But they do have the right to bring it out of beta unchanged, correct? I want this map to stay, along with everyone else. So why don't we just be honest with ourselves, assume qwert won't change his mind, and bring the darn thing out of beta?

why don't we just be honest with ourselves, assume qwert won't change his mind, and bring the darn thing out of beta?

If I had to guess, I'd say it's because the admin fears it will be a dangerous precedent. Then every mapmaker will think "well, if I don't get my way, I'll just leave the map hanging in beta and they'll have to accept it eventually"...

I'm playing a beta game of this map, and it's pretty nice. (My classicist heart reels with joy!) I have discovered a bug--namely, the Phrygians do not appear to be granting me the +2 bonus that is indicated.

This may sound harsh, but I think the admins are playing a grudge match with qwert. Nobody wins in that scenario. If CC gave us a smilie showing two thumbs pointed down, I would use it to express my frustration with how team CC has handled this mess. Idiots like Oaktown, gimil, and MrBenn have effectively ruined our chances of seeing this map sent out of BETA because they're too busy whining rather than clarifying to a person whose first language is clearly not English.

Other than feeling ashamed for yourselves, you three I singled out should also resign. You are of no help. As for now, this wonderful map has found much more life for lovers of adjacent forting. It is an exceptional map with fewer kinks than shit maps, like the ones being pumped out recently.

Politics have replaced commonsense for these three idiots who give us the semblance of democracy while truly imposing their own biased and fickle--yet collective--will.

iancanton wrote:if u really do have all 8 shields and ur opponent fails to capture at least one of ur shields during his turn, then u will win immediately when u start ur next turn.

u're not the first player to be confused by the wording. it would certainly be clearer if the legend said capture and hold all 8 shields to win the war.

MrBenn wrote:In fact

1. Wording of the objective - "Capture and hold all 8 Shields to win the war"

this is the only thing that actually NEEDS to be done - and is the only thing that is preventing this coming out of Beta...

ian.

Thanks Ian!

Yes, the game was won as you described - had read the description and some postings on this thread, but didn't realise that the holding had to last till the next turn - had assumed holding the 8 shields by the end of the round would be enough.

Qwert, this map is great, it really is. What exactly are some of the suggestions the blue men are asking you to change that you refuse? Perhaps we can compromise. Sorry, I have been out of the loop on this, but something has to give here, and my guess is the cartographers are not going to make an exception for you, if so, then they would have to for everyone. So, let me hear what you are challenged with here Qwert, and maybe I could offer some input so we could move forward possibly. Many on CC want this out of Beta, but, it sounds like you need to make a few little changes, so, what are they exactly?

The Voice wrote:Idiots like Oaktown, gimil, and MrBenn have effectively ruined our chances of seeing this map sent out of BETA because they're too busy whining rather than clarifying to a person whose first language is clearly not English...

Other than feeling ashamed for yourselves, you three I singled out should also resign.

Ha! Two of us already did resign, over a year ago!

For the record, I'd personally love to see this map pulled out of BETA. Just as I was thrilled to see that Das Schlos was finally re-released with gameplay fixes, I feel that this map remains a black mark on what I think was a generally productive run as a foundry moderator.

The conundrum that I faced at the time was this: do we stamp this map as is simply because time has passed, or do we hold this map to the same standards that we hold every other map on this site? CC's foundry process is an open one, which relies on community feedback and consensus to craft and perfect a map. Whether or not it's a good system, it's what we've got. When issues about a map's graphics or play are raised thoughtfully, they should be addressed.

The consensus opinion among the mods at the time was that a mapmaker should be willing to at least discuss the concerns that users have about his or map. This has not been the case here, and so foundry standards and expectations have not yet been met. Attempts were made - by me and others - to engage the mapmaker in this discussion, but the mapmaker refused on the grounds that he had done enough work already.

Of course, there are new sheriffs in town now. Gimil and I have been out of the picture for over a year, and the current team has less of a history dealing with this mapmaker. If they think that the rules that apply to CC's other mapmakers should be suspended in this case, and that the concerns raised about this map are not worth discussing, then by all means they should stamp it.

From the moment this map went into Beta, the CA's have been asking qwert to make an amendment to the legend and increase the user-friendliness of the map.

This evening, that amendment has gone live, which brings the Beta period to a conclusion. This update has not been created nor sanctioned by qwert, who has fully disengaged from the foundry, and refused to respond to our simple and straightforward requests.

MrBenn wrote:In fact

1. Wording of the objective - "Capture and hold all 8 Shields to win the war"

this is the only thing that actually NEEDS to be done - and is the only thing that is preventing this coming out of Beta...

There is no mapmaking medal to be awarded now, as prior to qwert's obstinance with this map, mapmakers were trusted to see their work through to completion and were commended upon the first quenching.

At any time this map was in Beta I could have pulled the map from live play, or stripped qwert of his medal. However, I firmly believe that neither course of action would have been in the best interests of the Foundry or the players of Conquer Club.

While it gives me great pleasure to release this map from the final forge, I should underline that the failure of future mapmakers to adhere to the foundry code of practice will have their work revamped (as happened to pepperonibread and the Germany map) or removed from Live Play until any issues are addressed.

--MrBenn

PB: 2661 | He's blue...If he were green he would die | No mod would be stupid enough to do that

Good call Mrbenn. Now if Qwert objects and wants the map taken down because it was changed without his consent, it will be up to him and people can't blame the Foundry for it.

Personally, I respect Qwert for all the maps he has made, but this one map really eats from that respect: if you start something you should have the integrity to follow through and see it to the end. Getting a map to beta and then refusing to work on it is really bad form and shows a bad attitude. No doubt there are people who disagree with me but this is just how I feel.