From the conversations he’s had with Dan about various forms of media it’s clear he has nuanced opinions that he expresses in private. He’s more wary of expressing opinions publicly and to a large audience who he’s historically chosen not to swear in front of, either. I think Phil is just careful about the public image he presents of himself and that’s really worked out quite well for him.

Also his partner is Dan so he gets interrupted every 2.5 seconds, which can be frustrating as a viewer when one of them—Dan—doesn’t want to discuss something, like Article 13, and Phil would still be willing to if left to his own devices. But that’s very different than learning that what you have to say isn’t important.

I agree with you about his public image and who knows, perhaps he is just overly cautious about sharing too much. Or maybe he feels that's information we, as viewers, aren't entitled to.

I just wish he would keep rambling after being cut off. Assert yourself, Phil and tell Dan to hush for a minute! lol

Mood. lol
But I personally think it's just him thinking that the audiences don't need to know about personal information and details. I'm pretty sure he mentioned that in an interview before. The one with Dan where they sit on the couch?

And I'm waaaay too invested in this 'Russel Sprout' story. He could be real, or he's a real person but Phil remembers the name differently. Or he's just Phil's imagination.

I would know that since I do that too lol. I remember vividly about a supernatural experience that I saw, the other kids saw too. But a few months later, they all got confused when I ask them about it. They say it never happened. So that's just probably my mind making up weird stuffs.

I know people get irritated with Phil's lack of opinions but I kinda feel bad for him.

He's not a loud guy, he often gets talked over, he's gone uncredited several times for thoughts and/or ideas he's had over the years and i think that takes a toll . When you dont feel like what you have to say is going to be heard? You learn to just sit back and shut up because you don't feel like what you have to say is important to anyone.

Hopefully this year he'll speak up more on things and make his thoughts known because I'd really love to hear them.

Being the quiet one in a group seems to come naturally to Phil based on what he’s said about his school friends when he was young and their surprise that he went on to do stage shows.

Sometimes people are quiet because they’ve been told or learned to ‘sit back and shut up’ as you said, but that’s definitely not the only reason. Phil doesn’t strike me as someone who’s been suppressed or learned not to express himself. I think he’s quiet because he’s listening, and when he has something to say he does actually say it and it’s often insightful/funny because he’s been thinking and listening.

From the conversations he’s had with Dan about various forms of media it’s clear he has nuanced opinions that he expresses in private. He’s more wary of expressing opinions publicly and to a large audience who he’s historically chosen not to swear in front of, either. I think Phil is just careful about the public image he presents of himself and that’s really worked out quite well for him.

Also his partner is Dan so he gets interrupted every 2.5 seconds, which can be frustrating as a viewer when one of them—Dan—doesn’t want to discuss something, like Article 13, and Phil would still be willing to if left to his own devices. But that’s very different than learning that what you have to say isn’t important.

I feel this all to an extent, but for years we got phil solo liveshows where he never expressed a real opinion, so honestly I feel like it's more his choice not to talk about personal things, not because Dan is loud

The only way to save 2017 is for The Cake Scene to be uploaded in 1080p

I know people get irritated with Phil's lack of opinions but I kinda feel bad for him.

He's not a loud guy, he often gets talked over, he's gone uncredited several times for thoughts and/or ideas he's had over the years and i think that takes a toll . When you dont feel like what you have to say is going to be heard? You learn to just sit back and shut up because you don't feel like what you have to say is important to anyone.

Hopefully this year he'll speak up more on things and make his thoughts known because I'd really love to hear them.

Being the quiet one in a group seems to come naturally to Phil based on what he’s said about his school friends when he was young and their surprise that he went on to do stage shows.

Sometimes people are quiet because they’ve been told or learned to ‘sit back and shut up’ as you said, but that’s definitely not the only reason. Phil doesn’t strike me as someone who’s been suppressed or learned not to express himself. I think he’s quiet because he’s listening, and when he has something to say he does actually say it and it’s often insightful/funny because he’s been thinking and listening.

From the conversations he’s had with Dan about various forms of media it’s clear he has nuanced opinions that he expresses in private. He’s more wary of expressing opinions publicly and to a large audience who he’s historically chosen not to swear in front of, either. I think Phil is just careful about the public image he presents of himself and that’s really worked out quite well for him.

Also his partner is Dan so he gets interrupted every 2.5 seconds, which can be frustrating as a viewer when one of them—Dan—doesn’t want to discuss something, like Article 13, and Phil would still be willing to if left to his own devices. But that’s very different than learning that what you have to say isn’t important.

I feel this all to an extent, but for years we got phil solo liveshows where he never expressed a real opinion, so honestly I feel like it's more his choice not to talk about personal things, not because Dan is loud

I think what might be happening lately (or at least in the last string of joint liveshows, specifically with moments like Article 13) is the growing pains of Phil coming out of the shell he used to be in but them having a comfortable pattern in which Phil doesn't talk about things like that and not yet being (as) comfortable in the flow of conversation with Phil asserting himself. Phil wanting to share more opinions about things and care less is relatively new, to us and to them.

I miss them a lot. I'm starting to think we might get a video soon, and the II watch party - is that even still happening?
(By soon I mean like, within ~2 weeks).

Who do you think will be the first to upload - Dan or Phil? Is it going to be something more 'serious' or something just for fun?

For some reason I think that Dan will be the one to upload first, not sure why - maybe it's because he hasn't uploaded in a long while and I feel like he might be ready to finally do that.

I just hope we will get a video soon because I feel like I'm dying. It's weird because I'm not sure I felt this way during the winter break last year, but I'm very much in pain. The ig stories help a little but they're not enough; I need content, new fresh content - even a liveshow would do, at this point (will liveshows ever come back, by the way? God, I really LOVE not knowing absolutely anything about their plans, so much FUN! )

Last edited by glitterintheair on Wed Jan 09, 2019 6:39 pm, edited 1 time in total.

I do agree that Phil is just naturally less inclined to share opinions, but I will NEVER forgive Dan for interrupting him during that liveshow where they talked about their first ever conversation about Muse. Them talking about 2009 makes me weak and we’ll never know what Phil was gonna say

I miss them so much. I agree that Dan might be the first one to upload, but I’ll take ANYTHING. Phil can upload a 10 minute video detailing everything he’s eaten so far this year and I will lap that shit up.

I just hope we will get a video soon because I feel like I'm dying. It's weird because I'm not sure I felt this way during the winter break last year, but I'm very much in pain. The ig stories help a little but they're not enough; I need content, new fresh content - even a liveshow would do, at this point (will liveshows ever come back, by the way? God, I really LOVE not knowing absolutely anything about their plans, so much FUN! )

I always miss them loads during droughts and their winter hiatus, but this is so much worse. I think it's like you said - not knowing absolutely anything, and while I'm not going to panic and assume terrible things, I just want to Know they are coming back SOON and that we won't get drastically less content than before.
And like @thestigdrivesamini, I would totally watch a 10 min video of Phil detailing everything he's eaten this year. I'd watch them read the phone book at this point.

I also have a hunch that Dan might go first, and I think the video will be at least mildly meaningful. I really can't see him coming back from such a long break with a "Top Dan Memes" or ISG. please don't prove me wrong dan. although as said, at this point i'll take anything.

For some reason today is the first time I took a step back from the immediacy of like, how I remembered each of these separate events, and realized that in 2018 Dan and Phil were on tour for like six months out of the year, Dan had a breakdown and stopped making videos alone, and Phil got so stressed out he actually passed out and was very briefly hospitalized.

I'm still not of the opinion that they 'deserve' a break more than anyone else who works hard - and I don't think that this is just purely a holiday from working. I believe them when they say it's them wanting to assess where they are and their goals/directions they're going in. But I think that perhaps the combination of their personal experiences and brushes with different flavors of burnout and hitting their own personal walls (of both mental and physical health) is behind the desire to regroup and keep engaged with what they're doing, and when I really contextualize what against what 2018 was for them I feel like acceptance is easier to grasp.

And like @thestigdrivesamini, I would totally watch a 10 min video of Phil detailing everything he's eaten this year. I'd watch them read the phone book at this point.

I feel like Phil would turn reading the phone book into a viral tag challenge he wouldn't get credit for when other youtubers copy it.

Oh definitely! It would do well and be entertaining because Phil would get flustered trying to read so much (flashbacks to dream daddy) and make little jokes about people’s names. People who don’t know him would watch just because of his voice. Then BAM.. 10 youtubers in the span of a week upload “THE PHONEBOOK CHALLENGE”

For some reason today is the first time I took a step back from the immediacy of like, how I remembered each of these separate events, and realized that in 2018 Dan and Phil were on tour for like six months out of the year, Dan had a breakdown and stopped making videos alone, and Phil got so stressed out he actually passed out and was very briefly hospitalized.

Absolutely +1 to all of this. I’m hoping to appreciate the content more when I do get it. But I’m still voting for Dan and Phil getting to choose, instead of what the people want. I’m just hoping for a decent amount of overlap.

I wanna get people's thoughts..... So, it's widely accepted Dan and Phil have 2 flats and we have our running theory that maybe they're getting rid of the "filming" one, but I keep wondering why they bothered to hide the fact that there were 2 in the first place? With enough clarity into what each flat was for, telling us that they were going to have a fliming space and separate living space would have been equally as reasonable as the explanation we got about them not dragging lights upstairs or whatever.

Now, if suddenly they're not filming in Phil's room or Dan's space or the gaming room, it's gonna be weird to have to explain that they just ~decided to change things up~. And what about like... baking? Will they use their actual kitchen?

Part of me just thinks they got into this pattern of lying about things here and there and so it seemed natural to just lie about the flat, but now it could bite them in the ass. And I guess this applies regardless of whether the filming space goes or not. What was the point? To not panic the phandom? idk bro. idk.

For some reason today is the first time I took a step back from the immediacy of like, how I remembered each of these separate events, and realized that in 2018 Dan and Phil were on tour for like six months out of the year, Dan had a breakdown and stopped making videos alone, and Phil got so stressed out he actually passed out and was very briefly hospitalized.

I'm still not of the opinion that they 'deserve' a break more than anyone else who works hard - and I don't think that this is just purely a holiday from working. I believe them when they say it's them wanting to assess where they are and their goals/directions they're going in. But I think that perhaps the combination of their personal experiences and brushes with different flavors of burnout and hitting their own personal walls (of both mental and physical health) is behind the desire to regroup and keep engaged with what they're doing, and when I really contextualize what against what 2018 was for them I feel like acceptance is easier to grasp.

To be honest, you writing this out really hit me like a ton of bricks, because I didn't really think too much about just how intense 2018 was for them. Tours are really no easy thing, no matter how fun and travel-y they seem and like.... the shitty feedback Dan got on Living My Truth at exactly the same time they were feeling like the tour wasn't gonna happen. Just yikes.

I also just watched Lilly's new video about her break and what she's doing upon coming back and tbh, my heart has grown a bit fonder for deps and their decision to take a break and work things out. While it leaves us twiddling our thumbs a bit... I'm using the time to find some more computer-free hobbies and I'm really looking forward to returning to Dan and Phil videos where both them and I are a little more at peace with ourselves.

I wanna get people's thoughts..... So, it's widely accepted Dan and Phil have 2 flats and we have our running theory that maybe they're getting rid of the "filming" one, but I keep wondering why they bothered to hide the fact that there were 2 in the first place? With enough clarity into what each flat was for, telling us that they were going to have a fliming space and separate living space would have been equally as reasonable as the explanation we got about them not dragging lights upstairs or whatever.

Now, if suddenly they're not filming in Phil's room or Dan's space or the gaming room, it's gonna be weird to have to explain that they just ~decided to change things up~. And what about like... baking? Will they use their actual kitchen?

Part of me just thinks they got into this pattern of lying about things here and there and so it seemed natural to just lie about the flat, but now it could bite them in the ass. And I guess this applies regardless of whether the filming space goes or not. What was the point? To not panic the phandom? idk bro. idk.

I agree about the pattern of lying but I also think keeping people guessing at first about the layout of the flat(s) was the easiest route for them to go to avoid having people figure out their address through floor plans and whatever (I think it was Dan who said in a liveshow something along the lines of don't even bother trying to figure out the layout/how many floors this place has? idk maybe I made that up). And yeah, not panicking the phandom too. I think lying about it worked to avoid having people think they lived separately since the amazingphil room is in the filming flat, and along those lines I think that maybe in 2017 they weren't 100% ready to blatantly put up the glass wall about the moon room. I guess with that I'm comparing it to them doing solo liveshows from the respective rooms and making more individually focused comments about the rooms versus that moment in witl where Phil's filming Dan in bed at 2 am (and of course the amazingphil room was nowhere to be seen in the entire video).

Slightly off from the question but I also want to say I don't think they're getting rid of the filming flat because their main thing when moving was storage and most of their shit from the last flat ended up in the filming flat, so if they're getting rid of it...where's their shit gonna go? (Unless they're getting rid of both which is the hill I'm dying on)

I rewatched the directors commentary yesterday as someone here mentioned the amazingphil as a martyr discussion dnp have in it and I also find that moment really interesting.

The dc always makes me think Dan should take a year or two and just go chill somewhere where no one knows him from YouTube. Do something other than share himself or his creations with an audience. The themes Dan describes relating to the audience and his relationship to the audience are just way too unhealthy.

With Phil I think it’s just about striking the right work-life balance, and I don't doubt he’s capable of that. With Dan I don’t know. He’s too much like those child actors who grow up sort of warped by their experience with fame.

Er, I don’t mean to hate on Dan here. I genuinely like both his personality and his creative content. I just seem to find a lot of what he says when he’s speaking honestly and at length (the dc, the mukbang) genuinely disturbing.

Swinging around to the whole ‘two apartments’ thing, I’m guessing it has to do with youtubers needing to seem unprofessional to be successful. I’m not very familiar with that but I think it’s been a theme in a few videos by popular youtubers, possibly one of the Greens? Saying they have a whole apartment that they don’t live in just for filming definitely puts them more in the land of wealthy professionals than relatable youtubers. I don’t think they’ve ever come straight out and lied about the second apartment either. They just refer to it as ‘downstairs,’ which based on the layouts, it probably is.

I wanna get people's thoughts..... So, it's widely accepted Dan and Phil have 2 flats and we have our running theory that maybe they're getting rid of the "filming" one, but I keep wondering why they bothered to hide the fact that there were 2 in the first place? With enough clarity into what each flat was for, telling us that they were going to have a fliming space and separate living space would have been equally as reasonable as the explanation we got about them not dragging lights upstairs or whatever.

Now, if suddenly they're not filming in Phil's room or Dan's space or the gaming room, it's gonna be weird to have to explain that they just ~decided to change things up~. And what about like... baking? Will they use their actual kitchen?

Part of me just thinks they got into this pattern of lying about things here and there and so it seemed natural to just lie about the flat, but now it could bite them in the ass. And I guess this applies regardless of whether the filming space goes or not. What was the point? To not panic the phandom? idk bro. idk.

Swinging around to the whole ‘two apartments’ thing, I’m guessing it has to do with youtubers needing to seem unprofessional to be successful. I’m not very familiar with that but I think it’s been a theme in a few videos by popular youtubers, possibly one of the Greens? Saying they have a whole apartment that they don’t live in just for filming definitely puts them more in the land of wealthy professionals than relatable youtubers. I don’t think they’ve ever come straight out and lied about the second apartment either. They just refer to it as ‘downstairs,’ which based on the layouts, it probably is.

Authenticity is also a big thing that seems to bring success to youtubers. And dnp seem to know that/have been learning that...so I imagine that them outright saying after they moved that they're going to film in a flat they don't even live in would kind of ruin that enjoyment for some? So maybe that's another reason they chose to hide it.

Rambling thoughts that @rizzo's excellent reflection on how intense 2018 and the ripples I've been seeing all over the internet community.

Since I work in the internet creator space, I feel like a running theme among my peers I've seen coming out of 2018/into 2019 is burnout/reorganization of priorities - especially realizing you're not bulletproof as you age. At the speaker dinner for an internet creator conference in November, I ended up talking with a 20-year-old youtuber who had just hit a million subs on the platform and was ALREADY burned out. Even PJ confessed to being burned out at the end of the year after producing a 6-week stage show (not even a 6-month stage show like our lads) losing his appendix and dealing with family stuff - and I see PJ as mainly being pretty stepped back from the hustle-content cycle a lot of other youtubers are on.

2018 I think exhausted everyone all over the world with way politics has been going; even people that looked like they had a lot of professional success on the outside were having to deal and process publicly with every thing going on in real time while also trying to do career stuff. Part of the big "self-care" trend has been a reaction to this environment.

Burnout at the end of 2018 is especially true, I think, of the old guard of youtube that went through all of 2018 with fresh demonetization and many hitting ~10 years on the platform - especially true of creators in their early 30's who realize they can't do it the way they could do it in their early 20's anymore. Many with kids/spouses/etc now who realize that maybe the youtube content treadmill with constantly changing algorithms just isn't sustainable. Even Shane moved into only series instead of posting every day like he did for 8? years.

Anyway, that was a long ramble. I don't think that DNP are necessarily completely burned out, but I think creative breaks are always good. That being said, since they're my hyperfixation escapism method, I've had to resort to doing actual work to fill my free time. Darn it.

For some reason today is the first time I took a step back from the immediacy of like, how I remembered each of these separate events, and realized that in 2018 Dan and Phil were on tour for like six months out of the year, Dan had a breakdown and stopped making videos alone, and Phil got so stressed out he actually passed out and was very briefly hospitalized.

I'm still not of the opinion that they 'deserve' a break more than anyone else who works hard - and I don't think that this is just purely a holiday from working. I believe them when they say it's them wanting to assess where they are and their goals/directions they're going in. But I think that perhaps the combination of their personal experiences and brushes with different flavors of burnout and hitting their own personal walls (of both mental and physical health) is behind the desire to regroup and keep engaged with what they're doing, and when I really contextualize what against what 2018 was for them I feel like acceptance is easier to grasp.

i really liked reading this cz it puts everything in a clearer perspective. their job as a public figure and a creator is already hard as it is, but they have to do it as both entertaining AND genuine. unfortunately, its easy for other people to take it for granted because either people put them on pedestals or forget the fact that theyre also humans that can make mistakes from time to time.

its a tough balancing act and i think they are slowly trying to find that sweet spot. theyve already started on tying all their loose ends and now they are on their resting period....im honestly kind of nervous yet excited as to what changes they are going to bring forth this year.

With Phil I think it’s just about striking the right work-life balance, and I don't doubt he’s capable of that. With Dan I don’t know. He’s too much like those child actors who grow up sort of warped by their experience with fame.

This part is interesting to me, I think you're right. It wouldn't be strange if Dan's view of success is very much connected to fame. For most people success means to be financially stable, with a safe living situation and good people around you. For someone who grew up adoring internet personalities and then stepped into that space at the age of 18, success to him probably involves being adored by strangers. To feel like your self worth is so connected to the opinion of millions must be exhausting.

For Phil I think that's a bit different, mostly because youtube was more a place to find friends that fans when he first started, and there really was no such thing as internet celebrities until he became on of them.

But this is obviously just theories of an outsider, what they really go through is just between them and their therapist/s

I just thought of something, and I know it's probably won't happen like it is in my head but..
To me, Dan and Phil seem to want to be more open, more honest. One thing that we have talked about the last year (and before that) is their communication with us. So, what if they start the year of with giving us some kind of update? In my head it's a video. But maybe it will be in some other format.

But either way, I would love to see them talk about their thoughts and the future, what do they want to be doing? What have they been doing? Only saying things they want to share, of course. But still include us more?

Saying they have a whole apartment that they don’t live in just for filming definitely puts them more in the land of wealthy professionals than relatable youtubers. I don’t think they’ve ever come straight out and lied about the second apartment either. They just refer to it as ‘downstairs,’ which based on the layouts, it probably is.

I agree and that's probably why they didn't say that they have an apartment they use for filming only. That and to prevent people coming up with "omg they live separately!11!!! " theories (although i still see people saying that every now and then, for some reason). I also agree with the fact that even though they didn't say anything, they technically never lied either; I don't recall an instance where they said they actually use the kitchen that's in the baking vids, for example. The only exception would be for the AP room but let's be real, it's not like Phil could have said that he used his bedroom only as a background for his videos. I think it's more of a 'we know they know we know' kind of situation, as it often is with them.

Speaking of the AP room, I wonder what will happen to it. Will Phil keep on filming there, even though he said he doesn't want to film in front of a bed anymore? Will he snap and just get rid of the bed (I wish) or will he change filming location altogether? But where else could he go? Or will he just keep on filming in the AP room until they move out in the next couple of months? So many questions.

Saying they have a whole apartment that they don’t live in just for filming definitely puts them more in the land of wealthy professionals than relatable youtubers. I don’t think they’ve ever come straight out and lied about the second apartment either. They just refer to it as ‘downstairs,’ which based on the layouts, it probably is.

I agree and that's probably why they didn't say that they have an apartment they use for filming only. That and to prevent people coming up with "omg they live separately!11!!! " theories (although i still see people saying that every now and then, for some reason). I also agree with the fact that even though they didn't say anything, they technically never lied either; I don't recall an instance where they said they actually use the kitchen that's in the baking vids, for example. The only exception would be for the AP room but let's be real, it's not like Phil could have said that he used his bedroom only as a background for his videos. I think it's more of a 'we know they know we know' kind of situation, as it often is with them.

Speaking of the AP room, I wonder what will happen to it. Will Phil keep on filming there, even though he said he doesn't want to film in front of a bed anymore? Will he snap and just get rid of the bed (I wish) or will he change filming location altogether? But where else could he go? Or will he just keep on filming in the AP room until they move out in the next couple of months? So many questions.

I think they're at a place where they could get an office space and be open about it. That gives Phil the opportunity to change his set without addressing the anything concerning bedrooms etc.
It would also further separate work and non-work and at the same time they would look more professional if they're seeking non-youtube work/projects. Basically a win-win.

IF they're moving soonish and IF they want a place to stay more longterm they really should keep that place more private. That's why I'm a bit confused about the whole "forever home" excitement. If I were them, I wouldn't want the phandom to know anything about a more permanent home. And even though they haven't really followed through at all, I think they wanted to keep their living spaces more private after the last move. So I'm assuming that would be an objective for them in the future as well.

So, a separate office space would not only be more professional (and good for their mental health), and it could give them a good opportunity to keep their (new) home a private place.

I think they're at a place where they could get an office space and be open about it. That gives Phil the opportunity to change his set without addressing the anything concerning bedrooms etc.
It would also further separate work and non-work and at the same time they would look more professional if they're seeking non-youtube work/projects. Basically a win-win.

IF they're moving soonish and IF they want a place to stay more longterm they really should keep that place more private. That's why I'm a bit confused about the whole "forever home" excitement. If I were them, I wouldn't want the phandom to know anything about a more permanent home. And even though they haven't really followed through at all, I think they wanted to keep their living spaces more private after the last move. So I'm assuming that would be an objective for them in the future as well.

So, a separate office space would not only be more professional (and good for their mental health), and it could give them a good opportunity to keep their (new) home a private place.

Do they want to be more professional, though? Questions keep popping up, lmao.
I'm gonna be honest here, I really hope they won't get offices outside their future house. This is a purely selfish thought and dnp should absolutely do what it's best for them but from my perspective they would end up alienating their audience. I'm saying this because sometimes I feel (just a little bit) detached even now whenever they film in the kitchen or in Phil's bedroom, or even in one of the bathrooms in the filming flat. I loved their old apartment because it was familiar, it was their actual home and I felt a bit closer to them. I loved the domestic atmosphere of it all, and it's something that it's missing in their current apartment.
All the other youtubers I follow film in their own houses while mantaining their privacy successfully, so I think that dnp could do that as well, if that's something they want to do.