I have a full article coming out in InfoWorld on Friday, but for those of you who have asked – and are jumping up and down looking for an answer – he[See the full post at: The core of the Win7 update scan slowdown]

I have an unbranded best buy windows 8.1 64-bit tablet that takes forever on the scans and downloads now too. I’ve also noticed that the MSE on the Win7 computer has not been updating definitions as often or running the daily scans like I have scheduled. I can get it to update and scan manually so not too concerned, but is this issue linked to the Win7 update scan slowdown? Win8.1 Defender has a similar issue when it updates definitions.

Alright I’ll download the update because I got the first one the 302 one I mean, the other I’ll download tonight or tomorrow morning and tomorrow night I’ll install updates that are safe and secure than crap because I hid the optional and other stuff. Plus I look here to ensure to install the needed or safe ones.

I’ve asked you this morning about it, but now that you’ve posted this article about Windows 7, I can’t help but ask again for windows 10. Is the issue of Windows 10 windows update hanging (while searching/downloading subsequent updates) after installing version 1607 a widespread issue? (please don’t tell me it’s just me…) And is it specific to 1607 or windows 10 in general? Ugh…so tempted to revert back to 1511 if it’s specific to 1607…

Woody: Gave up trying to update my Windows 7 rig after 2 1/2 hours last night … Just now followed your advice and applied KB 3172605 and had my updates in just over 3 minutes … Of course, that’s this month … who knows what’s lurking for November…

On Windows 7 machines, MSE can often fail to update its definitions when Windows Update is slow-scanning. If you turn off WU, MSE will resume its expected behavior.

I can’t speak for Windows 8.1, but I suggest that you try turning off Windows Update there, and see if MSE’s behavior improves. Assuming that you only apply patches once a month, there is no point in having WU running the rest of the time.

Yes, it is widespread for new installations. It is common with everything released under 1607, Windows 10, Windows 10 LTSB, Windows Server 2016.
The fix is to install the most recent CU manually – see my reply to you about how to access the Catalog in the other thread.

Thanks Woody. I managed to install the security only update for win 7 following your directions and it went well. Winupdate went wonky for a few days and the security rollup wouldn’t disappear even though I had the alternative and the MSRT and net update went into an endless loop. Two days ago I hid the “group a” rollup and managed to install the net and msrt. Things look good.

I’ll wait for your article before installing anything else but have a question about kb/3177467. This appeared after the last set was installed. Do we need it and will it speed up wu checks?

I actually installed the two updates Woody mentions on one of my machines today, based on Canadian Tech’s feature on the MS forum as linked from Windows Secrets. This followed a snail-paced WU installation on my other machine and with this machine taking 8 hours to check for the updates and a further 6 hours without the download moving off 0%. At that point I gave up, cancelled the download and went for the recommended solution.

Within half an hour or so I had both the speed-up updates installed, with the October updates also found, downloaded, and installed.

Thanks to Canadian Tech for his initial advice and to Woody for repeating it here.

Update on the 2 computers: Windows update still is taking too long imho.

Win7 is currently attempting to download and install the Silverlight & 2 Office patches available after it had no problem downloading & installing KB890830 and rather quickly like it used to. I have all the following already on the computer: KB3138612 & KB3145739 since Apr 30, KB3185911 since Oct 3, KB3192391 since Oct 29. Is there a newer version of KB3020369? My computer has had that installed since June 2 2015. I’ll have to check tomorrow to see if MSE improves.

Win8.1 tablet is attempting to download KB3192392 using the WU standalone installer. Currently see “searching for updates on this computer” for about 30 min now. On Defender scans/definitions (MSE is not on the tablet) : tried turning off WU on the 8.1 tablet, got message to check internet/network connections and error code 0x80070422 and could not update definitions. That’s when I stopped WU from running and changed the startup type to disabled. So I readjusted the settings back to manual like it was originally set to. Lately, I’ve been waiting for the popup notice saying that Defender needs to be updated, attempt to update 3-4 times before it finally updates. Any other suggestions?

Oops. Woody’s instructions said “turn off the internet” and I didn’t know how to do that, so I Googled and followed instructions to open Device Manager and right-click the Network Adapters” and choose “Disable.”

Fortunately, I only did that to the first of three (I still have internet access), but as soon as I chose “Disable,” it *disappeared* from Device Manager (so I can’t right-click and choose “Enable” to get it back).

I followed exactly your instructions in the article “Time to get the first post-patchocalypse patches”. After installing all pending (group B) and restart the WU search took forever. (Note: I completed all your instructions and updates).

KB3172605 tells me that is “not applicable to my computer”. I installed KB3020369 without problems but after that there are no changes, the WU has worked more than half an hour and still scanning…

Just a small caveat you might want to put in your article. Make sure that Service Pack 1 is installed, or the 3172605 update will give you “the update is not appropriate for you computer” message. I know it’s an obvious point, but it had been so long since I had seen a Windows 7 computer without SP1 installed, I never thought to look, and was mystified why I was getting that message.

It looks like I may have lucked out in the sense that apparently two of my three Network Adapter “devices” (Microsoft Virtual WiFi Miniport and Dell Wireless 1703 802.11) are created by the same driver, and I disabled the first, but the second was still shown. (I came to this realization after a trip to Dell Support.)

So I right-clicked the one that still showed and chose “Enable” and suddenly I had three “devices” listed again.

As an 8.1 user on my machines scans are actually quite fast. Although I do have a laptop that is sluggish. Like Windows 7 level sluggish here. Manually installing the April 2015 servicing stack update and March 2016 update client update? Update client update? I don’t know. I find these massively cutdown the scan time. Although you could have a slow internet connection too.

I thought I’d explain to folks a little bit about why your summary blogpost here instructs all the people who use Bluetooth on their computers NOT to try this speed-up process until after they have read your detailed InfoWorld article on Friday —

There is an issue with some Bluetooth adapters not getting along at all with the patch KB3172605, and installing that patch can sometimes even cause harm to the computer in ways that the action of uninstalling KB3172605 may NOT reverse (on its own).

Some people who do use Bluetooth on their computer can probably simply employ the speed-up process that you sketched out above —

it’s just that BEFORE they try this speed-up process, they need to make sure that

1) their Bluetooth adapter is not one of the makes/models that are known to be harmed by patch KB3172605,

OR

2) if it is one of the makes/models that are harmed by KB3172605, they need to find out if the manufacturer of the adapter (and/or the manufacturer of the computer) has in the last couple of months published a fix for it, and they need to employ that Bluetooth adapter fix before installing KB3172605.

OR

3) if it is one of the makes/models that are harmed by KB3172605, and the manufacturer of the adapter (and/or the manufacturer of the computer) has NOT published a fix for it, they need to decide whether they want their computer’s Bluetooth capability to work, or whether they want to install KB3172605. If they don’t want to lose the Bluetooth capability, and need to avoid installing KB3172605, then their future installations of Windows Updates might be limited or complicated to pull off, so this is a serious matter for them.

Woody’s InfoWorld article on Friday will discuss those complex issues and concerns, and advise on the steps to take,
so it will be well worth waiting until Friday for the people who use Bluetooth in their computers, and who are unfamiliar with this problematic Bluetooth/KB3172605 relationship, or who are familiar with the problems, but don’t know what they personally can or can’t do about it in relation to their own computers.

On another active discussion thread here, there were some concerns raised by CH100 and maybe a few others about KB3177467 and the wider servicing stack update situation – it’s a bit tricky, apparently; or on some machines, it is showing some unusual results or something.

You can look up KB3177467 in a site search to find the discussion I’m talking about – it has been active in the last two days, so it won’t be too hard to find.

@Tudor,
Regarding your question about whether Woody’s next InfoWorld article on Friday will discuss KB3177467, I do not think that that particular article (on the Bluetooth/KB3172605 issue) will include discussion of the servicing stack patches.

I believe that the user has KB3172605 hidden.
Hugo, you are far behind with the updates if you didn’t have KB3020369 installed. This update has been released in April 2015.
Your only chance to catch up and secure your computer is to move in Group A and unhide everything hidden and install everything that is already checked and comes up on Windows Update. It may take longer for the first scan or maybe not, but after you install the patches there, everything should get back to normal.
For the following months, follow Woody’s advice and install only when MS-DEFCON changes to 3, 4, or 5. Woody will clarify it every month when the time comes.
It is far too complex for you to stay in Group B if you have essential patches missing after 18 months.
Sorry Woody, you asked for it 🙂

WU Turned OFF in my Win 7 – Per CanadianTech I cannot STOP WU in Win Services (get Stop-ING)and I didn’t know at the time to disconnect the internet – BUT 3177467 Installed 10/28 as a Single Dnload (as WU “More Information” link suggests) and Nothing Negative has occurred following multi System Re-starts.

KB 3177467 Restart stuck on “Stage 2 of 2” or “Stage 3 of 3″……………..
After you install update 3177467 [together with other updates], a restart may be required to complete the installation. During this restart, you may find yourself stuck on “Stage 2 of 2” or “Stage 3 of 3”.
If you encounter this issue, press Ctrl+Alt+Delete to continue to log on. This should occur only one time and does not prevent updates from installing successfully.
Note In managed environments, such as by using Windows Server Update Services (WSUS), you can avoid either of these issues by deploying this update as a stand-alone update.

Easier way to do it would probably be to just unplug your modem. I mean, it would mean that nobody in your house would have internet access for however long you take doing what you have to do, but it works 😛

If you think Win7 has problems try updating a Vista machine. Windows Update uselessly sucked up 25% CPU usage on an x64 Quad Core machine while it devoured approximately 70% of Physical Memory. After letting the machine sit for about 10 hours in this condition I gave up and shut it down for the day. It looks like I’ll have to manually apply the security updates that I’ve already downloaded. I can do the same for the installed version of Office 2007 but the path to follow for dealing with the .Net Framework is much less clear.

The only thing Vista users are receiving from Microsoft in the twilight of Extended Support is an extended digit.

@poohsticks: TY for the clarification 🙂 When I compiled my latest ISO, I integrated the newest servicing stack all alone as the first one and then saved, unmount, mount again and integrate the other hotfixes.

To disconnect from the Internet:
Wireless connection. Click the connection icon on the bottom right of your screen. It looks like 5 vertical parallel bars. Select your connection, click on it, click disconnect. This will work in at least 90% of situations.
Wired connection. Unplug the Ethernet cable from your computer. The cable is unique in that the end is a square plastic piece (larger than the telephone connector) with a tiny little tab that you must depress to remove the wire from its port.
If your connection is through a telephone wire directly to your computer (rare these days), simply remove that plug.

To reconnect to the Internet:
Wireless connection. Click the connection icon on the bottom right of your screen. Select your usual connection. Click Connect
Wired connection. Put the cable back into your computer.

Thanks. I have a wired connection. Does unplugging the cable typically result in a simple/instant off/on, or does that create a need for modem cycling or resetting at the ISP end? (That’s what I was hoping to avoid by doing a software-based disconnect.)

The process starts by ensuring that there is nothing running that will prevent the update from working properly. Click on the Start globe and type services into the text box. Click on Services in the list that pops up. In the window that then pops up (its alphabetic), find Windows Update. Right-click on it (left-click if your mouse is set for left-handers) and choose Stop.

I’m having the same issue as Hugo. When I checked to see if KB3172605 was hidden, all my hidden entries are gone. It’s a blank page now, and says I haven’t hidden any updates. Yeah, I have. Where’d they go?

I manually installed all October Vista security updates. After rebooting, it still took Windows Update several hours to finish checking for remaining updates (Office & .Net Framework). At least it finished before the clock chimed midnight!

This is the situation:
– I’m doing a clean reinstall of Windows 7×64 Pro (spanish)
– After installing Windows 7 I installed SP1 (not from WU, I have it on file since 2014)
– Then I followed the exact instructions of Woody in “A new list of minimal updates for Windows 7”
https://www.askwoody.com/2016/a-new-list-of-minimal-updates-for-windows-7/
– Then I followed the instructions of Woody in “MS-DEFCON 3: Time to get the first post-patchocalypse patches patched”https://www.askwoody.com/2016/ms-defcon-3-time-to-get-the-first-post-patchocalypse-patches-patched/ (group B)
– After that the WU search took forever.
– Then I followed the instructions of Woody in “The core of the Win7 update scan slowdown”. KB3172605 says
is “not applicable to your computer”, then I installed KB3020369, but after that the WU still keep scaning forever.

– All I have installed is AVG antivirus and Chrome. That’s all (really).

I can start again all the process to do different steps if necessary, but what I need to change?.

Hey Woody, I installed KB 3020369, and then I was able to install KB 3172605. That fixed Windows update …for now. What are your thoughts on KB 3042058? It’s an update to the default cipher suite priority order and came up as a standalone security update when I ran WU. Oh, and after WU completed all my previously hidden updates reappeared. Updating really shouldn’t be this difficult. I was almost ready to just choose skipping updates from this point on.

I would not ever install an AV before completing the WU of a re-install. In fact, when I do re-installs, the AV is the last thing I install. Chrome could be a problem too, I do not know. I suggest you uninstall both and that includes the AVG removal tool.

I don’t know much about what you have done so far but, when I run into that situation where KB3020369 is just searching and searching, here is what I do:

Actually I have the same issue on my desktop (because it has the KB3172605 installed and WU is fast.

I have WU set to “Never Check”. Since the Rollup started, the only way I will see the hidden updates is to launch WU and start the WU check manually. After a few minutes it will show the Rollup (Important)and the preview (Optional). If I then click on “Show Hidden Updates”, it will show them (all 6).

If I install nothing and uncheck all the boxes and close WU, upon launching WU but not clicking check for updates, all the hidden updates are gone.

Looking back, I belived this started after the Servicing stack update and the rollup, but I cannot be sure.

The practice of hiding updates leaves you with orphaned records any time when Microsoft expires an update which was hidden. It is not clear if there are negative side-effects, but fact is that the cached database contains records which don’t have an equivalent record at the Microsoft master server.
The only way to recover from this situation and start clean is to reset the DataStore.edb, or preferred method, reset all SoftwareDistribution folder to regain some space on drive C:.

Okay, I see what’s happening with KB 3042058. It was previously available only from the Microsoft Download Center. MS published it to WU on October 13. The patch is from May 2015. According to the TechNet article, “Microsoft initially offered the update via the Microsoft Download Center (DLC) only in order to give customers the opportunity to test the new features before making them a default part of their environments.” Really? 17 months for test! Well, I survived without it for 17 months. I suppose another month won’t hurt. Thanks, Woody.

Thanks for all the tips everyone has been sharing. Both computers are in active process of trying to download a patch (even with high speed internet, it’s been hours for each now).

The 8.1 tablet is attempting the July 2016 rollup because the other was already installed in August. Funny thing is that I had planned on putting the tablet in group A because I only maintain it for the owner, but no matter what patch I attempt to download, it takes forever. Once I get WU sped up, I don’t know which way I will attempt to go with it.

Win7 desktop computer is downloading July 2016 update rollup KB3172605. I attempted to reinstall KB3020369, got message that it was already installed. Anyway to get the newer version installed? Got silverlight installed, Office patches still need to be installed.

What? no
KB3042058 was published to WU months ago
maybe just 2 or 3 months after releasing it in May 2015
but many users didn’t see it because they didn’t install prerequisite servicing stack update KB3020369
and this thanks to Woody’s advise about its cosmetic restart issue 😀

I am using windows 64 bit and click on the KB3172605 which appears to download but then the message comes up “searching for updates on this computer” for ages and then comes up with the message not found. Am I doing something wrong?

I’ve had trouble (quite a while ago) with some intel bluetooth and EMET. Their services didn’t like certain security options that I had EMET enable by default/opt out (SEHOP if I recall correctly). I had to opt them out of it manually to keep the service from crashing / not working.

I wonder if this update (KB3172605/KB3161608) sets SEHOP to opt out (programs that aren’t compatible with it need to opt out via complier flag, registry setting (above). (or crash/malfunction I guess).

Anyone want to test this who has bluetooth with the problem? Or perhaps debug the service and see what exception code it crashes with?

I was able to finally get KB3172605 to download and installed. WU sped back up and I was able to download and install several patches in about 5 minutes.

Computer would not download and install KB3020369. Like I said before, it was listed as already installed, out of curiosity I tried to uninstall it. No matter on many times I click on it in any form, there is no option to uninstall or change it. Do I need this patch?

As promised, here is my update from a post I made in various earlier sections on the Intel Bluetooth issue.

@Poohsticks, and others with the Intel BT vs. KB3172605:

I finally screwed up the courage and updated the Lenovo ThinkPad T440 Bluetooth Drivers today. I used the Intel Driver Update Utility v.2.6.1.4 (IDU) to identify what drivers to install. I first created a restore point. I then used the IDU to grab the newest Intel drivers. I found 2, the ProSET drivers for the wireless (WP-BT-17.1.1531.1764_s64.exe), and a second file Intel Wireless Software for Windows 7 (BT_19.0.1607_64_Win7.exe). More on the second file later.

I installed the ProSET Drivers first using the IDU as the launcher (probably not necessary). As I posted before, the installer offered 2 options, to Repair and to Remove. Select “Repair.” Do NOT Remove! The install was uneventful and successful and necessitated a reboot.

With fingers crossed, I waited for boot and turned on the Bose speaker. It worked! Successful stage 1! No Action Center warnings.

I then used the IDU to launch the second file Intel Wireless Software for Windows 7 (BT_19.0.1607_64_Win7.exe). It too proceeded and completed, however on reboot the tray showed a failure to load drivers and then the dreaded blue screen. I rebooted and Windows started, but again the errors and the blue screen. Failure on stage 2.

(NOTE: For those with the Intel BT problem, start with stage one and see if it works. If so go to stage 3.)

I rebooted into safe mode and did a system restore, which offered up to restore after the ProSET Drivers (para 1). The restore was uneventful and successful.

I then checked my Installed Programs in Control Panel. It showed ProSET Wireless Software v.17.13.2.2 and Intel Wireless Bluetooth Patch v.17.1.1531.1764. That setup works on my Intel N7260 Intel Wireless Bluetooth adapter. The Intel IDU showed the version for file WP-BT-17.1.1531.1764_s64.exe is v.17.13.2.2. I was very encouraged to see the listing in Installed Programs as “patch”.

Now for the acid test of Stage 3. I then installed the WU patch for KB3172605 from the Update Catalog. It successfully installed and even before logging in to the laptop I heard the Bose speaker beep that it was connected. So yes, Intel offered a patch that works for the later adapters. My first patch was dated 9/12 and it failed with bluescreens, however this last patch was dated at the end of September.

Finally Stage 4. I manually launched WU (currently set to Never Check). Before KB3172605, after the October patch Tuesday, my WU ran for 33 hours without success (it had been fast after the September speedup even without 605.) WU took 3 minutes and gave me the outstanding updates, like October Rollup 330 and the Preview, plus some hardware stuff with I never install with WU. Success!!!

As a follow-up, I decided to follow ch100’s recommendation and I un-hid all my hidden updates except KB2952664. I re-ran WU to see if any disappeared. None did. I then re-hid all the telemetry ones and installed the rest. I now have only 6 hidden plus the latest MSE update. I then installed the security-only patch for October. I then again ran WU and no new stuff. WU remains on Never, and all is stable now.

I have seen many cases in the Answers forum when people reported getting error codes and this procedure worked.

This procedure has a great advantage over the Internet disconnect that Woody recommends, I can do it remotely. Anyone like me who provides a lot of support remotely (Logmein in my case), can’t do the disconnect procedure.

Sorry, you misunderstood my recommendation. KB2952664 is the one which mainly needs to be unhidden, but if you decide so, you do not have to install it.
I explained this concept too many times here already, I am not revisiting it and I am not posting again about Windows 7 unless something entirely exceptional happens.
Everyone is entitled to decide for themselves, but I think Windows has become too complex for users with limited technical understanding and those who decide to manage it outside of the official guidelines, would be better off by using only a browser and connecting to Cloud services.
Maybe Woody’s idea about using Chromebooks is the best compromise in that direction.

You are right and understood exactly the meaning of what I tried to explain, only that it can backfire and send users to the competitors like the Chromebooks already mentioned. Some of those competitors and Google in particular seem to have more advanced solutions to connect and work with the Cloud, at least for now.

Thank you for your description of what you did!
It’s so appreciated when people follow up.

I hope that works out well for your computer!

—-
About 3 or 4 days ago, I checked my Lenovo’s ThinkVantage System Update (I do that about once a month),
and it actually offered me a new update for my Bluetooth adapter, which the Lenovo description specifically said was to fix the problems with windows update KB3172605.

I’m just getting around to this. What do I do if KB 3020369 itself is taking forever to install “Searching for updates…”? Will it eventually complete? It’s been going for over 15 minutes so far, on a Core i5 machine at 3.4GHz.

Thanks! I have both patches installed after resetting Windows Update, on at least one PC. I’m going to wait a day or two before braving the next.

I’m in Group B. I have the October security-only update installed, and just read the articles outlining how the November security update was pulled. Given DEFCON 2, I suppose I just sit and wait with a 2-month old security profile, eh? Gotta love Microsoft.

Thanks Woody. I failed to click on the update catalog, since I didn’t see a direct download link from the KB article, and posts here seemed to imply the update was pulled a few days ago. I didn’t see anyone posting it had been reinstated!

I had an issue though with the stand alone installer which just went round and round, forever?
So I rebooted, plugged ethernet cable back in, downloaded the other update (KB3020369),
Then pulled the cable again, went into services and stopped windows update,
then started windows installer and windows modules installer!

Have to say that I am NOT competent so the above may be very bad advice but on double clicking
KB3020369 it took about 10 seconds and it began to install it.
Then I double clicked KB3172605 and again it began to install within 10 seconds?
Restarted, ran update which very quickly found 150 important and 64 optional.
(fresh install which stopped after 23 updates when windows updater updated its self??)

After reading your advice I have installed all updates except the dec rollout and 1 dec optional?

lake, take a look at this thread in the Microsoft forum. It has been used by literally hundreds of thousands. Viewed over 170,000 times, more than a thousand replies. Goes on for over 100 pages. It is the solution for the Windows Update problem.

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