James Allen has no evidence (neither does anyone else) of which part is being stalled. Redbull has gained qualy pace, likely due to DDRS. But they have also gained race pace, which has got nothing to do with DDRS.

James Allen has no evidence (neither does anyone else) of which part is being stalled. Redbull has gained qualy pace, likely due to DDRS. But they have also gained race pace, which has got nothing to do with DDRS.

+1

I also cant quite figure out how removing downforce from the rear = more stability ... can someone expound on that please

which team make better use of the device in hand and which was more efficient in making it work properly ?

You and pretty much everyone else in here have absolutley no idea which one works better because based on the simple fact that the chassis are not identical and dont work the same way aero wise.

The Red Bull was already a superior chassis to the W03. In addition to that it could be argued that the W03 had the better DDRS iteration but is severely lacking in other areas.. which results in a net slower car which it has been for the last two seasons.

So bottom line .. know one knows ... Yes Red Bull DDR's definately helps in Qualy and getting top speed in passing... however as Timster said ... that device does not explain race pace.

Willis And what pedigree has the man proven himself since leaving Williams.

The simple fact is.. the MGP003 is simply too far back right now for the MGP004 to be a top 3 car .. let alone top 2. Teams simply do not make quantum leaps forward without significant rule changes and that isn't the case for 2013. Look at the back of the pack... they should have the easiest opportunity to make a 2s leap (with it be Mass or Cater) since they were so far back rushing to get on the grid and they haven't been able to make any impact from getting from the back 2 teams. Williams has been stuck for years mid pack. FI is the only team has made significant progress up the grid and even that is limited.

Michael made a wise decision. He saw that even A SIGNIFICANT upgrade by MGP be pointless and probably slow them down a few tenths so why bother committing to them early.. Unless RedBull or McLaren offered him a drive.. better to call it day and that's what he did.

Mercedes is actually quickly become a joke. Full works team. Tremendous engine experience. Supposed top F1 talent across the board and they can't get this dog of a car up the grid. After Toyota and BMW left, I had really hoped Mercedes would have been different.. but once again. Privateers are showing the manufacturers again how to compete in F1 (and I consider Ferrari a privateer).

Maybe we should take a poll of how long Mercedes will stay in F1 as works team and end up going back to being an engine partner only.

How is Ferrari a privateer? That is something I do not quite understand.

How can a big team go for about 3/4 of a season not developing the car? They said they concentrated on the tyres and not very many aero changes happened in this time, maybe they played with the engine maps/suspension geometry - what did all the aero and other guys do? I guess the team are putting a massive amount of time and money into the 2014 regulations.

I guess this team wants to WIN championships, not come second or just make progress from last year! Surely they know that they are not going to become the top team with the constant rules. So what can they do? Just wait it out until 2014 and make sure they are the most prepared team!

Next year I think they will try and build a semi-good car. See if it is any good in the first bit of the season and if its not they will simply give up and fully concentrate on 2014, but the top 3 will have to spend time on their 2013 cars as they will have a chance at the championships - hindering their 2014 cars.

Hamilton already says that he is not expecting to win races next season - I don't think he is just saying that! Also I think that people saying that he moved to Mercedes because they are a works team is wrong, I expect McLaren to have the same raw power. The only reason I can think is that MGP have shown him the plan for the next two years and it shows how much of the resources are going into the 2014 car and it is obviously more than McLaren - and as all the top teams will start for the same level MGP have quite a large chance of building a good car!

This is just my view on things, and even if I'm right then the 2014 car (even with all their efforts) could be crap, as perforce doesn't scale to resources used as they would like!

So guys on this thread need to chill out and look at the bigger picture!

they abandoned 2010 for 2011 and it was worse than 2010 , they abandoned 2011 for 2012 and now it is 5th and on the way down to 6th . now they abandoned 2012 and will abandon 2013 for 2014, this could only go well

they abandoned 2010 for 2011 and it was worse than 2010 , they abandoned 2011 for 2012 and now it is 5th and on the way down to 6th . now they abandoned 2012 and will abandon 2013 for 2014, this could only go well

Yea I guess that we can only hope that 2014 is different due to the rule changes!

How can a big team go for about 3/4 of a season not developing the car? They said they concentrated on the tyres and not very many aero changes happened in this time, maybe they played with the engine maps/suspension geometry - what did all the aero and other guys do? I guess the team are putting a massive amount of time and money into the 2014 regulations.

I guess this team wants to WIN championships, not come second or just make progress from last year! Surely they know that they are not going to become the top team with the constant rules. So what can they do? Just wait it out until 2014 and make sure they are the most prepared team!

Next year I think they will try and build a semi-good car. See if it is any good in the first bit of the season and if its not they will simply give up and fully concentrate on 2014, but the top 3 will have to spend time on their 2013 cars as they will have a chance at the championships - hindering their 2014 cars.

Hamilton already says that he is not expecting to win races next season - I don't think he is just saying that! Also I think that people saying that he moved to Mercedes because they are a works team is wrong, I expect McLaren to have the same raw power. The only reason I can think is that MGP have shown him the plan for the next two years and it shows how much of the resources are going into the 2014 car and it is obviously more than McLaren - and as all the top teams will start for the same level MGP have quite a large chance of building a good car!

This is just my view on things, and even if I'm right then the 2014 car (even with all their efforts) could be crap, as perforce doesn't scale to resources used as they would like!

So guys on this thread need to chill out and look at the bigger picture!

They have updated the car - it's just not working. The updates are not giving them anything.

Is there any reason in order to make mercedes did ​​a big step forward in 2013?

next year cars is an evolution of current cars , no technical changes . so expect top dogs in 2012 to stay put in 2013 ,unless merc discover a brilliant innovation that will make them slow sorry i mean fast

Danner Tells Lauda To Fire Mercedes Staff: A German F1 pundit has advised Niki Lauda to take an axe to Mercedes' current personnel lineup. Lauda, the great Austrian triple World Champion, has been signed on as Mercedes' non-executive chairman — effectively a decision-making link between the German marque's Stuttgart headquarters and the racing team in the UK. So far, he has negotiated Mercedes' new Concorde Agreement deal and lured Lewis Hamilton onto the team for 2013. RTL commentator Christian Danner, a former driver, now wants Lauda to sack staff. "The people who built this car should really all be fired," he told Bild newspaper. It can't be that you drive all around the world for nine months only to find that your car is as fast as a Toro Rosso." Danner said it is now up to Lauda to put things right. "He is responsible to make the next decisions. And those decisions will primarily be about the personnel."

I had thought Lauda was mostly advisory/ceremonial in his new position. I didn't think he had the power to fire people. I respected him as a driver but as a team executive, not so much.

Both Lauda and Marko have interesting roles that no one can clearly define. Marko has let both STR guys go and no we have 2 undefined quantities driving around. Lauda will bark, do some smoke and mirrors kind of stuff and get the credit if MGP improves... even for reasons not related to Lauda.

What I've gathered is that Costa is overseeing the W04 project (Willis the W05 project).
Obviously they'll be making use of the same design resources so I don't think they have separate teams. Those days are over since the RRA.
Costa is a mechanical design man. Mike Elliott, the new head of aero, should bring some new fresh ideas in aero design.

Who is the chief engineer of the project W04?? and in general what is the structure of technical staff team?

I'd like to know too!

Acording to Brawn, Willis. As to the 'general structure', it seems that they are taking the McLaren double-design structure to a whole new level, combining the classic Ferrari approach with the Mc philosophy. Working two seasons in advance, but incorporating what they can real-time, IMHO. If it pays off, they will be pretty strong in the years to come. If not, it is a fail of Toyota/Honda magnitude.

According to the link, Aldo Costa is already working on the 2013 car, and Willis is working on the base of the 2014 car. This is a pretty good way to work but a very expensive one too.http://www.motorspor...n_12100443.html

Luckily both drivers managed to get into Q3. But that's pretty much the best they could do today, maybe P8 would have been possible for Rosberg with a better sector 3 time. Sector 3 was ridiculous slow for Mercedes considering that it's a very short sector, this car is a pain when it comes to downforce in faster corners.

According to the link, Aldo Costa is already working on the 2013 car, and Willis is working on the base of the 2014 car. This is a pretty good way to work but a very expensive one too.http://www.motorspor...n_12100443.html

I think this is more of a 2014 specific decision due to the more radical chaange - Costa is working on the current regulation car, which even if not a direct evolution of the current car, they have 3 years of information of aspects of the current format to put to use, and aspects can certainly be carried over. Whilst Willis is undertaking initial work on the 2014 car - which has been given a longer lead time due to the changes making their current baseline (the W03 and W04) offer little benefit.