america's punditry

Dumb dumb dumb, dumb dumb dumb, dumb, dumb, dumb, dumb dumb dumb dumb dumb, dumb dumb dumb dumb. That is one “dumb” for each paragraph of Jonah Goldberg’s Los Angeles Timescolumn today. For the record, we did not expect it to be “good,” in the traditional sense — we didn’t expect to read it at all! But 18 paragraphs of unmitigated “dumb” has a strangely magnetic appeal during this lazy news season. So let’s check out Jonah’s column, in which he argues that Obama’s plan to offer educational aid as a reward for national service is somehow both (a) welfare and (b) slavery. Europe, MTV, “the JFK cult,” and Rolling Stone magazine also play bit parts in Jonah’s remarkable paean to the God of Shit.

The metaphorical “link” was obvious to anyone with half a brain, of course, but only Jonah has the courage to voice it:

There’s a weird irony at work when Sen. Barack Obama, the black presidential candidate who will allegedly scrub the stain of racism from the nation, vows to run afoul of the constitutional amendment that abolished slavery.

For those who don’t remember, the 13th Amendment says: “Neither slavery nor involuntary servitude, except as a punishment for crime … shall exist within the United States.”

I guess in Obama’s mind it must be a crime to be born or to go to college.

In his speech on national service Wednesday at the University of Colorado, Obama promised that as president he would “set a goal for all American middle and high school students to perform 50 hours of service a year, and for all college students to perform 100 hours of service a year.”

He would see that these goals are met by, among other things, attaching strings to federal education dollars. If you don’t make the kids report for duty, he’s essentially telling schools and college kids, you’ll lose money you can’t afford to lose. In short, he’ll make service compulsory by merely compelling schools to make it compulsory.

He adds, many dumb paragraphs later, the following: “No, national service isn’t slavery. But it contributes to a slave mentality, at odds with American tradition.” Since when is the “slave mentality” at odds with the American tradition, past or present?

Scanning ahead, we learn about the hypocrisy of the “hipster crowd,” the two most common trademarks of which are MTV and Rolling Stone, known furnaces of the radical leftist slave mentality:

Perhaps thanks to the JFK cult, which sees the refrain “Ask not what your country can do for you …” as an all-purpose writ for social meddling, even the idealistic hipster crowd is on board. Devotees of Rolling Stone and MTV, who normally preen like cats in a pool of sunshine over their alleged libertarianism when the issue is sex, drugs and rock ‘n’ roll, see nothing wrong, and everything right, with involuntary servitude — as long as we just call it “voluntary.”

These, of course, are the same Unpatriotic bohemian miscreants who Hate America, a knowledgeable conservative such as Jonah Goldberg might argue. What’s the term he fancies? Liberal Fascism? Yes, these are the Liberal MTV Fascists, the Too-Cool Cult of Carson Daly. And a government program that rewards national service with education would not, at all, offer disenchanted young people a greater, more profound identity as Americans — a start, at least. It would make them slaves, black ones.

Jim Newell is Wonkette's beloved Capitol Hill Typing Demon. He joined Wonkette.com in 2007, left for some other dumb job in 2010, and proudly returned in 2012 as our "Senior Editor at Large." He lives in Washington and also writes for things such as The Guardian, the Manchester paper of liberals.

Fucking retard. I cannot believe I read that. We should institute slavery for people named “Jonah Goldberg.”

OH AND YOUR BOOK WAS FUCKING RETARDED YOU HACK.

EnBuenOra

This all started when Mommy Lucianne Goldberg told little Jo’berg to clean up his room. He hated her for it, because he wanted to keep playing. Years later he would learn that he had just at that moment learned what life was like in a Soviet Gulag work camp, where he was made to do something other than what he wanted to do at that moment.

shortsshortsshorts

AND he thinks that everyone is a fascist. Not just liberals, but EVERYONE. This is because he is crazy. Like a loon, but more so.

GlennBecksTaint

“I had sex with Jonah and his Menorah.”

-Glenn Beck

queeraselvis v 2.0

One of the LAT commenters referred to him as “Doughy Pantload.” No further questions.

Lolo

Sounds more like a manifesto written from a cabin in the woods than a LA Times column…

ManchuCandidate

Fudgey Goldberg the Whale is correct because volunteer servitude in peacetime is the 15th level of hell while stop loss in a fucked up pointless war is fun fun fun.

Uncle Al

Cut him some slack. He’s a grotesque fat fuck who never got laid. That would make anyone cranky to the point of incoherence.

obfuscator

I’m very amused that Mr. Goldberg’s image of “hipsters” includes MTV viewers and the readers of Rolling Stone.

The definition of “hipster” must have changed to mean “15 year old semi-literates and 45 year old ponytails who want to be Nickelback-literate when hitting on 24 year olds”.

Inadequate Blackmail

Politics aside, Rolling Stone strikes me as a pretty conservative institution at this point, what with being bankrolled by ads for cigarettes, booze and penile enlargement. And MTV? Do the kids still watch that? I figured it had been completely rendered obsolete by Illegal Downloading, Internet Porn and Wonkette.

NoWireHangers

Republican minorities/log cabins/jews are the worst. Examples: Malkin, Condie, this guy, Mary Cheney. It’s like they have to go to the extremes of disgusting conservatism so that they can prove that they’re truly, madly, and deeply Republican. It’s because they know that their own party hates them so they up the ante. So sad. So very sad.

Tawmn

Idiocy that only LA-based conservative claptrap can generate. These guys love the smell of their own fumes so much that they have custom exhausts made to streamline their own flatulence.

NotUrEvryDayWEzl

[re=31431]queeraselvis v 2.0[/re]: Does he rise when baked?

MoodProcessor

I haven’t been to Wonkette all day, and this is the first thing I see? Makes me want to break something. Now I feel all liberal fascisty.

Jonah has a right to be worried. After doing 50 hours of community service the average highschooler will have a resume more impressive then his own.

4tehlulz

Jonah Decoded: The nigra wants to makes us all slaves.

AnnieGetYourFun

I agree that the way he says stuff is nearly unbearable, but I’m wondering if he might be right about this one? Please don’t call me Tony the Tiger for saying so. It’s idiotic to call volunteer work anything akin to slavery, but I don’t see the possibility of making volunteering manadatory as having any long-lasting positive effects. Most kids will just shoulder the responsibility and hate every minute of it, or find ways to get out of it.

Q2

If it’s dumb then I’m not reading it. Besides, I have people…people who read that stuff for me and if it’s important, they’ll tell me what to think. OH SHIT! I JUS’ GAVE MAH ‘DENTITY AWAY!

BigLar

“Devotees of Rolling Stone and MTV…” Does ANYONE read “Rolling Stone” or watch MTV anymore? I think the last time I did was sometime in the 80’s, where, yes, my “issue is sex, drugs and rock ‘n’ roll.” Or, was, rather. And, as much as I liked MTV (even working with them in Daytona Beach for their Spring Breaks in the 80’s), I never followed the political advice of “Downtown” Julie Brown (no matter how good a pool player she was), Ken Ober (ass), Nina Blackwood, Mark Goodman, Alan Hunter, J.J. Jackson, or Martha Quinn (really, really cute). I scare myself that I remember that many “VJ’s”. I am off for a drink.

AxmxZ

He’s just ventilating his nightly fantasy of being Barry’s slave in a socially acceptable way.

Doglessliberal

When did being fair and presenting facts and facets of an issue become giving any ranting idiot a platform? Sometimes, people are wrong. Sometimes, there are NOT two sides to an issue that deserve equal time. If the “fairness” standard the MSM seems to apply now had been around during WWII, Hitler would be getting a page a week for “his side of the story” in the NY Times. No. Just no. I am tired of the ranting morons being treated like learned sages and being given the imprimatur of the MSM.

(she says, ranting and maybe moronically)

queeraselvis v 2.0

[re=31442]NotUrEvryDayWEzl[/re]: Knowing Jonah, he probably rises after being kneaded for 5 minutes and then punched down.

Q2

And what are you doin’ reportin’ on dumb stuff Jim? Are we making any fuckin’ progess on removafication of Slim Slack Shank?

KevoTron

I think I suffered a stroke after reading that. All of a sudden I’m like that guy in “The Diving Bell and Butterfly.” In fact, I’m snarking using only my eyelid right now.

Doglessliberal

[re=31452]BigLar[/re]: You must be my age. MTV stopped being cool and cutting edge about 20 years ago.

SayItWithWookies

This is particularly brilliant:

“Does that mean the government should fund churches? That’s what they do in Europe and — surprise! — most pews sit empty.”

I’m going to skip the pure factual stupidity of this and move right on to the idea that Goldberg is now equating attending church with slavery. It kinda makes me feel a little bit churchy, even.

RaptorAvatar

Isn’t cornerning people with financial imperatives was what conservatives called “voluntary” with a straight face?

I am sure that at least 80% of the MTV-watching morans couldn’t describe what ‘libertarianism’ means, and at least half would respond with “I ain’t no librarian!”

I am currently paying $922 for a 3-semester hour course at my crappy in-state university and tuition has increased over 20% in 4 years time. At that rate I won’t be able to afford to send my yet-to-be-born kids to college. Besides, we already have a form of slavery in return for education dollars called the US Army and kids certainly don’t feel forced to volunteer for that.

Inadequate Blackmail

[re=31449]AnnieGetYourFun[/re]: Who cares what the kids think? They’re getting money out of the deal, right? So think of the benefit to the communities these kids work in: We’ll see the first soup kitchens with beer bongs. God Bless Us.

AnnieGetYourFun

[re=31454]Doglessliberal[/re]: I was just talking about that the other day with a friend. We were discussing how weird it is that certain issues seem to have unnecessary “balance”, where the guy who admitted to committing the crime gets to pussyfoot around the entire issue for half of the air time. Like pretty much anytime the current administration pisses on the Constitution. The story is the fact that the administration is breaking the law, and instead, 50% of the story is a mealy-mouthed defense or diversion tactic from one of their weasels.

jagorev

If Jonah Goldberg had more of a capacity to reflect on his own words, he would make the connection between his description of “voluntary incentive-based servce” as slavery and the Marxian argument that capitalism makes wage-slaves of us all. Of course, if he had said capacity, he would have to kill himself.

madirishman

Hmmm…requiring college students to work 100 hours of community service before a bank will lend them thousands of dollars in government-subsidized loans to goof off for four years at the college of their choice. Goldberg calls that slavery? I call it capitalism, as in “there ain’t no such thing as a free lunch”.

But then again, people like Goldberg think college should be restricted to those scions of “good families of correct breeding” who think “community service” is a check for $10,000 at a DAR luncheon. So get lost, you huddled masses!

shortsshortsshorts

Should read:
Tis iz teh realz prob wid teh nachonal serves maniacally: It fixin what broked. Noes! national slavery! But it contributing to a slave! It at odds with American Internetz tradition. It assuming tat work not done for government really for “common goodz.”

JSDC007

Anything that will force panty pudding Jonah Goldberg to slave away in the hot sun for 50 hours is good by me.

AnnieGetYourFun

[re=31468]Inadequate Blackmail[/re]: Just strikes me as something that will be overturned in a few years, that’s all. I could give a rat’s ass about what kids think or want, but there’s also the infrastructure to consider – you have to set up safe and legal ways for kids to volunteer with proper supervision. None of the issues that Jonah brought up are relevant, but the underlying idea, however noble, strikes me as doomed for failure.

ALIVE!

[re=31449]AnnieGetYourFun[/re]: Oh, without a doubt. Requiring community service for school kids is probably only 0.000001% more effective than requiring it for DUIs and misdemeanors – maybe less. But of course that wasn’t Jonah’s point.

Q2

Jonah? What kinda Jew names his progeny Jonah? I’m obviously not up to par on my Jewology, but I though God punished Jews if they didn’t name their kids Arvad, Joziah, or Jimmy? Obviously Jonah’s father was A VERY BAD JEW and has been banished to the wander the cultural desert of Miami Beach for 40-years and now Bad Jew Jr. is all bitter. I dunno! I don’t care! I WANT MY MTV!!!

m_supercomputer

Ahh, libertarians…those special souls for whom the beginning and end of all principle is “but I don’t wanna, and you can’t make me! I’M TELLING.”

The Goldberg: Indeed, there’s ample evidence that countries with intrusive and expensive welfare states stifle their citizens’ spirit of charity and volunteerism precisely because people conclude that every problem should be solved by government.

…the right is really fucking bitter that every indicator of quality of life, strength of the economy and overall health of a country show that the European way works better, aren’t they? But if we provided basic social services from mandatory tax money, that would take away the wealthy people’s ability to feel generous for giving away .05% of their huge incomes, which is clearly the most important consideration here.

AfghanVet

This is only the beginning of the psychosis we can expect to see displayed in a myriad of ways as it becomes clear that their attempt to turn this country into a religious cult that worships the “white god” and money has come crashing down around them.

Swift Boat – That shits for pussies. What will come out both before the election and after Hopey wins will be as ugly as anything this country has ever seen.

I challenge you to listen to FM 105 and the nuts they have on in the afternoons to get a taste of the absolute fear they have of not only Dems taking over, but a black liberal with the charm of JFK to boot.

AnnieGetYourFun

[re=31472]shortsshortsshorts[/re]: Thank you for translating!

Advocatus_Diaboli

I lost no less than 15 IQ points after reading that. At this rate, if I read Goldberg religiously, I’ll be as dumb as him in 50 to 75 years.

confusionanddelay&lt

His douchebag overfloweth.

Keram2

Hipsters don’t vote! They’re too busy ogling that chick in the slim slack Ad on the left. Or that girl on that huge Ad with the butt near the 2nd Ave. F train. New Yorkers, you know what I’m talking about.

WadISay

In Goldberg’s defense, in scoring this dive on the 1-6 crazy scale, we must note some signs of moderation. He did not say that national service was like being marched into Dachau by jack-booted storm troopers, and he did not mention the Red Guards. [Holds up card with the number 4 on it.]

freakishlystrong

What sired this wad? How does anyone have a worldview like that? And then get published?

ForeignSickSpecialist

Dost thou protest the selective service requirement to receive federal aid, Jonah? Write an article about Conservative Communism and I’m with you!

buythewholecow

Hmm I’m not from the US and I’ve never read anything by this Jonah Goldberg before, but I read the LA Times piece, and honestly, it is not nearly as stupid and crazy as you make it out to be. He argues that compulsory service conflicts with the idea that involuntary servitude is a punishment, as outlined in the 13th Amendment. Do you disagree with this? I sure can’t tell, all you did was call him dumb (wow…what an insightful observation…really adds to the debate) and laughed at the combination of words “Liberal Fascists”. I think this article is kind of disappointing and kind of dumb, there’s no actual engagement in a real debate.

Doglessliberal

[re=31471]madirishman[/re]: yeah, arguments like his always seem to come from whites who have been handed everything throughout there lives on a platter. New rule: no one gets to have an opinion published in the MSM or make laws until they have to support themselves with no help, family money, grants, scholarships, etc, for a year. You can vary the factors, so some would have to be in school and pay tuition while owrking a job or two, while others would have to support a family of three children and a spouse who doesn’t work because of a disability. Oh, and be black.

columnv

Everyone knows this guy is a fuck. His whole book is either brilliantly conflating liberalism and fascism or brilliantly obfuscating what fascism actually was.

I think the thing that bothers me most is that he actually believes this shit. I mean, Colter and O’Rielly obviously don’t believe the crap the peddle.

BigLar

[re=31459]Doglessliberal[/re]: Yes *sigh* I am way too old. I tell people at my old university that we used to watch MTV for the videos and I either get the “Tell us more about the olden days, o wizened one!” or the “Oh God, he’s reminiscing again, how can I get out of here?” look.

AnnieGetYourFun

“Indeed, there’s ample evidence that countries with intrusive and expensive welfare states stifle their citizens’ spirit of charity and volunteerism precisely because people conclude that every problem should be solved by government. Merely paying your taxes substitutes for charity, and cleaning up roadside litter for two years absolves you from doing anything more.”

I wonder if Jonah knows of foreign countries other than Canada? I ask because the only countries I can think of with intrusive and expensive welfare states, like China, also have zero history of modern civil society. Even when the government is less tyrranical, the probability of people beginning to volunteer their time for the common good is about zilch (Korea). This isn’t because people feel the government will handle everything, but rather because you don’t work for the common good – you work to uphold your family’s honor.

eatsshootsleaves

Wait, so by Goldberg’s (cough) logic, aren’t schools slavery?

Doglessliberal

THEIR lives. Nothing like making a point with the wrong word.

Godless Liberal *

My eyeball exploded about halfway through that article. I hope I didn’t miss anything groundbreaking and intelligent.

AnnieGetYourFun

[re=31487]buythewholecow[/re]: You must be under the impression that this site fosters debate. I pity you, O Foreign One!

Q2

[re=31479]AfghanVet[/re]: Yeah…This is gonna be GREAT! :-) :-) :-p

Serolf Divad

To echo what others have said: if your idea of “those darn kids today” = Rolling Stone readers and MTV viewers, then you’re probably the least qualified person still living to comment on anything even remotely pertaining to anyone under 38 years of age.

ForeignSickSpecialist

[re=31487]buythewholecow[/re]: I get the milk for free.

eatsshootsleaves

[re=31487]buythewholecow[/re]: How is comparing a compulsive educational program (in the vein of, I don’t know, EVERY OTHER PART OF EDUCATION) to slavery worthy of “debate?” It’s dumb, dumb, dumb.

paisley

umm… gee, a democrat, that actually wants people to work for their handouts?

hmm.. i guess he has this republican’s vote…

hey… maybe just maybe.. it can solve some welfare and homeless problems?

wow! what a concept! a candidate that actually thinks of solutions instead of kissing everyone’s ass!

I LOVE IT!@

Inadequate Blackmail

[re=31475]AnnieGetYourFun[/re]: You may be right, but I think it’s worth attempting. There seems to be this undercurrent in youth culture right now that recognizes, perhaps even longs for, the nobility of public service. If that could be tapped into, while offering educational rewards, this current generation and the country would be stronger for it.

Strong country? God, I sound like a Republican. Also we need free needles for heroin junkies.

NotUrEvryDayWEzl

Last I checked, I was working 40+ hours a week. I.e., all we are asking of said children is 2 and half weeks of work? OH THE HORROR

Advocatus_Diaboli

[re=31487]buythewholecow[/re]: In case you haven’t noticed, Wonkette is about making fun of idiots, not engaging in debate with them.

[re=31487]buythewholecow[/re]: It’s not compulsory service! First of all, many many high schools have community service requirements already, and they’re state-funded (“public”) schools, and that has not yet been considered slavery. Obama’s plan is to give like 4k in college tuition to kids who perform some sort of national service. If Jonah is saying this is money they “need” and are thus compelled to perform the service, why isn’t the state bankrolling everyone’s college education already? As far as the most half-rational argument in his column — that the program wouldn’t produce too much in the way of actual results — that’s not the metric by which its success would be measured. It’s a *voluntary* way of getting more people involved in collective action that requires individual sacrifice, and that’s a mindset everyone needs to shift toward if this country is going to survive.

Q2

[re=31504]paisley[/re]: Uh oh…he’ll probably have your dick in his ass if your not careful…or yours in his. You repubs are so…close that way. ;-P

confusionanddelay&lt

[re=31491]BigLar[/re]: Here’s how old I am. That replacements video that was just a picture of a big speaker was really cool.

StrangelyBrown

Slavery’s better than no jobs at all.

Beef Supreme

Wow, that is a highly concentrated dose of retardation right there. I picture Jonah Goldberg busting through a wall like the Kool Aid man, except shitting and drooling everywhere. “Duh, hey everybody, Obama is a slave master!”

SystemError

My private high school did have a community service requirement for graduation. Then during and right after I graduated college I took a series of unpaid internships.

OMG!!!1! I R A SLAVEZS.

Doglessliberal

[re=31511]Jim Newell[/re]: Yeah, most high schools around the DC area have community service requirements. The majority of the students complain and then end up falling in love with whatever they pick to do and go on and do more on their own or expand the service into a larger life goal. Call me Hopey, Jr., but I choose to believe that once people start giving of themselves, they realize how rewarding it can be, and how it helps all of society. Yeah, some don’t, but since when do we make rules based on the jerks and the lowest common denominator? I’d like to make policy based on the best we can be.

OK, soapbox, unicorns, and rainbows stowed for the day.

NotUrEvryDayWEzl

[re=31510]Serolf Divad[/re]: Oh, damn, hadn’t thought of that.

Ok, you win.

Botswana Meat Commission FC

I guess in Obama’s mind it must be a crime to be born or to go to college.

This is the hackiest line I’ve ever read. Kill yourself, shit biscuit.

columnv

[re=31521]SystemError[/re]: what do you get, like, a donkey and a half acre or something?

FMA

This guy’s evidence that the differently abled can indeed hold jobs that previously were reserved for so-called normal people.
You go, Jonah! We’re all winners!

Inadequate Blackmail

[re=31487]buythewholecow[/re]: In addition to the basically inarguable points Jim makes above, you also have to understand the deep hypocrisy in Goldberg’s article: Namely that a pundit who supports the current administration’s military policies would think he has any credibility to harangue his political opponents about involuntary servitude.

Botswana Meat Commission FC

[re=31487]buythewholecow[/re]:
Jonah Goldberg is well known to most of us at this point. We already know he’s a complete fuckwad. Very little to debate there, really.

StrangelyBrown

[re=31487]buythewholecow[/re]: If it’s constitutional to drag me from my home, shove a rifle in my hand, fly me 8000 miles, drop me in the mud (or desert), and force me to shoot at people who haven’t called me by any ethnic slur I’ve ever heard of — all under the threat of imprisonment — then this glorified adopt-a-highway business is definitely constitutional. Don’t think that people haven’t tried to sue the Selective Service Board on 13th Amendment grounds.

Also, doesn’t McCain have some kind of half-assed national service plan of his own? I guess that one must be slavery-safe.

TGY

I’m cool with young people doing community service, AS LONG AS THEY STAY OFF MY LAWN. Goddamned kids these days. Perhaps they could go replace golf course divots with McCain’s tool or something poetic like that.

Dave J.

One of my favorite “rumors everyone knows to be true” is the following:

Lewinsky:Clinton = Lucianne Goldberg:LBJ

AnnieGetYourFun

[re=31532]Botswana Meat Commission FC[/re]: Well, there’s the issue of whether he’s a fuckwad douchenozzle or a fuckneck ballsucker? I’ll bet we could foster a healthy debate, possibly for HOURS, around this question.

teebob2000

Whadda twat

Mo MoDo

[re=31449]AnnieGetYourFun[/re]: Community Service requirements for high school graduation are already required here in the People’s Republic of Maryland. Nobody seems to catch on to the inherent Orwellian oxymoronity of mandatory volunteerism.

That doesn’t excuse Jonah from being a whiny sack of shit.

crookedE

I am a slave to Wonkette. And Caramello bars.

shevralay

It’s already been said, but at least in Georgia we’re already required to do community service to graduate on a state level — only 10 hours a year, to be true, but most students do more than that to look good for college. No one really minds it, that I know of, and I (and most of my friends) did 60 hours this past year.

Guppy06

So… a few hours of community service a year is unconstitutional, but reinstating the draft isn’t?

Q2

[re=31548]shevralay[/re]: Selling Christmas trees at the high school or emptying bed pans at the hospital don’t quite stack up to the rigors of a coupla years in the Army or Peace Corps does it.

Hooray For Anything

I like how Goldberg framed the argument. I await his next column in which he starts off “It’s ironic that the Democrats are electing somebody who isn’t part of the Nazi concept of the Aryan race because said Democratic policy is like Nazism.”

Then, of course, somewhere in the middle he will say “no, I’m not saying the Democrats are like Nazis, but many Germans vote for them.”

liquiddaddy

I try to tell people it’s tough not knowing if you are LBJ’s or Dick Nixon’s love child. Kid’s laughed and called him “twinky.” Chuckie Todd gave him dutch rubs and swirlies all the time. He used to get phantom boners whenever Pat Buchanon was around that filled him with shame. One tragic day, Petey Beinhardt smoked a joint with him and revealed that the Seven Castaways each represented one of the Seven Deadly Sins sending his mind into a spiraling fit of paranoia about shadowy conspiracies involving the Rothchildes, Lizard People, and Nazis that lasts till today. Pity him.

obfuscator

[re=31542]AnnieGetYourFun[/re]:

There’s also a school of thought that sees him as more of a fuckbrained dickjuggler.

problemwithcaring

[re=31449]AnnieGetYourFun[/re]:

“I don’t see the possibility of making volunteering manadatory as having any long-lasting positive effects.”

Aww, Annie, everybody who reads Jonah, then him takes seriously isn’t then a “Tony the Tiger.” Their main mistake is “reading Jonah.”

Thing is – 1) nothing about Obama volunteer policy proposals are mandatory; they are in fact incentivized. 2) You may be right that for, say, an African America or Latino student, volunteering where one’s family and community lives will not have a single positive long-lasting effect that the typical 12 years of compulsory public education inner-city school won’t give them. Personally, I just don’t see how it’s not possible to see long-lasting, beneficial effects. Granted, not as beneficial as slavery, but what is?

norbizness

[re=31431]queeraselvis v 2.0[/re]: You won’t believe it, but I actually coined that term back in 2004.

mookworthjwilson

[re=31511]Jim Newell[/re]: Leave it to our esteemed Jim Newell to interject something sensible into what was otherwise a perfectly good Jonah Goldberg hatefest…Tanks fer nuttin!!!

jimh

Well since loquaciousmusic isn’t here to say it, I will:
Jonah Goldberg can tonguejack my shitbox.

Shame on you America, asking the children to work for their edumacation loans!
Loans shouldn’t have strings attached, or SHOULD I SAY CHAINS attached! SLAVERY, FASCISM, BYAHH!
WAKE UP PEOPLE!

And now a quote from Buster:
*yawns* “Wow, we’re just blowing right through naptime, aren’t we?”

shortsshortsshorts

[re=31480]AnnieGetYourFun[/re]: My pleasure.

randomsausage

This is like the shit I used to come up with in 10th grade when I was going to change the world into a libertarian/socialist nirvana. Man…if only I’d stuck with that instead of getting a job, having a career, I could have made a living as a douchebag columnist…

Did anyone catch Barry’s latest speech where he mentioned he wanted a “civillian national security” volunteer corps? WTF is that about, searching bags and groping people at the Metro? Snitching on gun owners?

Brave new world.

Gormogon

[re=31511]Jim Newell[/re]: Actually, Jonah’s saying that Obama wants to make all colleges which accept stuents who get federal aid (this is every college except, like, five) make all</bL of their students do “service,” not just the ones accepting federal aid.

Now, Jonah could just be making that up, since Jonah often makes shit up. OTOH, even if Jonah *is* just making it up, Barry could easily adopt it as his own position a few weeks from now, >cf FISA “reform,” etc.

jimh

[re=31657]Gormogon[/re]: Does it come with a free felt badge, red arm band, and an overweening sense of power and authority? Sign me up!

And don’t start with that “turning in one’s own family” crap, those assholes have it coming. They hate my freedoms.

Are you saying that Obama is little more than a pawn in the international Communist conspiracy to sap and impurify all of our precious bodily fluids through government-mandated fluoridation?

Good to know.

shortsshortsshorts

With a name like “Goldberg” I would be stark-shit afraid of fascism.

Canuckledragger

[re=31449]AnnieGetYourFun[/re]:“I don’t see the possibility of making volunteering manadatory as having any long-lasting positive effects.”

We’ve got compulsory community service requirements for high school graduation here. All my older kids did it and learned much. My two youngest guys have done or are now completing their service. The elder kid put in his forty hours by spending a week pushing people confined to wheelchairs around the local fair. He learned some compassion: how blessed he is not to be wheelchair-bound, and that this type of service is an honourable use of his time, because those people wouldn’t have had that opportunity for a bit of fun without him.

The younger kid is now serving as a museum tour guide for children a decade younger than he is, many of them with their own health issues. He, too, feels lucky to be healthy and able-bodied as a result, and has already announced he wishes to continue at the museum even after his ‘time’ has been served.

Forty years ago, I taught ‘retarded’ kids [as we used to call ’em] how to swim, for the extraordinary pay of a dollar a day. Best fuckin’ job I’ve ever had in my life, and if I could afford to do it, I’d go back to that in a heartbeat. As it is, I must settle for doing as much for local charities as time and cash will allow. In my case, I doubt the latter would have happened had I not done the former, as has been the case with my own kids.

Service to the community teaches kids – those open to learning the lesson – the value of service to community, and the benefits that they themselves glean from the experience. If it does nothing more, it’s well worth the small amount of effort required.

Token snark: The best part of Jonah Goldberg dribbled down mama Lucianne’s leg on the McGovern campaign plane while she was there spying for Nixon. The nominal “news” agency she toiled for has always been a CIA front. That might fill in some blanks on why Jonah is the fuckwad we’ve come to know and loathe.

Jim Newell

[re=31661]Gormogon[/re]: No, it’s middle and high schools. The college credit is a different but related idea of Obama’s. The funds for public middle and high schools are based on a service requirement (that many of them already have) and would give schools more federal money than they receive now.

Jewdishoowary Square

[re=31559]obfuscator[/re]: Oooh! How about “cockjowled shitfountain”?

jimh

[re=31679]shortsshortsshorts[/re]: I find it unbelievable that the author would approve that cover art for his book. It seems to me that to humorously caricature someone as incendiary and as emotionally powerful as Adolph Hitler would be difficult for a person of Jewish heritage. I know it’s popular to compare people to Hitler on the internets, but the cover art makes light of the deaths of six million people in my opinion. No “liberal fascist” is promoting anything akin to the “Final Solution”, and to invoke such an image to sell books seems irresponsible at best and fucking moronic at worst.

Gormogon

[re=31689]Jim Newell[/re]: Just like “No Child Left Behind” gives schools more money than they would get otherwise for making all the kids take the same test, etc…..

Thanks for the clarification.

snig

I hope he takes his stand to the logical conclusion, and goes to jail when he asserts his freedom by avoiding jury duty. I hope he gets the max sentence when explaining to the activist judge that he’s avoiding fascist government slavers.

shortsshortsshorts

[re=31696]jimh[/re]: Maybe “fucking moronic” at best and “shit-stained balls” at worst. He’s a schmuck.

The school I teach at requires our seventh-grade students to choose one of three activities in which to participate every week: they can volunteer in schools, they can clear the Audubon trail, and they can visit a nursing home and interact with the residents.

[re=31483]Keram2[/re]: I do wonder how a government hands off guy like Goldberg would feel about me publicly masturbating to said ad while spitting semi-coherent game to the girls leaving the Whole Foods omniplex.

FlipOffResearch

Ha ha ha, Jonah Goldberg is an idiot. It never ceases to amaze me how these legitimate news outlets give morons like this a forum. Don’t they (the LAT) know that their credibility is one of their most valuable assets? So they are trading the short term gain of having some bombastic blowhard increase circulation versus the long term value of being able to be taken seriously. Also, can you tell that chick to change her pants? They must be getting a little smelly.

FreshCliches

If the Cult Of Carson Daly is what is currently considered “too cool”, Sweet Jeebus, I’m sticking with Miles Davis and Gerry Mulligan.

You punks get off my lawn.

lumpenprole

oh look! A happy logo that kills Jews! :)
No wait.
sick! :(

Walter_Sobchak

I know I’m late to the discussion, but please all still checking, enjoy:

For someone who hates the way words (like fascism) are carelessly thrown around, he sure is carelessly throwing slavery around.

regisgoat

Incidentally, where the hell are my reparations for having been forced to take a work study job at college. I been beaten! I been ‘buked! and I’m currently in the middle of writing my next book “Beloved 2” all about my own personal slavery. They took my milk–at the cafeteria! I may not have been visited by any infant ghosts, but I met a spooky babe or two during my college years.

shevralay

[re=31554]Q2[/re]: Yeah, it’s not that big a damn deal. Adults are whiny.

The Neoskeptic

[re=31449]AnnieGetYourFun[/re]: uhm, the Boy Scouts, National Honor Society, being in Student Council – these are all things that require “service” – and they also have their attached strings rewards.

what Jonah reallllly means: “Barack Obama wants to tip off the darkies to all the ways us privelaged white-folk have used to get ahead in high school and college”. oh noes!!1!

The Neoskeptic

[re=31834]FreshCliches[/re]: the cult of Miles Davis and Geraldus wouldn’t tell the punks to “get off my lawn” – they’d invite the punks up to the porch for a toke.

buythewholecow

Very interesting replies to my comment, I enjoyed reading them, except for Advocatus_Diaboli. Don’t imply that I’m an idiot, sunshine, that’s very unbecoming. You don’t have to be smart to make fun of “idiots”, so don’t think insulting me makes you seem any smarter.

BoredOnTheHill

As a Returned Peace Corps Volunteer and chronic civil servant, I admit that I am keen to the notion of tying education to service. But rather than tie it to the school, tie it to the borrower. What makes it “your education”? For many students, college is paid for through their hard work during the school year and mountainous debt, while for others, there are scholarships or familial contribution. What makes college possible for most of us is the existence of Sallie Mae, the pseudo-private, government-backed lending institution that grants millions of dollars to students every year. (Currently, I owe Sallie Mae $60K plus, if you wanted to know). Sallie Mae is unique to the US, and nary a similar institution exists elsewhere. It is a remarkable service that our government provides, especially given the fact that these loans are interest free until we’ve graduated and many times can be deferred further if we enter government service such as the military or Peace Corps. So while it is not free money, the mere existence of this service is a remarkable accomplishment. There are alternative, private lenders such as Citi or Bank of America, but their terms are rarely more favorable in the long run. So why not ask students to give a little to get a little? Is it indentured servitude or slavery, as Mr. Goldberg purports? No. That you would borrow money voluntarily from one of many potential lenders doubly negates that argument. So, rather than thinking in such terms as Mr. Goldberg’s “slave mentality”, how about there’s no such thing as a free lunch. Want Sallie Mae’s , you have to earn it. What’s that favorite conservative dogma? Freedom isn’t free; well, neither should be education.