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Re: Webb Recovery Time and Long-Term Prospects

I just dont think that was really an issue with him. I dont remember hearing there was any setbacks and i highly doubt he wasnt pushing as hard as the staff wanted. I trust our medical staff to understand that to be an issue. If you think its going to help i think you could say it could just as easily be a reason for him to push too hard this time and have a setback, so i just dont really see it as advantage or disadvantage. I dont think its going to help his body heal faster and as far as rehabbing his knee, it basically comes down to strengthening the hamstring and quad which im going to assume the staff once again has a better understanding of how to do it than Webb or myself. I think theres a protocol to follow, and although he may have aced something and moved quickly past it before, doesnt mean this time he can just skip it as he may need that one more. I dont think if I went in to rehab my other knee that my program would be much different if at all. therefore i dont see it effecting the time table much at all.

Re: Webb Recovery Time and Long-Term Prospects

Stop bringing up Adrian Peterson as even HALFWAY relevant to this discussion. Just stop it. That dude is a freak of nature with wolverine blood, and his recovery is a huge exception, NOT the rule.

ACL's take 7-9 months to recover physically which is true of pretty much everyone. Nobody disputes that. But add another 6+ months on top of that for COMPLETE recovery, i.e. mental and emotional. When you've blown your knee out it takes a long time to get the confidence back in it, especially when you FEEL the knee creaking and straining (as scar tissue breaks up) for months and months after you're "technically" 100% physically. Just the pure reprogramming of the muscle memory takes a long, long time.

We don't really even know how long it took Webb to recover from the last one, frankly. He was terrible throughout all of 2010 mostly because he MENTALLY was not recovered, so he really got his confidence back somewhere between January 2011 and September 2011. He sustained the first ACL tear in December 2009, so you're talking about well over a year worth of recovery time.

Will it be shorter this time? Maybe, hopefully. But smart money IMO is on Webb never being 100% as a man-to-man cover corner in 2013. He will not have the recovery speed, cutting ability, and agility that were hallmarks of his game in the past. That is part of what makes a temporary move to FS a good idea... that would protect him from having to do too much cutting and running directly with receivers downfield. He would be able to use his instincts, awareness, and read-and-react skills to cover instead of being more reliant on raw athleticism.

I have been on the bandwagon of saying that Webb could be an All-Pro free safety since before he was even drafted by the Ravens. The reason is very simple: he has a prototypical safety skill-set (awareness, ability to play the ball in the air, sound tackling, instincts, etc.) All he lacks as a safety is size, which is irrelevant as he plays much bigger than his size.

He has a good cornerback skill-set as well, and because corners are more valuable than safeties he has proven that he should stay at CB long-term. But short-term, if the ACL would hold him back from playing CB at 100% in 2013, he should move to FS temporarily. That would also have the double benefit of allowing us to groom Ed Reed's long-term replacement for a year while we have a very capable fill-in for Webb's role in Corey Graham on the roster.

Re: Webb Recovery Time and Long-Term Prospects

Originally Posted by Sirdowski

I'm drawing a blank, it wasn't the same knee correct?

No, it wasn't same knee. I said that above

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“When I think of a Baltimore Raven - we go in there, we take your lunch box, we take your sandwich, we take your juice box, we take your applesauce, and we take your spork and we break it. And we leave you with an empty lunch. That’s the Baltimore Raven way.” - Steve Smith Sr.

Re: Webb Recovery Time and Long-Term Prospects

Well, get over it. You saw how good Chykie Brown and Corey Graham were, right? Guess what? They're both signed next year.

Chykie Brown has looked good at times, but I'm not sure he's earned my confidence yet. Hopefully he'll come on strong in his third year.

Even though we already have Webb, Smith, Graham, Brown, and Asa Jackson under contract for at least one more year, I'd feel better about that CB corps with Gorrer in it. Webb, Smith, and Jackson have all missed significant time in the last year (some of them for better reasons than others), so adding depth at CB seems really important. And considering our cap situation, we won't be able to sign any high-priced FAs. If Gorrer is still bouncing around the league, he seems like a nice solution.

Re: Webb Recovery Time and Long-Term Prospects

I see both sides. I just think what you have to think about is would you rather have struggle at CB or be better at safety as least starting out. Look at the patriots with mccourty(without the injury). He was considered there best corner and he moved to safety after they signed talib. He wasn't great but wasn't terrible. I think if the ravens moved him we would get a similar result because if we cannot keep reed Webb would be a suitable replacement. Not as good as reed but better than any draft pick or FA in my opinion. On the other hand I do not want to take graham out of the nickel where he excelled. Jimmy smith may be getting his confidence back, point is either way we have depth at corner and safety will be addressed in the draft at some point

Re: Webb Recovery Time and Long-Term Prospects

What we do and how we score in this year's draft may either accelerate Webb's transition to safety or put those thoughts on the back burner. Ozzie has said that the focus of the draft will be about improving the middle of the defense (i.e DTs, ILBs, safeties). If we get a solid safety in this year's draft we'll have the luxury of keeping Webb on the corner. I think Webb will be fine long term. He's been through this process before and knows the mental and physical demands of rehabbing this kind of injury.

Re: Webb Recovery Time and Long-Term Prospects

Originally Posted by Sascha

Chykie Brown has looked good at times, but I'm not sure he's earned my confidence yet. Hopefully he'll come on strong in his third year.

Even though we already have Webb, Smith, Graham, Brown, and Asa Jackson under contract for at least one more year, I'd feel better about that CB corps with Gorrer in it. Webb, Smith, and Jackson have all missed significant time in the last year (some of them for better reasons than others), so adding depth at CB seems really important. And considering our cap situation, we won't be able to sign any high-priced FAs. If Gorrer is still bouncing around the league, he seems like a nice solution.

My question, understanding where you are coming from, would be how much more Gorrer has shown you, compared to Chykie Brown?

"When questioned, the Elders explained that they were in search of magical powers. However, they're actually searching for the whereabouts of a certain ring. This ring is a legendary treasure that long ago was known to exist"

Re: Webb Recovery Time and Long-Term Prospects

Originally Posted by runrayrun27

Everyone needs to get rid of this Danny Gorrer boner. He was an average CB at best, so is Brown.

I wouldn't say all of that. They are both young CBs. Young players need time to develop. Chykie Brown played very well during the season. However, in the playoffs, his mistakes were magnified. If the Ravens make the playoffs in 2013, do you think he would make the same mistakes?

"When questioned, the Elders explained that they were in search of magical powers. However, they're actually searching for the whereabouts of a certain ring. This ring is a legendary treasure that long ago was known to exist"

Re: Webb Recovery Time and Long-Term Prospects

Stop bringing up Adrian Peterson as even HALFWAY relevant to this discussion. Just stop it. That dude is a freak of nature with wolverine blood, and his recovery is a huge exception, NOT the rule.

ACL's take 7-9 months to recover physically which is true of pretty much everyone. Nobody disputes that. But add another 6+ months on top of that for COMPLETE recovery, i.e. mental and emotional. When you've blown your knee out it takes a long time to get the confidence back in it, especially when you FEEL the knee creaking and straining (as scar tissue breaks up) for months and months after you're "technically" 100% physically. Just the pure reprogramming of the muscle memory takes a long, long time.

We don't really even know how long it took Webb to recover from the last one, frankly. He was terrible throughout all of 2010 mostly because he MENTALLY was not recovered, so he really got his confidence back somewhere between January 2011 and September 2011. He sustained the first ACL tear in December 2009, so you're talking about well over a year worth of recovery time.

Will it be shorter this time? Maybe, hopefully. But smart money IMO is on Webb never being 100% as a man-to-man cover corner in 2013. He will not have the recovery speed, cutting ability, and agility that were hallmarks of his game in the past. That is part of what makes a temporary move to FS a good idea... that would protect him from having to do too much cutting and running directly with receivers downfield. He would be able to use his instincts, awareness, and read-and-react skills to cover instead of being more reliant on raw athleticism.

I have been on the bandwagon of saying that Webb could be an All-Pro free safety since before he was even drafted by the Ravens. The reason is very simple: he has a prototypical safety skill-set (awareness, ability to play the ball in the air, sound tackling, instincts, etc.) All he lacks as a safety is size, which is irrelevant as he plays much bigger than his size.

He has a good cornerback skill-set as well, and because corners are more valuable than safeties he has proven that he should stay at CB long-term. But short-term, if the ACL would hold him back from playing CB at 100% in 2013, he should move to FS temporarily. That would also have the double benefit of allowing us to groom Ed Reed's long-term replacement for a year while we have a very capable fill-in for Webb's role in Corey Graham on the roster.

I agree with this statement. Webb blew out both knees in 3 years, he just might have bad knees. He blew both knees out on plays that you wouldn't think would cause a knee injury. He may be the highest paid corner and best, but it doesnt matter if you aren't on the feild. I think they move him to S. He would make a great S with his instincts and is a good tackler. Plus, in the NFL you do not need large thumper Safeties since they changed the hitting rules. I just feel more comfortable with him at S with his injury history.

Re: Webb Recovery Time and Long-Term Prospects

6 games played, 11 tackles, 1 INT. Yeah, we sure miss him. Good god. It never ceases to amaze me how some ppl fall in love with guys at the end of the roster. There are probably 10 CB's in the draft that we could get from Rounds 5-7 that are just as good or better than Gorrer. Shoot, they can probably get someone just as good as him as a UFA, since they got him as a UFA. Smh.....

As for moving Webb to safety. Stop! Just stop. First, this is his second ACL, so he'll have a better idea of what he can and can't do in his recovery. He also has two extra months to recover as opposed to last time. He's the best CB on the team. If you move him to safety you do it at the expense of weakening the CB position. Cary Williams is gone, so if you move Webb, your starting CB's are Jimmy Smith and Chykie Brown. Um....no. You find a safety to replace Reed, and you roll with Smith and Webb as your starters, with Pollard and Reed's replacement at S.

Never get in a fight with a pig; you both get muddy, and the pig likes it...