23 Comments

Hmmm… I’m skeptical of the math used on that site. Based on the graphic (dang, don’t remember where I found it) that compared tax changes by income level, I would have expected a 75k Gross Adjusted Income family to be a small increase, and a $150K GAI family to be a significant increase. In fact, that site shows a $75k GAI family as a modest $478 cut, and a $150k GAI as a $3,923.76 cut.

I’ll go read up on the Tax Policy Center report that fuels the site to see what’s up.

That said, I am having a very good year, and will likely gross around $145k for 2008, and a GAI somewhere around $100k. I do expect that Obama will increase my tax rate, but I expect McCain to do the same. Obama will do it so the working class and working poor can get a break, McCain will do it to fund tax breaks for oil companies.

I can only hope that policy will be the main topic of the upcoming debates – instead of the last primary debate with George Steph. spending the first half on stupid things like “how come you don’t wear a flag pin”. There are great chasms of difference between the 2 candidates, & the American people deserve substance instead of fluff.

32 years younger than McCain- The reason the figures don’t match is that the graphic you saw divides the income levels differently than the actual tax plans do. That graphic lumps all people making over $111,646 together and says they’ll have to pay an average of $4,092 more in taxes. That may be true, but it combines several different tax brackets, some of which get an increase and some of which get a cut. People making between $112K and $161K would get an average tax cut of $2,204, while those making between $161K and $227K would get an average cut of $2,789, those making between $227K and $603K would get a tiny increase averaging $12, and those making more than $603K would get much larger increases, in the hundreds of thousands. Here’s an example of the sort of chart I’ve been getting this information from, which matches all the charts I’ve seen except for yours:

32 years younger than McCain — The reason the figures don’t match is that the graphic you’re referring to divides the various income levels differently than the actual tax plans do. It lumps all the people making more than $111,646 together and says they’ll pay and average of $4,092 more in taxes. That may be true, but it’s averaging the changes for several different tax brackets, some of which get increases and some of which get cuts. According to the charts I’ve seen, people making between $112K and $161K would get an average cut of $2,204, those making between $161K and $227K would get an average cut of $2,789, those making between $227K and $603K would get a minuscule average increase of $12, those making between $603K and $2.9 million would pay an average increase of $115,974, and those making more than $2.9 million would pay a much larger increase averaging $701,885.

The Obama Tax Cut site does seem to have made a slight mistake, showing a cut of $12 for those making between $227K and $603K instead of an increase, but since their data seems accurate otherwise I’d chalk that up to a typo.

I’ve tried three times now to post this with a link, but my post keeps disappearing, so if you want to check my data, Google “McCain Obama tax plan” and click the results from CNN and the Washington Post.

Diane- He is going to pay for it by allowing Bush’s tax cuts for the rich to expire, which will lead to them paying MUCH higher taxes. If you look around on the website 32 years younger than McCain got his graphic from, you’ll find a chart comparing the average change in taxes for all incomes combined. It shows that Obama’s plan would result in a small decrease in taxes overall, because of the offset from the rich having to pay higher taxes. McCain’s tax plan, on the other hand, would result in a much larger decrease in taxes overall, because he would cut taxes for absolutely everybody. You might want to ask where HE’S going to get the money.

Admin- Thank you SO MUCH for posting about this! It really drives me nuts when I hear people who I know aren’t in those high tax brackets say they’re voting for McCain because “Obama will raise taxes.” I’d hate for him to win the election because of people being misinformed about this.

I’ve read parts and pieces of the puzzle, but haven’t seen a straightforward explanation of the whole thing.

Diane, McCain’s plan reduces federal tax revenue by $500B — what spending is he going to cut to fund his tax plan?
You call ‘fuzzy math’ on the Obama numbers. Lyn did a fantastic job explaining the plan.
I call ‘smoke and mirrors’ on the McCain numbers. Can you explain how I’m wrong?

32 years younger than McCain- You’re welcome! I didn’t really explain the whole thing, because I didn’t want to make my post even longer than it already was, so I left out the lower tax brackets (since those weren’t included in the “over $111,646″ category). As far as those making less than $112K go, let’s just say that while the tax cuts aren’t as large as the ones for people making $112k-$227k, they’re significantly larger than the ones they’ll get from McCain.

Irene, get real – rich can’t afford to pay their taxes? The middle class & poor folks have been able to do it while the rich have taken a ride to buy more houses. You don’t have to worry about it unless you are one of the 5%.

Taxation will never discourage people from seeking wealth.
John McCain’s middle class friend (the one making $4,500,00.00 a year) still gets far more take-home pay than I ever will. Given the chance to trade places, I’d take his tax bracket over mine in a heartbeat.

If Obama wants to cut taxes for 95% of the people (which is amazing since less than 60% of people pay Federal taxes) why doesn’t he go ahead and do it? The president has no tax code writing authority. But Congress does. Aren’t Hillary, Obama, Biden and Rangel in charge over there? What’s the hold up?

Using the website calculator linked on this board, if you make 35,000 a year or less, you get more back with Obama then McCain. However, if you make between 35,000 and 75,000 for a family of 4 or more, you get far more back with McCain then Obama.

At first, I thought great, big bold letters show I’d save $478 a year with Obama. Then I read the little print under, and hidden with in, it showed under McCain my savings would be over $1000 dollars. Twice of Obama’s. I have a family of 5, AGI is about 60,000 a year ( I used both $50,000 and $75,000 on the calculator, McCain benefited me better under both options).

Lets face facts, most would say the middle class is income earners between 30,000 and 60,000 dollars. But I think higher up to $75,000 or even #100,000 for a two income family would be a better scale for the upper end of the middle class (for a family). $30,000 being the lower end. But lets realistically look at the numers right in the middle of the middle class.

If a husband makes $12 dollars an hour, and a wife makes $12 an hour, the family income is 50,000 a year, give or take. Right in the middle of the middle class as defined. Under McCain, they would see LESS TAXES than under Obama’s plan.

Now if your single and make $12 an hour, Obama is your man, as would be near $30,000, and the lower end of the middle class. But if you marry, and now your Family incomes doubles, to between $35,000 and $75,000 a year (both making around $12 an hour), McCain gives the middles middle class ($50,000 a year), and upper middle class (75,000 a year), more of a cut.

Of course if you are a union worker, with good union wages (20-40 dollars an hour),you are consider rich by Dems and Obama, and your taxes increase substantially. However, under McCain, they continue to drop.

Don’t believe me, crunch the numbers. Take a calculor, type in an hourly dollar amount, multiply by 2080 hours (annual number of work hours). Then plug it into the link. Then go beyond the hyped bold letters with Obama savings, and read the fine print, as they are hoping you won’t and will be mislead.

Yes, we can.

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