500 words a day on whatever I want

The Broken Record Department

The Broken Record Department is an idea for this blog. It is a place to send commenters who bring up arguments that we have heard a zillion times before. While I like to keep comment threads somewhat loose and free-flowing, how many times do we have to sit through misinterpreted rape statistics or hearing about the average IQ of Africa being 70? If I have a post on it, I will list it in the Broken Records Department and send people there. It will be a top-level page like the Open Thread.

The idea is to keep comments about a stock argument in one place while keeping other threads more on point and, hopefully, have them not end in a Battle Against the Drones every time.

I got the idea, in part, from commenter Franklin:

Although it’s his house (and his rules), sometimes I DO wish Abagond would ban trolls. And I just mean the “broken record trolls”, who recycle the same drivel and clearly demonstrate that they are interested in doing nothing but creating distractions, by making excuses for the problems of whites.

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Each of those points are fine but would only qualify someone for being a contrarian at best or a troll.

For a broken record department, you would need to establish a template argument for each of those sophism. I don’t know.. maybe dedicate one page for each of those broken record as some kind of database.

I had coined the term “bliffism” after a (former) commenter who would repeat the very same claim that had been refuted by the post he was commenting on, or make himself example of the very subject that Abagond had posted.

Wasn’t it Franklin who had to remind Doug (and others) in, like, a dozen different threads, that there actually existed African writing systems prior to colonization?
It’s not surprising that he came with the idea of the Broken Records Dept.

You might call this place “Racism For Dummies” or “Introduction to Racism 100 for Dummies” or something in that vein, and style the page’s header in the easily identifiable “… For Dummies” yellow and black manual/book conventional stock format.

It’s a great idea. The angry blackman/blackwoman mindset has no place in modern society…Really? it’s okay for jewish folk to never forget the inhumanity of the holocaust, but, black folk should forgive and forget the transatlantic slave trade just to make white folk comfortable in their hypocrisy. This argument, more so than any other, makes my blood pressure rise X10. It’s insulting in the worst way. Black folk have every right to be upset about what was done to our race. Doesn’t give us a pass to do and say stupid ish in relation to others, but, we shouldn’t stay quiet about the bs that goes on in this country and abroad…Ditto!

I think the playing field really became ridiculously unbalanced here .jeezz. Don’t you think we’ve also heard alot of broken record arguments from black commenters as well. Point of view IS really everything.

You really need to go through this entire site and actually read the blog posts of the past. Every issue on that list has been debated here ad nauseum. This blog wasn’t put up yesterday. There is a history here that you should investigate before you judge whether the B.R.D. would be censorship.

While this is a good idea in principle, some of the arguments that would be filed there in the above list are there simply because some including Abagond don’t like them, not because they are incorrect.

He didn’t say they were “incorrect”. He stated that we’ve heard those arguments ad nauseum, hence the title “The Broken Record Department”. It just consolidates the most frequently used arguments on this blog.

I don’t see censorship here, I just see this used in order for threads to stop being congested with the same exact repetitive arguments, even if they have nothing to do with the topic. It shouldn’t be hard to come up with new arguments or points of view that relate to a topic.

@ Joshua,

It’s not an issue of being incorrect or correct, its an issue of these arguments being repetitive and redundant and used very frequently.

It’s funny that some people are commenting on how they feel the “Broken Records” is a form of censorship, or in prior articles have stated that they do not agree with the subject matter of the this blog. However THEY ARE STILL HERE…commenting, and talking. Sooo…..yeah. I don’t think anyone here is going to take up the mantle of “Blacks are too lazy,” or “Blacks are naturally stupid.” Because if you want an amen on that, maybe Stormfront is the place for ya, just saying…….

Oh and by the by, I think a good addition to Broken Records dept. might be “I know more about your experiences than you. I took classes/have a degree in/took a trip to Africa/have friends who have told me…..”

come on man where did you read “the race card” in there or blacks are just as racist. I SAID you are just as likely to repeat arguments as white people.

WOW you really want this advantage don’t you? This blog is highly visible now PARTLY BECAUSE of repetitive arguments from both sides, and it is worldly visible. If anything it needs to be MORE fair because of that, not less. Hence your recent onslaught of what you people call “Trolls”. Where do you think they are all coming from? The blog is popular , not just because of Abagonds comments but from ALL OF US> POWER TO THE PEOPLE!!!!!!!! I’m not a tattletale so it won’t be me , but I’m sure wordpress doesn’t want a highly visible blog to be ridiculously biased towards one group of peoples comments.

cont. @brothawolf. When YOU ban someone, or laugh them off your blog (no offense) but it doesn’t mean as much at this point. Because of higher visibility of search engines, there may be an issue someone looks up on google , and there is abagond’s blog staring them in the face. Then their like darn, I can’t go there because of the dictator like mentality. If he was making money off this site he sure as heck wouldn’t be able to do that as easy. I understand baning someone for a hateful or violent, or threatening remark. But a repetitive one? It just makes you look like the biggest bunch of hypocrites out there.

Take some personal responsibility man, you, right up there, tried to insinuate that this was a biased decision against white people.

“I’m not a tattletale so it won’t be me , but I’m sure wordpress doesn’t want a highly visible blog to be ridiculously biased towards one group of peoples comments.”

Wow. That is just silly.

Because you think that if you tirade like a petulant brat over a reasonable decision by the owner of the blog you’ll prove a point?

Are you kidding me? Anything to grasp for straws so that you can say, “Blacks are being racist!” How is this “biased” towards one groups of people’s arguments when it doesn’t seem to limit Sam, Mira, and others? Just because certain people can’t throw everything off track by copying and pasting the same argument again, and again, and again, and expecting everyone to sit there and argue back, again, and again, and again? I suppose I shouldn’t be surprise you’ve managed to do this. And here I thought you put “deep thought” into what you’d “learned”.

I think this is MORE fair because it makes it easier for people who want to actually discuss topics to not lose that opportunity in favor of a few trolls who can’t hold a conversation that isn’t copy and pasted repeatedly from Stormfront. I’d much rather see new arguments than have to argue against the same one every other day.

Also:

“Then their like darn, I can’t go there because of the dictator like mentality. ”

Your comparing a thread made specifically to help decongest threads and prevent derailment to the mentality of a DICTATOR? Are you serious? Do you not see just how immature that is to say?

You. don’t. own. this. blog. It is not made for YOU. And it isn’t here for you to decide what is allowed here and what isn’t.

Asking people to comment under the correct thread is not censorship. I am not afraid of any white racist argument because I know white racists are full of it – and, in any case, on the off chance they might be right about something, I would rather know the truth than to win an Internet debate.

Let me tell you about search engines, particularly Google. Try typing in “black women are…” and any letter of the alphabet and look at the suggested topics. Try seeing the difference when you type in “statistics about black people” and “statistics about white people”. Type in beautiful women and go to images. How many black women do you see? In fact, just type black women in the search bar and the first thing is “Why Black Women Are Less Physically Attractive Than Other Women”. But that is fine right because that doesn’t affect you. Please don’t ever use that argument again.

I believe the reason some are complaining is because you are taking their ammo away. Without it they don’t know what to do. I guess you can just say racists are broken records because they re-run the same stuff over and over and over again.

Should be interesting to watch what arguments they come up with now to justify there racist viewpoints now.

ok I will now eat embarrassing crow here. Someone told me , who is real computer savvy, that the reason I see abagonds blog come up when I look up things on google is because I frequent the blog alot, not because it is as visible as I thought. MY BAD. I didn’t see that happening till recently after I bought a new computer so I am sorry for my assumptions.

cont. like with the new google settings, I could look up how to make tuna casserole and there is the auto fill showing abagond “white racist guide to so and so” and I’m like what the f. Does this guy work for google or something?

ok ACE I admitted I was wrong, that being said this isn’t a blog that is not visible at all on google. Like I said it isn’t as visible as I thought, because I tried looking up similar things on someone elses computer and I couldn’t find it as easy through google. But you can find this blog more than some. So you could have a white person who isn’t a skin head or anything, find this blog through a search engine and still has an opinion that might be a whiter point of view, but isn’t a bad person, and they get censored because someone else already said something similar. I don’t think that is fair OK.

Well first of all, again, white doesn’t equal racist. Sam comes here and shares his “white” point of view, and he’s not limited by these rules, for example. It seems like it’s only limiting people who just want to copy and paste the same racist arguments over and over again, not anyone else. And why should this blog cater to them? It’s not like they don’t have many very public sites especially catered to their racist, repetitive points of view, feelings of Poc be damned.

Like Cleonette said, it’s not like people (especially black women) don’t have to wade through all manner of hateful things just by doing one internet search. there’s a lot worse people can see beyond “Oh I can’t use the same argument that was used 50 times on this blog in ten unrelated threads, oh well…”

@ace so you think anyone who comes here that has an opposing view point at times is cutting and pasting? I assure you the only time I EVER did that was when I copied and pasted Beastie Boys lyrics because I was sad of the passing of M.C.A. I just speak what comes to me at the moment. Do I shoot myself in the foot at times because of that? Yes. I’ll be the first to admit it. But I don’t copy and paste. You must be thinking of someone else.

Look abagond hasn’t used his idea yet. I just think it opens up racial censorship. I have argued in the past that the government wants us all to be silent. If white people go first you can be sure your next. Lets see how it goes. But I think it’s a bad idea. I have a sense of fairness that I guess you missed somewhere along the way. I’m not a bad guy. I got that from my family………not from you.

By the way Sam is effin rediculous with some of his responses. You could say like the bible kill the first born pharoh’s (white people’s) sons and he would agree with you. He seems to speak not from his heart or soul or mind as I do but what you so-called POC want to hear. (My opinion)

But how does that open up racial censorship? It’s not “censoring” any white people. It’s just keeping threads from being congested by the same arguments. If you go to the appropriate thread and see the arguments and counter arguments, it saves us from having to address the same thing every other thread.

“I have argued in the past that the government wants us all to be silent. If white people go first you can be sure your next. ”

Yeah, because no PoC has EVER experienced limits in their freedoms or silencing from the government. This would totally equate to that.

” have a sense of fairness that I guess you missed somewhere along the way. I’m not a bad guy. I got that from my family………not from you.”

If you care so much about people’s rights to their “speech and opinions”, why are you trying to say that just because Sam argues logical points with a lot of references that just happen to not support white supremacist views he’s not speaking from the heart or mind?

I don’t really see Randy putting too much of a fuss over this BRD either…

I apologize if anything I say is not to your rules, feel free to delete anything I say here if it violates anything.

@ Dave,

Okay. “Not from you…bad example there…”

Really? Okay. Your going there? Well guess what “bub”, I’m not going to let you turn this into another one of your pathetic little pity parties where you think if you waltz around like a kicked puppy you’ll make us seem like the mean “unfair” PoC.

You know you could care less about “freedom” when it comes to people who aren’t white, and frankly I’m tired of arguing why the feelings of people with “whiter points of view” aren’t the criteria that is going to decide whether or not something is implemented here. Unlike every other facet of our lives.

It is not an unfair decision, Abagond has gone above and beyond to let you and whatever other white person come here and say their ideas, even if they’re full of hateful things, even if it personally insults him. And your complaining because you think a BRD is “unfair”?

Just stop it. Stop being a little martyr and perpetual victim, grow up and learn to read. I’m tired of trying to explain to you what this is about and how it’s not hurting your “more important than everyone else” feelings.

You may not be a bad guy, but you surely have manic/depressive (up/down – hot/cold – on/off – for/against – insightful/absolutely clueless – now you get it/now you don’t – *are you seeing the picture Dave??*) issues/tendencies!

You can still use these arguments on any thread to MAKE a point BUT NOT to derail.

For example, on a thread about white self-segregation you can still say that crime stats prove that blacks are naturally violent and that is why whites self-segregate. Fine. But that debate on crime stats and the supposedly violent nature of black people will take place on a thread of its own, not on the white self-segregation thread. Everything in its place. That is the idea.

Whites, or enough of them at any rate, cannot bear to hear #2 and derail it. Any champion of free speech should be against that.

Instead I want the pattern to be:

1. OP: White people do x.
2. Black commenters agree and disagree and start discussing
3. White commenters insult blacks with crime stats, IQ scores, etc.
4. I declare #3 off topic as a broken record argument and refer those who want to discuss it further to post x which debates that argument.
5. Discussion about the OP continues.

That way we can talk about all kinds of things instead of the Ten White Derailments, like crime statistics, over and over again.

Dave, what a silly statement about Sam.Just because a white person can see through the bs doesnt mean they are a traitor to their “race”. The white racist and race realists who scour the world for racist information , and hold on to their racist veiws until they are cold and dead, are the real traitors and embarrasments to their “race” and are even a more let down for the human race

1. OP: White people are screwed up because (more often insert stereotyped or dubious claims of how whites are)
2a. Black commenters agree and start making ever more outrageous claims, along with “White people (as a race) should…”.
2b. White commenters defend themselves using both real and dubious arguments, along with “Black people (as a race) should…..”
3. Black commenters insult White commenters for using both real and bogus arguments, and by referring them all to some dubious list of argument types and making generally unsupportable claims of “derailment”.
4. White commenters insult Black people, claiming they are screwed up by using and misusing crime stats, IQ scores, etc both real and relevant or not.
5a. Black commenters defend themselves by claiming that these statistics are the fault of White people, ignoring the major Black role, and claim White people are the root of all evil.
5b. White commenters defend themselves by ignoring the major White role and claim Black people are the root of all evil.
6. The thread is now about how BLACK and WHITE people as races are screwed up, stirred by racists both Black and White.
7. Voices of moderation are attacked by both sides.
8. Debate cut-off is attempted by a claim that this is a space for Black commenters and White people should merely listen no matter how outlandish the comments or claims about Whites made by Blacks.
9. More dubious arguments/insults from both sides until people tire.
10. Repeat on next OP (it’s all broken record).

We have seen in recent months the perpetual, for want of a better word ‘disobedience’ in terms of some commenters who continually derail certain topics at will. Its hard not to get sucked in to it (I know I have) so a dedicated blog to ‘despatch’ people to sounds brill.

@dave

By the way Sam is effin rediculous with some of his responses. You could say like the bible kill the first born pharoh’s (white people’s) sons and he would agree with you. He seems to speak not from his heart or soul or mind as I do but what you so-called POC want to hear. (My opinion)

*sigh* Lashing out again Dave! The fact that you cant really give an adequate example of what you are trying to demonstrate (above) suggests ‘Emotional thinking’. This is something that Black commeneters are continually being accused of but the REAL evidence of emotive responses have come from white commenters who when they encounter someone who deftly dismantles their arguments, resort to vicious and vile language i.e. their ‘true thinking’ aka Doug.

To me, Sam comes across as comfortable in his own skin, -so comfortable that he is willing to discuss negative things associated with ‘whiteness’. He seems able to do so because he doesnt come across as encumbered and bogged down by it all – he is able to distance himself because I sense the he knows that it doesnt belong to him!

Speak from your heart, soul or mind all you like dave but, there seems to be constant turmoil, frustration and disquiet so it is not surprising that your comments reflect this and in turn evoke responses from commenters.

Many of the commenters come on here so that they can affirm their negative opinions NOT so that they can discuss, analyse and take on board what has come from their interactions with commenters and maybe, just maybe, use that thinking to inform their approach to people in life. I guess you need to decide what kind of commenter you are and tailor this accordingly…

Sam is from Finland. That means he avoided the Standard American Brainwashing on race – more so than even the black American commenters here. Further, he does not base his self-worth on being white. So he does not believe in the overblown self-image White Americans have of themselves nor does he feel the need to defend it.

I have no trouble with debating the broken record arguments themselves. In fact, I have written posts on some of them. What I object to is their misuse.

The broken record arguments function as a way for whites to silence people of colour. Those who use them show little interest in understanding what people of colour have to say or even in understanding the topic at hand. It is their way of sticking their fingers in their ears and going “La la la la”. It is their way of jamming the transmission, to quote Sting.

I don’t know Dave. You confuse me at times. Thanks anyways for the compliment. When I come to this blog, I want to be able to talk about the things about black people that drive me crazy and the things about white people that drive me crazy, but even in that I am limited because of the type of people that come to this blog with the same tired azz arguments and stats. No one live their life based off stats.

If I come to this blog and I want to talk about the evil white lady who clutched her purse when I walked next to her, the last thing I wanna here is that a stat proves that I am more likely to snatch this lady’s purse. Especially when she’s carry something with the value of a Ziploc bag and I have a Coach. I am not attacking a whole race of people by making this statement, but you better believe after making that statement I will be subjected to one of the following:

(1) Bombarded with black crime stats
(2) Called racist for talking about my experience
(3) Asked to back up my experience with stats
(4) Accused of being sensitive
(5) Told I am complaining
(6) Told I am mad about slavery

Don’t you think that gets old? Especially when:

(1) Stats are not 100% accurate or reliable and I personally have never been in trouble with the law. I have never even been to the freakin’ principal’s office

(2) I am not racist but a bit prejudiced. Prejudiced defined as “having or showing a dislike or distrust that is derived from prejudice; bigoted”. I do have a distrust for most whites, but because of the individual that I am, I allow them to prove themselves as trustworthy because of my personal experiences, not some stat. In that essence, I distrust most people I don’t know because of personal experiences with strangers, so I am not even sure of that counts as being prejudice or just cautious.

(3) Once again facts are better than stats, often because they include context

(4) I may be sensitive. I am a woman and it hurts me when I am misjudged based on my skin color or stereotypes. Black women are feminine despite what others may think. Some of my family even call me “prissy” (very southern word used in context for an extra feminine woman)

(5) You know what! You are dayum right I am complaining. I don’t like being treated that way!

(6) Another dayum right! I am mad about it but I don’t use it as a catch all to every problem.. In fact I hardly bring up slavery and it seems to be the derailers who tend to bring up being mad about slavery. Hell, I’m too mad about crap that happened last week rather than slavery. When that woman clutched her purse do you think I was upset because I was mad about slavery? That’s stupid!

I have even been told to leave America if it was so bad as if I choose to come on this trip and wasn’t satisfied with the festivities. Then if I turn around and say go back to Europe they want to say they are American and this is there country. Guess what! I am American as well whether I like it or not. It’s like being born into a dysfunctional family. I live my life trying to deal with it everyday. I can’t go anywhere without someone reminding me that I am black, I am a thief, I am a murderer, my IQ is low, I am violent, I’m ugly, I’m fat, I’m ghetto, I’m uneducated, I love chicken and watermelon, my skin is too dark, my hair to nappy, and I am not wanted here to the point that I should just pack up my sh*t and leave the country. How in the azz am I supposed to listen to that every f’ing day on this blog and be accommodating?! POC’s can’t have sh*t without someone wanting to criticize it, question it, change it to be more accommodating to them, compare it to their own attitudes, norms, and institutions, or just plain destroy it. If Abagond deleted this entire blog today, they would only find another blog like it to spread their poison. In the end I could give a flying F what some derailing, ignorant person has to say about me because despite what you think I am being the best person that I can be in-spite of you! Funny when I go observe racist white blogs, I don’t see any outrage, but you come here, a blog that is anything but racist and you want to destroy it and make sure we little lowly colored people are reminded that we don’t deserve to have thoughts and opinions on our own. You take precious time out of your day to post endless stats and racist opinions and expect some kind of respect.

You know what scared me, what really, really scares me. They way some people act on this blog, is already evident to me that POCs are not considered smart or credible. Our truths are always questioned. Dave, if you think the government has not already silenced POCs then you are very mistaken. We are allowed little victories followed by major defeats. Imagine a racist white cop planting drugs on a black man, how likely is the black man to be charged and sent to prison? A Muslim being accused of being a terrorist by some racist person? Imagine a little black girl saying she was raped by a well-known white man in the community and just one white person lying and saying the man was with him at the time. We are all afraid of being the next innocent black person to be shot by police, accused of a crime we didn’t commit, pulled over by the police on a dark lonely road, or racially profiled. It doesn’t matter that we have college degrees, loving families, careers, or respected citizens in out communities. It doesn’t matter if we have children waiting on us to get home, a loving spouse, church and community leaders like educators, doctors, and advocates. It scares me to no end that every time my 19 year old cousin walks out of the door; this kid who is in college as a forestry major with dreams to work for the federal government and works 10 hours a day to pay for it; will be racially profiled or accused of a crime he didn’t commit. I pray and pray that he will be judged by his character and not his skin. I see him getting angry when he is followed by the cops and other things like that. I tell him to keep his anger in check because a black man’s anger is viewed as a deadly weapon and his emotions can get him killed. He doesn’t need a gun in his hand to be view as dangerous. Just his skin and his feelings. That’s scary.

Cleonette I couldn’t have said that better myself. Ultimately, I think all this complaining about the BRD comes down to the notion of being denied anything(real or imagined) by those who are seen as less than is what sends these people into emotional fits. Sadly, it’s a losing argument 99% of the time.

Something I’ve learned from most whites, my dear, is we’re not ALLOWED to have a say in anything, even what goes on in our own communities. The startling truth is most whites act the way they do because they don’t consider us to be fully human. This was, is and always be the foundation of racial animus, envy and indifference.

Coming here to see it laid out for us on a daily basis is mind-boggling.
But I now expect NOTHING less.

It’s a case of our word against theirs no matter what. Our skin alone automatically discredits us whether it is true or now, but the word of the white man is truth?

We are not “whining” as most white people LOVE to say whenever we express our pain and frustrations about living in such a society. These are more than legitimate feelings and complaints, and the only thing that keeps them from being seen as “serious” is our skin.

Here’s a perfect example that just happened recently: Three black studies graduate students, their professors, and entire body of work were criticized by a white female writer named Naomi Schaefer Riley. You can view her article here:

“In her piece, she openly sneered at each woman’s dissertation (none of which she had read) and basically characterized their work as useless, “irrelevant,” outdated, and predicated upon victimization.”

I love it when they use stats as if that tells the whole story about a race. That’s low-level thinking when you rely on numbers that could very well be fixed to begin with or misinterpreted by certain people to fit their agendas.

I admit that I’m not good at reading statistics, and I try to stay away from them as often I possible. But one thing that’s true is that I’m not a number, nor am I a drone that’s part of the “hive”. Black people have never been a group with a hive-like mind. So, to use statistics and news reports to support that is childish.

1. Op: White People Are Screwed Up Because (More Often Insert Stereotyped Or Dubious Claims Of How Whites Are)

My counter intuitive argument? If the shoe fits, wear it clowns!

2a. Black commenters agree and start making ever more outrageous claims, along with “White people (as a race) should…”.
2b. White commenters defend themselves using both real and dubious arguments, along with “Black people (as a race) should…..”

What was 2? You went to 2a and 2b without even starting at 2.

3. Black commenters insult White commenters for using both real and bogus arguments, and by referring them all to some dubious list of argument types and making generally unsupportable claims of “derailment”.

Yes but it’s his blog. He decides what stays or goes, not you. He has deleted inappropriate comments I have made but so what? The absurdities abound hence the mockery which ensues for the white racist and their followers/ilk. If you can’t stand the heat, go drink another quart of liquor, guy.

5a. Black commenters defend themselves by claiming that these statistics are the fault of White people, ignoring the major Black role, and claim White people are the root of all evil.

I beg to differ. Old Scratch has nothing on you and your ilk. There is a demon sitting on a rock in hell weeping at your wickedness!

7. Voices of moderation are attacked by both sides.

Yeah. Bliff, Doug and incontinent truth always struck me as rational and moderate, even sane. I especially loved it when they constantly hurled invective at blacks, claimed to be cool calm and collected and ‘logical’, whereas the blacks argued from an emotional perspective. If anything, they were comical. That’s a new one(argument)! The comedy they and others of their ilk provide! Thanks bung holes!

8. Debate cut-off is attempted by a claim that this is a space for Black commenters and White people should merely listen no matter how outlandish the comments or claims about Whites made by Blacks.

Black commenters defend themselves by claiming that these statistics are the fault of White people, ignoring the major Black role, and claim White people are the root of all evil.

The problem isn’t with the statistics themselves. The problem lies in presenting statistics without context, reference, sources and explanation. That isn’t the way you’re supposed to utilize statistics to support your argument.

What the complainers really want is a typical site where they’re pandered to at the expense of everyone else, that’s why their reaction is so negative that they can’t even understand what this BRD is about.

And yet your “point” seemed to put the black commentors in the “outrageous” and unfounded role, while the white commentors get a “real and relevant OR not.” In a matter of fact, your “list” seems to blame the black commentors before anyone else.

You want to quibble over which words you think are worse. If it had been the other way around in your mind, you wouldn’t have said a thing. The truth is I was careful not to bias words to either side, which in your mind translates to bias against your side.