Damn HP!!!

Just had to throw out over $100 of HP ink cartridges due to expiration
dates. No other reason, as far as I can tell the ink was still good but
the printers wouldn't work with those cartridges.

The worst part is that this won't be the last time-unless I get rid of
those damned HP printers. (And from what I've heard that won't help-most
printer manufacturers have taken this route to rip us off.)

I mostly use the ink jets when I need to print in color-and I don't
print in color a lot. I've learned 2 things over the years. First, when
you run out of ink you'll do so when you're on a deadline. Second, if
you're limited to a few local stores (like I am-I simply *can't* fly out
at a moment's notice to buy an ink cartridge) then you can't count on
them having the cartridges you need in stock-and that assumes that
they're open when you run out (usually in the middle of the night).

So I've learned to keep a spare cartridge 'on the shelf'-but those are
the ones that I just threw out! Like I said, I don't print in color a
lot and these last cartridges lasted longer than I expected-long enough
for my spare cartridges to expire. Thank god I have several ink
jets-enough that I could finish the job. But if I can't keep a spare
cartidge on the shelf then what the hell can I do? Other than get rid of
HP, that is.

Advertisements

http://www.interex.org/insidehp/articles/insidehp02.04.03.html
End Around: Chicago Tribune reporter Jim Coates wrote that his HP printer
quit on him one day, telling him that the black ink cartridge had expired. A
spare ink cartridge yielded the same results. HP support told Coates that
the printer software reads a date code on cartridges and blocks their use
after a set length of time. He was told the block could not be bypassed. But
it can: "The best way to defeat such a software scheme that uses a
computer's internal clock to enforce software copy protection or check
expiration dates is to set the computer to a past year when the days of the
week for every month fall on the same dates as this year," Coates wrote. "Do
this and your calendar continues to be accurate, and you fool the enforcers.
The pattern of dates associated with specific days usually rotates every six
or 11 years and always every 28 years. So, the 1997 calendar is exactly like
the 2003 calendar, and so is the 1975 one. Set your clock/calendar to either
year to fool the printer cartridge expiration-date check."

The first method entails momentarily replacing the existing expiring
HP c5010 & c5011 officejet d145 ink cartridges with an existing ink
cartridge (this second HP ink cartridge can be expired or not); then
cycling the power on the Hewlett Packard Office Jet d145 all-in-one
printer. Repeat with a third HP c5011 & c5010 ink cartridge (expired
or not). Replace the original after the obligatory cycling of the
power on the HP OfficeJet d145 all-in-one printer.

That stuff about print heads being destroyed by running out of ink is
pure unadulterated HP FUD (hey, he filled the ink - it never ran the
ink dry so dry print heads is not of concern in this excellent ng
thread).

The second method entals repairing the HP Office Jet d145 printer by
removing the restriction on date altogether. Simply disconnect the MPU
board CMOS battery (just remove it from the clips momentarily); short
the terminals of the MPU board battery connector (with the 120v power
off, of course); then re-connect.

The HP OfficeJet d145 boot-up sequence (which normally occurs only at
the factory) will go through a series of questions such as:
- What is the current date & time?
(change it by a year or two but not three!)
- How many sheets of paper for the B&W ink low-ink message?
- How many sheets of paper for the color ink low-ink message?

These methods have worked for thousands of successful HP printer
homeowners to eliminate the Hewlett Packard illegal restriction on
refilling HP printer ink cartridges. They will work for you too!

TT

"Calvin Crumrine" <> wrote in message
news:...
> Just had to throw out over $100 of HP ink cartridges due to expiration
> dates. No other reason, as far as I can tell the ink was still good but
> the printers wouldn't work with those cartridges.
>
> The worst part is that this won't be the last time-unless I get rid of
> those damned HP printers. (And from what I've heard that won't help-most
> printer manufacturers have taken this route to rip us off.)
>
> I mostly use the ink jets when I need to print in color-and I don't
> print in color a lot. I've learned 2 things over the years. First, when
> you run out of ink you'll do so when you're on a deadline. Second, if
> you're limited to a few local stores (like I am-I simply *can't* fly out
> at a moment's notice to buy an ink cartridge) then you can't count on
> them having the cartridges you need in stock-and that assumes that
> they're open when you run out (usually in the middle of the night).
>
> So I've learned to keep a spare cartridge 'on the shelf'-but those are
> the ones that I just threw out! Like I said, I don't print in color a
> lot and these last cartridges lasted longer than I expected-long enough
> for my spare cartridges to expire. Thank god I have several ink
> jets-enough that I could finish the job. But if I can't keep a spare
> cartidge on the shelf then what the hell can I do? Other than get rid of
> HP, that is.
>
> Suggestions?
>

http://www.interex.org/insidehp/articles/insidehp02.04.03.html
End Around: Chicago Tribune reporter Jim Coates wrote that his HP printer
quit on him one day, telling him that the black ink cartridge had expired. A
spare ink cartridge yielded the same results. HP support told Coates that
the printer software reads a date code on cartridges and blocks their use
after a set length of time. He was told the block could not be bypassed. But
it can: "The best way to defeat such a software scheme that uses a
computer's internal clock to enforce software copy protection or check
expiration dates is to set the computer to a past year when the days of the
week for every month fall on the same dates as this year," Coates wrote. "Do
this and your calendar continues to be accurate, and you fool the enforcers.
The pattern of dates associated with specific days usually rotates every six
or 11 years and always every 28 years. So, the 1997 calendar is exactly like
the 2003 calendar, and so is the 1975 one. Set your clock/calendar to either
year to fool the printer cartridge expiration-date check."

The first method entails momentarily replacing the existing expiring
HP c5010 & c5011 officejet d145 ink cartridges with an existing ink
cartridge (this second HP ink cartridge can be expired or not); then
cycling the power on the Hewlett Packard Office Jet d145 all-in-one
printer. Repeat with a third HP c5011 & c5010 ink cartridge (expired
or not). Replace the original after the obligatory cycling of the
power on the HP OfficeJet d145 all-in-one printer.

That stuff about print heads being destroyed by running out of ink is
pure unadulterated HP FUD (hey, he filled the ink - it never ran the
ink dry so dry print heads is not of concern in this excellent ng
thread).

The second method entals repairing the HP Office Jet d145 printer by
removing the restriction on date altogether. Simply disconnect the MPU
board CMOS battery (just remove it from the clips momentarily); short
the terminals of the MPU board battery connector (with the 120v power
off, of course); then re-connect.

The HP OfficeJet d145 boot-up sequence (which normally occurs only at
the factory) will go through a series of questions such as:
- What is the current date & time?
(change it by a year or two but not three!)
- How many sheets of paper for the B&W ink low-ink message?
- How many sheets of paper for the color ink low-ink message?

These methods have worked for thousands of successful HP printer
homeowners to eliminate the Hewlett Packard illegal restriction on
refilling HP printer ink cartridges. They will work for you too!

TT

"Calvin Crumrine" <> wrote in message
news:...
> Just had to throw out over $100 of HP ink cartridges due to expiration
> dates. No other reason, as far as I can tell the ink was still good but
> the printers wouldn't work with those cartridges.
>
> The worst part is that this won't be the last time-unless I get rid of
> those damned HP printers. (And from what I've heard that won't help-most
> printer manufacturers have taken this route to rip us off.)
>
> I mostly use the ink jets when I need to print in color-and I don't
> print in color a lot. I've learned 2 things over the years. First, when
> you run out of ink you'll do so when you're on a deadline. Second, if
> you're limited to a few local stores (like I am-I simply *can't* fly out
> at a moment's notice to buy an ink cartridge) then you can't count on
> them having the cartridges you need in stock-and that assumes that
> they're open when you run out (usually in the middle of the night).
>
> So I've learned to keep a spare cartridge 'on the shelf'-but those are
> the ones that I just threw out! Like I said, I don't print in color a
> lot and these last cartridges lasted longer than I expected-long enough
> for my spare cartridges to expire. Thank god I have several ink
> jets-enough that I could finish the job. But if I can't keep a spare
> cartidge on the shelf then what the hell can I do? Other than get rid of
> HP, that is.
>
> Suggestions?
>

"Jerry G." <> wrote in message
news:ce5emp$grc$...
> Does this problem also exist with the HP 930 series printers? I have a
> number of spare cartridges.
>

I have a Photosmart 1215, and the black cart has been in there for well over
a year. No expiration problems yet. Seems like it must be on some of the
very newest of models. I had never heard of this issue prior to this thread.
If that is what HP is doing, it is reprehensible, and I hope they get sued
for it.

Thor wrote:
> "Jerry G." <> wrote in message
> news:ce5emp$grc$...
>
>>Does this problem also exist with the HP 930 series printers? I have a
>>number of spare cartridges.
>>
>
>
> I have a Photosmart 1215, and the black cart has been in there for well over
> a year. No expiration problems yet. Seems like it must be on some of the
> very newest of models. I had never heard of this issue prior to this thread.
> If that is what HP is doing, it is reprehensible, and I hope they get sued
> for it.
>
>

One of my printers is a Photosmart 1115-about 2 years old IIRC. The
other is an Officejet 6110-a little over a year old IIRC. They use
different cartridges, naturally, and exhibited different symptoms but
both returned to normal operation after I installed a cartridge I'd just
purchased. This time I really looked, both at the box before I purchased
& at the cartridge when I installed it.

I noticed on the box a 'best installed by' date with a limited warranty
that was only good for 6 months after that date. This isn't real
prominent but if you look for it, it's there.

I also noticed several old cartridges still on the rack in the store.
(In particular, there were about 30 HP 45 cartridges on the rack. 25 of
them were dated July 2004. Others were dated as far back as November
2003.) The 'expired' cartridges I had were purchased shortly after I
bought the Officejet-about a year ago. Who knows how long they'd been in
the store? I suspect that I got old stock. (A couple of the cartridges
it's very likely-I got them on closeout when the local K-mart shut down.
I knew at the time that they were hauling stuff out of the far corners
of their warehouse, but never dreamed that the cartridges had an
expiration date.)

When I installed the cartridges I took a good look at them & noticed a
date stamped on the cartridge itself. I no longer remember the exact
date (and I'm not at my printer so I can't look) but it was sometime in
2006 or 2007. Well over a year from the 'best installed by' date. So it
appears that HP gives ample time to use up a cartridge-if it's new when
you install it. My problem, I suspect (still no answer from HP) is that
I got old stock & then left it on my shelf for over a year. The
cartridges that didn't work had dates stamped on them in 2003 & early 2004.

"Calvin Crumrine" <> wrote in message
news:...
> Thor wrote:
>
> > "Jerry G." <> wrote in message
> > news:ce5emp$grc$...
> >
> >>Does this problem also exist with the HP 930 series printers? I have a
> >>number of spare cartridges.
> >>
> >
> >
> > I have a Photosmart 1215, and the black cart has been in there for well
over
> > a year. No expiration problems yet. Seems like it must be on some of the
> > very newest of models. I had never heard of this issue prior to this
thread.
> > If that is what HP is doing, it is reprehensible, and I hope they get
sued
> > for it.
> >
> >
>
> One of my printers is a Photosmart 1115-about 2 years old IIRC. The
> other is an Officejet 6110-a little over a year old IIRC. They use
> different cartridges, naturally, and exhibited different symptoms but
> both returned to normal operation after I installed a cartridge I'd just
> purchased. This time I really looked, both at the box before I purchased
> & at the cartridge when I installed it.
>
> I noticed on the box a 'best installed by' date with a limited warranty
> that was only good for 6 months after that date. This isn't real
> prominent but if you look for it, it's there.
>
> I also noticed several old cartridges still on the rack in the store.
> (In particular, there were about 30 HP 45 cartridges on the rack. 25 of
> them were dated July 2004. Others were dated as far back as November
> 2003.) The 'expired' cartridges I had were purchased shortly after I
> bought the Officejet-about a year ago. Who knows how long they'd been in
> the store? I suspect that I got old stock. (A couple of the cartridges
> it's very likely-I got them on closeout when the local K-mart shut down.
> I knew at the time that they were hauling stuff out of the far corners
> of their warehouse, but never dreamed that the cartridges had an
> expiration date.)
>
> When I installed the cartridges I took a good look at them & noticed a
> date stamped on the cartridge itself. I no longer remember the exact
> date (and I'm not at my printer so I can't look) but it was sometime in
> 2006 or 2007. Well over a year from the 'best installed by' date. So it
> appears that HP gives ample time to use up a cartridge-if it's new when
> you install it. My problem, I suspect (still no answer from HP) is that
> I got old stock & then left it on my shelf for over a year. The
> cartridges that didn't work had dates stamped on them in 2003 & early
2004.

You should have been able to use them. Did you call HP? I see vendors
selling expired cartridges, guaranteeing they will work. Apparently, the
date is burned into the cartridge when it is installed, regardless of the
date???

Michael-NC wrote:
> "Calvin Crumrine" <> wrote in message
> news:...
>
>>Thor wrote:
>>
>>
>>>"Jerry G." <> wrote in message
>>>news:ce5emp$grc$...
>>>
>>>
>>>>Does this problem also exist with the HP 930 series printers? I have a
>>>>number of spare cartridges.
>>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>I have a Photosmart 1215, and the black cart has been in there for well
>
> over
>
>>>a year. No expiration problems yet. Seems like it must be on some of the
>>>very newest of models. I had never heard of this issue prior to this
>
> thread.
>
>>>If that is what HP is doing, it is reprehensible, and I hope they get
>
> sued
>
>>>for it.
>>>
>>>
>>
>>One of my printers is a Photosmart 1115-about 2 years old IIRC. The
>>other is an Officejet 6110-a little over a year old IIRC. They use
>>different cartridges, naturally, and exhibited different symptoms but
>>both returned to normal operation after I installed a cartridge I'd just
>>purchased. This time I really looked, both at the box before I purchased
>>& at the cartridge when I installed it.
>>
>>I noticed on the box a 'best installed by' date with a limited warranty
>>that was only good for 6 months after that date. This isn't real
>>prominent but if you look for it, it's there.
>>
>>I also noticed several old cartridges still on the rack in the store.
>>(In particular, there were about 30 HP 45 cartridges on the rack. 25 of
>>them were dated July 2004. Others were dated as far back as November
>>2003.) The 'expired' cartridges I had were purchased shortly after I
>>bought the Officejet-about a year ago. Who knows how long they'd been in
>>the store? I suspect that I got old stock. (A couple of the cartridges
>>it's very likely-I got them on closeout when the local K-mart shut down.
>>I knew at the time that they were hauling stuff out of the far corners
>>of their warehouse, but never dreamed that the cartridges had an
>>expiration date.)
>>
>>When I installed the cartridges I took a good look at them & noticed a
>>date stamped on the cartridge itself. I no longer remember the exact
>>date (and I'm not at my printer so I can't look) but it was sometime in
>>2006 or 2007. Well over a year from the 'best installed by' date. So it
>>appears that HP gives ample time to use up a cartridge-if it's new when
>>you install it. My problem, I suspect (still no answer from HP) is that
>>I got old stock & then left it on my shelf for over a year. The
>>cartridges that didn't work had dates stamped on them in 2003 & early
>
> 2004.
>
> You should have been able to use them. Did you call HP? I see vendors
> selling expired cartridges, guaranteeing they will work. Apparently, the
> date is burned into the cartridge when it is installed, regardless of the
> date???
>
>
>
Sent an email to HP, no reply yet (except the auto-reply "we've received
your message, we care about you-chump")

Coincidences are always possible, but the circumstances provide prima
facie proof that the dates (either manufacturing or expiration-just two
ends of the same range) are in the cartridge before it's installed.

Evidence: Two different HP printers using 2 different series of
cartridges. Both exhibited problems with unused cartridges that were
date stamped prior to the installation date. Both worked fine with new
cartridges that were date stamped in the future.

I'll admit that my conclusions would be firmer if I had more samples (if
I remember my statistics class the minimum sample universe from which
you can draw statistically significant conclusions is something like 30)
but I'm not inclined to spend my money trying to prove this. If HP
denies what I see for myself then I'll just go elsewhere. Bye-bye, HP.

"Calvin Crumrine" <> wrote in message
news:...
> Michael-NC wrote:
> > "Calvin Crumrine" <> wrote in message
> > news:...
> >
> >>Thor wrote:
> >>
> >>
> >>>"Jerry G." <> wrote in message
> >>>news:ce5emp$grc$...
> >>>
> >>>
> >>>>Does this problem also exist with the HP 930 series printers? I have
a
> >>>>number of spare cartridges.
> >>>>
> >>>
> >>>
> >>>I have a Photosmart 1215, and the black cart has been in there for well
> >
> > over
> >
> >>>a year. No expiration problems yet. Seems like it must be on some of
the
> >>>very newest of models. I had never heard of this issue prior to this
> >
> > thread.
> >
> >>>If that is what HP is doing, it is reprehensible, and I hope they get
> >
> > sued
> >
> >>>for it.
> >>>
> >>>
> >>
> >>One of my printers is a Photosmart 1115-about 2 years old IIRC. The
> >>other is an Officejet 6110-a little over a year old IIRC. They use
> >>different cartridges, naturally, and exhibited different symptoms but
> >>both returned to normal operation after I installed a cartridge I'd just
> >>purchased. This time I really looked, both at the box before I purchased
> >>& at the cartridge when I installed it.
> >>
> >>I noticed on the box a 'best installed by' date with a limited warranty
> >>that was only good for 6 months after that date. This isn't real
> >>prominent but if you look for it, it's there.
> >>
> >>I also noticed several old cartridges still on the rack in the store.
> >>(In particular, there were about 30 HP 45 cartridges on the rack. 25 of
> >>them were dated July 2004. Others were dated as far back as November
> >>2003.) The 'expired' cartridges I had were purchased shortly after I
> >>bought the Officejet-about a year ago. Who knows how long they'd been in
> >>the store? I suspect that I got old stock. (A couple of the cartridges
> >>it's very likely-I got them on closeout when the local K-mart shut down.
> >>I knew at the time that they were hauling stuff out of the far corners
> >>of their warehouse, but never dreamed that the cartridges had an
> >>expiration date.)
> >>
> >>When I installed the cartridges I took a good look at them & noticed a
> >>date stamped on the cartridge itself. I no longer remember the exact
> >>date (and I'm not at my printer so I can't look) but it was sometime in
> >>2006 or 2007. Well over a year from the 'best installed by' date. So it
> >>appears that HP gives ample time to use up a cartridge-if it's new when
> >>you install it. My problem, I suspect (still no answer from HP) is that
> >>I got old stock & then left it on my shelf for over a year. The
> >>cartridges that didn't work had dates stamped on them in 2003 & early
> >
> > 2004.
> >
> > You should have been able to use them. Did you call HP? I see vendors
> > selling expired cartridges, guaranteeing they will work. Apparently, the
> > date is burned into the cartridge when it is installed, regardless of
the
> > date???
> >
> >
> >
> Sent an email to HP, no reply yet (except the auto-reply "we've received
> your message, we care about you-chump")
>
> Coincidences are always possible, but the circumstances provide prima
> facie proof that the dates (either manufacturing or expiration-just two
> ends of the same range) are in the cartridge before it's installed.
>
> Evidence: Two different HP printers using 2 different series of
> cartridges. Both exhibited problems with unused cartridges that were
> date stamped prior to the installation date. Both worked fine with new
> cartridges that were date stamped in the future.
>
> I'll admit that my conclusions would be firmer if I had more samples (if
> I remember my statistics class the minimum sample universe from which
> you can draw statistically significant conclusions is something like 30)
> but I'm not inclined to spend my money trying to prove this. If HP
> denies what I see for myself then I'll just go elsewhere. Bye-bye, HP.

I don't blame you for that one bit. Apparently this expiration scheme is
targeted at business class printers but it's up to individual consumers to
decide whether they support such practices. I certainly wouldn't purchase a
HP product after hearing about this fiasco. Making someone go to the extreme
of setting back a bios clock in order to use their printer with a perfectly
fine, albeit "expired" cartridge to avoid the purchase of a new, overpriced
cartridge is the height of hubris.

Michael-NC wrote:
> "Calvin Crumrine" <> wrote in message
> news:...
>
>>Michael-NC wrote:
>>
>>>"Calvin Crumrine" <> wrote in message
>>>news:...
>>>
>>>
>>>>Thor wrote:
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>>"Jerry G." <> wrote in message
>>>>>news:ce5emp$grc$...
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>>Does this problem also exist with the HP 930 series printers? I have
>
> a
>
>>>>>>number of spare cartridges.
>>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>I have a Photosmart 1215, and the black cart has been in there for well
>>>
>>>over
>>>
>>>
>>>>>a year. No expiration problems yet. Seems like it must be on some of
>
> the
>
>>>>>very newest of models. I had never heard of this issue prior to this
>>>
>>>thread.
>>>
>>>
>>>>>If that is what HP is doing, it is reprehensible, and I hope they get
>>>
>>>sued
>>>
>>>
>>>>>for it.
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>
>>>>One of my printers is a Photosmart 1115-about 2 years old IIRC. The
>>>>other is an Officejet 6110-a little over a year old IIRC. They use
>>>>different cartridges, naturally, and exhibited different symptoms but
>>>>both returned to normal operation after I installed a cartridge I'd just
>>>>purchased. This time I really looked, both at the box before I purchased
>>>>& at the cartridge when I installed it.
>>>>
>>>>I noticed on the box a 'best installed by' date with a limited warranty
>>>>that was only good for 6 months after that date. This isn't real
>>>>prominent but if you look for it, it's there.
>>>>
>>>>I also noticed several old cartridges still on the rack in the store.
>>>>(In particular, there were about 30 HP 45 cartridges on the rack. 25 of
>>>>them were dated July 2004. Others were dated as far back as November
>>>>2003.) The 'expired' cartridges I had were purchased shortly after I
>>>>bought the Officejet-about a year ago. Who knows how long they'd been in
>>>>the store? I suspect that I got old stock. (A couple of the cartridges
>>>>it's very likely-I got them on closeout when the local K-mart shut down.
>>>>I knew at the time that they were hauling stuff out of the far corners
>>>>of their warehouse, but never dreamed that the cartridges had an
>>>>expiration date.)
>>>>
>>>>When I installed the cartridges I took a good look at them & noticed a
>>>>date stamped on the cartridge itself. I no longer remember the exact
>>>>date (and I'm not at my printer so I can't look) but it was sometime in
>>>>2006 or 2007. Well over a year from the 'best installed by' date. So it
>>>>appears that HP gives ample time to use up a cartridge-if it's new when
>>>>you install it. My problem, I suspect (still no answer from HP) is that
>>>>I got old stock & then left it on my shelf for over a year. The
>>>>cartridges that didn't work had dates stamped on them in 2003 & early
>>>
>>>2004.
>>>
>>>You should have been able to use them. Did you call HP? I see vendors
>>>selling expired cartridges, guaranteeing they will work. Apparently, the
>>>date is burned into the cartridge when it is installed, regardless of
>
> the
>
>>>date???
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>
>>Sent an email to HP, no reply yet (except the auto-reply "we've received
>>your message, we care about you-chump")
>>
>>Coincidences are always possible, but the circumstances provide prima
>>facie proof that the dates (either manufacturing or expiration-just two
>>ends of the same range) are in the cartridge before it's installed.
>>
>>Evidence: Two different HP printers using 2 different series of
>>cartridges. Both exhibited problems with unused cartridges that were
>>date stamped prior to the installation date. Both worked fine with new
>>cartridges that were date stamped in the future.
>>
>>I'll admit that my conclusions would be firmer if I had more samples (if
>>I remember my statistics class the minimum sample universe from which
>>you can draw statistically significant conclusions is something like 30)
>>but I'm not inclined to spend my money trying to prove this. If HP
>>denies what I see for myself then I'll just go elsewhere. Bye-bye, HP.
>
>
> I don't blame you for that one bit. Apparently this expiration scheme is
> targeted at business class printers but it's up to individual consumers to
> decide whether they support such practices. I certainly wouldn't purchase a
> HP product after hearing about this fiasco. Making someone go to the extreme
> of setting back a bios clock in order to use their printer with a perfectly
> fine, albeit "expired" cartridge to avoid the purchase of a new, overpriced
> cartridge is the height of hubris.
>
>
>
>
Just ran across this articlehttp://www.alotofthings.com/inkjetinformation/TheNewInkJetMarketplace.htm
Although the cartridges mentioned aren't the same as I have the article
does state definitely that some HP (and Lexmark) cartridges have the
expiration dates burned in at time of manufacture, not installation.

I think there might be two dates 'burned' into the HP 14 c5010a ink
cartridges.
1. FINAL EXPIRATION DATE (dies 4.5 years from date of manufacture)
2. IN-SERVICE DATE (dies 2.5 years from date of initial installation)
The "actual" HP14 ink cartrdige expiry date is the first of these two!

I think the 4.5 year expiry date is burned in at manufacture time;
I think the 30-month expiry date is burned in when you install it.

I don't think HP burns in a serial number;
I think it burns the actual date!

Witness these facts:
Today, Christmas Eve, my color cartridge said it was out of ink.
When I put a second cartridge in, it said the SAME THING even though
the cartridge was full of OEM ink (it was only used ONCE on the day I
bought it). Same with a third OEM full HP 14 color ink cartridge.

I infer that the 30-months contiguous service is burned into the smart
chip at the time of install.

Interesting, since all three cartridges were put in service on the same
day in the same machine, and all three are saying "out of ink" even
though only one can possibly be out of ink, I suspect the date burned
into each cartridge is the SAME DATE (and not some unique serial
number).

That is, I'm surmising, the HP D145 printer is seeing the second and
third ink cartridges EXACTLY the same as the first (it appears). If I
had only put them in service on a DIFFERENT DATE, then perhaps it would
recognize the second and third cartridges as different.

In summary, I think the HP D145 printer is assuming the three ink
cartridges are one and the same because all the HP ojd145 "sees" is
the same date burned into the smart chip on all three (which were put
in initial service in the same machine on that same date months ago).
Does this make any sense?

Not really !!!
"Orak Listalavostok" <> wrote in message
news:...
> > Just ran across this article
> >
> http://www.alotofthings.com/inkjetinformation/TheNewInkJetMarketplace.htm
> > some HP (and Lexmark) cartridges have the expiration dates burned in
> > at the time of manufacture, not the time of installation.
>
> I think there might be two dates 'burned' into the HP 14 c5010a ink
> cartridges.
> 1. FINAL EXPIRATION DATE (dies 4.5 years from date of manufacture)
> 2. IN-SERVICE DATE (dies 2.5 years from date of initial installation)
> The "actual" HP14 ink cartrdige expiry date is the first of these two!
>
> I think the 4.5 year expiry date is burned in at manufacture time;
> I think the 30-month expiry date is burned in when you install it.
>
> I don't think HP burns in a serial number;
> I think it burns the actual date!
>
> Witness these facts:
> Today, Christmas Eve, my color cartridge said it was out of ink.
> When I put a second cartridge in, it said the SAME THING even though
> the cartridge was full of OEM ink (it was only used ONCE on the day I
> bought it). Same with a third OEM full HP 14 color ink cartridge.
>
> I infer that the 30-months contiguous service is burned into the smart
> chip at the time of install.
>
> Interesting, since all three cartridges were put in service on the same
> day in the same machine, and all three are saying "out of ink" even
> though only one can possibly be out of ink, I suspect the date burned
> into each cartridge is the SAME DATE (and not some unique serial
> number).
>
> That is, I'm surmising, the HP D145 printer is seeing the second and
> third ink cartridges EXACTLY the same as the first (it appears). If I
> had only put them in service on a DIFFERENT DATE, then perhaps it would
> recognize the second and third cartridges as different.
>
> In summary, I think the HP D145 printer is assuming the three ink
> cartridges are one and the same because all the HP ojd145 "sees" is
> the same date burned into the smart chip on all three (which were put
> in initial service in the same machine on that same date months ago).
> Does this make any sense?
>

Before you burst a blood vessel (which might solve the problem of the
magenta ink ;-)) I think HP may have a policy of replacing outdated
full or nearly full cartridges.

I know someone here will have your answer, if you are patient. I would
not remove the battery, especially f it is precarious, until at least
hearing from someone who knows HP's policy.

Art

Orak Listalavostok wrote:
>>Just ran across this article
>>
>
> http://www.alotofthings.com/inkjetinformation/TheNewInkJetMarketplace.htm
>
>>some HP (and Lexmark) cartridges have the expiration dates burned in
>>at the time of manufacture, not the time of installation.
>
>
> I think there might be two dates 'burned' into the HP 14 c5010a ink
> cartridges.
> 1. FINAL EXPIRATION DATE (dies 4.5 years from date of manufacture)
> 2. IN-SERVICE DATE (dies 2.5 years from date of initial installation)
> The "actual" HP14 ink cartrdige expiry date is the first of these two!
>
> I think the 4.5 year expiry date is burned in at manufacture time;
> I think the 30-month expiry date is burned in when you install it.
>
> I don't think HP burns in a serial number;
> I think it burns the actual date!
>
> Witness these facts:
> Today, Christmas Eve, my color cartridge said it was out of ink.
> When I put a second cartridge in, it said the SAME THING even though
> the cartridge was full of OEM ink (it was only used ONCE on the day I
> bought it). Same with a third OEM full HP 14 color ink cartridge.
>
> I infer that the 30-months contiguous service is burned into the smart
> chip at the time of install.
>
> Interesting, since all three cartridges were put in service on the same
> day in the same machine, and all three are saying "out of ink" even
> though only one can possibly be out of ink, I suspect the date burned
> into each cartridge is the SAME DATE (and not some unique serial
> number).
>
> That is, I'm surmising, the HP D145 printer is seeing the second and
> third ink cartridges EXACTLY the same as the first (it appears). If I
> had only put them in service on a DIFFERENT DATE, then perhaps it would
> recognize the second and third cartridges as different.
>
> In summary, I think the HP D145 printer is assuming the three ink
> cartridges are one and the same because all the HP ojd145 "sees" is
> the same date burned into the smart chip on all three (which were put
> in initial service in the same machine on that same date months ago).
> Does this make any sense?
>

I should make it clear I did NOT say the "darn HP" header.
I was merely responding to a header I found in GOOGLE groups
(i.e., nntp on the web). The response looks like it came from me
because the original dozen or more prior activity for some reason
doesn't show up.

So, I'm not bursting a blood vessel although I agree it might
re-fill my magenta tanks (it's cold, so maybe the cyan too)

I'm a scientist so I would really love to figure out WHY this
happened.

Wierdly, after replacing the battery last night (Christmas eve),
nothing changed; but this morning I received an unexpected
Christmas gift from HP. One of the three cartridges now works!

I immediately refilled it (so as to not damage the separate
print heads). Here is all I know.

- 12 hours ago, all three cartridges failed to print.
- I removed the battery & finished wrapping the kid's presents
- More than an hour later, I put the battery back.
- Nothing seemed to have changed; it still would not print.
- However, accidentally, I had forgotten to test the ORIGINAL ink
- Today, at 7am the kids awoke to hand-written laels
- Later, I tried printing (LCD now-dated JAN 00 00 00:00a)
- The completely full HP 14 C1050a ink said "Color Ink Out"
- However ... a strange thing happened next ...
- I found the original HP14 tri-color accidentally set aside
- It printed!
- Huh? Surprised, I immediatly took it out of service
- As it was indeed low on cyan ink
- I flipped the cartridge upside down & refilled all three
- I added 1 ml or so (assuming 15 drops per milliliter) slowly
- This originally "Color Ink Out" cartridge now prints better than
before!
- I guess it's the high quality ink that replaces the HP OEM ink
- Either way, I am desperately trying to figure out WHY this happens?

My hypothesis (stated to see if it stands the test of scrutiny):
- The 4.5 year expiry date is burned into the HP14 at time of
manufacture
- The 30-month service date is burned into the HP14 at time of 1st
service
- The low-ink condition is saved (somehow) in the printer computer
- Note this is not the Windows computer but the OJ d145 computer
- Somehow, I needed to change TWO variables (I am guessing)
- The first variable was removing the CMOS battery
- Somehow, the second variable was chaning the date by 12 hours
- This last part doesn't make sense so I ask HP printing experts:

QUESTION:
When the "color ink out" message appears, where is that data stored?"

I also heard there is a device that can reset the smartchip cartridge. This
can probably be found through the ink cartridge refilling kit vendors.

"Arthur Entlich" <> wrote in message
news:Sefzd.21302$KO5.5822@clgrps13...
> Before you burst a blood vessel (which might solve the problem of the
> magenta ink ;-)) I think HP may have a policy of replacing outdated full
> or nearly full cartridges.
>
> I know someone here will have your answer, if you are patient. I would
> not remove the battery, especially f it is precarious, until at least
> hearing from someone who knows HP's policy.
>
> Art
>
>
>
> Orak Listalavostok wrote:
>
>>>Just ran across this article
>>>
>>
>> http://www.alotofthings.com/inkjetinformation/TheNewInkJetMarketplace.htm
>>
>>>some HP (and Lexmark) cartridges have the expiration dates burned in
>>>at the time of manufacture, not the time of installation.
>>
>>
>> I think there might be two dates 'burned' into the HP 14 c5010a ink
>> cartridges.
>> 1. FINAL EXPIRATION DATE (dies 4.5 years from date of manufacture)
>> 2. IN-SERVICE DATE (dies 2.5 years from date of initial installation)
>> The "actual" HP14 ink cartrdige expiry date is the first of these two!
>>
>> I think the 4.5 year expiry date is burned in at manufacture time;
>> I think the 30-month expiry date is burned in when you install it.
>>
>> I don't think HP burns in a serial number;
>> I think it burns the actual date!
>>
>> Witness these facts:
>> Today, Christmas Eve, my color cartridge said it was out of ink.
>> When I put a second cartridge in, it said the SAME THING even though
>> the cartridge was full of OEM ink (it was only used ONCE on the day I
>> bought it). Same with a third OEM full HP 14 color ink cartridge.
>>
>> I infer that the 30-months contiguous service is burned into the smart
>> chip at the time of install.
>>
>> Interesting, since all three cartridges were put in service on the same
>> day in the same machine, and all three are saying "out of ink" even
>> though only one can possibly be out of ink, I suspect the date burned
>> into each cartridge is the SAME DATE (and not some unique serial
>> number).
>>
>> That is, I'm surmising, the HP D145 printer is seeing the second and
>> third ink cartridges EXACTLY the same as the first (it appears). If I
>> had only put them in service on a DIFFERENT DATE, then perhaps it would
>> recognize the second and third cartridges as different.
>>
>> In summary, I think the HP D145 printer is assuming the three ink
>> cartridges are one and the same because all the HP ojd145 "sees" is
>> the same date burned into the smart chip on all three (which were put
>> in initial service in the same machine on that same date months ago).
>> Does this make any sense?
>>
>

Orak Listalavostok wrote:
> The unexplained HP engineering is why did three HP14 c5010a ink
> tanks (all of which were placed in service on the same date with
> all but one of which were immediately removed from service) report
> "COLOR INK OUT" (even when 2 of the 3 were full of HP OEM ink!)?

The good news:
- We're back printing beautifully (better than before) scores of prints
- Using (strangely) the original HP14 c5010a tri-color cartridge
- Which previously exhibited the correct "COLOR INK OUT" message!

The bad news:
- I have no idea what particular event "cleared" the HP "memory"

The lessons learned:
- Switching the three cartridges Dec 24 had no effect on COLOR INK OUT
- Filling the one empty cartridge also had no effect on COLOR INK OUT
- Removing the CR2032 3V CMOS battery had no immediate efect ...

The day after:
- Yet, about 12 hours later (on Christmas day)
- The completely full cartridge was removed ...
- And then replaced with the original empty cartridge ...

And it printed without error!
After subsequent refilling ... the original PRINTER INK OUT HP14
tri-color ink cartridge is printing beautifully vibrant photos even
after scores of sheets of paper (and multiple refills).

I guess it's the first Christmas present from HP to all of us.
I can't explain it; if you can - please do!

Without "being there", I am going to suggest there was a dirty contact
somewhere, that once the system read a low ink level, the other
cartridges did not register to remedy because that contact was not
getting new data from the new cartridges.

I suspect the contact got renewed once enough cartridges were run by it
during the testing process, and then they began to work. Possibly, the
other two might also work now.

However, although I don't know enough about HP printers, they might have
a problem similar to that which can crop up on Epsons with the Inteledge
chip. Occasionally, the printer will shut down waiting a replacement
cartridge due to an empty tank... with many Epson they use separate ink
tanks for each color. A person would replace the necessary color, but
due to a mess up in process, the printer would not acknowledge the new
cartridge (likely due to a dirty contact, or other similar problem).
When this happens with the Epson, if you then shut the printer down, it
will write the level of the last known cartridge to the chip on the new
one, and therefore deeming the new cartridge as "empty" also. This
cartridge is then read as empty unless the chip is reset with an
external or software resetting device, which many people do not own.

I am unsure if HP printers can create the same scenario or not.

Art

Orak Listalavostok wrote:
> Orak Listalavostok wrote:
>
>>The unexplained HP engineering is why did three HP14 c5010a ink
>>tanks (all of which were placed in service on the same date with
>>all but one of which were immediately removed from service) report
>>"COLOR INK OUT" (even when 2 of the 3 were full of HP OEM ink!)?
>
>
> ... twas the night before Christmas ... my HP ink level sank ...
> ... not a printer was printing ... nary one of 3 tanks ...
>
> The good news:
> - We're back printing beautifully (better than before) scores of prints
> - Using (strangely) the original HP14 c5010a tri-color cartridge
> - Which previously exhibited the correct "COLOR INK OUT" message!
>
> The bad news:
> - I have no idea what particular event "cleared" the HP "memory"
>
> The lessons learned:
> - Switching the three cartridges Dec 24 had no effect on COLOR INK OUT
> - Filling the one empty cartridge also had no effect on COLOR INK OUT
> - Removing the CR2032 3V CMOS battery had no immediate efect ...
>
> The day after:
> - Yet, about 12 hours later (on Christmas day)
> - The completely full cartridge was removed ...
> - And then replaced with the original empty cartridge ...
>
> And it printed without error!
> After subsequent refilling ... the original PRINTER INK OUT HP14
> tri-color ink cartridge is printing beautifully vibrant photos even
> after scores of sheets of paper (and multiple refills).
>
> I guess it's the first Christmas present from HP to all of us.
> I can't explain it; if you can - please do!
>
> Orak Listalavostok
>

Arthur Entlich wrote:
>
> Without "being there", I am going to suggest there was a dirty contact
> somewhere, that once the system read a low ink level, the other
> cartridges did not register to remedy because that contact was not
> getting new data from the new cartridges.
>
> I suspect the contact got renewed once enough cartridges were run by it
> during the testing process, and then they began to work. Possibly, the
> other two might also work now.
>
> However, although I don't know enough about HP printers, they might have
> a problem similar to that which can crop up on Epsons with the Inteledge
> chip. Occasionally, the printer will shut down waiting a replacement
> cartridge due to an empty tank... with many Epson they use separate ink
> tanks for each color. A person would replace the necessary color, but
> due to a mess up in process, the printer would not acknowledge the new
> cartridge (likely due to a dirty contact, or other similar problem).
> When this happens with the Epson, if you then shut the printer down, it
> will write the level of the last known cartridge to the chip on the new
> one, and therefore deeming the new cartridge as "empty" also. This
> cartridge is then read as empty unless the chip is reset with an
> external or software resetting device, which many people do not own.
>
> I am unsure if HP printers can create the same scenario or not.
>
> Art
>
> Orak Listalavostok wrote:
>
> > Orak Listalavostok wrote:
> >
> >>The unexplained HP engineering is why did three HP14 c5010a ink
> >>tanks (all of which were placed in service on the same date with
> >>all but one of which were immediately removed from service) report
> >>"COLOR INK OUT" (even when 2 of the 3 were full of HP OEM ink!)?
> >
> >
> > ... twas the night before Christmas ... my HP ink level sank ...
> > ... not a printer was printing ... nary one of 3 tanks ...
> >
> > The good news:
> > - We're back printing beautifully (better than before) scores of prints
> > - Using (strangely) the original HP14 c5010a tri-color cartridge
> > - Which previously exhibited the correct "COLOR INK OUT" message!
> >
> > The bad news:
> > - I have no idea what particular event "cleared" the HP "memory"
> >
> > The lessons learned:
> > - Switching the three cartridges Dec 24 had no effect on COLOR INK OUT
> > - Filling the one empty cartridge also had no effect on COLOR INK OUT
> > - Removing the CR2032 3V CMOS battery had no immediate efect ...
> >
> > The day after:
> > - Yet, about 12 hours later (on Christmas day)
> > - The completely full cartridge was removed ...
> > - And then replaced with the original empty cartridge ...
> >
> > And it printed without error!
> > After subsequent refilling ... the original PRINTER INK OUT HP14
> > tri-color ink cartridge is printing beautifully vibrant photos even
> > after scores of sheets of paper (and multiple refills).
> >
> > I guess it's the first Christmas present from HP to all of us.
> > I can't explain it; if you can - please do!
> >
> > Orak Listalavostok
> >

"Arthur Entlich" <> wrote in message
news:IUxzd.28542$dv1.27080@edtnps89...
> I suspect the contact got renewed once enough cartridges were run by it
> during the testing process, and then they began to work. Possibly, the
> other two might also work now.
>
> Occasionally, the printer will shut down waiting a replacement cartridge
> due to an empty tank... with many Epson they use separate ink tanks for
> each color. A person would replace the necessary color, but due to a mess
> up in process, the printer would not acknowledge the new cartridge (likely
> due to a dirty contact, or other similar problem). When this happens with
> the Epson, if you then shut the printer down, it will write the level of
> the last known cartridge to the chip on the new one, and therefore deeming
> the new cartridge as "empty" also. This cartridge is then read as empty
> unless the chip is reset with an external or software resetting device,
> which many people do not own.

This sounds like what happened to his HP office jet.
I'm guessing the HP printer's COPPER (not gold!) contacts are dirty.

Best to get some sandpaper of a decent grit, say 300 grit, and scrape
down the contacts in both the printer and on the cartridge until they lose
their copper color and turn a metalic gray color.

Sharon Smith wrote:
>
> "Arthur Entlich" <> wrote in message
> news:IUxzd.28542$dv1.27080@edtnps89...
> > I suspect the contact got renewed once enough cartridges were run by it
> > during the testing process, and then they began to work. Possibly, the
> > other two might also work now.
> >
> > Occasionally, the printer will shut down waiting a replacement cartridge
> > due to an empty tank... with many Epson they use separate ink tanks for
> > each color. A person would replace the necessary color, but due to a mess
> > up in process, the printer would not acknowledge the new cartridge (likely
> > due to a dirty contact, or other similar problem). When this happens with
> > the Epson, if you then shut the printer down, it will write the level of
> > the last known cartridge to the chip on the new one, and therefore deeming
> > the new cartridge as "empty" also. This cartridge is then read as empty
> > unless the chip is reset with an external or software resetting device,
> > which many people do not own.
>
> This sounds like what happened to his HP office jet.
> I'm guessing the HP printer's COPPER (not gold!) contacts are dirty.
>
> Best to get some sandpaper of a decent grit, say 300 grit, and scrape
> down the contacts in both the printer and on the cartridge until they lose
> their copper color and turn a metalic gray color.
>
> This is what is recommended on the HP site anyway.

All of the HP, Lexmart, Cannon and Epson inkjet cartridges that i have
had gold contacts.
Copper can get a rather non-conductive oxide and/or sulfide film
rather fast in some areas.
If you can easily sandpaper off that color, it ain't copper; no
manufacturer would plate a thin film of copper onto any other metal -
but they would plate a thin film of gold.
Copper has a "reddish" color (look at a new uncirculated penny for
reference), and gold has a "yellowish" color (look at a 24 carat gold
coin, like a standing liberty or a maple leaf for reference).

Let's just say it is LESS easy. Epson uses gold plated contacts for
their cartridge contacts as well, and they still occasionally have problems.

As I stated, I wasn't there, so I'm guessing. I'm assuming the incident
was accurately reported, and I can't think of a good reason for a
cartridge with a head built in would have a expiration date that would
shut down the printer.

It's always possible there was another malfunction of some sort. Not
every incident can be explained logically in lock-step.

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