Former MMA champ Lyoto Machida is a black belt in karate. He employs a lot of karate in his striking....he lost the title at 205lbs when a Brazilian named Mauricio "Shogun" Rua knocked his ass out in less than one round....

you do know that lyoto himself is also brazilian?and that lyoto beat shogun aswell... they are 1-1.

it is lyoto his karate stance that makes him hard to hit. he leans back when kicking and striking.

you also forgetting that UFC rules.....i.e the gloves hinder Jiu Jitsu

It makes it harder to control your opponents wrists and ankles.....an harder to control the body..

The gloves also protect your hands........so you are more likely to throw more blows to the head without hurting yourself.

Watch some Vale Tudo videos if you want a more realistict street fight..--no gloves..hardly any rules..See how your karate does there

that is why you have bjj without kimono as well.... no gi bjjit is really not the gloves that hinder, they are grappling gloves you know??it is the fact that without a kimono certain moves are difficult to perform.

agreed about karate being useless in a mma fight. it is an martial ART... emphasis on ART.a lot of moves are really useless and even dumb to do in a fight.... same goes for kung fu, tkd is even worse....aikido whatever.... etc etc..mma is designed as a complete martial sport, fighting standing and ground fighting, pankration.....the old greeks were doing it already.and there is a reason that wrestlers and bjj guys perform well in mma.... it is effective!look at the average streetfight..... 90% of the time it ends on the ground.

and if you want real effectiveness in real life fighting there is krav maga.... but that is impossible to do in competion, because people will really get hurt... lol....

I was at my nephew's watching this UFC nonsense. A bunch of oily Brazilians and white trash humping each other. Garbage. I would pit my Black Belt in Kempo against one of these clowns any day of the week. One knife hand chop to the throat and the these Gracie characters are rendered helpless. There is no match for a traditional Karate master.

well, it may be because i am tired and not thinking very clearly, but i can not seem to find a post of yours in this thread explaining anyting... lol...if you are talking about another thread.... i almost have no time these days to spent on gb anymore man... so forgive me for not knowing what you are talking about...

well, it may be because i am tired and not thinking very clearly, but i can not seem to find a post of yours in this thread explaining anyting... lol...if you are talking about another thread.... i almost have no time these days to spent on gb anymore man... so forgive me for not knowing what you are talking about...

I'm sorry OptimusPrime1980, I didn't mean to blow up at you, I apologize.

I was at my nephew's watching this UFC nonsense. A bunch of oily Brazilians and white trash humping each other. Garbage. I would pit my Black Belt in Kempo against one of these clowns any day of the week. One knife hand chop to the throat and the these Gracie characters are rendered helpless. There is no match for a traditional Karate master.

dude your retarted, your fuckin 15 years of fairy tale kempo skills will go down to shit when u got a good wrestler pick your ass up and slam you on your ribs, MMA exposed traditional martial arts, plus to be a MMA fighter one has to be an athlete first abd foremost, if u u dont believe me, get in the CAGE, and youll see

I was at my nephew's watching this UFC nonsense. A bunch of oily Brazilians and white trash humping each other. Garbage. I would pit my Black Belt in Kempo against one of these clowns any day of the week. One knife hand chop to the throat and the these Gracie characters are rendered helpless. There is no match for a traditional Karate master.

This has already been settled in the cage you dumb ass. You can be a head-crushing kempo karate savage, but if you don't have take down defense or enough BJJ knowledge to defend submissions, you're going to get ground & pounded into unconsciousness or chocked out.

If you could only know one martial art and have no knowledge of the others, this is the order of effectiveness:

This has already been settled in the cage you dumb ass. You can be a head-crushing kempo karate savage, but if you don't have take down defense or enough BJJ knowledge to defend submissions, you're going to get ground & pounded into unconsciousness or chocked out.

If you could only know one martial art and have no knowledge of the others, this is the order of effectiveness:

1. BJJ2. Wrestling3. Muay Thai4. Karate5. Judo6. Boxing

very difficult to put together a top 6 like this.bjj is very effective once on the ground, but bjj guys really are not THAT great at getting a guy to the ground, an the fight starts standing. wrestlers are alot better at getting a guy to the ground.i would put boxing higher as well, and karate a lot lower.... it sucks....lol!but again , it depends the individual as well....

This has already been settled in the cage you dumb ass. You can be a head-crushing kempo karate savage, but if you don't have take down defense or enough BJJ knowledge to defend submissions, you're going to get ground & pounded into unconsciousness or chocked out.

If you could only know one martial art and have no knowledge of the others, this is the order of effectiveness:

1. BJJ2. Wrestling3. Muay Thai4. Karate5. Judo6. Boxing

For the sport of mma, this list makes sense. For true street survival self defense, your list is horrible.

For the sport of mma, this list makes sense. For true street survival self defense, your list is horrible.

Actually it's the other way around. For MMA, my list would be different, because most guys are well rounded enough to defend takedowns and avoid basic sub attempts. When it comes to MMA, wrestling is most important. It allows you to dictate where you want the fight to go. If you're fighting someone with a strong submission game, you can sprawl & brawl. If you're fighting a killer striker, you can take it to the ground and go from there.

In a street fight, you're not likely fighting someone with any kind of real skill. Rather than stand and throw punches with some idiot, I would rather close in and quickly choke the guy.

Actually it's the other way around. For MMA, my list would be different, because most guys are well rounded enough to defend takedowns and avoid basic sub attempts. When it comes to MMA, wrestling is most important. It allows you to dictate where you want the fight to go. If you're fighting someone with a strong submission game, you can sprawl & brawl. If you're fighting a killer striker, you can take it to the ground and go from there.

In a street fight, you're not likely fighting someone with any kind of real skill. Rather than stand and throw punches with some idiot, I would rather close in and quickly choke the guy.

"Closing in and quickly choking the guy" is easier said than done. And if I have a weapon or two in my possession (as I personally often do) you may come to regret bringing the fight into the range of close quarters.

I think ANY ground wrestling art that emphasizes staying on the ground is 2nd choice in a street setting — that’s just my personal opinion based on the fours years I spent working in prison. You need some ground (enough to enable you to get up!) but you also need something that works standing. I saw too many inmates (and a couple guards too) get bum-rushed in prison. Once the defender was on the ground they’d just swarm the guy on the ground and put the boots to him until we broke it up. – Bob Patterson

Back in the long-since-gone prison days I saw many groups of inmates who specifically tried to get their victim on the ground. Why? Because it was easier to put the boots to him! This even happened to one correctional officer who had boxed and who had also wrestled in college. He ended up with a separated shoulder and ruptured testicle. Granted, he did put one of the inmates in the hospital but were it not for other officers saving the day, he admitted that he was about done for. My point is that if you end up on the ground in a street setting you probably want to get back up and quick! Especially if there is more than one attacker. - B.P.

Standing up IS different than going to the ground in a street setting. Yes, you can get swarmed standing up. Yes, again that you can even get pinned against an obstacle or tied up in a standing clinch while others beat on you. This is all true. However, the one thing you can’t do on the ground is “stick-and-move”. Period.

"Closing in and quickly choking the guy" is easier said than done. And if I have a weapon or two in my possession (as I personally often do) you may come to regret bringing the fight into the range of close quarters.

I think ANY ground wrestling art that emphasizes staying on the ground is 2nd choice in a street setting — that’s just my personal opinion based on the fours years I spent working in prison. You need some ground (enough to enable you to get up!) but you also need something that works standing. I saw too many inmates (and a couple guards too) get bum-rushed in prison. Once the defender was on the ground they’d just swarm the guy on the ground and put the boots to him until we broke it up. – Bob Patterson

Back in the long-since-gone prison days I saw many groups of inmates who specifically tried to get their victim on the ground. Why? Because it was easier to put the boots to him! This even happened to one correctional officer who had boxed and who had also wrestled in college. He ended up with a separated shoulder and ruptured testicle. Granted, he did put one of the inmates in the hospital but were it not for other officers saving the day, he admitted that he was about done for. My point is that if you end up on the ground in a street setting you probably want to get back up and quick! Especially if there is more than one attacker. - B.P.

Standing up IS different than going to the ground in a street setting. Yes, you can get swarmed standing up. Yes, again that you can even get pinned against an obstacle or tied up in a standing clinch while others beat on you. This is all true. However, the one thing you can’t do on the ground is “stick-and-move”. Period.

Oh brother, now we're bringing weapons into the debate Closing in is very easy if you know what you're doing...very easy.