My above post is the reason I don't write fan-fiction. I fear I might semi-decent at it and like it, and Fanfiction leads down a dark and empty path imo.

Which is why I try to invent my own stuff.

You know on the topic of snake people, iirc doesn't the Buddhism mythology have Naga? who don't have souls and are thus exempt from the revolving wheel of reincarnation, so basically they are stuck as snake people? I mean isn't being unable to wear shoes or pants is bad enough?

Zummorr wrote:My above post is the reason I don't write fan-fiction. I fear I might semi-decent at it and like it, and Fanfiction leads down a dark and empty path imo.

Which is why I try to invent my own stuff.

You know on the topic of snake people, iirc doesn't the Buddhism mythology have Naga? who don't have souls and are thus exempt from the revolving wheel of reincarnation, so basically they are stuck as snake people? I mean isn't being unable to wear shoes or pants is bad enough?

Huh? Why is fanfiction so bad? I mean, yes, Sturgeon's Law is in full-force there, but if you're a good writer, you can inject some much needed non-suckiness at ff.net .

Also, Nagas are awesome ! And honestly, I wouldn't find it much of a curse to be stuck as a snake woman for all eternity (or at least for the Earth's entire lifespan); snake women are pretty much the...second sexiest type of demon/cryptid (sorry, nothing beats succubi!) ! I should know, I married one after all !

...No, wait, if I were a snake-woman, then I couldn't wear high heels, since I wouldn't have feet. Darn .

EarthPhantomTS wrote:Huh? Why is fanfiction so bad? I mean, yes, Sturgeon's Law is in full-force there, but if you're a good writer, you can inject some much needed non-suckiness at ff.net .

Fanfics (as well as fanfic doujin in manga) tend to both suffer from the same issue and it's not necessarily bad writing alone. All too often the writers simply don't understand the characters they're writing well enough so their personalities feels totally wrong even if the writing itself is perfectly fine.

What's wrong with Fanfiction? Well many things. And I'm going to ignore the piles of smut and incoherent nonsense that exist amongst that craft.

The root of many problems come from the fact that it is someone taking ownership of fiction that is not their own. Alice is correct in that one of the biggest flaws is that the writers usually have an incomplete understanding of the fiction they are working with and simply work from that fiction as a jumping point, without understanding that good fiction comes from interplay and understanding of the world and it's characters.

At the same time fan-fiction tends to play off of horridly over-extended character arcs. Which means that it either bloats a character that is pretty much completed (like say Goku) Or worse the writer portrays a character completely incorrectly.

Usually Fan-fiction writers also have no idea how to properly add new depth or interesting points to fiction while still maintaining the same mood. This is why you see hilariously grim-dark fan-fictions and countless mary-sue or insertion type characters.

To me, Fanfiction is born from a burgeoning desire to make something cool and like something that the fan-writer enjoyed, but without enough drive,understanding, or aptitude to nurture the piece of work. To put bluntly with ugly words. People can be lazy and dreamy eyed fools.

The other half of the problem, which is a rarer and stranger beast, is when you get good fan fiction writers who work on their 100+ page pieces that are surprisingly competent. At that point though, the question arises "Why write this as fanfiction? if a writer clearly had enough time and drive to put in a solid amount of work into something...why not cut off it's ties as fanfiction and let it persist as it's own entity? although those folks are pretty rare.

But the issue with those "good fan-fictions." is that even if they become very good, the writer can't really sell the fan-fiction, atleast not really anything major.

I don't touch the stuff for multiple reasons, the ever present dead end for the work is pretty significant. It's also not MY original fiction either, which means I'm not dealing with the piles of other ideas that the original authors likely had. And to me, it seems rather lazy and limiting to bypass the work of making an interesting background for one's fiction by just borrowing it from someone else.

There is a decent RL friend of mine who is currently doing this (for RWBY and Naruto of all things) and while he is an okay writer he falls into many of the traps that these kinds of authors fall into. Stuff they add doesn't fit into the fiction naturally, the characters they add are somewhat depthless or their personalities aren't developed enough. I'm not telling him to stop writing fan-fiction, but I have mentioned to him that I'm not familiar with both those series, so assuming I have knowledge of them if you mention stuff is going to confuse me.

Come to think of it, I've been wondering about that last e-mail that Iso got offscreen and then couldn't get onscreen... From a quick check of the wiki's page about the e-mails, I'm guessing it was #41, the one about the rug , right? I see #40 in the list at 16:03 in the final episode, and now that I think about it, I'm pretty sure I remember Iso laughing about Xelpud talking about taking up knitting ...

But the way that you get #40 and #41, according to the wiki, I find very interesting. Partly because part of me wonders why the developers would expect players to go tromping around the ruins, revisiting places where they've already solved the puzzles, when the Surface has gone into Extreme Serious Time mode and the endgame is right there... and partly because the rest of me wonders how they keep track of stats like "number of treasure locations revisited" efficiently.

Actually, I wanna talk about snake-girls. Why are snake-girls, like Tiamat and Nu-Wa, so hot ? Anyone got any ideas? Is it the fact that they have nice, sexy racks? The fact that their tail can squeeze the air out of you? The fact that they're typically evil (Evil is Sexy, after all !)? Or is it their power and smarts? Or something else?

bug girls are important 2 me but there arent many of them anywhere... cept in like, Touhou, which has a nightbug and also a spider I believe?

Girtablilu's awesome too ! Even though I personally think she's overshadowed by her mom, she's still adorbs in her own right (and I believe I shared an adorable and quite sexy fanart of her earlier in the thread)!

(Also, if you want bug-women, there's some in D&D and plenty in the Monster Girl Encyclopedia)

Last edited by EarthPhantomTS on June 19th, 2015, 2:26 am, edited 1 time in total.

EarthPhantomTS wrote:Okay, you know what? Sorry I asked . Let's just go back to talking about snake-girls and La Mulana, alright?

Sorry. if I came off as dismissive. I've just have been asked "If you were going to write Fan-fiction for something you really enjoy what would it be of?" It's not that fan fiction can't be good...just it's not for me...Don't feel like you offended me either I enjoy having a chance to talk.

On a side note regarding snake people. While snakes are known for pretty much only have small spurs of their remnant limbs a few lizards. The Mexican Mole Lizard of the lizard family Bipedidae actually has two decently developed forelimbs that it uses for digging. While it pretty far from a Naga. It is part of the group Amphisbaenia. (which are legless lizards)

It's pretty much the only representative of it's family but hey, it's a critter that has forelimbs and moves by undulatory motion! It's almost a Naga right? even if it looks like a worm. and it's sorta cute.

you know, I would imagine that the body shape of Naga would be pretty terrible evolutionarily. the Snake-tail and undulating locomotion is normally fairly energetically favorable but mostly because the organism doesn't have to expend energy on posture muscles iirc. But by adding a vertical trunk like that, you lose the energy favor-ability due to the posture costs. At the same time The speed at which the naga would move, is rather poor as well, since anaconda and other large snakes are much slower than two legged humans. Maybe it would be a decent form for scaling certain trees, but in rainforest-y areas the exposed thin skin of the human torso is just asking for bug bites,while the scaley snake portion would be an annoying target for clinging parasites due to the large surface area the snake torso would occupy. (reptiles still get ticks btw).

The higher vertical clearance of the human body would make it very difficult for the intended stalking and constricting intended by the snake portion. While at the same time the long snake portion would might make heat regulation by traveling would be much more difficult due to higher surface area. At the same time I would imagine that the snake portion would take long of grooming and managing. Another issue is that due to a crossing of mammalian and reptilian characteristics Naga would lose the reptilian benefit of water storage, since the water impermeable barrier of mammals is pierced by their hairs.

Sooo I'm at a loss as to what evolutionary benefits a serpent humanoid would have. Maybe climbing very tall vertical trees and manipulating objects, but the whole hybrid nature kinda renders the individual adaptations of the two animal groups moot. (which is what makes most mythological creatures really funny) Maybe the tail would be prehensile, but that seems redundant given the forelimbs.

The thoughts of the placement of the genitalia do give me the shudders. I do have a theory though regarding La-mulana's Tiamat...

Zummorr wrote:you know, I would imagine that the body shape of Naga would be pretty terrible evolutionarily. the Snake-tail and undulating locomotion is normally fairly energetically favorable but mostly because the organism doesn't have to expend energy on posture muscles iirc. But by adding a vertical trunk like that, you lose the energy favor-ability due to the posture costs. At the same time The speed at which the naga would move, is rather poor as well, since anaconda and other large snakes are much slower than two legged humans. Maybe it would be a decent form for scaling certain trees, but in rainforest-y areas the exposed thin skin of the human torso is just asking for bug bites,while the scaley snake portion would be an annoying target for clinging parasites due to the large surface area the snake torso would occupy. (reptiles still get ticks btw).

The higher vertical clearance of the human body would make it very difficult for the intended stalking and constricting intended by the snake portion. While at the same time the long snake portion would might make heat regulation by traveling would be much more difficult due to higher surface area. At the same time I would imagine that the snake portion would take long of grooming and managing. Another issue is that due to a crossing of mammalian and reptilian characteristics Naga would lose the reptilian benefit of water storage, since the water impermeable barrier of mammals is pierced by their hairs.

Sooo I'm at a loss as to what evolutionary benefits a serpent humanoid would have. Maybe climbing very tall vertical trees and manipulating objects, but the whole hybrid nature kinda renders the individual adaptations of the two animal groups moot. (which is what makes most mythological creatures really funny) Maybe the tail would be prehensile, but that seems redundant given the forelimbs.

Damn you, reality, always ruining my sexy plans *shakes hoof* !

Zummorr wrote:The thoughts of the placement of the genitalia do give me the shudders. I do have a theory though regarding La-mulana's Tiamat...

Also I didn't feel like mentioning a specific future cartoon series.

Huh? What's that? I'm legitimately curious now.

(Hey, your fault for bringing up Tiamat's pussy! You know who you're dealing with here !)

It's simple actually. My theory is that Tiamat's junk, is at the end of her human torso. My reasoning is the statue of the giant snake lady in the Magma Carverns. She wears cloth over her upper torso and around where her waist is. At the same time Tiamat does have a strange belt buckle/girdle around her waist as well.

(edit) Are you happy? you got me to bring up whats in a snakes metaphorical pants?

Zummorr wrote:It's simple actually. My theory is that Tiamat's junk, is at the end of her human torso. My reasoning is the statue of the giant snake lady in the Magma Carverns. She wears cloth over her upper torso and around where her waist is. At the same time Tiamat does have a strange belt buckle/girdle around her waist as well.

That's...actually half-right. Her pussy does appear there, but it's essentially...retractable. Like, it only exists when she (and I) wants it to. The girdle is just a status symbol .Talk about snake-girl privates

Zummorr wrote:(edit) Are you happy? you got me to bring up whats in a snakes metaphorical pants?

The show I was referencing was an anime btw.

Yes, I'm very happy *her facial expression shows she clearly has no shame*!

...As for that anime, I'm actually curious about that too. I'm wondering if it'd be something I'd enjoy .

P.S. You might actually want to NSFW tag the first paragraph of your post there . Just to be safe.

Zummorr wrote:I was referring to Monster Monsume since that is getting an anime, it's a based on a manga which is a harem of nagas and centaurs and etc.

[Edit.] Regarding the Alice's image. I must say it's still techically a snake humanoid. and perhaps technically more plausible.

Wow...sounds awesome ! You know, I've been meaning to get into that for a while, maybe the knowledge that there's an anime coming will push me to begin?

Also, regarding Alice's pic...ehh, I personally prefer when the "woman" half is on top and the "snake" half is on the bottom (or when the "snake" bits are subtle, like with pureblood Yuan-ti). I don't care how "unrealistic" that is, I've found that I rather enjoy "unrealistic" fetishes (I'm also into macrophilia/giantesses, which is perhaps even less realistic than lamias/nagas, and I also enjoy stripperrific "armor" ), and I just justify it by saying, "It's magic. I don't have to explain crap to you !" Cause with magic, you can do anything .

Zummorr wrote:I was referring to Monster Monsume since that is getting an anime, it's a based on a manga which is a harem of nagas and centaurs and etc.

[Edit.] Regarding the Alice's image. I must say it's still techically a snake humanoid. and perhaps technically more plausible.

Wow...sounds awesome ! You know, I've been meaning to get into that for a while, maybe the knowledge that there's an anime coming will push me to begin?

Also, regarding Alice's pic...ehh, I personally prefer when the "woman" half is on top and the "snake" half is on the bottom (or when the "snake" bits are subtle, like with pureblood Yuan-ti). I don't care how "unrealistic" that is, I've found that I rather enjoy "unrealistic" fetishes (I'm also into macrophilia/giantesses, which is perhaps even less realistic than lamias/nagas, and I also enjoy stripperrific "armor" ), and I just justify it by saying, "It's magic. I don't have to explain crap to you !" Cause with magic, you can do anything .

Well the anime intro should be on youtube. I just know the series is popular, but don't really follow it.

In my opinion there is a recent fad in fiction involving the deconstruction or recognition of said tropes. Where they either take the ideas through their logical progressions or they recognize such tropes and point out the ridiculousness of them, in an attempt to show that sometimes realistic things are cooler. Basically trying to do as little with the "you can do anything." as possible, but maybe it's just me.

Zummorr wrote:I was referring to Monster Monsume since that is getting an anime, it's a based on a manga which is a harem of nagas and centaurs and etc.

[Edit.] Regarding the Alice's image. I must say it's still techically a snake humanoid. and perhaps technically more plausible.

Wow...sounds awesome ! You know, I've been meaning to get into that for a while, maybe the knowledge that there's an anime coming will push me to begin?

Also, regarding Alice's pic...ehh, I personally prefer when the "woman" half is on top and the "snake" half is on the bottom (or when the "snake" bits are subtle, like with pureblood Yuan-ti). I don't care how "unrealistic" that is, I've found that I rather enjoy "unrealistic" fetishes (I'm also into macrophilia/giantesses, which is perhaps even less realistic than lamias/nagas, and I also enjoy stripperrific "armor" ), and I just justify it by saying, "It's magic. I don't have to explain crap to you !" Cause with magic, you can do anything .

Well the anime intro should be on youtube. I just know the series is popular, but don't really follow it.

In my opinion there is a recent fad in fiction involving the deconstruction or recognition of said tropes. Where they either take the ideas through their logical progressions or they recognize such tropes and point out the ridiculousness of them, in an attempt to show that sometimes realistic things are cooler. Basically trying to do as little with the "you can do anything." as possible, but maybe it's just me.

Yeah, I've seen some of that deconstruction stuff, and I think it only works to a point. Like, poking fun at how useless stripperrific "armor" would be in the real world can be entertaining for a while (I remember a College Humor skit that played on that theme), but I don't think anyone wants to read/watch the story of the giantess who couldn't do anything because her leg bones broke the second she tried to walk . I don't know, fantasy is fun for a reason, and sometimes that reason is its ability to do things that'd never work in the real world. Especially sexy things ! Realism, on the other hand, is frankly a bit boring, because it's just our world. Even the best "realistic" things, like crime dramas, are fantastic to an extent. So I can't say I enjoy that trend. Least, that's what I think.

But then, I'm the girl who married the 50 foot tall lamia who fights with her most vulnerable spots completely naked (admittedly, Tiamat wears clothes, but they're just for ornamentation obviously, are more like jewelry, and definitely don't cover her torso...or chin)!

But like when I say look at the how recognized tropes are. just look at Avenger's 2 and how much all the characters recognize the tropes. "And here comes the part where I tell you my evil plan." -Ultron Maybe it just Joss Whedon. but it seems much more common nowadays. sorta a cycle of fiction inspiring other fiction and therefore being a commentary on fiction itself...

Zummorr wrote:In Lamulana Ancient she doesn't even wear that belt of hers.

But like when I say look at the how recognized tropes are. just look at Avenger's 2 and how much all the characters recognize the tropes. "And here comes the part where I tell you my evil plan." -Ultron Maybe it just Joss Whedon. but it seems much more common nowadays. sorta a cycle of fiction inspiring other fiction and therefore being a commentary on fiction itself...

Yeah, I know. She's hot there too !

As for that other bit, ehh...personally I prefer to follow the Rule of Cool and Rule of Sexy. Honestly, if something's cool or sexy enough, I see no reason why reality should win out over fantasy . So if this becomes a broader trend...sorry, I'll just have to duck out of "modern" movies and games for a while and stick with the classics.

Well reality can be a really good inspiration for fantasy. I mean Dragons don't exist in real life, but Girdled Armadillo lizards are pretty cute and the closest thing you could get to a dragon, forgetting all the gliding lizards.

Realing it back in, what is the status of La-Mulana 2? has anyone tried the Demo?

Zummorr wrote:Realing it back in, what is the status of La-Mulana 2? has anyone tried the Demo?

The last thing they did was decide to redo the costumes they'd previously come up with because they felt the original designs clashed too much with what they were trying to do and had backers vote on them.

I played the old demo which is still on the LM1 engine and it was pretty good. I haven't gotten around the trying the more recent backer only one on Unity yet though.