Friday, February 17, 2012

I'm honored to have a guest post on the heart-wrenching intersection of doubt and community at Catapult Magazine.

I've written before (here and here, for example) about how hard it is now for me to rest in the structure of faith I was brought up in, the one my whole family and many of my friends embrace. It's been enough to drive me to (literal) despair at times. The community here has been gracious about it, but when I tried to share my story in words and writing with my former church communities, I was met … with no response.

This article at Catapult isn't about parenting, so you can click over only if you're interested. I'd love to speak with you further over there in the comments, and please enjoy the other articles on the subject of Taboo in this issue of this thoughtful magazine.

What’s the surest way to shut down conversation in a group of Christians? It’s to say you’re not sure what you believe anymore.

Ask me how I know this.

Several years ago now, I started doubting the fundamentals of the faith. It crept up on me — and scared me — so I kept it hidden away in my psyche, even from myself. I was too scared to examine the thoughts I was having.

…

My husband encouraged me to talk with other people, to be honest and work through it all in community. We were in an assortment of Bible studies and fellowship groups at the time, so I worked up my courage and said it out loud: I am doubting.

And that’s when I first knew the silence of a full room. People’s gazes slid onto their laps or the suddenly fascinating carpet. Everyone waited for someone else to do something with the person, me, who’d dared to speak the unspeakable. Finally, someone started a new thread of conversation, and the group moved on with relief.

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comments:

Thanks for sharing. I can totally relate. I grew up in Christian home and went to bible college, married a pastor even! but I have now come to a place where I just don't feel "christian" anymore... For me it's more of a head knowledge then feeling that I truly believe it. Of course, I know faith shouldn't be based on feelings but I feel as thought there should be some feelings otherwise I just have this hallow mechanical faith. (at least that's how I "feel" lol)

Just wanted to add...that I'm in Seattle as well...so if you ever want to talk (or check out our church) feel free to contact me. :)

I am so sorry you're having such a very difficult time with this. It's awful to try to juggle needing your community and needing to explore what you truly believe - especially when you have no local support - or even almost no support at all.

I am a non-Christian with a Christian husband and ILs.. I don't have the same struggles as you, but I am definitely sympathetic. Please feel free to tweet (@mendylady) me anytime to vent!!

Hello, what a brave post to write, its more controversial than mothering styles huh? My Mother is Protestant and my Father was Catholic, and this resulted in no faith being brought into our home. But, our extended families went to church (respectively), and I personally think it has left us kids (now aged 42, 39, and 35 lol), confused and faithless in a way that we feel we have missed out on something. When I go to church (infrequently) I feel like its a club I forgot to sign up for. Two weeks before my Father passed away he started carrying his rosary beads around with him, even though there was no indication that he was going to die. They seemed to comfort him in some way, and honestly in retrospect I was glad, and I wondered what would comfort me at the end.Valxxx

((((Hug)))) Thank you so much for your honesty and courage. I am so deeply sorry that your fellow Christians have responded in ways that only make you feel more isolated. I don't know that any of my answers can satisfy your questions, but I believe that there is tremendous value in asking those questions, anyway. I believe that God really is Love, and that He is big enough for questions and doubts. I admire you for giving voice to them, and pray that you will find what you are seeking. <3

I was raised around atheists and agnostics, so I freaked everyone out by becoming Christian. I think one advantage to this background is that I am very comfortable with doubt and skepticism. It is actually my "faith" that alarms most of the people in my life! :-)

That said, I am about the most skeptical and agnostic Christian who's had a crazy-conversion experience that you'll ever meet. Doubt is my norm, and I'm pretty used to it. I don't discuss my moments of profound faith with my atheist friends and I don't discuss my moments of profound doubts with my Christian friends (except my REALLY GOOD Christian friends). It's a lonely place to be sometimes.

But I also firmly believe that doubt, like faith, is something to be respected and accepted. Religious involvement is like a marriage - you're going to have times of burning passion, and times of really lukewarm meh, and that's okay.

I recently ran across this Karl Barth quote that I loved:

"Faith is not an art. Faith is not an achievement. Faith is not a good work of which some may boast while others can excuse themselves with a shrug of the shoulders for not being capable of it. It is a decisive insight of faith itself that all of us are incapable of faith in ourselves, whether we think of its preparation, beginning, continuation, or completion. In this respect believers understand unbelievers, skeptics, and atheists better than they understand themselves. Unlike unbelievers, they regard the impossibility of faith as necessary, not accidental."

Like the author of the article you linked, I've read a lot of books on faith and been disgusted by how condescending and circular they are. I mean, do they think I'm stupid? But I've also read some real mind-benders. I've learned to seek out theologians who are more comfortable and familiar with doubt, who do not fear it or avoid it, but see it as an integral part of the human condition and take it on.

I left the United Methodist Church in college and have since become Catholic. While I was never an agnostic or atheist, I did feel a lot of confusion about what church was the right place for me, and I definitely didn't feel like I was getting any satisfying answers from my local church. I think you might be like me in that you want an intellectually satisfying religion/belief system-not just one that wants you to sing cool songs and "feel" or whatever. Although I do love songs-a lot-and do sometimes have those warm fuzzy feelings so I'm not knocking them. Just saying that that's not enough for me. I'd encourage you to read. Read the Bible and read apologetics. First Things is a good website (it's conservative mostly-I don't really know where to find good liberal apologetics. Sorry-hopefully you'll get some good suggestions elsewhere.) And C.S. Lewis is awesome. I'm a big Narnia fan myself, but his adult non fiction is really great, especially for pondering serious religious issues. And the current Pope Benedict has written a lot-some about more specific issues that there is a clear Catholic-Protestant divide on, but also on less controversial (within Christianity anyway) issues like the life of Jesus. "God and the World" is the one I read first.

And I'm sure this has been said, but having doubts doesn't make you a "bad" Christian-it makes you a thinking one, and a human one. The stuff that Christianity teaches doesn't always seem to fit with what society-and sometimes even modern science-teaches, and it is difficult to reconcile that to where we can accept it. I heard somewhere that faith isn't the absence of doubt-it's believing despite the doubt. (someone famous probably said that but I'm too lazy to Google it.)

Anyway, I'd guess people don't know how to react because they aren't as smart as you and actually don't have the answers to the questions you're asking, but there have been really really smart people who have pondered those issues and written about it, and I think they will be more help to you than the people you've asked so far! Good luck!

Yeah, not only does doubt not make you a bad Christian - there is actually a long and illustrious and important tradition of doubt and questioning within Christian theology and thought that goes all the way back to St. Augustine (or heck, Peter and doubting Thomas!). It's too bad that many churches and church-goers are so uncomfortable with it. I figure if the APOSTLES felt doubt sometimes, then you certainly can't blame the rest of us for having some questions. :-)

Thanks for sharing! I hope you continue to write more on this topic. I'm going through the same thing. Religion is a tricky subject. I wrote a comment almost two years ago on your "Reshaping faith" post, a month after I found your blog, and funny enough it still applies today. What I can most relate to is pretending. Most of the time that I attended church I was pretending. I hated not being authentic, so I stopped going. 4 years 6 months later, I'm contemplating returning. This time, if I do go, I'm not going to pretend to believe everything. I've heard many people say that religion isn't a buffet, where you can pick and choose doctrine, but I say, "Why not?" If a doctrine doesn't feel right (like Original Sin) then don't believe it (my religion doesn't believe in that doctrine, by the way.) This world is full of different philosophies and perspectives and God is aware of that. I feel it is ignorant for us to claim that we know everything (e.g. that a particular religion is true and the others false.) As far as praying, I feel the same way as you do at times. Over all, it's my strongest spiritual trait though. Praying (even if there isn't a God) can be very therapeutic and motivational.

I'm certainly not in the position to give parenting advice, but if you feel uncomfortable about talking to your son about theism, just have your husband talk to him but be honest with him. I hope that when my daughter is old enough to have a conversation we can talk about church, why her friends go, and that she doesn't have to go if she doesn't want to (or vice verse.) I want to tell my daughter what I believe in and what I'm not sure about. The most important thing, perhaps, is to ask children what they think. These conversations will be testimony-building in the long run. It will be interesting to see how my perspective changes if I go back to church. I wrote about some of my thoughts on my blog. http://oldnewlegacy.wordpress.com/2012/02/15/why-church-gets-my-knickers-in-a-twist/

Hi Lauren,First, I love your blog. I was so happy to find another mom in Seattle with similar interests in parenting. My son was 11lbs 6 oz, I know I don't have to say any more.Regarding you post today, I think you are so brave. As an atheist, I can't imagine what you're going through, but I have some very good friends who have shared with me their struggles with faith. I guess I'm ” safe.” What I've all always said is that faith is just that, faith. There is no evidence, or even a special feeling universal to all those who believe, and that is the incredible power of faith. There is literally no argument against faith, by definition. And faith, for many people isn't just a feeling, it's a reason for being a good person and a guide to live by. These are all good things that you should feel good about. I imagine, like most things, there's a continuum of faith, and part of your journey is to find the right place for yourself on that continuum. There's only strength in introspection and self discovery. That being said, my son has god parents, and ”ungod” parents, because whatever he believes I want him to come by it because it feels right in his heart, not because mommy and daddy believe it. I guess I have faith in my son that he will find his path, and I practice in order to have the courage to accept his individualism. I have no doubt that the love you give your sons will guide them down a good path, because you're a good mom.

As always, so well-written! I applaud you for writing this, Lauren. I know how you feel, as I questioned my faith and even dabbled in Paganism throughout my twenties. It was about 10 years of me coming to grips with what I had always been taught about God. Coming back to a full understanding (fuller than it ever was before) of my faith came in its own time... I couldn't force it to happen, it just did. I came out on the other side of my doubts after my son was born, as I was dealing with what I now know was a mild form of PPD.

I'd had inklings before that you were dealing with something like this, but obviously had missed part of the story (not that I imagine that I know "the whole story" based on one post -- that is part of the problem, isn't it?), and just wanted to say: I love you and treasure you as a friend, whatever you do or don't believe.

And I hesitate to say "I'm praying for you," because in this kind of context that too easily means "I'm trying to passive-aggressively manipulate you into stepping back into line by letting you know that I'm expending emotional energy on your behalf pleading with a being who may or may not exist to change the way you think." But I'm gonna have to go with the Oprah definition of prayer as a way of expressing love at a distance, because even though I yelled in protest at my television set when she defined prayer that way, because no, Oprah, that's not "ALL" prayer is, it is in fact at least a PART of what prayer is, and that's the part I want to share when I tell you I'm praying for you.

I actually really loved this post, Lauren. I think Christians are afraid to express doubt, especially in the Protestant/Evangelical church. People in those churches often seem so wrapped up in "Christianese" and Christian niceties that anything dark scars them. Whether it's death or doubt. But doubting doesn't mean you don't have faith.

My senior year of college I was very challenged in my faith (typical evangelical background) and started studying Catholicism. I'm still sympathetic to the Catholic/Orthodox faiths, but am currently Anglican. But during that process I just became frustrated. I felt like all my "faith" had become just knowledge. And while things I learned completely WOW'D me about God, I didn't FEEL it. I didn't feel like I was really growing. I felt bewildered and confused.

Something my (now) husband had said to me at that time really struck me, and sticks with me today, was something along the lines of "Whether you are moving forwards or moving backwards, at least you are still moving." That your faith in God can still be growing, even if it feels like it's going backwards. I don't think I've fully recovered from that time. Some of it is just confusion about what my faith should look like now that my beliefs have changed. I think it's the Protestant vs. Closet Catholic/Orthodox fighting in me to a large degree.

Another degree, though, is that now that I'm a mom, I face a different battle. What should my faith look like NOW as a mother? I am often very discouraged, even in my family centric church that discourages the nursery-setting and loves babies jabbering in the services. I feel left out as a mother sometimes. I feel like I'm expected to attend Bible studies, or help make meals, clean the church kitchen, volunteer to teach a children's class or some other mode of service....but my life is consumed with my child. I find it hard to make a meal just for my family sometimes. Sometimes, all I want to do is sit down and nurse my baby. And then I feel guilty when mothers with more children than I have are teaching classes, attending the studies, etc, etc. And I can't tell if I'm just selfish and lazy or if I'm just fine doing what I'm doing. I've had to find my faith in the little things, the infantile things, as I teach my toddler how to pray. I have a little alter set up by our stairs and it reminds me to pray "Thank you God for our play today." Christ said that unless we become like little children, we will not see the kingdom of God. And so I've prayed that my faith would be simple, like a child's, as I teach my child.

It's kind of a strange place to be. Having been a Christian all my life and now having to kind of relearn what it really even means. My "Christian" home was detached and chaotic, the home I am building now is (striving to be) peaceful and attached. So it comes with different expectations about my faith, I think... if that makes sense. I don't know. I'm rambling now. I hope you find your answers to your questions. Sometimes, when I don't know what to pray about or I don't even want to pray (ahem, which is more often than i'd like to admit) I end up praying something like "God, help me want to pray...and if I'm lying in this prayer, help to want to want to pray." (Yes, two "to wants" on purpose :) That way I have all my bases covered right? Haha :)

And one last thought I'll leave you with: all of her life, Mother Theresa never felt God. She felt a great darkness in that area. Yet she faithfully served God, and found Christ in the poor lepers she served. The book "Mother Teresa: Come Be My Light" might inspire you. :)

The way my circle dealt with it was deciding I'd "had a fight" with God, which would soon be over when I realized his way was always right; and that I was "experiencing totally normal doubt---we ALL doubt sometimes, it's NORMAL!"

Lauren, I want to hug you. Doubt has been my predominant experience of God, really. Through experience I have come to feel Truth and realize the doubt is in man related ideas. This doubt can be "healthy", even necessary for the more true, pure experience of life you desire.

Maybe there is solace to be found in the silence... there's something that strikes me about it and your willingness to relate it here...

And as for talking with your son, possibly you can just let him know that Truth resides in him and ask him questions to see how he feels as ultimately it is more about that than what we tell our kids about the nature of Life. If you feel comfortable at some point you can share that sometimes, often times you feel unsure also and that you're learning to trust yourself and your motivations as you go along in life. Not sure I worded that 'just right' but possibly it will be helpful.

I assure you that you are right where you need to be. Some potentially insightful resources may be the writings of Joel S Goldsmith or Eckhart Tolle.

I was so sure and certain for so long...even went to college to become a missionary - it was my whole life. But nothing turned out the way I thought it would and it was not long before many people I respected and looked up to began turning their backs on me once I stopped fitting into their ideals.

It still took me many years to get to the place I am now - which is pretty much feeling like I hardly know anything! There are certain things I still consider to be part of my personal faith but for the most part it's all been turned upside down - at this point I'm glad for it, though experiencing rejection is never easy. My mom definitely thinks I'm a 'heathen', and when I had a recent discussion with my brother about how I no longer believe in hell - what does he do but send me a book (as a gift!) about hell. He's not even that into Christianity, but apparently that particular belief is something that holds such high importance that he felt the need to pass it along!

Mostly I try to laugh - and to surround myself with people I CAN talk to. There's been quite a few surprising discoveries among friends who seemed as entrenched as I was.

Anyway, I'm kind of babbling but Lauren, I really am sorry you've had to experience so much unwillingness to address your doubts, and you are so not alone, and you are more real than many who will simply accept things at face value without question. That is nothing but immaturity in my mind.

I'm truly hoping you can find your community, and happy to be part of it if you ever want to chat. :) Love to you! ~Kelly @BecomingCrunchy

@Brittany @ The Pistachio Project: I can relate to what you've just said for sure. I used to know the feelings weren't what I was supposed to concentrate on, but I had them all the same. And now … I don't. And it makes me feel like Spock or something, ugh.

@Valerie: Ah, yes. The fear of death is a huge one for me. It always has been, but it's worse now that I'm a mother who doesn't know if there's an afterlife. My old beliefs were so much more reassuring on that score. I hope we can both figure out something that brings us peace.

@Inder-ific: That's funny that you went the opposite way and are now scaring everybody. :) I guess it's always something! I'd love to hear more of your thoughts and your conversion story, plus any book recommendations you'd like to throw my way. I can totally understand this: I don't discuss my moments of profound faith with my atheist friends and I don't discuss my moments of profound doubts with my Christian friends. It's hard to know who can be trusted with the murky grays that are in our head. Thanks for the hope that this is maybe a phase in my relationship with God, and that better is to come; that gives me a little something to hold onto.

@Crunchy Con Mommy: I will add you to the long list of people I know who converted to Catholicism! Makes me wonder if that's in my future. ;) (I can't see it personally, but it really is funny how many I know!)

I'm a huge C.S. Lewis fan, so I'll check out some of the other resources you listed — thanks. I don't want to say thanks for telling me I'm too smart for everybody because that sounds incredibly vain, ha ha, but thanks for the hope that other intelligent people have written on just this topic. That was one of the hopes I had when I first started sharing, actually, that someone somewhere would give me recommendations of other people who came through doubts and ended up with faith again, but, as the article says, no one responded at all or responded ineffectually. I appreciate the reading recommendations, is what I'm saying! :)

@Becky: Totally. I think that proscription against using religion as a buffet is part of what's holding me back from reshaping my faith into a new form. It's like it's been drilled into my head that it's all or nothing, so I'm left with … nothing.

I've talked with Sam a bit more now that he's read my article (nothing like a blog post to get conversation flowing!) about how we talk with our kids about faith. He said that he, too, feels false sometimes, or overly simplistic, so that was reassuring, that we're both unsure of how to approach passing along belief. I think I'm feeling a bit more confident, through these talks here and with Sam, and through a post and comment conversation with Jorje at NPN: Anti-Faith, in the idea of being upfront with Mikko (and Alrik) that I'm not sure what I believe but letting them know what our church believes and asking what they believe.

@Rachel: Thank you, friend. I felt a little tongue-tied when writing about it in the past, somewhat because I felt like I needed to write everything I thought about the issue at once, and as all bloggers know, it's impossible.

I really do appreciate your prayers, and your fist shaking at Oprah, and I know you mean it in the best sense. Thank you. ♥

What a beautifully brave thing to share. <3 I can't speak much to questioning faith, as I don't have religious beliefs myself. Still, I do believe in concepts that require faith, and I wanted to respond to your feelings of reluctance and uncertainty when answering questions from your little one(s). You don't have to have all the answers. Part of "faith" is understanding that we can't concretely *know* all of the hows or whys.

Since we are not religious, I want to be careful how I answer those questions from my own child(ren), because I want them to feel free to explore religion and spirituality and come to the conclusions that are right for them, even if they believe differently than I do. My plan is to reflect the questions back and allow them to determine the answers that feel right for them. So when my daughter asks me if God is real, or why Grandma goes to church and we don't, or any other host of questions surrounding faith, I'll respond by explaining that some people believe X, and some people believe Y, and some people believe Z, and ask her which sounds most right to her?

This way, you aren't in a position of feeling like you have to be dishonest. If he asks what YOU believe, you can be honest and say that your are still learning what you believe, because it is a life-long process.

Thank you for sharing this. Even though I'm coming from a different place, spiritually speaking, it's important for all of us to think about how we will have these sort of discussions with our kids in order to encourage faith that is found through critical thinking and not through blind adherence to what they are told.

Thank you for this post, I felt like you were talking directly to me!I grew up in a home with no religion. God was just another fantasy figure head like Santa and The Easter Bunny. We never prayed or went to church and the only time God came up was when the topic of death arose and then it was only in a context of "don't worry, when you die you go to heaven" and that was it.

As a teen I began to feel like there was more to and began my journey to seek it out for myself. I went to many different churches but always felt weird, like an outsider, in them.

This journey continued in my early 20's with periods of active seeking followed by lulls where I just gave up for a bit. After the birth of our first child I began actively seeking again. I wanted him to have SOMETHING. I didn't know what but I wanted my kids to grow up with more than I did. A firm faith. I didn't want them walking around with a constant feeling of emptiness like something was missing.

Finally, after the birth of our first daughter I thought I found it. Everything was perfect for 2 yrs. Then, I don't know what happened. I started having those weird outsider feelings again. Something I have not shared with anyone until just now. Although I am sure many in our church know/suspect. We have pretty much stopped going to church. We will go months w/o it then I will spontaneously feel the urge, pack the kids up and go only for it to be an epic disaster again.

I have considered blogging about it but, knowing people from church read my blog, I avoid it. So thank you for this.

I want to go back to that time when I first started going and I was just happy, I had 100% pure faith and was happy. Now, I just feel lost again.

Wow. You are so amazingly brave, and you make it easier for the rest of us to be brave too. Thank you for sharing not just on this topic but on so many that are hard to open up about.

For me, it was fairly easy to admit to myself that I MUST be an agnostic, and have more in common with atheists than with the Christian family and friends I'm surrounded by. But the next steps--I haven't really taken them yet. It's like I lose even my vocabulary...I can't say "I'm praying for you" or "God bless you" anymore...sometimes I'll say something like, "maybe the universe will send something good your way" or something and I'm ALWAYS corrected, "You mean GOD of course." And I'm horrified at the thought of what they'd all DO, what kind of...intervention...they'd inflict upon me if they knew I don't believe exactly what they believe (and, for that matter, never did). I think it's ridiculously sad and even scary how people think it's better to believe in ANYTHING than that it's okay not to believe.

I think someone else suggested this already, but it's my absolute favorite way to handle just about everything...just always ask Mikko, "What do you think? Does that sound right to you?" and then if it does, great, and if it doesn't, great too...then you'll get a gauge of what he is and isn't interested/ready in discussing.It's also not controlling/dictatorial, nor does it leave us to choose between over-sharing our difficulties with them or feeding them the party line either.

I would say good luck and God bless but then I'd feel like a huge hypocrite. And if I say I'm sending good vibes your way, then I'll feel like an outdated '60s-era hippie. I need a new vocabulary.

But you? You'll be fine. You're so thoughtful, and open, and questioning, and caring, and honest, and brave, that whatever happens, I have faith...in you! ;) Hugs from afar.

Lauren - Thank you for this post. I have been struggling with this quite a bit.

I am a preacher's daughter. I was in church for the first time when I was a few days old. I've spent my whole life believing what my parents told me. When I went away to Uni, I took a break from church. Having been raised in the church I was 1) sick of having it shoved down my throat and 2) sick of all the fake fake Christians I saw everywhere. (You get an interesting perspective as a preacher's kid).

So now I haven't been to church in 10 years and I have 3 beautiful kids and suddenly I'm having panic attacks in the middle of the night about death, about what I believe. I have resumed prayer and recently dug my bible out of a box (though I haven't cracked it yet)...

But my adult brain suddenly sees all those "stories" my family/church told me as a kid in a totally different light. I am full of questions and feel like I have nowhere to turn...I'm not sure how to broach the subject with my parents as they've since left the church and I still fear they'd give me the same pat answers. I look at the churches around me and they all seem just as fake as the ones I grew up in. My friends and husband are not religious.

I remember being a kid and reading about people's conversion stories and feeling jealous of their ability to choose, to discover the answers for themselves, rather than to just simply believe what they've always been told. Now, as an adult, I guess I'm beginning that journey for myself...but I find it bewildering, frightening and lonely. Thank you for letting me know that I'm not the only one.

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Riding the rails with my husband, Crackerdog Sam, and our hobo kids, Mikko Lint Picker (born June 2007), Alrik Irontrousers (born May 2011), and one on the way (coming October 2014). Trying every day to parent intentionally and with grace.