2011 Razor

Razor 2011 - August 17 2010
- I Just returned from 5 incredible days at Nitinat. seeing and riding the next model year gear is always a thrill. Thank you John Z for your help - Next time I won’t consume so much Monster drink before riding. I was a bit wired.
I had a chance to ride a 10 M Razor and 10 Meter Rise back to back, which is the only way to really appreciate all the nuances of a kites performance characteristics. ( Note: I have hundreds of hours ride time on the 2009 & 2010 Rise, so the differences were clear, but only my opinion of coarse ).
I feel that the design characteristics of the Razor will fill a void in the OR lineup, for riders wanting a different feel then what the Rise offers.
In short the Razor has a constant pull, which is especially noticeable through and while turning the kite. This made surfing even the small waves at the mouth of the Nitinat a joy, since there was always power there to pull you through when you wanted it, even on straight downwind hard carves.
The turning speed was faster then the Rise, but not crazy faster. I estimated it to turn like a kite 2 meters smaller.
Example - I could easily be happy to ride the 10 Razor with the small Rise bar, which was my test setup. but with my Rise the 10 M gets ridden with the bigger bar.
Bar pressure is higher , but again not significant, just enough to add feel for when it’s important to know where the kite is.
It seemed to me that with my riding style I would ride one size smaller a Razor then the Rise and this is likely due to the Reduced range I believe you have with more of a C shaped kite like the Razor.
Jumping was lofty and great, & does require a difference in timing, as would be expected, but the learning curve is instant.
The new lines are super stiff and rated at 650 lbs. I really liked them - they look like the same lines that North uses. They have the respective colors interlaced within the white. The stiff lines reduce tangles and make setting up easlier.
Kite construction, is the normal bomber type we’ve learned to love, with the Kevlar in all the right places.

During some jumping mistakes I found the kite to be very forgiving, for instance, during a jump that had me outrunning my kite downwind by 30 + ft , the Razor flew downwind with slack lines and did not Hindenburg at all. Impressive.
Graphics are also nice,
So in all a super kite, best suited to a different type of rider then the Rise rider schools will also likely prefer the easier flying and more bar feedback I think this is a nice compliment to the lineup of great O.R. products.

Yippee..Officially the first crew to respond to this thread which I’m sure is going to grow and grow. Love the revue pointmike. It answered some of the questions I have in my head. Now I await further info. on the re-launch characteristics of the Razor compared to the Rise. Also comparisons between the SLE and the mini 5th. bar.

Re launching - sorry didn’t push it so never got a chance to try the relaunch, but others said it was much faster and basically easier to relaunch which would fit with the normal characteristics of this design type.

We did not have an above the bar depower bar with the mini fifth setup available, expected to come soon.
I liked it with the Rise bar, since I have a deep love of below the bar depowering.
The insides of the 2011 bar are to get a straighter line flow for easier adjusting. But I never had a problem with the 2010 bar, so if it’s better easier, excellent.
The cleat retention pin has been moved to make it impossible to loose the cleat, some cleats fell out in 2010, so no more of that.

The boards - Shapes have not changed thank God - but have been improved on a constructions and detail level.
With wood cores the boards should be even stronger then before, with extended life on the pop.
The Mako’s 140 & 150 & King now all have mutant inserts for the mutant option as well as twin tip style and the king now comes with a full deck pad for strapless riding, which become popular this last season, once the word got out.

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Regarding pull, The Razor has a more grunty low end type of feel, with constant pull at all times.
Compared to the Rise which has less pull while being turned.
I’ve adapted quite nicely to the Rise’s type of pull and feel while making transitions and I am not sure I want anything different for the future. That is why I’ve decided to mix up the quiver for 2011.
I know from other riders input and my own experience when flying other brands, that many other kite models also pull steady like the Razor, and with that typically comes the added bar pressure. Thankfully the bar pressure is not too much heavier with the Razor. I’ve ridden some kite with bar pressure that was way more then I could be happy with, but not this one.
My true opinion is that OR has produces the perfect compliment to the Rise, with just the right differences, without going overboard.

It was great to see you again and I’m glad you got to experience the great wind on Monday after Windfest.

Nice review of the Razor…I was so busy having fun on my 2010 gear I didn’t want to come in and try and track down the 2011 stuff to demo. I’m looking forward to getting some new gear out on the water when the production stuff hits the stores.

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I am stoked!
Great input pointmike, I can visualize the razor much better now and I am excited!
And I’m totally stoked you got some classsic nitnat conditions too you guys!
Riding out there while looking up at those huge trees on the mountains is something I’ll always treasure…
its like some ancient fiord that can blow like hell!

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Mike, thanks again for the detailed review - were all stoked that you enjoyed the Razor! For those who haven’t seen it, my thoughts on the kite parallel Mike’s, and can be found in this thread on Kiteforum.

This revue from Jeremie is very informative and ticks all the boxes in what I’m looking for in a 2011 quiver. I’m very interested to watch this thread for further updates especially on the low end characteristics of the kite.

I was contemplating a 9m/10m Razor and maybe keeping my 2010 Rise 7m but can an 8m Razor really have the low end equivalent to that of the 10m Rise/12m Diablo?

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Low end is a bit of a critical term for me - does it just mean to get up on the board, or stay upwind in certain light wind conditions?
Generally when a kite sits deeper in the wind window you get a stronger static pull, but trade upwind performance..

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As I explained in the review, in 10-12 knots I was able to stay up wind. In around 13 -15 knots I could do all my tricks. Don’t be afraid to over sheet the kite, u ll gain a couple knots having trimmed correctly. The venturi prevents backstaling a lot. I’m also pretty light, 65 kg, but I found the low end very good. Anyway, you guys should give it a try or look on other reviews regarding the low end, my review focuss more on the freestyle capabilities of the razor !! Anyway u guys can’t go wrong with this kite, hardest part now, how many do u need, how many ur wife or husband ll let u buy an which sizes to get !!!

My wife is very good and will let me have one new kite (more if I sell my present quiver)The question is which size? I’m also around 65kilos. At the moment I’m thinking keep 7m Rise and get 9m Razor but will watch this thread with interest. It would be nice to get away with an 8 or 9 as my biggest.

First, a big thanks to everyone who has contributed info and reviews already.

Second, more info/reviews focusing on sizing please! I get 3 new kites to replace 2 year old 14m and 10m Rises.

Debating between a 14/11/8 and a 12/9/7 quiver of Razors. I weigh about 90kg (195lb). Lots of unstable wind here so gotta keep to 3m spacing, max.

My trusty 14m has seen the most usage by far, but while it keeps me upwind from 12 knots, it won’t pop very nicely until about 16knots, when I can pull a few cm of depower. It is starting to sound like a 12m Razor might have me unhooking fairly nicely from 15-16 knots, and below that if it is just cruising I might as well be on my surfboard anyways. Also concerned about high end - I really want something for those super nuking days both at home and on trips to warmer lands.

I’ve been thinking that at around 65kilos my ideal 2011 quiver would consist of 6, 8 and 10 Razor.

Current projects elsewhere would leave me being strung up by my kids let alone the wife if I did that so realistically at this time I will be looking at keeping my 7m Rise and having a two kite quiver with maybe the 9m Razor?

I will wait and see what else is said about the low end capabilities of the Razor compared to the Rise. In previous seasons and with the winds we get here in the UK I have been perfect 90% of the time with a 10m Rise as my biggest.

The smaller I can get away with the better. As long as I can ride upwind and have sufficient power for basic hooked in tricks and jumping I will be good to go.

These thoughts are based on a board such as Mini Mako/132 Zen with the possibility of a directional surfboard to boot.

If Evan reads this….You’re not a heavy rider. Your 6 and 8 Razor kite choice for 2011? Is that based on the fact that you get consistantly strong wind in San Fran. or that you’re riding a surfboard all the time?

Cheers

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I´m 80kg on twintip 133x40.
I love my Rise 2009, 8mts range , and would like to know what size of Razor to buy, with similar windrange.
Is posible the Razor 7 mts , to start in 18 knots, and rich around 40 knots ?? , it will be great but the rise is in this range.
If not , can anybody tell me the windrange of the Razors, I cannot find it anywhere…....

4) Unhooking - no comparison to the Rise - no backstall at all at full power (no trim required) and far more control and consistent position in the window.

Overall, the Rise of course has a larger wind range on account of the massive top end, but in every other department she gives it up to the Razor. Hands down I think’ll you struggle to find a comparable kite to the Razor on the market.

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So could you say that the Razor, compared to the Rise
- Sits deeper in the wind window,
- pivot turns, rather than turning from the tips,
- has a stronger static pull at the edge of the wind window,
- has higher bar pressure?

How is the upwind vector and jumping(height, hangtime) compared to the Rise?
Since the Razor sits deeper in the window, I would expect the Rise to have advantages here.

How do both compare in depower per bar throw?

Top end?
I found the 2010 Rise deforms significantly less than the 2009 when overpowered. But to be realistic it doesn’t fly great if you trim it a huge amount, which is probably general common sense.

Kiteloops?
If the Razor sits deeper in the window I would expect more thumb here, however pivot turns would outbalance that again.
Another thing about pivot turning kites is that they don’t tend to catch you well in loops. I reckon the reason why the 2010 Rise improved in that department is because it turns more from the tips.

6 and 8 Razor with the OR 5’11” directional? Still going with a 6m Rise for super windy days too?

I’m your weight but also want mini Mako/JT pro. Undecided which at this time. Want the ease of ride in chop that the Mako should give but don’t want to sacrifice too much in the way of ‘pop’ for basic freestyle stuff.

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So could you say that the Razor, compared to the Rise
- Sits deeper in the wind window,
- pivot turns, rather than turning from the tips,
- has a stronger static pull at the edge of the wind window,
- has higher bar pressure?

How is the upwind vector and jumping(height, hangtime) compared to the Rise?
Since the Razor sits deeper in the window, I would expect the Rise to have advantages here.

How do both compare in depower per bar throw?

Top end?
I found the 2010 Rise deforms significantly less than the 2009 when overpowered. But to be realistic it doesn’t fly great if you trim it a huge amount, which is probably general common sense.

Kiteloops?
If the Razor sits deeper in the window I would expect more thumb here, however pivot turns would outbalance that again.
Another thing about pivot turning kites is that they don’t tend to catch you well in loops. I reckon the reason why the 2010 Rise improved in that department is because it turns more from the tips.

I’ll let the freestylers post their own thoughts (see Jeremie Tronet’s blog (you’ll find answers to your questions addressed), but my friend Andrew was kite looping the hell out of the 8m yesterday and his first comments were that it was far superior to the Rise, as the Razor caught him after the loop whereas he gets dropped with his Rise kites.

If top end and range are your priorities, get a Rise. If not, get a Razor - easy as pie.

6 and 8 Razor with the OR 5’11” directional? Still going with a 6m Rise for super windy days too?

I’m your weight but also want mini Mako/JT pro. Undecided which at this time. Want the ease of ride in chop that the Mako should give but don’t want to sacrifice too much in the way of ‘pop’ for basic freestyle stuff.

Cheers

Thanks Andy - you are going to be stoked…......6, 8 and 5’11, my Rises are mothballed, 4m for the 30+ big wave days over the winter.. I was initially concerned that the 6m Razor would not have the top end I need, but after riding it, those fears are gone. The new JT Pro is also very sweet - lighter than the Zen, and significantly more flex - you’ll like it for sure.

got to spend 2+ hours yesterday on the 2011 8m Razor and it is sick!!! Here is my review. I was riding with Evan on his 6m Razor. Thanks for the demo Evan!

First - I am 185 lbs, riding a 5’4” Naish surfboard, in wind in the low 20’s at Crissy field in San Francisco. I have had OR Rises every year for the last 4 years, Torches before that. I’ll mainly compare it to the Rise.

I took this kite out despite the fact that everyone was on 10m and 11m, I just really wanted to try it.

The kite is lower aspect than the rise with a more pronounced “C” shape. It’s nice and light with the 4 struts. In the sky it has more of a deep pocketed look, like a wainman does above you.

Power:
I was blown away by the low end grunt. I was well powered and I felt like the kite had the power of almost 10m Rise, more power than the 9m Rise. It’s also very easy to generate power with the kite. It sits a bit further back than the Rise, but not way back like a real wave kite (Kima, Catalyst, Renagade)
The Razor does not handle the gusts as well as the rise or other such kites. You feel what the wind is doing and you need to use your board more to control power, you can’t just turn it off by sheeting out. It’s more like a C kite in this way, but not that harsh.

At 185 lbs I will be getting 6,8,10 to replace my 7,9,11 Rises. You will not be able to run huge 4m gaps between Razors, you’ll end up disappointed. ( I think that 4m gaps suck on any kite)

Turning:
This is where it shines. It was super fast, even for an 8m. It zips across the window really fast. There is much more consistant pull through turns than the Rise and it climbs back up much faster without having to sheet way out. I didn’t have real waves, but rode a few head high tanker wakes which are like sideshore wave. It is way better at this than the Rise, you just have fast steady power thoughout the turn and it’s much harder to stall, even riding right at it.
The bar is very sensitive to inputs, which I like, but might be less forgiving to some riders.

Jumping:
Timing might be a bit harder, but it has good yank and great loft. It jumps as well as any other kite i’ve been on. LOOPS are where it also shines. I liked the rise a lot, but it didn’t loop great. The Razor generates much more power and catches you much better for softer landings. I had so much fun I must have done 50 kiteloops. I didn’t unhook while riding, but I did on the beach and without trimming at all the kite stayed stable and didn’t stall. Ideally it needs a bit of trim, but not a ton.

Relaunch
I crashed the Razor a few times to test relaunch and it is also better. Due to the lower aspect it will move by itself (auto-relaunch) to the edge of the window and wait to be steered into the sky. I didn’t need to pull a line at all. Granted this was on an 8m in decent wind.

All in all I would say this is definitely the kite to buy if you are an advanced rider or an intermediate looking to get into waves or freestyle. It is a much more involved, direct ride and will reward a good rider. For those looking to just cruise and do some jumps I would still get the Rise. The Rise has better range, better high end and a more forgiving ride. The Rise will still be a better kite for racing due to it’s range and upwind ability.

Good review Andrew, thanks. Totally agree with you, 4m kite spacing is not that great, especially in areas with unstable winds.

As I am heavier and ride smaller boards in an area with pretty lame wind in the summer, I do need a 12m unfortunately. Not sure if I should try to pull a fast one on the wife and go for a 4 kite quiver to cover the wind range all the way up to the winter storms, or go with 12-10 razor and 7m Rise. I am not a big fan of mixed quivers but then again it is hard to calculate how many nights on the couch that extra kite would cost…

If I were doing that mix I would actually go 12-10 Razor and 8 rise. The 7 Rise has the power of the 6 Razor and thus you will have a huge gap up to 10m. At 185lbs I have only needed a Rise smaller than 8m on a handful of wave days a year, and I probably could have made an 8 work on some of them.

Conversely you could get 6-8 Razor and then a 12 rise and the jump from 8 to 12 would “seem” more like 2.5 or 3m, not 4.

Why isn’t there a 14m Razor?
When it turns faster than the Rise and has more power, it would be a great light wind kite..

The 15m Light Wind Rise is essentially a whole different kite from both the Rise and the Razor and will offer a 4 strut, light wind option to cap out both ranges of kites. We joked about calling it the Raze or the Riser but in the end only had so much time and energy we could spend on the kite and decided to fit it into an existing line of the kites to save on having to market and advertise it separately.

Andrew, thanks for the suggestion. I had considered doing the smaller Razors and a big Rise, but since I’m mostly doing unhooked freestyle in light to moderate winds I want the Razors for that. If I had a passable surf spot in my area I’d go for the smaller Razors but I don’t. So, 12-10 Razor and 8 Rise is what it’s looking like for now.

KnutHansen, I’m guessing limited production capacity, same goes for the odd sizes. Most plausible explanation I can think of. I doubt OR would misread the market that badly, or that us two are such a small part of it that they did read it right and it wasn’t profitable to make those sizes.

Guys, we’re not making a 14m Razor because it’s unnecessary for 99.9% of riders. The Razor has a ridiculous amount of low end power. Even most 200# riders are going to be good to go on the 10m Razor unless the wind is very light - in that case, we make a 12m. And, if you are still not convinced (you need to RIDE the kite), as John Z mentioned we are offering a 15m LW Rise, which is very similar to the Razor.

Cheers,

Evan

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Guys, we’re not making a 14m Razor because it’s unnecessary for 99.9% of riders. The Razor has a ridiculous amount of low end power. Even most 200# riders are going to be good to go on the 10m Razor unless the wind is very light - in that case, we make a 12m. And, if you are still not convinced (you need to RIDE the kite), as John Z mentioned we are offering a 15m LW Rise, which is very similar to the Razor.

Cheers,

Evan

So, a 10M Razor has as more power than a Rise 12M? Holy moley.
Figured I could hold the 12 Razor down until wind is up to a 9M Rise.
180 lbs / ride on inland lakes and coastal winds / Mako 150 / Mako King / Wainmann Blunt 135.
I was thinking that the Razor 12M is gonna feel similar to the Wainman Boss 12M, anybody able to confirm and compare?
Been on the 2008,09,10 Rises and they are the stuff, excited for the Razor 12M for when the wind is 12-22mph…
Some of these reports leave me feeling like it will be too much to pair with the 9M Rise.
Glad there is lots of feedback flowing….. it helps.

yeeehaaa
big thanks to richard for letting me be the first in the uk to fly the razors!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
bad bit ,only in a gusty field gutted not to get them out to sea
had the 6m and 10m up and very impressed with all of it,will ooops
have put the order through so will be off the coast of south wales very soon
cool beans cant wait to get some feedback from the locals and students
pics will follow soon,shame i couldt keep them ones but hes gone off to vansurf with them
thanks again richard
happy days

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I agree it’s hard to say what works for everyone. A friend of mine who just got a 10m Razor also has a 12m Wainman kite (I refuse to call each size a different name). He says the 10m Razor is as powerful as the 12 Wainman.

I have had 2010 Rises in 8,10, 11, 12, and 13m.( at different times) I can say that the 10m Razor has a low end that I would put between the 11 and 12 Rise. The high end is not as good remember.

I have not flown a 12 Razor and I may never try one. I would guess that its’ something like a 13m Rise, but with less range. And, since it’s a 12m it probably won’t be as quick as everyone is saying the 8 and 10 are. For me the 8m Razor is the really amazing size. Much like the 9m/10m Rises were the best in my book. The appeal of a kite shaped like this diminishes for me as the size goes up. I don’t ride waves or do lots of kite loops on 12m kites. And I don’t unhook much, that is where the 12m Razor would beat a 12m Rise for sure.

I’d rather have a 12m Rise paired with a 8m Razor rather than the other way around. You’ll just have to try it I guess.

That’s about all the ruminating that I can do on this subject. Get out and try em. Return it if you don’t like it.

A friend of mine who just got a 10m Razor also has a 12m Wainman Boss kite.
He says the 10m Razor is as powerful as the 12 Wainman.

I have had 2010 Rises in 8,10, 11, 12, and 13m.
I can say that the 10m Razor has a low end that I would put between the 11 and 12 Rise.
The high end is not as good remember.
I have not flown a 12 Razor and I may never try one. I would guess that its’ something like a 13m Rise, but with less range.
For me the 8m Razor is the really amazing size. Much like the 9m/10m Rises were the best in my book. The appeal of a kite shaped like this diminishes for me as the size goes up. I don’t ride waves or do lots of kite loops on 12m kites. And I don’t unhook much, that is where the 12m Razor would beat a 12m Rise for sure. I’d rather have a 12m Rise paired with a 8m Razor rather than the other way around.

Your buddy feels more power in a 10M Razor than the 12M Wainman, wow thats a grunty 10M kite!
Your feeling the 10M Razor is between the 11M and 12M Rise.
The Wainman 12M felt more powerful than my 12m Rise to me, but I didn’t get much time on it.
Thank you for your feedback

Well I’m happy to say I’ve managed a go on a 10m Razor. Unfortunately the wind wasn’t playing ball with people only really managing to stay upwind on 13m SLE’s or bigger so I’m guessing the wind was in the 13-14mph range. My 11m Rise couldn’t get me going in fact it was struggling to pick me up out of t water. 10m Razor had me up and planing, but down wind. With the odd gust I was able to gain some ground. Really surprising low end on the kite and its speed is good. Excellent kite to whip around, down loop etc. Wave boys are gonna love it.

Unfortunately I wasn’t able to put it through its paces as the wind never quite showed so I cant comment on jumping. I guess I’d have been well powered on the 12m Razor if it can keep pace with the 10m

Personally I’d be looking at a 10m or 12m Razor to partner an 8m Rise. You would than have 2 kites with similar turning speeds but have the jumping and float that comes with the Rise. More demo time needed.

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Personally I’d be looking at a 10m or 12m Razor to partner an 8m Rise. You would than have 2 kites with similar turning speeds but have the jumping and float that comes with the Rise. More demo time needed.

So after riding the 8, 10 and 12m Razors at Windfest, I was in love with it… my one question / concern was for the range and gust handling abilities of this kite…
So I’m 210 lbs / 95kgs and was riding some butter on our lake (on a 10m Razor) when the wind picked up to 35 / 40 knots, and GUSTY! I had a couple km downwind to get back to our launch / land location and was a little concerned, but other than scaring the shit out of myself by boosting bigger than ever before… everything was good. There was only one other kite still on the water by the time I got back and people were ready to grab my kite at the waters edge… because that’s the kind of wind it was…
I caught my breath and headed out on the 6m Rise that my wife had been riding before the wind picked up… trimmed it in, load, pop, pull and LOOP!!
The adrenaline almost popped my eye balls out of my head.

Point being, the Razor can handle some seriously gusty conditions and has some serious range with the Freeride / Rise bar.

Thanks Ross, I now have the kite to take me to the next level of riding.

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Personally I’d be looking at a 10m or 12m Razor to partner an 8m Rise. You would than have 2 kites with similar turning speeds but have the jumping and float that comes with the Rise. More demo time needed.

Thanks Colyn - now I don’t know what to do. 10m Razor or 11m Rise.

Tough call dave. The 10m Razor definitely starts earlier but I’ve no idea what its top end would be and how well it jumps. It turns so much faster than the Rise but I cant argue against the progress I’ve made on the Rise this year. Fantastic kite. Definately want more time on the Razor to answer that questions on its performance when powered and where the top end is compared to the low end of the 8m Rise.

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can people advise how to setup the razors in terms of line length?
I used an 8m in light winds for first time yesterday and found it really likes running off the front lines and any sort of oversheeting and it was going backwards fast. Is this right?
I dont have the OR bar so just playing with another bar to try to get right.
Found i had to run it one length to get around then yank on the depower strap to be able to unhook on a wave and even then it was stalling and wanting to go backwards a bit so had to tamper with a chicken loop yank to keep it up every now and then.
It was ligh winds, like 12-16 knots max. I was very suprised at how well it was going and getting me around (on a surfboard). was pointing super easy and holding ground no worries.

The Razors certainly have loads of bottom end grunt . I was surprised and impressed. I think your line lengths are slightly wrong. I put the 8m on my Rise’s sle bar and it flew straight of. No back stalling
When your bar is against the chicken loop and depower set to full the loops at the kite end should all be the same length. You then need to add a 3” fool proof pig tale to the rear lines. In other words the loop on the front lines will be 3” shorter than the knot on the rear.

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The Razors certainly have loads of bottom end grunt . I was surprised and impressed. I think your line lengths are slightly wrong. I put the 8m on my Rise’s sle bar and it flew straight of. No back stalling
When your bar is against the chicken loop and depower set to full the loops at the kite end should all be the same length. You then need to add a 3” fool proof pig tale to the rear lines. In other words the loop on the front lines will be 3” shorter than the knot on the rear.

thanks sunrise, the pig tales would explain it as i dont have them. ill check and adjust lines tonight and re-test.
Of course murphy’s law has turned the wind off now that i have new kites to demo…

second session with the 8m razor. wind was prob only 14-16 knots. Some were out at Scabs with 10’s to 14’s. I figured id just pump up and see how it flies after line length mods from the weekend. Put it in the air and thought, this feels enough.
I was correct. Was holding ground on my 6 foot surfboard and getting about with little effort.
CANNOT believe the low end of this thing, so good!!! Thats an 8m!
Started unhooking on waves and if depowered it flies down the line really well. Did need a few inches of yank on the depower strap tho. sits really well and stable. That constant pull feels good, not too strong or twitchy or yanky so you can concentrate on surfing the wave.
I am curious to see how they handle stronger wind.

Hey Crew, I’m trying to decide whether to get the 2011 13m Rise or 2011 12m Razor for my light wind kite for riding good down the line waves waist high to 15’ faces with side on winds. I’m a big guy- 6’4” 230 lbs. ride surfboards 5’11” to 6’ 4”. Winds here can be light at times, in the 12-16 mph range. Don’t really care about boosting, just hitting the lip. I have the 2010 Rise 8m 10m 12m now and really like em. Just looking for a kite to get me on the water on the light days when the waves are really good. I hear the Razor is a faster turning kite, which appeals to me especially since I’m on bigger kites than the lighter riders. Any opinions? Remember I’m not a flyweight, I’d like to hear what OR riders think.
Mahalo,
Timmer

Thanks Brent! Like that the Razor has a little better low end than Rise. Looking for more feedback about it’s waveriding capabilities. Most wave riders seem to not like
a lot of “grunt” but as a bigger guy I do like it.

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I just spent four days on the 10m razor using a 2010 rise bar so time to comment. My current quiver is the 10m razor and 2010 - 7, 9, 11 rise kites (mako 140, surf coming), I weigh in at 155lbs. The wind was around 20 to 40km and I used both 21m lines and 24m on the razor. It took an hour or so to become comfortable and not so yanked around (basically just more pull) but I trimmed it up got more used to it and then….I fell in love with the way it jumps, and has that constant power. I only use the 21m lines now unless it’s very light and then I go to 24. The kite has very good range on 21m lines (with the freeride bar at least). I had seven other riders (3 OR rise, 1 OR one, and 3 misc riders) try it and nobody had any complaints, they all liked it right away and more.

The 10m razor effectively replaces my 11m rise (my biggest kite), and I never felt the need to pull out the 9m rise (although i did try them back to back to see the difference, and yes, they are different kites as has already been discussed). So I was able to comfortably use the 10 m razor right up to the point where the 7m rise kicked in at ~40km. If I chose or was restricted to 2 kites it would be the 7m rise (an incredible kite in 40 to 65 km) and the 10m razor, a perfect 2 kite quiver for my weight in my area….(but could the 6m razor replace the 7m rise and give similar performance and range?)

A 3 kite quiver would be a 6-8-10 razor or alternatively 7m rise-10m razor-13m rise if you really wanted to power up and had consistent light wind days.

I really like the kite, took a little time to fall for it having never flown anything but high depower kites (mainly ones and rises), but bottom line – the razors a blast and allows for lots of skill progression.

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I CAN’T F’N BELIEVE IT MAN!
I went from a 14m Rise to a 10m Razor today and got totally worked by this kite!
If you like massive traction and super fast turning…the Razor delivers!
(Is it cheating if you are riding the King?)

Yes it works in that wind range, but its not enough for the 12-14mph that I was flying the 14m in before the wind came up.
Now I am really curious what the 12m will do!
I’m a big guy-205lbs, so flying a 10m and jumping and staying upwind in winds less than 20mph is short circuting my conception of life itself.
Why do you keep doing this to me Ross Harrington!!!?

Agreed the low end has thrown a wobbly in my appreciation of basic kiting physics. Gees almost sounded like I knew what I was on about there.

I am so very tempted but

1. I still cant believe the low end and what will be the true low end for a 70-75kg person with a twin tip

2. How it performs jump wise at that low end

3. top end perfromance compared to the Rise.

I’ve been with OR kites for over 3 years now and my low end experience of them is that they are basically like a stubborn teenager in bed on a Sunday morning until a certain point and wind speed is reached. Then they come alive like someone has flicked the switch. The Razor was completely different only question being was there enough wind to haul the lump out of the water.

And yes they do it to me every year too.

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I have also been on Rise’s for three years now, and love the range… Weighing 75 kg with a twin tip, I can kite
in the 13-14 kt range up to around 22 kts with my 11m Rise. If the low end, wave riding characteristics of the Razor
are as good as the reviews, I’m trying to decide between the 8m or 6m Razor! Looking forward to east coast
demos.

Yeah About 14kn is about my bottom end on the 11m Rise too. I could probably hold it a little higher.

My temptatious little session on the 10m Razor left me thinking that it may be a repacement for the 11m Rise with the benfits of sharper turning and better unhooked but I’ll admit I don’t know 100% as I’ve no idea how it jumps and what the top end is.

I did love the way it responded to rider input though. Nice and sharp when you wanted it to be and behaved otherwise.
Grrr I need to get my hands back on it but that man Seabreeze has loaned it out to shops and schools rather than his No.1 test pilot

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Just got this feedback from a demo session.
OK Razor more bottom end and slightly higher bar pressure. Top end most will not notice as you will need to be on a smaller kite at about the same wind speed. The rise handles the top end gusts better and does not suffer poor steering when sheeted out.
Jumping Rise rips you from the water. The razor lifts you from the water.
Rise goes higher with a second lift. Both give good float and a soft landing.
If you want to go big go Rise. For waves and bottom end go razor. For anything else buy the colour you like.
If you are a dangle monkey learn what the hook is for. We did all that stuff in the late 1990s see old videos.

Razor does not equal Rise, they are totally different kites. If we are talking low end in specific, then the Razor is equivalent to a Rise one to two square meters larger, and to really confuse all of you, the larger the kite gets the greater the difference becomes.

Just buy one size smaller Razor than you normally would in the Rise (and pretty much any other kite out there) and you are done. And yes, there’s no way you need a kite bigger than the 12m Razor in this style of kite.

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Sounds interesting. Thanks BWD! For now gonna get the Razors and see how light I can go with the 12. Gotta drop a few (lot) of lbs (kilos). Hurt my back this summer pumping up a kite- can you bele dat? I was in California, didn’t bring my BST electric with me cause of the weight- BAD decision! Bought the electric cause I’ve had two spinal fusions over the years and was a great investment. Was on the couch eating and drinking away the pain for 6 weeks, gained about 20 lbs! Hope the 12 Razor will do it for me, if not I’ll look into the hybrid! What would be th comparison between a ‘10 Rise 14m and they new 15m hybrid? 12m Razor compared to ‘10 14m Rise and to 15m hybrid? Wave riding is my main focus. Let’s hear what the Crew has to say.
Thanks again

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This crew member thinks the razor will be a better kite for waves.
On the fast turning setting it is very easy to flick around one handed and the traction comes on much faster
which is what you need to get your butt out of trouble in the waves.

Wind was very light prob 14-16 knots with a bit current taking some of the punch out. Would not normally have ridden were it not for a brand new kite.

Was easily able to ride and stay upwind on my regular twin tip (138x42) at 195 lbs/88kgs (a lighter rider was pulled downwind on his 12m Thruster). Was definitely impressed with low end - power felt very immediate, and as though there was a little a more kite to pull/edge against than had I been on my 10 Rise. Noticed more power through turns, nice pull on some back roll kite loops (more than the Rise), climbed nicely back to the top of window too.

Wind was a little to light to gauge the boosting ability. Also a little to light to really unhook to much but a couple of raillies felt good.

I learned on C’s but have ridden Rises since 2007. Found my 12m Rise gets almost no use as my 10 would get me going in about 14 knots and anything less is not worth the effort. Am planning to have the 10m Razor and my “big kite” - at least for now.

Will post more after a few more sessions. Overall very impressed and very pleased.
Thank you Ross!

I guess I did not hear about changes in the SLE freeride bar at all.
Thought that one was pretty much done for now, and the work went into the wake style bar with mini 5th and above bar sheeting.
And as usual, I stray off topic again, just call me ADD man….....hey let’s ride bikes!

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Yo Tim great to see your still active on the OR forum
wannaha try a razor

Yes sure Barry i’m very curious on how the Razor fly’s, eventhough i’m riding an other brand kite now.
I think OR has made the missing link in their kite segment, they can satisfy more people now within the brand and also newcomers of course.

We only need wind Barry, last year windconditions were way better this year just makes me sad

More on the Razor:
Now have 3 or so sessions on this kite…and I am still super stoked.

1. Low End = Ridiculous. 2 of my sessions were in conditions I would not normally have ridden in, with light 14-15 knot winds. 10m got me up and staying upwind. Power felt very immediate and more grunty than Rise.

2. Upwind = No Probablo. The kite definitely sits deeper in the window and I was concerned that this would mean less upwind ability. Staying and going up wind is no problem…I haven’t ridden it back to back with my 10m Rise but if it’s not equal in terms of upwind ability (esp in light winds) then it is close.

3. Turning = Fast and Powerful. Turning is fast. Not super fast like cut all your bars down to 30 cm. But fast. Faster than the Rise by a just a bit in my opinion - the Rise was a fast turning kite mind you. What is nice is that the kite really generates a lot of power i the turn, even from deep in the window. This was noticeably better from the Rise.

4. Loops = Very Fast and Powerful. Loops are really nice! In the air and on the water - they have noticeably more pull than the Rise. I loved looping the Rise, the 2010 was killer in loops, fast and climbed nicely back to the top of the window to catch you before landing. You just had to have a fair amount of wind to really get a hard yank out of the Rise. With the Razor you really get that pull with a lot less wind. Very Nice.

5. Jumps = No Downside here. The Razor jumps really well. The Rise was a booster - ripped you off water and kept you there. Haven’t been able to really test the Razor fully lit but I was pleased with the lift and the hang time. Totally stable in the air. Think with the right amount of wind you could really score some serious altitude.

6. Relaunch = Ridiculously good. Crashed it once on purpose and once accidently. Before I could even hook back in (on the accidental crash) it was at the edge of window and nearly in the air If you struggle to relaunch, this is your kite.

7. Unhooked = Very Stable. Initially I had some back stall but checked my flying line lengths and the front lines has stretched by almost 6 inches - trimmed the lines to be equal and the kite unhooks with zero back stall. It also gives predictable power when unhooking. With a straight SLE when unhooking I felt like I didn’t really know how much power I was going to get - a simple railey could turn into a 20 foot jump. Not so with the Razor - very consistent power unhooked.

8. Range = So far so good. Low end is there, nuff said. At 195 lb (88 kgs) am planning on a 10 as my big kite. Rode with gusts up to 20 and never felt like it was out of control. If you are one of those people who rides a 12m from 12 to 30 knots you will likely notice less range/high end. However if you ride kites in their sweet spot you and rig down appropriately I think you not even notice a difference in the high end.

Over all this is killer kite. Areas I think the areas it has a real advantage over the Rise are low end “grunty-ness”, power throughout the turns/loops and unhooked. I love both kites and will have both in my quiver for now.

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Will have to leave the high end question to others who have been lucky to get more wind than we have had here.

That being said, it will have less high end than the Rise. And there is not the same amount massive de-power just by sheeting out as there is with the Rise (I got used to this in all of about 5 seconds). But I think the sweet spot for these kites will be sufficiently broad that if you select the right kite for the conditions you will have no problems whatsoever.

I almost always rig the smallest kite I can get away with, so take anything I say about high end with grain of salt.

I should also say the transition from Rise to Razor was pretty seamless - it will feel similar enough to be easy and different enough to be pleased.

I totally agree with these observations on the 10m Razor.
The Rise can sort of make you lazy when it comes to controlling the kite with your board,
it depowers so smoothly to whatever you feel like handling.
Flying a kite that forces you to edge hard to depower definately puts more energy into the session,
and having that sort of traction orginate from a rider friendly SLE with less square meters in the sky is an interesting dynamic
that I’ve never quite experienced before…the Razor has got me totally stoked!

Finally got a chance to ride my new 10m Razor. Love the way i looks and feels.
After reading the reviews and posts, i couldn’t wait to try one.
Been riding Rises for about 3 years now and enjoyed the improvements from
year to year. The Razors is a whole new level in performance!
It’s increased speed and smooth, steady pull makes it super fun in the waves!
I found the increased bar pressure provides more feedback for freestyle moves.
The Razor instantly improved my kiting…Thanks OR!

Ha, I agree though the kite is a beautiful kite. I am very excited to get large amounts of them out to market - people will be shocked.

To answer Brent’s question, we will have full availability of all sizes and both bar styles by the beginning of the 2nd week of November, around the 8th.

If I could shamelessly ask those of you who have tried the kite - please, take it to the forums and help raise awareness of this kite to the rest of the (currently) non OR world! - your help in hyping the 2011 gear on your local forums as well as KiteForum will be most appreciated!

Feels good to have this kite back after a couple of weeks of missing it.
I really like the Rises, but a quiver of razors gets more tempting all the time after reading something like this.

(Review by TUNA)
After spending a weekend with Craigs 10 Razor I got a few session on it. As claimed above the kite does have better low end than the Rise, and meter for meter delivers more power. However, I like to ride short lines. My go to bar has 19m 800# lines and this greatly reduced the low end (will for any kite). Later in a seesion I got to experience the hig end range and it seemed to be appropraite for the size. Also, I will add that the kites turning response did not decrease at the same rate as you depower the kite (meaning the kite still turns well when depowered).

This 10m Razor turns FAST, and nearly as fast as my 8m Rise.

When I missed the timming on redirecting the kite after boosting and the lines went slack, the Razon drifted back into the window very nicely. This is a great feature when riding in the waves.

The Razor does not have a center strut, and I like it. I bet this contributes to the kite turning faster. Also without a center strut the kite is a lot lees likely to drag on the ground while you are carrying it in hand upside down (these little things make a difference, nice). Also this kite pack up quickly and I feel this is due to the 4 strut configuration.

Now lets talk about backstall… In my flights I noticed less tendenancy to back stall (than my Rises), but I would not say the problem has been eliminated. Another kite I recenttly tried out absolutly would not backstall, however I felt that kite did not provide the power it should for its size. I feel a kite needs to be able to be backstalled somehow. Otherwise I think your are missing out on a little bit of power. I didn’t test the unhooking ability of this kite enough, so I don’t want to go into any more disscussion on this aspect.

The kite has a little more bar pressure than the rise which I liked, but not so much that I felt the need to ever use the stopper ball. The feel of the kite lets you know exactly where it is in the window.

The bag is great and very easy to pack the kite into. It has a very nice seperate zipper for the bar to go into (I don’t know why this isn’t more common with other kites’ bags). My older Rises had a place to attach you pump to the bag, the Razor’s bag did not… no big deal though.

There is more I could tell you about the kite, but I’m going to wrap up my ramblings. The 2011 10m Razon is an excellent kite and I would trade in all my Rises for it for sure (but I just don’t have the $$$). I think the most appropraite category for this kite would be “Freeride”, but I’d bet this kite wold be great for racing. If you are a beginner go for the Rise, if you want to ride purely wakestyle go for the Diablo (I have yet to test this kite model). I think with the creation of the Razor, Ocean Rodeo will be selling more of these than the Rise as it seems to suit a larger group of riders.

If you want to know more about any aspects of the kite and my experience/feelings on them, ask away.

One last thing, the new (I think it came out last year, new to me) control bar is super confortable, and works very well. Best bar that i have used. A++ on that one OR.

very nice!
T U N A

Tuna flying 19m lines in puget sound (photo by Krash)

I’m hoping to get a session with the kite before its passed out to the next testosterone kite junky.
The next rider to demo the kite has been bugging me for weeks now.
He absolutely needs to demo the kite on November 8th,
which, if I remember right…thats the day he’s going to Maui for a week!
Awwwwww Man!

Crew - please help hype the 2011 line up. Without a doubt this year’s 2011 line up of gear is the nicest collection of equipment we have ever had on offer.

2011 Rise kites - massive wind range, huge hang time
2011 Razor kites - insane boost, grunt and low end - incredible turning speed and direct pull
2011 Mako boards - smooth operator, deepest concave on the market - now with a wood core!
2011 JT Pro - 2/3 the thickness of the 2010 Zen the JT pro offers insane load and pop while handling the chop beautifully with its wood core flex. our best freestyle board yet and less expensive than last year’s Zen!
2011 5’11” Surf Series - Designed with input taken from over a year and a half of custom board builds for our Crew this board is a dream in the waves.

And that’s just the 2011 gear, we still offer the Predator Surf, the Pyro Pro (now in black and blue colour options), a ton of accessories and the Session Harness system!

hi all
been teaching with the 10m and 8m for over a week now also been getting a few sessions in myself,
the lessons have all gone well with the razors with students relaunching with ease etc,and with a few
up and riding really well i think the orders will be going in,mistakes have been forgiven and none of then had there
ass handed to them which is allways a good thing,been using the 2010 bar and once set up been fine,good for them to learn where to set the stopper as not many use them and it gets overlooked,steering being very direct and instant i think has also
helpedthem along,happy days
still waiting to get my hands on the rises,but not long now yeeehaaaa
got some gopro footage to post as soon as i get my head round how to do it
good winds
ben

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2011 gear will be rolling shortly. All distributors and importers will already have had their 1st 2011 shipment sent to them and our first batch of gear is expected to be in port this week with it cleared and ready to ship for early next week! (Fingers crossed)

Razors are IN. The 2011 bars are en route. We can ship kites no bars anywhere you like now, the bars will be with us next week with the goal of all open orders being fulfilled and shipped by that weekend.

I’ve got a size advice question for a Razor to fit into my existing quiver. I’d much appreciate advice from those of you who have ridden both.

I’m ~200lbs (90kg) and primarily ride a 6’1” traditional surfboard shape strapped/strapless. I’m new to the sport, but am progressing quickly into wave riding and free riding at the beach and in the bay. Not into freestyle.

I currently have a two kite quiver - 8 and 12m Rise 2009 kites. The vast majority of the time I’ve been on my 12 (90% of days?) because I’m always more concerned about being underpowered than overpowered. That said, I really needed a 10m, and would’ve been 10/40/50% between the 8/10/12 if I had a 10 to go to.

So… I was all set to get a 10m rise when I saw this Razor noise. Since I’m really looking to progress in waveriding, seems like the obvious choice. Since everyone is talking about how the kite flys bigger than it is, I’m perplexed. Would you go with an 8m Razor and have an 8/8/12 quiver on the notion that the 8 Razor is really a 9 or 9.5? Or would you go 10? I’ve seen mixed info on the existence of a 9m Razor, but that would be the easy choice if it exists.

10m Razor - it will fit in well and you’ll end up reserving the 12m Rise for the really marginal days. While the Razor is a fantastic kite with excellent low end, you need to take some of the ” enthusiastic low end posts ” with a grain of salt….in reality the Razor gets you about one half to one square meter of power more than the same size Rise.

Cheers,

Evan

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Lots of folks have had these size questions between the the Rises and Razors, trying to fit the Razor in correctly.
Some wild power claims from some on their first rides!...Glad Evan is giving the straight skinny.
I would guess Ocean Rodeo is gonna sell a lot more Razors this year than the Rises and that it will make sense to add 7,9,11 sizes next year….but maybe not necessary.

Oh, one other question. I’ve got two bars/lines for my two 2009 Rise kites. Recommendations for getting a 2011 bar? Do I get a choice between 5th line or traditional (the newer version of my ‘09 Rise bar)?

While it’s possible in the future, I don’t see us adding odd size Razors…..it makes things too difficult for our retailers and most hate it..having to stock so many sizes of both Razor and Rise, and in the end, they may not have the right size model in the right color (for you wankers who buy kites like women buy cosmetics….) anyway! Arguably odd sizes would make it simpler to fit a Razor into a hole in a Rise quiver, but in the long run most people who goes this route well inevitable transition to a full Razor quiver in the long run anyway.

Cheers,

Evan

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Oh, one other question. I’ve got two bars/lines for my two 2009 Rise kites. Recommendations for getting a 2011 bar? Do I get a choice between 5th line or traditional (the newer version of my ‘09 Rise bar)?

The ” standard ” bar for the Razor is the Freestyle (mini-5th) bar, but you can fly it with the Freeride (traditional below the bar depower) as well. Neither is ” better ’ - personal preference. Since you already have two of one style, I would recommend getting the Freestyle bar so you can figure out what you like better for the long run.

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Arguably odd sizes would make it simpler to fit a Razor into a hole in a Rise quiver, but in the long run, most people who go this route will inevitably transition to a full Razor quiver in the long run anyway.

Yep, that’s the plan, move to Razors.
Gonna try to get away with a two kite quiver for 2011.

I tested a buddy’s kite the other day, his bar system just seemed crap, I had forgotten how spoiled I am with the OR bar system.
It is just plain good.

Just a quick note too re: bars (Evan covered beautifully all the points I was going to make on the kites). The 2011 kites are made with a roll over bridle system to allow for the best possible de-power in the event of a full CL release. The 2008, 09, 10 bars will all work with the 2011 Rise and Razor kites but will not allow for the full extent of depower that a 2011 bar with a 2011 kite will offer.

All of that being said, if you have a 2009 or 2010 bar (or more specifically the chicken loop) you can re-fit your bar to accept the longer trim line and outside leaders needed to allow for a more complete depower upon release.

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OK, so my 8M Razor just came in tonight.
Two front line connection points and three back connection points.
Pretty much figure I know what they will do but it would be great if everyone heard from Ocean Rodeo what they were designed to accomplish,.....website stuff,.. hint, hint.
Feedback from those of you who have messed with them would be good.
If we get some 8M wind in the next week, I will be checking out the different positions myself.

My kite shipped rear on the fronts and middle on the back lines, which I recently moved back for a little faster looping.

Brent - I have had some more time on the Razor and think you are going to love this kite.

After getting a little more dialed in I can say the top end is more than I would have expected - had it out in a solid 22 mph without feeling out of control (be prepared to edge though). Also have gotten the timing on sent jumps down a bit more to get some good air - really more C’ish about how quickly you whip the kite back than the the “slower send and sheet in” of the Rise. Otherwise the unhooked stuff continues to impress me. Powerful, predictable pop and then the kite just pulls the perfect amount - not completely slack but light enough it won’t pull you off your landing - really comfortable. Unhook and the kite just stays where you put it - lovely.

Dude you know what those do as does anyone selling one to a novice.
They have been pretty standard on OR and many other kites for years.

Yep, the Rise 08/09 had two front line and two back line options, then the 2010 Rise came with a single front connection point only.
I was curious about why that change happened with the six strut Rise.
So the Razor comes with two fronts and three backs,.. awesome, choices are good.
The outside connection points on the fronts are sewn over a kevlar type scuff pad and the inside fronts are not sewn on a scuff pad, so the inside front connection points have me curious….I ask a lot of questions.
As far as dealers passing along useful information to a novice, I’ve not bought new kites at a retailer but I have watched and listened when I’ve been in the shop and guys that sell kites don’t explain stuff to customers any more than the kid at the skate shop does!! My suggestion is more from a standpoint of thinking it would be useful and a good marketing idea for OR to communicate more on the website with PDF’s that explain (all kinds of) stuff, saves printing new manuals every year. People like hype (oops I mean information), it sells gear.

Brent4336 - 01 December 2010 02:46 PM

fronts change the kites ability to depower a bit and slightly affect how far forward the kite sits in the window. Forward is more depower and further forward in the window.

Yep, people like to hear that fronts inside are for upwind/freeride and outside are for freestyle…I will say it again, people like the hype, marketing sells kites, OR is more of a no bullshit word of mouth company but more marketing never hurts.

I have not flown an OR kite. The Rise always looked like a smart, logical design, but maybe too many struts and too high aspect for my style.

The Razor looks absolutely ideal.

Vids help a lot since I don’t know anybody in Lake Michigan who rides OR.
Tronet’s vids are phenomenal! It would just be nice to see more footage of the kite drifting, recovering, downlooping, unhooking, launching, landing etc.

Also, what impact, if any, does the new bridle have on self landing?
Can it be eared at the edge of the window and yanked down?
Can the chicken loop be leashed to a fixed object, allowing the rider to walk to the kite and land?

Just got a test 8m razor here today, sadly its a bit to cold to try it at the moment, but tuesday i’ll be goin to Brasil :D
Will give you a full review after i get back. Jeremie also offered his 6 and 10 for testing.

Will also try it on the 2010 rise bar.

Anything u wanna know, see tested, just say so

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I don’t have any video but the Razor is killer in surf…..I’ve put mine through the paces in NorCal in everything from side-on mush to riding container ship wakes (essentially down-the-line for miles) to perfect, long period side-off stuff. The kite parks and fades down-the-line well (hooked or unhooked), but turning is super fast and crisp when you need it to be. Downloops are instant and powerless if you want them to be, but look out if you don’t…:)

In comparison to the Rise, the changes are exactly what I wanted out of a wave kite. Superior unhooked performance, lighter weight (while retaining bomber construction), quick turning and rapid relaunch - in this regard the Razor is far superior to the Rise. What you loose is the massive top end range that the Rise has.

Self landing is easy - put the kite to the edge of the window, climb quickly up the middle lines and yank the top front flying line - she’ll fall nose down head to wind.

I’ve had the 10 and 12 Razors out in good waves a few times now. Side/side on/side off wind. I’m 6’4” 230 lbs. I know there’s a lot of hype about em, but I do have to say they’re the best wave kites I’ve flown! (3 years kiting- 80% of the time in pretty good surf) More to my liking than my 2010 Rise kites for wave riding. I like the look of the more C shape, only 4 struts, less weight, etc, etc (I’m not much of a techie, just know they feel good and sit where I want em while going down the line looking for a lip to hit). Factory rear line position (middle) and bridle setting (farthest away from the center of the LE) didn’t have me as impressed as I thought I’d be after reading all the rave reviews. Then I moved the back lines closest to the wingtips, fronts forward towards the center of the LE and the kites came alive big time! The Razors seem to have more low end grunt than the Rise, are rock solid, really quick turning, very direct pull without any “mushy” feeling. I was concerned after reading that they sit further back in the window, but after moving the bridle attachment point the kite just feels better and getting back out to the line up up wind is no problem. Had the 12 out when wind picked up and it was still solid when I could have been on the 10. Same thing when I was on the 10 and it picked up to the point I could’ve been on an 8. Not the high end wind range of the ‘10 Rise, but plenty since I ride with a long throw bar. So, I like the top end as well. A 13 would be nice if they decide to make one. If I drop 25 lbs I wont need a 13 and will get an 8! In short I’M STOKED! Thanks OR!

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I caught the 10m in action with my gopro helmet mount this last thursday at my local spot.
2 other riders were out when I showed up, one was flying a 13m cab and the other was flying a 14m north.
Its a great feeling to be on the smallest kite (the mako king helped with this), and I was able to easily point upwind
and sail to Boeing creek a mile or so upwind. I was hoping the winds were steadier up there, but the gust and lulls were just bigger.
The Razor is much more attentive on the downwind leg than my Rise, everytime I sine’d it, it really pulled quick and hard.
No waves in puget sound, but it doesn’t take a rocket scientist to figure out that this kite will perform beautifully in the surf.
I’m getting a feel for the top end too, some of the gusts at the creek felt like 25-30, and thats close to the limit of my comfort zone with this big board. (I weigh 210lbs)
I am really stoked about how this new kite de-powers during a self launch deep in the window.
I thought for a second I was going for a drag when the bar ripped out of my hands,
but the traction spike leveled off instantly and the kite was super stable off the front lines.
Very curious about the 12m’s low end…its calling to me and I’m not sure I can resist that siren song.

great to see the kite at work like that. Something missing so far. Reviews tell of it, but its nice to see it. Also nice to see that from the rider point of view there is very little cloth that is not working to produce power. Looks like almost all 10m are flat, but it turns like anything but.

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Thanks you guys, and sorry about getting kinda mushy with the soundtrack.
Its just that sometimes I get this feeling that the soul of the designer is speaking to me through my flying lines.
And that language was timeless and classical during this session.
I am just stoked that this gear can transform a mediocre wind into something memorable that I have come to crave on a regular basis. Kitesurfing is a path to enlightenment for both the body and soul.
An excellent way to connect with natural forces.

Had an amazing session on the 6m with the small freestyle bar yesterday. Winds 25-35 knots with possibly higher gusts.

First take on the kite was the low end is definitely equivalent to the 8m Rise (my buddy rode them both back to back and confirmed this). Kite was super stable for a 6 - not twitchy in the least. Find the extra bar pressure helps to know where the kite is which is crucial with such small kites. Kite was definitely a booster in these conditions - really good rip off the water and plenty o hang. Really shone in the loops….HUGE yank, quick climb bak to top of window, soft but wicked fast landings…

Had some good sessions on the 8m in Cumbuco. Thanks Barry and Wouter, I’ll send it back this week.
If you have a rise at the moment you can take the razor 2m smaller. 10m rise and 8m razor had about the same low-end. But the Rise has a better high end.

Btw in low-wind and waveriding/downwind it will try to fronstall (drop in front of you in the powerzone). Both on the freestyle bar and the rise bar. Just cruising no problem and enough pressure. Really couldnt find something wrong with the lines so i guess if you get into some nice wave riding/downwinder make sure that you got the right kite size for that.

For pics i have to ask if i can take it with me to Mexico for 2 months.
Btw, they wouldnt buy my Rise there, cause OR wasnt really well known there, work on it guys Prices are good there for 2nd hand kites.

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fronstall (drop in front of you in the powerzone). Is this something different than backstalling? Haven’t heard that term before. What happens, what is it? The way one of my friends tunes his kites he is powered up with the bar waaaaaaaaaaay out, so it’s easy to oversheet and stall the kite. But he likes it that way cause when he’s on a wave he can have his front arm all the way extended and back hand off the bar when going frontside (wave riding downwind in side on conditions). Just his personal preference. BTW the guys rips.

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Nice work guys. This kite is a real winner. Even with the reviews I’m super impressed with how much power you can get per meter. Not much wasted fabric up there. The 6 feels like what I used to get out of my 8 sle just a couple years back. Would have too much overlap with last years 10m diablo for those to fit well together. Very clean profile, light, direct, and really well mannered. Its early yet, but I cant say there is much I miss about my old quiver.

Cheers to the year of the white kite!

Had a chance to compare it to a few other kites back to back and came away from it super stoked I chose the Razor. Was playing with the 10m 2011 Era from Royal, the 11.5m 2011 Kahuna and the 19m FS speed 3. Along with my 10m razor light conditions on snow. The razor was like a blend of the era and Kahuna that takes the good witout the bad. More direct and harder hitting power than the flatter Era with more power in the turns and nicer unhooked, but more reactive, smoother and better depower than the kahuna. The kahoona has loads of power, but I find deltas unresponsive when there is not a lot of kite speed and really hard to recover from a stall. The Razor has all that power without any of the bad manners at low speed. Easier relaunch than either of them to boot. Reverses right off the snow.

Not a lot of gap on snow between the 10m and 19m foil. Really only a couple of mph difference in low end but as soon as there is wind the smaller kite is 10x more fun to fly. You cant beat those big foils for power and behaviour in the stupid light stuff.

At the tail end of an absolutely fantastic 8 K downwinder my buddy suffered a rather colossal moment of poor judgment. Though the lines are TOAST, the kite and bridle were pristine, up and flying today. One inch abrasion on the canopy is all you can find with a magnifying glass. Nice work OR. Still after watching this clip together over a beer it was pretty much agreed that the dude had just bought the kite! One more to the crew, albeit by the side door!

We’re just about to launch a Crew Video contest with small monthly winners and one grand prize winner of a 2012 kite in September. We’ve lined up some sweet prizes and are working on the landing page now…

This my friend is the first official entry. Such a great video.. we all were laughing here at HQ. Tell your buddy we’re stoked to have him “on” the gear!

Maybe most of what can be said has been said, but with 5 sessions on the 8 m razor in… 10 to 30 kn… I had to report: I absolutely love this kite in this size! Its basic characteristics as previously reported are incredibly stability, power delivery, control and relaunch and… those characteristics didn’t really change no matter how much trim I had to yank in, and I found that impressive. On the low-end I was able to kite in ~10kn (I weigh in at 155 pounds), however that wind was quite dense i.e. cold and seemed to be more powerful, regardless, tremendous low-end. At the 25 to 30 knot high-end I was definitely wishing I had my 6m razor in my hands but that wind strength didn’t last long and I figured out you can pull in a lot of trim and survive, even kite. I was using the small freeride bar (24m of total line length) on the 49 cm setting and the turning was brisk but controlled. I would normally use shorter lines with the razor but the 8m is so stable and trimable that doesn’t seem to make too much difference. When jumping on a smaller kite I can usually manage to drop myself out of the sky a number of times, but jumping the 8m razor that never happened regardless of my incompetence or the wind speed. So when you add on all the other things it does incredibly well, including the wider than anticipated wind range, the 8m razor is my new alltime favourite kite.
6/8/10 Razor, Mako 140/50, Surf 5.11

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I got out for the first time on my 8m Razor. Winds were in the 14 - 20 knot range probably, I could have stayed on my 12m Rise, but I was having bladder issues so I figured I’d try out the 8m Razor.

I really like the kite, basically everything everyone has said held true. Solid feel, really grunty through the turns, super fast turning, and I like how it sits in the wind window for waves. Boosting will take some getting used too as the more direct feel requires more attention than the 12m Rise, but that’s really with any smaller kite, it was fast through the one or two loops I did.

Relaunch was a lot better/quicker than the 2010 Rise. Overall, I see this kite working out well for a wave kite for someone my size or smaller (185 lbs) and for my high wind kite on days where it’s solid over 20 knots on a twintip.

I’m going to start riding a surfboard more, so I hope to take the 8m out in light winds with a surfboard for downys.

Resurrecting this one again! Posted this on KF, thought it fit well here too. Its a bit of a read!

Since you asked, My current kites are definitely the best I’ve owned, and here’s why.

For some context, I ride a surfboard strapless in light wind and wave conditions. I ride a rockered stiff custom with boots in powered bump and jump conditions. So, two boards and currently two kites, a 10 and a 6.

The most important thing I’m looking for in a kite is unhooked performance. I’ve had a few really good SLE’s before but none of them unhooked well. They were great kites, but all needed too much strap pulled in to fly unhooked which really killed their performance. I switched back to modern C kites and thought I’d hit the jackpot. I was fine with the minor inconveniences of the 5th line and needing a 14m. The consistency and performance unhooked were well worth it. This year I stayed with Ocean Rodeo because they have been great to me in the past and I liked my C kites a lot, but they no longer make it, so I went with it’s replacement. Razors.

Firstly they are absolutely excellent unhooked. Predictable power, great pull through the turns, no stall and they stay right where you put em in the window. On par with my recent quiver of 5 line C’s in every respect with all the added bonuses of being an SLE:
simple 4 line, really powerful, with all the depower that comes with bridles

Now you wanted particulars so here they are:

Its a 4 strut kite. Lighter, faster, and less pumping than anything I’ve owned.

The one pump is better than previous years. The tubes are much shorter and are always straight because the nozzles on LE and struts are angled toward each other. Simple improvement that makes for easier inflation and deflation as the hoses never kink shut.

The strut construction is better as the closing seam is also where it is sewn to the Canopy. There is no long seam running up the inside of the strut that tends to weaken where the struts kink while sitting on the beach. Have had kites need some gluefix there in the past and always look to see how the struts are built. The struts are also very thin which makes em light and quick to inflate/deflate.

LE construction is an improvement. The final closing of the kite is now only from the outside strut to the tips. Somehow they manage to reinforce the LE from the inside with a flat piece of webbing that runs from outside strut to outside strut. This is a load bearing piece of webbing sewn flat on the inside of the tube that takes the load off the actual seam. You cant see the webbing just the stitching, so its pretty subtle, but I notice this stuff. Its brilliant. Not easy to picture I’m sure from my description, but it is by far and away better.

The bridle is as good as it can be. The kite is C shaped so its only three attachments up the leading edge. Its nice and compact, and it allows the kite to completely roll on its back when you go to safety or drop the bar unhooked. A significant improvement over any other kite that flies off its front lines in those situations.

Relaunch is the best I’ve tried and it easily reverse launches off snow by pulling both rear lines.

This brings up a point. I think the four strut design that puts a little more depth of chord toward the tips is ideal as the bigger wingtip compared to otherwise similarly shaped three strut kites like the WH or Bandit helps with light wind manners. There is just a little more wingtip to keep the kite flying when its way off to 10 or 2 o’clock in the window. Basically the kite just recovers better in really light wind (Sometimes the case on snow). Those big wingtips also make it really responsive.

The range of the kites. I’m down to two kites that overlap nicely. Especially with my boards. Both the 10 and 6 are incredibly powerful for their size, yet they are small. They are fast and fun to fly in the light stuff using a small fast and flat surfboard yet a wake set up gives you tons of strength at the top end of their range, easily 40 knots on the 6m. I don’t think I’d buy a bigger one. If I ever got the motivation to go bigger I’d jump straight to a 19m flysurfer.

The bar. Its clean simple, the swivel works, and they give you the choice of above or below the bar trim. I like above the bar for various reasons and theirs works perfect while staying tidy. IMO their chicken loop unit is one of the best out there. It’s push release, works every time, is simple to reload even in the water it auto aligns perfectly, its light and it doesn’t chew up the bar. The bushing in the bar is very large and has been the best I’ve owned for not wearing the depower line. All four flying lines are the same length, 21m. + 2m for the leaders on the bar and you get a total of 23, no extension crap to snag on unwinding. Simple, kook proof with pull tabs, and trimmed perfect on both kites out of the bag.

Well thats it. The Razor is a grunty, fast and well behaved kite, built both light and tough with a lot of attention and evolution in the details. I have outlined the details for you, but the magic is in the flying. So much performance with exceptional manners. Feedback is excellent with nice medium bar pressure. I’d put up with a lot of missed details or inconvenience for this kind of performance, but quite frankly Ocean Rodeo have not missed a thing when it comes to the fit and finish. This kite is the complete package and is perfectly geared toward the wave and wake set.

I don’t make a cent off the kite industry, but am lucky enough to be a shop rider so I get a break on costs. I have the choice of a number of big brands, but I make a decent living and absolutely love to kite so if I thought there was something better I would spoil myself. Kiting is my addiction and 8 years in I gladly support the great crew of people at Ocean Rodeo.

Hey Brent, great review but your timing couldn’t be worse. I received my 10m last Friday and was promised wind over the weekend. Which didn’t happen.
It’s sitting in its bag now an if I listen well I can hear it weep softly. Or is it me?

At the tail end of an absolutely fantastic 8 K downwinder my buddy suffered a rather colossal moment of poor judgment. Though the lines are TOAST, the kite and bridle were pristine, up and flying today. One inch abrasion on the canopy is all you can find with a magnifying glass. Nice work OR. Still after watching this clip together over a beer it was pretty much agreed that the dude had just bought the kite! One more to the crew, albeit by the side door!

enjoy

I’m impressed you still call him your buddy. Fucktard springs to mind!

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Brent…. excellent review of the Razor. Seems you have the opportunity to demo and choose different kites. Can you
compare the Wainmans’ to the Razor? Also, any opinion on a two kite quiver of 10 Razor with an 8 or 7 Rise?

Haven’t flown the wainmans but owned a 13 and 9m bandit. The razor is a convergence of the rise and the deltas. I remember asking if OR would build a delta. They said no! The razor was their answer. Razor, bandit, wainman, park, RPM, envy are all alternatives to the higher aspect ratio kites on the market like the rise, crossbow, rev, rebel, Helix etc. Funny, after all this evolution, you can still easily classify kites as either high or med aspect ratio. Delta’s are just one of the med type. I liked the 9m bandit a lot, the 13 not so much. The deep centre gives em tons of low end and great position in the window, but when you get them into light wind, they start to misbehave. Have recently flown an 11.5 kahoona in light wind, and they get unresponsive because they have tiny wing tips to steer with and are pretty front end heavy. They like to dive when underpowered out at the edge of the window and don’t like to recover. All not much of an issue in 9m weather, but when they reach their low end they kinda shut off altogether. Have flown next to and taken a good look at many wainman kites. They are pretty delta with a slightly bigger wingtip. The profile, aspect ratio, C shape and behavior when powered is not all that different from the razor and I would say they appeal to a lot of the same riders (guys not interested in racing, hang time or holding down a lot of kite in high wind). Both are great kites that give you more power per m, responsive performance and predictable behavior unhooked. Where the razor gets ahead is that they also incorporated the newer trends in light wind kites. Chiefly build them light, not weak, but light, as in thin struts and trim the dacron where its not needed, and keep some surface in the wingtips cause you need it to fly well at the edge and recover in the kites low end. Every review boasts about the razors low end power. Its so good cause they keep flying well when other kites have already “turned off”. Makes the 10 m razor work for me in light conditions all winter and hopefully in summer on a surfboard.

As winds go up and kites get smaller you can worry about this stuff less, and its better to sacrifice speed for stability. Everything is fast in 40 knots! If you own a small rise and are happy with its comfort, stability and top end it will fit nicely with a bigger razor. If not, just get a small razor. They don’t bite! Its hard to tell someone else what to get as a quiver. I run pretty big gaps but it works for me cause I infill with different board types and it always seems to line up with conditions. If you only run twintips then you might want to keep your gaps smaller. In that case I could see someone wanting a 10m razor and a 7m rise.

Hi Guys, just back from a really low wind session on the 10m Razor. I’m around 97kg/220 imperial things and took the 140x40 Mako. Had I taken the Mako King I would certainly have a lot of fun in this:
Now that ain’t more than 10-12 knots.

I’m totally blown away with the low end here, I could easily hold ground and wasn’t even sining like mad. I believe the venturis work really well on this smaller AR kite!
I’m so looking forward to real wind!

I had a quick session on my 12 meter Razor today. It was 12-17mph with some light chop and current. The kite is fast yet stable. It has good grunt to get you up and going and pull you through turns. At 140 lbs, I was able to stay upwind on my 129 x39 Zen without much flying of the kite.

I look forward to putting some more time on the Razor to get a better feel of how it handles the gusts and how well it jumps.

Aloha,
Jeff

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Hey Jeff… still flying the 8m Rise I purchased from you. With the low end reviews of the Razors, I’m surprised you didn’t
purchase the 10 Razor. At 170lbs (75kg) I am thinking of adding the 10 Razor as my biggest kite.

I’m getting an 8 and 10 meter Razor too. I started off with the 12 meter for lighter winds. The low end of the Razors is better than the Rises, but probably only half or one kite size better. I’d get the 12 meter Razor if you’re going to be kiting in winds lighter than 15mph.

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Did some high end testing of the 10m today, at least that’s what todays session became when it started gusting close to 40 knots. The razor turns out to have a very nice Eastern Egg hidden inside! By taking in about 15-20 cm of trim line, the kite is still very well behaved and remarkably steerable. In fact it starts to handle more like a Rise in terms of gust handling, with still plenty of that raw power which I love from this kite.
Jumping the ten in these winds is totally awesome. I was hucking myself into some really big airs, and I found the Razor easier to maneuver up there, which easily makes up for the lack of hang time it has compared to the Rise. Just moving the kite from side to side a bit with an aggressive down stroke by the time you’re ready to land will keep you up there for quite a while. With the Rise, I could just glide back down and land smoothly with little kite action, with the Razor some more work is required.
I feel I’m starting to get to know this kite a bit better now, throwing downloops in turns is ridiculously smooth and soooo powerful…

totally agree with rudo!! Today I had a sick session on the 8m Razor. With my 75 kg weight I wasn’t on the high end of the Razor. No trim on the depowerstrap, and even did some huge kiteloops in todays 35 knots wind!!

Man what a sick range!!
I can ride the kite from around 17-18 knots till (I think) 40-45 knots! Super stoked!!!

I’ve noticed the same about the Razor. It’s a fun kite to jump with, but does require more flying skill to land with. There are two main things I really like about the Razor. One, like you commented, it really pulls you through turns. Two, it is very stable when parked in one position for surfing.

So, far I’ve had one session on my 8 meter and about 6 sessions on the 12 meter. It would be interesting to see how well the Razor would do in heavier winds with the Freeride bar. I think you could probably extend the top end of the kite a little and make the kite even better behaved in gusty conditions.

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I agree with you Jeff, the free ride bar gives you that little extra high end.
I was using a prototype free ride bar today, with the basic set up of the 2011 free ride bar. I’m still very much an SLE kiter, using a full arms length to fly the kite through gusts. The Razor doesn’t depower like the Rise so I get spanked. It takes some getting used to dig in the rail of my board and see the kite move towards the end of the wind window.

@Pimpoldi, welcome to the crew dude! Why don’t you post your loop of last week here?

el rudo you inspire me!
caught an afternoon sesh at my local spot…other kiters had just come in with 7’s.
your post was on my mind as I pumped up the 10m razor and self launched.
piece of cake self launching, I love how this thing rotates and springs into action!
throwing the kite into a high loop just before landing is the ticket for soft touch downs with speed for sure.
went way upwind to boeing creek and got some lofty air in the squeeze section next to the cliff,
then smiled the whole time jamming towards the kite as I headed back down to the launch.
the razor is my favorite kite, so simple and powerful…Ross you are the man!

I’ve noticed the same about the Razor. It’s a fun kite to jump with, but does require more flying skill to land with. There are two main things I really like about the Razor. One, like you commented, it really pulls you through turns. Two, it is very stable when parked in one position for surfing.

So, far I’ve had one session on my 8 meter and about 6 sessions on the 12 meter. It would be interesting to see how well the Razor would do in heavier winds with the Freeride bar. I think you could probably extend the top end of the kite a little and make the kite even better behaved in gusty conditions.

Razor keeps you sharp for sure, you take a big jump on the Razor you better be really dialed in, you land fast doing downwind, much more so than the Rise… With the Razor, you can pull your front hand right at the last minute and get a nice boost effect that flattens you out a bit and softens the landing (but speeds it up), with the Rise you can kind of just float down and then keep going. I take the Razor when I’m ‘game on’, and the Rise when I feel like floating around

If you do mostly hooked in tricks go with the Rise, or if you need only 1 kite or 1 really versatile kite.
If you are working on mostly unhooked tricks got with the Razor, or if you can afford a few kites and like to mix up the feel.

Hello!
My name is Gloria and I’m newbie to this community. I started learning about this forum from this thread and I just want to say thank you for sharing this amazing and absolutely priceless information about your experience over here! I’m very grateful for that!