Great video Brad. I actually have been having this same revelation in my own throw. I was finding the less I opened my shoulders the better I was able to snap the disc and get it to rotate around my index and thumb. What I was actually doing was throwing with my back against a fence, preventing my shoulders from opening past 90 degrees. I think what is interesting about your pointing about not spinning on the plant foot is that, in my opinion, the plant foot actually serves to stop your rotation. I have been messing with slowing the shoulders down so the arm will swing out naturally and the only way to do so (slow/pause the shoulders) seems to be a plant step that is firm and not spinning. Only in the follow through does it seem that the plant foot should be pivoting to point toward the target.

I feel that this video of Avery really demonstrates this point. Notice how his right foot (toe specifically) is pointing 90 degrees left of the target until basically the follow through. The shoulders have to pause in order for the lower arm to swing out with the momentum provided by the hips, torso and shoulders.

Any thoughts?

Thank you for the great video Brad and I am glad to hear I am on the right track.

Thanks for the video Bradley. I've delayed the foot pivot and shoulder turn lately automatically, when i concentrated on pushing the elbow farther toward the target prior to the elbow chop. With less, but some, emphasis on keeping the thumb pointed away from the target as long as possible.

I had noticed from a high speed video that my form had deteriorated in that i wasn't getting the elbow out far enough. I was doing a bent elbow form and with an early shoulder rotation and foot pivot spinning to follow through early on. When i managed to delay the shoulder rotation and foot pivot long enough to get the elbow forward all those practice points combined gave me more D.

I tried active wrist snap too, but i am really lacking in stopping the wrist after the active wrist snap. I may be too late in trying to apply the brakes in the wrist once it goes actively plus passively past neutral left-right wise. Active wrist snap didn't give so much extra D that i could say for sure if it gave me added D. The differences between throws were so small, the winds varied and i had too few repetitions to determine anything.

I think it is time to revisit right then left pec drills concentrating on elbow moving forward and delaying the shoulders and leg pivot accordingly. Once this darn cold lets me. The weather is going awry fast.

Flat shots need running on the center line of the tee and planting each step on the center line. Anhyzer needs running from rear right to front left with the plant step hitting the ground to the left of the line you're running on. Hyzer is the mirror of that.

Soo... Are you saying that opening the shoulers doesn 't add to the rip, or just stressing that it happens much later than most think?

Edit: a while ago you compared moving the shoulder to moving the handle of a fishing pole saying you didn't need to move it much, just with the right timing in order to get the end to whip back and forth. Is that kind of what you were getting at with the "ever so slightly" comment in your video?

Redisculous wrote:Soo... Are you saying that opening the shoulers doesn 't add to the rip, or just stressing that it happens much later than most think?

Edit: a while ago you compared moving the shoulder to moving the handle of a fishing pole saying you didn't need to move it much, just with the right timing in order to get the end to whip back and forth. Is that kind of what you were getting at with the "ever so slightly" comment in your video?

Yes, I'd say that's it...

Oh the shoulder opens. It is like the little bit the hand moves when spinning a rope... Small motion at the hub equals faster motion at the diameter.

"The reasonable man adapts himself to his environment. The unreasonable man adapts his environment to himself, therefore all progress is made by unreasonable men."-George Bernard Shaw