Sita’s Agnipariksha in Ramayan

The Context

One of the most controversial episodes of Ramayan is the Agnipariskha (Test by Fire) of Sita. As per the alleged episode, after Ram had defeated Ravan and rescued Sita, he refused to accept her doubting her chastity. Thus, Sita jumped into fire. The Fire God then rescued her and hence she came out unburnt. All gods came from heaven to convince Ram that Sita is pure. He then agreed and accepted Sita.

Various strong viewpoints exist on this issue. Traditionalists justify the action of Ram citing his overriding responsibility of setting right standards in society as a king. Feminists criticize the culture of that era and Hindu religion for being anti-woman. Anti-feminists use this story to explain why women should have limited freedom. Evangelists cite this episode (among many others) to convince Hindus to leave Hinduism and accept any other religion. It is a favorite of Dalit movement protagonists who showcase this as an example of Brahminical dogmatism. Miraclists (those who explain everything through some miracles) explain this as a grand strategy of divine. Some explain that the Sita which was kidnapped by Ravan was actually a shadow of Sita and actual Sita was hiding inside fire. So when shadow Sita went inside the fire, actual Sita came out.

The Loopholes

What I always failed to understand was why Ram had to make such convoluted plans that would be known by none in any case. Could he not have implemented some less controversial and yet more efficient plans?

In general, I have always been confused by stories of miracles. The era before advent of videography and imagery seems to be full of miracles. Farther and remoter the place and event, more the probability of miracles explaining it. Whether it be Purans, Bible or Quran, the key events are explained by some miracle or the other. Whether it be splitting of Red Sea, or travel across seven skies in one night, or splitting of moon by simply pointing it, or churning of sea or Sita being fire-proof, its all a miracle happening everywhere which none of us has ever witnessed nor expect to witness in our lives. These miracles happen very inconsistently. For years someone would toil and then suddenly achieve something through miracle.

If one considers these stories as symbolic of certain deeper facets of life, it is indeed a very useful tool. We have so much to learn from such stories if we don’t take them literally. However, we are supposed to blindly believe in them verbatim in order to not be termed blasphemous. This is where these stories start separating religion from spiritualism.

The debates I often witness among religions – which religion is best – eventually boils down to who can prove the miracle of his religion to be more authentic!

And the atheists would laugh down such tales of miracles as a reason to hate religion. So they lose an opportunity to be purposeful in life, consider themselves as chemical reactions and become greatest victims!

Coming to the particular story of Sita’s asbestos test (asbestos is the material that is fully fire-proof), I could always see the flaws in it. The Ramayan era seemed to be very liberal from perspective of women rights. Women even took part in battles. Obviously participating in battle implies that there is a huge risk of getting imprisoned. Ram’s step-mother had accompanied Dashrath in one such war. So the family of Ram was quite liberal in these matters. Ram himself had been instrumental in uniting those women with their husbands who had been cheated by someone else. He made his friend Sugriva accept his wife again who was captured by his elder brother.

And if we trace the overall theme of Ramayan, there is no doubt that Ram was a role model par-excellence. Few people have inspired me as much as Maryadapurushottam Sri Ramchandra. (other two being Hanuman and Krishna). Its not out of nothing that he is the greatest icon of Hinduism for millenniums. Thus, this story as well as many others seemed to me like anomalies that contradicted the natural flow and other principles advocated in the same Ramayan.

Had it been a mythological story, we could have let go of this episode as imagination of the author or symbolic of something else. After all, there is no sensible way to explain what being fire-proof has to do with chastity of a woman. And if so, then all chaste woman should be fire-proof, which clearly is not the case. Because chastity does not convert your skin into asbestos. Further, what example is being set by such test in not clear. In fact by expecting such miracles to prove chastity of woman, generations have been misguided to denigrate women. Needless to say, this notion of chastity is blatantly against Vedas and Manu Smriti.

In case of Ramayan, the fact remains that it is a historical text, and not yet another tales of Aladin. Further it is a text associated deeply with not just Hindu psyche. Ram is a role model for entire India regardless of religion. He is a cultural icon. Thus these stories denigrate Hinduism, culture and nation – every thing. If these be true, if indeed Ram was anti-woman, then Ram cannot be role model.

So I decided to test out what the exact episode is in Ramayana. Now Ramayana is an epic text, and not a divine text in lines of Vedas. So, while Vedas have been preserved for ages through a variety of methods to protect from even minutest aberration, other texts have not enjoyed that protection. Ramayan and Mahabharat are thus replete with latter day adulterations. Same is the case with Manu Smriti.

Please note that for ages, there was no printing press and publication house to publish authentic versions of any text. They used to be written by hand and memorized and spread across various schools and among scholars. So adulteration was easier. While it would be impossible to decipher each adulteration, if one analyzes one can identify the obvious adulterations. Such adulterations can be identified by change in language style, change in story flow, being out of context, suddenly a miracle happening and then the story continuing again as normal and contradiction with rest of the text.

We have already analyzed how more than 50% verses of existing Manu Smriti can be purged out as adulterated through analysis.

In case of Ramayan, if we analyze the verses elaborating the Sita Fire-Proof test, startling truths emerge.

The story by and large goes on smoothly till 113th chapter of Yuddha Kand. In this chapter, Hanuman goes to Sita to inform her about victory of Ram.

In Chapter 114, Ram states that women are respected by the respect they get from nation and their own habits. Any kind of restriction on women – of home, dress code, boundary – in order to protect their respect is unwise.(27). This shloka sums up the Hindu view of woman.

The rest of the verses in Chapter 114 except the last verse do not take the story any further. They seem to be adulterated.

In the first 6 verses of Chapter 115, Ram emotionally elaborates how he destroyed the enemy who had committed a grave crime. In the next 4 verses, he acknowledges the efforts of Hanuman, Sugriva and Vibheeshan. Verses 11 and 12 seems to be a clear adulteration that act as a filler to redirect the story.

In Verses 13 and 14, Ram expresses his satisfaction of getting back Sita after winning over such grave challenges.

And then in Verse 15, he takes a surprise U turn and states that he did not do all this to get back Sita. Clearly this verse is an adulteration. Not only it suddenly gives a new direction to the story, it does not relate to rest of the Ramayan where Ram had been even weeping in separation of Sita. Even if Ram had to force Sita for Fire-test, he could have said this straight instead of lying here. In entire Ramayan, Ram has been a truth-seeker, so this sudden twist is an obvious adulteration.

And from there, all the remaining verses of Chapter 115 appear clear adulteration. For example, in verses 22 and 23 he advises her to live with Bharat, Lakshman, Sugriva, Shatrughna or Vibheeshan. The fake verses cover the entire 116th chapter where Sita answers Ram’s allegations and asks Lakshman to prepare a fireplace. Then she jumps into it. Suddenly, in this chapter, all Rishis, Gandharvas, Gods emerge, who were non-existent so far.

In Chapter 117, all the major Gods come to Ram to talk to him. This is perhaps the only instance in Ramayan where divinity suddenly overpowers the normal course of story. This is the first time that Ram is spoken of as the Ultimate God Himself. If Ram alone is Ultimate God, why the lesser Gods are coming to convince Him of his ‘mistake’ is unexplained. And why Ram asked so many Gods to come. In this Chapter, they praise divinity of Ram for all the 32 verses.

In Chapter 118, Fire God comes out with Sita in her lap and offers to Ram. Then Ram explains that he was playing a game to convince people about chastity of Sita. Finally the last verse 22 says:“Having said so, Ram met Sita with great happiness.”

If all verses from Chapter 115 verse 15 onwards upto Chapter 118 verse 21 are deleted, the story continues smoothly and this intermediate miracle drama has no relevance or impact whatsoever.

Recall that Chapter 115 verse 14 has Ram emotionally explaining how he got back Sita with great efforts. And then Chapter 118 verse 22 says: “Having said do, Ram met Sita with great happiness.” There is perfect continuity.

Now Chapters 119 and 120 are again pure adulterations where the Gods praise Ram even further, then Dashrath also comes with God Indra and they have very long discussions. Indra then makes dead soliders alive again through magic. Chapter 121 starts with: “Ram slept peacefully that night and spoke with Vibheeshan in morning.” With minor adulterations, story continues as normal about how Ram and Sita went back to Ayodhya on Pushpak plane. Now, till end of Ramayana, nowhere does any reference to miracles happening emerge.

So, if one undertakes a cursory glance of Ramayan, this episode clearly emerges as a latter day adulteration which may have fuelled many debates, groupism, anti-Hindu mindset, anti-woman mindset, conversions and insults thrown upon character of Ram. However, the fact remains that the very basis for all this is dubious.

To sum up:

Following verses are clear adulterations:

Chapter 114: Verse 28 onwards, except last verse

Chapter 115: Verse 15 onwards

Chapters 116 and 117

Chapter 118: Except last verse

Chapters 119 and 120

If you remove all these adulterations that bring discontinuity, the story moves very smoothly and logically.

Real Ramayan and Real Mahabharat

Some other frivolous myths from Ramayan and Mahabharat that are used to denigrate the noble culture of Hinduism but do not exist are as follows:

Ramayan:

– Sita exile (entire Uttar Ramayan is fictitious and a latter day creation having no linkage with Valmiki)

– Hanuman, Bali, Sugriva etc being monkeys or apes. They were human beings, Hanuman was a great scholar, brilliant and impressive personality

– Ram, Lakshman, Sita being meat-eaters or alcohol consumers

Mahabharat:

– Draupadi being married to 5 brothers. Her name was Panchali because she was daughter of ruler of Panchal, and not because she married 5 brothers.

– Krishna married 16000 plus wives.

The reason why Ramayan and Mahabharat were so susceptible to adulterations is also obvious. After Vedas, these 2 texts have been the most respected texts of Hinduism for several centuries now. So, if you are able to manipulate these, it is easy to manipulate Hindus. Same is the case with Manu Smriti – the oldest law book.

The greatest benchmark, thus, to identify truth is that if it is as per Vedas or as per reason, accept it. Else reject it as an adulteration. Follow the overall theme and do not be bogged by minor details if they appear contrary to reason.

Jai Shri Ram

Vedas alone are true Dharma. Based on rock solid foundation of Vedas, Hinduism is a culture that should be proud of not only all Indians but entire humanity.

Ram is a role model for entire world. We should be proud that we are progeny of Ram. Whether we respect Ram as a God or God-driven is a personal belief. But character of Ram is as pure as diamond. Agniveer is committed to defence of glory of our role models.

I am founder of Agniveer. Pursuing Karma Yog.
I am an alumnus of IIT-IIM and hence try to find my humble ways to repay for the most wonderful educational experience that my nation gifted me with. I am also on Quora.

It has become a fashion to designate and dismiss as ‘interopolation’ or ‘adulteration’ the things that appears distasteful to one’s personal inclinations.

The best a person could do is to be honest enough to state that “I find this disagreeable to my sensitivities”, and stop there. It is preposterous to assume and declare what disagrees with one’s personal sensitivities as ‘adulteration’ and then try to look and invent reasons for it.

Agnipariksha is not an adulteration. The language and narration of this episode is perfectly in sync with the rest of the epic.

The true adulteration is being caused by people who impose the narrow limitations of their own minds on the epics of the great poets.

Lord Ram was maryada pusushottam , and he has higher duty of being a king thn being husband. He was nt like kalyuga leaders who keeps family first n people last. To set an example fr entire human race, he decided to take agni pariksha, but he himself knew Sita is pure. Woman r not suppose to remain away under another man’s rule n to demonstrate this, he performed this act. However in kalyuga, woman r often found staying away frm their family, which is nt Vedic concept.

Can you provide evidence about hanuman being animal not ape or vice versa. Because many atheist friend Question me on this. NO answer with me to quote!!! Please write about atheist also.How to counter them.

How can a DHARMIC DACORIAN law having Religious sanctity be declared an ADHARM , without Sita getting Physically involved in it…………THINK..>>>>>THINK, then answer .

VALMIKI RAMAYAN contains lot of additions, alterations made subsequently and accepting the fact that Ramayan, Mahabharat, and all Puraans are also coded, the history that they contain, actually has to be culled out.

RAMCHARITMANAS written by Goswami Tulsidas Ji, also followed the same pattern except that it ignored altogether, the incident of disownment of Sita.

When Shri Ram took Avatar, all important events in which he was involved, as Human, would provide a Dharm. Agni Pariksha is one such event which Shri Ram established EITHER as DHARM or ADHARM…I WANT YOUR ANSWER ON THIS ISSUE.

Hindus by and large are afraid to accept Shri Ram as human incarnation of Lord Vishnu. Once we accept Shri Ram as Avatar, who came on this earth for establishing Dharm, we then have to start looking at all important events in which he was involved differently and to find what the Dharm was, which HE tried to establish.

Now the question is Why do you want to look for supernatural powers in history where NONE exists?

NOW the answer: GO and read full post after clicking on the link and you will know how Agnii Pariksha was declared as ADHARM.

Excerpts from the post:

‘King Ram REJECTED the results of Agni Pariksha and held that the only time when Sita was on her own, free to make her own decision, and under no duress, was when she was alone in Panchvati. Her decision to cross the Lakshman Rekha, without the use of any external force, can also be construed as her consent to go with Ravana. He also observed, that after his victory over Ravana, none of the action of Sita can be construed to be her own free decision and without any duress. He further said that it is true that, as a King, it is difficult to reject the result of Agni Pariksha, because it has religious sanctity, but he would like to go with…

Hello Sanjeev ji, great samaritan work . I know the basis of this epic and then basis of its later distortion, you’d be thrilled to know when I’d publish it in a book may be. I need to stay in touch with me. You’re doing a good job, I wish very best for you. What are current issues you working on. Are you working full time on this vast issue of Indianism?! Well we need to work on it, in scientific terms. We have been defeated for last 1600 yrs and thus all such corruption! beleieve me there is much to it, the greatest tale of world, of all time!!! kudos to you, for carrying on…. You didn’t reply the emails I sent you(other email id) Tc

AS per the case of KRISHNA’S 16000 wifes .. It was the status that he gave to them as that of rajapatni and who married these women will be given official job or something like that was announced , i think so …. This was done to protect their dignity & honour & keep them safe as they feared nobody will except them … What’s more safe than the tag of a RAJAPATNI . That was his brilliance, that had been now doctorined into Marrying them is all a hoax explanation .. i think during the end of krishna’s reign corruption gt stronger and wt the present media doing now, same happened after that ( the effect of kaliyuga, change in the psyche of people ) ..

Actually this instance has happened in present day world itself … I exactly dont know this leaders name ( not in india ) as read in a newspaper long ago ..

Dear Agniveer, You are going to play a vital role in helping the sanaatan dharma to end from this earth by doubting. End of eternal dharma is definite then only kalki avataar will be incarnated by Vishnu-who is protector of Universe. Islaam is the fastest growing region which is happening by the order of Shiva-the destroyer of Universe according to Bhavishya Puraan. And we cannot stop that because then only eternal dharma will get ended as practices of their so called leaders is such that…

Rama, Krishna, and other prophets were messenger of God they were not supernatural power. Goddess of nature is the supreme power thats why in sanaatan dharma we thank every greatness of God by bowing and joining hands before them be it cow, peepal, sun or anything else. Worshipping these things, you are worshipping the God only. Sanaatan dharma is the actual way to live the life.

Absolute nonsense. Rama and Krishna were the 7th and 8th incarnations of Lord Vishnu. They were not mere mortals. Sanatana Dharma cannot be confined like a monotheistic faith. There are different templates like Advaita Vedanta, Dvaita Vedanta and Sankhya Vedanta.

Agniveer,You are trying to understand things with limited boundations of human brain. Things may be more complicated. Dharma can not have a name be it Hinduism, islaam or any other. Dharma is eternal. Hindus will end, muslims will end one day what will exist is eternal (sanaatan) dharma.You will keep trying to find proofs of authenticity of bhavishya puraan. You will not get because if you get, destruction of this earth will not occur which is already written in all holy scriptures.

I had posed the question to my mother about how Ram could be considered an ideal man if he was party to an Agnipiksha that his wife had to undergo. She could not give me a satisfactory reply so I found my way to your article. It is written convincingly and does create reasonable doubt about the credibility of the agnipariksha anecdote. It is surely an interesting view point on the episode. I admire the open minded writing.

Brother, if hanuman was not an ape, why does Goswami Tulsidas describe him as such? It’s also being said that Tulsidas was a reincarnation of Valmiki and had met Hanuman himself. So, he must have seen him. Please clear this.

you should read Ramayan, when Ram met Hanuman and said that Hanuman was not an ordinary forest dweller and he must be well versed with the vedas as his samskrit uccharan was perfect. do you think that an ape can read and understand the vedas?!

I dont find any problem with you picking up Dayanand Saraswati’s stand as your focal point. To each his own. But I request you to consider the works of Madhvacharya to give an all round finish to your articles.

Madhvacharya has written more books than every bhashyakara in the history of hinduism. The biography of Madhva was also written during his own lifetime as opposed to most other acharyas.

Madhva has written books on not only the Prasthana traya, but also everything ranging from tithi nirnaya to tantrasara. These books highlight practices such as idol dimensions and such. So to say that idol worship is not supported in hinduism is incorrect, to the best of my knowledge.

Most of the miracles which you put down as interpolation are explained clearly, including panchali having 5 husbands and most of the “seemingly” suspicious behaviour of Rama.

The central point is that of “Hari sarvottamatva, Vayu jeevottamatva”. If you understand the descent of Hari as Rama-Krishna-Vyasa and the service rendered by Vayu on descending in the form of Hanuma-Bheema-Madhva, then most doubts will be resolved.

But I repeat again, to each his own. No offense given to you. I again wish you the very best in your future endevours and hope ShriHari-Vayu-Guru rewards your sincere efforts. You are truly an inspiration for all right minded hindus to get serious about our scriptures again.

Commendable- convincing Power and the virtuous assertiveness displayed in entire Text. Deserve a sheer “Well Done” and a Pure Justice been done in true sense. Really, its an exceptional piece of work which is the need of the hour to save Humanity and also it exhibit how we can actually leverage the technology for the rightful purpose in this Very Digital age. A Great Salute to your Initiative- “Agniveer”

myth, mythology, legends, apocryphal folk tales mixed with prejudiced narrow minded thoughts to subjugate majority so called lower caste indians, i wish there was british rule to help prevail british rulez

[…] guy, but a small attachment can leave you flowing in the wave of adharma. Regarding, smritis Sita’s Agnipariksha in Ramayan For other question of yours you need to understand the concept of avatar. Ram was just a normal […]

Excellent analysis and theory. It does answer many of the troubling events in Ramayana and Mahabharatha. However, my question though, is there any linguistic evidence – that is can we prove that based on the grammar, structure, and the words used can we conclude that certain words inserted at a later date? For example, tenth mandala of Rig Veda is later than the other mandala. This conclusion was reached on the basis of linguistic evidence and is accepted by both eastern and western scholar.

I enjoy your articles and thank you very much for your contributions to Vedic culture.

Brother, this is a mythological story , A STORY, A FIGMENT OF IMAGINATION, AN APOCRYPHA, the brahmins have ruled lesser mortals for centuries by concocting such stories and now since proselytization is rampant in hinduism because of divine anathema in it, groups like Agniveer have started fighting a lost cause by rewriting mythology, LOLZ.

Somehow, it is necessary for some people to prove that the religion that existed in India for centuries is not a religion but just a fiction !! People want to show that they are intellectual/secular by disapproving eveything that belongs to the great philosophy that is popularly called Hindu religion. This kind of people are indirectly serving the agenda of the so called “religion of Peace” that propagates lies, and I am afraid if this continues, our great nation will become like the neghibours !! I urge the people to study and understand the depth of philosophy which is only available in India, for their own benifit and feel proud of that, and let me assure that after deep study you will not say that it is fiction !!

Ahem Ahem, Brother , The religion of peace is REAL and its veracity is always substantiated by historical facts, unlike PAGANISM which stems from vivid imagination. It’s sad that some bigots have made their limited human origin thoughts and prejudices binding on lesser mortals like majority lower caste people in India, with the advent of modern education people have started seeing what is true religion and what is HERESY. However the wrath of billions of followers of these occult practices will not stop hunting these so called Vermins, Sad but True. I challenge if you can prove one mythology to be a historical fact , I bet for every claim of yours I can pose 100 counter claims. Mark My Words. Cheers, Amit.

This fellow Krishna Rao is an admin of Agniveer and he will block and allow comments based on his whims n fancy , he blocks the comments which does not suit his agenda. He enjoys with few nerds and illiterate followers of Agniveer and does not dare to come out of his comfort zone to have an open debate in Agniveer’s forum.

there is a particular line: “the event became history, the history became legend, and the legend became myth”

that is all that there is to discuss……………..the history that is being talked about of Islam or Christianity, it is merely 2000 years old, give or take a few years, it does not makes any difference.

the Indian Hindu calender which is called Vikrami Samvat, is dated today for year 2070, which in itself is a fact that in India we have a calender which predates to the modern calender. stating the fact that civilization in India was present before the westerners learned how to write. there is a complete chronology of the India kings from Parikshit (the heir of Pandavas) upto the modern history, if you want to check it, you can find it. the complete list of kings of Magadh from Jarasandh upto Dhananand can be found if you want to. that alone is one proof that, at-least conforms the authenticity of Mahabharat. all you have to do to conform the authenticity of Ramayan is to just match the events with their astrological markers, and you will get the proof of the happening of the event.

the biggest proof of existence of Shri Ram is the presence of Ramsetu. upto 15th century, one could go all the way from Rameshwaram island to Sri lanka by walking on it. and that is a fact.

Amit and Priya.. are the names that some Katuaa is using to deceive the hindu people here… they are by default liers … and are taught in their book to lie when required !! this is what their religion teaches…. dont worry about them. All hindu’s believe that Ram and Krishna are incarnation of GOD… without any doubt…

Next not all Hindus believe Rama is God or an incarnation or godman or superman or x-man or prophet or spiderman or something else. He was just a man.

I, like millions of other Hindus do not even believe in godman or superman or x-man or prophet or spiderman or incarnation or some other nonsense. I do not know what part of the story of Rama is true or not. And that story is not of any sense to me. In fact whatever religion anyone is, there is to much focus by these different religions on their history. In fact those religions can not be a religion without their history. The only religion that can is Vedic Dharam.

The reason Vedic Dharam can exist without anyone knowing its history is because the focus is on the idea and processes not the history. Yes there is history behind everything, but if your religion REQUIRES to know THE HISTORY of that religion and it cannot exist without it, it is a history centric religion. That is the weakness of the entire Abrahamic religion system. You can’t believe in islam without mohammed. It is central to the religion. You can’t just believe in the one God, you need to believe in some fantasied character named mohammed. He is just a man and nothing else. I don’t need him nor does anyone else. I just need the One God and that is it.

I really like the fact that Agniveer bravely confronted Zakir Naik through various online posts and articles. It was and continues to be a great attempt.

However, my problem starts when Agniveer sounds so Arya Samaji all the time. I have a big time problem when Arya Samajis openly say that the 18 Puranas are non-vedic and pure fiction. Nothing could be further from truth. Maharishi Ved Vyaas compiled the Vedas, Upansihads and the Puranas. To look down upon the Puranas is a spiritual offence. Just because we don’t have a logical human explanation of what is written in the Puranas does not make it fictitious. How can anyone understand the Divine through his or her brain. Has God designed the brain or vice-versa?

Kindly stop criticizing the divine scriptures of Sanatana Dharma. Several great acharayas of Sanatana Dharma have validated the shastras. Jagadguru Adi Shankaracharya, Jagadguru Nimbarkacharya, Jagadguru Ramanujacharya, Goswami Tulsidas, Chaitanya Mahaprabhu, Sukhdeo Paramhansa etc To condemn the Puranas is to condemn these great mystics and acharyas. Just because you don’t understand something does not make it a piece of fiction.

Brother Siddharth, Namaste! Aryasamaj is so famous for its hard stand for Dharma and true hinduism that if anybody stands by the same dharma and truths of veda, is attached to aryasamaj. Please come out of such thought. Agniveer and the team is highly learned and the articles are very rational, logical and abide by the very first books of creation, Vedas. Aryasmaj or Agniveer denies any content that is not in accordance with Vedas, may it be purans or kurans. Take the example of this article itself, sita’s agnipariksha. Can anybody come out as-is after entering a big fire. Does it sound rational or logical or scientific. He has critically explained here.

There are many things in purans that are not vedic and such things shouldn’t be taken. I think, Agniveer only criticized the adulterations in purans. Vedas are not adulterated and so they are agreeable any point of time, unlike Purans. Purans cannot be compared with Vedas.

why do we nee Ram?? If u agree that people have adulterated Ramayana,( be it of any belief, it can even be the hindus who wanted to justify the suppression of dalits and women), then it is quite possible that the metaphor of Ram is used as a weapon to crusade against other religions. Though i have not seen your complete website, but what i want to say is that why we still want to carry on with Ram? Let the story and its characters rest in peace, and let the faith in them be a private matter. Publicly applauding ram through some of your posts can be taken in a wrong sense for a wrong selfish purpose.

“Publicly applauding ram through some of your posts can be taken in a wrong sense for a wrong selfish purpose.” can you explain this. You should have said “why do I need Ram” and not “why do we need Ram” . besides why should we not have the true legend of Ram and shun the adulterations for whatever purpose they were done. can you logically support and give the benefits of shunning Ram and not the adulterations that you seem to be advocating? provided you know the moral standards and social standards set by him which are an elixir to a moral and just nation.

i just want to know that If ravan has a SRAP that if he touch any woman which not agri for touch than he was blast or burn in to the fire THAN how he kidnep the sita without touch i think sita is agri for kidnep Sorry confussed?

Lets start answering with loud voice —JAI SHRI RAM Some other frivolous myths from Ramayan that are used to denigrate the noble culture of Hinduism but do not exist are as follows: – Sita exile (entire Uttar Ramayan is fictitious and a latter day cre…

I fully support and stand by Agniveer. One must deduce truth and separate grain from the chaff. Hanuman and others were vannars (VANA + NARA) in other words Kings and Tribal Chieftains of Tamilnadu. Wars are always fought from geographical proximity and kingdom are always separated by geographical features like river, sea, desserts and mountains. To attack Iraq, the US has to come to emirates and use it as launchpad for attack on Iraq. Lord Rama defeated Ravana with army of Vannars who were talking human beings. It is a matter of archaeological research based on mythological facts to trace ancient history of post-vedic period of Ramayan. Mr. Pushkar Bhatnagar has done pioneer work of dating various occasions/events in Rama’s time based on various astronomical configurations mentioned by Saint Balmiki in his work Ramayan. According to Mr. Pushkar Bhatnagar Rama was born onafternoon of January 10, 5114 BC i.e. 7127 years back. Crude method of Vanshvalies or family trees should also support scientific and mathematical method of astronomical dating. Ancient civilisation of Mesopotamia defeated asura kingdom Assyria (present Syria). Most likely it was Devasur Sangram fought by Devta kings who were followers of Vedas against Asuras. Kings of Mesopotamia with capital Babylon were addressed as Indras. There is mention of Indra king in Sumerian (Sumeru Parvat) and Mesopotamian civilizations.

I don’t know what the truth is was never there to if it actually happened or was that just a myth, who cares? Rather than wasting time in verbally proving you are wrong, you are wrong, it would be much better if you use the same time to serve the poor, and followers of science use the same time to find answers that to the sufferings of the same poor and needy, one follows the god the other the science but none of them have taught to create conflicts, to argue for and increase the hatred, dear Science, dear God, show them the Path.

The debate about the authenticity of Ramayana and Mahabharata can be proved with a lot of available proofs.Ram Setu and submerged Dwaraka are greatest examples of the sacred texts.A person not willing to accept it has taken place can still learn a lot from these sacred books.The relations between parents and children,among the children,between a person and sister in law,the son’s accepting vanvas for no fault of his,the helpful Sugreeva,the great bhakta in Hanumanji,the vice of casting an evil eye on other’s wife,the ill’s of alcohol and speculation,the destiny of evil etc.One can lead an ideal life by following these Epics.There is not any thing left for a person to know if he/she understands these two texts.Only one thing I am confused about is the marriage of Draupadi to Pandavas.I need to be enlightened about it.

Dear Agniveer, I can not thank you enough for this article!! When I was a little girl I watched the Ramayan series on tv with my father. I was simply mesmerized by Sita and Ram, to me they were the ultimate couple ever! So beautiful, perfect and so in love. So when the agnipariksha happened I was in complete shock! Like, where the hell did this come from!? It seemed so out of the blue and unlogical, and Ram seemed so out of character. I remember feeling really hurt and wanting to cry. When growing up I’ve always thought of Ramayan fondly, but the pariksha always stuck out as a sore thumb.

Now as a woman I understand where the hurt comes from. The pariksha wasn’t only an insult to Sita, but for all women! If Sita says she is pure, then Ram should have believed it and just take her home. Not let her undergo such a dangerous (lethal!) and humiliating test just to prove something to his subjects!? That one act sends of so many negative messages! 1) A woman’s word can not be trusted. 2) If an abducted woman was adulterous or even raped (!!!) then she might as well jump and die in a fire. 3) What society thinks is more important than what a married couple think about their relationship, even if they are a king and queen.

So there you have it. That’s a lot of harmful messages. I have no doubt in my mind that this pariksha has had rammifications on Indian women. Thank you Agniveer for showing me that the agnipariksha could very well have been fabricated. I simply refuse to believe that Ram was this monstrous and that innocent Sita (and thus womankind) was hurt and humiliated this way.

RESPECTED AGNIVERR JI…NAMASTE I WANT TO ASK YOU A QUESTION, YOU SAY THAT IN ANCIENT PERIOD THERE WAS NO ANY PRINTING MACHINE, SO THE SCRIPTURES WERE PRESERVED BY THE HAND WRITTEN AND MEMORY….SO THERE WAS BIG ADULTERATION IN THIS SCRIPTURES…AGNIVEER JI I WANT TO KNOW THAT IF SUCH TYPES OF ADULTERATION CAN TAKE PLACE IN “RAMAYAD”,”MAHABHARAT”,”MANUSMRITI” AND THESE TYPES OF ARYAN SCRIPTURE TO INSULT THE HINDUISM THEN WHY THESE ADULTERATION WAS NOT DONE IN THE GREATEST ARYAN SCRIPTURE “VEDAS”????????

Yet another excellent piece of work! For vested interests, people adulterated the original works, it has logically been proved by you! However, by your accounts, as you write Hanuman was not a monkey, that sounds quite logical also, even Tulsidas could not get the right guidance. Though, whatever you have written, will be difficult for ordinary Hindus to believe initially, I know, the educated class knows, there is the truth of hard work in your research!

Hi Arpit, yes I’ve heard somewhere as well that Hanuman wasn’t a monkey. It was more like a tribe that lived in the jungle. They were like jungle people, quite ferocious-looking but still humans! It makes more sense doesn’t it?

Yes, Hanuman was not monkey. He belonged to a tribe Vanar. Hanuman was great scholar of Veda and a monkey can not be scholar of Veda. Rama himself acknowledge it when he met with Hanuman and said to Laksman about Hanuman न अन् ऋग्वेद विनीतस्य न अ\-\-यजुर्वेद धारिणः | न अ\-\-साम वेद विदुषः शक्यम् एवम् विभाषितुम् || ४-३-२८ “Nay…the non-knower of Rig Veda, or the non-rememberer of Yajur Veda, or the non-scholar of Saama Veda… can possibly, or truly speak this way… [4-3-28]

From hereon Rama’s analysis of Hanuma is depicted. In Rig Veda every letter has too many phonetically deflected variations, in many ways to mean many things. It is practically impossible to contain that knowledge, unless the recitalist has complete control over it. Hence the word, viniita , ‘well trained’ is used. In Yajurveda many anuvaaka-s or passages occur recursively, with different utilisation. Remembering not to mix one with the other is a difficult process. Hence the recitalist has to have enormous remembrance. In Saamaveda the pitch and duration of the rendering is of high importance, as such it requires a scholarly bent to control vocal notes. The three words, vinaya, schooling;

From reading this article, it “Appears” that a good research has been done. However, I totally disagree.

When someone tries to understand the God and his work during one of his several incarnations such as Bhagwan Ram, he first has to get the divine power to understand that. As you always mention Vedas, you can find it written there at several places that only by the grace of God you would understand what, why, who about him.

So no one can realize the God or know\understand him just by reading few pages here and there, and indeed it does not come by just being an alumni of IIT or IIM or being a high rank official.

Therefore, I would rather believe Ramayan by Tulsidas Ji rather than your version and interpretation of Ramayan. However, it appears that you just don’t believe that Ram was Bhagwan himself and you try to interpret and accept everything which you can understand and do.

We don’t have to go that far, just look few of the great saints of modern history (Saibaba of Sirdi, Tulsidas, Chitanya Mahaprabhu, Naamdev Ji, Tukaram Ji, Gyanyeswar etc..) and I suppose you can not explain most of the miracles they did, even though they were just saints 🙂 and you are trying to explain what Ram did whom most of us consider GOD 🙂 .

It is true that Ramayana & Mahabharata are the epics which was written thousands of year ago and todays editions of these epics were not same as it was originally written. It is difficult to identify which is the addition and which is corrupted. If you simply say that Uttar Kand is fiction, the verses of eating meat & liquar are additions,the verses mentioning about Tathagat Buddha is the addition then it is difficult to accept your books as how can you extract the original draft from the corrupt version. Early history of Rakshas and Vanaras were mentioned in Uttar Kand. The story of Kush-Lava & ashwamedha yadnya,the story of Valmiki, the story of Bharat & Shatrughna’s war with gandharvas & asuras will be fiction. Do not come to any conclusion. The story of Ramayana is available in south-east & southern shrilanka does not match with our Ramayana.But these countries were under the influence of Ravana so it is quiet possible that along with Valmiki some other peoples in south must have written about Ramayana. Ancient Paintings of Ramayana is available in etruscan musium in Italy. Pl see the Ramayana by Pt Satawalekar(swadhyay mandal,Pardi,Gujarat).Also see the research on Ramayana by Dr M A Chanserkar. There are some discripancies in your article.

Dear Agniveerji, Very first thing is that do not entertain Muslims & Christian on this site as they do not have respect towards hinduism.Their religions are not permitting them to do so. If any non hindu who really hates his religion for the bad things in it and really want to respect hinduism then & then he/she should welcome.

@Agniveer Your own Hindu people are against you then for what you doing all this. I assure If you go to a Hindu preacher say Sita Agnipriksha is adulteration/fabricated story they will say you are anti-Hindu & slap on your face. Yesterday when I given your sister concern website article regarding Hanuman was not Vanar (Monkey) but a human being like Ram, Lakasman etc. क्या हनुमान आदि वानर बन्दर थे?http://agniveerfans.wordpress.com/2013/02/24/hanuman/ They said whoever preaching this the person is anti-Hindu and want to destroy Indian culture. Overall my aim to write this you are spreading hate and even your Hindu people against you.

your wrong no learned hindu would do that maybe evil ignorant hindus/brahmins would do that and if some pagan hindus are against arya samaj/agniveer it is because they are have believed in what they have heard and watched from ignorant hindus who have been influenced by the people who tried to attack hinduism and have believed them

Yes, Satyavan is speaking the truth. In simplest example – It is like you have burnt into your dreams and will not get any feel any hurt when you awake. I am not saying spiritual world is like a dream but yes as dreams are reality, spiritual regimes are also reality and more real than actual world which we perceive through our senses. But, believe senses have limited capacity only.. there are species which percieve things differently from what we perceive. So, thru Yoga, one can enter into extra-sensory realm or spiritual world. This spiritual world is more bright, lightful, Blissful than whatever best and most luxurious thing you have tought of in this world. So, please ignorance is not always a bliss… as Bliss is still awaiting you to knock at its door. You will feel as mysticism, but yes this is the reality and gist of Vedas. So, to feel and live Vedas, you have to understand and practice Yoga to see the truth. Until then please enjoy this World!!!

Dear, it is a spiritual truth and rather a very obvious truth. We are into this world under the clutches of senses, can not percieve anything which is more illustrious and bright. Our mind can not allow us to see beyond a capacity of brightness as we can not hear more than 20K Hertz of sound. Similarly we can not see beyond certain brightness, etc. We are in well as it is said a “Bhav-koop” and so we need to go beyond it thru regular practice of Kriya-Yoga to see the light beyond lights, hear sound beyond sounds, feel bliss beyond happiness. It is not mysticism.. it is as real as you an I in ordinary perception.

I believe in you Tripathi ji. You have rightly said that if it was there, it would have been a spiritual fire. Even if ordinary fire, then it was a spiritual event and only great Yogis can enter into that Agni without getting any harm. However, Agniveer’s mission is different. agniveer wants to put the Hindu Dharma in right note and present to the world as most rational and logical religion, that it is, and hence, Agniveer choses to provide logical reasoning for every event. In that way he is more correct as per demand of time (Kaliyug) and we shoul applaud him for his endevor.

sir, how can you confirm that what was written in Ramayan or Mahabharat for that fact is not true to the word? before 1950 if a person says that a man can see & commune with another with a difference of thousands of miles is a possibility, that the form of entertainment we experience today is possible, will that seem as a reality to you or just a sort if insane imagination of that person?

how can we be sure of the fact that the stories of aerial warfare, existence of planes, submarines or for that matter of space ships was not present?

the ruins of Harappa & Mohan jo Daro were found in 1922, before the first nuclear explosion or for that fact, concept of nuclear energy was unknown to the modern mankind. these ruins are confirmed findings of the most radioactive ruins (extent of radioactivity equivalent to those of Hiroshima & Nagasaki, assumed during the actual happening of the event at these ruins). the concept of nuclear bomb was taken from the description of Brahmastra from the Mahabharat. if one concept can be realised, then how can we be sure about that other such instants mentioned in these stories is not true? it is said in our texts that only humans or mankind has the capability of rising to the greatness equal to that of a God, or to fall to the depths of depravity & cruelty equal to that of a demon or a devil (both are quite extremes). try it and you will find both possibilities (in our history), so how is anything that is said in MahaBharat & Ramayan can be termed as impossible acts (be that the swallowing of sun or reaching Lanka in one jump or burning the whole lanka with a burning tail)? in a movie i had heard a line “and the things which should not have been forgotten, were lost. the history became legend, and the legend became myth” seems like what happened with these two books.

Mughal emperor Humayun (1508-1556) was the first to try a royal fiat against sati. He was met with resistance from the local Hindu population. Akbar (1542–1605) was next to issue official general orders prohibiting sati and insisted that no woman could commit sati without the specific permission of his Chief police officers. The Portuguese banned the practice in Goa by about 1515. [20] The Dutch and﻿ the French banned it in Chinsurah and Pondichéry, their respective colonies.

sati was the most cruel part in indian history,it started b;cse the occupying islamic force after defeating even raped the dead bodies of the women who have killed themself out of fear being rape.for this purpose the womens killed themself by imolating.i will ask u one question in hindu tradition does women go to the place of cremation or not,it is no,then where is the question of sati arising.it all started mainly because of invading muslims (eg) prithviraj chauvan story..regarding GOA,The portugese were worst in the name of inquisiation they wiped out the entire Hindu population,converted the to christianity ,thats why we find many christians in goa. i will provide simple Eg from history to understand what our religion teaches. Christianity=In the name of religion they wiped out the entire civilization of aztec,Incas,aborginal of newzeland,australia & killed many in africa & converted them ISLAM = In name of Religion they almost killed many & converted all of them,Eg –U itself know Hindus–,In name of religion we have not killed any body ,we dont coerce or convert ,we have never invaded any country,we were the only country in the world that has not prosecuted jews,we were called as the Land of knowledge even by the GREEKS, what else do u need to get convined

evidences??? they just need confirmation by the westerners that it is so. one european or american says it in front of media, and they will start believing in it. that is all that is needed to make us realize of our own heritage.

one will die screaming that Sanatan Dharm is the true religion and all other religions are just a sect following some man’s teachings which that person took as he understood them from Sanatan Dharm, but we, especially Hindus will never believe the fact.

Thnk u arunesh for ur time and info, it cleared my doubt to sum extent. Bt still thnk it would have bettr if a direct battle take place between ram and bali. It is uniqueness of hinduism that being a believer v can debate on our believes,it helps to purify hinduism.

Jai Sri Ram! Sid, thank you. Actually there was no need of a direct battle and hence it was not happened. As Agniveer ji has said above that to kill a Terrorist, direct battle is not required. We must understand whn a battle or dharm-yuddha can happen. During those days, yuddha was allowed for following reasons: 1. To take control of a territory or cattles or gold 2. To judge the supremacy or might over other

These were 2 legal reasons for a battle. Anything else apart from these 2 was not considered as battle. So, with Baali, there was no contention for land, cattle, gold or anything. The only option left was to do a “Vadh” or “Removal of Nuisance”.

Dear Agniveer ji: I can give you the explanations for soe of the questions about Ramayana: Q1: Sita was accepted afte fire-test? Ans: We need to understand the background of this event. Those rishis and greats present there were not torturers. And, Sri Ram has never asked ma Sita to go for any kind of test!!! As, Ma Sita was in enemy’s house for almost an year, it was suggested to go for a re-marriage of Ram and Sita as part of reunion. Sita ji asked Lakshman ji to make arrangements of fire so that Ram and Sita both of them can take “rounds” again as they did in their marriage to reaffirm the oaths of 7 steps. After this ritual, Agni Dev appeared and did a kanya-daan again to sri Ram as per the need of ritual. So, there was no Agni-pareeksha, instead of it was “Agni-parikrama”. People have described in rather -ve terms. Q2: Shambook, the shudra, was killed by Sri Ram? Ans2: As you also know the Vedas are the most sacred and divine. It was the duty of a just monarch to protect the sanctity and originality of Vedas. Therefore, it was the law to protect the original meaning and texts of Vedas. These were to be transferred from a Vedic Guru to his/her disciples only. There was no other method accepted as that may adulterate the divine book. Shambook was the person who started understanding and reading Vedas by his own and was not able to understand the divine knowledge from them. There was a threat from him that it may contaminate the true meaning of verses and it will spread darkness in the society. This has to be removed. Sri Ram asked him to stop reading and talking about the meaning of verses as you can’t understand. You should understand it thru a Guru. Shambooka refused and hence there was only the choice to capture him. I doubt that he was killed, but yes he must have been stopped from corrupting Vedas!!

Sid, through this Sri Ram has presented a good example/good lesson for every Hindu too. We should not refrain ourselves from removing any evil either from front or from back. An evil is evil and ultimate goal of a righteous person should be to remove the evil from any side. This suffice the moral and social justification of killing of Baali. If you still want to blame, then another logic is for the people who dont understand Dharma nor Hinduism. Some additional reasons of killing the Baali: 1. Baali was behaving like an animal and he was hunted down by Sri Ram as hunters hunt a wild animal. 2. Baali was going to kill Sri Ram’s firend Sugreeva (who was under the protection of Sri Ram), and to save the life of Sugriva, Ram had to kill him from far, else, Sugriva could not survive. 3. Baali had usurped the wife of his brother. Sugriva told about this to Sri Ram that how Baali has broken his trust and wounded his heart. So, for the person who had deceived the real-brother must be punished by a deceive-act and this is the law of Karma. He deceived Sugriva, he was killed from a hide-out. 4. Baali was having super-natural power (not sure and illogical for today’s man, still want to quote here), and got a boon from Brhma Deva that nobody can kill you from front. So, to keep the honour of Brhma Dev’s boon, Sri Ram Killed Baali from behind. Hopefully, these few logical reasons will help you.

I do not accept this explanation. Lord Rama violated at least three yudha dharma.

1. One should not attack an enemy engaged in combat with other person. 2. One should not attack an enemy without warning. 3. One should not attack a person from a hiding. 4. One who is not a part of war should not engage in attack at all.

I don’t know why you are trying to explain everything on the Hindu scriptures. My understanding about Rama is like this. Krishna gave the impression and signs that he is none but Lord Vishnu himself immediately after his birth. From the second to until his death he lived as Bhagwan only. He performed miracles and people around him were not not surprised by that. He was known as Bhagwan. Even in many places of Mahabharata, Krishna is directly referred as Bagwan and not by his name.

But Rama took birth as an ordinary human and he died as an ordinary human. This Sita’s test could be an indication that no human is away from mistakes. Or before the people doubt or talk about Sita’s purity, Rama himself has forced her to prove her as pure by the best test possible so there would not be any doubt about her in the minds of people.

Please let me know if i am right or wrong. I am telling u wht i know from other sources, it can be correct or not. Bali asked some questions to Lord Ram. He said, the war was between me and Sugreev,I had no enmity with you. In such condition, is it morally correct to kill me?Lord Ram replied, enemy of our friend is also our enemy. The injustice which u had done, and the sins which you had committed have forced me to kill you.Our greatest religion is to fullfill our promise and when we raghuvanshi make a promise to anyone, we fulfill it at any cost (Praan jaye par vachan na jaye). He said to Bali, that at this time of death, you talk abt dharm, truth and justice but u never followed it in your own life! You yourself are unknown of these things. When u dont know its meaning, how come today suddenly u start preaching abt Dharm? When ur critising me for killing you, u look like an innoscent person. U had zero idea abt dharm. Leave apart dharm, u were so much poisoned by your huge strength, that u even disrespected the very common moral ethics. Younger bro, son and disciple, are considered equal. Sister, Younger bro wife (bhabhi) and daughter in law (bahu) , all are to be considered as daughter. But u dishonored the social, ethical or family morals. Sugreev made no fault, but still u kicked him out of kingdom and did injustice to him. And u took away his wife and kept her as your own wife, which is totally wrong (adharm) ! Bali said, i accept i am sinner, but still, only king has the right to punish, why did u try to make justice and punish me? Lord Ram replied to Bali, that dont be so arrogant and jst remember, that this whole earth belongs to the Ikshvaku king (Manu was first man and Ishwaku was his son and founder of surya vansh) . This time, Bharat is the ruler of Ikshvaku dynesty. Since I am obeying Bharat’s command, and also i am a part of Ikshvaku dynesty,so its my dharam and responsibility to love and protect all the creatures in this area. Hey Bali, dharma is subtle in nature, its very hard to understand it! Jst remember that whn king punishes a person for his sin, the sinner gets pure aftr getting punishment, but if king dont punish sinner, the king must pay for that sin. This is as per Manusmiriti. The sins which you have made, ur death is justified as per dharam! Bali realizes and says that he feels that the cover which was blinding his mind and soul, they have opened and he feels very happy to realise the path of truth and dharma. He apologized Lord Ram fr whtever he blamed at him. He said i have realized who are you! Before i die, please let me touch your feets and please let me do pryashit ( repent). Lord Ram said, after getting punishment, u are purified now. U already got ur punishment and u have realised ur mistake. So cast out the fear of death frm ur heart now. We shall give u treatment, and let u become healthy and pray fr ur long life. But Bali said, hey lord, I dont want to remain alive. It is a rarest among rarest apportunity that a person’s soul leaves his body through your hands. Every one gets struck in the cycle of birth and rebirth, but I am very lucky to obtain MOKSHA (salvation) from your hands. I will never get such death again in any births. So i have no wish to live now, i want to achieve you now.The death which i am getting today, in front of that death, the entire universe is inferior! Then he orders his brother Sugreev that he will rule the kingdom and help Lord Ram to fullfill fight against evil. He also ordered his son Angad, that he should stay in shadow of Lord Ram and help him to fight against evil. So evn Bali did not find it wrong whn Lord Ram Killed him. In fact he was very happy to get killed by Lord Ram and happily accepted that death which was his path to moksha (salvation).

As per Valmiki Ramayana :- There is nothing like whatever u vomited above ..

Ram was stated that Vali diverted from the path of DHARMA , was frivolous without consulting the elders who are wise was committing his act as per his whims.

Ram continued that “You are a sinner, since you are transgressing under the impulse of passion towards Ruma, your daughter-in-law when the great self Sugriva is alive.(a younger brother is like a son and his wife is like a daughter-in-law).

“We too have to follow Bharata’s (Follower of Dharma) command and determined to punish those wicked people who deviated from the norms of dharma. ” <<- This Shows this Responsibility as a KING , which is not just for his Kingdom's subject , It is against any Adharma)

Later on Vali realized his Mistake and in Grievance admitted this mistake and praise Lord Ram for following his DHARMA and KARMA.. Lord Ram was indeed Great and Reedemer of all.

It’s indeed a great job done. Like today’s sikhs waering turban(as an integral part of their body), the Vaanaras also used to wear monkey attire for some reason but surely they were not monkeys. I think people like Agniveer(might be a maharshi incarnated) should put in their god/nature gifted inquisitive/research mind in unearthing the truth in all available vaidik scriptures. If you read any book, you can see that adultration has taken place and the reality is masked. Krishna used his experience and knowledge to usurp pandavas into victory and surely not any miracle. It was a sheer commonsense which we also have but do not know how to use. Geetha must be an elaboration of what krishna has said in an abstract way. All said and done, it’s really a great work and being a staunch follower of VAIDIK system, I whole heartedly support this venture

We had an interview with a scientist who perceives Ramayana scientifically. He has written a wonderful book “Valmiki Ramayanam, A scientist’s view”. This definitely gives a clarity that Bharat was not only advanced in their lifestyle, but also in science and technology, arts and astronomy. As Agniveer points out, the agni-pariksha could well be an adulterated one as it simply does not match with the intellectual level that is portrayed in Ramayana.

When one reads Ramayana, many places of adulterations are obvious because they do not match the high level of thinking displayed elsewhere. Indeed, it seems as if Science & technology was quite advanced in that era.

Dear Agniveer, Above you have said that it seems that the science and technology was quite advanced in that era. I assume that you mean that it is very much possible that it was more advanced than it is now. If the above is correct then many of their deeds are likely to look like ‘magic’ to us now. E.g. 150 years back if you showed a TV to someone , they would think you to be a magician. So is it not possible that many of the so called magical things mentioned in the Ramayana and Mahabharat were actually possible at that time?

It could be if it is consistently depicted. But if there is inconsistency in such magical events, and the reason behind such magical events is frivolous, then that is not acceptable to rational minds. For example, there could be better tests to check for chastity than jumping into fire which is test of fire-proofness. And then all devatas coming to convince Ram and make him recall that he is lord of all. Does God have a forgetful memory? Or does He do such drama in front of His own people to enact such dramas. The whole story is full of loopholes explained by nothing but adulterations.

Yes, If rama/Krishna was God why did not they opened this before the whole world during his life time. Why was he frightening to open this. If this can be disclosed after the death of Rama that he was god why not this could not be revealed to all during his life time. He could have said that he is almighty and he came on earth to teach the people how to live and learn from his every activity. And all the incident and activities could have been recorded through video & audio to convince the next generation.

@Agniveer Agni : Which ERA ? What ERA ? You mean to say that in that imaginary ERA science was so developed in our country that a Monkey was able to cross 16 crore km non-stop to swallow a relatively smaller star called SUN which is 1,10,000 times bigger than planet earth. In that imaginary ERA , Ravan was flying a plane which was guided through his mind to go anywhere in the Solar System, Milky Way and even beyond, who knows he might have been to Andromeda galaxy too :P. In that imaginary ERA Human was able to form from the dirts of Parvati and later when he was beheaded by Shiva (in a state of oblivion) , again brought back to life by replacing his human head with an elephant head. Lots of Laugh :))) , I am sure you must be one brahmin bigot , the race which is the BANE of India. By the way do you know even Hary Pottor, Spiderman , Superman series are better fiction stories than Ramayana & Mahabharat ?

@suv, you seem to be a paid agent of Xtian missionaries. Even if you are born into a Hindu family as you claim, you are like a Jaichand to the Hindus. You don’t have any knowledge whatsoever on the Vedic Sanatana Dharma, and your ignorance and bigotry makes you speak like this. The Vedic religion is the most scientific, rational and humanist religion in the world. When you speak about the so-called “unscientific” supernatural events described in the Vedic scriptures, note that nothing is impossible for God and the other divine beings (demigods, angels and rishis). And please stop insulting Hinduism like this, else one day the soldiers of Hindutva will get you ! Anti-Hindu creatures like you are the BANE of India !

there is nothing wrong with agniparksh neither about 16000 wives of krishna and claim rama,lakshman and sita ate meat if you understand the the story you will realise these are just liars made to attack hinduism

Sir, It would be very nice if you could find and put the translations of yamala and amalas on net like rudrayamala. Their translation is hard to find on net .they are great sanskrit litrature of later vedic era.

Mahatman, I am reading Malayalam ramayan, many areas with wet eyes. Especially when SriRam departs Dasarath. And when Kousalya sent Ram to Forest. I am very sure that these stories teache us good lessons and I beleive that was the intention of the author. Adulterations in Ramayan and Mahabharatha should be removed by the great pundits Ofcourse we should consider Vedas are the Basic.

Also I request the pundits please explain difference between the following. Vedas,Upanidshads,Ithihasas,Puran,Brahmanas, Aranyakas Thanks

i have no problem with agniveer or it’s intentions. i could truly appreciate the works except for the situations it try to fool people, sometimes. a bad situation will occur when people will use your article in some place and still ge defeated by haters of hinduism that they know half truth.

your statement is //In Chapter 114, Ram states that women are respected by the respect they get from nation and their own habits. Any kind of restriction on women – of home, dress code, boundary – in order to protect their respect is unwise.//

Well done agniveer! I totally agree with agneevir. Many of our scriptures and books are CLEVERLY & BEAUTIFULLY ADULTERATED that u can not catch them and u think that our religion teaches wrong things. Those things which are beyond genuine reasoning, they should be ignored as corrupted knowledge!

You are right that over centuries a lot of fiction & myths have crept into our epics. I recently finished reading Dr. Narendra Kohli’s “Abhyuday – Ram katha”. Its a work of fiction, very well written. The author has successfully portrayed Ram as an ordinary human being who rises to highest levels by setting himself high standards. Similarly over last centuries/millennia many such works of fiction might have changed a few dimensions of the legend. Thanks a lot for your effort in clearing some myths about Ramayan, which undoubtedly touches the hearts of all Hindus. Please keep up this effort.

You have not read other stories, and you had not watched Sagar Ramayana. First it is some points disagreeable. In the story Sita had changed her formed and her jewelry had changed. /This is the main point, for it reasons not sati. Second historically before Muslim invasions no one had in Indian culture burned women or practiced Sati started with Padmani Johar. This is an important point that before India’s dark ages such practices were not existence..

So in Ramayana Sagar’s Ramayana it was not a test of chastity but something called her shadow hence the famous change in jewelry. Now there many related Indian stories which wives use their shadow to care for their husband while away, now wife of Surya Dev is an example. But yes, I agree there is inconsistency then too. Why then the emotion? It is very likely to justify Sati in the Dark ages had been written this part of Ramayana.

What I strongly disagree with you about monkeys, and you probably living a babus lifestyle/education have severe indifference to animals as the English language that refers to them as its.

Further you forget the setting of millions of years ago that identify places that were then plains, now hills and mountains. This arrogance of your will hurt the overall stories that monkeys were human beings. Even in Ramayana most monkeys were not smart like Hanuman, nor speaks to evolution which Hindu dhrama seems to support.

Draupadi married to Yudhishthir. Nowhere does Draupadi refer to any other Pandava as husband. Arjun won her in Swayamvar but she married to Yudhishthir as per norms that elder brother marries first.

Krishna rescued 16000 plus women from clutches of Narakasur. He gave them shelter and support as they had no place to go. It is a latter day imagination that he married them. If he were to marry 16000 women, it would take him years to complete the rituals, assuming he did nothing else. Krishna had only one wife – Rukmani.

If this is true that she married only to Yudishtir, then the following may also got adulterated, is it so?

1. Arjuna’s 12 year exile, where he begets Pasupatha and other divine weapons in the Himalayas. This he does after having entered the chamber of Yudishtir and Panchali. 2. Draupadi’s falling on the Maha Prastana Yatra where Yudishtir explains Bheema that “heart of hearts, she had an extra love for Arjun, and that befall her”. and there may be many. Can you throw more light on the debunking of these verses, maybe in a different article?

In general, all those instances that rely on miracles are dubious. Arjun’s exile was definitely not for ascetic exile as mentioned in story. It was perhaps for political purpose. Mahaprashthan Yatra is definitely an adulteration. Because all Vedic texts provide a different concept of death, heaven, hell. In Mahabharat itself, there are verses that say that many wrong verses have been added. There are references that Mahabharat kept expanding over times. Original Mahabharat must be a very small part of current version. Some scholars have done specific research on this. We would try to bring their research in mainstream in coming times. However, the overriding rule is that Vedas must be benchmark. All other texts are prone to adulterations and hence acceptable only to extent they comply with Vedas.

What about Gitopadesh by Krishna to Arjuna? Was it a later addition?After or during war Krishna said to the author what he told Arjuna or kept a diary just like as we write a diary of our daily routine?

i think you are a great believer of science,which is responsible for almost 90%of ills of todays society. regarding miracles i believe you have not witnessed one, even today you have a swami in trichy who sleeps on fire in front of scientists a yogi who lives without food and water in ahmedabad for which the doctors have no answer. there are thousands of vedas,mahabharatha,ramayana of different traditions in india and nobody knows with is right and which is wrong.so agniveer version is another one or another manipulation to suit their idealogy and teachings. even in gita krishna says in certain verses vedas can give material happiness when sacrifices as prescribed is done and not the eternal happiness. in the end he says forget all dharmas and surrender to me i will release you from all karmas.

from which it is clear that namajapa is the only refuge in kaliyuga. which has has been taught by many yogis and yoginis who has bron from time to time

The Shreemad Bhagwad Geeta, which i have read, shows Sanjay as the narrator of conversation going on between Supersoul Krishna and his disciple/ friend Arjun. I have heard, that Maharshi Vyasa gave spritual vision to Sanjay that he can see everything occurring in battle filed of Kurushetra , while sitting inside palace. So Sanjay is seeing the conversation between Supersoul Krishna and Arjun and narrating it to Dhritrashtra.

Agniveer is fighting for a lost cause. hinduism / paganism is full of apocryphal, made up, cooked up cock n bull stories & figment of imagination, light years far from science & truth. No wonder our country is ranked 136 now in terms of human development index and we are suffering from the menace of over-population & corruption. I attribute all the problems to this paganism culture, the root cause of all evil. Looks like there is a divine anathema which has come upon to our country because of this paganism/occultism/satanism. Every concept in hindu mythology is diabolical & fiendish including the vedas.

@suv Please you are a devious Christian bigot who sees everything through the awful prejudiced teachings of Christianity where only their particular narrow minded denomination is divine and all other religions even other Christian denominations are “satanic” – not just different but satanic. What a sick religion you follow. This is typical of the two Jewish derivative faiths Christianity and Islam. No other religion talks about other religions like this. This is an Abrahamic religion sickness. Only the real Jews who follow Judaism don’t bother other religions. Jews don’t need the whole world to convert to Judaism unlike its pathetic two derivative faiths, Christianity and Islam. And though Jews may not agree with other faiths I have never heard a Jew describe other faiths as evil. It is a great pity the two derivative Jewish faiths did not hold to that Jewish decency. India you ridiculous Christian bigot under Hinduism was a center of wealth and leaning. Even Julius Cesar dreamed of going to India. No one travels miles to a place of zero wealth. From ancient times to the Muslim evil Imperialist hordes, Christopher Columbvus, and European (Britain, French and Portuguese) Imperialism and colonialism, India’s richness on multiple levels beckoned.

@Arun : Oh C’mon man, I am born n brought up in an orthodox hindu family and a patriot hindustani. Rather You sound like a bigot and lunatic. Are you telling me that a monkey would travel 16 crore km crossing empty space to swallow a relatively small star called SUN which is 1,10,000 times bigger than planet earth. are you forcing me to believe such nonsense concocted, fabricated stories ?? Mythologies are based on Myths & legends and can be merely categorised as folk tales. I rest my case.

Have you ever heard of the idiom, “Don’t throw the baby with the bath water.” It is popular idiom in America that means to not throw out the good things with the bad things. You see over the centuries, Hinduism has built up a lot of negative things that have nothing to do with the Vedas. Examples would be caste system. But if you look into the Vedas there is no mention of Caste, it was made up.

Now in regards to mythology, yes, I agree, I don’t believe in any of that myths. Nor does the Vedas. Vedas never talks about monkeys or Rama or Krishna being Gods. Actually the Vedas do not recognize son of god/s, prophets, godman, incarnations, or any of that nonsense. It does not want man to put other people on pedestals. The Vedas only talk about a Rishi. Rishi is anyone who meditated, and connected directly with God, basically becoming enlightened. And anyone of us can become a Rishi. It isn’t preserved for some specific person in some specific time. If you actually read the Vedas you would know this.

@suv : It seems you have never been in the company of people who engage in logical and constructive argument. let me show you why. hinduism / paganism is full of apocryphal, made up, cooked up cock n bull stories & figment of imagination, light years far from science & truth. First you use hinduism and paganism interchangeably, so you have no idea of what separates the two. second,you have assumed and based the second part of your argument on your limited knowledge and that too of some hanuman vandana written, i believe by Tulsidas, then you endorse your credibility by saying that you were born in an orthodox Hindu family, rather you should have said “orthodox ignorant Hindu family”, seeing the sate of your knowledge about things you are opining on . No wonder our country is ranked 136 now in terms of human development index and we are suffering from the menace of over-population & corruption. –How exactly did you come up with this relation? it would be a good read for you,which says that india and china were the richest in the world about 2000 years ago, how could this happen(after all as per your this is not possible)http://www.knowledge-economy.net/uploads/documents/2012/briefs/KEN%20Brief,%20No.%2024,%20Year%202.pdf but this report also very conspicuously ignores the ginormous impact of colonization of the so called “pagans”(hindu indian, bhuddist china) in your Christianized terms, that all raw material for the industrial revolution was shipped from here for no cost and the finished good were dumped back.

but this report also very conspicuously ignores the ginormous impact of colonization of the so called “pagans”(hindu indian, bhuddist china) in your Christianized terms, that all raw material for the industrial revolution was shipped from here for no cost and the finished good were dumped back. I attribute all the problems to this paganism culture, the root cause of all evil. Looks like there is a divine anathema which has come upon to our country because of this paganism/occultism/satanism. Every concept in hindu mythology is diabolical & fiendish including the vedas. Here then comes the final sweeping statement of our so well read and knowledgeable scholar which supposedly starts with an “I” 🙂 , who has no knowledge of the matter of the Veda, setting aside the what is called here as mythology. Ramayan and Mahabharat are NOT mythology as they did happen and have historical evidence unlike most of the made up christian history. and for your information hanuman chalisa is not part of either. so wake up and stop blabbering.

@suv Please. Referring to other religions as “paganism” “diabolical” “fiendish” and “satanism” is pure Christianity. The Christian bigotry you as trying to pass off speaks for its self. Those are not words of an agnostic or an atheist. You don’t believe in myths, well Satan is the Middle Eastern Christian religion’s myth of a big bad angel named Satan that fell from heaven running a torture chamber called hell. Satanism is rituals to this Christian myth of an Evil being. No one cares if you don’t believe, but you are not here commenting on this site merely to express your disbelief, but to demonize Hinduism for the purpose of weakening belief so to make Hindus easy prey for Christian proselytizers. You see Agniveer as effective and this effectiveness is what you are going after. Continue with your disbelief. No one cares about you not believing. Who cares even if it is true you were born into a Hindu family, clearly you are not one now. There is no reason to come to a Hindu site and be all hot and bothered by those who believe in it. There are plenty of non-Hindu sites on the web. Knock your self out.

I find this a bit confusing. On your website, I have read in two separate articles that Krishna had only one wife..Rukmini. In Vishnu Sahsranamam…in the Dhyanam Section…the last verse of the Dhyaanam section says “Rukmini Satyabhamabhyam Sahitam Krishnamashrayae”. What does this mean. If Rukmini was his only wife then why is Satyabhama’s name here?

even 16000 friends are not possible.i can’t remember names of 16000 persons.How would I have 16000 wives?How will I contact to them?Loving 16000 wives would mean spending 16000 days only in love.ie.4.38 years in just showing the love.More 4.38 years to get married with them.Total of 8.76 years.Nearly nine year din just marriaging and getting personal information will take more 4.38 years.Adding 12.14 years.more than tweleve years in just marriaging,personal information and seeing with the eyes of love.But we sleep for 8 hours and go office for 8 hours.8+8=16.Remaining 8 hours in those three works.So the whole task will take 36.52 years.So,did Krishna spent his full life only in doing marriages till he did not aged?Its so koking.Hence the said story of 16000 wives is a myth.

Sounds logical! However, I would like to make a correction here. Lord Krishna had 2 wifes. Rukmini and Satyabhaama. As per the mythology, Satyabhaama goes along with Krishna to fight the evil Narakasur, which signifies the victory of good over evil. We celebrate Diwali on that occassion! Can’t justify it though; But, its a fact that he had two wifes.

I really apreciate efforts by agniveer……ram is. A pure. Soul the proof is today also we find majority hindu community ek patni… We r lucky to have ideal real hero. Like ram whos name itself source of power

Excellent peace of work Agniveer ji ! I do not understand why our so called intellectuals and Ram katha vachak not able to tell the truth to the people. They actually not able to defend this logically but create another magic stories !

Please let us know if we can also contribute to this great work being done by you .

Actually I am also a normal person .We are fortunate Enough to Visit this Site. I have joined Hands with another person and we are planning to explain “Science in Vedas” to schools and Colleges. My friend too has many more friends who are interested in this. So I think the best way to help agniveerji in this noble cause is to join hands with like minded people locally and take plans to Spread the vedas.

Dr.Vartak has written a book on exact date of ramayan. The acurate description of position of nakshatra given in ramayan was plotted in software. It gave date. As per dr.Vartak if the epic was false then such acurate date for each and every important event. was not possible.

//So they lose an opportunity to be purposeful in life, consider themselves as chemical reactions and become greatest victims!// to be purposeful why you need to imagine things? if atheists ask for evidence of existance soul then? although i see this comment completely irrelevant.

As a matter Of Fact , Vedas laid down the Foundation of Civilization in this Planet. India was scientifically,philosophically,spiritually,intellectually and materially Rich during the vedic period. This started to reduce when vedas lost their Significance in the society. As a matter of fact there are lot of evils in Hinduism. You don’t need to follow the Vedas . Just Think Logocally and Scientifically .

Since you are talking like this. Can you logically explain the Birth of Lord Ganesha? If shiva was really god, would’t he know that Ganesha was his son? If shiva was a real God, how could he get so angry? Why wasn’t he able to replace a human head instead of a elephant head? Does this mean Shiva Had limitations?

These are Stories Added During the Puranic Period. Yes Shiva is mentioned in Vedas(Rudram and Chamakam) but there were no stories around him.

If it was a physical tail, then burnt tail would take months to heal. Vaanar was a community living in forests. Valmiki Ramayan Balkand 17 details that Vaanars were children of Indra, Surya, Brihaspati, Kuber and Agni. Ramayan is adulterated with many fictions. Mahatma Amar Swami made research on this and wrote a treatise debunking myth of Vaanar being monkeys – “Hanuman Aadi Vaanar The Ya Manushya?”

agniveerji. everything cannot be explained from a modern viewpoint. for in kumbhmela lakhs of people take a dip in ganga and still carry ganga water as prasad which many may say as filth. Is is a matter of faith. ramayana according to traditional accounts goes back to treta yuga approximately 16lac years back . there are chances a group of itelligent people was there with tail. ihave been reading your website for many years. vedas what we are having today is not full. many slokas have been lost. regarding animal sacrifices. let us take athiratrayagnya,ashwedhayajyaetc in athiratrayajnya killing of a buffalo by covering all its nine orifices is clearly. mentioned.when it was performed in kerala we had to find alternative because of govt opposition.

VANAR means (VA + NAR) there is doubt if it is human or not , living a human life or not .. ” va nara ?” ram never lived in same place twice in his exile because he reached inhumane people and developed the culture from Hut to hut. and to make vanar into nar.

hello are you truth seeker that use to come on agniveer about 2 years ago if you are welcome back i love your responses that you use to give i would also like to see torment student, kalbhairav,vik,arya,vivek arya, agniveer,apollo reach,vajra arya ,sdc,yash arya etc to come back more often on this website

Yes Brother. Agniveer Changed My life. Actually couple of Days ago, I met a person on this very same website. I guessed that he came from the same place I come from(Chennai) through His Name. I contacted Him. This World is really Small. He is one year my senior in the same CA institute I study in. I contacted him and we are meeting in person tomorrow. He works in an Auditing firm and teaches Vedas after office Hours. We are planning to Join hands (With some of his friends who are also interested) and explain the “Scientific relevance in Vedas” in many Schools in Chennai.If it becomes successful, we are planning to open it to the public also. We chose Science because it is the only way the current generation will have faith on the vedas. My Journey also started in the same way and Now I have learned much more about the vedas. In fact AgniveerJi has given me enough courage to debate Muslims online and the best part,is they are left with no answers and try to change the topic. Long Live Vedic Culture Long Live AgniveerJi. This comment is to ensure that You are backed by many Loyal followers. Will keep you updated on our Plans.