Russell Westbrook's shot selection is so horrific, it's almost too hard to watch. Im posting this because I think Durant is an absolute stud but Westbrook is holding him back His court vision is terrible and Durant is suffering because of it. Harden was a much better complement to Durant. I honestly can't even put him in the top 20 pgs because of how much he holds Durant back

SugeKnight

11-02-2012, 12:09 AM

wow

Kashmir13579

11-02-2012, 12:10 AM

lol!!!! I think if Martin gets injured, like he usually does, OKC traded the wrong player.

Healthy Martin and Lamb IS a good package for Harden. On paper OKC are winners in the trade imo.

kswissdaf

11-02-2012, 12:10 AM

Talent wise hes a top 3 player in the game but god damn the guy makes more mental mistakes then anyone in the league

Daunter

11-02-2012, 12:11 AM

Westbrook is a star,after Rose he's the hardest PG to guard.He's a great rebounder,good defender and he always plays hard.

I take Westy over Harden

Kashmir13579

11-02-2012, 12:11 AM

LOL Inside the NBA trashing Westbrick.

Wade_County

11-02-2012, 12:12 AM

game 1 lets overreact

Kashmir13579

11-02-2012, 12:12 AM

Westbrook is a star,after Rose he's the hardest PG to guard.He's a great rebounder,good defender and he always plays hard.

I take Westy over Harden

Thats like taking Stephon Marbury over Manu Ginobili.

John Walls Era

11-02-2012, 12:12 AM

First thing he can do is pass to their best player. Then he can be even greater.

kswissdaf

11-02-2012, 12:13 AM

game 1 lets overreact

Dude its not one game, did you watch the finals he was terrible. He is one of the main reason we won it all

kswissdaf

11-02-2012, 12:15 AM

Hes a classic player that the average fan says "wow look at those great stats he puts up" but when you really pay attention he is actually hurting his team

P Harvy

11-02-2012, 12:15 AM

I actually think they would have been better off without Westbrook. Trade Russell for a pure PG that could run the offense through Harden and Durant. Would have been better

jayjay33

11-02-2012, 12:15 AM

Oh HELL YES, hRden is much better than Westbrook as a SG "and" a PG. they should have keep harden and trade Westbrook and perk for a top notch big and a solid pg like a Hinrich or someone of that elk.

popo85

11-02-2012, 12:16 AM

Im a Westbrook fan but he has some huge meltdowns there is no reason for him to chuck shots like Iverson or Arenas when he has arguably the best scorer in the game to play with. He needs to let KD attack then playoff his game. Harden had a great Houston debut makes me wonder if Rus was there would he be as efficient.

jp611

11-02-2012, 12:16 AM

Oh HELL YES, hRden is much better than Westbrook as a SG "and" a PG. they should have keep harden and trade Westbrook and perk for a top notch big and a solid pg like a Hinrich or someone of that elk.

They should have traded Westbrook for rondo and kept Harden

Bramaca

11-02-2012, 12:17 AM

Yes, they traded the wrong player. Westbrook is a great player but he would have netted the Thunder a great package and I think that a Durant/Harden core would work better together then the Durant/Westbrook core they are going with.

douglas

11-02-2012, 12:17 AM

Since OKC traded the wrong player, do you guys think Houston will be willing to do a trade-back so that OKC can trade them the correct player?

kswissdaf

11-02-2012, 12:17 AM

If the Thunder had CP3/Rondo/Dwill they would easily the best team in the west

Giraffes Rule

11-02-2012, 12:18 AM

One game.

Htownballa1622

11-02-2012, 12:19 AM

Since OKC traded the wrong player, do you guys think Houston will be willing to do a trade-back so that OKC can trade them the correct player?

no thanks :)

no trade backs :p

kswissdaf

11-02-2012, 12:21 AM

One game.

This is not a one game thing. There's a difference in having an off night and being a terrible decision maker

eternal slumber

11-02-2012, 12:21 AM

Since OKC traded the wrong player, do you guys think Houston will be willing to do a trade-back so that OKC can trade them the correct player?

no way, lol.

airforceones25

11-02-2012, 12:22 AM

OKC needs to run the Princeton offense! Get the ball out Westbrick's hands!

alexander_37

11-02-2012, 12:24 AM

Honestly OKC should have traded Westbrook for Lowry/Martin/2 firsts. But I would not have liked that trade. Give me that Harden deal every day of the week.

Sadds The Gr8

11-02-2012, 12:25 AM

they shoulda kept Harden and done Westbrook and Perkins for Jefferson, Mo Williams and a 1st rounder or some **** like that.

Daunter

11-02-2012, 12:25 AM

Thats like taking Stephon Marbury over Manu Ginobili.

Westbrook is much better than Marbury ever was

Westy is a superstar,remember when he scored 48 in the finals against the best defense in the NBA.

Jarvo

11-02-2012, 12:27 AM

Here we go again :facepalm: you people won't stop until Westbrook is out of a OKC uniform.

Rndy

11-02-2012, 12:28 AM

I still think it was a good trade all things considered. But Westy also needs to start setting up plays for teammates in late situations. I think a pick and pop game would really do good things for him. It helped Rose out a crap ton.

Greedy22

11-02-2012, 12:33 AM

Westbrook is much better than Marbury ever was

Westy is a superstar,remember when he scored 48 in the finals against the best defense in the NBA.

:laugh2:
No, he really isn't.

rockets-fan

11-02-2012, 12:33 AM

Westy is a better player than harden, but harden and Durante would play better

seikou8

11-02-2012, 12:34 AM

its one ****ing game damn it is going be like after every game god :facepalm:

Quinnsanity

11-02-2012, 12:37 AM

Tell me who Rondo for Westbrook didn't make sense for before OKC traded Harden? Boston needs more points, OKC needs more shots for Durant, and Rondo's less than max extension really would have helped the Thunder keep Harden.

Teeboy1487

11-02-2012, 12:39 AM

One game guys.

Daunter

11-02-2012, 12:41 AM

:laugh2:
No, he really isn't.

He puts up D-Rose numbers next to KD

Like i said 48 in the finals and he is a stronger leader than KD enen though KD is obviously better.

Wouldn't surprise me at all. But lebron will be back in Cleveland by that time so.....

Rndy

11-02-2012, 12:59 AM

durant is going to come to miami when his contract runs out. ;)

I hear he's going to Chicago to play with his BFF. Team Humble but trouble

Shareeb_omac2

11-02-2012, 01:02 AM

Westbrook sucks.

Bishnoff

11-02-2012, 01:03 AM

I said this when OKC extended Westbrook and ultimately created an "extend Ibaka or Harden, but not both" situation.

Harden is a better fit with Durant because he’s a much better distributor and is better at running an offense than Westbrook. Westbrook has arguably shown himself to be the better player so far (due mainly to being a starter, thus more court-time and exposure), but I've never been a fan of these hybrid PG's. Give me a pass-first PG any day.

Jahari Kavi

11-02-2012, 01:03 AM

I said the same thing as the original poster of this thread....Harden has the ability to score, but he is also 10 times better than setting up and running an offense....OKC could have gotten a lot for Westbrook too.......talented, but he will run this team into the ground and close their window for a championship.......

IKnowHoops

11-02-2012, 01:03 AM

its one ****ing game damn it is going be like after every game god :facepalm:

Hahahaha, your upset. Seriously, the team that benefited most from this OKC debacle are the Heat. It looks like they really will be able to go on a serious run of rings now that OKC isnt there to try and stop them.

seikou8

11-02-2012, 01:04 AM

Westbrook sucks.

yup you posters are so much better

P Harvy

11-02-2012, 01:04 AM

How is his legacy affected? I mean LeBron James got so much **** for never winning with Cleveland yet Westrbook is by far and away 100x better than any players LeBron ever had beside him.

With the Harden trade and teams all across the board getting stronger I just don't see OKC winning a title how they are currently set up.

Durant will never get the flack LeBron did just because he isn't LeBron. But I do wonder how he will be viewed. Many have him as the second best player in this league and from what I've seen a lot of people think he can be one of the all time greats.

Do you guys think he's headed in the direction of leaving OKC once his contracts up and joining up with a different star?

It's been talked about how Westbrook is just a cancer to Durant.

Bruno

11-02-2012, 01:04 AM

agreed.

meloman1592

11-02-2012, 01:07 AM

Talent wise hes a top 3 player in the game but god damn the guy makes more mental mistakes then anyone in the league

No he is not

Dade County

11-02-2012, 01:07 AM

Hahahaha, your upset. Seriously, the team that benefited most from this OKC debacle are the Heat. It looks like they really will be able to go on a serious run of rings now that OKC isnt there to try and stop them.

That would make me soooo happy :jumpy:

Jahari Kavi

11-02-2012, 01:07 AM

Tell me who Rondo for Westbrook didn't make sense for before OKC traded Harden? Boston needs more points, OKC needs more shots for Durant, and Rondo's less than max extension really would have helped the Thunder keep Harden.

He's going to go to the team that drafted him once his contract is up.

Alayla

11-02-2012, 01:09 AM

Wow thats nice overreact over a single game why dont you

Alayla

11-02-2012, 01:10 AM

Dude its not one game, did you watch the finals he was terrible. He is one of the main reason we won it all

And Harden played awsome right?

Baller1

11-02-2012, 01:10 AM

They traded the wrong guy, because they shouldn't have traded anyone. They should've amnestied Perk, used that money on Harden, and everything would've been fine.

Presti made his first significant mistake as a GM, and it will result in zero titles for OKC.

Mr_Amaziing

11-02-2012, 01:11 AM

Nawww they both would work it out. its only the 1st game

Lakers4life08

11-02-2012, 01:12 AM

suprised that they didn't try trade Harden for some big, Harden and perkins for Kanter and picks.......

P Harvy

11-02-2012, 01:12 AM

He's going to go to the team that drafted him once his contract is up.

Ayyy dem supersonics. I live in Seattle so I'm hoping for a team back here again (even tho I'm a wolves fan, seattle deserves a squad)

P Harvy

11-02-2012, 01:13 AM

By the way this thread has nothing to do with the loss tonight. (in fact I hadn't even checked the score before I made this thread)

I just think they got weaker when they got rid of Harden and when they had Harden they lost 4-1 to the Heat and the Heat aren't going anywhere so I just think its going to be tougher

Raph12

11-02-2012, 01:13 AM

Lakers is too old to win and need to scrap the princeton offense; Thunder traded the wrong star and need a new coach... The NBA, where Day 3 of the season happens.

Baller1

11-02-2012, 01:14 AM

Ayyy dem supersonics. I live in Seattle so I'm hoping for a team back here again (even tho I'm a wolves fan, seattle deserves a squad)

We'll get one. Balmer and Chris Hansen are working really hard to get an arena and a team in Seattle (most likely the Kings, there's a good chance the Maloofs are going to sell that team).

smuffins353

11-02-2012, 01:15 AM

Harden on the rockets baby woooooo!!!!!!!!!!

Jsmooth then boobie cousins next yeeeoooowwwwwwww

Dade County

11-02-2012, 01:18 AM

How is his legacy affected? I mean LeBron James got so much **** for never winning with Cleveland yet Westrbook is by far and away 100x better than any players LeBron ever had beside him.

With the Harden trade and teams all across the board getting stronger I just don't see OKC winning a title how they are currently set up.

Durant will never get the flack LeBron did just because he isn't LeBron. But I do wonder how he will be viewed. Many have him as the second best player in this league and from what I've seen a lot of people think he can be one of the all time greats.

Do you guys think he's headed in the direction of leaving OKC once his contracts up and joining up with a different star?

It's been talked about how Westbrook is just a cancer to Durant.

Since the league is rigged... He will be in a HEAT uniform, it's already shaping up to be that way...

We all see it coming.

Some Laker fans are going to say L.A, but look who he is bonding with (Lbj). It's going to happen, everyone can think what they want, it's going down; the people behind the scenes are already setting it up.

Harden was the 1st step, of KD rethinking his position.

P Harvy

11-02-2012, 01:19 AM

We'll get one. Balmer and Chris Hansen are working really hard to get an arena and a team in Seattle (most likely the Kings, there's a good chance the Maloofs are going to sell that team).

Yeah there will be a team back here eventually. Didn't an arena deal just get set up here in seattle?

P Harvy

11-02-2012, 01:20 AM

Since the league is rigged... He will be in a HEAT uniform, it's already shaping up to be that way...

We all see it coming.

Some Laker fans are going to say L.A, but look who he is bonding with (Lbj). It's going to happen, everyone can think what they want, it's going down; the people behind the scenes are already setting it up.

Harden was the 1st step, of KD rethinking his position.

The one player I thought of was Kyrie Irving. Looking down the road when Durants contract is up Kyrie is going to be a top 5 PG by then if not the best and I wouldn't be surprised if they get together somewhere.

Dade County

11-02-2012, 01:23 AM

The one player I thought of was Kyrie Irving. Looking down the road when Durants contract is up Kyrie is going to be a top 5 PG by then if not the best and I wouldn't be surprised if they get together somewhere.

I know it wont be in Cleveland :D

I see the entire landscape changing... From K Love to Bynum, it's about to go down.

Two teams are gone.

Baller1

11-02-2012, 01:23 AM

Yeah there will be a team back here eventually. Didn't an arena deal just get set up here in seattle?

Yeah it's looking promising.

RonE Coleman

11-02-2012, 01:24 AM

And Harden played awsome right?

Nope he played terrible. But it wasn't mental mistakes or chucking 22 shots a game

P Harvy

11-02-2012, 01:24 AM

I know it wont be in Cleveland :D

I see the entire landscape changing... From K Love to Bynum, ***** going down.

Two teams are gone.

Love will be gone eventually even tho I'm going to hate to see it so hopefully we can build something in Minne that is too good to leave.

Dade County

11-02-2012, 01:26 AM

Love will be gone eventually even tho I'm going to hate to see it so hopefully we can build something in Minne that is too good to leave.

You guys need to steal Bynum some how, and talk to players behind close doors.

it's just the way it is.

I actually see a team of Lin, Harden, Love & Bynum... don't ask me how the money works, this is a rigged league.

IKnowHoops

11-02-2012, 01:27 AM

At the end of the day both Westbrook and Harden are awesome players. Id love to have both. Honestly what OKC should of done was kept Harden. That team would have probably won 3 rings in row at some point but they opted not to pay luxury tax and not win any rings. They need all three of those boys to win the chip and getting rid of either was gonna make it impossible for them to do that. Going up against Lebron, and D wade is almost impossible to beat, and now that D wade is looking healthy and they have team chemistry its just gonna straight up impossible to stop them.

That first year they should of won, but the thing that held them back aside from Bron choking was the fact they were all trying to fit in, deferring to each other at the wrong times and you ended up only gettin 75% of Lebron and D wade. Now that they are comfortable, they are able to go out there and give 100% productivity without stepping on each others toes, making the team as efficient as they can and a beast. You cannot beat that team. Now with Bosh getting comfortable and those 3 pt shooters everywhere, its a done deal. I can easily see them winning the next 3. and challenging hard for 5,6,7.

*Silver&Black*

11-02-2012, 01:28 AM

If they indeed traded Westbrook instead of Harden, I would have gave them Horford/Teague for Westbrook.

Teague, Harden, KD, Ibaka, and Horford for the Thunder.

Westbrook, Smith and cap room for a max player next summer for the Hawks.

IKnowHoops

11-02-2012, 01:31 AM

They traded the wrong guy, because they shouldn't have traded anyone. They should've amnestied Perk, used that money on Harden, and everything would've been fine.

Presti made his first significant mistake as a GM, and it will result in zero titles for OKC.

This. Perk is a big bum.

KobeOwnSU

11-02-2012, 01:33 AM

Prisoners of the moment we are. Westbrook is better then Harden I say.

IKnowHoops

11-02-2012, 01:36 AM

If they indeed traded Westbrook instead of Harden, I would have gave them Horford/Teague for Westbrook.

Teague, Harden, KD, Ibaka, and Horford for the Thunder.

Westbrook, Smith and cap room for a max player next summer for the Hawks.

Westbrook and Perkins for Tyreke and Cousins would have made OKC the best team in the NBA. They could only loose to the Heat.

Becks2307

11-02-2012, 01:56 AM

1) Durant is not "The chosen one" there were not the same expectations as Lebron, he was not the son of Ohio who went to play in Cleveland.

2) He didnt spend 2-3 years with the top record in the conference and crash out in the playoffs.

3) People really like him

No Durant won't get the kind of flack Lebron got because the expectations were not as high.

KB-Pau-DH2012

11-02-2012, 02:01 AM

KD to the Lakers in the Summer of 2015 after Nash's contract is up. :)

naps

11-02-2012, 02:20 AM

Westbrook would be a better player than Harden as a primary option but a Durant-Harden combo sounds more potent than a Durant-Westy. OKC would net much more for Westy if they tried to trade him. But it's still just one game. Westy will learn through the season. He's a terrific player.

SINCESTARBURY25

11-02-2012, 02:26 AM

Durant to the knicks?

Kashmir13579

11-02-2012, 02:27 AM

LOL Jesus it was one game..

FOBolous

11-02-2012, 02:34 AM

or is it fine the way it is right now with Westbrook, Durant, and Ibaka?

heyman321

11-02-2012, 02:35 AM

as a houstonian, you forgot to add on the end of your sentence, "u mad?"

Hawkeye15

11-02-2012, 02:38 AM

Durant is the golden boy, walked straight into a well oiled machine, with a great front office. He will never deal with what LeBron has.

FOBolous

11-02-2012, 02:42 AM

as a houstonian, you forgot to add on the end of your sentence, "u mad?"

lol...to be fair, its only one game. but there's not doubt Harden has talent

Kashmir13579

11-02-2012, 02:51 AM

Durant is the golden boy, walked straight into a well oiled machine, with a great front office. He will never deal with what LeBron has.
Thats true. But at least in my opinion, Durant comes of as far more like-able. At least in my opinion. Its yet to be determined what Durants future will be with OKC but it bodes well for his image that Westbrick will alway be the scapegoat.

Shareeb_omac2

11-02-2012, 02:54 AM

They should have taken the Rondo-Westbrook deal.

DeyAce

11-02-2012, 02:58 AM

^ exactly

Kashmir13579

11-02-2012, 02:58 AM

Westbrook is much better than Marbury ever was

Westy is a superstar,remember when he scored 48 in the finals against the best defense in the NBA.

I disagree. If he is in fact better than Marbury ever was, its not by much.

IKnowHoops

11-02-2012, 03:00 AM

Durant to the Heat would be pretty funny. Why even play the season out at that point.

seikou8

11-02-2012, 03:05 AM

:facepalm:

5ass

11-02-2012, 03:20 AM

Tell me who Rondo for Westbrook didn't make sense for before OKC traded Harden? Boston needs more points, OKC needs more shots for Durant, and Rondo's less than max extension really would have helped the Thunder keep Harden.

exactly. Rondo and Harden would both start. Sullinger+Rondo for Westbrook would've been great for both teams.

Lakers4life08

11-02-2012, 03:26 AM

Harden+Perkins=D.Howard

Or Wesbrook and perkins for Howard....

but......

mngopher35

11-02-2012, 03:30 AM

We will see, but I see OKC winning one eventually and them having enough talent to keep durant for another contract. They have a solid amount of picks, westbrook, ibaka, and possibly lamb can develop. When westbrook ibaka and durant hit their peak and a rookie or two develops that team could dominate. Right now they may not be able to beat the heat (too early to be sure but its my guess), but they are the team currently best set up to dominate when the heat get a little older.

Hawkeye15

11-02-2012, 04:37 AM

Thats true. But at least in my opinion, Durant comes of as far more like-able. At least in my opinion. Its yet to be determined what Durants future will be with OKC but it bodes well for his image that Westbrick will alway be the scapegoat.

he is so soft spoken, and was not followed around by cameras at age 14. He isn't polarizing, if that makes sense.

Baller1

11-02-2012, 04:44 AM

It's close. They lose explosiveness as a team with Westbrook gone and Harden starting. At SG, but they gain control and poise.

Either way, Durant gets to play with a top 10 guard so it's a win-win for him.

Baller1

11-02-2012, 04:46 AM

If they indeed traded Westbrook instead of Harden, I would have gave them Horford/Teague for Westbrook.

Teague, Harden, KD, Ibaka, and Horford for the Thunder.

Westbrook, Smith and cap room for a max player next summer for the Hawks.

That would've been a very enticing trade offer for me... I'm a big fan of Horford.

STA_PLAR

11-02-2012, 05:18 AM

Did Harden even show up to the finals last year? Westbrook over for now.

sammyvine

11-02-2012, 06:43 AM

Westbrook is a star,after Rose he's the hardest PG to guard.He's a great rebounder,good defender and he always plays hard.

I take Westy over Harden

Rose has an basketball iq.

He is only a chucker because of who he plays with. If he had Durant he would never chuck like Westbrook does.

sammyvine

11-02-2012, 06:47 AM

One game.

No this has been going on for years.

Yes they got to the finals but they didn't win did they? Not saying its Westbrook's fault because Lebron was ballin, but when i saw the way Lebron was dishing the ball to Durant during the olympics it really did make me wonder how well Durant would flourish with a PG, not a ball hogging chucker. Imagine Durant with Rondo or CP3. Even Deron Williams is an upgrade since he can score and dish out.

Westbrook is talented but he doesn't fit with Durant. Why would you continue to take more shots than the best scorer in the game? That's absurd.

It's like having Isaiah Thomas and Michael Jordan in a team, and Isaiah, continues to take more shots than Jordan. You will never win a ring that way.

Bayless is a professional troll but he's been right with this Durant/Westbrook thing.

I don't think they will ever win a championship with those two together.

Iron24th

11-02-2012, 06:53 AM

Swap westbrook for rondo and watchout

sammyvine

11-02-2012, 07:00 AM

Swap westbrook for rondo and watchout

Imagine Rondo/Harden and Durant

Yes people will say Rondo can't shoot but what you want to shoot when you have Harden and Durant?:confused:

Heediot

11-02-2012, 07:03 AM

Westy is a better player than harden, but harden and Durante would play better

Westy is more athletic and faster, Harden is the better basketball player fundamentally.

Heediot

11-02-2012, 07:05 AM

Tell me who Rondo for Westbrook didn't make sense for before OKC traded Harden? Boston needs more points, OKC needs more shots for Durant, and Rondo's less than max extension really would have helped the Thunder keep Harden.

A Rondo/Harden/Durant/Ibaka has a higher chance for an OKC dynasty. I never thought the Harden in OKC would of been dynasty like the media and some assumed.

Heediot

11-02-2012, 07:08 AM

Spurs won the season series last year but lost in the playoffs. So this means little in the big picture.

JasonJohnHorn

11-02-2012, 07:23 AM

I think you are right. Me personally, I'm not a big fan of score-first PGs, and when you have such great scorers in Durant and Harden, what you really need is a distributor. That is not to say Westbrooks isn't an amazing player, he is, but I would have looked around at options to trade him as well, to see what I could get and to see which player would get me the better package.

That said, the Thunder got a good package back for Harden.

JNoel

11-02-2012, 07:31 AM

Russell Westbrook's shot selection is so horrific, it's almost too hard to watch. Im posting this because I think Durant is an absolute stud but Westbrook is holding him back His court vision is terrible and Durant is suffering because of it. Harden was a much better complement to Durant. I honestly can't even put him in the top 20 pgs because of how much he holds Durant back

I completely agree with this, except Westbrook is a top 6 PG. As much as I can't stand Westbrook, I'm rational enough to know that he's up there behind:

Rondo
Paul
Rose
Parker
Deron
Westbrook

Back to the point, Harden was a much better compliment, as Westbrook has been slowing down the Thunder since day 1. I think Durant, Harden, and Ibaka could have grew into a very similar core as the Big 3 in Miami or even better at some point. Westbrook sucks and is his biggest team's weakness at this point.

Also imagine if they traded for Rondo and his much more reasonable contract assuming they amnesty Pork:

Rondo
Harden
Sefelosha
Durant
Ibaka

Aleksandar

11-02-2012, 08:03 AM

Since OKC traded the wrong player, do you guys think Houston will be willing to do a trade-back so that OKC can trade them the correct player?

hahahah I usually skip reading your comments, but this is gold!

YoungOne

11-02-2012, 08:04 AM

I would have traded westbrook over harden aswell

koreancabbage

11-02-2012, 08:27 AM

both are top 10 in their position. Sometimes you have to stop nitpicking.

What they really needed to trade Harden for was a good big man who can score on downlow. A good scoring big man would open up the floor for Durant and Westbrook.

JNoel

11-02-2012, 08:33 AM

The only "Point Guards" in todays game are Rondo, Nash, CP3, Deron, Calderon, Rubio. The rest are Shooting Guards who can handle the ball

jt1bui

11-02-2012, 08:37 AM

Dude its not one game, did you watch the finals he was terrible. He is one of the main reason we won it all

Actually Harden completely disappeared in the finals, he didn't play very well through the entire playoffs in general.

Swashcuff

11-02-2012, 08:44 AM

Big supporter of Westy but I'll also hold no bones in being critical of him. Now that's Harden has been replaced by Martin he NEEDs to start playing the role of a more traditional PG (like his did in 10-11) a bit more since there is one less playmaker on the team. Its good to have Maynor back and healthy but they won't be on the floor together as much as Harden was with Westy.

All the facts, analysis, coaching etc points to the Thunder being a better team when Westy scores more but that was the last couple years with Harden in the fold now he has a player in Martin who can get his shot for himself with no real probs but getting shots for other players surely isn't his forte.

yaswaggin

11-02-2012, 09:45 AM

who's the one who showed up in the finals?

harden? :laugh2:

no, it was westbrook.

westbrook picked apart a defense that Rose couldnt.

IndyRealist

11-02-2012, 09:48 AM

Big supporter of Westy but I'll also hold no bones in being critical of him. Now that's Harden has been replaced by Martin he NEEDs to start playing the role of a more traditional PG (like his did in 10-11) a bit more since there is one less playmaker on the team. Its good to have Maynor back and healthy but they won't be on the floor together as much as Harden was with Westy.

All the facts, analysis, coaching etc points to the Thunder being a better team when Westy scores more but that was the last couple years with Harden in the fold now he has a player in Martin who can get his shot for himself with no real probs but getting shots for other players surely isn't his forte.

All analysis actually points to the Thunder being better with Harden on the floor, rather than Westbrook.

RonE Coleman

11-02-2012, 09:50 AM

who's the one who showed up in the finals?

harden? :laugh2:

no, it was westbrook.

westbrook picked apart a defense that Rose couldnt.

Lmao what finals were you watching, they both were dreadful and Westbrook had one great game and 4 terrible ones on below 40% shooting

yaswaggin

11-02-2012, 09:50 AM

The only "Point Guards" in todays game are Rondo, Nash, CP3, Deron, Calderon, Rubio. The rest are Shooting Guards who can handle the ball

Only one "Point Guard" on that list has a ring, Rondo. And Rondo didnt do **** that year, it was all because of KG, Ray, and Pierce. Rondo was still developing.

Deron has had back to back losing seasons, obviously cant carry a team without a good coach/good core like he had in utah.

Rubio was a rookie last year, too early to tell, but he played well with a great big man in love and a very good center in pek.

CP3 has yet to make it to the WCF.

Calderon lost his starting spot after many losing seasons in toronto

Nash also has never won a ring.

IndyRealist

11-02-2012, 09:50 AM

who's the one who showed up in the finals?

harden? :laugh2:

no, it was westbrook.

westbrook picked apart a defense that Rose couldnt.

And how did that work out for OKC in the Finals?

IndyRealist

11-02-2012, 09:53 AM

Only one "Point Guard" on that list has a ring, Rondo. And Rondo didnt do **** that year, it was all because of KG, Ray, and Pierce. Rondo was still developing.

Deron has had back to back losing seasons, obviously cant carry a team without a good coach/good core like he had in utah.

Rubio was a rookie last year, too early to tell, but he played well with a great big man in love and a very good center in pek.

CP3 has yet to make it to the WCF.

Calderon lost his starting spot after many losing seasons in toronto

Nash also has never won a ring.
Because a group accolade is the best measure of individual performance.

yaswaggin

11-02-2012, 09:53 AM

Lmao what finals were you watching, they both were dreadful and Westbrook had one great game and 4 terrible ones on below 40% shooting

actually he shot over 40% on all games except the last game in which the whole thunder team sucked and game 2 in which he shot 39%.

so overall he shot pretty well compared to harden.

RonE Coleman

11-02-2012, 09:55 AM

Only one "Point Guard" on that list has a ring, Rondo. And Rondo didnt do **** that year, it was all because of KG, Ray, and Pierce. Rondo was still developing.

Deron has had back to back losing seasons, obviously cant carry a team without a good coach/good core like he had in utah.

Rubio was a rookie last year, too early to tell, but he played well with a great big man in love and a very good center in pek.

CP3 has yet to make it to the WCF.

Calderon lost his starting spot after many losing seasons in toronto

Nash also has never won a ring.

And the point you are trying to make would be.....?

Swashcuff

11-02-2012, 09:56 AM

All analysis actually points to the Thunder being better with Harden on the floor, rather than Westbrook.

Actually they point to both. When Westbrook shoots at a larger volume the Thunder and namely Kevin Durant are at their best (http://www.sbnation.com/nba/2012/4/6/2930095/russell-westbrook-kevin-durant-oklahoma-city-thunder).

JordansBulls

11-02-2012, 09:57 AM

No the Thunder need Westbrook for the Lakers.

yaswaggin

11-02-2012, 09:58 AM

Because a group accolade is the best measure of individual performance.

did i say that? no.

i was simply pointing out that traditional pass first PGs aren't the new "in" anymore.

how do you think they should be compared? I think group accolades are a top 5 factor in determining their success, not the best measure.

RonE Coleman

11-02-2012, 09:58 AM

actually he shot over 40% on all games except the last game in which the whole thunder team sucked and game 2 in which he shot 39%.

so overall he shot pretty well compared to harden.

Take away game 4 and he shot 33% actually, nice try

yaswaggin

11-02-2012, 09:59 AM

Take away game 4 and he shot 33% actually, nice try

take game 6 away and he shot almost 50 percent, nice try.

ewing

11-02-2012, 10:02 AM

The only "Point Guards" in todays game are Rondo, Nash, CP3, Deron, Calderon, Rubio. The rest are Shooting Guards who can handle the ball

Off the top of my head Kidd, lawson, dragic, vasquez, ridnour, Miller, Jack, etc etc

SteBO

11-02-2012, 10:02 AM

No the Thunder need Westbrook for the Lakers.
Yup. The elite slashers the game are going to be guys that give the Lakers fits, and Westbrook definitely fits that mold.

In saying that, I do agree with Swashcuff's assessment of the Westbrook narrative. With Harden around, it was easier for Westbrook to just go out and do what he does regardless of his efficiency or lack there of because they had Harden to do the distributing. With him gone now, Westbrook is the only guy outside of Eric Maynor that has the capability of distributing when needed. He's going to need to learn the fine line between when to be a scorer and when to be a facilitator now.

RonE Coleman

11-02-2012, 10:03 AM

take game 6 away and he shot almost 50 percent, nice try.

There was no game 6 wtf, and no he shot 41% overall in the finals. You're math could use some work

yaswaggin

11-02-2012, 10:06 AM

There was no game 6 wtf, and no he shot 41% overall in the finals. You're math could use some work

i meant game 5, take away game 5 and he'd have almost a 50 percent shooting percentage

also rose shot 35% against the heat, so westbrook was more efficient even with a 4-20 game 5 stinker.

yaswaggin

11-02-2012, 10:06 AM

Yup. The elite slashers the game are going to be guys that give the Lakers fits, and Westbrook definitely fits that mold.

In saying that, I do agree with Swashcuff's assessment of the Westbrook narrative. With Harden around, it was easier for Westbrook to just go out and do what he does regardless of his efficiency or lack there of because they had Harden to do the distributing. With him gone now, Westbrook is the only guy outside of Eric Maynor that has the capability of distributing when needed. He's going to need to learn the fine line between when to be a scorer and when to be a facilitator now.

agreed, westy needs to distribute more like he did 2 years ago.

AWC713

11-02-2012, 10:06 AM

wonder how this team would have been had they traded westbrook for kyle lowry plus pieces....

yaswaggin

11-02-2012, 10:07 AM

wonder how this team would have been had they traded westbrook for kyle lowry plus pieces....

kyle lowry? they would have gone backwards.

RonE Coleman

11-02-2012, 10:09 AM

i meant game 5, take away game 5 and he'd have almost a 50 percent shooting percentage

also rose shot 35% against the heat, so westbrook was more efficient even with a 4-20 game 5 stinker.

41 is not even close to 50. And who is the Kevin Durant that rose has to help him out?

Daunter

11-02-2012, 10:13 AM

Rose has an basketball iq.

He is only a chucker because of who he plays with. If he had Durant he would never chuck like Westbrook does.

When did i say something bad about Rose?

Rose is the better player

yaswaggin

11-02-2012, 10:13 AM

41 is not even close to 50. And who is the Kevin Durant that rose has to help him out?

like i said, you cant read. he shot 41% in the finals, but if you take away game 5, his percentage skyrockets, just like if you take away his game 4 and it crashes.

so taking away games like YOU first tried to do is stupid.

rose didnt have kevin durant, but he had a good core around him. Deng and Noah are very good defensively, plus he ran the pick and pop with boozer.

durant or no durant, rose shot under 12% in the 4th quarter in that ECF. thats a disgrace.

RonE Coleman

11-02-2012, 10:17 AM

like i said, you cant read. he shot 41% in the finals, but if you take away game 5, his percentage skyrockets, just like if you take away his game 4 and it crashes.

so taking away games like YOU first tried to do is stupid.

rose didnt have kevin durant, but he had a good core around him. Deng and Noah are very good defensively, plus he ran the pick and pop with boozer.

durant or no durant, rose shot under 12% in the 4th quarter in that ECF. thats a disgrace.

But why are you making this about Rose, he's a far superior player than westbroook when healthy. Does everything westbrick can and more. You know, like actually running the offense and making teammates better

Daunter

11-02-2012, 10:17 AM

who's the one who showed up in the finals?

harden? :laugh2:

no, it was westbrook.

westbrook picked apart a defense that Rose couldnt.

Maybe its because they also have to guard the best Scorer in the league and the sixth man of the year.With the Bulls you only focus on Rose.

And considering Westy isnt the best player in OKC,your post makes no sense.

netsgiantsyanks

11-02-2012, 10:19 AM

all he needs to do is relax and take things slowly. the problem is, he has a inability to do that.

yaswaggin

11-02-2012, 10:20 AM

But why are you making this about Rose, he's a far superior player than westbroook when healthy. Does everything westbrick can and more. You know, like actually running the offense and making teammates better

how come westbrook had a better season last year? PER, true shooting percentage, FG%, PPG, everything.

westbrook>rose before the knee, after the knee,

westbrook>>>>>>>>>>>>>>rose

yaswaggin

11-02-2012, 10:22 AM

Maybe its because they also have to guard the best Scorer in the league and the sixth man of the year.With the Bulls you only focus on Rose.

And considering Westy isnt the best player in OKC,your post makes no sense.

So you dont have to guard noah, boozer, deng, korver, hamilton, etc?

you're just going to put 5 men on rose and leave everyone else open?

the heat didnt double durant or harden or westbrook, they played man to man.

they also didnt double rose either, actually they thought so lowly of rose they put mike bibby on him most of the game, and bibby actually did a good job.

Daunter

11-02-2012, 10:22 AM

how come westbrook had a better season last year? PER, true shooting percentage, FG%, PPG, everything.

westbrook>rose before the knee, after the knee,

westbrook>>>>>>>>>>>>>>rose

Maybe because Rose was injured the whole year...

yaswaggin

11-02-2012, 10:23 AM

Maybe because Rose was injured the whole year...

another advantage westbrook has over rose, he's a workhorse type of PG, never gets injured or tired.

Daunter

11-02-2012, 10:29 AM

So you dont have to guard noah, boozer, deng, korver, hamilton, etc?

you're just going to put 5 men on rose and leave everyone else open?

the heat didnt double durant or harden or westbrook, they played man to man.

they also didnt double rose either, actually they thought so lowly of rose they put mike bibby on him most of the game, and bibby actually did a good job.

Watch the Bulls series and you will see how wrong you are that is if your hatred for Rose lets you.

jt1bui

11-02-2012, 10:30 AM

Stop with the comparisons already. Rose is a better distributor while Westbrook is the better scorer. I don't really consider either player to be a true point guard, they're both combo guards. Westbrook is just more aggressive than Rose, which leads to alot of turnovers. If Westbrook can learn to control himself then he will become a much better player.

yaswaggin

11-02-2012, 10:31 AM

Watch the Bulls series and you will see how wrong you are that is if your hatred for Rose lets you.

i guess i must be blind then, because for most of that ECF series, bibby was put on rose.

lebron only guarded him for 3 minutes in the 4th quarter, chalmers was the backup if you rememmber that year. wade did guard rose a bit too. But it was mike ****ing bibby who was on rose most of the series

xxplayerxx23

11-02-2012, 10:32 AM

Dude its not one game, did you watch the finals he was terrible. He is one of the main reason we won it all

:facepalm: That would be Harden not showing up, westy played well in the finals.

Daunter

11-02-2012, 10:35 AM

i guess i must be blind then, because for most of that ECF series, bibby was put on rose.

lebron only guarded him for 3 minutes in the 4th quarter, chalmers was the backup if you rememmber that year. wade did guard rose a bit too. But it was mike ****ing bibby who was on rose most of the series

Watch the series

They trapped him every time he got inside the three point line

Even LeBron said you cant guard him 1 on 1

And if Bibby did so well,why did they even put LeBron on him?

He destroyed Bibby when he got no help

Ill say it again watch the ****ing series

yaswaggin

11-02-2012, 10:37 AM

Watch the series

They trapped him every time he got inside the three point line

Even LeBron said you cant guard him 1 on 1

And if Bibby did so well,why did they even put LeBron on him?

He destroyed Bibby when he got no help

Ill say it again watch the ****ing series

Destroyed Bibby? Do you have proof because using the eye test I thought bibby did a terrific job.

They did trap him, but that was once he got inside the paint. It was successful because rose was chucking that series and didnt kick it out, he tried to be superman

Daunter

11-02-2012, 10:39 AM

Destroyed Bibby? Do you have proof because using the eye test I thought bibby did a terrific job.

They did trap him, but that was once he got inside the paint. It was successful because rose was chucking that series and didnt kick it out, he tried to be superman

Im done with you,its just blind hatred/

yaswaggin

11-02-2012, 10:40 AM

Im done with you,its just blind hatred/

I'm done with you, you're a blind homer.

dee279

11-02-2012, 10:45 AM

Dude its not one game, did you watch the finals he was terrible. He is one of the main reason we won it all

Um Harden is one of the main reasons we won it all. He was terrible

KnicksorBust

11-02-2012, 10:45 AM

I've wanted the Thunder to trade Westbrook for a long time. He's insanely talented but he's better off being the #1 perimeter option with a talented bigman. Westbrook-Bosh could work. Westbrook-Aldridge could work. Westbrook-Durant is a flawed fit. Similarly to LeBron-Wade, they are both so good and so young that you'd hope eventually they'd just win a title based on skills. I don't think it will happen. But the Thunder made their choice. They think Westbrook gives them the better chance then Harden. I disagree and always have. For years I've suggested trading Westbrook and keeping Harden and now we'll get to see how the plays out.

C_Mund

11-02-2012, 10:47 AM

I actually think they would have been better off without Westbrook. Trade Russell for a pure PG that could run the offense through Harden and Durant. Would have been better

I agree. Frankly Westbrook would probably thrive even more as the best player on his own team as well. I did, however, just read an article about Harden getting close with Ibaka's girl and causing friction in the locker room. That could have something to do with it because him coming off the bench, sacrificing shots, etc + getting with a teammate's girl would be a ticking time bomb.

C_Mund

11-02-2012, 10:49 AM

I've wanted the Thunder to trade Westbrook for a long time. He's insanely talented but he's better off being the #1 perimeter option with a talented bigman. Westbrook-Bosh could work. Westbrook-Aldridge could work. Westbrook-Durant is a flawed fit. Similarly to LeBron-Wade, they are both so good and so young that you'd hope eventually they'd just win a title based on skills. I don't think it will happen. But the Thunder made their choice. They think Westbrook gives them the better chance then Harden. I disagree and always have. For years I've suggested trading Westbrook and keeping Harden and now we'll get to see how the plays out.

This is why Bosh could never win in Toronto. He needs a creator on the perimeter as much as Westy needs a high-percentage-shooting big man to level him out. They'd be a killer duo.

I Rock Shaqs

11-02-2012, 10:49 AM

Russell Westbrook's shot selection is so horrific, it's almost too hard to watch. Im posting this because I think Durant is an absolute stud but Westbrook is holding him back His court vision is terrible and Durant is suffering because of it. Harden was a much better complement to Durant. I honestly can't even put him in the top 20 pgs because of how much he holds Durant back

Cool....

RonE Coleman

11-02-2012, 11:01 AM

how come westbrook had a better season last year? PER, true shooting percentage, FG%, PPG, everything.

westbrook>rose before the knee, after the knee,

westbrook>>>>>>>>>>>>>>rose

Ahaha trolling at its finest. :facepalm:

Twins Fanatic

11-02-2012, 11:10 AM

I think OKC made a good choice in keeping Westbrook, the guys to explosive at that position (easily the best scorer at that position behind derrick rose). And yeah Westbrook is better than Harden; watch the finals last from last year, sure he put up a lot of shots, but a lot of them dropped and at least he showed up in that series.

torocan

11-02-2012, 11:20 AM

I think trading one or the other it's hard to say which would hurt the team more on a pure performance basis.

However, I would trade Westbrook before Harden for one simple reason... it's FAR easier to find a decent player to fill Westbrook's role than Harden's role.

The PG position is the deepest in the league. The SG position? Not so much.

It's not hard to find 5 or 10 PG's that you can argue wouldn't result in a severe performance dropoff for the team.

It's ALOT harder to find 5 or 10 SG's that you can argue can compensate to a significant degree for Harden's scoring AND passing skills.

They would have gotten more in trade for Westbrook ... more importantly, they could have secured a decent PG AND had good role players leftover to strengthen their bench and rotations significantly.

Instead, they got K-mart picking up Harden's shooting, and they're left hoping that Maynor can get into form to pick up the slack for Harden's passing.

bagwell368

11-02-2012, 11:22 AM

Why must it be either/or?

They could have kept both by amnesty. Perkins out the door. He was already starting to slide after 2009-2010. The knee injuries and no KG to disguise how minimal his skill set is, and has revealed him for the fringe player he is.

The general feeling is that OKC won that trade. No way - look again. They got owned. Admit it, and move on.

EDIT ADD:

Nate Robinson: cost 1/3 of $4.2M the year they got him for 4 games played out of 26 in the regular season, and 3 games out 17 in the playoffs. Then had to pay him $4.5M the next year and waived him before he ever played a game.

That move allowed the Celts to sign Brandon Bass ($4.25M), the current starting PF for the Celts.

The pick turns out to be Fab Melo - we will see, not a slam dunk either way at this point.

Kristic was superb his first 10 games, and the Celts offense was at its best all that season. He got hurt twice and didn't play well again until late in the playoffs, then left to play abroad. We still have his rights.

Green wasn't used well by Doc that first year, and then boom. But he's back and we'll see what is what.

Oh yeah, we got cash too, but I'm not sure how much.

Meanwhile 4 years and $38.4M for Perkins? Ouch. If the Celts traded him for nothing it would have been a steal.

IndyRealist

11-02-2012, 11:28 AM

i meant game 5, take away game 5 and he'd have almost a 50 percent shooting percentage

also rose shot 35% against the heat, so westbrook was more efficient even with a 4-20 game 5 stinker.

That's the problem with quoting a playoff series like it's definitive. One really good or really bad game can vastly skew the numbers. The sample size is too small. We have people making the same argument both ways. "Well, take out ONE game and..." Can you imagine what people would say "let's ignore his 16 worst games" during the regular season.

sep11ie

11-02-2012, 11:29 AM

Why must it be either/or?

They could have kept both by amnesty. Perkins out the door. He was already starting to slide after 2009-2010. The knee injuries and no KG to disguise how minimal his skill set is, and has revealed him for the fringe player he is.

The general feeling is that OKC won that trade. No way - look again. They got owned. Admit it, and move on.

They couldn't have kept them both. Harden couldn't have gotten the same extension that he wanted (and got with Houston) in OKC.

KnicksorBust

11-02-2012, 11:31 AM

Why must it be either/or?

They could have kept both by amnesty. Perkins out the door. He was already starting to slide after 2009-2010. The knee injuries and no KG to disguise how minimal his skill set is, and has revealed him for the fringe player he is.

The general feeling is that OKC won that trade. No way - look again. They got owned. Admit it, and move on.

1. They probably didn't want the embarassment of trading a young talent (Jeff Green) for somebody that they were only going to amnesty.

2. No team wants to go drastically over the luxury tax. Especially not with the harsh penalties put into place.

3. With an impending Lakers-Thunder playoff series, they probably felt more comfortable keeping Perkins to team up with Ibaka to matchup with Howard-Gasol.

bagwell368

11-02-2012, 11:34 AM

1. They probably didn't want the embarassment of trading a young talent (Jeff Green) for somebody that they were only going to amnesty.

2. No team wants to go drastically over the luxury tax. Especially not with the harsh penalties put into place.

3. With an impending Lakers-Thunder playoff series, they probably felt more comfortable keeping Perkins to team up with Ibaka to matchup with Howard-Gasol.

Green didn't fit that team. The deal for a banger C which they got - he was just broken.

Perkins has never recovered his game since he went to OKC, he has been miserable in season and even worse in the playoffs.

bagwell368

11-02-2012, 11:35 AM

They couldn't have kept them both. Harden couldn't have gotten the same extension that he wanted (and got with Houston) in OKC.

Hmmm. I thought with Perkins gone and a league min Center they could have kept both.

KnicksorBust

11-02-2012, 11:36 AM

It's annoying that OKC-Westbrook-Harden discussions are happening in 6 different threads but if you read my post in any of them you know how I feel.

KnicksorBust

11-02-2012, 11:38 AM

Green didn't fit that team. The deal for a banger C which they got - he was just broken.

Perkins has never recovered his game since he went to OKC, he has been miserable in season and even worse in the playoffs.

You're missing the focus. You say Perkins has a limitted skill set. What skills does Perkins bring to the table? What are his strengths?

bagwell368

11-02-2012, 11:50 AM

You're missing the focus. You say Perkins has a limitted skill set. What skills does Perkins bring to the table? What are his strengths?

I'm not missing the focus. His D in the paint is supposed to be good. But after watching the guy since the pre KG days of the Celts, I can tell you his mobility to get to places has declined a great deal. He's a decent rebounder for his size but can't beat anybody with any vertical, and he cannot range around after boards (as seen by a huge dive in his REB% numbers since the Celts). His offense has always been pathetic, but, it appears to be getting worse. The numbers say it's getting worse too.

I watched almost every minute of that first season in OKC playoffs and I was stunned. He was destroyed in each Series by a vast amount. The +/- with him on the floor was also awful.

His blocks are down, his TOV% is up.

He's age 27 for a few more days, and his numbers have been declining (even after he lost weight and got into shape - remember that PR crap that was floated about 14 months ago?) Didn't help his game at all.

He can't play, and even his supposed areas of strength are going down the tubes. Watch the guy - forget the '08 Celts, that guy is long gone.

goose14741

11-02-2012, 12:01 PM

ya they ****** up. They should have negotiated earlier and realized they have better options then k-mart, lamb and 2 firsts. Ya that's god but not for a contender. Most people had them as the #2 favorite behind the Heat.That's when you only try and get better no matter what the long term effects are. Being conservative is a business decision I understand that. They are in a position to contend for years but there were better options. For example..
3 team trade
Magic Receive
Harden
DeRozen
Perkins
2nd Round pick
Thunder Receive
Howard
Calderon
Raptors Receive
Reddick, Maynor, cook, a 1st and a 2nd and major cap relief.

Thunder then have
Calderon
westbrook
durant
ibaka
howard

calderon, howard would put them over the top

lvblay3

11-02-2012, 12:10 PM

Here we go again :facepalm: you people won't stop until Westbrook is out of a OKC uniform.

Read the commit... they arent OKC fans.. Please tell me one person on planet earth that can stop Westbrook... Iam waiting NO BODY He had a bad night had a lot of drive bounce out.. he be ok...

BKLYNpigeon

11-02-2012, 12:10 PM

last week Harden is overrated and overpaid. Thunder made a Great deal.

(Harden drops 37 points, Westbrook has a bad game)

Now its Harden is better then Westbrook, Thunder traded the wrong player.....OMFG.

kobebabe

11-02-2012, 12:12 PM

This is clearly an overreaction to a single loss. Yes WB is a chucker and hardly passes the ball when needed but is Harden better than him? I don't think so. Martin and Lamb plus picks was a pretty fair trade for them, assuming Martin stays healthy and the picks turns out great

StarvingKnick22

11-02-2012, 12:14 PM

Its funny cause I went to bed saying I'm gonna make a thread about this. Seems like you beat me to it. Anyways, your right, because Harden brought the team together whereas Westbrook always wanted to be the man. Even though everyone knows that Durant was and always will be the Man.

lvblay3

11-02-2012, 12:16 PM

I think OKC made a good choice in keeping Westbrook, the guys to explosive at that position (easily the best scorer at that position behind derrick rose). And yeah Westbrook is better than Harden; watch the finals last from last year, sure he put up a lot of shots, but a lot of them dropped and at least he showed up in that series.

Russell was the reason why the Thunder was in game four. Harden, Durant or the rest of the team was off and couldnt do anything. Russell put the Thunder on his back and carried the Thunder in the game, they lost yes and it was because of a foul by Russell but he the only reason why they were in that game.

yaswaggin

11-02-2012, 12:26 PM

Read the commit... they arent OKC fans.. Please tell me one person on planet earth that can stop Westbrook... Iam waiting NO BODY He had a bad night had a lot of drive bounce out.. he be ok...

DF? how did you post as a guest?

Im_in_Mia_bish

11-02-2012, 12:28 PM

wow, wayyy too early for this.

Im_in_Mia_bish

11-02-2012, 12:28 PM

that boy lvblay with his beautiful grammar.

2-ONE-5

11-02-2012, 12:34 PM

Westbrook holds KD back so much that he won a scoring title, is a top 3 player in the game, and played in the Finals last year. LOL

KnicksorBust

11-02-2012, 12:38 PM

I'm not missing the focus. His D in the paint is supposed to be good. But after watching the guy since the pre KG days of the Celts, I can tell you his mobility to get to places has declined a great deal. He's a decent rebounder for his size but can't beat anybody with any vertical, and he cannot range around after boards (as seen by a huge dive in his REB% numbers since the Celts). His offense has always been pathetic, but, it appears to be getting worse. The numbers say it's getting worse too.

I watched almost every minute of that first season in OKC playoffs and I was stunned. He was destroyed in each Series by a vast amount. The +/- with him on the floor was also awful.

His blocks are down, his TOV% is up.

He's age 27 for a few more days, and his numbers have been declining (even after he lost weight and got into shape - remember that PR crap that was floated about 14 months ago?) Didn't help his game at all.

He can't play, and even his supposed areas of strength are going down the tubes. Watch the guy - forget the '08 Celts, that guy is long gone.

His post defense is still among the best in the league. He's a true center who rebounds and has the length/strength to body up on Dwight Howard. Leaving that responsibility to Ibaka and/or Collison would be huge mistake. By keeping Perkins, they are thinking big picture.

Baller1

11-02-2012, 12:51 PM

Westbrook holds KD back so much that he won a scoring title, is a top 3 player in the game, and played in the Finals last year. LOL

This.

davids22

11-02-2012, 12:58 PM

Durant won't get flak as bad as Lebron if he never wins a ship because the media has been hyping up Lebron to be the "next MJ" since he was 16 years old. Plus, Lebron let it get to his head a little bit with the whole "Chosen one" mantra and what not. He's definitely come down to earth and is playing his best basketball right now.

Durant is just such a soft-spoken guy who does his job in the most efficient manner. He should receive criticism if he can't do it in OKC, but it will be leagues below what Lebron got. Durant never left his "hometown" (which was really just his home state) after having the #1 seed for two years and not winning a ship. However, a few more WCF or Finals losses for Kevin, and the media should be quick to jump on him (sort of like how Melo has the stigma of not being able to win in the playoffs).

Tymathee

11-02-2012, 01:01 PM

Harden playing point with Martin at the 2 would've been pretty nice, agreed, shoudl've moved WEsty, should've done it years ago. Should've done it for Cp3

CubZwin38

11-02-2012, 01:14 PM

How is his legacy affected? I mean LeBron James got so much **** for never winning with Cleveland yet Westrbook is by far and away 100x better than any players LeBron ever had beside him.

With the Harden trade and teams all across the board getting stronger I just don't see OKC winning a title how they are currently set up.

Durant will never get the flack LeBron did just because he isn't LeBron. But I do wonder how he will be viewed. Many have him as the second best player in this league and from what I've seen a lot of people think he can be one of the all time greats.

Do you guys think he's headed in the direction of leaving OKC once his contracts up and joining up with a different star?

It's been talked about how Westbrook is just a cancer to Durant.

Seems a little contradictory? Seems like you've come to the conclusion Durant's legacy will be affected negatively. So you think Durant has Westbrook so he should win a 'ship but you don't think as the team is currently set up that is possible? Maybe I'm missing something.

mightybosstone

11-02-2012, 01:16 PM

If Durant and Westbrook stick together, they will win at least one title. It's easy to forget because they've done so much at such a young age, but they're both just 24. They've probably got at least 5-6 more years at this level of play, and given how elite players are still playing into their mid-late 30s, I think Durant and Westbrook could play at this level for another decade. All it takes is one season where everything goes well. And given the age of the other Western Conference elite teams, OKC could be the best team in the conference for years.

ghettosean

11-02-2012, 01:17 PM

game 1 lets overreact
:laugh2:

netsgiantsyanks

11-02-2012, 01:21 PM

you know, there are 81 games left. you might want to see how that plays out...

GoferKing_

11-02-2012, 01:27 PM

They should simply swap Westbrook for Rondo, he would make that team a lot better, create for big guys, you all remember how Perk was playing with Rondo? He would make Ibaka a monster and create many open looks for Durant, Martin, Lamb. He is smarter and a better leader than Westbrook. Simply better and what is more important he makes the team better.

MrfadeawayJB

11-02-2012, 01:35 PM

1) Durant is not "The chosen one" there were not the same expectations as Lebron, he was not the son of Ohio who went to play in Cleveland.

2) He didnt spend 2-3 years with the top record in the conference and crash out in the playoffs.

3) People really like him

No Durant won't get the kind of flack Lebron got because the expectations were not as high.

yep, pretty much sums it up

SOMATS

11-02-2012, 01:35 PM

Give them a PG whose priority is getting Durant the ball in key situations and not being the superstar or center of attention, and I think they'd be much better off.

JNoel

11-02-2012, 03:48 PM

Only one "Point Guard" on that list has a ring, Rondo. And Rondo didnt do **** that year, it was all because of KG, Ray, and Pierce. Rondo was still developing.

Deron has had back to back losing seasons, obviously cant carry a team without a good coach/good core like he had in utah.

Rubio was a rookie last year, too early to tell, but he played well with a great big man in love and a very good center in pek.

CP3 has yet to make it to the WCF.

Calderon lost his starting spot after many losing seasons in toronto

Nash also has never won a ring.

They don't have to be "good" to be true point guards or have rings for that matter. The point I'm trying to make is that these guys I mentioned are really what point guards should be and not SGs like Westbrook who really shouldn't be playing PG. Also how is that guy posting as a guest?

Im_in_Mia_bish

11-02-2012, 03:50 PM

wow you guys are really overreacting to the max...

Im_in_Mia_bish

11-02-2012, 03:50 PM

and pls edit last option as westbrook, kevin martin, durant, and ibaka.
thanks.

astrosmaniac

11-02-2012, 03:51 PM

Hmmm. I thought with Perkins gone and a league min Center they could have kept both.

well they could have given harden a max deal of 4 years 60 mil with the freed up money from amnestying perkins, but they couldn't give him a 5 year max like houston did. the new CBA only lets you give out 1 5 year extension to a player coming off his rookie deal and they used that on westbrook

Alayla

11-02-2012, 08:38 PM

Smh... westbrook is so disrespected if the thunder are hurting from having him SOO much the sixers would gladly take him off your hands

LJEATON26

11-02-2012, 09:08 PM

well they could have given harden a max deal of 4 years 60 mil with the freed up money from amnestying perkins, but they couldn't give him a 5 year max like houston did. the new CBA only lets you give out 1 5 year extension to a player coming off his rookie deal and they used that on westbrook

They can have two and they used one on Westbrook and one on Durant. The Thunder did what they had to do, Ibaka and Westbrook both took less money to sign with the Thunder but Harden wouldn't do the same so they traded him and got an awesome deal out of it. They didn't drag it out like the Nuggets did with Carmelo or the Magic with Dwight, they took care of the problem. Amnestying Perkins would just lead to the Thunder having Cole Aldriche and Hasheem Thabeet as the starting and back up centers. How does that make them a better team?

TyrionLannister

11-03-2012, 01:28 AM

They shouldn't have traded either, but if they had to trade one of them it is at least up for debate. Harden was known to be able to take over and run the show when Westbrook went into a funk, but how this season plays out will be a good indicator.