I don't really like the word blog, but it seems pointless to fight it, Zis is a blog.
If you want to know more about an Algerian girl who lives in London and struggles with thoughts that are beyond the remits of her understanding, stories of society and social climbers of love and deception and of a status of seemingly eternal singlehood, then you are in the right place...

Monday, 12 November 2007

30 and single!

So you’re an Algerian girl, from a good family (middle class or higher) note that our class is related more to money and education than to actual blood and nobility…
You decide to move to Europe to see what’s out there and broaden your horizons. You choose London, The America of Europe, land of opportunities and diversity, you feel free and powerful, capable and you can take on the world, so you embark on your studies, work or whatever it is you came here for, you travel, go dancing, dinning, you live your life, make friends and enjoy the City and what it has to offer.

You have a whale of time; you are queen of your castle, at the top of your game, financial independence, glorious social life, amazing opportunities, travel and discovery…and then one day you hit 30…and the one thought you never thought or hoped would come hits you ….Marriage!

You start looking for a partner, a boyfriend of suitabe age...

Let me tell you ladies…those men go for the 20 years od, the little minxes they can control and manipulate to what they think is the perfect wife, 20 years old who never know better than him and therefore will always look up to him, fear him and admire him… they do not go for girls like you and me…we’re deemed a threat, too independent to have husbands and we can never make a man happy because we will always undermine his authority and make him feel unworthy…the truth is I am emotionally exhausted and I only just turned 30, I have only just started to feel the emptiness of a partner and the need for a man in my life, searching will only lead me to Type 1 described above, Type 2 as I said already, it seems I am not good enough for…so what a girl to do??

It seems from my long analysis and 30 years of being Algerian, that Algerian men do not like challenges, they like the easy life, easy gain, the cultural norms and hypocrisy go hand in hand and has been indoctrinated in them since the appearance of their very first chest hair…we cannot change that, so the solution I have been advised, for us Algerian Ladies who want to be with a fellow Algerian man is to lower your standards, do not judge and accept whatever comes your way because you go over 30 and you’ve basically missed the boat and you’ll end up an old spinster, I resent this and refuse to lower my standards, I will be judgmental to my future husband or boyfriend’s manners and education and way of thinking and will not accept less than I deserve.They say your body clock kicks in and your hormones change, you start to feel broody and nature takes it place, the urge for procreation is upon you, you find yourself seeking emotional support and a diffrent kind of stability, so you establish that you would like a man in your life, for a “serious” relationship…you establish your criteria, does he have to be Algerian, Muslim, Tall, dark or blonde (not ginger), intelligent, educated, rich, well mannered, sexy and has big hands (if you feel you fit the description, you can write to me)... You start searching, not actively but as it happens you’re a social butterfly and meet a lot of people, magnetic personality and charisma makes it easy for you to make contacts and network in different “classes” and groups…but you only meet men who are the complete opposite to your description!! Uneducated, not well spoken, not well mannered, not financially independent in fact will without a doubt be dependant on you, and they are attracted to you because they see you as the women with the drive who will make their life better, you’re the asset to have, you’re the mother to his children who in turn will succeed and grow up to be like their mother, you’re the trophy wife that all his friends will envy him for….that’s all well and good for him – he has hit the jackpot but what about me? Where is my ideal man, my trophy potential husband, and the great man who’d be the father to my children and who’d make my life easier and better!

101 comments:

I stumbled across your blog while searching for an insight into the Algerian male mind and I just wanted to say that I understand the search! Hard to find an intelligent, funny, feminist bloke.

I'm sort of but not really dating an Algerian guy who's actually kind of perfect aside from the lack of kissing. I was just wondering whether it's OK for a Western woman to make the first move or is it possible that he is being respectful by waiting. I just don't understand.

The only other Algerian guy I know is an ex and is not willing to help me date another guy.

Sorry to just blab this out on the net to you but if you have a moment it'd be great!

Hi DS, glad you read my blog, did you enjoy it? did you "get" the dilemma am reffering to?

It's absolutely ok for a women to intiate the kissing or touching, you wont be judjed on it (not usually) as it could be a case of him being too shy to do it...if you don't feel like instigating "the kissing", just simple touching of face or hands could elude to the fact that you're ok with him kissing you, which could be his own dilemma, not knowing if it'd be ok with you :)

Algerian guys are great, you can be very happy with!....a lot of them always want to end up with an Algerian girl though...so be careful with your feelings.

I meant to reply sooner but I've been out in the field and had no internet access. I understand your dilemma. I think all women our age feel it. I wonder though if it is hormones or if its societal pressure. Maybe a little of both.

Thanks for your advice about my Algerian guy. I think he wants to be friends though - even if we spend 12 hours together just talking. If he liked me, he would have kissed me already. There was plenty of opportunity for him to do so.

I wish you best of luck finding a decent guy. I'm sure you'll have more luck than me. I am living on the other side of the world, in a third world country where the singel women outnumber the men by at least a factor of 10!

Hi There,I am also Algerian (male) and live in London. I find your post very interesting.I want ot be very brief though: The problem is when young Algerian guys go abroad, and before getting a job, they will actually find it very hard to find an Algerian girl for the following reasons:- Algerian girls from big cities will actually snub guys from smaller towns.- Very sad, but a lot of Algerian girls are materialistic.- They don't want to be judged, and given the size of the Algerian community, they would rather date from other countries rather than date Algerian men.

Meanwhile Algerian guys (students) will look elsewhere, and the exoticness of white girls and south american women doesnt certainly help him to try and make more efforts with Algerian girls, especially that he himself is popular amongst these cultures given the looks and the natural charm!

The Algerian guy is likely to spend all his twenties having fun with girls from other cultures, they give him a lot of emotional supplement, meanwhile he resentfully wonders why the hell he was not good enough for Algerian girls at university.

He is now a guy with value, he has an excellent job, he has class and a life going for him,and he has managed to make it to the middle class in London, he is 30, he is talk, dark and handsome,he is not only a hot property for a lot of european women who now wants to settle down, but also for all those Algerian women that didnt give him anything, in fact if anything, they made it difficult for him to be confident with women, he chooses to give back and goes for the white girl. he now has more connection with European women, he understands them better, why not and all his beautiful youth was on the lap of some European girl.The Algerian man doesn't need verginity, he needs honesty, he has spent his youth fooling arround , he is willing to marry one has also been fooling arround as well, but he is not willing to marry one who didnt fool arround with him, especially that they didnt fool arround only with him because of the reasons above.If I was in your place I would stick with your decision to emmerse into metropolitan London, I dont see any reason for your worries, we are all human and a good man is what makes a good husband, whatever their race or culture.

Hmmmm...your post is very transparent Mr. Algerian Anonymous, though you try to talk in the 3rd person it's quite clear that you're discussing personal issues and dramas here! :) nothing wrong with that obviousely.

It's your experience and you can narrate it the way you see fit, I am not the one to judge.

One little point though! why do you refer to European girls as white girls to identify them from us? how do you know I am not white, I might be blonde or ginger? do you not consider algerians as white? did you know that Arabs are a sub-group of the Caucasian race! North African Caucasiods is the anthropoligical term to describe our race! so there you have it...I shall write something on this subject soon.

Hi, thanks for your reply.I will visit a number of points, but by no means all of them, this is an issue that has been studied and discussed by psychologists from East to West. In particular I will clarify two or three points:

1) W.r.t White vs. Semitic, it depends on the view you take. I like to think that white people are the Europeans and other peoples that emmigrated recently from Europe (e.g. UK,US,Austrailia,..ect), without a doubt, these countries share a lot of cultural values, and are quite different from us.

2) If the best mature Algerian men that you could find, went after 20 year olds, than by definition they are not, and you should definately seek to expand your network. I have a lot Algerian friends (don't even know single female one), and most if not all of them are not of this sort, and all of them are educated and well off and quite similar to the "third person" I described above, so it wasn`t about me it was about me and most of nice Algerian guys I know, although there was some element of style in my reply, as you used "you" I used "He", check out Arabic literature for the way Djarir replied to Farazdak! (not to say I am Arab but I love Arabic language, I am Algerian with a mix of cultural influences, and no I am not Kabyle, and I know who I am).

Have you thought about a middle eastner? I think Algerian guys are made for white women, and Algerian women are made for middle eastern guys, that is what I noticed!

What!!!! Algerian guys for Europeans and Algerian girls for Middle Easterners!! What analogy, how did you come up with this! Please do explain!

I think it’s more like: Algerian guys are for Polish girls because they want the; what you call the white race, yet with the submissiveness and the neediness they like in a women, but Algerian women don’t have anymore or are lacking in! And Algerian women; well they should go with Arab men because the latter are oppressive and backwards, and that will make sure the Algerian women will always be put in her place yet has that ridiculous love and romance the middle-easterners are known for…such self-centretd attitude and double standards.

Algerian men are such BRUTS (no offence I know it’s a sweeping generalisation) :).

I find Arabic literature most interesting but I am not familiar with the Djarir & Farazdak dialogue! Enlighten me please! I would love to know this tale!

As for the White vs. Semitic view…are you saying that Semitic people are not white! Does that mean a blond Jew or a blond Arab cannot be defined as White? Colour is not a religion or a race…colour is just a skin tag, nothing to do with your origins…being white does not always mean you come from the Northern Hemisphere and being black does not make you from the southern Hemisphere or Africa…as being ginger doesn't mean you must be Scottish or Irish or whatever Gingers come from...I reckon they come from MARS….but that’s just me!! :)

A bit tipsy for a Monday afternoon, but will still answer ur question.For the white question, of course I didnt mean it racially, but the term white is used only to refer to my description above, and thats how I use, I thought I was very clear in that it didnt imply any race :)You think that Algerians are bruts, that`s fair enough, as long as I have no probblems with white girls (what I like), and Algerians generally won`t have any problem with whith getting white girls, part of the reason why our women can`t just snub us off (I wont mention particulat cultures, but some cultures tend to have this phenomenon).You insist in drilling into phychology, I will bring it along.Women in some cultures such Arab and black look down on their men coz they see in them all failures of their parents, this is scientific fact.There is no reason for me to try and get an educated Algerian woman who has a complex to try and prove a point, I would rather settle with a balanced white woman, an educated, just emanucipated Algerian girl is the worst that happen, she will be always trying to prove that is assertive,..ect and all the point you mentioned above, and this just hell, relationships are supposed to be harmonial.Plus, I am into leftovers, I wouldnt mind finishing my leftovers, thanks very much but no,but not someone who has been hiding for the past 10 years, acting in propostreous manner, and deciding they actually need now to settle for an Algerian one (we are simply good, and this is a fact). Have a good one!

No problem, this is my last intervention (if you are honest enough to let it go thorugh).I am again tipsy today! but still failing to understand your double standards.It`s ok for you to say all Algerian men are brutE, but if anyone else who tries to draw a common trait on Algerian girls "has deep rooted issues".I havent judged you, obviously we are on a quite different intellectual level.Fi laman!

I haven’t judged you either!As for your "if you're honest enough to let it through" I think I have let all your comments through, I accept criticism and I have no issues with them even though some of your principals/comments seems to be fundamentally flawed...like the "I don’t like leftovers" it's okay if the leftover is European then I take it? Now that's double standards.

Sorry, tipsy again today (and inavoidably tommorrow for tradition honoring and the weekend to celebrate our youth albeit to a different degree!)I think any reader can see that both of us are making generalisations (very important to learn from life experience if you ask me). I am comfortable with that, but you obviously think you are the only one allowed to do so.

As for the leftovers bullocks, I was quite clear, white girls are not leftover to me, I gave been eating from theis plate all my life.Algerian girls on other hand (to the exception of my mother and sisters god blesss them) havent given me anything, and I say NOTHING!I hope I am more clear now.Have a good one!

Hi there, thanks for your continuous interest in my blog, I am glad this is keeping both of us entertained.

As for the generalisation, I did admit I was making a sweeping one and did not criticise you for yours if you did in fact make one.

You use such vile metaphors to describe things, such as “eating from their plate all your life” and certain Algerian women as “leftovers” , also your comment “someone who has been hiding for the past 10 years, acting in preposterous manner, and deciding they actually need now to settle for an Algerian one” is very derogatory, judgmental and so very typical of an Algerian men.

Who are you to judge or criticise any women, Algerian or otherwise if she wants to settle down after having been promiscuous or adventurous, we’re in the 21st century I think we’re all passed the being-judged for the past bit, women are free to be with whoever they want, regardless of colour, religion, nationality or in fact their past. You cry greatness and emancipation yet you’re proving with every word that you’re still in the traditional Arab mind-set of judge all Arab women but my mother and sister. No wonder Arab women are looking elsewhere.

what? an AA? double you tee eff?Anyways, u know i dont care whether u ar emanucipated...ect no cry..certainly, just had a brilliant night, collected few numbers, and off I go for the next few weeks ;)Language? the last time I checked I was only complemented for my dark eyes and hairy manly chest, but also for my accent!Please let go through!

I thank everyone who participated to this blog because I really really enjoyed it, and it's damn funny!!! You made my day. I was so bored at work until I found this blog, by the way that's true I like them young hehehehe :-))))

So stop describing me because you so right :-((( but still like it though.

hello everyone nchallah rakoume zahyine just a bit confused .why did you people left algeria ? and why do you still think in the same backwards way ? even that you live in london and you say that you are cleaver and wise and you have good jobs .so why can´t you just live the way you like and let others do the same and if you say something it better be good for da comunity . nchallah natlakaou fi saat el kheir

Hey DZ-ChickI must admit, the debate was very entertaining :).. I am an Algerian girl, living in London as well, so I can totally relate to the dilemmas you were refering to... I'd love to discover the secret place where Algerian people hang out though.. I have yet to discover it, 8 years after moving to London..Maybe the real issue is the absence of such places?Great blog though, I hope you'll keep it up :)

Did the World War 3 start already? reading the comments made it seem so. (Just kiding).Fair comment DZ-Chick. Without generalising and from personal experience, I found that a lot of Algerian guys can accept from non-Algerian girls what they are not prepared to accept from Algerian girls (call it cultural double standard) if you see what I mean. On the other hand Algerian girls tend to like the european type of guy and look down to Algerian guys.This hapened to me, I was rejected by an Algerian girl in London university that I liked just because I am from a small town in Algeria and she is from Algiers although I am educated and independent financially. There are stereotypes from both man and women in Algeria.I am now married to a European women and I don't regret it at least I tried. Unlike some I found your comments honest and I can't see the Hypocisie or vanity in them, you are only trying to find a stable relationship with an Algerian that you deserve and that deserves you. Everybody has a past and nobody is a saint so don't mention your past and don't expect from people to do so.An Algerian man who wishes you every success in finding your soulmate.

HiI don't think anyone has judged anyone personally.We both made few outrageous generalisations about Algerian men/women, Polish girls and Arab people

I was rather describing in general what usually happensJust to clarify I don't know you.One of the greatest Misconceptions about Algerian men abroad is that they will have lots of fun and then get an arranged marriage with hottest woman in town from DZ .In fact, while it is partly true, it applies to both men and women.Men need to estabslish themselves before thinking about marriage and by the time they are, I think we can give them the right to pick the best.Women on the other hand will be on the recieving end at a young age.And they could take their chance while they are young IF they don't want to risk it. Having said that I do also believe in faith.The ones that dont because of career, and let me say it again, because they think they still young, can still get married whenever they want as long as they being reasonable. Just a little harder to find DZ ones, because these guys have worked very hard and they wonna pick now.Salam

Hi.. this has been a very interesting read..I have a few questions of my own that I hope you will be kind enough to help me with..I am a young blk woman in her late 20s and have a thing for Arabic men.. more Egyptian, Algerian UK born types.. I do meet guys from these countries out and about in London. And even embarked on a relationship with a young hald Egyptian man.. However I have had a few negative experiences wen being introduced to friends.. particularly wen I was seeing an Algerian hottie..and a few friends have mentioned.. that they will never commit to me long term.. Is there any truth to this.. do North Africans look down on black people?Thanks

Hello Optimist, I am sorry to hear you've had a bad experience with Arab men but who hasn’t in general with any men.

"In general" and to be very frank. Yes Algerians are not the most tolerant of people when it comes to diversity. Diversity although major in Algeria has never been taught or mentioned in schools, universities or Tv programmes...etc

Algerian people tend to be very discriminatory amongst themselves in what we call "regionalism" they do not accept outsiders, our culture is very much closed on itself due to political and civil unrest for the last 2 decades almost.

Berbers don’t accept Arabs, Twareg are not Algerians but free men...so many races and so many ethnic minorities and no one understands or even tries to understand the other.

The black race is an ethnic minority in Algeria, very peaceful communities generally found in the Sahara (Ouargla Province being the major capital), their presence is rare in the north and so most Algerians in the north are not used to seeing black Algerians, so I wouldn’t say they are racist or look down on Black people, I would just say they just don’t know how to deal with any other race that isn’t Algerian.

I hope I helped in someway to answer your question. I have actually written a blog about diversity in Algeria its in my draft box, I'll have to publish it now :)Good luck Ms Optimist and keep your optimism up...that’s coming from me ms. Cynical…well lets face it, am a closeted optimist :)

Add: if anybody else has something to add to help answer Optimists question, please feel free.

So...Very interesting Blog indeed! The comments were so long...but I guess I will only react to the last ones...because funnily, I can RELATE!!So Im an algerian girl living abroad but originally from the south, thus, I am quite tanned myself..YET..when it comes to my family's expectations / criteria when it comes to my 'future'husband they can be quite ridiculous if you ask me...and sadly even sometimes racist.Unless overlook, It seems that you guys are forgetting about the importance families and also religion can have in our Algerian culture when it comes to 'ending up with someone'. I dont know if it's because most of you do not value religion or your parents approval when it comes to those things. But I personally do. I am usually only attracted to black men...I really do not believe I am better in any way than my algerian brothers...I think sometimes its just a matter of taste and 'affinites'. So obviously for my parents...as much as it saddens me to admit it, me ending up with a black guy is not preferred...I think I got lucky and managed to meet in the middle with my parents, my man now is very dark skinned yet arab, which will hopefully make everyone happy (as silly and shallow as it may sound!) since my parents criteria a part from the usual Good man, who loves you and is responsible: are Muslim and Arab. While I did not value the 'Arab'part...I only cared about the muslim part and this solely based on my personal values. At the end of the day, if you come from a relatively traditional family..and you love them and want to stay close with them (which is my case)...ending up with someone from a totally different culture...will probably end up bringing issues. However, I know many families (mostly from higher social classes) are very acceptable of different culture, especially when they do not practice Ismal at all.SAD but TRUE : as racist as it may sound...you will often find that lower class/traditional families would usually not accept a foreigners...but if he/she is 'white / caucasian 'melhekk...with an ínteresting passport...and even better if he has money...You can see a change in values all of a sudden. Which would have never happened if the guy were lets say Senegalese or Pakistani.I hope I did not go too far from the topic.To Optimistic, I would say, the best way for you to know if you could end up with a particular algerian (or middle eastern) man, would be to know more about his family. How open minded are they? Does he have any relatives married to foreigners? If you are not a muslim, how important is religion to him and his family...I think if you know the true answers to the above...it would probably help you and figure out if you should run away or stick around :p

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To Optimistic,Please don't leave your Algerian boyfriend, just because of some post by someone who does not even know your boyfriend.My advise would be to evaluate your relationship periodically to see whether it has any future and why not be honest about it and ask him.If you really want to know his intention it might help asking:"Has he introduced you to his family?" this might take some time though and differs from case to case and from family to family, hence my reluctence to set any hard rules about this.He might not be introducing you yet, because he wants to fall in love with you, so that he can have enough strength to Veto off any family bullying attempt for example.All the bestS

Salaam everyone, interesting blog, good read and made me chuckle. Anway alhamdulillah I will be getting married to an Algerian girl (in Algeria) very shortly inshallah. I am not of Algerian descent but I absolutely love the country and people - mashallah I have been all across the Magreb but by far the most wonderful people are the Algerians. And easily the prettiest and most humble sisters.

Hi everyone, that's a brilliant forum indeed.Thanks DZ-chick for bringing this topic out. I am a Algerian man living in London, and I truly believe that everybody is different, we all have different ways of thinking and various tastes although we share the same culture. I agree with the gentleman who said that some Algerian women are materialistic and look down on Algerian guys. My experience is actually quite similar to the one he described above, I've only had "white" European girlfriends here in London and I am very happy with my choice. It was very hard for me to start a relationship with an Algerian girl back home as many of them set up some specific and prerequisite criteria that a man should have (exactly the same ones DZ chick mentioned in her initial message: tall, rich, big hand, and big...whatever),nothing about the personality..., I think you girls should stop being too demanding and assessing men by their exterior and material aspects, you can be happy with a men who's got a good personality, well educated...DZ chick I wish all the best.PS: DZ-Chick, you are not white my dear and you cannot be white even if you are blond, white Ethnic group is used to describe Europeans and European settlers in other continents.

Salamou allah_i 3alaikoumThank you, all of you. From the very beginning of my life i heard mom saying "no camel could see his hump" in our language "b3ir ma ytol 3la edebtou" sorry for the language, but at least u could extract that i am from the Sahara.i mean god created the world so long ago, and he gave us the opportunity to create life (of course god created everything don't object plz), all what we have r choices. As colors and music i think choices are unquestionable. Without a deep knowledge in philosophy, psychology and ethnic sciences we can say "as Algerians" we like sheep have gone astray (another sahrawi stuff) we left our religion, beliefs, traditions...our identity and ourselves. I hope i can live an Algerian life, eat Algerian food speak Algerian dialect ... marry an Algerian girl and be Algerian as my grandfather was(before some white good-guys killed him) we already log in English don't we!?BECOZ there is no more of Algeria, we made OUR CHOICES already we are a blurred copy of them as we wanted to be.Taboos like kissing or whatever used to be a shame to talk about in public, thanks god they invented the internet for us.Excuse me I've got lost, anyway the last words r i don't like a person or a girl bcoz she is Algerian (that's so stupid) but i like the Algerian identity in my girl, that prototype of my mom, my sister and my little neighbor i used to play with. But that doesn't neglect the possibility of marrying a Chinese(yellow) or Cameroon(black) and the list is opened for exotic colors, In the name of Allah, the Beneficent, the Merciful "O mankind! Lo! We have created you from male and female, and have made you nations and tribes that ye may know one another. Lo! the noblest of you, in the sight of Allah, is the best in conduct. Lo! Allah is Knower, Aware"Anyway i hope to find Japanese girl at least they work more than they talk as i am lol.Finally god bless u all and I'm sure that we all love each other it is just Alibaba's band making things look grey , tomorrow is better day, Amen.

@ Anonymous 1: congratulations on your excellent match and recognising the awesomeness of Algerians (how's that for modesty) ;)

@ Anonymous 2: thank you for the good wishes, Algerian women are not all the same, I realise from general consensus that a lot of Algerian men have been scared and had their share of bad experiences with Algerian girls just as Algerian girls had theirs with the DZ boys, we must not generalise on this (ok to generalise on everything else though) my criteria was more candid than a serious set in stone list and it does not apply to all Algerian girls.

@ Moh: not really sure how to answer you if there is anything to be answered, it seems more like a monologue than anything else. So Thank you for your contribution :)

Salam everyone;Bravo DZ_chick, monologue! you got it. Living more than 30 years in Algeria made me a typical Alger_Rien so I do realize that i learned how to walk and talk to myself better than anything else.Truly i feel like praised by your words, because you have just remembered me of psycholinguistic teacher (Dear Mama Naïma) who was in England too, she used to tell me that I'm always out of subject and responding with jokes, but she ended up by giving me a good mark.I hope that u'll be generous enough to do the same.Thank you for your response.

Salam; To the girl that had 30 and single on Monday, 12 November 2007, GUESS WHOM ;)."Time is ticking awayyou've gotta live your lifeday by dayhappy or sad, good or bad,life is too shortyou've gotta keep your head"Salam.

Thank you soo much for taking the time out to read my query.. I think I knew the answer all along.. all men are different, good and bad come in all shapes and sizes and since we are no longer together I guess he just wasn't the one for me.. I am still single and hoping as a fellow muslim to meet a nice Algerian muslim to settle down with. Good luck DZ chick.. continue being wonderful xx

I'm a male!...born and bred in England of Algerian origin, and I've never dated an Algerian girl, not because I wouldn't want to, it's just that i've never come accross any my age. I didn't grow up with any Algerians, so i find it quite difficult interacting with them, as i feel like i'm on another planet. Anyways, my view on why Algerian men, don't get married with Algerian women, is because these men like to get married to gain residence or simply because they are lost souls. The excuses I've read on here sound so over exaggerated!

Excuses? Over exaggerated? That was written in 2007 and it's still as relevant today as it was then! I think your views are a little over simplistic for someone who aims does not know Algerians yet makes such a sweeping statement like that you have made. I think I qualify better as an "Algerian anthropology expert" than you, don't you think? ;)

I hope that you found your man by now, if you haven't? Let me know because I know an Algerian geeza who's the complete opposite to your ideal man or to what you described as latter, well! Give him a try you'll never know it might work lol.

By the way I'll be back to our homeland this coming weekend, send the exact specs and the option you would like your man to come with and I'll have a look don't forget my 10% commission, would you like me to send him CIF or FOB slight difference in the price but I can arrange;-)

well, you can think what you want to think! But I'm always travelling to Algeria and I see things from another perspective, maybe I see things you dont see! have you ever thought about that?

p.s. I didn't claim I didn't know Algerians, I just stated that I didn't grow up with any, because the majority of Algerians have only resided in the UK in the last 20 years! and my god those that came as 3 year olds etc are such cocky bastards, now in their 20's.

I found your blog 2 weeks ago, and I really like to read it time to time.I'm an algerian girl myself from France but living in the UK now. I'm also looking for a suitable man that I can marry and I refuse as you said to lower my standars.

Regarding algerian men to be honest I'm hopless, too agressive for me!! I just gave up and also I didnt meet many algerian men with high education (no offence guyz) maybe I met the wrong algerian guys I don't know. I feel also that algerian men are rude with algerian girls but when it comes to an european girl they change completely and all the values they were talking about seems to be gone!! Unfortunately these last years I started to date other arabs(middle eastern) and all I can say is they are sweeter than algerians!! But deep in my heart I wish I can meet a cultivated algerian with a good position and sweet. But you know dz-chick in general men are afraid when it comes to a woman who has a good job and is independent it's not only an algerian problem but a women issue in geneal.

I do beleive in mektoub and Im sure if you are still single is because someone special is waiting for you

Wish you luck dear and it's such a pleasure to read you while I have breaks :)

I stumbled upon your blog this morning at work and I must say, out of the 2-3 blogs that I have glanced through in my entire life...this is the most interesting and most relevant blog to me. This post in particular and its comments literally made me laugh out loud in the office. Especially comments from the first anonymous and continuously tipsy handsome Algerian man with a hairy chest (Legend!). And Moh if you're there bro Sahit Khouya!!

It's is so refreshing to see a fellow Dziria write and express herself so eloquently. As a londener born and bred I have sniffed out but a handful of promosing and intellectual Algerians. And no not in Costa Coffee Edgeware road where you’ll find an abundance of Algerians philosophising there all day long; but a few scattered here and there. So genuinely I was surprised yet happy to see that your blog is well written, funny and warm. (You see, I also thought I was the only one - lol).

Anyways back to the discussion. Firstly I would like to state that I understand what you’re saying and agree with you entirely. However I can sympathise with the Algerian men who are deemed to have ‘double standards.’ I think what they’re trying to say is this: The reason why they are happy to settle down with western women is because not only do they expect that they may have had relationships in the past... they can accept it! Whereas with Algerian women, they feel that they should know better! And I think that’s the underlying difference. Also, Algerian women have been known to be picky and materialistic, dissmissing any good loving man that happens to come from a village or poor family. Honestly, they are the one’s to be going for cos although they’re not big city boys they know the value and importance of family life. They will never turn away from a good women and will honour her, her entire life.

It is encouraged in Islam for women to work and integrate into working soceity. However, they should not forget themselves and their natural role, which is to comfort and help their husbands – not argue with them and stand up against them. If they do that than they are defying a man’s natural essence which is to provide and take charge if his household. That is why you correctly state that many are opting for 20 yr olds that they can control and why i believe that professional women should find the right balance between their independance and feminity/homelyness.

Lets be real, all Algerian men are MEN! in the traditional sense and will never stand to be bossed about by women. However, as MEN! we should act responsibly and listen to our women and consider their argument first (especially if they are professionals and on point) and then decide whether to act on it if it is in the best interests of the family. Ultimatley the woman should do the right thing and respect her man’s decision. Simples 

Similarly to you, ideally I would love to meet a like minded Dziria from London. No disrespect to the girls back home but it’s a London thing. Although I love your personality and would standardly ask you out on a date if I ever met you, but unfortunately (for me!) I may be too young for you!  Oh well, on a brighter note I hear Paris has potential!

Salam Dz chick, I just stumbled across your blog , I had to stay up until fajr so I thought hey let me find some Algerians in London , anyhoo, I'd like to say I totally agree with your post as for the 20years old part' I'm 22 and have seen this situation with Algerians occurring to my entourage , Algerian men do have double standards when it comes to their own , my sister recently got married , in her late 20's she was alarmed and wanted to get married but every Algerian she met ended up being a sour relationship , but on the other hand she too had very much so double standards , she speaks 5+ languages, has many degrees , very intellectual . So she set the bar really high , she wasn't getting anywhere oh may I add she only liked western Algerian ( We are from Wahran) , so the rarity that she would find someone on her ' level' was doomed to -0 probability , our friends hooked her up with a Westerner but from a very different world than her ( poor, from a village , doesn't exactly master 5+ languages let alone 2 ) she wasn't very keen at first but he turned out to be the best she ever had, she did certainly lower her standards when it came to looks , materialistic stuff or intellectual level but the main qualities were there : Allah fearing, honest, loyal , sweet, caring, etc) , so maybe it's mektoub maybe it's us , anyways hope you do find your ideal man inchallah, Saha ramdankoum. Yasmine B.

Interesting blog. Well done DZ-Chick. Can I just add my two-pennies worth. I think before we discuss the male/female problem, we should also acknowledge that Algerians as a whole (yes, I too hold a membership card of the Sweeping Statements Club) do not 'like' or trust each other when abroad. This in turn stems from a much deeper problem that was aggravated during the 90's. Our society has been fractured. We 'disliked' one another and being Algerian became to symbolise a negative rather than a positive. Like water seeping through bricks of a wall, it has 'contaminated' every aspect of our relationships with one another. Add to this the fact that we have a budding community here in UK, where we are slowly beginning to discover that it's not just young Algerian men who are living here. There are women too. I think we are slowly discovering who to interact intra-gender. I think us men need to change our approach. We have this view that almost assexualises Algerian women. (Oh no, I can't make any advances or she'll expect me to turn up with the proverbial 'boita gateaux' and ask for her hand). We expect virtue that we ourselves don't have. As for the controlling part, I think that's just some men. Yes it is accentuated in our machist culture but it speaks more of the weakness of said men rather than a general way of thinking.Anyway, I seriously think think that we are going through the necessary phases of establishing a diaspora. We are now discovering each other away from the national constraints and the more we talk about this the more we vulgarise it and make dating between Algerians as banal as anything. We do have to start healing as Algerians first though. The mothership has to understand that we are diverse and we don;t all fit the stereotypes of yesteryear. ps: Dating/marrying outside the community isn't an indictement of Algerians. ALL communities do it. People don't choose to fall in love. They just do.

Anizo so you finally made it to dz-chick land? A bit late I’d say ;) I hear Paris has potential but I personally prefer Algeria.

Yasmine B that’s quite the story – thanks for sharing and I realise you can’t always get what you want and sometimes you have to give a chance to someone who doesn’t necessarily fit into your criteria. Sadly I haven’t learnt to do that yet.

Beykar this is my first blog post ever! And everything you’re saying here and more is basically what I discussed in http://www.dz-chick.com/2012/04/others_04.html and http://www.dz-chick.com/2012/06/algerians-in-london-mind-gap.html

I stumbled across your blog, while looking for an update on the makhloufi story. It was a great read, slightly sad considering you still to find “the one”, but why does he have to be Algerian?

Although I think you were slightly harsh, overall I have o agree with you’re your evaluation of the Algerian man, especially for the Algerian men of your generation, but I believe the current crop of Algerian men in their 20s are more educated and prefer an educated independent woman who still holds to her Algerian heritage, I know I do, that’s why I married one.

I too had a negative view about Algerian women till I got to know some and eventually met my wife, Inchallah you find the Algerian guy who can change your view, if not I think you should look outside the race.

DZ-Banksy you have just given me a glimpse of what my life might have been had I behaved as 'respectful'conformist young woman.

I quit university, towards the end of my first year, in France to come over to the UK, got involved with a non-Algerian man and subsequently two children were born out of wedlock.I graduated when my children were 6 & 8, I was then a mature student and a single mother.

Evidently with retrospective, I am aware of my questionable choices and would be mortified if my daughters followed in my footsteps. Although I have no regrets whatsoever, I sometimes reflect on what my life might have been like if I would have gone down the traditional path.

Salaam DZ chick and all the commenters. I found your blog today. And this is the first post I've read. I'm finding all the views quite interesting and even surprising! But I'm appreciating all what has been said. As far as I am understanding, all of you (that are Algerian) are living in the UK, right? Do the Algerian -men and women living in Algeria share these same views?

As for myself, I'm an European born Muslim revert. I'm married to an Algerian man and have been living in Algeria for 5+ years now. I know my husband 1st married me for my religion. But also since we have similar values/views and I accepted him "as is" their was no financial or social requisite. But I know for his family, they accepted the marriage based on my "interesting passport" as one commenter mentioned. Years later, we are happy and have children too thank God. I consider Algeria my home. Yet even after living here for so many years, I'm still viewed as a "foreigner" I pray for my children, it'll be easier when it comes time to look for a mate. But I must say, in all the time I've lived here I've never heard such opinions. Maybe I'm naive. Maybe I don't get out much. But I've never come across Algerian "dating" or having a sex life, etc. As far as I know, these are not social acceptable. Am I wrong? But as for many of my ILs here, they are mostly uneducated and traditional people from outside Algiers in the farm lands. Sadly I have noticed the lowering of standards when it comes to Algerian educated women. And the men bring in barely legal girls from the "Sahara" as they call it! And far too many people focuses on how: (from the man's side) beauty, youth, cooking skills and the women: wealth, wealth and wealth. Maybe I'm wrong ... but this is how I see it as an outsider. And I say outsider, since I'm not Algerian born or raised. They say in the "West" marriages end in divorce, but I see it happening far too much here. One day, you hear a couple is getting married, maybe a year later you hear they've had a baby ... then boomed TALAQ! I've never been bold enough to ask the question WHY? But I wonder what happens during the "courting" process ... Do they ask questions about their potential spouse? I don't know! But I'm praying it will be easier then all I'm reading here. Again, appreciating the posts and comments! Real eye openers!

Miss Polemique that’s a quite a journey, thanks for sharing with us :)Heni El G your Algerian life seems to be very sheltered or your location is remote, hence the somewhat naïve questions.Yes dating, mixing and pre and extra marital sexual relations exist and are practiced widely in Algeria, perhaps even overtly so in larger cities and the capital than more rural areas.

As for your very pertinent questions on the high rate of divorce in Algeria, yes, couples get married quickly, pop a kid of two then follow it up with a bitter divorce, because they don’t know why they’re together, they have no idea what happened, they never really got to know each other or try to understand. It is sad and unacceptable in my opinion.

I hope you are doing well and enjoying london. I would like to ask your opinion on something.

I tend to try to avoid stereotyping people but am about to make a huge decision and just wondered what your thoughts were on the subject.

Basically I met my Algerian boyfriend a few months ago, he is a very nice guy, raised over there and lived in Paris with family for 3 years and has now been in London for 2. He is devout and doesn't party or anything and says his prayers daily. I am a British Nigerian muslim, I could be described as less devout. But he helps me, encourages me by calling me to wake up for prayers etc.

We spend a lot of time together watching movies and just talking when he is not working or studying for his masters, he has suggested our relationship should move forward with marriage, I care about him a lot and am now very fond of him.

But in the back of my mind I have doubts, as he hasn't introduced me to any of his friends (his parents are in Algeria and brothers in Paris) and he hasn't met mine. He suggested we attend mosque, but no real party afterwards, but that we can have a big wedding in Algeria at a later date.

I really care about him, but am cautious about his genuine intentions mainly because we have only known each other a few months.

I am a Christian black girl, who has contact with an Algerian guy from France (also studying in the UK). It's nothing serious yet. But I am curious to what other peoples opinions are concerning your situation. The best of luck!

Hi everyone. I stumbled upon this block while reading up on Algerians, and the culture. I'm from Singapore. And frankly I have no idea about the Algerian culture whatsoever. But I've travelled to 30 countries so far, for business reasons. And also the fact that I love travelling and meeting new people. So I do know on most bits of the world. Plus where I'm from, you will be able to meet anyone from around the world in this part of Asia.

Mainly why I got into this blog and read all the comments since 2007, is because I wanted to know more about your culture and understand it better. On one of flights to New York. I had a long layover in Istanbul, where I met an Algerian women. We hit it off right and things are looking bright. But I have no idea on what I'm really getting into when I go out with a women from Algeria. Too many people tell me that I have to convert to a Muslim no matter what? And as seen from all the commenters, religion plays a heavy role in the Algerian culture.

I'm starting to fall in love and trying to understand the depth of what I'm getting into.

DZ Chic! I need some advise or anyone who knows more really. I'm Indian/Portuguese (Catholic) but believe that there is no religion greater then any other religion, for the simple fact that every religion teaches everyone to do what's morally right.

If I decide to fly down to Algeria to meet her family and friends, am I digging my own grave?

Ps - I didn't know where else to ask this question. This post seemed like the right place.

If you have been invited to meet the parents, they must already know you're not Muslim, so I hardly think they'll try to convert you.

I have seen many examples all over Algeria, of Algerian women marrying outside the faith, depending on the family, some men converted truly because they were interested in the religion and probably had a disposition to do so. Others fake-Converted, in these cases, the families and girlfriend will ask you to go through formalities or showing your faith to the local imam and in front of the family or neighbours to avoid gossip etc...

Others just don't care about religion and it often doesn't even come into play.

You need to clarify this with your girlfriend right now and before embarking on this trip, so you don't have any surprises.Please feel free to ask me privately if you feel the need to, on my facebook page

Wow! I didn't expect a reply so fast! Thanks anonymous. You gave a me better believe. And DZ chick. Yes her Family do know I'm not Muslim. And I'm not in favour of the idea of converting. Actually they never knew a country called Singapore existed?! So I guess they're interested to know me better?

The nature of my Business causes me to travel many times, and sometimes I'll be stationed in different parts of the world for a couple of months. My women is a research scientist. So where ever I travel I try to get her to come along with me, because it doesn't feel right without her. Her parents Found out that she is dating a guy from Asia, and is trying to travel more often to be with me. So they demanded to meet me. I respect that. Just the fear of getting into a situation where I'm getting brainwashed / forced to doing something that I'm not willing. It'll end badly. 18 months we've been together. And she maybe sugar coating it. So I just wanted to get a better picture of what to expect from someone who knows the culture. Since I don't know one other person from Algeria, I'm here.

And I really appreciate that you'll answer my queries. I will ask you privately if anything comes up again.

Well travelling Jon just think of it as another trip to a new country you wouldn't otherwise visit. No harm can come of you trying, just go for it.

Sounds like your girlfriend is quite mobile, if she can join you in your many locations, does in fact mean that her parents are quite liberal so I really don't think religion is going to be an issue, they're probably just worried about her.

Do the right thing and stop listening to your alarmist friends, you're not going to come out of this wearing a burka, a beard or called Mohammed. :)

Interesting entry. My 24 year old Algerian fiancee sent it to me and I felt obliged to comment and offer my experience.

I'm going to be very crude here but I'll just state it like it is.

I'm an early 30s man from Algeria who has lived in the uk for 17 years.

Throughout these years I've had my share of relationships, with British, European and Algerian women.

You wrote this 10 years ago but your story is all too familiar - and it is not at all uniquely Algerian.

It is the story of many girls who spend their prime time (20s) chasing after "fun", be it dating, dancing, travelling etc... then the clock starts ticking and they suddently discover that they need to find a man to settle with and pay for a number of kids.

Meanwhile men mostly spend their 20s being clueless, then their value in society rises sharply in their early thirties - stable job, good looks, maturity, etc... all the things that women crave.

Deep down, a man doesn't want a "strong" "independent" "feminist" woman in her 30s - that raises so many flags I run away like I'm running from the plague. As crude as it sounds, what value does such a woman offer over a sweet early 20s? nothing. I don't need her job or her money. She is often less beautiful than girls in their early 20s. She is "independent" so I'm effectively just a sperm donor and a pay cheque. "independence" and "strength" aren't feminine traits that men want, just like women don't find a man's ability to polish their nails arousing. At best those traits are irrelevant, at worst they can destroy a relationship.

Now setting aside why men in our age universally prefer early 20 girls (whatever their nationality is), let's talk about Algerian women in particular.

I often found that those who live abroad have this toxic mix of entitlement, materialism and cultural baggage it is simply too problematic to waste any time with.

They expect to be able to be totally independent - because they are compensating for the supposed backwardness of Algerian men - and therefore can go out and party and all of that unchecked - this i found baffling. Even British women who I've had a relationship with had enough respect to consult with me when they wanted to do something that didn't involve me.

They expect to be able to hold a job, and spend as much time as they want in that job, delaying having kids and a family.

Then they expect the man to pay for everything because that's what a chivalrous man does and that's what we do in Algerian culture.

Let's just say that they are nowhere near adventurous and fun to be with as women of other cultures.

And finally they are entitled - there is a lot of "i deserve" feeling in your post - sorry, there is no deserving in life - you only deserve what you do and achieve. Nobody owes you anything.

I'm happy with my current woman because so far she is showing signs of wanting to help me and she is adding a lot of value. Why would I trade her for an "independent" "strong" woman who has 6 years left in her biological and good looks clock?

Wow, I find it staggering. Surely the right thing to do is to stick with the foreign woman who went out with you in your 20s when you had nothing. I suspect there was none,at best you have not fallen in love with anyone.You are not impressing anyone by buying an Algerian girl in her 20s now. In fact I might think you are a looser. If you are marrying for sex, then I suggest it wont last,so what you gonna do when she is 35? dump her and get another one? And do you think the curse of those you dumped will not catch up with you? what goes around comes around, don't expect you will get away with it: "wallah ma tarbah".Shame on you. You give bad name to Algerian men.

Anonymous, the one at the very heart of this post, 10 years on,now rich and affluent and very good looking, still with the English woman that stuck with me when I was nothing.