A good amount of management salary is based on performence/ percentage of profits and stock options. This is what drives long term incompetance and low salaries because the more profit, the more the bonuses as well as higher stock value.

There really isn't a good way to apply this to all employees ecept in mabufacturing were a piece count can be had. That introduces its own issues.

So no, talent in management will only perpetuate the problem not solve itself.

He wasn't totally clear about it, but he pointed to several big problems:1) the policy that one immigrant can bring in his entire extended family2) policies that allow immigrants to come in and then get welfare benefits instead of contributing to the system3) policies which don't seem to favor immigrants with talent whatsoever

You might want to amend that, to say "...and depress wages." To say there is a shortage of qualified American is a lie. There are plenty of qualified Americans, it's just cheaper to higher temporary worker.

The bullshit coming from you is amazing. No Republican is talking about expanding green cards. They'll gladly hand out H1B Visas, because those are just temporary workers.

There are already illegal or undocumented workers living and working here. So the point is there are already part of our community. Making them legal residents changes nothing. But depriving Americans of jobs, e.g., engineering jobs, by importing H1B Visa workers causes unemployment, and is detrimental to our economy.

However, he is correct that the system is fucked up. We desperately need to change our immigration laws back to allowing only talented ppl (i.e. skills that we need), their immediate family (spouse and kids), and kill off the H1-Bs.

Well, the problem is that a family can bring a LOT more than just their immediate family. They are actually able to get the parents who can then sponsor THEIR kids (i.e. brothers/sisters of the original person). In addition, the original spouse, who may not have a job, is able to bring his/her parents, which leads to other motions.
And none of those ppl are required to speak english or have marketable skills.

Instead, we need to limit it to the immediate family of the person that is working. In addition,

Ah, a political bigot. Thanks for putting that up front and saving me the effort of reading any more. Next you'll be telling us how Obama caused your erectile dysfunction.

Which is a shame, because his post was spot on. We used to import the best and brightest, and now we import whoever has a pulse and is willing to do the job for 20% less money.
The people that we used to import had PhDs, and had knowledge that was rare in the workforce. Now, we import people who do grunt work for which any number of unemployed Americans have the skill and knowledge to do.

Talent is only needed for some jobs. For most jobs, an indentured servant who does what he's told (or else!) is much preferable to some free citizen who asks questions and wants the occasional raise. Ideally, they want full-on slaves--who they don't have to pay at all and can beat at will. But those are still illegal (for now).

They can start with the CEO's, who are the most globally uncompetitive. Typical American CEO of a large company makes about 400x the average compensation of employees. In the UK it's 45x, and in the rest of the developed world is 10x-20x. Forget about India - just go to Canada and get a CEO for about 5% the cost of a US one. Similar culture, short travel, little time zone difference... what's not to like?

You say that like you don't believe it. Well it is true. Except you have to understand that your work has to creath value in order to accumulate wealth. Doing eveything twice because you screwed up the first time usually doesn't make you lots of money but you sure would be working hard. Now doing everything twice as fast and correctly will if your salary is not locked by a contract or union.

Sometimes you have to change jobs to see the money too. A whopper flopper is going to ve limited in tge amount of pay

Except you have to understand that your work has to creath value in order to accumulate wealth.

Nope. You can be the most both highly-paid and productive "worker" in the history of the world and you'll never become wealthy. The only way to become wealthy is to control the production of others in a scalable way, and skim profit off the top. In other words, you have to own a business or businesses or profit-generating property, either actively (as an entrepreneur or real-estate investor) or passively (as an in

I have made $14 an hour before rolling buritos fresh out of school. This was back in fhe 90s shortly after minimum wage went to $5.35 an hour. I was originally highed in at $5.00 an hour which was about 30 cents higher than the then minimum wage. You don't need to be promoted out of your job posistion, just get fair raises based on the extra work you do.

Of course that requires you to not have your salary locked by contract.

I'm not at all sure I understand the purpose of tech visas, but if the problem they're supposed to solve is that there aren't enough tech workers to fill the available jobs, then surely the upshot is the same either way? The visas issued to Infosys may be used to displace existing US tech workers, but those displaced workers are then available for Facebook to hire.

I'm not at all sure I understand the purpose of tech visas, but if the problem they're supposed to solve is that there aren't enough tech workers to fill the available jobs, then surely the upshot is the same either way? The visas issued to Infosys may be used to displace existing US tech workers, but those displaced workers are then available for Facebook to hire.

It still works out the same regardless of who the visas are issued to. If there are enough graduates to fill the available jobs, then you don't need any tech visas. That's an entirely different question.

This is exactly correct. Plus, H1B visa holders are tied to the company that issues the visa. If they leave the company, they must return to their home country. Tech companies like Facebook like to have such indentured servants.

H1B visas serve only to drive down wages for US employees. Additionally, they end up training foreign talent that are later kicked out of the country (after 3 or 6 years, depending upon whether the visa is renewed). They don't help the nation's interests, nor the public's interest. They serve only to increase the profit margins of the large firms.

Get rid of the H1B, and increase the green card slots available to foreign workers, especially the Indians. I've very pro-immigrant, but the H1B visa only provides for indentured servitude.

This is exactly correct. Plus, H1B visa holders are tied to the company that issues the visa. If they leave the company, they must return to their home country. Tech companies like Facebook like to have such indentured servants.

H1B visas serve only to drive down wages for US employees. Additionally, they end up training foreign talent that are later kicked out of the country (after 3 or 6 years, depending upon whether the visa is renewed). They don't help the nation's interests, nor the public's interest. They serve only to increase the profit margins of the large firms.

Get rid of the H1B, and increase the green card slots available to foreign workers, especially the Indians. I've very pro-immigrant, but the H1B visa only provides for indentured servitude.

I am seriously worried about the future of IT in the UK. A few years back we used to have half a dozen trainee graduate programmers a year. Now management outsources this work. The people who specify requirements, verify architecture, check for quality, etc are people who used to be trainee programmers a couple of decades ago. From what I have heard this is pretty typical for the industry. What will happen in a couple of decades time? Will we have to go to Indian companies for the whole system, specificatio

Depends on what you mean by "British"; do you mean it as a political designator or a geographic one? Ireland (both the island and the country) is part of "the British Isles" (though not "Great Britain", the larger of the two main Isles), so anyone who lives in any of the British Isles, including Ireland, could be called "British" based on this. However, these days, "British" usually seems to refer to citizens (or is it "subjects"?) of the United Kingdom, which includes all of the British Isles except for

Plus, H1B visa holders are tied to the company that issues the visa. If they leave the company, they must return to their home country. Tech companies like Facebook like to have such indentured servants.

Not true. H1B visa holders can change employers. Even if laid-off, H1B visa holders have some time to find a new job before they must return to their home country. The real lock-in occurs to those people who apply for green cards.

No they can't because the Visa is issued by the corporation sponsors that person. Once that ends they have to go back. Even if they found another job that company would have to issue a Visa.

Which orifice did you pull that one out of? The visa is issued by the US government. If a H1B visa holder loses his or her job, he/she has some time (30 days, perhaps) to get another job before he or she must leave the USA. Furthermore, visa holders have some period of grace when transferring to a new job, during which

How do H1B visas drive down wages when it's vastly more expensive to hire an H1B than to hire a local? That's the part of the anti-H1B thing I just don't get.

There are some significant costs associated with hiring, however once they're hired you only have to pay them the prevailing wage for the industry. This sounds good, but 'the industry' can be interpreted very broadly, so when you're hiring someone to do realtime C programming they count as being in the same industry as a guy who dropped out of high school and writes PHP. They're also in a very weak position when it comes to bargaining, because if they lose their job they have a very short time to find another sponsor for their visa before they are deported.

If you want to avoid this, the solution is to offer a full work permit to anyone who has skills in one of the shortage industries, so they can go to the US and work at the real (i.e. defined by the market, not defined by some fixed spreadsheet) prevailing wage. Immigrants don't depress wages when they expect the same standard of living and have the same bargaining power as their native colleagues.

Suppose you have a guy leading your Java dev team under the title "Java lead engineer". He is paid $100k pa. You want to cut this cost.

Here's how H1B's work: You decide there is a new role, "Key Java developer", you declare this has all the same skills but it's a "new" role. You declare that people doing this role (which you just invented) get paid $60k pa. Weirdly, no-one applies for a $100k pa job that only pays $60k pa. Damn, there is now a "skills shortage". The imaginary "skills shortage" means you can hire under H1B and pay $60k as you wished. An immigrant is glad to be paid $60k to do the job, and their visa is now legally under your control, so if they displease you then they aren't merely fired, they are thrown out of the country.

And that's how you replace a $100k pa salaried citizen with a $60k pa indentured servant.

At its best it's a nasty cynical way to hold down wage costs. At it's worst it's basically a milder modern day slavery.

... of course, it still makes sense to at least try to allocate the visas sensibly. I'd have thought the obvious approach was to give priority in any given period to the workers who are being offered the highest pay - that should favour the companies with a genuine need over those offering cut-rate replacements to existing workers.

I think the problem is that there actually is already enough workers, the shortage is mostly myth caused by either requiremenrs that are not needed or location. More foreign workers are happy to relocate for mediocre pay than US workers.

This also tips the employment numbers in so that the wages can remain lower due to more workers that jobs. Low unemployment usually raises wages as employers need to attract and keep worker from a short supply. With more VISAs, instead of raising wages, they can import more

There are plenty of STEM workers to fill the available jobs; I think the last figures put a 2:1 or 3:1 ratio of workers to roles. There just aren't enough available at the prices these companies want to pay. Hence offshoring: find a cheaper supply of labour elsewhere.

I dunno, the salaries shown in the database linked to from the lobbying site don't look too shabby to me. Of course that might all be made up for all I know.
Be that as it may, I still don't see the connection to the outsourcing companies. How does the fact that they're getting a large proportion of the allocated visas help prove that the visas aren't really needed?

+5 insightful? 2:1 or 3:1 ratio of workers to roles? While it would be fun to feed into the frenzy going on in this message board, that means for every job, there are 1 or 2 unemployed people... 50-66% unemployment And before you say that they're just underemployed, I've interviewed hundreds of candidates and the vast majority can't do simple aspects of the job (in my case, it was to write code). So, no, you're dead wrong and the people who modded you just have some sort of agenda or lack critical thinking

The visas issued to Infosys may be used to displace existing US tech workers, but those displaced workers are then available for Facebook to hire.

No, because Infosys uses the H-1B's not just to replace American workers, but to facilitate offshoring. The H-1B's already know how the company works in India, fewer problems from language and cultural differences, etc. Most importantly, the Infosys H-1B's know that if they do a good job on their tour of duty here, they'll be rewarded when they return to India. The Indian Commerce Minister has publicly called the H-1B the "outsourcing visa".

Because the H1-Bs are indentured servants they can pay them Mickey D's wages and your US tech workers can't live on Mickey wages thanks to our degrees costing 10-20 times as much as theirs? Not to mention unlike before where a person could get an entry level and continue to get an education while getting real world experience thanks to the H1-Bs you have an arms race where you need more and more degrees (and deeper and deeper debt) just to get ANY job other than lackey?

The American workers out of jobs, at least support American companies in the process, no?
I'm not even American, I'm Canadian, so while I don't have a vested interest, I can see and understand the hate.
Essentially it makes sense to bring in tech talent with the purpose of filling vacancies that can not otherwise be filled with the domestic talent. It isn't being used for that in many cases, though - rather is used to cut cost and 'get 'er done'. If the gov't is going to enable this cost-cutting advantage, it should make sense to at least offer it to American companies rather than foreign - why would they want to both displace more expensive workers as well as displace them with the intention of supporting a foreign enterprise in the process?

If you are tiny country or have small population yes it makes sense to bring in talent. When you are the 21st century USA with a plenty big population to fill most roles and a University system that is still considered among the worlds best, no I don't think it makes much sense at all.

How do reconcile a pro-education social policy with labor and economic policies that are opposed to developing your own talent?

The idea the USA *needs* to import tech workers is pure farce. If anything USA needs to put much tighter controls around the use of foreign labor. We should treat labor like any other import, wages paid to foreign workers ought to be taxed heavily. So if a company really really does *need* to bring someone in they *can* but would be heavily discouraged from doing so in other cases. There should be payroll taxes on foreign workers working for US companies in foreign countries as well, although these should be a much lower rate.

Real Immigration on the other hand isn't a problem. If people want to come here, have families here, live here as residents and be citizens; great! Then they are our people, attracting good talent is an investment in our own country.

Its pretty rare that I advocate taxing anything, but imports are an exception, I think we should go back to funding the operation of government primarily through import tariffs and foreign labor should no exception.

The unintended consequences of such a thing on Sugar and Steel completely fucked up both industries, manufacturing, and the health of your countries children. It's an axe to be wielded with care. Overprotection of an industry can lead to putting it on permanent life support, a slow decline, and malign effects on industries that depend upon them.In case you haven't heard of these examples before, manufacturing moved to where steel was cheaper and expensive corn syrup ended up being cheaper that cane sugar.There's other things that can go wrong with your suggested approach. Byzantium gave it a try up until 1204AD.

You don't have to get overly specific. Today we have huge volumes of tarried schedules, rather than pick winners and loosers and try and prop up specific industries, I'd argue the tarried schedule should be limited to a few broad categories; commodities, hard goods, labor, and everything else. One tax rate for each category.

So then you have a very large number of industries on life support. Not a good way to swing that axe. A more delicate approach is probably much better.You also seem to have missed that those tariffs I mentioned ended up costing money.

Australia adopted the idea as well, just like many other stupid ideas from the USA and not many good ones. Initially is was to fill the shortfall of doctors after we'd cut the numbers of doctors we were training (a lobby group thought scarcity would be a good way to drive up doctors incomes). Now it's even being used to employ cleaners as "skilled workers" that are supposed to be unavailable in the country. The reality is that mining companies and similar are just importing cheaper employees via such a rort whether there are people available to do the job or not. There are certainly large numbers of unemployed people who could do such a job in the areas where cleaners and other nonskilled or semi-skilled staff are employed on indentured servitude visas.

It was driven by groups representing medical specialists lobbying the Liberal Party and was actually against the wishes of the AMA. The person who made the decision to cut training numbers was the Minister of Health, Dr Michael Wooldridge (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Michael_Wooldridge). A bit of a "character". He got into a little bit of trouble when he redirected the funding for rural specialists into funding for a building that was to be his new workplace after he left politics and the Prime Minister

People who hire illegal immigrants don't want immigration reform. If the illegals all of a sudden had a legal status and had to pay income taxes and be on the grid, etc they would not be able to work so cheaply.

When foreign goods are sold locally cheaper because the foreign government subsidises their farmers, the local farmers are hit hard. The same with finished/consumer goods, local industries get hit. The US keeps pushing developing countries to open up their markets so that US made goods can be sold cheap.So may be its always a give-take relationship. Not that I support hordes of H1B displacing US folks, but its almost analogous to what happens in other areas caused by US companies.

Yes, that's exactly how "Free Trade" works. It's a global race to the bottom. Companies everywhere lower their costs by leveraging modern communication and shipping to continually move jobs to the places where they can pay the lowest possible amount for labor. Multinational companies have no loyalty to the nations that spawned them. As short-sighted greedoids, they don't realize (or care, what the fuck, they're getting rich) that by impoverishing and reducing their workers, they're chipping away at their

Free trade is about identifying and exploiting the potential energy of the system, in the process the imbalance is reduced and profits are made

What a clever metaphor. Is it supposed to mean something, or is it just a pathetic way to make your argument seem more scientific? To anybody who is dumb enough to buy it, it also has the propaganda effect of making it seem as inevitable as entropy, when in reality it's just the opposite - a matter of policies conceived by politically powerful people.

deal with it

Why?

You are also totally ignoring the gains in the 3rd world

Another myth comforting to free traders. There is no reason that China, for example, can't grow on the basis of internal consumption, just as the US did. I

There are other approaches, but I assure you that one which doesn't enrich the wealthy will never be enacted.

Exactly. It is class warfare, and the wealthy class is winning.

H1-Bs are tied to a particular company. The visa holders get deported after a few weeks if they lose their job or quit. Why is that? So the company has leverage over them if they get uppity. It's just a scam to drive down wages, and drive up the profits of the already most profitable corporations in the history of the world. The stock market is booming and unemployment is high? Perfect! They claim "free trade!" but it has nothing to do with free

However, every H-1B coming in will require a payroll tax to be paid that is the difference between the H-1B's salary and either an average salary for a professional in that field or the median US income, whichever is higher. That way, if a place hired someone for $20,000.00/year, the company will have to pay a tax of $31,017.00 at the minimum ($51010/year was the median income in 2012.)

If a company needs specialized labor, they can get it and it won't cost t

That a politician is beholden to the corporations? No news there thanks to the conservative Supreme Court's decision in Citizen's United.

Want to quit harping about that already. The H1B program existed long before that decision was handed down and it IS A FREE SPEECH issue. I don't think anyone should be barred using their property to promote a cause. Why should some Union be allowed to basically steer unlimited monies to a politician but a corporation not? It makes no sense. As far as campaign finance goes requirements should be for real disclosure, something we don't have today. That would make difference.

Using the Government as a weapon against their competitors is what progressives do. We are fast approaching the establishment of the progressive ruling class, where if you're among the progressive elite, your company gets favorable treatment from government, and a slanted playing field.

Instead of increasing H1b's which are abused by offshore firms, make a new category for foreigners who hold a graduate degree from a top US school. The US has by far the best Universities in most areas, but the best foreign students often leave the US because of the very restrictive H1b Visa system (employment-tied, application only on April for October start, dependents not eligible for work etc). Why provide world-leading education and then let the best talent go?

As someone who worked on an H1-B visa about 10 years back in Silicon Valley, i can confirm that these visas are being misused by IT consulting companies. They take the majority of these visas and then use them as baits in india for IT professionals. Most indian IT companies are nothing but cheap labour shops. If there is a dearth of IT professionals, make H1-B non-employer specific. All it does is make you a bonded labourer for 4-6 years with your employer who promises to process your green card while paying you a low salary. This is a big scam and i hope enough people take notice so that something is done about it. Most people on H1-B won't speak about it cause they don't want to go back home or lose their job. This is what keeps it going.

I am a US citizen (and native) who was employed by Tata for a F500 company (call them BigCo.) I had been with BigCo on a temporary project with another staffing group and BigCo's managers forced Tata to find and hire me for a basic support contract while BigCo's long time employees were slowly laid off. Two of us were citizens of the US on this contract, brought in by management, everyone else was either H1B or offshore. I can assure you that Tata let my contract expire and replaced me with an H1B worker

As someone who is working on an H1B visa in Seattle, I didn't see anything like what you describe. I get paid as much as my American colleagues - more on average, in fact. My employer has sponsored my green card application, which I'm patiently waiting on (and why'd they do that if they just want an "indentured servant"?) No-one has ever directly threatened or even hinted at abusing their ability to complicate life for me as an H1B. I'm also not aware of anyone else being similarly abused.

If the claim is that there is a shortage of talent, then simply add a fee to the process, that is roughly equivalent to a years worth of college education in the state where the job is located, for every year the H1B worker works, into a scholarship program for that industry/disipline. Facebook should jump at the chance to make college more affordable for CS majors, since they seem to need so many of them. And hey, if the student can graduate without "mortgage level" loans, they can actually afford to work for less money.

This isn't selling out resident workers, both green card holders and citizens. It's capitalism in action.

The US government is for sale, and the highest bidders get what they pay for. You buy enough legislation (and legislators) and you can make anything legal.

Want to make more money in the short run by gutting STEM employment and destroying US based intellectual capitial? No problem! (Just look at IBM).

Want to pay no US taxes while you plaster US flags on your equipment? You don't even have to make the flags in the US! (Caterpillar, a proud US giant.)

It really is equal opportunity at work. You don't even have to be a US company to buy what you want.

Stop whining, it's unpatriotic. You obviously don't love the US if you can't afford to buy you own slice of the American Dream. Tata Consultancy Services is clearly a much more important American Enterprise then any of the mere citizens who do useless things like live, vote and pay taxes in the US.

It's not like there is a "Government of the People, by the People and For the People" or any other nonsense like that.

This is exactly why Zuck and his coven are such scum. It also proves that being filthy rich makes you more of an addict than a heroin user; you can *never* get enough money, and you'll fuck over your own fellow citizens to gain more.

a real heroin addict can "never" get enough heroin either, but then they die from it. Unfortunately, I don't think Zucky will die from too much money, at least until the Revolution and his head rolls into the guillotine basket.

When wages really get depressed, Americans will stop studying for tech. Then US employers will point to the declining enrollment and scream that Americans are too stupid, and lazy, to study tech subject. The only answer will be to import more visa workers.

The more visa workers the US lets in, the more US workers will feel out of place in their own work environments. Then it will get easier to offshore tech jobs for even bigger savings. Then, due to technology transfer, foreign companies will take over - this is already happening in China.

Everybody I hang with in Minnesota loves Klobuchar. She has that nerd girl with glasses look and does photo ops out bicycling with the family. Probably eats granola. Always AWOL on any serious issue where anybody might have a different view so she'd have to defend herself on a reelection, she's always present for the photo op when she brings some tax money back for a women's shelter or something. In other words, the definitional example of a pork barrel populist. My point being that people in Minnesota who

The DMV in New Jersey was fine before Christie was elected. Since election he put through a series of budget cuts that have de-staffed the DMV to the point where you can count on long lines and excruciating service.

There is an interesting map regarding economic class mobility by state that I think is the ultimate reason why you don't want a Republican state government.

Lets issue another 535 H-1B visas, take the first 535 people off of the streets in New Delhi and replace congress with them.

I bet they would come to every session, special investigation, ad-hoc committee and all have perfect attendance. They would probably do a MUCH BETTER job, since there would be little in-fighting, and they would not be indebted to some controlling political group.

2) India alone has 4X the US population, and China has 5X times the US population, and the US already has an unsustainable number of immigrants from Mexico. Clearly, we cannot let in everybody in the world who wants to live here.

3) US students, and workers, are going to eventually ask: "why bother studying tech, or working in tech, when there is no way to compete with 3rd world wages." When that happens, the US loses it's technology edge, and that will lead to an economic nose dive.

The argument about local workers being displaced aside...its a slap in the face for foreign workers who can't get an H1B and are actually the original target audience for those visas.

I have friends who Canada with credentials up the wazoo, who have been working on TN1 visas for a bit, and want something more permanent. Those are 150-300k/year jobs (lead software engineers and architects) that aren't easy to fill outside of California.

And they have to hit the lottery like anyone else, and more likely than not they won't get their H1B...and so they have to stick with TN or looking for an american to marry =P

Why doesn't Zuckerberg take what amounts to beer money for him and give out a few hundred full four-year scholarships for STEM programs to native-born Americans? He could take the interest alone (at 1%) for one year on his net worth and foot the bill for probably a thousand students.

Even if there were not enough US workers, all you would have to do is create good jobs, and you could be 100% certain that US workers would train for those jobs. No shortage of US students competing for med school.

So then why does Zuckerberg desperately want to hire foreign workers? If he really needs workers and can't find the skills he needs with US workers, then they aren't being trained in currently marketable skills (I believe that based on personal experience) and he should fund training for the skills he needs which would take less money and time than a four-year college program. If he needs workers but doesn't want to pay what Americans are willing to work for then he's no different than every other company that outsources to China or wherever and any claims of altruism are total B.S.

According to the site - "h1bwage.com is the online wage library for h1b prevailing wage determinations, and the disclosure databases for other programs."

So it's referencing the standard salaries for positions, and/or the H1B application statements of companies applying for the visas. It in no way reflects what the hired workers actually earn, and is not intended to. Salaries are always "negotiable".

I suspect that some of those figures are what the consulting firm is charging to place one of those working in another company - so the company is paying that amount for the person, but the consulting firm is taking a good portion of it off the top before they actually pay the worker.

As software continues to devour the world, every industry becomes dependent on tech workers to continue to operate. Allowing the active participation of software outsourcing firms in the US labour market via H1B's helps manage wage inflation within the sector.

Riiiight. Because wage inflation is such a huge problem in the US. Oh, wait, actually, the US has exactly the opposite problem [dailymail.co.uk].

I think your CEO number is way off, which is why your specious argument fails. The myth of fair wages for CEOs is one of the problems with the conservative mantra. Free market ostriches stick their heads in the Fox News sand while the economy visibly deteriorates for the 99%.

I donate a LOT of money to FWD.us to try to get the H1-B limits increased. Why? Because while my company does do business in the US, I despise US workers - who are generally a bunch of self-important, entitled brats who think they are God's gift to development. The worst part? They are simply lazy. My God are Americans lazy. Show up at 8:45... leave at 4:15... hour and half lunch.. sitting around surfing the Internet all day while finding a few minutes here and there to do some work in between facebook posts.

And yet their output is still just as high in quantity and orders of magnitude higher in quality than anything that comes out of your 14-hour-day Bangalore sweatshop. I have to use 5 of those guys to do the work of 1 American developer, and it's still not a deal, because it has to be sent back 5 or 6 times for fixes just to reach the level of "barely acceptable".

You're still doing business in the US because there are still idiots that thing they're getting a deal. Boeing sure learned their lesson after their Dreamliner got grounded when the steaming pile of crap that HCL delivered was so bad they had to hire a whole new set of American developers to fix it. And yet, incredibly, after multiple failed projects like that which required total re-write to fix, HCL is somehow still getting work.

3 - "nationalistic outrage" has nothing to do with it. But dealing with cheap labor sold as talented but demonstrating below acceptable levels of competence, spending time fixing all this crap because management won't pay what actual skilled developers demand, while depressing my salary to the point that I'm taking on side jobs and working 12 hours a day to keep up with increasi