Because we keep paying billions in "loans" which will never be paid back.

The concept of solving a debt problem with more debt is ridiculous. Everyone in Europe (and Asia and North America) deserves to get burned. Problem of course is the banks are the people running the world and they will get burned worst. Privatize profits and socialize losses - great business if you can get it. Remember when the threats were hurled at Iceland about not taking a bailout? That has turned out great for Iceland as they are one of the strongest European economies right now. No one except the banks will prosper until the old debt is removed from the system but that actually requires someone to take a loss.... which is forbidden in today's mark-to-fantasy accounting practices.

The concept of solving a debt problem with more debt is ridiculous. Everyone in Europe (and Asia and North America) deserves to get burned. Problem of course is the banks are the people running the world and they will get burned worst. Privatize profits and socialize losses - great business if you can get it. Remember when the threats were hurled at Iceland about not taking a bailout? That has turned out great for Iceland as they are one of the strongest European economies right now. No one except the banks will prosper until the old debt is removed from the system but that actually requires someone to take a loss.... which is forbidden in today's mark-to-fantasy accounting practices.

*end rant*

Well, don't know if everyone deserves to get burned. There is not much one can do against it. It's really annoying that, at first, the politicians say that the money will come back. Of course we all knew it wouldn't and now we have been guaranteed it won't. Even more annoying is that 'they' think it's good practice to lie and say that the money will come back because they don't want to instabalize markets and the citizins viewed as consumers. Politicians have to stay optimistic because otherwise what they say will negatively influence the economy. So lying has become the moral better choice...

Well, don't know if everyone deserves to get burned. There is not much one can do against it. It's really annoying that, at first, the politicians say that the money will come back. Of course we all knew it wouldn't and now we have been guaranteed it won't. Even more annoying is that 'they' think it's good practice to lie and say that the money will come back because they don't want to instabalize markets and the citizins viewed as consumers. Politicians have to stay optimistic because otherwise what they say will negatively influence the economy. So lying has become the moral better choice...

The people who made the loans deserve to get burned. If you lend someone money, the interest you receive is the reward for your risk. If they cannot repay the loan, the lender takes back whatever assets they can and if they cannot they lose all they lend.

Iceland is what Europe should be modelling.

There is going to be unstable markets at some point. The more debt created will only make the market more unstable whenever the stack of cards comes tumbling down. All western countries (Europe, North America) are living beyond their means. The problem is no one wants to address this.

There will be no growth and therefore there will be no getting out of the current mess until the bad debt is written off. Sure it is going to hurt, it is going to hurt like hell, but it will also start a true recovery. Decades of debt piling up cannot go on forever. We are approaching the end.

The people who made the loans deserve to get burned. If you lend someone money, the interest you receive is the reward for your risk. If they cannot repay the loan, the lender takes back whatever assets they can and if they cannot they lose all they lend.

Iceland is what Europe should be modelling.

There is going to be unstable markets at some point. The more debt created will only make the market more unstable whenever the stack of cards comes tumbling down. All western countries (Europe, North America) are living beyond their means. The problem is no one wants to address this.

There will be no growth and therefore there will be no getting out of the current mess until the bad debt is written off. Sure it is going to hurt, it is going to hurt like hell, but it will also start a true recovery. Decades of debt piling up cannot go on forever. We are approaching the end.

But we're doing a lot of piling up at the end. With all the bailing out one has to wonder if banks and other financial institutions will become anymore responsible with their investments. Especially because the Bryan Colangelo's at the top are looking out for their own jobs instead of the long term succes of the company. Short term succes usually is much more 'rewarding'.

But we're doing a lot of piling up at the end. With all the bailing out one has to wonder if banks and other financial institutions will become anymore responsible with their investments. Especially because the Bryan Colangelo's at the top are looking out for their own jobs instead of the long term succes of the company. Short term succes usually is much more 'rewarding'.

The financial world is fixed in a two-step process:

1) Reintroduce Glass-Steagall in to US banking,
2) start making those who approved loans eat their losses and end the bail outs,
3) bring back mark-to-market accounting.

Just got to reading this thread and watching the video now. The competition looks decent, but this kid looks incredible. Even the weaknesses provided look like a bit of a stretch. I'll be fascinated to see where he is in a couple years' time. Hopefully in a Raps' uniform.

Thanks for the link. I'm curious to know something. This article, when I run it through google translate, states the following:

Even the last stiigmi seems that the Greek State avoids blunder and a window in citizenship law, brothers Antetokoumpo likely to gain permanent residence permit and a Greek passport, to form and real capital of Greek basketball. The meeting of the G.Vasilakopoulou Stylianidis lit the "green" light and soon both John and Thanasis Antetokoumpo will soon hold a Greek passport.

It is known issue. Both of the two brothers, although they were born in Greece, have grown up in Athens can not have citizenship.

So, that would mean that he does not have Greek citizenship, and is not eligible for Greek citizenship, but instead is being issued permanent resident cards and passports. What confuses me is that you've argued on this thread that he actually already has Greek citizenship and berated others for not acknowledging that (in this post, for example, and this one). Perhaps google translated it wrong and the section that was translated as 'cannot have citizenship' should have been translated as 'already has citizenship'? But then, if he already has citizenship, I don't understand why he'd need a permanent residence permit, unless that too has been mistranslated?

Please understand, I don't care in the least what his citizenship status is. If he plays for the Greek national team, whether as a full citizen or a permanent resident, good for him, and best of luck to the entire team! But his citizenship seems to be of great importance to you, so I just thought you might want to know that the translated version of the article you posted seems to be spreading information that is incorrect, according to your own version of the events.

Thanks for the link. I'm curious to know something. This article, when I run it through google translate, states the following:

So, that would mean that he does not have Greek citizenship, and is not eligible for Greek citizenship, but instead is being issued permanent resident cards and passports. What confuses me is that you've argued on this thread that he actually already has Greek citizenship and berated others for not acknowledging that (in this post, for example, and this one). Perhaps google translated it wrong and the section that was translated as 'cannot have citizenship' should have been translated as 'already has citizenship'? But then, if he already has citizenship, I don't understand why he'd need a permanent residence permit, unless that too has been mistranslated?

Please understand, I don't care in the least what his citizenship status is. If he plays for the Greek national team, whether as a full citizen or a permanent resident, good for him, and best of luck to the entire team! But his citizenship seems to be of great importance to you, so I just thought you might want to know that the translated version of the article you posted seems to be spreading information that is incorrect, according to your own version of the events.

Basilis is full of shit. But its hilarious when he flips out on us when he's actually the one spitting BS all over the forums. I still don't know why he's on a Raptors forum. We don't have a single Greek Player on the team unless he thinks every european is Greek.

Basilis is full of shit. But its hilarious when he flips out on us when he's actually the one spitting BS all over the forums. I still don't know why he's on a Raptors forum. We don't have a single Greek Player on the team unless he thinks every european is Greek.

There's no reason to insult Basilis.

I could point out that there's also no Canadians on the Raptors and many RR posters live outside Toronto, so I fail to see how geography or nationality should have any bearing on anyone's decision to support the Raptors!

If every poster who's ever made a statistical mistake, committed a logical error, or changed their mind were questioned for being on RR, this place would be a barren wasteland!

On a related note, can we all please return this thread to its intended purpose, which was to discuss the skill/potential of Adetokunbo, regardless of his nationality, citizenship, place or residence, ethnicity or financial well being. many thanks

Thanks for the link. I'm curious to know something. This article, when I run it through google translate, states the following:

So, that would mean that he does not have Greek citizenship, and is not eligible for Greek citizenship, but instead is being issued permanent resident cards and passports. What confuses me is that you've argued on this thread that he actually already has Greek citizenship and berated others for not acknowledging that (in this post, for example, and this one). Perhaps google translated it wrong and the section that was translated as 'cannot have citizenship' should have been translated as 'already has citizenship'? But then, if he already has citizenship, I don't understand why he'd need a permanent residence permit, unless that too has been mistranslated?

Please understand, I don't care in the least what his citizenship status is. If he plays for the Greek national team, whether as a full citizen or a permanent resident, good for him, and best of luck to the entire team! But his citizenship seems to be of great importance to you, so I just thought you might want to know that the translated version of the article you posted seems to be spreading information that is incorrect, according to your own version of the events.

Why are you doing this? WHY ARE YOU DOING THIS?WHAT IS YOUR AGENDA HERE?

NO. That is NOT what that means. He HAD Greek citizenship up until February, when a new law was passed that changed the rules for citizenship. UNTIL THIS FEBRUARY HE WAS A GREEK CITIZEN.

After the news rules changed, he was not. He has now been processed officially, and he IS a Greek citizen, and the passport will come by the end of this month.

NO ONE IS ELIGIBLE TO PLAY FOR THE GREEK NATIONAL TEAM AT ANY LEVEL, OR IN ANY SPORT, UNLESS THEY HAVE FULL 100% CITIZENSHIP STATUS.
NO ONE CAN PLAY FOR THE GREEK NATIONAL TEAM UNLESS THEY ARE A GREEK CITIZEN.

NO ONE CAN PLAY FOR THE GREEK NATIONAL TEAM IF THEY ARE A NATURALIZED CITIZEN. NO NATURALIZED PLAYERS ARE ALLOWED TO PLAY FOR GREECE UNDER THE NATIONAL LAW.

HE HAS A FULL GREEK CITIZENSHIP AND IT IS NOW OFFICIAL.

STOP SPREADING THIS PROPAGANDA THAT HE DOES NOT PLEASE. IT IS GETTING VERY INSULTING AT THIS POINT.

NoPropsneeded wrote:

Basilis is full of shit. But its hilarious when he flips out on us when he's actually the one spitting BS all over the forums. I still don't know why he's on a Raptors forum. We don't have a single Greek Player on the team unless he thinks every european is Greek.

He read the article wrong, because he can't read Greek, then he makes false statements as to what it said. Then you start trolling.

I could point out that there's also no Canadians on the Raptors and many RR posters live outside Toronto, so I fail to see how geography or nationality should have any bearing on anyone's decision to support the Raptors!

If every poster who's ever made a statistical mistake, committed a logical error, or changed their mind were questioned for being on RR, this place would be a barren wasteland!

On a related note, can we all please return this thread to its intended purpose, which was to discuss the skill/potential of Adetokunbo, regardless of his nationality, citizenship, place or residence, ethnicity or financial well being. many thanks

Have you been reading the conversation? all he cares about it greek players. Its pretty obvious

Why are you doing this? WHY ARE YOU DOING THIS?WHAT IS YOUR AGENDA HERE?

NO. That is NOT what that means. He HAD Greek citizenship up until February, when a new law was passed that changed the rules for citizenship. UNTIL THIS FEBRUARY HE WAS A GREEK CITIZEN.

After the news rules changed, he was not. He has now been processed officially, and he IS a Greek citizen, and the passport will come by the end of this month.

NO ONE IS ELIGIBLE TO PLAY FOR THE GREEK NATIONAL TEAM AT ANY LEVEL, OR IN ANY SPORT, UNLESS THEY HAVE FULL 100% CITIZENSHIP STATUS.
NO ONE CAN PLAY FOR THE GREEK NATIONAL TEAM UNLESS THEY ARE A GREEK CITIZEN.

NO ONE CAN PLAY FOR THE GREEK NATIONAL TEAM IF THEY ARE A NATURALIZED CITIZEN. NO NATURALIZED PLAYERS ARE ALLOWED TO PLAY FOR GREECE UNDER THE NATIONAL LAW.

HE HAS A FULL GREEK CITIZENSHIP AND IT IS NOW OFFICIAL.

STOP SPREADING THIS PROPAGANDA THAT HE DOES NOT PLEASE. IT IS GETTING VERY INSULTING AT THIS POINT.

LOOOOOOOOOOOOOOL

For real?

Go back and check post 18 again. Your story keeps changing and it is everybody fault for trying to get a credible link or source or clarification.

Council of State deems right of migrants to become Greek unconstitutional

ekathimerini.com , Tuesday February 5, 2013 (20:40)

The Council of State on Tuesday deemed unconstitutional a law passed almost three years ago which allows second-generation migrants to apply for Greek citizenship and to stand in local elections.

Greece’s highest administrative court ruled that only Greeks could stand for office. It also decided that the criteria for offering Greek citizenship were not sufficient and that each case should be examined individually to ensure the applicant has a genuine bond with Greece.

Known as the Ragousis law after former Interior Minister Yiannis Ragousis, the citizenship law was ratified by Parliament in early 2010, allowing those who had been born to immigrant parents legally living in Greece for at least five years to be granted Greek citizenship provided they had studied at a Greek school for a minimum of six years.

The Council of State’s decision could mean that some of those who were granted Greek citizenship in the last three years will lose their rights. It is not clear if the ruling will affect the outcome of local elections in 2010.

Greece had stopped granting citizenship under Ragousis criteria law in December, in anticipation of the court ruling being made public. The decision irked coalition partners PASOK and Democratic Left.

Deputy Interior Minister Haralambos Athanassiou said last month that the law would be replaced with legislation that would require migrants to show a “genuine bond” with Greece and prove they had assimilated into Greek culture.

ENGLISH article, so the trolls here cannot say it says something different because Google translate said so (unbelievable trolling level some of you do here to even argue about what is said due to Google translate)......

EVERYTHING I have said CONFIRMED in ENGLISH.

If anyone else here implies any more that I am lying, trolling, or making things up here, I am sending abuse reports to mods. Then you can explain how me backing up everything with legit sources and links is "lying", and all this other untrue nonsense that I am being falsely accused of here.