choad wrote:

whosasailorthen wrote:

I wonder how many of you will listen to this whole thing. Hmm.

Wasn't the intro creepy enough?

I watched the intro, and the first few minutes of the speech by the bought and paid for, tap dancing uncle tom. The uncle tom has made the decision to get his and screw everybody else, a decision made by many White politicians as well. His melanin isn't going to convince many people that he's not just another self-serving tool of the 1%.

whosasailorthen wrote:

I wonder. Is it possible for a black man or woman to be a non-Democrat in America and not be called an 'Uncle Tom'? Or is any diversion from the expected path against the rules?

There are any number of fucked up problems in the kneegrow community. Nobody from the outside will solve these problems. Theyíll have to do it for themselves, and use whatever help they can get from the Democratic Party, third political parties, churches, and anybody else who is willing to help. This outside help will only be a tiny part of the solution. But like the Gay Community, the kneegrows have already figured out that the Republican Party isnít a friend of theirs.

fnord wrote:

But like the Gay Community, the kneegrows have already figured out that the Republican Party isnít a friend of theirs.

Well, I'm not sure the Democrats are their friends either. After all, it is to the Democrat's advantage to keep the black-vs-white thing going and to maintain a black population who are seen as 'underprivileged' for as long as possible so that they can continue to gain re-election through being seen as the 'black man's savior'.

And the Democrats have gained favor with the blacks by bringing them things like the welfare program, which virtually insures that they stay 'unsaved' for a long, long time.

Welfare has not helped a damn thing... it has only resulted in generations of blacks (and whites, too, BTW) who don't know how to get up and to go to a job every morning, in father-less families where a husband would be nothing more than an added expense and not a valued family leader, in mothers having as many children as possible so that they can collect the maximum benefit, and in mothers not being able to work and advance themselves because they are saddled with raising children, making ends meet and chasing welfare and other public benefit paperwork. Not to mention the crime and depressed neighborhoods which result from all of the above. Welfare has become a virtual drain vortex into which generations have been sucked down, and for which escaping is almost hopeless. But thankfully, due to welfare, the Democrats will have the blacks looking to them for 'saving' for many generations to come. And that's really the point, isn't it?

Welfare does have many drawbacks, and thanks to Whosa for pointing out a few of them. The main problem is that when the various welfare programs were first implemented 'conservatives' demanded that they include punitive measures and onerous hoop-jumps to guarantee that only those with no sense of personal dignity would apply. These same intellectual giants are still surprised to this day that many people on welfare display no sense of personal dignity whatsoever.

Tall Paul wrote:

Welfare does have many drawbacks, and thanks to Whosa for pointing out a few of them. The main problem is that when the various welfare programs were first implemented 'conservatives' demanded that they include punitive measures and onerous hoop-jumps to guarantee that only those with no sense of personal dignity would apply. These same intellectual giants are still surprised to this day that many people on welfare display no sense of personal dignity whatsoever.

Help me understand. You're saying that conservatives are the source of the ills of the welfare state?

whosasailorthen wrote:

Tall Paul wrote:

Welfare does have many drawbacks, and thanks to Whosa for pointing out a few of them. The main problem is that when the various welfare programs were first implemented 'conservatives' demanded that they include punitive measures and onerous hoop-jumps to guarantee that only those with no sense of personal dignity would apply. These same intellectual giants are still surprised to this day that many people on welfare display no sense of personal dignity whatsoever.

Help me understand. You're saying that conservatives are the source of the ills of the welfare state?

OK. Yeah.

Welfare is practiced in many parts of the world without creating the social undertow it seems to in the States. When I was a young rapscallion I went on welfare here in B.C. 2 or 3 times, between jobs, to keep myself alive. The welfare officers back then treated people well. In consequence, I didn't scam, I only stayed on as long as I needed to, and I was grateful for the assistance. When I moved to Toronto (never move to Toronto) I worked construction until I got laid off, and after a few months of looking for work in the middle of a recession, I was forced back into the welfare office. As opposed to B.C., the welfare rules in Ontario were conservative and distinctly punitive. Since it was such a demeaning hassle for such a small amount of assistance I lied, cheated, and bilked the system for everything I could. Therein lies the difference - if you treat people like children and criminals, they will quickly become children and criminals. If you treat people with respect, and leave their dignity intact, they are much more likely to respect the system. Welfare is a wonderful thing, it is the state doing what a state should do - taking care of its citizens when they need a hand - but in the hands of conservatives it becomes just another way to beat people down and keep them poor, resentful and hopeless.

WilberCuntLicker wrote:

whosasailorthen wrote:

Tall Paul wrote:

Welfare does have many drawbacks, and thanks to Whosa for pointing out a few of them. The main problem is that when the various welfare programs were first implemented 'conservatives' demanded that they include punitive measures and onerous hoop-jumps to guarantee that only those with no sense of personal dignity would apply. These same intellectual giants are still surprised to this day that many people on welfare display no sense of personal dignity whatsoever.

Help me understand. You're saying that conservatives are the source of the ills of the welfare state?

OK. Yeah.

Welfare is practiced in many parts of the world without creating the social undertow it seems to in the States. When I was a young rapscallion I went on welfare here in B.C. 2 or 3 times, between jobs, to myself alive. The welfare officers back then treated people well. In consequence, I didn't scam, I only stayed on as long as I needed to, and I was grateful for the assistance. When I moved to Toronto (never move to Toronto) I worked construction until I got laid off, and after a few months of looking for work in the middle of a recession, I was forced back into the welfare office. As opposed to B.C., the welfare rules in Ontario were conservative and distinctly punitive. Since it was such a demeaning hassle for such a small amount of assistance I lied, cheated, and bilked the system for everything I could. Therein lies the difference - if you treat people like children and criminals, they will quickly become children and criminals. If you treat people with respect, and leave their dignity intact, they are much more likely to respect the system. Welfare is a wonderful thing, it is the state doing what a state should do - taking care of its citizens when they need a hand - but in the hands of conservatives it becomes just another way to beat people down and keep them poor, resentful and hopeless.

Thanks Wilber. I don't think most conservatives want to create poor, resentful and hopeless people, it's just that many who claim to be conservative make money that way.

whosasailorthen wrote:

And the Democrats have gained favor with the blacks by bringing them things like the welfare program, which virtually insures that they stay 'unsaved' for a long, long time.

Welfare has not helped a damn thing... it has only resulted in generations of blacks (and whites, too, BTW) who don't know how to get up and to go to a job every morning, in father-less families where a husband would be nothing more than an added expense and not a valued family leader, in mothers having as many children as possible so that they can collect the maximum benefit, and in mothers not being able to work and advance themselves because they are saddled with raising children, making ends meet and chasing welfare and other public benefit paperwork. Not to mention the crime and depressed neighborhoods which result from all of the above. Welfare has become a virtual drain vortex into which generations have been sucked down, and for which escaping is almost hopeless. But thankfully, due to welfare, the Democrats will have the blacks looking to them for 'saving' for many generations to come. And that's really the point, isn't it?