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March 14, 2006

The Two Recent Accidental Glock Discharges, detailed

An entry here the other day titled Accidental handgun discharges and Glock was inspired by two recent incidents and was an editorial about the frequency of accidental handgun discharges involving that particular brand of handguns. Here are some details about those incidents.

Case #1 - Accidental Glock discharge at Crockett Jr. High in Odessa

A lot of people are very angry about this, but no one was hurt -- a fact for which surely everyone is thankful.

To recap, Crockett Jr. High School principal Van Grady was arrested a few days following the discharge of a handgun in the school on February 24, 2006. Jeff Maher of News West 9 interviewed one of Mr. Grady's in-laws, Cindy Carlson, and published a report at the News West 9 website. Excerpts:

NewsWest 9 has obtained copies of the arrest and search warrant affidavits, detailing what Grady told officers, and what was found inside his car parked on campus, in the early stages of the investigation into the incident.

/snip/

They go on to say he later admitted to accidently shooting a gun, but claimed he didn't know the guns were inside the gym bag.

The fired bullet went through a wall, and into a bathroom. Luckily, no one was hurt.

Now, one of Grady's relatives is talking about what happened that day, saying what happened was just accident.

/snip/

"For some reason, that day, he put his weapons in his workout bag instead of the gun bag," Carlson acknowledged.

Carlson said that, before he comes to school, Grady often works out, and changes clothes at the office, using his gym bag ... but, accidentally had the guns inside.

"And brings the bag into his office," she described, "And he had a cold, too. Ao he reached in the bag to get his cough medicine, and he barely picks the bag up off the ground and, when he put his hand in - that particular gun doesn't have a safety on it - and the gun went off."

A Glock doesn't have a manual safety on it. There were two handguns recovered, a .40 caliber Glock 23 and a 380 Bersa (.355 caliber). All the public information about this incident points to the Glock as the one that discharged.

This could have been a serious tragedy, and I'm sure the parents of the students at the school all must have let out a huge sigh of relief before they started gunning for Mr. Grady, metaphorically speaking. As it stands Mr. Grady was put on paid suspension, a replacement was brought in, the Superintendent has said publicly that Mr. Grady's contract which expires in a few months will not be renewed, and Mr. Grady was arrested by the Odessa Police Department.

Few handguns are as easily discharged as a Glock, and I believe that none of this would have happened if he had had some other brand of handgun in his bag than a Glock. I'm not trying to justify the breaking of the law, I'm merely focusing on the handgun and the problems that seem to follow that brand like a dog on a leash.

Two 16-year-old Odessa boys accused of attacking a cook at the Ector County Youth Center, stealing her car and escaping from the facility remained at large Thursday evening.

/snip/

The foot chase caused the Ector County Independent School District to lock down five schools, because they were in the vicinity of where the escapees were running.

From 8:45 a.m. to 10:30 a.m. Thursday, Crockett and Bowie junior highs, Noel and Pease elementaries and Odessa High School locked their doors and restricted outside activity.

Van Grady, principal of Crockett, said he heard about the chase on the police scanner, called the ECISD offices downtown, then put the campus on lockdown.

"It was taking place just a block from here," Grady said. "I knew the guys were on the loose and dangerous. First thing I was concerned about was safety."

Case #2 - Accidental Glock Discharge in Hobbs Leaves One Dead

The incident occurred in Hobbs, New Mexico, on March 4, 2006. Here's the report from the Odessa American:

Local News
Monday, March 06, 2006
Hobbs man dies after being shot

Odessa American

Hobbs, N.M. A 24-year-old man died at a Lubbock hospital after being shot in the head early Saturday at a home in the 700 block of East Mesquite Drive.
Daniel Melton died at University Medical Center at 3:30 p.m. Saturday, according to a house supervisor.

According to the news release, officers say 33-year-old Donald Colvin was handling a .45 caliber pistol when the gun discharged, sending a bullet through a wall and striking Melton, who was in a separate room.

Police were continuing to investigate the incident Saturday, according to the news release.

Commander Donnie Graham of the Hobbs Police Department said the gun was a .45 caliber Glock 36 pistol. (He also pointed out that the victims correct name is Donny Melton.)

I don't believe an official ruling has been made yet, but the most logical explanation is that this was yet another accidental discharge of a Glock handgun.

Comments

George, a sobering couple of articles. You and I have talked about this issue before and while I don't personally know anyone who's had a problem with their Glock, it obviously pays to be careful.

My own Glock is a model 21, a .45 caliber issued to me by my Sheriff's Office. Neither I, nor any other officers in the department, have had any problems with accidental discharges. Are we more careful, or simply lucky? Probably a little of both.

The year was 1992, I E.T.S. from the military and after returning home I purchased a Glock 23 .40 S&W. I read many gun magazines on how this fine weapon should be carried. All the while forgetting Jeff Cooper's famous statement: “Unless a gun has a round chambered in it, it is useless.” To think I believed in the 1990s gun magazines over Mr. Coopers statement. I was taught Mr. Cooper's mindset while in the military. 12 years mind you and I qualified expert during each year to boot. Treat all weapons as if they were loaded! Yet, the gun magazines, mostly retired civilian police, who preached civilians should carry a fully loaded magazine and NO round in the chamber, O.K. One day, I went to the gun store and purchased a Hogue slip on grip for my Glock. When I returned home, I retrieved my Glock with the knowledge that it has a loaded magazine with NO round in the chamber. I removed the magazine and proceeded to place the new slip-on grip, done. The grip was awesome it looked and felt nice. I looked at the wall clock and thought to myself, I have time to dissemble, clean and lube my Glock. Now for those of you real gun professionals, gun editors, who preach a lot of good stuff, I think not. I got into the false habit of thinking since I carry NO round in the chamber there was NO reason to check the chamber. I removed the magazine and the second thing one has to do prior to dissembling a Glock is squeeze the trigger. This releases the firing pin, so that the slide pins can be pulled downward and the upper slide removed. After squeezing the trigger and to my surprise, the Glock loudly discharged inside my Condo. I can assure anyone who has never experienced this situation. The mind instantly replays the moment in slow motion, what! The round made a small hole through the window blind. Yes, the round flatten after making another small hole through the glass window, striking the metal screen window. The metal screen window caused the round to flatten and spiral upward. If I were criminal, I would not have called the local police department to report this as an accidental discharge. Some of you pros call this negligence discharge, ya right. I took responsibility for my actions and called the local police department. I won't go into all the police details. I will say this: the police officer, which responded, was very level headed and very understanding. I quote him: "we searched the condo complex and found no one injured nor did we find any damages to property, however if someone should call later, you can be charged with Reckless Endangerment." No one called later. I hear all the gun experts saying: "always check the chamber first." This, after they preached civilians should never chamber a round, only carry the weapon with a loaded magazine, this way is safer than one round in the chamber. Ya, right. Needless to say, I don't read any of today's useless gun magazine anymore, rather I practice military procedure taught to me many years ago. So, by now everyone is thinking how did that round get chambered? During the police investigation, my wife was contacted at her work and she was requested to come home. The prior night she had taken my Glock to look at it. While looking at it, she pulled the slide partially rearward peering into the chamber to see if a round were in the chamber, never thinking by doing so, she would chamber a round. Again, to all you expert civilian gun instructors... yes, she had taken a gun safety course. Yes, women are curious and just as fascinated as men are with weapons. As much as I loved my (third) Glock, I sold it to repair the window(s). I purchased a snub nosed revolver should my wife ever need to use it. I don't need to squeeze the trigger as part of the disassembly procedure as is required by the Glock. Plus, I carry it fully loaded and treat it as such. I no longer think the way I learned from the 1990s gun magazine civilians, who wrote civilians should carry a pistol with no round in the chamber, but with a fully loaded magazine. The best training is military training. They are the true professionals.

Yeah, blame the gunwriters. Blame your stupidity on someone else. Were you not taught to treat every firearm as loaded? You must always assume that a firearm is loaded every time you handle it. Maybe you were taught the opposite. Assume that a firearm is not loaded and squeeze the trigger first to check if the chamber is empty. What an idiot!

Even if someone treats these Glocks as safe as they can, discharges still occur with too frequent regularity. Putting a safety on a trigger's like putting a break on an accelerator! It just doesn't wash. If a cop gets in a scuffle with a gun like this, all it would take is for someone's finger to find its way into the trigger guard. I'm a longtime shooter and I've shot the Glock. It's a fine gun, but it needs a manual safety.

Just had a accidental discharge from a Glock 23 , Scared the hell out of me. Ruined a brand new comforter and mattress.I released the magazine ( no problem )I was attempting to remove the bullet in the chamber. I pulled the slide back to eject the bullet in the chamber, it doesn't pop out. I slowly and carefully let the slide go back...and the gun discharges. I take full responsibility for this, but really believe this is a problem that a lot of other people will experience. Is there a remedy or something else I could have done ?

Folks you trigger finger and your brain is your safety period. I think mandatory 8 hrs gun safety should be mandated for new owners of glock firearms. the safety is in the trigger. An approved I see that is need is to reduce the trigger guard's length to make it a more natural feel lay your trigger finger on so it doesn't slip into the trigger. Thanks for sharing your story though. Education is key to prevent accidental shootings.

Buy a RUGER. I own TWO of their P94 40 cal. Stainless, and Blue, and ALSO, My Favorite in the World, RUGER SR-9. I own Sigs, Colts, S&W's, Springfield Arms, NEVER a Glock, for ALL the reasons aforementioned. But Nothing compares to the Feel, the "Thumb Safety" that the SR-9 has. All my RUGER'S have Thumb Safety's which in NO WAY, prohibit any speed, in drawing and firing. RUGER is my choice, Hands Down, for their Safety & Quality, WITH PRECISION.

I have Glock 21 45 caliber being a retired military with 20 years active duty I been around with different kind of firearms. Here is the step by step disassembly.
1.Removed magazine loaded or not.
2.Check the chamber for round twice it there is one it should eject when pulling the top.
3.Now pull the trigger pointed on safe direction .Why pull the trigger? since the safety is in the trigger it is design that way.

In 2003, Glock announced the Internal Locking System (ILS) safety feature. The ILS is a manually activated lock that is located in the back of the pistol's grip. It is cylindrical in design and, according to Glock, each key is unique. When activated, the lock causes a tab to protrude from the rear of the grip giving both a visual and tactile indication as to whether the lock is engaged or not. When activated, the ILS renders the Glock unfireable as well as making it impossible to disassemble. When disengaged, the ILS adds no further safety mechanisms to the Glock pistol. The ILS is available as an option on most Glock pistols. Glock pistols cannot be retrofitted to accommodate the ILS. The lock must be factory built in Austria and shipped as a special order.

@ Alvin Empinado... your comment to Mr. Ouellette is pointless and is pure abusive ad hominem, which usually involves attacking the traits of an opponent as a means to invalidate their arguments. Equating someone's character with the soundness of their argument is a logical fallacy. Mere verbal abuse in the absence of an argument, however, is not ad hominem nor any kind of logical fallacy.

Mr. Ouellette clearly avers while disassembling his Glock handgun, per Glocks manual, it IS required you squeeze the trigger to release the firing pin IN ORDER to remove the slide assembly. Mr. Ouellette stated he keeps his personal weapon secured at home with NO round in the chamber and a fulled loaded magazine. NO other handgun requires the owner to squeeze the trigger to release the firing pin prior to dis-assembly of a Glock firearm..

Calling someone 'stupid' is a personal attack. The writer intelligently expressed his experience with others how his firearm became chambered with a bullet.

Negligent discharge, 3 things must occur: 1. That you willfully fired a gun. 2. That you did so in a grossly negligent manner. 3. That the discharge of the gun could have resulted in a person's death or injury.

Willfully, meaning: "You act willfully when you commit an act willingly or on purpose. It doesn't matter if you don't intent to break the law as long as the act is intentional. If you didn't intend to fire your gun, then you didn't "willfully" discharge it. This means that if, for example, you honestly and reasonably believe that your gun is unloaded when you pull the trigger, you aren't guilty of negligently discharging a firearm."