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Sunday, May 8, 2011

Imbaba on Fire "Updated"

Imbaba is on fire ,Imbaba is on fire after 100 days from January 28th ,2011 thanks to what appears as sectarian division turning in to chaos. For hours now we had contradicting reports and stories but this is what I found out and can be considered as main common points in all the stories. “I am not sure though after all these hours”

It all started with a lady named Abeer , originally from Upper Egypt who allegedly converted to Islam who couple of years ago and married a Muslim.

We found tweets and Facebook status online that Salafists and all Muslims should head to “Marimina” Church in Imbaba because Abeer was abducted by Christians and that Abeer herself called a man named “Abu Yassin” asking for rescue. We are speaking about 8 PM Cairo local time.

All accusation fingers are pointing to Paltalk chat room owned by someone called Wassem. “I think they mean Wassem Abdullah”

According to tweeps these twitter accounts “@masrislam” and @emudeer were the ones who started the tweets about Abeer online . It is worth to mention that Essam Mudeer is from Saudi Arabia. Unfortunately this fact makes many activists and Egyptians believe that this clash was planned by the Saudi intelligence and other Gulf intelligence to sabotage our revolution. There are rumors that the Salafists in Egypt are financially supported by huge sum of money from Saudi Arabia.

Misrislam's tweet about Abeer

Then we found a protest allegedly made of hundreds of Salafists standing in front of the Church demanding Abeer. A group of their sheikhs went in to the Church to search for the lady but found nothing

The army came and then things got escalated dramatically when allegedly Molotov cocktails began to be thrown and there was exchange of fire. Some claim that some people living besides the Church “Abeer’s Christian family” opened their fire from their rooftop on the army while others say that a Christian from inside the Church shot in the air one shot to scare the people and then the fight started to be violent and armed

Then there was allegedly an attempt to set the church on fire but the locals from the neighborhood protected it who kept chanting “Muslim , Christian one hand” while some are saying that the place that set on fire was dumpster beside the Church.

Putting down the fire

Then suddenly another big church “The virign” in a big main street “Al Wahda-The unity” was set on fire along with shops owned by Christians in the same street.Here is a photo from the church while the fire was being put off.

These shops were destroyed ‘Including a café allegedly owned by the one who open his fire in the Church , here is a video from Sarah Carr showing the Cafe destroyed . It is worth to mention those young men in the cafe do not seem Salafists to me’

Now some are saying that the Salafists behind this fire while on the other we got eye witnesses who are insisting that the ones who set the Church on fire were thugs from outside Imbaba. The army and CSF used the tear gas grenades to end the clashes but in vain.

CSF soldiers are back after 100 days of absence
in Imbaba

The curfew is officially imposed and the army supposedly is arresting everybody and will enforce the counter thuggery law immediately asking the public to evacuate the scene. The army is protecting Marimina church. The 777 unit is reportedly there.

Army vehicles in Imbaba

This is what I have gathered from all the stories I have heard from all parties whether eye witnesses , Christians , Muslims and bloggers/tweeps who went there but had to leave because it was extremely dangerous. What we know for sure that 5 Egyptians have been killed and 109 were injured according to the latest numbers issued by the ministry of health. The general hospital of Imbaba is demanding blood donation , of course I hope the army helps the hospital and facilitates the transfer of blood from the national blood bank from El Batal Ahmed Abdel Aziz street ASAP. Now there are important facts worth to be mentioned in our case here :
It is worth to mention that this Abeer’s rumor after one hour “not mor ethan 2 hours” from airing Kamilia Shehata’s interview on radical Christian Al Hayat where she revealed that she is Christian and not a Muslim and that she is apologizing for all these insults Pope Shnouda III.

Kamilia Shehata apologizes

It is worth to mention that there was that radical Christian channel called “The road” airing the events live , reportedly the Channel called the Christians in Egypt to have a sit in in front of the American in Embassy in Cairo demanding international protection to Christians in Egypt !! For the first time since the Egyptian revolution I have heard Morris Sadek today asking the U.S. to interfere. This is so stupid and will make things even worse. Both Christian Al Hayat and the road are reportedly broadcasted from outside , they are not considered Egyptian but rather American.
It is worth to mention that journalist Sarah Carr saw a former SS officer in the scene.Here is his picture from previous protest in 2010
It is worth to mention that the army and police are under huge fire for being so soft in dealing with the matter especially the police. People believe that the army could have ended this matter in couple of minutes. Of course we are not talking here about political activists protest that could be dispersed in no time by the army but we are speaking about tackling clashes in a populated area based on religious tensions and rumors , things could have gone disastrously if excessive violence was used in Imbaba like what happened on April 9th at Tahrir. I am not defending the army because it has got in share in responsibility for what happened but one must be fair. Dispersing these clashes should have been the sole mission of the bloody lazy police force.
It is worth to mention that this is the first real test for the SCAF ultimatum last week that it will not stand still against any attempt targeting the unity of Egypt and we not speaking here about Al Nor mosque but we are speaking about sectarian division.
It is worth to mention that this is Imbaba ,the choice of this place was not random again. If you check in all sectarian tensions locations in Egypt you will find them in high populated working class areas whether in urban or rural areas where rumors and lies can turn solid facts in no time. No one denies that light weapons in Imbaba are common like any populated area in Cairo and fights can turn very ugly to the level that police used excessive violence there.The new thing in our case here is the use of guns from the people there , of course during the revolution guns have become so easy to purchase.
It is worth to mention that this comes before hours from the regional visit of PM Sharaf to UAE and Bahrain.
It is worth to mention that what happened in Imbaba took place after El Adly’s historical jail sentence and the start of Gamal Mubarak’s interrogation. It is worth to mention all medical sources say that Hosni Mubarak himself does not complain from anything physically or psychologically to prevent him from being transfer to Tora to have his 15 days in jail pending investigation.
It is worth to mention that the political rights law will be announced this week.
Story is developing. The latest updates @1:23 PM :

The death toll increased to 12 while the injured have reached to 212 according to official numbers !!

The army is imposed a full curfew on that area in Imbaba till 12 PM tomorrow.

The internet and mobile phones are reportedly cut in certain areas in Imbaba !!

No one called Abeer was found !!

Group of angry protesters is protesting near the American embassy. They want the U.S. to force the army to protect the churches. This is so wrong despite I understand the anger of Christians , this will give a golden opportunity for the radicals.

PM Essam Sharaf has adjourned his tour in the Gulf and is going to have a press conference soon after an urgent meeting for the cabinet.

Minister of interior Eissawy visited the Marimina church this morning.

The minister of justice spoke in a press conference on behalf of the PM and said that the terrorism law will be applied starting from today and the cabinet is in a meeting session. The PM will address the nation supposedly soon.

A group of Christian protesters is currently having a protest in front of the High supreme court in Cairo and then will head to the Egyptian radio and TV building to have a sit in.

Things in Imbaba seemed to be electrifying. There are flyers distributed in churches there saying that Christians will protect the churches with their souls.

I will eat whoever comes closer to my church

The injured number has increased in to 232. The injured and dead include Muslim and Christian alike.

Latest updates @ 7 :26 PM:

A big group of Christians along with some Muslims are having a sit in front of the Egyptian TV building Masepro. From couple of hours ago there were clashes between some thugs 'according to eye witnesses' and the protesters. There was stone throwing and the army had to bring more vehicles to the army. According to eye witnesses the angry protest included chants and slogans like "Muslim and Christian one hand" and for anti field marshal Tantawy chants as well.

40 comments:

You forgot to say that it is worth to mention that Chrisiatian are being killed again...., it worth to mention that churches are being burned again...., it is worth to mention that the army is doing nothing to stop the so called thugs or whatever they're called again....

Rumours, fanatics, violence. This is very sad. It was only when you people were united that you were able to achieve something so big. Seems the Salafists or more interested in other peoples business or marriage than in democracy and peace. Seems they are similar to what we have in Europe in the form of Neo-Nazis. "Democracy is not good, we want to go bac to the middle ages, when people were so good", etc., all that bullshit.

You cannot help but wonder whether they do not, deserve it selling the rope that hangs you. if trends stay true they will soon be heavily attacked. PS when you say "radical christian channel" do you mean they are calling for attacks on non-Christians or they don't sing "all is well" when churches are fire-bombed j

You are obviously reluctant to link the Salafists to Saudi Arabia although they are so totally retarded Saudi. Like MB receives funds from Qatar Salafiyyah is funded by KSA. Those Gulf States are indeed undermining our revolution and do not forget how much King Abdallah tried to support Mubarak.Salafiyyah (and not MB!) is the enemy of a free democratic Egypt. We have to do much more but to watch. Sufis and Christians must join forces to eradicate this evil.

Wooha! the conspiracy theorists are at full swing tonight, this is why Egypt will never move forward because they blame everyone expect themselves. It's very plain and simple to see, Salafists call a protest based on unfounded rumors, things got ugly and here we are.Frankly I don't blame Christians protesting in front of the American embassy, if you feel unprotected in your own country to turn to outsiders.Of course we all know was gonna happen now a groups of a Sheikhs and priests come together for a ridiculous symbolic reconciliation, without any accountability or actions. The government will set up a fact-finding committee so it looks like they're doing something.

thannks Z for updating us on this matter. I was really concerned and worried about it since last night. It seems some extremist Salafist are creating problems again. I hope the military will take stern action against those who committed this chaos or crime! Why cant everybody lives in peace and together! that is the problem in the Arab World, they always divide themselves as Salafist, Syia, Sunni and Sufi!! Al-Quran didnt teaches us to be different beliefs or group, Al-Quran teaches us to be only Muslims, Al-Quran is the book from Allah swt as our guidance and we believe only one God which Allah swt!! This will destroy the revolution and freedom in Egypt! Dont let religion divide Egyptians and the country!

It is inconceivably mysterious why Salafists, radical Copts, Baltageyya, and other people who are doing so much damage to the country in the current state aren't executed by gunfire at the spot!

The extent of damage they have done is beyond belief. In hard times like these, they are popping their heads up with selfish, narrow-minded and immature demands and thus causing further chaos, injecting the society with morbid hatred, sectarian grudges and draining the last penny of foreign investment out of the country, thus strengthening further poverty and installing new errors, all in the name of them "not-willing-to-give-up-what-they-believe-in" although we've never seen them say or do anything when Mubarak and his regime were literally halving and quartering the country like a grilled chicken.

It's about time the Egyptian army did something useful, such as a constitutional amendment to outlaw such activities and have them punishable by immediate execution by gunfire at the spot! Aren't we still living under a state of emergency? Why isn't it properly applied? Why is it only used against peaceful demonstrations, and why is it prone to 'misunderstandings' instead of enforcing firm solutions to problems so crippling such as the Baltaga issue?

Do this and this problem will be eliminated till kingdom come.

God bless the people who fell victims to blind violence, extremism, and basically everything else.

Let's not fool ourselvesAbeer's husband recived a phone call by her telling him that she is kidnaped and she is in a 7 floors house beside the church, the husband went to the police when the police went with him to set her free the shooting began by Christians from the Church and thr neighbouring houses belong to Christians, no one now ask about Kamelia Shehata and Wafaa Constantine!!

>when you say "radical christian channel" do you mean they are calling for attacks on non-Christians or they don't sing "all is well" when churches are fire-bombed

No, she means that they are fringe US Christian channel that spreads sectarian lies (like the one originating from Saudi Arabia that started this hideous bullshit) with goal of spreading religious fundamentalism and sectarianism.

Keep in mind that the disgusting Saudi-funded Salafist channels also don't directly call for violence against Christians. They instead spread the sectarian lies and preach the religious fundamentalism that fuel this sectarianism in Egypt.

So in that respect, Al-Hayat is exactly like a Salafist channel.

I am an Egyptian who is pro-democracy and the rule of law, but I will not give a crap if the Army just rounds up all these Salafist idiots and puts them behind bars for eternity.

These salafist cavemen thugs should be hanged at sunrise tomorrow.Too many coincidences.Saudis/US/Israelis want Mubarak back.Bahraini lawyer was at the ICC yesterday.PM Sharaf was due in Bahrain today.

US and Saudi: the former provides the latter with money and protection, the latter provides the former with oil and legitimacy. In this embrace everybody in between get crushed, but what do they care. The american rednecks and the saudi salafis are just happy with driving around in their big oil-devouring cars, heartlessly shooting people in their way and legitimizing it by accusing normal Muslims and Christians of being infidels and scum. At last there will be no human culture left where it once started. God help us.

Rumours?? they are funded by Saudis although not directly linked to Saudi government but funds come from "Islamic" institutions and investment banks in SaudiArabia, some of them have notable amirs(Binturks and Sauds) on their boards. That idiot salafi sheikh Hassan is actually a member of the Baraka group... why don't you do some fact checking first before labelling what is a rumour and what isn't?

Egypt: Situation Deteriorating Badly and Rapidly. "The remaining Christians in most of the Arabic-speaking world may be on the edge of flight or extinction." says an article by Barry Rubin. On Instapundit, Michael Totten remarks "I’m sorry to say that I’m not surprised. It was fashionable to cheer the downfall of Hosni Mubarak, and I, too, took pleasure in seeing him go, but Egypt is, I think, the least likely of all the Arab countries to emerge from a revolution in decent shape. I know some terrific Egyptians who would build a wonderful country if given the opportunity, but they are outnumbered."

As an American redneck who firmly supported Egypt's revolution for freedom, I object to the idea that we, who are fighting the grotesque spawn of Egypt's Salaf Quttbists in the form of Al Qaeda are in anyway responsible for or desiring of the rise of Salafis or sectarian violence in Egypt.

Especially since these events do, in fact, open the door to such scum as Zawahiri, et al to return and wreak havoc on Egypt. And, just because i am predicting that does not mean I am some part of the greater American/Saudi/Zionist conspiracy to defrock Egypt's revolution. it means that events themselves can conspire to make things happen, people really do not have to do anything at all.

These are all conspiracy theories. The sectarian problem in Egypt has existed in Egypt for eons, decades, centuries, what have you. They were not created by Americans although they may have traveled out of Saudi Arabia's apparently greater mission to convert everyone to their extreme conservative version of Islam.

May I ask, with all due respect to the person who mentioned it above, where does Egypt get it's oil since it is not exactly a self sustained oil producing state? Whoever lives in glass houses should not throw stones.

This is a local problem exacerbated by the apparently successful ploy of some fellow Salafis to stir up their compatriots to act against the church. they may have had outside assistance, but this is likely individuals or groups acting on their own. I know that seems impossible, but once you actually understand that governments really cannot control all the people all the time, you will learn this lesson. A lesson that is abundantly clear since the military and police seem unable to control the Salafis or Imbaba.

The revolution broke the great fear of the Egyptian Secret Police being everywhere watching everyone and ready to make them disappear into the prisons. This is what happens. People no longer believe in that lie so they are much freer to act and they are acting as they have always wanted.

it may be difficult to accept that since it seems to tarnish the revolution, but it is the truth. the question now is how does the greater part of Egypt and the revolution deal with it? Do not count on the military or police. You broke them, now it is your responsibility to manage the greater society beyond the former police state.

I want to add one sentiment, which is great sadness that the revolution was the work of Zeinobia and her compatriots. I refer to educated secular democracy-loving Internet-enabled Egyptians. They were the instigators. Their revolution is being stolen by the Ikhwan, Salafists, et al, who sat on their asses until Mubarak resigned.

So what you want, you got ... unfortunately not realizing what it all than it threatens.Tak let's solve the problem! Army not working? Army is now at a crossroads, it is impossible to side with Christians, it is impossible to side with musulman.Civil war here here what you have! "Are you happy?" You wanted it? brainless crowd ..... you are not capable of democracy, the higher the power to introduce to you luchshe.Armiya extremely position and tighten the nut, then you'll understand ..... Have played it's time to order return.

Kat, obviously you know zilch about my country. First,sectarian problems did not exist in Egypt for centuries, it only began in the Saddat era when he made deals and coalititions with radicals also coinciding with the return of expats who worked in Gulf states with their imported extremism.Second, we are very self-sustained when it comes to oil and we do actually export a little too, we don't need the Gulf's oil and never did.Third..go read some books you ignorant redneck.

I don't subscribe to the assertion that the sectarian problems we have in Egypt are caused by a crazy individual or as part of a recent social or political development where a minority previously marginalized suddenly felt that this is the time to seek equality. The Christians in Egypt have never been marginalized no more than those in Iraq or Syria. Sectarian problems have the habit of suddenly showing up in areas where the Arabs dare defy the power that be. For example, Iraq with the kurds, and the two main Islamic factions with its historic background, also in Lebanon with the Muslim/Christians, in Bosnia, in the Sudan, in Bahrain and Syria etc..and if a country had a unified religious background then the divisions would pop out all the sudden based on political factions and which have been stirred up as the case is in Libya and currently Tunisia and of course Pakistan. All these have one thing in common, they all help destabilize the nation. Sectarian division is a golden ticket to brake up a country and divide it in order to claim a stake in its politics, economics and natural resources or all of the above. Egypt is next on the list and the light headed Egyptians have fallen for it as other Arabs did before them, so let us not brand it as a conspiracy theory thus totally discount any internal or external foul play.

@ Kat Great post I completely agree with you, Egypt will either move backward or not at all if we continue to blame everything on the Zionists or whatever

@JasonExactly!! The moment Wael Ghoinm got kicked off that sound stage in place of Qardawi, it was all gone, as we stand idly by .

Yes we'd all like to believe that this is all an elaborate ploy by the counter-revolution, I'm sure it'll make us sleep easy.. but it is true? Absolutely not!! Egyptians are still the problem as soon as we admit this, we'll be on the right road.

@Ahmed, Thanks for reminding me: The moment when Qardawi's bodyguards took Wael Ghonim off the stage was deeply significant. It gave me a creepy foreboding feeling. Not enough attention was paid and not enough outrage was expressed by Egyptians.

To the Kats and Jasons - You are quick to advise others on the other side of the oceans. When referring to "people who live in glass houses" you should look in the mirror; beware that you don't start persecuting Mexicans from south of your own border (you are, by the way, occupying their lands).

America like all nations has done wrong things, but occupying Mexican lands isn't one of them. That's a crazy-pearl. If it's widely believed by Egyptians, then Egyptian opinions about Israeli-Arab land-occupation disagreements should be judged in that context.

In support of Anonymous's advice "beware that you don't start persecuting Mexicans from south of your own border (you are, by the way, occupying their lands)", my attention is drawn to Netanyahu Urges U.S. Return To 1845 Borders.

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