My siblings and I really have no problems with criticism. One of the in-laws remarked to us at a family gathering, "It is amazing how you all can say anything you want and nobody ever gets mad. With my family we stopped talking to each other years ago based on even more trivial things."

Most threads asking this question have an excruciating amount of detail so we can very easily say DON'T DO IT. But I love the simplicity of your post. It invites the "it depends" answer. If the financial mistake is that they paying hefty commissions buying Vanguard mutual funds at Fidelity, I think it is reasonable to advise them on ways to avoid those commissions. If the mistake is they are paying too much money for an inferior hamburger and you know where they can get a better one, go for it.

Can you present the information as: "here's what I've done with my own money," and then let them decide? I like to tell people that they have options and here's what I do, and then leave it at that. If they want to know more, they can ask me.

"Financial Mistake" is a vague term. Are they putting their money into mutual funds with a 0.5% expense ratio, or are they investing in every IPO that comes down the road or in every stock anyone gives them a tip on? Are they making choices that can wipe out their net worth, or are they making choices that you think may have some marginal impact on their returns?

Depends on what a "financial mistake" is? I have warned people not to park at the parking garage directly across from a venue because I knew the one down the street was half price. But I would probably not bring up something major unsolicited with a friend or distant family.

In the rare circumstance that I bring something up unsolicited, I usually frame it as an earnest question. "What makes this higher fee active fund worth investing in over a lower cost index fund?" Believe it or not, I often get an "I don't know" or a "because he said it is better" answer and the person begins to question it him/herself without me inquiring further. With immediate family (dependents and spouse), I would less so "tell" them they are making a mistake and more so discuss their decisions and try to make a good decision together (because that is what families do).

"Financial Mistake" is a vague term. Are they putting their money into mutual funds with a 0.5% expense ratio, or are they investing in every IPO that comes down the road or in every stock anyone gives them a tip on? Are they making choices that can wipe out their net worth, or are they making choices that you think may have some marginal impact on their returns?

To add to the list

Invested with EJ?
Not investing
Loads of Debt?

I do wish I would have pushed my Dad into putting 10% of his IRA into stocks in 1990’s. As you may have guessed it is all in bonds. Mom is ok (dad died), but more money would give her more choices of where to live.

No and I don't even really give advice even requested. I might point to a few books, or more ideally, Bill Bernstein's If You Can.

1) Most people don't read, and those that do but know nothing of investing or personal finance do not want to read about it. The shorter the better.

2) People who come asking for advice on investing are asking because they generally know nothing. You don't want to be in the position of explaining to them what to do and then being "responsible" when their money doesn't just increase every single day.

If they did this and still asked for help I would assist them maybe opening up a brokerage account and showing them how to actually buy and sell securities, but again leaving them to their own devices.

If someone is making a stupid decision like leasing a car they can't afford or buying a house they can't afford...well it's not my position to tell someone how to lead their life.

Can you present the information as: "here's what I've done with my own money," and then let them decide? I like to tell people that they have options and here's what I do, and then leave it at that. If they want to know more, they can ask me.

^^ THIS is what you should say. Don't use the phrase "financial mistake."

In my experience, telling people about a better way to invest does not convince them to change anything. So, it is not worth the effort. They have their "guy" and they are happy with him. They say "I'm making money, so I am satisfied".

As you can see, asking general questions only gets you general answers. can you give us the example you're wrestling with so we can determine if it might/might not be wise? Context and details matter. As you can see, there are no broad brush strokes with most things in life. Give us the deets as the youngins say.

"Invest we must." -- Jack Bogle |
“The purpose of investing is not to simply optimise returns and make yourself rich. The purpose is not to die poor.” -- William Bernstein

My siblings and I really have no problems with criticism. One of the in-laws remarked to us at a family gathering, "It is amazing how you all can say anything you want and nobody ever gets mad. With my family we stopped talking to each other years ago based on even more trivial things."

So I would say, "Have at it."

My family , myself,children and sister, give and receive advice from each other without any problem. It may be appreciated or ignored , but it doesn t seem to offend.

Never give an opinion on anything unless it’s asked for. The only caveat is when if will affect me.

For example,I will voice my opinion if my parents were making financial mistakes that will potentially bankrupt them resulting in me having to financially support them. Also to include a course of action and condition that if they don't follow the course, I won't be able to help in the future.

Last edited by ddurrett896 on Fri Aug 10, 2018 8:01 am, edited 1 time in total.

My brother in law makes really good money working for a company that legally assists those who haven't paid their taxes by representing them in IRS situations. In other words, mostly deadbeats that have screwed up their financial lives, and now the IRS has frozen assets.
My BIL blows through his cash like crazy and is always talking about crazy investment schemes. The other day he said he will be able to double his money in just 3 months. He learned about a secret investment through one of his clients that owes the IRS almost 500k.
I don't ever comment on his schemes but this time I told him I thought he was making a mistake. I bet he will go through with this "investment."

My wife makes fun of me for trying to explain same simple investing concepts to everybody including parents. Now I've stopped trying,unless someone asks. Its pains me to see my father's effective tax rate, but its his money.

As you can see, asking general questions only gets you general answers. can you give us the example you're wrestling with so we can determine if it might/might not be wise? Context and details matter. As you can see, there are no broad brush strokes with most things in life. Give us the deets as the youngins say.

A few examples (this list does not pertain to a single person):
Monthly spending more than what he's making
Relying on parents for big purchases, cars, homes, etc
Listening to financial media for stock picking
Investing in active funds with >1% expense ratio, bitcoins, commodities
Always saying stock market is overvalued

I'm okay with getting general answers. From your success stories, I'll strategy how to approach each person.

It is probably too late to change their minds at this point. Better way is if they are really close you would have conversations with them about the things you have learned on your, hopefully successful, financial path. I was greatful, appreciative, and receptive of people who gave me advice when I was starting out. Don’t know how I would have handled it years down my journey.

This is a tough one and you should accept going in that you likely won't have much impact on their decision.

Having said that, it may depend on how you came about knowing what they were doing. If they told you, then the door is more open for a "hey, what is your thinking in doing....have you considered other options like x,y,z".

If you found out from someone else, they it may be much harder and more awkward to broach the entire topic.

Tread carefully and whatever you do bring it up in as much of a non-confrontational manner as possible. If they push back, drop it immediately and change the subject.

My siblings and I really have no problems with criticism. One of the in-laws remarked to us at a family gathering, "It is amazing how you all can say anything you want and nobody ever gets mad. With my family we stopped talking to each other years ago based on even more trivial things."

So I would say, "Have at it."

My family , myself,children and sister, give and receive advice from each other without any problem. It may be appreciated or ignored , but it doesn t seem to offend.

Can you present the information as: "here's what I've done with my own money," and then let them decide? I like to tell people that they have options and here's what I do, and then leave it at that. If they want to know more, they can ask me.

Giving advice is always problematic... Ive tried this approach as well and even that bit me... Got into a discussion at work with colleagues about the options in our 401k and I was saying how I just pick from the nice vanguard institutional index options we have and somebody decided to make it their mission in life to prove I was 'wrong' and how hedge funds can beat the market due to 'liquidity.'

Got so bad I finally had to just point him to the vanguard whitepaper on indexing and an article about the buffet bet and then he went on about how their methodology is flawed and he can beat it. But he still drives to work every day with the rest of us wage slaves, in spite of the claimed market beating genius.

Now I keep my mouth shut unless I am directly asked. From time to time I will voyeuristicly look though all the company audit filings for the 401k plan. Majority of folks are just in the default option (an American balanced fund), and well over half the total plan assets are in the few expensive active funds (American/JPM/Oppenheimer/Loomis/etc) - in spite of the fact we have a bunch of fantastic vanguard options (VINIX/VSCIX/VTSNX/VBTIX/VGSLX).

Most people don't know.
They don't want to know.
And they definitely don't want to be told, unsolicited.

Last edited by jharkin on Fri Aug 10, 2018 8:45 am, edited 2 times in total.

Can you present the information as: "here's what I've done with my own money," and then let them decide? I like to tell people that they have options and here's what I do, and then leave it at that. If they want to know more, they can ask me.

It depends on the severity of the financial mistake and the relationship you have with the person. But even then, it needs to be done gingerly. This is just me, but if I knew a close friend/relative was about to make a serious financial mistake, I would risk harming the relationship to help them avert the mistake.

If it comes up you can describe your finances. People are an average of the people they know, but what if nobody ever talks about money? Part of the reason I maxed out my retirement accounts in my early twenties is other similar aged employees and I would discuss what percent we were putting into our 401k and how much we put into our roth.

I wouldn't say what your friends should do or criticize any of their decisions, unless you want them to stop inviting you over.

Do you give your friends parenting advice if you think they are about to make a mistake with their children?

Do you give your friends religious advice if you think they are about to make a mistake with their immortal soul?

Do you give your friends political advice if you think they are about to vote for the wrong person?

Would you want your friends to give you advice about the above (all of which are probably more important than money) if they thought you were making a mistake?

Answer to first 3. No, no, no. I don't talk about subjects that I don't know much about. OTOH, I teach finance for a living.
Answer to the last. Yes, if they know what they are talking about. I gather all information and make decisions later on my own.

Last edited by acegolfer on Fri Aug 10, 2018 8:20 am, edited 1 time in total.

I was on one of my epic anti Edward Jones rants with the VP of Engineering when the senior accountant walked up. Being the oblivious person I am, I totally missed the purpose of the facial expressions, elbow to the ribs and the kick to the shins by the VP. Not to mention the angry facial expressions, body language and hostility emanating from the accountant.

The VP of Engineering later informed me that the senior accountant was 100% invested in EJ. The accountant never talked to me again for the remainder of my time at the company.

I have a reputation as being smart with money. Yet no one has ever asked me for financial advice. Friends and Family members have made grave financial mistakes. Money is an odd force in people's lives, meshed into their personality and experiences. I find it much better for peace of mind to not worry about others and to focus on my own finances.

I gave my friends and family members a copy of The Boglehead's Guide to Investing. I doubt any read it.

Never give an opinion on anything unless it’s asked for. The only caveat is when if will affect me.

For example,I will voice my opinion if my parents were making financial mistakes that will potentially bankrupt them resulting in me having to financially support them. Also to include a course of action and condition that if they don't follow the course, I won't be able to help in the future.

It's a slippery slope, though. If tax dollars are paying for someone's healthcare, should you as a taxpayer share your opinion that they shouldn't be smoking?

it seems like you are asking for problem. Some of Tax info I talk with co-workers has brought me headaches. I try to tell them it's not always about how much your refund check comes out too. They also love to mention how Overtime is not worth it because of taxes. I just try making random remarks to make them think what they are saying.

Example:
Even if they tax my overtime I still see more $$$.
I'll agree how taxes are high but then make a comment about how taxes are at the lowest rate.

Do you give your friends parenting advice if you think they are about to make a mistake with their children?

Do you give your friends religious advice if you think they are about to make a mistake with their immortal soul?

Do you give your friends political advice if you think they are about to vote for the wrong person?

Would you want your friends to give you advice about the above (all of which are probably more important than money) if they thought you were making a mistake?

Answer to first 3. No, no, no. I don't talk about subjects that I don't know much about. OTOH, I teach finance for a living. Answer to the last. Yes, if they know what they are talking about. I gather all information and make decisions later on my own.

If you mean you teach financial literacy for a living, then this may mean your advice, even unsolicited, might be accepted and be of some benefit. Are they aware of your profession?

I told my family to not invest in cryptos in December of last year, at least not more than they could throw in the trash. None of them listened, and all of them lost money. (I've posted multiple times on BH that I also lost $500, which I can't just throw away but it didn't hurt.) This was solicited advise, as they were hyping it all up. I don't think I hurt their feelings.

I don't tell people they're making a "mistake". It's more an offer to help if they'd ever like it, and usually comes after they bring up finances one or two times. One family member struggles with loans and prioritizing paying off debt. I've offered several times to sit with them after hearing their complaints. Another struggles with a young family and relatively low income. I've offered to help make a budget and give them overarching goals. Neither have taken me up on the offer, but we're still very close.

Problem is: money has an important behavioral and habitual aspect to it, and people can get very defensive about their mistakes/"habits" (addictions?). Plus these are learned behaviors a lot of the time, and those aren't changed with a seemingly helpful 5 minutes convo. A lot of people post here about trying to help family members (in an unsolicited manner), and it doesn't usually turn out well.

It's almost as bad as talking about religion or politics, but like you with finance I have no problem talking about religion with people. Just not here!

Most people think they know how to invest their money better than you do. However, once in a while you can be of significant help.

Five years ago, I was visiting a colleague of mine in Chicago, and the subject of money and investing came up. I knew she had a lot more money than I do. She, her husband, and I were eating pizza in her kitchen.

When she told me that she has "a guy" who takes care of her investments, I took a bold step and asked her, "Cheryl, can I ask you a personal financial question?" She laughed and said, "Sure."

"Do you have over a million dollars invested with this guy?" She got serious and said, "Yes."

"What if I told you that if you put all your investments in Vanguard, you could probably save enough in a year or two to re-do your kitchen." This got her attention, and she wanted to know how. I gave her a back-of-the-envelope scenario of the expense ratio figures. She said, "Can I get back to you?"

That night she called me in my hotel and asked for specifics. I told her to show me where the guy had her invested, and she sent me a statement as an email attachment. He had her invested in 24 different mutual funds! No wonder she left it all to him.

In an hour or so I put together a spreadsheet listing all her funds and the e.r. for each, and totaled the fees (not counting his commission, which was 1 or 2% a year).

Then I indicated how much a 4 fund, 60/40 Vanguard portfolio would cost. I was right--she'd save enough in a year or two to re-do her kitchen.

She called me a few days later and said she'd told her financial guy that she was transferring everything to Vanguard. Which she did.

So, even though this was a rare occurrence, miracles do happen. I still feel good about it and she still thanks me. (I don't know if she re-did her kitchen.)

Last edited by Jazztonight on Fri Aug 10, 2018 10:39 am, edited 1 time in total.

If we are talking about finance/investments in general or someone asks a specific question, I generally say 'this is what I do' or 'this is what I would do in that situation' and then let the conversation go from there. If they ask for more specifics then we can get into a deeper discussion about approaches to investing or specifics of a particular situation.

But it's always in the context of what I do or what I would do, not what they should do.