@ smash bros fan obviously the hardline republicans spiked ur koolaid. the proposed plan allows an option of whether or not you have the plan, you can choose.also, i never heard anything about forced doctor choices, they will let you choose to keep him/her

...other than that, i agree, stop complaining about tax hikes that may or may not exist! D: that is not why i started this thread!

You can't honestly expect us to believe you're naive enough to think taxes wouldn't be a part of this dialog. They're an integral component of the government run health care discussion you started. If this were the Should everyone have the best healthcare but never need it because we live in fantasyland where no one gets sick and only go to doctors to get lollipops thread and people started talking taxes, then yeah, sure... Better healthcare? Yes. US Government run healthcare? Ridiculous.

Yes, we are in the worst recession since WW II. It's not even a debate it's a fact.

The numbers do not lie. It isn't even as bad as the 1970s/1980s recession.

The unemployment rate via the US Department of Labor, clocks in around 9.4% for July, the inflation rate around 5.6% at it’s highest mark.

Reagan’s economic recession: The unemployment rate hit 9.71% in 1982 and the inflation rate around 14.76% in 1980 (which seeing how I was using the high mark from Bush’s last year, I am going to go on and use the high mark from Carter’s last year since the Recession carried over).

Now with those two economic indicators alone, the recession as it currently stands, isn’t as bad as during Reagan’s term. Now lets look at the Misery Index, a mathematical index and economic indicator made famous during Carter’s term. The current index, as it stands is at 8.07 as of June 2009. It’s current high point was at 11.47 during August.

When Reagan took office, the index was at 19.33. Nearly twice what it is, even at the height of this current recession in August. Just a few months before that in June 1980 the index was at 21.98. A level that hasn’t been reached since that time.

We use to have the goverment run our stuff and it was much better than the companies that run it now and only want to make profits out of you.If i would life in North-America i would be screwed by both sides i think, but i don't see.

If you are the richest country in the world yeat millions of people are actually uninsured because otherwise they wouldn't be able to buy food, there is something terribly wroong with your healthcare system.

The thing is, Obama's plans are nice but were is he going to get the money from now that there's a ginormous financial crisis going on with the government having lots of debts itself.

I personally prefer a system with little to no market-influence but that wouldn't work in America I think. It's probably a good approach for now to talk with both government bodies as well as businesses to make a proper health care system in the longer run, say 10 to 15 years like Obama has proposed.

To those living in countries with very strictly regulated health care, as Bram070 said, we used to have it in Holland and it worked fine! But market reforms only made things more difficult. I'm willing to pay a little more tax for proper health care and not the type that is good quality only if you pay more, making poor people getting the crappy health care nobody deserves. And the worst thing is, now they all start competing with each other at stunt prices for which no company can really provide good quality health care. Result: They merge into larger and larger companies to be able to keep on providing good health care so we end up with a new monopoly but instead of the government its just a few large companies which will always be profit-oriented.

I DON'T WANT TO FREAKING CHOOSE my health care company who only CARES ABOUT PROFIT, I just want the government to provide the basic health care I need and no bureacratic BS.

From all the countries I've seen the following rule applies:

Free government healthcare: higher taxes but everyone is insured.

Market healthcare: the more money you have and the lesser you need health care insurance, the better quality you get. But if you're less fortunate you will have to do with cheap, crappy health care while you need to be insured because you're short on money yourself.

I'm willing to pay a little more for the money and I don't want to choose what I may need or not need. I just want it when I need it.

What our health system needs is one able to buy insurance across state lines. That right there would cut costs dramatically. Another thing all of these frivolous medical cases should be dropped. Which would cause less unnecessary medical tests. Thus dropping costs. Another thing would be to have the option to buy catastrophic insurance that would cover major medical expenses, and then you could pay for yourself to go see a doctor. This would also drop prices do to a capitalist system. See there is no reason for the government or any for that matter to run health care. Oh, and another great reason why our government should not steal the health care system from us is that there is no way that we can afford this!

...other than that, i agree, stop complaining about tax hikes that may or may not exist! D: that is not why i started this thread!

You can't honestly expect us to believe you're naive enough to think taxes wouldn't be a part of this dialog. They're an integral component of the government run health care discussion you started. If this were the Should everyone have the best healthcare but never need it because we live in fantasyland where no one gets sick and only go to doctors to get lollipops thread and people started talking taxes, then yeah, sure... Better healthcare? Yes. US Government run healthcare? Ridiculous.

well part of that comment was the fact that the proposed taxes are for people making over $250,000 US dollars.do you even make close to that?

No system is perfect but I prefer having the NHS over a private system, you could argue both are biased in some way, but I'd rather a system biased to the most needy over a system biased towards the most wealthy.

@Zenman: And when the money raised by the so-called "proposed" taxes falls short of paying the increased costs, where do you suppose the balance will come from?

And regarding your question, well... you'd be wrong to make any assumptions about my income, and very wrong in your implication.

two things. number one: i was not assuming what you make, i do not know, but the majority of americans do NOT make close to $250,000 dollars. second: wouldn't it be better if every american did not have to worry about their health, even if taxes are raised a little?