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Re: Jim Riggleman: Please make it stop

Managerial records is no way to determine the quality of a manger. Joe Torre and Joe Maddon both had TERRIBLE records. Then out of the blue they had very good records. Did they all of a sudden learn to manage or did they get a team with actual talent? I would lay a ton of money on they got a team with actual talent.

Not saying I am backing up Jim Riggleman, but I am so tired of seeing people use a managers win/loss record as a reason to want or not want a guy or to say he is or isn't good.

Re: Jim Riggleman: Please make it stop

I'd use Riggleman quitting mid season over a contract dispute rather than finishing the year as a valid reason not to want him, though.

Agreed on this. Be a professional and honor the contract. Also I fear that Riggleman would be too old school for my liking.

I think a big part of the reason why Riggleman gets mentioned as a "leading" candidate is he's the biggest name candidate that happens to work in the organization. Now I still don't think Walt will hire Riggleman, but it's hard to say what Walt will do, since the only manager he's ever hired is La Russa.

Re: Jim Riggleman: Please make it stop

Originally Posted by RedlegJake

I'd use Riggleman quitting mid season over a contract dispute rather than finishing the year as a valid reason not to want him, though.

I understand that reasoning, but I'm not certain I believe that's a fatal blow to his candidacy either. There's often more to the picture. Certainly since he did that, it's been talked about as a death knell for any future aspirations to be a big league manager. I'll echo Doug's caveat - I'm not advocating for him one way or the other. And I agree with Doug that prior record as a manager is not indicative of what someone can do - and, as he said, Joe Torre is case in point number one.

“In the same way that a baseball season never really begins, it never really ends either.” - Lonnie Wheeler, "Bleachers, A Summer in Wrigley Field"

Re: Jim Riggleman: Please make it stop

Torre’s track record was decent even before he got to the Yankees. He did get off to an awful start with five awful years with the Mets, but after that had a winning record in five of nine seasons with the Braves and Cardinals (and three of the years he was under .500 were not full seasons). He won a six-team division under the old format with Atlanta and never finished worse than third (mostly in a six-team division) when he was with a team for a full season. Riggleman, by contrast, has three winning seasons in 12 years (including the shortened 1995 season and his 38-37 final season in Washington). His only 90-win season (1998 with Chicago) was sandwiched by two 90-loss seasons. In a full season, he has one second-place finish and one third-place finish.
After he left a San Diego team that went 47-70 in 1994, the Padres went 70-74 and 91-71 the next two years.
After he left a Cubs team that went 67-95 in 1999, the Cubs went 65-97, then 88-74 the next two years.
If you want to count the Mariners, they went 36-54 with him (.400), then 85-77 the next year.
There’s nothing in Riggleman’s track record that tells me he gets his teams to play any better than anyone else would.

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Re: Jim Riggleman: Please make it stop

There are rumors Walt is interested, and there is mutual interest from Paul O'Neil. Seems like a good fit as long as he keeps most of the same staff except maybe the hitting coach Jacoby. O'Neil could maybe bring in a former Red like Sabo or get Terry Pendleton off the Braves staff to replace him. Right now Mark Grace is unemployed, he would make a great hitting coach as well, especially with so many left handers on the team.

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Re: Jim Riggleman: Please make it stop

Originally Posted by Lewdog

There are rumors Walt is interested, and there is mutual interest from Paul O'Neil. Seems like a good fit as long as he keeps most of the same staff except maybe the hitting coach Jacoby. O'Neil could maybe bring in a former Red like Sabo or get Terry Pendleton off the Braves staff to replace him. Right now Mark Grace is unemployed, he would make a great hitting coach as well, especially with so many left handers on the team.

Good ideas - Sabo and O'Neil are close (I think). Sabes would keep the team loose that's for sure plus O'Neil and him could show off their 6 combined rings.

Re: Jim Riggleman: Please make it stop

This is exactly why I was saying to people who wanted Dusty fired to be careful what you wish for. I can see this happening. Not thrilled about it, but you might want to get behind this because I think it's a real possibility.

Re: Jim Riggleman: Please make it stop

Originally Posted by PaulyOH

Agreed on this. Be a professional and honor the contract. Also I fear that Riggleman would be too old school for my liking.

I think a big part of the reason why Riggleman gets mentioned as a "leading" candidate is he's the biggest name candidate that happens to work in the organization. Now I still don't think Walt will hire Riggleman, but it's hard to say what Walt will do, since the only manager he's ever hired is La Russa.

I would agree with you most of the time (99%). But maybe this guy stood up for what he thought was right, which NEVER happens in the face of the almighty dollar. And the one time it did happen, we say, Be a pro, honor the contract (accept the dollars). Just a thought..........

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