Regulative Principle Of Worship – There are no Biblical examples of Jesus participating in sports. Therefore both PCC and BJU (*snort “BJ You”), are both guilty of idolatry and damnable heresy. Let it be known amongst all men. And now with every head bowed and every eye closed, let me see a show of hands.

That would be my guess. “Trying” being the operative word here. Of course – and I mean this in the kindest possible way – watching PCC and BJU play basketball is kind of like watching a couple of downs-syndrome babies playing hide and seek. Cute and funny in its own sort of way, but in the end everyone really loses.

Back in the ’80s I heard many a chapel sermon from Jr. and Triplestyx on the ills of intercollegiate sports: When we begin that sort of stuff, we will end up having drunks on campus, playing their rock and roll music. We don’t need to water down our separation for the applause of men. Intramural sports is the Godly way.

…I do not exaggerate. So sad when even our competition for fun and school spirit gets placed under the microscope of “God’s favorite.” Sounds like a little reaping of what was sown by previous leaders of BJU.

The insurance bit might have been legit. When I was a youth director, our liability insurance policy specifically stated it would not cover injuries from football. It also mentioned water slides, which I found out in the middle of a youth activity in which we had an epic 200-foot water slide behind our fellowship building. Fortunately, no hospital visits on that date. (My wife did suffer a concussion on a water slide during an youth activity off-site, so perhaps there’s some valid reasoning behind the exclusion.)

I remember a news report from years ago of slip-n-slides being particularly hazardous for adults, resulting in sometimes paralyzing neck injuries. Never-the-less, my daughter had a giant one at her wedding reception.

It seems clear that BJUIII’s prophetic ranting about the other fundy schools who were supporting intercollegiate sports and regional accreditation being perched perilously upon a slipperly slope above new-evangelical compromise were simply the angry words of a loser.

The schools that ignored him and went about the business of building quality educational programs and proving their academic chops with qualified instructors and transparent reporting while participating competitively in organizations like the NCAA and NCCAA are solid and maybe even growing (in a shrinking demographic) while BJU is slashing and burning to keep the lights on.

Hindsight may be 20/20, but sometimes it is only useful to watch your clown car drive off a cliff.

Pastor Monte is a 1989 graduate of Bob Jones University (Summa Cum Laude), holding a Bachelor of Arts degree in Bible. He graduated from Pensacola Theological Seminary in 2007 with a Master of Ministries degree. In addition, he was awarded an honorary doctorate in 2005 for work related to exposing the dangers of radical Islam in America.

Wow. I guess we marched together at graduation. I’m so embarrassed. But then, He’s a DOCTOR now. I’m still a mechanic with just an Associates Degree. And a lot of self-study on my own, which involves researching both sides of topics to try to determine truth instead of listening to only the local Baptist Pope for my beliefs.

I went to HS with him. He (and his twin brother–YES, there are 2) are a couple years older than me, so we didn’t march together. But…yeah. Forth Baptist Christian School, Minneapolis, MN. Part of Fourth Baptist Church, one of the biggest IFB bastions in the Twin Cities…and my parents’ church. :Sigh:

Connie, I’m a mid-90’s graduate of Fourth Baptist. They were still extremely fundy then, but they’ve lost a lot of their fundy credentials since then. Central Seminary no longer has the support of many of the area IFB churches due to not having a KJB-only stance, and the school’s dress code has loosened considerably. I even know several members of the church don’t believe that alcohol is forbidden.

IFB they may still be, but they’re hardly still one of the biggest bastions of it in the Twin Cities. 🙂

Hmm, I’m an extremely retentive person who bought his own DD just to prove their worthlessness. But I never thought about tweeting my dissertation. Anyone have any suggestions? Since I am no longer fundy, I am actually open to ideas.

“Dr”MarcMonte-
To which of the series of “Received Texts” are you referring? Erasmus’ original or subsequent? Or the edition printed about fifty years after the King James Translation was first published, at which time the phrase “Textus Receptus” was first used? Have you actually studied this issue, or just read Riplinger’s fictional account?

( I would tweet this as a response, but it’s too long for a tweet, and I have trouble with 140 character theological discussion)

Amen! I sat through a series of classes in my old IFB dedicated to teaching me KJVO. I was hooked on the premise for a while, then I downloaded this awesome KJV bible on my computer that contained the deuterocanonical books. I was shocked, but then I laughed and shook my head. The same man who taught KJV only was the same man who taught that the Catholic Church was, let me just say, “bad.” A little bit of a conflict of interest there, teacher… End of controversy for me.

I don’t know for sure, but I believe BJU teaches greek out of Wescott Hort and they certain accept about any version of the Bible you want to use (probably would cause some commotion if you brought the Message, or the New World Translation). When I was at PCC it was more or less declared that Wescott & Hort was an abomination and all translations proceeding from it were damnable heresies. It was a rather shocking chapel sermon in the mid to late 90s from Dell Johnson, as before that I was under the impression that PCC was pro-Wescott & Hort, or at least accepting of it as equal.

First of all, there is no “Westcott Hort” text. There is the Nestle Aland and the UBS. NA is on its 26th or so, UBS is on its 4th I think (editions, I mean). Both owe their heritage to Westcott and Hort’s work. The PCC position is fiction, as in whole cloth fabrication, as in they invent their own “facts”. And then argue them at a kindergarten level. And then put them in videos. And then force the students to watch them at gun point. Ok, I made up the gunpoint thing. BJU, while encouraging the use of the KJV from the pulpit, understands how the Greek language actually works, and the history of our manuscripts, and so – like every other seminary in the world that isn’t fundy – uses a modern text.

My bad on Wescott Hort. I’ve been so indoctrinated with that name, it’s a habit. Thanks for the info. Very true on PCC’s inventing a position. I suspect it was more of a marketing/branding decision, and they used whatever logic the Horton’s approved. I was very hurt by Dell Johnson going that direction. I think he’s a great person and a lot of fun, but I had a lot more faith in his intellectual honesty before that chapel sermon.

“Spiritual Gunpoint” – I like that – very descriptive. I ‘ve always referred to the concept of forced fundy indoctrination and brain washing as “Spritual Blackmail”, but I think both descriptions can be used as one and the same

What depths of stupidity! As if God actually demonstrates the superiority of a position that way!

Okay, I admit it. It is kinda-sorta-wishy-washy “Biblical.” David beats Goliath, so God wins. Elijah beats the Baal priests, so God wins. And Pharaoh enslaves the Hebrews so God loses. God then demands a rematch.

Of course, the guy could be joking. Somehow I doubt it. It reminds me of Pat Robertson in all seriousness attributing Hurricane Sandy to God’s judgment on gays. All the straight victims were just collateral damage.

And the KJV-only argument is so infantile (mentally, spiritually, and so on!). Yet PCC has decided that all the truth of God rests on this one issue.

Funny that. Jesus said that all the Law and the Prophets rested on “Love the Lord your God with all your heart, soul and strength” and “Love your neighbor as yourself.” Micah said that God’s requirements are to do justly, to love mercy, and to walk humbly with your God. PCC says “only accept the KJV.”

Fundamentalism is the spiritual equivalent of bovine spongiform encephalitis.

rtg – I thought Hurricane Katrina was God’s judgment on TEH GAYZ. Although I am sure there are some whack jobs who thought Hurricane Sandy was judgment for some perceived slight. After all, the Joplin, MO. tornado was God’s judgment on America for not 100% embracing Israeli actions in the Middle East. Or so said my old pastor.

How it was discussed in the close PBs was that God has his plans for this world and as Christians we are not to mess with them. We are to be in the world, not of the world. Voting is trying to make the world a better place and the world is destined for fire and we should concentrate on the lost not the political systems of the world. Also the unequally yoked verse was quoted, voting seemed to them to be attaching oneself to a political party. The systems of the world are all anathema to the PBs. A lot of them will not have insurance or even call the police.

MiriamD, I am quite ignorant of the PBs but what you say about the voting seems similar to Bob Jones 3rd on Larry King trying to explain their interracial policy: inter-marriage will speed up the end times because intermingling of the races is somehow tied into revelation. We stand against the end times world government, therefore, cannot agree with interracial dating.

I wanted King to ask, “How can you say your dating policy has anything to do with the government in Revelations, and why do you stand against something that you believe is already written and prophesied by God? If God says it’s going to happen, why would you attempt to thwart His decree?”

The person who I heard preach the voting theory, was I suspect, messing with our heads. I am not joking either. I think a lot of fundy preachers are control freaks and this particular one has psychopathic tendencies. It adds to their control to keep their followers off balance. He didn’t come out with that crap for several years after he had people thinking he was wonderful and things got crazier and crazier till he crashed and burned. He ended up in jail as a paedophile.

Wow. I am seeing the fundy preacher/tyrant thing so often, it is no longer surprising anymore. I know of one locally here who had his parishioners build a huge playground for the kids to play on during choir practice and between services. It really is an impressive playground. Then, he decided that Sunday isn’t a day for kids to play, so they needed to stay off the playground on Sunday. Then he decided that it was disruptive to let the kids play on the playground before midweek service, so he banned them from it. So no one’s kids were ever allowed on the playground. Did I mention his parsonage is next door and he is a quiver full type who homeschools, so his kids can use the playground any other time of the week that they want to.

Well, my fundy friends claimed Katrina was God’s judgment on the hookers. And Mardis Gras. Because all those other folks who died should have moved away from those slutty mcslutters if they didn’t want to face God’s wrath.

Those slutty mcslutters happen to be what makes New Orleans so darned fun. I’ve never understood why fundies have a cow over something as essentially harmless as a drunken parade with a few exposed breasts but go out of their way to excuse or cover up things like child rape. Really odd ethics there.

What about justice? Looking after the widows? Freeing rhe opressed.Feeding the hungry (ie keeping them alive long enough to hear the Good News)?
I have a feeling that reason and ligic , go against Scripture….

Honestly Paul. love in the Peebs is not what the rest of the world, or I suspect Jesus, would recognize as love. It is more punishment and scowling at you until you capitulate and agree that the Brethren know what is best and you agree to put a smile on and do what you are expected. They look after their own, as long as their own are doing “right” but deviate and you are on your own. People won’t talk to you, no more invites, no more fellowship.

Taught at a Christian school in which the head coach blamed the dismal season on “sin in the camp”. Had nothing to do with the fact that opposing teams had players who, on average, outweighed our guys by at least 50 pounds at each position. (I, for one, think his clock management and offensive scheme may have been an issue.) He pulled the guys out of class (can’t use practice time for this) to yell at them one day for about an hour, encouraging the sinners to repent. Guess they never did, based on the results.

Benefit of the doubt and all, I’m gonna assume the tweet’s a joke, all in good fun. I’m about the last person to give these Fundy U’s any credit, but I seriously doubt they’re deciding theological spats with ballgames these days.

Though the whole “God really wanted us to win out there” or “we were losing cause there was sin in the camp” (seriously?!?) is sort of walking right into the definition of taking the name of the Lord in vain. Not to mention crediting God for natural disasters, etc., but that’s all in a day’s work for today’s fundies.