I ignored candidates if I could not obtain their clear pictures and also those with non-excessive masculinization, but it should be clear that the prevalence of women with masculinized faces is non-trivial.

The following six women are not easily assigned to the female sex based on their face pictures.

If the four women immediately above do not obtain the top four slots and Ms. Melomud does not win the crown, then I hope that the judges have their homes infested by cockroaches and other vermin. Amen!

Comments

I do not necessarily think that Miss Anna Melomud should win. Miss Universe contestants are judged not just on feminine beauty but also on other aspects like how well they answer the questions the judges ask them.

samantha johnson is a friend of mine-- and she is closely assigned to the female sex when seen by other people--- maybe not you. she is of asian heritage so has stronger features(filipino, irish, black). she also has the most killer figure ---like ever. typically, she is the center of a party not because she is a n awesome dancer, etc, but because she is absolutely gorgeous.so i think the general public would like her just fine.as a side note, her chest is REAL. it grew in over time like all the other girls.

Brenda: You are right that answers to questions count. However, all the participants are state-level champs, i.e., they can provide decent answers. If Ms. Melomud were outcompeted by, say, one of the three women shown immediately above her because of how well she answers questions, it would not be much of a problem, but to see a masculinized woman outcompete a feminine one would be outrageous. On the other hand, the organizers of the pageant know that they need to throw in a few feminine women and occasionally let some win in order to maintain public interest. Since last year’s winner, Tara Conner, happens to be masculine, and the one before her, Chelsey Cooley, not feminine either, there is a chance that this year’s winner may be feminine.

Kristin: Samantha Johnson has an obviously manly face. It looks like she has prominent breasts, and although I have not seen her physique, it is unlikely that it is feminine. I can understand someone like Samantha attracting attention at a party. I would myself be staring at her, but then if one attends a general social gathering and comes across a long-haired man(?) with female breasts, dressed in women’s clothing, then it would be difficult to not stare at least initially.

Sarah: Miss USA is about who is the most beautiful? Haven’t you seen an extensive discussion of the looks of the previous Miss USA, Tara Conner, within this site? Who finds a fake and unfeminine woman like her beautiful enough to be designated Miss USA? Besides, femininity is a very powerful correlate of beauty in women, i.e., it would be very important if the Miss USA pageant were about what the general public finds to be beautiful. I am not going to defend the looks of Ms. Melomud since I haven’t seen clear pictures of her, but Rachel Smith is an unattractive woman. If she were white, I would have addressed her looks right after she had won, but finding a suitable ethnic match is a pain and the matter is not a priority. So what if Alla isn’t feminine enough? You have already pointed out my comment that femininity does not necessarily equal attractiveness, i.e., somewhat masculinized women can look good. Alla looks better than the masculinized women above her.

Tara Conner won the crown because that is what most people find to be beautiful (at least here in the U.S., anyways.) You may not agree, and even I may not agree, but that is the general consensus.

Rachel Smith is also considered beautiful in most peoples' eyes. YOUR opinion doesn't matter, and no, it isn't factual information that she is unattractive. Again, YOUR opinion. Get over yourself. You are not the general population. You are just ONE guy with too much time on his hands.

Also, where you listed the 4 women you thought were the most attractive, you put that it was a "general public perspective." Did you take a poll from the general public? Was there something I missed?

I would not have a problem at all and wouldn't even bother commenting if you had stated this site was only YOUR opinion, but you have commented time and time again that you actually really believe this is factual. Just because you cited some studies you found doesn't make anything about this factual at all. Your website is certainly not very informative nor is it the general view of most men. It's just a very loooong rant.

Sarah: Don’t be under any delusions regarding Tara Conner. Go through her entries within this site: Part 1, Part 2. The studies regarding correlates of beauty, examples of feminine and attractive women shown within this site and the comparisons make a compelling case for what the public finds to be attractive looks, and these are nowhere close to the looks of Ms. Conner. I didn’t take a poll of people regarding how attractive they find Rachel Smith, but this is hardly necessary; just look at her. The typical person who takes a good look at the contestants shown above should immediately realize that the contest these women participated in had little to do with beauty as it is understood by most people.

So you would not bother commenting if I had stated that this site is my opinion? Why bother to comment at all if it is obvious to you that this site is merely someone’s opinion? Shouldn’t this be obvious to others, too? And, how are your comments going to prevent people from being mislead by this site given that they are devoid of scientific counter arguments?

It SHOULD be obvious to others that your "informational" website is complete bullshit, but unfortunately, there are dumb little girls on here who actually take your ridiculous theories to heart. You attack fashion designers for promoting anorexia and other eating disorders, yet you're also promoting the idea that if a woman doesn't have big boobs, a tiny waist, round ass, and childish face, she is not feminine enough. You're just as bad as these fashion designers you look down on, if not worse.

Sarah: Why you are you pissed by “bulls**it”? Shouldn’t most people see B.S. for what it is? Why don’t you set up a website to refute this site line by line and do a favor to the "dumb girls" who are mislead by this site? I’ll gladly link to it.

On the other hand, it should be clear that this site is not about how women are supposed to look like. It is about promoting feminine beauty in miscellaneous modeling scenarios and beauty pageants catering to the general public. I have already explained that this site is nowhere as bad as the fashion industry.

This is only my opinion after viewing a couple of photographs of each. Some links didn't post the pics; sorry for that. As for Norway, her in that gown is not a very good picture, but her face is pretty nontheless. My opinions on their attractiveness is based on their face only, too, since there aren't more pictures of their figure.

Sarah: Your comments, especially those elsewhere, do not imply that you find this site amusing. Anyway, I will address the Miss Universe contestants in a separate entry. The women that you posted pictures of, presumably closer to your physique, look like they haven’t had enough to eat for a while; Donald Trump needs to buy them some food.

Oh don't get me wrong, Erik. Things can be both misleading as well as entertaining. Ever watch the Daily Show?

I already mentioned I haven't examined their physiques enough to judge them based on that. The only two I see that look unhealthily thin are Italy and Tanzania, based on these pics anyways. I'm sorry they're not juicy cows like you prefer your "women." Just because one is thin doesn't mean they are anorexic, either. But hoorah for over feeding our American people to the point where we're wasting precious food, right? Screw the starving in 3rd world countries. Let's eat all the food in the world even if we're not hungry! YAYYY

Sarah: Of course, thin women are not necessarily anorexic. I didn’t call any of the women posted by you anorexic. Don’t blame me for those Americans who are eating excessive food. I am certainly not one of these people. As I already pointed out elsewhere, excess body fat is more prevalent in ethnic minorities in the U.S., mostly originating in developing nations. Besides, the U.S. donates a lot of food to poor people around the world.

In your suggestion that they look like they haven't been eating for a while and that Trump needs to buy them food implies that you think they're anorexic. Duh. That statement wouldn't be coming from someone that knows not all thin women are anorexic.

I'm not saying that I think these contestants all don't have eating disorders, since many women do, especially those that are under pressure from competing in these pageants. However, some women, no matter how much they eat, cannot gain weight due to their fast metabolism.

And please. I wasn't blaming you for the famine in third world countries; it's just ridiculous to tell skinny women to go eat something just because they're thin. It's wasting food. If you're not hungry, then don't eat anything.

Excess body fat in minorities? Hmm that's funny. I don't see a lot of fat Asians here in California. There are a few overweight Latinos/Hispanics and some overweight black people, but mostly the overweight people I see waddling around are white. And "excess body fat" doesn't necessarily mean they LOOK fat. My friend who looks perfectly normal, even skinny, has a BMI that is over average. Thin people could also have more body fat than normal if they don't exercise.

Sarah: People who have been undereating lately are not necessarily anorexic. They could be bulimic or have disordered eating symptomatology that does not meet diagnostic criteria for anorexia. In addition, like you have said, people can be naturally skinny, but in terms of looks, naturally skinny individuals will look like they haven’t been eating enough. Therefore, it does not follow that I was implying that the women are anorexic.

I have already cited a bunch of studies regarding percentage body fat in various ethnic groups in the U.S., and your reply comprised of profanity and anecdotal observations. Of course, people with a similar body mass can have different body fat levels, which is why I cited the statistics regarding percentage body fat. Why the hell do you keep coming back to this “bullsh*t site” (to use your preferred description of it)? Do something better with your time.

Will you be commenting on the 2007 Miss Universe pageant? I started reading your site just before the pageant and watched it with a more critical eye. Your theses, arguments and empirical data have reenforced what I had felt instinctively but could not put into words. The 2007 Miss Universe pageant, to me, was a sham and a disservice to beauty pageants and beautiful women.

Paul: Yes, I will be commenting on the 2007 Miss Universe pageant. These pageants keep getting worse. I know of one person who usually takes a favorable view of a good number of masculinized fashion models, but even he regarded this pageant as a farce. This guy is Dwayne Bell at the body in mind site. His words:

Quote:

May 26, 2007 - The Miss Universe pageant airs this Monday evening from Mexico City...but be warned, it may not be something you want to watch.

Miss Sweden, who "applied" for the position along with men(because Sweden can't abide sexual discrimination, even when choosing "Miss" Sweden), older women, etc in feminist-run Sweden, has dropped out because the contest is demeaning to women. Miss Jamaica is showing up in mangy dreadlocks, Miss Tanzania has a shaved head, and part of Miss Colombia's national costume includes a bloodied stick used to kill bulls during a bullfight.

Watch it if you can stomach it. We're sure there won't be many more broadcasts in the future if this destruction of beauty continues.

Since 1996 Hooters has held Miss Hooters International Swimsuit Pageant, a competition of Hooters Girls from around the world; Hooters does not have an official maximum weight or size limit, however the average is bra size is a 36C and most of them have breast implants. Anyway there is great variation among the physical features of the contestants, different waist-hip ratio, different bust size, and different facial typologies. I've seen some very gorgeous faces but others contestants don't have a very feminine face, maybe in this kind of competition it is more important have a sexy body that high facial beauty. In my opinion many of the models have a stunning body.

I would like if Erik could give some pointers about this pageant. We can see some contestants in the photographic examples: