a reply to: JimTSpock
Well we were aware of PRISM on ATS and speculation about it's existence took place years before Snowden blew the whistle for example. UFO tech and
the theory of what makes them tick is based on decades upon decades of eye witness reports , some guys like Lazarr , grass roots scientists
experimenting with anti grav ect. Like PRISM , UFO's have made themselves known while operating in a covert fashion.

If Roswell was just a huge misunderstanding and a simple goof of the Army with the press it would have not become such a huge story . The fact the air
force changed it's story several times and it was covered up for 60 years plus says alot. Not even counting the tons of witnesses that seen a crashed
disc bodies and such. It realy is the meat and potatoes of where our huge leaps in tech originated according to Corso.

As for ET helping humans back engineer UFO's does not fly with me. All ET would need to do is give our scientists schematics and potential materials
and or isotopes to build. But I dont think that is the case. If ET is there in tandem with humans it is for something else. ET imo has no knowledge
to gain from us. They seem only interested in genetics. If you research the topic that is. Im weary to call them ET at all. They could be many other
things..

What if future humans traveling back in time looked different , so different after a evolutionary turn and were assumed to be aliens. And they needed
to isolate themselves and be covert so that they do not alert enough people altering thier existence. So the ET story was pushed.

Antarctica is no longer such an unreachable place. Tourists and adventures travel there from time to time. I wouldn't say Antarctica is any better
place to hide technology than an underground military base where at least you know the territory is restricted. The transcript reminds of so many
other stories - in fact it reminds me of the Dulce papers. There really needs to be a really big proof for these claims because what is seen or said -
the criteria for reality that Dulce base suggested isn't enough anymore. You know, the boy that cried 'wolf' many times and in the end it really
came but no one believed him.

originally posted by: frugal
I read about this story on Linda Howe's web site first. I nearly fell off my chair! Exciting information. Now who is going to whip it up into a great
movie script idea? Filling in the details of the unknown with creative information. Must have fabulous special effects and detailed plot of why they
are here and what they are doing.... What are the scientists doing, and why are they even involved with the ET? If Jupiter's moon has a massive
quantity of water on it the ET are not here for the water. They must be visiting or inhabiting for our environment with air, and the Earth's life
forms....

This is proof that there were in fact bodies and a craft at the crash site..Check it out!

Barely noticeable in one of the 1947 photos and clutched in Gen. Ramey's left hand is a slip of paper (boxed in red). Probably unwittingly, Gen. Ramey
had the text side facing towards the camera, allowing the text on this paper to be photographed.

When blown up and analyzed, it tells a remarkably different story of events from the one Ramey or contemporary Air Force counter-intelligence wants
you to believe.

The message turns out to be a telegram from Gen. Ramey to the Pentagon and Gen. Hoyt Vandenberg, the acting AAF Chief of Staff at the time. Ramey is
providing Vandenberg an update on the very fluid situation in-the-field at Roswell.
The first paragraph describes what had been found. Ramey starts by acknowledging "THAT A 'DISK' IS NEXT NEW FIND." He then adds that "THE VICTIMS OF
THE WRECK" and something else (possibly just "A WRECK") had also been found near the recovery "OPERATION AT THE 'RANCH'." At the end it states that
"YOU" (i.e. Gen. Vandenberg) had ordered the "victims" and/or the wreckage "FORWARDED" to "FORT WORTH, TEX."

originally posted by: JadeStar
What I see is a new "alien base" story coming along at a time when most people have discounted Bob Lazar's "aliens at Area 51" and Mirage Men
exposed the lie that is "Dulce Base" which was intentionally fed to Paul Bennewitz to cover up classified, but terrestrial projects.

Not to mention both of those claims have been thoroughly investigate.

Conveniently, we now have an 'alien/human base' story in a part of the world that is anything but convenient to investigate.

And it comes from the same easily duped Linda Moulton Howe who still believes the CARAT fake drone photos/documents. She has her own belief system and
agenda, facts be damned.

She will believe -proven- hoaxes and publicize them as though they are real. That's shoddy journalism by all standards.

BTW: I showed my ex this thread and he laughed and said "if the aliens are down here then apparently they aren't very intelligent because why would
they need to hide? Nothing we have could really hurt them."

Which is sound logic.

So if you were aliens it would be logical to locate yourself in populated areas? I fail to see the logic in that..I think its logical if there are
aliens to locate themselves where there is almost no one to see them...Antarctica I think would be the perfect place for that..

Why hide at all is the point?

Let me put it this way: You are an alien species millions, perhaps billions of years more advanced than humanity.

Why hide? What would you have to fear? You can summon energies and technologies we can not even dream of. Humanity's most fearsome weapon is of
little consequence since you spend more energy in a month of travel among the stars than all of humanity's nuclear weapons put together.

Aliens hiding is great sci-fi but it doesn't wash in reality.

Exactly. Just a pitty I couldn't star that more than once. Supposedly you've got this advanced species that can travel unthinkable distances through
the universe, yet they hide in the snow, what they be doing? Chilling out. Just land in a public place and be done with it ffs.

originally posted by: JadeStar
What I see is a new "alien base" story coming along at a time when most people have discounted Bob Lazar's "aliens at Area 51" and Mirage Men
exposed the lie that is "Dulce Base" which was intentionally fed to Paul Bennewitz to cover up classified, but terrestrial projects.

Not to mention both of those claims have been thoroughly investigate.

Conveniently, we now have an 'alien/human base' story in a part of the world that is anything but convenient to investigate.

And it comes from the same easily duped Linda Moulton Howe who still believes the CARAT fake drone photos/documents. She has her own belief system and
agenda, facts be damned.

She will believe -proven- hoaxes and publicize them as though they are real. That's shoddy journalism by all standards.

BTW: I showed my ex this thread and he laughed and said "if the aliens are down here then apparently they aren't very intelligent because why would
they need to hide? Nothing we have could really hurt them."

Which is sound logic.

So if you were aliens it would be logical to locate yourself in populated areas? I fail to see the logic in that..I think its logical if there are
aliens to locate themselves where there is almost no one to see them...Antarctica I think would be the perfect place for that..

Why hide at all is the point?

Let me put it this way: You are an alien species millions, perhaps billions of years more advanced than humanity.

Why hide? What would you have to fear? You can summon energies and technologies we can not even dream of. Humanity's most fearsome weapon is of
little consequence since you spend more energy in a month of travel among the stars than all of humanity's nuclear weapons put together.

Aliens hiding is great sci-fi but it doesn't wash in reality.

Exactly. Just a pitty I couldn't star that more than once. Supposedly you've got this advanced species that can travel unthinkable distances through
the universe, yet they hide in the snow, what they be doing? Chilling out. Just land in a public place and be done with it ffs.

Yeah because announcing themselves to the public would be a great idea.. Most people are not ready for the truth and society will collapse that's
why..

originally posted by: Aquariusdude
Yeah because announcing themselves to the public would be a great idea.. Most people are not ready for the truth an society will collapsed s that's
why..

I think this is failed logic...

The reason it is failed logic is because they could have been totally integrated with humans, totally out in the open quite easily in the last 10,000
years or more, but now it is a popular argument that society is not ready because of maybe the frailness of our society in the last 100 years or less.

So lets debunk this once and for all. Lets say advance aliens become public tomorrow... They offer the cure for everything, they offer food for all.,
they offer a new start that would end all wars, end all ideals of race supremacy and we enter into a new age of total enlightenment. Ok, it disrupts
our way of life for what a few years at best, but everything gets better and better...can you see how silly and illogical the concept of "society will
collapsed" ideal really is?

Ok, lets say our secret Government wants to keep control, and that is why aliens are still secret... Really? Do you think a super advance alien race
really cares about our primitive Government setup to really feel the need to protect it?

The reason why we have a secret Government that keeps aliens a secret is because there are no aliens and this is the only story that can explain why
they are still hidden all these centuries/millenniums.

There's something that caught my attention when I was listening to the interview. For the most part is does not really sound like natural speech, as
if it's being read off of paper. It felt very scripted and forced. It's especially apparent when you listen and read the interview at the same time.
Normally a person's speech would not be so structured, there would be pauses, mistakes and whatnot. This one is absolutely sterile.

originally posted by: Aquariusdude
Yeah because announcing themselves to the public would be a great idea.. Most people are not ready for the truth an society will collapsed s that's
why..

I think this is failed logic...

The reason it is failed logic is because they could have been totally integrated with humans, totally out in the open quite easily in the last 10,000
years or more, but now it is a popular argument that society is not ready because of maybe the frailness of our society in the last 100 years or less.

So lets debunk this once and for all. Lets say advance aliens become public tomorrow... They offer the cure for everything, they offer food for all.,
they offer a new start that would end all wars, end all ideals of race supremacy and we enter into a new age of total enlightenment. Ok, it disrupts
our way of life for what a few years at best, but everything gets better and better...can you see how silly and illogical the concept of "society will
collapsed" ideal really is?

Ok, lets say our secret Government wants to keep control, and that is why aliens are still secret... Really? Do you think a super advance alien race
really cares about our primitive Government setup to really feel the need to protect it?

The reason why we have a secret Government that keeps aliens a secret is because there are no aliens and this is the only story that can explain why
they are still hidden all these centuries/millenniums.

Think about it....

I don't think its a failed logic.. Interfering with humanity's development would not help us but hurt us. Its like the prime directive in Star Trek.If
aliens announced themselves today there would be mass panic..Religion will most likely fall apart as well as economies.

We are not ready. There is a case where ufos showed up in Washington d.c on 1952 and has numerous photographs,radar contacts, witnesses and even a
shoot-down order .Then president Harry Truman even asked the AF what they were..Even with this case people still don't believe in the possibility
that alien life is currently visiting earth.(and there hundreds of other cases with solid evidence with credible witnesses)..But for a large segment
of the population they will never be able to accept the possibility that we are not alone and are currently being visited...

Also you are assuming that if alien's exist that they are benevolent...

I would love for you to tell me what those saucers in Washington D.C were...Temperature inversions? lol

The sightings of July 26–27 also made front-page headlines, and even led President Harry Truman to personally call Capt. Ruppelt to ask for an
explanation of the sightings. Ruppelt, remembering the conversation he had with Capt. James, told the President that the sightings might have been
caused by a temperature inversion, in which a layer of warm, moist air covers a layer of cool, dry air closer to the ground. This condition can cause
radar signals to bend and give false returns. However, Ruppelt had not yet interviewed any of the witnesses or conducted a formal
investigation.[17]

CIA historian Gerald Haines, in his 1997 history of the CIA's involvement with UFOs, also mentions Truman's concern. "A massive buildup of sightings
over the United States in 1952, especially in July, alarmed the Truman administration. On 19 and 20 July, radar scopes at Washington National Airport
and Andrews Air Force Base tracked mysterious blips. On 27 July, the blips reappeared."[18]

White House concern may possibly have resulted in an order to shoot down the UFOs, reported in various International News Service (INS) stories on
July 29, 1952. E.g., one such story reported that "jet pilots have been placed on a 24-hour nationwide 'alert against the flying saucers' with orders
to 'shoot them down' if they ignore orders to land." An Air Force public information officer, Lt. Col. Moncel Monte, confirmed the directive stating,
"The jet pilots are, and have been, under orders to investigate unidentified objects and to shoot them down if they can't talk them down."

originally posted by: Aquariusdude
I don't think its a failed logic.. Interfering with humanity's development would not help us but hurt us. Its like the prime directive in Star
Trek.If aliens announced themselves today there would be mass panic..Religion will most likely fall apart as well as economies.

Ah the old Prime Directive... Here is another reason why aliens do not exist and is a social creations... The term alien means just that alien to us,
but once again for some reason they are like us in physical attributes and thought. Aliens from another planet would be extremely different than us.
It would be like us using the prime directive on cows. These are all human thoughts, human creations and that is why they are like us.

Also you are assuming that if alien's exist that they are benevolent...

You know that evil alien race that rapes planets and eats everything... that's us...Even Hawking suggests that we would most likely not have a good
outcome if aliens find us.

The sightings..........

Why must these be aliens? Some how we decided they were and so they are...

Please tell me what those saucers were then in the most protected airspace in the world...

It is funny that you use the word "saucers" and not UFO. You are totally convinced that they were aliens. No one actually saw anything but lights
and a radar ping so how did we jump to saucers and aliens, as jumps go that is most likely the biggest one a person can use to come to a conclusion.

If we were to use deduction here the best thing is to do is ask why.

1. Why would aliens have bright lights on their aircraft at all?
2. Why would they have a formation over DC for 15 minutes then go and not do it ever again.?
3. Why do we not pick up strange radar pings daily if they are always around us since it seems even our older tech in the early 50s can see them.
4. I guess the military never does anything unannounced to to public/FAA, or other agencies never to this either.
5. Throw in other countries too that never do anything unannounced. Wouldn't it be funny if it was a group of Russian aircraft deep in the start of
the cold war in a show of force due to our vulnerabilities at that time...lol
4. In 1952 was the white House really heavily Guarded airspace... Was any airspace at that time guarded?
5. Why were they not angel? Both aliens and angels have about the same evidence of their existence.

Please tell me what those saucers were then in the most protected airspace in the world...

It is funny that you use the word "saucers" and not UFO. You are totally convinced that they were aliens. No one actually saw anything but lights
and a radar ping so how did we jump to saucers and aliens, as jumps go that is most likely the biggest one a person can use to come to a conclusion.

If we were to use deduction here the best thing is to do is ask why.

1. Why would aliens have bright lights on their aircraft at all?
2. Why would they have a formation over DC for 15 minutes then go and not do it ever again.?
3. Why do we not pick up strange radar pings daily if they are always around us since it seems even our older tech in the early 50s can see them.
4. I guess the military never does anything unannounced to to public/FAA, or other agencies never to this either.
5. Throw in other countries too that never do anything unannounced. Wouldn't it be funny if it was a group of Russian aircraft deep in the start of
the cold war in a show of force due to our vulnerabilities at that time...lol
4. In 1952 was the white House really heavily Guarded airspace... Was any airspace at that time guarded?
5. Why were they not angel? Both aliens and angels have about the same evidence of their existence.

I) I didn't just make up that they were saucers..That' was front page news...read the wiki on the incidence
2) They were only there for 15 minutes really and never came back??really then why were the sightings witnessed over a period of two days?
3 We actually do pick up sightings quite often read this..www.ufodigest.com...
4) so you are saying that the military was responsible for the sighting lol that's hilarious so the shootdown order was to shoot themselves? And the
president was not informed?
5)Russian craft? really? In the middle of the cold war? You think russia would violate the most protected airspace in the ENTIRE WORLD in order to
risk nuclear war? Wow

6) Angels last I checked don't give off radar pings.. LOL You lost me with the angel's part..take care

.............
We are not ready. There is a case where ufos showed up in Washington d.c on 1952 and has numerous photographs,radar contacts, witnesses and even a
shoot-down order .Then president Harry Truman even asked the AF what they were..Even with this case people still don't believe in the possibility
that alien life is currently visiting earth.

If you can find a genuine photograph of the UFOs over DC in 1952 I will be mightily impressed. If you can find the names of more than a handful of eye
witnesses then I will also be impressed. If you can find a quote directly from the lips of Harry Truman about "shooting down the UFOs" then please
cite your sources.

Because that case, whilst very intriguing, certainly does not make me jump straight to the conclusion that aliens were involved. In fact that case
could well be something very much to do with the properties of high power radar and secret military tests. You just have to do your research.

That's a really nice color photograph of 1952 DC... you do realize that is a bit problematic. Unless all those saucers posed for the picture and
stayed still while the exposure took place, it's likely a bs photograph.

4) so you are saying that the military was responsible for the sighting lol that's hilarious so the shootdown order was to shoot themselves? And the
president was not informed?
5)Russian craft? really? In the middle of the cold war? You think russia would violate the most protected airspace in the ENTIRE WORLD in order to
risk nuclear war? Wow

My point is we do not know.... so how do we instantly go to something that has zero proof of existence?

6) Angels last I checked don't give off radar pings.. LOL You lost me with the angel's part..take care

Really, do you know that for sure? Is this another fact of yours? Everyone knows angels do not ping radar...hmmmm prove it...

That's a really nice color photograph of 1952 DC... you do realize that is a bit problematic. Unless all those saucers posed for the picture and
stayed still while the exposure took place, it's likely a bs photograph.

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