Well my first thought is, ain't no thing but a chicken wing. Yer boy's 4. He probably wants to play with Barbies while being a professional ninja on the moon fighting fires at the cookie factory too.

My second thought is, if you don't want it, set boundaries. No harm in that.

My third thought is, where did he get the idea? A little alarm bell rang in my head when I read "I have the right". Seems pretty confrontational for a four year old. If someone's raising your kids for you, you gotta break that sumbitch in two.

I kinda like Stark's idea of using it as a way of teaching the value of diversity. That's a nice move.

I do like the idea of a thankful four year old. Way better than the lil'shit syndrome pandemic sweeping the nation at the moment

My final thought is, critical thinking is not a skill set that is teachable to four year olds. So don't crucify yourself if you feel you ain't turning him into a young free thinker

My final final thought is, monkey see, monkey do. You don't believe in Jesus and you don't do anything to encourage it. That's not a suggestion, that's just my assumption based on what I know of you. What I mean is, there's no oxygen for that fire in your house. If he really wants to have a relationship with Jesus, he'll have to go out of his way. Otherwise, he's way more likely to wanna be like dad.

Somebody taught him to pray. I would tell him he's welcome to pray but you're not going to wait while he does it, or join him, because you don't believe what he believes. If that upsets him, you can have a discussion about free thought and share some of the different beliefs practiced in other parts of the world. You can also say that the best way to show thanks for your food is to eat all of it, including the carrots

I'd be looking for the person who decided to impart their belief system on a four year old and Hitch-Slap them.

If Jesus died for our sins, why is there still sin? If man was created from dust, why is there still dust? If Americans came from Europe, why are there still Europeans?

He's 4 years old, he doesn't have an opinion that has not been given to him.
The lesson I would teach is the one that I did teach to my daughter, now 8 and certainly not a believer in any invisible god.
Ask him to ask Jesus to answer some questions.
"Does Jesus know everything? (his answer) I have in my hand an object (closed hand with object hidden). Ask Jesus to tell you what it is?"
When Jesus doesn't respond ask him why?
Then get grandma (assumptive perp) and ask grandma in front of the kid to ask Jesus what is the object in your hand.
Now let him come to his own conclusion if Jesus is real.
Kids are very straight forward. He will not fall for the "Jesus doesn't like to be tested" BS. He will see it for what it is.
Let me know how this turns out.

The old gods are dead, let's invent some new ones before something really bad happens.

As a side note, I'm a lot more inclined to let a child believe in Santa Clause because there is physical evidence of Santa existing. Who leaves all these presents signed by Santa? Who eats all the milk and cookies left out? It's hard to fathom that adults may be lying to them at that young age but they figure it out eventually. When it comes to belief in God at that age there really isn't any evidence to support it...

(11-07-2012 02:49 PM)N.E.OhioAtheist Wrote: I also would say that is NOT free thinking, It's bondage to religion. A open mind would never give in to mythology and superstition like praying to a non existent God . But That's my thoughts not yours. He's your son and no one can tell you the right way to raise him. Go with your heart and you will be fine.

Free thinkers come in all various belief systems, and whether or not you are actually confined to the literal definitions of your dogma is up to you. My dad's side of the family is Mormon, but they are incredibly open-minded.

First, have a laugh about the idea of teaching him the Ricky Bobby way to give thanks

Second, I suggest taking care not to over-react

Third, a discussion is in order to find out where this behavior was learned, and I suggest that you follow up with the source to determine why it happened.

Fourth, you could perhaps lead the way out of it by starting a family meal ritual where instead of speaking to an unseen entity (which is retarded), instead take turns in saying to each other what you are thankful for - so you could first say "I'm thankful for my family and that we have enough food to eat" and your wife could then say something, and then ask your child what he is thankful for, and re-groove the behavior from saying thanks to expressing publicly what he is thankful for.

If he has the desire to pray, lead the prayer in a direction away from thanking any gods.
At Christmas or Thanksgiving, when it's my turn to say grace, I say "Thank you mother for preparing the meal."
"I thank all my family who are here and able to share in this special day."
And I don't bow my head during grace. Haven't since I was a kid. I walk with my eyes open and bow before no one.

Teach him that there are no invisible castles in the sky. There are no invisible lords who live above us.
There is no need ever to bow down to anyone. Hold your head high and look people in the eye when you speak to them.
Tell him "Jesus is character in a book. If you would like to read his stories, we can do that."

In the process, you can also introduce other stories about other gods to put this Jesus character in perspective

If none of that works, don't make anything for dinner one night. Set all the dishes at the dinner table and have everyone sit down.
Begin to say grace "Jesus, my son wanted to thank you for the food but it appears that you haven't prepared anything for us to eat."
Ask you son "Who usually makes dinner" ? - He'll reply "Mom or Dad"
"Ok, so do you want to thank us" ? - Hopefully he'll reply "Thank you"
Ask him "Did the farmers grow the food" ? Hopefully he'll reply "yes"
"You might want to thank them"

"Now then, what did (Jesus) the character in the book we read last night do to help with dinner ?
Did the character of Zeus in the book we read two nights ago do anything to help with dinner ?
How about Mickey Mouse ? Did he have anything to do with making dinner ?"

So, we know where our food comes from and we know who prepares it. These people are real.
The characters in the story books are not.

Insanity - doing the same thing over and over again and expecting different results

Is your son in a day care situation? Or home care? Maybe he is learning it there.

I agree that this is a teaching moment but I would want to know who has already taught him that not praying isn't an option...then that person and I would have to have an ahem, Come to Jesus Meetin' as they say.