Renault have more or less said they don't want him. They put it as the cost of bringing him in would not be worth the returns, but there must be at least a small element of not wanting him slagging them off because he does not have the fastest car out there.

Who said that? I'd be interested in reading it.

I can not find the actual article I read, but these from PF1 are more or less the same.

(Abiteboul)"I don't think next year we will be in a position to fight for the championship. So we need a driver who can support us in this ultimate fight for the championship, but be prepared to wait for the time to come for this to happen."

Renault advisor Alain Prost told Sky Sports News HQ. “I don’t think we can offer him a car to be World Champion next year....We have to be really careful about that. We want to progress but we cannot have stupid objectives only because Fernando would be there.”

But while Renault are the favourites to sign Alonso for next season, Prost has poured cold water on the speculation with the admission that the team, still finding their feet after returning to the status of fully-fledged works outfit barely a year ago, will not yet be able to give the Spaniard what he craves in the foreseeable future

Sky f1

Next year, wouldn't the Renault car be much more refined? Alonso may not win but could dream of occasional top 5 spots till the car becomes a title contender.

I think what they're doing with those quotes is cooling expectations and being honest with Alonso as to where Renault think they'll be next year. Rather than the McLaren 'we'll be winning titles in 2017' nonsense, Renault are saying to Alonso 'we'd be happy to have you but we won't be winning any titles next season. Ball's in your court'.

I think what they're doing with those quotes is cooling expectations and being honest with Alonso as to where Renault think they'll be next year. Rather than the McLaren 'we'll be winning titles in 2017' nonsense, Renault are saying to Alonso 'we'd be happy to have you but we won't be winning any titles next season. Ball's in your court'.

Possibly, but they also say they want to develop a driver along with the car. I also think they are nervous of him slagging Renault off on air if things do not go according to plan.

My one prediction: if Fernando Alonso leaves McLaren at the end of 2017, McLaren will be winning races in 2018.

(Actually, I'll also add I expect Leclerc to be at Haas in 2018, and that if Kimi is indeed dropped by Ferrari, Carlos Sainz is the guy they should be replacing him with. But if their interest is in Perez, and Alonso doesn't return to Renault, I'd predict that Carlos Sainz partners Hulkenberg in 2018, probably whilst still remaining a Red Bull-contracted driver.)

I think what they're doing with those quotes is cooling expectations and being honest with Alonso as to where Renault think they'll be next year. Rather than the McLaren 'we'll be winning titles in 2017' nonsense, Renault are saying to Alonso 'we'd be happy to have you but we won't be winning any titles next season. Ball's in your court'.

Possibly, but they also say they want to develop a driver along with the car. I also think they are nervous of him slagging Renault off on air if things do not go according to plan.

Which is why Renault are publicly saying they won't be challenging. It would be poor form for Alonso to slate Renault in those circumstamces.

Renault have more or less said they don't want him. They put it as the cost of bringing him in would not be worth the returns, but there must be at least a small element of not wanting him slagging them off because he does not have the fastest car out there.

Who said that? I'd be interested in reading it.

I can not find the actual article I read, but these from PF1 are more or less the same.

(Abiteboul)"I don't think next year we will be in a position to fight for the championship. So we need a driver who can support us in this ultimate fight for the championship, but be prepared to wait for the time to come for this to happen."

Renault advisor Alain Prost told Sky Sports News HQ. “I don’t think we can offer him a car to be World Champion next year....We have to be really careful about that. We want to progress but we cannot have stupid objectives only because Fernando would be there.”

I've read those too, but I'm struggling to see how you can interpret either as Renault not wanting Alonso. It seems a lot more like they want to make sure they're being clear about what they can offer him; if Alonso wants to drive for Renault, fine, but he has to expect he won't win the championship in the first year or two if he does. That's how I read it, anyway.

Renault have more or less said they don't want him. They put it as the cost of bringing him in would not be worth the returns, but there must be at least a small element of not wanting him slagging them off because he does not have the fastest car out there.

Who said that? I'd be interested in reading it.

I can not find the actual article I read, but these from PF1 are more or less the same.

(Abiteboul)"I don't think next year we will be in a position to fight for the championship. So we need a driver who can support us in this ultimate fight for the championship, but be prepared to wait for the time to come for this to happen."

Renault advisor Alain Prost told Sky Sports News HQ. “I don’t think we can offer him a car to be World Champion next year....We have to be really careful about that. We want to progress but we cannot have stupid objectives only because Fernando would be there.”

I've read those too, but I'm struggling to see how you can interpret either as Renault not wanting Alonso. It seems a lot more like they want to make sure they're being clear about what they can offer him; if Alonso wants to drive for Renault, fine, but he has to expect he won't win the championship in the first year or two if he does. That's how I read it, anyway.

I believe what friends over here are trying to say is that Since Alonso wishes to fight for titles in 2018 & Prost believes that the Renault car won't be up to the mark yet in 2018, Prost feels Alonso would either have to be patient for 1 more year or Alonso could look elsewhere.

I've read those too, but I'm struggling to see how you can interpret either as Renault not wanting Alonso. It seems a lot more like they want to make sure they're being clear about what they can offer him; if Alonso wants to drive for Renault, fine, but he has to expect he won't win the championship in the first year or two if he does. That's how I read it, anyway.

I believe what friends over here are trying to say is that Since Alonso wishes to fight for titles in 2018 & Prost believes that the Renault car won't be up to the mark yet in 2018, Prost feels Alonso would either have to be patient for 1 more year or Alonso could look elsewhere.

Well, yeah. But how does that translate to Renault not wanting him? If they didn't want him, why try to temper his expectations instead of just saying no?

Who do we think for STR for next season? Almost certainly a space opening up.

I think Lecrerc will be with HAAS.

Great opportunity for rookies next season with lots of drives potentially available.

I see them having trouble keeping Sainz, unless there's reason to think Ricciardo will move to Ferrari. Sainz has proven himself for a better drive than STR, and if he gets an offer I think RBR will have to offer him a seat to keep him, which they won't do if RIC is staying put.

Kvyat - out of the sport I think, but he's probably better than Ericsson, Palmer or Stroll, and possibly the Haas duo as well. The only saving grace for him may be that Red Bull don't have two drivers ready for F1, so if Sainz flies the coop I could see Kvyat being retained.

Who do we think for STR for next season? Almost certainly a space opening up.

I think Lecrerc will be with HAAS.

Great opportunity for rookies next season with lots of drives potentially available.

I see them having trouble keeping Sainz, unless there's reason to think Ricciardo will move to Ferrari. Sainz has proven himself for a better drive than STR, and if he gets an offer I think RBR will have to offer him a seat to keep him, which they won't do if RIC is staying put.

Kvyat - out of the sport I think, but he's probably better than Ericsson, Palmer or Stroll, and possibly the Haas duo as well. The only saving grace for him may be that Red Bull don't have two drivers ready for F1, so if Sainz flies the coop I could see Kvyat being retained.

Do they have a contract with Sainz for 2018? If so then they can keep him if they want.

Leclerc will almost certainly be brought into F1 by Ferrari if they can find a seat for him. With Sauber going to Honda you'd have to say Haas is looking the most likely. I get the feeling he may have to settle for a 3rd driver role like Vandoorne first though.

Just to bring it back to 2017 for a moment it was rumoured that Monaco would be Palmer's last race for Renault, assuming they do look to replace him for Canada who do we think they would be looking at? Call me crazy (I'm thinking it myself) but with Maldonado at the last 2 races in a row and his history with Enstone... is that possible? I feel like I'm going crazy but the pieces sort of fit.

In any case I doubt Palmer will be in the seat next year so do we think Sirotkin has a shot or will they maybe look to Rowland if he performs well this year?

I think the most likely driver to replace him would be Sirotkin plus I believe he would bring some money as well.

Well it took him 2 years less than Palmer to be competitive in GP2, and in the early part of last season when Palmer was struggling he did a FP1 session and seemed to put Palmer to shame, but no there is no guarantee he would be better but it's doubtful he would be any worse either.

My one prediction: if Fernando Alonso leaves McLaren at the end of 2017, McLaren will be winning races in 2018.

(Actually, I'll also add I expect Leclerc to be at Haas in 2018, and that if Kimi is indeed dropped by Ferrari, Carlos Sainz is the guy they should be replacing him with. But if their interest is in Perez, and Alonso doesn't return to Renault, I'd predict that Carlos Sainz partners Hulkenberg in 2018, probably whilst still remaining a Red Bull-contracted driver.)

Regarding Leclerc you are forgetting that Giovinazzi, who was the rookie runner up in GP2 last year, is the Ferrari reserve driver, he is Italian which isn't necessarily a per-requisite for Ferrari but might help, and also he's been recently penciled in this year for FP1 sessions with Haas.

Who do we think for STR for next season? Almost certainly a space opening up.

I think Lecrerc will be with HAAS.

Great opportunity for rookies next season with lots of drives potentially available.

I think that Sainz will stay at STR for next year bearing in mind that Ricciardo is out of contract at Red Bull for 2019 so might wait for that opportunity?

STR will surely replace Kvyat with Gasly if based just on performance but I heard that Kvyat brings money to STR so that might help to keep his seat?

Regarding Haas you are forgetting that Giovinazzi is the Ferrari reserve driver and as I've just posted he has been penciled in for several FP1 outings with Haas for this year so if a seat were available there for next year he would be first in line and not Leclerc.

Stroll is a cash cow for Williams while Massa has been hired as his mentor as much as anything else plus he's been quite solid this year, a younger driver might not fit the bill, so I could see this line up being unchanged.

Meanwhile at Sauber, Ericsson is solid because his sponsors own the team and I don't believe there is a McLaren Honda junior that is ready for F1 next year, and regarding KMag he has a contract with Haas for next year.

Stroll is a cash cow for Williams while Massa has been hired as his mentor as much as anything else plus he's been quite solid this year, a younger driver might not fit the bill, so I could see this line up being unchanged.

Meanwhile at Sauber, Ericsson is solid because his sponsors own the team and I don't believe there is a McLaren Honda junior that is ready for F1 next year, and regarding KMag he has a contract with Haas for next year.

I think Williams will be looking for better than Massa. Expect Perez, Sainz and Grosjean all to be offered drives. Probably another go for Button as well. Extremely hard to predict next years line up. Unusually there actually seems to be a lack of drivers to fill places higher up the grid.

Stroll is a cash cow for Williams while Massa has been hired as his mentor as much as anything else plus he's been quite solid this year, a younger driver might not fit the bill, so I could see this line up being unchanged.

Meanwhile at Sauber, Ericsson is solid because his sponsors own the team and I don't believe there is a McLaren Honda junior that is ready for F1 next year, and regarding KMag he has a contract with Haas for next year.

I think Williams will be looking for better than Massa. Expect Perez, Sainz and Grosjean all to be offered drives. Probably another go for Button as well. Extremely hard to predict next years line up. Unusually there actually seems to be a lack of drivers to fill places higher up the grid.

Of all those drivers I only see Grosjean that would take up the offer, both Perez and Sainz would be wanting factory drives whilst Button is retired.

Stroll is a cash cow for Williams while Massa has been hired as his mentor as much as anything else plus he's been quite solid this year, a younger driver might not fit the bill, so I could see this line up being unchanged.

Meanwhile at Sauber, Ericsson is solid because his sponsors own the team and I don't believe there is a McLaren Honda junior that is ready for F1 next year, and regarding KMag he has a contract with Haas for next year.

I think Williams will be looking for better than Massa. Expect Perez, Sainz and Grosjean all to be offered drives. Probably another go for Button as well. Extremely hard to predict next years line up. Unusually there actually seems to be a lack of drivers to fill places higher up the grid.

Here is my unlikely but possible lineup

Ferrari - VettelPerez

Mercedes - HamiltonBottas

Red Bull -RicciardoVerstappen

FI - OconGiovinazzi

STR - SainzGasly

Williams - GrosjeanStroll

Renault - Hulkenberg Wehrlein

Haas - MagnussenLeclerc

SauberEricssonFukuzumi

Mclaren - AlonsoVandoorne

I would make Wehrlein more likely to be at F1 then Giovinazzi and Giovinazzi more likely to be at Haas than Leclerc, whilst would Fukuzumi have the necessary super license points?

Of all those drivers I only see Grosjean that would take up the offer, both Perez and Sainz would be wanting factory drives whilst Button is retired.

Agreed. They'll still get offers though. Wouldn't surprise me if someone like Wehrlein is approached as well. Button is on a sabbatical. I agree he probably won't want to return but....

Or curve ball, but how about Kimi?

Kimi would retire especially as Williams are not big payers and he wouldn't want to just make up the numbers, another thing that you are forgetting is that their sponsors need a driver over 25 years old, Button is not on a sabbatical he is retired which leads us back to Grosjean again.

Another thing about Kimi he is older than Massa and is he actually any better, they were teammates after all?

As per 1 banned site from this forum, Alonso has given McLaren time till the summer break to get its act clean. He said from the summer break onwards 'I'll be open to any negotiation whether with McLaren or any other team'.

This year's summer break onwards it's going o be quite interesting for Alonso & a few more drivers.

As per 1 banned site from this forum, Alonso has given McLaren time till the summer break to get its act clean. He said from the summer break onwards 'I'll be open to any negotiation whether with McLaren or any other team'.

This year's summer break onwards it's going o be quite interesting for Alonso & a few more drivers.

Five races to go until then, clearly not enough time to sort out the mess they're in.

As per 1 banned site from this forum, Alonso has given McLaren time till the summer break to get its act clean. He said from the summer break onwards 'I'll be open to any negotiation whether with McLaren or any other team'.

This year's summer break onwards it's going o be quite interesting for Alonso & a few more drivers.

Five races to go until then, clearly not enough time to sort out the mess they're in.

Macca can say bye-bye to Fernando.

The indy car race that ended in another engine failure was the final nail in the coffin!

Of all those drivers I only see Grosjean that would take up the offer, both Perez and Sainz would be wanting factory drives whilst Button is retired.

Agreed. They'll still get offers though. Wouldn't surprise me if someone like Wehrlein is approached as well. Button is on a sabbatical. I agree he probably won't want to return but....

Or curve ball, but how about Kimi?

Kimi would retire especially as Williams are not big payers and he wouldn't want to just make up the numbers, another thing that you are forgetting is that their sponsors need a driver over 25 years old, Button is not on a sabbatical he is retired which leads us back to Grosjean again.

Another thing about Kimi he is older than Massa and is he actually any better, they were teammates after all?

True.

I don't think Kimi is likely but if he likes being an F1 driver than Williams could be his best option. Surely over 21 would be fine?

I think Grosjean will leave Haas.

Williams, Force India or Renualt could be options for him.

Personally I think they could all do better but he does seem to be rated.

As per 1 banned site from this forum, Alonso has given McLaren time till the summer break to get its act clean. He said from the summer break onwards 'I'll be open to any negotiation whether with McLaren or any other team'.

This year's summer break onwards it's going o be quite interesting for Alonso & a few more drivers.

It's not like they are not really trying though is it? You know, OH! we better pull our finger out or Fernando will be going.

Sorry if it sounds crass, not intended as a slight to you, just had a picture of it in my head

Massa has, I believe, been really quite impressive. True we don't know the full potential of the car due to Stroll being REALLY average BUT, he finished 6th in Aus and Bahrain. Should have been 6th in Russia AND at least 6th Spain if it weren't for punctures AND got points in Monaco, which is by far and away their worst track on the calendar. Can't really fault what he's doing and couldn't see anyone that would be in line for the job doing THAT much better tbh.The fact that he retired last year tells me he probably won't hang around for 2018 anyway? But who knows. RoGro would be a good fit if they wanted someone young in at HAAS but i feel if either of those two were going to be pushed out it would be MAG?

Like I've just posted Kvyat brings money, with Kari no way do I see him jumping in front of Gasly.

I've never heard that Kvyat brings much money, but it wouldn't matter if he did. Red Bull still calls the shots on Toro Rosso's drivers, and if they want Gasly in that seat he's getting it.

I agree with this. Don't think i've ever heard Paying Driver and the Redbull arm of F1 mentioned in the same sentence ?? I could be wrong but they're usually all about the raw talent. Kvyat seems to be turning things around slowly, super unlucky on the SAT and SUN in Monaco, but will have punch in some extreme results by the end of the season to keep Gasly out of the seat.

Of all those drivers I only see Grosjean that would take up the offer, both Perez and Sainz would be wanting factory drives whilst Button is retired.

Agreed. They'll still get offers though. Wouldn't surprise me if someone like Wehrlein is approached as well. Button is on a sabbatical. I agree he probably won't want to return but....

Or curve ball, but how about Kimi?

Kimi would retire especially as Williams are not big payers and he wouldn't want to just make up the numbers, another thing that you are forgetting is that their sponsors need a driver over 25 years old, Button is not on a sabbatical he is retired which leads us back to Grosjean again.

Another thing about Kimi he is older than Massa and is he actually any better, they were teammates after all?

True.

I don't think Kimi is likely but if he likes being an F1 driver than Williams could be his best option. Surely over 21 would be fine?

I think Grosjean will leave Haas.

Williams, Force India or Renualt could be options for him.

Personally I think they could all do better but he does seem to be rated.

Williams sponsor Martini specify that at least 1 driver has to be over 25 years old.

Regarding Kimi would Williams consider him to be a step up from Massa and also like I said he is older than Massa, the reason for retiring Massa seems to be more related to his age so it seems?

Similar with Grosjean would Williams see him as a step up from Massa, I'm not so sure?

Also is he a driver to lead Williams, he seems to get a bit wound up at times?

Massa has, I believe, been really quite impressive. True we don't know the full potential of the car due to Stroll being REALLY average BUT, he finished 6th in Aus and Bahrain. Should have been 6th in Russia AND at least 6th Spain if it weren't for punctures AND got points in Monaco, which is by far and away their worst track on the calendar. Can't really fault what he's doing and couldn't see anyone that would be in line for the job doing THAT much better tbh.The fact that he retired last year tells me he probably won't hang around for 2018 anyway? But who knows. RoGro would be a good fit if they wanted someone young in at HAAS but i feel if either of those two were going to be pushed out it would be MAG?

It wasn't Massa's choice to retire he was just surplus to requirements, regarding KMag he is under contract at Haas for next season.

Like I've just posted Kvyat brings money, with Kari no way do I see him jumping in front of Gasly.

I've never heard that Kvyat brings much money, but it wouldn't matter if he did. Red Bull still calls the shots on Toro Rosso's drivers, and if they want Gasly in that seat he's getting it.

I agree with this. Don't think i've ever heard Paying Driver and the Redbull arm of F1 mentioned in the same sentence ?? I could be wrong but they're usually all about the raw talent. Kvyat seems to be turning things around slowly, super unlucky on the SAT and SUN in Monaco, but will have punch in some extreme results by the end of the season to keep Gasly out of the seat.