this has been done to death. yes, we all know muay boran is for the battlefield, blah blah blah, thats all good and great and im sure back in the day there were plenty of legit schools, thats not whats at issue here. quality control now? non existent, cos it isnt used in war anymore. we use guns. this makes it obsolete as an art form.

and please shut up about the killing people by dislocating their necks business. do you realise how difficult it is to do that to someone with a strike? human bodies are not as fragile as most bullshit artists would like to think.

I will loose when you tell me sport muay thai teaches killing teachniques.

Muay thai has many killing techniques because what makes a technique lethal is often less about what the technique is than how and when it's used. A nak muay hits you in the jaw with a punch,kick,elbow,knee, or shin you fall down. The same fighter uses the same attack against your temple or throat you die.

take their fighting stance and do the pathetic song dance the sport muay thai crowd does nowadays.

I've never been to Ohio but I would imagine there has to be a muay thai gym somewhere in the state. How about you walk into one and then report back to us on how much singing and dancing occurs.

And street fighting is nothing close to battle field fighting.

I wouldn't know. I've done little of the former and none of the latter. Have you done either, or are you just parroting what you were told by your instructors? Actually,don't answer. Ther are plenty of people on Bullshido with confirmed street and/or battlefield experience so I'll leave it to them to pick you apart.

In ThaiYuth, to pass to a senior level, you fight 10 guys on the test.

When I took aikido I "fought" 10 attackers at a time from time to time. Post a video of one of these tests so we can see if what you call fighting is closer to randori or kyokushin kumite.

ThaiYuth is the training for the Tahan Sua (Tiger Solder) of Prajao Taksin (King Taksin who liberated Siam from Burmese control). Phaya Pichai Dab Hak was a general in Prajao Taksin's army and Muay Thasao derived from his training.

Hooray. Muay boran was a big deal 300 years ago. Following that thought process I guess I should take up musket shooting to learn the real deadly .

Thasao is a town in Uttaradit province where Pahaya Pichai was from.

I am from Milwaukee, which is Algonquin for "The Good Land".

Muay Boran competition was banned becasue people died during the match

Remember what I said about the search function? Now be a good boy and use it to look up "too deadly for the cage".

and the the west kept trying to pussify South East Asia during the colonial period. People had to wear hats, have western culture and looks, etc... so a perfectly decent competition was banned because it was deemed barbarism and Siam was at risk of invasion by the western powers. It had to display civility or be deemed barbarians and fit for conquest.

Curse those ignorant, oppressive round-eyes!

Also Samnak Dab Buddhai Sawan teaches Krabi Krabong so it isn't hard to find like someone mentioned. I have known this since I was a toddler living in Thailand.

this has been done to death. yes, we all know muay boran is for the battlefield, blah blah blah, thats all good and great and im sure back in the day there were plenty of legit schools, thats not whats at issue here. quality control now? non existent, cos it isnt used in war anymore. we use guns. this makes it obsolete as an art form.

and please shut up about the killing people by dislocating their necks business. do you realise how difficult it is to do that to someone with a strike? human bodies are not as fragile as most bullshit artists would like to think.

Hehehe, I have a conceal carry permit and I won't hesitate to use my Glock 22 to end an assailant's life. I trained at the Tactical Defense Instatute with John Benner in Tactical Rifle 1 & 2 and Tactical Shotgun. What's the point about guns? We are talking about Muay Boran battle field techniques. Technique is technique. Like Algebra formulas. I'm assuming people know human physiology hasn't change that much in 200+ years. Neck is in the same place, kidneys, heart, lungs, joints, and weak points. You learn the technique (aka formula), you know how to do it. Just like a kick, a punch, an elbow, a knee all have techniques to deliver them, Tum/Tub/Jab/Hak also have their techniques that is "DOCUMENTED" in Thailand's national archive. A sport thai boxing guy may dodge punches and hold kicks but a Muay Boran guy would break your arm when you deliver a punch and break your leg when a kick is delivered. Both are illegal in sport Muay Thai. Heck, in the USA, you can't even elbow. You act how you train and if you train not to use elbow so you can fight sport Muay Thai in USA, you are going to be accustomed to your training. I know how it goes because I trained in sport Muay Thai for a year at the Son of Siam gym in Wilder, KY. In regards to Muay Boran being obsolete, Tactical Defense Institute offers a Close Quarters Personal Control
combat class which utilizes elbows and knees similar to Muay Thai so if Muay Thai techniques is considered legit training for the SWAT team in Cincinnati, then Muay Boran is also a legit combat technique as it is more lethal. Same thing goes for Krav Maga techniques borrowed from Muay Thai.

I will loose when you tell me sport muay thai teaches killing teachniques.

Muay thai has many killing techniques because what makes a technique lethal is often less about what the technique is than how and when it's used. A nak muay hits you in the jaw with a punch,kick,elbow,knee, or shin you fall down. The same fighter uses the same attack against your temple or throat you die. .

Yes, everything in Muay Thai is also in Muay Boran but Muay Boran have more killing techniques and attack techniques than Muay Thai.

Originally Posted by dougguod

take their fighting stance and do the pathetic song dance the sport muay thai crowd does nowadays.

I've never been to Ohio but I would imagine there has to be a muay thai gym somewhere in the state. How about you walk into one and then report back to us on how much singing and dancing occurs.

Hehehe, I already trained at son of siam in wilder kentucky for sport muay thai. Same holding the neck and hugging around. Imagine doing that in the battle field.

Originally Posted by dougguod

And street fighting is nothing close to battle field fighting.

I wouldn't know. I've done little of the former and none of the latter. Have you done either, or are you just parroting what you were told by your instructors? Actually,don't answer. Ther are plenty of people on Bullshido with confirmed street and/or battlefield experience so I'll leave it to them to pick you apart. .

There are paintings in the wall showing battle field scenes, even at Nakorn Wat in Cambodia which I visited. There are documents in asian cultures depicting battle fields. So its documented once again. Also looking from sword fighting techniques which is hot, fast, and aggressive, like Muay Boran, we know that is how the people fought in battle fields. Not the Yang Sum Kum stare at each other for a bit, fake a few kicks, hug and knee each other until the referee breaks you up style of Sport Muay Thai.

Originally Posted by dougguod

In ThaiYuth, to pass to a senior level, you fight 10 guys on the test.

When I took aikido I "fought" 10 attackers at a time from time to time. Post a video of one of these tests so we can see if what you call fighting is closer to randori or kyokushin kumite.

Good for you, I never said Thaiyuth had a monopoly on fighting 10 attackers. I don't have any videos of the test. I suggest going to Thailand and getting in touch with one of the Thaiyuth schools so you can view the test.

Originally Posted by dougguod

ThaiYuth is the training for the Tahan Sua (Tiger Solder) of Prajao Taksin (King Taksin who liberated Siam from Burmese control). Phaya Pichai Dab Hak was a general in Prajao Taksin's army and Muay Thasao derived from his training.

Hooray. Muay boran was a big deal 300 years ago. Following that thought process I guess I should take up musket shooting to learn the real deadly .

OMG, you can't be serious. Using your logic, any martial art is obsolete so you need not train at all. Albebra and the Bible must be obsolete too, they are quite old.

Originally Posted by dougguod

Thasao is a town in Uttaradit province where Pahaya Pichai was from.

I am from Milwaukee, which is Algonquin for "The Good Land".

Good to know...

Originally Posted by dougguod

Muay Boran competition was banned becasue people died during the match

Remember what I said about the search function? Now be a good boy and use it to look up "too deadly for the cage".

What is there to look up? The king ordered it banned. End of story.

Originally Posted by dougguod

and the the west kept trying to pussify South East Asia during the colonial period. People had to wear hats, have western culture and looks, etc... so a perfectly decent competition was banned because it was deemed barbarism and Siam was at risk of invasion by the western powers. It had to display civility or be deemed barbarians and fit for conquest.

Curse those ignorant, oppressive round-eyes!

"It is forbidden to kill; therefore all murderers are punished unless they kill in large numbers and to the sound of trumpets" - Voltaire

Originally Posted by dougguod

Also Samnak Dab Buddhai Sawan teaches Krabi Krabong so it isn't hard to find like someone mentioned. I have known this since I was a toddler living in Thailand.

Yeah, I believed a lot of things when I was a toddler, too.

Good for you. Education is a never ending process. When you are green you grow, when you are ripe you rot.

Like Algebra formulas. I'm assuming people know human physiology hasn't change that much in 200+ years. Neck is in the same place, kidneys, heart, lungs, joints, and weak points. You learn the technique (aka formula), you know how to do it.

You need to learn the difference between practice and theory. I "know" how to break necks and limbs because several teachers have shown me but I have never done so. And neither have you.

a Muay Boran guy would break your arm when you deliver a punch and break your leg when a kick is delivered.

This brings us to your next search function assignment, "aliveness". In theory, breaking an opponent's arm/leg/neck is more effective than merely punching him in the face or kicking him in the gut. In reality, these "inferior" techniques are better to train because students can deliver, and receive, them at full contact and get accurate feedback on what does and doesn't work. This can't be done with the crippling teachniques you seem so enamored with because, unless you live in a Michael Dudikoff movie where expendable training partners are plentiful, they can only be practiced in fully cooperative slow motion. Kind of like kata, or that song and dance business you sneer at. If you ever had to do them under uncontrolled, full speed and power conditions you would fail. You're actually correct when you write "You act how you train" but you don't understand what those words mean.

And as an aside, even if you could reliably pull off maiming moves under duress there are very few scenarios where you could legally do so.

Like Algebra formulas. I'm assuming people know human physiology hasn't change that much in 200+ years. Neck is in the same place, kidneys, heart, lungs, joints, and weak points. You learn the technique (aka formula), you know how to do it.

You need to learn the difference between practice and theory. I "know" how to break necks and limbs because several teachers have shown me but I have never done so. And neither have you.

Could it be that people practiced it in the battle field first before it was taught as a technique?

Originally Posted by dougguod

a Muay Boran guy would break your arm when you deliver a punch and break your leg when a kick is delivered.

This brings us to your next search function assignment, "aliveness". In theory, breaking an opponent's arm/leg/neck is more effective than merely punching him in the face or kicking him in the gut. In reality, these "inferior" techniques are better to train because students can deliver, and receive, them at full contact and get accurate feedback on what does and doesn't work. This can't be done with the crippling teachniques you seem so enamored with because, unless you live in a Michael Dudikoff movie where expendable training partners are plentiful, they can only be practiced in fully cooperative slow motion. Kind of like kata, or that song and dance business you sneer at. If you ever had to do them under uncontrolled, full speed and power conditions you would fail. You're actually correct when you write "You act how you train" but you don't understand what those words mean.

Again, it was proven in the battle field before it became a technique. It only takes a few lbs of pressure to snap a person's elbow joints when he punches you. When I say you act how you train, I am saying if you trian to be a ring sport fighter, you will fight like that. If you train to break arms and legs, that is what you will do. You don't have to break a person's arm to practice, you can practice controlled techniques at a speed. As you progress, your speed and technique improves. Its common sense.

Originally Posted by dougguod

And as an aside, even if you could reliably pull off maiming moves under duress there are very few scenarios where you could legally do so.

Depends on which state you live in. In ohio, I can use lethal force for a home breakin or if I fear for my life.

There are paintings in the wall showing battle field scenes, even at Nakorn Wat in Cambodia which I visited. There are documents in asian cultures depicting battle fields. So its documented once again.

"Someone painted it, so it must be true". Seriously? This has to be the single most asinine argument ever offered on Bullshido, and that's quite a feat considering that we allow ninja to post here.