Chelsea Clinton Says She Finds It ‘Insulting’ When Others Question Her Mother’s Faith

During a recent fundraiser for her mother’s presidential campaign, Chelsea Clinton told supporters that she finds it “insulting” when others cast doubts on her mother’s claims of being a Christian.

“My mother is very deeply a person of faith,” she said of her mother, Democratic presidential candidate Hillary Clinton. “It is deeply authentic and real for my mother, and it guides so much of her moral compass, but also her life’s work.”

Clinton said she doesn’t appreciate when her family’s faith is questioned.

“I find it quite insulting sometimes when people say to my mom, my dad or me … that they question our faith,” she stated, according to Page Six.

As her mother was raised Methodist and her father Baptist, Clinton outlined that she has attended the services of both denominations.

“I was raised in a Methodist church and I left the Baptist church before my dad did, because I didn’t know why they were talking to me about abortion when I was six in Sunday school,” she stated. “That’s a true story.”

“I recognized that there were many expressions of faith that I don’t agree with and feel [are] quite antithetical to how I read the Bible,” Clinton continued. “But I find it really challenging when people who are self-professed liberals kind of look askance at my family’s history.”

According to reports, the Clintons attended Foundry United Methodist Church in the 1990’s when Bill Clinton served as president. United Methodist congregations are generally pro-abortion and do not believe that homosexual behavior is sinful.

“We’re going to defend a woman’s right to make her own health care decisions. We’re going to defend Planned Parenthood,” Hillary Clinton declared at a campaign rally in New Hampshire last week. “We’re going to defend marriage equality and end discrimination against LGBT Americans.”

Planned Parenthood President Cecile Richards is also currently in Nevada to hit the campaign trail with Clinton in the name of “reproductive rights.” She stumped for the presidential candidate in earlier this month Iowa.

Clinton has suggested that she views the Scriptures as providing more of a “social gospel” mandate to help the poor and needy.

“I have always cherished the Methodist Church because it gave us the great gift of personal salvation but also the great obligation of social gospel,” she said in 2014 at the United Methodist Women’s Assembly in Kentucky. “And I took that very seriously and have tried, tried to be guided in my own life ever since as an advocate for children and families, for women and men around the world who are oppressed and persecuted, denied their human rights and human dignity.”

As a result of her positions on the institution of marriage and the sanctity of life, as well as other aspects, some have stated that Clinton’s life does not comport with that of a biblical Christian.

“[S]he doesn’t fear God,” said Kevin Swanson in a broadcast of Generations Radio. “She is against the commandments of God. She opposes righteousness on just about every opportunity…”

“She needs to turn from her wicked ways. She should repent or she will likewise perish,” he stated. “[People] need to take God’s law seriously. … I think our nation is too proud—I think Hillary Clinton is too proud. They need to fall on their faces before God [and say], ‘God have mercy on me, a sinner.’ That’s what Hillary Clinton needs to do, and that’s what the people who vote for her need to do as well.”

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Josey

If it walks like a duck, quacks like a duck or in Hillary’s case shrieks, then it is a duck!

mrpoohead

……….or a man with an imitator.

robertzaccour

She is NOT a Christian.

mrpoohead

Well she did forgive Bill, who is obviously the devil – along with all of the other Presidents.

sandra-paquette-

Read the book The Clintons they are most degrading humans. She was as EVIL as he is .

mrpoohead

Obviously not or they would have been struck down surely?

sandra-paquette-

You are a born idiot.

mrpoohead

………………………and you are the Almighty?

afchief

This is not a woman I would want my daughter to emulate or aspire to be. Moreover, she simply is not competent. She has never truly managed anything but cover ups. She has never truly started anything but a criminal extortion racket. We have seen a history of Democratic versions of intimacy: From the Gore’s awkward kiss that ended in divorce to Kerry’s marrying for money to John Edwards unfaithfulness on his wife’s deathbed to JFKs serial infidelity to Jackie O. Now, we have Michele 0bama’s, finger-wagging, lunch-pullin’, hypocritical scowl. These are the faces of Democratic Women. When will we have an authentically loving and lovable Democratic wom—-, wait, not just woman but any authentically loving and lovable Democrat leader?! I’m sorry, and I hate to say this but, really, stop for a moment and reflect on all the Democratic Party leadership: Wasserman-Schultz. Pelosi. Reid. Weiner. Warren. Schumer. Cuomo. 0bama. They are cold-hearted, bitter, mendacious and self-serving slimeball people.

THEY HAVE NO HONOR… THEY HAVE NO INTEGRITY… NOTHING IS BENEATH THEM… THEY ARE DEMOCRATS!

mrpoohead

As the Bible basically is guiding folk to be nice to each other and advocates social responsibility that surely makes the Republicans the most evil party devilish even. Not that the Democrats fair much better – at least they attempt responsibility though.

You have very strange views on the Left – I suspect you have never left West Virginia. If you visit the rest of the Western World you will find all have parties representing the Left. All are safer places to live (homicide rate is a fifth to a tenth), the Aussies have the highest minimum wage in the world. Two kids on minimum get to the bottom of the property ladder, in Norway the government has invested over a million dollars in every citizen – this funds pensions, schools and welfare. Neither are slothful, the former being viewed as hard working/playing/partying.
Conversly; the Right keeps slavery alive.

afchief

The demon-crap party has become the Neo-Fascists. They hate people, they hate liberty, they most of all hate themselves. Destruction of any kind is central to their disease.

The Democratic Party is the party of Slavers, the party of Jim Crow, the party of class warfare, the party of race baiters, the party of hate. Demolition should start there.

Democrats should change their symbol to the hammer and sickle.

mrpoohead

Personally I wouldn’t vote for them either, but out of a choice of dreadful and dreadful they do seem the least appalling.
I think you need to look up neo-fascist and Jim Crow, obviously your education is seriously lacking.

sandra-paquette-

Have to agree on this one.

Emmanuel

Chelsea, you need to understand the difference between believing in Jesus and living for Jesus. Anyone can say they have faith in Christ. But, they don’t live it.

thelordlives2011

Emmanuel, good point. What is insulting is that Hilliary Clinton has no faith except in the Devil. The evil that Clinton exhibits shows where her faith lies and it is not in Jesus Christ. Chelsea gets insulted because people know all about her mother.

Emmanuel

Right on.

mrpoohead

Let he is without sin cast the first stone – never been naughty?

sandra-paquette-

They are beyond naughty – They are of satan. Bill is a cocaine user, serial rapist and murder. She is the most foul mouth monster, murder, liar etc etc.

mrpoohead

George W Bush too was a cocaine user. Both have been accused of rape – neither has been committed or even gone to trail. As you are obviously God and all seeing I had best watch out I suppose

mrpoohead

……………if you’re going to live it, when will you start forgiveness?

FoJC_Forever

The Devil finds it insulting when you won’t obey him as if he is God.

Follow Jesus, find Wisdom.

WorldGoneCrazy

“It is deeply authentic and real for my mother, and it guides so much of her moral compass, but also her life’s work.”

“Ye shall know them by their fruits.” — Matthew 7:16 (a)

mrpoohead

The thing I love about religious zealots (any faith) is their ability to cherry-pick verses to fulfill their own bigotry. Leviticus 18:22 claims gay to be a sin, it does not say go out and whack them. Equally it is in the First/Old Testament, no Jesus yet. In the New Testament Jesus is preaching peace, love, forgiveness and understanding – makes him seem a bit of a hippy, but definitely a liberal. The Bible also evokes us to care for other people and spread the love/wealth – that’s socialism. In Islam jihad meant ones internal stuggle not an excuse to start shooting.
With all this in mind it kind of makes America the least christian of all western countries, Presidents thanking God for the election seems as crass as some Islamist shouting “Jihad”. That’s irony!

Josey

Yes, we as Christians are to forgive and love one another and love will speak the truth, Jesus always spoke the truth, the religious leaders of his day hated Jesus because He spoke the truth, he pointed out their hypocrisies and He pointed out their sin, they hated Christ. Everyone Christ set free, He told them “go and sin no more”. Also, the Bible does not advocate spreading the wealth as you suggest in a socialist manner, the Bible talks about helping one another, especially widows who have no one else to care for them, if you are able to work you should or you don’t eat. The Bible never advocates just taking from another and giving it to those who are poor because they choose not to work. The Bible commands a lot of things, such as children support your elderly parents, do not disrespect them. Your comment shows a lack of understanding of what God is teaching from His word in context from Genesis thru Revelation.

mrpoohead

Obviously you did not do history at school – where Jesus was born the population was mostly Jewish, but the ruling power was the Romans. Jesus was Jewish and never claimed to be the son of God; to the Jews he would have been seen as holy and prophet like. Judaism and Christianity did not split for a few hundred years. By his actions Jesus would have been seen by the Romans as a revolutionary, a Commie by today’s standards.
Am not sure what you mean by spreading the wealth in a socialist manner – how is it not? He was most assuredly advocating “social responsibility”. This means to take care of the people in the “greater” sense – not give them money for the sake of it. Example: Norway has invested over a million dollars in each of its citizens, this funds welfare if they cannot work, pensions, education and health. They are not all sloths, but quite industrious. Australia has the highest minimum wage in the world, so that two kids on minimum can get to the bottom of the ladder (in housing terms). Norway has the smallest social disparity in the world, Australia has the best in the English speaking world. The Aussies are seen as hard working, hard playing, hard partying people – again not sloths. Australia has the greatest social mobility in the world, making it the land of opportunity.
It is only later that Jesus was deemed the son of God, here the Jews disagreed but did acknowledge him as a prophet. The same can be said of Mohammed – they are all acknowledging the One God, they merely have differing views towards sons/prophets. Either way they are all following the “Word”, which is liberal and socialist in its outlook – the latter two are merely re-enforcing the path to be taken. Whichever one you follow is deemed more by where you were born and family circumstances – which is right is irrelevant as in theory you will all be going to the same place and as all advocate forgiveness, if you did not acknowledge one they will forgive.

Josey

your name suits you well for you no nothing of the Bible. God Himself says Jesus is His Son in many scriptures.

mrpoohead

………………..I said Jesus never claimed to be the son of God – and I am correct. You twisty turn-y thing. Are you a politician as you answer questions not asked and avoid ones you cannot

Mom2Five

Sorry but you are wrong!

In Matthew 16:15-17

He said to them, “But who do you say that I am?” Simon Peter answered, “You are the Christ, the Son of the living God.” And Jesus said to him, “Blessed are you, Simon Barjona, because flesh and blood did not reveal this to you, but My Father who is in heaven.…

Then again in Mark 14:61,62

“Again the high priest was questioning Him, and saying to Him, “Are You the Christ, the Son of the Blessed One?” And Jesus said, “I am; and you shall see THE SON OF MAN SITTING AT THE RIGHT HAND OF POWER, and COMING WITH THE CLOUDS OF HEAVEN.”

mrpoohead

Ambiguous at best – I suspect there is a simple reason he never claimed to be the son of God. Humility; something you are sadly lacking. Well that and the fact that he would’ve been murdered and it would without proof be blasphemous.

Mom2Five

Well I agree that when He was talking to Peter He didn’t say it outright but at the Sanhedrin He most definitely did say it outright and yes that was what they used to justify crucifying Him. That was why the Romans put the saying “King of the Jews” over His head and the Jews wanted them to change it to “He says he is the King of the Jews”

mrpoohead

Errrrrrrrrrrr no! Well not in my Bible – maybe you’re dodgy one from Ebay, “Made in China”. Try reading again – incorrect. Historically the sign above his head was invented centuries later in artistic depictions – it is doubtful that Roman soldiers would have been literate at the time.

Mom2Five

Ok I get it you’re just playing a game here. I hope you decide to read the Bible for real and find out what it really says. I pray that your eyes will be opened to the truth of God.

FoJC_Forever

Jesus is the Word of God made into human form, into the likeness of sinful flesh. He has always existed.

You simply chime the same compromising philosophy as those who live in Unbelief.

Judgement is coming.

mrpoohead

I think you need to re-read what I said – your comment is puerile. I pointed out “errrrr’s” in society, whatever religion. You’re saying nothing.

Mom2Five

I think this is what is meant by someone making a god in their own image.

mrpoohead

And obviously you are the one to stand judgement. Not very forgiving?

Mom2Five

Her views are inconsistent with the Bible what is there to judge? I is simply glaringly obvious. You can only serve the God of the Bible by following the Bible. If she says she is serving God and her actions are contrary to that then it just makes sense to assume she means a different one or she is mistaken. Some people think they are serving the God of the Bible but in actuality are serving their idea of what God is or what they think He ought to be. Therefore they have made a god in their own image as the bible warns of. As for being forgiving, yes I am forgiving. It is a requirement of serving the God of the Bible to forgive.

mrpoohead

If you are forgiving you would not be making such comments. You are hardly serving God by your statements.
All US Presidents claim God is on their side – an oxymoron of the first order, none of them are divine. Most are awful!

Mom2Five

If you mean your god then you are probably right, but my God said in His word in Matthew 7:15-20 You Will Know Them by Their Fruits

15 “Beware of false prophets, who come to you in sheep’s clothing, but inwardly they are ravenous wolves. 16 You will know them by their fruits. Do men gather grapes from thornbushes or figs from thistles? 17 Even so, every good tree bears good fruit, but a bad tree bears bad fruit. 18 A good tree cannot bear bad fruit, nor can a bad tree bear good fruit. 19 Every tree that does not bear good fruit is cut down and thrown into the fire. 20 Therefore by their fruits you will know them.

Does Hillary have good fruit according to the Bible. Absolutely not!

Not only that but the Bible also says in 1 John 3:14 “We know that we have passed from death unto life, because we love the brethren. He that loveth not his brother abideth in death.” Which means that we can know that people are Christians because they love other Christians. Otherwise they are pretending.

Does Hillary actions show love toward Christians? Absolutely not!

mrpoohead

Let the one without sin cast the first stone.
Truly amazing that the potential leaders of the country are judged in a biblical sense. Surely their political views are more important? Who cares what their religious views are, who cares what religion they represent – what they intend to do for the country surely is paramount? Thankfully I won’t be voting for Democrat or Republican – they are both fairly awful and neither follow the Lord’s social responsibility.

Mom2Five

Apparently Chelsea Clinton cares since that is what the article is about. And as for that Bible story, it is surprising to me how many people forget or fail to mention that after running off all the legalistic religious crowd, Jesus himself told her to “Go and sin no more”.

mrpoohead

Well, sadly, it is worth votes. This makes America a non-secular society like Saudi Arabia – Iran has a better standing. Frightening – religion should not even be on the agenda, along with abortion, but every election it is, not just for the Clinton’s. Quite frankly I care not what they do behind closed doors – they could be Christian, Jewish, Muslim or atheist. That is irrelevant to running the country.

Mom2Five

Your vision is skewed. It isn’t secular vs. religion in this world. It is the one true God and His son Jesus Christ vs. evil. Islam does not fall on the same side of the coin as Christianity. They are polar opposites. They are good vs. evil, God vs. the devil. That is why the media does not criticize Muslims but will crucify Christians at every opportunity. They claim it is because the Christians are hypocrites who tell everyone how to live and oppress women and hate gays. When in reality it is Islam holds its worshipers through fear, killing those that break their laws, throwing gays off of rooftops and are the real oppressors of women in this world. The world and the Muslims are on the same side of the coin and at the foundation run by their father the devil. The people of the world are blinded to believe that Christianity is what is wrong with our world. Jesus said that the world hated Him and would hate Christians also. Its not a new concept. Jesus is the stumbling block. Christianity is what propelled the Western Civilization to its greatness because it served God albeit clumsily at times but it spread the gospel. There are forces that want to destroy civilization as we know it here in this country. The left through progressiveness and socialism and the East through Muslim encroachment working in tandem. Religion is not irrelevant to running the country, its the only hope we have. Which one will win out? Will Christianity win out making the country great again? Or will the devil be allowed to have his way? It is up to us all to turn to Jesus with our whole hearts and turn away from sinfulness because God will give us what we want. If we want Him and His righteousness we will get it, but also if we want to feed our flesh, gorging on sin, He will turn us over to it. Problem is when He turns us over to our sin and lets us have what we want in our flesh, then His hand of protection is removed. I pray that we still have enough people to stand up for what is right because once that protection is gone it won’t be pretty.

mrpoohead

Well with opinions like yours I see war ahead – thanks. I suspect you have never been outside of your state, never mind overseas. The difference between Christianity and Islam is one sees Jesus as a son of God, the other sees him as a prophet and has an extra prophet – Mohammed. They are both supposed to follow the doctrine of the First Testament. Unfortunately a few folk on both sides turn it into a battle – the least of my concerns is Islam. I have two Muslim neighbours both are in mixed relationships – one moved in with her boyfriend last year and had a child, they marry this year. He is a confirmed atheist. The other couple have been married years and have grown up kids, who were shown both religions and chose to ignore both.
Neither religion is wrong – both advocate social responsibility and goodness and are following the First Book. There’s just a few idiots on both sides who stuff it up for us all. A Muslim is allowed to have three wives (mad!) yet if he is adhering to Allah then he can only do this if he treats them all fairly/equally. I do not know any educated Muslim man who has more than one.
You are narrow minded and bigoted – God help us if people vote on your views. War! Please volunteer your five.

Mom2Five

No I am not narrow minded and I am not bigoted. This is a lie manufactured to keep people from coming to Christ as is your view of the difference between Christianity and Islam. First of all Islam does not use the Old Testament of the Bible and they do not serve the God of the Bible. Allah is not God the Father the one true God. He is a deceiving spirit. Jesus is the Son of God as well as the Word of God. Islam is most definitely a false religion. It demands hate and death and evil. If it were possible to locate the bones of any deceased person and know without doubt who they had been, you could find Mohammed’s grave and what is left of him there, but you could not find the bones of Jesus because He is not dead and His body did not see decay. Jesus is alive and there is power in his name and He loves you and longs for you to notice Him and come to Him with all your troubles and turn your life over to Him. The absolute best thing I ever did with my life. Jesus takes our burdens and give us peace. He is worthy and mighty. He works all things together for our good when we love Him. Any carnal pleasure pales in comparison to His Glory! His Holy Spirit is more intoxicating than any drug. He is calling to all “Come, follow me”! The people who have heeded that call live a life of joy in all things even the hard times that come to us all. I have joy and peace no matter what happens in my life. So can you! All it takes is turning to Jesus.

mrpoohead

I’m not sure what is more frightening – you either didn’t go to school, paid no attention or decided to ignore what was taught.
Judaism, Christianity and Muslim are all Abrahamic religions – same source, division at different times. Jesus was Jewish, all acknowledge him as a prophet, only one as God’s son.
I am a Christian (you are not) and as such am gracious enough to accept other folk have different views, as long as there is a common goal the journey there is irrelevant. Islam is no more about hate and death than Christianity – occasionally we have loonies, not all are Muslims. In the Balkans it was the Christian Serbs who tried to “ethnic cleanse” – just were in the good book is this allowed?
I would recommend some history lessons and a re-reading of the Bible which urges peace and understanding. Something you are obviously devoid of, yet claim to be Christian.

Mom2Five

That is just like Satan to claim to be a Christian while accusing me of not being one. I have no doubt that I am truly saved because I have a relationship with Jesus Christ. I am well aware that He was Jewish. There is a reason why Jews that find Christ are called “completed”. Yes Mohammed was descended from Abraham but this is where the relationship between ends. I have nothing against Muslims they need Jesus just like anyone else. I am concerned about the ones who threaten Western Civilization for sure, who in their right mind isn’t? Of course there are loonies from every “religion” but Islam encourages and demands death to infidels. Christianity brought about the freedom of the West. Big difference. Your sentence about common goals and the journey being irrelevant, do you mean salvation? I encourage you to read through the New Testament to get fresh perspective on what it means to be a Christian. Jesus said “I am the way, the truth and the life. No man comes to the Father but through me”. There is no other way.

mrpoohead

Fundamental to Christianity is forgiveness – you have none, unless they have the exact same believes as you. Reminiscent of the Spanish Inquisition, Hitler and Pol Pot. You are no better than ISIL and Bin Laden – neither are following Islam, which does not order death to infidels. Loonies like you, do that – Christianity did not bring freedom to the West, it enslaved much of it for hundreds of years. Did you go to school?

You have a very tainted view of Christianity, I suspect you are one of these “born again hooligans”. You have merely replaced one legal drug for ones that were not. Please find another.

I pity your “five” – lets hope none ever “errrrrr”, as you will send them to purgatory. “To errrr is human, to forgive divine”.

“Kindness is a mark of faith, and whoever is not kind has no faith,” Muhammad.

Mom2Five

I forgive people who do something to me that requires forgiveness. Other people need forgiveness just not from me because I am not Jesus. What exactly am I supposed to be forgiving people for? They have done nothing to me. Having a different opinion than me is not an offense. That’s silly. I am not one of these Millennial cry babies who need to find a safe space when someone offers a dissenting view. I simply put on my boots and get over it. I might pray for someone if I think that they are in need of Jesus but I don’t see where forgiveness comes in.

As for school, yes, I have had quite a bit of it with History being a particular favorite and proclivity. Seven years of college courses. I understand things quite well actually. My IQ tested at 140 which is nothing to sneeze at. And yes, I am definitely born again just as Jesus said that we must be.

As for my 5, would you call getting pregnant at 17 erring? Because my oldest did. I didn’t explode at her either. I didn’t scream or yell or go through the roof. I patted her while she cried on my shoulder and told her not to worry and that I would watch the baby while she finished school and that is exactly what I’ve been doing these days. She is quite amazing and so is my grandson and I couldn’t be prouder of them.

As for being kind, do you think Mohammed was being kind while he raped his 9 year old child wife?

mrpoohead

Well please go back and shoot your history teacher as they were obviously dreadful. IQ 140, well you can buy anything these days I guess – Ebay?
Well, thankfully it would seem, your actions are far better than your words though I did note you seemed to give your daughter no choice over finishing school. What if she’d wanted to be a full-time mum?
Still your words condemn most everything else. In Muhammed’s time you were deemed an adult when puberty arrived, equally they were married – now I grant you that is abhorrent by todays standards but the yard-stick was somewhat different then. Five centuries later the English King married someone of a similar age and he was a Christian. Currently we have a few nut jobs around The Jeffs family being only one – in theory they have modern day education but because of God chose to ignore today’s laws.
Equally; Mary Magdalene in the Bible was portrayed as a “camp follower” – the same term for other depositions in similar times was a hooker/groupie. I’m open-minded about what went on, a lot of years are not written about – I’m kinda thinking; yep, he got laid somewhere. He’s male and horny, especially between 18 and 30.
Now more importantly did you forgive the father of your grandson or did you chop his dingle dangle off and feed it to the pigs?

Mom2Five

I will pray for your soul. You can still turn to Jesus and be redeemed. There is still hope for you. I pray that the Lord will send people to you to help you.

I have a great relationship with my grandsons father. His nickname for me is Care Bear. I liked him from the minute I met him although at the time there was no clue that there was anything between him and my daughter. What is the purpose of getting upset? It wouldn’t have changed anything. Anyway I think getting pregnant was the best thing that could have happened to her so I wouldn’t have wanted to change it. He is supporting them and they have plans to get married. I have no problem with him. He is family as far as I am concerned. The logistics will get worked out eventually. There’s a lot worse things have happened in this world.

mrpoohead

Don’t think I need you to pray for my soul. “Turning to Jesus” by your standards then I know I won’t follow – you are promoting bile and hatred, I do not find that particularly Christian/Muslim/Jewish. Essentially you are claiming to be the Almighty – your way or the highway. I do not think that is what Christianity is about.
Seems like you gave your daughter a “fait accompli” as opposed to her making a decision.
Muhammed had all but one of his children with his first wife – they were married for 14 years before she died and that then was his only wife. Obviously he was fertile, it seems a little ludicrous to think that the subsequent wives were not. More likely the marriages were about politics, the supposed nine year old may also have been 19 – most of the wives became important after his death, especially the “young one”. Were they consummated, I doubt anyone was checking and without a time machine we’ll never know.
You harangue Clinton – well she might not be someone I would vote for either, but your rhetoric is obnoxious. Wouldn’t vote for Trump or Cruz either – think NoBody would be better.
You claim Christianity, but I think you are as far away from it as ISIS is from Islam.

Mom2Five

Christianity is about the fact that Jesus is the Son of God and He loves us so much that died for our sins and if we believe and love Him we can be saved from an eternity without Him in hell. It is a free gift that only needs to be accepted. To say anything else is to fail to understand the message completely.

Of course my daughter wanted to finish school. It would have been silly for her not to. Since her baby was born in December of her senior year I suggested that she should take her GED test and then start college in the fall rather than to leave her baby in order to spend 8 hours a day in a high school classroom. She thought that was a great idea and instead spent just a few hours a week at classes and she is doing well at college.

You are very naive about Mohammed. You seem to believe only good about everyone other than Christians (and I suspect Jews also). Then you suspect only evil intentions and hate seething. Jesus said the world hated Him and would hate Christians also and you seem to have bought right into it. Jesus is the stumbling block.

I take your last sentence as a compliment. However I don’t live up to what I could be. I try and fail daily to live up to what I should be as a Christian. It is only by His mercy that I am able to be called a child of God. I would never claim to be as successful at living out Christianity as a member of ISIS is at Islam.

mrpoohead

I have found this all very enlightening. I was brought up with the Bible as a guide – “The Good Samaritan” and other worthy stories. It gives one a code of ethics – in all honesty I struggled with the son of God bit; dying, rising up stuff, miracles and such like. I need proof, equally I am sceptical about aliens and ghosts too – not seen one, don’t believe. I am happy to live by the code of ethics, seems quite fair and rational. I may not approve of abortion but equally I feel it is not my right to impose my thoughts on others and I would wish them to be taken care of properly. You are correct to be a Christian means acceptance of the idea of God, Jesus ascending and being the son of, along with the Holy Trinity. If belief in that concept means you are always right, then the world will self-destruct – I feel the important stuff has been forgotten.
I realise that the Jesus thing is not for me; though the illusion is that it is caring and loving I feel that the forces that use it are merely using it for their own gains – politically both sides would seem to have him on their side. The same goes for Judhaism and Islam. The reality is the books vary very little, but it’s adherents seem to find that if they have it on their side they are right; even when they are ignoring most of the works. Example; gay people – little is said in the Bible, the Old Testament claims it a sin, but page after page is filled with how we are supposed to forgive and take care of those more needy. The latter seems to have been forgotten completely but folk will rant about the former, when they are supposed to be forgiving. Personally gay folk never bothered me, much to pragmatic – meant there were more girls for me. Jihad means internal struggle to do good – it is not a signal to go around killing. ISIS is not representing Islam, they have forgotten it. To believe Jesus died on the cross does not make you christian in thought or if you believe Muhammed was a prophet it does not make you a conscientitous muslim.
I find it all very disappointing – people that meant well in their day have had their thoughts and actions twisted beyond belief to suit the crazies. Jesus seems humble, yet he has been made to be too important – same with Muhammed. They were both trying to inspire social responsibility – I wonder how they would feel if they realised how much they had been ignored, abused instead.
Thankfully to live by a code of ethics does not require a God/Allah/Jesus/Muhammed or anyone else, something that Budhists seem to realise. It is easy to be christian without being a Christian.

Mom2Five

I know that I am a Christian because I know Jesus personally. He lives inside of me. I have seen miracles in my life. I have been given dreams and visions that came true. Not only that but in my personal life I have had peace in times of great tribulation. I have been given the oil of joy for mourning. I believed first but now I see. Yes there have always been people who have tried to twist the will of God to suit their own agenda. But if we base our belief in an infallible God on fallible man where is the sense in that? He is above all that. Satan tries to sift us as wheat as Jesus said he tried to do Peter. He succeeds with some. I hope that you finally go toward the truth for yourself and not allow yourself to be sifted.

As for gay people, gay people do not bother me any more than any other group of people. The only thing I can say is that their lifestyle keeps them separated from God who loves them and wants what is best for them. It is for their own sake that I am against their way of life. I do not wish them any harm or ill. I cannot tell them that I am happy for them or that what they are doing is good, but again for their sake not mine.

Jesus is humble and He does see. As a matter of face when He was on the earth He it pained Him and He said that He longed to gather us all like chicks under His wings. I am sure He still feels the same. The others feel nothing other than the flames of Hell because they are dead.

You should ask yourself, where does your code of ethics come from? What makes your brain capable of coming up with the correct ethics? I recommend Mere Christianity by C. S. Lewis.

Mom2Five

I hope that you have been considering my words and contemplating your eternal salvation that is only available through Jesus Christ the Son of the Living God. I have been thinking about you and praying for you. I have prayed that God would send His people into your path that you might be led towards Him. I can look back now in my life and see where the Lord was leading me towards Him all my life. I can also see where the Devil was there to lead me astray. Don’t let anything get in the way of you getting to Jesus. I will continue to pray for you.

mrpoohead

I have enjoyed browsing ChristianNewsNet. Being a Christian means believing Jesus is the son of God, but Jesus was merely advocating living by the First Testament, with maybe a slightly more liberal zeal. So is belief enough?

Folk on this site seem to “believe” but are using their belief to be raging bigots. I see little difference between them and the KKK or FrontpageNews – if this is Christianity I have no requirement for it. Obviously they belief that all their bigotry will be forgiven because they “believe”.

If this is what being a Christian is, then I think I’ll become a Muslim. Either way the same God will be evaluating you, if you go upstairs. Whether you accept Jesus is his son, Abraham and Muhammed are his prophets the point is moot, it is still God doing the assessment.

You do not need to pray for me, I would encourage you to learn to be more liberal and less bigoted or maybe you’ll be the condemned.

Mom2Five

Jesus is not the one that condemns that is the devils job. God is the judge of the world and the devil is the prosecutor. Thankfully if we are believe in the Lord Jesus Christ and Him only and have turned to follow Him, He is our defense attorney and He never loses. The devil accuses and brings up the past sins in our life but Jesus says I have paid that fine on the cross with my blood and God says case dismissed. I am not sure what you are meaning by saying I am a bigot. I do not judge people based on their race.

mrpoohead

bigot: someone intolerant of other viewpoints – political, sexual, religious and race. Congratulations, you have not mentioned race, but got you on all of the other three. I suspect you’d qualify for the fourth too if I wait long enough.

If Christianity is what you exemplify then I think I’ll run off and join ISIS.

Mom2Five

I am not intolerant of anyone’s viewpoints. I have not called anyone names. I have my own opinion and I am entitled to it same as anyone else. If just disagreeing with someone is being intolerant and a bigot, then sir I am not the only intolerant bigot that is having this conversation. I stick with my point though. I hope that your eyes will be opened and that you will see the truth of Jesus Christ before it is too late.

mrpoohead

I suggest you re-read previous comments. Specifically vis-à-vis Muslims, Clinton and gay folk. BIGOT! I’m off to join ISIS – then I’ll bomb the President, which might of course be Clinton so at least you’ll be happy then.

Mom2Five

Might I point out the obvious? You have said more about Christians than I said about any of the above.

mrpoohead

Hmmmmmmm, as I am technically a Christian and was merely pointing out how un-Christian most of the folk on this site, you included, are – not really in the same ballpark. You have poured hatred on Muslims, Clinton and gays – all I did was point out your bigotry. Generally I find Christians forgiving and accepting; however this supposed Christian site seems to be a portal for bigotry and bile dressed up as being a good Christian. Oxymorons then, is that better suited than bigots?

Mom2Five

Technically a Christian is someone who believes that Jesus Christ is the son of the only true God that He died on the cross to save us from our sins and is one day returning for those of us who have lived for Him, has turned away from their sin to follow Jesus and is in the process of becoming more like Him (spoiler – none of us ever arrive at perfect). You have made it clear, as has Hillary Clinton, that this does not describe you. Christians cannot accept sin as ok, they can and do love the person, but cannot validate the actions. Therefore although I love gay people and Muslims and everyone else, I cannot pretend that they are right with God and headed for eternity anywhere other than hell. I will not ease them there by loving them without truth. I would not walk up to a person on the street and say to them “YOU ARE GOING TO HELL”. That is not loving. If I were ever to say that to someone it would be to someone whom I have earned the right to say by being a part of their life and loving them to that point and I wouldn’t be yelling or mean. I will, however, unhesitatingly tell someone how wonderful Jesus is (because He is) and how he pulled me up out of my sin and made me His own (because He did) and that He can do that same thing in their own life (because He can). He pulled me up out of the miry clay and set my feet upon a solid rock. God has no grandchildren. If someone thinks that they are a Christian because their parents were Christians (or thought they were) or if they live somewhere that the population is predominately Christian, that is not how it works. We must actively chose to accept the gift of eternal life that He is offering. Someone can buy us a gift but unless we take it from them and open it then it doesn’t do us any good. The same is true of salvation. Jesus paid the price and is offering it to us, but unless we take it from Him and open the package it won’t make a difference in this life or the life to come.

mrpoohead

So basically as long as I embrace Jesus as the son of God then I can be obnoxious to everyone else – as you have already demonstrated; Muslim’s, gays, Clinton. This is quite a relief as I am happy to berate the opposing football team and have occasionally been known to suggest that the referee is off dubious parentage. Unfortunately none of my neighbours have wife’s I would like to covert, but fingers crossed for future house sales. I think it rather radical of you to suggest that God has no grandchildren; as most of Jesus’s life has not been written about. Quite likely he was humping and bumping everything in sight when he was younger and may have had a long list of progeny – after all he died on the cross to sort out the sins. I really like your attitude – believe Jesus is the son of God and completely forget what he extolled, essentially social responsibility and forgiveness. I shall make sure that I try to sin as much as possible in the future as it really matters not a jot. Now, more importantly – have you stopped taking the meds?

Mom2Five

Nothing matters more than our eternal salvation. Nothing is more important in life than Jesus and what we decide about Him. If we decide the right thing, that He is who He said He is and we take His path then we will spend an eternity with Him in Paradise. If we decide that He was a sinner like the rest of us and not God, then we will spend an eternity without Him which is Hell. I hope that you make the right decision. I hope that some of my words will come to you at 3:00 am some day and that you will see them for the truth that they are and be saved. I fling religion as far away from me as I can get it. I find religion and its Pharisees abhorrent as did Jesus. What I have found isn’t religion. It is a relationship with the true and Living God of the Universe, Lord of Eternity, God of all Mercy. As for your blasphemous description of your ideas of Christ’s life, He was in all points tested as we are yet without sin. Jesus never sinned. That is how He was able to be our perfect sacrifice and take our place.

mrpoohead

Ha, ha, ha! You do not know what Jesus got up to for most of his life. Personally I hope he was a bit naughty – “to errr is human, to forgive divine”. We are, amazingly, somewhat agreed on organised religion, but what you are extolling is merely another version – heh, this is America package it and sell it. You’re bound to find a few more nut-jobs.

I think at 3am I’ll be too busy humping the new neighbour or, more likely, getting up to let the dogs out as they have woofed to go out for the toilet. I do not need to be saved; I ain’t perfect, but equally i ain’t that bad.

I think hearing people talk to you is either a good time to turn off or visit the medics for some prescription drugs, not the illegal one’s you obviously took before. Here’s hoping you stay out of the asylum or do they allow internet access there?

Mom2Five

God isn’t going to judge you on whether you were good or bad. He will be judging you on whether or not you asked for forgiveness and accepted His son’s sacrifice. We all need to be saved. You hope Jesus was naughty because that allows you to justify your sin to yourself and allows you to push away thoughts of eternity and ease your conscience. “For he hath made him to be sin for us, who knew no sin; that we might be made the righteousness of God in him.” 2 Corinthians 5:21

mrpoohead

I think, in fairness, 2 Corinthians 5:21 is a subject of much discussion – folk in the same denomination cannot agree on what it means. So, I think, best left alone – unless of course you have God on speedial, number please. I do not need Jesus to be naughty for my own sake, more for his own development and discovery. Analogy: one never appreciates what one has until they have been other places, seen other things. Growing up ought not be a race; personally if your daughter were mine I’d have been very relieved if she’d gone for an abortion – getting bogged down with responsibilities too early is no good thing for mother or child.
Having travelled myself somewhat I have discovered there are many ways to “believe” – how do we know which is right and wrong. Much of the Bible is ambiguous, not just 2C5:21. I suspect that heading in the right direction is all that is required, the journey there is personal to each and everyone of us.

Mom2Five

In fairness 2 Corinthians 5:21 is easy to understand and clearly says what other parts of scripture says also. Never heard that the interpretation of that was up for debate but probably because I travel in circles that believes what the Bible says as opposed to trying to find fault with it. Like I said before having a baby was the best thing that ever happened to my daughter. I am glad that I do not have the blood of my innocent grandson on my hands and so is my daughter. She was extremely self centered and rudderless before this baby came into our lives. A lot of 17 year olds are but she was abused as a very young child by her grandfather and basically abandoned by her biological mother (She and I both consider each other mother and daughter despite lack of blood ties as I have been her step mother since she was 2 and raised her from the age of 4 almost exclusively). Her biological mother passed away 4 months after the baby was born due to complications from long term drug abuse and other health problems. The baby softened that blow as well as giving her purpose and growing her up. She is not a silly young adult like so many of her peers. She is an amazing mother and would take extreme offence to anyone suggesting that she should have murdered her child so that she could have continued to be selfish and silly indefinitely.

Jesus created the Universe and everything in it. What is there that He would need to discover and develop? God came here as a man and set the world on fire. No man in history has had anywhere near the impact that Jesus has had. He is God, He is man, He is Creator. The very idea that there is anything left for Him to discover is asinine.

mrpoohead

Again ambiguous – some religions see Jesus as God, some say they are seperate entities. You do not have a problem with 2C5:21 because you have made a decision – are you God? If not then be gracious enough to accept others have different interpretations – I do! Not hard. I do not think that they are trying to find fault with the Bible, there are many versions just as there are christian religions. I do not think one is likely to be more correct than the other, they are travelling in the same direction, just different paths. Ditto Islam.
God has had more impact than any other religion as it is the base of all Abrahamic religions. Christianity was imposed on much of the world by Europeans – historical fact. Hinduism has half the followers of Christianity and mostly in one country – good job they didn’t try to take over the world I guess.
Whether God is Jesus or not I would have thought that to embrace becoming a man he would have to experience being one – how else does he relate/lead?
Good luck to your daughter I am pleased I never had that conundrum to deal with and even more pleased I was a lot older before I got to become a dad (am sure my wife would agree – boys don’t grow up until 30, sometimes not at all) – don’t think God approved or disapproved of abortion. That is something that two sides have managed to abuse.

All you claim to be true is how you have interpreted things, I am merely liberal enough to accept there are more ways to cook an egg than just your way – all are correct, none are wrong. Of course you might be God, but I’d like proof first, please.
I had a religious experience myself yesterday – paddling out in the surf a wave was travelling towards me, when from the middle of it popped out six dolphins who proceeded to race the wave and turn left and then show-boat around the place. Made me think I need a better board. Life is a road to be travelled, lots of roads, lots of routes. You’re still a BIGOT!

Mom2Five

That was not a religious experience. That was a moment of joy. I used to look for those moments as well. I would hear a certain line in a song and get that feeling and try to replay the song to get it again or see it in a certain view of nature that was particularly beautiful. They would come rarely and go quickly leaving a memory to dream about. Where was that illusive feeling when it felt like the veil was parted for a moment and I caught a glimpse of eternity? I spent my life chasing that feeling. Then I found a church where it didn’t seem like the dry and dead religion that I was used to experiencing in church and I found life and Jesus there. Not long after that the love of my life, my fiance, was diagnosed with cancer. We were 21 years old, well I turned 21 that winter during his illness. That is supposed to be a big celebration, turning 21, but I was spending time in hospital waiting rooms and long car rides. I can remember being strong for the first time in my life. His cancer was in his tongue and jaw bone. Surgery removed his entire jaw bone and 90% of his tongue. Just let those numbers sink in for a moment.

Of course he could no longer speak, he had a tracheotomy to breathe through. He would write me notes. “I’ll never be normal again”, he wrote to me. He was my rock before that. He was always the strong one and I was always crying about something, but not that day. I remember thinking “how am I not a puddle of goo on the floor right now?”. His surgery left him disfigured. Swelling was greater on one side of his face and he couldn’t close his mouth since he had no jaw bone (think Roger Ebert, he had the same type of cancer). He was crying noiselessly except for the sound of the grey phlegm that shot out of the trach hole in his neck as he sobbed. I was able to get down in his face and say “Look at me! Do you not know that I would be a mess right now if I didn’t know that everything was going to be alright?” I was able to say that without my voice even shaking. Another trip to visit him in the hospital I noticed during the car ride that I was no longer looking for that feeling. I wasn’t looking out the window anxiously to see that perfect scene of nature that would thrill me. I wasn’t listening intently to the music playing on the radio hoping for that particular line that would touch me. That is when I realized that the feeling was joy. It was joy that I had been searching for, but why was I not searching for it anymore? Shouldn’t I be looking harder than ever right now while in the midst of the greatest trial of my life? Or maybe despair was so great that joy was the last thing on my mind? No, I realized. The reason I was no longer searching for the fleeting moment of joy was because I no longer had to search it out. It was with me all the time now. Even in the darkest of times in the most lonely of places I had joy. Joy unspeakable and full of glory!! That is what Jesus did in my life. That is how I know that He is there with me. There are many many other things that would make this post way too long where Jesus showed me that He was with me and that He was real and living and God. That was the first time though that I as able to articulate it and understand it so clearly.

Ambiguous? No! A bigot? No! I have knowledge of the truth. That is all. Absolute truth that exists whether anyone believes it is true or not. I pray that you will be able to find it as well.

mrpoohead

So Jesus merely substituted Van Halen or Bon Jovi – more than likely Muhammed/God/Lakshmi/Buddha does it for other people elsewhere and none of us knows what is correct or what body of church or branch of Islam is right. Thus, you are a bigot. There are gay affirming churchs and ones that accept abortion as an option – you are a BIGOT!
Conversely, I had no “hole” to fill, I had a “must do list” instead. I was selfish in the extreme and fulfilled myself by ticking boxes off that list. I gave myself a time limit before growing up – I like the idea of a mid-life crisis, but suspect I would not qualify having done everything I wanted to do. So for me getting up and going for a surf does it, as does a run in the morning, cycling to school with the kids, watching the kids grow – don’t need Jesus to fill holes, ain’t got none. Life is there to be lived, if you don’t do you deserve another shot?
Ambiguous – yes! There are hundreds of English language versions of the Bible. Were the translations correct – 2000 years of Chinese Whispers, thus there could be much discussion. The basic concept is social responsibility and acceptance, which is all Jesus condoned. Just believing he was the son of God is not “living” but merely an excuse to be a lousy person.
PS Where I am dolphins are the norm, as is a lot other wonderful stuff. Still, I’m “hole” free.

Mom2Five

Actually my preference was America and James Taylor. Van Halen and Bon Jovi was my middle school days and when in High School 90’s music was terrible beyond comprehension I found solace in 70’s selections. Anyway I guess the story of my fiance was a reason to be called a bigot again.

mrpoohead

You’re a bigot because you are intolerant of anyone unless they have your ideals – reminds me of my Mother.
90’s music – what was wrong with Nirvana and the Red Hot Chilli Peppers – my high school was the Sex Pistols and the Clash. Bad ass! I had America on earlier today, currently Harry Connick Jnr.

Mom2Five

I was a headbanger in my middle school years. I saw Bon Jovi, Skid Row, AC DC, Great White, Trixter, Cheap Trick, L.A. Guns and others in concert during that time. I never got into Nirvana and I did like Red Hot Chili Peppers early 90’s but around ’94 everything new started to get on my nerves. My mother was a hippy and had me and my sister young and our dad was a drunk so she force him out of the picture and became a career woman of the 80’s and she rocked it. We never fought over what radio station to listen to in the car because we all liked 70’s and 80’s music. I discovered a 70’s radio station that I didn’t know existed and heard Sister Golden Hair for the first time in years.That first bit of music before the lyrics start on Sister Golden Hair was definitely one of the things that gave me my moment of joy. I saw them in concert a few years ago minus Dan Peek since he hadn’t been part of the group for a while, my husband took me since he knew I loved them. I still don’t think I am a bigot. I am just convinced of the truth. I have no problem with other people believing whatever they want to believe as long as it doesn’t affect me or my children negatively, which Hillary Clinton becoming President definitely would and militant Muslims taking over or going on a killing spree around me would. I am only concerned about people’s souls and showing them Jesus. What they do with Him is their business. I will pray for their eyes to be opened.

mrpoohead

Well I am an old fart and have moved onto Paradise Radio (internet) mainly because they don’t talk and don’t play ads and the music collection is eclectic, but a lot of 60’s-90’s stuff, odd bit of classical even. My wife says they play too much Genesis, I say they play too much REM – we agree they play too much Jethro Tull.

I owe you an apology; I wasn’t empathic over the fiancee and I hope that is not really me. I find your statements intolerant and belligerent, I feel there are many ways to believe and they are all personal – Islam is no more violent than Christianity, it’s just idiots that claim either as there’s. I have no desire to show folk something different when they already have peace. I quite enjoyed watching the level of devotion that folk have in all religions – it seems to give most peace, it just gets twisted by a few loonies who are obviously not following the words. I think you will find most Muslims are peaceful and merely want a good life for them and their kids. Contrary to what is in the papers Islamic terrorism is the least of our worries – in Europe the EUROPOL (police organisation) consider them to be in the bottom 5%, doubt the US is any different.

Mom2Five

I know this is going to be a big shocker for you, but I have moved on to K-Love which is a Christian station if you didn’t know. I still like my oldies but the Christian music of today is great. You are right, there are many ways to believe and it is personal, they just aren’t all leading to the same place as some think. Too many people don’t have the peace that you are speaking of. You can’t have true peace without Jesus. He is the prince of peace. I accept your apology about my fiance. My Pastor prayed for me to have the peace that passes all understanding when he got sick and I really did have it. I got to see him have an experience with God and give his life to Jesus before he died (when he was well) and that meant so much. Then after his death I had a dream about him. While he was sick he kept writing that he wanted a Biggie Coke from Wendy’s because if you can imaging having your tongue your jaw bone removed, you would no longer have saliva and you couldn’t swallow and so his throat was always dry. In my dream his face was round and perfect again and I put my hands on the sides of his face and I said “show me your tongue” and he opened his mouth and showed me his perfect tongue. His eyes were dancing with joy! I was reminded of a praise song that was popular at the time that said “I’ve been through the desert but now my cup is filled with water”. He is no longer dry and thirsty. He is no longer disfigured. He is no longer sick and he is with Jesus who was in the dream too by the way. He was standing in the background smiling and laughing with pure joy! Speaking of dreams, did you know that record numbers of Muslims are having dreams of Jesus and getting saved?

mrpoohead

Well; thankfully, no K-Love here and I doubt they play Led Zepplin and definitely not the Clash. Amusingly; a father, of one of my elder ones friends, had AC/DC play at his High School dance/prom – after school he became a roadie for a time. The band did three gigs that night, hard work in those days.
I think idiots on both sides make silly claims about conversion – most of it is related to a side in Africa gaining political dominance. Barrack Obama’s grandfather converted no less than three times I believe – Catholic/Islam/Catholic. Generally in less turbulent places it is related to marriage or advancement in some way – a partner less committed to their religion invariably converts to keep the peace, Cat Stevens converted to Islam for love as did Jemima Goldsmith. So no real records being set – although I believe Cat Stevens had a new release last year.
My Mother is/was very opinionated – thankfully, I learnt to take it all with a pinch of salt. Much easier when you realised she wasn’t always right – my youngest is a chip off the old block and hasn’t been wrong yet either. Frighteningly, she corrected my spelling last night, “You don’t spell ‘nincompoop’ like that Daddy” – she was correct, although she also informed me you could spell it D A D D Y.
I think we will have to agree to disagree – I am never going to believe that Jesus is the bee all and end all for everyone and am happy for Muslim’s/Hindu’s/Jew’s to follow their own thing. Trying to convert them isn’t going to solve anything and there’s as much peace in all than any one in particular – if anything I think Budhism has the lead, they are the one’s that never have terrorists, ALL of the rest do.

As for politics I see lttle choice – Clinton/Trump; maybe installing the Kardashians as royalty with no political stand would be best. At least then you can ignore them and let the Speaker of the House get on with the real job. Canada, Australia, New Zealand have the best of it – a Queen who doesn’t live in the country and has no political clout. Feed her the odd dinner and show her the sights and that’s it – if times not so good, you could always sell tickets of to go to the dinner as well.
My dreams tend to be surf related or “naughty”. Ciao’

Mom2Five

I like Cruz for President myself but it looks like the American public will screw things up again as usual. Cute story about your kid.

mrpoohead

Think I’d prefer Caitlyn Jenner over the lot of them. Yes, she is cute and scarily only eight – they have both pointed out to me that brains obviously skip a generation in our family. I gave up letting them win chess when I realised they were winning anyway – now I try and I think they let me occassionally win.

Mom2Five

Nobody would vote for Cait. The left hates him because he is conservative. The right thinks he is too progressive.

mrpoohead

Just a thought, but not really sure why you are worried about Islamic terrorists. For every terrorist death in the US (over the last ten years) there have been over a 1000 “normal” homicides – doubt all terrorist deaths were Islamic. Guns and idiots might be the problem.

Mom2Five

Oh hey! How are you doing? Did you have a nice Easter holiday? Mine was really good. Probably the best ever. I am not worried about Islamic Terrorists. I do not fear them. They do not scare me. I do have a problem with them because the attacks that they commit are not their ultimate goal. Their goal is to make our country the pit of hell that they have made their own homelands into. The want to rape and oppress our women. They want to destroy our religions. They want to fundamentally change our way of life. That is not cool.

mrpoohead

Hmmmmmmmmmm; unlikely. And some of their homelands are beautiful.

Mom2Five

They could be very beautiful I am sure but when the people in power practice sharia law it doesn’t matter what a place looks like.

mrpoohead

You need more of an education – Sharia Law is not all bad, much is common sense stuff like our own.

Equally; only one country operates nothing but, the rest are secular or with a smattering of both disciplines. The US is in the top five of executioners in the world. The Middle-East is not a bunch of heathens, they have schools, they have universities – my GP is from Saudi Arabia, a girl.

Mom2Five

So you are totally ok with throwing Gay people off of buildings to their death then, since the rest of it is not so bad? Oh wait there’s still that little problem of killing women who were raped unless 4 men witnessed it and corroborate her story. . . but that is only if they are Muslim women. It is totally ok to rape women who are not Muslim any time at all.

mrpoohead

Your response is beneath you. Western countries now adopt Sharia Law were both sides agree and were it does not conflict with the law of the land – it is overseen by lawyers educated in both. Usually used to resolve civil matters, neighbour disputes.

What you have cherry-picked is extreme ideology – most likely Saudi Arabia, which is the only nation that has Sharia Law and nothing else, everywhere else has a bit of both or what is left over in the case of countries that were colonies. Unfortunately power and/or money corrupts; think of OJ Simpson.

Obviously what you suggest is abhorrent, but so is Christian Serbian genocide on Muslim Bosnia’s. How can any Christian condone the death penalty? Of which the US is the greatest user in the modern world.

Mom2Five

How can you see to type with all that sand in your eyes where you’ve been burying your head? Exactly the kind of attitude that leaves defenseless women without even a legal recourse.

mrpoohead

You mean like Mrs OJ Simpson and the incest that goes on in US backwaters?

Mom2Five

I am sorry, but what? If you mean that OJ Simpson got acquitted, yes he did but he had the Constitutional right to be defended in a court of law in front of a jury of his peers and that is what he got. The fact that the police and prosecutors screwed up the case does not take away from that. He ended up in prison and broke after all so justice was served. As for the incest you speak of, incest goes on everywhere around the globe. It is universally abhorred by polite society and is illegal in the United States. Under sharia law women don’t have any rights. It keeps women captive to violent husbands as his property. Sharia law has absolutely no place in the US as it is fundamentally contrary to our Constitution.

mrpoohead

Well in OJ’s case the law is an ass, though he subsequently lost the civil case making him culpable.

Warren Jeffs, Fundamentalist Church of Jesus and the Latter Day Saints, seems like a nice fella.

Sharia Law in its entirety belongs nowhere, same as Biblical Law. Elements of both are acceptable and in use, even in the US. Only one country uses Sharia Law only, most use elements of it with bits of modern.

Yes, out in the boondocks you still have folk hanging on to old ways, no matter the country – education will help, but it is not a quick process. Polygamy is illegal in the US, but Warren Jeffs don’t care.

Mom2Five

The US Constitution is based on Biblical Law. At its core is that God created men as equals and therefore they should be free. Its too bad that evil men still hold people as slaves here today but at least it is illegal.

And the Latter Day Saints church is actually a cult.

Quite frankly I think that some of the old ways should be held onto. Although, I think that you are referring to incest so I will agree with you that it needs to die but I will disagree that it exists mainly in the boondocks. Detroit Michigan has a much higher rate of incest than say the entire state of West Virginia which is traditional boondockery.

mrpoohead

Well I kinda included Detroit in the boondocks since the demise of the car industry. However, Detroit Metro region’s population is three times that of WV – am just making a point, not saying you are wrong.

The Latter Day Saints is an officially recognized church, Jeffs “Fundamentalist” version however is not – it is a cult, just like ISIS.

Thankfully American Law is based on the English Common Law and not Biblical – am sure there are cross-overs and yep the Bible is a wonderful moral guidance; we do not however stone people anymore. Equally we have moved on from the death penalty for adultery, bestiality, working on the Sabbath, Witchcraft (there goes my wife), disobeying a parent or not being a virgin on their wedding night (girls only – sexist or what). So I trust you will be offering up your daughter soon.

America is the only Western country in the world to still use the death penalty. Most Third World countries have moved on from it too, Cuba included.

Mom2Five

You are 40% more likely to be a victim of incest in Detroit Michigan than you are in the entire state of West Virginia. I would be interested to see the figures on how it compares to not just West Virginia but the entire Appalachian Region. I would risk a guess that it is still around 40%. Maybe slightly less

To be fair the bible moved on from stoning people once Jesus came. In other words the stoning was never a part of Christianity. That was Judaism.

As for the Constitution, Thomas Jefferson who authored the Constitution, was so convinced that the law of the bible should be a basis for law that he passed it out to his congress when he was President to be used when making new law. Granted he cut out the parts of the bible that are supernatural in nature when he did so but that doesn’t negate that he used the biblical law.

As for the death penalty, wait, why are we talking about the death penalty?

mrpoohead

I was criticizing the use of statistics. Example; the US is top three medals at the Olympics – per capita they are down in the forties; per capita Australia is top three most Olympics and never out of the top ten. Who’s more successful?
The US has the most Nobel prizes – works out to be one per million people; Germany has one for every half a million, whilst Norway has one for every 300,000. Impressive – many US claimed awards are for foreign academics whilst working there, they’re home-grown in Germany and Norway.
Thus if there were 100 incest cases in WV, that would mean 140 in Detroit, but per capita that would put Detroit down to 53. Without the whole picture, I can even make my football team seem good. They aren’t.
Whatever the whole truth – it’s a sorry fact.

So you’re happy to write off the bits you don’t like in the Old Testament, but cling to Leviticus 18:22 – seems a little unfair. Agreed, Jesus was more liberal and was not faced with the gay dilemma – if he turns up next Friday I surmise he will tell folk to leave them alone, they’ve been ridiculed enough. Ditto abortion, also mostly a OT thing and lose at that.

“Death Penalty”, because that was what waited for you for all those sins – harsh for the majority.

Wikipedia; American Law; “The United States and most Commonwealth countries are heirs to the common law legal tradition of English law.” Sorry, fact.

Mom2Five

Firstly, you seem to forget the England was also a Christian Nation and would have made laws based on that mindset as well. I thought that was slick how you totally bypassed what I said about Thomas Jefferson. I guess if you don’t want to acknowledge something you can pretend its not there and skirt the issue completely.

I see now what you mean about the Death Penalty, I thought it was coming completely out of left field so I was confused why you mentioned it. My explanation that those things are not “Christian” stands. Also you mention Leviticus 18:22, sins have always been sins and they will not and have not changed. What has changed is the punishment. We do not have to have the punishment of death for our sins any longer because that is what Jesus did on the cross. He took all sin, yours and mine, all peoples from the beginning of time until the end, on himself. He who knew no sin BECAME sin in order to pay the price of death for us. That is why stoning someone or any other form of the death penalty is not required in Christianity. The price was paid, the debt forgiven. All that remains is for us to accept that fact into our lives and apply it. Did some Christian groups in the past get this wrong? Yes they most certainly did. Humans are humans and they lose their way. They forgot that Jesus paid the price, they became “religious” as opposed to following Jesus. I am specifically thinking of the Salem Witch Trials as I type this. Yes still today people are executed for heinous crimes and it is for the protection of the population. I am not a fan of it. To me it seems that you can never be sure enough that you have the right person. Also they no longer have a chance to change their minds and see their sin as sin and repent and turn to Jesus being saved if you kill them. So no, I don’t approve of the death penalty.

mrpoohead

English Common Law – not based on Bible. It will have given moral code, but the difference between it giving the moral code and Sharia is negligible. Jefferson is irrelevant – English Common Law.

Biblical law would mean we condemn disobeying parents, blasphemy, Adultery and sex before marriage. We’ve moved on – ditto Leviticus. Don’t blame the Jews, Jesus was one and never started a new religion – he merely advocated the First Testament. Christianity was created much later, by folk following his lead – ditto Protestantism, Mormons.

Mom2Five

Jesus COMPLETED Judaism. He fulfilled the law when He died on the cross in our place. We are called Christians because we follow Christ. Simple. And as for Christianity being created much later, the new testament is made up of the disciples accounts of Jesus and what they did after his resurrection and Paul’s letters to the churches. They were all Jesus’s contemporaries. Not sure how much later you think it was.

mrpoohead

Christianity did not break from Judaism until the 2nd Century – he was dead by then. It initially existed as a sect of Judaism. Essentially the disciples writings were not in a book – diaries. the first Bible was a long way off.

Britlurker

Christianity does not come from Judaism. Are you a kike?

mrpoohead

Historian actually – and I am correct. Try reading – opens up a whole new world.

Mom2Five

Actually Jesus was alive by then and had been for quite a while seeing as how He was only dead for 3 days. He is alive! That is the good news! Although the exact year of Jesus’ birth is up for debate it is generally believed that he was crucified somewhere between A.D. 33 and 36. In the book of Acts the disciples were called Christians 3 times and specifically says that the saints were first called Christians at Antioch and that was in 47 A.D. That is only 11-14 years later. By 59 A.D. the term was so widely used that King Agrippa in Caesarea told the apostle Paul that he had almost persuaded him to become a Christian. The followers of Jesus embraced this name although it was originally intended to be derogatory.

Just because the disciples wrote down their accounts and they weren’t all put together in a single source doesn’t mean that Christianity wasn’t a thing. The disciples went from town to town and shared what they eventually wrote in their account. It could have been the way that History has always been was passed down from generation to generation (which has been proven to be accurate), the disciples shared with others who memorized it as well and continued to share once the disciples had moved on to another area. However based on the fact that Paul wrote letters (the epistles) to the different churches where he had ministered, I think it is highly likely that these accounts were immediately written down and shared. What has survived to today and has been scientifically dated to the second century doesn’t mean that earlier copies hadn’t just been used to the point of being destroyed.

mrpoohead

Well he wasn’t physically walking around then – I hope. Am pleased you agree with me about it being a Jewish sect until it broke away. Remember all Jesus was really doing was endorsing God’s word, how it was achieved gave us a new religion and today given us a variety of churches and ways. Example: the Church of the Holy Sepulchre has four different denominations with their own chapels. They take it in turn to do services. And of course walking through a town will give you a variety of choices.

Mom2Five

In some ways I think it is a shame that we can’t all be one church body but in other ways I am thankful that we aren’t. People have distinct personalities and what will draw one person will repel another. So I guess it is good that we can all find a church that speaks to us as long as what they teach matches up to what the New Testament says. Personally I prefer Pentecostal (specifically Assemblies of God) denominations. There is a lot of freedom there to worship God and not have people act like you are insane because you clap your hands or lift them up. They can keep their dry churches where everything is straight laced and formal. Give me the Holy Spirit any day. If you find a church where you can dance before the Lord you have found a priceless treasure as far as I am concerned. And don’t anybody be bringing me any of that legalism crap where you can’t wear shorts or cut your hair or go to the movies. To me if God has a problem with anything I am doing He will let me know either by speaking to my heart or showing it to me in His word and he doesn’t need any little toadies going around letting everyone know what is wrong in their life. We are all at different levels in God and He is working on us and none of us ever arrive to the place where we can’t be worked on anymore. My first Pastor I had when I got saved said that the Sunday he first went to church after getting saved he wore shorts and a tank top and had a green mowhawk and he went flopping loudly in his flip flops down the aisle to the second pew because he was late. He said eventually God laid it on his heart to dress differently but thankfully no one admonished him rudely and squelched his first attempts to become churched. My oldest daughter where she was abused by her birth mothers family I handled her with kid gloves as far as how she dressed to church. Sometimes you could have eyed her clothes a little critically for church but no one ever did. I didn’t want to scare her off from church. Although there was one time where what she tried to wear needed tugged up at the top and down at the skirt and I said no, but she listened to me because I had not beat her over the head with it before that. You can protect your kids from the world too much to where they don’t know how to handle it when they get off on their own and then they never come home because they are worried you disapprove of them. I want to be a jolly grey haired old lady crocheting/knitting in a rocking chair with children and grandchildren who come to me for advise and share their lives with me. So while I won’t tolerate complete nonsense I won’t be too hard to please either and I will always teach them about the Lord.

mrpoohead

Sunday, church or surfing. Sorry, no choice. The church generally ticks me off – pompous and hypocritical. don’t need a place of worship to be a Christian/Jew/Muslim.

Mom2Five

That stuff ticks me off too. Not all churches are that way. That is what I was trying to get at by saying I am kind of glad that there are separations because otherwise that type of “christian” would come to my church and I would have to deal with them. You might not need a place of worship but if you can find a church where the Holy Spirit is given free reign and the Pastor protects the congregation from the wolves in sheeps clothing that try to come in, then you have found a priceless treasure. It would make the best day of surfing seem commonplace. Psalm 84:10 “A single day in your courts is better than a thousand anywhere else! I would rather be a gatekeeper in the house of my God than live the good life in the homes of the wicked.” Oh and I have been slightly obsessed about watching the videos where Jews tell how they met Jesus at a website called I met messiah. As it kind of goes along with what we had been discussing I thought I would share. I highly recommend.

mrpoohead

Plenty of churches have proved themselves less than exemplary. I’ll stick to surfing thanks. Did watch the “Life of Brian” this last weekend, that’ll be enough.

Mom2Five

Oh dear! Haven’t seen that. I normally like their stuff but I think that one would be too much for me considering the content. I hate to tell you but really its not going to cut it.

mrpoohead

Never really got Monty Python – humour for the retarded. I thought it was stupid and actually I fell asleep.

Mom2Five

That’s probably for the best. 😀

Gary Whiteman

You can’t join ISIS, they only recruit men.

mrpoohead

Technically incorrect – female suicide bombers, never heard of them?

I thought I was the sad old loser – following me is surely a sign of devotion with nothing better to do. Errrrrr; get a job? Kissey, kissey!

mrpoohead

Technically incorrect – there have been female bombers, duh! So incorrect, sad and lonely for following me, can’t imagine why anyone would? Plus you like to call folk “fried liver” and you’re a bit of a sissy!

MamaBear

I cannot see anyone who advocates for the murder of unborn children as being an advocate for children and families.
And I suspect Chelsea is indeed lying about being taught about abortion in a Southern Baptist Sunday school at age 6. Abortion is not mentioned in the curriculum until the teens and adults, and even then it is very rare. Maybe she heard a sermon on it, but my experience is most 6 year olds are busy drawing on the bulletin rather than listening to the sermon. Or maybe she heard her parents complain because it was brought up in their Sunday School class. Or maybe she thought Pharaoh was aborting the Hebrew babies and Moses’ mother hiding him in a basket on the Nile and Pharaoh’s daughter adopting him were pro-life advocates.
If Chelsea knew about abortion at age 6, I’m pretty sure it ha to do with her parents, not the Baptist church. All the Clintons seem very good at “misremembering.”

Gary Whiteman

She’s about as Christian as a statue of Stalin.

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