Comments

deadhead

minornudget please put the crack pipe down. Tou haven't a clue or any insight to me or my religous beliefs nor the traditions and rituals that over the centuries formulated my personal relationship with Jaweh. The mere fact that the temple has not been rebuilt in the last 2000 years shows that in fact the rabbi known as Jezeus was not the messiach fortold in the talmud... go to church today and have fun. Keep breaking those commmandments... I'll never stop you

deadhead

sure I do Bull... I don't proselytize about Judiasim (THE Monotheistic Religion of the World) and try to convert gentiles. Jews do not try to convert gentiles; we only try to tolerate them and have empathy for their lost lives... The only Rabbi I ever heard proselytize and try to convert people was Rabbi Menacham Schneerson... whose crazy followers were very disappointed that upon his death they learned HE was not the messiach. I keep my god to myself until it is confronted by the folks who feel the only pathway to heaven is theirs... I will argue against that at every turn.

deadhead

the bottom line is this... if your religion needs you to proselytize about its greatness etc... it is then neither great nor self evident.. god bless be a CHRISTian..enjoy being a cult follower of a false prophet. Remember everytime you say "in Jesus name" you break the 1st commandment that Moses received "Thou shalt have no other gods before me." and every time you cross yourself you break the 2nd; "Thou shalt not make unto thee any graven image, or any likeness of any thing that is in heaven above, or that is in the earth beneath, or that is in the water under the earth." So... your holier than thou stuff is pretty weak sauce. Please keep it to yourself and enjoy. Remember you are just jealous that the Jews are the chosen people... I suggest you follow our lead and keep god between you and he/she and not between you and me

Bullhead

You state, "you somehow imagine that it's not even possible you are engaged in self-deception when choosing to interpret the world in a manner consistent with your favorite supernatural beliefs which lack evidence."

Where did I say that? I think it is more than possible. That is why I "test" my beliefs and tested other worldviews/religions before settling on the validity of Jesus Christ.

I'm sure that I misunderstand a lot about God's Word, character, workings, and created Order. Every human being is wrong about stuff.

I don't have blind faith, however. A reasoned faith is a good thing. It is what you claim to have with atheism/naturalistic humanism, despite your protest.

You can't help but accept some things on faith and not your own personally observed and tested data. That is all I am doing with Christianity as you would be doing with atheism/naturalistic humanism.

HillTopWV

You have already admitted, “I also go on faith.” You might as well stop pretending that you rely on reason. You also admit that “Mankind is easily (bent toward) deceiving ourselves,” which is true, but you somehow imagine that it's not even possible you are engaged in self-deception when choosing to interpret the world in a manner consistent with your favorite supernatural beliefs which lack evidence.

So, no, I do not agree that I suspend reason as you do. You have admitted that you suspend reason deliberately in order to sustain your preconceived notions. I do not.

Bullhead

You state, "There is nothing you can do, think, or believe that has not already been decided, planned, and approved by your deity who drives everything together to its final termination."

I disagree mostly. Yes, He's allowing things toward a final termination which He controls.

However, there's a difference between having the power to intervene and even knowing the future, but then actually intervening.

If God chooses to hold back His power and allow human free-will and the punishment for our choice, how is that wrong?

Does God intervene and use even human suffering? Yes, to some degree (unknown to us). Miracles are God's intervention into His created Order. Jesus Christ was the culmination of God's influence in this world!

But that doesn't mean that He's constantly dictating the sock color I choose today. He simply created His Order and humanity with Freedom and left some things to "play out on their own" within His created system.

HillTopWV

Your supernatural world, governed by a deity who knows everything down to the number of atoms in each hair on your head, knows in advance every thought you have and everything you will do, and has the power to influence, direct and alter the destiny of every atom in each hair on your head, leaves you absolutely no free-will. There is nothing you can do, think, or believe that has not already been decided, planned, and approved by your deity who drives everything together to its final termination.

This is logically inescapable based on the attributes of the Christian god. Calvinists have made predestination their signature dogma based on it. Other Christians (e.g., Lutherans) opt to call the contradiction a paradox and treat it as a “mystery” instead, since it would otherwise make god responsible for the damnation of sinners. The Calvinists don't care if their dogma makes their god into a cruel, manipulative monster. That's what reason demands.

HillTopWV

Have you read the Josephus quote in context? Josephus was not a contemporary of Jesus any more than the gospel writers were. There is also no reason to believe that he was or became a Christian, yet the quote speaks of Jesus miracles, being the messiah, and rising from the dead as if they were true and he believed it.

Even a layman should be suspicious of this quote, especially since we've seen how revisions were made to “divinely inspired” scripture to tidy up little theological issues over time. Christians have never been above a little editing, if it served their purposes. Swallowing it whole, as you do, proves again how willing you are to suspend your reason in favor of what you want to believe to begin with.

HillTopWV

Your contradictory beliefs drive you to grasp at scraps of “evidence” and make illogical leaps to support your faith claims. For example, Pontius Pilot was a real person, therefore the whole content of the Apostles' and Nicene Creeds are true.

But when you encounter evidence or reasoning which contradicts your faith, you fall back on the notion that your powers of reason are too corrupt and inadequate to resolve the conflict, declare it a “mystery,” and default to accepting the faith claim. This is dishonest.

Christians are thoroughly trained to accept contradictions, e.g.: Jesus is both completely human and completely god at all times; The three “persons” of the Trinity are separate and distinct, but completely one “being;” The bread and wine are (or appear to be) bread and wine but are also completely the body and blood of Jesus (after the appropriate incantation is recited over them).

Bullhead

You state, "The quote from Josephus is a forgery inserted into his history by later Christian scribes, as is obvious from the way it is written."

I find it odd, how you take on face-value an assertion made by modern scholars far removed from any understanding.

Yet you won't believe simple first-person accounts written by former generations and instead resort to conspiracy theories.

And, by the way, unless Paul was lying too (as you would claim), then he saw Jesus. It transformed his life from being one of the powerful, up and coming Pharisees to being a persecuted, tortured, destitute, and eventually killed Christians.

Bullhead

You state, "(1) Christianity is true because it is reasonable and supported by the evidence.

(2) Your reason and perception is clouded by sin and your own judgment and ability to know the truth cannot be trusted."

Those two statements are not mutually exclusive. There is reason and evidence to support Christianity.

Is that all I go on? No. I also go on faith, God's reliability, and Truth. He is the giver of Truth and Mankind is easily (bent toward) deceiving ourselves--without Gods' Truth and Mercy.

I was blind (boxed into a natural only world), but now I see (Reality has both natural and supernatural realms).

Do you believe in a human free-will, HillTop?

If you believe only in the natural, then there is no such thing as a free-will or individual personality--which should be common-sense flying in the face of Reality and scientific observation. Can you chose Right from Wrong? Is there an absolute Right or

HillTopWV

(1) Christianity is true because it is reasonable and supported by the evidence.

(2) Your reason and perception is clouded by sin and your own judgment and ability to know the truth cannot be trusted.

I pointed this problem out to you a long time ago when you made the astounding assertion that human reason did not conflict with faith. There's a very long Christian theological tradition of deliberately pitting faith against reason, and treating reason as the enemy of faith.

The facts of the matter show that reason, your ability and willingness to think for yourself and subject claims to scrutiny, is very corrosive to the supernatural claims of all religions, including Christianity. You can't have it both ways. You can't claim reason is on your side, but abandon it when the conclusions it leads to conflict with what you want to believe.

ScienceNotStupidity

@Majoritarian- The vast majority of glaciers are melting. The 5% that are growing do so because global warming is increasing the water vapor in those localized regions resulting in heavier snowfall. Scientists are not "leftists." That comment is ridiculous.

HillTopWV

All of the "evidence" for Christianity is contained in the Bible. That's like accepting one of those fake news story advertisements as evidence for the how good the advertised product is. In short, it's gullible to accept it as evidence.

The quote from Josephus is a forgery inserted into his history by later Christian scribes, as is obvious from the way it is written.

The gospels were written decades after the fact, and not by eye witnesses. The later gospels greatly embellished the original, Mark, which had no virgin birth and ended at Jesus' death. The gospel of Matthew was written in large part to fabricate obscure connections to Old Testament prophesy and pepper the story with miracles (still working today). Only some (not all) of the letters of Paul are first person. Paul never knew Jesus, and recast the new religion's theology to make it marketable to the gentile masses. Modern Christianity should really be called "Paulism."

WVVet25

Bullhead: it's time to stop "casting pearls before swine"...and time to "kick the dust off your sandals". Do not waste time arguing over God, He needs no defense lawyer.Anyone who KNOWS God ,understnads what's happening here, and in the country in general.they can't change what's coming...and it's coming soon.

Bullhead

You state, "No, what I abhor about religion is reliance on faith in fabricated stories for which there is NO EVIDENCE."

Then you shouldn't abhor Christianity because there is plenty of evidence for Jesus the Christ's claims and actions.

You close-mindedly block any Reason and evidence when it comes to anything supernatural, yet you believe HUGE amounts by faith when it comes to your attempts to keep everything within the natural realm.

HillTopWV

No, what I abhor about religion is reliance on faith in fabricated stories for which there is NO EVIDENCE. Science, by definition, relies on evidence. You remain terribly confused about these basic concepts.

To think, for example, that seeing a tree with your own eyes as a tree involved in photosynthesis and growing leaves and seeds, etc., and imagining that the tree has a spirit that might eat your soul if it casts its shadow over you, are somehow the same sort of beliefs about the tree.... well, it makes me really wonder about you.