I do love the mood being set by the editing and art direction. So many quick cutaways to slightly ominous shots of things barely glimpsed through doorways or shots in which the distant background comes into focus and the camera lingers juuust long enough to make you think someone or something is going to emerge but then it cuts quickly away again. Every shot is pregnant with a kind of tension and dread that I haven't really experienced since the first season of True Detective.

For some reason I am beginning to suspect Alan. The little exchange about how he should spend the night with Adora and he gets the immediate rejection might be telling. Then again, it could be just another red herring.posted by Ber at 12:57 PM on July 24, 2018 [1 favorite]

I'm glad that we know why she keeps listening to the same music over and over again.

I'm sad that I didn't catch a single hidden word this episode, I felt like I won that game in episodes 1 and 2.posted by sacrifix at 6:34 PM on July 24, 2018

There are hotels/motels in Wind Gap. Even after recently spoiling the story for myself by reading about the book, I still don't understand why Camille is staying at home after fleeing the small town for the big city.posted by emelenjr at 8:43 AM on July 25, 2018

I still don't understand why Camille is staying at home after fleeing the small town for the big city.

Because many people who grew up in dysfunctional families never get over it - and clearly Camille certainly hasn't. I think it informs a lot about her character that she's voluntarily putting herself back in that house with her abusive mother. She doesn't see another option.posted by something something at 12:58 PM on July 25, 2018 [4 favorites]

Oh, that was brutal, in a way that I can't shake. I'm glad I can't binge this right now, because it's pretty grim right now.

This show's timeline is harder to follow than WestWorld.

It's not as extended, so it doesn't feel as disjointed or tricky. Skimming over the Wikipedia article on the miniseries gave me some hints that I didn't pick up directly from the show, which I won't mention here in case they're spoilers unless you've read the book.

Because many people who grew up in dysfunctional families never get over it - and clearly Camille certainly hasn't. I think it informs a lot about her character that she's voluntarily putting herself back in that house with her abusive mother. She doesn't see another option.

To complicate things, her mother has this (inflated) sense of needing to appear normal, and the normal thing to do is have visiting family stay with you, if you have the means, and they definitely have the means. Despite having a toxic family, she still wants to make her momma happy. Also, a happy mother means a mother less likely to interfere with her job.

For some reason I am beginning to suspect Alan. The little exchange about how he should spend the night with Adora and he gets the immediate rejection might be telling.

I was starting to suspect Alan, too, in part because I mis-heard him call Amma a grown woman, but he was talking about Camille. Still, it got me thinking on the teeth, and the show's focus on "almost a woman" -- I started thinking that pulling teeth was somehow trying to hide the fact that these young teenage girls are adults by pulling out the adult teeth. And he's featured in the show, but not featured. Camille Preaker's step-dad, apparently wealthy but not because of the town's hog industry (unless there's a Crellin Farm somewhere, in addition to the Preaker Farm). Composed in the face of conflict, but not shying away or playing blind. It might not be him, but it feels like they've eliminated other suspects, and I don't get the feeling this show would not introduce the "villain" by this point, considering that the show season is only 8 episodes long, and it sounds like this is a one-season miniseries.

I'm sad that I didn't catch a single hidden word this episode, I felt like I won that game in episodes 1 and 2.

Vulture is updating their "subtle words" article and it now includes episode 3. "Delicious, Nourishing Meat" is pretty dark. I was going to say it seems like there were fewer hidden words in this episode, but I see I'm quite wrong, based on the Vulture article.

And because this is the sort of show that gets in my head, here are my musings on the fans:
- Fans are not air conditioning, which changes the air (drying and cooling)
- Fans keep on spinning, move air and make you feel cooler, but they don't really change things
- Or fans push things along, move them (again, without really changing them)

This show weighs on my mind, which is a good mark for the show, but now I have to find something happy to think about for a while.posted by filthy light thief at 10:35 PM on July 25, 2018

I think Camille is fairly typical in deciding to stay at her mother's house. People from abusive backgrounds do this all the time. And the story wouldn't really work without her being thrust back into all of that; Camille sitting in her car drinking a mini of vodka before stepping into the house for the first time is very relatable. Also, Adora's seeming ambivalence about having her there is excellent. It suggests there is something to be learned, something she is guarding, as well as playing into the dynamic of the toxic family. Despite everything, Camille is still trying to win her over on some level.

In addition, Camille's insider status-- however ambivalent-- is giving her an entrée in a number of ways. Showing up to the funeral from a motel where you're staying is much different from showing up with your socially prominent mother with whom you are staying. And then sneaking around the kid's room? People will accept this sort of thing from a member of Adora's family, not from a black sheep who is visiting for the weekend. Further, Camille needs the information she can get from her family and their friends. Nothing in this series is serving only one purpose, and usually more than two.posted by BibiRose at 7:05 AM on July 26, 2018 [4 favorites]

I see Camille as still being very cowed and terrorized by her mother. She can manage enough to leave town and limit communication, but that's because those are the only ways she can deal with her mother. She can't set boundaries. I don't know that she even has boundaries per se, her self-harm is the physical reflection of her emotional self.

Over and over she's placating and submissive to her mother. The private moment between them after Marian's funeral, when she tentatively attempted to place her head in her mother's lap only to be rebuffed (or made irrelevant by her sister), is a model of their relationship. Even now. Despite herself, she still yearns. She's fearfully attached. She can be distant for a while, but she's still in orbit.

A lot of things are different because of gender roles, but I think the reason this show makes me so anxious is because I had a narcissistic, abusive parent who, in a very real sense, terrorized me. Even assuming Camille could resist the pull and stay in a motel, the size and culture of the town means that just being there places her squarely inside her mother's context, aware (without being told, but nevertheless repeatedly told) that at the other end of everything she does or says is her mother's reaction. She'd be on eggshells, anyway; at least this way (she tells herself) nothing will come as a surprise. Really, though, there's this compulsive need to attempt to manage, as if that were possible.

Strikingly, it's Amma who seems to most have succeeded in navigating her mother's treacherous waters. But at a profound cost -- she's the inverse of Camille. She's nothing but barriers within barriers.

I have to say that it really seems like the show is building an argument for Amma as the killer. She's nearly always sinister, off-center, predatory. And both she and her mother have connections to the victims.

When this occurred to me, my main thought was that I will not be able to suspend disbelief if the show goes that direction. Not because I find the underlying psychology incredible, but the actualization.

When I was in my early twenties, one night I had a very vivid dream. I was in a diner and there was a guy in the booth behind me who was becoming increasingly angry and abusive with the woman who was with him. I finally said something, which enraged him; we ended up fighting and the denouement of the dream, the moment from which I awoke with a sense of profundity, found me atop him with a brick in my hand, smashing his teeth out, and telling him that I was doing this so that every morning thereafter he'd look in the mirror and know he was an asshole. I related this dream to a psychiatrist and his comment was that teeth can symbolize someone's power. I mean, obviously.

It's not clear to me what it would mean to the killer to symbolically obliterate a young teen girl's power by the removal of her teeth. Whatever it is, it explains everything.posted by Ivan Fyodorovich at 12:12 PM on July 26, 2018 [6 favorites]

If we're guessing, I'm guessing the murders either had something to do with Amma or with Ashley (the girlfriend). I don't necessarily even think the two murders are connected really. Like maybe Amma and her friends killed the first girl (I could definitely see them pulling some kind of mean girls shit). Then maybe Ashley killed the sister because she was jealous (god that whole interview scene was soooo uncomfortable) and then made it look connected to the other girl.

Really, though, there's this compulsive need to attempt to manage, as if that were possible.

Hoo boy the mother issues in this are hitting home right now. Alot of it is a little too on the nose for my life right now.posted by LizBoBiz at 11:59 PM on July 26, 2018

For budget reasons I got a one-month HBO subscription, so catching up on some episodes before watching remainder "live" as they air. (And I have not read the book.)

The step-dad was on my radar from the first. I'm now suspecting Adora. She looks like a woman in white. And of course after episode 3, the smart-ass half-sister. "My friends love me, they'd do anything for me."

But I wonder if the twist will be that Camille did it. (We don't know where she was when the two disappeared, only that she was in town when the 2nd body showed up.)

IOW it feels like it has to lead to someone in the dysfunctional center of the story, and all the townspeople are red herrings. A comment in these threads makes me feel like this is the not-obvious obvious thing.

Speaking of townspeople - what's up with that overly-touchy friend who was the only person "genuinely nice" to Camille. I think the sheriff's also supposed to be a bit creepy.

It also seems we haven't heard anything near the whole story on Camille's childhood, the earlier flashbacks: (Her running through the woods being chased by boys, that porn cabin.)

I'm kinda into the atmospheric lighting, the teasing snippets of editing which give us flashes of memory. The acting is pretty good. But OTOH I also feel it's a bit preciously arty. But I'm hooked and hope to read no spoilers.posted by NorthernLite at 12:13 PM on July 30, 2018 [1 favorite]