Eventually, the ZFT will start releasing, on a pay-to-download basis, the original tapes from the vault transferred directly to lossless digital files. This will be an industry first. No more tinny sounding CDs in cheesy paper covers. We will finally be able to feel the warmth of Zappa's music for the first time since we last heard the band play in concert.

I don't understand the appeal of downloads at all...unless the price is cut by about 3/4. Why should I do all the work? Hand me a cd and I'm happy. I'll dump it on my computer if I feel like it.

A growing number of people think that even putting a CD in their hand is "work" and having a shelf of CDs quaint.

And to think I had you in my Will for first dibs on the collection. You're Out!

Edit: btw, yes, I am old! Anyway, my entire record collecting life has been about gambling on music. Takin' 'em home, give it a whirl, maybe live with it for a year or two, reassess, down to the shop to trade it in. This is my entertainment and I love it. I just thinned out my Mod Classical collection...pulled in around $500. on ebay. Have another pile here that I'm gonna swap at a shop in NYC this week. Ought to fetch $300. in trades. It's a way of Life.

And to think I had you in my Will for first dibs on the collection. You're Out!

Edit: btw, yes, I am old! Anyway, my entire record collecting life has been about gambling on music. Takin' 'em home, give it a whirl, maybe live with it for a year or two, reassess, down to the shop to trade it in. This is my entertainment and I love it. I just thinned out my Mod Classical collection...pulled in around $500. on ebay. Have another pile here that I'm gonna swap at a shop in NYC this week. Ought to fetch $300. in trades. It's a way of Life.

I think you just spoke for the vast majority of record collectors worldwide Mr. Pang!I....for one have been doing that for over 30 years. But I never looked at it as a gamble....more of an investment. Digital is today... and will always be a form of " Convenience Media" that can never replace vinyl IMHO.G.C.

_________________"It is the mark of an educated mind to be able to entertain a thought without accepting it."

Eventually, the ZFT will start releasing, on a pay-to-download basis, the original tapes from the vault transferred directly to lossless digital files. This will be an industry first. No more tinny sounding CDs in cheesy paper covers. We will finally be able to feel the warmth of Zappa's music for the first time since we last heard the band play in concert.

I can't wait

JFK, I'm new to these forums and have always been curious as to the future of the vault and how it will be preserved. Is the ZFT actually considering this? Where did you hear this? Thanks!

I suggest all future releases be based on this fantastic technological breakthrough. Think of the profit margin, especially when you consider the implications of the number of people who like Frank's music and like to get high. One good case of the munchies and a new copy would be shipping, and then there's the depressed love lost crowd. Seriously Gail we're talking billions.

_________________"Whose foot is to be the measure to which ours are all to be cut or stretched? Is a priest to be our inquisitor, or shall a layman, simple as ourselves, set up his reason as the rule for what we are to read and what we must believe?" T.J.

Eventually, the ZFT will start releasing, on a pay-to-download basis, the original tapes from the vault transferred directly to lossless digital files. This will be an industry first. No more tinny sounding CDs in cheesy paper covers. We will finally be able to feel the warmth of Zappa's music for the first time since we last heard the band play in concert.

I can't wait

Ummm, are you just conjecturing here or did you actually hear from a reliable source that ZFT has plans to put out previously unreleased FZ music on-line?

one of the uglies wrote:

I suggest all future releases be based on this fantastic technological breakthrough. Think of the profit margin, especially when you consider the implications of the number of people who like Frank's music and like to get high. One good case of the munchies and a new copy would be shipping, and then there's the depressed love lost crowd. Seriously Gail we're talking BILLION$.

I don't understand the appeal of downloads at all...unless the price is cut by about 3/4. Why should I do all the work? Hand me a cd and I'm happy. I'll dump it on my computer if I feel like it.

I don't see any issues with it ... I'm not a purist by any stretch of the imagination ... but this old idea that money needs to be spent to get a better this and that ... that is really not there in the first place!

I'll tell you one example that stinks ... and is horrible. It's not "digital" per se, but it is now ... and the problem with it was not the "digital" or the "analog" ... the problem was the meddling with the energy ... and that is bad all around ... and an important lesson for all.

37 years ago, there were a pair of bootlegs from Led Zeppelin that shook the bootleg world and listeners world. They were called "Bonzo's Birthday Party" and "Live on Blueberry Hill". And what stood out in these was ... the incredible energy that was in them from beginning to end ... it starts ... "nice to be back" and it doesn't let up for 20 minutes of a total blow out of energy and amazing musicianship.

33 years later. Jimmy decided to release "How the West Was Won", which consisted of some moments from these shows and a couple of others ... and he did something that is inexcusable, pathetic, boring and ridiculous ... he took out some parts that he felt were "mistakes" and replaced them with newer bits. ... and no one bought that album ... you know why? ... it's shit! ... it doesn't have the psychic energy and pulse ... that sold those bootlegs like hotcakes!

And sorry Jimmy ... you didn't cut it this time, and you know why!

And I doubt, 100% doubt, that anything of Frank's that gets released can be changed or made any better other than some EQ'ing and some noise cleaning up ... if they touch the music, they will hurt it and kill it! ... and I hope that you understand that to the very last letter and number in the universe Gail (or Dweez or anyone else) ... because that secret is a sacred moment ... in the life of an artist!

You can never duplicate it ... you can never make it better ... all you can do is live with it and love it for what it is ... not something else that we want to hear!

Make a good choice ... but some moments in life, can not be duplicated ... sometimes it is love, sometimes it is death, and sometimes it is a moment in time ...

... when the music is over, turn out the lights ... gives that sone a whole new meaning when we try to deny that moment's existence, doesn't it?

Last edited by Moshkito on Tue Dec 21, 2010 5:11 pm, edited 1 time in total.

Eventually, the ZFT will start releasing, on a pay-to-download basis, the original tapes from the vault transferred directly to lossless digital files. This will be an industry first. No more tinny sounding CDs in cheesy paper covers. We will finally be able to feel the warmth of Zappa's music for the first time since we last heard the band play in concert.

I can't wait

Industry first? Robert Fripp has been doing that for a while now?!?! Over 200 releases by my estimate?!?!

Tinny sounding CD's? how do you figure? Maybe vinyl-o-files think that the RIAA amplifier was a wonderful thing to get their "loins" massaged by the deep bass that it gives (and I still wonder why people think that vinyl sounds better) My recording professor did a demonstration for us (years back) that entailed his extensive collection of every medium he could find off a control sample recording (in this case Steely Dan's Aja album, which in his mind was a pristine and perfect recording) We went through Vinyl album, CD, DAT, reel to reel, 8-track, cassette and PCM F-1, and it was decided that the "digital" mediums with proper EQ sounded the best! He played the "CD" version flat, then with properly added EQ, then followed it up with vinyl, and it was just as deep, and resonant as he wanted to make it! He also compared standard CD's with the "gold audiophile" CD's and there was NO difference, either sonically or graphically!

Seeing that mostly CD's and downloads (other than Mp3 and iTunes versions) are virtually the SAME file set, I find that "tinny sounding CD" comment to be laced with prime USDA BULLSHIT!

My take on the "Zappa downloads" is that the ZFT is going to cheese more money than they deserve out of the foolish young consumer/complete-ists that we are by milking the prices, with little to no overhead, other than uploading and server maintenance! King Crimson is basically in the same boat audience - wise as Zappa, it's a "niche" following, and their prices for a current download is $9.95-Mp3 and $12.95 for FLAC (lossless files) Seeing that Mothermania (for example) is $18.00 for the Mp3 version,and $22.00 for the "lossless" version (that was BEGGED for by the teeming masses since it was originally only available as an Mp3) the writing is on the wall! The KC download I illustrated was for a DOUBLE CD worth of music! The Buffalo D/l is $20 Mp3 and $28 lossless!

Eventually, the ZFT will start releasing, on a pay-to-download basis, the original tapes from the vault transferred directly to lossless digital files. This will be an industry first. No more tinny sounding CDs in cheesy paper covers. We will finally be able to feel the warmth of Zappa's music for the first time since we last heard the band play in concert.

I can't wait

Industry first? Robert Fripp has been doing that for a while now?!?! Over 200 releases by my estimate?!?!

Not to mention that bands like Marillion even had their fan base help them with the costs for a new album ... for which they got a lot more in return later!

It's a new day and time, and the mechanics and costs of a CD and all that will eventually die off and the option left is ... get your own CD and rip it yourself!

The issue here, however, is the RIAA problem and lack of trust ... kinda like how can you trust a thief when you are one, hey? And a lot of folks in that area do not want the digital to get going now for fear they will lose control of their finances. In the end, the real issue is, that the "control" means that these finances won't be in the hands of a record company or a conglomerate ... so you know the advertising is populist crap trying to instill fear in you ... by people that stand to lose money instead of making it off any artist out there ... do you think I really give a shit if Avatar makes 1 Billion or not? ... specially when I am trying to sell my own music, for example?

It's a scare tactic and Gail should know about it by now ... look where the major studios got her and Frank ... and nothing has changed! Yeah ... I see that studio sending a check for 30 cents every month for 200 Motels ... she could make 10,000 times that in one month if she had it in her hands instead!

It has nothing to do with digital or analog ... it has to do with control. Plain and simple! And some egos are bigger than others and are protected by lawyers that can move mountains of money and idiots!

Eventually, the ZFT will start releasing, on a pay-to-download basis, the original tapes from the vault transferred directly to lossless digital files. This will be an industry first. No more tinny sounding CDs in cheesy paper covers. We will finally be able to feel the warmth of Zappa's music for the first time since we last heard the band play in concert.

All that matters to me is the fucking music. Don't care for CD's gathering dust on a shelf. Don't care for manufacturing costs, don't care for distributions costs, warehouse and shipping costs. You can stick all that up your ass.

Access to the music within seconds for a fair fee is Fucking Great.

For all the old farts desperately hanging on to the old ways I give you this advice.

Buy a big external hard drive for your computer. Begin filling it with audio (mp3, flac, wav, whatever) and organize your collection into folders by artist/album/songs. This will help satisfy your collecting mentality. Buy a 2nd hard drive and back the thing up now and then.

Now buy the best Wi-fi music player you can afford. Logitech squeezebox type thing and hook it up to you super dooper sound system where you normaly play your CD's, Plastic, Wax Cylinders etc.

Now enjoy access to your music collection as you have never done before. Trust me, you won't ever look back!

For all the old farts desperately hanging on to the old ways I give you this advice.

Buy a big external hard drive for your computer. Begin filling it with audio (mp3, flac, wav, whatever) and organize your collection into folders by artist/album/songs. This will help satisfy your collecting mentality. Buy a 2nd hard drive and back the thing up now and then.

...and get a third one just in case. And then go to church every fucking sunday and pray that Microsoft Windows remains the standard interface on your computer and other devices....Cause within 10-15 years, you wont be able to play any of your downloads on the available software...or hardware.

Downloads suck big time.

_________________"Welcome to the Frank Zappa Memorial Country Club & BBQ" at wgt.com 45 members and counting.

That will be a problem, that's is why I distrust the digital-only medium. Ringo is a helpful guy, but the fact that digital may be soon replaced with new digital is somewhat frustrating and ultimately depressing.

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