Wow, this guy is so off track, he makes it sound as if you can't reproduce then you have no right to be in love. What about Heterosexuals that can't reproduce?I know I was born gay and I am a Christian - I'd like to know if we aren't born gay or straight, can this guy decide not to be attracted to women and make the "choice" to be attracted to men. the answer is no, and I can't make the "choice" to be attracted women it's not how God created me. He said that Moses said at the burning bush "I am what I am" well, I am what I am. He also made it sound as though being gay is only about eroticism, yes that's there, but no more than with hetersexuals. Gay men and women fall in love and have very loving relationships just as our "straight' counterparts do.

ActiveAndFit saidI hear this "natural law" thing being spouted more and more .. It reminds me of the Nazi party's eugenics propaganda .. scary. The pope adheres to it also ..

The pope also adheres to "no masturbation" . . .um. . .religon is ruining mankind. . .once again, we are animals still. By nature, animals are sexual creatures. Monkeys and apes have sex for fun and have been documented and filmed to having sex with same sex monkeys and apes. Dolphins. . . by far the most intelligent creatures on the planet (they dont destroy their surroundings). . .they masturbate together in packs by rubbing against eachother in circles in groups. Maybe we just need to abolish orginized religon. The ancient world had brothels and worshiped the male physique along with the falic symbol UNTIL christianity came around. . . .they then VANDELIZED artwork by adjusting them to their beliefs and covering parts of the artwork.

That's the problems with these kind of people .. natural for them has become a codeword for religious doctrine disguised as something more "scientific" like "nature" .. I mean nature just can't be wrong can it? But is is all a farce as you are pointing out .. it is ALL NATURAL. those behaviors occur naturally if you look at it in a TRULY scientific way. The thing that is unnatural for the most part is their religious doctrine ... resurrecting from the dead .. changing wine into blood .. miracles .. worshiping crosses, virgins, books .. calling a man who is celibate "father" as well as taking marriage advice from celibate men, etc all NOT NATURAL and nonsensical.

If you are not preserving your semen and sperm in a jar or bottle or something that will preserve it for all eternity until it finds a receptive egg, you are a murderer. If you're not peeing into something that you can seal and preserve for all eternity, you too are a murderer. We release sperm cells when we piss, yes, yes, yes, look it up, don't try to change my mind. If you are simply flushing these potentional people down the toilet, what does that say about you besides that you're obsessively sanitary? Every sperm is sacred and if you think otherwise, you're going to H E double L.

The big question from CPAC is "What are the evangelical right wing nuts demanding as the price of their support for Newt Gingrich ?"

Gingrich, you may remember, is twice divorced and has a long history of rather sordid affairs. (In my book those are not disqualifications from office, though being a mean-spirited ant-government fruit cake is. But, to the Bible thumpers, Newt's behavior is an abomination. Any guesses as to what promises for policy changes they will be wresting from Gingrich?)

flieslikeabeagle saidThe big question from CPAC is "What are the evangelical right wing nuts demanding as the price of their support for Newt Gingrich ?"

Gingrich, you may remember, is twice divorced and has a long history of rather sordid affairs. (In my book those are not disqualifications from office, though being a mean-spirited ant-government fruit cake is. But, to the Bible thumpers, Newt's behavior is an abomination. Any guesses as to what promises for policy changes they will be wresting from Gingrich?)

Gingrich recently converted to Catholicism, which is antithetical to most of the principles of evangelicalism. Despite his veering harder to the right on social issues, he has no chance of being elected to federal office. In fact, when he was speaker, he was run out of DC on a rail.

flieslikeabeagle saidThe big question from CPAC is "What are the evangelical right wing nuts demanding as the price of their support for Newt Gingrich ?"

Gingrich, you may remember, is twice divorced and has a long history of rather sordid affairs. (In my book those are not disqualifications from office, though being a mean-spirited ant-government fruit cake is. But, to the Bible thumpers, Newt's behavior is an abomination. Any guesses as to what promises for policy changes they will be wresting from Gingrich?)

Many in the evangelical camp are trying to rewrite the definition of divorce so that it becomes more palatable and thus does not carry the previous godly weight of one of the do nots. thus you will note evangelical christians are also getting divorced and remarried without so much of an eyebrow raised.

the evangelicals are simply demanding two things:1. you must be anti-abortion2. you must be anti-gay.

as long as you are against abortion and anti-gay; you are a christian and all of your other sins are overlooked - such is the gospel of the right wing evangelicals.

ActiveAndFit saidI hear this "natural law" thing being spouted more and more .. It reminds me of the Nazi party's eugenics propaganda .. scary. The pope adheres to it also ..

I agree. There are many who use natural law to argue against homosexuality and it is a disturbing trend. However, it seems that those using this argument have fixated on natural law as described by Thomas Aquinas in reference to same-sex unions, which itself appears to be more concerned with applying natural law to a particular circumstance rather than using natural law to understand the larger picture.

As I understand it, natural law, like so many other studies, is continuously evolving. For example, it was thought that slavery was normal and natural by those who subscribed to natural law theory. This is obviously no longer the case.

The point is that natural law is being twisted much the same way religion has been twisted to rationalize prejudice and discrimination. While I believe the rhetoric will strengthen the resolve of those who have already committed to the fight against homosexuality, I believe that most intelligent and rational individuals will reject this deceptive argument.