I got 2 friends who think BOTH Kobe and LeBron now are better players THAN Jordan ever was. So, in other terms, LeBron is the best all time, then Kobe, then Jordan. They say jordan had no real competition. I think that is absolute ludicrous, and my brother wholeheartedly agrees. We point out players such as Kareem, Bird, Magic, Barkley, Stockton, Malone, Payton, Shaq, Ewing, D. Robinson, Hakeem O, and many more as some of the "lack of competition". Plus, these guys (although they are huge sports fans that do know there stuff as well) don't realize the domination of Jordan. Both being a generation after jordan, i dont think they really saw him play ( I am a generation after jordan too, but i did see him play beginning in 96 forward, and i have numerous collections of film and games of the Great one)

SO its 2 opinions to 2. PLEASE SETTLE THIS BET.

NOTE: this is a question that does not take in potential nor future impact. i think MAYBE LeBron could someday pass Jordan as the best player ever, but as of now, i still think Jordan no contest is the best of all time.

When Jordan was playing and in his prime, NOBODY had a chance to win a title. That tells of his dominance right there. The only titles won during his reign by teams other than his Bulls were when he was out of the league. He then came back and won more rings. I think LeBron and Kobe may both have more talent than MJ, but when it came to heart and desire to win....its not even close.

However your friend does have a bit of a point. By the time MJ's Bulls started dominating, guys like Magic and Bird where past their prime but there still were incredible players in the league much like their always will be.

yeah, i think Always hit it spot on... Jordan wasn't the most skilled or most naturally gifted (though he was still highly skilled and gifted). But he was by far the most passionate, focused, and motivated player ever, and with his skills, he became the most dominate player ever and the best player ever.

I think when this post reaches a few more votes to Jordan, and a few more comments, I will link this to my two buddies who I debated with yesterday.

Kobe wishes he was Jordan, but he never says it. He got everything handed to him on a silver platter. I tip my hat to him for seizing the opportunity, but the fact that he had it made for him since he was a kid does not make me impressed.

LeBron is still young and still has a long way to go. He's broken incredible records at such a young age, but he has yet to win a title. He could finally this year, but if LeBron is ever to be considered better than MJ, it'll be because he wins 6 titles before he retires and dominates the league just as MJ did.

LeBron will get close if he can start winning titles (although MJ was like 29 when he one his first want he? took 5 years or so) and be abit more clutch.

Kobe had his day, won his rings, got his rep, reached his plateau..............and he still isnt anywhere near MJ, and LeBron will eclipse him easily.

Yeah the Kobe thing is appalling. It is a slap to basketball fans everywhere saying kobe IS better than Jordan ever was. This conversation disappointed me, but i found myself in the minority opinion when having this conversation, especially from two very big sports fans such as myself.

The thing is, my generation is so selfish (the me me me era), that they do not consider generations prior to them. What I love about this board is that most of you guys are at least a few years older than myself if not more (i am 22). My generation didnt see much of Jordan, and dont realize his utter dominance. I do because I was absolutely obsess with basketball since a young age, but i am in the high minority.

LeBron will get close if he can start winning titles (although MJ was like 29 when he one his first want he? took 5 years or so) and be abit more clutch.

Kobe had his day, won his rings, got his rep, reached his plateau..............and he still isnt anywhere near MJ, and LeBron will eclipse him easily.

Yeah the Kobe thing is appalling. It is a slap to basketball fans everywhere saying kobe IS better than Jordan ever was. This conversation disappointed me, but i found myself in the minority opinion when having this conversation, especially from two very big sports fans such as myself.

The thing is, my generation is so selfish (the me me me era), that they do not consider generations prior to them. What I love about this board is that most of you guys are at least a few years older than myself if not more (i am 22). My generation didnt see much of Jordan, and dont realize his utter dominance. I do because I was absolutely obsess with basketball since a young age, but i am in the high minority.

again, thanks guys, this post has made the world a little more sane.

Keep up the good fight the Crackerz!

As you say, the generation of "here and now", "me and me", "everything we have/do is the best".............f*ck em, there wrong. (although I suppose each generation feels like that to an extent..........and each generation before it will feel they are punk kids, such is life)

Anyway, its the same with most things............movies, music, every generation thinks their sh*t is the best and unfortunately they are not usually right, just different tastes I suppose but most of us dont see it that way when we really think about it.

However, with sports, and especially a topic like this where we are not talking about players who played against vastly different opposition, talent wise, then it is stupid to apply the "our guy is better than the guy before" thing...............because its so easy to see that he wasnt.

I mean debates about Wilt, The Big O, Russell, Jerry West compared to players of the last 15/20 years are something that makese sense because of the massive gap in talent that those older guys played against...............vs the modern players who play against teams and players who arent that far behind them in terms of talent.

Anyone who knows what they are talking knows that MJ is the greatest and would do what he did against any generation of ballers.

I mean think about it, he played against the best of the 80's and dominated them. He played against the next group of amazing players in the late 80's and early 90's and dominated them, took a year out, then came back and dominated again against the mid-90's new wave of talent..................then he came back again! and finished off the 90's guys and schooled the next generation a little, all the while heading into his 40's for f*cks sake!

I mean jesus, just think of all the players that MJ played against and competed against and dominated over the course of his career..............its insane.

Not Kobe, not even LeBron will eclipse the sheer talent that Jordan overcame and kept title-less.