Huseng wrote: Zen/Chan terms largely evolved out of native Chinese monasteries and ideas. They don't correspond to Indian thought, so tracing them to Sanskrit and then Tibetan is impossible. You can easily find the equivalent terms in the case of Abhidharma, but not Chan. Chan specific terms won't exist in Tibetan.

mañjughoṣamaṇi wrote:Here is a very small start of about 80 terms that I made in 2009 and abandoned shortly thereafter. This list should not be considered reliable.

Thanks for the contribution!

dzoki wrote:

Raksha wrote:What's Wu-wei in Tibetan?

I´d say "bays med".

Perhaps you meant byas med? Maybe...

Wu-wei is Tao/Daoist, so there's probably not going to be good correspondence in most languages. In Sanskrit, closest might be dharmatā... ??

uups, sorry for a typo. Well I wouldn´t say dharmata, as far as I understand this, wu-wei is basicaly a state beyond concepts although maintained somewhat with contrivance like a state of shamatha as apposed to wei-wu-wei which fully integrated with everything and does not require any effort. Anyways this is not my own idea,it is based upon what was told to me by a friend who dabbled a little in this chan thing, but he is also not really a chan practitioner, so he might be wrong too.

viniketa wrote: Wu-wei is Tao/Daoist, so there's probably not going to be good correspondence in most languages.

Sorry, that was a bit silly It's just a trick question, because it doesn't have any correspondences. Wu-wei can only be fully understood in Chinese or related ideographic languages. As well as Taoism, it is a vitally important part of Ch'an Buddhist philosophy. So my conclusion is that Huseng was right, and Malcolm was wrong, baby, wrong!!!!

viniketa wrote: Wu-wei is Tao/Daoist, so there's probably not going to be good correspondence in most languages.

Sorry, that was a bit silly It's just a trick question, because it doesn't have any correspondences. Wu-wei can only be fully understood in Chinese or related ideographic languages. As well as Taoism, it is a vitally important part of Ch'an Buddhist philosophy. So my conclusion is that Huseng was right, and Malcolm was wrong, baby, wrong!!!!

Rather obvious it was a trick question... I'd say both Huseng and Malcolm were correct, as there will be some but not all terms that have cognates.

I'd also say Raksha needs to come on down off that dead horse and stop beating it...

If they can sever like and dislike, along with greed, anger, and delusion, regardless of their difference in nature, they will all accomplish the Buddha Path.. ~ Sutra of Complete Enlightenment

"Dao’an (ad 312–85) criticized the Prajñāschools, challenging their faithfulness to authentic Buddhist positions as well as the translation methodologies behind the texts they and other Chinese Buddhists had come to rely on. In particular, he criticized the practice of ‘matching the meanings’ (geyi), by which translators seeking Chinese equivalents for Indian Buddhist technical terms and concepts borrowed heavily from Daoist literature. This ‘matching of meanings’ was a mixed blessing. Packaging Buddhist ideas in familiar terms made them amenable and understandable, but the ‘matches’ were often less than perfect, distorting or misrepresenting Buddhism. For instance, early translators chose a well-known Daoist and Confucian term, wuwei (nondeliberative activity), to translate nirvāṇa. Arguably, wuwei and nirvāṇa represent the teloi of Daoism and Buddhism, respectively, but it is not obvious that they denote the same telos (see Daoist philosophy §6; Nirvāṇa). Later, to emphasize the uniqueness of Buddhist nirvāṇa, translators dropped wuwei in favour of a transliteration, niepan. Wuwei was retained to render another important Buddhist notion, asaṃskṛta (unconditioned)."

Is there a specific term, of is it simply voiced more poetically, such as "such and such has seen their own Nature". ?Or is there some sortof innitatiatory empowerment/level that is given that sortof indirectly depends on it without directly referring to it?(I apologize if I'm not referring to things correctly, I'm not as familiar with Tibetan Buddhism as I am with Zen.)

Thank you.

In Gassho,

Sara H

"Life is full of suffering. AND Life is full of the EternalIT IS OUR CHOICEWe can stand in our shadow, and wallow in the darkness, ORWe can turn around.It is OUR choice." -Rev. Basil

" ...out of fear, even the good harm one another. " -Rev. Dazui MacPhillamy

"Dao’an (ad 312–85) criticized the Prajñāschools, challenging their faithfulness to authentic Buddhist positions as well as the translation methodologies behind the texts they and other Chinese Buddhists had come to rely on. In particular, he criticized the practice of ‘matching the meanings’ (geyi), by which translators seeking Chinese equivalents for Indian Buddhist technical terms and concepts borrowed heavily from Daoist literature. This ‘matching of meanings’ was a mixed blessing. Packaging Buddhist ideas in familiar terms made them amenable and understandable, but the ‘matches’ were often less than perfect, distorting or misrepresenting Buddhism. For instance, early translators chose a well-known Daoist and Confucian term, wuwei (nondeliberative activity), to translate nirvāṇa. Arguably, wuwei and nirvāṇa represent the teloi of Daoism and Buddhism, respectively, but it is not obvious that they denote the same telos (see Daoist philosophy §6; Nirvāṇa). Later, to emphasize the uniqueness of Buddhist nirvāṇa, translators dropped wuwei in favour of a transliteration, niepan. Wuwei was retained to render another important Buddhist notion, asaṃskṛta (unconditioned)."

We can't assume there *is* one. Here's one way to find out if there is such a thing, though. From the greatest academic resource ever at any time <blushing>, wikipedia: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Kensh%C5%8D

remembering that Kensho is the Japanese form of the Chinese term jianxing...

Buddhist monks who produced Sanskrit-Chinese translations of sutras faced many linguistic difficulties:

Oh, they have something Jikan.I have very little doubt about that.It may not be a straight across equivilant "standard term" like the Japanese word.But they at least mark it or reffer to it somehow.Even if it's in somewhat poetic and flowery language.*smiles*Oh yes. They do.

Though it's possible the may not be allowed to talk about it due to esoteric tradition.

In Gassho,Sara H

"Life is full of suffering. AND Life is full of the EternalIT IS OUR CHOICEWe can stand in our shadow, and wallow in the darkness, ORWe can turn around.It is OUR choice." -Rev. Basil

" ...out of fear, even the good harm one another. " -Rev. Dazui MacPhillamy

We can't assume there *is* one. Here's one way to find out if there is such a thing, though. From the greatest academic resource ever at any time <blushing>, wikipedia: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Kensh%C5%8D

remembering that Kensho is the Japanese form of the Chinese term jianxing...

Buddhist monks who produced Sanskrit-Chinese translations of sutras faced many linguistic difficulties:

So... is there a Tibetan concept corresponding to dṛṣṭi-svabhāva? (assuming of course that the etymological work at wikipedia is plausible)

i looked into Tonny Duff´s edition of Mahavytpatti and found that dṛṣṭi is translated as blta ba in most cases and svabhava is "ngo bo nyid rang bzhin", now it did not find an equivalent in mahavyutpatti, but this is of course just a glossary of terms not a dictionary with comple sanskrit-tibetan vocabulary. In Rangjung Yeshe I found this: