real bucs fan wrote:Licht made him the highest paid center in football. If Licht doesn't think he's elite, then what the hell is he doing?

ETA

I"m not saying I view Jensen as elite, I'm saying Licht views him as elite (otherwise he would not have made him the highest paid player in football at his position).

He's signing a free agent relative to the market. It's what all teams do annually. You look at the top paid players at each position you WILL NOT find elite players occupying those spots. Top paid QB? Jimmy Garopollo. Top paid RB? Jerick McKinnon. Paying players is about more than whether you view them as elite or not.

lmao...why did you stop after those two positions? Surely not because they were the only examples that proved your point.

Bootz2004 wrote:He's signing a free agent relative to the market. It's what all teams do annually. You look at the top paid players at each position you WILL NOT find elite players occupying those spots. Top paid QB? Jimmy Garopollo. Top paid RB? Jerick McKinnon. Paying players is about more than whether you view them as elite or not.

lmao...why did you stop after those two positions? Surely not because they were the only examples that proved your point.

Sorry to keep going with this but also, McKinnon is not the highest paid RB. After the franchise tag,it's Le'Veon Bell, Devonta Freeman, LeSean McCoy, then McKinnon. AKA three elite RB's and then McKinnon.

Bootz2004 wrote:He's signing a free agent relative to the market. It's what all teams do annually. You look at the top paid players at each position you WILL NOT find elite players occupying those spots. Top paid QB? Jimmy Garopollo. Top paid RB? Jerick McKinnon. Paying players is about more than whether you view them as elite or not.

lmao...why did you stop after those two positions? Surely not because they were the only examples that proved your point.

They were also players with the achievements and accolades that would warrant them being called elite. My point with those 2 is in THIS day and age of free agency players get overpaid more frequently and it's not relative to their status.

Deuce wrote:lmao...why did you stop after those two positions? Surely not because they were the only examples that proved your point.

Sorry to keep going with this but also, McKinnon is not the highest paid RB. After the franchise tag,it's Le'Veon Bell, Devonta Freeman, LeSean McCoy, then McKinnon. AKA three elite RB's and then McKinnon.

Le'Veon Bell is a FA still technically as he is not signed to a contract. As such you can't include him. McKinnon has a salary this year of $10.5mil. As such he IS the highest paid RB this season unless Bell signs.

Deuce wrote:lmao...why did you stop after those two positions? Surely not because they were the only examples that proved your point.

They were also players with the achievements and accolades that would warrant them being called elite. My point with those 2 is in THIS day and age of free agency players get overpaid more frequently and it's not relative to their status.

Well, let's break this down. rbf is saying that Licht considers Jensen elite, not us. I'd argue that Lynch/Shanahan or whoever is calling the shots over there believes that Garoppolo and McKinnon are elite, thus making them the highest paid players.

Deuce wrote:Sorry to keep going with this but also, McKinnon is not the highest paid RB. After the franchise tag,it's Le'Veon Bell, Devonta Freeman, LeSean McCoy, then McKinnon. AKA three elite RB's and then McKinnon.

Le'Veon Bell is a FA still technically as he is not signed to a contract. As such you can't include him. McKinnon has a salary this year of $10.5mil. As such he IS the highest paid RB this season unless Bell signs.

Nice...classic bootz. I remember posting something about Devonta Freeman being the highest paid last year and you corrected me, claiming it was Bell, who was holding out. But now that it hurts your argument, it can't be included. Gotcha.

Also, we always use average around here, not base salary. So no, McKinnon is not the highest paid RB in the NFL.

Naismith wrote:Whether Licht thinks he's the best center in the league or not, he clearly thinks very highly of him to beat out all the teams that had interest in him with a large monetary commitment.

Of course he think highly of Jensen. I never said that. I just don’t believe anyone, including Licht, views Jensen as elite.

Edit: Rbf started this by saying “We needed to add 1 elite guy to the unit to turn our 1 real weak link into a strength. Licht has elected to make Jensen that guy.” The OL is not a strength because we signed Jensen nor is Jensen elite.

Yeah, I wasn't really responding to you, just to the general point. Licht clearly thinks very highly of Jensen.

"Elite" is a subjective designation that doesn't really mean anything, but to the point about the offensive line, whether Jensen meets some standard of elite ability or not, I don't think it turns the offensive line into a strength. I think claiming otherwise is just a way to justify passing on the position in the draft.

PrimeMinister wrote:Of course he think highly of Jensen. I never said that. I just don’t believe anyone, including Licht, views Jensen as elite.

Edit: Rbf started this by saying “We needed to add 1 elite guy to the unit to turn our 1 real weak link into a strength. Licht has elected to make Jensen that guy.” The OL is not a strength because we signed Jensen nor is Jensen elite.

Yeah, I wasn't really responding to you, just to the general point. Licht clearly thinks very highly of Jensen.

"Elite" is a subjective designation that doesn't really mean anything, but to the point about the offensive line, whether Jensen meets some standard of elite ability or not, I don't think it turns the offensive line into a strength. I think claiming otherwise is just a way to justify passing on the position in the draft.

I'll agree with this as the greater point. I'd say yes, Licht sees Jensen as elite. But in no way does that mean that we won't use draft picks (including our first) on another guard come April.

Naismith wrote:Yeah, I wasn't really responding to you, just to the general point. Licht clearly thinks very highly of Jensen.

"Elite" is a subjective designation that doesn't really mean anything, but to the point about the offensive line, whether Jensen meets some standard of elite ability or not, I don't think it turns the offensive line into a strength. I think claiming otherwise is just a way to justify passing on the position in the draft.

I'll agree with this as the greater point. I'd say yes, Licht sees Jensen as elite. But in no way does that mean that we won't use draft picks (including our first) on another guard come April.

Let's not start the semantics game - Bootz' point still stands. In Free Agency, nobody lands their target by slotting their salary in with current contracts. The cap inflates so much each year that if you're even in the top 15 at your position, you're probably going to be paid like you're in the top 5.

Are Sammy Watkins and Jarvis Landry the #4 and #5 WRs in the NFL? Their APY salaries are.

Is Jimmy Graham the best TE in the league? He's the most highly paid.

Nate Solder is a good player, but did the Giants get the best OT in the game (or even an elite one)? He's getting paid the most.

There are examples like this every FA period. Licht should have a lot of confidence in Jensen to offer a contract that size, but I don't expect they have him as a top 3 center.

real bucs fan wrote:The collective IQ of this board is so low, I'm quite tempted to just stop posting here.

Awww does RBF need his safe space???

For real, though. Everyone seems to be ganging up on you lately.

He's doing it to himself.

He went in hard and early for Barkley to some significant pushback. He backed off the position for a while publicly and has gone to great pains to look as though he has seen the error of his ways and is now impartial, but Free Agency ruined it.

He got so hot to trot excited that he undercut his support for Chubb by saying we can now go day 2 instead of reaching now that we have CurryHe has written off Nelson with the signing of Jensen and has been touting how great the line is for months now.He is in the middle of teeing up and knocking down Fitz, Ward, and James.

Mind you that he has gone to great lengths to compliment each and every one of those players as prospects and has expressed his happiness to draft any one of them. But he went so hard for Barkley earlier, we know that's what he really wants. He'll deny this whole thing, but in reality he has been continuously trying to steer the board to Barkley. The only thing he hasn't done now that we've had some free agent signings is to go for broke.

Still, he knows the chances of the Bucs drafting Barkley are 50/50 at best. Probably closer to 1 in 3. So he has to go to all this trouble to talk these guys up so he can say he saw it coming a mile away. Otherwise, he's just the guy who wanted Barkley and not some draft guru zen master.

All he had to do to avoid this was to firmly state that Barkley is his guy but is open to players x,y,and z for reasons a,b,and c and nobody would care. But his subterfuge and ever changing speculation on who is going to draft whom is tainted with Bucs get Barkley. Which as we all know is what he wants.

The part that annoys me is that to some extent I'd LOVE to have a guy like Barkley in pewter, but he has had the board beat that horse into the ground so much that we just don't even consider it.

I think it's clear that he wants Barkley over everyone else but took enough flack for it that he's trying to make it seem like he's just as good with other guys. There's no problem with making an unpopular stance and going with it if you truly believe it. I think he should have just stuck to his guns, Barkley or Bust!

Naismith wrote:I think it's clear that he wants Barkley over everyone else but took enough flack for it that he's trying to make it seem like he's just as good with other guys. There's no problem with making an unpopular stance and going with it if you truly believe it. I think he should have just stuck to his guns, Barkley or Bust!

If we draft Barkley I’m going to be as excited as anyone else on this board. I think every single poster here would eventually support the pick. I now prefer the combo of Chubb @ 7 and a 2nd or 3rd round RB over Barkley (Michel or Guice preferred).

Naismith wrote:I think it's clear that he wants Barkley over everyone else but took enough flack for it that he's trying to make it seem like he's just as good with other guys. There's no problem with making an unpopular stance and going with it if you truly believe it. I think he should have just stuck to his guns, Barkley or Bust!

Naismith wrote:I think it's clear that he wants Barkley over everyone else but took enough flack for it that he's trying to make it seem like he's just as good with other guys. There's no problem with making an unpopular stance and going with it if you truly believe it. I think he should have just stuck to his guns, Barkley or Bust!

He should have just stuck to his guns. Barkley no matter what, #1 overall. It's not like Barkley would be a reach at 7.

Naismith wrote:I think it's clear that he wants Barkley over everyone else but took enough flack for it that he's trying to make it seem like he's just as good with other guys. There's no problem with making an unpopular stance and going with it if you truly believe it. I think he should have just stuck to his guns, Barkley or Bust!

He should have just stuck to his guns. Barkley no matter what, #1 overall. It's not like Barkley would be a reach at 7.

Barkley would be an OUTSTANDING pick at 7 and while multiple arguments can be made for multiple guys, at this point, we shouldn't rule it out. Particularly after adding some free agents last week.