Newb Bike build... help please....

I want to build a bike and I have decided on picking up an xl 2009 stumpjumper pro carbon frame.... it comes with s120 forks and front derailleur. I am 6'2" 240lbs.... is this the right size frame for me? Whats wheels, gears, etc would fit this bike? I am clueless but want to build a bike because it will be more cost effective for me and I can learn the in and outs of the bike.... thanks

you might want to recheck the "cost effective" part, building a bike from scratch can be more than a fully assembled one, one the other hand, building a bike from scratch teaches you all the stuff you'll need to know, and can carry over say you break something out on the trail. it also lets you have the parts that you want to have on your bike. if i had the money i would do the same.

you'll need to know the frame specs. for bottom bracket and from there you can start searching what drivetrain you'll want. depending on what kind of riding you do, there's many choices that you can pick from. with a great frame like the one you have, try to avoid putting low end parts on it. it may cost more but it will be worth it. the best way to learn about what parts work with what is to Google it, and visit your LBS and ask them questions. most of them will be happy to help you and explain how drivetrains and derailleurs work. once you found a part that your interested, you can give the company a call and ask them personally. some companys will be able to tell you if there parts will work for your bike, they should have that information availble because the part you may be buying could be factory installed on some other bikes. DO NOT order parts without checking and then checking again to make sure it will fit. its frustrating getting a new part in mail after waiting for ever and then only learning that it wont work on your bike.

and to learn how to install and adjust and tune your bike that you'll be building. YouTube has you covered. they have videos on everything. thats how i learned to adjust my deraillurs and change my Cog rings out when i bent the big ring.

im probably leaving out some information to, so i'll let someone who has built a bike from scratch fill in the missing spots. i havent built my bike from ground up. only replaced the fork, Cogs and front and rear derailleurs

I built my first ever bike over the past few weeks. I spent many weeks reviewing these forums, especially, as well as searching online. People here can tell you that these wheels will fit your frame, or that stem, but it's you that's gonna ride it, and pay for it.

I suggest putting a parts list together in a spreadsheet of some sort. I was also concerned about weight, so the projected weight was also something I considered. Then the research came. I didn't know how may seatpost or stem sizes there were, but after asking questions in the noob section and putting that list together, I was confident that I could build my bike with the correct fitting parts at the price I wanted to pay, and it's pretty satisfying to tell my friends that I built it from scratch, never mind the cheesy grin on my face when I'm on the trails.

Find out everything you can about the frame, and learn from others' mistakes in here. It's gonna take hours of research- there's no easy part, but I can assure you the rewards far outweigh the time spent.

Guess what I'm saying is that research is the most valuable thing you can do

1. Frame sizing - go test ride some bikes at a friendly LBS to see what sizing fits you best. Ride for 15 mins or so and you'll REALLY know if the sizing is right for you.

2. Do some research on the frame you're buying. It should tell you what the bike came with originally. Nice place to start for you is here: Specialized Bicycle Components

3. Now that you know what the bike came with, decide what you want to put on the bike (i.e. what will work, and what doesn't, what kind of parts). Example - I built my 07 SJ with the plan to go straight to 3x10 SRAM drivetrain instead of sticking to 3x9 as it would have come originally.

4. Start reading install manuals, tech articles, watch how-to videos.

6. Do your parts research for the parts you decided on - how much each really costs, and how cheap you can buy them for (researching completed listings on ebay is very helpful)

7. Order all the parts - search locally, online, on ebay etc. Black Friday deals are everywhere right now so it is a great time to pick up bargains.

8. Wait for parts to arrive.

9. Put everything together using the knowledge you picked up from the manuals, videos etc.

10. Take the bike for shakedown ride - make adjustments.

TADA!!! You have built your own bike! Now go hit the trails!!

BTW, I usually come in way below market value by putting my bikes together.

A couple of comments. You can't make good decisions without experience. Experience requires learning from mistakes. I suggest you buy a used bike from Craigslist or similar place in order to have a starting place.

I want to build a bike and I have decided on picking up an xl 2009 stumpjumper pro carbon frame.... it comes with s120 forks and front derailleur. I am 6'2" 240lbs.... is this the right size frame for me? Whats wheels, gears, etc would fit this bike? I am clueless but want to build a bike because it will be more cost effective for me and I can learn the in and outs of the bike.... thanks

;'
I will echo others sentiments. Building from scratch and cost effective are two things that almost never go together. not to say that it can't be done, but it's awfully tough if you have no experience. There are so many little parts that really make the price start adding up that buying from bikes direct for your first bike is probably the best bet and then stripping all the parts off it and then putting them onto this frame you have. That way you will learn a lot about how to build and work on your own bike and when you are done you can sell the bikes direct frame for a couple hundred bucks and recoup. to build it on the cheap otherwise means scouring ebay and craigslist for parts and while you may get some deals on parts you won't necessarily know if they are any good or not.

;'
I will echo others sentiments. Building from scratch and cost effective are two things that almost never go together. not to say that it can't be done, but it's awfully tough if you have no experience. There are so many little parts that really make the price start adding up that buying from bikes direct for your first bike is probably the best bet and then stripping all the parts off it and then putting them onto this frame you have. That way you will learn a lot about how to build and work on your own bike and when you are done you can sell the bikes direct frame for a couple hundred bucks and recoup. to build it on the cheap otherwise means scouring ebay and craigslist for parts and while you may get some deals on parts you won't necessarily know if they are any good or not.

Understandable..... I guess the madscientist needs to get to work.... lol

dont let the naysayers dissuade you. if you want to start riding right away, buying a used bike is a better option. if your willing to take time to get it built and buy it part by part, then go for it. There are also a lot of speciality tools specific to bikes, particularly in the area of crank removal and installation and headset removal and installation so you not only need to buy parts, you need to buy the proper tools or have a bike shop do certain aspects of your install

I want to build a bike and I have decided on picking up an xl 2009 stumpjumper pro carbon frame.... it comes with s120 forks and front derailleur. I am 6'2" 240lbs.... is this the right size frame for me? Whats wheels, gears, etc would fit this bike? I am clueless but want to build a bike because it will be more cost effective for me and I can learn the in and outs of the bike.... thanks

Originally Posted by MadScientist

I dont want to get a bike off of craigslist.... I already have a great frame

You are not going to be riding that frame any time soon. Do you already have a mountain bike to ride? I suggested a used bike because you do not have a clue how much this will cost in dollars, hours, and calendar time. Say six months, and $1200. That's an educated guess.

The building of the bike can be realatively fast. It is getting the parts and tools that can take a long time. The most recent bike i built took about a week and a half of building but probably 4 months of part collecting in the process. I knew what parts I wanted plus had a bunch on hand (I was building my girlfriends bike and was able to upgrade lots of my parts and put my old ones on her bike. Win/win hehe). It is nice to have another bike around to look at for examples and ride while you are building your new bike.

Beside the skills needed to build the bike up you'd also need proper tools, and they are not cheap, when you starting out. You'd need a bike stand of some sort and go from there. If you decide to go that route then all the power to you, there are some learning curve but once you got them down it's like riding a bike

You are not going to be riding that frame any time soon. Do you already have a mountain bike to ride? I suggested a used bike because you do not have a clue how much this will cost in dollars, hours, and calendar time. Say six months, and $1200. That's an educated guess.

Holy dag gone golly gosh dern it jasper....I didnt know it took six months to build a bicycle
good luck mr madscientist... this must be impossible...er most of these folks is bike shop employees er something

Holy dag gone golly gosh dern it jasper....I didnt know it took six months to build a bicycle
good luck mr madscientist... this must be impossible...er most of these folks is bike shop employees er something

im sher madscientist will figure it out. Most off us have changed out our BBs since we were kids. Just cuz you have coin now and a job where you dont have to do anything..i.e. 6,000 posts, doesnt mean you have to shred on the dood who is just getting into the sport. This is the noob thread and no one can even answer if the frame is the right size? That was a general question that endend up gettin flamed in the noob section. I got so bored as soon as I moved to PA that I went on here....YOU GUYS ARE NOODLES At least i know the reason I never heard of this site when i lived in mammoth

im sher madscientist will figure it out. Most off us have changed out our BBs since we were kids. Just cuz you have coin now and a job where you dont have to do anything..i.e. 6,000 posts, doesnt mean you have to shred on the dood who is just getting into the sport. This is the noob thread and no one can even answer if the frame is the right size? That was a general question that endend up gettin flamed in the noob section. I got so bored as soon as I moved to PA that I went on here....YOU GUYS ARE NOODLES At least i know the reason I never heard of this site when i lived in mammoth

Something is wrong with you, you should have it checked out. How did I shred MS, hmmm?. Don't worry about my coins, and my posts as I have plenty of both, you are more than welcome to check my profile

Also genius, internet is the worst place to fit a bike, I bet you've done that since you were a kids, eh? This is a noob forum so many posts here do not know any better, and many vet participate because they can help out, not because we are know it all, but certainly, collectively we have made more mistakes than any noobs, that's how people learn.

Mr. helpful do you even know what frame MS want to build up? and your first suggestion to him is to use a bucket and some brick? Go troll somewhere else boobs.

I love to help out new people. Heck, I'm new to mountain biking. I did turn wrenches in a bike shop long time ago. All I want is to see madscientist have some idea that this can be a big job. Some of us have jobs, and have limited time to build stuff at home, as fun as that is.

I've been collecting parts for a Surly Krampus frameset which I hope to get in December. I have spent more money than I would like to admit to. I have also been unsure about component choices. I obsessed over brakes for weeks, before finally deciding what I could afford, what would fit the bike, and which adapters I would need. Still need to buy a headset. The part numbers don't line up for me. I see recommendations about what to get for this frame, but do not see those exact part numbers on the online marketplaces.

I did buy a $200 bike from Craigslist so I do actually ride. I have lots of bike wrenching experience, though that is a couple of decades out of date. The bottom brackets are different, shifters are different. Nothing I can't figure out, but it all takes time.

Enjoy the journey. Just don't expect it to be real fast or real cheap.

I looked up the frame geo, and depending on your build it may be a BIT large for you (25.1" effective top tube length, 33.1" standover height) but it's likely in the ballpark and can be dialed in for you with the right seatpost/bar & stem combo.

I have not seem anyone hammering on OP. telling someone that building a bike can take a while and cost a lot is true. I just paid 170 dollars for my handlebars and due to them be back ordered and getting the wrong ones it took 4 weeks. That is handlebars. I have paid about 1g for rims and tires, stem, and pedals. You can get a bike for that. So yeah it can be expensive. I also have built 4 bikes and still take them to the LBS to get certain things done, I am sure others do not but I don't have the tools or knowledge. I enjoy building them though. Having a stand is nice (I have one) but not a necessity. I feel like my skill is more suited to commuters and back up bikes. I still feel like my main mountain bike needs to get difficult work done by the lbs due to the fact I don't want to make an expensive mistake.

That I can see, not ideal but it can be done, but a bucket and bricks on a carbon frame is a horrible idea.

Dude wtf kinda cranks do you install? It is not hard to build a bike, especially on a new frame. Removing a crank is FAR more difficult than installing one. Installing a headset can be tough without proper tools but its $10 and 5 mins for an lbs to do it. Everhthing else on a bike is bolting on simple parts. At worst the inexperienced needs a good torque wrench.

just for the hell of it, lets review installing a bb. step one measure bb shell determine if its 68 or 73mm. Apply grease to threads inside bottom bracket and on threads of outboard bearings. Screw on outboard bb bearings using appropriate spacers based on headshell. Tighten to proper spec. slide drive side crank through bottom bracket. Slide on crank arm on other side. install bearing tension setter thingy (sorry brain fart on what that piece is called) tighten hex bolts on non drive side crank arm to spec. Voila. simple instructions for your standard outboard bearing crank ala Shimano. WHAT IS SO HARD?????? WHY WOULD YOU TELL SOMEONE THEY NEED TO SPEND $100 ON A STAND???????
Does a stand make things easier? yes. Is it required? absolutely not. do you carry a stand with you on the trail when things break? lol

Are you replacing a bottom bracket on the trail? I would probably walk home. But it does sound easy now that you put it that way. You are telling someone to get a torque wrench that costs a lot. The bottom bracket is definitely not the most difficult part of putting a bike together. You going to measure and cut a fork on the trail? You going to install the headset without tools, use your multitool and a rock? You absolutely don't need a stand but it is nice. There are lots of tools required to build a bike that would not be cost effective to buy to use once. That is why I do what I can and when I need special tools go to the lbs.

Are you replacing a bottom bracket on the trail? I would probably walk home. But it does sound easy now that you put it that way. You are telling someone to get a torque wrench that costs a lot. The bottom bracket is definitely not the most difficult part of putting a bike together. You going to measure and cut a fork on the trail? You going to install the headset without tools, use your multitool and a rock? You absolutely don't need a stand but it is nice. There are lots of tools required to build a bike that would not be cost effective to buy to use once. That is why I do what I can and when I need special tools go to the lbs.

I agree that there are things that it's worth having the lbs do because the amount of times that you are going to do them doesn't justify the cost of the tools. With that said, what planet do you live on that a torque wrench is expensive? cutting a fork? A hacksaw blade is a $1!!! I live in NYC. I barely have room for my clothes never mind a basement "man cave", garage, workshop, shed, etc and I have had no problem building up numerous bikes. Bottom line the op needs realistic expectations and saying he can't build a bike at all, or that he can't build one without a stand is utterly ridiculous. That is what other posters did.

just for the hell of it, lets review installing a bb. step one measure bb shell determine if its 68 or 73mm. Apply grease to threads inside bottom bracket and on threads of outboard bearings. Screw on outboard bb bearings using appropriate spacers based on headshell. Tighten to proper spec. slide drive side crank through bottom bracket. Slide on crank arm on other side. install bearing tension setter thingy (sorry brain fart on what that piece is called) tighten hex bolts on non drive side crank arm to spec. Voila. simple instructions for your standard outboard bearing crank ala Shimano. WHAT IS SO HARD?????? WHY WOULD YOU TELL SOMEONE THEY NEED TO SPEND $100 ON A STAND???????
Does a stand make things easier? yes. Is it required? absolutely not. do you carry a stand with you on the trail when things break? lol

Dude chill. OP is not spending your money or mine on any bike tools, if you are cool with building the whole bike from the frame up I'd love to see that on youtube. Can it be done? absolutely! Is it a good idea? absolutely not!

OP has a carbon FS frame and want to build it from the frame up, one of the point he asked in his op was cost effectiveness. Which has different answer, yes and no. Yes if you want specific parts on the bike and learning as you go, and no, it would not be cheaper than buying complete bike or a groupo/build kit.

Since op did not mention the budget(if he did show me where I missed it), I'm not going to assume that he does not have any to spend, just because someone is new does not mean they are poor as well Last thing you want when building a bike from the frame up is not to have proper tools. It's not like he picked up the bike on craigslist for cheap and want to learn how to wrench it.

I've done my fair share of trailside repair using whatever available but I'm certainly not going to recommend anyone to do that at home everytime, WTH is wrong with you, stop screaming

edit: OP just to give you a point of reference, LBS would charge $100-170 to build a bike up from the frame when you bring them all of the components. Smaller job would be $10-25 like headset installation, adjustment, etc.

Dude chill. OP is not spending your money or mine on any bike tools, if you are cool with building the whole bike from the frame up I'd love to see that on youtube. Can it be done? absolutely! Is it a good idea? absolutely not!

OP has a carbon FS frame and want to build it from the frame up, one of the point he asked in his op was cost effectiveness. Which has different answer, yes and no. Yes if you want specific parts on the bike and learning as you go, and no, it would not be cheaper than buying complete bike or a groupo/build kit.

Since op did not mention the budget(if he did show me where I missed it), I'm not going to assume that he does not have any to spend, just because someone is new does not mean they are poor as well Last thing you want when building a bike from the frame up is not to have proper tools. It's not like he picked up the bike on craigslist for cheap and want to learn how to wrench it.

I've done my fair share of trailside repair using whatever available but I'm certainly not going to recommend anyone to do that at home everytime, WTH is wrong with you, stop screaming

you are such an unknolwedgeable person it's disgusting! lol, I didn't know I needed to make a youtube video of me sliding a seatpost into a tube and locking it down with a clamp. or putting my wheels on and shutting the quickreleases. WHY ON GODS GREEN EARTH DO YOU NEED A STAND TO BUILD A BIKE? explain the role that a stand plays in building a bike? I wonder if you've even ever built a bike with the answers you are giving, they are so ridiculous. And the fact that it's carbon is irrelevant. people act like carbon magically implodes during assembly without a torque wrench. torque wrenches are for inexperienced dummies. Have you ever seen someone use a torque wrench to put lugnuts on a car wheel? technically the instructions call for it, but people that have experience and know what they are doing don't need to do it.

you are such an unknolwedgeable person it's disgusting! lol, I didn't know I needed to make a youtube video of me sliding a seatpost into a tube and locking it down with a clamp. or putting my wheels on and shutting the quickreleases. WHY ON GODS GREEN EARTH DO YOU NEED A STAND TO BUILD A BIKE? explain the role that a stand plays in building a bike? I wonder if you've even ever built a bike with the answers you are giving, they are so ridiculous. And the fact that it's carbon is irrelevant. people act like carbon magically implodes during assembly without a torque wrench. torque wrenches are for inexperienced dummies. Have you ever seen someone use a torque wrench to put lugnuts on a car wheel? technically the instructions call for it, but people that have experience and know what they are doing don't need to do it.

A know it all do not need technical instructions or proper tools Do you suggest the OP follow your instruction? Youtube vid? I'd love to see how you put up the entire bike not grips, seatpost and reflectors. Headset, bb, and bike adjustment would be a nice welcome.

It's true, I'm not as knowledgeable as you. If you don't like to build a bike with stand then don't. We are not as smart as you to know that you don't need to baby the carbon frame because it's strong and will not implode, who cares about the scratches on the new carbon frame build right? Who cares about torque, if you overtightened the bolts no problem, call it learning curve?

No, I've not build a bike without the bike stand before, or ever, why?. I learned it the easy way. I bought my first bike from LBS, then picked up a few tools as I go, now I have plenty. Except for facing and alignment tools, I have all of them to build the bike from the frame up, which I do all the time. Sometimes I build up a few bikes just for the heck of it, and yes, I still don't have the mad skillz you have. Next time I'm in NYC, I'd sure like so hook up and learn something from you.

Let me catch up guys.... you guys are all too helpful.... I just ordered some specialized s works carbon handlebars... is 640mm the correct length?

Personal preference. Long bars can always be cut shorter. Make sure you get proper clampsize on your stem. It mist likely is 31.8 as opposed to 25.4. Most importantly, don't torque those stem bolts without putting it in a stand first

Let me catch up guys.... you guys are all too helpful.... I just ordered some specialized s works carbon handlebars... is 640mm the correct length?

Before you order you should pay a visit to a Specialized dealer and check out the options. Look around, see how they the bike's built, how they route cables, etc. I like wider bars for trail riding. My riser bars are around 680-750mm. Unless you are riding in a tight singletrack you can go with a bit wider bar. It's a personal preference so try both extreme one that too narrow and one that too wide, you'd figure out what you like pretty quick that way.

If you plan to do more trail riding/ AM then wider bar is usually the preference for most. Specialized only make 31.8(oopps) diameter so order the appropriate stem.

Before you order you should pay a visit to a Specialized dealer and check out the options. Look around, see how they the bike's built, how they route cables, etc. I like wider bars for trail riding. My riser bars are around 680-750mm. Unless you are riding in a tight singletrack you can go with a bit wider bar. It's a personal preference so try both extreme one that too narrow and one that too wide, you'd figure out what you like pretty quick that way.

Oh wow, this thread is a complete mess. Where to start... don't order parts or frames before checking to make sure that is what you want. Post here before you order the parts. The frame may be too big or it may fit you great. Those size bars should be fine, especially since you already purchased them. I ride with bars that wide.

For all of you new people. Mimi has very valid points. You can put a bike together without a stand and tune cables, but a bike stand makes life a lot easier. The OP can hang two hooks in the ceiling of his garage or whatever, but a brick on a 5 gallon bucket. Really? I would not want to set a frame worth 2k on that and work on it. That is ghetto.

Thanks again everyone.... I just figured the bars I purchased would be adequate for the situation... the bars are 640mm long... 31.8mm clamp.... 6 degree up sweep... and 8 degree back sweep.... low rise.... I had a few questions about brakes and gear sets and shifters. .. what is a good brake set up? Avid juicy ultimate carbon? I see the newer bikes run avid xo? Im not sure? I have a 9 speed sram xo rear derailleur and it is a long cage? A friend sold it to me for $30.... i would need 9 speed sram shifters for this correct? this should work right? Sorry for all the questions....

Oh wow, this thread is a complete mess. Where to start... don't order parts or frames before checking to make sure that is what you want. Post here before you order the parts. The frame may be too big or it may fit you great. Those size bars should be fine, especially since you already purchased them. I ride with bars that wide.

For all of you new people. Mimi has very valid points. You can put a bike together without a stand and tune cables, but a bike stand makes life a lot easier. The OP can hang two hooks in the ceiling of his garage or whatever, but a brick on a 5 gallon bucket. Really? I would not want to set a frame worth 2k on that and work on it. That is ghetto.

Yea I am most definitely going to get a decent 360° swivel bicycle stand. I found some good ones for around $120 I am interested in.....

T I had a few questions about brakes and gear sets and shifters. .. what is a good brake set up? Avid juicy ultimate carbon? I see the newer bikes run avid xo? Im not sure? I have a 9 speed sram xo rear derailleur and it is a long cage? A friend sold it to me for $30.... i would need 9 speed sram shifters for this correct? this should work right? Sorry for all the questions....

I'd suggest the shimano hydro brake. The new XT are very nice, but you can get much better deal with the older model which is still awesome. Juicy ultimate is not really that good, many(myself included) have issues with howling and vibration, the newer elixir cr was not better either, it came with my blur LTc.

SRAM xo are very nice they are 1:1 ratio vs shimano 2:1 rear shifting of course, the front are the same 1:1. Yes you'd need SRAM shifter, take your pick trigger or Gripshift.

What else do you plan to buy, next set of question should be fun wheels, forks, tires. Save some fund for a dropper post they are added fun for trail riding. What is your seatpost diameter 30.9 or 31.6?

I'd suggest the shimano hydro brake. The new XT are very nice, but you can get much better deal with the older model which is still awesome. Juicy ultimate is not really that good, many(myself included) have issues with howling and vibration, the newer elixir cr was not better either, it came with my blur LTc.

SRAM xo are very nice they are 1:1 ratio vs shimano 2:1 rear shifting of course, the front are the same 1:1. Yes you'd need SRAM shifter, take your pick trigger or Gripshift.

What else do you plan to buy, next set of question should be fun wheels, forks, tires. Save some fund for a dropper post they are added fun for trail riding. What is your seatpost diameter 30.9 or 31.6?

Thanks again everyone.... I just figured the bars I purchased would be adequate for the situation... the bars are 640mm long... 31.8mm clamp.... 6 degree up sweep... and 8 degree back sweep.... low rise.... I had a few questions about brakes and gear sets and shifters. .. what is a good brake set up? Avid juicy ultimate carbon? I see the newer bikes run avid xo? Im not sure? I have a 9 speed sram xo rear derailleur and it is a long cage? A friend sold it to me for $30.... i would need 9 speed sram shifters for this correct? this should work right? Sorry for all the questions....

There is a sticky thread in the Drivetrain forum about which derailleur with which shifter. The Brakes forum has lots of good information about which brakes various people are having problems with. The long cage is usually safe for most MTB uses. Some people adjust their gear choices so they can use a medium cage and shorten the chain some. Not me.

Exact match shifters are certainly the best choice. Are you going to run a front derailleur as well?

OP, yes if you have the cash buy a repair stand. They are a great addition and you will use it forever! That being said, is a repair stand an absolute necessity? NO! Will it make life easier? Yes, especially when you get to dialing in your drive train. But I am sure many of you out there remember the days of just flipping your bike over on its seat and handlebars and working on it from there. Not ideal, but you can get the job done. OP, most of all, however you end up doing this build, have fun! You will no doubt be frustrated at times, but bikes aren't rocket science. Enjoy!

you are such an unknolwedgeable person it's disgusting! lol, I didn't know I needed to make a youtube video of me sliding a seatpost into a tube and locking it down with a clamp. or putting my wheels on and shutting the quickreleases. WHY ON GODS GREEN EARTH DO YOU NEED A STAND TO BUILD A BIKE? explain the role that a stand plays in building a bike? I wonder if you've even ever built a bike with the answers you are giving, they are so ridiculous. And the fact that it's carbon is irrelevant. people act like carbon magically implodes during assembly without a torque wrench. torque wrenches are for inexperienced dummies. Have you ever seen someone use a torque wrench to put lugnuts on a car wheel? technically the instructions call for it, but people that have experience and know what they are doing don't need to do it.

Wow. So much anger. Building a bike up with a stand is easier than without a stand. It's a lot easier to face a head tube and install a headset when a frame is in a stand. It's also a lot easier to face a BB shell.

Speaking of unknowledgeable, your instructions on installing a bb are off a little bit. You didn't cover press fitting.

Your torque wrench analogy is a bit off too. First, any pro wrench (auto, bike, motorcycle, etc) will have a torque wrench in their toolbox.

Second, your example of lug nuts is flat out wrong. A mechanic absolutely uses the proper torque when installing lug nuts. You're likely too ignorant to realize that they install them w an impact wrench. And the impact wrench has a specific torque setting on it.

The OP is spending a lot of money to build up a sweet bike. Money doesn't appear to be a limiter. So buying a nice stand, while not required will make the build easier and will be used whenever he's wrenching on his bike.

Wow. So much anger. Building a bike up with a stand is easier than without a stand. It's a lot easier to face a head tube and install a headset when a frame is in a stand. It's also a lot easier to face a BB shell.

Speaking of unknowledgeable, your instructions on installing a bb are off a little bit. You didn't cover press fitting.

Your torque wrench analogy is a bit off too. First, any pro wrench (auto, bike, motorcycle, etc) will have a torque wrench in their toolbox.

Second, your example of lug nuts is flat out wrong. A mechanic absolutely uses the proper torque when installing lug nuts. You're likely too ignorant to realize that they install them w an impact wrench. And the impact wrench has a specific torque setting on it.

The OP is spending a lot of money to build up a sweet bike. Money doesn't appear to be a limiter. So buying a nice stand, while not required will make the build easier and will be used whenever he's wrenching on his bike.

Take it easy, Francis.

Sent from my rotary phone and compiled with a telegraph machine.

Not anger at all, just passion and EMPHASIS. With the written word its difficult to always communicat the feel of what you are saying like what we can do in the spoken word so I use some caps from time to time. My dad was a mechanic, I was using impact wrenches when I was 5 years old. I can also tell you that with all of the different wheel types that the average shop isn't taking time to read manf specs and adjusting impact wrenches. it just aint happening. My dad had a SHITLOAD of torque wrenches in his toolbox. There were certain applications they would definately get used for but for run of the mill stuff they didn't come out of the box. Sorry, but I'm experienced, I don't need a torque wrench to install most parts on my bike though I may use it simply because one of my tool kits has a convenient set of hex bits to use with it.
As for money being a limiter, the op did state that he was trying to save a few dollars (to which we all informed him that building himself was NOT the way to do so) but If someone was trying to save money suggesting that they NEED to buy a stand is flat out silly!! An el cheap stand is probably still $50-75. The most difficult things to install for the inexperienced would be cranks and headsets, things that a LBS would charge $10-15 to do. IF you are looking to save money, have the shop install those, then put your wheelset on your bike and lean it up against something and bolt on the rest of your parts, it's really quite simple. I can't believe that this is even being debated!!!!!

Not anger at all, just passion and EMPHASIS. With the written word its difficult to always communicat the feel of what you are saying like what we can do in the spoken word so I use some caps from time to time. My dad was a mechanic, I was using impact wrenches when I was 5 years old. I can also tell you that with all of the different wheel types that the average shop isn't taking time to read manf specs and adjusting impact wrenches. it just aint happening. My dad had a SHITLOAD of torque wrenches in his toolbox. There were certain applications they would definately get used for but for run of the mill stuff they didn't come out of the box. Sorry, but I'm experienced, I don't need a torque wrench to install most parts on my bike though I may use it simply because one of my tool kits has a convenient set of hex bits to use with it.
As for money being a limiter, the op did state that he was trying to save a few dollars (to which we all informed him that building himself was NOT the way to do so) but If someone was trying to save money suggesting that they NEED to buy a stand is flat out silly!! An el cheap stand is probably still $50-75. The most difficult things to install for the inexperienced would be cranks and headsets, things that a LBS would charge $10-15 to do. IF you are looking to save money, have the shop install those, then put your wheelset on your bike and lean it up against something and bolt on the rest of your parts, it's really quite simple. I can't believe that this is even being debated!!!!!

Written communication is far more effective if you use paragraphs, not all caps (yelling).

I'm a little unclear on your point. It sounds like we're agreeing? That having a stand makes a bike build easier.

You seem to be struggling to read for context. The OP stated that a side benefit of the build up would be saving money, which was corrected by many here. But the reason for the build up was to learn how to build a bike, not paying someone to do it.

Installing a headset is really simple. You don't need to pay a shop to do it. It's a lot easier if you have a stand. A stand is something that you'll use as long as you're riding bikes. You don't need one, but it makes routine maintenance far easier.

Cpfitness, I am gonna disagree a bit here. For the inexperienced I think adjusting front and rear der would be the most difficult and frustrating part of the build but still quick, cheap and easy at LBS. Yes, pressing cups should be done with the correct tools but not difficult. Correct spacing on the BB is imperative but most new BB come with very detailed instructions to become nearly a no-brainer. Also, Harbor Freight has torque wrenches for as little as $19.99...not the best but will do for the beginner.

Dam I fell asleep and people went bonks. Thanks fer backin me up cpfitness...

And thanks for the negative points mimi1885.... you shud be proud of how awesome you are AND how many posts those little fingers can push out.

What have you contributed to this post so far beside personally attacking mimi and suggest a backyard DIY crapper. Stop with the number of posts, mimi is a contributing member and the neg rep given to you is well deserved. If you are not comfortable being civil in this forum I'd suggest you go back to pinkbike.

Go back and read his first post, not only mimi did not shred op every said was true. If you want to build a bike get the stand and tools then go from there, it gets easier but there's a learning curve, even said that DIY stand is ok to most general work by experienced wrencher. What's wrong with that?

Not every noobs buy a two thousand dollars frame and want to build it up themselves, it can be done but not easy and certainly not with a crapper and misfit tools. Using the right tools is hard enough for noobs' first build and here you are goading op to do it with a poor suggestions, and got mad when people disagree, go figure.

What have you contributed to this post so far beside personally attacking mimi and suggest a backyard DIY crapper. Stop with the number of posts, mimi is a contributing member and the neg rep given to you is well deserved. If you are not comfortable being civil in this forum I'd suggest you go back to pinkbike.

Go back and read his first post, not only mimi did not shred op every said was true. If you want to build a bike get the stand and tools then go from there, it gets easier but there's a learning curve, even said that DIY stand is ok to most general work by experienced wrencher. What's wrong with that?

Not every noobs buy a two thousand dollars frame and want to build it up themselves, it can be done but not easy and certainly not with a crapper and misfit tools. Using the right tools is hard enough for noobs' first build and here you are goading op to do it with a poor suggestions, and got mad when people disagree, go figure.

Mojo: You must have missed that he was super helpful in his last post where he took what everyone else was saying and passed it off as if he had been the one saying it all along. Is that not helpful? I am glad you realized it was a crapper because I was super confused about what the bucket was for.

Cpfitness, I am gonna disagree a bit here. For the inexperienced I think adjusting front and rear der would be the most difficult and frustrating part of the build but still quick, cheap and easy at LBS. Yes, pressing cups should be done with the correct tools but not difficult. Correct spacing on the BB is imperative but most new BB come with very detailed instructions to become nearly a no-brainer. Also, Harbor Freight has torque wrenches for as little as $19.99...not the best but will do for the beginner.

I agree that tuning deraileurs can take some work but i consider that tuning, not assembly of the bike. Yes adjusting on a stand is easier but again, flip your bike upside down and do what you gotta do or ride it on the block and tweak it which will let you see how its going to shift under load

Thanks again everyone.... I just figured the bars I purchased would be adequate for the situation... the bars are 640mm long... 31.8mm clamp.... 6 degree up sweep... and 8 degree back sweep.... low rise.... I had a few questions about brakes and gear sets and shifters. .. what is a good brake set up? Avid juicy ultimate carbon? I see the newer bikes run avid xo? Im not sure? I have a 9 speed sram xo rear derailleur and it is a long cage? A friend sold it to me for $30.... i would need 9 speed sram shifters for this correct? this should work right? Sorry for all the questions....

I run the Avid Juicy Ultimate Carbon on my SJ and they work well. 203 front/185 rear Avid G2CS discs with metallic pads. The Avid Elixir series replaced the Juicys on the newer bikes.

;'
I will echo others sentiments. Building from scratch and cost effective are two things that almost never go together. not to say that it can't be done, but it's awfully tough if you have no experience.

Originally Posted by cpfitness

dont let the naysayers dissuade you. if you want to start riding right away, buying a used bike is a better option. if your willing to take time to get it built and buy it part by part, then go for it. There are also a lot of speciality tools specific to bikes, particularly in the area of crank removal and installation and headset removal and installation so you not only need to buy parts, you need to buy the proper tools or have a bike shop do certain aspects of your install

Originally Posted by cpfitness

WHY ON GODS GREEN EARTH DO YOU NEED A STAND TO BUILD A BIKE? explain the role that a stand plays in building a bike? I wonder if you've even ever built a bike with the answers you are giving, they are so ridiculous. And the fact that it's carbon is irrelevant. people act like carbon magically implodes during assembly without a torque wrench. torque wrenches are for inexperienced dummies...technically the instructions call for it, but people that have experience and know what they are doing don't need to do it.

Originally Posted by cpfitness

I guess u dont read, he already said he ordered it!

Originally Posted by MadScientist

I dont want to get a bike off of craigslist.... I already have a great frame

Originally Posted by cpfitness

Sorry, but I'm experienced, I don't need a torque wrench to install most parts on my bike though I may use it simply because one of my tool kits has a convenient set of hex bits to use with it.

If someone was trying to save money suggesting that they NEED to buy a stand is flat out silly!! An el cheap stand is probably still $50-75. The most difficult things to install for the inexperienced would be cranks and headsets, things that a LBS would charge $10-15 to do. IF you are looking to save money, have the shop install those, then put your wheelset on your bike and lean it up against something and bolt on the rest of your parts, it's really quite simple. I can't believe that this is even being debated!!!!!

Originally Posted by jrogs

Mojo: You must have missed that he was super helpful in his last post where he took what everyone else was saying and passed it off as if he had been the one saying it all along. Is that not helpful? I am glad you realized it was a crapper because I was super confused about what the bucket was for.

I agree. cp Edumucation is out of this world, he's all over the map. Not only he's a self admitted clueless noob on the post he started in the forum however later in this thread he has become an expert bike builder. Even suggested op to buy a crappy bike from bd and transfer them to the new bike, what a noob move. Oh, flipping bike over to tune the drive train is just classic, cp you should stick with road riding and hybrids. I don't have the patience mimi has to be quite civil with him.

This is a noobs corners where good solid advices to noobs is needed and I think veterans like mimi, rod, ken as well as everyone except the 2 morons has painted a realistic pic for op. These 2 bring bad rep to noobs advising noobs.

Yeah, bikes exolode when you rest them on the seat and handlebars, especially rugged mtbs. And i forgot, the xtr and x9 groupsets on bikes direct bikes are inferior to the ones on name brand bikes. Silly me. Im a moron. I havent built a dozen road bikes in the past 3 years and you know those mtb hex bolts are wayyyyy different than those road bike hex bolts. I dont know anything.

Nice!! I picked up a used set of Juicy Ult 7's recently for spare parts - I should just rebuild those calipers and have them handy. My wife isn't too happy with my ever growing parts pile. I think I have enough parts to put together another bike soon.

Yeah, bikes exolode when you rest them on the seat and handlebars, especially rugged mtbs. And i forgot, the xtr and x9 groupsets on bikes direct bikes are inferior to the ones on name brand bikes. Silly me. Im a moron. I havent built a dozen road bikes in the past 3 years and you know those mtb hex bolts are wayyyyy different than those road bike hex bolts. I dont know anything.

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Yeap, that the confirmation needed. When you see BD deals you just got tunnel vision and only see XTR, X9 components not all I might add, nevermind some come with road cassette, oem fork, god knows what wheelset, and generic headset that may not fit op's bike. To top them off without the bike stand he had to pay to take the parts off, in order to install it into his bike. If you are building a $300 road bike on the budget bike then it's one thing.

Looks to me like op is planing to build a $5000+ retail bike and the advice you have to offer him is lean it against the wall and flip the bike upside down to tune the drivetrain.

Lol I dont know about $5000... but I have $2500... I figure it will cost me that much to get a decent start and have some pics to post. This is actually fun and suspenseful waiting for parts... I am going to go to my lbs for install help if you tube cant help me.... I plan on buying a bike stand from my lbs so I am sure they will help... thanks again everyone.... this is getting addicting to say the least

Yeap, that the confirmation needed. When you see BD deals you just got tunnel vision and only see XTR, X9 components not all I might add, nevermind some come with road cassette, oem fork, god knows what wheelset, and generic headset that may not fit op's bike. To top them off without the bike stand he had to pay to take the parts off, in order to install it into his bike. If you are building a $300 road bike on the budget bike then it's one thing.

Looks to me like op is planing to build a $5000+ retail bike and the advice you have to offer him is lean it against the wall and flip the bike upside down to tune the drivetrain.

Which has very solid all around set of components for him to START riding on. He then has a carbon frame and Reba Shock he can resell. Perhaps the market for a carbon BD frame isn't that high but put the price right and someone will grab it. So he can probably recoup $5-700 from selling those items off. With that money he can buy himself another set of wheels and/or upgrade any parts that came from BD that he feels are deficient. At the rate the op is going it sounds like he is shooting to go pretty high end and I think he is gonna have some unpleasant surprises in his wallet! The little things of bike building really add up. IT's easy to think about wheels, cranks, shifters and derailleurs. But the little things like Seatpost, Seatpost clamp, pedals, saddle, handlebar, stem, tires, etc can really start adding up into the cost of a build.

I'm still in awe that you guys feel the need to tell people that a stand is an absolute necessity. You guys are more bougie than roadies!!! I'm surprised any of you even wrench your own bikes!!!!

I'm done fighting with you guys.

OP, post up the costs of the things you are ordering and keep a running tab. it will be fun to see.

did you get the brakes from ebay or something without rotors? Avids rotors are priced crazy imho considering you can buy a bb7 road mechanical disc brake for $60 and it comes with a g3 rotor that would cost you $30 to buy standalone. Obviously you are going with larger rotors but ultimately,your brakes should come with rotors already, make sure you aren't buying twice!

OP that is a good set up so far. Should be fast. I don't think you should buy a 29er from bikes direct since there would be a ton of research to see if the parts would fit. And since specialized didn't make a carbon 29er stumpy in 09 I am guessing your frame is 26" so truly buying a 29er would be stupid. I am actually proud of you for doing a good job collecting parts despite cpfitness "help". I may have missed it if you have a front derailleur or not. Make sure you do research on the type of pull you need and the clamp size. I am still confused about the bucket. Can I get a picture of how you used a bucket and a brick to hold a bike?

did you get the brakes from ebay or something without rotors? Avids rotors are priced crazy imho considering you can buy a bb7 road mechanical disc brake for $60 and it comes with a g3 rotor that would cost you $30 to buy standalone. Obviously you are going with larger rotors but ultimately,your brakes should come with rotors already, make sure you aren't buying twice!

OP that is a good set up so far. Should be fast. I don't think you should buy a 29er from bikes direct since there would be a ton of research to see if the parts would fit. And since specialized didn't make a carbon 29er stumpy in 09 I am guessing your frame is 26" so truly buying a 29er would be stupid. I am actually proud of you for doing a good job collecting parts despite cpfitness "help". I may have missed it if you have a front derailleur or not. Make sure you do research on the type of pull you need and the clamp size. I am still confused about the bucket. Can I get a picture of how you used a bucket and a brick to hold a bike?

my mistake in using a 29er as an example for some reason i was thinking that is what he is building. The cost actually becomes even more advantageous when using a 26er from BD. They have an aluminum full suspension with SRAM XO components for $2100 as well as a Ti Hardtail for $2500 There is not a ton of research involved in figuring out if a bd bike will work. it's easy enough to look up specs of both bikes. his frame is here Specialized Bicycle Components
first of all, shifters, brakes, and deraileur are definately going to work. bottom bracket shells are compatible. Sounds like he already has a headset since he has frame and fork already but the BD bike has a 1 1/8th headtube while his frame is tapered so that wouldn't work out of the box but again, he's already got a fork so he would be selling off the BD frame and fork (and would get more $$$ for it since he can sell it with the headset already installed. Looks like he also needs a new seatpost and seatpost clamp but he can keep the BD saddle. Over all the bulk of the parts he needs would carry over to the new bike. Again he can recoup close to a grand if he sells of a Ti hardtail frame with those extras he doesn't need and then reinvest it back into the bike. or he could simply keep the frame and make that part of his next project, perhaps rebuild it with lesser components for a beater bike. He has a lot of options. I'm sorry if you guys think I'm coming off as a know it all, I'm just trying to give the guy some options that include saving $$$$ and some simplicity all the while enabling him to learn how to wrench. Hell with the money he would save by stripping parts he could even afford a nice park tool workstand! he's prepared to spend 2500 bucks, if he follows my advice he could have a high end rideable bike for $1250.

my mistake in using a 29er as an example for some reason i was thinking that is what he is building. The cost actually becomes even more advantageous when using a 26er from BD. They have an aluminum full suspension with SRAM XO components for $2100 as well as a Ti Hardtail for $2500 There is not a ton of research involved in figuring out if a bd bike will work. it's easy enough to look up specs of both bikes. his frame is here Specialized Bicycle Components
first of all, shifters, brakes, and deraileur are definately going to work. bottom bracket shells are compatible. Sounds like he already has a headset since he has frame and fork already but the BD bike has a 1 1/8th headtube while his frame is tapered so that wouldn't work out of the box but again, he's already got a fork so he would be selling off the BD frame and fork (and would get more $$$ for it since he can sell it with the headset already installed. Looks like he also needs a new seatpost and seatpost clamp but he can keep the BD saddle. Over all the bulk of the parts he needs would carry over to the new bike. Again he can recoup close to a grand if he sells of a Ti hardtail frame with those extras he doesn't need and then reinvest it back into the bike. or he could simply keep the frame and make that part of his next project, perhaps rebuild it with lesser components for a beater bike. He has a lot of options. I'm sorry if you guys think I'm coming off as a know it all, I'm just trying to give the guy some options that include saving $$$$ and some simplicity all the while enabling him to learn how to wrench. Hell with the money he would save by stripping parts he could even afford a nice park tool workstand! he's prepared to spend 2500 bucks, if he follows my advice he could have a high end rideable bike for $1250.

Again, paragraphs are your friend.

And you're right, this could be a solution. But that's not what you said earlier. What you said was that Mimi was an idiot for suggesting that the op purchase a stand.

Sorry if i dont stick to perfect grammar when typing on a phone. Ive been consistent in my answers all along yet ive been erroneously told im way off base. How much more must i post to prove my points?

Lol you dont have a point. I dont kiss anyone's ass. I havent resorted to name calling. Ive pointed out factual errors and been called a moron and now a dick. Total ********. Go reread the entire thread. People told the op it takes 6months to build a bike and he must have stand. Im the bad guy for calling ******** on that? I build bikes in an hour or 2 without a stand and im not a pro wrench! Now if you want to say it may take time to source parts and stuff like that? Fine but 6months? Lol.

Lol you dont have a point. I dont kiss anyone's ass. I havent resorted to name calling. Ive pointed out factual errors and been called a moron and now a dick. Total ********. Go reread the entire thread. People told the op it takes 6months to build a bike and he must have stand. Im the bad guy for calling ******** on that? I build bikes in an hour or 2 without a stand and im not a pro wrench! Now if you want to say it may take time to source parts and stuff like that? Fine but 6months? Lol.

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Again w the cognitive dissonance. And I most certainly didn't call you a dick. Simply offering some advice.

I agree man, you have missed the point. I have read the whole thread and yes, someone said that it could take 6 months if he were looking for deals and saving up. That was BEFORE the OP said how much he had to spend on the build. And not literally how long it would take to build the bike once he was in possession of all the parts.

As far as repairs stands go, I don't recall anyone saying that he "must have" a repair stand. I myself said that they make life easier but not totally necessary. Why are you so against repair stands?? They are a worth while tool. Higher on the list of tools than a headset press, IMO.

I agree man, you have missed the point. I have read the whole thread and yes, someone said that it could take 6 months if he were looking for deals and saving up. That was BEFORE the OP said how much he had to spend on the build. And not literally how long it would take to build the bike once he was in possession of all the parts.

As far as repairs stands go, I don't recall anyone saying that he "must have" a repair stand. I myself said that they make life easier but not totally necessary. Why are you so against repair stands?? They are a worth while tool. Higher on the list of tools than a headset press, IMO.

Mimi clearly stated that a repair stand was a must. All i said was that it was certainly not a must which he refuted. He then went on to ask how a crank could be installed without a stand. I answered him in detail. Im contemplating shooting a video of me removing and reinstalling my crank! This began as a discussion on doing a build to save money. That is the way I continue to approach it. Hell, i even advised the op that a first time builder will almost never realize any savings but certainly can learn a lot to save money down the road. Can we get this discussion back to helping a newbie build a bike because until someone can present concrete facts proving me wrong like ive done to others, im not backing down.

It was not said that it takes 6 months of building. But if you are trying to save money it does take time to find a good deal on the specific parts that you would want. That is what takes the time. you advice has consisted of telling OP he doesn't need a stand when he has said he was going to get one and to buy another bike and harvest the mediocre parts and sell the rest. If he wanted to be stuck with parts that the company decided he could have bought a complete bike in the first place and it could be specialized and quality parts and not bikes direct parts.

you are such an unknolwedgeable person it's disgusting! lol, I didn't know I needed to make a youtube video of me sliding a seatpost into a tube and locking it down with a clamp. or putting my wheels on and shutting the quickreleases. WHY ON GODS GREEN EARTH DO YOU NEED A STAND TO BUILD A BIKE? explain the role that a stand plays in building a bike? I wonder if you've even ever built a bike with the answers you are giving, they are so ridiculous. And the fact that it's carbon is irrelevant. people act like carbon magically implodes during assembly without a torque wrench. torque wrenches are for inexperienced dummies. Have you ever seen someone use a torque wrench to put lugnuts on a car wheel? technically the instructions call for it, but people that have experience and know what they are doing don't need to do it.

"torque wrenches are for inexperienced dummies"? This is the worst advice I have ever heard on this site. Proper torque values on fasteners, (especially when mating to carbon) is paramount to a safe and reliable build.
The negative rep will be from me. You will be able to tell by the signature, and the fact that I used a Torque wrench set to 5.6 nm to give you proper rep.

"torque wrenches are for inexperienced dummies"? This is the worst advice I have ever heard on this site. Proper torque values on fasteners, (especially when mating to carbon) is paramount to a safe and reliable build.
The negative rep will be from me. You will be able to tell by the signature, and the fact that I used a Torque wrench set to 5.6 nm to give you proper rep.

LOL! The + rep will be from me. You will be able to tell by the signature...

Maybe the brick is used to ensure proper torque without a repair stand to secure the bike??

It was not said that it takes 6 months of building. But if you are trying to save money it does take time to find a good deal on the specific parts that you would want. That is what takes the time. you advice has consisted of telling OP he doesn't need a stand when he has said he was going to get one and to buy another bike and harvest the mediocre parts and sell the rest. If he wanted to be stuck with parts that the company decided he could have bought a complete bike in the first place and it could be specialized and quality parts and not bikes direct parts.

Again tell me how the xt, xtr, and xo parts from bikes direct are different from what the "name brands" put in their bikes. Nobody said anything about mediocre parts, just showing him how to get better prices on best stuff without spending "6months" looking. Lets get off the stand issue, for the last time you dont need a stand to build a bike, nice to have but unnecessary. He said hes gonna buy one, great. Stop putting words in my mouth and putting misinformation out there.

"torque wrenches are for inexperienced dummies"? This is the worst advice I have ever heard on this site. Proper torque values on fasteners, (especially when mating to carbon) is paramount to a safe and reliable build.
The negative rep will be from me. You will be able to tell by the signature, and the fact that I used a Torque wrench set to 5.6 nm to give you proper rep.

Let me repeat myself. Torque wrenches are for inexperiences dummies. Id love to put a hidden camera on a pro wrench and see how often they use torque wrenches. Its CARBON fiber, not silk fiber. You know carbon, the same things diamonds come from. A little common sense goes a long way, the op is a mechanic by trade for chrissakes
Ps i also said torque wrenches arent crazy expensive like someone else made them out to be! Lol
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Let me repeat myself. Torque wrenches are for inexperiences dummies. Id love to put a hidden camera on a pro wrench and see how often they use torque wrenches. Its CARBON fiber, not silk fiber. You know carbon, the same things diamonds come from. A little common sense goes a long way, the op is a mechanic by trade for chrissakes

Yes, I suggested the first thing to get is a bikestand it's no brainer, sop, then njoy said he uses a DIY contraption mojo finely referred to as a crapper. I asked how are you even going to install say a crankset and bb. Cp not understanding the context went on and explained how to do it.

I said, I can see that it can be done but not ideal. Not saying that bikestand is a must. He didn't get it. Now it's on, or how he put it? I'm not backing down. That's when we start seeing his flip flopping the context to fit his new agenda.

...and if you really want to nitpick, some types carbon fiber is also called "graphite fiber".....it all depends on what temperature it is made at - and also the manufacturer's sales guy selling the stuff to you.

Let me repeat myself. Torque wrenches are for inexperiences dummies. Id love to put a hidden camera on a pro wrench and see how often they use torque wrenches. Its CARBON fiber, not silk fiber. You know carbon, the same things diamonds come from. A little common sense goes a long way, the op is a mechanic by trade for chrissakes
Ps i also said torque wrenches arent crazy expensive like someone else made them out to be! Lol
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Then I guess I will volunteer for you to put a "hidden camera" on me then. While I would not consider myself a "pro wrench", I do build bikes all day long for a major bike retailer. All day long the stem binder bolts, bar face-plate, cable anchor bolts, caliper mounting bolts, rotor mounting bolts, BB cups, crank bolts, seat post clamp bolts, etc, are all torqued to spec. I especially pay close attention to torque specs when building my personal stuff.

Yes, I suggested the first thing to get is a bikestand it's no brainer, sop, then njoy said he uses a DIY contraption mojo finely referred to as a crapper. I asked how are you even going to install say a crankset and bb. Cp not understanding the context went on and explained how to do it.

I said, I can see that it can be done but not ideal. Not saying that bikestand is a must. He didn't get it. Now it's on, or how he put it? I'm not backing down. That's when we start seeing his flip flopping the context to fit his new agenda.

One it would turn into a rep party, two, cp would be ban, and three, this would get binned.

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lol, why would I get banned, I'm not the one being antagonizing and doing name calling. I continually try to present facts. on 2 occassions you said a stand was a must before finally conceding that you've never built a bike without one but supposed it could be done. I'd love to know what I've flip flopped on? Bottom line, I could take the op's frame and build it to a reasonably high end spec in under 1 month and under 1500 bucks. I'm saying one month because I'm allowing for time to sell off parts under my donor bike scenario. Personally, I think the op is making a big mistake in going high end on his first build for a few reasons.

1. my personal opinion is that you should start on lower end bikes to help develop a feel and appreciation for the better bikes.
2. Expensive high end parts often aren't the BEST part for us casual riders. i.e. if your a pro racer with sponsorship that doesn't have to pay for parts, you will go with lightweight over durable parts that function equally well.
3, If he truly takes on this endeavor solo and makes a serious mistake it could be very costly. I'd rather strip a thread on a Suntour crank than a XTR crank. I don't expect this to happen he's an experienced mechanic but still, it's possible.

Obviously the op probably should re-evaluate what his ultimate goals are. You don't expect someone to say "I've never ridden a bike before, I want to build my own to save money.....oh and by the way, I want to build it with all the highest end parts that exist" Quite frankly, I think it's a foolish endeavor but when involved in forums I do my best to try to answer the questions that are asked not just inject my opinion on the question being asked.

you guys seem to derive so much pleasure from your forum rantings. I have no friggin idea what this whole "rep" thing even is and really dont give a **** if I have any or not. And I love being called a noob. just because I"m new to your forum doesn't make me new to the world of cycling. you keep building your over priced bikes and I'll keep building my value bikes that equally or outperform yours.

Again tell me how the xt, xtr, and xo parts from bikes direct are different from what the "name brands" put in their bikes. Nobody said anything about mediocre parts, just showing him how to get better prices on best stuff without spending "6months" looking. Lets get off the stand issue, for the last time you dont need a stand to build a bike, nice to have but unnecessary. He said hes gonna buy one, great. Stop putting words in my mouth and putting misinformation out there.

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Hmmm! You are really a noob. The $2500 bd bike advertised 3x10 XTR dynaSys contain only a few XTR parts. Fsa cranks and bb, ultegra 11-28 cassette and knc chain and the list just keeps growing. Slipping grip? Op would ended up spending dollars tryoing to save pennies.

You are not the first genius to have the eureka moment, also why at the beginning and the end on the riding season bd's frames are flooding ebay and CL.

Then I guess I will volunteer for you to put a "hidden camera" on me then. While I would not consider myself a "pro wrench", I do build bikes all day long for a major bike retailer. All day long the stem binder bolts, bar face-plate, cable anchor bolts, caliper mounting bolts, rotor mounting bolts, BB cups, crank bolts, seat post clamp bolts, etc, are all torqued to spec. I especially pay close attention to torque specs when building my personal stuff.

in all honesty, I have no beef with using a torque wrench. considering the bulk of things like stem bolts, deraileur clamps, bottle cages and shifter and brake levers all use a couple of different sized bolts, it's super easy to use a torque wrench. If I spent a ton of money on a high end carbon frame, I would take out my torque wrench and be safe rather than sorry. But as it pertains to the general buildability of a bike, plenty of bikes on the road are doing just fine without torque wrenches being used on them, even carbon bikes.

Lets look at all the specs. Kindly tell me what is wrong with FSA K-light carbon cranks??? thats an upgrade from xtr in a lot of peoples books! ANd obviously if you have an FSA crank it's going to come with it's matching BB! and are you really going to complain about a kmc chain? lol give me a break! the brand of chain should be the least of your worries, its the cheapest part of the drivetrain!

The bike comes with XTR Shifters, Front and Rear Deraileurs and an XT 11-36 cassette. Oh yeah by the way, this is all latest and greatest 10spd drivetrain, not previous generation 9 speed. now I know there is absolutely nothing wrong with 9speed and it is preferable to many but since the op seems to be interested in building up a high end machine, why wouldn't we want latest and greatest technology??
Avid XO brakes and Ritchey WCS bars, stem, seatpost etc round out the bike. Thats a pretty high end build. Not the highest, we don't hve carbon bars, stem, etc but cmon, the guy said he was trying to build himself to save a few bucks. The first place you save in doing a build is by going with quality aluminum over carbon(half the time aluminum parts weight the same as their carbon counterparts)

Chains are much more expensive than front derailleur. So $2500 for handlebars, stem, saddle, shifters, derailleurs, brakes and rotors, tires and tubes, maybe front derailleur, maybe seat post and clamp. Since he already has rims and a fork. That is a good deal? Then have to sell off the other parts. You could get the SRAM xo groupo brand new for $1500 without shopping around and don't need to sell anything.

I'm done, op my pm box is open if you want straight talk and advice about how to build up a bike. I'm sure that we all want you to have a successful build but somewhere along the way we all forgot that there are multiple ways to skin a cat. As a fellow clydesdale, I can offer you insight into some of the durabilty issues bikes will present to you as they are numerous.