Newcastle’s last line of defence – Part Deux

Thou shalt not pass!Two months (and a bit) on from the last review, with the transfer window looming, I thought it might be worth having another look at how the players are doing. With off-field sagas taking a backseat for now, the focus is thankfully on the pitch and given our recent blip, does it add significance to the opportunity to invest this month?

We’re just about halfway through our first season in The Championship since our untimely relegation, and as we sit proudly at the top of the table, it goes some way to proving the quality and endeavour that we have available in the squad.

There is still that underlying fear that our position owes much to the lack of quality elsewhere in the league, an argument which holds some water. Much of our good start to the season is undoubtedly owed to a tremendous defensive record, which was something surely none of us expected.

For what it’s worth here’s my own term review of the keepers and defenders. I’ve only included the lads who have played at least a couple of games so far and I’ve just added to my initial review from back in October.

Stevie Harper – Harps has waited long enough in the shadows of former custodians and particularly big pal Shay Given before we sold him to Moneybags City. Not many people have a bad word to say about him and his professional approach to the game and in the past, when called upon, just came in and did the job. I think he’s quite a calming influence on the defence and they look more organised this season so perhaps the communication is getting better. Pulled off some good saves already this season but I still think he looks a bit suspect on crosses and jeez those ones he ‘watches go wide’. (Update) Nonetheless, Harper has continued to perform and has even drawn suggestions of an England call-up in time for the World Cup…….. rating so far – 8/10

Tim Krul – The young Dutch stopper waited patiently, or at least he was doing until he had a bit of a rant about Hughton and his lack of chances. Has looked fairly solid and confident and definitely looks like a good shot stopper but doesn’t look like the finished article yet and considering experience and everything else, probably needs to recognise Harper is the stronger of the two at the moment. (Update) Krul has done everything that’s asked of him when he’s stepped into the fray and with encouraging words to suggest he’s committed to the club, remains one young player very much for the future…….. rating so far – 7/10

Ryan Taylor – Considering his uncanny knack of scoring against us, I think we all looked forward to seeing Taylor delivering his famed final/dead balls and creating chance after chance and scoring freekick after freekick. It never really worked out that way initially, but in fairness, the quality is starting to come and even though he’s been invariably deployed in the right back role, in which he admits he’s happiest, he gets forward well to support. Lacks a little pace at times which can leave him exposed with nippier opposition. (Update) Taylor has admirably adapted to a number of positions when called upon, notably right-back and right-midfield but looks more comfortable in his preferred position at full-back, though I’d like to see more consistency with deliveries as he can clearly strike a ball when he wants. I get the impression he’s actually a few steps ahead of other players sometimes and looks like he dwells on the ball because the runs aren’t being made, so we don’t get the best out of that right foot of his. Or he might just be dwelling on the ball……… rating so far – 7/10

Danny Simpson – I guess, inevitably, the fact we got him on loan from Manchester United meant there was the hope that he’d have ability. Of course there was the old argument that he wasn’t being loaned out for nothing and Ferguson is no fool. Whether expectations were high, I’m not sure, but for me he’s been solid. And that’s probably about it. Solid and dependable, nothing spectacular, but then is spectacular what you’re looking for in a defender? Probably not. (Update) Conflicting rumours at the minute as to whether he’ll be recalled by the Mancs, despite being cleared for the FA Cup game. Epitomises the no nonsense approach to defending we sometimes need to counter the more flamboyant Jose and Colo……… rating so far – 7/10

Fabricio Coloccini – Who’dathunk that a few months into the season we’d be missing Coloccini? Not me. And yet it’s happened. He forged a fairly formidable partnership with Stevie Taylor before picking up an injury and with the drop in standard and the pace not quite so quick, I think it’s fair to say he can get away with more this term. However, I also think he’s gotten to grips with the English game a bit more and seems steadier and more determined. Long may it continue. When he gets fit again. (Update) Returned from fitness, carried on where he’d left off and has actually just got better and better. To be honest, I don’t care anymore whether it’s down to the lack of opposition, the kid has been a different class in recent games……… rating so far – 9/10

Steven Taylor – As mentioned, has developed a good understanding with Colo and is also a big miss. Lion-hearted, 100%er and local lad to boot, we can probably forgive him, his tendencies to overact when struck on the arm by a ball. His natural pace and strength are much more effective at this level where refined defending isn’t necessarily needed but has looked composed on the ball. We’ll look much better without a doubt when he’s back. (Update) Another defender that returned from injury, and has continued to improve game after game, not as classy Colo but just as vital……… rating so far – 9/10

Jose Enrique – Jose has always been someone I rated highly despite some of his obvious flaws, particularly his tendency to overplay it in our third. His strength and pace are phenomenal really and he makes sheperding the ball out of play look so easy. I think I may nickname him Batfink, because his wings are like a shield of steel. Is a massive shining light in a squad that teeters around average. Never flustered and has carried the ball to great effect this season. If only Gutierrez would play the easy ball more often, we’d get much more joy down the left with Jose whipping them in. (Update) I think by his very own high standards that he’d set up until about three or four games ago, Jose would have justifiably got a 10 out of 10. As it is, despite still looking like our best attacking player at times, he’s got a little over-confident in his last few games and hasn’t been as impressive, but still without doubt, a million miles above any other left back in this division that I’ve seen……… rating so far – 9/10

Zurab Khizanishvili – Another loanee defender, this time from Blackburn Rovers and started well but then showed signs of getting caught for pace a little. Not convinced it’s helped having to chop and change his defensive partner though. Looks nice and tidy on the ball and carries it out of defence and moves it sharply which is a refreshing change. Evidently, he doesn’t mind a bit of argy bargy, so I’m sure he’ll fit in well around here. (Update) Barely played after this but when he did, looked shaky and I don’t think he’ll be missed after his return to Blackburn. Can’t see Hughton going back to get an extension on the loan……… rating so far – 6/10

Tamas Kadar – Saw a bit of him in pre-season, where despite all the inevitable changes throughout, he looked nice and steady. Played well the other day but had a couple of lapses which might have been more costly. Also gave the ball away for the Doncaster goal. Definitely one for the future though if he keeps progressing. (Update) – Impressive displays continue for the reserves and when called upon for the first time has never let us down, earning rave reviews for his performance against Plymouth in the cup. Another defender showing bags of promise? Somebody is making this up right?……… rating so far – 7/10

Ben Tozer – Just scrapes in because of my ‘games’ rule but to be honest I haven’t seen much of him though he’s clearly highly-rated. Difficult to say much more and I’ll give him a six for kicks but hard to rate him just yet. (Nothing to update on)……… rating so far – 6/10

I’d like to think none of these players goes anywhere in the transfer window and we secure the services of Danny Simpson, at least until the end of the season. I’d also like to imagine that Matthew Kilgallon will become a Newcastle player sometime soon. Anyway, enough of my waffle…

What do you lot think?

NUFCBlog Author: bowburnmag
bowburnmag has written 234 articles on this blog.

fair assessment – my main worry here is injuries especially to enrique will cause us problems, when collo and taylor were out we went 2 draws and 2 defeats (tho saying that we’re currently on a streak of 3 draws!)

The team has as a whole played ok in a fairly average league I have mentioned before that most of the opposition we have played against could be bought with the fee we payed for Coloccini…so it’s hardly surprising we are top of the table.

What we seriously lack is pace and creativity as well as a goal scorer that produces the goods regularly and to that some pace and we would be laughing.
Defence wise we seem pretty solid and organised.

Interesting thing about this window is the intent of Big Mike….will he gamble on stripping the assets?Will he back CH and surprise us with a few good players? If he does spend a decent wedge that will defiantly get more fans on his side.

My gut feeling is that CH will not land anything major in this window or get much backing financially either and I have a sneaky suspicion that some assets (possibly Nolan)will be sold to pay for 2 cheaper players.

Personally, I don’t think anyone will be going anywhere unless they put in a transfer request.
If we are to believe that Ashley is the big gambler and risk taker that he is supposed to be then he will know that now is not the time to withold investment in NUFC.
His best chance of getting his money out of the club is when we are in the Premier League. He knows that and will do all he can to get us back in there.

A got stopped off the bizzies before and this fat bizzy bifta lass sitting in her panda says,

” Hoo Troy, whats that on the end of your nose?”
A says, ” It’s Toot man, am buzzing, what yi ganna de aboot it like?”

Ha, the daft doylem thought it was snow and just drove off!!

Anyways, am meeting Big Mick Ash, laters like. Ave gotta drop a henry off for him and lambi.
A spoke to him on the phone like, when he phoned up on the phone. A asked aboot the transfers like and he says,

“TROY MAN, AM OFF ME BOX MAN! ME AND LAMBI HAVE BEEN UP RAVING AAL NEET LISTENING TO THE DJ SMACKHEED’S BEST RAVE TUNES OF 2009!!, WU HAVEN’T EVEN LOOKED AT TRANSFERS MAN!!”

A says, “HOO MAN MICK, THE LADS ARE AAL SITTING SNORTING TOOT WATCHING THE BLOG TO SEE IF YE’S ARE GANNA BUY SOMEONE MAN, YI CANNIT JUST DE NOOT”

Lambis starts singing doon the phone,
“ME BROTHERS IN BORSTAL, ME SISTERS GOT POX, ME MOTHERS A WHORE ON THE HARTLEPOOL DOCKS, WE ARE THE GEORDIES BOTH MENTAL AND MAD, AND JACK THE RIPPER’S ME DAD”

Pure radgey Lambi like when he’s on the gear like.
A just put the phone doon and says like, “Laters”

Aal keep yi’s updated when a gan doon on me BMX to deliver the gear to them like.

Six days in is a bit early to be judging, but I have to admit that I’m having trouble generating any optimism given past failures.

BUT I’m really, really hoping to be proven wrong. I don’t want to see much – perhaps two or three players, even if on loan. Losing Geremi and Barton too would make it a perfect score for me, but these guys aren’t miracle workers.

As for our defence – what can you say? Best record in the league, and among the best if you include the Premiership. It’s easy to be negative and mention the quality (or lack of) they’re defending against, but I think that’s just failing to recognise the fantastic turnaround we’ve seen. We should enjoy it and be proud of these lads.

Oh, and I watched Kadar from close range on Saturday. Absolute class – brilliant performance.

I think the Best is yet to come from Barton…he aint going anywhere right now as he has done nothing to justify his big wages and I can’t see another club taking a risk unless he puts in some decent shifts.

Best option BBM is to believe no media.
I dunno what to believe but I would have though the ground work for both Kilgallon and Beckford would have been done before the window…they are hardly major transfers.

On the subject of media: if you want to understand just why 99% (literally) of stories prove to be false, read a book called “Flat Earth News”. If it was possible to have even less respect for journalism as a profession, this book will do it for you.

Glad Nicky Butt is planning retirement…hopefully he will pick up a knock and call it quits.
May be good on the coaching side though and the type of character that might work in management at some point.

SJT: it’s not really about agendas any more… well, not the media’s. It’s more about fewer journos covering many times the media, and not given any time to research or validate. Even the BBC site has a 5-minute limit from getting a new story in to having a ticker summary up. No visits, validation – nothing. And that’s the BBC. Once you get to tabloids and local press, it’s pretty much “get 20 stories out; nick as much as you can from syndicates, make up the rest”.

just recieved a text from the official nufc site and the bad news about Kilgallon has been confirmed, just what have we done to deserve the complete incompitents that are running our club, we are heading for another failed window with sights lowered and cut price mediocrity put before us with the message, be grateful for what you get from uncle mike.

I seen this coming…BBB.
The general consensus is from where I am sitting that those that have gave Ashley 1 more chance to prove he is here for the journey will result in a massive backlash come the end of January.
I was fooled by Mike early doors but I can sniff out a rat from a mile off.

If Beckford and Kilgallon want to hold us out for more and more cash then stuff them. We’re a different NUFC to what we used to be, not only can we not afford to just throw cash at players, we wont lose the dignity of copying past regime’s mistakes and squander money.

To be fair, if they don’t want to come, there’s a couple of very suitable replacements in the form of Chopra and Campbell who would jump at the chance of playing for us.

I like both Becks and Kilgallon, but make no mistake, we can’t just allow ourselves to be held for ransom over players who, undoubtedly have a lot of interest, but are out of contract in the summer. Beckford doesn’t wanna come? He won’t get a better chance at the Premiership than this. Kilgallon doesn’t wanna come? Well don’t kid yourself thinking Sheffield United’s gonna be serious Premier League promotion and survival contenders.

No players/transfers are bigger than the club, wage structure or our dignity.

Yep, the Mirror reported it about 45 mins ago, but the cheeky gits said –

“The Toon thought they had landed Kilgallon when they agreed a fee with Sheffield United for the former England Under-21 international.”

When it might have been more humble to admit they’d fugged up. Cue raucous laughter.

Considering this looked nailed-on, the good start is turning sour, when you think the Beckford deal is likely protracted and quite possibly going to go the same way.

Will it be a case of chasing Beckford all month and then trying to get some randoms in last minute? e.g. Jason Roberts or the like because we’ve concentrated on specific targets? The problem is that it’s so easy to smell a rat around the transfer windows after the last few.

Andy – to be fair, we don’t know if it’s the clubs holding the players and NUFC to ransom. Or the agents could be snidey, and the players have been ill-advised.

Either way, I agree we shouldn’t pay over-the-odds for these players. But I find it difficult to believe we haven’t sounded out Kilgallon and Sheff Utd before now. And if we have, and we got negative vibes, then hopefully there’s a contingency in place.

I suspect, given the relative lack of experience on the board, that we may get stiffed again, even if we’re genuinely trying to bring players in. Either because we’re penny-pinching or because they’re not used to all this football transfer lark.

With our position, top of the table, a good defence compared to last year, it’s not a huge necessity to get players in – it would just be nice to have the cover. So in that case, we may as well forget panicking over not throwing the millions around after players, agents or clubs who are possibly trying to hold us for more money than we should be paying.

I’d get a left back in on cover, is the Shorey deal done yet? Maybe Queudrue? This gives Kadar the chances to break through and shine. Beye on loan? Just get Harewood back on loan till the end of the season?

Whilst Beckford and Kilgallon would be good additions, they aren’t necessary, and I can see our club’s point of view from not wanting to spend cash for the sake of it.

AndyNUFC – spot on. Beckford is 26, so not the ‘promising youngster’ some seem to think, and gives the impression of being, um, well… a bit of a cock.

We do NOT need to get a load of future stars. We can build a premiership squad when we’ve got premiership status back. Until then, we just need to keep doing what we’re doing, but reduce the risk currently posed by injuries. That’s all.

For me, if we do that and avoid selling any 1st-teamers, I’m happy.

Those shouting for Wenger-style recuitment coups are barking up the wrong tree. Sorry to be dull.

By the way – SJT: I think we may be agreeing that the press messed up over the Climategate thing… but that we think they moved it in different directions.

Are you in the ‘climate change is all a load of lobbox made up by scientists looking after their jobs’ group, or the ‘the press spend all their time trying to cast doubt on what is a no-brainer certainty if you look at the raw facts’ lobby?

Whumpie, spot on mate. Not to be disrespectful at all to other fans but I believe some just have a transfer window feeling of, “we’re top club, Beckford’s the man of the moment, we must sign him!”. If you think about it, Harewood did get us goals and we only paid his wages, why buy Beckford when we could get a reliable loanee and then buy somebody like Beattie when we do get promoted (I think some people think we already are too).

ashley wants to do himself a favour and sack that idiot llambias.
we need an experienced man to come in and handle transfers,it just seems ever since owl heed has been involved we cannot sign players.
he was also heavily involved in the turmoil around keegan resigning,imo it,s time for him to be given his marching orders.

Trojan, if Ashley didn’t sack Llambias over the Keegan situation (which wasn’t exactly Llambias’ fault), then I doubt he would sack him now over transfers.

I’m sure as a chairman it isn’t up to Llambias to call the shots in terms of choosing players to sign and sell, but more advice and requests from Hughton from which Llambias and Ashley probably discuss and evaluate.

You have to remember that even football clubs need to watch it through a recession, and since the economic downturn, although it’s on the surface been a lot of ‘cost cutting’ and skimming corners, dropping standards etc, we have actually saved a shedload of money in advertisement, wages being cut, club restructuring and we’re still on for promotion.

Next season we’ll hopefully enter the Premier League with one of the best financial footings in the league, added to the revenue from Sky TV money and we’ll be in good shape as a club.

andy,i think if ashley wants to get back some respect with the fans,sacking owl heed and bringing in a couple of experienced football men to run the club properly,is a must.
he cannot keep on his mate red eighteen,to run a football club surely?he,s a much use as a gay bloke with piles.

We’d all love the club to be run top to bottom by Geordies, Shearer as chairman, Keegan as manager and Gascgoine as the mascot – but it just doesn’t work like that.

Arsenal are such a fine club because they treat the business side as respectfully as the football side and it shows in almost everything they do on and off the pitch.

If Mike just brings in people to keep the fans happy, what would happen if he was to come into continuous disagreements? The last thing we need is more instability and a L’Pool/Gillette Hicks style feud at the top level.

He might be tight but we’re in good financial steading now and the last thing we need is more chopping and changing. If it aint broken, don’t fix it!

If Kilgallon doesn’t want to leave Sheff then fair play to him. We’ve obviously made our interest known as the statement said they’d informed us of the situation. He’s showing a bit of loyalty, nowt we can do about that.

Obviously the jury is out regarding Beckford but given the chance i’d snap him up. He has a good goalscoring record and we dont have an out and out goalscorer. Get Harewood back if possible, extend simpsons loan deal with the option to buy, maybe LB cover….I dont expect much however. Same old same old window as far as i’m concerned.

Whumpie…climate is the new religion and the people at the top of the scam are fookin evil and the followers hysterics.

Here’s a few quotes from the men at the top.

“Isn’t the only hope for the planet that the industrialized civilizations collapse? Isn’t it our responsibility to bring that about?”
– Maurice Strong, founder of the UN Environment Programme

“A massive campaign must be launched to de-develop the United States. De-development means bringing our
economic system into line with the realities of ecology and the world resource situation.”
– Paul Ehrlich, Professor of Population Studies

“My three main goals would be to reduce human population to about 100 million worldwide, destroy the industrial infrastructure and see wilderness, with it’s full complement of species, returning throughout the world.”
-Dave Foreman, co-founder of Earth First!

“The Earth has cancer and the cancer is Man.”
– Club of Rome, Mankind at the Turning Point

“Unless we announce disasters no one will listen.”
– Sir John Houghton, first chairman of IPCC

“It doesn’t matter what is true, it only matters what people believe is true.”
– Paul Watson, co-founder of Greenpeace

“No matter if the science of global warming is all phony, climate change provides the greatest opportunity to bring about justice and equality in the world.”
-Christine Stewart, fmr Canadian Minister of the Environment

Andy – We’d all love the club to be run top to bottom by Geordies, Shearer as chairman, Keegan as manager and Gascgoine as the mascot – but it just doesn’t work like that.

I wouldn’t want that thanks.:)
Can’t stand this old pals act in football-best leave all three to the history books where they belong,no disrespect to them (I love the all) but we need to move forwards,fresh faces,new ideas.

andy,does not have to be geordies running the club,my personal choice would be someone like david dein.
david did a lot of good work at arsenal,our club needs an md of that magnitude.
ashley should move heaven and earth to get some experienced men in to run tranfer dealings and other areas of the club.
ashley needs to stop running his veresion of the apprentice,we got apprentice managers,we had apprentice director of football,two apprentice chairmen,stand ins for stand ins.
we cannot allow ourselves to become a football club that provides on the job training in executive and managerial positions.

SJT I meant it in that way. It’s best to have a clear, business approach to football nowadays IMO, sentimentality (as shown) can destroy a club and after that you can start thinking about PR etc.

And related to your world evil comments, i’d have to judge them on the context of how they were spoken first before assuming i’m a pawn in a world of corruption and fear mongering, but thanks for such hopeful and light hearted banter on a snowy day off :)

Since Mike took over I have looked at most senior managerial appointments as not well thought out and mostly ineffective and lacking vital football experience.
Chris Mort came across to me as quite slimy and aloof,most people liked him and thought he was great.
I would love to be a fly on the wall in the boardroom I bet it is hilarious :)

Stuart, i’ll rephrase then, we’re looking on for promotion and we’re in a lot better shape financially to what we were, as well as spending money more wisely and looking for revenue in as many places as possible – such as the stadium naming rights. There’s nothing to say we can’t follow a success story like Birmingham and have a great season back in the Premier League without burning a shedload of money.

Well SJT the whole story of our downfall has, essentially, been from managerial instability – but the causes of which of course can be traced back to the board room level. It could be argued, and I firmly believe, that had we stuck with Allardyce or Keegan, we’d simply not be in the position we’re in now, but I really can’t be bothered to get into the whole past reflection and “what if this/that” debate :)

As much as people don’t like Llambias though, does anybody actually have recommendations of a chairman who talks to the fans constantly and says all the right things, signs all the right players and always backs the manager? Chairman are an unknown commodity in some respects and at the end of the day the only thing I can judge ours on is our league position.

I’ve always thought Ashley’s tight ways would actually, eventually give us a healthy bank balance and probably a decent team, so I think a couple of seasons time we will really be able to judge what Ashley was right and wrong about.

Trojan that’s a pretty heavy view but I must admit I am interested in the whole conspiracy theory, illuminati, NWO ideas. Some call it crazy but then again, we as common citizens are maybe naive to just discard cover ups, as the government demonstrates so often.

I don’t think Ashley would be paying over-the-odds for Kilgallon’s wages, so he’ll get significantly more money (by way of signing-on fees) by running down his contract. Combine that with the inevitability that he’ll be behind Taylor and Colo, and that assuming the form continues, he could be for the rest of the season. The result for me would be that the agent has steered him toward the most lucrative deal for himself on that basis.

Perhaps he doesn’t have the desire to come and fight for his place, and maybe money talks.

Or he could just genuinely want to stay at Sheff Utd.

I think we all know that the latter is probably the least likely given the previous statements and speculation, but it’s the one the agent is harping on about, predictably.

andy,have you heard of the av truth movement thats been going on for the last years? some good speakers like cynthia mckinney,len horowitz,ian crane,brian gerrish all people who have in the past been invovled in geo politics.
all these people saw and heard things,that changed the way they view the world we live in.

To be honest mate out of all my reading up on “bigger picture” cover up theories etc, I actually haven’t heard of that. I will have a look though, I kind of tend to believe that as inevitable as aliens are, there must be a few things that we don’t know the full truths about. Some of the videos on youtube exposing this and that from politicians can be scary in the context they’re presented.

come on lads how much cash do u expect mike too stick into the club didnt he stick another 20 mill in to the club a couple of month ago and some of u are still calling him names shame on u now leave the fat ugly peice of shit alone plz

Am I the only one who hates all the (media?) stuff about transfers. You know the sort of thing:
“Toon interest in Ivor Pegleg -Fallova?”
“Toon deny interest in Ivor Pegleg – Fallova”
“Toon favourites to sign I P-F”
“Hitch in I P-F transfer?”
“Deal for I P-F to be announced soon?”
“I P-F says “I’d love to play for Newcastle”
“Pegleg-Fallova signs for Real Madrid / Man City / Hartlepool / staying at Athletico Winlaton”
I much prefer the announcement of a real signing of somebody good, out of the blue (and not an injured South American bought to get on the good side of an agent)

Which is why at the behest of some of the lads, and possibly incurring the wrath of worky, I’m refraining from blogging every single media update on speculative transfers. That and the fact I need to do some work like…

Andy I wouldn’t scaremonger my fellow toon fans :)
It’s the real deal my friend and people are waking up to the globalist plans.

I suggest you read 1984 by George Orwell google it and there’s plenty free ebook version…he was well in with the eugenics founders and think tanks so had first hand knowledge of the agendas they have been pushing.

Ok, for SJT, Stuart and the other ‘climate denialists’ as you’re now called, here’s my response on the climate thing.

First of all, I should admit that I am close to, but not involved in, the raw information. I don’t get my info from papers, I get to talk to the people whose job it is to trawl through all the data – good and bad – and put the conclusions in front of governments and others who really need to keep it unbiased. Believe me, if you think the Mail makes things sound bad, try hearing it from someone who you know is completely unbiased and just gives you raw facts to interpret yourself. Not nice.

There are a lot of loonies on both sides, as illustrated by some of those quotes. But they don’t alter the facts. And if you think some academics in Norwich can be a bit unscientific, try talking to an oil industry lobby team on six figure salaries.

Secondly, there IS doubt – but it’s vital to appreciate how much. Even after aggregating thousands upon thousands of different studies all pointing the same way, there is still some doubt. I believe the official figure is a 5% chance that man-made climate change is NOT happening.

So – two questions for you:

1. If I had a 20-shot revolver and I put 19 bullets in it, spun the thingy and held it to your knackers, would you give up watching football to stop me pulling the trigger?

That is the same question with climate change. If there is a 5% chance that it’s all rubbish after all, are you going to risk everything on that number coming up? What about if it was 50%? Even 80%?

2. Try to be honest and answer this: Why do you believe man-made climate change is not happening?

While you come up with one of a dozen well-worn reasons, I’ll give you the one you’ll have in your head if you are really honest with yourself:

BECAUSE YOU DON’T WANT IT TO BE HAPPENING.

Sorry to be a doom-monger on such a cracking day, but as probably one of a few thousand people who really know about this stuff, I can tell you: you may as well argue that smoking’s not bad for you. People did once, even when it was damned obvious about that, too.

whumpie sed >>>1. If I had a 20-shot revolver and I put 19 bullets in it, spun the thingy and held it to your knackers, would you give up watching football to stop me pulling the trigger?<<<< u would have trouble finding stuarts knackers dont think hes got any :lol:

I thought the only true scientifically proven link in climate change is the magnetic activity of the sun (not sun spots)

The magnetic link is undeniable and proven, yet the Carbon Trading Community (which will rapidly approach oil in the future)makes billions of dollars trading “nothing” but licences to produce carbon in this new world.

The earth will simply generate more plants when CO is high.

All of the world almost in one moment went green – do you not think this was planned and implemented?

The trouble is when folks have a vested interest (money and wages) in a view point it all becomes hazy. Thats why scientific tests only – not statistical analysis – should be believed. And only the magnetism arguments stands up to scientific scrutiny.

The carbonists have been shot to smithereens at the moment – relying on hysteria and smokescreens not fact – their trouble is they were so greedy and wanted to push so quickly – people have smelled the rat and are now finding them.

“Secondly, there IS doubt – but it’s vital to appreciate how much. Even after aggregating thousands upon thousands of different studies all pointing the same way, there is still some doubt. I believe the official figure is a 5% chance that man-made climate change is NOT happening.”

Yup, correct Whumpie. The IPCC’s official declaration in 2007 was that man made climate change is “very likely”. When they say “very likely” this translates to a degree of ‘certainty’ of over 90% in their official terminology.

Ok, first things first, Keegan is from Doncaster, so he cannot be a Geordie.

Also, why are concentrating on Beckford, when Victor Moses is around? I’m hoping for a surprise headline of Moses parts the Tyne on his way to Newcastle or some other bible related headline.
Beckford would be a good signing, but Moses would be, err Heaven? :o

Sorry, but where did you read all that balony about sun spots?? Boy’s Own Almanac??

Every ‘fact’ you quoted there is just plain wrong. The only proven link?? It’s no more proven than any of them. Science just doesn’t work like that; it’s about levels of certainty and doubt.

Here’s a way of looking at it: Compare it with smoking and lung disease and how people dealt with that:

You have two types of logic: deductive and abductive.

Abductive: If I set light to this bundle of leaves and chemicals and breath in the smoke, I’d have thought that it would be bad for my lungs.

Deductive: I am dying of lung cancer. It could be the smoking.

DUH.

Yet people still smoke. For decades people still denied it was bad for them. Some still do, and get laughed at, because they simply cannot grow the stones to admit it. Not the finest bit of human nature, but there you go. The ‘convenient lie’ gene.

So – apply that to climate change:

First up – abductive reasoning: We have known about the greenhouse effect for about 40 years, and it isn’t disputed; it’s not even complicated. Basically, raise CO2 and things warm up – we’ve seen it happen many times over the millennia. We have raised CO2 by over 30%. Conclusion: we really ought to be seeing some warming; it would make no sense not to.

Next up: Deduction. While it’s hard to measure, just about every method used around the world (and there are dozens) shows a marked increase in global temperature in line with rising CO2 and scarily close to what was predicted. We’ve already seen a rise of about half the change in the other direction which led to the last ice age. What could be causing it?

DUH.

(Incidentally, you can check any other indicator – ocean salinity, atmospheric chemistry, anything – it all points the same way as temperature.)

So yes, you can latch onto as many little stories of nutters, extremists and doctored data as you like, but you’ll not have scratched the surface of the huge mass of really obvious, undeniable and unequivocal date that exists. Unfortunately, the press can’t make stories out of that bit.

More unfortunately, the press are a vital link in us failing to deal with this. Those idiots have half the population thinking it’s all a conspiracy – something which appeals a lot more to the human mind than the rather banal but horrible truth.

Re – Saturday match. It is supposed to be pretty bad down there. I think the pitch will be fine, its just a question of how it is around the ground regarding ice. The H&S brigade will be watching closely i guess.

@whumpie – good stuff, it’s interesting that a billion dollar industry has sprung up on the back of carbon trading trading the offsets that were given out almost free by the u.s government due to lobbying from global companies

whumpie,i,m not just talking about climate change but the broad view of other things that are happening in the world like false flag operations that are carried out.
things like 9 11 where there are more questions than answers.
i,m not a crackpot,i,ve just got an open mind on some things in this world ,that we are told seem like cover ups.
dont take my word for it,there,s evidence out there if we look.
there are also scientists who think the world is actually cooling and not warming.

Whumpie – the very fact you disregard widely held scientific proof – i.e the predictability of climate change in relation to magnetic activity on the sun (in fact the only direct correlation of temperature change and variance at any particular point in time – not the one you choose to grab out of thin air) – and then dismiss it – suggests to me you are not providing an objective view – far from it.

Yes the level of CO2 in the atmosphere varies over the millennia – so does global temperature – it is cyclical.

A great deal of evidence suggests we are now on the decline and have been for 7 years – but hey ho fella – continue in your dismissal of others views who have real data (scientists – real scientists not statisticians) – not commercially motivated statistics and you will never be stand out in you field.

Anyone can regurgitate info – understanding and seeking the definitive answers requires a different type.

You even allude to the Oil trade and the opinions of “experts” – Read John Perkins – confessions of an economic hitman – it will help you along the way just how far the US in particular goes to generate the flow of Dollars needed to keep them afloat – and now oil is reducing they need the next cash cow – Carbon Trading.

for example – one quote re a summary of such a study “Summary Spectral analysis of geomagnetic activity, global air temperature, Earth’s rotation rate and zonal circulation, when smoothed from secular trend and periods shorter than 23 years, shows a concentration of energy around the 60-year period explaining more than 80% of the entire variance. This information has enabled the set-up of a cascade physical model that integrates the Sun-atmosphere-Earth system as a single unit and ties solar corpuscular radiation to global warming through Earth’s rotation and atmospheric circulation. Our results suggest that changes in geomagnetic activity, and in the Earth’s rotation, could be used as long- and short-term indicators, respectively, of future changes in global air temperature”

We ARE sucking ALL the earths natural resources up & burning them as fuel-That can not go on forever!
Chopping down forests, polluting the oceans.
It’s ALL gonna end in tears.
I guess, so long as we’re not here to witness it, that’s ok.
Bollox to future generations, hey?

Stu,
i was on about fossil fuels mate.
But, y’right mate.
We’re an island, surely we can generate power via the waves that crash against these here shores of ours?
Basically, we’re not gonna do anything really ’til it’s too late, it’s the human way.
Homo-sap-peon.
If ya’ get me drift.

“Biomass for instance is renewable energy, you can grow fuel like coppice, miscanthus ect that can be re-grown after harvest within a year in fields all over the country.”

Just because it is “renewable”, this doesn’t necessarily mean that it is always a good thing, Stuart. There are some huge potential pitfalls in the use of biofual / biomass which in some cases can make it even more envioromentally unfriendly in the long run. It’s a highly complex subject.

Wind turbines look a hell of a lot better than power statios & pylons.
Don’t remember anyone complaining about them like.
A lot like everyone complaining about sat dishes being an eyesore, they look better than the old tv ariels.
We are scared of change & we’ll find/make any excuse not to do it.
It’s our nature. (to coin a phrase)

CO2 is a cosh to bash people with and children are being schooled in it with brainwashing similar to nazi germany which involved snooping on family and neighbours and reporting them…see climate cops (think it’s on eon website off the top of my head).

CO2 has no effect on warming and climate change,it is simply a tax to fund a worldwide dictatorship and a carbon trading scam similar to the derivative banking scam/implosion which was also done by design netting banks in the usa 27 trillion in taxpayers money and are showing record profits at the moment.

It’s a ‘double whammy’ Bowburn. Massive deforestation, mostly to provide ranch land for livestock releases huge amounts of CO2 into the atmosphere. Then, when cows are moved on to the land to make burgers for idiots to eat, huge amounts of methane gases are released, which, as I wrote before, are 22 times as bad as Carbon Dioxide (CO2).

Ok stardust – just another 5000 or so studies to look at and you can justifiably argue against the hundreds of properly qualified scientists of the IPCC who spent 20 years assessing ALL of them and didn’t just pick the tiny minority which supportehat they hope is true.

To continue your analogy: you have a body in a room piled high with smoking guns. 5% have various peoples’ fingerprints on them and 95% have the prints of the known psychopath living next door. You picked the one belonging to the vicar and you’re running with it because you don’t like him and you want it to be him.

“CO2 is a cosh to bash people with and children are being schooled in it with brainwashing similar to nazi germany”

Sir Jason, It’s funny you should mention Nazi Germany, as all the NWO / Bilderberg / Bohemian Grove grand conspiracy stuff you keep alluding to originally had it’s origins in the Russian antisemitic / anti masonic literature used by Hitler and Goebbels to fuel hatred against Jews in the Germany of the 1930s. It’s a funny old world.

Its not like it is a case of myself being totally and utterly unconvinced. There are tens of millions of unconvinced.

I as SJT does, believe Carbon Trading is at the heart of the debate ie MONEY. America at the time of introduction was the worlds largest producer of CO2 – what better way than to issue the licences at that point in time before the Chinese etc get to be largest to cement the USA position as in effect controlling all the “new” oil (carbon, in the world.

Workey
Check out the author “Chalmers Johnson” either “Blowback” or “Nemesis” possible you might find them interesting.
Ever read a St. Cuthbert`s old boy (now teaching history @ Harvard, in the belly of the beast) “Kennedy”, either “The rise and fall of the great nations” or
“Preparing for the 21st. century”. been out a while but still relevant.
Only suggesting now !

It`s a bit complex actually, having given up red meat in the seventies and getting my protien from mainly beans, I have probably saved a minute part of the rain forest but added to the problem by emitting an enormous amount of methane,
Oh, though fairly expensive goats milk is not only considered better for humans it has no bovine growth hormone, though I believe it may be banned in Europe ?
Though looks like you lost the war against the giant seed companies (Monsanta) and their frankenfoods, too bad really.