Whenever Titans are mentioned it is said they travel, never is their homeworld even mentioned.

That does not mean they are nomadic.

Originally Posted by Combatbulter

Algalon was a failsafe Program, whose mission it is to purge the impure and to start a cycle anew if necessary, the signal would have meant yeah the world is toast you have to come back and to start from scratch.

His mission was to alert the Titans if it needed purging, not to purge it himself.

Originally Posted by Combatbulter

That is why I said it depends on their power even a mortal could in theory have a demonical army if he is strong enough to shackle them to his will.

That is not 'following'. It is not the demon's choice.

Originally Posted by Combatbulter

If Illidan could do it, why should an Old god not be able to do so? The Old Gods would most likely work together initially and go their separate ways after they disposed of Sargeras, the demons which they would have swayed would most likely splinter into camp N'zoth etc.

Illidan was able to because Sargeras wasn't around. If this is a discussion about Sargeras versus the Old Gods, the Old Gods would have to show themselves a better leader than Sargeras. Considering Illidan proved his worth by defeating the commander of the demons who would later serve them, I don't see how they could sway them from Sargeras.

It is heavily implied, while them staying in one place is never mentioned.

Originally Posted by Lightfist

His mission was to alert the Titans if it needed purging, not to purge it himself.

Yeah I reread Algalon and yeah you are right, but it changes actually nothing the space Nazis would have had to purge the planet themselves.

Originally Posted by Lightfist

That is not 'following'. It is not the demon's choice.

Illidan was able to because Sargeras wasn't around. If this is a discussion about Sargeras versus the Old Gods, the Old Gods would have to show themselves a better leader than Sargeras. Considering Illidan proved his worth by defeating the commander of the demons who would later serve them, I don't see how they could sway them from Sargeras.

The old Gods are incredibly powerful, they stood up to many titans and they still have vast armies of their own, many demons could see merit in joining up with them instead of Sargeras.

He who sees his own doom can better avoid its path. He who sees the doom of others can deliver it.

I don't think Azshara has a strong enough visual design to warrant her own expansion, all of her zones would be naga oriented, and there's only so much of that people can take. And to do a lot of things that seem to have nothing to do with the naga while still tied into her just seems off kilter. I expect it is possible Blizzard could dazzle with such a theme, maybe, but I don't see them ever using her as her own thing. She works best in conjunction with another villain.

For the record, Algalon was suppose to be the person to start the reorigination process on Azeroth. It has been said by blizzard (don't have the referance on me atm sadly) that after he analyzed the Planet for corruption he was to go to the Halls of Origination and activate the reorigination device the Titan's left there. Never any mention to my knowledge of him doing anymore than simply informing the Pantheon that the planet was too far gone as far has their connection to his mission.

I don't see how it is 'heavily implied'. Traveling vast distances doesn't speak much about a civilization when they have interplanetary travel.

Originally Posted by Lightfist

The point is that the Titans were watching over Azeroth, even if it was indirectly through sentient constructs.

You are actually making my point you know, they might watch but they don't seem to leave Titans on their worlds. One of their given names is the travelers that pretty much sounds nomadic to me.

Originally Posted by Lightfist

They stood up to the Titans because they had to, and they were defeated utterly and terribly. By comparison, the Titans have been unable to stop Sargeras or the Legion.

I mean, it's not even like the Legion would be surprised to learn of Azeroth's Old Gods. The two forces have clearly encountered each other on other worlds.

It took quite some time until they were defeated and they are still alive,so are many of their soldiers they infested the Titans greatest creation. So I would say they were hardly ever terribly and utterly defeated.

They seemed to be blissfully unaware during the WoA since Sargeras himself danced to their tune.

He who sees his own doom can better avoid its path. He who sees the doom of others can deliver it.

I don't think Azshara has a strong enough visual design to warrant her own expansion, all of her zones would be naga oriented, and there's only so much of that people can take. And to do a lot of things that seem to have nothing to do with the naga while still tied into her just seems off kilter. I expect it is possible Blizzard could dazzle with such a theme, maybe, but I don't see them ever using her as her own thing. She works best in conjunction with another villain.

When it comes down to "either we use her as a villain or shut down the game" she will come.

"Oh, who does my hair? You might have heard of my stylist. It's called the Void!"
"No matter how much you plead I will not sprout tentacles or turn into a giant eyeball. Well, I might. But not because you asked!"

I don't think Azshara has a strong enough visual design to warrant her own expansion, all of her zones would be naga oriented, and there's only so much of that people can take. And to do a lot of things that seem to have nothing to do with the naga while still tied into her just seems off kilter. I expect it is possible Blizzard could dazzle with such a theme, maybe, but I don't see them ever using her as her own thing. She works best in conjunction with another villain.

TBC had things that didn't have to do with Illidan, as did Wrath with LK. Azshara has more of enough warrant for her own expansion. And so what if all the zones would be naga oriented? MoP's zones are all based on Asia. Blizzard has shown they can create pretty much anything if they set their works on it.

1. It was heavily hinted that she might have been saved by the Old Gods when the Sundering happened.
2. She was pretty damned close to everything that was happening under the Maelstrom.
3. Naga live underwater, they shouldn't care less what Deathwing does as cataclysm on the ground.
4. The first expansion with truly underwater questing, Azshara isn't part of it as an important character?
5. Seriously?

1. It's rare that you come across the grand pu-bah of the enemy force. We don't run into Illidan at the intro zone. We didn't fight Garrosh in the Barrens. Simply put, the general isn't really on the front line where we are fighting.
2. Fast running water isn't something most creatures can inhabit, so while she may have something to do with the Maelstrom, I doubt she was anywhere near it.
3. the basic idea of tectonic plates and land masses should tell you why your statement is bit inaccurate.
4. See number 1.
5. Yeah. Seriously.

Also, for the DW fight, if you fall in the water, you die, because apparently DW was making it boil, so that might also explain why the naga weren't present.

It seemed simple to me. Both are servants of N'Zoth. N'zoth seems to be a fair bit more intelligent then Yogg-Saron and C'thun, even while 'asleep' as he is. To put it simply, N'zoth doesn't seem the type to use all of it's forces together. Why have Deathwing, Azshara and whatever other forces he has strike together? Just using Deathwing, he's ripped open Azeroth, disabling many Titan security measures and opened up new ways for Old God forces to be used, in addition to making the Dragon Aspects mortal. One pawn out of the two that we know of, and however many we don't know about, and he did all that. Just imagine what he's having Azshara and the naga do behind the scenes

There is no Peace, only Passion
Through Passion, I gain Strength
Through Strength, I gain Power
Through Power, I gain Victory
Through Victory, my chains shall be broken
The Force shall free me

You are actually making my point you know, they might watch but they don't seem to leave Titans on their worlds. One of their given names is the travelers that pretty much sounds nomadic to me.

Once again, you don't have to be nomadic to travel. It doesn't make sense for such an advanced civilization to not have at least one base of operations. Hell, it could even be a mobile one.

Originally Posted by Combatbulter

It took quite some time until they were defeated and they are still alive,so are many of their soldiers they infested the Titans greatest creation. So I would say they were hardly ever terribly and utterly defeated.

It took 'some time'? Relative to what?

Also, they were cast down in shackles beneath the planet they previously ruled - with only one possible causality ever mentioned on the Titans' side. That sounds like a pretty utter defeat.

Originally Posted by Combatbulter

They seemed to be blissfully unaware during the WoA since Sargeras himself danced to their tune.

How did Sargeras 'dance to their tune'? They might have had a plot involving him, but it coincided with his own goals.

And the Legion might not be aware of the Old Gods of Azeroth, but the forces have obviously met before. Harbinger Skyriss mentions them by name, referring to them as the 'mighty Legion'.

How did Sargeras 'dance to their tune'? They might have had a plot involving him, but it coincided with his own goals.

Indeed, he didn't. He has never even encountered an Old God as far as I'm aware. On that matter as well just because the Old Gods were confident they could beat Sargeras doesn't mean they could, Audley Harrison claimed he could beat David Haye and well.. you get the point

Once again, you don't have to be nomadic to travel. It doesn't make sense for such an advanced civilization to not have at least one base of operations. Hell, it could even be a mobile one.

That is nomadic you know.

Originally Posted by Lightfist

It took 'some time'? Relative to what?

Also, they were cast down in shackles beneath the planet they previously ruled - with only one possible causality ever mentioned on the Titans' side. That sounds like a pretty utter defeat.

Same goes for the Old Gods only one of them was ever actually killed, not to mention the Titans outnumbered the Old gods and no that is far from a pretty utter defeat, if their armies had been utterly destroyed and they themselves would have been killed by the Titans they would have been utterly defeated, but they weren't they are still around regaining their strength.

Originally Posted by Lightfist

How did Sargeras 'dance to their tune'? They might have had a plot involving him, but it coincided with his own goals.

And the Legion might not be aware of the Old Gods of Azeroth, but the forces have obviously met before. Harbinger Skyriss mentions them by name, referring to them as the 'mighty Legion'.

They were indirectly responsible, that the legion learned of the Dragon Soul, so that they would use it to bring Sargeras into the world, in the process freeing them all at once, so yes they used them as tools.

Harbringer Skyriss also mentions the Old Gods are more powerful than the legion so what is your point?

Originally Posted by TJ

Indeed, he didn't. He has never even encountered an Old God as far as I'm aware. On that matter as well just because the Old Gods were confident they could beat Sargeras doesn't mean they could, Audley Harrison claimed he could beat David Haye and well.. you get the point

The point being the old Gods battled the Titans before and many had been necessary to seal them, so given their experience their claim is not a foolish one.

He who sees his own doom can better avoid its path. He who sees the doom of others can deliver it.

The point being the old Gods battled the Titans before and many had been necessary to seal them, so given their experience their claim is not a foolish one.

The Old Gods also had near infinite minions so it wasn't like they were unaided, not to mention as I said before the Titans didn't lose anyone apart from a presumed lesser titan and even chained them which again is harder than just killing them which they could've done with ease. I'm betting they thought they were going to beat the Titans in the first war also, which was far from the case.

Same goes for the Old Gods only one of them was ever actually killed, not to mention the Titans outnumbered the Old gods and no that is far from a pretty utter defeat, if their armies had been utterly destroyed and they themselves would have been killed by the Titans they would have been utterly defeated, but they weren't they are still around regaining their strength.

Only one of them was killed because the Titans wanted to take them prisoners. Only one Titan was possibly killed because the Old Gods were unable to kill them.

We don't know the exact forces on either side. The Old Gods also had their faceless armies and their elemental forces, and the Titans could have had constructs (though, as far as I know, these weren't mentioned). You can't say they were outnumbered.

Also, I consider having all of your forces imprisoned a pretty utter defeat.

Originally Posted by Combatbulter

They were indirectly responsible, that the legion learned of the Dragon Soul, so that they would use it to bring Sargeras into the world, in the process freeing them all at once, so yes they used them as tools.

Again, you can't say they 'used them' if it coincided with his own plans.

Originally Posted by Combatbulter

Harbringer Skyriss also mentions the Old Gods are more powerful than the legion so what is your point?

My point is that they knew of each other. Again, which side thinks which could win is irrelevant.

Originally Posted by Combatbulter

The point being the old Gods battled the Titans before and many had been necessary to seal them, so given their experience their claim is not a foolish one.

Once again, I must point out that we do not know how many Titans were involved, nor do we know how difficult the war was.

Honestly, arguing they were hard to defeat is sort of silly considering the Titans could have just destroyed the planet.

1. It was heavily hinted that she might have been saved by the Old Gods when the Sundering happened.

2. She was pretty damned close to everything that was happening under the Maelstrom.

3. Naga live underwater, they shouldn't care less what Deathwing does as cataclysm on the ground.

4. The first expansion with truly underwater questing, Azshara isn't part of it as an important character?

5. Seriously?

1. Not hinted, she WAS saved. At the beginning of the Sundering she heard the whispers of the Old Gods, offering to save her and her people if she pledged loyalty to them.
2. Minding her own business or breeding plans that are not yet rdy to be implemented. She abducted Neptulon, possibly to siphon his power.
3. They both have the same boss; N'zoth. She doesn't care about what DW does since he's her ally. He burns the world down, she then floods it.
4. The chapter on Azshara is far from over or closed.
5. Yes.

Originally Posted by King Ragewing

Any relation? Does "dead" to an old God mean something other than what we know as dead? Was whoever said that quote specifically using the word dead to hint at some other meaning? Speculaaaationsss...

There was a blue post saying he was "quite dead". The Sha are his remains since the Titans basicly 'dismembered' that Old God.