as usual, conservitard false equivalency. Know why Greece is farked? because, as a member of the european union, cannot simply sell more bonds to cover debt, nor print money, or any other economic fix like the US can.

Lurking Fear:as usual, conservitard false equivalency. Know why Greece is farked? because, as a member of the european union, cannot simply sell more bonds to cover debt, nor print money, or any other economic fix like the US can.

Next year, with any luck, the Bush tax cuts will expire and unemployment will improve. That will impact lots of things related to the deficits. And then...2014, we're out of Afghanistan.

Those are things we'll have without Congressional help. I'd love to see the sequestrations in defense, but it isn't going to happen. Congress is going to continue to be a logjam - we need to vote those GOP farkers out of Congress.

CreamFilling:Lurking Fear: as usual, conservitard false equivalency. Know why Greece is farked? because, as a member of the european union, cannot simply sell more bonds to cover debt, nor print money, or any other economic fix like the US can.

Yes, the United States, still the largest economy in the world, with umpteen million square miles of territory in several climactic zones holding all manner of natural resources and arable land, with an entreprenurial economy and one of the larger R&D expenditures on the planet, is JUST LIKE a mountainous country the size of Alabama spread over several small islands and peninsulas.

'U.S. Per Person Debt Now 35 Percent Higher than that of Greece'However US Per Person Income now 85% higher than that of Greece. In addition, US Per Person Wealth is considerably higher than in Greece, though I cannot find any numbers on Greece because it is not in the top 10.

ScouserDuck:60% eh? No matter how much you make, a person should be able to keep AT THE VERY LEAST half of what they make.

A 60% rate would likely leave people in the bracket bringing home between 30 and 40% of what they make.

Perhaps you should have thought about how you were going to finance that shiny new car and 4 year degree in underwater basket-weaving before you spent $100,000 you didn't have on them.

National debt and per capita debt is different.

The nation of Greece is in debts to it's people because they made a bunch of promises to keep money around to take care of people when they got too old to work. This is a wonderfully noble idea that belongs in any advanced society. Unfortunately, their corrupt politicians, embezzled all that money meant for the people and now their government is completely broke.

America HAD a surplus we could have saved for things like infrastructure improvement, hardening cities against hurricanes, healthcare and taking care of the elderly.

We are spending it on drone strikes and military equipment the military doesn't even want.

/I wonder where that will get us in the long run.//If only we had saved all that surplus in some kind of... Lock box.///nah, that's a silly idea. We can just spend it and pay it back later.

ScouserDuck:60% eh? No matter how much you make, a person should be able to keep AT THE VERY LEAST half of what they make.

Why? What are your reasons for a 50% max marginal tax rate?

The only tax rate I think is conceptually or philosophically unjustifiable would be 100%. Otherwise, rates should be empirically determined, progressive in nature, and high enough to cover the costs of society.

ScouserDuck:Slaves2Darkness: Psst, I'l let you in on a little secret. We can close the deficit today, save Social Security, Medicare, Medicaide, and start to pay down the debt without affecting GDP growth.

How you ask it is one simple solution and is really quite easy.

RAISE TAXES! A 60% top marginal rate on income, remove the cap on Social Security taxes, and set capital gains taxes at 33%.

I know it is amazing, but the only problem is the white welfare queens and corporate whores who think they are Taxed Enough Already.

60% eh? No matter how much you make, a person should be able to keep AT THE VERY LEAST half of what they make.

They should be, but that is not an option when the same people who want to keep taxes low are refusing to allow cuts to 1/3 of the US budget. You don't want your taxes to increase then all government expenditures, including the military, will need to make deep sacrifices to bring the US budget in-line with US tax revenue.

Of course we could keep going on like we are, we will probably last at least another 20 years and maybe a little longer before the whole house of debt comes crashing down. We could fix it now though, several grand bargains could be made that shares the pain of getting our financial house in order around, but that would require the Republicans to become suddenly reasonable. Least you forget there was a bargain on the table in 2011 that for every one dollar of tax increase gave ten dollars of spending cuts. It was the Republicans who refused the deal.

Arkanaut:CreamFilling: Lurking Fear: as usual, conservitard false equivalency. Know why Greece is farked? because, as a member of the european union, cannot simply sell more bonds to cover debt, nor print money, or any other economic fix like the US can.

Printing money is an economic fix?

When the problem is a massive crunch in the money supply, yes.

You can't print wealth. You can print currency, but I don't think a lack of currency is our problem. You might as well cut a pizza into smaller pieces to see if it will feed more people.

The way the US creates and borrows money has become a flawed concept. Technically if you're creating value with education, healthcare, and infrastructure you could simply create those dollars in the economy without any ill effect as it's introducing equivalent economic value in the society. There is no sense in paying interest on deficit spending in those areas. But the spending would still need some sort of counter balance so it didn't get out of control. It should be safe to create as much money as you want, as long as demand doesn't outstrip supply at which point inflation would occur, but we are currently facing the opposite problem, which is somewhat of a first for humanity.

However defense spending, legal, and correctional institutions should be kept on the books in a conventional manner. As they create very little economic value, and added spending creates markets that potentially have a negative impact on the economy.

Arkanaut:CreamFilling: Lurking Fear: as usual, conservitard false equivalency. Know why Greece is farked? because, as a member of the european union, cannot simply sell more bonds to cover debt, nor print money, or any other economic fix like the US can.

CreamFilling:Arkanaut: CreamFilling: Lurking Fear: as usual, conservitard false equivalency. Know why Greece is farked? because, as a member of the european union, cannot simply sell more bonds to cover debt, nor print money, or any other economic fix like the US can.

Printing money is an economic fix?

When the problem is a massive crunch in the money supply, yes.

You can't print wealth. You can print currency, but I don't think a lack of currency is our problem. You might as well cut a pizza into smaller pieces to see if it will feed more people.

Well, it's not lack of "currency" per se, in the sense of number of dollar bills or figures in bank accounts. But the lending conditions are measurably tighter than they need to be. Small businesses are having trouble getting loans to buy needed equipment. Home loan rates are down, but the spread between mortgage rates and banks' borrowing costs has been up since the crisis. And you probably heard about how corporations are holding onto cash instead of hiring or making capital investments because of "uncertainty" -- if the Fed pushes inflation, then that changes the relative value of holding on to the cash (which is declining in value) vs investing in new workers / equipment (which will increase in value).

Arkanaut:CreamFilling: Arkanaut: CreamFilling: Lurking Fear: as usual, conservitard false equivalency. Know why Greece is farked? because, as a member of the european union, cannot simply sell more bonds to cover debt, nor print money, or any other economic fix like the US can.

Printing money is an economic fix?

When the problem is a massive crunch in the money supply, yes.

You can't print wealth. You can print currency, but I don't think a lack of currency is our problem. You might as well cut a pizza into smaller pieces to see if it will feed more people.

Well, it's not lack of "currency" per se, in the sense of number of dollar bills or figures in bank accounts. But the lending conditions are measurably tighter than they need to be. Small businesses are having trouble getting loans to buy needed equipment. Home loan rates are down, but the spread between mortgage rates and banks' borrowing costs has been up since the crisis. And you probably heard about how corporations are holding onto cash instead of hiring or making capital investments because of "uncertainty" -- if the Fed pushes inflation, then that changes the relative value of holding on to the cash (which is declining in value) vs investing in new workers / equipment (which will increase in value).

In theory, yes. In reality, you end up devaluing your currency so much without a corresponding rise in economic growth. If your plan is to just give money away to whoever you think needs it most, every time anyone has ever tried every that the money quickly ends up disproportionately in the hands of the rich anyway.

Slaves2Darkness:RAISE TAXES! A 60% top marginal rate on income, remove the cap on Social Security taxes, and set capital gains taxes at 33%.

I know it is amazing, but the only problem is the white welfare queens and corporate whores who think they are Taxed Enough Already.

What do you think will be the effects when you raise taxes on the very wealthy? Well, where does the vast majority of the 1% controlled money end up? I would argue primarily in the bond market and the stock market. They aren't hoarding money in some sort of Scrooge McDuck vault, if that is what you were imagining. So when this money leaves those markets, the price of those assets fall. So lower stock prices and higher bond yields. Which means all of those pensions that are invested in stocks will immediately become less valuable, and the government will be forced to pay a far higher rate to borrow money. Which still results in massive amounts of economic pain.

I agree with you that we should tax the wealthy, but to think that taxing the wealthy will somehow fix our problems is ignorant. We're in for some serious economic hardship no matter what steps you think we should take.

Arkanaut:Well, it's not lack of "currency" per se, in the sense of number of dollar bills or figures in bank accounts. But the lending conditions are measurably tighter than they need to be. Small businesses are having trouble getting loans to buy needed equipment. Home loan rates are down, but the spread between mortgage rates and banks' borrowing costs has been up since the crisis. And you probably heard about how corporations are holding onto cash instead of hiring or making capital investments because of "uncertainty" -- if the Fed pushes inflation, then that changes the relative value of holding on to the cash (which is declining in value) vs investing in new workers / equipment (which will increase in value).

Lending conditions are tight because they need to be tighter. When you try to encourage lending, you create artificial booms in the economy. Easy loans created the housing bubble. Easy loans have created the student loan bubble. The answer isn't easy loans somewhere else.