You know, the “Bachelor” was around in the early 2000’s. Oh yeah. It happened. Granted, season 7 of the “Bachelor” seems to be wiped off all records since I can’t find any video clips of it online anymore. There are very few clips from that season still online. But Sarah Brice and Charlie O’Connell had quite an interesting ride as a “Bachelor” couple after season 7 which aired back in 2005. One of the major clips I found I included below, and that was an interview they did on 20/20 which she said ultimately led to their final breakup. Interesting to listen to her in the podcast then go and find that interview and watch it. Yeah, Charlie wasn’t all in. You can almost sense it in that interview giving the canned response he did. Season 7 of the “Bachelor” was pretty groundbreaking for this franchise in that 1) it was the first time they’d filmed a season that didn’t shoot anything in LA 2) it was the first time the “Bachelor” didn’t choose anyone and dated both his final 2 girls post-show only to make his decision on the first live ATFR. Sarah Brice was the girl he chose and they had a 5 year relationship post-show and today she talks about it. Quite an interesting take on things that I think you’ll like. As always, if you want to respond to the interview, please include Sarah’s Twitter handle (@sarahabrice) in your replies. Hope you enjoy it.

Side note: Remember how I told you that Arie’s ex Sydney attended high school at the same time as Lauren’s ex-fiance Chris Crane in Ohio? After I tweeted earlier this week that Sarah was this week’s podcast guest, Sydney texted to tell me that Sarah once removed one of Sydney’s tattoos about four years ago while she was living in Ohio. How random. Sydney has her imprints all over this crazy “Bachelor” world, doesn’t she? Small world I guess.

You can listen to today’s podcast on a number of platforms, but you can also tune in by clicking the player below:

(SPOILERS) Sarah joins me and we talk about how I screwed up her career last week, how her season of the “Bachelor” is basically missing from the internet (5:46), how she got cast & how’d she find out the “Bachelor” was Charlie (7:28), her season being filmed all outside of LA for the first time (10:12), what she remembers about the first night (11:25), the dates being local & more realistic on her season (13:23), Charlie’s behavior on set & how they got along (16:40), the ending of Charlie not choosing anyone dating both girls (22:15), how secretive they had to keep their meet ups post filming while the show was airing (25:08), the live finale & did she think he’d propose (29:10), their 5 year post-show relationship (32:04), why they ultimately broke up (34:23), what she’s doing now (38:20), how she met her husband (41:28), and we end with the Final 10 (46:43).

Here’s one for next week. I have been seeing someone, very happily, for about five months. Relevant background: he’s the first exclusive relationship I’ve had in a little over a year, after recovering from an abusive relationship; ditto for him–first relationship after a year, but in his case after getting over a seven-year relationship that ended in a broken engagement for reasons that weren’t really anyone’s fault. Basically, I would say we are both still kind of in recovery from pretty serious heartbreak, but we each waited a full year to start dating again so I would say things feel healthy and non-reboundy. The bad news is that six months from now I will be moving away from the city we live in for a new job. The job is non-negotiable: it’s a kick ass career opportunity and I did not even remotely take into account what was then a three-month relationship when I accepted it. But the relationship has only gotten better in the last couple of months, and I’d say if anything we’ve both gotten more serious about it. (Introducing each other to other people in our lives, planning an overseas trip together for next month, etc.) I *think* we both have the same attitude at the moment, which is kind of just taking it one day at a time and not worrying to much about the future. My question: should I just cut bait here and avoid long-term heartache?

The job is in a really, really undesirable location, which I don’t even want to move to and hope to move away from ASAP and, while his career is more portable than mine, it would still be a significant hardship for him to try to relocate. (It’s a U.S/Canada situation, so there would even be annoying immigration issues, though probably not insurmountable). I have no idea if he would even consider it after what would then be only 11 months together. I don’t bring it up, not exactly because I don’t want to know the answer, but because I doubt he knows the answer after only 5 months and it’s a totally unfair question to pose. (He’s the only one who would stand to lose if he were to move with me; I would, even worst case scenario, just be gaining companionship at a lonely time. He would be uprooting his whole life). But basically, I’m afraid if we get more attached it will just suck even worse once I move. I’m afraid that–in the highly likely event we just break up in six months when I leave–moving to a place where I will already be pretty unhappy will be compounded by the break up. But on the other hand things are going super well and he does not have any unbreakable ties to our current city. We are both in our late thirties and neither of us wants kids, which is in and of itself rare enough that I sort of hate to ruin a good thing on the off chance that it could prove permanent. Your thoughts would be much appreciated!

Best,
Overanalysis FTW

Comment: You’re thinking rationally on this, which is good. I don’t think you’re overanalyzing at all. You’re right, there’s no need to think about what’ll happen in 6 months right now. I’d enjoy what you’re doing in the current and let things play out. You said he doesn’t have unbreakable ties to the city he’s in, so you never know, he might wanna go with you. But you certainly have to prepare for the fact that maybe he won’t, and I think you know that. Is it gonna suck when you move in 6 months, knowing it would’ve happened and you invested more time when you could’ve gotten out of it earlier? Yes. But I don’t think you cut off all ties now just because of that. Even if you decided that’s what you wanted to do, I bet you wouldn’t end up doing it anyway because you’re enjoying your time with him and it doesn’t sound like you’ve put too much pressure on it.

You didn’t say how long you’ll be in this new place other than to say you wanted to get out of the new location ASAP. If you’re not there long, is it possible to continue long distance with him until you move back or leave that place? I’d say that’s an option. If you’re enjoying being with him I wouldn’t cut bait right now. He knows the situation and you know the situation. If you’re both fine with it now, then no need to end it. Yes, it’ll hurt that much more when you leave, but you just don’t know what it could possibly become at the 11 month mark. Enjoy your time now, keep doing what you’re doing, and I’d say around the 10 month mark, ask what his feelings are about the whole thing, figure out if you both want to continue it long distance, and take it from there. I think ending it now for fear of heartbreak later you’d end up regretting.
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Dear Dr. Reality Steve,

I always think you give brilliant relationship advice, so I wanted to reach out to you regarding something I’ve been struggling with on and off. Bear with me while I give some background info.

My boyfriend- lets call him “Dave,” and I have been together for several years, living together for two, and we were best friends for a while first. We know each other very well and are quite convinced we could be right for each other in the long-term. We’re in our early/mid-20s, which I know some people may deem “too young” to know.

I have anxiety, and Dave is always there for me. He’s the only one who knows how to calm my panic attacks. Additionally, he’s one of the only people- if not the only person- that I feel I can always be 100% myself around. I’m a mega people-pleaser and mediator, which has gotten me taken advantage of before, and he has helped me to learn that I matter and to stand up for myself in problematic friendships. TLDR; Dave is amazing and neither of us want to lose one another.

With that said, I’m pretty confident Dave has Intermittent Explosive Disorder, which basically means he doesn’t always have the social cues to restrain himself from getting extremely upset over seemingly trivial things. He never takes it out on me or anybody else, but he has taken it out on objects before. Basically, during an episode, he starts talking really quickly, grows red in the face, can’t be talked down, ends up yelling a bit (think like an adult temper tantrum) and then storms off to another room to remove himself. He always ends up feeling relief afterward, followed by severe remorse and guilt within a half hour or so. It happens once every few months, on average. I think his mother may suffer from it, too, and that it’s genetic.

My question for you is: I know and love Dave, and I can understand and forgive his behavior, but sometimes I become anxious regarding other people who are quicker to judge. Some of them think I’m making a mistake being with him, and others don’t believe me when I tell them I’m safe and it’s more awkward than anything else. My best friends believe me and love him, but he’s had an episode in front of two of them and it was tough. He’s trying to watch his behavior and sincerely improving, but I don’t quite know what the best solution is for us. We want to be together, and we want to work on his mental health together. He is there for me and I want to be there for him to stop him from losing friends or giving people the wrong impression of his personality, because he’s a caring, wonderful man.

Do you have any advice? I’m considering helping him to seek out therapy (I already attend for my own shortcomings), but I’d appreciate your honesty regarding whether you think anything can be done, etc. Additionally, I fear that I’m being too superficial in worrying about what others think of him when I know who he is, so maybe the main issue is with me.

Thanks so much. I visit your site daily and you’re a huge role model of mine. I hope this comes across ok. Looking forward to hearing your thoughts.

Sincerely,

Ingratiator in Love

Comment: Thanks for the kind words. I’ll admit, I’d never heard of Intermittent Explosive Disorder (IED) before, so I googled it. Basically exactly what you explained. It’s random, lasts for less than 30 minutes, and it’s a rage for things that really aren’t that important. Sounds like he definitely suffers from it, that he picked it up during childhood, and there really isn’t a cure for it. But I think you’re safe. Nothing I read makes it seem like this something that’d ever be taken out on you physically or verbally, so that’s good.

From what I read, you’re on the right track with getting him therapy. Seems to be the only known thing that can at least help him control these outbursts. Here, I’m sure you’ve seen this but I cut and pasted the “Prevention” part of IED for you (and maybe others) who know someone who suffers from this. In the meantime, I absolutely wouldn’t break up with him over this. That’s a bit extreme. He’s got a problem, but one that isn’t related to you, and one that, with the right treatment and therapy, could become less extreme. Stick it out, and do what you can to follow most, if not all of these steps, to make the outbursts less frequent:

“If you have intermittent explosive disorder, prevention is likely beyond your control unless you get treatment from a professional. Combined with or as part of treatment, these suggestions may help you prevent some incidents from getting out of control:

Practice relaxation techniques. Regular use of deep breathing, relaxing imagery or yoga may help you stay calm.

Develop new ways of thinking (cognitive restructuring). Changing the way you think about a frustrating situation by using rational thoughts, reasonable expectations and logic may improve how you view and react to an event.

Use problem-solving. Make a plan to find a way to solve a frustrating problem. Even if you can’t fix it right away, it can refocus your energy.

Learn ways to improve your communication. Listen to the message the other person is trying to share, and then think about your best response rather than saying the first thing that pops into your head.

Change your environment. When possible, leave or avoid situations that upset you. Also, scheduling personal time may enable you to better handle an upcoming stressful or frustrating situation.

10 Comments

rob22

February 8, 2018 at 9:02 AM

Over-analyzer: Some of us definitely like to analyze and over plan. In a work environment, that’s prized by many companies and bosses. But in your personal life, with a relatively short time relationship, it makes no sense. What does make sense, is to wait and see how things progress over the next several months. When you….. if you… make it to 9-10 months, then it’s time to have those discussions. By then, you both should be starting to understand whether this relationship is going to be a long term relationship. That will make the discussion a lot easier to have. If you want to stay together you’ll figure out what you want to do. There are really only a couple of options. He either comes with you, or you try to do the long distance thing. If you’re not on the same page, you’ll break up and wish each other well. The key, however, will be for you to let go of the long term planning and just see where you are in another 4-5 months. Bringing up the future this far in advance will likely hurt the relationship. So, don’t do that. Enjoy your relationship and don’t kill it by looking too far in the future. Really, don’t do what you’re thinking of doing. I know you can’t help yourself, but don’t. Really. Really Really.

rob22

February 8, 2018 at 9:12 AM

Ingratiator in Love: Intermittent Explosive Disorder. Hmmmmm. Yeah. In my day, we called that Having. A. Bad. Temper. Honestly they’ll label anything a syndrome or a disorder today. The fact that his Mom has the same “Disorder” is not evidence of bad genes. It’s evidence that a bad temper can be learned from your parents. Your parents didn’t control their anger and emotions, and so you learn the same. I can guarantee that if you really looked into this, there is no scientific genetic link, though they’ll certainly imply that there might be one. That aside, a lot of the recommendations Steve listed are really common sense things, if you want to learn how to control your temper. So, get some counseling, maybe in anger management. But let’s drop the silliness of calling it a “disorder”. The guy manages his emotions poorly because he had a parent who did the same. It can be improved & he’s not a slave to his genetics. But we all have bad habits we struggle with. AND if he doesn’t improve, you’ll have to decide whether you really want to be with a guy who struggles with a bad temper & doesn’t manage his emotions well.

tinyred500

February 8, 2018 at 10:56 AM

I have to agree with rob22 with the silly names and labels these days. I grew up in the 80’s and glad I did! I have found though that some children go in the opposite direction to what behaviour a parent(s) showed them when they were growing up, my Father most certainly did, so it can’t all be down to genetics in what we become when we’re adults. It’s about making choices and who we choose to be too.

dreamteamer

February 8, 2018 at 11:27 AM

Neither of you are therapists so your dismissive opinions aren’t relevant here. Do you realize your responses are the type of judgement that trigger the LWs anxiety? FYI good advice giving doesn’t include telling people you don’t believe their issues are real and they should just make better choices. IED is a disorder in the DSM5, the Diagnostic and Statistical Manual of Mental Disorders 5th edition, published by the American Psychiatric Association the actual psychiatric professionals. It is not the same as having a bad temper.

Moving on to actually responding to the LW… As Steve mentioned in his response therapy will help immensely to learn how to manage the disorder. Please encourage your boyfriend to seek therapy! I am in a similar situation, I have anxiety and my boyfriend is the only person who really knows the depths of it and the only one I can truly be myself around. He in turn has PTSD. While I don’t think he has IED his painful emotions definitely manifest in anger. I don’t fear him, I know he won’t hurt me, it’s just stressful when it happens. Fortunately he is in therapy and it is helping. I think the dealbreaker for me in this situation would be whether or not your boyfriend is willing to try therapy. Because the disorder triggers your anxiety I would hope he would at a minimum consider it out of respect for you. I don’t think any issues are insurmountable as long as you treat each other with respect, and are able to ask for help when you need it. It sounds like you have a good thing going, try not to let what other people think get you down. It’s not a reflection of you, but them. As an anxious person myself I know it’s hard, but they are not in your relationship so literally do not know enough about your relationship to form an opinion. Also, if you aren’t in it already, I recommend therapy for you too. It has helped me so much with my anxiety, i used to have panic attacks and couldn’t always go to work because of it. I’ve been doing it for 10 years now and haven’t had a panic attack in 7. Best of luck to you!

tinyred500

February 8, 2018 at 12:46 PM

Your taking other people’s comments to the extreme and reading far too much into comments.

I live in the UK and so many simple things have a label now, whereas they never used to, and I’m not saying issues are non existent. I’m not talking about extremes of any behaviour. Extremes forms of bad or poor behaviour is another issue entirely, and yes, they are very real and can be horrendous to live with. I’ve suffered from panic attacks for most of my life and so I know how life changing they can be.

tinyred500

February 8, 2018 at 1:05 PM

That should be ‘You’re’ and not Your. 😉

justa_viewer

February 8, 2018 at 2:07 PM

Are we sure that Overanalyzer (whom I assume is a woman) has actually told her boyfriend about the job and that she is definitely moving in six months?

I know she hasn’t asked him to move with her; I just wasn’t 100% clear, the way the email was written, as to whether or not she has told him that *she* is definitely moving. The way she put it was: “I *think* we both have the same attitude at the moment, which is kind of just taking it one day at a time and not worrying to much about the future.” Hopefully he is aware that the future includes her pending move.

asdf

February 8, 2018 at 4:40 PM

Thank you dreamteamer. I never post on boards but I was similarly angered and offended by the dismissal of a disorder that must have been well researched before being included in the dsm. I would hope as time goes on we are better able as a society to learn and disvover new things we previously didn’t know about and how to support mental health. Here is a quote relating to this very subject: “People don’t see this as a medical problem. They think of it as simply bad behavior they have developed over the course of their lives, but it isn’t. It has significant biology and neuroscience behind it,” said Coccaro, who is the Ellen C. Manning Professor of Psychiatry and Behavioral Neuroscience at UChicago.

rob22

February 9, 2018 at 7:26 AM

As for disorders, I realize that Psychiatry has embraced “disorders” as valid science in many, many areas. So, I have to concede that point. But, there are plenty of others that challenge that science and point out that the science behind many disorders is dubious. I won’t go into all of that, because people are going to believe what they want to believe regardless. That’s the way humans operate. We mostly decide what we want to believe and craft our reality around our beliefs. Often, we’d like to believe that something biological is the cause of something we have trouble changing. So…..

Regardless of the labeling, anyone who has emotional outbursts over small matters needs to have counseling & work on improving themselves. Nobody should have to live with someone that is unable/unwilling to control themselves. Labeling behaviors as disorders or as just behavior changes nothing….. except perhaps the willingness of a girlfriend/spouse to accept the behavior as something their spouse “biologically” cannot control. That’s false. Girlfriends/Spouses shouldn’t accept that behavior in their lives, and people can and should work to control their behavior. Even if we are biologically disposed to angry outbursts, that doesn’t mean that we’re not responsible for our behavior and it’s impact on our family, friends and others we come into contact with. If we agree on that, then feel free to label it however you want. We’re not in any disagreement of substance.

shenanigans

February 9, 2018 at 10:21 AM

In the medical community, there were practical reasons for labeling many behaviors and problems as “disorders.” Once they did – and the person had a formal “diagnosis,” they qualified for all sorts of treatments that were covered by third party payment systems (ie, insurance companies).

Net result? Everybody “won,” because there was a lot of money to be made: counselors, psychiatrists, and drug companies all got their piece of the pie. But, the thing is this: not all of these disorders are legitimate – and many people can get better without expensive “treatments.” As a result, I tend to treat all of these discussions on a case by case basis.

The woman’s boyfriend may have a legitimate disorder. But, then again, he must just be a hothead. It’s not for me to say. LOL