posted at 12:05 pm on November 15, 2013 by Allahpundit

Gut-check time for House Democrats: Was yesterday’s phony “fix” from on high enough political cover for them to vote no today on Upton’s bill or do they still feel the need to do something dramatic to distance themselves from ObamaCare? The One’s done everything he can in the past 24 hours to nudge them to oppose the GOP’s bill, from holding that shinola-eating presser yesterday in which he claimed Upton’s idea more or less as his own to threatening a veto of Upton’s bill last night. The House Democratic leadership is even preparing its own bill, “Landrieu-lite,” to give the more panicky members of the caucus an alternative to Upton. Given all that, if they vote for Upton anyway, it’s practically a vote of no-confidence. Precisely for that reason, plus the fact that Pelosi’s been dumping on Upton’s bill as “dangerous,” I’ll be surprised if more than a few dozen Dems cross the aisle. If it’s many more than that, political media will have a field day about the Democratic schism over O-Care this afternoon.

President Barack Obama’s credibility may have taken a big hit with voters, but he’s also in serious danger of permanently losing the trust of Democrats in Congress. The Obamacare debacle has been bad enough that it’s tough for Democrats to take on faith that the president can fix the problems. His one-time allies are no longer sure that it’s wise to follow him into battle, leaving Obama and his law not only vulnerable to existing critics, but open to new attacks from his own party.

“I don’t know how he f—-ed this up so badly,” said one House Democrat who has been very supportive of Obama in the past.

Not good enough? Okay:

Rep. McDermott (D-WA) just now: "I haven't seen so much panic on this floor since 9/11"

A big Democratic vote for Upton wouldn’t just be a blow to Obama’s credibility, says Yuval Levin, it’d be a blow to the future of ObamaCare:

If many dozens of House Democrats broke with the leadership and the president to vote for the Upton bill (which would allow insurers to keep selling any 2013 plans they wanted to all comers next year), they might well never come back to the Obamacare fold, and the inevitable fights to come would be all the more painful for the president. If the Senate Democrats championing the Landrieu bill (which would impose a guaranteed-renewability requirement on all 2013 plans, overriding Obamacare’s qualified-coverage mandates) got their way, they would expose deep divisions in the Democratic caucus that Harry Reid has worked for years to hide (mostly by avoiding difficult votes) and put the president in the position of seeming to be reprimanded by his own party. If both bills passed, the result of a conference committee between them could well be unbearable for the president in both political and policy terms.

He comes to the same conclusion I did yesterday: For a party that was impressively farsighted three years ago in passing a paradigm-shifting health-care law even at the expense of losing their House majority, they’ve been freakishly short-sighted in panicking over the rollout with “fixes” that’ll only make things worse. It’s chaos, truly. Even our favorite Democrat can’t deny it.

One senior GOP aide tells NRO that Democrats’ behind-the-scenes efforts against the Upton bill are more concerted than some might think, though Democratic leadership isn’t formally whipping the bill.

“Pelosi on the House floor personally arm-twisting — never seen anything like it,” he says.

Update: I guessed 45 Democrats would switch sides. Actual number: 39. The final tally was 261-157, nowhere near a veto-proof majority but enough to make a point about dozens of House Dems going wobbly on this. Reid’s move now: Does he bring up Landrieu’s bill for a vote?

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Comments

Again, why does the government’s role in America’s Healthcare System have to grow, at all?

kingsjester on November 15, 2013 at 1:50 PM
It shouldn’t. We need free market reforms.

Of course we do. We also need to ban these insurance companies from lobbying on Capital Hill and demand they compete nation wide with no restrictions on the number of insureres available to customers in individual states.

We then need an end to the pre existing condition scam the insurance companies have been hiding behind unreasonably limit their risk….or create a separate, federally funded pool to cover preexisting conditions for seriously or chronically diseased individuals.

How much lounger are the fools on the left going to continue letting this guy destroy the lives of so many Americans? He lied and deceived then cancelled the health insurance of millions only to attempt to implement an administrative counter action that does nothing but give his political cronies cover. Wake up people before you lose it all.

We then need an end to the pre existing condition scam the insurance companies have been hiding behind unreasonably limit their risk….or create a separate, federally funded pool to cover preexisting conditions for seriously or chronically diseased individuals.

But doesn’t this just give Obambi cover by making his decree legal?
It still does not fix anything. Repeal!

TerryW on November 15, 2013 at 2:31 PM

It allows insurance companies to offer non-compliant plans to all their customers. Obama will just extend the plans for customers that already have them. And it allows insurance companies to design new non-compliant plans until January 31 and offer them.

…We then need an end to the pre existing condition scam the insurance companies have been hiding behind unreasonably limit their risk….or create a separate, federally funded pool to cover preexisting conditions for seriously or chronically diseased individuals.

rickyricardo on November 15, 2013 at 2:26 PM

Wrong again. If insurance companies cannot base their rates on pre-existing conditions, then it’s not insurance.

Pre-existing conditions were already heavily regulated by state insurance regulators before Obamacare was shat down upon us.

Several states had set up working high-risk pools for those that really “could not get insurance”. Most of those that make the claim to “not be able to get insurance” however are lying. They CAN get insurance, they just don’t like the price. Many of them also stumbled into this state by going without insurance until they got sick.

Getting the federal government out of the health insurance business has to be Step One.

Obama is like a pyromaniac who sets a building on fire lets the fire engulf the building, and then says, “Well the fire department has my royal permission to put it out, so if it burns down, it’s their fault, not mine”. The man is sick in the head.

Pardon my language, but if just one Democrat tells Pelosi to go f* herself before I die, my life will have been worthwhile. Former Speaker Mimi McRictus twisting arms on the House floor is just like a caricature of evil.

Obama is like a pyromaniac who sets a building on fire lets the fire engulf the building, and then says, “Well the fire department has my royal permission to put it out, so if it burns down, it’s their fault, not mine”. The man is sick in the head.

Yes they do. In fact its hard enough to find a doctor that takes that unless you live in or close to an urban area. Your a second rate patient when it comes to that. Doctors make next to nothing and sometimes have to wait a long time for payment.

You also do understand that these 2 programs DENY care much more than any private carrier ever did right? What is going to happen when there is even more strain put on it?

Forgot to add that the dems cut some spending out of medicare and put it into the AHCA in order to try to balance it… even less money in that pool now.

So the repubs managed to take something that was 100% owned by BO and the dems and turn it into bipartisan ownership. Do I have that right? The repubs just bought their tickets on the USS BOcare and lined up for buckets to help bail.

I knew they couldn’t resist helping BO make it work and giving the dems a better chance in 2014.

KATTY KAY: If David Axelrod is right and if we’re looking at this in a year’s time going into the mid-term elections and the kinks in the website have been worked out and enough young people have–all ifs–enough young people have signed up, there is a chance, isn’t there, that Democrats can go into the mid-terms with a policy that actually does at that stage seem to be working? This may not end up being the disaster that Republicans are today assuming it will be.

Have to say, I’m not thrilled by this. I think it puts GOP fingerprints on it, helps divert blame from where it ultimately lies, and mitigates the disaster potentially awaiting the Dems in November ’14.

What am I missing? How does this help the Republicans politically, the country generally, and how does it further the effort to actually repeal/kill this abomination?

Why not simply pass a repeal bill and force the Democrats to publicly take a stand on it, right now, when they’re desperate and in a panic?

How does delaying things for a year (that’d be post election, yes?) help?

It’s gonna be kinda hard to keep up the Republicans are obstructionists meme after this…except maybe on MSNBC

workingclass artist on November 15, 2013 at 2:58 PM

Yep, those wily Republicans just signed on to also being responsible for this piece of shit legislation.

Score for the GOP? Um, no. This *was* the issue that could potentially DESTROY liberalism for generations – and the GOP just gave the Dems an ‘out’, from what I can tell.

Maybe I’m missing something.

When people continue to be furious as states/insurance companies *don’t* roll-back cancellations (because, for the most part, they can’t at this point), it will no longer be Obama and his lies that are 100% to blame – it will be the states/insurance companies. And if there’s residual blame, Obama now gets to share it with the GOP.

Brilliant. / I can almost see O’s poll numbers going back up as we speak.

What am I missing? How does this help the Republicans politically, the country generally, and how does it further the effort to actually repeal/kill this abomination?

Why not simply pass a repeal bill and force the Democrats to publicly take a stand on it, right now, when they’re desperate and in a panic?

How does delaying things for a year (that’d be post election, yes?) help?

Midas on November 15, 2013 at 3:21 PM

I’m back and forth on whether this is good politics and have decided that it probably is. Passing Fred Upton’s bill (which is not much different than Obama’s idea for a fix), demonstrates that the GOP isn’t just sitting on their hands as millions are losing their health insurance.

Passing a repeal bill is probably coming but we need to wait until after the first of the year when some of the really bad stuff starts happening as Obamacare really kicks off. That will also be about the time for the “I gotcha by telling you that you could keep your doctor too!” speech.

Long-term it doesn’t help at all but getting a one-year extension really starts the death spiral as the healthies keep their old policy while Obamacare has to deal with all the unhealthy and lazy that fought hard to sign up for more welfare. And a year is a very long time when it comes to politically charged issues like healthcare.

No, I got that. And on one hand, I’m a bit surprised more Dems didn’t vote for it. It seems to clearly give them a release valve on the pressure that’s been mounting 100% on them and Obama for the last several weeks.

They have completely owned the Obamacare debacle – now they don’t.

This bill will help people make the argument that it’s the insurance company’s fault, or the state insurance board’s fault, moving forward.

“Hell, Obama said they could now keep it, and the House even passed a bipartisan bill saying so – why won’t those evil insurance company’s do it?”

See? Already Obama doesn’t ‘own it’ anymore. And if the heat *does* begin to point back to DC, Obama/Dems can and will make sure that everyone knows that the GOP has some of the taint on them now, too. Hell, they were trying to blame the GOP *before* this – you think they won’t *now*?

Instead of making people deal with the reality for the next year (election cycle), it would seem to postpone most if not all of that reality until after the next election – that seems… profoundly dumb.

And, as someone else mentioned, it gives HHS a much needed pressure release valve under which to actually get the website working, get the exchanges working, and point to a viable, functioning mechanism – before the election. Now, people may not be happy with what they’re getting, but it won’t be NEARLY as caustic as it is NOW.

Sorry, it just seems like the GOP took an unbelievable, once in 100 years opportunity to merely help the Dems DESTROY themselves for a very long time, that was served up on a silver platter to them – and whiffed.

That’s one way to look at it but those same democrats still face angry voters and have to explain why they voted for legislation that hurt americans in the first place.

What will they say…We didn’t read it?

workingclass artist on November 15, 2013 at 3:34 PM

No – they will say, “we were duped, and just as mad about it as you are. As a result, we just voted in a bipartisan way to make the greedy insurance company’s let you keep your policy. If they’re not doing it, that’s on them, we’ve done everything we can.”

You know – as opposed to actually having to explain themselves and not having anything they can remotely point to with any shred of credibility.

We’ll see; I just ‘have a very bad feeling about this’, and am pretty sure the GOP just fumbled an unbelievable, never thought we’d have such a great one, opportunity to actually get ACA repealed, with the support of deeply frightened Democrats.

We’ll see; I just ‘have a very bad feeling about this’, and am pretty sure the GOP just fumbled an unbelievable, never thought we’d have such a great one, opportunity to actually get ACA repealed, with the support of deeply frightened Democrats.

Midas on November 15, 2013 at 3:45 PM

I see your point.

I guess we’ll see one way or the other if this works.

And it will be mostly working, a year later and new squirrels to chase. By election time next year BOcare will be old news with everyone wondering what all the fuss was about.

Dr. Frank Enstine on November 15, 2013 at 3:45 PM

Expanded medicaid maybe…but that will bankrupt state budgets in a few years.

By election time next year BOcare will be old news with everyone wondering what all the fuss was about.

Dr. Frank Enstine on November 15, 2013 at 3:45 PM

I’m afraid I agree. Obama will beat us down. The “new normal” will prevail. Lots of grumbling but the brute power of the federal government is just too much, the Cruzes and Lees just too few. The Republicans, as a whole, are useless. They don’t really want Obamacare to fail anyway.

I’m afraid I agree. Obama will beat us down. The “new normal” will prevail.

rrpjr on November 15, 2013 at 4:04 PM

A couple of weeks ago I might have agreed with you. Not so much now. When Americans. When voters get letters in the mail cancelling their insurance with no other option than high priced wealth redistribution….. new game.

This is a two pronged attack immediately. One, it shows compassion to those who are getting hosed, really hosed by trying to comply with the law, realizing of course that this won’t open the flood gates right away. Two, it forces Reid and Obama to vote on this. Either one doesn’t let it pass is the bad guy.

Long term, this is the death of the exchanges, for good. Because the next fix will be coming right before the next elections and the exchange prices will be out of sight. Totally worse than now. This will force sky high prices with no way to get enough subsidy money out front to make a big impact.

You know – as opposed to actually having to explain themselves and not having anything they can remotely point to with any shred of credibility. Midas on November 15, 2013 at 3:43 PM

I feel ya, but the fact remains that the insurance companies cannot just break the law and offer policies that are now illegal.
What CEO is going to sign off on that?

You’re saying that the Democrats are spineless lying bastards. Okay! If not for the Upton bill they would just say that the GOP is the party of no and won’t help fix this mess, then if Landraeioueuax’s bill passes the senate

Your average Dem voter isn’t half as clued in as you are, as you know, so don’t expect so much insight from them as to make iron clad logical arguments necessary. Without Upton, if Landreeaiosueax’s bill were passed and presented to Boehner, he’d say no, and the commie press would be filtering all of this to favor the Democrats no matter what.

It is completely unworkable, crumbling before our eyes, nothing can fix it, it’s the beginning of the end.

I feel ya, but the fact remains that the insurance companies cannot just break the law and offer policies that are now illegal.
What CEO is going to sign off on that?

You’re saying that the Democrats are spineless lying bastards. Okay! If not for the Upton bill they would just say that the GOP is the party of no and won’t help fix this mess. Without Upton, if Landreeaiosueax’s bill were passed and presented to Boehner, he’d say no, and the commie press would be filtering all of this to favor the Democrats no matter what.

It is completely unworkable, crumbling before our eyes, nothing can fix it, it’s the beginning of the end.

We just found ourselves in a chess game with Obama and he only had his king and a pawn left. Now would seem a bad time to decide to let him trade his pawn in for the rooks, bishops and knights he’d already lost, no matter how confident we think we are that he’s going to lose anyway.

Things happen that don’t work out the way we think they will sometimes.

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My guess they were voting on principle and want the ACA to collapse under it’s own weight.
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I see my congressman – S. Maloney (D) (NY-18) voted No. He’s a first term congressman, in a swing district, and rightfully concerned – as well he should.

I don’t tink most people understand just how bad this is going to get. Krauthammer gets it. By January most Dems will be begging to scrap the entire bill and start over. Watch the implosion as it escalates.

I don’t think most people understand just how bad this is going to get. Krauthammer gets it. By January most Dems will be begging to scrap the entire bill and start over. Watch the implosion as it escalates.

dddave on November 15, 2013 at 9:17 PM

There will be no starting over. The Democratics only snuck through Obamacare because they had a very rare once-in-a-generation supermajority. In a divided Congress there will be nothing anywhere near the magnitude of the crap-pile that Obamacare is, and that’s good.

The only acceptable path is to kill Obamacare and go back to what we had before Obamacare which is looking better every day.