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Topic: Wiring for a direct insert cable (Read 3758 times)

I have pre-made TRS > XLR F short (6" dongle) cables that I'd like to use on soundboards with limited outputs (and in one case a board in which the operator as of yet hasn't figured out how to send me a stereo out buss). So I'd like to use them on insert jacks used for effects. There are multiple old threads, and I'm looking for some clarity. I don't want to do the insert-halfway method for multiple reasons. I asked a fellow board member who had weighed in previously on this. He told me:

"Insert cables send out of the board on the tip of a TRS connector. The return comes back to the board on the ring with ground on the sleeve."

Ok, that seems clear.

"Take a TRS to MXLR cable and short the tip and ring together with a small jumper. You can also do this at the xlr end by shorting line 2 and 3. Now your 1/4 send and returns the insert signal while splitting the signal to the FXLR."

The question: Instead of shorting tip and ring on the TRS, can I accomplish the same thing by soldering a jumper to XLR pins 2 and 3? The TRS is encased in molded plastic and for ease of modification, it would be much easier to disassemble the XLR and modify that. Would that arrangement result in a cable that would allow me to receive/send? I also realize this would now be unbalanced, correct? Any implications other than keeping the cable as short as possible? It would be going into a pro deck.

Seems like the manual for Mackie mixers goes into some detail about recording from the direct outs. As I recall, they recommend inserting one click and that's what I've done with some reservations about someone yanking them out by accident.

Mike Rivers - who authored some of the Mackie manuals, and also published a "Mackie Compact Mixer Reference Guide" - has elaborated on this "best way to insert" topic, on various occasions in r.a.p. newsgroup threads.

For instance, here's his explanation from a thread of 2006:====================

mcmillan@engineous.com wrote:

> The mixer has no per-channel line-level outputs except for the INSERT> jacks. But plugging a 1/4 mono (e.g. unbalanced) plug into the INSERT> jack cuts out the signal. If I partially insert the mono 1/4 plug into> the INSERT jack I can get both a signal to the recorder and the signal> through the board. But that is an awful setup - any slight bump of the> plugs and we either lose the recorder signal or the live signal. Ugh.

It indeed looks suspicious, but you'd be surprised at how many peoplework this way without a problem. You just have to be careful. However .. .

> Any sugggestions on how to configure this? Will a 1/4 inch> stere-to-mono adapter do the trick? I assume it just needs to short> the right/left channels of the stereo plug to prevent the board from> losing the signal?

That's exactly what you need to do, however, sticking a stereo-to-monoadapter on to the plug adds another couple of inches of lever to what'sstraining the jack. If you don't properly support support the cable totake the weight off the jack, you'll have a jack failure sooner thanlater

What you really need to do (you can't buy this off the shelf) is buildsome cables that have a TS plug on one end and a TRS plug with the tipand ring terminals connected together on the other end. Buy half asmany 1/4" TS cables as you need, but twice as long as you need. Get asmany TRS plugs as you need. Cut the cables in half and solder the TRSplugs on to the cut ends.==========

After I encountered my first intermittent signal failure, I stopped using the half-insert method for all critical recordings [<= but aren't they all? :-) ]

Seems like the manual for Mackie mixers goes into some detail about recording from the direct outs. As I recall, they recommend inserting one click and that's what I've done with some reservations about someone yanking them out by accident.

Seems like the manual for Mackie mixers goes into some detail about recording from the direct outs. As I recall, they recommend inserting one click and that's what I've done with some reservations about someone yanking them out by accident.