Sunday, October 02, 2011 11:10:37 PMAsk any educator whose head isn't firmly planted up the fundamentalist, extreme right-wing ass of people like George Bush about NCLB and they will unanimously preach to you about what a detriment it is to our education system. Rich, in-control conservatives love education the way it is because it helps maintain the class system they need to perpetuate their influence and wealth; less affluent, "middle-class" conservatives love it because anyone who is a gun-toting, Bible-thumping conservative obviously knows what is best. Those goddamn liberals with their social welfare programs and human rights are a bunch of homogay, atheist bleeding hearts who think that humans have effects on the earth like heating the atmosphere! Nutjobs!

If you do not pay taxes, the government uses force to incarcerate you. If you don't give it, they take it.Well, from the looks of it the American education system was failing LONG before NCLB, considering that you don't know your words either.

THAT'S THE F*CKING DEFINITION OF OBLIGED, DUMBASS.

"Make (someone) legally or morally bound to an action or course of action."

So, indeed you are OBLIGED to pay taxes.

Every day, when you conservatives post, it just proves more and more the statistic that liberals tend to be more intelligent.

Sunday, October 02, 2011 7:58:20 AMI'm too tired to skim through all the comments right now, but let me say...I hate the standardized testing and NCLB.

As a product of it, it gave me a skewed view of 'writing' all through high school and instead of teaching me how to pump out well written essays for college, I was being taught how to condense an essay into five paragraphs and make it as simple and effective as possible.

As someone going into teaching...Let me just set up a scenario. You're in a classroom where the majority of the students are two grades below reading level (meaning a third grader is reading at a first grade level). You have about eight?ish months to get them up to a third grade level in order for them to get a proficient score on the test. You have to schedule your curriculum around that fact, and as such, your students miss out on everything "unimportant" that isn't on the test. It's poop.

Saturday, October 01, 2011 11:24:48 AM""Slave" is defined as: "a person held in servitude as the chattel of another" A man who works, but his money taken away by force--is a slave."

Alright, let's get technical up in this bitch.

1. Paying taxes towards education does NOT make you the 'chattel of another'. Everyone pays taxes, or at least should be paying them. Arguably some should pay more than they currently do, some maybe less, but everyone pays 'em, and since EVERYONE pays them, NOBODY individually possesses you because while you pay for everyone's child's education, everyone pays for your child's education too. Nobody is in a position of ownership.

2. I would change what you say to 'A man who works, but all his money and possessions, or the required money and possessions for a comfortable and free life are taken away by force, AND HE IS NOT OBLIGED TO GIVE THEM UP, is a slave.'

Saturday, October 01, 2011 7:34:02 AMIts good coming from a student who was subject to this act for most of my education. Teachers would just teach the skills to pass the test and the least amount information possible and its going to hold the future work force back

Saturday, October 01, 2011 5:35:09 AMAs a product of the NCLB system, I have to say, this is the right choice. The test isn't an "unbiased" look at taking a test - rather they hammered us with certain skills in elementary school (Like the "hamburger method" of writing), which was tactics we were immediatly told to ditch up entering Jr. High and High School. More standardized testing is more time wasted.

Friday, September 30, 2011 11:38:07 PMYou want reasons why capitalism wouldn't work for education? 1) The class divide would widen exponentially; i.e, the rich would get richer and the poor would get poorer. 2)As was mentioned earlier, you would have a choice, but it would essentially be a choice between Tescos or wall mart; both as bad as each other. 3)Choice is a very deceptive concept. You have the choice to go to a bank and spend 30 years repaying a mortgage...or you don't own your own home. Where else do you go? Capitalism ultimately ends in being completely cornered, which, no matter what you argue you never are with a government as it is a democracy. "It has been said that democracy is the worst form of government except all the others that have been tried.”. Now please, listen to the voices of your peers and accept it; Capitalism would be a bad decision where education is concerned. Maybe in a few years time you'll realise that the 'free market' is a bitter oxymoron.

Friday, September 30, 2011 9:39:47 PMOh, and as for your "choice" bullsh*t:

You DO have a choice of governments.

You can get the f*ck out of the country. And stay out.

Problem is, governments are like corporations: you can either deal with all the mediocre ones that you don't like, pay out the ass to get the good ones you do like (which, more often than not, still aren't perfect), or go without.

I hear Somolia's pretty nice for those who prefer to do without...

I don't really know of any that match up perfectly with your criteria, but hey, that's any business... I mean, government.

Friday, September 30, 2011 9:31:23 PMWhile we're ditching NCLB, why don't we ditch the entire Department of Education? To call this bureaucratic nightmare a giant steaming pile of $#!+ is an insult to giant steaming piles of $#!+. It's blatantly unconstitutional, it wastes $billions, and it makes everything it touches worse. Just fire every single employee, degauss the hard drives, and auction off the buildings, furniture, and equipment.

True, NCLB was enacted under Bush as another of his misguided efforts to "get along" with Democrats. However, NCLB was the creation of two Democrats: Ted Kennedy and Education Secretary Rod Paige. There's nothing conservative about it.

Friday, September 30, 2011 8:37:56 PM"if the computer and electronic industry was run by profit-makers, there would be no service because they just care about money! Computer technology would take a back seat to corporate greed!"Well, Apple pretty much is that problem incarnate... And Microsoft is only getting worse anymore... But I digress.

Friday, September 30, 2011 8:29:06 PM For one thing, double-standard much? "Of COURSE, corporations are corrupt and greedy; and of COURSE, the government are benevolent overlords thinking only about the welfare of its citizens."You've also made this argument before, and it's flawed.

Look at what the two are founded around:

A government is funded by, controlled by, and is meant to benefit THE PEOPLE. EVERYONE. A few bad seeds can f*ck it up, and have been for many years especially here in America, but in the end it's founded on the primary goals of keeping as much of the ENTIRE POPULATION secure and (relatively) happy as possible.

A corporation is founded by a group of people who intend to benefit THEMSELVES and a GROUP OF SHAREHOLDERS (maybe). A "benevolent" company is still, first and foremost, about profit, and will throw anyone and everyone under the bus if they have to to make their next dollar.

Friday, September 30, 2011 8:19:43 PMI mean capitalism and the free market as the ONLY means of getting an education.The rich kids get a better education, they excel for the rest of their life, they get richer.

The poor kids get a sh*tty education because they couldn't afford it in the first place, they get left behind for the rest of their life, they get poorer.

The class divide widens, and we end up back where we were in the Middle Ages: The powerful, intelligent, and wealthy upper-crust is in control, has everything they need, and the rest of us all rot in the mud working for them, too dumb to realize that we're being paid Mexican wages for American work.

All because the kids whose parents couldn't afford to send them to a good school, couldn't, and they ended up with a half-assed "get what you pay for" education.

The system you suggest is basically letting the children suffer for the parents' mistakes.

Friday, September 30, 2011 7:34:11 PMNo, it's the "if you can't state my position with such an accuracy that I would say, 'yeah, that's what I think', then there's nothing to discuss." tactic; a debate would be pointless if you couldn't do that. Otherwise, it would just involve you making straw man after straw man which is what you've certainly been doing.

And your ad hominems i.e. you calling me a "right-wing nut" and a "troll" only reenforce my point.

Friday, September 30, 2011 7:03:38 PMAh I see. The age-old, tried-and-true "Cover my ears and shut my eyes, blah blah blah I don't care what you say" tactic. Here's a better suggestion: how about cast your misconceptions and prejudice aside and listen to your opponent for once? ... Damn, for a moment I forgot that right wing nuts are basically trolls.