Bazooka could've been stationed in (West) Germany and learned to use the MILAN there. I've seen pictures of US personnel using non US weapons whilst deployed together in Saudi in 1990 or Iraq in the 2000s and on exercises with UK personnel. In the latter instance, I follow the Parachute Regiment page on Facebook and they've posted photos of US and UK paratroops on exercises together and the UK soldiers using the M4 instead of the L85 and vice-versa.

1. Bazooka has Milan. It's a great missile, but not American. Where did he pick that up? Some of the more notable users at that time were the UK, France, and Germany. Does anyone think Bazooka might have done an exchange with any of those nations?

3. Similarly, none of the armor guys actually are qualified expert on tank weapons. You'd think that Steeler in particular would have scored that, given his work with experimental AFVs.

4. But here's an even stranger one: Cross Country is qualified expert Heavy Laser Cannon - but the HAVOC's blueprints don't list it as having laser cannons. Think he might be a laser guy who could work the HAL when not out driving around in the HAVOC?

Anyone have any theories or imaginative ideas to explain any of these?

The other thing about marksmanship badges is it seems they classify them as a board range of weapons (such as rifle) versus specific weapons within that category (such as M-16). So Clutch, who is qualified with both an M-14 and M-16 would be qualified as Rifle and Zap would be qualified in Rocket Launcher versus TOW and LAW specifically (at least that is how I read it).

The other thing about marksmanship badges is it seems they classify them as a board range of weapons (such as rifle) versus specific weapons within that category (such as M-16). So Clutch, who is qualified with both an M-14 and M-16 would be qualified as Rifle and Zap would be qualified in Rocket Launcher versus TOW and LAW specifically (at least that is how I read it).

Well, given that it appears that there are badges for Recoilless Rifle; Rocket Launcher; and Missile, I think Zap would get "Rocket Launcher" for the LAW, and "Missile" for TOW. There's a certain irony that he doesn't have recoilless rifle when that's what he normally carries.

But I think you're right that Clutch would just get "Rifle" for M-16 and M-14, even if he qualified with both.

On the Wikipedia page I don't see "grenade launcher," so I'm not sure how Clutch (and others - including Zap!) would get M-79 (or M203 or other variants).

Snake Eyes: Definitely not my favorite character, but more due to overexposure and the shift from commando to ninja (and the comics continually setting his face on fire) than the concept. I like the idea of a black-clad highly competent ruthless killer on a team like Joe.

Anyway, his first file card is pretty vague on his background. He's basically good at everything ("Has received extensive training in mountaineering, underwater demolitions, jungle, desert and arctic survival, and some form of holistic medicine."). His second file card says that he was on the Long Range Reconnaissance Patrols. That makes sense for a military background coming into a team like Joe. His v3 file card says that he was both Ranger qualified AND did the Recondo course before joining the LRRPs. That seems odd to me. My understanding of the Recondo course was that it was an in-country course run by Ranger-qualified Green Berets for non-Ranger qualified personnel (sounds like something the character Recondo would have done). It was shorter, but more Vietnam-focused than the Ranger course. It seems strange to me, and a bit of a waste of time, that someone would have done both courses since Recondo was basically a repetition of Ranger.

The Ranger course would have been a good entry to the mountaineering and jungle and desert survival. Maybe he did an exchange with a SEAL team (I'm guessing that happens) to pick up the UDT stuff.

Anyway, the cards sort of explain his skills, but also seem to indicate more repetition in training than breadth of training.

A number of Joe file cards are written up with Vietnam backgrounds, which in some cases are developed in the comic. Stalker and Snake Eyes and Storm Shadow were LRRPs, and Stalker and Snake Eyes were in MACV SOG in 1968. Wild Bill was a LRRP. Shipwreck was in the Mekong, Spirit did something unspecified, Leatherneck was in 1st Recon Battalion, Breaker was in Project Delta, Mainframe was in an Airborne unit around '74. Duke joined Special Forces in 69 and worked with tribesmen. I'm sure there are a couple of others I've forgotten.

The above list touches on some of the various esoteric activities in Nam - LRRPs, riverine units, Green Berets raising indigenous forces, Project Delta . . . but there's a major omission: The Son Tay Prison raid (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Operation_Ivory_Coast). This was a complete failure as it turned out there weren't any prisoners there at the time of the raid, but was conducted by Green Berets in 1970, and it has had a major influence on US SOF culture ever since. Doesn't it seem weird that for all the Vietnam influence on Joe, no Joes were associated with this raid?

Snake Eyes: Definitely not my favorite character, but more due to overexposure and the shift from commando to ninja (and the comics continually setting his face on fire) than the concept. I like the idea of a black-clad highly competent ruthless killer on a team like Joe.

Anyway, his first file card is pretty vague on his background. He's basically good at everything ("Has received extensive training in mountaineering, underwater demolitions, jungle, desert and arctic survival, and some form of holistic medicine."). His second file card says that he was on the Long Range Reconnaissance Patrols. That makes sense for a military background coming into a team like Joe. His v3 file card says that he was both Ranger qualified AND did the Recondo course before joining the LRRPs. That seems odd to me. My understanding of the Recondo course was that it was an in-country course run by Ranger-qualified Green Berets for non-Ranger qualified personnel (sounds like something the character Recondo would have done). It was shorter, but more Vietnam-focused than the Ranger course. It seems strange to me, and a bit of a waste of time, that someone would have done both courses since Recondo was basically a repetition of Ranger.

The Ranger course would have been a good entry to the mountaineering and jungle and desert survival. Maybe he did an exchange with a SEAL team (I'm guessing that happens) to pick up the UDT stuff.

Anyway, the cards sort of explain his skills, but also seem to indicate more repetition in training than breadth of training.

I wholeheartedly agree that Snake-Eyes is way overused. Then I read in another thread something about the new Hama comics killed SE off and put some female version in there to continue on with his legacy or something? No thanks Jeff...

That aside I always thought his first filecard read more like a Navy SEAL than anything else, especially the "underwater demolitions" part. I could see him doing some sort of exchange program with the SEALs. Not sure if a SCUBA-qualified Special Forces Engineer Sergeant would have any training in underwater demolitions or not but I thought that would be closest to an Army equivalent to a SEAL.

Quote:

Originally Posted by LowTech

A number of Joe file cards are written up with Vietnam backgrounds, which in some cases are developed in the comic. Stalker and Snake Eyes and Storm Shadow were LRRPs, and Stalker and Snake Eyes were in MACV SOG in 1968. Wild Bill was a LRRP. Shipwreck was in the Mekong, Spirit did something unspecified, Leatherneck was in 1st Recon Battalion, Breaker was in Project Delta, Mainframe was in an Airborne unit around '74. Duke joined Special Forces in 69 and worked with tribesmen. I'm sure there are a couple of others I've forgotten.

The above list touches on some of the various esoteric activities in Nam - LRRPs, riverine units, Green Berets raising indigenous forces, Project Delta . . . but there's a major omission: The Son Tay Prison raid (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Operation_Ivory_Coast). This was a complete failure as it turned out there weren't any prisoners there at the time of the raid, but was conducted by Green Berets in 1970, and it has had a major influence on US SOF culture ever since. Doesn't it seem weird that for all the Vietnam influence on Joe, no Joes were associated with this raid?

Either A) Hama hadn't thought about it, B) the names of those involved are classified or C) the possibility of even one member of the Joes being involved with that operation (when there was a small number involved in the first place) would be slim to none.

Since I am "modernizing" my Joes all of those involved in Southeast Asian conflicts are going to be Afghanistan instead of Vietnam. Shipwreck I may make him fighting pirates off the Horn of Africa instead of the Mekong.

Are you making Shipwreck a SWCC? That might be the only place we know of where they currently operate. Unless there is some unknown action in the Philippines or something.

As for the Son Tay Raid. It was a failure so what's the point of having guys from that operation? Other than Duke, Colton, Claymore, no one else is a Green Beret from that era so that sort of limits who is involved. Keel-Haul and Payload maybe as pilots could have been involved though?

Operation Eagle Claw may have had some Joes though? https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Operation_Eagle_Claw
It's a little later, and a BIGGER failure, which could have led to the formation of the Joes, had a Snake-Eyes backstory tie-in (with the disfigurement, this may have been Hama's inspiration?)

Shipwreck could've served in a brown water capacity in Iraq on the Euphrates or Tigris rivers or around the Al-Faw peninsula. Pretty sure I read something once about anti-smuggling ops trying to thwart Iranians supplying militias in Iraq.

Are you making Shipwreck a SWCC? That might be the only place we know of where they currently operate. Unless there is some unknown action in the Philippines or something.

As for the Son Tay Raid. It was a failure so what's the point of having guys from that operation? Other than Duke, Colton, Claymore, no one else is a Green Beret from that era so that sort of limits who is involved. Keel-Haul and Payload maybe as pilots could have been involved though?

Operation Eagle Claw may have had some Joes though? https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Operation_Eagle_Claw
It's a little later, and a BIGGER failure, which could have led to the formation of the Joes, had a Snake-Eyes backstory tie-in (with the disfigurement, this may have been Hama's inspiration?)

Still not sure on Shipwreck yet. I keep going back and forth between SWCC and SEAL. I guess it depends on how I eventually settle on how my Joe structure is (if I ever get that accomplished. lol).

And Major Meadows sounds almost exactly like Duke....the only difference being that he actually took a commission. lol

Quote:

Originally Posted by CapBritain

Shipwreck could've served in a brown water capacity in Iraq on the Euphrates or Tigris rivers or around the Al-Faw peninsula. Pretty sure I read something once about anti-smuggling ops trying to thwart Iranians supplying militias in Iraq.

That aside I always thought his first filecard read more like a Navy SEAL than anything else, especially the "underwater demolitions" part. I could see him doing some sort of exchange program with the SEALs. Not sure if a SCUBA-qualified Special Forces Engineer Sergeant would have any training in underwater demolitions or not but I thought that would be closest to an Army equivalent to a SEAL.

Either A) Hama hadn't thought about it, B) the names of those involved are classified or C) the possibility of even one member of the Joes being involved with that operation (when there was a small number involved in the first place) would be slim to none.

Since I am "modernizing" my Joes all of those involved in Southeast Asian conflicts are going to be Afghanistan instead of Vietnam. Shipwreck I may make him fighting pirates off the Horn of Africa instead of the Mekong.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Loose Cannon

As for the Son Tay Raid. It was a failure so what's the point of having guys from that operation? Other than Duke, Colton, Claymore, no one else is a Green Beret from that era so that sort of limits who is involved. Keel-Haul and Payload maybe as pilots could have been involved though?

Operation Eagle Claw may have had some Joes though? https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Operation_Eagle_Claw
It's a little later, and a BIGGER failure, which could have led to the formation of the Joes, had a Snake-Eyes backstory tie-in (with the disfigurement, this may have been Hama's inspiration?)

I think some Army divers do underwater demo, but likely not to the extent that SEALs do.

EAGLE CLAW is the clear inspiration for Snake Eyes' injury (albeit in a Huey instead of a Stallion), and you're right - it was a monumental failure. Probably the biggest since Bay of Pigs (Mogadishu - Black Hawk Down may be a distant third, or perhaps the fiasco in Beirut). Hama doesn't have too many Joes dating back to the Son Tay time, but it was still a pretty big deal and I remain surprised that it never got a mention.

john shaft - if you're modernizing I can see Flint riding horses in Afghanistan, Stalker jumping on Kandahar, Snake Eyes being in one of the Chinooks that got shot down (or injured in the near-miss bomb on Karzai) and then taking Saddam in Iraq, and Torpedo capping OBL. Recondo and Shipwreck feel left out in the Philippines, and Wet Suit is trying to catch up by rescuing Captain Phillips.