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Royal baby puts cost of giving birth in U.S. to shame

Most developed countries provide deeply subsidized, flat-fee maternity care to give each newborn the healthiest start possible, but the cost of prenatal care and delivery in the U.S. is the highest in the world — and billed to the patient item by item, leaving some women to choose during labor whether to spend hundreds or thousands of dollars on an epidural.
"British royal born in fanciest ward: $15,000. Average US birth: billed $30,000; paid $18,000. What's wrong here?" Elisabeth Rosenthal of the New York Times tweeted this week.
The historic Lindo Wing of St. Mary's Hospital, where the Duchess of Cambridge delivered her son ... (full story)

If it was not so expensive here we would have more kids for sure. The thing that gets me is that when i drive past the welfare place in Las Vegas there are so many people down there and every person is armed with two to three kids each. Only people that can afford to have kids in the USA it seems are those on medicaid. Its a shame since those kids are then dragged up with poor education, poor support and standards. They then have their own kids that they cant afford and the cycle continues.

There are too many people on earth that make no contribution to progress in any way and by just consuming they are the killers of mother earth. It's time that every couple be restricted to only two kids.

There are too many people on earth that make no contribution to progress in any way and by just consuming they are the killers of mother earth. It's time that every couple be restricted to only two kids.

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Then I restrict you to one meal a day since we have so many on this earth starving! When it gets down to the nitty gritty, the few - although growing - are dependent upon everyone else but themselves for their daily needs.

People use to come to America for a better life. To strive to become great. Now it's littered with bums that suck up the resources because they are too fecking useless to contribute.

Yes, personally (this may ruffle feathers, at least those that are poorer) think this wouldn't happen if the government didn't hold the bill, and a lot of it comes from the various minority cultures and the lack of education. By no means do I exclude whites, but it's not uncommon for black and hispanic families having four, five, plus kids without the means to support them.

However, regardless of ethnicity, the more educated think about finances, the impacts of kids, this and that. There has been a trend in the US that couples have kids a lot later...

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A way to distroy a nation is to cut the access to education and proffessional services. We see that, contrary to the nature, everything in USA is business: education is business first; healthcare is business first. It looks that the cheapest thing in USA is to die. At least it is a single payment; My daughter spent 2 hrs at El Camino -Los Gatos medical group, sent there by her physician to get some blood test faster(she had to return to the University). The first bill was $22k, the second $16K and I had to pay my copayment almost 2K. Poor rich country!. The slavery did not disapeared in USA, it is more and more deeper. And the slaves come by their own decision and ask the master to get a job. It looks that the only freedom in USA is to choose your master.

There are too many people on earth that make no contribution to progress in any way and by just consuming they are the killers of mother earth. It's time that couple be restricted to only two kids.

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Exactly. Just look at the UK for example. A welfare state where the 'needy' rely on handouts' Guess which people have the highest birth rate - yes you guessed it those people on free handouts that live in a perpetual cycle of unemployment -drug and alcohol abuse. And why do they have such large families? Because they get more free handouts. For the working families be they working class or middle class, having children is not considered a human right, it's an economic decision and for many a very difficult choice and so it should be.

If people let their biological urges overwhelm their rational decisions and they become bankrupt as a result, that's just tough and they deserve zero sympathy. But the paradox is a welfare state that allows for the growth of families in a perpetual culture of unemployment is a great threat to a country's economy. In the UK this is happening but instead of blaming the welfare state breeding a dysfunctional society, they blame the immigrants. Immigrants are scapegoated yet it is these very people that work the hardest and are keeping the UK economy affloat.

Well said my friend, you're obviously no liberal. I live in Africa they breed like flies and got nothing to sustain them. As long as he have the pleasure of sex

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As in western europe the politicians could prevent this. Unfortunately in Africa as women's status is more second class than in western europe there is less hope of control. Africa's speed in becoming a developing urbanized nation will continue with this growth, which can only mean bigger business for governments to line their pockets alongside their corporate partners that capitalise on urbanization as a result of population growth.

It's one thing to take from the collective pot and give to someone who is unable to contribute. It's a rather different thing to take from the collective pot and give to someone who is able, but unwilling to contribute... Government makes no such distinction. Milton Friedman explained this so well, and he was so right about it! Anything the government touches turns to crap.

90% of the welfare bill you refer to is directed towards pensioners, the long term unemployed account for less than 5% of the bill and fraud less than 1%, 15% lies unclaimed due to ignorance and shame. 97% of housing benefit claims (according to 2011 data) went to individuals in work. There are 4.8 million UK adults of working age on a form of out of work benefits chasing a regular monthly churn pool of 400K jobs, therefore only 10% of the unemployment issue can be solved, still leaving 4.4ml on a form of out of work benefit.

As for your sickening views on the 'right to give birth' children can act as motivation for many young couples, the common sense "have them when you can afford them" mantra lead to a generational deficit and gap such as Germany is currently experiencing. For the vast majority of UK and EU citizens there would never be a right time to start a family if being financially secure is the predominant factor. And who would determine and impose this arbitrary affordability, the state?

Exactly. Just look at the UK for example. A welfare state where the 'needy' rely on handouts' Guess which people have the highest birth rate - yes you guessed it those people on free handouts that live in a perpetual cycle of unemployment -drug and alcohol abuse. And why do they have such large families? Because they get more free handouts. For the working families be they working class or middle class, having children is not considered a human right, it's an economic decision and for many a very difficult choice and so it should be.

Part of why it's so expensive to have a baby is because the poor OB delivering has to have malpractice that will cover incase the kid grows up and does lousy on it's SAT.
OB's have dropped out like flies due to the cost of malpractice. Fix the legal system and the prices could be lowered.
I'm an internist but I refuse to see anyone under the age of 18 even if it's something I feel confident I can treat because of the length of time I have to carry a tail policy on kids. For adult, I only carry 2 yrs.
Care in the UK isn't very good. When I lived there, folks joked it took 10 months to get a pregancy test.

Bullshit, our national health service is an incredible asset and the quality of 'service' we received during all our kids births was first class. I've yet to hear of any close friends or family bemoan their experiences when giving birth, unless they're the type with a pre determination to moan their tits off over anything and everything.

Bullshit, our national health service is an incredible asset and the quality of 'service' we received during all our kids births was first class. I've yet to hear of any close friends or family bemoan their experiences when giving birth, unless they're the type with a pre determination to moan their tits off over anything and everything.

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But does it burden the system thought? Is healthcare 100% and do tax revenue pay for the services?

Idk just asking because here in the states every talks about how cool Canada has free healthcare, but it's so overrun you could wait up to 3 months for a referral to see a specialist and what not.

In the UK we pay for our NHS through national insurance stamps and contributions and have done since its inception. It could be better, France and other countries have an arguably better care system through spending more of the country's revenue versus GDP on healthcare, but for all its minor faults our free healthcare is a fantastic public asset.

I am happy to hear that Just curious, was there a reason that facilitated the move? It's a long way lol.

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Well, i was the kid at school that always told everyone i was going to move to the USA. It was always on the cards for me. I was an unhappy person in the UK in the cold and wet. It brought the worst out in me as an alpha male.

People in the UK though for sure in general take their free healthcare for granted. i did. When my friends have kids in England it is not even a consideration about money.

It is not free of course as it must be paid for through taxes but what is certain is that the relative cost of things here in the USA is outrageous. On our line itemed bill for having the twins we noticed that a pain killer for my wife (just one pill) was more than $20. I could go to the store next door to the hospital and pick up a pack of 100 for less than $5.

Healthcare out here is out of control. In my view of the governance of a nation i believe healthcare and emergency services such as police, fire, coastguard etc should not be private enterprise. Yes im a soicialist at heart.

But does it burden the system thought? Is healthcare 100% and do tax revenue pay for the services?

Idk just asking because here in the states every talks about how cool Canada has free healthcare, but it's so overrun you could wait up to 3 months for a referral to see a specialist and what not.

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It overwhelms the system in the UK as the givernment can not really afford it. The best system i have seen is in Australia where it is mostly free (and state controlled) but you do pay a co pay with most things.

This stops so many people just running to the doctor for nothing (which happens in the UK).

Having to pay a little keeps the volume of use lower whilst also contributing to the cost.

Of course the country can afford it and as well as paying forty percent as a high rate tax payer we pay close to ten percent NI to cover pension contributions and a 'free'. NHS. The ignorance peddled on this thread with regards to the uk NHS is alarming.

The issue with our NHS is that right wing swivel eyed loons recognise that the NHS if broken up and delivered into the hands of Tory donors would be worth in excess of 100 bn over a ten year period. For the most part our NHS is an incredible institution paid for and by the workers of this country over generations.

It overwhelms the system in the UK as the givernment can not really afford it. The best system i have seen is in Australia where it is mostly free (and state controlled) but you do pay a co pay with most things.

This stops so many people just running to the doctor for nothing (which happens in the UK).

Having to pay a little keeps the volume of use lower whilst also contributing to the cost.

Well, i was the kid at school that always told everyone i was going to move to the USA. It was always on the cards for me. I was an unhappy person in the UK in the cold and wet. It brought the worst out in me as an alpha male.

People in the UK though for sure in general take their free healthcare for granted. i did. When my friends have kids in England it is not even a consideration about money.

It is not free of course as it must be paid for through...

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I ran a half-marathon once, and noticed some pain in my foot. I thought I might of had a stress fracture, so I went to the hospital and didn't have insurance at the time.

I waited in the empty waiting room for 5 hours. I got into my ER room. Waited for 90 min. Seen the doctor for 10 min., took an x-ray, gave me a ankle brace and two pills, one a muscle relaxer and a vikodin. I then waited for another two hours to be dismissed.

I was so pissed I ran around that bitch looking for the doctor to dismiss me. I find him chilling in his office.

Of course the country can afford it and as well as paying forty percent as a high rate tax payer we pay close to ten percent NI to cover pension contributions and a 'free'. NHS. The ignorance peddled on this thread with regards to the uk NHS is alarming.

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Not sure if your being sarcastic bro?

If not...

NHS has crippled the UK for years. It is one of the reasons for the incredible fuel prices in GB. VAT, bedroom taxes, poll tax etc etc all in an effort to pay for spiralling health care costs that are and will continue to be out of control.

I remember as a kid sitting in the doctors office with 40 other people with a simple cold.

I dont know how any would could resent that. I just found out ill be a father a week ago. Finances held me back, but i refuse to not be a parent due to the unknown. Life itself is unknown, and ill looking forward the the chaos, havoc, joy and excitment it will bring

NHS has crippled the UK for years. It is one of the reasons for the incredible fuel prices in GB. VAT, bedroom taxes, poll tax etc etc all in an effort to pay for spiralling health care costs that are and will continue to be out of control.

I remember as a kid sitting in the doctors office with 40 other people with a simple cold.

I dont know how any would could resent that. I just found out ill be a father a week ago. Finances held me back, but i refuse to not be a parent due to the unknown. Life itself is unknown, and ill looking forward the the chaos, havoc, joy and excitment it will bring

The majority of those in receipt of housing benefit are in work, iirc the figure is around 95%. When costa coffee advertised ten barista jobs in a small town they had 800 applicants. BT advertised 200 apprenticeships they had 8000 applications. That's just two examples there's many more that demolish the work shy scrounger myth that the uk right wing press have peddled for years.

In terms of crime we have circa 500 homicides a year out of a population of 60 ml, approx ten a week. Comparing that to the USA with circa 35000 murders a year and up to 50,000 deaths by guns ( 20,000 suicides) tells its own story wrt the quality if life in the uk and Europe vis a vis the USA.

The truth is that in many countries such as France, UK, etc it has become too easy to sit on welfare and collect the minimum needed to just get by. I watched many of my family and friends do it for years in England.

Income support, child benefit, invalidity, SDA and others along with free health care and your rent paid for if you cant find work have led to abuse of the system. It was embarrassing to see the Polish, Slovakians and others to flood into the UK to take jobs that the new generation of British kids wouldn't lower themselves to do....

Bro im not disagreeing with you on the homocide rate etc but i would say that after living in both countries i feel much safer on the streets in the USA.

As for the 'work shy scrounger myth' i grew up in Peterlee in the North East and more than half the people i knew were on income support or disability. They were all fairly fit and active and could have worked in one of the many factories in town but instead spent their days in the club getting drunk (using the vouchers they got from the DHSS). Being British you have surely seen this yourself? If not then you grew up in the south? I went to Bournemouth years ago and found an entirely different culture down there.

Im sure you are correct for the numbers on applicants with BT and im not saying that everyone in the UK is lazy and uninterested but comparing the quality of life in the Uk with that of the USA is a non starter.

Take me for example, i spent 29 years in the UK. Did everything i could, worked hard, but still had to be a criminal just to have a half decent life and pay my bills. By no means a 'high' standard of living.
I come to the USA and within a few years earn more money than i would of in England over the course of my entire life. I then get sued and have twins which cost me everything i had achieved. Even within one year of 'starting again' i have already earned more money than i did in my adult life (13 years) in the UK.

Dear god this is painful to reply to, we waste 4.5bn a year on trident. Estimates of our tax avoidance and evasion are at 85bn a year.

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Bro all nations that spend more on interest payments to debt than education can simply not afford the growing cost of healthcare and pensions.

To spend almost two thirds of actual government spending on either pensions or healthcare as a nation is crazy, particularly when the balance of payments is negative every year.

True there is waste and still some corruption leading to misappropriation but that we both know will never completely disappear and is evident in every country on earth.

In terms of your 'painful to reply to' comment. If you want to disrespect my comments bro that is fine, I thought we were having a legitimate discussion. By all means educate me if I am wrong but If you choose to insult me and get personal bro this will go a whole different direction.

I have lived in both countries and I am in a good place to compare the two.

I dont know how any would could resent that. I just found out ill be a father a week ago. Finances held me back, but i refuse to not be a parent due to the unknown. Life itself is unknown, and ill looking forward the the chaos, havoc, joy and excitment it will bring

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congratulations bro,

and your right.... Money will mean nothing when you hold your child for the first time. good luck

You're ignoring facts instead preferring to rely on specious generalisations, I'm delivering them. The UKs total 'bill' for healthcare is approx £100 bn a year the individual tax take is approx £550bn. We lose approx 85bn through evasion and avoidance. The uk can easily afford its healthcare bill, its not even an issue, you chose to make it such. Unlucky, raise your game next time...er ....'bro' ( whatever the fukc that means)

Unlucky, raise your game next time...er ....'bro' ( whatever the fukc that means)

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Got to be honest im quite shocked. There was no need to turn this thread into a personal dispute. We might have a difference of opinion which we talked about but to get aggressive is dissappointing. These threads are meant to open up discussions not to be used as an opportunity to beat your chest and be unnaccepting of anyone elses input.

Im not relying on generalisations but on what i have experienced in growing up in an area of England with one of the highest rates of welfare incidence.

Your comments to Jaygee are also rude. True that Britian once led the world in literature, economics, medicine, industry, commerce and exploration but those days are long gone.

It might be you that may need to raise your game and take a look in the mirror.

Expecting hate mail i suppose, why dont you tell me something about who the person is hiding behind the profile on FF?

Would love to show you how i can 'raise my game' in the real world 'bro'

For the record, the Uk spends closer to 130 Billion annually on healthcare and also has around 100 billion every year that it is in the red. Even if ALL of the waste and missappropriation was ended (which is not ever going to happen). The UK would still be running deficits. The cost of healthcare and pensions is growing so to claim the UK can afford it 'if they didnt pay for trident' is plain wrong.

So we replace our capitalism with what? Some of those liberal systems? Sure, you can keep it and shove it right up your liberal asses. Does half your paycheck go to taxes but you have "free" healthcare? Sure you do. It parallels a welfare system, you wait forever and die in line. So many commies crawling out of their rocks to chime in their 2 cents on why America sucks. Notice how they never say what should replace it. By all means, bash us everday and all day long. Envy is a bitch. By the way, i paid 0 dollars for my first born and $500 copay on my 2nd. Zero more, zilch, nada. if you prefer socialism, go to Cuba and then get back to me shall you? They have free healthcare too!

So, in your world you have a system were becoming ill can ruin you, or giving birth to twins bankrupt you? Honestly, try and find first gear in your brain's clunky mechanics before commenting. As for the USA 56million on food stamps tells its own story. Taxation in the uk and much of Europe is fair and equitable. As for your "envy" retort wrt to the USA its obvious that you're not being ironic but as a choice of emigration destinations the USA would be the bottom of many Europeans' lists.

So we replace our capitalism with what? Some of those liberal systems? Sure, you can keep it and shove it right up your liberal asses. Does half your paycheck go to taxes but you have "free" healthcare? Sure you do. It parallels a welfare system, you wait forever and die in line. So many commies crawling out of their rocks to chime in their 2 cents on why America sucks. Notice how they never say what should replace it. By all means, bash us everday and all day long. Envy is a bitch. By the way, i paid 0 dollars for my first born and...

So, in your world you have a system were becoming ill can ruin you, or giving birth to twins bankrupt you? Honestly, try and find first gear in your brain's clunky mechanics before commenting. As for the USA 56million on food stamps tells its own story. Taxation in the uk and much of Europe is fair and equitable. As for your "envy" retort wrt to the USA its obvious that you're not being ironic but as a choice of emigration destinations the USA would be the bottom of many Europeans' lists.

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I agree that the food stamps is ridiculous, but you cannot have social welfare in various forms and call it something else to make it sound better. The UK's welfare is lower than many other European countries, but it is still there.

Many Europeans' views on America are what the media feeds them. When I was in Ireland, my friends roommate was English. Of course, she never been to America and never wanted to go. Had ill conceived notions of who I was and what I was about until she actually spent the time to talk to me.

So, if Europeans chose not to come to America because they're close minded than they can stay where they are. Trust me, I know there are things about this country I dislike but there are problems in every country. Say a contracting economy and 12% of Europeans unemployed.

I never been to the UK, but I would like to. I don't judge you because you're English and your preconcieved notions about a country you very well never been to. However, life is to short for petty shite, and I will travel and enjoy each place and their people equally

If your disagreements with someone lead to a breakdown in your relationships with them you end up with few friends of any worth and become an insular person. You surround yourself with 'yes' men that just agree and reaffirm what you think. It is a personal weakness with no ability to think in any other way lacking the maturity and wisdom to ever be wrong. As an example, I disagree with trading outlook almost 80% of the time with Il be back. We joke with each other about it but it never would see us fall out. We respect each other as men and our difference are just opinions that's all. I feel fairly confident that it would be the same with Pip Anon but we tend to agree on trade plans anyway.

I just have to glance at certain posts on these news items to get an idea of where people are as people and if you cant hold a discussion without being a dick then you shouldn't. Just go and sit in a room with lots mirrors and talk with yourself. That way nobody will ever challenge your opinions. It seems people get so defensive about their country and its relative strength index. In reality, its history, achievements etc had nothing to do with you and you have nothing to be defensive about.

The American capitalist system and 'dream' has failed, Americans actually live in a socialist superstate, but have been brainwashed from the cradle to believe that any mention of socialism is positioned in the same area as communism. As capitalism in its latest form has failed an exercise in socialism immediately began in order to socialise the greatest banking losses ever witnessed onto an unsuspected ill educated society. The irony should be a point of mirth if it wasn't so tragic.

Your assumption that I haven't visited America several times is wrong, I passed up the opportunity to work in NY twenty years back and despite the usual 'adventure' regrets I've no underlying doubts that the decision I made was the right one.

I look at many aspects of the Amercian way of life and remain aghast as to how so many are hoodwinked into believing they have a high standard of living and quality of life when in reality your precious muddled class hasn't moved on financially; wages have remained stagnant in real and inflation adjusted terms for decades. The crime levels and the highest incarceration levels globally paint a picture of an out of control society held together by a gossamer thread under a police state, a state that homeland security has increased exponentially.

If the uk were to suddenly experience the same homicide levels as the USA we'd need a 'jump' from 500 to close on 12,000 murders a year, superimposing that figure onto our nation would cause many to believe we were living in a war zone, a war zone, through the love of gun culture, Americans have accepted as the norm due to the levels of ignorance and myopia, believing that chasing the American ideal has such 'acceptable' consequences.

To finish, the largest economy on the planet should be in a position to provide free health care from cradle to grave, a support system for citizens that fall on hard times, free education up to university age, pension provision for its elderly and free services such as fire service, police and ambulance at the end of a phone call. The fact that it can't and won't ranks the USA as a brutal, cruel and unforgiving environment, the majority of its citizens are trapped in an arrogant illusion that the USA is a great nation. It isn't. It's supposed greatness has been acquired down the barrel of a gun, at home in its police state and by exporting might and terror through its close on one thousand military posts to 'encourage' other nations to bow to its will.

I agree that the food stamps is ridiculous, but you cannot have social welfare in various forms and call it something else to make it sound better. The UK's welfare is lower than many other European countries, but it is still there.

Many Europeans' views on America are what the media feeds them. When I was in Ireland, my friends roommate was English. Of course, she never been to America and never wanted to go. Had ill conceived notions of who I was and what I was about until she actually spent the time to talk to me.

If your disagreements with someone lead to a breakdown in your relationships with them you end up with few friends of any worth and become an insular person. You surround yourself with 'yes' men that just agree and reaffirm what you think. It is a personal weakness with no ability to think in any other way lacking the maturity and wisdom to ever be wrong. As an example, I disagree with trading outlook almost 80% of the time with Il be back. We joke with each other about it but it never would see us fall out. We respect each other as men and our...

The American capitalist system and 'dream' has failed, Americans actually live in a socialist superstate, but have been brainwashed from the cradle to believe that any mention of socialism is positioned in the same area as communism. As capitalism in its latest form has failed an exercise in socialism immediately began in order to socialise the greatest banking losses ever witnessed onto an unsuspected ill educated society. The irony should be a point of mirth if it wasn't so tragic.

The American capitalist system and 'dream' has failed, Americans actually live in a socialist superstate, but have been brainwashed from the cradle to believe that any mention of socialism is positioned in the same area as communism. As capitalism in its latest form has failed an exercise in socialism immediately began in order to socialise the greatest banking losses ever witnessed onto an unsuspected ill educated society. The irony should be a point of mirth if it wasn't so tragic.

Your assumption that I haven't visited America several times...

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Pierce Morgan, is that you? What does homicide have anything to do with it? Like I said, America has its faults. Every country does. I guess Europeans would know socialism when they see it.

The fact is many of your opinions are biased and are of no experience. Group all Americans into whatever you want.

To be honest, if I could retire on the coast of Ireland I would, but I never regret being born in America. And if you want to judge me because of it that's ok, no sweat off my sack

A well balanced and mature response. More members like Pip needed in this forum. This maturity and wisdom is also evident in his trading. Some of the people here (naming no names) seem to lack the skills to be able to even discuss a topic without getting personal. Im sure their trading results are pretty dire too. Insecurity from inability leading to a brash conflictive personality.

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Thanks man! Just try to remain balanced. I just can't stand internet warriors that speak their opinions on with no experience to what they speak of.

As to try and teach how to trade without ever trading or what its like to be in a gun fight without being in one. Words are very facile

It's supposed greatness has been acquired down the barrel of a gun, at home in its police state and by exporting might and terror through its close on one thousand military posts to 'encourage' other nations to bow to its will.

Britain's greatness was acquired fom King Arthur who had a gallant half-brother, by the name of *****. Good guy he was. Trader he became,

"prince of the plunder,
The unrelenting warrior to his enemy;
Heavy was he in his vengeance;
Terrible was his fighting.
When he would drink from a horn,
He would drink as much as four;
When into battle he came
He slew as would a hundred.
Unless God should accomplish it,
Cei's death would be unattainable.
Worthy Cei and Llachau
Used to fight battles,
Before the pain of livid spears [ended the conflict].
On the top of Ystarfingun
Cei slew nine witches.
Worthy Cei went to Ynys Mon
To destroy lions.
Little protection did his shield offer"

Britain's commonwealth is nothing more than an historical remnant and embrassment, the majority of the commonwealth has been liberated for generations. Putting that forward as an historical reference is as irrelevant as referring to Europeans emigrating to North America and slaughtering the indigenous populations.

Football violence has been virtually eradicated from the football scene, it was an incredibly small activity that 'peaked' in the early 80 s. The latest recorded crime figures were released in the UK last week showing a circa ten percent fall in crime. Don't try to compare crime stats, you'll just embarrass yourself. A multiple homicide is a rare event in the uk, in the USA it occurs every fortnight (yesterday being the latest) and that's just the peak of the USA's crime ridden legacy.

Football violence has been virtually eradicated from the football scene, it was an incredibly small activity that 'peaked' in the early 80 s. The latest recorded crime figures were released in the UK last week showing a circa ten percent fall in crime. Don't try to compare crime stats, you'll just embarrass yourself. A multiple homicide is a rare event in the uk, in the USA it occurs every fortnight (yesterday being the latest) and that's just the peak of the USA's crime ridden legacy.

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It was an example. Look up your crime statistics. Non-gun related crime is high. And you don't embarrass yourself. The numbers for UK will be relatively low because the US has nearly six times England's population. Ridden in legacy? Like England's ridden legacy of occupation? FBI crime statistics indicate descending crime levels.

Just because you read about what happens on the south side of Chicago or LA does not mean you have any clue.

Pierce Morgan, you can preach your anti-gun nonsense all you want. However, when some criminal breaks into your house with your family is inside, I hope you're not bringing a knife to a gun fight.

The fact of the matter is you speak of ill-emotion. And that's fine because as horrendous as the English view the US, they sure have no fecking problem asking them for assistance as "allies."

You seem to have an answer for everything when speaking of your country. Quite the loyalist you are. To Queen and country and whatnot

The crime figures are relative. The USA has the largest jail/prison population on the planet at circa 2 million. The uk has 70,000. On a pro rata basis the uk prison population would need to rise to 400,000 to rank with the USA. Similarly the uk would need to see its murder rate rise by circa 2000% to rank with the USA.

I'm a republican, and a European ahead of any patriotism to Great Britain. I'm hoping the uk will rid itself of the monarchy and that this royal birth will serve as a target, the monarchy to step down to be an outdated anachronism by the time this child is ready to take up his position.

As for asking for assistance as allies unfortunately Hollywood doesn't provide the facts. Russia 'won' the Second World War, the USA armed Germany in the initial stages.

It was an example. Look up your crime statistics. Non-gun related crime is high. And you don't embarrass yourself. The numbers for UK will be relatively low because the US has nearly six times England's population. Ridden in legacy? Like England's ridden legacy of occupation? FBI crime statistics indicate descending crime levels.

Just because you read about what happens on the south side of Chicago or LA does not mean you have any clue.

Pierce Morgan, you can preach your anti-gun nonsense all you want. However, when some criminal breaks into...

After working as a nightclub bouncer in both the UK (North East) and the USA (Las Vegas) I can safely say that violence and public disorder is maybe twenty times worse in England.

I think it is because of 3 factors. One is guns which in the USA definitely weighs on your mind before picking a fight just for kicks. I mean you never know what might happen if you start something.

Secondly, there is far less respect for the law in England, so many times I have seen drunken men in groups arguing with the police pointing and screaming. In the USA this will not happen as people have more respect/fear of the authority.

Thirdly, there is less tendency for men here to try to prove themselves physically. When I was kid at school in England the only thing that mattered was how 'hard' you where. Not, were you good at football, maths, or anything else. Just how hard you were. That's what I meant by it brought the worst out in me. Kids here are more likely to be enrolled in a soccer club or something else than just roaming around on the streets looking to prove themselves.

Spreadbetter, the royal family is pretty much the envy of the world and all the British have to be proud of anymore. To want rid of it is surely not a good idea. We would just be like any other country then surely?

As for the second world war. NOBODY won, it was a mess. Russians were a factor, as where we but there was no winner.

US prisons have a high population as the sentencing in the US is very different to most places in the world. You might go to prison in the UK for 3 years for fraud. In the US you will get 40 years. UK is more violent of this im certain. I have lived in the USA for 8 years and still have never seen anyone have a fight on the street. In East Durham I would see it once a week. Even club fights are rare. Back in Newcastle it is every night without doubt.

I would hope that you would at least take on board some of these points considering it is the opinion of someone who has actually lived in both places. My guess is though that you wont due to the said lack of ability to be wrong or even challenged.

How can you be in a position to compare things when you have not spent enough time in the USA to even have an understanding? Being offered a job in Boston does not give you the depth of knowledge in the USA to be able to put it to the sword.

Like any other there is good and bad. There are things I miss. There are negatives in the USA for sure. However, I have a choice where I live. I could go and move my family anywhere so I live in the USA. You have mentioned that most British would not wish to emigrate to the USA but in reality they all would if they knew the truth and not what they have seen spun by the media.

The strength of your argument actually hints at jealousy. Why are you so bothered by the US? Maybe you had a visa application rejected a few years ago?

Only joking with the last paragraph which I shouldn't. I apologise.

Oh and the word 'bro'. It is what people informally call each other to show respect and friendship. Which is how the people of the world would be better treating each other. Raising their game as they go.

Britain's commonwealth is nothing more than an historical remnant and embrassment, the majority of the commonwealth has been liberated for generations. Putting that forward as an historical reference is as irrelevant as referring to Europeans emigrating to North America and slaughtering the indigenous populations.

Ignored

Are you implying that it was ethics that prompted the "liberation"? Or was it economics? I would argue that most of the population of Britain would still very much like to have their empire (and some still believe they do). The only reason it's a "historical remnant" is because Britain was unable to keep it, not because it gave it up voluntarily.

Don't kid yourself about your superiority to the US or to anyone else. Exceptionalism is what we should banish to the history books.

So, in your world you have a system were becoming ill can ruin you, or giving birth to twins bankrupt you? Honestly, try and find first gear in your brain's clunky mechanics before commenting. As for the USA 56million on food stamps tells its own story. Taxation in the uk and much of Europe is fair and equitable. As for your "envy" retort wrt to the USA its obvious that you're not being ironic but as a choice of emigration destinations the USA would be the bottom of many Europeans' lists.

Ignored

We all know that you have already proven yourself as a real fake and liar when it comes to trading. Suffice to say, it is obvious you are a commie. Case closed. Like the U.S. who does not negotiate with terrorists. I don't entertain myself with commies. Now go run along to your demo account.

I think there may be an ulterior motive to spreadbetters comments. i sure hope he isn't trying to convince anyone that his opinions are valid. He is beginning to sound like another ff member that constantly tries to validate his wrong assumptions. Anyway had a great weekend in the mountains and feel refreshed for this week. Hope everyone had a good weekend too. Good lick trading this week,

Are you implying that it was ethics that prompted the "liberation"? Or was it economics? I would argue that most of the population of Britain would still very much like to have their empire (and some still believe they do). The only reason it's a "historical remnant" is because Britain was unable to keep it, not because it gave it up voluntarily.

Don't kid yourself about your superiority to the US or to anyone else. Exceptionalism is what we should banish to the history books.

We all know that you have already proven yourself as a real fake and liar when it comes to trading. Suffice to say, it is obvious you are a commie. Case closed. Like the U.S. who does not negotiate with terrorists. I don't entertain myself with commies. Now go run along to your demo account.

There's no ulterior motive, the original discussion centred around the cost of having a 'royal baby' versus the cost of an ordinary birth in the usa. Iirc family medical insurance in the USA costs a family circa $15k a year, now given that the average median family income in the USA is circa $44k this suggest complete healthcare costs a third of gross income.

Once again the average American is conned into believing they live in a low tax environment. Your health care, child care, college fees, retirement, senior care is in a mess. But it's an impossible discussion to have with patriotic bigots unable to separate their emotions from the reality.

Here's a link that may open your closed mind to the reality of your American Dream

I think there may be an ulterior motive to spreadbetters comments. i sure hope he isn't trying to convince anyone that his opinions are valid. He is beginning to sound like another ff member that constantly tries to validate his wrong assumptions. Anyway had a great weekend in the mountains and feel refreshed for this week. Hope everyone had a good weekend too. Good lick trading this week,