I can not get my 15 week old puppy to stop eating her poo! she is not house trained yet but we are working on it. If she goes outside i can catch her if she is trying to do it but she gets sneaky inside and will go into the kitchen or away from me where i cant see her and she will poo. then when i call her she will come running around the corner with a poo in her mouth like its a treat. does anyone have any experience with this or have any suggestions?

K9Friend

December 5th, 2005, 08:23 PM

patience and a routine is what you need.
How many times a day do you feed your dog?
Most pups will poo 15 min to 30 min after eating first thing in the morning.
When your pup poos outside - PRAISE, and give her a small treat.

Lucky Rescue

December 5th, 2005, 08:31 PM

This behavior is so common it could be said to be normal.

You aren't going to get her housetrained if you allow her to go around the house and relieve herself. Your goal is to prevent mistakes and accidents and not try and correct after the fact.

Inside, you must either confine her or tie her to you with a leash and take her outside at regular intervals, also on leash so you can stop her from eating her stools.

Take her out after she eats, plays and wakes up. Stand there until she goes, then praise her and if she tries to eat it, say "Leave it" and direct her away.

heather331

December 5th, 2005, 09:32 PM

i dont allow her to potty in the house...i am working very hard on potty training, but she does have accidents. as far as feeding (i already know im going to get lectured for this) she doesnt get fed on a set schedule. if i notice her bowl is empty ill fill it up. later if she wants more she will bark at her bowl or bring it to me.

Prin

December 5th, 2005, 09:39 PM

Free feeding is fine as long as the dog is at a healthy weight. But, I hope you realize that it is much harder to judge when your dog will want to go out if you don't know when she ate, and that might hinder the housetraining process.

You can try charcoal cookies (they sell them at dog food stores). Those supposedly take some of the tasty smell away.

Otherwise, what food are you feeding? With foods that are high in fillers (like corn), a lot of unabsorbed food comes out the other end and the doggy can smell the proteins, etc, and will try to give it a second go to try to absorb as much as they can (not a good thing, as along with those nutrients comes E coli and other harmful bacteria from the colon....). You might want to think about switching to a better food if yours has fillers in it.;)

(Just from experience, my doggies were on the best food at my park and when the poopie-eater used to come to the park, my doggies' loads were the only ones she didn't care at all for... Just a little anecdotal evidence, but sometimes it's not about the food at all....:D )

Lucky Rescue

December 5th, 2005, 09:57 PM

Free feeding a puppy is going to make housetraining very tricky and impossible to set a schedule. It can also make dogs overweight and very picky eaters. I really suggest you feed her meals at set times, and take the bowl away if not eaten within 15 minutes or so.

gets sneaky inside and will go into the kitchen or away from me where i cant see her and she will poo.

If you confine her when you can't watch her, or tie her to you, she wouldn't be able to do this. Every time she poops in the house, the behavior is reinforced because it feels good!

But of course, it's your choice!:)

heather331

December 5th, 2005, 10:11 PM

she eats purina puppy chow...is that ok? if not what is better for her? I would like to start feeding her on a set schedule but she is a nibbler. she will get a mouthful of food and then lay down and eat it and then go back for more later. she never stands there and eats alot at one time. do you still suggest i take up her bowl. how many times a day should she eat and when?

StaceyB

December 5th, 2005, 10:36 PM

She should be supervised at all times and if you are unable to she needs to be in a safe room or crated. She should not be able to leave your sight, use gates. As for the other, as gross as it is as long as it is her own it doesn't pose a health risk. You can get deter, I believe she is old enough to take it. The best solution is to clean it as soon as it happens.

technodoll

December 5th, 2005, 10:38 PM

Puppy chow (and any other stuff you can pluck off grocery and pharmacy shelves & walmart) is the lowest-grade dog food on the market and IMO, no dog should be submitted to it :yuck: So, no big surprise that your puppy is not a big eater... it is fillers, preservatives, meat by-products and low-quality grains. Better to dump that bag and go get her a some holistic kibble, i am pretty sure you will see an improvement on her appetite. adding a bit of canned food to the dry food at mealtimes will ensure she eats her meals when you put the bowl down. Twice per day should do it for her age. if she does not eat after 20 minutes, pick up & put away until next mealtime. Your puppy will quickly understand that she either eats when the food is there, or it will go away. this will help you twofold: she will not feel the need or desire to eat her poop anymore, and her housebreaking will be that much easier since you will know exactly what needs to go out, based on what went in, and when.

here is a great resource to get you started: The dog food project: identifying better foods
http://www.mordanna.com/dogfood/index.php?page=identify

(hint: the better dog foods are only available in good pet shops)

another good article: http://www.boxerworld.com/feeding/

:queen:

heather331

December 5th, 2005, 10:44 PM

could someone give me a few brands of food that are good for her

Prin

December 5th, 2005, 10:48 PM

These two are the best two I have found so far... You can look at them and compare with the ingredients in the puppy chow. Which would you eat?

Wellness Super5Mix Puppy (http://www.oldmotherhubbard.com/dogs/wellness_detail.asp?pCode=dryDogSup5MixPuppy)
If you have a large breed doggie, this one is great too: Solid Gold WolfCub (http://www.solidgoldhealth.com/products/showproduct.php?id=61&code=180)

technodoll

December 5th, 2005, 10:49 PM

here you go:

http://www.iei.net/~ebreeden/kibble.html

(IMO, Iams and Eukanuba (pukanuba!), Pro Plan and Science Crap (diet) should NOT be on that list, but the rest looks ok)

You will find that she will actually eat better meals on a schedule. Take her food off the floor now and only leave water. Tomorrow give her the food for no more than 20 min. After the 20 min take the food away whether she ate it or not. Don't leave it longer and don't place it down again until the next scheduled feeding. She probably won't eat much for the first few feeding, don't worry. She will start to get hungry and begin to understand when the food appears and when it doesn't.
Free feeding dogs especially puppies can affect all areas of training.

heather331

December 5th, 2005, 10:52 PM

im not very familar with alot of those foods. i know of science diet and iams and those were listed. ill try either of those. thanks for the help!

Prin

December 5th, 2005, 10:56 PM

No, Science Diet and Iams are nearly as bad as Puppy Chow. You should head to the dog food forum to learn about how to read ingredient labels.;)

technodoll

December 5th, 2005, 10:56 PM

NOOOOOOOOOOOOO!

No science diet and no iams!!! they are bottom of the pile. please read the links i posted to get a better understanding on how to read dog food labels, and you will see what i mean!!!

:eek:

Prin

December 5th, 2005, 10:59 PM

NOOOOOOOOOOOOO!LOL Technodoll, I held back on my reaction.:D

technodoll

December 5th, 2005, 11:01 PM

:highfive: ya gotta let it out sometimes, LOL!

man i hate those dog food mega corporations :mad:

Prin

December 5th, 2005, 11:03 PM

I hate how the ones who advertise the most and have their names at the tip of everybody's tongue are the crappiest and most horrible foods out there! I hate how the price difference is a deterrent for people to switch when in the long run it costs you less because you feed less and you don't have to bring your dog to the vet for little things all the time.:rolleyes: If only people knew. It only takes max 6 months to figure it out and to never go back.

heather331

December 5th, 2005, 11:04 PM

geeezzz....im lost:confused:
the only two i was familiar with are bad? where can i find these other kinds? i didnt know this was so complicated. Ive had dogs all my life and we always fed them "normal" (grocrey store) food. ahyayaya:(

Prin

December 5th, 2005, 11:06 PM

You may have always fed grocery store foods, but that is because you didn't have us to show you that there are way better foods! :) Usually those foods are in dog food stores or stores that sell the higher end foods and toys (like a pet shop without the pets...). The Solid Gold website has a store locator on it.;)

technodoll

December 5th, 2005, 11:07 PM

oh darling no worries, i too had to learn (the hard way) and remember that knowledge is power, the more you know, the more you can make great choices for your beloved furkids. and knowledge is right here, at your fingertips! and it's very easy!

first, you need to spend a few minutes reading.

please read these two articles and then let's take this over to the dog food section and continue chatting... ask questions... you will get fantastic answers from everyone i'm sure.

http://www.mordanna.com/dogfood/index.php?page=identify

http://www.boxerworld.com/feeding/

you'll see this is FUN! and your dog will thank you for it! :party:

heather331

December 5th, 2005, 11:16 PM

i just checked online at petsmart and they dont carry any of those foods. there are no other petstore where i live. what should i do?

Wellness Super5Mix Puppy (ALL ingredients):
Deboned Chicken, Chicken Meal, Oatmeal, Ground Barley, Salmon Meal (natural source of DHA), Canola Oil (preserved with mixed tocopherols, a natural source of vitamin E), Ground Brown Rice, Rice Bran (from brown rice), Tomatoes (natural source of lycopene), Natural Chicken Flavor, Rye Flour, Ground Millet, Flaxseed, Carrots, Apples, Spinach, Blueberries, Sweet Potatoes, Potassium Chloride, Calcium Carbonate, Dicalcium Phosphate
The ones I put in bold are ingredients you should avoid if you can. Corn meal is dehydrated corn. "Chicken" is not dehydrated, "Chicken Meal" is. Even being the second ingredient, there is probably more corn than chicken because the weight of the chicken drops down after cooking when all the water evaporates out of it.

"By-products"- all the stuff that is too disgusting for any humans to eat- they can contain decaying/rotting chickens too...:yuck:

"Fish Meal"-- what fish? Trout? Salmon? Guppies? Ingredients should be more specific.

Beet Pulp is another filler. It's in there to harden the stools (there is a thread about stool hardeners in the dog food forum from a couple of weeks ago). Hardeners make your dog seem healthier because it takes a lot more to get diarrhea (something that isn't pleasant but is very helpful when judging how healthy your doggy is).

Egg product- eggs not fit for human consumption.

Brewers' anything (rice or yeast)- whatever is left after processing for human foods (i.e. not many nutrients).

You get the picture? Now look at the Wellness- there's not much in there that a normal person would not eat.

technodoll

December 5th, 2005, 11:17 PM

ok give me the petsmart link and i will find a good food for you in their list, ok ? :highfive:

Prin

December 5th, 2005, 11:18 PM

i just checked online at petsmart and they dont carry any of those foods. there are no other petstore where i live. what should i do?
Call me naive, but if there's a big enough market for a petsmart to open up, I'm pretty sure there will be a few smaller dog food stores around. Have you tried the store locator on Solid Gold's site? Store Locator (http://solidgoldhealth.com/stores/)

technodoll

December 5th, 2005, 11:19 PM

great crash course Prin! :highfive:

Prin

December 5th, 2005, 11:20 PM

:o I have to keep up my foody reputation...:D (It's expected of me at this point)

technodoll

December 5th, 2005, 11:23 PM

i am soooo happy to have an ally! :grouphug:

so what do you feed your furkids?... and how did you get passionate about this subject (as i obviously am too, LOL)?

Prin

December 5th, 2005, 11:24 PM

Solid Gold Wolf King (I have one allergic to wheat and corn and the other has a chicken intolerance...)

technodoll

December 5th, 2005, 11:26 PM

do you just feed the dry food, or?... :crazy:

jawert1

December 5th, 2005, 11:29 PM

Hey Heather, I know, it's totally confusing. I got lucky that the shelter that I adopted Simon and Peaches from fed Regal, which is a pretty good food IMHO. No fillers, byproduct or nasty stuff I can't pronounce. You may want to look in your local yellow pages (or superpages.com) for a feed mill near your home, a lot of times they carry the foods that Prin and technodoll mentioned. It takes a bit of research and maybe a bit of driving - I drive approx. 10 miles from my home to get their food, and potentially more expensive, but in the long run, your baby will be allergy free, have a beautiful coat, less smell to her poops and a far nicer disposition. Also, LR and Stacey are deadon - timed feedings will help you with overall training and housebreaking. Good luck and your pics of her are just darling :) She's lucky to have you as a very caring and conscientous mom :)

Prin

December 5th, 2005, 11:31 PM

I put in some Merrick canned food sometimes as a treat, but not too often... I'm on a student's budget.;)

But once you stick your nose in to the whole business of dog foods, it's really hard to pull it out again. Plus my doggies are the healthiest shiniest doggies around. They're walking ads... For some reason Solid Gold seems to have mixed opinions- one food store near here refuses to carry it because the owner says it's "unnatural". They carry Wellness and I seriously don't see what the difference is, or what makes Solid Gold "unnatural".

ok i found a pet store that isnt too far away that carries the solid gold...ill try that. thanks for the help and the lesson in doggy nutrition

Prin

December 5th, 2005, 11:34 PM

Heather, what kind of doggy do you have? I ask because Solid Gold has a lamb and rice puppy formula too (Hunchen Flocken), but it's far less tasty than the Wolf Cub (that's why I only really recommend the WolfCub even though both have great ingredients.)

Prin

December 5th, 2005, 11:35 PM

ok i found a pet store that isnt too far away that carries the solid gold...ill try that. thanks for the help and the lesson in doggy nutrition
Usually if they carry one good brand, they carry most of them.:)

heather331

December 5th, 2005, 11:35 PM

http://www.pets.ca/forum/showthread.php?t=21815

here's a thread i started concerning what type of dog she is....i dont know. she's a puppy though if thats what you were asking

Prin

December 5th, 2005, 11:38 PM

Ohhh! Ya, that's the cutie! She'd do great on Wolf Cub, I think. She'll be big enough.:)
I asked because WolfCub is for larger breeds and Hundchen Flocken is just regular.

WolfCub is loaded with Salmon, so you get the nicest coat out of it.:) Oh, and you might be able to set meal times because a lot of doggies totally wolf this food down...

heather331

December 5th, 2005, 11:40 PM

so wolfcub is my best bet you think?

technodoll

December 5th, 2005, 11:45 PM

question about solid gold... not knocking the food at all but don't you think it's quite grain-centric, compared to other holistic brands?... just curious what you think... also it's the only kibble sample my silly dog never wanted to come close to, and he will eat any because he thinks it's cookies...

so heather, perhaps get a sample to try it out before buying a whole bag, *just in case* your dog does not like it... or make sure the store has a good refund- return policy. although i'm sure the jump from purina to this will be a great improvement and doggy will love it!

prin, where are you in montreal? :party:

ps: my doggy is mostly on a natural raw diet.... with a bit of everything thrown in to supplement it... he eats better than we do, LOL!

Wellness is great too, and maybe a couple of dollars cheaper, but some doggies don't like wellness foods (like my little one..). Merrick is more expensive.

Just switch VERY VERY gradually. The doggy's belly has to sort of "relearn" how to digest because there isn't anything in the food to help with digestion. So start with a little new and the rest old and feed a bit more new and a bit less old food for between 7 and 14 days, depending on how sensitive she is. The first little while, the stools will be HUGE and smelly (!) (they call that "detoxifying") but within a couple of months at most, the doggy should get better than normal again.:)

Prin

December 5th, 2005, 11:50 PM

question about solid gold... not knocking the food at all but don't you think it's quite grain-centric, compared to other holistic brands?... just curious what you think... also it's the only kibble sample my silly dog never wanted to come close to, and he will eat any because he thinks it's cookies...
It depends which one. The "holistic" one has very little meat in it. Wolf King is more meaty and every dog I have ever told to try it LOVES it. Our doggies wake us up to eat in the morning.

I could never feed a raw diet (or a cooked diet) because I have a hard enough time feeding myself...:D And my doggies are doing so great.

I'm actually in Laval now... But I still buy my food at Woofers on Sources...

ok well... only the ingredients up to the first source of fat makes the bulk of the food so here is what it is... after the water is cooked out of the bison, it will fall to the end of the list... remains salmon meal for main meat source, then 4 sources of grain... then some bison. so basically this is grains, then meat. not a reeeeaallly great food IMO...

compare it to Chicken Soup for the Dog Lover's Soul (available almost everywhere in good feed shops and very affordable):

ps: note about the raw food diet... it's much cheaper than buying the kibble actually, LOL! as long as you have some kind of freezer space for buying in bulk...

Laval ain't far, i'm on the plateau! hello fellow montrealer, LOL!

heather331

December 5th, 2005, 11:55 PM

do you know if wellness has a website so i can find a store locator to see if the sell it at the store located near me?

technodoll

December 5th, 2005, 11:57 PM

Wellness: http://www.oldmotherhubbard.com/

Nature's Recipe: www.naturesrecipe.com

Eagle Pack: http://www.eaglepack.com/

Natural Balance: http://www.naturalbalanceinc.com/

Prin

December 6th, 2005, 12:00 AM

ok well... only the ingredients up to the first source of fat makes the bulk of the food so here is what it is... after the water is cooked out of the bison, it will fall to the end of the list... remains salmon meal for main meat source, then 4 sources of grain... then some bison. so basically this is grains, then meat. not a reeeeaallly great food IMO...True, but rice bran doesn't contribute much other than fiber, so I wouldn't really count it as a grain... (BTW, diss all you want. That's how we learned about dog foods, right?:D) The hard thing is finding a similar food without poultry for Boo and without corn or wheat for Jemma. After feeding fishy, it would be really hard to go back to any other meat (even if Boo would allow it) because the fur is just so different. (And their energy level too)

On the other hand, I don't agree with the protein only diets. The 42% protein ones? Solid Gold is supposed to come out with one too and I just think that is way too high. None of the meat we eat is 42% protein by mass.

heather331

December 6th, 2005, 12:03 AM

thanks for the information on the websites technodoll....oh yeah and our dogs have the same name except my dakota doesnt have a "h" on the end.

heather331

December 6th, 2005, 12:07 AM

so i guess now i need to put my cats on a better food too :( ....i'm such a bad mom

Prin

December 6th, 2005, 12:09 AM

compare it to Chicken Soup for the Dog Lover's Soul (available almost everywhere in good feed shops and very affordable):

ps: your dogs are gorgeous btw!! so shiny! :o
I was just looking again, and it's hard to say because the chicken soup has more big cheap grains, and combined, there might actually be more grain in the chicken soup than in the wolf King. Chicken soup has 6 real grains and Wolf King has 4, you know? So it might be like breaking down the grains so they don't show as much- like put in a ton of different grains, but when they all add up, there's a huge amount of grain? It's so hard because of how they word stuff and how they break it down. They need more specific nutrition breakdowns on their labels.

Prin

December 6th, 2005, 12:11 AM

so i guess now i need to put my cats on a better food too :( ....i'm such a bad mom
NO! You're not a bad mom! A bad mom is one who doesn't even consider switching foods even when they know all the facts. Some animals do better on the crap foods, but I wish people would at least try better foods, you know?

heather331

December 6th, 2005, 12:14 AM

ok petsmart carries this...thats good right?

Prin

December 6th, 2005, 12:16 AM

Carries what?

heather331

December 6th, 2005, 12:17 AM

http://www.petsmart.com/global/product_detail.jsp?PRODUCT%3C%3Eprd_id=84552444177 6319&FOLDER%3C%3Efolder_id=2534374302025917&ASSORTMENT%3C%3East_id=2534374302023689&bmUID=1133845972881
sorry i forgot to paste the link

But it's a bit better than IAMS, so if you're debating between the two, at least this one doesn't have by-products.;)

jessi76

December 7th, 2005, 03:25 PM

I was just looking again, and it's hard to say because the chicken soup has more big cheap grains, and combined, there might actually be more grain in the chicken soup than in the wolf King. Chicken soup has 6 real grains and Wolf King has 4, you know? So it might be like breaking down the grains so they don't show as much- like put in a ton of different grains, but when they all add up, there's a huge amount of grain? It's so hard because of how they word stuff and how they break it down. They need more specific nutrition breakdowns on their labels.

this is the exact reason I recently switched Tucker to Solid Gold.

technodoll

December 7th, 2005, 03:35 PM

out of curiosity i picked up a sample of solid gold after work (reveil du maitre is awesome!!) and again... dog sniffs, takes a kibble, and spits it out then walks away. it is the *only* kibble he does this with.

so really... he's an idiot, LOL!

(but i love him anyways)

Prin

December 7th, 2005, 04:47 PM

Which one? If you haven't already, you have to try the Wolf King..

technodoll

December 7th, 2005, 08:15 PM

it was the Holistique Blendz Adult Dog (fish). it really stank :yuck: but it was the only sample they had of SG... in any case... next bag will be Eagle Pack something cuz i have a coupon for it, LOL! what he ate today?... hmmm... breakfast was leftover pasta heated up in olive oil with 2 eggs and a $1 can of salmon... dinner was a raw bone-in chicken breast (.99/pound) and some raw chicken hearts - 1.25 lbs total - and before bed he will get a cup or two of chicken soup kibble.... so you see, some days it's less of a raw diet than other days :) noooooo my dog is not spoiled, noooooo! :angel:

Prin

December 7th, 2005, 09:25 PM

That's the worst one!! Any doggy wouldn't want a bite of that.:D Look out for the Wolf King and then you'll see.:)

jawert1

December 7th, 2005, 10:36 PM

First off, I will apologize in advance for hijacking this thread - only temporarily mind you, but I was under the impression that chicken (poultry in general) bones were REALLY bad for dogs as they splinter and catch?

LM1313

December 8th, 2005, 03:15 AM

Chicken bones can splinter and pierce a doggy's innards. I always had to be very strict with my dad about not feeding Ebony chicken bones. He'd always say, "But wolves in the wild eat whatever they want!" Yeah, and some of them probably die from it and we never know it! Besides, how many chickens are running around in the wild . . . :rolleyes:

~LM~

Prin

December 8th, 2005, 03:18 AM

Any bones cooked can splinter, but supposedly raw ones are fine.:)

technodoll

December 8th, 2005, 09:37 AM

yes prin you are correct. RAW bones are totally soft and digestible, it's the COOKED bones that are dangerous. NEVER feed cooked bones of any kind!

mother nature has been feeding carnivores on this planet for millions of years without our intervention and yes, that includes bones (ever watch The Discovery Channel? LOL). kibble has only been around for what, 60 years? a mere drop in the ocean of evolutionary time. dogs are built to eat & digest bones, sinew, cartiledge, meat, just like their wolf brothers.

check out http://www.geocities.com/havens_home/feedraw.htm for a great visual that is an eye-opener.

and http://rawfed.com/myths/index.html explains things even further.

i have NEVER had a problem with my dog eating raw bones of any kind. he is the healthiest dog i know. vets hate me cuz i never need to give them a dime!