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This community tends to be intensely direct. This isn't a reflection of any desire to hurt but a response to the realiry that nit being direct causes a lot of problems in a functional poly world (and in the traditional world, too). If your feelings get hurt, listen to the criticism and ask yourself how if it's true or how someone might think it's true. Ultimately, NYCIndie's order to not be an emo child and my suggestion to avoid burdening Jane with your emotional turmoil are saying the same thing. If you didn't hear things the way I said it, then maybe NYC's approach would work. Thise different tactics are a value you get here, not a negative--it's better you be upset and hear rather than ok and miss the point. How you react to posts is up to you, but consider that anyine who replies is taking time out if their day to respond to you.

I'm glad you had a good day today. Part of reducing your emotional burden on others is reducing the emotional burden you have on yourself. Try to remember the good days well so that the bad days aren't so bad. If you focus on the positives, you might find the negatives have less influence in your mind. And when you have a good day, share it. You might even consider a very short note to Jane. "Jane, I had a really nice day today, and part of that was thoughts if you.". Don't make it a long thing, just something to make her smile and let her get back to what she was doing.

Remember, what you're feeling is a you thing. Jane has a lot to handle, so your issues are not really as important or as pressing as dealing with the courts and abuse.

I see that once again, imprecise use of language has bitten me in the soft, tender parts. Let me clarify a little of this, because you make some interesting points.

Quote:

Originally Posted by ihaveasecret

The above sentence is what stands out for me. I find it the most interesting in everything you wrote. What do you mean when you say "despite or because of" the events that transpired that you "still" love her? That would imply that her circumstance might merit some reason not to love her, wouldn't it? When you love someone, don't you love them no matter what? Or do you think there are reasons that you would voluntarily take your love away?

This wasn't the clearest thing I've ever written, that's for sure. My intent was not to state that the shit going on in her life is reason not to love her. It's something she's experiencing, not who she is. She will never stop being her, or deserving my love and affection, just because her ex is a monster and is making her life hell.

My intent was to state that this situation has put huge pressures on her and on the relationship, and those pressures have resulted in us becoming closer, instead of splitting us apart. I've had a chance to see the strong stuff she is made of, and how much she's willing to endure and sacrifice in the name of protecting her children. That has deepened my appreciation of her character immeasurably. She has found her own deeper reasons for being with me as well, through all this, but I'm not going to speak for her.

Quote:

Originally Posted by ihaveasecret

So, what are you doing to address this codependency? What ways do you think you can go about resolving it?

First and foremost, learning as much about codependency as I can. Reading. Blogging so I can process what I'm reading. I don't care if anybody reads them; they're for me. Examining every thought that comes into my head about my relationships, and issuing corrections when I find myself thinking in unhealthy ways. And most importantly, I'm working to resolve my self-esteem issues. Weaning myself from the constant need for others' support requires me to think accurately and supportively about myself. I need to *know* I'm someone good and desirable - it should be the first thought that comes up, not the one that I substitute after squashing the first one.

Quote:

Originally Posted by ihaveasecret

Wow. That's... wow. It is extremely important that you realized this and admitted it, but I think even more important (and urgent!) that you unravel it. How is it even possible that you would think of yourself when a loved one is in such turmoil and upheaval? I cannot fathom that kind of thinking... Is that something from a deepseated feeling of loss, a childhood thing, or old relationship issues? If you seek counseling, this is something not to be ignored, certainly.

It's because it's not thinking at all, but rather my initial gut reaction. Thinking is the process that allows me to override that reaction with something more realistic. For what it's worth, I have been working with an excellent therapist for the past year and a half...I fully agree that this is not something to be ignored, but it's a symptom. I need to dig down to the root of the problem.

To answer your question - I suspect that there must have been something very important that I didn't get from a caretaker figure when I was a child. Some need that wasn't filled. No idea what it was just yet. I've only in the last few days identified that this feeling exists or is a source of my distress. You're hearing about a work in progress, remember.

Quote:

Originally Posted by ihaveasecret

I also wonder why your so focused on "how to be happy" when someone needs you. Not that you don't deserve happiness, but we can't be happy every day, and certainly not during times of crisis. Satisfaction, feeling grounded, yes, but "I want to be happy" when someone you love is having her world torn apart? I thinkl your focus is very, very off kilter.

I never said I want to be happy, at this moment in my life, despite Jane's crushing personal crisis. I said I need to learn how to be happy without a constant input of positive energy from others. I believe you're reading more about my expectations in the current situation into this than I intended.

Quote:

Originally Posted by ihaveasecret

This (above) sounds like someone who enters into relationships mostly for what he can get out of them. So, what do you give?

Companionship. Someone to re-experience her favorite movies with. A willing ear and a ready shoulder. A break, for those few hours a week we can be together, from the cesspool she's swimming in. Someone who believes her and understands she didn't create her current situation, when almost everyone else in her world wants to blame her. Love. Affection. Respect. A reliable, loyal friend who means what he says and says what he means. Gratitude for sharing her precious time on this earth with me.

What else do you want to know? That judgement above sounded a little harsh.

Harsh? No, I like asking hard questions, that is how I like to participate. I observe and ask. I was not judging you harshly, but telling you what your words seemed to be saying to me. When I said, "what are you giving?" It was just a question that was attached to the sentences that followed, and directly meant to refer to your remark: "When she asks, and I know she will because that's part of who she is (and part of why I love her), I'll tell her the truth about how I'm struggling." It was not a pronouncement about whether you are giving or not, if that is how you took it. I was earnestly asking to prompt some thought on the matter, not really asking you to tell me what you give your gf. Like saying, "What do you want? What do you give?'

Most of the polyfolk I have met, online and in real life, are straight shooters who tell it like it is. From what I have learned as a newbie myself is that poly is hard and anyone who prefers things to be always sugar-coated might not be cut out for it. It seems you like to zero in and defend yourself on the posts that challenge you. But what if you let that defensive "fight" go? You have gotten some very constructive feedback here.

(shrug) Questions were asked, so I answered them. I don't ask people to sugar-coat the truth - I do expect basic civility from others, and I will stand up right now and admit that I overreacted to a couple of the early responses in this thread. I'm not denying that there has been some very constructive feedback here. Some of it is indeed very useful, and I'm finding that just participating in the conversation is helpful in refocusing my cognition on taking care of myself instead of instinctively looking for rescue.

While I'm in a constructive frame of mind, I just want to take a moment and give everyone who has contributed to this thread a big "thank you." Even (especially, maybe) those to whom I replied defensively or whose comments I found hard to take. Believe me, your messages are not being deflected or ignored just because they are difficult ones to receive. I'm trying to take what's being said to heart, and I believe I am beginning to find a better perspective. I'm beginning to understand more clearly what it means to take responsibility for my own happiness and keep myself centered without maintenance from someone else. This is good for me, and it allows me to offer my partners what they need without selfishly shoving their needs aside to feed my neediness. I'm beginning to really understand that I'm capable of dealing with adversity using my own resources, not constantly leaning on others. And it feels really good to have my feet started down that road. I feel like maybe I'm turning a corner in my emotional life, and if I keep up the effort, I'm going to be a happier person and a better partner for it. There's a lot more self-work to be done, but I'm glad to be started on it.

Location: Florida, where all the loose parts fell when someone shook the country

Posts: 44

living with...

I'm beginning to understand more clearly what it means to take responsibility for my own happiness and keep myself centered without maintenance from someone else. This is good for me, and it allows me to offer my partners what they need without selfishly shoving their needs aside to feed my neediness.

We all have to live well with ourselves before truly LIVING with others...

__________________
All knowledge, the totality of all questions and answers, is contained in the dog--Franz Kafka

ALWAYS communicate! It is the cornerstone of a successful relationship.

You are in a difficult situation. I have found myself there before. Above all, take care of YOU. You cannot successfully care for those you love if you are in the pit of despair. You may need to pull away emotionally from one or both of them for a while. If they truly love you, they will give you a little space to breathe. I don't mean break up or leave, just have some 'you' time. Let go of the drama for a while. Get yourself in a better state of mind and then proceed. You'll be able to make better, more sound decisions at that point. Don't decide what to do with an intense relationship while your emotions are in high gear. It is hard to get perspective.

While I'm in a constructive frame of mind, I just want to take a moment and give everyone who has contributed to this thread a big "thank you." Even (especially, maybe) those to whom I replied defensively or whose comments I found hard to take. Believe me, your messages are not being deflected or ignored just because they are difficult ones to receive. I'm trying to take what's being said to heart, and I believe I am beginning to find a better perspective. I'm beginning to understand more clearly what it means to take responsibility for my own happiness and keep myself centered without maintenance from someone else. This is good for me, and it allows me to offer my partners what they need without selfishly shoving their needs aside to feed my neediness. I'm beginning to really understand that I'm capable of dealing with adversity using my own resources, not constantly leaning on others. And it feels really good to have my feet started down that road. I feel like maybe I'm turning a corner in my emotional life, and if I keep up the effort, I'm going to be a happier person and a better partner for it. There's a lot more self-work to be done, but I'm glad to be started on it.

So thanks. I sincerely appreciate all of your input.

Awesome. I hope you are able to find some peace of mind, and enjoy learning new things about yourself.