Shreddy Krueger

Who gives a sh*t which sells more? I'll have a copy of GTA, I won't ever buy a COD game. I'll be happy playing the newest GTA and I'll leave it up to industry analysts and R* sales department to worry about competition.

Dick Valor

Actually, now that I am thinking about it, I honestly think GTA is just going to slowly fade out a bit. Yes, it is a big series, but there really are so many other great games out there now. In the past, even just a few years ago, video games weren't as big as they are now. And there was no where near as many major hits. GTA may always have a historical value to it because it started out as a very old game, but it is going to slowly just become one of many huge games. I'm sure it will keep up selling well for the next 10-20 years (assuming they keep making new versions of it for that long), but it won't be as big relative to other games as it used to be since games are getting better, more plentiful, and there are so many big hits now (which will just increase with the years going by).

To complement this idea, how many people honestly have a GTA game as their number 1 game? I personally am one of those people who has difficulty narrowing down to one for a category (whether movies music tv or games etc.), but there are enough people who can do this. And if we take their opinions, it is not going to be as much as you think, especially since the most recent version of the game (IV) (which usually is the most representative of a series because it is the most current) didn't seem to fare too well with the video game masses overall.

And for the people who think you could ask GTA forums to get an idea of what the overall population's favorite video game is...... I hope enough of you are smart enough/have even just a bit of research or educational knowledge to know that GTA forums is a very biased sample. And I truly believe, the video game masses as a whole will not have GTA as their named favorite game. Potentially not even in the top 3-5 spots. It's big, I love it, but it isn't what it used to be for video games.

Wtf are you smoking? I wish there were other games out there as good as GTA... I certainly wouldn't be on this forum salivating like a rabid dog over V if there was. IV is my favorite game; RDR is a close second; only V can top them. Given enough time and word of mouth, I think V will sell at least 20 million copies... which is much more than any of those "great games" out there are selling (CoD being the sole exception). GTA will always have a distinctive appeal to the masses so long as R* keeps providing believable open world experiences based on real world spaces.

Actually, now that I am thinking about it, I honestly think GTA is just going to slowly fade out a bit. Yes, it is a big series, but there really are so many other great games out there now. In the past, even just a few years ago, video games weren't as big as they are now. And there was no where near as many major hits. GTA may always have a historical value to it because it started out as a very old game, but it is going to slowly just become one of many huge games. I'm sure it will keep up selling well for the next 10-20 years (assuming they keep making new versions of it for that long), but it won't be as big relative to other games as it used to be since games are getting better, more plentiful, and there are so many big hits now (which will just increase with the years going by).

To complement this idea, how many people honestly have a GTA game as their number 1 game? I personally am one of those people who has difficulty narrowing down to one for a category (whether movies music tv or games etc.), but there are enough people who can do this. And if we take their opinions, it is not going to be as much as you think, especially since the most recent version of the game (IV) (which usually is the most representative of a series because it is the most current) didn't seem to fare too well with the video game masses overall.

And for the people who think you could ask GTA forums to get an idea of what the overall population's favorite video game is...... I hope enough of you are smart enough/have even just a bit of research or educational knowledge to know that GTA forums is a very biased sample. And I truly believe, the video game masses as a whole will not have GTA as their named favorite game. Potentially not even in the top 3-5 spots. It's big, I love it, but it isn't what it used to be for video games.

Wtf are you smoking? I wish there were other games out there as good as GTA... I certainly wouldn't be on this forum salivating like a rabid dog over V if there was. IV is my favorite game; RDR is a close second; only V can top them. Given enough time and word of mouth, I think V will sell at least 20 million copies... which is much more than any of those "great games" out there are selling (CoD being the sole exception). GTA will always have a distinctive appeal to the masses so long as R* keeps providing believable open world experiences based on real world spaces.

I agree with this. I know this is biased being on a GTA forum, but although I've played some good games this gen most are generally forgettable IMO. My life circumstances have change since I was a kid, but the GTA series still gets me pumped even if I don't get as much time to play video games.

The only games coming out this year besides GTA V I'm going to get because I truly want are MP3 and ACIII. Nothing else interests me. That's why I don't care if the new COD outsells GTA V 10 to 1.

HeNDo6750

Between GTA SA and IV = 4 years of groundbreaking and outstanding quality workBetween GTA IV and V = 4 years of outstanding and groundbreaking quality work

Between Uncharted 1 and 2 = 2 years of outstanding and groundbreaking quality workBetween Uncharted 2 and 3 = Again of 2 years of outstanding and groundbreaking quality work

With CoD however, Activision rushes every CoD title without taking the time and the care of their games only to satisfy their impatient fans which are people who aren't allowed to have GTA as there parents are strict, yet CoD has the most violence compared to GTA and also the most less innovated story etc ever to exist in the gaming industry in years. Also 1 year between the same game is not enough. So if CoD fans can't wait for more than a year of the same repeated CoD title, then they should stop saying BS about CoD will outsell everything and also saying that CoD is way better than any other game out there, which it is most definately not.

Now yes R* has been quiet about GTA V, but in a way i'm glad R* is taking their time, but also annoyed at the same time of the lack of info

Finn 7 five 11

Between GTA SA and IV = 4 years of groundbreaking and outstanding quality workBetween GTA IV and V = 4 years of outstanding and groundbreaking quality work

Between Uncharted 1 and 2 = 2 years of outstanding and groundbreaking quality workBetween Uncharted 2 and 3 = Again of 2 years of outstanding and groundbreaking quality work

With CoD however, Activision rushes every CoD title without taking the time and the care of their games only to satisfy their impatient fans which are people who aren't allowed to have GTA as there parents are strict, yet CoD has the most violence compared to GTA and also the most less innovated story etc ever to exist in the gaming industry in years. Also 1 year between the same game is not enough. So if CoD fans can't wait for more than a year of the same repeated CoD title, then they should stop saying BS about CoD will outsell everything and also saying that CoD is way better than any other game out there, which it is most definately not.

Now yes R* has been quiet about GTA V, but in a way i'm glad R* is taking their time, but also annoyed at the same time of the lack of info

Time between COD is one year each, but different developers are at work for each yearly series so really it is two years per game. But it doesn't seem like they make use of those two years at all.

Money Over Bullshit

I think a lot of people were disappointed with Modern Warfare 3 and given that Black Ops 2 is set in the future shows that they are getting desperate to claw back a few fans. Needless to say it won't top the past two offerings. If anything the GTA fanbase has gone up since GTA IV so I'm gonna say yes it can

HeNDo6750

I think a lot of people were disappointed with Modern Warfare 3 and given that Black Ops 2 is set in the future shows that they are getting desperate to claw back a few fans. Needless to say it won't top the past two offerings. If anything the GTA fanbase has gone up since GTA IV so I'm gonna say yes it can

And putting horses in a war game is only set for disaster for Activision sales and animal rights as well. Now horses and animals in Red Dead Redemption fine but not in CoD

mirmihir

dc0322

I voted yes, and think V could outsell Black Ops 2 if only because it's been so long since GTA IV and EFLC. The GTA fanbase is still alive and strong, and my thought is that it has the potential to win in sales especially if both are released before the holday season this year. Even if both are released around the same timeframe, say between November (when BO2 is scheduled to come out) and March 2013, I think GTA V takes the cake on a game vs game basis. However, on the whole over the next say 2-3 years, the CoD series between both developers will most likely outsell GTA V, unfortunately.

Note that personally, I plan to buy both V and BO2.. But if I had to choose, I'd pick V without a doubt.

Zee

R* got lazy, pure and simple. They've been on top for ten years now. They got greedy, got lazy, and took too long to release a game. The video games industry is all about "what have you dine for me lately" and R* havnt produced jack sh*t when it comes to GTA in almost four years. They got cocky, and figured they could wait as long as they want. Until CoD came up from behind and stole their throne, and rightfully so.

Seeing as this section is filled with blind fanboys, I won't go into this point too much because it really is a sore spot. They just can't handle the fact and feel the need to flame. Scream all you want kiddos, you can't change the fact that EFLC didn't even sell over a hundred thousand copies, while CoD continues to break all the records because they can actually release a product ON TIME.

Poet4Life

R* got lazy, pure and simple. They've been on top for ten years now. They got greedy, got lazy, and took too long to release a game. The video games industry is all about "what have you dine for me lately" and R* havnt produced jack sh*t when it comes to GTA in almost four years. They got cocky, and figured they could wait as long as they want. Until CoD came up from behind and stole their throne, and rightfully so.

Seeing as this section is filled with blind fanboys, I won't go into this point too much because it really is a sore spot. They just can't handle the fact and feel the need to flame. Scream all you want kiddos, you can't change the fact that EFLC didn't even sell over a hundred thousand copies, while CoD continues to break all the records because they can actually release a product ON TIME.

Yeah they release it on time, But look what happened to the first black ops the game was full of Bugs and glitches the first 5 weeks the game was out I had about 4-5 updates for the game

And you Say R* is greedy?, Cod comes out every year because they know they will be getting a S**t load of money cause of little kids begging there mums for the game, If anything Activision is more greedy

What legal reasons if you don't mind me asking as i would like to laugh at that

says in the link But I will just sum it up

Infinity ward and Activiosn has a legal agreement that Iw will be the ones who will have anything to do with COD games that are set in the near or distant future so 3Arch are going against this contract

HeNDo6750

This only gets better and better of treyarch going against its contract with Activision of making future games. Maybe if Treyarch gets closed, then maybe the end Activision?, but who knows, it could be?

brian.

Black Ops 1 was garbage. "Black Oops" etc. After that came out, all the "nubs" went to that and all the hardcore (fans of cod, not mode of the game) players stayed in MW2. Over a couple of months, BO died and went off of Steam top ten, but was of course still strong across all platforms - however not as strong as MW2 remains even to this day. All the players went back to the best one. Many of my friends (and I friend usually only pro-level players who can actually beat me in some games) are back from MW3 to MW2, we go in MW3, and we wreck people, it's way too easy, too many noob tools, they nerfed tubes AND nerfed scavenger, should have been one or the other, they nerfed so much stuff overdone, that it just feels dumb now, and far too easy to use Specialist and just destroy with it.

So I believe people have a foul taste in their mouth for 3arch as it is, let alone now that they are entirely changing cod to larger maps, vehicle warfare, etc - it's not going to be cod anymore, at least, Black Ops 2 won't be. Everyone I know for the most part is hoping the next cod will be better than MW2, because the last two have not been, and now it is completely changing the game as described above, and so, I don't think they are going to outdo the original black ops, let alone GTA IV.

We play cod because it is the only tactical competivie FPS on the market. All others are too big maps, too sandbox style, etc - and BO2 is walking away from this, and leaving a void, that I am sure we will continue to fill with MW2.

It looks like they are competing with Ghost Recon Future Soldier or something, and stepping away from the core audience that pays them: The audience that likes fast paced, well-layed-out maps, tactics, all that. It will have some awesome stuff, it will capture much of the audience, it will sell great whether it stays played popularly or not, but it likely won't be breaking records like before, and if it does, it will be for the sheer curiosity in the gamers to see the new engine features being touted and the new direction of the multiplayer, but if it's too different, I assure, we will all go right back to MW2 where skill is required just to defeat the noobs who use g18s and tubes, let alone how good that game is when a lobby is full of pro players.

So, I really don't think BO2 is going to even be considered a call of duty game by the fans who know how far the engine has come, who know all the trash talk on the game is nonsense from people who A: suck at it or B: just don't know what they are talking about/need glasses etc (I'm sure we have all met the type, especially when Battlefield 3 was coming out soon )

It really is true: CoD is IW's baby, and IW died after MW2. Cod is on the way out, and they know it is, so 3arch wants to try and change it and we won't like that. What they don't seem to understand is that we buy cod every year the same mechanics with a few tweaks and under-appreciated enhancements to the engine itself, not because we like cod, but because cod has been the ONLY game respecting competitive FPS design philosophy (levels set-up like target ranges for epic gunfights etc), and if they step away from that, all they are going to do is leave a huge gap for someone else to come in and eat that spot, which if I speak for other hardcore fans of cod, I can say, we will welcome it, because as much as I like MW2 and as much as I wish CoD4 wasn't filled with only modded and hardcore and noob modes these days, I will drop MW2 in a heartbeat for something that takes lessons from that game.

So yea, I really don't think we will see cod do great this year. It may sell huge, it may open huge, but it will die fast, and it will likely be the most childish cod of all time, with the least amount of serious adult players out of all.

Since Rockstar targets the average gamer (30 to 40 years old), they will certainly crush cod if GTA is released in the same time frame, because BO2 is looking like a 12-18 game, not like an adult game. And again, on top of that, if they change the multiplayer as much as it seems they are with vehicles and stuff, it's over for cod, they are done, because they are no longer a real competitive fps that way, and they turn into a sandbox fun time like battlefield instead, and that is not how to sell record numbers.

HeNDo6750

Why didn't they have for BO2 as a 80's theme like the flashbacks from CoD 4 instead of a futuristic game which i thought was IW line of work. Now i'm not a CoD fan, but why didn't they go in full depths of (now i can't remember his name) from CoD 4 along side the main character so the CoD fans understood his past abit more, and went back to MW1 roots of CoD

Black Ops 1 was garbage. "Black Oops" etc. After that came out, all the "nubs" went to that and all the hardcore (fans of cod, not mode of the game) players stayed in MW2. Over a couple of months, BO died and went off of Steam top ten, but was of course still strong across all platforms - however not as strong as MW2 remains ..................etc....

That was a pretty good talk about COD and why it works/is popular. But I don't think it is going to die as much as you are expecting. People say a game is bad INCREDIBLY EASILY. Everyone is always expecting and hoping for something amazing and beyond their expectations, so when the game comes out and it isn't a work from the beyond the future, everyone claims it wasn't that great. I am not saying that the COD's after MW2 were as good as it, but I am simply explaining why it is so common (and it applies to GTA also). People expected so much for GTA IV because the GTA games before it were ground breaking, so when it wasn't incredible they complained. COD MW2 revolutionized the multiplayer for FPS and as you said remains one of the only games to be like that, hence its popularity. But just like GTA retains a crowd, COD will retain a crowd.

But then you also have to seriously consider what another poster said about R* being "lazy" (or maybe better said, slow). It is a valid and legit point. And it is what I was trying to get at a bit with saying that GTA isn't what it used to be for video games. If you want to be on the top, then you release a popular game and do it consistently because your fans always want it; and once they stop getting it, they lose interest and look elsewhere for the new better thing. GTA has retained a bit of an audience, but if they consistently put 3-5 year gaps between games, especially if they aren't incredibly improved, then they will absolutely lose out over the next 20 years. Stop blindly claiming that GTA will forever be the most popular game just because of its past. Seriously, let's jump back 20 years or so in video games, what was the top game then? Didn't it eventually burn out and yield way for GTA and COD and others?

The exact same thing will happen again and again. Especially if R* can't keep up with other companies who frequently release popular games in their series. Yeah, they may not be THE BEST GAMES OF ALL TIME, but that isn't what matters in the end. All that matters is that a company makes a GOOD ENOUGH game that is popular and gets a crowd and then after that they frequently make DECENT ENOUGH updates to it that keep people around. People complain about the COD's after MW2 but they keep buying them and love that they come out so frequently (aside from the perspective that they continually have to spend money on it).

I love GTA, I enjoy COD, but GTA absolutely is not what it used to be for video games and it will fade out more and more as the years go by and R* can't keep up with other companies. Sorry, but it is reality. Eventually GTA will burn out and something new will be the top dog for the next 20 years or whatever. It's life, enjoy the game while you can; because whether you want to admit it or not, soon you will enjoy something else more.

superhobo666

I voted yes, I mean, the only people who still buy COD are dumb enough to not realize it's the same recycled features, gameplay and story every time around, and to those who say "but hurdurr multiplayer!"

it's the same experience copy and pasted, with a new gun in each game, the same map layouts, the same textures, animations, kill cams, etc.

every year it's the same recycled content with a few new guns added.

the other ones are the kids who aren't yet smart enough to realize it's the same content over and over, but have the potential to realize this and (hopefully) move onto something better.

I for one won't be buying COD haven't liked COD since before Modern Warfare.

brian.

I agree with you to an extent, Booger. I feel rockstar is fully wrong when they say they don't need a GTA every year (even if it's on handhelds and later ported to other systems, and what not - they need more GTA)

For basically the exact reasons you explained. However, in the case of GTA V, this is going to be a very, very massively popular game.

Also, I think IV was incredible. It's still to this day the most advanced game on the market (barring perhaps RDR? but i dunno... it doesn't have cars, helicopters, modern architectural shaders, lots of 'electric lights', RDR has a lot, but I think GTA IV actually has more quantity). Unreal Engine lacked most of GTA IV's features until March of 2011 and still doesn't match rage, and could never run GTA IV without a complete rewrite. Euphoria, the sheer volume of work in the map, GTA IV is uncontested as the most advanced "all around" package a gamer can play today. Sure, BF3 has shiny graphics and a couple vehicles, but those maps are a joke cause they are terrain with a couple models here and there, while GTA games are fully made of unique models (V may use terrain subsystem, but I doubt it, but can't be sure), Cryengine is nice with advanced terrain and all, but it's not capable of GTA IV either. It takes a very special engine to do GTA IV, a specialized type of streaming, alongside all of the cinematic-quality cars, procedural animations, all that stuff makes GTA IV a modern marvel of game development.

I think the people who were let down by IV after SA overlook that LC isn't SA, you know what I mean?

QUOTE

I voted yes, I mean, the only people who still buy COD are dumb enough to not realize it's the same recycled features, gameplay and story every time around, and to those who say "but hurdurr multiplayer!"

No offense intended at all to you, but the only people who say THAT are people who 1: know nothing about game development, 2: need glasses, 3: hate it cause they get beat in it and never win

It's true man! The only people who hate cod are either fans of a competitor that isn't even the same genre of fps, or they just are bad at it, or, again, they really don't realize just how advanced the cod engine is. I am into game development, I am into engines, I research daily, CoD engine is leaps and bounds further than it is given credit, and just as there are no engines out there that can do GTA IV, there is no engine out there currently that can do MW2 either. There is a lot of overlooked work in that tech. The player count is small because props are all synced. When something blows up on your screen, it blows up on mine, etc. Spend on that immersive stuff instead of more players = smart. Trust me, that is a recycled complaint, and has been wrong since the first time it was uttered by a bf fan. Trust me, Call of Duty is a true powerhouse tech that people poop on, but never really amount to much substance, because people who know about IdTech3, know that what IW did over the years with that engine, is nothing short of amazing. It's not recycled, it's refined and iterated, and nothing from idtech 3 even remains except for command names, everything has been completely rewritten and they fully own it and it is no longer an old engine

Where it's going now? Dunno. Where it was in MW2? That is the best Tactical Competitive FPS engine ever made.

Black Ops 1 was garbage. "Black Oops" etc. After that came out, all the "nubs" went to that and all the hardcore (fans of cod, not mode of the game) players stayed in MW2. Over a couple of months, BO died and went off of Steam top ten, but was of course still strong across all platforms - however not as strong as MW2 remains ..................etc....

That was a pretty good talk about COD and why it works/is popular. But I don't think it is going to die as much as you are expecting. People say a game is bad INCREDIBLY EASILY. Everyone is always expecting and hoping for something amazing and beyond their expectations, so when the game comes out and it isn't a work from the beyond the future, everyone claims it wasn't that great. I am not saying that the COD's after MW2 were as good as it, but I am simply explaining why it is so common (and it applies to GTA also). People expected so much for GTA IV because the GTA games before it were ground breaking, so when it wasn't incredible they complained. COD MW2 revolutionized the multiplayer for FPS and as you said remains one of the only games to be like that, hence its popularity. But just like GTA retains a crowd, COD will retain a crowd.

But then you also have to seriously consider what another poster said about R* being "lazy" (or maybe better said, slow). It is a valid and legit point. And it is what I was trying to get at a bit with saying that GTA isn't what it used to be for video games. If you want to be on the top, then you release a popular game and do it consistently because your fans always want it; and once they stop getting it, they lose interest and look elsewhere for the new better thing. GTA has retained a bit of an audience, but if they consistently put 3-5 year gaps between games, especially if they aren't incredibly improved, then they will absolutely lose out over the next 20 years. Stop blindly claiming that GTA will forever be the most popular game just because of its past. Seriously, let's jump back 20 years or so in video games, what was the top game then? Didn't it eventually burn out and yield way for GTA and COD and others?

The exact same thing will happen again and again. Especially if R* can't keep up with other companies who frequently release popular games in their series. Yeah, they may not be THE BEST GAMES OF ALL TIME, but that isn't what matters in the end. All that matters is that a company makes a GOOD ENOUGH game that is popular and gets a crowd and then after that they frequently make DECENT ENOUGH updates to it that keep people around. People complain about the COD's after MW2 but they keep buying them and love that they come out so frequently (aside from the perspective that they continually have to spend money on it).

I love GTA, I enjoy COD, but GTA absolutely is not what it used to be for video games and it will fade out more and more as the years go by and R* can't keep up with other companies. Sorry, but it is reality. Eventually GTA will burn out and something new will be the top dog for the next 20 years or whatever. It's life, enjoy the game while you can; because whether you want to admit it or not, soon you will enjoy something else more.

GTA will not crash and burn, as that is CoD's way of dying (which it already is). Stop being negative towrads GTA, and if you don't like it then move on instead. Also GTA has never had cr*p reviews nor innovation at all, GTA has had so much innovation in the past 15 years like never before.

For example 1997 had GTA 1 released to the world and great successionIn 1999 GTA London and GTA 2 was releasedIn 2001 GTA III introduced the greatest and most innovated story in GTA's current history back then and nowIn 2002 GTA VC was released with a 80's atsomphere and an outstanding story, game content etcIn 2004 GTA SA was released with the biggest map, innovation, story, content etc in GTA's historyIn 2005 and 2006 both R*'s first PSP games in the series with slight improvements, but was outstanding gamesIn 2008 GTA IV was released with R* first attempt of a proper GTA multiplayer and also an outstanding, innovated story and game contents with a few let downs

GTA has always been so innovated in its history and it will continue for many years, as CoD will die very soon

boogernut

I voted yes, I mean, the only people who still buy COD are dumb enough to not realize it's the same recycled features, gameplay and story every time around, and to those who say "but hurdurr multiplayer!"

it's the same experience copy and pasted, with a new gun in each game, the same map layouts, the same textures, animations, kill cams, etc.

every year it's the same recycled content with a few new guns added.

the other ones are the kids who aren't yet smart enough to realize it's the same content over and over, but have the potential to realize this and (hopefully) move onto something better.

I for one won't be buying COD haven't liked COD since before Modern Warfare.

Exactly, you never liked COD. And yeah, people have left it over time, but more than enough people have joined it over the years. Very similar game time after time, yes. Same exact game each time, no. If something is popular the first time around, why wouldn't minute changes be enough?

People don't want GTA to suddenly be a game about running around the city building structures. It is open world, inappropriate, and crime related time after time. It definitely makes a ton more changes than the COD series. But the same idea is there; you just need an idea that people like enough, and as long as you keep it up with enough changes and enough quality, people will buy it until the next big change in video games happens in the future.

Not an attack on you at all, just saying that you somewhat prove the point.

EDIT

Brian. --> I definitely accept most of what you said.

HeNDo6750 --> You seem to be an extreme on the other said. GTA isn't bullet proof and no where near perfect. DON'T get me wrong, I love the game. But I am playing an important Devil's Advocate here in pointing out that it gets much more credit on a GTA focused forum/fan site than it ends up in reality deserving when compared to video games as a whole.

brian.

Indeed booger, on the cod counts - We buy this game because we like it, changing it is the biggest risk I have ever seen ATVI take, and it will likely end in a popular game, but a new, different fanbase. It's probably why Robert Bowling left. But you could tell in every MW3 interview that he and Glen Schofield don't like each other (probably because Robert didn't like where they went with MW3 perhaps, and how they came in and took control and became center of attention when they were only supposed to help like Raven did)

We buy cod because we like tactical, competitive fps. Even a lot of pros say cod isn't competitive, but then why do people get so mad when they lose if they are not being competitive, right?

CoD isn't "recycled", it's "true to competitive fps philosophy", it's just the only game that has been carrying that torch, and now, this year, looks like the first year in quite a few that won't have a real tactical shooter. MW2 is "Everything CSS should be by now, everything CSgo fails to be" - They will probably stretch through MW3 and MW3 is probably going to keep everyone happy until the next IW/SHG game, while BO becomes a new "flavor" of cod. Cool, but I am not into pretending about the future personally, and I never liked WW2 or Vietnam games to begin with (but I disliked BO because it was cheesy gameplay in MP, far too easy for me, I felt like a cheater on free weekends, all the noobs we wrecked in MW2 went there, and never improved I'm speaking of PC, I can't speak to console cod, very limited experience there and I assume it isn't such a steep contrast as on PC)

MW series gripped me. BO2 I think is a risk that will pay off for them, no one can complain about recycled stuff anymore, but if it changes and stays changed, it's a sad day for FPS Dougs everywhere. On a side note, I am hoping to clone CoD on idtech4 as a free open source game for PC with map editor support etc (fill all the gaps cod has been leaving since DLC took over and killed mapping), killstreak rewards, endless maps (as many as the community can make), dedicated servers, if anyone is interested in taking part in something like that - no matter how small, you may be surprised at how useful your collaboration could be), please inbox me.

GTA is loved everywhere, however. I am pretty sure that it is the most important series in video games today. They just have been sleeping on that, and I believe it has costed them, but will never know clearly how much. I appreciate their other work, loved bully, etc, but GTA is really all I care about in games, other than modern FPS, which I really only care for MW2 these days (cod 4 is ruined and can't find normal games that aren't over-populated with too many people so you can spawn, step back, and shoot the guy who spawns in front of you, and of course Black Oops need not say more, and MW3 has let me down but I will probably buy DLC and play MW3 and MW2 for 2013 until OP Kingfish/cod2013)

R* got lazy, pure and simple. They've been on top for ten years now. They got greedy, got lazy, and took too long to release a game. The video games industry is all about "what have you dine for me lately" and R* havnt produced jack sh*t when it comes to GTA in almost four years. They got cocky, and figured they could wait as long as they want. Until CoD came up from behind and stole their throne, and rightfully so.

Seeing as this section is filled with blind fanboys, I won't go into this point too much because it really is a sore spot. They just can't handle the fact and feel the need to flame. Scream all you want kiddos, you can't change the fact that EFLC didn't even sell over a hundred thousand copies, while CoD continues to break all the records because they can actually release a product ON TIME.

I don't really have anything against the COD games persay. I mean they're not that bad, but I wouldn't buy more than one or two. I own Black Ops and used to own WAW. The problem I see is they out date really quick.

6-8 months after release and they already start to date. The only thing keeping COD alive IMO is multiplayer. I genuinely believe they're designed like this for a reason. Think of it like a disposable camera. Sure it'll do the job of a really hgh quality camera, but it's designed to be thrown away after use.

Hardly anyone ever talks about single player. Even the multiplayer while it's good doesn't have much variation between each game.

I played MW when it came out and when I bought Black Ops last year the first thing I noticed was how little had changed even though there was a good 3 years between the two games. I know the GTA games generally repeat certain concepts, but R* do a good enough job to make each game feel different. The COD series literally is cut and paste. The only real variation is the setting and time period.

I think the COD series would work better if there was a bit of a break between the games. I mean you start to get really into it and 12 months later you know there'll be a new one which your mates will all buy. They don't have a long life span. I bet when GTA V comes out it'll be played years after like all GTAs are. Who still plays COD older than MW3 or even Black Ops?

Also what do you expect on a GTA forum? Seriously Zee you've been coming on here for months and annoying people with the same, old repetitive arguments. We know you love COD, but please remember what forum you're posting on.

I don't hate the series, but I certainly don't love it. Does that make me a blind fanboy?

Diego Delgado

Call of Duty is lame as hell, stopped playin it after Modern warfare 2, they come out with a new game ever 4 months it seems like lol... GTA 4 beats all the newest COD games to hell and its outdated. GTA V WILL DOMINATE ALL

WorldofCog

F**k Call of Duty, that s**t ain't nothing compared to GTA. I don't seem to understand why every Call of Duty is so overhyped and overrated when every game is the same, and they come out every year. The last good CoD game IMO was WaW (and probably MW2 as well) - after that, it started to crash and burn.

F**k Call of Duty, that s**t ain't nothing compared to GTA. I don't seem to understand why every Call of Duty is so overhyped and overrated when every game is the same, and they come out every year. The last good CoD game IMO was WaW (and probably MW2 as well) - after that, it started to crash and burn.

ITT: I voted Yes.

That's what I was getting at before. COD comes around so quick you don't have time to sneeze.

For example what's the point of getting Black Ops 2 when apart from the single player campaign it's going to be the same old, same old? Again I know this can be said about GTA V, but there's so many factors that make up each GTA game that makes them different from eachother like the story, characters, location, atmosphere, theme etc.

IMO the developers should've just made a game called "Call of Duty" without any single player and just update its multiplayer every year.

Saves forking out the $60 (Or over $100 AUD) every year. I find it funny how Zee calls R* greedy, but how can they be greedy when they don't over saturate the market with GTA titles every year and suck people in?

I understand leaving a title too long can potentially hurt, but as far as I'm concerned the amount of time between GTA IV and GTA V is basically the normal for most acclaimed franchises.

No one complained when Skyrim came out 5 years after Oblivion did they? As I said I think the only thing keeps COD alive is multiplayer. No one from who I know ever raves on how awesome the single player campaign is like how people do with the GTA games.

In reality after GTA V comes out there'll probably be another 4 CODs before GTA VI or whatever, but eventually people will get sick of the copy and paste formula. Hell people already are.