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Smash Lord

Vergeben talking about a new Square Enix character since July, and that in the August Direct they shown that the stage select screen lacks 5 spaces kinda proves that they were decided quite a while back sadly.

Considering how stingy Square Enix is being right now, if Final Fantasy, Square's flagship series, has nothing to represent it aside from the same FF content that was in Smash 4, then what chance does any other Square Enix IP have? For heaven's sake, there are no Square Enix Spirits at all (Geno is a special case because he's also a Mario character). I don't see Dragon Quest happening because no one from that series is really iconic despite it's popularity (unless you count the slime). Sora has an even bigger hurdle because of Disney. And Square likes to forget about it's other IPs so even if there was an actual chance of there being a new Square rep, it would only come from the big three (Final Fantasy, Dragon Quest and Kingdom Hearts). But considering Square's stinginess, even it's big three don't have a chance.

Vergeben was right with the base game characters but i think that's as far as it goes.

Smash Journeyman

Considering how stingy Square Enix is being right now, if Final Fantasy, Square's flagship series, has nothing to represent it aside from the same FF content that was in Smash 4, then what chance does any other Square Enix IP have? For heaven's sake, there are no Square Enix Spirits at all (Geno is a special case because he's also a Mario character). I don't see Dragon Quest happening because no one from that series is really iconic despite it's popularity (unless you count the slime). Sora has an even bigger hurdle because of Disney. And Square likes to forget about it's other IPs so even if there was an actual chance of there being a new Square rep, it would only come from the big three (Final Fantasy, Dragon Quest and Kingdom Hearts). But considering Square's stinginess, even it's big three don't have a chance.

Vergeben was right with the base game characters but i think that's as far as it goes.

I mean... one thing I don't understand is why everyone is saying Disney would be a hurdle when they said they're all up for Sora to be in Smash and they'd just need Nintendo to give them the call, alongside the fact Nintendo and Disney are actually really cooperative with each other, even if they were Disney projects like Wreck It Ralph. Nonetheless I still agree with Verge not knowing anything about DLC, and what'll determine that is if an Enderdragon really is a Day one patch boss and the day one patch isn't just Let's Go Spirits, Super Mario Party spirits, and the replay fix for physical copies.

Smash Lord

Just my opinion maybe... but the dream Square rep would be Chrono. He's pretty iconic to SNES and is arguably a bigger deal than another FF character or even a DQ one.

But that's likely never happening. Square has not only been difficult to work with, but over the last decade+ they've seemingly tried to forget about one of their most beloved games/franchises.

Personally.. and this is my opinion again.. Geno would probably be one of the more disappointing additions. He was in one game, and was an interesting character... but I've never understood why so many people are crazy about him in Smash. Maybe it's partly because it would be an invitation to revive him in an actual game featuring him again. I can understand that. But in terms of Square reps for me he's bottom of the barrel. Only reason I kinda would want him is cuz I know it would make a lot of people that want him happy, heh.. and I know Sakurai could make any character cool and fun.

Either way, the rumors do point to a Square something and the way DLC purchases could be spread out to Square themselves might just be the thing that makes them ease up on their properties. I wont be too surprised if we do get a Square something.. but I also wont at all be surprised if we don't. Certainly, in my mind, most Nintendo properties, including Xeno stuff, have better odds. Odds are just odds tho and hard to really quantify. Sure makes things exciting, heh.

Smash Apprentice

So Joker was the first Fighter to be announced for DLC. I love Joker and persona, so I'm really excited. However, this actually makes me even more nervous for Rex. Joker was way out of left field, and after hearing Reggie emphasize that the season pass is crazy, it makes me think that Rex may not get in after all. Now characters like Banjo, Sora, and other obscure non-Nintendo characters have a much higher chance of getting in. And Nintendo may want to focus on getting these obscure characters rather than from something they own.

Smash Journeyman

Man, if Rex and Pyra don't get in because of this rule that all DLC is from new franchises, that's the dumbest excuse ever. I was more sure of them being in the game than even a Pokemon newcomer! Xenoblade deserves some love after how much it's blown up. And I would be shocked if Sakurai doesn't plan/want them to be playable. I mean, they're not even assist trophies in the base game. I don't see them being completely left out like that.

The only thing I really see as a point against an XC2 rep from that comment is the "all of them will be unexpected" part, cuz an XC2 rep is among the more expected characters that Nintendo could choose, imo

Truth be told, the reveal of the first DLC and the game's release has forced a lot of conflicting thoughts into my head regarding Rex and Pyra's chances. There's plenty I've seen recently that could be argued for them and plenty that could be argued against that often comes from the same "evidence". But because I'm not too concerned with getting burned by disappointment and choose to hope when I can, while also recognizing the alternative possibilities...... I guess my opinion of their odds hasn't really changed that much when compared to more pessimistic minds.

I mean, there's only 4 "slots" left in this DLC package now, so there's that to consider... and I guess that objectively lowers their odds? Reggie's comment is kinda vague but does seem to indicate to expect the unexpected. Referencing Joker's inclusion, the implication people are latching onto is that this gives characters from franchises that aren't even necessarily popular on Nintendo consoles, but rather competitor consoles, an actual decent chance - a concept people were perhaps previously less open to. But what this really means to me, (if anything), depends on who we assume really called the shots here. Sakurai is lead dev but he claims Nintendo chose the DLC list, as I recall. Does that mean Nintendo gave him a shortlist and he picked the DLC, or did he give Nintendo a shortlist that they had to approve? It's likely some mix of both.

I made the earlier distinction because, one thing to remember is that Sakurai loved Persona as a game and mentioned it as inspiration in some design choices - like the FS character portrait thing. Likewise, he mentioned he loved XC2. So perhaps Joker's inclusion was largely Sakurai's choice (as you might expect) even as he said Nintendo finalized or had some strong influence on the choices. Maybe Nintendo simply agreed because Sakurai already had permission. Depending on how you look at it, the fact that we're getting a character from a game Sakurai loved could be a good sign for us since maybe that was a strong factor and could imply XC2's likelihood.

On the other hand, you can assume it was mainly Nintendo that approved a Persona character for other reasons, and that just broadens the potential competition as it's seen as a sign that Nintendo isn't sticking close to their own properties and anything is possible. Although, a couple posts ago I said the real trouble with guessing what the DLC will be is just the shear amount of possibilities really, and said Sakurai and Nintendo are mostly gonna do what they want. So in my mind this outcome and Reggie's comment about "surprising choices" isn't that unexpected. There was always a ton of potential candidates, so nothing's really changed. Also worth considering, in a more pessimistic point of view, even if Sakurai chose a Persona rep because he loved the game... if Nintendo as a whole made the final calls, they might've taken XC2 reps off the table early on and "forced" Sakurai to do the "compensation" as an alternative that he decided for himself even as he'd have enjoyed including the characters as DLC.

Yeah, that last part is pretty doom and gloom for us, heh... but it's just another possibility. Seems quite unlikely to me tho. Granted, the big money can be made off those "franchise characters" from non first party properties. I wouldn't say Joker is on a Cloud or Ryu level, but he represents a more recently very popular franchise and may well attract people to the Switch and Smash with his inclusion that aren't necessarily here otherwise. That's what's special about third party inclusions. Smash 4 seemed to agree what with half of it's DLC being characters that weren't 1st party. And yet, it still feels weird that Nintendo would say "no" to Sakurai about XC2 characters but yes to Persona.

TL;DR - I think we're right where we were before... just one less slot in this DLC pack. There's plenty of new information to process, but in the end we're just as ignorant as we've always been, lol. If our speculations are as good as a coin toss, may as well enjoy hoping for the best rather than getting worried about fearing the worst. Sure, one can temper their expectations to not get burned, but assuming the worst when it could easily go the other way just seems like a bummer of a time. As always, still cautiously optimistic.

Smash Hero

My hope is that they'll add more Nintendo characters but like fogbadge
I'm pessimistic. They could do something similar to the Tekken DLC's and have one guest, four Nintendo characters, which would be fine by me.

As for Rex, we'll have to wait and see. It really depends on what Nintendo think's is "unexpected."

Cats > Dogs

The playable characters's icons are at the top of the list and use Ultimate's renders, not Fighter Spirit artwork. There are also no repeats (i.e Ganondorf (Twilight Princess) is not an icon). If Rex was going to be DLC, he would have to have an icon that stood alongside the other playable characters and not have his XC2 art elsewhere in the list to comply with the other fighters, so the absence of his XC2 art is suspicious especially considering we got Pyra and Mythra. So while the article did make an error in explaining the theory, the overall point that Rex not having an online icon helps his chances still stands. Also, I think it's worth noting that Octoling is another strange omission from the list. But honestly this probably doesn't mean much regardless.

Smash Apprentice

I wouldn't put much weight into it considering that Pyra and Mythra are more popular than Rex but it is something.

Anyway, Just wanted to bring up something Hitagi said before and still somewhat believes. He heard that a Nintendo sword character could be added as DLC. This bodes well for Rex, but could be anyone else (Especially considering that a new Fire Emblem game is in the works). Can't really say I believe him, but it's something.

At this point, I'm not putting much faith in Rex. Not because I don't think he has a chance to be playable (Though that's partially it), but because I fear disappointment. I wouldn't be surprised if Sakurai were to make Rex playable outside the Fighter's Pass due to demand(Especially in Japan), but I wouldn't get my hopes up.

Smash Lord

This icon theory is pretty weak tbh. It's premise essentially opens the door to every wild character inclusion you can imagine just about. The number of icons doesn't compare to the amount of potential fighters, and there's plenty of characters that could be DLC that aren't there. It helps Rex as much as anyone else. Tho I understand the whole "he's a main character in a game so it's not like seeing Reyn is missing an icon, and it's not like Elma not having an icon unless we had Lin without her!" The general premise still is pretty assumptive.

The theory is basically wrapped around being surprised Rex isn't in there to begin with. Like implying he would be if wasn't planned as DLC. I'm not sure that's necessarily true. We're kinda assuming he'd have to be there otherwise. It is a bit odd he's not, but that's tenuous evidence. Course, it's also safe since it cant be deconfirmed unless they add Rex's icon without making him DLC. The chances are either it wont get updated or we'll get a playable Rex so whoever guesses this theory holds water is unlikely to proven wrong.

I mean, there's no doubt I want Rex in Smash but I'm not putting any hope in this theory having any real meaning....... well, maybe some fraction of percent of credit, since I don't mind a tiny boost in hope, heh~

Chuggaaconroy has a long history with Xenoblade and is a huge fan. Unsurprising really, heh... but fun he still talks about it even in unrelated let's plays. He has like a 100+ episode XC Let's Play that might be worth checking out if you've not played the game... or even if you have if you're interested. I started watching that Let's Play as it released and got to episode 20 or so before I decided to borrow XC from a friend and play it myself. I beat the game and years later I finished watching the let's play just because I liked how it was going so well and wanted to see his take on everything.

Cats > Dogs

The strangest thing to me about the icon theory is that Sakurai acknowledged Rex's absence in a 2 minute segment of the direct dedicated to him and XC2 in general, yet didn't add his png as a battle icon. You would think that the character you were using as a DLC incentive would have an avatar, but he didn't even receive that.

banaenae'd (69 points)

The strangest thing to me about the icon theory is that Sakurai acknowledged Rex's absence in a 2 minute segment of the direct dedicated to him and XC2 in general, yet didn't add his png as a battle icon. You would think that the character you were using as a DLC incentive would have an avatar, but he didn't even receive that.

Smash Hero

In addition to the icon thing, something other have pointed out is that there are a lot of spirits that weren't censored. Azure, for instance, still shows a lot of leg. Contrast to the female Corrin which was altered slightly to show less leg. Here is an example for Smash Wii U. Corrin has the same design in Smash Ultimate

Mythra is changed in a similar way and also uses black tights to hid skin. Her outfit also hids skin on her hips that are mostly covered on the 2D image