Alison Maclean has had a long history of film in her life. She was originally born in Canada but moved to New Zealand where a film industry was burgeoning. She made numerous short films then wrote and directed Crush with Marcia Gay Harden, which is a very disturbing film about love interests gone wrong. For the next few years she directed a lot of the new television shows such as Sex in the City, Homicide: Life on the Street and Subway Stories. She finally broke with American audiences with the critically acclaimed movie Jesus Son starring Billy Crudup based on the novel by Denis Johnson.

Her latest film is very different. Its a documentary called Persons of Interest and is a very stark film. In the wake of 9/11 many Muslim-Americans were detained by the American government and often jailed for no reason. They were never arrested or told why other than that they were of interest to the government. Maclean and co-director Tobias Perse videotape these detainees and/or their family members telling their stories.

Daniel Robert Epstein: I just rewatched all your movies this week for a refresher course. Was there anything specific that made you want to do Persons of Interest?

Alison Maclean: To be honest, it wasnt my idea. When I was doing Crush at the Sundance Lab years ago I met Larry Konner, who became a good friend of mine, he had formed this company called the Documentary Campaign to make films that promote social justice and human rights. He wanted to work with feature directors who didnt come from the documentary world. There was much information about the people who had been detained in the wake of 9/11. He came to me with the idea of doing a short film, then we got my boyfriend, Tobias Perse involved. We decided to do it together and after filming for three days we found that the material could support a longer length. So we ended up cutting it into an hour long film.

DRE: Were you surprised that he wanted to do this project with you since you werent born in America?

AM: No I wasnt surprised.

DRE: How long have you been living in New York?

AM: Since the end of 1992 so I guess I feel like a New Yorker by now.

DRE: What I really liked about Persons of Interest is that you kept a lot of in-between stuff that would normally get cut out of a film like this. Just the people adjusting themselves and trying to get their kids to relax in-between talking to the camera. Did you plan on that or did you find that it just worked?

AM: It was part of the idea. The inspirations for that was a film called Salaam Cinema by this Iranian filmmaker named Mohsen Makhmalbaf. He put an ad in the paper asking for Iranians to come in and audition for his next movie. It was quite proactive in some ways because he might berate them or ask them to act on demand. Basically the people realized halfway through that the audition was the film. Also I did a music video with Natalie Imbruglia a long time ago for a song called Torn. That had a similar conceit to Persons of Interest because it had a locked off camera with all the moments in-between where you would see her walking, preparing and you would see the crew. We thought that would be interesting for this film to create a set that you wouldnt realize was a set at first. It would be a series of encounters where we could capture the awkwardness and honesty of a first meeting between us and the people coming in.

DRE: How did you come to the decision to use the extra stuff? Because obviously you didnt tell the subject you were going to be doing that.

AM: They just came into the set inside this church and the camera was there. We didnt say anything about it though we did make a point of deciding to not meet them beforehand and have it be a first meeting. That was always part of the idea. Some really unexpected things like when this woman from Afghanistan who had lived here for 20 years came in with her three small boys. She got a call on cell phone from her husband who had been deported to Jordan. Thats just something you could never plan. You see her taking this call while her kids tear up the set.

DRE: How did you find the people?

AM: Daniel Massey, one of the producers, was in contact with a number of community organizations and one in particular called the Islamic Circle of North America. This one guy there, Adam Carol, worked very closely with detainees, wrote letters for them and put them in touch with lawyers. He was an incredibly important person for these people who felt completely lost and invisible in this system. Because he was involved with the film their trust translated to us.

DRE: Had you ever done a documentary before?

AM: No never before.

DRE: How did you get into the mindset of doing it?

AM: Its a very different way of working. It was very inspiring to me and I would love to do it again. Its completely different working with real people. One of the things I loved about it was that its a bit more alive when its happening in front of you. So its very spontaneous. There is something about working in feature films that is very unwieldy because youre dealing with such a huge crew. To change your mind or to have anything spontaneous happen is very difficult. Thats one of the big struggles with making a feature. This had a tiny crew and felt very direct. It was very exciting. I love working with Tobias and weve worked on a script together before this. Hes my boyfriend so were very in sync. Its nice to have another brain engaged in the process.

DRE: I know the film has played at many festivals. Has it helped the subjects at all?

AM: I wish I could say it has. Some of them have been able to show it in their communities and in some cases they can use it to help. There are one or two detainees such as this woman Shokreia [Yaghi] who is trying to fight her husbands case so maybe the film can help her. But in truth its probably not going to help them all that directly. I think its more about educating Americans about whats going on. To question what the Justice Department has been doing. Unfortunately I think its more of a longer term process.

DRE: How was going to Sundance with the movie?

AM: It was great. It was the first time we had shown it to a big audience. People were very engaged and had a lot of questions. We wondered how it would play since its just people talking and its very austere. But it definitely seemed to hold people rapt.

DRE: Did your film and television experience come into play much when doing the documentary?

AM: Not directly. Tobias and I talked a lot about how the standard format for documentaries is a bit tired. Where its a combination of interviews where the interviewer is never seen and even the questions are cut out then its combined with archival footage, narration and B-roll. There is something even complacent about it. By questioning what a documentary could be we were more inclined to try something different.

DRE: I know you did your episodes of Sex in the City a long time ago but how did you feel about the show ending?

AM: I hadnt really been following so I didnt have an emotional attachment to it. It seemed like it was probably time for it to end. Im sure at some point its not so interesting for the actors.

DRE: Your episode "Valley of the Twenty Something" was one of my favorites.

AM: Yes they were very funny scripts. I was very lucky to get to do the first two episodes so those scripts really sang.

DRE: Are you going to be directing more Carnivale?

AM: I dont know. I hope so. Im about to do an episode of The L-Word.

DRE: How did Jesus Son come to you?

AM: I was approached by two producers, Elizabeth Cuthrell and David Urrutia, who had bought the option to the book. They had seen Crush and liked it. Totally separately I had bought the book a year earlier and loved it. Originally I had rejected doing it as a film but they had such a strong idea of how to do it. We worked on it together and at some point they won me over.

DRE: Why was there such a long period of time between Crush and Jesus Son?

AM: I spent years developing feature ideas. I worked on three feature scripts and tried to get those made. Sometimes it got very close to happening but didnt happen for various reasons. I went back to one of those scripts recently and now Im hoping to make it next year. Its very difficult to do especially if you want to make unusual drama that doesnt fit the model of whats a proven success.

DRE: I read that you really identified with Fuckhead [Billy Crudups character]?

AM: In certain ways I did and certain ways I didnt.

DRE: Well its been years since you did the film. Do you feel the same?

AM: When I came out of that film I felt like I wanted to go back to doing one of my own stories. Something that was more personal. I feel excited about doing something that I generated.

DRE: Did you get a lot of opportunities after Jesus Son came out?

AM: Not as many as I expected. There were some but a lot of the scripts that come my way I dont really connect to which is another reason to develop your own material. Every now and then a script will come my way that I am interested in but then there is a lot of competition for it.

DRE: What about your own TV show?

AM: I havent really given it serious thought but its a good idea.

DRE: Then I can produce since its my idea.

AM: [laughs] Each time you try to break into some new world its a whole new undertaking.

DRE: Does one actually direct Jack Black or just point him?

AM: He came in and had such a strong fully formed character already that sometimes I had to tone it down a notch [laughs]. Hes so funny and inventive that a lot of time its just getting out of his way.

DRE: Did you ever experiment with drugs?

AM: Very little. Ive had one very bad experience with weed and since then Ive been very cautious.

DRE: Since Crush Marcia Gay Harden has become a big star with an Oscar.

AM: Yes Im so happy for her.

DRE: Have you and her talked about doing anything else?

AM: Id love to. Its always a matter of the right material.

DRE: She doesnt play such bad people anymore.

AM: I know [laughs].

DRE: Why did you move from Canada to New Zealand when you were 14?

AM: My parents are from New Zealand.

DRE: You kind of caught this wave of filmmaking that was coming out of there.

AM: It was a better place maybe than Canada to be starting out. They have a very generous system of grants for short films. I made four shorts that were paid for by the government before I made my first feature. That was pretty lucky.

DRE: Do you think you have more trouble as a female filmmaker?

AM: I didnt use to think so but yeah I think it is harder. There are certain instances where it might be easier because youre a little bit of a novelty. Certain times people might gravitate to a woman because of the subject matter. But I think there is something insidious there. I do a lot of commercials and I feel that as a woman its quite a lot harder to get work as a woman in that world. Maybe its paranoid but I instinctively feel that. I think that is the way in the feature world works as well. I cant understand why there are such a tiny percentage of women doing it and especially women developing their own material. When you look at countries like Australia, New Zealand and France where there are so many strong women directors. I feel like I would have been better off if was born as a woman in France.

DRE: Do you consider yourself an auteur?

AM: I guessIm always a little wary of that term because its such a collaborative term. It seems a little egocentric to think that one person is the one and only author of a film as opposed to a writer of a book. I am interested in making films that have a singular point of view, with a sensibility and that have their own voice. I like the idea of generating a film that doesnt feel like it could have been made by anybody.

Alison Maclean has had a long history of film in her life. She was originally born in Canada but moved to New Zealand where a film industry was burgeoning. She made numerous short films then wrote and directed Crush with Marcia Gay Harden, which is a very disturbing film about love interests gone...