cheers Rob, yeh ive always done legs last, i usually feel pretty sick after so its nice to just walk out of the gym and sit in the car for a bit oh yeah i didnt think of alternating the exercises for some reason ill start doing that i think. that looks like a nice routine, i could probably do with cutting the volume down on mine slightly by not doing arms directly etc but i love the feeling of pumped arms. ive been thinking i might do Hit legs on a saturday and upper body HIT on a sunday just so i can go a little bit more all out on legs as ill have trained nothing before them, what do you think?

"iam the strongest one! iam the viking!" - jon pall sigmarsson“may all of your dreams and ambitions happen, but most important, may all of your enemies die"www.infowars.com

Indeed you could do an upper body / lower body split, but when using a split, remember to keep in mind, you must allow for systemic recovery, in most cases that takes 3-7 days (or longer depending on the individuals recovery ability).

The only reason why I've been getting away recently with training 2x per week is because I've been using pre-exhaustion, which is classed as a"low stress" high intensity technique. But if your training in straight set fashion with compound movements to failure as the focus, that's classed as "high stress" training.

Mike Mentzer actually put me on his consolidation routine (aka The athletes routine), i didn't realize it at the time, but their actually full body workouts...

W/O A Squats or Leg Press (i went with Leg Presses)Underhand Pulldown

7 days rest then...

W/O BDeadliftsWeighted Dips

7 days rest then back to W/O A

I gained strength on this routine like there was no tomorrow:) The idea behind these workouts was to keep overlapping to a minimum.

There's certainly a case to be made for abbreviated full body H.I.T workouts, here's one of my favorite article's writing on the matter, its called full body workouts for complete recovery by Ian Duckett, one of the worlds best natural bodybuilders...http://www.irontruth.co.uk/fullbodyrout ... overy.html enjoy:)

i think i might give it a try, or maybe just do legs first one week and then upper body first the next and so on, i love HIT so many possibilities and very few "rules" if you know what i mean.

i didnt even know there was low stress and high stress HIT training....

i did that routine also and it was insane how strong i got, i got it from one of his books i cant remember which one, but i didnt put much size on for some reason but the most amount of weight ive ever lifted was on tht program about 7 or 8 years ago........ichanged it a little though to

leg press cuz squats hurt my back, i maxed the machine pretty quick and then my mate used to push the back of the sled against meweighted pull ups cuz the pull down machine only went to 90kg, in the end i was using a 45kg dumbell chained to my waist for reps

7 days rest then....

deadliftsbench press as dips used to aggrevate my shoulders

less than 15 mins a week and smashing pb's

ah the good old days of strong bear

did you have any luck with myprotein.co.uk in the end mate?

"iam the strongest one! iam the viking!" - jon pall sigmarsson“may all of your dreams and ambitions happen, but most important, may all of your enemies die"www.infowars.com

Yes the high stress and low stress H.i.T techniques Mike, Low stress begin pre-exhaustion, J-reps, 1 1/4 reps, your still training the movements to failure, but, these techniques force you to employ far lesser resistance, techniques such as rest pause, negative only, or static holds are high stress as your employing much greater resistance. Thats why the latter should be used sparingly.

Did have success at myprotien thanks mate, got some soy protein, haven't used it much though, leaves me a bit bloated:(

sweet nice one Rob think ill start on those programs tomorow, they look good! ive been a bit instinctive with training lately because of the niggles ive had, but think i can take it serious again now having discovered what i can and cant do, ill use the two prgrams you have given me and ill also alternate the high and low stress levels of training too...... been probably more stressed out in work than ive ever been in my life this week so didnt go to the gym today just chilled out and had some work done on my tattoo. HIT the weights again in the morning i think

shame about the soy, thats the one i use........mainly because its cheap. judging by the weights you use and the progress you have been making maybe you are getting enough with out it anyway mate!?

"iam the strongest one! iam the viking!" - jon pall sigmarsson“may all of your dreams and ambitions happen, but most important, may all of your enemies die"www.infowars.com

Just right mate:) I'm a big believer in instinctive training as well Mike, i actually do what Brain Johnston recommends, that is, on the day your due to train rate on a scale of 1-5 how you feel, one being tired/lethargic, five being prime awareness/energetic, if your anything less than a 4, just give training a miss and and wait another day or two.

Must tell ya, you've put me in the mood for full body training, i hit the gym last night and did a compound full body workout, like it so much i've decided to stick FB workouts for a while, alternating between compound/generalized movements one workout, and isolation/targeted movements the next, 4-5 days between workouts.

No worries about the protein shakes, i should have known better lol, I've always been more of a whole foods kinda guy, i personally believe that protein requirements have been crossly over stated in the field of bodybuilding for financial gains. When i look back at my logs of the last few years Mike, I noted that when i reduced my protein intake (from when i was a lacto-ovo veggie) and increase my fat intake, my progress has been just as good, I've continued to get leaner and stronger. Which begs the question, just how must have are these supplements:)

HIT Rob wrote:Just right mate:) I'm a big believer in instinctive training as well Mike, i actually do what Brain Johnston recommends, that is, on the day your due to train rate on a scale of 1-5 how you feel, one being tired/lethargic, five being prime awareness/energetic, if your anything less than a 4, just give training a miss and and wait another day or two.

yeh that makes sense, theres no point in trying to stimulate maximum gains if your not 100% up for it,it takes alot of effort and concentration to push yourself hard enough for HIT to work. sometimes another day of rest and good food is all it takes!

Must tell ya, you've put me in the mood for full body training, i hit the gym last night and did a compound full body workout, like it so much i've decided to stick FB workouts for a while, alternating between compound/generalized movements one workout, and isolation/targeted movements the next, 4-5 days between workouts.

haha, it will be interesting to follow your progress on that too then, i love the feeling of just total, almost shock after a whole body HIT day i cant even think straight once ive finished its awesome!

No worries about the protein shakes, i should have known better lol, I've always been more of a whole foods kinda guy, i personally believe that protein requirements have been crossly over stated in the field of bodybuilding for financial gains. When i look back at my logs of the last few years Mike, I noted that when i reduced my protein intake (from when i was a lacto-ovo veggie) and increase my fat intake, my progress has been just as good, I've continued to get leaner and stronger. Which begs the question, just how must have are these supplements:)

yeh i agree with you there, i think for people who use steroids then the more the better as most steroids work by increasing the rate of protein synthesis if im not mistaken, so im guessing you can make them work better or at least have more of the protein fed to the muscles if you are taking alot of it in. but for naturals then i think after a certain point its just a waste, i have 2 a day just because its easy in work and saves me making a packed lunch. ive increased my fat a little like you said and so far so good. i think if you want to get massive muscles then its more about just clean good calories rather than grams of protein, like what you do.

"iam the strongest one! iam the viking!" - jon pall sigmarsson“may all of your dreams and ambitions happen, but most important, may all of your enemies die"www.infowars.com

"i cant even think straight once ive finished its awesome" LOL, i can barely put a sentence together after a workout. I usually have a chat with my trainer for 20 minutes or so after my workouts, last night i kept forgetting what i was going to say, John said to me "your head's away with the fairies":))

well todays planned routine went out of the window when i got to the gym and every person who has ever thought about going to the gym decided today was the day to go and they brought a friend each too, so i just hammered each bodypart with whichever machine and weight i could get to and it actually turned out alright. well i felt sick tired and unable to use my brain very well for a while after so i think it went well.

"iam the strongest one! iam the viking!" - jon pall sigmarsson“may all of your dreams and ambitions happen, but most important, may all of your enemies die"www.infowars.com

mrbear666 wrote:well todays planned routine went out of the window when i got to the gym and every person who has ever thought about going to the gym decided today was the day to go and they brought a friend each too, so i just hammered each bodypart with whichever machine and weight i could get to and it actually turned out alright. well i felt sick tired and unable to use my brain very well for a while after so i think it went well.

The biggest problem I ever had with going to the gym.. Sometimes they're people you know which can we quite nice, but when you wanna get on with it and they're all chatty and mostly dickheads that don't know what they're doing its so frustrating.. What happened to your home set up mike?

klaatu21 wrote:sensai ross, forgive me for doubting you and myself

Mini Forklift Ⓥ wrote:There's only one thing I'm riding at 6am, and it's not a bike!

yo Ross, i just find the gym easier at the minute cuz im using alot of machines in my work outs due to dodgy back and i only have free weights at home........the fools that annoy me only go in the week nights so im safe on the weekends and only alright people are there lol hope all is good with you mate

"iam the strongest one! iam the viking!" - jon pall sigmarsson“may all of your dreams and ambitions happen, but most important, may all of your enemies die"www.infowars.com

went to watch amon amarth, carcass, bleed from within, and hell last night........was a brilliant night, amon amarth are the best band ive seen i think. had no voice for a while today after singing along

"iam the strongest one! iam the viking!" - jon pall sigmarsson“may all of your dreams and ambitions happen, but most important, may all of your enemies die"www.infowars.com