I don’t disagree that the Lords might be in need of some sort of reform, (but this is hardly the time or the place). I must admit I’m finding it funny that now they are actually doing some damage prevention, against the interest of thier traditional support base, that same base is calling for abolition because they don’t like what’s being said.

Dare I say that our democratic political infrastructure is actually bearing up in a time of chaos and performing as intended?

We’re well and truly into ‘you couldn’t make it up’ territory when it was Dave, lest we forget, who stuffed the Lords with Tory Peers who are now gleefully revelling in telling Theresa to eff off. For this they are rewarded by being labelled as Traitors and Enemies of the People by the headbangers., but I suspect are being cheered on by the less unhinged majority of Tory MP’s

Whats not being remarked upon as much, but is equally as significant, is the number of labour peers who are also as happily waving two fingers at Jezza and the labour leadership when being whipped (or attempting to be) to vote against remaining in the single market etc. I’m pretty certain the vast majority of Labour MP’s (who are pretty much all remainers) will be willing them one in that too.

Its 14 amendments sent back now for a vote in the commons. Every single one of which is potentially rubbing out Theresa’s precious, oh-so-important red lines. No wonder the Mail/Express/IDS/Redwood fruit-loops are so apoplectic

We’re well and truly into ‘you couldn’t make it up’ territory when it was Dave, lest we forget, who stuffed the Lords with Tory Peers who are now gleefully revelling in telling Theresa to eff off. For this they are rewarded by being labelled as Traitors and Enemies of the People by the headbangers., but I suspect are being cheered on by the less unhinged majority of Tory MP’s

Maybe this is what THM meant by the grown-ups coming up with a solution.

“May has ‘split her cabinet’ to find a solution to the customs arrangements.”

Even leaving aside the brilliant choice of words, it’s just become an office teambuilding exercise hasn’t it? We’ll split into two and whoever can build the best spaghetti bridge wins. Except that the hard brexiteers insist spaghetti is an EU conspiracy and build their bridge entirely out of blutac then declare themselves the winners because it doesn’t collapse as fast as you’d expect

We’ll split into two and whoever can build the best spaghetti bridge wins. Except that the hard brexiteers insist spaghetti is an EU conspiracy and build their bridge entirely out of blutac then declare themselves the winners because it doesn’t collapse as fast as you’d expect

Has one half of the cabinet being sent of to discuss the ‘Fairies and Unicorns’ option, while the other half look at the finer details of the’Uber-wizzy Internettty Super-Duper, Space Age, Mega-High-Technology yet-to-be-invented’ variation?

“Best of all, they are arguing over two non-functional alternatives that have already been rejected by the EU.”

I’d like to think it’s a delaying tactic to bring things to a real crunch..

Option 1 being hard brexit /economic suicide for decades to come.

Option 2 being a retraction /let’s call the whole thing off.

Bit of a gamble seeing as corbyn has again said he’ll whip abstention from his MPs, quel surprise.

The man is an utter disgrace, he’s supposed to be leader of the opposition yet he repeatedly is towing the tory line by having Labour abstain from critical votes. He’ll have to come down from sitting on the fence at some point, hopefully he’ll land in a very thorny Bush.

“He isn’t pro-EU and never was, so you could hardly expect him to take a hardline remain position now could you?”

I see your point, but he could allow his MPs to vote on critical issues, that’s how Parliament is supposed to work, if a fair amount of whipped Labour MPs are too scared vote, then it’s going to squew the result. It’s not really democratic or representative.

He sounds more and more dictatorial rather than socialist, as time goes by. There’s a certain irony there.

Hang on a minute. Being in opposition doesn’t mean automatically disagreeing with the government on every issue

Exactly. Politics would be a lot better if MPs could openly say they agree with other parties policies. I have even been know to agree with some Tory policies (not many admittedly) but when I do I am happy to say so.

I’ve never knowingly agreed with a Tory policy. Well…. certainly nothing this inept self-serving shower have come out with (I see today they’ve found a shed-load of cash to throw at grammar schools, while starving the rest of the education system of funds)

Unfortunately, I’m one of the 48% of the population who’s views, on probably the most important political process in my lifetime, aren’t represented by the main opposition party either

Both the main parties will be rightly damned for generations as this shitstorm unfolds!

I used to think he was just a shameless opportunist, and he is, but now I think the main problem is that he’s a dangerous fantasist.

In his befuddled, ego-ravaged, vainglorious head, I think he seriously believes that he’s Winston Churchill, and Brexit is his WW2. That he’s fulfilling his destiny leading a grateful nation out of the EU and on to the glorious second empire, and that he will be judged by history, and lionised, as this great leader

Now if only Theresa would step aside and let me fulfil my/our great date with destiny…..

Really good interview with Dominic Grieve in today’s guardian. About the most sensible assessment of the folly of Brexit as I’ve heard articulated by any politician. He’s definitely got the measure of Johnson and the rest of the headbangers in his own party

I am not a fan of Blair but I think you are doing him a serious disservice here. Whilst his relationship to the truth does seem somewhat relaxed its not in the same league as Johnson. Blair mostly lied by omission, eg 45mins if you take the most optimistic/pessimistic view of Saddam’s capabilties and also hint its strategic and not tactical, whereas Johnson simply makes rubbish up.

In, sort of, I think agreement with Binners I think he is one of those really good salesmen types who can convince himself that whatever he is saying at the time/suits his personal aims is the truth. So having thrown in his lot with Brexit he needs to really, really believe in it.