Everyone keeps complaining about all the small school players we took. But you know what? I've actually heard about these players and seen them ranked by everyone which is why I like our draft and think it's one of the better ones I saw this weekend. Do you realize how many teams drafted players in the top 5 rounds that I never even heard of? Now that's bad drafting or reaching(whatever you want to call it). Taking small school players is not bad drafting.

Miami got 2 of the top 10 offensive linemen. Pretty smart move considering it was our weakest part of the team. They got one of the most clutch receivers in this draft and an eventual starter.In the 4th round they got a mammoth corner to add to an already talented secondary.In the 5th round they got the 6th best tight end on some websites boards. Not sure how anyone can complain about that. And the other 5th round pick is an Uber-versatile linebacker that draft analysts were raving about leading up to the draft.Can't say I know much about the receiver Hazel but he looked pretty impressive in those highlights.terence Fede was on lists of the top small school players.

So I am very satisfied with how Hickey did in his first draft in Miami.

The teams that should be complaining are as follows.

Cleveland Browns:Your team enters this draft with a mountain of picks. Your superstar receiver is busted on his 3rd drug offense. You're sitting in the Sammy Watkins draft slot and you trade out of it???? What? and for Justin Gilbert? Oh and then you go 7 rounds without drafting a wide receiver? WHAT???? EPIC FAILSo who will Johnny Football be throwing to opening day? Greg Little and Travis Benjamin? LOL

Dallas Cowboys:Your defense got completely picked apart in the offseason you need 3 starters in the front 7 and you draft Zack Martin? Here's one of those teams that took a guy I never saw on any ranking list in the 4th round. They also did that last year.

They're making fun of Ray Farmer right now on ESPN for not taking a single receiver , when in fact he needed one in round 1.

We could trade them Matthews. Haha

Mon May 12, 2014 1:54 pm

ag_fin_90

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Re: Miami not even close to one of the worst drafts

People have to realize that at least 2 guys are almost guaranteed to play and i wouldnt be shocked if up to 5 of the guys get good playing time. Say what you want but a team who i can look and say shouldve ben a 10 win team who does that did a good job ijs

Mon May 12, 2014 1:55 pm

Phins Rock

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Re: Miami not even close to one of the worst drafts

I don't post on here anymore, but I logged in and saw this, and thought I would just give my 2 cents.

Everyone has vast scouting departments; guys who are not only watching tape all season, but are going to schools getting a look at players in practice and games in person, talking to coaches, teammates, all the way down to equipment managers to get a sense of who these players are on and off the field. You then have scouting coordinators, directors, and other personnel staff who are constantly cross-referencing each other's work, watching tape, and compiling their own opinions.

Then coaches get involved in the Off Season, other top personnel execs, etc.

My point is so much work goes into every single player that it is silly to sit here and say "they drafted poorly/well" based on who that team took. While some teams scout better than others, to me the difference is not in the players taken. The difference is in how teams attack the draft and build the roster as a whole. The teams that reach for need, and draft positions in each round rather than players tend to not do as well, in my opinion. The teams that prioritize the premium spots your scheme dictates, and then drafts the best players available relative to that, are the teams that do well.

The other factor is luck. At the end of the day, with what I just said above, every team has the resources and intellect in the building to draft well. Luck is a huge factor, as is coaching…Who was giving Seattle's drafts A's and B's over the last few years? Nobody. You look back at them now, and they were stacked with talent from top to bottom. On the opposite end, Bellichick was praised for years with his drafts between around 2009 through 2012, and look at the amount of misses in them.

You criticize the Patriots for taking guys with injury concerns, and the Browns for not taking a receiver early. It could be that Easley recovers from his ACL better than ever and becomes dominant, Jimmy Garrapolo becomes a phenomenal QB for them, Stork and Fleming are long term starters, etc. It could also be that none of them pan out as planned. It could be that the WR the Browns would have taken in round 2 ends up being a bust, and Bitonio an All Pro lineman.

We don't know anything. I can sit here and say this and that about what I think the players Miami, or any other team drafted, will become. But I have no idea, nor does Dennis Hickey, or anyone else. I think the thing you can judge is in how they handled the draft as a whole. Did they reach for needs, or attack their board vertically with need being a minimal factor? I don't know. We can all have our opinions there.

You criticize them for taking Gilbert and a #1 next year rather than taking Sammy at #4. What if Gilbert turns into the next Jonathan Joseph and that #1 next year is another top 10 pick?

Swerve, I'm not blasting you. Just saying to judge drafts now, and say "this team did better than this team", is pointless.

One thing I will say is that "needing to take position X" in a certain round is a recipe for disaster. Hopefully that's not the reason James was taken in the first, or Landry in the 2nd. If so, as of now it was a poor draft. If they attacked their board vertically, as of now it was a good one.

My opinion on Miami's draft is this: They passed up on (in my opinion) more high-cieling talent at the top for safer, more immediate impact players. I think the O-line will be above average in pass protection next season, but run blocking could be an issue. Turner is a big, long player with no college experience (to my knowledge) at OG. For a long player to get his hands up, inside quickly and win the leverage battle, it takes a lot of technique and fundamental work. I think his run blocking in the short term will show flashes, especially when he gets out in space, and over time will be devastating. In 2014 I think we'll see struggles. James' strength is not his run blocking, nor is Albert's. Combined with Miami's backfield, and I see running the ball being difficult. Lamar is going to have to develop as a good shot-gun runner, which I don't see his skill set as such.

The small school thing doesn't concern me. Again, scouts and the entire personnel department know what they're doing. It's more about applying them to the offense/defense than the evaluation of the level of talent of the player himself. I will say it will probably take more time to develop those guys, as they get used to the speed/size of the NFL game (Turner included).

Overall, it was a draft that attacked short term needs throughout. As long as they followed their board vertically, I would be fine as a Dolphins fan. If they reached and attacked positions rather than players in each round, I'd be concerned.

Mon May 12, 2014 2:05 pm

Rock Sexton

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Re: Miami not even close to one of the worst drafts

Phins Rock wrote:

I think the thing you can judge is in how they handled the draft as a whole. Did they reach for needs, or attack their board vertically with need being a minimal factor? I don't know. We can all have our opinions there.

Kudos. I agree completely and said the same thing in another thread

Quote:

My opinion on Miami's draft is this: They passed up on (in my opinion) more high-cieling talent at the top for safer, more immediate impact players. I think the O-line will be above average in pass protection next season, but run blocking could be an issue. Turner is a big, long player with no college experience (to my knowledge) at OG. For a long player to get his hands up, inside quickly and win the leverage battle, it takes a lot of technique and fundamental work. I think his run blocking in the short term will show flashes, especially when he gets out in space, and over time will be devastating. In 2014 I think we'll see struggles. James' strength is not his run blocking, nor is Albert's. Combined with Miami's backfield, and I see running the ball being difficult. Lamar is going to have to develop as a good shot-gun runner, which I don't see his skill set as such.

I too have major concerns about the running game based on the O-line as it's being assembled.

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Mon May 12, 2014 2:16 pm

Rich

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Re: Miami not even close to one of the worst drafts

Rock Sexton wrote:

I too have major concerns about the running game based on the O-line as it's being assembled.

The Dolphins seemed to have structured their offensive line so that the tackles focus on pass protection while the guards and center focus on the run. Shelley Smith is supposed to be a very good run blocker. Can't comment on the rookie guard since he played tackle in college.

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Mon May 12, 2014 3:08 pm

Rock Sexton

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Re: Miami not even close to one of the worst drafts

Rich wrote:

The Dolphins seemed to have structured their offensive line so that the tackles focus on pass protection while the guards and center focus on the run. Shelley Smith is supposed to be a very good run blocker. Can't comment on the rookie guard since he played tackle in college.

Thus far then it's Smith and Pouncey in regards to any credible run blocking abilities, but most of our guys are not inside runners.

Worries me that we'd be tipping our caps too often with weak run blocking on the outside and we'll continue to be too pass dominant to try and set up the run.

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Mon May 12, 2014 3:12 pm

Rich

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Re: Miami not even close to one of the worst drafts

Rock Sexton wrote:

Rich wrote:

The Dolphins seemed to have structured their offensive line so that the tackles focus on pass protection while the guards and center focus on the run. Shelley Smith is supposed to be a very good run blocker. Can't comment on the rookie guard since he played tackle in college.

Thus far then it's Smith and Pouncey in regards to any credible run blocking abilities, but most of our guys are not inside runners.

Worries me that we'd be tipping our caps too often with weak run blocking on the outside and we'll continue to be too pass dominant to try and set up the run.

Well, Albert is not a world-beater at run blocking, but he isn't horrible at it either. He's middle of the road.

James scouting report says he is powerful at the point of attack and can drive defenders, the concern is that because of his height, he can ocassionally struggle with pad level, which is more important in the run.

Zone blocking is designed to overcome some of the challenges the tackles may face in run blocking. It just didn't work with Clabo or McKinney because neither of them are zone guys.

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Mon May 12, 2014 3:18 pm

DanRambo

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Re: Miami not even close to one of the worst drafts

Lynch on the outside will help for our blocking too. I see our RB's getting a lot of screens this year...Miller especially.

Mon May 12, 2014 3:27 pm

shularino

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Re: Miami not even close to one of the worst drafts

Hickey showed me a lot.............there are a lot of very good players in Div 2............our own Brent Grimes came from Div 3...........yes 3.......Shippensburg U. A lot of GMs just give Div 2 or 3 a cursory look, he obviously wanted his guys looking there for late round prospects.

Mon May 12, 2014 5:32 pm

swerve13

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Re: Miami not even close to one of the worst drafts

I'd rather reach for needs than not fill any needs at all. Could you imagine the uproar on these boards if Miami was without a # 1 receiver and went the entire draft without picking a single wide receiver? Value or not, that's just plain stupidity.

Supposedly Giants GM Jerry Reese is big on taking BPA all the time and ESPN just had an entire piece on how bad his drafts have been lately. So to say picking by need is a disaster waiting to happen???? Is there really any absolute proof you can show me?

I don't like to reach on needs in the top 45 or so. After that i don't have a problem filling needs. If you're sitting at pick 56 and there's a receiver on your board rated 52nd and a defensive end rated 55th....but you're loaded at receiver and don't have any good ends...you take the defensive end!You cant fill every hole in free agency.

Last edited by swerve13 on Tue May 13, 2014 1:45 am, edited 1 time in total.

Mon May 12, 2014 11:33 pm

wkloiber13

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Re: Miami not even close to one of the worst drafts

There are a couple things that worry me about this draft class. Number one, we drafted two wideouts. This makes me wonder about the health of Hartline and Gibson going into the season. Are the Dolphins just being overly cautious? Or is the medical staff telling them to be prepared to be without them at 100% come the beginning of the season? Number two, is Miami ready to go into the season with two rookies starting on the right side (James and Turner)? Or do they intend to sign a stop-gap to play right guard while Turner develops? All of that said, this draft could have gone a lot worse. We got some good young prospects, many of whom will likely have a shot to compete for either a starting job or playing time this season.

Tue May 13, 2014 12:51 am

swerve13

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Re: Miami not even close to one of the worst drafts

Can anybody tell me if Jason Fox can play guard if he had to? Maybe right guard alongside James.

Tue May 13, 2014 1:48 am

Big Dave

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Joined: Tue Jan 12, 2010 9:41 amPosts: 10227Location: Raleigh, NC

Re: Miami not even close to one of the worst drafts

I'm a little more skeptical of small school kids, but I feel comfortable that Tone and Swerve, who know the draft better than anyone else here, know who these guys are and are excited about this draft. We've been drafting big school kids for years and I've been grading each draft at a B and been seriously disappointed.

I will say that Hickey impressed me a bit with the draft, and taking care of team problems to send out a message of what will not be tolerated (Ireland's entire time here has been one embarrassment after the next with behaviour). The players he drafted seem to be hungry with a chip on their shoulders. I think we should give Hickey the benefit of the doubt.

I'd rather reach for needs than not fill any needs at all. Could you imagine the uproar on these boards if Miami was without a # 1 receiver and went the entire draft without picking a single wide receiver? Value or not, that's just plain stupidity.

The experience of last year seemed to have influenced this year. Going into the season question marks at left tackle and right guard, not having zone blocking guys, no one who could pull...

Miami directly addressed these things in free agency and the draft.

Minus some of the linebacking issues because there was not a quick fix option, I'd say Philbin got "his" guys for need positions.

Tue May 13, 2014 8:10 am

Makchell

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Re: Miami not even close to one of the worst drafts

All we need now is Philbin and company to coach.

Tue May 13, 2014 8:32 am

Phins Rock

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Re: Miami not even close to one of the worst drafts

swerve13 wrote:

I'd rather reach for needs than not fill any needs at all. Could you imagine the uproar on these boards if Miami was without a # 1 receiver and went the entire draft without picking a single wide receiver? Value or not, that's just plain stupidity.

Supposedly Giants GM Jerry Reese is big on taking BPA all the time and ESPN just had an entire piece on how bad his drafts have been lately. So to say picking by need is a disaster waiting to happen???? Is there really any absolute proof you can show me?

I don't like to reach on needs in the top 45 or so. After that i don't have a problem filling needs. If you're sitting at pick 56 and there's a receiver on your board rated 52nd and a defensive end rated 55th....but you're loaded at receiver and don't have any good ends...you take the defensive end!You cant fill every hole in free agency.

That example is not what I meant by a reach.

A reach is committing to drafting a certain position in that round, and drafting a player you have graded significantly lower than others available. 52 and 55 at 56 isn't a reach.

Jerry Reese built two Super Bowl winners based off it. So the criticism of him is unfounded; if you draft busts you draft busts. Not sure what your point is there?

Miami, for example, have taken a needs based approach for years. They moved up for Daniel Thomas because of it. They drafted Koa Misi and John Jerry instead of one of the great TE's in that class because of it.

Last year they threw that away and took more of a BPA approach. People are critical because they didn't produce in year 1, but that's being impatient. I think last year's class will prove to be the best of Ireland's drafts.

Investing into a long term asset to fix a short term need, especially if you're passing up much greater assets, isn't the way I like to attack the draft.

Tue May 13, 2014 10:13 am

swerve13

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Re: Miami not even close to one of the worst drafts

Would like to add Colledge

Quote:

The Dolphins have also expressed interest in free agent OG Daryn Colledge.Colledge will meet with the Eagles on Tuesday. In Miami, he'd have a much better shot to start at right guard where third-round rookie Billy Turner and second-year G/T Dallas Thomas are currently expected to compete for the job.Related: DolphinsSource: Alex Marvez on Twitter

Tue May 13, 2014 11:13 am

swerve13

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Re: Miami not even close to one of the worst drafts

Quote:

Miami, for example, have taken a needs based approach for years. They moved up for Daniel Thomas because of it. They drafted Koa Misi and John Jerry instead of one of the great TE's in that class because of it.

How do you know this? How do you know they didnt have high grades on these players? Maybe they moved up for Thomas because they felt he was a steal by their own board. Jimmy Graham didn't have a very high grade by any team. Otherwise he would have gone in the top 40.I remember I thought very highly of him and was banging the table for him for Miami to pull the trigger. But he was considered a project and a 'high potential' player.

Tue May 13, 2014 11:17 am

Manhattan

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Re: Miami not even close to one of the worst drafts

shularino wrote:

Hickey showed me a lot.............there are a lot of very good players in Div 2............our own Brent Grimes came from Div 3...........yes 3.......Shippensburg U. A lot of GMs just give Div 2 or 3 a cursory look, he obviously wanted his guys looking there for late round prospects.

shippensburg is div 2

Tue May 13, 2014 11:31 am

wkloiber13

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Re: Miami not even close to one of the worst drafts

swerve13 wrote:

Can anybody tell me if Jason Fox can play guard if he had to? Maybe right guard alongside James.

He was a four year starter who split time between right and left tackle at the U. He was groomed as a project left tackle by the Lions. But he was injured a lot and never really saw the field much in Detroit. I think he's going to compete with Ja'Wuan James for the right tackle spot. Or at the bare minimum be veteran depth behind James in case the kid struggles. I think Dallas Thomas is going to be the guy competing with Billy Thomas for the right guard spot. Unless of course Miami decides to bring in some more veteran competition.