Throughout the Churchs history, it has warred with Islam. Yet, it has nothing to offer us today. This is the typical answer I get when I discuss Christian history with many Evangelicals. They tell me that beyond the Bible, there is nothing else we need. So next time you have a fire in the house, read the Bible, dont forget to pray while you forget dialing 911 and enjoy the smoke and fire billowing inside the house.

I find it difficult to even ask questions: What was Christian history like, that withstood Islams evil and defeated it in Europe? Why and how did Christendom lose Egypt and Asia Minor to Islam? And what are we doing in our days to emulate or not emulate from that history?

The one million dollar question that no one can answer  although I will get many remarks from people damning me as a heretic  is this: Why did God choose Catholics to stop Islam in its tracks in all the major battles intended to destroy Christendom? Anyone who has the answer, please step forward.

What do most spirit-filled evangelicals know about the Battle of Lepanto, Battle of Tours, The Battle of Vienna, and The Battle of Malta?

Had the damned Catholics not fought the Battle of Tours, all of Europe would have been Muslim today, like in Asia Minor. It would have been the end of Christianity, as we know it. Today, Turkey (Byzantium) is 99% Muslim and looks very likely to produce the Antichrist while Evangelicals still think that Antichrist and the Harlot is the Roman Catholic Church.

Why is it so rare to find holy spirit-filled evangelicals that speak of such history, except paint it as Crusader, dark, warring and bloodthirsty? What difference then is there between the die-hard liberal and the spirit-filled evangelical? Both criticize this history. Even further, like many evangelicals and liberals, the Muslims also condemn this history. So why do we echo their interpretation as we damn the Catholic?

Why? Is it because of them damned Catholics who defended Christendom and saved the Protestants from utter annihilation? Could it be perhaps the Catholics did something right, like fight them damned Muslims and thwart them from annihilating Christendom?

In all these battles there were no Protestants coming to help save Europe and Protestant states refrained from helping or even lifting a finger. They were too busy doing Bible studies on how them damned Catholics were the Antichrist.

Perhaps I need to exercise the typical American habit before speaking about such matters and prequalify my statements. I am not saying that all Protestants are evil, heavens no. Yet, every time I say the word Catholic and the whole church jumps up and down pin-pointing the leaven of the Catholics without even looking into the piles of dung worth of heretical books produced by so-called evangelicals.

Is the rich Catholic history such an evil subject that the Bible warned us not to touch and even beat down on the Catholic wars with Islam? Even during Nazism, there were many more of these damned Catholics that chose to die in Hitlers ovens than there were evangelicals and Protestants put together. Are these Catholics damned to hell despite making a choice to enter Hitlers furnace? Which of the two is more pleasing to God, the sodomite loving pastor or the Jew loving Catholic who died in the infernos of Hitlers crematoria?

So who will answer my questions? Will it be some unlearned, half-cocked, spikey-haired, tattooed, nose-pierced, ear ringed, mocking, useless, teenage brained heretic from The Free Grace Movement who will instantly obtain from his own authority to anathematize and excommunicate me since such homosexual sodomite sinners must be welcomed into the fold as Christians without repentance? Will such mutants be the future soldiers who will outdo the Knights of Saint John and fight to thwart the forces of darkness and the devil? What will they use to fight, the earrings of their noses and the spikes of their stupid looking hair? Or perhaps these are the very sons of the devil?

Must I denounce the Pope as a heretic while I remain silent on Americas pastor, this self-appointed son-of-the-devil-pope named Rick Warren who signs a treaty with Islam saying we worship the same God? Dare I say anything on that fattened whore who pussyfoots with homosexuality while he condemns the Crusaders in that very treaty?

Perhaps these things can aid in answering my question, which Ive asked more than once and no one seems to have answered: During my two-decade walk in my Holy Spirit filled evangelical faith; Jesus said: I will build my church and the gates of hell shall not prevail against it. Well, in two thousand years, who was this church? Was the church lost from the time the authors of the New Testament departed until the time the holy Martin Luther showed up? Hitler used Martin Luthers demonic writ, On The Jews and Their Lies, to help him rid Europe of six million Jews.

Evangelicals answer this dilemma by saying that the true Church was always there but it was persecuted by them damned Catholics. Yet, such answers are impossible to prove. Perhaps some Jesus-style questions will help clarify this issue. So which Christian movement was it that them damned Catholics persecuted? Was it the Montanists, Novationists, Donatists, Docetists, Cathars, Albigensians, Waldenses, Hussites, and the followers of Wycliff? Were these The Church that Jesus spoke about? Were these the true Bible-believing, evangelical-type, spirit-filled believers?

There is no historian who will tell you that these movements even fit into the definition of evangelical spirit-filled model. Such movements, which the Catholics squashed (thank God), were radically non-Christian, heretical, and gnostic. Only the Waldenses and the Hussites were somewhat Christian but even these were closer to Catholicism than they were evangelical. How would a common Holy Spirit-filled evangelical even know what these movements are all about? After all, we only need the Bible and the hell with history, right? To ignore history is to also ignore the Bible.

Even Martin Luther and the Protestant movement, which came up with the Westminster Confession of Faith (WCF) that is adhered to by protestant denominations, in fact, aided the Ottoman Muslims and provided them with tin to build canons to destroy catholic states because in their view, the Catholic Church was the Harlot of Babylon and the Antichrist.

So important was this WCF that it was an essential doctrine of the faith and was non-negotiable. If the Trinity was essential, so was this belief regarding Catholics. Despite Islams overt denial of the Trinity, it was never even mentioned in the WCF while the Catholics who prevented the annihilation of Christendom, took precedence over Islam when it came to that document, despite Islam being the religion of Antichrist. Even Martin Luther himself came around on this issue to confess after reading the writing of the Catholic Riccaldo Di Montecroce in his wonderful work, Refutation of The Quran. As a result, Luther changed his views and even according to him Islam was the system of Antichrist, yet the WCF never even included it.

And lest I get into grace versus works theology One thing is certain; Jesus gave the example about the good worker and the gung-ho church-goers of His day when He chose the Samaritan over the Pharisee who walked by the persecuted beaten naked man and did nothing, claiming he was doing the Lords business. If we take that example, the Samaritan in that time would be viewed as the way we view a Catholic; he was all screwed up and got it all wrong. The Samaritan didnt even follow Sola Scriptura and his canon of Scripture was missing many books. He even believed such madness that the Temple was on mount Gerizim and not Jerusalem. Yet, Jesus honored the Samaritan over the Pharisee who got both the Bible and Temple correct  but helped not, the persecuted.

When Jesus comes, He will throw in hell many damned Catholics and them damned Evangelicals for not helping persecuted un-damned Jews, un-damned Catholics and un-damned Evangelicals and other un-damned others (Matthew 25). Today, neither Catholic nor Protestant is doing much to save Christians slaughtered in Muslim countries. Name me the organization that rescues Christians today? There are NONE. We try and our supporters are predominately Armenian, Copts and Assyrians. Where is Americas pastor? Where are the American Evangelicals and Catholics? Perhaps I should follow the Copt, Assyrian or even Armenian and dump this modernized homosexual-loving, Americanized version of Christianity.

While we accuse these ancient churches of holding to deuterocanonical books like The Wisdom of Solomon, which Evangelicals reject, in less than fifty words, sums up the entire purpose of the Incarnation of the Son of God and why God became man:

While all things were in quiet silence, and the night was in the midst of her swift course, Thine almighty Word leaped out of Heaven out of Thy royal throne, as a fierce man of war, into the midst of a land of destruction. (Wisdom of Solomon, 18:14-15)

Who is this Thine almighty Word? Who was The Word? When will He leap from out of Heaven and out of Thy Royal throne? When will He be this man of war? Is this not a prophecy about Christ coming to battle in the end of days? Who is He battling with? The Catholics, who preserved the Bible  including The Wisdom of Solomon? Has wisdom departed from earth that no man can point it out? Isnt the Holy Spirit leading me to re-discover such prophecies struck out of the American evangelical Bibles? Is Polycarp who was the student of John unnecessary for study? Was Irenaeus his student so unimportant? Was the Coptic Church that was founded by Saint Mark of the Bible unimportant? Was it not Christ who built that Church in Egypt? Even when the Portuguese first entered India they found native Christians who, to their surprise, declared their apostolic succession to St. Thomas.

When I first became Christian, I entered an Evangelical Church that taught me that in Daniel chapter II, the two legs were the Eastern and Western churches (Orthodox and Catholic) and that these were the spirit of Antichrist. Yet, I never believed them because I examined the Word of God and discovered that Bible prophecies were speaking of Islam. Was I not following the Bible or were these Evangelicals misinterpreting the Bible? It was the Evangelicals who also misinterpreted many things in the Bible.

I reject all doctrines that differ with the Bible but for centuries, Holy Protestants have pointed to several Popes as Antichrist, which have all turned out to be false. Is this not unholy slander? Did Jesus not warn about such damned slanderers?

We trumpet: my people perish for the lack of knowledge when we, the ones who trumpet such verses are perishing. There is a difference between knowing the Bible and doing the Bible.

But there is also a difference between emotionally loving Jesus and doing what Jesus says. We preach something. Yet, we follow the opposite; we continue in lacking knowledge.

As a result, we see things from a certain prism we think is holy and is not.

On a Monday, Henry VIII was a staunch Roman Catholic and all his scribes and historians celebrated, rightly, Catholicism’s defeating the Muslims. It was in the curriculum. On Tuesday, Henry decided his Catholic wife was the reason he couldn’t father a male heir. When Henry bolted from Rome, all thse scribes and historians - being fond of their heads and allergic to the Traitors Gate - rewrote it all. All things Roman Catholic were bad. The new curriculum corrected the old “errors”. So we Americans, steeped in our English heritage are ignorant of Charles Martel at Tours, Spain’s Catholic Reconquista; Lepanto, Vienna and even the true history of the Crusades. We have been taught for hundreds of years that the spiritual world is flat, not round, and to discount clear thinking heroes because they were Roman Catholic.

When the Muslims start killing Evangelicals ...wait, they already are.... Jesus won’t be there to defend your daughters being raped; your wives being made slaves; your pastors being crucified. That’s already happening in Iran, Iraq and in Africa. Jesus wants you to think like an Israeli and like Isabella of Aragon and kill the bastards instead of singing hymns and waving your arms in the air. Don’t hand me the pap about Jesus will win. You are his instrument in this world and unless you are ready to think clearly and fight you are failing Him.

You make a good point. Keeping your head is a powerful incentive for joining the revisionist crowd.

Most history majors these days will join whatever camp they have to in order to gain tenure or get a job so what would they do were they physically in danger? Revisionists with an agenda seem to outnumber honest historians these days, but it could be a lot worse.

7
posted on 06/13/2013 5:41:37 AM PDT
by Rashputin
(Jesus Christ doesn't evacuate His troops, He leads them to victory.)

I am a member of the “nuke them all and let God sort them out” party. In fact, most people at my church (and as far as I can tell, in my denomination) feel the same way. Letting evil triumph and kill inocents is disobeying God.

Give them one last chance to convert by dropping tracts on them for a week or so, then elimniate the problem as a defense of the innocents. (moslems will eventually kill the innocents, it’s what they do and what they are commanded to do by tehir scriptures.)

Unfortunately we cannot let anyone, even new converts to Christianity, out of the target countries as moslems are commanded to lie to gain advantage. At least the new converts would know they will be with Jesus soon.

It's out there but most people seem to be carrying their own personal Electronic Dark Age with them wherever they go. It seems to me there are an awful lot of people who have bought into the idea of the electronic age being about freedom from information.

They're each in their own little pouch 224/7 like an infant kangaroo and want to be sure they never find out anything makes their cozy pouch less comfortable. They're not the least bit interested in facts other than as specifications for a new toy.

15
posted on 06/13/2013 6:08:58 AM PDT
by Rashputin
(Jesus Christ doesn't evacuate His troops, He leads them to victory.)

Throughout the Churchs history, it has warred with Islam. Yet, it has nothing to offer us today. This is the typical answer I get when I discuss Christian history with many Evangelicals. They tell me that beyond the Bible, there is nothing else we need. So next time you have a fire in the house, read the Bible, dont forget to pray while you forget dialing 911 and enjoy the smoke and fire billowing inside the house.

Catholics and their apologists could make a better case against the all-sufficiency of the scriptures if they weren't so loudly opposed to the total inerrancy of scripture.

Considering that the Protestant attitude towards chrstian oral tradition has its origins in the catholic attitude towards the Sinaitic Oral Tradition ("Modern Judaism isn't Biblical! It was invented by the Talmud!"), the constant attacks on the consistency of Protestants is hypocritical in the extreme.

I gave a friend from Kuwait who is now a Baptist a handgun for his birthday and he kissed it. Kissing a gift is about the same as saying “thank you” but don’t let reality get in the way of good propaganda.

23
posted on 06/13/2013 8:46:46 AM PDT
by Rashputin
(Jesus Christ doesn't evacuate His troops, He leads them to victory.)

So now that you've finally accepted that Jesus Christ is God from God, our Savior, you want to join your fellow Christians (who you no longer say are hapless and stupid dupes of a fraudulent religion) and discuss something with Christians?

How nice, I'm glad you've finally accepted Jesus Christ as your Lord.

Now if you could drop that Palestinian propaganda catch phrase intended to slander of Jews as your screen name . . .

24
posted on 06/13/2013 8:51:14 AM PDT
by Rashputin
(Jesus Christ doesn't evacuate His troops, He leads them to victory.)

I gave a friend from Kuwait who is now a Baptist a handgun for his birthday and he kissed it. Kissing a gift is about the same as saying thank you but dont let reality get in the way of good propaganda

Would you kiss the book written by haSatan ?

Why should anyone who seeks salvation from the G-d of Abraham, Isaac and Israel ?

To be polite in the way folks from that area are polite the same way he is polite to Jews who deny that Jesus Christ is the Son of God and say that Christians are all fools deluded by a false religion.

26
posted on 06/13/2013 9:16:25 AM PDT
by Rashputin
(Jesus Christ doesn't evacuate His troops, He leads them to victory.)

Were all the non-Catholic churches of the time, pro-Islam or something?
Were there lots of big arguments between the various Christian denominations and among the secular voters about whether to fight conquering invaders or not, how was Christian, non-Christian, and government discussion handled at the time?

Zionist Conspirator has stated they were once Catholic. I get the distinct impression that since becoming a Zionist, Zionist Conspirator has rejected Jesus Christ and follows some modern sect or cult based solely on the Old Testament. Zionist Conspirator can correct me if I'm wrong.

Most people, at least in the US, don't realize the Roman Empire didn't fall until hundreds of years after the Western Empire had fallen apart so they don't realize that Constantinople was the capital of the Roman Empire for nearly as long as Rome was.

You just can't get some people past the incorrect translation of "mountains" as "hills" so they can claim Rome, built on thirteen hills, is the capital of the evil empire. Forget the fact that Constantinople where the Caliphate was centered was built on seven and only seven hills, it doesn't fit with the Bestselling Surrender and Evacuate Doctrine.

"True Bible Scholars", though, know that Cincinnati, OH will be the real headquarters of the AntiChrist empire. That's where Procter & Gamble which has for so long put Satanic moon god pictures on their products is headquartered and Procter & Gamble has the advertising savvy to give the prophet of the AntiChrist the springboard he'll use to to sway the masses. /sarc (is that really needed?)

34
posted on 06/13/2013 11:53:57 AM PDT
by Rashputin
(Jesus Christ doesn't evacuate His troops, He leads them to victory.)

1 Corinthians 2:1 And when I came to you, brethren, I did not come with superiority of speech or of wisdom, proclaiming to you the testimony of God. 2 For I determined to know nothing among you except Jesus Christ, and Him crucified.

On a Monday, Henry VIII was a staunch Roman Catholic and all his scribes and historians celebrated, rightly, Catholicisms defeating the Muslims. It was in the curriculum. On Tuesday, Henry decided his Catholic wife was the reason he couldnt father a male heir. When Henry bolted from Rome, all thse scribes and historians - being fond of their heads and allergic to the Traitors Gate - rewrote it all.

Oh but history proves that the other way around - It is rightly said the Roman church invented propaganda - One cannot accuse the English Crown, and not admit the MANY instances of proven inclusions and outright forgeries evidenced in the Roman church's history, by it's own hand. Anyone who would accept the Roman tradition on it's face has not investigated it's provenance, to be certain.

All things Roman Catholic were bad. The new curriculum corrected the old errors. So we Americans, steeped in our English heritage are ignorant of Charles Martel at Tours, Spains Catholic Reconquista; Lepanto, Vienna and even the true history of the Crusades. We have been taught for hundreds of years that the spiritual world is flat, not round, and to discount clear thinking heroes because they were Roman Catholic.

Oh please. I read your words and find it hilariously fist pumping for the Roman church. What of Innocent III and De Montfort's extermination of the Languedoc? Why no mention of the war against the Waldenses, The whole of the European Crusades, the Conquistadors in the Americas? The Inquisitions? Why aren't you declaring these mighty men and heroes?

I find it no surprise that you seem to have made no mention of these. The Roman cup is full of innocent slaughtered blood, steeped in lies, intrigue, and corruption, and it has been since it's inception.

There is only one that claims to be authorized of YHWH. There is only one that changed the times and laws. There is only one that claims to be YHWH on earth. There is only ONE that is the fullness of the Pagan rites... And it sits on seven hills.

36
posted on 06/13/2013 12:13:00 PM PDT
by roamer_1
(Globalism is just socialism in a business suit.)

You tell me, you're the one calling the Anti-Christ, Satanic, Muzzies a distraction and Christians the real problem.

No, I am telling you that I most certainly will not be swimming the Tiber because of the Muslim horde. that does not nullify 'Come out of her, my people'. The Roman church can pat her own back all she wants, it doesn't change the cup she holds.

'Horns like a lamb, but speaks like a dragon'... here's your sign...

43
posted on 06/13/2013 12:46:40 PM PDT
by roamer_1
(Globalism is just socialism in a business suit.)

I don't ask folks who flee from a Crucifix like a bunch of low budget movie Vampires to do anything.

I simply posted what I think is an excellent article that addresses some of the silly divisions and the lies and absurd thinking that serve to divide Christians. Divisions and lies encouraged along with the spreading of blasphemies by both ignorant, misled, people, and people who claim to be Christian and are not, or who claim to be Jews and are not and who are in reality liars from the synagogue of Satan.

44
posted on 06/13/2013 1:21:50 PM PDT
by Rashputin
(Jesus Christ doesn't evacuate His troops, He leads them to victory.)

I simply posted what I think is an excellent article that addresses some of the silly divisions and the lies and absurd thinking that serve to divide Christians. Divisions and lies encouraged along with the spreading of blasphemies by both ignorant, misled, people, and people who claim to be Christian and are not, or who claim to be Jews and are not and who are in reality liars from the synagogue of Satan.

Right. I know about them- The Roman church and her false ecumenicsim, the lies of popery, the absurd thinking of tradition. the division created by claimed authority and conversion by the sword. The blasphemy of idolatry and paganism, pantheons of saints... alternatives to Yeshua (anti-christ)...

That is not the TRUTH of YHWH. Unity will come in truth.

45
posted on 06/13/2013 1:46:00 PM PDT
by roamer_1
(Globalism is just socialism in a business suit.)

My you are a bird walker. In your rush to say “nanny nanny boo boo” you missed the point. The only point I am making is that our American view on history is colored by our English heritage and that heritage is colored by Henry VIII’s dynastic progeny difficulties and Henry’s decision to make himself “head of the church in England”. He achieved his Defender of the Faith moniker for refuting Luther. Once he broke with Rome, any teacher, historian or writer did so at peril of his life. Ask Thomas More. In your “Oh, please” doesn’t address my point: Charles Martel, Ferdinand and Isabella, Jan Sobieski are either untaught or unrecognized in English / American military history.

Regarding the Crusades: the Bible is replete with epistles to churches throughout present day Turkey, Lebanon, Iraq and Syria. The same is true of North Africa. Islam conquered and destroyed all of them. The Crusades were a defensive response to Islamic expansionism.

My you are a bird walker. In your rush to say nanny nanny boo boo you missed the point. The only point I am making is that our American view on history is colored by our English heritage and that heritage is colored by Henry VIIIs dynastic progeny difficulties and Henrys decision to make himself head of the church in England. He achieved his Defender of the Faith moniker for refuting Luther. Once he broke with Rome, any teacher, historian or writer did so at peril of his life. Ask Thomas More. In your Oh, please doesnt address my point: Charles Martel, Ferdinand and Isabella, Jan Sobieski are either untaught or unrecognized in English / American military history.

I am not missing any point. I declared the point too narrow. The OP is, like you seemed to have, glossing over the horrible atrocities the Roman church has intentionally performed. If you care to complain about Martel not being taught, why then shouldn't De Montfort be taught too? why did that fail to come to mind?

Regarding the Crusades: the Bible is replete with epistles to churches throughout present day Turkey, Lebanon, Iraq and Syria. The same is true of North Africa. Islam conquered and destroyed all of them. The Crusades were a defensive response to Islamic expansionism.

not the ones in Europe. And the Jews might have a different view of the 'defensive responses' of the Roman church in the Holy Land and Spain.

50
posted on 06/13/2013 4:35:19 PM PDT
by roamer_1
(Globalism is just socialism in a business suit.)

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