Really, how does he seriously claim to be a friend of the Jewish people when he spouts crap like that? I know I’m not Jewish so I can’t specifically comment but his attempts to make himself out to be close to the victims of the Holocaust is something I find disgusting. He’s just a guy who doesn’t like the government the way it is now. Big fucking deal. I wouldn’t like it if his ideal person was in power but I wouldn’t act like I was a Jew in occupied Europe either.

I can’t understand why Al Gore didn’t want to sell his TV channel to this guy!

Have to say, I am pretty sure Dr. Martin Luther King (whose name and image Beck invokes habitually) would not have been cool with Beck calling the first black president of the United States a racist…but that is strictly my opinion.

Really, how does he seriously claim to be a friend of the Jewish people when he spouts crap like that? I know I’m not Jewish so I can’t specifically comment but his attempts to make himself out to be close to the victims of the Holocaust is something I find disgusting. He’s just a guy who doesn’t like the government the way it is now. Big fucking deal. I wouldn’t like it if his ideal person was in power but I wouldn’t act like I was a Jew in occupied Europe either.

He’s protecting “real” Jews from The Wrong Kind Of Jews, like George Soros and his Bolshevik banker cabal that secretly dominate the world through financial institutions.

What he does makes light of how evil the real Nazis were. That’s what angers me the most about what he does. He just says “Oh, they’re like the Nazis”, ignoring that the Third Reich was one of the worst regimes in history. That if someone like him was even doing a fraction of what he does in this society during Germany 1933-1945, they’d either be dead or in a camp.

He’s protecting “real” Jews from The Wrong Kind Of Jews, like George Soros and his Bolshevik banker cabal that secretly dominate the world through financial institutions.

What’s so hard to understand?

Nothing, it just pisses me off to see the Prime Minister of Israel treat him like he actually cares about the Jewish people when he clearly just sees them as a political tool to attack Obama and the left rather than genuine friends. As a human being, I find that disgusting.

I can’t understand why Al Gore didn’t want to sell his TV channel to this guy!

Have to say, I am pretty sure Dr. Martin Luther King (whose name and image Beck invokes habitually) would not have been cool with Beck calling the first black president of the United States a racist…but that is strictly my opinion.

If Beck were around in MLK’s time, he’d be calling him a racist. I have no doubt about that whatsoever. An actual black socialist and anti war activist. Beck would be having a field day if MLK were around today and so would the other right wing nutjobs.

Re-posted from downstairs. I was talking about Jonah Goldberg, but it could apply to any of these jabbering freaks.

(Insert jabbering freak’s name) wouldn’t fight anyone. He’s just another pampered right wing hack who gets picked up by a car to take him where he needs to go, he spends his time having lackeys bring him water in the Green Room, and he never encounters those people whom he so glibly insults on the regular.

That’s the problem with these assholes. They live an insular life where everyone they encounter agrees with every word of bullshit they spew, and in that type of environment it becomes really easy to talk about how your opponents should be beaten. After all, he’s the ‘talent’ and his ‘opinions’ are facile enough to get his mug on TV every week. Who’s gonna dare to disagree with him?

In the world that Beck and Goldberg and freaks like them live, it’s easy to rhapsodize about civil war or beating liberals, because they live in a world without consequence. If some impressionable moron takes their words to heart and attacks or kills someone, they feel no blowback whatsoever.

Nothing, it just pisses me off to see the Prime Minister of Israel treat him like he actually cares about the Jewish people when he clearly just sees them as a political tool to attack Obama and the left rather than genuine friends. As a human being, I find that disgusting.

Note to Steve Stockman, you wouldn’t be elected if you were in a regime where the head of state was like Saddam Hussein. You’d be dead, being tortured, in prison, or exiled. You certainly wouldn’t be an elected official.

And remind me how it’s Obama that’s trying to radically change America because of his own petty anger? Really, changing the way EVs are awarded just reeks of sour grapes and I hope if somehow they succeed at it, it ends up biting them in the ass later and we can say “Hey you wanted it.” Funny how they never had a problem with the status quo when they had candidates that weren’t shitty like McCain and Romney.

Don’t know if this has been posted previously, but this is a must-see chart that really concretizes the extremism of the Republican Party (I found it linked originally at Sam Wang’s blog - click to embiggen):

Don’t know if this has been posted previously, but this is a must-see chart that really concretizes the extremism of the Republican Party (I found it linked originally at Sam Wang’s blog - click to embiggen):

Far right is larger than right. Not shocking unfortunately. It’s not even about moderates being replaced by rightists really. It’s about unhinged replacing those with some sanity. Good example of that is Lugar who could easily be called a conservative and a member of the right being primaried out by a far rightist.

Except gay marriage, get adequate healthcare or get rich people to pay taxes.

or social justice. Social justice is Nazism according to the Beckster. Yeah because when people think of Nazis, they think of people who helped the less fortunate improve their lot and not a bunch of mass genocidal murderers. And besides, someone like Beck would have been sympathetic to fascism because he’d like the anti-communist rhetoric.

Far right is larger than right. Not shocking unfortunately. It’s not even about moderates being replaced by rightists really. It’s about unhinged replacing those with some sanity. Good example of that is Lugar who could easily be called a conservative and a member of the right being primaried out by a far rightist.

Well - the good side is that there is a strong possibility that this trend will only serve to further marginalize the Republican Party - in particular given the prevailing demographic trends. But that’s only if you look at the country as a whole, and it doesn’t take into account the fallout from this regional extremism on those unfortunate enough to live in areas predominate by extremists. Along those lines, a good analysis that blows up the myth of the balancing out of gerrrymandering:

And remind me how it’s Obama that’s trying to radically change America because of his own petty anger? Really, changing the way EVs are awarded just reeks of sour grapes and I hope if somehow they succeed at it, it ends up biting them in the ass later and we can say “Hey you wanted it.” Funny how they never had a problem with the status quo when they had candidates that weren’t shitty like McCain and Romney.

It will be interesting in how they try to sell this on the national level. If they say “it’s more representative to split up the EV in each state” then the immediate response is to point out that they are only espousing it in the states that have GOP state legislature majorities that just so happen to go Democratic overall for POTUS (and often Senate) elections. If it’s such a good idea why isn’t Texas and the rest of the GOP-controlled states doing it?

Well - the good side is that there is a strong possibility that this trend will only serve to further marginalize the Republican Party - in particular given the prevailing demographic trends. But that’s only if you look at the country as a whole, and it doesn’t take into account the fallout from this regional extremism on those unfortunate enough to live in areas predominate by extremists. Along those lines, a good analysis that blows up the myth of the balancing out of gerrrymandering:

Interesting. Sounds like it’s really bad in Pennsylvania. Always wondered how PA could be so Democratic for President and usually at least competitive for Democrats in the Senate yet at the same time have such a high proportion of Republicans to Democrats in the House. We only have what you’d call two safe Dem seats in Virginia- the district that’s in Arlington and the district that makes up Richmond city. Yet there’s like four districts I’d say are totally safe Republican.

American fascists looked for someone or something to blame, rather than searching for viable solutions to the socioeconomic morass that plagued them. Appropriating a Neo-Jacksonan distrust of monetary institutions, people of prestige, and the role of government, they declared that the Depression was a fiendish plot hatched by Communist-Jewish “banksters” who reveled in the chaos they wrought

It will be interesting in how they try to sell this on the national level. If they say “it’s more representative to split up the EV in each state” then the immediate response is to point out that they are only espousing it in the states that have GOP state legislature majorities that just so happen to go Democratic overall for POTUS (and often Senate) elections. If it’s such a good idea why isn’t Texas and the rest of the GOP-controlled states doing it?

A good point. One I don’t think we’d get an answer on let alone a truthful one. I find the whole thing suspect. A lot of these states went for Bush once or twice and nowhere did we hear something so radical being discussed. As I said, if they succeed, I want it to backfire on them big time.I’m already giddy at the thought of Texas becoming competitive in presidential elections as that state’s demographics change.

Yeah. The role of government thing is what made me think of Luap Nor but those three especially the latter two work very well. And regarding McCarthy, it’s funny to hear right wing pinheads like Bryan Fischer whine about “McCarthyism” directed at gunowners when they loved the original McCarthyism directed at people whose sole crime was having different values.

Really, how does he seriously claim to be a friend of the Jewish people when he spouts crap like that? I know I’m not Jewish so I can’t specifically comment but his attempts to make himself out to be close to the victims of the Holocaust is something I find disgusting. He’s just a guy who doesn’t like the government the way it is now. Big fucking deal. I wouldn’t like it if his ideal person was in power but I wouldn’t act like I was a Jew in occupied Europe either.

Oh, he’s no friend!

He went to Israel to hold a nutcase rally he called “Restoring Courage” because, god knows the Jews in Israel are all cowards.

Obviously they’re civilized anyway, or he would have come home in a casket for that insult.

He went to Israel to hold a nutcase rally he called “Restoring Courage” because, god knows the Jews in Israel are all cowards.

Obviously they’re civilized anyway, or he would have come home in a casket for that insult.

I didn’t say he was a friend. I said he claims to be one yet he does stuff like quote Anti-Semites like Skousen on his show. He’s an ass, something I think most people let alone most Israelis recognize.

I always had the idea of penning a short story where someone like Ron Paul gets real power and gets power hungry. Really, it’s easy for Paul and the Paulians to act like he’d be nothing but benevolent but I’ve seen how intolerant Paul and his fans are of anyone who doesn’t think Ludwig Von Mises wasn’t the greatest economist ever.

I always had the idea of penning a short story where someone like Ron Paul gets real power and gets power hungry. Really, it’s easy for Paul and the Paulians to act like he’d be nothing but benevolent but I’ve seen how intolerant Paul and his fans are of anyone who doesn’t think Ludwig Von Mises wasn’t the greatest economist ever.

In the largest political victory of his career, Rep. Ron Paul (R-TX) was elected Supreme Ruler of the planet of New Texas today, a remote, fiscally conservative planet populated by 1 billion tiny versions of himself.

“My people, I stand before you today to announce that I, Ron Paul of Earth, accept this position as your planet’s benevolent ruler,” said Emperor-elect Paul, smiling before millions of 18-inch-high Ron Pauls, who alternately applauded, cheered, and chanted, “You are our supreme leader,” at a victory rally held minutes after the Ron Paul News Network declared him the projected winner of the 2012 election. “From this day forth, the planet of New Texas shall be a veritable utopia for Ron Pauls of all sizes.”

Standing below the 50-foot solid-gold Ron Paul statue that adorns the city plaza of Paulville, New Texas’ capital city, Paul thanked the crowd and promised to “do right by the people of New Texas, who made the right choice at the polls today.” Ten minutes of sustained applause later, Paul took a moment to raise his campaign manager, Ron Paul CCN-14139-093, to eye level and personally thank him for “knocking this one out of the park.” Paul then thanked his wife, Carol, and their five children who, not being Ron Paul, will live in orbit around New Texas.

The worst part about Pennsylvania was the handful of Democrats who voted for the redistricting in return for safe seats in Philadelphia. Sometimes I wonder if Casey Sr. running to the right of most Republicans destroyed the old political equilibrium in the state.

I must have missed that in November. Thanks dude. Honestly, I think Rand is even worse than Ron if only the fact that we still have Rand in office and Rand is in the more powerful body and could easily take his father’s mantle for a long time. Now the positive is, he’s not his dad and some of the Paulians only worship Ronnie.

Lord, the few wingnuts I associate with are going nuts over news that Obama will be appearing with children tomorrow for his press conference. Apparently the idea of having children at a conference dealing with issues meant to address threats to them is taboo now. Mark that down, there will be a test later.

The worst part about Pennsylvania was the handful of Democrats who voted for the redistricting in return for safe seats in Philadelphia. Sometimes I wonder if Casey Sr. running to the right of most Republicans destroyed the old political equilibrium in the state.

I thought Casey was just to the right on social issues which was fairly common for a Democrat from his part of Pennsylvania but was otherwise in line with Dem orthodoxy.

Lord, the few wingnuts I associate with are going nuts over news that Obama will be appearing with children tomorrow for his press conference. Apparently the idea of having children at a conference dealing with issues meant to address threats to them is taboo now. Mark that down, there will be a test later.

Remember the harassment the kid who asked Congress to support SCHIP got?

Lord, the few wingnuts I associate with are going nuts over news that Obama will be appearing with children tomorrow for his press conference. Apparently the idea of having children at a conference dealing with issues meant to address threats to them is taboo now. Mark that down, there will be a test later.

It’s a appeal to emotion inappropriate for lawmaking. Children ought not to be used to score political points in that way, and that goes for Republicans as well.

Anybody watch the closing segment on the Rachel Maddow Show? It was about the way Republican state legislatures are trying to change state laws governing the election of Electoral College electors. It’s not an isolated effort. It’s being coordinated at the national level and the Republicans seem to be trying to take advantage of all the media coverage of gun control and debt ceiling stuff to sneak these laws under the radar. If these people had been successful in 2012, Barack Obama would have won the popular vote by 5 million yet lost the Presidency by about 40 electoral votes.
I posted some comments the other day about swamping the Republican Party with normal people. The idea was roundly mocked. It would seem that many people think the Republican Party is going to wither away. Well that’s a pipe dream. Thanks to gerrymandering, which will last at least through the end of the decade (until the next census), the Republicans can hold onto the House even though they lost the aggregate House voting by about a million votes. The same goes for many states. Wisconsin and Pennsylvania voted for Barack Obama, yet they are solidly red through the state house and the governor.
So how much damage do you think the Republican Party can do? If you’re not careful, a Republican President can nominate plenty of judges. I can easily imagine some of the liberal Supreme Court Justices waiting until after the 2016 election to retire. Are you sure you want to take the chance that the next President just has to be Hilary Clinton?

I usually don’t like kids being used in politics as well but I think this is an issue that effects kids. I mean for fuck sake. Look at the majority of the victims last month. 1st graders. And honestly maybe we do need a little appeal to emotion because here we are having been able to live past the age of six and those kids won’t get to enjoy what we have. They won’t get to enjoy life beyond six. Sorry, Sandy Hook’s emotional for me. Have a little cousin that’s in first grade and even resembles one of the victims a little. I don’t want us making rushed decisions without thinking about the consequences but I don’t think a litlte appeal to emotion is bad.

No, there’s no MBF moment here. The NRA didn’t just pick some random children, some high society kid who goes to a private school. They picked the daughters of the President of the United States to use against him, all but painted targets on their backs, and they did it for the purpose of driving up animosity towards the man. Obama choosing to appear on stage with children, all of whom will no doubt be subject to similar threats before the week is over, does not begin to compare to that.

Yeah, pretty much, but keep in mind the Senators when he was first elected were John Heinz and Arlen Specter- people who were hardly social conservatives.

Another thing to keep in mind about Pennsylvania is that it still has a lot of commonsense government programs that moderate the worst instincts of the Republicans. I think the elimination (or privatization) of these programs is Corbett’s long game, but it’s about to get a lot harder for him after the statewide offices were swept by the Democrats in this last election.

I posted some comments the other day about swamping the Republican Party with normal people. The idea was roundly mocked. It would seem that many people think the Republican Party is going to wither away. Well that’s a pipe dream. Thanks to gerrymandering, which will last at least through the end of the decade (until the next census), the Republicans can hold onto the House even though they lost the aggregate House voting by about a million votes. The same goes for many states. Wisconsin and Pennsylvania voted for Barack Obama, yet they are solidly red through the state house and the governor.

Clearly the bulletproof strategy is to join the party whose leadership is openly contemplating defrauding voters and asking nicely that they don’t.

Lord, the few wingnuts I associate with are going nuts over news that Obama will be appearing with children tomorrow for his press conference. Apparently the idea of having children at a conference dealing with issues meant to address threats to them is taboo now. Mark that down, there will be a test later.

What kind of politician brings a bunch of kids on stage when talking about an issue?

Yeah, pretty much, but keep in mind the Senators when he was first elected were John Heinz and Arlen Specter- people who were hardly social conservatives.

Another thing to keep in mind about Pennsylvania is that it still has a lot of commonsense government programs that moderate the worst instincts of the Republicans. I think the elimination (or privatization) of these programs is Corbett’s long game, but it’s about to get a lot harder for him after the statewide offices were swept by the Democrats in this last election.

Yeah, I remember thinking PA was unique in that regard that they would elect pro choice Republicans but pro life Democrats. I hope Crobett’s game gets harder for him. Did not hear that about the statewide offices. That’s good. My aunt lives in Pennsylvania and has been in some financial trouble lately. Eliminating some key social programs could really hurt people like her.

No, there’s no MBF moment here. The NRA didn’t just pick some random children, some high society kid who goes to a private school. They picked the daughters of the President of the United States to use against him, all but painted targets on their backs, and they did it for the purpose of driving up animosity towards the man. Obama choosing to appear on stage with children, all of whom will no doubt be subject to similar threats before the week is over, does not begin to compare to that.

The other, other non-MBF part of it being that the NRA are claiming that Obama is an elitist who doesn’t care if anyone else’s kids die.

Which would you rather have under your control? The legislature, or the Attorney General? I forget whether Corbett is in his first or second term, but I don’t know who’s available to run against him. Oh, and BTW, voter ID will be enforced next time.

If some deranged wingnut acted out in the way Beck is strongly sugggested people will, I would only blame the wingnut for what happened. But I would also hope Glenn Beck would be able to look himself in the mirror (Rush Limbaugh, Sean Hannity, Mark Levin, and all the wingnut talk show hosts around the country who parrot them, and who are parroted by them), and say, “What have I done???”

Both, obviously- but the Democrats can’t afford to be defeatist about it now. At the very least, Democratic control of those offices will hopefully lead to more honest auditing of Corbett’s corrupt management.

Both, obviously- but the Democrats can’t afford to be defeatist about it now. At the very least, Democratic control of those offices will hopefully lead to more honest auditing of Corbett’s corrupt management.

That’s so adorable. You think there’s going to be a wave of indignation that will cause a shitload of people in the gerrymandered state districts to vote for a bunch of socialists because some democrat ran a political prosecution of the governor. Count me unconvinced.

That’s so adorable. You think there’s going to be a wave of indignation that will cause a shitload of people in the gerrymandered state districts to vote for a bunch of socialists because some democrat ran a political prosecution of the governor. Count me unconvinced.

Yeah, okay. If I told you Republicans were going to win every House election for the next 20 years would that make you feel any better?

I’m listening to Ed Meese, Who I used to respect, talk about an Executive Order controlling guns as being an impeachable offense. Doesn’t the President have to first break a law to get impeached?

Yeah I think Meese missed the whole “high crimes and misdemeanors” part of the Constitution. Not “The president does a policy I dislike” because otherwise Meese’s boss and 39 presidents before him could have been impeached.

Clearly the bulletproof strategy is to join the party whose leadership is openly contemplating defrauding voters and asking nicely that they don’t.

How about that, I missed that post. What is the matter with some of you guys? I didn’t say anything at all about “asking nicely that they don’t”. You sure you’re not a closet Republican, just making shit up? I’m talking about swamping the party and primarying these clowns from the left.

If you are holding onto the slim hope that Netanyahu and his allies will not dominate the upcoming Israeli election, I offer a tiny bit of good news. A man who played a role in Mitt Romney’s sound defeat last year is getting involved:

A Chaplain is a specialist officer of the Adeptus Astartes and serves as the appointed spiritual leader of a Space Marine Chapter. Chaplains are the warrior-priests that minister to the spiritual well-being of their fellow Battle-Brothers, instilling in them the values and beliefs of the Chapter and promote the veneration or in rarer cases the actual worship of the Emperor of Mankind. Chaplains lead from the front as awe-inspiring warrior-priests, fighting wherever the foe is most fierce, leading his brethren and praising the Emperor through the destruction of His enemies. Rejoicing in the glorious act of war, Chaplains exhort their Battle-Brothers to ever greater deeds of bravery and devotion.

In battle, the Chaplains will be at the forefront of the Chapter’s battlelines, rousing their fellow Space Marines through their words and actions. Their Power Armour is black and often incorporates Imperial skull iconography, most commonly in the form of a skull-shaped helmet. Most Chaplains wield a Power Weapon that takes the form of a mace and is called a Crozius Arcanum. They are also equipped with an Imperial holy symbol known as a Rosarius. Individual Chaplains are assigned to each company within a Space Marine Chapter. Others, including the Reclusiarch who cares for the Chapter’s sacred Reclusiam and the Master of Sanctity who is the chief Chaplain of a Chapter and an officer whose rank is usually subordinate only to that of the Chapter Master himself, operate within the Chapter’s command structure independent of any specific company. A Chaplain is fanatically loyal to his Chapter and to the Emperor, and works to instill a similar devotion in his fellow Astartes.

If you are holding onto the slim hope that Netanyahu and his allies will not dominate the upcoming Israeli election, I offer a tiny bit of good news. A man who played a role in Mitt Romney’s sound defeat last year is getting involved:

[Embedded content]

So a certain Obama pick for a certain important government position wasn’t too far off with his “Israeli lobby” comment he made all those years ago after all…

It will be interesting in how they try to sell this on the national level. If they say “it’s more representative to split up the EV in each state” then the immediate response is to point out that they are only espousing it in the states that have GOP state legislature majorities that just so happen to go Democratic overall for POTUS (and often Senate) elections. If it’s such a good idea why isn’t Texas and the rest of the GOP-controlled states doing it?

Even without gerrymandering, even if congressional districts were drawn entirely fairly, if they split EV’s like this everywhere, it would still advantage the conservatives — other than Rhode Island, all the states with only 1 congressional district would have their three EV’s go R. It’s the states with big cities (i.e. the blue states) that would have their power diluted.

If Cali instead of 55 blue was 33 blue and 22 red, if NY instead of 29 blue were 18 blue and 11 red…

We are not dealing with states here, we are dealing with the notion that every US citizen is free to interpret the Constitution as they see fit, and if they disagree with the Federal Government, then they have the right to take up arms to defend whatever pea-brained, bigoted interpretation of the Constitution they currently hold.

If some deranged wingnut acted out in the way Beck is strongly sugggested people will, I would only blame the wingnut for what happened. But I would also hope Glenn Beck would be able to look himself in the mirror (Rush Limbaugh, Sean Hannity, Mark Levin, and all the wingnut talk show hosts around the country who parrot them, and who are parroted by them), and say, “What have I done???”

For chrissakes, it is accepted that the President’s family is to be protected by armed guards, that is part of the office.

The rightwingers want to get rid of that protection for the President, by requiring all people (including law enforcement, Secret Service and military personnel) protecting the White House to be unarmed.

Checking around the gun sites this morning, I see that even traditional manual action guns are in short supply and command premium prices, at least compared to a few months ago. They are in not in such short supply as semi-automatics, which have virtually disappeared, but they are obviously included in the current buying panic.
This means that a fair number of people believe it is likely that even, for example, bold action rifles and revolvers will be severely restricted in the near future; likely enough that they are willing to plunk down some real money for them at any rate. At the risk of belaboring the obvious, this is the product of paranoid fantasy and misinformation since no member of Congress, and certainly nobody in the administration, has proposed such a ban.

The rightwingers want to get rid of that protection for the President, by requiring all people (including law enforcement, Secret Service and military personnel) protecting the White House to be unarmed.

Because they are into political posturing. Again, it is accepted that the President and his family should be protected by armed guards.

Sadly, I don’t think it is just posturing.

The Secret Service has been protecting this man against multiple, credible threats since 18 months before he was elected. Since he took office, they’re dealing with more than triple the number of threats any previous president has faced, and they’ve arrested record numbers of plotters.

The wingers have very specific, horrific, tactical reasons they’d like him to be unprotected.

A good Samaritan who harbored six terrified survivors of the Sandy Hook massacre has been singled out by conspiracy theorists accusing him of being a liar and an actor.

…

The sincerity of that anguish was questioned by a group of conspiracy theorists who call themselves “truthers,” Salon reported earlier this month. These truthers have so far posted Rosen’s personal information online, created fake social media accounts using his name and harassed him via email and phone.

Checking around the gun sites this morning, I see that even traditional manual action guns are in short supply and command premium prices, at least compared to a few months ago. They are in not in such short supply as semi-automatics, which have virtually disappeared, but they are obviously included in the current buying panic.
This means that a fair number of people believe it is likely that even, for example, bold action rifles and revolvers will be severely restricted in the near future; likely enough that they are willing to plunk down some real money for them at any rate. At the risk of belaboring the obvious, this is the product of paranoid fantasy and misinformation since no member of Congress, and certainly nobody in the administration, has proposed such a ban.

Got to think that some of that is speculation—How many guns can one family maintain and bring to bear? There must be saturation in terms of a ‘normal’ sporting/self defense market. Waiting for the bubble to burst, here.

OT, but I watched the 1st episode of season 2 of “Girls” last night. This would not be worth a mention, except for the fact that professional misogynist and hysteric Ben Shapiro is obsessed with Lena Dunham and had the Breitbart Borg screaming about how her character wouldn’t date a black conservative.

Well…she was dating a black conservative in last night’s episode. She even asked him for his copy of “The Fountainhead” at the end of the episode. Now, I suppose the relationship won’t last, because that’s the whole point of the series: making jokes at the expense of the “woe-is-me” life of affluent artsy 20-somethings in Brooklyn. I suppose that subtlety flies over Shapiro’s head.

In the end, Ben Shapiro probably needs a better hobby, for the sake of his own sanity.

The right wingers made issue with the fact that President Obama restored the lifetime USSS security detail for the President once he’s out of office, amending the law back to a pre 1997 version that limited the detail for former presidents to 10 years after leaving office. Under the 1997 law individuals who are in office before January 1, 1997, will continue to receive Secret Service protection for their lifetime. Individuals elected to office after that time will receive protection for 10 years after leaving office. Therefore, President Clinton would have been the last president to receive lifetime protection under the 1997 law.

President Bush would have been affected by the 10 year cap, but Obama is now getting grief for a lifetime protection detail for former Presidents.

The right wingers made issue with the fact that President Obama restored the lifetime USSS security detail for the President once he’s out of office, amending the law back to a pre 1997 version that limited the detail for former presidents to 10 years after leaving office. Under the 1997 law individuals who are in office before January 1, 1997, will continue to receive Secret Service protection for their lifetime. Individuals elected to office after that time will receive protection for 10 years after leaving office. Therefore, President Clinton would have been the last president to receive lifetime protection under the 1997 law.

President Bush would have been affected by the 10 year cap, but Obama is now getting grief for a lifetime protection detail for former Presidents.

Obama creating jobs, but unfortunately they’re government jobs.

Surprised the nuts haven’t started referring to the Secret Service as becoming Obama’s “Praetorian Guard” or something like that. Guess they haven’t decided to switch the rhetoric over to Roman Imperial terms yet.

Surprised the nuts haven’t started referring to the Secret Service as becoming Obama’s “Praetorian Guard” or something like that. Guess they haven’t decided to switch the rhetoric over to Roman Imperial terms yet.

I’m only surprised they haven’t gone comparisons based on the Secret Service’s initials.

As for Rome, I doubt if 5% of them would even recognize that phrase “Praetorian Guard” came from ancient Rome as all they know of Rome is from the “Acts of the Apostles”…

Honestly, I’m surprised there aren’t more Idi Amin, Jean-Bedel Bokassa, Charles Taylor, or Francisco Macías Nguema comparisons. I figure the racist right who wants to pretend Obama is from Kenya would compare him to crazed African tyrants more often. Maybe the above guys just aren’t famous enough (although Amin was famous enough to be a film subject pretty recently).

The RWNJ godwinning is spinning so furiously that we could have a new unlimited power source that would put all others to shame (which would then be source for a new claim that Obama is putting the coal, oil, and nuclear industries out of business by fiat).

Honestly, I’m surprised there aren’t more Idi Amin, Jean-Bedel Bokassa, Charles Taylor, or Francisco Macías Nguema comparisons. I figure the racist right who wants to pretend Obama is from Kenya would compare him to crazed African tyrants more often. Maybe the above guys just aren’t famous enough (although Amin was famous enough to be a film subject pretty recently).

Most of these folks don’t own passports or the intellectual curiosity to be able to reference any of the aforementioned monsters. If it didn’t happen in America, or in a war America participated in, they are unlikely to know it happened at all.

It takes such incredible self-delusion to believe that having kids around for photo ops is something that only Obama and Hitler have done. It’s like the teleprompter thing.

Echo chamber stuff.

And politicians doing appearances with children being some sort of evil thing is sort of odd. There’s a very long running meme about campaigning politicians holding babies, etc. Just watch old WB cartoons and you see references to it there.

In an effort to increase support for itself, the Tea Party has found a way to appeal to more people…change its name to the National Liberty Federation!

Same idiots who can not spell, or read, and who hate women’s rights, minorities, gays, immigrants, unions, teachers, education, government workers, government itself, the non- religious, Indians, and of course “Libtards” and “Dumocrats”…but with a NEW LABEL!!!

BUT!!! IT GETS BETTER!

In a move of unsurpassed ignorance, these people who first named themselves after someone’s testicles resting on your face, but now they’re correcting it by naming themselves “The NLF” after the Viet Cong?!

If this takes over with other Teabagger groups I will only refer to them as the National Liberation Front and chant “Ho-Ho-Ho Chi Minh, the NLF is gonna win!” at them.

So I encountered a Sandy Hook truther on FB. Here are a few excerpts from our conversation, names removed:

Her: Watch the video and do the research, those grieving parents (none of which shed an actual tear) are actors

Me: I’ll take the word of the parents who buried their kids. It happened, and denying it or buying into some anti-gun conspiracy is an insult to those kids who died and is beneath contempt.

Her: Can you prove it? gUess we are on opposite sides of the fence I’m very conservative and you appear to be very liberal.

Her: Let me guess…you voted for obama

Me: What does voting have to.do with anything? 20 kids were murdered by a crazy guy. It happened. It was real. I suppose next you’re going to tell me that only liberals believe that the Earth is round or that we landed on the moon. Political slant has nothing to do with the objective fact that those kids died. You have to be a special level of paranoid or stupid to think it’s a hoax.

Her: You have to be a special level or paranoid or stupid to beleive everything you hear or see on tv

Her: you also have to be a new level of idiotic to support the current administration and all their antics

Her: want to argue politics? bring it on…you will lose!

Her: Prove to me that it happened Also, voting for the current potus shows you buy into all sorts of baloney

Her: Can you tell me why the person that was intervied as the school nurse doesn’t show up as a licensed nurse in CT

Her: [mutual FB friend’s name]- so sorry for this rant on your wall

Her: please take the time to research the topic for yourself.

Me: So you seriously don’t think it happened? You think it was all staged? Wow. I mean, you’re arguing against reality for political reasons. I can’t fathom that at all. Forget politics. We aren’t even starting from the same version of reality. That’s a much bigger hurdle. You might as well say the sky is magenta and water is dry.

Her: Not after reading and researching I put nothing past the current administration. Why don’t you research it and get back to me. Believe me when I say I take politics very seriously, I stay informed and am well read in the subject. While you’re doing research on sandy hook. Take a little deeper look at our prez. You may be sickened by what you find.

And there were a couple of other people in the thread who swore it was a case of “wag the dog” and that the videos they’ve seen raise doubts about the shootings happening at all, or about the events as they unfolded.

This is insane. These people think they’re educated and informed. They think that it’s a political hoax by the Obama administration. WTF.

Remember the first rule of naming RWNJ organizations: use liberty, family or constitution in it somehow.

And you can usually tell what type of group it is depending on which 3 of those monikers they utilize. Family always has some sort of creepy religious/woman hating type of goal, Constitution usually is for those who think the it’s a document that contains only the 2nd amendment and a bunch of privileges, and Liberty is pretty much an all-encompassing bugfuckism which is usually based on “fuck you, I got mine.”

I always had the idea of penning a short story where someone like Ron Paul gets real power and gets power hungry. Really, it’s easy for Paul and the Paulians to act like he’d be nothing but benevolent but I’ve seen how intolerant Paul and his fans are of anyone who doesn’t think Ludwig Von Mises wasn’t the greatest economist ever.

So I encountered a Sandy Hook truther on FB. Here are a few excerpts from our conversation, names removed:

And there were a couple of other people in the thread who swore it was a case of “wag the dog” and that the videos they’ve seen raise doubts about the shootings happening at all, or about the events as they unfolded.

This is insane. These people think they’re educated and informed. They think that it’s a political hoax by the Obama administration. WTF.

And you can usually tell what type of group it is depending on which 3 of those monikers they utilize. Family always has some sort of creepy religious/woman hating type of goal, Constitution usually is for those who think the it’s a document that contains only the 2nd amendment and a bunch of privileges, and Liberty is pretty much an all-encompassing bugfuckism which is usually based on “fuck you, I got mine.”

You left out that constitution groups are usually big on states rights.

So I encountered a Sandy Hook truther on FB. Here are a few excerpts from our conversation, names removed:

And there were a couple of other people in the thread who swore it was a case of “wag the dog” and that the videos they’ve seen raise doubts about the shootings happening at all, or about the events as they unfolded.

This is insane. These people think they’re educated and informed. They think that it’s a political hoax by the Obama administration. WTF.

Ask her if she thinks 9/11 was staged as well. After all, there’s some pretty “compelling evidence” to that effect. /// extreme

Which, of course, would lead to them being declared incompetent and unfit to own firearms, hence their dilemma. We can’t blame guns or gun-nuts, so we have to blame crazy people. But only certain crazy people.

Ask her if she thinks 9/11 was staged as well. After all, there’s some pretty “compelling evidence” to that effect. /// extreme

Oh, I gave up. When she couldn’t convince me that Sandy Hook was a topic worth “researching” to find out the “truth”, she switched tactics and started to insult me personally. She insulted my alma mater, the fact that I didn’t get my undergrad until I was in my 30’s, anything she could to try and hurt me.

At that point, I just said good riddance and went off to do something else.

Oh, I gave up. When she couldn’t convince me that Sandy Hook was a topic worth “researching” to find out the “truth”, she switched tactics and started to insult me personally. She insulted my alma mater, the fact that I didn’t get my undergrad until I was in my 30’s, anything she could to try and hurt me.

At that point, I just said good riddance and went off to do something else.

IS there anything positive about Facebook? Just walk away from it & leave it to the nutjobs.

And ultimately it will. Movements like this invariably burn themselves out.

It will once most of the new weapon regulations are passed and 99% of the gun owners realize that they don’t negatively effect them in any way. Of course, they’ll never realize the whole thing was a sick joke perpetrated by the weapons manufacturers and their mouthpieces like the NRA. That’s pretty much the only tangible result out of all of this - rich people got richer. The new regulations will most likely do very little to curb gun-related violence, a bunch of morons will have been exposed by their pro-gun anti-government paranoia, but Wayne LaPierre will be able to stuff his pillows with Benjamins.

It will once most of the new weapon regulations are passed and 99% of the gun owners realize that they don’t negatively effect them in any way. Of course, they’ll never realize the whole thing was a sick joke perpetrated by the weapons manufacturers and their mouthpieces like the NRA. That’s pretty much the only tangible result out of all of this - rich people got richer. The new regulations will most likely do very little to curb gun-related violence, a bunch of morons will have been exposed by their pro-gun anti-government paranoia, but Wayne LaPierre will be able to stuff his pillows with Benjamins.

That’s the sad part…..it occurs to me a lot of the folks on the right simply don’t realize they’re the mark in an elaborate swindle.

Honestly, I’m surprised there aren’t more Idi Amin, Jean-Bedel Bokassa, Charles Taylor, or Francisco Macías Nguema comparisons. I figure the racist right who wants to pretend Obama is from Kenya would compare him to crazed African tyrants more often. Maybe the above guys just aren’t famous enough (although Amin was famous enough to be a film subject pretty recently).

Honestly, I’m surprised there aren’t more Idi Amin, Jean-Bedel Bokassa, Charles Taylor, or Francisco Macías Nguema comparisons. I figure the racist right who wants to pretend Obama is from Kenya would compare him to crazed African tyrants more often. Maybe the above guys just aren’t famous enough (although Amin was famous enough to be a film subject pretty recently).

Probably because most of them are so ignorant they have no idea who any of those people are.

Oh, this is new. I’m no longer posting on that thread, but the OBAMA IZ USING KIDS AS PROPS fail has made an appearance:

If the kids did die, then why is one of them posing for pics with the president days after the tragedy??? And why were there funds set up for the dead people’s families before they even knew they were dead? I’m not saying I believe it all either, but some things need to be answered!!

These are deeply stupid people. They’re looking for anything to blame on Obama. This is ODS on bath salts.

IS there anything positive about Facebook? Just walk away from it & leave it to the nutjobs.

There’s plenty positive in my experience. My encounters with nutjobs are few and far between because I tend to ignore politics on there. I just got dragged into that conversation last night because I called the whole Sandy Hook truther thing nonsense.

As Beck foresees it, Obama will initially accept some sort of compromise gun control legislation from Congress but then start complaining that it didn’t go far enough while waiting patiently for another high-profile gun crime to take place which he can then use as evidence that the compromise legislation was insufficient and thus provide justification for issuing an executive order banning and confiscating weapons.

Maybe if responsible gun owners would start being responsible there won’t be another “high profile gun crime”.

At which point, Americans will have two choices: either to hole up in heavily armed compounds à la Waco and Ruby Ridge or to peacefully protest and resist. Beck prefers the latter because, as everyone knows, things Waco and Ruby Ridge just provide an opportunity for the government to kill its citizens while the media portrays the victims as a bunch of crazies:

I’m a big fan of the wall-compound for wingnuts plan, although the difference between it and the FEMA trailer prison camp doesn’t strike me as being really large.

Her: Can you tell me why the person that was intervied as the school nurse doesn’t show up as a licensed nurse in CT

This one is easy to check, and it’s already been done. There is a Sarah Cox who is a licensed nurse in Newtown. Sally is a pretty common nickname for Sarah, but these Newtown-truthers don’t seem to recognize that.

That’s a concern of mine as well. I can easily see an assassin or another Tim McVeigh with these morons. Or at least, they’ll attempt it. Did you hear about the “militia” in Alaska trying to kill Federal officals? They got busted thanks to a couple of informants, and they’re in deep shit.

This one is easy to check, and it’s already been done. There is a Sarah Cox who is a licensed nurse in Newtown. Sally is a pretty common nickname for Sarah, but these Newtown-truthers don’t seem to recognize that.

It could be like here, too…we don’t usually have an actual nurse sitting in the school nurse’s office. It’s just a person given some first aid training who handles stuff. The actual school nurse is assigned to multiple schools and goes to a different one each day.

I checked CT regulations. There has to be at least one RN in each district.

State law requires each local or regional board of education to appoint at least one school nurse or nurse practitioner (another title for advanced practice registered nurse or APRN). School nurses must meet the qualifications established in regulations adopted by the State Board of Education in consultation with the Public Health Department. And they must submit to a criminal history record check (CGS § 10-212).

With some exceptions, these regulations (Conn. Agency Regs., 10-212-1 to -7, adopted in 1982 and incorporated in the Public Health Code) require a school nurse to be an RN with a current Connecticut license. The nurse must have the equivalent of at least one year of full-time employment as an RN within the immediate past five years. And the nurse must have among his or her educational experience at least 12 college credits, 18 continuing education units (CEUs), or 180 workshop or in-service training hours distributed as follows:

Hey, Lizards - prayers, positive waves, happy thoughts what ever you do please. We’ve had no income since thanksgiving when my wife’s in home nursing care client passed away. Now, though, she has an interview tomorrow for a RN position and I’ll be interviewing next week for a half time book keeping and access database creating position.

Hey, Lizards - prayers, positive waves, happy thoughts what ever you do please. We’ve had no income since thanksgiving when my wife’s in home nursing care client passed away. Now, though, she has an interview tomorrow for a RN position and I’ll be interviewing next week for a half time book keeping and access database creating position.

Any help is good help :)

Thanks!

Moriarity has been tied down, given a stiff drink, and a manual on German transmissions.
;)

Hey, Lizards - prayers, positive waves, happy thoughts what ever you do please. We’ve had no income since thanksgiving when my wife’s in home nursing care client passed away. Now, though, she has an interview tomorrow for a RN position and I’ll be interviewing next week for a half time book keeping and access database creating position.

Hey, Lizards - prayers, positive waves, happy thoughts what ever you do please. We’ve had no income since thanksgiving when my wife’s in home nursing care client passed away. Now, though, she has an interview tomorrow for a RN position and I’ll be interviewing next week for a half time book keeping and access database creating position.

The National Rifle Association claims to speak for more than four million gun owners. But the shots are really called by a hush-hush group of 76 directors. The majority are nominated via a top-down process and elected by a small fraction of NRA members. A breakdown of the current board, based on their official bios:

- 87% are men. 93% are white.
- 25% are current or former federal, state, or local lawmakers or officials.
- 22% are current or former law enforcement officers. 30% are current or former members of the military.
- 24% are lawyers.
- 12% are entertainers or athletes.
- 64% are hunters. 71% are sport or competitive shooters.
- At least 71% were nominated, endorsed, or selected by the NRA’s Nominating Committee.

A new RWNJ meme is taking hold on my Facebook - that Gov. Cuomo enacted the new NY gun law without a vote.

This is fucking crazy. These people are, as Lidane said, working with their own distinct reality. How the fuck do you deal with that?

Well, they use the current House of Representatives as their standard for formulating and passing legislation. New York state got something enacted in less than 100 days - so it must have been some sort of dictatorial conspiracy at work.
///

There were separate Senate and Assembly votes, message of necessity attached, and Gov. cuomo signed it into law. These people who are claiming that Cuomo enacted the SAFE act by fiat are just flat out operating in a separate and distinct reality that is not the current one.

A new RWNJ meme is taking hold on my Facebook - that Gov. Cuomo enacted the new NY gun law without a vote.

This is fucking crazy. These people are, as Lidane said, working with their own distinct reality. How the fuck do you deal with that?

At as great a distance from yourself and your family as possible. Yes, I’m serious. If you’re like me and your family contains a few of these psychos, I’ve pretty much made it an ultimatum - if this is batshittery is discussed in any way, you’re dead to me.

You can lead these people to facts, but you can’t make them think. They are the absolute end-product of the assault on critical thinking in this country, perpetuated by religious and political cultism. There is no reasoning, talking to, explaining, asking to think or to read.

It is IMHO best not to engage these folks. They are precisely the type of people who should not be permitted access to firearms because their perception of reality is faulty and their reasoning is clearly impaired. They should merely be added to the ATF list for people not able to possess firearms. You know that federal legislation the NRA is so keen on to prevent “crazy” people from accessing guns?

Her research consists of Internet posts and “articles” bouncing around the echo chamber.

Exactly! Sometimes, it’s better to coach people on their research skills. Like pointing out that they are reading an “article” originally posted years before or one that has been cut and pasted many times—which makes it as reliable as a rumor. Most people have some little bell that goes off when it comes to the word “rumor”. Probably from the “rumor” game everyone played in grade school.

But, I don’t do this very often. Mostly I just keep quiet. I don’t always have that much patience.

Heh, I said the same thing the other night. It’s a big conundrum for them; they won’t ever blame guns, so they have to start blaming “crazy people,” which of course entails increasing mental-health checks for people looking to buy weapons. And many of these people shouldn’t be allowed near sharp objects, let alone weaponry.

The NRA knows its audience. The organization’s main selling point is the fear in old white people that the violent minorities are coming to rob you and burn your house down and rape your daughters. After all, where was the NRA when Trayvon Martin was shot? Shouldn’t they have argued that Martin should have been armed to protect himself?

I have a theory that the main reason the GOP does so poorly with young people is that they’re still selling the boogeymen of 1968: rioting minorities, hippies smoking weed, and the communists. For a generation who has guzzled beer and absinthe in Prague (as I have) or has moved back into the cities their parents fled (as I have: Fort Greene, Brooklyn), this kind of stuff is so ridiculously alien. They might as well be selling fear of the Visigoths.

Exactly! Sometimes, it’s better to coach people on their research skills. Like pointing out that they are reading an “article” originally posted years before or one that has been cut and pasted many times—which makes it as reliable as a rumor. Most people have some little bell that goes off when it comes to the word “rumor”. Probably from the “rumor” game everyone played in grade school.

But, I don’t do this very often. Mostly I just keep quiet. I don’t always have that much patience.

Sometimes a person will thank you for pointing out a fake quote and ask for advice on how to determine if it is authentic. Others will just SPAM BLOCK you for linking to TEH LIBRUL SNOAPZ.

President Reagan had 5 executive orders in his 8 year term, Clinton had 15 executive orders in his 8 year term, Bush had 62 executive orders in his 8 year term and Obama has had 923 in his last 3 year term.

Sometimes a person will thank you for pointing out a fake quote and ask for advice on how to determine if it is authentic. Others will just SPAM BLOCK you for linking to TEH LIBRUL SNOAPZ.

For that reason, I don’t use snopes as an example. I usually find the source document and use that.

Usually, I think they feel really stupid because they weren’t aware that they (as regular citizens) could have access to the “source”. They’ve been deluded into thinking they are mere ants and the pundits are near G-d—with privileged insight into the nature of things.

Mostly, it’s a matter of taking the pundits off Mt Olympus and showing that they are flawed human beings. I’m amazed at the number of people who think their own brains are sub-standard and that they couldn’t understand the Congressional Record no matter how hard they tried.

Exactly! Sometimes, it’s better to coach people on their research skills. Like pointing out that they are reading an “article” originally posted years before or one that has been cut and pasted many times—which makes it as reliable as a rumor. Most people have some little bell that goes off when it comes to the word “rumor”. Probably from the “rumor” game everyone played in grade school.

But, I don’t do this very often. Mostly I just keep quiet. I don’t always have that much patience.

I don’t think they’re posting to look for truth. They’re looking for feedback reinforcement of their prejudices. Thus the efficiency of the echo chamber (and retweeting of the same misinformation) since they hear a lot more voices agreeing with them than a few that are saying, “Wait a minute, that’s not accurate.”

I got burnt out on this a long time ago. Too many “rational” discussions where as you won points they retreated to the next point, and so forth, until they suddenly retreated right back to the first point (again). At that point you realize that they were not going to sway from the general viewpoint based on any evidence you offered and that you were wasting your time with them. (Unless you’d paid your five pounds of course.)

The NRA knows its audience. The organization’s main selling point is the fear in old white people that the violent minorities are coming to rob you and burn your house down and rape your daughters. After all, where was the NRA when Trayvon Martin was shot? Shouldn’t they have argued that Martin should have been armed to protect himself?

they keep not-very-subtly making the point that they believe americans will not be safe as long as negroes have guns

i am waiting for some public figure so call them out on this in so many words

For a generation who has guzzled beer and absinthe in Prague (as I have) or has moved back into the cities their parents fled (as I have: Fort Greene, Brooklyn), this kind of stuff is so ridiculously alien. They might as well be selling fear of the Visigoths.

Yes, Conservatives don’t realize that their “future” is the current reality.

A majority of Americans favor such gun control measures as banning assault weapons and expanding background checks on those who buy guns and ammunition, with support for banning high-capacity ammunition magazines at a new high in ABC News/Washington Post polls.

With Vice President Joe Biden set to present recommendations that were prompted by the Newtown, Conn., school shootings last month, this latest poll shows overwhelming support for certain moves: Eighty-eight percent favor background checks on firearms buyers at gun shows; 76 percent support checks on buyers of ammunition and 71 percent back a new federal database that would track all gun sales.

(METHODOLOGY – This ABC News/Washington Post poll was conducted by telephone Jan. 10-13, 2013, among a random national sample of 1,001 adults, including landline and cell-phone-only respondents. Results have a margin of sampling error of 3.5 points, including design effect. Partisan divisions are 33-24-37 percent, Democrats-Republicans-independents.
The survey was produced for ABC News by Langer Research Associates of New York, N.Y., with sampling, data collection and tabulation by Abt-SRBI of New York, N.Y.
Analysis by Gary Langer.
ABC News polls can be found at ABCNEWS.com at [Link: abcnews.com…]

I don’t think they’re posting to look for truth. They’re looking for feedback reinforcement of their prejudices. Thus the efficiency of the echo chamber (and retweeting of the same misinformation) since they hear a lot more voices agreeing with them than a few that are saying, “Wait a minute, that’s not accurate.”

I got burnt out on this a long time ago. Too many “rational” discussions where as you won points they retreated to the next point, and so forth, until they suddenly retreated right back to the first point (again). At that point you realize that they were not going to sway from the general viewpoint based on any evidence you offered and that you were wasting your time with them. (Unless you’d paid your five pounds of course.)

The Purpose of Rhetoric is to Persuade.

Usually, I don’t engage in lengthy discussions. I just point out some flaw or link the source and move on.

Often it is best to simply say nothing, or in some cases to simply point out that the person is not worthy of engaging on a serious matter. It happens here too. Yesterday in a 4 post back and forth on Israel an individual on LGF misrepresented my position 4 or 5 times. It became clear he was engaged not in a debate with me based on facts, but rather in a cathartic diatribe to satisfy his own (erroneous) pre-conceived notions.
Eventually I just told him to shut up. There is no way to have a real discussion with such a person.

Often it is best to simply say nothing, or in some cases to simply point out that the person is not worthy of engaging on a serious matter. It happens here too. Yesterday in a 4 post back and forth on Israel an individual on LGF misrepresented my position 4 or 5 times. It became clear he was engaged not in a debate with me based on facts, but rather in a cathartic diatribe to satisfy his own (erroneous) pre-conceived notions.
Eventually I just told him to shut up. There is no way to have a real discussion with such a person.

Yeah, I find people need to repeat, repeat, and repeat without rinsing in an effort to memorize the rhetoric into which they’ve invested.

I don’t think they’re posting to look for truth. They’re looking for feedback reinforcement of their prejudices. Thus the efficiency of the echo chamber (and retweeting of the same misinformation) since they hear a lot more voices agreeing with them than a few that are saying, “Wait a minute, that’s not accurate.”

I got burnt out on this a long time ago. Too many “rational” discussions where as you won points they retreated to the next point, and so forth, until they suddenly retreated right back to the first point (again). At that point you realize that they were not going to sway from the general viewpoint based on any evidence you offered and that you were wasting your time with them. (Unless you’d paid your five pounds of course.)

my much-too-extensive experience of this was instructive in some way, although i’m not sure how exactly except perhaps as a sociological or psychoanalytic exercise

generally, i discovered that a lot of people seem to have read those web pages on common logical fallacies and mistaken them for guidelines for “debate”

Anyone know when socialized medicine actually came to Germany? It sounds like the kind of think Bismarck would have done (leaving aside the quality of “medicine” in the 19th century) on his conservative belief that a social safety net is necessary for a stable and prosperous society.

Hitlers 1st term went well people loved him.2nd term he socialized medicine and disarmed the citizens

yeah except actually not at all in reality

i do believe that there a two or three books that have been published on nazi germany over the decades that one could consult to learn about what actually happened in this obscure and unexamined period in 20th century history

Anyone know when socialized medicine actually came to Germany? It sounds like the kind of think Bismarck would have done (leaving aside the quality of “medicine” in the 19th century) on his conservative belief that a social safety net is necessary for a stable and prosperous society.

According to wiki

Germany has the world’s oldest universal health care system, dating back to Otto von Bismarck’s social legislation, which included the Health Insurance Bill of 1883, Accident Insurance Bill of 1884, and Old Age and Disability Insurance Bill of 1889.

Germany has the world’s oldest universal health care system, dating back to Otto von Bismarck’s social legislation, which included the Health Insurance Bill of 1883, Accident Insurance Bill of 1884, and Old Age and Disability Insurance Bill of 1889.

Anyone know when socialized medicine actually came to Germany? It sounds like the kind of think Bismarck would have done (leaving aside the quality of “medicine” in the 19th century) on his conservative belief that a social safety net is necessary for a stable and prosperous society.

There’s also the point that the Iron Chancellor was doing a bit of political triangulation in that move…..by bringing forth universal health care, he undercut the socialists of that era.

Germany has the world’s oldest universal health care system, dating back to Otto von Bismarck’s social legislation, which included the Health Insurance Bill of 1883, Accident Insurance Bill of 1884, and Old Age and Disability Insurance Bill of 1889.

at the time it was said that Bismark threw the socialists in jail and then stole their ideas

of course, 19th century socialism espoused such radial ideas as the 40 hour week, banning child labor, and the right of workers to join collective bargaining organizations

Did Hitler even have “terms” of office? He was appointed chancellor in 1933 and quickly arranged to gain complete control of the government. By that measure, he had exactly one term of office that lasted until 1945.

my much-too-extensive experience of this was instructive in some way, although i’m not sure how exactly except perhaps as a sociological or psychoanalytic exercise

generally, i discovered that a lot of people seem to have read those web pages on common logical fallacies and mistaken them for guidelines for “debate”

My experience(s) that made me identify and then avoid these “debates” was formulated back in the 80s and 90s during college and then doing fraternity volunteer work.

Not actually discussing politics, but alcohol use, risk management, and limited resource budgeting. If you think gun control is a loaded topic, try talking underage drinking and alcohol with groups of male college students.

(And “you can pry my beer from my cold dead hands” is not the talking point you want to get to since that is exactly what you are trying to get them to avoid.)

Did Hitler even have “terms” of office? He was appointed chancellor in 1933 and quickly arranged to gain complete control of the government. By that measure, he had exactly one term of office that lasted until 1945.

With all the crap that’s flying around on the far right, people are forgetting what a real tyranny or dictatorship is like.

I think they’re just typing what feels good to them, and fits into their victim/justified indignation mindset. It’s disconnected from what’s really happening now or what actually happened in the past.

The folks on the right have worked themselves into quite a state; being persecuted, GULAG’ed, forced to bow down to Emperor Palpatine Obama, and of course, let’s not forget being made to convert to Islam en masse. These folks have lost all connection to reality and developed a siege mentality of the first magnitude.

Did Hitler even have “terms” of office? He was appointed chancellor in 1933 and quickly arranged to gain complete control of the government. By that measure, he had exactly one term of office that lasted until 1945.

Yes of course. But those “facts” did not mirror Obama’s democratically elected second term so they were abandoned in favour of a fiction that made for an easily absorbed tweet.

The folks on the right have worked themselves into quite a state; being persecuted, GULAG’ed, forced to bow down to Emperor Palpatine Obama, and of course, let’s not forget being made to convert to Islam en masse. These folks have lost all connection to reality and developed a siege mentality of the first magnitude.

They’re at the top of the heap (politically, religiously, biologically), therefore they must be constantly under attack by the lesser peoples trying to tear them down either openly or covertly.

Same old playbook. Keep the followers convinced that they are the elect and are being properly led and protected from the “other” as long as the contributions and deference continues to be made.

With all the crap that’s flying around on the far right, people are forgetting what a real tyranny or dictatorship is like.

They have no fucking idea. As someone noted elsewhere here, someone who has really lived under such circumstances could clearly say there is no resemblance between our government and a tyranny/dictatorship.

And to answer the question, yes, he would have won in 2008, probably by a larger popular vote margin, because he would have gotten more support in the fever swamps of the racist right where shit like this tweet comes from.

There was a map (I don’t have the time to look for it) that showed Obama’s county-by-county vote total in comparison to John Kerry’s. The only places he did worse were in a belt stretching from West Virginia down through Arkansas. Gee, I wonder why that would be…..

It’s what I don’t get. What the hell are they afraid of? I’ve interacted with black people my entire life. Hell, my first kiss was from a black girl at the age of six, when she chased me around the playground and finally tripped me (I guess I must’ve been a cute kid). When I lived in Berlin, I hung out with fellows from Nigeria, Cameroon, Liberia, Uganda, etc. And of course, Turks galore.

Are they afraid black people are getting to avenge themselves upon their pasty white asses? I really fail to understand it.

In an interview with NPR, Whole Foods CEO and self-professed libertarian John Mackey revived his previous criticism of Obamacare — but this time, with a new twist. While Mackey incorrectly denounced the landmark health reform law as “socialism” in a controversial 2009 Wall Street Journal op-ed, the multimillionaire CEO has revised his assessment and now considers Obamacare — also incorrectly — to be closer to “fascism”:

“Technically speaking, it’s more like fascism. Socialism is where the government owns the means of production. In fascism, the government doesn’t own the means of production, but they do control it, and that’s what’s happening with our healthcare programs and these reforms.”

It’s what I don’t get. What the hell are they afraid of? I’ve interacted with black people my entire life. Hell, my first kiss was from a black girl at the age of six, when she chased me around the playground and finally tripped me (I guess I must’ve been a cute kid). When I lived in Berlin, I hung out with fellows from Nigeria, Cameroon, Liberia, Uganda, etc. And of course, Turks galore.

Are they afraid black people are getting to avenge themselves upon their pasty white asses? I really fail to understand it.

Mackey is an idiot. I work in the food industry, so I had the misfortune of hearing him speak at a conference shortly after election day this past November. It was mostly an incoherent rant about how businesspeople are unfairly demonized by the government and “intellectuals”.

Fuck Whole Foods. It’s overpriced. I’ll go to Trader Joe’s any day of the week.

Fear of the “other.” Most if not all of these people live among only white people. They’re probably not too keen on Chinese and other Asians, too, but for different reasons.

How dreadfully boring these people’s lives must be. I’ve traveled the world (thanks, TEFL Certificate!) and lived all over. I love it. I enjoy meeting people from everywhere. I love cities like Istanbul, Aleppo (before it was blown to shit, at least), Kampala, Ho Chi Minh City, Tokyo, Beijing, Cairo, etc.

What is there to be afraid of? We’re all human beings. Sure, people live differently, and what of it?

Or is it that they simply cannot wrap their little provincial minds around things that are “different”?

Mackey is an idiot. I work in the food industry, so I had the misfortune of hearing him speak at a conference shortly after election day this past November. It was mostly an incoherent rant about how businesspeople are unfairly demonized by the government and “intellectuals”.

Fuck Whole Foods. It’s overpriced. I’ll go to Trader Joe’s any day of the week.

Whole Foods (by me) has the best deli. It’s the only place I can go and get enough food that I can eat to last the whole week.

Hey, Lizards - prayers, positive waves, happy thoughts what ever you do please. We’ve had no income since thanksgiving when my wife’s in home nursing care client passed away. Now, though, she has an interview tomorrow for a RN position and I’ll be interviewing next week for a half time book keeping and access database creating position.

How dreadfully boring these people’s lives must be. I’ve traveled the world (thanks, TEFL Certificate!) and lived all over. I love it. I enjoy meeting people from everywhere. I love cities like Istanbul, Aleppo (before it was blown to shit, at least), Kampala, Ho Chi Minh City, Tokyo, Beijing, Cairo, etc.

What is there to be afraid of? We’re all human beings. Sure, people live differently, and what of it?

Or is it that they simply cannot wrap their little provincial minds around things that are “different”?

I grew-up in a Metropolitan area and get the creeps when I’m surrounded by only white people. Seems so wrong to me.

I’ve found that, among most Americans, I am an anomaly. Especially since my main experiences with non-whites (neighbors and friends) growing up was with Arab-Americans. Homemade Bakalava -mmmmmmmmmm!

It’s so frustrating because I can’t “hear” the vowel sounds. Drives me up the wall.

Tones are tough. I worked in Beijing off and on for years. It took a long time for me to get the tonal difference between the word for chicken and the word for prostitute. I can’t tell you how many times I ordered the spicy peanut hooker in a restaurant./

How dreadfully boring these people’s lives must be. I’ve traveled the world (thanks, TEFL Certificate!) and lived all over. I love it. I enjoy meeting people from everywhere. I love cities like Istanbul, Aleppo (before it was blown to shit, at least), Kampala, Ho Chi Minh City, Tokyo, Beijing, Cairo, etc.

What is there to be afraid of? We’re all human beings. Sure, people live differently, and what of it?

Or is it that they simply cannot wrap their little provincial minds around things that are “different”?

I would bet some of them have never left their home county, and most their state, much less visit another country.

TEFL, huh? Did you do a certificate program, or go to university to get it?

I grew-up in a Metropolitan area and get the creeps when I’m surrounded by only white people. Seems so wrong to me.

I’ve found that, among most Americans, I am an anomaly. Especially since my main experiences with non-whites (neighbors and friends) growing up was with Arab-Americans. Homemade Bakalava -mmmmmmmmmm!

I know among my white friends/acquaintances in Portland, OR, I’m practically the reincarnation of Ernest Hemingway (for my lifestyle and travels), and some of them consider me “suspect” for having been all over and hanging around so many different types of people. It makes them……”nervous”, as one of them put it.

We blur our words together. Chinese (and maybe Vietnamese) say. each. word. separately. Teaching my Chinese students to connect their words together is an uphill battle, because I am combatting 15+ years of their education in spoken Mandarin.

Tones are tough. I worked in Beijing off and on for years. It took a long time for me to get the tonal difference between the word for chicken and the word for prostitute. I can’t tell you how many times I ordered the spicy peanut hooker in a restaurant./

Obama’s such a dictator that he’s got to propose legislation that will be watered down to nothingness by the House GOP and has to go through long established legislative and judicial review channels.

After all, even if he agrees with Congress to enact a law on firearms, those same laws are subject to judicial review and a potential decision by the US Supreme Court finding the law unconstitutional that would essentially void the law’s effect.

Civics are completely beyond these people. US government and history are beyond these people. They are beyond reasoning with at this point.

1. Issue a Presidential Memorandum to require federal agencies to make relevant
data available to the federal background check system.

2. Address unnecessary legal barriers, particularly relating to the Health Insurance
Portability and Accountability Act, that may prevent states from making
information available to the background check system.

3. Improve incentives for states to share information with the background check
system.

4. Direct the Attorney General to review categories of individuals prohibited from
having a gun to make sure dangerous people are not slipping through the cracks.
5. Propose rulemaking to give law enforcement the ability to run a full background
check on an individual before returning a seized gun.

6. Publish a letter from ATF to federally licensed gun dealers providing guidance on
how to run background checks for private sellers.

1. Issue a Presidential Memorandum to require federal agencies to make relevant data available to the federal background check system.

2. Address unnecessary legal barriers, particularly relating to the Health Insurance Portability and Accountability Act, that may prevent states from making information available to the background check system.
3. Improve incentives for states to share information with the background check system.
4. Direct the Attorney General to review categories of individuals prohibited from having a gun to make sure dangerous people are not slipping through the cracks.
5. Propose rulemaking to give law enforcement the ability to run a full background check on an individual before returning a seized gun.
6. Publish a letter from ATF to federally licensed gun dealers providing guidance on how to run background checks for private sellers.
7. Launch a national safe and responsible gun ownership campaign.
8. Review safety standards for gun locks and gun safes (Consumer Product Safety Commission).
9. Issue a Presidential Memorandum to require federal law enforcement to trace guns recovered in criminal investigations.
10. Release a DOJ report analyzing information on lost and stolen guns and make it widely available to law enforcement.
11. Nominate an ATF director.
12. Provide law enforcement, first responders, and school officials with proper training for active shooter situations.
13. Maximize enforcement efforts to prevent gun violence and prosecute gun crime.
14. Issue a Presidential Memorandum directing the Centers for Disease Control to research the causes and prevention of gun violence.
15. Direct the Attorney General to issue a report on the availability and most effective use of new gun safety technologies and challenge the private sector to develop innovative technologies.
16. Clarify that the Affordable Care Act does not prohibit doctors asking their patients about guns in their homes.
17. Release a letter to health care providers clarifying that no federal law prohibits them from reporting threats of violence to law enforcement authorities.
18. Provide incentives for schools to hire school resource officers.
19. Develop model emergency response plans for schools, houses of worship and institutions of higher education.
20. Release a letter to state health officials clarifying the scope of mental health services that Medicaid plans must cover.
21. Finalize regulations clarifying essential health benefits and parity requirements within ACA exchanges.
22. Commit to finalizing mental health parity regulations.
23. Launch a national dialogue led by Secretaries Sebelius and Duncan on mental health.

I have a Trader Joe’s in walking distance (~5 blocks), local produce stores (Center City Philadelphia), and I tend to hit one of the big suburban Wegman’s every other weekend for other items. A combination that I am pretty happy with.

Obama asked Congress to reinstate and strengthen the assault weapons ban and to impose a 10-round limit on ammunition magazines. He also called on Congress to require criminal background checks for all gun sales.

Congress should also approve a law against so-called “straw purchasing” of guns, and authorize new funding for gun violence research, mental health efforts, and a program that would place mental health counselors and police officers in schools. In total, the White House estimates that the president’s requests would total “in the neighborhood” of $500 million in the coming fiscal year.

The extensive proposals do not include any calls for restrictions on video games or violent films, which some have argued are a contributing factor. But it would have the Centers for Disease Control study violence in the media.

Much of Obama’s plan is expected to meet resistance on Capitol Hill — from both parties.

Senate Majority Leader Harry Reid (D-Nev.) suggested this week that he won’t bring an assault weapons ban to the floor.

But Sen. Patrick Leahy, the chairman of the Senate Judiciary Committee, said Wednesday that he’ll hold a gun violence hearings on Jan. 30. The Vermont Democrat singled out background checks, mental health policies and anti-trafficking measures as areas of particular interest.

I think this may be my cue to finally rid myself of Facebook. It, um…. just got ugly.

I had an encounter with a guy posting on my brother’s page, or whatever they call it. It started out to be about gun control, but this guy started posting links to wingnut sites about how dangerous Muslims are. I gave him some push-back, so he implied, no, he said I was ignorant, and he referenced Robert Spencer. I told him he doesn’t know what I have read and where I have been, and I kept pushing back, and my brother ended up blocking him. I doubt I changed the mind of the bigot, but I may have educated my brother in the process.

A presidential memorandum is a type of presidential order issued by the President of the United States to the executive branch of the United States government. Presidential memoranda do not have an established process for issuance or publication. Presidential memoranda are generally considered less prestigious than executive orders.

A little-known kibosh on government research into the public health effects of gun violence is expected to be lifted after President Barack Obama called Wednesday for renewed scientific inquiry — and funding — to address the problem.

Obama issued a presidential memorandum directing the Centers for Disease Control and Prevention and other scientific agencies to research the causes and prevention of gun violence — and he called on Congress to provide $10 million to pay for it.

“We don’t benefit from ignorance. We don’t benefit from not knowing the science from this epidemic of violence,” he said.

The move effectively reverses 17 years of what scientists say has been a virtual ban on basic federal research and is part of a package of new gun control policies aimed at reducing gun violence after tragedies such as the shootings last year in Aurora, Colo., and Newtown, Conn. It would encourage research including links between video games, media images and violence.

The action immediately was praised by scientists who said pro-gun advocates — including the National Rifle Association — had choked off funding for CDC firearms research starting in the mid-1990s and imposed a chilling effect on those who dared to pursue it.

Great. The solution to nutjobs thinking it’s OK for everyone to be armed to the teeth at all times is to train elementary school teachers to deal with the problem.

What a load of crap.

umm, no. That is not what those two items mean.

“School Resource Officers” are on-duty police for schools. They get additional tasking and training peculiar to their duty station.

“Emergency plans” means: identifying when to lock doors and hide or use evacuation routes, what those routes are, how to locate and pass along location of shooter(s), who if anyone should confront and how (if you’ve got a trained negotiator on premises, for example - some schools do), and so forth. If your school allows armed teachers then part of the plan will be priorities for those teachers - get the kids out or put them behind barricades and stand ready or go hunt the shooter down (Yes the last is stupid. But it’s a question to ask and answer as part of planning.)

How does that play with the moratorium on research on “gun control” that seems to have hampered such in the past?

from the release:

END THE FREEZE ON GUN VIOLENCE RESEARCH: There are approximately 30,000 firearm-related homicides and suicides a year, a number large enough to make clear this is a public health crisis. But for years, the Centers for Disease Control (CDC) and other scientific agencies have been barred by Congress from using funds to “advocate or promote gun control,” and some members of Congress have claimed this prohibition also bans the CDC from conducting any research on the causes of gun violence. However, research on gun violence is not advocacy; it is critical public health research that gives all Americans information they need.

 Conduct research on the causes and prevention of gun violence, including links between video games, media images, and violence: The President is issuing a Presidential Memorandum directing the Centers for Disease Control and scientific agencies to conduct research into the causes and prevention of gun violence. It is based on legal analysis that concludes such research is not prohibited by any appropriations language. The CDC will start immediately by assessing existing strategies for preventing gun violence and identifying the most pressing research questions, with the greatest potential public health impact. And the Administration is calling on Congress to provide $10 million for the CDC to conduct further research, including investigating the relationship between video games, media images, and violence.

 Better understand how and when firearms are used in violent death: To research gun violence prevention, we also need better data. When firearms are used in homicides or suicides, the National Violent Death Reporting System collects anonymous data, including the type of firearm used, whether the firearm was stored loaded or locked, and details on youth gun access. Congress should invest an additional $20 million to expand this system from the 18 states currently participating to all 50 states, helping Americans better understand how and when firearms are used in a violent death and informing future research and prevention strategies.

The derp squad over at blogmockracy seem to be confused about the difference between an Executive Order and a Presidential Memorandum.

“The EOs are just a pile of horseshit. Nothing real about them.”

“O/T Comrade zero has made excersizing your rights under the 2nd Amendment a medical issue as one of this EOs”

DoD is just getting started.

Rumor has it that he will be surrounded by children.
He’s surrounded by men armed with automatic weapons of war.
Thus he is exposing those poor children to evil gun rayz that cause mass murder, much as he exposes his poor daughters to the dangers of their private school, which is also home to armed men.
This is intolerable.
When and if President Obama signs his Pro-Rapist Pro-Fascist Act of 2013, he needs to be surrounded by cheering criminals and photos of other fans of all-powerful government, such as once-favored philosopher Mao Xedong. But he needs to leave the kids he’s abandoning to them out of the picture, just like the ones he voted to leave in closets with scissors stuck in their skulls

Who’s gonna be surrounded by children? Harry Reid? He’s never denied having a thang for boys, you know.

When I went to visit my wife in a Southern town (It claims to be a city but to me it’s a town) I was amazed at how segregated it was, and more than a little uncomfortable.

We are blessed in Toronto to live in one of the most ethnically diverse cities in the world. There is a ton of good things that come from that. Tolerance is perhaps first on the list, access to good, interesting food is pretty high up there too.

We are blessed in Toronto to live in one of the most ethnically diverse cities in the world. There is a ton of good things that come from that. Tolerance is perhaps first on the list, access to good, interesting food is pretty high up there too.

Strangely, when I was in Toronto, I thought it wasn’t as good as Chicago in regards to food.

Strangely, when I was in Toronto, I thought it wasn’t as good as Chicago in regards to food.

Well it is all about local knowledge I suppose and what you are looking for. Chicago is a good food city. No doubt. But I rank Toronto ahead of it but behind New York and LA.
Toronto should be better than it is particularly in some areas. But for sheer breadth of choices (particularly ethnic based choices that are authentic) it is pretty hard to touch Toronto in North America outside of New York.

The reality is that Obama will be unable to act through congress as long as the two chambers are split. No gun control measure will get through the House under GOP control.

Not so sure about that. Two indicators:

a) In NY state a number of republicans voted for it, and more allowed it to come to the floor even though they voted against. Basically, when the majority of your constituents tell you to do something, you tend to do it.

b) with that in mind I point to the fact the GOP has broken the Hastert rule twice now. The Hastert rule is the (informal) rule that the Speaker not bring a bill to the floor unless a majority of his own party approves it (either does or can be arm-twisted to say they do.)

I don’t think all of the items will get to and through congress, but I think we’ll see some of them.

I spent my first honeymoon in Quebec City. I can still taste the food (in a good way).

But Toronto is my home. I love it here.

My wife and I visited Quebec on a trip back to Canada last year. Some of the best food we had was at a place called Paillard down in the old city. Had a ham croissant to die for and a phenomenal chocolate desert for a total cost of about $9.

Depends on where you go. I’ve had some really great food in T.O. , but some craptacular stuff as well. I would rate Ottawa, Montreal and Quebec City as far better Canadian destinations for food.

Wow. Ottawa, and Quebec City as better for food than Toronto? HAve to disagree with that. Montreal certainly ranks, and in particular with those 3 you would have to be talking about regional food in particular.

There is tons of shit food in Toronto. There is tons of mediocre food in Toronto. There are a few exceptional restaurants in toronto and quite a few good ones. But in particular when seeking diversity in the offerings Toronto tops all of Canada. Vancouver has its share most notably Asian and sub continent fare but again not as much total diversity.

I’m sick of seeing Hitler mentioned by both sides. These people need to grow the fuck up.

I’m only seeing people on the right invoke Hitler in this particular debate but nice try MBFing this. It does suck, I will agree with you on that but no one on the left is comparing the gun nuts to the Nazis.

Excerpt from the obituary of a 12 year old killed by a gun last Friday:

Oskar was an unbelievably witty young person who loved to laugh and make everyone around him laugh. He enjoyed speaking in accents and doing impersonations, especially ones of his mom, his sister Gracie and his grandmother Carol and he endlessly entertained his family. He had a voice like his dad’s and loved music and movies. He had an incredible memory and was extremely smart and inquisitive by nature, often capturing adults in long, intelligent conversations. He also loved fireworks and cute girls and always found joy in the small things in life. He loved his brothers and sisters and playing outdoors and camping. He was curious about how things worked and was constantly questioning things. He truly was wise beyond his years.

I hear more than Humans are dangerous and guns are to be respected as the weapons they are. Yes, they are inanimate objects, yet they are always loaded.

I’ve seen a lot of dismissing of their danger myself. I agree human beings are dangerous but a gun makes a human being that much more dangerous IMO. Take the stabbing incident that occurred in China the same day as Sandy Hook. A gun makes it a lot easier to kill people. I’m not suggesting ban guns fwiw but I do want honest discussion about their danger rather than just saying video games, lack of God, etc.

Now the seething volcano of #TGDN is umgebroyzelt about “mental health checks.” Isn’t this what Wayne LaPierre WANTED?

They’re seething about mental health checks because deep down, most of those mindless morons know they couldn’t pass one. For instance over here in the Czech Republic, where you can indeed have a concealed weapons permit, most of the RWNJ’s would fail the psychiatric exam.

I’ve seen a lot of dismissing of their danger myself. I agree human beings are dangerous but a gun makes a human being that much more dangerous IMO. Take the stabbing incident that occurred in China the same day as Sandy Hook. A gun makes it a lot easier to kill people. I’m not suggesting ban guns fwiw but I do want honest discussion about their danger rather than just saying video games, lack of God, etc.

I was raised with very strict in-home gun control and education. Probably what the NRA thinks everyone is raised with. That is the problem. These days, most gun owners (men) haven’t served in the military and didn’t learn the same protocols my Dad and other people’s Dad’s learned.

I’m only seeing people on the right invoke Hitler in this particular debate but nice try MBFing this. It does suck, I will agree with you on that but no one on the left is comparing the gun nuts to the Nazis.

Of course this last issue is drumming up asinine Hitler references from the right. The left will be right behind them doing the same thing on another issue. It’s been going on for many years and it’s disgusting.

MBFairy dust wafts through the thread…how many Hitler references have come out in reference to Obama in the past 48 hours alone?

Even that reference, which claims “three” Nazi references, has to include one which didn’t mention the Nazis directly and was a case of one politician accusing another of telling a “big lie” in order to have it believed. A bit of a stretch, even for the notoriously supple MBF.

On mental health checks, expect the GOP/NRA to water down the requirements to such a degree that they wouldn’t be functional/relevant to protecting the public or the individual with mental health problems from obtaining the weapons that could be used in the commission of a crime or as a means of committing suicide.

People seem to forget that the mental health aspect isn’t only to prevent criminal acts, but to reduce the chances of suicide - in which firearms is a leading cause of suicide. Figuring out a way to allow mental health professionals to intervene and address privacy rights and freedoms is what is a tough nut to crack.

Of course this last issue is drumming up asinine Hitler references from the right. The left will be right behind them doing the same thing on another issue. It’s been going on for many years and it’s disgusting.

THE CONVENTION? You can’t be even remotely fucking serious. It’s one thing to evoke the Magical Balance Fairy, but this is what I’d consider kidnapping, assault, and attempted murder of the poor Fairy. Leave her alone you creep.

On mental health checks, expect the GOP/NRA to water down the requirements to such a degree that they wouldn’t be functional/relevant to protecting the public or the individual with mental health problems from obtaining the weapons that could be used in the commission of a crime or as a means of committing suicide.

People seem to forget that the mental health aspect isn’t only to prevent criminal acts, but to reduce the chances of suicide - in which firearms is a leading cause of suicide. Figuring out a way to allow mental health professionals to intervene and address privacy rights and freedoms is what is a tough nut to crack.

I was raised with very strict in-home gun control and education. Probably what the NRA thinks everyone is raised with. That is the problem. These days, most gun owners (men) haven’t served in the military and didn’t learn the same protocols my Dad and other people’s Dad’s learned.

True enough. They do seem to be stuck in the past which may explain why LaPierre cites 1990’s movies.

Remember a couple of years ago, when every single Democratic-leaning commentator was screaming how Republicans were just like Nazis for implementing a reasonable legislative program that’s supported by over 80% of Americans?

I was raised with very strict in-home gun control and education. Probably what the NRA thinks everyone is raised with. That is the problem. These days, most gun owners (men) haven’t served in the military and didn’t learn the same protocols my Dad and other people’s Dad’s learned.

Even that’s not always enough - I just read “With The Old Breed” ( memoir of the Pacific Theater in WWII) and in it was story of two marines fucking around after the battle on Okinawa was over. It ended with an M1 shot, 1 marine dead & 1 marine in the stockade for killing his best friend.

Remember a couple of years ago, when every single Democratic-leaning commentator was screaming how Republicans were just like Nazis for implementing a reasonable legislative program that’s supported by over 80% of Americans?

Oh? You don’t? Maybe because IT NEVER FUCKING HAPPENED.

I was stating my opinion that I hate seeing both sides bring up Hitler. If you have a problem with that I don’t give a shit. It’s not a left or right statement. It pisses me off when the left or right bring it up.

I was stating my opinion that I hate seeing both sides bring up Hitler. If you have a problem with that I don’t give a shit. It’s not a left or right statement. It pisses me off when the left or right bring it up.

You must be very pissed off with the right at this point then. Maybe it will bring you to reconsider your voting habits.

I was stating my opinion that I hate seeing both sides bring up Hitler. If you have a problem with that I don’t give a shit. It’s not a left or right statement. It pisses me off when the left or right bring it up.

Funny, Charlton Heston acted in some pretty violent movies and killed his share of people in them.

Yeah. Funny that huh. Or that the NRA leadership really has shown no problem with real wars but somehow American Psycho and Natural Born Killers, two films I’d be shocked if Ryan Lanza saw more than once were responsible for what he did.

I’ve been hearing news reports of local and regional law enforcement heads saying they won’t enforce new gun regs they themselves deem unconstitutional. Which puts the 2nd Amendment evangelicals in a logical quandary WRT the ‘well regulated militia:’

If local-regional law enforcement won’t subscribe to the Fed government, then isn’t that the ‘well regulated militia’ the Holy Founders decided should be armed?

This means that citizens do not have inalienable rights to own weapons.

Even that’s not always enough - I just read “With The Old Breed” ( memoir of the Pacific Theater in WWII) and in it was story of two marines fucking around after the battle on Okinawa was over. It ended with an M1 shot, 1 marine dead & 1 marine in the stockade for killing his best friend.

I know I sound like a broken record. The problem is some young men and testosterone.

Young Men need Old Men and in lieu of that at least one strong person to keep them in line and mentor them into adult hood. Since that seems to be lacking as well, we need, as a society, to wake-up and provide the services needed
and channel any violent tendencies into sports or something constructive. And, Yes, we need to restrict their access to weapons.

In the Very Least, we can do what ever is necessary to make sure they can READ.

I was stating my opinion that I hate seeing both sides bring up Hitler. If you have a problem with that I don’t give a shit. It’s not a left or right statement. It pisses me off when the left or right bring it up.

Local law enforcement officials are not legally authorized to determine what is and is not Constitutional. That’s the Supreme Court’s job. Otherwise you can nit-pick any law and say “that’s not Constitutional” and America would just be an anarchy.

For starters, they should be fired for dereliction of duty, and if crimes are committed because they weren’t enforcing laws they were supposed to, they should be held liable.

Joe Jervis alerted us to an interview Buehner gave to Colorado Springs NBC affiliate KOAA, which reported that Buehner’s comments are “causing a national stir.”

Buehner repeated his claims about homosexuality and claimed that homosexuals should be treated like rapists and murderers. He also urged Colorado legislators to “remove homosexuals from society, saying they’ll also pay the price at the golden gates if they don’t fall in line.”

Buehner maintained: “God’s law to the civil magistrate in terms of homosexuality says you should remove the abomination from the land, so that’s God’s instruction to the people who work up in the capitol who make our laws. That’s what they’re going to be held accountable for.”

Buehner and his co-host Pastor Kevin Swanson support the Ugandan “kill the gays” bill and laws from the pilgrim era that criminalized homosexuality.

Any reference to Hitler is absurd in this context. That is clear. It is fair to say that there have been points in the recent history of the US when left wing supporters have used the Hitler comparison as well. Most notably George W Bush was repeatedly compared to Hitler when he went to war with Iraq. The evidence of this was all over pictures of the protests. It did happen. It was wrong. It was also not mainstream at all.
What is missing though is the systematic attempt of the right to tie Obama to Hitler, Mao, Lenin, Stalin, Caliphate. It has been a constant for the last 5 years. It was mainstreamed by the likes of Beck and others and it has become part of the right wing consciousness. There is simply no comparison of the quantum and the proliferation of it at all.

I lean conservative but I don’t vote down the party line. Give me some credit for thinking for myself please.

Fair enough.

Watching the current round of Godwining towards Obama and declaring everyone does it is a weak argument. One of the reasons is that for all of the Bush Derangement that went on from 2000 to 2008, the people making those statements weren’t running the Democratic Party.

The same cannot be said about today’s conservative movement/GOP. It’s a huge problem that just exploded exponentially over the last 12 hours. The Republicans are being driven by fanatics that are so pissed off over losing power, that they’re slowly losing their grip on reality (the latent racism doesn’t’ help either.)

Andrea Mitchell just got done interviewing some nut from the NRA. If anyone thought the web video was just in “bad taste” then just watch the interview she just did with them. They’re batshit insane and proud of it.

Any reference to Hitler is absurd in this context. That is clear. It is fair to say that there have been points in the recent history of the US when left wing supporters have used the Hitler comparison as well. Most notably George W Bush was repeatedly compared to Hitler when he went to war with Iraq. The evidence of this was all over pictures of the protests. It did happen. It was wrong. It was also not mainstream at all.
What is missing though is the systematic attempt of the right to tie Obama to Hitler, Mao, Lenin, Stalin, Caliphate. It has been a constant for the last 5 years. It was mainstreamed by the likes of Beck and others and it has become part of the right wing consciousness. There is simply no comparison of the quantum and the proliferation of it at all.

Local law enforcement officials are not legally authorized to determine what is and is not Constitutional. That’s the Supreme Court’s job. Otherwise you can nit-pick any law and say “that’s not Constitutional” and America would just be an anarchy.

For starters, they should be fired for dereliction of duty, and if crimes are committed because they weren’t enforcing laws they were supposed to, they should be held liable.

Any and every Sovereign Citizen has the right to interpret the Constitution as he sees fit, as well as to determine whether the provisions as they stand in the Constitution are consistent with God’s Divine Law, which, of course, takes precedence.

I’ve been hearing news reports of local and regional law enforcement heads saying they won’t enforce new gun regs they themselves deem unconstitutional. Which puts the 2nd Amendment evangelicals in a logical quandary WRT the ‘well regulated militia:’

If local-regional law enforcement won’t subscribe to the Fed government, then isn’t that the ‘well regulated militia’ the Holy Founders decided should be armed?

This means that citizens do not have inalienable rights to own weapons.

Discuss. I have to commit some capitalism.

Not really. You need to plow through the federalist and anti-federalist papers some time to realize how much we take for granted (on all sides).

No, they would not have expected the feds to inform the states how to have a well-regulated militia. Not least, they expected state-run militias to be competitive in size and strength if not out-power the federal army. A standing army of any strength was anathema to all sides. I’ve seen arguments that the main cause of the death of anti-federalism wasn’t the civil war but was instead the decision to maintain a large army for its ability to rapidly respond to threats.

After an opening segment in which Beck claimed that Obamacare will force people to give up their guns and lead to Nazi-like euthanasia programs, the two got down to business with Barton explaining that the NRA was founded in order to protect freed slaves from lynchings and that there never used to be school shootings in the 1800s because all of the kids carried guns to school:

I am still trying to understand what the big deal about Marco Rubio is.

Well, he’s a Republican, he doesn’t play with his own shit, and he’s not white, thereforeminority votes bitchez!. Plus, the Florida connection when it comes time for a Presidential election (because it really helped Romney/Ryan’s parade of fail).

That’s it. Same thing with Jindal. They see Obama and think they can just run any minority, regardless of ideology, and win black/hispanic votes.

Right, seems the same deal with Cruz. These guys really aren’t any different other than their ethnic backgrounds and that they’re new in national politics. Isn’t that the same thing the GOP and right accuses Obama of being? And I have to say as much as I dislike Rubio, it’s beyond fucked up that he has a birther troup. Of course, knowing what I know about him, he’ll claim his birthers are left wingers because of no true conservative.

I’ve been hearing news reports of local and regional law enforcement heads saying they won’t enforce new gun regs they themselves deem unconstitutional. Which puts the 2nd Amendment evangelicals in a logical quandary WRT the ‘well regulated militia:’

If local-regional law enforcement won’t subscribe to the Fed government, then isn’t that the ‘well regulated militia’ the Holy Founders decided should be armed?

This means that citizens do not have inalienable rights to own weapons.

Discuss. I have to commit some capitalism.

I think it goes like this:

inalienable right to life = right to self-defense
right to self-defense = firearm ownership
therefore, take away unregulated firearm ownership and take away unregulated right to self-defense.

Keep in mind that the actual number may be significantly higher due to the lack of media coverage in rural areas back then, not to mention that the physical size/population of the US was much, much smaller than it is today.

A day earlier, the Obama administration admonished Morsi over the comments, which were revived when they were aired on an Egyptian TV show this month, and called on him to repudiate them.

At the time, in September 2010, Morsi was a leader in the Muslim Brotherhood. In the video, he refers to “Zionists” as “bloodsuckers who attack Palestinians” as well as “the descendants of apes and pigs.”

On Wednesday, Morsi told a visiting U.S. Senate delegation led by Republican John McCain that a distinction must be made between criticism of what he called the “racist” policies of the Israelis against the Palestinians and insults against the Jewish faith, Morsi’s spokesman Yasser Ali said.

Barton noted that guns were only fired in schools at the time to stop criminal activity.

“The great example, in the 1850s you have a school teacher who’s teaching,” the historian explained. “A guy, he’s out in the West, this guy from New England wants to kill him and find him. So, he comes into the school with his gun to shoot the teacher, he decides not to shoot the teacher because all the kids pull their guns out and point it at him and say, ‘You kill the teacher, you die.’ He says, ‘Okay.’ The teacher lives. Real simple stuff.”

Barton added: “There was no shooting because all the kids — we’re talking in elementary school — all the kids pull their guns out and says, ‘We like our teacher, you shoot our teacher, we’ll kill you.’”

“Kids did not shoot each other,” Beck insisted.

“No, no,” Barton agreed. “Two accidents I have seen in 200 years of everybody having guns. It just didn’t happen.”

Nope, that certainly doesn’t sound like a steaming load of horseshit at all.

Keep in mind that the actual number may be significantly higher due to the lack of media coverage in rural areas back then, not to mention that the physical size/population of the US was much, much smaller than it is today.

Yeah not being able to own a military weapon is just like that or having to wait a period of time for a weapon is just like that. Sigh, get back to me when you’re actually being persecuted for being a gun owner. Until then, you’re a whiny baby who just wants to be a martyr.

It’s also a false quote. The first sentence can be found (more or less, depending on translation) but the sentence that follows in Mein Kampf is different. Here’s that section from Gutenberg (my emphasis to show the relevant sentence):

It will be the task of the People’s State to
make the race the centre of the life of the community. It must make sure
that the purity of the racial strain will be preserved. It must proclaim
the truth that the child is the most valuable possession a people can
have. It must see to it that only those who are healthy shall beget
children; that there is only one infamy, namely, for parents that are
ill or show hereditary defects to bring children into the world and that
in such cases it is a high honour to refrain from doing so. But, on the
other hand, it must be considered as reprehensible conduct to refrain
from giving healthy children to the nation.

That one is my favourite of the day for sure. I like the catchy slogan at the end. “Gun control is not about guns. It is about control. ” He wrote that one while reading his bible, which you know, is about something else entirely, but definitely not about control.

Just to let you know, I vote for 2 Reps, 1 Dem and an Independent last time, not that it’s any of your fucking business.

That grinding sound you here is the motorized goal post mover bulldozing the rock as the hole moves sideways. Same passive aggressive response as always after being called on a distraction attempt in a thread where the conservatives are being criticized for something.

I’m actually surprised. Rather than that I expected the MBF attempt to be something linking to Huffpo…
///

“Guns require a finger to pull the trigger. The sad young man who did that in Newtown was clearly haunted by demons and no gun law could have saved the children in Sandy Hook Elementary from his terror.

“There is evil prowling in the world - it shows up in our movies, video games and online fascinations, and finds its way into vulnerable hearts and minds. As a free people, let us choose what kind of people we will be. Laws, the only redoubt of secularism, will not suffice. Let us all return to our places of worship and pray for help. Above all, let us pray for our children.

“In fact, the piling on by the political left, and their cohorts in the media, to use the massacre of little children to advance a pre-existing political agenda that would not have saved those children, disgusts me, personally. The second amendment to the Constitution is a basic right of free people and cannot be nor will it be abridged by the executive power of this or any other president.”

Actually, according to the document all 23 are going to be executive orders. Of course what’s going on is tripping over semantics. If the executive orders his agencies to do something, whether through actual EO or by memorandum, it is de facto an executive order.

Me, I’m going to wait a couple of days to see what shows on the list of EOs the White House maintains. One or two of those explicitly described in the body as EOs will show up, and then I’ll know which are EO and which are order by memorandum.

So, that went well. Should have a second phone call with the hiring manager tomorrow or Friday, and if that goes well a final face to face before the end of the month. They’re looking for someone to start soon and according to their technical recruiter whom I spoke with this morning, I fit most of their check boxes. Basically, they need someone to hit the ground running who has experience building teams and frameworks from scratch. And they have budget!(that’s always important)

The NRA needs to FOAD. I’d dearly love to be in the media sometime, just so when some wingnut wanker came on my program, I could say - live, on national TV, “You’re full of shit and let me tell you why…..” and then eviscerate their arguments.

Positioning himself for a ‘16 run, no doubt. Personally, I think it hilarious that the first thing out of the “gun advocates” mouths after “Don’t politicize this” was “let’s wait til we have all the facts.” Well, it’s over a month later and despite not knowing if Adam Lanza was a frequent consumer of violent media or prayed to God, all the “gun advocates” wanna talk about is how we’re too violent a country and how we need to get right with God if we want to stop future Adam Lanzas.

Yegods, it’s like I went to bed like night and woke up in the weeks right about Columbine.

Wow. Ottawa, and Quebec City as better for food than Toronto? HAve to disagree with that. Montreal certainly ranks, and in particular with those 3 you would have to be talking about regional food in particular.

There is tons of shit food in Toronto. There is tons of mediocre food in Toronto. There are a few exceptional restaurants in toronto and quite a few good ones. But in particular when seeking diversity in the offerings Toronto tops all of Canada. Vancouver has its share most notably Asian and sub continent fare but again not as much total diversity.

Actually, according to the document all 23 are going to be executive orders. Of course what’s going on is tripping over semantics. If the executive orders his agencies to do something, whether through actual EO or by memorandum, it is de facto an executive order.

Me, I’m going to wait a couple of days to see what shows on the list of EOs the White House maintains. One or two of those explicitly described in the body as EOs will show up, and then I’ll know which are EO and which are order by memorandum.

Nope. Take number 11, “nominate an ATF director.” You don’t have to nominate an ATF director through an EO. The rest are just proposals and plans of action that might not require congress.

Positioning himself for a ‘16 run, no doubt. Personally, I think it hilarious that the first thing out of the “gun advocates” mouths after “Don’t politicize this” was “let’s wait til we have all the facts.” Well, it’s over a month later and despite not knowing if Adam Lanza was a frequent consumer of violent media or prayed to God, all the “gun advocates” wanna talk about is how we’re too violent a country and how we need to get right with God if we want to stop future Adam Lanzas.

Yegods, it’s like I went to bed like night and woke up in the weeks right about Columbine.

Actually, I saw somewhere that Lanza was a regular church goer. Haven’t seen any actual proof he ever played a video game.

Hey, the Czech Republic has Vaclav Klaus, climate change denier if it makes you feel any better.

But he’s also one of those cerebral types that would likely mercilessly mock Perry (and Palin) for their lack of intellect. I’ve heard from a friend of mine, who worked in the Czech President’s office, that Klaus does not suffer fools.

Actually, I saw somewhere that Lanza was a regular church goer. Haven’t seen any actual proof he ever played a video game.

HW’s pretty much right, I don’t think it’s possible these days to go without ever having played a video game, whether it be on a console, on a computer, on an iPhone, or just at one of the increasingly few arcades.

HW’s pretty much right, I don’t think it’s possible these days to go without ever having played a video game, whether it be on a console, on a computer, on an iPhone, or just at one of the increasingly few arcades.

Which is not to say that he can’t attain some of the proposals through or with an EO. Haven’t seen one yet. This morning all I saw mentioned was “presidential actions.” EOs, presidential memorandums and presidential proclamations fall under presidential actions.

True, which is what makes this all so amusing. They’re screaming “Gun control laws criminalize honest citizens and make them out as the bad guys,” then target gamers for hatred and bile. As if we’re the root of all evil these days.

Look, just because I bashed that guy’s brains in in Fallout does not mean I’m a violent person.//

WELL IT DOESN”T ACTUALLY SAY THAT QUENTIN TARANTINO CAN’T HAVE HIS FREE SPEECH REGULATED!!!!!!!! But yeah, I don’t get it. Background checks and banning military weapons are tyrannical but it’s perfectly reasonable to limit Mr. Tarantino’s free speech rights. Why are they blaming him anyhow? I know his new movie’s release coincided with the shooting though I think the film was released afterwards. I mean not that it really matters but I’ve read nothing about Ryan Lanza that suggests he was a big Tarantino fan or a Tarantino fan at all.

I am still hoping to hear from Palin on this gun issue. I can’t imagine she will stay silent. But I just checked her Twitter account and her most recent post was this meaningful tidbit than every American (read Christian) would be thrilled to see from their political representatives. You know I really don’t know why secular progressives had any concerns about her in politics.

Be confident of this: No matter what you face, you have what it takes! You can do all things through Christ. Phil 4:13

(On the other hand I don’t think I want to know what their respective special “kill” moves are.)

Santorum dissolves his opponent in a frothy blast.
Perry whips a Colt Revolver out of his jockstrap, shoots his opponent 6 times, knocking him up into the sky, then leaps forward and slams a bible into their head.

You know, the sheriff forgets his job is law enforcement not law making If he has a problem with the law, he should either run for office or resign his job as sheriff. If law enforcement officials all got to pick and choose like this one wants to, there would be anarchy.

You know, the sheriff forgets his job is law enforcement not law making If he has a problem with the law, he should either run for office or resign his job as sheriff. If law enforcement officials all got to pick and choose like this one wants to, there would be anarchy.

They all think that the movie character Sheriff Buford T was a real person and their role-model.