Other Links

Leading Off Podcast: Alex Kirilloff Time?

Matt and Cooper of Twins Daily discuss the recent week for the Twins along with the Michael Pineda suspension, the metric ton of injuries sustained recently, and the odds of promoting Alex Kirilloff to the majors.

I don't think so -- his minor league IL time doesn't count toward the 60:

"time spent on a minor league 7-day Injured List or minor league 60-day Injured List does NOT count toward the minimum number of days a player must spend on an MLB Injured List if a player is recalled from an optional assignment"

Basically, you can't recall a minor league player and then make their MLB IL placement retroactive. (Poppen last pitched in the minors on August 6 too, so even if it could be retroactive, he wouldn't be eligible to return until Oct. 6, two days after the start of the ALDS.)

I am usually quite skeptical about promoting people and expecting them to make a big splash. In this case, I think it is worth considering. Kirilloff has been red hot in the AA playoffs and he is a top prospect. The Twins have at least three outfielders (I'm counting Gonzalez) with injury issues who may or may not be available for postseason.

If Buxton can't swing a bat or Kepler or Gonzalez is out for a week or more to come, I think the Twins should recall Kirilloff and throw him in there.

I am usually quite skeptical about promoting people and expecting them to make a big splash. In this case, I think it is worth considering. Kirilloff has been red hot in the AA playoffs and he is a top prospect. The Twins have at least three outfielders (I'm counting Gonzalez) with injury issues who may or may not be available for postseason.

If Buxton can't swing a bat or Kepler or Gonzalez is out for a week or more to come, I think the Twins should recall Kirilloff and throw him in there.

And we're not to the point of starting LaMarre in the playoffs yet or anything -- I know everybody seems banged up right now, but I'd expect Cave to be back, at least. And Arraez can play the outfield with Schoop taking over 2B, and Adrianza as a capable reserve. (And I'd still expect one of Kepler, Buxton, and Marwin to make it back too.) Edit to add: we also may need a spot for Carved when Castro starts behind the plate...

Are we really expecting Kirilloff to make some adjustment to be meaningfully better than Cave, Arraez, Schoop in just 3 weeks? By facing Detroit and KC pitchers, no less? I remember Kubel dominating multiple levels in 2004, including AAA, and even looking pretty good in his September MLB debut, only to get exposed pretty badly in ALDS Game 2 vs the Yankees...

I see no losing in calling him up. Why not put him on a roster that wins to give him that playoff experience. His bat is undeniable. It’s Mauer-like, but with power. Just give him a jersey.

He can probably sit with the team in the dugout, if that's the kind of playoff experience you want to give him.

There are a few costs -- chiefly, one less 40-man spot to protect another player or claim/sign someone this winter. Also would make it more likely an option is used on Kirilloff in 2020. An offseason or spring training injury (a non-negligible risk with Kirilloff) could require him to go on the MLB DL and collect service time.

Nothing insurmountable, if the guy is a ready phenom, but I have my doubts about that at the moment. Even if he quickly manages 2019 Cave/Schoop/Arraez/Adrianza level performance, but parks one of those guys on the bench, you haven't really gained anything.

I liked a couple posts because they were smartly thought out. But I have to agree with Spycake overall. We still have about 3 weeks for Buxton, Kepler and Gonzalez to be fully healthy. And no matter how much I love Kirilloff and believe in his future he's really going to be better than any of them, or Cave at this point?

He can probably sit with the team in the dugout, if that's the kind of playoff experience you want to give him.

There are a few costs -- chiefly, one less 40-man spot to protect another player or claim/sign someone this winter. Also would make it more likely an option is used on Kirilloff in 2020. An offseason or spring training injury (a non-negligible risk with Kirilloff) could require him to go on the MLB DL and collect service time.

Nothing insurmountable, if the guy is a ready phenom, but I have my doubts about that at the moment. Even if he quickly manages 2019 Cave/Schoop/Arraez/Adrianza level performance, but parks one of those guys on the bench, you haven't really gained anything.

You're too logical Spycake.In all honesty, your take is probably the correct take in every sense.It's conservative, and it's because we have such a potent offense already in place.When Kepler got the complimentary call up from Chattanooga in '15, it was because we had some give.I just wish it wasn't so far fetched because the kid is a real talent and deserves a call-up.

You're too logical Spycake.In all honesty, your take is probably the correct take in every sense.It's conservative, and it's because we have such a potent offense already in place.When Kepler got the complimentary call up from Chattanooga in '15, it was because we had some give.I just wish it wasn't so far fetched because the kid is a real talent and deserves a call-up.

I have to disagree with the potent offense part as of right now. An outfield consisting of Rosario, Wade, and either Miller/LaMarre is not potent what so ever. Also with Cruz, Sano and Cron (thumb) dealing with nagging injuries we need a consistent and powerful bat to fill the void we have right now. Cleveland is still within striking distance and a lineup similar to the one that we threw out on Sunday is very worrying because there is not much fire power in there. Twins need a reinforcement. Kirilloff should be that guy. I wouldn't be expecting him to come up and make an immediate impact, but I bet he would give the Twins much better at bats than either Wade, Miller, or LaMarre.

I don't think so -- his minor league IL time doesn't count toward the 60:

"time spent on a minor league 7-day Injured List or minor league 60-day Injured List does NOT count toward the minimum number of days a player must spend on an MLB Injured List if a player is recalled from an optional assignment"

Basically, you can't recall a minor league player and then make their MLB IL placement retroactive. (Poppen last pitched in the minors on August 6 too, so even if it could be retroactive, he wouldn't be eligible to return until Oct. 6, two days after the start of the ALDS.)

When Kepler got the complimentary call up from Chattanooga in '15, it was because we had some give.

Yeah, Kepler came from AA in 2015 -- but was already on the 40-man roster (and had been for 2 years at that point). There was zero cost to give him a taste of big league action then. I believe Kubel was already on the 40-man in 2004 too, in his first option year (and of course he saw extensive action at AAA that season).

I have to disagree with the potent offense part as of right now. An outfield consisting of Rosario, Wade, and either Miller/LaMarre is not potent what so ever. Also with Cruz, Sano and Cron (thumb) dealing with nagging injuries we need a consistent and powerful bat to fill the void we have right now. Cleveland is still within striking distance and a lineup similar to the one that we threw out on Sunday is very worrying because there is not much fire power in there. Twins need a reinforcement. Kirilloff should be that guy. I wouldn't be expecting him to come up and make an immediate impact, but I bet he would give the Twins much better at bats than either Wade, Miller, or LaMarre.

If you don't expect Kirilloff to make an immediate impact anyway, and you're just looking for a bat upgrade on Miller and LaMarre, why not just call up De Aza? He was raking at AAA. He has experience, and there's zero long-term cost/risk to the move.

FWIW, I think Wade has been taking decent at-bats and getting on base, no? Plus Arraez can play the outfield, with Schoop at second... Adrianza and Astudillo too. Maybe Garver should see some reps out there? It's not like we really *have* to play Miller or LaMarre right now. And I'd expect a few more options to become available again soon (i.e. Cave).

I don't know the chances of Buxton and Kepler being back for the post season, but from the outside side it feels like there is very little chance with Buxton and maybe a 60% chance with Kepler. I think it would be foolish for the Twins not to give Kirillof a try to be the RF for the stretch run and if he succeeds to add him to the post season roster. If Kepler gets healthy an OF of Kirilloff, Kepler, and Rosario on paper sounds much better than gimpy Cave, Kepler, and Rosario.

If Kepler doesn't get healthy then we are talking an OF of Wade/Gonzalez, Cave, and Rosario (with two of those three returning from injury).

And we're not to the point of starting LaMarre in the playoffs yet or anything -- I know everybody seems banged up right now, but I'd expect Cave to be back, at least. And Arraez can play the outfield with Schoop taking over 2B, and Adrianza as a capable reserve. (And I'd still expect one of Kepler, Buxton, and Marwin to make it back too.) Edit to add: we also may need a spot for Carved when Castro starts behind the plate...

Are we really expecting Kirilloff to make some adjustment to be meaningfully better than Cave, Arraez, Schoop in just 3 weeks? By facing Detroit and KC pitchers, no less? I remember Kubel dominating multiple levels in 2004, including AAA, and even looking pretty good in his September MLB debut, only to get exposed pretty badly in ALDS Game 2 vs the Yankees...

I thought immediately of Kubel also but the counter to that is Arraez who has thrived. Buxton is now officially out so I would want a possible impact guy like Kiriloff.Rosario, Kepler and Cave but I would be happy with Kiriloff backing them up.

If Kirilloff had dominated AA I think it would be different. For much of the year his numbers weren’t remarkable. It was clearly the injury that set him back but he missed that valuable time and couldn’t make the most of the time as he recovered.

The Twins should be aggressive as they were with Arcia, Sano and Buxton when players dominate a level. I think they would have been with a healthy dominating Kirilloff.

I have to fully agree with you here.The Twins will probably take the approach Spycake mentioned, but I get greedy.I'm not a fan of bringing in AAAA players who have a higher floor.And again, for the record, I CANNOT STAND the term "years of of player control".If a player proves to be of worth on a major league roster, give it to him.Kirilloff could easily take the spot on the 40 man.Get him up here while we got guys who need rest.Give him a taste, if he hits, we keep him on.If he tanks, we don't.

Kirilloff's numbers haven't been absolutely lights out, but he's earned it.However, we all thought Buxton was "can't miss".Kubel was dominant in his minors tenure.Same as Oswaldo.There's just something about Kirilloff that reminds me of Mauer w/Morneau power.

I have to disagree with the potent offense part as of right now. An outfield consisting of Rosario, Wade, and either Miller/LaMarre is not potent what so ever. Also with Cruz, Sano and Cron (thumb) dealing with nagging injuries we need a consistent and powerful bat to fill the void we have right now. Cleveland is still within striking distance and a lineup similar to the one that we threw out on Sunday is very worrying because there is not much fire power in there. Twins need a reinforcement. Kirilloff should be that guy. I wouldn't be expecting him to come up and make an immediate impact, but I bet he would give the Twins much better at bats than either Wade, Miller, or LaMarre.