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Egypt angered by the new Tana Beles dam, Trying to block the new Nile deal

* President is set for Italian visit in protest over European aid for Ethiopia dam projects

Egypt has intensified various diplomatic efforts to delegitimise recent new Nile deal signed by four countries.

Yesterday, Egyptian officials on Nile affairs met in Cairo and expressed their anger over Ethiopia’s new dam, inaugurated on Nile River last Friday.

Hosni Mubarak of Egypt

“Tana Beles dam aims to provoke Egypt’s anger and lead it to taking swift diplomatic behaviour which would turn global public opinion in favour of upstream Nile countries” a statement from the meeting said.

Egypt is preparing to respond to Ethiopia as well as to the signatories of new Nile deal. According to diplomats, Egyptian president Hosni Mubarak is set to travel to Italy, the main financier of hydro dams in Ethiopia.

wen Arabs and Turks invade Egypt and made it hell for our fathers to travel to Israel or charge us with lots of Gold to send us one Head of the Church Leader…Jah jah neva hold your evilness in his arm but send it bk to ya..you reap wt you sow….Pay bk tyme!!!!
Ethiopians Deserve to Live!!!!!!!

No one has the right to restrict our water in which we are 86 percent source. We don’t care weather they angry!!!!!!!!!!!
If they want to live with mutual benefit, it may be ok. Other wise 100s years of foolishness is Enough!!!!!!
Enough is Enough!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Nile river is enough for Ethiopia our African brothers- Sudan, Egypt and others , I think no need of miss understanding here,there is only one thing needed it is how we(Ethiopia, Sudan,Egypt and others ) will agree on how to use this resource mutually and wisly with out conflict.I hope all coserned parties will come in good agrement.

it’s just a matter of time befor hosni mubarak orders air strike on our dams , the BIG QUESTION is are we prepared for WAR????? how is meles planning to retaliate if god forbid they blew one of our bilion birr dam?????

Ethiopia will not be stopped by the diplomatic efforts of egypt. They may delay it a few years but this tactic will not be useful to them in the long run. Ethiopia is determined to use its river for electricity and irrigation. Stupid move by egypt.

More must be done to electrify Ethiopia and use the river for irrigation, this is the only way to get our country out of darkness and end the cycle of hunger by implementing irrigation schemes in areas constantly hit by drought.

Who cares if Egypt angry Coz they don’t want see us in stable economy. . Well done MZ. It is not all about ready, to win the war its all about the truth.we have experience in the past several years we never prepared our self for war b/c we were so innocent and never violet others but when the enemy came we always won. . b/c we have a reason to don’t give up…Egypt should act wisely other wise the consequence will be very dangerous.. Ethiopia has entitled the right to use Nile river.

My question,
the dam is not fully operational yet,i guess all turbines will function in two or so months. So why the “inauguration” now before the dam is complete ? We know the inauguration of Gibe 2 was not when only one turbine started operation,it was when all four turbines with 420MW capacity started operation.
Is the reason for this “too early inauguration” the so-called election ? And is this so-called confrontation with Egypt a trick to get for Meles support from voters ?

If he declare war on Ethiopia, He will be another Esmael Pasha, he declared many war on Ethiopia but he lose all. i think another war after 100 years is unnecessay. Since Nile is enough for all of us, but if war is obeligatory, ……………….

Nile! The crux for Ethiopia’s destability and poverty. Nile! The colonial time bomb for East Africa’s misery. Nile! Egypt’s plenty and prosperity and the East African curse of hunger destability & poverty fueled by Egypt. Here we have East African governements renaissnce “to close once and for all the dominance of too-selfish Egypt over their globally laughable green hunger”. Egypt, we the downstream and downdrained East Africans are ready to go to the end, if need be, to reclaim our god-given resource. You should rather be wise and sign a prudent deal in order to ensure equitable utilization of the river. You develop and prosper, we atleast need to crawl and taste the cream as you have been doing for thousands of years. Whatever conspiracy you may attempt, we are now concious more than ever,and expect no success, we are by the side of our great PM and all pro-equitable Nile utilization counries. Now every Ethiopian is watching all your agents, national or foreign, all over Ethiopia. NILE. THE WAYFORWARD AGAINST FAMINE AND HUNGER IN EAST AFRICA!

In Ethiopia history we never declare war on any country but always war came to us !! if he declare war on us we know how to finish & i’m sure our government is prepared for any out come i hope they are not go to make the same mistake unprepared in Ethiopia & eritrea war !!! don’t forget what they call us the sleeping lions !!!!

deducting from ppl’s response, Ethio politics has less to do with strategy and logic and more to do with emotional outburst…regardless, what’s wrong with fully digesting the news instead of yeqerebewin hulu mewat ina magsat? qes tebilo bebela, tiyaqe such as “why would Eth initiate the Nile water share (an important initiative) a week before election, since this may create conflict and we will need a stable political climate to respond appropriately?” “If conflict arises from the deal, will we have to postpone the election (if we have such)?”; “will this initiative indefinately keep the old admin of 20yrs for another two decades?” would come up. A political party that’s on election starting something as major as the nile initiative would have to inevitably stay in power to continue what they started and that’s the whole idea regarding the initiative timing and “conflict”. one thing mz and I agree on–ppl are just FINDATA betinishu betiliku. relax. the nile has been stolen for thousands of yrs; we can wait one more week and deal with it after election but min yidereg altadelim bechinqilat. One political party on election wanna be everybody’s hero and ppl forget 20yrs worth of misery and fan like little league cheerleaders. yimechachihu.

So after questioning the timing of this “inauguration” and if it has to do with getting support for Meles i want to say that the steps taken so far,building dams on the Abay river and other “Nile” tributaries like Tekeze and the use of that water for irrigation,are the right ones.

Waiting for unspecified period of time to reach an agreement with Egypt and co. would have been wrong. The Egyptians would have used the time to develop or acquire WMDs like nuclear weapons and threaten us with them.

So now we have to see what Egypt will do.If it attacks us we have to defend ourselves.But with the unpatriotic leader Meles in power who divided the country under ethnic or language lines,made it landlocked and the likes we are in a weaker position than we could have been. Now Egypt with its Arab sisterly countries might try to fight Ethiopia in different ways,Eritrea, Djibouti, Somalia,Muslims in Ethiopia and anti-Ethiopian rebel groups like ONLF and OLF could be used as instruments against Ethiopia.

The right steps are taken by woyanes and now we have to prepare ourselves for possible consequences.

Defining time… an issue of NILE RIVER… Its a miracle issue for our motherland… this nile river issue will change some home made policies which has been seen as a negative policy by some citizens…. its an opportunity to see almost all ethiopians united on this matter!!….. i also would like eritrea to remain an enemy of ethiopia for some very exceptional and genuin reasons… its a great benefite for ethiopia….may GOD BLESS ETHIOPIA.!!

Enigma, how genius. The kind who generates hysteria so ppl can rationalize the ethnic/religion based stereotypes to create diversion from the real issue. Interesting–last election saw the administration playing ethnic card and targeting amharas and oromos. This election will also include muslims. So we now have the summary of the enemies of the state: Amharas, Oromos, Somalis and Muslims. Well, how convenient for a 20yr ruling party made of homogenous ethnicity and religion.
Fact is: the dam the chinese built is plagued with technical problems. If we were going to spend money on damns, Holland would have been a smart decision but…mts. who actually read the reports on the failure of the dam? nobody. Fact is: there is internal politics involving diversion of the Nile water from one region to far North illegally/with arms and intimidation, without addressing the water insecurity of the same region(s) from which the Nile comes. Yes, yes. we have Tekeze. but where is the water going? not to the indigenous people to whom the water belongs, but a neighboring region that was its own empire once, one that fought for independence not to long ago. The real people who should have a say in the water are dying of drought, so yihe hulu girgir and findata calm down behon tiru new. AND FYI Enigma–Lake Tana is in Gojjam, and Gojjam has Muslims (that is, Gojjame Amhara Muslims). Now, is this bastard hinting that they’d backstab the principles of their forefathers/mothers for Egypt? is that it? what a smart analysis. gets an F in my class. Obviously, the Nile deal is also about/for them, too. This is the kind of stuff, this kind of hysteria and petty crime for ethnic politics/gain, the extremists camouflaged in bureaucratic language, rationalized stereotypes that just makes me feel that we either get a different govt and a diff attitude as a nation or we all should part ways because this is ignorant, backwards and shameful. and no matter how smart and intellectual ppl like this one make it, it shows how terrible wasting a mind is–a mind a ton of school can’t fix.

generates hysteria so ppl can rationalize the ethnic/religion based stereotypes to create diversion from the real issue. last election saw the administration playing ethnic card and targeting amharas and oromos. This election will also include muslims. So we now have the summary of the enemies of the the state: Amharas, Oromos, Somalis and Muslims. This is often a syndrome of a group that is homogeneous in ethnicity and religion.
Speaking of accomplishments of Mz-dams:
1. the dam the Chinese built is plagued with technical problems. If we were going to spend money on dams, Holland would have been a smart decision. but smart is not what we strive for. cheap is.
2. Sticking it up to Egypt does not resolve the internal politics involving diversion of the Nile water from one region in Ethiopia to another, which is a controversial and undemocratic move. This internal water issue involves a conflict-related region with 20yr ruling party governing Ethiopia taking the water from the region(s) of the source of the river who have been struggling with water insecurity for years.
3. zoro zoro, be it land, sea or river–if Mz is willing to risk war/conflict, chances are it’s not for the benefit of Ethiopia as a whole. This issue is about his party’s interests, his region and security of resources. let’s not argue about this; we all know this is true, no matter how delusional some people are.
4. the Muslim threat: this shows how dangerous ignorance and political propaganda and isolation can be. When enigma suggests that Muslims will side on behalf of Egypt, he/she claims that their solidarity is not based on nationhood but religion. That’s the level of ignorance ruling the office today–for ex. Gojjam, home of Tana Lake, has Amhara Muslims. The traditional Muslim rep. has been haderes and Gurages. The majority of the regions have Muslim populations within their own cultures. Is this a suggestion that these cultures are secretly harboring favor for Egypt and willing to turn against Ethiopia? inesus min iyetetu? ayer? I question the motive of anybody claims unfounded theory lol

Dear Everyone,
At least let’s unite on bread for the hungry. What comes first? Democracy or bread? Have to breath to fight for democracy. Dams, power, roads are to stay in Ethiopia. No one can take them away any time. Yes, democracy comes next. But be wise and let Meles (the wisest) deal with it. In such strtategic issues only leaders wise, bold and mean, at times, are successful. In politics there is also unfair play. Fair Election and democracy will come by later, I believe. And please let’s stop insulting each other and exercise a mature dialogue. Of course, everybody is entitled to his opinion. Love you all Ethiopians.

we ar about see the real light in our country. doing this itself is war against fukn egypt. this is the way of winning the war.ethiopia will not back.our people is ready to defeat egypt and famine.God bless ethiopia

Dear Everyone,
As an Ethiopian I’m upset about Egyptian approach on the interest of the Abay River. In any case Abay River is Ethiopia’s river! This is fact! And everyone who has interest on Abay River should have to accept this truth before anything! However, I believe that those who are dependent on the Abay River have to get their share. Moreover, everyone should think putting himself as all parties! And I need to ask everyone a question particularly Egyptian! What would they do if the origin of ABAY is in EGYPT? This question also includes Sudanese. So I need advise Egypt should calm down! Think yourself as Ethiopian when you try to decide on the situation. And as an owner Ethiopia should get the benefit owner can have.

As an Egyptian i am a little bit shocked of all this hatred in all these comments i don`t know why . Because we don`t have any bad feelings about Ethiopia but the problem is we are 80 million people and the only source of water for us is Nile river and by 2020 that quantity wont enough for us .on the other side Ethiopia has many different kinds of water sources includes rains and your population isn`t that big like us so i think if Ethiopia want to built dams for electricity it is OK else it will be a catastrophe for us

We Ethiopians have no desire to harm Egypt. But Egypt has too selfish attitude. That is no one should touch the waters of Nile except Egypt. Do you know what the Egyptian want. The Nile basin in Ethiopia is 70% of the nation. The Egyptian are telling us that no one in this area should take water from any small or large stream, creeks, rivers anything that is flowing into Egypt. Do you know according to Egypt it is illegal for a farmer to prevent run off from his/her land flowing into a stream since it reduces the water that will reach Egypt.
It is true there is more rain fall in Ethioia than in Egypt but we have come to a point where we can not rely on rain fall alone. On top of that sense of entitlement of Egyptians when it comes to the Nile and the scorn they show to Ethiopians. The late president Sadat said the Ethiopians can go to hell. I will do what i want to do withe the waters of the Nile. This is when Ethiopia objected the pumping of Nile water to Israel accross the Sinia. So if you want peace negotaite with good will and acknowledge our right to our own resource otherwise no power on earch can stop an Ethiopian from drinking from the waters of Nile. Imagine being told that you can not use the water that drains off of your field so someone ungearteful 6000KM away needs it. Com on be real

Dear Tazabi
according to our agriculture minister he said we dont have any problems if Ethiopia want to use water to irrigate fields but in limited areas and it happened before but when you are talking about selfish ,our water consumption wont be enough for us soon and we didnt talk about have more water because we respect the rules and i know u will say this rules done after occupation but also dont forget this occupation who make the boundries of your country and my country and also our agriculture minister says we can co-operate in collecting rain water in Ethiopia
by the way no one here in Egypt has any wish to transfer water to Israel because of two reasons 1st we dont like them as known 2nd the International laws prevent transferring water outside its basin
at the end we are drinking from the same water basin so you can say we are brothers

I guess we should start by getting your facts straight.First don’t try to justify Egypt’s unfair claims based on its population size.Ethiopia alone is a couple of millions short of the figure you cited for Egypt and its quite possible that it will soon surpass it.Moreover when you add all the population upstream, your argument wont hold water at all.

Second, my dear brother don’t be mistaken!!! The border of my country is drawn by the blood of its people.I ask you to consult history and see the fact for yourself.If your best argument to support the “rule” is that it is drawn by the colonialists, tell us how much of the “rules” of the British still govern your life in the streets of Cairo? I bet most of them have been changed simply because they don’t serve your interests anymore.The “rule” on Abay is just one obsolete piece that deserves the eyes of tourists at El-Gizah for its unprecedented injustice. No matter what you choose to do with it, the fact remains that for us Ethiopians, and I believe to all downstream countries, this “rule” meant nothing more than a useless piece of paper which will have no implication whatsoever on our efforts to water our fields. If you expect us to accept partial agreements that do not involve all stakeholders, I guess you should also start getting used to agreements that exclude Egypt and Sudan.

With facts on the table, let me tell you my (and I believe many Ethiopians’)long over due position on the use of Abay, as we respectfully call it here.We Ethiopians don’t want Egypt to get thirsty. That doesn’t however mean that we get thirsty in your place.Rather, we want a collective but efficient management of the water giving fair weight to the needs of all these nations.Does that sound selfish? I don’t think so. What sounds selfish is to “threaten” to impose the most unfair deal the region had ever seen. So my brother, don’t let your politicians lead you astray. They are at the critical cross road where they can decide which direction Egypt is going.There is one crucial step in that decision expected from your government and hence all Egyptians: send that “rule” where it belongs namely the trash bin.

Finally, do you know that 12-14% of the input to Aswan is lost to seepage and evaporation? Can you think of where that figure will go as Abay marches through the deserts in a global warming world? That doesn’t call for more water to Egypt. It rather calls for efficient management of the entire basin say using dams in the fairly cold upstream.
So buddy, do us all a favor and lets drink water from Abay on the round table. When the train is passing, you either get on it or you chose to be left out. You choose!

Dear Egyptian brothers,
I appreciate the way you argue. I don’t like the way some of us try to communicate our opinions. Hatred to each other will never be fruitful for all of us. Let’s try to be less emotional and disuss the issue, learn from each other and build understanding. After all we all come from motherland Africa. We all eat from its soil. Of course, if unlimited amount of water is used from the Nile, your well being be compromised. However, how can we sit still while our impoverished population can’t eat to survive. Yes rain is relatively plenty. But a significant size of our lowland areas do not have sufficient rain to grow crops and rain is also seasonal. We need to irrigate the area around Nile to grow crops to attain food security. We don’t have oil yet and no ports as well. So we need to utilize available resources (this time rivers) to generate power to drive our factories and probably transport systems and also help us secure the neccessary foreign exchange. AND we are only saying let’s have equitable distution of the Nile. The downstraem countries offered a 75% share to Egypt, which I believe have been professionally calculated. Your gov’t shouldn’t say no one is going to touch a drop. It doesn’t work anymore. Your gov’t should rather negotiate on the percentage than sticking to a 1926 agreement where we are not represented and the International law is by our side. Let’s continue discussing please.
Thanks

Dear Abay
i am totally agreed with you about the problem is not about the water quantity it is about the good management but i think till we can have this good management we should keep the current agreement because no one will get hurt if we kept it but if we dont Egypt and Sudan will be hurt .and by the way this is what our irrigation minister said before
finally you cant give me a choice and the two choices are bad for me and want me to choose from them this is not fair
we didnt ask for water although our population is going up and we started to recycle water but you are asking for more water and dont care about any one else

Dear Samoa
I appreciate the way you argue too sounds like you are a respectable man .we dont say u dont have the right to irrigate that area we said it is ok but without talking our part of water which is not enough for us and we talked over and over about helping you about collecting the rain water and we didnt say you can use the rain in irrigating because we know it is seasonal but we are talking about collecting .Our part of water isnt enough for us but we started to recycle water and we didnt ask for changing any agreement or talking water part from any body else .it is all about good management not any thing else
And by the way the international law isnt in your side because this is an international agreement and you want to refuse it and if you want a Loan from the World Bank
it will refuse and this happened before
and come on if i talked the only bottle you have and let you without water what will you do ? that is the reason of what our government said although i hate this kind of talking we are brothers and we will still if god wants to . Greetings form Egypt

Samoa,
are you really serious when you talk about upstream countries offering Egypt 75% of the Nile waters ?
And you call that equitable ?
We should remember that the country contributes nothing to the Nile waters.
Really you must be joking.

No no, 75% for Egypt can not be accepted by the upstream countries,who in that case would be left with less than 10 % when we substract Sudan’s share.

No no, i think even the outdated so-called agreement between Egypt and Sudan is not very different from that.

Egypt should get less than 50%(i dont know how less,40 or 30 %) of the 90 billion m³ annual water volume of the Nile so that upstream countries with their hundreds of millions of population would have enough for irrigating millions of hectares.By the way Ethiopia has already more people than Egypt.

Concerning Ethiopia,the country must start now with large scale irrigation (in the Nile basin alone the potential is several million hectares)because due to the recurrent drought it can not rely on rain-fed agriculture. FYI Sudan and Egypt irrigate some 2 million and 3.5 million hectare land respectively.
Other countries like Kenya,Tanzania and Uganda want also to irrigate their land.
This is possible only when “Egypt’s share” is reduced drastically.
And Egypt can manage this decrease by drastically reducing the use of Nile water for irrigation. Egypt is supposed to have other water sources,like underground water.

So we have to ask Egypt to stop partly or substantially using Nile water for agriculture.
Then we can talk about equitable use of the Nile waters, and we will have peace in the region.

What we should not forget is that in the last several decades Egypt was a destabilizing and destructive force in the Horn of Africa. Eritrea is now a separate country from Ethiopia mainly because of Egypt !

1. What do you mean when you say lets keep the old “agreement” until we have good management? Do you know for how long the Nile negotiations took place? 13 years!!No agreement has been reached and your country, Sudan and the so called “agreement” are the key culprits for the failure.So how long should we wait till Egypt realize its already 2010 and no more 1929 or 1959? You also said “no one” will get hurt if the “agreement” stays. I would have respected you more if you said “Egypt and Sudan will not get hurt if the “agreement” stays”. We get hurt buddy unless you want to count as “no one” like your fathers did in 1959.If that is what you meant, let me tell you a good news: ” we will make sure that you pay attention.” The only reason we tell you the agreement doesn’t even have a salvage value is because its an “agreement” between you and Sudan. So when Sudan asks for more water you can ask for your so called “agreement” to hold. We didn’t sign any agreement with you so we don’t care.Its a new day my brother.

2. Don’t ask me to take your irrigation minster’s words like the Holy words. If I tell you that our agriculture minster said Ethiopians need to stop the flow of Nile to Egypt, will you accept? I doubt it.The same rule applies here.

3. I didn’t give you a choice. Your government has self-imposed a choice on itself and the peoples it represents. Choose to work in tandem with the rest of the nations for a reasonable deal that serves all interests fairly or we consider it that you chose not to work with us and we move on.Its that simple on this side of the basin.

4. I repeat what I said in my previous comment.Don’t use population size as an argument my brother.You know why? it will turn against you before you know it. Egypt is 88 million? ok. Ethiopia is 77 million, Kenya is about 40 million, Uganda is about 32 million… did you start to feel getting dwarfed?

5. What do you mean when you said we asked for more water? Do you at all know the 1959 agreement? Let me remind you however: Out of the estimated 84m3 of water from the Nile, 55.5 was taken (I said taken) by your country while 15.5 was taken (yes taken) by Sudan. The rest 10m3 was left to evaporation. So which “share” of Ethiopia or Uganda or Kenya are you talking about?Have you seen where the absurdity of that “agreement” comes? It gives allowance for evaporation while it leaves out several millions of human beings.

My brother, I will find it extremely hard to think of you as someone who believes in fairness while you don’t even blink when you stand by an “agreement” that serves you and ONLY you.

Finally, if you would like to be listened next time, step back, check your facts, and be honest. There is nothing wrong with defending your country’s interests. Thats what I am proudly doing. But when you do so, come with the truth and with an open heart to hear the other side too.Otherwise, please don’t clutter the comment space with sugar-coded but extremely obvious selfishness. Face it…the 1929 or the 1959 “agreements” work only on that part of the basin starting from where the Blue and the White Nile meet, which is Sudan if you don’t know that.

And Dear “I’m Egyptian”,
Do you realy believe an agreement between two countries can be an international law? I don’t think. That law was not the one blocking loans to Ethiopia. It was the Egyptian Dollar, corruption and international conspiracy. These laws have zero power when it comes to fair play. That is why the upstream countries are pushing ahead with the initiative.
The Egyptian politicians were also out to make sure Ethiopia will never grow economically. Because if it did it will be able to construct large scale dams. They sweated to make sure that it remained unstable by working on weak points, such as ethnicity. It was an insideous means which now is out dated. Your politicians are now again trying the same means going to Italy and China to tell them to stop supporting Ethiopia. But they should know that both countries are in Ethiopia not for the sole purpose of helping. They are looking for a strategic ally that would allow them to invest their resources and look after their economies as well, in the current economically competetive world. Do you also know that the Ethiopian Patriarch used to be crowned from Egypt for many years in the past. In that way Egypt tried to inculcate crippling components in the orthodox religion which still is a problem. Thanks to them it was made sure that most of the days of the month were orthodox holidays named by the various saints. There is more and more. Again let bygone be bygone. Your politicians should be able to come up with an ingeneous means to get around this problem. NEGOTIATE AND SIGN THE NEW DEAL.

Dear Enigma,
That is what I heard as set by the upstream initiative. If I’m wrong I stand corrected. I believe we have to stand by these people as they have worked against the tide day and night for generations to come. I also believe that they have thought over the matter very professionally. It also seems they have gone miles to attract Egypt to sign the deal, and as you know, it too needs Nile to exist. But I also believe, Egypt should have spent it’s dollars on alternative sustainable resources, than wasting their efforts on making sure that other countries remain unstable and undeveloped.

Dear Michale,
I don’t believe Egypt is so unwise to take that route, and god forbid. Do you know why Ethiopia remained free from colonial powers. Besides, the bravery of it’s people, my dear you’ve to see the landscape starting from Addis in the north up to Alamata, in the East upto Hararghe and more. Who on this earth can deal with these incredibly beautiful but untouchable mountains and vallys. Leave alone a soldier that can easily be demasked into his white color /whatever training he took, jungle warfare or other/ ethiopians are now more concious of what a foreigner means, in times of unstability.
I have no worries at all about this. We should also be sure about the very strong and disciplined army that has been built. WE ALWAYS SHOULD STAND FOR PEACE, TALK PEACE AND PRAY PEACE. SOLUTION THROUGH DIALOGUE AND NEGOTIATION.

Dear Samoa
you have an old thought about wars .we are now in 2010 so they dont need to be here they can send rockets and bombs and that is so enough .i saw a movie in Youtube shows that they have a special force training in jungles and i saw their training .one of these is to be in water eating,sleeping and walking for a week so i think they know our landscape well .i am praying too for peace but i want to make sure that we are fully prepared for such thing like that

Dear Michale
We arnt talking here about wars and battles here and i am sure that we will find a Peaceful solution to serve every one and consider the needs of each country so no need for talking about wars…thx

Dear Abay
Although the attacking tone which you are using i will speak quietly as i did before just for one reason which is we are saying each other opinions so these opinions wont be in any deals or agreements so be quite and speak normally if you would like to be listened next time and i appreciated Mr.Samoa for his Sporting kindly spirit in speaking
any way
Population density is almost close to each other, but when comparing we shouldn`t talk about numbers only, but compare also sources of water available and the percentage of each country’s reliance upon .Egypt is for example, relies on the Nile by 90% but Ethiopia, which leads the campaign,depend on Nile by 1%, Kenya 2% and 3% of Tanzania and the Congo1%, Burundi, 5% and 15% of Sudan. So that the intensity of rainfall on those countries reduce the importance of the Nile water for her
You failed to find solutions to collect rain water and you want to use the easiest solution at the expense of countries that are fully adopted on the river in spite of our offer you more than once to help you in the rainwater, but you prefer the easiest solution in your opinion, you think that the World Bank and donors in your side, but This is not true because you can not change the agreements and they cant be against the international agreements and also for a simple reason that the Institute of International Law adopted in 1961 the principle rights are not undermined the historical legacy of water resources, supported by Article 12 of the Vienna Convention on Treaties in 1978, and provided for the inheritance and transmission of treaties in kind and the conventions of borders.
The agreements on international rivers of the treaties passed from parents to their offspring.
In this context, the International Court of Justice in its ruling that rule in 1997 when the hearing of the dispute between Hungary and Slovakia over a project on the Danube River, which supports the negotiating position of Egypt.
by the way, I live in Saudi Arabia and they have only rain water and groundwater, but they did not complain about it and did not lay down their problems on other countries but they have to find solutions to collect rain water and are now irrigating thier fields depend on this .
You are saying that Egypt is main reason for the instability of African countries well I’m going to give you one example, and you have decided if we were the cause or not Ethiopia envolved in the affairs of Somalia militarily until reaching the access to this precarious situation while we are trying to unite the north and south Sudan so who is the element of stability?
We also have investments in the upstream country and contribute to erase weeded of lakes there and dig wells and other activities. We are supporting you as brothers and not as an enemy, you can review sites and blogs and even statements by our ministers to have to make sure we do not have any feeling of hostility towards you

and i want a short answer for this question
how can we compensate for this shortfall in water if we abandon our current share, although we do not have rain like you, or any essential water source else ?
finally do you know that we are mixing the pure water with the waste water in irrigation canals because our current share cant help us to irrigate with only clean pure water
did you understand now how big is this problem for us ?

I don’t want to fell into the trap of ignoring the point and picking on your opponents. If I have to comment on your perception of the way I speak, I will do it at the end. As usual I start by exposing your desperate efforts to twist facts.

1. If you knew population is almost the same, why did you try to convince us we are too few to claim water from Nile? As far as I recall, you were the one who played the “we are too many” card. I was quite willing to accept that you didn’t know and there is nothing wrong about that. But after reading your twists again and again, I m convinced that you do it deliberately and hope that we take it on face value.I m sorry that we disappointed you.

2. You also think that we should consider that Egypt relies so much on Nile while others don’t. Why do you think that happened? Do you think that is because we don’t need the water? Can you feel the irony between loss of millions of Ethiopians on drought caused famines while Abay, flowing from my neighborhood, kept on delivering bread to your table? I don’t blame your country completely for that, though I will come to your roles of the misery in this part of the continent despite your effort to twist another fact again.

3. Honestly, it made me laugh when you said we went for the simplest solution to solve our problem. Isn’t that what you have done for years? If not, why don’t you install desalination plants on the beaches of the red sea and the Mediterranean and leave the Nile for those of us who love simple solutions? You also kept on telling us that you offered us to help on rain collection. First we never asked for help and second, unlike your claim of our failure, we already do so. The simple truth is that we can’t industrialize nor keep up with a demand for electricity that increases by over 20 percent each year by covering our country by millions of tiny rain collection ponds.So, we are grateful for the offer but we will ask for it when we need it.

4. I guess you should leave it to us on how we deal with the likes of the world bank. You also mentioned the Vienna convention and especially Article 12.What does it say? In a word, it says countries are obliged to be bound by an agreement they signed. The Hungary-Slovakia case can be seen within this law because both countries willingly signed the 1977 Budapest treaty.Do you know of an agreement that was signed between Egypt and Ethiopia to allow Egypt use the Nile waters as it like? As far as I know Ethiopia is not a signatory of your 1929 and 1959 frauds.That was one of your two biggest lies in your last reply to my comment.

5. Here comes your gigantic twist. You told us we are a destabilizing force in the region because we went to Somalia to neutralize a force that declared Jihad on us several times through international media. I am sure you heard about the frequent deceleration.So you expect us to sit idle and wait for them to knock our doors and undertake the homework they were given by some nations who feel discomfort to see us stable? Thats not our style buddy.But if you raise the Somali issue, do you know who disturbed the Jan 1997 Sodere accord that took place in Ethiopia which was a big step forward for our Somali brothers? Do you also know the name written on most landmines that take the lives of many East Africans? Do you also know the only African producer of anti personnel landmines that didn’t sign the Ottawa convention to ban them? Its your country brother. Do you also know that it was your Butros Butros Gali suggestion to allow the first foreign intervention in Somalia? Give me a brake my dear brother. On the fame of your country, especially when it comes to aborting peace in Ethiopia, I invite you to read the paragraph on the link at the end of my reply.

6. Let me force myself to believe you, as a person, have no hostility against us. Nor do I, as a person, has a hostility against you. I also don’t recall my government showing hostility towards your country.How about your government? Below you will find a link to a recent example.

7. Finally, on my way of writing.If you have the right to write white lies and confusion, I reserve a full right to dismember it.If that feels like an attack, your best antidote must be to step back, collect facts and write the truth without being blinded with paranoia and unfair claims.Then you can successfully deny me a reason to “attack”, if I am doing that at all.I, once again say, lets have a glass of water from the Nile without saying its mine or yours, but OURS. Then we have a future together.Is there an alternative to peace? You decide, as your politicians are trying to do so.

Links:
On Egypt’s effort to “give” peace to Ethiopia and the region as whole 🙂

Dear Abay
first:
i am so happy because you made you words in points because you were like who writes a story
second:
you need to accept the other opinion like every one will accept your opinion and you should stop trying to make your opinion to be accepted without real facts and i am saying real facts and by the way i am not twisting facts if i did tell me one fact i twisted ..I m sorry that i disappointed you too because you wont find any thing wrong in my sentences.
3th:
yes i talked before about the population but i talked also about the available water sources which you denied it in your speech deliberately
i was talking about the population-water sources factor as a one factor not about the population and water sources factors
4th:
As i said before you are 1% depending on Nile so that means you have another sources can be enough for you if you managed it well so if you managed it well you will be able too avoid any hanger but if you want to use the easiest solution -The Nile- we will have a hanger and there is no way to avoid it because we haven`t another source
5th:
by the way i am not saying any jokes here which making you laugh .this is my opinion and you should respect it as i respected yours
any way
Who told you that we want to prevent you from build dams to produce electricity ?
our irrigation minister was so obvious when he said you can build electricity generator dams as you like because it won`t harm us and this is a prove of we want your to be better and start to have factories …etc
and who told you too we did not start to install desalination plants on the beaches of the red sea and the Mediterranean ?
we already do but we do it for the coastal cities only because it is costly to do it in big scales.
the situation is to work with the available sources you have not the others have and i am meaning by that our share
because it is OUR share and i didnt say that the Nile`s water is ours like you said .you obviously have a bad feelings and information too
and i think this feelings and informations from these unknowns books and websites you are using and want me to accept them as a reliable sources
6th;
you said there are no agreement between Egypt and Ethiopia also it is your opinion but the WHOLE world accepted it
and the dispute, which was between Slovakia and Hungary was the result of the signed agreements, done by the Soviet occupation and the International Court of Justice upheld the historical conventions signed by the occupation authorities .
And on what basis you think that Britain divided the waters of the river on this form ?
because of the same principles i am talking about it population-water sources so dont call us a selfish
because you will find that you are the selfish one because you have your heavy rain and want to talk the Nile too is that fair in your think ?
7th:
According to YOUR BOOK which accuse us of trying to destabilize Somalia Well do you know what the Suez Canal was affected due to the lack of stability in Somalia due Canal revenues by 30% Do you think we want to lose to ourselves ?
The talk about mine I do not know anything about it, but if we really produce mine are we put them there
If you have a person with a knife wound your hands Is it possible to blame the plant, which produced the knife, but maybe it is you who put it there because you are the only military force that intervened there
Are you sincere when you say my Somali brothers because brothers didn`t kill each other as i know
and please stop claim that we are the cause of what you are in. If you decide that you want to be a stable country you will be stable even if the whole world don`t want you to be stable
8th:
Quote :”Let me force myself to believe you, as a person, have no hostility against us. Nor do I, as a person, has a hostility against you. I also don’t recall my government showing hostility towards your country.How about your government”
Why force yourself this is my opinion and it is the truth if you want to believe it and if you do not want this is your problem
There is also a common saying :who looking for hate ,will find it and who looking for peace will find it too but it seems that you are busy to find hatred , hostility and unreliable links and are not recognized by the State and do not reflect the intentions of the state’s official
9th:
finally i didnt be the only one who feels about this attacking tone but also there is a respectable man called Samoa feeled it
and again i amn`t saying any unfair or white lies as you said because i don`t lie at all even a white lies if you did please do not feel that all people lie like you
AND AGAIN THIS RIVER IS BELONGING TO ALL NILE BASIN COUNTRIES
Salam
Eng.Ahmed

I suggest a 35-35-15-15 solution to the share of the Nile waters problem.

Egypt should get 35% considering
1. its relatively large size of population
2. its relatively high dependency on the Nile

Ethiopia should get 35% considering
1. its relatively large size of population
2. its relatively high contribution to the Nile waters

Sudan should get 15%,which is slightly less than its present share

Uganda,Kenya,Tanzania and the rest should get 15%,which is equivalent to white Nile’s contribution to the Nile waters.

This could be what one would understand as equitable use of the river.

Of course the amount of the avialable water of the Nile could vary, and there is a possibility that it could rise when it is possible to reduce loss of water through evaporation,some 30 to 40 billion m³ annually according to some reports.
Also electrification through hydro-generated power in the region will help to preserve trees or even to plant more with the effect of raising the water volume of the Nile.

But if Egypt and Sudan are not willing to accept this 35% and 15% share respectively the upper riparian states have no other choice but to go ahead with their own projects.

Notice also that tens of billions of m³ Nile water flows in the Mediterranean sea annually, could that not be reduced to a minimum or zero ?

It is reported that the nutrient rich Nile water positively influences the amount of fish in the Mediterranean sea. In other words without the flow of Nile river into the sea fishers and fisher companies in European,North African and Middle Eastern countries will have less fish to catch.

But this is also an issue one can raise here, why does Egypt waste Nile water by letting it flow into the Mediterranean sea ?

This will be my last reply to you simply because one can’t wake up a person who plays asleep.

Since you finally appreciated (and also imitated)the way I write, I continue point by point.

1.I am not sure where you got the 1% you were talking about Ethiopia’s use from the Nile. I would think it is even below that. Despite the percent, however, unlike your interpretation, its not because we met our needs for water by other sources that we used only 1%. The simple reason is that we were not in a position to use the Nile because of instability and poverty.Things have changed so we started exploiting all our water resources and next on the line is the Nile, preferably in cooperation with you and all the Nile basin countries. As I told you on my first reply, no Ethiopian wants you to get thirsty. But that doesn’t mean we get thirsty in your place.It means we share fairly.If your response to that is to flex your military muscles, I quote our PM to you: “Don’t try to stop the unstoppable.”

2.Do you know about the Tana beles dam? Its our brand new dam primarily used for electricity generation. But what does the title of the article say? It says you guys are pissed off despite what you irrigation minster, whose words that you seem to take like words from the Holy book, said. In fact what really worry us as Ethiopians is not whether you like it or not, although we will be glad if you cooperate with us in a collective and efficient use of the Nile. What worries us is how quickly can we do it since it has been due for centuries.

3. I am glad to learn you started desalination because it seems like you will need it. I know its costly and that is why you want the waters of the Nile so dearly. But didn’t you accuse us of going for simple solution before? So why do you look for the simple solution of using the Nile while you can do the difficult and costly desalination? It doesn’t make sense right? That is exactly the thought process in our minds too: why do we fill our scarce agricultural lands with potholes while there is a simple solution of tapping into OUR SHARE of the Nile? Mind you…I said OUR FAIR SHARE!!

4.I call Somalis my brothers because they are my brothers.You measure their misery by the revenue you lost from the Suez canal while we share their misery by providing food, hope and home.For your personal account of our brotherhood that puzzled you, I invite you to the streets of Addis or any city in Ethiopia.The same goes true with Eritreans with whom we had an issue some years ago. By the way do you know that there are Ethiopian Somalis with their own federal state in Ethiopia? Check for yourself.

5.If your quote of your own irrigation minister can be a reliable source, how come a published book can’t be? If you question the integrity of the book, I challenge you to write an alternative one with the “real facts” you have. We read it and then we judge.By the way its not my book as you said so. As a genuine display of my original “Ethiopian” brand, I don’t like to take what belongs to others and it infuriates me when others take whats mine.My dear brother, you can’t undermine a book just because it said things that implicate you as a destabilizing force.You counteract it by facts and we remain to see your “real facts”, as I will ask you to do so at the end.

6. If you have links that are more “reliable” (not your irrigation minster of course), let us see.

7. Dear “I am Egyptian” here come my favorite sentence in your last reply to me. I quote: “THIS RIVER IS BELONGING TO ALL NILE BASIN COUNTRIES”. Wow…that is exactly what I like to hear from my Egyptian brothers. I hope by “ALL” you don’t mean Egypt and Sudan but also Ethiopia, Kenya, Rwanda, Uganda, Tanzania etc.If so, I want you to answer the following question.According to the 1929 and 1959 “agreements” (that are best referred as old frauds), I know the share of Egypt (55.5mil m3 out of 84mil m3), Sudan (18.5mil m3 out of 84mil m3) and of evaporation (10mil m3 out of 84mil m3). Tell me the share of Ethiopia, Kenya, Eritrea, Uganda, Rwanda, Congo and Tanzania then I will believe you.Honestly, I eagerly wait for your answer.

8. Here is a second question for you. Tell me the name of the treaty that Ethiopia signed with Egypt on the use of Nile (the one you said the whole world accepted), when and by whom it was signed.Don’t tell me its the one signed by you and Britain because we were not Britain’s colony, a fact that you can cross check.I also eagerly wait for your answer on this one since you claim to be the man of “real facts”.

9. Samoa’s comments are brotherly to me and he is entitled to his own opinion on my way of writing. Your attempt to use his comment against me however is the tactic that you guys use to turn us against each other.Sorry buddy..that is an age-old tactic so may be try to look for a new one.

Once again, my dear brother, I hope we will soon see a day that you and me can join our glasses of water from the Nile and say cheers.

Dear Abay
-Why did not respond about the mine case which you accused us by using it to instable Somalia or do you find yourself in an awkward position ? i really get sick of your lies .It wasn`t a polite style to tell me that you won`t respond to me next time .My brother Samoa was right when he resented the style of talking you are using and i am not wanting to use this as tactic i just said what he said so stop your lies and your fabrications.
-I said and will repeat again stop to think that the others are the cause of your instability the occupation left you time ago and it was the main cause of instability in any state, however you still unstable then the reason is your leader and your government, who thinking only about being in power forever and do not think about the stability of the country .We were also under occupation and we freed ourselves and we are a stable many years ago
-You were the reason of instability of your neighbors Eritrea and Somalia, and I quote here the words of the President of Eritrea ” Ethiopia must be stopped to deal with its neighbors as if they were a superpower ”
-When Somalia started to be stable you entered thier land although they didnt hurm you country or start a war with you but you are doing the USA agenda which didnt want Somalia to be stable or to be leaded by islamic groups so your leaders didnt care about your stable as they cared about doing America`s agenda just to let them in thier positions
And by the way i am not measuring their misery by the revenue you lost from the Suez canal and under any meaning the most important thing is we didn`t want them to be instable because it is against us and please stop acting like you care about them because you are the reason of thier misery
-You said that we are angry about electricity generator dams come on use your genius brain in electricity generator dams it just turbines generating electricity so they didn`t waste water but we are refusing dams which collecting water for irrigating because it will reduce our share of water so the summary is if you want to build electricity generator dams it is ok go on what are you waiting for?
-You are saying from where did i get the percentage of 1% for Ethiopia and the other percentages ? you can search and tell me if you find another percentages till this you cann`t accuse me .
-You are saying “I am glad to learn you started desalination because it seems like you will need it “yes we will need it because our current share are not enough for us right now and we didn`t export our problems to the other countries but we think about solving our problems by ourselves and if you said this because you thought that you can decrease our current share i am telling you you can`t for many reasons international law is one of them and come on come on do u think that the cost of collecting rains is equal to desalination?
By the way desalination is using in drinking and other stuff not in irrigating

– you can`t use your simple solution because it isn`t yours . the whole situation is like a pie and yes it must be an equal share but in different forms you have rains and Nile you will take rains and a small part of Nile and we didnt have rains so we will take a big part because we didn`t have rains .you failed to use your rain part it is your problem
And do you know that the rain volume in Ethiopia only is 900 billion m3/year and you are wasting it
Because your rain intensity is 1000-1500 mm/year and in Egypt and Sudan is about to 20 mm/year
Also our actual need is 75 billion m3 and our share is 55 billion m3 and also we irrigate only 4% of our area due to our limited water
-When i am talking about our irrigation minister , i am talking about our formal state situation so it is not about reliable or not
-by the way we didnt flex our military muscles and if you review my respond on Mr.Michale`s comment you will know we want peace and we have any hostility to anyone
-and about treatment between Egypt and Ethiopia i think i explained it before and i gave you an example for a similar situation but you didn`t understand so it is your problem not mine also
And again ask yourself why did the British occupation divide shares like that ?
It is all about population-water sources factor . i think you will ask me about this again
And my answer is up there
-Finally i didnt set with persons who didn`t respect me and have a hostile speech against me and say cheers so i am sorry for disappointing your invitation
but of course it is my pleasure to set with any respectable man Ethiopian , Sudanese, Ugandans ,….etc
bye bye

Dear Egyptian,
I won’t try to reply to your latest message. Maybe I will come to that later.
I would like to hear what your responses would be to my thoughts below. I asked my self “But should a country base its whole survival on resources which are so precarious, controllable by external forces. Should a country like Egypt famous for people with inventive and creative mentality who managed to make such a mysteriously giant pyramids sit back and enjoy resources that might at some point in time may be halted by external forces”. Should a country trust a treaty “if at all legal” and its invisible and visible destabilization hands and carryover with these tactics that were received from predecessors. Shouldn’t your govt. have invested and left no stone unturned to acquire a more reliable local resource. Israel is an example for this, sorry if you don’t enjoy the example. Should you blame me if I protest and want to share the meal you are eating from my dish. For example can’t egypt invest on desalination using solar power which is amply available there. Shouldn’t your govt invest on sustainable and reliable resources or had a contingency plan in case all their efforts (including war) fail to secure these resources.
Salam

Dear Enigma,
thank you for the info. Forgive my ignorance. My main inquiry here, however, is how a country strategizes its resources, the root cause of the problem. Is Egypts strategy for a resource base reasonable. It would be educational for me if I get your thoughts on this.
Thanks

The Abay River is a river in Ethiopia. Locally it is also known as the Gihon, and believed to be the same river flowing out of the Garden of Eden in the Bible. The river is considered holy by many in Ethiopia. The river forms the upper part of the Blue Nile, and the majority of the water in the Nile originates in the Abay.

I M SORRY EGYPT WE BUILT MANY DAMS FOR THE COMING YEARS ON ABAY 1,2,3,4,5,6,7..OK.WE SHOULD BE THE MAN OF TODAY NOT THE PAST OK..

Egypt! No more prospority over the destitution of Ethiopia and the Nile basin countries. Egypt should have had a prudent contingency plan rather than sleeping lousily, enjoying a precarious resource, and counting on it’s capacity to destabilize and threaten desperate Ethiopia. Still, rather than laboring on alternatives, Egypt is busy with sponsoring anti-stability forces, such as Issayas, and dividing the allied Nile basin countries, begging for world sympathy for it’s inefficiencies. A waste of time and resources, I presume. I saw an article about a pregnant women with a tap in her house with no water near the Nile. Is Ethiopia to blame for this? Do they know the number of women dying in Ethiopian hospitals and clinics due to the lack of water and electricity? You Egyptian politicians will soon be asked by your people, what you have been doing all these years to safeguard the water security other than military might and drilling on the weakness of others.
A fit-for-nothing guy in the horn, Issayas, induldging him self in all buisness against Ethiopia. Because Ethiopia is, and will remain, a demonstration of his weakness and megalomaniac arrogance. He was borne as a curse to Ethiopia and Ethiopians should pray for his extermination.

It is mind boggling and at times ridiculous to hear the Egyptians telling us not to use our own resource for irrigation purpose while they squander a large amount of the same resource. We understand that we can’t be use the water 100% as there are some international laws and norms concerning international rivers. But the current allocation of the Nile water is outdated and totally unacceptable. The agreement was signed by colonial powers and it didn’t include Ethiopia although it contributes the lion’s share of the water. it is high time now that we sit as civilized people and sort out a new deal that will be equitable and fair for all parties involved. Threats and misinformation will no longer work. And everyone should know that when it comes to our country’s sovereignty we Ethiopians never even blink a second to defend it.

No frasturation with Egiptian speech at all! B/c it is Ethiopia and we are Ethiopians.
So, just go a head with the project fiarly and geniunly with out in the way of harming others.
Dear Egiptians! we are sisters and brothers, you are eating more than 4 times a day but we eat 2 times (five -eleven principle). so it is must to share us the fourth one. And to do this targeting our water resource as a primery solution acceptable and inevitable.

We Ethiopian not need war and want to use the Nile river fairly without affecting the Egyptian benefit from Nile river.You know Nile is not only the owner of Egyptian.If Egyptian not accept this fear share the will not good for them.