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I once attempted to add a second sub a few year after purchasing the first one (not Epik). They didn't sound the same. Apparantly, the manufacturer changed something (probably an improvement) but I wasn't able to intergrate them due to that change.

What does your comment have to do with our disappointment over them arbitrarily dropping their top of the line models, and trying to spoon feed us the brainwave of buying two of a lessor replacement?

This lesser replacement got me to sell my SVS. Some will come. Some will go elsewhere. Why bish about it? Epik, SVS, Rythmik, HSU, Seaton etc world don't revolve around you and me. At the end of the day they are all in it to make money so quit bishing about the 18"s already. I needed something more than a 12" v1-5 so I went elsewhere. Nag nag nag. Shhheeeeessh!

This lesser replacement got me to sell my SVS. Some will come. Some will go elsewhere. Why bish about it? Epik, SVS, Rythmik, HSU, Seaton etc world don't revolve around you and me. At the end of the day they are all in it to make money so quit bishing about the 18"s already. I needed something more than a 12" v1-5 so I went elsewhere. Nag nag nag. Shhheeeeessh!

I never suggested the world should revolve around you, or me? I mean jeez, you've never owned the models we're missing, you've gone from a SVS to a single Empire in your little apartment, and because that's good enough for you, damn everyone else's opinion. You are now declaring that should be good enough for everyone else too? I'm glad you're happy, but how can you possibly comment on something you've never experienced? Thanks for the blazing advice Homer.

I once attempted to add a second sub a few year after purchasing the first one (not Epik). They didn't sound the same. Apparantly, the manufacturer changed something (probably an improvement) but I wasn't able to intergrate them due to that change.

I had something similar happen. I bought a JL F112, and a year later bought a second one. In the meantime, there was a firmware update and the two subs were not a good match. It took me months to figure it out, and when I finally did, JL sent me a replacement amp with the same firmware as the newer sub. They matched well after that.

Craig

Lombardi said it:Perfection is not attainable, but if we chase perfection we can catch excellence."

I never suggested the world should revolve around you, or me? I mean jeez, you've never owned the models we're missing, you've gone from a SVS to a single Empire in your little apartment, and because that's good enough for you, damn everyone else's opinion. You are now declaring that should be good enough for everyone else too? I'm glad you're happy, but how can you possibly comment on something you've never experienced? Thanks for the blazing advice Homer.

Yes I am happy with my single Empire in my debt-free apt. A single Submersive isn't enough for some people. I have read where people have 3-4. I don't hear them whining. That is not the point. Your connnnnstaaaaaant bishing is the point. Take that Homer. ALso, for the record the Ultra dug deeper but would flap with some heavy midbass scenes. The Empire doesn't flap and I couldn't care less about the extra 10-15hz depth in 1-3% of my movies.

Yes I am happy with my single Empire in my debt-free apt. A single Submersive isn't enough for some people. I have read where people have 3-4. I don't hear them whining. That is not the point. Your connnnnstaaaaaant bishing is the point. Take that Homer. ALso, for the record the Ultra dug deeper but would flap with some heavy midbass scenes. The Empire doesn't flap and I couldn't care less about the extra 10-15hz depth in 1-3% of my movies.

I'm truly happy that you are now living flap free, and the universe is squarely aligned over your debt, and equity free apartment. Until which time you DO experience "the extra 10-15hz depth" (more like anything below 20Hz vs the Empire), trust me, you'll never know what you are missing. Again, in your situation, in deference to your neighbors and landlord, that's probably a good thing as ground shaking bass is very addictive, which in your case could result in homelessness. To everyone else who might crave something more, or at least add to what they already have, F 'em, right? As long as you are happy, nothing else matters. Jeesh...

You may end up with the same kind of issues mixing dissimilar subs as what Bsoko did. In addition, you may have an issue with dissimilar max output capabilities. IOW, the dual Empires will have higher SPL capability than the dual Mirage's. The Mirage's will go into distortion/compression long before the Empires. Therefore, you'll never realize the full output potential for the Empires as you have distortion coming from the Mirage's at lower SPL's. My suggestion would be to try the Empires by themselves first. If you don't have all the bass your require, I would sell the Mirage's and add more Empires.

Craig

I agree, I will try the Empires by themselves and see if that pleases me.

what's bishing? . Ok, I've got a little tiny rant. Certainly not knocking the company. I'm a fan of Epik and the talented owner Chad. But, I can honestly say now, after owning it for 4-5 months and only yesterday, finally finding the best to incorporate it into the system, I really expected allot from the lone Empire initially. But it is what it is. The problem is not the Empire. It's my expectation of that one sub cure. (You know:- flat to high single Hz digit, even response at the LP, great for music and movies). Goals of the "bass obsessed" that an Empire cannot provide me in my "non ideal" large my room. Multiple Empires....mabye 4 max? I'm sure it'd be much closer to those goals. I think Chad said 4 makes you feel whats going on below 10 Hz in room. But being in a state of wanting to know what else is out there, and what they sound like, I'm satisfied I got one to hear how the Empire sounded. AND it is a steal of a price that I got it for $918 shipped. Dense like a tank, clean edges and an overall nicer, more refined black appearance scores more points on the WAF...the build quality is at its peak right now. Is sealed sub sound for me? Individually, my Epik Tower outperforms it- losing some points only with music. Then again, I'm bass obsessed, so my wants can seem unrealistic to some. I hope Chad has atleast a ported beast in the works. Or mabye the return of the Dragon or Phoenix. Speaking of which, I was a bit worried at first about the orientation of the woofers in the Empire when first pictures were posted. Placement problems. I know now that I do prefer the driver firing into the direction of the LP, so no more dual opposed for me. Not sure if this also applies to downfiring subs as yet. After I've "settled" (thank goodness income is limited) and no more wondering how does that sound, I'm going to settle on multiples of the same. (I sure do wish I got another Tower or a Dyansty when it was in production). I have yet to try the Empire in a small sealed 12W*8H*14L sealed room I have, so I'll see how that goes. My pops is in need of a sub for music, and I'm tempted to send it off to him. But shipping outside of the US is going to be a bish :P .

I am disappointed in those who are doubting their purchase before the subs have even left Epik's warehouse???????

The fact of the matter has been mentioned numerous times, every sub will perform differently in all of our different rooms!!!! There are tools to help performance, and positioning can do wonders. Those hoping to add Empires to lessor qualified teammates to form some sort of WWE styled ring of BOOM are setting yourself up for disappointment. I guess I was lucky, or maybe I created a decent room for sound, or maybe some are still expecting loud, boomy, sometimes muddy bass coming from a corner of their room????

I agree with many of the comments on the entire Epik line, but how about investing some time in your purchase before condemning it.

what's bishing? . Ok, I've got a little tiny rant. Certainly not knocking the company. I'm a fan of Epik and the talented owner Chad. But, I can honestly say now, after owning it for 4-5 months and only yesterday, finally finding the best to incorporate it into the system, I really expected allot from the lone Empire initially. But it is what it is. The problem is not the Empire. It's my expectation of that one sub cure. (You know:- flat to high single Hz digit, even response at the LP, great for music and movies). Goals of the "bass obsessed" that an Empire cannot provide me in my "non ideal" large my room. Multiple Empires....mabye 4 max? I'm sure it'd be much closer to those goals. I think Chad said 4 makes you feel whats going on below 10 Hz in room. But being in a state of wanting to know what else is out there, and what they sound like, I'm satisfied I got one to hear how the Empire sounded. AND it is a steal of a price that I got it for $918 shipped. Dense like a tank, clean edges and an overall nicer, more refined black appearance scores more points on the WAF...the build quality is at its peak right now. Is sealed sub sound for me? Individually, my Epik Tower outperforms it- losing some points only with music. Then again, I'm bass obsessed, so my wants can seem unrealistic to some. I hope Chad has atleast a ported beast in the works. Or mabye the return of the Dragon or Phoenix. Speaking of which, I was a bit worried at first about the orientation of the woofers in the Empire when first pictures were posted. Placement problems. I know now that I do prefer the driver firing into the direction of the LP, so no more dual opposed for me. Not sure if this also applies to downfiring subs as yet. After I've "settled" (thank goodness income is limited) and no more wondering how does that sound, I'm going to settle on multiples of the same. (I sure do wish I got another Tower or a Dyansty when it was in production). I have yet to try the Empire in a small sealed 12W*8H*14L sealed room I have, so I'll see how that goes. My pops is in need of a sub for music, and I'm tempted to send it off to him. But shipping outside of the US is going to be a bish :P .

lol, well you know what they say..."Life's a bish and then you buy another sub!" Or something like that.

I am so happy with my single Phoenix and would not get rid of it for anything at the moment. It is possibly the best ported WAF approved sub out there right now. It digs deep and plays LOUD when called upon. Finally, it sound perfect for music too.
Chad hit a grand slam with this model. YO CHAD, bring back this great subwoofer already!!!!!!!!!

I for one am pretty happy with my single Empire.I knew being a sealed unit it would deliver less slam bam boom, but instead provides solid clean bass for music and HT. Others have mentioned how much the room size will affect the bass response and I concur. I've got a listening room almost 8000 cu. ft. with another 2000 cu.ft. kitchen on the side. Plus a open doorway in back to bedrooms, but at least those have doors I can close,lol. Yes, it's alot easier when you are only trying to pressurize a room with 2000 cu. ft. At least there are other options like acoustic panels, antimode 8033, audyssey etc. I'll probably end up getting another Empire and that's fine with me.

I am so happy with my single Phoenix and would not get rid of it for anything at the moment. It is possibly the best ported WAF approved sub out there right now. It digs deep and plays LOUD when called upon. Finally, it sound perfect for music too.
Chad hit a grand slam with this model. YO CHAD, bring back this great subwoofer already!!!!!!!!!

I just changed my order from dual Empires to quads. They should be shipping out within the next couple of weeks. Epik is backlogged like crazy. Chad told me that he has sold more subs so far this year than he did all of last year!

Chad is a great guy to talk to. He had a lot of interesting things to say. It's amazing how well we was able to get "down" to my level to help me make sense of some things. He also confirmed some experiences/suspicions I have had.

He is simply a great guy.

I'll also be glad to finally be part of the Epik clan. I hate to post in subwoofer-specific forums when I don't actually own one of their subs.

Never argue with an idiot; they drag you down to their level and beat you with experience.

Basically I talked to Chad about all my experiences so far since I have been in the hobby (appx 3 years). I had some questions about integrating my Ultras with the Empires. I asked about the competition and how they stack up to his new Empires, etc.

He is a very nice guy. I could tell that he wanted to make the sell, but more importantly wanted to help me make an informed decision.

He had to talk about some things that he normally would rather not talk about (the competition) in order for me to make an informed decision.

As you can tell, I am really not the "kiss and tell" type of guy. He didn't ask me not to tell, but he did state that he refrains from posting some things because he doesn't want to cause a stir. I totally understand.

Not only that, I would misquote him if I tried to quote him.

The main thing I wanted to know was if I could integrate the Empires with my Ultras knowing that I wanted more mid-bass slam (since my Ultras are 3 to 4.5 dB down in the 35 to 70 Hz area). I wanted them to be nearfield so I could potentially attain some more tactical feel (since my basement has a cement floor, although it is heavily carpeted). He assured me that the Empires should fit the bill.

I also asked why my quads in my large open basement only yields me "x" amount of SPL when other folks are able to attain "y" SPL in a "z" sized room. He gave me multiple examples of how the room itself is the culprit.

I don't know, he just a really nice guy. If you are interested the Empire, give him a call. If you want him to talk crap on his competitors on the forums... its not going to happen.

One thing he did mention, which we all already knew, he owns almost every single competitor's subs. He knows he has a superior product at the price point. "x" competitor's sub may be stronger in some area, but dual Empires essentially bests them for less $. There are some caveats and I am sure I misquoted parts of this.

Never argue with an idiot; they drag you down to their level and beat you with experience.

I just changed my order from dual Empires to quads. They should be shipping out within the next couple of weeks. Epik is backlogged like crazy. Chad told me that he has sold more subs so far this year than he did all of last year!

Chad is a great guy to talk to. He had a lot of interesting things to say. It's amazing how well we was able to get "down" to my level to help me make sense of some things. He also confirmed some experiences/suspicions I have had.

He is simply a great guy.

I'll also be glad to finally be part of the Epik clan. I hate to post in subwoofer-specific forums when I don't actually own one of their subs.

Wait a second...so you're going to be running four PB13-Ultras AND four Epik Empires? That room will be insane!! You should have a ridiculous amount of mid-bass. Any idea how you'll position the Empires? All four nearfield behind the LP would be crazy (though possibly not the best solution...)

BTW, I agree 100% with your comments about Chad. I talked to him for about half an hour before I decided to purchase my Castle. He's just a down-to-earth guy. He obviously believes in his products and is confident they are superior to the competition in the price/performance category, but he doesn't put down other products, either. I felt like I was getting his genuine thoughts when he compared his products to the competition - not a "sales pitch".

Welcome in advance to the Epik club. Your system should be killer with quad Ultras and quad Empires. I'd highly doubt you'll be left wanting for more bass after this . Did Chad give you any idea when your subs would ship? Keep us posted.

Wait a second...so you're going to be running four PB13-Ultras AND four Epik Empires? That room will be insane!! You should have a ridiculous amount of mid-bass. Any idea how you'll position the Empires? All four nearfield behind the LP would be crazy (though possibly not the best solution...)

I am going to use REW to figure out the best placement for the Empires. I am thinking all four lined up behind my couch or against the back wall. Whichever yields the best frequency response.

Quote:

BTW, I agree 100% with your comments about Chad. I talked to him for about half an hour before I decided to purchase my Castle. He's just a down-to-earth guy. He obviously believes in his products and is confident they are superior to the competition in the price/performance category, but he doesn't put down other products, either. I felt like I was getting his genuine thoughts when he compared his products to the competition - not a "sales pitch".

Agreed.

Quote:

Welcome in advance to the Epik club. Your system should be killer with quad Ultras and quad Empires. I'd highly doubt you'll be left wanting for more bass after this . Did Chad give you any idea when your subs would ship? Keep us posted.

I am a bass addict. That's for sure. My Empires will ship on May 28th, give or take a few days. He mentioned something about just sending out 50 or so Empires.

Never argue with an idiot; they drag you down to their level and beat you with experience.

Chad did mention to me today that he was thinking about updating his blog soon as to give everyone an update. I didn't necessarily get the impression that he was going to do it today though. I hope does...

Never argue with an idiot; they drag you down to their level and beat you with experience.