Keep hearing from lots of people that he deserves more time at 10. Today proved why he doesn't. We lost control of the game when Smith went off. His passing in particular was laboured and telegraphed. Understandable why Smith played 80 mins last week when we won at the Ricoh and we would have won this week if he'd stayed on.

A bit harsh to single him out, I know, but I really think we suffered because Smith broke.

Smith's kicking from hand is still a worry, he's losing us a lot of territory there. Much happier with his general control of the game though, he's settled in nicely to our attacking patterns and is really noticeable in general play.

I'm sure Tim would be fine if he had game time actually playing at 10. As it is, young Smith has grown into the position & we do now look very fluent with him. We seemed to lose it today when Robshaw went off, he's the glue that holds us together. Scrums were awful today. Disappointing loss.

QuinAlanI'm sure Tim would be fine if he had game time actually playing at 10. As it is, young Smith has grown into the position & we do now look very fluent with him. We seemed to lose it today when Robshaw went off, he's the glue that holds us together. Scrums were awful today. Disappointing loss.

Except he had as much pre season as Smith and didn't hit the ground running in the same way.

QuinAlanI'm sure Tim would be fine if he had game time actually playing at 10. As it is, young Smith has grown into the position & we do now look very fluent with him. We seemed to lose it today when Robshaw went off, he's the glue that holds us together. Scrums were awful today. Disappointing loss.

Except he had as much pre season as Smith and didn't hit the ground running in the same way.

Er, no. Swiel and Catrakilis both missed pre-season games with injury. Smith & Lang played the majority of pre-season games.

Swiel is a good choice to have on the bench. He covers FB and FH. He is quick so he can cover wing and I think he has played at centre during an a league game. But, he is behind Lang in terms of quality at FH. This game is the first time this season that he had played at FH. He missed pre season and played at FB in a league.
I think that having no a league last Monday hurt us. Some players looked short of game time.

QuinAlanI'm sure Tim would be fine if he had game time actually playing at 10. As it is, young Smith has grown into the position & we do now look very fluent with him. We seemed to lose it today when Robshaw went off, he's the glue that holds us together. Scrums were awful today. Disappointing loss.

Except he had as much pre season as Smith and didn't hit the ground running in the same way.

Er, no. Swiel and Catrakilis both missed pre-season games with injury. Smith & Lang played the majority of pre-season games.

Just checked as it's not how I remembered it and Swiel started against Bristol and was involved against Irish. Smith started against Jersey.

He then fell behind Catrikilis and came back on the bench as an unused sub for Wasps. Also saw him in all the pre-season video (e.g. at the adidas centre). So not a valid excuse.

Swiel has a very good skill set and is a useful utility back. He wasn't a game changer yesterday; he did however come on in place of the excellent Smith, and it was his first proper rugby after an injury, and a few runouts in the A-league, albeit in a different position.

He's shown previously that he can play well at 10, especially after a run of games.

Well, they tend to be fiercely one eyed. They either have a single item they wish to ram down people's throat "JK out" "David Ellis out" "Everyone currently managing the club out" or they're general irritations that just try and post negative stuff to get a reaction. From the title this looks like a "David Ellis out" type, with the "trying to be as negative as possible so we can sack DE" approach. Best ignored if you can.

Just saw the other post on Lambo - well beyond the pale, so gone in this particular incarnation.

DOKWell, they tend to be fiercely one eyed. They either have a single item they wish to ram down people's throat "JK out" "David Ellis out" "Everyone currently managing the club out" or they're general irritations that just try and post negative stuff to get a reaction. From the title this looks like a "David Ellis out" type, with the "trying to be as negative as possible so we can sack DE" approach. Best ignored if you can.
Just saw the other post on Lambo - well beyond the pale, so gone in this particular incarnation.

Back to Cookie's original thread. If Lang has had game time so far at 10, how would he shape up in the first team? Only seen him play once so cant comment. Is he on a level with Swiel & Catrakilis? If so then should he get some starts? What does he bring to our game that might be different? Genuine question.

RockerA bit harsh I feel. Didn't Swiel put in an excellent performance last year (?) in Ireland

That's right Rocker, people on here have short memories. Swiel has put in some excellent performances for us before and now he comes on in a game where we were staring to go backwards and it's all his fault!

It's very hard to tell whether it was Robshaw or Smith going off which had the most significant impact. Certainly we seemed to lose our composure - which often seems to be the case when Swiel comes on, we tend to go a bit headless chicken. But alos our defensive alignment went to pieces as did our tackling - is that down to defensive organisation from 10, or a lack of 2 Robshaws tackling evrything in sight?

Overall I'd say it was a very enjoyable game of rugby from two sides with attacking intent who were evenly matched. Our lack of back row depth and general weakness off the bench was probably the deciding factor, although I do feel that over the 80 minutes we suffered a little more than Leicester at the hands of a ref who was woefully out of his depth.

Positives, Marcus Smith, Mike Brown much improved, good effort around the park from both locks

Negatives : Robshaw injury, lack of impact from bench, mullered in the scrums, more dopiness at lineout.

In short, the script hasn't changed much, and we'll probably go into the last match of the season with no silverware, but a shot at finishing 6th.

CookieBig fan of Luamanu once he sorted his tackling out. He's carrying is strong and made all his tackles v Tigers.
He's been one of the biggest plusses in 2017 and I genuinely think Bothma will struggle to get the jersey off him when fit.

I like Luamanu at 8, and he took his try well, but the guy needs to get back to where he was a few years ago and shed some pounds.
He scored tries like that every week when he played in the ITM cup.

Luamanu has improved considerably with more game time this season. At first his handling was dire and he looked unfit, but he has been much improved. Watching the Wasps game back, I hadn't realised at the time how often he was the receiver when we were running down the clock, and didn't let us down.

CookieBig fan of Luamanu once he sorted his tackling out. He's carrying is strong and made all his tackles v Tigers.
He's been one of the biggest plusses in 2017 and I genuinely think Bothma will struggle to get the jersey off him when fit.

I know you've taken agin Bothma generally, but whilst I agree that Luamanu has started the season well, I'm looking forward to seeing Bothma and whether he can challenge for that position. We've lacked depth in so many positions for a few years, and it will be great to have a couple of decent options at 8 once Bothma is back.

Not sure it's always good to have an obvious 'first team' and I'd much rather have a squad like Exeter where lots of players can step into the first team and do a job.

I haven't been a fan of Luamanu, but I loved his try. Everything about it.

Turnover possession.
The lightning reaction of Smith to put Yarde away in the first place.
That Yarde kept the ball alive and got his pass away in the tackle.
And the - what was it? - 30 or 40 yards of Luamanu galumphing to the line, fending off the faster defender, getting there and getting the ball down without losing it forward.

RockerA bit harsh I feel. Didn't Swiel put in an excellent performance last year (?) in Ireland

That's right Rocker, people on here have short memories. Swiel has put in some excellent performances for us before and now he comes on in a game where we were staring to go backwards and it's all his fault!

Start him at 10 for a few games and it'll all be forgotten.

He really hasn't. He's put in one decent performance as a starter and that's about it.

My view on him has been consistent because he hasn't really done anything to cause me to change it, so the accusations of short memories is wide of the mark.

We record all IP addresses on the Sportnetwork message boards which may be required by the authorities in case of defamatory or abusive comment.
We seek to monitor the Message Boards at regular intervals.
We do not associate Sportnetwork with any of the comments and do not take responsibility for any statements or opinions expressed on the Message Boards.
If you have any cause for concern over any material posted here please let us know as soon as possible by e-mailing
abuse@sportnetwork.net