I don't wish to discredit any victims, but a few of these stories seem hard to believe.

But I wonder why Mooji has not spoken about any of these allegations. Every thing seems to have gone into lockdown. And now the Wikipedia page has been deleted even. If these rumours have no basis in any fact then why not say so?

"Rumors thrive on the lack of news. The almost total absence of fear-inspired rumors in Britain during the darkest days of the blitz was due to the people's conviction that the government was giving full and accurate news of the destruction and that they, therefore, knew the worst. When people are sure they know the worst, they are unlikely to darken the picture further by inventing unnecessary bogies to explain their anxieties to themselves."Helio Fred Garcia

Could it be that, rather than seeking resolution and openness, gurus like to use a threat of impending group implosion (the end of the world scenario) as fuel to solidify their hold on people?

I think you are absolutely right with that quote, and I think this is what has happened with rumors about Mooji. I remember years ago chatter about him always being surrounded by beautiful women, which then moved to chatter that he must be sleeping with at least one, which escalated to a kind of ‘gossip consensus’ that this is true. Now, in the absence of confirmation or denial, the more recent phase seems to have been rather twisted ideas that young women are being selected and ‘groomed’ by his team to sleep with him. From what I have found, this latter phase seems to be based on / ‘confirmed’ by two sources.

I hate to go down the path of discrediting alleged victims, because it is important for victims to have a voice, but if these supposed victims falsely accuse someone of something as serious as sexual misconduct or rape, shouldn’t we look at the report with some scrutiny rather than blindly believing it and repeating it as true?

The first source that I found is a woman who posted in a YouTube video a series of comments claiming to have seen first hand such vile things, and the second is the comment from xivoparig in this forum.

The woman from YouTube (all of whose comments have now been deleted) seemed to my eyes to be more of a troll than a true account. Why? She first said he was sleeping with many young women and knows this as a fact, then changed her story to him only sleeping with one woman, she also reduced one woman’s age from around 26 to 16 to suit her story of ‘ritualistic deflowering’, and finally she advertised another site ‘that makes fun of gurus’, which then reposted a selection of her comments as an ‘expose’ in a blog.

In the account from xivoparig there are very serious allegations, and of course if it were true Mooji should be brought to justice. However, it cannot be true simply because the facts of when, where and how do not add up. This person is not even aware of where Mooji is at any given time, let alone how he and his followers operate. I won’t go into details because if people want to create such fiction, it’s better they don’t know what they got wrong the first time!

I have also seen one person presenting as ‘fact’ in Mooji YouTube comments that Mooji is sexually promiscuous, and when asked for proof he refers to the xivoparig post on this forum and a video where Mooji holds hands with 2 or 3 women at different times.What kind of proof is that?!Perhaps Mooji and his followers are not denying these allegations because they are not concerned about some ‘big story’ coming out, because there is no story.

Why am I getting myself involved in all this? Because I like Mooji and his find his teachings very beneficial. I saw these things, became concerned and then dug into it a bit to see what kind of substance I could find behind these rumors. So far I found nothing.

I actually saw the Mooji Wikipedia page while it was being flagged for deletion. It was deleted by Wikipedia because no-one could come forward and name 3 reliable sources that would confirm that Mooji is a "notable person".

Someone had put in a complaint to Wikipedia that Mooji was only a sort of dogdy business-man and not a legitimate spiritual teacher. This led to further questioning... Anyway, no-one came forward to authenticate Mooji to the standards held by Wikipedia.

As for the allegations of sexual misconduct against Mooji, I view them in light of all the other allegations out there about psychological abuse, narcissism, aggressive yelling at devotees and 'gaslighting' among his inner circle. So far only two people have come forward with sexual allegations, but I think all the psychological abuse allegations are just as serious. These are on Reddit and on Gururating.org. There are plenty of them.

Now several people are claiming that the guru rating.org site is blocked in the UK and Europe, so I don't think Mooji's group have done nothing at all about all these allegations: I think they are going crazy trying to control the allegations getting out.

There is also the fact that if you say anything of concern on the Mooji Sangha Facebook group, that your post is deleted or else the post comments are turned off. So someone is watching this closely.

Look at YouTube and see all the Moojiji channel videos where comments are "disabled". It's not one or two videos... It's like 70 to 80 per cent of the videos! Why? Are there that many complaints against this guy? So many! This is very heavy censorship.... Something is up.

The woman who first came forward with sexual allegations has posted elsewhere on YouTube too, saying that she is very lost and unhappy, that she is home from Monte Sahaja now, but still confused and scared. Her friends are rejecting her because she has changed. I personally don't think that she is a troll. I think she is traumatised. I have worked with people who have undergone trauma. It is so sad.

Sahara71 Wrote:-------------------------------------------------------> As for the allegations of sexual misconduct> against Mooji, I view them in light of all the> other allegations out there about psychological> abuse, narcissism, aggressive yelling at devotees> and 'gaslighting' among his inner circle. So far> only two people have come forward with sexual> allegations, but I think all the psychological> abuse allegations are just as serious. These are> on Reddit and on Gururating.org. There are plenty> of them.

I haven't come across any psychological abuse or aggressive yelling from Mooji, so can't really comment on that, but am quite interested to find out more about gaslighting. I have read up on it and can see how some self-inquiry / advaita teachings could get seen as gaslighting. Like if someone has an agitation or irritation feeling in satsang, and then someone else might say, "It's nothing. It's just resistance from your ego." I'd love to have a robust discussion with someone on this subject who knows about gaslighting. I myself have had such agitation and have seen its just something that passes (like everything else), but I can also totally see how this feeling being seemingly invalidated as nothing could be seen as gaslighting. Not sure this forum is the place to discuss this though ;-)

> Now several people are claiming that the guru> rating.org site is blocked in the UK and Europe,> so I don't think Mooji's group have done nothing> at all about all these allegations: I think they> are going crazy trying to control the allegations> getting out.

I don't think this because of Mooji's group. I can't post on any of the teachers, and friends form the US also not. Maybe there is something wrong with the site?

Wombat wrote:I myself have had such agitation and have seen its just something that passes (like everything else), but I can also totally see how this feeling being seemingly invalidated as nothing could be seen as gaslighting. Not sure this forum is the place to discuss this though ;-)

No need for the ;-) wink emoticon, Wombat.

The CEI forum discussion IS the right place and remains the right place -- to discuss concerns about Moo, especiallyas Sahara71 has listed how so many discussions about the Moo situation are beingblocked or disabled.

Only thing we are accountable to are the rules of use for this message boardwhich we all agreed to when registering here.

This forum is specifically the place to discuss "gaslighting" and other forms of manipulation and abuse in authoritarian often personality-driven groups.

That's why people post here.

Often when people post complaints here a supporter of some group, guru or leader will come in and try to dismiss complaints through their posts and/or denigrate people who post complaints and/or ask critical questions.

That type of posting is absolutely NOT allowed here and people who do that will be banned from this message board.

The Cult Education Institute contains a wealth of information about thought reform, coercive persuasion and detailed research about how destructive cults operate.

Hi Wombat,I'm glad you asked about gaslighting, as it relates to the Mooji group. They use their "Neo-Advaita" or "non-dualism" philosophy to negate any kind of questioning or debate that doesn't suit them.

If you are a genuine spiritual seeker, as indeed I was, this has the effect of making you feel like you might not belong, or you don't believe strongly enough in the "truth", or that you are not evolved enough to understand their answers. It makes you doubt yourself.

Over and over again, Mooji says in his videos "of course some resistance to the truth of who you are will come up". So if you are questioning what he is saying, then you feel validated hearing that statement - you think "that's great, because I am actually questioning some of this stuff".

And then Mooji hits you with "That is just your mind". He says it all the time. It's like a broken record!

The end result is that you begin to see your own mind as the enemy. It's like a subtle form of thought control... You begin not to trust your own mind. If you would like to explore this further, just join the Mooji Sangha Facebook group and ask a lot of questions. You will soon see that you will always get the same answer to every question: always it is a variation along the same theme, "That is just your mind". Every single time.

Try it.

Sadly, this is a very lame perversion of classical Advaita teaching. Traditional Advaita teachings never, ever suggest that you should give up reasoning skills and critical thinking! I do not know of any legitimate religion or spiritual doctrine that suggests you give away critical thinking! The Mooji group take a classical piece of esoteric Hindu philosophy and manipulate it and mis-use it to suit their own needs. Mooji is the master Manipulator. He is dangerous.

For the purposes of brain-washing, as employed by cults, it's very important that you give up critical thinking, become empty of thought, and become compliant. That way they can fill your head with whatever they like. Mooji supporters are very compliant. They are completely empty-headed.

Mooji even says that he does not do a lot of reading himself and does not study the scriptures. This was a big red flag for me. He doesn't want people to read about Advaita, because he doesn't teach it correctly and he doesn't want any questions!!!

This cult can also get you to donate money and work for free on their ashram, building Mooji's house for his comfortable retirement.

I was going through a tough time and I ended up watching Mooji videos, at home alone for several weeks. People like me are the ones in danger of being pulled into this stuff, because it is like a form of escapism. You will see that it is, unfortunately the vulnerable people in society that get attracted to this stuff.

Luckily, I saw something in a Moo video that bothered me and I did further investigations. Now I want to speak out to warn others. Please be very wary of the Mooji group. They are not legitimate.

Too often, all too often, when an ashram or worship complex iscompleted, the guru grows distant.

The early warmth and camaraderie between guru and devotees fades. Gurubecomes distant.

Buildings create and maintain pecking orders.

Will big donors be given equal treatment with those who donated less?

Will long time supporters have access to Mooji as they had inthe good old days before the ashram was built?

Or will the completed ashram result in the guru becoming remote,will your support be forgotten, and will you be forced to wait, whilenew supporters or the rich supporters be given preferential treatment?

Another question: Will neighbors be respected? Will the ashram communitybe an asset to the area?

Or will noise, traffic and disruption take place around the ashramin ways that mirror the changes in Tiru, now that so manyhave shoved in and turned it into (so they say) a spiritual bazaar?