Everything Hangers... Hiccup*

Ok, ok. I have to. I have no idea what the heck these are actually going to be good for. I am curious if I will have access to these hangers with each world/docking stations/landing pad that supports my hanger (as in the Revel and York will be available in all stations that support high bling hangers) or will I have to assign my hangers to a "home" port. It sounds like CIG wants to save your ship at the last place it landed. That being said, let me spawn my rover in the hanger and load 'er up! before spawning a ship. Thoughts?

I can only hope that they continue on the trend of item persistence. In most MMOs, items are thoroughly treated as data. If you pick up an item, it magically disappears into your 100+ slot inventory and it stays there as an icon in your bag. The idea that you can have a horse, a car, a dozen guns, 100 loaves of bread in a stack, ten full suits of armor, 200 gallons of water, enough ammo to supply a small coup d'etat, and a dog in your backpack is ludicrous.

Right now in SC, I am seeing things like the need to shoulder your weapon, pick up a crate, and carry it to another location. I am seeing the player arsenal being limited to what legitimately mounts or straps to their person. I see the need to put on a suit that is stored in a locker and not simply pressing "i" and dragging it from your bag onto your character screen. I am seeing personnel transport. I am seeing ship transport. I am seeing cargo visibly limited by the physical space in your ship's hold.

I very much want this to continue. I want to face situations like the need to spend the two hours or 2k uec to transport my Super Hornet across the galaxy so I can use it in the Test raid the following day. I want to be able to run out of gas and need rescue instead of just logging off and summoning my ship at the nearest spawn point. I also want my hangar to mean something.

I want my hangar to be my home base. I want to pick a spot that is convenient for my preferred occupations and deploy from it. I want to pay rent if my ship is docked at a NPC hangar. I want to be able to store a ship or two at a friend's hangar. I want an epic Org hangar that org mates can come and go out of. I want my ships to be at the location I last left them.

What I don't want, is to be able to magically transport myself or my ships to another location. I want it to take time and resources to move around the galaxy. I don't want this for just immersion either. I want this for gameplay and most of all, pvp. In order for jobs like personnel transport to be successful, there must be a need to transport people. If there is going to be an info runner profession, there needs to be information worth running.

Lets say this sense of permanence sticks just like I am describing it. Lets say an Org wants to raid Spider in the Cathart system. Their org inforunners have determined that a couple orgs with tons of high value warrants are hanging out in that area. They need to organize. They pick out a time. They spend a day or two transporting their ships across the galaxy and park them in a org hanger they have out there in the Cathart system. They pick a time, all log on, and assault Spider.

The problem was, the opposing org had their own info runners. Since they had so many high value org mates in the same area at the same time, they took precautions. They ran rotations of Terrapins, Heralds, a few DURs and some 315Ps. They discretely kept track of the traffic in the solar system. While doing this, they noticed that a high volume of org ships had been running one way trips to a local moon. So, they had a couple org members that were skilled in hacking, tap into the Spectrum voice chat of that org. They found out the time and date of the invasion and were waiting with a fleet of their own. It was an epic battle. More than 3 dozen ships were destroyed and the forums were talking about it for weeks.

You see, if playing requires planning, then plans can be discovered. It changes the gameplay from arcade style or twitch shooter into coordinated events that require player cooperation. It allows for things like suspense, anticipation, excitement, and risk. It allows planning to combat brute force. It allows stealth to mean more than just a mechanic to run away when you are loosing. It transforms gameplay from a shallow encounter to a meaningful battle of wits.

In short, I want hangars to mean something because your ship is always going to be exactly where you parked it last. I want my hangar to be where I store my stuff and I want to be required to go there to use it.

Never assume you are stronger, smarter, tougher, or in any way better than someone you have never met.

I remember seeing a video from CIG where they briefly discussed hangers and clearly stated they would be a fixed location. There would be limitations where certain locations could only have certain types of hangers, you can purchase an hanger for that location, or you can choose to pay docking fees instead.

Donor

I can only hope that they continue on the trend of item persistence. In most MMOs, items are thoroughly treated as data. If you pick up an item, it magically disappears into your 100+ slot inventory and it stays there as an icon in your bag. The idea that you can have a horse, a car, a dozen guns, 100 loaves of bread in a stack, ten full suits of armor, 200 gallons of water, enough ammo to supply a small coup d'etat, and a dog in your backpack is ludicrous.

Right now in SC, I am seeing things like the need to shoulder your weapon, pick up a crate, and carry it to another location. I am seeing the player arsenal being limited to what legitimately mounts or straps to their person. I see the need to put on a suit that is stored in a locker and not simply pressing "i" and dragging it from your bag onto your character screen. I am seeing personnel transport. I am seeing ship transport. I am seeing cargo visibly limited by the physical space in your ship's hold.

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I'd really love it if they scaled everything to reality. Ok, you have a wardrobe where you keep your clothes, but only 20 clothes fit. My point is: even if it's storage, don't let me store everything there (an example of a wrong way to do it is Fallout 4; I have a small chest where I keep 30 rocket launchers).
My wife's bag is something like that.
It's a game design problem, where you're required to have a ton of things with you. If I only really need a few things, I'll find a way to carry it. Give me a backpack where I can keep a few things (like I always carry a backpack IRL), but don't let me store 100 loaves of bread - and don't make me NEED 100 loaves of bread.

NaffNaffBobFace: "I've been waiting for this so long if it's ugly i'll cry like a child."

I would love to have home ports. The descriptions suggest work/client/friend meetings and some seem to be only for civilized systems. I just hope they don't start to wash it up. I know Bling is a real thing, so says my starkitty shirt. I love the fish tank I have with fish. I am at least expecting it to be my "home" and I rather don't like the idea of just getting access to them in any system. This leads to starting location, especially if all my ships will not fit in my hanger, as in I have a Merchman Bar man, and not a single other ship can spawn in until I despawn the size 5/6 ship. Perhaps every ship owned will be saved there for your ability to spawn it (now I am getting sad they removed the expanded hangers from alpa). I have confidence, I also want to have that special asteroid hangar to be able to rent out for others on long journeys because they don't want to give up their travel, l but what is the size limit realism if you can save 50 ships there....

It's a game design problem, where you're required to have a ton of things with you. If I only really need a few things, I'll find a way to carry it. Give me a backpack where I can keep a few things (like I always carry a backpack IRL), but don't let me store 100 loaves of bread - and don't make me NEED 100 loaves of bread.

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That's a very important point. Most games take it directly over the top. You need food and drink to constantly regen. You need your buff foods and potions. For your gear, you need to carry a variety of situationally specific sets. You need your hp and resource potions. You need your mounts, vehicles, and pets in there too so you can use them. The list goes on and on.

I would much rather the game leash you to where these items or their equivalents are stores. For instance, you can't wander too far from your ship without risking running out of resources like air. Other games would simply have you carry a 100 stack of air canisters in your back pack.

Never assume you are stronger, smarter, tougher, or in any way better than someone you have never met.

Seems Cig also doesn't want the player to have multiple hangers of the same type, they seem to not like the idea of backers having 20 self land hangers on 20 worlds. They want the mechanic of being far from home. I am guessing they will allow one of each type to be owned across the universe. I would like the idea of multiple ships spawned in the hanger-and that the "bikes" are pilotable in them (rovers, nox, Dragonfly etc) -at least to give players a chance to launch into the universe with them loaded up. I am not excited to leave an open ship alone while I go off and try to get a nox in it, ripe for the picking, though this may be a mechanic to be played upon. locked doors will help some.

Donor

I remember seeing a video from CIG where they briefly discussed hangers and clearly stated they would be a fixed location. There would be limitations where certain locations could only have certain types of hangers, you can purchase an hanger for that location, or you can choose to pay docking fees instead.

As they explained it in the video, yes.
The video was more about talking about the plans for the PU, but the person used hangers as an example talking about having different ones at different locations, then not having to pay docking fees when in those locations if you use your own hanger located there, but once you place a hanger somewhere it is placed there permanently.

Additionally they mentioned how they would be limited by location, so like:

The Revel & York would only be usable on luxury stations and developed planets

The VFG Industrial would only be usable in asteroid stations (like Grim Hex)

The Aeroview and SELF-LAND hangers would be the most common, but not usable at asteroid stations, luxury stations, or developed planets

Donor

As they explained it in the video, yes.
The video was more about talking about the plans for the PU, but the person used hangers as an example talking about having different ones at different locations, then not having to pay docking fees when in those locations if you use your own hanger located there, but once you place a hanger somewhere it is placed there permanently.

Additionally they mentioned how they would be limited by location, so like:

The Revel & York would only be usable on luxury stations and developed planets

The VFG Industrial would only be usable in asteroid stations (like Grim Hex)

The Aeroview and SELF-LAND hangers would be the most common, but not usable at asteroid stations, luxury stations, or developed planets

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This is pretty much how I understand it, and I like it. I wonder if we'll be able to sell a hanger we don't use anymore?

In short, I want hangars to mean something because your ship is always going to be exactly where you parked it last. I want my hangar to be where I store my stuff and I want to be required to go there to use it.

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I think the plan is just as you describe, save that in the case where a player is flying a ship with no bed, if they log out and do not return within a set time period (to be determined), when they log back in they and their ship will appear in some port or hanger. There has been discussion of how to avoid this becoming an exploit, so ships may not always end up where you hoped they would but rather could end up in the nearest public port. The intention though, is that you can't log and return where you were outside a port or hangar, unless you have a bed. The bed is what makes truly "long range" ships to be that.

Also, I think they are still planning that you set your spawn point to an individual bed, which is what may make it possible to spawn on a ship if it has a bed. The fact this issue is not yet resolved is why so many hesitate to purchase the Warden over the Harbinger, Sentinel and Hoplite. IIUC though, a strike group flying all four Vanguard classes should be able to individually set their spawn on the Warden, so all four classes end up as "long range". Still not resolved how this would work but is very interesting.

3.0 will be our first taste of how range works. It's very exciting. Should be soon!

Donor

Ow, that is a bummer, I have a LTI hangar (it comes with a LTI ship, so I guess the hangar also is LTI), I place it concealed in an asteroid, but when it gets discovered, I can't move it to somewhere else hidden. Other players can't hopefully enter it, unless I give them permission, but still people will know where I am or where I can show up...