halabar wrote:And progression suffered as a result. Yep, got it. Can only tell people so many times to get out of the pools, and which slime to target.

Social raiding has never really been about progression...

If social raiding is not about progression why so many people QQ as soon as a boss can't be facerolled by social guilds?

theckhd wrote:Fuck no, we've seen what you do to guilds. Just imagine what you could do to an entire country. Just visiting the US might be enough to make the southern states try to secede again.

halabar wrote:Noo.. you don't realize the problem. Worldie was to negative guild breaking energy like Bolvar is to the Scourge. If Worldie is removed, than someone must pick up that mantle, otherwise that negative guild breaking energy will run rampant, destroying all the servers.

I believe Blizzard defines "social" and "casual" raiding as the same, even though we know it aint. Though, the big majority of the so called "social guild to raid with friends" goes emo when they can't faceroll a boss within the first week of the launch and blames Blizzard for having made them too hard and not cather casuals enough.

From my understanding from blizzard anyone who isn't in a progress raiding guild is "casual". Doesn't matter if he good or bad, raids with friends or just LFR.

Hell they are convinced LFR is a social tool even though I've never seen something less social than that in WoW.

theckhd wrote:Fuck no, we've seen what you do to guilds. Just imagine what you could do to an entire country. Just visiting the US might be enough to make the southern states try to secede again.

halabar wrote:Noo.. you don't realize the problem. Worldie was to negative guild breaking energy like Bolvar is to the Scourge. If Worldie is removed, than someone must pick up that mantle, otherwise that negative guild breaking energy will run rampant, destroying all the servers.

Worldie wrote:Hell they are convinced LFR is a social tool even though I've never seen something less social than that in WoW.

QFT

Fetzie wrote:The Defias Brotherhood is back, and this time they are acting as racketeers in Goldshire. Anybody wishing to dance for money must now pay them protection money or be charged triple the normal amount when repairing.

Fetzie wrote:The Defias Brotherhood is back, and this time they are acting as racketeers in Goldshire. Anybody wishing to dance for money must now pay them protection money or be charged triple the normal amount when repairing.

So, AFTER I upgrade my 502 Voice of the Quillen, the 502 Drumu xbow drops, which would help, since I'm way over on hit, and can't get rid of it all.

THEN, I do the heroic scenario, and I get the 516 Panderan Xbow of the Stormblast (hit/crit), which at that point, I say screw it and update that xbow. So 1000 total valor blown, but a weapon upgrade. It's not ideal as in it's upgrade form it provides ~710 weapon dps over the upgraded Voice, but is ~26 Agi less (and ~100 more crit). I think that's still an upgrade, even for BM. (I can't check MrRobot or FemaleDwarf yet, as they don't have those weapons listed yet). With either weapon I'm way over the hitcap and can't do a thing about it. I could upgrade the Drumu bow which has no hit, but that would be yet another 500 valor, and that could be better spend on another upgrade.

Now I'm wait for ToT tomorrow night to see if the 522/528 shared boss loot bow drops...

Amirya wrote:... because everyone needs a Catagonskin rug.

twinkfist wrote:i feel bad for the Mogu...having to deal with alcoholic bears.

(LFR, the two bat-packs before Tortos. Pulled both at once. The #1 damage Pali was the guy tanking them all. Had to rez my pet during that as it drew aggro from EVERYTHING at one point. Did I mention that Blink Strikes + the Beast Cleave buff is dumb?)

Most people want the wealth produced by a society with limited government distributed to them more generously by bigger government.

halabar wrote:And progression suffered as a result. Yep, got it. Can only tell people so many times to get out of the pools, and which slime to target.

Social raiding has never really been about progression...

If social raiding is not about progression why so many people QQ as soon as a boss can't be facerolled by social guilds?

KysenMurrin wrote:All raiding is about progression, except for the very top end of heroic raiding where progression is pretty much guaranteed and it's about the race.

not to dwell on it - but the first thing (the QQ) is unavoidable now. That said, I'm pretty sure blizzard doesn't mind a few tears until they have actual data of unintended roadblocks, or simply decide it's time to remove them (Elegon, Garalon). For the second: I think the emphasis on rate of progression is what differentiates groups. If you have a lot of people who'll bail and go to a faster guild because your social guild isn't progressing fast enough for their tastes, I wouldn't call them social raiders.

That said, I think at some point you can only tune content so much. If a very large percentage of your group can't grasp the fundamental mechanics of a fight even with a few weeks (and presumably a number of attempts each night) of trying, I'd argue that is a strong indicator that your group isn't ready to raid at that level, and if that level is the lowest, then they aren't ready to raid. And frankly, that's gotta happen at some point... there's just too many people in this game for everything to be for everybody.

The idea of having a lower tuned 10 man, but allowing up to 15 people could be a possible solution (should still drop the same amount of loot as a 10 man though, IMO), but I feel like if you do it with 10+ in your group, you should get LFR-level drops (or maybe 1/4 upgraded LFR), while if you do it with 10 or less you should get 2/4 upgraded LFR, just so this doesn't become more widely used as a 'AFK for upgrades' method.

Tonight I had a dream, where I was in a soccer field, then I clicked a corner flag, and I learned triple specialization.

When I woke up I was like "dafuq did I just dream?"

theckhd wrote:Fuck no, we've seen what you do to guilds. Just imagine what you could do to an entire country. Just visiting the US might be enough to make the southern states try to secede again.

halabar wrote:Noo.. you don't realize the problem. Worldie was to negative guild breaking energy like Bolvar is to the Scourge. If Worldie is removed, than someone must pick up that mantle, otherwise that negative guild breaking energy will run rampant, destroying all the servers.

Tonight I had a dream, where I was in a soccer field, then I clicked a corner flag, and I learned triple specialization.

When I woke up I was like "dafuq did I just dream?"

Wasn't there a datamined triple spec on the 5.3 ptr at some point? Maybe it made it in, and the only way to get it is to click a flag on that game field in the Goblin starting area. And you must have dual spec already.

I occasionally compliment with people if their performance is particularly good or if their transmog is interesting!

Era wrote:

Worldie wrote:Speaking about amusements:

Tonight I had a dream, where I was in a soccer field, then I clicked a corner flag, and I learned triple specialization.

When I woke up I was like "dafuq did I just dream?"

So you dreamt you could play both offence, defence and keeper?

No, in the dream I was clearly my gnome priest and specced my third spec Holy after this.

No clue wtf my gnome was doing in a soccer field with real people.

theckhd wrote:Fuck no, we've seen what you do to guilds. Just imagine what you could do to an entire country. Just visiting the US might be enough to make the southern states try to secede again.

halabar wrote:Noo.. you don't realize the problem. Worldie was to negative guild breaking energy like Bolvar is to the Scourge. If Worldie is removed, than someone must pick up that mantle, otherwise that negative guild breaking energy will run rampant, destroying all the servers.

(LFR, the two bat-packs before Tortos. Pulled both at once. The #1 damage Pali was the guy tanking them all. Had to rez my pet during that as it drew aggro from EVERYTHING at one point. Did I mention that Blink Strikes + the Beast Cleave buff is dumb?)

Those numbers, while big, don't look any bigger than SV AOE-fest, so hopefully big numbers will stay. Those numbers also still aren't bigger than ele shammy AOE-fest either.

I know, it's just hard for a BMer to consider the possibility of doing good AOE..

I haven't tried the AOE yet, I was testing my normal rotation with the changes.

Side note.. hunters need to click off the AoTH buff, and reapply it, to get the buff. I did one whole LFR wing before I realized that I still had the old version of the buff up.

Amirya wrote:... because everyone needs a Catagonskin rug.

twinkfist wrote:i feel bad for the Mogu...having to deal with alcoholic bears.

halabar wrote:I know, it's just hard for a BMer to consider the possibility of doing good AOE..

Good... AoE? Huh? What is this language you're speaking?

I dunno - I've seen good numbers from SV and ELE on those before, but nothing near that. Only thing I've ever seen pull 300k+ on those packs are Pali and Monk tanks. *shrug*

Dumb Aside: I need a name for the Pink Flamingo. I'm awful with names and usually just use the in-game ones. Was using the purple flamingo before ("Torranche"), but now I actually have stable space again and can have both colors. The pink one is just "Deviate Plainstrider" or somesuch though so I have to come up with something else for it.

Dumb Amusement: Stampede-ing with 5 differently-colored Tallstriders, just for the lulz. Could also do that with all four Portents (Pocket Stone Guards!)

Most people want the wealth produced by a society with limited government distributed to them more generously by bigger government.

halabar wrote:I know, it's just hard for a BMer to consider the possibility of doing good AOE..

Good... AoE? Huh? What is this language you're speaking?

I dunno - I've seen good numbers from SV and ELE on those before, but nothing near that. Only thing I've ever seen pull 300k+ on those packs are Pali and Monk tanks. *shrug*

Dumb Aside: I need a name for the Pink Flamingo. I'm awful with names and usually just use the in-game ones. Was using the purple flamingo before ("Torranche"), but now I actually have stable space again and can have both colors. The pink one is just "Deviate Plainstrider" or somesuch though so I have to come up with something else for it.

Dumb Amusement: Stampede-ing with 5 differently-colored Tallstriders, just for the lulz. Could also do that with all four Portents (Pocket Stone Guards!)