The Packers went 15-1 with a terrible Defense last year. Without Rogers they would have been 8-8. Brady carried his team to the Super Bowl last year and the D was a joke.

Warner took his Rams to the big game with an awful Defense. Manning's Defenses have been average with some plus players. They had Freeney, Bob Sanders, and Mathis. When you have a Manning that could points on the board at will it forces the opposition to scrap their ball control plans to keep Peyton off the field and they are forced to throw. They get pressure from Freeney and Mathis which forces the QB in to forcing throws. His defense was never great.

Eli had great pass rushers too, but the defense was never elite. I love how you guys want to compare our rebuild to Super Bowl winning QB's/teams. We need to have a winning season, a play-off season, then worry about getting back to the super bowl. Even with the best defense in the league, Carson Palmer would not lead this team to the Super Bowl.

The Packers went 15-1 with a terrible Defense last year. Without Rogers they would have been 8-8. Brady carried his team to the Super Bowl last year and the D was a joke.

Warner took his Rams to the big game with an awful Defense. Manning's Defenses have been average with some plus players. They had Freeney, Bob Sanders, and Mathis. When you have a Manning that could points on the board at will it forces the opposition to scrap their ball control plans to keep Peyton off the field and they are forced to throw. They get pressure from Freeney and Mathis which forces the QB in to forcing throws. His defense was never great.

Eli had great pass rushers too, but the defense was never elite. I love how you guys want to compare our rebuild to Super Bowl winning QB's/teams. We need to have a winning season, a play-off season, then worry about getting back to the super bowl. Even with the best defense in the league, Carson Palmer would not lead this team to the Super Bowl.

The Packers went 15-1 with a terrible Defense last year. Without Rogers they would have been 8-8. Brady carried his team to the Super Bowl last year and the D was a joke.

Warner took his Rams to the big game with an awful Defense. Manning's Defenses have been average with some plus players. They had Freeney, Bob Sanders, and Mathis. When you have a Manning that could points on the board at will it forces the opposition to scrap their ball control plans to keep Peyton off the field and they are forced to throw. They get pressure from Freeney and Mathis which forces the QB in to forcing throws. His defense was never great.

Eli had great pass rushers too, but the defense was never elite. I love how you guys want to compare our rebuild to Super Bowl winning QB's/teams. We need to have a winning season, a play-off season, then worry about getting back to the super bowl. Even with the best defense in the league, Carson Palmer would not lead this team to the Super Bowl.

Exception, not the rule. You can 2 QBs who won w/ great defenses. You can name countless Superbowl winners and playoff contenders who had a great QB.

The Bucs and Ravens defenses were insane top to bottom. It's rare to have that kind of talent across the board on defense. Deep and start studded. 9ers are the closest thing to it since the Bucs.

i hear you but who's the last qb to have a all star type SB performance and win?

arod? steve young? maybe

Don't really understand the question. But Eli, Brady, Peyton have all won Superbowls in the last 10 years. Each a great QB. Rodgers, Big Ben.

im saying in SB's usually the great qb's have sub par games leaving it up to the defense to bring home the ring. its rare for a qb to have a great game in the SB and carry the team to victory and defense usually is the deciding factor not whose behind center. defense won those games not the qb imo.

brees- sub par SB defense bailed him out
peyton- same
brady- same x 2
eli- same

only qb's i can remember having a great sb game and leading the team to victory was steve young and arod._________________

The Bucs and Ravens defenses were insane top to bottom. It's rare to have that kind of talent across the board on defense. Deep and start studded. 9ers are the closest thing to it since the Bucs.

Those teams also never returned to the SB while those with elite QBs remained SB contenders for years and in some cases won another title. What it shows is that the teams built around a great D can have that one magical run where everything falls in place but it's pretty much impossible to replicate. Those built around an elite QB show a lot more consistency throughout the years. And it's pretty logical. You need a lot of players to form a great defense.

So on the subject of QB or defensive player in this next draft, let's assume whoever we pick is gonna be an elite player at the next level. If we get a defensive player, all it will bring us is one elite defender without any certainties regarding the results we'll get from it. If we get a QB, it makes us very likely playoff contenders for 10 years._________________

The Bucs and Ravens defenses were insane top to bottom. It's rare to have that kind of talent across the board on defense. Deep and start studded. 9ers are the closest thing to it since the Bucs.

Those teams also never returned to the SB while those with elite QBs remained SB contenders for years and in some cases won another title. What it shows is that the teams built around a great D can have that one magical run where everything falls in place but it's pretty much impossible to replicate. Those built around an elite QB show a lot more consistency throughout the years. And it's pretty logical. You need a lot of players to form a great defense.

So on the subject of QB or defensive player in this next draft, let's assume whoever we pick is gonna be an elite player at the next level. If we get a defensive player, all it will bring us is one elite defender without any certainties regarding the results we'll get from it. If we get a QB, it makes us very likely playoff contenders for 10 years.

-does a SB ring make a qb elite?
-imo its pretty much impossible to replicate a SB run despite having a elite qb or not. recent multiple SB winning qb's have great defenses to lead them on magical runs (pitt, giants)
-after brady's defensive all star team left he hasnt won another ring

interesting 2012 playoff teams stat:

Quote:

Five of the six NFC teams had offenses that finished in the top 10 in yards, but only San Francisco has a top-10 defense.

Four of the six AFC teams have top-10 defenses, but only New England has an offense in the top 10.

What's more, every team except Denver ranks in the top 10 in either offense or defense, but none in both.

-does a SB ring make a qb elite?
-imo its pretty much impossible to replicate a SB run despite having a elite qb or not. recent multiple SB winning qb's have great defenses to lead them on magical runs (pitt, giants)
-after brady's defensive all star team left he hasnt won another ring

No.

In recent history, the Rams went to 2 SBs, the Pats won 3 SBs, the Colts went to 2 SBs, The Steelers went to 3 SBs, the Giants won 2 SBs. The fact they all have an elite QB wasn't enough and they obviously needed help from the rest of their team but teams like the Bucs, the Ravens or even the 85 Bears couldn't sustain their success for long despite having some historically great defenses and they never returned to a SB. I see some kind of pattern there.

He still went to 2 more SBs and has been to the playoffs every single year. He's actually the perfect example for my point since he's giving his team a shot every single year.

No player is going to win the SB alone but with an elite QB, you're half way there._________________

The Packers went 15-1 with a terrible Defense last year. Without Rogers they would have been 8-8. Brady carried his team to the Super Bowl last year and the D was a joke.

Warner took his Rams to the big game with an awful Defense. Manning's Defenses have been average with some plus players. They had Freeney, Bob Sanders, and Mathis. When you have a Manning that could points on the board at will it forces the opposition to scrap their ball control plans to keep Peyton off the field and they are forced to throw. They get pressure from Freeney and Mathis which forces the QB in to forcing throws. His defense was never great.

Eli had great pass rushers too, but the defense was never elite. I love how you guys want to compare our rebuild to Super Bowl winning QB's/teams. We need to have a winning season, a play-off season, then worry about getting back to the super bowl. Even with the best defense in the league, Carson Palmer would not lead this team to the Super Bowl.

Exception, not the rule. You can 2 QBs who won w/ great defenses. You can name countless Superbowl winners and playoff contenders who had a great QB.

The Bucs and Ravens defenses were insane top to bottom. It's rare to have that kind of talent across the board on defense. Deep and start studded. 9ers are the closest thing to it since the Bucs.

i hear you but who's the last qb to have a all star type SB performance and win?

arod? steve young? maybe

Don't really understand the question. But Eli, Brady, Peyton have all won Superbowls in the last 10 years. Each a great QB. Rodgers, Big Ben.

im saying in SB's usually the great qb's have sub par games leaving it up to the defense to bring home the ring. its rare for a qb to have a great game in the SB and carry the team to victory and defense usually is the deciding factor not whose behind center. defense won those games not the qb imo.

brees- sub par SB defense bailed him out
peyton- same
brady- same x 2
eli- same

only qb's i can remember having a great sb game and leading the team to victory was steve young and arod.

-does a SB ring make a qb elite?
-imo its pretty much impossible to replicate a SB run despite having a elite qb or not. recent multiple SB winning qb's have great defenses to lead them on magical runs (pitt, giants)
-after brady's defensive all star team left he hasnt won another ring

No.

In recent history, the Rams went to 2 SBs, the Pats won 3 SBs, the Colts went to 2 SBs, The Steelers went to 3 SBs, the Giants won 2 SBs. The fact they all have an elite QB wasn't enough and they obviously needed help from the rest of their team but teams like the Bucs, the Ravens or even the 85 Bears couldn't sustain their success for long despite having some historically great defenses and they never returned to a SB. I see some kind of pattern there.

He still went to 2 more SBs and has been to the playoffs every single year. He's actually the perfect example for my point since he's giving his team a shot every single year.

No player is going to win the SB alone but with an elite QB, you're half way there.

-does a SB ring make a qb elite?
-imo its pretty much impossible to replicate a SB run despite having a elite qb or not. recent multiple SB winning qb's have great defenses to lead them on magical runs (pitt, giants)
-after brady's defensive all star team left he hasnt won another ring

No.

In recent history, the Rams went to 2 SBs, the Pats won 3 SBs, the Colts went to 2 SBs, The Steelers went to 3 SBs, the Giants won 2 SBs. The fact they all have an elite QB wasn't enough and they obviously needed help from the rest of their team but teams like the Bucs, the Ravens or even the 85 Bears couldn't sustain their success for long despite having some historically great defenses and they never returned to a SB. I see some kind of pattern there.

He still went to 2 more SBs and has been to the playoffs every single year. He's actually the perfect example for my point since he's giving his team a shot every single year.

No player is going to win the SB alone but with an elite QB, you're half way there.

half full vrs half empty

i hear you. there are arguments for both sides.

Agreed. Thats why I say we should end up with a good player either way. If there is an elite signal caller available, we could potentially find our franchise QB. If not, we can go after a top pass rusher and help our defense for the next decade. Either way we end up with one thing that each of our units are lacking.