Froggy wrote:If you are expecting 25 goals and 50 points out of Kennedy, then the problem isn't with Kennedy

Yeah, those are pretty lofty expectations. However...

Career GP: 354Career Goals: 73Career Assists: 89

82-Game Pace: 17 goals, 21 assists

It's more than reasonable to be disappointed in the lack of production from Kennedy this season. 3 goals and 2 assists in 28 games just doesn't cut it, especially when you see that Cooke has 5 goals + 7 assists and Sutter has 8 goals + 5 assists. That's a rather substantial cap from 13 and 12 points to 5 points for guys who play (mostly) on the same line.

I don't think anyone has argued that Kennedy was having a good offensive season. But if he puts up 3 or 4 more goals and like 8 or 9 assists from here on out, he'd be right on pace for his career averages, or at least close enough. Either way, it's pretty clear that he's gone after this year unless he goes absolutely nuts down the stretch and in the playoffs.

Froggy wrote:If you are expecting 25 goals and 50 points out of Kennedy, then the problem isn't with Kennedy

Yeah, those are pretty lofty expectations. However...

Career GP: 354Career Goals: 73Career Assists: 89

82-Game Pace: 17 goals, 21 assists

It's more than reasonable to be disappointed in the lack of production from Kennedy this season. 3 goals and 2 assists in 28 games just doesn't cut it, especially when you see that Cooke has 5 goals + 7 assists and Sutter has 8 goals + 5 assists. That's a rather substantial cap from 13 and 12 points to 5 points for guys who play (mostly) on the same line.

I don't think anyone has argued that Kennedy was having a good offensive season. But if he puts up 3 or 4 more goals and like 8 or 9 assists from here on out, he'd be right on pace for his career averages, or at least close enough. Either way, it's pretty clear that he's gone after this year unless he goes absolutely nuts down the stretch and in the playoffs.

If you think that his career average is what he needs to produce, then why would you think he's 'gone' if he doesn't perform above average?

The 3rd line should be scoring a goal every other game. In other words, in an 82 game season, 40 goals would be an acceptable total for the line. So the three guys should have 12-15 goals each. Sutter and Cooke could easily get more than that, and Kennedy typically would. But he is not scoring at all this season.

Also, is anyone else concerned with the play of Brooks Orpik? I think he played one of his worst games last night, and he's been inconsistent at best the past two seasons. He does not hit much like he used to, and leaves players wide open in front of the net way too often. I like Mikey's suggestion of getting Smid and bumping Orpik and Niskanen to the 3rd pairing. I'd leave Letang-Despres alone for like the next 10 years.

RxBandit66 wrote:Also, is anyone else concerned with the play of Brooks Orpik? I think he played one of his worst games last night, and he's been inconsistent at best the past two seasons. He does not hit much like he used to, and leaves players wide open in front of the net way too often.

Funny that you say this in that I actually remarked out loud last night about just how poor Brooks has looked lately. There is a part of me that wants to think that he is injured and can't do the basics right now but he is making so many mistakes that you can't help but get a little concerned.

Only to the biased eye could someone say that he looked better than Engo last night. Midseason funk?

RxBandit66 wrote:Also, is anyone else concerned with the play of Brooks Orpik? I think he played one of his worst games last night, and he's been inconsistent at best the past two seasons. He does not hit much like he used to, and leaves players wide open in front of the net way too often.

Funny that you say this in that I actually remarked out loud last night about just how poor Brooks has looked lately. There is a part of me that wants to think that he is injured and can't do the basics right now but he is making so many mistakes that you can't help but get a little concerned.

Only to the biased eye could someone say that he looked better than Engo last night. Midseason funk?

Froggy wrote:If you are expecting 25 goals and 50 points out of Kennedy, then the problem isn't with Kennedy

Yeah, those are pretty lofty expectations. However...

Career GP: 354Career Goals: 73Career Assists: 89

82-Game Pace: 17 goals, 21 assists

It's more than reasonable to be disappointed in the lack of production from Kennedy this season. 3 goals and 2 assists in 28 games just doesn't cut it, especially when you see that Cooke has 5 goals + 7 assists and Sutter has 8 goals + 5 assists. That's a rather substantial cap from 13 and 12 points to 5 points for guys who play (mostly) on the same line.

I don't think anyone has argued that Kennedy was having a good offensive season. But if he puts up 3 or 4 more goals and like 8 or 9 assists from here on out, he'd be right on pace for his career averages, or at least close enough. Either way, it's pretty clear that he's gone after this year unless he goes absolutely nuts down the stretch and in the playoffs.

If you think that his career average is what he needs to produce, then why would you think he's 'gone' if he doesn't perform above average?

It doesn't seem like there is a place for him going forward on this roster. simple as that. He'll get picked up somewhere, and he'll have a nice little career. but it's generally not great to have your statistically worst year by a large margin in the last year of your contract.

is someone actually accusing ME of having unreasonable criticism of kennedy?

RxBandit66 wrote:Also, is anyone else concerned with the play of Brooks Orpik? I think he played one of his worst games last night, and he's been inconsistent at best the past two seasons. He does not hit much like he used to, and leaves players wide open in front of the net way too often.

Funny that you say this in that I actually remarked out loud last night about just how poor Brooks has looked lately. There is a part of me that wants to think that he is injured and can't do the basics right now but he is making so many mistakes that you can't help but get a little concerned.

Only to the biased eye could someone say that he looked better than Engo last night. Midseason funk?

Any potential injury would have nothing to do with him giving Kessel a 10-foot gap before the Leafs' first goal.

His gap control is awful and his clearing attempts + coverage are not much better.

cooke scored 1 ES goal assisted from either sutter or TK - and that was a set faceoff play. sutter's only scored 2 ES goals assisted by either player. i can't tell from a quick lookup, but i'd be willing to bet the vast majority of either player's production has occurred either on special teams or when put in the top 6. so it's not really like they're producing on the 3rd line and kennedy isn't. every component of that line is an offensive failure when those 3 are put together. even though i think kennedy is on his way out, that doesn't really make me believe that our 3rd line scoring will just improve by default. there's a bigger issue there.

Froggy wrote:If you are expecting 25 goals and 50 points out of Kennedy, then the problem isn't with Kennedy

Yeah, those are pretty lofty expectations. However...

Career GP: 354Career Goals: 73Career Assists: 89

82-Game Pace: 17 goals, 21 assists

It's more than reasonable to be disappointed in the lack of production from Kennedy this season. 3 goals and 2 assists in 28 games just doesn't cut it, especially when you see that Cooke has 5 goals + 7 assists and Sutter has 8 goals + 5 assists. That's a rather substantial cap from 13 and 12 points to 5 points for guys who play (mostly) on the same line.

I don't think anyone has argued that Kennedy was having a good offensive season. But if he puts up 3 or 4 more goals and like 8 or 9 assists from here on out, he'd be right on pace for his career averages, or at least close enough. Either way, it's pretty clear that he's gone after this year unless he goes absolutely nuts down the stretch and in the playoffs.

If you think that his career average is what he needs to produce, then why would you think he's 'gone' if he doesn't perform above average?

It doesn't seem like there is a place for him going forward on this roster. simple as that. He'll get picked up somewhere, and he'll have a nice little career. but it's generally not great to have your statistically worst year by a large margin in the last year of your contract.

is someone actually accusing ME of having unreasonable criticism of kennedy?

I'm not even being critical of TK specifically-- I think he's doing just what he was re-signed to do -- but I'd argue that most of Sutter & Cooke's points came playing with James Neal either with Malkin or in his absence. Easier to produce points with a goal scorer... no chemistry on the standard 3rd line.