It's funny how most of you need to point at Obama when trump's incompetence is at full show.

One of them surrounded themselves with idiots and views human lives as fodder material whereas the other took a more cautious cautious approach when it came to analysis of any enemy situation. And this palpably explains why this raid didn't materialize during Obama's presidency.

(Original post by BigTraderBoi)
If a Muslim kills another Muslim, they are not a Muslim. They are an apostate.

...Of course according to your interpretation. As it's already been alluded to you via another thread, the Muslims that kill other Muslims in the violent sectarianism present in parts of the Muslim world, see themselves/self proclaim themselves as "Muslims"/"True Muslims", often decrying the differing/rival Muslim similarly to you as an apostate/blasphemer...and given apostasy/blasphemy is seen to be a punishable offence by many Muslims, cue in a continuation/exacerbation of such sectarian conflict.

(Original post by string56)
...Of course according to your interpretation. As it's already been alluded to you via another thread, the Muslims that kill other Muslims in the violent sectarianism present in parts of the Muslim world, see themselves/self proclaim themselves as "Muslims"/"True Muslims", often decrying the differing/rival Muslim similarly to you as an apostate/blasphemer...and given apostasy/blasphemy is seen to be a punishable offence by many Muslims, cue in a continuation/exacerbation of such sectarian conflict.

What's your point here? There is only one correct interpretation of Islam. And yes, apostasy and blasphemy are punishable offences.

(Original post by AlexanderHam)
What Islamic ruling do you have in support of that claim?

I've seen no serious Islamic scholar substantiate the position that a Muslim committing a sinful act means they cease being a Muslim. If they adhere to the five pillars, they are Muslim.

Your "No True Scotsman" position is puerile

Killing a Muslim is not just a sin. It's different to just any other sin. I'm not saying that this act does not make you a non-Muslim but it no longer makes you a representative of the faith, since Muslims are forbidding from killing Muslims.

I guess your reading comprehension must not be top notch, perhaps you should further digest my post. To reiterate...

Of course according to your interpretation. As it's already been alluded to you via another thread, the Muslims that kill other Muslims in the violent sectarianism present in parts of the Muslim world, see themselves/self proclaim themselves as "Muslims"/"True Muslims", often decrying the differing/rival Muslim similarly to you as an apostate/blasphemer...and given apostasy/blasphemy is seen to be a punishable offence by many Muslims, cue in a continuation/exacerbation of such sectarian conflict.

There is only one correct interpretation of Islam.

I think I've covered this in another response to you, to quote..."True Islam", as you seem to allude to, is I'm sure you know a contentious title amongst Muslims fractured into their various sects/interpretations and I'm sure differing/rival Muslims will make similar if not the same statement as you have made above, in relation to their own "True Islam".

And yes, apostasy and blasphemy are punishable offences.

Of course under your interpretation. There are self proclaimed Muslims of rival sects/interpretations that do not hold blasphemy and in particular apostasy to be a punishable earthly offence in Islam.

Though that aside, it's statements like the above quote, rather than preventing apostasy, now seems to contribute to doubts and disbelief amongst some adherents of Islam. It doesn't take much thought to know why. As persecuting apostates and critics, only further highlights the unsound nature of Islam, too often requiring childhood indoctrination and coercion via threats of harm to be accepted as truth (i.e. hell and the various punishments associated with leaving, criticizing and opposing Islam), all in a bid to not expose the likely truth of that insecure religion being unsubstantiated and false.

(Original post by BigTraderBoi)
Killing a Muslim is not just a sin. It's different to just any other sin. I'm not saying that this act does not make you a non-Muslim but it no longer makes you a representative of the faith, since Muslims are forbidding from killing Muslims.

That's not what you said before. Your exact words were;

If a Muslim kills another Muslim, they are not a Muslim

Of course, some of the "most Islamic" people in history have also been some of the biggest killers of other Muslims. Many of the early caliphs were knee-deep in the blood of other Muslims, as they engaged in brutal civil wars for control of the new Islamic empire. Are you going to say these "right-guided" Islamic caliphs were not Muslims?

Now let's get down to brass tacks. There is no such thing as Allah. Like all religions, Islam is man-made. And like all such man-made ideologies, the people at the top are characteristically power-hungry, violent, manipulative and greedy. Anyone who stands in their way doesn't just become their enemy, they become an "enemy of God". That's how religion has traditionally worked; it is an exercise of power and control, an exercise of the accumulation of wealth and prestige.

Saying that, by killing another Muslim, a Muslim ceases to become a Muslim, is not only contrary to the actions of some of the most revered Muslims in history, it also implies that there is some objective standard of behaviour set by heaven against which the people on earth are judged. Given Allah doesn't exist and it's all just made up, that is clearly not the case. Someone is a Muslim if they think of themselves as one and follow the determinative Five Pillars. That is all.

(Original post by AlexanderHam)
That's not what you said before. Your exact words were;

If a Muslim kills another Muslim, they are not a Muslim

Of course, some of the "most Islamic" people in history have also been some of the biggest killers of other Muslims. Many of the early caliphs were knee-deep in the blood of other Muslims, as they engaged in brutal civil wars for control of the new Islamic empire. Are you going to say these "right-guided" Islamic caliphs were not Muslims?

Now let's get down to brass tacks. There is no such thing as Allah. Like all religions, Islam is man-made. And like all such man-made ideologies, the people at the top are characteristically power-hungry, violent, manipulative and greedy. Anyone who stands in their way doesn't just become their enemy, they become an "enemy of God". That's how religion has traditionally worked; it is an exercise of power and control, an exercise of the accumulation of wealth and prestige.

Saying that, by killing another Muslim, a Muslim ceases to become a Muslim, is not only contrary to the actions of some of the most revered Muslims in history, it also implies that there is some objective standard of behaviour set by heaven against which the people on earth are judged. Given Allah doesn't exist and it's all just made up, that is clearly not the case. Someone is a Muslim if they think of themselves as one and follow the determinative Five Pillars. That is all.

Citation please?

Hey guys it's me. I'm going to quote some hard facts, don't worry you can trust me. Islam is true. Allah exists. Muhammad was the last prophet. These are true. Given that Allah exists, we should all convert to Islam. That is all.

(no I don't need to back up anything I say. I'll say what I want and you should all believe me)