UMECUnited Mining Exploration Commission: A group of friends playing JumpGate-- "a MMORPG that launched smoothly, breaks from fantasy character setting, emphasizes PvP, and is the first persistent world space simulator that nobody talks about." ~Scorch

I *LOVE* how you know what other ships and bases are up to. This is the first big "sandbox" game (which includes Hardwar, Terminus, and even Morrowind) that really provides you with a LOT of information on the goings-on around you.

To use an example, let's use Terminus. Terminus, despite its ugly graphics and somewhat suspect newtonian flight model, was a pretty good representation of a small, working dynamic universe. However, much of what went on in the universe was a mystery -- ships would be flying around, combats would be occuring, and the player would effectively be isolated from all of this because of the dearth of information. Because of this lack of information, the ships (and NPC) pilots may have just as well be randomly generated, ala BC3k. This isolation was enough to turn me off from the game.

Morrowind is much the same way. There's a ton of NPCs out there, but they have no sense of purpose or agenda. That adds to the sense of disconnection and isolation. (Modders have addressed this issue in many way, particularly with companions, but there still isn't the feeling of a "living world").

Hardwar did an excellent job with its dynamic economy, and comes close to Freelancer with world interactivity.

Freelancer doesn't have the complex dynamic model that Terminus has, but DAMN is it a kick in the pants to hear the NPC ships interacting -- trade manifests and locations, police requests, and the like. There's a great "feel" to Freelancer's universe, even if the economy is not dynamic.

Anybody else think that this is the best part of Freelancer?

I guess the question boils down to: "Why, after all of this time, can't anyone get it right:"

- Privateer freedom juxtaposed with a great big story;
- Dynamic economy ala Hardwar;
- Persistent universe ala Terminus (yes, once an NPC ship was created it stuck around in the universe and you could meet up with it much later...if it hadn't been destroyed by then);
- Player-centralized (if unrealistic) information per Freelancer;
- Modern day graphics engine;
- Decent cause-effect political/caste system (Privateer, et al).

Mystery Guest wrote:

Egosoft are attempting to do all of that with X2: The Threat. Of course how successfully they pull it off remains to be seen... They already did the persistant universe and dynamic economy parts very well in the previous games in the series; the aim with X2 is to bring the rest of that stuff in your list up to the same level.

Oh, and being a part of their developer network I can also tell you that the generated missions will have a heck of a lot more variety than Freelancer's... In fact they even got the community involved with creating missions for it.

scharmers wrote:

X:BTF and X-T were simply, to me, another example of a long series of space-sims that come so damn close, yet have critical flaws. In both of those games, I felt a)that combat sucked, and b)the time-to-fun ratio was just too high. Granted, they did have a superb economics model and a great persistent universe, but the game (talking about X-T here) was JUST a big sandbox. Now, I have an imagination, but I don't expect to make EVERYTHING up as I go along in games. As for the whole scripting thing that X-T provided (for people to make their own missions), that turned out to be a bust in the end...nobody wrote missions. Having said all that, I am looking forward to X:2.

Best attempt I've seen at an episodic game (as in Internet distributed) was Halcyon Sun. This is not the screaming praise that it may sound - it was a mediocre game at best, and it was rarely that good. The first episode involved watching almost half an hour of cinematics and the space combat was pantaloons. Not a classic by any stretch of the imagination.

However, it got a lot of the basic ideas right - easily reusable figures, highly compressed voices (but still including them) and a very Wing Commander esque focus on the characters rather than just the Mission of the Week. They had a certain character that I've missed ever since X-Wing and Freelancer decided that you were the only person in the entire war worth concentrating on and that your relationship with your wingman should never go beyond you calling him Alpha-2. Which I hate. I want the likes of Angel, Paladin, Jazz, Maniac and the rest of it to add life and a story beyond just sweeping a few points and being told 'Well Done'.

It'd be interesting to see it done properly. For my money, it could be like...well, let's take Sam and Max as an example. Instead of one massive story, split into chapters, each month you could return for a brand new mini-adventure. With decent models and clever asset reuse (cell shading for instance would let them get away with much, much lower complexity art), it would probably be possible to do that. Like the TV show, rather than a novel.

Alternatively, I remember tuning in weekly for You Don't Know Jack: The NetGame. I want that back - best quiz show on the PC, bar none.

I'd say the big problem with it is a simple one - who actually finishes games? I do, I'm sure you do, and likewise for the hardcore market, but I see the average gamer simply moving on after a while. Your game has to be absolutely, jaw-droppingly stunning and addictive in the single-player mode AND carry on the same level of quality in the online updates to keep people interested (The Sims being the obvious exception to the rule, but discountable if we're talking plot and more direct episodic finishes).

And even then, it's only a maybe. If you build your game around that concept only to have it tank, you get to make a choice between either supporting it out of your own pocket to retain honour, or waving your hands in the air and saying "That's all folks!". You're also competing with any free stuff that other companies release, like Epic's BonusPacks, and probably fighting with your own users - who are likely to be the only ones really checking the site to see the updates, about why you're not handing out your work for free.

I'd rather see people chasing the episodic model from the off, and effectively taking chances a bit more. If you're focusing on story, puzzles and the like, you can re-use the same engine and to a large extent get away with lower quality art assets simply because of the much, much lower standards that people hold to online stuff. You can use this leap to start putting together smaller scale games than the overblown epics that everyone feels honour bound to make at the moment, without having to risk the entire company on a particular title failing. A string of them would wipe you out, but that's true of anything - at least there'd be a chance to acquire a fan-base in the course of one story and then build from it with the future ones.

A big thing would be to avoid the gargantuan stories to begin with, and instead tell a more basic story in, say, six parts. That's doable, you can plan in advance and know roughly how taxing it's going to be, and the smaller timescale should stop users from panicking that the story won't be finished.

There are two big differences with EQ - that it's an insane time-sink of a game, and the bajillion-zillion versions of it that are already coming out. An episodic game would need is a hook right now, not the possibility of one some three months down the line. Someone will subscribe for a 'play any time' game and dip in and out until they get bored or addicted, but they're not going to keep plonking down cash for Spend-Two-Hours-Clubbing-Monsters-Like-Seals every month.

i played Freespace2 demo just now and remembered why i couldn't stand the game: no newtonian-like flight engine. Simply a "horrible" wooden feeling like i was some lousy actor hamming up their lines.

Freelancer's best feature so far, i believe, is the unique external view has the same user interface as cockpit view. (which privateer, freespace, jumpgate, etc don't provide because of the "HUD"-centric interfaces would have made for a different "feel")

to those who say they are hating the flight model, i recommend you try
this out... just head into combat, hit Z, and use your AB in tiny
spurts (seriously, like "tap... tap... tap...") and see if it makes it
at least more interesting for you...

If you go the heavy fighter route, there appears to be a regular progression (probably the same for light fighters). As you said, the heavy fighter of each government-type faction is available on its battleships. Save your money and at level two, go to a Liberty battleship and buy a Defender. Next, at level 8, pick up a Bretonian Crusader. Then, at level 13, a Bounty Hunter Barracuda (Kyushu, New Tokyo, and Curacao [Cortez]) or, alternatively, a Kusari Dragon. When you reach level 16, the Anubis will be made available to you dirt cheat by the Order. I used it to painlessly finish the story-line. It's a good, all-around ship and quite competitive for post-plot adventuring. I finished the plot at level 22 so I kept the Anubis til I reached level 26 and traded it for a Hammerhead (Freistadt Base [Omega 7]), which I traded for a Sabre (Outcasts on Malta [Omicron Alpha] and the Red Hessions at Vogtland Base [Dresden]) at level 30. A few minutes ago, I traded the Sabre for a Titan (Corsairs on Crete Omicron Gamma]), just to see what the Titan was like (I'd heard some negative things about it). I actually like the looks of the Titan better than the Sabre (most folks think the Titan is butt-ugly) and I don't experience any manuevering problems against AI enemies. So I guess I'll keep it for a while.

If the bribe is not available, please dock on repeatedly, The bribes are in these bases.

--
"Arguing with anonymous strangers on the Internet is a sucker's game because they almost always turn out to be -- or to be indistinguishable from -- self-righteous sixteen-year-olds possessing infinite amounts of free time." -- Neil Stephenson, _Cryptonomicon_