Ruben Amaro didn’t exactly brush it off, however, going on WIP in Philly this morning knocking Heyman’s report and saying that Heyman “is wrong a lot of times.” We’ll try to post the full interview when WIP makes it available later.

This sort of thing makes me feel all sorts of feelings. I mean, yes, ripping Jon Heyman is all kinds of fun. But it’s one thing for a sleazy little blogger boy to do it. It’s another thing for a GM to do it. Shouldn’t these sorts of reports just be chuckled off at most? More properly ignored?

And more to the point: Jon Heyman may be wrong sometimes, but I feel like he’s done his job way better than Amaro has in the past year or two. I mean, Heyman didn’t give that deal to Ryan Howard and make Delmon Young a major part of the 2013 business plan. Methinks Amaro is not in any position to go after people for their mistakes, real or imagined.

He is probably also frustrated because he just doesn’t seem to understand baseball or asset management that well.

He doesn’t seem to understand why his team isn’t very good (even though before the season started, they really looked like a .500 team), and truly believes that with a little luck and better health they will be fine.

He also doesn’t seem to understand how other organizations value players or particular skills. He also doesn’t seem to understand that teams do not pay twice for players anymore, especially players with expensive contracts or albatross contracts. They will pay in prospects or they will take on the salary, but teams aren’t paying twice anymore.

I’m sure he’s frustrated, but it is just because he isn’t very good at his job and he doesn’t understand why that is.

Not taking a stance on defending or criticizing Amaro here, but isn’t the title of this article a bit of an exaggeration? Maybe he will “snap,” but I don’t think calling a reporter wrong fits the bill.

That may or may not be true. Also who do you think from the Yankees farm system would be a good return for Young and Ruiz? I’m all for trading, but don’t do it for the sake of simply trading, at least got some kind of value.

blacksables - Aug 1, 2013 at 8:53 AM

Money saved is the first consideration. And Young, while I’m not one of those people who hate him as he is a serviceable major league who can play mulitple positions, albeit badly, is not worth a front-line prospect.

A top-level and two to three lower level prospects for the both of them would save money for the Phillies, allow younger guys to play, and possibly net a good player for the future.

Making the Yankees take the entire salaries is the first key. Use that money next year.

paperlions - Aug 1, 2013 at 9:58 AM

Will Young or Ruiz be back next year? If not, getting ANYTHING for them is better than letting them walk during the off-season…or even re-signing them, which you would do even if you traded them.

Both are FA at the end of the season, so 2014 budget is no consideration. Also the majority of the salaries have already been paid, you won’t save much and money saved here doesn’t really carry over into next year since teams operate on a budget, more than likely ownership simply pockets whatever is saved. It’s not like moving Papelbon or Cliff Lee who hae multi-year deals. Remember that the Rangers are already paying the majority of Young’s salary.

I don’t think ownership will say: “Since Ruben saved 3 Million at the deadline, let’s increase next year’s budget by 3 Million”. I think the process of determining what’s the budget for 2014 is independent of whatever happens this year. So unless you’re moving a multi-year contract Money isn’t really a consideration (since it was already budgeted for). The only instance would be to move under the Luxury Tax. But they’re already under it.

As for allowing younger players to play, that can be accomplished independently of trading. You can move Ruiz as a backup catcher if you want to try someone new, though as far as I can tell no catching prospect is currently ready. Cody Asche was called up and from what I gather while Michael Young has no home he can be moved to 1B or given more time off while easing Asche into the lineup by starting against right-handers.

So the only real reason to do a trade is to get value in prospects. I was actually serious and curious regarding the question. Which prospects from the Yankees might be worth a trade? Unless you think you can get someone who has a chance of helping the team down the line, all you’re doing is adding AA or AAA filler.

If not, getting ANYTHING for them is better than letting them walk during the off-season

Not if it’s subtraction by addition. What do you think of Tommy Kahne.

paperlions - Aug 1, 2013 at 10:25 AM

In this case there is no subtraction. 2013 is shot. Nothing that Young or Ruiz do the rest of the year has value to Philly as an organization, it won’t help them win this year or in the future. If you get a middle prospect that turns out to be a useful bench player or middle reliever…that is far better than the giant pile of nothing you’ll have otherwise.

Two things: both can still be dealt by the end of August. I doubt they will have issues clearing waivers. Second: I asked about Tommy Kahnle, because THAT’s the prospect that was offered. If you add Kahnle you need to drop someone else or demote someone else in the organization’s AA affiliate.

From what I’ve seen players like Kahnle are a dime a dozen, he has a 6.00 BB/9. I believe the Phillies have plenty of minor leaguers that know how to walk batters.

THAT’s subtraction by addition.

paperlions - Aug 1, 2013 at 10:50 AM

…but now, each can ONLY be dealt to the team that claims them on waivers. No way either go totally unclaimed, and the teams that claim them may have zero interest in a trade, may just want to block a trade to another team.

You honestly think contending teams would try to block Ruiz or Young from going to an opposing team? What if at that point in time Ruben decides to simply let them assume the contract. Would you, as a blocking team… want to take that risk? Let’s be realistic.

paperlions - Aug 1, 2013 at 11:19 AM

There is almost no risk. They would be taking on about 1.5 months of salary for contracts that are not very big. So what? Although I am not a huge fan of either player at this point, there are plenty of teams that could use either guy on their benches….and each will only cost a few buck (within a baseball management context).

Agreed. You never know how a player will turn out. It makes no logical sense to keep a player and let him walk, and get nothing for him if you had an offer. The Phillies can easily drop a bench player off of the A/AA/AAA teams to make room for a player they want to give a chance to.

tfbuckfutter - Aug 1, 2013 at 8:34 AM

Aside from finding their fan base irritating and fun to wind up, I really don’t care about the Phillies one way or another.

So I’m not sure why I am going to enjoy the public meltdown that is coming for Amaro.

Tomorrow I leave the frozen tundra of Canuckistan to go to Philly to see RAJ’s boys do something (hopefully play ball, but you never know with these guys). I’ve packed batteries and vomit proofs. I’ve endured a daily shock treatment to prepare me for the tasing I’m sure to get if/when I spill my drink(s). One of the many things I’ll be sure and do is take a long deep breath of Citizen Bank Field air: smelling for the rot. If RAJ really has put a suboptimal product on the field the smell test will reveal all. Its the characteristic odour of dead mullet, left in the sun for too long. I shall have a full report on my return. It’ll be at least as good as anything Heyman could have done. I at least went to the games and saw the product, smelled the air, threw the batteries. When was the last time Heyman threw a battery, eh?

Very perspicacious of you, FC. The company has VERY much to do with it. I shall be hanging around with the no less than the August and Noble Jonny5, Philly SuperPhan, as my Native Guide. He speaks the local vernacular with ease, knows when to duck, if AA or AAA is appropriate (this I think is judged like knowing which fork to use at a given part of a fancy meal) and who’s about to vomit. I’m just there to learn.

Well Rik, You will be eating so many Schmitters that you will have no sense of smell or be able to see straight. I plan on bringing you guys from out of town a Jersey treat Saturday morning. A Pork roll egg and cheese on a kaiser roll from Dad’s deli. I bet you can’t eat eat a whole one. BTW, wear your femme French Canadian beach speedos to the game (Canadians are so weird), they make a good slingshot for the Batteries.

C’mon man, we’re gonna hang on a handful of things when rumors are Bill the Butcher and his group run things at that stadium north of the border?

Do me a favor, go and visit the other finer points of the cradle of liberty, see where Washington crossed the Delaware as the famous painting depicts, see where the American forefathers did their work, check out the Franklin Institute where you can walk through a simulated human heart, and run the Art Museum steps an do a Rocky impression. Then go in and enjoy the beauty within, including the armory. Enjoy all the positive goodness that this area has to offer.

If after that, if you still feel like trolling, go back to Canada, and go to bed with the Elk and bearded women and such.

Enjoy the trip, sounds like you’ll have good locals to show you the ropes. Just keep this in mind: 9th street between Washington and Christian. You should definitely at least do a fly by. and stop in a few places.

historiophiliac - Aug 1, 2013 at 10:03 AM

Please, cur, avoid the ancestor-worship. Oooh, but you could hit the Eastern State Penitentiary. That would be cool.

heyblueyoustink - Aug 1, 2013 at 10:30 AM

Wow, ancestor worship? Someone’s been inhaling too much red clay this morning. Those buildings are cool no matter who you are. Just my opinion. They were the stage to some pretty historical events.

Then again, you’d probably skip stonehenge too.

Not that there’s anything wonrg with Eastern State, but they do their best work closer to Halloween.

And ” 9th street between Washington and Christian” has more to do with pleasing the taste buds.

This Moose stuff reminds me of an old English Language conundrum. Goose is the singular, but Geese is the plural. Moose is the singular, but the plural isn’t Meese? Such inconsistency! Also it seems Elk and Moose are synonyms?

cur68 - Aug 1, 2013 at 9:03 AM

In all seriousness, I just want to see the Braves and Phillies play baseball live in front of me. Contrary to the opinion of some of the bloggers who shall remain nameless, Craig, I’m taking my glove, too. So there.

You can’t spell. Its “blubber” and everyone wants blubber. Can’t get good seal blubber down south. Y’all persist in deep frying it. Yuck.

The Rabbit - Aug 1, 2013 at 4:32 PM

Cur, you sexist pig….all the arrangements for this trip were done by? not Jon…who I think is the bomb, but is just along for the beer, the games, and the other stuff.
Now, I will taking you, Jon, and Indaburg for scrapple. You will eat it and like it.

cur68 - Aug 1, 2013 at 4:56 PM

Mea Culpa. I blame the rancid seal blubber and maple syrup. A man can do rash and foolish things on that stuff. Anyhow, Rabbit, Jon’s the local. He’s doing translation services for us. Excuse me: PHOR us. Otherwise we’ll be at the mercy oph the locals. I’ll see y’all tomorrow. I’ll make it up to you in alcohol and my impression of Sean Connery quoting Gollum. You’ll plotz.

historiophiliac - Aug 1, 2013 at 9:58 AM

Wait, coming to America and going to a Phillies game of all places???? This must be a blubber-smuggling operation, right?

He heard the mini Phillies Louisville slugger souvenir bats are made from the finest ash in the world (go figure). They make the perfect baby seal clubbing tool. The darned Blue Jays bats are Maple (go figure) and they just shatter all over the place. If only they made some sort of protective shield to stop that from happening…….?? Anyway, he comes here for the superior clubbing device.

historiophiliac - Aug 1, 2013 at 1:07 PM

How have we not had an ash v. maple debate on here yet this year?

cur68 - Aug 1, 2013 at 4:58 PM

Shhhhh! If the border people find out they might launch an invasion and we don’t wanna have to repeat that business from 1812, now do we?

So your saying that Heyman is above lying or exaggerating the truth. These reporters are exactly like you it’s their job to start controversy so that us followers of this garbage get to respond and make ourselves feel super intelligent about our teams or their opponents. What makes you feel Heyman has done his job better than Amaro has done his. I feel Heyman has reported more false rumors and untruths, than any other analyst in the game. He seems to work under the concept that if you throw enough s#%t against the wall some of it will stick

blacksables says “Money saved is the first consideration. And Young, while I’m not one of those people who hate him as he is a serviceable major league who can play mulitple positions, albeit badly, is not worth a front-line prospect.

A top-level and two to three lower level prospects for the both of them would save money for the Phillies, allow younger guys to play, and possibly net a good player for the future.

Making the Yankees take the entire salaries is the first key. Use that money next year.”

A couple problems with this.

First, Ruiz’s and Young’s contracts run out after this season, so dumping them has no effect on what they can spend next year. The Phillies don’t owe either much for the rest of the season and the Phillies aren’t in financial trouble, so there really is no financial aspect.

Second, there is no little chance the Yankees or anyone else was offering a top-level and two to three lower level prospects for Ruiz and Young. If they had, the Phillies management would have driven those guys to Yankee Stadium themselves. It’s clear no one was offering anything of value for Young because he’s still with the team. The Phillies wanted to move him and there is just no reason for the Phillies to keep him around. Young also kind of screwed the Phillies and hurt his trade value by asserting his no trade rights (no criticism of Young – he is perfectly in the right to do so), which limited the Phillies leverage. As for Ruiz, his value has fallen off the cliff since his post-Adderall suspension performance. It also doesn’t help matters that he’s been banged up the past couple of years with various injuries. I wasn’t expecting much out of a deal for either guy.

I can’t imagine that the Phillies wouldn’t have pulled the trigger if they had gotten a decent offer for Young and Ruiz. But the Yankees are still on the outside looking in and have this A-Rod thing hanging over them. I’m sure they were being more conservative than usual.

Also, there was really was no urgency for the Phillies to deal either guy at the trade deadline – both more than likely will clear waivers such that they can still be dealt. In fact, I think the odds are still very good that Young will be traded by the end of August. Ruiz, maybe less so, largely because the Phillies are so barren at catcher and they may want to try to work something out for him to return next year.

The real disappointment for me as a Phillies fan was that they couldn’t dump Papelbon’s salary. They held on to this season too long and Papelbon’s recent performance killed any chance they had to deal him. If they had been able to combine dumping Papelbon’s salary with the increase in the luxury tax thresh-hold next year and having Halladay’s and Ruiz’s deals expiring, they would have had some flexibility to take a run at McCann and maybe an outfielder like Choo, which would have been a major boost to their lineup, and still have some money to add a decent 5th starter behind Lee, Hamels, Gonzalez, and Kendrick, or stick with one of their young guys and use money to help the bullpen and bench.

And sure, I would have loved for them to be able to deal Lee, Rollins, and Utley and get back an awesome haul of prospects to help set them up for the future, but it’s clear that (1) teams weren’t ponying up for Lee given his massive deal, (2) Rollins wasn’t going to agree to be traded, and (3) the top of the organization has made a decision to keep Utley as a Phillie for life.

So much of the Phillies’ fans hysteria toward Amaro for the trade deadline silence is a bit overblown. The real Amaro problem was his hamstringing the organization with the Howard extension (which was also probably a Phillies ownership decision) and the absurd deals given to Papelbon and Adams, as well as the unnecessary deal for Pence, which not only cost them good, young talent, but likely led them to pass on Cespedes, who was exactly the type of player the Phillies needed then and for the future.

“But it’s one thing for a sleazy little blogger boy to do it. It’s another thing for a GM to do it. Shouldn’t these sorts of reports just be chuckled off at most? More properly ignored?”

So what’s with the comment section, blogger boy? If Ruben Amaro, who is involved in baseball, is supposed to ignore professional baseball writers, why are we supposed to give an eff what a blogger boy writes, much less respond? Or perhaps its fun to disagree with people who know less about baseball than the blogger boys, and you don’t want people who know more about it (say Ruben Amaro) to actively let you know you’re full of it.

So it’s ok for you,the scumbag media to rag on a GM and say how many dumb things he did etc etc but a GM can’t defend himself or give you guys a taste of your own medicine…as the old saying goes…if you can’t take it then don’t dish it