The only rabid Buckeye fans who won't just reflexively put the white hat on Meyer are the ones who post here. Because when Peeks responds to posts from Buckeye fans on this board by referring to the OSU fan base as knob-gobbling sycophants, so blinded by OSU homerism that they can't see or admit any fault with anything associated with the scarlet and gray, he constantly assures us that he's not talking about, you know, anyone who posts here. (I refuse to use emoticons, but this would be a good place for that winking one, Peeker)

That's why I'm not worried that what I'm about to say will be taken in that light. And sorry if you've heard me say this before...

As soon as the Meyer talk started after JT was fired, I wondered aloud to some of the OSU media types I have come to know how likely(or smart)it would be, with OSU trying to dig itself out of the NCAA dungeon, for them to consider a guy fresh from the SEC, with the reputation that conference carries.

Two different OSU media people I respect, independent of each other, (and again, six months before the Meyer hire)told me that their sources told them Meyer's resignation had a lot more to do with his refusal to continue winking at the cheating that was going on (at Florida as well as the rest of the SEC). He was uncomfortable with the kinds of things that a school (again, including his school) had to do in order to compete in that conference. He saw it, he fought it...and he lost....just like Terry Bowden tried to call a halt to it at Auburn...and lost...as did Tommy Tuberville, who tried to distance the program from Lowder and his influence...and got fired for it.

Now, Urban Myer may be the cheating, scumbag asshole that Peeks says we (sorry, all those other OSU fans) were calling him while he was at Florida. I would just suggest that maybe the reasonably well-connected people I talked to were right...at least in part...and that a good part of the reason for his resignation (and maybe contributing to his declining physical and mental health) was his problem continuing to be a part of what he saw as a dirty system...one that he ultimately decided he couldn't continue to be a part of. Further...

He says he didn't oversign at Florida, and the numbers would appear to bear that out.

The averages at the link don't coincide exactly with Meyer's years at UF, he was there for six of the nine years in the sample (2002-2010) Florida was 10th out of 12 SEC schools in numbers of recruits signed per year...23.33, which comes out to 93 every four years...a fair number accounting for normal attrition, and even more so because he redshirted less than many other schools. (That number BTW is an average of five fewer commits per year than Auburn took in the same time period) Sayin'

If we've learned anything in the last year, it's that no coach is a saint, It's a sleazy business in many respects. And I am as guilty as the next fan of giving our guy the benefit of the doubt...the emotional investment that Furls talked about, of wanting to believe the best rather than the worst about "our guy", solely because he's "our guy". Doesn't mean we're impervious to facts on the ground. I am open to consider all evidence anyone can put forward about Urban Meyer the cheating sleazebag.

What to me seems silly though, is talking about the OSU fan base...or any fan base...in the aggregate...as if they all act and think and emote in the same blindly partisan way...putting white hats and black hats on people,etc...when this board itself is evidence that you just can't do that.

"I believe it is the nature of the human species to reject what is true but unpleasant and to embrace what is obviously false but comforting." H.L. Mencken

It's now that he's here that we have this 'Come to Jesus' moment about judging and being judged. Try and find all the calls and investigative measures undertaken here to see if the SEC stank was separate from Meyer before that.

Again, legendarily speaking, Erich Barnes was a dirty mo-fo til he landed in Cleveland after the trade.

Keep that in mind.

No one was looking at how their perceptions may not have been reality when Meyer's SEC team was beating the shit out of OSU in the MNC. They were just painting with a broad brush, like me.

Meh... unfair... maybe a couple really, really fair and impartial people here were. I have no proof otherwise. In fact, I'm sure the two or three people here who take issue with this were leading the charge....

Emoticon-

I'm not even saying this is necessarily a bad thing. It's just what it is. Why fans can't acknowledge it, own it and move on after admitting they're no better here than anywhere else is beyond me.

And there's a slight chance that there's a small trolling element in my stuff. I'm not at all above that. I'm the Urban Meyer of that.

You can't separate the stink of the SEC from Meyer. That's my point, and it's quite possibly why he quit...that was the only way to separate from it. (If the accounts are true)

My memory is not the greatest, but after Florida whipped OSU's ass five years ago, I don't recall the OSU fan base attributing the whipping to SEC (or Meyer's) cheating. I'm sure some did, but most people saw it for what it was. The better team (and the better coach) that day won the game. Ginn got hurt, Troy Smith showed up fat and slow, OSU had no answer for Meyer's tight ends or his fast defensive ends, and we got smacked.

I for one didn't need to rehabilitate Urban Meyer when he got hired, because I have never trashed him while he was at Florida. And I don't think I am unrepresentative of OSU fans in that regard. Maybe that's the only place where we disagree.

"I believe it is the nature of the human species to reject what is true but unpleasant and to embrace what is obviously false but comforting." H.L. Mencken

danwismar wrote:Wow...you're the undisputed king of the emoticons, dude.

You can't separate the stink of the SEC from Meyer. That's my point, and it's quite possibly why he quit...that was the only way to separate from it. (If the accounts are true)

We (I'll use the royal 'we' since I'm not claiming to be any different or better than anyone else, rather, just more willing to admit..I guess?) never really cared or tried IMO.

My memory is not the greatest, but after Florida whipped OSU's ass five years ago, I don't recall the OSU fan base attributing the whipping to SEC (or Meyer's) cheating. I'm sure some did, but most people saw it for what it was. The better team (and the better coach) that day won the game. Ginn got hurt, Troy Smith showed up fat and slow, OSU had no answer for Meyer's tight ends or his fast defensive ends, and we got smacked.

I for one didn't need to rehabilitate Urban Meyer when he got hired, because I have never trashed him while he was at Florida. And I don't think I am unrepresentative of OSU fans in that regard. Maybe that's the only place where we disagree.

I think you underestimate yourself in the above regard. Maybe I spend too much time in places like sports bars or Sec119 at CBS where idiocy just oozes down the aisles and from every corner. Or maybe I'm just a jaded, arrogant prick. Likely though, it's a combination. No need to jump all over the last possibility only.

Good replies. Dan, I really didn't mean to imply that Urban cheated at Florida, because I don't consider what he did cheating. Some kids will get "processed", especially early on. Every once and a while he'll have some grayshirt options too. And he will definitely tell a kid that he shouldn't go to Michigan cause Hoke is a piece of shit. This isn't a game for nice guys.

Also, I like the fact that he does it on the slide. He won't go out and sign 30 like Saban or Houston Nutt. Urban is going to recruit well and win at Ohio State. I have no doubts.

"Dammit you piss me off. I f#ckin hate you and I hope you f#cking get killed by a rabid polar bear you douche bag."

Farming the Ohio State brand to fill the pipeline worked for the first six months of each recruiting cycle under Tressel. Each class predictably staggered to the finish once actual hunting became necessary to win. Meyer's arrival late in the season created a force rarely if ever seen in December and January: Buckeye coaches aggressively hunting for their future stars without the benefit of a large spring cache of elite verbals.

i loved that. It was perfectly put. Bielema, Hoke and Dantonio should be scared. The only thing that will stop Meyer is burnout.

Coming from a Wolverine, we're the football equivalent of a formerly abused wife of a meth addict who just remarried the safe nice guy. We're just glad we have someone who's aware that it's a rivalry and that tackling on defense is integral. Baby steps.

With 2012 recruiting over (aside from Neal rumors and Diggs pending commitment) I have unstickied this thread and will now sticky the 2013 thread.

I must say that this is probably the most popular thread ever in the college sports arena.... almost 11K views and over 600 posts, good stuff. Hopefully the 2013 thread is as spirited.

Coming from a Wolverine, we're the football equivalent of a formerly abused wife of a meth addict who just remarried the safe nice guy. We're just glad we have someone who's aware that it's a rivalry and that tackling on defense is integral. Baby steps.

Quotable: "What I did when I came in and was hired, I told (Penn State President) Rodney Erickson and Dave Joyner (Acting AD) the number one thing we were going to try to do is keep the commitments that were already there committed to Penn State. To me the most important thing is these guys have committed to the university; the football program. We're very proud of that fact. That was our main goal." — Bill O'Brien. This is like a hyena killing a wildebeest and then being chased off by a lion who then eats everything he wants off of said wildebeest and then upon returning to the wildebeest that he killed, the hyena says, "The goal was to make sure that there was still a little bit of rib meat remaining. I'm very proud of that fact. That was my main goal."

"I believe it is the nature of the human species to reject what is true but unpleasant and to embrace what is obviously false but comforting." H.L. Mencken

The rumors are all over the place on Diggs. Anyone that claims they know anything is really putting themselves out there. Personally, I would be surprised if he ended up somewhere besides Columbus. Surprised.... not shocked.

tOSU just makes too much sense, particularly when compared to the competition. Maryland won 2 games last year.... it may be close to home but it is still Maryland, and this kid has to know that his path the NFL through Maryland is going to be tough.

You can never count out Auburn. A$k Jordan Diamond.

I think it is down to tOSU or UF and it really depends on whether he believes in Meyer.One thing that has stuck with me was Zach Smith's tweets during Diggs' official visit. They were ambiguous but VERY positive:

BWI to CMH... It's #XmasMorning - Bot of the 9th, 2 On 2 Out Down by 2 - Nolan Ryan's on the mound... #GoBigorGoHome gotta #Swing4TheFences

That #BuckeyeSwagg is RIDICULOUS right now... Get on FAST - This Train is COOKIN' right now

I may be reading to far into the tea leaves here, but BWI is Baltimore Washington International and CMH is the Columbus Airport.

Coming from a Wolverine, we're the football equivalent of a formerly abused wife of a meth addict who just remarried the safe nice guy. We're just glad we have someone who's aware that it's a rivalry and that tackling on defense is integral. Baby steps.

e0y2e3 wrote:Yeah, it's clear the Ohio State staff feels good about their chances.

Feeling good means nothing.

This is one where you are probably better off just ignoring the tea leaves and waiting till Friday night.

FACT.

Coming from a Wolverine, we're the football equivalent of a formerly abused wife of a meth addict who just remarried the safe nice guy. We're just glad we have someone who's aware that it's a rivalry and that tackling on defense is integral. Baby steps.

Quotable: "What I did when I came in and was hired, I told (Penn State President) Rodney Erickson and Dave Joyner (Acting AD) the number one thing we were going to try to do is keep the commitments that were already there committed to Penn State. To me the most important thing is these guys have committed to the university; the football program. We're very proud of that fact. That was our main goal." — Bill O'Brien. This is like a hyena killing a wildebeest and then being chased off by a lion who then eats everything he wants off of said wildebeest and then upon returning to the wildebeest that he killed, the hyena says, "The goal was to make sure that there was still a little bit of rib meat remaining. I'm very proud of that fact. That was my main goal."

Can't say it much better than Ramzy did, I know no one reading this here is surprised...

Ramzy Nasrallah @ramzyn

Gordon Gee called OSU's 13-13 tie vs. UM "one of our greatest wins" 20 years ago yet people are still surprised when he says stupid things.

This Diggs thing has been hilarious to follow. Still at this point you can find someone with sources linking him to every single school. Kid is redefining playing the media (and he isn't even doing interviews to do it).

He's announcing at College Park as of right now (this has changed a few times) which means roughly nothing either, IMO.

This is funny, funny shit.

Although opening a single thread about Diggs at Scout will make you respect even the worst thread ever here. OSU Nation is, uhm, out of their damn minds.

I'm starting to buy Auburn on this one, but honestly I don't care that much. We are short on numbers next season and there is a great talent pool. When I was watching his most recent film, its clear he's a heck of an athlete, but he doesn't make my eyes pop out of my head offensively. They are pitching Percy but he just ain't that guy (and who will be? who knows). I like Marshall a HELL of a lot more, and not because he's in the bag, because hes better.

Diggs looks dynamite as a CB though. Have very diffent feelings on him as a defensive player.

e0y2e3 wrote:Although opening a single thread about Diggs at Scout will make you respect even the worst thread ever here. OSU Nation is, uhm, out of their damn minds.

Makes you think you're back on the Scout free board, doesn't it, eO?

Gotta believe the kid is going to stay home in Maryland though, now that he's announcing at a DC area bar, which will be packed with locals. Don't think he'd be doing that if he were going to pick OSU...probably get shit thrown at him.

"I believe it is the nature of the human species to reject what is true but unpleasant and to embrace what is obviously false but comforting." H.L. Mencken

e0y2e3 wrote:Although opening a single thread about Diggs at Scout will make you respect even the worst thread ever here. OSU Nation is, uhm, out of their damn minds.

Makes you think you're back on the Scout free board, doesn't it, eO?

Gotta believe the kid is going to stay home in Maryland though, now that he's announcing at a DC area bar, which will be packed with locals. Don't think he'd be doing that if he were going to pick OSU...probably get shit thrown at him.

ehhh. Remember this isn't Ohio here dan.

I've been living just outside College Park for the better part of a decade, and I can tell you they just dont give a shit about CFB here. Nascar, pro Football, Hockey, College Basketball....even horse racing is undoubtably far more important here.

Lacrosse might even be more important, and I am not shitting you when I say that. As far as CFB fandom goes, this is a foriegn country to anyone from Ohio.

JCoz wrote:No one is saying that. What I'm saying is the there is strong correlation between recruiting and winning. You rent going to find nation champions who don't recruit well.*

Urban Meyer and his staff would not have won national championships at Florida with classes full of three stars. It is not a coincidence that USC was so dominant under Carroll and also recruited better than any team in the country. It is not a coincidence that Alabama is now recruiting better than anyone in the country and is dominating on the field under Saban.

You need good coaches but more than that you need good players.

Recruiting is absolutely critical and by and large four and five star players ARE better than three stars as a general rule.

I agree with everything except the "You need good coaches but more than that you need good players"

I think it's 50/50.

I also think really good coaching can get a 3* recruit to produce at a 4* star level while shitty coaches will kill your 5* really quick.

50/50 if not slightly skewed to coaching. Example. I think shitty coaching/staffing hampered a 5* tpeezy2.

No doubt he was 5*, right? No doubt he was very good in college but never truly reached that 5* collegiate level?

Exactly. The point on TPeezy is right on. Even more apparent in Mike Adams who seems to have stumbled into approaching his 5* potential while JB Shugarts was successfully converted from a 5* to a 3* by Jim Bollman. Mike Brewster was exactly as good as a freshman as he was after 47 starts. It is a very sad commentary on how ineffective Jim Bollman was.

Bump- JCoz, let's keep our recruiting/coaching debate over here where it began. I don't even know what the original point of the Wetzel article was.

e0y2e3 wrote:Although opening a single thread about Diggs at Scout will make you respect even the worst thread ever here. OSU Nation is, uhm, out of their damn minds.

Makes you think you're back on the Scout free board, doesn't it, eO?

Gotta believe the kid is going to stay home in Maryland though, now that he's announcing at a DC area bar, which will be packed with locals. Don't think he'd be doing that if he were going to pick OSU...probably get shit thrown at him.

ehhh. Remember this isn't Ohio here dan.

I've been living just outside College Park for the better part of a decade, and I can tell you they just dont give a shit about CFB here. Nascar, pro Football, Hockey, College Basketball....even horse racing is undoubtably far more important here.

Lacrosse might even be more important, and I am not shitting you when I say that. As far as CFB fandom goes, this is a foriegn country to anyone from Ohio.

We can keep it where ever you want it Peek, its reached a dead end. We know that development is important.

We know Tress had cronies that did a very poor job in development. You know the only thing Bollman did worse than development? Recruit.

I mean Mangold was also a Bollman player, how do you explain Bollman turning him from a 4* to a 5* ? it doesn't matter. Meyer knows his formula and its to recruit the game changing talents and coach them up.

I wish just once we had an opportunity to ask Meyer to settle this, because the bottom line is that you just aren't going to let me change your mind.

To me the National champions and recruiting results speak for themselves.

Alabama has had the #1 recruiting class 4 of the last five seasons. Meyer and USC traded 1 and 2 before that with LSU dominating stretches.

My opinion doesn't matter because its right there for anyone to see,

Meyer was asked the other day what can the big ten do to catch up to the SEC. know what he said?

Also, if the kid ends up picking Maryland (which is how it looks) playing all of these look at me games is a very small statement compared to the statement being made by staying home on a team whose starting QB just transfered to lead the program back to relevancy. That would be the opposite of attention whoring when you could have went anywhere in the country and had OSU/Florida/Auburn as the rest of your final four.

hahahaha, to win championships in this town. Has he ever seen UMD play?

Coming from a Wolverine, we're the football equivalent of a formerly abused wife of a meth addict who just remarried the safe nice guy. We're just glad we have someone who's aware that it's a rivalry and that tackling on defense is integral. Baby steps.

e0y2e3 wrote:Also, if the kid ends up picking Maryland (which is how it looks) playing all of these look at me games is a very small statement compared to the statement being made by staying home on a team whose starting QB just transfered to lead the program back to relevancy. That would be the opposite of attention whoring when you could have went anywhere in the country and had OSU/Florida/Auburn as the rest of your final four.

Maybe- Still coulda been done ten days ago. It's attention whoring whatever way you slice it. Kid didn't need an official to MD. He can see it at lunch every day of his life.

tpeezy2-like whore and I hated that when Pryor did it. Nothing's changed.

He attention whored for a week. No issues for me there (nor with TPeezy for listening to his dad who forced him to visit PSU late). Tons and tons of these kids do this shit and it isn't historicly indicitive of anything. The one example you have seen really doesn't make it a universal law.

The kid could turn into a complete asshole, but plenty of assholes sign on signing day and plenty of good kids after.

I don't think for a second he knew where he was going ten days ago, but I don't doubt he knew this week.

Kid may be the biggest asshole ever, but this process doesn't say that he is or isn't just like it doesn't for Alex Kozan who committed to Iowa on signing day but is sitting on his LOI debating between them and scUM.

He attention whored for a week. No issues for me there (nor with TPeezy for listening to his dad who forced him to visit PSU late). Tons and tons of these kids do this shit and it isn't historicly indicitive of anything. The one example you have seen really doesn't make it a universal law.

The kid could turn into a complete asshole, but plenty of assholes sign on signing day and plenty of good kids after.

I don't think for a second he knew where he was going ten days ago, but I don't doubt he knew this week.

Kid may be the biggest asshole ever, but this process doesn't say that he is or isn't just like it doesn't for Alex Kozan who committed to Iowa on signing day but is sitting on his LOI debating between them and scUM.

You're an NBA fan. You're fine with all that "Look at Me!!!! Hey, I said look at ME!!!!!"