SANDHURST, England — Emmanuel Macron invited Theresa May to “be my guest” if she wants to maintain the access Britain’s financial services industry currently has to the EU single market after Brexit — but only if the U.K. adopts the Norway model.

Speaking at the close of an Anglo-French summit aimed at strengthening bilateral ties, the French president addressed the question of the U.K.’s future trading deal with the EU directly, portraying May’s choice as a simple one between a Norway- or a Canada-style relationship.

Brexit was not formally on the agenda at the summit, which was held at the Royal Military Academy in Sandhurst, and both leaders in their remarks at a press conference rounding off the event reinforced the importance of bilateral ties between the two countries. They announced commitments on shared military operations and a new "Sandhurst Treaty" to address the migrant crisis at the French port of Calais — both trailed before the event.

But asked in the closing press conference about his stance, Macron gave a pointed assessment of the consequences of Brexit and May’s decision to leave the single market.

“I’m here neither to punish nor to reward … I want to make sure that the single market is preserved because that’s very much the heart of the EU,” Macron said, according to the summit translation.

“So the choice is on the British side, not on my side,” he added, saying there could be "differentiated" single market access.

“If you want access to the single market, including the financial services, be my guest but it means you need to contribute to the budget and acknowledge the European jurisdiction,” he said. Macron gave his answers during the press conference in French but slipped into English to emphasize the phrase "be my guest."

Briefly addressing the Brexit negotiation, May repeated her call for a “comprehensive free-trade agreement” that would cover both goods and services, adding that the City of London would continue to be “a major global financial center” after Brexit; something that she said would be to both the U.K. and the EU’s advantage.

Macron said he did not rule out financial services, or any other sector, being included in a final trade deal that was “closer to the situation of Canada,” but was explicit that the level of access would not match the U.K.’s existing levels as a member of the single market.

“I do not want to exclude any sector in the trade agreement to come … but it does not mean that access ... will be equivalent to access as if you are a member of the single market,” he said, adding that there would be “no hypocrisy in this respect.” To do otherwise, he said, would “destroy” the single market and its “coherence.”

Burgundian

Little Napoleon seems to forget that he lacks money, hard power and support from most of Europe.

Posted on 1/18/18 | 10:44 PM CET

Stefan M

@ Burgundian -quite opposite-he has support of Germany and all other member states,
Only a deluded brain can fantasize such non senses (lack of money )

Posted on 1/18/18 | 10:56 PM CET

YellowSubmarine

So, this is France and Germany open to a financial services deal as long as they get the money, seems as though this will be the EU negotiating position when talks start again. Just a question of how much, and if Macron and Merkel are both happy it cannot be cherry picking, can it …

And in other news – European Commission has told EU diplomats to consider the possibility of an agreement with the UK that would keep flights in the air even in the event of no deal.

So another few wheels falls off the remain camps ‘project fear’ bus. 😉

Macron said with simple words, why the EU can’t give to the impudent UK that what the latter so desperately wants and why cherry picking is not possible. He explained it like he would explain to a child, but I guess May will pretend she didn’t hear it.

So, it could be expected, that the insolent Brits will keep insisting, because they may hate the EU, but they are still in love with its free market :)))
Their politicians behaviour is something average between this of a beggar and a blackmailer. Quite pitiful.

I am glad, that EU has politicians like Macron and Merkel.

Posted on 1/18/18 | 11:20 PM CET

tpk

What a relieve that finally one of the ‘big’ politicians starts talking in technical terms. This should force UK eventually to also give a clearer answer what they mean by their special deal.

@YellowSubmarine
You can not just buy an access same as SM. Only if you also accept ECJ and FoM.

Posted on 1/18/18 | 11:38 PM CET

xyc

YellowSubmarine “So, this is France and Germany open to a financial services deal as long as they get the money, seems as though this will be the EU negotiating position when talks start again. Just a question of how much, and if Macron and Merkel are both happy it cannot be cherry picking, can it …”

Not one bit, what he said is that the Norway EEA deal is on the table, that’s been the EU position from day1, ie, pay into the budget, observe the 4 freedoms, comply with EU rules under ECJ jurisdiction. All without set at the table or a say on the rules. “So the choice is on the British side, not on my side. They can have no differentiated access to financial services. If you want access to the single market, including the financial services, be my guest. But it means that you need to contribute to the budget and acknowledge European jurisdiction. Such are the rules and we know this is the system already in place for Norway.”

“And in other news – European Commission has told EU diplomats to consider the possibility of an agreement with the UK that would keep flights in the air even in the event of no deal.”

No sources for this info? I don’t see how this could be. For starters, they can’t just add the access into an FTA, the EU would have to change EU law to facilitate the UK, which would open the door for Emirates, American Airlines etc.. demanding the same access. Currently EU law dictates that only aviation companies with majority EU shareholding can carry persons and baggage intra EU.

Posted on 1/18/18 | 11:43 PM CET

YellowSubmarine

@tpk – You can not just buy an access same as SM. Only if you also accept ECJ and FoM.

Relevant EU banking regulations would have to be observed by UK banks but Germany did not say ‘stay in custom union or no deal’. The suggestion was UK would get no financial services deal unless we paid for it.

So France/Germany want money for services, and UK says we will not pay for services, it’s a deal on services and goods traded or nothing. I expect some money to change hands eventually but lets see.

Posted on 1/19/18 | 12:06 AM CET

wow

@xyc

erm………….because it wouldn’t be intra -EU anymore a flight from london to paris.

HELLO!!!!

It is NOT going to be a problem to/from london ANYWHERE. All problems will be IN THE EU!! Ohhh what a punishment! That flight from paris to london will be fine. But not that cheap flight from paris to berlin. That’ll be disrupted! Yeah take that London.

You do remember the threat was flight to/from london would cease? No flights oH No a cut off island LOL!! Oh you forgot, of course you did. No, it will be cheap intra-eu flights that will have problems…. effecting EU citizen’s not UK at all.

Posted on 1/19/18 | 12:17 AM CET

YellowSubmarine

@xyc – No sources for this info? I don’t see how this could be. For starters, they can’t just add the access into an FTA

Diplomats have seen slides of a “bare bones” UK-EU agreement that would include recognised safety standards and traffic rights. Airlines with EU-based headquarters will continue to be able to fly after Brexit. Diplomats said the future relationship could be based on existing aviation agreements with the US and Canada.

I don’t see why it is strange for the EU to continue wanting a functional air travel system after brexit , unless you believed the hype that all UK aircraft would be grounded after brexit. An arrangement was always going to be organised , one way or the other.

Posted on 1/19/18 | 12:17 AM CET

klv

@yellow “So France/Germany want money for services, and UK says we will not pay for services, it’s a deal on services and goods traded or nothing. I expect some money to change hands eventually but lets see.”

regarding ecj uk for a norway model must accept it,especially regarding financial services.
Regarding fom,uk can use the “swiss”solution ..here how works:after referendum,a compromise was found,so suppose there is tot jobs put on official paer and online,the swiss got the priory(like only swiss offical papers and so on for 5 days),and after in other european site/papers and so on.

Posted on 1/19/18 | 12:22 AM CET

wow

@xyc

Let me guess you’re going to make a new lego plane company out of thin air to do the new intra-eu flights to the new lego financial centre in frankfurt, current population 770,000 is going to be made from lego into London’s 14 million population metropolis, with 2.5 million lego world class expert financial people and a new lego airport to rival the busiest airspace in the world: London.

Then you’ll be a lego superpower muhahahahahaaa!

Posted on 1/19/18 | 12:23 AM CET

klv

sorry I meant “,the swiss got the priority”,because know 1st.

Posted on 1/19/18 | 12:25 AM CET

wow

@xyc

Make sure you make some of the largest lego law firms in the world, with centuries old world famous world class lego universities teaching and researching in an international lego language!

Otherwise, it’s just not going to work is it, let’s be honest.

Posted on 1/19/18 | 12:26 AM CET

wow

It’s funny how the EU27 wants to copy London and London wants to copy NOTHING WHATSOEVER about the EU27!

Posted on 1/19/18 | 12:28 AM CET

wow

‘GUARDIAN
15 hours ago – Before he was president, Macron once said that, when he travels to London on the Eurostar and the City towers in the distance, he sees two things: tall, modern buildings, and French policy failure.’

Posted on 1/19/18 | 12:30 AM CET

That's right

Canada or Norway. Repetita iuvant, I guess.

The UK is in such a weak and shameful position. It’s pitiful.

Posted on 1/19/18 | 12:32 AM CET

xyc

@YellowSubmarine – Those articles you refer to only talk of the UK airlines being allowed to fly into the EU under the same rules enjoyed by USA or Canada, so about 4 of the 9 freedoms I think. That was always going to happen. That doesn’t resolve the problem of intra EU flights, BA would still be locked out of those, and several CEOs (Air France’s. notably) have stated they will fight in court the validity of IAG’s subsidiaries (Iberia, Aer Lingus) permissions to fly ntra EU under EU ownership rules when the owning parent company (IAG) is majority non EU (or will be once UK shareholders are no longer EU).

@wow – you’re an ignorant sh1t as always, the problem was always said to be with intra EU flights, I personally have made this very point on this forum umpteen times. Stop embarrassing yourself and do everyone a favour…take a break from this forum

Posted on 1/19/18 | 12:40 AM CET

wow

@always wrong

as usual. Just repetative platitudes and subjective own opinions.

Posted on 1/19/18 | 12:47 AM CET

YellowSubmarine

@klv – regarding ecj uk for a norway model must accept it,especially regarding financial services.
Regarding fom,uk can use the “swiss”solution ..here how works:after referendum,a compromise was found,so suppose there is tot jobs put on official paer and online,the swiss got the priory(like only swiss offical papers and so on for 5 days),and after in other european site/papers and so on.

The Swiss and Norway models are arrangements between those two nations and EU, the UK is not in the same position as either Norway or Switzerland. So referencing these, when setting out the parameters for a UK deal, is
only useful as a starting point.

Posted on 1/19/18 | 1:15 AM CET

NK

Macron acting ‘Like a Virgin’. The lyrics echos loud …

Posted on 1/19/18 | 1:33 AM CET

klv

@yellow”The Swiss and Norway models are arrangements between those two nations and EU, the UK is not in the same position as either Norway or Switzerland. So referencing these, when setting out the parameters for a UK deal, is
only useful as a starting point.”

well,that s main point:you want deal on financial services?ecj must be accepted.
About fom,I told because swiss had referendum about it, but only solution was that,conforming to the eu law.
And,as stand for canada +++ deal,change on 1 mean change on all
Well ,for eu,same is applicable on efta deal,fom must be accepted as eu law say,otherwise change cards for other as norway ,swiss.

Posted on 1/19/18 | 1:47 AM CET

klv

@yellow” UK deal, is
only useful as a starting point.”

you can a bespoken uk deal,nice word for brexiteers, deal,but rules are the same on eu side.

Posted on 1/19/18 | 1:49 AM CET

Colby Phelps

I don’t necessarily think that the UK should be focused on staying in the single market, or having access to the single market. Professor Patrick Minford illustrates that focusing on the world market is where the advantage is for the UK. Minford said only 15% of UK exports go to EU countries? The trend is UK trading more with non EU countries. And with that being the case, it would be beneficial to the UK to not have the tariffs from EU regulations when trading with non EU countries. He says that benefit outweighs the negative of being outside of the single market when trading with EU countries. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=leKEUT1TiLU&t=1209s

Posted on 1/19/18 | 1:49 AM CET

Anthony Chambers

Financial services covered by passporting amounts to £2bn in imports and £2bn in exports. It is not worth the extra costs to go to EEA for such a little gain from CETA covering goods and services without passporting.

Posted on 1/19/18 | 5:40 AM CET

Priscilla du Bleu

@Stefan M
“@ Burgundian -quite opposite-he has support of Germany and all other member states,
Only a deluded brain can fantasize such non senses (lack of money )”

Good Morning Stefan! 🙂 What you sad. I wonder if we – us ‘treacherous remoniacs’ should set up a blog for analyzing our resident trolls’ behaviour and the rubbish they post. Might be fun.

Greetings from the opposite side of the globe, i am going to bed now. Have a good start into the weekend.

Posted on 1/19/18 | 6:01 AM CET

Priscilla du Bleu

@Yellow<Submarine
"The Swiss and Norway models are arrangements between those two nations and EU, the UK is not in the same position as either Norway or Switzerland. So referencing these, when setting out the parameters for a UK deal, is only useful as a starting point."

Starting point to a 'bespoke Norway model'?

Forget it.

From the guardian the other day, what us 'remoaners' had predicted and have been preaching since 1.5 years: 'generous cherrycake bespoke' for the UK would alienate other trading partners, which is why the EU won't grant cakes and cherries. The EU certainly won't be silly enough to annoy a bunch of existing trading partners in order to grant treats for one single diva :-D.

"Theresa May has been hit with a double Brexit blow as the EU toughened up its terms for a transition period and Norway privately warned Brussels that giving in to the UK’s demands for a “special” trade deal could force it to rip up its own agreements with the bloc. …. However, the Guardian has learned that repeated representations have been made to EU officials by Oslo over their fears that an overly generous offer to the UK will fuel calls in Norway to renegotiate its ties with the bloc, according to senior diplomatic sources.The Nordic intervention presents a fresh hurdle for Theresa May’s aim of delivering a “deep and special partnership” with the EU that goes beyond the scope of a Canada-style free trade deal, an arrangement under which significant barriers to trade in goods and services remains.

Norway makes larger financial contributions to the EU per capita than the UK and accepts free movement of people in order to have access to the single market. But it has no decision-making role in Brussels’ institutions."

Posted on 1/19/18 | 6:22 AM CET

tpk

@YellowSubmarine

I would think that if the EU gave you some cherries the economic damage for EU (e. g. Norway, Canada insisting on the same) would be so high that you could not pay enough to compensate.

Posted on 1/19/18 | 7:57 AM CET

tpk

@YellowSubmarine

I could imagine that you are right here. We are so much interdependent that a radical no deal is only something extreme fundamentals could whish.

Posted on 1/19/18 | 8:01 AM CET

tpk

(Regarding flying)

Posted on 1/19/18 | 8:25 AM CET

Anthony Chambers

UK People making a massive mistake begging for financial services to be regulated by the ECJ via EEA membership. The vast majority of crossborder financial services is wholesale business. It has never been part of the single market. It was always regulated in london, currently by the bank of england.

There are some regulations now coming in from the EU. It has to be said each one without exception is bad news for the city.

Far better to leave financial services out of the equation. Then we van continue to regulate them in London and using the international systems of regulation.

Posted on 1/19/18 | 9:11 AM CET

Ken

another desperate attempt to keep the UK in the club.

No thanks

Posted on 1/19/18 | 9:35 AM CET

Tabulazero

Are the wheels finally coming off the Maybot ? Her scripted answer were ludicrious verging on the embarassing.

Posted on 1/19/18 | 10:17 AM CET

jack humphrey

Seems to me that the EU still has the same stance on the City as they had on the 24th June 2016.

Posted on 1/19/18 | 10:20 AM CET

Tabulazero

@Anthony Chambers
“Far better to leave financial services out of the equation. Then we van continue to regulate them in London and using the international systems of regulation.”
Yes because the UK has obviously European Union’s best interest in mind… with all its red-lines, carve-outs, exemptions… etc

What part of Leaving don’t you get ?

Posted on 1/19/18 | 10:21 AM CET

Dan

@Tabulazero
“Are the wheels finally coming off the Maybot ? Her scripted answer were ludicrious verging on the embarassing.”

She always sounds like that.

Posted on 1/19/18 | 10:22 AM CET

Dan

@jack humphrey
“Seems to me that the EU still has the same stance on the City as they had on the 24th June 2016.”

Why wouldn’t that be the case, we’ve only just now got around to discussing it.

Posted on 1/19/18 | 11:15 AM CET

John C. Ojones

The best the UK can get is a Canada style agreement.
Maybe the britons think they are more important for the EU than Canada?
Lol. Well… They are not the brightest of the bunch

Posted on 1/19/18 | 11:58 AM CET

Yaaawn

The French President, who is scheduled to meet with Prime Minster Theresa May on Thursday, has been dealt a huge blow as the CEO of Dimension Data, Jason Goodall, said he did not even consider Paris as an option for the base of his company’s headquarters.

Speaking to CNBC, Goodall revealed London was his top choice for his tech hub despite Brexit.

He said: “It was very important for us to be close to our clients, very important for us to have access to the best talent from a technology perspective.

“London ticked both those boxes so we’re very excited to be investing in London and to have a strategic hub in London with a lot of our executive team now based here.”

Posted on 1/19/18 | 11:58 AM CET

wow

@john

Most pathetic not even remotely entertainingly b**chy comment of the day. I nearly fell asleep.

You won an award though. Well done.

Posted on 1/19/18 | 12:07 PM CET

Ian

Priscilla du Bleu ,
Referencing articles in the Guardian (or Russian owned The Independent ) is the equivalent of leave voters quoting The Express or The Mail , which of course you dismiss. Please try to look at logic and both sides of the arguments , rather than just accepting biased journalism .

Oh look , this article has been written by Charlie Cooper , a journalist that writes for The Independent ( a Russian owned Pro EU paper )

klv , You state that Norway and other countries would want to renegotiate their trade deals if the EU gave Britain a bespoke trade deal .

Why shouldn’t they ?

Surely it is reasonable that member countries renegotiate trade deals to reflect world political changes , and changes in technology and trading demands .

Surely it also the duty of The EU to be fair to ALL countries when offering and renegotiating trade deals ,they should not be detrimental to either side , but that is not how it operates .

If the EU does not offer trade deals bespoke to each country , why is there Norway , Switzerland and Canada agreements , rather than just 1 trade agreement that everybody has to accept ?

Norway wants to renegotiate its agreement if Britain gets a good deal

Switzerland does not seem happy with its agreement , and may be having a referendum in the future .

How did Germanys abuse of EU rules on competition and falsifying car emissions show anything other than the largest EU member is just out for itself , to the detriment of EVERY other member .
Germany demanded Greece honour contracts for arms deals with Germany , whilst Greek citizens suffered from harsh austerity measures imposed by Germany, The EU and the IMF , when it was supposedly bailing Greece out .
Merkel created a problem for other EU member countries with her open door policy , then demands The EU set quotas to all other EU member countries , ignoring all opposition

The EU members claim Russia to be a threat .

Germany sold arms and the latest technology to Russia up until 2014 .
Merkel opposed harsher sanctions on Russia
Russian gas and oil being sold to Germany for its industry , thus helping the Russians economy and ability to finance its armies and weapons .

Juncker to Britain prior to the EU referendum: No new reform deal for UK after vote, Jean Claude Juncker warns
European Commission President’s comments will be seized upon by Leave campaign as evidence of EU leadership’s intransigence over Britain’s terms of membership .No new reform deal for UK after vote, Out is Out ” Charlie Cooper , writing for the Independent 22nd of June 2016

Now you Pro EU want
Large Sums of Money
Access to British waters for fishing
ECJ Superiority over UK Law ( whilst the UK being outside the EU)
Continued UK support for intelligence and armed services , paid for by UK tax payers
Continued access to sell EU member goods to 65 million UK customers , generating a £70bn a year trade surplus to the EU

I could go on

All for a Norway , Switzerland or Canada agreement , that of course doesn’t include our requests for Financial Services .

Who is Cherry picking ?

Posted on 1/19/18 | 12:08 PM CET

wow

@john

Don’t worry John, the scared insecure EU is safe with Canada. EU have never COMPLETED a deal with anyone bigger than themselves or bigger than the UK for that matter. (we can do that ourselves love, what is the point of the EU?).

If UK/EU complete a deal it will be the biggest they’ve ever done. But they’re too scared, so don’t count on it.

Posted on 1/19/18 | 12:10 PM CET

wow

A trading block that is too scared to do deals with economies bigger than itself…

That’s a good joke.

They had ONE job to do… *LOL* but they’re too scared to do it.

Posted on 1/19/18 | 12:12 PM CET

alan

Wonder how much the French wine industry will be prepared to pay for access to the UK market?

Posted on 1/19/18 | 12:22 PM CET

wow

Can;t even do the job they were meant to… Pointless EU.

Posted on 1/19/18 | 12:30 PM CET

French

alan
Wonder how much the French wine industry will be prepared to pay for access to the UK market?

Anthony Chambers

@French: There are about 20 so called connoisseurs drinking French wine. I think you will miss the money of all the other’s. A French Sancere is surely a lovely drink. But so is a New Zealand Sauvignon Blanc.

Posted on 1/19/18 | 1:03 PM CET

Anthony Chambers

The correct place for regulation of wholesale financial services is view global institutions which will then get enacted into UK regulations. Post Brexit it is better that Finance Services are not part of the agreement between the UK and EU, this is likely to lead to inappropriate regulatory involvement from the EU.

So just a simple CETA agreement with no exclusions so that it covers 100% of goods and services (but without passporting).

Posted on 1/19/18 | 1:07 PM CET

klv

@Ian”You state that Norway and other countries would want to renegotiate their trade deals if the EU gave Britain a bespoke trade deal .

Why shouldn’t they ?

Surely it is reasonable that member countries renegotiate trade deals to reflect world political changes , and changes in technology and trading demands .

Surely it also the duty of The EU to be fair to ALL countries when offering and renegotiating trade deals ,they should not be detrimental to either side , but that is not how it operates .

If the EU does not offer trade deals bespoke to each country , why is there Norway , Switzerland and Canada agreements , rather than just 1 trade agreement that everybody has to accept ?

Norway wants to renegotiate its agreement if Britain gets a good deal

Switzerland does not seem happy with its agreement , and may be having a referendum in the future .

How did Germanys abuse of EU rules on competition and falsifying car emissions show anything other than the largest EU member is just out for itself , to the detriment of EVERY other member .
Germany demanded Greece honour contracts for arms deals with Germany , whilst Greek citizens suffered from harsh austerity measures imposed by Germany, The EU and the IMF , when it was supposedly bailing Greece out .
Merkel created a problem for other EU member countries with her open door policy , then demands The EU set quotas to all other EU member countries , ignoring all opposition

The EU members claim Russia to be a threat .

Germany sold arms and the latest technology to Russia up until 2014 .
Merkel opposed harsher sanctions on Russia
Russian gas and oil being sold to Germany for its industry , thus helping the Russians economy and ability to finance its armies and weapons .

Juncker to Britain prior to the EU referendum: No new reform deal for UK after vote, Jean Claude Juncker warns
European Commission President’s comments will be seized upon by Leave campaign as evidence of EU leadership’s intransigence over Britain’s terms of membership .No new reform deal for UK after vote, Out is Out ” Charlie Cooper , writing for the Independent 22nd of June 2016

Now you Pro EU want
Large Sums of Money
Access to British waters for fishing
ECJ Superiority over UK Law ( whilst the UK being outside the EU)
Continued UK support for intelligence and armed services , paid for by UK tax payers
Continued access to sell EU member goods to 65 million UK customers , generating a £70bn a year trade surplus to the EU

I could go on

All for a Norway , Switzerland or Canada agreement , that of course doesn’t include our requests for Financial Services .

Who is Cherry picking ?”

First canda made a ceta total difference.
Regarding option uk in efta and the possible deal ,norway isn t happy at all,and don t like at all give to uk better deal than them.
So,suppose,if uk has a better one,eu to make them,for example,norway put quite few money on eu,happy got to update /edit on uk deal.

What you put here :Now you Pro EU want
Large Sums of Money
Access to British waters for fishing
ECJ Superiority over UK Law ( whilst the UK being outside the EU)
Continued UK support for intelligence and armed services , paid for by UK tax payers
Continued access to sell EU member goods to 65 million UK customers , generating a £70bn a year trade surplus to the EU

is called stay under eu law,you accept it?cool?you dont like?canada as it is or option no deal and wto for uk.
Usually efta deal are based on request needs of country,so generally bespoken,but 1 point on common very important is : all of them pay every year money to eu,all stay under eu law and rules.
Repeat,you need services on your norway deal,but bespoken based on your need requestl,ll be more expansive, and uk llstay on eu law and rules, if want this cool.
If you don t like canda or wto up to you.

Posted on 1/19/18 | 1:14 PM CET

klv

@anthony”So just a simple CETA agreement with no exclusions so that it covers 100% of goods and services (but without passporting).”

you know better than me that eu is n ot going to put services on ceta,the only way that you can have it is a norway ish deal.

Posted on 1/19/18 | 1:17 PM CET

Anthony Chambers

@klv: Services are already in CETA. Just not financial services.

Posted on 1/19/18 | 1:23 PM CET

Ian

Priscilla de bleu,

“Norway makes larger financial contributions to the EU per capita than the UK and accepts free movement of people in order to have access to the single market. But it has no decision-making role in Brussels’ institutions.”

That was their choice , but that doesn’t mean that everybody has to accept the same choice .

It differs in views if your countries economy relies on sales to the UK .

Just Logic and facts

Posted on 1/19/18 | 1:36 PM CET

klv

@anthony”Services are already in CETA. Just not financial services.”

I know,but on real terms to put financial services for mfn clause and so on,can mess up so much eu especially regarding the existing trade deal and also for future trade deal/ceta.
So,based on this fact,for a deal with financial services included,the only practical option is norway option.

Posted on 1/19/18 | 1:37 PM CET

namedeiros

Bravo Macron! Well said. Who can argue with that except the the most thick-headed?

Posted on 1/19/18 | 1:42 PM CET

Tabulazero

@ alan
“Wonder how much the French wine industry will be prepared to pay for access to the UK market?”

Please do not talk about something you do not have the money to buy.

Posted on 1/19/18 | 1:57 PM CET

Anthony Chambers

@klv: If financial services is excluded, which I think is actually the best for the UK industry anyway, given that the UK is the current regulator in this area for wholesale business, not the EU, there is no problem at all. Here is the CETA agreement scope:

Article 9.2 – CETA
Scope
1. This Chapter applies to a measure adopted or maintained by a Party affecting crossborder
trade in services by a service supplier of the other Party, including a measure
affecting:
(a) the production, distribution, marketing, sale, and delivery of a service;
(b) the purchase of, use of, or payment for, a service; and,
(c) the access to and use of, in connection with the supply of a service, services
which are required to be offered to the public generally.
2. This Chapter does not apply to a measure affecting:
(a) services supplied in the exercise of governmental authority;
(b) for the European Union, audio-visual services;
(c) for Canada, cultural industries;
(d) financial services as defined in Article 13.1 (Definitions);
(e) air services, related services in support of air services and other services

Posted on 1/19/18 | 2:28 PM CET

klv

@anthony Well,if this kind of model is ok for uk,happy days for both parts no?

Posted on 1/19/18 | 2:56 PM CET

YellowSubmarine

From the guardian the other day, what us ‘remoaners’ had predicted and have been preaching since 1.5 years: ‘generous cherrycake bespoke’ for the UK would alienate other trading partners, which is why the EU won’t grant cakes and cherries. The EU certainly won’t be silly enough to annoy a bunch of existing trading partners in order to grant treats for one single diva :-D.

It’s a nice try from the ‘G’ but they are confused again. If you have Norway looking for a better deal and the Swiss and probably the Italians latter this year, as well as the UK, who has given up and gone, this can only add more weight to the argument that EU needs serious reform. Not keep things as they are.

Only a blinkered man at the end of his political carrier, intent on pursuing his ideologically dream come what may, and without worrying about the cost to his fellow EU citizens, would think the status quo is now a good idea.

If Juncker wants a political legacy to leave behind he first has to leave something standing, he has already cost the EU $150 billion over the next 10 years by losing the UK on his watch.

The EU is set to lose a lot more if there is no original thinking on a UK deal.

Posted on 1/19/18 | 3:45 PM CET

YellowSubmarine

That should read political career, not political carrier. 😉

Posted on 1/19/18 | 3:53 PM CET

klv

@yellow” If you have Norway looking for a better deal and the Swiss and probably the Italians latter this year, as well as the UK, who has given up and gone, this can only add more weight to the argument that EU needs serious reform. Not keep things as they are.”

You are mixing up things: swiss are unhappy but because got bilateral deal,eu and them sort out a way,possibly.
Norway are watching close eu and which kind of offer and condition ll be for uk to stay on efta,obviously if better condition are guaranteed for uk,they ll ask too.
Italy is 1 of 3 founders,and generally are very pro eu .A coalition government is most likely solution and ll be pro eu.
Even the 5stars movement know gave up about eu, and instead ask for reform/change.

Posted on 1/19/18 | 4:02 PM CET

klv

@yellow”Being realistic, the best the UK can hope for is a form of Canadian trade deal.
So we will lower our aims and be happy to brag of that as a victory.”

Only option for financial services is norway(ish) deal,not others.

Posted on 1/19/18 | 4:11 PM CET

Anthony Chambers

A rare moment of agreement. CETA with goods and services (no financial services) will do the job fine. It would probably be sensible to work together to make the customs handling as pain free as possible. If the paperwork is prepared in advance it would be easier. I would have no problem with Dutch customs collecting British tariffs (on our behalf) from goods coming from Hong Kong, I am sure some commission can be found. Or alternatively don’t land it until it gets to the UK.

Posted on 1/19/18 | 5:00 PM CET

John C. Ojones

@wow
“EU have never COMPLETED a deal with anyone bigger than themselves or bigger than the UK for that matter.”

Dear wow, we all know you have been brainwashed and indoctrinated by Farage and his minions, anyway, you should know that the deal with Japan is THE WORLD’S LARGEST FREE TRADE AGREEMENT.

That is something the UK can never even dream.

Posted on 1/19/18 | 5:58 PM CET

Anthony Chambers

@John C. Ojones: The Japanese have already confirmed that they will allow the deal with the EU to be grandfathered for the UK. It was in the news about 3 months ago.

Posted on 1/19/18 | 6:16 PM CET

crispin hythe

It is amazing that so many brekkies don’t seem to understand brexit. No passporting, no favours, no cherry-picking. Brexit means brexit! As they say in London, ‘Yer a-h-t AHT!’ Brexit will preoccupy the English for decades – to us, getting rid of Nothengland is just a chore, like having to get your dog dewormed. Brekkies should change their national anthem to ‘Here Comes Your 19th Nervous Breakdown’.

Posted on 1/19/18 | 6:33 PM CET

Mark Boyd

@anthonychambers,
Do you work in financial services ?
I presume you don’t.
I myself, have been looking into opening a subsidiary in Ireland and it’s not as easy as just opening a subsidiary.
You have to shift your entire base into Ireland to maintain the same access if we don’t get a deal including financial services. Regarding what’ll be better for financial services,
I do not need to take anyone else’s opinion because I, personally can see that the best option is remaining in the single market/Swiss deal.
Anyone in the financial sector who says otherwise is either lying, deluded or on their own weird agenda.
CETA won’t work. It is just a basic trade deal which is not the same as membership.
I don’t see how a hard brexit is possible if the EU doesn’t somehow include services in the deal.
I for one, would strongly oppose such a brexit even if 90% voted for it.
You cannot vote to damage another person’s interests.
I personally hope other people in the financial sector also take the same stance and push us towards an EEA/Swiss deal.
The sector as a whole is quite strong and it’s almost impossible for any government, even UKIP if they got in, to go against us.
May’s getting a nice good taste of it now.

Posted on 1/19/18 | 7:39 PM CET

Mark Boyd

To me, an EEA/Swiss deal is perfectly acceptable. I say go for it.
I anyways think this’ll be the most likely outcome, if not a future reversal of the 2016 referendum

Posted on 1/19/18 | 7:46 PM CET

xyc

Anthony Chambers
@John C. Ojones: The Japanese have already confirmed that they will allow the deal with the EU to be grandfathered for the UK. It was in the news about 3 months ago.

Great stuff, dropping Japanese tariff barriers for cheese and agri-food in exchange for dropping tariffs on Japanese made cars, just about the only thing the UK still manufactures (for now). Also, there was no commitment to grandfather the agreement, the statement was “As the UK exits the EU we will work quickly to establish a new economic partnership between Japan and the UK based on the final terms of the EPA.”. A verbal pledge to “quickly” negotiate a similar deal is not worth the paper it s written on!! :o)

Posted on 1/19/18 | 8:08 PM CET

Anthony Chambers

@Mark Boyd: I did explicitly state that there is a small portion of financial services in the UK that does indeed use the single market. And it appears you are involved in that small sector. If it were me I would include ot, but the EU apparently.is not interested unless we pay a serious amount of money. I am sorry for you really, but there is no way that the UK government should spends 4-5 billion euro to protect an industry that is only doing 2 billion in business. That is just no a good use of public funds.

Posted on 1/19/18 | 8:34 PM CET

YellowSubmarine

@Priscilla du Bleu – Question, then, is, why are they so desperate to get a trade deal?
And the answer is… yes you are right… because they are extremely dumb.

Much of the desire for a trade deal is down to reassuring the financial markets. They could have a bigger effect on the UK economy than the influence of any deal with the EU, or the general state of the global economy, as seen with the currency depreciation after the brexit vote.

It is in the UK’s interest to reduce any negative knee-jerk reaction once UK is operating as an independent country.
A deal that is seen as OK will help limit any medium / long term effects of this on UK.

In the end the UK currency devaluation was as helpful as it was a hindrance but it’s the uncontrolled aspect to this which has to be managed.

As luck would have it the timing of the brexit vote could not have been better in respect to the global economy, with EU finally dragging itself out of the doldrums and US/China all performing well it has taken some of the focus off UK and many in financial markets are looking for opportunity to make money rather than reducing risk.

Ideally the UK needs to be running independently for a year or two before the next global recession hits to be safe from the dangers of market speculators. Bur so far so good.

Perhaps the gods are smiling on Albion and who would bet against them. 😉

Posted on 1/19/18 | 9:51 PM CET

Mark Boyd

@anthonychambers,
Mate it’s not just me and a small portion of the sector, almost every single bank uses passporting to sell services across the single market.
I also do not know how you’ve reached the 2 billion amount.
The government has no clue as to the real amount brought in by services.
They can only estimate from what they’re told.
And almost nobody tells the government the actual real amount profited. If for example a company profits £10 million a year, amounts are cut off and put under expenses here, there and other places, until the real amount for tax purposes would show less than half the actual profits.
My guess is, the real amount brought in by services via trade with the single market is somewhere in the vicinity of £100 billion a year (which shows as £40 billion as most firms use accounting strategies to cut down profits for tax purposes).
It is something that if not May, Hammond is sure to know.

And regarding trade with the ROW, let me tell you, no country will ever allow us unrestricted access.
India almost totally blocks off British traders. So does China. Only their own traders have unrestricted access to their markets. Similarly, Europe also blocks off Indian and Chinese traders.
The States, is a bit more open but still gives preference to their own traders over any other trader.
The only place we’re free to invest and sell in, with absolutely no restrictions, is the European single market, a market of 18+ trillion.

Posted on 1/19/18 | 10:22 PM CET

Mark Boyd

@EuroTroll,
I can’t yet diverge because it isn’t clear what the future rules will be yet.
If we get an EEA/Swiss deal, then there’s no use diverging. It’ll just be a waste of money.
I know TM has said she wants to leave the SM, but I believe with enough pressure from the financial sector, she will have to back down.
Everyone is in Limbo until the terms become clearer.
An EEA/Swiss deal would solve everything. The only think better than that would be reversal, but that’s not practical.
If such a deal is signed, I can guarantee you, the pound will immediately shoot up by around 5-10 percent.

Posted on 1/19/18 | 10:32 PM CET

klv

@american mike “There will be a deal Mark, and it WILL include (full) passporting, but it may come at a cost (any cost will be from an EU origin) so there may be a UK tax on it to claw back some revenue for HMRC to ‘balance the books’. BUT, rest assured, it wont cost more than the EU tax hike”

you talked about big stuff and is full passporting.At the moment none of efta countries got that,only eu members.
That require lot of change from eu policy,which i find very unlikely.
But nothing is impossible,as old adidas ad used to say.

Posted on 1/20/18 | 12:50 AM CET

klv

“Wasn’t talking to you but to a Brit. Go back to sleep.
We are protecting you in europe although we are getting tired of paying for you.”

ok,so troll, and even fan of donald ……..good luck uk

Posted on 1/20/18 | 2:39 AM CET

Priscilla du Bleu

@YellowSubmarine
“Perhaps the gods are smiling on Albion and who would bet against them”

The gods are far too busy laughing their derrières off about albion and their begging bowl trips across the continent 😀 – hence they do not smile on them.

@my fakes: yep, those were not too bad. Could have been from me indeed. Insofar: go ahead. You have my approval for more of this.

Posted on 1/20/18 | 9:16 AM CET

Un-American

@An American

Wasn’t talking to you but to a Brit. Go back to sleep.
We are protecting you in europe although we are getting tired of paying for you.
—————————
Here we laugh, you cant even protect America from Mexico let alone anything else further afield 🙂

Posted on 1/20/18 | 1:39 PM CET

YellowSubmarine

According to the BBC, Macron said a future arrangement could fall somewhere between a Canada-style free trade agreement and a Norway-style deal with access to the single market.

“For sure you will have your own solution,” the French leader said – it’s something perhaps between this full access and a trade agreement,” he added.

The gods and now Jupiter smile on Albion. Barnier must feel as though he has been hung out to dry by Merkel and Macron, although pressure is now coming from all sides within EU for a bespoke UK deal.

They can have no differentiated access to financial services. If you want access to the single market, including the financial services, be my guest. But it means that you need to contribute to the budget and acknowledge European jurisdiction. Such are the rules and we know this is the system already in place for Norway.”

Posted on 1/22/18 | 4:03 AM CET

Slasher

Ain’t gunnar happen. Free-Movement.

Posted on 1/22/18 | 8:32 PM CET

Steuersklave

@YellowSubmarine
The gods and now Jupiter smile on Albion.

You idiot. Leaving out the conditions connected means blocking out reality.

Bespoke deal only if we accept the FoMs connected to it.

Won’t happen. Hence no bespoke deal. I am coming to think that most fellow-leavers are mentally handicapped. Grow up.