I for one as a volunteer with the LNERCA based on the NYMR used to use the Moors to get to Pickering. I'd get the train from Newcastle to Middlesbrough, the the Whitby service changing at Grosmont. When I went for my first working visit my contact remarked "we can pick you up at Malton [on the York - Scarborough line], my reply being why, I can get the train to Grosmont then ours over Moors. The reply being oh hadn't thought of that. Then later on another working visit the Guard on the Moors train was just as surprised as I was using the train to "commute" and was pretty well the first traveler he'd had on his train using it that was......

statistical data with contemporary, real-world facts and figures - to prove me that any heritage railway can afford to run any kind of service on the basis of 'getting people from A to B'. I'm confident that you won't be able to.

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As far as I know, no railway has tried it, so statistical data can't exist ( although if it does, I'd like to see it) There is no need to 'prove' anything, as posts are just opinions. Until a line actually tries at least 1 full year through all seasons, with early and late trains, it will remain an unknown. Some lines will be taking a few from A to B where convenient. Perhaps Watchet to Minehead, perhaps Haworth to Keighley, perhaps Bewdley to Kidderminster, perhaps Kingscote to East Grinstead, for shopping/meet friends for coffee/doctors appointment/all 3. Without a detailed survey of travel patterns, it is impossible to know for sure.

Such grim determination to be negative. Plenty of 'BR' lines are doing that successfully now. As you well knew, I meant preserved lines.

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It's actually a "grim determination" not to waste resources on a need long since disappeared. Even to run lines as visitor attractions is far from wildly profitable and relies heavily on shop and catering receipts.

Don't the lines that have re-opened since the late 80's prove the need has reappeared? Why ignore those inconvenient examples.

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Apart from the northerly portion of the Waverley Route (heavily subsidised) I can barely think of any outside the imaginations of placard wavers, be they politicians or gricers, that have actually happened.

Which just proves your deeply ingrained negativity. Assuming- deliberately and knowingly- I only meant relaid lines when I said reopened ones. Try South Wales, Midlands and Southern Scotland for starters. Other intact lines are the subject of official backing. Wisbech, Okehampton, most obviously, Bicester-Bedford. Why did you 'forget' about Bedford-Cambridge? Many never closed lines are heavily subsidised also. By your logic, they should all be abandoned.

Brush 4 mentions the Dartmoor LIne. Only part is in regular use and the remainder survives because it has supporters and is used as test track. In fact many tourist lines - some with a more heritage aspect than others - survive purely because its supporters freely denote money for their upkeep. Those with a sense of purpose and direction will continue, providing they do not get carried away with unhelpful schemes mostly seen though rose tinted glasses. Others will struggle, some falling by the wayside as restrictions and legislation exhaust their income.

I know linking the WSR to the mainline is fraught with problems but are they insurmountable? Could a new station (a la Smallbrook Junction) be built at Norton Fitzwarren ?

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If anything happens re the WSR and connecting to Taunton in the next few years it will be along the lines of GWR stopping services to Taunton being extended to Bishops Lydeard for cross platform interchange with the WSR. This is 100% possible from an infrastructure point of view as it has already happened on special occasions. Whether GWR can deliver and whether it makes financial sense is a different matter. I understand Norton Fitzwarren is unsuitable for an interchange for several important reasons (on a tight curve, road access, ground conditions?) and given the current issues on the WSR I don't think there's any money for this sort of thing, it's all needed for the current infrastructure etc.

So Bishops Lydeard interchange is really the only game in town for the forseeable future; but only likely to happen as a very limited service in the high season, perhaps if GWR thought they could make money or at least break even using existing stock and crew and charging a premuim for Taunton to BL so they could do it at no cost to the WSR.

As regards main-line connections, to most people, a preserved railway is purely an attraction to visit, like the seaside, the adventure park, the shopping centre, etc. and they will no more think of using the train to reach a preserved railway than they would to get to any other attraction. So, while there is no doubt that a main-line connection will bring in additional traffic, it will only bring in significant numbers where there are a lot of people used to travelling by train to get to places. That is why the Bluebell's extension to East Grinstead was so successful, because it tapped into the London commuter market: a large number of people who automatically think of using the train/tube to get to where they want to go. Likewise the SVR and the K&WVR, whose connections tap into the significant Birmingham and Leeds commuter markets. Compare those with the EVR's connection at Duffield, or the FR's connection at Blaenau Ffestiniog, both of which undoubtedly bring in useful numbers of passengers, but not significant numbers, because very few people in those areas are used to travelling by train to get somewhere.

If you double the length of your line, then roughly speaking, you double your costs. You have twice as much infrastructure to maintain, and to keep running the same frequency of service you will likely need to run twice as many trains. So, unless you double your income, you will lose money by extending. Doubling the fare would not be enough - a significant proportion of most lines' incomes comes from sales, and most people will not buy twice as many Thomas toys and eat twice as many sandwiches just because the ride takes twice as long.

Bearing in mind that joe public just sees you as an attraction to visit, competing with all sorts of other attractions for his money, increasing your entrance fee is going to make you less competitive compared to the other local attractions. As has already been pointed out, increasing the length of the journey may also make your line less attractive, e.g. to families with little children, who may decide not to do the full trip.

The extensions that pay for themselves are those that bring in significant numbers of extra passengers, and their extra revenue, because they make the railway more attractive to visit (e.g. because they take you somewhere interesting), or make it easier to visit (the mainline connection).

The Ffestiniog and Welsh Highland Railways are an interesting case, in that the Welsh Highland was not built as an extension of the FR, and they are deliberately marketed as separate entities, rather than one long railway.

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As an aside, does anyone know if the proposed extension to Bala Town follows the route of the old GW standard gauge line; and is the new station on the same site as the station closed in the 60's?

Could the West Somerset Railway trains run to and from Taunton using the same method as the Swanage Railway running trains to and from Wareham which started recently? Surely this would be fairly simple to arrange?

Could the West Somerset Railway trains run to and from Taunton using the same method as the Swanage Railway running trains to and from Wareham which started recently? Surely this would be fairly simple to arrange?

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I think there's a lack of capacity on the long stretch between the junction and Taunton station, with a very expensive set of alterations (including slewing the mainline under the bridge at Silk Mills) to accommodate a dedicated line alongside the mains.
Plus the added costs of having mainline registered stock etc.

Wow, that looks like a great and sensible extension plan. I visited last year and it felt a bit like a ride from nowhere to nowhere. Starting and finishing in the town makes a lot more sense. Fantastic website. I noticed mention of the new town station being located near the existing car-park

I feel I must have already contributed to the coffers as I had a footplate ride from Bala to Llanuwchllyn on Winifred last year. Wasn't cheap but well worth it; will remember that ride for many years. Best wishes to the Railway getting the extension approved and built.

Could the West Somerset Railway trains run to and from Taunton using the same method as the Swanage Railway running trains to and from Wareham which started recently? Surely this would be fairly simple to arrange?

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It's not simple. It's taken many years and some big grants for the Swanage Railway to be in this position, and even given time and money there's no guarantee that NR would agree at all for WSR services to regularly run into Taunton (crossing the mainline and occupying platforms) given that Taunton is *much* busier than Wareham (e.g. 1100-1200 today: 4 services through Wareham, 10 through/to Taunton.
It would be a bit different if the relevant Taunton bay and line to access it from the WSR hadn't been removed and then made near-impossible to reinstate by subsequent changes.

The 'simple' solution is to extend some mainline GWR stopping services from Taunton to Bishops Lydeard for a cross-platform interchange with the WSR services, this has already happened for special events and there has been talk of this happening more regularly either this or next year (but there's nothing definite in the public domain yet as far as I know).

It's not simple. It's taken many years and some big grants for the Swanage Railway to be in this position, and even given time and money there's no guarantee that NR would agree at all for WSR services to regularly run into Taunton (crossing the mainline and occupying platforms) given that Taunton is *much* busier than Wareham (e.g. 1100-1200 today: 4 services through Wareham, 10 through/to Taunton.
It would be a bit different if the relevant Taunton bay and line to access it from the WSR hadn't been removed and then made near-impossible to reinstate by subsequent changes.

The 'simple' solution is to extend some mainline GWR stopping services from Taunton to Bishops Lydeard for a cross-platform interchange with the WSR services, this has already happened for special events and there has been talk of this happening more regularly either this or next year (but there's nothing definite in the public domain yet as far as I know).

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On the day I travelled to Corfe Castle on the limited SWR service last year the service was very busy. I'd definitely visit WSR this year if GWR can put on a service from Taunton for Bishops'.

I have heard about long term plans to extend the Bluebell Railway from Horsted Keynes to Ardingly and then use the existing freight only line from Ardingly to Haywards Heath which would then allow through trains to run between Haywards Heath and East Grinstead stations. There has even been talk about electrifying the line with third rail to allow through electric trains to run. This extension would probably be worth the money and effort as it would allow Southern Rail to divert their trains between Haywards Heath and East Grinstead when there is engineering work on the Brighton Main Line between Haywards Heath and Three Bridges stations. I imagine that the Bluebell Railway could make a huge amount of money out of this considering how often the Brighton Main Line is closed for engineering work. It would also attract more visitors now that there would be two different connections with National Rail services. Hopefully this may happen at some point in the future.

It is a rare example of a Southern electric line that was closed. So, re-electrifying it would be authentic but, crucially would finally give all these preserved EMU's that are scattered all over the place, a home and a line to run on without diesel help. It probably needs the Ardingly stone terminal to close, before it could happen, as there needs to be a stabling point for the units, for which there yard would do nicely. I didn't realise until looking on Sat image that it has a separate line down to Haywards Heath sta. thus allowing parallel running Eridge style.

The diversion route is a good point as well, better than bus chaos as seen this very week. (Mmm, I know it was a different part of the line, principle is the same though.)