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At most these horses would have only been in their paddock a couple of hours per day. Some horses are very finicky about their water and will refuse to drink it at times. I suggest that most of their water intake would have been in their boxes.

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At most these horses would have only been in their paddock a couple of hours per day. Some horses are very finicky about their water and will refuse to drink it at times. I suggest that most of their water intake would have been in their boxes.

You would suggest a professional horse trainer that charges a lot of $ per month for training fees would be 100% sure the water their horses have access to would be clean and tested. It's amateur hour at its finest if you actually believe their 'story'. Personally I think you would have to be rather naive to think this is the actual reason. Can't wait to learn more from the RIU!

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No , this is a very, very plausible submission that has avoided the heavy handed highbrow approach........ that you would expect from such a well armed and well connected defence team. The dumbing down ploy brings it closer to its being possible through its simplicity.

So the defendants now should be made to prove that these results could have been generated by such means.

Ivan, I think you will find that it is the prosecution that has to prove the results could have been generated by such means.The defence know this,which gives them time and leverage.Beyond resonable doub't springs to mind

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Guest 2Admin2

Guest 2Admin2

Oh, and when and if did anyone at RIU learn that the cattle in the food chain [Milk] were full of cobalt? Did they then advise the authorities? If not, and those cows produced milk within a commercial diary someone at RIU could face very serious charges. Fonterra will be watching wont they? A scandal waiting to hit the news, China, repercussions, where's Nathan Guy? he'll need to make a statement, cmon Nathan, happy face mate.

Biff you are talking absolute irrational crap. Where was it said the cattle were dairy cows? In any event if a cow and a horse drank the same volume of water from the same cobalt dosed tank they would return completely different test results.

The cow as a ruminant would convert the cobalt it needed to B12 much more efficiently than the horse. What it didn't need it would have pissed or shat away.

The horse as a monogastric animal is much less efficient at cobalt conversion to B12. It is very conceivable that the horse would test much higher than the cow.

Also there are many approved feed supplements and water treatments that contain comparatively high levels of cobalt that are used in the human food chain.

Do some research first before joining the hysteria driven ignorant group of screaming banshees looking for blood.

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Guest 2Admin2

Guest 2Admin2

You would suggest a professional horse trainer that charges a lot of $ per month for training fees would be 100% sure the water their horses have access to would be clean and tested. It's amateur hour at its finest if you actually believe their 'story'. Personally I think you would have to be rather naive to think this is the actual reason. Can't wait to learn more from the RIU!

Are you serious? Why infer a distinction between a professional trainer and an amateur? The implication being they should all be testing their water on a regular basis?

Also note the water was clean from bacteria and algae due to the treatment. A constant battle I might add for anyone looking after livestock in the summer months.

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NZ Racing reminds me of every episode of Yes Minister, however, one was funny, one isn't........it also reminds me of the late, not so great Victoria Racing Club and it's old boys mantra. NZ's reputation on the global stage is not good, racing wise that is, the racing minister helps with that perception, Mr John Allen, AKA The Invisible Man, our esteemed CEO, blame shifting on Peter's radio show, ''Not us, it's the RIU''........ the lifeless, impotent NZTA, The self interest groups, the ineffectual owners assoc and finally, but not least, the useless lame duck racing writers [I loathe to call them journalists as they are not] are all passengers on the Titanic AKA NZ Racing. Peter Earley to his credit, at least challenges the issues, however, the stable involved here, in the current cobalt controversy is, until found guilty of something more sinister, guilty of supreme stupidity and negligence, it will be the RIU who will have a case to answer should this diary herd have provided milk or by products with excessive cobalt within to or for public consumption. If they knowingly withheld such info that was provided to them by the stable, then all hell should break loose, China will have Fonterra's guts for garters.

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Biff you are talking absolute irrational crap. Where was it said the cattle were dairy cows? In any event if a cow and a horse drank the same volume of water from the same cobalt dosed tank they would return completely different test results.

The cow as a ruminant would convert the cobalt it needed to B12 much more efficiently than the horse. What it didn't need it would have pissed or shat away.

The horse as a monogastric animal is much less efficient at cobalt conversion to B12. It is very conceivable that the horse would test much higher than the cow.

Also there are many approved feed supplements and water treatments that contain comparatively high levels of cobalt that are used in the human food chain.

Do some research first before joining the hysteria driven ignorant group of screaming banshees looking for blood.

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I heard a couple of them haven't been milked since. Evidently can outrun the cattle dog.

While not as precise as I'd like, it's certainly a clever and effective administration method, especially if you can then convince the RIU that it's not an administration method and it was all an unfortunate accident. I somehow doubt the Oz stewards would be quite so easily convinced.

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Boarding elsewhere or being paddock-trained the day before the Derby? .This scenario proffered and supposedly accepted by Grierson testing is the ultimate insult to intelligent racing folk.

I doubt Grierson accepted the scenario or not. That was for the RIU to establish. Grierson, as I understand it, simply showed that horses drinking water with high doses of added cobalt could exceed the threshold.

The incredible thing is that testing should have taken weeks, maybe a month or two to complete. Why has it taken a year for any charges to be brought or the application made to relegate the horses?

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I doubt Grierson accepted the scenario or not. That was for the RIU to establish. Grierson, as I understand it, simply showed that horses drinking water with high doses of added cobalt could exceed the threshold.

The incredible thing is that testing should have taken weeks, maybe a month or two to complete. Why has it taken a year for any charges to be brought or the application made to relegate the horses?

It took so long Leggy as they had to dig up Hans Christian Anderson and then translate from Danish.......Jacques Tati couldn't have devised this........it has to be a fairy tale not a comedy.

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Guest 2Admin2

Guest 2Admin2

How long were the cattle sharing the trough?......I bet these cattle are now knackered, you lot show your small town mentality and old boys club....get a life, in fact get out and get a few

Really Biff? Didn't you get out of the "big town" but you bought an attitude with it. You are spouting unsubstantiated clap trap without any understanding of the science. Suggest you do some reading regarding cows and cobalt levels.

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I have not seen or heard anything or in fact know anything to suggest that their defence would not be plausible in a court of law, but then i'm not an expert and certainly won't be called upon by any side as a witness.