Vertigo Cycles Fatbike

So I've been ruminating a fatbike for a while now, talked in earnest to several builders, but finally hired Sean of Vertigo Cycles to build one for me. I decided to go with him because he's an innovative, down to earth, good guy. It didn't hurt that he used to be local, knows how I ride and where I like to.

This bike isn't built primarily for the snow. It'll be a trail, rock, and tech bomber with short chainstays and laid back head angle, among other things. I plan to clobber, squash, crush, and plain ol' destroy anything that gets in my way, including squirrels.
...OK, not really What I do plan to do is have as much fun and keep rolling as much as possible over as many obstacles in as many conditions as I can.

I haven't completely decided on the parts, but I like to tinker. I'll probably start with a Salsa Enabler fork (which fits the A-C of the design), but I'm also in the queue for Lefty clamps. It'll be dressed as a singlespeed or a gearie when the mood strikes.

It's being made. Here are some pics from his flickr site. I'll update this thread with build pics and words as they come. Hope you don't mind.

How did I just see this now? I love Vertigo bikes, mostly because of DrjOn's bikes and following his flickr stream. This is interesting to me as I love the idea of the not for snow fat bike. So looking forward to updates and such.

Is Speedway the only ones making decent fat rims in SILVER? I need one offset drilled rim so that I can build a Lefty fat wheel. Already called Speedway and they don't have any offset drilled silver rims in stock.

The other option is to find a rim that already has the offset row of spoke holes and repaint it. So, has anyone stripped or repainted the Large Marge Lite? If so, how'd it turn out?

A few people have suggested that I could drill new spoke holes in a silver Speedway rim, and I'm considering it if I can't source what I'm looking for. Just seems a little scary to do to a brand new $150+ part

Is Speedway the only ones making decent fat rims in SILVER? I need one offset drilled rim so that I can build a Lefty fat wheel. Already called Speedway and they don't have any offset drilled silver rims in stock.

The other option is to find a rim that already has the offset row of spoke holes and repaint it. So, has anyone stripped or repainted the Large Marge Lite? If so, how'd it turn out?

A few people have suggested that I could drill new spoke holes in a silver Speedway rim, and I'm considering it if I can't source what I'm looking for. Just seems a little scary to do to a brand new $150+ part

Please lemme know if you have any other ideas or leads. Thanks!

According to Speedways neww site they list their rims as available in offset. I dont think it's correct but you might want to check it out.

If you find a eyelet-less rim with a welded joint, you can have them re-anodized... ask Surly to see whether the Marge Lite is bonded or welded.

P.S. How can you not have wheels ready yet?!

Originally Posted by Drevil

Is Speedway the only ones making decent fat rims in SILVER? I need one offset drilled rim so that I can build a Lefty fat wheel. Already called Speedway and they don't have any offset drilled silver rims in stock.

The other option is to find a rim that already has the offset row of spoke holes and repaint it. So, has anyone stripped or repainted the Large Marge Lite? If so, how'd it turn out?

A few people have suggested that I could drill new spoke holes in a silver Speedway rim, and I'm considering it if I can't source what I'm looking for. Just seems a little scary to do to a brand new $150+ part

Is Speedway the only ones making decent fat rims in SILVER? I need one offset drilled rim so that I can build a Lefty fat wheel. Already called Speedway and they don't have any offset drilled silver rims in stock.

The other option is to find a rim that already has the offset row of spoke holes and repaint it. So, has anyone stripped or repainted the Large Marge Lite? If so, how'd it turn out?

A few people have suggested that I could drill new spoke holes in a silver Speedway rim, and I'm considering it if I can't source what I'm looking for. Just seems a little scary to do to a brand new $150+ part

Please lemme know if you have any other ideas or leads. Thanks!

Just as a note, you don't need to build Lefty into offset drilling - this is crosslaced 3x:
The USChopper 100mm rim is available in silver (the one above was powdercoated)Rim Only 26 x 4 Silver - Cycles U.S. LLC/Choppers U.S.
You do have to get a P321 36h hub, since the rims are 36h only. 65, 80, and 100mm width.

If you find a eyelet-less rim with a welded joint, you can have them re-anodized... ask Surly to see whether the Marge Lite is bonded or welded.

P.S. How can you not have wheels ready yet?!

Ha! Look what the cat dragged in. You looking for a fatty now too?

I haven't built the wheels yet because I wasn't sure which direction I'd go with the fork (Enabler, White Bros, Lefty, etc.) Unfortunately, they're all incompatible with each other's hubs, so I held off building until I decided. I'll run the Lefty, but I'm also looking at rigid options.

Regarding re-anodizing, can you go from a darker color (black) to a lighter color?

Wadester- MendonCycleSmith and I had a phone discussion over Lefty wheel options, and your name came up. I've been looking at your old threads, and frankly, your wheel lacing looks intimidating. I've built maybe 50 wheels, but it has always been 3x with no fanciness whatsoever. Those rims look solid and...heavy. I'm looking to go as light as I can, and drilled-out single wall rims look to be the way to go.

this forum is killing me. Between building Ricky's bike (which is amazing fun) and looking through Mike C's thread I'm having a bit of an internal struggle right now as to whether or not I should slot myself into the next available build opening.

Big thanks to Ricky for giving me the opportunity and to Mike for setting the bar so high.

this forum is killing me. Between building Ricky's bike (which is amazing fun) and looking through Mike C's thread I'm having a bit of an internal struggle right now as to whether or not I should slot myself into the next available build opening.

Big thanks to Ricky for giving me the opportunity and to Mike for setting the bar so high.

What, no NAHBS? I'm sure you're busy and the show is costly, but this bike...

What, no NAHBS? I'm sure you're busy and the show is costly, but this bike...

No NAHBS this year. The cost of NAHBS is worth the exposure potential without a doubt, but it interfered with some family planning. I need this time to focus on preparing for rugrat #2 rather than fretting about a display, crating, t-shirts and all the associated hoopla.

this forum is killing me. Between building Ricky's bike (which is amazing fun) and looking through Mike C's thread I'm having a bit of an internal struggle right now as to whether or not I should slot myself into the next available build opening.

Big thanks to Ricky for giving me the opportunity and to Mike for setting the bar so high.

Is Speedway the only ones making decent fat rims in SILVER? I need one offset drilled rim so that I can build a Lefty fat wheel. Already called Speedway and they don't have any offset drilled silver rims in stock.

The other option is to find a rim that already has the offset row of spoke holes and repaint it. So, has anyone stripped or repainted the Large Marge Lite? If so, how'd it turn out?

A few people have suggested that I could drill new spoke holes in a silver Speedway rim, and I'm considering it if I can't source what I'm looking for. Just seems a little scary to do to a brand new $150+ part

Please lemme know if you have any other ideas or leads. Thanks!

Redrilling singlewall rims is a piece o' cake.

If I were you I'd find your preferred rim based on it's specs and build history (and I know this guy who knows a bit about these things...) and then have it stripped and polished.

So, not being terribly familiar with Vertigo, you'll forgive the question....

Ti, or stainless? The welds look steelish, hence the question.

Lookin' sweet, LOVE the build kit

Craig,

That's a photo of a fusion weld, where the two tubes are simply melted together with no filler. That's why it looks so tiny. If one were to try to get the full weld width in this manner, the mitered tube would tear open. The fusion ensures full weld penetration and is followed by another pass to add the filler and bring the joint up to strength.

That's a photo of a fusion weld, where the two tubes are simply melted together with no filler. That's why it looks so tiny. If one were to try to get the full weld width in this manner, the mitered tube would tear open. The fusion ensures full weld penetration and is followed by another pass to add the filler and bring the joint up to strength.

This is interesting;

Laying down a contiguous "bed" for the actual weld to nest/fuse into. Very interesting. I had never considered this, but it makes perfect sense! As he suggests, even with exceptional miters (which are mandatory for this), you are stealing material from both tubes to create this fusion, and necessarily thinning them at a critical juncture. You can do this with some materials and in certain applications and get away with a fusion weld alone (I do it on stainless intercooler/intake hard pipes), but not in this case. It also occurs to me that this fusion step makes it much easier to get visually stunning (and structurally solid) final welds when it is time to add the filler.

Thanks for letting that little trick slip out!

Most people ply the Well Trodden Path. A few seek a different way, and leave a Trail behind.
- John Hajny, a.k.a. TrailMaker

Laying down a contiguous "bed" for the actual weld to nest/fuse into. Very interesting. I had never considered this, but it makes perfect sense! As he suggests, even with exceptional miters (which are mandatory for this), you are stealing material from both tubes to create this fusion, and necessarily thinning them at a critical juncture. You can do this with some materials and in certain applications and get away with a fusion weld alone (I do it on stainless intercooler/intake hard pipes), but not in this case. It also occurs to me that this fusion step makes it much easier to get visually stunning (and structurally solid) final welds when it is time to add the filler.

Thanks for letting that little trick slip out!

exactly right on all counts but it also gives the joint some thermal stability when you go back to add filler, all but entirely preventing too big a keyhole opening thanks to too much heat.

if you ever get an opportunity to cut up a bike, take it. Specifically, cut through an acute joint to see if there's a gap underneath the weld bead. Ideally, you won't see any air space at all between the two parent tubes. In a lot of cases though, you'll find that the filler rod "bridges" between them, leaving a triangular gap. With something as notch-sensitive as ti, that's bad news bears.

I haven't completely decided on the parts, but I like to tinker. I'll probably start with a Salsa Enabler fork (which fits the A-C of the design), but I'm also in the queue for Lefty clamps. It'll be dressed as a singlespeed or a gearie when the mood strikes.

Since it's getting closer, I figured it was time to start gathering together the parts. Some of it recently purchased, some of it NOS, and some of it being stolen off other bikes:

Have:

Fat Lefty Clamp (ala Mendon Cyclesmith)

Tires: Almost all of 'em

Spokes: double butted silver

Brake Levers: Paul or Avid Ultimate (haven't decided which to use)

Saddle: Specialized Phenom or WTB (undecided)

Grips: Oury (whichever matches the saddle)

Jones Ti Loop Bar

Thomson Stem

Eriksen 450mm 30.9 seatpost

Speedway Uma 50mm rim for rear

Avid Full Metal Jacket brake cables

Paul Shifter Mounts

Dura Ace Shifters

XTR Rear Derailleur

XTR Pedals

Middleburn 58/94 170mm crank

PC-951 Chain

Pink and silver streamers

Haven't yet:

BB-7 Brakes, 160s both ends

Phil Wood Ti BB

Endless Kick-Ass-Cog/ XT Cassette

Some sort of direct mount front derailleur

Project 321 Lefty hub

Surly Large Marge Lite rim

Silver Reflective tape for rim holes

If I do throw rigid into the mix, I'm thinking of getting a Carver O'Beast. It works with the fat front wheel I already use on my Jones (Paul Whub).

Because Lefty is offset, and the Marge Lite has an offset spoke bed, is relatively light, and is available now. Why not the same on the back? Because I bought it a little ways back, plus I already know it works well for me.

Because Lefty is offset, and the Marge Lite has an offset spoke bed, is relatively light, and is available now. Why not the same on the back? Because I bought it a little ways back, plus I already know it works well for me.

I've just put together a lefty wheel with a 80mm GFS, with non-offset drilling. Theres a fair amount of tension on the right side, with a notable amount less on the left side. But IMHO these tensions are fine. With a BFL mounted (at 18 PSI), the disc mounts of the hub, are 1-2 mm from the floor when laid flat. So I'm not sure you actually need an offset rim to make this work. In fact when I get my Lefty, I fully expect to be able to losen the right nips half a turn, while tensioning the left by the same.

The standoff wasn't long enough to work with a 100mm shell with a +5mm offset for the rings so...
machined a sleeve to a light press fit, welded around the circumference, turned the weld into a taper, mitered for extra tire clearance, cut a hunk out of a scrap tube, shaped and then fusion welded. Then the weld cap was filed down to make it look as if it were machined from a solid bar.

The standoff wasn't long enough to work with a 100mm shell with a +5mm offset for the rings so...
machined a sleeve to a light press fit, welded around the circumference, turned the weld into a taper, mitered for extra tire clearance, cut a hunk out of a scrap tube, shaped and then fusion welded. Then the weld cap was filed down to make it look as if it were machined from a solid bar.

Hoe Lee Cow. That is a pretty part. Function over form always works for this architect!

We're gonna skip a few steps and go straight to where it is sitting in my dining room. I don't have all the parts yet, but I have some parts that will proxy until I decide exactly what I want. Plus, I have to build a rear wheel. Hopefully I got the right size spokes

At midnight I decided I wasn't going to be able to sleep with a brand new frame sitting downstairs. Got up, and gathered parts I needed to start building the rear wheel. After lacing a side...OY! The 170mm rear hub doesn't fit into my Park TS-2 truing stand. ARRRRGGGGHHHH. After a few minutes of trying to figure out how to make it work, I came up with this solution:

Yup, I used a mini-tripod for my P&S velcro-d to the chainstay. Seems like this could come in handy on a ride

Anyways, after 5 more hours of tinkering, I come up with this:

Long night into morning. I haven't taken it outside yet to give it a whirl. This is gonna be rough Easter mass and brunch in a couple of hours because of the exhaustion and the anticipation.

You'll probably see parts swapped on and off. I tinker a bit.

16.5" chainstays with the current gear ratio, with a little room to go even shorter

At midnight I decided I wasn't going to be able to sleep with a brand new frame sitting downstairs. Got up, and gathered parts I needed to start building the rear wheel. After lacing a side...OY! The 170mm rear hub doesn't fit into my Park TS-2 truing stand. ARRRRGGGGHHHH. After a few minutes of trying to figure out how to make it work, I came up with this solution:

Yup, I used a mini-tripod for my P&S velcro-d to the chainstay. Seems like this could come in handy on a ride

Anyways, after 5 more hours of tinkering, I come up with this:

Long night into morning. I haven't taken it outside yet to give it a whirl. This is gonna be rough Easter mass and brunch in a couple of hours because of the exhaustion and the anticipation.

You'll probably see parts swapped on and off. I tinker a bit.

16.5" chainstays with the current gear ratio, with a little room to go even shorter

I like the long post. Looks kind of old school ala Cunningham Bradbury plus should provide for a bit more flex / cush than a short one.

How are the brakes working out for you? I noticed it took a lot more brake force to stop when I built up my fat bike. I have a 203 front and 160 rear with 1st generation Saint brakes ( which aren't as strong as new Saints ). I'd like to switch out to a 180mm rear as it takes a fair amount of pressure to lock up the rear tire.

I've been moving to bigger rotors as a rule the last year. 180 front and 160 rear on lighter bikes and 203 front 180 rear on heavier bikes. It makes life easier. But there is a balance. I had a 203 on the front of my 3 speed and it was too grabby so I went with a 180 which is better.