If this is your first visit, be sure to
check out the FAQ by clicking the
link above. You may have to register
before you can post: click the register link above to proceed. To start viewing messages,
select the forum that you want to visit from the selection below.

Hi Unregistered,
We'll be undergoing major forum changes in the very near future. Be sure to check out the details here

i find the combination of x and y chromosomes and norse mythology to be slightly strange. i like the norse mythology idea and i'm guessing the other memeber of the trio will be a green dragon/wyvern like pokemon, but how does that involve chromosomes?

i find the combination of x and y chromosomes and norse mythology to be slightly strange. i like the norse mythology idea and i'm guessing the other memeber of the trio will be a green dragon/wyvern like pokemon, but how does that involve chromosomes?

Presumably they'd use Z since not only does that keep the axis double meaning, it's also a chromosome (though not used by humans). Another plus to it is that Z can only be represented by few animals in shape so a serpent/dragon would be perfect in that regard.

i find the combination of x and y chromosomes and norse mythology to be slightly strange. i like the norse mythology idea and i'm guessing the other memeber of the trio will be a green dragon/wyvern like pokemon, but how does that involve chromosomes?

It's almost as if all of this is 100% speculation with no confirmed, official basis. Well-founded speculation in some parts, maybe, but speculation just the same.

-----
Never underestimate the power of stupidity, of the one and of the many.Words to|live by

The four stags of Midgard. The gems in Xerneas' antlers are the exact same colors of the gems that are in the antlers of the stags. Xerneas also has the antlers of the stags themselves

You show me where in the Eddas it mentions the four stags having a) gemstones in their antlers or b) color in their antlers at all, and I'll buy it. To the best of my recollection, they were only ever mentioned (briefly, mind you) as the four stags that represented the four cardinal directions.

Originally Posted by Seraphina

Personally I think the Yggdrasil Norse mythology theory was really concise and very well thought of. I hope it is true.

Concise, yes. Well thought out? No, not at all. I assume we're both thinking of the same "Well, Xerneas is a stag, the Yggdrasil myth has stags. Yvetal is a bird and the Yggdrasil myth has an eagle. Also Xerneas is shown in front of a tree, ergo Yggdrasil." Yeah, that's about it for the Yggdrasil theory. Personally, I'm looking more toward the lesser known Celtic mythos here, which seems far more likely. My theory (which I've posted here once or twice before) is as follows:

The basis of the theory is thus: This game's legendaries will not be based on Norse mythology, rather, it will have it's roots in the Celtic tradition.

In a purely geographic sense, this has some merit to it. We can be reasonably sure that at least part of this game will be based off places in France. The Versailles-looking palace in the trailer, along with the Eiffel Tower and the desert observatory all lend themselves to this. Well, historically, the French were a Celtic people before they were Gallic, and their ancient pagan belief system ran parallel to the the many other Celtic groups dotted around Europe. Taken only on that, France has a much closer tie to Celtic mythos than to Norse. The only contact ancient people in France would have had with the likes of the Yggdrasil myth was when Norse raiders swept down from the north to raid the French coast.

Moving on: Xerneas. One of the most prominent Celtic deities is [http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cernunnous]Cernunnous[/url], though depending on the tradition, he goes by different names. Sometimes he's Herne the Hunter, the Horned Lord, Dagda, the Green Man, etc. Regardless, every depiction of him portrays him as having a rack of antlers like a stag coming from his head. He is widely believed to have been a god of the forest and natural places, along with being a male fertility icon. Look at his name, or at least the name widely attributed to Him. Cernunnous. Say it aloud (scholars generally agree it is pronounced Cerno-on-os, with a few similar variants from region to region). Now say Xerneas. Sounds rather similar, no?

Now get this. The only way we know about Cernunnous name is because it is inscribed on an ancient column erected by the Romans, depicting many deities, both those of the Romans and the native Celtic tribes. This column is known as the Pillar of the Boatmen. This pillar was found in France, in an area that is now a part of Paris itself. Maybe it's all just a coincidence, but I think it's all a little too convenient. The game has obvious European roots, and the Horned God is a common icon (arguably the MOST common) for ancient European paganism. Then there's the similarities with the name... It all seems like a far more concrete argument than Xerneas being one of the four stags that eat the leaves of Yggdrasil.

If this is the case, I'd hazard a guess that Xerneas is a grass type, or a psychic type. Come what may though, it'll have a strong connection to the forest.

So, let's move on to Yvetal, shall we? Remember earlier, how I said one of the names for Cernunnous was Dagda? Dagda is essentially the Irish incarnation of the Horned Lord. One of his counterparts (some sources say occasionally his consort) is a goddess called the Morrigan. The Morrigan is representative of a lot of things, crows, death, and war among them, and with a loose connection to female fertility by way of Macha. All of that seems to point as a direct counterpoint to everything Dagda/Horned Lord represents in the same way Kyogre and Groudon do, or Lugia and Ho-oh, or basically any box legend you care to name. Yvetal appears to be some kind of carrion bird, like a condor or a vulture. The Morrigan often appears as a crow, or surrounded by crows or ravens. Corvids are her calling card.

Alternatively, Yvetal could be Badb Catha, who is incredibly similar and just a twisting of the belief system in a different region. Oftentimes the Badb is portrayed as one of the Morrigan's aspects.

So there you have it, a bit of a glimpse at Celtic deities, and how they could relate to what little we know about these legendaries. Personally, I think there's a lot more evidence to shore this theory up than the Yggdrasil one. I won't claim any of this as gospel truth until we know a little bit more about Xerneas and Yvetal and their mythos in the game, but I think this is definitely something worth considering.

Okay, so it's not as concise as the Yggdrasil theory, but it's at least as compelling, and the arguments fit together much better.

You show me where in the Eddas it mentions the four stags having a) gemstones in their antlers or b) color in their antlers at all, and I'll buy it. To the best of my recollection, they were only ever mentioned (briefly, mind you) as the four stags that represented the four cardinal directions.

Concise, yes. Well thought out? No, not at all. I assume we're both thinking of the same "Well, Xerneas is a stag, the Yggdrasil myth has stags. Yvetal is a bird and the Yggdrasil myth has an eagle. Also Xerneas is shown in front of a tree, ergo Yggdrasil." Yeah, that's about it for the Yggdrasil theory. Personally, I'm looking more toward the lesser known Celtic mythos here, which seems far more likely. My theory (which I've posted here once or twice before) is as follows:

The basis of the theory is thus: This game's legendaries will not be based on Norse mythology, rather, it will have it's roots in the Celtic tradition.

In a purely geographic sense, this has some merit to it. We can be reasonably sure that at least part of this game will be based off places in France. The Versailles-looking palace in the trailer, along with the Eiffel Tower and the desert observatory all lend themselves to this. Well, historically, the French were a Celtic people before they were Gallic, and their ancient pagan belief system ran parallel to the the many other Celtic groups dotted around Europe. Taken only on that, France has a much closer tie to Celtic mythos than to Norse. The only contact ancient people in France would have had with the likes of the Yggdrasil myth was when Norse raiders swept down from the north to raid the French coast.

Moving on: Xerneas. One of the most prominent Celtic deities is [http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cernunnous]Cernunnous[/url], though depending on the tradition, he goes by different names. Sometimes he's Herne the Hunter, the Horned Lord, Dagda, the Green Man, etc. Regardless, every depiction of him portrays him as having a rack of antlers like a stag coming from his head. He is widely believed to have been a god of the forest and natural places, along with being a male fertility icon. Look at his name, or at least the name widely attributed to Him. Cernunnous. Say it aloud (scholars generally agree it is pronounced Cerno-on-os, with a few similar variants from region to region). Now say Xerneas. Sounds rather similar, no?

Now get this. The only way we know about Cernunnous name is because it is inscribed on an ancient column erected by the Romans, depicting many deities, both those of the Romans and the native Celtic tribes. This column is known as the Pillar of the Boatmen. This pillar was found in France, in an area that is now a part of Paris itself. Maybe it's all just a coincidence, but I think it's all a little too convenient. The game has obvious European roots, and the Horned God is a common icon (arguably the MOST common) for ancient European paganism. Then there's the similarities with the name... It all seems like a far more concrete argument than Xerneas being one of the four stags that eat the leaves of Yggdrasil.

If this is the case, I'd hazard a guess that Xerneas is a grass type, or a psychic type. Come what may though, it'll have a strong connection to the forest.

So, let's move on to Yvetal, shall we? Remember earlier, how I said one of the names for Cernunnous was Dagda? Dagda is essentially the Irish incarnation of the Horned Lord. One of his counterparts (some sources say occasionally his consort) is a goddess called the Morrigan. The Morrigan is representative of a lot of things, crows, death, and war among them, and with a loose connection to female fertility by way of Macha. All of that seems to point as a direct counterpoint to everything Dagda/Horned Lord represents in the same way Kyogre and Groudon do, or Lugia and Ho-oh, or basically any box legend you care to name. Yvetal appears to be some kind of carrion bird, like a condor or a vulture. The Morrigan often appears as a crow, or surrounded by crows or ravens. Corvids are her calling card.

Alternatively, Yvetal could be Badb Catha, who is incredibly similar and just a twisting of the belief system in a different region. Oftentimes the Badb is portrayed as one of the Morrigan's aspects.

So there you have it, a bit of a glimpse at Celtic deities, and how they could relate to what little we know about these legendaries. Personally, I think there's a lot more evidence to shore this theory up than the Yggdrasil one. I won't claim any of this as gospel truth until we know a little bit more about Xerneas and Yvetal and their mythos in the game, but I think this is definitely something worth considering.

Okay, so it's not as concise as the Yggdrasil theory, but it's at least as compelling, and the arguments fit together much better.

I have said it once and I will say it again, I really like your theory! It seems well researched and I am really hoping this is the actual basis for Xerneas and Yveltal. It may not get as popular as the Norse Mythology theory ( you know how they are), but it makes a lot of sense.

What most people are saying is that it is based on Norse mythology with the deer, the eagle, and the....serpent? Most people think there will be pokemon z. I think that too. But you never know. They did suprise us with black 2 and white 2. That could of been just because there were major plot points left out in black and white, or it could be the new norm. (Norm is a word. Look it up.) But I think that it possibly may be based more on DNA then Norse mythology. With the mewtwo form, that may be likely. I hope that the make something cool with deoxys.
Deoxys was sorta based on DNA, so...yeah. It would be cool to see like the new evil team finds team rocket's research and they try to do some sort of experiment to take over the world but it goes wrong and there is like..5 different forms of mew/mewtwo that you would have to beat and not catch until you were done with the main story. That would be cool. To me at least it sounds cool.

You show me where in the Eddas it mentions the four stags having a) gemstones in their antlers or b) color in their antlers at all, and I'll buy it. To the best of my recollection, they were only ever mentioned (briefly, mind you) as the four stags that represented the four cardinal directions.

Concise, yes. Well thought out? No, not at all. I assume we're both thinking of the same "Well, Xerneas is a stag, the Yggdrasil myth has stags. Yvetal is a bird and the Yggdrasil myth has an eagle. Also Xerneas is shown in front of a tree, ergo Yggdrasil." Yeah, that's about it for the Yggdrasil theory. Personally, I'm looking more toward the lesser known Celtic mythos here, which seems far more likely. My theory (which I've posted here once or twice before) is as follows:

The basis of the theory is thus: This game's legendaries will not be based on Norse mythology, rather, it will have it's roots in the Celtic tradition.

In a purely geographic sense, this has some merit to it. We can be reasonably sure that at least part of this game will be based off places in France. The Versailles-looking palace in the trailer, along with the Eiffel Tower and the desert observatory all lend themselves to this. Well, historically, the French were a Celtic people before they were Gallic, and their ancient pagan belief system ran parallel to the the many other Celtic groups dotted around Europe. Taken only on that, France has a much closer tie to Celtic mythos than to Norse. The only contact ancient people in France would have had with the likes of the Yggdrasil myth was when Norse raiders swept down from the north to raid the French coast.

Moving on: Xerneas. One of the most prominent Celtic deities is [http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cernunnous]Cernunnous[/url], though depending on the tradition, he goes by different names. Sometimes he's Herne the Hunter, the Horned Lord, Dagda, the Green Man, etc. Regardless, every depiction of him portrays him as having a rack of antlers like a stag coming from his head. He is widely believed to have been a god of the forest and natural places, along with being a male fertility icon. Look at his name, or at least the name widely attributed to Him. Cernunnous. Say it aloud (scholars generally agree it is pronounced Cerno-on-os, with a few similar variants from region to region). Now say Xerneas. Sounds rather similar, no?

Now get this. The only way we know about Cernunnous name is because it is inscribed on an ancient column erected by the Romans, depicting many deities, both those of the Romans and the native Celtic tribes. This column is known as the Pillar of the Boatmen. This pillar was found in France, in an area that is now a part of Paris itself. Maybe it's all just a coincidence, but I think it's all a little too convenient. The game has obvious European roots, and the Horned God is a common icon (arguably the MOST common) for ancient European paganism. Then there's the similarities with the name... It all seems like a far more concrete argument than Xerneas being one of the four stags that eat the leaves of Yggdrasil.

If this is the case, I'd hazard a guess that Xerneas is a grass type, or a psychic type. Come what may though, it'll have a strong connection to the forest.

So, let's move on to Yvetal, shall we? Remember earlier, how I said one of the names for Cernunnous was Dagda? Dagda is essentially the Irish incarnation of the Horned Lord. One of his counterparts (some sources say occasionally his consort) is a goddess called the Morrigan. The Morrigan is representative of a lot of things, crows, death, and war among them, and with a loose connection to female fertility by way of Macha. All of that seems to point as a direct counterpoint to everything Dagda/Horned Lord represents in the same way Kyogre and Groudon do, or Lugia and Ho-oh, or basically any box legend you care to name. Yvetal appears to be some kind of carrion bird, like a condor or a vulture. The Morrigan often appears as a crow, or surrounded by crows or ravens. Corvids are her calling card.

Alternatively, Yvetal could be Badb Catha, who is incredibly similar and just a twisting of the belief system in a different region. Oftentimes the Badb is portrayed as one of the Morrigan's aspects.

So there you have it, a bit of a glimpse at Celtic deities, and how they could relate to what little we know about these legendaries. Personally, I think there's a lot more evidence to shore this theory up than the Yggdrasil one. I won't claim any of this as gospel truth until we know a little bit more about Xerneas and Yvetal and their mythos in the game, but I think this is definitely something worth considering.

Okay, so it's not as concise as the Yggdrasil theory, but it's at least as compelling, and the arguments fit together much better.

Wow, that is awesome! Honestly, both theories are really great. I loved reading this.

I'd like to have those DNA related legendaries, Genesect/Deoxys be available to catch in the game. Maybe not Mewtwo... Got too many already =p
But somehow I think only special Mewtwo that can change form, like event Shaymin.

I'd like to have those DNA related legendaries, Genesect/Deoxys be available to catch in the game. Maybe not Mewtwo... Got too many already =p
But somehow I think only special Mewtwo that can change form, like event Shaymin.

yeah... if x and y are to do with chromosomes, then i want to see pokemon to do with DNA. deoxys, genesect and i'm guessing by the new form for it mewtwo will be available.

I'd like to have those DNA related legendaries, Genesect/Deoxys be available to catch in the game. Maybe not Mewtwo... Got too many already =p
But somehow I think only special Mewtwo that can change form, like event Shaymin.

That's weird, considering how Mewtwo, Deoxys and Genesect came from odd gens. ;P. But I think Mewtwo's a yes, as out of the three he's the only one who was never an event-exclusive.
And BTW, any Shaymin can switch formes-you just need an event Shaymin to get the forme-changing item.

Anyway, I'd like Xerneas to be a Special Sweeper, with Yvetal being either a Phys Tank or Phys Sweeper.

That's weird, considering how Mewtwo, Deoxys and Genesect came from odd gens. ;P. But I think Mewtwo's a yes, as out of the three he's the only one who was never an event-exclusive.
And BTW, any Shaymin can switch formes-you just need an event Shaymin to get the forme-changing item.

Anyway, I'd like Xerneas to be a Special Sweeper, with Yvetal being either a Phys Tank or Phys Sweeper.

Xerneas being a special sweeper seems likely, but a non-metallic bird like Yveltal probably won't be a tank...

Spoiler:- Credits::

...to Eeveelover824 for the Dragon TPC button, Shadow♠ for the Ghost Type Club button, and Brutaka for the Fire Type Club button.