Originally posted by ragesRemorse The novels will be forgotten because Potter didn't Die? That is just stupid. Children will be reading the Harry potter books for generations to come. I beleive these books, with the immortalization of the movies, will become as classic and cherished as the Lord of the rings, and Narnia novels. Readers appreciate good writing. Rowling delivers very vivid, competent and deep writing. The life of a books popularity stands on the quality of the writing, not a decision that a writer makes for one of their characters.

Personally, i think Keeping Potter alive was a brave decision. I think most people were clamoring for him to die. People love to see heroes die. Many times, a hero does need to die, but Potter is not a hero. Potter was thrust into those situations and had people plotting out his life long before he even went to hogwarts. Having Potter die would make him a martyr, a hero and an instant legend. This would not have been consistent with his character or the story. Potter was not a hero and was never supposed to be perceived as one. Having Potter die would just add unecessary tragedy to a 7 book series that revolves around tragedy. It would have been redundant to kill him. Potter went through some shit, he didnt save the world, but he saved some people along the way while trying to save himself. after Hogwarts, Potter's life is very mundane when compared to what he went through, this makes his character feel even more real.

Ok. Let me try to reply or answer some of the points you raised. I will start with the central one. Potter & Hero

POTTER! Was predestined to be a hero and martyr!
Let us see, he went from extremely traumatic childhood to celebrity. That is a hell of a start, many readers saw justice accomplished, and the little boy finally saw some appreciation and attention.

In the first four books, he went through extreme experiences that placed him in the league of extraordinary gentlemen. He managed to achieve what many others have failed, or never imagined to get engaged in. A journey straight to legend! His briliance and achievments were often compared toVoldermort's, since the begining Olivander tells us to expect great things

a) In the first book, he fought the surrogate of Voldermort and managed to postpone his return
b) In the second book, he killed the basilisk
c) In the third book, he went from chasing “ the most notorious murderer (can you think of any child or other wizard kid doing that. JK Rowling told us that everyone was freaking from the name of Black, but still he went after him) to helping and saving his life.
d) In the fourth book, he fought VOLDERMORT. People, according to JK Rowling convinced that the later was dead, still feared to pronounce his name. Most of them adults, except Dumbledore. So since the begining Harry was elevated to the level of Dumbeldore, in this context. Hermione, the brightest and most talented of all, pronaunced VOldermort's name 5 year after. Doesn't that speak volumes?

I can continue with this list until tomorrow. But what it proves is very simple: JK Rowling gave us Harry the Hero ( “ The special place you take in the hearts of all of us in the anti Voldermort movement”). And yes, I liked the books very much, enjoyed every page, they took me back and it felt like being child again. However, Harry was supposed to die and the book would have received immortality. I can assure you, that the number of Harry Potter readers will decrease every year, at least I think so.

Now, my dear friend, when you debate with someone over opinions on different matters, try to show appreciation and respect for your self and avoid using words such as: this is stupid… It gives no value to your statement nor it strengthens your arguments, only shows arrogance

Epic failure? I would strongly disagree to that gross mischaracterization, but I will say that Ms. Rowling failed to meet the standard she set for herself in the character of Lord Voldemort and then his subsequent "final duel" with Harry Potter.

Throughout the series, Ms. Rowling used exposition and third party statements to establish that Voldemort was not only a supremely gifted wizard but also "the most brilliant student Hogwarts has ever seen," and yet every time we see him, she undermines that reputation. Voldemort's only intelligent move was his arranging for his name to be tabooed so that they could capture Harry; otherwise, every other action and attempt he made demonstrated remarkable incompetence from a man who is supposed to be the most brilliant wizard alive. The most common excuse is "LOLZ HE WAS GOING INSANE" -- there is no excuse for incompetence -- especially when it becomes the predominant trait in your antagonist. The purpose of the antagonist is to threaten and represent an extremely formidable challenge for the protagonist. Here? Voldemort fails.

Their final duel? An equal failure. After Harry was murdered by Voldemort in the forest and then returned to life, I immediately knew that there was no way that he was going to die. Deus ex machina after deus ex machina after deus ex machina coming out of the woodwork to save Potter's ass; I would have been utterly terrified if I had been Voldemort. The little shit just wouldn't die. Even after Harry's sacrifice seemed to nullify the full damage of Voldemort's magic, Voldemort claims "we duel on skill alone" and seems confident of victory. As a reader, I never got the impression that Potter was ever in any true danger. And then, after Harry spends an hour and a half logically pointing out Voldemort's errors concerning the Elder Wand, Voldemort goes ahead and tries to kill him anyway, owning himself... for the second time. So, apparently, "brilliance" translates to "extraordinarily stupid and/or deaf". Voldemort apparently can't learn from his mistakes?

In this way, she renders her villain impotent and forgetful, and thus is the ultimate tragedy of Lord Voldemort: he sucks.

Perhaps if Rowling took the time to show Voldemort kicking someone's ass (just AK'ing them doesn't count. If I shoot someone in the head, it doesn't demonstrate superior skill) in the form of him owning someone in a duel, I might have been more impressed.

Originally posted by Unicor777 Ok. Let me try to reply or answer some of the points you raised. I will start with the central one. Potter & Hero

POTTER! Was predestined to be a hero and martyr!
Let us see, he went from extremely traumatic childhood to celebrity. That is a hell of a start, many readers saw justice accomplished, and the little boy finally saw some appreciation and attention.

In the first four books, he went through extreme experiences that placed him in the league of extraordinary gentlemen. He managed to achieve what many others have failed, or never imagined to get engaged in. A journey straight to legend! His briliance and achievments were often compared toVoldermort's, since the begining Olivander tells us to expect great things

a) In the first book, he fought the surrogate of Voldermort and managed to postpone his return
b) In the second book, he killed the basilisk
c) In the third book, he went from chasing “ the most notorious murderer (can you think of any child or other wizard kid doing that. JK Rowling told us that everyone was freaking from the name of Black, but still he went after him) to helping and saving his life.
d) In the fourth book, he fought VOLDERMORT. People, according to JK Rowling convinced that the later was dead, still feared to pronounce his name. Most of them adults, except Dumbledore. So since the begining Harry was elevated to the level of Dumbeldore, in this context. Hermione, the brightest and most talented of all, pronaunced VOldermort's name 5 year after. Doesn't that speak volumes?

I can continue with this list until tomorrow. But what it proves is very simple: JK Rowling gave us Harry the Hero ( “ The special place you take in the hearts of all of us in the anti Voldermort movement”). And yes, I liked the books very much, enjoyed every page, they took me back and it felt like being child again. However, Harry was supposed to die and the book would have received immortality. I can assure you, that the number of Harry Potter readers will decrease every year, at least I think so.

Now, my dear friend, when you debate with someone over opinions on different matters, try to show appreciation and respect for your self and avoid using words such as: this is stupid… It gives no value to your statement nor it strengthens your arguments, only shows arrogance

Potter achieved none of these things on his own. He never had a choice but to embrace these situations for his life and the life of his friends were always at stake. Of course he did heroic things through his experience at Hogwarts, but he never did anything more grand than the right thing. The entire focus of the series was that perseverance and good morals will lead way to righteousness. I can see how Potter may be a hero, but, personally, i never saw him as more than a person who did the right thing.

Saying these books will not be remembered because Potter didn't die, however, is stupid. I don't mean to insult you, but it is a silly statement. Now, if you said that the quality of the seventh book being lower the than previous 6 will weaken the fan base. I may be able to see where you are coming from, but there are dozens of memorable stories where the prophecy of the hero becomes fulfilled and the hero survives. You say Potter was destined to die...,why? Because everything else in his life was stolen away from him? By that logic, Luke Skywalker should have died, Aragorn and frodo should have died and all of the other main characters that have survived epic adventures and dark prophecies should have died. It makes no sense to say that the Harry potter books will not be remembered and loved as much as they are today in thirty years when the story is well written and has the basic ingredients which appeal to everything it means to be a child and an adult.

__________________"If you tell the truth, you never have to remember anything" -Twain
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