To start, I think the key issues we want to address and resolve from all this are miscommunication and transparency between admins, staff, and players. We need to clarify and/or update some of our rules, and we need better consistency in our communication with players on what is and is not acceptable behavior on Atlas. Players also feel as if punishments are overly harsh, and that purgatory is used too liberally and without warning - part of that is us being more consistent with elevation of rule enforcements from staff, but also on us to clarify that purgatory is hardly ever given without warning or prior violations of similar rules in short succession. I’ll get into some of our thoughts on our intended solutions (some of which are already in effect) below. It seems like there are some other issues wrapped up in here as well, but conflating those all together here will help no one, so let’s address them separately, and focus on immediate solutions moving forward.

Issue #1: Rules need to be updated to reflect current staff rule enforcementSpecifically, the “no shit-talking” rule is one that, while we made players aware of at the SOTS and subsequently on the server that we’d be enforcing, it is not one that has been added to the official rules list on the website - however, players have still received punishments for breaking this rule.

Solution: Add the “no-shit-talking” policy to the Official Atlas Rules page.This seems like a “why didn’t you do this already” kind of thing, but a major point was still being discussed: should trash-talking be allowed from an RP perspective? It would be a major caveat to this “no shit-talking” rule, and one that the Elders have been internally debating over the last few days. Which leads into the next issue:

Issue #2: Not being able to trash-talk from an RP perspective hampers RP on the serverIt’s clear that some players want the ability to publicly speak negatively about other players “all in good fun” or in a “tasteful” way. We don’t disagree that many of our current players would do just that if given the opportunity. But cooler heads don’t often prevail, especially in competitive environments - and so what starts as something one side considers “tasteful RP” really pisses off the other side, but their opinion is not taken into consideration because “they shouldn’t be offended by that.” This is behavior we have seen time and time again, not just in one instance with one group of players. Hence why we have been grappling with this issue, and debating it at length amongst the Elders.

Solution: Create a Roleplay chat channel with strict guidelines. As stated, the Elders have debated the pros and cons of the suggested RP reforms internally at length. We have looked at other RP servers, specific rulesets, discussed whether or not we could make it work to some degree. A lot of RP-heavy servers allow a degree of targeted trash-talking that we are not alright with - however, we want players to feel as if they can post wartime RP (that doesn’t target a specific player or their skills) without fear of breaking the “no shit-talking” rule. As an example, claiming “Our mighty nation will crush the heathens of Nation X!” is fine, while saying “Nation X are the most pathetic fighters I’ve ever seen on the battlefield!” is not. The difference is, the latter is an insult at the player’s skill, not their character. Characters don’t lose on the battlefield - the players playing them do, and so that sort of targeted “RP” just ends up being fancy ways of saying “git gud nub.” No one on the receiving end of that enjoys it.

This RP channel would still fall under the general community and behavior guidelines of Atlas. Staff will still moderate this channel as they would any other, and outside of legitimate RP, they will ask players to not say or repeat certain things if they deem them unacceptable. But RP between players that does not specifically target individual players or their skills, will be allowed. With this addition, Staff will also ask players to direct RP to the appropriate channel, rather than Global Chat. The RP channel will not be auto-joined by default, so players may opt in if they choose.

Issue #3: There are currently a lack of PVP outlets on the server, giving players no way to actually “fight,” leading to more toxicity in generalThis is a point we agree with, and are well aware of, and for that reason, the new Siege Relics system has been priority #1 on the dev side. The frustration of not having a definitive way to win wars is one we totally agree with, and one that we hope to solve with Relics and future Diplomacy mechanics after that. If this is what was meant by “dev issues” being related to staff issues, then on this specific element you’re right. But let’s not mix economy balancing and other endgame content up in this - let’s solve the first issue first: Sieges.

Solution: Get Sieges out ASAP. Not that this is different than our current approach, but all we can say is we’re working as fast as we can on this. I know players want a specific date, but right now we can’t provide that. The best we can say is that, as we have already begun testing of the completed systems, we’re hopeful that this will be implemented onto the server in the next few weeks. We understand the impatience, and the importance of the system - but we will never rush and release an undertested or unpolished mechanic that could have such large gameplay implications.

Issue #4: Miscommunication between Staff and Players, and perceived inconsistent purgatory sentencesAs part of the discussion we’ve been having with players recently, a problem that’s been identified is that purgatory sentences seem to come without provocation, when in fact they are rarely used without prior warnings, or previous violations from that specific player. A player who says “shut up idiot” in general chat without any prior instances of that attitude, will never get a 2k purgatory sentence out of the blue. There is obvious offensive language that merits an immediate unwarned purgatory sentence, but again, those should be quite obvious. Harsher punishments come when a player responds negatively to staff who ask them to not repeat what they’ve said in public chat, and become publicly combative. That is a clear violation of our first server rule: If admins or staff ask you to do something (or not do something) - listen to them! We’re not saying you can’t disagree with a decision, and that discussion about suggested rule changes can’t happen - but the place for that conversation is not defiantly in staff’s face in global chat. DM staff with questions, or do what was done initially here and write your points clearly down in a document that we can read and digest, and have constructive debate about, without getting emotional.

Solutions: More clarity and transparency on punishments, publicly available to all players. This is actually something we’ve already begun doing, but players may not be aware of this page’s existence on the website: https://mc-atlas.com/punishments. We’re also being more clear in the explanations listed there, to show that players aren’t simply “insta-purged” without warning, but that most purgs come after repeatedly ignored staff requests or consistent rule violations without change. We hope that this will help in dispelling the myth that purgatory is used willy-nilly by staff, or that any one person on the staff or admin team gives out purgatory sentences without running it by staff first (except in obvious cases.)

More consistency from Staff in elevation of chat punishments. An issue we’ve heard from several players is that they feel Person A got punished way harsher than Person B, even though they committed the same offense at a different time. We try to minimize this as much as possible, and strive to be consistent in “how punishable” certain specific offenses are. But there are additional factors that may affect this as well, and this is something we (and Staff) can be more clear about. The largest example of this is repeat offenses, of which we intend to be more clear about (as stated above.) If a player continually winds up in purg for similar offenses, their sentence is going to go up, regardless of the severity of each individual infraction. But if it’s clear that a player honestly wasn’t aware what they said was offensive, as it is not something they've said in the past, Staff should always provide a warning. Veteran players who continually toe that line with no regard for Staff’s decisions, will cease to get the benefit of a warning. We figured these sorts of things were self-explanatory, but if specific points such as those are helpful to spell out in the rules themselves, we can certainly do so. But at the end of the day, while Staff can be more communicative with players, players also need to respect Staff’s authority. Staff will not always side with you, and that does not make them, or the server, “wrong.”

Issue #5: A perceived inactive Staff team, resulting in a small number of Staff members involved in decisionsThis is a valid point, and a solution that you’ll probably find unsurprising, because I’m sure all sides agree on it:

Solution:Get more staff. The truth is, just as has been the case with many players, the Staff team has been pulled away from their usual level of Atlas involvement the past few weeks due to exams, classes finishing - everything that comes with the beginning of summertime. Of course the solution to this is having a larger, more representative Staff team - but it’s not as easy as just making everyone who applies Staff. Getting the right people is important, and players who continually lose their cool in stressful situations do not make good and balanced Staff - it makes for emotional and irrational decision-making. Does that mean we should explore the idea of hiring a specific “community manager” - a person who doesn’t play on the server, but who is consistently aware of community issues at a granular level on a day to day basis? Perhaps - a “full-time Bork,” if you will. Honestly we need a few of those, but no one who has claimed to be capable of that position so far can keep a cool enough head. We may end up hiring for this position from outside the community, for that reason. But certainly something we’ll be discussing internally.

I hope that these immediate solutions address the more pressing issues that this group originally set out to bring to our attention. We hear your concerns, and while we don’t agree with everything, we’ll always welcome the discussion and debate (as long as it remains constructive.) For now, after a couple weeks of open discussion with the petition group and with individual players, we want to implement the solutions listed here and move on to addressing other things like getting our next content updates out.

(06-08-2019, 08:01 PM)Iyoforeayo Wrote: Solution: Create a Roleplay chat channel with strict guidelines. As stated, the Elders have debated the pros and cons of the suggested RP reforms internally at length. We have looked at other RP servers, specific rulesets, discussed whether or not we could make it work to some degree. A lot of RP-heavy servers allow a degree of targeted trash-talking that we are not alright with - however, we want players to feel as if they can post wartime RP (that doesn’t target a specific player or their skills) without fear of breaking the “no shit-talking” rule. As an example, claiming “Our mighty nation will crush the heathens of Nation X!” is fine, while saying “Nation X are the most pathetic fighters I’ve ever seen on the battlefield!” is not. The difference is, the latter is an insult at the player’s skill, not their character. Characters don’t lose on the battlefield - the players playing them do, and so that sort of targeted “RP” just ends up being fancy ways of saying “git gud nub.” No one on the receiving end of that enjoys it.

This RP channel would still fall under the general community and behavior guidelines of Atlas. Staff will still moderate this channel as they would any other, and outside of legitimate RP, they will ask players to not say or repeat certain things if they deem them unacceptable. But RP between players that does not specifically target individual players or their skills, will be allowed. With this addition, Staff will also ask players to direct RP to the appropriate channel, rather than Global Chat. The RP channel will not be auto-joined by default, so players may opt in if they choose.

Solutions: More clarity and transparency on punishments, publicly available to all players. This is actually something we’ve already begun doing, but players may not be aware of this page’s existence on the website: https://mc-atlas.com/punishments. We’re also being more clear in the explanations listed there, to show that players aren’t simply “insta-purged” without warning, but that most purgs come after repeatedly ignored staff requests or consistent rule violations without change. We hope that this will help in dispelling the myth that purgatory is used willy-nilly by staff, or that any one person on the staff or admin team gives out purgatory sentences without running it by staff first (except in obvious cases.)

More consistency from Staff in elevation of chat punishments. An issue we’ve heard from several players is that they feel Person A got punished way harsher than Person B, even though they committed the same offense at a different time. We try to minimize this as much as possible, and strive to be consistent in “how punishable” certain specific offenses are. But there are additional factors that may affect this as well, and this is something we (and Staff) can be more clear about. The largest example of this is repeat offenses, of which we intend to be more clear about (as stated above.) If a player continually winds up in purg for similar offenses, their sentence is going to go up, regardless of the severity of each individual infraction. But if it’s clear that a player honestly wasn’t aware what they said was offensive, as it is not something they've said in the past, Staff should always provide a warning. Veteran players who continually toe that line with no regard for Staff’s decisions, will cease to get the benefit of a warning. We figured these sorts of things were self-explanatory, but if specific points such as those are helpful to spell out in the rules themselves, we can certainly do so. But at the end of the day, while Staff can be more communicative with players, players also need to respect Staff’s authority. Staff will not always side with you, and that does not make them, or the server, “wrong.”

Solution:Get more staff. The truth is, just as has been the case with many players, the Staff team has been pulled away from their usual level of Atlas involvement the past few weeks due to exams, classes finishing - everything that comes with the beginning of summertime. Of course the solution to this is having a larger, more representative Staff team - but it’s not as easy as just making everyone who applies Staff. Getting the right people is important, and players who continually lose their cool in stressful situations do not make good and balanced Staff - it makes for emotional and irrational decision-making. Does that mean we should explore the idea of hiring a specific “community manager” - a person who doesn’t play on the server, but who is consistently aware of community issues at a granular level on a day to day basis? Perhaps - a “full-time Bork,” if you will. Honestly we need a few of those, but no one who has claimed to be capable of that position so far can keep a cool enough head. We may end up hiring for this position from outside the community, for that reason. But certainly something we’ll be discussing internally.

I hope that these immediate solutions address the more pressing issues that this group originally set out to bring to our attention. We hear your concerns, and while we don’t agree with everything, we’ll always welcome the discussion and debate (as long as it remains constructive.) For now, after a couple weeks of open discussion with the petition group and with individual players, we want to implement the solutions listed here and move on to addressing other things like getting our next content updates out.

The Elders have put forward the solutions to the problems that we brought up in the original draft course of this petition. I am content with the proposed solutions. Thank you all for helping make Atlas better!

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