1. This a computer game first not a fantasy book or a lore collection. Gameplay should trump lore but luckily it doesn't even have to because the tinker cave already exists!2. Sawbutchers are a strong class but using more RNG as a balance mechanic seems like a bad way to balance anything. I've had a horrible early game with sawbutcher and I've had one that ran through the whole game on insane in under 15 hours without deaths..3. If the tinker classes and tinkering "aren't meant to be played" or exist in AoA...well they do, don't they? So what kind of an argument is this even?4. "The devs don't have enough time". How many hours would it really take to make the tinker caves available right from the start without enemies inside and with a few more items for tinker classes? I assure you, that's not what has kept the devs busy for the last 6 months.

id wish i would be able to craft steam implants or steam generators, arent they tinkers already?they'd will still have some tedium because you have to find the schematics (or vault it if you really want it) but imho makes the aoa run way less bad

Why not just start Sawbutchers with the Steamsaw schematic? (Instead of the Pain Suppressor salve that nobody has the mats for until T2 anyway).

You could start Gunslingers and Psyshots with the Steamgun schematic too, though it's less important for them than saws are to Sawbutchers.

Starting tinkers in the tinker cave would work too. But creating a brand new tinker starting zone feels like building a new house because your old one has a leaky sink faucet. And a secret LH tinker shop is a little too invasive of the lore for my taste. Yes, gameplay comes before lore, but starting tinkers with the relevant schematic solves the same problem with likely less effort and no shoehorning required.

starting with schema doesn't help since you need an absurd amount of dsteel to make adequate ones, which means you got lucky with starting drops or are already getting T3 drops (or you bought out like all of last hope instead of armor, better infusions to replace the awful starting salves....)

e: literally just start them in current tinker zone and throw in T1-3 steamgun and steamsaw shops. minimal effort maximum effectiveness solution

_________________<Shibari> You're full of shit<darkgod #tome> ster is a troll<Sheila> and ster, i do agree with you on most things game-related, but do try to not be such an ass!<mex> your posts lead to people like me being abused and murdered

Start Tinkers in the Tinker cave + 2 extra of the shop things, one selling T3 Steamsaws and the other selling T3 Steamguns + (maybe shots, but LH sells those). If a racial start overrides it, it appears on the map when they come to the world map. Seriously, every other class can make the trip to LH and buy T3 gear right at the start, there's literally no reason for tinkers to be limited.

End the discrimination

_________________A little bit of a starters guide written by yours truly here.

maybe instead of making new items for AoA tinker classes, they could just increase the drop rate for the steamgun and steamsaw schematicsthat way you don't have to worry as much about getting good enough weapons, AND you don't have to make new content or startscum for an hour to fix it, AND you can avoid making the tinker cave available to characters who didn't ask the tinker escort where it isedit: possibly schematics could be divided into tiers if they aren't already, with steamsaw and steamgun and frost salve as tier 1 schematics and healing salve as T2 and good stuff like crystal edge and ablative armor and corrosive shell as T3 or higher schematics

you could also increase the drop rate of steam generators and medical injectors to that of runes and infusions as well as also making vaults with runes and/or infusions(such as the vault in trollmire with 1 troll and the skeleton mage vaults) also be able to drop injectors and steam generators if you know how to make any tinkerim not sure if they normally can or not atm though

Last edited by Zeyphor on Thu Mar 16, 2017 3:45 am, edited 2 times in total.

maybe instead of making new items for AoA tinker classes, they could just increase the drop rate for the steamgun and steamsaw schematics

how has this thread gone 2 pages without anyone realising this is an awful fix? you don't need the schematics to drop, you need steamsaws/guns and generators immediately after the game starts

e: i think this problem will get fixed as a side result of drowning finally being killed in 1.6 anyway

_________________<Shibari> You're full of shit<darkgod #tome> ster is a troll<Sheila> and ster, i do agree with you on most things game-related, but do try to not be such an ass!<mex> your posts lead to people like me being abused and murdered

maybe instead of making new items for AoA tinker classes, they could just increase the drop rate for the steamgun and steamsaw schematics

how has this thread gone 2 pages without anyone realising this is an awful fix? you don't need the schematics to drop, you need steamsaws/guns and generators immediately after the game starts

e: i think this problem will get fixed as a side result of drowning finally being killed in 1.6 anyway

insane is not so difficult that you cannot do both trollmire and kor'pul without drowning NPCs and using shops with a huge risk of dying somewhere along the line as a TINKER classyou can even do the lumberjack village and the arena inbetween kor'pul floorsit wasn't that hard before you automatically got raised to level 2 either

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