Reminder: You Don't Compete With Piracy By Being Lame, The DVD Edition

from the fbi-warning dept

It's a point we've tried to make over and over again: you don't compete with "piracy" by offering a product that's a lot worse. And yet, so many people do. A bunch of you have sent over the following image that highlights this in the DVD world (tragically, no one seems to know who made this image -- but if anyone knows, please tell us in the comments and we'll add it to the post). It shows how an unauthorized downloaded copy of The Matrix lets you start watching it immediately. But if you purchase the legitimate DVD, it forces you to sit through multiple FBI warnings and multiple trailers for other movies, with no ability to skip past them. It's humorous, but the point it makes is really important. When your product is less valuable (and yes, that includes being more annoying) than the unauthorized alternatives, you're going to be hard pressed to get people to agree to pay you for your product.

Re:

Maybe true. Also bad. But most of us go to see a movie in the theatre once.

When we buy a DVD, we are forced to go through the above gauntlet Every. F'n. Time.

And don't forget that the DVD menu screen draws itself up slowly as part of some douchbag's high-school art project. Those menu screens have all the badness of a Flash-based website: Skip intro. Skip intro. Where's the @#$@ skip intro button?

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That doesn't make it less true.

I'm having this exact experience with a TV series I bought on BluRay.

My HD downloads had all the useless warnings and crap stripped of, and were easy browsable. Now that I have teh blurays, I have to sit through warning carp before EVERY EPISODE!!! and its much harder to browse through and skip intros etc.

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What the chart leaves out is that when you pirate movies, you don't even have to get up and find the DVD, then insert it into your DVD player.
It's already on the hard drive, you can just double click the icon, and it plays. No effort at all. It's wonderful.

Re: MGM Home Television Distribution ?

I was recently watching something from my disk and it started with 'MGM Home Television Distribution'... Hmmm... not really applicable I thought, but still they get away with the claim that they provided the distribution.

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That is an excellent point that's rarely brought up. When speaking of pirated video games and movies specifically there's a huge advantage in being able to switch and load titles without having to leave the couch. It's the difference between a physical library and a digital one.

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"I had no idea that the other half lived with such trivial lollygagging frivolity"

It matters when you've paid for a DVD and the maker has decided to control and dictate how you, as the paying consumer, enjoy and use the DVD. I care more about other things, like local and state politics, but that doesn't mean I can't also get irked by these smaller things.

Liberate your media and take control of it.

> and here I am getting annoyed when I have to fast forward
> through the theme song for every episode of a tv series
> i'm trying to get through
>
> I had no idea that the other half lived with such trivial
> lollygagging frivolity

My HTPC video player has a set of Tivo style buttons that do instant replay and 30-second skip. These are very handy for jumping through those annoying extra opening & closing credits.

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Ummm, last time I checked there are no DMCA police inside my house. What I do inside my home is my business. I did not say rip the DVD and post it to the internet. I said rip it for personal use. Unless your kid has a crazy 'school can spy on you' laptop (thankfully mine does not) then what is the issue?

While it may be technically against the DMCA, what the DMCA does not know will not hurt it.

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What I do inside my home is my business.

I'm always amazed at people who think that the law doesn't apply "insider their own home", "on private property", an so on. I suggest you go to a prison and ask the inmates there how many of them are there because of things they did in "their own homes" or "on private property". I think you'll find that the law does indeed apply to those places.

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I think the GP was meaning that unlike some things (drugs, pimping, etc) the police don't show up and inspect your computer hard drive to see if it has ripped movies on it. While still illegal it has a very very low enforcement rate. so low in fact that I'm willing to bet that if a cop came into my house and saw the matix playing he/she would not even ask if it's a legal copy. They would simply ignore it or ask for it to be turned off, or say, hey cool movie.

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Fine, but should you have any reason for external authorities to access your premises, you face potential prosecution. Say you have a fire or the IRS audits you or a city worker knocks on your door to ask if you have any unlicensed pets (yes, happened to us). They are at your door, see "something strange" and invoke other authorities.

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Last time I checked ripping a DVD for personal use does not send you to jail. I did not say 'make crack' or 'make meth' or 'rape someone' inside your home. There is a big difference between things that send you to prison and format shifting a DVD ( DVDs ARE LEGAL AND YOU PAID FOR IT ).

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Last time I checked ripping a DVD for personal use does not send you to jail.

you probably won't go to jail for it, but circumventing a copy protection mechanism is still illegal. that's the point. even if you bought the DVD legally and ripped for strictly personal use, and even tough there is most likely no way you will ever get caught, you are still breaking the law.

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Check the post from Henry Emrich (its here on this page but I'll go ahead and repost it for you). Read carefully:

This is where the whole "mass civil disobedience" thing comes in:

In reality, it's only a "law" to the extent that it can be enforced. The multinational corporate megaliths absolutely *love* the idiotic little drones who actually take pride in being "law abiding", irrespective of the *content* of any particular law.

And, ultimately, that's the problem. Laws "criminalizing" homosexuality only "worked" to the extent that gay people failed to stand up, and fight back. (Look it up: The Stonewall riots.)

So if you're stupid enough to take pride in mindlessly complying with any and all "laws", then I'll say it again: you *deserve* to have multinational corporate megaliths/government functionaries exert draconian control over any and every aspect of your existence, because you ALLOW them to do so, without protesting, fighting back, or monkeywrenching the system itself into oblivion.

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> 'm always amazed at people who think that the law doesn't apply
> "insider their own home", "on private property", an so on.

Well, since there's no such thing as "the law", that might be the source of your confusion. Some laws do apply to private property and others do not.

For example, the civil rights laws forbid me from discriminating against people based on their race in places of public accommodation, but they do not apply to people's private homes. If I run a cafe, I can't ban all Hispanics from the premises, but I can certainly be as racist as I like in my own home and forbid any Latino from setting foot in my house. That may make me a repugnant person but "that law" does not apply to me in my home.

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Have you ever crossed the street where there is no cross walk, you know jaywalked?

Have you ever driven your car faster than the speed limit?

Have you ever failed to use the turn signal in your car?

You would probably agree that all of those things are easy to do, that we all do them occationally (intentionally or otherwise) and that its not a big deal. For the most part, if your act is not causing a problem for someone else, you will get away with it too. These things do not make us hard core criminals that need to go to prison.

When I pay for a DVD and I choose not to watch the movie from the disc itself but to rip it, to my Media PC for easier access, that is ok. There is no lost sale. I can't buy the movie in the format that I want it in. I purchased the DVD and I'm only going to purchase the movie in one format. I purchased one copy and I use one copy. I did nothing wrong or out of the ordinary. Space-shifting/Format-shifting for personal use is not a crime.

Re: (rip it yourself)

"Well, if you buy the DVD you can always rip it and remove the crap part yourself. Its for personal use, do whatever you want with it."

I hope that was sarcastic. I tried doing that legitimately. I went out and bought software from a retail store that would allow me to do that. Installed it, it worked great. A few months later, had to reload Windows on my box. No problem, I still have the software. Attempted to install. Uhoh. It needs to authenticate to a license server, which no longer exists, because the MPAA sued the software maker out of existance. It was DVD X Copy and 321 Studios. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/DVD_X_Copy

Never again. Guess I just use software from a company based outside the US, or download the pirated version. At least until the MPAA figures out that pissing off customer who want to follow the law, but still enjoy thier products in a way that works for them, is a bad idea.

Fast forward five years. I hear RealNetworks is releasing a legitimate DVD backup utility. Guess what happened? Yep, same thing. They got sued and the software isn't available.

If I am stuck breaking the law in order to enjoy a DVD, even when I purchased a legal version, what incentive is there to attempt to follow the law in the first place? http://xkcd.com/488/

Re: Re: (rip it yourself)

it gets worse than that, watch a dvd that uses CSS on linux. Unless someone has started selling a dvd player for linux in the last 4+ years, you have to start by cracking the encryption (DMCA violation) to watch the shiny disk. So at that point i might as well rip it to the hard disk.

Re: Re: (rip it yourself)

Re: Re: (rip it yourself)

> I hope that was sarcastic. I tried doing that
> legitimately. I went out and bought software from a
> retail store that would allow me to do that. Installed
> it, it worked great. A few months later, had to reload
> Windows on my box. No problem, I still have the software.
> Attempted to install. Uhoh. It needs to authenticate to a
> license server, which no longer

Or you could have just downloaded a copy of AnyDVD from the web.

Alternatively, you could have used any number of gratis and shareware tools without this limitation including the "dump" option of mplayer.

Sure you can intentionally make things more difficult than they really need to be. Although I find it hilarious that this "phone home" style software left you with unusuable files when the whole point of the exercise is to completely free you of that sort of nonsense.

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This is where the whole "mass civil disobedience" thing comes in:

In reality, it's only a "law" to the extent that it can be enforced. The multinational corporate megaliths absolutely *love* the idiotic little drones who actually take pride in being "law abiding", irrespective of the *content* of any particular law.

And, ultimately, that's the problem. Laws "criminalizing" homosexuality only "worked" to the extent that gay people failed to stand up, and fight back. (Look it up: The Stonewall riots.)

So if you're stupid enough to take pride in mindlessly complying with any and all "laws", then I'll say it again: you *deserve* to have multinational corporate megaliths/government functionaries exert draconian control over any and every aspect of your existence, because you ALLOW them to do so, without protesting, fighting back, or monkeywrenching the system itself into oblivion.

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It's bigger than "how the U.S. got started".

It's a basic fact that the *worst* aspects of every political regime can only continue because the vast majority of the populace don't stand up against such things --- EVEN IF doing so involves "breaking the law".

According to the Chinese government, the Tien-an-Men Square protesters were engaging in "illegal" activity. So was anybody involved with the abolitionist or "Underground Railroad" movements that helped runaway slaves escape. (hell, that has a lot of parallels to the copyright thing, because slave-"owners" were always bitching about how anti-slavery folks were "depriving them of their property", etc.

Anybody who thinks being "law-abiding" is, in and of itself, a mark of virtue, is nothing but an enabler of the *worst* aspects of whatever political regime he or she happens to live under.

Re: DRM circumvention for personal use

On the other hand, the DMCA makes circumventing copy protection a criminal act. But according to section 1201(c), "Nothing in this section shall affect rights, remedies, limitations, or defenses to copyright infringement, including fair use, under this title."

According to these laws, circumventing a DVD's encoding should be legal, as long as it's for personal use only. Too bad the courts don't seem to think so.

Flickr is a photo sharing site

You're supposed to link back to the Flickr photo page when embedding images from the site. The Flickr sharing philosophy is long-established, and this is one of the few requirements they have. It really isn't a photo hosting site.

I've seen accounts get deleted over issues like this, in which case all these embedded images would disappear and you'd have to edit the original blog posts to fix them. Best way to prevent that from happening is to include back to the Flickr photopage, link when embedding images from the site.

Re: Flickr is a photo sharing site

Re: Re: Flickr is a photo sharing site

see how that links to the floorsixtyfour page? and floor64 is the company, techdirt being the blog. Meaning he probably doesnt have to link back to his own flickr site, just wanted to know who created the original, not a misguided lecture on netiquette. afaik.

Re: Re: Re: Flickr is a photo sharing site

You do have to link back to the photopage on Flickr.com, per their rules. It's also supposed to be a place to share images that you've created, not a place to host graphics that you found elsewhere on the web.

I don't really care. But Techdirt should, since Flickr might delete the account for:
1) Uploading images that they didn't create;
2) Posting images on a commercial site without linking back;
3) The general commercial nature/ purpose of the account.

Better that they host the graphics themselves than to use Flickr. With the amount of traffic that Techdirt gets, there's a fair chance that Flickr will notice.

Flickr is a photo sharing site

You're supposed to link back to the Flickr photo page when embedding images from the site. The Flickr sharing philosophy is long-established, and this is one of the few requirements they have. It really isn't a photo hosting site.

I've seen accounts get deleted over issues like this, in which case all these embedded images would disappear and you'd have to edit the original blog posts to fix them. Best way to prevent that from happening is to include back to the Flickr photopage, link when embedding images from the site.

Forgot some

The author of the piece forgot to include the series of unskippable legal disclaimers (usually in four different languages) about how the views expressed in the commentaries are not those of the studio, etc.

Now shoot your other foot.

I have a doctor friend who can easily afford to rent or buy DVDs, no problem, and used to do so all the time. Yet, he has recently begun to buy bootleg DVDs from a patient of his instead: not to save money, but just so that he doesn't have to sit through all the crap on the studio disks. His time is just too valuable for that (and he's not the only one). Way to go, Hollywood.

Re: Trailers

> if you cannot skip trailers in the movie theater why would you
> be able to do so in your home theater

It's gotten so bad that I just put the DVD in the player, hit mute, then go into the kitchen and start preparing my snacks. By the time I'm done 10-15 minutes later, the disc has run through all its unskippable trailers and warnings and threats and disclaimers and is waiting patiently for me on the Menu screen. I press "play" and settle in.

Re: Re: Trailers

One criticism

I realize this is a critique of the experience of viewing all the slog on commercial DVDs, but this diagram leaves out the other legitimate options of PURCHASING a digital download of the movie from Amazon or iTunes movie store (minus some of the DVD extras and behind-the-scenes fluff). Another point I'd make is that many premium or special collector's editions DVDs don't have all these extraneous previews and trailers, though they come at a premium price.

Re: One criticism

Not really a criticism. What you're saying is that by paying more for the product that you *own* (iTunes is invariable much more expensive than a DVD), you're allowed to watch it without being lectured about not "pirating" it. At which point does this make sense for legitimate customers?

The DVD Magically Appears

Of course, the DVD in that example apparently just magically appears in your DVD player.

If it were honest, it should also outline all the steps you need to go through to download it and put it on the DVD or rip it from a legit disk. Such as install a torrent client, configure it, find your movie, decide where to download it from, downloading it, make sure it's not infected with spyware or viruses, putting it on DVD and starting to watch it.

Seem like watching a trailer or two would actually take less time.

The graphic makes a point and does so cleverly, but it's not particularly honest about it.

Re: Re: The DVD Magically Appears

I don't think it's dishonest. The graphic is about the customer experience. The source of the DVD isn't discussed in either case. While there's a good chance someone torrented the dvd at some point, the source could just as easily be a friend or even some guy in a parking lot.

Re: Re: The DVD Magically Appears

If you want to be an ass:
DVD:
Get in your car > drive to store > find parking > get into fight with person who stole your spot > find new parking spot > park > walk into store > skip the over priced new releases and head over to the $5.00 bin > fight the fat lady and her 3 kids for access to said $5.00 bin > find a movie worth purchasing > get in line > wait > wait > wait > pay > return to cashier who rang it up at the original price of $15.99 > get into fight with manager > finally get everything situated and go home > unwrap DVD > curse when I hurt my finger nail trying to remove the security tape > put in DVD > DVD is defective > return back to store > discover store wont take returns on opened DVDs > cries > goes home > becomes pirate

Re: Re: Re: The DVD Magically Appears

Wow. You might want to take shopping lessons. While I rarely buy DVDs and don't make a special trip, when I am already out for other things, say, at Costco, it' just goes into the cart with other things I'd be shopping for anyway. If unwrapping a DVD causes you that much trouble, it might be the least of your problems.

Re: Re: Re: Re: The DVD Magically Appears

Bought any dvds lately? It takes me 3-5 minutes and two knives I keep just for the occasion to open modern movie and game dvd packages. Let's look at my dvd for star trek online, for example.

- Shiny outer wrap.
- Slipcover sealed in 4 separate places.
- Remove slipcover.
- DVD box sealed in 3 places.
- Open DVD box.
- Try to remove DVD without breaking it from one of those horribly grabby little stubs that have no depression button to release the DVD and seem designed to never let anything escape their grasp.

Obnoxiously sealed packaging that is difficult to open has been a long-standing and high-profile complaint for years. Anyone who has had to open a dvd in the last 10 years will laughingly acknowledge how aggravating the experience was. Don't try to pretend the whole thing doesn't exist with a snotty little "well then you have bigger problems" fallacy. It just makes you look like a jerk who is incapable of rational discourse.

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So, what you're saying is: you don't even specifically "decide" to buy DVD's, you just buy them when you're "out for other things?"

Damn, an actual, self-identified "impulse buyer". I suppose you also buy DVD's of films you've never seen before (either at the theater, on TV, or rented from a video store)?

Your attempt to refute the blindingly-obvious facts pointed out by the article was pretty shaky. Your understanding of how to use BitTorrent was even worse. But the fact that you seem to actually take pride in being the sort of totally thoughtless "consumer" who doesn't even *think* about what he/she buys, and just gets stuff on impulse....wow.

Re: Re: Re: The DVD Magically Appears

Re: Re: The DVD Magically Appears

Of course I'm honest about criticizing it. Put all those steps you outlined into the graphic, and you'll have a good comparison. Most people don't have a problem with shopping for a DVD or opening their mail box to get a Netflix mailer.

Re: Re: Re: The DVD Magically Appears

Of course I'm honest about criticizing it.

It would be true if you didn't follow with...

Most people don't have a problem with shopping for a DVD or opening their mail box to get a Netflix mailer.

You are being dense on purpose, as you know that it takes longer than just opening the mail box to get a movie. Unless you have a magical one that you walk up to, wish for a movie and all of a sudden it's there! Every one of your "counterpoints" was countered and the best defense you've got so far is that your way of being anonymous is somehow more honest. Way to go.

Re: The DVD Magically Appears

And what about getting in the car, going to the store, buying the movie, bringing it home, ripping off those little damn tabs, and the impossible-to-remove-without-damaging-the-package "security" tape things, then popping the disk out of the case... there's a lot ignored in the acquisition in both cases. Because this post is simply about WATCHING the movie, not getting it. Stop being stupid.

Re: The DVD Magically Appears

If it were honest, it should also outline all the steps you need to go through to download it and ... blah blah blah...

Except you don't have to do all that. There's a guy who comes around to my office about once a week offering bootleg DVDs out of the trunk of his car. That's even easier and fewer steps than going to the store to buy a DVD. (last time I checked, Best Buy and Walmart didn't offer free delivery)

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Now who's making accusations without foundation!

Not me. Why, did you think that something that I said accurately described you? If so, then it wasn't without foundation, was it?

Mike knows who I am.

How? I've seen the process for registering here and it certainly doesn't include identity verification. You could register as the Queen of England if you wanted to. And I certainly don't know who you are, so as far as I'm concerned, you're anonymous.

On the other hand, Mike can see my IP address, so does that make me non-anonymous in your book? What a joke.

Let me ask you directly: do you buy pirated DVDs? Do you support selling pirated DVDs from the trunk of a car?

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Not me. Why, did you think that something that I said accurately described you? If so, then it wasn't without foundation, was it?

You quite perceptively observed that "LostSailor" isn't my real name, but you also accused me of registering with a false identity, without foundation. Unless you've hacked into my registration files...

How? I've seen the process for registering here and it certainly doesn't include identity verification.

I never said it did, but you're making assumptions. I simply said Mike knows who I am.

Direct answer: No, and no. Apologize now?

Well, I'm heartily glad to hear it. I'll even be charitable and believe it. And, yes, you can apologize any time you like.

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but you also accused me of registering with a false identity, without foundation.

No, I said that that would not be an honest thing to do in explaining why I didn't do it. I didn't actually say that you *did*, and now you've been caught lying about what I said again. I don't know what makes you think you can get away with it when anyone can look up above to see what was actually said. I sure am glad Techdirt doesn't let people to go back and edit their posts.

Unless you've hacked into my registration files...

I don't know what would make you think something like that. You really have a "vivid" imagination.

I never said it did, but you're making assumptions. I simply said Mike knows who I am.

What assumptions would that be? I'm quite aware that I don't know how Mike knows your identity, which is why I asked "how?" (which I note, you still haven't answered). Can you not read?

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1. If you "don't expect anyone here to get the little joke", then why bother using a "clever" handle? Is it some kind of weird, inside-joke between you and the voices in your head, or what?
(Or -- and this is actually quite plausible, given recent events here on Techdirt -- are "you" merely another of "The sockpuppeting troll formerly known as TAM"'s sock-puppet ID's? There's something about the mix of inane quibbling, deliberate "misunderstanding" of the article to which you're replying, and self-congratulation about the fact that you're a "law-abiding" type of person who impulse-buys DVD's at Costco, and would *never* complain about stuff like being forced to sit through trailers and previews and crap -- EVEN AFTER HAVING "bought" the DVD itself!

I mean seriously....is that you, TAM? Haven't seen much of you lately. Did you have an accident with that "morning cofee", or just get frustrated at your own inability to spel "Metallica", and smash your keyboard?

Re: The DVD Magically Appears

Then you'd also have to add; get in your car, start car, drive to store, turn car off, get out of car, walk into the store, find dvd area, find dvd, take dvd to checkout, pay for dvd, leave store, walk to car, get in car, start car, drive home, turn car off, go into your house, SPEND TEN FLIPPING MINUTES TRYING TO UNWRAP THE DVD!!... and then finally starting on that graphic... "insert dvd".

Re: The DVD Magically Appears

Yeah, it's not like the damn DVD is wrapped in plastic, has a security seal on three sides, and locking clips you have to get through before you even get at the DVD. Before that, I had to go to the store, mull over which movie to get, take it to the checkout, wait in line behind the flatulent obese couple, pay for it, wait for the manager to clear the transaction because the clerk did it wrong, and then finally take it home!

Re: The DVD Magically Appears

Well if i am to use your logic then, on the legit copy side we would have to add the parts:Get a job-> Checking our bank accounts for money->go to our car-> Make sure it has gas->Drive to the store->buy the movie->return home-> remove the plastic->remove all three of the stickers that hold the dvd shut->pry open the case->insert movie.....
lol

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Re: Re: Re: The DVD Magically Appears

Way to willfully miss the point,

So, I'll explain it;
The downloading of the pirated version of the movie is much more trivial in both actual time spent and actual effort expended than going to the store & getting a legit copy.
PLUS everything that the graphic points out.

Re: Re: Re: Re: The DVD Magically Appears

For the vast majority of people, going to a store is a normal part of life; most people aren't scared of or put out by shopping.

You also miss the point that you could just as easily go to your mailbox to get your latest Netflix delivery. You also miss the point that you could get the same movie legitimately streamed to your computer or TV. You also miss the point that for most people, getting movies by torrents is not as easy as it is for you.

You can argue from you one-sided perspective, but that doesn't make it true. Okay, maybe it's true you're annoyed by trailers, but not everyone is.

I'm just looking for a little balance in this discussion; it seems in short supply.

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Okay so, because you are already at the store it doesn't count? Interesting, by that same argument, I am already on the internet and it takes me literally less than 15 seconds to find and set a movie to download and less than 5 minutes to download and watch. Roughly 6 minutes in total vs. days from amazon vs. roughly an hour at walmart, which doesn't have food like some SuperWallies do so I would be making a special trip all to be told you are a criminal if you chose to watch this movie in any way other that the way the creator intended, which I might add is completely against the original point of copyright. But you seem to live in a different reality than the real world SailorMoon. The only unfortunate thing is you seem to find your way here. So why don't you take your trolling thoughts to the RIAA sponsored site since they wouldn't approve of you being here and you'd like to do things like a good little toady. Also, a pseudonym is only used to remain anonymous you asshat. That's why women wrote with male names. The only times a pseudonym is when the person becomes too popular or if the original name was meant to be remembered a la Rip Torn.

Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: The DVD Magically Appears

So, don't go to the store, if that's not your thing. Order from Amazon, stream it from Netflix.

all to be told you are a criminal if you chose to watch this movie in any way other that the way the creator intended, which I might add is completely against the original point of copyright.

Actually, that's not entirely true. Part of the purpose and mechanism of copyright is intended to do just that. Whether that's good or bad is another discussion. You seem to feel you're entitled to content in any way you want to feel entitled.

Also, a pseudonym is only used to remain anonymous you asshat./i>

Whatever you say "AW".

Though it always amazes me that folks in comments here are just so damn angry when confronted with even a hint of a differing opinion. Almost petulant.

Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: The DVD Magically Appears

Part of the purpose and mechanism of copyright is intended to do just that.

I knew that copyright law gave copyright holders certain rights concerning copying, distribution, and the creation of derivative works, but I didn't know that choosing the way someone looks at the work was one of them. Could you please quote the part of the US Constitution that says so?

Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: The DVD Magically Appears

Ah, the old 'if the exact words aren't in the Constitution, the law doesn't exist' gambit.

Copyright law isn't in the Constitution, that document merely provides the fundamental basis for copyright legislation to be enacted by Congress. And Congress has allowed copyright holders to restrict your use of copyrighted content, including, in some instances, viewing options on movies.

(1) to reproduce the copyrighted work in copies or phonorecords;
(2) to prepare derivative works based upon the copyrighted work;
(3) to distribute copies or phonorecords of the copyrighted work to the public by sale or other transfer of ownership, or by rental, lease, or lending;
(4) in the case of literary, musical, dramatic, and choreographic works, pantomimes, and motion pictures and other audiovisual works, to perform the copyrighted work publicly;
(5) in the case of literary, musical, dramatic, and choreographic works, pantomimes, and pictorial, graphic, or sculptural works, including the individual images of a motion picture or other audiovisual work, to display the copyrighted work publicly; and
(6) in the case of sound recordings, to perform the copyrighted work publicly by means of a digital audio transmission.

Now, I don't see the right to control how people look at a work anywhere in there, but perhaps I'm over looking it. Could you please point it out for us?

Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: The DVD Magically Appears

So... you're argument is that we should just sit down and follow every rule that makes it into law, no matter how unjust and immoral the actual law is? How are those slaves and segregation working out for you?

Civil disobedience is sometimes needed before a law will be changed, as a way to make a point in whatever form, whether it be protest, not recognising a law or even descending into violence. Especially against Governments who seem intent on only listening to one group over another that does not represent societies best interest.

1. That's where the *mass* aspect of MASS civil disobedience comes in. Make it prohibitively expensive, time-consuming, intrusive, and downright onerous in general for those "in power" to actually enforce the "laws" bought by their corporate cronies.

2. As to 'consequences", where the fuck are the "consequences" for the multinational corporate megaliths buying 11 copy"right" term extensions over the last thirty years (much less, their cronies in government?)
I don't see *any* evidence of you "obey the law *because* it's the law" types *EVER* actually addressing the fact that the "consequences" go BOTH ways.

Should those *forced* into the Warsaw Ghetto (and the death-camps that followed) simply, placidly fallen into line and been "law-abiding" *because* it was "the law?"

Sometimes the worst "consequences" arise, simply from OBEDIENCE TO "THE LAW" ITSELF. That's how oppressive regimes continue to function -- not merely by terrorizing the recalcitrant among their subjects, but *more* by training those subjects in the belief that uncomplaining subjugation is a virtue.

Of course, it's not surprising that a rabid "law = virtue" type such as yourself would ALSO be an apologist for copyright "law".

Re: Re: The DVD Magically Appears

While exploits of this kind are very rare, it *is* possible to unleash a trojan if the application loading your innocuous data is vulnerable to certain kinds of attacks. Witness the death of the notion "You can't get a virus from a picture" after Microsoft's famous JPEG library buffer overflow exploit reached the wild.

I don't know offhand of any such exploits in the wild for movie files though, probably because of the complexity and diversity of the available codecs, containers, and players.

Re: The DVD Magically Appears

This may be true, but I could easily find and download a copy of the matrix in several hours at the most.

Example:
searched "the matrix torrent" in google

downloaded torrent (actually a collection of all three movies) from first two results, the seeds combined from both

time remaining: 2 hours

Compare to driving to store, finding the matrix trilogy (its an older movie set now), paying likely $49.95 for the box set, getting home, finding out it was a junky store that sold region 2 dvds, blah blah blah

the list goes on. The point is, all of this crap is useless.

If I bought a DVD (which I never would), its already known that I didnt/wouldnt pirate it. Therefore, why put 10 minutes of warnings, why make region DRM, why make ANY DRM at all.

If I was going to pirate it, I never would have seen the warnings. Makes no sense

put it where it belongs

All that crap needs to go at the end of the movie, not the beginning. The FBI warning has never prevented anyone on the planet from copying a movie, and if it must be there for legal reasons (I suspect not) then stick it after the movie so you can at least say it's on the disc. It's crap crap crap.

Re: put it where it belongs

Thanks to this very site, I've put some thought into why DRM is often used. Consider that DRM is there, not as a way to prevent copying, but simply a mechanism to create a law that publishers can enforce. I refuse to believe that there is a thinking person alive who thinks DRM is about copy protection. It's about being able to ENFORCE punishment. If publishers didn't include DRM, how could they justify suing customers and winning? Publishers must show that they're doing SOMETHING to prevent people from using content in the way they want by putting some sort of restrictions that if circumvented a law is being broken. Next, make global IP laws such that no matter where you live, you are breaking the law by circumventing DRM. This, my friends, is what I think DRM is all about. Expand this thought to licensing playback hardware and now publishers not only control content through consumers, but also by making manufacturers adhere to ridiculous limitations and they make money by licensing the ability to playback content.

This is nothing short of an enormous scam. Publishers make money from enforcing draconian IP laws, creating a scarcity (where is there is none) and then limit manufacturer’s ability to create hardware consumers want to buy. It seems to me that publishers go to enormous lengths to avoid giving consumers what they want. I’ve simply stopped consuming. No HDTV for me, no Blu-ray, I’ve stopped buying DVDs because like most everyone here has already said, we’re not getting what we want. The verdict? And we won’t anytime soon.

They also didn't put in...walking to your car, getting in it, buckling your seat belt, driving to the store, going into the store, finding your dvd, waiting in line, getting back in your car and driving home...

seems like a fair trade off to me.

Or do you just sit on your couch, wave money and the dvd of your choosing magically appears in your hand?

I have one DVD..

I have one DVD in my collection that plays the movie immediately upon inserting it, and that is The Blues Brothers Special Edition.

Someone may have mentioned it, but "Disney Fast Play" is the biggest crock there is. All it does is automatically play the movie.. AFTER it plays all of the above mentioned stuff. That means it eliminates one click on your remote. Ridiculous.

Legal copying.

I quite often dump a ripped version of a legit DVD onto the hard drive for the very reason shown.
I store copies of the legal movies I've bought, onto the drive and can select what I want.
Running 2 x 1TB drives in the entertainment system lets me store a few hundred movies, music and games and other info with immediate access from any computer.
Illegal? probably but I have the originals. (Grey area!)
Cutting out the adverts, and extra crap means full movies take less than 4 gig a piece. (I've got approximately 40 movies at the moment and barely touched the space avaialble.)
I can watch movies when I want, without the propoganda and adverts.! AND I can stream to any devive in the house.

hes sees it as safer

teh guy most likely doing it is like a dope dealer or gangster or other "solid" type that would goto prison without saying who he sold anything too.

ALSO it costs less in time and people will pay 5$ a dvdr with just the movie on it
funny cause they only cost 1$ each

i have huge selection of dvdrips but do not sell but people have asked the worst ill do is have them pay for the disk or give me one
one could argue that if you think of a job being paid 4$ for the technical know how, the cost of dling and storage and then the blank disc and the risk of getting caught is why you see 5 or so bucks.
BRING acta in and get rid of file sharing and your going to have people like this a lot more and tell me how they gonna know everyone doing it?
they wont
they ant afford the coppers
so they will target those they know of who are vocal or against there polices like abuse of power its going ot be a law of convenience

Re: Found the Author

The graphic also misses out on region coding. For instance, if you live in North America and you want to watch the version of Revolver that doesn't completely suck (ie, the UK version), you have to go to a giant hassle to get a UK copy of the DVD (not sold in most North American stores, and if you order online they may very well do a swap and give you the North America version), and then crack the region coding to make it play. But, if you just download it, you're probably getting the UK version--pirates prefer to share the better version.

Yes, as a matter of fact

"Ah, the old 'if the exact words aren't in the Constitution, the law doesn't exist' gambit. "

You know, I'm getting pretty sick of your smug attitude and dismissal of all other dissent. YES, as a matter of GOD DAMN fact, exact fucking words DO fucking matter in fucking law. They are called "legalities" and in some cases, "technicalities" but they DO FUCKING MATTER. See also the 1st, 4th, and 5th amendments, where wording and specificity DO MATTER VERY MUCH.

And before you dismiss YET ANOTHER VALID POINT, yes, the cursing is necessary, because sometimes you have to hit people in the FACE to get them to see a god damn point.

Re: Yes, as a matter of fact

Re: Re: Yes, as a matter of fact

RD:

It's probably just "TAMhole" fucking with us again. He's already admitted to creating numerous sock-puppet accounts for just that reason, and, if you read his drivel, it bears a strong resemblance to his idiocy.

TAM's "responses" usually consisted of:

1. Dismissing whatever he was replying to on the grounds that it "isn't really that bad" (whatever "it" happens to be -- from runaway copyright term extension, to re-monopolizing formerly "Public Domain" content, etc.)

Pain in the Ass DVD's

The sad thing about that picture is that some DVD's over the last several years have been exactly that bad.

Over the last several years I've built up collection of about 1,000 DVD's, mostly re-releases of old 1950's and 1960's movies (every John Wayne movie for example), but also a whole lot of new movies. After a while I got extremely pissed off at DVD's I bought that matched the profile shown by that picture.

When I buy a DVD that's pretty much like the one described in that picture, I create/burn 10 edited copies, CD/DVD labels, and package them. Just so know, copying/editing a DVD is ridiculously simple. Then I give them away to whoever wants the movie. I've been doing that for about 3 years now.

Does it cost the movie companies money, you bet, that's the whole purpose of the exercise even if it is penny ante. My business partner and I, before we retired, used to call this type of thing an asshole tax, applied when we had to put up with jerks.

Is giving the copies away illegal, oh hell yes (making copies of your legally purchased DVD's is NOT illegal, the DCMA does NOT trump that right, I do carry it to an extreme though). Do I give a good damn if it's illegal, not one little bit.

I'm sure this will seriously offend some of the apologists here but, again, I don't give a good damn if it does. It'll probably help keep their noses bent out of shape.

Why...

does it seem that the big copyright industry fans around here also seem to be such big liars? If those are the kind of people copyright breeds then I say the sooner we get rid of it the better and those violating it are doing the world a favor.

Re: Why...

The reason for the similarity is, quite simply, because it's ONE person.

He/she has admitted to using sock-puppet accounts previously (most recently "The Anti-Mike"). Masnick is pretty sure it's the same person as "Weird Harold".
Do a search, the results will probably interest you.

The primary reason there's only *one* big-media apologist troll who has to create the illusion of massive support by way of sock-puppet accounts, is because nobody in their right mind could actually take the position of "bend over and take it from your corporate overlords/their cronies in government", so consistently, and retain any self-respect whatsoever.

But, it's wrong.

This picture actually really annoys me and I don't know why it is being so widely circulated. If anything, I think it makes the automatic point. It makes all "pirates" sound like they are 12-year-olds who like making inaccurate pictures and spread them around to justify their shenanigans.

The beef I have with the picture is that I have NEVER had to deal with the picture it paints for legitimate DVDs. YES, I have seen the FBI warnings on DVDs... but I have ALWAYS been able to skip past the previews. So, why does this picture claim otherwise?

Anyone who has ever properly used a normal DVD player would see this picture and say, "well, that's not the way it really is" then would completely dismiss it as the rant from an obvious 12-year-old.

So, again. I don't have a problem with this picture because I am against piracy... I have a problem with this picture because it only HELPS the big shots make their case AGAINST piracy, by showing that those in favor have no clue how to operate a DVD player properly, or clearly don't care to know.

Re: But, it's wrong.

"I have a problem with this picture because it only HELPS the big shots make their case AGAINST piracy, by showing that those in favor have no clue how to operate a DVD player properly, or clearly don't care to know."

The picture is comedy, a bit overdrawn just to make the point. Can't you see that even though you can fast forward or skip some (or all) of the warnings/trailers, it is still more annoying than the "press play - watch movie" of an illicit copy? (which also happens to be free)

The point is that the paid version should be better, not slightly worse or even the same.

Re: But, it's wrong.

The beef I have with the picture is that I have NEVER had to deal with the picture it paints for legitimate DVDs. YES, I have seen the FBI warnings on DVDs... but I have ALWAYS been able to skip past the previews. So, why does this picture claim otherwise?

Hmm. There are definitely DVDs that I have where I have not been able to skip past the previews, and it is a real pain.

I don't know if it's DVD specific, or DVD player specific, but I have come across that problem.

Re: Re: But, it's wrong.

Part of the DVD specification includes a "coding language" which includes a command to tell the DVD player to simply ignore buttons on the remote control (such as Fast Forward/Next Chapter/Menu etc.) So it is basically just arbitrary choices made by the studio.

FBI for the win

I just love how they don't even bother to change the FBI warning when they sell DVD's here in Denmark. The region code, subtitles and DVD cover is made for europe (at least, if not for Denmark itself) - but they choose to threaten us with... FBI? Their closest jurisdiction is more than a quarter around the world away. FBI? Seriously?

Frustrated.

I have been downloading my entertainment for years. I rarely go to the theaters anymore. The last few times I begrugingly paid the high prices, I was infuriated to be subjected to nearly 20 minutes of advertising. Why should I pay good money to be hammered with marketing? This really pisses me off. Ill watch my movies at home thanks (with no trailers/marketing/warnings/propeganda).

Offer me something I want, and ill pay for it. The strings attached to many media sources today make the product much less desirable. Great article.

True dat

Had this exact same issue with "Up" on blu-ray recently. What that picture leaves out is when your blu-ray player needs to be "updated" and you have to wait 20 minutes for it download crap from the internet.