Windows 10 October 2018 Update (1809) Still Flawed, Incompatible With Some AMD GPUs

Credit: MicrosoftMicrosoft planned to fully release the Windows 10 October 2018 Update in, well, October. That didn't happen. Shortly after it started rolling it out, people who manually installed the update, also known as Windows 10 1809, discovered various file system bugs that prompted Microsoft to delay the update's official launch. The company ended up missing the update's namesake month entirely and finally re-released it on November 14. But it turns out it's still flawed and is even unusable by certain AMD and Trend Micro customers.

File Explorer Issue

ZDNet ran down the ways in which Microsoft has yet to fix the Windows 10 October 2018 Update. The biggest issue is that File Explorer reports mapped network drives as being broken, even if there's nothing wrong with them.

Microsoft acknowledged this issue and shared a few workarounds, but unfortunately, those hackney solutions could lead to more problems for businesses that depend on their mapped network drives. The company said that "Mapped drives may fail to reconnect after starting and logging onto a Windows device" and that it "is working on a resolution and will provide updates in the 2019 timeframe." In the mean time, businesses will have to use Microsoft's workarounds and hope for the best.

But at least those businesses have a choice regarding whether or not they want to install the Windows 10 1809 update. That option hasn't even been made available to some consumers because they're using software or hardware that isn't compatible with the update. (As opposed to the "always-connected" laptops that shipped with a version of Windows 10 that was never meant to support them just so they could reach holiday shoppers.)

Incompatibility With AMD, Trend Micro

The problem lies with Trend Micro's OfficeScan and Worry-Free Business Security software, as well as AMD Radeon HD 2000 or HD 4000 series graphics cards. Trend Micro is working on patches to improve compatibility with Windows 10 1809, but until they're ready, its customers won't be able to install the latest version of Windows 10. Microsoft is actually blocking the update on those devices until Trend Micro gives the go-ahead.

Microsoft's doing the same for people with affected AMD graphics cards. Folks with an AMD Radeon HD 2000 or HD 4000 series card might notice performance issues on the lockscreen, find that Microsoft Edge flat-out stops working, or get the "INVALID_POINTER_READ_c0000005_atidxx64.dll" error. Those are old graphics cards, sure, but it's still surprising Microsoft would ship Windows 10 1809 with flaws like that.

The older GPUs is a driver side issue. I am surprised AMD didn;t have a driver ready for the launch.

Trend Micro has been known to wait till the last minute to update their software to work.

As for the mapped drives issue, this is nothing new. In fact it has existed since Windows 7 at least and doesn't mean they wont work. You have to just open the drive and it works fine. Another well known issue is the network icon on the start bar shows an exclamation mark and states "No Internet" even though internet works just fine. However I have noticed this less with newer versions of 10 than other older versions of Windows.

I think a lot of this is just trying to find flaws to bolster views and clicks more than anything as I said the mapped drives issue has existed for a very long time but is a very small problem that almost never affects any of my users.

richard_mp

"... but it's still surprising Microsoft would ship Windows 10 1809 with flaws like that..."

In what world is this surprising. MS has had screwed up updates since forever. There is a reason that anyone with any sense what so ever waited for the bugs to be worked out of updates before installing them.

The problem is now with Win 10 you no longer have that choice. Which is why even though I have been been using an MS operating systems since back in the DOS days I decided to move to bite the bullet and move to Linux. I kept my Win 7 box going for the three programs I still need Windows for but for everything else the transition was fairly pain free.

I can see why MS would feel the need to force security updates on everyone and I probably would have been able to deal with that but the whole take it all or nothing is just plain stupid. I have seen way too many updates over the last 25+ years that ended up breaking my system to allow that to happen.

Too bad really as from everything I have seen Win 10 is a pretty good OS but giving MS the ability to break my system any time they please just does not work for me.

svan71

JIMMYSMITTY pointing out all you did and trying to say hey these problems have always existed really doesn't say much for the # 1 os on the planet, especially after a month delay on there botched release.

jimmysmitty

101441 said:

JIMMYSMITTY pointing out all you did and trying to say hey these problems have always existed really doesn't say much for the # 1 os on the planet, especially after a month delay on there botched release.

I am not excusing Microsoft for the issue. I am stating that this is not news worthy and is only being used to ride on the tail of the original issue which was major however was not as major as it was made to be since the update was never rolled out in a forced manner and only released in a "take it if you want it" manner.

This issue used to be fixed with a log on script to extend the time to connect and this particular "problem" will only affect companies.

But then again who am I to argue with the media who is really good at making Mt. Everest out of an ant hill?

bigpinkdragon286

Instead of Microsoft trying to cram new features down our throats we aren't asking for, Microsoft should make their engineers fix the stupid issues already. Users don't need Windows 10 trying to reinstall itself every six months. This is only asking for problems.

jcroe72

1. and no dark mode yet? maybe I was blocked2. my clean as a whistle pc is getting mega lag spikes occasionally is this due to the updates?

Tanyac

149725 said:

As for the mapped drives issue, this is nothing new. In fact it has existed since Windows 7 at least and doesn't mean they wont work.

I concur. This wasn't an issue in Vista. Lots of things were removed when Windows 7 was released, This is one of the issues that started back then. There was also other issues like Windows no longer remembers folder sizes and positions, requiring the use of a program called ShellfolderFix to restore that functionality.

But the network drive issue, and the "Could not reconnect network drives" has been around for almost a decade. The workarounds Microsoft suggested (UNC Paths or using powershell scripts) work (Unless your programs require a mapped drive). I had to change 2 registry values and set up a batch file to replace mapped drives at logon.

I've been doing that since 2009. Microsoft has never fixed the issue in Windows 7, 8, 8.1 or any release of Windows 10. As you said, this is nothing new. So, I don't know why anyone is making a big issue of it now...

And even more curious is that Microsoft has "acknowledged the issue" and plans to fix it in several months?? Say what?

stdragon

"99 little bugs in the code 99 little bugs in the code Take one down, patch it around 117 little bugs in the code"

drtweak

149725 said:

The older GPUs is a driver side issue. I am surprised AMD didn;t have a driver ready for the launch.
Trend Micro has been known to wait till the last minute to update their software to work.
As for the mapped drives issue, this is nothing new. In fact it has existed since Windows 7 at least and doesn't mean they wont work. You have to just open the drive and it works fine. Another well known issue is the network icon on the start bar shows an exclamation mark and states "No Internet" even though internet works just fine. However I have noticed this less with newer versions of 10 than other older versions of Windows.
I think a lot of this is just trying to find flaws to bolster views and clicks more than anything as I said the mapped drives issue has existed for a very long time but is a very small problem that almost never affects any of my users.

Yea the mapped drive reconnecting on logon has been a LONG time issue and honestly I hate it. Login, no internet, it tired to connect even though it says no connection, map drive failed, stay disconnected till you click on it. Its like this has been an issue since XP. Almost 2 decades now and that isn't fixed till even with windows 10. This is why all my domain clients has netlogon scripts so they remap on every login and it is when there is connection because it can't get the bat file till it connects to the server. But yea annoying issues.

nufelevas

Those are the most evident and visible bugs.

The horror comes from all the hidden bugs, running underground, which will break things before anybody notices.

stdragon

926377 said:

149725 said:

The older GPUs is a driver side issue. I am surprised AMD didn;t have a driver ready for the launch.
Trend Micro has been known to wait till the last minute to update their software to work.
As for the mapped drives issue, this is nothing new. In fact it has existed since Windows 7 at least and doesn't mean they wont work. You have to just open the drive and it works fine. Another well known issue is the network icon on the start bar shows an exclamation mark and states "No Internet" even though internet works just fine. However I have noticed this less with newer versions of 10 than other older versions of Windows.
I think a lot of this is just trying to find flaws to bolster views and clicks more than anything as I said the mapped drives issue has existed for a very long time but is a very small problem that almost never affects any of my users.

Yea the mapped drive reconnecting on logon has been a LONG time issue and honestly I hate it. Login, no internet, it tired to connect even though it says no connection, map drive failed, stay disconnected till you click on it. Its like this has been an issue since XP. Almost 2 decades now and that isn't fixed till even with windows 10. This is why all my domain clients has netlogon scripts so they remap on every login and it is when there is connection because it can't get the bat file till it connects to the server. But yea annoying issues.

FYI, you can use a GPO to map drives.

Anyways, yes, this "red X" bug has always been there. I suspect there must be a race condition going on in which Explorer.exe attempts to validate SMB connectivity before authentication has cleared. In theory, it shouldn't be possible because you must first authenticate at logon before your own session loads Explorer.exe. Anyways, simply opening up the mapped drive will make the X go away as the resources is in fact there. BTW, this is regardless if your on a LAN or WLAN.

drtweak

2695855 said:

926377 said:

149725 said:

The older GPUs is a driver side issue. I am surprised AMD didn;t have a driver ready for the launch.
Trend Micro has been known to wait till the last minute to update their software to work.
As for the mapped drives issue, this is nothing new. In fact it has existed since Windows 7 at least and doesn't mean they wont work. You have to just open the drive and it works fine. Another well known issue is the network icon on the start bar shows an exclamation mark and states "No Internet" even though internet works just fine. However I have noticed this less with newer versions of 10 than other older versions of Windows.
I think a lot of this is just trying to find flaws to bolster views and clicks more than anything as I said the mapped drives issue has existed for a very long time but is a very small problem that almost never affects any of my users.

Yea the mapped drive reconnecting on logon has been a LONG time issue and honestly I hate it. Login, no internet, it tired to connect even though it says no connection, map drive failed, stay disconnected till you click on it. Its like this has been an issue since XP. Almost 2 decades now and that isn't fixed till even with windows 10. This is why all my domain clients has netlogon scripts so they remap on every login and it is when there is connection because it can't get the bat file till it connects to the server. But yea annoying issues.

FYI, you can use a GPO to map drives.
Anyways, yes, this "red X" bug has always been there. I suspect there must be a race condition going on in which Explorer.exe attempts to validate SMB connectivity before authentication has cleared. In theory, it shouldn't be possible because you must first authenticate at logon before your own session loads Explorer.exe. Anyways, simply opening up the mapped drive will make the X go away as the resources is in fact there. BTW, this is regardless if your on a LAN or WLAN.

Yea i know it can be done though GPO as well but sometimes it is easier to just make the batch file and make multiple and just assign then especially when I have some clients with like a dozen different shares with all kinds of different people who have different permissions.

And yea there is a regedit for the WLAN part that allows it to connect to the WLAN before logon. i don't need it very often as 99.9% of the time they are hardwired plus again once it picks up the batch file on connection to the server it gets reconnected but still it is something stupid that its like why is this still happening?

jimmysmitty

2695855 said:

926377 said:

149725 said:

The older GPUs is a driver side issue. I am surprised AMD didn;t have a driver ready for the launch.
Trend Micro has been known to wait till the last minute to update their software to work.
As for the mapped drives issue, this is nothing new. In fact it has existed since Windows 7 at least and doesn't mean they wont work. You have to just open the drive and it works fine. Another well known issue is the network icon on the start bar shows an exclamation mark and states "No Internet" even though internet works just fine. However I have noticed this less with newer versions of 10 than other older versions of Windows.
I think a lot of this is just trying to find flaws to bolster views and clicks more than anything as I said the mapped drives issue has existed for a very long time but is a very small problem that almost never affects any of my users.

Yea the mapped drive reconnecting on logon has been a LONG time issue and honestly I hate it. Login, no internet, it tired to connect even though it says no connection, map drive failed, stay disconnected till you click on it. Its like this has been an issue since XP. Almost 2 decades now and that isn't fixed till even with windows 10. This is why all my domain clients has netlogon scripts so they remap on every login and it is when there is connection because it can't get the bat file till it connects to the server. But yea annoying issues.

FYI, you can use a GPO to map drives.
Anyways, yes, this "red X" bug has always been there. I suspect there must be a race condition going on in which Explorer.exe attempts to validate SMB connectivity before authentication has cleared. In theory, it shouldn't be possible because you must first authenticate at logon before your own session loads Explorer.exe. Anyways, simply opening up the mapped drive will make the X go away as the resources is in fact there. BTW, this is regardless if your on a LAN or WLAN.

That is what is going on. And depending on your network setup the system might not authenticate until you open a web browser, our sonicwalls require you to try to hit the web before it actually does anything.

The only drives we have that do not do this are ones that are pushed using AD profiles. With those they tend to always come up without the red X but I suspect that's because the system is logging into AD anyways which then pushes the drive letter and mapping each time. Although one issue with this is that if you are not on the domain the drive will sometimes not appear. The only solution to this I have found is to map the drive first then set it to push in AD in the users profile.

There will always be little issues. Honestly some of the things we do with technology these days amazes me and I can accept little issues like this that don't affect me or the end users in any real negative way vs having an issue that does like the file deletion bug.

nufelevas

My Areca backup simply stopped working with the last update (1803), and simply there is no way to roll back

I hate MShit and windows 10

mikeebb

Be careful. Intel decided not to update video drivers (with a little non-help from the 3rd-party supplier) any more in one of their Atom chips. MS stopped availability of Win10 for tablets with those CPUs as soon as it was discovered. There are lots of other graphics (especially) and other systems that aren't supported any more. If Windows breaks one of those in a feature update and the OEM chooses not to (or cannot) update legacy drivers to work around things, Windows stops all support of that computer after 12 months of security-only updates (18 months from release of the last feature update that worked). Read the policies. This is what will be done to drive people to buy new computers more often...or to switch to Apple or Linux.

BorgOvermind

How about it making W10 completely unusable ?After the 14th update, we got this on many systems: the OS loads up to the login screen fine. After login, nothing else works. Start menu is disabled, explorer gets instant-stuck and when it dies it leaves us with empty black desktop. No options work in the mean-while. Taks manager also loads very hard and gets stuck. Anti-virus fails to load components. And of course, we do not have access to updates uninstall in safe mode, which in W10 is btw GONE for whoever does not know - you have to crash/power-off your system 3 times for recovery menu to show. And no JIMMYSMITTY, old drivers or drivers of any kind are NOT an issue. Windows 10 removing them and replacing them with junk ones is. AMD has excellent drivers while W10 update bricks systems more often than I get my morning daily coffees. W10 is broken in all aspects and will remain so as long as the user does not have any control over it.

jimmysmitty

578974 said:

How about it making W10 completely unusable ?
After the 14th update, we got this on many systems: the OS loads up to the login screen fine. After login, nothing else works. Start menu is disabled, explorer gets instant-stuck and when it dies it leaves us with empty black desktop. No options work in the mean-while. Taks manager also loads very hard and gets stuck. Anti-virus fails to load components. And of course, we do not have access to updates uninstall in safe mode, which in W10 is btw GONE for whoever does not know - you have to crash/power-off your system 3 times for recovery menu to show. And no JIMMYSMITTY, old drivers or drivers of any kind are NOT an issue. Windows 10 removing them and replacing them with junk ones is. AMD has excellent drivers while W10 update bricks systems more often than I get my morning daily coffees. W10 is broken in all aspects and will remain so as long as the user does not have any control over it.

I said nothing about "Old Drivers" I said it was a driver issue as the drivers that were out at the time were not designed for 1809. Normally AMD and nVidia have the drivers ready before the official launch and for some reason the AMD graphics drivers were not.

I have done the updates on many machines and never had an issue with drivers. Mostly everything works as it should and after every new version I always check and reinstall the latest drivers from the vendors. However my experience, like yours, is anecdotal. It is not indicative of the majority.

Makron

Yup my i5 4200m with 850m GPU only runs on internal GPU now thank you Microsoft.

i installed old, new and latest drivers, in windows 10, windows 8.1, and back to windows 10 again. With and without updates. I've spent more than three days on this <mod edit>, what the actual <mod edit>...

<Moderator Warning: Watch your language in these forums>

stdragon

1809 has been republished and so far been solid for me. I've updated at least 6 machines to it with no problems. However it's recommended to update your Intel iGPU driver now regardless what version of Windows 10 you upgrade or stay with.

bigpinkdragon286

Even if 1809 is finally to the point it contains no major issues, it's still a rather unnecessary nuisance to have to go through and verify which drivers are in use and make sure previous settings are put back in place. Nothing like having Windows reinstall all of the hardware under device manager every six months. This may not be an issue for folks with the most common hardware, as they won't even realize this is happening, but having to redo driver configurations just "because" is counter productive. Even if all of the same drivers get put back, you are increasing the possibility of machine downtime and decreased productivity.

Might as well be driving down the road and at some random time, twice every year, have the government forcibly mandate that you pull over to the side of the road, take all of your tires off, then put them back on.

I didn't buy a computer so I could follow Microsoft around and clean up after their OS, and I don't like having to wander through their terrible new settings UI after major updates trying to figure out which settings have been reset to Microsoft's preferred default again.

Can anybody even name off the top of their head, a major new feature that Windows 10 1809 brings to the table that might get regular use, without resorting to a Google search? I don't count DXR as that isn't an update to the OS, and it shouldn't require reinstalling Windows, that's just an extension of the existing DX12 API.

stdragon

I have to agree. Most of the time there isn't a compelling reason to upgrade to the latest build. And if there is, it's usually UI enhancements/features or performance enhancements worthy of making the move. But more often than not, it's to MS benefit in code cleanup and setting the stage for future market expansion.

So then why did I upgrade? Well, because MS is going to force it as "security update" as they always do after awhile. Unless you're Enterprise on a LTSB path. So for 99% of the Windows 10 users, you have two options; either you're pro-active with drivers and OS upgrades, or you just let MS decide for you and wake up the next morning with an updated OS. At worst, it updates and all hell breaks loose from incompatible drivers.

You could always turn off Windows Updates, but that leaves you open to all sorts of security issues. So, pick your poison or don't use Windows at all. Really, they're in control when you get down to it.

bigpinkdragon286

I think I would disagree and say that Microsoft is not in control but rather out of control, hence most of their problematic updates, and also trying to usurp control of things they shouldn't. 99% of the security patches issued to Windows are for local attacks and can be skipped. Machines don't magically get compromised when run without any Windows Updates whatsoever, whether they are daily internet drivers or not. Saying otherwise has been nothing more than a scare tactic and repeated ignorance for many years, and I don't appreciate it being promulgated by folks that are supposed to be tech saavy. The whole point of the forced Windows 10 updates is to get folks used to being subject to whatever Microsoft wants to push into your installation of Windows without consent.

Turning off Windows 10 updates is a big, unnecessary headache. Should be built in from the get-go. Is adding a bunch of bobbles and trinkets in the form of added features built into the OS Microsoft's way of distract from the fact that moving from Windows 7 or 8 to 10 actually comes with a feature reduction?

Telling people to just stop using Windows must be amusing to some, but it's not a practical reality for the majority of PC use cases. Be as useful as telling Apple fans to give up their iPhones. :-)

stdragon

I'm working backwards here - But to be clear, there's legitimate delineation between a "security update" and "feature" change/add. The former is a no-brainier and should always be applied from a fundamental standpoint. Though I understand the hesitation given MS piss-poor QA/QC track record leading to system and platform instabilities. Features OTOH should be 100% discretionary to the end-user; to an extent because all products have a development life-cycle.

So about that QA/QC. See, MS is not out of control. What they're doing...in fact EVERYTHING they've been doing as of late is done to externalize costs to the rest of the industry and via extension, the end-user. That includes the user being the "beta tester", reducing costs in QA/QC as being pro-active is more costly than responding to bugs re-actively. Also out-sourcing in-house development via adopting open source will still creating intellectual property that be controlled and sold as a service.

TLDR - MS focus is on SAS and PAAS via externalizing costs while creating profit via a consistent revenue stream. And, to their argument of approach, they're correct. Just look how well they've been profitable and their stock prices reflect that in the market. MS has zero incentive to change, and if anything, double-down on the path they've been going down.

bigpinkdragon286

I disagree with your opinion. If you aren't in any imminent danger of certain security breaches, there's little immediate need of security patches regarding those. Changing code is always dangerous, especially if it comes with no immediate benefit, questionable long term benefit, and even more so when you are updating code that has already been deployed. Security update or not, whether an update is applied needs to always be the choice of the person who has responsibility over the system it's being deployed to, even if that choice is to consent to updating automatically. Microsoft is missing a great opportunity to educate and better empower people here. The more ignorant they keep their users, the more parenting will need be done. Wonder if that's coincidental?

I understand management wanted to do some cost cutting. I don't agree that damaging a brand such as Windows by making it less stable and less basic feature filled, and implementing policies that users of that software do not agree with is good long term. So what if you can show short term, or even medium duration gains in your bottom line. If Microsoft alienates too much of the Windows market, they may be in for a rude awakening.

Microsoft does have incentive to change, hence the new bully behavior of the last few years toward Windows 10. They are changing because they aren't quite sure how they want to proceed in the market. Let's hope their current phase passes and they go back to trying to win hearts and minds by making an OS that has long term desirability like XP and 7. I for one am not a fan of having to quell pop-up ads on production Windows 10 Pro machines. This isn't endearing me to want to implement more of that garbage in the workplace.