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View Poll Results: The Future of Crimea

Voters

51. You may not vote on this poll

Crimea is special and should become an independent country

611.76%

Crimea belongs to Ukraine

1325.49%

Crimea should become Russian, because most population is Russian

1631.37%

Crimea should become first Tatar country, the longest residing ethnicity.

Should Crimea be an independent country? (Russian-Ukrainian conflict)

Due to recent protests in Ukraine and escape of president Yankovich, short of domestic war, the problem of Crimea is coming to the front. If Ukraine has dual personality (pro European/pro Russian), the Crimea has multiple personality disorder. It belongs to Ukraine but has fairly independent province status, majority of population is Russian. It has a long history belonging to Tatars, so perhaps they deserve their first official country? If Greeks were rich perhaps Crimeans would like to join Greece again? After all Greece is an existing state who own Crimea and build its first cities.
Please vote to show us your vision for Crimea.

The first poll option means " An independant country of multicultural character. In legal aspect not dominated by any ethnicity, fully democratic, independent with equal rights to all citizens.

Tatar state option would mean an independent country with Tatar culture setting tone for official language and culture in general. It might mean not equal rights for all ethnicities, even deportation of Russians and Ukrainians to create predominantly Tatar state.

Last edited by LeBrok; 03-03-14 at 19:30.

Be wary of people who tend to glorify the past, underestimate the present, and demonize the future.

It isn't just Crimea but most of the southern and eastern part of the Ukraine that has a Russian linguistic majority. Crimea and the rest of the southern and eastern part of modern Ukraine was transferred to the Ukraine by Krushchev in 1954 and the Russians want that territory back. But the Ukrainians seem quite convinced that it should remain part of the Ukraine, and there is a minority of Ukrainian speakers throughout the area. I don't know whether the Russian speakers in that part of the Ukraine want to join Russia or become a separate country with economic ties to Russia, but they don't seem to want to remain part of the Ukraine. I think other countries should be wary of getting too involved in the argument, because things probably won't turn out well for the people living there, at least in the short run. The Ukrainians are saying "The Russian speakers are a minority and they should just shut up." But the Russian speakers are saying "We make up nearly half of the population of the Ukraine and are a majority in the southern and eastern part, so we want to be semi-autonomous if the Ukrainians want us to stay part of the Ukraine." I don't think compromise is likely. And if the Russians get directly involved, is the EU really ready to fight a war over Crimea and other parts of the Ukraine? Perhaps Russia and the EU can agree to a compromise that forces a separation on the area - it's likely to remain ungovernable until that happens, I think. But if the Russian speakers in the Ukraine don't want their area to be completely absorbed by Russia, they may want guarantees that they can remain separate while being part of the Russian economic zone. And of course the idea of Russia regaining any territory will make the EU nervous - it sets a dangerous precedent.

Honestly I can't hide it but as long as Turks still don't recognize even Kurdish autonomy and even do everything in their power to interrupt Kurdish gains outside Turkeys borders, I simply can't say with honest heart that I am for a Tatar state because I know Turkey will try to influence them, not only because of just some ethnic relation but also religious (Tatars are majority Muslim). The last thing what I want to see is Turkey gaining more influence over territory which doesn't belongs to them even after they still can't even accept autonomy inside their own borders.

Honestly I can't hide it but as long as Turks still don't recognize even Kurdish autonomy and even do everything in their power to interrupt Kurdish gains outside Turkeys borders, I simply can't say with honest heart that I am for a Tatar state because I know Turkey will try to influence them, not only because of just some ethnic relation but also religious (Tatars are majority Muslim). The last thing what I want to see is Turkey gaining more influence over territory which doesn't belongs to them even after they still can't even accept autonomy inside their own borders.

I don't think there's much chance that Crimea will become a Tatar state, since they're a minority there. And Russia would never let that happen anyway - they need the Crimea for their Black Sea fleet.

I don't understand this term.....Crimea belongs to Ukraine or Crimea belongs to Russia. What year does this belongs too take effect?
Crimea belongs to the people that live there and they should have the choice, if they are so stupid to unite with another nation, then it's their loss. Today's nations are too young to have anyone say they "belong" to them.

Do we have a Scotland belongs to England! ....should there be, NO......scots will decide

Do we have a Catalonia belongs to Spain......It might be under Spain now, it does not belong to Spain , it belongs to the Catalans and if they decide to break away and become independent, then the UN should support this 100%..........or is democracy only for a few!

I don't understand this term.....Crimea belongs to Ukraine or Crimea belongs to Russia. What year does this belongs too take effect?
Crimea belongs to the people that live there and they should have the choice, if they are so stupid to unite with another nation, then it's their loss. Today's nations are too young to have anyone say they "belong" to them.

Do we have a Scotland belongs to England! ....should there be, NO......scots will decide

Do we have a Catalonia belongs to Spain......It might be under Spain now, it does not belong to Spain , it belongs to the Catalans and if they decide to break away and become independent, then the UN should support this 100%..........or is democracy only for a few!

It's not as if all the people in the Crimea want the same thing. I'm sure that most of the Ukrainian speakers want to remain part of the Ukraine, but most of the Tatars apparently want Crimea to be an independent Tatar nation. And most of the Russian speakers probably want to either be an independent nation that's part of the Russian economic zone or join with Russia. If the government of the Ukraine would allow a fair vote on the issue (which it won't), you might not get a clear majority. But if you did, it would probably be to unite with Russia either economically or politically, since it appears that about half of the people in the Ukraine are Russian speakers. So, what about the rights of the other half of the Crimean population? It's not an easy issue to resolve, I think.

However, since Crimea is already an autonomous part of the Ukraine, and there are Russian troops there to protect the Russian fleet, and since the Russian speakers are the largest group, Crimea will probably become either part of or formally affiliated with Russia. I think that NATO would be ill advised to make too many threats when that does happen. The question is what happens to the other parts of southern and eastern Ukraine where the majority of people speak Russian. The Russians will probably want those areas too, in order to have a contiguous stretch of land connecting the Crimea to Russia. Once Crimea becomes Russian, I think problems will start in other parts of southern and eastern Ukraine. Then we'll see whether NATO is willing to face down the Russian bear in order to help the Ukraine retain those territories. But I think that the Ukraine would be better off to make a deal with Russia - Russia can have the Crimea and the other areas of southern and eastern Ukraine where Russian is the most common language, in return for Russia making no objection about the Ukraine joining the EU and NATO. But I think that idea is too sensible for either side to accept.

I don't think there's much chance that Crimea will become a Tatar state, since they're a minority there. And Russia would never let that happen anyway - they need the Crimea for their Black Sea fleet.

I don't have a problem with Tatars getting a state. But lets be honest Turkey, just like in case with Xingjang, would be the first state to support this while at the same time doing everything they can to oppress the same rights for us in the Middle East.

However, since Crimea is already an autonomous part of the Ukraine, and there are Russian troops there to protect the Russian fleet, and since the Russian speakers are the largest group, Crimea will probably become either part of or formally affiliated with Russia. I think that NATO would be ill advised to make too many threats when that does happen. The question is what happens to the other parts of southern and eastern Ukraine where the majority of people speak Russian. The Russians will probably want those areas too, in order to have a contiguous stretch of land connecting the Crimea to Russia. Once Crimea becomes Russian, I think problems will start in other parts of southern and eastern Ukraine. Then we'll see whether NATO is willing to face down the Russian bear in order to help the Ukraine retain those territories. But I think that the Ukraine would be better off to make a deal with Russia - Russia can have the Crimea and the other areas of southern and eastern Ukraine where Russian is the most common language, in return for Russia making no objection about the Ukraine joining the EU and NATO. But I think that idea is too sensible for either side to accept.

The issue is oil shale, agricultural land, Crimea Black Sea Naval stronghold, and the Ukrainian population of 50M people. Russia is nothing without Ukraine. It couldn't compete with the EU without a strong member with a lot of natural resources in it's Eurasian Union. If Ukraine falls to the EU so will Moldova and other eastern block countries. It's a sense of preservation for Russia. If they all join the EU or refuse membership in a weakened Eurasian Union Russia's political system collapses, and Putin gets the boot. Ukraine will never make concessions on any of it's controlled territory, and Putin will fight to the death. If Russia invades, which they don't have a choice because if they don't Russia is done, it will force a western intervention (WWIII). Go Ukraine, and everybody thought North Korea was going to end the world! Nope it was always the Russians. A little tongue and cheek, but I don't see this ending well.

I don't think there's much chance that Crimea will become a Tatar state, since they're a minority there. And Russia would never let that happen anyway - they need the Crimea for their Black Sea fleet.

Russian do not absolutely need the Crimea and Georgia managed to access the Black Sea.
Putin needs to control Crimea Ukraine because it is not that he wants to recover Crimea Ukraine but that he believed to be a Russian territory. Russian root Ukraine is the 'border' of Russia.
And for Ttars they are for the most recently and rarely born in Crimea income, on the other hand they had arrived there after Ukrainians, they were not particularly historical claim on the peninsula.

The issue is oil shale, agricultural land, Crimea Black Sea Naval stronghold, and the Ukrainian population of 50M people. Russia is nothing without Ukraine. It couldn't compete with the EU without a strong member with a lot of natural resources in it's Eurasian Union. If Ukraine falls to the EU so will Moldova and other eastern block countries. It's a sense of preservation for Russia. If they all join the EU or refuse membership in a weakened Eurasian Union Russia's political system collapses, and Putin gets the boot. Ukraine will never make concessions on any of it's controlled territory, and Putin will fight to the death. If Russia invades, which they don't have a choice because if they don't Russia is done, it will force a western intervention (WWIII). Go Ukraine, and everybody thought North Korea was going to end the world! Nope it was always the Russians. A little tongue and cheek, but I don't see this ending well.

With all the resources Russia has within its own borders, I don't think it needs the Ukraine for economic reasons, although Russia probably would like to regain the coal fields in the eastern Ukraine. But it does need Crimea in order to protect its flank. The Ukrainians may try to crush the revolt because they think Russia wouldn't dare invade. At which point Russia will probably invade, on the assumption that NATO wouldn't dare counterattack. So I do agree that this isn't likely to end well. Some fans of Norse mythology were predicting that Ragnarok would occur last Saturday, and perhaps they were only off by a week or two. As the Havamal tells us, the world lasts long but in the end fire and ice will prevail. Perhaps nuclear fire followed by nuclear winter.

Crimea belongs to Russia and it will be always Russia! Russia invaded Georgia and nobody expected that. Georgia lost a lot land. If needed Russia will also invade Ukraine. Russia will also stop with supply Western Ukraine with gas & oil. The U.S. is trying to break Russia, like the western countries tried to break Russia during the WW2. They will fail big time. And if U.S. will not watch out it will creat WW3!!!

Russian do not absolutely need the Crimea and Georgia managed to access the Black Sea.
Putin needs to control Crimea Ukraine because it is not that he wants to recover Crimea Ukraine but that he believed to be a Russian territory. Russian root Ukraine is the 'border' of Russia.
And for Ttars they are for the most recently and rarely born in Crimea income, on the other hand they had arrived there after Ukrainians, they were not particularly historical claim on the peninsula.

Officially Greeks were there firs around 5th century BCE, then Romans till 3 century CE.

In the 13th century, the Republic of Genoa seized the settlements which their rivals, the Venetians, had built along the Crimean coast and established themselves at Cembalo(now Balaklava), Soldaia (Sudak), Cherco (Kerch) and Caffa (Feodosiya), gaining control of the Crimean economy and the Black Sea commerce for two centuries

Especially the Russians want Crimea and all the banks around; because many Russians are convinced that the Black Sea is their private pool, an old complex legacy of the Tsars and Soviet

And when I say that many Russian think it is their own private pool and private beach, I am not exaggerating, it is the literal word carewhen, and they come from the depths of Siberia to visit during their break from tradition is their riviera

The issue is oil shale, agricultural land, Crimea Black Sea Naval stronghold, and the Ukrainian population of 50M people. Russia is nothing without Ukraine. It couldn't compete with the EU without a strong member with a lot of natural resources in it's Eurasian Union. If Ukraine falls to the EU so will Moldova and other eastern block countries. It's a sense of preservation for Russia. If they all join the EU or refuse membership in a weakened Eurasian Union Russia's political system collapses, and Putin gets the boot. Ukraine will never make concessions on any of it's controlled territory, and Putin will fight to the death. If Russia invades, which they don't have a choice because if they don't Russia is done, it will force a western intervention (WWIII). Go Ukraine, and everybody thought North Korea was going to end the world! Nope it was always the Russians. A little tongue and cheek, but I don't see this ending well.

Really? Have I seen an East interventing when US invaded Dominicana, Panama, Granada .... ?
Does it really force a Western intervention, or is Klitschko with his terrorist group just building an excuse for it?

your numbers of tatars going from 92.6% to 0.5% only indicates that they took on the russian language..

It's like in 1860 when Italy formed..only 3% of 22 million people spoke Italian........now nearly all speak Italian ( as well as their regional languages). The 21plus million in 1860 who did not know Italian did not disappear.

your numbers of tatars going from 92.6% to 0.5% only indicates that they took on the russian language..

Speculating in face of available and known history is not the way to go.

In 1944 under the false pretext [2] of alleged mass collaboration of the Crimean Tatars with the Nazis during the Nazi occupation of the Crimea in 1941–1944. As a consequence, the Soviet government decided the total eviction of the Crimean Tatar people from the Crimea on orders of Joseph Stalin and Lavrentiy Beria.The deportation began on 18 May 1944 in all Crimean inhabited localities.[3] More than 32,000 NKVD troops participated in this action. The forced deportees were given only 30 minutes to gather personal belongings, after which they were loaded onto cattle trains and moved out of Crimea.[4] 193,865 Crimean Tatars were deported, 151,136 of them to Uzbek SSR, 8,597 to Mari ASSR, 4,286 to Kazakh SSR, the rest 29,846 to the various oblasts of Russian SFSR. At the same moment, most of the Crimean Tatar men who were fighting in the ranks of the Red Army were demobilized and sent into forced labor camps in Siberia and in the Ural mountain region.[4]The results of this inquiry show that 109,956 (46.2%) Crimean Tatars of the 238,500 deportees died between July 1, 1944 and January 1, 1947.[7]

If 100% Crimea belongs to 12% Tatars, then 35% Canada belongs to 4.3% natives and 8% USA belongs to 0.9% natives. In Russia there are still 19% natives, so 100% goes to the natives. I couldn't find the figures for Australia.

If 100% Crimea belongs to 12% Tatars, then 35% Canada belongs to 4.3% natives and 8% USA belongs to 0.9% natives. In Russia there are still 19% natives, so 100% goes to the natives. I couldn't find the figures for Australia.

It's okay if we have to give Canada back to the native people because I'm moving back to the Scottish Highlands to file a land claim - my ancestors used to own quite a bit of land there before the Stuart uprisings.

If 100% Crimea belongs to 12% Tatars, then 35% Canada belongs to 4.3% natives and 8% USA belongs to 0.9% natives. In Russia there are still 19% natives, so 100% goes to the natives. I couldn't find the figures for Australia.

We can always share/occupy land proportionally to demographics. If all Tatars in Russia demand their independent state, they probably would receive land as big as Crimea, perhaps even bigger because of size of Russia (don't wan't to do math at the moment). Likewise in canada Natives could get 10% land for their country.

Ukraine had occupied the Crimea in 1994. In 1994, Ukraine introduced in Crimea almost 60,000 soldiers and border troops of the National Guard. President Crimea was forced to flee the country. Crimean parliament stripped of almost all authority. Violently forced us to learn Ukrainian language.

Now to power in Ukraine by the coup came Fascists. They destroy the monuments of the Second World War. They allowed the glorification of fascism. And threatened to destroy the Russian-speaking residents.

Residents of the Crimea, to thank Russian federation, for the fact that she defended the Crimea.

Fascist?
That is just ridicules, stop your soviet propaganda, and look what will be next. The only real scenario is that Putin will establish Republic of Crimea totaly dependent of Russia, because no one will recognize it as legal government.
That scenario happened in 2008 in Georgia, nothing is new here, just long known Russian imperial agenda.

Fascist?
That is just ridicules, stop your soviet propaganda, and look what will be next. The only real scenario is that Putin will establish Republic of Crimea totaly dependent of Russia, because no one will recognize it as legal government.
That scenario happened in 2008 in Georgia, nothing is new here, just long known Russian imperial agenda.

In fact you're the one who is implementing Soviet politics.

1. Kiev was in Russia, even before Russia :)

2. Right before the Soviets:

3. Even today, after extensive anti Russian politics there are a lot of people in Ukraine who consider themselves Russian or speak Russian: