Tuesday night live

I'm here reporting live from the League of Women Voters forum on charter review. There's about 40 others here with me. It's mostly an older crowd except for the Laborers union folks sitting behind. When one of the organizers said she wanted a polite debate, Richard Beetle from the union said: "I want to see a fistfight."

And they're off with their debate. Bob Ball launched into his stump speech: change = more efficiency. Chris Smith is up now. His point: Portland is cool and accessible because of the form of government.

Next up: Randy Leonard v. Mark Rosenbaum over PDC.

More to come ...

-- Ryan

UPDATE 1: Reading back on Anna's post from the Merc/Bus Project forum, how did I miss that forum. There's no Miller High Life or Maker's Mark here.

UPDATE 2: Chris Smith's core message so far on this election: It's all about power. He's mentioned their web site www.toomuchpower.org. The measure, he said, isn't about saving money. "This measure is really about the balance of power in the city" Later: "But costs are not the issue here. The issue is who has power in City Hall."

UPDATE 3: And the hits keep on coming. Smith just threw out George Bush's name. Went something like this: Should George Bush be president, speaker of the house and chief justice of the supreme court? That's what the Portland mayor would get in this new system. He closed with this: He may be comfortable with Bud Clark having that power but not Frank Ivancie.

Chris, you may not be a George Bush fan but your ability to stay on message is nearly as good as the Bush White House.

UPDATE 4: In case you're a real lover of wonk, this debate is playing on Channel 30.

UPDATE 5: Mark Rosenbaum is no doubt a smart, successful guy. But a relaxed debater he is not. Like at the City Club debate with Sten a few weeks ago, Rosenbaum seems stiff and a bit intense up there.

One question put to Rosenbaum asked if regular audits would have exposed past financial missteps. Rosenbaum points out that PDC has high marks from outside finance auditors. That may be true. But let's not forget that an auditor also found some serious problems with the PDC's contracting oversight in 2005.

UPDATE 6: Randy and Mark finished up. On a break, I talked for a minute with a couple of voters. Ester McGinnis said she's been opposed to the change before tonight. After hearing the Ball-Smith debate, McGinnis said she's waffling. She's concerned about conflicts between bureaus. She mentioned a dispute between PDOT and the fire bureau over parking spots near fire station 18. "How can we resolve Iraq if we can't resolve an issue like that," she said. "If I could be convinced that the change would really make bureaus communicate ..., I would vote for it."

UPDATE 7: We're now on to the civil service portion of our show. For some reason, the crowd here thinned out a bit. But not much. It's now David Kelleher from the charter review commission v. Rob Wheaton from Laborers 483. If I understand this right, the arguments break down basically like this: The charter limits seasonal workers to 860 hours a year. Laborers 483 wants to keep the limit in the charter. They feel the charter wording helps keep down the number of lower wage and low benefits jobs. Kelleher says the hour limit shouldn't be in the charter. He says it should be negotiated at the bargaining table.

UPDATE 8: OK, more fun. Kelleher v. Amanda Fritz on the regular charter review measure. I could use that Maker's Mark about now. Kelleher called this "by far the biggest no brainer" of the measures. Even Kelleher couldn't manage to use up all his time in this debate. He stopped early, saying: "That's all I've got."

UPDATE 9: Just about done here and ready for the cage match Rich Rodgers promised at last week's forum. Rich, meet me at the Slow Bar?

But one final note. Amanda Fritz just closed with this line that may summarize how some voters who haven't been to 22 forums to learn the details view the measures: "When I don't understand constitutional changes I vote no because that means it leaves things the way they are."