Hasbro and Lucasfilm weren't wrong in naming the red b-wing-suited Sullustan "Nien Nunb", during the briefing scene in ROTJ, you can see clearly that Nien is standing right next to Lando, and he's wearing a red B-wing pilot costume. I'll attach a still showing him next to Lando:

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You can tell it's Nien because A) he's standing next to Lando, and B) he's wearing his flight cap (which Hasbro did not produce with the recent flight suit Nien Nunb figure). Here's another shot of Nien from a different angle (you can see Wedge standing on his right side and make out Lando's cape on his left) where the hoses on his B-wing pilot costume are present:

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But stranger, a few minutes earlier, there's a long shot of Lando & Nien Nunb, and Nien is TALLER than Lando!

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The official database lists Nien Nunb as being 1.6m, which is 5' 2", while Lando is listed as 1.78, which is 5' 8" (and also wrong since Billy Dee Williams is 5' 11"). I'm 6' tall and my sister is 5' 2" tall, together she's nearly a head shorter than me.

This blows my mind a little, it counters 2 notions I had always carried:

that Nien Nunb was always *just* the guy in the Falcon costume, and
that Nien Nunb was a pretty small guy.

It also puts into question the very existence of Ten Numb, the "other" Sullustan that's in a white B-wing costume as seen in the movie's production materials. Nien Nunb is back in his red B-wing pilot duds and hat at the end of the film during the celebration, but there are no white B-wing outfit-wearing Sullustans in the film at all that I can see, and none without a hat.

That said, the hat Nien wears is merely the same flight helmet that Ten Numb has always had, but without the earpieces and chinstrap. So is that just a generic Sullustan hat that has earpieces clamped on, and for no reason at all, Ten Numb wears red in the film and is standing next to Lando during the briefing? I'm not buying it, but there is still wiggle room.

Darth Awgmon

08-20-2010, 04:37 PM

Nice research, JT! I love finding out new stuff about the original movies. Nien Nunb was one of my favorite minor characters and ROTJ action figures as a kid. Later in life, my friends and I referred to him as "pu**y face." I hope I can get away with that here!

El Chuxter

08-20-2010, 04:43 PM

In that last shot, are you sure it's not the perspective that makes him look taller than Lando? To me, they look like they're about the same height, but that's not accounting for Nien being closer to the camera than Lando, which is what it looks like to me?

Nien's head is also much larger than Lando's in the last shot, which makes me think that's a trick of perspective.

Mr. JabbaJohnL

08-20-2010, 05:15 PM

In that last shot, are you sure it's not the perspective that makes him look taller than Lando? To me, they look like they're about the same height, but that's not accounting for Nien being closer to the camera than Lando, which is what it looks like to me?

Nien's head is also much larger than Lando's in the last shot, which makes me think that's a trick of perspective.
If he's closer, it's only very slightly, by perhaps three inches at most. Look at the table in front of them to see how he couldn't be that much closer than Lando. And in case you weren't aware, Nien Numb in that shot is a human actor with a mask on his head, meaning of course his head is going to look larger than a normal human head. :p

This is a very interesting find, JT!

JediTricks

08-20-2010, 05:16 PM

Nice research, JT! I love finding out new stuff about the original movies. Nien Nunb was one of my favorite minor characters and ROTJ action figures as a kid. Later in life, my friends and I referred to him as "pu**y face." I hope I can get away with that here!Thanks! I was actually researching the Y-wing pilot costume for a Q&A question that was being suggested, and when I saw it, I couldn't believe what I was saying.

Nien Nunb always captured my attention when I was a kid too.

Your self-censor with 2 letters out is adequate for the site's needs. That term is generally reserved for the titular character in "Predator" though. ;)

In that last shot, are you sure it's not the perspective that makes him look taller than Lando? To me, they look like they're about the same height, but that's not accounting for Nien being closer to the camera than Lando, which is what it looks like to me?

Nien's head is also much larger than Lando's in the last shot, which makes me think that's a trick of perspective.I am positive it's not perspective. They're standing next to each other and the camera is pretty far away and not at a funky angle. There are other shots that show it as well, and shots from the celebration at the end where he's taller than other pilots. I'll include the next frame from that shot of Nien, Wedge, and Lando so you can see where Lando's head is:

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Plus, looking at the shot, Wedge is closer to the camera and yet Nien is still taller than him, so the idea that perspective is at play here is unlikely. And in that shot's action, Nien's is nodding so it's slightly lower in that shot. Nien Nunb is taller than Lando.

And of course Nien's head is larger than a human's, it's a full-head puppet alien mask, it's larger in real life.

El Chuxter

08-20-2010, 05:48 PM

Okay, that shot shows it a bit better. The long shot of them, and it could be due to the focus, looks like Nien could be standing as much as a foot or two closer to the foreground when you account for the curvature of the table. No mistaking there's a height discrepancy from what we've been told in this pic, though.

When I was referring to his head, it looked (and it could, again, be due to them both being blurry in the long shot) proportionally larger to the body and to Lando's head than in the other shots.

Very good detective work, JT.

DarkJedi5

08-20-2010, 05:52 PM

Well, this all sorta makes sense to me. I mean, I always thought Nien was shorter cause he looks shorter sitting next to Lando on the Falcon. But when you think about it, he's sitting in Chewie's chair and Chewie is really tall and so perhaps his seat is set lower on the ship. Like when my wife sits in the driver seat after I get out of the car she can barely reach the pedals. If the seats on the Falcon are not easily adjustable, and the actors/characters just sat in the seats, Han's chair being higher would make Lando seem taller.

Rocketboy

08-20-2010, 11:09 PM

That is not Nien Nunb!

You guys are just racists that think all Sullustans look the same.

bigbarada

08-22-2010, 09:04 AM

From the behind the scenes info that I've read, Nien Nunb was supposed to be leading a B-Wing squadron in the battle that eventually destroyed the Super Star Destroyer. That's where that one famous image of a group of B-Wings flying away from an exploding Star Destroyer came from. However, for some reason the scenes weren't filmed and I believe the Green Leader A-Wing Pilot scenes were filmed to fill in those gaps.

Also, Nein Nunb in the Millennium Falcon is a puppet, not a guy in a costume. Which probably explains the height inconsistencies.

Bel-Cam Jos

08-22-2010, 09:30 AM

And in no way does NN resemble Snaggletooth, the most acurate screen-to-toy version in SW lore. I heard Kenner originally had him with webbed boots, since they figured (pun always intended) Nunb was from Walrusman's world.

Good video evidence, JT. But the heights of characters are relative when it comes to their bios and backstories.

Mad Slanted Powers

08-22-2010, 01:12 PM

If he is taller than Lando, then how do you explain the first shot where he is clearly shorter?

LTBasker

08-22-2010, 05:06 PM

That's actually Ate Nunb. Nien is his twin brother and Ten is Ate's son with Too Nunb. :p

The height on whoever that is is difficult to really gather from those screencaps, each one looks different. The first has him drastically shorter, the second has Lando looking barely taller (an inch or so), and the third is too far away to be reliable. I can believe it was supposed to be Nien, though. Although if it is supposed to be Ten, the cap could be explained as part of the gear since it looks like it's supposed to be an aviator-inspired flight cap.

The white/gray flightsuit that "Ten Nunb" is shown in was probably given to the Y-wing pilots. I'm going to guess they randomly made more B-wing pilot equipment than Y-wing equipment, which obviously meant B-wing Pilots would be more abundant. So, they probably decided to switch'em to a brighter color so their presence in the background would be noticed rather than blending with the white set.

JediTricks

08-22-2010, 10:34 PM

Okay, that shot shows it a bit better. The long shot of them, and it could be due to the focus, looks like Nien could be standing as much as a foot or two closer to the foreground when you account for the curvature of the table. No mistaking there's a height discrepancy from what we've been told in this pic, though.

When I was referring to his head, it looked (and it could, again, be due to them both being blurry in the long shot) proportionally larger to the body and to Lando's head than in the other shots.

Very good detective work, JT.I think a closer, lower shot would be more likely to cause the type of height discrepancy you originally considered, which is why I didn't consider it. But also, seeing it move and breathe probably told me a lot more than a few frames and text descriptions could say.

Thanks!

Well, this all sorta makes sense to me. I mean, I always thought Nien was shorter cause he looks shorter sitting next to Lando on the Falcon. But when you think about it, he's sitting in Chewie's chair and Chewie is really tall and so perhaps his seat is set lower on the ship. Like when my wife sits in the driver seat after I get out of the car she can barely reach the pedals. If the seats on the Falcon are not easily adjustable, and the actors/characters just sat in the seats, Han's chair being higher would make Lando seem taller.I really like that idea, it made me chuckle quite a bit. I'm not ready to subscribe to it though, Han is sitting in Chewie's seat at a normal height just after Tarkin and Vader discuss letting the Falcon escape, but I like the thinking none the less.

Also, I just found this which suggests that Nien isn't sitting lower than Lando:

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Notice that he is slightly lower, but look at the angle of the dashboard in the front and the door in the back, the camera's tilted so Nien would look lower due to that. Here's a few shots from the opposite angle (the first is dark and Lando's leaning down a little and Nien isn't, so I tracked down one where they're both around the same posture):

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Now I'm beginning to question why I ever thought Nien was shorter. Was it just the suggestion of the toys?

From the behind the scenes info that I've read, Nien Nunb was supposed to be leading a B-Wing squadron in the battle that eventually destroyed the Super Star Destroyer. That's where that one famous image of a group of B-Wings flying away from an exploding Star Destroyer came from. However, for some reason the scenes weren't filmed and I believe the Green Leader A-Wing Pilot scenes were filmed to fill in those gaps.

Also, Nein Nunb in the Millennium Falcon is a puppet, not a guy in a costume. Which probably explains the height inconsistencies.The sitting puppet height doesn't appear to be SHORTER than the performer (Kirk Thatcher) as seen in this pic:

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[source: http://movies.ign.com/articles/035/035854p1.html ]

And in no way does NN resemble Snaggletooth, the most acurate screen-to-toy version in SW lore. I heard Kenner originally had him with webbed boots, since they figured (pun always intended) Nunb was from Walrusman's world.

Good video evidence, JT. But the heights of characters are relative when it comes to their bios and backstories.I don't really catch the drift of what you're saying in anything here.

If he is taller than Lando, then how do you explain the first shot where he is clearly shorter?This is an example of what Chux and I are talking about. In this case, the camera is extremely low and close to the main subject in the shot, Lando, while others in the shot are standing further back and thus appear lower, because they're not as close to the low camera. It's the same reason why those 2 X-wing pilots in the background of that shot are even shorter than Nien, they are further from the camera.

The white/gray flightsuit that "Ten Nunb" is shown in was probably given to the Y-wing pilots. I'm going to guess they randomly made more B-wing pilot equipment than Y-wing equipment, which obviously meant B-wing Pilots would be more abundant. So, they probably decided to switch'em to a brighter color so their presence in the background would be noticed rather than blending with the white set.Not likely that they gave the white suits to the Y-wing guys, the Y-wing jumpsuits have a closed neck with no collar just like the X-wing jumpsuits, while the B-wing jumpsuits have an open neck design with a standard fold-over collar.

El Chuxter

08-22-2010, 10:54 PM

The EU has long maintained that Sullustans are short, possibly based on the shots in the Falcon. Maybe that's why you thought that, JT?

JediTricks

08-22-2010, 11:03 PM

Only the shots from the Falcon aren't short.

Mad Slanted Powers

08-22-2010, 11:13 PM

How do we know he isn't using a booster seat?

JediTricks

08-22-2010, 11:20 PM

How do we know he isn't using a booster seat?
Occam's razor.

Mad Slanted Powers

08-22-2010, 11:34 PM

Occam's razor.

Ah, you're no fun anymore.

Bel-Cam Jos

08-23-2010, 12:07 AM

Kenner used different screen shots to create their Snaggletooth figure, and then found other shots for a taller one. Since they never saw Ponda Boba's (who?) legs, I guess they assumed that a walrus alien should have webbed feet for swimming. I don't think Han's age/height/weight are the same as Harrison Ford's, and many of the actors' info isn't necessarily the same as their characters (is Vader that tall? or Yoda that short? Luke/Mark compared to Leia/Carrie? etc.).

But, since I am often confusing, just feel free to ignore me in this instance. :rolleyes: To confirm that idea, maybe Nien Nunb was cut shorter by this Occam person and his razor of which you speak, JT.

Mad Slanted Powers

08-23-2010, 12:10 AM

But, since I am often confusing, just feel free to ignore me in this instance. :rolleyes: To confirm that idea, maybe Nien Nunb was cut shorter by this Occam person and his razor of which you speak, JT.That's exactly what I was thinking. Once again, we great minds think alike.

El Chuxter

08-23-2010, 01:14 AM

It can't be Occam's Razor. He would've cut his butt.

JimJamBonds

08-23-2010, 02:38 PM

It can't be Occam's Razor. He would've cut his butt.

No, its the new and improved Occam's SAFTEY razor. His butt is just fine. lol

bigbarada

08-23-2010, 08:20 PM

The sitting puppet height doesn't appear to be SHORTER than the performer (Kirk Thatcher) as seen in this pic:

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[source: http://movies.ign.com/articles/035/035854p1.html

First of all, that picture just looks wrong on so many levels. :eek:

Anyways, I've seen this image of the B-Wing Pilot Nien Nunb before. So it confirms that Hasbro wasn't just making stuff up.

As for his height, I don't know what to say. I was also under the impression that Nein Nunb was supposed to be short, but I have no idea where that notion came from. The vintage figure was about average height, but the POTF2 figure was shorter than everyone else at the time. Could this just be more of Lucasfilm's resizing of its characters despite what we see onscreen?

JediTricks

08-24-2010, 01:44 AM

Ah, you're no fun anymore.That's not what your mot... never mind. :p

Kenner used different screen shots to create their Snaggletooth figure, and then found other shots for a taller one. Since they never saw Ponda Boba's (who?) legs, I guess they assumed that a walrus alien should have webbed feet for swimming. I don't think Han's age/height/weight are the same as Harrison Ford's, and many of the actors' info isn't necessarily the same as their characters (is Vader that tall? or Yoda that short? Luke/Mark compared to Leia/Carrie? etc.).

But, since I am often confusing, just feel free to ignore me in this instance. :rolleyes: To confirm that idea, maybe Nien Nunb was cut shorter by this Occam person and his razor of which you speak, JT.No, actually that made a LOT of sense, it just needed a little more context (or separation) to get the idea across. Snags was the wrong height, Walrusman's legs were way out there, Han's height is indeed different from Ford's like many of the actors (although Vader is that tall when Prowse is wearing the suit). And those are all salient points to this discussion, just the presentation was what vexed me.

No, its the new and improved Occam's SAFTEY razor. His butt is just fine. lol"Safety razor", what are you, someone's grandpappy? Not exactly a modern term. :D

First of all, that picture just looks wrong on so many levels. :eek:No, you know what's really wrong? Imagine having to puppet Nien Nunb in the Falcon cockpit using that same rig but with an actor in the seat behind the character!

Anyways, I've seen this image of the B-Wing Pilot Nien Nunb before. So it confirms that Hasbro wasn't just making stuff up.Some of the jury in this thread is still out, but I'm with you, the evidence is strong in that favor.

As for his height, I don't know what to say. I was also under the impression that Nein Nunb was supposed to be short, but I have no idea where that notion came from. The vintage figure was about average height, but the POTF2 figure was shorter than everyone else at the time. Could this just be more of Lucasfilm's resizing of its characters despite what we see onscreen?Right? That's how I feel as well, cannot track down in my mind the idea of where the mouseman was a short character, but I'm fairly confident it was before the POTF2 figure - though I wouldn't testify to that in court.

Lucasfilm's numbers you and I have proved are totally out the window crapola - 5' 4" on C-3PO is ludicrous too, and there are others.

JimJamBonds

08-24-2010, 03:35 PM

"Safety razor", what are you, someone's grandpappy? Not exactly a modern term. :D

That is kinda what I was going for there actually!

JediTricks

08-25-2010, 04:00 PM

That is kinda what I was going for there actually!
Suuuuure, claim irony. We know the truth, you're someone's grandpa.

JimJamBonds

08-25-2010, 10:32 PM

You are both right AND wrong sir, I was "kinda" claiming to be somebody's grandpa.