Poor people need aid but when you give them free stuff they grow dependent and stop trying to help themselves, and even worse they breed out of control and make it even worse.
Rich people need to pay more taxes because this whole "job creator" talk is nonsense and rich people wield too much power and political influence.
And.... back in the 50's the 80% tax rate worked fine.
But.... any tax raise now will not put any dent in our national debt, and... giving this administration any more tax dollars now will just be a wasteful gov't program that doesn't get cut, and... the 80% tax rate worked back then because anything worked back when the post war economy was rolling (demographics)
Sadly this whole mess is heading for a crash.

I become more convinced of that with every page I turn in the WSJ and in the many books like Wiedemers' "Aftershock" series and "Crash Proof 2.0" I read and every time another multi-billionaire investor says, "We're farked". One very persuasive common thread is their absence of politics and theory; they stay focused on economic data and logic, written for laymen. Some point out that this freight train's brakes failed under Reagan and that Obama has put that freight train into full afterburner as a matter of policy, but their focus remains on the fiscal fallacies, not the ideologies or politics. If they are as right this time as they were about 2008, the real value of stocks, bonds, most commodities, real estate investments, and the USD will be decimated within 1 to 4 years. And they don't mean in the technically correct use of the word, "decimated" (a 10% drop); they mean in its popularly misused interpretation: a 90% drop ... and lasting for as long as a generation ... globally.

Even if it turns out to be science fiction, unlike their predictions of 2008, it makes interesting and informative reading. Schiff/"Crash Proof 2.0" has probably the clearest presentation, but the Wiedemers, although good friends of Schiff, explicitly say he doesn't go far enough, that he's too optimistic on the global (almost every nation) and markets (almost every market) expanse and depth of this collapse. Both (and many other) sources like gold, but Schiff also holds some faith in select foreign markets; the Wiedemers emphatically do not. Schiff believes that fiscal abyss is imminent; the Wiedemer's latest estimate (as of November) is 2 to 4 years.

None of these and many other sources that I've read and watched are paying a lot of attention, other than as Breaking News value, to this little "Fiscal cliff" speed bump beyond its literal decimation of our national defense. And why should they? After all, what are several percentage points increase in everyone's taxes, much more in health insurance costs, and many hundred thousand more jobs lost compared to the destruction of virtually everyone's life's savings and pensions AND the decimation of our national defense?

I hope these many sources are wrong, even if it clobbers the value of precious metals held under government scrutiny in prudent investors' Roth IRA account vaults on the east coast. All but the people who are going 100% gold will survive such an error. HOWEVER, not all of us will survive the decimation of our national defense capability. Many of our immediate and extended family members will ultimately rue that mistake.

OK, time for a few imbecilic one-liners from the children's table.

Last edited by isobars on Wed Dec 12, 2012 11:13 am; edited 1 time in total

Peter Shiff is one of the great scam artists of our time. He yelled and screamed that the world was coming to an end in 2006-2007, and he was right...problem is that his advisory firm was 100% LONG US assets, and the clients got decimated. Weidemer is another SCAM artist. I have read the Aftershock books, and they are filled with BS. Next thing ISO will tout is the felon Porter Stansbury, who claims Obama's goal is for a third term.

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