One thing you have to drop is the idea of "new" team. If you're not using a certain move, or a certain pokemon because it would be "copying" someone else's idea and not it being an original creation, that's idiotic. Between the fundamental sets and strats (restbell, curselax, sleep talk) developed by the 00-02 foundational players, and vil/celia/bob/whatever developing most of the defensive conceptual shit, and my developing everything else, there's very little, if any "new" left. The concept of "new" teams revolves around a "new" idea, of which there really aren't any. Changing surf to hydro pump, or cloyster to forretress, doesn't really destroy the core foundational function of the team, so for all intents and purposes, it's still the same team. That's why if I try to "rate" teams, I really just end up giving them a worser version of a team I already made.

So this started off as a warstory, but after 6 natty lights, I realize I’m no good at creative writing. I’m pretty good with satire, but in an alcohol induced state, I tend to rant (exhibit A). Anywho, this has become more of a “inside the mind of competitive battling” kind of thing really. A guide to competitive battling if you will. Or a part 2 to my guide.

If there’s one thing I learned about competitive Pokemon, it’s about prediction. Notice, it’s “about” prediction. If there’s one thing you know about competitive Pokemon, it’s the importance of prediction. That’s how skill is determined right? Wrong. You can’t really learn prediction, it’s something you already know, it’s intuition, it’s something you grow accustomed to, something you improve through learning other things (like playstyles and play patterns), without those things, prediction only exists in one state. It’s ONLY possible to predict against lesser opponents, when faced against equal/greater opponents, it’s known as GUESSING. That’s what you’re doing for the most part, it’s not prediction whatsoever. Prediction implies beating the odds, against better/equal opponents, that won’t happen. You’re playing the odds, and exactly the odds.

And, by the way, this thread will it’ll be a three-part issue. Consider it a treat.

Yes that’s mine. I started writing it one nostalgic day 2 years ago. Don’t ask why, just appreciate the fact that it exists.

The second, the battle itself. Read the commentary, it’s good stuff. Really, I promise. Will induce thought and make you a better battler.

I sign on for the first time in 18 months, feeling nostalgic. I go away (since I'm too cool for Pokemon obviously) and get a message from poke god: "hai wants play?!". That's not what he said. But that's the gist of it. He challenges me, I notice "Apply PP Ups", which I'm not too fond of in the realm of GSC.

But it was a rated match and not that unrated pussyshit so it's cool, instant +10 respect for not being a record whore. But then again, there's so few people on for that to even matter. Show enemy HP wasn't ticked, so I wasn't in full NB 0.9.6 nostalgia mode.

So later on I find out this is actually Bob, since he ran the same team under his Professor Pokemon or whatever alias. Not important. Anyway, high off his victories over some former vets, smurfing the hell out of vil/havoc, and some cruel wins over whatever remains of the GSC community, he decides to get cute with me. So I retaliate with some cuteness of my own. Truth be told though, I couldn't care less. I didn't expect a challenge, not knowing who he is, and he certainly didn't expect a challenge either. Chatlog confirms this.

This is actually only my third time playing Bob. The first two ended in a draw back in early 2004 or so, after 564 (arbitrary) turns of not being able to do anything against each other. I won in the end, via struggle 5-0, but I think we both gave up at that point, so I consider it a draw. This battle is just as long (as of writing, it’s 75 pages long), but it was on-your-toes the whole way through. There was never a hopeless moment for either team, ‘til about turn 300 or so. Even then, should I misplay, I’d still lose. This isn’t one of the best battles I have, but it’s definitely one of the best out of my available 4 logs.

Spoiler warning: After reading through it, there’s very little satire. It comes off as a pretty strong in-your-face competitive-Pokemon-is-serious-business kind of notion. But it’s really good info though, a lot of which will make you better battlers, GSC and other generations as well I hope.

My Raikou start gives me the edge on pretty much every common starter, with the exception of Nidoking. Prior to this game, I've always ran Roar Raikou... and that hasn't changed (didn't expect that did you?). What did change, though, is that I forwent Crunch in favor of Reflect. Experimentation really, based on the idea that Crunch usually ends up hitting Steelix, Nidoking, Marowak, or Rhydon. Steelix couldn't careless, Nidoking and Rhydon both pose no reasonable threats, and Marowak is... well, again... "experimentation". Anywho, this matchup isn't really ideal, but hey, I might as well begin with the "experimention".

I was almost surprised to find Suicune on the team, then I realized I made another experimental change before the battle. I’ve always had Starmie in this slot to cover up the Machamp weakness, as well as anti-spikes coverage.

Ideal matchup for Raikou. Losing leftovers with Raikou is eh, unless he's packing Zapdos/Raikou with spike support, it doesn't really matter. This is where I begin scouting the team. I like knowing what I'm dealing with, and I emphasize it for any advanced player. You don't want to sacrifice Pokemon blindly unless you know exactly what to expect. Losing to a last poke drum/curselax, drumzard, druidcruel, growtheon, is not cool.

It was. Anywho, at this point, I pretty much realized if he was any good, he's running the same strategy as me. Two differences in the team that are ultimately inconsequential, Tyranitar/Starmie vs Raikou/Suicune. Marowak is a threat to every team, but I have as much Marowak coverage as one could have. Snorlax is obviously a threat, especially with an unknown set. My guess was drumlax which takes advantage of SD wak.

Ahh, curselax with Body Slam. This was pretty much my worst fear. With DE/Return, I could send skarm in on Snorlax all day, but with Body Slam, paralysis becomes a hassel. I couldn't send Miltank in yet, not without knowing whether or not it packed Belly Drum as well. And with Marowak waiting on the wings, probably SD kind, flinch + para becomes an issue for skarm. This followed the exact same offensive strategy that my team relied on.

DP was a high-risk move, with the only benefit being Marowak is now in KO range for Starmie. But even then, he has to make another correct prediction to get out of the scenario. It would’ve also been the right move had he assumed I’ve been a 4 move mixed sweeper with Fire Blast.

I predicted he'd Rest since he'd think I'd switch since RS couldn't kill. Confusing? Probably. You have to know when to think, but not overthink. But this time, he just went right over my head. Either way, SD was the right move.

He thought if he had used WW, there was more or less a 30% chance that I'd win the game should I RS. A CH/Flinch would've pretty much ended it, and a WW to Skarm/Snorlax would've kept the game going.

I half expected Starmie, and half expected Skarmory to stay in for the WW. Probably 44/56 between the Earthquake and Rock Slide paying off after factoring CH chances/accuracy, so I just picked the latter.

I didn't expect him to sacrifice someone this early, which is the safest route to keep the game going.

From his perspective, here are six options:

Sacrifice Snorlax: Well this doesn't make any sense. Marowak alone poses no threat whatsoever to his team.
Sacrifice Starmie: I'd have to sacrifice another as well, since Starmie is the only thing that can stop Marowak via OHKO at this point.
Sacrifice Miltank: Without Miltank, my Marowak (which ran the same set as me) would be stupidly slow. So no Miltank = no Marowak.
Sacrifice Skarmory: That unleashes his two offensive threats with pretty much no drawback.
Sacrifice Tyranitar: I only know 5 of his Pokemon, and should his 6th be Misdreavus, that becomes a huge hassel as my offense now relies on Marowak once again.
Sacrifice Marowak: Offense relies on Snorlax, but as a bonus, he doesn't know my 4th move yet.

Had he scouted all 6 of my Pokemon, he probably would've sacrificed Tyranitar, completely changing the game.

Yep. Well fuck. I had ruled out a drumcurselax on the account that he hasn't shown the greatest of skill and has been outplayed to this point. Had I been more cautious and continued on my original plan of scouting out Snorlax's moveset, I wouldn't be in this position.

I couldn't risk Skarm getting para'd/CH'd on the switch, so I decide to sacrifice either Raikou or Suicune to get Skarm in safely. He doesn't seem to pack Thundermissy, and for whatever reason, I still felt his Tyranitar was a mixed sweeper, so Raikou was more or less dead to me. Suicune had a better chance of shutting down his presumed mixtar than my Raikou had of making an impact with Reflect. Had I known Tyranitar packed neither Rock Slide nor EQ, I would've sacrificed Suicune. Respect comes back.

In hindsight, I should've known he ran pursuittar. A team that focuses on a Snorlax that can't touch ghosts isn't very reliable, and someone as skilled as to make a team like his certainly knows that, hence a reliable way to deal with said ghosts must be necessary. Enter pursuittar. Whatever.

That's not true. If he gets lucky with the paras, my Skarm still struggles with drumlax. I knew that, he knew that. I temporarily put my offense on hold while I try to PP waste the last of his offensive threats.

Oh God, I forgot that even existed. I realize I'm back at square one with my offensive efforts now. Had I been more aware, I would've made Marowak a bigger part of my prediction priority, as a low HP Skarm and Starmie isn't really a Marowak stopper by any means.

1. If he drummed, I could've used Body slam and we both could've been in KO range. A CH from either side would've resulted in death. Had I Heal Belled on the turn he used Belly Drum, something probably would've died.

2. If he used curse, I could've belled up and switched to Skarm on the following turn. Had I used Body Slam, I had a chance to para/fp/both (which it did), CH and prevent a subsequent Drum, or if neither happened, would've probably lost someone.

Going with Heal Bell was pretty much a 50/50 and a pure test of prediction.

Going with Body Slam was roughly a 64/36 factoring in para, fp, and ch in my favor to come out without a scratch.

1. If he drummed, I could've used Body Slam. That would put him in a horrible position. Heal Belling this turn would've put him at 39% HP, me at full, with Body Slam doing about 23% a turn. In the subsequent turn, anything that ISN'T him critting my Miltank would've ended badly for him.

2. If he cursed, I could've Heal Belled, allowing me to bring in a "fresh" Skarm. Body Slam would be inconsequential.

Going with Belly Drum, odds are greatly against him for him to come out beneficial in the exchange. Curse was the clear choice, and I played accordingly.

How gay is Suicune? Very. He starts to realize he can force a Suicune vs Snorlax matchup at will with Tyranitar though. And he can force a Tyranitar vs Skarm matchup at will with Snorlax. I begin to give up the pure stalling and try to execute my own offense. The safe route was taking too long and could probably cost me the match if luck didn’t go my way.

Spoiler: Luck didn’t go my way for pretty much the rest of the battle.

Brilliant move! Many less experienced players would've chosen to go with Rest this turn, which is actually the worst possible option (save a second Belly Drum).

Using curse was a way for him to keep Snorlax alive should I get through para, and at the same time, should I FP, he would've been in a position to go on the offensive.

From a defensive perspective, the only way his Snorlax could've died that turn is if I CH'd him through para, which is about a 4.5% chance. So Rest is an inconsequentially right move 4.5% of the time. Body Slam is the right move 26% of the time (26% chance to win the game really). Curse is the inconsequentially right move 92.5% of the time, and 3% (triple FP or FP + CH would've won the game; .25^3+.25*.0625) chance to win the game.

Ate my words not 10 turns later. I wasn't staying in, seeing as my luck is horrendous. Since I was out of Rock Slides at this point, I had to find another way to win. Neither of us had enough offense to break the other. What I did have though, is two Pokemon extremely adept at taking advantage of Struggle, whereas he had one. Slowly but surely, I'd waste my PP so that I can deliver a 999 attack Struggle. I was careful not to use up all my Earthquakes so I can keep Skarmory active instead of the other two.

At this point, I was counting everything. I had to be sure he was out of either Whirlwinds or before I could abuse 999 attack struggle. In order to do that, I had to force Skarm to use attacks instead of mindlessly switching around. And I had the Pokemon to do that.

Whereas I could waste PP via switching, he HAD to keep Skarmory in versus Marowak or risk an EQ if he decides to get cute with prediction

Horrible misplay here, should've used drum. Getting rid of drum as soon as possible ensures that your last attack will be Rest before your 999 attack struggles and not something that destroys half your life. But then again, I didn't bother to check his PP. I knew he was out of Drill Pecks, but I thought he had a lot more PP left of Rest, giving me plenty of opportunities to drum. At this point:

1. My vision was blurring.
2. I honestly didn't care that much anymore.
3. I started drinking.

He was keeping count of my drum/rest PP. Clever, he needed me at full HP to ensure I couldn't drum twice. If he had kept Skarm in, I would've been able to drum, bringing myself to <40%, allowing myself to drum once again.

Inevitable now really, he has more Belly Drum PPs than Rest PP, he would have to Drum twice and when he does, I can just Body Slam for the win. I have enough Growl PPs to outlast his Drum + Rest waste.

After this battle, he goes on ranting about him being in the midst of creating some revolutionary poker playing program that'd win money for him, despite how moronically impossible to anyone half-adept at understanding the very basics of the limits of artificial intelligence. Crazy fool. I admire his perseverance, ignorance really is bliss.

Raikou taking one for the team. I know buddy, it should’ve been Suicune.

Being drunk for most of the latter half of the battle.

Slops

The only lucky move on my part throughout the entire game, resulting in the game lasting more than twice as long as it had to. Odds of me failing all 9 chances to win the game: .64*.88*.88*.88*.64*.64*.88*.64*.64 = 6.4%.

Snorlax sucking at paralyzing.

Miltank sucking at paralyzing.

Marowak sucking at flinching/CHing.

Suicune being suspetible to CHes during times of bad STs.

Downplaying the existence of drumcurselax outside of myself.

A surprising number of misplays on my part.

Not being able to count to 24.

Being drunk for most of the latter half of the battle.

Honestly though, the battle could've gone either way from beginning to end, even when we resorted to PP wasting and whatnot, we knew one wrong move could result in some pretty devastating 999 attack struggles. That's what I like. And that's usually the result of GSC battles between two teams that were more or less, equal.

This was ultimately a mirror match. Had this battle been replayed, my knowing his Pokemon and his knowing mine, it would've really just been a matter of execution and para/flinch/CH rolls. My Raikou allows me to drum more freely, whereas his t-tar could wear down my skarm much quicker with pursuit. Suicune and Starmie, for the most part, is there for show. If one of us ran Drumfable instead of the waters, it would've given him a huge advantage over the other. If I ran DE instead of Body Slam on Snorlax, I probably could've broken down skarm much quicker. Anyway, there's a lot of hypothetical situations that don't really matter.

As aforementioned, should our teams ever clash, it just be a matter of skill and luck, the team dynamics are virtually identical in terms of breaking each other, so it comes down to execution.

Versus other teams

Similarities are in the coverages: regular curseshit is handled nicely by a combination of Skarmory + Miltank, the usual threats (drumzard, druidcruel, joltwak, etc) are also covered nicely. The teams dish out enough damage against quicker teams to make that matchup a tossup, and are much quicker than the slower, even more methodical teams.

Because he chooses to forgo the legendary duo of Suicune + Raikou, he’s very susceptible to mixed sweepers. A mixlax, especially one running LK can have a field day here, as well as Nidoking, Dragonite, and other Tyranitars. Miltank can only hold the forte for so long. Also, oddities like growth vaporeon, cursecune, etc are also huge headaches from turn one.

But if there’s one weakness my team has that his doesn’t is against certain spikes teams. Whereas I’m forced to outplay most teams running Spikes, he can generally get it out of the way without too much hassle. Starmie is the best spinner in the game, and because it packs both Psychic and Surf, it all of the spikers hard. Running Psychic also means stupid shit like Gengar can’t wall spin, and should the opponent run Misdreavus, there’s always pursuittar waiting in the wings.

There are some defensive loopholes however. There’s no real answer to clefable, granted, it would have a hard time switching in in the first place. Against a growth passing team, it’s really all about attacking. It’s no different from any other team.

The one-two punch delivered by Marowak + Snorlax are generally more than enough to break through even the sturdiest of stall teams.

Thief on Skarmory is an interesting choice that I’ve considered myself. However, it needed to steal leftovers from either Marowak, Snorlax, or other Skarmory in order for it to really make a difference for my team. Curse offers awesome defensive coverage against drumlax; skarms are susceptible to CH Des, which OHKO. After a curse, regardless of ch, I’ll survive the ordeal. After the drum/hit ordeal, Snorlax (assuming initially full HP) will be at 62% HP, and I’ll be at 69%, versus the 62%/50% without curse. In addition, Skarm’s speed is reduced to 159 after a curse, just enough to outspeed Snorlax. And because Skarm deals an average of about 30% damage to Snorlax, that’s a 2hko, potentially ohko should I CH, which forces Snorlax to either switch or heal up.

On a numerical scale, here’s how I’d rate the teams:

Team #1

Offense: 7/10; enough to break every team, but you’ll be in a jiff should luck not go your way with flinch/CH/paras
Defense: 8/10; will wall most orthodox sets to hell and back, “weak” to quicker spiking teams, Drumfable is deadly
Consistency: 8/10; with Raikou, Snorlax, Suicune, Miltank, and Skarmory on the team, there’s very little that can go wrong against rogue opponents

Team #2:

Offense: 8/10; with pursuittar, offense is flawless. It’s the not the quickest of teams, but with the anti-spike coverage, it’ll have plenty of opportunities
Defense: 7/10; defense against spikes teams is as good as it gets; weak to mixed sweepers and most NYPC shit; God forbid if they run two ghosts; general coverage is pretty good
Consistency: 8/10; Starmie, Skarmory, Snorlax, and Miltank is plenty coverage should you go wrong.

Spoiler: There’s actually a part 4 to this, where I kind of go off ranting about GSC. Stay tuned.

EDIT: Both of these teams suck. Use starmie over cune. HP kou to update.

Anyway, here’s me ranting about pokemon. This has been in the works for two years now, so if there’s any incoherence, that’s my excuse. First off, clauses.

HP Legends – Probably the most debated “rule” in all of GSC. Countless arguments have been made about this topic, ranging from “well it’s stupidly hard to attain legendary Pokemon with HP Ice/Water 70”, to which the respondents say “it’s just as hard to attain Pokemon with perfect DVs”. Honestly, if you want my opinion, no Pokemon should be banned based on exclusiveness, stats, or anything objective like that. There’s only one reason stuff should be banned: over-centralizing the game or making the game stupid. HP Zapdos/Raikou forces opponents to run either Raikou and Snorlax, sure, but aren’t those two (especially Snorlax) pretty much on every team already anyway? Unless you get rid of those two, I see absolutely no reason to ban them, since it’s not really over-centralizing the game more than any other set. I would LOVE to see a metagame without Snorlax, Suicune, Raikou, Skarmory, and Zapdos.

NYPC – This was a huge debate, and still is until the death of GSC. Often the target of many heated debates among Pokemon fanatics, definitely up there with HP legends. Arguments once again come mostly in the shape of either “exclusiveness; not many people are able to attain such moves”, or “making sense; Lovely Kiss should come from Pokemon that can actually… kiss, and what the hell is Umbreon doing with the grass exclusive Growth?” Again, I don’t care for these arguments, the only reason something should be banned is for over-centralizing the game. Stuff like LK Nidoking or Sing Pikachu doesn’t really force any team to run a specific counter, whereas LK Snorlax… well, has no real answer. In the case with LK Snorlax, I’ll make a case on it being pretty damn broken (don’t worry guys, I address Hypnomissy later).

1 Legendary – This was more of a gentlemen’s agreement than anything. I don’t think you’ll find in the record books anywhere mention this clause, but this was pretty much the consent amongst most people. Or maybe it was just me. Whatever. Legendaries include the 3 birds, the 3 dogs, and Celebi.

Double Team – This was never that big of a problem to most veteran battlers back then. Given the innate suckitude of all BP Pokemon, the only possible problem that could arise would be from certain last Poke DT-ers, the most famous of these: SHUCKLE. Curse, Double Team, Rollout, Rest. This Pokemon single handedly won countless games for me. For a short stint in ’04, it was my curselax counter, but man was it good at it. It walled and beat all forms of Snorlaxes.

Sleep Trapping – Sure, the ban currently (according to Smogon), is the sleep perish trapping ban. But honestly, what’s the difference between hypnomissy running Hyp/Psong and Hyp/Curse? Not much really. The former is certainly more formidable regarding Misdreavus, but the latter applies to a far greater population. Stuff like Spider Web/Spore Smeargle, LK/ML/Nightmare Jynx run along the same principle. People say Encore zam shuts down hypnomissy, but that’s not true at all. Assume zam comes in on a ML, it’s forced to Encore the Mean Look, whereas missy can either Perish Song OR Protect. And because Encore only has 5 PP (8 with ups), it’ll run out long before missy runs out of Mean Looks. I agree with this ban, but it should be more inclusive, to include all forms of trapping + sleeping (baton pass notwithstanding).

Celebi as an uber – It isn’t. Plain and simple. It has the stats, it doesn’t have the movepool. Think of it as Suicune with Recover and Heal Bell, but without Roar. Well that doesn’t make much sense, but that’s how I see it. It’s annoying sure, hard as hell to kill, but what isn’t? To put forth blatantly: it doesn’t pose much of a threat to any team. It’s just there… always… there.

With that said, Celebi is unhealthy metagaming in its truest form. However, if there's ever one pokemon where just being defensive makes it overpowered, it's celebi (and lugia/mewtwo, but that's beside the point). You can't possibly tell me you have fun playing with it/against it. It's just +100 unnecessary turns, as well as upsetting the current offense vs defense seesaw, which is the closest it's ever been. Shit like Marowak is being used outside of Jolteon teams is "new" (2006-2007; not new to you guys, but to us), Machamp threatening ever team legitmately (as opposed to the pre-2008 of just hitting everything hard, but koing nothing), and Exeggutor rocking up OU the way it's meant to. Blissey and Skarmory has become as unreliable as ever, and Miltank has taken a pretty harsh hit as well. Bellers are becoming the crutch they're meant to be. Celebi needn't come back. And no, "just use HP Bug" isn't a viable counterargument. HP Bug Steelix/Espeon/whatever is far outside the reasonable norm to countering something and arguing it's viability.

Bottomline: It's not uber by way of power, but that doesn't mean it shouldn't be unbanned.

There’s quite a few popular Pokemon that’s never made it to my rotation. That’s not true, some of them have, even if it’s just for a short stint. Here’s some honorable mention of some Pokemon I’ve tried to make work, but just couldn’t.

Tried, tried, and failed Pokemon:

Clefable – The little engine that could. God I loved this little bastard. Belly Drum + one turn recovery? Sign me up. Fire Blast running off better-than-Snorlax SA? Ice Beam? Shadow Ball? Submission? ENCORE?!? Why is this not OU? I don’t know, but believe me, I’ve tried to make this Pokemon work. I really have, especially the Encore set, which is just downright nasty. The thing is, on paper, it’s awesome. It’s better than awesome. But in practice, it’s just lacking something. I’ve always thought it was the defense, but hey, 244 def/278 spc. def running off 393 HP and one turn recovery isn’t bad, in fact, it’s pretty damn good. Then I thought it was the speed, 218 isn’t anything to write home about. That’s part of it. Combine that with the fact that, while it has all these great options to counter Skarmory, or Gengar, or Rhydon, it couldn’t do all 3, and whatever 4th move you choose, it’ll probably be the wrong one. It’s much too overpowered for UU [and probably even BL] play though.

Porygon2 – I loved the stat distribution on this thing. 258 attack was just enough to reach the 999 cap, speed was inconsequential, the special stats were incredible! And the movepool? Sufficient. The standard, to this day, was Curse, Return, Recover, Ice Beam/Thunderbolt. Random fact: Porygon2 can out PP stall standard curselax. It falls to Body Slam Snorlax though, unless you’re very lucky with the fps. Anywho, the problem with this Pokemon, much like the aforementioned Clefable, is the fact that you can’t reliably pull off a sweep. Tyranitar walls all forms of Porygon2, and if it’s the cursingttar kind, the tables have turned. Ghosts still give you hell, albeit you’ll eventually kill them (Rest Gengar/Missy don’t exactly… exist). And you can’t reliably stop Reflect Forretress from flatout walling you. So the problem comes down to movepool, 3 moves could’ve made it a much more viable Pokemon: Body Slam, Earthquake, and Flamethrower. Belly Drum too, but that’s another story. This is the slightly bigger engine that still couldn’t.

Exeggutor – This was probably one of THE most popular Pokemon among the “veterans” of the day. And I can see why. He was an offensive defensive Pokemon. He didn’t have a great movepool, but it was just enough to carry out his role effectively. This thing could force switches, tons and tons of switches. Leech Seed, Stun Spore, Sleep Powder, Psychic, Giga Drain, Substitute, Protect, HP Fire and Explosion. I hate facing it.

Update: Exeggutor owns. Doesn't need spikes to work, it just works. Everywhere, almost any team. Almost Zapdos/Raikou like in terms of flexibility (not quite Snorlax-esque). The 2nd most dangerous Pokemon in GSC, usurping Gengar (albeit probably 4th most useful, since it isn't a consistent performer like Raikou/Zapdos).

Gengar – A couple years ago I deemed this the second most dangerous Pokemon in GSC, behind Snorlax. The reason for this: unpredictable. Hypnosis, Destiny Bond, Mean Look, Explosion, Counter, Perish Song – that’s six game-breaking moves. Use him properly and be rewarded. Not much is more satisfying than Countering Tyranitar’s EQ, then following that up by Destiny Bonding Snorlax. However, his greatest asset was also his greatest weakness. When you expose all four moves, Gengar loses a lot of his effectiveness. And I’m not too fond of that. Regardless, it makes several appearances in my other teams. It’s one of the better Raikou “killers”, and probably the best Spin blocker. The former was due to the fact that Raikou was one of the better Gengar counters, so he could effectively “lure” out Raikou and explode on him. And because Raikou walled so many otherwise dangerous Pokemon, Gengar saw use. However, for the most part, these teams were not very consistent in their performances. They may win matches with skill and style, but sometimes lose to some inferiorly built teams because of that “unpredictability” factor.

In addition to these, there were a few more Pokemon that were just deemed “cool”. Nidoking falls in that category, its NYPC usage never disputed. Regardless of how well the following Pokemon worked, and believe me, a couple of them wrecked GSC for months, they’re awesome.

Cool just on another level Pokemon:

Charizard – Honestly, any Pokemon that can sport Belly Drum is cool (Smeargle withstanding, more on that later). But come ON, Charizard? He’s a legend, iconic to all. Too bad Ash sucked as a trainer. Anyway, it was once the most dominant Pokemon on the GSC stage, regardless of how short that period may have been. Belly Drum, Earthquake, Rock Slide, Fire Blast, everyone knew the set, but people still lose to it. One turn setup and it’s all over, badass in all regards. I have built several teams designed to lure out and kill the counters (Suicune, Raikou, Starmie) and it works surprisingly well, even against the best of players. And it’s damn fun to use. Random fact: BD’d Pink Bowed Hyper Beam OHKOs Suicune.

Tentacruel – What can I say, this was more of a general consensus than anything. I’ve never personally been swept by one, but I’ve done it to others, and I’ve heard legen… wait for it… dary stories. Swords Dance, Hydro Pump/Surf, Substitute, Sludge Bomb, how men do it. None of that Mirror Coat business, he’ll beat you even though you know exactly what’s coming. A Psychic/tbolt totting Starmie or ST Raikou is probably the closest thing you’ll get to for surefire counters. This is a bit slower to pull off than Charizard, but a lot less risky. As a result, it was also more popular. It took a great deal of skill to use and required constant mind games to succeed against better-built teams, which made it damn fun to use (sound familiar?). Fun fact: learns Rapid Spin, resists Forretress’s HP Bug, Cloyster’s Surf/Ice Beam, and Toxic. Best spinner? May very well be. Go figure.

Jynx – Luna – Ice Beam, Psychic, Lovely Kiss, Substitute. Almost synonymous with the word, awesome. And like Tentacruel/Charizard, her set was beyond predictable, yet she still worked. She got the job done always, and is just a legend in her own right. ST Raikou and ST Suicune [and occasionally Starmie] causes all kinds of trouble for her though. Whatever.

Vaporeon – This is more of a personal “cool” more than anything. My favorite stall breaker by far is Vaporeon with AA, Growth, Surf, Rest. This was a set I ran back in '04, when growtheons were banned. I used it to recordwhore some 150+ winstreaks in Battledome. Not sure how original it is, but I've never seen its use prior to my own, so I guess I can put a claim on it. Clear all electrics and it sweeps. Not even Drumlax can switch into it. It outpaces curselax for the kill. Seeing that it’s UU/BL in the eyes of many just makes that that much more awesome. It’s the only special sweeper that actually works, and works consistently in GSC to date. The rest of the Eevee-tree are too fragile to pull off game after game. Sweet.

Pikachu – The Pokemon that boasts the strongest single special attack in the game, a STABed Thunder off 396 spc. Ridiculous! Sing, Surf, Thunder, Dynamic punch, reap the benefits. Gimmick, or is it? You’d be surprised.

Following the list of awesomeness, we go down the less of slightly less awesome, but still useable and effective.

I can see why these work, but just not my style Pokemon:

Steelix – I’ve never used him outside of killing Suicunes. A single Curse lets him OHKO Suicune, which is great for my Drumzard team. Helps Druidcruel too, but that’s another story. Actually, I lied, as a result of running EQ, Roar, Curse, Explosion, I’ve found that Skarmory often becomes the target should the opponent have no bulky waters. But that’s more crossfire kills than anything. Regardless, from experience, Steelix is one of the best at forcing switches, and doubles as an amazing physical wall. I haven’t run the damages, but I’m pretty sure he can “wall” Shuckle, which might not sound like a lot, but believe me, it is. Also, it survives a Drumlax’s EQ, which is always useful.

Dragonite – He doesn’t really fit here, since he is my style. But I’ve stated before that Raikou is probably my favorite Pokemon of all time, and seeing that all forms of Dragonite is stopped dead cold by Raikou, that kind of gives me the wrong impression of Dragonite. Whatever though, it’s still pretty damn cool, as lovable a dragon as any. HP Flying/Double Edge, Thunder, Ice Beam, and Dynamic Punch, pick offensive move and go. Watch your opponent struggle to find the appropriate wall, only to find there is none. He’ll go down as one of the greatest mixed sweepers in GSC.

Machamp – Cross Chop was legendary back in the day, it’s the primary reason that Skarmory isn’t considered a counter to Machamp. Anywho, I’ve actually used Machamp to decent success in my day. Be it Curse with HP Ghost or as a mix sweeper with Fire Blast, he’s been modestly useful on every account. However, for whatever reason. It. Just. Wasn’t. Right. In your average battle, there’s hardly a time where I could send in Machamp without getting hit for a decent chunk myself. The CHs were also untimely, I don’t know. And I never saw this as a “cool” Pokemon because of its immense popularity.

Misdreavus – Probably among the most bitched about Pokemon in the game. She was the topic of conversation when it comes to arguing the legality of NYPC moves. When people think of Perish trapping or sleep trapping, this is who they think of. Missy revolutionized Perish Trapping. Seeing that no Pokemon can downright kill it in a turn, she’ll always be able to take at least one down. This lead to p-hazing being mandatory among competitive teams. However, she adapted, Attract and Confuse Ray were used in the 4th slot instead of the standard [at the time] Pain Split/Destiny Bond. This meant that p-hazers “only” had about a 81.25% chance to work (1-.5*.5*.5*1.5=.8125), or about a 20% chance to die. Futhermore, with Skarmory/Suicune being the two most popular p-hazers, Misdreavus running Thunder can run circles around standard teams. To add injury to insult, NYPC offered Hypnosis. This stirred enough controversy that resulted in its immediate ban, under the term “Sleep Perish Trapping”. This also raised questions regarding the legality of other NYPC moves.

Umbreon – If there’s one set that stands out in my mind when mentioning Umbreon, it’s Charmbreon, co-created by Bob and ViL. Charm, Toxic, Pursuit, Rest, a tool of a Pokemon if there ever was one. Created at the peak of Curselax and prior to the coming of drumlax, it pretty much was the answer to anything running curse at the time. Occasionally, you’ll see one with ML + BP, hoping to trap some unsuspecting customer, though that rarely worked (see: single-digit IQ). Pursuit + Toxic was great for TSS teams (or TS really, no one used Sandstorm), where Starmie was the primary spinner for the majority of teams. Pursuit did around 40%, and Starmie hates getting Toxic’d. Skamory is generally the switch-in to Umbreon, as it blocks Toxic and doubles as a phazer should Umbreon try to ML. Not to mention, Pursuit’s damage is in the negatives to the steel bird. However, on a personal note, I don’t really like Pokemon whose sole purpose is defensive and poses no offensive threat. You’re honestly asking stuff to set up on you all day, and Pokemon you slowly and methodically worn down with the rest of your team can just switch in and Rest it away because your only attack is a 40 base power move running off a sub-220 spc attack stat. But in the end, Umbreon was still damn good at doing what she’s meant to do. Probably the best. Definitely worth mentioning.

Jolteon – The first half of the dreaded JoltWak. There’s not much else really. Her set is pretty conventional, yet with a hint of unpredictability, just enough to throw off players. Is it passing Sub or Agility [or Growth in an NYPC environment]? HP Water, Ice, or Grass? Usually water, but I’ll touch on that later on. That’s really all the variation there is, but it just works. Jolteon’s the only Pokemon in GSC that can reliably Baton Pass with some regularity. She shuts down all forms of Skarmory and Suicune, the two most popular phazers. HP Water is plenty good for the likes of Rhydon, Tyranitar, and Steelix, the next most popular. The only phazer that she can’t set-up on is Raikou, to which I’ll take my chances with tbh. Sleep talking Raikous are by far the most popular variations, followed by the Reflect kind. Then you have HP Ice, which died out with the implementation of showing percentage HP instead of actual values. The whole point of HP Ice was to maintain 333 HP, not giving away the element, while still hitting Grounds (Piloswine and Quagsire withstanding). Should you ever meet a Roaring Venusaur or something though, I guess it’s an option. And Hazing Dragonites, or something equally dumb. HP Grass really has no advantage over water at all, so don’t do it, unless you’re passing Agility and you fear Quagsire. Eh. I’ve ran a sleep talking Jolteon set just for the sake of running one, but 333 HP doesn’t really cut it, regardless of how awesome 288 Spc Def combined with 0 spc weaknesses may be. Use Ampharos. It can actually take a physical hit. Sort of.

Moving away from me personally and onto the metagame as a whole, there’s quite a few Pokemon that impacted the game in one way or another. There are those listed above. which all had their own contributions to the metagame, some small (Clefable), some non-existent (Pikachu), some pretty damn revolutionary (Misdreavus, Druidcruel), or in other words, I don’t want to redo the rants on the already mentioned Pokemon. I don’t know how to categorize the first group, so “miscellaneous” will have to do.

Miscellaneous mentions of the Pokemon that never quite made it to the big leagues, but they all shined in small quantities.

Donphan – Yep, the 2nd most popular spinner that’s not inherently a spiker. His defense is definitely underrated, and joins Suicune, Umbreon, and Cloyster as one of the only Pokemon that isn’t 3 shotted by Snorlax’s DE (not factoring resistances). Not much to say, generally ran Roar, EQ, Rapid Spin, and Rest; boasted the second strongest EQ in the game. That’s pretty much it. Oh and don’t use HP Rock to hit birds; you’re not being creative, you’re missing the point, he’s an utility Pokemon, not a sweeper. And as a curse Roarer, Tyranitar does everything better. I couldn’t find much use for him personally in any of my teams, but I’ve seen him work, since it does pack quite a punch should all the birds go down. Probably the most offensive of all the spinners, yet not… if that makes any sense. If I had to sum up Donphan, he’s a hard-hitting physical spinner that also p-hazes but can’t hit flying.

Houndoom –There were a lot of sets that worked for Houndoom. The sunnybeamer is probably one of the closest thing to a special sweeper in GSC. It was definitely one of the better sleep talkers in the game. It also had a game changing surprise move in Counter. And with the iconic Pursuit, Fire Blast, Crunch, Sleep Talk set, it was the closest thing to a true sleep trapping counter. And what many don’t know is that this thing packs 278 attack. With all those positives, it never got off the ground as being anything more than Borderline for several reasons. His defense is abysmal, and he has one of the worst combination of types defensively, which leaves him susceptible to every physical type that mattered (Ground, Rock, and Fighting). The two lone physical types it isn’t weak to (Bug and Normal)… well one runs of 348 attack with 180 base power, and the other will generally run off 300+ attack with 150+ base power. Furthermore, Houndoom finds it difficult to go head to head with the common special attackers in the game (Starmie, Suicune, Zapdos, Raikou), meaning it can’t reliably hit without being hit in the process. And that 278 attack? Awesome. Too bad it doesn’t learn Dynamicpunch to hit the one thing that matters, Blissey, nor does he get STAB on any of the physical attacks he does learn. And with the almost universal ban on sleep trapping, there’s almost no point in using him. Regardless, 318 Spc Attack combined with 288 Speed, and two stupidly powerful STAB attacks will always have a place in the game.

Popular failures

Kingdra – Great stats, great typing, horrible movepool. That’s everybody’s view on Kingdra. And for the most part, it’s true. The movepool does suck, a lot. The stats are perfectly balanced. And for all intents and purposes, it had no weaknesses. However, because his stats are just average - slightly above average in every way, it doesn’t stand out. It neither excels at being a physical attacker nor a special attacker, a physical wall nor a special wall. It was jack of all trades, master of none. If it were me, I’d move 30 points from spc def to def, and 30 points from attack to spc attack, at least then you’ll know what it’s suppose to do. And it’s defensive typing is great, but as a result, his offensive typing is mediocre at best. Dragon attacks don’t really hit SE on anything, other than Kingdra itself. Dragonite is better off being Ice Beamed. So offensively, he’s nothing more than a water type. Furthermore, his movepool lacks a lot of coverage, no Thunderbolt, no Flamethrower, and no physical attacks of which to speak. The general accepted set for Kingdra is Surf, Dragonbreath, Rest, Sleep Talk. What’s that set suppose to do exactly? Surf everything, and whatever’s resistant to Surf, Dragonbreath it. Dragonbreath, after STAB, has 90 base power. That makes Houndoom laugh. And when’s the last time you killed something important with Surf on the quicker, harder hitting Starmie? Dragonbreath offers paralysis, and that’s pretty much the only thing going for that set. So if you’re really thinking about this ST set, just use Lapras with Thunder Wave, Surf/Ice Beam, Rest, Sleep Talk. If you’re really keen on using Kingdra because the stats/typing have you fooled, a set that MIGHT work is Curse, Return, Surf, Rest. But then, Suicune would probably do that better. Oh well.

Update: Might be the only legitimate Hazer in the game on second thought, made possible by my very own Vaporeon. Oh what's that Vaporeon? How about 4x resistance, and a Haze to stop you dead in your tracks. Jolteon trying to pass Agi? Nah, don't think so. Surf, Rest, Haze, ST or something like that might be viable in some odd stall team. Maybe.

Alakazam – I don’t know what it is about Alakazam that makes it so popular in the first two generations. It’s the 5000-IQ-influenced charisma. Amazing speed, other worldly special attack, and pretty good attacks to support it. STABed Psychic running off 368 spc, along with the collection of elemental punches, fools most into thinking that Alakazam is a special sweeper. That won’t work. For comparison’s sake, Alakazam’s Ice Punch is weaker than Starmie’s Ice Beam. Psychic is stronger, sure, but by how much? 24% to Snorlax, 34% to Raikou, 29% to Suicune, 15% to Blissey, 22% to Starmie. There’s no way of sweeping with damage values like that. Furthermore is the problem of getting Alakazam in. Recover is a great move, and 338 speed will ensure his recovery. Problem? Pretty much EVERYTHING hits it for half his HP. If you end up switching it into an attack, you’ll probably spend the next turn healing. If you end up switching it into a Rest or an opponent’s switch, you’d have net better results switching to your own Snorlax/Marowak. Starmie hasn’t been used as a sweeper since the early days of GSC, so why is Alakazam still often used as a 2-3 attack sweeper? Starmie is now relegated to spinner duty, along with p-passing/t-waving. If you want to use Alakazam, it should be the same way: support. Throw on Reflect/Light Screen, along with another utility move. While we’re on the topic of Starmie, they have similar speed, HP, special def, and both have Recover, HOWEVER the two are NOT comparable defensively. Starmie is a water type, meaning whatever special attack that hits it will either be super effective, or not very effective. It’s free to switch into whatever NVE attack it feels like, and it probably won’t switch into anything SE coming from a STAB’d source. Alakazam, on the other hand, pretty much takes every special hit (it’s not taking a physical hit from anything) for neutral damage. That means, while nothing is going to threaten it for the KO persay, EVERYTHING is going to threaten it to Recover. So while Starmie has free reign over fire, water, and ice attacks, Alakazam is fucked at least partially against all. But alakazam does have some interesting support options. Toxic + FP might make for interesting results. Encore is a good option, but only with spikes. And remember, it’s probably not a good idea to Encore any sort of damage attack. And there’s always Thunder Wave, which could be awesome for a 338 speed… thing. It’s a BL pokemon, no more, and no less. Being a top 10 at one point was completely unjustified. Mr.E is an idiot.

Jumpluff – It doesn’t even attack for fuck’s sake! While we’re on the topic of attacking, Rhydon/Golem both survive its Giga Drain with room to spare. Hell, they both survive HP Grass from this thing. So what does it do? Forces switches. And it has a plethora of ways to do it. Encore and Leech Seed are stupidly reliable, the threat of Sleep Powder keeps opponents on their toes, and there’s Stun Spore (doesn’t directly cause switches persay) for more fun. Toxic too, but everything learns that, so it’s not worth mentioning (too late). But like Alakazam, while it has the speed to run Encore, it lacks the ability to actually take the hit to really show off the move’s flexibility. Meaning, you’ll always run the risk of taking an attack (oh God!), which it sure as hell can’t do (but still a lot better than zam). And like ‘zam, should you switch into an attack, don’t Encore it (unless it’s that rare Giga Drain or something). However, unlike zam, you have the option of switching into one of the most popular attacks in EQ, and it’s faster than all EQ users to boot. Too bad it’s so stupidly spikes-reliant, and is such a offensive crutch, and is just a huge “Rest against me please” sign that it’s really ineffective. Plus, Exeggutor does it so much better. Also not deserving of its OU title, nor BL for that matter. And I can’t see it dominating UU either… given UU’s lack of legitimate spikers and Jumpluff’s inability to damage even an unborn fetus.

Scizor – It’s a baton passer than has no way to threaten the most popular p-hazer (Skarmory). That’s like a basketball player with no legs. I guess it’s possible to win, namely against basketball players with no arms, but really? It could pass a plethora of stuff though, Swords Dance, Agility, and Double Team. And it had a 358 attack to back it, and great typing + defenses to see plenty of action. Too bad it never did what it’s suppose to. Sure you could run HP Fire to wear down Skarmory, but what about the rock/water p-hazer? And given its 228 speed, even hazers could ruin its fun. And now that DT is banned, there’s no possibility of that “lucky” pass (a +1 evasion HP Zapdos/Raikou can threaten most things). I’m stretching the analysis here, but this is one pokemon that never really worked, at all. In the rare cases it gets shit passed (because it doesn’t do anything else), the next pokemon does it better. However, if you throw one of these, in a team with a BPing Jolteon and/or Smeargle, then you might get off a successful pass against most non-stalls, which could mean GG then and there.

Smeargle – The best movepool in the game, coupled with the worst statistical total of all usable Pokemon. The creativity of movesets for this pokemon is limitless in theory, but almost non-existent in practice. Spore is almost a given, seeing that the original user made a horrific deal with satan, sacrificed its speed, HP, defenses, and garnered the worst possible typing in the game (4x resist to EQ though; Rhydon’s EQ only does ~7% after leftovers, but RS does 75%) for the 100% sleep move. At first, people saw teamplay potential in it, saving two slots in being able to use both Heal Bell and Spikes. That didn’t work, given the beller actually has to stay alive for it to make any difference. And unlike the other spikers, it’s non-existent explosion and equally non-existent defensive values didn’t help its case. Later on, it was seen potentially as an amazing bp-er, Belly Drum + BP HAD to be broken. It wasn’t. If it drummed, it died. GSC is slow, but not 248 speed slow. Even Skarmory has the potential to do 50% to it (not that it matters, since skarm WWs). Later on, people realized how hopeless he was, and therefore turned to more obscure sets. Spider Web, Spore, Super Fang, s-toss/nightshade was a popular choice at one time. “Was”. It still couldn’t switch into anything, and any team with a sleep-talker completely shut it down. And also see my rant on sleep-trapping, but do take note that this was not the intended target. I could care less about Smeargle. Furthermore, I had the novelty ideal of making it a solid sweeper: Belly Drum, Agility, Flail, Reversal. Focus Band, of course. There was no way it’s pulling off Endure, because it’s dying the turn it drums. Focus Band at least gives you a chance. IF it does work, you’ve probably just won the game; it OHKOs Suicune, Steelix, Snorlax, Celebi, Umbreon, and Miltank. Anyway, the most effective route to go is to uncheck “sleep clause” and go wild with Agi/Spore. People did it to recordwhore against the careless, and that’s probably all that it’s good for. Oh, and it’s decent in level-balance as well. However, if you throw this guy in a team with a BPing Jolteon and/or Scizor, then you might get off a successful pass against most non-stalls, which could mean GG then and there.

Snorlax – Snorlax is both disappointing and amusing. Lethargic and awesome. But can anyone explain why in the middle-goings of GSC popularity (01-03), Blissey was more widely used… and for DEFENSIVE purposes of all things? I don’t care if it has 713 HP, it had 118 defense. That’s essentially 357 HP with 236 defense. That’s a Seaking, an Ariados, a Golbat for fuck’s sake! I don’t care if it had one-turn recovery. Was it so hard to use a physical attack on a special attacker? Well, apparently, at the time, it was. Just as hard as it was to tack on fire-attacks on physical attackers. Go figure. Ahh… I wish I had all the knowledge I do today in the yesteryears and be laughed out with these “absurd ideas” (yep, you heard correctly; if I had a time machine, Pokemon would be a priority, over money and women; I am a loser). Oh well, Snorlax surpassed Blissey now, and for good reason. Amazing movepool. A. Maze. Ing. And contrary to popular belief, I don’t think people realize how “absurd” his defenses actually are. In fact, I’d consider Snorlax not only an amazing special wall, but also an extremely resilient physical wall. To put things into perspective, Snorlax has the equivalence of 349 HP and 342 defense. That’s Umbreon-esque. Curselax took off in early years, and completely reshaped GSC. It single-handedly made several never-before-considered Pokemon in OU standards (Skarmory comes to mind). There was Snorlax, and there was the rest of the Pokemon.

Raikou/Zapdos – For all intents and purposes, I’m grouping these two. Zapdos was at one point, the number 2 pokemon in GSC. Nowadays, Raikou surpassed it, but now with HP, who knows? Raikou’s growth in popularity was fueled by GSC’s gradual movement to a slower and slower metagame. Its 298 special defense, coupled with 383 HP and no special weaknesses made it a premier GSC special wall, probably better than Snorlax (because it resists the most common special attack, and scares away users of #2 and #3) and just under Blissey. The 328 speed sure didn’t hurt it either. Furthermore, Crunch gave it something to do against Rhydon/Golems, as well as other electrics, and a spc. down forces even Snorlax to switch out. The tradeoff is not being able to touch Blissey, and probably isn’t your best answer to Heracross. Raikou has Reflect and Roar, both of which it uses very well. Being horrendously resilient to just about everything, Raikou makes for one of the best p-hazers in the game, but not in the traditional sense. It’s not good at Roaring out cursers/drummers/dancers, but it’s good at just about everything else. It switches into at least 2/3 of most teams, hence easily racking up spikes damage. Being genderless and resistant to tbolt, it becomes the best counter to p-trappers and the tried-and-true joltwak. And behind Reflect, he gets even more annoying. On the other hand, Zapdos has Roar and Whirlwind, albeit neither should be used. Zapdos isn’t a phazer, it has no special resistances (grass doesn’t count). And while 278 is respectable, enough to make Nidoking struggle to 3HKO with IB, it’s not enough to constantly switch into IP Gengar or Jolteon. Zapdos also has Reflect and Light Screen, both of which are just as good on him as on Raikou. In general, you should be fine switching into about half your opponent’s team, and you’re probably faster, allow you to throw up the screen. Furthermore, you have Thunder wave; this is probably one of the best reasons to use Zapdos over Raikou. It allows you to paralyze Raikou with surprising frequency, and this is useful for many teams. Raikou is often the bane of sweepers (Charizard, Vaporeon, Tentacruel, Dragonite all come to mind) due to its speed, and Thunder wave instantly shuts Raikou’s ability to counter them. Plus, Thunder wave is useful in general, even against Snorlax. A paralyzed Drumlax is much less likely to drum. Another reason to use Zapdos over Raikou is Heracross and Machamp, two of the biggest threats in GSC. Also, an interesting set that probably won’t work is Curse, Drill Peck, Rest, Thunder/Thunderbolt. As for offensive merits Raikou and Zapdos are probably the closest things to special sweepers. Thunder hits THAT hard, and HP for grounds is plenty. Furthermore, with spikes, Roar becomes an issue very quickly for teams playing against Raikou/Zapdos. And both of their physical defenses, while not amazing, should be plenty. You have no business switching either of them into Rhydon or anything (but I guess you could take that risk if you’re prediction is spot on and you have HP Water), but it’s fine for general physical attacks (something like Miltank or Pgon2). And they’re probably the two top sleep talkers, both for their defensive and offensive merits.

Depends on the teams really. Because you have complete control over the team you choose to play, you have control of how long the battles are. Some teams can consistently pull off wins/losses in 40-60 turns, others 100-150. Battles don't tend to last longer than that without the game having already been decided.

But usually, no, not this long. This is an exception more than anything, but still, it's certainly nowhere near the longest I've played.

And I think it was about an hour and a half.

Anyway, to do reviews:

Msc mentions - Donphan, Houndoom, Slowbro, Muk

Blissey, a category on its own.

Popular failures. I have no idea why people used these. – Kingdra, Alakazam, Jumpluff, Scizor, Smeargle

Depends on the teams really. Because you have complete control over the team you choose to play, you have control of how long the battles are. Some teams can consistently pull off wins/losses in 40-60 turns, others 100-150. Battles don't tend to last longer than that without the game having already been decided.

But usually, no, not this long. This is an exception more than anything, but still, it's certainly nowhere near the longest I've played.

And I think it was about an hour and a half.

Anyway, to do reviews:

Msc mentions - Donphan, Houndoom, Slowbro, Muk

Blissey, a category on its own.

Popular failures. I have no idea why people used these. – Kingdra, Alakazam, Jumpluff, Scizor, Smeargle

heres why scizor/smeargle were used one word baton pass. Scizor is a better jolteon that is WW by skarm rather than Roared by raikou. useful because if you pp stall skarm out of WW's you sweep. Scizor passes to marowak@thick club
fire blast
EQ
rest
rock slide
Smeargle on the other hand could BP belly drums to pokemons that needed ATK. however... i generally agree that scizor and smeargle were weak and just wasted a team slot

I know exactly what people were thinking when tacking those two on. I just don't know why they continue to be used even when it's clear nothing ever gets baton passed by those two.

Any Pokemon packing a STAB'd attack will 2hko Smeargle. Smeargle is forced to Spore turn 1, then generally meets a phazer turn 2. And if said pokemon is faster, it won't even get the chance to Belly Drum. The only time Smeargle is useful is in a Sleep Clause free environment (and these existed way back when, there were a few pathetics running around record-whoring the unwary), running the likes of Spore, Agility, Spider Web, Baton Pass.

And Scizor... well, he can't do anything to the popular phazers. And for that reason, he's nowhere near the level of Jolteon (which I'm also doing a review of btw).

And did you really just suggest that Marowak set? Rest over the likes of HP Flying/Bug? On a team with both Marowak and Scizor (aka no longevity)?

nah but people i face ran rest for some retarded reason. honestly hp flying is MUCH better because it takes out eggy. and jolteon what can jolteon do to raikou? raikou roars away jolteon and jolteon becomes a hassle. although since over half of teams run skarm theres no way scizor is doing squat. BP is worse than drinking moonshine.

and suicune+raikou is such a great combo that it deserves its own name Raicune

Because Raikou is not as common of a phazer as Suicune/Skarm, both of which wail on Scizor all day. In addition, if Raikou happens to be active against Scizor, you can bet he sure as hell won't be scared away by Scizor. Raikou is the only phazer Jolteon can't effectively setup against.

HP Flying is mainly for taking out Heracross along with the OHKO potential on Egg. HP Bug only guarantees an OHKO on Egg.

1. You listed two stages.
2. That's partly true because of the nature of GSC itself. However, once you get over the hump and create a team capable of dealing with anything you can throw at it, then the game will be decided during the "battle", akin "skill".
3. RSE should be no different, except that "hump" is much smaller and much easier to negotiate.

umm blissey is a useless poke in GSC. snorlax is a much better special wall it can take psysical hits unlike blissey. and is a offesive threat unlike blissey who can only preform duties better suited for miltank.

Paralyze skarmory with Snorlax (and if they're clueless, Miltank), then Flinch/FP it to death with Marowak.

Curse is intended to lure out the growlers/charmers (as seen in the battle), where Drum can subsequently set up on for a potential sweep. In addition, having drum ensures a Snorlax vs Skarmory matchup.

Of course, if they run a phazing Rhydon/Ttar (especially one with Rest), that kind of messes with the plan a bit.

And Blissey has never been a threat, nor a nuisance to any of my teams tbh. I can see one running Sing force some odd matchups, but whatever.

rid this world of human waste

pottlepalooza

"Popular failures. I have no idea why people used these. – Kingdra, Alakazam, Jumpluff, Scizor, Smeargle"

Kingdra is indeed useless, those stats are so ridiculously good though that people thought they could make good use of them. "Arcanine Syndrome," as I call it.

Scizor is somewhere along the same line, but Steelix and Skarmory shut Scizor down completely which made it completely drop off the face of GSC after being one of the most-used pokemon in GSC's infancy. Scizor still has potential, STAB HP Bug is nice and I feel Bug is an underrated attacking type (notably being SE on Reflect Starmie and Charm Umbreon), and even oddball Steel Wing is SE on Tyranitar and Rhydon and hurts after a Swords Dance (I think Swords Dance/HP Bug/Double-Edge/move is Scizor's best option though). However, the prominence of Steelix and Skarmory will be Scizor's bane.

Smeargle's worst option is trying to set something else up, which aggravates me because that's the only thing people think it's useful for. I still personally think that Smeargle is useless even with all the moves it has, but shit, try something unexpected. Encore? Destiny Bond? Super Fang? Spikes? Mirror Coat/Counter? I could see more usefulness in any of those moves than Spider Web/whatever.

Jumpluff I think is useful. the philosophy of pokemon now seems to dictate that either something must be able to sweep entire teams or wall entire teams. Jumpluff also requires a lot of, uh, como se dice, "prediction" to work properly, but Jumpluff's job is to force switches and status shit, and it does that. with the rise of one-turn setups (SD Marowak, Belly Drum whatever), I think paralysis will become en vogue again--I don't think people would risk a Belly Drum with paralysis and have an FP when they get Roared out.

Alakazam is awesome, I don't care what people think. Crazy array of moves, outspeeds Raikou and Starmie, uber Special Attack. the most recent time I used it with Fire Punch and Toxic and it's actually pretty good, especially with Spikes. Drumlax can't really switch into it since Psychic puts a very reasonable dent in it (--SpDef helps too), and I especially loved it with Toxic + Spikes since Snorlax would have to Rest before it could do anything. unfortunately Pursuit stuff wrecks it, but unless we're dealing with "game changing" pokemon (ie every pokemon on both teams involved in that battle) I guess that's the case sometimes.

I'm going to post more like these (I meant to in the first one), but since I don't have much time to do these kinds of things they'll be section by section.

a. Rapid Spinning Tentacruel has really no other use than to Rapid Spin; Forretress and Cloyster can also Spike, Starmie is faster and has a free move to use as it wishes in addition to not having to Rest. There's also Donphan I guess, who can pseudo-Haze (not well) and has at least a decent attacking move (Ghosts can't take Donphan's Earthquake). devoting an entire pokemon slot just for Rapid Spin doesn't cut it.
b. Swords Dance/Surf/Sludge Bomb/Substitute
c. Tentacruel can't take an Earthquake.

rid this world of human waste

I've been thinking: could you technically not just SD instead of Sub on the switch and use Ice Beam over Sub? I know Sub protects from para, sleep, and other amazing stroopwafel moves that kill Cruel dead, but Ice Beam would be nice to give something random like Dragonite a dent.

(then again i suppose dragonite has no business switching in on sd'd sludge bombs)

Also paralysis is nice, but too much shit has rest (and sleep talk to boot). Plus Heal Bell Blissey. I imagine Jumpluff is a pain for teams that just rely on powerful, slow offense without too much defensive teams but I can't imagine para stopping a slow stall team - unless you consistently manage to para something like a Restless Snorlax (or basically any GSC sweeper that does not have Rest), I imagine.

@havoc: Will respond to those 5 when I get to it. Donphan is a drag to write about.

Starmie's role, at least in the later years, was almost always as a designated spinner. Two secondary roles were Machamp counter (lets face it, every team is weak to Machamp), as as a pseudo passer. Tentacruel could pseudo pass as well (the better of the two screens), and it learns Haze, however useful that may or may not be.

Hydro Pump.

Depending on how popular Tentacruel may have gotten as a spinner, it still would've been a toss-up between HP Bug and EQ. Hit Tentacruel/Gengar/Missy versus hitting Starmie and whatever else harder.

@Altmer: I'm not really following you on the first part. Are you recommending Ice Beam over Sub on Druidcruel? Sludge Bomb hits the grasses harder. And as far as flying types go, without Substitute, you're going to have to IB on the switch versus Zapdos (and an SD'd Sludge Bomb does more), relying a lot on prediction, and Dragonite has never been a suitable switchin. Hydro Pump does pretty much the same as Ice Beam to Zapdos anyway.

I address jumpluff in my current in-the-works, but he's not that fun to talk about either :(

is this thread actually 20+ posts long, about actual GSC strategy, and made in the last week

if this keeps up i might have to add it to my favorites!

EDIT: I also wanted to add a few notes about Umbreon, Jolteon, Misdreavus.

Umbreon - Another more direct idea was Zap Cannon, does a more direct job of crippling Starmie, and sometimes even hits Raikou/Zapdos that don't mind being charmed (before they sleep talk) which we all know can lead to easier BL sweeper ownage

Jolteon - My personal preference was Agility/Baton Pass/HP Water/Thunderbolt, hits a ton of p-hazers and passes agility otherwise. Not as easy to use as the Sub version but with much higher upside, all you need is prediction.

Misdreavus - Rest is also a viable option if you have Restbell, this and protect allow misdreavus to beat pokemon that need two/three moves to kill it before the perish song goes out. Nothing is more satisfying than
Resting misdreavus on the last turn of perish song and switching out!