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What did you like about the Krell? Just trying to get a feel for what is important to you and the sort of sound you are after.

The Classe has built-in 5-band per channel PEQ, but it will either take a professional acoustician to measure your room and set the filters, or a good working knowledge of using and RTA yourself. You will also need your own RTA software and measuring mic, stand, etc. It is not an auto-cal like Audyssey.

You can find my review of the sound of the 800 on the previous page of this thread.

Tim,

The music was very natural it was very easy to listen too it was not fatiguing it was if you were there live. The only time I have heard better was with the high-end Boulder mono blocks with with wilson X2 which is in a totally different league. I was unable to listen it in multi channel because I was not aware at the time it was unable to process HD formats, and had a bad unit.

The Classe has built-in 5-band per channel PEQ, but it will either take a professional acoustician to measure your room and set the filters, or a good working knowledge of using and RTA yourself. You will also need your own RTA software and measuring mic, stand, etc. It is not an auto-cal like Audyssey.

Well I've been going through some birthing pains over the past few days as the SSP-800 returned to sounding lean and mid-forward. Frankly this threw me for a loop and I was starting to doubt what I thought I heard the second night.

However, things shifted again last night for the better. Back was this wonderfully transparent, smooth, yet detailed sound. Not lean or bright, but also not warm or lush-- pure. (Yes, yes, I know, break-in is all in my mind.)

Just so you know, I've been using two compilation discs I made for speaker auditions as my reference point and sprinkling some other music discs in there to break up the monotony.

I listened to my original compilation disc last night and I have to say that I thoroughly enjoyed 90% of that disc, and the other 10% was not bothersome, just not up to the same standard as the rest of the tracks and could very well be blamed on the recording. This is the same disc that sounded great on the 2nd night and less than great the 1st night (and several of the nights after the 2nd). Many of the tracks on this disc have exhibited grain on the vocals and/or sibilance. While the other tracks were selected because while the overall recording and music is good, they all contain something that annoys me, like hot or sour sounding notes.

One thing that really stood out, and it was something I was not expecting at all, is that many of the tracks that contained what I thought were hot/peaky notes were still dynamic through the SPP-800, but no longer peaky sounding. When playing these same tracks on my previous Lexicon prepro, there were certain notes that would grab my ears and make me want to turn the volume down, but at the same time this meant that overall volume was too low for my liking. These hot notes would literally make me wince and tighten up a bit when I knew they were coming. I was sure that this was room interaction causing these hot notes, but through the Classe I would brace my self as usual for the attack on my ears, but every time the offensive notes just flowed out in a very pleasantly dynamic way. In retrospect, it's as if the Lex was farting out dynamics with no regard for control. The Classe handles dynamics in a more refined and listenable way. I have to say again how surprised I was to hear these hot notes go away, especially when I was certain that it was the room causing the problem.

About the vocal grain. The first track on my demo disc, The Ubiquitous Mr. Lovegrove by Dead Can Dance had this grain / electronic hash that would ride along the top of the male singer's voice when listened to through the Lexicon. It was mild, but very distracting to me. Almost like they recorded his voice through a telephone. That's an exaggeration, but it gives some idea of the quality of sound. With the SSP-800 I waited, and I waited, and I listened very intently . . . and then I played the track again, but the grain was gone. I could still hear a slight rasp to the singers voice, but it was clear that this was a character of his voice and not something added by the playback chain. What a relief that was. I have been trying to get rid of that digital sounding artifact for months and I was starting to think that this just wasn't that great of a recording to begin with.

Now things were not 100% perfect, and I could still sense a bit of overemphasis on the breath of the singer on some tracks and a vocal little leanness on others, but even if the SSP-800 remained in this state, it is a vast improvement over the Lex. I never thought I would say that, and frankly I find it completely surprising how easy it is for me to tell the difference between the sound of the Classe and the Lexicon, considering that I was traveling further and further down the "amps all sound the same" road.

Off topic, but have I mentioned how much I love my new JL sub? Compact, powerful, tuneful, tight. It's all I could ask for and a marked improvement over my previous sub in terms of attack and punch.

I don't know what the next few days will bring with the SSP-800, but as long as it keep moving towards the sound I heard last night, things are looking very good.

Isn't the REW a PC based RTA? Well, anyway REW is exactly what I was referring to when I said RTA and it is what I use.

RTA is a system which shows the magnitude of the signal across the frequency spectrum at any particular time and, yes, REW can do RTA. However, what is really needed to develop and test the filters in a roomEQ is a waterfall display that adds the time dimension to the frequency and magnitude axes.

RTA is a system which shows the magnitude of the signal across the frequency spectrum at any particular time and, yes, REW can do RTA. However, what is really needed to develop and test the filters in a roomEQ is a waterfall display that adds the time dimension to the frequency and magnitude axes.

Since the SSP-800 uses PEQ, shouldn't analysis of FR be all you need? I suppose that you could notch out a resonance with PEQ, but those usually show up as a peak in the FR, so you end up making the same correction anyway right?

Well I've been going through some birthing pains over the past few days as the SSP-800 returned to sounding lean and mid-forward. Frankly this threw me for a loop and I was starting to doubt what I thought I heard the second night.

However, things shifted again last night for the better. Back was this wonderfully transparent, smooth, yet detailed sound. Not lean or bright, but also not warm or lush-- pure. (Yes, yes, I know, break-in is all in my mind.)

Just so you know, I've been using two compilation discs I made for speaker auditions as my reference point and sprinkling some other music discs in there to break up the monotony.

I listened to my original compilation disc last night and I have to say that I thoroughly enjoyed 90% of that disc, and the other 10% was not bothersome, just not up to the same standard as the rest of the tracks and could very well be blamed on the recording. This is the same disc that sounded great on the 2nd night and less than great the 1st night (and several of the nights after the 2nd). Many of the tracks on this disc have exhibited grain on the vocals and/or sibilance. While the other tracks were selected because while the overall recording and music is good, they all contain something that annoys me, like hot or sour sounding notes.

One thing that really stood out, and it was something I was not expecting at all, is that many of the tracks that contained what I thought were hot/peaky notes were still dynamic through the SPP-800, but no longer peaky sounding. When playing these same tracks on my previous Lexicon prepro, there were certain notes that would grab my ears and make me want to turn the volume down, but at the same time this meant that overall volume was too low for my liking. These hot notes would literally make me wince and tighten up a bit when I knew they were coming. I was sure that this was room interaction causing these hot notes, but through the Classe I would brace my self as usual for the attack on my ears, but every time the offensive notes just flowed out in a very pleasantly dynamic way. In retrospect, it's as if the Lex was farting out dynamics with no regard for control. The Classe handles dynamics in a more refined and listenable way. I have to say again how surprised I was to hear these hot notes go away, especially when I was certain that it was the room causing the problem.

About the vocal grain. The first track on my demo disc, The Ubiquitous Mr. Lovegrove by Dead Can Dance had this grain / electronic hash that would ride along the top of the male singer's voice when listened to through the Lexicon. It was mild, but very distracting to me. Almost like they recorded his voice through a telephone. That's an exaggeration, but it gives some idea of the quality of sound. With the SSP-800 I waited, and I waited, and I listened very intently . . . and then I played the track again, but the grain was gone. I could still hear a slight rasp to the singers voice, but it was clear that this was a character of his voice and not something added by the playback chain. What a relief that was. I have been trying to get rid of that digital sounding artifact for months and I was starting to think that this just wasn't that great of a recording to begin with.

Now things were not 100% perfect, and I could still sense a bit of overemphasis on the breath of the singer on some tracks and a vocal little leanness on others, but even if the SSP-800 remained in this state, it is a vast improvement over the Lex. I never thought I would say that, and frankly I find it completely surprising how easy it is for me to tell the difference between the sound of the Classe and the Lexicon, considering that I was traveling further and further down the "amps all sound the same" road.

Off topic, but have I mentioned how much I love my new JL sub? Compact, powerful, tuneful, tight. It's all I could ask for and a marked improvement over my previous sub in terms of attack and punch.

I don't know what the next few days will bring with the SSP-800, but as long as it keep moving towards the sound I heard last night, things are looking very good.

Tim,

Once again, a very interesting and informative review. I will admit to being somewhat perplexed by your observation that the Classe, on the first night,
"sounded a bit lean and mid-forward out the box, but transparent, detailed and neutral on the second day," and then on subsequent days, back to the lean and mid-forward sound, and then last night the sound was similar to the great sound you heard on the second day.

ASSUMING for the sake of argument that Classe is correct when they say that the SSP-800 requires 300 hours of break in, I've always thought of this process as being linear, that is, a steady improvement in the sound of unit over time until it reaches a plateau. Is this not the case?

Well I've been going through some birthing pains over the past few days as the SSP-800 returned to sounding lean and mid-forward. Frankly this threw me for a loop and I was starting to doubt what I thought I heard the second night.

However, things shifted again last night for the better. Back was this wonderfully transparent, smooth, yet detailed sound. Not lean or bright, but also not warm or lush-- pure. (Yes, yes, I know, break-in is all in my mind.)

Just so you know, I’ve been using two compilation discs I made for speaker auditions as my reference point and sprinkling some other music discs in there to break up the monotony.

I listened to my original compilation disc last night and I have to say that I thoroughly enjoyed 90% of that disc, and the other 10% was not bothersome, just not up to the same standard as the rest of the tracks and could very well be blamed on the recording. This is the same disc that sounded great on the 2nd night and less than great the 1st night (and several of the nights after the 2nd). Many of the tracks on this disc have exhibited grain on the vocals and/or sibilance. While the other tracks were selected because while the overall recording and music is good, they all contain something that annoys me, like hot or sour sounding notes.

One thing that really stood out, and it was something I was not expecting at all, is that many of the tracks that contained what I thought were hot/peaky notes were still dynamic through the SPP-800, but no longer peaky sounding. When playing these same tracks on my previous Lexicon prepro, there were certain notes that would “grab” my ears and make me want to turn the volume down, but at the same time this meant that overall volume was too low for my liking. These hot notes would literally make me wince and tighten up a bit when I knew they were coming. I was sure that this was room interaction causing these hot notes, but through the Classe I would brace my self as usual for the attack on my ears, but every time the offensive notes just flowed out in a very pleasantly dynamic way. In retrospect, it’s as if the Lex was farting out dynamics with no regard for control. The Classe handles dynamics in a more refined and listenable way. I have to say again how surprised I was to hear these hot notes go away, especially when I was certain that it was the room causing the problem.

About the vocal grain. The first track on my demo disc, “The Ubiquitous Mr. Lovegrove” by Dead Can Dance had this grain / electronic hash that would ride along the top of the male singer’s voice when listened to through the Lexicon. It was mild, but very distracting to me. Almost like they recorded his voice through a telephone. That’s an exaggeration, but it gives some idea of the quality of sound. With the SSP-800 I waited, and I waited, and I listened very intently . . . and then I played the track again, but the grain was gone. I could still hear a slight rasp to the singers voice, but it was clear that this was a character of his voice and not something added by the playback chain. What a relief that was. I have been trying to get rid of that digital sounding artifact for months and I was starting to think that this just wasn't that great of a recording to begin with.

Now things were not 100% perfect, and I could still sense a bit of overemphasis on the breath of the singer on some tracks and a vocal little leanness on others, but even if the SSP-800 remained in this state, it is a vast improvement over the Lex. I never thought I would say that, and frankly I find it completely surprising how easy it is for me to tell the difference between the sound of the Classe and the Lexicon, considering that I was traveling further and further down the "amps all sound the same" road.

Off topic, but have I mentioned how much I love my new JL sub? Compact, powerful, tuneful, tight. It’s all I could ask for and a marked improvement over my previous sub in terms of attack and punch.

I don’t know what the next few days will bring with the SSP-800, but as long as it keep moving towards the sound I heard last night, things are looking very good.

I agree, very interesting indeed Tim, out of curiosity what speakers are you using, the Revels or the WB... I'm sorry if you mention this in some above post...I just fell in this thread from ( We're back and a new "journey" has begun: amps and preamps )

Once again, a very interesting and informative review. I will admit to being somewhat perplexed by your observation that the Classe, on the first night,
"sounded a bit lean and mid-forward out the box, but transparent, detailed and neutral on the second day," and then on subsequent days, back to the lean and mid-forward sound, and then last night the sound was similar to the great sound you heard on the second day.

ASSUMING for the sake of argument that Classe is correct when they say that the SSP-800 requires 300 hours of break in, I've always thought of this process as being linear, that is, a steady improvement in the sound of unit over time until it reaches a plateau. Is this not the case?

Again, please Tim, keep the information coming. Thanks.

Jeff.

Doesn't make sense to me either. Hell, up to this point I put break-in on the same shelf as fairy dust. There is one other owner that has reported similar ups and downs. Unless mine is malfunctioning? We'll see at the 300 hour mark. If the sound doesn't stablize by then, I will see about having it checked out.

I agree, very interesting indeed Tim, out of curiosity what speakers are you using, the Revels or the WB... I'm sorry if you mention this in some above post...I just fell in this thread from ( We're back and a new "journey" has begun: amps and preamps )

Great insight thanks

Djoel

Hey Joel, or is that DJ?

I've still got the front three Revels at the moment. The WB's won't be here for another month.

Funny thing is, that when the SSP-800 is firing on all cylinders, the music flowing through the Revels is pristine and they almost completely shed their lab-coat. If I hadn’t already heard the WB’s, and if I weren’t wanting to go with a sub/sat system, I don’t think I would be too eager to part with the Revels. The WB’s still line up with my preferences better though, and I think that they will pair up nicely with the SSP-800.

Doesn't make sense to me either. Hell, up to this point I put break-in on the same shelf as fairy dust. There is one other owner that has reported similar ups and downs. Unless mine is malfunctioning? We'll see at the 300 hour mark. If the sound doesn't stablize by then, I will see about having it checked out.

Tim
My Odyssey amps did exactly the same thing. Initially out of the box; harsh, lacking bass, almost piercing. Then got better, bass tightened up but the highs were still sharp. At about 300-400 hours, as Klaus said, it warmed up and jelled together. I can't describe it, doesn't make since. I have been gone a lot, so it's not like I sat and listened for 300 hours and my mind made them sound better; I just let them run while I was gone for sometimes 3 weeks at a time and they got better. I'm sure "someone" will scoff this, oh well.
Who knows
Mark

Glad to hear that it all worked its self out in the end. It certainly lends credibility to phenomenon that you were away from the equipement and like you said, not just getting used to it through daily listening.

Even though I would have scoffed at the idea of break-in as little as a few months ago, you just don't know until you experience it. You can go through a number of components that show no signs of change with break-in, but that doesn't make it true for all.

Since the SSP-800 uses PEQ, shouldn't analysis of FR be all you need? I suppose that you could notch out a resonance with PEQ, but those usually show up as a peak in the FR, so you end up making the same correction anyway right?

Well, you could. OTOH, since you have only one mic effective on an RTA and only a few bands in the PEQ, you really want to use each filter effectively. Some peaks/dips of the same magnitude have more decay issues than others. Those are the ones you must attend to and you need to see them from more than on mic position. Moreover, you need to see effect of the filter in the time domain.

Perhaps, Classe's decision to not include a measurement/setup system implies that they expect a fairly professional use of it by someone with the right tools.

My SSP-800 just arrived and it gets installed tomorrow.
I'll post a full review and list of the other system components. I am not alone when I say many of us have had our theaters on stand by waiting for this unit.

My SSP-800 just arrived and it gets installed tomorrow.
I'll post a full review and list of the other system components. I am not alone when I say many of us have had our theaters on stand by waiting for this unit.

Congrats! I've had mine for about a month and like it a lot, though now that it has passed the 300 hour break-in mark, I have no speakers at the moment. Those are about another 2 weeks away from arriving.

Install went as smoother then I thought it was going to be. It took about an hour to get the SSP-800 integrated into my monster rack and wired. It took another 25 mins to go through the set up, really a piece of cake. It took about 15 mins to get the unit up and running and about another 30 mins of fine tuning. In discrete which is all I had time to test last night, the unit switched flawlessly. I through everything under the sun at it, 7.1 PCM, DoLBy True HD, Master DTS, BD, HD, SACD.
My first impressions of the unit are pretty much what I expected, just a fantastic unit for the money.
I am running, McIntosh amps, B&W 7.1, etc, etc. I have the control4 guys coming back out next week to get the programming done and then I will post a full review of music and movies. Going from the Onkyo to this is like to going from a VW to a Ferrari. Any flaws? Yes, it doesn't make popcorn and it wont clean the house

Install went as smoother then I thought it was going to be. It took about an hour to get the SSP-800 integrated into my monster rack and wired. It took another 25 mins to go through the set up, really a piece of cake. It took about 15 mins to get the unit up and running and about another 30 mins of fine tuning. In discrete which is all I had time to test last night, the unit switched flawlessly. I through everything under the sun at it, 7.1 PCM, DoLBy True HD, Master DTS, BD, HD, SACD.
My first impressions of the unit are pretty much what I expected, just a fantastic unit for the money.
I am running, McIntosh amps, B&W 7.1, etc, etc. I have the control4 guys coming back out next week to get the programming done and then I will post a full review of music and movies. Going from the Onkyo to this is like to going from a VW to a Ferrari. Any flaws? Yes, it doesn't make popcorn and it wont clean the house

Install went as smoother then I thought it was going to be. It took about an hour to get the SSP-800 integrated into my monster rack and wired. It took another 25 mins to go through the set up, really a piece of cake. It took about 15 mins to get the unit up and running and about another 30 mins of fine tuning. In discrete which is all I had time to test last night, the unit switched flawlessly. I through everything under the sun at it, 7.1 PCM, DoLBy True HD, Master DTS, BD, HD, SACD.
My first impressions of the unit are pretty much what I expected, just a fantastic unit for the money.
I am running, McIntosh amps, B&W 7.1, etc, etc. I have the control4 guys coming back out next week to get the programming done and then I will post a full review of music and movies. Going from the Onkyo to this is like to going from a VW to a Ferrari. Any flaws? Yes, it doesn't make popcorn and it wont clean the house

How did you throw audio codes at it that it cannot process?? It can only handle LPCM, it cannot bitstream the HDMI 1.3 high resolution audio formats.

he had to of done processing in the source, but he still can play all of the hi-res codecs.

I just don't understand why people think that if the proc doesn't do the decoding, it is inferior. time to change your paradigm.

I fully understand what he was saying, but thanks anyway
All he did was LPCM if the decoding was all done in the player. They are all methonds for unpacking the PCM, so if it was decoded in the player than that is what he did. I know you are compelled to defend your dollars spent.

I fully understand what he was saying, but thanks anyway
All he did was LPCM if the decoding was all done in the player. They are all methonds for unpacking the PCM, so if it was decoded in the player than that is what he did. I know you are compelled to defend your dollars spent.

no, im compelled to question you and your paradigm... or stigmatism as it may be.

but if you want to believe that on board processing is any better, or yields different results, you go ahead with that thinking.

ask not what you can do for your country, but what your country can do for you.

All he did was LPCM if the decoding was all done in the player. They are all methonds for unpacking the PCM, so if it was decoded in the player than that is what he did. I know you are compelled to defend your dollars spent.

It is still lossless and no different the decoding it in the processor or receiver, infact you are suopose to use LCPM and decode everything in the source, just have a look at what happened with iron man on blu ray.

It is still lossless and no different the decoding it in the processor or receiver, infect you are suppose to use LCPM and decode everything in the source, just have a look at what happened with iron man on blu ray.

So you are saying it is better to decode in a $300 blu Ray player rather than in the $8000 Classé SSP-800 when it is upgraded?

My SSP-800 just arrived and it gets installed tomorrow.
I'll post a full review and list of the other system components. I am not alone when I say many of us have had our theaters on stand by waiting for this unit.

If you could post a couple of pictures of your system, that would be welcome as well.