Watching the current massacre of Muslims in Gaza and other such events like in Burma, a question comes to mind: What good are Muslim armies for?

To me it seems that mostly their role is to protect global capitalistic agenda in their respective regions, plus some sort of illusionary nationalism. If they were truly Muslim armies, then what is happening in Gaza would not happen.

I am not a military person, but I think if each Muslim navy was to send just one battle ship to Gaza, I don’t think that Israel would be able to block them. They will kill us one by one while we watch our Muslim brothers & sisters die in different places.

Our armies are good for securing the limited area they are assigned and funded to protect.

The Pakistani army has been tasked to defend against India which has 10 times the budget of Pakistan Army. That is only the eastern border - and we have problems on the western border now as well.

In the given funds we can only manage so much - and we are already pushing the boundaries. As for other Muslim countries - I don't know but generally the capabilities are quiet limited. Much progress is needed in the economic and scientific fields before we can manage to project our power globally.

Whether we are working towards that end is not certain yet. I believe Pakistan is being forced to work towards it through circumstance, that is only explanation for our progress despite the corrupt leadership (not just political). The other countries are either in shambles or locked in some kind of violent struggle

However. I think these last few years after 9/11 many Muslim countries are going to start experiencing change - either peacefully or violently. These few years have brought fourth the weaknesses of our systems and are acting as catalyst for change. It may take time but I hope it will come without much bloodshed.

w/salaam

In case I forgot here is it is... Asalaamualikum

"There is none worthy of worship but He, glorified be He: [Far is He] above that which they associate [with Him]" (Qur'an 9:31)

Not equal are the owners of the fire and the owners of the Garden. The owners of the Garden, they are the victorious. [Quran 59:20]

Allah knows best [who are] your enemies. Allah is sufficient as a Friend, and Allah is sufficient as a Helper. [4:45]

Fudayl ibn Iyaad said: "Verily, if an action was done sincerely for the sake of Allah but was not correct, it will not be accepted by Allah. And if the action was correct but not done sincerely it will not be accepted until the act is sincere and correct. For it to be sincere, it has to be done for the sake of Allah, and in order for it to be correct, it has to agree to the sunnah."

the Messenger of Allah pbuh says; “whoever does not care about the affairs of the Muslims is not one of them.”

Watching the current massacre of Muslims in Gaza and other such events like in Burma, a question comes to mind: What good are Muslim armies for?

To me it seems that mostly their role is to protect global capitalistic agenda in their respective regions, plus some sort of illusionary nationalism. If they were truly Muslim armies, then what is happening in Gaza would not happen.

I am not a military person, but I think if each Muslim navy was to send just one battle ship to Gaza, I don’t think that Israel would be able to block them. They will kill us one by one while we watch our Muslim brothers & sisters die in different places.

Regards & AH

Nadeem

AoA bro..

While your sentiments are right... your suggestion beget ground realities. First of all no army in complete ummah can decide for itself to mobilise, it has to be ordered by respective governments. Moreover less Turkey hardly any Muslim Navy is a lean hard hitting force manned by professionals. Can't same the same for Israeli Navy which is now deploying SSGK subs...

We have a long overhaul due at home before we decide to grab someone by the neck.

"And Make Ready Your Strength, To The Utmost Of Your Power". Quran

Men at their best Pakistan Army

As long as we hope tomarrow awaits

"I'll be glad when we are no longer dependent on US aid". Winston Churchill said in 1954

"Each time Paris was taken during last centuary,French resistance crumbled within an hour". Charles de Gaulle wrote in 1934

What is funny is we citisize our own army to attack terrosits in our own country to defend us, and in the same time we ask what good is our army for if they cannot go defend our brothers and sisters outside our own country.

Does it not prove that there is nothing called 'Muslim Army'? They are merely national armies of Muslim-majority nations?

AoA,

Watching the current massacre of Muslims in Gaza and other such events like in Burma, a question comes to mind: What good are Muslim armies for?

To me it seems that mostly their role is to protect global capitalistic agenda in their respective regions, plus some sort of illusionary nationalism. If they were truly Muslim armies, then what is happening in Gaza would not happen.

I am not a military person, but I think if each Muslim navy was to send just one battle ship to Gaza, I don’t think that Israel would be able to block them. They will kill us one by one while we watch our Muslim brothers & sisters die in different places.

This is a very sensitive topic and one that brings about great frustration to the masses. However, it is important to be discussed and everyone will give in their own perspective and, interestingly, they would all be accurate to some degree.

I would like to jump in and give some food for thought as well.

First of all, we need to come to agreement that the military is an institution of the government that is to carry out its bidding as per the internal and external policies established by the state. Secondly, we must come to agreement that the government is a representation of the people of the state. Finally, we must agree, that a status quo exists between the government and the people based on the governance model adopted to run the state such as democracy, authoritarianism, monarchy, or any other governance model etc.

If you are to look at the present day Islamic world, you will find a mix of all these governments. Take the Middle East (the so called 'crade of Islam'), these are monarchies who have immense wealth and a desire to control their local population. Going to other Arab states, you will find the ability to impose democracy but excessive coups have led to authoritarianism states. However, recent revolutions have dislodged dictators of these state and introduced a confused democracy aka democrazy in these states.

As far as Pakistan is concerned and other countries in the region, well...we know our situation really well. We excessively divided in all aspects of life and I will delve into this topic since it has been discussed numerous times already.

So...what is the point of all of this...well...its quite simple, the different forms of governments and other economic and social factors are what is driving the citizens of these respective countries. Each muslim country is excessively divided. Either the divide is on religious lines i.e. the sunni shia divide. Its either economic or its plain social where tribal affiliations prevent common sense.

What is equally important to realize is that the education level of many muslim countries is paltry. To complicate matters worse, the economic model is twisted and adopted i.e. we want to adopt free-market economy models but its implementation is on the basis of religion. Yet, not enough suitable graduates are available nor are these knowledgeable investors who are willing to flourish potential entrepreneurs. We do not have ambitious entrepreneurs as well.

So...what does the average muslim do...they try to get educated and then run for the west and get settled there and forget they have a home country that can make use of their skill. There is no effort from the people or the government to attract back such skilled manpower. On the other hand, we have people who are uneducated and are in an economic climate where life becomes unbearable. These people start corruption, crimes, or are misled by those who have ulterior motives. Likewise, the governments do not make an effort to handle these problems and create opportunities. Likewise, people associate value to certain professions whereas others are extremely neglected and under valued. This creates an imbalance. Finally, governments and its leaders have their own agendas and are sitting on a throne under which there is garbage (created by themselves and the ineffectiveness of the general population). They will do everything in their power to stay in power lest they fall in their own garbage and start struggling.

However, to stay in power, the head of states need to control the masses and prevent coups. So, they create a police state where the police uses excessive force to keep the masses in check. Likewise, the military is balanced in a manner that prevents coups but is sufficient for internal security.

How does this all tie in to the question you asked? Well...it doesn't take long for one to realize that our ineffectiveness is due to our busy lives in securing our own interests. Our education prevents us to think at a national level. Our lack of education prevents us to see right and wrong and further prevents us from making an effective response. We embroiled in so many financial difficulties that we do not have time to demand from the government. OR we have so much wealth that we do not want to demand something from the government lest they take that away.

The modern muslim is a selfish muslim. Ask yourself one question....what effort have you made to demand from your government at helping our brothers and sisters in Gaza? Are you an armchair warrior sitting in front of the computer? Have you raised your voice and attempted to rally people? Did you carry out any demonstrations or were you too concerned of your own personal work?

This is why OIC is toothless because we simply can not speak up. We are too afraid. Our Iman is weak.

To give you a different perspective...all that is happening now and the minor signs of the day of judgement and interestingly it seems that 95% have come to pass. What we are witnessing now is the unrest that is to plague the arab states in the coming years and will spread to saudi arabia as well. The Euphrates river has almost dried up and gold is now being found...it will not take long before the 'mountain of gold' is found on the Euphrates river. The unending conflict in Syria and Iraq (two countries through which the Euphrates passes) is so extreme that there complete collapse of the government and lawlessness prevails. There are warring parties everywhere. These are ripe conditions for when armed groups will battle to take control of that 'mountain of gold'.

Jews and Christians are everywhere and strike with impunity. Be it a full scale invasion such as that in Gaza or never ending drone strikes by the US and its allies.

So...to put your question to rest is that we are at an age where death is sudden and violent and minor Islamic prediction becoming reality is the evident. It is quite possible that the Imam Mehdi will and come in our lifetime although we may get old...our children may witness them. I do not think we can change anything because this written. We can only suffer because of our weak Iman and we must make Tawbah and do what is in our power to bring about change. Allah will only ask that...the rest is simply happening as per Allah's plan.

Pray for your brothers and sisters in Gaza. Boycott Israeli products. Become and entrepreneur and work hard to fix your country. Work hard to be fair man and enter into the country politics and give hope to the people. This what should done.

lamdacore wrote a long comment, some of the points I could gather from it are:

1) we (muslims) should ask our governments to take action

2) education

3) these are signs of end of time

My response to point #1 is that the governments/rulers in almost all of Muslim countries, with few exceptions like Turkey, are basically agents of the global capitalistic system. Take for example Saudi Arabia and Egypt, two closest to the Gaza. Prince Bandar and his counterpart in Egypt are doing their maximum to choke Gaza and its people to death. SA gave approx. 5 Billion dollars to Egypt when the current crooks in Egypt over threw the government of Moorsi. So asking our governments to help is like asking the assistants of murderers for mercy.

Regarding point #2 I have already stated my response.

Point #3 is becoming prevalent in our society. But does it mean that we should just wait for Dajjal and Mehdi and let these things happen? More over my view on this aspect is that the current secular-capitalist system is Dajjali system and it is preparing Dajjal’s army. When Dajjal will physically appear in this world, he will just order this army and they will follow him, because they will be fully trained by that time. Who is going to prepare Mehdi’s army? Or is it going to appear out of thin air?

btruant2002 wrote “They are merely national armies of Muslim-majority nation”. I completely agree. But nationalism is antithesis of religion, as Allama Iqbal very clearly pointed out.

Blueazure pointed out Pakistan, Iran and Turkey. I agree with some of his conclusions but not all. For example Turkey did send a relief convey during the last invasion even though as he pointed out its armed forces are secular. Iran is not helping HAMAS now.

Saad wrote that “of all no army in complete ummah can decide for itself to mobilise, it has to be ordered by respective governments”. That is very interesting. I don’t remember Gen Pervez Musharaf asking the respective gov if he can do what he did. Similarly I don’t think that the current crook in Egypt asked Moorsi if he can overthrow his government, or the Algrian crooks or … I can go on and on. The point is that they do what suites them.

Noxiouspython mentioned limited resources, technology, money etc. All these are valid but I think the most important is the ideology. If we are not clear on our ideology than the presence or lack of resources is not significant. Until and unless we are firmly rooted in Tauheed it does not matter how many hydrogen bombs, missiles, and submarines we have or don’t have. It was proven in battle of Bader fourteen hundred years ago, Afghans proved it with USSR and inshallah going to prove it again with USA. We need eyes to see beyond the obvious and have a firm belief that Allah alone grants victory and defeat, life and death.

lamdacore wrote a long comment, some of the points I could gather from it are:

1) we (muslims) should ask our governments to take action

2) education

3) these are signs of end of time

My response to point #1 is that the governments/rulers in almost all of Muslim countries, with few exceptions like Turkey, are basically agents of the global capitalistic system. Take for example Saudi Arabia and Egypt, two closest to the Gaza. Prince Bandar and his counterpart in Egypt are doing their maximum to choke Gaza and its people to death. SA gave approx. 5 Billion dollars to Egypt when the current crooks in Egypt over threw the government of Moorsi. So asking our governments to help is like asking the assistants of murderers for mercy.

Regarding point #2 I have already stated my response.

Point #3 is becoming prevalent in our society. But does it mean that we should just wait for Dajjal and Mehdi and let these things happen? More over my view on this aspect is that the current secular-capitalist system is Dajjali system and it is preparing Dajjal’s army. When Dajjal will physically appear in this world, he will just order this army and they will follow him, because they will be fully trained by that time. Who is going to prepare Mehdi’s army? Or is it going to appear out of thin air?

btruant2002 wrote “They are merely national armies of Muslim-majority nation”. I completely agree. But nationalism is antithesis of religion, as Allama Iqbal very clearly pointed out.

Blueazure pointed out Pakistan, Iran and Turkey. I agree with some of his conclusions but not all. For example Turkey did send a relief convey during the last invasion even though as he pointed out its armed forces are secular. Iran is not helping HAMAS now.

Saad wrote that “of all no army in complete ummah can decide for itself to mobilise, it has to be ordered by respective governments”. That is very interesting. I don’t remember Gen Pervez Musharaf asking the respective gov if he can do what he did. Similarly I don’t think that the current crook in Egypt asked Moorsi if he can overthrow his government, or the Algrian crooks or … I can go on and on. The point is that they do what suites them.

Noxiouspython mentioned limited resources, technology, money etc. All these are valid but I think the most important is the ideology. If we are not clear on our ideology than the presence or lack of resources is not significant. Until and unless we are firmly rooted in Tauheed it does not matter how many hydrogen bombs, missiles, and submarines we have or don’t have. It was proven in battle of Bader fourteen hundred years ago, Afghans proved it with USSR and inshallah going to prove it again with USA. We need eyes to see beyond the obvious and have a firm belief that Allah alone grants victory and defeat, life and death.

WS

Nadeem

I agree with you, Allah does not change the condition of nation unless nations strive for it. If muslim will take a step Allah will aid and make that step = to 100 steps, but if we just sit and wait for everything to be perfect before we take a step, we will end up achieving nothing. In Islamic history we can see that muslims armies have been always out number and out weaponed by enemies but they were still victorious because of Allah aid. We need to take stand and Allah all mighty will help and get us through tough times.

Allah says in the Quran that if Muslims have strong faith they can defeat an army twice their size. Yet today entire Muslim world combined cannot do anything to a tiny nation like Israel. This shows the level of Iman of current Muslims.

This is the flag of Islam, for you cannot separate the Muslim league from Islam. Many people misunderstand us when we talk of Islam, particularly our Hindu friends. When we say this flag is the flag of Islam, they think that we are introducing religion into politics, A FACT OF WHICH WE ARE PROUD. Islam gives us a complete code. It is not only a religion, but it contains laws, philosophy and politics. It contains everything that matters to a man from morning to night. When we talk of Islam, we take it as an all embracing word.

- Quaid-e-Azam Muhammad Ali Jinnah (11th January 1938)

Let us go back to our holy book, the Quran. Let us revert to the Hadeeth and the the great traditions of Islam which have everything in them for our guidance if we correctly interpret them and follow our great Holy book, the Quran.

- Quaid-e-Azam Muhammad Ali Jinnah (6th March 1946)

"It is my strong belief, that there is no ideology which is more democratic, enlightened and progressive than Islam."

Allah says in the Quran that if Muslims have strong faith they can defeat an army twice their size. Yet today entire Muslim world combined cannot do anything to a tiny nation like Israel. This shows the level of Iman of current Muslims.

The entire Islamic world did try to take on Israel twice...you know what happened afterwards.

The entire Islamic world did try to take on Israel twice...you know what happened afterwards.

Entire Muslim world? You mean a few weak Arab states. Israel would seize to exist if one Arab starts pissing on your Zionist brothers. Let alone fight. Arabs don't have the courage to take on Israel. We all know that.

So who took down those Israeli planes if it were only "few Arabs" fighting? Are you deliberately being stupid?

Do you realize the inconsistencies in your own sentences.....how much lead did you ingest when you were a kid?

Israel would seize to exist if one Arab starts pissing on your Zionist brothers. Arabs don't have the courage to take on Israel.

Shut the hell up moron. Stupid twat. You're full of ####. Every word that comes out of your mouth is full of BS. Every post is filled with self-loathing, controversy, anger and hate. Always arguing and bitching.

Now get this through your thick skull. There is no need to fight your Zionist brothers who only know how to murder innocent women and children. Yes, your Zionist brothers would seize to exist if just one Arab nation stood up and pissed on them. It's just that these Arab nations are as coward as you are.

So basically you're contradicting yourself and distorting history but when I expose that you have a mental breakdown.....chalo let's assume arabs are coward etc....why don't you enlighten us who are the brave ones?

So basically you're contradicting yourself and distorting history but when I expose that you have a mental breakdown.....chalo let's assume arabs are coward etc....why don't you enlighten us who are the brave ones?

The entire Islamic world did try to take on Israel twice ...you know what happened afterwards.

Please tell me that you weren't asking a serious question. Cuz if you were, then it was a very disappointing display of intellect.

Firstly, the entire Islamic World, as you so eloquently put, was not a collective. The Khilaafah was broken up by the Brits and what remained were fragments of the Islamic World, in the shape of small states run by sellouts and traitors to Islam. The ones who did fight against Israel were fragments of the Khilaafah, lead by a bunch of invertebrates.

Also, I suggest you read Skullbuster's post again, carefully. Because you have conveniently left out the part where it states that Muslims must have a "Strong Imaan" in order to defeat the enemy larger and more powerful then us.

And yes, before you bring up the argument of me suggesting that the ones who lead the fight against Israel did not have strong Imaan. The latter is a far fetched thought, they did not have any enemy to begin with.

So there you have it my dear brother.

In future, may I suggest you respond kindness with hostility .... oh and make sure to leave sarcasm out of the kindness when you respond to hostility.

........ when the first drop of a Munafiq's blood drops in the Kaa'bah ........

........ the Black Flags Army shall rise from Khurasan and commence its earth rumbling march toward Damishque. Any force that tries to come in its path, shall be destroyed with ruthless destruction. Awaiting, upon reaching Damishque, the safron and beads of pearls and the Black Turban that shall lead the Salah of Fajr .........

........ the stones and trees of Lud shall cry out to the Black Flags and tell them of the Munafiqs, Yahuds and Kuffar that are hiding behind them, to come and kill them. That day shall be the day of reckoning, the day of justice, the day when no power shall hold and unfair advantage. The battle shall be fought and won by way of faith ........

Brother the fact is that Muslims have gotten their arses handed over to them on a silver platter....perhaps just using the rhetoric of Khilafa to hide our true problems is getting redundant? Don't you think so?

Either ways...where do you think Khilafa will come from now? Which people will lead the khilafa....the arabs, the turks or the persians? These are serious questions and I think we all know that Khilafa is simply not possible. Pakistanis ka kiya hai...they are very subservient people...they'll gladly and happily accept their place as 2nd grade citizens in a Khilafa....I will bet you my life savings no one amongst the arabs or the turks or the persians will accept Pakistani leadership.

I would also like to mention that doubting the iman of the people who have fought all these wars or are currently fighting is not a good excuse. They have iman that is why they are fighting. Yet they are getting their behinds kicked for as long as I can remember.

The problem is that Muslims are the only people who want to revert back to the 14th century in true spirit while the rest of the world has moved along. It is usually a muslim person who is restless no matter where he is at....never happy...always talking about how the universe is about to end and how they are the only righteous people worthy of establishing global order. The least pragmatic, least practical and the least progressive people of modern times with full of hypocrisies. The most negative people....every Friday sermon they curse the non-muslims with passion but simultaneously utilize everything of theirs...reap full benefit of their progress.

That is why nobody respects the Islamic world.

Check out the Abbasid Caliphate...during which the Islamic world realized their Golden Age...least we can do is emulate them on a national basis, right?

Muslim Countries keeping their military capability up to par & being ready is part of Imaan. Holding tight to the rope of Allah swt and maintain unity among Muslims & not getting divided into sects is also part of Imaan. Truly, if us Muslims have strong Imaan, we can be a force to reckon with.

Secondly, even after all our best efforts; end results ultimately lies with Allah swt. We should not forget that when Righteous Caliphate expanded Eastwards, Westwards, Southwards, its advance was stopped Northwards. We know that from the "Best of Generation" during Khilafah Rashda an army led by Abdur-Rehman ibn Rabiah in 640-650's was defeated by the army of Khazars. Had it gone the other way, I doubt Christianity & Judaism would have survived. We would have been looking at an early departure of dark ages with Islamic Renaissance for all of Europe in the 7th century, and sharing with Gengis Khan’s ancestors on how to do wudu properly.

forum is a place for serious discussion and posts that are backed with concrete evidences and accepted facts , not your typical urban street nonsense

1) 67 six day war

israel had the initiative, better training and most importantly motivation.

2) 73

egypt and syria turned the tables and took the initiative this time, egypt esp inflicted serious damage to IDF in their surprise breach of suez . only continued aid from US and a final threat of nuclear strike prevented the complete rout of IDF

war is a see saw battle , governed with variables, its a fluid situation, the same IDF which routed the main Egyptian army in 67 was given a bloody nose by the hezbollah militia that had no air force and armor to speak of. the SAME IDF is loosing men to HAMAS tunnels

iraq 2003 :-

the main iraqi army routed by coalition forces in one week , barely six months later, the same coalition was loosing 10 men a day in the most violent urban insurgency, ( most of it led by ex-iraqi military commanders ) . in the south, the british were kicked out of basra altogether by the mehdi army

coming to caliphate, i wont expect a village idiot to under stand the complications of systems of governance ,esp when one is intellectually retarded and thinks muslims should protect animal rights

If we Muslims try to find guidance in a system other than Islam, be it secularism or communism or liberalism, we will be doomed to failure.

The only way Muslims can collectively progress and defeat their enemies is by strengthening their Iman. Because people with strong Iman will follow the Quran and Sunnah, and those who follow the Quran and Sunnah will not only follow the principles of equality and justice etc... but also the directives to learn and be educated, to increase the military strength, research and development etc...

Without strong Iman we will end up with groups such as ISIS whose only concern is the length of the beard and the covering of women, or with armies with expensive shiny toys but no will to fight at all.

This is the flag of Islam, for you cannot separate the Muslim league from Islam. Many people misunderstand us when we talk of Islam, particularly our Hindu friends. When we say this flag is the flag of Islam, they think that we are introducing religion into politics, A FACT OF WHICH WE ARE PROUD. Islam gives us a complete code. It is not only a religion, but it contains laws, philosophy and politics. It contains everything that matters to a man from morning to night. When we talk of Islam, we take it as an all embracing word.

- Quaid-e-Azam Muhammad Ali Jinnah (11th January 1938)

Let us go back to our holy book, the Quran. Let us revert to the Hadeeth and the the great traditions of Islam which have everything in them for our guidance if we correctly interpret them and follow our great Holy book, the Quran.

- Quaid-e-Azam Muhammad Ali Jinnah (6th March 1946)

"It is my strong belief, that there is no ideology which is more democratic, enlightened and progressive than Islam."

The Arab-Israeli wars were what the name suggests, ARAB-Israeli wars. Yes non-Arab Muslim countries did provide very limited support but that does not take away from the fact that Arab countries fought the war on purely nationalistic grounds.

Indonesia sent two submarines to help Pakistan during the 1965 war, although they reached after the war ended. That doesnt make it an Indo-Pak-Indonesia war.

This is the flag of Islam, for you cannot separate the Muslim league from Islam. Many people misunderstand us when we talk of Islam, particularly our Hindu friends. When we say this flag is the flag of Islam, they think that we are introducing religion into politics, A FACT OF WHICH WE ARE PROUD. Islam gives us a complete code. It is not only a religion, but it contains laws, philosophy and politics. It contains everything that matters to a man from morning to night. When we talk of Islam, we take it as an all embracing word.

- Quaid-e-Azam Muhammad Ali Jinnah (11th January 1938)

Let us go back to our holy book, the Quran. Let us revert to the Hadeeth and the the great traditions of Islam which have everything in them for our guidance if we correctly interpret them and follow our great Holy book, the Quran.

- Quaid-e-Azam Muhammad Ali Jinnah (6th March 1946)

"It is my strong belief, that there is no ideology which is more democratic, enlightened and progressive than Islam."

You summed it quite nicely and good to find people, though rarely, who understand where we are heading

Our people, societies and visions are stuck in an imperial designed matrix known as 'nation state' and anyone with common sense can conclude that Islam and the concept of nation state are complete opposite; one reason Pakistan has failed miserably is because we mixed both of them, in a quite ugly fashion

In the post imperial era, each 'Muslim' state was given their flag, national anthem and national hero to worship, protect and die for them; an illusion that has no history nor any future

Let me say it what perhaps you were afraid to say openly and we know the reasons also (NSA and co) ...

but allow me to say GAZA and the likes of Gaza would only be protected and liberated ... only and only when we would raise our swords for Jihad Fee Sabilillah ... Jihad by Sword is our destination no matter how much kuffar and taghut will make fun of us ... however Jihad in this context is very very ... very tricky concept

Indeed in this age and in the age of our next generation, Jihad would be our destination; however most fail to identify the means to this destination ... sand thats why we see an illiterate teenager blowing himself up in a public place via SVBIED

Unless muslim nations become polically strong through unity, they cannot do anything militarily.

The best strategy would be to raise militias and send them to Gaza. That way the govt's get out card would be they cannot control each individual like it can army, so these trained fighters can go abroad, eventually sneak in and make a difference in Gaza.

This is all international politics, there are no permanent enemies or friends, just Interests. they can do military deals and upgrades of weapon systems with Israel but freeze deals and stand and look during any conflict in Gaza.

Iran:

According to Ronen Bergman, Israel sold Iran US$75 million worth of arms from stocks of Israel Military Industries, Israel Aircraft Industries and Israel Defense Forces stockpiles, in their Operation Seashell in 1981. Materiel included 150 M40 At guns with 24,000 shells for each gun, spare parts for tank and aircraft engines, 106 mm, 130 mm, 203 mm and 175 mm shells and TOW missiles. This material was transported first by air by Argentine airline Transporte Aéreo Rioplatense and then (after the 1981 Armenia mid-air collision) by ship.

According to Trita Parsi, Israeli support for Iran consisted of several elements:

· Arms sales to Iran that totaled an estimated $500 million from 1981 to 1983 according to the Jafe Institute for Strategic Studies at TelAvivUniversity. Most of it was paid for by Iranian oil delivered to Israel.: "According to Ahmad Haidari, "an Iranian arms dealer working for the Khomeini regime, roughly 80% of the weaponry bought by Tehran" immediately after the onset of the war originated in Israel.

· Israel is also reported to have supplied instructors and non-armaments help to Iran for the war effort.

According to the report of the U.S. Congressional Committees Investigating the Iran-Contra Affair issued in November 1987, "the sale of U.S. arms to Iran through Israel began in the summer of 1985, after receiving the approval of President Reagan."These sales included "2,008 TOW missiles and 235 parts kits for Hawk missiles had been sent to Iran via Israel." Further shipments of up to US$2 billion of American weapons from Israel to Iran consisting of 18 F-4 fighter-bombers, 46 Skyhawk fighter-bombers, and nearly 4,000 missiles were foiled by the U.S. Department of Justice, and "unverified reports alleged that Israel agreed to sell Iran Sidewinder air-to-air missiles, radar equipment, mortar and machinegun ammunition, field telephones, M-60 tank engines and artillery shells, and spare parts for C-130 transport planes." Israeli arms deals to Iran continued after the Iran-Iraq war, although sporadically and unofficially

According to Mark Phythian, the fact "that the Iranian air force could function at all" after Iraq's initial attack and "was able to undertake a number of sorties over Baghdad and strike at strategic installations" was "at least partly due to the decision of the Reagan administration to allow Israel to channel arms of US origin to Iran to prevent an easy and early Iraqi victory."

Israeli arms dealer Yaacov Nimrodi apparently signed a deal with Iran's Ministry of National Defense to sell $135,842,000 worth of arms, including Lance missiles, Copperhead shells and Hawk missiles. In March 1982, The New York Times cited documents indicating that Israel had supplied half or more of all arms reaching Tehran in the previous 18 months, amounting to at least $100 million in sales. The Milan weekly Panorama reported that Israel had sold the Khomeini regime 45,000 Uzi submachine guns, anti-tank missilelaunchers, missiles, howitzers and aircraft replacement parts. "A large part of the booty from the PLO during the 1982 Lebanon campaign wound up in Tehran," the magazine claimed.

Even with such figures for weapons supplied, Ayatollah Ruhollah Khomeini, leader of Iran during the war, angrily denied that Israeli arms were sent to Iran. In a speech on August 24, 1981, he maintained that Iran's enemies were trying to undermine the Islamic Revolution by spreading false rumors of Israeli-Iranian cooperation. He alleged that while Israel had bombed and destroyedIraq's Osirak nuclear facilities in 1981, this was because Saddam Hussein was actually an ally of Israel who "forced" Israel to destroy his own nuclear facilities:

"They are accusing us of importing arms from Israel. This is being said against a country which rose to oppose this condemned Zionist claim from the very beginning ... For over twenty years, in speeches and statements, we have spoken of Israel and its oppression, whereas a great many Islamic countries did not even take a step along this road in opposing Israel. This man Saddam who resorted to play-acting and, as reported, forced Israel to bomb his [nuclear] center in order to save himself from the disgrace he himself created by attacking Islamic Iran—his aim in doing this was to camouflage this crime and give the impression that Israel opposes Saddam, ... That is childish nonsense."

and since 2005 or so, the game has shifted to threats only with little or no Iranian direct involvement in supporting Hamas and other organizations against Israel.

On 2 October 2012, Hojjat al-Eslam Ali Shirazi, the representative of Supreme Leader Ayatollah Ali Khamenei to the Iranian Qods Force, alleged that Iran required only "24 hours and an excuse" in order to eradicate Israel. Shirazi alleged that Israel was "close to annihilation," and allegedly sought to attack Iran out of desperation.

On 5 November 2012, Israel's Prime Minister Benjamin Netanyahu reiterated his willingness to mount a unilateral attack on Iran's nuclear facilities even without US support.

In January 2014, during a plenary session at the 9th World Economic Forum in DavosSwitzerland, the President of IsraelShimon Peres said in response to a question about the threat of Iran's nuclear program that "Iran is not an enemy", and there are no historical hostilities between the two countries. In that regard he added: "I don't see a reason to spend so much money in the name of hatred".

Turkey:

In 2007, Israel and Turkey discussed the sale of Israeli Ofeq satellites and Arrow missile air-defence systems to Turkey to upgrade Turkish military and intelligence capabilities. Israeli defense companies have helped to modernize the F-4 Phantom fleet of the Turkish air force.

Agreements have included air, sea, land and intelligence cooperation, manufacturing of aircraft, armaments and missiles, mutual military visits, training and exercises, dispatch of observers to oversee military exercises, staff exchanges and military know-how.

· The two navies conducted maneuvers during Operation Reliant Mermaid (the U.S. also participated) in January 1998.

In September 2011, military agreements between Turkey and Israel were suspended. Turkey has frozen 16 defense contracts worth billions of dollars since March 2010. Turkey suspended a 5 billion dollar deal for 1,000 Merkava Mk 3 tanks. Turkey also dropped Israel Aerospace IndustriesArrow-2 anti-ballistic missile system worth $2 billion from bidding. Now only U.S, European, and Chinese companies can bid.

Pakistan

· In the 1980s (1980–1988), during the Soviet war in Afghanistan, CIA along with MI5, Mossad and Pakistani-based intelligence ISI, ran a covert operation named Operation Cyclone in Afghanistan to remove the Soviets from the country. During the operation Israel and Pakistan also had high-level dealings through their intelligence agencies, which included military dealings. Israel also supported Pakistan by providing Soviet weapons to Pakistan during the 1980s.

· In 2001, Pakistan via ISI, passed intelligence about the Gulf States and the nuclear ambitions of Iran and Libya, whose programs Pakistani scientists had helped to build.

·In 2011, Israel was alleged to have exported British military technology to Pakistan, both Israel and Pakistan denied it.

The interesting bit about Pakistan is that , israel IAF planned to attack KRL but PAF planned to attack India IAF, not anywhere in Israel.

Saudi Arabia:

The Times has reported that Saudi Arabia has tested the ability to stand down their air defenses to allow an Israeli strike on Iran to pass through their airspace.Both nations have denied this.

After the Arab Spring, Israel views the Saudi government as "guarantor of stability", according to the New York Times. In 2011,

Israel approved a German sale of 200 Leopard tanks to Saudi Arabia. The approval came from Uzi Arad, the national security advisor to Benjamin Netanyahu.

During the 2014 Israel–Gaza conflict, Middle East Eye editor David Hearst wrote an article claiming that Saudi Arabia was supportive of Israel's actions in the conflict, and that officials from Mossad and the Saudi intelligence agencies met regularly. The Saudi ambassador to the United Kingdom, Mohammed bin Nawwaf bin Abdulaziz, denied that the Saudi government was allied with Israel, describing Israel's actions against civilians in Gaza as "crimes against humanity" - however he did not deny that the two countries had had contact, saying that "any dealings by the Kingdom of Saudi Arabia with Israel have been limited to attempts to bring about a plan for peace".

KSA did cut ties with Egypt over camp david accord between Egypt USA and Israel but resumes ties in 1987.

According to an Egyptian Government 2006 poll of 1000 Egyptians (taken at the time of the 2006 Israel-Lebanon conflict), 92% of Egyptians view Israel as an enemy nation.In Israel, the 1978 Camp David Accords were supported by 85% of Israelis, according to a 2001 poll taken by the Jaffee Center for Strategic Studies, based in Israel. So the government of Egypt and its people have different views.

Egypt mediated several unofficial ceasefire understandings between Israel and Palestinians.

iran managed to get US weapons channelled through israel by the bargaining chip of the embassy hostages, this was a diplomatic feat on their part ,smart as they mostly are , israel / US didnt do any favours out of love.