UNI88 wrote:
I said that "a lot of kids form an attachment to sports" not all kids. I used CTE as one of the reasons that football is losing young participants not as a reason to promote rugby as an alternative. Rugby is a violent sport and injuries are common. Reading comprehension is important.

Rugby tackling techniques do tend to be better than traditional football techniques that's why Pete Carroll and others have adopted them and similar techniques (head's up). They're trying to stay ahead of the curve and keep the sport relevant.

My point was that it's always been that fewer kids play organized football than several other sports, but the NFL is still the king of viewership in the US.

Agreed - obviously the numbers of people watching NFL games far exceed that of people that actually play football. The NFL is just made for TV - it works and people watch it. Certainly CTE is something that needs to be addressed, but for now, NFL football is king.

GannonFan wrote:
And yet, the Brits keep showing up in large numbers over and over for NFL games. The football that you bring up that wasn't successful was the WLAF stuff - that was not even a minor league system, it was something less than. And yes, that didn't work (although it did very well in London while the other outposts not so much). But that folded more than a decade ago, and since then the NFL has been widely successful in bringing actual NFL games that matter with actual NFL players and the crowds have responded accordingly.

Oh, and Tottenham is owned by Joe Lewis, a Brit, with no ties or connections to American football. But I'm sure he'll be fine with that when the NFL sells out his stadium in October when the first NFL game played there occurs. Spurs, in a successful season with Champions League games at home, hasn't sold out similarly-sized Wembley yet so far this year.

I'm not sure about there being a London franchise in 10 years. Huge crowds at 1 or 2 games a year featuring different teams doesn't necessarily translate to huge crowds at 8 games a year every year. The novelty of the game helps to increase demand. Rugby has something similar with All Blacks games at US football stadiums. Take away the novelty and the demand will drop. There still might be enough to sustain a franchise but it's not guaranteed.

Another factor is the travel. The NFL can use bye weeks to help the teams playing in England adjust to the travel now. That will be more difficult if there are 8 games there and pretty much impossible for the home team. The NFLPA will complain up a storm about that one and demand concessions in exchange.

The NFL is definitely interested in a London franchise but they haven't figured out how to make it work yet.

It's actually 3-4 games per year now - you need to keep up. And Jacksonville has been trying to be a "home" team of sorts and has been there more than anyone else. Considering that Jacksonville, over that time, has been terrible, and yet they keep selling out Wembley and Twickenham, I'd say the NFL has done a good job of building the fanbase there.

The travel stuff will be worked out, and the NFLPA isn't going to get in the way of bringing more money into the NFL. They've already talked about whatever team is in London would be in an East coast division, and they would likely have the schedule staggered accordingly to adjust for the travel, and that they would likely have a second training facility, likely in the southeast part of the US, to stay at when it makes sense travel-wise to stay in the US. It's not as big of a hurdle as you're making it out to be. The fact that the Tottenham stadium is being built the way that it is, and that a new collective bargaining will be done in the next few years, suggests that a London expansion team is something we could see announced in the next 5-10 years.

89Hen wrote:
My point was that it's always been that fewer kids play organized football than several other sports, but the NFL is still the king of viewership in the US.

Agreed - obviously the numbers of people watching NFL games far exceed that of people that actually play football. The NFL is just made for TV - it works and people watch it. Certainly CTE is something that needs to be addressed, but for now, NFL football is king.

I'm talking about future viewership. I love watching football but the current troubles aren't going away and could get worse. I would guess that participation in youth football has dropped 30-40% in the last 5 years. That's a problem that could impact the sports future. They can begin to address it or stick their heads in the sand and count their money.

GannonFan wrote:
Agreed - obviously the numbers of people watching NFL games far exceed that of people that actually play football. The NFL is just made for TV - it works and people watch it. Certainly CTE is something that needs to be addressed, but for now, NFL football is king.

I'm talking about future viewership. I love watching football but the current troubles aren't going away and could get worse. I would guess that participation in youth football has dropped 30-40% in the last 5 years. That's a problem that could impact the sports future. They can begin to address it or stick their heads in the sand and count their money.

I agree that it could be a problem, but IMO any drop in viewership is not because of CTE or fewer kids playing. All sports are seeing a decline because there are simply too many other entertainment options and the fact that younger generations simply don't care about their local teams as much. Growing up in the 70's you had three networks, maybe three UHF channels and a PBS. You had a handful of games on TV each week and they were always your local teams for pro sports. It was damn hard to be a fan of any other team. That made for rabid, local fans.

My kids used to bowl in a junior league here and nearly all the boys would wear NFL jerseys on Saturday mornings. I honestly can't recall a single one of them wearing a Redskins jersey. 89Jr wore a Seahawks jersey because he like the colors and logo. Others wore their favorite fantasy league player. This has nothing to do with playing or not playing youth football.

UNI88 wrote:I'm talking about future viewership. I love watching football but the current troubles aren't going away and could get worse. I would guess that participation in youth football has dropped 30-40% in the last 5 years. That's a problem that could impact the sports future. They can begin to address it or stick their heads in the sand and count their money.

I agree that it could be a problem, but IMO any drop in viewership is not because of CTE or fewer kids playing. All sports are seeing a decline because there are simply too many other entertainment options and the fact that younger generations simply don't care about their local teams as much. Growing up in the 70's you had three networks, maybe three UHF channels and a PBS. You had a handful of games on TV each week and they were always your local teams for pro sports. It was damn hard to be a fan of any other team. That made for rabid, local fans.

My kids used to bowl in a junior league here and nearly all the boys would wear NFL jerseys on Saturday mornings. I honestly can't recall a single one of them wearing a Redskins jersey. 89Jr wore a Seahawks jersey because he like the colors and logo. Others wore their favorite fantasy league player. This has nothing to do with playing or not playing youth football.

I agree - there could be a drop, but a large chunk, if not the vast majority, of viewership comes from folks who never played a down of football in their life. Watching football, especially NFL football, has very little to do with playing youth football as a kid.

Guys, rugby is not going to approach American Football in terms of popularity or revenue generation in our lifetimes. Not even remotely. You're not going to see, for instance, a rugby game approach what the Super Bowl generates in ratings. You're probably not going to see a rugby match approach what the FCS championship game generates in ratings. But I guess I wouldn't be shocked if you proved me wrong on that one.

I'm not putting rugby down but there's not going to be a demise of American Football in any of our lifetimes. The flipping 2018 NFL draft probably got better TV ratings than any rugby match ever has in the United States.

JohnStOnge wrote:Guys, rugby is not going to approach American Football in terms of popularity or revenue generation in our lifetimes. Not even remotely. You're not going to see, for instance, a rugby game approach what the Super Bowl generates in ratings. You're probably not going to see a rugby match approach what the FCS championship game generates in ratings. But I guess I wouldn't be shocked if you proved me wrong on that one.

I'm not putting rugby down but there's not going to be a demise of American Football in any of our lifetimes. The flipping 2018 NFL draft probably got better TV ratings than any rugby match ever has in the United States.

JohnStOnge wrote:Guys, rugby is not going to approach American Football in terms of popularity or revenue generation in our lifetimes. Not even remotely. You're not going to see, for instance, a rugby game approach what the Super Bowl generates in ratings. You're probably not going to see a rugby match approach what the FCS championship game generates in ratings. But I guess I wouldn't be shocked if you proved me wrong on that one.

I'm not putting rugby down but there's not going to be a demise of American Football in any of our lifetimes. The flipping 2018 NFL draft probably got better TV ratings than any rugby match ever has in the United States.

Ibanez wrote:While in Charleston this weekend, my nephew was playing for the State Championship. He was playing against my Alma Mater, Bishop England.

Bishop England have some large boys that were difficult to take down.

But the Wando Warriors emerged victorious.

Now on to Missouri....

Good luck to him in the nationals. Tell him to root on Gonzaga in the other division.

Thanks. He's excited.

I hope they do well. Evan is a great kid, extremely kind and generous, focused, honest. He's a tough kid.

The boy has a busy summer ahead of him. He graduates on June 1, a few days later he and his family are travelling to France and then the UK for 1.5 weeks. Then he reports to The Citadel on July 5 for CSI which is most of the month..then he has 2 weeks for reporting in August to begin his Knob year.

GannonFan wrote:
Oh, and Tottenham is owned by Joe Lewis, a Brit, with no ties or connections to American football. But I'm sure he'll be fine with that when the NFL sells out his stadium in October when the first NFL game played there occurs. Spurs, in a successful season with Champions League games at home, hasn't sold out similarly-sized Wembley yet so far this year.

Do you actually know anything about Tottenham, Wembly, or the new WHL? Do you know what WHL stands for?

Wembley’s capacity is no where near the old WHL, which was 36k, or the new WHL, which is set to be 62k. Wembley is 90k and an hour and a half from The Northumberland/Tottenham Burroughs. It’s on the other side of London.

Oh and Tottenham has the highest average attendance in Europe this year at something like 70,000. It was 68k for EPL games and the CL brought it up. Set English football attendance records for games over 84,00 and multiple others over 80,000 this season. No soccer match has ever cross the 90,000 mark. 89,874 is the largest ever, and that was for an FA Cup final. Barcelona and Liverpool got to 89,846 for a preseason match there. One of the 4 largest clubs in England ( and top 10 or so on the world) vs one of the 3 largest clubs in the world didn’t get to 90k. Wembley is despises by the brits for about 30 dozens reason, one of the main reasons is it’s impossibly difficult and arduously get too.

New WHL was designed with American football 100% in mind. The soccer pitch is on a tray system that can be out of the stadium with the football field, kept under the soccer pitch, ready to go in just a half hour. It was designed to be able to host both types of football IN THE SAME DAY. It was built more like an American football stadium than a traditional English football stadium.

Joe Lewis May be a Brit by birth but he spends nearly all his time on American, or American owned soil. He’s about money. Also the stadium is owned by the club, not Lewis. Not ENIC. Not Daniel Levy. There’s talk of Lewis selling the club in a year or two. Once the stadium is paid off and value of it is seen. Talking multiple billions in sale. Links to potential buyers already floated around - all of them American. Now, if that sits well with the Brits? Probability not at first. Depends on if the owner ran things like Woolwich, Scousers or United.

GannonFan wrote:
Oh, and Tottenham is owned by Joe Lewis, a Brit, with no ties or connections to American football. But I'm sure he'll be fine with that when the NFL sells out his stadium in October when the first NFL game played there occurs. Spurs, in a successful season with Champions League games at home, hasn't sold out similarly-sized Wembley yet so far this year.

Do you actually know anything about Tottenham, Wembly, or the new WHL? Do you know what WHL stands for?

Wembley’s capacity is no where near the old WHL, which was 36k, or the new WHL, which is set to be 62k. Wembley is 90k and an hour and a half from The Northumberland/Tottenham Burroughs. It’s on the other side of London.

Oh and Tottenham has the highest average attendance in Europe this year at something like 70,000. It was 68k for EPL games and the CL brought it up. Set English football attendance records for games over 84,00 and multiple others over 80,000 this season. No soccer match has ever cross the 90,000 mark. 89,874 is the largest ever, and that was for an FA Cup final. Barcelona and Liverpool got to 89,846 for a preseason match there. One of the 4 largest clubs in England ( and top 10 or so on the world) vs one of the 3 largest clubs in the world didn’t get to 90k. Wembley is despises by the brits for about 30 dozens reason, one of the main reasons is it’s impossibly difficult and arduously get too.

New WHL was designed with American football 100% in mind. The soccer pitch is on a tray system that can be out of the stadium with the football field, kept under the soccer pitch, ready to go in just a half hour. It was designed to be able to host both types of football IN THE SAME DAY. It was built more like an American football stadium than a traditional English football stadium.

Joe Lewis May be a Brit by birth but he spends nearly all his time on American, or American owned soil. He’s about money. Also the stadium is owned by the club, not Lewis. Not ENIC. Not Daniel Levy. There’s talk of Lewis selling the club in a year or two. Once the stadium is paid off and value of it is seen. Talking multiple billions in sale. Links to potential buyers already floated around - all of them American. Now, if that sits well with the Brits? Probability not at first. Depends on if the owner ran things like Woolwich, Scousers or United.

Yes, I'm a Spurs fan thank you very much. You got all frothy at the mouth thinking I was comparing seating capacity of Wembley with the old White Hart Lane - I was comparing the size of the stadiums the NFL plays in over there (Wembley for instance) with the new stadium. And yes, Wembley is hard to get to, well aware of that.

My nephew's Rugby team won 4th place last week in the Rugby Championships. His team won a Sportsmanship Award (I've personally seen how the team are class acts. Last year, after they lost a semifinal game, they stayed for the award ceremony and applauded the team, each player when their named was called, and stood for a huge group photo. That was after the traditional "shaking hands after the game.")

Now he graduates, matriculates to the Military College of South Carolina where he'll play Rugby.