Diablo 3 Podcast #107: D3:RoS Gamescom Review Part 1

Posted By: August 26, 2013

Flux is joined by Muggs and JrMint to discuss all the new Diablo 3:Reaper of Souls content from Gamescom. Paragon 2.0, Loot 2.0, Crusader first impression, Josh Mosqueira’s enthusiasm, Legendary hunting, and more.

0:30 — Intro, Muggs and JrMint speak on their recent play experiences and RoS excite.

4:00 — Paragon 2.0 preparation. Must not die with high level Hardcore until the system goes live. Flux’s recent Witch Doctor play spurs another rant about the Demon Hunter’s lack of a death-cheating passive.

11:10 — Paragon 2.0 bonuses discussion. Hard caps on any of the bonuses?

14:50 — Inferno shock at RoS install? Will lvl 60 chars get pwned instantly by Inferno lvl 70 enemies? Have to go back to Hell to level up and hunt gear? Upcoming end game bonus content. Nephalem Trials?

20:30 — Magic Find in the Sharagon System? Still inherent bonuses, or only from assigned Paragon points?

34:00 — Joshy Woshy Mosqueira’s enthusiasm compared to Jay Wilson’s exhausted last two years of Diablo III. Finding upgrades will be amazing, or so surprising that it’s just confusing? Bro-deals make trading more fun.

41:35 — Crusader first impressions. More pro than con. More exciting to SC than HC, since HC sees sword/board Monks and Barbs all the time — who can pass for a Crusader in bad lighting.

47:00 — Legendary items in D3X… will really be that buffed and awesome? Impossible to find any specific legs with so many now possible and high levels scaling down and low levels scaling up?

52:00 — D3:RoS beta start date prediction and release date prediction? Complaints about all gear needing replacement in an expansion pack? Zero sympathy from both guests on this point.

I’m going to do some editing on the OT portions and post that at a video in our YouTube channel, and it’ll be the first (but hopefully not the last) video podcast in our series. I just haven’t had time since 1) I suck at video editing, and 2) we recorded it hours before the Gamescom PR event, and things have been kind of busy since then.

One change that you will see with the auction house in RoS is that items with 3 REALLY good mods that are missing one key mod will be worth much more than they are now.

For example, you find an amulet with 140 STR, 9% crit, 94% CD, 40 INT. This is a good amulet now, but not godly. But in RoS, with the ability to reroll that INT into attack speed, this amulet becomes extremely valuable before it’s actually been rerolled. The re-roll value will be factored into the item when it’s put on the AH.

So what we will see over time is that items with a few extremely good mods will go up in value, while the truly godly items will actually crash in value, because the mystic can easily turn a great 3 mod item into a godly 4 mod item. Everyone will have their BoA enchanted trifecta items.

I think you’re correct in the large, but I don’t see already great items dropping in value below potentially great items. Especially since you can resell those items at some point, while the ones you imbue become BoA.

I suppose it’ll depend in part on how much the Mystic’s imbues cost and how quickly they are successful; if it’s a Demonic Essence and 1m gold each time, and it’ll take you 20 or 30 rolls to get the great affix you want… that’s not a big deal on end game super quality gear, but would be quite a hurdle for a lot of non-billionaire players.

Just wanted to post and say that I had difficulty finding/subscribing to the podcast through iTunes, the iTunes link on this page goes no where. And searching for “diablo podcast” manually doesn’t seem to bring up anything incgamers related!

Finally gave up and managed to subscribe through the RSS feed though, thankfully.

Alas, none of us running the site actually use Itunes, so every time they change the the system or technical formatting on their end (which is unfortunately often) it breaks something and we don’t notice it until someone points it out.

i am listing to the podcast while i am playing my p43 dh i have 537 of mf (with 5 stacks of Nephalem) and not one legendary. I ran the whole act on mp7. I have such bad luck when it comes to legendary drops anyway. Just though I would give my 2 cents.

I’m going to do some editing on the OT portions and post that at a video in our YouTube channel, and it’ll be the first (but hopefully not the last) video podcast in our series. I just haven’t had time since 1) I suck at video editing, and 2) we recorded it hours before the Gamescom PR event, and things have been kind of busy since then.

Didn’t get a chance to hear much about the expansion before listening to this, so the podcast was very interesting to me.

Gotta say, though, I was a little disappointed with the details. I have no real problems with any of the changes, but I was hoping for, well, more. Specifically that the expansion would enable much more depth of gameplay and item hunting. No talisman or charms? No randomly-rolled gems/jewels? No effects based on elemental damage type? No rune levels? No PvP? No ladders or leagues? No Guilds? It doesn’t sound like they saved a lot of feature reveals for Blizzcon either…more like they just laid it all out there.

Considering their track record with what they promise and what they actually release with Diablo 3, I’d take a wait and see attitude before actually buying anything, otherwise you could just be throwing your money away. Most likely half of their announced “features” will be watered down or cut for release “at a later patch” (just like PvP, hmmm), or else held over till the next expansion.

Having faith in Blizzard to release something good these days is like having faith that the bottle of hydro-chloric acid in your hands will quench your thirst…

I know the podcast team this episode felt convinced that resetting gear is vital to the game, but before you commit to that opinion I have a few things to say….

When I played WoW, I got off the gear treadmill because I realized that collecting new gear is not really where the most fun is in an RPG (MMO or otherwise). The point is to PLAY THE GAME. I think this really dawned on me at some point in Alterac Valley. I realized that AV was the most fun I was having, not running on a gear treadmill.

So I changed it up. In BC I got into a 59 twink guild. Back then, battlegrounds didn’t award XP, and BGs were separated into brackets, one of them being 50-59. Those of us who decided the gear treadmill was not the way to play WoW formed these guilds. We would just play 50-59 BGs. It was TREMENDOUS fun. It was also liberating. Neverending gear upgrades are a distraction. Once you set up a playstyle where best-in-slot exists, you collect the gear and then forget about gear. Then you just PLAY.

So, we formed these guilds and we started recruiting. New recruits would come in skeptical at first. They would sound like Flux or Muggs or JrMint. They felt collecting gear was how to play. But after playing with us for a bit, the light went on, and they started getting it.

I remember after months of recruiting our guild had FINALLY turned the corner and we had enough active players so that new games could be formed up 24/7 (excluding resets). We had people on at all times wanting to play.

And then….Blizz dropped the hammer. They added xp to BGs and that effectively killed the guild. I wonder what would happened had we been given another 6 months to recruit and grow. I think it would have REALLY taken off.

Nowadays, twinking is back in WoW. This time its on trial accounts, where people level up to 20 and play WSG and AB. Same principles. Best-in-slot gear exists. You collect it, then forget about gear and just play. Trial accounts can’t form guilds unfortunately, and I don’t recruit since I figure Blizz will drop the hammer on it again without warning and kill this version. Its fun tho! There’s also level 24s for paid accounts.

As it turns out, when you remove gear from the equation, achievements seem to fill the void when needing a sense of “progress”. In the 59 twink guild, people stopped worrying about gear and worried about getting the Justicar / Conqueror titles. Currently in level 20 trial play, people stop worrying about gear and work on getting “the Bloodthirsty” title, which is acquired from 250,000 HKs. Some level 20s DO have the title, in fact.

I’d also like to point that FLUX HIMSELF made a STRONG case for moving past gear resets / the gear treadmill to the devs in his interview of them. Flux mentioned that the FIRST time they played PvP at Blizzcon, it was set up so that everyone had a premade set of gear, and they just went into the arena and fought. And Flux told the devs how this was SO MUCH FUN and everyone just lined up for hours to play it. And Flux requested they install this system into the game right now and how HAPPY everyone would be.

So when I hear that, I think Flux had a taste of D3’s version of 59 twink / 20 trial life and he REALLY REALLY enjoyed it. Maybe Flux should consider that. Instead of constantly resetting gear, let best in slot exist and refocus on other goals. Its actually a fantastic way to play RPGs…

But that’s where I’m coming from when I get upset at gear resets. Instead of gear resets, what if there was best in slot and long long long term goals from Paragon 2.0? I think it’d be much more fun from my experience…

I know the podcast team this episode felt convinced that resetting gear is vital to the game, but before you commit to that opinion I have a few things to say....
When I played WoW, I got off the gear treadmill because I realized that collecting new gear is not really where the most fun is in an RPG (MMO or otherwise).

I was going to hit this piece by piece but let me just say it is a load of tripe. ARPGs are and always have been about loot and loot progression it is all about finding the Shiney. There is not many RPGs period that are different and no ARPGs. Also twinking was not about getting off the treadmill it was people getting the best gear for a level then enchanting it with echants well beyond that level and facerolling anyone who was not a similar match. It was mostly done by people who could not pvp at top level vs equally geared people. Twinking was fun and many people did it but your example of a way to escape the gear treadmill as you call it is not the purpose. You still went out and found all the gear then you chose to stop well guess what in d3 if you don’t want to get the new gear then don’t buy the expansion. Then you won’t level and you will not have to get on your mythical treadmill. It is the same in WOW you don’t want to level don’t buy the expac or don’t level your chars or for you example get the starter so you are forced to stay at 20. No one is forcing you to upgrade but for the rest of us Jrmint and Muggs hit the nail on the head we love the loot and that is why we all play these games for the promise of that next amazing *** drop.

Thanks Jrmint and Muggs for putting into words what many of us were thinking.

Sorry you feel so upset about my comments, Prey. I’m telling you what my personal experience is with playing a gear treadmill vs best-in-slot. Do you have much experience playing a best-in-slot style of RPG? I don’t think you would be so hostile to the idea if you gave it a try…

I sacrificed a lot to run guilds in WoW. Its a lot of recruiting and organizing most shy away from. I put effort into the games I love. I’m hardly the person that would enjoy “facerolling” people. When I play I make things harder on myself. Like in D2 I never trade and play self-found in D2 and D3. I like to think I’m a pretty good guy and someone people like to play with.

She was a really good podcast guest along with Azzure. A lot of people quit D3. I’d assume they are two of them, especially if the expansion announcement didn’t even bring them back. Flux has other good guests. Neinball’s Ball of Lore. Xanth is hardcore at playing hardcore.

Is this website broken for anyone else? The front page claims 27 comments to this news post, but when I click the article I only see 4 comments. Of course, will anyone see this comment I am posting to ask about it? 🙂

I was going to hit this piece by piece but let me just say it is a load of tripe. ARPGs are and always have been about loot and loot progression it is all about finding the Shiney. There is not many RPGs period that are different and no ARPGs.

wrong. there are two schools of loot design, set and random loot. the diablo series is an example of randomized loot design. the designers set up algorithms for loot generation. conversely, the souls series is an example of set design, which means the designers coded every piece of armor, item and weapon in the entire game. one advantage of set design is it allows the designer balance the game. there is no drive too look for “the best sword in the game” because each weapon type is unique in its move set.

Sorry you feel so upset about my comments, Prey. I'm telling you what my personal experience is with playing a gear treadmill vs best-in-slot. Do you have much experience playing a best-in-slot style of RPG? I don't think you would be so hostile to the idea if you gave it a try...
I sacrificed a lot to run guilds in WoW. Its a lot of recruiting and organizing most shy away from. I put effort into the games I love. I'm hardly the person that would enjoy "facerolling" people. When I play I make things harder on myself. Like in D2 I never trade and play self-found in D2 and D3. I like to think I'm a pretty good guy and someone people like to play with.
Have you done much leading, building, or organizing?

Yes I have a ton of experience with guilds running them being officer etc. Not sure what it has to do with the loot grind or treadmill. You chose to play an MMO, which lets be clear D3 is not, in a way that still caused you to find the best loot but freeze your game. You can do that with D3 by not buying the xpac and you can continue to have best in slot gear for a lvl60 with the current game. And I am not sure what ironborn has to do with loot treadmills but I disagreed with your primary post. If blizzard did not give us all new loot people would lose it but they give us all new loot and people still complain. Let us not forgot what d2x did to d2 loot. It is the cycle of gaming. Like the one guy on the podcast said it is fun getting a new item and now we get to remake a character with new items and that is great and amazing.
As to your character I am sure you are a decent human being but that is neither here nor there in the grand scheme of opinions of what makes an RPG.

wrong. there are two schools of loot design, set and random loot. the diablo series is an example of randomized loot design. the designers set up algorithms for loot generation. conversely, the souls series is an example of set design, which means the designers coded every piece of armor, item and weapon in the entire game. one advantage of set design is it allows the designer balance the game. there is no drive too look for "the best sword in the game" because each weapon type is unique in its move set.

Who said anything about loot design I just said finding loot whether it is a predetermined piece or random it still must be acquired and hence the loot hunt. RPGs are about finding loot no matter how it gets there prior, the players are in the hunt to level and find new items it is the core of RPGs from D&D to D3 to Fallout3 to WOW (which has predetermined loot) you were always on the hunt for that next piece of gear. So am I not sure where the "wrong" comes from. If you don't like the loot design of D3 that is another thread entirely. :coffee:

no, you didn’t say anything about predetermined loot until i mentioned it. i also notice you’re not saying anything about loot progression anymore since i brought up an example of a game where you can beat the game with a reinforced club at level 1 if you have the skill. which blows a hole in your “all arpg are about hunting to level and find new items” theory.

no, you didn't say anything about predetermined loot until i mentioned it. i also notice you're not saying anything about loot progression anymore since i brought up an example of a game where you can beat the game with a reinforced club at level 1 if you have the skill. which blows a hole in your "all arpg are about hunting to level and find new items" theory.

I am not bringing it up because even the darksouls and demonsouls have loot and you acquire loot. You still get rewards of loot because you can do something with a low piece of loot does not mean the game is not loot based. You have 2 rewards in RPGs leveling and loot it is the core mechanic of an RPG. And because you mention 1 game that you say you can win with the 1st piece of loot required it does not meant you did not need to acquire said loot or you chose to ignore the loot rewards later that were present. You obviously have an issue with the loot design of D3 and most of us do but that does not change the core mechanic of RPGs. D3 is the most loot based RPG out there and so are a little less loot reliant but they are still RPGs and have leveling and loot as the rewards. You are talking degrees of loot as if it changes the fact there is loot which it does not. loot is loot the reliance on the level of loot is up to the designer but the fact you go for the shineys in RPGs is core to rpgs.

I am not bringing it up because even the darksouls and demonsouls have loot and you acquire loot. You still get rewards of loot because you can do something with a low piece of loot does not mean the game does not reward players with loot.

really? no way! who knew those games had loot! seriously, i’m not disputing the existence of loot. my only point was one doesn’t need to constantly hunt for new and better loot in all arpg as you claimed.

You have 2 rewards in RPGs leveling and loot it is the core mechanic of an RPG.

actually, it’s more like “fight, loot, and level”, but that as i pointed out earlier that paradigm doesn’t necessarily apply and as i pointed out earlier. set loot can kill the drive to hunt for new loot. if you can beat a game at level 1. that kills the need to level. the real problem here is apparently some diablo players think every arpg is designed as some kind of diablo clone. believe it or not the genre has evolved since 2000.

You obviously have an issue with the loot design of D3 and most of us do but that does not change the core mechanic of RPGs.

speak for yourself. diablo has always used randomized loot and D3 is no different in that respect. apparently, between the two of us, you’re the one that has a problem with loot design of D3.