Who Are The Males Who Sneak Into Michigan Womyn’s Music Festival?

September 6, 2011

The Michigan Womyn’s Music Festival is a weeklong private event produced annually since 1976 by and for people who are female. For the last ten years, groups of male transgenders have protested the existence of the festival. Not only protested, but terrorized and harassed and tried to sabotage and destroy the festival. Their reason for doing so is their strong belief that people born female have no right to congregate on the basis of that commonality. The male transgender activists have literally formed an encampment each year outside the perimeter of the Michfest festival grounds, which they patrol with weapons and plan sabotage missions into the camp– to write graffiti, to cut the water lines to the handicapped showers, to slash tires, to wreck tents, to flier the camp with pictures of their penises. Last year many of the male transgenders fled their own encampment out of fear of the growing violence of their own group members. Why are these men so angry? Why do they want to destroy a private women’s music festival? Why do they want to force women to look at their penises?

They believe that females have no rights to any space or service or gathering, public or private, that excludes the presence of males, or that exists for the benefit of female fellowship, or for the protection of females from potential male predation. It’s true! That’s what transgender activists believe, and that is what they are fighting- sometimes literally with violence and terrorism – to enforce on females. It’s also worth noting that female spaces and organizations (whether public or private) that exist for Lesbian women are the target of most of the terrorism harassment and boundary violation of these women-hating, homophobic males.

Some of these male-supremacist activists violate the boundaries of female spaces in the most direct manner. They simply ignore the wishes of the women and insert themselves in female spaces in a hostile act of unwanted penetration.

Here is a partial list of incidents involving these men at this year’s festival, as posted by Graceaware on the Michfest forum:

“0.1. a female-born womon is told “I am more woman than you” by a trans woman

0.2. a trans woman’s detailed narrative about masturbating with her penis and cock ring is read aloud in a sex-for-one workshop for pre-orgasmic womyn, triggering the sexual trauma of one woman severely and upsetting and triggering several others. (Alice K)

0.3. a trans woman with a penis is seen nude at the shower by a woman born female and her four-year-old granddaughter

0.4. a trans woman’s erection is noticed at a party in the Zone

0.5.a penis is seen at the WOC Burlesque show

0.6. a WHITE trans woman wears a “Trans Women Belong Here” t-shirt to the WOC Burlesque show, offending womyn of color with the proclamation that she belongs in WOC space (Angel S)

0.7. a trans woman, seemingly high, wanders into the Teen Tent, causing a pre-teen to be asked by the other teens there to leave for her own safety due to her pro-Fest boundary t-shirt

0.8. the clothesline of a woman born female is stolen after she hangs up her shirt with “No They Don’t” on it (in response to “Trans Women Belong Here.”)

0.9. “IT WAS HERE” and the symbol for trans with an anarchist A in the middle was carved into janes at triangle.

0.11. many female butches’ sex and gender are questioned in the ONE place they used to be able to count on that NOT happening.

0.12. the stories of violation, trauma, and triggers on the Land as told by women born female are discounted and disbelieved.

0.13. in the “Allies in Understanding” workshop, a wbw who was paired up with a trans woman (Tobi H) asked the trans woman if she was trans. Tobi said yes. The wbw did not want to discuss the issue with a trans woman, she preferred to discuss it with another wbw with the opposite opinion so she did not engage. AT the end of the workshop Tobi said that the wbw she was paired up with “made assumptions about her” and therefore chose not to engage.

0.14. A trans woman elbowed a wbw in the breast as she shoved her way onto the dance floor at Night Stage (Alice K)

0.15. a wbw was harassed late at night by several trans women who followed her on the path and said things like “how does it feel to be the last one out late at night?” as the shone flashlights in her eyes.

0.16. a wbw at a fire was harassed by a trans woman who tried to press her into a conversation about the Issue, and would not take no for an answer, forcing the wbw to leave the fire.”

Who are these men that ignore the boundaries of women and expose themselves to four year old girls in women’s showers at a private women’s festival?

Let us start the list:

Alice Kalafarski

Alice Kalafarski – attends a pre-orgasmic workshop for women- many of whom are healing from male sexual predation and violence- he shares a graphic description of using a cock ring to beat his meat. When women attendees are traumatized he poo-poos them, and laughs. (Horrifyingly, he claims to volunteer at a rape crisis center) Says he snuck into fest because it was where “Michfest was made for queer women to celebrate their shared sisterhood and give each other lots of orgasms” and he wanted to see if he could find a lesbian to have sex with. Refused to perform the two work shifts all attendees are required to perform as condition of attendance. Interrupts a ritual goddess ceremony to announce to the women that “goddess stuff is silly”. Pushes women out of the way to force his way onto a crowded dancefloor- elbows one of them in the chest. (More incidents will be added as they come to light).

Tobi Hill-Meyer

Tobi Hill-Meyer- Calls himself a trans butch lesbian (“TransDyke”). Protests flyers posted at fest honoring butch women as discriminatory, because the flyers didn’t mention that “men can be butch lesbians too”. Says: “Lisa Vogul hasn’t changed her stance saying that trans women shouldn’t come. But the fact is, we are coming.” Allowed other men to use his armband so they could enter without paying “I know that at least one person was re-using my arm band and I was under the impression that there were some other folks who re-used an armband or two or three as well.”

Gemma Seymour

Gemma Seymour – A heterosexual man and father who trans-itioned into genderism in his forties: “I was born a woman, from a woman, and will always be a woman. My cunt may be only in my head for the time being, but at least I don’t use it like a dick.”

*UPDATE: Gemma is now claiming he has never ever set foot into Michfest, only encamped at the perimeter and stood at the gate. More info will be posted when available.

Annie Danger- Penned the widely distributed “Open Letter to my friends who go to Michfest” where he asks attendees to ““Please do things while you’re there that show me that you really respect my body. My life. My womanhood.” And states: “I feel hurt and I am writing because want to trust that you have my back as a transwoman. I am having a hard time separating your attendance of MWMF and your silence with me about this issue from your level of respect for me; for my body.” You can see what he means by respecting his body And what he means by his “womanhood” if you skip to the six minute mark in the following video which he posted on youtube in children’s section (since removed by moderators). *Warning- not for children or weak stomachs! *Second warning! Really, you’ve been warned! Once seen can never be unseen!

Michfest attendees have tried for years to discuss, talk, explain, ask nicely, converse, dialogue, and mediate with these men. They have tried to get the men to respect the boundaries of their private space- one week a year for females to gather at a private event for females only. Well guess what. It hasn’t worked. These men will never ever respect the boundaries of women, or respect the rights of females to congregate according to their constitutional rights as human beings. To these men, people born female are NOT human beings, and have no civil rights. No amount of talk will get them to respect the experiences and rights of those who are born and raised female in a male-supremacist world.

I’m going to continue to profile these men so that a list can be compiled before next year’s festival. I will add names and pictures to this post as they come in. Perhaps a separate website can be created to track the trespassers and identify them. Perhaps photos of the trespassers can be posted around the festival next year so the men can be escorted off the festival grounds. Perhaps next year womyn can photograph all the trespassers during festival so we can compile a complete list of predatory males.

When a man won’t take “No” for an answer, women must take whatever measures are necessary to protect their boundaries, their rights, and themselves. Enforce Boundaries, don’t just ask for them, because your requestsare being denied.

268 Responses to “Who Are The Males Who Sneak Into Michigan Womyn’s Music Festival?”

Males who refuse to take “no” for an answer are called rapists, or at the very least, rapist mentality. In my opinion, those males infiltrating (and disrupting) MichFest are no different to males in the wider world, trampling over women’s boundaries for their own gain.

Noan wrote a great comment on FaceButt, on a similar thread, about boundaries. I hope she will copy it here, it is brilliant. (*hint* Noan, LOL)

The claim by M2Ts that they have every right to be at MichFest is proven false by their behaviour, eg Kalafarski at the workshop. Talking about their penises, flashing their penises, are all things that sexual predators do. WBW-only spaces like MichFest were created to get away from all that. What to M2Ts do? Well, they “proudly” disrupt by showing or talking about their penises ffs. M2Ts have 100% proven that they do NOT belong at MichFest.

What’s to stop them having their own music festival? They won’t. They, like all other males, like to ride on the back of what females have created, and either appropriate it or destroy it.

The swapping armband thing is a low trick. They are obviously dishonest scum as well.

WBW boundaries will never be respected. They will always have to be enforced. The sooner other females realize that, and act with us, we can have WBW spaces again on private property.

These fucking pricks know that Michfest owners cannot call public law enforcement to evict these males, because the law enforcement agencies will refuse to send female police officers.

In a way I say, since we already have pricks waving their dicks around at Michfest, the call the bloody cops on them. Might as well have a few of those dicks on our side.

OF COURSE Michfest will be the focus of trannies rapism, female-hatred, and exhibitionism. Poison the event for born-females, none of us will return, and then they will minstrelize their “own” MWMF (on their *own* private property – believe me, they have lots of it), with their own deluded female-born groupies dancing attendance on them.

Time for the strongholds, FAB-ones. The time is *now*, if ever. Don’t ever think that we can “achieve” this by “dialogue” with rapists. Action, action, action. Think, think, think.

Never will Michfest be one of those strongholds. The owners and attendees have already rolled over.

Cathy, despite your characterization of the status of MWMF, you cannot possibly be so naïve as to believe that there is not some serious disagreement as to whether Fest truly qualifies as a private entity that ought to be exempt from anti-discrimination laws. True, no such laws exist in that jurisdiction, but to my mind, and to the minds of many others, MichFest easily qualifies as a public accommodation.

To wit, the Fest organizers make no attempt to limit ticket purchases, except that they *will* deny tickets to a person who obivously identifies as male. I’m not sure if you are aware of this fact, but Lisa Vogel is herself an attorney. I am certain that she is aware of exactly how far she can push her point of view before she pushes too far.

It occurs to me to wonder why, given that there is absolutely no explicit mention of the trans exclusionary intention/vision/policy in the available Fest literature, and given that trans women who publicly identify themselves as such are freely sold tickets, something that is true even of those trans women who explicitly announce their trans status to the ticketing agents, isn’t the energy of those supporting trans exclusion focused more on Lisa Vogel and the other Fest organizers, rather than on people like me, especially when I have never crossed any Fest boundary.

No Gemma, you raving asshole, you can’t possibly know what Lisa Vogel thinks because she was raised as a girl and has lived her whole life as a woman. You were raised an entitled boy, lived most of your adult life as an entitled man and there is no way on earth you will ever understand how we think, how we make decisions, and what we care about. We make decisions based on different criteria than men who are used to getting their way no matter what. We think of the collective. We think of people other than ourselves. We think past our egos and our immediate needs. That’s the whole damn reason WBW are in this stinking shit hole of an issue with people like you who simply will not get the fuck out of our space — because women think they have to take care of everyone all the time. And men like you take advantage of that. Rapists. Abusers. And trans who will not let females have space of their own.

You are capable only of thinking of yourself and aggrandizing your feelings into imagining that they are part of something larger than yourself. You have no way of knowing that you’re just a narcissist — that’s one of the hallmarks of the disease. You have never taken a single minute to consider what it would be like for a young girl to be exposed to predatory males. You have never taken one damn minute to really understand what women who have been raped experience as trauma and why being around people with penises is re-traumatizing. All you can think about is what it would be like for YOU and leads you to dismiss that as unworthy of your attention. You are incapable of being empathetic. You don’t give a shit about women. You care about YOU only. Your comment a year ago to a woman who tried to make her point illustrates perfectly who you actually are: Gemma the All-Knowing Mansplainer Who Explains It All for the Stupid Wimminz.

can you please confirm that I did NOT give you JuneDay’s real name. She is pissed and blaming me on a thread on FB. I have no clue who she is. All I know is, she posted on a website about going and I saw her twice on the Land. She is claiming that having her real name and porn name associated is causing her harm. For the record, I did not post her real name because I did not know it.

Lena, a simple google search gave me that name. He brags proudly about his porn career to the public at large using both names.
If he’s accusing you (or me) of “outing” him or invading his privacy in any way, he is simply lying. All those featured in this article have posted loudly, publicly, proudly and widely about their experiences sneaking into the womyn’s festival, or their intention to terrorize or disrupt it. All very public. All photos were posted by them to publicize themselves. No one has been “outed” by me. Or you, I’m sure.

So my question is why don’t MtT’s apply to join the women’s athletic team at the Olympics or any woman only sporting event? They won’t, Michfest is an easier target. And damn right they should be arrested for indecent exposure. Scum indeed and thank you for this.

I too had the same response at the video. The warnings should be heeded.

True. It’s part of the whole “females can’t have anything including sports and title 9” portion of the trans agenda.
The trans don’t usually compete in team sports though. They usually choose individual sports where their male anatomy gives them an advantage over female competitors. Specifically arm length. Golf, tennis and fencing. It’s why you see men in their 50’s embarking on professional sports careers that they could never have as men. Like Lana Lawless, who began his professional sports career at the age of FIFTY SEVEN in Women’s Golf.

Yes, that’s a given. Male transgenders in Female sports is more about destroying opportunities for females than a desire to play sports.
“Nobody starts out playing in the LPGA because they want to. And certainly nobody starts out playing the LPGA at age 57 because they want to. I don’t care what sex they are. . .or used to be.

Every player on the LPGA has played amateur golf with some success and entered amateur, or possibly professional tournaments, before qualifying for the LPGA. If good enough, perhaps receiving an exemption from a sponsor, they will be able to compete on the LPGA one day, which is not likely to be the case with Ms. Lawless.

There are, however, other places for Ms. Lawless to compete. She apparently does not want to participate in those. So in her case, it is not about the competition: It’s about her wanting attention.

If Ms. Lawless really wants to play golf why doesn’t she enter events on the Gateway Tour in Phoenix? Golden State, men’s or women’s, entry is not prohibited in either category. What about the Canadian Tour? Or, you’ll all love this—I didn’t think of this, one of my male friends did— The Hooter’s Tour? Couldn’t resist.

Taking the other side where women are allowed to play in men’s events, Michele Wie qualified for the men’s Public Links event and was provided a limited number of sponsor exemptions into men’s and women’s tournaments. Suzy Whaley won the Connecticut PGA Section Championship—beating men—and later found out that had qualified her for the Travelers tournament in Hartford.

What has Lawless done that qualifies her to participate in the LPGA? Nothing that we have seen yet.

Has Lawless entered and won any of the women’s amateur events in California? If she can’t win a women’s amateur event in California, why would she believe she had a “right” to play in an LPGA event anywhere? What’s she done? What’s her record? What did she shoot? Who did she beat? Has she called up some former LPGA pros and asked them for a game to test her skills? Has she won any men’s events?

If she’s really good at golf, she should try to play on the Champions Tour or the Nationwide Tour, where there are no regulations regarding sex of a person at birth. There are plenty of Monday qualifiers for those. Chances are she isn’t good enough to do that or she would have done it already.

All she wants to do is pick on the LPGA.”

“If there was no other opportunity to play, you might be able to find some sympathy. But no 57 year old woman— check the mid amateur players—would try out for the LPGA any more than a 57 year old man would try to qualify for the PGA Tour. Why would a trans-gender man now a woman feel that she has the right to do any different?

If she’s that good she’ll find a place to play golf because people do. Right now, it looks like the only club she knows how to hit is the attorney club”

“The reason it’s unfair for someone who has been a man at one time to play on a regular basis on the LGPA comes down to one thing: Upper body strength, pure and simple. I don’t care what the ruling is for the Olympics. If you know anything whatsoever about golf, you know that distance comes from strength and the ability to move a club head fast.

You only get that with upper body strength.”

“Guess what Lawless’ distance was at the 2008 Long Drive Championship? Three hundred thirty five yards. That’s nearly 100 yards longer than Paula Creamer’s average. And Lawless complained that taking the hormones had caused her to become weaker. How far did she hit when she was a he? Apparently not long enough to beat the men.

Ms. Lawless has already proven that the Olympic committee is wrong. She has proven with her Long Drive participation that no matter how many hormones she takes, she still is going to have—by birth—more upper body muscle and upper body strength than even the longest hitting women. Even European Tour player Laura Davies doesn’t hit a golf ball 335 yards.”

Even Renee Richards went on to regret his lawsuit allowing him to play in women’s tennis. He recognized how unfair it is for males to bully their way into female competition and not only play with an unfair advantage but actively displacing a spot for a female athlete to rightfully participate.

OMG WHY were they not escorted OFF the land the very minute any of these outrageous things occurred????
We knew there were trans at Fest this year but had no direct encounters like those listed. This is just awful! If they have a penis, they have NO business being on the land!!

One of our Trans issues this year was the women that were transitioning to men. They were on testosterone and it was weird being around them. We love butch women and these women were not butch..they were for all practical purposes and appearances men even if they had not had bottom surgery yet.

I feel sorry for you and all the other close minded people who post on this blog. To think that you claim to be so discriminated against as women yet also think you have some right to discriminate against transgendered people and men in general is disgusting.

This is hilarious- There’s a trans completely fabricating quotes and attributing them to me on the Michfest boards. I’ve never heard of or written about the doctor he mentions, then he intersperses my actual quotes with unattributed comments that are not even from anywhere on my blog! A total outright fiction! lol
He actually cuts and pastes someone else’s words and attributes them to me. Well guess what Zoe Brain- you are an outright LIAR. That is really pathetic. But funny.
If you can’t dispute anything I actually said: just make shit up!

I think if you’re a MtT, the ultimate achievement would be to gain entry into the MIchigan Womyn’s Music Festival. For a MtT to get in an to go unnoticed would give an MtT the ultimate bragging rights among his MtT peers.

Just so you know, and for the sake of accuracy in reporting, the closest I have ever come to setting a single foot on The Land is when I was leaving Camp Trans this year, I stopped for a moment to inquire of a Fest worker about the possibility of obtaining a Fest program. This took place in the middle of the road, which I will note is within the bounds of a National Forest and not within anyone’s private property.

I have also never even walked the line to talk with Fest attendees about anything at all, let alone any subject which they, or you, might find discomforting. So, as you can see, I have never entered the MWMF, sneaking, or otherwise, and I always make a point of waving to Fest workers and attendees as I pass by the gates on my runs into town.

Not that I expect you are interested, but for my own edification, I will note that your depiction of what actually goes on down at Camp Trans, and between Camp Trans and Fest, doesn’t quite match up with the reality of my experience. It makes me wonder if you are relying solely on third-party accounts. If you ever want to hear what actually happened at Camp Trans last year, feel free to contact me. The truth is both less, and more, interesting than many accounts have depicted, but no one who was actually there can deny that I was the strongest voice in opposition to actions that might have led to a violent confrontation.

Journalism tip: If you want to be taken seriously as an opponent in a debate, it is usually customary to use actual quotes from your target. The words you attribute to me have neither left my mouth, nor my pen.

You don’t have to agree with anything I have to say to get to know me. I invite you to do so.

That link so needs a warning too. “Remember to bring cupcakes”, I so say that every day of my life, or is that what is expected of me? Why is it in cartoon form? I hope this isn’t posted on youtube in the children’s section. Gross.

We may stand of different sides of the issue, but I have no reason portray events inaccurately. to you, or to anyone else. In fact, I think quite important that we discuss these things as truthfully as possible.

I am already aware of most of the links you posted, and their accounts are of no greater value than my own, which I also note is also a first person account, nor do you have anything to fear from anything I might have to say about the matter. While some things have been widely reported, there is a whole lot more to the story that has not been reported. You might note that I have not refuted any of your claims, only stated that there is more to the story.

“I was the strongest voice in opposition to actions that might have led to a violent confrontation.”

To even say you had to be “the strongest voice in opposition to actions that might have led to a violent confrontation” means people are camped outside the gate discussing the merits of violent confrontation.

I have no doubt that many, far too many, women have just cause to feel such fear.

Despite the portrayal of me above by Noanodyne, that I have “never taken a single minute to consider what it would be like for a young girl to be exposed to predatory males”, at least some of GallusMag’s description of me in the article is accurate, in that I *am* a father, a father of a wonderful 6-year-old daughter. Her safety is even more important to me than my own, and that is a topic I contemplate every single day of my life.

Standing in opposition to violence that day put me in danger, as well. I spent a lot of energy keeping up my guard for the rest of the week, not to mention the energy I had to spend simply trying to hold a community together through sheer will that could have been better spent on community building.

For some women, dialogue, understanding, fairness, etc. are the most important things. For me, being able to have a space for WBW and to set and maintain a boundary around that are the most important things. Women are trained from birth to make everyone else comfortable, to understand everyone’s point of view, and to try to make everything come out ok in the end for everyone. What we’re not taught is that we can say what we want and leave it at that. We are also not taught to set boundaries and that it’s perfectly fine to do what we have to do to protect those boundaries. My anger derives from people trying to overrun a boundary that I see as very clear, consistent, and reasonable. I do not want to talk about that boundary, explain it, come to an agreement about it, etc. I want to state that it’s there and have people respect that. If someone tells me they have a boundary, it is simply abusive if I try to talk them out of it or to somehow get my way past that boundary. It’s only by actively demarcating and protecting a boundary that we can maintain it. And sometimes that takes a forceful position that does not relent, does not concede, does not explain endlessly, does not seek middle ground, etc. Women wouldn’t have the rights we do if we hadn’t pushed back long and hard against the powerful forces arranged against us. “Those who profess to favor freedom, and yet deprecate agitation, are those who want crops without plowing the ground; they want rain without thunder and lightning; they want the ocean without the awful roar of its many waters. Power concedes nothing without a demand. It never did and it never will.” Frederick Douglass said that and the suffragists quoted him during their struggle. The forces arranged against us having our own space have the power of the patriarchy behind them. We must never forget that.

I want you to know that some women with history agree with you, agree with the MichFest policies for MichFest and think Camp Trans is the most clear possible proof that most trans people have absolutely zero respect for women because it is as pure an example of male privileged chest pounding you can get.

This invasion of a space that requests they stay away, a private space at that, come from the need for validation of a womanhood they know deep down they are not a part of in any fashion.

Oh, and “encamped at the perimeter” is still inaccurate. I have attended Camp Trans for the past two years, which takes places on National Forest Service public land a sufficient distance away from The Land that Camp Trans cannot even be seen or heard from Fest. In fact, this year, Camp Trans didn’t even coincide with Fest. Regardless of what you may think of me, or of Camp Trans, even you must admit that we have a right to use public land.

More lies, Gemma. In years past, we could easily hear the performers belting it out over at Camp Trans because that was the whole point and you know it and so do thousands of other festies who have heard CT.

There’s a whole country (or countries) with millions of acres of public land — if any of you had any talent, any abilities, any of the strengths that the women who built MWMF had and have, you would have found that land and created a fabulous festival that would draw thousands of women of every stripe and you wouldn’t need to try to steal what isn’t yours instead.

I was given to understand that, due to members of CT trespassing last year, Camp Trans was not granted a permit this year during the MichFest time frame, the first time that has happened. This comment “…didn’t even coincide…” appears to have the intention of omission of that fact in order to framing it as a example of live-and-let-live. I smell disingenuous here. I stand willing to be corrected if I got my facts are wrong.

Because it is coercive, demanding when it comes from a whole or part that has power (both historical, personal, and collective, i.e. males). They are taught from early on to tell people (females) what they must do/say. If I were to be told that I had to accept something, I would respond with, “No, no, I don’t HAVE to accept anything.” It’s like saying, “You HAVE to accept this!” and/or “You HAVE to eat shit.” Well, no, no, I don’t.

What/Who is going to make me? When asking someone, who/what is going to make me, a challenge becomes apparent. Because then it become their turn (more than likely an oppressive force, because what reciprocal existence [reciprocal implies a desire for the same level of everything, compassion, equality, empathy, etc] demands that one HAVE TO?

And that is exactly the fight that they BROUGHT to fest and why many women have been at a loss of what to do. The false choice has been, let us be here willingly or we will be here without your permission. There are women who actually argue that point — if we don’t make a policy inviting them in, they will crash the gates. Of course these are women — like all of us — who have been soaked in the experience of men doing whatever they want and often violently. So we know the threat is real. And many women go right to that place of dealing with the consequences as if they have no power. Just getting women to see this as a boundary issue is difficult enough and getting them to simply say “no” and be willing to enforce that is a huge step in the process.

And men KNOW this about women and use it against us. There has never been actual dialogue about trans inclusion (you know, where both sides are heard). There has only been “dialogue” about how, when, and where men would be allowed to attend.

This is a community of women making these decisions together and it will take all of us to come to a place of understanding that the males and their allies will continue behaving exactly as Kitty describes above and that we must answer that to our benefit, not theirs.

Hi there. I’m graceaware on the MichFest BB, who posted this list. Just wanted to clarify a few things:
Camp Trans is not just mtf transsexuals, but many differently gendered peoples. Their original purpose is to strategize ways to encourage MWMF to change its policy to include mtf people. http://www.camp-trans.org/ Last year (2010), there was some vandalism that occurred such as the water line to the showers for disabled womyn who camp in RV was cut, and profanity was spray painted on the water tank and on the front gate of Fest. A trans-anarchist group called “BashBack” predominately took responsibility for these events. http://anarchistnews.org/?q=node/11968 They camped at Camp Trans actually were disruptive to Camp Trans itself, and some trans women left early because they felt uncomfortable.
The reason most trans women give that they want to attend MWMF is because they identify as women and Festival says it is ‘for all womyn’. From the very beginning of Festival ‘womYn’ was used to designate those women who were born female, and Festival was designed by, created by and for ‘womyn-born-womyn’ or those who were born and assigned female at birth, grew up as girls and are still living their lives as womyn today (unlike trans men who have transitioned from being womyn and now are living as men. A few linger on at Festival who have not yet opted out of women’s space, as I personally would think is appropriate and respectful).

I haven’t ever heard anyone when pressed actually say to me that they believe womyn-born-womyn-only space is wrong, but they do say it is transphobic. I disagree. Not all spaces are for all people. And I believe ANY group of people have a right to gather with others around a shared area of commonality and that this separate space can be quite healing and empowering for that group. I have heard a few trans women admit that they feel that going to Festival would somehow validate their womanhood. They are sadly mistaken, because all women must validate their own selves, and their own womanhood.

I wrote that list and published on the MWMF Bulletin Board because I think it is important to see that actually yes, including trans women at the Festival did have some negative consequences this year. The womyn working in the “TWBH group” for lack of better terminology (TWBH=TransWomynBelongHere http://transwomenbelonghere.blogspot.com/ ) thought that it would be no big deal, that when they organized fund raisers to raise money to buy tickets for about 5 trans women to attend (I heard about 9 attended altogether, but not sure of an accurate count), that there would be no negative consequences, and those of us defending our right to have separate space would see that all the fuss if for naught. Well, no actually. The trans women who came did cause some disruptive and violating things to occur, and aside from the incidents on this list (and there are other types of incidents not listed) many,many womyn felt violated by their presence and betrayed by the TWBH womyn who assisted them in coming.

I am personally not going to argue who is or is not a woman, or say one woman is ‘more woman’ than another. MWMF is not trying to define ‘woman’ either. It is just creating an event with a specific parameter. I will defend my right to separate space of any kind of my choosing, and I will defend the right of anyone separate space of their choosing. Framing that separate space as negative or anti-you when you aren’t invited does nothing but make you feel upset and left out. Just because I take some private space for myself, doesn’t mean I’m anti-you.
~Grace

PS Tobi, Alice and June came, and a few others I know of. Annie did not come, although I believe she was planning on it before Festival. I never saw Gemma, and I believe here when she said she did not come. I think it’s really imporatnt to be specifically accurate in this ongoing discussion.

The actions of the TWBH women is one of the most painful aspects to this whole mess. The males didn’t have to “sneak” in, they were walked right through the gates by WBW. We are never going to get through to entitled males who want to destroy what we’ve created, we all know that. The fight now is to get through to other WBW what we will lose if they continue helping these men destroy our sacred space.

“Annie did not come, although I believe she was planning on it before Festival. ”
Yes he was there. He was in the Femme Strut and was confronted by a WBW. No word on whether he had pumped his ballsack up full of IV fluid for the event.

PS Tobi, Alice and June came, and a few others I know of. Annie did not come, although I believe she was planning on it before Festival. I never saw Gemma, and I believe here when she said she did not come.

@Dave- Eww is right. But I think I’d prefer watching Annie stick needles in his dick all night long than watch 5 minutes of the sad boring porn that Tobi Hill-Meyer and Angel S./June Day are peddling. At least Annie has a work ethic. LOLOLOLOLOLOL

Interesting that 3 out of the 4 trespassers in this post are all pornographers whose life’s work is sexualizing and exploiting people who are trying to code themselves “female”.

Surely, there must be hundreds of lesbians who are security guards IRL, that could help police the front gate. No tickets should be sold to self-identified trans, and any trans who flashes a penis should be taken off the land immediately.

Womyn born womyn need to take this threat seriously. And in the past, I used to think that when womyn gather together that it might not have been as radical an act as it is. However, just see how men act and how desparate they are to destroy all wommin only spaces, and especially lesbian created spaces.

I don’t see them invading Catholic women’s organizations, or conservative straight women’s groups. I don’t see them take on right wing republican women’s groups. I see them attacking primarily radical lesbian spaces, and trying to destroy radical lesbian culture. That is what they do.

If they wanted to “pass” as women, they could do so anywhere, but where to they set up camp? Saying
No to men is THE most radical act women can do.
Saying the raped women, and women who hate men, and women who want to be around only women…oppressed classes have that right. Would trans go to an NAACP women’s event and say they are black when they aren’t?

We need to really beef up security at the gate, lesbians have got to wake up before we lose all our spaces.

Catholic woman here – no trans women do not attend groups like the Catholic Women’s League, possibly because Catholicism holds that the gender/sex you were born with is who you are. I don’t know of any trans men that attend men’s groups either.

I used to attend a group called Dove which was a woman-only spirituality group. It was really interesting to see women sing, dance and freely express themselves in ways that I never saw them do in a mixed gender environment. I have never heard of a man trying to violate that female spiritual space.

Thank you so much for this posting, Gallus. And thank you, Fab, Mary, Noan, Maggie, Cathryn, Lynn, and others for all that you said here. I have been so upset at reading about what happened at Michigan this year, including being shut down and reprimanded by the woman (not Lisa) who is using the “WomynMichfest” logo on fb. Any of us who tried to counter the use of female pronouns for these men and who refuse to call them “women” of any kind were told to stop disrespecting the men, as if going more liberal would help things. In an effort to reach those who now support “transwomen,” she is betraying those who have been fighting the strongest to protect Michigan. She may have good intentions, but it will not work. The entire situation reminds me of any other attempt in history of telling the radicals to not upset the liberals and fence-sitters, while the movement goes more right-wing — like when the democrats tried to appeal to the “centrists” and is now almost indistinguishable from the right-wing. Perhaps some hope that as these men show how typically male-minded, rape-minded and agressive as other het men, then women will be radicalized. But this has been going on for 40 years, with the result being that women take even more abuse.

In this case, the radical and courageous defenders of the precious, remaining bastion of female-only space that is Michigan, are being isolated and made to feel like they should just give up. I made a few comments on that fb thread and got a lot of new friends who agree with us. Gallus’ post exposing the horrific details of what has happened can help tremendously, but please do contact the group to let them know what you think.

Yes, Mary, I even agree about resorting to calling the police. (They were SO nice in helping us at the recent Oakland Dyke March. One even got down on the ground to retrieve something I’d dropped that rolled under his car wheels.)

I just have to comment about “Tobi.” He actually had a workshop on “transwomen Butches” at the Butch Voices conference, as well as being more welcomed than I was at the Butch Nation counter-workshops. Men are not and can never be Butches. You NEVER see a trannie looking Butch, and Tobi is no exception. He moves and lisps in an exaggerated gay male stereotypical fashion and is obviously feminine and obviously male. Men can more easily transform into dogs than play at Butch, but of course we are the extreme representation of Lesbian that they are desperate at getting at and marking territory on. We are the final frontier in a way. But since they have no idea what a woman in, they also have no idea of what a Butch is. I’m guessing they think it’s a less drag queenish version of trannie. Look at his coy little dyed-hair photo! Please can all this be put to a stop by someone with sense?!! Why are these incredibly narcissist men being so catered to?

It is an outrage that this man was given a workshop space at BV when many Butches were turned down.

It’s also very upsetting if Butches are being questioned more since all the MTFs present as feminine, while most FTMs are very Fem.

I just need to say that the Womyn Michfest private fb page has been enormously uplifting and empowering to the over 1300 womyn (and counting) who joined that page and realized how many of us do actually support the intention/boundary of MWMF as is. We were being told that we were a ‘vocal minority’ and we foudn out that is simply not true. The intention of that group is not to bash trans women or try and define who is/is not a woman. The intention of the page is to find other MWMF Intention supporters.

Who do we hold the most sacred? Is it the woman who was raped and battered by men, wanting healing on womyn’s land? Who do we honor and protect the most?

And why is it so hard for men who were born men to not understand what it would feel like to be continually violated by penis showers on womyn’s land?

And also, womyn who own the land, and celebrate the land for decades, create a morphogetic field of wommin loving sacred space. It has not been violated by men until now, or the past ten years.

Go start you own music festivals trans, go find other land to buy… loaded with money made by your male priviledge that a lot of you still carry around. Do something creative that doesn’t invade or insult our sacred land or our lesbian feminist vision.

The lesbian feminist vision does not include you at all. You have proven yourselves to be the bringer of lies and violence, of rape threats of piggish insanity… we cast you out of Artemis’ grove.

Go found your own festival, have fun, leave us to our vision, and no, I have no interest in your festival and wouldn’t want to be there to save my life!

P.S. I’d love to read the positive reports on this years Michigan. Who were the singers? What were your favorite wommin’s workshops? Let’s not let the menz waste our woman loving festival with their tactics, terror and bullying. Let us erase male energy and cast it out of the goddess grove!

I agree, Maggie and Sheila. I’m thinking we should try to get every woman who is interested in supporting Michigan to go public on their site, at fb, and everywhere we can. This is where it becomes absolutely clear that these men who want to invade and destroy everything we have, have succeeded. Maybe now we can get others involved, when it’s obvious how bad it’s become.

A friend has said that Michigan will probably end up being known for the rapes there, even more than het music festivals — unless we can stop the men.

Everyone who is WBW (and especially lesbians) should be ACTUALLY GOING TO THE FESTIVAL. Many of the people chiming in on this issue have never set foot on the land (and have various excuses, none of which wash with those of us who have sacrificed plenty to get there). If you want this event to survive, you have to put your own resources and time on the line and not just from your keyboards. The festival needs paying participants who are WBW lesbians who will love and defend it against attackers. It is NOT enough to just talk about defending it, you must participate in person, on the land.

Here’s my thinking…. let’s document what these men are doing on the land…. posting photos is a good start. If they are showing penis, get the word out about the stuff they are doing.

Most lesbians who aren’t all that political go to Michigan, they tend to be younger, and open to trans… they have never experienced the dangers, the penis in the showers, cutting the water lines to handicapped women’s trailers… so documenting this abusive invasive stuff will be key to alerting the whole lesbian community of just how bad these men really are.

Following a woman alone to her camp is outrageous, and they need to be reported to the police.

I don’t know why lesbians don’t put lesbians first, why we defer to every group but our own, but this is a self-hating sickness.

And I think there is a generation gape among women who built lesbian feminist space one brick at a time, and every woman who came along later. They don’t know that all the lesbian businesses on Valencia street are now gone, they don’t know how Old Wives tales in San Francisco was put out of business by unproved accusations… they don’t know that people destroyed Women’s Press… vandals… they don’t know about Elliot attacking and belittling old time dykes like Bev Jo.

So let’s document document document, let’s expose every trans lie, and let’s get our police at the front gates to keep these jerks out. Born womyn dykes need to know that other women will be in danger because they think trans in Michigan is harmless. It isn’t. If you want a “mixed” group, then create something else, but leave the sacred land of Michigan free of these invasive rapist pigs.

It’s not like trans haven’t taken over just about every pride parade, every film festival, every lesbian drop in group out there. Because they’ve already done the damage, they have already gotten lesbian filmmakers banned from Frameline, and they’ve already moved in on rape crisis centers among other things.

Nothing new except to the ignorant wommin who don’t really know what they do when they take over.
Lesbians, after all, like to be fair, and this can be a weakness, because we bend over backward for everyone but ourselves. Then we wonder why we are poor, because lesbian are delivery food to men with AIDS while their own sisters starve. Wake up!!

While you are free to have your own opinions regarding the MWMF, it’s unspeakably vile for you to publicly out several MtF transwomen by their stage AND legal names and photos without their consent.

Transgendered people are subject to much more extreme levels of discrimination, violence, and bigotry than we cis-women ever have been. I am appalled that a group of people who have been the subject of so much oppression are willing to further marginalize an already less-privileged group of people based on a BODY PART. It’s ludicrous to suggest that any of these people benefit from male privilege when not only do they NOT LIVE AS MEN but live as a segment of society that is at some of the greatest risk of suffering from violence and discrimination. It’s disgusting.

It’s a gross violation of these people’s privacy to out them like this against their will and put them at risk. I would hope that women, who understand what it’s like to be subjected to acts without consent, could refrain from inflicting it upon other people.

Guess I thought too highly of you all.

This post has been reported to WordPress for violations of these women’s privacy, safety, and dignity.

All of the Activists featured are public trans activists who have posted proudly of their intentions to violate the boundaries of the “womyn born womyn” policy of the Michigan Womyn’s Music Fest, and all photos are from public websites, not private. All materials are being used under Fair Use Doctrine for the purposes of education, commentary, news reporting, and criticism.
NO ONE has had their privacy violated or been put at risk. Everyone featured has proudly, publicly shared their intentions and/or actions of violating the boundaries of the private gathering of females they have trespassed and/or harassed.
Your characterization is absurd.
These activists can trespass and violate the civil rights of assembly of womyn, and write and blog about it widely, and womyn are not to respond or comment in return?
Dream on.

Your comment has been reported to God for stupidity.
And don’t think the fact that you ignore the violation of the Michfest womyn’s privacy safety and dignity has been missed. It has been duly noted you hateful person.

For the sake of discussion, would female-to-male transpeople be allowed at the Michigan Womyn’s Music Festival, since they were born as women (and may, despite living as men, still possess the requisite female anatomy?).

Hi Gabriel. The MWMF is an annual gathering for those who are born female, raised as girls, and live their lives as female. Hence the phrase “Womyn Born Womyn”. The womyn gather together on the basis of that shared experience, as a place of healing. No different than any other private gathering of people based on a shared experience. Some people feel that those who are born and live as female have no right to gather on the basis of that experience, even at private events. They feel that the experiences of women who were raised as girls are unimportant and as Gemma Seymour says, not a “valid experience” on which to meet. Not only do they believe the experiences of females raised as girls are invalid, but some are actively trying to prevent women who share those experiences from meeting together, even on private land. Those activists are featured in this post. Thankfully quite a few transwomen respect the experiences of WBW and support our right to gather on the basis of that profoundly formative shared experience.

I think private events and organizations are welcome to set any criteria they like for their participating members.

I guess my second question is how do you know that no transmen have attended? Glancing through a few photos of the event, I noticed a number of attendees wearing clothing and hairstyles traditionally considered to be masculine dress. Is there a process whereby an attendee wearing such dress is asked whether they identify as female and just happen to like that type of clothing, or whether they are in fact wanting to become male, in which case, are they asked to leave?

I ask because of the third part of your criteria: “and live their lives as female.” As a completely ignorant bystander (I’d only heard of the Michigan Womyn’s Music Festival tonight), I’m curious to know what protocols or procedures are in place to verify that criteria is being met.

I’m SO glad someone is actually taking this issue on, and in a serious way.

I find it odd that would be so much complaint over photos, especially when we saw what just happened with the death threats and cropped photo wrt the very moderate letter to the U.N. This letter simply called for reasonableness and absolutely had nothing to do with taking rights away from transfolks, as asserted on website after website. But instead the women who wrote the letter, which can be read on RadicalHub, are called the “extermination twins,” as if they’re Nazis.

I wasn’t at fest this year, but the events I read about broke my heart.

I agree the boundaries need to be enforced, and I’m all for a website calling out perps.

In an ideal world, no enforcement would be needed, but then, in an ideal world, women would actually be treated as more than sexbots undeserving of a modicum of respect.

Hey, these trans publically posted photos, they publically declared that a private event, on private property was theirs to violate at will.

Go to any male oriented rap concert, you have bouncers at the door, and people get excluded all the time.

Given that trans often pack penis, and penis is a weapon used against women, I believe that Michigan is a womyn born womyn event. It is not designed for trans, for people packing peen, for people who do not respect the private boundaries womyn set.

Can’t live by those rules, pack peen, act like invader idiots… it means you are male oriented and male acting, and you have no right to invade private land.

Period end of. Go get a huge place of your own trans, cook amazing dinners, do all the cooking, clean-up, listen to womyn born womyn and shut your damn mouths for an entire evening. Maybe you’d learn something from womyn. NO this is NOT about you, this is about womyn’s sacred radical land.

How dare you? You’ve set your movement back a
just by how you’ve invaded our land, our community, our political brilliance, go back to male lands, go back to LGBT land, get the hell out of our land you invading rapist female impersonators, get th
hell out!!

Next time, post the posters, get the dyke security guards, and throw the jerks out bodily if they come on the land again. Get the police, lock up the people tresspassing on private property, oh yeah, I forgot, men think they own everything, they own womyn, and we are supposed to let them waltz in…peen packers and all. You have got to be kidding me? No shame you male impersonators, you are acting just like the men you were born and raised to be!

In response to Zie, what is “disgusting” is continuing the cult lie that men who masquerade as women, who minstrel women, who caricature women are “subject to much more extreme levels of discrimination, violence, and bigotry than we cis-women ever have been.” Most women in patriarchy are sexually assaulted at least once. We grow up bombarded by the most offensive, grotesque, female-hating images in the media imaginable, which these men fetishize. Many, if not most of these man happily grew up with all the privileges that males are given, and many have had those privileged for decades.

It is men who commit violence against girls and women, and it is men who are violent to other men, so stop complaining to us about your beloved men.

Lesbians show far too much sympathy already to those who despise and oppress us, yet you want more taken from us? Stop using our oppression aganst us.

It’s about way more than their body parts, although those certainly are used as weapons against females. It’s their minds, and I cannot believe you really haven’t noticed how they are among the most selfish and narcissistic men imaginable.

Why do you have so little love or caring for women that you insult us by calling us the ridiculous male-invented “cis?” And why do you not support women against the men who are refusing to take “no” for an answer? Why do you so worship these incredibly oppressive men? Do you really not notice how they sexually fetishize you? Do you not notice how grotesque they are? Have you tried saying “no” to them to see the result?

“It’s about way more than their body parts, although those certainly are used as weapons against females. It’s their minds, and I cannot believe you really haven’t noticed how they are among the most selfish and narcissistic men imaginable. ”

Have more true words ever been written? You want to know the level of gynophobia and mysogyny of these “trans women” simply research how they treat the female-bodied women of history who dare oppose them. It is not those of us who are female bodied women of history insisting on invading MichFest, it is those penis packing “women” doing so. I used to debate radfems about attitudes towards women of history but I had to stop because over and over I saw for myself they were right.

If you let the tranny camel’s nose in the tent it will be making a mess on the carpet in no time flat. When that happens everything is suddenly all about the trans and nothing to do with feminist woman’s issues. As a woman of history I have seen this over and over and over and why, even though it excludes me as well, I fully support the right of those who wish woman born woman space, events and businesses to do so. Tranny excesses simply make it impossible to do otherwise.

Sorry I didn’t get to attend Fest this year, but had I encountered these man/boys I would have roared right then and there. I’ve taken ass kickings for being a Dyke so I am not ever backing down from any man or boy at Fest. I agreed to abide with the Fest rules, and I will LOUDLY enforce Fest WBW policy. This Dyke isn’t afraid, polite, or well behaved. Go figure. Why aren’t more Dykes protecting our Community?

Definitely click the “fled their own encampment” link that GM embedded in her text..

Okay, I’ll get this out of the way really quick: Right. He’s a woman. So believable.

But listen to what he says–he wants a “trans-woman centric space” at Camp Trans??? Oh, but we’re not allowed a woman-centric space, i.e., Michigan? Everyone but actual women are allowed to have a boundary.

And all the calls to “burn it to the ground.” Women have got to take these threats seriously. These are MEN, and they are mentally unstable men, and they mean it when they threaten violence. What is it going to take for women at Fest to stop defending men and acknowledge the truth–they are men, they hate us just as much as other men? This is going to keep escalating.

Yes I too had the misfortune to ‘watch the can’t be unwatched’. Basically this Annie Danger dude makes amateur wank-porn videos – in another one that I skipped through, he is pretending to be a female minister at the podium, which towards the end has him standing there in his underwear (turning NOBODY else on except himself). He is the posterchild of autogynephilia, actually, in the wank intro spoof at the start of the video GM linked to, he fluttered around words like autoandrophiliac and autogyneandrophiliac. He is definitely the latter, turning himself on with his male and faux-female parts.

When you contrast his true self (his wank videos) with the bullshit ‘letter’ about why dudes like him should be let into MichfFest, the truth is 100% clear.

And also, womyn who own the land, and celebrate the land for decades, create a morphogetic field of wommin loving sacred space. It has not been violated by men until now, or the past ten years.

Thank you, Sheila. It is not only about womyn, but also about the sacred land. Men, particularly the most entitled men, have destroyed land everywhere. They see it as an object to be used. They see it as a “right” to exploit for profit, for their own unseeing, unfeeling, unhearing selfishness. The land cries out everywhere, cries out in agony. Everything is dying, plants, creatures, water, air, and soil. Humans are also dying and even entitled men will die if they get to act out their entitlements. Their idea of winning appears to be that they will be the ones who die out last. And die with unearned privileges intact. Nonsense! Enough!

The born-males who act out these entitlements at Michigan desecrate the land. They have made a web of lies that it is they who need to be protected, that it is they who are victimized. This is a reversal. It is the very entitlement that is causing the harm.

Lesbians are in a position to understand this sacred land and the sacredness of womyn together on sacred land. Lesbians are in a position to stand against this exploitation in minds, hearts, and bodies in a way that no one else can. Lesbians are in a position to remember, to see, hear, and feel in a way others do not.

For anyone new to the Mich Fest experience, etc. you can go to the forum on their web site (Michigan Womyn’s Music Festival) for much, much, much more information about the festival and everything surrounding it. Just spend some time on the web site, you’ll learn a lot and you’ll find the forum on there.

And let me say this again: COME TO THE FESTIVAL. There is no point in saving it if women don’t financially support it by attending. The dates in August next year are already set. If you start planning now for transportation and ticket costs, logistics of getting there and camping for a week, you can make it work. There are a bunch of women who are very happy to give advice and insight into how to make it work. That’s really what the forum is good at — connecting all of us between festivals. There are also touring events, ways to stay connected, and you can find out more about the performers who you can see in your neck of the woods the rest of the year. Just in the last 4 months or so I’ve seen been to 6 local concerts by the performers that I’ve seen at Michigan.

The fear of some long-time festies is that we are being replaced by a younger generation who doesn’t care about the same things. That isn’t true of course, there are plenty of young women who are fierce about the exact same things older dykes are. But the point is that we need EVERYONE to come to the festival and continue making it what it has always been. And you can only truly know what that is by being there. It’s not like anything else on earth.

That’s really good, Kitty. I agree. I recently got in trouble on a het woman’s fb thread because a very agressive man responded with insult and cohersion to something I said. The reason I’m bringing it up here is that I like and respect that woman and her work, but her connection to men means she has to be oblivious to some of their aggression and plain nastiness. For all of our protection, we have to recognize when men are doing this, including when they are men trying to trick or force us into accepting them as women. Even with the ones who seem nice at first, they soon reveal themselves if you say the smallest “no” to them. I do see a tremendous difference between the writing of females and males, which means that the female impersonators are very transparent. I wish all females would see it as clearly as so many of us now do.

I just love what Katie, Catkisser, Jaye, Carmen, Maggie, Kitty and the rest of you have said.

So what can we do? A friend has asked if a woman is raped at Michigan, would that finally convince the male supporters, but then she said no, the woman would not be believed because the men are already coming first.

I want to suggest an ongoing group to plan strategy and just to share support, so that no woman feels alone and in grief about all this. We need an alternative to being told to behave and be quiet on the fb Michfest site, where we can say whatever we like. This is the best place we have for now, but Gallus will need to continue bringing us more topics. So what do you think? Would an fb group be the place? If we set it up, then we can invite everyone else we know, including those threatened with banning from the Michfest site. You can reach me at Slakewings@aol.com.

I’m wondering if this could be part of the resurgence of Radical Lesbian Feminism that started in the Seventies. Unlike the Michfest fb strategy, I believe that the more of us who dare to say what we think — no man can ever be female — then the more other women will agree and be strengthened. After all, deep down, everyone already knows it. They just have to leave the cult.

Never thought I’d ever agree with kitty on anything, but I must say, the assumption that we HAVE TO accept anything as women is b.s. No we don’t have to accept men wearing dresses invading our sacred lands, no we don’t have to accept trans invasion of radical feminism, and all their attempts to take away “women’s studies” and turn it into “gender” studies. Because men say so, I don’t think so.

No one tells me who to accept or not accept, and their bad behavior forcing themselves onto women’s land when they were told specifically it was a private event NOT for them is colonization, and degredation of women. That is what men do, and I don’t accept them for one minute in our worlds that we worked so hard to create.

It’s a place for wimmin born wimmin, and even FtTrans should really get that if they want to “be men” they have no business in wimmin only groups either. Go to the men’s groups…geez.

And NO we don’t even have to call them women because they aren’t, they are men who had their bodies cut up by doctors, their bodies are immitations of how men think women are, but it is not at all how our bodies function or how we are either. that is their delusion and I don’t accept it for one minute men.

I thought it was worth mention that on Alice K’s blog, he discusses how he felt a group discussion the boundaries women set should be focused on trans needs. His supporters also don’t see a problem with him describing his first experience with masturbation, because, hey, transgendered men get “triggered” (read: infuriated) by womyn setting boundaries.

And then he says he plans to come next year.

If the intent of festival is to have any meaning, it’s going to be enforced.

I couldn’t watch that entire Annie D. video you posted. Wow. Just wow. One can only hope something like that would be a huge wake-up call to born-women.

June Day came onto a group of mine, that was about the Twilight Zone and ANNOUNCED that June WOULD be going to Michfest, and I said “We are NOT debating the WBW Policy in my group!” I’m the moderator. June kept insisting on June’s right to attend Michfest and to be in my group, each time I said ‘you’re violating the space by your presence’
and FINALLY even had the gaul to speak of June’s experiences AT Michfest and that June wanted to starte a ‘trans positive group(ON MY GROUP) about the Twilight Zone’ and whined that I had discriminated against June and deleted each of June’s threads FOR intending to VIOLATE THE POLICY. I deleted ALL of June Day’s comments and threads on my group. June’s intentions were very clear that June would be going to Michfest despite the policy and my own warnings to June.

Till my dying day, I will support the Policy of WBW only at Michfest, and have seen it violated the two times I went(2001 and 2003), including a party I went to where the doorkeeper was full FTM(NOT strongly masculine hardcore hirsute Butch), with the body/facial hair and scratchy hormone induced voice. Because of his presence I left the party in about 15 minutes and didn’t feel comfortable there. Also at Michfest, there was a wonderful singing circle after Ruth Barrett’s Sunday concert, and one pretty obvious to me MTF cried and cried and made it all about them how ‘oppressed they felt’ and got all the women to give them attention, and took away from the singing circle. Thinning male pattern baldness hair and the typical features after studying them for 1/2 an hour, as well as the self seeking all about me,me, me behavior counting on bio-female women’s sympathies to cater to them…..I did not feel comfortable staying at the women’s singing circle after this dramarama…..and did feel violated feeling I was in safe wbw space connecting with other wbw.

There was another I suspected that was one of the busdrivers for DART.
-FeistyAmazon

I have been arguing with Gemma over this post. I think the biggest problem is the “transgender umbrella” which includes some pretty freaky people. Gemma told me the radfems want to divided us and I replied “I WANT THAT”! I am not trying to force anyone to accept me as a woman but I most certainly don’t want to be grouped with perverts. The “Transgender” movement is more about rights for men than rights and protections for women.

Womyn-with-a-y means “100% lesbian” the way I learned it, so I feel a bit funny about posting here at all just for that. But THIS??? This is what’s been going on at Fest? This is who Bilerico is promoting? These are the people Lyon-Martin has been using donor money to enable at the direct expense of financially strapped females? Mr. Big Bag of Saline, what the frick’n frack?

I sensed that something was very wrong with “the T” but couldn’t have imagined these depths of depravity in my wildest nightmares. I’m wide awake now; thank you for documenting the atrocities, GM and others. Whatever you all decide to do about it, you have my full support and please let me know if I can help.

If I’ve intruded, apologies for it and I’ll show myself out, but can I borrow some brain-bleach to wipe that video out of my head first? Please?

It seems like the transwomen are doing more damage to their community by trying to get into michfest. Seriously fucking chill. Society seems to go towards inclusion, just let it happen. You people are fucking up and making your community look bad.

Just have to mention (off topic) that WP is throwing a hissyfit over the last few days on comment timestamps (including at my blog). Making it quite difficult to follow these longer, nested comment threads.

Thankyou for this post. The best part is how the trans claim their privacy has been violated, yet that all the information and images featured here were taken from what they themselves publicised.

I guess the outrage that others might discuss public information is all part of the trans delusion and entitlement to the world’s participation. I say I’m a woman cuz I say so, therefore you have to play along; failure to do so is a violation of my rights. I say that information I have made public is private cuz I say so, therefore you have to play along; failure to do so is a violation of my rights. Perhaps the information is “trans private”?

It really is something, isn’t it? These guys have been posting proudly- some of them for years- about their actions trespassing and/or harassing those who wish to gather at a private event on the basis of the shared experience of being born and living as females. Not only do these guys demand that females have no constitutional rights to assemble at a private event, but they insist we have no right to DISCUSS their actions and anti-female activism. I guess they believe that women have no right to “talk back” to males, even (or especially?) transgender ones.

Thankfully, several SANE transsexuals and transgenders have posted in this thread and leant their support.

I do not object to Mitchfest rules on only allowing Womyn Born Womyn. There are things women born transsexual can’t experience that women born women have. I will never know what it is like to grow from a young girl to womanhood. I have experienced male privilege for the majority of my life.This is something I can’t change. I can, however, unlearn that privilege and can support rights and protections for all women, including those born transsexual. I can’t support those who claim the transgender status, however, because the majority of transgender reeks of testosterone. When I hear the term “transgender woman” I have to wonder what the hell that person is. Are they a crossdressing male? A sissy maid? Do they mock women with their fetishes? Why would a woman born a true transsexual ever accept that label? To me, it is bizarre but then the Transgender Zoo is just bizarre.

Transgender rights is more about men’s rights than it is for women’s rights and protections. There is more testosterone than estrogen there and they are the transgender leadership. It makes sense they would want to try and crash Mitchfest.

I think the radfem community would be better served if they focused on those who identify as transgender. Transsexuals who don’t identify as transgender are not like those in the videos in the article and most certainly not a threat to the safety of women. Most of these women born transsexual are concerned and fight for the rights and protections of all women. I am not a threat to women…I am an ally.

The thing is, the fight between TG and TS is their fight. If feminists were to accept one or appease one, then it would be the equivalent of the water slowly coming to a boil without the frog being aware. The TS want to pass as females and believe they do, simply because they are castrated. Castrated or not, no male can become what I am. A male is a male is a male. To parse one out as more worthy of feminist energy is problematic. Are any of them worth feminist energy? And neither one have the right to tell females what they should or should not be doing, or what is better for females to do or what is best for feminists.

So, just for the record, I understand the position/argument, I just don’t think it is beneficial for females to accept that argument.

I will back out here though, because, I already wouldn’t allow males of any stripe to even have their voice in my space, because their voices are heard everywhere. However, I respect what others do with their space.

I know, the accusation of ‘outing’ was the funniest (and most inaccurate) thing I have heard in a while.

It seems that by the mere act of Googling something, that has become twanzphobic now? LOLOLOLOLOL

If I was a fly on the wall for the court case “But Your Honour, she had the nerve to Google stuff, and type words together in one place – it was twanzphobic!!”.

It is very similiar to when Collina came onto my blog demanding that I “cease and desist”. It’s a dude thing. They are so used to the law being on their side, they think the law will also come to their aid with their fairytale charges as well. They are just so used to having the privilege of double standards, they think it applies to everything.

Kitty, what DLT was saying (probably phrased badly) is that there is a split under the twanzgender parasol, with transsexuals distancing themselves from the rest of the freakshow that is under the parasol (whom the TS call “Tee Gees”). The transsexuals are being targeted as viciously as we radfems, by people like Sandeen (I think GM gave the link above).

I can at least respect people like DLT, who recognise that they have no right to crash WBW space. The “Tee Gee” freaks don’t.

I just have to comment again. Look at that smug Tobi’s face, and remember that this man was honored with being able to present a workshop on “Butch Transwomen” at the Butch Voices conference while true Butches were denied the time and space. Last time, over 100 Butches came to the Female-identified workshop — some crying from desperation and lack of support — but this year, no such workshop.

Remember, the vast majority of misogynist males were raised by mothers. Females need to remember that. These males suck the energy from females (mothers primarily), then when grown, using the gift their mothers gave them, actively hate and oppress other females.

That post at your blog is brilliant! Yes, males are cuckoos. We’d written years ago in our book and earlier articles about Lesbians and women giving birth to our enemy, to those who may someday sexually assault and even kill them or their sisters. Another aspect is that many of these men will later have the power to incarcerate their mothers in mental institutions and nursing homes. 85% of Lesbian’s who get pregnant have males. It’s like a science fiction nightmare.

I remember the story of the Lesbian activist murdered by her son.

Yes, most men, most rapists, torturers, murderers were raised by loving mothers who tried so hard to make them be good. Ted Bundy talked about his loving family. Ted, who worked at the rape crisis center and who was so praised as a good man and feminist. Ted, who raped and murdered countless little girls and women.

I always say, you never know what they are doing when alone with babies and animals….

And about the abused becoming abuser? Another excuse for men. If that was the case, then most women would be serial rapists and murderers.

No, please, feminists who support the men. Listen to the men. They tell us it is biology. They ought to know.

Yes, stop feeding and supporting the cuckoos who are out to harm you and our kind. Finally, put females before males.

It really is quite simple…. it is a complete waste of time engaging the trans in any way … radical women are in search of freedom. We want to spend time with women to overthrow male supremacy in all its forms. The trans issue is just another male derailment.

And again, kitty is quite correct to never allow men to comment on her blog. They’ve been consistent about this. Gallus your blog is your blog, but I believe if you even allow men a voice on here, it is time away from radical women talking to each other.

We know from decades of experience that it is a complete waste of time engaging men on radical feminism. Radical feminism wants men forever out of the room and out of the discussion.

We know women need to seriously talk to each other, we knows males suck the air out of a room… since men have had a couple of thousand years to do male only political stuff, it’s time for women to realize that a an female conversation is exactly what the trans are trying to destroy at Michigan. They are literally giving the male game away again.

You will see more power to your blog if you kick out the male voice entirely. Power up women, do not engage the enemy…. even a little bit… they will never give in unless we freeze them out, and develop a solid front against male supremacy in all its forms. And males always have an excuse… one day it is trans, the next it is something else. Always a waste of time.

I have thoroughly enjoyed the endless exposure that radical feminists are doing with camp tranz. I just want to LMAO! Well, I do, LMAO! There have been many highlights but some just take the cake, such as accusing females of outing males who have clearly out-ed themselves. The hypocrisy, double-speak, and the demand for us not to see what we see or hear what we hear is just so maddening that it is hilarious.

So, here is a question for you. Where are the black trans women, gaining access and disrespecting the Festival intent? I think it is safe to say, you won’t find any, because as black mtf, they get it. This issue is a uniquely, white male to female, privilege in action!

It’s also interesting to me how it is mostly post-op transsexuals (who believe -and assert- that their experiences as transsexuals are different than others under the “trans umbrella”) are also the ones who are able to respect the difference in experience of those born female. Not true across the board, but seems to be a trend.

It can be easier sometimes to see the harm in appropriating other’s stories and spaces, when you face some of the same things being done to you.

I try very hard to respect other’s spaces, and I have no desire to be where I’m not welcome. When I saw hedonistic testosterone-driven fetishistic transvestites start invading private spaces and appropriating my story, it was a kind of a slap in the face. It was also a bit of a wake-up call.

There is some incredible narcissism in the “trans” community. Some of it is to be expected – transition is a choice made to benefit yourself, and it often comes at huge expense to others – family ties, relationships, children. Even so, it never ceases to amaze me how for some, that selfishness becomes a way of life. They “demand” that you see them as they see themselves, and if you don’t, you are met with violence, emotional blackmail, and legal threats.

Love, compassion, empathy, and mutuality can’t be built on force – they can only be given – freely, not taken. No two people are the duplicates of each other, but we all have things we share (including some forms of patriarchal oppression), and some things we do not (risk of impregnation, growing up with a female experience).

While I can not, and would not speak for the community as a whole, there are those of us who celebrate your right to self-determination, to build a safe space based on common ground – regardless of whether said common ground includes us or not. Many of us work to try to show others the harm they inflict in forcing themselves (physically, emotionally, or legally) upon others. Often times, people are more receptive to messages from people they feel are “like themselves”.

Reading through this and other forums, I see the reverie, the reverence, and respect that attendees have for Michfest. I would love to understand and feel the power the festival has, It sounds like an awesome place to meet and connect, but it is not my place, nor do I have some “birthright” by which to claim it. So, I find enjoyment in seeing the joy and peace that others find in their spaces, and I look for a space of my own.

I cringe when I see the violence and coercion that men do to women every day, and try to figure out what I can do to help. It’s abhorrent when that violence is done by proxy (to women’s spaces). For what it’s worth, it will not be done by me, nor will I associate with or tolerate those who do.

Title IX, affirmative action and other similar laws were designed to help women and non-whites get access to male controlled everything. That was the purpose of it all.

Michigan is a private event owned and operated by lesbians for the benefit of lesbians. It is the right for women to create safe space for other women, and as Camp trans amply proves, trans do not create safe for women. They have brought violence, sexual threats and disrespect into Michigan.

It is not discrimination to create compensatory institutions where few such places existed for women or non-whites.

Males don’t dictate to women within radical feminist space, that’s why it’s radical. And so what the Michigan women will have to do, is police the land more. Trans women will have to rejected solidly at the gate, the gate crashers have been warned. Again, you don’t negotiate as women with terrorists, with MtTrans… it doesn’t work. Because they will further degrade the spirit of Michigan if they were allowed in, and it will go down hill. Women born women will stop coming. I know I don’t go to a lot of lesbian events now because of the trans invasion. We have found other venues.

And if you are pre-op, what you are doing is even worse.

So we must understand that this has escalated, as most male threats and violence do. And trans are simply the newest male domination tactics to come on the scene.

It takes lesbians a very long time to get, that the loss of lesbian space, the loss of women’s space often cannot be reclaimed. We have a whole generation of young lesbians unaware what it is like to speak to all lesbian groups, what that power and respect FEELS like in a room.

Trans destroy this, because trans have not transitioned out of a male entitlemant brain, thus they claim, as most underminers do that reverse discrimination occurs, they believe that women who want full human rights don’t even have them yet.
An oppressed people that wants a land of its own is not discrimination against anyone… they are the oppressed.

This is raw power here, raw rapism here… and women have just got to wake up that there will be a confrontation and it won’t be nice eventually.

And trans do not understand or comprehend the life of born women, not even close. This will not change ever, and you can’t “be nice” to these people, because that is what women try to do with men…placate them, hope that they will leave women alone, put up with it. We all know that this has never worked.

It is not discrimination to create compensatory institutions where few such places existed for women or non-whites.

This is true.

I would like to point out a logical flaw in the twanz argument. They want in to places like MichFest, won’t create their own TwanzFest, yet maintain they are “the mostest oppressest of ALL women”. Well, you would think they would, as the mostest oppressest group, want to create their own healing space, wouldn’t ya? But no, not our M2Ts. They are so fucking male, they can’t even create their own space, they get some female to do it for them.

And guess what, if they did create their own TwanzFest, then WBW would be extremely unlikely to crash it. Who the fuck would want to?

Oh my god, that disgusting “Annie” was there?!! Oh, typical for these men to be drawn to the grotesque Fem Strut crap. Why doesn’t he have a medical accident?

I’m responding to a much earlier post that I missed — It’s simply not fair to say we should all go and excuses “don’t wash.” I’m sorry, but that’s incredibly ableist when you are talking to disabled Lesbians. I went in 1982 and afterwards, but physically and financially, I can’t do it now. I’m chronically ill with very little income. If it wasn’t for the horrific effect on my health (which I experienced in the late Eighties and which was permanent) I would go. I am not the only one who has been supporting Michigan for years and cannot go the way it is now. If I could drive there, it might be possible, but not any other way. (And I also can no longer drive solid for 4 days or more.) When would a Lesbian saying they just couldn’t do it be accepted? What level of illness or disability?

Are there no “scholarships” or emeritus grants for women like Bev Jo? LOL. Seriously, there must be quite a few who could use financial help getting there, both for transportation and food costs, and to be able to stay in inexpensive motels along the journey. I know that’s how I would have to travel now. And still arrive half dead. Anyway, are there?

Muerk had an intersting observation about why MtTrans don’t attend the women’s Catholic league.
I believe lesbians will be plagued by these trans invasions until lesbians get the clue that no trans presense every truly benefits lesbians. This is issue is a complete and utter waste of time, and it endangers other lesbians to allow this to happen.

Gallus made a valid point about 3 out of the 4 trans gate crasher at Michigan turn out to be pornographers. Do lesbians really want other lesbians to suffer the presense of male pervs and pornsters?

Having read Alice Kafarski’s post and having seen plenty of other writing on the topic, I have to wonder: what would these conversations be like if white transpeople would stop co-opting women of color, their history, and their struggles to make their points?

@AnotherBridgeOnMyBack The answer to your question is they would lose a very large, integral part of their arsenal. The main weapon of claiming the [SIC] ‘the struggle for trans isuues is very like those who are black or other minorities’. Which as any rational being will tell you, is bullshit.

What makes the argument by many (not all) white trans folks truly sickening, is that canned crap, where they try to say they are ashamed of their privilege. Like what is being said, in the shadow of recent events. Amazing these folks would say this, considering that for years….many have treated minorities and women, with the patronizing tone one would use with a parrot. (the examples of this, if counted would fill the memory of several Cray servers).

The co-opting will end, when at some point….the populus realizes that many of the rights issues that many trans want to share in, are nothing but land grabs by a bunch of melanin-deficient folks, who are playing a bad game of Monopoly or Risk. With the lives of people they aspire to be like, yet hate, despise and want as second class citizens in the balance.

in response to Kathrin
“but it is not my place, nor do I have some “birthright” by which to claim it. ”

The whole “birthright”-thing sucks. We call it nobility. As a matter of fact I would not be happy there even if transsexuals were allowed on the grounds, when men categorially aren’t. I have to say that from the perspective of Northern Europe, where I live, this whole discussion around Michfest is a showcase of bigotry in America.

“I cringe when I see the violence and coercion that men do to women every day”

I think women are bunch of disgusting liars and some of the stories about rape, not to speak of harassment, are made up. A woman invents a story about rape to rip off money from a poor immigrant man, when they had entered her apartment in good and happy consensus.

I wasn’t speaking to nobility, per se. My point was that there is no “man card” one is handed at birth that somehow magically gives one the “right” to go wherever one wishes, even if your presence is unwelcome.

As a practical matter, men may behave as if there is such a right, but that doesn’t make it ethical, justified, or appropriate.

“As a matter of fact I would not be happy there even if transsexuals were allowed on the grounds, when men categorially aren’t.”

Seriously, it really doesn’t matter if you are “happy” with it, because IT’S NOT ABOUT YOU. People have a right to organize, to associate, to build community with whomever they want, and you don’t have to give them “permission” to do so. Call it “bigotry” if you like, but it’s the ethical thing to do.

The KKK is morally abhorrent. They are repugnant, vile creatures blinded by hate and anger towards a group of people who have done no wrong. Despite that, I would give up my life if necessary to protect their right to have their own spaces, their own beliefs, even while I condemn them for those same beliefs. It is the only consistent way for me to support my right to exclude them from my spaces. I don’t go crash their assemblies, their churches, their gatherings, and in exchange I demand the respect that they do likewise.

“I think women are bunch of disgusting liars and some of the stories about rape, not to speak of harassment, are made up. A woman invents a story about rape to rip off money from a poor immigrant man, when they had entered her apartment in good and happy consensus.”

Many HUMAN BEINGS are disgusting liars. Consequently, any reasonably sized group of people you can come up with (religion or lack thereof, political system, ethnicity, culture) will have liars in it. This includes women, who make up an _extremely_ large portion of the population (go figure!). Rape is a tool. Accusation of rape is also a tool. The former is always misused. The latter (like any tool in the history of mankind) is on occasion misused too.

Again, I can’t speak for the experiences of the human race, but I can speak for mine. I can also speak for my family. Rape happens. It is violent, it is traumatizing, and it is scary. The possibility of rape is often used to control through fear and intimidation. It can happen at the hands strangers, coworkers, family, friends, loved ones. I’ve fled in terror from people who wished to do me harm: if I was “lucky”, they just wanted to harass and intimidate me. If I wasn’t so “lucky”, rape and murder were possibilities. When I called for help, all I got was disbelief, and victim-blaming (from a female officer, no less), and a threat of a ticket for something unrelated.

Maybe I’m one of those “disgusting liars”. Maybe my family members, and the women I’ve worked and associated with are too. Regardless, the fact that some women somewhere lie doesn’t mean that all women everywhere are liars, any more than the fact that some men are liars make all men liars.

Pot, kettle, black. You say that you are not misogynist and expect me to buy that? LOL

I am only openly misogynist. Some white women lure black men to have sex with them. I know, I would love to have sex with a black male someday. I think black people look better than us white people, but in this climate, white skin needs less maintenance. After they have sex in full agreement, the woman starts yelling “rape, rape” and files a report and bad authorities believe all she says. And the black fellow pays his heavily earned euros to compensate the harm done, probably goes to prison and might even get deported.

It is so bad that local males here don’t even look at us, but get their brides from Bimbonesia or Bimbo-China or wherever or watch porn.

You know, the surgery is so botched, that penetration hurts every time, so I am actually afraid of having sex with a guy, even though I am attracted to them sexually. And peeing hurts also. Ten years after the surgery.

I am not even asking where your so-called empathy is that you supposedly learned playing with dolls when you were little (except that some of you didn’t play with dolls, but learned it nonetheless), because I think you are cool and calculating. I pretty much think like in 1001 Arabian nights, women are evil, smart and in control, men are naive dumbasses.

@Fab- Yes I was doing a quick moderation fly-by and one slipped through. It’s good for people to see how incredibly hateful, violent, misogynist, racist, and insane some of these guys are though. Stacy S is a prime example. I spammed most of his (many many many) comments.

Stacy S, you are no longer welcome to comment. Your scary madness has been duly noted.

oh my god….yes, do let everyone see how completely disgusting, oppressive, evil, and repulsive these transholes all seem to be. There seems to be a thread throughout all the writing I’ve seen by female impersonators, where, even when some start out sounding concerned and with some understanding of feminism (after years of trying to copy and never coming close) they all end up being as offensive and as far from female as possible.

The lack of understanding, lack of compassion, or anything but their own narcissism and aggrieved complaining just shows through. Are any other males this bad?

But it’s helpful to show to the women who keep appearing on threads and blogs to call anyone “bigot” who dares defend our culture and community. For those who so love and champion these men, please look at them and how they think. Please recognize when someone is clearly your enemy.

Honestly, I appreciated a chance to see the vitriol and attitude. I just wish it hadn’t come at your expense.

I’ve seen a lot of bashing of radfems from within “the [t] community”, but logic and empathy always seemed more appropriate to me.

I wanted to see for myself why radfems felt the need to specifically speak out against trans individuals. Now, it makes a lot more sense. You have every right to be upset, and we (as a community) are going out of our way to be rude, invasive, and violate any boundaries. Nobody shouldn’t have to defend themselves in your own spaces, or defend their right to exist. You get denigrated for standing up for yourself, when instead you should be lauded for doing what is right, even in the face of harassment and coercion.

Maybe it won’t do a whole lot of good, but what kind of person would I be if others (who purport to speak for the “community” I get lumped in with) invade, colonize, and harass while I stood idly by? My ethics won’t allow it. One person can’t change the world, but I will call people on their behavior when I see it, and do what I can to make things just a little bit better.

In the not too distant future, I may have the honor of assisting a daughter with finding her own path in the world. I have a duty, an obligation, to do what I can to help make this world the kind of safe, supportive environment she (and my sisters, and every woman on the planet) has a right to.

I am saddened to read of all the rancor and sheer vulgarity brought about by the invaders of the phallocentric shemale cult who have taken what ought to be a beautiful and most spiritual event of Sisterhood and turned it into a misogynistic predatory attempt at domination and control.

But then again, I would have liked to have gone to the Michigan Womyn’s Music Festival back when it began in 1976- the year I began transition which led to my having had sex reassignment surgery in 1977.

[Yeah, No Teresa Ellen Reeves, I’m not going to post your 1662 word comment, much of it I’ve seen cut and pasted all over the internet, all about your hard knock life and how having a hard life erases male privilege. No.
Also, don’t bother with your “sadness” at the “phalocentric she-male cult” bullshit. I’ve seen your crazy-ass “Taking Down The Dyke Klux Klan of MichICan” post (and I have the screen caps to prove it). Even other transwomen are horrified at your behavior. You are an aggressive, woman-hating person- this is why women and other transpeople reject you in your daily life. -GM]

It would be a dream if I could have been invited to perform my songs of Sisterhood at Michigan. But then I am reading of too much hatred and no love there and I don’t want to go to a place where I am not welcomed or loved. But I belong to the Sisterhood of Real Women. Because all I ever wanted to be was a woman, a respected woman among women and a female-bodied one at that. Ard that is what I became.

[Yeah, so that’s yer dream. So what. “But I belong to the Sisterhood of Real Women. Because all I ever wanted to be was a woman, a respected woman among women and a female-bodied one at that.” You belong where women don’t want you because it’s all you ever wanted? No. Just because you want something doesn’t mean you can force women to accommodate your desires. Find another dream, or keep dreaming. Stop bullying women. Now. -GM]

[P.S. You are not wanted or loved on this blog. But then you knew that.]

Well, thanks to the Secret Trannysquirrel named Dave,
I now suspect that his name must have been Davina before he squirreled away his womanhood for a male-identified name. It’s as accurate as guessing that my name must have been Alan or supposing someone used to be known as Phalice Gag.

And congratulations on declaring Dana Lane Taylor to be your designated transsexual feminist ally of the moment.
14 minutes and counting.

Of course I know this will never make it past moderation– which is why I preserve these comments for an audience that finds your hatred of transsexual women to be nothing more than misogynistic hate speech in butch drag. But then again you wouldn’t know or respect a real transsexual feminist, anyway.

Well well what a surprise. The “real” Teresa Ellen Reeves makes an appearance. What was that about NOT wanting to go places where you know you are NOT welcomed or loved?
More bullshit. I suspect bullying your way into places where women don’t want you is one of your greatest thrills.

Look you delusional nutcase, you’re not a woman, you’re a transsexual woman, you will be a transsexual for the rest of your life in your hideous cheap blonde wig, pre-op, post-op, it doesn’t matter you will still be a transsexual, forever. Stop hating yourself, take pride in what and who you are.

Do you think your right to be considered a ‘real’ woman trumps the rights of a rape victim to have a place where she feels safe? You’re a frigging nutcase, transsexuals like me (you know blanchard’s homosexual transsexual) wish people like you would go away and stop bullying us out of your support groups telling us we’re fags and drag queens just as your bullying these poor people, I don’t know how much I can stress how much we hate you in your little upper middle class houses with your convertabiles with your former careers as macho Sgt. friggin joe of the fifth brigade. I hate it that when I say I’m a transsexual and immediatly people think of me as some nutbar running around harrarsing rape victims in a tacky wig screaming at everyone around you how your not a fag your really a straight woman. Just go away. Do you understand just how insane you sound running around calling yourself a feminist, running around bullying and frightening women, then you turn around and call actual women born as women mysgonists. You’re an absolute nutcase, I don’t care if you payed off a gender therapist 200/hr to give you a letter declaring you’re sane you are completely delusional.

I don’t want to be pulled into a fight that has nothing to do with the original reason I came here. I am here because Cathy Brennan and Elizabeth Hungerford included my name and an article I have on my wiki site in a document sent to the U.N. I feel we all have at least one common interest and that is to keep the testosterone filled transgender community out of women’s private spaces. I don’t have to agree with everything that Gallus and everyone else here believes. And I am not here to “make” them accept me as a woman. I know I have experienced male privilege…If I could pour acid on myself and wipe all that away, I would but I can’t.

Do I support every word on this site? No…I can’t. Do I support Gallus in her right to say these words? Yes, I can. The transgender umbrella is to thank for a lot of this crap. Any woman born transsexual that identifies as transgender is helping to keep us all down. There is more testosterone in transgender than estrogen and you can tell because of the way transgender smells.

15 minutes of fame, right? Who gives a shit? What is this “fame” I am experiencing? I have been made an outcast by almost everyone and now you seem to be focusing on me. I don’t want any part of it but if you want to attack me, go right ahead. I am getting used to it.

Dana, you are a good person. I don’t agree with anyone 100% of the time either – and that’s okay. We are advocating a legislative proposal. I am also tired of the accusations against me. Happily, making accusations doesn’t make them true. Best to you.

The transgender umbrella has absolutely nothing to do with this, stop blaming it on them, those people were all transsexuals and identified as transsexuals that did those things. You don’t see transgendered people all over the internet spouting homophobia and hate. In fact most transgendered non-transsexuals are proud of who they are, being genderqueer androgynous and whatever. I really couldn’t see an androgynous guy acting in the aggressive manner these people do. The rest of the transgendered community just seems to be taking it from us or staying silent, you hardly even see them fight back at all the slurs the transsexual community is always spewing at them.

Wow… wow. I followed a link from Radfemhub… I am brand-new to this whole thing re: trans-folks (usually mtf, why is this?) and the issues vis a vis radical feminist spaces… my mind is blown. Any helpful links, I’ll read them. I want (need) to understand this. Thank you all for posting your thoughts.

I’m almost in tears right now I’m so ashamed of what has been done to you women. I want to crawl in a hole and die. As a transsexual I just want to say I’m so so sorry for the things these its have said and done. Please don’t think we’re all like this someone like me came out very young and has spent their entire lives being ridiculed for being a fag and a transsexual, These people are all rich white breeders that lived as macho men and then started stealing their wive’s panties at age 35, for them it’s a sexual fetish. They are doing this because they hate themselves as transsexuals to the very core that they have to run around and force their moronic delusions on everyone, no matter if they’re scaring rape victims or abusing women. I know exactly how these people think and I think it’s important to let you know that it is impossible to have dialogue with them as they are completely and utterly batshit insane. After spending an hour in a transsexual support group listening to them you’ll think a schizophrenic is normal. Right, the head of my pride center is running around telling everyone she’s a real woman in a pink fucking plastic wig, with clown makeup and a football players body frame, driving in the convertible she bought enjoying the last 30 years of her breeder privilege, absolutely fucking batshit insane, telling me she knows what it’s like to face the discrimination I faced being out at 14, just a complete and utter nutcase. Don’t be afraid to use violence if you have too as these shitheads were the same people that wouldn’t have given a second thought to beating me to within an inch of my life for being a fag in high school, I’ve heard some of these walking pieces of shit actually admit to bashing fags and beating their wives and tell me I should feel sorry for them as they did it because of their gender dysphoria.. One piece of shit told me his gender dysphoria was so bad he shot a bullet into a wall 3 inches away from his wive’s head then expected me to feel sorry for him. You can’t have much respect for your wife or mother if you’re stealing her panties for your sick fetish, right? I’m sorry these things are being done to you by these walking pieces of shit, we’re not all like that, some of us just want to have nice quiet lives. I have only gratitude for the feminists that fed and clothed me when I lived on the streets. Feminists and LGB people gave me a place to sleep so I wouldn’t have to go to a men’s shelter and worry about getting raped by a guy who just got out of prison. These pieces of shit that are doing this to you, they’re not down on the streets helping transexuals that are actually suffering, they’re to busy forcing their fucking retarded and abolutely insane delusion that they’re “real” women but with a birth defect, while people like me and my friends are being murdered and raped. I’d speak up more but I’m like tiny and they’re like 6’2 intimidating ex-marines and they scare me.

I have to add that as a person that has been a victim of rape, domestic violence and assualts at the hand of men and that has been on the streets and knows lots of women and transsexuals that have also been rape victims, that the walking piece of human trash that was going off about it’s cock ring should have just been beaten do death right there on the spot.
[Ann, as a non-homophobic trans you have a right to be angry at the grotesque raging homophobia these straight men express, and as a survivor you of course have a right to rage at and call out perpetrators when you see them, but do not say that someone should be beat to death. You’re angry and that’s okay but it’s not okay to talk about beating people to death on my blog. I don’t let anyone do it but thanks for the rest of your comments.-GM]

If you’d like to visit the person that related the story about the bullet in the wall to me there nick is kyenammo every one knows them and everyone knows the bullet story as this sack of shit constantly talks about it in a room full of thirteen year old children. The moderators do nothing about this and in fact defend this person if you tell them they’re a sack of shit. kyenammo hangs out at http://www.lauras-playgroundDOTcom/chat.htm this sick piece of shit is quite proud to relate this story over and over again as it proves how bad it’s gender dsyphoria is so we should all feel sorry for it.

If any of you would like to go there to express your displeasure at a place where 13 year old children are learning that it’s ok to try and put a bullet in your wife’s head and beat women or steal your mom’s panties and get off in them because of your gender dysphoria. A place where these pieces of shit are teaching little kids that they should feel sorry for woman beaters. I’m seriously not exageratting about any of this. That chat needs to be shut down,

I’m sorry for taking a dump on your blog, I was really angry about what I had just read and was shooting off at the mouth, seriously though someone harassing sex assault victims, ya know, I’m so sorry, especially knowing the size and aggressiveness of many of these people, I also grew up mostly on the streets so that’s kind of how people think of rapists and how they talk about them. If they walked into the Women’s Resource centre in downtown east Vancouver and started talking like this they wouldn’t leave the place alive and it wouldn’t just be the wbw getting angry, I mean even the men would get angry. I apologize again now that I go back and read it it does look like an insane rant 😦 with lots of swearing, really I’m not crazy I was just mad, you probably think I’m just another insane tranny. I wish there was more I could do to help, I’m thinking of maybe setting up a website (maybe clown of the week), I mean people like me we just get shot down, I mean they even wrote a whole book to reinforce their delusional world, “whipping girl” I don’t know if you’ve heard of it. You are totally right all these people are just breeders in bad drag, they’re homophobic, they hate women, they’re aggressive, they brag about their ‘femininity’ like they used to do their masculinity. It’s obviously not hormones that make people this way as even without the testosterone they’re still acting like hetero men.

The first statement you have there about trans being better then real women, they say that all the time, like constantly. It’s a competition like drunken hets at the sports bar. I’ve been on forums with these people and chatted and had them admit to beating on gay kids in high school (once again I know, should have taken a screenshot). I was in AA as a kid and my sponsor for five years was this wonderful lesbian woman who also was disabled and was somewhat of a role model to me as my family disowned me for being gay, hey we even fought to try and get the language in the AA Big Book changed so it’s not all masculine(didn’t happen but we tried). She’d even protect me from jerks at the bar. Then to see these people call themselves feminists too, ya know, like wow.

Really I’m not some insane ranting cow swearing and beating people up I’m actually quite shy and quiet, mousy and a bit of a book worm. If you’d like to delete that post or all my posts go ahead (I’m actually a bit embarrassed reading them now, All the swearing especially since I don’t swear irl, I had a hard time figuring what to call these people as calling them he is insulting men, so I just settled on piece of shit), if you’d like to leave it up so people can see how angry someone who’s been through those experiences would get then that’s fine too.

I wish I did take a screen shot but I got banned (I realize now after talking to some people and trying to tell them what’s going on that no one actually believes this stuff is happening and I need to collect proof, they just think you’re making stuff up and these things that lived their lives as straight white heteros are ‘oppressed’), I mean I can’t sit and watch someone say these kinds of things over and over like they’re bragging about it and then to have the moderators admonish me and tell me I should feel sorry for these pieces of trash. Like the guy is saying this in the chat and I’m having flashbacks, right, I’m sure you know what I mean. Like I’m not going to say I know what it was like to grow up as a woman but I can relate to many of the experiences of a survivor of assaults, more then once, I just started my transition a little while ago after 15 years out as a gay male and have been dating men all my life and had men hurt and abuse me. I had men bash me for being gay because I’m feminine and was out and proud at my high school, remember how big of a deal it used to be to be to be out and proud. I’m anything but homophobic, and these clowns they actually try to shame my life as a gay man into the closet by trying to get me to embrace some delusional theory that I was a ‘woman’ the whole time I was having that great old gay time, most my friends are still gay guys I don’t hang out with these clowns. At your own community centre and someone trying to shame you into the closet.

I can also say that as an attractive feminine trans woman when I go to trans meetings I’ve had some of these “lesbian” identified people stalk me and creep me out and grope me, I imagine this is what they’re doing at your festival. I had one sit in the support group and talk about her sadist fantasies in intimate detail when it was her turn to talk all the while staring at my crotch the group leader actually had to tell her to stop as it was getting so graphic (right just like the cock ring person was doing). You know if I want to talk to actual normal trans women I have friends in Asia, that’s where I get my support, not from these clowns. You know it’s not these people that are on the streets helping us trans women and my girlfriends, it’s feminist groups, so think you’re like me dirt poor and you read this stuff and maybe some day you might end up on the street again, and maybe because of these clowns you won’t have anywhere to go because it’s feminists not them that are helping trans women on the streets. Right like what are they going to do when they force themselves into the inner city wbw crisis centre, they’re all middle class white heteros, they’re never going to need the services anyway. The trans women that do need the services aren’t going to go there because everyone is going to hate them. They’re going to go back to their middle class homes and honk their honky horns all over the internet about their victory and puff up their chests.

Thanks for letting me express my views and please don’t think I’m like a clown running around in a clown suit, raving and being all aggressive, certain things can set me off and this is one of them and it’s why I avoid watching the news.

ok this crosses a line, you just linked a suicide prevention site and advocated attacking it, we have no safe places in most of the world as it is, must you attack the only one online?
I had zero objections to womens only spaces, just to the way you demeaned , insulted, and attacked all trans based on the example of 9 individuals. Some of us just want to survive our transitions safely . You have safe places, where are ours? Answers on a postcard please because you just attacked practically the only one we have. Based on one persons story.

Guess that link doesn’t work as it won’t let you directly link to posts but ya that whole forum is full of clowns, they’ve got pictures of themselves at a protest all dressed up in transvestite outfits making it look like a circus.

Anyway, you don’t have to post this but I just want to let the moderator know, I’m done, after seeing that creepy video up there my eyes are burnt out, I do not want to associate with any type of person that would do something like that, I almost threw up a bit in my mouth. I’m just going to call myself genderqueer or maybe androgynous and go back to working at my local LGBT community centre and just show everyone I can this webpage at every opportunity. If you look on the internet they’re sending armies of ex-marines in dresses all over the world, different countries, different cities, it’s worse then Fred Phelps, they don’t even have make up on, when you look at the picture on the articles it’s just a guy in a dress with a penis. On websites, televisions, everywhere. It’s like the army of the anti-christ trying to destroy all we’ve worked for as LGB people. If I read anything in my local area as they’re sending these guys down in vancouver to get into wbw places in dresses all the time, the last guy looked just looked like a dude, wasn’t even trying, like he couldn’t just go somewhere else. I’ll post an update here to the website or news article. Thanks for showing me how terrible of people I was associating myself with, I want to be proud of who I am.

I recently tussled with some of these radicalized, hate-filled characters on-line and they ridiculed me and claimed that my sexual-abuse history was “made-up stories” because I (innocently, ignorantly) was trying to explain to them how re-traumatizing — terrifying, really — it would be for me to encounter a naked male body in the showers or locker rooms at my pool or gym.

Just because I disagreed with them being admitted to women’s private and safe spaces, they accused me of being not just anti-trans but wishing death on them and being an extreme and violent bigot.

In their (narcissistic?) delusions, anyone who doesn’t 100% agree with everything they do and everything they want is a mortal enemy. They translate the (supposed) high attempted suicide rate among trans people as: “anyone who doesn’t give us everything we want wants us dead” which then becomes: “anyone who doesn’t agree with me on this issue all the time and in all ways is trying to kill me”.

I think the festival should invest in female armed guards and very skilled female martial artists with nunchucks to patrol and protect. There is hate and rage in some of them (a smallish subset, I hope) that goes far, far beyond simple “gender dysphoria”.

That is so typical of all the twanz. They can’t seem to accept disagreements and to them, it’s all about them and their narcissistic delusions. They simply resort to their male inborn behavior that if your not in agreement with them, they consider you their mortal enemy and lash out at you by calling you names and calling you a bigot. It happens all the time and when you disagree with them, they like to lash out at you and even their twanzsupporters will lash out at you as well.

I absolutely agree, Rose. Anyone who has written in defense of female-only space has gotten death and mutilation threats. These are men. Statistically, many of them have raped and beaten girls and women. I wouldn’t be surprised if more of them have than men who don’t claim to be women (the majority of who have assaulted females) because their female-hatred is unchecked. Their male sense of entitlement is way beyond most men’s, which is bad enough.

How many men claiming to be women have killed girls or women? That is almost never discussed, except perhaps by Gallus in her description of the female-killing men in prison claiming to be women.

We should take the threats seriously. Michigan is a likely target for their violence.

I’m a musician. I find it ironic that I regularly work with heterosexual male musicians who are 100 times more gentle and accomodating in spirit — more “feminine” in the patriarchal, traditional sense of the word — than these radical, hyper-aggressive, in-your-face “trans women” of whom we’re speaking.

After further research on-line, it appears to me that some subset of “trans women” are so filled with rage against women — against anyone who opposes them, but especially women — that it might legitimately be considered part of their condition. There is an obsessive need for power and control in their condition, a need to take everyone by the neck and FORCE them to join in the “trans woman’s” delusions, a desire to crush anyone and anything that holds a mirror up to them, a mirror that says, “No, you’re not a woman.”

What I find alarming are the laws being enacted (Washington state’s is a good example) where anyone who dares to call a “trans woman” what he is — “he” rather than his preferred “she” — can be successfully accused of employment discrimination. Anyone who refuses him access to — for example — the women’s showers, can be successfully charged with discrimination in providing public accommodations, too.

The laws that people died for during the Civil Rights movement are now being used to force a “trans woman’s” female co-workers to call him “her” and to dress with him in the employee locker room! WTF?!?

I have even seen some trans use the intersex card to push their agenda down people’s faces as well. It seems to be one of trans favorite tactics. To steal, and co-opt intersex people and their name at the expense of intersex people. They like to use it as an excuse to people when in fact it makes real intersex people like me look bad.

That happened in my state as well, where trans used the so called intersex excuse to push their rights at the expense of intersex people. They claimed that intersex was part of them and got my state to convince them to enact laws like that.

Personally, I believe in a free society. So if someone wants to hold a private affair, they have the right to restrict admission in any way they see fit. Period. If the rule is that this festival is restricted to those who are born with a female body then that is their right. If you want to hold a festival that is restricted to those who are white and catholic that is also perfectly fine. I for one see nothing wrong with this, it should be no issue. I would never dream of sneaking in to a place or festival where I was not wanted. Please do not assume that all transsexual women are the same or that we all have the same opnions. It is not fair that the bad and unacceptable actions of a few should be used to characterise the actions of many. People should be judged for their personal actions and those actions should not be used to judge some larger group they belong to.

This is really icky and gross…I cannot believe these men! I worked with “June Day” before he “transitioned” and I always knew there was something wrong with him. He used to tell us all about his weird relationships and lecture the women about women’s health and other issues. We need to stop enabling them!

You remind me that back in the mid- to late-70’s I knew a man around townie his late 20’s that used to show up at community dances and farmer’s markets wearing: a full beard down to his chest, a flannel plaid shirt, a full, floral, ankle-length gathered skirt and heavy socks scrunched down over his size-14 leather hiking boots.

He was another one to lecture women on women’s issues and feminism, as if his skirt conferred expertise on him that women didn’t have automatically due to our biology: menstruation, ovulation, vulnerability to rape and sexual abuse, sexual harassment, job and wage discrimination, pregnancy, childbirth, lactation, etc. etc. etc.

Besides the odd clothing choice and the tendency to mansplain at will to us (which man didn’t at that time, really? or now?), he was generally a polite and friendly chap. He could be counted on to show up at demonstrations about women’s issues holding the right kind of sign while drawing the wrong kind of attention from passersby.

I have to wonder now if he’s gone on to harder stuff over the years? Is he one of these dudes in their 50’s or 60’s who claims that he has always been female and that he knows just what it feels like to be a…real lesbian or whatever?

[…] organizing a UK version of Camp Trans, which is a group of anti-lesbian and anti-female activists that conducts harassment, vandalism and terrorism against the lesbian and female-only US Michfest Women’s Music […]

My name is Beatrix Bandia Dickon, and by posting this I risk being flamed by members of my own community. I am writing from the perspective of a MtF transsexual from Ohio, and a Women’s and Gender Studies Major at the University of Toledo.
First of all, I’ve never attended this festival. I make it a habit of not going anywhere that I am not welcome. I read a comment near the top asking why trans-women don’t get their own festival. And you know? I’ve been asking other trans-women this same question. To me this is not a question of transphobia. Not the policy itself anyway. Its not transphobic to want your own space of liberation if you treat trans-people like decent human beings when you go home. Everyone deserves a space to escape to and learn from the collective experience of their sisters. And you know. All that jazz.
So why shouldn’t transgender people make our own space. And lets not forget the FtM transsexuals as well. We have a little habit of forgetting about them. 😉 Give us a space to love ourselves and liberate ourselves, and let womyn-born-womyn have it for themselves. Peace and love my lovelies. And blessed be. ❤

Oh. Gahhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhh. I don’t understand why these people don’t get a life and create their own fest. Parasites? Get a honorable self-existance and stop soaking off your moms. Female is the root, male is the expression. Evolved men are grown up individuals creating new fests and respecting.

Hi,
I came back to read more and I noticed that you are unsure/moderating-pending my comment. I’m sort of weird so I bet my ideas didn’t read so well for you. Take my comment off, if you don’t mind,
Thanks.
PS-I won’t make any more posts so there you go, best wishes, nice site, thanks for sharing 🙂 .

I have no idea what the fuck you are going on about the only other comment you submitted said “Yeah”. So please stop sending me those long creepy “not for publication” messages. I don’t know you and I don’t want to be subjected to your weird disjointed shit. If you have something to say than just post it. Not interested in yer “sekrets” dude.

A gentle request: I know it’s more work than just linking, but is there anyway in the future you could take screen caps or otherwise archive the pages you have linked? Because After you linked to them, the cowards deleted, made private, or otherwise shut down all evidence of their own malfeasance.

I think it’s clear that the reason that men demanding access to women don’t want their own event is that they really don’t want to be with each other – other than to organize to harass real women and Lesbians. From what I’ve been seeing for years, their goal, like other het men obsessed with Lesbians, is to get access to us. This is just a variation. I never see the ones who invade women-only space in my community hang out with each other, or even go to public events. They go to the rare women-only events, spew their porn, and destroy the basic feeling/meaning of the space.

Ever notice how there still are mainstream movie and TB themes of “Lesbians” wanting to be fucked by men and rarely anything showing Lesbians just wanting to be with Lesbians? (Are there any?) I still say that most M2Ts did not think for a moment about being girls when they were growing up, but they sure have watched a lot of “Lesbian” porn made for men, by men. Notice their raffle prize of “queer porn.”

[…] pretendbian Tobi Hill-Meyer, who calls himself a “butch dyke” and holds benefits for anti-female sympathizers to support his campaign against the rights of females to gather among themselves, has admitted that he is the author of the censored […]

[…] I want to ask you to do something now that will also take amazing courage – please tell your daughter, Tobi Hill-Meyer, to stop terrorizing Lesbians. Tobi has every right to exist in the world as a woman; please don’t misunderstand what I am asking of you. But Tobi has taken it upon herself to tell Lesbians that we are bigots for shunning penis. Perhaps you don’t know this? She also has perpetuated the myth that Lesbians as a group secretly crave penetration by males – because some Lesbians use dildos. And Tobi, aided and abetted by would-be helpers who think they are waging a noble battle against “bigotry,” willfully violates the boundary established by Females for Female-only space. […]

I am a 31 year old lesbian mother to 2 children. I have been attending the festival with my 3 sisters and my lesbian mother since the age of 10. My daughter has been attending with since she 2 months old. I have not ever brought my son with even knowing there is Brother Sun. I feel this is a womyns space and at the young age of 6 he understands. I have stopped attending the festival since the threats of violence and hatred that Camp Trans is doing. I was there when the first Trans was asked to leave in 1991, I was there when the shower incident happened. I feel like Camp Trans started as a protest which everyone has a right to protest, but the energy shifted to violence. I know MWMF land like the back of my hand. But I don’t think I can feel safe anymore. Many of these violent threats are FTM with tons of testosterone running through their bodies and I don’t what could happen.

We are a family of three generations who have attended MWMF and now none of us have been back. MWMF is my home. The week where I feel safe and can be myself. It’s very selfish of Camp Trans to take that away. I want my daughter to experience what I did when I was her age. When I am at the Fest I have 10,000 moms not just one.

I hope that Camp Trans can learn to accept the Fests policy of WBW or to classify it as women assigned women at birth. I need my week a year to unwind and feel safe and just soak in the energy from my fest family.

I am not “trans phobic” I have many trans friends. I am just asking the trans community to respect the WBW policy and allow the festie goers the safe and energy they need every august.

You have NO understanding of the very concept that is transgender. The very idea is that they too are born women. Males are those who IDENTIFY as male, so stop calling transwomen males. How does male privilege as a result of outward sex apply when it comes twinned with being treated as a man when you are not one? To put it another way, if you, as (I would presume) someone born with a female sex and belonging in a female gender, went out and convincingly disguised yourself as male, would you feel like you had male privilege? Or would you feel like you were dressed up as something you are not?

I’d say its transphobia, but it’s more like plain ignorance. At the same time, saying you’re not against trans people (as some here have) but you think ‘they’ should go make their own separate festival because they are not women is not identical to but not far off saying ‘I’m not racist, I’m just saying different races shouldn’t come near me because they’re different. I doubt anything can change the way you feel about this, but know that that’s what your opinion sounds like to anyone who doesn’t share it.

It makes me sad because I am a ‘woman-born-woman’ or whatever stupid term you use, and a feminist, and I’d never go near such a disgusting festival. The bigoted attitude of all involved has ruined what could have been a beautiful celebration of womanhood.

But seeing as you can’t even see the problem with your thinking, you probably will delete or repeat yourself in response to this. Unfortunately for whatever reason, you’ve not educated yourself on what/who a transwoman is, you’ve not considered how you actually sound talking about this, and typing this was probably a waste of my own time.

This is unlinked to my previous comment, but the policy makes me wonder; if what is important to this festival is not ‘gender’ but ‘how one was born’ would pre-transition transmen (female in sex, from birth, but identify as male) be allowed in? Not that they would probably desire to, it being a festival that supposedly caters to women, but how could this policy exclude them if they did?

To be frank a persons pre transition name is none of your concern, why people feel entitled to demand answers to such personal questions is beyond me. A persons pre transition name is something deeply private, and often steeped in a great deal of pain and personal suffering. Not something that anybody has a right to demand.

unchanedaura–I just call them sir, or mister. And that, sir is not your concern. And not something anyone has any right to demand me not to do. Legal within my rights–sir. And claiming that is bigotry or causes violence or suicide is just plain stupidity, sir. So I don’t much care if their name is William or James–sir works. And in department stores–don’t get out of my way I just go to the security and say–that man in a dress is trying to harass me and my children–one at the breast and one in the belly and a full stroller.

And no one cares about the women or girls in all the concern for the men claiming to be women. We have almost nothing left, most women have been raped/sexually assaulted, but only men feel great deal of pain and personal suffering. Even when they are the rapists who won’t take no for an answer.

Yes, Bev, they think theirs is the only suffering that matters. I got into it with “Savannah”, only to have him equate my being orally raped as a child by my father to his being “sexually harassed” at work. He wouldn’t say what form his “harassment” took, but his histrionics seemed to indicate it was much worse than my insignificant child molestation. Trans suffering is the only suffering!

Wish they’d just leave these women alone. “Cis” lesbians are still considered a minority, and I see no problem with women who connect with each other wanting to have a space where they can bond. All minority groups have this. The path to womanhood for a trans* woman is different of a non-trans woman. Nothing stating that one is superior or inferior…just different outlooks on life. Being socialized as a female since birth and having society treat you as such puts a different perspective on life as opposed to someone who didn’t go down that same path. Someone who is still in the closet and is still “passing” for male. Someone who has just started hrt and/or other procedures. Your outlook on life depends on how society treats you. You don’t know what it’s like to be affected by the male gaze since birth as a female. You just don’t. If trans* women are to be included in this festival all while still having trans* only events, where does this leave “cis” lesbians? Out in the cold? Do people not give a shit since they’re “cis”? And from what I’ve been reading from angry trans* activists, most of them really don’t give a damn about the performers or the festival. They just see forcing the festival to allow trans* women in as an entitlement victory. If the majority of the festival goers feel more comfortable being around “women born women”, then why bully your way into a space where you’ll feel unwanted? Is it for bragging rights? There are queer prides and other festivals that welcomes trans* women…but there is also a break-down of sub groups for special events on the side. If everyone under the lgbt umbrella can have their own special events, then why can’t “cis” lesbians? Jeez, just let these women have their moment for one freakin’ week. And people can sugarcoat it and be phony all they want, but at the end of the day, the vast majority, if not all of true “cis” lesbians may see trans* women as potential friends, but as long as there is still a penis down there, then you can forget about potential romantic/sexual partners. I’ve even been called transphobic because I prefer a woman with a vagina, like pretty much all lesbians out there. I refuse to be apologetic because I’m aroused by all of the things that come with performing cunnilingus on my gf. When the issue of sex comes up, there will always be this divide considering most trans* women are pre-op. If you’re a trans* lesbian amongst “cis” lesbians, would you rather them be upfront about it or be hypocrites like the “so called” pc trans allies. I’ve also noticed that this group of trans* extremists trying to bully their way into this festival are white and have benefitted from male privilege most of their lives, so the mentality of entitlement has already been planted. I was just thinking about this….would these trans* women also consider gynecologists transphobic for not being trained to examine their penises?

I’m sorry that i’m commenting on an old thing. But f*ck these orrible males. I was looking for somewhere to go that was just female (in the entire plant earth) but males just cannot leave women alone, anywhere.

I find it sad and desperate that these people cannot just respect females wanting to be with other females without applauding these males just violently injecting themselves. Really strange behaviour.

I stumbled on this by pure chance, and I am not from the general location of this event; however, I feel compelled to comment on what I had reviewed here. First and foremost: I find it necessary to apologize to all the CIS women that had been harassed, offended, brought to harm in ANY way by these offender and trespassers. I am a transgender woman, and I know damn well that it DOES NOT make me the same as a CIS woman…other transgender women, feel free to argue it all you want, but it is simple biology. These actions and the gross display of arrogance and ignorance on your part is the very reason why it is difficult for those that do respect the boundaries of others to be accepted in society as a whole. Because transgender people or any sort is one of the smallest minority groups that currently exists with an astoundingly loud voice, such action affect use all even greater. For those of us that are simply just trying to live our lives, keep to ourselves, not impose on others in such an oppressive manner: You are a blemish to those that try to live a good, respectable, and healthy life with society as it is; and, you are a total disgrace and embodiment of a disgusting nature. You have NO right to act on these women as you have. By the way, the nature of your actions are VERY characteristic of REAL MEN; thus, if you believe yourself to be a woman, want to be treated like a woman, respected as a woman, seen as a woman…you best change your ways right quick. Composing yourself around minors, a four-year-old girl no less, such a deplorable organization of militant half-wits leaves me with no words to express the extent of my loathing for you and your sort in a proper manner. I abhor the actions you have taken just to thieve your way into, around, and about this collaboration of women that have more than paid their dues for a natural right that they should NOT have to fight for. As for your impact on rape victims, apparently you have no clue about how serious of a crime they had fell victim to, and it is not to be taken lightly, nor as a joke. You have NO idea what these people had experienced, what they had to go through, and I will tell you this: The impact of a rape is such that it kills a part of one’s very soul. A part that NEVER heals. A victim does their best to continue to live their lives as best as they can, whilst that wound made keeps bleeding forever. Some victims find it too much to bear, and cannot survive the trauma. I have been the victim of such acts of men. I am familiar with the agony, but I know that even still, it cannot compare. It happened as I was a child, a teen, even an adult. I cannot stand to be the very type that destroyed me, and I equate them with those that had harmed me and killed pieces of my soul. They should be ashamed of all they have done, what the represent, and the bad connotations they bring to those of us that do our best to respect as we wish to be respected. This is not what it means to be a woman in any way. To me, they are all just evil oppressive men, and I do not want to be associated with them. So, once again, I do sincerely apologize.

Was it just me who spotted the rather distasteful I know how women feel about rape because I’ve been raped as well (hence I’m MORE like them and NOT like men) line?

So, we have a man mansplainin to men how women feel about rape. Lovely, colonize us some more why don’t you, just now with the excuse that you’re actually defending us (because OBVIOUSLY we can’t do that for ourselves!).

Oh all these guys have “been raped” that is part of the fantasy, the drama. Just damsels in distress. Porn soaked pricks. It is the tale the love to tell because “authentic” women get raped. Just another part of the fetish. Show me a police report and an ER report.He gets off some more with his rape fantasy–pretty male if you ask me.

“. It is the tale the love to tell because “authentic” women get raped. Just another part of the fetish…”
Except that thought is so monstrous I really couldn’t get my head around it. But I think you’re absolutely right.

Plus explains why trans want so hard to get into rape crisis counselling — recognition AND they get to hear more juicy stories to fuel their fantasies.

You’rr absolutely right BadDyke, I noticed that too Furthermore, it seems the only requirement for being female is being “nice.” Sorry so called nice transwomen, no matter how much you by into the steroetype of the demure Earth mother I’m not going to call you “she.”

Reblogged this on winterdominatrix and commented:
It is scary. This is how I found out about GT and Gallus’ island of sanity. I was on a BDSM site[sorry ladies, but man-slapping is my favorite sport and men sometimes need that and will even pay girls to do to them- they get tired of the unfairness of oppression and even feel a little guilty.] and on a certain board of rabid people, a hate-filled discussion between cd’s, shemales and transpeople [that were there for sexual fetish purposes to begin with] began complaining about this post. It was a testosterone filled hate rant. Females that tried to comment were brushed aside like their words were not as important as the opinion of the males that wanted the male privileged to be the #1TOP female in the female spaces and found one last even they could not control or take over. Any coment made by a female[even the ones that thought they had equality by saying they were men in women’s bodies] was dismissed as ‘women nonsence in a man’s conversation by the Men born men identifying as women. It was then I could clearly see that they were mad that lesbians were not obeying them. They did not want equality, they wanted control.

This was the ‘occupy lesbian’ movement of men that believed that they were being kept out of a magical world of lesbian sex and culture, and they feel entitled to control or destroy it. There solution was to paste flyers of penises everywhere and sabotage the Mitch festable. Talk of launching bear-spray repellent into mitch fest was discussed, the few females that mentioned that there were female children did not seem to matter as much as denying a man’s right to lesbian porn parties. Their solution was to destroy it. If they cant control all that is female, they would do what ever they could to destroy women’s spaces, especially if they were not about men’s fantasy about lesbians.
What do they want?
Being treated as female is not enough for some porn addicted men, they want control to lead all females not attached to men and get access to their children.
They want more porn, and dont want to pay for porn. The logic behind this is: if you are a female, sex and porn should be free. Sadly some pedophiles think this is the easiest way to get full access to children as well, no kidding. The believe that women born women are a vast resource of women to use that no other men are controlling r telling what to do, no men own these women, so they think that ‘male-women’ should be their leaders and pimps.
The first thing they want to do is destroy all the anti-porn and anti-prostitution groups. This is what they think all women should be doing, and women are somehow privileged [this is a Straight/Lesbian/and Bi- WBW’s highest cis-privileged!] that there is a majority of men that desire them over other men for sex. Sadly, not all men believe a mouth is a mouth, and are born straight. They do not accept other men for sex, because that is their sexual preference. They are branded with the slur of ‘cis’ because of their ‘straight’ sexual orientation, that makes them only desire biological females for sex. They cant help being straight, the majority of humans are this way on earth, but they are hated for the missed income opportunity of sexworker trans that want them to believe a mouth is a mouth. There is some butthurt over this and they want a cut of female sexworker money. It does not matter if you do not desire men as sex partners, or you do not want to be a sexworker, Too bad. They see ALL females as cash-cow sexworkers and wish to push female rights to this direction.
WBW,s are the highest priority targets for sex violent men target for rape, kidnapp, and some trans wish men had fantasies like that for them but they dont and they cant sell the fantasy to other men on their own. Of course when they do get raped & killed, they cry over the loss of male privilege and the death rate that is lower than women!
‘Boo-hoo! I was treated like a woman, but I am more than one and deserve better’ want your cake and eat it to situation.
They want to pull women into their sexual disorder and ‘occupy women’ by taking away our human rights and turning ‘woman ‘ into an idea, a hole, and a feeling any man can have or speak for and decide what their purpose is. This will erace women and remove protections from sex exploitation and open the opportunity for ‘trafficking as a woman’s movement’ lead by men that call them selves speakers for women.
The #1 campaign for slutwalk is for pimps to be called ‘sexworkers’ too! The idea is to hide trafficking. The women that buy into this mainly are unemployed and/or have drug problems. They think that the young women and female children will be left alone if they are the ones working, this is not so; The target age for females on facebook that are targeted will become lower and more pimps will be free to enter women’s spaces to recruit at earlier ages. Men get the crazyist ideas! XD They dont think we will notice! This is a pornification of females by men movement.

If these were actullay men that wanted to live as women, they would not be destroying what little protections women have, no these are porn addicted men that are looking for a free-sex lesbian utopia in a bad economy. Get a job and zip up your pants dudes.

“sorry ladies, but man-slapping is my favorite sport and men sometimes need that and will even pay girls to do to them”

Classical porn-obsessed male speak from this supposed female. You can’t attack men for their porn obsession whilst being part of it yourself. And frankly, this women who hate men (i.e. feminists) then being willing to man-slap them is just another male porno fantasy anyway.

Seems we have two people trying SO HARD to convince us what good feminists and REAL FEMALES they are, except you can spot the artificiality a mile off.

not to to say I agree with some of these actions done by transwomen, I will say that the hormone regiment is designed to wipe out the majority of the testosterone that fuels a man’s inner world. During Transition from him to her, the very basics of maturity, emotion, respect and basic moral values are all thrown out the window and replaced with an estrogen based “Freedom”.
and with freedom comes responsibility.

Nevertheless, these kinds of women are under the influence of a lesser dominating hormone than what was there before. Some women need to realize that oftentimes it’s their behavior like that is what inspires other females to have these Womyn’s events in the first place.

“the very basics of maturity, emotion, respect and basic moral values are all thrown out the window and replaced with an estrogen based “Freedom”.”

You seriously think changing hormone levels can do all that? What utter nonsense! To get rid of all that, you’d need something like a serious debilitating brain injury, not removal of nads and a quick shot of ‘female’ hormones…………

Sounds like it’s out of the same medical texts that thought that womens wombs wandered around the body and caused us to go slightly mad (origin of hysteria, and why hysteria is close to hysterectomy, ancient greek you know!). Just replace womb by oestrogen, same male madness, different era…………

Not just that though – if they need to have all these supposed “changes” come via taking hormones, doesn’t that contradict the idea that they had a “lady brain” and “women thought patterns” from birth?

As others aptly noted, the whole bullshittery of hormones being designed to “wipe out the majority of the testosterone” and being under a lesser influence and other fuckwittery flies completely out the window when one considers the time wasted by twanz claiming they have LAYDEEEEEEEE brains. And, even if one wanted to accept it makes changes to temperment, then what rationale could possibly exist to explain the repeated threats of violence that continue to come forth from twanz?

Don’t worry…I won’t be holding my breath…it will be just like the request for any evidence to the claims made in the crap statement signed off on by all the funfems, libfems and twanz where it was alleged that rad fem adherents have committed any acts of violence against twanz…

I am disgusted and appalled, mainly by two things:
1. The constant and pervasive use of HE / HIM in reference to TRANSGENDER WOMEN (not TRANS MEN, as that would imply one was born female and transitioned into male), and,
2. The idea that all transfemales are somehow out to harm women

That’s must be so very hard on you. You’re brave, that much I can see right off the bat. Let me back step here, what I think I hear you saying is that you’re appalled or perhaps more simply put, you find it appalling that women call men men and use he or him for men. I can understand you utter distress I mean when there are such things as starving refugees and gang rape that just pale in comparison to women fulfilling a male sexual fantasy. Imagine the outrage, the utter when I say calling him a man implies he was born with a dick and the use of the correct pronoun pretty much is a clear indication that women are not going to suck it because he calls it his Pricilla. You are free to do so if you wish. And the stats for how many of these guys have raped and murdered women and children speak loud and clear. They are dangerous. But you go head and suck them off and don’t forget to roll play–

“Sorry so called nice transwomen, no matter how much you by into the steroetype of the demure Earth mother I’m not going to call you “she.”– Bad Dyke put it so well.

And I don’t want you in our women only spaces either, because you are men, you threaten like men, you want to colonize lesbian bodies, and we get nothing out of alliance with these trans-gressors on female space.

To quote another blog, I don’t want you searching our spaces because I don’t want you messsing with my female self or safety, now go and create your own music festivals, go buy your own land.

Heck, with all the money these guys made in the military or as helicopter pilots with their fat male paychecks, now they expect lesbians to just move on over and let them in the gate.

Well I say, trans, take those resources and build your own lands and festivals. If you are so fired up about being accepted as women, then start acting like women under patriarchy. What women do under patriarchy, is that they are nice, they are kind, and you could even turn Camp trans into a welcoming neutral place, cook fine food, play music, have a good time, invite lesbians to stop by and say hello, make some coffee, hang out, clean up the mess afterward. But stop trying to bust into the few spaces where born women run and rule and suppot one another. If you want us to trust you, then start from a position of service to women, not male gate crashing aggression. You’d be more believable if you actually did something FOR born women for once.

[…] spamming them with photos of their vaginas and text claiming that their ability to produce eggs is “more manly than their pale and flaccid cocks will ever be” (note to John Waters: that was MY script idea […]

Reblogged this on FeistyAmazon and commented:
Yep enforce boundaries. That Tobi Hill Meyer crashed the ONE Female identified workshop for Butches held 10 stories above and separately from Butch Voices because our Dyke WBW Female proud Voices were NOT included in ANY workshop in the Conferenxe and yet Tobi Hill Meyer had a workshop FOR Mtf “Butches” that he was a part of….so no he knows no boundaries nor is he Butch. If hes so fucking butch he shoulda just stayed a fully intact MALE.

[…] knew: the integrity of biological womyn-only space at Michfest had been compromised and trans women regularly attended the Festival. She emphasized that the Festival would continue to be directed toward non-trans women […]

Reblogged this on WolfWomanoftheNorth and commented:
“They believe that females have no rights to any space or service or gathering, public or private, that excludes the presence of males, or that exists for the benefit of female fellowship, or for the protection of females from potential male predation.”

S-H-E. H-E-R.
Just stop calling trans w-o-m-e-n “men”, and fucking stop using those fucking he pronouns.
People actually DIE because of people like you.
You TERF should all be ashamed of yourself.
As a cis woman I’m ashamed of you and feel actually disgusted.
Denying these real women’s identities is how get people mad.
Because you insult them. Because they’re not men. If they were why would they claim they are women when faced with hatred both from women (TERF) and misogynystic men ?
And it’s all the more ridiculous as trans MEN are allowed to enter. These are actual men. Better name this so-called womyn-only space a vag-womb-ovaries-only espace.
So you basically assume women to be essentially walking vaginas. Like misogynystic assholes.
Shame on you TERF.

Women actually die and are raped due to male violence, male entitlement, male people regardless of what pronouns those males “prefer to be called.” I won’t waste a single tear on HE or HIM until violence against women is recognized as an epidemic. It is male hatred of women the desire to erase the biological reality of women, and as a cis woman, you should be disgusted and ashamed.

Men are adult males and there are many, many, many ways of being a man and one of them is being a transwomen. To say that transwomen aren’t men limits what the male experience is and defines man solely in sexist, male supremacist terms. It’s also transphobic as it shames transwomen for being men.
Im rubber, you’re glue, no shame on me, the shames on you.

And transmen are women who take testosterone and have mastectomies, not “actual men”. That’s just silly, men are adult males, set above, etc. Transwomen are actual men, get over it, bigot.

So basically a woman (resp. a man) is a walking vagina (resp penis) ?
And there’s no difference between a man who knows he’s a man and a trans woman who knows, deep inside, that she’s a woman ?
Assuming you’re a cis woman, would you have been a man if you had been born with typical male genitalia ?
Eventually, this would mean that being a man, a woman or anything else is all about one’s body.
Don’t you think that there’s more to being a woman than wearing a dress and having a vag ?
I’m not shaming transwomen. They know they are women and not men, and they probably know better about themselves than anyone else. Unless they actually consider themselves to be men.
Sure there are many ways to be a man. But saying that this includes trans women’s experiences is just like saying that being a woman is just another way to be a man.

Why do you view human beings with as being NOTHING BUT their reproductive status? Why can’t people be fully human and also female? Why must female human beings be “walking vaginas” instead of fully human beings who are also female (ie. women)?

“Don’t you think that there’s more to being a woman than wearing a dress and having a vag ?”

Yes women are completely and fully human. It’s very disturbing that you think being female and fully human are mutually exclusive characteristics. Please stop dehumanizing women for being female by claiming our sex reduces us to nothing but our sex. Thanks.