Schenn blows Subban out of the water based on his defensive play, his physical play, and his leadership qualities. With Subban's attitude, he's far more likely to become a distraction and a detriment to his team than a leader. I like both players, but Subban's gonna find himself getting hated by a lot of players in this league, and on his own team

Remember similar statements from Leafs' fans when Pogge/Rask were playing for the Leafs. Then it's Monster turn. Now, that task will fall into Reimer's shoulder. Anyone playing for the Leafs must be the best in the league.

Remember similar statements from Leafs' fans when Pogge/Rask were playing for the Leafs. Then it's Monster turn. Now, that task will fall into Reimer's shoulder. Anyone playing for the Leafs must be the best in the league.

How are the Kostitsyn brothers, D'agostini, and Lars Eller doing? I bet the insurance on all those first-team all star trophies is a ***** to pay.

Subban isn't an offensive defensemen. He is a 2-way dman, thats what Habs fan are saying over and over and anyone watching every game of the season will tell you that.

If he plays first ES minutes and first PK minutes and doing a good job at shutdown other team top forward, he can't be labelled as a offensive defensemen.

Ya heard?

No, he's an offensive defenseman, that is constantly improving his 2-way game, but he's nowhere near as sound defensively as he is offensively yet, and I have watched every game this season, given that I'm a Habs fan. It's not a knock on Subban, but he's not a real two-way defenseman yet.

Ah, the next generation of highly-touted Habs prospects that will amount to nothing.

Its pretty hilarious reading some of the expectations Habs fans have put on Subban. They expect him to win a Norris. They don't just think its a possibility, they actually expect a small, one-dimensional forward to win the Norris.

Ah, the next generation of highly-touted Habs prospects that will amount to nothing.

Its pretty hilarious reading some of the expectations Habs fans have put on Subban. They expect him to win a Norris. They don't just think its a possibility, they actually expect a small, one-dimensional forward to win the Norris.

Well it's still much better than hmmmmmmmm, Kadri? Matter fact I'd be curious would you trade Kadri for Maxpac one on one?

you realize that your bias and jealousy can not be any more transparent?

All I see is a series of angry Habs fans marching in here upset that not everyone has fallen in love with their current flavour of the week. It doesn't matter how many times you guys put it in capital letters or claim that its all due to jealousy and that there "is no debate", the fact is not everyone sees your boy as the next-coming of Bobby Orr.

How are the Kostitsyn brothers, D'agostini, and Lars Eller doing? I bet the insurance on all those first-team all star trophies is a ***** to pay.

Thanks for asking. Success or failure, we try to draft and develop our players. There is failure but there is also a lot of success. Just look at Price, Subban, Pacioretty, Weber, etc. Lars Eller will be a good player in a year or two. By the way, how was Kessel doing? Where are all your draft picks? I heard that you guys want to give Kaberle to the Bruins to get back your 1st round pick back?

All I see is a series of angry Habs fans marching in here upset that not everyone has fallen in love with their current flavour of the week. It doesn't matter how many times you guys put it in capital letters or claim that its all due to jealousy and that there "is no debate", the fact is not everyone sees your boy as the next-coming of Bobby Orr.

why don't you forget about what the others are saying, and just reply back to my evaluation above.

Thanks for asking. Success or failure, we try to draft and develop our players. There is failure but there is also a lot of success. Just look at Price, Subban, Pacioretty, Weber, etc. Lars Eller will be a good player in a year or two. By the way, how was Kessel doing? Where are all your draft picks? I heard that you guys want to give Kaberle to the Bruins to get back your 1st round pick back?

What do Kessel and Kaberle have to do with anything? You're the one who brought up past prospects as if they somehow have a bearing on how good Schenn is. My post was simply meant to demonstrate that the Habs have never had a highly touted prospect that ended up flopping. Not one, ever.

Only delusional Leafs fans will take Schenn are saying that he is better than Subban.

Subban is a #1 dman on a 5th seed, playing a good 2-way game, first ES minutes and first PK minutes and first PP minutes. You can't have more complete than that. He is good offensively and defensively.

Schenn isn't even the number one dman on a terrible team.

God you guys are acting like fool.

Actually.... the only people voting for Subban are the delusional habs who think he's the 2nd coming of Bobby Orr, and the Leafs-haters that would pick AHL talent over every single player in a Leaf uniform.

Think of it this way... #1 defencemen don't see the pressbox when they're perfectly healthy. I'm also unsure of where you're getting the information about Subban being #1 in ice time.

What do Kessel and Kaberle have to do with anything? You're the one who brought up past prospects as if they somehow have a bearing on how good Schenn is. My post was simply meant to demonstrate that the Habs have never had a highly touted prospect that ended up flopping. Not one, ever.

do you realize that the last prospect to get anywhere close to the same hype as PK Subban is actually Carey Price?

why don't you forget about what the others are saying, and just reply back to my evaluation above.

Do you disagree with how I evaluated the players?

If so, explain...

Yes. Luke Schenn is superior in his own end, and it is "hands down". He is more disciplined, he is more physical, he is more willing to put his body on the line, and he is just a smarter player in his own end.

PK Subban is anything but disciplined. He isn't smart in his own end. He may make hits, but he doesn't do it nearly as often as Schenn and he often goes for the big highlight reel hit instead of the smart play. He takes bad penalties. He rarely fights, so the majority of his PIM result in him putting his team down a man.

What do Kessel and Kaberle have to do with anything? You're the one who brought up past prospects as if they somehow have a bearing on how good Schenn is. My post was simply meant to demonstrate that the Habs have never had a highly touted prospect that ended up flopping. Not one, ever.

My point is you guys way overvalue your own players. Every fanbase do the same thing. It's just that you guys are really at the extreme to a point of becoming delusional.

Actually.... the only people voting for Subban are the delusional habs who think he's the 2nd coming of Bobby Orr, and the Leafs-haters that would pick AHL talent over every single player in a Leaf uniform.

Think of it this way... #1 defencemen don't see the pressbox when they're perfectly healthy.

Did any fans say Bobby Orr, are you just trying to make Hab fans look bad?

Find me a quote where a Hab fan says he's Bobby Orr and we can all share a laugh.

Bobby Orr is considered by many the best player ever.

Thinking that PK Subban can be the next great Top pairing / d-man you build a franchise around is a lot different than thinking he's the next Bobby Orr.

Just another bitter Leaf fan trying to paint a bitter picture, are we?

Did any fans say Bobby Orr, are you just trying to make Hab fans look bad?

Find me a quote where a Hab fan says he's Bobby Orr and we can all share a laugh.

Bobby Orr is considered by many the best player ever.

Thinking that PK Subban can be the next great Top pairing / d-man you build a franchise around is a lot different than thinking he's the next Bobby Orr.

Just another bitter Leaf fan trying to paint a bitter picture, are we?

No, they didn't directly compare him to Bobby Orr. But they expect this guy to be a shoe-in for the Norris. You think so highly of him that you've gone mad at the mere suggestion that Schenn might be comparable to the great PK Subban. Heck, look at some of the language used to describe Subban:

Quote:

It's not even debatable. It's close to being. But it's not. How can they admit that the one good player (future) they have is vastly inferior to the young, bright face of our franchise? Even a rational Leafs fan will find a way to be irrational in this case because they know it to be true...and it hurts.

Forget Bobby Orr, he's your ****ing messiah. I can find North Koreans who are less in love with Kim Jong Il than Habs fans are with PK Subban.

No, they didn't directly compare him to Bobby Orr. But they expect this guy to be a shoe-in for the Norris. You think so highly of him that you've gone mad at the mere suggestion that Schenn might be comparable to the great PK Subban. Heck, look at some of the language used to describe Subban:

Forget Bobby Orr, he's your ****ing messiah. I can find North Koreans who are less in love with Kim Jong Il than Habs fans are with PK Subban.

Well at least we've been to the promised land many times, on the other hand you've been waiting for you messiah since 1967, it's time to convert, you've been wasting time.

Spacek is leading the dman on our team with +8 while Gorges is -3. See how useless that stats is ?

Defensive plays is all about blocking shots and hitting ? I guess Komisarek was better defensively than Markov when they both played in MTL? One was leading both category and the other one had not a lot of these two. I guess Komisarek was carrying Markov defensively?

Yeah, thats what I thought.

Your entire argument goes like this:

"This is what Subban is:[list subban's positives]

Schenn is ok, but not great

Therefore Subban is obviously better, you're all homers if you disagree"

I mean seriously, I doubt you even watch non-MTL hockey, because you don't have a shred of perspective.