you can buy sanitizer test strips to tell you how to do your water+bleach ..so you do it safely

super useful. may be (probably 100% is) overboard for single person..but.. i use them for a big group kitchen at the burn, so .. i have them around for my own use as well... (tip: youre putting too much bleach in)

What do you hope to gain by continuing to perpetuate the ugliness? Being a bully make you feel better? I know mean spirited people exist everywhere, glad you've shattered an illusion that Burning Man will be no different. Since only one person actually attempted to answer the question I posted, I'm going to guess that no one here can actually help me out with this issue.

Thanks to all who actually had something postive to say.

I'm sure you'll have some overly snarky retort or "clever " picture to post. So have at it.

"A little nonsense now and then is relished by the wisest men." - W. Wonka

You need to grow some thicker skin Muffin. You're not going to be babied here, and if you expect that you ought to delete your account right now and move on. At the very least use the plonking link in my signature to add whomever you feel you don't like, so at least you don't attract more--real--snark from your childish reactions.

"The essence of tyranny is not iron law. It is capricious law." -- Christopher Hitchens

BBadger wrote:You need to grow some thicker skin Muffin. You're not going to be babied here, and if you expect that you ought to delete your account right now and move on. At the very least use the plonking link in my signature to add whomever you feel you don't like, so at least you don't attract more--real--snark from your childish reactions.

Thick skin? Shouldn't you follow your own advice? Why are you commenting? If being "babied " equals being treated with kindness you have serious issues. I would saying getting involved with more negative comments at this point is more childish than anything I've said on this board.

"A little nonsense now and then is relished by the wisest men." - W. Wonka

Hi Muffin. I think you are on the right track with your food ideas. You may want to consider purchasing a vaccuum sealer. These are great for general home use as well as Burning Man. I purchase something new for burning man every year. I started with a sealer, couple years ago it was a Kodiac tent & this year i've ordered a home canner. ( im jarring salsa, & grape leaves ) when you are packaging your meals you might consider making them small portions. That way you won't have to throw away alot of leftovers & stink up your trash. You will also want to bring LOTS of non perishable snaks. Cheers & happy preparing!

Boijoy wrote:Hi Muffin. I think you are on the right track with your food ideas. You may want to consider purchasing a vaccuum sealer. These are great for general home use as well as Burning Man. I purchase something new for burning man every year. I started with a sealer, couple years ago it was a Kodiac tent & this year i've ordered a home canner. ( im jarring salsa, & grape leaves ) when you are packaging your meals you might consider making them small portions. That way you won't have to throw away alot of leftovers & stink up your trash. You will also want to bring LOTS of non perishable snaks. Cheers & happy preparing!

Thank you so much for the response. I looked at brands last night and found one that's not too expensive, but I didnt see the ziplock brand one. I'll look at that one tonight. Small portions= yes! Though i havent been to BM I've attended aome 4 to 5 day festivals in 90 degree weather and I ate onnce a day and I had to make myself. I would assume it will be the same in the desert. I just really want to bring a few comfort dishes that i know are next day cures and ones I will eat. I reseached MREs fir a while (and may bring a few) l knowing nt sure I could do it for a week.

I know this isn't on topic, but since you mentioned it, and are actually iffering real advice: How do you like your Kodiak? A friend has one that they will let me borrow (9x8), but I'm worried about the weight and rolled up size. Do you think it's worth the trouble? The reviews are nothing but positive and it seems to keep the dust out, and cool air in in the am, and is durable.

Thanks so much for the help.

"A little nonsense now and then is relished by the wisest men." - W. Wonka

The wax on wax paper will start to melt between 122-140°F, so it's probably best to avoid using it when heating your food. Additionally, it is flammable, so having it near an open flame is also not such a good idea. I think the vacuum sealed bags are probably your best bet.

KM, I had one of the Ziploc bag sealers and it works great. you just can't use juicy stuff, because it won't get a good seal. I use dry ice. I keep the good stuff I want to eat on the dry ice, not directly though. It'll last abour 4 days. Then I use ice for everything else. I bring powdered milk too. But I keep 1 cooler for dry ice and one for regular ice. And Ziploc bags are your friend! I like your idea of having a stand of sorts to keep some foods above the ice.

Sometimes I'm confused by what I think is really obvious. But what I think is really obvious obviously isn't obvious.

KrisMuffin wrote:Thick skin? Shouldn't you follow your own advice? Why are you commenting? If being "babied " equals being treated with kindness you have serious issues. I would saying getting involved with more negative comments at this point is more childish than anything I've said on this board.

Follow my own advice on what? Plonking? Why would I bother? I'm not being negatively impacted here.

"Kindness" is very open to interpretation. Parents can think themselves "kind" by not punishing their children when they misbehave--but those parents are really only setting up their children for failure when real life hits. You can be taught by some "kind" ballet teacher who lets you wear the tutu, and prance around with sickled points--but that's because the teacher is just accepting money to make you a mediocre "ballet princess." Who is really being "kind" here?

We could be likewise "kind" and show you our indifference. Give you a "Cool idea bro" so to speak. Then you could walk away all happy thinking your idea is significant, or that someone actually took any time to even bother with it.

But it's not like that here. You asked us what we thought, and some of us told you. Don't want negative opinions, why did you ask?

Or maybe you think we're just being mean in the way we don't sugar-coat the responses. Well too bad. Rather than thinking that people are just being mean with some of their responses, try considering why negative comments are being directed towards you. "Ever camped? Anywhere?" basically implies "No, that's a dumb idea, by someone who doesn't seem to understand much about camping."

If that's the case here, maybe you're out of your league. You have a choice at this crossroads: try to learn something, or stamp your foot and keep seeking validation for your ideas.

If the latter, you probably ought to just delete your account right now, because dumb ideas don't get validated here.

"The essence of tyranny is not iron law. It is capricious law." -- Christopher Hitchens

KrisMuffin wrote:Though i havent been to BM I've attended aome 4 to 5 day festivals in 90 degree weather and I ate onnce a day and I had to make myself. I would assume it will be the same in the desert.

That would be a bad assumption. The playa is a high-altitude alkaline lake bed, and the alkaline dust that makes up the playa is a desiccant - it doesn't care if it's 90 or 60 degrees, it's still going to be sucking the moisture out of you and you won't realize it. Your body may react by craving more food than normal, or less, or even the amount you normally eat, but you won't know until you've gone; and if you're dehydrated or exhausted and you have to cook that meal, you may be in a spot of trouble. Plan multiple ways to eat- easy cook, no cook, even super-fancy if you want; just make sure to give yourself options.

I eat far less than normal out there (2-3 small meals, +snacks), but I know people who eat more than they normally do. If they packed like I do, they would be very hungry a few days into BMan, and run out of food well before the weekend. For your first year I personally would bring more than you think you'll need to give yourself coverage, you can start adjusting quantity in the future.

As for low waste- like a couple people have mentioned, use what you're familiar with. Anything that doesn't need to be refrigerated until after it's opened (if ever) is perfect. It gets warm during the day- if you're near a vehicle, set canned food inside near the window or, if you don't, put it where it's going to get sun (and not be visible from the street). Leave it while you go wander, come back in a couple of hours- warm food. Not glamorous, but food.

BB, please don't put words in my mouth; just means I'm curious about people's usual camping habits, or lack thereof, in the context of what they're asking. And that I value honesty, and radical mercy. Yeah, I'm spiritual that way.

Great advice Eric, though I'll leave the whole "alkaline playa" thing alone (ie it's mostly the airborne clay that kills you and your stuff, not the tiny amount of alkaline minerals).

KrisMuffin wrote:Thick skin? Shouldn't you follow your own advice? Why are you commenting? If being "babied " equals being treated with kindness you have serious issues. I would saying getting involved with more negative comments at this point is more childish than anything I've said on this board.

Follow my own advice on what? Plonking? Why would I bother? I'm not being negatively impacted here.

"Kindness" is very open to interpretation. Parents can think themselves "kind" by not punishing their children when they misbehave--but those parents are really only setting up their children for failure when real life hits. You can be taught by some "kind" ballet teacher who lets you wear the tutu, and prance around with sickled points--but that's because the teacher is just accepting money to make you a mediocre "ballet princess." Who is really being "kind" here?

We could be likewise "kind" and show you our indifference. Give you a "Cool idea bro" so to speak. Then you could walk away all happy thinking your idea is significant, or that someone actually took any time to even bother with it.

But it's not like that here. You asked us what we thought, and some of us told you. Don't want negative opinions, why did you ask?

Or maybe you think we're just being mean in the way we don't sugar-coat the responses. Well too bad. Rather than thinking that people are just being mean with some of their responses, try considering why negative comments are being directed towards you. "Ever camped? Anywhere?" basically implies "No, that's a dumb idea, by someone who doesn't seem to understand much about camping."

If that's the case here, maybe you're out of your league. You have a choice at this crossroads: try to learn something, or stamp your foot and keep seeking validation for your ideas.

If the latter, you probably ought to just delete your account right now, because dumb ideas don't get validated here.

A. You have no power. I will keep my name. B. I'm so sorry you are unhappy with your life and have nothing better to do than To be jerk. There's nothing here but the rantings of a bitter and lonely person. Please waste you're time on someone else.

"A little nonsense now and then is relished by the wisest men." - W. Wonka

KrisMuffin wrote:Though i havent been to BM I've attended aome 4 to 5 day festivals in 90 degree weather and I ate onnce a day and I had to make myself. I would assume it will be the same in the desert.

That would be a bad assumption. The playa is a high-altitude alkaline lake bed, and the alkaline dust that makes up the playa is a desiccant - it doesn't care if it's 90 or 60 degrees, it's still going to be sucking the moisture out of you and you won't realize it. Your body may react by craving more food than normal, or less, or even the amount you normally eat, but you won't know until you've gone; and if you're dehydrated or exhausted and you have to cook that meal, you may be in a spot of trouble. Plan multiple ways to eat- easy cook, no cook, even super-fancy if you want; just make sure to give yourself options.

I eat far less than normal out there (2-3 small meals, +snacks), but I know people who eat more than they normally do. If they packed like I do, they would be very hungry a few days into BMan, and run out of food well before the weekend. For your first year I personally would bring more than you think you'll need to give yourself coverage, you can start adjusting quantity in the future.

As for low waste- like a couple people have mentioned, use what you're familiar with. Anything that doesn't need to be refrigerated until after it's opened (if ever) is perfect. It gets warm during the day- if you're near a vehicle, set canned food inside near the window or, if you don't, put it where it's going to get sun (and not be visible from the street). Leave it while you go wander, come back in a couple of hours- warm food. Not glamorous, but food.

Eric,Thank you very much for the advice. I've read many accounts and talked to some friends who've gone, and all have said they eat a lot less, but im sure everyone is different. I spent some time in Egypt and there I ate once a day maybe. But you're right, who knows how I will react when I'm out there as the environment seems to be different than a typical desert. That's why I wanted to bring a few comfort dishes that I know I will eat, as i try to avoid a lot of canned food in my normal life (except for green bean. Love them. LoL) I already have my shopping list of food, and most are dry goods that wont need refrigeration. I thought about making a solar oven to reheat items and keep them from getting to super dusty, but I'm not married to that idea yet.

I just wanted to come up with a way to reheat frozen food and eat it out of the same container while avoiding the potential plastic exposure that could come with vaccum sealing and boiling, not to mention that that would cost more than I had budgeted for supplies. But maybe I can borrow a sealer from a friend and use paper plates(sigh). Im going to a regional burn in July, so I'll have an oppurtunity to test out some thing then and time to change things before the burn.

"A little nonsense now and then is relished by the wisest men." - W. Wonka

Bob wrote:BB, please don't put words in my mouth; just means I'm curious about people's usual camping habits, or lack thereof, in the context of what they're asking. And that I value honesty, and radical mercy. Yeah, I'm spiritual that way.

Great advice Eric, though I'll leave the whole "alkaline playa" thing alone (ie it's mostly the airborne clay that kills you and your stuff, not the tiny amount of alkaline minerals).

Dear Bob,

I appreciate your comment, and I'm sorry that I got huffy with you. I took you question in a way that it seems wasnt inteded, which as i said before is the horrible downside of communitcation electronically. Even though there are some great people on here, there has been so much elitism and just plain unkindess towards new people, that it puts those of us who are putting ourselves out there and are reading everything we can on the defensive. Ironic that radical inclusion is a principle, and that seems to slip the mind of so many. Usually, I find these are the same people who will do everything they can to point out if someone new is doing somthing they think is wrong or against the principles. But there's people like that in every bunch, so why should Burners be different? Even though I seen and expirenced some downright nasty behavior on here I'm not going to let it ruin my time at the burn nor soil the great encounters ive had on eplaya so far (Drawingablank wonderfully gifted a homemade mini top hat to me and even payed to have it shipped! Such a cool feeling to get that in the mail. i only hope to be able to pay that forward.) At the very least this has been a great sociological experiment. No matter how different or counter culture a group of people touts to be theres always cliques, a wariness of new people (even though every single person on here started out that way), and some bullies. Either way, thanks for shedding light on your position.

-K

PS- Thanks to those that offered up their kind advice and expirences. It helped me a lot to rethink about other avenues I had closed before.

"A little nonsense now and then is relished by the wisest men." - W. Wonka

Uncertainties abound, thanks to the BM website greywater page being 12 years out of date. Yes, your very small camp can dispose of graywater on the playa IF it's filtered and treated. Yes, there's a good, easy way to be (moderately) sure that you've disinfected your graywater. This is all on the NEW BM graywater page.

This page is still making its way through the editorial process. Here's where you can read a draft: [url]https://sites.google.com/site/evapotrons/graywater-experience-and-advice[/url]

The page lists nine techniques for getting rid of graywater, with the pros and cons. It presents a guideline for disinfecting graywater, with a really simple rule of thumb for when you need bleach and how much.

Two of the nine techniques involve the use of [b]evapotrons[/b] : burner-designed devices for eliminating graywater. In fact, the whole website is concerned with evapotrons and how to build them. Start at the "Home" page for some entertainment and enlightenment.

I'm the designer of the "Gray-B-Gon" evapotron. For five years, burners have been building these on their own (online guide in Instructables.com) or in my workshops. The Gray-B-Gon has good performance (15-20 gallons/day), is artistic in a burnerish sort of way, helps build neighborhoods, and will operate for years.

Anyone who's ever held a cordless drill can build a Gray-B-Gon. Experienced builders from previous years come to the workshops, just for the fun and satisfaction of helping new builders. The last workshop of the year will be in Oakland on July 7; if you're interested, email ember@burningman.com. Currently there's space for 10 more builders.

Full disclosure paragraph: nothing is perfect. Solar-powered evapotrons don't work at night; the Gray-B-Gon doesn't work when there's no wind. In 2011, thanks to the perfect playa surface not kicking up dust, we had four straight days of calm air -- not that anyone complained, but many idle Gray-B-Gons filled with graywater. By the end of the week we had wind again, and the crisis receded.