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Topic: How important is prophecy? (Read 4665 times)

SQ

I have been thinking a lot about prophecy and how important it is in the world today. I have been pretty interested in it but find I and others may lean more on our own understanding and not actually what scriptures are saying, just speculation like I have done many times, thanks to Jack Van Impe and others. So I ask you is prophecy that important? I remember back in 1999 how I stored food and water because computers was not programmed to go beyond that year according to some prophecy speculators.Here it is 2009 and people are still guessing, I am beginning to think prophecy is guess work at best.It appears lots of bad things in the world today, but there are good too as always.I am asking also, has prophecy been fullfilled in 70 AD and will it happen again?Nothing new under the son as spoken Ecclesiastes.Many Thanks to everyone that replies.

SPOKENFOR

Good Question. I think prophecy is important. I also feel the prophecy today in many ways is more to exhort people to get closer to God than anything. I use to listen to Jack Van Impe too a while ago, but not anymore.

Doug

I have been thinking a lot about prophecy and how important it is in the world today. I have been pretty interested in it but find I and others may lean more on our own understanding and not actually what scriptures are saying, just speculation like I have done many times, thanks to Jack Van Impe and others.So I ask you is prophecy that important?

There is a basic truth, that we should keep in mind, when thinking about prophecy: The gospel is a prophecy. "In thy seed shall all nations be blessed." [Galatians 3:8] That was the promise given to Abraham, that Paul called the gospel. Isn't that a prophecy?

Keeping that in mind, the scriptures show that prophecy is simply the story about how that promise is working out in the world, told in advance. Consider what the apostle Peter said. Referring to Jesus, he said to Cornelius and his family, "To him give all the prophets witness, that through his name whosoever believeth in him shall receive remission of sins." [Acts 10:43]

Each prophet added some information, that in some manner, has something to do with the Gospel. Much of the New Testament discusses old Testament prophecy which is interpreted, to reveal more about the gospel.

Paul said to king Agrippa that he based his entire message upon what the prophets and Moses had said. "Having therefore obtained help of God, I continue unto this day, witnessing both to small and great, saying none other things than those which the prophets and Moses did say should come:" [Acts 26:22]

He confirms this in his letter to the Romans: "But now the righteousness of God without the law is manifested, being witnessed by the law and the prophets;" [Romans 3:21]

Peter exhorted his readers to "take heed" to prophecy. "We have also a more sure word of prophecy; whereunto ye do well that ye take heed, as unto a light that shineth in a dark place, until the day dawn, and the day star arise in your hearts:" [2 Peter 1:19]

Prophesying was to "comfort" the saints, Paul said. [1 Corinthians 14:31] And he wrote, "but prophesying serveth not for them that believe not, but for them which believe." [1 Corinthians 14:22]

The false prophets believe prophecy is a way to make themselves wealthy! They hurry to publish revisions of their books, or make sensational claims about the future, when some big event happens in the world. They don't understand what the Bible itself says prophecy is about.

In his first epistle, Peter tells us the prophets understood that they ministered "not unto themselves," but "unto us," that is, his readers, the church. His epistle was not written to Jews, or those who do not believe the gospel. Peter said the prophets wrote about "the grace that should come unto you," referring to the Gospel, and he said they wrote "by the spirit of Christ that was in them." These fundamentals of prophecy are all contained in 1 Peter 1:9-12.

SPOKENFOR

I have been thinking a lot about prophecy and how important it is in the world today. I have been pretty interested in it but find I and others may lean more on our own understanding and not actually what scriptures are saying, just speculation like I have done many times, thanks to Jack Van Impe and others.So I ask you is prophecy that important?

There is a basic truth, that we should keep in mind, when thinking about prophecy: The gospel is a prophecy. "In thy seed shall all nations be blessed." [Galatians 3:8] That was the promise given to Abraham, that Paul called the gospel. Isn't that a prophecy?

Keeping that in mind, the scriptures show that prophecy is simply the story about how that promise is working out in the world, told in advance. Consider what the apostle Peter said. Referring to Jesus, he said to Cornelius and his family, "To him give all the prophets witness, that through his name whosoever believeth in him shall receive remission of sins." [Acts 10:43]

Each prophet added some information, that in some manner, has something to do with the Gospel. Much of the New Testament discusses old Testament prophecy which is interpreted, to reveal more about the gospel.

Paul said to king Agrippa that he based his entire message upon what the prophets and Moses had said. "Having therefore obtained help of God, I continue unto this day, witnessing both to small and great, saying none other things than those which the prophets and Moses did say should come:" [Acts 26:22]

He confirms this in his letter to the Romans: "But now the righteousness of God without the law is manifested, being witnessed by the law and the prophets;" [Romans 3:21]

Peter exhorted his readers to "take heed" to prophecy. "We have also a more sure word of prophecy; whereunto ye do well that ye take heed, as unto a light that shineth in a dark place, until the day dawn, and the day star arise in your hearts:" [2 Peter 1:19]

Prophesying was to "comfort" the saints, Paul said. [1 Corinthians 14:31] And he wrote, "but prophesying serveth not for them that believe not, but for them which believe." [1 Corinthians 14:22]

The false prophets believe prophecy is a way to make themselves wealthy! They hurry to publish revisions of their books, or make sensational claims about the future, when some big event happens in the world. They don't understand what the Bible itself says prophecy is about.

In his first epistle, Peter tells us the prophets understood that they ministered "not unto themselves," but "unto us," that is, his readers, the church. His epistle was not written to Jews, or those who do not believe the gospel. Peter said the prophets wrote about "the grace that should come unto you," referring to the Gospel, and he said they wrote "by the spirit of Christ that was in them." These fundamentals of prophecy are all contained in 1 Peter 1:9-12.

and it is the testimony /witness of Jesus Christ and those whom carry this same Spirit of prophecy they are persecuted and hold this witness /testimony of Jesus Christ because it is hated in the world , but loved by God /Father

it is a Spirit/Breath of life and it is holy /pure Rev 12:17 And the dragon was wroth with the woman, and went to make war with the remnant of her seed, which keep the commandments of God, and have the testimony of Jesus Christ.

Rev 19:10 And I fell at his feet to worship him. And he said unto me, See [thou do it] not: I am thy fellowservant, and of thy brethren that have the testimony of Jesus: worship God: for the testimony of Jesus is the spirit of prophecy.

Strong's G4394 - prophēteia 1) prophecy

a) a discourse emanating from divine inspiration and declaring the purposes of God, whether by reproving and admonishing the wicked, or comforting the afflicted, or revealing things hidden; esp. by foretelling future events

b) Used in the NT of the utterance of OT prophets

1) of the prediction of events relating to Christ's kingdom and its speedy triumph, together with the consolations and admonitions pertaining to it, the spirit of prophecy, the divine mind, to which the prophetic faculty is due

2) of the endowment and speech of the Christian teachers called prophets

3) the gifts and utterances of these prophets, esp. of the predictions of the works of which, set apart to teach the gospel, will accomplish for the kingdom of Christ

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Jesus is the reward !!

Doug

it is a Spirit/Breath of life and it is holy /pureRev 12:17 And the dragon was wroth with the woman, and went to make war with the remnant of her seed, which keep the commandments of God, and have the testimony of Jesus Christ.

The scripture quoted above identifies the woman with the church. However, there has been some controversy about this. If it is the church which is meant, in verse 13 she is persecuted by the dragon, and in verse 15 she is pictured as threatened by "a flood from the mouth of the serpent." And in verse 14, she is given two wings of a great eagle, that enable her to escape to the wilderness. What are the two eagle's wings?

I suggest, they represent an understanding of prophecy.

There are several reasons this may be so. In Daniel's vision of the four beasts, in Dan. 7, the first beast, which represented Babylon, had eagles' wings, but they were plucked off. And Nebuchadnezzar was a remarkable king, as he was given revelations from God. His dream of a great image is the subject of Daniel 2, and his account of another dream is contained in chapter 4. His insight, I suggest, is represented by the "eagles' wings" in Daniel 7:4, that were plucked.

Interestingly enough, Nebuchadnezzar's period of insanity is described by comparing his hair to eagles' feathers, and his nails to bird's claws.

Daniel 4:33The same hour was the thing fulfilled upon Nebuchadnezzar: and he was driven from men, and did eat grass as oxen, and his body was wet with the dew of heaven, till his hairs were grown like eagles' feathers, and his nails like birds' claws.

In the prophecy of Ezekiel 17, Nebuchadnezzar is represented as a great eagle:

Ezekiel 17:3-5A great eagle with great wings, longwinged, full of feathers, which had divers colours, came unto Lebanon, and took the highest branch of the cedar:He cropped off the top of his young twigs, and carried it into a land of traffick; he set it in a city of merchants.He took also of the seed of the land, and planted it in a fruitful field; he placed it by great waters, and set it as a willow tree.

This is interpreted beginning in verse 12:

"Say now to the rebellious house, Know ye not what these things mean? tell them, Behold, the king of Babylon is come to Jerusalem, and hath taken the king thereof, and the princes thereof, and led them with him to Babylon; And hath taken of the king's seed, and made a covenant with him, and hath taken an oath of him: he hath also taken the mighty of the land:"

Thus, eagles' wings were a symbol of something that was associated with Nebuchadnezzar, who was taught an important lesson:

Daniel 4:34-37And at the end of the days I Nebuchadnezzar lifted up mine eyes unto heaven, and mine understanding returned unto me, and I blessed the most High, and I praised and honoured him that liveth for ever, whose dominion is an everlasting dominion, and his kingdom is from generation to generation:And all the inhabitants of the earth are reputed as nothing: and he doeth according to his will in the army of heaven, and among the inhabitants of the earth: and none can stay his hand, or say unto him, What doest thou?At the same time my reason returned unto me; and for the glory of my kingdom, mine honour and brightness returned unto me; and my counsellors and my lords sought unto me; and I was established in my kingdom, and excellent majesty was added unto me.Now I Nebuchadnezzar praise and extol and honour the King of heaven, all whose works are truth, and his ways judgment: and those that walk in pride he is able to abase.

Perhaps this understanding, given to Nebuchadnezzar, is pictured by "eagles' wings."

Let's see how those eagles' wings contrast with the wings given to the third beast in Daniel's vision in chapter 7.

Daniel 7:6After this I beheld, and lo another, like a leopard, which had upon the back of it four wings of a fowl; the beast had also four heads; and dominion was given to it

The third beast represented the four Hellenistic kingdoms, which arose after the conquests of Alexander, that history shows were noted for superstition, and the proliferation of pagan religions. This is probably what is pictured by the inferior "four wings of a fowl." Perhaps they represent the false prophets, and spiritual ignorance of that age.

The "wings" of eagles, in Revelation 12:14, may represent an understanding of prophecy, that is to be given to the church. An eagle soars at a great height, and looks down on the earth from above, so pictures the divine viewpoint, as opposed to the human one. And its wings are far more powerful than those of most other birds, and of the inferior fowl, which are hardly capable of flying at all.

Doug

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Doug

The "wings" of eagles, in Revelation 12:14, may represent an understanding of prophecy, that is to be given to the church. An eagle soars at a great height, and looks down on the earth from above, so pictures the divine viewpoint, as opposed to the human one. And its wings are far more powerful than those of most other birds, and of the inferior fowl, which are hardly capable of flying at all.

The significance of the eagle in the above scripture may chiefly be that the eagle is a predator, and it is a great enemy of the serpent. The church is "the pillar and ground of truth," Paul said in 1 Timothy 3:15.

Below is the first paragraph of one of the chapters in a book by Andrew Jukes, about the traditional association of John's Gospel with the symbol of the eagle. The book is: "The characteristic differences of the four Gospels considered as revealing various relations of the lord Jesus Christ," by Andrew John Jukes. (F. H. Revell Co., 1853.)

"The fourth living-creature was like a flying eagle."--Rev. iv. 7."The way of an eagle in the air is too wonderful for me."-- Prov. xxx. 18.

We come now to that Gospel which more than any other carries on its face the plainest tokens of being occupied with an aspect of Christ distinct from all the rest. "The fourth living- creature was like unto an eagle." And if in tracing those views of the Lord, the emblems of which are taken from creatures which walk on earth, it has been difficult to bring within my limits the characteristic peculiarities of each Gospel, what shall I say of this Gospel, which like the eagle soars away to heaven, where nearly the whole is peculiar, and every part throughout replete with mysteries touching the Son of God. Canst thou fly as the eagle? "She mounteth up on high : she dwelleth and abideth in the rock, upon the strong place. Her eyes behold afar off; her young ones suck up blood, and where the slain is there is she." [1] Who can follow here? Some have heard a voice, saying, "I bare you upon eagles' wings:" [2] and in His strength who makes His redeemed to ride upon high places, they also "mount up with wings as eagles." [3] For "as an eagle stirreth up her nest, fluttereth over her young, spreadeth abroad her wings, taketh them, beareth them on her wings; so the Lord leads His beloved" [4] into heavenly places, thence to behold what such as walk on earth can never see.

1. Job xxxix. 27.2. Exod. xix. 4.3. Isa. xl. 31.4. Deut. xxxii. 11.

It is by the truth God has hidden in prophecy, pictured by the wings of an eagle in Revelation 12:14, that the deceptions of Satan, who is represented by the serpent in this prophecy, can be overcome, because "the testimony of Jesus is the spirit of prophecy." [Revelation 19:10]

Prophecy is not fortune-telling as most north americans believe. Prophecy doesn't see the future as a time traveller, or as some mystical understanding. Prophecy is a very direct and revealing tool.

Who were the prophets?

The easiest way to describe the prophet without 15 pages of concept building... they were legal emmisaries arguing the law on God's behalf, they were the lawyers of God.

God spoke the law, and He set forth alot of consequences for action in them. He said if you do this then this will happen. The lawyers all read and understood and that's why they "prophesied" to Isreal saying, God said because you are doing this, then this is going to happen.

They were lawyers as it was concearning the old covenant. That's why in Daniel it is said that all prophecy would be done when Jesus came!!

Daniel 9:24"Seventy weeks have been decreed for your people and your holy city, to finish the transgression, to make an end of sin, to make atonement for iniquity, to bring in everlasting righteousness, to seal up vision and prophecy and to anoint the most holy place.

26"Then after the sixty-two weeks the Messiah will be cut off and have nothing, and the people of the prince who is to come will destroy the city and the sanctuary And its end will come with a (BB)flood; even to the end there will be war; desolations are determined.

27"And he will make a firm covenant with the many for one week, but in the middle of the week he will put a stop to sacrifice and grain offering; and on the wing of (BC)abominations will come one who makes desolate, even until a complete destruction, one that is decreed, is poured out on the one who makes desolate."

This speaks of the end of prophecy when the temple comes down and when Jesus makes atonement and Jerusalem is destroyed.

All prophecy concearning the old covenant has come to an end. It is refering to the old, by the old about the old covenant.

There is new prophets for the new covenant. The 12 and all those who prophey about what jesus did, I am a prophet prophesying to you about the new covenant.

When I say all people will be restored into the fullness I am prophesying, I am a prophet. Not a fortune teller.... that's for mystics and head games not the peace joy and righteousness of God.

« Last Edit: August 27, 2009, 08:17:20 PM by Dallas »

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Doug

The prophets and apostles are the Church's foundation, Eph. 2:20. Their message, Peter said, was for the church: "unto us they did minister;" and they wrote about the Gospel: "the grace that should come unto you;" and they wrote "by the spirit of Christ which was in them." [1 Pet. 1:10-12]

Quote from: Dallas

They were lawyers as it was concearning the old covenant. That's why in Daniel it is said that all prophecy would be done when Jesus came!!

That's not what Daniel said!! But he did say that the 70 weeks prophecy would seal up prophecy, and Dan. 12:7 indicates all the things mentioned in Daniel would be fulfilled in the mysterious "time, times and a half."

Daniel 12:7And I heard the man clothed in linen, which was upon the waters of the river, when he held up his right hand and his left hand unto heaven, and sware by him that liveth for ever that it shall be for a time, times, and an half; and when he shall have accomplished to scatter the power of the holy people, all these things shall be finished.

A "time, times and a half" is one half of "seven times." Jesus was to confirm his covenant for one week, which is "seven times." But the last half week is not a literal three and a half years. It continues today, because Jesus is still "confirming his covenant" with his church.

Quote from: Dallas

This speaks of the end of prophecy when the temple comes down and when Jesus makes atonement and Jerusalem is destroyed.

The destruction of the temple, Daniel said, would occur in the midst of the last week, not the end of it: "and in the midst of the week he shall cause the sacrifice and the oblation to cease." [Dan 9:27]

Beware of the doctrine of preterism! Daniel said that the antichrist would "plant the tabernacles of his palace between the seas in the glorious holy mountain." [Dan. 11:45] The "holy mountain" of God is the church! Jesus said,

Luke 21:20-22And when ye shall see Jerusalem compassed with armies, then know that the desolation thereof is nigh. Then let them which are in Judaea flee to the mountains; and let them which are in the midst of it depart out; and let not them that are in the countries enter thereinto. For these be the days of vengeance, that all things which are written may be fulfilled.

Preterists think it applies to the Jews of Jerusalem in the first century AD. However, their problem is the same one those unfortunate Jews had. Christ did not come, and fight against the invading armies, as predicted in Zech. 14:3.

Just as Jesus sent his prophets of old, the spirit of antichrist has sent his armies against them. Those armies are called Gog and Magog and their hordes, in Rev. 20:8-9, and they are the subject of Ezekiel's prophecy in Ezek. 38, and also Zech. 14, where all nations come against Jerusalem. The Jerusalem here could not be the earthly city as preterists and dispensationalists say.

Were Roman soldiers in the siege of Jerusalem afflicted with eye rot, tongue decay, or some kind of flesh-eating disease, in 70 AD? Did Christ fight against the Roman armies, and deliver the Jews? Of course not! The Jews who expected God to come and fight on their behalf were miserably disappointed.

The Jerusalem of Zechariah's prophecy is the church! Zech. 14:8 says a river of living water will flow from Jerusalem, and Jesus spoke of this:

John 7:37-39In the last day, that great day of the feast, Jesus stood and cried, saying, If any man thirst, let him come unto me, and drink.He that believeth on me, as the scripture hath said, out of his belly shall flow rivers of living water.(But this spake he of the Spirit, which they that believe on him should receive: for the Holy Ghost was not yet given; because that Jesus was not yet glorified.)

Only the church has been given this promise of the spirit of God. And so Zechariah's prophecy is about the church, the heavenly Jerusalem.

I suggest the Olivet discourse of Jesus is the subject of Zechariah's prophecy about mount of Olives dividing into two, and half of it moving towards the north, and half of it moving towards the south. The prophecy is fulfilled in our time, by two contrasting interpretations of the prophecy of Jesus. Preterists say it was all fulfilled in the first century AD, and dispensationalists claim it applies to a future 7 years tribulation. Both views displace the Olivet prophecy from its correct application, represented by the wide valley between the two halves of the mountain that are displaced from their positions. The "valley of the mountains," between those two extremes, is where Zechariah says to flee.

In the figurative "valley of the mountains," between the two halves of the mount of Olives, the prophecy of Jesus is properly understood. Perhaps it is what Jesus meant when he said "flee to the mountains." The Olivet discourse applies not to Jews in a future age, or Jews of the first century AD, but to Christians today. So don't be a preterist! If this interpretation is right, they are among the enemies Christ will fight against!

The "root" of prophecy is to speak those things that are not, as though they were, under the leading and inspiration of the Holy Ghost. And no, it is not a fortune telling device to tell you what you are going to do next Tuesday at noon.

It is the same as when the Spirit moved upon the face/nature of the "waters", making that which is void and without form into what thus saith the Lord. It edifies or builds up the body, and can also be used to speak healing miracles into being, if the Lord so desires to do it that way. Blessings....

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"I would rather train twenty men to pray, than a thousand to preach; A minister's highest mission ought to be to teach his people to pray." -H. MacGregor

Leelee

I wanted to share what I think is an answer to my prayers. My prayer was to end confusion as to when the end times were and what HE intended. There is soooo much out there!

Then, a friend sent me the DVD on Daniel's Timeline. These people spent 20 years researching all of this and I sat in awe the whole time. Have watched it 3 times already and going to a bunch more time as a lot to it. Anyway, I want to share with ya'll since you are interested in prophecy.

Thanks for the comments on Prophecy. There is so much of that out there also; even some putting curses on lands and waters saying that is what GOD wants done?? To me that takes away from what GOD is and wants, doesn't it?

There are many (including Gary Amirault) who see many truths to be had and explored in the ideas of Preterism, at leastpartial Preterism. No one individual has the corner on the truth, and there are many pieces to the puzzle.

Prophecy is very important! Love must have a destination. Unfortunately, much of Bible prophecy is made of none effect by the traditions of men. Love is the fulfillment of prophecy, though.

Hi Green arrow well God is love scriptures says in the Book of John , and Jesus Christ was sent by the Father to mediate on our behalf so the testimony/witnes of Jesus Christ is the =SPIRIT of prophecy

Rev 19:10 And I fell at his feet to worship him. And he said unto me, See [thou do it] not: I am thy fellowservant, and of thy brethren that have the testimony of Jesus: worship God: for the testimony of Jesus is the spirit of prophecy.

the Love of God was shed abroad in our/ many a hearts in the face of Jesus Christ .. so yes can see that Love is the fulfilment of prophecy