8.26.2017

I read with great interest the 12th "thought piece" about the new Nikon D850 camera on DPReview. I started looking through my files to see what I've been missing all these years...

When the Sony A7Rii came out it was a revelation and a (mostly) finished product. Along with the A7R it was the first big jump up in useable, focusable resolution in a mirrorless camera platform. The Nikon D800 and D810 were the first big, dramatically increased resolution cameras in the DSLR space and they were also worthy of praise for the sheer technological leap they pulled off. Bravo to Nikon for elevating cameras from the 24 megapixel range to the 36+ megapixel range; a real plus for all those who needed (or thought they needed) a lot more detail in their files. As a bonus both Sony and Nikon users also benefitted from a huge jump in dynamic range in both sets of cameras. The winning point for the Nikon D810 was the ability to squeeze out the last shreds of insanely good dynamic range at the lowest ISO (64). The winning points for the Sony A7Rii were: Amazingly good 4K video in the APS-C crop mode, with full featured video features (including usable zebras, focus peaking, a range of S-Log settings and much more). The Sony also featured an even better sensor and the first full frame BSI sensor, which gave the camera faster throughput, even with bigger files, than the closest and (at the time) only competitor in the high res race. For nearly two years the A7Rii has stood on apex of the heap with a sensor that topped DXO's ratings for all 35mm sensor sized cameras. Finally, the BSI technology made the A7Rii the leader in high ISO performance as well.

Now Nikon has released (announced?) their new D850 and it's sending the writers at Digital Photo Review over the edge. To read their spirited hyperbole you would imagine that the D850 is the first high resolution camera to crest 12 megapixels. That it is the first one to have a dynamic range of more than 5 stops and also the first professional camera able to focus on.......anything. The mostly mindless gushing also revolves around the idea that buying the D850 frees one up from having to buy one of the new medium format toy 50 megapixel cameras from Fuji or Hasselblad. Of course, anyone who bothered to read DPRs own press about the Sony A7Rii from several long years ago would remember that they already brought up the idea of a cost effective medium format killer in all their press surrounding that camera. And many have done comparisons in which the A7Rii competes with MF at 50M to a draw, albeit with much better handling...

Gushy, Gushy. It's embarrassing when the writers can't remember and avoid a repetition of the same hyperbolic enthusiasm they dished out for the high res Sony. Now the writers make it sound as though the D850 is the absolute first accessible camera to go nearly toe-to-toe with the bigger sensors in the MF cameras, and the first high res camera anywhere that's capable of actually focusing. It's just sad.

It's not my intention here to denigrate the D850. I'm sure it's a good camera and a worthy successor to the D810, which was a fine camera. My point is that we're seeing a lot a churn over what is basically nothing more than a three year refresh of a niche camera. And not so much of an upgrade at that.

Yes, the BSI sensor at 45.7 megapixels will undoubtable be a half or two thirds of a stop less noisy at similar ISOs. Yes, the BSI structure will allow for faster file throughput. Yes, the camera (if it's as well built as the D810) will be mechanically and electronically sound. The AF module derived from the D5 will probably solve some of the focusing issues I experienced with two different D810s (NO, their issues were not cured by the AF micro-adjust in those cameras, not over all focusing distances...).

Nikon still has a way to go if they want to match the overall performance of the camera Sony introduced two years ago. The A7Rii is still a much better spec'd video shooting platform. The combination of CD and PD on sensor still promises more accurate focusing and easy implementation of Eye Detect AF. The sensor in the two year old camera is hardly a baby step behind the sensor in the D850 when it comes to resolution and dynamic range, and both seem to be of the same generation BSI technology.

In my mind the A7Rii earned its gush quotient from the brain trust at DPR because it set so many goal posts for future cameras to match. What disturbs me is the manipulative re-writing of camera history represented by the loose fact journalism (an untested device)surrounding the D850 introduction. It seems driven by a sense of relief that Nikon hasn't totally dropped the ball in the high end camera game and is still able to successfully iterate off a camera that was launched three plus years ago. This must mean continued ad revenue, continued clicks and something new to write about. But it's hardly the breakthrough product it's being made out to be.

Don't blame Nikon for overselling expectations. The fault lies solely with the round-the-clock hyping of the product by the industry media, with most of the blame trackable to one source.

If I was a Nikon photographer there's no doubt in my mind that I'd have two of the D850s on order. Not because I would expect them to set new records for innovation or have astonishingly better image files but because my D810s would have been putting in good service for three long years and are ready for retirement. A shutter is only built for so much action....

If business was good I'd certainly want to take advantage of any sort of improvements that have been made. A bigger raw file is always welcome; especially if I have the option to shoot at smaller ones. The upgrading of video from decent 1080p to decent 4K would be welcome, if I chose only to carry around one type of camera body.

I'd relish the bigger battery as well and I would always harbor the thought, true or not, that Nikon spent those three years fixing just about any fault that could be found on the D810.

But....if I were contemplating diving into my first camera system the D810 might not be on my short list. If I shot with Canon cameras I'd have to do a lot of justifying to make a switch --- and in the back of my mind would be the constant thought that Canon will introduce a killer sensor in a killer camera body about a week to ten days after I've made my financially disastrous switch to Nikon. A couple weeks before the web in its wisdom finds the latest Nikon camera body flaw and the recalls start in earnest.

I am happy, I guess, that Nikon might survive the industry downturn that's been ongoing since 2013. I think their latest camera will have value for traditional photographers who do traditional work. But I will conjecture that the world moves on and the pursuit of highest resolution is no longer as important to hobbyists and professionals that it was when all resolutions were hovering in the 16 megapixel and below range. A lot has changed and the consumer is a moving target. I assume that if this camera does everything the enervated boys at DPR have catalogued that the real danger to Nikon is that it will steal many sales from the D5. But I guess, in the long run, the real game is to sell more lenses. The camera body is just the platform.

Up until we hit 16 megapixels there were always some (few) situations for advertising photographers where more sheer resolution was needed. Once we hit the 24 megapixel mark we could have stopped cold and only 1% of the jobs we handled would have been perceptively impacted. Not made un-doable; just somewhat impacted. When we exceeded that threshold we came face-to-face with mostly diminishing returns. Yes, the BSI sensor in the A7Rii has great image quality but what if Sony had concentrated on bigger but fewer photo sites? Would the files have been even better?

But really, the impact on our work flow has been that bigger files, which added nothing to the overall quality of a project, cost more to shoot, took more time to process and cost more to archive. We ended up taking more time and doing more work without any increase in overall quality (or profit) within our prevailing use targets. Our envelope for clients didn't go from a #10 to an A4. Just an increase in the hassle of handling much bigger 14 bit Godzilla sized files.

In the end the D850 will make Nikon pros happy. They'll keep shooting with an OVF instead of savoring the benefits of EVFs. They'll do fine with an average video implementation because almost every deliverable in video (for clients) is still 1080. The sensor will yield great results. They'll still need to watch out for subject and camera movement to take advantage of the increased resolution. But they, for the most part, will be satisfied.

When I look through twenty years of shooting digital it's not like everything pre-A7Rii or pre-D810 is worthless garbage. In fact, the exercise revealed to me (once again) that subject matter trumps almost everything, if your basic technique is good. A well focused 12 megapixel camera trumps a poorly focused 24 megapixel camera any day of the week. A photograph of a captivating subject taken with a camera that's mediocre at high ISOs still beats another noise free image of a coffee cup in a coffee shot every time. Waiting for the perfect camera is a fool's errand.

I'm happy we have all these really cool tools but at some point the hyperbole becomes unbearable. At this rate the D850 will have more coverage on DPReview than did all the cameras reviewed in the first ten years of the site's existence --- combined. And really, half the articles about the d850 are generic fluff.

Put the cameras into the hands of real professionals, stir, let rise and then come back to us and give us real facts. Or continue on this gushy trajectory and skip down the path toward irrelevance.

The substance-hype ratio was a lot different before Phil sold DPR. In fact, I don't recall much hype at all. He could be very ... deliberate with his reviews and was overly selective at times, but his reviews were solid. The new site isn't nearly as essential.

I stopped reading DP Review and most of the other crap gear sites 2-3 years ago. Didn't think I would miss anything. I am pretty sure I am not missing anything. I still read a few photo related blogs, including this one and TOP, but other than Thom Hogan's (who still has interesting commentary, and I mostly skip his gear reviews), I stopped reading the ones that are all about the gear, whatever the gear may be. Coincidentally, I also find myself quite content with the gear I have and don't see the need to rush out to get the latest, greatest anymore. Life is good.

Thank you for this article. I happened to click over here directly from DPReview where I read part of one story about the D850. I know we're ALL gear lovers at some level so it doesn't surprise me that these types of discussions will take place.

For what it's worth, I got of the megapixel bus at 22MP, a number that seems to be overkill for 90% of what my clients expect for the photos I deliver.

What it is, and fairly hyped to this end, is the first truly high-performing, do-it-all body for the stills photographer hobbyist that could be used for high-megapixel needs, sports/action needs, and deep-DR needs. It's the AF unit -- the world's best -- that finally makes this camera the first to cross the line.

And DPR aren't starting the hype: they are reflecting the mood of the masses. I promise you that long before DPR cranked into overdrive, from the minute the specs started to leak, it was the stills photographers who started to palpitate.

It is my sense that you, Kirk -- as a pro not a hobbyist; as a true video/stills combination user not a still-oriented guy any more; as a multi-camera owner not a small-budget hobbyist struggling to justify one expensive body and needing it to do everything; and despite your confessed tendency to go down the mental rabbit-hole of GAS and knowing how that feels -- you are left cold by the D850 because you don't need and no longer connect to the desire for "one ring to bind them all".

The D850 is IMHO the *first* camera of any form to cross the threshold and achieve the Triple Crown of stills photography. In that sense, it is a breakthrough product. The unusual hype is coming from the general photo enthusiast, not the sales machine, which is just in normal hype mode.

to InargsNice description of your very positive opinion about this camera. As a minute member of the non professional, enthusiast, photography masses I can only say that I have no interest in lugging around a heavy full frame dslr and no interest in paying $3k, 4k, 5k, or more for the latest and greatest truly amazing incredible camera. Whenever I start thinking about how great it would be to have some new feature I look at some photos by people like Steiglitz, Strand, Bresson, etc, remind myself how primitive and hard to use their equipment was and what they achieved with it, and sadly realize yet again that the weakest link in my photography is not my equipment. Enjoy your new camera. Jeff

13 articles that are found by Google that lead to search results that lead to eyeballs that lead to sales. You really shouldn't be surprised that a site in the gear selling business is creating a lot of content for the latest and greatest. They did the same for the A9 and A7rII as well. And to be fair, they gave little coverage to the 7500 or the 6Dii, which were both collective yawns.

I visited our local ProPhoto supply store and viewed images through the high resolution GH5 EVF. It was the first time that an EVF seemed almost as clear and real as a Nikon OVF. I would never by an EVF camera with any less resolution. Hopefully Sony will catch up with Panasonic in is next generation. I own the A7rii but I will not buy another Sony camera until Sony quits dumbing down its video capability to 8 bit 4:2:0. In my mind Nikon really missed an opportunity by not increasing its 850 video capability more to in camera 10 bit 4:2:2 at a minimum. It is the price they pay for depending on Sony sensors since Sony will not build a faster video capable sensor in a smaller camera that would compete with its video camera lineup.

I'm regularly printing 8, 10, even 20" print with m/43 cameras at less than optimal conditions. I can't even get sour grapey anymore or try to tell myself why I don't need this camera. I'm so far past point of sufficiency that it's just flown under my radar as it's a tool that has no purpose in my work. I'd rather spend money on glass (though kit lenses seem to be ok) or trips.

"And DPR aren't starting the hype: they are reflecting the mood of the masses. I promise you that long before DPR cranked into overdrive, from the minute the specs started to leak, it was the stills photographers who started to palpitate."

There speaks a dedicated consumer! The Nikon is a good camera, but the above's hyperbolic statements, confirm what many of us find so tiresome about much of the web's camera coverage. We have had ecstatic exultations about the Fuji X-PRO2/XT2, GFX, Sony A9, and Canon 5DIV to name just a few over the last 2 years. So I think it will depend entirely on which "masses" one is talking about. From people I know, the general reaction is the same as most of the comments here. "Nice camera, but I don't need/want it". I remember when the Nikon D700 fans seemed to find it necessary to prove that it was absolutely the "best camera" and that was only about 8 (?) years ago.

I see that my positive comments drew some negative feedback from third parties. That's fair enough -- but it is worth noting that I have been using m43 mirrorless gear exclusively for 4 or 5 years now. So any attempts to position me as a DSLR apologist are sorely misplaced. Nor am I a "dedicated consumer": in the 8 years since 2009 I have only bought 2 camera bodies priced near $1k each. And I certainly haven't ordered a D850!

It's funny to see how wrongly people accuse and pre-judge anyone who makes a positive comment on a camera, in this case me, all wrong comments and assumptions. I hope you guys don't run around doing that all over the internet!

No, my positivity about the D850 is balanced, level-headed, and absent any vested interest or brand favouritism. It really is the first camera to cross a critical threshold for the stills photographer, namely, top-bracket performance in the three realms. Its weight is not what I would specify in my dream camera, but since no lighter camera exists for its performance, one can hardly accuse it of unnecessary physique. The stills photographer who seeks the highest overall performance, only has to decide whether they are willing to throw away that performance level due to weight. Because (today) we can't have both. But today, for the first time, we can have the performance -- in one camera. Bravo.