Nancy Kalish, Ph.D. is the author of Lost & Found Lovers, a book about her research on people who go back to lost loves. She has been doing this work for 11 years, and has a web site, You can see links before reply with a discussion board. Now she has completed a new survey of adults who have not tried a reunion with a lost love. Her findings suggest that men may be more "romantic" than women.

We too often define "romantic" in women's terms -- the flowers and cards, saving items and putting them in a scrapbook or listening to romantic songs all day long.

The men may not do these things, but they do something more romantic than all that:

Dr. Kalish's survey asked "how long did it take for you to get over your lost love?' The men tended to take longer to get over a lost love than the women. And some of the men were not satisfied with the survey choices.. The last choice listed was, "Over 10 years."Only the men crossed out all the choices and wrote, "I never got over her." While no doubt some women never got over their lost loves either, only the men wrote this comment in the margins.

Adolescent boys are not supposed to cry for a lost love. But many of Dr. Kalish's male participants cried hard, in private, nightly...for months.

This is not just a reunion phenomenon. Dr. Kalish is finding the same results in her First Love experience survey - for adults who have never tried a reunion with a lost love. There are significantly more men who chose to answer this survey than women, and they express strong feelings for their first loves, even though they have not contacted her (and may never do so).

Members of Dr. Kalish's web site, who are permitted to post messages, seem to be more represented by women than men. But Kalish warns that appearances are misleading. There are slightly more men who paid to join than women. The men don't post as often as the women

-- but they are reading!

Men are less likely to initiate leaving their marriages than women, and over the last few years, there is little difference between the number of men who have affairs versus the number of women. As more women entered the workplace, they found the same temptations there.

Dr. Kalish also offers private phone consultations. Men more often want to talk to her about their lost loves than women.

But it is a rare magazine that is pitched to men that will print a story about love and romance. The media think men are uninterested. Not so!

As Valentine's Day approaches, we should all remember that men express themselves differently -- and that does not mean worse than -- women. If women want men to open up, says Kalish, they have to take men on their own terms, not try to make them express their feelings like a woman would.

Men may not make scrapbooks of their love experiences, but they are every bit as loving, loyal, and yes, romantic, as women.

The Great OV!!!

07-02-07, 02:34 AM

Dr. Kalish's survey asked "how long did it take for you to get over your lost love?' The men tended to take longer to get over a lost love than the women. And some of the men were not satisfied with the survey choices.. The last choice listed was, "Over 10 years."Only the men crossed out all the choices and wrote, "I never got over her." While no doubt some women never got over their lost loves either, only the men wrote this comment in the margins.

YES! I have been saying that forever! All my guy friend are like "Tom, you are never gonna get over her" and the girls are like "Come on, get over her already".....dumb people just don't get it, I can't.

Nice find. If it is legit....some psychologists are wackos...but I can relate to it by experience.

--------------------

Junket

07-02-07, 02:53 AM

From my experience, besides food, the quickest way to a guy's heart is through his ego.

Tiay

07-02-07, 04:06 AM

women like shallow stuff like flowers and shit whereas [all] men are truly romantic, this is proved by how long it takes them to move on"....
anybody see the above in it?
actually, I do agree with it in general; Men are generalised as having no feelings, just being after the physical, etc. In fact, I think most men definitely have feelings just as deep and romantic as women do.

anachronistic

07-02-07, 06:50 AM

Pfft... Well I didn't bother to read all that. I just thought "Wow. What a generalized question."

Tiay

07-02-07, 07:19 AM

in this aspect though, men deserve to be generalised in a favourable way for once.

anachronistic

07-02-07, 07:22 AM

in this aspect though, men deserve to be generalised in a favourable way for once.

Well fine, make a general judgement then.

I guess this makes me a truly unique guy though, since I have many romantic qualities.

Junket

07-02-07, 07:25 AM

I guess this makes me a truly unique guy though

::cough::BULLSHIT::cough::

anachronistic

07-02-07, 07:34 AM

::cough::BULLSHIT::cough::

...gee thanks. :mad:

____

artyemi

07-02-07, 09:31 AM

I think every individual is romantic in different ways.

Some women will never get over the lost love. Some men will never get over their lost love.

Like two years ago I met a super awesome dude. Never a single flower, or cards, or anything like that. Just a simple invitation to drink beer and an occasional offer to drop me off at home. Oh man. It was quite a lost to see him leave. Or maybe it could have been a crush.

Oh, and I had a crush on this guy in the second grade for the longest time. Over 15 years. :( And even when we were working for the same company we never saw each other. Talk about higher powers. I run into his sister, I run into his brother, but never him.

michaelmorgan

08-02-07, 03:01 AM

Men are becoming more and more feminine.
Women the other way around.
Men are experiencing this much faster than women.

Result: everyone is talking about emotions, hurt, pain, trust, communication.
Mating is happening today on a bed of love guides, psychology books.
We lost our roots, and we are left in the winds of personal history, peer pressure and hollywood happy ends.

No wonder therapists get rich. :)

The Great OV!!!

08-02-07, 03:36 AM

Men are becoming more and more feminine.
Women the other way around.
Men are experiencing this much faster than women.

Result: everyone is talking about emotions, hurt, pain, trust, communication.
Mating is happening today on a bed of love guides, psychology books.
We lost our roots, and we are left in the winds of personal history, peer pressure and hollywood happy ends.

No wonder therapists get rich. :)

Not everyone. Anyways, wtf is feminine anyway? since when did females pettin...pattin...(however you spell that shit) talking about emotions? Thats like looking at a Lion roar and saying ...OMG..that mother ****er is becoming such a dinosaur...what a phony! big fat phony!.

To me when I think of "feminine" I think of the physique and body type. Like girls have feminine eyes and waist...I have not seen man have that yet...although some try...lol

Junket

08-02-07, 03:38 AM

Men are becoming more and more feminine.
Women the other way around.
Men are experiencing this much faster than women.

Result: everyone is talking about emotions, hurt, pain, trust, communication.
Mating is happening today on a bed of love guides, psychology books.
We lost our roots, and we are left in the winds of personal history, peer pressure and hollywood happy ends.

No wonder therapists get rich. :)

Yeah...one day we'll all be wearin' dresses...

michaelmorgan

08-02-07, 04:04 AM

Sure we will. Some of us have started with ear rings, dying hair, removing hair, watching soap-opera porn :)
When you find in a man's bathroom 3 body lotions, 8 perfumes and whatever else....
Metrosexuality rules! :)

I painted an extreme picture, but...it's happening unfortunately.

vashti

08-02-07, 04:30 AM

in this aspect though, men deserve to be generalised in a favourable way for once.

Ture, if one considers the need for romance to be a *positive* quality.

Anyway, I have long felt men were at least as "romantic" as teenage girls, and I think the girls tend to outgrow simple definitions of romance that men continue to cling to (such as roses and candlelit dinners).

jurupa

08-02-07, 04:43 AM

Ture, if one considers the need for romance to be a *positive* quality.

Anyway, I have long felt men were at least as "romantic" as teenage girls, and I think the girls tend to outgrow simple definitions of romance that men continue to cling to (such as roses and candlelit dinners).What is wrong with that? I think part of the reason why you think this Vashti is that for most men, even me, that is pretty much what we know romantically for the most part. As it is the most oblivious to us and emotionally it works out as well as men tend not to express their emotions, if they have any.

vashti

08-02-07, 05:04 AM

Flowers and candles are *nice*, but not romantic. Genuine romance requires more thought. You can light candles or give flowers to *anyone*, whether you love them or not, but genuine romance is tailored to what an individual would value.

Junket

08-02-07, 05:34 AM

but genuine romance is tailored to what an individual would value.

Which is why you can't come up with a specific and concrete example of men's example of romance.

I believe we're a lot more romantic than you give us credit for.

Come on, you act as if we're unaware of anything beyond candles and flowers.

Why else do you think so many guys comin' on here looking for ideas to woo their lady friends?

jurupa

08-02-07, 05:41 AM

Flowers and candles are *nice*, but not romantic. Genuine romance requires more thought. You can light candles or give flowers to *anyone*, whether you love them or not, but genuine romance is tailored to what an individual would value.Vashti getting a bit materialistic there? Wouldn't being romantic also include the delivery and the way the guy went about it? Because if a girl valued something and just giving her it would be considered romantic then why are guys doing more than just giving the item to the girl straight up?

vashti

08-02-07, 06:00 AM

I didn't say that it should have *monetary* value - true romance is of high *emotional* value. Example - the most romantic thing my husband ever did for me was to make me breakfast under a broken umbrealla in the rain while he let me stay inside a warm, dry tent.

Frasbee - I already agreed that adult men seem to be much more inclined to being labelled "romantic" than women. I think the reason is that what women define as "romantic" evolves over time.

Junket

08-02-07, 07:25 AM

Frasbee - I already agreed that adult men seem to be much more inclined to being labelled "romantic" than women. I think the reason is that what women define as "romantic" evolves over time.

I think what women (and men) may define as romance, evolves with the relationship.

Buying a hallmark card and some roses may not be the most ideal gift for a couple who has been married or dating for a long period of time.

However, for people that are just getting to know each other, or for males who are pursuing someone new, gifts like that are quite appropriate. I would say they are more symbolic than anything else.

Gigabitch

08-02-07, 08:40 AM

I had a meeting this morning with my ex-husband to discuss changes to our parenting plan. It was really stressful and tiresome. My boyfriend wrote me a fantastic supportive e-mail at exactly the time of the meeting so I'd have it when I got back to my office and would know that he had been thinking about me when I was in the midst of turmoil.

I find that to be really romantic.

anachronistic

09-02-07, 06:16 AM

Flowers and candles are *nice*, but not romantic. Genuine romance requires more thought. You can light candles or give flowers to *anyone*, whether you love them or not, but genuine romance is tailored to what an individual would value.

Hey, I wish women were a little romantic. No girl has even lit candles or has given flowers to me...

Vashti, please share with us some romantic things you have done for your husband and/or other men.

koolwhip

09-02-07, 07:49 AM

"WE MEN DON'T NEED TO BE ROMANTIC! WE CAN DO WHATEVER WE WANT!"

which the angry wife replies

"I WOULDNT BE TALKING! IM NOT THE ONE WITH THE CHILD SIZED ****! I'LL BEAT YOU SO BAD THAT YO MAMA FEELS THE PAIN!"

to which the husband replies

"Did i ever tell you i loved you?"

um, yup that just about covers it rite thar...

then again, there are the types of men, (like me, but i really dont mean to brag) who actualy understand women in ways a person with an ego cant.

and we call those men

metro sexual.

please dont down me on this one.

Kiechi

09-02-07, 07:59 AM

"WE MEN DON'T NEED TO BE ROMANTIC! WE CAN DO WHATEVER WE WANT!"

which the angry wife replies

"I WOULDNT BE TALKING! IM NOT THE ONE WITH THE CHILD SIZED ****! I'LL BEAT YOU SO BAD THAT YO MAMA FEELS THE PAIN!"

to which the husband replies

"Did i ever tell you i loved you?"

um, yup that just about covers it rite thar...

then again, there are the types of men, (like me, but i really dont mean to brag) who actualy understand women in ways a person with an ego cant.

and we call those men

homo sexual.

please dont down me on this one.

I fixed your post.

Junket

09-02-07, 09:13 AM

then again, there are the types of men, (like me, but i really dont mean to brag) who actualy understand women in ways a person with an ego cant.

Is this the new trend?

What's with all these dudes coming here claiming they understand women unlike the "typical" guy?

Do they really think they're so special? Some God's gift?

Get over yourselves.

You can't compare to a guy like me.

Kiechi

09-02-07, 09:23 AM

Is this the new trend?

What's with all these dudes coming here claiming they understand women unlike the "typical" guy?

Do they really think they're so special? Some God's gift?

Get over yourselves.

You can't compare to a guy like me.

That is exactly what it is. It seems that the male gender has somewhat strayed away from the masculine, macho man type figure and moved onto the whole, I like to wear eyeliner and shave my chest hair type of figure. Men are becoming increasingly feminine these days. Sporting pink items of clothing and claiming to be womens best friend. Just a bunch of closet fags.

vashti

09-02-07, 09:41 AM

Hey, I wish women were a little romantic. No girl has even lit candles or has given flowers to me...

Vashti, please share with us some romantic things you have done for your husband and/or other men.

I am not the romantic half - my husband is. I do nice things for him all the time, but I don't guess I would label them "romantic" (although one time I went into his office and plastered it with Valentines while he was out... he was mortified).

koolwhip

09-02-07, 08:14 PM

That is exactly what it is. It seems that the male gender has somewhat strayed away from the masculine, macho man type figure and moved onto the whole, I like to wear eyeliner and shave my chest hair type of figure. Men are becoming increasingly feminine these days. Sporting pink items of clothing and claiming to be womens best friend. Just a bunch of closet fags.

YUP!:D
thats it!

Tiay

10-02-07, 03:47 AM

Hey, I wish women were a little romantic. No girl has even lit candles or has given flowers to me...

Vashti, please share with us some romantic things you have done for your husband and/or other men.

I wouldn't have thought men would appreciate flowers or candles. I've given my SO a half-heart keychain and I have the other half. I also made a timeline thing with photos of each visit, and stuff like plane tickets, gifts, etc. He hasn't seen that yet though :D

jurupa

10-02-07, 05:17 AM

That is exactly what it is. It seems that the male gender has somewhat strayed away from the masculine, macho man type figure and moved onto the whole, I like to wear eyeliner and shave my chest hair type of figure. Men are becoming increasingly feminine these days. Sporting pink items of clothing and claiming to be womens best friend. Just a bunch of closet fags.You forgot that they drive VW Bugs and Jettas

The Great OV!!!

10-02-07, 07:58 AM

You forgot that they drive VW Bugs and Jettas

Those dudes are just f*cking gay.

anachronistic

10-02-07, 08:33 AM

I wouldn't have thought men would appreciate flowers or candles. I've given my SO a half-heart keychain and I have the other half. I also made a timeline thing with photos of each visit, and stuff like plane tickets, gifts, etc. He hasn't seen that yet though :D

(although one time I went into his office and plastered it with Valentines while he was out... he was mortified).

Those are all things that I would appreciate! You both are wonderful SO's to your lovers. :)

The most recent thing I have done, is make a book with pictures, and things like the movie ticket from our first date, and songs and poems and letters that I have written to her. She had no idea I kept all that, I gave it to her for Christmas..

... and she has kept every rose I ever gave her. :D

Tiay

10-02-07, 09:10 AM

I had a meeting this morning with my ex-husband to discuss changes to our parenting plan. It was really stressful and tiresome. My boyfriend wrote me a fantastic supportive e-mail at exactly the time of the meeting so I'd have it when I got back to my office and would know that he had been thinking about me when I was in the midst of turmoil.

I find that to be really romantic.

aw, giga's head over heels (:
I know what you mean, I can get my email on my phone so I love getting little thoughtful mails from him, especially in situations where it's just so touching to know that he was thinking of me.

Junket

07-03-07, 01:55 PM

I laid in my room for 2 hours writing her non-sensicals on a yellow piece of construction paper.

All I want is to lay with her, I don't need sleep, I don't need food.

Such inane thoughts feel like the most logical ideas ever conceived.

If it's all in my head, why do I feel it all in my chest?

Gigabitch

08-03-07, 01:45 AM

Ooo, it isn't all in your head, though. Your brain is pumping chemicals into your bloodstream that are making you loopy. Isn't it cool?

My bf called me this morning at 6:45 (5:45 his time) because he'd been up for three hours, thinking. It was really sweet to hear his voice first thing in the morning, and he was thinking sweet things, too.

I think you should call her sometime when she's totally not expecting it and just tell her you're thinking about her.

Junket

08-03-07, 09:51 AM

Ooo, it isn't all in your head, though. Your brain is pumping chemicals into your bloodstream that are making you loopy. Isn't it cool?

My brain is a dick.

vashti

08-03-07, 10:01 AM

I laid in my room for 2 hours writing her non-sensicals on a yellow piece of construction paper.

All I want is to lay with her, I don't need sleep, I don't need food.

Such inane thoughts feel like the most logical ideas ever conceived.

If it's all in my head, why do I feel it all in my chest?

Fras, I think every female in the world wants a man to feel this way about her. Your lucky girl ALSO has one who knows how to verbalize it.

::jealous::

Junket

08-03-07, 10:12 AM

Fras, I think every female in the world wants a man to feel this way about her. Your lucky girl ALSO has one who knows how to verbalize it.

::jealous::

Yeah, I guess I haven't updated you guys at all lately.

Things have been going well between us, considering it's an LDR.

Back in November, when things changed for the better, she kept promising me she'd get better at talking on the phone, and sending me letters.

I didn't really expect results, y'know, easier said than done.

But the phone conversations have been great, and just last week, I woke up to find a letter from her sitting on my desk. That's awesome to wake up to. She's also starting to speak more freely of her feelings towards me and the relationship, something she was very hesitant to do before.

I love it.

I think I'll send her that piece of yellow construction paper...I was gonna send her a letter, but, this'll be different, and I feel like it expresses a lot more than words alone.

I'm also looking to go back down over Easter.

Gribble

08-03-07, 11:07 AM

Oh god... I ought to scan the nonsense I scribbled in my notebook a month back while I was waiting for class. I was writing silly stuff about the girl I have back home and what exactly I wanted to do to/with her. Another girl walked by as I was writing, her ass sort of jiggling in that wonderful way, and I stopped mid-sentence and immediately started writing about how incredibly hot that girl was and how much I wanted to jump her bones.

I'm the anti-Fras.

Junket

08-03-07, 11:24 AM

Oh god... I ought to scan the nonsense I scribbled in my notebook a month back while I was waiting for class. I was writing silly stuff about the girl I have back home and what exactly I wanted to do to/with her. Another girl walked by as I was writing, her ass sort of jiggling in that wonderful way, and I stopped mid-sentence and immediately started writing about how incredibly hot that girl was and how much I wanted to jump her bones.