Sizing up the "birthers"

Asked an open-ended question about where President Obama was born, 14 percent of Americans say he was born abroad - giving an incorrect answer that shows how widespread the misunderstanding of his birthplace is nearly a year and a half into his presidency.

Fully 68 percent of those surveyed in a new Washington Post-ABC News poll say, unprompted, that he was born in the United States, including 48 percent who accurately cite Hawaii. Another 9 percent say it's their "best guess" that he was born in this country, bringing the total saying he is U.S.-born to 77 percent.

Broad majorities across party lines volunteer that Obama was born in the U.S., although substantial numbers in some groups say he wasn't. In addition to the 14 percent who volunteer that he was born in another country, another 6 percent say that's their best guess. Overall, about a third of Republicans and conservatives say Obama was born in another country, or call it their best guess. Asked how firmly they hold this belief, most say they see his being born outside the country as their "suspicion only."

About a third of all those who say Obama might have been born in another country approve of how he's handling his job as president, hold favorable views of him personally and prefer him over congressional Republicans when it comes to dealing with issue No.1, the economy.

Some 9 percent see "solid evidence" that Obama was born elsewhere, a figure that peaks at 17 percent among those who consider themselves to be ideologically "very conservative."

Q: On another subject, where was Barack Obama born, as far as you know?

First off I am not a birther. It does not consume my time or thoughts. However since I read the article I would like to say this. Mr Obama applied for a job. This job has certian restrictions and qualifications. If I apply for a job and refuse to supply the required information asked for by the employer I will not get the job. My question why is there a question? Why is the requuired information not presented? Why was there a need for the Gov. of Hawaii to make his birth certificate unavailable? Why if there is no issue will they still not release it. It appears to me its not the birthers causing the problem. It is The administration. If you don't like the word coverup then I suggest you don't coverup.

Obama didn't "refuse to provide the information." He has posted his birth certificate online. The state of Hawaii has verified that he was born there. End of issue, except for those with several screws loose who keep harping about their insane belief that he wasn't.

"
Why was there a need for the Gov. of Hawaii to make his birth certificate unavailable? Why if there is no issue will they still not release it. It appears to me its not the birthers causing the problem. It is The administration. If you don't like the word coverup then I suggest you don't coverup."

so do you have your original birth certificate, i know I don't and can't get it from the state of MO since it is now microfilmed and stored. I get a certified true copy for my passport. Most other states have done the same for the last 30 years or so. So how do you release the true copy. This is chattering morons trying to undermine a political opponent who they can't tag as stupid since he hasn't given them grounds to do so

"The scalar waves produced by the microwave/laser radio frequency directed energy weapon (RFDE) are capable of carrying multiple "subcarrier" radio frequencies that affect human physiology, at variable power levels (or "amplitude"). In effect, the RFDE arms security forces with a "God machine" that can manipulate, disrupt, or destroy the biological processes that govern the functioning of human beings."

"Why was there a need for the Gov. of Hawaii to make his birth certificate unavailable? Why if there is no issue will they still not release it."

It's because Hawaii has these pesky things called privacy laws - the same laws which prevent state governments from releasing your original birth certificate to anyone who asks for it, regardless of their need or plans for it. The document Obama released is his official Hawaii birth certificate and is fully accepted by the federal government and all state governments as proof of birthplace and thus citizenship. Live with it.

I don’t care if he was born in outer space at this point.
What I am concerned about is his ideologies. His arrogance. His agenda. His racism and divisiveness. His break the bank spending. Behind closed doors deal making. His pandering to special interests. His need for apparent total control and obvious temper tantrums directed at those who dare to disagree with him.
I’m more concerned about who he really is now!

"So This great Nation will endure as it has endured, will revive and will prosper. So, first of all, let me assert my firm belief that the only thing we have to fear is fear itself—nameless, unreasoning, unjustified terror which paralyzes needed efforts to convert retreat into advance." FDR's 1St Inaugural address March 4th, 1933.

I tried like hell to find a core rationale for such thinking. I've concluded what ever one has in common is they unfortunate cling to the emotion of "fear".

We often hear that label flunged at the GOP, fear-mongering. When we were enlightened by the RNC fundraiser tactics reported by Politico 3/3/10. The fact, the presentation was delivered by RNC Finance Director Rob Bickhart to top donors and fundraisers at a party retreat in Boca Grande, Florida on February 18. Politico reported that the big donors were wooed by ego-building tactics. The blind minions, usually the sporadic twenty dollar donors, were told to be afraid, be very afraid. Politico reported it was based on "The small donors who are the targets of direct marketing are described under the heading “Visceral Giving.” Their motivations are listed as “fear;” “Extreme negative feelings toward existing Administration;” and “Reactionary.”

Accordingly the motive behind the RNC is clear, prey on the peoples fear.

I see now why all the outlandish thinking in the Republican base. If we look across the GOP members of Congress, you here the same push for fear. Seems Southern politicians are the worst. Senator Demint is like a pusher man. So they RNC, GOP, "independents", all have been obviously successful. Unfortunately, their trying like hell to break the democrats that are gullible. It's obvious as hell.

Since the followers of the right-wing are so pathetically fearful, I believe their fear level has heighten with the Arizona law. Not because of illegal aliens, the hierarchy of the RNC, GOP, Rush, were hit by a board of reality. Making 12 million immigrants, 76% Hispanic will become future democrats? The white people are becoming a minority? We will become an extinct party? The GOP has the chances of becoming a tiny whinny party? We must use:

FEAR! FEAR! FEAR! use it to obtain power.

Birthers are just a fringe of such fearful thinking, unfortunately it's wider. If you watch a debate or comment or even the semantics, It is the concept of fear. It is all to commonplace. Are people really this gullible?

Let me guess....100% of the Birthers watch Fox News and use phrases like "activist judges," "elitists," and "Sarah Palin isn't stupid; you are just afraid of her!"

They probably think we should kill all suspected terrorists without a trial yet applaud the American who didn't want to pay taxes so he flew into an IRS building and killed someone. They also elected Joe the Plumber into office this year too even though his response to immigration was, "put up a fence and start shooting."

thrh, chet_brewer, and JackCarter42 are all, of course, totally correct. But it doesn't matter to the nutcases who will insist that Obama was not born in the U.S., no matter what documentation is provided. As chet_brewer said, almost NOBODY has a copy of their original birth certificate, and I had the same experience having to get mine from South Carolina 35 years ago. The only copy I have of my "true" birth certificate is one made on a wet copier that is basically unreadable. Good thing I'm not running for President and have to supply that to satisfy the birthers and other lunatics. But, wait a minute: wasn't SC once part of another country?!? Maybe I wasn't born in America after all. In that case, never mind...

16% of Americans believe that 9/11 was perpetrated by the US government. 30% still believe that Saddam was involved in 9/11 even though no less an "expert" than G.W. Bush said he was not. I guess that a number as small as 14% in this case is good and shows a low "ignorance factor" on this issue.

Everyone with half a brain knows that the "birthers" found the perfect vehicle to express their racism. Even these ignorant people are smart enough (oxymoron notwithstanding) to know they cannot talk "racism" openly, but from day-one these people didn't like Obama's race and would use any euphemism -- and did -- to display their feelings like preening peacocks. Should they be ignored? Absolutely not. America needs to know its enemies.

I believe that Obama should be challenged on the topic of his birth certificate because those who raised the issue were wrongly smeared as racists. Attempting to use illegitimate means to squelch debate of legitimate questions, even marginally legitimate questions, cannot be permitted in a healthy democracy.

I would be VERY HAPPY to know that he and his attorneys have released his academic records (SEALED THEY ARE -- FOR THOSE THAT DON'T KNOW) from his years and Occidental, Princeton, etc. all higher learning college records were sealed at his attorney's request. Now I ask you, what is THAT all about???

The Birther's are misguided Kooks, who are devoid of any semblance of rational thought.

Has it ever occurred to these Kooks that before most rank-and-file, high level gov't employees, and officials can be hired or fill certain positions in the Federal Gov't or Military there is a series of background checks and investigations that have to be completed first, by the FBI and other investigative sources.

These background checks and investigations also include Gov't Contractor's working for the Feds.

The Birther's need to figure out a way to step outside of their distorted brains for a 10 minutes or more, so that they can see and understand the bigger picture.

The birthers are wingnuts. They generally are ignorant and not terribly bright. Conspiracy theorists in seem to have some sort of mental instability, or they just don't have enough to do with their time. With all the things most people have to deal with in today's world, that in itself is amazing.

While the idea of using "literacy tests" for voting has traditionally been used to exclude people based on race, maybe we could devise some national basic test toweed out people this amazingly stupid from influencing our politics.

These are the people who think that Alaska is right beside California bacause that is where it is on their maps....and that Hawaii is a foreign nation because it is far away and has a funny name.

Obama could FedEx a certified copy of his birth certificate to every one of them and nothing would change.

Have they asked for McCain's, Palin's, McConnell's, or Gingrich's birth certificates? Or Biden's, Reid's, or Pelosi's, for that matter? How do KNOW they are natural born citizens, other than they say so?

These folks really should have some sort of test of basic political competence and simple 4th grade logic before they are allowed to vote, or drive cars for that matter. Who knows when someone with a blog will convince them that traffic lights are a communist conspiracy and stopping for "red" is part of indoctrinating them into the commie agenda!

I'm less concerned about where he was born than I am about where he was raised, by whom, and under what conditions. From what I gather, his mother and father, a citizen of Kenya, split up right after he was born and his mother moved with him to Indonesia. Michelle Obama has stated that Barrack's home country is Kenya. He's the first president in my lifetime that has seemed to act like he is not from the U.S. Like he didn't grow up proud of his country. He doesn't buy the notion of American Exceptionalism. And he's more interested in how America looks in the eyes of foreigners than Americans.

While I believe the President was born in the U.S., I wonder if there is something that is being hidden by his not releasing the long form of his birth certificate. As opposed to the short form which is listed online, the long form certificate includes the name of the hospital, the name of the attending physician, name and address of the parents, the race of the parents and the race of the baby.
Mr. President, can you post the long form of your certificate online?

"The Agenda" is bringin employment back -- with great results...stopping the slide into economic chaos, with great results (wonder if it was a Birther who typed BBBBBBILLLION insted of MMMMMMMMMILION yesterday and sent markets into a tailspin?) reinvigorating the US infrastructure, taking on the Taliban and Qaeda instead of piddling away lives and treasure in Iraq, getting a start on a new energy infrastructure, enforcing civil rights and environmental and workplace laws.....what a horrible agenda! Next thing you know he is going to start moving toward balancing the budget after the crisis of the conservatives is handled....commie.

I'm less concerned about where he was born than I am about where he was raised, by whom, and under what conditions. From what I gather, his mother and father, a citizen of Kenya, split up right after he was born and his mother moved with him to Indonesia. Michelle Obama has stated that Barrack's home country is Kenya. He's the first president in my lifetime that has seemed to act like he is not from the U.S. Like he didn't grow up proud of his country. He doesn't buy the notion of American Exceptionalism. And he's more interested in how America looks in the eyes of foreigners than Americans.

Posted by: Love-em-or-leave-town

~~~

I too was concerned about how George Bush was raised his living conditions, his drug use, alcoholism, and his ability to fail at so many things all of his life.

George Bush acted like he was not proud of his country, otherwise, he would not have been so hell bent on destroying it from the inside.

A poster wrote: "What I am concerned about is his ideologies. His arrogance. His agenda. His racism and divisiveness. His break the bank spending. Behind closed doors deal making. His pandering to special interests. His need for apparent total control and obvious temper tantrums directed at those who dare to disagree with him."

This poster is not concerned about where Obama was born. Oh, what terrific news! This poster is concerned about all the other things he heard from Rush Limbaugh and Fox News and the Republican party. Gosh, we can all breath a sigh of relief that at least one right wing conservative is concerned about the right things!

"Posted by: cjhill41 | May 7, 2010 8:43 AM
First off I am not a birther. It does not consume my time or thoughts. However since I read the article I would like to say this. Mr Obama applied for a job. This job has certian restrictions and qualifications. If I apply for a job and refuse to supply the required information asked for by the employer I will not get the job. My question why is there a question? Why is the requuired information not presented? Why was there a need for the Gov. of Hawaii to make his birth certificate unavailable? Why if there is no issue will they still not release it. It appears to me its not the birthers causing the problem. It is The administration. If you don't like the word coverup then I suggest you don't coverup."

___________________________________________

Two things. First, I can't recall any President ever being obligated to show their birth certificate. Did George W. Bush have to do this? What about Bill Clinton? The answer in both cases is no. So why does Obama? Out of the principal, I would also refuse to show my birth certificate if I were Obama, and flip the the people demanding it the bird.

Second, its an entirely made up accusation, mostly by people who can't stand having the son of a Muslim (and later atheist), African immigrant. Talk about 3 things that will really rile up the very conservative (17% who say there is "strong evidence" to support he was not born in the US). These people will always be suspicious of a person like these, even if the original certificate was placed in front of their face. So whats the point? It wouldn't dispell the myth anyway.

What is so crazy about birthers, is that they ignore the constitution in their reasoning. All the constitution requires is that the President of the United States be a Natural Born Citizen, and also at least 35 years old. The constitution does NOT require the President's LONG birth certificate, or that the President show his/her birth certificate to any authority. Obama has met the requirements. He is the legitimate President. Birthers should go get a rabies shot, and then the foaming at the mouth would subside.

I'm less concerned about where he was born than I am about where he was raised, by whom, and under what conditions. From what I gather, his mother and father, a citizen of Kenya, split up right after he was born and his mother moved with him to Indonesia. Michelle Obama has stated that Barrack's home country is Kenya. He's the first president in my lifetime that has seemed to act like he is not from the U.S. Like he didn't grow up proud of his country. He doesn't buy the notion of American Exceptionalism. And he's more interested in how America looks in the eyes of foreigners than Americans.

Same folks who still believe the world is flat. If the aliens rumors are correct, that could explain Rush, Glenn and Dickie boy (and the Fox mother ship). Some people are so lazy they listen to talk radio and believe everything that comes out of it. Of course, they only listen to morons who have no obligation to tell the truth.

Considering GWB still had a 25% approval rate the day he left office and we all rightfully made fun of those knuckledraggers, can you imagine being one of these basement dwelling, inbred grade school dropouts that STILL think Obama was born elsewhere?

We should get them all together and give them their own state. We will call it "New West Virginia"

tmjirc said it perfectly in a post at 9:14 am this morning. I am much more worried about what the egomaniac in chief is doing to the United States now, than where he was born. In 2012, the world will little note nor long remember where he came from, we will all be watching him eagerly as he leaves!

When I first brought up the WaPo homepage this morning the first thing I saw was the headline for this article that 14% of Americans think that President Obama was born in another country. Right above that blurb was another headline reading "Neanderthal Inbreeding." Coincidence or simply the answering as to why there are so many stupid people in this country.

SInce clearly this is a Republican meme I was wondering if there is or has been any equivalent on the Progressive side? I'm not talking political theory or philosophy but rather believing in something that can be proved to be false.

Obviously, 14 percent of our population is ignorant and do not have the ability to process readily available information. I wonder what percent of the 14 percent can be linked to Neanderthal interbreeding? 100%? 75%. I bet the number would be high.

what would happen if i started a viral, below-the-radar campaign that said gingrich, beck, limbaugh, graham, demint, et. al. were actually born on the planet vulcan or romulus? do you suppose i could get enough pressure going so that they would all have to post their birth certificates on line, along with their kindergarten grades for deportment and their high school marks in woodshop?....

Birthers are not the issue, we all understand where they lie. Injecting the emotion of fear is the GOP way. If "independents" are as gullible to tap into the scheme the GOP feeds off of, Democrats simple have to come out in numbers.

Look at the AZ law, what the extreme GOP politians know, if the hispanics come into play, the 76% of the 12 million illegals will most likely choose the Democratic party. This is a major threat to the leadership of the GOP.

When gullible GOP minions i.e. birthers, Tea baggers, the extreme right Arizonians, are filled with fear of a government takeover, the leaders of the GOP know damn well their party may become on a extinction list.

Dear Sirs,
Should an ex-con have access to public airwaves or be allowed to "vet" a dog's pedigree?
In particular, should a pardoned felon like G. Gordon Liddy, be allowed to demand Beau's pedigree, much less Obama's birth certificate?
Clifford Spencer

I am not a birther, but do have doubts that he was born in Hawaii. Also the fact that he was enrolled in a school in Indonesia that does not allow dual citizenships is disturbing. That document that he has produced that "proves" he was born in Hawaii is worthless. More concerning to me is that fact that we can not view his educational records. There is a shroud of doubt about this whole scenario- who remembers him? Who talks about going to school with him? This guy is a charlatan, and an arrogant one at that. I have never felt so disconnected from a President

Was it just for those who believe that the President was born ourside the United States that that the poll asked whether the respondent based that on solid evidence or mere suspicion? That seems like a good question to also ask those who believe that he was born in the U.S.

@9:14 --
"I don’t care if he was born in outer space at this point.
What I am concerned about is his ideologies. His arrogance. His agenda. His racism and divisiveness. His break the bank spending. Behind closed doors deal making. His pandering to special interests. His need for apparent total control and obvious temper tantrums directed at those who dare to disagree with him."

There has recently been some more very interesting Youtube videos by Dr. Ronald J. Polland, PhD on his forenic work on Obama's jpg posted Certification of Live Birth. For those who want to see the basis of the claim that for some reason Obama forged his own COLB.

tjmlrc says "What I am concerned about is his ideologies. His arrogance. His agenda. His racism and divisiveness. His break the bank spending. Behind closed doors deal making. His pandering to special interests. His need for apparent total control and obvious temper tantrums directed at those who dare to disagree with him." Gee, are you still talking about George Bush?

I'm not a "birther". It doesn't occupy my time. But having been a journalism student at the time of Watergate, I do like to ask questions and to get to the truth of things. Those who attack the so-called birthers seem not to have such curiosity. Instead, they attack and ridicule those who do. If the administration really wanted to quell such talk they would furnish the real proof, or explain why it may not exist. Funny, they never do. They just mock others who have the audacity to ask questions. It's too bad Bernstein and Woodward are so old in the tooth these days. This poll convinces me of nothing.

The birther crowd will never accept Obama for what he is, despite proof to the nth degree. They are really sore losers who want to try to discredit Obama, and this is the only wand that they can wave. Sadly, for them, there is no magic dust in it and they look more like frustrated orchestra leaders than anything else. But let them continue, the music in their minds is most comforting to them and they may find peace among the notes that they direct.

The birther movement defies all laws of common sense. Everyone in the US including all that have posted in this forum know that President Obama was born in the United States. Considering the thoroughness of the presidential vetting process if he was not a citizen he would not be president-end of story. The real issue here is that these folks do not like this man because he is a black. Never before in the history of presidential politics has the vetting process been questioned. Also you have other key words that these folks use ie "socialist" etc. Clearly these folks do not know what a socialist actually is, and when asked many cannot give an accurate answer. All they can muster is that Obama is for big government. It's curious how these folks did not protest or call into question the Arizona immigration profiling law which is a function of big 'government'. They did not argue with that b/c it suited their interests. The funniest aspect about this is that these folks actually think right wing conservatives have their best interests in mind just b/c they look like them. This is no further from the truth. The only qualities these folks share with the conservative right is that of skin color. The conservative right wings mission is to further the agenda of the corporate infrastructure. Truly unfortunate and I am ashamed to call these people my countrymen.

It makes me sad that the far right would rather engage in fear tactics, threats, and outright lies than to open up a logical, solution-focused discussion about our country's issues. The basic philosophy that founded the GOP was a darn good one -- small government, personal responsibility, etc -- the religious zealots have manipulated the party to the point of it being unrecognizable from its original form. Dems & Reps did not used to be that far apart at all on the issues -- until religion took over the GOP and they decided to tell everyone how to live. Not exactly "small government." Now they seek to undermine an administration for whom 75% of its job is to clean up the mess left by the last GOP in the White House.

Either they are ignorant (which is a failure on the part of their parents and their educational system), or they are misguided (which means they are scared little lambs), or they are deliberately and willfully being stupid. Which one?

There is no depth to which ignoramuses will sink when they hate someone so much. If it wasn't about his birth records, it would be about something else.

Bases on many of the above comments we are either a nation of morons or racists or both. John McCain was clearly not born in this country and it was dubious whether he is a natural-born citizen, but no one cared. Obama has posted more information than any President and people continue to make it an issue. Conservatives are wonderful. We spent millions of dollars investigating Whitewater with conservatives looking in every corner...and nothing. The 2000 election was clearly stolen from Gore...and conservatives say, "get over it." Wow, amazing.

MPH- I'm sure in Oil City you have a huge illegal Hispanic population that is draining your financial resources. I live in California and we are on the brink of bankruptcy- and a large part of that is due to entitlement programs. I have illegals walk in to my office on a regular basis toting their illegal identification- and then hop in to their uninsured vehicle, with no legal drivers license and drive off. Maybe it is your Social Security number they are using? Then maybe you would wake up. You people who do not live in border states need to keep your self righteous mouths shut. Arizona and Texas security is at stake- maybe if your daughter was caught in the crossfire of some drug gangs dispute you might wake up also. I stand in line behind people all the time at the grovery store buying food with their food stamps- 3 kids at their side and one on the way- illegals. I know of an illegal who had a child with a birth defect and that child has cost the taxpayers hundered of thousand of dollars- who is going to pay for all this when they DO NOT pay taxes? Who pays for the police services, and roads? Pick up my local Ca newspaper any day of the week and the crime reports are 80% Hispanic involvement. Kids who don't even know what Cinco de Mayo is, are demonstrating because some WHITE people wore American flag shirts- Cinco de Mayo is not even celebrated in Mexico- it is a holiday that Corona and Tecate beer has promoted to sell beer. So take your Tea Bagger and right wing extremist talk, and get an education--sitting their on your ivory back East tower

Has anyone noticed that you cannot have a conversation with people on the left?
No matter what you say they disintegrate into name calling, racist spewing, hate mongers.

This is the legacy that obama is going to leave. That this country took five steps backwards when the first black president was elected because he was not mature enough to lead the people but instead he encouraged partisanship and in-fighting by his and his wife’s deep seated anger at this country.

I suspect history, when it is read many years from now, will finally admit that the actions of this administration were indeed one of the reasons that our society failed.

this is a surprise? what other fantasies do teabaggers choose to believe because they prefer it over reality? Let's see. that saddam had WMDs. turned out he had a gun and a sword. lot of money and lives as a cost to get that evil man who may have actually pointed that rifle at the unites states at one point. I coudn't sleep at night thinking that bullet might come thousands of miles and hit me, until dubya the chickenhawk took care of that. they believe obama will send our children to re-education camps. he's a closet muslim. they believe john kerry fought for the other side in nam and faked his wounds. they believe if elected kerry would outlaw the bible and would insitute gay marriage, despite the fact that he reads the bible and is opposed to gay marriage. Sorry, I'd continue with 1,000 other outrageous and absurd things teabagloonies prefer to believe over reality, but I've got other things to do.

Do you really believe a black man could become president of the United States without every major law enforcement and intelligence agency from here to Interpol to Scotland Yard, checking every aspect of his background? Give me a break. Mr. Obama was born in the United States. This fringe element needs to get a life.

Davidsawh- nice talk...spoken like a true liberal. Hate, hate, hate. You progressives hated George Bush and spewed hate then. Now you are in ht drivers seat and still spew hate,. I would hate to be you.

If 14 percent believe then 86 percent do not believe. Try selling any product with those numbers and you'll quickly see you're fighting a losing battle. "One out of ten dentists believe Crest is the best....Choosy mothers choose Jif but only one of ten would recommend it......you get my point. This is a non story that only remains a story because the Post and other "news" organizations continue to print it and pay attention to it. If only one in three of Obama's staunchest detractors believe it, why do we continue to get stories about it? Slow "news" day...

"Mr Obama applied for a job. This job has certain restrictions and qualifications. If I apply for a job and refuse to supply the required information asked for by the employer I will not get the job."

He has supplied them.

And while you and all Americans may consider ourselves Obama's employer, as in, he's a servant of the people, neither you nor the rest of us has the role of verifying his eligibility. It is not up to you, me, or the man on the street to determine his legal eligibility for office, and Obama is not obligated to show us proof that is satisfactory to all of us.

Those agencies and persons who _do_ hold such a role have performed the appropriate checks.

Name another president or candidate who had to "show his papers" every time an individual citizen requested it. Name a time when such a thing was requested.

If the copy of the birth certificate displayed on line is their proof, that does not cut it. He is the problem. Rather than spending $1.7 million dollars to fight it, why not show it? The one shown on line is not even valid in Hawaii for identification. He and his family caused the problem, now he needs to correct it. If he had the hospital vault copy, wouldn't it be easier to show it and stop the hullabaloo. He is not elgible anyway because his father was not an American citizen, he recieved a Fulbright Scholarship as a foreign (Indonesian) citizen. Both of these issues are not in dispute and provable. Also, he did not register with the Selective Service on his 18th birthday which automatically precludes him from holding ANY public office. I do not think that a natural born citizen would behave like him and tear down the institutions of this country like he has. He has no loyalty to us.

OK birthers, how do you explain that the (R) Governor of Hawaii, and the Director of the Dept of Health have both made public statements confirming that Obama was born in Hawaii? Oh, I know, birthers discredit any valid sources of proof, and only believe rumormongers. How do birthers explain that every legal challenge the birthers have made has been turned down by the courts? Oh, again, discredit all the judges, and believe rumormongers instead. Birthers, if you have PROOF that Obama is not eligible to be President, by all means bring it forward. But don't expect reasonable people to believe rumor.

Plain and simple, 'birthers' are idiots who have a 'follow the pack' mentality. They hear what they want to hear and see what they want to see. It is frightening that we have such morons living among us, some are even in our Government.

If obama was born in the U.S., why did he have his birth record sealed in Hawaii. It is confirmed that he put the short form of his birth record on line; however, that does not indicate that he is a natural-born citizen, which is a requirement for presidents of the U.S. The long form of his birth record remains sealed. If obama has nothing to hide, why did he seal this birth record? What is hiding? Why did he seal his college records? His papers that he wrote as a student? No president has ever caused so much harm to the U.S. because of his radical liberal views, nor has a president and his administration been so secretive as his. Ultimately, I hope and pray that he is not a citizen of the U.S. because everything he has done against the will of a majority of American citizens will be null and void. What a joke it would be that after destroying our economy, bankrupting the country, taking over private business, stealing money from our children and grandchildren and children yet to be born for many generations to come, that he is not a citizen! The Founders were afraid America could be destroyed from within - they were right.

capatriot you're my favorite kind of person. You have patriot in your handle, but you support an un-American agenda and you don't know one thing about America. glad you brought up the chimp, and since you seem to think "true liberal" is a degoratory term I'll assume you're a "conservative" or as I like to call your kind a mindless sheep. so, you're a patriot huh? How upset were you when the entire repiglet convention was devoted to smearing john kerry by making up absurd lies about his service record? and why again do your "leaders" have to spin and lie and keep the propaganda machine running at full steam if they're telling the truth, and they have an agenda that America could accept? Were you upset when Max Cleland who left three limbs in Nam while cheney/chimp/rove were hiding and peeing down their legs everytime someone mentioned the word nam was portrayed as unpatriotic and was shown alongside pictures of osama bin laden and saddam hussien? How upset were you when American citizens who dared to display anti-bush t-shirts or bumper stickes were literally dragged out in shackles and charge with crimes? how upset were you when a gentelman in Colorado was arrested and charged with a crime, and told his young child would be "taken care of" by child services because in America this man had the audacity to say to cheney's face in a calm voice and manner, "I think your policies in Iraq are reprehensible?" that's the repuke version of patriotism. You're not a patriot, you're un-American and you should get out.

If Obama were to produce his valid birth certificate a second time, and if the Republican governor of Hawaii were to verify it's authenticity a second time, and if the Republican State Registrar were to verify it's authenticity a second time, do you really believe that the Republican Party would stop telling the ignorant rubes it manipulates that Obama wasn't a natural born citizen?

No. Of course they wouldn't.

That's what modern conservatism is all about. Manipulating dumb and gullible hicks for the benefit of the super rich.

All this talk about "Birthers" being racist is getting really tiresome. We are not the ones pulling out the race card at every opportunity. This administration has set the racism issue back decades. Remember...Pres Obama is half white...he's only about 7% black. As far as the birth certificate...anyone can get a copy of their original birth certificate. I got them for my kids when they needed them for school trips and when they competed in BMX. What was produced was a certificate of birth. WAY different. So why seal the records if their was nothing to hide...including school records???

Obama's birth certificate was posted on line. This is all the work of the GOP and other nut cases who are still angry at their losses in the last two elections and that's all this is!

Hell we spend 8 years with a fake cowboy as president, born in Connecticut, summering in Maine and sauntering like a cowboy in Texas.

If Obama wasn't really a citizen he wouldn't have made it to the general election in 2008!

So get used to it conservatives. Sarah and her little lap dog McCain did NOT win! So get over it and stop this nonsense.

Instead of looking for ways to bring our president down I don't understand why these people just don't work with their fellow citizens to bring this country back the greatness that the last GOP regime let slip away!!!

I am in Arizona, so much is posted before I even get up. It is very interesting to see what people are thinking and feeling across the country. The thing that most strikes me in these posts, and also in the conservative and right wing groups, is the feeling: FEAR. This alarms me. The fear is so vivid that people don't even see the facts. In this case, it would be that O'Bama's birth certificate has been posted for a long time now. As in a previous post, I agree that Republican and right wing leaders are promoting that fear and irrationality. A lot of people don't go to source material -- they just hear or read the bits of the fear mongering commentators and take it all in. I don't know if these people are aware of the potential dangers of their tactics. Preying on peoples' fears to win has probably already prompted violence by people who take things into their own hands. From fear, we could end up with violence or a fascist government, impervious to the civil liberties we treasure. I hope people get back into their right minds and start paying attention to what is actually happening before fear leads to more irrational acts.

concernedconservative i would agree with much of your post if you changed the name obama to bush. Obama's is the most secretive administration. thanks for the laugh. there were almost daily articles in the paper during the bush regime about how they wouldn't give up information and how many times they were sued over it. bush's radical neocon agenda not only ruined the country, it will take decades to reverse the damage if that can ever be done. god you people are naive, gullible, mindless and hypocritical. obama is here and he's running it. how's it feel? pretty much how it felt for people with brains that can operate independently of fox news and the repuke propaganda machine felt when bush and cheney were installed in the WH as the result of a deal made with Satan.

As an adoptive parent I must point out that a "Certificate of Live Birth" is not the same as a "Birth Certificate"...the former is a stipulation that you were born alive and is not necessarily an attestation or affirmation of the place where one was born. I am not a "birther" but it is curious that the Federal Election Commission does not require the production of documents verifying that you meet the qualifications to be President of the United States. Afterall, this is the most powerful position in the land and arguably in the world. More intriguing though is the sealing of the birth certificate as well as all other documents that would give insight to this man we now call President...why is that? Why can we not see his college and law school records? Why have we not seen any of his work with the Harvard Law Review? I cannot believe the press is not all over this...for goodness' sake, this is our country on the line...Mr. Obama should be compelled to produce the document that suppports the primary qualification to be President of the United States - he had to be born here - a BIRTH CERTIFICATE, not a "Certification of Live Birth".

How can anyone be sure about the details of Obama's birth when only a single political official has seen his long form birth certificate? The certificate of live birth that Obama presented in 2007 is just a printout from a government computer database that was created long after his birth. The long form certificate, which was created at the time he was born, has only been seen by one person: a political official in the Hawaiian government.

So are we supposed to be sheep and just believe the word of a single political official who says she saw the long form certificate in a vault? I don't. And she didn't instill trust in me when she spelled Barrack with only one "r" in the initial press release of her findings.

If I have learned anything about government from reading the Washington Post for the past 45 years, it's that I should have a healthy skepticism about government. I am not sure what Obama is hiding on that original birth certificate, but we all know he is hiding something. The truth will eventually come out in the wash. Hopefully, that will be soon.

I'm less concerned about where he was born than I am about where he was raised, by whom, and under what conditions. From what I gather, his mother and father, a citizen of Kenya, split up right after he was born and his mother moved with him to Indonesia. Michelle Obama has stated that Barrack's home country is Kenya. He's the first president in my lifetime that has seemed to act like he is not from the U.S. Like he didn't grow up proud of his country. He doesn't buy the notion of American Exceptionalism. And he's more interested in how America looks in the eyes of foreigners than Americans.

Posted by: Love-em-or-leave-town
____________________________

LET ME GUESS -- you are SEAN HANNITYs wife or mother, daughter or paid HO as every other night on FOX NOISE HANNITY rants about OBAMA not believing in AMERICAN EXCEPTIONALISM

That shows you how misinformed the people of United State's are. Mainly conservatives just watching conservative entertainment Fox News which should not call itself news at all. Conservatives whining and crying because they don't have their way anymore after an 8 year skrew up.

That's okay. As far as I can tell, even more people think that a health care bill that covers 6 years of benefit costs with 10 years of revenues is somehow part of "a new era of fiscal responsibility".

davidbronx...perhaps you could post the site where you saw this birth certificate. I would love to see it. All I ever saw was a certificate of live birth. I hope you aren't so gullible that you believe that to be sufficient???

right on point andrea_kc. I never blame the repig leaders for the things they say and do. they couldn't get away with it if it werent for this massive horde of mindless sheep that are embarrassingly easy to manipulate. Of course you have to be smart enough to be embarrassed, but those who can't comprehend anything more complex than American Idol or who wants to marry my stepmother from another planet, don't fall in the category of smart. If these people had been at Guyana they would have all guzzled the kool aid and crawled back for seconds. instead they keep guzzling the kool aid supplied by fox news, sessions, bonerhead, and the rest of the repukes.

OK birthers, how do you explain that the (R) Governor of Hawaii, and the Director of the Dept of Health have both made public statements confirming that Obama was born in Hawaii? Oh, I know, birthers discredit any valid sources of proof, and only believe rumormongers. How do birthers explain that every legal challenge the birthers have made has been turned down by the courts? Oh, again, discredit all the judges, and believe rumormongers instead. Birthers, if you have PROOF that Obama is not eligible to be President, by all means bring it forward. But don't expect reasonable people to believe rumor.

In response to Cyclopsina: The governor of Hawaii and Director of DOH are not the legal authority to speak on obama's birthright - only the long form birth certificate can do that. If that is true, then produce the supporting documentation - don't give me lip service. Let me guess - is the governor a dumocrat? The liberal media has not reported in any great detail the lack of proof of obama's natural U.S. birth so most liberals don't even know what the issue is about. Every legal challenge has been eventually dismissed because at some point, the case is heard by a liberal judge who, just like the liberal media, are in obama's pockets. They have ruled AGAINST the Constitution in an attempt to stop lawsuits from going forward. But that won't stop those who truly believe that ALL Americans have a right to know who their president is. These actions will be brought to the courts again and again until obama can either prove he is a natural born citizen as all presidents before him have done. If he refuses to do so, he should be removed from office. What is so special about him anyway that he thinks he can withhold required documentation for this hight office? If he has nothing to hide, he should unseal ALL of his records. It is the right of the People to know.

Isn't it amazing how divisive this man is! He could easily stop all the fuss by providing a copy of his birth certificate. I understand no other president has done so...........simply because there was no question as to their location of birth and they didn't hide their birth records.
Mr. Obama is a agitator and a propigandist. He wants to build on this "birther" suspicion because it does split the citizenry and he like the "us" against "you" mentality. All racists do.

It should come as no surprise that in any country (including the US), there are uneducated and/or ignorant people. The bigger issue is: how did these ignorant people blossom from 0% to 14%?

While I'm sure conspiracy theorists had a hand in it and can be forgiven for their mental disorders, the larger push behind this blossoming is the concerted, quite successful push by conservative political activists (blessed and cheered on by the GOP) who are determined to undermine American confidence in the Democratic President.

In a word: propaganda.

The GOP and their allies have made a concerted effort to fool unfortunate ignorant Americans in a bid to return to power. Utter moral bankruptcy...

I find some conservatives in this country rather frustrating. Before you click "comment" and tell me to get out of the country, hear me out.

Conservatives have a very compelling argument to make to the country on the economy, the most pressing concern facing this country. Current spending levels are unsustainable and need to be brought under control. Anyone who knows anything about the budget and government spending realizes this. This should play right into conservative hands. You'd think they'd focus on this important and powerful issue, but no.

Significant chunks of the conservative movement in this country waste their time peddling idiotic conspiracy theories about the President being a foreigner, a muslim or both. I've seen Barack Obama's birth certificate. It was posted online. But that doesnt satisfy some. I guess some people need to see video of Barack Obama being born in front of a major American landmark in order to be convinced.

Conservatives have way more compelling arguments to make to the country than this kind of nonsense. It just screams crazy conspiracy theorist. The sooner they stop beating this dead horse, the better.

Really larry51? That's your proof. I know so many people that were born in this country that are mostly something like lets say swedish and call themselfs swedish. Just because you say ya I'm german and this doesn't mean your from that country.

This poster is not concerned about where Obama was born. Oh, what terrific news! This poster is concerned about all the other things he heard from Rush Limbaugh and Fox News and the Republican party. Gosh, we can all breath a sigh of relief that at least one right wing conservative is concerned about the right things!

Posted by: qrsi
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Wrong. You are a silly naive person. What I am concerned about is what I have watched obama do and what I have heard him say, going back to when he was campaigning. How he has reacted to various situations and what he has said. All one needs to do is listen and remember and then the pattern begins to emerge. Unless of course you are a blind follower. In that case undertand your limited mentality.

He hasn't presented a birth certificate, just a "certificate of live birth", which is not the same thing. His wife said his home country is Kenya. His grandmother said he was born there.

Documents show he became a citizen of Indonesia, which would make him inleigible, whether he was born in Hawaii or not.

I voted for Obama. I have no bias. Most evidence presented shows he is ineligible to be president.

Posted by: greenjet5 | May 7, 2010 11:12 AM

_________________________

let me see

I was born in Pennsylvania. My mother truly believes I was born in IRELAND because my mother is DELUSIONAL in her old age -- she has dementia.
My husband says my home country is IRELAND because I identify with my heritage and culture (and I drink alot of GUINESS)
I am a citizen of IRELAND as well as THE US.
I was educated mostly overseas in IRELAND AND ENGLAND.
I do not have access to my long form birth certificate.

BUT I AM A US CITIZEN AND ELIGIBLE TO BECOME PRESIDENT - but of course as a female you would all question me

The survey should have sought other correlations: people who voted for Bush twice; people who think Palin has the capacity to be President; people who think we should celebrate the Confederacy without mentioning slavery; etc.

Quick guess is that the correlation rate would be very high, perhaps in the 90% range, which only goes to show that the same nut jobs are consistent, and consistently wrong.

These people don't care about truths; they just follow their own particular bias and prejudices.

1st, I'm not a “Birther”, don’t care, don’t waste my time on that group or the people that have given them that name. It was necessary by the democrats to put a label on them as it makes a handle on the group so they can then wage their champagne to marginalize them, and call them “crazies”. Why must the Democrats do this? To distract and misrepresent.

2nd, I don't believe the numbers, that is so extremely subjective I don't know where to start a rant about how un-factual this articles numeric values really are, other than its total crap journalism and part of the distraction and the need to further marginalize from the fact Obama has no record of birth in the USA.

3rd, he did not produce a birth certificate when he was supposed to at the White house, he didn’t even have the hospitals certificate of birth, he has nothing. Deal with it.

4th, I applied for a passport a few months ago, and had both my hospital certificate, which was not accepted, and my original copy of my real birth certificate, which they took. How can Obama move about the land masses, boats and planes with a legal passport, like on Air Force One? Forged documents are my best guess. Is there another answer that is not the delusional rant of a Democrat hating on a Republican dealing with the facts?

5th, Obama and I are almost the same age, we have done all the same things in life, he has done far more so than I. How can he have gone this far with out ever presenting any form of proof of birth, whether a hospital or birth certificate even before he showed up empty handed at the White house? I have had to provide my certificate a number of times over the years, how in the world has he been able to skate by all that when we have done the same things and he more so?

6th, why were the rules broken for him for the presidency when all other presidents followed the proper procedure and guide lines? If McCain showed up shining his forehead and said I don’t have one, what would have come of him?

7th, the” after the fact birth certificate” that Hawaii finally and conveniently coughed up, that’s pure unadulterated crap. The various government agencies are pros at forging all sorts of documents, and have been doing that since the printing press was invented.

8th, it smells like a classic cover up. And the birth certificate isn’t the only thing hidden, what about his grades from all the schools he attended? All the other presidents have had such details shared, why not Obama? What gives? Why is there a need to hide?

larry51: "There are at least two videos in existence in which Michelle O. describes her husband as a Kenyan. Google "michelle obama kenya"."

Why does she refer to him as a Kenyan?

------------------------
Why is that any different than someone in the US saying they're nationality is Irish, English, French, German, etc? Would it have bothered you if she said one of those? Probably not.

"It should come as no surprise that in any country (including the US), there are uneducated and/or ignorant people. The bigger issue is: how did these ignorant people blossom from 0% to 14%?"

It was never 0%, and I'd love to think that 14% was actually the figure. But if you count all the people, across the entire political spectrum, who believe stupid crap in some form or another, you're pushing something closer to 90% or more.

Just to put this in perspective, about the same percentage thinks he is a Muslim and a terrorist and has a diabolical plot to destroy the U.S. About the same percentage are praying to Jesus to show up in the next few years and murder anybody who doesn't go to their church. These are the racists and hate-mongers, and we have left them behind.

Too bad these idiots don't share the same passion for meaningful issues in this world. Of course all the time they waste on this is not directed in support of some other wing nut cause. So maybe its a good thing.

Perhaps the most interesting dimension of this discussion is that the "birthers" convictions have never been substantiated with any credible evidence.

Journalists have dropped the ball on this one. While there is a great deal of ink spilled over the need for President Obama to prove that he was born in the U.S., rarely is there a forceful and persistent insistence that "birthers" prove their point. The fact that so many respondents in this poll allude to a "suspicion" bears this out.

Rumors spread, infect the fearful, and persist. They are best countered by evidence. I understand that the "birthers" reject the evidence provided by President Obama. I also think that no amount of evidence would suffice.

I would like to have the evidence guiding the "birthers" convictions demanded with the same intensity. The best we have is the track record of Orly Taitz. Shouldn't that get as much or more air time.

"I don’t care if he was born in outer space at this point.
What I am concerned about is his ideologies. His arrogance. His agenda. His racism and divisiveness. His break the bank spending. Behind closed doors deal making. His pandering to special interests. His need for apparent total control and obvious temper tantrums directed at those who dare to disagree with him.
I’m more concerned about who he really is now!

The towering ignorance and lack of curiosity on display in many of these posts is stunning. Why didn't Bush or Clinton have to show their birth certificates? Because it wasn't an issue for millions of Americans! If it had been, I'll bet those guys would have produced it in a heartbeat, just as all Americans may occasionally be called upon to do. It's routine in any number of instances! What about McCain? Nobody cared? Does anyone remember that there was a Congressional hearing on the subject of his eligibility to be president? And there wasn't even any doubt that he was born in the Panama Canal Zone! The "Certification of Live Birth" appearing on the Internet, assuming it's an authentic document, is NOT Obama's long-form b.c., which the state of Hawaii claims to have on file and will not release. Obama could make that happen. His refusal to do so is not just out of spite . . . since he apparently has already spent more than a million dollars and tied up the nations's courts for many months, in an effort to avoid having to do so. Combining all this birth certificate stonwalling with Obama's refusal to authorize the release of many other records from his colleges, law school, etc., one would have to be a moron NOT to suspect that the guy is hiding SOMETHING. And if he had been a Republican, the media would definitely have been pounding away and demanding disclosure long before the election. (Incidentally, Michelle Obama is on video at a 2007 fundraiser, referring to Barack as "a Kenyan". In another video, she referred to Kenya as Barack's "home country". Rather curious, wouldn't you say?)

1. His certificate of live birth is not signed or otherwise certified by Hawaii. It is not a legal document. If there are any marks that demonstrate it was stamped they are not visible. Also when making a copy the State would have stamped it as a certified copy.
2. It is also just a certificate of live birth. In Hawaii parents can obtain such a document if they are residents of Hawaii. They do not need to show where child was born when they apply. For a birth certificate (different document) they need to show birth in Hawaii.
3. I would like to see a marriage certificate. As a very old fashioned person it would be good if his parents had taken this old fashioned step. It would also be good to know that his father was not married in Kenya

The gulf coast is about to be inundated by crude oil, in a stunning bipartisan betrayal the Senate voted down the Brown-Kaufman Safe Banking amendment, and the stock market is behaving like a meth-head--and these crazies are still hung up on their long-since-debunked cospiracy theory? Hmm. You think maybe our educational system has failed some of these folks?

So President Obama supplied the same info and documentation that all other presidential candidates provide. Nothing was left out for him. So why this furor about this one president and not for any others in the past? One really has to wonder this. Why do some Republicans consider him suspect? Well, I have my opinion as to why that is, as do many Americans. That most Republicans don't seem embarrassed by this tells me all I need to know about Republicans. Fortunately, they are going the way of the dinosaur after all their bashing of Hispanics lately. And not a bit too soon.

concerned conservative wrote:The governor of Hawaii and Director of DOH are not the legal authority to speak on obama's birthright - only the long form birth certificate can do that.
____
That isn't true. The director of the department of health is the legal authority to speak on Obama's eligibility, as the department of health maintains vital records, which includes birth certificates.

The constitution does not require that you get to see a "long" form. The constitution only requires that the President be a Natural Born Citizen. Both the Republican Governor of Hawaii and the Director of the Department of Health have confirmed that Obama was born in Hawaii. Therefore he mets the eligiblity requirements laid out by the consititution.

The reason why courts have turned down all challenges to to Obama's legitimacy aren't because they are "liberal" judges, but because no one has actually had a legitimate case. There is no proof that Obama is not eligible.

"Obama has never made a certified, signed copy of his birth certificate available. All we have seen is a form filled out with information that anyone with a scanner and computer could produce."

That is not true. Go to factcheck.org--they sent a representative to see and lay hands on the certified, signed document issued by the State of Hawaii. Are you suggesting that President Obama have Hawaii issue a few thousand of them so he can personally mail them to each and every birther?

It was stated long ago that 33% of the american public is functionally illiterate. We have found 14% of them in this poll.

These people get alllll of their updated information from one source. Guess what animal network? They don't read books and part of their anatomy is a remote.

They must be ignored for their continual demands for a birth certificate. If one was hand delivered one to them you would then need someone to read it for them..

Let them wallow in this incessant drible of their's because they are hard to train and heavens forbid to untrain. They have been taught this mess and you cannot possibly have the necessary time to redirect their (pardon the use of this word) thoughts. The expression : "Stuck on stupid" is appropriate here.

I bet 14% still think the earth is flat. Maybe the same people. From reading the rantings of some of these birthers, I believe that they wouldn't be satisfied until each and every one of them has held the birth certificate in their own hand and examined it. It doesn't matter that others have done so and told them it's official. They don't believe these people. The people who have affirmed its authenticity are liberal plants or in on the conspiracy. So basically nothing would suffice except they each hold it in their own hand, which is impossible. Therefore they will carry on with their lunacy forever. Why the news media keeps talking about it is beyond me.

Why can't liberals discuss anything intellectually without attacking, insulting and belittling people? I think that is their only response because they can't stand on principle. I'm not wasting anymore of my time on this.

Other questions which may have been asked:
Was he adopted by his mother?
Are there some witness in the Hawaian facility were he is said to be born?
Was he clandestinely brouhgt to Hawai?
Is he a son of one of his father's six (?) other wives?
Did his mother divorce as soon she was in Kenya not to be sold as sex slave to Arabs?
Did his father come repetitively in the US to start a ring (see preceeding question) with young American pro-Muslim suggestible women? (Are they other cases?)
Was his mother so ashamed to have been victim of that scheme as not to return immediately to the US after divorce?
Is it true that his ancestors are Luos, i.e, a tribe which came to Kenya from Muslim Sudan to raise goats in its greener pastures?
Is it true that the Luos found more lucrative to trade local Kenyans as slaves to Portuguese and Arabs, for centuries?
Any human deserves respect, as much as the truth and as much as the US constitution.
Why an American judge refused to hear the cause of his contested nativity?
Why the reporter sent by the NRO to Kenya to ask locals returned empty handed?
Was the illiterate society a sufficient excuse not to investigate deeper?
Have the families involved made DNA testing and if not, why?
Family secrets in the 21C are unacceptable as tools are available to get the truth.

It was stated long ago that 33% of the american public is functionally illiterate. We have found 14% of them in this poll.

These people get alllll of their updated information from one source. Guess what animal network? They don't read books and part of their anatomy is a remote.

They must be ignored for their continual demands for a birth certificate. If one was hand delivered one to them you would then need someone to read it for them..

Let them wallow in this incessant drible of their's because they are hard to train and heavens forbid to untrain. They have been taught this mess and you cannot possibly have the necessary time to redirect their (pardon the use of this word) thoughts. The expression : "Stuck on stupid" is appropriate here.

The survey was an intelligence test. 17% of radical conservatives failed it. So did a lot of other people.

The "Birther" contention is just plain silly. IF there were any chance Barrack Obama was born elsewhere, or even if there was some chance that he couldn't absolutely PROVE he was born in the United States, his political opponents would have jumped on it with all four feet.

Wow! This is news to me. I can't believe President Obama was born a broad. He looks too much like a man to have ever been a broad. And if he ever was a broad, how did he ever sire children? Sex change operations
aren't that good, are they??

No, Obama was never a broad. Now Michelle Obama, there's a broad for you. At least she looks like a broad. I guess you really can't tell for sure nowdays.

Sometimes belief is more powerful than the facts. Birthers want to believe Obama is not an American citizen. The facts are secondary.

John McCain was born in Panama, technically the Panama Canal Zone. To my knowledge, there is nothing in the Constitution stating that American citizenship includes those born on foreign soil or that the United States territory includes military installations overseas. That law states that those boon in Panama are "declared" to be citizens, but is that the same as citizen by birth? The point is moot. No one argues that Senator McCain is not an American citizen nor should they. He is an American, just like President Obama.

The media does love this story and it has long legs on the internet . . . as does the belief that the 9/11 Pentagon attack was a US military conspiracy. The fringe has always been there, it just gets more media attention today than it did in the past.

A ven diagram of one third of the Republicans, white supremacists and Palin's twisted, intolerant, evangelical lemmings of Beck and Limbaugh. The crazy, adolescent, school-yard-bully, right-wing fringe. Why do the rest of us give them so much attention?

The larger question is of course WHY do so many people question Obama's birthplace in the 1st place? I don't recall ever hearing of some politician's birthplace being questioned in our entire history. WHY was the question raised only after he was elected? WHY did Hillary not raise the issue since she wanted to beat him so badly she would have done anything short of murder? WHY was McCain's birthplace (Panama) not ever mentioned as an issue?

Could the answers to these questions have something to do with the fact that Obama is the 1st partially black President in our nation's history and a lot of racists just can't handle that reality?

Why can't Huckabees discuss anything intellectually without attacking, insulting and belittling people? I think that is their only response because they can't stand on principle. I'm not wasting anymore of my time on this.

Reading the various comments seems to reveal the ethnic origin, political party affiliation, education level, income, reasonableness, and sanity or lack of, of those who posted remarks. However, to each his/her own way of thinking is America's strength. Keep on posting fellow Americans.

To me it is just bizzar how anyone can believe this man was born in another country.
Shows the twisted way this country see a conspiracy theory around every corner.
We are indeed a very paranoid society.
As well as how easily manipulated some people are.
Obama went through a very intense primary and if anyone was to find anything suspicious in his background, it would be Hillary and given the intensity of the primary between the two, don't think she would not have exploited that.
I just have to shake my head at the sad state of ignorance and paranoia this country is in.

FACT: Only Obama's (supposed) Certificate of Live Birth has been shown, which is NOT a Birth Certificate. --There is a huge difference, one that has to do with where he was actually born. A Certificate of Live Birth, does not have to say where a baby was born or show proof.

Does this mean that he was not born in America? Not necessarily. It might just mean that there is something on his birth certificate that Obama does not want people to see. Like, did they put Arab down as his race? His father was half Arab, and his father's father was full Arab.

Does this mean that if had been born here, that his mother never gave up his American citizenship when he went to school in Indonesia? No, it does not mean such. She may very well have given up his citizenship, as Attorney Philip Burge has said. --Obama's book says he went to school there as a child.

Does this mean that Obama is a natural born citizen? No, it does not mean that, because it appears that one has to have both parents born in this country, for one to be a natural born citizen.

benefits wrote:
Why didn't Bush or Clinton have to show their birth certificates? Because it wasn't an issue for millions of Americans! If it had been, I'll bet those guys would have produced it in a heartbeat, just as all Americans may occasionally be called upon to do. It's routine in any number of instances! What about McCain? Nobody cared? Does anyone remember that there was a Congressional hearing on the subject of his eligibility to be president? And there wasn't even any doubt that he was born in the Panama Canal Zone! The "Certification of Live Birth" appearing on the Internet, assuming it's an authentic document, is NOT Obama's long-form b.c., which the state of Hawaii claims to have on file and will not release.
-----------------------------------

Obama has produced his bc and the state of Hawaii as well as the republican governor have verified the real certificate is authentic.
You are right about no other president has even had the question come up.
So, why is it such a big deal in regard to Obama?
Why with all the verification and his posting it online is not enough for you?
What is the real reason for this insane obsession?

Why is that only Obama as President has been asked to prove that he is a US citizen? No other has been asked that. Could it be bias. McCain was not born in the US. As a matter of fact all of our first 7 presidents were British citizens and claimed to be that. Martin VanBuren was the first President born in what is now the US. So...Birthers - the way you think G. Washington, T. Jefferson, J. Adams, etc could not have been President because of their citizenship. Get over it!

Does this mean that Obama is a natural born citizen? No, it does not mean that, because it appears that one has to have both parents born in this country, for one to be a natural born citizen.

Size all of that up!

Debra J.M. Smith
of www.InformingChristians.com

Posted by: DebraJMSmith | May 7, 2010
------------------------------

wow. are you misinformed.
You do not have to have both parents born here to be a natural born citizen. You have to be born on American soil.
I could have been president because I was born in this country even though my mother was born in France and is a citizen of that country.
Try knowing what you talk of before you write foolish and insane things.

"No person except a natural born citizen, or a citizen of the United states, at the time of the adoption of this Constitution, shall be eligible to the Office of the President...." Art. II, sec. 1, U.S. Constitution. Anyone who has taken a high school civics class should know this. If he weren't a natural born citizen, he would have been disqualified from appearing on the ballot, you can be sure.

This president in an obvious liar and phony. He never did submit a birth certificate to show he was born in Hawaii. Why do you liberls continue to lie and distort this evidence of fact. I'll tell you why. Liberals are born liars and deniars. It doesn't upset them to lie. They believe it is their duty to lie to achieve an objective. Former liberals like celebrities Dennis Miller, Ron Silver, Dennis Hopper and many more will tell you that when they were in the ranks of the lunitic left they were instructed on how to lie and be believed

The term "natural born citizen" was defined by Emmerich de Vattel as "those born in the country, of parents who are citizens."
==========================================

The issue isn't so much Obama being born abroard but his father not being American. There is some debate as to what the framers meant by "natural-born". Modern day readers think this means born on our soil but this is incorrect.

The term natural-born comes from Emerich de Vattel who said that natural born is anyone whose parents are also a citizen. He went on to say that being born in a land does not make one a citizen just a place of birth.

The birthers are going about this all wrong his place of birth is not the issue. The fact his dad was Kenyan (British) at the time of birth is the issue since citizenship has traditionally been passed on by the father.

It's apparent to me that some people WANT Obama to be from another country, since it fuels their misguided rage about the way the country is changing.

If they can keep alive the falsehood that he's an alien or un-American, they can maintain their smug world view of white dominance and entitlement. His election is a reminder that the world is changing, and no one - especially this angry mob - wants to face it.

WHOEVER WROTE THIS BLOG IGNORES MANY THINGS, NOT THE LEAST OF WHICH IS OBAMA'S OWN FAMILY..HIS GRANDMOTHER SAYING HE WAS BORN IN KENYA. HIS POSTED BC WAS A FRAUDULENT DOCUMENT, AND HE FINALLY ADMITTED THE ONE ON HIS SITE WAS "DUMMIED UP"..AND SINCE HE HAS SPENT LOTS OF MONEY STOPPING THE SUITS OVER THIS..IS HE NOT ADDING FUEL TO THE SPECULATION FIRES? WHY NOT MERELY PRODUCE IT, ONCE AND FOR ALL AND STOP ALL THE SPECULATION..CAN YOU PRODUCE YOURS? i CAN IN ABOUT THREE MINUTES..WHY CAN HE NOT? AND WHY IS IT HIDDEN FROM HIS EMPLOYERS? THAT WOULD BE US..LIBTARDS!

"Fourteen per cent is about forty five million people, roughly the population of Spain. Can they all be wrong?"

Posted by: jdonner2 | May 7, 2010 10:21 AM
=====================
I don't know. Using your logic, though, what does that say about the many millions more who DON'T have any doubts? If you believe numbers translate into being right on an issue, then you ought to get on the right side of this one and accept the overwhelming evidence.

FACT: Only Obama's (supposed) Certificate of Live Birth has been shown, which is NOT a Birth Certificate. --There is a huge difference, one that has to do with where he was actually born. A Certificate of Live Birth, does not have to say where a baby was born or show proof.
======
Here's what I know. When I went to get my driver's license I presented a document entitled "Certificate of Live Birth." I got my driver's license.

When I went to get a passport I presented the same document entitled "Certificate of Live Birth" and I got my passport.

So why was my "Certificate of Live Birth" good enough to prove my age and country of birth but Obama's "Certificate of Live Birth" not good enough to prove his age and country of birth.

Now I also have a document entitled "Birth Certificate." This document has a gold seal and a little footprint on it. The Department of Motor Vehicles and U.S State Department had no interest in this document. Why you ask? Because it's a souvenir given to my parents to commemorate the occassion of my birth. It has no legal significance.

So why do birthers insist on seeing a souvenir that has no legal significance?

Let's see: Obama ran a campaign with the usual attendant promises. Against the odds of an unusually difficult inheritance from, largely, the previous administration, and yet another extremely adversarial partisan defeated party bent on a triumphant re-emergence come November at any cost, this president has accomplished a remarkable number of those promises on which he was elected. There is the health care package that looks remarkably similar to the Republican attempt in the 90's- hardly left-wing socialism- that is now become a wrong-headed commy plot...? he is successfully getting our failed economy back up- with more jobs slowly appearing again. That started with a derided stimulus package which attempted to give continuity to Mr Bush's stim package that Republicans then thought was okay...? The road to prosperity was defined in his campaign to be a nec. investment in a sustainable future- for which, in part, he was democratically elected. He is doing largely what he said he'd do in the foreign policy tightrope and, whereas not a very "liberal" path, it appears fairly effective (compared with the last decade) and we enjoy a better an more profitable relationship with most of our neighbors again. Etc., etc.
At some point simply deriding the man without even really looking at accomplishments and what is a pretty centrist ideology (for which parts of his own party objects) is really what makes bigotry. It is a confusion of stereotype and archetype that is fundamental to all prejudice in societies. Who gives a crap where his diplomas come from? He is clearly a bright, measured, well informed man not given to hysteria and reactionary response. Not bad qualities for a president at the end of the day. He may not have it ALL right, but he is not doing so badly in my opinion. If you don't like our system of government...

I believe that Obama should be challenged on the topic of his birth certificate because those who raised the issue were wrongly smeared as racists. Attempting to use illegitimate means to squelch debate of legitimate questions, even marginally legitimate questions, cannot be permitted in a healthy democracy.
___________________________________

Dear blasmaic ---I agree that not all birthers are racist; that would be hateful, petty and wrong. Nope, they aren't all racists (some are for sure but not all) but you can bet your bottom dollar they all have at least one screw loose.

There is an awful lot of numbers and analysis provided in this article that seem to be being published to somehow confuse the issue by mixing race, political affiliation, counts, etc. into a fraudulent justification why a black man does not have to supply his birth certificate and college records, etc. to become president of the United States.

One person on this forum said it perfectly. When you or I have to apply for a job, we have to provide all kinds of information including a birth certificate to even apply for the job much get it. No tickie, no jobbie.

Now you’ll probably call that last statement racial. Everything is racial now-days. Racial this, racial that. That is the key word you use to get you any job including the president of the United States. It worked didn’t it?

We do have some reporters who have dug a little deeper and have provided this much information about the President so far.

My reaction is, "So what?" There are probably 14% of the people who don;t believe we went to the moon, or deny the holicost, or whatever. There are also biggots of all colors, creeds, genders, sexual preferences and national origins.

Mostly, we are just sad or take these folks as a matter of stride, hoping that enlightenment will come to them before they violate someone's constitutional rights.

But, a more rational question here is, who actuially does validate that a candidate is who he says he or she is? You'd think that the Supreme Court or someone would require a valid birth certificate or something before someone is sworn in.

I am not a birther but I do think that the Democrats or the POTUS is being a bit stuborn here. I mean, how hard would it be to end this debate with a certified, validated birth certificate? There are so many other things more inportant to worry about -- like is there really a tooth fairy or is Santa Claus really your parents?

It's hard to believe that these people are DUMB enough to actually believe that Barack Obama, with all of his intelligence and education, and with EVERYTHING to lose, would be STUPID enough to run for president and lie about being born in the US.

Let's call this exactly what it is: RACISM. From day one, there has been a group of people in this country who have tried to de-legitimize the Obama Presidency simply because they can't accept the fact that a Black man was elected president.

The "birther's" entire argument, based soley on the origin of the Obama family name, has been this nonsense about the president being born in Kenya or Indonesia, or someplace else.

Had the election been close, they would have accused him and his supporters of "stealing" the election a la George W. Bush. Funny how they were so silent about the advent of a court-appointed WHITE president. Can you imagine the howling had that happened with Barack Obama?

It's racism, pure and simple. Anyone who denies it is an idiot who thinks we are as stupid as they are. End of story.

Debra Smith wrote:Does this mean that if had been born here, that his mother never gave up his American citizenship when he went to school in Indonesia? No, it does not mean such. She may very well have given up his citizenship, as Attorney Philip Burge has said. --Obama's book says he went to school there as a child.
_____
Parents can't give up US citizenship of a child. And going to school in a foreign country has no relationship on the citizenship of a child.

Even if the State of Hawaii were to make public the original birth certificate (a violation of state law, by the way, which is why it was viewed by Hawaii's Sec. of State and certified - twice - as genuine), the fringe crowd would not accept it. It would be a forgery, as far as they are concerned. Why? Because they had no real interest in the birth certificate to start with; it was a convenient canard to use to label Obama as un-American.

He's Black, folks. Let's get over it and move on - there are bigger issues.

There is an awful lot of numbers and analysis provided in this article that seem to be being published to somehow confuse the issue by mixing race, political affiliation, counts, etc. into a fraudulent justification why a black man does not have to supply his birth certificate and college records, etc. to become president of the United States.

One person on this forum said it perfectly. When you or I have to apply for a job, we have to provide all kinds of information including a birth certificate to even apply for the job much get it. No tickie, no jobbie.

Now you’ll probably call that last statement racial. Everything is racial now-days. Racial this, racial that. That is the key word you use to get you any job including the president of the United States. It worked didn’t it?

We do have some reporters who have dug a little deeper and have provided this much information about the President so far.

http://www.wnd.com/?pageId=138321
=====
You folks at the WorldNutDaily are truly on a vendetta or are truly stupid (And I don't use that word lightly). Many people that have a law degree do not have a license. A license is only neccessary to represent clients before a court of law. Many lawyers who do not represent clients have "voluntarily" given up their license because they no longer practice in front of a judge and do not want to pay their ABA dues. Is the WorldNutDaily stupid, disingenuous, or on a vendetta. I think the latter.

"When you or I have to apply for a job, we have to provide all kinds of information including a birth certificate to even apply for the job much get it."
==========================
Don't know what kind of jobs you've been applying for (NSA? CIA?), but I've never had to produce a birth certicate as a condition of employment. And if ever do, I know a Certificate of Live Birth, which is what Obama has made abundantly public, would be considered a sufficient legal document.

Sadly, the birthers will not accept anything as evidence that Obama was born in Hawaii. They reject the birth certificate that is published online and they reject the newspaper reports of his birth published in two Honolulu newspapers the day after he was born (they probably think that his mother "planted" the birth announcements because she knew that someday he might want to run for President).

Of course I am not surprised.. All of the folks who support and believe in this bull are probably faithful followers of Limbaugh, Beck, O'Reilly, Cavuto, Gingrich, Coulton, Blackmon, Palin, Boehner, McConnell, Lou Dobbs, and other far right wingnuts whose sole purpose in life is to manufacture & distribute hateful rhetoric about the POTUS.

But - if you think this is bad - and I do believe it is all because we elected a Black Man - just wait until this country elects a woman as the POTUS...

Whether Obama was born in the US or not, he does not meet the Constitutional requirement of "natural born citizen" as defined during that period of our history.

And it shouldn't surprise anyone that Obama's first official act was to deny access to his records. Obama has lived for 48+ years without leaving any footprints -- none! There is no Obama documentation -- no bona fides -- no paper trail -- nothing:

Original, vault copy birth certificate -- Not released
Certificate of Live Birth -- Released -- Counterfeit
Obama/Dunham marriage license -- Not released
Obama/Dunham divorce -- Released (by independent investigators)
Soetoro/Dunham marriage license -- Not released
Soetoro adoption records -- Not released
Soetoro/Dunham divorce -- Released (by independent investigators)
Fransiskus Assisi School School application -- Released (by independent investigators)
Punahou School records -- Not released
Selective Service Registration -- Released -- Counterfeit
Occidental College records -- Not released
Passport -- Not released and records scrubbed clean by Obama's terrorism and intelligence adviser.
Columbia College records -- Not released
Columbia thesis -- Not released
Harvard College records -- Not released
Harvard Law Review articles -- None
Baptism certificate -- None
Medical records -- Not released
Illinois State Senate records -- None
Illinois State Senate schedule -- "Lost"
Law practice client list -- Not released
University of Chicago scholarly articles -- None

It's also pretty obvious that he has no pride in being an American, and consistently promotes divisiveness between the races, the ethnic groups, the social classes, and the political parties. He is, without a doubt, the most radical president in our history, and that is not an opinion - it is a provable fact in the eyes of any objective person who has dared to research his background and associates.

Obama and the Progressive Democrats are apparently on a path to fulfill Communism's goals (Congressional Record from January 10, 1963) to destroy the U.S. from within. If you don't believe that, do your own research.

Strictly as a public service, the mainstream media have long pointed out that those pesky folks who question where Barack Obama was born are your typical knuckle-dragging, mouth-breathing Neanderthals. You know, the type of know-nothings who attend Tea Parties and other such sinister gatherings.

So those deep thinkers must be stunned by the findings of the latest ABC News/Washington Post poll, which finds "about a third of so-called 'birthers' nonetheless approve of Obama's work in office and express a favorable opinion of him personally." Not only that, but as shown in the accompanying charts and questionnaire on ABC News's Web site, "15 percent of Democrats say they think Obama was born elsewhere, as do 12 percent of liberals."

Democrats and liberals are birthers? Whenever life became just too frustrating for Chester A. Riley, he'd exasperatingly wail, "What a revoltin' development this is!" The talking heads at MSNBC, CNN and other bastions of liberal thought must share that feeling today. Michael Bates

BULLETIN: It doesn't make any difference! As long as there is failure to produce ANY documents (articles written, GPAs, Certificate of Live Birth, etc) it perpetuates the forment that he is "illigtimate." It is fuel for the fire as the idiots who persist even today that GWB didn't win the 2000 election (even after SEVEN recounts!). If you recall, event he Freedom of Information Act could not get Clinton's health records - even after herpes was revealed by Lewinsky. I just hope the 'birthers' continue to stir the pot.

The sky is falling, fossil fuels are clean and unlimited, pharmaceutical companies are friends to the consumer, tabloids always tell the journalistic truth, etc...

I suspect there are more than the 14 percent of the population that this survey suggests are dumb enough to believe all of that. And the worst part is, they can vote, raise children and pass those moronic values on to the next generation. Watch the movie 'Idiocracy' and you will see what I mean.

Go get another 6 pack of wife-beater juice and keep believing that Obama is a feeer-in-er.

A Certificate of Live Birth, does not have to say where a baby was born or show proof.
===

Funny... I have a 28 year old certified copy of a Certificate of Live Birth in my fire safe at home. It pretty clearly states that I was born within the jurisdiction of King County, Washington. I've used it to get passports on two occasions, drivers licenses and voter registration cards from four states, and to prove legal residency and right to work.

This is one of the internet rumors that is out there without any proof. This is why no court of law has taken up the issue. And why no legislator has taken up the issue. Birtherism is based on rumor. Maybe you didn't hear, but not only did Obama release his Certification of Live Birth, it lists Honolulu as his birth place. This was verified by the Director of the Department of Health for Hawaii. Obama is a natural born citizen as required by the Constitution. You may not like it, you may wish otherwise, but too dang bad.

It is an exercise in futility expending our energy on determining whether Obama is an American or not. Perhaps we should concentrate on his college admission records and law school admission records. How did he register and get a free education? Did he apply as an American or as a foreign student? When he went to Harvard, did he apply for a grant or get money from a Saudi Prince?
These issues will clearify his character and his suitablity as President by birth.
When he was in his twenties, did he identify himself as an American, a revolutionary Black Panther Party member or a foreign "aid" recipient?
Right now, seems to me, that he is bent on the distruction of our way of living. Sounds foreign to me. What about you?

Obama could have been born on the Fourth of July on the steps leading to the liberty bell for all I care. His mother could have been a Daughter of the American Revolution and his father the holder of the Congressional Medal of Honor. His birth place is irrelevant. His lack of judgment, his poor leadership, his attack on basic freedoms including freedom of speech for all who disagree with him; his attack on good people who petition for the redress of grievances; his attacks on American values and our allies, while giving in to our enemies; his arrogance, hubris and divisiveness that has caused the American people to be divided against each other make him a one term president.

Had he been a good American president who happened to have been born among the Taliban that would have been better.

Sounds foreign to me. What about you?
===
You're confusing words. "Suitable to be POTUS" does not mean the same as "eligible to be POTUS". Even if he had done all of the things you suggest he might not be the former, but a COLB stating that he was born in HI says that he is the latter.

If the American public retained confidence in the objectivity of the news media there would be no birther movement and Rush Limbaugh would have a much smaller audience.

When I was much younger the news media had an agenda. To report the news. Now they run promos about "helping you understand" the news. The comical part is journalists are now mostly educated as journalists and don't have the education or world experience to provide context.

So we're left with a void that talk radio and conspiracy theories fill. If the media bias skewed right, Air America would rule the airwaves and you would be confronted with a completely different set of conspiracy theories. But the lack of objectivity is so far to the left it makes even well researched stories disproving the birther issue not seem credible to the far right.

Journalists can take back the conversation, but only when they decide to start being journalists and stop being advocates.

I have a photocopy of my birth certificate and don't know if I can even get a passport with it. My son was born in 1992 and I received a "sorta" birth certificate which was accepted when I got his social security number and when he entered school, but when I tried to get him a passport two years ago for an overseas school trip, the government wouldn't accept it. It took 6 months of constant letters, emails, and screaming phone calls to the county of Los Angeles before I was able to get a PHOTOCOPY of his original certificate. It was accepted and he got a passport. I understand perfectly well how Obama probably doesn't have an original and that records departments outright refuse to release anything. This whole birth thing is ridiculous. John McCain was born in Panama, outside of the US zone! Technically he isn't even a citizen, yet they don't complain about him!

To MPH in Oil City PA - fear is the currency of Democrat pols, if you'd ever really pay attention. Do these sound familiar?? "The GOP will take away your right to choose" "The GOP will come to your home and take you away in the middle of the night after tapping your cell phones" "If we don't pass this stimulus RIGHT NOW, the economy will crumble" "If we don't pass Health Care Reform RIGHT NOW, it will be a disaster" (yet few of the measures take effect until at least 2014 - huh???????). Pay attention, dude.

why no long form with doctors, etc? - there is no such thing, doctors names go on hospital certificates that are souvenirs. the one posted is as official as anything

why is the on line version not signed and certified and just a hand filled out form? it is signed and certified by the state.

why are his educational records sealed at the request of his attorneys? they aren't. they are sealed, like all college records, by federal educational privacy laws.

where's the 'vault copy'? there is no such thing. there isn't even any such thing as an "original" BC. if I go to my birth state today and order a BC, it's not a copy of some original in a vault somewhere. it's a new (original) certificate by the state that I was born there according to their records.

These people that we refer to as the birthers are people who have let their imagination run wild and probably don't like having a black President. There are folks in this country who are just butt stupid and are prone to believe anything that they hear. Why should it matter if the man is black or white? I would bet that a good percentage of the birthers are from the very old generation and have been taught the hate that they so prominitely display. I know about hate because I am a Vietnam Veteran and was treated like dog doo when I came home. One thing that I did learn in Vietnam is that a child is a child whether born in the US or Vietnam, so regardless of nationality or color of your skin we all start out the same.

i am not a birther but i have a friend who is -- he has a good question why does bho not provide it? -- what bho provided was a cert of live birth-- it is not acceptable as stand alone proof of age by ssa-- yes other potus candidates have provided b c

"I wonder why these fools didn't want to investigate the moron w who could not make it into Yale and Harvard on his academic record [FALSE]. He was straight d's [FALSE]. Why won't that moron release his transcripts [FALSE]. Why won't he admit he servied a year at an inner city facility resulting in his cocaine conviction being expunged [FALSE]."

The only thing to "size up" is that the "birthers" are a pack of slack-jawed racist bigots egged-on by faux "news, limbaugh, beck and co. They sat on the sidelines while dubya ran our country into the ground, spent the Dem surplus, destroyed the middle class, started an illegal war for oil, and gave obscene tax breaks to the rich and corporations while paying for none of it. Now that a black man is president and trying to clean up this horrendous mess, they are dreaming up every ridiculous thing they can to discredit him. There is NO other reason for these actions except hatred for anyone not like them.

The term natural-born comes from Emerich de Vattel who said that natural born is anyone whose parents are also a citizen. He went on to say that being born in a land does not make one a citizen just a place of birth.

The birthers are going about this all wrong his place of birth is not the issue. The fact his dad was Kenyan (British) at the time of birth is the issue since citizenship has traditionally been passed on by the father.

Posted by: cleancut77 | May 7, 2010 1:20 PM
+++++++++++++++++++++++

Ridiculous!

Using that logic, the first 14 Presidents would have been ineligible to serve since they were all born before this country was formed, making it impossible for their parents to be natural-born US citizens.

I have been told that Hawaii is actually a giant hologram resting on a bed of styrafoam. Apparently there is a "ring" around the islands, called "The Hawaiian Triangle"(?), that when passed through, activates each individuals perception of the island reality. People that have had chips implanted cannot go there. This is all proof that Hawaii doesn't even exist and that you couldn't have had a good time when you were there.

I have been told that Hawaii is actually a giant hologram resting on a bed of styrafoam. Apparently there is a "ring" around the islands, called "The Hawaiian Triangle"(?), that when passed through, activates each individuals perception of the island reality. People that have had chips implanted cannot go there. This is all proof that Hawaii doesn't even exist and that you couldn't have had a good time when you were there.

"It appears to me its not the birthers causing the problem. It is The administration. If you don't like the word coverup then I suggest you don't coverup."

----

Wrong. The "birthers' are entirely to blame (along with folks like you who claim not to be one of them, but then proceed claim the many times refuted "fact" that this information has not been released and that there's a "coverup").

The certificate has been released twice that I know of. The local paper (I believe the Star Bulletin) released a birth announcement printed in their paper a day or two after his birth.

The "birthers" are Obama-haters, pur and simple, who ignore the facts and make up their own to serve their ends.

As a friend of mine says of these matters, "don't confuse me with the facts!"

On there, I would download a form, fill it out with the requisite information, attach $20 and order a "certified birth record". I would then wait by the mailbox, like a kid waiting for the decoder ring to come in the mail.

The question is: what would come in the mail?

The answer is: A piece of paper entitled, "Certificate of Live Birth."

I did this several years ago when I misfiled my COLB and lost track of it for some time. Since I was in the middle of a job hunt, I went on that very King County web site, ordered a birth record, and then proceeded to find the one I already had. I now have two, identical but for the issue date, certified copies of my "Certificate of Live Birth".

oldhat -
1. Those aren't regs. They're guidance which you can't seem to follow.
2. Follow the links. You can get to the second site I posted by doing nothing but clicking on hyperlinks from the first.

Starting from the first here is where I clicked:
A: "copies certified by the issuing office"
B: "Washington"
C: "Washington State Department of Health."
D: "local health departments"
E: "King"
F: "Birth and Death Records"
G: "Birth certificate orders"
H: "Mail-in form in Microsoft Word format"

You'll notice on the form you download after that last one that there is no checkbox for "Birth Certificate" vs "Certificate of Live Birth". King County only issues the latter. Surely you are not suggesting that no one who was born there can ever use the COLB for proof of age? That's just silly.

I left when I was three months old, and haven't ever been back. Seattle just happened to be dad's penultimate med school rotation. I would like to visit it some time. Seems like a nice place with good food and beer. Maybe go to a Sounders game, if I can stand the rave green.

GenuineRisk: you are confused. no one accepts photocopies of birth certificates, not the Social Security Administration, not the DMV, not even the AAU for basketball teams.

An original BC does not refer to some old thing in a vault (there is no such thing, states take info from the hospital on a state information form and enter it into their records one way or another, they don't prepare a birth certificate for a vault). It refers to the document you actually get from the state certifying your birth. whether you get that the week after you were born, or the day before you die, it's an original. If you put that in a copy machine, it's a copy, and worthless as proof of birth.

"So This great Nation will endure as it has endured, will revive and will prosper. So, first of all, let me assert my firm belief that the only thing we have to fear is fear itself—nameless, unreasoning, unjustified terror which paralyzes needed efforts to convert retreat into advance." FDR's 1St Inaugural address March 4th, 1933.

I tried like hell to find a core rationale for such thinking. I've concluded what ever one has in common is they unfortunate cling to the emotion of "fear".

We often hear that label flunged at the GOP, fear-mongering. When we were enlightened by the RNC fundraiser tactics reported by Politico 3/3/10. The fact, the presentation was delivered by RNC Finance Director Rob Bickhart to top donors and fundraisers at a party retreat in Boca Grande, Florida on February 18. Politico reported that the big donors were wooed by ego-building tactics. The blind minions, usually the sporadic twenty dollar donors, were told to be afraid, be very afraid. Politico reported it was based on "The small donors who are the targets of direct marketing are described under the heading “Visceral Giving.” Their motivations are listed as “fear;” “Extreme negative feelings toward existing Administration;” and “Reactionary.”

Accordingly the motive behind the RNC is clear, prey on the peoples fear.

I see now why all the outlandish thinking in the Republican base. If we look across the GOP members of Congress, you here the same push for fear. Seems Southern politicians are the worst. Senator Demint is like a pusher man. So they RNC, GOP, "independents", all have been obviously successful. Unfortunately, their trying like hell to break the democrats that are gullible. It's obvious as hell.

Since the followers of the right-wing are so pathetically fearful, I believe their fear level has heighten with the Arizona law. Not because of illegal aliens, the hierarchy of the RNC, GOP, Rush, were hit by a board of reality. Making 12 million immigrants, 76% Hispanic will become future democrats? The white people are becoming a minority? We will become an extinct party? The GOP has the chances of becoming a tiny whinny party? We must use:

FEAR! FEAR! FEAR! use it to obtain power.

Birthers are just a fringe of such fearful thinking, unfortunately it's wider. If you watch a debate or comment or even the semantics, It is the concept of fear. It is all to commonplace. Are people really this gullible?

BC, COLB, just two names for the same thing. there's no federal law requiring states to use the same name for a birth certificate. all anyone who requires one requires is that it be an original, raised seal, or whatever the state uses to help against forgery. every state issues one that will meet social security, passport, etc. needs. It does not need to be old, just original (which just means you didn't keep the original, whenever issued, at home, and try to bring a photocopy).

First off I am not a birther. It does not consume my time or thoughts. However since I read the article I would like to say this. Mr Obama applied for a job. This job has certian restrictions and qualifications. If I apply for a job and refuse to supply the required information asked for by the employer I will not get the job. My question why is there a question? Why is the requuired information not presented? Why was there a need for the Gov. of Hawaii to make his birth certificate unavailable?***If you don't like the word coverup then I suggest you don't coverup.

*************************

In all states that I am familiar with, birth certificates are not documents made available to the public. It's against the law. Getting someone's birth certificate creates the opportunity for identity theft.

So, next time you get all huffy after listening to your favorite crazy conservative drug addict on the air, do some fact checking. Otherwise, you will make a fool out of yourself again.

oldhat: the second bullet on the link you cite is to a birth certificate. that's exactly what the rest of us are referring to, regardless of what your state calls it. A COLB is a BC. if you scroll down, they tell you that if for some reason you can't get yours, they will, online. guess how? by contacting the Bureau of Vital Statistics (or whatever it's called in your state) and getting them to send one to SSA. That's exactly what you or I would do to get an original BC, or COLB (being the same thing). I have one my parents ordered and put in my scrapbook the year I was born. I show it to employers, and used it to get my passport a new SS card, because they don't ask you to surrender it even for a little while. I get new ones for those that do, by going on line to the state (either directly or through a service that most states now use), provide a whole bunch of proof of my identity by mail, etc.) and I get a brand new, perfectly good, original BC.

The term natural-born comes from Emerich de Vattel who said that natural born is anyone whose parents are also a citizen. He went on to say that being born in a land does not make one a citizen just a place of birth.

The birthers are going about this all wrong his place of birth is not the issue. The fact his dad was Kenyan (British) at the time of birth is the issue since citizenship has traditionally been passed on by the father.

Posted by: cleancut77 | May 7, 2010 1:20 PM
+++++++++++++++++++++++

Ridiculous!

Using that logic, the first 14 Presidents would have been ineligible to serve since they were all born before this country was formed, making it impossible for their parents to be natural-born US citizens.

Keep at it. So far, you guys are batting 1.000.

Posted by: ceefer66 | May 7, 2010 3:50 PM
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
Obviously, you haven't read the U.S. Constitution (it's only 33 small pages - you should become more familiar with it).

Article II, Section 1, Paragraph 5: "No Person except a natural born Citizen, OR A CITIZEN OF THE UNITED STATES AT THE TIME OF THE ADOPTION OF THIS CONSTITUTION, shall be eligible to the Office of President; neither shall any person be eligible to that Office who shall not have attained to the Age of thirty five years, and been fourteen Years a Resident within the United States."

The term natural-born comes from Emerich de Vattel who said that natural born is anyone whose parents are also a citizen. He went on to say that being born in a land does not make one a citizen just a place of birth.

The birthers are going about this all wrong his place of birth is not the issue. The fact his dad was Kenyan (British) at the time of birth is the issue since citizenship has traditionally been passed on by the father.

Posted by: cleancut77 | May 7, 2010 1:20 PM
+++++++++++++++++++++++

Ridiculous!

Using that logic, the first 14 Presidents would have been ineligible to serve since they were all born before this country was formed, making it impossible for their parents to be natural-born US citizens.

Keep at it. So far, you guys are batting 1.000.

Posted by: ceefer66 | May 7, 2010 3:50 PM
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
Obviously, you haven't read the U.S. Constitution (it's only 33 small pages - you should become more familiar with it).

Article II, Section 1, Paragraph 5: "No Person except a natural born Citizen, OR A CITIZEN OF THE UNITED STATES AT THE TIME OF THE ADOPTION OF THIS CONSTITUTION, shall be eligible to the Office of President; neither shall any person be eligible to that Office who shall not have attained to the Age of thirty five years, and been fourteen Years a Resident within the United States."

I don’t care if he was born in outer space at this point.
What I am concerned about is his ideologies. His arrogance. His agenda. His racism and divisiveness. His break the bank spending. Behind closed doors deal making. His pandering to special interests. His need for apparent total control and obvious temper tantrums directed at those who dare to disagree with him.
I’m more concerned about who he really is now!

Posted by: tjmlrc | May 7, 2010 9:14 AM

Sounds like a perfect description of Dubya and Darth Cheney. Thanks for the insight.

Birthers, if you show me proof that Obama was born anywhere else but Hawaii, then I'll believe you. The problem is, there is no proof.

For those that argue that he has to have both parents as citizens to be eligible regardless of place of birth, past court cases seem to say otherwise. True, there have been dissent in court cases that cite Emerich de Vattel and his "Law of Nations", but in this country, "Natural Born Citizens" is something that has been debated for ages and there is no clear definition, only what your ideology permits you to follow.

If Obama was not eligible, our intelligence community would have red-flagged this long before Obama became President.

He's our duly-elected President. He's not going anywhere at least until 2013. I wish there were more birthers to be honest with you. They would severely split the GOP and and hand our American born President another four years to clean up Bush's mess...

The certificate Obama put on line was not a birth certificate. Why is the real certificate sealed? Why are his college records all sealed? How come, when all his so-called classmates in college were asked if they knew him or met him, they all said they never saw him, never met him, never knew he was there. Even some that apparently were in some of his classes and in the same field of study?
Why has he said that there are 57 states? Talk about birthers as morans!
And the Bush bashers are just that. Before the Dems took over in the 06 election, Bush had the deficit headed down each year for 3 state years. 05, 06 and 07. Unemployment was in the 4% to 5% range nd some places under that. Tax collections were at record highs, Dow broke all records. Then the Dems took over Congress and the purse strings in 2007. Downhill ever since.

At least since 1950, in every state, any birth that takes place at a hospital generates a birth certificate. That document is attested to by the signatures of (1) a Doctor or Nurse (2) a family member and (3) a government official.

This document is the Birth Certificate.

This document may be copied, microfiched or made into a PDF but is never destroyed.

Anyone who has a legitimate interest in this document can get a certified copy of it by requesting it from the record keeper which is usually that State's Bureau of Vital Statistics.

This recording keeping has nothing to do with becoming president but rather to settle inheritance and heirship issues that may arise decades later.

Some hospitals will give you a souvenir with baby footprint and call it a birth certificate.

For ease of administration, the various states allow you to obtain a certificate of live birth which imprints some of the information taken from the Birth Certificate. this document is often also referred to as a birth certificate.

This allows interested persons to go to their local county clerk or similar office and easily get one.

The original birth certificate can be changed by an event, such as an adoption, resulting in a new father's name being inserted.

However, the original is never destroyed.

For reasons unknown, or more accurately for obvious reasons, Obama is unwilling to share the information on the original birth certificate with his constituents.

It has become obvious by now that there is really no check on candidate eligibility for office except for their opponents.

Many states are now passing laws to have candidates furnish proof of their eligibility to hold office before their name can appear on the ballot.

I am speechless at the lack of knowledge you show by your remark that President Obama would not share the information on his birth certificate. I have seen a copy of his birth certificate. In fact, I have seen it a number of times. Obviously you do not want to believe it so you just state that he is hiding information.
We are lucky to have an intelligent, a compassionate and good man as President. What amazes me is the lack of intelligence of the people in Congress. Did you see the picture of the Tepublican congressmen marching into the House to vote on healthcare two by two. Like robots or kindergartners. I have been to the Congress many times and never have I seen this before. But now the congressmen, both house and senate, show a decided lack of knowlege, of brains. They make the same remarks. They do not think. I regard with horror that I have voted men like that into office. I wanted them to represent me; instead they merely act in accordance with Big business, Wall Street, Lobbyists and make inane remarks. They were responsible for the financial mess Obama found when he became president.

For ease of administration, the various states allow you to obtain a certificate of live birth which imprints some of the information taken from the Birth Certificate. this document is often also referred to as a birth certificate.
===

Again- I, a US citizen born of two US citizen parents, cannot get my "Birth Certificate" from King County, Washington, where I was born. I've been told by them that no such document exists. It's only a record in a database. When I request one ( on the form for requesting a "birth certificate"), I am sent a "Certificate of Live Birth" with an impressed seal and the following information:
1) City and County of birth
2) Date of birth
3) Time of birth
4) Father's name
5) Father's DOB and place of birth
6) Mother's name
7) Mother's DOB and place of birth

An observant birther will note that the info on my COLB is the same as BHO's COLB except for 5 and 7. This is not surprising as states do things a bit differently. Race matters a bit more in HI than WA due to the extremely multiracial nature of Island culture and history. My COLB has been accepted by ever private, county, state, and federal government agency which has requested a BC. This indicates to me that a COLB is a birth certificate, and anyone who claims otherwise is wittingly or unwittingly wrong.

So, 14% of the people interviewed doubt Obama's place of birth. Then what on earth are you all getting so exited about??
Why all this frightful name calling and rage?
And why are there still people who actually buy all this hysterical crap about an extreme rightist GOP, for chrissakes?
You're all calling the kettle black.
Have you forgotten what you all said about president Bush??

My goodness - reading this one million blazing comments you'd think WW lll was about to break out.
Well - the way things are going I wouldn't be at all surprised by second civil war One half of America hates the other half, and it's calling their adversaries right wing extremist..?
Hysterical.
And wrong - dead wrong, about everything

The fact of whether or not Obama was born in the United States, is at this point, irrelevant. Even if he wasn't born in the US, there's probably not a "stacked" court in the US that would give this point a fair hearing. So, rather than paying attention to this "red herring", let's pay attention to our Federal Government and The Administration and let's make sure that our rights, which are guaranteed to us under the Constitution, are not stolen from us.

The fact of whether or not Obama was born in the United States, is at this point, irrelevant. Even if he wasn't born in the US, there's probably not a "stacked" court in the US that would give this point a fair hearing. So, rather than paying attention to this "red herring", let's pay attention to our Federal Government and The Administration and let's make sure that our rights, which are guaranteed to us under the Constitution, are not stolen from us.
===

Your comment begins in an absurd place and improves little from there. You sound a bit paranoid and delusional.

lAST NIGHT I WATCHED THAT NEW SHOW "WHO DO YOU THINK YOU ARE". THOSE BIRTHERS ARE LIKE THE SAME OLD SOUTHERNERS WHO DECIDED THAT ONE DROP OF NEGRO BLOOD MADE YOU A NEGRO. TO THINK THEY WERE NEVER GOING TO FIND OUT WHO WAS IN THAT' WOOD PILE'.

I THINK THAT INSTEAD OF IMMIGRATION REFORM AND CENSUS DATA, MAYBE EVERYONE NEEDS A DNA TEST TO FIND OUT IF THEY HAVE ENOUGH NEGRO BLOOD TO COUNT AS SOMETHING OTHER THAN A MUT.
ONE THING THAT THE SHOW SAID WAS VIRGINIA BREED SLAVES AS THEY DID HORSES. MOST NEGROS OLD ENOUGH TO KNOW BOTH THEIR WRITTEN AND ORAL HISTORY KNOW THAT.

OLD NEGROS FROM VIRGINIA ARE AS RACIST AS THOSE BIRTHERS AND OTHER ANTI-WHATEVER THE PRO WHITE ISSUE IS.

THOSE OLD BLACK VIRGINIANS BELIEVE THAT THE BLACK SLAVES BREED WITH OTHER BLACK SLAVES WERE SUPERIOR TO THEIR OWNERS. ONE REASON WAS THAT THE WEAKER, LESS SMART SLAVES DID NOT SURVIVE THE MIDDLE PASSAGE. OTHERS WHO WERE WEAK DIED FROM ABUSE. WHAT WAS LEFT WERE THE STRONG SMART SURVIVORS.
ON THE OTHER HAND, THOSE VIRGINIANS BELIEVED THAT TO HAVE WHITE BLOOD WEAKENED THEM FOR GENERATION. THE WHITE LAND OWNERS AND OVERSEERS WERE USUALLY MISFITS WITH FEW MORALS AND MORE VIOLENT THAN THE CHRISTIAN DOCTRINES THEY BASED THEIR BELIEFS.
THE PRESIDENT WAS NOT A SLAVE DECENDENT OF THE BREEDS 0F VIRGINIA. COULD IT BE THAT THE BIRTHERS ARE AFRAID OF ALL PEOPLE OF COLOR. IT SEEMS THAT THE GOP WANTS TO PURSUE AN ARIAN RACE. THE BIRTHERS, THE IMMIGRATIONIST, THE ANTI CONSTITUTIONAL RIGHTS (REMEMBER THE YOUNG WHITE GUY THAT FOUGHT WITH THE TELABAN AGAINST THE AMERICAN SOLDIERS, CAPTURED IN AFGHANISTAN? HE GOT HIS RIGHTS, NO GITMO, ONLY 20 YEARS FOR "TREASON".
BECAUSE THERE ARE SO MANY HATE GROUPS, WE MUST DEPEND ON THOSE STREET VENDORS OF ALL NATIONALITIES TO DEFEND US. THEY DON'T EVEN LIKE US. WE CAN'T EVEN REMEMBER HIS NAME. HOW PATHETIC WE ARE.

The "birthers" should hire Dan Rather and his former producers at CBS to craft a fake birth certificate, the way Rather/CBS faked GWB's armed services records in 2004 to try to smear him. I understand Rather et al have some time on their hands.
The hypocrisy of both sides is stunning on this - the Left always whines when the Right claims "Executive Privilege" on this sort of thing, but then uses the same tactic when the shoe is on the other foot (and then the Right whines).

"giving an incorrect answer that shows how widespread the misunderstanding of his birthplace is nearly a year and a half into his presidency." Wow Jon...just a bit short of convincing.

Given the evidence on all sides, I have no idea where Obama was born. For those who claim they do know (as a point of fact), what led you to your conclusion?

What is most curious to me about the comments on this issue (as with many others) is the overwhelming number of people who seem unwilling to question their government or, at least, their political party of choice. Regardless of your political point of view, given the propensity of politicians (any politician), the federal government at-large, or specifically Barack Obama to lie to us, why is that?

Now, on to the specific matter at hand, here is what we do know:

- In 1961, computer generated documents were not commonplace.

- Michelle Obama has publicly stated that her husband's home country is Kenya.

- Government officials of Kenya and some of Obama's family members have publicly stated he was born there.

- Barack Obama has chosen to hide many personal records and large segments of his life from the people he works for, including all of his college records.

- Barack Obama has spent in excess of $2 million of the taxpayer's money to ensure that what he has chosen to hide from us, stays hidden.

- The first lawsuit filed on this issue was by a Democrat.

Under these circumstances, it seems reasonable for anyone to question just what the hell is going on.

Tom Maguire of Just One Minute nails it:
" I have a news-making idea - instead of hiring a pollster to ask 1,000 citizens about the circumstances of Obama's birth, why doesn't the Washington Post or Jake Tapper ask the White House to authorize the release of the full file held in Hawaii? Or do we have to wait for Obama to request it for his memoirs? Hmm, he will want to break some news to justify his 7 figure deal..."

cjhill
the answer to your question is simple.
First, if he supplied the document himself,
the people who asked for it who are considered a bit looney, gain some credibility.
Second since they would never accept it as genuine, they get to keep their views alive and perhaps grow it. Best to NOT stir the stick in the drying manure,and manure is what it is, for if you do so sureley it will STINK again !

"LAST NIGHT I WATCHED THAT NEW SHOW "WHO DO YOU THINK YOU ARE". THOSE BIRTHERS ARE LIKE THE SAME OLD SOUTHERNERS WHO DECIDED THAT ONE DROP OF NEGRO BLOOD MADE YOU A NEGRO. TO THINK THEY WERE NEVER GOING TO FIND OUT WHO WAS IN THAT' WOOD PILE'."

It is Obama you should address with this. He checked "black" on his census form when he has a white mother and there's a slot of" multiracial."
It's he, not I, who apparently follows the one drop theory.

Bargain Citizen writes: - Barack Obama has spent in excess of $2 million of the taxpayer's money to ensure that what he has chosen to hide from us, stays hidden.
____
Birthers don't mind making up stuff. This is complete fallacy. There have been a number of nuisance suits filed by birthers, which the Justice Department must then use resources to send representation. If birthers don't want taxpayer money spent, then don't file ridiculous lawsuits.

The rest of your comments are straight up nonsense, or taken out of context. The fact is, Barack Obama was born in Honolulu. He released his birth certificate, and the Director of the Dept of Health for Hawaii verified that he was born in Hawaii. This makes him a natural born citizen. At least, birthers, tell the truth. Stop making stuff up.

Ok, the defense in numbers and percentages has been done. You are repeating yourselves. I've counted some 4 or five "legimate" (quote unquote) Birth Certificates of the person who has become Barak Husan Obama. Not a single one looks like it was produced in the United States. If you all could produce for public disimination a United States Birth Certificate from the late 1950s early 1960s kinda Birth Certificate that indicates our president was not hatched out of some marxist baiting super plot this simple minded one would be happy, but this cannot be done except by fraud now can it? You see the "cheesy" bizzare photocopy of the dommon birth certificate is a lasting testiment of American ingenuity. You recognise the nasty government copy opf the Birth certificate as if it werea a slice of "spam" on a piece of cheap White bread.

Well America is waituing. Bring America the truth or we shall know the truth and know the Fraud Oban=ma is.
You guys do yourselves no favor trying to push this Birther idea from your minds.

this blog post is malicious at worst, or at best an example of how blog posts even if on a "national newspaper of record" destroy journalism...

the context of the information—more than a year's worth of bald faced naked mendacity and slander funded by the GOP—is not provided or even alluded to.

the 14 percent is manufactured and shows what we can expect with corporations being given carte blanche on political spending

if you have no regard for the truth and have deep pockets you can move 15 percent of the population to believe any fiction you care to promote

birthers and teabaggers are manifestations of the GOP's rear- guard-post-election-loss-battle that they have now lost as well

which is why you now see stories being written about GOP repudiation of the "party of NO!" strategy and distancing if not active destruction of the teabagger "movement"...

if the DNC were smart—and recent events conclusively show they aren't—they would hang the GOP with its own Party of NO!, teabagging birthers identity rope it created for itself over the past 18 months and it would sink them deeper than the blown out "Beyond Petroleum" oil well spewing poison in the Gulf of Mexico—thank you Cheney/Bush's Mineral Management Service.

Ok, the defense in numbers and percentages has been done. You are repeating yourselves. I've counted some 4 or five "legimate" (quote unquote) Birth Certificates of the person who has become Barak Husan Obama. Not a single one looks like it was produced in the United States. If you all could produce for public disimination a United States Birth Certificate from the late 1950s early 1960s kinda Birth Certificate that indicates our president was not hatched out of some marxist baiting super plot this simple minded one would be happy, but this cannot be done except by fraud now can it? You see the "cheesy" bizzare photocopy of the dommon birth certificate is a lasting testiment of American ingenuity. You recognise the nasty government copy opf the Birth certificate as if it werea a slice of "spam" on a piece of cheap White bread.

Well America is waituing. Bring America the truth or we shall know the truth and know the Fraud Oban=ma is.
You guys do yourselves no favor trying to push this Birther idea from your minds.

I really do not know where Barry Obama was born. His place of birth has not really been made clear.

However, one thing I do know is that Obama and his handlers are making a serious effort to hide something from the American people. Much of his life is a mystery, and no one seems to know him first-person in his teenage years.

Folks who don't believe Obama was born in the United States and splitting hairs over the fact he was born 3000 miles from the mainland have other intentions covering up the fact that it's only been less tahn 50 years since they signed the Civil Rights Act in 1965. It hurts me to think even with mandated intergration and the prevalence of feel good sentiments and lawful support of the law that white folks are still disingenuous about full equality for all. All this is is subliminal racisim and folks who disagree are just racist and have no confidence a black man can solve the incredible financial fix the banks and financial institutions put us in. The finanacial institutions themselves perpetuate racism with their credit rating instruments. The financial institutions themselves have perpetuated racism and who runs these institutions?

The Internet is flooded with plausible-sounding arguments, sometimes long lists of them, that on the surface seem rather convincing that the President was born overseas. After all, we have professional political operatives and lawyers cranking out this stuff, and the average Joe is not in this league.

Since late 2008 I've run the ObamaConspiracy.org web site that deals with nothing but the birther question and I've seen thousands of comments like "if he's not hiding anything they why is he spending millions of dollars in legal fees keeping his records hidden?" It sounds convincing as an argument until you find out that the President isn't spending millions to keep his records hidden. They say that "anyone can fill out a form and get a Hawaiian birth certificate." That's equally untrue. Just think, they are saying that Hawaii hands out birth certificates to anybody saying they were born in Hawaii. Who would believe such a preposterous claim? Birthers who haven't thought about the implications apparently do.

I could go on all day, but in my considerable experience it's "once a birther, always a birther." It is an incurable disease. I can only take comfort that similar numbers believe in witches.