I don't know when human intelligence peaked, per ce. But from my personal observation it's definitely on a sharp decline since the early '00s. Reality TV is just one perfect example.

11-16-2012, 06:44 AM

sarasue624

The average citizen from Athens ate a grain-based slop diet while producing olive oil to burn or sell which eventually ruined the land (that wasn't that good to begin with) completely. Ecological disaster and famine! Well, I guess he would have fit in today just fine!

11-16-2012, 07:33 AM

Bosnic

[QUOTE=JoanieL;1006756]I don't know the stats on the number of offspring. However, I have to believe that when "everybody passes," it knocks the wind out of little developing, naturally competitive, high achieving kids. What's the point of working your ass off if everyone gets the same reward?

Imagine a world where everyone who took the CPA exam, Bar exam, Medical boards, etc., got to work in those professions regardless of ability, just because they tried "real hard," but just didn't get the grades. As it is, in my lifetime, they've dumbed down the SATs so much that if I want to be one of those senior citizen grad students, they automatically add 200 points to my scores because of those changes.

I don't know current numbers, but when I lived in CA, I learned that for every dollar spent on "exceptional" children in education, 98cents was spent on below average learning abled and 2cents was spent on above average. I'm not heartless, and I believe in public education, but damn, that's a huge disparity.

Large segments of our culture glorify the good old boy mentality while sneering at "those over-educated snobs."

I don't know when intelligence peaked. But I think the respect for intelligence went in the toilet about 25 years ago. :)[/QUOTE]

That's all well and good, but this is more about genetic intelligence. And I don't know if that even affects the birth rates in terms of intelligence.

However, as it stands, poorer people tend to have more children than richer people. And there is a correlation between poorness and low IQ. That isn't to say all poor people are dumb, some are Einstein smart. But poor people tend to be less intelligent on average, as a group, than rich people.

One solution is some sort of incentive to not have more children while on welfare.

11-16-2012, 08:19 AM

Kochin

[QUOTE=Bosnic;1007010]That's all well and good, but this is more about genetic intelligence. And I don't know if that even affects the birth rates in terms of intelligence.

However, as it stands, poorer people tend to have more children than richer people. And there is a correlation between poorness and low IQ. That isn't to say all poor people are dumb, some are Einstein smart. But poor people tend to be less intelligent on average, as a group, than rich people.

One solution is some sort of incentive to not have more children while on welfare.[/QUOTE]

Rather than the current incentive of "Have a kid? Too young/underqualified to work? Have more and it's almost like earning a living!" Seriously, why schemes that pay you for having kids? Why something that says your kid is in "relative poverty" if they don't enjoy the same videogames as their friends? Why not something like several high-schools run, which is a day-care for teenage mums, so they can study, but see their kids on campus? Why not get paid for getting a job, after all, many teen mums study and/or work with one or two kids and make an amazing life for themselves. We need an incentive for young mums to educate themselves and get a job, not shrug and tell them they're doomed "breed" for cash from now on.

[Hell, I've been on welfare for two years. I made my way out of it. I know I'm smarter and stronger than to need it and better than to demand it. But even I look back and wonder why it was all so easy. Anyone who's smart enough can escape that cycle, but, right now, there's no incentive.]

11-16-2012, 08:23 AM

Leida

Uhm, I am sorry to put this here, but would that be Athenian showing up among the modern Greeks or modern Americans? Folks from the US tend to examine every problem very inwardly, and then extrapolate the result to the entire world, when they are actually an exceptional minority. Just sayin'.

11-16-2012, 08:28 AM

Kochin

[QUOTE=Leida;1007098]Uhm, I am sorry to put this here, but would that be Athenian showing up among the modern Greeks or modern Americans? Folks from the US tend to examine every problem very inwardly, and then extrapolate the result to the entire world, when they are actually an exceptional minority. Just sayin'.[/QUOTE]

Culturally, the difference is kinda disappearing. To quote Rammstein: "We're all living in America."
(OK, I get your point there, but I assume they just mean Ancient Greeks vs any Advanced Modern Society.)

11-16-2012, 08:53 AM

Leida

I think that millions of people in Asia and Africa can but disagree. Heck, I live in Canada, and I do not feel like I live in USA.

11-16-2012, 09:54 AM

Uncephalized

[B]IF[/B] the selection pressures on intelligence have relaxed or shifted, then he might be on to something. In no way has he demonstrated that this is the case, however, so it remains merely one of many possibilities.

11-16-2012, 10:30 AM

Kochin

[QUOTE=Leida;1007154]I think that millions of people in Asia and Africa can but disagree. Heck, I live in Canada, and I do not feel like I live in USA.[/QUOTE]

I know. It's just a joke based on how Americanized most Western cultures are. :p Look up the video to the song. It makes enough of a point of how much America's culture is "leaking" into other ones.

11-16-2012, 10:34 AM

Kochin

PS: The main reason the potential loss of intelligence in humans is hard to study, btw, is because most modern science refuses to accept "devolution". Things (supposedly) go from heavy to light, muscular to fast, armoured to armourless, dumb to smart and CAN'T go the other way. A lot of species and data that don't fit those criteria are sort of ignored. Stupid, I know, but, unfortunately, science isn't one genius having bright ideas, it's a group-effort, using pre-conceived concepts and concensus. Makes it hard to get anything "genius" done.
In the eyes of modern science, humans CAN'T "get dumber" because that'd be "devolution" and that "doesn't happen", so it's unlikely to be folled up with another study, as it isn't a supported view.