Not only does that keep desperate teams in Wash and Miami involved for Flynn and RG3, bit per JTA, Kevin Kolb is owed $7million on Mar 17th. If the Cardinals sign Manning they're not going to sign Kolb.

It'll cost you no picks to get him, just cash.

And if you're not a Kevin Kolb fan, I'd be worried.

I said six weeks ago Kolb would be the Browns starter in 2012. I thought it would cost a 4th or so to get him but it won't.

I'd be okay with all of this if Kolb starts the 2012 season with RG3 as the rookie just waiting for Kolb to get hurt or struggle.

But where Manning goes makes a big difference on everything else as well as the potential price for getting the Rams #2.

In an ideal world Manning goes to Miami, Wash goes and gets Flynn and St Louis is holding a much weaker poker hand.

Not only does that keep desperate teams in Wash and Miami involved for Flynn and RG3, bit per JTA, Kevin Kolb is owed $7million on Mar 17th. If the Cardinals sign Manning they're not going to sign Kolb.

It'll cost you no picks to get him, just cash.

And if you're not a Kevin Kolb fan, I'd be worried.

I said six weeks ago Kolb would be the Browns starter in 2012. I thought it would cost a 4th or so to get him but it won't.

I'd be okay with all of this if Kolb starts the 2012 season with RG3 as the rookie just waiting for Kolb to get hurt or struggle.

But where Manning goes makes a big difference on everything else as well as the potential price for getting the Rams #2.

In an ideal world Manning goes to Miami, Wash goes and gets Flynn and St Louis is holding a much weaker poker hand.

If the ideal scenario took place and the Browns were the only realistic suitor (at least without STL moving way down), would #4 and #22 be enough on its own? I think it might. You might even get away with paying a little less than that, i.e. #4, #37, and a third rounder next year. Strange things can happen when the team holding the pick has zero credible threat to take the guy.

Last edited by Kingpin74 on Wed Mar 07, 2012 12:12 pm, edited 1 time in total.

"Well then I guess there's only one thing left to do...win the whole, f***in', thing."- Jake Taylor

Hikohadon wrote:I like Kolb more than Colt. I even like Kolb more than Flynn.

He's not a GREAT option, but the Browns could do worse.

His injury/concussion history worries me though. Doesn't seem like a guy that can make it through a 16 game season.

There's only one QB they could get that would excite me. RG3 is the high end of the interest spectrum.

Colt is at the bottom. Anyone else is somewhere in between (probably closer to Colt than to RG3).

With Kolb and Flynn, at least they didn't cost draft picks. Probably the most exciting thing about them.

I'm with ya there. I think Kolb is a decent option given he'd be back with guys and an offense that had him ascending in Philly. And if he was signed to a relatively friendly deal (knowing his 'prospect status' is about dead) I'd be fine with him running the show for ahead of RG3 initially.

As JTA mentioned to me, consider (for however briefly) that Washington might not be inclined to move up for St Louis pick if the Browns sign Kolb, believing that Cleveland will 'have thir guy). Unlikely? Maybe. But it still would lessen price to move up and it creates however small a window that you wouldn't have to at all if Wash stays at 6 and RG3 falls to Browns at 4 w/o move.

ST louis cannot drop below Washington's 6 pick if they want Khalil or Claiborne. And JTA noted it was Fisher who picked Pacman at #6 a few years back.

Either way, it all starts today at noon. Manning gone, all the speculation where he'll go, MAC tourney, NCAA tourney, baseball following that and plenty of NFL free agency and trade/draft speciulation.

Ziner wrote:I just can't see Manning in Washington. Manning wants to have control over the offense, Shanahan won't give that control up.

This. Plus he will not play against his bro 2X per year. No way he goes to the Skins.

Has he said something about this? Or are you just assuming that?

I'm not sure why he, or anyone, would be opposed to playing his brother twice a year. In fact I could just as easily see that as some sort of incentive.

just making shit up - that's how I roll

No, actually that is the prevailing feeling of numerous talking heads. Tony Dungy was on Milke and Mike this morning and alleged that he has spoken to the Manning family and that Peyton does not want to play in the NFC East.

Not sure how this would be an incentive anyway- why would Manning the Elder want to knock Manning the Younger out of the playoffs? The incentive I could see is Manning going to the AFC South to play the Colts 2X per season. That's an incentive.

I don't need to be patient, they're going to be shit forever. - CDT, discussing my favorite NFL team

Ziner wrote:I just can't see Manning in Washington. Manning wants to have control over the offense, Shanahan won't give that control up.

This. Plus he will not play against his bro 2X per year. No way he goes to the Skins.

Has he said something about this? Or are you just assuming that?

I'm not sure why he, or anyone, would be opposed to playing his brother twice a year. In fact I could just as easily see that as some sort of incentive.

just making shit up - that's how I roll

No, actually that is the prevailing feeling of numerous talking heads. Tony Dungy was on Milke and Mike this morning and alleged that he has spoken to the Manning family and that Peyton does not want to play in the NFC East.

Not sure how this would be an incentive anyway- why would Manning the Elder want to knock Manning the Younger out of the playoffs? The incentive I could see is Manning going to the AFC South to play the Colts 2X per season. That's an incentive.

Agree with Matt here. 2 places I don't see him having any interest in:

Washington (doesn't want to play vs. bro in NFC East)New York Jets (doesn't want to go toe to toe in same media market as bro)

Hikohadon wrote:I like Kolb more than Colt. I even like Kolb more than Flynn.

He's not a GREAT option, but the Browns could do worse.

His injury/concussion history worries me though. Doesn't seem like a guy that can make it through a 16 game season.

There's only one QB they could get that would excite me. RG3 is the high end of the interest spectrum.

Colt is at the bottom. Anyone else is somewhere in between (probably closer to Colt than to RG3).

With Kolb and Flynn, at least they didn't cost draft picks. Probably the most exciting thing about them.

I'm with ya there. I think Kolb is a decent option given he'd be back with guys and an offense that had him ascending in Philly. And if he was signed to a relatively friendly deal (knowing his 'prospect status' is about dead) I'd be fine with him running the show for ahead of RG3 initially.

As JTA mentioned to me, consider (for however briefly) that Washington might not be inclined to move up for St Louis pick if the Browns sign Kolb, believing that Cleveland will 'have thir guy). Unlikely? Maybe. But it still would lessen price to move up and it creates however small a window that you wouldn't have to at all if Wash stays at 6 and RG3 falls to Browns at 4 w/o move.

ST louis cannot drop below Washington's 6 pick if they want Khalil or Claiborne. And JTA noted it was Fisher who picked Pacman at #6 a few years back.

Either way, it all starts today at noon. Manning gone, all the speculation where he'll go, MAC tourney, NCAA tourney, baseball following that and plenty of NFL free agency and trade/draft speciulation.

Winter ends today

I kind of agree with all of this. But I still don't see RG3 falling to 4. Seattle or KC or someone will try to move up to #3 if they can't get it done with STL. Also, not sure anyone will be thinking "Oh, they've got Kolb now, they're SET at QB."

Hikohadon wrote:I like Kolb more than Colt. I even like Kolb more than Flynn.

He's not a GREAT option, but the Browns could do worse.

His injury/concussion history worries me though. Doesn't seem like a guy that can make it through a 16 game season.

There's only one QB they could get that would excite me. RG3 is the high end of the interest spectrum.

Colt is at the bottom. Anyone else is somewhere in between (probably closer to Colt than to RG3).

With Kolb and Flynn, at least they didn't cost draft picks. Probably the most exciting thing about them.

I'm with ya there. I think Kolb is a decent option given he'd be back with guys and an offense that had him ascending in Philly. And if he was signed to a relatively friendly deal (knowing his 'prospect status' is about dead) I'd be fine with him running the show for ahead of RG3 initially.

As JTA mentioned to me, consider (for however briefly) that Washington might not be inclined to move up for St Louis pick if the Browns sign Kolb, believing that Cleveland will 'have thir guy). Unlikely? Maybe. But it still would lessen price to move up and it creates however small a window that you wouldn't have to at all if Wash stays at 6 and RG3 falls to Browns at 4 w/o move.

ST louis cannot drop below Washington's 6 pick if they want Khalil or Claiborne. And JTA noted it was Fisher who picked Pacman at #6 a few years back.

Either way, it all starts today at noon. Manning gone, all the speculation where he'll go, MAC tourney, NCAA tourney, baseball following that and plenty of NFL free agency and trade/draft speciulation.

Winter ends today

I kind of agree with all of this. But I still don't see RG3 falling to 4. Seattle or KC or someone will try to move up to #3 if they can't get it done with STL. Also, not sure anyone will be thinking "Oh, they've got Kolb now, they're SET at QB."

Lowers ultimate price if Browns come in late with #4 and something else though. Keeps St Louis in the Khalil and Claiborne game or option to over reach for Blackmon if they want.

I'm not a Flynn fan, even though we keep our draft picks. Two great games against weak defenses, playing for the Packers. meh. He doesn't have the best mechanics, although he does understand the system.

Kolb is good, not great either. Higher INT% than Colt (.031 to .024). Same completion %. Was sacked less than Colt but lost more yards on sacks (with this line...). More yds/att in a different system. I'm not sold that he is an upgrade over Colt. Another QB who lost time due to a concussion, similar stats.

I am on the RG3 bandwagon. We know Luck is out of the picture.

And here's a thought. There's rumors other players are leaving if Payton doesn't come back. The Colts could have traded their pick to whoever, the Browns, resigned Manning, and rebuilt the team around him with the Brown's picks. They could have been contenders again, as early as 2012. But they chose to start over from scratch. I don't think I would have gone that route.

Spin wrote:I'm not a Flynn fan, even though we keep our draft picks. Two great games against weak defenses, playing for the Packers. meh. He doesn't have the best mechanics, although he does understand the system.

Kolb is good, not great either. Higher INT% than Colt (.031 to .024). Same completion %. Was sacked less than Colt but lost more yards on sacks (with this line...). More yds/att in a different system. I'm not sold that he is an upgrade over Colt. Another QB who lost time due to a concussion, similar stats.

I am on the RG3 bandwagon. We know Luck is out of the picture.

And here's a thought. There's rumors other players are leaving if Payton doesn't come back. The Colts could have traded their pick to whoever, the Browns, resigned Manning, and rebuilt the team around him with the Brown's picks. They could have been contenders again, as early as 2012. But they chose to start over from scratch. I don't think I would have gone that route.

They had to make that call and went this route. Even if they had traded him they would have been on the hook for about $20million of that $28million bonus from my understanding.

Manning could be done after one hit in preseason. Seems like Colts wanted to build for 2013 and beyond, clear the decks, maybe draft their Manning of the next ten years and free up Manning's money, Wayne's, Saturday's, Garcon's, etc.

Did anybody watch the press conference? Was it to announce the Colts are not picking up the option or that Peyton is definitely not going to be there next year? I still think that it is highly possible that Peyton re-signs with Indy and finishes up there. Peyton had to have known they weren't going to pay the $28MM so that part of it should not be a surprise.

Love child of shawn kemp wrote:Did anybody watch the press conference? Was it to announce the Colts are not picking up the option or that Peyton is definitely not going to be there next year? I still think that it is highly possible that Peyton re-signs with Indy and finishes up there. Peyton had to have known they weren't going to pay the $28MM so that part of it should not be a surprise.

I think e0 has a better job getting a bj from Kate Upton tonight than Peyton Manning re-signing with Indy.

Love child of shawn kemp wrote:Did anybody watch the press conference? Was it to announce the Colts are not picking up the option or that Peyton is definitely not going to be there next year? I still think that it is highly possible that Peyton re-signs with Indy and finishes up there. Peyton had to have known they weren't going to pay the $28MM so that part of it should not be a surprise.

Hikohadon wrote:I like Kolb more than Colt. I even like Kolb more than Flynn.

He's not a GREAT option, but the Browns could do worse.

His injury/concussion history worries me though. Doesn't seem like a guy that can make it through a 16 game season.

There's only one QB they could get that would excite me. RG3 is the high end of the interest spectrum.

Colt is at the bottom. Anyone else is somewhere in between (probably closer to Colt than to RG3).

With Kolb and Flynn, at least they didn't cost draft picks. Probably the most exciting thing about them.

I'm with ya there. I think Kolb is a decent option given he'd be back with guys and an offense that had him ascending in Philly. And if he was signed to a relatively friendly deal (knowing his 'prospect status' is about dead) I'd be fine with him running the show for ahead of RG3 initially.

As JTA mentioned to me, consider (for however briefly) that Washington might not be inclined to move up for St Louis pick if the Browns sign Kolb, believing that Cleveland will 'have thir guy). Unlikely? Maybe. But it still would lessen price to move up and it creates however small a window that you wouldn't have to at all if Wash stays at 6 and RG3 falls to Browns at 4 w/o move.

ST louis cannot drop below Washington's 6 pick if they want Khalil or Claiborne. And JTA noted it was Fisher who picked Pacman at #6 a few years back.

Either way, it all starts today at noon. Manning gone, all the speculation where he'll go, MAC tourney, NCAA tourney, baseball following that and plenty of NFL free agency and trade/draft speciulation.

Winter ends today

I kind of agree with all of this. But I still don't see RG3 falling to 4. Seattle or KC or someone will try to move up to #3 if they can't get it done with STL. Also, not sure anyone will be thinking "Oh, they've got Kolb now, they're SET at QB."

I don't think Min will trade that pick. Kalil is too good a prospect at a position of need. Something gets done with St Louis or he drops to #4.

I'd be willing to wager you whatever you'd like this doesn't happen. Any of it.

The Jets would need to build a larger training facility to hold all of the egos involved. Where ever Peyton goes, he becomes not only the starting QB, but the OC and most likely face of the franchise. It will need to be a good fit.

I don't need to be patient, they're going to be shit forever. - CDT, discussing my favorite NFL team

Spin wrote:I'm not a Flynn fan, even though we keep our draft picks. Two great games against weak defenses, playing for the Packers. meh. He doesn't have the best mechanics, although he does understand the system.

Kolb is good, not great either. Higher INT% than Colt (.031 to .024). Same completion %. Was sacked less than Colt but lost more yards on sacks (with this line...). More yds/att in a different system. I'm not sold that he is an upgrade over Colt. Another QB who lost time due to a concussion, similar stats.

I am on the RG3 bandwagon. We know Luck is out of the picture.

And here's a thought. There's rumors other players are leaving if Payton doesn't come back. The Colts could have traded their pick to whoever, the Browns, resigned Manning, and rebuilt the team around him with the Brown's picks. They could have been contenders again, as early as 2012. But they chose to start over from scratch. I don't think I would have gone that route.

They had to make that call and went this route. Even if they had traded him they would have been on the hook for about $20million of that $28million bonus from my understanding.

Manning could be done after one hit in preseason. Seems like Colts wanted to build for 2013 and beyond, clear the decks, maybe draft their Manning of the next ten years and free up Manning's money, Wayne's, Saturday's, Garcon's, etc.

Just a thought.

I think the Colts know they are a long ways from just a healthy Peyton Manning from really competing. This team is far removed from the one that played in the SB in 09. The defense is two very talented but aging ends surrounded by replacement level players. The offense can pass the ball but they can't run and they don't protect the way the line did for years. They know they need to stop and complete a full rebuild.

Swerb wrote:Go start a blog if you want to tell the world your incomprehendible ramblings.

Cerebral_DownTime wrote:I have a big arm and can throw the ball pretty damn far...... maybe even over those moutains. The Browns should sign me, i'll let you all in locker room to drink beer. Then we can all go out the parking lot to watch me do motorcycle stunts.

JCoz wrote:I don't think Min will trade that pick. Kalil is too good a prospect at a position of need. Something gets done with St Louis or he drops to #4.

Maybe, but I'm betting that STL takes Kalil if they stay at #2.

Claiborne & Blackmon aren't so awesome that MIN can't trade down.

It's unfortunate - there are 3 elite prospects in this draft, and we pick #4. Just like last year when there were 5 elite prospects and we picked #6.

My guess is that Manning goes to Zona, Flynn goes to Miami, Washington mortgages everything to move up to 2, Browns trade down from 4 (if they can find a taker).

Oh, and they sign Kolb at a bargain rate and put him in a "competition" with Colt.

Browns take Claiborne at 4 and a LB or DE at 22. Sign some schmoe at RB and give Hardesty a shot to show he's recovered from his ACL. Sign a WR in FA like Meachum. Sign some guy to play RT and draft one too.

Kolb beats out Colt (amidst much dispute between the people that still care), plays 11 games, misses 5 due to injury. Colt plays the other 5. This super-duo combines to win 7 games, mainly on the back of the D. Idiots everywhere take sides a la Couch/Holcomb, mistakenly thinking either is more than a placeholder. Browns draft around #15 in 2013, nowhere high enough to get a Real QB. We head into 2013 all excited about maybe getting the NFL equivalent of an 8 seed.

Hikohadon wrote:It's clear that we want Manning to go to the Skins, since I then think it likely that Miami signs Matt Flynn in FA and the price to get RG3 goes down.

I just don't see Peyton going to the NFC East and playing outside in the cold against his brother.

The price becomes zero in that scenario Hiko

STL may not want to trade with Seattle, but MIN would.

If STL takes Kalil, MIN has no motivation not to move down. Combine that with Seattle's Fantasy-esque roster moves (was it two 2nds they gave up for Charlie Whitehurst?), you can hear a pin drop at the draft party that thought that RG3 was ours since he got past #2.

Kolb is the "X" factor now if Peyton goes to the desert. The talking heads say Manning will be signing sooner than later so we won't have to wait long to see if corn-Kolb may be in the mix for orange & brown.

Rons Paul wood be prezident before Patton Manning goes with the J-E-T-T-S, they already have a stud top noch QB.

SD:

There are over twenty teams in this league who would entertain the possibility of swapping out their QB for a sure hit HOF QB like Manning , including some teams who made the playoffs last year .

However Mannings record out doors in the cold would preclude the Jets from being of prime consideration while he picks and chooses his next home , , so Sanchez has naught to worry .

However your other heart throb Lady Quinn who you assured me was so much better than Mark currently doesn't have a job , let alone need worry about looking over his shoulder at a HOFame replacement .

Keep leading the charge and maintaining your lead as a retard with continued stances such as your , """We don't need no Sanchez at QB we have our little lady heart throb hurray for us as I speak for all the rest of the dumbasses who luv Brady .... we don't need no Cam Newton we have Colt , he deserves more time .

How did those to work out fool.

Sanchez is a starter in this league did so from day one and has two playoff stints in three years .

I'll take that over your colt Mccoy Brady is a QB record any day of the week and twice on Sunday you scum suckin jackass .

Rons Paul wood be prezident before Patton Manning goes with the J-E-T-T-S, they already have a stud top noch QB.

SD:

There are over twenty teams in this league who would entertain the possibility of swapping out their QB for a sure hit HOF QB like Manning , including some teams who made the playoffs last year .

However Mannings record out doors in the cold would preclude the Jets from being of prime consideration while he picks and chooses his next home , , so Sanchez has naught to worry .

However your other heart throb Lady Quinn who you assured me was so much better than Mark currently doesn't have a job , let alone need worry about looking over his shoulder at a HOFame replacement .

Keep leading the charge and maintaining your lead as a retard with continued stances such as your , """We don't need no Sanchez at QB we have our little lady heart throb hurray for us as I speak for all the rest of the dumbasses who luv Brady .... we don't need no Cam Newton we have Colt , he deserves more time .

How did those to work out fool.

Sanchez is a starter in this league did so from day one and has two playoff stints in three years .

I'll take that over your colt Mccoy Brady is a QB record any day of the week and twice on Sunday you scum suckin jackass .

Rons Paul wood be prezident before Patton Manning goes with the J-E-T-T-S, they already have a stud top noch QB.

SD:

There are over twenty teams in this league who would entertain the possibility of swapping out their QB for a sure hit HOF QB like Manning , including some teams who made the playoffs last year .

However Mannings record out doors in the cold would preclude the Jets from being of prime consideration while he picks and chooses his next home , , so Sanchez has naught to worry .

However your other heart throb Lady Quinn who you assured me was so much better than Mark currently doesn't have a job , let alone need worry about looking over his shoulder at a HOFame replacement .

Keep leading the charge and maintaining your lead as a retard with continued stances such as your , """We don't need no Sanchez at QB we have our little lady heart throb hurray for us as I speak for all the rest of the dumbasses who luv Brady .... we don't need no Cam Newton we have Colt , he deserves more time .

How did those to work out fool.

Sanchez is a starter in this league did so from day one and has two playoff stints in three years .

I'll take that over your colt Mccoy Brady is a QB record any day of the week and twice on Sunday you scum suckin jackass .

and

By the way .

You don't speak for me , not now not ever cocksucker.

SoulDawg

Ahhh... like a big cup of coffee to start the day.

i was thinking more along the lines of a nice big crap.

I don't need to be patient, they're going to be shit forever. - CDT, discussing my favorite NFL team

Hikohadon wrote:I like Kolb more than Colt. I even like Kolb more than Flynn.

How does this work? With an ALL-WORLD Receiver Kolb's only stat which was BETTER than McCoy [significantly] was his yards per attempt.

Why pay the money for someone who isn't astronomically better?If we go get RGIII we can have a competition between Colt and him.

Flynn will be overpaid, and I rather it not be by Cleveland.

Let other teams pick up those guys. There is one LOCK in this draft at QB and that is Luck, and the Colts have become [again] ridiculously lucky (pun intendend?) to have the opportunity to pick up a sure thing at the top of the draft.

(RGIII has an huge ceiling, tons of potential, and will LIKELY succeed. But not a LOCK in the way Luck is)

Hikohadon wrote:I like Kolb more than Colt. I even like Kolb more than Flynn.

How does this work? With an ALL-WORLD Receiver Kolb's only stat which was BETTER than McCoy [significantly] was his yards per attempt.

Why pay the money for someone who isn't astronomically better?If we go get RGIII we can have a competition between Colt and him.

Flynn will be overpaid, and I rather it not be by Cleveland.

Let other teams pick up those guys. There is one LOCK in this draft at QB and that is Luck, and the Colts have become [again] ridiculously lucky (pun intendend?) to have the opportunity to pick up a sure thing at the top of the draft.

(RGIII has an huge ceiling, tons of potential, and will LIKELY succeed. But not a LOCK in the way Luck is)

No one's arguing those points. Most of us agree with you. But look at the history of the men making the decision and tell me that you can't see Kolb happening here. I thought it was likely enough that I said he was going to be the starting QB here 8 weeks ago and that was when I thought he'd cost a mid round pick.

None of us thinking it's possible/likely necessarily want it.

Although I agree with Hiko in that I believe Kolb is still better suited for the NFL than McCoy though I understand why some wouldn't. The guy is becoming a walking ace bandage or headache and can't stay on the field.