Paragon wrote:...Hugh has already responded to this and while he is right for the most part there is one thing he forgot. If the person you are a white phantom for gets invaded by a spirit of vengeance, you are not allowed to help the host fight the SoV...

Iris may be gone, but i believe we should remain as close to precedent as possible.

Hugh_G_Johnson wrote:...The normal rules for no ganking and no killing darkmoons apply...

That's what I meant by no killing Darkmoons. However, I realized this is actually too broad. It's possible a red could use DMB, thus identifying themselves as a Darkmoon. These misguided Darkmoons are to be quickly destroyed for their own good. The less time they're in the host's world; the less chance that something goes wrong and the host dies potentially giving sin to the Darkmoon. As ever pray/prostrate for them. Paragon is right to say SoV rather than Darkmoon.

I agree about maintaining precedence; I thought of that rule while making the OP and the only reason I didn't put it in was because Sword didn't. Though; I don't mind taking the liberty to mention we should make sure to kill any red who happens to be a DMB.

Paragon wrote:If you make it too low it severely limits the options available to the players. Ultimately these events are a matter of interpersonal respect between the players. One might earn a lot of points or the like from one shot builds, but they wont earn any respect from it. And it doesnt matter how much some one pretends they dont care about respect, the only two things that matter in multiplayer games are fun and respect. Anyone who cares too much about one rather than both obviously has some issues in real life that they need to work out. As such, rather than restricting players with rules that make them feel weighed down, using a very conservative set of rules to guide the spirit of the event will encourage players to be reasonable with their builds and hopefully steer them away from builds that ruin the fun for everybody.

Paragon has it right. The Guerrilla Event the Exiled hosts has few rules yet most players when left to their own devices have shown respect and restraint. Most are there for the fun and the hysterical laughs that can erupt over the oddest occurrences.

Only a few have come in with the "one-hit" mentality. Interestingly enough they don't find the event fun. Hmmmm, food for thought....perhaps.

However, due to some past occurrences I will need to put in to place a only a few restrictions. Sadly.But the bottomline is most people will honor and respect others and come to the event with the fun to be had in mind!!

As for low level builds...I love challenge builds. Rather then looking at them as limiting I find them simply unforgiving in that they limit the mistakes you can make and get away with.

meh it was just an idea if people really don't like fighting one shots. and yeah i don't think to many people would actually use them for events. Personally i prefer the lvl 100 area, but the important thing is having fun. also u can still do a lot with a lvl 30 just gotta be careful were u put those points.

To some extent I feel the concept is designed for OP builds. Hyper-mode or buff builds would actually be at a pretty big disadvantage. Even a dark bead build should have trouble dealing with three people. I'm thinking any super-OP 1-shot build would have the tendency to grab people's attention and may prove to be counter-productive.

Speaking of events; did anyone notice my idea for a new location for the fencing event (on top of the aqueduct in the beginning of the undead burg)? Any thoughts?

Don't forget tonight is the deadline for the 1st ever EotW (less than 12 hours)! I have two more submissions:

The accomplice also pays the price:

I spawn in Dark Anor Londo on the side of the first gargoyle fight at the beginning. The host is summon as I load; I grass & buff aiming to off this guy before his help shows. He turtles and I'm unable to do much more than chip damage before the white arrives. Of course the host immeditately backs off and circles trying to flank me. I run for the stairs to that precious no-BS sanctuary. I buff and ready myself. The white is a mage and approaches with HCSM. I decide to stick to the plan and hope wog can deflect the soul masses. The wog catches both, but I eat some damage. The host is feeling frisky now that he has help and comes at me -- well, almost -- he tries to BS me, LOL. It's hilarious how many people don't know you can't on those stairs. I turn and go to town on him with my claymore (the white is literally out of the picture after getting blown away by the wog). The host staggers and appears to die as the white returns to action, but I take one last swipe to be sure.

Much to my dismay, not only was that last swing unnecessary but it got me hit by a dark bead. I roll through another one, but catch another and my HP bar basically vanishes. It turns out I have a faint sliver left, though. Normally, I'm trying to kill phantoms after a host death, but at this point I'm just trying to stay alive and deny the white any satisfaction. The white moves towards me, amazingly I'm still able to cast a wog. It lands and the white dies! The HP check reveals 19!

FYI -- I've noticed you seem to be able to cast spells longer after a host's death than you can do normal attacks. Although you're unable to do anything a certain length of time after a host's death, you're able to act again for a second or two right before you load back to your world. I know you can access your menu (that's how I did the HP check) and I'm fairly certain you can do anything else you normally could do as well.

Being thorough finally pays off:

Dark Anor Londo again, I spawn by a missing staircase. I retrieve the stairs and head down to the Darkmoon Tomb bonfire room... nobody's hiding around the corner. I always check by the fog just in case someone has the fog ring on or something, no -- no one has ever been down there hiding with the fog ring on. A few have been down there apparently waiting for a sign to show, though. I look down -- nothing. I go to check the fog and *jawdrop* there's a faint figure standing still half way down the stairs!! It doesn't move as I approach, so I keep going like I can't see it. I go by then quickly turn and BS the guy! LOL -- I'm sssooooo glad I tried that instead of going right up to him! He immediately spams roll meaning he was not AFK and is in fact another victim of a Hugh counter-troll.

Not only was he not AKF, but he dropped about 12,500 souls after I quickly finished him without taking damage. So, he was SL 138! I was SL 125, for what it's worth. Sometimes people with the fog ring on are low SL and just trying to avoid a straight up fight. This guy just got out-trolled!

For the fencing event locations I say the area to Ceaseless Discharge, the bridge connecting the towers with the bloated hollows in the PW, even the area with the hellkite dragon in the parish can work.

The deadline for submissions for EotW has passed. I have updated the EotW page with this week's candidates. Anyone can vote and Paragon & I must vote (but not for ourselves) since we've submitted. Go ahead and vote in the thread; either it's not serious enough to warrant a private ballot or it's serious enough to need more than one person counting votes -- take your pick. I've also added the spoiler to this post.

My vote (of course) is for Paragon's "Slow Speed Chase". Please vote! Remember also, to vote for 1st, 2nd & 3rd. I could not, since only one submission was not mine.

Inaugural EotW Candidates:

The Free Lesson:

Hugh_G_Johnson wrote:I spawn in the Great Hall in Dark AL. I usually check outside first, the stairs are down so I check it out. Someone else invades right before I get to Gwyn's tomb, I don't hear the spawn but I check anyway -- nobody there. Back up and to the Great Hall I go. I spot the other invader; it's a blue with the fog ring on. I try to get his back, since he's probably checked a few places I figure he's got a better idea where to look at this point. But, he's acting erratic, so I leave him and head to the bonfire -- but he follows me. I use some grass because I don't want to have to stop to do it (especially since I'll buff first anyway, if I have the time) and odds are the host will either be very close or nowhere to be found. The blue starts swinging at me with some kind of dagger (I think Priscilla's). So, I figure screw this guy... each man for himself. I leave him again and head to the spot I wanted to check next anyway... the ledge. I get to the top of the stairs up and I notice the blue has followed me again. :00011:So I pull out my gold tracer and slash at him a few times (I totally won). I go out (the blue leaves me finally), nothing doing... I pop a humanity to top off the fall damage and I notice the gate to the Giant Blacksmith is locked (that's a big no-no, I always open shortcuts when possible -- never know when I or a future invader will need it) and re-enter the hall. The blue is on the side stairs standing around, I race up towards the Blacksmith... but notice a green haze atop the stairs! The host! He heads for the ledge and goes out, clearly not seeing me (I guess he was investigating my fall damage -- a little late, pal). I ready the wog, finally I catch up and he turns around just in time to catch a wog that knocks him off -- I follow with a plunge. The other blue shows up in time to see me kneeling in prayer over my victim. That's how ya do it, jerk! :PAlthough, in writing this I realize he must have opened the shortcut to the Blacksmith... so well done to him for that at least.

Slow Speed Chase:

Paragon wrote:...one particular poor unlucky sod stood out. He was wearing full paladin's, grass crest shield, and quelagg's fury sword. When i find him he's fighting off a couple of crystal golems and doing a really poor job of it. As soon as he sees me he disengages from the golems and starts "sprinting" to the caves. I use the term sprinting here very loosely because while he was going as fast as he could, he was fat rolling.

I chased after him, expecting to pivot and attack me. He never did. Once I got close enough i did a running r1 with my sunlight straight sword (guess who i was cosplaying) and did about 500 damage. After the first hit I was sure he'd realise his only option was to fight. NOPE, dumb *** just keeps fat running.

Undeterred i chase him down and hit him two more times with the running r1, he dies right as he reaches the caves. I prostrated before his corpse.

I literally felt so bad after killing the poor idiot that when i invaded him again later. (I ran into him at the kiln) that I gave him his ear back.

.... and then i killed him again.

The accomplice also pays the price:

Hugh_G_Johnson wrote:I spawn in Dark Anor Londo on the side of the first gargoyle fight at the beginning. The host is summon as I load; I grass & buff aiming to off this guy before his help shows. He turtles and I'm unable to do much more than chip damage before the white arrives. Of course the host immeditately backs off and circles trying to flank me. I run for the stairs to that precious no-BS sanctuary. I buff and ready myself. The white is a mage and approaches with HCSM. I decide to stick to the plan and hope wog can deflect the soul masses. The wog catches both, but I eat some damage. The host is feeling frisky now that he has help and comes at me -- well, almost -- he tries to BS me, LOL. It's hilarious how many people don't know you can't on those stairs. I turn and go to town on him with my claymore (the white is literally out of the picture after getting blown away by the wog). The host staggers and appears to die as the white returns to action, but I take one last swipe to be sure.

Much to my dismay, not only was that last swing unnecessary but it got me hit by a dark bead. I roll through another one, but catch another and my HP bar basically vanishes. It turns out I have a faint sliver left, though. Normally, I'm trying to kill phantoms after a host death, but at this point I'm just trying to stay alive and deny the white any satisfaction. The white moves towards me, amazingly I'm still able to cast a wog. It lands and the white dies! The HP check reveals 19!

FYI -- I've noticed you seem to be able to cast spells longer after a host's death than you can do normal attacks. Although you're unable to do anything a certain length of time after a host's death, you're able to act again for a second or two right before you load back to your world. I know you can access your menu (that's how I did the HP check) and I'm fairly certain you can do anything else you normally could do as well.

Being thorough finally pays off:

Hugh_G_Johnson wrote:Dark Anor Londo again, I spawn by a missing staircase. I retrieve the stairs and head down to the Darkmoon Tomb bonfire room... nobody's hiding around the corner. I always check by the fog just in case someone has the fog ring on or something, no -- no one has ever been down there hiding with the fog ring on. A few have been down there apparently waiting for a sign to show, though. I look down -- nothing. I go to check the fog and *jawdrop* there's a faint figure standing still half way down the stairs!! It doesn't move as I approach, so I keep going like I can't see it. I go by then quickly turn and BS the guy! LOL -- I'm sssooooo glad I tried that instead of going right up to him! He immediately spams roll meaning he was not AFK and is in fact another victim of a Hugh counter-troll.

Not only was he not AKF, but he dropped about 12,500 souls after I quickly finished him without taking damage. So, he was SL 138! I was SL 125, for what it's worth. Sometimes people with the fog ring on are low SL and just trying to avoid a straight up fight. This guy just got out-trolled!

While I like reading the entries and votes Free lesson, Being Thorough and Slow speed it would be good to have more members join and submit there entries in the future weeks of this. The advantages are good we just need more people to submit theirs.

Jolly good! Thank you for your participation in EotW. Hopefully someone else will vote, so I can win we can have a winner. Ok -- ninja'd in a good way. Thanks, for voting Iceman -- I expect an entry form you this week. We're now taking submissions for this week as well, btw.

Also; I finally got around to writing up a handbook entry on Dark Anor Londo:

Dark Anor Londo:

First, the preliminaries: I suggest equipping the covenant ring in the right ring slot (it's easier to change that way). You can move a breakable ring if needed by selecting the ring you want to move in the slot you want it to be in (it will leave the old slot empty). Remember to switch the covenant ring out. I've noticed that I seem to lose invasions if I take it off early, so I wait for "as a dark spirit" to flash at least twice.

Upon arrival, take in your surroundings immediately. And never stop paying attention to your surroundings. There are tons of people who hide and only look to back-stab in dark AL. Keep your head on a swivel and move erratically through dangerous areas (most of dark AL). I recommend using a soul mass spell if you're on an int build while searching for the host. Many times I've noticed someone trying to sneak up on me and got an easy kill by turning and hitting R1 2 or 3 times. It also will alert you to someone you can't see at times. The exception would be if I see a red. I never engage anyone who isn't the host unless necessary, especially if I don't know where the host is. That includes reds, hosts summon friendly reds and use them as bait or a distraction to land hornet back-stabs. I love killing reds and phantoms, but I don't get ears for that and I won't do anything to reduce my odds of collecting an ear.

Pay attention to where you spawn; there are basically 3 spawn locations (two are about 8 feet from each other). The first is at the beginning before the moving staircase and it covers the area outside until the moving stairs and inside the painting room (rafters & ground floor). The second is on the other side of the moving stairs. It covers the area outside past the stairs (but not the area outside the Giant Blacksmith room), including the archer area and the Darkmoon Tomb bonfire room. The last is just inside the Great Hall it covers all of inside and the area immediately outside the Giant Blacksmith room.

The first location is a popular spawn-gank spot. Some gankers think to leave the staircase down so you can't go that way. If you're mid-rolling your best bet is likely to fight it out, if you're fast-rolling look for and opportunity (ASAP usually) to escape the other side and head to the rafters. If they chase go ahead and use gravity, but don't count on that. I bring the stairs back down and try to fight on the stairs so they can't back-stab me (nod to Sword for his mention of this important fact in his contribution on AL) . If nobody is there, check the chest with the demon titanite. That's a popular spot for dark AL summoning.

The second location often means the host is at the Darkmoon bonfire, especially if the stairs are down -- the host can warp there directly though, so the stairs don't have to be down. Keep in mind if the host is hiding on the ledge in front of the façade in front of the Great Hall, you will spawn here. I've noticed quite a few trolls doing this lately. Other clues would be items near ledges (I saw one trying to snipe w/a great bow), broken pots (previous invaders got desperate), a phantom who was there before you seems frustrated (shrugs, searching in weird spots…), arch tree carving spam when you're visible to anyone up there and not being able to find the host anywhere else.

When approaching the Darkmoon bonfire room grass while your outside. If you're on a buff build use resin (it's better than nothing and won't waste your buff). Just accept that if there's anyone down there that you're going to get jumped by at least one person waiting around the corner -- you won't have time to grass or buff later. Listen and be ready to run from firestorm or twop. If you can see the host don't let your guard down -- he could still have a phantom. Especially if he gestures; that's a guarantee he has a phantom and I won't even bother charging in without help. Let them come to you or wait for help. When you do go into the bonfire room run and jump so you can't be back-stabbed on entry and immediately rotate your camera 180 degrees.

A few more things to watch for: don't be too anxious to help reds who are engaged with the host when you show. You might just get yourself ganked. If the fighting is half-hearted and/or the damage seems low, especially, that's another sign of one of those friendly-red trap-ganks. Many hosts love to run and do the quick turn lag Back-stab. Take precautions to avoid that; running R1s with spears or rapiers are good (rapiers less so because they're shorter and can easily be poise-stabbed). Chasing unlocked off to the side is the only way to truly avoid any danger of a lag-stab. Usually, I like to find and engage the hosts ASAP. However in Dark AL it's not always practical or necessary (less enemies and most are not questing). Sometimes it's best to wait for help or try to wait until you can fight on your terms. Usually that means reducing or eliminating the possibility of being back-stabbed. I try to fight on the stairs as often as possible; all critical attacks are impossible there. That means while you can get parried, you cannot be riposted so, there is much less deterent to R1 spam.

Use the environment. Host hiding on the ledge? Knock him off and do a plunge attack. Many of the stationary stairs in AL switch back… if you can't catch up, wait & wog. You can jump the rails on the double spiral stairs inside in multiple spots. Use this to escape, chase or cut off an escape. Annoying gankers working well together and not letting you finish the other off? Retreat to Painting to heal and for help, and maybe stall long enough to get another blue for help… go to the rafters. I actually like to go to the divine blessing spot when the really hit the fan.

Yeah, duels and 1v1s are at best tough to describe with words for the most part. But, if anything comes up... and yeah, gank-hunting is much better for this. Put that ring on, Iceman! Thank you for voting, though. I really wanted to make sure I won we had a winner the first week.

I have a good invasion story for this week, but I think I'll keep it in my pocket just in case I get some better ones.

I want to join your club! Met Hugh a while back in some forest pvp, and later on he introduced me to Paragon..pvp'ed, sparred and also did some co-ops with them.. Not much else to say than that i hope to join you soon in your hunt for sinners!

Nosferatu; start your scouting missions out in the Demon Ruins since we've already kinda welcomed you in with the Painted World. We had a little mini-FC there last night. I do quite like that location for MoV exercises (the open area by where Jeremiah invades), it would be perfect if I left the Velka statue facing us. I called it 'troll FC' because Nosferatu and Paragon kept poisoning each other. BTW, Paragon; did that 'pro' invader (who died immediately) spawn on the bridge? He should have spawned in the annex or in front of it. I was sure I had been in the Phalanx area the whole time.

@Godzilla -- Enjoy your vacation, can't wait to hear your stories when you get back to hunting.

I invade dark AL and spawn where the 1st gargoyle fight is. I see a white tank and it looks like the host is standing shoulder to should with him just barely on the stairs, but the host is difficult to make out in dark armor at a distance. It becomes apparent I was seeing things when the stairs go up. Oh, boy... the stairs come back down before I start to seriously consider leaving (not very long). The white hangs back a bit, but the host is not intimidated by my HCSM and meets me head-on. He eats a few of them and I try to combo a CSS, but he goes for a futile roll-stab (I'm just on the stairs). I turn and go to town with my MLGS. Finally, he escapes the stun-lock with a sliver of HP and begins roll-spamming. I don't even bother switching to my rapier, I kill him standing on the crack where the stairs join the solid walkway. Right as the host dies I hear the switch for the stairs. I step forward to make sure I don't fall. The host is dead and the white is about 3 steps away from me (best Ganker NA) -- yet there goes the staircase. I start spamming CSSs at the white desperately trying to kill him before I load out. He's unable or unwilling to stop it and I'm actually able to get off 3 CSSs and kill him. Right after he dies the mysterious switch operator shows up (these guys have really bad timing). It turns out not only are they trolling with the stair switch (trying to, anyway -- I think I was meant to fall the first time they pulled the switch, too), but they're using the super-scumbag summon a friendly red tactic.

Sorry for not getting back to you Hugh. I have been a bit "out of it" for the last few days and I'm still not quite "in it". Rl kinda sucks atm...so running around in the Fallout Wastelands seems even more apropo. Haha!!

Hey Nosferatu. Can i stick to calling you Neb, or should i shorten your forum name into Nos. I typically like to refer to people on the forums with as little formality as possible. Helps keep the community tight. Go ahead and let us know what you wanna be called and we will be sure to respect your wishes

As for my self, I go by either Luvz or Para. My other nicknames include luvzy, paragade, and porygon. Feel free to take your pick, i luvz(tm) 'em all