegal means they aren’t following rules.

Those companies that may lose out on jobs to illegals have the most to benefit from immigration enforcement. One way the RNC could potentially get the public on board with enforcement is by turning the popular liberal talking points regarding jobs overseas. Make it very clear that there are jobs in the United States, but that the left has allowed to be filled by illegal workers. The hardest part there would be to make clear it is the fault of the left without demonizing companies that may unknowingly have illegal workers on their projects.

Effay5 on February 7, 2014 at 4:04 PM

Yes. And yes.
The construction industry alone should anger those put out of work so illegals can slap together piss poor quality housing.

Better for no reform so we can use the issue to split the Republican party and suppress the white conservative vote.

HonestLib on February 7, 2014 at 3:44 PM

I agree with most of your comment, but I’m interested in this. It seems to me that passing amnesty (what you refer to as reform) is more likely to split conservative votes than not passing it, at least for 2014.

I suppose that no passing any kind of amnesty keep the issue alive, but the reality is that most of the pro-amnesty GOP crowd are unlikely to not vote if amnesty isn’t passed, while I think the opposite is true of anti-amnesty conservatives if amnesty is passed. So, “keeping the issue alive” wouldn’t seem to work either.

Monkeytoe on February 7, 2014 at 3:54 PM
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Thanks for the cordial response. Like most folks, at the end of the day most try to have a good life and raise our kids. Thus, we have short memories about everyday life. Things that stand out, or being pointed out to us on a daily basis….we remember. No matter who passes, to use your word, Amnesty; life will go back to normal for those effected and in the short term your 37% could increase over time if you guys get your act together. Keep it an issue, target the Tea Party as the racist group within the Republican party, we (hope) can keep your percentage at 37, or lower.

Its not about amnesty….it is all about keeping our based fired up and casting the Rs in a bad light; even if amnesty is bad for the country.

The construction industry alone should anger those put out of work so illegals can slap together piss poor quality housing.

HillC Liver Spot on February 7, 2014 at 4:07 PM

Question though: how much blame can be placed on a contractor for “piss poor quality housing” if that matches the demand of the market?

During the housing boom, it was everyone’s right to own a house, and they were thrown together as the only way to keep up with that demand.

I’m in agreement regarding the ‘illegal’ part, but think the lower quality housing may be attributed more to economics than the industry.

The adage: Cost, time, quality… pick two to control, the third goes out the window.

During the boom, there was tremendous pressure on cost and time (when looking at cookie cutter type housing; luxury homes are a different story). Because of the pressure to have low costs and quick construction periods, lower quality finishes were designed. The structural aspects should not have had any corners cut, by code, but they can use cheap drywall if you aren’t paying for a nice finish to it.

Disclaimer: I don’t work in residential construction, but rather commercial. These are just the trends I saw and was aware of when observing the boom.

The late Lawrence Auster on the ‘stupid party’ and its support for amnesty:

“So the death of the GOP as a national party is assured—at the hands of the very ethnic group whom in their fantastical mindless delusion they are now embracing, thinking it will mean their salvation.

And I think the GOP has now also assured its death from another quarter—from white conservatives who will now finally realize that the Republicans do not stand for America but for its undoing. How could any conservative now support the GOP? It deserves to be destroyed. I, for one, wish it to be destroyed, and to be replaced by genuine conservative party.”

Mass deportation is totally feasible.You anti-American working middle class leftists think if you keep saying it people will buy it.Where there’s a will there’s a way.You leftists don’t have the will because you don’t believe in the rule of law and care more about big business getting their cheap labor than you do for the American workers!

You may end up with blood on your sleeves just as did the Apache Chief Mangus Colorados. Often that comes with taking a stand and being good leaders. That and the truth in the long trail of history does loose from time to time. But what the hell…..

About the only border security Democrats would favor is the kind keeping productive U.S. citizens from leaving the country. The caliber of public discourse I’ve observed leads me to believe they could credibly base their measures on preventing any racist from evading his or her Constitutional duty to support the welfare state. You know, so others, who refuse to work, might pursue happiness. Seems legit, bro.

GOP is done. They will anger their white base with amnesty and still not make enough inroads with Latino/a voters. Appealing to white nativists will skyrocket Latino/a support for democrats. And they can’t approach the issue around wages because they consistently defend and advocate policies that leave workers more vulnerable to corporations. Sayonara GOP!

libfreeordie on February 7, 2014 at 2:21 PM

Wrong. Republicans outbreed Democrats. While the progressive dies unhappy and alone, the conservative down the street dies surrounded by his four conservative children and ten conservative grandchildren.

So great job, professor. We look forward to more of your startling insights in another half-decade.

rogerb on February 7, 2014 at 2:35 PM

Professor,

HonestLib on February 7, 2014 at 3:44 PM

FWIW, we don’t call him “professor” out of respect for his position. Often it’s laughing at posts like the one above, consistently unrelated citations, or his tendency to exhibit laughably bad basic math skills.

Oh, and his inability to understand why he should save for retirement.

Regardless, you’d probably do better just saying “libfreeordie” if you’re not laughing at him.

rogerb on February 7, 2014 at 5:00 PM
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Not sure of your point. But to be honest we laugh at a lot of those that vote with us….including libby. A vote for our side, no matter from who, is a vote that counts. The reason Al Franken won is that about 900 felons voted in that election and 747 went our way. If I remember correctly he won by 350ish votes. Once a vote is cast, no matter if it is illegal, it becomes legal.

I would also change whatever amendment that states that all children that are born in the U.S are automatically U.S. citizens to only those children of legal immigrant s are automatically U.S. citizens & uf any member of Congress opposes that, I will cut off any federal fundung & end welfare permanently & any Congress person that opposes that, I will personally cut off federal funding to that person.

How many Non illegals … or persons currently NOT receiving at least 2 types of benefits from the government (welfare, food stamps, Obama-phones, etc) did they actually question during this poll?!

Those who benefit the most from amnesty, especially without ensuring the border is secure/illegal immigration ends, fall into 2 groups:
1. ILLEGALS
2. Liberal politicians seeking to BUY illegal/new citizen votes to stay in power.

We went through this already. We made millions of illegals citizens and vowed to start over & stop the problem. Here we are again with our politicians selling us the same ol’ dead fish in the very same piece of fish-wrap. 1) Insanity is doing the same thing over & over and expecting a different outcome…. 2) Fool me once, shame on yo….Fool me twice, and I am either an ignorant dumb@$$ who is so stupid I shouldn’t be allowed to vote, an illegal who has voted in every election for the last 10 years, or a politician who thinks YOU are stupid enough to let them pull the ‘bait and switch’ ‘amnesty 1st THEN border security’ BS again.

…..Mass deportation is totally feasible.You anti-American working middle class leftists think if you keep saying it people will buy it.Where there’s a will there’s a way.You leftists don’t have the will because you don’t believe in the rule of law and care more about big business getting their cheap labor than you do for the American workers!

Absolutely this is what it’s all about!
Secure the borders take away all the freebees for illegals and watch how fast they go back to Maaaayheeecoe. Once employer hiring rules are tightened up and the law is finally enforced the illegals will be gone.
Our country has been under attack by the communists now in power who use every way possible to destroy the country. Immigration being only one of them.
Throw in bozos like Boehner constantly trying to protect his million dollar per year job after politics with one of the multi-nationals who currently feed him/rnc dough to do their bidding and you have a perfect storm.
Believe it or not Limbaugh caught Boehner in one of his biggest cons. Boehner’s plan was to thread the needle by passing an immigration bill (that surely would have been EOed to death by the regime)and still eek out a small victory in 2014 even with many very pissed off conservatives.
Rush called him on it and hours later Boehner announced there would probably be no immigration bill before the elections since he couldn’t trust zero.
What a startling revelation! You can’t trust the regime.
We need to keep lighting fires under the rino asses of the GOP-e if we want even a chance to save the country.

If the Republican Party goes along with amnesty or even legalization …they can kiss their collective butts goodbye. This will literally be the final nail in the coffin of the Republicans as a viable political party. You can’t survive if all you do is push tax cuts and opt to use force whenever someone overseas does something you don’t like. That’s not enough to get people to turn out at the polls on election day…but that’s all they have to offer these days. The local Republicans will last a little longer, but they too will eventually go the way of the dodo. People like me, and there are millions of us, are at the tipping point…the point where we say “WTF” and stop participating in politics. There’s no reason to vote for a Republican who will do exactly the same thing as the Democrat on every major issue…with the only real difference being the Republican wants to give the DOD everything they want…and even some things they don’t need.

No one thinks mass deportation is feasible. Hardly anyone’s suggesting it anymore.

WRONG.

In reality, few BELIEVE the govt. is willing to enforce the laws.

IF there was a decision to enforce our laws, then, “mass deportation is feasible” — noting that “mass deportation” is a weird phrase.

Deportation of illegal aliens, one at a time, is entirely possible, “feasible” and is the law in almost all cases of illegal immigration, except by those who claim asylum for political, religious reasons and even in those circumstances, credibility is not reliable.

If the Republican Party goes along with amnesty or even legalization …they can kiss their collective butts goodbye. This will literally be the final nail in the coffin of the Republicans as a viable political party…

Is it ethical for “news” organizations to conduct and publish push polls?

RightKlik on February 7, 2014 at 7:27 PM

Is it ethical for “news” propaganda organizations to conduct and publish push polls and call these news?

FIFW

brentspolemics on February 7, 2014 at 7:35 PM

The poll results from Leftwing media sites/orgs always reflect their Leftwing visitors — and, many Leftwingers get various newsletter/emails advising them of “hey, there’s a poll at…” so they then visit and participate, whether repeat visitor or not.

ABC polls, CBS polls, CNN and especially MSNBC polls — any site that hinges on linkage to HuffPo, among others — their “poll results” always result in Leftwing opinion. Because their only or majority participants are Leftwingers.

No one thinks mass deportation is feasible. Hardly anyone’s suggesting it anymore.

WRONG.

In reality, few BELIEVE the govt. is willing to enforce the laws.

IF there was a decision to enforce our laws, then, “mass deportation is feasible” — noting that “mass deportation” is a weird phrase.

Deportation of illegal aliens, one at a time, is entirely possible, “feasible” and is the law in almost all cases of illegal immigration, except by those who claim asylum for political, religious reasons and even in those circumstances, credibility is not reliable.

Lourdes on February 7, 2014 at 11:37 PM

And that phrase, “mass deportations,” is agitprop. It’s tradecraft language, an effort to present a lawful result being applied by affixing a degree of distasteful emotional character to it: “mass” as in, “group” or, as is being implied, “generalization” or…the dreaded “racial” or “ethnic.”

“Round up the mass and deport them” is what that phrase implies, which realistically alarms anyone who is concerned with fair application of our laws, and enforcement of them.

No one wants to see any generalized human type, race, ethnicity, whatever, “rounded up” and sent packing based upon their shared characteristic. BUT in the case of illegal aliens, their BEHAVIOR merits application of our laws and the penalty for such is usually deportation, as it should be.

Enforcement is what is at stake here. Based upon behavior by some, violating our nation’s laws. No “mass” or generalized prejudice but only proper application of laws against illegal behavior.

An obviously “scientific” poll conducted with a 75% La Raza member sample.

ConstantineXI on February 7, 2014 at 11:38 AM

Yes, that’s the sum of it.

Anyone who assumes this “poll result” reflects a changing US demographic has limited scope. CNN, the poll host, isn’t known for being a popular site with anyone except the Left and even the Left isn’t keeping it afloat with viewers/participants. Same with all Leftmedia.
Poll a Leftwinger, get a Leftwing result.

…Revise Birthright Citizenship (“anchor babies”) so that at least one married parent has some U.S.legal status.

ncinca on February 7, 2014 at 12:54 PM

Agreed. Because that is necessary to accomplish before any “guest worker program” can ever be implemented, at least as to any credibly functional one at what it claims it’s to accomplish.

Congress *must* eliminate “birth right citizenship” from all participants in any guest worker program AND keep any guest worker program entirely separate from immigration. Participants in one or the other, in other words, with no comingling of circumstances.

I’m sick and tired of dishonest polls that try to manipulate public consensus. Bottom line here is that I don’t give a rat’s hind leg about what’s good for the GOP politically. If I can’t tell the difference between a Republican and a Democrat… they might as well all be Democrats.

Thought it was understood that legalization was essentially the whole ball game: citizenship would inevitably follow after all the bleeding heart crying. I.e. Legalization = amnesty & a big magnet for more illegals & millions more democrats voting.

Together with their wife/common law spouse, children, parents, in-laws, brothers and sisters, nearly all who do not have jobs. But they never ask about that.

Ask about legalization vs. active deportation of a single employed person and the results are not surprising. Especially in light of the time and space the media has given, since Romney’s remarks, to the phantom idea of mass deportation.