tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-17340756.post5287901892121863316..comments2015-02-24T00:56:10.474-08:00Comments on HARDCORE ZEN: SNOW!Brad Warnernoreply@blogger.comBlogger51125tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-17340756.post-77139250025374636482009-05-13T11:37:00.000-07:002009-05-13T11:37:00.000-07:00酒店經紀PRETTY GIRL 台北酒店經紀人 ,酒店經紀 酒店兼差PRETTY GIRL酒店公關 ...酒店經紀PRETTY GIRL <A HREF="http://www.taipeilady.com/" REL="nofollow" TITLE="台北酒店經紀人">台北酒店經紀人</A> ,<A HREF="http://tw.myblog.yahoo.com/jw!qZ9n..6QEhhc0LkItOBm/" REL="nofollow" TITLE="酒店經紀">酒店經紀</A> 酒店兼差PRETTY GIRL<A HREF="http://www.mashow.org/" REL="nofollow" TITLE="酒店公關">酒店公關</A> 酒店小姐 彩色爆米花<A HREF="http://blog.xuite.net/jkl338801/blog/" REL="nofollow" TITLE="酒店兼職">酒店兼職</A>,酒店工作 彩色爆米花<A HREF="http://tw.myblog.yahoo.com/jw!BIBoU5SeBRs21nb_ajFpncbTqXds" REL="nofollow" TITLE="禮服店">禮服店</A>, <A HREF="http://mypaper.pchome.com.tw/news/thomsan/3/1310065116/20080905040949/" REL="nofollow" TITLE="酒店上班">酒店上班</A>,酒店工作 PRETTY GIRL<A HREF="http://tw.myblog.yahoo.com/jw!rybqykeeER6TH3AKz1HQ5grm/" REL="nofollow" TITLE="酒店喝酒">酒店喝酒</A>酒店上班 彩色爆米花<A HREF="http://mypaper.pchome.com.tw/news/jkl338801/" REL="nofollow" TITLE="台北酒店">台北酒店</A>酒店小姐 PRETTY GIRL<A HREF="http://www.mashow.org/" REL="nofollow" TITLE="酒店上班">酒店上班</A>酒店打工PRETTY GIRL<A HREF="http://www.tpangel.com/" REL="nofollow" TITLE="酒店打工">酒店打工</A>酒店經紀 彩色爆米花Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-17340756.post-88743323222613725982009-05-12T05:01:00.000-07:002009-05-12T05:01:00.000-07:00I asked the question and got an answer. It's calle...I asked the question and got an answer. It's called humour, Neil. Hang ten . :-)floating_abuhttp://www.blogger.com/profile/14461977576679458008noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-17340756.post-30490023648369233502009-05-12T05:00:00.000-07:002009-05-12T05:00:00.000-07:00This comment has been removed by the author.floating_abuhttp://www.blogger.com/profile/14461977576679458008noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-17340756.post-34695991786659619832009-05-12T04:15:00.000-07:002009-05-12T04:15:00.000-07:00I guess people like Jinzang are lucky that nobody...I guess people like Jinzang are lucky that nobody does regulate the comments here since they can use it for shameless self promotion...<br /><br />"Jinzang said... <br />I can't promise that I'll never drop a message, but anyone looking for enlightenment or a good restaurant recommendation in Baltimore can find me through the contact me link on my website."<br /><br />Jeebuz, use your own damn blog man.<br /><br />Brad -- you rule. Thanks for coming to Saskatoon.Neilhttp://thenewheretics.wordpress.com/noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-17340756.post-1927281995346348372009-05-11T07:32:00.000-07:002009-05-11T07:32:00.000-07:00Perhaps in the future, new drugs will be discovere...<I>Perhaps in the future, new drugs will be discovered/invented that will be less blunt in their<br />effects and allow us to better use them as beneficial tools.</I><BR><BR>I can see that the future of Buddhism in America is tripped out stoner Buddhism. "Put down that sutra and pass me the hash pipe."Jinzanghttp://www.blogger.com/profile/04155467948613318531noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-17340756.post-35239071933456443922009-05-11T07:29:00.000-07:002009-05-11T07:29:00.000-07:00feel like you are the most trustworthy teacher ava...<I> feel like you are the most trustworthy teacher available. Zen has been brought into my life twice, both at similar times of need, both through you or indirectly by your books to be truthful. Feel free to email me at any time via my gmail account.</I><BR><BR>Brad does not read the comments regularly, you would do better to email him directly. I don't intend any criticism of Brad's ability as a teacher, but you would do better to find a teacher in your own area that you can talk to face to face.Jinzanghttp://www.blogger.com/profile/04155467948613318531noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-17340756.post-72149943889441369402009-05-11T05:41:00.000-07:002009-05-11T05:41:00.000-07:00I said:
"So intoxicating drug(s) other than alcoh...I said:<br /><br />"So intoxicating drug(s) other than alcohol were not only known, but considered indespensible to the spiritual practice of Gautama's time."<br /><br />To be clear, I should have added:<br />"...until he came along."Reallynoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-17340756.post-24959741625582073532009-05-10T22:14:00.000-07:002009-05-10T22:14:00.000-07:00Jinzang said... [yada-yada-yada]
A chemical may n...Jinzang said... [yada-yada-yada]<br /><br />A chemical may not be able to cause<br />one to fully grok all of Sanskrit<br />grammar in a moment (like instantly<br />learning how to fly a helicopter in<br />"The Matrix"), but it may allow one<br />to concentrate more effectively and <br />thus learn a little more efficiently.<br /><br />Also, psychedelics produce a whole<br />range of effects depending on "set<br />and setting", dosage, timing, etc.<br /><br />The multi-hour descent is often<br />more interesting than the peaking<br />and sometimes might be described<br />as "being in the moment" (to use<br />a hard-to-replace phrase that's<br />now become a trite cliche).<br /><br />(BTW, whatever "balancing the<br />autonomic nervous system" means,<br />it sure <I>sounds</I> like it<br />has something to do with<br />biochemical processes ;)<br /><br />And no one but you said anything<br />about one-to-one mappings --<br />different drugs for different<br />nervous systems (at different times).<br /><br />Also, perhaps in the future, new<br />drugs will be discovered/invented<br />that will be less blunt in their<br />effects and allow us to better<br />use them as <A HREF="http://www.maps.org/" REL="nofollow">beneficial tools</A>.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-17340756.post-51706386865867999452009-05-10T19:23:00.000-07:002009-05-10T19:23:00.000-07:00Dear Mr. Warner,
I recently recieved a copy of yo...Dear Mr. Warner,<br /><br />I recently recieved a copy of your newest book and have been reading it thouroughly for the past few days. I love it. But, the reason I'm writing is because of the way and timing your book has fallen into my life. I read your first book when I was in high school going through heavy times in my life and began practicing zazen. It really changed my life. I joined the military and lost the practice. Forgotten it even. I recently began backsliding again and your new book made it's way to me. My reading has reawakened my want to practice zazen again, but I want to do it right this time. My identity I'm writing with is also my gmail account and I'd like to speak with you more about Zen, practices, and precepts. I understand that you are very busy, but I feel like you are the most trustworthy teacher available. Zen has been brought into my life twice, both at similar times of need, both through you or indirectly by your books to be truthful. Feel free to email me at any time via my gmail account. Thank you for your time.<br /><br />Devon D.Bankyhttp://www.blogger.com/profile/09482756024807546602noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-17340756.post-25371525009499125712009-05-10T18:33:00.000-07:002009-05-10T18:33:00.000-07:00"Sure. But to be fair to Brad, some of the people ..."Sure. But to be fair to Brad, some of the people expressing their disagreements with Brad have been pretty damn nasty about it, even by Internet standards.'<br /><br />To be fair to the internet, I think it was Brad who set the standards around here. But he doesn't want to hear that part of the equation..Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-17340756.post-14320736387769086642009-05-10T18:02:00.000-07:002009-05-10T18:02:00.000-07:00I have few doubts that magic mushrooms were used i...I have few doubts that magic mushrooms were used in the Hindi, Jain, Buddhist, Christian, and Islamic cults during their 'formative years.'<br /><br /><A HREF="http://csp.org/chrestomathy/sacred_mushroom2.html" REL="nofollow">Allegro's book</A> comes to mind.<br /><br />But is is more than a mere book that leads my thinking in this direction. <br /><br /><A HREF="http://3.bp.blogspot.com/_dcw9foEyIl0/SYSLcwlNyNI/AAAAAAAAAhU/mcZl5xIXUNQ/s320/persephone_mushroom.jpg" REL="nofollow">Persephone</A> and the eleusian mystery school, <A HREF="http://wikicompany.org/wiki/images/thumb/Shiva_with_mushrooms.jpg/199px-Shiva_with_mushrooms.jpg" REL="nofollow">Shiva</A> and the Hindu, <A HREF="http://www.goa-shoom.net/ethnomycology/images/mushstone.jpg" REL="nofollow">ancients</A>, and yes, even Buddha...<br /><br />"Buddha died, according to legend, from a mushroom (truffle?) that grew underground. Buddha was given the mushroom by a peasant who believed it to be a delicacy. In ancient verse, that Tassili mushroom shaman ala dimitri mushroom was linked to the phrase "pig's foot" but has never been identified. (Although truffles grow underground and pigs are used to find them, no deadly poisonous species are known.)" <A HREF="http://deoxy.org/mushman.htm" REL="nofollow">source</A> <A HREF="http://wisdomquarterly.blogspot.com/2009/04/pork-mushroom-how-buddha-died.html" REL="nofollow">MORE</A>Perhaps "Buddha died" is metaphorical or even allegorical. Buddha may have "tripped" without falling. Just a thought.Mysterionhttp://www.blogger.com/profile/12649237112389489841noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-17340756.post-5952988194088996052009-05-10T17:45:00.000-07:002009-05-10T17:45:00.000-07:00He wrote for series such as... "Kung Fu,"<A HREF="http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/20090510/ap_en_tv/us_obit_john_furia_jr;_ylt=Amgx5NrpCvlzS5Q04LIHHFFpMhkF" REL="nofollow">He</A> wrote for series such as... "Kung Fu,"John Furiahttp://www.imdb.com/name/nm0298891/noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-17340756.post-55391948293299699732009-05-10T17:22:00.000-07:002009-05-10T17:22:00.000-07:00Brad has no way of knowing whether those that disa...<I>Brad has no way of knowing whether those that disagree with him are haters or angry. Might be projecting his own mindstates on others.</I><BR><BR>Sure. But to be fair to Brad, some of the people expressing their disagreements with Brad have been pretty damn nasty about it, even by Internet standards.Jinzanghttp://www.blogger.com/profile/04155467948613318531noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-17340756.post-27870937403940723072009-05-10T17:00:00.000-07:002009-05-10T17:00:00.000-07:00Perhaps no more than you or I. But I, like you, ha...<I>Perhaps no more than you or I. But I, like you, have no way of knowing, however it may "seem".</I>Yep. And in the same way Brad has no way of knowing whether those that disagree with him are haters or angry. Might be projecting his own mindstates on others.<br /><br />To echo what Jinzang said, psychedelics may well be useful for some people under some conditions (as therapy aids, etc) and I think they can also reveal certain insights about our subconscious content and motivations. But they can never actually produce enlightenment since enlightenment isn't a vision or concept, it's just seeing things as they are.mountaintop moisturenoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-17340756.post-82417266851432038582009-05-10T16:29:00.000-07:002009-05-10T16:29:00.000-07:00Are you suggesting that whatever it is that happen...<I>Are you suggesting that whatever it is that happens to longtime sitters is not a biochemical process, but rather something supernatural or mystical or whateverthefuck?</I><BR><BR>What we're talking about is an understanding of what mind is. This understanding comes from dropping our false ideas. And we see they are false by simply paying attention to them and finally seeing that they don't correspond to how things are, they're an assumption we've added to the facts.<BR><BR>Presumably each time we understand a new fact, or drop an old lie, there's a biochemical change in the brain. But there's no reason to believe that two people who understand the same fact have the same biochemical change. That is, no reason to believe that distinct understandings map one to one to distinct biochemical changes. And certainly there's no reason to believe ingesting a chemical can give you kensho any more than ingesting a chemical can teach you Sanskrit grammarJinzanghttp://www.blogger.com/profile/04155467948613318531noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-17340756.post-37472086730456782852009-05-10T16:17:00.000-07:002009-05-10T16:17:00.000-07:00Could it be possible that a chemical might help on...<I>Could it be possible that a chemical might help one's mind "settle down"?</I><BR><BR>Psychedelics do not make the mind settle down.<BR><BR><I>Or even help one notice or "see" something that one has not noticed or seen before?</I><BR><BR>Possibly one can see something new, therefore they can have value. But the inisght into the nature of mind almost always happens to a mind settled by meditation. There's a reason why we sit and it's not masochism.Jinzanghttp://www.blogger.com/profile/04155467948613318531noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-17340756.post-24497695085745768002009-05-10T14:08:00.000-07:002009-05-10T14:08:00.000-07:00Mr. Google sez:
Datura in Buddhist Tantra
Both D...Mr. Google sez:<br /><br />Datura in Buddhist Tantra<br /><br />Both Datura stramonium and Datura metel are well-documented in India and Tibet. In Sanskrit datura is known as dhattūra, while in Tibetan the plant is da dhu ra or thang phrom. Datura's effects were described in several ayurvedic materia medica. It is mentioned in the Kāmasūtra (ca. 4th-6th century CE), which says: "If food be mixed with the fruit of the thorn apple (dathura) it causes intoxication". It also advises a man to anoint his penis with honey infused with datura and long peppers (pippali = Piper lungum) before sexual intercourse to make his partner "subject to his will". -- Vātsyāyana. The Kama Sutra of Vatsyayana. trans. Richard Burton. Modern Library. 2002. p 188,181.<br /><br /><A HREF="http://www.erowid.org/spirit/traditions/buddhism/buddhism_tantra_article1.shtml" REL="nofollow">source</A>By the way, here is the "garden of eden" and the fall from grace (in Buddhist Scripture):<br /><br />"Now people remained a long, long time enjoying the savory earth for their food and support; and so long as they did thus, mere coarseness entered into their bodies and differences of caste arose.[1] Some people were beautiful and others were ugly. Then those who were beautiful despised the ugly ones and said: "We are handsomer than these, they are uglier than we." And by reason of their conceit of color the savory earth disappeared among those born with pride and conceit. When the savory earth had vanished, they met together and lamented, saying: "Oh, the savor! oh, the savor!" Even now, when men have taken some surpassing[2] dainty they say the same: "Oh, the savor! Oh, the savor!" In this they imitate exactly the ancient primeval men, but know not the meaning thereof.<br /><br /> After the savory earth had disappeared, there sprang up for those people a fine kind of moss. It was somewhat like a mushroom, and in color, scent, and savor was like unto ghee or butter. And even as a little honey undefiled, such was its taste.<br /><br /> [3]Then, as before, they ate the fine moss and lived a long time thereon, while coarseness entered still more into their bodies, and differences of caste arose. Also, as before, the beautiful despised the ugly, whereupon the fine moss disappeared. When it was gone a sweet creeper sprang up, which was somewhat like the cadamba, and in color, scent, savor, and taste, as the other foods before. The same experience was repeated, and the sweet creeper vanished away. Then they met together and lamented, saying: "Alas for us! Alas! the sweet creeper has failed us!" Even now, when<br /><br />[1. The word caste is simply color or complexion.<br /><br />2. The word "surpassing" is literally divine or angelic. As in the Old Testament, this word is used to mean great or fine.<br /><br />3. Here and in following paragraphs the exact phraseology of the preceding narrative is tediously repeated in the Pâli, but it is no part of a translator's business to perpetuate these mannerisms. [Their use is to preserve the text from corruption.]<br /><br />p. 212 men are touched by some divine catastrophe, they say the same: "Alas for us! Alas, it has failed us!" They recall the very letter of the ancient primeval men, but know not the meaning thereof.<br /><br /> Now, when the sweet creeper had gone from those people, a delicate rice appeared, without coating or husk, pure, sweet-scented, and with the fruit already winnowed. They fetched food at evening for supper, and in the morning it was ripe and grown again. They fetched food in the morning for breakfast, and at evening it was ripe and grown again. It was not known to fail. Then the people lived a long, long time, enjoying the delicate rice for their food and support; and so long as they did thus, mere coarseness entered more and more into their bodies and differences of caste arose.<br /><br /> Then the organ of womanhood appeared in the woman and the organ of manhood in the man. And the woman offered to the man strong drink in excess, and the man unto the woman. And as they did so, passion arose, and suffering entered into their bodies. By reason of the suffering they indulged in the act of sex. Then, when people saw them in those days, indulging thus, some threw dust and others ashes, and others cow-dung, saying: "Perish, vile wench! Perish, vile wench!" And again: "How can one being do such a thing unto another?" Even now, in some country places, when a murderess is being executed, some people throw dust, others ashes, and others cow-dung.[1] They recall the very letter of the ancient primeval men, but know not the meaning thereof."<br /><br /><br /><A HREF="http://www.sacred-texts.com/journals/mon/abudgen.htm" REL="nofollow">source</A>the western book (bible) is recycled Indian folklore...Mysterionhttp://www.blogger.com/profile/12649237112389489841noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-17340756.post-63582919707750199602009-05-10T13:38:00.000-07:002009-05-10T13:38:00.000-07:00Anonymous said...
"Nor do I think psylocybin mushr...Anonymous said...<br /><I>"Nor do I think psylocybin mushrooms were in use in ancient India during Siddhartha's time."</I><BR><BR>cf. <A HREF="http://www.amazon.com/Soma-Mushroom-Immortality-Ethno-Mycological-Studies/dp/0156838001" REL="nofollow">Soma</A>Jinzang said...<br /><I>"Enlightenment is something you have already. You just have to sit down and pay attention to your mind and let all the bullshit thoughts settle down and sooner or later you will see it."</I><BR><BR>Could it be possible that a chemical<br />might help one's mind "settle down"?<br />Or even help one notice or "see"<br />something that one has not noticed<br />or seen before?<br /><br />Or are you suggesting that whatever<br />it is that happens to longtime sitters<br />is not a biochemical process,<br />but rather something supernatural<br />or mystical or whateverthefuck?Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-17340756.post-65255578310364842082009-05-10T07:14:00.000-07:002009-05-10T07:14:00.000-07:00Hi,
Just a note to say that, in the lineage that ...Hi,<br /><br />Just a note to say that, in the lineage that Brad is in, he would have been instructed to drop body, drop mind, drop everything, including attention, non-attention, 'enlightenment', 'delusion' etc etc etc...<br /><br />"Even if some physically understand sitting to be the Buddha-Dharma, none has realized sitting as sitting. How then can they be maintaining and relying upon the Buddha-Dharma as the Buddha-Dharma?" (Shobogenzo Zanmai-o-Zanmai).<br /><br />Regards,<br /><br />Harry.Harryhttp://www.blogger.com/profile/05168631752214481563noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-17340756.post-73138922580338384702009-05-10T06:34:00.000-07:002009-05-10T06:34:00.000-07:00Brad's made his opinion on psychedelics clear, I d...Brad's made his opinion on psychedelics clear, I don't need to repeat them. Some people have been helped by psychedelics and I'm glad for that. Maybe we'll have a sane drug policy in this country some day and psychiatrists will be able to use psychedelics to help people. But you're fooling yourself if you think that psychedelic experiences have anything to do with realization or enlightenment. Enlightenment is something you have already. You just have to sit down and pay attention to your mind and let all the bullshit thoughts settle down and sooner or later you will see it. The idea that what we have already is not enough, that we have to become something better, maybe through some drug, is a significant obstacle to seeing this.Jinzanghttp://www.blogger.com/profile/04155467948613318531noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-17340756.post-53226923388160720942009-05-10T05:46:00.000-07:002009-05-10T05:46:00.000-07:00"Funny that the original precept against intoxican..."Funny that the original precept against intoxicants pertained to lsd."<br /><br />Well it didn't, silly. <br /><br />"Nor do I think psylocybin mushrooms were in use in ancient India during Siddhartha's time."<br /><br />Maybe yes, maybe no. But vedic literature is full of SOMA - wiki it. So intoxicating drug(s) other than alcohol were not only known, but considered indespensible to the spiritual practice of Gautama's time.<br /><br />"[Brad] just seems to dislike reading anything that contradicts his own opinions..."<br /><br />Perhaps no more than you or I. But I, like you, have no way of knowing, however it may "seem".Reallynoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-17340756.post-20817431663770555392009-05-09T22:12:00.000-07:002009-05-09T22:12:00.000-07:00Funny that the original precept against intoxicant...Funny that the original precept against intoxicants pertained to lsd. Especially since it was first synthesized in 1938. Nor do I think psylocybin mushrooms were in use in ancient India during Siddhartha's time. I haven't used any drugs in years and years but I don't think they're evil when used correctly. Set, setting, moderation, right motivation.<br /><br />Another very obvious reason Brad does not like to read the comments here may have nothing to do with irrational haters or angry posters. He just seems to dislike reading anything that contradicts his own opinions and views anyone that dares to disagree with him as angry irrational or mean.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-17340756.post-20776158347292125692009-05-09T18:21:00.000-07:002009-05-09T18:21:00.000-07:00Anonymous Anonymous said...
"and regarding pschede...Anonymous Anonymous said...<br />"and regarding pschedelics, even warner speaks mildly against them..."<br /><br />which <A HREF="http://reporter.blogs.com/photos/uncategorized/2008/09/25/warnerbrothersshield.jpg" REL="nofollow">warner</A>?Mysterionhttp://www.blogger.com/profile/12649237112389489841noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-17340756.post-68511235649843116662009-05-09T07:36:00.000-07:002009-05-09T07:36:00.000-07:00i understand what thich nhat hahn (dont discount h...i understand what thich nhat hahn (dont discount his smarts cause he's famous) was saying. hahn is a teetotaller himself and even if he might personally disapprove of drinking, you are the one ultimately responsible for yourself and your path. there is no true sin (excepting acid washed jean shorts). and regarding pschedelics, even warner speaks mildly against them in pursuit of a buddhist idealAnonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-17340756.post-61724482053117754682009-05-09T04:32:00.000-07:002009-05-09T04:32:00.000-07:00Mysterion said:
"To be fair to everyone (?), Brad ...Mysterion said:<br />"To be fair to everyone (?), Brad would need to read ALL the comments with equal attentiveness. Yet, in a moment of failure (being somewhat judgmental), Brad has decided to look at some (but not "READ") of the comments from time to time - time permitting."<br /><br />I kind of understand Brad's view but it seems to me he is missing an opportunity to guide this conversation in a positive way which would help in modulating the crazy negative hateful comments. One could say that listening to too much music is overstimulating, and the same for web surfing etc. Doesn't he ever feel like making a comment in his own blog? Seems natural that he would but can't for some reason. Ofcause I'm just speculating because I'm overstimulated.Richhttp://www.blogger.com/profile/06825454951290155337noreply@blogger.com