Arctic Wind

Welcome to my final RMT. My brother is moving overseas and taking his laptop with him, so I probably won't be coming back to Pokemon for about a year (when I get my laptop), and by then, I'll probably have to spend all of my time doing homework and stuff :( This is pretty much a revival of a team my brother and I worked on in the Garchomp era, based around an incredibly annoying SubDisable Froslass set that my brother made.

The team ended up really fun to use, but also really solid. There is one main threat (namely Jirachi) but I can often overcome it with a combination of Tentacruel, Abomasnow, Terrakion and smart play. I honestly think this is the greatest team I have made, even though I haven't peaked too high with it (I think the highest I made was around the low 1400s), and I'm really comfortable using it, even after midnight :) Basically, when I do RMTs, all I want is to score a luvdisc, so if you like this team (or me), look at the top-right corner of the thread, and hit 'like this' and that would be very cool of you :)

Teambuilding

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This was the finished product of the team, consisting of CB Abomasnow, Scarf Kyurem, Bulky Garchomp, Starmie, SDef Scizor, and SubDisable Froslass. But after Garchomp was banned, the synergy was pretty much wrecked, because Garchomp's typing was amazing and held the team together. I tested numerous changes, and in the end, Garchomp was replaced by Gliscor, and Heatran was added over Scizor because of the sun (and fire in general) weakness, and I needed Stealth Rock.

This team was very solid, but it struggled against standard sand volt-turn team, so I switched Gliscor to Terrakion for some more offencive presence, and then switched Heatran to Skarmory for numerous reasons. I had no ground immunities, I had sun checked well with Terrakion, and some extra defence against Landorus and his sand homies. There were also a few set changes; Abomasnow to an offencive Leech Seed variant, Kyurem to the Sub + 3 attacks and for some reason, I added Thunder Wave to Starmie. It works well as a last-ditch effort to cripple something

This was the best variantion of the team, and the one I originally posted. Starmie was replaced by Tentacruel simply because Tentacruel is better.

Delko / WhiteQueen's Abomasnow set is the greatest Abomasnow set out there imo, but honestly, there isn't much to choose from. I had a few different sets here, from Mixed all the way to a defencive SubSeed. But in the end, this was the best. Nothing can switch in and enjoy taking a Wood Hammer to the face (except Skarmory and Ferrothorn), and Leech Seed is an effective tool to hit switch-ins with, and then protect to rack up hail + Leech Seed, and heal Abomasnow with Leftovers + Leech Seed. It also lets me scout for things like Terrakion and Scizor while slowly but surely wearing them down. As well as bringing on the all-important Hail, he is my best check to Rotom-W, and he makes dealing with DD Dragonite and Salamence much easier.

This Kyurem set is the best out there, as his perfect blend of bulk, coverage, and raw offencive power + Substitute is a nightmare for opposing offencive and stall teams alike. It has about 3 counters: Jellicent (who can be PP stalled easily, or frozen with Blizzard), Jirachi, and SDef Scizor (who isn't seen much anyway). With all those pathetically weak Scalds and Volt Switches going around on rain teams, Kyurem finds it very easy to get a sub up, and weak choiced moves can give him a free sub too. Pressure is also a very useful ability, which enables Kyurem to beat Ferrothorn one on one. The opponent will often sac a mon just to break the sub, which enables Kyurem to get about 2 kills every time I switch in at the right time, provided there's no Scizors or Jirachis around to stop the destruction. One of my favourite mons to use right now, in hail or not.

Terrakion is great to use against Sun and Sand teams, as his Stone Edges and Close Combats have no safe switch-ins, except for some stupid shit that is never used, like Claydol. Even most resisted Close Combats can 2HKO most of the metagame on the switch, like offencive Celebi, Moxie Salamence and Toxicroak. I also put a Scarf on it sometimes, because it's such a good cleaner with its CCs, and it adds some extra defence against set up dragons and stuff. I've been testing them both out for ages and I can't decide which one, so every day I visit the team, I change the item. It also deals the hardest hit on the team to Jirachi, and it's my main check to Toxicroak (with the Cross Chop crit chance, Skarmory is often OHKOd), and is one of the most useful mons on the team, whether it's revenging or blasting holes into the opponent's core.

After lots of testing, this guy replaced Starmie as my spinner. It gives me a second check to Scizor, Terrakion and Volcarona, and unlike Starmie, he can beat Jellicent one on one, unless it decides to switch, which gives me a free spin. Toxic also helps when Volcarona switches into Tentacruel and starts setting up, not expecting to be stalled by poison. It's funny how many people switch in Toxic susceptible mons expecting me to Toxic Spikes. About Toxic Spikes, the reason I don't use them is simple: I don't need them. Hail helps wear down most mons enough anyway, and Toxic Spikes clash with the haxxing from Froslass. Although they help with Kyurem, I'd rather use Knock Off to help beat Jirachi, or Blizzard to destroy Dragons.

Skarmory is the steel type of the team, and basically guarantees that no physical sweeper will sweep me. It's my SR setter, phazer, and my only ground immunity. That last reason is why it is used over any other steel mon, and the only other steel type that shares that characteristic is Bronzong, who is absolutely hopless this gen. Again, the spread is weird, but I have a perfectly good reason to be using extra Speed EVs. Honestly, Skarmory is too slow to heal efficiently, so i bumped up his speed to outspeed Bulk Up Breloom, Jellicent, the majority of Scizors, and uninvested Rotom-W, so I can Roost on the Volt Switch and it's worked well thus far. It holds all the hazards on the team, and it's really easy to set them up with all the Dragonites and Scizors running around rampant. With Froslass as a spinblocker, the hazards can almost never be spun away, unless Tentacruel Scald burns first turn, Forretress hits me with Gyro Ball on the switch, or Starmie hits me (60%ish chance) with a Life Orb boosted Hydro Pump. All these situations are unlikely, so Skarmory proves itself useful over and over again.

You thought SubDisable Gengar was annoying? Well that thing has nothing on the focus of this team, SubDisable Froslass is everything you need if you want to get opponents ripping out their pubic hair in rage. With Snow Cloak and Paralysis the opponent has about a 60% chance to hit Froslass with a 100% accuratcy move. Now, considering that most moves are NOT 100% accurate, Froslass can easily get a sub up, and with the hail damage, Shadow Ball / Ice Move damage, and pure haxxing, the opposing mon will be dead in no time. To make matters even worse for said opponent, Disable gets rid of their main attacking move, or in some cases, their only move that can damage Froslass (CM Reuniclus, Conkeldurr, Flamethrower Blissey etc.), enabling Froslass to get a sub up against just about every mon in the metagame. She can perfectly counter any choiced mon behind a sub, and that alone gives her a spot on my team, but the extra stuff is cool. The hax winning, ragequits, immunity to hail damage, spinblocking, and a counter to non-Bullet Punch Lucario. The only threat to Froslass is losing Hail, but all that changes is Snow Cloak. Overall the coolest mon ever, and definently try this out sometime.

Hey areomence this is a really cool team! I'm seeing a weakness to Scizor at the momment as the only thing on your team that can safely switch into it is Skarmory who can't do much in return. You could try revisiting Rocky Helmet on Skarmory to gradually wear Scizor down; the residual damage may seem like as issue, but the only Pokemon that will give Skarmory trouble without Leftovers are CB Haxorus and Terrakion, the former you have a ton of Ice-type attacks for while that latter can be beat with Froslass + Terrakion. I'm concerned with Starmie's ability to spin for this team. With three Stealth Rock weak Pokemon, spinning is crucial especially for winning the weather war. Starmie can't spin vs Jellicent at all and since this is a hail team, the opponent won't fear a Life Orb Thunder. I'm going to suggest a SubToxic Tenetacruel over Starmie. While this variant of Tentacruel can't KO Jellicent, it can stall it out with the combination of Toxic + Sub, while Jellicent won't be able to break the sub or Taunt Tentacruel as it is faster. Jellicent will eventually have switch out or die to Toxic at which point Tentacruel will be able to safely spin. Tentacruel also provided you with an excellent check to Scizor. With Tentacruel spreading Toxic, Froslass will be even more difficult to take down as it will be able to stall out stuff it can't paralyze such Gastrodon and Quagsire if Tentacruel manages to get Toxic on them. One concern you might have is Tentacruel being worn down quickly, but you may be able to heal it with Abomasnow's Leech Seed.

Hey areomence this is a really cool team! I'm seeing a weakness to Scizor at the momment as the only thing on your team that can safely switch into it is Skarmory who can't do much in return. You could try revisiting Rocky Helmet on Skarmory to gradually wear Scizor down; the residual damage may seem like as issue, but the only Pokemon that will give Skarmory trouble without Leftovers are CB Haxorus and Terrakion, the former you have a ton of Ice-type attacks for while that latter can be beat with Froslass + Terrakion. I'm concerned with Starmie's ability to spin for this team. With three Stealth Rock weak Pokemon, spinning is crucial especially for winning the weather war. Starmie can't spin vs Jellicent at all and since this is a hail team, the opponent won't fear a Life Orb Thunder. I'm going to suggest a SubToxic Tenetacruel over Starmie. While this variant of Tentacruel can't KO Jellicent, it can stall it out with the combination of Toxic + Sub, while Jellicent won't be able to break the sub or Taunt Tentacruel as it is faster. Jellicent will eventually have switch out or die to Toxic at which point Tentacruel will be able to safely spin. Tentacruel also provided you with an excellent check to Scizor. With Tentacruel spreading Toxic, Froslass will be even more difficult to take down as it will be able to stall out stuff it can't paralyze such Gastrodon and Quagsire if Tentacruel manages to get Toxic on them. One concern you might have is Tentacruel being worn down quickly, but you may be able to heal it with Abomasnow's Leech Seed.

the tentacruel definently seems interesting, i'll certainly test it out, and I'll use rocky helmet on skarmory as you made a good point. I could always run a set similar to this on starmie (or just use toxic over thunder wave). I'll test both out, thanks

Theoretically Tentacruel should work better, especially since this team would benefit a LOT from Toxic Spikes. The only significant reason to use Starmie is that it checks Terrakion better. It's dangerous but it shouldn't get any safe switches without risky double switching. Skarmory and Froslass can also check it reasonably well.

Other than that I can't see anything to change, its a really fun effective team. I tried Disable Froslass out a couple of months ago but with Toxic Spikes support and a more offensive EV spread, it's an amazing set.

I second the above suggestion of tentacruel. I used to use a sub disable frosslass but with protect in place of thunder wave since i had toxic spikes support. It basically turns it into a cross between subprotect toxic stall gliscor and sub disable gengar, with added hax. So yeah i think tentacruel could really help this team out! It would also help you against scizor, who can wear skarmory down with superpower and plow on through with bullet punch, the burn support from scald is much needed IMO.

I used to run a similar team with heatran over kyurem, and oddly once used trick ring target starmie too! Nice team though! <3 sub disable froslass... Luvdisc <3

Theoretically Tentacruel should work better, especially since this team would benefit a LOT from Toxic Spikes. The only significant reason to use Starmie is that it checks Terrakion better. It's dangerous but it shouldn't get any safe switches without risky double switching. Skarmory and Froslass can also check it reasonably well.

Other than that I can't see anything to change, its a really fun effective team. I tried Disable Froslass out a couple of months ago but with Spikes > Thunder Wave and lots of paralysis support, its a great set.

I second the above suggestion of tentacruel. I used to use a sub disable frosslass but with protect in place of thunder wave since i had toxic spikes support. It basically turns it into a cross between subprotect toxic stall gliscor and sub disable gengar, with added hax. So yeah i think tentacruel could really help this team out! It would also help you against scizor, who can wear skarmory down with superpower and plow on through with bullet punch, the burn support from scald is much needed IMO.

I used to run a similar team with heatran over kyurem, and oddly once used trick ring target starmie too! Nice team though! <3 sub disable froslass... Luvdisc <3

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thanks for the rates :)

i've been testing tentacruel, but im not sure what version i should use. the offencive spinner with giga drain to heal is probably my favorite, but i'll test every tenta with every spread i know

I'd personally just run the max physically defensive version with Scald / Toxic Spikes / Rapid Spin / Ice Beam. Faster offensive versions are cool but they can't take a hit from Terrakion which is a major problem for this team. That said I'm only theorymonning because I've never tried offensive Tenta so it might work out better anyway.

EDIT: Lol I didn't even notice you weren't running Spikes on Skarmory, it should definitely help you more than BB.

I'd personally just run the max physically defensive version with Scald / Toxic Spikes / Rapid Spin / Ice Beam. Faster offensive versions are cool but they can't take a hit from Terrakion which is a major problem for this team. That said I'm only theorymonning because I've never tried offensive Tenta so it might work out better anyway.

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well i've tested for a bit and found out that scald / toxic / rapid spin / knock off works really well, especially against jirachi which this team really hates. it also beats jellicent. the only problem is lack of recovery, so i may bump up the speed a bit and run chestorest over knock off. just thinking out loud, i'll test it soon

i think you can drop brave bird on skarmory for spikes. bb's only real use is hitting bulk up breloom, but you've got froslass, who completely shuts it down, and kyurem as a secondary check. other than that, this team is great, especially with the tentacruel addition. luvdisc

Hey there! Solid team you got there and the SubDisable Froslass is such an epic troll. My only suggestion is to back up the use of Rocky Helmet on Skarmory to wear down Scizor. Volt-Turning might become annoying against this team if Tentacruel doesnt get an early Rapid Spin to wear down the hazards. If you use Rocky Helmet, you might want to use Drill Peck on Skarmory considering that with Hail and Brave Bird´s recoil he will die too quickly. Spikes, who was suggested by BKC is still a good option to replace Brave Bird.

I really liked this team and kudos for making that Froslass set, who combines the haxing of AcroBat Gliscor and the annoyance of SubDisable Gengar. 5/5 and a Luvdisc.

i think you can drop brave bird on skarmory for spikes. bb's only real use is hitting bulk up breloom, but you've got froslass, who completely shuts it down, and kyurem as a secondary check. other than that, this team is great, especially with the tentacruel addition. luvdisc

Hey there! Solid team you got there and the SubDisable Froslass is such an epic troll. My only suggestion is to back up the use of Rocky Helmet on Skarmory to wear down Scizor. Volt-Turning might become annoying against this team if Tentacruel doesnt get an early Rapid Spin to wear down the hazards. If you use Rocky Helmet, you might want to use Drill Peck on Skarmory considering that with Hail and Brave Bird´s recoil he will die too quickly. Spikes, who was suggested by BKC is still a good option to replace Brave Bird.

I really liked this team and kudos for making that Froslass set, who combines the haxing of AcroBat Gliscor and the annoyance of SubDisable Gengar. 5/5 and a Luvdisc.

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thanks for the rates :)

I'll test out both suggestions, and in theory I guess it makes more sense to use Spikes on Skarm. Drill peck + Rocky Helmet seems good too

If you do choose to run Dugtrio, be wary that you lose a very important Fighting-type immunity. In my opinion, Jellicent + Donphan might be a better combination than Tenta + Frolass. What this allows you to do is not only mitigate the role of defense, but also allow you to play a more balanced game against stall and offense, burning offensive sweepers and still be able to recover off damage and spin (since donphan is more threatening to offensive teams by far. Stall is then dealt with because you not only have a spinblocker with recovery now, but also because Skarmory can now afford to run Spikes.

This is really just a minor consideration, the obvious drawbacks are that Toxic Spikes aren't going to absorbed immedaitely, which are really critical in playing a hail team to have them off the field. I might also suggest running a defensive Golurk over Froslass and changing nothing else in order to check Terrakion better. Just a few thoughts.

This is a nice team, but I think it's pretty weak to full stall. For one thing, Skarmory lacks Spikes, so you won't be able to constantly wear down a Stall team's walls with Spikes and CB Terrakion, although most solid stall teams have a few ways of withstanding Terrakion's strong attacks [such as a Gliscor, a Ghost or Tentacruel in rain]. Tentacruel doesn't have fantastic longevity, either, considering Hail nullifies its Leftovers Recovery, so a stall team could constantly lure it in and wear it down with hazards and weak hits. Tentacruel is definitely a good option for the team, however, but I'd change its spread to 252 HP / 212 Def / 44 Speed, just so that it outspeeds Defensive Gliscor and Jirachi, which sit at 246 Speed. Outspeeding the latter can prove quite useful if you need to get a Scald off, since burning Jirachi makes it a lot less of a problem. Kyurem and Froslass will prove pretty underwhelming against most stall teams too, considering the former loses to Blissey and Jirachi, one of which is usually on most stall teams and the latter loses to Heatran/Jirachi and has a pretty large dependence on luck. I agree with the others on the basis that Skarmory should give up Brave Bird for Spikes, since it allows Terrakion to act as a much better stallbreaker. Anyways, on the basis of Terrakion, I can see Choice Band Terrakion being an even bigger problem than in the past, since you have nothing to revenge it with and it can pretty much take out your team by spamming Close Combat since Tentacruel can come in only a limited amount of times and Stone Edge is able to 2hko Skarmory if Stealth Rock is up. I think you could potentially replace Froslass with Dugtrio. It seems a bit unorthodox, but Dugtrio holds the benefit of trapping and revenge killing a lot of threats to this team, such as MixTar, Terrakion, Heatran and Jirachi. Trapping the first two obviously guarantees your team safety, establishing Hail as the dominant weather and eliminating one of the major threats to this team. Trapping the other 2 allows you to Blizzspam without any interference/take out 2 major hail threats overall. You can also keep Drill Peck on Skarmory and swap out Brave Bird for Spikes if you use Dugtrio.

Then i'd lose my spinblocker and the funnest element to my team. You also fail to realise that with enough luck, froslass can beat stall by disabling their recovery move and hail + Shadow Ball / Ice beam will beat them. also, how am i weak to mixtar and heatran? i have changed spikes on skarmory though.

If you do choose to run Dugtrio, be wary that you lose a very important Fighting-type immunity. In my opinion, Jellicent + Donphan might be a better combination than Tenta + Frolass. What this allows you to do is not only mitigate the role of defense, but also allow you to play a more balanced game against stall and offense, burning offensive sweepers and still be able to recover off damage and spin (since donphan is more threatening to offensive teams by far. Stall is then dealt with because you not only have a spinblocker with recovery now, but also because Skarmory can now afford to run Spikes.

This is really just a minor consideration, the obvious drawbacks are that Toxic Spikes aren't going to absorbed immedaitely, which are really critical in playing a hail team to have them off the field. I might also suggest running a defensive Golurk over Froslass and changing nothing else in order to check Terrakion better. Just a few thoughts.

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honestly, i think i have terrakion checked fine, because the only real threat is the band version. Froslass takes a cc, and skarmory isn't 2hkod by stone edge, and i can scout with aboma. Kyurem behind a sub can also beat it 70% of the time. Tenta also does well against it, but thats another reason to run giga drain.

also, delko didn't come up with that abomasnow's set. i did. he just modified the evs a bit. also, drop earthquake on abomasnow and put in leech seed. NOW. abomasnow without leech seed is like a dragonite without multiscale, useless move. also, abomasnow isnt fast enough to earthquake jirachi ever. on the other hand, jirachi's iron head will rip abomasnow into pieces. earthquake on abomasnow is a useless move. drop it now.

also, delko didn't come up with that abomasnow's set. i did. he just modified the evs a bit. also, drop earthquake on abomasnow and put in leech seed. NOW. abomasnow without leech seed is like a dragonite without multiscale, useless move. also, abomasnow isnt fast enough to earthquake jirachi ever. on the other hand, jirachi's iron head will rip abomasnow into pieces. earthquake on abomasnow is a useless move. drop it now.

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true... rachi might not like taking leech seed + protect any more than an unSTABd earthquake coming off 311 attack

Hey, Aeromence. First of all, nice try with the whole hail thing. I guess that's been trendy lately or something. But seriously, Froslass? I could think of 10 better Pokemon to replace Froslass that would alleviate the weaknesses I am about to point out.

First of all, Arcanine just straight up mauls you. You have zero counters to it, Terrakion checks but will not enjoy taking a Close Combat to the face. I don't even know what you are going to do about this. Maybe add a Dragonite in place of Froslass? This would also help you check Infernape which gives your team much trouble as well.

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Heatran would be nice to have, but I don't really see where you're going to fit it in.

Finally, anything with Dugtrio is going to give you some severe problems. Duggy can trap and kill Tentacruel (your only means of ridding yourself of hazards), and from there, Stealth Rock + any decent player can wipe the floor with you. Once again, this is a problem that doesn't look like it can be overcome considering your current setup.

Nice team overall, though. I appreciate the semi-originality with Froslass. Good luck.

Dragonite doesn't fit Hail teams nicely. In fact, it doesn't fit Hail teams at all since Hail removes Multiscale. In fact, that makes it outclassed by Kyurem completely. Froslass is incredible under Hail, and Aeromence seems to have found the perfect set for it. This team isn't mauled by Arcanine at all - Terrakion is a solid counter, resisting Flare Blitz (if you switch it in) and threatening it with Stone Edge or Earthquake. Heck, Froslass can beat it too if it Disables Flare Blitz. I do agree that Dugtrio is a problem, but it can't really be overcome without skillful playing.

I would like to back Leech Seed over Earthquake on Abomasnow though - taking a Seed to the face can be just as debilitating as taking an Earthquake. It'll help you with a lot more as well.

Hey, Aeromence. First of all, nice try with the whole hail thing. I guess that's been trendy lately or something. But seriously, Froslass? I could think of 10 better Pokemon to replace Froslass that would alleviate the weaknesses I am about to point out.

First of all, Arcanine just straight up mauls you. You have zero counters to it, Terrakion checks but will not enjoy taking a Close Combat to the face. I don't even know what you are going to do about this. Maybe add a Dragonite in place of Froslass? This would also help you check Infernape which gives your team much trouble as well.

Dnite set that fits your team nicely(Move your mouse to reveal the content)Dnite set that fits your team nicely (open)Dnite set that fits your team nicely (close)

Heatran would be nice to have, but I don't really see where you're going to fit it in.

Finally, anything with Dugtrio is going to give you some severe problems. Duggy can trap and kill Tentacruel (your only means of ridding yourself of hazards), and from there, Stealth Rock + any decent player can wipe the floor with you. Once again, this is a problem that doesn't look like it can be overcome considering your current setup.

Nice team overall, though. I appreciate the semi-originality with Froslass. Good luck.

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i lol'd when i saw this. honestly, arcanine? its easy enough to beat with just about anything. and don't bag froslass when you haven't even tried it. stealth rock + dugtrio + a skilled player may be a able to beat me, but im not stupid enough to sac tentacruel. also, why would i use dnite in hail? also, when has anyone EVER seen that jirachi set. and Arcticblast pretty much summed everything else up.

Dragonite doesn't fit Hail teams nicely. In fact, it doesn't fit Hail teams at all since Hail removes Multiscale. In fact, that makes it outclassed by Kyurem completely. Froslass is incredible under Hail, and Aeromence seems to have found the perfect set for it. This team isn't mauled by Arcanine at all - Terrakion is a solid counter, resisting Flare Blitz (if you switch it in) and threatening it with Stone Edge or Earthquake. Heck, Froslass can beat it too if it Disables Flare Blitz. I do agree that Dugtrio is a problem, but it can't really be overcome without skillful playing.

I would like to back Leech Seed over Earthquake on Abomasnow though - taking a Seed to the face can be just as debilitating as taking an Earthquake. It'll help you with a lot more as well.

Also, way to rip off my username for your team.

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lol, i really couldn't think of any other cool name for a hail team apart from deep freeze...

anyway, i think i might go back to leech seed, because i guess you're right. thanks for the rates

Your team struggles with special attackers of all sorts, namely dragons such as Latios. They can repeatedly switch in on something, spam a DM and switchout for nothing.

Another major problem is Volcarona (yet another special attacker) once Tentacruel is gone, and considering that Hail negates Tentacruel's lefties it isn't hard to wear him down over the duration of the game.

It's pretty clear what I'm getting at here; you need a special wall of some sort. Looking at your main weaknesses I would suggest running either a Heatran or Blissey. The difficult thing is finding an opening on your team to get one of them in. I'll leave that too you but it is a pretty glaring weakness.

Your team struggles with special attackers of all sorts, namely dragons such as Latios. They can repeatedly switch in on something, spam a DM and switchout for nothing.

Another major problem is Volcarona (yet another special attacker) once Tentacruel is gone, and considering that Hail negates Tentacruel's lefties it isn't hard to wear him down over the duration of the game.

It's pretty clear what I'm getting at here; you need a special wall of some sort. Looking at your main weaknesses I would suggest running either a Heatran or Blissey. The difficult thing is finding an opening on your team to get one of them in. I'll leave that too you but it is a pretty glaring weakness.

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Tentacruel, Abomasnow and Kyurem cover that up, as well as Terrakion in sand. Draco spam is a problem, but i can, switch skarm in and roost while latios switches. Also, most CM users with Psycho Shock are problems, but Terrakion can beat jirachi and Abomasnow can beat Latias

I dropped Knock Off for Toxic Spikes on Tenta which was surprisingly funny with Toxic in the same set when the likes of Jellicent switch in after seeing TS. I also gave Froslass Blizzard over Shadow Ball/Ice Beam. By the way, your Froslass set is awesome. Overall a really solid and interesting team.

I dropped Knock Off for Toxic Spikes on Tenta which was surprisingly funny with Toxic in the same set when the likes of Jellicent switch in after seeing TS. I also gave Froslass Blizzard over Shadow Ball/Ice Beam. By the way, your Froslass set is awesome. Overall a really solid and interesting team.

Good job, Luvdisc for you Sir.

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The problem with toxic spikes is that is takes up a valuable move slot which could be used better by beating dragons, scouting, or getting rid of the opponent's item. The problem with blizzard is the really low pp, as i often find myself using 7 blizzard pp to beat rotom-w, when i could use 4 shadow ball pp. thanks for the rate