cylon wrote:As you know know my fellow friends you've heard that the Malian Army has succeeded in taking power from the main government and it looks like their cry for better weapons needs to be heard. We already have our foregin minister there wentangula and it look like that is a good thing for us because he can bring an end to the coup and return the government back to civilian hands because the international commuinty is distancing itself from the crisis.

@Cylon, i also think this a good window of opportunity for Mr Wetangula to enhance his diplomatic credentials in the international sphere. He should stop facebooking and grab these five minutes of fame with Zeal. First he has the advantage of being an outsider therefore will not be seen as taking sides and secondly Kenya as a country has been involved in peace making efforts in a lot of countries therefore its an open door for him to bring the warring parties together.These boys need to know that better armament will need to be imported from the international community and i am not sure that their removal of a democratically elected government ups the chances in the formers face.

Couldn't have said it better, We are known for peace keeping missions all over Africa and our last mission in the western side of Africa was in sierra Leone even though we lost a few good men to an incompetent Indian colonel or general we were able to secure sierra Leone with a democracy type state. Now in Mali we have the golden hour where there is a ton of confusion the civilians are worried and are fleeing to the borders the police doesn't know what to do, the army is stunted and cant even mobilize a single soldier to reclaim the city, government officials left from right are fleeing like animals and in all of this confusion we can help and end this situation in a matter of days the USA/NATO caused this problem(BLOW BACK) and i read in the news that Wetagula refused to board a plane from the UN that was brought to save him and he gave his seat to one of several Kenyans left in the country, he must know he can do something to help.

Well if you read all of that then you can disregard it we have missed the golden hour. But im happy the minister is safe and coming back home

The minister is finally home and dry but he did not take cue from us and engage the malians, hence he is now no longer the foreign minister. Kazi sio facebook peke yake haapana!![/quote]

I was Reading today's news and the reason of the coup was to control Mali's gold fields. I agee with you there sierra. Now things in the upcoming months will get out of control as foregin backed malian army tries to regain power these rebels are pretty weak they are so disorganized and the celebration of sucess hasnt kicked in yet.

kimiti wrote:Forgive me for my ignorance people, I never thought seriously about finding oil in Kenya so I never asked the important questions till now. 1 ) The company that does the exploration, do they have rights to the oil or are they paid for their services and they leave? 2) What are the Manenos that M7 is bringing up in Ug on Oil? 3) What is the role of Tullow in the future exploitation of the reserves? 4) Who is most likely to drill the oil?

on top of all that, since the cost of oil consists of more than half of it being transportation, I am looking forward to more than halving the price. And also the death of the cartels.

A kenya company will likely be given the tender to extract the oil, Tullow was only the expolration team and will be paid for there great work. Tullow will also be given another tender to explore eastern province, Thats why they were trying to expand momabsa refineries to be an export point for petroluem based fuels in kenya and beyond.

mJESHI mMOJA wrote:Military air space gentlemen ..Geo-politic affairs should be directed to the current affairs page..tafadhalini

The vibrancy of this page and freedom to discuss all issues affecting our economy here is part of the reason this thread remains the most interesting and and the forum continues to grow. I think we should be free to discuss these issues here as they impact our military and defense organization. Any attempt to curtail that is a put off.

mJESHI mMOJA wrote:Military air space gentlemen ..Geo-politic affairs should be directed to the current affairs page..tafadhalini

The vibrancy of this page and freedom to discuss all issues affecting our economy here is part of the reason this thread remains the most interesting and and the forum continues to grow. I think we should be free to discuss these issues here as they impact our military and defense organization. Any attempt to curtail that is a put off.

Very contentious differentiation, Mekatilili- ''issues as they impact on our Military and Defense''. But tis not a Forum for Kenya,but Kenya Military. Conditionally, I reckon Mjeshi puts it right. Ama? Self regulation,no?

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olenkareiif i may ask does the kacheliba military observation base still exist? i know it was put up partly to protect that part of kenya in mid 1980s when the mighty turkwel gorge dam project was being constructed. i remember it was on a hilly ground overlooking the valley that river swam passed thru from Uganda.

countersniper wrote:olenkareiif i may ask does the kacheliba military observation base still exist? i know it was put up partly to protect that part of kenya in mid 1980s when the mighty turkwel gorge dam project was being constructed. i remember it was on a hilly ground overlooking the valley that river swam passed thru from Uganda.

This is an open site, bro. I am certain you know, as well as I do, that I cannot respond to that query, in that manner. Tafadhali.

mJESHI mMOJA wrote:Military air space gentlemen ..Geo-politic affairs should be directed to the current affairs page..tafadhalini

The vibrancy of this page and freedom to discuss all issues affecting our economy here is part of the reason this thread remains the most interesting and and the forum continues to grow. I think we should be free to discuss these issues here as they impact our military and defense organization. Any attempt to curtail that is a put off.

Very contentious differentiation, Mekatilili- ''issues as they impact on our Military and Defense''. But tis not a Forum for Kenya,but Kenya Military. Conditionally, I reckon Mjeshi puts it right. Ama? Self regulation,no?

Well it is good news that oil was found in the NW.But here is a question for everyone - is this a good thing or a bad thing.For me the discovery of black gold always seems to attract Sammy really quick (Cylons hilarious video if very close to the truth). Is it not preferable that KE controls all the routes for the oil out of SS and UG or is it preferable for us to have our own? Something to ponder.....

Also on another note the talk for subs for the KN - sorry to say this but this is not a realistic idea - Kenya doesn't have an offensive military doctrine. Its aim has always been to protect the country not to instigate conflict. A sub is in every which way an offensive weapon. It is the only combat system I can think of that doesn't add to the defensive capability of a country- with the caveat that we are not including nuke subs - where the defence lies in the deterrence its offensive capability posses.

Money would be better spent on upgrading the green water capabilities of the arm since most conflicts in this area are primarily littoral in nature.

Ned Starks Head wrote:Well it is good news that oil was found in the NW.But here is a question for everyone - is this a good thing or a bad thing.For me the discovery of black gold always seems to attract Sammy really quick (Cylons hilarious video if very close to the truth). Is it not preferable that KE controls all the routes for the oil out of SS and UG or is it preferable for us to have our own? Something to ponder.....

Also on another note the talk for subs for the KN - sorry to say this but this is not a realistic idea - Kenya doesn't have an offensive military doctrine. Its aim has always been to protect the country not to instigate conflict. A sub is in every which way an offensive weapon. It is the only combat system I can think of that doesn't add to the defensive capability of a country- with the caveat that we are not including nuke subs - where the defence lies in the deterrence its offensive capability posses.

Money would be better spent on upgrading the green water capabilities of the arm since most conflicts in this area are primarily littoral in nature.

The oil discovery is a good thing for kenya because it will compliment our already booming tourist markets, horticulture, and cargo transportation and we will set an example to all of africa on how to handle the black gold. This has been a plan in the making ever since kenya experinced the 1970s or 80's oil embargo that the Arabs had put in place made moi wake up and begin oil exploration in kenya his finds were quite spectaculiar but he silenced all reports of the discovery because he knew kenya wasn't ready for that kind of wealth and we had to secure our borders, then formulate a plan to transport the oil which is lamu port and him and his ministers took an oath of secrecy not to reveal the finds till the time is right and that time is now we have pacified Somalia removing the "SHIFTA ELEMENT" EAC is back and kenya military has finally awoken put down internal or external aggressions. We can handle this black gold but what i worry about is the corrupt officials buying up land like fruitflies hatching on a pineapple.

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@Ned Starks Head, I just cannot agree more – you know, the young lad Cylon wrote an exact similar opinion on this a while ago!!. A sub is a ugly gauntlet one throws at one’s neighbor face– it is not a defensive tool.

Allow me to redirect discussions in light of the public Hydrocarbons' acknowledgement by the Old Man tonight. Certainly now, the greater picture must be emerging even to the skeptics on this Forum - a very wide Oilproducing Eastern African that must find convergence in itself to avoid military conflict that has exponentially grown in capacity and probability. But does anyone now notice the clear divergence of Strategy about Kenyana between Sammy and Johnny + cousins? Can Johnny's recent frantic fraying about on Somalia now be contextualised? Or Sammy's Caramba garrison? Johnny has recently supplied Meles with a good number of APCs and Infantry Assault weapons - wtf now? Don't be shy with your views, fellas, lets us share, tafadhali!!

ole Nkarei wrote:@Ned Starks Head, I just cannot agree more – you know, the young lad Cylon wrote an exact similar opinion on this a while ago!!. A sub is a ugly gauntlet one throws at one’s neighbor face– it is not a defensive tool.

Allow me to redirect discussions in light of the public Hydrocarbons' acknowledgement by the Old Man tonight. Certainly now, the greater picture must be emerging even to the skeptics on this Forum - a very wide Oilproducing Eastern African that must find convergence in itself to avoid military conflict that has exponentially grown in capacity and probability. But does anyone now notice the clear divergence of Strategy about Kenyana between Sammy and Johnny + cousins? Can Johnny's recent frantic fraying about on Somalia now be contextualised? Or Sammy's Caramba garrison? Johnny has recently supplied Meles with a good number of APCs and Infantry Assault weapons - wtf now? Don't be shy with your views, fellas, lets us share, tafadhali!!

Pleasure to provide some insight our navy is still the weakest front we have but for now we have no naval borne threat unless if its small gun totting idiots which a number of our naval vessels can handle. The Apcs are just a conciliatory prize for Ethiopia for entering Somalia and scaring the AS and helping johnny set up his Somalia siphoning scheme i bet there is more tech on the way. And also KDF will be getting a boost also in that department thanks to the recent strike.

ole Nkarei wrote:These three questions should make every Kenyan deeply worried about today’s announcement and Sammy’s response to it.

I somehow suspect the US is already in on this? which companies were/are prospecting for the oil. I believe 35 x upgraded F-15s don't come without a lot of American trust and "friendship" ... ... I could be wrong.

mJESHI mMOJA wrote:Military air space gentlemen ..Geo-politic affairs should be directed to the current affairs page..tafadhalini

Not very easy to differentiate the two. In my eyes the oil find and the Ke military are joined in the hip. I posted the image of the Ngamia site there because I found it after I had already posted the earlier one on the news about oil being found in Turkana. I believe if they were together it would not have looked misplaced.

On the other hand, I believe self regulation is the best. We all know(been here for a few months) that this is Ke Mil page/site and so I do my best to keep it that. Feeling as if someone is on the look out to point out where you have gone wrong is counterproductive.

ole Nkarei wrote:These three questions should make every Kenyan deeply worried about today’s announcement and Sammy’s response to it.

I somehow suspect the US is already in on this? which companies were/are prospecting for the oil. I believe 35 x upgraded F-15s don't come without a lot of American trust and "friendship" ... ... I could be wrong.

Actually I meant ''Johnny'' and not 'Sammy'. It has been a pretty tough 4 months, and I am kinda wearing out.But, yes Sammy has been on this, making more demands than we can / should give him - and making eyes at the neighbouring girl when we balk kidogo. It makes every sense to stage diplomatically and commercially from Nairobi where it is expected the Petrodollar Industry will converge along the entire eastern seaboard from Puntland to Ruvuma.

ole Nkarei wrote:Allow me to redirect discussions in light of the public Hydrocarbons' acknowledgement by the Old Man tonight. Certainly now, the greater picture must be emerging even to the skeptics on this Forum - a very wide Oilproducing Eastern African that must find convergence in itself to avoid military conflict that has exponentially grown in capacity and probability. But does anyone now notice the clear divergence of Strategy about Kenyana between Sammy and Johnny + cousins? Can Johnny's recent frantic fraying about on Somalia now be contextualised? Or Sammy's Caramba garrison? Johnny has recently supplied Meles with a good number of APCs and Infantry Assault weapons - wtf now? Don't be shy with your views, fellas, lets us share, tafadhali!!

I would like to congratulate all my Kenyan brothers (and sisters) on this site for that important discovery. The discovery of oil is like a second announcement of of independence - no truly independent country would like its affairs to be determined by events thousands of miles away, such is the importance of oil.

This region is going to grow by leaps and bounds in importance to the world, believe you me. That means competition for our attention, more investment and more prosperity.

When all the exploration is done (Uganda intends to explore for oil in the Karamoja region next to Turkana, as well as potential oil discoveries offshore Kenya and in Ethiopia), East Africa and GoSS could be producing well over 2m bopd in five years.

However, beware of the oil companies. Like the missionaries came followed by armed men in the 1880s, oil companies come with the interests of their countries. One important piece of advice - NEVER ALLOW PRODUCTION SHARING AGREEMENTS THAT PROVIDE FOR DISPUTES BETWEEN GoK AND OIL COMPANIES TO BE ARBITRATED IN WESTERN CAPITALS. If you have that right, everything will be ok, we made that mistake, don't do the same.

Yes, there is oil. Not only in Turkana, but the wider region.But this is not the News we've been waiting for. It's an old story. So don't pop the cork just yet.Weatherford confirms that there are only traces. What else, at 1 km?Tullow's statements are very cautious.GoK talks about "a long journey" which "typically takes in excess of three years." My 10 bob says much longer than that.There are some very hot issues that are getting too much attention. A diversion is needed.I'm taking bets.

Sorry for the cold shower.

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mekatilili wrote:The vibrancy of this page and freedom to discuss all issues affecting our economy here is part of the reason this thread remains the most interesting and and the forum continues to grow. I think we should be free to discuss these issues here as they impact our military and defense organization. Any attempt to curtail that is a put off.

Agreed. In any case, we cannot extricate Defence from an (alleged) Oil Find.

Vitruvian wrote:Yes, there is oil. Not only in Turkana, but the wider region.But this is not the News we've been waiting for. It's an old story. So don't pop the cork just yet.Waterford confirms that there are only traces. What else, at 1 km?Tullow's statements are very cautious.GoK talks about "a long journey" which "typically takes in excess of three years." My 10 bob says much longer than that.There are some very hot issues that are getting too much attention. A diversion is needed.I'm taking bets.

According to this writer in the daily monitor, oil discovery in Kenya renders the Ugandan find not viable or good for investors because Kenya already has a developed infrastructure like pipelines and functioning refinery plus other oil based services to make the Ugandan option nonviable.my god we need those eagles E 15 yesterday before kibaki made this announcement.

Analyst was busy writing about another oil find for Kenya in his usual guise at SN..but the ngamia find has pulled the rug under his feet lets see what he says when he resurfaces.can you imagine how his credibility would've been enhanced had he talked about ngamia before kibakitalked it out ?i have tried posting that link but some clever brat has put controls on it..so the link becomes invalid.but you can read it at SN.

Last edited by countersniper on Tue Mar 27 2012, 04:33; edited 2 times in total (Reason for editing : needed links faulting.)

Quite expected but real sad news!!! Since SS independence, the World saw this coming. After Jan oil dispute, it became quite evident that GOS would attack;someday. http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-africa-17515209.

The question what has been the World doing to stop this senseless loss of lives from taking place?

For anyone with know how on the oil manenos. how does an oil well in excess of 20m i.e (65ft) in depth translate in possible oil reserves in barrels assuming mapping gives a positive find. You can case ua explanation on any other oil wells found else where. #pardon me it aint militaristic.EAC has always vowed to stand by SS, how will these play out? @Spartan, was the alleged military mobilisation in Uganda motivated by this unfolding events in the 'sudans'? Ofcourse i dont expect an affirmative answer.

Cyclon.....i was pretty sure you would poke me if not Spartan....heheh!!

But i will certainly comment on the issue....an my take is quite subtle.

Oil Discovery in Kenya and the Military Capacity Angle.

'We must further build our armies to greater capability. Oil remains a panacea of subversion, ethnic and political conflict, besides a horde of problems particularly militancy.

With Kenya's geopolitical largese, huge economy, a great army, and a hub for peace and conflict resolution....the ethno-economic instability on Turkana and neighboring areas will be a thorn in the flesh.

Cattle rustling, a major problem might be used by either Sam or John,or even Uganda, to stymie the building of oil rigs and any activity that will consummate the drilling and transport of the crude to Mombasa.

Intelligence shows that the oil deposits in Kenya might be large than that found in Uganda, besides its similar to Libyan oil, which is of very high quality.

Kenya has the resources and infrastructure to pipe and refine the crude the moment the first barrel is brought to the surface, meaning we will beat anyone in the region to realize economic gains of the oil.

Kenya's political weakness must be preempted quickly and have a democracy model like Ghana's if at all we need to achieve any economic gains.

Sammy and Johnny are now more than worried for many good reasons of their own and if China offers better concessions, we might see plenty of renewed cattle rustling and even ethnic conflicts in Rift and Northern areas of Kenya.

Literary, our intelligence gathering and defense should be very ready for eventualities since oil is such a bloody curse if not protected.....

livefire wrote:For anyone with know how on the oil manenos. how does an oil well in excess of 20m i.e (65ft) in depth translate in possible oil reserves in barrels assuming mapping gives a positive find. You can case ua explanation on any other oil wells found else where. #pardon me it aint militaristic.EAC has always vowed to stand by SS, how will these play out? @Spartan, was the alleged military mobilisation in Uganda motivated by this unfolding events in the 'sudans'? Ofcourse i dont expect an affirmative answer.

You can have oil wells that are quite shallow. An example is the canadian oil sands that are at the surface or slightly sub-surface. For the Ngamia 1 well, there was 20M of oil pay at depths beyond 880M. this alone is not enough to map out the extents of the field. However, the same blok 10BB has been explored before by Shell (Loperot-1 well was drilled in the southern portion of the block in the Lodwar South sub-basin. The well found a total of 13 m net pay in thin, shallow landstone layers of the Auwerwer formation)and the well they drilled some time ago (Loperot-1)hit oil of 29API density. this plus seismic surveys already cariied out on the block may give an indication of size of reserve.

Analyst was busy writing about another oil find for Kenya in his usual guise at SN..but the ngamia find has pulled the rug under his feet lets see what he says when he resurfaces.can you imagine how his credibility would've been enhanced had he talked about ngamia before kibakitalked it out ?i have tried posting that link but some clever brat has put controls on it..so the link becomes invalid.but you can read it at SN.

You great lot....One day i will admit aloud that SIN is me.....Kenya is excited about the oil but am not sure they should....they should be worried its such a great resource full of incredible curse..