I don't understand where a track with that tall of paddles (or whatever the technical term is) would do you any good where a stud is useful.

I think of using a stud on hardpack or ice, and a paddle track like that in deep snow.

where and how we ride we dont use studded tracks....we dont ride trails as I have seen and been part of to many accidents and we take no part in trail riding in michigan anymore.

I agree by the way that there are a lot of disprestful idiots on sleds that dont care about others, and will burn out with there studded tracks. I have only been to the UP a few times in the summer, but when I was there I didnt see every hotel booked solid full with bikers, as I do almost every single weekend in the winter with snowmobilers. Im not trying to argue as I think snowmobilers can be some D bags and arent respectful of thers and the destruction of property. For bikers and snowmobilers both are good for michigan economy.

where and how we ride we dont use studded tracks....we dont ride trails as I have seen and been part of to many accidents and we take no part in trail riding in michigan anymore.

I agree by the way that there are a lot of disprestful idiots on sleds that dont care about others, and will burn out with there studded tracks. I have only been to the UP a few times in the summer, but when I was there I didnt see every hotel booked solid full with bikers, as I do almost every single weekend in the winter with snowmobilers. Im not trying to argue as I think snowmobilers can be some D bags and arent respectful of thers and the destruction of property. For bikers and snowmobilers both are good for michigan economy.

I only ride the trails during the weekday...the woods are empty and you have them to yourself

where and how we ride we dont use studded tracks....we dont ride trails as I have seen and been part of to many accidents and we take no part in trail riding in michigan anymore.

I agree by the way that there are a lot of disprestful idiots on sleds that dont care about others, and will burn out with there studded tracks. I have only been to the UP a few times in the summer, but when I was there I didnt see every hotel booked solid full with bikers, as I do almost every single weekend in the winter with snowmobilers. Im not trying to argue as I think snowmobilers can be some D bags and arent respectful of thers and the destruction of property. For bikers and snowmobilers both are good for michigan economy.

1. Biking "destinations" are not as plentiful as areas to snowmobile. You'd have to look in the right spots.
2. I lived in the UP, I did not see hotels completely filled with snowmobiles during the time that I lived up there.
3. Snowmobilers probably spend more as a group, but individually the costs are about the same.

1. Biking "destinations" are not as plentiful as areas to snowmobile. You'd have to look in the right spots.
2. I lived in the UP, I did not see hotels completely filled with snowmobiles during the time that I lived up there.
3. Snowmobilers probably spend more as a group, but individually the costs are about the same.

i have rode with out studs in the same sled i want studs. ever come to a corner that some asshat with a long track cleared the snow off and than polished it studs help. if you want want to ride wiht out them fine by me but
but i bet you can keep up with the guy with them

if you need studs, keep off all roads, simple as that. you don't need studs in snow when you aren't racing. above is mentioned adjust with a deeper track. bam, problem answered. I see no problem with banning studs or cletes on ANY road or trail.

Until the retards figure out that studs and tire chains cause the same end result in short order, they're arguments are going to be name calling and hot air.

if you need studs, keep off all roads, simple as that. you don't need studs in snow when you aren't racing. above is mentioned adjust with a deeper track. bam, problem answered. I see no problem with banning studs or cletes on ANY road or trail.

Until the retards figure out that studs and tire chains cause the same end result in short order, they're arguments are going to be name calling and hot air.

deeper track is not going to help on a hard pack trail or a corner of ice. they should just close the trail when the snow is low

If you count up the money spent by guys on sleds compared to cyclists and skaters I guarantee the guys on sleds put less money into the local economy.

Really? They don't have $30 dollars per vehicle fees to maintain trails and road crossings. That adds up quick not counting what they buy in gas and other things when they are out. Also what is a little up setting is when the state Takes out of what was made by trail permit fees and builds a bike path and sleds cannot ride on it. Example... path between Charlevoix and Petoskey was partially funded by trail permit fees. Charge the bike riders taxes to build their own paths. They don't have to by permits or pay gas taxes. Snowmobiler's pay gas taxes, registration fees, and trail permits.

Really? They don't have $30 dollars per vehicle fees to maintain trails and road crossings. That adds up quick not counting what they buy in gas and other things when they are out.

The sled trail fee doesn't help the local economy, it repairs the shit the guys on sleds tear up. Yet you're lumping it in as an area where the locals profit? Wrong, and it doesn't come close to covering the costs of repairing culverts and signage that are destroyed by drunks on sleds.

Quote:

Originally Posted by liftedandgifted

Also what is a little up setting is when the state Takes out of what was made by trail permit fees and builds a bike path and sleds cannot ride on it. Example... path between Charlevoix and Petoskey was partially funded by trail permit fees. Charge the bike riders taxes to build their own paths. They don't have to by permits or pay gas taxes. Snowmobiler's pay gas taxes, registration fees, and trail permits.

My ORV money goes to maintain routes that only sleds can use during the winter. Get over it, it's no more one persons land to recreate on than anothers. It's called equal access and it's what pro 4x4 associations like the Blue Ribbon Coalition have been fighting for. 9 months out of the year that sled parked out in the barn doesn't contribute shit to the economy and bikers, hikers, skaters, walkers, bird watchers, butterfly collectors, photographers,etc... pay the bills at the Mom & Pop Shop.

As a side note; As long as we're saying money talks, the last two years ORV registrations have out numbered sled registrations. Should we turn more trails over to ORV's and ban sleds from those trails in the winter?

If you count up the money spent by guys on sleds compared to cyclists and skaters I guarantee the guys on sleds put less money into the local economy.

That has got to be the stupidist thing I've read in awhile.I spend $10,000 on a new sled every couple years.$100 to register it.I spend $500-600 for a weekend of riding several times a year.I figure I spend at least $4000 a year to snowmobile,that is not including parts,insurence,and the cost of the sled,or clothing.Im curious how much money you think people riding bikes spend.O and the best part is that snowmobile registration and trail permits are what pay to maintain the trails.
Im a snowmobiler,and ride a mountain bike.I think bike riders should pay for there own trail system,and go thru all the work that the snowmobile assosiation does to get permision from land owners,etc.
Keep the bikes and blades off of our snowmobile trails,period.