You could easily beam WMD's all across the surface of the Klingon homeworld and aboard all ships/bases that you knew the location of. You might not completely wipe them out, but with a co-ordinated effort it would be a hell of a first strike.

On the intermittent occasions when they appear, newtontomato's posts are nonsensical or comical more often than anything, and this one certainly didn't merit that kind of cheap-shot response. Or any response at all, really.

BeamMe:
I don't think Marcus wanted to reshape Earth or the Federation. He was just worried that we would lose the war with the Klingons and wanted to reshape StarFleet to defeat the Klingons. Thus killing them from afar would have accomplished that goal.

I guess this explains why some things don't make sense if the writer's craft the story and then decide who the characters are and if their backstories work in the current story. I thought things felt shoehorned in, and this just confirms it.

Khan in this movie is one of the best villains in Trek as he isn't a maniacal madman, he is at all points, up until he believes his comrades have actually been killed, in complete and total control. His manipulation of Kirk from the moment they have their discussion in the brig is testimony to this. And this harks back to his appearance in Space Seed, rather than TWOK when his brilliance is clouded by the losses he suffered over the years and his rage and thirst for vengeance.

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Well said.

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Thanks

Had Khan acted that way in TWOK, I think the next movie after that would have been Star Trek III - Bow Before Our Mighty Overlord Khan!

Why do so many people think that the partially destroyed moon is Praxis? Was it mentioned in STID? Did they say in TUC where Praxis was in relation to Kronos? Wouldn't an explosion like the one that opened TUC likely have destroyed Kronos in TUC if it was an orbiting moon?

My only problem with the movie is that in my opinion it's just as good and well-made, over all, as the last one, but there is no "newness" to it like the last one had. They should have upped the charm and heart to it, instead they upped the action and literally every action scene was in the trailers, leaving nothing to surprise.

Why do so many people think that the partially destroyed moon is Praxis? Was it mentioned in STID? Did they say in TUC where Praxis was in relation to Kronos? Wouldn't an explosion like the one that opened TUC likely have destroyed Kronos in TUC if it was an orbiting moon?

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The fact that it looks exactly like Praxis, is a moon of Kronos just like Praxis, and that the writers of this movie have packed the last two entires with references to old Trek is a damn good indication.

That discussion on remakes in the other forum made me think of something peculiar.

Star Trek 2009 and STD constantly reference the previous Trek films. The I have been, and always shall be your friend thing, the needs of the many thing, the Khan thing, Spock's death scene, lots and lots of references, even in pivotal moments of the film.

Just what is there in those two films that future films will be able to pay homage to or reference? Is there anything that you are going to take with you that is truly memorable and stands on its own?

That's an interesting question, and the fact is at the moment, we don't know.

Remember, Star Trek II was over 30 years ago, with three decades of being watched and re-watched, allowing it to seep into the public consciousness.

Even non-trek fans are usually familiar with the KHAAAAAAAAAAAAAANNNNNNNNNNNNNN!! reference for example, but when we watched the movie at the theaters all those years ago, did we know that line would become so well known?

Just what is there in those two films that future films will be able to pay homage to or reference? Is there anything that you are going to take with you that is truly memorable and stands on its own?

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30 years from now Quinto's Spock falls into a new alternate universe to become the new old-Spock. Then the new-new Spock gets to die again and Kirk gets to yell "Khaaaan!" in order to be a "clever reversal of Into Darkness." That's the point where endless reboots and homage reaches absurdity. It just becomes this endless ping-pong match that goes nowhere.