Microsoft revamped this year's 10K filing with the Securities Exchange Commission to remove mention of Linux, Mozilla and Opera as significant competitors and amplify the role of Apple as a competitor in both software and online services.

The new filing, detailed by Windows enthusiast Ed Bott of ZDNet, completely erases mention of the Linux operating system as a competitor to Windows.

Instead, the company now states that it is "mainly" Apple and Google who offer "various commercial software products that compete" with Windows. Last year, Microsoft cited various competitors "including" Apple and Google.

Microsoft has also changed its description of alternative platforms that compete against Windows, greatly deemphasizing the threat of web browsers that were once the company's top competitive priority. Even last year, the company listed Apple, Google, Mozilla and Opera as offering software that "competes with the web browsing capabilities of Internet Explorer," which the company described as "a component of the Windows operation system."

All of that verbiage is now gone, reflecting tremendous shifts that have occurred in the tech industry, both in the erosion of Internet Explorer's share of web use as well as in the shrinking role of PCs in general as people move to mobile devices.

World gone mobile

Microsoft doesn't mention smartphones or the iPad specifically, but does remove two key words that indicate how much mobile devices have changed its competitive landscape.

First, the removal of the word "new" before "devices" that compete with Windows indicates that Microsoft now sees mobile devices as being a mainstream phenomenon, rather than an approaching trend.

Secondly, the company struck the word "consumer" from its acknowledgment of the risk of reduced demand for PCs, indicating that mobile devices are now making great strides in the enterprise as well, not just within consumer markets.

Microsoft continues to note that "user and usage volumes on mobile devices are increasing worldwide relative to the PC," indicating that devices like the iPad, which can perform a variety of web and app functions, are far more of a significant threat to the company's business than alternative web browsers running on PCs.

Apple online services get a new mention

The company also added Apple in front of Google and Yahoo as competitors to its "Windows Live software and services," a remarkable shift given the general lack of respect the industry has accorded Apple's MobileMe services.

Microsoft is clearly recognizing Apple as a prominent supplier of online services, particularly as it moves to enhance cloud services to its growing audience of iPad and iPhone customers with the new iCloud, which will be available for free and by default for all users starting with iOS 5 later this fall.

Microsoft's own efforts in mobile devices, ranging from the Zune music player to the KIN and Windows Mobile/Windows Phone smartphone platforms and its tablet products based on both Windows CE and Windows 7 have all been dismal failures, resulting in the company's share of the smartphone market plummeting from 28 percent to less than 1 percent from the appearance of Apple's iPhone to the most recent quarter.

Mentioning Apple more prominently as a competitor may also be intended to address some suspicions that Microsoft and Apple are co-operating behind the scenes in tag-teaming Google and/or Android. It wouldn't serve MS well to be perceived as having an understanding with Apple on an Android strategy.

Mentioning Apple more prominently as a competitor may also be intended to address some suspicions that Microsoft and Apple are co-operating behind the scenes in tag-teaming Google and/or Android. It wouldn't serve MS well to be perceived as having an understanding with Apple on an Android strategy.

Mentioning Apple more prominently as a competitor may also be intended to address some suspicions that Microsoft and Apple are co-operating behind the scenes in tag-teaming Google and/or Android. It wouldn't serve MS well to be perceived as having an understanding with Apple on an Android strategy.

I kinda agree with you. google seems to be all domineering once you get on the WWW. i dont have a problem with it yet but its only a matter of time.

Hello buddies! I am sorry but I have to ask some tough questions. I noticed Steve Jobs was getting skinnier the last time I saw him. So I would like to know:

(a) Does Steve Jobs still have cancer?
(b) Is getting skinnier an ominous sign?

I am seriously worried after I read some comments on sites like 9to5mac.com. Hence, I'm very anxious to hear your thoughts on this. But I hope I'm just worried too much.
Thanks.

Hi. This has absolutely nothing to do with this thread, but I'll indulge you.

1. He wouldn't have been given a liver if he had cancer.
2. If getting skinnier is an 'ominous' sign (you read that idiot's post on the 9to5 thread about the Steve Jobs autobiography, didn't you?), then I'm about to die just because I'm trying to be a healthier body composition.

Steve lost a ton of weight because his liver failed. Then the surgery took away more. We obviously can't know this for sure, but I believe if Steve weren't a vegan, he'd've been back to proper weight LONG ago. It's probably his diet that's keeping him so thin (remember after the September keynote last year when he told us about having a liver transplant? He was interviewed and said that he's eating 'a lot of ice cream' to get his weight back up. The only reason for that would be his diet, as doctors would have had to respect his dietary wishes and forgo other foods more suited to postoperative weight gain).

Last week I learned that Microsoft Live offers 25 Gigabytes of free online storage. I investigated it. On their page there is no mention of the amount of storage. Finding the right buttons and getting it set up was incredibly difficult. Once I had my account set up I tried using it. That too was very difficult.

I successfully uploaded a file to test it. It was tedious but it got done. The file won't open in a browser when the link is clicked. It must be downloaded. On top of that there are no buttons or right click capabilities to delete it or move it. It took me at least five minutes of clicking around the whole site to find a button two clicks away from the page to delete the file.

Microsoft is just killing itself by making even their free products difficult to use. The whole point of letting people try services free is to get them to like the service enough to buy it, not hate it. I doubt I'll ever visit that account again.

Perhaps there is just some lack of oversight or vision within that company. They don't seem to have a clear strategy or an imperative to make things work with ease for the average person.

They had better consider Linux and the other browser companies as competition. I swear installing Ubuntu wasn't as difficult as using that Microsoft free storage site. The instructions I found were very clear on the Ubuntu web site. Canonical is maintaining Ubuntu and moving it into many business operations all around the world. Red Hat is too.

Is this shift in Microsoft's idea of it's real competition a portent of them becoming a hardware manufacturer more than a software company? Will Windows become just a small part of their portfolio of products instead of a main product? Could Microsoft truly turn their Windows OS into a good OS by controlling all of the hardware that runs it?

Mentioning Apple more prominently as a competitor may also be intended to address some suspicions that Microsoft and Apple are co-operating behind the scenes in tag-teaming Google and/or Android. It wouldn't serve MS well to be perceived as having an understanding with Apple on an Android strategy.

Hello buddies! I am sorry but I have to ask some tough questions. I noticed Steve Jobs was getting skinnier the last time I saw him. So I would like to know:

(a) Does Steve Jobs still have cancer?
(b) Is getting skinnier an ominous sign?

I am seriously worried after I read some comments on sites like 9to5mac.com. Hence, I'm very anxious to hear your thoughts on this. But I hope I'm just worried too much.
Thanks.

IronTed

(a) We don't know.
(b) Not always. Case study: SF Giants third-baseman Pablo Sandoval lost a lot of weight from last year and his effectiveness both at the plate and on defense have been remarkably elevated this year. Of course, those are different situations however, generally speaking, being overweight is considered to be far more of a health risk than being underweight.

Hi. This has absolutely nothing to do with this thread, but I'll indulge you.

1. He wouldn't have been given a liver if he had cancer.
2. If getting skinnier is an 'ominous' sign (you read that idiot's post on the 9to5 thread about the Steve Jobs autobiography, didn't you?), then I'm about to die just because I'm trying to be a healthier body composition.

Steve lost a ton of weight because his liver failed. Then the surgery took away more. We obviously can't know this for sure, but I believe if Steve weren't a vegan, he'd've been back to proper weight LONG ago. It's probably his diet that's keeping him so thin (remember after the September keynote last year when he told us about having a liver transplant? He was interviewed and said that he's eating 'a lot of ice cream' to get his weight back up. The only reason for that would be his diet, as doctors would have had to respect his dietary wishes and forgo other foods more suited to postoperative weight gain).

Yeah I did! Anyway, thanks for clearing this up. I feel much better now

I think Gatorguy's nailed it. The edits serve MS's current purposes. In fact, it wouldn't surprise me if MS planted the story.

Emotions can change rather quickly when a new common enemy enters the fray. Everyone is ganging up on Google because Google has the largest market share and is an easy target. This reminds me of the game Settlers of Catan. Without fail, half way into the game someone will appear too powerful. That person NEVER wins because everyone gangs up on them.

There is a good chance Google is going to get crushed. The purchase of Motorola Mobility doesn't surprise me. It is a desperate measure taken at a desperate time. Don't be fooled by the Android market share. Android is in BIG TROUBLE. They were giving away Apple knock off software for free and now it isn't free anymore because of licensing fees. They could lose market share just as fast as they got it.

I think Gatorguy's nailed it. The edits serve MS's current purposes. In fact, it wouldn't surprise me if MS planted the story.

Emotions can change rather quickly when a new common enemy enters the fray. Everyone is ganging up on Google because Google has the largest market share and is an easy target. This reminds me of the game Settlers of Catan. Without fail, half way into the game someone will appear too powerful. That person NEVER wins because everyone gangs up on them.

There is a good chance Google is going to get crushed. The purchase of Motorola Mobility doesn't surprise me. It is a desperate measure taken at a desperate time. Don't be fooled by the Android market share. Android is in BIG TROUBLE. They were giving away Apple knock off software for free and now it isn't free anymore because of licensing fees. They could lose market share just as fast as they got it.

By the way, in case you're asking why everyone doesn't gang up on Apple. The answer is simple. Apple only makes high end products. They actually have a relatively small percentage of the market (even though they make all the money). Microsoft, Nokia, HP, etc., are at the moment most interested in the same market as Google. I'm sure anyone of them would like to dethrone Google first to have a force in the market and then take on Apple by slowly eroding away the high end market (from the bottom up).

No matter how many times I hear the comment that mobile is replacing desktop computers I still don't see how It could ever apply to my usage patterns. Sure I use my iPad and iPhone as well as my MBP but I look at those as compromised devices. I check my mail or read the news but as soon as it is time to do anything at all complicated I have to turn to a desktop machine. I can't believe that the masses are settling for the limited capabilities of mobile devices. But, after all the masses are asses. Good luck MS. Apple really dropped the ball with Lion IMO so maybe this is your second chance to win back some users.

By the way, in case you're asking why everyone doesn't gang up on Apple. The answer is simple. Apple only makes high end products. They actually have a relatively small percentage of the market (even though they make all the money). Microsoft, Nokia, HP, etc., are at the moment most interested in the same market as Google. I'm sure anyone of them would like to dethrone Google first to have a force in the market and then take on Apple by slowly eroding away the high end market (from the bottom up).

Not always true. And your quoted strategy did not work for Apple's competitors in the MP3 player market.

You can buy an iRiver 4GB player for $25, while the 2GB iPod shuffle lists at $49. And yet, Apple's music players have something like 90% marketshare. Walmart just announced the closing of their online music store. Cost competition isn't doing it in many cases.

No matter how many times I hear the comment that mobile is replacing desktop computers I still don't see how It could ever apply to my usage patterns.

The problem here is that you are focusing your own usage patterns which are irrelevant to the larger marketplace.

Apple, as well as other manufacturers, sell far more mobile devices as desktop computers. Notebook computers started dominating Mac sales years ago and continue this trend. Same with every other PC manufacturer on this planet.

It's about the entire marketplace, not about your own individual usage case. You, like me, are statistically insignificant. Apple still sells desktop computers for people like you. However, you fall into a smaller group of users. Go read Apple's SEC filings if you want to know how many people like you still live on this planet. You are part of a dying minority. As a Mac mini user, I'm part of that group. I am, however, using an iPad for most of my computing needs these days.

Mentioning Apple more prominently as a competitor may also be intended to address some suspicions that Microsoft and Apple are co-operating behind the scenes in tag-teaming Google and/or Android. It wouldn't serve MS well to be perceived as having an understanding with Apple on an Android strategy.

Sooo, things are not what they seem. I get it. Following that logic, MSFT could be working with Google against Apple behind the scenes instead. Or perhaps, it is Firefox that they are really targeting as competitor #1, as suggested by the removal of Mozilla as a threat. Take the reasoning one step further, it's clear Nokia is the company they want to beat down. The alliance announced earlier is nothing but a Trojan horse.

Those devious Redmond bastards. Can't believe anything they say, or don't say, or kind of say, or kind of don't say.

The problem here is that you are focusing your own usage patterns which are irrelevant to the larger marketplace.

Apple, as well as other manufacturers, sell far more mobile devices as desktop computers. Notebook computers started dominating Mac sales years ago and continue this trend. Same with every other PC manufacturer on this planet.

It's about the entire marketplace, not about your own individual usage case. You, like me, are statistically insignificant. Apple still sells desktop computers for people like you. However, you fall into a smaller group of users. Go read Apple's SEC filings if you want to know how many people like you still live on this planet. You are part of a dying minority. As a Mac mini user, I'm part of that group. I am, however, using an iPad for most of my computing needs these days.

Thank you for your remarks. Although your points are very obvious. I still don"t read any rave reviews about Lion. Average people just don't relize how screwed up this OS is. After 20 + years being an Apple fan boy I am seriously considering switching to CS6 for Windows this time around instead of Mac. I love Apple but they are screwing over the pros.

Thank you for your remarks. Although your points are very obvious. I still don"t read any rave reviews about Lion. Average people just don't relize how screwed up this OS is. After 20 + years being an Apple fan boy I am seriously considering switching to CS6 for Windows this time around instead of Mac. I love Apple but they are screwing over the pros.

Rave reviews on Lion (since you claim to have missed them, if I understood you correctly):

Walt Mossbery: "... a giant step in the merger of the personal computer and post-PC devices like tablets and smartphones ... The past two major computer operating system releases, Windows 7 and Snow Leopard, were incremental. Lion is very different. Its a big leap, and gives the Mac a much more modern look and feel for a world of tablets and smartphones. If you are willing to adjust, its the best computer operating system out there." (http://allthingsd.com/20110720/mossberg-lion-review/)

No matter how many times I hear the comment that mobile is replacing desktop computers I still don't see how It could ever apply to my usage patterns. Sure I use my iPad and iPhone as well as my MBP but I look at those as compromised devices. I check my mail or read the news but as soon as it is time to do anything at all complicated I have to turn to a desktop machine. I can't believe that the masses are settling for the limited capabilities of mobile devices. But, after all the masses are asses. Good luck MS. Apple really dropped the ball with Lion IMO so maybe this is your second chance to win back some users.

Thank you for your remarks. Although your points are very obvious. I still don"t read any rave reviews about Lion. Average people just don't relize how screwed up this OS is. After 20 + years being an Apple fan boy I am seriously considering switching to CS6 for Windows this time around instead of Mac. I love Apple but they are screwing over the pros.

As a user of every OS Apple has ever made (thats 30+ years) I simply cannot agree with you. Of course there are many ways one can switch back on things that Lions seems to have removed making Lion almost like Snow Leopard if one wishes, even simple access the ~/Library, scroll bars etc . The additional features such as Mission Control have simple made my life far better across multiple screens running pro apps. Lion is awesome. I even want a few more of iOS's features adding. For example, I love on my iPad tapping the top of Safari to go to the top of the page for example and find myself clicking there on my Macs but nothing happens.

From Apple ][ - to new Mac Pro I've owned them all.Long on AAPL so biased"Google doesn't sell you anything, Google just sells you!"

Thank you for your remarks. Although your points are very obvious. I still don"t read any rave reviews about Lion. Average people just don't relize how screwed up this OS is. After 20 + years being an Apple fan boy I am seriously considering switching to CS6 for Windows this time around instead of Mac. I love Apple but they are screwing over the pros.

If you have professional requirements for the OS, wait awhile before upgrading to Lion, until more bugs have been shaken out and the software you use has been updated. Most OS features you don't want can simply be turned off or ignored. I like Lion, but the removal of Rosetta caused me some headaches.

Yep, and I believe MS intended it as an insult to say that Apple was such a small entity in terms of market share that it could be struck off as a statistical anomaly. Maybe that rounding error has grown into something a little harder to ignore?

Last week I learned that Microsoft Live offers 25 Gigabytes of free online storage. I investigated it. On their page there is no mention of the amount of storage. Finding the right buttons and getting it set up was incredibly difficult. Once I had my account set up I tried using it. That too was very difficult.

I successfully uploaded a file to test it. It was tedious but it got done. The file won't open in a browser when the link is clicked.

Skydrive has always been seen by Microsoft as a background tool rather than a destination.

For example you can sync a OneNote notebook between PCs and your iPhone, you can open\\save documents using Office 2010, upload photo albums and videos directly from Photo Gallery etc

So SkyDrive is just extending the local application experience to the cloud.

Of course the web apps are still there if you need them, but they make more sense when you see it in the context of business/enterprise rather than personal use.

The biggest problem at the moment is the disconnect between Live Mesh and SkyDrive.

Live Mesh is Microsoft's version of Dropbox (or more correctly, Dropbox has their own version of Live Mesh ) and SkyDrive is the storage center for all other applications.

The problem is that files sync'd with Live Mesh don't end up as part of SkyDrive, they are in their own separate section. This means you don't get the same online editing, sharing and collaboration capabilities you do with SkyDrive.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Smallwheels

Perhaps there is just some lack of oversight or vision within that company. They don't seem to have a clear strategy or an imperative to make things work with ease for the average person.

They had (and in some instances still have) a problem with competing divisions. In this "management" style various groups in the company design similar solutions and the best one is selected... in theory. In practice they ended up with a bunch of stuff that didn't work with anything else.

In this instance they purchased FolderShare in 2005 (a PC to PC sync tool). This evolved into Live FolderShare and eventually Live Sync which added some online storage.

Two other products Live Mesh Beta (like Live Sync with more focus on devices) and SkyDrive (the online only storage center) evolved independently.

So at one point they had 3 or 4 online storage solutions that didn't work with each other.

In Live Essentials 2011 they merged Live Sync and Live Mesh Beta into the one product called Windows Live Mesh. They then linked this with the SkyDrive online storage (although as I said above they aren't fully integrated yet).

Microsoft are adding more API's into SkyDrive so I think it's a pretty safe bet to say SkyDrive will end up as the backend storage/sharing/collaboration center, and Live Mesh will be one of the many applications that utilize that online storage.

Mentioning Apple more prominently as a competitor may also be intended to address some suspicions that Microsoft and Apple are co-operating behind the scenes in tag-teaming Google and/or Android. It wouldn't serve MS well to be perceived as having an understanding with Apple on an Android strategy.

I think it runs deeper than that.

I have a feeling that Microsoft are going to add functionality to Windows 8 that is going to draw a lot of anti-trust fire in their direction.

They need the idea out there (rightfully so) that "the Windows operating system also faces competition from alternative platforms and devices that may reduce demand for PCs".

The point being, Windows no longer has a monopoly.

Things that will likely be in Windows 8...

Bundled Windows 8 Marketplace selling movies, tv, music apps and games. This is going to piss off Valve, EA, Amazon, Google, Netflix and anyone else that runs a competing media store for Windows.

Bundled Security Essentials and Smart Screen filter across the OS. This will basically mean the death of Antivirus for Windows.

A new package format (APPX). No idea of how (or if) other non-Microsoft development tools will be able to work with this.

Other software that is normally a part of Live Essentials like a mail/contact/calendar program, image and video manager/editor, chat/voip/video (Messenger/Skype) and file sync. The number of companies that will have an issue with this is too long to list!

EDIT: And I didn't even mention the hardware! This is another hint that Microsoft may be looking at either having their own hardware or a (WP7 like) hardware controlled environment for Windows 8

This is the kind of stuff that, 10 years ago, almost got the company split in two.

Their MS Office Suit of products is not going to be THE office platform of the future -- it's going to be whatever people have on their smart phone.

Right now, you can get Keynote for $9 on an iPhone, and then project an entire presentation onto a big screen. It's missing a lot of gee-wiz effects of Desktop-based presentation programs -- but for the traveling salesman, they were abusing MOST of those features anyway.

>>MS has some good moves with Bing versus Google's search engine -- but I can't help but feel that they accomplished that the way they USUALLY do; Rip off someone's IP and then delay the lawsuit until their stock crashes and you buy them off at a bargain. That won't work with Google -- but it might be harder to prove stolen algorithms since I'm SURE they've learned how to at least change the names of variables by now to cover their tracks. It's going to take a tech savvy judge and an actual WILL for the truth to get anywhere -- so, likely Bing will be safe.

>> On the Cell Phone front; they've basically got to PAY all the companies who want to make their smart phone. But regardless-- that won't help their marketshare, because so far -- nobody is PAYING the customer to use the Microsoft Smart phone -- so with all the other headaches and expenses of mobile computing, I'd prefer to pay $200 for an iPhone and keep the rest of my hair on my head.

How's that Zune "Playsforsure" working for you? People invest MORE in their smartphones than an addressbook these days -- so the REPEAT business factor, and the "My Nephew uses the iPhone and plans to help me set it up" -- is a HUGE factor in the market.

I don't think anyone knows how screwed Microsoft is in the Smart Phone race than does Microsoft -- because EVERYTHING they had going for them with Windows/Office is nonexistent for them on a phone and Apple and Android already have the MINDSHARE.

>> Free Advice for Microsoft: Your next advertisement; "Buy our Smart Phone, and you get a free copy of Microsoft Office with your purchase of Windows 8!" Drop the "I'm a PC" ads -- everybody uses a computer today and it's no longer a secret that they are useful -- only that very few people really know how to use them.

What does it say that a company like Microsoft actually even needs to "rewrite" its already published 10K to address such a thing. I mean, really, they didn't see this coming? They were so "out of the loop" that, oops, messed up the primary operational regulatory document for our home country and well, we have to change everything just recently claimed, knew and understood? This is alone is Epic Fail in the true sense of the phrase.

To me this actually confirms the decline of Microsoft I've been watching for the last 10 years more than almost anything I've see of Apple's successes.

I think it runs deeper than that.
...
This is the kind of stuff that, 10 years ago, almost got the company split in two.

I agree on the direction you've outlined that MS is likely going, although I would question whether MS of all companies can actually pull off so much work in such a relatively short period of time and have the "quality" (like you can use this word about MS ) / experience a user would want.

Moreover, it is exactly this level of thing that as you mentioned would have got them split into two, but this time around, there is real competition, and if another 3 years goes by w/o MS adding some of this stuff, the ships will have already sailed to beyond where MS could ever catch up. So I think a court would have to leave them be, seeing as how far behind in the "post-PC" space they really are.

Without such a dramatic tie-in and consolidation of their services, there is little hope for MS to ever catch a consumer's eye, who are driving this market currently. I do think they still have some solid assets that if used properly under the right vision, they are still in a great position to challenge Apple, much better than the other competitors. I think Google's days are numbered as their creepy privacy and data practices continue to be known more and more and also the bigger shift coming as we see the merging of desktop/mobile OS's (in which case Google can't really play there anyways).

I think Google's days are numbered as their creepy privacy and data practices continue to be known more and more and also the bigger shift coming as we see the merging of desktop/mobile OS's (in which case Google can't really play there anyways).

They're already working on the mobile/desktop OS merge with ChromeOS. That's what the Chromebooks are about, tho it's just the first step.

As far as "creepy privacy" practices, what are you referring to? You're aware that Google privacy policy require you to "opt-in" for your details to be shared with them, and even then they don't share your personally identifiable information with any outside sources without your specific authorization? That's even more restrictive than Apple's stated privacy policy.