When chains aren’t cheaper

A Facebook post from Gavel Grille in Hudson Falls makes a great case for the good values available from locally owned restaurants:

We serve a bare basic Kobe Burger, all fresh, never frozen premium beef with house truffle French Fries on a large toasted Asiago Chiabatta Roll that we bake fresh. Sounds delicious for $8.95. All that included. Yes you can add toppings for additional money. Yes we have specialty burgers for more, but we don’t hide charges!

LET’S LOOK AT OUR COMPETITION (AND THE MANY FRANCHISES THAT PEOPLE LOVE TO FREQUENT BECAUSE THEY ARE GETTING SUCH A GREAT DEAL).

60 Responses

Chains are almost never a better value. I spend at least $40 – 50 if I take my family (2 adults, 2 children) to Friendly’s, Red Robin or Chili’s. For the same or less money I can eat at just about any independent casual restaurant in the Capital Region and get better food / service. The primary thing to remember when discussion chains is that there is something else you are paying for besides the food – CONSISTENCY. Theoretically you should be able to get the same dish at an Applebee’s in Albany that you would get in Chicago. Yes, it is somewhat overpriced mediocre food – but it is the SAME overpriced mediocre food that you are used to. No need to worry that the little hole in the wall restaurant might not have something that you can (or are willing to) eat.

I feel this way as well. Our sandwich and salad prices are comparable to Panera Bread, but with actual artisan bread not refrigerated and trucked. Actual fresh (local) ingredients, without added dough conditioners, preservatives, gmos, hormones, antibiotics. We don’t have the advertising budget of a big chain, though. Our portions may not be as large and we don’t serve meat, but our meals are more nutritionally dense since there are no fillers and artificial ingredients so there’s no need to gorge. And they are prepared with extreme care by one or two people from beginning to end. Thank you Gavel Grill for bringing up this topic!

to me “consistency” means “added crap”. i’d rather experience variations occurring through nature and preparation choice by the chef than the same burger from Boston to San Francisco courtesy of “added crap”. i will also take a smaller portion of something local any day (nevermind that most restaurant meals, particularly at chains, are daily caloric intake hogs)

local businesses deserve our patronage – support them and you support your neighbors, your city/town, and if they utilise it (like AllGood) local suppliers and farmers – the trickle-down from locally owned businesses is far more beneficial than salaries/etc paid by the chains

I think that’s a great job by Gravel Grille to point that out. But, I think people prefer chains not because they are necessarily cheaper, but we’re taught to prefer large national brands from a young age and we equate that recognition with consistency/quality/safety. I’m not saying that chains provide any of that, but it’s what many people believe.

I love the local flavor cafe in Watervliet on rt 2. Great food generous portions high quality ingredients… On the meat scale it sits between panera and Carnegie delli. Cap City Gastropub is another favorite with great prouducts at reasonable prices.

Chains do offer consistency, whatever else their (many) shortcomings. Especially when traveling, someone who sees a familiar name (from McDonald’s to Ruth’s Chris) is inclined to choose what they know to the unknown.

Even locally, consistency sells. Cost is a relative idea–if someone spends $50 in Applebees, they know what they are going to get. If they spend $40 in a local restaurant, but the food stinks, the fact they spent less is irrelevant.

Personally, I prefer trying new, and running the risk of disappointment, because more often the experience is a good one. But it’s hard to fight people’s preference for safe.

While I have to agree with the local/independent restaurants in this particular case, let’s not turn this into an “evil chains are ripping everyone off” argument. Some chains are good; others are horrible, but sometimes, people simply want the familiar.

Chains offer consistently bland, overpriced food that is full of salt and chemicals, so there is your consistent logic.

No reason today to go to a chain restaurant whatsover, even if you have children. Gone are the days that local pubs/restaurants looked down on families patronizing their establishments. Today, all local restaurants welcome families with open arms. My neighbors/friends have 2 children, 8 & 11. They eat at the Orchard, Martel’s, TJ’s and the Fountain, just to name a few of the local Albany eateries. Not a chain in sight in their food list. Heavy media marketing is the only reason that people go to the chains.

IMO, locally owned restaurants are always a better deal because there is an incentive for the owner to care about the quality of service and food. Why would a manager at “name your chain” restaurant care, they’re just an employee and have little invested.

On a slightly separate note, I used to think that the number of chain “restaurants” in our area was a poor reflection on us, but now I’m okay with it because it’s keeps me comfortably insulated from the hoi polloi while dining out.

High Quality American Kobe Beef and Fullblood Wagyu Beef in America, Most Wagyu is 100% Raised and finished on private ranches and not on commercial feed lots. They do not use any antibioitics or other non-natural methods to finish cattle. They use the Finest Top Marbling Wagyu Bloodlines Available in the world. Wagyu Beef a.k.a Kobe Beef is a unique beef which is predisposed to have intense marbling, buttery taste and tenderness, Wagyu Beef taste unlike any other breed. Most Wagyu Cattle are directly descendant from Kobe Beef Cattle in Japan and Australia.

High Quality American Kobe Beef and Fullblood Wagyu Beef in America, Most Wagyu is 100% Raised and finished on private ranches and not on commercial feed lots. They do not use any antibioitics or other non-natural methods to finish cattle. They use the Finest Top Marbling Wagyu Bloodlines Available in the world. Wagyu Beef a.k.a Kobe Beef is a unique beef which is predisposed to have intense marbling, buttery taste and tenderness, Wagyu Beef taste unlike any other breed. Most Wagyu Cattle are directly descendant from Kobe Beef Cattle in Japan and Australia.

Aside from the chain restaurant vs independents issue, one cannot get a burger made from Kobe beef for $8.95….not $18.95…not at all in this country.unless you ground an $85 piece of steak and made a burger. That’s why we hear/read of Kobe burgers going for $100. I don’t doubt that this restaurant believes they’re serving Kobe beef, and it may be a fantastic burger, it’s just not Kobe beef. There are a couple of good pieces on the Kobe beef “scam” in the April 12 and Sept 28 2012 FORBES magazine.

While I agree with the notion of supporting local businesses over chains, it’s laughable to think that all these local places in the area are actually using good, high-quality, fresh ingredients. Why else would you find freezer-burned food, vegetables clearly from cans, or piles of Sysco boxes in a restaurant?

The distinction should be made between places like All Good Bakers, where the folks behind the enterprise really do care about quality, and many other places in the area that are serving you frozen food no better than what you’d get at a chain.

@non_foodie: Ah, that’s far too reasonable of a response. As soon as I saw this post I knew that Steve was playing to that vocal part of his audience that believes with every fiber of their being that all chains are always crap, no exceptions. This argument is perfectly encapsulated in the comment immediately after yours.

And if I ever find myself in Hudson Falls, I’ll be sure to AVOID Gavel Grille. It’s obvious from that attitude-laden Facebook post that they feel they are God’s gift to dining, which means they’re probably mediocre at best and highly sensitive to any criticism.

I didn’t “perfectly encapsulate” anything because I do not believe what you write. I find some chains to be quite good. I was commenting on the fact that numerous others were saying the appeal of chains lies in their consistency, even if they are consistently terrible.

The answer is to “shop around,” just like we do for anything else. If a local restaurant has the best deal, take advantage. Many local places are sensitive to their customers’ economic needs and offer great deals (I LOVE the mid-week takeout deals that a lot of local restaurants have been offering).

If a chain floats your boat (and some DO have good deals), then jump on and put on your life jacket!

zack #25 – Just as not all independently-owned restaurants are good, neither are all chain/franchise restaurants bad. I selectively eat at both independents and chains. I have had good and bad experiences at both.

As someone who travels extensively for business, I value consistency highly. I usually eat more meals in restaurants than at home by a large margin and am usually out of town 70-75% of the time, it’s important for me to find something I can be reasonably sure is what I expect AND get get in and out quickly, that is worth a LOT to me. Also, since I almost always dine alone, knowing what to expect is very important to me.

Want incentive to eat local (other than it’s the right thing to do)? Get a deck of “City DIning Cards” – a deck of 50 discount cards for $10 off $30 at locally owned restaurants. Look it up on Google. I got a deck for a gift and I love it! Eat local!

Let’s not forget the ‘Chain” distributors like SYSCO and US FOODS that support these expensive chain restaurants. Don’t forget to consider the local NY. based distributors like Reliable, Ginsberg’s, Quandts and produce companies and dairy. Let them have a crack at your business.

To be fair The entire FB post should have been on here. The owner was complaining because someone gave them feedback on how good the food is but found it to be expensive. The owner then goes on to knock another local business, who has been successful for years with several business. Here is he full post:

So someone said to us we love your delicious food but you are a bit too expensive. I always take that the wrong way as being a small business person. Our food is all homemade, nothing frozen, good portions (and then some), great atmosphere.

So let’s do a little comparison…

We serve a bare basic Kobe Burger, all fresh, never frozen premium beef with house truffle French Fries on a large toasted Asiago Chiabatta Roll that we bake fresh. Sounds delicious for $8.95. All that included. Yes you can add toppings for additional money. Yes we have specialty burgers for more, but we don’t hide charges!

LET’S LOOK AT OUR COMPETITION (AND THE MANY FRANCHISES THAT PEOPLE LOVE TO FREQUENT BECAUSE THEY ARE GETTING SUCH A GREAT DEAL).

I can go on and on…We serve Fresh Pasta, Fresh Everything, and serve a healthy portion of wine! Our Burger Night on Thursday includes a beer or wine for $12.95. NOT BAD…The most expensive thing on our menu is $24.95. So do some research and determine what others are charging and what you are really getting for your money.

In addition, we usually put a coupon in a local newspaper or facebook weekly.
WE HAVE A PUB, SO YOU DON’T HAVE TO SIT IN THE DINING ROOM, SAME MENU, CASUAL ATMOSPHERE WITH TVS, GAMES.
JUST SAYING…

I try to go to independent restaurants whenever I can – however, sometimes they are just not an option – recently I was in Florida in the Tampa airport and went to a TGI Fridays for lunch there because you know what you are getting – one thing I noticed at chains though is that they fill the plate with fries to keep costs down – I think we are so conditioned at seeing a mound of fries that if we go to an independent (and usually better place) the portions seem small

I honestly feel that if Applebee’s were to PAY ME $50 to eat their crap I really don’t think that I could do it! Are people really this stupid?? Do people really still “run into TGIF’s” for lunch?Wow that is such a terrifying thought…still wonder why Americans are so fat??

BFS: You sure have a deep amount of hatred for Applebee’s. Did you get food poisoning there? Did a server personally insult you? Were you beat up in the parking lot? I mean come on! There are dozens of chains to pick on. How about Pizza Hut, Papa John’s, etc. attempting to serve their mediocre or worse product when there are at least 100 independently owned and operated pizzerias in the region, if not more?No, Applebee’s fare is not gourmet food, but they do a great deal of charitable work in the area, including hosting fundraisers for school athletic teams and various other causes, and lots of kids in their teens prefer to eat at fast-food outlets and chains; just a fact of life. And even MacDonald’s, the pinnacle of “evil” fast-food chains, has revised its menu to offer salads and more nutritious alternatives, granted bulk and processed. But the market is evolving. As others have stated, chains fill a niche which is why they remain in business. Not my personal cup of tea, but I’m not preaching to others who have the freedom to make their own choices. It’s attitudes like yours that turn people off because it comes off as so arrogantly superior. Obviously, a degree of snobbery comes with the territory in this blog, but your harsh judgments o0f people are IMHO, unwarranted. Enjoy your smug little world where everything you do is perfect.

To the other frequent travelers: where is the fun (and health) in eating at “chains you know”?
I find that searching for and experiencing great, unique local places is what makes the trips more enjoyable (plus I don’t have to run as much).. for every bad experience I’ve had, I’ve had 6 others that were better than a national chain meal and 3 others that blew the doors off the best national chain meal I’ve ever had.. plus chains typically don’t have the beer selection I desire..

BFS, I go to Friday’s for lunch now and then. I never realized I was so stupid until reading your post. Thanks for enlightening me. Although I’m not fat yet, I’ll keep eating there until I am. I would rather have an enlarged waistline over a bloated head such as yours.

Good reply, LJ. While I don’t care for Friday’s, I like Ninety-nine, Cheesecake factory, (some things are very good) and Macaroni Grill. I mostly go to locally-owned restaurants, but sometimes a chain restaurant with no surprises works well.

I feel bad for people in really small/rural towns that don’t have the local variety to choose from that a lot of us get to experience. I’ve been to places in West Virginia and South Carolina that have a chain supermarket, a Burger King and either Red Lobster or Olive Garden…and that’s pretty much it.

As rough as my upbringing may have been, I’m thankful that I got to experience those years in New York City, where you had to go out of your way to find a chain. We grew up on local bakeries and restaurants that were on the same block or in the same building, dishing out local/ethnic food for 20 years before we were born.

Comment #3 is why I will always support and promote AGB. Good, quality people putting out good, quality product.

Everyone is preaching, ‘Death to chains!’ but let’s see what the wait looks like at Olive Garden, Red Lobster, Macaroni Grill and Cheesecake Factory in a little over two weeks, on Valentine’s Day. Some of you romantic gentlemen will be sitting right there, across from your wife, ordering some of that same old prepared bs you do every year around this time.

Say what you want on here, anonymously, but deep down, you know you’re full of sh!t. And so do the chains, that’s why you’ll never hear any of their PR reps commenting on topics like this. They know when push comes to shove, whether you’re a regular or only visit on Valentine’s Day/Mother’s Day/Anniversaries, chances are, your little butt will be firmly seated in one of their comfy chairs, Made in Indonesia, of course.

I totally understand the positive issues of buying local. This past weekend, I made a concerted effort to do so, and also committed to trying a couple of new places in the area. Saturday, around noon,I went to a place that has been open for about 2 weeks. It advertises its support of local farms and suppliers for nearly everything on the menu. I had the gobbler sandwich- smoked sliced turkey breast/cheese/mushrooms on rye, thrown in a panini press. Frankly,I was not impressed. No more than 2 thin slices of turkey in that sandwich. A little flavor would have been most welcome. It was served with some processed vegetable and air chips that totally lacked flavor. For over $9.00 for the sandwich, I expected a bit more, and was unhappy to walk away hungry. Sorry, those air chips were inedible. And if this bistro fails, it will be because of the weird staffing level. They can not afford to carry 10 employees at a time (I counted), and the worst of it is that even with that level of staffing, I couldn’t get my water glass refilled. And it needed to be filled, since that sandwich was DRY. (Maybe we need a local supplier of mayonaise?)
On Monday morning, we ended up at another new place- this one has been open a few months. The menu offered a basic omelet, with a list of additions for $1.50 each. My partner in crime ordered the basic omelet plus swiss cheese. I ordered a standard omelet combination off the menu. I also had a cup of coffee. When the bill came, the upcharge for the swiss cheese was $2.50, not the advertised $1.50. I was charged $2.00 for the (small) cup of coffee, plus another $2.00 for the partial refill I received towards the end of the meal. Umm, not feeling the love from this place.
I’m specifically not mentioning the names of the places because sadly these bad business practices don’t just happen at those 2 addresses. They shouldn’t happen anywhere. Business owners who want to be successful will pay attention to these details because they will want me to come back as a repeat customer. In both these cases, they’ve lost my future business. I do have other dining options.
For all their failings, the chains do a fair amount of quality control of their operations as a matter of course. Local restaurant operators could take a lesson out of the chain business playbooks and learn some valuable lessons about how to keep customers coming back.

I ate at a place called Comfort Food in Saratoga Springs on Broadway. Amazing natural burger and the price was not outrageous.

The debate between local and chain restaurants boils down to misconception that natural food is more expensive. Not necessarily true in all cases.

I’ve said it before that chain restaurants offer consistency and at least the guarantee for people they know what their food will taste like. This way of thinking is not for everyone but it does exist.

esooG,
Nope, not happening. How uninspiring that one could even think Olive Garden or Cheesecake Factory could be a romantic place for Valentines Day. I would rather cook that meal myself. If my husband brought me to one of those places for any occasion I would think 1. that he was suffering from some sort of dementia or 2. he was trying to pick a fight.

Sorry to say, but it seems like the gavel grille still thinks they are in Saratoga with the prices that are charging. Chains not only offer consistency in food, but also in hours of operation. Most mom and pops in the area seem to open and close when they feel like it. Very annoying when you are trying to plan a night out. Why bother having hours if your not going to follow them. You go to a chain that says they serve till 11Pm and you show up at 11pm, 99% of the time you will be served. h and the beef at TGIF is Black Angus.

For me, if I’m going to spend money eating out, I’m going to a place I’ve been before, and I’m going to order something I’ve had before and liked. No way I’m wasting money on something I won’t like or be able to eat. In my experience, chains are more likely to comp my meal or fix my food than local establishments. I do have a few local places that I enjoy. I also enjoy a few select chain restaurants.

The last time I had lunch with my daughter at Red Lobster it cost me over $40. We had two sodas, an appetizer and two lunches. The app and the entrees were carb heavy and I was struck by how much it was. I thought about how concerned chains are about their Profit and Loss statements and how they have contest among staff to push appetizers and drinks from the bar to push up sales. In the end, our meal wasn’t that great and was overpriced. I wish I had gone to Scotti’s in Niskayuna instead or some place like that…Cornells, Cafe Nola…It would’ve been a better lunch at the same or lower price.

For those who travel a lot and are worried about possibly having a bad meal at a local restaurant, download the Yelp Ap! I have had so many wonderful meal in tiny towns (less than 1000 ppl population) thanks to this ap!

Have any of you burger lover’s been to Sutter’s lately? I work near it and have had lunch there twice in the last two months. The burgers and the service have been terrible both times. Are they under new ownership? Used to be a great place for a burger..

When I eat out, I make every effort (most of the time) to try something I haven’t had before – or even thought of, if possible. That usually works fine, especially at places like Ala Shanghai where the quality is first rate and the care spent on the food by the chef is high.

Sometimes I eat at chains, but not too often. Then I may look for something new or something familiar. It’s a little hard to have a new experience somewhere like the Chipotle Grill.

Mickey, you weren’t replying to my post, but I HAVE gotten sick after eating at Applebees. That was in Syracuse. I really never wanted to go to one again but I went to one locally with my sister and her family. They could not get our orders right to save their lives, and even when we got what we ordered, it was awful. I agree that privately owned restaurants are preferable to chains, but if I have to eat at a chain, any chain is preferable to Applebees.

SP, some people have more tender, sweet young stomachs than others. That, of course, goes without saying.

That being said (eat your heart out, whoever), I’ve eaten at Applebee’s a fair amount and have NEVER gotten sick. What’s more, the ones I’ve patronized have always done very well distinguishing my orders from others, and the food has been quite good for what it is.

I vote for a happy medium, based mostly on taste and quality taking precedence over price. I have had great and not-so-great to downright terrible meals at chains and indie restaurants alike. Believe it or not, there really are a few chains (mostly not around here… yet) that have served me a delicious and satisfying meal in more than one location, meals that I’d go out of my way to eat again. Some chains (that seem to be extremely popular) have only ever served me an overpriced, under-flavored mess on a consistent basis, and I will never visit again. Exact same can be said of the local indies too. Price points are often negligible between the two these days in my experience.

Also, folks seem to cite consistency as a main factor of chain success, however I find store management to be a stronger factor. Chain establishments can and do vary considerably from location to location much of the time, and this has everything to do with how the building and its staff are managed or mismanaged.