It really rubs me the wrong way when children go through these procedures. If they want to do it as a adults, that's perfectly fine, but right now they are not capable of making such life altering decisions. Jesus.

well hes already trying to chop off his own dick, will it still be there when he is legally considered an adult?
better to get the treatment now and grow up as a girl (pretty much force nature to make him grow up as a girl) than to grow up as a boy to a man, then go through the surgery and look like an ugly bitch of a pretend women

one shapes the metal while its hot, shaping it cold will make it crack

most kids grow up aspiring to be like their parents, some kids are driven to success like mom and dad, maybe even try to be more successful to compete with parents...some are redneck trash where sons grow up to be wifebeaters like daddy or women who tolerate wifebeaters because mommy did

kids who grow up in same sex parent families may seek to emulate that behaviour or at least experiment with it, and same sex parents who have a kid of the opposite gender may feminize them
this doesnt hurt daughters because either way, lesbian or gay parents, they still take up on a feminine personality, whereas with sons, them taking on feminine personalities end up with cases like this, they get confused what they are

Internal gender is based on prenatal hormones. You can't make them identify as an alternate gender except through heavy mental conditioning. Which, unless said parents are both insane master psychologists, isn't going to happen.

Sorry, I was tired last night and it might have given slightly the wrong message. What I'm saying is that if their prenat hormones say they're going to end up identifying as gender X, there's very little you can do to make them identify as gender Y, and vice versa.

A good example is Victorian times. All children were treated as girls until they hit puberty, but you didn't have Brunel identifying as a woman.

And how do you quantify these cases? You can't say what gender they are born as except through extensive hormone testing during pregnancy, and it's not done due to issues with people possibly aborting it because of prejudices. So those "multiple cases" sound like bull to me.

And you're confusing gender I.D. with sexual orientation. Just because someone identifies as a woman doesn't affect the gender they like - and for the record, Elton John and Richard Simmons see themselves as male. They're just irritatingly camp.

I don't know where you're fear of "a world full of [people] acting all twilight faggy sparkly" is coming from, since homosexuals only make up 5-10% of the population, and those mostly act like your average dude. My best mate is a lesbian, and you wouldn't know unless she told you, since she's got a (rather unfortunately for the male world) good woman's body, she wears dresses and the like and she acts feminine. I've another mate that happens to like cock, and the same applies to him - **** , I'm sure most of his workmates haven't noticed. "Peackoc gays" such as Louis Spence, which is what you're afraid of, make up a tiny fraction fringe society of the homosexual scene. I think you need to retire the beating stick and accept that same sex parents can be just as good or as bad as your average parent.

i was going to rant but then i saw your last comment and a compliment softened me a bit

......SO..... to be reasonable
it is a common issue that children seek to emulate their parents, growing up thinking what mommy and daddy are lie is whats 'normal' hence, in same sex parents, the kids will grow up thinking thats normal and most often seek to be like them
this will by and large end up with sons growing up to experiment or straight out dive right into same sex relationships without the kid actually being officially of the gay disorder

i have met girls raised by lesbian parents who, while not being born gay do have preference for females and are actively flirty with them
i have not met kids raised by gay men so have yet to determine how they act

"i have met girls raised by lesbian parents who, while not being born gay do have preference for females and are actively flirty with them
i have not met kids raised by gay men so have yet to determine how they act"

I do know a dude who were raised by gay men, and he's straight as an arrow. Also, being gay is normal. It's as normal as you being straight. It's determined by hormones, not psychology - it can be suppressed by psychology, as with my aforementioned lesbian mate. Her dad was massively anti-gay, and as such she suppressed it until she hit her early 20s.

"it is a common issue that children seek to emulate their parents, growing up thinking what mommy and daddy are lie is whats 'normal' hence, in same sex parents, the kids will grow up thinking thats normal and most often seek to be like them "

If what you're saying is true then gay people shouldn't exist, since their parents would be straight. Do you see how that doesn't work? My grandparents are anti-gay, and yet my uncle is happily married to a guy called Ken.

well im sure your uncle stayed in the closet for a bit, trying to live straight before the gay side of him took control and he came out to his illness despite how he was raised

yes emulating isnt 100% but it does build in ideals, like a gay kid raised by straight parents will feel guilty about being their way when the parents are normal, as much as a straight kid raised by gay parents will feel out of place, and either experiment with gayness or feel uncomforatble with their gender (as this boy raised by lesbians did)

well because in the normal world, heterosexuality is the mainstay of humanity, and homosexuality is a minority
as much as most people in the world are ****** in the head one way or another, the majority are perceived as 'normal' the minority gets dubbed abnormal thus ill

but times will change

just like how a couple thousand years ago, the majority of people on the planet were of siberian heritage (aka siberian/native canadian/native american/south american) then the mutation that created white people popped up and over time, they spread like rats till then white people became the majority

one day, gays will hold the majority and that will be considiered 'normal' and straight people will be the illness

scientists have theorized this....its been suggested that since the y chromosome is shrinking,...in say 200,000 years, there will be no y chromosome and the world will just be pure self-fertilising females

myself, i say that explains the current gay issue....the mutating y chromosome is making girls that think like guys and guys that think like girls, as the y chromo pushes us towards asexual female dominance

"one day, gays will hold the majority and that will be considiered 'normal' and straight people will be the illness"

Actually, homosexuality rates have been steady since BC times. Check out ancient Greece or Rome. Still around one in ten there, cos they were ok with homosexuality. It was just a thing that happened, and no one really bothered themselves about it. Same can be said of any society that hasn't evolved from Abrahamic principles, as such principles see gayness as something bad and wrong. I wouldn't worry yourself unduly about that kind of thing. The only reason we're seeing an increase now is because we're an advanced society that is slowly accepting the fact that being gay is a fine thing to do, despite our Abrahamic roots.

It aint just humans either; chimps, dolphins, horses, dogs - all these species experience homosexuality borne from hormones. Those "scientists" you mentioned are practising junk science.

well love is an open thing, people can find love between genders, or within same gender,...hell some people can even fall in love with animals, are you going to say that its natural for 2 men to love each other but a person who falls in love with an animal is unnatural? the person can love the animal and depending on the animal, it could consider the person their life mate, thus love by animal standards

and taking a step back, you mentioned greece and rome....well id guess they didnt have laws giving special entitlements to gays, they just treated them as part of normal life, whereas today, gays get special legal protection just for being born,

yes, in some places they cant get married or adopt, BUT, they get protection from anything otherwise anti
any time a gay person disgrees with something, they can bleat the other party is against them because theyre gay, and in some countries, especially USA the land of lawyers, can get legal action started on the other party

Well, the whole card of equating gay love (between two humans who can both affirm that they love each other) and a human and an animal (only one of which can do so) has been called, so I'm evacuating this conversation with all due speed. I wish you luck in your strange, strange life, my friend.

well gays can be considered simply natures population control, a mutation that acts as a boundary to curb mankinds prolific side by same sex partners not having kids

then again, mankind has proven like most things it does, it ****** things up in this respect, let people **** their brains out with no regard to families able to sustain the kids they have, so despite gays, mankind is still overpopulating, making gays kinda redundant

so do you keep the roadblocks up when assholes just built sidestreets around them?

Huh? so you're saying we should remove gays from the population because people are ******* for fun? The reason for us breeding like mad is because we should be dying at 20, according to our metabolism. But thanks to the wonder of modern medicine, we aren't - so we're lasting longer, but still breeding as fast as a shorter lived organism. You'd remove the love and tenderness that thousands feel for each other because you feel it is impure?

Strength is unity and acceptance. And like I said, gay people have been around since the birth of mankind. Faith in humanity - all of humanity, not just your prescriptive view of what humanity is - should be more important.

well not really, im against corruption in the gene pool,
but since the world is not only so accepting of things going to **** but also encouraging it, ive just decided to not have kids and just let my family die with me so i dont condemn future generations into being part of the conservative minority that seems to be so hated

i admit, theres things MUCH worse than gays, just this topic was about that problem not the others

id say theres a difference between the old days when everyone came out and was gay, and today where its shunned and only the daring come out....it doesnt count in all those ill who dont come out or dont consider themselves 'gay'

indeed there are some who are too ashamed to come out, and others who just treat sex with men like prison - the 'woman' is the gay one while the dominant man considers himself straight as long as he doesnt take it in the ass

So with aforementioned German girl, there would have been very little you could have done to make them identify as a dude. You could have surrounded her with machismo and a strong father figure and made her read guns n' ammo, and she still would have wanted to be a woman, albeit most likely a little more quiet about it. Which wouldn't have been good for her.

That being said, 13 is too ******* early for that kind of treatment. They need to wait until they're old enough to make their decision properly.