Ron Paul on Larry King: Investigate the Causes of Terrorism

Last night on Larry King, Ron Paul called for an investigation into the causes of terrorism. He pointed out that America fell into Osama Bin Laden’s terrible trap: We are now involved in destructive wars that bankrupt our nation and drive hateful recruits straight into Al Qaeda’s hands. Unfortunately, the discussion went downhill from there due to Ben Stein’s ludicrous attempt to dismiss Ron Paul’s argument as “anti-semitic”.

Show: Larry King LiveChannel: CNNDate: 12/28/2009

Transcript

Larry King: Okay, we meet Representative Sheila Jackson Lee, she’s a member of the Homeland Security committee, and she chairs the panel sub-committee on transportation security and infrastructure protection. Representative Ron Paul is a Republican of Texas, member of the International Relations Committee. He was a flight surgeon in the air force, and an OB/GYN in civilian life. And Ben Stein, the economist attorney, former presidential speech writer, columnist with Fortune Magazine.

Representative Lee, were you satisfied with the president’s statement today and do you think we’re now getting on top of things?

Sheila Jackson Lee: Absolutely, Larry. I believe the president has always been on top of this issue of securing the homeland. It is not a partisan issue, it is not a Democratic issue or Republican issue. And he stood today and indicated that we now are moving forward on some of the items that we’ve already done, improving our security and our screening, looking to ensure that we are going after the terrorists who want to come after us, finding Al-Qaida wherever it is, and yes, doing an inventory and investigation on what happened and why. But I believe that there are several issues that we have to address. And one of them is the serious stovepiping of intelligence. Communicating information that could have prevented this individual from boarding this plane; flight 253.

Larry King: Congressman Paul, is politics outside the door here?

Ron Paul: Well, I don’t know, that depends on your definition of politics. If you disagree, I guess it’s political. If you agree then it isn’t. But no, the answer to your first question, you know, this statement wasn’t all that satisfactory to me, sort of putting the pressure on the people, if we were just more vigilant. It seems to me that the people had the responsibility in that embassy and should have been more vigilant. You know, we’re right now spending 75 billion dollars for intelligence gathering, and look at what we have. We had FBI agents telling us about the pilots that were flying but not landing an airplane before 9/11, and here we have this incident. So I would say we come up way short and I think there’s a fundamental flaw in the system, and that is government’s incapable of doing it. Everything else in this country, all the businesses and factories and hotels and everything, they’re protected by the owners and by private security. But all of a sudden if you own an airplane, you have to depend on the bureaucracy. And 75 billion dollars worth of intelligence gathering, and all of a sudden we’re all going to be safe as long as we’re alert and tell everybody what’s going on.

Larry King: Governments are responsible to do that Ben, aren’t they? We can’t have private industry run our security.

Ben Stein: Governments are totally responsible. I was stunned at what President Obama said today. I mean, it was as if somebody said after Pearl Harbor: “Okay, we all got to be vigilant against the Japanese and the Germans”. It’s the government’s job to protect us, we’re paying a fortune in tax and debt to have them do it. They’re not taken it seriously, they’re being like bureaucrats and really just doing 9 to 5 work and not getting the job done. Look, this is a war, we’ve said it over and over again. It’s not a war against Islam, but it is a war against terrorists. We know a lot about them, it’s not getting shared. I am not a stock holder in IBM, but I think you could give this job to IBM, in about a month they can come up with a system where there will be little dots going off on a million different people’s desks in the bureaucracy if somebody like this Nigerian guy was trying to get on an airplane. Let’s get the work out like we mean it.

Larry King: Congresswoman Lee, you want to respond to that?

Sheila Jackson Lee: I do, I do frankly. We are getting to work, we have been getting to work, but there are problems. And frankly this needs to be addressed by Congress and by the administration. The stovepiping that I was suggesting was very obvious for this individual who had family members who notified our embassy in Nigeria, and that information was not transmitted anywhere else until Homeland Security. It’s obvious that Homeland Security should be the focal point and the key in terms of acting on any threat to the homeland. That means that the information that we received, that was a viable behavioral assessment that you could have made on this individual. He went to Yemen, he has become radicalized. His family has called, and therefore there was a basis of acting. We don’t need to talk about 75 billion, and by the way, my friends on the other side of the aisle have voted against aviation security funding and also explosives funding. But what the president can do at it, Larry, what I would suggest that he do is to make a recess appointment to the individual that is being held up as the TSA administrator by a Republican senator. Leadership is important is in this aspect, so I believe the government is responsible, I take responsibility and we have a way to solve the problem.

Larry King: I got to take a break, hold on. Ben, hold it. I got to take a break and we’ll have Ben and Ron respond right after this.

Ron Paul, you want to respond first to the Congresswoman?

Ron Paul: Yes, I do. One thing that is missing here is never asking the question what is the motive. With Abdulmutallab he said why he did it. He said it was because we bombed Yemen 2 weeks ago; that was his motive. Osama Bin Laden said that he has a plan for America. First, he wants to bog us down in the Middle East in a no-win war, he wants to bankrupt this country, demoralize us, as well as have us do things that motivate people to join his radical movement. It seems like we have fallen into his trap. You know, why is it off base? Today when the gentleman indicated that he did it because of the bombing, you know what the administration said? They just dismissed it; it can’t possibly be so. If you dismiss motivations for why they hate us, we can never resolve this. There is hate on both sides, but you have to ask the question, “Why do they hate?” and they usually come up with the reason and we’re foolish not to take that into consideration.

Larry King: Ben?

Ben Stein: Well, I never heard anything quite like that in my whole life. What he’s saying basically is we are doing something wrong by defending ourselves. Look at these terrorists trying to kill the government in Yemen. We got to help defend them, they’re our friends. We can’t just let Al-Qaida run wild…

Ron Paul: Why, why?

Ben Stein: Why should we stop them? Because they’re terrorists and murderers and they’re very anti-American.

Sheila Jackson Lee: I think I can referee between the congressman and Ben.

Larry King: Two Republicans going at it with a Democratic liberal in the middle. This is fascinating.

Sheila Jackson Lee: I can referee between the two of them. Let me referee, please.

Larry King: Alright, Sheila say something.

Sheila Jackson Lee: Yes, let me referee, please. That is interesting.

Larry King: Both have good points, right?

Sheila Jackson Lee: Well, they have good points, but let me clarify and try to say that Congressman Paul has a point on our positions that we took in Iraq, which obviously created a very terrible atmosphere and we all asked the question what were the results. And, of course, Afghanistan is still a question, but we must be reminded that the terrorists acted under President Bush’s clock, and so this can’t be an issue of the president’s inactivity, per se, and lack of commitment to the homeland. But we have to do better. And I believe we need to have behavioral assessment. There was no reason for this individual to have a visa that still was in place until 2010, for them to be able to travel. There was no reason for him not to be detected because of his behavior. Behavioral assessment; we need to make the homeland security of the nation focus. Secretary of Homeland Security should be the point person, and that person should establish a roadmap that then allows us to fund and to put resources accordingly. And finally, the president should put in place the TSA administrator by a way of recess appointment letter.

Larry King: Debt, taxes, and these three are going to be back tomorrow.

103 Comments:

I think some of you Ron Paul supporters dislike the government so much, you can no longer think straight. The government is not perfect, neither are companies, it’s easy to blame but in real life things are not as simple as a politician make it sound. Mass murder of innocents (aka terrorism) has no valid justification; it requires a made up one. If you think there can be a valid justification for mass murder, then I am sorry, something is wrong with you.

I think you were very brave Ron to talk about this issue on Larry King Live. I know that most of the people especially the elected officials will think twice before making a statement like yours. Unfortunately we have sold ourselves to special interest groups and now they control everything including what we say on TV.

Fundamentally, there ain't no Yemeni government. There are tribal leaders in the broken-down desert town, Sana'a, that call them themselves the government, but the country has been fundamentally ungovernable since the British left not long after the end of WW2.

It is a tribal culture and the tribes can't agree on anything except that it is always goddamn hot! Yemen is currently the most poverty-stricken country outside of Africa. It is a sand-pile with the occasional watering-hole with two or three palm trees, about a day's journey apart if you have a young, hurrying, desperately thirsty camel.

The region that now calls itself the Republic of Yemen was an artificial construct of the British Government after the defeat of the Turkish Empire in WW1. The tribal leaders still have border issues with Saudi Arabia, and if I have my facts straight, there is still violence and killing going on over that issue right now. While such regions were part of the Turkish Empire they remained simply wide open desert regions inhabited by various nomadic tribes who accepted the overall sovereignty of the Turkish Caliph. The endless struggle that is going on the entire Middle Eastern region is party brought on by the fact that many majority Muslim Arabs want to return to a Caliphate form of government, a governmental system that was and is very similar to the former European Holy Roman Empire in which the Pope in Rome was the ultimate spiritual head of government and the various Kings, Princes, and Dukes ruled their regions with the Pope's official consent.

My memory is getting hazy, but my recollection is that when the British left, the Yemeni region actually broke into two, possibly 3 different tribal regions, with the north (including Sana'a) being financed by the CIA and British Intelligence, and and the southern end of the sand-pile (including the former Royal Navy re-fueling station at Aden) ending up in the hands of tribal folks who passed themselves off as Communists, and who were probably getting a monthly allowance from the Soviet KBG.

The struggle between our client state and the KGB's client state went on for years but finally petered out some years ago, what government there is, is now centered in Sana'a, but there is still an ongoing struggle to come out on top of the tribal heap.

The folly continues, and it makes me ill! The Turkish Caliphate - which stretched all the way from Istambul, across North Africa to the Atlantic - thrived for some 500 years, and if the stupidity of our government is any guide, we can expect that a minimum of 25 generations of sad-sack American citizens will pay the price of our government's blind and brain-damaged folly, endless terrorist acts or worse, until the American Empire collapses into irrelevance about the year 2508. Only 499 years to go!

E.

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On Dec 30, 2009, at 12:01 PM, pjess@vom.com wrote:

> pjess@vom.com sent you a link to the following content:
>
> Ron Paul vs Ben Stein Dust Up on Terrorism
> http://videocafe.crooksandliars.com/heather/ron-paul-vs-ben-stein-dust
> -terrorism
>
> The sender also included this note:
>
> Ernie: You must agree with Ron Paul on this issue

Should we accept murder as a universal policy? That's really what terrorism is. Terriorism is a foreign policy. It is also a domestic policy. It's a policy to get people to submit via fear. In reality they have no qualms killing innocents east west north or south. Alibis from mass murderers should be taken with a grain of salt. Why are people surprised that terriosts say they don't like our foreign policy? Even with domestic policy, we have ardent opponents, that's just the way democracy works. They know that. But if mass murder is their acceptable policy, should we really be listening to them?

And again, just to preface, all of a sudden it appears when ron paul gets punched in the mouth he... Blames himself? The framers had something about a ball o democracy that would (should?) Roll around the world. Google 'ball of democrcacy' I believe it was thomas jefferson

I'm sorry, Mr. Paul, but the reason Muslims commit terrorist attacks throughout the world is NOT because the United States is in the Middle East nor is it because Israel gets aid from the U.S.. Were you to actually do some historical research on Islam, you would discover that beginning in the 7th century and continuing to the present day, Muslims who follow the teachings of the Koran, the hadiths and the sura are required to compel all, and I mean ALL, non-muslims to submit to their ideology or die. Pointing at the United States and Israel as "occupiers" is so far off the mark as to be ludicrous. Prior to 1948, there was no "Palestine" insofar as a government was concerned. Moreover, if the Middle Eastern countries that justify their violent attacks on others based upon some misguided notion that the "Palestinians" should have an autonomous country of their own, why don't they simply agree to annex portions of their relatively large and open spaces to the "Palestinians" for a country? Why must it be where all other countries decided that Israel could exist? And if you think it's because Jerusalem is somehow "holy" to muslims, you really need to do your homework inasmuch as Mohammad never set foot there and the only reason the Al-aqsa mosque was built there was a belated attempt some 500-600 years after Mohammad's death to try to politicize the Islamic presence there.

I used to respect that you were associated with the Libertarian party but I must admit that your "parroting" of the misinformation the media feeds you has changed that. I won't vote or support you in any way as a result.

So when doctor/now public servant ron paul(/wanna be like bushes and take a priveleged life and live off politics like the bushes) is checking his mail and someone punches him in the mouth ten times, its his fault?

What would he do? Or his family? Non-paranoid style?

I bet he would blame american society.

Go mexicans. Save the alamo! Ron paul and his family now needs their pension!

Ron Paul states it simply and perfectly.. if Russia, or anyone, occupied America "for our own good" and bombed us it would not take long at all before we were all doing anything we could to fight back. Against an overwhelming military force the only option is insurgency. The more we meddle in other countries the more people strike out against us. We had no problems with the middle east until around the time we got invloved with Iran.

Quote.. Prior to 1948, there was no “Palestine” insofar as a government was concerned.

Yes but that doesn't mean there was no Palestine. The land was promised to be an arab nation for the help in overthrowing the Ottomans in WWI and had been inhabited by them for centuries. But that is a long story.

Quote.. And if you think it’s because Jerusalem is somehow “holy” to muslims, you really need to do your homework inasmuch as Mohammad never set foot there.

Muhammed never set foot there but he ascended to heaven there during the Night Ride and it played such an important role in the religion that for awhile all muslims faced Jerusalem and prayed before it was changed to Mecca.

Anyone who trusts any government fist of all is an idiot, sorry, but that is the way it is. Especially an over bloated, un-constitutional government we have in place now. Go Ron Paul, the only man who makes sense in congress today!

I find it incredibly disturbing that if someone says we should not be interfering in the Middle East and Israel they can so quickly be labeled "anti-Semitic". Really? So if I believe (as Ron Paul does) that we should not be interfering in ANY other country's politics - including Israel - I am anti-Semitic? That is absurd.

Exactly Sarah... the greatest gift we could give Israel is a lack of funding because it is a metaphorical "handcuff key"...

If we cut the foreign aid to all nations including Israel (which is dwarfed by the amount of funds sent to Arab nations) that means they're all on their own... and that also means that if you lob a missile at Israel... you deal with the consequences your actions bring upon you...

No one in the Middle East wants us to stop giving aid to Israel (especially their enemies) because if we do they no longer have to "kiss our ring" and ask for permission to defend themselves against aggressors...

I'm not sure exactly how that can be twisted to be interpreted as "antisemitic"... but in this "politically correct" world where the truth is sold as "lies"... treason is sold as "patriotism"... and integrity is sold as "weakness"... stupid people no longer shock me when they open their stupid mouths... like Ben Stein did in the video above...

For those of you that don't get the message that Dr. Paul was trying to illustrate... let me break it down for you...

If you come to my house and break my furniture and smash my television... and I tell you that because you did that I'm going to come find you and punch you in the face...

Then I come and find you... and then I punch you in the face... are you going to say that you "have no idea why I came and punched you in the face"... because if you do you're either an idiot or a liar...

The fact of the matter is politicians are now not only saying they have "no idea" why we're being attacked... they won't even call the attackers what they are...

Here's what Paul was really saying: If I break in to your house and steal $5000 worth of your belongings and when I'm caught I say "Well, the U.S. government taxed me by force to the amount of $5000 so I was just getting my money back. I was retaliating."
You would not say that I was justified in stealing from you just because America stole from me. - So why, according to Ron Paul, was the Flight 253 attacker justified in trying to kill Americans just because the American government occupies Yeman? What did the passengers on flight 253 do to the country of Yemen?

Of course there are tons of reasons why the US shouldn't be in Yemen, but to have a Libertarian candidate justify such violations of individual liberty by blaming our government is why people don't get involved in the Libertarian movement. These statements make Libertarians appear out of touch with the real justification of liberty.

Except he never said that the Flight 253 attacker was justified in his actions. Nor did he imply such an absurd notion. Ron Paul just pointed out what motivated the attacker to do what he did. There is a wold of difference between motivation and justification.

It's quite easy to imagine why a person could be motivated to perform all sorts of horrendous acts but just because we can discover the motive, it does nothing to justify the behavior. When a detective discovers the motive behind a crime does that in anyway justify the criminal act? Not at all. I don't understand why this relationship is so easily obscured when it comes time to apply it to government policies and international relations.

Paul did not clearly make that point. And he is pretty much the face of the Libertarian Party. He had an opportunity on national television to demonstrate how American interventionism does play a part in terrorism. Instead he came across as defending the terrorists and getting into a yelling match about anti-semitism. The democrat came out looking like the reasonable referee on the panel. I'm just frustrated because Paul continually misses such opportunities. I consider myself Libertarian and he makes even me wonder sometimes. We need a new guy.

Ron Paul isn't even currently a Libertarian Party member. How can he be the face of the party if he's not a member?

You're welcome to find a new guy. I'm of the opinion that there are plenty of people who promote the cause and there is room for all of them.

I watched the interview. Yes, the shouting match was uncalled for but I can understand why it happened. Ron Paul most certainly demonstrated "how American interventionism does play a part in terrorism". In fact, he made the point too well. It was so well demonstrated that Ben Stein had no choice but to raise the bogeyman of antisemitism.

Also, "the Democrat" didn't come off well at all. She came off as incoherent.

Motivation is one of the basics when it comes to solving or preventing crimes. Attempting to understand the motives of someone does not equate to justification of their acts.

It seems that some here are simply reacting to the manufactured fear of the boogyman. They will give away every last bit of their liberty and spend every last drop of young American blood and borrow trillions from the Chinese just so they do not have to worry about that big bad boogyman. Understandable, until you figure out that this is simply promoting perpetual war.

You could cover the planet with American soldiers (we are getting closer with 700+ bases in 160+ countries) and nothing would change. It simply drains our blood and treasury, and does little to protect our homeland. It has never worked in history, and it never will.

Is their a tipping point for these people? How many dead U.S. soldiers would be too many? Having spent our children's inheritance should we now spend their children's inheritance, all in the name of faux security?

Face it, some of you have fallen for the oldest trick in the history books. Any state that wants more power need only trot out the latest boogyman and the sheople beg for safety. They will sell their children and their soul for that feeling of security that is a mirage.

Grandpa said "If you stick your nose in a hornets nest, expect to be stung".

Dear Ben Stein, what qualifies you to make such baseless accusations? You're biggest claim to fame is "Buehler....Buehler" so perhaps you should stick to acting. It is completely beyond me why you were even invited to this charade, other than to toss around the J card out, of course in clear view of the African American 'mediator'. It's very interesting and telling how political arguments can be won by throwing around the Anti-Semite card, at least in the mainstream media. Well, technically, you're not really winning when that card is now pretty much without base but oh well...keep trying Ben.

Geez, the top Libertarian candidate just went on Larry King and made Ben Stein look smart. No wonder the Libertarian Party still isn't a contender after 30 years!
My love for liberty keeps me hopeful that they will get it right eventually, but remarks like "They're terrorists because we are occupiers" sure makes me want to throw in the towel.....

I'm a supporter of Ron Paul, and even I find myself dismayed with the comments in this section. I thought that Paul was the most patriotic of all of all the candidates. Well, actually I still DO think that. Still, how does the most patriotic of all candidates attract such rabid America-haters as Nitroindole and Go Ron?

Seriously--"slaughtering terrorists with advanced WMDs"? Give me a break. I don't think we should be in Iraq or Afghanistan, but I can't believe how far these commentors have ventured out onto the lunatic fringe. I'd like to believe that you guys are some kind of provaocateurs sent over by more "mainstream" GOP candidates to make Ron Paul look bad.

I'm dismayed with Ron's remarks also. Apparently my liberty stops at the American border. If I'm ever attacked by Jihadists, I sure hope Ron is not my attorney! He'd say that since I'm an American, the attack was my fault because I choose to live in a country that occupies other countries.

Wow! I've been reading the comments section, and I must say--all the nuts come out for Paul, don't they? 9/11 "Truthers", America-haters, and all around idiots. Are you aware that you embarass your candidate when you associate yourselves with him?

Oh, and before someone starts yelling, "If you love fascist America and its imperialist wars so much, WHY DON'T YOU YOU GO ENLIST!"...I am an Iraq War veteran.

Sorry to reply to my reply, but to put that in perspective the number of architects and engineers that believe in AE911 crackpot theories is 25 times closer to ZERO PERCENT OF ENGINEERS than it is to ONLY a mere ONE PERCENT OF ENGINEERS.

Solid. Looks like a lot of support - Comedy and Swimming Pool engineers and all.

Yep, it's all our fault. Poor third-worlders never have any freedom of will, free choice, or willpower of their own. They aren't capable of making decisions or choices; they're not capable of intelligent thought, just reactions.

So don't blame them, blame us.

Oh, and this concept is totally not racist; all the other people of the world are just incapable of rational thought or independent action... you can't blame them for it.

So Ron Paul, his ideas seem predicated on the belief that only western nations are capable of independent action or rational thought beyond simple reaction.

But not at all in a racist way; all the other peoples of the world are simply not really self-aware people... they're more like dogs or something I'm sure... but totally not in a racist way. Which I have to keep saying; because this premise seems predicated on a very racist ideal.

Or maybe other people are capable of independent action, rational thought, etc. but only western nations should ever be held accountable for anything... Why? I guess because other people of the world aren't capable of complex morality where holding them responsible for their own actions would be fair... wait, is that racist too?

Weird... can anyone come up with a non-racist explanation why only western nations are responsible for their actions? and why western nations need to be responsible for the actions of everyone else too? I seem to be failing to explain this well.

Maybe because this position is idiotic, indefensible, and completely racist... but maybe not. Anyone want to take a stab at it?

Matt, don't try to hide yourself under new aliases and monikers or fool the public with your idiosyncratic embellishments. You are trying to fool people into actually believing you are an expert, when it's clear what you engage in is intellectual dishonesty.

For starters Matt, you seem to cover up the argument by using very peculiar obsufucation techniques, what I would term as "Zionist" inspired education techniques because they are so far off in left field when it comes to reality or foreign policy.

According to your world and version of events, Ron Paul is a fringe lunatic who should not be speaking a single word about Yemen because he does not know enough about the people there - he is merely an ignorant 'racist' because he implies that people should be taking a conscious effort to consider all the factors which proffer terrorism, rather than look at only one factor.

In effect and in your world, a lone terrorist in Yemen or Iran is an infidel who must be dispatched simply because they are trained killers and hate the United States since birth. No you see, it could not possibly have anything to do with the fact we incinerate their children, bring fiat currency to their homeland to enslave their workforce, or occupy their land with standing military barracks and the brutal jackboot of a dictator.

No, none of that could have anything to do with the fact this sharp dressed man assisted Abdullah to get on board that airplane and attempt to blow it up - along with thousands of other questions surrounding the people he was working with, who were not Al Qaeda 'terrorists'
http://www.mlive.com/news/detroit/index.ssf/2009/12/commenter_says_he_was_aboard_n.html

You see, in your version of events none of these outside factors contribute to terrorism....people just get angry, they snap, and they blow up and attack people.....right?

It does not matter if the US military occupied Saudi Arabia for the last 20 years and raped many of their wives & children, since Ron Paul was the only politician in a long time with the guts to say that.

It does not matter that our own CIA installed two or three dictators in Saudi Arabia in order to gain control of the drug flow to Afghanistan, because you see, now those dirty infidels have Cell Phones and technology! We helped them! Good ol' USA.

No Matt, that is unfortunately not how the world works and the cause of much of our problems really is our foreign policy. Lone nuts become alone, as well as nuts due to the environment they grow up in. If the environment instills in them hatred, then many of those in other countries; could easily be terrorists.

Not whole GROUPS of people, not a STATE of people. Unless of course, I suppose if we included the Israeli government and the South African apartheid regime. But that is the LAST thing you would want to hear, such blasphemous things are the work of racist lunatics who have no right to speak....isn't that the truth?

Or maybe, just maybe the fact Ron Paul's view is now mainstream is what scares you the most. That people are actually thinking and considering, maybe all this "war on terrorism" project is just a complete lie of a war that can never be won.

Because not everyone thinks Palestinians wake up one day and just decide to loathe and hate humanity, and blow up parking garages in the United States. Even if you do. Most people do not, most suspect it may be due to many contributing factors.

Including occupying their nation with armed military, including occupying another nation with hired mercenaries, and including Israel never seriously even considering that what it does to expel all the Palestinians off its land is basically murderously wrong. As after all, in the foreign policy of today all that matters is there are nutty people out there who will do anything to shoot or kill people in the USA or across the world.

Its perfect. They are indoctrinated to hate since birth, its not the influence of outside CIA or any of that rubbish. In your perfect little world that does not exist. In the real world, most people reject the nation-building version of why terrorism exists.

For if terrorism can never disappear because radicals are born to hate, then that amazingly means the war on drugs and war on terror can never be won. TWO unwinnable wars in half a century, my god good old Roosevelt was right!!

And even though you won't change your thinking, just remember who benefits. Somebody benefits from the endless terrorism boogeyman and it isn't you or me. It's the bankers who run the world. Those benevolent bankers that are just there to help humanity reach its full potential.

Matt, you keep at this because it inspires me. What you engage in is not merely misleading, it is intellectual dishonesty. You are keeping a lie going for thousands of people because you believe in the lie. So anyway, I am off to sulk in your world. Must be pretty annoying knowing most people do not think Ron Paul's ideas are off the mark.

Let me get one thing straight, I am conflicted on Iraq and Afghanistan. My Brother has been in Afghanistan for three years now, my Uncle retired from the Marines last year.

However, to simply blame EVERYTHING on ourselves, and all the pain and the suffering in this world is COMPLETELY and ALWAYS a result of something we (our military) did - and if we just retreat from everywhere right now all hatred will *poof* disappear is such a ridiculous proposition I cannot entertain it.

Things are more complicated than Ron Paul makes it.

Maybe I'll just let Nitroindole answer your question of 'who benefits' in the paranoid language that y'all apparently understand (and I do not agree with):
"Also it is a possibility that zoinists (sic) contribute into this by igniting devastating global conflict between Christian and Islam worlds."

Matt, I think what he is implying is that YOU are a ridiculous proposition. You assume that what he said was that all the factors that contribute to terrorism, are caused by our own military. However nowhere in his lecture did he say anything about that.

You assume that we should not be in Afghanistan, however nowhere in his lecture did he say anything like that. What he said was eloquently clear, being over there is of no help and is one of the larger contributing factors for why terrorists might attack us.

Another factor is of course the country's living conditions, the environment they grow up in, criminal activity and outside influence. All of those factors contribute to terrorism, Matt. One of the largest is of course our constant military misadventures. You just got schooled in history 101.

I'm disgusted with my country. U.S. needs to get the hell out of other people's countries.

For the idiots on this thread that support the mass slaughter the U.S. is perpetrating all over the world, but in particular the M.E., I say GO JOIN THE ARMY NOW!!!! You Love your government so much, and believe everything you hear on mainstream media, THEN GO NOW!!

The U.S. is now the most COWARDLY OF NATIONS. Slaughtering children with advanced WMDs against people that can barely protect themselves. What a bunch of REAL MEN!!!wooohooo.

I ask you morons: What the f*ck would you do if China starting bombing your town and killed a couple of your kids...While they are saying they are here to bring us liberty from our disgusting and fascist government, and spouting the old standby propaganda "we are after the terrorists in the white house"??

Would you throw rose pedals after the tanks coming down your streets?

HA! Most likely the U.S. tanks will be turned on the American people one day. They already got drones on both borders and soon on the West coast. The great land of LIBERTY!!

And the morons bought it all. Without cracking a book, because they got Rush Limbaugh to tell them how to think.

Ummmm, so the U.S. needs to 'get the hell out of other people's countries'? It's really just that simple?

So if Al Qaeda slams planes into our WTC towers we turn tail, blame ourselves and our terribly misguided ideals, and then... we give texas back to Mexico and the rest of the United States to the American Indians?

Ohhh, that's right... When you say 'our country' it's the one that we... Fought and killed innocent women, babies, and children for?

Ron Paul is the only visible sober and honest politician. All what is going on is a set up by financial and military forces to pull taxpayers money and restrict our liberties. Also it is a possibility that zoinists contribute into this by igniting devastating global conflict between Christian and Islam worlds. Ask question: Who benefits? Then see what you see. It is remarkable that Ben Stein have had to point out " It is not a war agoinst Islam" but in FACT it is! Stein call thgem all "psychopats". Looks like he and those who are behind 9/11 and the "war on terror" want to whipe out Afghanistan, Iran, Pakistan, Iraq etc... The whole Islamic World population. Watch out!

And to Matt: You need reading books, not listening PR only. And you have to apologize for your naming Ron Paul.

Wow Longshotsheeple, you get a little vodka in your kool-aid today? Awwww, go sleep it off and come back after you sober up.

You don't think terrorist actions are an act of war? What, was Bin Laden (assuming you don't think he is a CIA shill and you actually believe 9/11 actually happened) and his slamming planes into buildings and killing thousands of people was a.... one time patriotic handjob?

Please sign up for the military tomorrow if you believe in it so much.

The fact is, the U.S. is TERRORIZING many people around the world. You need to check facts. You obviously can't think for yourself.

I'm getting sick of hearing how folks like you believe the bull shit "official government" version of 911.

Yes, all of us 911 truthers are nuts in your eyes. But guess what? I'm a nut in good company...Physicists, Architectural Engineers, Aviation Specialists, and many more...

What are you scared of? You might find out what a bunch of shit they taught us all in school? You might find out that our "beacon of light" country might not be so good after all..
Does this ruffle your feathers? It does, and that's because you cannot stand the thought that you might be complicit in mass murder just like we all are as long as we allow the putrid criminals to keep up what they do...for profit, for world power,

But got news for you. Our country will never be the same. Your buddy Dick Cheney made sure of that (now there's a terrorist if there ever was one).

Go back to square one. Read George Orwell's 1984. Pay close attention to the proverbial enemy 'Emanuel Goldstein".

Read Carroll Quigly. Read "War Is A Racket" by Major General Smedley Butler.

Its hard to grow a conscience in the U.S. Its hard when you realize that everything you were taught was mostly lies. But the truth will set you free.

Matt, I was strikingly surprised to find out how many Americans are ignorant and uneducated so they have NO idea of what "The Project for New American Century" (PNAC) signed by Cheney, Jeb Bush, Rumsfeld and Wolfovitz in 1997 is about. They have no idea of what is says in September 2000 about desirable "catalyzing" New Pearl Harbor event to speed up their PNAC project. This website and pdf documents were available to public all these years. (No more, they closed website just a week ago.) But few of us have paid attention...

Matt, go get your education if you can afford it then you maybe will see what Ron Paul can see. You believe that you are not an idiot but this government keeps you uneducated, brainwashed and manipulated by spending at least 19% of the budget (at least 636 billions) for Defence and only 1.3% for education its people....
That's right, keep trying NOT to be an idiot but seriously in reality not in delusion.

Matt, seriously, put aside your emotions and anger. Take a minute reading the below then analyse:

Rebuilding America's Defenses (RAD)" is a policy document published by a neoconservative Washington think tank called the Project for the New American Century (PNAC). Its pages have been compared to Hitler's Mein Kampf in that they outline an aggressive military plan for U.S. world domination during the coming century. And just as Hitler's book was not taken seriously until after his catastrophic rise to power, so it seems that relatively few Americans are expressing alarm at this published document that is a blueprint for many of the present actions of the Bush administration, actions which have begun to destabilize the balance of power between the nations of the world.

There is, indeed, much reason for alarm because PNAC is not an ordinary think tank and "RAD" is not an ordinary policy paper. Many PNAC members now hold key positions in the White House, Defense and State Departments, among them Dick Cheney, Donald Rumsfeld, Paul Wolfowitz, Richard Perle, Elliot Abrams, Lewis Libby, and John Bolton, along with others in lesser positions. William Kristol, writer for the conservative magazine, the Weekly Standard, is chairman of the group.

Some of these men have been advocating for a strong military posture since the ending of cold war hostilities with the Soviet Union. Wishing to capitalize on the fact that the US had emerged as the world's preeminent superpower, they have lobbied for increases in military spending in order to establish what they call a Pax Americana that will reap the rewards of complete military and commercial control of land, sea, air, space, and cyberspace. This, they said, would be accomplished by the waging of "multiple simultaneous large-scale wars" and one of their first orders of business was always the removal of Saddam Hussein, thereby giving the US a toehold in the oil-rich Middle East.

During the Clinton presidency, when the Republicans were out of power, this militaristic wing in American politics became highly organized and efficient. They formed the PNAC in 1997 And published "RAD" in September 2000. Determined to have their world empire, they offered an eerie prophecy on page 52 of that document about how it might be accomplished, "Further, the process of transformation, even if it brings revolutionary change, is likely to be a long one, absent some catastrophic and catalyzing event – like a new Pearl Harbor." Their dream of a catalyzing event could not have been better actualized than in the events of 9/11.

Although there could have been many responses to the tragedy of 9/11, the Bush administration seized upon that event to mold public opinion into accepting many ideas embodied in "RAD". The overthrow of Saddam Hussein, was being proposed by Rumsfeld and Wolfowitz one day after 9/11, even before anyone knew who was responsible for the attacks. As soon as the war against Afghanistan was completed, the focus of US policy became regime change in Iraq, with all of the tragic consequences we are now seeing in that country.

Policies advocated in "RAD" are being enacted with terrifying speed, such as denigration of the UN, importance of Homeland Security, abrogation of international agreements, revamping of the US nuclear program and the spread of American military power into all corners of the globe by preemptive engagement. In Iraq we have seen the embodiment of "RAD" directives that call for the subjugation of regimes considered hostile to US interests and the prevention of military build-up in countries that may challenge US power. Bush's "Axis of Evil" nations Iraq, Iran and North Korea are mentioned numerous times as potential trouble spots and there is repeated insistence that the US establish military outposts in the Middle East and East Asia.

PLEASE wake up and SEE that all of this is NOT for U.S. gain. War is being waged by GLOBALISTS who have no loyalty to America (initally led by Rockefeller). In Rockefellers own book he states he is "proud to be against America." These people are globalist who want total economic control over everyone. Codex Alimentarius is one of thier scariest plans. Look it up. PLEASE SEE THE YOUTUBE VIDEO entitled "New World Order is Here." Or look up "One World Government." Then you'll understand what this is all about.

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