If this is your first visit, be sure to
check out the FAQ by clicking the
link above. You may have to register
before you can post: click the register link above to proceed. To start viewing messages,
select the forum that you want to visit from the selection below.

Bird Placement

Although there are several threads out on RTF, I wanted to try to put together a "punch" list of difficult bird placement scenarios that I could keep with me when looking at an area and trying to determine what type of mark I want. So asking for your thoughts given no more than a double and often single...

Trying not to be super detailed if possible, but realize detail makes the mark. Also if distance is the key to the mark, please state distance.

I think a lot of people fail to consider sky lines when placing marks, especially where the dog runs down in a bottom and looses sight of the mark. They have a big tendency to run to the open sky line.

Here is the Open 1st series at Minot this year. I think the short retired, bird #3 is pretty good placement. It was thrown right up against the heavy brush. I saw lots of dogs run right by the left hand side of the cover and hunt deep. I saw others hunt out in front but not get right up against the brush, then they hunted around the back and ended up in the flyer.

"For everyone to whom much is given, of him shall much be required." -- Luke 12:48

Here is the Open 1st series at Minot this year. I think the short retired, bird #3 is pretty good placement. It was thrown right up against the heavy brush. I saw lots of dogs run right by the left hand side of the cover and hunt deep. I saw others hunt out in front but not get right up against the brush, then they hunted around the back and ended up in the flyer.

It may be the camera giving the illusion that the birds are throw more or less equidistant, but 2, 3 and 4 pretty much look like they're thrown in a pile. I don't mind tight lines, but those look like tight fall areas. I'm also not a fan of the mama/poppa concept going on with 3 and 4. 3 looks like a well placed bird, though.

Here is the Open 1st series at Minot this year. I think the short retired, bird #3 is pretty good placement. It was thrown right up against the heavy brush. I saw lots of dogs run right by the left hand side of the cover and hunt deep. I saw others hunt out in front but not get right up against the brush, then they hunted around the back and ended up in the flyer.

#3 is a classic trained concept,, My dogs would absolutely run there because that's where I usually put birds. The only solid feature in the field.. Yup... The momma/poppa concept doesn't bother me though I don't like but I do train for it. I feel there's enough definition between the marks here that there shouldn't be an issue.

Personally I would like any throw that's retired that is thrown on the face of these rolls with a stand out gun behind it... I know that's not what was thrown but that is what I would have done. I like 1 and 4.

#3 is a classic trained concept,, My dogs would absolutely run there because that's where I usually put birds. The only solid feature in the field.. Yup... The momma/poppa concept doesn't bother me though I don't like but I do train for it. I feel there's enough definition between the marks here that there shouldn't be an issue. Personally I would like any throw that's retired that is thrown on the face of these rolls with a stand out gun behind it... I know that's not what was thrown but that is what I would have done. I like 1 and 4.Angie

WOW Angie!

I could train on this all the time (and do) but would never say that my dogs could get #3. For starters, the order is not friendly for #3 with #1 first and then the swing towards the flier from #2 to #4. #3 would be the most poorly watched bird. To get #3, the dog goes out of sight and then starts to roll and climb a hill. What an easy over-run. I think this is a good but tough test that I would say my dogs are capable of doing but never that they would on any given day.

Personally, I like #1 retired. If you keep a visible gun exposed just past a shorter retired, you are really trying to deceive the dog into running longer for the visible. It can really be too much and I'd rather seek good bird placement than trying to deceive the dog. I know we see it all the time- that doesn't make it a good marking test, only one that you need to work on.

A punch list is really not what you are looking for because then what you will have is a cheat sheet of what to you are really cool things and then you will tend to go around looking for a place to plug them in. Great bird placement some people just seem to have the eye and the knack for it, but you can bet that it came from experience. Good bird placement you learn maybe on your way to great bird placement by running and observing, judging, running and making mistakes, and most of all judging and running and training with people who are a lot better than you and observing and asking questions. Experience is the teacher and to be really good there is no shortcut.

Field Trials are competitions....not everyone gets a "participation ribbon" and they do "keep score"