Ranwolfwrote:
I am really tried of people trying to claim the old mentally disabled sympathy card. She committed a serious crime , a crime that anyone else would have ended up doing real time for. The law applies equally to all or to none at all, you can't make exceptions regardless of what the conditions surrounding the crime are. If you do so then Justice is not blind and in fact has 20/20 vision.

Er, making the punishment fit the crime is the entire point of justice in the first place and the legal system is specifically built on motive. Canada also leans towards rehabilitation instead of punishment. Its pointless to just punish someone who is this mentally disturbed. It doesn't help anyone or solve anything save satisfy a few people's base need for vengeance. We always make exceptions based on the conditions surrounding a crime. That's why sentencing guidelines are guidelines. So the judge can weigh motive, conditions, remorse, etc.

If we only punish someone that is mentally disturbed, we're just fucking them up even more for when they are eventually released back into the general public and then what? We've made things worse. She clearly has some serious shit going on if she's going knifey stabby at 14, but she did not even inflict any serious injuries. So she's looking at aggravated assault charges which means she isn't going away for life she'll be back out in the public some day.

So she needs to be sentenced someplace with psychiatric care. If not for her sake based on our empathy, then for our sake based on pragmatism.

14 year olds don't tend to just snap by themselves either. I am quite willing to bet her parents and/or her peers are going to end up being partially responsible for this as the full story comes to light.

Er, making the punishment fit the crime is the entire point of justice in the first place and the legal system is specifically built on motive. Canada also leans towards rehabilitation instead of punishment. Its pointless to just punish someone who is this mentally disturbed. It doesn't help anyone or solve anything save satisfy a few people's base need for vengeance. We always make exceptions based on the conditions surrounding a crime. That's why sentencing guidelines are guidelines. So the judge can weigh motive, conditions, remorse, etc.

If we only punish someone that is mentally disturbed, we're just fucking them up even more for when they are eventually released back into the general public and then what? We've made things worse. She clearly has some serious shit going on if she's going knifey stabby at 14, but she did not even inflict any serious injuries. So she's looking at aggravated assault charges which means she isn't going away for life she'll be back out in the public some day.

So she needs to be sentenced someplace with psychiatric care. If not for her sake based on our empathy, then for our sake based on pragmatism.

14 year olds don't tend to just snap by themselves either. I am quite willing to bet her parents and/or her peers are going to end up being partially responsible for this as the full story comes to light.

Mate the only and only reason this isn't at least second or third degree murder charges she'd be facing is because some one was crazy enough and ballsy enough to tackle a knife wielding psychopath who clearly showed she had no problem putting those knives to bloody use.

Regardless of whatever factors she had been facing she made the choice and I repeat choice to inflict harm and quite possibly death upon the people around her. She acquired weapons , and at least somewhat calmly went to school armed with them and then proceeded to attempt to carry whatever messed up plan was in her head.

Furthermore no one and I repeat no one is responsible for your actions but you. There is no such thing as somebody physically forcing you to do anything as a reaction to something they may have said or done to you.

Ranwolfwrote:
Mate the only and only reason this isn't at least second or third degree murder charges she'd be facing is because some one was crazy enough and ballsy enough to tackle a knife wielding psychopath who clearly showed she had no problem putting those knives to bloody use.

And? We don't charge people for possibilities. We charge them for actions. She only managed to inflict lacerations, not stab wounds. So I'm guessing she was just swinging wildly. So thats aggravated assault. Even at the absolute maximum possible sentence for all 9 counts she will be released from prison some day.

Ranwolfwrote:
Regardless of whatever factors she had been facing she made the choice and I repeat choice to inflict harm and quite possibly death upon the people around her. She acquired weapons , and at least somewhat calmly went to school armed with them and then proceeded to attempt to carry whatever messed up plan was in her head.

Furthermore no one and I repeat no one is responsible for your actions but you. There is no such thing as somebody physically forcing you to do anything as a reaction to something they may have said or done to you.

I am not arguing she should not be charged or face consequences for her actions, I am arguing that she needs treatment because her actions clearly aren't those of a emotionally and mentally stable individual. Simply sentencing her like a normal criminal would serve no purpose and actually make matters worse in the long run. Both for her and for society.

Poor miserable soul. She's made a mistake that will affect her entire life.

Meh, you reap what you sow. She's old enough to know what the consequences of her actions are. Old enough to understand the difference between life and death. I rather hope she is tried as an adult. You have to make examples when stuff like this happens.

This is probably going to be one of those very rare instances where I have to wonder if I'm O.K. Because, I find myself... agreeing with you on this.

I am so sick of reading about shit like this. Seriously, do kids not have anything better to do now? Fucking christ.

My peers thought it was funny to endlessly try to convince me to kill myself, among many other types of physical and emotional abuse - and while I won't say the thought never crossed my mind, when I was in school, to bring a weapon and teach some bullies a lesson - these kids don't even target someone like that. They just randomly start hurting people?

This is just retarded. Any attempt at justification is retarded too. It used to piss me off when I was a kid, to hear people say things about how each generation is getting dumber, and has more and more mental problems than the last - but now that I'm older and I get to watch the NEXT generation try to kill each other at the drop of a hat I'm inclined to believe there's something to those sayings. No, I don't actually believe it, because I know some extremely smart young'ins, smarter than me anyway - but I can't even comprehend shit like this.

The problem isn't that weapons are available, that was never the problem.

Mate the only and only reason this isn't at least second or third degree murder charges she'd be facing is because some one was crazy enough and ballsy enough to tackle a knife wielding psychopath who clearly showed she had no problem putting those knives to bloody use.

Regardless of whatever factors she had been facing she made the choice and I repeat choice to inflict harm and quite possibly death upon the people around her. She acquired weapons , and at least somewhat calmly went to school armed with them and then proceeded to attempt to carry whatever messed up plan was in her head.

Furthermore no one and I repeat no one is responsible for your actions but you. There is no such thing as somebody physically forcing you to do anything as a reaction to something they may have said or done to you.

Actually, the reason she isn't being charged with murder is because she didn't kill anyone. It wouldn't make sense to charge her for a crime that didn't happen.

As for your belief that the law is one-size-fits-all, it's not. It's true that the law shouldn't give people unfair advantages (by that I mean giving someone a lighter sentence just because of their skin, wealth, religion, etc.). However, that doesn't mean that everyone should receive the same punishment for different circumstances. Otherwise, there would be no need for courts. It's the court's primary job to determine appropriate punishments based on the circumstances.

For example, let's say you were at a party and you were attacked by one of the guests who has a knife. You two fought fiercely and you ended up stabbing the guy to death. There are a number of different ways this could go depending on the specific details. If you were desperate to save your life and there was no way to stop the assailant other than by grabbing a knife in the kitchen and hitting back, which just happened to kill him, then you would probably be changed with some degree of manslaughter and receive a very light sentence. Some courts might even decide not to punish you at all since it was self defense. Now let's change that scenario a tiny bit. Instead of using the knife as a last resort, you successfully manage to beat the attacker and make them drop their knife. Then you proceed to pick up their knife and stab them to death after they've already been disarmed and doesn't have the strength to continue fighting. If that's what happened, you'd likely be charged with murder and receive a harsh punishment. You see how the circumstances of the crime can influence the punishment?

In regards to the 14 year old girl in this story, it looks like she's being charged for a lot of counts of assault. Her punishment should reflect both her actions and the circumstances behind them. It appears that she was being bullied in school and was suicidal. Her state of mind should be taken into consideration when determining how harsh her punishment will be. That's the way the justice system works. It's why the courts use psychiatrists to determine how mentally competent someone was when they committed a crime. Someone who is mentally handicapped isn't going to receive the same punishment as someone who understands the law perfectly but still decides to commit the crime.

Yeah girls love knifes and boys love guns -__- atleast when its talked about thats more or less many feel about it dunno if its that true?

So all the attackers was young and from where or in what group was this a planned attack with multiple people?

VeggyZwrote: I am so sick of reading about shit like this. Seriously, do kids not have anything better to do now? Fucking christ.

My peers thought it was funny to endlessly try to convince me to kill myself.
and to bring a weapon to teach some bullies a lesson - these kids don't even target someone like that. They just randomly start hurting people?

something better to do, and do you say many kids are like this? -__-
Depression may come more along the future, some because they don't know what to value or take care of (like before there was more threats to be AWARE of like cold, food, housing, knowing etc) as well with relationship's.
These kids maybe not have had the things to make them value life, and there could be much behind it as well, as we should know children could have had more problems then many adults as well... in how being treated, forced, abused, used in many ways etc.

Ranwolfwrote:
Mate the only and only reason this isn't at least second or third degree murder charges she'd be facing is because some one was crazy enough and ballsy enough to tackle a knife wielding psychopath who clearly showed she had no problem putting those knives to bloody use.

And? We don't charge people for possibilities. We charge them for actions. She only managed to inflict lacerations, not stab wounds. So I'm guessing she was just swinging wildly. So thats aggravated assault. Even at the absolute maximum possible sentence for all 9 counts she will be released from prison some day.

Ranwolfwrote:
Regardless of whatever factors she had been facing she made the choice and I repeat choice to inflict harm and quite possibly death upon the people around her. She acquired weapons , and at least somewhat calmly went to school armed with them and then proceeded to attempt to carry whatever messed up plan was in her head.

Furthermore no one and I repeat no one is responsible for your actions but you. There is no such thing as somebody physically forcing you to do anything as a reaction to something they may have said or done to you.

I am not arguing she should not be charged or face consequences for her actions, I am arguing that she needs treatment because her actions clearly aren't those of a emotionally and mentally stable individual. Simply sentencing her like a normal criminal would serve no purpose and actually make matters worse in the long run. Both for her and for society.

Exactly. Thank you for explaining this when I was having trouble finding the right words.

Freddy96NOwrote:
Yeah girls love knifes and boys love guns -__- atleast when its talked about thats more or less many feel about it dunno if its that true?

This occurred in Canada, much more difficult for a 14 year old to get their paws on a firearm. She only had two steak knives and didn't even manage to do much damage with them. No serious injuries. She cut 9 people, only 4 of whom needed to go to hospital for stitches and what not. Others were treated on site.

It sounds more like she just went over the edge and flailed wildly then had any sort of mass murder plan.

runecwrote: This occurred in Canada, much more difficult for a 14 year old to get their paws on a firearm. She only had two steak knives and didn't even manage to do much damage with them. No serious injuries. She cut 9 people, only 4 of whom needed to go to hospital for stitches and what not. Others were treated on site.

It sounds more like she just went over the edge and flailed wildly then had any sort of mass murder plan.

okey so in some way she was desperate for doing it? (need more info about her) and no fire arms isn't that hard but could be hard for her to manage or get/sneak in still could be possible as others have done it for years..
You never know how far kids go -__-

Freddy96NOwrote:
okey so in some way she was desperate for doing it? (need more info about her) and no fire arms isn't that hard but could be hard for her to manage or get/sneak in still could be possible as others have done it for years..
You never know how far kids go -__-

She definitely went over the edge over something. I'm going to assume a pattern of bullying or something will emerge as the story unfolds.

And yes, firearms are hard in Canada. Even if she did live in a home where the parents owned a firearm, storage laws mandate it not only be locked up but also rendered inoperable with a security device. And that is just for unrestricted firearms. So knives would be the most immediately available weapon.

Freddy96NOwrote:
okey so in some way she was desperate for doing it? (need more info about her) and no fire arms isn't that hard but could be hard for her to manage or get/sneak in still could be possible as others have done it for years..
You never know how far kids go -__-

She definitely went over the edge over something. I'm going to assume a pattern of bullying or something will emerge as the story unfolds.

And yes, firearms are hard in Canada. Even if she did live in a home where the parents owned a firearm, storage laws mandate it not only be locked up but also rendered inoperable with a security device. And that is just for unrestricted firearms. So knives would be the most immediately available weapon.