A complaint that I am more likely to have is where you take the work to a dealer because it requires a level of skill above a mere DIY monkey like myself.So you take it to the expert who them attacks it like a teenager and breaks it, then charges you top rates for the priveledge!!

If it comes back in a worse state and you are still charged then I can see that you might be upset. But this was clearly not the case for the OP.

But your example prompts another question - should they charge for just looking at something. For instance, if my sus fork stopped working and the shop said that they'd have to spend an hour stripping it down to see what was wrong with it before giving me a quote for a new part do you think that they would be justified for charging for the time spent stripping it, especially if I then decided not to lash out on the new part and just took the bits of my fork home? It's meant that their mechanic has been away from other money earning work for an hour, but I haven't gotten my fork fixed.

Si wrote:But your example prompts another question - should they charge for just looking at something. For instance, if my sus fork stopped working and the shop said that they'd have to spend an hour stripping it down to see what was wrong with it before giving me a quote for a new part do you think that they would be justified for charging for the time spent stripping it, especially if I then decided not to lash out on the new part and just took the bits of my fork home? It's meant that their mechanic has been away from other money earning work for an hour, but I haven't gotten my fork fixed.

I think the problem with that nowadays is that they're more likely to think you're going to get them to do the hard work on troubleshooting only to go home without paying them for the part and getting it off t'interweb and fitting it yourself.

So some places will charge you a minimum service charge, usually then integrated (and maybe discounted) into the cost of the part if/when it's replaced.

EDIT - Although as with both my washing machine and my new bike recently - I'm finding the internet to be a useful source of information anyway when it comes to troubleshooting or solving problems and helping me to do it myself.

Si wrote:- should they charge for just looking at something. For instance, if my sus fork stopped working and the shop said that they'd have to spend an hour stripping it down to see what was wrong with it before giving me a quote for a new part do you think that they would be justified for charging for the time spent stripping it, especially if I then decided not to lash out on the new part and just took the bits of my fork home? It's meant that their mechanic has been away from other money earning work for an hour, but I haven't gotten my fork fixed.

This just points to the obvious mistake that caused all this. The sensible thing to do is to agree terms - not necessarily a price - before the job starts. Asking somebody to do work without first checking how they will charge for doing that work is the route to disagreement at best, being ripped off at worst.

thirdcrank wrote:Asking somebody to do work without first checking how they will charge for doing that work is the route to disagreement at best, being ripped off at worst.

there are some trades/professions where this isn't possible.when i extended my house, the planning authority made it a condition of permission that an archaeologist must be present. now, luckily, they found nothing was found, so it was just £250+vat for a 10 minute visit and a letter saying that nothing was found. had there been some iron age skeletons or a roman well, the fees would have been a lot higher.

the same goes for roofing. if you've got a leak, then without removing the tiles & felt, there's no knowing how bad it is.....if the timbers have rotted, then the bill could be an eyewatering amount. had it just been one rip in the felt (or a stolen bit of lead) then it may be no more than a days work.

The fact that the OP hasn't replied to any of the comments made suggests (s)he is a wind-up merchant. There was a similar complaint made on this very forum re my LBS. Some guy had bought a canal rust junker and baulked at the cost of repairs, then bad mouthed my LBS on bike forums. The customer isn't always right.

thirdcrank wrote:Asking somebody to do work without first checking how they will charge for doing that work is the route to disagreement at best, being ripped off at worst.

there are some trades/professions where this isn't possible.

The quotes within quotes have got a bit mixed up but I did say that while it might not be possible to agree a price, there should be an agreement over terms. There must be any number of circumstances where the size of the task is not obvious from the outset - that's why a it's often necessary to use experts. OTOH, they must know the basis on which they charge for their work, be it % commission, by the hour or whatever. I'd expect that the greater the expert's expertise, the better guide they could give to the different possible outcomes. If they cannot give you a decent guide to cost, how can they have any idea you will be able to pay?

Somebody has mentioned dentists and AFAIK their professional body (or somebody else?) requires that they give a written treatment plan including the cost and potential extra costs if additional work is needed. (On a personal note, having broken two crowns in quick succession and finding it impossible to cope in comfort with a denture, I decided that all I wanted for Christmas etc and shelled out for two implants. These are titanium screws into your gums - or rather my gums in this case - surmounted with a pair of porcelain tushies. The detailed estimate + treatment plan ran to three pages. Worth every penny.)

hubgearfreak wrote:when i extended my house, the planning authority made it a condition of permission that an archaeologist must be present. now, luckily, they found nothing was found, so it was just £250+vat for a 10 minute visit and a letter saying that nothing was found. had there been some iron age skeletons or a roman well, the fees would have been a lot higher.

Tsk, you should have asked, I'd have done it for considerably less - and if there'd have been anything found I might even have made a profit for you if you weren't in a mad hurry to get it done.

BTW, if they did it properly it's not just the 10min visit, the DBS comes first and the recording comes after (even if the recording is just to say that nothing was found).

i am not a trader, i am not ron spencer, i am not a wind up merchant! i was just giving a point of view on what actually happened in the bike shop! some of the reaction on single track world and bike radar has bordered on pure hatred and hysteria! i am very pleased that the majority of comments on ctc have been very calm measured and intelligent to say the least! and i would like to thank you all pesonally for your contribution whether you agreed with my point of view or not! long live the ctc forum, a different class of opinions compared to the other two sites! kind regards michael!

I think if i had gone into the shop in a similar position to yourself, I would have been hacked of at paying the fiver for apparently so little. In fact i have been frequently in the past. However as you realise all the overheads etc of running a business, you see someone has to pay for it.I had a look at the other forum and it did seem as if it is was filled with shopowners with a vengence!

Out of interest, has the views of the people on this forum made you more accepting (even grudgingly ) of the money paid. Possibly with a resolution not to take things like that to a dealer again?

cody1 wrote:i am not a trader, i am not ron spencer, i am not a wind up merchant! i was just giving a point of view on what actually happened in the bike shop! some of the reaction on single track world and bike radar has bordered on pure hatred and hysteria! i am very pleased that the majority of comments on ctc have been very calm measured and intelligent to say the least! and i would like to thank you all pesonally for your contribution whether you agreed with my point of view or not! long live the ctc forum, a different class of opinions compared to the other two sites! kind regards michael!

Cody1, I took a look at those forums and saw all the bitching and abuse (I don't understand why internet forums bring that out in people). If I drew the wrong conclusion in my earlier post I apologise. I'm glad you came back to put me straight I hope that you stay and continue to enjoy the 'different class'.

Colin63 wrote:Cody1, I took a look at those forums and saw all the bitching and abuse (I don't understand why internet forums bring that out in people). If I drew the wrong conclusion in my earlier post I apologise. I'm glad you came back to put me straight I hope that you stay and continue to enjoy the 'different class'.

Internet forums are a bit like cars people are faceless so people who are of that persuasion think they can be rude and aggressive. fortunately as cody1 pointed out we are quite easy going here.

A while back on another forum not cycling. What started out as a disscussion over simple physics a subject which I do have some authority to speak on. End up with some person hounding me. writing stories suggesting I should be sent IRAQ and hoped that I didn't come back. This turned into a campaign when I posted on anything. I would recieve hate mail via email. It was only a stroke of luck that the said person had something to sell and sent a letter to another message board of which I was one of the co owners asking if we would pst an advert for him. I rang the number ask to come and see the motorcycle took his address and sent him a letter warning him that further harassment in any form would lead to me reporting him to the police and taking legal action.

NUKe wrote:Internet forums are a bit like cars people are faceless so people who are of that persuasion think they can be rude and aggressive. fortunately as cody1 pointed out we are quite easy going here.

I always find it really interesting when you meet people you've only ever conversed with on forums via the written word - the mental picture you build up about people can sometimes be so very different to the person you meet in the flesh.

I used to go diving alot with members of a diving forum, and organise the odd trip where 10-12 of us would have a weekend on a boat somewhere, and it was always fun to meet those people you had a pre-concieved impression of. Including those who seemed rather 'abrasive' on the board, who in reality used to be really nice people alot of the time - it was just that the way they came across on the board was particularly aggressive because they weren't very 'flowery' with their language and just came across as blunt.

And even more amusingly, because you only know someone from their nickname and avatar (which isn't usually them) - sometimes the mental picture you have would be of a bloke and you end up being faced with a lady instead.

One of my best friends who I met through the diving forum originally thought I was black, and it was a surprise to him on the first trip we did to be faced with an unexpected 6ft3 pasty white bloke!