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Pedigree or breeder which matters more?

:confused: if you believe that i want some of what you been drinking. yes some do hang false titles on dogs but take it from someone who knows things in the dark come to the light. your false "rom,por,xw will be in question. who did he go into who was there too vouch what weight what times, what has she or he thrown that can be proven to there titles. it happens to known dogmen more then you think bud. if your stuff is offical the real will know you will only be able to trick greenhorns with no connections. if you cant prove it prepare to be called out on it. dont think people not gonna want a peice of that action so if you cant back it up dont post it.

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yeh, problem is people do post it, don't they.
and in general i am talk'n about this for the perpose of the greenhorns Bud:eek:
wtf, do you think id buy anything from anyone posting their stuff on the net, get real lol...
ps, ive no need to further puchase any.
i can appreciate wardogs kennels gaurantee but man, i was not in the dogs to sell them so have no need to make gaurantees neither.
you want to buy one from me?.fark off lol....
would i give one to someone i know? if i thought it was a good one, maybe.:rolleyes:
if i told that person he would be a good one and he didnt turn out, then yes, id give him another.

mr. futuristic, ya want'a drink mate, no problem, c'mon over and we will have a few brew's and talk dogs.

im down with the drinks behavin, your treat wright lol. im with you on not needing to buy dogs because im at the same point where as i have the worthy stock to breed off myself. i dont question a win record for the purpos of buying if id might like 2 race if the circumstances are there. an im not going to call out net doggers to a pull it will be known adba comp. word of mouth if you will. wasnt meaning anything by my statement on your words just was touching in on what you left out. real recognize real i see you over there. take it easy:cool:.

im down with the drinks behavin, your treat wright lol. im with you on not needing to buy dogs because im at the same point where as i have the worthy stock to breed off myself. i dont question a win record for the purpos of buying if id might like 2 race if the circumstances are there. an im not going to call out net doggers to a pull it will be known adba comp. word of mouth if you will. wasnt meaning anything by my statement on your words just was touching in on what you left out. real recognize real i see you over there. take it easy:cool:.

Just because dogs have the same/similar pedigree, it does not always mean that they are equal in producing well and have the same performance. And if you know the breeder , you can know why he is breeding/what he is breeding for... (gameness,mouth,etc.)

And you will know the breeders past breedings, if he had success with the dogs that were produced and such;to see if the breeder has a clue to what he is doing when breeding the dogs.

And also people can scam and sell a pretty looking pedigree on paper that is all lies to the dogs that he is selling. (If you dont really know the breeder...)

So thats why I say breeders are more important. Of course both are important, but breeders>pedigree IMO

Thank you button for this post. This is why anytime I sell a dog I give it a guarantee. I've gotten in a few serious debates about my guarantee because they can't beleive it! Anyone who buys a pup or dog from me gets a satisfaction guarantee. I have always doine this and very few have come back to me. My guarantee is if for any reason you are unsatisfied with the pup or dog you purchase just return it in good health and get another one from a current or future breeding. Also this guarantee never expires! For example, you buy a 12 week old puppy and 2 years later you can't keep hiom or her or it doesn't turn out like you were hoping bring it back and get another puppy close to the same age as the one you bought. Another example, if you buy a 2 year old dog and after some time it doesn't turn out like you thought return it and get another of the same age or younger. Sounds good right? Here is the only catch. If you decide to breed the dog then it cancels the guartantee. Why? because a dog need to earn its right to be bred and if you bred him or her then you must of been satisfied with the dog! How many people will give you this guarantee? I bet not many! What do you guys think of that?

The breeder can put any paperwork he wants on any pup on the yard, wheather is from the ADBA,AADR or hand written. He can tell you what ever you want to hear.

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WHY would a dog breeder, wanting to IMPROVE a breed, want to do anything to falsify or mislead someone on a pedigree?

Pedigrees are a look into history, what worked, what didn't.

I don't hear much about falsified pedigrees in other performance animals. The pedigrees are revered and considered an important link in the history of a breed -- for all to see and study for years to come.

Why would anyone want to deny that to the history of their breed?

Thoroughbreds, all kinds of working dog breeds -- I don't hear this same stuff about THEIR pedigrees....why THIS breed?

WHY would a dog breeder, wanting to IMPROVE a breed, want to do anything to falsify or mislead someone on a pedigree?

Pedigrees are a look into history, what worked, what didn't.

I don't hear much about falsified pedigrees in other performance animals. The pedigrees are revered and considered an important link in the history of a breed -- for all to see and study for years to come.

Why would anyone want to deny that to the history of their breed?

Thoroughbreds, all kinds of working dog breeds -- I don't hear this same stuff about THEIR pedigrees....why THIS breed?

Dreamer

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There are breeders who strive to improve the line and there are breeders who strive to improve there wallets. A breeder who needs money will tell you anything just to make the sale. Any breeder with a decent amount of dog knowledge can tell a greenhorn right from the first conversation, he'll ask questions about different lines and different dogs in history to see what the buyers knowledge base is. If the buyer has a very low knowledge base of the breed, then your a sitting duck, and must rely on the integrity and honesty of the breeder to sell you a good product.
The reason we see it in these dogs so much is because its one of the few breeds that are still used for working purposes and competition. Now factor in the fact that we have no publications to verify what dogs are winning in any competition. It gives way to people who lie because in case you dont know the right people, you have no prove of accomplishments or lack there of.

l really got to go with Mr Futuristic,cause lets face it .........when you go for a fancy "ped"......you would have to be pretty darn stupid to not look, up down left right and way back for false names and titles. Personally l wouldn't go for hand written ped,only if the breeder was related to me.I dont know the way it works in the usa these days,but the country l come from the "apbt is a petbull" without adba/ukc ped. LOL

Thank you button for this post. This is why anytime I sell a dog I give it a guarantee. I've gotten in a few serious debates about my guarantee because they can't beleive it! Anyone who buys a pup or dog from me gets a satisfaction guarantee. I have always doine this and very few have come back to me. My guarantee is if for any reason you are unsatisfied with the pup or dog you purchase just return it in good health and get another one from a current or future breeding. Also this guarantee never expires! For example, you buy a 12 week old puppy and 2 years later you can't keep hiom or her or it doesn't turn out like you were hoping bring it back and get another puppy close to the same age as the one you bought. Another example, if you buy a 2 year old dog and after some time it doesn't turn out like you thought return it and get another of the same age or younger. Sounds good right? Here is the only catch. If you decide to breed the dog then it cancels the guartantee. Why? because a dog need to earn its right to be bred and if you bred him or her then you must of been satisfied with the dog! How many people will give you this guarantee? I bet not many! What do you guys think of that?

Lol, I am in Erie, PA. Not sure if you are just messing with me but I will take the bait. If someone that wanted to buy a pup from me and didn't have all the money, yes, I would take payments. As long as it didn't take to long to pay it off. I remember the guy I bought my first good dog from. His name was Joe D. I made payments totalling a $1000 for a 6 month old grandson of Bell's Baby Jones. I was lucky because he let me take the pup home and care for it while I gave him $200/month. He became my mentor and I learned about half of what I know now from him and I will never forget the lessons he taught me. What he taught me was worth its weight in gold!

It looks like I'm going to disagree with most here, but if your looking for great dogs then the pedigree is more important than the breeder. What does it matter if you buy from someone that doesnt have any good dogs in the pedigree for the first few generations. I would rather get a pup off a champion, even if the owner just got into the dogs, and has no idea what he has. -Not to say there isn't many different situations, but just as an example. If you want great dogs, then they must come from great dogs.

This is where the breeder comes in. A good breeder will have dogs with good pedigrees but most importantly will know how to line breed and outcross his preferred line of dogs. This is why a good breeder will always have good dogs. He knows what he is doing!

It looks like I'm going to disagree with most here, but if your looking for great dogs then the pedigree is more important than the breeder. What does it matter if you buy from someone that doesnt have any good dogs in the pedigree for the first few generations. I would rather get a pup off a champion, even if the owner just got into the dogs, and has no idea what he has. -Not to say there isn't many different situations, but just as an example. If you want great dogs, then they must come from great dogs.

war dog guarantee makes alot of sense not alot of people in the game will give you a guarantee...hell you just got to get really lucky to get 5 out 5 dogs from a breeder and they all turn out to be aces

Lol, I am in Erie, PA. Not sure if you are just messing with me but I will take the bait. If someone that wanted to buy a pup from me and didn't have all the money, yes, I would take payments. As long as it didn't take to long to pay it off. I remember the guy I bought my first good dog from. His name was Joe D. I made payments totalling a $1000 for a 6 month old grandson of Bell's Baby Jones. I was lucky because he let me take the pup home and care for it while I gave him $200/month. He became my mentor and I learned about half of what I know now from him and I will never forget the lessons he taught me. What he taught me was worth its weight in gold!

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not alot of ppl will do that...well the way i was taught that in this game as men we only have our word and if you dont have that you dont have squat....