[duxhelp] Re: Problems with the "go to page" and "go to next and previous page"

From: "Jack Maartman" <jmaartman@xxxxxxxxxxx>

To: <duxhelp@xxxxxxxxxxxxx>

Date: Thu, 22 Jul 2004 20:41:13 -0700

Hi Bill:
There is no problem with the Braille display. For some reason it has to do
with Window-eyes speaking the line or for that matter the full document,
with read to end. Don, who wrote the set files for DBT also noticed this. I
will check it out tomorrow asap, try making some adjustments and will let
you know.
Thanks
Jack
----- Original Message -----
From: "Bill Herzler" <billh@xxxxxxxxxxx>
To: <duxhelp@xxxxxxxxxxxxx>; <duxhelp@xxxxxxxxxxxxx>
Sent: Thursday, July 22, 2004 2:41 PM
Subject: [duxhelp] Re: Problems with the "go to page" and "go to next and
previous page"
> Jack,
>
> Can you be more specific as to your problems with DBT and Window-Eyes?
>
> You say that we can't read the entire line and that you can't read a whole
> document using Window-eyes. I am not having that problem here after
> translating section 1 of the Window-eyes manual.
> I am using an alva satelite with Window-Eyes 4.5 sp3 under Windows XP.
> The document shows on the braille display here.
>
> Since I am not totally femilar with all the different things you can do in
> Duxbury as others are on this list, what I need from you and anyone else
> seeing this, is exact step by step instructions key strokes etc. and a
> document that you are having problems with reading.
> Please leave nothing out and I will attempt to duplicate and see if we can
> solve the problmes you are having asap.
>
> Thanks.
>
> Regards, Bill
>
> At 12:05 PM 7/22/2004, Jack Maartman wrote:
> >It certainly does. I am still trying to coax DBT to print to file, so I
can
> >start replicating the bahaviour on a device that only displays one line
at
> >a time.
> >
> >Another thing I'd like to add, but off thread, is that DBT is performing
> >very poorly with Window-eyes. I spoke to Don about this, and the problem
> >would seem to rest with Window-eyes, and not DBT. Window-eyes will not
read
> >a complete line, and certainly can't be used to read a document. I can
> >however, read any file when any translation table is in effect using a
> >screen reader without a braille display, although it's a bit slow. I'd
like
> >to see this resolved for the new release, and will certainly contact
> >GWMicro, if you find this useful. I'd like to be very clear about the
> >problem, so I can be as succinct as possible.
> >
> >Jack
> >
> >----- Original Message -----
> >From: "Peter Sullivan" <peter@xxxxxxxxxx>
> >To: <duxhelp@xxxxxxxxxxxxx>
> >Sent: Thursday, July 22, 2004 9:47 AM
> >Subject: [duxhelp] Re: Problems with the "go to page" and "go to next and
> >previous page"
> >
> >
> > > Jack,
> > >
> > > As I read your first question, I can read it one of two ways. I'll
answer
> > > it each way.
> > >
> > > When reading "Formatted Braille" files, DBT counts lines up to a
certain
> > > maximum value. The maximum is set in the "Global, Formatted Braille
> > > Importer" dialog. However, if the checkbox "Preserve formatting..."
in
> >that
> > > dialog is checked, then the maximum line count is taken from the page
> >setup
> > > of the dialog being created. That is, it is taken from the template
or,
> >if
> > > the template is one we distribute, from your Global, Embosser Setup.
DBT
> > > determines that there is a page break in the "Formatted Braille" file
when
> > > that maximum line count is reached, or when it reads a formfeed.
> > >
> > > When formatting documents on-screen and for printing or embossing, DBT
> > > counts lines as it places text on the page. When the number of lines
that
> > > your page should contain is reached, it goes to a new page. It may go
to
> >a
> > > new page without filling all the lines if some number of lines are to
be
> > > kept together insofar as possible. This is indicated with the [kps]
and
> > > [kpe] commands. Moreover, DBT may use the last line of each page for
a
> > > running footer.
> > >
> > > Your second question is an interesting one. I believe that DBT does a
> >good
> > > job of reformatting documents for different embossers. And we
certainly
> > > believe that, in every case, the on-screen document will match what
you
> >get
> > > from your embosser. Exceptions to this typically occur when your
embosser
> > > is configured one way, but you tell DBT that it is configured a
different
> > > way.
> > >
> > > I hope this answers your questions.
> > >
> > > - Peter
> > >
> > > -----Original Message-----
> > > From: duxhelp-bounce@xxxxxxxxxxxxx
[mailto:duxhelp-bounce@xxxxxxxxxxxxx]
> >On
> > > Behalf Of Jack Maartman
> > > Sent: Thursday, July 22, 2004 12:45 PM
> > > To: duxhelp@xxxxxxxxxxxxx
> > > Subject: [duxhelp] Re: Problems with the "go to page" and "go to next
and
> > > previous page"
> > >
> > > Hi:
> > >
> > > How does DBT calculate pages, does it count form-feeds, or lines?
Does it
> > > mean that if you format a file for two different embossers, it can
count
> > > acurately?
> > > ----- Original Message -----
> > > From: "Dave Durber" <dadurber@xxxxxxxxxxxxx>
> > > To: <duxhelp@xxxxxxxxxxxxx>
> > > Sent: Thursday, July 22, 2004 9:25 AM
> > > Subject: [duxhelp] Problems with the "go to page" and "go to next and
> > > previous page"
> > >
> > >
> > > > I have two questions as follows:
> > > >
> > > > When you press <CTRL+G> to go to a specific page, the program will
> > > > often come up with a message telling you that you cannot go to that
> > > > location. However, when you press the <ENTER> key, you will
> > > > invariably find yourself at the location you requested regardless of
> > > > the previous message.
> > > >
> > > > I think that DBT comes up with that message because it cannot
> > > > calculate accurately enough, for example, where the top-of-the page
is
> > > > on certain pages.
> > > >
> > > > A good idea might be to use the same or similar system that
> > > > WordPerfect used, that is:
> > > >
> > > > [spg], which stood for "soft page break". This code indicated when
a
> > > > page was filled up and a new page began. You would see this code
when
> > > > paragraphs, list and outline items spread across page boundaries
from
> > > > one page to another.
> > > >
> > > > [hpg], which stood for "hard page break". This code was used when
you
> > > > wanted to end the current page and start a new page.
> > > >
> > > > Now, if DBT used such a system, then the go to page function could
> > > > search for the [spg] or [hpg] codes, calculate the number of codes
to
> > > > reach that location and place you at the top of that page that you
> > > > requested.
> > > >
> > > > This brings me onto another function, that is the <CTRL+PGDN> "go to
> > > > next page" and the <CTRL+PGUP> "go to previous page commands, which
at
> > > > present do not work as they really should.
> > > >
> > > > Although these keystrokes do move the cursor to the next and
previous
> > > > page, in my experience they do not move the cursor to the top of the
> > > > page by default, which should be the case.
> > > >
> > > > Example: If you have a braille file on-screen that contains 50
pages
> > > > of text and the cursor is on "page15 line5 column1, you press
> > > > <CTRL+PGDN> to go to top of page 16, the status line should say
> > > > "page16 line1 column1", logically, this is where the cursor should
be
> > > > located but, in my experience when you read the status line it
> > > > actually reads "page16 line5 column1", which is the same line and
> > > > column positions as the previous page. This might vary depending on
> > > > format codes and styles that might be in effect at that location in
> > > > the file which might force DBT to place the cursor as near to
> > > > "column1" on "page16 line5" as possible.
> > > >
> > > > Likewise, if you want to move the cursor from its current location
> > > > which is "page 16 line5 column1" an move it to the top of page 15
You
> > > > should have to press <CTRL+PGUP> once to move the cursor to the top
of
> > > > "page 16 line1 column1", which is the top of the current page and
then
> > > > press the <CTRL+PGUP> again to move the cursor to the top of the
> > > > previous page which is "page15 line1 column1".
> > > >
> > > > >From my experience this is not the case. If the cursor is on
"page16
> > > > line1 column1" and you press <CTRL+PGUP> the cursor moves to the
> > > > previous page with the same line and column location, that is "line5
> > > > column1", depending on the format or style codes that might be in
> > > > effect at that location in the file which might force DBT to place
the
> > > > cursor as near to "column1" "page15 line5" as possible.
> > > >
> > > > Like the "go to" command if DBT used codes such as [spg] and [hpg]
to
> > > > indicate hard and soft page breaks, Dbt could search for these codes
> > > > to accurately place the cursor at the top of the next and previous
> > > > page when the <CTRL+PGDN> and <CTRL+PGUP> key combinations are used.
> > > >
> > > > Sincerely:
> > > >
> > > > Dave Durber
> > > >
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>
>
> To insure that you receive proper support, please include all past
> correspondence (where applicable), and any relevant information pertinent
> to your situation when submitting a problem report to the GW Micro
> Technical Support Team.
>
> Bill Herzler
> Training and Technical Support Specialist
> Voice 260-489-3671
> Fax 260-489-2608
> E-mail billh@xxxxxxxxxxx
> Web http://www.gwmicro.com
> Ftp ftp://ftp.gwmicro.com
>
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