Re: War of the (Four) Roses: Single Barrel

Originally Posted by SMOWK

Why does anyone care so much about what others think about a whiskey? Four Roses...

Two reasons for me...
1.) As a newbie, my knowledge base benefits from the recommendations of others. Honestly, I don't even know what I don't know. So when I hear what others enjoy, I add it to my shopping list. Will the tasting notes of others sway by opinion? ...perhaps but not usually. Those who know me know that I make up my own mind. However, I am a strong believer in making an informed decision.
2.) My Jim Murray Bible toting, thumping friends could stand a smack down. When they quote the ratings of their whisky god, I simply pull up the posts of the wise, sage tasters on this forum. You guys are my Jim Murray.

Re: War of the (Four) Roses: Single Barrel

Originally Posted by Josh

It's a rookie mistake to assume that high age always equals high quality. The rye version of Vintage 17, ER 17, Pappys 20 & 23, 4R 100th anniversary 17 y/o are all among the most disappointing and dull whiskeys I have ever tasted.

I hear a lot of smack about ER17. You all should have a sip from my bottle because I just dont see/taste the issue. It tastes smooth and flavorful and actually different from Stagg. I have the 2011 release which should be the worst by most acounts and i have the 2010 GTS open. They're just night and day.

I was almost certain all the BTAC is small batch, but they could be numerous small batches? That might account for why my ER17 tastes so good.

Re: War of the (Four) Roses: Single Barrel

I think your first mistake was assuming that it would be similar to Stagg based on similar rating number, and so when it didn't taste like your bourbon of choice, it was a let down.

You are exactly right! I was equating the ratings scale with taste profile. Never thought of it like that but I was expecting them to taste similar because of their high ratings. Alas, I'm afraid nothing can compare to my beloved George. Thanks for helping me think outside the (bourbon) box.

Re: War of the (Four) Roses: Single Barrel

Originally Posted by smgrey24

You are exactly right! I was equating the ratings scale with taste profile. Never thought of it like that but I was expecting them to taste similar because of their high ratings. Alas, I'm afraid nothing can compare to my beloved George. Thanks for helping me think outside my (bourbon) box.

If you're looking for something similar to Stagg I recommend Abraham Bowman 18 year bourbon. I've heard there are still some floating around the MD/VA area. I did a side-by-side a few weeks ago and the two are very similar (which is unsurprising given the Bowman's age, proof, and origin).

Re: War of the (Four) Roses: Single Barrel

Originally Posted by Bmac

I hear a lot of smack about ER17. You all should have a sip from my bottle because I just dont see/taste the issue. It tastes smooth and flavorful and actually different from Stagg. I have the 2011 release which should be the worst by most acounts and i have the 2010 GTS open. They're just night and day.

I was almost certain all the BTAC is small batch, but they could be numerous small batches? That might account for why my ER17 tastes so good.

Small Batch is really a completely meaningless term. ER, Stagg, Buffalo Trace, Old Charter, E.H. Taylor are all the same mashbill. So they make more from that mashbill than of any other one they make, or so I would guess.

I know a lot of people who like Er 17, and I have passed bottles of it I have found along to them. I think it's really dull. I feel the same way about Saz 18. I think your ER 17 tastes good to you because you are one of the people who like it. Different strokes for different folks!

Re: War of the (Four) Roses: Single Barrel

Originally Posted by Josh

It's a rookie mistake to assume that high age always equals high quality. The rye version of Vintage 17, ER 17, Pappys 20 & 23, 4R 100th anniversary 17 y/o are all among the most disappointing and dull whiskeys I have ever tasted. Don't get me wrong, I'm a fan of age statements, but one of the great things about bourbon is that there are some very tasty options at single digit ages and in the NAS category.

I loved the 100th Anniversary bottle I had. It was one of my first 4R experiences, and I savored every last drop of the bottle. I'm find the 120th to be much, much more stiff - I'm holding out for it to open up over time.

I'm starting to learn that I like certain 4R profiles more than others, namely I prefer the bottlings that surprise me with flavors you don't normally find in bourbon. I prefer the exotic to the more classic lip-smackers like the 2010 LESmB.

I think there can be a fair amount of variation in the LE1B offerings.

"A man comes from the dust and in the dust he will end-- In the meantime it is good to drink whiskey."
-->WhiskeyWonka<--

Re: War of the (Four) Roses: Single Barrel

Originally Posted by AaronWF

I loved the 100th Anniversary bottle I had. It was one of my first 4R experiences, and I savored every last drop of the bottle. I'm find the 120th to be much, much more stiff - I'm holding out for it to open up over time.

I'm starting to learn that I like certain 4R profiles more than others, namely I prefer the bottlings that surprise me with flavors you don't normally find in bourbon. I prefer the exotic to the more classic lip-smackers like the 2010 LESmB.

I think there can be a fair amount of variation in the LE1B offerings.

Well put and I completely agree about the variations and the exotic flavors. I didn't mean to imply that I thought only rookies like old bourbons. What I meant to say was that drawing a straight line between age and "goodness" is an easy mistake to make when starting out.

Re: War of the (Four) Roses: Single Barrel

Originally Posted by Josh

Small Batch is really a completely meaningless term. ER, Stagg, Buffalo Trace, Old Charter, E.H. Taylor are all the same mashbill. So they make more from that mashbill than of any other one they make, or so I would guess.

Wow, that's a a lot of product that uses Mash Bill #1. So, I should be able to taste a similarity with Old Charter 8yr to ER17?

Originally Posted by Josh

I know a lot of people who like Er 17, and I have passed bottles of it I have found along to them. I think it's really dull. I feel the same way about Saz 18. I think your ER 17 tastes good to you because you are one of the people who like it. Different strokes for different folks!

Re: War of the (Four) Roses: Single Barrel

FRSB just became available here north of the border. I enjoy it and as far as pricepoint goes it's better than almost anything available here.

I like to read the odd whiskey review for the taste profile, I know what appeals to me...I don't really care so much about the number it's given. I have noticed that brands put the highest review they get to promote their product. Corner Creek was given a 92 by the BTI...and most would rate this much lower I'm sure.

Re: War of the (Four) Roses: Single Barrel

Jim Murray is just another guy with another opinion. His opinion may not reflect yours or anyone else's as we all have different palates.

Personally 4R1B is my all time favorite regular offering. It's smooth, balanced, refined and tastes damn good. Stagg is too intense to be a session drinker and I consider it more of a novelty than anything else.