I think this is a good comparison band wise. Both are two of my favorite of all time. I grew up in the grunge era, so bands like the Pumpkins and PJ will never get old to me.

That being said, Pearl Jam has always been my favorite band, and still is to this day. They started of with a bang with their first two albums in Ten and Vs, and then started to slip a little, mostly because they started changing their style a bit, and most trendy fans decided that they sucked, yet decided that the **** known as Limp Bizkit and Korn were pretty good. IMO, some of their better music was written after Vs, most notably to me Vitalogy, and Yield, which are my two favorite albums. Eddie Vedder is my favorite lead man and vocalist ever. Their live shows are consistently better than most any other band out there. I followed them for about 4 shows around AZ, CA, NV, and all the shows were unique and different, but still killer.

My favorite Pearl Jam songs

Immortality
Off He Goes
In My Tree
Release
Leash
Black
In Hiding
You Are
Nothingman
I Got ID

....many more

Smashing Pumpkins were always right below Pearl Jam, and right above bands like Alice In Chains and Soundgarden. Billy Corgan, like Vedder, has one of the more unique voices in rock. I don't think there was a kid in middle school or high school that didn't own Siamese Dream, which is one of my favorite albums to this day. As with Pearl Jam, I have seen the Pumpkins on numerous ocassions, and I have been hit or miss with them as far as their live performances go. I went to one show in 99 in which they were promoting their unreleased "Machina..." album. The venue was small and they only seated about 1,000 people. That was a fantastic show!! Then later that year I went to their actual "Machina...." Tour and it wasn't great at all.

LOL at people saying Pearl Jam, a lock for the rock and roll HOF, sucks.

A lot of people don't like them because they refused to make 'Ten' over and over and over. They carefully and thoughtfully developed their sound and always created extraordinarily well-crafted records. Some of their musical tangents are admittedly a bit odd and sometimes seem a bit esoteric or out of place, but that's the price you pay sometimes when you are trying to make music that is occasionally a direct hit to the gut and at other times subtle and nuanced.

As much as the ISH community worships bands like Radiohead, I'd think they would appreciate that a little more than has been demonstrated in this thread. The fact is that Pearl Jam remains one of the most important and influential bands of the last 20 years.

As far as Smashing Pumpkins is concerned, Billy Corgan has an amazing talent to fuse different musical genres and styles together into a sound that is quite exhilarating, but the fact remains that his egomania and dictatorship over the band's musical direction has prevented them from producing a consistenly solid record arguably since Siamese Dream. Mellon Collie has its moments, for sure, but is also a complete mess in parts. And their latest record, though it will certainly appeal to a given taste, is by and large a disaster.

Both groups have created brilliant work, but as far as the questions of who the better band is and who has grown more musically, creatively, and artistically? Pearl Jam, and its really not close.

LOL at people saying Pearl Jam, a lock for the rock and roll HOF, sucks.

A lot of people don't like them because they refused to make 'Ten' over and over and over. They carefully and thoughtfully developed their sound and always created extraordinarily well-crafted records. Some of their musical tangents are admittedly a bit odd and sometimes seem a bit esoteric or out of place, but that's the price you pay sometimes when you are trying to make music that is occasionally a direct hit to the gut and at other times subtle and nuanced.

As much as the ISH community worships bands like Radiohead, I'd think they would appreciate that a little more than has been demonstrated in this thread. The fact is that Pearl Jam remains one of the most important and influential bands of the last 20 years.

As far as Smashing Pumpkins is concerned, Billy Corgan has an amazing talent to fuse different musical genres and styles together into a sound that is quite exhilarating, but the fact remains that his egomania and dictatorship over the band's musical direction has prevented them from producing a consistenly solid record arguably since Siamese Dream. Mellon Collie has its moments, for sure, but is also a complete mess in parts. And their latest record, though it will certainly appeal to a given taste, is by and large a disaster.

Both groups have created brilliant work, but as far as the questions of who the better band is and who has grown more musically, creatively, and artistically? Pearl Jam, and its really not close.

Great albums have to sound great and have great replayability. In all honesty, both bands failed in those regards a lot of the time so to say one band is clearly better isn't right. I mean I could play different kinds of music and say my music is better because I took more risks. Not fair. I still say SP > PJ.

As far as innovativeness and better experimentalization/progressiveness:

Great albums have to sound great and have great replayability. In all honesty, both bands failed in those regards a lot of the time so to say one band is clearly better isn't right. I mean I could play different kinds of music and say my music is better because I took more risks. Not fair. I still say SP > PJ.

As far as innovativeness and better experimentalization/progressiveness:

Dream Theatre >>>>>>>>>>>>>> Pearl Jam and Radiohead.

You guys who only listen to rock and indie **** will never know.

In all honesty, I have listened to a lot of Dream Theatre, and I just wasn't that impressed. Not my cup of tea. Not saying that they aren't a talented or innovative band, but I don't connect with them at all.

Music is soley based on opinion. There is no way to actually prove one band is better than the next. Music is something that a person has to connect with. It has to move you. Just because someone agrees with an opinon doesn't mean they're right or wrong. You can argue that bands are more talented than others, but talent does not always = good music.

This is why I still think Pearl Jam is better. Though they took risks, and changed their style multiple times, I was still able to connect with it. Just because something isn't mainstream or forced down your throat by a radio station doesn't mean it's not good music. I think there are a good majority of people who are close-minded to a lot of good music just because it's not the most popular. I still listen to all of PJ's albums on a frequent basis. The quality of good music + the longevity of the band itself = better than SP IMO.

There is absolutely nothing wrong with indie music. Some of the better music I have heard over the last 7-8 years has come from the indie bands. Today's mainstream music is so redundant and generic it's disgusting. The indie scene is a breathe of fresh air to me.

There are too many Pumpkins songs I like to give anyone else a shot at the title... but thats just me...

Off the top...
Mayonaise
Disarm
Suffer
Tonight, Tonight
1979
Galapogos
Zero
To Forgive
Bullet With Butterfly Wings
Bodies
Where Boys Fear to Tread
Thirty-Three
The Everlasting Gaze
I of the Mourning
Stand Inside Your Love
Try Try Try
Wound
This Time
Eye
Once In Awhile
Set the Ray to Jerry
Perfect
Tear
Tale of Dusty and Pistol Pete
Doomsday Clock
7 Shades of Black
Neverlost
Stellar
Death From Above
Home
Daydream....

LOL at people saying Pearl Jam, a lock for the rock and roll HOF, sucks.

A lot of people don't like them because they refused to make 'Ten' over and over and over. They carefully and thoughtfully developed their sound and always created extraordinarily well-crafted records. Some of their musical tangents are admittedly a bit odd and sometimes seem a bit esoteric or out of place, but that's the price you pay sometimes when you are trying to make music that is occasionally a direct hit to the gut and at other times subtle and nuanced.

As much as the ISH community worships bands like Radiohead, I'd think they would appreciate that a little more than has been demonstrated in this thread. The fact is that Pearl Jam remains one of the most important and influential bands of the last 20 years.

As far as Smashing Pumpkins is concerned, Billy Corgan has an amazing talent to fuse different musical genres and styles together into a sound that is quite exhilarating, but the fact remains that his egomania and dictatorship over the band's musical direction has prevented them from producing a consistenly solid record arguably since Siamese Dream. Mellon Collie has its moments, for sure, but is also a complete mess in parts. And their latest record, though it will certainly appeal to a given taste, is by and large a disaster.

Both groups have created brilliant work, but as far as the questions of who the better band is and who has grown more musically, creatively, and artistically? Pearl Jam, and its really not close.

In all honesty, I have listened to a lot of Dream Theatre, and I just wasn't that impressed. Not my cup of tea. Not saying that they aren't a talented or innovative band, but I don't connect with them at all.

Music is soley based on opinion. There is no way to actually prove one band is better than the next. Music is something that a person has to connect with. It has to move you. Just because someone agrees with an opinon doesn't mean they're right or wrong. You can argue that bands are more talented than others, but talent does not always = good music.

This is why I still think Pearl Jam is better. Though they took risks, and changed their style multiple times, I was still able to connect with it. Just because something isn't mainstream or forced down your throat by a radio station doesn't mean it's not good music. I think there are a good majority of people who are close-minded to a lot of good music just because it's not the most popular. I still listen to all of PJ's albums on a frequent basis. The quality of good music + the longevity of the band itself = better than SP IMO.

There is absolutely nothing wrong with indie music. Some of the better music I have heard over the last 7-8 years has come from the indie bands. Today's mainstream music is so redundant and generic it's disgusting. The indie scene is a breathe of fresh air to me.

Word. That's what I was saying before. Everything is just an opinion unless it's really obvious like Iron Maiden vs. Oasis.

As far as indie rock goes, the music is tired in my opinion. Boring and doesn't bring much to the table. Just my opinion.

What Dream Theatre songs have you heard. I can't grasp how someone could not like Pull Me Under, Metropolis Pt.I, Glass Prison, etc. I did say earlier though that they are very hit and miss though.