“It’s a little bit of a bullfight, but we take turns. He knows that he’s walking into a room with a person with a strong point of view, and I do too,” she says of working with the rapper on her track “Illuminati.” “I listen to what he has to say, take it in, and he listens to what I say and takes it in. We didn’t agree on everything, but he has good ideas.”

Throughout the interview, Madonna asserts herself, admitting from music to everyday life, being a strong woman can be tough.