Just got the game and the two expansions, doing ok so far. I play WITP AE and TOAW and have started to enjoy this game a lot as well. I'm playing the tutorial in BTFB and the two tactical exercises in the Greek expansion, and have a quick question about the bridge unit in the tactical exercise. There is a creek to the northeast of the objective and motorized can not cross, but I cant get the bridge unit to build a crossing there. I just keep getting the beep (u cant move there) sound, what am I doing wrong? Again, glad I found this game, cant wait to play some of the more challenging scenarios.

Just got the game and the two expansions, doing ok so far. I play WITP AE and TOAW and have started to enjoy this game a lot as well. I'm playing the tutorial in BTFB and the two tactical exercises in the Greek expansion, and have a quick question about the bridge unit in the tactical exercise. There is a creek to the northeast of the objective and motorized can not cross, but I cant get the bridge unit to build a crossing there. I just keep getting the beep (u cant move there) sound, what am I doing wrong? Again, glad I found this game, cant wait to play some of the more challenging scenarios.

TC ET1(SS)

Check the equipment making the move to the chosen location, and the terrain's ability to support it's movement.

The "you can't move there" notice indicates that units depending on motorized transport can't traverse the route to the selected location because the routing doesn't allow travel by vehicles.

There's a tool for reviewing routing. Use the "Path / MOT" on the tools menu to find a route allowing motorized transport to the location.

Posts: 3070
Joined: 11/26/2009 From: Living in the fair city of Melbourne, AustraliaStatus: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: xnavytc

Hi Everyone,

Just got the game and the two expansions, doing ok so far. I play WITP AE and TOAW and have started to enjoy this game a lot as well. I'm playing the tutorial in BTFB and the two tactical exercises in the Greek expansion, and have a quick question about the bridge unit in the tactical exercise. There is a creek to the northeast of the objective and motorized can not cross, but I cant get the bridge unit to build a crossing there. I just keep getting the beep (u cant move there) sound, what am I doing wrong? Again, glad I found this game, cant wait to play some of the more challenging scenarios.

TC ET1(SS)

You should be able to issue a Build Bridge order to the Bridge Engineer unit, by clicking on a spot within 500 meters of the crossing icon and in the right side of the creek.

TOAW was my all time favorite until I discovered Matrix' marketing for Command Ops.

One frustration with TOAW was the requirement to manage each unit while maintaining cohesion among organizations, particularly difficult when the scenario OOBs weren't designed for much cooperation among friendly formations.

The beauty of Command Ops is the operational commander can manage subordinate units with insight into unit health / strength and unit commander strengths and weaknesses or structure task groups for micromanagement of global assignment.

Not too different from battlefield management where the top commander can attach and detach individual units from formations to function at his, or his chosen subordinate's discretion to attain operational goals.

Couple that with the refined movement / path determination, unit formation, supply management, and fire discipline decisions, and the game becomes even richer for the grognard interested in operational management than what was available with TOAW.

Watch out for those brigade attack scenarios, Xnavytc. As I posted recently, I was having difficulty getting anything other than a marginal defeat on them (actually got a draw twice since then) - then someone kindy pointed out to me that they have to be 'the dumbest scenarios in there' (I think those were the words) as all your units are mounted (as allies)and there's no dismount code in the engine, which means you will find it very hard to occupy the objective, as the terrain up there is impassable to wheels. The objective circle is very wide, of course, and you have arty - so it might be theoretically possible to get your units into those parts of the objective circle which are passable to wheels (the lower slopes), then dislodge the enemy footsoldiers sitting pretty on the high ground above you using indirect fire. But I haven't managed that. Let me know if you can!! More likely, this scenario is very odd. If you use scenmaker to swap out your rangers for the NZ foot troops in the OOB (in scenmaker) then the scenario becomes more realistic and achieveable. Just a thought.

Be nice - given the wheel problem - if someone (Bletch?)could let us in on the idea behind this scenario design?

The origins of the 'Brigade Attack' scenarios is before even my time. I think they were intended to be quickie little COTA scenarios to try out the mechanics. I can get a draw on the day attack fairly easily, but any type of victory does indeed seem allusive. There's a challenge for you phoenix!

BFTB made it more difficult for motorized to negotiate steep slopes so that may have thrown off the balance a bit.

Posts: 3070
Joined: 11/26/2009 From: Living in the fair city of Melbourne, AustraliaStatus: offline

Yeah, I'm quite a noob when it comes to trace scenario lineage, Phoenix.

In most COTA maps you'll see that contour lines intervals are considerably higher than what you find on the Netherlands or Belgium maps. So a map that looks "similar" to a Dutch or Belgian map, will actually be portraying much steeper slopes. Generally speaking, is very bad country for heavily motorized units - they'll be confined to roads at the bottom of valleys. As far as I know, that's quite a theme in the Spring 1941 campaign for Greece.

Dismounting capabilities is something in the TODO list - it's going to happen, sometime. In the meantime, one thing that would work nicely is to modify the estab introducing "dismounted" versions of the forces involved (I think you're already doing something similar). That would indeed account well for motorized infantry leaving behind their trucks, etc. provided the scenario is short enough (1 or 2 days).

Regarding VP locations: if you want the scenario to present more varied results, break down objective areas into smaller ones. That should broaden and diversify considerably the possible resulting outcomes.

Thanks Simovitch and Bletch. Confirms what I thought, I think - for these scenarios you really have to swap out some motor units for foot in the scenmaker to get them to work well. For anyone finding that too difficult (might involve reading the manual, if you haven't used scenmaker before!) then an easier alternative would be to use scenmaker to drag the single VP point down to the road, or the road bridge behind the hill. That makes sense too, strategically, since it's actually the road that the allies are after, not the hill, it's just that the hill commands it. If you drag the VP down to the road bridge behind the hill then you will at least be able to occupy it if you can get your forces past the hill. Might be a tad easy then to win. Will try.

By the way, can anyone tell me how I would upload a file here - attach it to a post, I mean - then I could slot in the changed scenario, in case anyone interested. I can only see buttons to allow you to attach a picture. I've never posted a file before.

I gave it a try with a battalion of New Zealand foot infantry instead of the motorized Rangers, but it was still a little tough: the attack went well up until the Germans fell back on the top of the hill, at which point it became a battalion-on-battalion throwdown between an even number of New Zealanders with artillery support and German mountain infantry with a mortar team. I ended up inflicting 10-1 casualties (lost 47 vs. 450 captured or killed), but in large part, that happened when the tanks were in combat, before the Germans moved all the way up the hill.

I changed the VP to the bridge behind the hill and added in the NZ foot troops (kept everything else), got a Decisive Victory - so that was too easy. Am now tinkering with keeping the VP on the hill, and adding one on the bridge (equal points between them), plus adding the foot troops. You're right, Fishbreath, the slog on the hill is hard to win with a Bn v Bn situation (and in the night attack variant it's always that because the tanks have no visibility up to the battleground atop the hill at night, so take no part).