Re: You Just Can't Make This Stuff Up!

I've read that his fortune was made in Las Vegas/Nevada real estate. Are you saying that that is not correct? Or that one (the cash flow from the casino) was the facilitator of the other?

Engelstad ran a construction company in Las Vegas, and also speculated in real estate. He used the money from that to buy a motel on the Strip in 1967, and then bought the Flamingo Capri in 1971. In 1972, he added a casino to it. It was renamed The Imperial Palace in 1979.

Engelstad ran a construction company in Las Vegas, and also speculated in real estate. He used the money from that to buy a motel on the Strip in 1967, and then bought the Flamingo Capri in 1971. In 1972, he added a casino to it. It was renamed The Imperial Palace in 1979.

Engelstad ran a construction company in Las Vegas, and also speculated in real estate. He used the money from that to buy a motel on the Strip in 1967, and then bought the Flamingo Capri in 1971. In 1972, he added a casino to it. It was renamed The Imperial Palace in 1979.

The Imperial Palace (which supposedly represents a swastika from above) housed an auto museum (an extremely good one as a matter of fact) which had in its collection one of the original Hitler parade cars, complete with bullet holes, put there by British troops (just for the fun of it) when Berlin fell. That car was only one of two in the collection that was displayed with a complete diorama, which included Hitler standing in the car waving to the crowd.

Make of that information what you will...

[I've stayed in the Imperial Palace and went to the museum (free for hotel guests). Nice hotel and excellent museum. Then again, I didn't know all the history behind it until many years later...]

Re: You Just Can't Make This Stuff Up!

I don't fault UND at all for getting involved with Engelstad. By all accounts, he was an unsavory character, but he was THEIR unsavory character. He came to them offering to build what was then (and still may be) the finest facility in all of college hockey, turning a recruiting deficit into a huge recruiting advantage.

Engelstad's money is not tainted in any official way, and there is no question that much good has come from that donation. As much as I enjoy seeing the Gophers beat the Fighting Flickertails up there (it has happened, you know), I don't begrudge them their Taj Mahal on the prairie.

Re: You Just Can't Make This Stuff Up!

Originally Posted by Eeyore

Sure. They should never, ever have accepted the donations from Ralph Engelstad, let alone gone along with naming a building after him, under the circumstances he was facing, nor with the conditions he insisted upon. You're talking about someone who ran a casino in Las Vegas in the days when you had to have mob connections to run a casino in Vegas. His first donation to renovate the old hockey arena was timed so as to bail Engelstad out of a PR nightmare, with the Nevada State Gaming Commission debating whether to suspend his gaming license for celebrating Hitler's birthday and making bumper stickers saying "Hitler Was Right." They accepted the $100 million donation in 1998 despite conditions that meant that Engelstad retained control of the public image of the arena and the university.

When you're fund raising, you have to be willing to walk away from a donation, no matter how large, under conditions like that. If you don't, you assume all of the baggage of the person making the donation. That's what happens when you sell your name. UND wasn't prepared to do that, so they own the ethical quagmire that was Ralph Engelstad.

Yeah, when this was asked about earlier you would have thought it was obvious that Engelstad was the central figure in the "ethical issues". But as Leather Helmet points out he is THEIR shady guy and the palace on the prairie is there for them to make rationalizations about.

Re: You Just Can't Make This Stuff Up!

Originally Posted by Sean Pickett

Can whoever started "the seventeen" please list them all?

Sean

There was a poll earlier this year which was about which women's team you supported and If I'm remembering correctly there was between 50 to 60 respondents and I think Minnesota had the most with around a dozen or so. So Maybe the Minnesota folks could be tabbed the dirty dozen...

Re: You Just Can't Make This Stuff Up!

Originally Posted by FiveHoleFrenzy

Yeah, when this was asked about earlier you would have thought it was obvious that Engelstad was the central figure in the "ethical issues". But as Leather Helmet points out he is THEIR shady guy and the palace on the prairie is there for them to make rationalizations about.

But Eeyore's original post said that how UND handled the women's hockey exit wasn't even in top 5 of UND ethical issues. Eeyore claims taking the Engelstad money was one, and we'll have to just agree to disagree on that one. That dead horse has been beaten unmercifully in the college hockey community.

However, I'm still waiting to hear about all the rest.

That community is already in the process of dissolution where each man begins to eye his neighbor as a possible enemy, where non-conformity with the accepted creed, political as well as religious, is a mark of disaffection; where denunciation, without specification or backing, takes the place of evidence; where orthodoxy chokes freedom of dissent; where faith in the eventual supremacy of reason has become so timid that we dare not enter our convictions in the open lists, to win or lose.

Re: You Just Can't Make This Stuff Up!

I'm curious, if UND was unethical in taking Ralph's money, weren't all the hockey players also unethical taking scholarships from UND? They could have gone to other schools.

I wouldn't worry when Utopians make a claim of a breach of ethics, they are hypocrites and among the most unethical people there are. There are a million examples, here's one:
They pay uneducated poor women to have babies while at the same time providing funds to the same women to kill their unborn child, and then with a straight face saying "every child a wanted child". Yeah, the ones that aren't killed in the womb are wanted alright, for their government handout they bring to their mother. In the Utopians upside down world the child takes care of the mother.

BTW, the Utopians are outraged these "wanted children" will lose their Obama Care under Trump Care. The rest of us are outraged that half the babies born in the US qualify for Obama Care. IOW, they are born to women who cannot afford to care for them or even have the background to know how to care for them

Re: You Just Can't Make This Stuff Up!

I'm curious, if UND was unethical in taking Ralph's money, weren't all the hockey players also unethical taking scholarships from UND? They could have gone to other schools.

I wouldn't worry when Utopians make a claim of a breach of ethics, they are hypocrites and among the most unethical people there are. There are a million examples, here's one:
They pay uneducated poor women to have babies while at the same time providing funds to the same women to kill their unborn child, and then with a straight face saying "every child a wanted child". Yeah, the ones that aren't killed in the womb are wanted alright, for their government handout they bring to their mother. In the Utopians upside down world the child takes care of the mother.

BTW, the Utopians are outraged these "wanted children" will lose their Obama Care under Trump Care. The rest of us are outraged that half the babies born in the US qualify for Obama Care. IOW, they are born to women who cannot afford to care for them or even have the background to know how to care for them

Re: You Just Can't Make This Stuff Up!

I'm curious, if UND was unethical in taking Ralph's money, weren't all the hockey players also unethical taking scholarships from UND? They could have gone to other schools.

I wouldn't worry when Utopians make a claim of a breach of ethics, they are hypocrites and among the most unethical people there are. There are a million examples, here's one:
They pay uneducated poor women to have babies while at the same time providing funds to the same women to kill their unborn child, and then with a straight face saying "every child a wanted child". Yeah, the ones that aren't killed in the womb are wanted alright, for their government handout they bring to their mother. In the Utopians upside down world the child takes care of the mother.

BTW, the Utopians are outraged these "wanted children" will lose their Obama Care under Trump Care. The rest of us are outraged that half the babies born in the US qualify for Obama Care. IOW, they are born to women who cannot afford to care for them or even have the background to know how to care for them

What? No comment on the effect of seventeenth-century mercantilism on UND athletics? Seems like only half an explanation.

Re: You Just Can't Make This Stuff Up!

Originally Posted by Leather helmet

What? No comment on the effect of seventeenth-century mercantilism on UND athletics? Seems like only half an explanation.

I just assumed everyone understood that it lead to European colonization and emigration, including to North America, which eventually lead to the displacement of some Sioux tribes from Minnesota to North Dakota. And who wouldn't be miffed at having to move to North Dakota? So when the two Sioux tribes were asked for their blessing of the UND mascot, they said no, still mad at having to live in North Dakota.

And that is the irony, Utopians are always saying "that's the way they do it in Sweden" or some other country, yet most people are here because of the failure of the economic policies of these countries. That's was their argument for Obama Care (notice that even the Utopians no longer call it The Affordable health Care Act, obviously because it is anything except affordable) "Canada has national health care" yeah, it's also nothing but frozen lakes and trees up there, why do you suppose any Canadian that can, moves to the US? Ask a Canadian to trade one of their dollars for one of ours.

Last edited by pokechecker; 05-17-2017 at 08:42 PM.
Reason: you can't make this up, but the utopians can

The answer to your question is that they are either extremely stupid, extremely ignorant or if they do have some understanding of what is really going on they are attempting to make a relatively quick score and get out before the curtain completely comes down on the Criminally Corrupt Police States of Amerikka, which can't happen too soon for all the decent inhabitants of the planet, including most Americans. But that timing is problematic, thereby making such a gamble dangerous. Hopefully those that have made such a move as you suggest, that fall into any of the above categories, haven't been so stupid as to apply for and to obtain American citizenship, as Shannon Miller did. Serious masochistic tendencies. I suppose by now the realities of FATCA have intruded themselves upon her conscious awareness. But it's too late. She voluntarily allowed herself to be captured by the criminally insane US Deep State...the unelected authorities (whose never ending crimes, including crimes against humanity, never ever get punished) who call the shots in your country. Be Proud.

Re: You Just Can't Make This Stuff Up!

Originally Posted by Blackbeard

Yeah, so terribly different from Minnesota.

The answer to your question is that they are either extremely stupid, extremely ignorant or if they do have some understanding of what is really going on they are attempting to make a relatively quick score and get out before the curtain completely comes down on the Criminally Corrupt Police States of Amerikka, which can't happen too soon for all the decent inhabitants of the planet, including most Americans. But that timing is problematic, thereby making such a gamble dangerous. Hopefully those that have made such a move as you suggest, that fall into any of the above categories, haven't been so stupid as to apply for and to obtain American citizenship, as Shannon Miller did. Serious masochistic tendencies. I suppose by now the realities of FATCA have intruded themselves upon her conscious awareness. But it's too late. She voluntarily allowed herself to be captured by the criminally insane US Deep State...the unelected authorities (whose never ending crimes, including crimes against humanity, never ever get punished) who call the shots in your country. Be Proud.

Re: You Just Can't Make This Stuff Up!

Originally Posted by pokechecker

I just assumed everyone understood that it lead to European colonization and emigration, including to North America, which eventually lead to the displacement of some Sioux tribes from Minnesota to North Dakota. And who wouldn't be miffed at having to move to North Dakota? So when the two Sioux tribes were asked for their blessing of the UND mascot, they said no, still mad at having to live in North Dakota.

OK, I can accept this.

Little-known fact: the Utopians actually cut their first album before ABBA, but of course tensions within the group derailed their success.

only the part the Brits gave up because they were preoccupied with fighting with other Old World nations

thank you, I don't have to travel as far to go fishing and pay the high cost of Canada

Originally Posted by Blackbeard

The answer to your question is that they are either extremely stupid, extremely ignorant or if they do have some understanding of what is really going on they are attempting to make a relatively quick score and get out before the curtain completely comes down on the Criminally Corrupt Police States of Amerikka, which can't happen too soon for all the decent inhabitants of the planet, including most Americans. But that timing is problematic, thereby making such a gamble dangerous. Hopefully those that have made such a move as you suggest, that fall into any of the above categories, haven't been so stupid as to apply for and to obtain American citizenship, as Shannon Miller did. Serious masochistic tendencies. I suppose by now the realities of FATCA have intruded themselves upon her conscious awareness. But it's too late. She voluntarily allowed herself to be captured by the criminally insane US Deep State...the unelected authorities (whose never ending crimes, including crimes against humanity, never ever get punished) who call the shots in your country. Be Proud.

I am.
you have to admit, the invention of the petro dollar was a brilliant reaction to the bath the US was taking from the gold standard, which you should recall the US took on as responsibility to help the Euro's & Asians recover from the world war they started, which was a result of the mercantilism of the Old World, which by the way Canada still subscribes to, although they are obviously influenced by American Capitalism, a blend of the old and new which leaves those in power riches, and the general population of Canada screwed, which is why any that can, move to the US. And those that can't, making the weekly trek to America to buy inexpensive gas and other goods.

Maybe if you people had thrown the yoke of the crown off, rather than for them to have the good grace to give you your freedom ....

maybe I should stop there while you digest it, I wouldn't want you to choke on it

Re: You Just Can't Make This Stuff Up!

So you see it does pertain to hockey, if the Brits hadn’t caved in to the US and kept NE MN as part of Canada, hockey would not be as it is today in MN. There would be about as many hockey players coming out of MN as there is in WI, and likely wouldn’t be a pro team there.

Re: You Just Can't Make This Stuff Up!

Originally Posted by pokechecker

you have to admit, the invention of the petro dollar was a brilliant reaction to the bath the US was taking from the gold standard

I do. I agree. (And Aug 15/71 for your information was the second time that the US government had defaulted on its obligations (on behalf of its citizens, of course)...nothing to be proud of...financial deadbeats). But you are right...the petro dollar scam was brilliant (and crooked like everything the US government does) in that it allowed US citizens to live way beyond their means...because everyone else was paying the freight for them...so Americans enjoyed a substantially higher standard of living than they otherwise would have been able to accomplish honestly...in other words, US citizens have been freeloading off the rest of the planet for over 40 years...like Uncle Charlie who showed up at the door looking for a handout and then forgot to leave. (I guess that should have been Uncle Sam).

Originally Posted by pokechecker

which is why any that can, move to the US. And those that can't, making the weekly trek to America to buy inexpensive gas and other goods.

You don't seem to be aware that this charade is coming to an end because the petro dollar scam is unravelling and has been for a few years...in case you are not aware Gaddafi and Hussein, among others, are dead because they threatened this US Ponzi scheme. The US has murdered and maimed millions of people because of it. This is something that you are proud of? When enough threads have unwound themselves from the petro dollar scam the US dollar as the reserve currency of the planet is history. So, stock up on your cheap goods while you can because you are going to get crushed in the not too distant future because Americans will experience a drastic decrease in their standard of living. The freeloading will be over and the mega hangover will begin. I mentioned this here five years ago and since then it has only progressed further toward its logical conclusion...implosion due to long overdue economic realities forcing themselves on Americans for which you can thank your government for creating a fake world for you to live in in the first place. A world of hurt...it won't be a pleasant place to live...not that it is now.

Originally Posted by pokechecker

Maybe if you people had thrown the yoke of the crown off

I agree with you here as well.

Monarchies, Royalty etc. are one of the most unbelievably absurd concepts in existence that millions of people still foolishly salivate over. The ancestors of kings and queens were nothing but local thugs, albeit successful thugs, who needed serfs to do their bidding for them in exchange for "protection" usually within the walls of the newly and forcibly stolen castle ...(exactly the same thing that's been going on in the US for years now by the way...a time honoured scam that most people usually fall for because they fail to think for themselves). A protection racket on steroids. So those who admire these people are really admiring the descendants of thugs...kind of setting the bar embarrassingly low, I'd say...thereby proving their serf mentality. Some things never change.

Originally Posted by pokechecker

maybe I should stop there while you digest it, I wouldn't want you to choke on it

You stroke yourself unnecessarily. Not much to digest and certainly nothing to choke on. You made a couple of good points and I agree with them. But you don't seem to understand or be aware of the end game. That will be extremely costly for you if you don't correct it...and quickly.

And how does this relate to women's hockey for those who can't connect the dots? Ask yourself how many here, most of whom are Americans, are going to be able to afford to go to women's hockey games and to pay for the parking not to mention the cold dogs and warm beer or even to pay for the streamed games when enough unravelling has occurred. Worse, women's hockey may no longer exist, a victim, among many, of economic realities. I asked a question or two here about this five years or so ago with respect to how this would affect recruiting and no one responded which told me that it was a pretty safe bet that no one was aware of the situation which means most will be blindsided. Everyone will suffer because the planet is so interconnected but Americans will suffer the most. For the most part the winners will be the ones who lose the least, however, there will be a very small minority who actually profit, who see their standard of living increase, because they saw it coming years ago and wisely took advantage of the time afforded them and took the necessary steps to protect themselves.

And, that would be 10,000 lakes to 100,000 lakes (at least if you are referring to this province) but how could you be expected to know that?