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Read this if you want to keep this forum

Once again a pirated full length video was posted in the daddies forum. While some newbies often do not read the rules, I expect regulars to know the rules and at least report the post. This works fine for the rest of the forums, but for some reason not here. You all cried loud when this forum was abandoned, and today I tell you if there are any more incidents like this one, we will close the forum for good.

Re: Read this if you want to keep this forum

I think most people only report posts that they find personally offending and expect the moderators to watch over this place.

Also i dont think there is a "you" here.
A bunch of people from all over the world are posting in this subforum because they have somewhat similar interests. That doesnt make them a "you" that can be adressed or "punished" as a whole.

Re: Read this if you want to keep this forum

If this is indeed because of copyright violation, then perhaps we need to no longer be allowed to embed youtube videos that show entire music videos. I don't say that to be snarky--it's a very real issue, and if you think porn owners are vicious about pursuing copyright violations, the RIAA is even worse.

I only check this forum every once in a while, but the vast majority of the threads here don't seem to have anything to do with sharing porn videos. Posting of other copyright protected materials is rampant in other threads all over the place. I guess I won't be posting any more youtube videos of other artists' songs, videos or other original materials, since this is an issue JUB would want to enforce equally everywhere.

Re: Read this if you want to keep this forum

youtube videos are not a problem, the RIAA knows to go to youtube if there is a problem. the porn industry however comes to us. we are not talking about the usual RT, xtube or whatever clips here, but about full scenes or even entire porn movies being posted here.
this board partly relies on self-policing and this is working quite good so far. except in this forum, where during the past months we regularly had to remove a lot of full length movies which nobody reported and even regulars obviously saw because they were posting in the threads.
it's not that the same people post movies all the time, often it are newbies. so if we ban them right away, it would not change much - plus we rather don't want to ban newbies for one mistake.

Re: Read this if you want to keep this forum

Originally Posted by marleyisalegend

^Only if the owner of the material doesn't want it embedded. If I recorded a porno today and uploaded it and every single JUBer embedded on a different site, you'd hear no complaints from me. Free exposure!

That scenario hinges upon permission. Not turning off embedding does not necessarily imply permission. These issues are going to be plaguing courts and internet users for years to come.

Re: Read this if you want to keep this forum

Oh ok see thats what first came to mind but then i was like well if there "homemade" lol i couldn't see a problem.

The rules apply only to copyrighted material. Material you produce would be subject to whatever conditions you would impose on it.

Originally Posted by Killjoke

If this is indeed because of copyright violation, then perhaps we need to no longer be allowed to embed youtube videos that show entire music videos. I don't say that to be snarky--it's a very real issue, and if you think porn owners are vicious about pursuing copyright violations, the RIAA is even worse.

I only check this forum every once in a while, but the vast majority of the threads here don't seem to have anything to do with sharing porn videos. Posting of other copyright protected materials is rampant in other threads all over the place. I guess I won't be posting any more youtube videos of other artists' songs, videos or other original materials, since this is an issue JUB would want to enforce equally everywhere.

When you start paying the retainer that JD & Seth pay for their attorney, and assume equal liability for damages, then perhaps we could overlook your snarky post.

Originally Posted by Killjoke

So, the issue is not so much copyright violation as it is about whether or not the owners of the material are likely to complain?

I don't envy Seth, JD or anyone who works for them in figuring out where to draw the line on this issue.

Nor do I. This being a gay porn site, and one which derives ad revenue from the gay porn companies, I can see why they would be more troubled by pirated content from gay porn sites than the latest Celine Dion song.

Originally Posted by The General

Didn't know a full length movie had been posted to be honest. The title "Daddy-Son Video Clips" was enough to keep me from clicking on it. Not my cup of tea so I left it alone.

Sorry. Will try and be more vigilant next time.

Hopefully we'll be able to delete it so that you don't have to see it. If we appear to have missed it then please send in a post report. What I miss another mod may spot, but there are never any guarantees. Mods are just volunteers here, so sometimes we may have real life issues we have to attend to.

Re: Read this if you want to keep this forum

we have something like that - it's called infractions. Only they will see them though. And even that is too much for many people, it's unfair, unjust, discriminating and what else we have heard over the years People don't like being reminded of their mistakes, if this were public for everybody to see we probably wouldn't ever stop discussing for every warning we give out

Re: Read this if you want to keep this forum

I'm not reading this whole thread, just the first post... but what the fuck? If you just delete this whole forum just because some jack ass decided to post copyrighted material, you're out of your fucking mind. Punish everyone in this section because of one dude? Wow. Just ban that member, and delete the thread. Easy enough.

Re: Read this if you want to keep this forum

Originally Posted by Corny

if you are unable or unwilling to read and comprehend a thread, do not make assumptions.

Don't insult my intelligence, I simply stated that I did not read the entire thread, at least at that point. I read your main body, which was enough for me to make my assumptions. If you didn't want people to make assumptions, maybe you should have made everything crystal clear in your original post.

Re: Read this if you want to keep this forum

Originally Posted by Fat Tom

Don't insult my intelligence, I simply stated that I did not read the entire thread, at least at that point. I read your main body, which was enough for me to make my assumptions. If you didn't want people to make assumptions, maybe you should have made everything crystal clear in your original post.

I suggest you sit back and chill.

The opening words in the original post, 'Once again' clearly means that it has happened before and therefore the most recent incident was a repeat.

This all happens in the Opening Post. Now, which part of that wasn't crystal clear?

I'm sorry if you find our tone offensive, patronising or insulting - however the gently gently approach seems to have fallen on deaf ears, and ocassionally we have to resort to a blanket in yer face 'Principle's Office' tone.

Instead of trying to blame your assumptions on a volunteer Site Administrator, your energy would be much better appreciated in assisting us - by use of the Report Post button - whenever you even suspect that something may be in breach of our Video Policy.

This is something that happens in the other forums, but in this forum the silence is deafening!

Again, I'm sorry if the tone is aggresive, but it seems that it is the only way we can get members to react in this forum.

Re: Read this if you want to keep this forum

If I can be brutally honest for a moment, we DO need someone to take a leadership role in this forum. And I would welcome anyone to contact me or one of the other mods if that is something that would interest any of you.

This is a very popular forum. It's like the 4th or 5th most popular forum on the entire board on any given day. And on most of those days at least half of the people in this forum are newbies with 10 posts or less posting pirated content.

Most of the posts in this forum are very brief and not very insightful in determining who is here for the pirated content, and who is here for discussion of Daddies & Bears, as well as content that is allowed.

To be clear, we're not talking about a picture here and a rapidshare link there. We're talking wholesale copyright infringment of full movies and clips from sites that regularly advertise on here.

Fat Tom, I can safely eliminate you from any consideration. And I'll also promise you a forum ban from this forum if your attitude does not improve.

We are not playing. Now, I wish I knew each and everyone of you personally, and could make some recommendations. But I don't know many of you. So anyone interested in taking a leadership role, please contact me or one of the other mods.

Re: Read this if you want to keep this forum

Originally Posted by snapcat

Fat Tom, I can safely eliminate you from any consideration. And I'll also promise you a forum ban from this forum if your attitude does not improve.

We are not playing. Now, I wish I knew each and everyone of you personally, and could make some recommendations. But I don't know many of you. So anyone interested in taking a leadership role, please contact me or one of the other mods.

Again...I'm new here and quite frankly don't care if I'm "stepping on toes" here, but um...that response to Fat Tom sounds to me as though you are saying "If I don't like something you say, I'll ban you because I'm the moderator"

Re: Read this if you want to keep this forum

Ok let's calm down a bit again please.
BillyBear, friendliness can go a long way, but after a few months trying to fix a problem the nice way, I am about done with that. The video posting rules in this thread were made just in response for what was going on in this very forum. But not much has changed since September. If the visitors here don't want to change something - we need to.
But the fact that we are discussing here that if it is right or not that we get that outspoken on the matter, and not that the visitors of this forum discuss what might be wrong here, shows that there seems to be not that much interest in solving the problem.

Re: Read this if you want to keep this forum

Originally Posted by BillyBear

Again...I'm new here and quite frankly don't care if I'm "stepping on toes" here, but um...that response to Fat Tom sounds to me as though you are saying "If I don't like something you say, I'll ban you because I'm the moderator"

That's pretty poor.

To be fair, we're trying to protect the whole site here, and this forum is the area that is letting us down with regard to video sharing and piracy. The inactivity of members within the forum to report piracy is making participants here look complicit in the copyright breaching.

With regard to Fat Tom, we don't ban someone just because they might disagree with us - hell, differences of opinion keeps this place active! We just don't appreciate people pissing on our efforts and criticising us for daring to be pro-active in keeping the site open.

You won't find this kind of brutal attitude from us mods anywhere else on the site - which says a lot about this forum.

Bottom line is, if we have to cut off a limb to save the body, we'll cut off a limb!

Re: Read this if you want to keep this forum

BillyBear, you can be part of the problem or you can be part of the solution.

I'll be happy to show you the door if you find our effort to enforce the rules to be objectionable.

I never said I would not enforce or follow the rules. And if there are FAIR rules to a forum and a member disregards them...then that is cause for suspension/banning. So the statement "if you find out efforts to enforce....." is completely irrelevant because I never said I wouldn't.

If you have a rule for copyrighted material, etc...and people still post...then I totally agree, that's a problem and it puts the forum, and probably justusboys as a whole in jeopardy and we don't want that.

I just get tired of the "I'm the moderator and you'll listen to me you peon" attitude some of them tend to have. I got banned before from a website, literally because I am a democrat and a couple of the mods were completely right wing.

I'll gladly follow rules here, but I won't put up with the attitude that some people tend to have. I hope that isn't the case here.

Re: Read this if you want to keep this forum

RocketTube is one of JUB's sister companies - as is BearZone.com, neither of these sites are problems. The root of the problem comes from members posting both multiple links or a single link to file sharing hosts.

With regards to the number of infringements, it only takes 1 infringement of the wrong company for it to be a problem!

My guess is that many members are having trouble seeing the big picture because they're too busy enjoying the smaller picture thanks to the links that have been posted here in the past.... oh, and thanks to at least one member who had a fabulous private piracy site on the go!!!

Re: Read this if you want to keep this forum

I get that you (the mods) are only trying to protect the site, and if the posting of copyrighted material becomes a threat to the future existence of JUB then of course, action needs to be taken.
On the other hand you DO admit that the bear/daddies forum is a popular section of the site and by closing it you would certainly risk losing a lot of traffic. Let me then just remind you that such traffic could also be lost due to other reasons, for example such as general discontent over pissy attitudes from power tripping mods, etc, and it could also affect the other sections of the forums.
I have to say that i find some comments made in this thread by some of the mods to be pretty unprofessional, particularly those of snapcat.
It's this kind of thing that usually generates bad rep, and everyone knows that the most effective way to kill a website is through bad rep.
I've enjoyed the site and still do, but i think i speak for everyone when i say; you need us more than we need you. So how about just keeping a more watchful eye over the threads and delete the stuff that needs to be deleted instead of punishing the many for the indiscretions of the few?

Re: Read this if you want to keep this forum

Originally Posted by snapcat

When you start paying the retainer that JD & Seth pay for their attorney, and assume equal liability for damages, then perhaps we could overlook your snarky post.

You know what? I've been on this forum for years now, I'm consistently well-behaved, and if I wanted to be snarky, I would have been so. I did not, and that's why I made the distinction. I was completely serious with my questions, because I had just posted three separate videos from a television show in another thread, as well as a music video a few nights earlier, and I could not understand why this was a copyright violation issue and the other was not. I even requested that my videos be removed, but quasar helped me navigate the slippery slope enough that I left them alone, and I just vowed to myself not to post anything of the sort again.

I did not complain about big bad Corny or how unfair this all is or about the Mods abusing power bullshit that many members would be railing against. I only come into this forum occasionally and was interested in the title to the thread, then wanted to understand what the differences were between was was going on here, versus what was going on all over the other threads. Corny and quasar had patience and seemed to understand that, and I appreciate them taking their time to explain it to me. Once I understood, I dropped the issue.

But many thanks to you for coming in late and treating me like a little bitch. I'll certainly never ask questions again--silently conflicted is preferable to publicly bitch-slapped any day.

Re: Read this if you want to keep this forum

i think the main problem has been stated... this forum gets a lot of traffic from people specifically looking for free DLs of movies. usually they don't stay or intend to be a part of a community, they just want a place for people to give them free shit. this is obviously a problem for the people who control this site.

i don't want this forum to be closed because i enjoy coming and looking at the pictures and discussing the kinds of men that i find attractive with guys who hold similar interests.

i really hope we can find a way to quickly enforce the rules for the folks who want to just poke in and break them and keep the forum friendly for new folks who want to be part of the community and am willing to do whatever i can to help.

Re: Read this if you want to keep this forum

Originally Posted by NomineDetracto

i really hope we can find a way to quickly enforce the rules for the folks who want to just poke in and break them and keep the forum friendly for new folks who want to be part of the community and am willing to do whatever i can to help.

That's exactly what we want for the forum and what we want from you. This thread was started to make you all aware of how bad the situation is, and how you can stop it. As said multiple times before - it works well for the rest of this board, but not so much for this part. Usually we deal with stuff like this in private. You never notice when a thread/post with questionable content is deleted. But here I made a few public posts in the past (see first post) to draw attention to the problem in this forum. They were ignored - hence this more "radical" thread.

Re: Read this if you want to keep this forum

I know this might be tricky and probably time consuming so it might not work but what if someone had a video or something that they are not sure whether or not it would violate a copyright....what if there was a thread that you could post to, but only the mods/supporters could see and that's where the image/video be posted and it would have to get "approved"

Re: Read this if you want to keep this forum

Originally Posted by BillyBear

I know this might be tricky and probably time consuming so it might not work but what if someone had a video or something that they are not sure whether or not it would violate a copyright....what if there was a thread that you could post to, but only the mods/supporters could see and that's where the image/video be posted and it would have to get "approved"

Would that involve a lot of technical stuff?

I don't know that it would be all that hard to do, but I also don't know that we need to go to that much trouble.

A good rule of thumb is to just apply common sense. If it is a short scene then it may be OK. Depending on the company. For instance, Falcon does not mind if you post short clips of their movies. They Do mind if someone posts the whole movie.

I'm sure most people here are savvy enough to know of many of the major porn companies. You don't want to post clips from any company on the banned content list. And you don't want to post clips from a site that charges a fee to see the movie.

We are at that point in which ALL rapidshare links (and the like) will be added to the banned words list. And we're also at the point where this forum may go dark.

We've had very few reasonable suggestions from the users of this forum, and many (too many) snarky remarks.

We're completely aware that many of you are here just for the rapidshare links and nothing else. If you are one of those people then yes, we really don't care if you stay or if you leave.

Re: Read this if you want to keep this forum

Sorry, I don't come in here a lot (I'm not a 'Bear/Daddy' type person) - but you will see my name on a couple of the stickies at the top of this Forum.

Reason for that is, back in September, when I was looking into something completely unrelated to this problem, I saw that there appeared to be a lot of video 'clips' posted in here. So (to answer a question posed by one preceding poster) I checked - and discovered that about 20 threads were nothing more than 'Full video piracy'. These had been posted by about half a dozen different members. Those threads were deleted, the matter clarified with the site owners - and the stickies I mentioned were posted. (I also took the trouble of finding someone to interpret the rules for one of the 'offenders' who spoke little English).

Unfortunately, that didn't solve the problem as Full videos continued to be posted. Several other threads over subsequent months have since been deleted - and I am pretty sure that NONE of the deleted threads (up until the time of Corny's opening post above) were reported by ANY of the regulars in the Bear Forum.

It certainly didn't help that this Forum was 'light on' as regards moderation for some time (Mods away/exceedingly busy in 'real life') - but you had better believe we are taking much more notice of it now.

If we do sound a touch 'dogmatic' or 'hard' on this, it is our frustration showing through - In the other Porn Forums, a lot of the members understand the risk to the site if this sort of thing goes on - and Post Report it to advise us. In this particular Forum (up till now) everyone seems to have just been ignoring the piracy issue.

All we are asking for is some help and co-operation. The Mods here cannot possibly look at every post made on JUB - there are just too many. I'm sure, now that people understand, Post Reporting of these problems here WILL happen more regularly - so thanks in advance for your help.

Re: Read this if you want to keep this forum

Originally Posted by sundevil

Of course the "ban" thing isn't gonna work! I'll post something pirate, i'll be banned, then i'll make a new account and -hey, a new pirate thread.. pfff

You may be surprised to learn that it isn't as easy to circumvent a ban as you might think. You might say that we've become skilled at detecting that. There are also a variety of ban options open. I won't go into detail on all of them, but there are a variety of methods to select from, for those folks who are hellbent on posting pirated content.

Re: Read this if you want to keep this forum

i have to say i'm pretty disappointed to read some of the posts in opposition to a simple request for help. how selfish! rather than be a good neighbor and keep this forum up and running some of you are bitching and moaning as if you're being put out. i can't speak for any of you but i have recently found this forum and really enjoy it. i am all too happy to do what i can to keep the "open" sign up. i hope you nay sayers will see the bigger picture and pitch in and help.

Re: Read this if you want to keep this forum

I honestly can't remember having seen one of these movies being posted. Maybe I'm good at avoiding them, or maybe I'm just getting senile. At any rate, I know there's a massive problem, because I cannot see Corny getting this huffy over one or two bad apples. So I appreciate that there's a serious problem going on, even if I remained oblivious for some reason. At the same time, I think closing this forum down altogether would be far too drastic a measure. I agree with Fat Tom and a few others here: you would take something away from the members who do abide by the rules. I for one would be really saddened to see this forum go.

From what I've read in this thread, the people who post links to copyrighted material have two things in common:
- they use the same sites
- they are newbies

I would say it's best to focus on these two problems. For one, are there any legitimate uses to Rapidshare etc. that are applied often? I don't believe so, so why not ban those sites from being linked to? Also, and this is a slightly more radical idea but still less so than killing the entire forum: why not restrict access to this board (or rather all of the 'porny' forums - gotta be consistent) for people who have less than, say, 50 posts? Deny access outright or better yet, make it read-only for the new members. That way you'll not get any people who come here, post a copyrighted vid and leave again. They would have to invest some time, become part of the community, before they can post here.

What do you think?

."We are all in the gutter, but some of us are looking at the stars." (Oscar Wilde, Lady Windermere's Fan)

Re: Read this if you want to keep this forum

Originally Posted by TriBi

and I am pretty sure that NONE of the deleted threads (up until the time of Corny's opening post above) were reported by ANY of the regulars in the Bear Forum.

You are the mods, so it's your task to go through the forums and threads once in a while. Some subject lines are even absolutely obvious and the thread more than three pages long, yet they stay in the forum, making me wonder if you ever do your job.

Originally Posted by sundevil

Of course the "ban" thing isn't gonna work! I'll post something pirate, i'll be banned, then i'll make a new account and -hey, a new pirate thread.. pfff

I noticed that many of the members who ask for or post pirated stuff are newbies who don't know the English language very well. It seems they're looking for bear videos and the first result in a search engine is JUB, so they ask here. Like "NEED DADDY VIDOE. GIV ME NAW". They don't understand that JUB is backed up by porn companies and therefore tries to stay on the legal side.

There are enough dedicated sites to download gay porn movies illegally, but they probably don't know about it.

Re: Read this if you want to keep this forum

Originally Posted by Paws

You are the mods, so it's your task to go through the forums and threads once in a while. Some subject lines are even absolutely obvious and the thread more than three pages long, yet they stay in the forum, making me wonder if you ever do your job.

do you honestly think there are enough mods to read every post in every thread in every forum every day on the entire site? there aren't and we can't. most of us moderate more than one forum. some of those forums are really active and some are not. some require a lot of "modding" and some don't. we rely on members to post things that are in violation of the code of conduct or are insulting, baiting, mean spirited, or whatever.

the whole reason this has come up is because we HAVE been going through these threads in this forum and deleting them or removing content and posting why it's bad to do so over and over and over in the past several months. Just do a search of all posts I've made in this forum and you'll see what we're talking about. I've recently gone to leaving these threads open, but just deleting the link and posting in the thread why it was deleting, i thought that was helping because i saw a decline for a while. then i go on vacation come back and see this thread, which indicates there have been problems again.

some threads i've caught early, before pirated content has been posted and i just remind folks to not post pirated stuff. the example text you noted above about a newbie who doesn't understand English that well, is an example of threads where i've posted in early to remind folks not to post pirated stuff (but i leave the thread open so folks can post non pirated stuff). that has been my attempt to help educate the newbies on the rules of the forum.

Re: Read this if you want to keep this forum

I don't read this particular forum but saw the 'if you want to keep' and looked in. I, myself, have had infractions for getting angry with someone and getting nasty. I deserved the infractions because there shouldn't be a need to be unkind to someone else. I agree the rules should be followed because, if for nothing else, the sight could get penalized for copy write material or under age pics. I am all for following the rules to keep a safe haven for we the posters and lookers on.