Hello! I was wondering if you could help me get started making electronic music on my Macbook. What are some good softwares to use? I'd be recording largely using samples to start, rather than live recording or the like. I'm starting up a small music project with a friend based on making electronic music, and I think that I should try making some on my own, too (or at least get familiar with the technology)

I'd like to keep things free to start, because I'm not entirely sure what I'll need at the moment. For example, I don't exactly remember which software he records on, and there might be some trouble sending my songs to him if they're not compatible with his music software, so might hold off on paying for programs for now. (This begs the question: will I have any trouble sending songs to my friend that he can open and alter on his PC? I'll have to ask what he records on soon...)

Also, where could I find good advice about making electronic music this way, or about making it on a mac, or about how to use the best software for this situation?

At 5/13/12 02:40 AM, NoNeVERNoTEvERFoREVR wrote:
Hello! I was wondering if you could help me get started making electronic music on my Macbook. What are some good softwares to use? I'd be recording largely using samples to start, rather than live recording or the like. I'm starting up a small music project with a friend based on making electronic music, and I think that I should try making some on my own, too (or at least get familiar with the technology)

Garageband is a pretty good place to start to learn the basics, it does all you want according to this paragraph and more (it has bukt in instruments for you to mess around with using "Midi", its not something you have to record live, istead you could use your mouse to "put in" notes).

I'd like to keep things free to start, because I'm not entirely sure what I'll need at the moment. For example, I don't exactly remember which software he records on, and there might be some trouble sending my songs to him if they're not compatible with his music software, so might hold off on paying for programs for now. (This begs the question: will I have any trouble sending songs to my friend that he can open and alter on his PC? I'll have to ask what he records on soon...)

While Garageband files are not compatible with PC software you can bypass this by sending each track to him as an mp3 or .wav, its not ideal, but for a starting project it should be more then enough.

Also, where could I find good advice about making electronic music this way, or about making it on a mac, or about how to use the best software for this situation?

Thanks!

Youtube, no joke, is probably the best, theres tons of beginners tutorials for garageband explaining the layout and workflow.

Also: I suggest not using the loop browser that follows with garageband, you wont learn anything that way, theres a lot of youtubers who only use them and the end result just sounds... bad.

At 5/13/12 09:32 AM, Usernamemyarse wrote:
Also: I suggest not using the loop browser that follows with garageband, you wont learn anything that way, theres a lot of youtubers who only use them and the end result just sounds... bad.

Not to mention, if you ever decide to upload your music to NewGrounds, using Garageband loops (or loops that come with any other software, such as Mixcraft, Logic Pro, Fruity Loops, etc.) will get you banned.

Not that you should ever resort to using loops, for two reasons: 1) due to the licensing terms, you can't actually do anything commercial with any tracks you make that use those pre-made loops, and 2) it's insulting to people who actually do put the time and effort into writing every note for every instrument in their music.

Garageband loops are in fact perfectly legal to use in commercial productions and it happens all the time. Doesn't mean you get to do it here though, and different companies make up different rules about what you can do with their stuff.

At 5/13/12 11:11 AM, RampantMusik wrote:
Not that you should ever resort to using loops, for two reasons: 1) due to the licensing terms, you can't actually do anything commercial with any tracks you make that use those pre-made loops, and 2) it's insulting to people who actually do put the time and effort into writing every note for every instrument in their music.

I think a discussion worth having is one about the differences between using software that's entirely loop based, such as mixcraft, and uploading it to the portal, and using professional loop-based packages in music. Saying 'Loops = banned' seems unfair, when there's plenty of precedent in commercial music for using tools that allow composers and musicians to lay down tracks for instruments they don't play.

Saying that no loops can be used commercial is incorrect, and you know it. There's plenty of libraries specifically designed for use in commercial music.

Further, saying that using one kind of tool is somehow 'insulting' to other people is ridiculous. Don't get me wrong, if someone slaps a couple of extended loops together and calls it a song, then there shouldn't be any hesitation to call them out on it, but saying that anyone who doesn't spend a bunch of time doing tedious sequencing they don't need or wants acoustic instruments they don't play is somehow less of a musician is the insult, not someone who wants to apply a valid tool to their production process.

At 5/13/12 01:45 PM, loansindi wrote:
Saying that no loops can be used commercial is incorrect, and you know it. There's plenty of libraries specifically designed for use in commercial music.

My post was referencing programs such as Magix Music Maker and Mixcraft, etc., in which it IS against the license to use them for anything other than personal projects. I do not recall ever putting the word "ALL" in front of "LOOPS." In addition, we have a post in the Audio Mod lounge that lists loop packs that are allowed and which ones are banned from the portal. In general, it's better to tell a new user "stay away from loops," because it's much easier to avoid that potential problem altogether.

Further, saying that using one kind of tool is somehow 'insulting' to other people is ridiculous. Don't get me wrong, if someone slaps a couple of extended loops together and calls it a song, then there shouldn't be any hesitation to call them out on it, but saying that anyone who doesn't spend a bunch of time doing tedious sequencing they don't need or wants acoustic instruments they don't play is somehow less of a musician is the insult, not someone who wants to apply a valid tool to their production process.

Nope, loops are a cheap, cheap way of making music. There are certain times in which it's acceptable (such as woodwind runs that come in some sample libraries), but that is because it's usually impossible to accurately and realistically create a woodwind run without having a recording of someone actually playing it.

If someone writes four notes over a descending bass line, that's far more worthy of praise than someone who has slapped some loops together and said "Done." If you think loops are great, and they're a seriously valid tool for serious composers, then you can get the fuck out of music composition: it's amateur musicians with attitudes like that who have brought down the price point for semi-professional composition to the point that where people expect work to be done for free, and even when we get paying gigs, it's hardly enough to live off of.

On Garageband, I've messed around a bit, but I'm not able to alter samples the way I've seen my friend do it so far; maybe I can manage it if I dig further into the 'help' info, which I'll try. I'll also definitely check out Youtube, as I've heard good things about instructional videos on there before, as well. It seems like there are a lot of good music-production info. sites out there, but I'll check some of the recommended sites when I have a minute. Then again, the sites recommended here are probably more reliable than anything I immediately pulled up on my Google search...

Regarding the two arguments that emerged here, I'm glad that Garageband samples are cleared for commercial uses, but aside from that consideration, I don't have much of a stance on the use of loops, and would still consider using them. I'm new at this, so I should at least become familiar with the use of loops, and decide what I think about them for myself. Also, I'm really new at this, so I wouldn't turn down any useful information :)

By the by, I've talked to my collaborator, and he says that he uses Fruity Loops with a variety of added synths. So, I guess the question is, what would be most compatible with that on a mac? A quick search suggests that Fruit loops itself is not made to run on a Mac (although someone may have managed it with hacks).

At 5/13/12 03:35 PM, RampantMusik wrote:
If you think loops are great, and they're a seriously valid tool for serious composers, then you can get the fuck out of music composition

yawn

it's amateur musicians with attitudes like that who have brought down the price point for semi-professional composition to the point that where people expect work to be done for free, and even when we get paying gigs, it's hardly enough to live off of.

as far as i'm concerned there is no problem here. if loop based music is good enough for animators then it simply means that you've become irrelevant.

Saying that no loops can be used commercial is incorrect, and you know it. There's plenty of libraries specifically designed for use in commercial music.

I have a question, loans: are any of the loops that come with Fruity Loops banned from commercial use, like RampantMusik suggested? Where on a program can we tell if we're allowed to use the samples for commercial purposes? Admittedly, it doesn't really matter at this point-- most of the music we've been making so far is based on using synth instruments. However, I might use a sample here and there, at least to start, and being able to tell would be useful.

Ramp, I think it's incredible how lazy some folks get with loops, that they don't realize the whole point is to CUT the thing up, get individual notes and incidentals from the instrument that can't be produced any other way.

I've never even been able to fit a whole loop into a composition and make it sound right. I've always HAD to cut it up.

At 5/31/12 06:27 PM, NoNeVERNoTEvERFoREVR wrote:
are any of the loops that come with Fruity Loops banned from commercial use, like RampantMusik suggested?

If they're from the "Used in demo projects" folder from any version of FL, then probably! Otherwise I would consider them fair game. There isn't enough loop content that comes with FL to make an entire song from anyway.

There used to be a folder that had loops from a bunch of big name songs made with FL (Faxing Berlin was one of them) but they got rid of it to protect themselves and the end users from being legally buttfucked by the recording industry. That folder isn't in versions 9.0 or later.

Well you got a good start with Mac, throw garageband out the window, download Reaper for Mac, its free and just as good as pro tools, for electronic music you can fill reaper with Vsts, there are alot of free vst synths, that will get you started, you need a midi keyboard too.

It's not free. The demo is just fully functional (kinda like FL studio only without the save restriction). Without buying it, you will have to keep it in "evaluation mode" (which u can do forever)....it just means you have to wait at a bit of a loading screen before you can work in it everytime you open it, and then select "still evaluating."

It is however a damn good DAW and pretty cheap to get the license(I think its like 60 bucks for a student edition)

Thanks for the heads-up about loops, guys. Good to know it works like that. Also, I'll definitely give Reaper a shot once I at least get the hang of GarageBand.

With Garageband, there's only one thing I still need to know how to do: how do I place notes using the track editor? Oh sure, I can record them, but that doesn't always give the notes the precision that I'd like. I can adjust the size of notes on a preset track, but I can't seem to place them.

That's probably a dumb question (it's gotta be pretty easy to place notes, otherwise they would be overlooking a key feature), but it's legitimately causing me a problem so I have to ask. (At least I didn't start a new thread!)