Posted
by
ScuttleMonkeyon Monday October 20, 2008 @01:12PM
from the no-nomad-comparisons dept.

IMOVIO has launched a new cellphone-sized computer that is aimed at something similar to the subnotebook market. While it doesn't have 3G of its own, it does have a QWERTY keyboard, Wi-Fi, and a $175 price point. "It can connect to the Internet using a standard Wi-Fi connection, or it can use your cell phone's mobile broadband connection via Bluetooth. The company is currently pitching it to mobile network operators and retail stores. It's being compared to the ill-fated Palm Foleo. But the comparison doesn't work because the Foleo was Palm-phone only, didn't fit in a pocket and cost well over three times the price of the iKIT.

It's infuriating. I already have a computer the size of a cell phone. It's called a "cell phone". Damn it, why can't I plug it into a TV or monitor, and plug a mouse and keyboard into it and use the damned thing like a computer?

Let me ask: Why should it matter where we buy it from? If anything you would think the manufacturers would find accessories of this nature to have high profit margins compared to their phones. I know I'd buy into it.

Carriers want you using the easiest phone to support and the phones that use the least data. Highly capable phones are a nightmare, especially when you add in that the average American is as smart as a radish.

They don't really want you to use data, they just want the money for having it available, just like your ISP. So they'll sell you a branded phone, that's locked to hell so you can't do much besides buy ringtones.

Easy solution to locked phones: don't buy them (yes, I just heard thousands of Apple fanboys gasp at the though of not having Steve's latest piece of crap). Go get an unlocked phone and use a GSM carrier, that wasn't so hard was it?

Easy solution to locked phones: don't buy them (yes, I just heard thousands of Apple fanboys gasp at the though of not having Steve's latest piece of crap). Go get an unlocked phone and use a GSM carrier, that wasn't so hard was it?

You just couldn't help but stick an anti-Apple jab in there, could you...:D

Realistically, you don't have to buy only factory-unlocked phones -- a lot of phones are trivial to unlock. I used to always buy Nokias for that reason (DCT-3/4 have been busted for ages). Recently I picked up a second-hand iPhone because I knew that it could reliably be unlocked. It's happily working outside the OS, tethered to my laptop. Kinda makes me the carrier's worst case user...

Cell phone companies would come out with that kind of stuff, if people quit buying cell phones from the service providers, and instead bought them from the cell phone manufacturers.

In Finland it's always been the norm to buy your own phone, and get the service separately. It's only recently that you can get a phone (3G only)
as a part of the service. Even then, the phones are rarely sim-locked, and you have the option of buying the phone and service separately for the same total price.

Nevertheless, there's limited market for something as geeky as the grandparent idea. Most people seem to want a cell phone, not a cell computer.

You can buy a phone in the USA for $9.99 delivered, which includes $10 worth of free airtime and doesn't tie you to a contract (Virgin). If you want a camera you have to pay a massive $50 for your phone. That's not expensive for what you get and it's not expensive in absolute terms either. For what you get, mobile phones are absurdly cheap.

After shrinking down audio technology with integrated circuits, true audiophiles decided that big, 'ol honkers with tubes are better. I predict that the same will happen with PCs. What? A PC in your pocket, how mundane. I have a tube powered ENIAC in my basement. In fact, it IS my basement.

I can really tell the difference, because every month when the power bill comes, I know it must be good, because it is using butt-loads of electricity.

Bah. A TRUE computophile won't settle for less than a full-fledged Analytical Engine. Gears are the true analog circuits!
I can really tell the difference, because every month when the coal bill comes, I know it must be good, because it is using butt-loads of coal.

Burning all that coal is going to black out our atmosphere and leave the world in shambles for our children and animals. When you decide to finally join the 21st century, you'll learn that CLEAN computphiles use hydraulic analytical engines powered by slaves on rowers! I can really tell the difference, because every month when the mortality report comes, I know it must be good, because I'm going through butt-loads of slaves.

The Sharp Zaurus is the name of a series of Personal Digital Assistant (PDA) made by Sharp Corporation. The Zaurus was the most popular PDA during the 1990s in Japan and was based on a proprietary operating system. The first Sharp PDA to use the Linux operating system was the SL-5000D, running the Qtopia-based Embedix Plus. The name derives from the common suffix applied to the names of dinosaurs, and was chosen to convey the idea of strength

When you're not plugged into the keyboard/mouse and tv/monitor, you're carrying around a bunch of hardware that will blow through your small cellphone battery in minutes.
And if it disables a bunch of stuff and underclocks... You're now carrying around hardware you're not using. For what purpose?

Why not just come up with an easier way to sync/combine your phone and your computer.

I'll admit it, I was just stealing your high mod points and page location to point out that the Sharp Zaurus had pretty much the same specs as the device mentioned in TFA. There is a reason the Zaurus is no longer made, as you said, the cell phone has replaced it.

It's all about convergence. It's not unthinkable to believe that in 10-15 years your cellphone WILL be your computer, your media server, your video game console system etc. It'll just depend on what you plug it into.

And your cell provider will become your ISP. And all will be right with the world.

I have to admit I never tried it, but my Nokia N95 has TV out and support keyboards via bluetooth, so there you are.
Personally I prefer my Nokia N810 for mobile computing, connecting to the internet via WLAN running Joikuspot on my N95 with a unlimited data subscription with t-Mobile in the Netherlands (HSDPA)

I would buy this because: I am one of those people who wants to be connected to my data but hate people, so...I do not CARRY or even own a cell phone. iPod Touch yes, cell phone no. I would be interested int his if the specs were good. what ARE they by the way? CPU? Speed? memory? drive/SD Size? Screen size, dimensions. that article provides a nice pic and NO information

It's infuriating. I already have a computer the size of a cell phone. It's called a "cell phone". Damn it, why can't I plug it into a TV or monitor, and plug a mouse and keyboard into it and use the damned thing like a computer?

With a $25/month subscription to our "MyComputer Integration" service you can. Please be advised that if you wish to connect the peripherals you stated the following services are required: "MyKeyboard" for $10/month, "MyMouse" for $5/month, and "MyMonitor" for $15/month. Would you care to also connect an external hard drive for only $30/month using our "MyStorage" service?

It's infuriating. I already have a computer the size of a cell phone. It's called a "cell phone". Damn it, why can't I plug it into a TV or monitor, and plug a mouse and keyboard into it and use the damned thing like a computer?

While I believe you'd have to use a USB VGA adapter to get a TV-out, you can certainly use it with a mouse and keyboard. (Tragically, it seems most developers do, as the device's built-in UI is still lacking. The OLPC is (about a year after I got it) just approaching tolerable, I suppose it'll take the Freerunner just as long.

It's infuriating. I already have a computer the size of a cell phone. It's called a "cell phone". Damn it, why can't I plug it into a TV or monitor, and plug a mouse and keyboard into it and use the damned thing like a computer?

I am so waiting for something like that to happen. I think of it more as a pocket-size computer "core" (not sure exactly what it contains - CPU, RAM, SSD, what else? NIC? Video?) that you carry around and can plug into various "carriers" that embody the I/O, display, etc. You might have a small, smartphone-sized carrier for true mobility, a larger one that would be basically a notebook PC minus its motherboard, maybe even a set-top box for when you want to browse in front of your big-screen TV, etc. I

No, the keyboard etc could stay home; if everyone had them nobody would have to lug them around. You could keep a set in your car's trunk (boot if you're British) for the few times you needed one and didn't have one.

Because I hear tethered data connections are cheap. I could see wifi, but I don't see it going very well as a tethered device. That said, at that price point I could see alot of geeks, at least the/. crowd picking them up for novelty value -- so it should well well either way.

Nice.
In Canada we get no such thing -- Telus even recently dropped their unlimited data plan for $100. So one must pay for their standard plan (voice plan + 15 for unlimited BIS when I got mine) + the standard data to be able to use tether, $100 for 1GB a month.
Unless there is an overhaul of data plans in Canada it would never fly here, it would just be too prohibitively expensive.

What's the screen pixels? An Eee 700 is usable at 800x480; this can't go much below that and be usable on the modern Web. Even if the resulting text is Flyspeck 3, at least it'll be detailed Flyspeck 3 rather than pixelated.

Someone posted on the original article's forum that it's 320x240. Unfortunately, in this day and age, that resolution borders on useless. Sure, for 80x25 text or for an old VGA 320x200 DOS game it would be cool. But to do anything of recent vintage, you'll end up having to pan-and-scan in zoom mode to see a webpage. Hell, I don't like browsing on my Toshiba Libretto 110CT--and that's 800x480... (And my complaints are with the screen resolution, not speed--Firefox 3 runs acceptably on it).

My O2 XDA Stellar (which, I think, is an HTC Kaiser in disguise) is 320x240, and it's surprisingly usable. Sure, you might have to scroll right to get past the page menu, but for the most part the content is usable - certainly enough for most things I want to read on the move. (Two notable exceptions are anything PHPBB-based and Slashdot.) Being able to use it in landscape mode definitely helps. Really, though, in terms of limitations, IE Mobile's lack of meaningful Javascript support (just enough to ignore

No, it makes a crap mp3 player. I've got a device with the same processor(see other post), it can just barely decode and let you keep using your shell. But it makes an awesome wireless TTY that fits in a shirt pocket. The place I work at uses a AIX box for the manufacturing/ordering system and I love being able to check it from anywhere in the plant. I rather prefer my EEE, but it just barely fits in a cargo pocket.

I dunno about anyone else but I have something that looks like a tricorder and serves a real, useful function; a Metrix MTX-3282 [asras.co.th] multimeter. And just like the looks, the prices are astronomical...

Computers of this size and form-factor are not totally unprecedented. Things like the Nokia N810 internet tablet [wikipedia.org] are similar. (QWERTY keyboard, fits in your pocket, WiFi or bluetooth connectivity...). Also, many smartphones have all the features and functionality of this device (including having a physical keyboard, etc.) with the advantage of direct connectivity through the cell network.

The only thing this new device can offer is a somewhat lower price ($175 instead of >$400 for the N810). But I think this device will only appeal to a very small market (most people would prefer to spend a bit more for a more capable device, or get something with a bigger screen/keyboard).

Cheaper, yes. But the CPU is less than half the speed, it has half as much RAM, a lower-resolution screen, half the battery life, a much older kernel, no X11, no GPU or DSP. Less than half the functionality for half the cost.

Well, the thing that keeps me from getting a smart phone is that I don't want to pay for the data plan, but want a way of connecting to wifi ( most places I go are wifi'd or close to wifi'd places). Many otherwise capable phones ( see iphone) requires a data plan. However, I also don't want to carry another device around with me. Any recommendations for a wifi capable smart phone that doesn't require a data plan and is around $200? And while, I'm at it, I'd also like a competent government of the people for

The only thing this new device can offer is a somewhat lower price ($175 instead of >$400 for the N810). But I think this device will only appeal to a very small market (most people would prefer to spend a bit more for a more capable device, or get something with a bigger screen/keyboard).

Yeah, first size, then usability, then cost. If this thing had more than QVGA I might trade in my n810 for it, but I traded in my Treo for more screen real estate. Like others have said, though, decent DNS server.

Nokia has a line of small devices that do the same thing. The 770 (which I use) and 800 have on-screen keyboards, the 810 has a slide-down keyboard. The access the internet via WiFi or a bluetooth connection on a phone.

Well, I like the form factor actually. It reminds me of my Casio dictionary [google.com]. I also have a Windows Mobile phone with a flip-out QWERTY keyboard, and I use it for a Chinese dictionary (Pleco), but being able to perch it at an angle like a computer would be much better. I guess something like a HTC Athena is what I want, but that's too expensive for me. If you could get Wenlin running on this, it would be great for Chinese students... The keys look like a cheap Besta though.

The specs seem much closer to a PDA than a netbook. Also the choice of using a 2.4 based Linux is interesting. I admit I haven't been following Linux on Xscale, so perhaps that explains the choice. Personally I expect more general purpose use out of a "computer" and these specs seem like it's more geared for PDA use.

Lots of small form-factor devices that use Linux use a 2.4 kernel. This is a shame - 2.6 doesn't seem to support small devices well, and 2.4 lacks a number of features that you'd expect from a semi-modern *NIX. I do wonder why they don't use a BSD variant for these devices, and get something with modern features and a small footprint.

It looks neat and I'm sure it works well...but smartphones have GPS and 3G/data plans built in. Most have some developer support good to go and better cameras. Ultra-portables have a better keyboard/mouse, more ports to connect crap and full web browsers. Hell, some allow you to just stick in SIM card, rolling all 3 into 1.

The battery life is ok but not great, seeing how long it takes to charge. It honestly fills no niche or even covers everything. Solid Meh.

Pretty soon, your iPod/iPhone is going to be your computer. You'll be able to have your iPhone in your pocket, walk in to any building, sit at a thin client (monitor & keyboard) and connect to your iPhone using a physical cable and possibly even BlueTooth or Wi-Fi. Soon your iPhone/iPod will be a wearable computer, with sunglasses for the display and a bluetooth headset. Commands will be spoken into the handset instead of typing. You'll meet somebody and be able to look at their MySpace/Facebook while you're talking to them face to face.

Do you think I have a decent chance on the speaking circuit as a futurist?:-)

Access Google Apps for document processing.Access the internet in a normal fashion (non-WAP)Check emailCalendaringPDFsHook up to data projectors using the component cable adapterPlay music on my home stereo/computer/carAnd honestly, looking at that keyboard on this sub-sub-notebook, the iPhone's input is likely better (I'm one of the lucky people who LOVES the iPhone keyboard)SSH using a new app I bought (sorry...I did buy it)RDP using a free app (not as good as the SSH app, but it does let me control my office webcam)Play gamesMake lightsaber sounds

Seriously...this sub-sub-notebook doesn't offer anything I don't have and that the iPhone (and likely other phones) don't already do better.

Seriously...this sub-sub-notebook doesn't offer anything I don't have and that the iPhone (and likely other phones) don't already do better.

A phone needs a 2-year commitment voice/data plan and a legal residence in a covered area. The basic iPhone plan is $70 per month and unavailable, for example, to Vermont residents. You can get an iPhone without a phone (iPod Touch, $229), but that's still more expensive than the device of the article ($175).

The iPod Touch, however, is twice as fast, has twice the RAM, has a multitouch touchscreen, has twice the screen size (480x320 vs. 320x240), comes with more built-in storage (the smallest version comes with as much as the iKIT can possibly hold; without an additional card (= additional cost) the iKIT has a whopping 25 megs of storage), has access to the Apple App Store with lots of third-party apps, does OpenGL and can play MP3s without performance issues (which the iKIT's CPU apparently can't do when used

I still have my old tandy with whopping 4k of ram somewhere:
http://www.trs-80.com/images/computer-pc5x300.gif [trs-80.com]
Boy I miss that thing. I remember writing little programs for my physics class. It was also handy to write out equations "long hand" to make sure I entered them properly.
If I buy a cell-palm-top, am I just trying to relive junior high? Maybe I won't get beat up so much this time.

PXA270 is a pretty old core design, and 312MHz is very slow. 2.4 series kernel lacks a number of features that you'd expect from a *NIX, and it seems not to be running X11, which makes porting apps that don't use Qt quite difficult. Only 64MB of RAM is a bit tight too. Power up time of 3 hours is just lame - my 770 gets 3 hours of browsing time, and the OpenPandora units get around 10 hours.

Honestly, it sounds like someone was aiming for the Â£99 price point and ended up crippling the devic

Remove the keyboard, screen, and wireless stuff. Add one or two ethernet ports and one to three USB ports. Cut the price to $100, max. Then you'd have a perfectly useful micro-server, good for all those tasks that don't take much processor oomph. I could use one or two of what I've described. But this thing? It's neither fish nor fowl and I don't see the use of it.

The Zipit2 has a 300 mhz system with 32 megs ram, 8 megs flash, miniSD card slot, has b/g wireless(does WPA), and can run OpenEmbeded Linux. It also has JTAG and serial pads inside, and I think someone is working on getting USB out of the weird connector on the back. The keyboard is chiclet, but it looks about the same as this thing. Honestly, the whole thing looks almost the same, except "business"ified.

The big plus? You can get it on amazon for $50 bucks. It was $150, but they separated out their IM/S

Actually, I just read the spec sheet somebody posted. It is a beefed up version of the Zipit. Exact same processor, same screen but it has the USB port brought out, microSD instead of miniSD, but with a bit more ram and bluetooth.

More ram+bluetooth isn't really worth another 100 bucks though.

I wonder if this is the same company, or if it is like the Wind/EEE/etc where it a bunch of different companies working off the same reference model.

The Zipit Wireless Z2 [wikipedia.org] has somewhat similar specs(no bluetooth, and only miniSD support) for only 49.99 new, a bit less if you hunt around. The default firmware is absolutely worthless(IM only, and demands that you pay a monthly fee after a couple of weeks of use); but the device runs linux, and there is an openembedded port http://linux.zipitwireless.com/ [zipitwireless.com] and http://openzipit.org/ [openzipit.org]

Not quite as good, and not an out of the box ready to go kind of thing; but pretty cheap for a PXA270 platform that plays reas

It has a 16 meg RAM video system in it (not bad for a PDA, and it does VGA on screen as well as using the external VGA to monitor cable), although it costs 50 or so dollars (USD) more to get the VGA output on your monitor, it's still relatively cheap. (http://www.amazon.com/Dell-Axim-X51v-Presentation-Cable/dp/B000FFYALU)

I tried one the other day, it even ran my 3D editor perfectly at speeds which would put one of those old SGI boxes to shame. It has VGA output for big-screen presentations and would have saved me a lot of shoulder ache from lugging a laptop around last month. I'm getting one as soon as I've got a few hundred bucks to spare.

The ONLY thing I can see that this thing has got going for it is the WIFI. With some custom applets it could do all sorts of cool things wirelessly.

I mean, this is a great competitor for palms and noce PDA stuff, I mean yet another small thing with tiny screen This one got a keyboard?! Well, so could a Palm... but hey, this computer's keys are so tiny that are a little infuriating, you should see that even the much bigger keyboard used by the eee is already pretty hard to use unless your fingers are thin, I think this computer's keyboard is more or less just decorative so it looks like a computer (so people that still don't get it that cell phones and

I'm not one for making a big deal about form over function of a computer, but Sony made something a lot like this a few years back called the UX-50. Ran Palm OS, etc. Probably could have run linux quite well if someone wanted to do a little hacking. It looked 10 times better than that shrunken 1989 looking laptop.

This IMOVIO device looks really cheaply made, and that's just not acceptable in any small form-factor mobile device. Those things take 5 times the beating a normal-use laptop takes. It also

Absolutely. I've never quite understood the desire to carry around two 3G radio sets and have two phone contacts. I just Bluetooth to my HSDPA phone - no extra devices, dongles, cables or contracts required. You only get 2.1Mbps through Bluetooth 2.0 EDR, which is theoretically a bottleneck when using an HSDPA network, but in practice it's rare you actually hit those speeds. Perhaps when 7.2Mbps and higher HSDPA speeds arrive it will become more of a bottleneck in real life, but it's not like 2.1Mbps is slo