Fernando Alonso thread [merged]

And this is exactly the kind of pressure I was talking about. Everybody makes mistakes. But when Alonso makes a mistake, it's a much bigger deal. People expect him to be perfect.

He is far from perfect in my eyes and is overated what has he done since his two titles other the anger and piss off the team he is driving for and cheat. Not alot few wins here and there. Many mistakes though. Just my opinion.

He is far from perfect in my eyes and is overated what has he done since his two titles other the anger and piss off the team he is driving for and cheat. Not alot few wins here and there. Many mistakes though. Just my opinion.

Does someone have a list of who was there? I see Heidfeld, Rosberg, Petrov and Alguersuari in the back row and Trulli, Vettel, Liuzzi, Massa, Di Grassi and Fernando in the front. And is that Heinz-Harald Frentzen?

From the old F1 drivers I can see Emanuele Pirro (middle one of three guys between Liuzzi and Massa) and Ivan Capelli (between di Grassi and Alonso)

Why do a lot of experts count Alonso as the best driver under pressure in the history of F1?
There are more and more people who say, that Alonso is not, as some medias try to construe him, like Alain Prost, rather he is more a perfect symbiosis of Prosts and Sennas qualities!
What do you think guys?

"There are two people that we fear for this world title," Marko told the APA news agency. "They are Fernando Alonso, because he is at his absolute peak, and Lewis Hamilton. What the others are doing bothers us not so much."

Alonso's last victory in Monaco was in 2007, and it was the event that marked the beginning of the end of his relationship with McLaren and their former team principal Ron Dennis.

That race is remembered as one that Alonso won thanks to team orders, after McLaren told team-mate Lewis Hamilton to slow down and not challenge Alonso for the victory.

But that reading is wrong.

This has never come out before, but it was Dennis's actions after that race that so angered Alonso, and which convinced him the team would always be behind Hamilton and not him. That was the backdrop to the tumultuous fall-out that enveloped McLaren and Alonso as that famous 'spy-gate' summer unfolded.

As a McLaren insider revealed to me: "Fernando won in Monaco fair and square in 2007.

Why do a lot of experts count Alonso as the best driver under pressure in the history of F1?There are more and more people who say, that Alonso is not, as some medias try to construe him, like Alain Prost, rather he is more a perfect symbiosis of Prosts and Sennas qualities!What do you think guys?

Is Alonso overrated, or is he trully the best ever?

he's not yet, but is on his way

he looks happier, more focused and more confident than ever, he's got the talent and a team which really supports him and has blown him away, time will tell

Why do a lot of experts count Alonso as the best driver under pressure in the history of F1?There are more and more people who say, that Alonso is not, as some medias try to construe him, like Alain Prost, rather he is more a perfect symbiosis of Prosts and Sennas qualities!What do you think guys?

your attempt to devirtuate the fact by using emoticons won't affect such reality. the guy is yet 28, youngest twice wc with possibilities of becoming youngest three times wc, his stats put him 8th of all times and they guy's just started a new era inside a top team with at least 7 or 8 seasons to deliver on his hands...I sincerely think your denial makes you look really stupid

your attempt to devirtuate the fact by using emoticons won't affect such reality. the guy is yet 28, youngest twice wc with possibilities of becoming youngest three times wc, his stats put him 8th of all times and they guy's just started a new era inside a top team with at least 7 or 8 seasons to deliver on his hands...I sincerely think your denial makes you look really stupid

I think that is all a bunch of hype. RBR knows that it has to keep its eye on the current champ and even Merc. But Alonso is definitely worth the scrutiny also. I think there is definitely support for the idea that he is the best driver on the grid now if you consider performance, skill and experience (MSC would be but for his performance - and others are clearly as skilled or more, but don't have the experience.) And I am also not very bothered about the mistakes - they happen. That said, I fear he will have a poor season - first because the F10 is not all it was hyped to be and second because other cars are just that. The "what if's" are null and void because while different outcomes might have seen him in 1st place now, that is true for a number of drivers, including Hami and Button - both facing reliability issues as well as mistakes. Vettel of course had extreme reliability issues that set him back - and Rosberg might well have done a heck of a lot better in both Spain and Monaco if Schumi hadn't had his fingers in the pot. So I don't think that makes much difference. I am rooting against Alonso because I want Vettel to take it - and Ferrari is far from a class act in my book right now, so seeing them and their drivers do poorly works for me. But that aside, I kind of suspect Fernando would have a tough season with a poor end (for him, that is anything less than WDC mind you) mainly due to the quick RBRs and even the Maccas seem to have Ferrari by the throat right now. Even if they come along, their recent history is so marred, I would have to see it before believing that Ferrari will be able to provide Alonso with a sure fire winner ride. We'll see. Perhaps Alonso should have had Santander offer the millions to Red Bull instead - not sure buying into Ferrari was the way to go. Course I am still upset at them with the whole Kimi situation, so I am not really into any good driver wasting their worth on the red car, but from Fernando's point of view, buying into that franchise at the moment just doesn't seem all that wise - maybe in a few years...

I think that is all a bunch of hype. RBR knows that it has to keep its eye on the current champ and even Merc. But Alonso is definitely worth the scrutiny also. I think there is definitely support for the idea that he is the best driver on the grid now if you consider performance, skill and experience (MSC would be but for his performance - and others are clearly as skilled or more, but don't have the experience.) And I am also not very bothered about the mistakes - they happen. That said, I fear he will have a poor season - first because the F10 is not all it was hyped to be and second because other cars are just that. The "what if's" are null and void because while different outcomes might have seen him in 1st place now, that is true for a number of drivers, including Hami and Button - both facing reliability issues as well as mistakes. Vettel of course had extreme reliability issues that set him back - and Rosberg might well have done a heck of a lot better in both Spain and Monaco if Schumi hadn't had his fingers in the pot. So I don't think that makes much difference. I am rooting against Alonso because I want Vettel to take it - and Ferrari is far from a class act in my book right now, so seeing them and their drivers do poorly works for me. But that aside, I kind of suspect Fernando would have a tough season with a poor end (for him, that is anything less than WDC mind you) mainly due to the quick RBRs and even the Maccas seem to have Ferrari by the throat right now. Even if they come along, their recent history is so marred, I would have to see it before believing that Ferrari will be able to provide Alonso with a sure fire winner ride. We'll see. Perhaps Alonso should have had Santander offer the millions to Red Bull instead - not sure buying into Ferrari was the way to go. Course I am still upset at them with the whole Kimi situation, so I am not really into any good driver wasting their worth on the red car, but from Fernando's point of view, buying into that franchise at the moment just doesn't seem all that wise - maybe in a few years...

After the failure of his association with Mclaren in 2007 Alonso had an invitation from Honda and Red Bull but decided to return to Renault possibly already targeting a Ferrari drive. And who would have guessed that those 2 teams would have the dominant cars for 2009 and 2010?!

But he decided to stay with the classic and signed Ferrari - there are no other historical winning teams, besides his 2007 Mclaren there's Williams but definitely not a top team for the moment.

Yeah maybe he looks like that... but during interviews the drivers can always put on their happy face and come up with positive comments. You can't look into a driver's mind just watching him on the telly and reading press releases. For this reason, I can't judge whether Fernando is happy or relaxed or feeling under pressure etc... but it's a fact that he is making more (and usually big) mistakes this year than in his previous years in a top car. In 2008, he was also making mistakes but I thought it was down to him pushing that Renault over the limit and risking a lot because because the WDC wasn't at stake so the points he lost didn't matter so much. But this year, he would easily lead the championship, by quite a margin, if it hadn't been for his mistakes. A proper start in Melbourne, or in China, or an accident-free FP3 now... he has thrown away many points this year, and this did not happen in '05 and '06.

I'm not too satisfied with his performance so far, yeah he has been really fast, but he should have exploited the problems of Vettel, Hamilton and co. and he should be leading the championship now, even if the Red Bulls are faster.

On the other hand, after making a mistake, his recovery drives are very good, so it could be much worse, but he shouldn't make those mistakes in the first place.

I agree with every single word. We speak the same language, and I am happy to see someone who likes Alonso as much as you do still see him in such an objective light.I hope Fernando "recovers" in general from making these mistakes in the first place, if he does not now it will be bye bye WDC 2010...

I agree with every single word. We speak the same language, and I am happy to see someone who likes Alonso as much as you do still see him in such an objective light.I hope Fernando "recovers" in general from making these mistakes in the first place, if he does not now it will be bye bye WDC 2010...

I agree too. He has shown great speed and consistency so far, but he should have capitalized on Red Bulls and Hamilton's problems and be leading the WDC right now. Well see how it ends, but to me it looks like Red Bull is just about to start to flex their muscle.

I agree too. He has shown great speed and consistency so far, but he should have capitalized on Red Bulls and Hamilton's problems and be leading the WDC right now. Well see how it ends, but to me it looks like Red Bull is just about to start to flex their muscle.

While it is too bad that points have slipped away from Alonso, RedBull have to hate losing so many. The development race is tough to predict, and advantages can disappear overnight.

For all his troubles so far, it says a lot that Alonso is only three points back and still in the hunt.

I am happy to see someone who likes Alonso as much as you do still see him in such an objective light.

Well, I tend to be a bit more biased towards Alonso than the other drivers and I often take his side, but... I'm an F1 fan in the first place, and an Alonso fan in the second place... So I usually look at the whole picture and don't try to defend my favourite driver desperately when I know that it's not right.

But this year, he would easily lead the championship, by quite a margin, if it hadn't been for his mistakes. A proper start in Melbourne, or in China, or an accident-free FP3 now... he has thrown away many points this year, and this did not happen in '05 and '06.

I think you are watching an another season!Alonso did only one real mistake this season and that was jumping the start in China!Normally a accident in f3 (or better say a missing braking point) has not a big influence on quali or race, but this year in Monaco it had. That was more of a big pity than a big mistake of Alonso.

So in my eyes he just did one mistake, jumping the start in China, and so loosing one position from the position he started!

I cant see Alonso making more or less mistakes than in other seasons!He makes constantly very very few mistakes!

I think you are watching an another season!Alonso did only one real mistake this season and that was jumping the start in China!Normally a accident in f3 (or better say a missing braking point) has not a big influence on quali or race, but this year in Monaco it had. That was more of a big pity than a big mistake of Alonso.

So in my eyes he just did one mistake, jumping the start in China, and so loosing one position from the position he started!

I cant see Alonso making more or less mistakes than in other seasons!He makes constantly very very few mistakes!

And what about the start in Australia? He got away very slowly, and that caused the incident which sent him to the back. I think he could have won that race.

And his Monaco crash was a mistake which cost him points. The outcome of the accident was unfortunate, but it was a mistake . You shouldn't hit the wall, not even in FP3...

I'm not saying he's having a terribly mistake-filled season , but in 6 races, the number of these mistakes should have been less...

And what about the start in Australia? He got away very slowly, and that caused the incident which sent him to the back. I think he could have won that race.

His Australia start was not his mistake, he was hitted by Button!

And his Monaco crash was a mistake which cost him points. The outcome of the accident was unfortunate, but it was a mistake . You shouldn't hit the wall, not even in FP3...

A mistake in f3, or better say a missing braking point in f3, yes! normally it hasn't any influence on quali or race, but in that unfortunate situation, it costed him maybe the race win!Unfortunate, yes! A big mistake: no!

I'm not saying he's having a terribly mistake-filled season , but in 6 races, the number of these mistakes should have been less...

still there was just one real mistake in race, and that was jumping the start, and so losing just one position than the one he started from.

Why is that bias? I'm straIghtforward inthat I root for another and my unhappiness with ferrari's behavior. But all of spain and beyond know he has the support of santander. In my bank in cordoba, he's on a giant placard, that is no secret. Their sponsorship was not for massa, lol. Now it could be that ferrari was a necessary part of the deal and another constructor was a nogo, but this is not some grand mystery. I didn't mean Alonso was not talented enougvh for Ferrari, if that is how u took it. But if he had a say in it, taking his sponsor elsewhere might have been wiser. Not in terms of prestige, but for the wdc. I didn't like the way Ferrari did it, but they were not doing much for their last set of drivers either, imo.

your attempt to devirtuate the fact by using emoticons won't affect such reality. the guy is yet 28, youngest twice wc with possibilities of becoming youngest three times wc, his stats put him 8th of all times and they guy's just started a new era inside a top team with at least 7 or 8 seasons to deliver on his hands...I sincerely think your denial makes you look really stupid

I was laughing at the premise that at this point Alonso is "the best driver under pressure in the history of F1" and "a perfect symbiosis of Prost & Senna" and further "the best of all time". Better than Fangio? better than Clarke? Stewart? Lauda? Prost? Senna? Schumacher? C'mon... Fred is a fine driver but that post just such masturbatory fanboy hogwash. And this had nothing to do with what may or may not happen in the future so your post is completely off topic, and basically adds up to airy fairy wishful thinking at this point anyhow. Btw, I sincerely think your resorting to petty namecalling makes you look seriously biased & thin skinned.;)

A friendly tip: You might want to chill out a bit and not take things so personally. It will improve your foruming experience.

I agree too. He has shown great speed and consistency so far, but he should have capitalized on Red Bulls and Hamilton's problems and be leading the WDC right now. Well see how it ends, but to me it looks like Red Bull is just about to start to flex their muscle.

Why is that bias? I'm straIghtforward inthat I root for another and my unhappiness with ferrari's behavior. But all of spain and beyond know he has the support of santander. In my bank in cordoba, he's on a giant placard, that is no secret. Their sponsorship was not for massa, lol. Now it could be that ferrari was a necessary part of the deal and another constructor was a nogo, but this is not some grand mystery. I didn't mean Alonso was not talented enougvh for Ferrari, if that is how u took it. But if he had a say in it, taking his sponsor elsewhere might have been wiser. Not in terms of prestige, but for the wdc. I didn't like the way Ferrari did it, but they were not doing much for their last set of drivers either, imo.

santander follows fernando and not the other way round. fer-fer deal was done way earlier than santander decided to join ferrari,

kimi's fans attempt to justify kimi's back-door farewell by pretending to show fernando as a pay driver is just ridiculous.

santander follows fernando and not the other way round. fer-fer deal was done way earlier than santander decided to join ferrari,

kimi's fans attempt to justify kimi's back-door farewell by pretending to show fernando as a pay driver is just ridiculous.

It justifies nothing. All of Alonso's sponsors give him a leg up in his negotiations - but the other drivers have sponsors also - so don't read my posts as a knock on Alonso as if he is some second rate driver. I started off saying I felt he was likely the driver with the most talented + experience on the grid since Michael is suffering at the moment - how does that translate to his only driving because he can supply money? That doesn't even make sense to me seeing as Ferrari still has to pay its old driver anyway. Alonso is a 2x WDC for goodness sakes - fairly earned, and any luck is no more than every other WDC had along their route to success. However, none of that made the F10 any better for Alonso in terms of reliability. They are still trying to catch up with the faster cars and the car has had other problems as well. If he had an invitation to Red Bull, well in my humble opinion, he should have taken it. His sponsors would have been a plus to help in his negotiations with whoever - including Ferrari and it seems to me he could have put all he has (talent, sponsors, experience, etc.) toward a constructor fairing better right now (I only know the big one Santander, but all of them). That is all I am saying.

Did you fail to notice the part, that said the accident was a direct result of his poor start? Ok then...

A mistake in f3, or better say a missing braking point in f3, yes! normally it hasn't any influence on quali or race, but in that unfortunate situation, it costed him maybe the race win!Unfortunate, yes! A big mistake: no!

It wasn't a big mistake? What are you smoking? In a track like Monaco, to have an accident like that when it doesn't even matter is a BIG mistake exactly for the reason that there are no run off areas, unlike other tracks. Which is exactly why they couldnt have the car ready for Qualifying. I fail to see your reasoning again...

still there was just one real mistake in race, and that was jumping the start, and so losing just one position than the one he started from.

Wrong. The mistake in Australia, Monaco, and China makes it three mistakes.

Is it so hard to accept that its now Alonso in the red car and not Kimi?

Edit:
Eventhough Alonso made a few mistakes this season, im more happy with him as a tifosi then I ever was with Massa or Raikkonen.
He reminds me so much of Schumi, right now Alonso seems to be the fastest guy out there. Kimi/Massa never showed so exciting races as Ferrari drivers like Alonso in Melbourne this year.
Ferrari and Alonso can become a real dreamteam, the car and the rules suites him and "just" needs to cut those mistakes like the jump start.

Is it so hard to accept that its now Alonso in the red car and not Kimi?

Edit:Eventhough Alonso made a few mistakes this season, im more happy with him as a tifosi then I ever was with Massa or Raikkonen.He reminds me so much of Schumi, right now Alonso seems to be the fastest guy out there. Kimi/Massa never showed so exciting races as Ferrari drivers like Alonso in Melbourne this year.Ferrari and Alonso can become a real dreamteam, the car and the rules suites him and "just" needs to cut those mistakes like the jump start.

Yep, he's made his mistakes but I think he's settling in pretty damn well. I think he's overdriving the car a bit, trying to go just a little too fast. Some great recvery drives so far, and in the long run, you know he can get the job done.

but you can't talk about these things on autosport, that's all a conspiracy conclusion of fernando's lunacy, hamilton beat him with the same equipment and treatment

Hamilton did beat him with same equipment and treatment. Remember, Hamilton lead Alonso through most of the year, after the 3rd race of the season already. This will always be a fact - ROOKIE BEAT ALONSO IN EQUAL CARS.

His Australia start was not his mistake, he was hitted by Button!A mistake in f3, or better say a missing braking point in f3, yes! normally it hasn't any influence on quali or race, but in that unfortunate situation, it costed him maybe the race win!Unfortunate, yes! A big mistake: no!

The crash with Button was 100% alonsos fault.The mistake at Monaco was indeed a bad mistake, nothing to do with fortune.

and with the little help of his friends (at Mclaren) (Nothing is more important than the psychology in sports, and if a team harm a drivers psychology, this driver is not any more at his/her best, as happened in 2007 in Mclaren)not to forget: Alonso was the Rookie in Mclaren (Ham introduced him to HIS team), and was accustomed to Michelin tyres (also RAI and KUB had a very hard time getting used to the bridgestones)

Ham had already a chance to start in 2006, replacing Montoya, but he was off the pace on the Michelins and so he did not!

Wrong. The mistake in Australia, Monaco, and China makes it three mistakes.

Sure in Australia it was his fault, the same was with the hamilton webber crash, it was hamiltons fault

The Monaco-mistake: the most unfortunate crash in history of f1, because it happened in free practise and had an effect on qualy and race. Normally a free practise is the place to make mistakes and it should not have any consequences on qualy and race, but with this years regulations it had -> pity!

so if you want we can count like that:1 mistake in race (costed him 1 place)and 1 mistake in free practise

Sure in Australia it was his fault, the same was with the hamilton webber crash, it was hamiltons fault

The Monaco-mistake: the most unfortunate crash in history of f1, because it happened in free practise and had an effect on qualy and race. Normally a free practise is the place to make mistakes and it should not have any consequences on qualy and race, but with this years regulations it had -> pity!

so if you want we can count like that:1 mistake in race (costed him 1 place)and 1 mistake in free practise

Are you trying to make Alonso fans look silly? It was a mistake, and a big one - nothing to do with luck there. There are countless more unfortunate crashes only in last few seasons (Massa dangerous accident last year comes first, Kimi's Nurb 2005. comes to mind too, Hamiltons Barcelona this year, etc.).

This was a pure driver error, nothing more nothing less. It happens in every GP, you just don't notice it since its not your precious driver making the error

in a free practise! Yes! Normally this has no (or should not have any) effect on qualy and race. In that unlucky situation it had, so it was very unfortunate!If a driver makes a mistake, normally the place to do it, is in the free practise --> the rules should be changed, that a mistake in free practise has no effect on qualy and race (exception loosing some practise time)!

in a free practise! Yes! Normally this has no (or should not have any) effect on qualy and race. In that unlucky situation it had, so it was very unfortunate!If a driver makes a mistake, normally the place to do it, is in the free practise --> the rules should be changed, that a mistake in free practise has no effect on qualy and race (exception loosing some practise time)!

Do you want drivers to have some kind of nanny who will feed them too? They are supposed to be the best in the world, for f*cks sake! Even Alonso himself accepts consequences, why shouldn't we? Only ferrari whines as always, but who cares?

because he cant change them! And not because he doesn't think that under other regulations, his mistake would not have any effect on his starting place!

Everybody accepted what happened, still it was very unlucky, and with just a little change in the regulations, he would just have missed some practise time, and not also the whole qualifying. As I said, very unfortunate.

Sure in Australia it was his fault, the same was with the hamilton webber crash, it was hamiltons fault

The Monaco-mistake: the most unfortunate crash in history of f1, because it happened in free practise and had an effect on qualy and race. Normally a free practise is the place to make mistakes and it should not have any consequences on qualy and race, but with this years regulations it had -> pity!

so if you want we can count like that:1 mistake in race (costed him 1 place)and 1 mistake in free practise

In Australia, the contact with Button was questionable but it was a result of his very poor start. He made a mistake at the start and that is why he got involved in the incident with Button.

Monaco? Most unfortunate crash ever? Come on Yeah, normally an FP3 crash shouldn't affect qualy and race, but this year there are no T-cars, so they shouldn't hit the wall during practice... You say: "a free practice is the place to make mistakes" I agree that a practise is a place to search for the limits and they usually overdrive it on other tracks, running off the track many times... but this is Monaco, and a mistake like that will result in a crash into the armco. And a crash like that can potentially damage the car so much that it cannot be repaired in a couple of hours. He knew it, and he knew there were no T-cars available, so I don't think he went out onto the track thinking "a free practise is the place to make mistakes"... He shouldn't make mistakes like that in a Saturday practise, even if the car had been repairable, he would have lost many practice time.

You should get over it and accept that he is to blame for the points he lost in Monaco, not bad luck. This doesn't make him a bad driver, not at all, Monaco is a track where everybody has crashes, Hamilton last year, Kimi in qualy a few years back... He made a pretty common mistake, it happens.

In Australia, the contact with Button was questionable but it was a result of his very poor start. He made a mistake at the start and that is why he got involved in the incident with Button.

sure, and webber hitted hamilton, because hamilton tried to overtake alonso, but he couldnt do that, so he was hit by webber Button hitted alonso because button braked to late (as webber did) and not because alonso (or hamilton) made a mistake!

You should get over it

I accept what happened, but I say that it was unfortunate, where is here the antagonism you are looking for?

because he cant change them! And not because he doesn't think that under other regulations, his mistake would not have any effect on his starting place!

Everybody accepted what happened, still it was very unlucky, and with just a little change in the regulations, he would just have missed some practise time, and not also the whole qualifying. As I said, very unfortunate.

As alonso's fan I would never say let's change the rules cause he was unlucky (and honestly I don't think he was unlucky, he just fu*ked up this turn). Looks like you want to change the rules cause ALONSO lost qualy. Yeah, i know this could happened to everyone. But who cares, this is how it looks like.

And by the way, we all want circuits which show who is THE DRIVER and who is pussy. Monaco is one of them. Why to change that?

Yeah, i know this could happened to everyone. But who cares, this is how it looks like.

because free practise should not effect, whether a driver can or cannot start in qualy and race!

And by the way, we all want circuits which show who is THE DRIVER and who is pussy. Monaco is one of them. Why to change that?

Please do not change the circuit! Just adjust the rule, that a incident in free practise does not distort the competition! Thats it!The fastest driver until the accident (he was fastest in all thursday, and the fastest till his accident) was not able to compete in qualy, becuase of an error in free practise!

You want to see who is THE DRIVER, but want the driver who tried hardest, and was the fastest, not be able to compete in qualy, becuase of an error in free practise Thats nonsense!