Hail, Fire and Blood

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An unlikely mix?

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Rev. 8:6-7.

"And the ‘SEVEN ANGELS’ which had the ‘SEVEN TRUMPETS’ prepared themselves to sound. The ‘First Angel’ sounded, and there followed HAIL and FIRE mingled with BLOOD, and they were cast upon the Earth: and the third part of trees was burnt up, and all green grass was burnt up."

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And, especially from the sky, where does the “blood” come from?

And how can hail, which is ice, fall along with fire, without melting?

To understand this phenomenon, let’s first look at each component of the mix.

Hail is a form of solid precipitation. It consists of balls or irregular lumps of ice, each of which is called a hailstone.[1] Unlike graupel, which is made of rime, and ice pellets, which are smaller and translucent, hailstones consist mostly of water ice and measure between 5 millimetres (0.2 in) and 15 centimetres (6 in) in diameter.

Hail forms in strong thunderstorm clouds, particularly those with intense updrafts, high liquid water content, great vertical extent, large water droplets, and where a good portion of the cloud layer is below freezing 0 °C (32 °F).

These types of strong updrafts can also indicate the presence of a tornado. The growth rate is maximized where air is near a temperature of −13 °C (9 °F).

Blood rain or red rain is a phenomenon in which blood is perceived to fall from the sky in the form of rain.

Cases have been recorded since Homer‘s Iliad, composed approximately 8th century BC, and are widespread. Before the 17th century it was generally believed that the rain was actually blood.

In the 19th century blood rains were scientifically examined and theories that dust gave the water its red colour gained ground. Today, the dominant theories are that the rain is caused by red dust suspended in the water (rain dust), or due to the presence of micro-organisms.

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In the 19th century, there was a trend towards examining events such as rains of blood more scientifically; Ehrenberg conducted experiments at the Berlin Academy, attempting to recreate "blood rain" using dust mixed with water.

He concluded that blood rain was caused by water mixing with a reddish dust mostly composed of animal and vegetable matter. He was unclear on the origin of the dust, stating that it lacked the characteristics of African dust which might have indicated it came from the Sahara Desert.

Instead, he suggested that the dust came from dried swamps where it was picked up by violent winds and would later fall as rain.[20]

This explanation has persisted, and the Academic Press Dictionary of Science and Technology (1992) attributes the colour of blood rain to the presence of dust containing iron oxide.[21]

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Other reasons for blood rain aside from dust are sometimes given. Schove and Peng-Yoke have suggested that the phenomenon may be connected to sunspots and aurorae.[22][23] When red rain fell in Kerala, dust was the suspected cause.

Alternative theories included dust from a meteorite and extraterrestrial cells in the water.[24] These were later dismissed. The particles causing the red colour in Kerala were "morphologically similar" to algae and fungal spores.[25]

Poisons trapped in earth released from earthquake corrupted atmosphere. Both fire and hail occurred together in this event.

Earth was, indeed, subjected to bombardment from space during the 14th century and that this may very well have been not only the cause of the 25 January 1348 earthquake, but also the cause of the Black Death. Baillie quotes a great selection of material from contemporary accounts including the work of Ziegler cited above:

Ziegler discounts entirely reports of a black comet seen before the arrival of the epidemic but records: heavy mists and clouds, falling stars, blasts of hot wind, a column of fire, a ball of fire, a violent earth tremor, in Italy a crescendo of calamity involving earthquakes, following which, the plague arrived. (Baillie)

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It even rained toad and snakes:

It says in the same letter that in this year [1348] fire falling from heaven consumed the land of the Turks for 16 days; that for a few days it rained toads and snakes, by which many men were killed: that a pestilence has gathered strength in many parts of the world. (Horrox)

Worms and snakes:

… massive rains of worms and serpents in parts of China, which devoured large numbers of people. Also in those parts fire rained from Heaven in the form of snow (ash), which burnt mountains, the land, and men.

And from this fire arose a pestilential smoke that killed all who smelt it within twelve hours, as well as those who only saw the poison of that pestilential smoke. (Cohn)

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Cause of death:

As Baillie notes, if this oft-cited earthquake was, in reality, the result of cometary impacts then the corrupted air could be from one or two causes: high-energy chemical transformations in the atmosphere or outgassings from the earth itself.

(If dark matter were to ionize Nitrogen as well as water vapor in the atmosphere, you can get ammonia, which was detected in ice cores from periods of known cometary impacts – see the Haber Process). This would also be poisonous to humans in large concentrations.

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The German Historian, Hecker, informs us about a hurricane during the earthquake on Cyprus:

On the island of Cyprus, the plague from the East had already broken out; when an earthquake shook the foundations of the island, and was accompanied by so frightful a hurricane, that the inhabitants… fled in dismay…

The sea overflowed…

Before the earthquake, a pestiferous wind spread so poisonous anodor that many, being overpowered by it, fell down suddenly and expired in dreadful agonies. …

and as at that time natural occurrences were transformed into miracles, it was reported that a fiery meteor, which descended on the earth far in the East, had destroyed everything within a circumference of more than a hundred leagues, infecting the air far and wide. (Cohn)

(2)

Comet of 540 AD and “Climate Change”

Analysis of tree rings shows that at in 540 AD in different parts of the world the climate changed.

Temperatures dropped enough to hinder the growth of trees as widely dispersed as northern Europe, Siberia, western North America, and southern South America.

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A search of historical records and mythical stories pointed to a disastrous visitation from the sky during the same period, it is claimed.

There was one reference to a “comet in Gaul so vast that the whole sky seemed on fire” in 540-41.

Famine followed the crop failures, and hard on its heels bubonic plague that swept across Europe in the mid-6th century. […]

At this time, the Roman emperor Justinian was attempting to regenerate the decaying Roman empire.

But the plan failed in 540 and was followed by the Dark Ages and the rise of Islam.

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Conclusions

Earthquakes and hurricanes can occur together.

Earthquakes and comets can occur at the same time.

Fire and Hail can occur together, as in the 1348 earthquake.

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Cometary impacts can cause earthquakes.

Earthquakes can also trigger hurricanes.

Earthquakes can release poisons into the air.

So can comets!

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Hurricanes can carry poisons.

Hurricanes can carry comet dust, life forms, and other debris.

Comet dust contains iron oxide, which is red in color, and is toxic to breathe in.

Poisons can cause pestilence and death.

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The bible is true. It has always been true.

It even predicted “natural events” that were not so natural 2000 years ago.

Yeshua / Jesus will return, when the sun turns dark and the moon turns red, and the stars fall from the sky.

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245 Responses to “Hail, Fire and Blood”

Thanks for this presentation. Sounds perfectly reasonable to me. I am in a state of shock by what’s going on in the earth already. The worst one I’ve read is that Netanyahu (PM of Israel) is wondering if he waited too long to take action against Iran’s nuclear buildup, with all the nations at the Vienna summit saying to reduce the sanctions on Iran. He believes, the article says, that the US betrayed Israel. This is very serious from a prophetic point of view.

… it snowed in the middle of July, once; here in southern Oregon. 😉
Seriously though, the very same thought came to me this week. I’m not kidding! Then it came to me that the blood which comes down may be symbolic and actual of the millions of unborn that have been slaughtered in the wombs of the ungodly and washed into the sewers. Now, all that is pure presumption without any scriptural support whatsoever but, this subject matter is reasonable to give thought to and pray about, I think.

It is also easy for hail and fire to mingle with blood when each of these are symbols. Considering Revelation is symbolic it makes perfect sense and doesn’t require the bible reader to be a scientist unless God expects all bible readers to have a degree.

Yeshua is pictured with a sword coming out of his mouth. Does he literally ride with a sword sticking out of his mouth or does that “sword” represent the “word of God” which protrudes or comes out of the mouth.

The word of God comes out of the mouth and is pictured as a sword as it divides people like a sword does. Religion has divided mankind even families because each person interprets things differently and thus we have so many religions because of this. That division was prophesied when he wrote

34“Do not suppose that I have come to bring peace to the earth. I did not come to bring peace, but a sword. 35For I have come to turn

“ ‘a man against his father,

a daughter against her mother,

a daughter-in-law against her mother-in-law—

36a man’s enemies will be the members of his own household.”

And thus it has divided people even causing divorce and families disowning other members just because of religion. Just as that sword was a symbol representing the word of God, the symbols in Revelation are all symbols which represent things in the end times. If it is preferable to believe that we have more love than God and that he enjoys everlasting torture or cruel punishments that cause tremendous pain then that is a version of God I want nothing to do with.

The God of the Hebrews is a loving God who has a master plan which will convert the wicked and refine the maximum of mankind.

“32For God has bound everyone over to disobedience so that he may have mercy on them all.”

It is not a lottery to just see who is smart enough to figure things out. That would be unloving to all humans who are less intelligent or slower mentally. The ransom was already paid. There is nothing you can earn by works for it is written…

“6And since it is through God’s kindness, then it is not by their good works. For in that case, God’s grace would not be what it really is—free and undeserved.”

When you do works, something is owed to you for the work of your hand. If we are all to be awarded based upon our works then it would be negating graciousness or undeserved kindness. We would be making it into kindness.

Sadly though the majority of humans want to be better than other humans and want to view themselves going to heaven achieving a higher calling or status and in their eyes they feel according to their works they deserve this or that.

If we were truly judged on works we would all get nothing because we have all failed in the law in some way or another not to mention inherited sin. I know some people probably want to sit with popcorn and watch fellow humans being rained on with a literal hail of fire. They have spent their lives being harassed and persecuted possibly by these ones. But what would Yeshua say?

“Father, forgive them for they do not know what they are doing.” This is the truth and the most desirable thing to God is not to destroy the evildoer but to turn the evil person into a good one. Even if it takes considerable time and lessons to do this he will do what he wills, not what other humans might desire.

Really, Marianne?
Are you actually going to try to explain this one with the scientific method?
Does anyone here actually think that these freaks of nature will all happen at the same time all over the world at the same time?
Give God some credit here. Remember how Pharaoh tried to explain away the 10 plagues as natural phenomenon – until the last two? Well if this happens as explained, then it will be beyond those of Egypt and at that point there will only be one possible explanation and that is the wrath of God himself.
After all, if it is simply a freak of nature, there is no need to believe in God or His powers. It is like trying to day the Red Sea parted simply because it happened to be windy right at that time.
Yeah right. Yet I have seen some scientists trying to prove it could have happened in some strange attempt to prove the bible using science.
That’s not only nuts but almost blasphemous, denying the need for God to produce bible miracles. It is like saying when Jesus returns we will receive spiritual bodies thru some sort of virus or cosmic radiation, like Spiderman or the Hulk.
Please, leave some things as pure acts of God and just move on. This whole article is just an exercise in futility as far as I’m concerned. Know what I mean?

“Observers around the world report that Comet ISON is now visible in binoculars. The comet is brightening as it plunges toward the sun for a perilous pass through the solar atmosphere on Nov. 28th. It is not, however, the brightest comet in the night sky. As November unfolds, there is a rare gathering of four comets rising in the east before dawn.”

There is a good book out called “The Comets of God”. It theorizes (but backs up a lot of its ideas with scientific evidence) that comets (as opposed to asteroids) are what God uses to chastise the world. I highly recommend its reading.

“1) The First Trumpet tells of “hail and fire mingled with blood” (“blood” is a metaphor for “death”) hitting the Earth and burning up one third of the trees and grass. The expression “hail and fire” is used not only in the Bible as a reference to cometary material hitting the Earth (Exodus 9:18-25, and Joshua 10), but also in the Sumerian and Akkadian literature. In the Sumerian “Lamentation over the Destruction of Sumer and Ur” there were “hailstones and flames” and large trees were destroyed, and “large stones, one after another, fell with great thuds.” NASA recently took pictures of a twenty mile wide cloud containing hailstones the size of basketballs enclosing and travelling with Comet Hartley 2. Passing through the Earth’s atmosphere before hitting a heavily forested area, these dust laden hailstones would be on fire.”

Revelation 8:7
“The first angel blew his trumpet, and there followed HAIL and FIRE, mixed with BLOOD, which fell on the earth; and a third of the earth was burnt up, and a third of the trees were burnt up, and all green grass was burnt up.”

I have always wondered if spiritual occurrences is the cause for events that take place in the natural world…

Granted, things do happen in the natural, but
since God is a spirit …I always look for spiritual meanings in Scripture..
So I looked up hail and fire…
Psalms 18-13..The LORD also thundered in the heavens, and the Highest gave his voice; HAIL STONES and coals of FIRE…
God is angry hence the hail and fire… He also tells us something interesting that takes place during this anger…
Verse 15…Then the channels of waters were seen, and the foundations of the world were discovered at thy rebuke, O LORD, at the blast of the breath of thy nostrils…… During God’s anger we will understand the foundations of the world Satan set up in the Garden of Eden..
The dragon beast comes out of the great waters, I.e. The sea…hence the channels of waters in verse 15., 16…
Rev 12-9 shows us that the dragon beast is that old serpent. (of Eden)……
2 Corinthians 11-3,4,14 also shows us the latter day events are comparable to Eve’s deceptions..
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I think mingled with blood symbolizes the anger of god indwelling this great army of wrath ..
Psalms 18-16,17 shows god rescues some out of great waters and from those too strong for us to fight..

Ezekiel also speaks of hail and fire and blood…..
Ezekiel 38-22, 23..And I will plead against him(gog) with pestilence and with blood; and I will rain upon him, and upon his bands, and upon the many people that are with him, an overflowing rain, and great hailstones, fire, and brimstone. ..

GOG-Magog is not Russia…A clue to who God-Magog is is in Revelation 20-8..And (Satan)shall go out to deceive the nations which are in the four quarters of the earth, Gog and Magog, to gather them together to battle: the number of whom is as the sand of the sea….These are Satan’s army and they are the men God numbered as the SAND OF THE SEA SHORE…Aka, Arabs, including converts into the Arab lie of Islam..
Ezekiel 38-4…And I will turn thee back, and put hooks into thy jaws, and I will bring thee forth, and all thine army, horses and horsemen, all of them clothed with all sorts [of Armour, even] a great company with bucklers and shields, all of them handling swords:These are the army of the apollyon-Satan-rev 9…The apollyon is Satan ….The apollyon is also the return of antichrist -mohammed….The apollyon is the SUNRISE in the western world… Currently he is gathering his Muslim army aka Arab Spring…

Ezekiel 38 and Psalms 83 are about the Islamic attack on America…We are the hidden ones, hidden in Christ… We are also the land that has always dwelt safely and we are built against the mountains of Israel…means we worship at the same mountain as does Israel of old, aka The God of Abraham…..It might possibly include the land of Israel but I doubt it…Israel has NEVER DWELT safely nor have hey been hidden to my knowledge…….
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Thanks for your post – I was just reading Psalm 18 this morning and noticed the same passage you copied/passed above.

Psalm 18 is symbolic spiritual warfare language, which is inclusive of spiritual discernment.

“For we do not wrestle against flesh and blood, but against the rulers, against the authorities, against the cosmic powers over this present darkness, against the spiritual forces of evil in the heavenly places” (Ephesians 6:12).

At the closing of this age, God is judging and destroying the darkness (which is still present on earth) in the spiritual realm.

What we don’t seem to understand is that the spiritual realm is where the battle is active and on going since the “day” when God said “Let there be light.”

I think this page adds confusion rather than help clarify.

We’re once again considering the natural, physical environment and little thought given to spiritual discernment (Hebrews 5:14) and the war that is all about us.

James and John were nicked named “son’s of thunder”, right?

What could that mean in the physical realm?

Did they have intestinal, methane issues?

Or, did lightning flash from their eyes too?

The following may help give insight into what is coming with this Hail, Fire and Blood. For the most part – a very large part of the unfolding events in these last days – it will not be natural events but spiritual.

“The Lord thundered from heaven, and the Most High uttered His voice,
hailstones and coals of fire.

He sent out His arrows and scattered the foe, lightnings in abundance, and He vanquished them.

Then the channels of the sea were seen, the foundations of the world were uncovered at Your rebuke, O Lord, at the blast of the breath of Your nostrils” (Psalm 18:13-15, NKJV).

So now, the following is a description of the spiritual warfare that manifests in the physical realm (upon the earth and “the sea of life”).

Please think about James and John (disciples/followers) as members of the Lord’s army when reading the following account in Joel.

“Fire devours before them, and behind them a flame burns. The land is like the garden of Eden before them, but behind them a desolate wilderness, and nothing escapes them.

Their appearance is like the appearance of horses and like war horses they run.

As with the rumbling of chariots, they leap on the tops of the mountains, like the crackling of a flame of fire devouring the stubble, like a powerful army drawn up for battle.

Before them peoples are in anguish; all faces grow pale.

Like warriors they charge; like soldiers they scale the wall.

They march each on his way; they do not swerve from their paths.

They do not jostle one another; each marches in his path; they burst through the weapons and are not halted.

They leap upon the city, they run upon the walls, they climb up into the houses, they enter through the windows like a thief. The earth quakes before them; the heavens tremble.

The sun and the moon are darkened, and the stars withdraw their shining.

The Lord utters his voice before his army, for his camp is exceedingly great; he who executes his word is powerful.

For the day of the Lord is great and very awesome; who can endure it? (Joel 2:3-11, ESV).

Obviously the wicked, un-repenting sinner will not survive. But, the righteous will (Malachi 4), thank you Lord.

If folks can’t see The One World Tower for what it represents and the Statue of Liberty for what it represents – well, the passage above will also make little sense.

Your observation of “An unlikely mix” is correct and I have often wondered what is meant by hail and fire mixed with blood, whether God is using natural causes or supernatural, but I believe that the gist of this plague is the result. If you have a third of the earth and trees being burnt up, then it is what is not written that becomes of concern and that being fatalities. For you cannot have a third of the earth and trees burnt up without people and animals being involved and a third of the earth would cover a lot of area, as well as envolve a lot of people and animals. Not only is this true, but this plague would also remove a third of the trees which replenish earths oxigen. Unlike the 4th seal and the 6th trumpet, no percentage of fatalities is given here, but it would be impossible for there not to be any. The same can be said for trumpets 3 and 4 as well as for the bowl judgments.

Just a correction on your list up there, it is the 6th trumpet that records a third, where the 1st Trumpet doesn’t record a percentage, but as I said, you can’t have a third of the earth burnt up without having fatalities, but their just not mentioned.

Dj – Liked your post – the word “Grass” sometimes in the O.T is talking of men. So we have to understand when its meaning is men and not real green grass. I will not learn that by science but by symbolic Revelation by the Spirit. It just so happens that O.T Hebrew is Pictorical which makes Hebrew language more Revelational than others. It interprets itself many times.

If I may, since the prophecy begins with the literal earth and trees being burnt up, it would be in keeping with the context to regard the grass as literal grass as well, opposed to symbolizing it to mean men. There is just nothing there that would suggest that the grass is to represent anything but literal grass. A good rule of thumb is that if the Scripture starts off with the literal, then it is not going to be mixed, that is, some literal and some symbolic. Another example would be:

“The sun turned black like sackcloth made of goat hair, the whole moon turned blood red, and the stars in the sky fell to earth”

In the verse above, since the literal sun and moon are in view, we should not apply a symbolic meaning to the stars, as I have yet to find anywhere where there is a mixture. The woman of chapter twelve is said to be clothed with the sun, with the moon under feet and wearing a crown of twelve stars, which we should view this as being all symbolic and not mix and match. The dragon with seven heads and ten horns, all symbolic. Unless there is something in the context that would suggest symbolism, then the objects mentioned should be viewed as literal.

Where in prophecy does it indicate a literal world destruction? If I subscribe to Hellenistic metaphor interpretation and Dantainism, then it would give me that particular picture of world destruction.

you cannot assume that everything is a metaphor. most of the bible is literal.

when jeremiah predicted the fall of jerusalem, for example, a real army showed up and took the city.

when Gd defeats the wicked, he has always used physical means….this is history……so when he predicts the same for the future, he will do the same….he will not overcome the wicked with philosophy or metaphors….he will kill them literally and destroy everything they have.

I believe you missed my point, I did not make an assumption or an assertion that everything was metaphorical, the question I posed was the contention and I supported it with an “If” example. Where some might think that to renew the earth for example, a literal destruction of the earth must take place in toto, but renewal used in its proper context (i.e. covenant, etc.) actually means renewing what is already existing, not creating all over again.

Since you brought it up, I personally would have to agree in that when God says, ” I am making all things new,” that it would have to mean not renovated, but something out of nothing. The word translated new is ” kainos” which is defined as, “fresh, new, unused, novel.” Being familiar with the way that God does things from his word, I doubt very much that the new heaven and new earth will be a renovation of the first ones, but brand spanking new, something from nothing. Also, If the New Jerusalem is any indication, then we can count on a completely new heaven and new earth and that because we know that the New Jerusalem will not be a renovation of the earthly one, but a brand spankin new, novel, never seen before city.

This new earth is also said to have no sea (sorry you surfers). There is also no need for the sun to shine on it, for God will give the new earth light and there will also be no night time there.

Hi M, correct me If I am wrong. What you suggest or state is that at the rapture the “saints” will zoom up to heaven and their celebrate the “Marriage Supper”. I do not find support for this theory in Scripture. We meet Jesus in the air (1 Thess 4:17). Since Jesus only returns once, true believers meet Him in the air when He returns. In Acts 3:21-26, He (Christ) must remain in heaven until the time comes for God to restore everything, as he promised long ago through his holy prophets. Concerning the “Marriage Supper,” I cannot find where this takes place in heaven? I do find in Rev 19:17-18 “a great feast here in Israel (presumably Meggido/Armageddon). Another point, “what can God not do?” Careful we do not put God in a box and limit what He can do and not do! Christ returns and rules for a thousand years from the New Temple in Jerusalem. I do find Scripture that this earth will be burnt up, but I also find Scripture to say that this earth will be renewed. So, we will have to wait and observe. We live in very exciting times, the false Christians want Jerusalem, Islam wants Jerusalem. The power elite have built mega tunnels deep down in the earth for their survival, even around Petra! Amazing how Rev 6:15 maybe be linked to these world leaders hidden in these deep tunnels. For us believers, it is those who totally trust in Jesus and hold on to Him through the coming tribulations. This site is blessed and full of blessed believers. Stay true to the Lord, Amen.

Marianne, I am not certain but I think this verse applies to the marriage supper and I think it is taking place now…
Rev. 19-9..And he saith unto me, Write, Blessed are they which are called unto the marriage supper of the Lamb. And he saith unto me, These are the true sayings of God…Does this not mean the marriage supper is when we eat the true sayings of God,,
As I said I am not certain but I think the marriage supper is when God reveals all the mysteries of Himself and of satan when he crushes leviathan’s head and gives him as meat to God’s people…
Psalms 74-3,4..Thou didst divide the sea by thy strength: thou brakest the heads of the dragons in the waters. Thou brakest the heads of leviathan in pieces, and gavest him to be meat to the people inhabiting the wilderness.
The woman (church or bride) in the wilderness of Rev 12-14..And to the woman were given two wings of a great eagle, that she might fly into the wilderness, into her place, where she is nourished for a time, and times, and half a time, from the face of the serpent.

.Men like Matthew are poisoning the marriage supper for themselves and for those who believe men like Matthew..

It will be a literal feast of eating and drinking. Consider the following:

“I tell you, I will not drink from this fruit of the vine from now on until that day when I drink it new with you in my Father’s kingdom.”

Jesus here is speaking of the wedding feast, when his disciples and all believers will be there to drink the fruit of the vine with him, that being in his and our Father’s kingdom, which would put it as taking place in heaven.

You said:
“Hi M, correct me If I am wrong. What you suggest or state is that at the rapture the “saints” will zoom up to heaven and their celebrate the “Marriage Supper”. I do not find support for this theory in Scripture. We meet Jesus in the air (1 Thess 4:17). Since Jesus only returns once, true believers meet Him in the air when He returns. ”

The problem is that expositors have erroneously made the gathering of the church and the end of age synonymous. At the resurrection and catching away (1 Thes.4:17), the Lord does not return to the earth, but only meets us in the air and then fulfills John 14:1-3 where he will then take us back to the Father’s house, that where he is we may be also. Sometime after the 7th bowl has been poured out, then Jesus will physically and visually return to end the age and begin his millennial reign.

If we were to interpret the resurrection and the catching away as the same event as Jesus return to end the age, that is, after the 7th bowl judgment, then it would put the church through the seals, trumpets and bowl judgments, the entire wrath of God. Though there will be tribulation taking place for those great tribulation saints by the beast and the false prophet, the wrath of God will also be taking place. If you’ll notice, for example, after the 6th trumpet has taken place, it is stated that,

“The rest of mankind who were not killed by these plagues still did not repent of the work of their hands; they did not stop worshiping demons, and idols of gold, silver, bronze, stone and wood—idols that cannot see or hear or walk. Nor did they repent of their murders, their magic arts, their sexual immorality or their thefts.”

And

“The fourth angel poured out his bowl on the sun, and the sun was allowed to scorch people with fire. 9They were seared by the intense heat and they cursed the name of God, who had control over these plagues, but they refused to repent and glorify him.”

Notice in the Scriptures above, the purpose of these plagues is to get men to repent and glorify God. The true believer in Christ would have already done these things and therefore, it would make no sense for God to be pouring out his wrath on those who will have previously repented and who will have been walking in faith, believing in his Son. Do you actually believe that God is going to pour out his wrath on those who have already complied with his will?

Regarding the great tribulation saints, the fact that they are being newly introduced “These in white ropes, who are they and where did they come from” and the fact that John did not recognize them “And I said, sir you know” shows that John did not recognize them as the church and therefore a completely different group. In addition, though you will see the word “Ekklesia” translated “church” from chapter 1 through the very end of chapter 3, you will not see the word church thereafter. While all of the plagues of the seals, trumpets and bowl judgments are taking place, you will never see the word church, only “Hagios” translated saint or saints. Therefore, the reader would have to ask himself, why is the word church used up until the end of chapter 3, but then never mentioned again later?

The answer again is that, expositors have made the resurrection and catching away as being the same event, which is false. The Lord will descend from heaven and the dead will rise first, then we who are still alive will be changed and caught up with them where the Lord will take us back to the Father’s house. After that, the man of lawlessness will make his covenant for that one seven year period and the wrath of God and everything else that is written about that time will take place.

After Paul tells the Thessalonians about the resurrection and the catching away, he then says, “Therefore encourage one another with these words.” What kind of encouragement would there be if the church was going to suffer under the same wrath of God that the unbelievers are going to suffer? the answer is that, all overcoming believers are removed from the earth before God begins his wrath.

You said:
” Concerning the “Marriage Supper,” I cannot find where this takes place in heaven?”

“I say to you that many will come from the east and the west, and will take their places at the [feast] with Abraham, Isaac and Jacob in the kingdom of [heaven].

From the verse above you can see that the feast will definitely be held in heaven. Also, the parable regarding the ten virgins and the language used would also infer that the wedding feast will be held in heaven (Mt.25:1-13).

Hi, all fear comment. Let us not be presumptuous with Scripture and see what the Word says: 1. In Rev 19:17 there is mention of a “supper of the great God,'” which could be the “marriage supper of the Lamb.” 2. Re timing of the rapture: it is after the “last trump” at the Feast of Trumpets which reveals a God of order and not chaos as in “imminent rapture.” In Jn 11:24 Martha tells us when the rapture is. In Jn 6:39; 40; 44 and 54 Jesus tells us when the rapture will be. As I understand Scripture we are then with the Lord while His wrath (from His mouth/sword) is spelt out on the earth on the unbelievers. Jesus descends and reigns from Jerusalem.
Jn 14:1-3 indicates to me, and I maybe wrong, firstly to those who die before the rapture and secondly (vrs 3) to those at the rapture where Jesus says, “I will come again and receive you to Myself and where I am you may be also.”
Regarding the Church not mentioned after Ch 3 in Rev. To me the church fell away in the 1960’s when liberalism entered the main churches, where same sex marriage, abortion, adultery, “name it, claim it” and now befriending the enemy Islam. The church left are the true believers, those who trust Jesus in every area of their life and have no barriers in their relationship with Jesus. To know Jesus is not enough, you must have an intimate relationship, which includes obedience. Maybe that sounds pious but the Scripture is in the Bible. As Jesus said, “If you love Me, keep My commandments.” (Jn 6:10; 14:15). Also, when Jesus returns, how many believers are left? from Scripture it would appear most have fallen away, only the “elect” is left.
We could interpret Matt 24:31 to indicate that when Jesus returns the Saints will be with Him and then the “elect” or true believers will join them in the air. God bless.

You said:
“In Rev 19:17 there is mention of a “supper of the great God,’” which could be the “marriage supper of the Lamb.”

What you have stated above is not remotely possible and that because the wedding feast of the Lamb is a cellebration of the Bridgegroom (Jesus) and the Bride (the faithful) in heaven. Whereas the “supper of the great God” is where the Lord will be descending from heaven to the earth to end the age and at that time Scripture states that an angel will be calling all the birds of the air to come and gather themselves to the great supper of God to eat the flesh of kings, generals, their armies, their horses and all who will have been gathered their at Armageddon as can be seen in the following Scriptures:

“And I saw an angel standing in the sun, who cried in a loud voice to all the birds flying in midair, “Come, gather together for the great supper of God, so that you may eat the flesh of kings, generals, and the mighty, of horses and their riders, and the flesh of all people, free and slave, great and small.”

“The rest were killed with the sword coming out of the mouth of the rider on the horse, and all the birds gorged themselves on their flesh.”

So you see, the wedding feast cannot possibly be the event of the supper of the great God mentioned, for one is a blessing for the faithful and the other is death for those who will gather to make war against the Lamb and his army, that army being us on white horses wearing white clothing, fine and clean. Here’s the scenario when Jesus returns to end the age as recorded in Rev.19 – 22

The rider on the white horse (Jesus) and his army descends to earth

An angel calls all birds to gather them together for the great supper

The Beast and false prophet are thown alive into the lake of fire.

All who are gathered at Armageddon killed with double-edged sword

Birds eat the flesh of those killed with the double-edged sword

Satan thrown into and restricted in the Abyss for a thousand years

Resurrection of the great tribulation saints

The thousand year reign of Christ begins

End of the thousand years

Satan is released from the Abyss.

Satan gathers Gog and Magog and surrounds Jerusalem

God kills those gathered with fire from heaven

Satan is thrown thrown into the lake of fire

The lost dead are resurrected out of death and Hades

This present heaven and earth pass away

The lost dead are judged at the great white throne

Death and Hades are thrown into the lake of fire

Anyone’s name not found written in the book of life are thown into the lake of fire.

Unfortunately, just based on reading so many others comments on erroneous doctrines here on this webpage and on my former webpage I used to have (which is not a reflection on Marianne or other sound and mature posters) I see many appear to have departed from the simplicity of the gospel and are embracing strange and unscriptural beliefs. They are already loving that “spirit of delusion” instead of embracing the Truth.Not all of course, but I see many are doing this.

It’s tragic to me. Men want to conform Jesus and His word into their own image instead of trusting scripture (He is the Word) and Jesus as “it is written”.

That’s not to say that there is a valid place for genuine questions, as we are all still learning and none has all the complete answers, because scripture is also revelatory in nature-some things remain to be seen prophetically played out on the world stage.

Questions are good. That’s how we learn. But many just want to argue their points and not practice walking in obedience or submission to God or each other….and no one is blessed or edified as a result.

I really think the door is soon closing on the truth via the internet and what we will have to rely upon is our own intimate relationship with Christ and our obedience to Him and His word -what He has born witness to in and thru us.

If what we are hearing is from Him, Jesus always confirms thru the Holy Spirit and His word. We can trust Him in all things. This is what I have learned.

I believe that there is a problem, which is getting worse and that is deviation from Scripture. We live in a time where the following is taking place:

“For the time will come when people will not put up with sound doctrine. Instead, to suit their own desires, they will gather around them a great number of teachers to say what their itching ears want to hear. They will turn their ears away from the truth and turn aside to myths.”

God gave us his word for a reason and that so we could know what his word says. True, some things take deeper study and God’s revelation, but his word is meant to be known. Therefore, those who study God’s word should be ready to:

“Preach the word; be prepared in season and out of season; correct, rebuke and encourage—with great patience and careful instruction.”

Because:

“All Scripture is God-breathed and is useful for teaching, rebuking, correcting and training in righteousness, so that the servant of God may be thoroughly equipped for every good work.”

The person who proclaims to know the word of God should be able to always back it up with Scripture. The problem is that today, you can’t even do that, because many no longer adhere to Scripture, but are following after the teachings of men. For example, if you listen to Rob Bell, then there is no Hell, because he got rid of it and that because “Love Wins” and he has a large following who are those who want teachers to say what their itching ears want to hear. Many people don’t like to hear about the doctrine of Hell and so a teacher who gets rid of it is the kind of teacher they’re satisfied with. If you listen to Hank Hennagraff, then the book of Revelation falls under the banner of hyperbole, that is, exaggerated and not to be taken literally. Imagine that, the Revelation of Jesus Christ, which God gave to him to show his servants what must soon take place, but according to Hank, what Revelation is saying is not what it means. An example of Hyperbole is: “I’m so hungry I could eat a horse.” This is how he claims that the book of Revelation is written.

We need to stand strong on Scripture, because many are teaching what they want instead of what Scripture says and the masses are following after them. As for me, I am not wishy washy when it comes to the word of God. I am zealous when it comes to contending for the truth and accuracy of God’s word. So, when I hear someone misinterpret something, I correct them and I always back it up with Scripture so that the person can read it for themselves.

The biggest problem that I see regarding prophecy todays is that, many apply a symbolic meaning where none is required. Furthermore, if they do correctly interpret something that is meant to be symbolic, then they don’t apply God’s provided meaning behind the symbolism, but they apply their own or what someone else has taught them. Very soon we will see who is who, that is, who truly belongs to Christ and that because before our gathering takes place, there is going to be a great falling away. If Paul’s apostasy (2 Thes.2:1-3) is the same falling away that Jesus spoke of found in Mt.24:9-10, then it will be a visible apostasy and that because of the threat of persecution and death for his name sake and the gospel. In any case, the time is coming when there is going to be a line drawn in the sand, so-to-speak.

In any case, when I see for example, something like what Allan posted regarding “the marriage supper of the Lamb” as being synonymous with the “The great supper of God,” then I’m going to contend and correct and that because there isn’t a shadow of a doubt from Scripture that shows that these two are different events. In fact, all one has to do is read the context of both and it will quickly become apparent that they are two different events.

Another example was I believe the post by Chris, who was claiming that the angel in chapter 10 of Revelation is representing Satan, when the context makes it perfectly clear that he is a holy angel of God and is speaking on his behalf. She is applying the Scripture that states:

“For such people are false apostles, deceitful workers, masquerading as apostles of Christ. 14And no wonder, for Satan himself masquerades as an angel of light. 15It is not surprising, then, if his servants also masquerade as servants of righteousness.”

So, she just haphazardly applies the above description to the angel in Revelation 10 and that because of his description. I’m just using these as examples from what has been posted and they may not seem important, but they are false interpretations non-the-less.

What do we do when someone teaches that the resurrection of Christ was spiritual and not bodily, do we entertain that possibility? No! We contend for the truth using Scripture to back up a bodily resurrection. As for me, I will continue to teach, train, correct, rebuke and contend for the truth of God’s word with in gentleness and love, but I will remain firm regarding the truth of Scripture.

Hi dmcal, I take your point and explanation, thank you. However, supposition is applied regarding the “marriage supper.” Maybe you are right, I just do not find it written in the Word. Regarding the “great apostasy or falling away.” For people to fall away they would have to be believers/Christians or nominal believers. Why do they fall away, I think you are right but also in the context of “no pre trib rapture.” Most Christians are set on a pre trib rapture. When we see either the “official signing of the peace accord” or the world leader on stage, or persecution in the West against Christians it maybe that many will fall away and become scoffers, “where is Jesus?” which means their trust in Jesus is gone/lost.

The seals, trumpets and bowl judgments are representing the destruction of the earth and mankind, which is the fulfillment of the day of the Lord prophesied by the prophets and given to us in detail in the book of Revelation. Peter recognized it when he said:

“But the day of the Lord will come like a thief. The heavens will disappear with a roar; the elements will be destroyed by fire, and the earth and everything done in it will be laid bare. Since everything will be destroyed in this way, what kind of people ought you to be? You ought to live holy and godly lives as you look forward to the day of God and speed its coming. That day will bring about the destruction of the heavens by fire, and the elements will melt in the heat. But in keeping with his promise we are looking forward to a new heaven and a new earth, where righteousness dwells.”

The seals, trumpets and bowls are also the fulfillment of God’s prophecy through Isaiah regarding that time of destruction:

“See, the day of the Lord is coming

—a cruel day, with wrath and fierce anger—

to make the land desolate and destroy the sinners within it.
The stars of heaven and their constellations will not show their light.
The rising sun will be darkened and the moon will not give its light.
I will punish the world for its evil, the wicked for their sins.
I will put an end to the arrogance of the haughty and will humble the pride of the ruthless. I will make people scarcer than pure gold, more rare than the gold of Ophir. Therefore I will make the heavens tremble; and the earth will shake from its place at the wrath of the Lord Almighty, in the day of his burning anger.”

This destruction is coming soon, for the day of the Lord is approaching quickly!

Had a question for you, do you feel the “day of the Lord” comes BEFORE the 1,000 year reign of Christ, or After the 1,000 year reign of Christ upon the earth?

I have heard various interpretations that some think that there is no literal 1,000 years of Christ as King, with the saints, upon the earth, but several scriptures contradict this.

For example, Isa 24:23 “Then the moon shall be confounded, and the sun ashamed, when the LORD of hosts shall reign in mount Zion, and in Jerusalem, and before his ancients gloriously. ”

And

Zec 14:16 ¶ And it shall come to pass, that every one that is left of all the nations which came against Jerusalem shall even go up from year to year to worship the King, the LORD of hosts, and to keep the feast of tabernacles.

14:17 And it shall be, that whoso will not come up of all the families of the earth unto Jerusalem to worship the King, the LORD of hosts, even upon them shall be no rain.

Jer 23:5 Behold, the days come, saith the LORD, that I will raise unto David a righteous Branch, and a King shall reign and prosper, and shall execute judgment and justice in the earth.

And

Rev 11:15 ¶ And the seventh angel sounded; and there were great voices in heaven, saying, The kingdoms of this world are become the kingdoms of our Lord, and of his Christ; and he shall reign for ever and ever.

And

Rev 20:6 Blessed and holy is he that hath part in the first resurrection: on such the second death hath no power, but they shall be priests of God and of Christ, and shall reign with him a thousand years.

P.S. I don’t see the whole 7 year tribulation period as being the “day of the Lord” but perhaps the “day of wrath” at the end of the tribulation (answering my own question-)

I guess the day of the Lord would then be before the 1,000 year reign of Christ, but if everything is burned up, destroyed, how then will there be an earth for Christ to reign upon with the saints for 1,000 years?

You could ask the same question regarding the fact that the oceans and lakes, rivers and fresh waters are going to be turned into literal blood. The cities of the nations will have collapsed from that worst earthquake to hit the earth as a result from the 7th bowl and the mountains and islands will be gone. Obviously, the Lord will be doing some clean up after all that. After all, if he spoke the sun, moon and stars into existence on the 4th day, I don’t think that it will be a problem for him to straighten things up after his wrath and that just by speaking his word. Scripture doesn’t say that, just my observation. After the thousand years are over, then Satan is thrown into the lake of fire where the beast and the false prophet will have been thrown a thousand years prior and then the great white throne judgment of the lost dead will take place (Rev.20:11-15), then chapter 21 and 22 are regarding eternity, where this current heaven and earth will have departed and the new heaven and new earth are created and the new Jerusalem comes down out of heaven from God.

By the way, “Day of Lord” or “Day of wrath,” they’re both the same period.

It shouldn’t be confusing once you understand that nothing is impossible for God. All he has to do is speak and it happens, so why the confusion about the world being a chaotic mess when he returns? He can simply speak and clean it up in a moment.

First, I think that you need to change your screen name to watchthelord (he, he). Thank you for your comment. Sorry if I seem a little harsh at times with my responses, but I am zealous to contend for the accuracy and truth of Scripture. So, I apologize if offend anyone.

You said:
“Had a question for you, do you feel the “day of the Lord” comes BEFORE the 1,000 year reign of Christ, or After the 1,000 year reign of Christ upon the earth?”

First of all, the day of the Lord is not a day, but a time period. That time period covers the time of God’s wrath as carried out by the seals, trumpets and bowl judgments. In the letter to the Philadelphia church, Jesus also refers to the day of the Lord as the “hour of trial,” which is also not an hour. According to the OT prophets, the day of the Lord was described thus:

“See, the day of the LORD is coming– a cruel day, with wrath and fierce anger– to make the land desolate and destroy the sinners within it.” (Isa.13:9)

In the letter to the Thessalonians, Paul reveals another feature of the day of the Lord previously not known, which is the resurrection and the catching away. If you’ll notice in 1 Thes.4:13 -18 Paul describes the event of the resurrection and catching away and then in chapter 5:1 he refers back to that same event saying “Now, brothers and sisters, about times and dates we do not need to write to you, for you know very well that the day of the Lord will come like a thief in the night.” By doing so, he includes the resurrection and catching away as being apart of the day of the Lord; in fact our being gathered initiates it, which is then followed by wrath and the escapades of the beast and the false prophet.

So, in answer to your question, the day of the Lord begins with the resurrection and catching away of all believers dead and living, then when they say peace and safety, then destruction will come upon the inhabitants of the earth. The day of the Lord is made up of the resurrection and catching away, the seals, trumpets and bowl judgments, which is the wrath of God and includes the event of Armageddon, which is depicted in Rev.19:11-21. I don’t know if the day of the Lord extends beyond that.

You said:
“I have heard various interpretations that some think that there is no literal 1,000 years of Christ as King, with the saints, upon the earth, but several scriptures contradict this.

For example, Isa 24:23 “Then the moon shall be confounded, and the sun ashamed, when the LORD of hosts shall reign in mount Zion, and in Jerusalem, and before his ancients gloriously. ”

First of all, there is definitely going to be a thousand year reign of Christ after he returns to end the age, which will be sometime shortly after the 7th bowl has been poured out which is identified by the voice from the throne which says, “It is done! This brings God’s wrath to an end. Isa.24:23 does not contradict a thousand year reign. All that it is stating is that after the event of the sun, moon and stars takes place, then sometime after, the Lord will reign on earth. The Scripture does not state that the Lord will be reigning on earth when the event of the sun, moon and stars takes place. As proof of this, right after the 6th bowl is poured out, which is after the event of the sun, moon and stars, Jesus interjects within the narrative and says:

““Look, I come like a thief! Blessed is the one who stays awake and remains clothed, so as not to go naked and be shamefully exposed.”

The above would show that at the pouring out of the 6th bowl judgment that the Lord hasn’t returned yet.

Furthermore, there are many references to the thousand years for it not to be a literal thousand years:

“He seized the dragon, that ancient serpent, who is the devil, or Satan, and bound him for a thousand years.” (Rev.20:2)

“He threw him into the Abyss, and locked and sealed it over him, to keep him from deceiving the nations anymore until the thousand years were ended. After that, he must be set free for a short time.”
(Rev.20:3)

“They had not worshiped the beast or its image and had not received its mark on their foreheads or their hands. They came to life and reigned with Christ a thousand years. (The rest of the dead did not come to life until the thousand years were ended.) (Rev.20:4-5)

“When the thousand years are over, Satan will be released from his prison” (Rev.20:7)

At some point, the prophecy of Christ reigning on the seat of David on earth has to be fulfilled and this will take place during the millennium. The thousand years begins after the Lord returns to end the age, as shown in Mt.24:30-31 and Rev.1:7, 19:11-21.

You said:
“Zec 14:16 ¶ And it shall come to pass, that every one that is left of all the nations which came against Jerusalem shall even go up from year to year to worship the King, the LORD of hosts, and to keep the feast of tabernacles”

The above Scripture is prophecy regarding the thousand year reign of Christ. Below are some other prophecy’s regarding that thousand year reign:

“Never again will there be in it an infant who lives but a few days, or an old man who does not live out his years; the one who dies at a hundred will be thought a mere child; the one who fails to reach a hundred will be considered accursed.”

“If any of the peoples of the earth do not go up to Jerusalem to worship the King, the Lord Almighty, they will have no rain.” (Zech.14:17)

“The wolf will live with the lamb, the leopard will lie down with the goat, the calf and the lion and the yearling together; and a little child will lead them.The cow will feed with the bear, their young will lie down together, and the lion will eat straw like the ox. (Isa.11:6-7)

“The infant will play near the cobra’s den, and the young child will put its hand into the viper’s nest. They will neither harm nor destroy on all my holy mountain, for the earth will be filled with the knowledge of the Lord as the waters cover the sea.” (Isa.11:8-9)

“He will judge between the nations and will settle disputes for many peoples. They will beat their swords into plowshares and their spears into pruning hooks. Nation will not take up sword against nation, nor will they train for war anymore. (Isa.2:4)

The Scriptures above are all in reference to the thousand year reign of Christ. The first tells us that longevity of life will be restored during the millennium just as it was before the flood.

The second one is a warning of no rain to any nation during Christ’s millennial reign, who doesn’t come up to worship once a year at Jerusalem.

The third one shows that the ferocity of animals will be removed during that thousand years, for when have you ever seen where a lamb can live with a wolf and a calf with a lion or a cow with a bear. And where have we ever seen a lion eating straw like an Ox? That would be, never!

Regarding the 4th Scripture, when have we ever in the history of man seen people beat their swords into plowshares and their spears into pruning hooks and where there no more war? That would be, never!

All of the above will be the characteristics during Christ’s thousand year reign. My advise to you is that, when people tell you things like there is no literal thousand year reign, be like the Berean’s of whom Paul said where more noble than the Thessalonians because they searched the Scriptures daily to see if what Paul was teaching them was true. If it says that there is a thousand years reign of Christ, then there will be one and it will begin after he returns to end the age.

You said:
“Rev 20:6 Blessed and holy is he that hath part in the first resurrection: on such the second death hath no power, but they shall be priests of God and of Christ, and shall reign with him a thousand years.

“and shall reign with him a thousand years”

Those who are mentioned above as taking part in the first resurrection, will be those great tribulation saints that John saw in his vision in Rev.7:9-17 and are also the same group whom the beast is given power to make war against and to conquer as recorded in Rev.13:7.

This group that comes to life after Christ returns to the earth to end the age are those great tribulation saints who will have died during the great tribulation while keeping the testimony of Jesus and the word of God and who will not have worshipped the beast, his image nor will they have received his mark. They are part of the first resurrection of which there are phases. Jesus being the first fruits of the first resurrection, then the resurrection and catching away of all believers in Christ will take place, the dead and iving (which is what we are watching for), next will be that male child, which is a collective name for the 144,000 who come out of Israel (The woman gives birth to) and who will be caught up to God’s throne. Then the two witnesses will be killed and resurrected, then finally the great tribulation saints will be resurrected after Jesus returns to the earth, where they and we will all reign with him for that thousand years.

The first resurrection is made up of any resurrection or catching away that takes place prior to the end of the thousand years. Anyone who takes part in that resurrection, the second death, which is the lake of fire (Hell), holds no power over them. Of those of whom it says that, “The rest of the dead did not come to life until after the thousand years were over” is because those people are the unjustified, the lost dead, which come out of death and Hades, of which the second death has power over and that because they will not be taking part in the first resurrection, which will have taken place a thousand years or so prior.

To put it simply, the resurrection that takes place at the end of the thousand years is not a good one, for they will be coming out of Hades (Remember the rich man). If death and Hades are being thrown into the lake of fire, then what will become of those who come out of them?

Dmcal, thank you for your response. My name is watchthebeast because that is what I was told to do- in other words, be aware of the beast 🙂 (not put my head in the sand)

But I endeavor to have my eyes on the Lord. Glad you believe in a literal 1,000 year reign of Christ upon the earth. I do too. I know several who do not, which I find puzzling.

Anyway,

So, I take it you look at the whole tribulation time period as “the day of the Lord”? The seven years. Is that correct?

And I am guessing you believe in a pretrib rapture?

Me, I am inclined to see just the “wrath” is at the end of the tribulation time period, and perhaps that is the “day of the Lord” So I believe we will be here during the tribulation but not during the “wrath” being poured out upon the unrepentant, as we are not appointed unto wrath.

So that would make me post trib, but pre wrath, if that makes sense.

Mainly this part of the quote you quoted earlier from Peter is what was confusing me:

““But the day of the Lord will come like a thief. The heavens will disappear with a roar; the elements will be destroyed by fire, and the earth and everything done in it will be laid bare. Since everything will be destroyed in this way, what kind of people ought you to be? ”

Peter saying the heavens disappearing would seem to contradict that there would be a 1,000 year reign of Christ to go thru. But perhaps Peter meant something else when he said “the day of the Lord”

You said:
“Me, I am inclined to see just the “wrath” is at the end of the tribulation time period, ”

Though the end of the tribulation period is also part of the wrath, the seals, trumpets and bowl judgments are also God’s wrath and are in fact referred to as wrath, as can be seen from the following:

6th Seal:
“They called to the mountains and the rocks, “Fall on us and hide usf from the face of him who sits on the throne and from the wrath of the Lamb! For the great day of their wrath has come, and who can withstand it?”

7th Trumpet:
““We give thanks to you, Lord God Almighty, the One who is and who was, because you have taken your great power and have begun to reign. The nations were angry, and your wrath has come.

Seven Bowls:
“I saw in heaven another great and marvelous sign: seven angels with the seven last plagues—last, because with them God’s wrath is completed:”

“Then I heard a loud voice from the temple saying to the seven angels, “Go, pour out the seven bowls of God’s wrath on the earth.”

So, from the above, you can see that the seals, trumpets and bowl judgments are all referred to as God’s wrath, which we who are believers are not appointed to suffer. The tribulation that the saints and the inhabitants of the earth will suffer will run concurrently with the seals, trumpets and bowls and therefore, you cannot separate the two. In fact, the entire seven years falls under the banner of God’s wrath, but it is only poured out on those who rejected Christ. Those great tribulation saints will be those who will have become believers after the resurrection and catching away has taken place and therefore, they will be caught in that time period and that because they were not ready when the resurrection and catching away occurs.

dmcal52 – you said
A good rule of thumb is that if the Scripture starts off with the literal, then it is not going to be mixed, that is, some literal and some symbolic. Another example would be:

Answer: A. The Spirit reveals the symbolic meaning of thousands of Scripture in the Bible. Symbols are necessary in all languages I would Imagine. Quicker way to understand something. You get a picture in your mind and it becomes real and alive. A picture is better than a 1,000 words they say.

Answer – The Spirit was first in God before he ever made Adam’s literal flesh body. The Spirit was put in him by God making Adam a Spirit in Flesh. = Son of God.
A. without the Spirit their is NO LIFE in the Word of God. St. John 1:1-3
In the Beginning was the Word and the Word is Spirit. Its God.
St. Jh 6:63 and God means Spirit. The “words” I speak unto you are “Spirit and Life.”

The “Spirit Word” created the literal world. By words that are spiritual.
Heb 11:1-3 The things invisible by faith=revelation are more sure than things seen.
Elijah looked up and seen the “Real Eternal Kingdom” in the Heavenlies and it was a “Spiritual world the Kingdom of God. But on the ground was the natural kingdom of satans eden. We need to know the difference amen.

There was a heavenly host of mankind in those clouds. = not literal clouds as we would say. But Spiritual clouds. God was the Pillar of FIRE and then their is manmade fire. Amen
The Son of God in Malachi 4 says “Sun of Righteousness” Its spiritual.
Even satans sons are spiritual beings. They just defy Gods word. And want to be their own mouthpiece for their god satan. Their are 2 creations on earth. Gods Spiritual creation of mankind the Kingdom of God. And then their is “satan’s creation” by refusing to do it Gods way. A lie is just a perversion of the Truth. They both create something.

You Said – “The sun turned black like sackcloth made of goat hair, the whole moon turned blood red, and the stars in the sky fell to earth”
Answer – We all have went through the “whole thing” about the “moon, stars, sun” and most people just kept their own opinion when it was proved by many on this forum to be “both Spiritual and Natural”.

Example of this in my way of thinking is – Moses literally wrote the 5 books and yet Paul said it was “Spiritual”.
The O.T had to be “Discerned” by the Spirit to understand the N.T. So that said – if we cannot discern the Spiritual part from the Natural part we have a mess on our hands. And that’s what we got today. This is the Reason they killed Jesus as a liar, And the Jews was always trying to kill Apostle Paul. The Apostles and all were Spiritual men in a Natural minded world or satan’s religion.

Spiritual things happen first and then the literal follows.
Before a “Baby is Born” a Spirit has to be waiting on it to live in the Baby.
Before a Fish was made with a fin. God made the Ocean for them to
swim in. By His Spiritual life giving Word.
You said – the Whole bible was literal – It is to the unbeliever. They cannot see God in it at all. The world as a whole thinks the Bible is just Mans writings. Well they are right in one way. Its Gods writings. Done by Called and Elected Men. Surely you believe there are still God Called and Elected Men if their is a church on this planet. Amen

The Wedding Marriage and Supper is in Heavenly Places on Earth.
Just as the perfect type was Israel coming out of Egypt into the land of “MILK AND HONEY”. It was a Spiritual deliverance from the Slavery from Sin and Unbelief . Its a MESSAGE OF GOD SENT TO HIS PEOPLE. By Moses and all Prophets gave out the food to eat. In Rev. 10:7-11. The Mysteries are fulfilled and made known by Prophets. And the people were commanded to EAT THE BOOK. That is the Marriage supper of the Lamb. You will not need the Word when you already dead and gone into Heaven. Hello out their. We need it NOW to OVERCOME SATAN and all the deceiving spirits that is always at the END OF A AGE to deceive us — from the slavery of the World philosophies and false ideas and culture.

Revelation 10-7 through 10
The angel of Rev 10 is Satan coming as an angel of light with another gospel of the kingdom… 2 Corinthians 11-14, 4..His appearance denotes the return of Jesus, coming in the clouds,,his face as the sun, and his rainbow of peace..
The little opened book is the gospel of Satan of 2 Corinthians 11-4,14..He is claiming the entire earth and sea in Verse…as did Mohammed ..
Matthew 23-15…Woe unto you, scribes and Pharisees, hypocrites! For ye compass sea and land to make one proselyte, and when he is made, ye make him twofold more the child of hell than yourselves….This angel that proselytizes sea and earth with his little book are the cause of second death..V. 3 This angel roars as a lion as does Satan….1 Peter 5-8..Be sober, be vigilant; because your adversary the devil, as a roaring lion, walketh about, seeking whom he may devour
V. 3 seven thunders accompany this angel… I am pretty sure these are Satan and his seven demons, aka the beast /seven heads…:
This angel declares the end of time in verse 9…. Whereas Jesus said the son and the angels of heaven do not know the time…
The little book that John eats appears to be words of God aka sweet as honey in his mouth,, but these make his belly bitter… Which means those that ingest this gospel of Satan become demonized..

Numbers 5-222, 23, 24.. And this water that causeth the curse shall go into thy bowels, to make thy belly to swell, and thy thigh to rot: And the woman shall say, Amen, amen. .And the priest shall write these curses in a book, and he shall blot them out with the bitter water: And he shall cause the woman to drink the bitter water that causeth the curse: and the water that causeth the curse shall enter into her, and become bitter.

Rev 10-11..God commands John to prophesy again to many…He prophesies against this angel of light with his sweet bitter gospel that desolates men…

It is a possibility John represents one of the witness of Revelation 11 that witness against the seven headed dragon Islamic beast..

The two witness are two of the churches (candlesticks) of Rev. 1-20 but God sometimes tells us in the singular to make is simple to understand and sometimes to hide the mysteries…

You said:
“Revelation 10-7 through 10
The angel of Rev 10 is Satan coming as an angel of light with another gospel of the kingdom… ”

Rebut:
Satan is not even mentioned in chapter 10 anywhere, either by name or description. The angel that John sees, that angel robed in a cloud, with a rainbow above his head; with his face shining like the sun, is a mighty, holy angel of God who is giving information to John regarding that there will be no more delay before the 7th trumpet is sounded and about the little scroll. This is a holy angel, not a fallen one, as he is speaking on behalf of God. We know this to be true because this angel swears by him who lives for ever and ever and Satan would never make such a confession about God.

You said:
“The little opened book is the gospel of Satan of 2 Corinthians 11-4,14..He is claiming the entire earth and sea in Verse…as did Mohammed ..”

Rebut:
The little scroll that the angel is holding represents the information that we are reading in the book of revelation. As proof of this the angel tells John to eat the scroll (word as food) and then he tells John that he must prophecy again (with the words in the scroll) about many peoples, nations, languages and kings. So, the little scroll contains the word of God that John is going to be prophesying about.

You said:
“V. 3 seven thunders accompany this angel… I am pretty sure these are Satan and his seven demons, aka the beast /seven heads”

Rebut:
What the seven thunders spoke is information that God, for whatever reason, did not want us to know, which is why the voice from heaven told John not to write what they said. Chapter 10 has nothing to do with Satan at all.

You said:
“It is a possibility John represents one of the witness of Revelation 11 that witness against the seven headed dragon Islamic beast..”

Rebut:
The two witnesses of chapter 11 are yet future, as well as all that they will be performing. John cannot be one of them, for he died and will be resurrected when the Lord meets us in the air to gather the dead and living in believers to himself. The two witnesses could be two men who have never died a physical death, which would be Enoch and Elijah. Other than that, we have no idea who they are, but I’m sure that one of them is not the Apostle John.

You said:
“The two witness are two of the churches (candlesticks) of Rev. 1- but God sometimes tells us in the singular to make is simple to understand and sometimes to hide the mysteries…”

Rebut:
The two witnesses are two actual men who be here on earth with power to strike the earth with whatever plagues they want to and as many times as they want to. The beast who comes up out of the Abyss will kill them at the end of their 3 1/2 years of prophecy and will leave their dead bodies in the street of Jerusalem for 3 1/2 days, where at which time they will resurrect and ascend back into heaven, just exactly as the Scripture states. There is no reason to apply symbolism to this.

God did not send angels to preach the Gospel, of Christ… The only angel that preached a gsopel is satan…2 Corinthians 11- 4,14…Satan comes as an angel of light with another gospel. that teaches another Jesus and another spirit of god… aka mohammed and koran…..

As for the angel in Revelation 10 it and chapter 11 are of the woes….

The bible speaks of another angel flying at noon (midst of heaven means noon) with what he says is the everlasting gospel…Rev 14-7…This gospel is more than likely the cursed book that flies all over the earth and is a curse to man…The word curse is spelled ALAH in Hebrew… God shows that this book is about alah… and is a curse…

You are free to believe anything you want, but ntobdy and I mean nobody understands God’s word unless it is revealed to them..

“NASA Science News for Nov. 15, 2013
On Nov. 18-19, two comets (ISON and Encke) are going to fly by the planet Mercury in quick succession. NASA’s MESSENGER spacecraft will have a front-row seat for the rare double encounter.”

This is a perfect example of circumventing the word of God. The verse states that the feast is in the kingdom of heaven or my Father’s kingdom, which can only be referring to the literal heaven above, but then you and others come along and distort the word by interpreting the kingdom of heaven as being on the earth, which is a contradiction of terms and is done because it doesn’t support your interpretation. Why do you people continue to distort the word of God? Why can’t you except what is being said as referring to the literal kingdom of God in heaven instead of symbolizing it in order to fit your interpretation. The kingdom of God or the Father’s kingdom is in heaven not on earth. It’s no wonder why there are so many interpretations of Scripture and that because with your type of interpretation a person can make Scripture say whatever they want.

Here’s another question regarding the above: how would you ever know when Jesus was talking about the heavenly realm, if when he says it, you interpret it as being here on earth? How about, the kingdom of heaven and my Father’s kingdom equals the literal kingdom of heaven.

“My [Father’s house] has many rooms; if that were not so, would I have told you that I am going there to prepare a place for you? And if I go and prepare a place for you, I will [come back] and take you to be with me that you also may be where I am. You know the way to the place where I am going.”

In the Scripture above, Jesus mentions his Father’s house and that he is going there to prepare a place for us. Furthermore, Jesus says that he is coming back to take us with him, that is, to his Father’s house, so that where Jesus is all believers can be also. So, are you also going to also try to interpret the Father’s house as being on the earth as well or just as Scripture suggests, which is referring to heaven? Therefore, when Jesus says that he will not drink from fruit of the vine until he drinks in anew with us in his Father’s house, he is referring to heaven, not earth. The wedding supper is going to be a literal feast, with literal food and drink. There is no reason to symbolize these things.

A good rule of thumb is, If the literal sense makes good sense, then don’t seek any other sense. Stop symbolizing what is meant to be literal.

Why has no one ever considered that the 1000 reign is the same 1000 years that satan is locked in the pit…
As Rev 19-9..
And he saith unto me, Write, Blessed are they which are called unto the marriage supper of the Lamb. And he saith unto me, These are the true sayings of God.
God has always fed his children spirtual truth, why would he stop. doing it at the marriage supper……

Why would you assume that nobody has considered that Christ’s reign and Satan being locked up in the Abyss are the same thousand years? I’m pretty sure that everyone on this site knows that the thousand year time period is synonymous with Christ’s reign and Satan’s imprisonment.

dmcal52…
Revelation 20-2, 3…And he laid hold on the dragon, that old serpent, which is the Devil, and Satan, and bound him a thousand years, And cast him into the bottomless pit, and shut him up, and set a seal upon him, that he should deceive the nations no more, till the thousand years should be fulfilled: and AFTER that he must be loosed a little season. ……

Mohammed knew he would return AFTER 1000 years to deceive the world again..
Koran..
.[20.102] On the day when the TRUMPET shall be blown, and We will gather the guilty, blue-eyed, on that day
[20.103] They shall consult together secretly: You did tarry but ten (centuries).
[20.104] We know best what they say, when the fairest of them in course would say: You tarried but a day.(a day is as 1000 years.)

So is this the return of Jesus or satan with his little gospel…

I think Mohammed/Satan indwelled all the imams and the 1000 years began after the last imam became silent….which means his return occurred after the mid 1900s…

First of all, the Scripture above is speaking of the literal being of Satan once called Lucifer and is not symbolic for Mohammed. Does Mohammed lead the whole world astray? No, that would be the real fallen angel, Satan who does that, as well the fallen angels with him. As I said to Tom, when you symbolize or spiritualize Scripture that is meant to be interpreted literally, then you lose the true meaning.

Regarding the verse of Rev.20:2-3, Satan is literally going to be thrown into the Abyss and restricted there during Christ’s thousand year reign just as the Scripture states. To symbolize Satan as being Mohammed is to err and distorts the true meaning of the Scripture.

The phrase “that anceint serpent called the devil, or Satan, who leads the whole world astray” is to convey to the reader that this is none other than that ancient serpent, the devil who was in the garden of Eden, the one who tempted Eve. Satan who used to be Lucifer is the one who leads the whole world astray, not Mohammed. The literal fallen angel callled Satan or the devil with his angels, will be those who will fight against Micheal the archangel and his angels after the 7th trumpet is blown.

Trumpets 5, 6 and 7 are described as 3 woes and take place in sequencial order meaning 5th trumpet/first woe takes place first, which is then followed by the 6th trumpet/second woe, which followed by the 7th trumpet/third woe. Now that being said, you cannot have the 7th trumpet/third woe taking place prior to trumpets 5 and 6. The 5th trumpet/first woe are demonic beings being let out of the Abyss to torment mankind for 5 months with the stings like that of a scorpion. At the blowing of the 6th trumpet/second woe a third of the inhabitants of the earth are killed by the fire, smoke and sulfer that comes out of the mouths of those demonic beings that the four angels will have gathered together. Now my point is this, since we have no record, historical, biblical or otherwise of either of these two events taking place, then neither can you have fulfillment of the 7th trumpet/thrid woe and therefore, the war in heaven betweem Michael and Satan has not yet taken place. I’m pretty sure that the world would have taken notice of those events. That is of course unless you, like Tom, are going to change the meaning by symbolizing or spiritualizing those events. In that case you can make anything in Scripture mean anything that you want.

If the literal sense makes good sense, then don’t seek any other sense.

dmcal, do you know who or what the beast of Rev 13 is????
i will give you a hint.. It is a counterfeit of the kingdom of God…
The dragon and seven heads counterfeit of God’s spirit…The first beast who is indwelled by satan and his seven demons is a counterfeit of Jesus messiah…He is satan in flesh…
The earth beast are those Christians who were the tares but have been removed from the church…Hence these HAD two horns like a lamb but speak like the dragon..
This counterfeit of God’s kingdom blaspheme God and the bible and God’s people.. They overcome some of them, namelly the tares and more….They kill by beheading…
One more little clue…How could lucifer claim to be god except by claiming he is the god of abraham….

You said:
“One more thing…The sword is the word of God…Jesus kills the enmies with the sword… aka truth…”

You got that one right. The double-edged sword is symbolic for the word of God. So basically, that double-edged sword that procedes from the Lord’s mouth will be the spoken word of God which kills all of those people gathered at Amageddon. Here are the Scriptures showing the sword as the word:

“Take the helmet of salvation and the sword of the Spirit, which is the word of God.” (Eph.6:17)

“For the word of God is alive and active. Sharper than any double-edged sword, it penetrates even to dividing soul and spirit, joints and marrow; it judges the thoughts and attitudes of the heart.” (Heb.4:12)

Dear Bro. dmcal52 – God bless you and hope you enjoy this and get something out of it. Is my prayer. I will work on the ” Feast ” next.

THE “KINGDOM OF GOD IS NOW!” IN YOU
Note that Kingdom of God and Heaven is the same thing

MATT. 3:1-2 ¶ In those days came John the Baptist, preaching in the wilderness of Judaea, 2. and saying, Repent ye: for the “KINGDOM OF HEAVEN” is “AT HAND “.
MATT. 4:23-24 And Jesus went about all Galilee, teaching in their synagogues, and preaching the “GOSPEL OF THE KINGDOM “, and healing all manner of sickness and all manner of disease among the people.
24. And his fame went throughout all Syria: and they brought unto him all sick people that were taken with divers diseases and torments, and those which were possessed with devils, and those which were lunatick, and those that had the palsy; and he healed them. – “The Gospel is from Heaven – That is why it transforms bodies and minds and hearts on earth. Heaven is a place of Healing and transforming lives to the better.

2. MATT. 6:33 – But “seek ye first” the “kingdom of God“, and “HIS” righteousness; and all these things shall be added unto you.
a. Why seek ye first – That’s NOW – not in future somewhere. Proves Kingdom of heaven is NOT after you die. But found on earth in Jesus.
b. Why did Jesus call the Kingdom of God – “HIS” RIGHTEOUSNESS
c. The Kingdom of God is “within you” when you receive HIM = Jesus as your Savior and Filled with the Power of the Holy Ghost Spirit. Transforms you on “earth” just like it did the Apostles and Prophets.

3. LUKE 16:16 – The law and the prophets were until John: SINCE THAT TIME the KINGDOM OF GOD is preached, and EVERY MAN “presseth into it“.
a. If ‘every man” has to press into it. It must be on Earth NOW.
b. You will not have to “Press into it” after you are dead.

4. JOHN 11:25 – Jesus said unto her, “I AM” THE RESURRECTION, and the LIFE:=ZOE IS ETERNAL he that believeth in ME, though he were dead, yet shall he live:
a. “I AM” is Jesus Christ – He resurrects us – To Eternal life by the GOSPEL MESSAGE. “HIS LIFE is HEAVEN” on earth. Just the word ETERNAL has to be sought for and received. ON EARTH – satan’s life is not eternal. Eternal can only be HEAVEN OR THE KINGDOM of GOD = same thing

5. MATT. 12:28 – But if I cast out devils by the Spirit of God, then the KINGDOM OF GOD is COME UNTO YOU.
a. Acts 10:38 How God anointed Jesus of Nazareth with the Holy Ghost and with power: who went about doing good, and healing all that were oppressed of the devil; for God was with him.
b. Acts 10:44 – ¶ While Peter yet spake these words, the Holy Ghost fell on all them which “heard the word“.
c. Acts 11:1- And the apostles and brethren that were in Judaea heard that the Gentiles had also “received the word of God“.
Question; How do we get into the “Kingdom of God” or Heaven. By believing HIS HEAVENLY WORD – GOD and HIS WORD is the SUPERNATURAL POWER EVEN living in this Worlds dimension’s which is the lower heaven and hell .
d. Acts 10:47 Can any man forbid water, that these should not be baptized, which have received the “Holy Ghost” as well as we?
When we understand that the HOLY GHOST is HEAVEN AS WELL. Its God come into you AFTER His death, burial, and resurrection. Gods name is the “Word of God”.

6. MATT. 21:43 Therefore say I unto you, The “kingdom of God” shall be TAKEN FROM YOU, and given to a NATION bringing forth the fruits thereof.
a. If the Kingdom of God was “taken from nation of Israel” it would became desolate and dead. Jesus is “plainly Speaking that Israel WAS IN the Kingdom of God” till they rejected their own Messiah and that was their “unpardonable sin” for that age. 70 Ad proves it to be. Taken from “You” was “men on earth.” – To men on Earth is where the Kingdom of God is Preached. And Mankind is Supernaturally translated into the Kingdom of God. God is Heaven – He is the Holy Spirit. Praise God

7. ROM. 14:17- For the “kingdom of God” is not meat and drink; but “righteousness, and peace“, and “joy in the Holy Ghost“. = New birth
a. Literally spoken – spiritually has to be experienced.

8. MARK 9:1 And he said unto them, Verily I say unto you, That there be some of them that stand here, which shall NOT TASTE OF DEATH, “till they have SEEN THE KINGDOM OF GOD COME IN POWER “.
a.There were 120 people in the Upper Room that Experienced the Kingdom of God in the Person of Jesus Christ. He lives in us NOW and that brings HIS Kingdom into us NOW – not in the future.

“NEXT PORTION” IS DEFINING the WORDS FOR YOU IN GREEK
“HEAVEN defined in greek“.
“3772” perhaps from the same as 3735 (through the idea of elevation); the sky;
1. heaven — air — sky — heavenly +
2. the vaulted expanse of the sky with all things visible in it
3. the aerial heavens or sky, the region where the clouds and the tempests gather, and where “thunder and lightning” are produced=heavenly places
4. THE SEAT OF ORDER of things eternal and consummately perfect where God dwells and other heavenly beings
5. Where does GOD DWELL – Answer – IN YOU -we are the thunder and lightning thundering out the Message of the Gospel to a lost world. We are the light of this world NOW. We are the worlds only hope.
“3735“{or’-os} (to rise or “rear”, perhaps akin to 142, compare 3733);
AV — mountain — mount — hill (3) [65]
1 a proverbial phrase, used by rabbinic writing, to remove mountains, i.e. to accomplish the most difficult, stupendous, incredible Power of a thing

142 airo a primary root; — take up — take away — away with – lift up — bear
1. to raise up, elevate, lift up
2. to take upon one’s self and carry what has been raised up
3. to bear away what has been raised, carry off
THE ABOVE IS YOUR NEW BIRTH AND RAPTURE-INTO THE AIR
While living on this Planet Earth.

EPH. 1:3 Blessed be the God and Father of our Lord Jesus Christ, who HATH blessed us with all “spiritual blessings in HEAVENLY places in Christ“: == Notice HATH past tense – The Holy Spirit lives IN ME on Earth right NOW. I’m not waiting for the future to be Blessed and Powerful, and Holy etc. The Holy Ghost lives in ME. His will be done in Earth as it is in HEAVEN. NOW – Every Believer is “NOW PERFECT” in the Eyes of God. He lives in us. He cannot hate himself.
Check out this below – its powerful. Paul said we in Heavenly

“Heavenly defined” 2032 {ep-oo-ran’-ee-os} from 1909 and 3772;
1. Heavenly –CELESTIAL –IN HEAVEN–existing IN HEAVEN -WOW!
2. things that take place in heaven– 1b) the heavenly regions,
3. heaven itself, the abode of God and angels, the lower heavens or the heavens of the clouds
3.) the heavenly temple or sanctuary.
4.) of heavenly origin or nature –

1.So where is Gods abode – In his temple – The Bride =singular of The Son of David having many wives. Praise God – Rev. 21:9-22 and I saw no Temple therein. For the Lord God Almighty and the Lamb are the temple of it. Question is – are we in the Lamb and the Lamb in us.
2. Then you are the Temple of God. The Lively stones right NOW.
Your new Creation is heavenly – God does not dwell in buildings made by men but in New Creations not made with hands. OH DO YOU SEE IT
So where does God dwell now. In HIS BRIDE Temples IN HIS SUBJECTS – AMEN. If Christ had not RISEN then I would not be saying these things. I would be a liar. If He has RISEN then I have ALSO RISEN into the HEAVENLIES WITH HIM. HE IS A HEAVENLY BEING NOW IN the HOLY GHOST. That was Gods Plan before the foundation of the world was ever laid and before HE ever made mankind. He knew He had to be the Kinsmen Redeemer to save his Creation. Thank you Jesus Christ the only God forever.

THIS IS OUR POSITION RIGHT HERE ON THIS PLANET – NOT IN THE SWEET BYE AND BYE OR IN THE FUTURE SOMEWHERE
1. We are Celestial beings NOW right on this planet if you have the HOLY GHOST IN YOU- I am also an angel – a messenger of the Gospel. I cause a lot of sparks and lightning and thunder with the Gospel Message I teach. Just like Jesus and John and all His followers of the 1st century and on.
How many on this forum believe you have the “Celestial man” living IN YOU NOW.

Hi Tom and thank you for all that you posted. Without going into details and posting Scripture, the phrase “the kingdom of God is within you” meaning that Jesus is among us and through faith of the heart we can obtain salvation which grants us access to the true, literal kingdom of God. There are too many verses of Scripture to show that there is a literal heavenly kingdom.

In John 14:1-3, Jesus said, “In my Father’s house are many rooms” and then he told his disciples that he was going to prepare a place for them there, that is, in the Father’s house and what he said to his disciples is meant for all believers. The Father’s house can be nowhere but heaven, therefore when he left he began to prepare rooms for us in heaven. Then the Lord says, “I will come back and take you to be with me so that you may be where I am.” Well, where Jesus was going to be was obviously not on earth and that because he was already on earth when he was speaking to them and therefore, where he was going was to the Father’s house in heaven where he has rooms prepared for us.

Some time soon, the Lord is going to descend from heaven and the dead are going to rise and the living in Chirst will be changed in a moment and be caught up with them in the clouds and then Jesus will take us back to the Father’s house (in heaven) just as he promised, which is also where the marriage feast will take place (John 14:1-3, 1 Thes.4:13-18, 1 Cor.15:50-53). At the end of that seven years, sometime after the 7th bowl judgment has been poured out, then the Lord will descend from heaven on a white horse and we following behind him also riding on white horses, where the beast and the kings of the earth will make war against the Lord and us and will be killed by that double-edged sword (Rev.19:11-21).

The Scriptures that you listed do not do away with a literal kingdom of God, which seems to be what you are inferring. When the Lord says that many will come from the east and the west, and will take their places at the feast with Abraham, Isaac and Jacob in the kingdom of heaven, he means exactly that, the literal kingdom of God in the heavenly realms and not a symbolic meaning for the kingdom of heaven here on earth. The Lord’s appearing and our being gathered to him in the air to go back to the Father’s house is what all believers should be anticipating and looking foreward to.

You said:
“So where is Gods abode – In his temple – The Bride =singular of The Son of David having many wives. Praise God – Rev. 21:9-22 and I saw no Temple therein. For the Lord God Almighty and the Lamb are the temple of it. Question is ”

This Scripture in Rev.21:9-22 that you quoted, takes place after this current heaven and earth have passed away and the new heaven and new earth have been created, as well as the New Jerusalem, which comes down out of heaven. John here is giving a description of the New Jerusalem and it is there that he says that he sees no temple in the New Jerusalem, not here. Everything that John was describing is related to internity in the new heaven, new earth and new Jerusalem. To prove that John is not referring to things pertaining to this present earth, he also says that will be no more sea, no more sun or moon and therefore we know that he is not referring to this present heaven and earth, but the those in eternity.

To my friend.
Here’s another question regarding the above: how would you ever know when Jesus was talking about the heavenly realm, if when he says it, you interpret it as being here on earth? How about, the kingdom of heaven and my Father’s kingdom equals the literal kingdom of heaven

Dear Brother. Your Holy Spirit in you is YOUR GUIDE. To all truth. Truth has to be sought after just like Salvation means a lifetime living for Jesus. You will know the Truth by REVELATION which comes from the WORD OF GOD. And then you will never question it again. You will know it is absolutely the TRUTH.

Their is a Literal Kingdom dear brother. It is IN YOU. It Brought you LIFE and Joy, and Peace and Healing, and a Soul Change, and a Mind change. It literally happens to you when the Spirit gets in you and you let if flow and do not resist it.
The Gospel of the Kingdom will cast out the devils in our lives. But you have to pray and listen to the VOICE of God inside your Heart and Mind. Thats why we have to stay in the Spirit and Word in these days. This age has more demons cause it is the Fullness of Times and that is when Jesus was in His Generation. It was the fullness of times. We are crossing over a major world ending experience. We have to be watching and praying always. The Earth has been bombarded by demons in this age. Crossing over the Eurphrates. The Middle east has never been the way it is now. Because of Demons flooding it. And ALL nations. We in a Battle . But you will make it through brother. No Devil can take if from you.

Gotta go. Lord bless you . And I do recognize you in the picture. And I love you brother whether you believe like me or not. You are hungry for the Word and so am I. I’m sorry if I hurt your feelings. We need all the Brothers we can get these days.

By the way, the above was rhetorical. My point was, if you are always spiritualizing and symbolizing everything, how would you personally ever know when Scripture is speaking to you of literal things? By doing this, you miss the true meaning of Scripture. You are correct in that the Holy Spirit is my guide, but he is not leading me to the interpretation of Scripture that you are claiming.

You said:
“Their is a Literal Kingdom dear brother. It is IN YOU.”

There is also a literal heavenly kingdom where God and his angels dwell which is not in this realm and which is hidden from our view. Stop being one sided in your interpretation, because you are missing the big picture.

“After this I looked, and there before me was a door standing open in heaven.” (Rev.4:1)

Seeing as how you spiritualize and symbolize everthing, I suppose that since you claim that heaven is only within us, then the door that is open in heaven in the Scripture above would have to be the door of our hearts, correct? But that would also be a false interpretation as well and that because the context supports John going up into the literal heavenly realm where he see’s God’s throne, the four living beings and the myriad of angels that dwell there.

With all due respect, you have no idea what you are talking about. Furthermore, with all that you have posted, you do not support the word of God, but you distort it just like so many are doing in these last days. You say that we are already Celestial, then explain the following:

“Jesus replied, “You are in error because you do not know the Scriptures or the power of God. At the resurrection people will neither marry nor be given in marriage; they will be like the angels in heaven.”

Notice that Jesus says that “at the resurrection” which is a literal rising of the dead and living to meet the Lord in the air and when it takes place we will BECOME like the angels of heaven, meaning that the celestial has yet to take place. When the resurrection takes place, this mortal must put on immortality, this body that was sown in discrace will be raised a glorified body and this body that was sown in weakness will be raised in power (1 Cor.15:42). Your mistake is that you symbolize Scriptures that are meant to be understood literally and by doing this they lose their meanings. You need to learn to discern between literal from symbolic in Scripture, which seems to be one of the the biggest problems in these last days .

You said:
“Regarding the “great apostasy or falling away.” For people to fall away they would have to be believers/Christians or nominal believers.”

Regarding this Apostasy Paul wrote:

“Concerning the coming of our Lord Jesus Christ and our being gathered to him, we ask you, brothers and sisters, not to become easily unsettled or alarmed by the teaching allegedly from us—whether by a prophecy or by word of mouth or by letter—asserting that the day of the Lord has already come. Don’t let anyone deceive you in any way, for that day will not come until the rebellion occurs ..”

The coming of our Lord and our being gathered to him is referring to his descending and the resurrection and catching away of believers described in 1 Thes.4:13-18. Therefore, according to the above Scripture, there must be a falling away prior to our being gathered to him. Furthermore, If the apostasy that Paul is speaking about is the same apostasy that Jesus was speaking of, the cause of it will be because we will be hated by all nations for his name sake and the result of that will be the persecution and the threat of death for those in Chirst and because of that many will fall away from the faith. In any case, we know from the Scripture above that there must be an apostasy before the resurrection and catching away takes place.

dmcal, evidence of the apostacy (the falling away from Christ) is apparent right here on this forum with apostates who deny the letters of Paul and individuals who try and spiritualize every scripture to the exclusion of the literal interpretation, that they have or are in great danger of losing their salvation.

Such is the state of the church right now and Jesus said it would be so.

It’s happening for sure. The door is closing. What we are waiting for now is the man of sin to be revealed, and that will happen soon in just a couple of years.

Watchthebeast –You will be waiting along time to see the anti-Christ if you cannot see him today. They is something not in tune with your Word of God.

We need to understand that a Spirit controls the soul of man which includes the heart of mankind as well.
Every person in man kinds kingdom. Has a ruling spirit in them that make them what they are.

John said – If they do not live righteous lives, or do not Love God, and also they must HATE the WORLD. Hate evil. Evil is a Spirit. Evil spirit. That is the Worlds spirit. If you love the world then the Love of God is not in you and you are a liar if you say it is and you still love the world. That is John writings.

Next If you do not believe that Christ comes in the Flesh – you are a anti-Christ. In other words – replaces that “old sinful soul” with a “Brand New Soul” which makes you a New Creation of the Heavenly Kind.

How many types of anti-Christ do you all think their is. They all going to the same place.

Some in the world are called by God even to be in high position’s. Its still all anti-Christ to the core. Hitler was no more evil than the system of men that followed him. Hitler had millions of converts to the devil yet said he was a Christian. come on. Christian or not he went to hell along with all that believed like him. They had faith in him. Mankind and individuals have faith in how they live. Even if its bad. They believe that is the way the are. They are still anti-Christ. And are living in a dillusion of the great lie.

Tom York, unfortunately for you as well, you have a very skewed new age and false interpretation of scripture which has not the revelation from the Holy Spirit.

Are you a gnostic?

You have a partial truth but not the whole truth. That makes what you espouse, false.

I’ve read other comments by you and you are way way off.It’s not, as DMcal said, “just” about the “spiritual” interpretation.

You only “think” you hear from the Holy Spirit. Truth comes from revelation of the Spirit and you do not have the understanding of it.

There are many “antichrists” with a little “a”. Just as John said.But there is one Antichrist Beast individual. If you cannot comprehend that, then you are blind.

I know who the Antichrist individual is and he will rise in a couple of years just as I said and MOST will miss the fact that he is the beast because most, such as yourself cannot see the truth except your own “spiritual” new agey interpretation of it.

First I would like to say to WATCH THE BEAST…..I love your nic….and I am positive the Lord sent you as an ally….This room is filled with apostates….I have never seen Marianne’s site like this before…
Matthew, Al, and many others trying to lead people back into the old covenant that leads to death forsaking Jesus and even using old covenant language calling God YHVH and Jesus some other hebrew name…
And continuous lying…These people make Jehovah’s Witnesses look ok …
As for Moses knowing jehovah I have never read that in Scripture… Moses knew the I AM THAT I AM..That is not the word Jehovah in any language.. and it in fact means that god was saying he was the I AM of john 8-58 that was before Abraham.. aka Jesus..in effect God said I am that I AM OF JOHN 8-58…Jesus said unto them, Verily, verily, I say unto you, Before Abraham was, I am.

EXODUS 6-3..And I appeared unto Abraham, unto Isaac, and unto Jacob, by the name of God Almighty, but by my name JEHOVAH was I not known to them.

Thanks. Yep, the Lord tends to do this a lot with me.Sends me in where needed. Guess He knows I am to the point and will speak what He wants me to speak. He knows who the apostates are and it angers Him greatly.

I’ll say that much. Actually He is furious. And He is storing up His wrath upon the unrighteous.

Play time is over for the church. Judgment cometh now. It begins in His house.He does not like perverters of His truth.This forum, which I recently discovered, is filled with apostate lieing perverters of the purity of the truth as you said.

I see this increasing more and more all over internet land.. Hense my previous comments.

Sad because I don’t think that was Marianne’s intent when she started her blog, based on what I have read.

I agree and appreciate your comments. Good job contending for the TRUTH.

This is the vision/revelation. I was in the midst of a great meeting hall (a church), and the walls and ceilings were covered with jewels and ornaments, and the windows were made of colored glass (a typical cathedral or church). The hall was full of people, some rich, some poor, some sick and crippled, mute and blind; but all had chains on and were hand-cuffed, and no one was free (a picture of today’s church, they’re in church but they’re not free).

In front of the meeting hall was a large platform, with a pulpit on one side and a large cage on the other, with a huge green serpentin it; and hanging over where the speaker would stand, was a great sword suspended by two strings horizontally; and on the platform were several ministers, 8 or 10, clothed in clerical robes, sitting one behind the other, one seated just a little above the other.

The assembly looked upon these men and they looked upon the church. There was silence for a while, until a thundering voice sounded from the pulpit, as if it came directly from God, saying, ‘Who will declare the whole counsel of God?’

And the first clergyman arose with a Bible in his hand, and when he did, the old green serpent uncoiled and stretched out hissing against the man with sparkling eyes and protruding fangs; and the man of God, falsely so-called, sank back into his seat and placed his Bible under the chair. And when the serpent stretched up his head and touched the sword, he said to that man, ‘Anyone who obeys the voice of God, I will kill with this sword.’ And for a little while, there was silence again.

And then the Voice sounded from the pulpit again, ‘Who will declare the whole counsel of God?’

And then the second man in clerical robes arose as if he would step forward, and again the serpent uncoiled against him, and he tumbled back with fear and sat down and placed his Bible under his chair (hiding the Word). The serpent again touched the sword, and with the sameremark said, ‘I will kill you, if you obey the voice of God.’

And for the third time the Voice from the pulpit thundered, and a third man arose and sat down like the two before him. And again and again the Voice sounded until each of the clergyman had had an opportunity to resist the serpent, but fear overcame them all, like the first three had been overcome. And the serpent smiled with his evil smile.

And then the Voice sounded again from the pulpit saying, ‘Oh if there were a man, Oh if there were a man; Oh if there were a man who would declare the whole counsel of God, that these chained men might be set free! Is there not one man?’

Then a man of little stature (meaning he was nothing in the sight of the world), ascended the platform and stood under the sword, and he lifted up his eyes toward heaven and said, ‘Into Thy hands O God, I committ my spirit.’

Then he opened the Bible and read. He didn’t add anything to It, and he didn’t take anything from It; he read the Word, and spoke as a man having authority.

And when he had finished, the old serpent stretched up to the edge of the sword and cut off one of the strings holding the sword in place, and the sword swung down and missed him, passing over his head; because he was a man of “little stature”; and the weight of the sword made the other string to break, so that the sword swung back and pierced the hearts of those clergymen who were lined up and nailed them to the wall.

And a great scream of despair sounded from the pulpit; but an even greater cry of joy sounded from the assembly, for every man’s chains were loosed and they were set free! (By the word they were set free).

When this vision had vanished, I saw another vision of the Savior in a cloud, just above my head.

He spoke saying, ‘Hear my son the meaning of these things.

The meeting hall which you saw is the secularized church, having a form of godliness, but denying the power thereof. They are all covered with the jewels of the joys of this world, and there is no end to heir silver and gold.

The people which you saw, are those for whom I died, but My people are destroyed for lack of knowledge; they have eyes, but they do not see; they have ears, but they cannot hear. They are trulyin bondage and must be set free!

The platform in which you saw, on which the clergymen were sitting; the platform is the preconceived ideas, having their origins from the pit of hell.

The pulpit is the throne of God; and the serpent, old Lucifer himself.

The sword which you saw, is the Word of God; and the strings on which it was hanging, mean the power of the Word to give life or the power of the Word to take life. Life was given to the man of little stature and life taken from the clergymen that did not preach My Word!

The clergymen that you saw, are men (& women) from every church who pretend to know Me, but they teach My people things which are not written in the Book of life; and their pride and their presumption, and their wordly spirit force them to obey Satan, who is a liar and the father of lies; and each of the clergymen try and exceed the other in elegance, in extensive writings, argumentation and the like; but they only consider the” letter” of the Word, and leave out the “spirit” of the Word. And the day will come and now is at hand, when they shall all perish, just like these.’

After having considered this horrible scene, the Lord spoke again with these words, ‘Do you remember My words in the prophecy of Jeremiah chapter 23, as well as My words in the prophecy of Ezekiel chapter 34?’

Jesus said, ‘Read it.’

And I opened my Bible and read, ‘Woe unto the shepherds that destroy and scatter the sheep of My pasture, saith the LORD. (Jer.23:1) In the prophets I have see a horrible thing, they committ adultery and they walk in falsehood: (a perversion of the Word of God), and strenghthen the hands of evil doers’ (Jer.23:14).

Jesus said, ‘At the end of days you shall understand this. Woe to the shepherds that feed themselves, should not the shepherds feed the flock! (Ezek.34:2). The weak you have not strengthened, nor have you healed the sick, you’ve not bound up that which was broken, and neither have you sought that which was lost; but with harshness and with rigor have you ruled over them. (Ezek.34:4). I will destroy the fat and the strong shepherds; and I will feed them with judgement’ (Ezek34:16).

Then He said to me, ‘That these false shepherds shall in no wise escape when the sword falls upon them. But My sheep must be warned, they must be set free! And again He said, Do you remember My words in the prophecy of Jeremiah in the latter part of chapter 25? Read it!’

And I read these words, ‘And the slain if the LORD shall be in that day from one end of the earth, even to the other end of the earth: (Jer.25:33). Howl ye shepherds, for the day of your slaughter is come!’ (Jer.25:34).

Then He said to me, ‘These days shall come quickly, the shepherds shall howl, yea, there shall be weeping and gnashing of teeth; but when the sword has fallen it will be too late forever.

The man whom you saw who was of little stature, is every man and woman who will humble himself or herself, and be obedient even to the death of the cross, putting his or her trust in God, and going forward declaring the whole counsel of God! Oh, if I could find such a man, can you tell Me where there is one? With such a man I could shake heaven and earth, saith the LORD.’

“Then He said to me, ‘These days shall come quickly, the shepherds shall howl, yea, there shall be weeping and gnashing of teeth; but when the sword has fallen it will be too late forever.”

There is going to be a lot of howling because the sword hangs over the heads of the false ones. He will remove them. Best they humble themselves and repent NOW and get on the Lord’s side for their soul’s sake.

Are the yhvh people who are trying to bring back the old covenant laws and ordinances those that sit in Moses seat of Matthew 23-2 and chapter….

The very fact Jesus and some of the apostles were killed because of old covenant ordinances is enough to show me what the law and ordinances really are.The following verse is apt…
Psalms..94-20., 21….Shall the throne of iniquity have fellowship with thee, which frameth mischief by a law?..They gather themselves together against the soul of the righteous, and condemn the innocent blood. ….
The innocent blood is Jesus /Christians and the law is the old covenant balsphemy law….
DOES GOD HAVE FELLOWSHIP WITH with the throne of iniquity…..No, he does not..

Then, please outline your understanding of the current status of the end of the age relative to Seal 1, 2, 3 and 4.

Please – specifically address which (if any) of the first 4 seals are open and what leads you to that conclusion. Outline is fine – don’t need an essay or a dissertation in APA format or footnotes.

What is your estimated year and season for the end of the age and His return? What leads you to that date and season.

What is your definition of The Beast, which you are watching earnestly. Why is this so important?

Please define who or what is Babylon as we read in Revelation 18. Rome/Vatican, USA/NYC, Iran/Iraq, Cincinnati Ohio – whatever. No need for a long explanation.

With the above information – I can better understand your perspective on current events, what comes next, and who you believe becomes the AC without telling us or if your information on his identity is not accurate.

Do you think da Pope is The False Prophet?

Many folks have dreams, fewer receive visions and dreams, some also receive “words of knowledge” but a very few have all of those and experience some or all of Mark 16:17-18.

“What is your estimated year and season for the end of the age and His return? What leads you to that date and season.”

answer: The 7 year tribulation timeframe: 2013-2020 (the last 3.5 years of that being the “great tribulation)

“What is your definition of The Beast, which you are watching earnestly. Why is this so important?”

answer: The beast is a “system” as well as an individual “beast” person. There is duel meaning of the word “Beast” throughout scripture.The Beast system , the New World Order, allows the Beast (person) the last days Antichrist individual, to rise.

It is known as the forth reich, which is no longer headquartered in Germany but the USA.The Beast (person) follows in the footsteps of Hitler, but will be given greater power than Hitler was given.

answer: Babylon or rather “mystery babylon” as Rev 18 discusses, is headquartered in the USA, which is an economic as well a spiritual headquarters which will be destroyed when the Beast/Antichrist individual is given full power to reign

Rev 17:12:”And the ten horns which thou sawest are ten kings, which have received no kingdom as yet; but receive power as kings one hour with the beast.

Rev 17:13 These have one mind, and shall give their power and strength unto the beast.

Mystery Babylon is destroyed towards the end as we see in Rev 18.

The whore of mystery babylon, the USA, as a spiritual and economic center for the whole world, rides on the back of this NWO beast system (headquartered at the UN)

That is why all the top “christian” leaders, protestant and catholic, new age, hindu and islamic leaders, are all joining/linking hands together at the UN as well as all the political leaders becoming a spiritual/political conglomeration of religion/economics.

The One World New Religion.

The pope (whoever the chosen one is) will be the “spokesman”, or the mouthpiece for this new one world religion. That would make him the False Prophet.

They, the world’s leaders,political and spiritual, are all joined together. at the UN.The political system and the spiritual system ( the papacy) is linking up together at the UN.They are in bed with one another.

“Many folks have dreams, fewer receive visions and dreams, some also receive “words of knowledge” but a very few have all of those and experience some or all of Mark 16:17-18.”

I recieved knowledge of who the Antichrist/Beast person is from direct revelation from the Most High God.

he rises out of the USA, as I said, which is the headquarters for the beast system.

In other words, this “beast system” allows the Beast person, to rise.

“Do you think da Pope is The False Prophet?”

answer: I haven’t been given direct revelation of “who’ the False Prophet is, but I feel he is the next pope. Not the present one. But as I haven’t recieved direct knowledge of who he is, I can’t give a definite answer on that. He will be the pope though, I feel.

I know this was addressed to the Watchthebeast, but I thought that I would respond as well:

You said:
“Then, please outline your understanding of the current status of the end of the age relative to Seal 1, 2, 3 and 4.

The end of the age doesn’t take place in relation to any of the seals, but is in relation to the 7th or last bowl judgment. That the Lord will have not returned until after the 7th bowl is poured is supported by the following Scripture:

““Look, I come like a thief! Blessed is the one who stays awake and remains clothed, so as not to go naked and be shamefully exposed.”
(Rev.16:15)

After the 6th bowl judgment has been poured out, Jesus then interjects the above announcement, which clearly shows that he has not yet returned, but is about to after the 7th bowl has been poured out. His return to end the age is then recorded in Rev.19:11-21

You said:
What is your estimated year and season for the end of the age and His return?

As previously stated, the return of the Lord which ushers in the end of the age, will take place shortly after the 7th bowl has been poured out and not before. Jesus can not return prior to the 7th bowl and that because at the pouring out of the 6th bowl he says, “Look, I come like a thief,” which would indicate that by the 6th bowl he hasn’t returned yet.

You said:
“What is your definition of The Beast, which you are watching earnestly. Why is this so important?”

The “beast” refers to that last kingdom and is also one of the designations of the ruler of that last kingdom, who is that angel that comes up out of the Abyss at the blowing of the 5th trumpet in Rev.9:11. He is also the one who kills the two witnesses and the one who receives the fatal wound, but lives and he is the one who makes war and conquers the great tribulation saints for that last 3 1/2 years (Dan.7:25, Rev.13:5-7). He is also the one who thrown into the lake of fire at the Lord’s return. Though we can see the world getting set up for the beast’s revealing, which tells that we are close, we should be watching for and anticipating the Lords return to gather us at the resurrection and catching away.

Please define who or what is Babylon as we read in Revelation 18. Rome/Vatican, USA/NYC, Iran/Iraq, Cincinnati Ohio – whatever. No need for a long explanation.

The seven heads you saw are seven hills upon which the woman sits (her headquarters) – Rome/Vatican

The woman you saw is that great city that rules over the kings of the earth – Rome was ruling over the kings of the earth and was literally built on seven hills.

The Scripture points us to Rome, which in turn points us to her Babylonian pagan system whose influence is world wide (sits upon many waters). She is the prostitute, for she is claiming to be of Christ while committing spiritual adultery against him. As I have said before, that 19th century B.C. Egyptian pagan obelisk sitting out in St. Peter’s square is showing her true nature, for there should be no reason whatsoever for that pagan object to be sitting at the headquarters of what is supposed to be the church of Christ.

You said:
With the above information – I can better understand your perspective on current events, what comes next, and who you believe becomes the AC without telling us or if your information on his identity is not accurate.

The next big event is the resurrection and the catching away of the dead and living in Jesus Christ, followed by the covenant that will be made for that one ‘seven’. The AC can only be the one who fulfills what is written of him namely, the one who makes that seven year covenant and the one who will be proclaiming himself to be the God of god’s and the one who has that abomination set up in the holy place, which takes place in the middle of that seven years (Dan.9:27). But he will first be identified when he makes that covenant.

You said:
Do you think da Pope is The False Prophet?

The pope would be my top choice, for who better to be the false prophet than leader of the woman who rides the beast, the one who is the current leader of a billion plus devout people. And if they are devout now, how devout do you think they will become once one of the future popes begins to perform those miracles, signs and wonders? Not only would they more devout, but all of those so-called Christian sects such as Mormonism, Jehovah’s witness, Unification church and others would all be deceived by the deception of those miracles, signs and wonders as well. Of course there is no way to prove that one of the pope’s will play the part of the false prophet and so it is my own personal belief and therefore, is not set in stone. But consider this, most of the rulers on earth consider him and his religious system to be God’s true agency on earth and the pope as its sole ambassador.

WATCHTHEBEAST…
Pretty sure we can agree that antichrist is satan in the flesh….Read 2 corinthians 11-4,14….Satan comes as an angel of light (means messiah like Jesus)…He brings another gospel that teaches another Jesus and another Spirit…. I interpret these as Mohammed, koran Issa and Allah..

Mohammed as did Jesus said he would return during judgment.. He said he would return with the name he left his family..That name was hussein VIA HIS GRANDSONS..He ALSO SAID HE WOULD BE AS the sunrise in the west…meaning western world…..

Isaiah 59-10..So shall they fear the name of the LORD from the west, and his
glory from the rising of the sun. When the enemy shall come in like a flood, the
Spirit of the LORD shall lift up a standard against him.

Shariah law is old covenant ordinances same as the apostates are teaching..
Satan is trying to take men backward into perdition..

Islam blaspemes the Bible, beheads Chrisians, forces peopel to bow to the allah beast or death,.. these have truly made war with the real God and with Christians.. They are right now killing Christians in 140 countries and their plans are to take over the entire world and make it Islamic..

You said:
“Pretty sure we can agree that antichrist is satan in the flesh”

Rebut:
I would have to greatly disagree with you. See below:

“The great dragon was hurled down—that ancient serpent called the devil, or Satan, who leads the whole world astray. He was hurled to the earth, and his angels with him.”

The Scripture above shows that the dragon is Satan and he is the one orchestrating the events of the beast and the false prophet.

“The dragon gave the beast his power and his throne and great authority.”

Clearly the above Scripture shows that the Dragon, that is, Satan is giving his power, throne and great authority to the beast, therefore, how can they be the same entities as you claim?

“People worshiped the dragon because he had given authority to the beast, and they also worshiped the beast and asked, “Who is like the beast? Who can wage war against it?”

Here again, the Scripture shows that people will worship the dragon/Satan and will worship the beast as well, referring to two separate entities.

“But the beast was captured, and with him the false prophet who had performed the signs on its behalf. With these signs he had deluded those who had received the mark of the beast and worshiped its image. The two of them were thrown alive into the fiery lake of burning sulfur.”

“And I saw an angel coming down out of heaven, having the key to the Abyss and holding in his hand a great chain. He seized the dragon, that ancient serpent, who is the devil, or Satan, and bound him for a thousand years. He threw him into the Abyss, and locked and sealed it over him, to keep him from deceiving the nations anymore until the thousand years were ended. After that, he must be set free for a short time.

When Jesus returns to the earth to end the age, the beast/antichrist along with the false prophet are thrown into the lake of fire alive. After that an angel comes down from heaven and throws and locks the dragon/Satan up in the Abyss. So again, how can the dragon/Satan and the beast/antichrist be the same persons if one is going to be thrown into the lake of fire and the other is restricted to the Abyss, which is within the earth?

Scripture clearly shows these as being two separate entities. It is the angel called “Destroyer” who is the king over those demonic beings, who comes up out of the Abyss at the 5th trumpet who is that beast who once was, now is not and yet will come. He is the same one who will kill the two witnesses at the end of their 1260 days (3 1/2 years ) of prophecy. When he comes out of the Abyss he will possess or control his human counterpart referred to by Paul as the man of lawlessness and by John as the antichrist. This angel, the beast who comes up out of the Abyss is another fallen angel that once was once in the world, but is now in the Abyss and will come up out of the Abyss.

.The dragon and his seven heads are Satan and seven demons…These indwell the beast who is a man…This man is a counterfeit messiah…Just as God indwelled Jesus, Satan and his seven friends indwell the beast messiah man…
…Matthew 12-43,44,45..When the unclean spirit is gone out of a man, he walketh through dry places, seeking rest, and findeth none. Then he saith, I will return into my house from whence I came out; and when he is come, he findeth it empty, swept, and garnished. Then goeth he, and taketh with himself seven other spirits more wicked than himself, and they enter in and dwell there: and the last state of that man is worse than the first. Even so shall it be also unto this wicked generation.
These three verses in Mathew 12 are about the Christians that fall to the beast…and become indwelled by Satan and his seven demons, aka the dragon and seven heads…
Revelation 12 shows the dragon and his tail drag one third of the Christian stars out of the woman’s crown and cast them down to earth…These fallen Christians who are now incorporated into the beast are shown in Rev 13-11…..These are the earth beast that comes out of the earth…These HAD two horns like a lamb, but now speak as the dragon..This means they were Christians but the dragon now indwells them and they speak as a dragon…
These are called false prophets in other verses of Revelation.. Bear in mind these fallen Christians are the tares that grew up together with the wheat but have been removed from the heavenly realm where Christians abide in Jesus..Jesus also warned us about these false prophets.. In Matthew 7…He said “Beware of false prophets which come to you in sheep’s clothing but inwardly are ravenous wolves… The sheep’s clothing is the two horns like a lamb of Rev 13-11…These have graduated from wolves eating the sheep while part of Christianity to being the false prophets of the beast who are indwelled by the dragon-Satan and his seven demons just as Matthew 12-43,44,45 warns us..

.The great dragon was hurled down—that ancient serpent called the devil, or Satan, who leads the whole world astray. He was hurled to the earth, and his angels with him.”

I think you misunderstand Revelation 12…Rev 12-9 is informing us that the dragon is the same entity that deceived Eve…This dragon and friends are a wonder in the heavens.-Verse 3…I think they attain this status because the dragon-Satan is claiming he is the god of Abraham… Plus God has allowed this for the removal of the tares who have grown up together with the wheat..

Revelation 12 is about the tares who grow up with the wheat until they are removed as God promised…aka the stars the dragon’s tail cast down to earth…The remaining Christians are hid in the wilderness and fed from the face of the serpent…
Whereby god is teaching her good and evil the real truth about good and evil, not the version Eve believed.
This event is called bruising the serpent’s head of Genesis 3-15…
Rev 12-17..And the dragon was wroth with the woman, and went to make war with the remnant of her seed, which keep the commandments of God, and have the testimony of Jesus Christ.
Rev. 12 is also about the prophecy of Genesis 3-15,, the seed of the woman and the seed of the serpent and the bruising of head and heel…
Bruising the head means exposing all the lies of satan…Bruising the heel is what happens when the gospel of Christ which clads our feet is discarded when we believe Koran gospel , etc.

You are correct in that, the dragon/Satan is the same spirit who deceived Eve in the garden, but you are incorrect as to who the stars are in chapter 12 are. For the Scripture itself tells us who the stars are. Chapter 12:1-6 is a summary, where verse 7 thru 17 is a detailed account of 1 thru 6. As proof, let’s compare:

Summary account:
“Then another sign appeared in heaven: an enormous red dragon with seven heads and ten horns and seven crowns on its heads.Its tail swept a third of the stars out of the sky and flung them to the earth”

Detail account:
“Then war broke out in heaven. Michael and his angels fought against the dragon, and the dragon and his angels fought back. But he was not strong enough, and they lost their place in heaven. The great dragon was hurled down—that ancient serpent called the devil, or Satan, who leads the whole world astray. He was hurled to the earth, and his angels with him.”

In the summary, they are referred to as “Stars,” where in the detail they are revealed as fallen angels.

In the summary, the dragon’s tail throws the stars to the earth, where in the summary we see that this represents Satan and his stars/angels being thrown to the earth by Michael and his angels.

Summary account:
“The woman fled into the wilderness to a place prepared for her by God, where she might be taken care of for 1,260 days.”

Detail account:
“The woman was given the two wings of a great eagle, so that she might fly to the place prepared for her in the wilderness, where she would be taken care of for a time, times and half a time, out of the serpent’s reach.”

Note: 1260 days is the same as a time (1 year), times (two years) and a half a time (half a year), both representing the same 3 1/2 year period.

The woman is said to be “clothed with the sun, with the moon under her feet and a crown of twelve stars on her head.” Now, if we allow Scripture to interpret Scripture, in order to find out who the woman is we must read Genesis 37:9-10 which uses the same exact symbols:

“he had another dream, and he told it to his brothers. “Listen,” he said, “I had another dream, and this time the sun and moon and eleven stars were bowing down to me. When he told his father as well as his brothers, his father rebuked him and said, “What is this dream you had? Will your mother and I and your brothers actually come and bow down to the ground before you?”

Jacob gives us the answer to who the sun, moon and stars are:

Will your mother (moon) and I (Sun) and your brothers (eleven stars) come and bow down to you? Since the sun is Jacob and the moon represents his wife/wives and the stars represent eleven of the twelve tribes of Israel (Joseph being number twelve) then the woman collectively represents the nation Israel, NOT spiritual Israel as some have interpreted, but literal Israel.

Ruth, if you will allow Scripture to interpret Scripture, you will come to the same conclusions and will rightly be able to expound on the word of God, but you must stay within Scripture and not just apply whatever you want as the symbolic meaning for any given thing, for God has supplied the meanings behind all of the symbolisms in his word.

The woman in rev 12 with the crown of stars and clothed with the sun and the moon under her feet is in no way connected to Joseph’s dream or to Jews or Israel…..
Rev. 12 is about the wonders in heaven and the sun being turned black and the moon to blood and the stars falling from heaven..
Rev 12-1, 3 are the wonders in Heaven of Joel 2, and many other likewise prophecies…
This woman is Christianity…Her stars are the congregation both the wheat and the tares…She is clothed with the sun… The sun of righteousness…She has the moon under her feet.. This moon is sin the moon god aka Satan…Where as God promised to bruise Satan under our feet shortly..Which event occurs in V. 14. For the unfallen….
The tares who are one third of the stars are cast down to earth by the dragon’s tail… The tail means false prophet..Isaiah 9-15..These fallen stars are the tares the Bible says will be removed and delivered to destruction Matthew 7..

Verse 2 is about the dragon and his heads and is Lucifer ascended into the heaven realm…
Isaiah 14-13…For thou hast said in thine heart, I will ascend into heaven, I will exalt my throne above the stars of God: I will sit also upon the mount of the congregation, in the sides of the north:
Verse 3 is about Lucifer in the heavens and he is claiming he is god,,specifically the god of Abraham..and he very much is exalting his throne above the stars of God..
Daniel speaks of Christian stars…
Daniel 13-3..And they that be wise shall shine as the brightness of the firmament; and they that turn many to righteousness as the stars for ever and ever. These are the Christian stars…
Daniel again speaks of these stars…
Daniel 8-10..And it waxed great, even to the host of heaven; and it cast down some of the host and of the stars to the ground, and stamped upon them.

Rev 6-2…And the stars of heaven fell unto the earth, even as a fig tree casteth her untimely figs, when she is shaken of a mighty wind….The stars falling or cast down to earth is compared to the falling away of the Jews in other verses..The mighty wind is WINDS OF DOCTRINES OF DEMONS..

This woman is the woman of Genesis 3-15 and this is he prophesied battle which continues in Rev 13..

Rev 12-17…And the dragon was wroth with the woman, and went to make war with the REMNANT OF HER SEED, which keep the commandments of God, and have the testimony of Jesus Christ. …These are Christians…. The battle takes place in Rev 13 and the falling stars cast down to earth are the earth beast of Rev 13-11… These HAD two horns like a lamb but now speak as the dragon , cause he indwells them now…Thereyby turning their sun to blackness and their blood mingled with sin the moon god…

You can believe anything you want but the sad fact is when we get Scripture wrong so does our education stop and we then eat lies instead of inspired truth…
Maybe that is the reason the churches have dried up…

One more thing, if Joseph’s dream were relevant it means Jacob worshipped he astrology lore, sun as father, moon as mother. This is of the astrology lore.God did says Isaac/Abraham’s descendants would be as he stars of Heaven IN NUMBER.. And you can take it to the bank the adopted children are also stars…….

Now listen carfully, this is exactly what I was talking about regarding Scripture interpreting Scripture. Revelation 12 mentions the sun, moon and twelve stars and God has provided the answer to those exact symbols in Genesis 37:9-10. But instead of Ruth going and looking at the verse and recognizing that Jacob referred to himself as the sun and his wife/wives as the moon and his sons as the eleven stars, she ignored it, but instead continues to support her’s or someone elses teaching which cannot be proven through Scripture. The mention of a woman clothed with the sun, with the moon under her feet and wearing a crown of twelve stars immediately alerts the reader that this is symbolic and the sun, moon and stars here are not speaking of the literal constellations. We can only understand who the woman is by those symbols and Genesis 37:9-10 reveals the meaning of those symbols.

The woman is identified as Israel and she will be cared for out in the desert for 3 1/2 years, which will be the result of that abmoniation of desolation that will be set up in the holy place and is the same reference to the same event that Jesus quoted in Mt.24:15 of Dan.9:27.

““So when you see standing in the holy place ‘the abomination that causes desolation,’a spoken of through the prophet Daniel—let the reader understand—then let those who are in Judea flee to the mountains.Let no one on the housetop go down to take anything out of the house.Let no one in the field go back to get their cloak.How dreadful it will be in those days for pregnant women and nursing mothers! Pray that your flight will not take place in winter or on the Sabbath.For then there will be great distress, unequaled from the beginning of the world until now—and never to be equaled again.”

The woman fleeing into the desert as mentioned in Rev.12:6,14 will be the result of that abomination being set up in the holy place and is the same event spoken of by Jesus in Mt.24:15-20. The woman of Revelation 12 IS NOT representing the church, as there is nothing to link her to it. The symbols are given so that we can know who the woman is by interpreting their meaning, which you continue to ignor.

You said:
“One more thing, if Joseph’s dream were relevant it means Jacob worshipped he astrology lore, sun as father, moon as mother. This is of the astrology lore.God did says Isaac/Abraham’s descendants would be as he stars of Heaven IN NUMBER.. And you can take it to the bank the adopted children are also stars…….”

I assure you that the symbols in Joseph’s dream are relevant to the woman of Revelation 12. The dream regarding the sun, moon and stars was given to Joseph by God and has nothing to do with Jacob worshipping astrology lore. God used the sun, moon and stars bowing down to Joseph depicting that event when Jacob, his wives and his sons all went to Egypt for food and ended up bowing down to Joseph whom they thought was an Egyptian offical and that because they didin’t recognize him.

If you remember the story, his brothers sold him out of envey to a passing caravan and then tore up his multicolored coat and smeared blood on it so that Jacob would think that a wild animal killed him. Years later because of the famine, they find themselves, Jacob (the sun), his wives (the moon) and his eleven brothers (eleven stars) bowing down to Joseph just as God had prophecied in Joseph’s dream. To put it simply, the only reason that Jacob brings up the sun, moon and stars is because Joseph told him about his dream, which God caused him to have. If God is the one that caused Joseph to dream about the sun, moon and stars bowing down to him, how then can you claim that Jacob is worshipping astrology? What you are saying makes no sense!

I know that you read Scripture, but why are you not interpreting things according to Scripture?

You said:
“The dragon and his seven heads are Satan and seven demons…”

Rebut:
Here is the interpretion that Scripture provides about what the seven heads represents:

“This calls for a mind with wisdom. The seven heads are seven hills on which the woman sits. They are also seven kings. Five have fallen, one is, the other has not yet come; but when he does come, he must remain for only a little while. The beast who once was, and now is not, is an eighth king. He belongs to the seven and is going to his destruction.”

Seven Heads = Seven hills upon which the woman sits, which is her headquarters.

Seven Heads = Seven kings.

Five have Fallen – That is, five of those kings had ruled and gone.

One is – King number six is ruling at the time that the angel is giving John that information.

The other has not yet come – After King number six is done ruling, king number seven would come, but would only remain in rule for a short while.

The beast who once was and now is not is an eighth king, but is counted as belonging to the succession of those seven kings. The context of Scripture does not infer that those other seven kings are demons, but human kings. It is that eighth king, who is still in the Abyss and still future who also is the one who receives that fatal wound.

Once was = He was once in the world and possibly means he was possessing or controlling other world leaders previously.

Now is not = He is currently in the Abyss as John is receiving this information from the angel.

And yet will come = He will come out of the Abyss and that when that 5th trumpet blows.

You said:
“Matthew 12-43,44,45..When the unclean spirit is gone out of a man, he walketh through dry places, seeking rest, and findeth none. Then he saith, I will return into my house from whence I came out; and when he is come, he findeth it empty, swept, and garnished. Then goeth he, and taketh with himself seven other spirits more wicked than himself, and they enter in and dwell there: and the last state of that man is worse than the first. Even so shall it be also unto this wicked generation.”

and regarding the above you said:

“These three verses in Mathew 12 are about the Christians that fall to the beast…and become indwelled by Satan and his seven demons, aka the dragon and seven heads…”

The verse above that you quoted has nothing to do with Christians that fall to the beast. Jesus spoke this parable agains that generation of Israel, namely the Jewish leaders. Though the parable gives also gives us some insite to the doings of demonic beings, Jesus spoke this against that generation of Israel and that because they said to him, “Teacher, we want to see a sign from you.”

The gist of what Jesus was saying against that generation in teh parable has to do with their spiritual state before Christ appeared to them and then their spiritual state after, which was referring to their disbelief after seeing all the miracles that he had already performed and they still didn’t believe (cleaned, swept and garnished).

Ruth, I say this in all humility, but you need to read the whole context of what is being said in order to understand why it was said. As I said, Jesus gave this parable in response to the Jews wanting to see a miraculous sign to prove who he was and has nothing to do with the Christians or the beast. Read Mt.12:38-45 and you will see what Jesus is responding to.

You said:
“These are the earth beast that comes out of the earth…These HAD two horns like a lamb, but now speak as the dragon..This means they were Christians but the dragon now indwells them and they speak as a dragon… These are called false prophets in other verses of Revelation.

The Scripture above is introducing that second beast, also referred to as the False Prophet as seen in Rev.16:13, 19:20. He is the one who will preform those miracles, signs and wonders (2 Thes.2:9, Rev.13:13) and that for the purpose of giving credibility to that first beast who will be proclaiming to be God. This false prophet has ” two horns like a lamb, but it spoke like a dragon.” His having two horns like a Lamb would seem to speak of his gentle outward personna, but his speaking like a dragon would be regarding his true nature, which is evil. This Scripture is speaking of a real person and that because in Rev.19:20 we see the first beast and the false prophet both thrown alive into the lake of fire and are therefore real individual persons.

Simply, this false prophet is going to be a religious leader whom I personally believe will be one of the future popes, ergo, false prophet, because that is what all the popes have been and will continue to be. He will authenticate the first beast as being God by performing those miracles, signs and wonders.

2 Corinthians 11- 4,14,,,.And no marvel; for Satan himself is transformed into an angel of light. This is satan coming as a counerfeit of Jesus….He like Jesus brings a gospel of the kingdom which teaches another Jesus and another spirit…
v.4..For if he that cometh preacheth another Jesus, whom we have not preached, or if ye receive another spirit, which ye have not received, or another gospel, which ye have not accepted, ye might well bear with him
This is satan in flesh and it is antichrist…..As prophecied in scripture he will be put in the pit and return after 1000 years.. Mohammed also prophecied this of himself…Tht he would return..
koran..Mohammed knew he would return AFTER 1000 years to deceive the world again..
Koran..
.[20.102] On the day when theTRUMPETshall be blown, and We will gather the guilty, blue-eyed, on that day
[20.103] They shall consult together secretly: You did tarry but ten (centuries).
[20.104] We know best what they say, when the fairest of them in course would say: You tarried but a day.(a day is as 1000 years.)
[20.105] And they ask you about the mountains. Say: My Lord will carry them away from the roots.

Yes, we are in agreement with this and that because it is Scripture interpreting Scripture. You can’t claim, as many do, that Satan and the beast are the same entity and that because as Scripture states, when Christ returns the beast is thrown into the lake of fire and Satan is locked up in the Abyss. It doesn’t take a Scholar or a theologian to understand that they can’t be the same individuals if they go to two separate places when Christ arrives; that would be quite a trick! For those who would claim otherwise, the debate becomes ludicrous. The only thing that I am neutral on is whether or not Satan is the one who opens the Abyss and that because Scripture does not elaborate as to who this angel is that is falling from heaven to the earth, but the he is referred to as a “Star” but is also referred to as a “He.” Therefore, we know that the word “Star” is being used symbolically to refer to an angel, just as they are in chapter 12. What I do believe is that this angel is of the fallen variety and that by comparing the way in which the angel of the 5th trumpet descends to the earth compared to the angel in Rev.20:1, who is obviously of the holy variety, for you would not have another fallen angel throwing the king of fallen angels into the Abyss and therefore, this mighty angel casting him in is holy.

If we allow scripture to interpret Scripture, then we should arrive at the correct interpretations. But when we don’t do that, then we have all of these erroneous interpretations, such as the person on this post who claimed that the “Wedding feast of the Lamb” which is stated as being a blessing for those who are invited, as being the same feast as “The Great supper of God” which is obviously a curse, for that supper is a feast for the birds that will be gathered to eat the flesh of all those gathered and killed at Armageddon.

As the Holy Spirit said through Paul, the days are coming (and are here) where people will not put up with sound doctrine and will They will turn their ears away from the truth and turn aside to myths.

It is also uplifting for me to see that someone else is also rightly understanding the Scripture’s and that from the same Spirit.

“The only thing that I am neutral on is whether or not Satan is the one who opens the Abyss and that because Scripture does not elaborate as to who this angel is that is falling from heaven to the earth, but the he is referred to as a “Star” but is also referred to as a “He”.”

I will agree with you that the “star” is a “He” because the scripture says “him”

Rev 9:1 :
“Then the fifth angel sounded, and I saw a star from heaven WHICH HAD FALLEN TO EARTH; and the key of the bottomless pit was given to him.” (NASB)

But,
I will suggest to you that it is Satan who opens the Abyss because of the phrase “which had fallen”…….this is past tense.

Satan already fell. Satan was thrown out of heaven and no longer allowed to live in the heavenly rhelm where Father God dwelled.

“Isa 14:12: “How you ARE FALLEN from heaven,
O Lucifer, son of the morning!
How you are cut down to the ground,
You who weakened the nations!”

You said:
“Satan already fell. Satan was thrown out of heaven and no longer allowed to live in the heavenly rhelm where Father God dwelled.”

On the above I disagree with you. If you are claiming this, then you would have to be saying that the war that takes place in Revelation 12:7-9 between Michael and his angels and Satan and his angels has already taken place? Because, in that war it states that Satan and his angels lose their place in heaven. Furthermore, If you are claiming that this war has already taken place, then it would mean that the 7th trumpet has already been blown. In fact, Satan and his angels being thrown out of heaven takes place at the 7th trumpet third woe (Rev.12:12).

Now, if you are going to say yes, that the war has already taken place, I would also have to disagree and here is the reason: The first, second and third trumpets are woes and that because they are all demonic in nature. The Scripture is clear in that, the fist woe is followed by the second, which is followed by the third woe, that is, they are in sequencial order. Therefore, if you are claiming that the war in heaven has already taken place, then the world would have had to have experienced the first woe, which as you know are those demonic beings that look like locusts with tails and stings of scorpions who torment the inhabitants of the earth for 5 months and I’m sure that if this had already happened at any time in history we woiuld definitely have a record of it. The same goes for the second woe, where a third of the inhabitants of the earth are killed by those four angels who will be released from being bound at the Euphrates River and who gather those 200 million demonic beings to kill a third of mankind by fire, smoke and sulfer issuing from their mouths. I’m sure that we would have record of that one as well. But that fact is that, we don’t have any record of any of these events taking place in any time in history.

If you are claiming that Satan no longer has access to heaven, then you would also have to explain the following to me:

“One day the angels came to present themselves before the Lord, and Satan also came with them.”

I’m sure that you recognize this from Job where Satan came with those other angels to present himself to the Lord, which of course would be in God’s heaven. Therefore, this would show that Satan did have access to heaven during Job’s life time.

Also, if Satan no longer had access to heaven, you would also have to explain this one to me:

“Then I heard a loud voice in heaven say:

“Now have come the salvation and the power and the kingdom of our God, and the authority of his Messiah. For the accuser of our brothers and sisters, who accuses them before our God day and night, has been hurled down. They triumphed over him by the blood of the Lamb and by the word of their testimony; they did not love their lives so much as to shrink from death. Therefore rejoice, you heavens and you who dwell in them! But woe to the earth and the sea, because the devil has gone down to you! He is filled with fury, because he knows that his time is short.”

Notice that it refers to Satan as the one who is accusing the brothers and sisters day and night before God, which would mean that he would have to be in heaven to be able to do that and that he will at that time, be hurled “Down” to earth, which would also infer that he is being tossed out of heaven. And again the Scripture says, “But woe to the earth and the sea because the devil has “gone down” to you.

And if there was still any doubt that Satan and his angels still have access to heaven, then I submit the following:

“Therefore rejoice, you heavens and you who dwell in them!

Those who dwell in heaven would be the angels, the four Cherubim and any others who reside in heaven. This would also show that it is God’s actual heaven that Satan and his angels are bing thrown out of and that because those living in it are rejoicing because of this.

“When the dragon saw that he had been hurled to the earth, he pursued the woman who had given birth to the male child.”

The above is another verse showing that Satan has been hurled down from heaven to the earth and he knows that his time is short, meaning that he knows that he only has 3 1/2 years before he is going to be thrown into and restricted in the Abyss.

I don’t believe this to be the case, that is , that Jesus was descibing a past tense event that he saw. Allow me to explain. Here is the Scripture in question:

“The seventy-two returned with joy and said, “Lord, even the demons submit to us in your name.”

He replied, “I saw Satan fall like lightning from heaven. I have given you authority to trample on snakes and scorpions and to overcome all the power of the enemy; nothing will harm you. However, do not rejoice that the spirits submit to you, but rejoice that your names are written in heaven.”

The disciples are excited that they had power over demons, then Jesus says, “I saw Satan fall like lightning from heaven.” So my personal belief regarding this is that, Satan falling like lightning from heaven was in relation to the 72 disciples who had been driving out demons. Remember when the Jews accused Jesus of driving out demons by the prince of demons, Baalzebub? Then he told them the parable about not being able to plunder the stong man’s house (demons) unless you first bind the strong man. Jesus response is based on what the deciples told them about driving out demoms. This combinded with the other information showing that Satan and his angels still having access to heaven and keeping this in the context of what his disciples said regarding having power over demons, leads me to believe that he was not speaking in regards to Satan falling from heaven when he rebelled.

In any case, Jesus’ statement regarding Satan should be taken into consideration in regards to the fact that the war in heaven is yet a future event showing that Satan and his angels are still inhabiting heaven and therefore, Jesus response to the deciples must be referring to something other than what you have suggested.

Whether you agree or not on what I have written above, I guess it just comes down to a disagreement on this particular subject. Now, if you told me that Christ’s resurrection was spiritual and not bodily, that would be an important issue and that because it has to do with faith.

e1313truth, Amen to what you state. Most preachers and Christians do not realise, accept or want to know that Islam will be the One World religion under the One World Order when comes upon this earth. It is the religion of the UN. What is currently happening in the Middle East and Africa will come to the West. You will either bow to Islam or they will cut your head off. Most Christians will fall away and bow to Islam (2 Thess 2). Ch 13 of Revelations tells us what is coming, except the “mark” or they cut your head off. The Western Christian church should be totally ashamed of themselves for not standing up against the Christian persecution in the Middle East and Africa. In Africa, the war front is Kenya in the East and Nigeria in the West. South Africa is the next place of attack in Africa as hordes of Moslems invade South Africa. Pres Obama, who they say is a sunni Moslem, told the Nigerians to stop persecuting the Moslems! Who also supported the Moslem Brotherhood in Egypt which were rejected by the people. This same regime attacked the US consulate in Bengahzi which resulted in the killing of the ambassador and three marines. No help from the US military?
As the future US President, Hillary Clinton said, “who cares?” Guess how many Islamic brotherhood advisers in the US government. In Canada, we now have the Moslems causing strife and claiming Sharia law as in Detroit and Western Europe. The liberals opened the door and allowed these Moslems into Western countries, and against the providence of God we will reap the result. To the shame of Christianity, we have Christian groups and pastors who reach out to the enemy Islam and who often are against Israel, Lord help those people. My advice to them, is drink gallons of water daily for the coming thirst will totally denigrate their minds. Wake up Christians and know your enemies. Liberals hate Christians and love Islam, because Islam hates Jews and Christians. God bless and enlighten you all.

Psalms 74-14..Thou brakest the heads of leviathan in pieces, and gavest him to be meat to the people inhabiting the wilderness.
Revelation 12-14..And to the woman were given two wings of a great eagle, that she might fly into the wilderness, into her place, where she is nourished for a time, and times, and half a time, from the face of the serpent.

Ruth said:
“Psalms 74-14..Thou brakest the heads of leviathan in pieces, and gavest him to be meat to the people inhabiting the wilderness.
Revelation 12-14..And to the woman were given two wings of a great eagle, that she might fly into the wilderness, into her place, where she is nourished for a time, and times, and half a time, from the face of the serpent.”

This is a perfect example of Scripture NOT interpreting Scripture, as these two Scriptures have nothing whatsoever to do with each other, except for the word “wilderness” which does not mean that they are in reference to the same event. The Psalmist is glorifying God as the creator of all things and Psalm 74:14 is mentioned as part of that praise. I has nothing to do with the woman clothed with the sun with the moon under her feet wearing a crown of twelve stars. From Scripture, mainly Job, Leviathan seems to have been an actual creature that we have seen, whereas the Dragon is Satan and not Leviathan. These two Scriptures have nothing to do with each other.

Who has been teaching you lies????
Rev. 12-14..And to the woman were given two wings of a great eagle, that she might fly into the wilderness, into her place, where she is nourished for a time, and times, and half a time, from the face of the serpent.

Psalms 74-13, 14..Thou didst divide the sea by thy strength: thou brakest the heads of the dragons in the waters.
V. 14..Thou brakest the heads of leviathan in pieces, and gavest him to be meat to the people inhabiting the wilderness.

DO YOU KNOW WHAT IT MEANS TO CRUSH /BRUISE THE HEAD…

Hab. 3-13..Thou wentest forth for the salvation of thy people, even for salvation with thine anointed; thou woundedst the head out of the house of the wicked, by discovering the foundation unto the neck. Selah. It means to expose all the lies right down to the foundation…It Satan’s case it would be back to Genesis 3..

When the Lord feeds you from the face of the serpent/dragon then you will understand even back to Genesis 3..

That’s the point, no one has taught me anything, but I have studied and study the Scriptures personally and end time events for 40 plus years and therefore, I am not teaching what anyone has taught me and I am not swayed by anyone elses teachings. On the otherhand, you continue to link Scriptures together that are unrelated and when you do that the meaning is lost.

I think this passage has some implication to the wilderness experience (Revelation 12) and the “spirit of Elijah”.

“Then the word of the Lord came to Elijah: ‘Leave here, turn eastward and hide in the Kerith Ravine, east of the Jordan [wilderness]. You will drink from the brook, and I have directed the ravens to supply you with food there.’

So he did what the Lord had told him. He went to the Kerith Ravine, east of the Jordan, and stayed there [wilderness]. The ravens brought him bread and meat in the morning and bread and meat in the evening, and he drank from the brook” (1st Kings 17:2-6, NIV).

The apollyon
Rev 9-11..And they had a king over them, which is the angel of the bottomless pit, whose name in the Hebrew tongue is Abaddon, but in the Greek tongue hath his name Apollyon.
The apollyon who is the angel of he pit is Satan….
Revelation 20-2…And he laid hold on the dragon, that old serpent, which is the Devil, and Satan, and bound him a thousand years, The dragon is that old serpent, aka Satan..

Rev 20-7…And when the thousand years are expired, Satan shall be loosed out of his prison,
Rev 17-8…The beast that thou sawest was, and is not; and shall ascend out of the bottomless pit, and go into perdition: and they that dwell on the earth shall wonder, whose names were not written in the book of life from the foundation of the world, when they behold the beast that was, and is not, and yet is.
This beast that ascends out of the bottomless pit is the return of the antichrist…He is the apollyon.. The apollyon is actually the name of the ancient god Apollo the astrology god of light… He was the sun god…When Mohammed said he would be as the sunrise in the west in his return he meant the apollyon in the western world..Obama showed clearly that he is the sunrise in the western world with his logo…

think the tree of knowledge of good and evil plunged mankind into a delusional parallel world..Whereby Satan counterfeits all of God’s works..

For instance tGod’s foundation of the earth and Satan’s version is called the foundation of the world which he founded in Genesis 3..

And then there are the two cities, New Jerusalem and Babylon.These cities are established by a name of a deity whereby they are not scattered but gathered in the same name, hence a city….New Jerusalem is the wife/bride of Christ,, Babylon is the wife of the beast aka Satan..

Of course the parallel of the tree of life is the tree of knowledge of good and evil..
Two images, the image of God and Satan’s image when he transformed Adam,, genesis 3-22..
Two baptisms, God’s is holy ghost baptism and the baptism of fire which is reserved for the chaff….Matthew 3-11,12..
Two messiah, Messiah Christ and Satan’s version is the antichrist…
Two gospels, the Gospel of Christ and the gospel of antichrist..
Two Gods, which are the god of Abraham and the counterfeit god of Abraham who is satan…..
Two ways, the narrow way and the broad way…

Two sons of Abraham, from which come forth the Christ and the antichrist.
Wheat and tares
Sheep and goats,
Two resurrection, the resurrection of the just and the resurrection of the damned..

I think god intends to show us the real truth about good and evil…His version and Satan’s counterfeits…

Clearly this passage defines Levathan as demonic spirit of pride not a literal sea monster.

“On earth there is nothing like him, which is made without fear. He beholds every high thing; He is king over all the children of pride” (Job 41:33-34, NKJV).

“Nothing on earth is its equal— a creature without fear. It looks down on all that are haughty; it is king over all that are proud” (NIV).

In context of Job, the language suggests an aquatic monster which dwells in the sea. We know within Scripture that the sea represents nations of people. The sea is the voice of many waters, or many people, in the book of Revelation.

Leviathan is the name of “pride” and we are given a vivid description of this “spirit”. It is a very powerful spirit associated with Satan and his principality & powers (Ephesians 6:12).

“His rows of scales are his pride, shut up tightly as with a seal; one is so near another that no air can come between them; they are joined one to another, They stick together and cannot be parted” (Job 41:15-17, NKJV).

Pride – as scales are his pride, bound so tightly that air cannot penetrate. God resists the proud.

In Job, Leviathan is described as “strength dwells in his neck, and sorrow dances before him. The folds of his flesh are joined together; They are firm on him and cannot be moved” (Job 41:22-23, NKJV).

Pride – is known as “stiffed necked” in the Old Testament. Oh, those Israelites can be a very stiff necked people, as well so manyChristians.

Pride – is evident in with those holding a “hard heart” not soft as the Lord God gives us, when we repent. “His heart is as hard as stone, even as hard as the lower millstone. When he raises himself up, the mighty are afraid; Because of his crashing they are beside themselves” (Job 41:24-25 NKJV).

Leviathan, a demonic spirit, attacks the spiritual goals of believers, restricts and bondage of worship and human move towards the Lord, disrupts learning and understanding, and almost always present as the result of a generational/family curse.

Job has his eyes open to Leviathan as he is when he states in the climax and to conclude the account “I’ve heard but now I see” (41:5). Job became personally aware (through friends and the work of Satan) that the “problem” was pride and God enabled Job to experience it and share the story with us.

“You crushed the heads of Leviathan [Egypt]; You did give him as food for the creatures inhabiting the wilderness” (Psalm 74:14, NKJV).

“In that day [the Lord will deliver Israel from her enemies and also from the rebel powers of evil and darkness] His sharp and unrelenting, and strong sword will visit and punish Leviathan the swiftly fleeing serpent, Leviathan the twisting and winding serpent; and He will slay the monster that is in the sea” (Isaiah 27:1, NJKV).

The amazing thing about you listing this Scripture from Job regarding the Leviathan supports the fact that it was a literal creature. When you see something like this with so much detail to it, it is speaking in literal terms. Leviathan was some type of literal creature that God is speaking of that God knows all about, but Job does not. As proof of this, prior to mentioning the Leviathan, he mentions other animals, such as when he asks Job “Do you know when the moutain goats give birth?” or “Did you give the horse his strength or clothe his neck with a flowing mane?” God goes on and on with questions regarding the characteristics of literal animals, clouds, the constellations, which shows that Leviathan was a literal creature and not symbolic for something else and by listing this, you are supporting what I said in the previous post and that is that Leviathan was some type of creature that we have never seen.

Also, I don’t know where you got the idea that I ascribe to Tim Lahaye, as I have already told you that he should stick to the left behind series and leave the interpretatioin of Scripture alone. I assure you that I do eat solid food and have been for years. It is amazing to me that if someone doesn’t agree with what you are teaching, then you claim that they are drinking milk and are in need of solid food as Scripture. The point is that when you interpret something, then I provide the Scripture with the correct answer, you don’t bother with checking it out and that because you are just going to continue protecting your false interpretations. You don’t know how to read Scripture, which is obvious by your interpretations. My comments are not the perfect example of a lack of spiritual discernment, but the perfect example of discernment of the Scriptures and all that God has revealed to me over these 40 plus years and some day you are going to find these things to be true and that because you’ll be starring these issues in the face and won’t be able to deny it.

If you read the original hebrew definition of “leviathan” in the concordance

says: “leviathan” is a “sea monster, dragon
large aquatic animal”

In Job 41:1 THAT is what the scripture is talking about. A sea monster.

“Can you draw out Leviathan with a hook,
Or snare his tongue with a line which you lower” That’stalking about a sea monster.

You can read that in a strong’s concordance.

However, as I said, the term can also have a “spiritual “.Leviathan is term for Satan or a satanic spirit.

Isa 27:1 says: “Isa 27:1 In that day the LORD with His severe sword, great and strong,
Will punish Leviathan the fleeing serpent,
Leviathan that twisted serpent;
And He will slay the reptile that is in the sea.”

In THAT scripture, it is talking about Satan because Satan is also a SERPENT like being.

“DJ you also said:

“Please respond to my request for your understanding of the end of the age.”

In regards to Leviathan, the burden of proof is on you and that because God is describing every charateristic of this creature and no where in the context does it allude to a symbolic meaning, but is only implied by you. Symbolism’s do not have the detail of description that we see here in Job regarding Leviathan.

I am not going to tell you WHO the Beast is -as I said, I am not allowed to at this time. The Lord wanted me to know who it is, and it is enough for me to to know right now. He hasn’t been revealed to the world…yet.

And, I have already written about those topics you mentioned in another thread, but being that you cannot even get to first base with your comprehension of what “leviathan’ means in CONTEXT, I am not going to continue this dialogue with you any further.

Genesis 37-9, 10…..And he dreamed yet another dream, and told it his brethren, and said, Behold, I have dreamed a dream more; and, behold, the sun and the moon and the eleven stars made obeisance to me. And he told it to his father, and to his brethren: and his father rebuked him, and said unto him, What is this dream that thou hast dreamed? Shall I and thy mother and thy brethren indeed come to bow down ourselves to thee to the earth?
So If Joseph’s dream was relevant to the woman in Rev 12.. , does that mean the woman was clothed with Joseph’s father and she had Jacob’s mother under her feet..and Joseph’s brother were stars in her crown……

The real truth about Revelation 12 is that the woman and the dragon are the wonders in heaven of Joel 2 -30, 31..And I will shew wonders in the heavens and in the earth, blood, and fire, and pillars of smoke….The sun shall be turned into darkness, and the moon into blood, before the great and the terrible day of the LORD come. ..

Matthew 24-29..Immediately after the tribulation of those days shall the sun be darkened, and the moon shall not give her light, and the stars shall fall from heaven, and the powers of the heavens shall be shaken:..

Revelation 12-1 and 3..REVEAL these wonders in heaven….
This woman represents the Christian church..The stars represent the congregation, both the wheat and the tares…When one third of the congregation is cast down to earth the sun that clothes them is turned to darkness, ,,,The moon who is Satan, aka sin the moon god now indwells these fallen ones, thereby the moon become blood…He lives in heir hearts and minds and heir blood..That is why when they are cast out in Rev 13-11 these speak as he dragon…

All I can say to complete this is no wonder God does not reveal his mysteries,, mens mind are packed with so many lies they cannot accept truth …

Ok Ruth, I’ll leave this debate with whatever you want to believe, because that is what you are going to do anyway. If you have done this with the obvious interpretation, I’m afraid know how you have interpreted the other issues in Revelation.

The woman in Rev. 12 in heavenly places..
Eph 1-3..Blessed be the God and Father of our Lord Jesus Christ, who hath blessed us with all spiritual blessings in heavenly places in Christ:
Eph. 2-6…And hath raised us up together, and made us sit together in heavenly places in Christ Jesus…The woman is the Christian church…The stars in her crown are the Christians… Jesus even told us stars are the angels of the church… Rev 1-20..He also told us He is the resurrection and those he is resurrected in (born again) are as angels..

The dragon in Rev 12 in heavenly places..
Eph. 3-10…To the intent that now unto the principalities and powers in heavenly places might be known by the church the manifold wisdom of God,..When Satan invades the heavenly realm God begins to reveal his wisdom to the church as he does in Rev 12-14……
Also Isaiah 14-13..Lucifer invades the heavens…

When Jesus said he beheld Satan as lightning fall from heaven he was speaking of the battle in Rev. 12.., a future event,, not a past even…As for Satan falling as lightning. …Jesus said Matt 24-17…For as the lightning cometh out of the east, and shineth even unto the west; so shall ALSO the coming of the Son of man be..He is telling us he will return when the lightning shines from the east to the west…..I am positive that lightning coming out of the east to the west means Satan and his kingdom of Islam will come out of the east to the western world and this includes Obama aka antichrist, aka Satan in flesh..The name BARACK means lightning…The name Barack is the name of the fallen angel who taught men astrology in the Garden of Eden.. So said ENOCH….HE DOES NOT WIN…

I could tell you what The Lord has done in my life – but these Psalms can give you an insight (Psalm 88, 51, 40, 23:1-3 and 27).

Yes, I also have 40 years of evangelical church attendance along with graduate theological seminary – big deal. My righteousness is but filthy rages (Isaiah 64:6).

I could tell you the visions, dreams and “words of knowledge” He gave me. Visions graciously given that were fulfilled and one vision that will be fulfilled in the coming months, thank you Lord.

I could tell you of my deliverance from demonic oppression, my ministering deliverance to others, sharing/teaching this deliverance ministry with dear brothers-in-Christ (Mark 16:17-18), which no one in my 40+ years of church attendance or graduate seminary shared with me.

Those churches mostly taught milk and served milkshakes for desert.

Those graduate school divinity professors from Yale, John Hopkins, University of Chicago, University of Edinburgh and other renown scholarly institutions were smart men and knew the books of the Bible but did not know solid food.

I could tell you of accounts when my dear brothers-in-Christ received understanding/comprehension of deliverance then ministered deliverance to others, “setting the captives free”. One account of deliverance by a dear friend led a women to accept Jesus as Savior and Lord. Thank you Lord!

I could tell you of doing spiritual battle with witches working their pagan spells during church services and applying spells to children’s toys. A small band of the Lord’s Army rebuked those spells and disrupted the voodoo queens’ work in that church, thank you Lord.

I could tell you of wolves standing in pulpits, leading spiritually blind sheep.

The enemy is within so many “Bible teaching churches” and the enemy laughs at the stupid, dumb sheep (Hosea 4:6) and their fat Shepherds (Ezekiel 34). The enemy speak so discreetly so no one will notice (Psalm 64).

The evangelical church is filled with “Bible Study”. That is the message of Hebrews 5:12-14.

You want to talk solid food?

Here is evidence of solid food.

In the mighty name of Jesus – advance the Kingdom by binding/casting out demons (setting the captives free), rebuking witches and break their dark, evil spells. Walk around schools, office buildings and church buildings tearing down strongholds by calling down warrior angles from Heaven. Overall – advance on the gates of Hell (which shall not prevail) and give testimony of supernatural, blessed results – thank you Lord!

Once you can tell me of such accounts (I want to learn that you have bound and cast out demons from the flesh in the name of Jesus), then – I’ll know that you comprehend what solid food is and what it accomplishes in the name of Jesus and for the glory of Almighty God. I’m speaking specifically of deliverance ministry such as the 72 recorded in Luke 10, the accounts in the acts of the Apostles and by Jesus.

You suggest that I don’t know, misinterpret or maybe twist Scriptures, right?

I’ve tried to get your attention – different ways within various pages of Heaven Awaits and it has not been effective.

This is my last attempt.

Since the Lord gave me this understanding of solid food, the application of His Word and I have evidence, witnesses to these accounts – you should be able to concluded that I am competent in matters of spiritual discernment and interpretation of Scriptures beyond graduate divinity school education. In addition, (as an intelligence indicator/measurement for some) I also hold a Masters of Science degree, published in 2 college business text books and a professional journal. But big deal, I want to be an active soldier in the Lord’s Army and a servant until He returns.

So then, there is so “pre-trib rapture”. He told His disciples what all His followers understand (Matthew 24:29-31).

I want you to be prepared to endure and overcome until the end (Matthew 24:29-31) so you can trample on the ashes (Malachi 4:1-3).

Here is what the Word tells us, “He who has an ear, let him hear what the Spirit says to the churches. ‘The one who conquers will not be hurt by the second death’”(Revelation 2:11).

“He who overcomes and keeps My works to the end, to him I will give power over the nations and he shall rule them with a rod of iron. And I will give him the morning star” (Rev 2:26-28).

We overcome him by the blood of the Lamb and by the words of their testimony, and they did not love their lives to the death (Revelation 12:11, NKJV).

Yes DJ, your credentials I’m sure are true, but the fact is that when it comes to the book of Revelation and Scripture regarding end time events, you haven’t a clue. You think you do, but the reality is that you don’t. Everything must be supported by Scripture and neither you nor Ruth, nor Allan have any idea of what Revelation is saying and that’s the truth. You apply symbolic and spiritual interpretations where none is required and when it is required, you apply your own meanings instead of the ones that God has provided. But let’s watch and see, for the truth of this matter will eventually be revealed and then we will all know who was accurately interpreting Scripture. It seems that the only thing that we can agree on is Christ crucified, buried and resurrected, that is of course you are one of those who claims that his resurrection was spiritual and not bodily. Those people, like you also think that they are right, but they don’t even understand that by believing that, they are denying the Lord who bought them. So far nothing that you have said proves anything. So, I guess we agree to disagree.

It is a system that once conceived of building a tower (Babel) when the nations (peoples of the world) all spoke one language.

They came together back then under one ruler of the mighty kingdom. Babylon openly, publicly, corporately rebelled against God. The tower was their effort and a representation of the rebellion.

The Beast is now all cleaned up (very nice and appealing), with a new, modern identify (www, media, banking, military with mass destruction weapons, UN political agenda, Islam and other religions that do not accept God’s Son as the Messiah), having one common language again (English).

The Beast (in all it’s ways and methods) has the same purpose as the days of Babylon and that tower of old.

Can you see it? Can you smell it?

But here is the Good News:

“Little children, make sure no one deceives you; the one who practices righteousness is righteous, just as He is righteous; the one who practices sin is of the devil; for the devil has sinned from the beginning. The Son of God appeared for this purpose, to destroy the works of the devil” (1st John 3:7-8).

I don’t disagree with what you wrote here. In fact I have said much the same before about the Beast….I call what you wrote about a “Beast System” because it permeates all aspects of society and our lives. The over powering “beast sytem” entrenches upon every aspects of our lives. So again, I agree with you here.

The Beast system is Satan’s system that effects every part of our lives and is opposed to God’s way, or if you want, God’s “system”…..ie: how His kingdom of righteousness operates.Satan is the “god of this world” presently. Doesn’t mean this IS his world- just that he is the “god” of it.

However, there is ALSO an individual in scripture known as the Beast. Another name for the Beast is the man of sin, the son of perdition, the little horn and of course, the Antichrist

So there is in fact a “beast system” of which there will be a FINAL BEAST PERSON who rules this “beast system” in it’s final days, which is know as the “tribulation”. He rules but for a short while as He is given that allotment of time by God to rule. But only for a short time…ie, the last 3.5 years of the tribulation known as “great tribulation” of the saints.

So yes, what you are saying is true but there is also a BEAST individual known as the Antichrist with a capital A, not a little “a” of which, we , there are many “antichrists”.

Hi, from the comments above many believe the US is the center of the end time scenario. The US will be destroyed in WW III. For God it is all about Israel. Christians are grafted onto the Jews (Read Romans). Who is the enemy of God and His children: Islam. The number for Islam is 666! Babylon in the Bible is Babylon, not Rome. If it was Rome then the Bible would say so. Who wants to kill all the Jews and Christians, Islam! Islam is presently killing all the Christians/catholics in the Middle East. Do not be deluded, the enemy of God’s people is Islam, they are the bride of Satan. When Satan makes his final assault on God and is rebuffed and cast to the earth his fury will have no bounds (Rev 12:7-9). No longer will he recognize any restraints by God. What is more, like in the case of Job (Job 2:6), God will hand the SAINTS over to him for 3½ years: Dan 7:25 “He will speak against the Most High and oppress his SAINTS and try to change set times and the laws. The SAINTS will be handed over to him for a time, times, and half a time (3½ years). It should be noted that the SAINTS are those who have the Holy Spirit or Seed.
There are two time periods mentioned here. A 1,290 day period, and a 1,335 day period. The 1,290 days is the period from when this beast abolishes the daily sacrifice and the time when he actually SETS UP the image or abomination. The second period of 1,335 days covers the period of the Great Tribulation which begins immediately after the image is set up (Matt 24:15-21).
Forget imminent rapture, do you see the New Temple in Jerusalem? Before the New Temple is built the Dome of the Rock must be removed, it is on Holy ground. So, we must have at least 2 wars before this rebuilding. Psalm 83 and WW III. God bless the enlightened.

Who is the Anti-Christ
Bro. Rowley – As I appreciate your great testimony on the other post. I mean you no harm. Yes Islam is an Anti-Christ movement. But so is Hinduism, Buddahism, and every other ism in the world. Politics in general is a religious group of men pounding out their agenda for their anti-Christ movements. Yet the Vatican is controlling all of them. The Vatican stands alone and cannot be touched as it even joined Hitler’s movement and still remained in power after that. Saying it was neutral was a lie. She will do anything to keep her power.

Even in this day we still have a “Maximus Pontiff ” over all of religions. The C.C has got its fingers in all politics, governments, and religions. They are the Richest entity on the planet at the moment. “They are known to have MORE GOLD than any other government.” The Vatican is located on 300 mile circle of property that even Italy has no power over or any other Nation. As you can see. They are now changing their polices to fit the culture of the world as well. But they always have.

It just shocks me that after 1000 years of darkness in the pit of hell. It ruled the Earth and conquered most of the world. Even the U.S. They have a voice in all the seats in all the nations. And the Bible says “satan” will be loosed out of the pit for a season. And it has Risen again.

When a so called entity makes their leader “Thee Prophet” and says that he is the replacement for Jesus Christ. IN the Name of Christianity. That makes the government of the Vatican the worst anti-Christ in the world. And it has succeeded in deceiving every denomination on the planet. Try to make war with her and her doctrines.

But her day is coming very soon. She will be blown off the map by Russia. I believe in the near future. It has been prophesied and it will happen. By some Nation. The USA and world has for a long time been in the Great Tribulation. Tribulation means “Extreme Pressure, Stressed out, its a sense of “Perplexity” of all nations, and no answer for the people of the world. Because something bad is going to happen soon. Like a Lamb in thick weeds dances around very nervous and yet does not see the Lion crouched down in the weeds ready to devour the little guy. That is the way it is in American. And the whole world today in most cases.

A true Prophet will always tell you fear Romanism even over communism. And history has showed us the truth that Communism always follows Romanism. Look at Europe today. Romanism has never faded away.

“Islam is not going to deceive anybody to except Christ.”

But even now when the ” Great Pontiff Maximus” can stand up and the WHOLE WORLD will listen to the Christian leader of all denominations.

The anti-Christ in Jesus day was Israel, and Imperial Rome uniting and – killing Messiah — today it is the Christian denominations and Papal Rome. uniting all Religions together. Jesus said BEWARE and BE NOT DECIEVED I have told you all things. WW ONE and or WW TWO were the warning signs to mankind that man cannot make peace with their God. WW 3. Comes in this last World = AGE = world means age. This age is passing right over us and eternity is all that will be left. Rev. 10:6 – Then I believe the Lord will start another New heaven and Earth but that is just my thought.

Hi Tom, thanks for your reply. Let us see hat the Word says:Rev 17:1 “..Come, I will show you the punishment of the great prostitute, who sits on many waters.” The reference to ‘many waters’ is a marker for a previous prophecy: Jer 51:12 “…The LORD will carry out His purpose, His decree against the people of Babylon. You who live by many waters and are rich in treasures, your end has come, the time for you to be cut off.” Again and again, the Bible positively identifies Babylon!
In the book of Revelation, the many waters are identified. They are nations, tribes and kings: Rev 17:15 “Then the angel said to me, ‘The waters you saw, where the prostitute sits, are peoples, multitudes, nations and languages.'” These waters are her harlot daughters. They are peoples, multitudes, nations and languages – NOT churches!
Continuing Rev 17:2 “With her the kings of the earth committed adultery, and the inhabitants of the earth were intoxicated with the wine of her adulteries. Then the angel carried me away in the spirit into a desert. There I saw a woman SITTING on a scarlet beast that was covered with blasphemous names and had seven heads and ten horns. The woman was dressed in purple and scarlet, and was glittering with gold, precious stones and pearls. She held a golden cup in her hand, filled with abominable things and the filth of her adulteries. This title was written on her forehead: MYSTERY BABYLON THE GREAT THE MOTHER OF PROSTITUTES AND OF THE ABOMINATIONS OF THE EARTH.” Almighty God pulls no punches with this dreadful creature!
If this were referring to Rome, why does it say BABYLON? Rome had existed for at least a 1,000 years before this. It makes no sense at all for John to do such a thing, and particularly since much of what he wrote is pointed to from the Old Covenant prophets. We should also remember that when John penned these verses, the Roman Empire was already ruling most of the world. In V7 the angel explains the meaning behind all this: “Then the angel said to me, “Why are you ASTONISHED? I will explain to you the mystery of the woman and of the beast she rides, which has the seven heads and ten horns. The beast, which you saw, once was, NOW IS NOT, and will come up out of the ABYSS and go to HIS destruction.” So the angel tells us that this beast was not around at that time. This clearly rules out the Roman Empire that WAS ruling at that time!
Now we come to a scripture that requires wisdom to understand! V9 “This calls for a mind with wisdom. The seven heads are seven mountains [Str: oros] on which the woman SITS.” Rev 17:1 tells us that the woman SITS on many waters and identifies these as peoples, multitudes, nations and languages (V15). The waters and the mountains are where the woman SITS, and they are peoples, multitudes, nations and languages. The woman and the beast she rides, represent two beasts; one who arises from the sea (Rev 13:1) and the other that arises from the earth (Rev 13:11).
Continuing Rev 17:9 “The seven heads are seven mountains on which the woman SITS. They are also seven kings. Five have fallen, ONE IS, the other has not yet come; but when he does come, he must remain for a little while. The beast who once was, and now is not, is an eighth king. He belongs to the seven and is going to his destruction.” Here we are plainly told that five of these kings had already fallen when John recorded the Book of Revelation. But one king still remained! What king is this? ‘The beast that once was’ was no longer around at that time, but the sixth king was! The first five kings had already fallen, but he was still around! Who was he? The Bible reveals all! And shortly we will discover who he is.
You can dredge up all the evils of the Roman Empire, and you can identify all the monstrous evils committed by the Catholic Church over many hundreds of years, but nothing in the Scriptures identifies them as either the beast or Babylon the Great! God tells us that this beast did not exist (Rev 17:9-10) at the time He delivered this information to John! History records that the Roman Empire did exist at that time! You either believe God or you call Him a liar! The choice is yours! Most people, it seems, prefer to believe the false prophets!
The Bible is either the Word of God or it is not! If it is, then it means what it says! The prophet Jeremiah confirms what John says: Jer 51:49 “BABYLON must fall because of Israel’s slain, just as the slain in ALL the earth have fallen because of BABYLON.”
in Hab 3:13 he saw ‘the leader of the land of wickedness’ crushed, and stripped from head to foot: “You crushed the leader of the land of wickedness, you stripped him from head to foot.” The book of Revelation describes the demise of the leader of Babylon: Rev 17:16 “The Beast and the ten horns will hate the prostitute (Babylon). They will bring her to ruin and leave her naked.” In both accounts the leader of Babylon is crushed and left naked along with the leader.
Hab 1:5 “Look at the nations and watch – and be utterly amazed. For I am going to do something in your days that you would not believe, even if you were told. I am raising up the Babylonians, that ruthless and impetuous people, who sweep across the whole earth to seize dwelling-places not their own. They are a feared and dreaded people; they are a law to themselves and promote their own honour.” God left no doubt at all of when the Babylonians would sweep across the earth. He even speaks of the final outcome in the same Book of Habakkuk. Hab 2:2 “The the LORD replied: “Write down the revelation, and make it plain in tablets so that a herald may run with it. For the revelation awaits an appointed time; it speaks of the end and will not prove false. Though it linger, wait for it; it will certainly come and will not delay.” We all know when the end comes, don’t we? (1Cor 15:24). This is when Christ destroys all dominion, authority and power and puts all His enemies under His feet. And the last enemy to be destroyed is Death himself (he’s mentioned in Rev 6:8). Since God’s words speak of an appointed time – they speak of the end, we are further advised of which time this is: Hab 2:14 “For the earth will be filled with the knowledge of the Glory of the LORD, as the waters cover the sea.” Only God’s true servants believe God, and this is the way it’s always been. Hab. 3:3 “God came from Teman, the Holy One from Mount Paran. His Glory covered the heavens and His praise filled the earth.” Teman is Saudi Arabia today, and Mount Paran is just beyond the borders of little Israel. These are the regions where Esau (Edom) settled, and are still there today! Isaiah tells us exactly what He plans to do there (Isa 3:1-6). Gog (Antichrist) will be the guardian of Libya, Persia and Somalia/Sudan (Cush).
The prudent in the western Church will begin to realize that the Antichrist system will not be the European Union – as modern prophecy buffs have stated for years – but an Islamic Union led by Turkey. In Zechariah 9:13, the Lord declares:
“I will rouse your sons, O Zion, against your sons, O Yavan.”
In this passage, Israel is seen fighting against Ionia or Yavan, not the European Union. In several Bibles, this word is translated as “Greece” but Ionia/Yavan was simply a province that was located on the western coast of modern Turkey. This is crucial because the clear context of this battle is the return of Christ: “Then Jehovah will appear over them” and fight on their behalf. So in the End-Times, at the time when Jesus returns, the Jews (Zion) will be engaged in a war with Turkey (Yavan).
Arabia is the mouthpiece (mouth of a lion), which Islam emanates from. It is the Harlot from the desert Island (Revelation 17:3) that sits on many waters, the “desert of the sea” (Isaiah 21) which John saw.
The Antichrist is said to rule from Pergamum (Revelation 2:12-13), which Christ proclaimed would be the future seat of Satan. This is on the sides of the northern lands (Asia Minor / Turkey).
Blessed are the enlightened.

The scriptures you site can only be on nation and one location. One nation with many tribes, peoples and the center of world commerce (“rich in treasures”). The world really hate US – wealth, power, and all that goes with a such a woman. The animosity has grown more so thanks to the NSA leaks.

Did you know that the stage from which BHO spoke (when he accepted the nomination) was a representation of Pergamum’s temple?

“Scholars identify this throne or ‘seat’ as the Great Altar of Zeus that existed in Pergamos at that time. So important was the worship of Zeus in ancient Pergamos that perpetual sacrifices were offered to him upon the towering and famous 40-foot high altar. Antipas, the first leader and martyr of the early Christian church is believed to have been slain on this altar, slowly roasting to death inside the statue of a bull [the symbol of Wall Street no less], the symbol and companion of Zeus. The phrase in Revelation 2:13 “wherein Antipas was my faithful martyr, who was slain among you, where Satan dwelleth” is considered a citation of this event.”

I wrote out the following on another page within Heaven Awaits. It seems to fit with what you posted above.

Here are a few pennies worth of thoughts out of my bank regarding this mystery.

She is not a woman (but a “Jezebel spirit”) just as she does not sit literally on a city with 7 mountains.

Spiritually – she sits on the seven deadly sins (Proverbs 6).

The Heavens, Holy Apostles and Prophets rejoice over this city’s destruction, for God has avenged them – why?

Let’s look at this with spiritual eyes to see 7 mountains of a city (center of commerce for the world) identified for destruction in that day (very soon).

Jesus said, ”Truly I say to you, whoever says to this mountain, ‘Be taken up and cast into the sea,’ and does not doubt in his heart, but believes that what he says is going to happen, it will be granted him” (Mark 11:23,NASB).

The seven mountains upon which she sits (spiritually) are found in Proverbs 6:16-19.

These mountains are the roadblock/barrier to Apostles, Prophets, Evangelists, Pastors and Teachers ( Ephesians 4:11). This is a reason why they rejoice in Heaven.

A spiritual celebration is heard because these 7 sins on which she sits hinder the work of saving souls for Christ and are removed, thrown into the sea (as it were). Read what happens with some folks as a result of the fall of this great city (NYC) in Revelation 18:19.

So what about Revelation 17:9, “Here is the mind which has wisdom” (Proverbs).

Let’s read some wisdom, shall we?

“These six things the Lord hates, yes seven (7) are an abomination to Him:
1) A proud look,
2) A lying tongue,
3) Hands that shed innocent blood, (which includes abortions),
4) A heart that devises wicked plans,
5) Feet that are swift in running to evil,
6) A false witness who speaks lies,
7) And one who sows discord among brethren.

The first and seventh are the greatest hinderances (demonic) to the work of spreading the Gospel.

As for 7 mountains this could represent the 7 continence, natural realm not spiritually.

The 7 mountains could also represent (spiritually) those sins in Proverbs – Satan took Jesus upon the “highest mountain” giving Jesus a choice. I don’t think that was Mt. Everest or a mountain overseeing Rome or Jerusalem either.

Pride is the first and the highest of the “mountains” (deadly sins).

Rev 18:8 says this events is very powerful because she is Proud!

What great city sitting on many waters (commerce center of the world today) operating in a system (Beast driven, not honoring God), that is filled with these 7 sins?

A proud city (think “New York, New York” by Frank Sinatra) in a proud country (“I’m A Yankee Doodle Dandy”), taken down short order.

Keeping on the pop music list of the past 100 years, think Don McLean:
“So, bye bye Ms. American Pie.”

“Therefore her plagues will come in one day—death and mourning and famine. And she (NYC) will be utterly burned with fire, for strong is the Lord God who judges her.”

My reading of the end of the age (Matthew 24), is that we are within the mid-point of seven years, which began about 10/09/09.

When this catastrophic event [destruction of that great city] takes place maybe the churches (6 of 7), pay attention and repents (revival).

Rev 18:19 says some put on sackcloth/ashes, while those worshiping the Beast move on, giving their kingdom to the Beast.

What will the people of the world (other parts of the USA too), think and do when this great city is destroyed in a very short time (an hour)?

Again, pay attention to what happens in Revelation 18:19, because some repent!

“Then he said to me, “The waters which you saw, where the harlot sits, are peoples, multitudes, nations, and tongues. And the ten horns which you saw on the beast, these will hate the harlot (NYC/USA), make her desolate and naked, eat her flesh and burn her with fire (da bomb).

For God has put it into their hearts to fulfill His purpose, to be of one mind, and to give their kingdom to the beast, until the words of God are fulfilled.

And the woman (a Jezebel spirit – as we read in all of Marianne’s pages and the list of sins in Proverbs), whom you saw is (represented by) that great city (NYC), which reigns (Wall Street, NY Federal Reserve Bank, and the One World Center – “Tower”), over the kings of the earth (Rev 17: 15-19, NKJV, and my interpretations).

The Lord shows us what Babylon is in Genesis 11- 4 And they said, Go to, let us build us a city and a tower, whose top may reach unto heaven; and let us make us a name, lest we be scattered abroad upon the face of the whole earth…

The city of Babylon was the congregation of all those who worshiped the same name. Of God..

For instance Christians gathered throughout the world in the name of Jesus..This constitutes a city aka New Jerusalem..They are not scattered but gathered in the name of Jesus…

Likewise with Babylon…But Babylon of Rev. 17 and 18 is no widow…Could this be a direct reference to the Jesus Muslims say died a natural death and was not resurrected which means all Christians are widows.

Babylon has been in existence since the tower of Babel…It is/was of the ancient astrology lore..Nimrod is the first king of Babylon..Genesis 10-10 and Rev. 17-10..I am not sure who the second to sixth king is but I am pretty sure Mohammed was the seventh king….Islam is an offshoot of the Babylonian astrology lore…Mohammed just named Allah who was the ancient moon god of astrology as the god of Abraham…The “satanic” verses of Koran show who Allah really was..The satanic verses name Allah’s three moon god daughters…Koran 53-19, 20..

Mohammed was the antichrist…He was a complete counterfeit of messiah Jesus..He built his synagogue of Satan on the lie that Jesus is not Son of God…That should be proof enough for anyone that Mohammed was the antichrist…Mohammed as he said and as the Bible substantiates is the eighth king of Rev 17-10…that returns as the antichrist we must face today..He said he would return in his family name.. That name is Hussein…He said he would be as the sunrise in the west…This means the apollyon in the western world…Research Obama’s name and logo and see if it fits…

Rev. 18-..23 And the light of a candle shall shine no more at all in thee; and the voice of the bridegroom and of the bride shall be heard no more at all in thee: for thy merchants were the great men of the earth; for by thy sorceries were all nations deceived…THESE are the fallen stars (Christians ) of Revelation 12 -4 and 13-11..that have been incorporated into the beast’s congregation…

The fallen stars of Rev 12-4 is one third of the Christians.. the other two thirds are hid away and God reveals the lies of the dragon to them..Islam is being exposed now…
But before the dragon departs he tries again to cause the woman to be carried away from the real God.. He sends a FLOOD, (of words that they might drown in perdition.)….Revelation 12-15..
I relate this is one thing..Perdition..
1 Timothy 6-9..But they that will be rich fall into TEMPTATION and a SNARE, and into many foolish and hurtful lusts, which DROWN men in destruction and PERDITION.

Hebrews 10
.38 Now the just shall live by faith: but if any man draw back, my soul shall have no pleasure in him.
39 But we are not of them who draw back unto perdition; but of them that believe to the saving of the soul.

These two verss in Hebrew show clearly that drawing back is drawing back to old covenant laws in lieu of FAITH..and that is perdition..

“My little children, I write you these things so that you may not violate God’s law and sin. But if anyone should sin, we have an Advocate (One Who will intercede for us) with the Father—[it is] Jesus Christ [the all] righteous [upright, just, Who conforms to the Father’s will in every purpose, thought, and action]. And He [that same Jesus Himself] is the propitiation (the atoning sacrifice) for our sins, and not for ours alone but also for [the sins of] the whole world.

And this is how we may discern [daily, by experience] that we are coming to know Him [to perceive, recognize, understand, and become better acquainted with Him]: if we keep (bear in mind, observe, practice) His teachings (precepts, commandments).

Whoever says, I know Him [I perceive, recognize, understand, and am acquainted with Him] but fails to keep and obey His commandments (teachings) is a liar, and the Truth [of the Gospel] is not in him.

But he who keeps (treasures) His Word [who bears in mind His precepts, who observes His message in its entirety], truly in him has the love of and for God been perfected (completed, reached maturity). By this we may perceive (know, recognize, and be sure) that we are in Him: Whoever says he abides in Him ought [as a personal debt] to walk and conduct himself in the same way in which He walked and conducted Himself”(1st John 2:1-6, Amplified).

Now consider Peter’s letter.

“…be diligent to be found by him without spot or blemish, and at peace. And count the patience of our Lord as salvation, just as our beloved brother Paul also wrote to you according to the wisdom given him, as he does in all his letters when he speaks in them of these matters.

There are some things in them that are hard to understand, which the ignorant and unstable twist to their own destruction, as they do the other Scriptures.

You therefore, beloved, knowing this beforehand, take care that you are not carried away with the error of lawless people [neglect the teachings/application of the law], and lose your own stability.

But grow in the grace and knowledge of our Lord and Savior Jesus Christ. To him be the glory both now and to the day of eternity. Amen” (2 Peter 3:14-18).

Now consider Psalm 119.

Blessed are those whose way is blameless,
who walk in the law of the Lord!
Blessed are those who keep his testimonies,
who seek him with their whole heart,
who also do no wrong,
but walk in his ways!
You have commanded your precepts
to be kept diligently.
Oh that my ways may be steadfast
in keeping your statutes!
Then I shall not be put to shame,
having my eyes fixed on all your commandments.
I will praise you with an upright heart,
when I learn your righteous rules.
I will keep your statutes;
do not utterly forsake me!

You rebuke the insolent, accursed ones,
who wander from your commandments.
Take away from me scorn and contempt,
for I have kept your testimonies.
Even though princes sit plotting against me,
your servant will meditate on your statutes.
Your testimonies are my delight;
they are my counselors.

Teach me, O Lord, the way of your statutes;
and I will keep it to the end.
Give me understanding, that I may keep your law
and observe it with my whole heart.
Lead me in the path of your commandments,
for I delight in it.
Incline my heart to your testimonies,
and not to selfish gain!
Turn my eyes from looking at worthless things;
and give me life in your ways.
Confirm to your servant your promise,
that you may be feared.
Turn away the reproach that I dread,
for your rules are good.
Behold, I long for your precepts;
in your righteousness give me life!

DJ, i am not sure what direction you think I am headed but if it is about Christians falling away that is prophesied.. 2 Thessalnains 2…We are living in the hour of temptation now…Some Christians will fall sad to say… And some Christians will forsake faith and go backward to the laws and ordinances of Moses… The ordinances are said to be a curse in the old Testament and in daniel 9-11..The ordinances are not the 10 commandments but the laws Moses wrote after the Isralites made the golden calf….They are punishments for disobeying the ten commandments…About like Islam does, cut off hands, feet, kill for blasphemy, etc..When people love god and man correctly the ten commandments that God wrote are kept..As for the ordinances the Bible says Jesus nailed them to the cross..
..D.J. I hve never depended on men’s knowledge to help me under
stand the Scripture.. I depend on God only and he has taught me much..

2 Colossians 2-14, 18…
14 Blotting out the handwriting of ordinances that was against us, which was contrary to us, and took it out of the way, nailing it to his cross;

15 And having spoiled principalities and powers, he made a shew of them openly, triumphing over them in it.

16 Let no man therefore judge you in meat, or in drink, or in respect of an holyday, or of the new moon, or of the sabbath days:

Satan’s doctrines is what changed Adam from God’s image to an image like unto the serpent and his wisdom…Genesis 3-15
The pharisees of Matthew 23 -15 by proseltizing their doctrine change men into two fold men of hell..
Both examples become desolate of God’s spirit because of the doctrines they believed..
As I see it the abomination that makes men desolate is a gospel that goes over the entire world…Matthew 24-11, 14,15..11 And many false prophets shall rise, and shall deceive many.
14 And this gospel of the kingdom shall be preached in all the world for a witness unto all nations; and then shall the end come.
15 When ye therefore shall see the abomination of desolation, spoken of by Daniel the prophet, stand in the holy place, (whoso readeth, let him understand:)
I thiink Jesus added whosoever readeth let him understand is in reference to the gospel that is preached in all the world..
I think the holy place means the gospel of satan is standing in the place of the gospel of Christ, maybe more..Zech 5-1,3 speaks of this (roll) gospel that goes over the entire world and it is called a curse…CURSE is spelled ALAH in Hebew.

The gospel of Christ was preached in all the world before the apsotles died.. That is in scripture..

The word perdition is a revealing word… For instnce the Christians who fall away from Jesus in 2 Thessalonians 2 become sons of perdition..
.
Jesus said While I was with them in the world, I kept them in thy name: those that thou gavest me I have kept, and none of them is lost, but the son of perdition; that the scripture might be fulfilled.

But we are not of them who draw back unto perdition; but of them that believe to the saving of the soul..

And the beast that was, and is not, even he is the eighth, and is of the seven, and goeth into perdition.
Does drawing back mean to draw back to old covenant….Which i find very informative that the beast of Rev. 13 and Islam both apparently teach old covenant which leads to death , not to life.. 2 Corinthians 3-7..

You didn’t read those verses from Peter, John and Psalm 119 – did you?

Okay, after reading those – please read Rev. Chapters 2 and 3. Those messages to da churches is to us, today. The churches are not doing what is commanded, trust and obey, or what He has told us to do.

Notice the warnings.

There is nothing in those chapters about “falling back to the law”. The Church is to trust and obey.

What is about to be opened (seal 4) tests the faith, hope and love of 6 of the 7 Churches.

I think the Philly Church is in no way a denomination or the evangelical church of America. Those churches are filled with spots and has so many blemishes.

D.J. I think you misunderstand some of the things I have said…I know the ten commandments are still in effect.. I also know that if we love God and man as Jesus said we obey the ten commandments…
I also do not think the entire Christian body falls away, only possibly one third..These draw back into perdition whether it be with the Islamic beast or Christians who really believe old covenant over new covenant which is also falling back into perdition..Nothing abut the old covenant can save a man for eternity..If it could there would be no need of the new covenant..
I think Jews and all have to come through Jesus..He is the door..
An interesting Scripture. Is the first shall be last and the last first…I think this is in regard to the Jews who were first and the Christians who are last….In the same breathe It also says many are called but few are chosen…And that is defined as being, the chosen have their wedding garments on, and the ones not chosen do not have a wedding garment on…Sounds like serious business to me.. Since those without a wedding garment are cast into outer darkness..I just do not know for sure if these verses relate to Christians and Jews or Christians and tares…Do you know????

He is lawless – and they follow along, by not following God’s commandments, statues etc.

Keep it up and I’ll just quote Scriptures over and over again.

Peter, John know the truth. Just read it.

“My little children, I write you these things so that you may not violate God’s law and sin…

And this is how we may discern [daily, by experience] that we are coming to know Him [to perceive, recognize, understand, and become better acquainted with Him]: if we keep (bear in mind, observe, practice) His teachings (precepts, commandments).

Whoever says, I know Him [I perceive, recognize, understand, and am acquainted with Him] but fails to keep and obey His commandments (teachings) is a liar, and the Truth [of the Gospel] is not in him.

But he who keeps (treasures) His Word [who bears in mind His precepts, who observes His message in its entirety], truly in him has the love of and for God been perfected (completed, reached maturity). By this we may perceive (know, recognize, and be sure) that we are in Him: Whoever says he abides in Him ought [as a personal debt] to walk and conduct himself in the same way in which He walked and conducted Himself”(1st John 2:1-6, Amplified).

Now consider Peter’s letter.

“…be diligent to be found by him without spot or blemish, and at peace. And count the patience of our Lord as salvation, just as our beloved brother Paul also wrote to you according to the wisdom given him, as he does in all his letters when he speaks in them of these matters.

There are some things in them that are hard to understand, which the ignorant and unstable twist to their own destruction, as they do the other Scriptures.

You therefore, beloved, knowing this beforehand, take care that you are not carried away with the error of lawless people [neglect the teachings/application of the law], and lose your own stability.

But grow in the grace and knowledge of our Lord and Savior Jesus Christ. To him be the glory both now and to the day of eternity. Amen” (2 Peter 3:14-18).

Now consider just a fee verses from Psalm 119.

Blessed are those whose way is blameless,
who walk in the law of the Lord!
Blessed are those who keep his testimonies,
who seek him with their whole heart,
who also do no wrong,
but walk in his ways!
You have commanded your precepts
to be kept diligently.
Oh that my ways may be steadfast
in keeping your statutes!
Then I shall not be put to shame,
having my eyes fixed on all your commandments.
I will praise you with an upright heart,
when I learn your righteous rules.
I will keep your statutes;
do not utterly forsake me!

You rebuke the insolent, accursed ones,
who wander from your commandments.
Take away from me scorn and contempt,
for I have kept your testimonies.
Even though princes sit plotting against me,
your servant will meditate on your statutes.
Your testimonies are my delight;
they are my counselors.

Teach me, O Lord, the way of your statutes;
and I will keep it to the end.
Give me understanding, that I may keep your law
and observe it with my whole heart.
Lead me in the path of your commandments,
for I delight in it.
Incline my heart to your testimonies,
and not to selfish gain!
Turn my eyes from looking at worthless things;
and give me life in your ways.
Confirm to your servant your promise,
that you may be feared.
Turn away the reproach that I dread,
for your rules are good.
Behold, I long for your precepts;
in your righteousness give me

Peter and John are writing to Believers! Simple – the introduction to these letters tell us so.

These are letters to “baby” (eating milk not solid food) Christians, warning them of false teachers with lawless (tickling ear) messages.

No matter, in a few weeks/months the “evangelical church” is going to wake up because most are a bunch of pretty, rich, naked foolish virgins (Rev. 3:14-21).

“The Amen Hebrew for “so be it”; here referring to Jesus], the faithful and true witness, ·the ruler of all God has made [1:5; Prov. 8:30–31; C the resurrected Jesus], says this [L these things]: I know ·what you do [your works], that you are not hot or cold. I wish that you were hot or cold [C both positive images, alluding to cold refreshing mountain streams and healing hot springs near Laodicea]!

But because you are lukewarm—neither hot, nor cold—I am ready to ·spit [vomit] you out of my mouth.

You say, ‘I am rich, and I have become wealthy and do not need anything.’ But you do not know that you are really ·miserable [wretched], pitiful, poor, blind, and naked. I advise you to buy from me gold ·made pure in [refined by] fire so you can be truly rich. Buy from me white clothes [C indicating purity] so you can be clothed and so you can cover your shameful nakedness. Buy from me ·medicine [salve; ointment] to put on your eyes so you can truly see.

“I correct [rebuke] and ·punish [discipline] those whom I love. So be ·eager to do right [zealous; earnest], and ·change your hearts and lives [repent]. ·Here I am [L Look; T Behold]! I stand at the door and knock. If ·you hear my voice and open the door, I will come in and eat with you, and you will eat with me.

“Those who ·win the victory [overcome; conquer] will sit with me on my throne in the same way that I ·won the victory [overcame; conquered; C over death, by his resurrection] and sat down with my Father on his throne. Everyone who has ears should ·listen to [hear; obey] what the Spirit says to the churches” (Rev. 3:14-22, Expanded Translation).

D.J. Do you think the pharisees who had Jesus and Stephen , etc. killed because of their blasphemy laws, etc. were correct??? There condemnied Jesus because He said He was Son of God…These law abiders were the anithchrist of Jesus day…These denied Jesus is Son of God and these said they worshipped Abraham’s God .. Jesus said these were children of satan… Jesus said these pharisees were SEED of Abraham, but not SON of Abraham..They were of Esau and Ishmael, not of Israel…
Did you know that Abraham was of faith and that the Gospel was preached to abraham Gal 3-8,10, 11. ….8 And the scripture, foreseeing that God would justify the heathen through faith, preached before the gospel unto Abraham, saying, In thee shall all nations be blessed.
10 For as many as are of the works of the law are under the curse: for it is written, Cursed is every one that continueth not in all things which are written in the book of the law to do them.
11 But that no man is justified by the law in the sight of God, it is evident: for, The just shall live by faith.

If one wants to go backward to old covenant laws and ordinances so be it… But be warned the old coveant laws and ordinances lead to death… Take you pick tree of life and faith or tree of death and cursed ordinances….

Eat what? Lies about the Word? You are not reading Peter or John’s letters.

Try this food from Psalms.

“I will bless the Lord at all times; His praise shall continually be in my mouth.
My soul shall make its boast in the Lord;The humble shall hear of it and be glad.

Oh, magnify the Lord with me, And let us exalt His name together. . . .Oh, taste and see that the Lord is good; Blessed is the man who trusts in Him!”(Psalm 34:1-3, 8).

Someone posted this essay as a reply a few days ago and it needs to follow your post.

“Look at Europe, the bastion of Christianity, with their massive cathedrals, religious statues and art work, still the home of the Catholic Church, the legacy of Emperor Constantine (one of the greatest false teacher of the past 2,000 years).

Europe is dead spiritually, with their empty cathedrals and a predominately secular view of life. Constantine and the organization he built was predicated on renouncing the faith of Hebrews (see the book of Hebrews), along with the Torah – all the while, by force, pursuing the Jewish people to convert through torture and murder, bordering on genocide.

What writings did they use to accomplish these things or define the direction they were taking? Was it not the Pauline letters that were misinterpreted (please read Peter’s letters again and again), thereby creating a new religion which was never the intent of Yah, though He allows it to accomplish His own end? Europe is now a hollow shell with little to show for their former glory.

Let’s look at the “Christian” nation, America (aka USA). The country was founded on Christian principles and theology without the Torah (written instructions from the hand of Yah, read Psalm 119 again and again along with Proverbs chapter 3). America, like every other nation preceding it, has turned into a reprobate nation that has lost every aspect of being considered set-apart (Kadosh-Holy).

Without specific instructions (Torah) to guide our actions, which in turn would at least have pointed us in the right direction, we were doomed from the beginning to go the way of the nations (goyim).

Obama was wrong when he said that we are not a Christian nation. We have become the epitome of a “Christian” nation (without instructions – (please read Proverbs 3 and Psalm 119).

We (USA) are the major exporter of pornographic material to the world; our military is now openly homosexual; we have openly aborted tens of millions of babies in the womb (Proverbs 6 and the truly 7 deadly sins), which is leading to after birth infanticide. If the fetus in the womb is a baby and we are able to “kill” it, then why should we not be able to kill a baby after it has been born?

This is out there and is seriously being discussed; homosexual marriages are currently legal in 7 states; homosexuals are ordained as ministers.

How did the nation that was the light to the world end up in this pitiful state? Was it not because we thought we were so spiritual that we didn’t need any instructions?

The truth is we are a people without a fence, without instruction, without moral order and (God’s) law (“liberty for all”, thank you ACLU).

We have become a nation that mirrors our “religion-no law” (see 2 Peter chapter 2).

Our end has been precipitated by a vagueness of what has been defined as being “righteous” (doing the right thing).

Our instructions need to be more than just saying we need to “Love” more. Once saved always saved, without accountability for our actions, has brought about our demise as a nation.

The best word to describe our condition is iniquity which basically means- lawlessness, being without law ( without Torah).

We have Messiah, but in a condition of iniquity. So, what do we really have? I am sure we will find out in the very near future at the Judgment Seat of Messiah!”

Please, keep it up e1313ruth and look for Scriptures to express what lawless is and what truth is – from the Word.

Warning – read Peter’s “Be ye holy as He is Holy”.

Try that without Psalm 119 and Proverbs 3, understanding John and Peter’s letters as quoted above in previous replies.

Hi DJ, interesting comments. I think most people interested in the end times know about Obama and the satanic rituals. Many people became aware when Clinton was the president that satanic forces were being employed. If you accept that the US is Ephraim then you can understand the blessing God has poured out on the US. You imply everyone now hates the US. I take you to task on this. Western civilization does not hate the US only Islam and their benefactors. Again, I reiterate, Islam is the enemy. All Islam hates Israel and the Jews, then the Christians. God made the US the protector of law & order. Take the US out of the equation and there will be lawlessness around the world. I am convinced the US is the “restrainer” of 2 Thess. Are we in the tribulation as you suggest? NO! Where is this peace accord between the enemies of Israel and Israel? Guess who will sign that accord. It will be headlines on CNN for weeks. It is Obama’s goal to get that “peace accord” or destroy Israel. Before we get to the mid point of the tribulation there must be a new Jewish Temple. Where is the antichrist going to sit if it is not there? (2 Thess 2). There is coming 4 blood moons, the orthodox Jews say at the eclipse of the sun there will be war. Either it will be the Pslam 83 or WW III war. I believe it will be the Psalm 83 war, I maybe wrong. From prophecy I have heard WW III comes when Hillary Clinton is president? Presently the Muslims do not want peace, they want war! The Illuminati want us all to be slaves to their system. Expect the next event on the world stage to be a colossal economic collapse of Biblical proportions, paper money will be worthless and we will buy and sell with plastic cards or the internet. One more step down the road to a NWO. Obama is the current catalyst but he may have passed the “sell by” date for the NWO with all the lies and corruption. Believers should prepare (prep), trust the Lord and pray. God bless.

The truth about 2 Thess. 2..
Now we beseech you, brethren, by the coming of our Lord Jesus Christ, and by our gathering together unto him, ,, 2 That ye be not soon shaken in mind, or be troubled, neither by spirit, nor by word, nor by letter as from us, as that the day of Christ is at hand………………….Paul tells us not to be shaken when people twist and lie about the word of God and the letters from the apostles..
3 Let no man deceive you by any means: for that day shall not come, except there come a falling away first, and that man of sin be revealed, the son of perdition;……………………Paul is telling us there will come a falling away from Christ that reveals the son(s) of perdition ..These were sons of god but have fallen away from Christ and accept Satan and are now sons of perdition..the indwelling of god or of Satan is what constitutes sons of god and sons of Satan..

4 Who opposeth and exalteth himself above all that is called God, or that is worshipped; so that he as God sitteth in the temple of God, shewing himself that he is God……………………..Satan is now sitting in the temple of God which is our bodies and saying he is God..

5 Remember ye not, that, when I was yet with you, I told you these things?

6 And now ye know what withholdeth that he might be revealed in his time…………………What withholds the revealing of Satan and his kids is that he is bound in the pit for 1000 years

7 For the mystery of iniquity doth already work: only he who now letteth will let, until he be taken out of the way……………….This mystery of iniquity that already works is the Broadway workers of iniquity of Mathew 7..These are the tares that grow up with the wheat till he days of separating and these tares are removed from THE WAY OF CHRIST…..

8 And then shall that Wicked be revealed, whom the Lord shall consume with the spirit of his mouth, and shall destroy with the brightness of his coming:…………………When these tares are removed from the way of Christ we will see them as they really are..Likewise Islam…

9 Even him, whose coming is after the working of Satan with all power and signs and lying wonders,………..The Lord includes the revelation of Satan and his gang.. 2 Corinthians 11-,3, 4,14 shows this is clearly Islam……aka the dragon beast of Rev 13..

10 And with all deceivableness of unrighteousness in them that perish; because they received not the love of the truth, that they might be saved….None of the above loved truth…

11 And for this cause God shall send them strong delusion, that they should believe a lie:Therefore God has sent strong delusion…That delusion is believing an imposter is God..aka allah… Isaiah 66-4, 5…

12 That they all might be damned who believed not the truth, but had pleasure in unrighteousness.These have earned the resurrction of the damned…which means satan will indwell them ….

6 And now ye know what withholdeth that he might be revealed in his time…………………What withholds the revealing of Satan and his kids is that he is bound in the pit for 1000 years….Note the words revealed in HIS TIME……Matthew 8-29 shows the demons knew they had a set time when they would be tormented with truth and exposed… …

Agree – I also think the “restrainer” is the US and the current government of the people and by the people will be set aside for marshal law. The “protection” given by the US “over” or standing behind Israel will end completely. The Lord will be with them.

Yes, the US dollar as the world’s currency standard will change and the US economy goes from flat to trash. I think China then leads the world economy/currency, giving “power” to the Beast (system). I’ve been expecting this since September 2012.

But, that is about as much as I am able to agree.

There is no need for a “peace agreement” because Scripture says “he confirms peace”. The meaning of the word confirms is to uphold what already is in place. Confirm. He did that already.

His first confirmation of peace with many occured on 09/09/09 at the UN (with many nations). Flip those numbers and you have one clue. There are many many clues given.

Here is why I think we are in the middle. It is by seeing the Sign in the Heavens (Rev. 21:1-5). Then, looking at the seals.

The sign in the heavens is a unique sign/marker that is not open to interpretation – it is as specific as the sign of His first coming – both conception and birth.

The heavenly Revelation sign (Rev. 12:1-5) is the sign of His return as well as a description of events.

Everyone agrees that the Star of Bethlehem was Regulus/Jupiter under Leo (2BC).

The science of astronomy agrees (majority) that this was the Star that brought the wise men from the east, seeking to worship the new born King.

So now – please read this study. At the end of the astronomy study comes the fig tree lesson (Matthew 24).

He spoke on a stage representing the alter of Zeus (Pergamon Acropolis), which is where Satan resides (Revelation 2:13).

He confirmed peace with many at the UN – first appearance at the UN was on 09/09/09 (flip those numbers). They like to hide thing in place sight (flipping things upside down).

He received a crown (Greek word “prize”) for peace on Feasts of Tabernacles 2009 (10/09/09). That is an important date (Feast) for future reference – 7 years out.

He, along with Middle-East leaders, Israel and a European Union representative, signed an arbitration agreement to re-start (confirming) the pease process in Washington DC (09/2010).

The second seal opened with Arab Spring (12/2010) in Tunisia, spreading throughout “the region” (Greek word definition, it is not KJV “earth”). He also gave one billion dollars (without Congressional approval, no problem at all) to the Brotherhood in Egypt a year or so later.

The third seal also opened (inflation/economic crises) in the region: from Greece to Spain and the Arab Spring counties, but it did not harm Israel (oil/wine), starting in 2011.

The 4th seal opens very soon.

I think seal 4 opens with Israel strike on Iran and a subsequent strike by someone on the US. But, I don’t know, just an educated guess.

All we know is death follows after the 4th seal, because the confirmation of peace is nullified by war.

He who rode the white horse and has a Nobel Peace Prize (crown), is setting up Israel to act alone in her own self defense by a first strike operation. So cleaver is this man of peace with a crown.

The US is the harlet riding the Beast (system) and NYC represents “the great city” that is destroyed in one hour. This could take place very soon.

Did you read “The Harbinger”? – the 9/11 sycamore becomes a cedar tree? This all occurred before Barry, telling us how vast The Beast (“illuminati”) is within our government and around the world.

This link (video) explains the “representations” within 9/11 and what is going on within The Beast (system – “illuminati”). This was before Barry.

I’ll post another link after you have time to read and see all I’ve put on this one. It can be information overload – all the information posted in one setting.

Also – the Temple artifacts, including the ashes of the red heifer are ready. The Ark is also known to a select few, coming forth when God is ready to being down the Dome. It will not take long to build. But, the key is not The Temple but The Ark of the Covenant.

I can not be moved from all of this evidence and there is more that I could share.

As I explained to the other guy within Heaven Awaits – personally, since May 2010, the Lord led me to comprehend deliverance (Mark 16:17-18), binding and casting out demons (applying this to myself then to 3 others), then teaching 2 other guys who also experienced deliverance and then those 2 guys ministered to others.

The Lord gave me a vision that was fulfilled and one vision what will be. So, I’m very confident of what I think, believe and trying to explain.

It all began for me – this journey of Him opening my eyes and ears – in the Spring of 2010, thank you Lord. I could tell you of witch confrontations and voodoo curse stories, asking and receiving angels to clean out demonic forces in buildings and a school but I did that already within Heaven Awaits on another page.

I’m confident that we are within the 7 years.

Hillary? Please – that is a distraction like “Nibi”, planet X. They want folks to be distracted and not prepared for tomorrow (sooner rather than later).

Allan – your not the first guy to lead me into this topic. I can almost cut/paste all the above from other posts/replies.

Scripture says:
“For the secret power of lawlessness is already at work; but the one who now holds it back will continue to do so till [he] is taken out of the way. And then the lawless one will be revealed”

“For the secret power of lawlessness is already at work”

The verse above shows that the restrainer was already holding back lawlessness during the apostle’s time. In the verse above, the restrainer is also referred to as a “He” referring to a person or individual.

“The one who [NOW] holds it back will [continue] to do so”

The same restrainer that was restraining during Paul’s time is the same one who is continuing to hold back the full power of lawlessness and the man of lawlessness to this very day. Therefore, since the United States didn’t exist during the apostle’s time, it could not be the restrainer.

DJ said:
“There is no need for a “peace agreement” because Scripture says “he confirms peace”. The meaning of the word confirms is to uphold what already is in place. Confirm. He did that already.

The confirming of the covenant is the initiation of it, that is, his making the covenant is what starts that last seven years. That he initiates the seven years is also evident by the words “In the middle of the seven,” that is, from the time of his confirming it until the middle of the seven (3 1/2 years later) he causes the sacrifice and offerings to cease and sets up that abomination.

The angel told Daniel that seventy ‘sevens’ are decreed upon your people and your holy city, sixty-nine of those ‘sevens’ were accomplished with Christ crucified (after seven ‘sevens’ and sixty-two ‘sevens’ the Anointed One would be cut off). One ‘seven’ remains and it begins when that ruler confirms it. He can’t be confirming an already existing covenant because it can only be seven years long according to the prophecy and therefore, he must be the one to establish it.

Hi DJ, thanks for the reply. Most of what you have written I have read and also watched the video a few months ago on this site. The Illuminati is using Islam as their one world religion because their god is Satan and they are under bondage and control? The Illuminati wants WW III so they can reduce the world population to initially 1 billion then down to 100 million. The Heritage sites are for their use only. There lived in South Africa a man of God who died in 1926. So far his visions/prophecy has been correct. We have our own civil war coming where the Christians will be fighting for their lives while Islam and Communism fight for an ideology. Fortunately for the Christians most of the Africans are Christians and the persecution of the African preachers by the Muslims has started. The Illuminati forced the whites out of Zimbabwe and then told the white South Africans, you have 20 years. To the day it happened, and South Africa was handed over to an Illuminati (Mandela). This site has the visionary, Senir Van Rensburg in the files. God bless the enlightened.

Here is wisdom let him that hath understanding count the Number of the Beast, for it is the Number of a Man, and his number is six hundred and three score and six”. Rev. 13:18

From the 2nd Century A.D. onwards, the interpretation “LATEINOS” has been given, because the numerical values of the letters add to 666. This identification was given by IRENAEUS, the disciple of POLYCARP (born A.D.70) who was a contemporary with the APOSTLE ST.JOHN the DIVINE who wrote the book of Revelation. It means Latin Man

L A T E I N O S
30 1 300 5 10 50 70 200 = 666

The official name or title of the popes is “Vicar of the Son of God”= ‘Vicariusfilii Dei – Means instead of the Son of God- Was written over the door of where the pope sit in the Vatican. And taken off in 1917 I believe. But he is still Vicariusfilii Dei today.

The official signature of the Pope is “Dux Cleri” which means “High or Chief Priest”. Thus, every time the Pope of Rome officially signs a document, he writes the Latin equivalent of the Number 666

D U X C L E R I
500 5 10 100 50 0 0 1 = 666

The Hebrew Word for this power is “Romith” – The Hebrew value being:

R O M I I TH
200 6 40 10 10 400 = 666

John used a puzzle called gematria in which numbers are used to represent certain letters. John used this puzzle to reveal Nero without actually writing down his name. Remember, the early churches were being persecuted during this time—not only from the Jews, but also from the Romans. The numerical values of the Hebrew letters in Neron Kesar (Nero Caesar) are:
￼
Nero Caesar fits the gematria code number “666.” Using this code, his name would be rendered as “NRWN QSR.” (NRWN QSR). The number values are:
N = 50
R = 200
W = 6
N = 50
Q = 100
S = 60
R = 200
which, when added together, equals 666. The fact that Nero fits the description of the “beast” is well documented. According to Suetonius, he murdered his parents, wife, brother, aunt, and many others close to him and of high station in Rome. He was a torturer, a homosexual rapist, and a sodomite. He even married two young boys and paraded them around as his wives. One of the boys, whose name was Sporus, was castrated by Nero. He was truly bestial in his character, depravity, and actions. He devised a kind of game: covered with the skin of some wild animal, he was let loose from a cage and attacked the private parts of men and women, who were bound at stakes. He also initiated the war against the Jews which led to the destruction of Jerusalem in 70AD..
Nero’s persecution, which was initiated in A.D.64, was the first ever Roman assault on Christianity. Roman historian Tacitus (A.D. 56-117) spoke of Nero’s “cruel nature” that “put to death so many innocent men.” He records the scene in Rome when the persecution of Christians broke out: “And their death was aggravated with mockeries, insomuch that, wrapped in the hides of wild beasts, they were torn to pieces by dogs, or fastened to crosses to be set on fire, that when the darkness fell they might be burned to illuminate the night.” Christians were crucified, beheaded, burnt alive, and used as torches to light the palace gardens. Historically, Nero is the one that persecuted Christians beyond all comparison. St. John’s banishment to Patmos (where he wrote the book of Revelation) was itself a result of the great persecution of Nero

I have to stick with the “Apostle John the Devine” on his interpretation of the number 666. And what it means. John and his generation knew who it was. Paul even told us as well. It was Nero. John and Paul were persecuted by him. Israel was the False prophet that was Spiritually devoid of understanding of Messiah. The only mystery to this is – The beast just changes their name from one age to another age. The beast left his trail in the 7 church ages. So easy to spot if you will just study the 7 church ages. Remember now that the 1st beast was Imperial Rome. It was destroyed and up rose the Papal Roman Empire of “clay’ that rides out to perdition as told of in Daniel. Completely into the 8th. Final day we are living in right now. From time into eternity. Rev. 10:6 We are seeing it now with our eyes of understanding and wisdom. We are living in the Great uniting gathering of Time into Eternity right now.
Question -Do you see any similarities of Nero’s Character to this present time. And the Rulers of the Nations as well.

Hi, interesting comments. Firstly, Lighthouse, remember, the Word says, “end times,” which if I understand the Bible basically starts with the return of the Jews to Israel. For God, it is all about Israel especially Jerusalem where Micheal, the archangel stands guard. If you get the “alternate” news sites, the atrocities in Syria, Africa, in fact the Middle East, Islam is as bad as Nero, if not worse. e1313, Satan is not bound up yet, that happens when Jesus returns, read Rev 20. No matter how the Illuminati or Satan plan, they are limited by God. The Illuminati hate the internet because people are quickly informed of their actions. Remember, “Thy Word is truth.” What God says will happen. The Illuminati wants to reduce the world population down to 100 million but the Bible has its own numbers. Satan will use any delusion he can to take one’s mind off Jesus. Be careful what you dig deep into, it could be a trap. God bless the enlightened.

Allen…
The one who puts Satan in the pit for 1000 years is not Jesus but an angel. In Rev 20-1 And I saw an angel come down from heaven, having the key of the bottomless pit and a great chain in his hand.
Let me show you …..
Rev 20-3.. 3 And cast him into the bottomless pit, and shut him up, and set a seal upon him, that he should DECEIVE the nations no more, till the thousand years should be fulfilled: and after that he must be loosed a little season.
Now let me show you HOW SATAN deceived the nations…
1 Corinthians 11-14, 3,4…Satan comes as an angel of light which means he comes as a messiah like Jesus..When he comes he brings another gospel that teaches another Jesus and another spirit…These are Mohammed, Koran, Issa and Allah…whereby Satan deceived the nations…
I think the 1000 years began after the last imam…

Mohammed knew he would return after 1000 years and wrote of it….
Koran..
.[20.102] On the day when theTRUMPETshall be blown, and We will gather the guilty, blue-eyed, on that day.THESE are NON ARABIC AND/OR NON MUSLIMS.
[20.103] They shall consult together SECRETLY: You did tarry but ten (centuries).
[20.104] We know best what they say, when the fairest of them in course would say: You tarried but a day.(a day is as 1000 years)
I am not saying it in secret, I am shouting in on the Internet..

Rev 19-12 through 21..Jesus returns on a white horse with his armies …The beast and false prophet are then cast into the lake of fire…
Rev. 20-10…After the 1000 years and the return of Satan-antichrist goes on their seven year rampage Satan is put in the lake of fire where the beast and false prophet are…..

Satan and the beast and the false prophet are all put into the pit and held there for 1000 years, but these return and are then put into the lake of fire after a short period……Rev 17-8 and Rev 20-2..

As for the 1000 reign with Christ we really have reigned with Him for 2000 years.. The 1000 year reign is speaking specifically the 1000 years satan is confined to the pit…Christianity thrived and ruled until just the last few decades….We Are falling to the curb now with the abortion, homosexuality, godlessness in gov., and schools, etc…and the tares that satan planted in the church are making their last stand with their lies and misinformation and hypocracy…Satan is back. full force……….

Illuminati – basically are people who (knowingly or unknowingly) are the hands and feet of Satan’s strategic plans. The Lord has His followers and da devil has his too.

It is a “web” a “network” of organizations, businesses, institutions, media and political, social, military, financial and religious “players” that execise their influence (money, sex, drugs, politics) and power (direct or indirect) to achieve strategic objectives, advancing his kingdom of darkness in the world.

illuminati sounds “conspiracy” and keeps folks from accepting the reality of evil people operating, trying to control the world as a system (The Beast).

Satan can not be everywhere and do everything – he and his demons (“principalities and powers”) but he needs people to do the “leg work” – da illuminati.

It’s bigger than da Vatican and it’s not Italian. Small plans and decisions are made and then there are major plans and decisions made taking decades to achieve.

Rome, London, Washington DC, NYC, Paris, Geneva – locations of influence around the world (“follow the money”), extending back to the days of Nimrod.

That’s my best definition after reading and watching it for the past 3 years.

e1313, 1. I did not state that Jesus puts Satan in the pit, I said, “Satan is not bound up yet, that happens when Jesus returns.” Regarding the Koran, either the Bible is “truth” or the Koran. The Bible is God’s written Word while the Koran is Satan’s word. If you want to believe the Koran, drink gallons of water, or you can rebuke the Koran and know you will get “living water.” Mohammed coming back? get real! His soul is either living in the midst of hell or his soul is totally dead! He will definitely not be coming back. The Muslims are awaiting their Mahdi, their coming spiritual leader, they believe that the world must be in total chaos before he comes back and that Israel must be destroyed for him to come. He will not be Mohammed, he will be the one world leader or antichrist. Many Christians have been deceived that the antichrist system will be Rome, but Rome is not antichrist, Catholics believe that Jesus was the Son of God. Muslims do not believe Jesus was the Son of God but a prophet. The interesting part of this end time period is that Obama/Illuminati think they are the driving force, but they can only do what God allows them. I repeat, watch Israel, as the coming Psalm 83/Isaiah 17 war comes about the surrounding nations of Israel will be destroyed, read the Bible, it tells us this Biblical fact. God bless the enlightened.

Allen I do not believe the koran but I do think Mohammed was satan and satan knows things we do not know…As for the Islamic madhi, the Bible shows us that satan and his demons will be returned to earth during judgment I believe..

e1313, suggest you study the spiritual world from someone who has insight. 20 years ago I read a number of books by Rebecca Brown. I am not suggesting you go deep into the satanic world or wisdom. Satan or his demons can manifest themselves in someone. In fact logic tells us, if we are created in the image of God then anything not like Jesus is demonic. What am I saying, from my observations as a Christian, if a person has a spirit of temper, steals, lies or kills I would suggest they have a demonic spirit for each of these ungodly traits. When I was 6 or 7 I had a bad temper spirit, so when I lost at a ball game, my brother would tease me and I would lose my rag. One day I threw a bat on the ground, it sprang up and broke a window. Now that is trouble coming, I hated what I did, was remorseful and said to myself, “no, I never want to do that again.” The temper spirit left me and although my brothers and sisters continued to teased me, I felt no anger again and they gave up after 7 days or so. People with “bad spirits” generally want to keep them because they give them “power” or “authority” or “money.” So, my theory would be Mohammed had a demonic spirit or many as he killed, stole and had sex with a child. Each bad trait is a demonic spirit. Many times God has spoken plainly into my ear and told me someone was going to do something, normally against myself. Sometimes, your trust is tested because the person who is about to do this thing (steal), you trust them. Guess what, God was right every time. You just can not trust people. When the antichrist comes on the scene he may have many demons but only when he dies, then he rises with the spirit of Satan, then the trouble starts for believers. God bless the enlightened.

Bro. Allen – you said it was in the end times. Yes you are right. This is the end times. God works are complete in the # 7. And in those 2 thousand years have been 7 church ages. Just as in O.T. Each church age ending and bringing in another till we have the 7th. which is the Fullness of time again just as in Jesus day. Jesus was here in his 1st. coming. The fullness of time had come for the O.T church to move into a Brand NEW Dispensation of Time and doctrine.
That church age knew nothing about how his coming was to be but they sure thought they did. They had their big schemes and theories and missed Jesus Christ in THAT GREAT FALLING AWAY. Though they was looking for His Appearing THEY missed it “killed their own Messiah. WHY

Because Israel had 7 ages they went into captivity in Egypt and became slaves to pagan rituals and religions and laws, then Assyria, Babylonian, Persian, Grecian, Roman – “Then Christ came” – To Give us the Kingdom of God to live in” – then “Imperial Rome destroyed Israel” in 70 AD. And later took Christianity for their religion. Can you imagine that. They reigned for a few hundred years. Their Emperors thought they were gods etc. Then Imperial Rome Fell altogether. But a miracle was coming in the name of satans power to “rise the fallen Imperial Rome into a “system of religion” and the Popes became the “Revised Papal Rome” and still is. In 539 AD the 1st Pope’s took office until 1799 = 1, 260 years. The saints were relentlessly persecuted. During the 1260 years in which the Papacy persecuted the true Church , the Bible was also suppressed until 1799 when the Pope died in prison . After being conquered by Napoleon. The Catholic church hated the printing press invention when the Bible finally started reaching the “common man” and many started believing in it. And left the Church of Rome. Millions died for their faith.

The DARK AGES IS WHY there is SO MUCH ” CONFUSION’ in Christianity doctrines today.—– Its because the Apostles doctrines were polluted in the Dark ages by Papa Rome. Who called himself the “Vicar of Christ” who was the “Son of Perdition” and who was the “Man of sin” That sit in the Temple of the Church and Ruled and Reigned over it till Christianity became just a fable and pagan to the coor.

Their had to be a Restoration of the “Apostolic Word”. And that started back in our 5th church age with the Message of Luther. That church age was called “Sardis” Rev. 3:1 on. means “escaped ones”. Salvation comes by Faith not the Catholic church. Luther exposed the CC for what it was. Pagan to the core. And he said the WHOLE thing was ANTI-CHRIST. Now do you believe that. The reformation of the restoration of the Word is come back to the “Original” doctrines of the Apostles once again. And then its over. Luther was just one part of the complete messages to Restore the Complete Word of God back to the Bride of Christ again.

So we know by HISTORY and WORD we have a PERFECT REVELATION when you have both.

And Notice the 4th. church age was DEAD. Jezebel means Baal is Lord and is alive. Right in the N.T church age. Their is your “Man of Sin” sitting in the Temple of the Christian church dictating what to believe or die. Having the same spirit in him as Nero did. And Satan being worshipped as God. Rev. 2:13 Pergomas = means “Thoroughly Married” – The triple crowned Pope got his SEAT of AUTHORITY in that “time period” on the Throne dictating to the N.T church just like Israel had their Jezebels and many false prophets that had demon spirits destroyed the so called believers and turned them to pagan doctrines = worshipping Baal. Where were Israels leader’s at in those days? Enjoying their Babylon religion of prosperity, and rank, being Called Rabbi, Great Teacher, Dr. pd, hqu. Oh they were reformed and educated really well. And the church beacame Ichabod.

Both North and Southern Kingdoms. Were taken over by Jezebel and her daughter married the king of Judah thus all of Israel went into Apostasy.
BUT MESSIAH WAS STILL COMING AND DID COME. A few received His Kingdom of God within them. And the majority rejected it. And most where destroyed in 70 AD. That is part of the multitudes of Rev.12.

Face to face. Called him a Devil. It is that bad today as well. Whether people want to believe it or not.

N.T again 4th. church age is “Thyatira”= means Dominating female, and Continual Sacrifice. = that is definetly C.Church= Rev. 17 & 18. All over the World. God never changes his plan. The N.T church had been bombarded with false doctrine for 1500 years and that is why it is like it is today.

Amos 8-11..Behold, the days come, saith the Lord GOD, that I will send a famine in the land, not a famine of bread, nor a thirst for water, but of hearing the words of the LORD:
This verse says it best and is apt for today…and so cometh darkness…
Amos 8-9..And it shall come to pass in that day, saith the Lord GOD, that I will cause the sun to go down at noon, and I will darken the earth in the clear day:

The false christs and false prophets, Matthew 24-14,15 are trying to erase he truth of the Bible with their lies..

1313 – There is a “great famine” in the land today. Among the “daughters” of the “whore” that still believe in denominations. They cannot leave their “fairy tales” and dogma’s to see the truth. Just like I said above. In Jesus 1st. coming.

LUKE 12:32 Fear not,” little flock”; for it is your Father’s good pleasure to give you the kingdom.
MATT 7:13 Enter ye in at the strait gate: for wide is the gate, and broad is the way, that leadeth to destruction, and many there be which go in thereat:
MATT 7:14 Because strait is the gate, and “narrow is the way”, which leadeth unto life, and “few” there be that find it.

The Bride see’s the “narrow strait gate” and it is the Hard way. But much more glorious than the wide gate. Yet hated, and abused, and rejected.

The “broad way” will follow the “majority always” and they will be in the click with the “wide gate” and the multitude will believe you and love you for your education, and degree’s. And how you say “ahhmen” just perfect with perfect sermons and perfect rituals and wear $1,000 suits etc. But it’s still man’s way. The whore and her daughters will burn and will not even leave the stubble left.

Lighthouse – I’m for you not against you. saith the Lord – you shall know the truth and the truth will set you free.

Lighthouse, to me you wrote a lot of babel. The Jews have always been separate, they are God’s chosen people. In Egypt, they were separate, they were destined by God to stay in Egypt over 400 years, they never accepted the gods of Egypt. There have been no church ages. The 7 churches were in Asia minor, they did exist. John gave us a description of each church. Dispensationalism is basically Darby doctrine, if you want to believe in it, good luck. As to Luther, he did a great feat breaking away from the Catholic church but he could not get catholism out of himself. His last edict was, “kill the Jews, especially the children and confiscate all their property.” God gave him 2 days to repent, he did not, and dropped down dead! A lot of what you wrote I have heard from the 7th Day Adventist church who are bound by the Law, their own choice. The church age started with Jesus preaching the Gospel. That the Jews rejected Jesus was foretold by the Old Testament prophets so the gentiles could get salvation. It was God’s plan, not man’s plan. The great falling away is still to come, it will be the believers who fall away, when will it happen? maybe when the antichrist world leader comes on the scene and does similar miracles as Jesus, I would suspect he will be in his early 30’s as will deceive many, and believers will lose their trust in Jesus. As in the Old Testament and so in the New Testament and as we go into the end times and persecution, God will always have a “remnant,” both Jew and the Christian believer. As Jesus said, “Will I find faith when I return.” I reiterate, for God it is about Israel and the Jews, so watch Israel. As the world goes against Israel, as is happening now, God will go against the world. How many Christian churches are now anti Israel and moving closer to Islam. It just plain scares me how these false preachers can call themselves Christians. God bless the enlightened.

Allen -you said -The Jews have always been separate, they are God’s chosen people.
Answer —Since Christ – We are ALL GODS chosen people. We are the Israel of God. Jew and Gentile – All God’s children are the Temple of God according to the Bible.

Allen said – In Egypt, they were separate, they were destined by God to stay in Egypt over 400 years, they never accepted the gods of Egypt. There have been no church
Answer – Dear Allen – They were slaves for 400 years in a PAGAN environment with many gods. 400 years of this influence on them. And in the Wilderness they built a “Golden Calf” and wanted to go back to Egypt. Egypt is the World. God said they were stiff necked, gainsaying people. They rebelled against their MESSAGE for their hour which came by MOSES with Miracles, Great Signs and Wonders. And still wanted to kill Moses. Only TWO of the original crossed over Jordan. Calab and Joshua.
The 400 years they stayed there was from Gods Word and that was their first church AGE to the Land of Promise their Millennium in Solomon’s day.

The Book of Daniel clearly repeats itself with the 5 dynasties of pagan Empires that ruled over Israel. They were All Pagan Nations “John the Divine” wrote it in Rev. 13:1 You see the same 5 beast that Israel was captive and influenced by these pagan Nations. John was bringing it up for all to see. You ought to be able to see it as well. I named all 7 of these ages in another post. It started with Egypt and Assiryia. Then the 5 from Daniel. Thier dark ages made them so dull and could not understand the simplest of Christ doctrine. And stood there and called him a devil. What blindness. The same thing is happening today. Somebody has got the truth. And it will always come by a Prophet with signs and wonders PLUS a MESSAGE. God Never changes his plans.

Rev. 13:3-11 talks about the deadly wound – This happened when Imperial Rome died but Rose again in Papal Rome that went into the dark ages.
THEN NEXT IS yet another Beast that makes the same Image unto the 1st.
beast and cause’s the same Image by another beast carrying it. The BEAST ARE NATIONS that carry the False Church. = called the False Prophet.

Then Rev. 13:11-18 is the Beast and False prophet in our day.
He exerciseth all the power of the “first” beast. Making the people of the earth to go back and worship the 1st. Beast who’s deadly wound was healed. Its all written above. In my other post.

Israel will have to come in “Under the Same Message that the Gentiles came to Christ with.” NOT NO cement temple going to save them. Christ destroyed it. It represented the Law and sin doubt – Israel has to come by FAITH just like the Gentiles did. Its All the Israel of God NOW – Gal. 6:16 Abraham was the Father of Faith for the WHO — the Gentile and Jew and all who would believe. He was a uncircumcised Gentile pagan. Yet the Father of Jews and Gentiles called HIM out to start the Salvation process with 7 ages. Just like N.T –

Theirs a Lighthouse on the hill side that overlooks lifes seas. It gives light to those that are hungry and God wants to feed.

Lighthouse you are so far off about the beast it is pathetic…You would be wise to pray about it and ask the Lord for revelation…When I have more time I will endeavor to show you some things..But I caution you, God cannot revel truth until we relinquish lies…
Lucifer is the beast…And Babylon is his congregation….and there is much more to this story…

2 Thessalonians 2 is easy to understand if you read as Jesus said…not by bread alone but by EVERY WORD OF GOD…
.
Both Jesus and Satan sow the seed.( Word of God)..Mathew 13-24 through 30..
These seeds produce the wheat and the tares….these are narrow way and the broad way.Both grow together till the harvest

The seed Jesus sows is the word of God (Luke 8-11)…..This word when planted in the hearts and minds of men produce the children of God..We are born again of the word of God….1 Peter 1-23..Being born again, not of corruptible seed, but of incorruptible, by the word of God, which liveth and abideth for ever. ..These are those of the narrow way. of Matthew 7..

Satan also sows seed…His seed is a counterfeit of the Word of God…
Satan’s version of the Word produces the tares of the Broadway of Matthew 7, the workers of iniquity..These are called son of perdition because they are the sons of Satan…These are counterfeit of Son of God..twice dead because they believe Satan’s lies..2 Thess 2-3, 7

And one more little tidbit…
2 Thess 2-2..That ye be not soon shaken in mind, or be troubled, neither by spirit, nor by word, nor by letter as from us, as that the day of Christ is at hand…Note Paul warns us that deceivers will use the word of God to shake us…He also mentions the letters.. I guess Paul knew the law keepers would rise up and try to defame Paul’s words..
2 Thess 2-3…Let no man deceive you by (m)any means: for that day shall not come, except there come a falling away first, and that man of sin be revealed, the son of perdition; ..Bear in mind history and Scripture prove Satan was SIN the moon god even back to Genesis…..The man of SIN is Satan’s counterfeit of men of Christ…I.e. … Christ indwells his son…Satan indwells his sons…Bear in mind deception is what causes these Christians to become sons of Satan..

The mystery of iniquity is Satan’s counterfeit of the mystery of godliness. and more… Satan is manifest in flesh, both in a false messiah and in men…

The mystery of iniquity was already working in the apostles day as per 2 Thess 2-7 …..They were of the false brethren of Gal 2-4..And that because of false brethren unawares brought in, who came in privily to spy out our liberty which we have in Christ Jesus, that they might bring us into bondage: ………..These are like some false Christians today who have crept in to bring us into bondage…Paul also adds ‘not giving subjection even for one hour.’. I am sure that hour is today…The hour of temptation..

2 Thess 2-4..Satan sits in the temple of God..This means he indwells men (our bodies are the temple of God)..and he speaks through these that an imposter is God…They teach anyone but Jesus…Some teach Jesus but as an inferior to the big god..

2 Thess 2-6..And now ye know what withholdeth that he might be revealed in his time. Satan had a set time to return…Plus he was locked in the pit for 1000 years…When He returns from the pit to deceive the world again then he and his gang will be revealed to the elect……We are there now…

2 Thess 2-7 For the mystery of iniquity doth already work: only he who now letteth will let, until he be taken out of the way. …Those that allow this mystery of iniquity to continue will be removed from the WAY of Christ…When they are removed they will be revealed to all that they are of Satan…They will also be delivered to destruction…Remember the Broadway leads to destruction…That destruction is Islam…

2 Thess 2-8, 9 says these will be destroyed by the brightness of the Lord’s coming…and Paul says in 2 Thess-2-9 .Even him, whose coming is after the working of Satan with all power and signs and lying wonders, ..
This is the beast and his flock which is Satan’s kingdom of Islam..2 Corinthians 11-3,4,14 shows Mohammed comes as an angel of light (messiah) with another gospel (Koran) that teaches another Jesus (Issa) and another spirit (Allah). Verse 3 shows it is like eve’s deception… Plus Rev 12-9 shows the dragon beast and co. are that old serpent, aka Satan….The same one who deceived Eve…

Didn’t you watch this video? The producer of this video summarizes what is ongoing – and what is about to unfold.

But! Hold on to our faith in Christ. It will be obvious to even the sleeping virgins very soon.

“‘For behold, the day is coming,
Burning like an oven,
And all the proud, yes, all who do wickedly will be stubble.
And the day which is coming shall burn them up,’
Says the Lord of hosts,
‘That will leave them neither root nor branch.
But to you who fear My name
The Sun of Righteousness shall arise
With healing in His wings;
And you shall go out
And grow fat like stall-fed calves.
You shall trample the wicked,
For they shall be ashes under the soles of your feet
On the day that I do this,’
Says the Lord of hosts” (Malachi 4:1-4, NKJV).

1313 – calm down a little bit. I believe most – “not all ” what you say.
Except for who satan is – And the last paragraph here etc. etc..

You said here – This is the beast and his flock which is Satan’s kingdom of Islam..2 Corinthians 11-3,4,14 shows Mohammed comes as an angel of light (messiah) with another gospel (Koran) that teaches another Jesus (Issa) and another spirit (Allah). Verse 3 shows it is like eve’s deception… Plus Rev 12-9 shows the dragon beast and co. are that old serpent, aka Satan….The same one who deceived Eve…

Satan’s kingdoms are the men and Nations of the world

II CORINTHIANS 11:3- But I fear, lest by any means, as the serpent beguiled Eve through his subtilty, so your minds should be corrupted from the simplicity that is in Christ.
11:4 For if he that cometh preacheth another Jesus, whom we have not preached, or if ye receive another spirit, which ye have not received, or another gospel, which ye have not accepted, ye might well bear with him.
II CORINTHIANS 11:14- And no marvel; for Satan himself is transformed into an angel of light.

You are saying then that the Serpent, and Satan, are Mohammed and the Koran is what beguiled Adam and Eve. I do not believe that.

All mankind is the Serpent if they do not have Jesus Christ Spirit in them.
John called it the “World”
Jesus to the Paul – taught the same thing. The flesh loves the world and is carnal minded and breeds death. Because the soul was in a fallen condition after fall.

Its the whole of fallen humanity of the whole WORLD=unbelievers
I JOHN 4:1- ¶ Beloved, believe not every spirit, but try the spirits whether they are of God: because many false prophets are gone out into the WORLD.
2. Hereby know ye the Spirit of God: Every spirit that confesseth that Jesus Christ is come in the flesh is of God:
I JOHN 4:4 – ¶ Ye are of God, little children, and have OVERCOME THEM: because greater is he that is in you, than he that is in the “WORLD”.
I JOHN 4:5- They are of the WORLD: therefore speak they of the WORLD, and the WORLD heareth them.
I JOHN 4:14- And we have seen and do testify that the Father sent the Son to be the Saviour of the WORLD.

So who is the great adversary that deceives – Its Mankind. The Fiery Serpent – really Means – in Rev. 12 – ‘Fiery Red Snake’ is the literal.
That snake is the “human spirit and soul” that defiled all of the world. And it lives in Mankind. Until Jesus the Serpent killer – creates them ANEW by HIS HOLY GHOST CREATING POWER.

That is the #1 missing element in the world today that makes them as serpents. Humanity is very serpentine in heart, soul, and body.

Not just one nation called Islam – I also understand the word Islam and have studied it. The WORLD crucified Christ. Politicians of the WORLD preach there Dogmas in Every Nation in the whole WORLD – By MANKIND
God uses men to deceive other men. And HE uses men to SAVE other men from death, hell, and the grave by giving them HIMSELF = Holy Spirit

The Greatest deceivers of Religion are other Men that say they are Christians and even GOD – The Worst is the Papa system and their Harlots that follow their pernicious ways. I read what John said was going to happen to them.

“I looked, and there before me was a pale horse! Its rider was named Death, and Hades was following close behind him. They were given power over a fourth of the earth to kill by sword, famine and plague, and by the wild beasts of the earth.”

Regarding death, In 1 Cor. 15:26, Paul says:

“For he must reign until he has put all his enemies under his feet. The last enemy to be destroyed is death.”

The fulfillment of deaths destruction takes place after the thousand years at the great white throne judgment as follows:

“The sea gave up the dead that were in it, and death and Hades gave up the dead that were in them, and each person was judged according to what they had done. Then death and Hades were thrown into the lake of fire.”

The lake of fire is the ultimate and final place of continuous,conscious punishment for those whose names are not found written in the book of life. Therefore, I submit to you that though Death is a state of being, there is also an actual entity representing Death. Likewise, though Hades is a literal location within the heart of the earth (see rich man and Lazarus), there is also an actual entity representing Hades. At the great white throne judgment both death and hades will be thrown into the lake of fire. Therefore, I would tend to believe that the fourth seal riders are referring to the actual entities of death and Hades. These two together will be the cause of a fourth of the earths inhabitants being killed, that is, they will be the forces behind the killings resulting from sword, famine, plague and the wild beasts of the earth.

Furthermore, since all of the lost dead are seen as being judged in Rev.20:11-15, this would also include individuals belonging to Islam and therefore, I doubt very much that the reference to death and hades being thrown into the lake of fire would be referring to Islam.

My point was and is that, God is not throwing in inanimate objects into the lake fire and that because it is a place for conscious torment and therefore, when it states that death and Hades are being thrown in, Scripture is speaking of them as literal entities for the purpose of punishment. That along with the fact that Paul said that the last enemy to be destroyed is death which is exactly what takes place in Rev.20:14. In regards to Islam being the culprit opposed to death and Hades as being the cause, there is just not one shred of evidence within the context of Scripture to come to the conclusion of Islam being the perpetrator. To come to that conclusion is basically just applying it without any rhyme or reason. Because of this, I believe that death and Hades will, just as the Scripture states, be given power to kill a fourth of the earths population by those means that are stated. The fourth seal being the result of the previous seals, by sword, famine and plagues.

who be the ghost rider – Fiery RED serpent – Adam means RED. Mankind
Jesus killed the Serpent for good on the Cross. For those that Have faith in him. The serpent has no power over you until you sin. Then those that Walk in the Image of Christ – Jesus gave us power and Grace and took our Past, Present, and Future sins and put them into the sea of forgetfulness. If he Knew us before we were ever born and if He is the Alpha and Omega – knowing the beginning and End. Christ is the Author and Finisher of our Faith. I trust Him for my past, present and future. The Serpent is Fallen Adam that produced 2 offsprings called Cain and Abel. One God’s seed the other serpent seed. One that knew Gods will and gave the right sacrifice. The other Cain knew not the Fathers will. Cain ended up with a “Mark” of satan on him. A killing machine, A war monger, No remorse, No conscience even for his brother. Cain only wanted to rule. He was the beginning maker of Great Cites along with civilization, and created music, and iron for war, and set the pattern for the nature of the World and civilization. And mankind grew very evil because they shunned their God the Creator and lifted up themselves among the “stones”= humanity. By becoming Great men of evil character.

On the other Hand Adam was a Son of God and was forgiven. As his sin was for the love of His Bride Eve. And He taught both sons the right sacrifice was Blood. But Cain did not care. He wanted to be a ruler and became a great one.
God even talked to Cain who was Adam’s son, a son of God. But Cain could not repent cause he wanted his own way. Welcome to Satan’s World –
The Devil, Satan, Lucifier all the same = evil mankind. The human spirit did not want to live in the same body as the Holy Spirit. and vice versa. So the prominent one had to leave. Welcome to Gods Seed and Creation Which was Adam’s heart.

Satan cannot live in a Temple where there is a Eternal prosperous God living. So God had to depart from the unbeliever after they made their decision to serve their Flesh and Human spirit over HIM. Leaving them to themselves and turning to perversion as wrote in Rom. 1 took over. Its all mankind with a human spirit in them. Makes them Satans, Perversions of Sons of God. They become reprobate and hate God. And change the nature of even their sex desires. To perversion. Same as the World today. Reprobate, No Conscience for Righteousness, For needing God in their life. They worshipped animals and became one. Called a BEAST
Bible calls them Natural Brute Beast. Jude, Peter and Paul.

A community of human beast become nations. And war and rape and killing is all they know. Till this day. Its only the Grace of God and His mercy that could bring them back to Sons of God. Remember Nebuchadnezzar. God let him be turned into a BEAST for glorifying himself and gave God not the Glory.
I rest my case.

Whether you believe me or not. Makes no difference. But God inspired me to keep writing and I did write what He gave to me write. I was quitting after about the first 3 lines but the Spirit bid me to write on while listening to the Holy Spirit within me.

Thanks for the replies. Some interesting comments. Thanks DJ.
Lighthouse, you gave the answer re: Jews are God’s chosen people. Answer —”Since Christ – We are ALL GODS chosen people. We are the Israel of God. Jew and Gentile – All God’s children are the Temple of God according to the Bible.” Correction: “When a person, Jew or gentile gives their life to Jesus or invites Jesus into their lives and this is done by the heart, in all humbleness and repentance, then they become a child of God.” The Jews are not children of God because they have rejected Jesus but are God’s chosen people. There is a distinction, on death a “child of God goes to heaven,'” the rest go to hell. In your second letter you stated, “God uses men to deceive other men.” Where is Scripture did you get this, it sounds like blasphemy to me, God cannot sin, but you say God can get someone else to sin for Him? I suggest you repent quickly before judgment comes.

We in our Church knows that our Father in heaven wants to move the Earth close to the sun for a short while and then everybody will die because of the heat and it will probably be so so forgett hail, fire, brimstones, pestilence and blood. Hail and stuff is just about the doom and our father doesn’t want Yeshua to hold the doom. Our Father had enough of people on Earth.

Leatherneck
Our Father took our sins upon him on the Cross when he was in Yeshua and he did this because we would be free from the laws in Torah that people broke. The Church created new laws that we must obey Catechism and we are breaking thoose laws to so our Father had enough of us.

First of all, our heavenly Father did not take our sins upon himself. The Word of God who left heaven, born of a virgin, became a man, kinning himself to mankind being found in the same flesh. God the Father remained in heaven, while God the Son lived a perfect life in the flesh, but paid the penalty for our sins. For those of us who have repented and have received Christ and are remaining in him, our Father has NOT had enough of us. Our Father is no longer angry with us and that because Jesus took upon himself the wrath that we deserve (atonement), satisfying God’s wrath against us which resulted from our sins, for there is now no condemnation for those who are in Christ Jesus. If any man says he has no sin he is a liar and the truth is not in him.

Those whom, as you say, the Father has had enough of, are the inhabitants of the earth who continue to live according to the flesh and who continue to reject his Son Jesus Christ and who do not fear God, nor acknowledge him, nor do they give thanks to him. We who are in Christ are still sinners, but we are credited with righteousness for faith. The true follower of Christ is in agreement with God about his/her sins and sin in general and is always wrestling to overcome whatever is of the flesh, the sinful nature, for the flesh wars against the Spirit and the Spirit wars against the flesh, for they are contrary to one another.

True believers have been reconciled to God through Christ’s payment by his blood, the righteous for the unrighteous, which means that we have been brought back into a right relationship with God by Christ’s sacrifice through our faith in him.

Rev 20-14..And death and hell were cast into the lake of fire. This is the second death. V.15..And whosoever was not found written in the book of life was cast into the lake of fire.
The first death was brought about because the Adams believed the lies of the serpent….This first death and apparently the hell that accompanied it are cast into the lake of fire….The lake of fire is the SECOND death which has no reprieve…..

The second death as was the first death is caused apparently by the lies of the serpent..
Matthew 23-15…says the pharisees, etc (also called serpents) encompass land and sea to teach their doctrines …When he is made they are TWO FOLD more children of hell…Once dead from Adam’s sin and now twice dead from the serpents proselyting..Remember the lake of fire is the second death…
Matthew 23-15..Woe unto you, scribes and Pharisees, hypocrites! For ye compass sea and land to make one proselyte, and when he is made, ye make him twofold more the child of hell than yourselves…

Jude warned us to those twice dead… Jude 1-12..These are spots in your feasts of charity, when they feast with you, feeding themselves without fear: clouds they are without water, carried about of winds; trees whose fruit withereth, without fruit, twice dead, plucked up by the roots…

I just can’t stop thinking that the Beast of Rev 13 is Islam and that Islam is the second death aka the lake of fire…or at the very least the door that leads to eternal fire…Islam is a lie from Satan that contradicts every word of the Bible… First they teach there was no original sin,,,therefore you do not need redemption from Jesus…Then they teach that Jesus did not die and resurrect, therefore there is no redemption…And then they teach Jesus is not Son of god which means man does not and cannot be restored as Sons of God….All of these lies most definitely guarantees the second death..
When calculating he number of people Islam has killed it must calculated over the last 1400 years, not just present day… Not to mention that all Muslims themselves are twice dead…
Revelation 13-13..
And he doeth great wonders, so that he maketh fire come down from heaven on the earth in the sight of men,

ANTI-CHRIST AND MUCH MORE
Dear Allen and all- You said to me – God cannot sin, “but you say God can get someone else to sin for Him? I suggest you repent quickly before judgment comes.”

Im sure glad that you are not God or I would be a gonner.
But I assure you – That Men teach other men their ways. Just as God spoke to us and told us to “bring up” our teach our children the “Way of Truth” and that whey would not part from it. That is scripture. You teach them to not love God or to not Obey God. They you are putting the “Mark of the Beast” in their “MIND”=forehead – and they will do “SERVICE with their HAND” to do evil and make war with their GOD all the days of their life.

I JOHN 3:12 Not as Cain, who was of that WICKED ONE , and slew his brother. And wherefore slew he him? Because “his own works were evil”, and “his brother’s righteous”.
I JOHN 3:13 Marvel not, my brethren, if the world hate you.
JUDE 1:11- WOE UNTO THEM for they have “gone in the way of Cain”, and ran “greedily after the error of Balaam” for REWARD , and PERISHED in the GAINSAYINGS OF CORE.
You see Balaam -a MAN withstood Moses – a MAN as did Core=Korah in the Wilderness withstood Moses and died being swallowed up of the earth. Korah’s, Balaam’s, Cain’s – Evil men that influenced millions of people to their death. —-God uses Mankind for good or evil. Question not the Father of LIFE for he knows what He is doing. His ways are far past our ways. Who can know the Mind of God and not tremble or faint.

So Simple to understand the below. In Exodus we are commanded to teach or children the way of God.
Now just take it the opposite. Men and Women teach their children nothing about God and teach them to hate, be racist, kill, mame, perversions of all kinds cause they live it in front of them and teach their children their way. That is how Satan comes into their family and takes over and raptures them into his poison and they die lost.
JOHN 10:10- The thief cometh not, but for to steal, and to kill, and to destroy: I am come that they might have life, and that they might have it more abundantly. The thief is the Human Spirit or Nature that is ruling mankind. Thief, the devil, satan, the serpent, on and on.
JOHN 10:12 But he that is an HIRELING,= MAN LIKE BALAAM, CAIN, ETC. and not the SHEPHERD,= GODLY MEN, LOVE THE BRETHREN, whose own the sheep are not, seeth the wolf coming, and leaveth the sheep, and fleeth: and the WOLF CATCHETH them, and scattereth the sheep. THAT WOLF IS A HIRELING FALSE PROPHET. GATHERING HIS OWN TO RAPTURE THEM TO HELL. While they live on Earth. NOW

Here is a great great mystery to all rapture-ist who buff at this.
The Word Catcheth is ‘Harpazo” the same word that most all believe in some future advent that will take out all the GOOD CHRISTIANS and leaving all the bad ones to great tribulations. Yet they are missing the “CURRENT ADVENT ” that is going on EVERYDAY of the WEEK in this world as 2 people die every second. What you believed when you die follows you. Mankind the World loved and chose = Death over Life- That is true and the wolf is the one that IS influencing them BY THEIR WORLDLY WORD. Called the WORLD of MANKIND the ECUMENICAL MOVE OF THE WORLD. They LUST and live by the flesh and love Evil and their Eyes are not single AND THEY ALL WANT TO RULE OTHERS LIKE CAIN DID. They burn with lust 24 hours a day. More than Righteousness. If you do not have the HOLY SPIRIT “The Humanity of the World” will “Catch” you up and gather all his subjects for your reward in hell. And it starts right here on EARTH. According to your faith. So be it.
They are anti-christ and they do not know it. Lost Religious Mankind is the WOLF — with all his False prophets of mankind with many religions. They preach and teach with their own “Human spirit” which is satan=adversary and the devil= accusing,even Christianity has the same in it. Christendom has turned completely into HUMANISM PLAIN AND SIMPLE. WORSHIPING THEIR SELVES OVER THE GOD THAT CREATED THEM.

But God in his mercy sends a “Man of God” A “Preacher” and one of Gods offspring hear the “WORD” and give their heart to Jesus. God in Mercy sent that man to the lost brother by Grace. Oh the foolishness of “Preaching” the Word of truth is the only way you can get saved and filled with the Holy ghost. God uses men. God knows what He is doing. He became a man himself, wrapped flesh around that Precious Spirit and was veiled to the world. They should have know him by HIS WORD. But NO MAN SPAKE LIKE THIS MAN. They called HIM a devil – cannot somebody believe this. This is not my mind it is the mind of Christ telling and giving you golden streets to walk on. Their is a True Gold and their is Foolsgold.

He also uses the Judas, Balaams, Jezebels, and false prophets. To sway people away from God. That is the way it is. Its still ALL GOD doing HIS will. For HIS BRIDE. You have a right to Marry whoever you want to amen. Then as a human let God of all the world “elect” whom HE choses. That is not EVIL my friend. GOD knows their hearts and Soul will never satisfy the demand for HIS LOVE>

You cannot appreciate the LIGHT unless you have LIVED in DARKNESS.
You cannot appreciate RIGHTEOUSNESS without knowing EVIL.

One man Jesus Christ died for the whole world. Why does not the whole world come in. Because they do not WANT TO BE RIGHTEOUS or HOLY. The Like Cain love their sin. To Turn away Christ THEE PROPHET is Death. THAT IS THE ‘MARK OF THE BEAST’

I hope you understand my brothers and sisters. Just sharing with you not preaching on you.

1313 – You said. — I just can’t stop thinking that the Beast of Rev 13 is Islam and that Islam is the second death aka the lake of fire…or at the very least the door that leads to eternal fire…Islam is a lie from Satan that contradicts every word of the Bible…

Dear bro. 1313 – The 2nd. Death is your final death of the “Spirit-man” that lived in you IF you was a sinner. So no need to worry about the 2nd. Death if you have Jesus Christ you only die once. And that is while we Live. We “DIE” daily. We are Mortify our bodies, and soul, and heart daily to Jesus Christ. When your Spirit leaves your Body its going straight to be with the Lord. WHY because the LORD IS YOUR BEING INSIDE YOU RIGHT NOW> What else could happen.

You said Islam is a lie — The Bible says that loving the “World is a LIE” and it has a Broad GATE.
Jesus said you can only serve one Master – God or mammon. The mammon is the riches of this world. How ever and whatever you think make you feel good about yourself. Humanism at its best. Hate is a lie which is a perversion of LOVE – A lie is the Perversion of the Truth. – the Human Spirit is a perversion of the Holy Spirit. The Kingdom of the World is a perversion of the Kingdom of God. Thats why Christ died for us. To give us the “Kingdom of God” not just in the sweet bye and bye. But NOW their is peace in the time of trouble. Jesus said so . I believe it. He will give us rest even at the end of the world. We can say as Christ said. I commend my spirit unto the Father. The Bible says the Jesus said I commend my Spirit back to God.
Other words I give it back. He GAVE UP the Ghost. We live in the image of Christ we ought to be able to do the same thing. amen. Their were times when I thought I might want to give it up. But the Spirit of the Ghost said not now. But our time will surely come – we just give it up and in a few seconds we with Jesus Christ and all the Saints. I will talk to you their . We will have no great doctrines to study anymore. But we will live together in LOVE DIVINE – Praise God –

Christ did not get murdered on the cross because the world’s kingdom is a perversion of the kingdom of G-d. What utter nonsense.

The word made flesh died for human sin, because G-d’s laws have a price if broken, and G-d so loved the world he live among us as a unblemished lamb to take the burden of sin away from humans. It is called G-d’s grace.

It is the only thing free in this world. Lighthouse, you are so far out there in left field you are misleading yourself, and others knowingly, or unknowingly. How do you call yourself Christian?

Well said Leatherneck, and if I might add, regarding this issue the Lord said:

“No one takes my life from me, but I lay it down of my own accord. I have authority to lay it down and authority to take it up again. This command I received from my Father.”

Scripture also states that Jesus was slain before the foundation of the world, which means that before the world even began it was decided in the heavens, in eternity, that the Lord would become the sacrifice for fallen mankind, even before we fell. In short, the Lord’s sacrifice was planned from the beginning and he was crucified right on time at Passover, he being our Passover Lamb, which is what the Passover celebration was all about; it was always pointing to Christ.

Furthermore, the Jews were so concerned about celebrating the Passover, that they didn’t realize that they were killing the actual Passover Lamb. And though those men are guilty for their part, as was Judas, we should always be thankful to God for his sacrifice, otherwise we would all still be dead in our sins, with no hope of salvation. No man took Jesus’ life for he gave it freely, and we as believers should have a spirit that is always ready to be persecuted and to face death keeping the testimony of Jesus and the word of God.

On the fourth horse. Your writings were very deep. The Bible always seems simple to read, and understand to me. Why would G-d make it so hard to understand if it would take only deep thinkers as yourself to understand same?

The fourth horse, and it’s rider take a fourth of mankind. Isn’t that about the number of souls under the coming Caliphate. Also, known as region 4 within the WTO? Christians are getting their heads cut off by the religion of peace like never before except in the seventh, and 12th centuries under the attacks by Islam.

I think we are seeing the fourth rider now, and I think we are witnessing the martyr’s that cry out under the alter for G-d to take his revenge.

You said:
“The fourth horse, and it’s rider take a fourth of mankind. Isn’t that about the number of souls under the coming Caliphate. Also, known as region 4 within the WTO? Christians are getting their heads cut off by the religion of peace like never before except in the seventh, and 12th centuries under the attacks by Islam. I think we are seeing the fourth rider now, and I think we are witnessing the martyr’s that cry out under the alter for G-d to take his revenge.”

My view:
The verse states that both death and Hades are given power over a fourth of the earths population (25%) to kill by sword, famine, disease and by the wild beasts of the earth. The population would have to refer to the immediate population meaning that this decrease would be noticeable to the world. But regarding the earths population it has been steadily increasing and that because the current ratio of births vs. death is 20.18 vs. 8.23 respectively, which is why we continue to see the earths population increasing and not decreasing.

There are two places within the Scriptures of Revelation that mention the percentages of people killed as a result of the God’s wrath, 25% of the population by death and Hades at the 4th seal and a third of the population at the 6th trumpet, which combined would be over half based on 7 billion and that’s not counting the fatalities that will result from trumpets 1 thru 3, as well as the bowl judgments of which the percentages are just not mentioned. These percentages are in reference to the immediate population of when these things take place, that is, this decrease would deal with the immediate population of that time and therefore this decrease would be noticeable. The fact is that, instead of a decrease we continue to see the world population increasing. If the 4th seal was currently taking place, then there would be over 1.5 billion dead by the end of that plague, but this is not the case, because as stated, we continue to see the global population increasing.

This decrease in the world population is in direct fulfillment of the Scripture in Isaiah 13:12 regarding the day of the Lord:

“I will make people scarcer than pure gold, more rare than the gold of Ophir.”

The gist of what is going to happen during the day of the Lord is that, God through the seals, trumpets and bowl judgments is going to decimate the worlds population. But the fact is that currently we are continuing to seeing an increase in the global population. This being the case, I personally do not believe that the 4th seal has yet been opened.

The other reason that I do not believe that the 4th seal has been opened is because seals 1 through 3 would have had to been opened before the 4th seal. Regarding this, I believe that the 1st seal, the rider on that white horse who go goes out to conquer and is bent on conquest is that antichrist who is to come, and he has not yet been revealed. I believe he will be revealed when he makes that covenant for one ‘seven,’ followed 3 1/2 years later by the setting up of that abomination. Also, regarding the second seal rider on the red horse, he is given power to take peace from the earth and to make men slay each other. Though there are uprisings and commotions world wide, there is still peace on earth. I go to work every day without incident, I go out to eat, swim in my pool, go on motorcycle rides, relax with a movie, etc.. The 2nd seal rider is meant to take peace from the earth and therefore, the entire earth would be affected by this. I don’t believe that this removal of peace is restricted to the nations armies fighting against each other, but the removal of peace for all people and we just don’t see this happening to that extent right now.

The seals, trumpets and bowl judgments are events that are meant to be unprecedented and will be overwhelmingly noticeable for those who are here on the earth during God’s wrath. Personally, I believe that believers, who are not appointed to suffer God’s wrath (seals, trumpets, bowls), will be gathered to the Lord prior to the first seal being opened and therefore, I believe that we will never see that antichrist, as we will have been removed prior to his revealing.

Lighthouse, I know you mean well but you are providing camoflauge for satan’s Islam ….The Lord wants people to know the truth about Islam which the Bible says several times is the same deception as Eve’s deception…Please for your own sake open your mind up to the real truths and investigate…

bro.1313 – I appreciate what you say. But to me Romanism is the worst enemy Christianity could ever have. Pagan Nations can only kill the body. But cannot touch the soul the bible says.

Islam is a major player in these last day of this age. It might deceive the World but it will never deceive true “Holy Spirit filled Christians”. Where Romanism has already produced the harlots of Rev. 17:5 which are all the forms of Protestant’s church’s and C.C that preach the myths of their mother.
REV. 17:5 And upon her “FOREHEAD” was a name written, MYSTERY, BABYLON THE GREAT, THE “MOTHER OF HARLOTS” AND ABOMINATIONS OF THE EARTH. = abominations is what makes desolation. no matter what age you live in. the Mark of beast is in the Mind.

REV. 17:6 And I saw the woman drunken with the BLOOD OF THE SAINTS, and with the BLOOD OF THE MARTYRS OF JESUS: and when I saw her, I wondered with great admiration. = yes john had to wonder at the little Pentecostal church that was in Rome became what he saw in this vision. He was stunned to say the lest. Overwhelmed!!!!

REV. 17:7 And the angel said unto me, Wherefore didst thou marvel? I will tell thee the mystery of the woman, and of the BEAST THAT CARRIETH HER, which hath the “seven heads and ten horns”. = The 7 heads and ten horns is speaking of the battle of the “Overcoming Bride of Christ” against the Nations and its 7 ages of false vine religion and it 10 completeness of mankind and the nations. The True vine Overcomes them both. The Worlds nations against the Kingdom of Gods one Nation. Among other things. The Lords people and Satan’s people in battle. Spiritual Armageddon has already come dear friends. We are right into the midst of the greatest battle ever fought in our Minds, and Hands we serve with.

Verse 8 is of most importance and opens up the Mystery of Babylon
REV17:8 The ‘beast that thou sawest was and is; and shall ascend out of the bottomless pit, and go into PERDITION: and they that dwell on the earth shall wonder, “whose names were NOT WRITTEN in the book of LIFE” from the foundation of the world, when they behold the BEAST=IMPERIAL ROME “THAT WAS”- in Jesus and Johns day, “AND IS NOT” = “FOR A SEASON IT DISAPPEARED”,and “YET IS” = the REVISED ROME – becoming – PAPAL ROME into the 8th. eternal day of the Lords days that we live in right now. Rev. 17:11

Verse 8 gives us the mystery of Imperial Rome Rising from its deadly wound into Papal Rome. Imperial Rome was the IRON kingdom of Rome. Papal Rome is the CLAY kingdom of the Papal system of Religion. And it followed Iron Rome into perdition. She is still here and doing fine. No body can touch her or tell her what to do. But she will be destroyed by a Bomb probably from Russia. Look for American to go under as well. By some tragedy. Maybe missles and bombs. Could be Nature. But Papal Rome holds all the wealth of the world. She has hoarded gold for many, many hundreds of years by taking from the poor and rich that she is suppose to be leading to Christ. And the Nation’s will make a pact with her. Rev. 17:11-15. Will come to “ONE MIND “= ver 13 Mark of the Beast. As they are doing right now. But it will not last very long. Papal Rome will be gone for her Abominations done to the Bride of Christ.

THAT IS THE ANTI-CHRIST CHURCH. THAT WENT INTO PAGANISM YET STILL CALLS ITSELF CHRISTIAN. JUST PUTTING IN THE “NAME OF CHRIST” MAKES IT THE WORST PAGAN NATION IN THE WORLD.

It is the one that killed more prophets than any other. Nero was a perfect type of “Man of sin” in his day and Paul speaks of that. Nero hated all Christians and made fires of them, skinned them, fed them to wild beast etc. etc. But when you read the history of the Papacy – it did the very same things under the guise of Christianity – their is the major difference in Islam and Romanism. They hated each other. Islam never carried the name of Christ with them. Their god and prophet was mohammed how ever you spell it.

The above is the true and undisputed truth of what Nation was the ORIGINAL N.T –mystery whore that had harlots. Just as Jezebel had 450 false prophets educated to her pagan ways. Her daughter married the King of Judah and destroyed the whole of Israel. The became “ONE MIND” To the point of no return. Jesus had to come when HE did. So did John the Baptist and so did the Apostles and John the Divine.
The book of Revelations reveals ROME . And it also reveals ISRAEL’S APOSTASY. NERO WAS THE ONE WHO STARTED THE DESTRUCTION OF THE TEMPLE MOUNT AND JERUSALEM IN A.D 64 THEN NERO DIED AND TITUS CAME BACK TO JERUSALEM AND ALTOGETHER IT WAS AN EXACT 3 AND 1/2 YEARS TO DESTROY JERUSALEM AND THE TEMPLE. THAT IS THE ABOMINATION OF THE DESOLATION SPOKE OF BY DANIEL. THEY REJECTED THEIR OWN MESSIAH AND WAS DESTROYED BY THE BEAST THAT CARRIED THE FALSE BACKSLIDDEN, REPROBATE IN APOSTASY CHURCH OF THAT AGE PROPHET ISRAEL. THEY TURNED THEIR PROHETS AND WISE MEN INTO “systems of men by men. ” Man cannot chose who is a prohet or wise man. Only God can create Apostles and Prophets.

Cannot we see that in OUR OWN AGE today. If not we need to get some Spiritual glasses on.

John wrote his Revelation with all this in mind. If we today could just open our minds up to understand what happen in the 1st. century. Then you could read Revelation in the View that Christ gave it to John – and you know positive that the same thing is happening today. It was not that great a mystery to the 1st century brethren. They knew what John was saying exactly.

Jesus is ending the Revelation in chapter 22 with Come, I come quickly, yes HE was speaking about the future coming ages. All 7 of them. In other words. Come unto me for salvation, let me GATHER you all under my wings as he told Israel. And then when the abomination of your age comes . You will have already been delivered by my Great Power of the Holy Ghost. He would say to us now. Let me LIFT YOU UP OUT OF THIS WORLD and I will PRESERVE YOU. That is shouting time.

There’s a “lighthouse” on the hillside that overlooks life seas.
Run to it and enter it now. before the flood comes.
Jesus is that Lighthouse that made my eyes to see.

Lighthouse, you are either a jester, a waffeler, a lost soul, delusional or just looking for an argument. Careful who you might upset. It wont be me, but Someone mightily powerful who is coming back as the Lion of the Tribe of Judea. Again I reiterate: Observe what the Bible has to say about God’s honesty and, therefore, His reliability.

Numbers 23:19: “God is not a man, that He should lie, nor a son of man, that He should repent. Has He said, and will He not do? Or has He spoken, and will He not make it good?”

1 Samuel 15:29: “And also the Strength of Israel will not lie nor relent. For He is not a man, that He should relent.”

Psalm 92:15: “To declare that the Lord is upright; He is my rock, and there is no unrighteousness in Him.”

Malachi 3:6: “For I am the Lord, I do not change.”

Romans 3:4: “Indeed, let God be true but every man a liar.”

Titus 1:2: “[I]n hope of eternal life which God, who cannot lie, promised before time began.”

Hebrews 6:18: “[I]t is impossible for God to lie.”

James 1:17-18: “Every good gift and every perfect gift is from above, and comes down from the Father of lights, with whom there is no variation or shadow of turning.”

God is the only being Who is incapable of lying. Everything that God said would happen before now, has happened—just as He said it would. Since God knows all things past, present, and future (and since He is completely honest), it is impossible for Him to speak untruths.

To say that God will lead someone into sin is rebellious and verging on the final judgment for yourself. Believe me, God hears what everyone says and watches what does and what everyone writes down.

The Islamic world stretches from Indonesia to Morocco with 1/4 of the world’s population under rule of Islam. Take a look at the flags of those countries – the colors include one or more of the following: white, red, black and “pale green”.

Is it just a coincidence that each of the 4 horses in John’s revelation are given a specific color (white, “fiery red”, black and “pale”)?

Could it be that there is a clear, obvious correlation with the 4 horse colors and the great Arabic political, military, social and religious powers throughout the history of Islam, known as Caliphates?

Yes!

The goal of the Brotherhood, “Arab Spring” is to bring a mighty Caliphate, crushing Israel and defeating “the Great Satan” (USA). To think, the USA supports this rebellion.

Here is one of those four color horses in Revelation – “And another horse came out, flaming red. And its rider was empowered to take the peace from the earth (Strong’s region), so that men slaughtered one another; and he was given a huge sword” (Amplified Bible).

Breaking down the word “red” as written in the King James, (Strong’s definition, G4450), and that is “fiery red”.

A little deeper into the definition and we read the red is like a flame. That is not blood red as some folks believe.

The 2nd Caliphate (Khawarij), which operated under a red banner, has a historical fingerprint in the “region or terrene”. This historical Caliphate with a red banner took leadership positions – not by negotiations or voting – but by conflict or “rebellion”.

Here is more information to support that historical “fiery red” and very “rebellious” Caliphate matching up with this “fiery red” horse in Revelation.

“The Khariji theology was a radical fundamentalism, with un compromised observance of the Quran in defiance of corrupt authorities. Khariji would consider today’s moderate Muslims to be ‘hypocrites’ and ‘unbelievers’. The Khariji held that only the most pious members of the community could be entrusted with political power.”

Egypt, Libya, and other nation states in the “region” are in “rebellion” and bringing Quran based government/leadership on steroids. It is the brotherhood – a Caliphate movement.

Seal # 2 is wide open and operational.

So, re-read Rev 6:4 “…fiery red, was granted take peace from the earth [a particular region/terrene], and that people should kill one another [rebellion]; and there was given to him a great sword” (Amplified Bible).

Bro. Allen I am not trying to argue with anybody. As Christ just told the Truth to the “suppose to be spiritual nation of Israel” He got mocked, ridiculed, called a blasphemer, false prophet, He had to speak to them in what you call “a jester” I call = parables. Because the “Word of God” was foreign to them as it is today. Not trying to belittle you dear brother. But give you some insight into the “Spiritual realm of the Word” along with history.

If History said something definitely happen on a so and so date.
And you have the “Word of God agreeing that it happened on that same day or hour. Then you have an “Infallible Revelation from God”. This is why history and the Word is so important because it is a declaration of absolute truth. I believe and understand that Israel in Jesus day.
Is exactly the same today cause we are at the end of the complete church ages. Just as when Jesus came the O.T was ending out. Same today the time element of the NT church ages is over and Eternity is rushing in on us with Salvation and or complete destruction. Rev. 10:6 says so. Did you read it. Its the last 7th. age of the church systems of men and going into exactly what you said. The Son of David Realm or dimension. The time for “ignorance” is over. Its time we going to have to have Faith and Revelation inside us by the Holy Spirit. Doctrines are essential for Maturity. Knowing right from wrong. Paul told a church that they were still on milk and needed to grow into rightly dividing the Word of Truth. He told them Cor. the way it was. A bunch of babies boo hooing cause they do not want off the milk is a cop-out for ignorance. And do not have the desire to study it or even read the Bible. Whatever the Pastor says I believe it fully. Well you believe in Popery then. No matter what you call yourself.

Chapter 11 the church is RISING up symbolized by the 2 Prophets. Raising from the dead. To me that has alot of baggage with it.
It means raising above the False doctrines that where in the 7 church ages. And the true vine goes on into Restoration of all things.

We are likened into Jesus day with rebellious Israel coming to the end of a period of time. And they were absolutely living and believing off their “Traditions of MEN” making the Word of God of NONE EFFECT.

John the Baptist and Jesus walked right into the Last O.T church age. And declared them all wrong. They were living in their “Humanism” self just like today its all about the “human achievements” and popularity, and awards of Dr. so and so and had the Word memorized, they had it down pat. BUT they missed their Messiah.

So all that education that came from man and their own idea’s, and the false Sanhedrin system of religion killed 1 million and 100 thousand Jews that were GATHERED by SATAN in the Temple mount and lived in Jerusalem in 70 AD. Nero started that war and that was the “judgement for Israel” killing and rejecting Jesus Christ their GOD and MESSIAH. Israel did not possess or even recognize God was talking directly to them. They were void of the Spirit of God. And they missed their Pentecost with the few 120 that did believe that Jesus Christ was the King of Kings and Lord of Lords.

Jesus said Israel and their Rabbi’s that rejected him were of their “Father the Devil”. Now if I am wrong then please, please brother tell me where. If I am wrong then Jesus was wrong.

When I got into this Message that I preach now. I was a die hard Pentecostal Charismatic. But I ran into a REAL PROPHET with the Signs and wonders that were infallible and the Dead raised in documented reality. But what the greatest quality was he HAD A REAL MESSAGE AS WELL. He was so different but at the same time so humble and said things like I have never heard them said that I told my wife that this man has to be a False Prophet or a REAL GOD SENT PROPHET. No in between either. The latter was the truth. My whole life changed and things I use to just take for granted but wondered about for years he explained in just a childlike way. I could not resist that TRUTH. Praise God for Prophets in this day. That do not beg money, make merchandise out of people they just Preach the Word and let it fall where it may.

I believe every scripture you posted above.

You Said -I said that God will lead someone into sin is rebellious and verging on the final judgment for yourself. Believe me, God hears what everyone says and watches what does and what everyone writes down.
answer ; I have no idea what you are talking about on this statement.
You might have mis-understood it or whatever. You will have to say what I said before I can clearify it.

Malachi 3:6: “For I am the Lord, I DO NOT CHANGE . I agree with you.
This is my favorite scripture of all below:
Heb, 13:8 Jesus Christ the same yesterday, today, and forever.
This is how I base all my doctrines on history and today by the Bible. God never changes. I do not believe God is a liar either.

Sin had to come by man’s own FREE AGENCY – Lust-eyes-pride
JAMES 1:13 ¶ Let no man say when he is tempted, I am tempted of God: for God cannot be tempted with evil, neither tempteth he any man:
14. But every man is tempted, when he is drawn away of his own lust, and enticed.
15. Then when lust hath conceived, it bringeth forth sin: and sin, when it is finished, bringeth forth DEATH.
16. Do not err, my beloved brethren.

I JOHN 3:12 Not as Cain, who WAS OF THAT WICKED ONE , and slew his brother. And wherefore slew he him? Because his OWN works were EVIL, and his brother’s righteous.

“QUESTION NOW” WHO IS ‘SATAN’ AND OR THE DEVIL IN THESE SCRIPTURES OF JAMES and I JOHN 3:12

Rules what? Y’see that’s the problem… The Vatican doesn’t recognize that all authority has been handed to the Salvation of Yahweh, who is seated at His right hand, and Yisrael is the apple of the eye of Yahweh. Just remember this, No one comes to the father but through the son, and no one comes unto the Son but through the father… I don’t see where the Vatican has any thing or any business in that precept… The Vatican is nothing more than another corrupt entity of oppressive and tyrannical government. The Vatican promotes death!!! How long is the Vatican going to leave the Salvation of Yahweh on that cross? The Salvation of Yahweh is no more with the Vatican than he is on that cross! To every Catholic I say, leave the Vatican; come to the living Salvation of Yahweh and worship in Spirit and in Truth by his grace through faith. The Messiah is not on the cross! He is alive! He does not want you to worship His death! He wants you to worship His Spirit that overcame death!

….Next time you insult others who do not believe as you think they should. be careful! I carry a 3 foot double-edge sword. One edge is called Truth and the other is the Salvation of Yahweh, and I’ll use it cut you into a number of pieces that will rival the numbering of the stars! The meek shall inherit the Earth and I’m one of several who is called to get it ready for them!

Regarding your note, the Scriptures do indeed indicate that the covenant that is made is with Israel. In support of this, we must look at the whole prophecy. In Daniel 9:24, the angel tells Daniel the following:

“Seventy ‘sevens’ are decreed for your people and your holy city to finish transgression, to put an end to sin, to atone for wickedness, to bring in everlasting righteousness, to seal up vision and prophecy and to anoint the Most Holy Place.”

So regarding the Scripture above, the angels says “Seventy ‘sevens’ are decreed for “your people and your holy city.” Daniels people would of course be Israel and their holy city would be Jerusalem, therefore according to Scripture Israel and Jerusalem are the focus of the entire seventy ‘sevens.’ Then the Scripture gives a break-down of those seventy ‘sevens’ as follows:

“Know and understand this: From the time the word goes out to restore and rebuild Jerusalem until the Anointed One, the ruler, comes, there will be seven ‘sevens’ and sixty-two ‘sevens.

“After the sixty-two ‘sevens,’ the Anointed One will be put to death and will have nothing.”

In the Scriptures above, seven of the ‘sevens,’ are to restore and rebuild Jerusalem, which is then followed by the fulfillment of the sixty-two ‘sevens,’ equaling a total of sixty-nine ‘sevens.’ At the culmination of the sixty-nine ‘sevens,’ the Anointed One is cut off, which is Christ crucified.

Well, that takes care of sixty-nine of the seventy ‘sevens’ decreed by the angel, so where’s the last ‘seven?’ Oh, there it is below!

“He will confirm a covenant with many for one ‘seven.’ In the middle of the ‘seven’ he will put an end to sacrifice and offering. And at the temple he will set up an abomination that causes desolation, until the end that is decreed is poured out on him.

After Jesus was crucified, he put that last ‘seven’ on hold and began to build his church, which is still in process. Once he is finished building his church, he will descend from heaven and all believers, dead and alive will be resurrected and caught up to meet him in the air where he will then take us back to the Father’s house as stated in John 14:1-3. Once all believers are removed, then God will pick up where he left off with Israel regarding the seventy ‘sevens’ and will begin that last ‘seven’ with the establishing of that covenant and since this last ‘seven’ is part of the prophecy of the seventy ‘sevens,’ then it still applies to Israel and Jerusalem, because that’s who the prophecy is about according to the angel.

Furthermore, the verse itself declares that Israel is at least one of the many represented and that because, in the middle of the ‘seven,’ that ruler, the antichrist, causes sacrifice and offerings to cease and he sets up that abomination in the holy place, which according to Jesus found in Mt. 24:15, it is set up within the holy place within the temple in Jerusalem. In short, the verse is telling us who the many are by the mention of the sacrifices and offerings, as well as the abomination being set up in the holy place.

Also, you said that the bible doesn’t state that the covenant will be a public event, this is true, but I’ll allow history and current events to be my witness. Today, if anything at all takes place regarding Israel, be it a bombing, a territory issue or even the slightest hint regarding peace talks, etc., it is in the newspapers worldwide and all over the internet. Therefore, you can bet that when this covenant (contract) is made with Israel, the entire world will know of it. The making of this covenant will be the starting point for that last ‘seven’ years and will alert those saints during that time that it has begun, with the setting up of the abomination marking the middle of the ‘seven.’ Since the angel said that the decree was for Israel and their holy city Jerusalem, we cannot jump out of context and refer to the “Many” as some other people. Granted Islam will be involved and that because their dome of the rock is going to end up in the outer court of the coming Jewish temple and therefore, the many is definitely Jerusalem and could also include Palestine/Islam. What will this last ‘seven’ accomplish?

“to put an end to sin, to atone for wickedness, to bring in everlasting righteousness, to seal up vision and prophecy and to anoint the Most Holy Place.”

So again, this last ‘seven’ has to do with bringing that seventy ‘sevens’ to its fulfillment which was decreed upon Israel and their city Jerusalem.

Revelation 14-6.And I saw another angel fly in the MIDST OF HEAVEN, having the everlasting gospel to preach unto them that dwell on the earth, and to every nation, and kindred, and tongue, and people, Note he has invaded the holy place, I.e. The Heaven…
God did not give the Gospel to angels to preach..He gave it to man….2 Corinthians 11-14,4 shows Satan coming as an angel of light (messiah like Jesus) with another gospel that teaches another Jesus and another spirit..
This angel of Rev 14-7 is a flat out liar and is Satan….Did not Lucifer say he would ascend into the heavens..that he would be like God???
Christ’s Gospel was preached in all the world during Paul’s lifetime as Colossians 1-23 says…If ye continue in the faith grounded and settled, and be not moved away from the hope of the gospel, which ye have heard, and which was preached to every creature which is under heaven; whereof I Paul am made a minister;

The gospel that Jesus is speaking of in Matthew 24-14 is not the gospel of Christ , but is the Gospel that the false Christs and the false prophets bring…This gospel of the kingdom will be preached in all the world and then the end will come..Note; Colossians 1-23……This false Gospel is of the abomination that makes men desolate of God’s spirit…Truth leaves when lies abound…God is truth…

Matthew 24-14..And this gospel of the kingdom shall be preached in all the world for a witness unto all nations; and then shall the end come.
Matthew 24-15…When ye therefore shall see the abomination of desolation, spoken of by Daniel the prophet, stand in the holy place, (whoso readeth, let him understand:)
Revelation 12-3, 4 shows the abomination of desolation in the holy place..
“”””””And there appeared another WONDER IN HEAVEN; and behold a great red dragon, having seven heads and ten horns, and seven crowns upon his heads. …And his tail drew the third part of the stars of heaven, and did cast them to the earth: and the dragon stood before the woman which was ready to be delivered, for to devour her child as soon as it was born. “”””
This wonder in heaven is the abomination that makes men desolate of God’s spirit….This is the abomination that makes men desolate standing in the holy place..Isaiah 9-15 describes this dragon who has invaded the holy place best….The ancient and honorable (the God of Abraham) is the head and the false prophets that teach lies, he is the tail..Of course this is Allah claiming he is the God of Abraham and his congregation of Koran bearing Muslims are the tail..

The truth of all of this is, God has allowed the Islamic dragon to invade the heavenly place for a purpose..He is collecting the tares that have grown up with the wheat… The stars in the womans crown represent the Christian congregation, both the wheat and the tares…..As promised God has sent forth the (bad) angels to deliver the tares of the broad way to destruction./fire. I.e. Islam…

Matthew 13 38 The field is the world; the good seed are the children of the kingdom; but the tares are the children of the wicked one;39 The enemy that sowed them is the devil; the harvest is the end of the world; and the reapers are the angels.40 As therefore the tares are gathered and burned in the fire; so shall it be in the end of this world.41 The Son of man shall send forth his angels, and they shall gather out of his kingdom all things that offend, and them which do iniquity;42 And shall cast them into a furnace of fire: there shall be wailing and gnashing of teeth

Matthew 12-43,44,45 is about the last generation of Christians whose house has been swept clean but is empty, (no holy ghost indwelling)…Satan and his seven demon (heads) indwell this fallen Christian…This is the abominable spirits that makes men desolate.This is accomplished via the lying Koran doctrines they bring.. See Matthew 23-15…whereby men are made two fold more children of hell because of lying doctrines…..
.43 When the unclean spirit is gone out of a man, he walketh through dry places, seeking rest, and findeth none.44 Then he saith, I will return into my house from whence I came out; and when he is come, he findeth it empty, swept, and garnished. 45 Then goeth he, and taketh with himself seven other spirits more wicked than himself, and they enter in and dwell there: and the last state of that man is worse than the first. Even so shall it be also unto this wicked generation.

The church has taught that Revelation 12 is about Israel…..It not about Israel unless it means the blood line of Abraham, Isaac and Jacob whose descendants were the apostles and early Christians and their descendants…..
It is about Christians, the falling away ..It is also about the prophecy of Genesis 3-15 and the brusing of the seeds, lucifer in heaven, ….and much more… The lie that this woman is Israel stops future enlightenment…

Rev 12-2..And she being with child cried, travailing in birth, and pained to be delivered.
Galatians 4-19..My little children, of whom I travail in birth again until Christ be formed in you,

Show me anywhere that you see the word Church appear after the end of Revelation chapter 3. You will not find it within the narrative. The church is not present during chapter 12 and is not mentioned from chapter 4 on. If you will go to Genesis 37:9-10, the anwser to the symbolism regarding the Sun, moon and stars is revealed by Jacob regarding Joseph’s dream. God used the same symbols in Revelation 12 to show us who the woman is, which is Israel. Furthermore, there is nothing in the context that would bring us to the conclusion that the woman represents the church. The sun is symbolic of Jacob, the moon is symbolic of his wive(s) and the stars are symbolic of the twelve tribes of Israel. Therefore, the woman as a whole represents the nation Israel. During that time, she (Israel) will give birth to a male child who are those 144,000 Jews, who are the first fruits to God who come out of Israel acknowledging that Jesus is indeed their Messiah, ergo, gives birth to. The male child/144,000 will be caught up to God and his throne before the dragon/Satan can devour (kill) them, who are seen later in chapter 14 after they have been redeemed. The Church has not taught that Revelation 12 is about Israel, the word of God teaches this.

Regarding the woman’s offspring crushing the head of the serpent, this took place when Christ defeated the powers of darkness on the cross, making a public spectical of them.

The apostles and early Christians were of the descendants of Abraham, Isaac and Jacob which means much of Christianity are also bloodlines of Abraham, Isaac and Jacob…SOME are adopted into the Abraham family..These are of Israel which fact is either hidden or unknown..Today’s Israel that is not converted will also be saved in time..My point is this…When God said He would make Abraham-Isaac’s as the STARS OF HEAVEN , surely He was aware of Revelation 12-1…And there appeared a great wonder in heaven; a woman clothed with the sun, and the moon under her feet, and upon her head a crown of twelve stars:
Genesis 26-4..And I will make thy seed to multiply as the stars of heaven, …

Israel that has not converted is actually very small in number…But when you include the congregation (stars) of Rev 12-1 then Abraham’s-Isaac’s seed is many as the stars of Heaven…
Daniel spoke of these stars being cast down to earth..
Daniel 8…
10 And it waxed great, even to the host of heaven; and it CAST DOWN SOME of the host and of the STARS TO THE GROUND, and stamped upon them.11 Yea, he magnified himself even to the prince of the host, and by him the daily sacrifice was taken away, and the place of the sanctuary was cast down.12 And an host was given him against the daily sacrifice by reason of transgression, and it cast down the truth to the ground; and it practised, and prospered.13 Then I heard one saint speaking, and another saint said unto that certain saint which spake, How long shall be the vision concerning the daily sacrifice, and the transgression of desolation, to give both the sanctuary and the host to be trodden under foot? Daniel 12-11..And from the time that the daily sacrifice shall be taken away, and the abomination that maketh desolate set up, there shall be a thousand two hundred and ninety days.

One third of the Christian stars are incorporated into the beast and are those that come up out of the earth and HAD two horns like a lamb but now speak as the dragon… Cause he indwells them now…Rev 13-11…

Rev 13 also speaks of the events that produce the earth beast of Rev 12 ..4 And they worshipped the dragon which gave power unto the beast: and they worshipped the beast, saying, Who is like unto the beast? Who is able to make war with him?5 And there was given unto him a mouth speaking great things and blasphemies; and power was given unto him to continue forty and two months.6 And he opened his mouth in blasphemy against God, to blaspheme his name, and his tabernacle, and them that DWELL IN HEAVEN.. .7 And it was given unto him to MAKE WAR WITH THE SAINTS , and to OVERCOME them: and power was given him over all kindreds, and tongues, and nations.8 And all that dwell upon the earth shall worship him, whose names are not written In the book of life of the Lamb slain from the foundation of the world.