Hours after an Israeli army medic was convicted on Wednesday of manslaughter, for executing a wounded Palestinian suspect last year in the occupied West Bank city of Hebron, Israel’s prime minister, Benjamin Netanyahu, called for the soldier to be pardoned.

Netanyahu’s move completed a full retreat from his initial position. He had first expressed revulsion at the behavior of the medic, Elor Azaria, after viewing video of the incident published by an Israeli human rights group, B’Tselem. That graphic clip, recorded by a witness, showed that Azaria had fired a point-blank shot into the head of Abdel Fattah al-Sharif, a suspect in a knife attack at an army checkpoint who had already been subdued and was lying prone at his feet.

Sympathy for the killer has grown over the past nine months, even as his victim’s family has been forced to view the fatal shot again and again in news reports on the trial in a military court.

Despite seeing the same images of the crime — and more video showing that no medical attention was offered to the suspect after he was immobilized by gunfire during the attack at one of the city’s many military checkpoints — polls found that most Israelis sympathize with Azaria.

(It is important to note that many polls conducted for the Israeli media, including one published the day after the verdict by Israel Hayom, a tabloid Sheldon Adelson set up to support Netanyahu, only survey Jewish Israelis. That poll, finding that 70 percent of respondents “believed Azaria should be pardoned immediately,” drew on “a random pool of 500 Jewish Hebrew-speaking Israelis over the age of 18.”)

Israeli politicians, including Naftali Bennett, the far-right education minister, Shelly Yacimovich, a former leader of the Labour Party, and Miri Regev, the culture minister and a former spokeswoman for the Israeli army, have scrambled to channel the popular mood.

Jewish Home chair @naftalibennett says Elor Azaria must be pardoned "immediately, right now"

As Human Rights Watch reported this week, in the months before the shooting, senior Israeli officials, including the new defense minister, Avigdor Lieberman, and Jerusalem Police district commander, Moshe Edri, had argued that any Palestinian suspected of trying to stab an Israeli, even soldiers tasked with enforcing the occupation, should be subject to immediate execution.

In addition to calls for clemency from politicians, demonstrations of support for Azaria came from hundreds of protesters who scuffled with the police outside the courtroom, waving nationalist banners and at least one Trump sign, and a group of his fellow army medics who dripped their own blood onto a placard claiming that the military’s justice system was “killing us from within.”

Elizabeth Tsurkov, a rights activist in Tel Aviv, noted that among the chants heard at the protest in favor of Azaria was one suggesting that the Israeli army chief of staff, Maj. Gen. Gadi Eisenkot, who defended the prosecution of the soldier in a speech this week, could suffer the same fate as Yitzhak Rabin, the prime minister who was assassinated in 1995 by an opponent of the Oslo Peace Accords.

Chants outside the military court: "Gadi [Eizenkot – IDF CoS] be careful, Rabin is looking for a friend" [you'll be assassinated too]

Azaria’s supporters and detractors agreed that without the video evidence obtained and published by B’Tselem, an Israeli group that distributes cameras to Palestinians to help them document Israeli army abuses in the occupied territories, the soldier almost certainly would not have been prosecuted. (Indeed, witnesses told B’Tselem that shortly before one of the group’s volunteers, Emad abu-Shamsiyah, filmed Azaria shooting Sharif, a second Palestinian man suspected of taking part in the knife attack, Ramzi Aziz al-Qasrawi, was executed with a gunshot to the head from another soldier as he lay prone on the ground.)

B’Tselem’s executive director, Hagai El-Ad, who calls himself “realistically pessimistic” about the “one-state reality” Israelis will continue to live in as long as their military occupation of the lands seized in 1967 endures, detected something positive in the outcome.

“The verdict clearly states that the B’Tselem video is an objective record of the incident and that it hasn’t been manipulated,” he told The Intercept in an email. Given concerted efforts by the government, the army and right-wing activists to discredit his group’s work, and a frightening campaign of incitement against him personally, that is not insignificant.

He expressed concern, however, for Emad abu-Shamsiyah, who recorded the incident and has faced threats and intimidation ever since. While there are only several hundred Jewish settlers living in the center of Hebron, a city of nearly 200,000 Palestinians, they are protected by thousands of Israeli soldiers and often act with impunity.

El-Ad also stressed that “the exceptional conviction of a single sergeant” should not be taken as a sign that the Israeli military justice system, which is used almost exclusively to prosecute Palestinian civilians living under military rule in the West Bank, is fair. “The occupation’s routine includes the whitewashing of hundreds of cases of killing and injuries of Palestinians, for which no one stands to trial,” he wrote. “That is the grim norm, unchanged by the extremely rare, current, publicized trial.”

He added that the conviction did nothing to change the reality of Israel’s open-ended occupation of the West Bank and East Jerusalem, which has now lasted five decades, and failed to answer “a very basic question: what was an Israeli soldier doing in the heart of a Palestinian city in the first place?”

That sentiment was echoed by Noam Sheizaf, an Israeli journalist and commentator, who wrote on Twitter that most political leaders seemed to hope that “we can be united in forgetting about the occupation as soon as the trial ends.”

The reaction to the case, “is sort of a political theater,” Sheizaf said in an interview. “The real story here is Israeli military control over a civilian population.”

“These high profile dramas prevent us from seeing the real nature of the occupation: an open-air prison which deprives millions of people of their basic rights,” he added. “The fact that the army is prosecuting one person and not others is a sideshow that the Israeli public and political system care about.”

“The court’s verdict, which I think was the right verdict,” Sheizaf said, “didn’t get us any closer to ending the occupation or preventing the next case. The next case is out there, waiting to happen.”

Top Photo: The father of Abdel Fattah al-Sharif, a Palestinian man who was killed by an Israeli soldier following a knife attack in the occupied West Bank city of Hebron in March, watched television coverage of the soldier’s trial on Wednesday.

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There is a popular sentiment to pardon this soldier, but it arises from a sort of mass PTSD. The Israeli public will never get used to terrorist activities enacted against civilians including innocent women and children, not to excuse his actions, but it does explain the public sentiment. What is important to note; the Israeli Judicial system did it’s job and the soldier is incarcerated. Can you even imagine this happening on the Arab side if the situation was reversed?

Jack- almost everything you trolls ever say leads back to your types smearing others with the shitstain of “anti-semite!” Or worse, self aggrandizing racial supremacist viewpoints.

The ADL types are the cowardly kings of the smear- blood libel first, ask questions later. Your version of safe space for anti-goy culture is killing free speech and much more.

It’s sickening on every level, and it diminishes the great things that some Jews have contributed to free speech and the cultural dialectic. You’re constant navel gaze is not one of them.

So, every time I hear ‘anti-semitism’ I know it’s just conspiracy theory spouted by a misanthrope, a bully, a coward, a blackmailer, or a troll- “you disagreed with me! U hatez da jooos! ‘

Seldom is the term something to take seriously anymore, as it is so heinously and war-crimesily overused-but Trotsky/Herzl- and especially Leo Frank would be proud how long many have belabored it to great advantage (couldn’t resist putting Frank in there with Herzl, lol)..

Thank you. The book I’m currently reading, which I describe just below, is stomach-turning. The extent to which Zionists have always loved on antisemites, including Nazis, is just horrifying.

In the 30s and 40s, the Jewish Agency, as well as the Lehi, actively opposed having Jews fight Hitler with the Allies. They LOVED Nazi Germany. By 1942, the regular Jewish press was flooding the world with stories of the death camp horrors; the Zionists were unmoved. They were literally modeling their terror campaign against fellow Jews and Palestinians on the Nazi SS.

” Menachem Begin, after Kristalnacht, specifically opposed programs to deliver German Jewish children to safety in England, because he preferred that the “half” who would survive Nazis be drawn to Zionism and come to Palestine as Zionists.”

The fact that creating terror or waging terror, or manipulating terror is so integral to the zionist mind is utterly baffling- and horrifying.

One can’t help but picture the imagery of Smoloko, and the parasite sucking at the brain of the big bully- the great alliance of fanatical zionists with fascist Catholics and others is truly a bizarre symbiotic relationship.

We see it in every policy anywhere in the US today, this perverse ‘shepherd and sheepies’ mindset is so transparent, and so indicative of the thousands of years history between the slavers and the slaved, via state terror, and “mystery terrorists” who operate off of racism, and superstitions embedded like land mines in old scrolls and laws about who can, and who cannot have a handmaiden, who first was had by a dog, and so on, and on and on.

Cuz, along with lashon hara, to protect the dead(and keep the news free from ‘fake news’ of course) it’s all ‘for the children.’

But whose?? Ah- that’s the question that baffles them most….because the answer proves the point.

My copy of Thomas Suarez’ book, State of Terror, has arrived. I’m only on p. 32, and it’s already overwhelming. The statement by Dr. Paul Nathan regarding the horrors Zionists were inflicting on Arabs by 1914 in Palestine is the merest tip of the iceberg. No doubt I’ll have opportunity to be citing from this book in numerous threads here.

Menachem Begin, after Kristalnacht, specifically opposed programs to deliver German Jewish children to safety in England, because he preferred that the “half” who would survive Nazis be drawn to Zionism and come to Palestine as Zionists. Again, I’m only on p. 32 of this massively footnoted book.

Holocaust denial during a visit to Yad Vashem; a call to blow up the Hassan Bek Mosque while strolling through Tel Aviv’s Carmel Market; and a question about the “Jewish gene” in Beit Hatfutsot, the Museum of the Jewish People. This is what the far-right German version of a trip to Israel looks like.

A writer for the German magazine Neon snuck onto a tour of Israel by supporters of populist anti-immigrant parties in Germany last November. The article, which the magazine published this week, documents the week spent up close with Holocaust-denying, racist and Islamophobic Germans. They describe themselves as Israel supporters, who came to see how “the only democracy in the Middle East” deals with “the Muslim problem” that has gripped Germany recently.

The tour was organized by the popular German blog Politically Incorrect, which is identified with the far-right. The blog invited its readers to Israel for eight days under the title “Modern Israel: Politics, Army, Society and Fun.”

Antisemites loving Israel is nothing new; Zionists forged working relationships with them from the outset, including with German Nazis. As I showed below, white nationalists are often deeply enthusiastic about Israel’s ethno-supremacist form of government.

So if violent resistance is illegitimate “terrorism,” what about other alternatives for resisting the decades-old, still-expanding illegal Israeli occupation? The nonviolent route embraced by Palestinian activists and their anti-occupation allies around the world is a campaign of boycott, sanctions, and divestment (BDS) aimed at Israel, modeled after the campaign that helped end South Africa’s apartheid regime in the 1980s (a regime that, just by the way, was a close ally of both the U.S. and Israel).

But there is a highly successful campaign by Israel and its U.S. allies not only to decree this nonviolent boycott campaign illegitimate, but literally to outlaw it. Official bodies are enacting rules to censor and officially suppress it by equating the campaign with “anti-Semitism” even though, as fervent Israel supporter Eric Alterman wrote in the New York Times this week, “it is filled with young Jews.”

Because boycotts always hurt innocent people (More than 575,000 Iraqi children died from sanctions,) they should not be used unless the matter is very important like life & death.
Don’t single out a particular country when other countries are doing the same thing otherwise you lose moral authority.
There should be just one demand & everyone should agree to stop as soon as the goal is met otherwise the target will not change if it is not confident that the sanctions will stop.
It is especially wrong to hurt innocents when there’s little chance of success. Omar Barghouti, the founder of BDS, won’t end BDS until Israel agrees to take in all Palestinian refugees. Israel would never agree to stop being a Jewish state so there’s zero possibility of success.

These “terrorists” attacked soldiers. BDS gets a steroid injection every time Israel commits further apartheid actions against Palestinians. No Jewish families are EVER sanctioned for Jewish terrorism. It’s done routinely to Palestinian families, their homes are BULLDOZED or stolen.

Israel is literally founded on ethnically cleansing and slaughtering innocent Arab people — and dissenting Jews. Your chutzpah is breathtaking.

My country, by the way, has always “singled out” Israel. That’s why I, as an American citizen, have especial moral authority to support BDS.

The unlawful premeditated killing of one human being by another is the definition of murder. What happened fits the description. If you don’t think that what happened is murder, the burden is on you to prove that it’s not murder.

At least 300,000 Palestinian refugees live in Lebanon in what Human Rights Watch calls”appalling social and economic conditions.” They’re blocked from working in a variety of professions, and the Lebanese government has largely resisted granting them broader property rights.

The Redditor quotes British member of Parliament Gerald Kaufman on his 2011 visit to the refugee camps in Lebanon:
When I went to Gaza in 2010 I thought I had seen the worst that could be seen of the appalling predicament of Palestinians living in conditions which no human being should be expected to endure. But what I saw in the camps in Lebanon is far worse and far more hopeless. The conditions are unspeakable, but for over 400,000 of our fellow human beings this is their life: today, tomorrow and for a future that cannot even be foreseen. At least in Gaza, frightful though the situation is, the people are free within the confines of their blockaded prison. In the camps of Lebanon they are not free.

That is false. Zionists kill and ethnically cleanse Palestinians to steal their land. That is why Palestinians then turn around and kill Zionists. You seriously need to read a book. Either Ali Abunimah’s, which I’ve already linked, or John Judis’s, would do.

Mona, I expect you are probably a decent person, and a compassionate one. But, you are so wrong headed, and maybe a self-hating Jew. In my own experience, self-hating people of any ethnicity, have self-esteem issues which compels them to sometimes do and say outrageous things to impress a group they want to associate with. In the case of Israel, to excuse terrorist attacks, even against Israeli soldiers would suggest that Israeli soldiers would have the right to retaliate, and if you make that claim, the pardoning of Elor Azaria for killing the Arab terrorist makes some sense. That’s not my view, but it’s your’s if you want to be consistent. Furthermore, the right for Jews to live in the Jewish state of Israel has both a historical and a legal justification. I don’t think I have to cite historical facts, they’re well known. The legal right for the existence of the Jewish state of Israel, including all of Jerusalem, and Samaria and Judea reside under the terms of the League of Nations, and the British Mandate, a right as a matter of law. These terms were confirmed by the San Remo Conference, Article 80 of the United Nations charter, and the Armistice Agreements of 1949. Furthermore, Israel is the only true participatory democracy in the Middle East, giving all it’s citizens, Jewish and non-Jewish all the rights and privileges to it’s social programs, access to all of Israel’s professional and governmental careers, and economic opportunities.

Israel is “singled out” today, but by its friends and not just by its enemies. It has been singled out for unparalleled support – financial, military, diplomatic – by the western powers. It is indeed, to quote Ben-Ami, a “special case”.

Which other country is in receipt of $3billion a year in US aid, despite maintaining a 47-year military occupation in violation of international law? Which other country has been allowed to develop and stockpile nuclear weapons in secret?

Which other country’s prime minister could “humiliate” – to quote the newspaper Ma’ariv – a sitting US vice-president on his visit to Israel in March 2010, yet still receive 29 standing ovations from Congress on his own visit to the US a year later? And which other country is the beneficiary of comically one-sided resolutions on Capitol Hill, in which members of Congress fall over each other to declare their undying love and support for Israel – by 410 to eight, or 352 to 21, or 390 to five?

Indeed, which other country has been protected from UN Security Council censure by the US deployment of an astonishing 42 vetoes? For the record, the number of US vetoes exercised at the UN on behalf of Israel is greater than the number of vetoes exercised by all other UN member states on all other issues put together. Singling out, anyone?

Israel has begun to implement a series of draconian measures after a Palestinian ran a truck into a group of Israeli soldiers at the East Talpiot settlement near Jerusalem in the occupied West Bank on Sunday, killing four and injuring 13. The Palestinian man, identified as Fadi Ahmad Hamdan al-Qunbar, 28, was shot dead at the scene.

…

Israel and its supporters also insist that any attack by Palestinians be viewed as terrorism, despite the fact that international law has long recognized their right to resist against military occupation.

Israeli lawmaker Amir Ohana said a local tour guide “shot the terrorist and prevented further casualties.

Virtually no definition of “terrorism” includes attacks on the military.

From the article which Mona claimed said the Ashkenazi refused to work and where her buddy, and follow liar Jace claimed she read the same thing.

“Crowded together in worst lodgings or in the dark cellars under as synagogue building without food fuel or water even water at Jerusalem being of price numbers died of starvation and various diseases while others went raving mad Those who could were denied employment by the bigotry of the Mussulmans and the OrientalChristians They found compassion only among the English residents in the city directed by Consul Finn and wife the Rev J Nicolayson Bisho Gobat Miss Cooper other benevolent persons A plot o ground outside the walls which chanced to bear the name of Abraham was soon purchased for a large market garden and vineyard It was cultivated by some of these Jews for wages enough to them and their wives and children alive Few of them accustomed to such labour being mostly artisans tinsmiths glaziers dyers tailors or literary and theological students of…”

I included what was needed to prove tou lied when you claimed that you proved in citing this article number one reason for these peoples plight was their refusal to work. It not a red herring, and you using that term to descibe my post shows you dont even know what the term means.

Gil, you are weak because Zionism is weak. Those who adhere to its terrorist principles are not Jews. I can understand that your very hurt that no one believes any of your formulaic diatribes. You were raised to be this myopic, and downright ignorant. Prove that I lie you cheap suit…lol!

This is what he does, especially with me. If one let’s him, he’ll keep you running and hopping to his bait — calling you a liar, claiming you can’t prove this or that — all to keep you wrapped up in his bullshit, and misdirect the thread.

He’s angry that his terroristic, fundamentally fascistic ideology is exposed. This is all he, or any of them, have, but don’t feed any of them. Use them, but do not feed them.

Come of it Mona, I didn’t claim you couldn’t prove this or that. I claimed an article that you cited repeatedly didn’t say what you claimed. When I disproved your first lie, that the Ashkenazi Jews discriminated again the Sephardi Jews you changed the lie to being the condition of the Ashkenazi Jews was caused by their unwillingness to work. Then I proved that was a lie. If you need to make up imaginary plots as a defense mechanism to keep your ego from going down the toilet I understand.

I have proved you are a liar. You said the article confirmed Mona’s claim. I provided the quote that proved she was lying. You claimed to have read something that wasnt there.
Now of course you or Mona could provide yhe quote you say makes me a liar. Lets see you do it Jace. Too funny a pair of liars caught red handed and stupid enough to think they can deny their way out of it.

Something is happening in the UK that is not happening in the U.S.: Al Jazeera is about to release a four part investigative series titled “The Lobby,” on the influence of the Israel lobby in British politics. Over the weekend, AlJazeera published one of the more damning findings: that a high official of the reigning Conservative Party conspired with an Israeli diplomat in London about how to create a scandal so as to “take down… the Deputy Foreign Minister,” Sir Alan Duncan, for being critical of Israeli settlements.

Al Jazeera characterizes its investigative series:

The Israeli government is in the midst of a brazen, covert influence campaign in Britain, a six-month undercover investigation by Al Jazeera will reveal.

The U.S. is frequently behind the UK on multiple issues, but not that far behind. Attention on the same, and even worse, Zionist machinations here will eventually begin receiving more mainstream examination. It will take the under-35s coming to positions of power. But it will happen. And Zionists have demonstrated they know that.

Thank you for sharing…as per usual the Zionist menace has no shame, no moral compass, and is ALWAYS scheming to undermine someone. Israel is already up to its neck in a self constructed abyss. It is only a matter of time when they hang themselves…not even Trump, and the mendacious congress, and senate can save them now.

Too funny, yes the “zionist menace ” has no shame. Unlike the anti-zionists who claim jews were at fault for the holocaust.

Come on Jace you were going to show me evidence Mona wasn’t lying, where is it. Go back to Stormfront where you belong and take Mona with you at least there see can peddle her lies where they won’t be proven wrong.

A group of masked Israelis, some of them minors, attacked three activists of the NGO Ta’ayush and two female volunteers from abroad who were accompanying Palestinians plowing in the South Hebron Hills, video of the event shows…. When they were a few hundred meters from the settlement, more than 10 Israelis followed close by before throwing stones at them and punching them.

…

“They threatened Danny: ‘We’ll tear you apart, get out of here.’ One encouraged the others the whole time to grab the cameras, and they started throwing stones at us ? at first one or two, then pretty much all of them. There were between 15 and 20,” he added.

Any interested should also see this sub-thread, to observe Gil’s duplicitous behavior and inability to read/admit error. And that’s only in this thread. Typical Zionist behavior — downright Dershowitzian.

Yes indeed they should also read the article in question, Mona and I both provided links to , and see how she flat out lied about what the article said. Not only did she lie about the contents of the article but she lied about why I called her a liar. Which has now been proven. also notice how Mona, rather than admit that she can’t provide the quote to back up her claim, acts like a pretends to be indignant about the request. Absolutely hysterical to see the her squirming like a worm. Deceitful and typical of her.

As I already said, I’m done hopping to your demands. All you accuse me of is false. I’m content to rest on my long record for truthfulness and error-admisison here, as opposed to the constant mendacity of Zionists, you included.

Of course you are done. You got outed as a liar again and now rather than admit that what you posted was a falsehood you are running away like the propagandist you are.
The only long record you have is of being deceitful and not admitting your lies when they have been exposed. All you have to do if find the quote that backs up your claim in an article your already have the link to. You really think anyone who knows you believes you wouldn’t provide it if it existed. Too funny.

I did read it, and it seems that your ability to obfuscate and create bs out of thin air is your forte’. The only liar here is the one in your mirror. Grow a pair, and get an education while you are at it! Dolt!

It is quite amazing how ineffective the entire Zionist diatribe really is. These poor myopic souls like Gil, and Jack have been fed a lifetime of lies, and disinformation that reality unto itself does not exist.

Their world is a world built upon mendacity, racism, and the desire to dominate other’s by force, and hasbara. Thankfully the world has awakened to this travesty, and is doing something about it.

If you read it you can surely cite the part that backs up Mona’s claim that the article says the Ashkenazi Jews didnt want to work. So come on Jace provide the cite. Do it. If you do uou prove i am what you claim. If you cant you prove you are a liar just like Mona.

Arguing with hasbara must be profitable-otherwise, why, Mona, et al? (laughing to myself as I see that, apparently, those who argue with “Jack Green,” who on one day might be a 17 year old college freshman, and on another day, a group of Squad 8200 trainees at the same terminal)

And none of you have the certainty that Jack Green is even real- probably an AI chatbot, cooked up in the Squad 8200 laboratory.

Anyways-Gilad Atzmon/Jonathan Blakeley has a guide you can use to sort out which form of time consuming bot you are arguing with (big win for zionism if you let them steal your time)

I find it too funny that the rabid anti-Zionists need to make up conspiracy theories to explain why they get exposed as liars so often. It couldn’t possibly because they don’t know their facts, so it must be because of a robot poster cooked up by those wily Jews.

What conspiracy theory’s?? Zionism is an atheist fabrication with no ties to Judaism, or the land of Palestine. Where did Abraham mention Zionism in the Bible?? Where was the term Ashkenazi used in the Talmud, Bible or Torah??? HMMM???…Where was it written that the Ashkenazis were God’s chosen??? Stop being a lapdog Gil! Your laughable sect has always been on the wrong side of history.

Typical canned response. I call these baiting rsponses “zioturds” that these things fling like monkeys. Do your own research Gollum- everything I said up there is in play on the internet, and more. Love Jews, hate zionists-for the good of all humanity.

That is wrong, if by “steal time” you mean rebut them with facts, and demonstrate the egregious extent that Zionists lie. Hasbara trolls — whether bot or person — provide ample fodder to demonstrate the sickness of Zionists and Zionism. On many levels. (Countless times, commenters have thanked me for the information I post.)

That said, it is necessary to not let Zionists such as Gil keep one occupied meeting absurd demands or on the defensive in the face of constant allegations of lying, or other alleged bad behavior. I decided to spend over 30 minutes re-locating a Google archives link to satisfy him, this one time, but I’m done.

Really, hasbara trolls and/or Zionists can be an enormous gift, facilitating the education of many. One simply has to take care not to let the Zionists take control.

Mona: “Really, hasbara trolls and/or Zionists can be an enormous gift, facilitating the education of many”

Yeah, I can see that point, and maybe you are the right person to do the time-consuming work. Agreed. But ‘I ain’t the one…’

And- as a matter of fact, I actually did copy one of your responses it was so good, and informative. It began ” Israel was founded by Jewish terrorists, who used children”

Yup. “It’s for the children” some say-but whose? These people shouldn’t breed-especially with their chatbots. Here is what happens when an IDF/Squad 8200 mad scientist/ AIPAC troll breeds with artificial intelligence:

My fellow forum minds….Do you know why the Jack Green’s of the world exist??? it is a fear of legitimacy. Zionists have proven since day one to educated, and well read minds that it is nothing more a snake oil ploy. The Zionist concept from the very beginning was to enrich itself and the Atheists who founded it.

One can look at the Holocaust Industry that has taken shape after the Zionists invaded, polluted, and destroyed every Palestinian village that stood for centuries. The Zionists needed money, so the narrative of six million Jews dying was pushed to no end.

These fiends cared nothing about all of the other lives lost in WW2….typical Zionist behavior. This was the “highjacking” of the Holocaust by the Zionist menace. The Zionists cared nothing about Jewish suffering, all they wanted was land, money, and power. period.

The uneducated trolls like JG come here to prove that Zionist terror is real, and it will do, and say anything in order to remain in the conversation, but those who really know realize that Zionism is as relevant as say Scientology or any other cult unable to assimilate with humanity.

Jews had been persecuted for centuries in majority-gentile countries. Even when not actively persecuting the Jews, the majority-gentile countries refused to give refuge to the Jews when they needed it. There would have been no Holocaust if majority-gentile countries would have allowed in Jewish refugees who were escaping from the Nazis. The idea of Zionism was that Jews would return to their homeland & have a majority-Jewish country because majority-gentile countries had failed to provide safety for the Jews.

The first Zionists arrived in Palestine in 1882. The holocaust was more than 40 years later.

The idea of Zionism was that Jews would return to their homeland & have a majority-Jewish country because majority-gentile countries had failed to provide safety for the Jews.

Not exactly. The idea was that European Jews would find anywhere — it was not initially designated to be Palestine — to found their own ethno-religious supremacist state; such state models were popular among various fascist-nationalist movements in the late 19th and early 20th century. Most Jews found that notion repugnant (which it is), and notwithstanding antisemitism, they overwhelmingly denounced political Zionism that relied on ethnically cleansing the indigenous population, and starting a racist state for Jews. (Albert Einstein was vehement in his rejection.)

The root of the word “Zionism” is “Zion” which refers to Jerusalem.
The definition of Zionism according to Merriam-Webster:
“an international movement originally for the establishment of a Jewish national or religious community in Palestine and later for the support of modern Israel”
Notice “Palestine” & notice no mention of supremacy or racism or ethnic cleansing.

According to Dictionary.com:
a worldwide Jewish movement that resulted in the establishment and development of the state of Israel.
Notice “Israel” & notice no mention of supremacy or racism or ethnic cleansing.

According to the Free Dictionary:
1. (Judaism) a political movement for the establishment and support of a national homeland for Jews in Palestine, now concerned chiefly with the development of the modern state of Israel
2. (Government, Politics & Diplomacy) a political movement for the establishment and support of a national homeland for Jews in Palestine, now concerned chiefly with the development of the modern state of Israel
3. (Judaism) a policy or movement for Jews to return to Palestine from the Diaspora
4. (Government, Politics & Diplomacy) a policy or movement for Jews to return to Palestine from the Diaspora
Notice “Israel” & “Palestine” & notice no mention of supremacy or racism or ethnic cleansing.

According to the Cambridge Dictionary:
an international political and religious movement that supported establishing an independent Jewish state in Palestine and that supports the modern state of Israel

According to the Oxford Dictionary:
A movement for (originally) the re-establishment and (now) the development and protection of a Jewish nation in what is now Israel. It was established as a political organization in 1897 under Theodor Herzl, and was later led by Chaim Weizmann.
Notice “Israel” & notice no mention of supremacy or racism or ethnic cleansing.

Why do you suppose there has been Jewish persecution in the first place?? It was not just outward racism. There is a a cause and effect scenario here. The were/are able to gain power in these countries and choke off the non-Jewish people from prosperity.

The rise of Hitler was not a lark, it was a rage from the poor and disaffected German population. The objectives of Jews in these countries and the US is to keep their power, and wealth to themselves, and not share in a mutual prosperity that would be beneficial for all.

Zionism did not return anyone to a fabricated homeland since Zionism does not exist in any holy text, or is defined by name as having any relevance to the Jewish people for Judaism.

The whole canard that Zionism was a return for Jews to Palestine is an old wives tale that was created in order to give credence to the Zionist narrative…which has always been about deceit, lies, and propaganda.

Ok, this is where you and I dramatically part ways. German Jews simply did not do what you claim, or in any manner bring the vile crimes of the Nazis on themselves. Take some care, because they do delete and ban antisemites here.

Hi Mona, I am not blaming all of German Jewery for the rise of Hitler. Many societal elements were to blame for Hitler’s rise. The 1929 stock market crash, plus the loss of WW1, and the Collapse of a grand coalition of right and left wing parties in Germany . I am not an anti-Semite, furthermore I lost relatives in the Holocaust which is why I am an ardent activist against Zionism.

The objectives of Jews in these countries and the US is to keep their power, and wealth to themselves, and not share in a mutual prosperity that would be beneficial for all.

Names like Greenwald, Blumenthal (Max), Brandeis, Chabon, Einstein and Arendt are only the beginning of what could be marshaled against that claim. For many, Zionism has badly corrupted the Jewish ethics that historically have been a great gift to the West, perhaps especially the United States. But those gifts remain, and many Jewish people still give them.

Jace: ” The objectives of Jews in these countries and the US is to keep their power, and wealth to themselves, and not share in a mutual prosperity that would be beneficial for all.”

Be careful with this line of thought- and NEVER FORGET that these rich/inter-related narratives of Jewish culture contain both collaborators and vehement dissenters as well.

I think you might be saying that certain elements of Jewish radicals as well as zionists of all stripes ( and they do deserve some stripes, on their backs…) stirred up a pot in pre-Hitler Germany (not much different than what we saw with HRC-v-The Donald in the American election)- but you left out the fact that they had lots of non-Jewish allies as well, and particularly relied upon non-Jewish women for power.

That some Jewish supremacists worked with international capitalists to break the balls of Germany, while privileging women’s narratives would steer you to see that it ran deeper then just “the Jews,”and they did it with propaganda that rendered German men and patriarchs as “the other”; that these interests worked to impart a top down “I, Thou, it” narrative wherein men who had actually fought for the country, died for it, plowed it’s fields and so on, were demonized to their own daughters, and rendered the ‘outsiders’ in their own locale; that literally, like we saw under the HRC run-up, the constant jousting at ‘white men,’ and claims of cuckoldry/pedophile/rapist/etc – and Hitler was in part a response to that, and he took the opposite “othering” approach by blaming Jews exclusively.

Wherever you find a ‘corrupt and immoral Jew’ or a zionist, you will also find ten more equally corrupt “others” doing business together, whether it is killing babies with white phosphorous, or drilling oil in the ‘promised land’ (and not Argentina…) you will find these same people-Eric Prince is one great example.

This had it’s roots in the fact that that Frankfurt school of kabbalists held great sway in his press and the national propaganda and academia; not at all unlike what we see with the power of zionists and their christian/catholic/others, slaves and parrots today.

Particularly, the leftist /bolshevik element in Germany at the time could not perpetrate wholesale terror, rape, pillage, and slaughter as they did in Russia, so instead, they courted the women of the nation with propaganda and ’cause,’ by using Bernay’s “peacetime propaganda” and Freud’s bizarre narratives about, well, Freud’s bizarre mind.

A great read is Charu Gupta (who I am guessing is neither Jewish nor Christian), who wrote about women in Nazi Germany at that time, and the pull between the left and right elements; but also between the tension between the Jewish cosmopolitan and the ‘native’ German vying for control of the women:http://www.academia.edu/2185103/Politics_of_Gender_Women_in_Nazi_Germany

What is interesting about Gupta’s work is that she wrote it in 1991- and many other ‘feminists’ have since attempted to write or re-write the paper, because what Gupta did was in essence, laid *some* culpability at the feet of women, as well as men (which is generally intolerable to the whitish western feminist).

And she concluded that what we were really looking at was fascism, regardless of which side started it, and that in fact, women needed to rise up to resist the encroachment of government into our private spaces, which is what fascism does:

“One of the features of the Nazi state was its totalitarian tendency to wipe out the boundaries between public and private life and to politicise every aspect of the individual’s existence.

As time went on women came to resist this politicisation of the family. The stage was set for the cult of domesticity which was a central feature of German social and political life in the two decades following the collapse of the Third Reich”

So, again, she notes what few women, and even fewer feminists of today note, which is that women are responsible to resist or stop the blurring of public and private life for everyone, not just women. But instead of the cult of domesticity, we have women today that think they are empowered if they own a dog instead of a kid, belong to multiple ’cause’ organizations instead of a cult(….), have a job, and own a Fitbit, while they argue online with the patriarchy about why they don’t care about NSA spying or Israeli interception of ALL OF OUR DATA (badmenz AND women who voted HRC alike are targeted ).

So, again, like then, we saw how easily the HRC democrats were willing to sell American privacy just to keep the reigns of power and encouraging both the encroachment, and the fascism. And all of that because last generations feminism skipped the class about ‘personal responsibility and how it affects the Constitutional rights of speech and privacy.’

And even now, Democrats that run the gamut of fallen away Catholics, and other religions are blind to their own culpability in building this modern police state, primarily because the allies of “cosmopolitan Jews”who on one hand preach empowerment of women, then work with the same group of white women/minorities who “other” others, while resenting being othered themselves- and call the DHS or Jack Dorsey every time someone uses badwerdz on Twitter, which is really, just another statement of power and privilege (that of being believed.).

How readily these cringed when they realize how they themselves had raped privacy, demolished the safety of the domecile, and replaced badmenz with Officer Friendly, good touch, and the VAWA; and all the while inserting the words “vagina” and “rape” into every dialogue/monologue. I can’t imagine why Palantir is worth so much money-can you?

This next round of American fascism has every thinking person scared regardless of tribe. The fascists amongst the Jews have their communist slaughters, but they are equally involved with the fascists amongst the Catholics/Christians/Zionists of all stripes ( and believe me, they richly deserve a few stripes, on their backs) today, who wage their constant fascist pogroms, one bloody hand washing the other….

Fascism is what we are really talking about, and the big guys and gals are all in on that together (Dianne Feinstein’s version of ‘democracy’ via marriage to the war industry and its objectives provides the perfect example of that hypocrisy)Maybe it’s time to look at that, instead of ‘the objectives of Jews.” Leave them out of it….

To the humans looking in-and especially those who know what real anti-semitism looks like: Zionism is NOT Judaism, and does not speak for all Jews, but rather those who descend from thugs, gangsters, pimps, rum runners, white slavers, and holohoaxers who paint swastikas on their own synagogues every time they lose an election.

Which, fortunately for the rest of us, is a minority element of radical, sociopathic, and misanthropic Jewry. Here is one such example: when the “Nazi’s” led by Frank Collin~nee Cohen, marched in Skokie Illinois:

The punchline of course is not only that Frank Collin-the “Nazi” leader was Jewish (and a pedophile) but also that the ACLU took that one (just that one) case defending the right of Nazi’s to march, and speak.

Fastforwards to today, and well, ZIONISM is everywhere, because Frank Collin’s early attempt at modelling fascism for batshit crazy militant Jews worked out so well.

The Israeli Defense Force (IDF) soldier and medic Elor Azaria, who was filmed last March (by Imad Abu Shamsiya, a Palestinian B’Tselem volunteer) executing an incapacitated Palestinian man, Fattah al-Sharif, in cold blood has been convicted of manslaughter. He is now the modern Israeli hero, “the child of all of us” as many Israelis refer to him.

Israel does not care that each and every one of the arguments for self-defense brought forth by Azaria’s lawyers was completely and utterly debunked by the judges. It makes no difference to him that the act was caught on tape and that the murdered Palestinian was clearly incapacitated and neutralized. It is immaterial that if Azaria thought the Palestinian man had a suicide belt, one of the defense’s arguments, his actions would have made even less sense and endangered more of his surrounding comrades.

Let’s be clear: this is not the first summary execution of a Palestinian by an IDF soldier nor will it be the last. It was just coincidentally captured on film, and consequently caused an uproar that led to an unavoidable trial. Elor Azaria is not a rotten apple and Israelis are indeed correct in calling him “the child of all of us”. He is an ugly mirror of Israel.

Mona writes: ” I do know I demonstrated that Christian and Muslim employment discrimination was a tertiary cause of Sephardic immiseration in 19th century Jerusalem. Ashkenazi refusal to work, and Sephardim refusal to share charitable funds with them, were the first two.”

No where in the article does it say the Ashkenazi refused to work. Again you are lying.
You didn’t demonstrate anything except your inability to disseminate information honestly. Now go read the article again and see if you are still laughing.

Ah, I thought the odds pretty good that you’d get in a snit and call me a liar and etc. Here ya go, Gil.The Saturday Review of Politics, Literature, Science, Art, and Finance, Volume 46, p. 699, November 30, 1978. Do note the NYT snippet is a month subsequent to that date — that would be because it was not original there, but rather was included in a round-up section of news from other publications , just as I said.

Why do you keep questioning my claims? You’ve seen countless times I seldom err*, and certainly not materially on anything related to Israel.

Now, please stop piddling around with such digressions, going off into the weeds about minor issues that no one else cares about. You demanded, I complied.

Enough.

*(Not because I’m intellectually superior to the rest of the world; I’m merely very careful about making firm fact claims.)

Amazing, absolutely amazing, how Zionists lie, call others liars, and then — confronted with evidence of their duplicity or mistake — they go on to insist the others are still liars. No gracious concession of error, much less an apology. You thereby demonstrate that you are a propagandist, not a normal participant in political debate.

I do not lie in political discussions, as my long record here and elsewhere demonstrates — including here, again. I also always admit error. Quite ironically, I mistakenly conceded error to the hasbara troll, only to discover a week or so later that I’d been right after all. His source (Wikipedia) is wrong.

Going forward, Gil, I will link to this exchange any time you call me a liar or otherwise doubt my claims. It illustrates many unpleasant truths about your honesty and methods of engagement. (As does your utter silence about the many and egregious lies of Alan Dershowitz, knowingly repeated by your hasbara troll buddy.)

(I’ve already dealt with this other claim you keep spewing that I’m lying, and will not do so again, not in this thread. You stand discredited enough that I feel no need to.)

oh and I never said you were lying about the article being published elsewhere I just said you never provided the link.
I said you lied about the relationship between the the two Jewish groups, and your claim that the Ashkenazi Jews refused to work. Which you did.
So yes please link back to this thread it shows not only do you lie about the facts but you also lie about what other posters have claimed.

This is where you stomped like a bully, demanding a link, and demanding it now. Higher in the thread, in this sub-thread, I gave you the link.

And Dershowitz is wholly relevant; your hasbara buddy made him so by yet again repeating Dershowtiz’s lies. Oddly, you are utterly silent about all that. As a Zionist, your real objection is that I show one of your main U.S. propagandists to be a total liar, who was justly accused of plagiarism. (Note: Finkelstein boldly and in several venues (including a book) accused him of it, and Attorney and retired Harvard Law Professor Dershowitz, never sued.)

While retrieving the evidence that our hasbara troll repeats a knowing lie from a Dershowtiz book-length propaganda tract, I discovered something I had not known. Dershowitz advocates destroying entire Palestinian villages in response to a terrorist attack.

“It will be a morally acceptable trade-off even if the property of some innocent civilians must be sacrificed in the process,” Dershowitz wrote.

So of course he endorses demolishing the family homes of Palestinian terrorists, as Israel routinely does. (In the apartheid state, the family homes of Jewish terrorists are never touched.)

I found this claim supported in multiple sources, including the Harvard Crimson, but will link to Norman Finkelstein again. Who also documents that Dershowitz wrote:

Nope, none of that is oppression. You’ve claimed that scads of times before, and no one reasonable is going to believe it. Moshe Dayan didn’t believe it. Your absurdity would mean the African National Congress “oppressed” the whites of South Africa during apartheid, and the Irish Republicans oppressed the English — both of which are as preposterous as your assertions.

As you are well aware, he made clear that no people would tolerate what Zionists did to Palestinians without responding violently. You’ve seen that Dayan text probably a dozen times at least.

So, as I said, “the Palestinians are the oppressed, and the oppressor sanctioning their victims is and would be repugnant.”

And also, Dershowitz should be a moral leper. He advocates vile policies and is himself vile. And you agree with him.

The ANC was defending itself against white violence. The Irish Republicans were defending themselves against English violence. But the Arabs were not defending themselves against Jewish violence in the nineteenth century.

If murdering Jews is OK because of what Jews did to Arabs, then isn’t murdering Arabs OK because of what Arabs did to Jews especially because Arabs were terrorizing Jews first?

The only witnesses to these “so-called” stabbings have been the IDF, and illegal settlers….Most of these “set-ups” are to provoke the Palestinians. You see JG, no one trusts anything that a Zionist says, because 95% of the time it is a lie. You are really are quite the duped lapdog….here you have illegal terrorists settlers destroying Palestinian homes, illegally occupying their land, threatening and killing Palestinian children….THE IDF DESERVE TO BE TARGETED FOR BRUTAL RETRIBUTION!!!..considering their rampant criminality on a daily basis in a country where they have no legal mandate to be in. TROLL!

Why would the the German population in the 30’s elect Hitler?? Oppression, and no power to change the status quo. Jews owned Germany in the run up to Hitler being elected…You ask some very stupid questions. Zionists want all of the land, furthermore they are accountable to no one. The Palestinians are in the way…The occupation is illegal, and always has been…provide any UN security resolution, or general assembly vote that states the occupation of Palestine since 67 is legal…GO!!

Where is the Jewish faith within Zionist Israel??? Here you have a population whose majority embraces a terrorist ideology over an established religious faith that unto itself is the polar opposite. This brings into question the actual legitimacy of Zionism especially since it resembles the KKK in its zeal for a pure state…is unable to assimilate with any other culture or people, and is devoid of any moral compass. If Israel were an actual Jewish state I believe it would have been something completely different….something’ coherent, tolerant, and democratic…not the sociopathic menace that exists today.

Here you have a population whose majority embraces a terrorist ideology over an established religious faith that unto itself is the polar opposite.

That brings to mind Yuval Diskin’s (a former director of Israel’s FBI) lament, published in the Tablet, of the severe fascistic ethos and terrorism resurgent in Israel, spreading from the settlement fanatics in the West Bank. He sees this racist, terror-embracing Zionism taking over his whole country and wants it to be stopped.

That isn’t going to happen, and Diskin doesn’t face the fact that what he opposes is inherent in Zionism, and part and parcel of its long history. But he himself seems aware of Zionists’ terror history, for he writes:

I considered Jewish terrorism to be a cancer and that no Jew may legitimately resort to terrorism when protected by a strong state and defense organizations….

Clearly, then, he believes Jews may resort to terrorism under certain conditions, and no doubt knows that Zionists did — often and egregiously. (He is silent as to whether Palestinians may so resort.)

Diskin also fears:

Among [these Zionist fanatics] are dozens who would be willing, without hesitation, to apply violence and terrorism against their Jewish brethren should their idea of the sanctity of the land ever be put to the test.

That has always been the case, and was so in Mandate Palestine, where Zionists killed politically “wrong” Jews, including those who didn’t want their children indoctrinated to accept terrorism and being child-terrorists. None of this that Diskin laments is new; it has always been of Zionism.

But you are right — this monstrous belief system is not defensible in any traditional form of religious Judaism. As Max Blumenthal put it, Zionism kills Palestinian bodies and Jewish souls.

Israel is a multicultural, multiracial, multi-confessional country whose people have freedom of speech, freedom of the press, freedom of assembly, freedom of religion, etc. plus the vote. All this despite existential threats from its neighbors.
Its people are the 11th happiest in the world. Its per capita GNP is #31.

Israel is a wonderful country that set up field hospitals in Haiti & Nepal to help those hurt by the earthquakes & to help those in the Philippines who were injured by the typhoon. Israeli advances in science, medicine & agriculture have helped billions of people all over the world.

In 2011, a team of Israeli neonatologists went to Kumasi, Ghana’s second-largest city, to train local doctors and nurses in advanced, low-cost methods to address the city’s high infant mortality rate. The doctors, sent by the Alliance for Global Good in cooperation with MASHAV, also established two new neonatal units in Kumasi’s sole hospital.

An Israeli-built emergency room at Kisumu East District Hospital in Kenya was put together in less than a month by Israeli engineers and medical specialists in 2011. It is the hospital’s first fully-equipped ER and serves a region of six million people.

Israel has been instrumental in the drive to provide voluntary circumcision to African men as a proven method to reduce the risk of contracting HIV infection.
A circumcision clinic for Zulu men set up in 2011 by Israeli doctors in the AIDS-stricken province of KwaZulu-Natal, South Africa, has treated thousands of men. PrePex, a non-surgical circumcision device from Israel’s Circ MedTech, was prequalified last summer by the World Health Organization (WHO) for use in 14 African nations with high rates of new HIV infections.

You have proven nothing…all you do is obfuscate, and avoid the topic at hand. you have not addressed any of the points I made on Zionist legitimacy, and its complete lack of…For all of Israel’s good deeds they are pointless in the face of its sheer embrace of outright sociopathic bigotry, racism, and zeal for being completely lawless. Jack Green?? Not even a real name…your a fraud whose entire being is based upon lies and bs that embrace terrorism. Oh yeah huckster…STOP WITH THE CUTTING A PASTING.. like all Zionists you are unable to actually compose a clear and rational thought….lapdog.

For the past six years, Prof. Zvi Bentwich of the Center for Emerging Tropical Diseases and AIDS at Ben-Gurion University of the Negev has been working toward ridding Ethiopia of common parasitic infestations that contribute to AIDS, tuberculosis epidemics and other serious health problems particularly in children. Israelis in his NALA Foundation distribute anti-worm tablets and educate hundreds of thousands of Ethiopians on prevention.
Better farming

Israel is planning to build a model agricultural village in South Sudan to teach local farmers how Israel’s breakthrough agricultural methods and technologies can help the fledgling African nation boost its vegetable output. The idea took shape when former Deputy Foreign Minister Danny Ayalon met South Sudan Minister of Agriculture Betty Ogwaro at the Agritech 2012 expo in Tel Aviv.

“Israel is a multicultural, multiracial, multi-confessional country whose people have freedom of speech, freedom of the press, freedom of assembly, freedom of religion, etc. plus the vote. ”

Baloney. For whom?
Israel is simultaneously running three systems of government.
The first is full democracy toward its Jewish citizens — ethnocracy.
The second is racial discrimination toward the Palestinian minority — creeping Jim Crowism.
The third is occupation of the Palestinian territories with one set of laws for Palestinians and another for Jewish settlers — apartheid.

All this despite existential threats from its neighbors. Baloney.
The only reason Israel has an existential threat from Palestinians and it’s Arab neighbors is because of its illegal occupation and land theft and subjugation and mistreatment of the Palestinian People and its clear meddling in Arab affairs to ensure its domination of the Middle East and the Arabs quite clearly want no part of what Israel is offering or wanting to do in the region.

If you want Palestinians to accept Israel’s existence, you must show that Israel’s existence does not preclude a viable Palestinian state. All the rest is commentary.

Please spare us all your hasbaric BS you are just another hasbaric troll slaving away at the Hasbara Institute in their capital Tel Aviv – employing an army of social media activists skilled enough to read jejune slogans but completely at a loss when confronted with the dark, fact-based truth that is Israel.

After-all, how many times can a hasbaric troll continue the laughable joke of trying to justify israel before a mindless 18 year old paid $10.00 an hour finally says enough and saunters off to the beach?

We Americans also have racial discrimination so we’re not a perfect democracy, but we’re still a democracy. The same with Israel. While there may be discrimination against Arab Israelis, there’s also discrimination in favor of Arab Israelis e.g. they are exempt from the draft – a major advantage!

No country treats foreigners, especially enemy foreigners, the same way it treats its own citizens. When we occupied Germany, we didn’t let Germans vote in our elections. Apartheid? Of course not!

Israel was attacked by its neighbors on the day it declared independence.

Every time Israel offers to end the occupation, the Palestinians say “No!”
Even Prince Bandar bin Sultan of Saudi Arabia (certainly not a Zionist) said that Arafat’s refusal to accept the January 2001 offer was a crime. Thousands of people would die because of Arafat’s decision & not one of those deaths could be justified.

As Clinton later wrote in his memoir:

It was historic: an Israeli government had said that to get peace, there would be a Palestinian state in roughly 97 percent of the West Bank, counting the [land] swap, and all of Gaza, where Israel also had settlements. The ball was in Arafat’s court.

But Arafat would not, or could not, bring an end to the conflict. “I still didn’t believe Arafat would make such a colossal mistake,” Clinton wrote. “The deal was so good I couldn’t believe anyone would be foolish enough to let it go.” But the moment slipped away. “Arafat never said no; he just couldn’t bring himself to say yes.”

“While there may be discrimination against Arab Israelis” – you are not addressing the Palestinians. Again –
Israel is simultaneously running three systems of government.
The first is full democracy toward its Jewish citizens — ethnocracy.
The second is racial discrimination toward the Palestinian minority — creeping Jim Crowism.
The third is occupation of the Palestinian territories with one set of laws for Palestinians and another for Jewish settlers — apartheid.

You really have to stop with the hasbara:
The Palestinians formally recognized both the reality of the state of Israel and “its right to live in peace and security” as per the September 9, 1993 letter from Chairman Arafat to Prime Minister Rabin and the subsequent double amendment of the PLO’s Charter in 1996 and 1999.

What they cannot be expected to do is to renege on their past, deny their identity, and give up on what they believe is their history. They cannot be expected to become Zionists. They deserve their own state just like Israel, nothing less. You have done all you can to make it clear they are not residents of Israel, with no rights. They do not need to abide by the laws of “your” state. It is fully fitting that they and the rest of the world ignore you.

Working in tandem, Barak and Clinton tried to shove a very bad deal down Arafat’s throat during the 2000 Camp David Summit. It could only be rejected. Suffice to quote Shlomo Ben-Ami, then Israel’s foreign minister and lead negotiator at Camp David: “Camp David was not the missed opportunity for the Palestinians, and if I were a Palestinian I would have rejected Camp David, as well.”

While an agreement at Camp David was never going to happen, those talks laid the groundwork for further talks. Those took place several months later at Taba, and it was Barak who canceled them when it appeared that Arafat was prepared to sign.

It is understood that Barak only went to those talks because he was facing Sharon in an election, and that he had no real intention of signing a peace treaty with Arafat. But my point is that no one ever mentions Taba and how it was Barak who withdrew his negotiators in order to prevent a peace treaty. He them constructed the myth of The Generous Offer.

Israel has painted themselves into a corner, surrounded by states, countries and people around that loathe you. Their idiocy, mismanagement, hubris, arrogance and sense of entitlement based on the ridiculous credo of “God’s chosen people”, has left you and Israel discredited, unmasked, de-legitimized, scorned, laughed at and alienated from the rest of the international community. That will be their well deserved legacy.

If the US stopped sending money to Israel, Republicans would give that money to the rich as tax reductions.

Actually, giving money to Israel helps Americans because all that money must be spent in the US which puts Americans to work. If the money were given to the rich, there’s no guarantee that it would be spent here in the USA.

Being that you are a paid troll and advocate for Zionist terror, how is anyone here able to take your bigotry seriously?? Look Bibi Jr, I do realize that Israel has done good things in the world, and developed technologies that are quite impressive, but all of that good is crushed by the sociopathic nature of Zionists, and their quest for total domination by force over the Palestinian people on Palestinian land.

I have many friends in Israel who agree with my assessments and have “refused to serve” in the murderous IDF. The problem with people like you is that you enjoy seeing misery, kids being murdered, and homes that have existed on Palestinian for generations destroyed.

What separates your evil for that of any Aryan serving under Hitler?? or any cold blooded killer serving under Pol Pot??? There is no daylight that separates your sick, and anti-Semitic sect.

Your posturing, and complete mendacity regarding Palestinian history, and Jewish history are proof that you are a troll. You are here to provide disinformation, false truths, and push the Zionist agenda.

You are a pathological liar as most Zionists are. Israeli soldiers have no legal right or mandate to be in the West Bank. This is Palestinian land, and the Palestinians reserve the right to protect themselves, and their land from IDF terrorists whose sole goal is subjugation, terror, murder, and the destruction of the Palestinians ability to live free of Zionist terror.

When have you once had the balls to be truthful here about the occupation, and all of its destruction??? Never…because in essence you are a terrorist advocate. You support every single criminal agenda being pushed by the Zionist menace. Your racism and bigotry are what define you.

Being that you are a paid troll and advocate for Zionist terror, how is anyone here able to take your bigotry seriously?? Look Bibi Jr, I do realize that Israel has done good things in the world, and developed technologies that are quite impressive, but all of that good is crushed by the sociopathic nature of Zionists, and their quest for total domination by force over the Palestinian people on Palestinian land.

I have many friends in Israel who agree with my assessments and have “refused to serve” in the murderous IDF. The problem with people like you is that you enjoy seeing misery, kids being murdered, and homes that have existed on Palestinian for generations destroyed.

What separates your evil for that of any Aryan serving under Hitler?? or any cold blooded killer serving under Pol Pot??? There is no daylight that separates your sick, and anti-Semitic sect.

Nurse-educators at Jerusalem’s Herzog Hospital lead video conference classes for health care personnel at a Christian hospital in rural Ghana in topics such as diabetes prevention and treatment. The live-streaming video setup was donated by Rotary International’s Jerusalem chapter and a partner chapter in Windsor, Ontario (Canada). Diabetes has been dramatically increasing in Africa, with four million cases in Ghana and rising.

The Israeli nonprofit Eye from Zion brings Israeli ophthalmologists to volunteer their surgical and training expertise in developing countries including Ethiopia, where 1,000 patients have received free treatment including cataract surgeries in a portable operation room donated by Chaim Sheba Medical Center at Tel Hashomer. Patients needing more complex procedures, especially children, are brought to Israel for lifesaving eye surgery.

For the past six years, Prof. Zvi Bentwich of the Center for Emerging Tropical Diseases and AIDS at Ben-Gurion University of the Negev has been working toward ridding Ethiopia of common parasitic infestations that contribute to AIDS, tuberculosis epidemics and other serious health problems particularly in children. Israelis in his NALA Foundation distribute anti-worm tablets and educate hundreds of thousands of Ethiopians on prevention.

Yet in reality Israel is the least pure state in the region. Israel is the most ethnically, racially and religiously diverse state in the ME . Why do you thing the Bahai religion had to move their headquarters from the Islamic Republic of Iran to Israel? Please show evidence that the majority of Israels embrace a terrorist ideology. How does a country that rescued black Jews from Ethiopia resemble the KKK?

Richard Spencer is a partial answer. The Black Lives Matter Movement that thrives in Israel would be another. Black Jews are refusing to serve in the IDF in record numbers due to the racism. No doubt somewhat informed by Israel’s injecting Ethiopian Jewish women with contraceptives without telling them.

You actually did not answer any of my questions. However I noticed you did have the time to link to another post (not to one that had anything to do with refuting what I wrote) but still claim to have no time to back your claim of the Times article being taken from the Journal you say it was.

I think you’ll find, Gil, that other readers feel I answered your last question. As to the other matter, I’ll get to it in my own good time. I gravely doubt anyone but you cares (and possibly your hasbara troll pal), and I’ll wait until peak posting is over, and I’ve watched my movie. You see, Gil, your demands are not my priority. (I gave the journal name in at least one thread in which you were participating, and you could search it yourself in google’s archives, where I told you it is located.)

Black Jews from Ethiopia have been terrorized and pushed out of Israel..what are you talking about??? Zionism resembles the KKK in its complete goal for a pure Zionist state, just as the Klan wanted a complete an pure white country. Both are unable to assimilate with other cultures, and races. The majority of Israeli’s in the article above support the occupation, subjugation, and total violent domination of the Palestinian people. 67% support the release of a cold blooded murderer. This is Zionism in its sick glory…

Jace, your post does a great job of illustrating how little the worst critics of Israel actually know about the place. Please provide evidence of Jews from Ethiopia being pushed out of Israel. Please answer my question regarding diversity in the region. Again show me one country in the ME that is more diverse, put up or admit you were wrong.

It is a theocracy that is unable to assimilate with other cultures, and people..which is why equality in Israel is despised. Prove that Israel is more culturally diverse than another country in the ME….yeah…you need to get un-lazy and do this…

Nice satire Gil…but you didn’t bother to lead the article which proves that I am right about you, and your illegitimate sect. Only a racist anti-semite like you would not have any outrage in the obvious violent discrimination taking place against Ethiopian Jews. The main reason being is that these are real Jews, not Zionist poseurs who wear racism on their sleeve like You! Oh those blacks…damn them…lol!!! Right Gil!!

I read the article and what you claimed was there ““Black Jews from Ethiopia have been terrorized and pushed out of Israel.” wasn’t there, you pinhead. All you have proven was your own source proves your claim false. Of course you could cite the article the part of the article that does prove your claim and prove me wrong. Lets see you do it.

The most fascinating thing here is the degree to which national “leaders” are not leaders at all. They can’t even take a stand against a duly prosecuted, properly convicted, murderer…not if it’s unpopular with more than 60% of the voters.
I’m not talking about the politics here, or the merits of the case. The iron facts remain that the court convicted him, just not normally something a politician would take a position on. But for 67% of voters polled, a politician will look you right in the eye and say that blue is green, up is down.

It’s useful to remember that when voting for them, supporting them, trusting them. These are not people you’d leave a child alone with. They’d toss your kid off a cliff if 70% of voters decided your nine-year-old was a Terrorist.

Well, for one thing, they are not told that any people would react the same way as the Palestinians, as Moshe Dayan long ago observed. Israelis are not schooled in the truth of their history and are taught to see Palestinians as acting only for reason of irrational hatred.

See this below from hasbara troll, Jack Green. He is lying, and has been told and shown he is lying, and relying on a lie put forward by Zionist liar, Alan Dershowitz. (Who lifted the same wrong quoted material, verbatim, from another source, which led to credible accusations of plagiarism against Dershowitz.) I’ve told him this repeatedly. But he’s shamelessly doing it yet again.

I can prove he’s posting a falsehood. Just ask. Zionists do it all the time. Their whole narrative has been built on an edifice of lies.

The evidence of which the hasbara troll is fully aware. Norman Finkelstein, my emphasis:

Dershowitz cites the same statement as [Joan] Peters, reporting that [William T.] Young “attributed the plight of the Jew in Jerusalem” to pervasive anti-Semitism. Turning to the original, however, we find that the relevant statement did not come from Young but, as is unmistakably clear to anyone who actually consulted the original, from an enclosed memorandum written by an “A. Benisch” that Young was forwarding to Canning. One wonders if Dershowitz also consulted Peters’s original source for the term “turnspeak”—a coinage of Peters, which she says was inspired by George Orwell’s 1984, but which Dershowitz, confounded by his massive borrowings from Peters, not once but twice credits directly to Orwell (“George Orwell’s ‘turnspeak,’” “Orwellian turnspeak”). On which pages of 1984 did Dershowitz find “turnspeak”?

“Let it be absolutely clear,” Dershowitz states elsewhere, “that my demographic conclusions are very different from Peters’s.” Really? The centerpiece of Peters’s book is a demographic study purporting to prove that many of the 1948 Palestinian Arab refugees were actually recent arrivals to the area of Palestine that became Israel from other parts of Palestine. Far from reaching different conclusions on this key point, Dershowitz repeats Peters’s fraudulent claim, even fabricating the flat-out lie that the “United Nations recogniz[ed] that many of the refugees had not lived for long in the villages they left.”

So, some Unknown Guy said something, and the British Consul, William Young, merely forwarded it; he neither said it nor vouched for it. Zionists lie often and egregiously, Alan Dershowitz included — perhaps especially.

See the link, where Finkelstein explains the depth and extent of more lies.

What does the USA get for paying Israel more than the entire cost of their Universal Health care program. Nothing. They’re in league with Trump, they disrespected Obama, all Obama did wrong was offer them insufficient obedience.

They killed their own Prime Minister, Rabin, how’s that for un-patriotic. They are against Democracy, they want to tax people without representation just exactly like South Africa. This is apartheid, and they are also in league with the Saudis and Al Qaida, who attacked us on 911.

Former Supreme Commander of NATO and U.S. Secretary of State Gen. Alexander Haig (deceased) described Israel as “the largest US aircraft carrier, which does not require even one US soldier, cannot be sunk, is the most cost-effective and battle-tested, located in a region which is critical to vital US interests. If there would not be an Israel, the US would have to deploy real aircraft carriers, along with tens of thousands of US soldiers, which would cost tens of billions of dollars annually, dragging the US unnecessarily into local, regional and global conflicts.”[6]

Why are you rolling your eyes regarding Alexander Haig United States Army general who served as the United States Secretary of State, White House Chief of Staff, Vice Chief of Staff of the Army, and as Supreme Allied Commander Europe commanding all U.S. and NATO forces in Europe?

Why is “The USA discriminates against white men” hilarious?
Don’t you know that we have affirmative action? Discrimination in favor of African-Americans & women in effect discriminates against white men.

Writing anonymously in the Mail on Sunday, the former minister said: “British foreign policy is in hock to Israeli influence at the heart of our politics, and those in authority have ignored what is going on.

“For years the Conservative Friends of Israel (CFI) and Labour Friends of Israel (LFI) have worked with – even for – the Israeli embassy to promote Israeli policy and thwart UK government policy and the actions of ministers who try to defend Palestinian rights.

“Lots of countries try to force their views on others, but what is scandalous in the UK is that instead of resisting it, successive governments have submitted to it, take donors’ money, and allowed Israeli influence-peddling to shape policy and even determine the fate of ministers.”

The same dynamic corrupts the U.S. political system, and has since the Truman Administration. While we’re all freaking out about Russia supposedly interfering in U.S. elections, it would be salutary to consider the pernicious influence of the Israel Lobby.

I love it that on the same board where the regular denizens and their leader Glenn Greenwald have been ranting about how nothing is true without absolute evidence in the case of Russian hacking. An anonymous source is taken as proof when it comes to conspiracies about Israel controlling the UK and US gov’t.
Too funny. It just goes to show that people who lack the ability to think critically will always believe what they a predisposed to believe regardless of the evidence.

Anonymous evidence, standing alone, would not be, and should not be, taken as true. Hence my second post and supporting link.

What do you think, Gil, of what the Guardian reports, which was also this:

The Labour party has called on the government to immediately launch an inquiry into “improper interference in our democratic politics” after the disclosure that an Israeli embassy official had plotted to “take down” UK MPs regarded as hostile.

The shadow foreign secretary, Emily Thornberry, said: “The exposure of an Israeli embassy official discussing how to bring down or discredit a government minister and other MPs because of their views on the Middle East is extremely disturbing.”

I’ve already provided that evidence, many months ago to the hasbara troll — it’s in Google archives of the relevant, defunct London journal, as well as cited in some clipped version of the NYT piece.

You didn’t watch the linked Dispatches show, or else you are being dishonest. Nothing else could explain your likening it to the government’s evidence-free claims about Russia vis-a-vis the U.S. election.

The British Israel Lobby behaves like thugs toward politicians and journalists, it’s an amazing spectacle to behold. They have the money and clout to command obedience of their extreme demands, and have often gotten it. Do see the program.

Provide the evidence to me. I’m the one you are claiming was dishonest for not reporting it yet my source which I clearly documented shows no such thing.

I watch the program if you provide the evidence you say you have. It’s funny how you have no trouble linking to the same propaganda over and over on every single thread but when actually asked to provide something that proves your claim you suddenly can’t provide a link.

Gil, I’m not gonna do it right now– ask me again later tonite. But you know I do not make claims I cannot support (as opposed to making immaterial errors about a source every now and then, as all humans do), and if I say I’ve supplied it before, then I have. Right now I refuse to be distracted from the issues I wish to continue to post about in this thread.

I don’t care if you don’t watch the program. It would not do you any good since you are an indoctrinated Zionist incapable of receiving and then digesting truth that is contrary to your preferred narrative.

Moreover, I note with great amusement your silence about the hasbara troll’s documented lie. A lie he knows is a lie. A lie taken from liar Alan Dershowitz, who lifted it off another, as he did so much else. In due course, I’ll get to Dershowitz on Orwell, Joan Peters and “turnspeak.”

Isn’t it great the many opportunities the hasbara troll gives me to document truth that puts Israel, Zionism and Zionists in a horrible light? Why do you suppose they continue to let him do that? [shrug]

Not only do I know you do but I have proved it. What you are now terming a mistake was the basis of a premise you were promoting that European Jews always discriminated against even in the 1800’s Sephardic Jews.

I will be happy to allow you to divert the subject to Dershowitz when you have proven your claim.

As for Jack being paid to post you have no more evidence for that than you did for your current claim about the source of the article. Your the one that even when presented with facts refuses to modify their beliefs not me.

Sorry, that’s incoherent and I do not know what you are talking about. I do know I demonstrated that Christian and Muslim employment discrimination was a tertiary cause of Sephardic immiseration in 19th century Jerusalem. Ashkenazi refusal to work, and Sephardim refusal to share charitable funds with them, were the first two.

Gil, I don’t need you to “allow” me to post as I please. LOL What is that, some patriarchal thing?

As for the hasbara troll, yeah, that’s what he is Gil and everyone knows it. Including you.

(You got a “LOL” out of me Gil, something I so seldom do, but I really did.)

No where in the article does it say the Ashkenazi refused to work. Again you are lying.
You didn’t demonstrate anything except your inability to disseminate information honestly. Now go read the article again and see if you are still laughing.

The most coward country in the history of world. If they want to fight face to face then fight with a man who is also fighting you.

WHY the fuck shoot at somebody who is lying helpless on the ground. WHY???
Its true God Of Abraham, Jacob is cursing Israel now just as He continued to curse them since MOSES took them from Egypt.
Israel you are dead for sure. what you think your are. Nothing. All Muslim countries are planning day and night to destroy you.
You will get what you deserve.

Jack Green is a hasbara troll, but there are and have been quite a few others of them infesting this site.

At any reasonably prominent online venue, there are always a number of accounts who make it their mission to post vacuous, misleading and disruptive Zionist bullshit. Often, they are following talking points issued by both formal and informal “hasbara” projects. (Hasbara means “explaining” in Hebrew; in practice it means “propaganda.”)

Max Blumenthal has described these annoying creatures and their programs thus:

The more the State of Israel relied on force to manage the occupation, the more compelled it was to deploy hasbara. And the more Western media consumers encountered hasbara, the more likely they became to measure Israel’s grandiose talking points against the routine and petty violence, shocking acts of humiliation, and repression that defined its relationship with the Palestinians.

Under the leadership of Prime Minister Benjamin Netanyahu, a professional explainer who spent the early years of his political career as a frequent guest on prime time American news programs perfecting the slickness of the Beltway pundit class, the Israeli government invested unprecedented resources into hasbara. Once the sole responsibility of the Israeli foreign ministry, the task of disseminating hasbara fell to a special Ministry of Public Diplomacy led by Yuli Edelstein, a rightist settler and government minister who called Arabs a “despicable nation.”

Edelstein’s ministry boasted an advanced “situation room,” a paid media team, and coordination of a volunteer force that claimed to include thousands of volunteer bloggers, tweeters, and Facebook commenters fed with talking points and who flood social media with hasbara in five languages. The exploits of the propaganda soldiers conscripted into Israel’s online army have helped give rise to the phenomenon of the “hasbara troll,” an often faceless, shrill and relentless nuisance deployed on Twitter and Facebook to harass public figures who expressed skepticism of official Israeli policy or sympathy for the Palestinians.

Israel and Zionist organizations publish “hasbara manuals,” many of which are available online.

Hasbara trolls have also been assigned to comments sections, such as at the Guardian. They are likely here as well — Jack Green almost certainly is one.

*(I thought I’d just reposted this, as I do every few months, but it must have been snagged by the tech problems the site’s been having.)

Should the world be surprised that the Israel public by majority sanctions cold blooded murder against the Palestinians??? Most if not all have trampled upon the Palestinians, killed them for sport, destroyed their homes with not even a slap on the wrist since they all have served in the “outlaw” killing machine called the IDF.

There is no real rule of law in Israel. If there were, there would be no illegal occupation, detained indefinitely Palestinian men, woman, and children for no other reason except being Palestinian. There are no human rights to speak of in Israel, and the whole democracy charade is a complete sham.

When will the Palestinians get justice for the decades of Zionist terror, mass murder, and destruction of THEIR land???its coming…in due time Israel will pay dearly for its sheer lack of any moral compass and complete embrace of won ton criminality.

The British consul, William Young, writing in the 1840’s (before Zionism) said that the Jews of Jerusalem were living in fear for their lives. He attributed the plight of the Jews to “the blind hatred and ignorant prejudice of a fanatical populace…”

JEWS IN JERUSALEM.
New York Times December 29, 1878
Crowded together in the worst lodgings, or in the dark cellars under a synagogue building, without food, fuel, or water –even water at Jerusalem being a commodity of price – numbers died of starvation and various diseases, while others went raving mad. Those who could labor were denied employment by the bigotry of the Mussulmans and of the Oriental Christians.

Notice the date. This was before the first Zionists arrived. Notice the word “bigotry.”

Jews lived for in Hebron & Gaza for centuries until Palestinians shouting “The Jews are our dogs!” & “Islam was spread by the sword.” ethnically cleansed those areas of their Jews in 1929.
“…The riots took the form, in the most part, of attacks by Arabs on Jews…”

“…110 Arabs were killed and 232 were injured, the vast majority by the British police while trying to suppress the riots…”

The hasbara troll has recycled that bit about Jews in Jerusalem some dozen times now. What he always omits is that the entire piece is about Sephardic Jews oppressing and immisserating hyper-religious Ashkenazi Jews, whose religious views cause most of the latter to refuse most jobs. The Sephardim have charitable funds they do not share with these other Jews. The Muslims and Christians are, at best, a tertiary cause of their poverty. (No one doubts that historically members of all three Abrahamic faiths have manifested bigotry and hostility toward the other two.)

The hasbara troll is entirely aware of why Palestinians — after Zionists had long been using terror against them — resorted to their own terrorism. (Just as some in the ANC and IRA did against their respective oppressors.)

The hasbara troll has seen, over and over, documentation of extensive Zionist terrror, without which Israel would not have been founded. Upon good faith request from another I shall document it, yet again. In the meantime, see my comments in this thread, beginning with the one captioned: Israel was founded by Jewish terrorists, who used children.

Wait, is this the same article that reports that Sephardic Jews were given more rights than Ashkenazi Jews by the Turkish gov’t. And that Jews had to pay a special Jew tax by that gov’t. And that Jews were not allowed to work because of the bigotry of the Muslims and Christians ? Yes or No?

This is the same article you failed to note — and claimed I was lying — was merely excerpted in an old NYT, but did not originate there. Sure, Muslim governments historically discriminated against Christians and Jews. And Christian governments discriminated against the other two. Now we see that Jewish governments outdo them, with a vengeance.

I proved that to the hasbara troll months ago, and am not doing it again right now. I’m busy showing the manifest lie of the hasbara troll. He knows it’s a lie, and that Alan Dershowitz lied when he wrote it — and lifted it wholesale from another source, who was wrong. As he lifted so much else, including her identical errors. Because it isn’t Dershowitz’s work.

Th troll knows all this, becasue I’ve repeatedly told him, and shown it. Why do you suppose he keeps doing posting shit? How can his superiors, or even he, actually think his performance assists the Zionist cause?

I haven’t seen you prove anything. And I’m the one you accused of leaving out a fact.

As I proved you are an unreliable reporter when it comes to this case, and not above misstating the facts. Funny how you have the time to regurgitate falsehoods but no time to back up a claim you say is a fact.

That never happens wittingly, and did not happen here, as you are well aware. I conflated Sephardim with Ashkenazi, and nothing more; the truth of what I said remains, the parties simply are in reverse.

Truly entertaining you would make a claim implying dishonesty on my part, given what your hasbara pal often does, including this. And including the fact that you will not concede CAMERA’s duplicity on the Wikipedia matter. Gil, I’ve never seen you out-and-out lie, but you are as fundamentally dishonest as Zionists usually are.

I mean, look at the hasbara troll just above, still claiming to believe I have not shown overwhelming evidence that Israel would not exist but for Zionist terror. That’s dishonesty he will continue to endlessly repeat, as he does all his (mostly baseless) claims. It’s what he does. It’s what many, if not most, Zionists do. As they “must.”

If the Israeli’s want justice they can remove the Zionist menace from Palestinian land. FYI, the turmoil between Muslims, Arabs, and Jews began when Zionists began infiltrating Palestine for the one goal of occupying and removing the indigenous population for THEIR lands. You sir are an enemy of Judaism, and what it stands for. All of your laughable hasbara is just fabricated terror speak. One can not expect someone with such a poisoned, and mendacious vernacular as yours to know that history is your true enemy. You are a lapdog for Zionist terror and mass murder. Nice satire Sir Goebbles….

Palestinians had been oppressing Jews before any Zionists arrived in Palestine.

The British consul, William Young, writing in the 1840’s (before Zionism) said that the Jews of Jerusalem were living in fear for their lives. He attributed the plight of the Jews to “the blind hatred and ignorant prejudice of a fanatical populace…”

JEWS IN JERUSALEM.
New York Times December 29, 1878
Crowded together in the worst lodgings, or in the dark cellars under a synagogue building, without food, fuel, or water –even water at Jerusalem being a commodity of price – numbers died of starvation and various diseases, while others went raving mad. Those who could labor were denied employment by the bigotry of the Mussulmans and of the Oriental Christians.

Notice the date. This was before the first Zionists arrived. Notice the word “bigotry.”

Jack, you are the queen of Hasbara. No sources for your deluded racism, and no shred of any historical or religious ties that would connect Judaism to Zionism. There was no Zionism prior to Herzl. Furthermore Jews and Muslims lived in relative peace until the influx of Zionists came in the late 30’s. Israel has no historical rights to Palestine or any of the surrounding lands. You are not even a Jew…just a cheap suit spreading lies and embracing Zionist terror speak.

The British consul, William Young, writing in the 1840’s (before Zionism) said that the Jews of Jerusalem were living in fear for their lives. He attributed the plight of the Jews to “the blind hatred and ignorant prejudice of a fanatical populace…”

JEWS IN JERUSALEM.
New York Times December 29, 1878
Crowded together in the worst lodgings, or in the dark cellars under a synagogue building, without food, fuel, or water –even water at Jerusalem being a commodity of price – numbers died of starvation and various diseases, while others went raving mad. Those who could labor were denied employment by the bigotry of the Mussulmans and of the Oriental Christians.

Notice the date. This was before the first Zionists arrived. Notice the word “bigotry.”

Even Shakespeare wrote of Jewish greed and exceptionalism.
Remember the Money Changers from a couple thousand years ago? Yeah, the Jewish religion is centered on criminal activity like usury and ponzi. The state that is self-proclaimed to be Jewish extorts money from every single American.
What’s new?

Jews are increasingly rejecting Zionism, including many American Jews. The political Zionism on which Israel is founded was always racist and proto-fascist; this was recognized by many Jews in 1948 (I’ve often extensively shown Albert Einstein’s vehement denunciations of political Zionism). That recognition is growing rapidly.

Boehm says white nationalist Richard Spencer helped to blow up the liberal Zionist hypocrisy in his famous encounter with a Texas rabbi when he said he admires Israel for its ethnic purity and the rabbi had nothing to say. Some of Boehm’s hammer blows:

…by denying liberal principles, Zionism immediately becomes continuous with — rather than contradictory to — the anti-Semitic politics of the sort promoted by the alt-right…

…insofar as Israel is concerned, every liberal Zionist has not just tolerated the denial of this minimum liberal standard, but avowed this denial as core to their innermost convictions. Whereas liberalism depends on the idea that states must remain neutral on matters of religion and race, Zionism consists in the idea that the State of Israel is not Israeli, but Jewish. As such, the country belongs first and foremost not to its citizens, but to the Jewish people — a group that’s defined by ethnic affiliation or religious conversion…

Boehm never comes out and uses the term “racist,” but he might as well.

Indeed, Zionist Israel could not so delight Richard Spencer if it were not racist. Spencer agrees with Netanyahu that all Jews should live there — as an enforced majority, if not exclusively.

Aside from the reality that a 1-state — apartheid state– has long existed, a 1-state has always been the only equitable solution. One in which all are equal before the law, regardless of ethnicity or religion. Nothing else can end Israel’s existing as a state founded on “principles” that excite American white supremacists.

Apartheid South Africa fell, and did so faster than anyone expected. Apartheid Israel will fall as well — led significantly by Jews.

Dusgusting. He is now the modern Israeli hero, “the child of all of us” as many Israelis refer to him. Azaria is a criminal. But above him are even bigger criminals. Azaria was merely unlucky because he was caught executing a Palestinian on video.

Abed al-Fattah Yusri al-Sharif did not attack Israeli soldiers, he raised his hands and he was shot in his stomach by soldiers. And he lay on the ground. It was clear that Elor Azraya, the Israeli soldier who killed al-Sharif, did so with the consent of an officer.

Let’s be clear: this is not the first summary execution of a Palestinian by an IDF soldier nor will it be the last. It was just coincidentally captured on film, and consequently caused an uproar that led to an unavoidable trial. Elor Azaria is not a rotten apple and Israelis are indeed correct in calling him “the child of all of us”. He is a mirror unto mainstream Israel.

This case will further solidify the complete dehumanization of Palestinians and pave the way for further ethnic cleansing and genocide in the Occupied Palestinian Territories.

The root of it all is hatred of Arabs. Azaria is virtually a national hero for one reason only: He killed an Arab and the lines between Arabs and terrorists are blurred in Israel. Disgusting.

…Palestinian homes are routinely bulldozed to make way for Israeli settlements and that Israel has more than 50 laws on its statute books that discriminate against Palestinian citizens of the state. The United Nations has defined the crime of genocide as including a deliberate policy to impose conditions of life on an ethnic, racial or religious group to bring about the group’s total or partial destruction. By seriously examining the situation, it is entirely reasonable to argue that Israel is trying to destroy the Palestinian people and is therefore committing the crime of genocide.

A century (at least) of Zionist terror, ethnic cleansing, apartheid and myriad other injustices and atrocities, seem to fit the definition.

Jack, the main problem with all of your fabricated bs, is that Zionism has no historical ties to Judaism, no ties via the Bible, Torah, or Talmud, plus this sociopathic ideology was founded by Atheists who sought to use Judaism as a tool to attain land.

Zionism is the inherent opposite of Judaism, and it is sheer heresy that war criminals like Bibi use the word Jew in the first place.

Israel was founded by Zionist terror gangs of which all of the initial leaders wear a part of…The Stern Gang, Lehi, and Irgun. These terror gangs were not affiliated with Jews, but Zionists. Zionism is the new KKK, and resembles the Afrikaners whom Zionists gladly supported during SA apartheid. You sir need a deep reality check.

The first Zionists arrived in 1882. The terrorists gangs didn’t arise until around 50 years later. They arose for self-defense from Palestinian terrorists.

Jews had been persecuted for centuries in majority-gentile countries. Even when not actively persecuting the Jews, the majority-gentile countries refused to give refuge to the Jews when they needed it. There would have been no Holocaust if majority-gentile countries would have allowed in Jewish refugees who were escaping from the Nazis. The idea of Zionism was that Jews would return to their homeland & have a majority-Jewish country because majority-gentile countries had failed to provide safety for the Jews.

Ashkenazi (European) Jews have long imposed a racist caste system on their fellow Jews, especially in Israel — Zionism was an explicitly a European, colonial project. I was challenged on this in an older Israel thread, and bring the topic here where the discussion has moved.

That’s right: This [Israeli] commercial is all about selling real estate. Apparently, the best way to do that is to encourage derision directed at secular, non-Ashkenazi Jews. The implication is both that (a) being an authentic religious Jew means being Ashkenazi, and that (b) if you’re a good Ashkenazi Jew and you want to be able to practice your religion in peace, you need to get the hell out of dodge — which is to say, away from those dark-skinned, guttural-accented, costume-clothed, ignorant Sephardim and Mizrahim.

Hundreds of books and articles have been written about — or touching upon — Ashkenazi racism, both against other Jews, as well as Arabs and Africans. It’s a virtually inexhaustible topic.

Those who may be shocked by the blatant bigotry in the Karmei Gat video must remember that racist attitudes toward Mizrahim are part and parcel of Israel’s DNA. The founders of the state, Jews of Ashkenazi origin who were raised on European ideas of nationalism and socialism, viewed “Oriental Jews” as backward and primitive from the moment they began arriving en masse on Israel’s shores, shortly after the founding of the state.

Famed Israeli Foreign Minister Abba Eban described in 1957 how Mizrahi Jews were, in the plainest sense, a direct threat to the nascent State of Israel: “The goal must be to instill in them a Western spirit, and not let them drag us into an unnatural Orient. One of the biggest fears… is the danger that the large amount of immigrants of Mizrahi origin will force Israel to compare how cultured we are to our neighbors.”

Those same racist sentiments laid the groundwork for racist policies. During the early years of the state, Mizrahi Jews were subject to ghettoization, cultural theft, and medical experimentation. Most disturbing of all was the alleged kidnapping of hundreds of Yemenite babies during the years 1948-1956. Although Yemenite Jews were viewed by the Zionist establishment as being the most “authentic” Jews, they were still seen through the prism of the East, infected with a disease that could only be cured through a dosage of Western acculturation. “Why destroy the diaspora in Yemen and bring these people who will harm us more than help?” asked Yitzhak Grinboim, Israel’s first interior minister. “By bringing 70 percent of ill Yemenite Jews we will harm both us and them.”

To understand the scorn, and at times detestation of Jews from Arab countries in Israel, we must go to the source.

Do go read the whole thing. Zionism was and is an entirely European, racist, colonial project.

Zionism is inherently racist, founded on ethno-religious, Jewish supremacy, and explicitly modeled on the fascist nationalism popular in the late 19th and early 20th centuries. You’ve seen this documented innumerable times.

Jews had been persecuted for centuries in majority-gentile countries. Even when not actively persecuting the Jews, the majority-gentile countries refused to give refuge to the Jews when they needed it. There would have been no Holocaust if majority-gentile countries would have allowed in Jewish refugees who were escaping from the Nazis. The idea of Zionism was that Jews would return to their homeland & have a majority-Jewish country because majority-gentile countries had failed to provide safety for the Jews. There’s nothing about Jewish supremacy in Zionism.

The idea of Zionism was that Jews would return to their homeland & have a majority-Jewish country because majority-gentile countries had failed to provide safety for the Jews. There’s nothing about Jewish supremacy in Zionism.

Zionism is entirely about Jewish supremacy. You’ve seen copious documentation of many notable Zionists saying they embrace the same fascist nationalism that, e.g., Nazis did. Some of them explicitly identifying with the Nazis.

Zionist Jews decided to do to the Palestinians what was being done to them. As sympathetic as the reasons driving some Zionists were, there is no moral justification for becoming the thing they hate — an oppressor. But that’s what they did and do.

A teenager and his mother are walking, happy and carefree, along the street, together with the boy’s aunt, on the way to buy him a present – a pair of new shoes – as a reward for his excellent report card. As they proceed up an alley, a group of children running for their lives hurtle toward them. Before they can figure out what’s going on, they hear a shot and the boy falls to the ground in the horrified presence of his mother. He screams in agony, as blood streams from one eye.

Ahmed Mahmoud, a 15-year-old in the 10th grade, a top student well groomed with stylishly cut hair, is on the verge of losing consciousness. He thought he’d lost his sight and was coughing up blood, he recalls now, weeks later. His mother, Esrar, was panic-stricken.

The incident happened on December 5, at about 3:30 P.M., on a street close to their home in the village of Isawiyah, within the municipal boundaries of Jerusalem….

…

Ahmed relates that he was beaten during his interrogation: He was made to lie on the floor and was kicked for about 10 minutes, to force him to admit to throwing stones. He also says that the interrogators cursed his mother and threatened to arrest her if he didn’t confess. They also threatened to bring in his school principal unless he confessed. He was given a Hebrew-language form to sign but he refused to so, he says.

Ahmed lost sight in his one eye. How long will the Israeli outlet, Haaretz, be allowed, in relative safety, to report these stories?

As the article above points out, Jews of decent morality have good cause to fear violence, including assassination, from other Jews. Many have fled from Israel, and of these, a great number live in Berlin. Among them, Israeli filmmaker, Dror Dayan.

Dayan has made new documentary: Even Though My Land is Burning:

The film portrays the lives of Palestinian villagers under occupation and how some anti-Zionist Israeli Jews support their cause and their resistance. It shows how the organized resistance works in Nabi Saleh.

…

It was important to Dayan, who is strongly anti-Zionist, to show that being against Zionism is not a matter of religion or ethnicity. He believes, he said, that every Israeli Jew has the option to decide to abandon Zionism.

“Ignorance is a choice,” Dayan said.

Dayan said anti-Zionist Israeli Jews, like those in his documentary, are often considered either traitors or simply insane in wider Israeli society. And with the success of the boycott, divestment and sanctions movement, they are even seen as a self-hating fifth column.

Anti-Zionist Jews, especially hose like Dayan who highlight the atrocities of Zionism, are not safe in Israel. They were not safe in Mandate Palestine, either, where Zionists marshaled their children to blow up Arabs. Parents and teachers who objected were often simply assassinated — by other Jews.

Mr J. Green is a deluded and unhappy person…none of his argument are convincing…fact is Israel is the most disliked country in the world which reflects on the israeli jews, weather they like it or not …

He’s not deluded — Jack Green is an indoctrinated Zionist working as a hasbara troll, a formal role whether undertaken by those paid or by volunteers. The State of Israel and other Zionist entities send them out all over online.

The great problem hasbara trolls have is increasingly, as seen in comments here, they encounter well-informed individuals who easily dispatch their propaganda, and show the Zionist troll to be full of lies, halftruths and misdirection. Which, of course, only sets the Zionist cause back even further.

I guess the most recent reason that comes to mind would be the 60% approval rating of street executions. Conducted in the manner of just another day in the office by a medic who has taken a Hippocratic oath. Absolutely abominable. You have no standing in the civilised world. I’m sure you throw the term self-hating Jew around quite a bit, are there any self-hating Zionists?

The hasbara troll translated: “I’ve been instructed that in response to all claims about Zionist terrorism to reply that Palestinians started it in the 1920s, and if necessary to link to Wikipedia. I don’t know what to do in light of this new Thomas Suarez book that documents how much earlier and egregiously Zionist terror began — they haven’t told me yet.”

Dr. Paul Nathan, by the way, was a prominent and well-respected man. His 1914 report about Zionists executing a virtual pogrom on Palestinian Arabs caught the attention of the New York Times early in that year, which said that Jews in New York said Nathan was “exaggerating.” The NYT index does not say, however, they denied all Zionist terror.

Thank you for the info.
There was a really heated dispute between Jews as to whether the language used at the new Technical Institute should be German or Hebrew.
No one was killed. No one was hurt. There was no violence. Arabs were not involved.

Why did Zionists commit terrorism against Palestinians from at least 1914, so severe and appalling that a German, Jewish physician in that year called it: “a campaign of terror modelled almost on Russian pogrom models”?

Please note, I’m not asking who started what first, which is being discussed below. I wish to see how you defend, if you do, this egregious, long-standing Zionist terrorism.

Everyone should observe the troll continue to tap dance. (And claim some link that’s not offered to all, or even a relevant quote.) This is a great example of the hasbara troll, especially when confronted with greatly damning evidence that’s too new to be dealt with yet in their instructions.

I’ve ordered the book and you can be sure I’ll be reporting more extensively here. For now, I’ll simply quote from Thomas Suarez’ recent speech to the British House of Lords:

By the time the Balfour Declaration was finalised, thirty-plus years of Zionist settlement had made clear that the Zionists intended to ethnically cleanse the land for a settler state based on racial superiority; and it was the behind-the-scenes demands of the principal Zionist leaders, notably Chaim Weizmann and Baron Rothschild.

First-hand accounts of Zionist settlement in Palestine had already painted a picture of violent racial displacement. I will cite one of the lesser known reports, by Dr. Paul Nathan, a prominent Jewish leader in Berlin, who went to Palestine on behalf of the German Jewish National Relief Association. He was so horrified by what he found that he published a pamphlet in January, 1914, in which he described the Zionist settlers as carrying on

a campaign of terror modelled almost on Russian pogrom models

And settlers still are carrying on pogroms. Nothing has changed, because Zionism is what it is.

Israel wants to be respected as a world power? Start by obeying intl. law. Instead, if I dare to criticize them with facts (ex. Israel is a apartheid state), instantly the AIPAC and Israeli Govt. trolls attack and scream YOU’RE A GODDAMN FUCKING ANTI SEMITE!!! This is why the rest of the world despises Israel.

Uh-huh. Israel was his friend, supporting apartheid South Africa and even offering to sell it nuclear weapons. DeKlerk is a racist, and the African National Congress says Israel is an apartheid state. They know apartheid, too. As does international law, the definition and analysis of which you’ve repeatedly been given.

Given that you somehow think refusing to let people live in their homes, with their families, because of their race, isn’t racial discrimination, and excluding them from being present on certain streets, and towns, because of them being the ‘wrong’ race isn’t segregation, that you’d also consider DeKlerk’s opinion as more compelling than Tutu’s isn’t surprising.

Desmond Tutu said: “Whether Jews like it or not, they are a peculiar people. They can’t ever hope to be judged by the same standards which are used for other people.”
That means that we should not accept as Gospel anything Desmond Tutu says if it concerns the Jews because he’s biased.

You’ve been smacked around about that before. Tutu was speaking in solidarity to a group of Jews in that speech from the 1980s. Tutu and the African National Congress both hold that Israel is an apartheid state.

And yes, Israel is guilty of apartheid per international law. Denying it doesn’t make the law and analysis go away.

And before you tell us again about Mr. Pogrund, please be advised that DeKlerk has also never lived in Israel, yet you approvingly cite that racist man.

That *is how many Zionist Jews see and saw themselves. They explicitly adopted the antisemites’ view of Jews to promote Zionism. For example, the Second Father of Zionism (Herzl was the First), Vladimir Jabotinsky, said this: “The Jewish people are a very nasty people. Its neighbors hate it and they’re right.”

That’s so odious a statement that a person would likely be banned from this site if offering it as their own. But Jabotinsky, like many Zionists, regarded antisemites as the Zionists’ best friends. To the great disgust of, e.g., American Jews who long opposed Zionism.

Tribal savagery. If the rolls were reversed and it was Hamas who executed a unarmed wounded IDF soldier in the same manner, there would have been another military incursion. God’s chosen people delusion is alive and thriving in Israel. Too bad it took the US this long to say what they did. Israel can be a democracy or the Jewish State but it’s blantantly obvious there can’t be both. It’s the incessant brutality Zionists inflict on the Palestinians that beyond Appalling.

Israel is a wonderful country that set up field hospitals in Haiti & Nepal to help those hurt by the earthquakes & to help those in the Philippines who were injured by the typhoon. Israeli advances in science, medicine & agriculture have helped billions of people all over the world.

In 2011, a team of Israeli neonatologists went to Kumasi, Ghana’s second-largest city, to train local doctors and nurses in advanced, low-cost methods to address the city’s high infant mortality rate. The doctors, sent by the Alliance for Global Good in cooperation with MASHAV, also established two new neonatal units in Kumasi’s sole hospital.

Why did Zionists commit terrorism against Palestinians from at least 1914, so severe and appalling that a German, Jewish physician in that year called it: “a campaign of terror modelled almost on Russian pogrom models”?

Please note, I’m not asking who started what first, which is being discussed below. I wish to see how you defend, if you do, this egregious, long-standing Zionist terrorism.</blockquote?

You haven’t been told what to say about 1914, because those facts are only recently being widely documented. You’ve seen the link many times now, in two threads. The hasbara instructions simply have not yet been updated to instruct you on how to handle it.

Shiver me timbers!
Great post! nice find.
Pages and pages of accusations and characterisations without facts of actual events. And then suddenly “RT DID IT”.
Has wallstreet wmd media has lost their marbles!?

Jack Green is a hasbara troll, but there are and have been quite a few others of them infesting this site.

At any reasonably prominent online venue, there are always a number of accounts who make it their mission to post vacuous, misleading and disruptive Zionist bullshit. Often, they are following talking points issued by both formal and informal “hasbara” projects. (Hasbara means “explaining” in Hebrew; in practice it means “propaganda.”)

Max Blumenthal has described these annoying creatures and their programs thus:

The more the State of Israel relied on force to manage the occupation, the more compelled it was to deploy hasbara. And the more Western media consumers encountered hasbara, the more likely they became to measure Israel’s grandiose talking points against the routine and petty violence, shocking acts of humiliation, and repression that defined its relationship with the Palestinians.

Under the leadership of Prime Minister Benjamin Netanyahu, a professional explainer who spent the early years of his political career as a frequent guest on prime time American news programs perfecting the slickness of the Beltway pundit class, the Israeli government invested unprecedented resources into hasbara. Once the sole responsibility of the Israeli foreign ministry, the task of disseminating hasbara fell to a special Ministry of Public Diplomacy led by Yuli Edelstein, a rightist settler and government minister who called Arabs a “despicable nation.”

Edelstein’s ministry boasted an advanced “situation room,” a paid media team, and coordination of a volunteer force that claimed to include thousands of volunteer bloggers, tweeters, and Facebook commenters fed with talking points and who flood social media with hasbara in five languages. The exploits of the propaganda soldiers conscripted into Israel’s online army have helped give rise to the phenomenon of the “hasbara troll,” an often faceless, shrill and relentless nuisance deployed on Twitter and Facebook to harass public figures who expressed skepticism of official Israeli policy or sympathy for the Palestinians.

Israel and Zionist organizations publish “hasbara manuals,” many of which are available online.

Hasbara trolls have also been assigned to comments sections, such as at the Guardian. They are likely here as well — Jack Green almost certainly is one.

*(Usually I link to this comment, which I’ve posted before. But every few months I repost it — when new readers have accumulated and Jack or another hasbara troll indicates that I should.)

The pictures and horror speak for themselves. Most of the dead were civilians; the UN says 7 in 10. And the dead soldiers were fighting defensively as Israel cannot be, becasue it is the oppressor, the thief and the aggressor. (Would you like to see the Moshe Dayan quote on that again?)

Of the Palestinian fatalities, 551 were children and 299 women.[2]
11,231 Palestinians were injured including 3,436 children and 3,540 women, 10 percent of whom suffer permanent disability.[3]
More than 1,500 Palestinian children were orphaned.[4]
142 Palestinian families had three or more members killed in the same incident, for a total of 742 fatalities.[5]
18,000 housing units were destroyed in whole or part.[6]
73 medical facilities and many ambulances were damaged.

Hamas GHM says that there were 2,310 dead. Subtract 551 children leaves 1,760. If the Israelis were indiscriminate (which is part of the definition of massacre,) there would be an equal number of men & women so if you divide 1,760 by 2 you would get 880 men & 880 women. But the actual number of women killed was 299 so it was certainly not a massacre.

Ima gonna just let that sit there, let people observe your mathematical silliness and attempted semantic ploy in response to the horror Israel imposed on Gazans. All decent people will be disgusted. Bad, bad hasbara-ist.

You seem rather eager to state your views, but not your definition of Apartheid.
As I said, my definition of Apartheid is a regime that denies citizenship and residency rights to a large part of its legal population so that a minority ethnic group within that population can proclaim themselves the majority of the state, and the state a democracy.
Does this mostly match yours, or is yours tied up with the ‘petty apartheid’ practices of the South African regime (the race classification appeal board, for instance) that could not exist without the ‘grand apartheid’ of my definition?

It’s not for us to make up definitions. Definitions are what people mean when they use the word. Dictionaries don’t just make up definitions. They listen to what people are saying & what people are writing to distill the meaning.

When I looked up “apartheid,” all the definitions mentioned racial segregation. That includes “petty apartheid.”

Oh, I have to compliment whoever came up with that for you, even while reviling him for his service to an Apartheid regime.
Now, to get around the verbal deflection, do you deny that the Israeli regime is an Apartheid state as defined in the international law designating Apartheid a crime against humanity?
Take your time, consult the writing team at headquarters, I’m sure that they’ll have a workaround worthy of Trump, aimed at those of the same intellectual capacity as that ‘No socialized medicine, but hands off Medicare’ lady.

The definition includes: “…for the purpose of establishing and maintaining domination by one racial group of persons over any other racial group of persons…”
Israel’s purpose is not establishing and maintaining domination by one racial group of persons over any other racial group of persons. Israel’s purpose is self-defense.

Israel maintains domination of Jews over indigenous Arabs. It does this by, among other things, laws and policies that ensure a Jewish super-majority. The whole analysis, moreover, should be taken as a whole.

Neither of these proves that there would be no Israel without terrorism. Terrorism may have sped up the process, but colonialism was in decline. From 1945 until 1960 three dozen new states in Asia and Africa achieved autonomy. Why wouldn’t Israel have become independent, too?

You either didn’t read all of that material, or you are lying. As well as spewing non sequiturs about “colonialism in decline.”

Through terrorism, Israel ethnically cleansed and stole all the land on which it sits, and from which it maintains an apartheid state. It could not exist but for that terror.

Neither the the UN nor any of its member states owned any of the land and so could not morally give any away. But even on the terms of that body’s 1947 plan, Zionist terror was heinous:

…township of Sderot, targeted by Gaza’s rockets and therefore a major propaganda asset of the Israeli regime, is built on the ruins of an ethnically-cleansed Palestinian village called Najd, whose inhabitants were forced to flee by Jewish terrorists in May 1948. Najd wasn’t allocated to the Jews in the 1947 UN Partition Plan — they stole it at gunpoint.

Remember, too, that Ben Gurion airport, which serves Tel Aviv, was formerly Lydda airport. Lydda, shown on my biblical map of Palestine, was a major Arab town and communications hub during the British Mandate and designated Palestinian in the 1947 UN Partition Plan. In July 1948 Israeli terrorist troops seized the town, shot it up and drove out the population. Donald Neff reported how, as part of the ethnic cleansing, the Israelis massacred 426 men, women and children. Some 176 of them were slaughtered in the town’s main mosque. Of all the bloodbaths, they say this was the biggest.

Out of a population of 19,000, only 1,052 were allowed to stay. The others who survived the murderous onslaught were forced to walk into exile in the scalding July heat, leaving a trail of bodies — men, women and children — along the way. Who was responsible for this act of infamy? Answer: Israel’s great “hero”, Moshe Dayan, who later became defense minister and foreign minister.

The United Nations did NOT give away any land. It simply drew a border. On one side of the border, the people were mostly Jews. That side became Israel. On the other side of the border, the people were mostly non-Jews.
No private property was handed over.

Palestinians started a war against the Jews in 1947. Wars create refugees.
If Palestinians had not been murdering innocent Jews, no one would have been killed or displaced.

You still haven’t proved that without terrorism there would be no Israel.

It’s not land theft. It’s a land dispute. The settlers believe they are exercising their right of return. They are just taking back their own land that was stolen from them during the Arab conquest of the Middle East in the seventh century. The settlers believe that the Jews have a deed to the land. In determining ownership, the law says use the oldest document. There’s a Torah that’s over a thousand years old. You don’t have to believe in God, but this ancient document lists the names of the owners of the land (the 12 sons of Jacob [aka Israel]) & the boundaries of the land. In other words, it’s a deed to the land naming the children of Israel as the owners. If you dig in Palestine, you will find ancient synagogues & Jewish ritual baths & Jewish coins. Settlers see this as further proof that it’s their land.
Palestinians say that it’s Palestinian land because Palestinians have lived there for centuries.

Should this be a reasonable proposition – a dubious one, to my mind – those “settlers” are generally far more removed from the lineage of ancient denizens than today’s Palestinians. It doesn’t matter how you approach the question, there is no valid claim to the land by contemporary Israel.

That’s straight of a hasbara manual, literally. (I can quote if you like.) You’ve seen the copious documentation from myriad Zionists admitting it was colonialism and taking land by force, that is, ethnic cleansing.

Tell us Jack, do you have Hasbara Team supervisors you report to or anyone that sees your work? I’m genuinely curious whether they know that the primary result of your spouting and spewing is me and others posting vast amounts of truth about Zionists and Israel that makes them look like moral monsters they were and are.

I have no team. I have no supervisor. No one pays me. I’ve never seen a hasbara manual.
I’m just disgusted by the bigotry against Israel & I know that in the past false accusations have been followed by pogroms & genocide.

There was a riot in Palestine in 1920 in which both Jews and Arabs attacked each other; the British undertook an official inquiry, which resulted in the Palin Report.

Zionist Jews were making it clear they were taking over Palestine and were not respecting the promise the WWI Allied powers had made to the indigenous Arabs — that they would have right to self-determination, and that the land was theirs.

After dozens of findings of fact, this is part of the Palin Report’s conclusions.

69. The following are the considered opinions submitted by the Court:

That the causes of the alienation and exasperation of the feelings of the population of Palestine are:

Disappointment at the non-fulfilment of promises made to them by British propaganda.

Inability to reconcile the Allies’ declared policy of self-determination with the Balfour Declaration, giving rise to a sense of betrayal and intense anxiety for their future.

Misapprehension of the true meaning of the Balfour Declaration and forgetfulness of the guarantees determined therein, due to the loose rhetoric of politicians and the exaggerated statements and writings of interested persons, chiefly Zionists.

Fear of Jewish competition and domination, justified by experience and the apparent control exercised by the Zionists over the Administration.

Zionist indiscretion and aggression, since the Balfour Declaration aggravating such fears.

Anti-British and anti-Zionist propaganda working on the population already inflamed by the sources of irritation aforesaid. [p81]

That the Zionist Commission and the official Zionists by their impatience, indiscretion and attempts to force the hands of the Administration, are largely responsible for the present crisis.

By 1920, ever-increasing numbers of European Jews had been fucking over the indigenous Arab population for many years, including through terrorism, as I’ve documented. It was about to get much, much worse.

Why did Zionists commit terrorism against Palestinians from at least 1914, so severe and appalling that a German, Jewish physician in that year called it: “a campaign of terror modelled almost on Russian pogrom models”?

Please note, I’m not asking who started what first, which is being discussed below. I wish to see how you defend, if you do, this egregious, long-standing Zionist terrorism.

our society/culture would look awful to any alien lifeform, we have allowed our future to be in the hands of murderous lying corrupt politicians who are naively labeled “leaders”. we seem to have no positive goals/aspirations. nothing to reverse climate change, no shutting down of the stupid nuclear industry, no constraint or arrests of thieving banksters, nothing but devotion to the lying newsmedia and the 1% megathieves. no “new deal”/new alternative energy push. it wont be long and the window of opportunity to stop climate change will be closed. the businessman rules, the rest stupidly allow it.

we seem to have no positive goals/aspirations. nothing to reverse climate change, no shutting down of the stupid nuclear industry, no constraint or arrests of thieving banksters, nothing but devotion to the lying newsmedia and the 1% megathieves.

That is mainly because of the “escape clause” which reads, When you die your life is over and you may go to heaven or hell so let your mess be the next guy’s problem – they need a job anyway.

I tell you the truth. LIFE RECYCLES. You shall return. I guarantee it. The mess or bless you leave you will come back to in life. What do you want to come back to?

The evidence for one’s return is in the bible AND in physics. I guarantee it.

I notice the knife attacker is being described as a “terrorist” online. I understand he attacked a soldier of an occupying army. You can stretch the definition of terrorism to include him and simultaneously exclude standard state violence, but it’s clearly an artificial distinction.

I’m curious how a people without a state, or an individual Palestinian, can “attack Israel”?

One human being can attack another, and someone nominally who identifies as a “Palestinian” can attack and “Israeli”, but I’m pretty sure one Palestinian individual attacking an Israeli individual (particularly a soldier in an occupied parcel of land) isn’t representative of all stateless Palestinians, or is it an “attack on Israel”. It most certainly would likely be a crime, but it should be treated as such, not the basis for a policy of apartheid against all Palestinians.

But apparently Zionists and their supporters, like you, don’t like the idea the “Palestinians” are individuals, or even human beings entitled to basic human rights–that’s why I’m supportive of BDSing anything and everything that has to do with the state of Israel, and Zionists who aren’t advocating for a fundamental change in Israel’s policies vis a vis the Palestinians.

I personally think right-wing Israelis are the biggest bullies and cowards on the planet, afraid of a stateless people who fight them with rocks, bottles and knives while Israel rains down the most high-tech destructive devices every devised by man, on all huge numbers of Palestinians every time a drop of Israeli blood is spilled. If there are actions more cowardly than that I don’t know what they are.

What exactly is the “worth ratio” in your mind of an Israeli citizen vis a vis a Palestinian? 10 to 1? because that’s a low estimate of the ratio of Palestinian deaths caused by Israelis by comparison to Israeli deaths caused by Palestinians, and that’s been the case since the inception of Israel.

When that’s how you see the world, it’s no wonder most everyone on the planet (except the equally bloodthirsty and willing to kill others American people) see Israel as no longer having the moral high ground in this debate.

You treat the flyspeck of relative violence that the Palestinian people commit against citizens of Israel, by bombing all Palestinian’s lives to rubble about every half a decade. I think bully and coward describes right-wing Israel and right-wing Israelis quite accurately.

Because boycotts always hurt innocent people (More than 575,000 Iraqi children died from sanctions,) they should not be used unless the matter is very important like life & death.
Don’t single out a particular country when other countries are doing the same thing otherwise you lose moral authority.
There should be just one demand & everyone should agree to stop as soon as the goal is met otherwise the target will not change if it is not confident that the sanctions will stop.
It is especially wrong to hurt innocents when there’s little chance of success. Omar Barghouti, the founder of BDS, won’t end BDS until Israel agrees to take in all Palestinian refugees. Israel would never agree to stop being a Jewish state so there’s zero possibility of success.

BDS is the same thing done to end apartheid in Israel. It didn’t kill South Africans, and it isn’t going to kill Israelis, either.

I want a SodaStream, badly. I’m not going to buy a SodaStream. I have every reason to believe that no one will die as a result.

Further, Israel can end BDS at any point by stopping the apartheid. (It doesn’t matter that you absurdly deny the apartheid; what matters is that Israel can end the vile polices that many others, including the African National Congress, call Israeli apartheid.)

Sanctions killed 575,000 Iraqi children. How do you know that it won’t kill Israeli children?

What you’ve achieved so far with BDS is that hundreds of SodaStream’s Palestinian employees lost their jobs.

How can Israel stop committing apartheid when it’s not committing apartheid?

Omar Barghouti, the founder of BDS, won’t end BDS until Israel agrees to take in all Palestinian refugees. In other words, BDS won’t end until there is no longer a Jewish state. You are helping him achieve his goal. Is that your goal, too?

Jews had been persecuted for centuries in majority-gentile countries. Even when not actively persecuting the Jews, the majority-gentile countries refused to give refuge to the Jews when they needed it. There would have been no Holocaust if majority-gentile countries would have allowed in Jewish refugees who were escaping from the Nazis. The idea of Zionism was that Jews would return to their homeland & have a majority-Jewish country because majority-gentile countries had failed to provide safety for the Jews.

What you’ve achieved so far with BDS is that hundreds of SodaStream’s Palestinian employees lost their jobs.

Well, not exactly. BDS is a Palestinian-led and -founded movement. If those Palestinians are willing to see some Palestinians lose jobs, it is their call to make. Moreover, the boycott caused SodaStream to leave its factory in the West Bank. They admit that even if it is true they were planning to move, they did it sooner because of BDS.

I’m not further discussing why BDS isn’t going to kill Israelis; we’ve been through that dozens of times before. It didn’t kill South Africans and neither will it kill Israelis. (And could be stopped at any point in the extremely unlikely event it looked like it would lead to many deaths.)

The evidence is overwhelming that BDS is causing economic pain to Israel (but killing no one). It is succeeding.

Do you buy Chines products despite China’s illegal occupation of Tibet & the millions of settlers China has transferred into Tibet?
Do you buy Turkish products despite Turkey’s illegal occupation of Cyprus & the Turkish settlers in Cyprus?
Do you buy Moroccan products despite Morocco’s illegal occupation of Western Sahara?

So if a Palestinian tries to kill an Israeli with a rock, the Israeli is only allowed to defend himself with a rock?

Why, of course not, Jack. When that rotten Palestinian kid throws a rock at heavily armed and armored IDF troops, he should definitely be execute in a hail of automatic weapons fire and, then, for good measure, his parents’ crappy little hovel should be blown up.

If you keep hearing words together, even if they are unrelated, your brain will link them. Israel is not apartheid, but if you keep hearing the word “Israel” together with the word “apartheid,” you will automatically link them.

Well, that just isn’t true at all. The brain does not blindly create or strengthen neural pathways based on any input at all, even with repetition. Were the mind to function that way, we’d all be dysfunctional blobs of insanity. Nor is it able to throw away context in processing language.

It may not be apartheid, but that is only because apartheid was a unique abomination suited to a unique historical context. It certainly has many parallels, from using labels to define ‘people of value’ vs. ‘people of no value’ (race in SA, religion in Israel) to applying the law completely differently to different groups. It even has a lovely ‘tiers of worth’ system like good ol’ SA, where the occupied Pals are the blacks, the Arab Israelis the ‘coloreds’ , and Israeli jews the whites. And most importantly, it assigns the value of lives based on bogus, unfair labels- race in SA, religion in Israel. I still am baffled how a supposedly democratic state literally defines rights based on f-ing RELIGION (ps folks, it’s a freaking fantasy- worshiping Jupiter or Ahura Mazda makes no more or less sense). And the overwhelming support for this constantly smiling murderous turd shows how deeply depraved Israeli society is. They look like a bunch of religious fanatics to anyone with an honest heart and a brain. Fortunately, most of the world already gets this, and more and more of American society gets it, too. Seeing the blind, frothing hate that spewed forth when the US had the temerity to not veto the UN resolution will help. We look at 39bn to prop up this ugly, repressive psuedo-theocracy and wonder how many suffering Americans could be helped with that money. They have taken a sharp right turn and are traveling the road to full pariah status, without the slightest sign that they understand that they are wandering off into an ugly, hateful wilderness where they will have NO friends (except, evidently, some very corrupt Arab autocrats).

Jack, let’s see if we’re talking about the same thing when we say ‘Apartheid’.
I mean a regime that refuses citizenship and residency rights to a large segment of its legal population so that a minority ethnicity within that population can style themselves the majority of a state, and claim that state as a democracy?
Are you, perhaps, conflating ‘petty apartheid’ (the things like the racial classification appeal board) with the thing that allowed petty apartheid to exist?

Seriously, why do you even think that at this point? The Israeli government doesn’t want a 2 state solution and no one sees it as viable anymore. Israelis routinely refer to the West Bank as Israeli territory. For all practical purposes, the West Bank is a part of Israel, where — undeniably — there are 2 classes of people under the law.

The ‘citizens’ of the ‘White state’ in South Africa also wanted a 2 state solution. But the problem for your Israelis is that such a ‘solution’ violates recognized international law, relies on extinguishing recognized individual rights on a group basis.
But given your refusal to say what you think Apartheid is, but your eagerness to declare that Israel isn’t that, why should anyone take you any more seriously than the Republican supporter who declared ‘We don’t want socialized medicine, but hands off our medicare’ (which, of course, is socialized medicine)

When this murder happened I wrote a comment to TIC piece (below) related to it that among others described moral decay of Israeli society (and Palestinian society as well) psychologically under siege of their own political extremists, warmongers, blasphemers of holocaust whose political careers are tied to the war and its power to intimidate and terrorize their own Israeli society for American money.

Here it is still relevant:

What is more outrageous than this strait forward murder on tape of a wounded man (not an enemy anymore) are some dreadful comments I have read here.

The small remaining group of holocaust survivors, in their nineties, are appalled by this murderous behavior of Israeli military because is it exactly what they witnessed from NAZIs in WWII. Every Jew was considered a threat to national security of Germany back then adult or child, man or a woman, old or young, healthy or wounded. And some really wanted to kill German soldiers.

Jews walking on the street (not on a sidewalk, since it was punishable by death or beating) in their cities own they grew up, often were shot while trying to take their hats off (as required by law) while passing a German civilians or military “misunderstood” as a attempt of an assault, by a bandit or terrorist as they precisely called it in their reports and in the media, and it was a language form Germans used as they testified to the police.

None of that was truth, as so many of those alleged knife attacks by Palestinians are; many of them are pure fabrications and provocations.

In fact those few attacks on German military SS or administration that were perpetrated by Jewish resistance were effective in their objectives but they always resulted in copycat propaganda and deaths of hundreds of innocent Jews baselessly accused of attacks inspired by medial hysteria “Jews are out there to kill us”;

A Jew that happened to be shot and not instantly killed was lying on the street sometimes for hours while police and military investigated and interviewed German witnesses. German children were poking still alive man or woman with sticks, spit on them, or shout profanities, investigating officers were stealing from pocked of the victim, and if suspected of carrying a bomb they blew him up with a grenade.

For adults rushing on the street going about their business, reading their newspapers about another terrorist attack in Germany, dying on a pavement human being was invisible. After that, if still alive, a Jew was shot in the head and collected by a garbage truck.

This was what Jewish holocaust survivors eye witnessed or heard from eyewitnesses and now they are being threatened, punished and social services denied or cut to keep them silent about Palestinian holocaust in their last months or years of witnessing collapsing of humanity of too many Jews, exactly what they eye witnessed 70 years ago in Europe.

Now, many of them are protesting the new holocaust of Palestinians confined to ghettos of Gaza and West Bank like Jews in Warsaw ghetto, an entity, a fully dependent statelet (like Gaza), recognized by only Hitler as a Jewish independent state, designed to be in a state of permanent starvation, crisis, economic depression and slow death. And when Jews raised up for one thing and one thing alone namely their human dignity in 1943 with knifes, clubs, hunting rifles they met with this same abhorrent response as I am reading here, namely just do not try to kill Germans and you gonna be fine.

The leader of Jewish ghetto uprising M. Edelman under pressure from communist authorities in eastern block to emigrate after 1967 ME war, refused to resettle to Israel exactly because he condemned Israeli state for how it treated Palestinians and for their wars and provocations in ME.

He chose to stay under communist regime rather them become Israeli citizen. This powerful message never reached any Jew in Israel or US where he was blacklisted and threaten by MOSSAD with death if he wouldn’t shut up.

Suffering from nightmarish Stockholm syndrome, Israel recreated a NAZI state in the Holy land. The same type of amalgamates of modern enlightened Fascism and Theocracy that almost exterminated Jews in Europe, with its rational dehumanization of a segment of the population (now Palestinians, then it were Jews “rationally” and even “scientifically” dehumanized). The plans of extermination of Jews was called “instilling European values and culture” in those savages that can’t be reason with and will always continue their conniving, devilish ways, I am paraphrasing NAZI political platform. Just change Jews to Palestinians and European to Israeli and here is, updated current Israeli political platform of all political parties.

I myself do not support HAMAS or ABBAS or any current leader of Palestinians, they all should resign as traitors of the nation and mainstream secular Palestinians should take charge since this old Palestinian corrupted clique are much more contributing to the problem then to any kind of peaceful solution and only fueling extremism on both sides but what Israel, that hardly can be called a Jewish state, and its dehumanized robots i.e. conscripted soldiers are doing is nothing less than abhorrent, directly from NAZI playbook.

The Israeli government and all political elites are tainted by war disease and all Israeli oligarchs are making profits of death and destruction and hence should be removed from power an imprisoned for war crimes against Palestinians and economic crimes and pauperization and exploitation of Israeli citizen pushed into perpetual war and existential dependence on US imperial power, if we want to have any hope for political solution and preserving lasting peace.

What we are witnessing is deterioration of basic human morality, social order and steady economic collapse throughout globalized world and the same we can say about corporate governments or observe in the media everywhere, in India, China, Europe or in the US, seemingly local, specific entrenched in history conflicts are nothing but representations of the same pains of US imperial globalization as generations before witnessed when it was British, Spanish or Roman globalization of imperial powers with deadly consequences of denying sanctity of human life everywhere. Underlying all the Imperial political strive is a question of humanity, nothing else.

And netanyahoo can’t understand why Americans are disgusted with his regime. Go figure. When 70% of the population is happy with what this POS did and feels he was justified, then they are beyond redemption. Not even 70% of Americans feel that cops are justified in executing people who are handcuffed or otherwise immobilized.

Elizabeth Tsurkov, a rights activist in Tel Aviv, noted that among the chants heard at the protest in favor of Azaria was one suggesting that the Israeli army chief of staff, Maj. Gen. Gadi Eisenkot, who defended the prosecution of the soldier in a speech this week, could suffer the same fate as Yitzhak Rabin…

Absolutely – Zionists have always murdered dissidents in their midst. Indeed, they have been committing terror since the onset of Zionism; in Mandate Palestine they targeted politically “wrong” Jews — those who didn’t want to discriminate against their Arab neighbors and steal their land — for assassination more so than any other group.

They used threats and intimation to stop parents and teachers from opposing the indoctrination of Jewish children to kill; Zionists used children to, e.g., blow up buses full of Arabs (in one case, a 12-year-old girl was sent to commit this atrocity).

Zionists have absolutely no moral standing to object to terror; Israel would not exist but for their terrorism, then and now.

Leftist Jews in Israel frequently hire heavy security — many have left to, of all places, Berlin. They simply are not safe in “The Jewish State.”

Palestinians were terrorizing Jews before Zionism.
The first Zionists arrived in Palestine in 1882. Evidence of terrorism in 1882?
Evidence that Israel would not exist but for their terrorism, then and now?