Anyone who thinks that a song can be judged on its' chordal complexity obviously don't write songs!

I think you missed the point of that response. The point was that EVERY 90s grunge band was playing three chords and singing the same style of
unintelligible moaning. I have been playing guitar for 35 years and I could not tell one of those bands from the other. And where were the guitar
melodies? The solos? Not that a song needs a solo but most of that crap was lacking a basic hook, even.

And to agree with you a bit, look at U2/BB King, When Loves Comes to Town. Great song. Two chords.

I'm 46 and am an aging metalhead, who came up in the SF area of California in the early to late eighties. My father was from Oklahoma, and nurtured
me on a steady diet of Waylon, Willie, Hank Sr., and Johnny Cash. The music of my peers was thrash, punk, surf music, hard rock, latino rock, soul,
folk, funk - and I can still recall the first time I heard a quirky song on the radio - called "Rappers Delight".

I took it all in - and found the good in every single form of music I've been exposed to since.

Addressing the anti-grunge sentiments. There was a lot of good music that came out of that scene. Alice In Chains for example. The Nirvana stuff? For
a guy who cut his teeth on hardcore and classic punk Nirvana made perfect sense. It's hard to go from Led Zeppelin to Nirvana... easier to get there
from the Stooges or the Ramones.

Electronic music, dubstep included, has been a difficult issue for me. As stated, I predominantly see myself as a metalhead and any old school
metalhead will tell you... synthesizers are bad, mmmkay? This, of course, was a major aspect of our identity back in the day. Duran Duran and A Flock
Of Seagulls used synths - Motorhead did not. The eighties ( at least where I lived ) were basically the fifties all over again... and anyone who's
seen the movie or read the book, "The Outsiders" - knows the score. We were the greasers, the Duran Duran, Nu Wave folks were the Soc's ( preppies
)... so bridging that gulf can be hard. Even then there was a lot of Nu Wave / AOR music that I enjoyed ( Simple Minds, U2, Romeo Void, and others ).
But the full electronic thing is still something I have almost a visceral reaction to. My nephew keeps trying to make me like Skrillex - and I keep
saying that if I wanted to hear that crap, I'd shove a brick into my garbage disposal and have it for free.

But I do bear something in mind - even now. Those country artists I listed earlier? When I was a teenager I loathed them. Now listening to that music
is like going home again. A good bit of the eighties stuff - even the freaking Duran Duran brings back memories now - and I will let it play just so I
can go back in time for a minute. So I understand that a day may come when I find myself a bit older, shoving a brick down my garbage disposal - all
because I want to reconnect to this period when my nephew was on the brink of manhood and trying to make me like something called Skrillex.

That was kind of my point. Many people thought he was extremely untalented, myself included.

Your claim that he or others in that music scene had soul is simply subjective. He wrote crappy poetry and put it to bad music.

Kids today may identify with a new generation of music the same as you do with what you grow up with. But to say its meaningless is a bit presumptuous
of you when people said the same thing about your stuff. These kids today will say the same thing about the next generation of music.

edit on 9-2-2013 by Hopechest because: (no reason given)

So did Jim Morrison and he was considered a God.
There is a difference between being talanted in reality and living with your head up your bum.
Too many talented musicians are passed over for commercial rubbish, you only have to go to the music forum to listen to commercial pastic crap being
passed off as music

by youngsters trying to promote rubbish albums as art, whilst using ATS as a free advertizing forum whilst "sharing their
soul"
Give me a break

Just because it's electronic music doesn't make it easy to produce. It is actually very difficult, as all parts, inspiration, writing, everything
comes from you.

It is very easy to make a crappy sounding electronic song, just as easy as it is to make a crappy rock song, but to make a really good one, that's
just as hard or harder. You should check out some of the gear that people who produce electronic music use, it's far more than a keyboard and a
computer. Most have vintage synths, racks of gear, effects, ect.

The biggest thing that has killed music is business. These major label giants care nothing for art. They keep shoving garbage out onto the airwaves
for a quick buck. But if it's popular, you say? Well, music isn't on the radio because it's popular. It's popular because it's on the radio.
These media giants create and control trends, much in the same way fashion is dictated by the designers. They say short skirts are in this year, then
by golly everyone has to have a short skirt.

Another thing that has negatively impacted music (and I say since the 80s) is technology. I hate to say that, because I love technology. In the 80s,
you had a lot of new digital technology that was as low as 8 bits, so it sounded very cheesy. People were caught up in the things they could do with
this stuff, though. Drum machines made their arrival, sequencers, and finally samplers. In my opninion, this is when things began to nose dive and
never stopped.

Yes, there are still good musicians out there, but they are not being promoted, and likely will not be.

I feel that musicians are missing an opportunity here. Now that we have access to recording equipment that rivals that of the major studios of the
past (at least it can come close), many musicians are making quality recordings on their own, but cannot compete with the money of a major label.
Musicians need to find a way to work together and overthrow the big dogs. With online piracy dealing them a near fatal blow, a campaign should be set
forth to deal a fatal blow the industry and musicians should take control of their business directly. Now is the time.

On a final note, back in the 50s, there was a science fiction short story written which was set in the future. The personality of a famous composer
was brought into this future to compose more music. There were several interesting predictions in the story. There was a "hit calculator" which was
used to create a guaranteed hit by applying a specific formula. There was also musicians creating new works of art by blending together recordings of
the past. There were some other interesting things and the story has a great ending. I highly reccommend it. It is called, "A Work of Art" by James
Blish. Check it out.

Maybe you are a bit ignorant... Music has many faces, dubstep is one of them.

I have to agree, music this days is mostly a lot of crap, but I like dubstep for example.

I love Wagner and Vivaldi, I love Metal (even Death and Blackmetal), I love some Hiphop if it is done well, I love some electronic stuff to chill and
relax.

You don't have to like everything (for example I really hate this mainstream pop stuff with no message), but it is ignorant to say, that it is not
good. Tastes are just different. And I love dubstep, especially Skrillex. Watch the Video to First of the year ( Equinox) and you will even get the
message there

Oh man that made me laugh
As younger men we used to ride our bikes to "The key theatre" We'd get entrance for 50p and cheap beer, it was a biker place and duran duran played
there once.................... I repeat once...................

That is an inaccurate blanket statement. If you have a hard time telling the difference between Soundgarden and Stone Temple Pilots or can't figure
Alice in Chains from Nirvana and you have been playing guitar for 35 years I feel bad for you. I don't know what else to say about that but if you
really have been anything more than an open chord strummer for 35 years and can't tell the tonal differences in the vocals of said bands or the
general style of riffing each musician brings to the table in their respective bands, then the music you must find acceptable must hold its value in
the way or the time it was presented to you; outside factors influencing what you hold close to your heart. Lots of great classic rock songs have 3-5
chords.

And as far as the lack of solos and guitar masturbatory techniques on "EVERY grunge" song, this was purposeful as a statement against the awful self
indulgent music that dominated the charts from the mid 70s through the 80s. I would rather listen to "nevermind" 50 times straight (not a Nirvana
fan either) than a Journey and Boston top 20 countdown. I would rather listen to a drunk hobo hit a broken bongo and slur about what's brought him to
this than any King Crimson or Yes record.

As a guitar player I can appreciate both the force and raw emotion of noise and the technique and tension build up and release of a good solo.

Older people never listened to new music when I was young well not the ones I knew. I vowed not to be like
them and expand and be willing to grow with new music. I didn't want to be stuck in the 80's. I am 43. You should know not to judge a music genre by
one group. There are crap groups in every genre old and new.Here is some dubstep, chill dubstep and glitch hop

Originally posted by notquiteright
The biggest thing that has killed music is business. These major label giants care nothing for art. They keep shoving garbage out onto the airwaves
for a quick buck. But if it's popular, you say? Well, music isn't on the radio because it's popular. It's popular because it's on the radio.
These media giants create and control trends, much in the same way fashion is dictated by the designers. They say short skirts are in this year, then
by golly everyone has to have a short skirt.

This. Radio, like television, isn't there for your enjoyment. It's there to control the masses and push agendas.

Start listening to British Music, not the crappy pop stuff but the folk and rock stuff, particularly stuff that has come out of Scotland like the
View, Biffy Clyro and Paulo Nutuini I could name more but they’re good. They might not exactly be “new” but I do think that in recent years
British Music, in particularly Scottish music has been enjoying something of a resurrection. Ok we don’t have the stones, led zeppelin, the beetles,
queen or the who but its getting better.

Yngwie Malmsteen is an embarrassment to metal, classical music and Sweden.

Sorry, you're not even a strummer. You are a karaoke guitarist! I remember I used to brag about being able to copy Clapton and Van Halen when i was in
my first year of teaching myself how to play! I learned how from a Guitar For Dummies I bought when i was 12. That's not playing the guitar, that is
attempting to emulate somebody else, and I'm sure the part you omit when reciting is the soul and personality of the piece.

Once I developed my musical ear and learned how to move my fingers swiftly enough to play what I wanted to play, I focused less on which pre-written
solos I could skip through and more on how to create the sounds i could hear and feel in my imagination.

If you have always desired to learn chicken pickin', then learn how! I'm sure you can and I know you have the desire or else you wouldn't have
mentioned it. I might try a little cluckin' and pluckin' myself this afternoon.

How many parents in the history of forever have ever liked their children's music? The point is you can't stay current forever, in fact you're not
supposed to. Skrillex is the pinnacle of electronic music, not really my thing either. Maybe you like Korn, but how do you feel about Jon Davis in his
solo DJ project J-Devil? They are very technical musicians, but play equipment more than music theory...there are very intense time signatures but
really no key, well maybe Z flat minor.

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