He didn't have any digs at Seb, in fact he praised Seb for being infallible in 2011, how can that be anything but a compliment, these so called 'digs' are non-existent as ashley has said above me and made it abundantly clear that he wasn't saying it to make people think anything and was merely putting forward his opinion that he considers Hamilton his main rival

You see, Ashley described this very situation, where fans fill in the blanks. Alonso never said that Hamilton was his main rival, only that Hamilton was the strongest driver.

Oh but he was also directly quoted as saying about Vettel: "I didn't say he's not the strongest driver" Ashley tried to describe the situation, but she admitted that his comments made no sense and rather than try to make sense of them, she just ignored the nonsensical part and focused on the praise. That does not take the onus off of Alonso and her statement does not support your point either.

Others speak of language barriers (i.e., maybe Alonso doesn't understand that "strongest" is the final superlative - so what he actually meant was "strong" and there can be two or more "strong" drivers). True, but those "fans" are also "filling in the blanks" so again, Ashleys reasoning fails.

Alonso gave Seb a couple of backhanded compliments - which is not the opposite of badmouthing. Perhaps you can call it badmouthing light, but he knows what he is doing. A contradicting compliment (Hamilton is the strongest, oh - I didn't say Vettel wasn't the strongest) and false praise (he made no mistakes in the wet - except his biggest mistake from the lead and his biggest accident in F1 to date) does not serve as "praise" - sorry.

Furthermore, this is one statement. Alonso's history of negative remarks concerning Seb speaks for itself. If he was trying to turn over a new leaf, he failed.

But he isn't. He's just onto more games. You'll see.

nike2die4 wrote:

it does come off as Seb fans get disgruntled that Alonso doesn't mention Vettel's name.....it's as if Alonso isn't entitled to his opinion,the guy has been saying the same thing since the end of the 2010 season,i don't know why it's so hard for some to accept that's how genuinely feels,they always have to put on their Sherlock Holmes and Dr Watson hats to dissect everything and pass it off as "mind games".

Actually, it comes off as if some are a bit desperate to see Alonso's words of praise as genuine, and that it means a lot to them that he praise their driver of choice. They feel that if Alonso is playing games with Vettel, his statements about Hamilton just might not be genuine.

I can relate, but sadly, it is all just games for Alonso. Just like Monty publicly valuing Vettel over Hamilton. Their Vettel quest might be sincere, but most of the public comments: just games games games.

-If Alonso praises Hamilton he is covering up for his inferiority of 2007.-If Alonso doesn't praise Hamilton he is a bitter old man still upset about 2007.-If somebody with a professed liking for a driver other than Alonso makes a reply backed up with quotes, supported by facts that millions of F1 fans witnessed, they are bitter based solely on the fact their driver is an opponent of Hamilton.

This polarization of fans into colored camps of each driver and team is looking like football. Users that write with nothing but politeness and show nothing but respect to others attract abuse for no other reason than their "colours." It must stop.

_________________"Jean Alesi is using the Maginot Line policy-You shall not pass!"-Murray Walker

-If Alonso praises Hamilton he is covering up for his inferiority of 2007.-If Alonso doesn't praise Hamilton he is a bitter old man still upset about 2007.-If somebody with a professed liking for a driver other than Alonso makes a reply backed up with quotes, supported by facts that millions of F1 fans witnessed, they are bitter based solely on the fact their driver is an opponent of Hamilton.

This polarization of fans into colored camps of each driver and team is looking like football. Users that write with nothing but politeness and show nothing but respect to others attract abuse for no other reason than their "colours." It must stop.

You're forgetting the Vettel factor. If Fernando praises a different driver than Vettel then he is playing mind games on Sebastian.

-If Alonso praises Hamilton he is covering up for his inferiority of 2007.-If Alonso doesn't praise Hamilton he is a bitter old man still upset about 2007.-If somebody with a professed liking for a driver other than Alonso makes a reply backed up with quotes, supported by facts that millions of F1 fans witnessed, they are bitter based solely on the fact their driver is an opponent of Hamilton.

This polarization of fans into colored camps of each driver and team is looking like football. Users that write with nothing but politeness and show nothing but respect to others attract abuse for no other reason than their "colours." It must stop.

You're forgetting the Vettel factor. If Fernando praises a different driver than Vettel then he is playing mind games on Sebastian.

Naturally. Don't forget, if he praises Vettel than he is playing mind games too, luring him to the great glorious Scuderia as a friend, not a foe...

_________________"Jean Alesi is using the Maginot Line policy-You shall not pass!"-Murray Walker

While I don't think his comments actually made any sense and I never trust anything he says is his personal feeling and not serving an agenda, don't get your panties in a twist about him bad mouthing Seb. He didn't. At all. It might be his intention to have his words construed that way, but he didn't actually say anything negative. He went out of his way to do the opposite. He will always leave it in a way that allows the doubts (and insecurities) in the minds of his listeners to fill in the blanks - that makes it the listener who is projecting the negative sentiments on Sebastian, and you'd have to say Kimi and JB as well given they're left out of the conversation entirely. Its a clever and easily identifiable tool out of the public communication handbook studied by all advertisers, politicians, spokespersons, public speakers.

Anyone recall a game called Simon Says? When a statement started with the words 'Simon Says' everybody had to do what was said.Here's a new game. It's a bit like Simon Says but it requires everyone to go berserk attaking or defending specific drivers.

I'd rather do the Simons says thing, for instance, Symonds says "crash against the wall on lap 14th."

Alonso says he thinks Hamilton is his strongest rival. There are two possibilities of what this means:

a) He is telling the truth and he does think Hamilton is the strongest rivalb) He is lying and does not think Hamilton is the strongest rival.

If it is a) then there are two possibilities.

1) His opinion is correct, Hamilton is his strongest rival2) His opinion is incorrect, Hamilton is not his strongest rival.

If it is b) then there are two possibilities

1) His true opinion is incorrect, Hamilton is his strongest rival2) His true opinion is correct, Hamilton is not his strongest rival.

I think that it is a) and this is his true opinion, that Hamilton is his strongest rival. Because all F1 drivers believe themselves to be the best and Hamilton is the one he will always be directly compared to. It is easier for him to dismiss Vettel's success, both in his mind an mentally and publically down to the Newey factor regardless of how factually correct it is. Because he has faced Hamilton in the same car - regardless of whether Hamilton had an unfair advantage handed to him from McLaren (although it is probably correct to say that on balance, over the course of the season, any favouritism was probably evened out) - he is more aware of what Hamilton is capable of having worked with him in the same environment as team mates. Although Vettel and Alonso may be more equivalents in terms of actual success, Hamilton will always be the driver Alonso is compared to because of 2007.

However, Alonso in the quote stipulated this was just his opinion:

"The strongest driver? It is a personal opinion, not political, not to make people think something. Who is the strongest opponent, the strongest driver on grid? Who is the one you have to keep an eye on? It is Hamilton - and it will still be Hamilton next year."

So when he then says:

"I am not saying [Vettel] is not the strongest driver.

What he is saying is that his opinion might be incorrect. Of course, this assumed a) not b).

The fact is, as Alonso said himself, this is his opinion. Whether it's his actual opinion or just some deception, in either case the truth could be that either Hamilton is his strongest rival or someone else is. Alonso's opinion does not reflect reality and other people are free to have a different opinion that may or may not be more correct.

It's horrific. In fact I don't even think it's supposed to be mentioned around here is it?!

Horner's picture... well... I don't know what to say... I wonder if he looks back at it and says "I've made many wise decisions in my time, and this is definately one of them. DAMN."[/quote]

That flavio picture Since I have seen the picture i think its only fair that the other new members see that picture Mods can i post the picture?[/quote]And give half the forum nightmares for a week? No, thanks!!! Have mercy, some of us work really hard at trying to forget we ever saw that image.

Schumierules, I am with you. In fact, I would not oppose the idea of giving mr Horner's display the same treatment we give mr Briatore's![/quote]