sekiyoku

Thanks for all the support. At this point maybe it's better it didn't print in the steampunk derby, maybe I can get it printed somewhere else or possibly in the double take where it can run based only on the merits of the design.

BaldBob007

cxl wrote:So let's think about things a little. Most people join when they buy a shirt, right? So if wooters seriously do like ramy/seki shirts, then it would make perfect sense that all these accounts would appear AFTER ramy/seki shirts started being sold.

Get your causality right, yo.

Of course, it makes perfect sense. But that doesn't make it right. I'd like to give Ramy and Seki the benefit of the doubt on the whole "multiple accounts" thing.

I know that people just want cool shirts, but most of the popular artists will usually submit their artwork on other sites where they may better fit a theme or may not have a theme. Why can't people just skip the vote and request it be submmitted elsewhere (or is the need for instant gratification that intense)?!

Another problem I see is (and has been) that the majority of their voters just don't seem to be part of the "community". The "community" being those that participate. Not necessarily submitting entries, but that:

1) Read the theme
2) Vote for their favorite entries that FIT the theme, without the need to validate relevance
3) Interact with the "community" regularly and meaningfully; not just leaving "love it!!!" comments, or flaming others who have posted valid comments

I know that the non-participants will always be around and can't be stopped; but it saddens me that the purpose of Shirt.Woot's themed derby is slowly, but surely, being undermined...

BaldBob007

sekiyoku wrote:Thanks for all the support. At this point maybe it's better it didn't print in the steampunk derby, maybe I can get it printed somewhere else or possibly in the double take where it can run based only on the merits of the design.

I like your attitude. I really, really wanted to vote for your design this week (sorry!). In my opinion, it is your best work to date. If it gets nominated for the double take, you can be assured of my vote. ;)

Feeferscat

HeartlineTwist wrote:Why? I mean, it's really easy to just say "This isn't steampunk" or "Lul, steam pipes don't equal steampunk," but these comments completely ignore the detail in the contraption part of the design and the execution of that feature in general.

However steampunk isn't about a contraption in the middle, it's a whole style and ethos, simply having a contraption as part of the design doesn't make this steampunk, there's a few tiny changes that could have been made to have make this fit but I would state from several people that love the steampunk genere, this design doesn't quite fit.

Arma

I'm so upset that this didn't make it. Me and my girlfriend were both going to buy one, this has been my favorite shirt to date. I hope it pops up in the double take, like people have been saying...if you put it up elsewhere, I'd love to buy it!

itoaseik

That is a ridiculous and almost indefensible statement. Yes "Girl in Red" was a cool shirt, but it had almost nothing to do with Steampunk. So, you could say "I preferred Girl in Red" or "I wish Girl in Red had won," but if you are talking about anything more than personal preference then clearly relevance to the theme makes you dead wrong.

smedgrick

this is a shirt that may incorporate steampunk, but it's not what the design is about. Just look at the thumbnail - the shirt's about the dog. It's a cute pet in an unconventional setting; but that could be said for far too many of your/sek's shirts (every once in a while is okay because a lot of artists have submitted something along those lines, but that theme in your stuff is reoccurring.)

Also, there are a lot of definitions of what's steampunk out there, but here's my rule: If I don't think "cool" after seeing it, the design isn't representing steampunk. It should make mechanical engineers marvel at what could be accomplished, what fabulous combination of art and power could produce something so complicated yet elegant. This has a robot in it, and that's all I feel when I see it.

smedgrick

HellMac826

Seriously, who would have thought that little red riding hood and the big bad wolf would have been eat out by this...this...monstrosity! I mean look at it, all the gears, and pipes, and clockwork, not to mention the entire victorian theme...sheeesh.

squirrelfry

oh no! this shirt was the only one I wanted to buy! awesome job with it and I hope it gets printed somewhere else (wish it could get into next week's double take...now we have to wait another 11 weeks...sigh)

eHalcyon

BaldBob007 wrote:Of course, it makes perfect sense. But that doesn't make it right. I'd like to give Ramy and Seki the benefit of the doubt on the whole "multiple accounts" thing.

I know that people just want cool shirts, but most of the popular artists will usually submit their artwork on other sites where they may better fit a theme or may not have a theme. Why can't people just skip the vote and request it be submmitted elsewhere (or is the need for instant gratification that intense)?!

Another problem I see is (and has been) that the majority of their voters just don't seem to be part of the "community". The "community" being those that participate. Not necessarily submitting entries, but that:

1) Read the theme
2) Vote for their favorite entries that FIT the theme, without the need to validate relevance
3) Interact with the "community" regularly and meaningfully; not just leaving "love it!!!" comments, or flaming others who have posted valid comments

I know that the non-participants will always be around and can't be stopped; but it saddens me that the purpose of Shirt.Woot's themed derby is slowly, but surely, being undermined...

The majority of voters on ANY entry - not just those belonging to Ramy and Seki - are members of this "non-participant" group of which you speak.

The derby is supposed to be a democracy, so letting "non-participants" vote is, in fact, a purpose of the derby. Just because someone refrains from commenting or has a looser interpretation of the theme doesn't mean they should be made into pariahs.

In any case, they are participating by voting. If only the "participants" as you defined them could vote, then the voting pool would be pretty much static. The community grows when new people start voting and, eventually, join in on the commentary (and all the delightful drama as well). If these newbies can't vote, many will be disinclined to join in on the conversation. Not to mention, you'd then have to have some arbiter watching all the members, arbitrarily deciding which members were "participating", since general guidelines like "post x number of times" would only prompt people to start spamming and finding other ways around the rules.

I'll agree that I am disappointed when designs that I feel are off-topic end up going to print. But I'm not going to fault the voters, since many of them probably considered the design on theme, as they understood it. I fault Woot for failing to reject the offending piece.

HeartlineTwist

Feeferscat wrote:However steampunk isn't about a contraption in the middle, it's a whole style and ethos, simply having a contraption as part of the design doesn't make this steampunk, there's a few tiny changes that could have been made to have make this fit but I would state from several people that love the steampunk genere, this design doesn't quite fit.

I disagree. I think the execution of the wings in conjunction with notable steampunk elements such as the goggles make this fit. So the penguin isn't steampunk...okay. But these are a far cry from Icarus wings. Hell, this is essentially a steampunk jetpack, but instead of just being a jetpack, it is a set of wings because we're essentially talking about a bird. Not only would I argue that this IS steampunk, but I would argue that even the nontopical element is better served by the topical part because it is an incorporation of steampunk into a larger design.

HeartlineTwist

Get over it, guys. I will now say that the voting MAJORITY of Woot couldn't give two flying penguins about the theme. I am almost going to agree that if I am judging Girl in Red and this by what I think looks good on a t-shirt, the race is a lot closer than if I'm judging it by what has a better adherence to theme.

I mean, even if it's not what I would prefer, I can at least recognize that the theme doesn't take precedence over "that looks neat" when it comes to the majority of voters.

As for whether that's a bad thing or not is a harder call past the fact that if the theme is merely a suggestion or guideline, why even bother? Make the themes hyper-vague then and be done with it.

L3g3ndQ

Get over it, guys. I will now say that the voting MAJORITY of Woot couldn't give two flying penguins about the theme. I am almost going to agree that if I am judging Girl in Red and this by what I think looks good on a t-shirt, the race is a lot closer than if I'm judging it by what has a better adherence to theme.

I mean, even if it's not what I would prefer, I can at least recognize that the theme doesn't take precedence over "that looks neat" when it comes to the majority of voters.

As for whether that's a bad thing or not is a harder call past the fact that if the theme is merely a suggestion or guideline, why even bother? Make the themes hyper-vague then and be done with it.

well i agree that you should vote on what you would like to see on a tee and what you would actually buy and wear... but as for the theme Woot! is the real one to blame for this sad derby. they should have rejected all the off topic shirts from the beginning... granted we may have only had a hand full to vote on but hey that's what rules are for, if you don't want to fallow the rules then you shouldn't play the game! i had high hopes for this derby but was royally let down!! were there great looking shirts?? Heck yea!!! but were there a lot of really great looking steampunk shirts?? nope! not many at all B^(

BaldBob007

eHalcyon wrote:The majority of voters on ANY entry - not just those belonging to Ramy and Seki - are members of this "non-participant" group of which you speak...

I apologize if my entire post was taken to be against Ramy and Seki, I only meant to address them in the first paragraph about multiple accounts.

I definitely agree that new voters should be encouraged. Who would be here if they weren't? I was "attempting" to comment on the fact that the majority seem to be non-participants and consistently vote off-theme.

Shirt.Woot, on the other hand, is wildly inconsistent in its rejections (as you mentioned). I was impressed by how strict Art Deco was, then there was this week...

eHalcyon

BaldBob007 wrote:I apologize if my entire post was taken to be against Ramy and Seki, I only meant to address them in the first paragraph about multiple accounts.

I definitely agree that new voters should be encouraged. Who would be here if they weren't? I was "attempting" to comment on the fact that the majority seem to be non-participants and consistently vote off-theme.

Shirt.Woot, on the other hand, is wildly inconsistent in its rejections (as you mentioned). I was impressed by how strict Art Deco was, then there was this week...

In that case, sorry for misinterpreting.

Again though, how many don't care about theme and how many just interpret the theme differently? Although there were certain designs in this derby that I felt weren't steampunk, I could also see how others might potentially consider them to be on topic, if they were more open-minded, had a loose interpretation or were just a little less well-informed on what "Steampunk" entails. Again, that ball is in Woot's court.

Supertenni

smedgrick

ewaldjw wrote:I think there's a little to much ink on this shirt. I fear that the minute I get sweaty it would get all gross.

no worries, really. A lot of the design incorporates the color of the shirt, so you aren't wearing a huge glob of ink on your chest. I've got Drakxxx's dragon slayer, which looks like it would be heavy but it feels/looks great.

eHalcyon

smedgrick wrote:no worries, really. A lot of the design incorporates the color of the shirt, so you aren't wearing a huge glob of ink on your chest. I've got Drakxxx's dragon slayer, which looks like it would be heavy but it feels/looks great.

Actually, there does seem to be a lot of ink on this one. I hadn't noticed it before. Dragon Slayer has the advantage of being on a lighter coloured shirt, whereas with this design they'll first have to lay down an extra layer of white ink. However, I believe there have been several shirts printed relatively recently that use just as much or more ink with nary* a complaint of non-breathability. Maybe Woot is using better ink or a better process or something?

mitchellp

bduboftexas

ramyb wrote:Continual submitting, as in I did two designs that you consider similar 3 months apart? I feel that if I do a design that's a "googly eyed animal" once every 5 or 6 weeks, it's more of an exception than a rule. It amazes me that every week that I don't do a cute animal, people say that it's great to see something different from me, when I rarely submit cute animals anymore. On top of that, this design is not a "googly eyed animal" at all. In fact, you can hardly see the animal's eye in the design because it's so small.

Anyway, I'm done defending this design. I put a lot of time into it, I'm happy with it, and it's different from the rest of the entries in the derby. I think I accomplished my mission.

I'm sorry that these people are so rude to you (some of them). Your design is cute and if they don't like it, then they don't need to vote for it. But I really am surprised by the attacks. I guess I haven't been reading comments lately - but obviously there's some in the community who have gone all snarky.

itoaseik

I just looked at SDS again and it had changed the numbers to put this behind by 4... a full day later. Anyone know how their tracking works and if that's any more likely to be right than the previous tie?

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