Had some ideas for abilities to add. These are designed to aid Magi's attacks outside retardation while providing limited benefit in Retardation due to timing factors.

Infuse <element>: Saturates the [battle]staff with the element, which is then transferred to the target on-hit. Could also be infused directly into the target but I think the two-step process balances better for retardation. Infusing adds a level of the element's influence into the target. Each level will fade after 18 seconds of contact (max 6 levels), and while above 3 levels, a particular effect is granted (similar to tempered humours). (3s BAL on the ability) Effects as follows:

So basically, Earth aids with prep, fittingly. Water aids with afflictions that help damage/hinder. Fire aids in hindering and slowing healing. Air -- as usual -- helps bypass defenses and escapes.

We've also got Erode, Lightning, and Dissonance that strip defenses. We're better strippers (lol) than almost any other class. Adding more ways to capitalize on missing defenses would be cool. So instead of chasing herbs/salves for purposes of afflicting, it's just to keep defenses down to make bigger damage and things.

So if you Infuse Water in someone, deepfreeze (~3.0 with Aldar) will consume 4s of target's salve balance instead of 2s. And since infuse only affects one target it doesn't make the freeze any more useful against multiple opponents. Normal freeze is about 2.3 with Aldar, so it'd actually be slower than the salve balance. Staffstrike is 3.0 balance.

The only tricky thing is ablaze, the ablaze affliction is so easy to cure that it has no particular use outside retardation. Magi have two ways to give the aff but no way to capitalize on it. Maybe keeping a target ablaze could negate their frost defense?

I was referring to the Healing skillset, when I said "Healing". Not Rite of Healing. And a lock implies not being able to get "unlocked", which doesn't apply to Sylvan, Apostate, Druid, Paladin, Shaman, or Sylvan. Only Priest and Magi have passive healing that doesn't wear off.

I'd almost like to see staff fighting, to give a physical element. Staffstrike feels like a move in that direction, especially considering that it's balance based rather than eq.

Had some ideas for abilities to add. These are designed to aid Magi's attacks outside retardation while providing limited benefit in Retardation due to timing factors.

Infuse <element>: Saturates the [battle]staff with the element, which is then transferred to the target on-hit. Could also be infused directly into the target but I think the two-step process balances better for retardation. Infusing adds a level of the element's influence into the target. Each level will fade after 18 seconds of contact (max 6 levels), and while above 3 levels, a particular effect is granted (similar to tempered humours). (3s BAL on the ability) Effects as follows:

Magi have a few elevation-based techniques that could be made part of additional kill strategies, so that's the basis for those.

To give you some fair feedback:

Earth: Okay, I guess.Water: Nah, too much of an effect. Caloric + mending break is a 4s salve application with this and you can do that freely on one temper thing. Too strong.Fire: Nope, free transfix (see old epidermal illusion) was retarded.Air: This one is not a terrible idea, but at the same time, it sort of is, since it transforms adduction into an unavoidable beckon tick on an unmassed person, which is pretty horseshit.

Cyclone & Thunderbolt: Forced synergy between two skills is so pointless. May as well just make the same ability do both things.

If you genuinely lock someone and apply voyria, it's basically impossible (I think both of those things are 15 second ticks, if this is the case then it is impossible) for passive regen to cure both voyria and a lock affliction before you get balance and use an instakill, or relapse them out.

Passive healing is fine since the changes.

Cascades of quicksilver light streak across the firmament as the celestial voice of Ourania intones, "Oh Jarrod..."

You can lock long enough for a kill, that's a fact. And yeah, I agree with you that passive curing is fine, aside from the lack of 3rd person message on most of them.

edit: Angel care is like 10-30 second random, RoH is like 7-20 second random, and necklace of purity is a fixed 10 second, but only cures venom afflictions (which actually makes it better even better, vs serpents).

The same situations where other active curing can't be used i.e. crippled/broken arms, paralysed and prone? The only difference is that you need simultaneity up to use it, which is not all that much of a prerequisite. It's definitely one of the better active curing abilities. Not that I think this is a reason for Magi to not have necklace, it makes sense given retardation, but Magi's are pretty decent vs afflictions really.

Magi is harder to lock than most, but it's far from impossible. Personally however, I find the concept of hidden passive curing to be a little OP. Serpent combat (like any other affliction class) relies on momentum, and having something like rite of healing, panacea, necklace, etc. eat up something key like asthma or impatience can destroy massive setups, without even showing that something was cured. If a message was shown, at least I'd know that -something- went away, or in most cases, how many things went away, during a setup.

I don't think magi would be losing anything by having necklace/bloodboil have a 3rd party message, and same goes for all other passives. I doubt them being invisible was ever intentionally even part of their design, and I'm in favor of fixing it if so.

I'd almost like to see staff fighting, to give a physical element. Staffstrike feels like a move in that direction, especially considering that it's balance based rather than eq.

Had some ideas for abilities to add. These are designed to aid Magi's attacks outside retardation while providing limited benefit in Retardation due to timing factors.

Infuse <element>: Saturates the [battle]staff with the element, which is then transferred to the target on-hit. Could also be infused directly into the target but I think the two-step process balances better for retardation. Infusing adds a level of the element's influence into the target. Each level will fade after 18 seconds of contact (max 6 levels), and while above 3 levels, a particular effect is granted (similar to tempered humours). (3s BAL on the ability) Effects as follows:

Magi have a few elevation-based techniques that could be made part of additional kill strategies, so that's the basis for those.

To give you some fair feedback:

Earth: Okay, I guess.Water: Nah, too much of an effect. Caloric + mending break is a 4s salve application with this and you can do that freely on one temper thing. Too strong.Fire: Nope, free transfix (see old epidermal illusion) was retarded.Air: This one is not a terrible idea, but at the same time, it sort of is, since it transforms adduction into an unavoidable beckon tick on an unmassed person, which is pretty horseshit.

Cyclone & Thunderbolt: Forced synergy between two skills is so pointless. May as well just make the same ability do both things.

Appreciate the feedback, but each of these requires 3 infusions of the element and maintaining above that level for the effect to work. Fire's intended to give a free transfix because it's currently impossible outside of retardation. Water also requires those levels, which again fade after 18 seconds total (or 9s after your 3rd balance recovery from infusing). And yeah, the air version is to negate mass (not remove) so that adduction is not a pointless vibe and to be able to use the proposed Cyclone on people who are infused or unmassed.

You also can't do a caloric and mending break at the same time. I noted that restoration shouldn't be affected, so the best you could do is the standard staffstrike water to get your lvl2 break. It would slow down other mending cures slightly but only while the infusion remains above 3 levels. Their resto apply consumes about 4s of salve balance (3 of which you're offbal from staffstrike) so in your remaining 5 seconds of their double salve effect you could probably deepfreeze (3.65 diadem) and get a disrupt before the infusion wears off completely, but again, it's only hindering.

It's also double the prep time on your end and probably doesn't have any more effect than if you'd prepped 2 limbs instead.

If you try to make use of it in retardation...

Infuse earth, maybe still valid if your vibes' proning didn't already prevent the use of parry.

Infuse water, deepfreeze and the magi's other attacks should already outpace salve curing if he's smart

Infuse fire, 3 seconds versus transifx (2.2 diadem)

Infuse air, again, just gives adduction validity, this one might be smart in retardation since they'll want to tumble at some point

But in general, the 3 seconds of adding an infuse while in retardation is probably better served by just transfix/deepfreeze/damage or brazier. If you PREP with infusions, it's the same balance as 3 staffstrikes which are the current prep for retardation. The difference being that infusions would wear off.

These ideas were designed to benefit non-retardation damage in the way of hindering that could slow limb curing or counter tumbling so that holocausts and such can be used strategically rather than spamming them and hoping they enter your fogged room at the right time. Everything a Magi does revolves around staying in the same room, but top tiers tend to fight with a monolith in every adjacent room so they can always tumble out safely. That's the 1v1 reason that adduction needs power.

The alternative is to suggest what combat skill is going to replace Enchantment in a balanced way. But I'm primarily addressing multi-enemy things (again, first post) right now.

I'll follow up with 3rd skill ideas later but I figured I'd get this stuff out of the way to see where people feel Magi is at.

@Xith, if you can't look at your ideas and have some notion of what's 'enormous', or rather what should be considered unreasonably powerful, I don't think @Cooper is going to be able to explain it to you.

See but that's a cop-out response. If someone asks "explain why I'm wrong", you can either explain it or say "I'm not tellin" and they have to assume you're the one spewing bull.

Some skills were explained why they would be overpowered, I acknowledged those and moved on to refining ideas and coming up with new ones.

You'll notice that in movie reviews, for example, critics don't just say "That film was so bad why are you even making films?" They dissect it and give paragraphs of basis for their opinions.

I don't need a novel, but a post that says "I'm not even gunna explain why this so bad" does nothing for me, the thread, the game, and not really anything for you except to look self-assured, no matter how many members of your boy band Like or Agree the post.

@Xith - I'm not going to go through all your suggestions and point out why they are overpowered and not balanced in the slightest, necessary, or why the entire premise of your suggestions is wrong (hint: Magi are already the strongest in the game at fighting/damaging/hindering multiple people by a long shot and are already amazing at this). You should have a better understanding of the strengths of your class and combat in general before suggesting massive, sweeping changes to a class.