Re: What happend to fragrance community.

Re: What happend to fragrance community.

From the OPs premise, I would conjecture that fragrance aficionados have merely become bored with YouTube. Fine fragrance sales are still strong, the mid-market range is showing some fairly strong debuts, and lo-end market still seems fairly robust.

I was about to smart off and say something like, "Yessiree sonny, things were so much better back in the old days." But I don't really think they were.

Re: What happend to fragrance community.

Falco4758, You're right. In the past, I never really paid much attention. I really only listened to Youtube for music in the past, with the exception of a couple of Creed reviews I watched about how to detect fakes. However, I just went to Youtube and of the four brand new 2013 fragrances I've personally reviewed for Basenotes for the month of April. only one is reviewed on Youtube.

Re: What happend to fragrance community.

It may just be my perception, but I find there are a glut of mens frag reviewers on YT. There are even a dozen or so reviews of today's SOTD Yatagan.

I don't watch many YT frag reviewers, although I do subscribe to 860Cologne.
He hasn't reviewed any fragrances I particularly like, but he's a good reviewer and has a pleasant voice and mannerisms.

Every time I'm slightly tempted to join the already bloated reviewer market, I realise that I'm neither articulate nor telegenic enough to appear on camera.....also I don't have a camera....and my voice is whiny and annoying

Re: What happend to fragrance community.

It may just be my perception, but I find there are a glut of mens frag reviewers on YT. There are even a dozen or so reviews of today's SOTD Yatagan.

I don't watch many YT frag reviewers, although I do subscribe to 860Cologne.
He hasn't reviewed any fragrances I particularly like, but he's a good reviewer and has a pleasant voice and mannerisms.

Every time I'm slightly tempted to join the already bloated reviewer market, I realise that I'm neither articulate nor telegenic enough to appear on camera.....also I don't have a camera....and my voice is whiny and annoying

You have it all wrong. The one thing we don't have is the whiny annoying reviewer. The happy upbeat positive act is already taken. The professional articulate act is taken. The pretending to be articulate but repeating the same phrases and adjectives is taken. The blue collar I bad production I hate everything is taken. Whiny and annoying isn't.

Re: What happend to fragrance community.

Originally Posted by Awakening950

You have it all wrong. The one thing we don't have is the whiny annoying reviewer. The happy upbeat positive act is already taken. The professional articulate act is taken. The pretending to be articulate but repeating the same phrases and adjectives is taken. The blue collar I bad production I hate everything is taken. Whiny and annoying isn't.

Re: What happend to fragrance community.

Re: What happend to fragrance community.

Originally Posted by Birdboy48

Part of it may be that there's just so many darned frags being introduced that people have thrown up their hands in despair of keeping up with them all.

I never liked the video reviews. And they mostly focused on top notes as well. There are some of us who are taking our time with scents, going back to them once in a while, reevaluating, thinking about a larger context, etc. If you want to know what that is like, take a look at my blog, now with well over 50 posts (none of them short entries, IIRC). I think a lot of people "burned themselves out" and jumped to conclusions about scents, rather than studying them closely over a long period of time.

As to the idea that something major happened, it may just be among the tiny percentage of extreme enthusiasts, ones who create blogs, for example, and not most people. It may in fact be that interest has expanded among those who don't do these things. It also may be that the major scent sites have enough on them now to satisfy a lot of people who 5 years ago would have created a blog on their own. It's important not to rush to judgement without really studying all the facets of the phenomenon.

Re: What happend to fragrance community.

Anyone know why Hiro deleted all his videos off youtube? I went and came back from holiday to find them all gone.

It's a real shame because I really enjoyed them.

He mentioned in his last clip that his new career requires him to 'not be a public figure' resulting in deleting his videos.

Originally Posted by Awakening950

You have it all wrong. The one thing we don't have is the whiny annoying reviewer. The happy upbeat positive act is already taken. The professional articulate act is taken. The pretending to be articulate but repeating the same phrases and adjectives is taken. The blue collar I bad production I hate everything is taken. Whiny and annoying isn't.

Re: What happend to fragrance community.

Here's one guy's thoughts on the same subject - the exhaustion/boredom/stagnation of the perfume community as a whole. Be warned that this guy is highly critical of basenotes. He has some valid criticisms in this regard, but the main reason I'm linking this is because of the larger picture he describes.

Re: What happend to fragrance community.

People come and people go. There are probably more people on YouTube making fragrance related videos now than ever before.

This. I see much more fragrance related videos than I did a couple years ago. Seems like for every old school reviewer that leaves, 2 to 3 new reviewers pop up.

Originally Posted by GSHARP

Anyone know why Hiro deleted all his videos off youtube? I went and came back from holiday to find them all gone.

It's a real shame because I really enjoyed them.

As someone mentioned earlier, he deleted his videos a few weeks back. Mentioned something about his new career and how he can no longer do videos nor keep the past videos up because of it. So he said he'd delete them a few days later and he did.

One a sidenote, I really miss Marc Robes' haul videos. Too bad he said he'll no longer be doing them. It's one of the few fragrance videos I used to watch. I'm usually turned off by the long drawn out reviews.

Re: What happend to fragrance community.

Recently got into the fragrances heavy When I look on youtube it seems the videos were very huge and made from about 2009-2011 then the community seem to have faded. What happend?

1) Redundancy of reviews, how many reviews of Aventus, DHI, and Black Afgano can one watch? Most ground has been covered and the new reviewers are merely repeating old info without offering anything new.

2) Internal bickering in the community

3) Lack of ground breaking frags to fuel the hype train.

4) Burnout of established reviewers with a significant following.

5) Elitism such as not responding to comments unless it is from another reviewer.

"If you enjoy the fragrance of a rose, you must accept the thorns which it bears."
-Isaac Hayes

Re: What happend to fragrance community.

Originally Posted by Diamondflame

Real life happens.

No truer words have been spoken in this thread.

I think that's why Robes08 aka Marc is able to continue doing it, because his real life takes him away from reviewing for every quarter of the year. Also this keeps his fan base missing him. Over saturation isn't good on either end.

Re: What happend to fragrance community.

Originally Posted by frostyicy

No truer words have been spoken in this thread.

I think that's why Robes08 aka Marc is able to continue doing it, because his real life takes him away from reviewing for every quarter of the year. Also this keeps his fan base missing him. Over saturation isn't good on either end.

As much as I enjoy being part of that community, it does bug me when reviewers refer to their subscribers as "fans". The fragrance is the star.

Re: What happend to fragrance community.

I have only watched 2 YouTube reviews in my life. 5 minutes of watching some guy stammer and "um... it's *sniff* *sniff* kinda like... *sniff* *sniff* pretty nice initially... and *sniff* *sniff* [looks down at notes] I am getting some bergamot too *sniff* *sniff* yeah.. and *sniff* *sniff* ummm... soft of some *sniff* *sniff* [looks back down at notes] vanilla... and *sniff*"

I would much rather spend 1 minute reading a thought out concise review than 5 minutes watching a guy sniff his arm or sprayer and meander around the English language's filler words throwing some notes out there that he is getting... Watching a guy sniffing a sprayer like a poodle sniffing the ass of another poodle is something I can do without.

But maybe someday I will go back and look at a few more - if so many people are spending time watching these, there must be something to it.

Re: What happend to fragrance community.

Originally Posted by noggs

Here's one guy's thoughts on the same subject - the exhaustion/boredom/stagnation of the perfume community as a whole. Be warned that this guy is highly critical of basenotes. He has some valid criticisms in this regard, but the main reason I'm linking this is because of the larger picture he describes.

Re: What happend to fragrance community.

As much as I enjoy being part of that community, it does bug me when reviewers refer to their subscribers as "fans". The fragrance is the star.

It's all part of the youtube generation and the inflation of the ego. People really think what they have to say is important because they now have the ability to broadcast their mumblings.

Originally Posted by dougczar

I have only watched 2 YouTube reviews in my life. 5 minutes of watching some guy stammer and "um... it's *sniff* *sniff* kinda like... *sniff* *sniff* pretty nice initially... and *sniff* *sniff* [looks down at notes] I am getting some bergamot too *sniff* *sniff* yeah.. and *sniff* *sniff* ummm... soft of some *sniff* *sniff* [looks back down at notes] vanilla... and *sniff*"

I would much rather spend 1 minute reading a thought out concise review than 5 minutes watching a guy sniff his arm or sprayer and meander around the English language's filler words throwing some notes out there that he is getting... Watching a guy sniffing a sprayer like a poodle sniffing the ass of another poodle is something I can do without.

But maybe someday I will go back and look at a few more - if so many people are spending time watching these, there must be something to it.

So true. Filler words is about all you get and qualitative adjectives that don't actually tell you anything. I love it when they read note lists of bizarre things that a guy in some New York basement has clearly never smelled in his life before. They are always good for a laugh though especially the terrible, terrible pronunciation of the French words. What makes it so funny is that the reviewer is so willing to spend $1000 on the selection of fragrances they are reviewing but they aren't willing to spend $100 on an hour long lesson on how to pronounce common words like 'l'eau'.

Re: What happend to fragrance community.

I've been an active reviewer on Youtube for almost 3 years now. I understand what the OP is saying. I have several things to say about the topic. For one, the market is very saturated, so it's difficult to stand out. You really have to have a unique channel to grab the attention of the community anymore. Also, yeah, there is some infighting in the community, kinda like old school vs. new reviewers kinda thing. Also, lets not forget about the impact of Facebook. Many reviewers have their own pages, and that seems to satisfy many people's need to connect to other reviewers without subjecting yourself to troll attacks and hate that can really take a toll on some of the long term committed reviewers.

Re: What happend to fragrance community.

Everyone has an opinion and some are more opinionated than others. There are various medium available to express one's opinions and to read/hear those opinions of others. To me, YT is a very inefficient means of getting to know others' opinions. ^Those reviewers on YT that think it's about them in the least and not the fragrance... well, I've never had time for that! It's not my idea of entertainment and I'm not so easily amused. Just another virtual identity with another opinion, but it's inefficient. Here, in the reviews section and given the fragrance, I can quickly come to know scores of opinions in the same time frame. That aspect was a major attraction back a few years when my enthusiasm was more at fever pitch AND I, for whatever reasons, thought there was more objectivity to this thing. Over time, I learned that that is but an impossibility with such things so subjective and so ever-changing.

Where is that gent with all the 'scientific studies' when you might really be interested in one? Excuse me... while I whip this scientifc study out! hehe, j/k

Oh yeah, one more thing... that guy from pygros has got one major chip on his shoulder. Maybe it's justified maybe it's not, but if I ever got myself so deep into this thing to think that way and feel I had to express myself that way publicly, well I'd hope I'd be able to push myself away from the bar, give up my seat, and find something better to do with my limited time on this ball-o-mud.

Re: What happend to fragrance community.

Also, there is this lose-lose situation going on. You realize that most views come from overreviewed frags like Le Male or Fahrenheit. Seems to me that most people have smelled these anyway, so it may be hard to justify reviewing them except for the sake of Youtube views. Then again, you discover some hidden gem in the niche market, and then nobody cares, unless you happen to be one of the few reviewers with about 1500 or more subs.

Re: What happend to fragrance community.

Originally Posted by BradW

Also, there is this lose-lose situation going on. You realize that most views come from overreviewed frags like Le Male or Fahrenheit. Seems to me that most people have smelled these anyway, so it may be hard to justify reviewing them except for the sake of Youtube views. Then again, you discover some hidden gem in the niche market, and then nobody cares, unless you happen to be one of the few reviewers with about 1500 or more subs.

Keep in mind, a shocking amount of views come from non-fragrance community folks doing a search. That's why many of the most common scents lead to so many views.

If someone wanted to launch a fragrance channel on youtube, it would still be wise to review scents that have already been reviewed to death. That will lead to views. Also review niche and best-of bargains. That'll lead to fragrance community folks finding your channel.

There's still a ton of potential for new reviewers to build a following on youtube.

Re: What happend to fragrance community.

Keep in mind, a shocking amount of views come from non-fragrance community folks doing a search. That's why many of the most common scents lead to so many views.

If someone wanted to launch a fragrance channel on youtube, it would still be wise to review scents that have already been reviewed to death. That will lead to views. Also review niche and best-of bargains. That'll lead to fragrance community folks finding your channel.

There's still a ton of potential for new reviewers to build a following on youtube.

Sounds like solid advice to me. However, it amazes me how often a new reviewer jumps right into the thick of things with rare niche reviews. I think there is pressure to impress the community by buying and reviewing expensive niche frags, even if you haven't reviewed many designers. I feel that in order to appreciate niche, you need to have the foundation of designer. How can you say, for example, how great L'Humaniste is if you haven't tried Edition Blanche or Eau Savage? So, there must be a balance on being credible and also, of being willing to retread the waters with your opinions on classics like Cool Water and Drakkar Noir.

Re: What happend to fragrance community.

^Those reviewers on YT that think it's about them in the least and not the fragrance... well, I've never had time for that!

OH MY GOD, THIS.

I often go to youtube for advice about scents, especially when choosing samples to buy or scents to seek out while traveling. I'm not going to name names, but here's what I usually find on youtube:

THE GUY WITH AN OPINION: He usually sprays the scent on his arm a few hours before doing the review so he's not smelling the frigging fleeting top notes while discussing the scent. He gives his opinion. He probably sprays his other arm and discusses the top notes too, but he focusses more on the heart and base. I may not agree with him, but his review is excellent. It's excellent because his review is about him giving his opinion rather than him telling me what I'm supposed to think, or what he thinks I'll think. He just gives his opinion, and that's excellent. He may seek opinions of others to include too, but his thoughts are his own. There are a few of these guys on youtube. I wish there were more. [EDIT: I shouldn't say guy since there are great women doing these too]

THE HYPER: He just regurgitates what he's heard on other reviews. His reviews are usually nothing but rambling as he tries to look smart. There are too many of these guys on youtube.

THE GUY WHO THINKS HE'S IMPORTANT: Holy cow, there are a few of these guys, and their reviews are rarely any good. Some of these people think they're TV stars.

THE DEBBIE DOWNER: He seems to only review scents he doesn't like. I don't get it. And his reviews are mostly him telling viewers whether or not they'd like the scent rather than doing a review where he tells viewers what HE thinks. LOL!

THE IDIOT: He reviews top notes but isn't smart enough to know that. He probably does first impressions videos too. First impressions are fine, but wear the scent for a while first so you're not just reviewing top notes!

THE TALKER: This is someone who just turns on the camera and spill out thoughts on a scent he/she likes or thinks more people should know about. The Talker doesn't seem to be trying to build a following even though they've posted a bunch of reviews. Sometimes, their reviews don't even feel like reviews. They tend to turn the camera on, say hello and then talk about something they want to share. I often find these reviews just as helpful as the reviews from the more popular fragrance community channels. I actually think it's funny that these reviewers seem to have better info that the wannabe stars and hypers.

Re: What happend to fragrance community.

Originally Posted by L'Homme Blanc Individuel

There's still a ton of potential for new reviewers to build a following on youtube.

I'm not out to pic a fight... but what is the end game for YT critics/reviewers? Claim to some kind of fame? Is there any money involved? The opportunity to show up on The Morning Show, The Today Show, The Tonight Show, The wutever Show and bring along a handful of witty fragrances for a confused whirly drive-by bit? Or, are these the same type people that gravitate towards ANY tv camera and think it's just the beez kneez to get on the telly making a funny face? Maybe it's a generational thing here. I'm 50 and perhaps don't get it. What I do get are the slammin' sarcasm-laden lyrics of Cracker's Teen Angst running through my mind when topics like this surface...

Cracker - Teen Angst

I don't know what the world may need
But I'm sure as hell that it starts with me
And that's a wisdom
I've laughed at

I don't know what the world may want
But a good stiff drink it surely don't
So I think I'll go and fix myself a tall one

'Cause what the world needs now
Is a new kind of tension
'Cause the old one just bores me to death

'Cause what the world needs now
Is another folk singer
Like I need a hole in my head

I don't know what the world may need
But a V8 engine's a good start for me
Think I'll drive and find a place
To be surly

I don't know what the world may want
But some words of wisdom could comfort us
Think I'll leave that up to
Someone wiser

'Cause what the world needs now
Are some true words of wisdom
Like la la la la la la la la-la

'Cause what the world needs now
Is another folk singer
Like I need a hole in my head

I don't know what the world may need
And I never grasped your complexities
I'd be happy just to get
Your attention

And I don't know what the world may want
But your long sweet body lying next to mine
Could certainly
Raise my spirits

'Cause what the world needs now
Is a new Frank Sinatra
So I can get you in bed

'Cause what the world needs now
Is another folk singer
Like I need a hole in my head

What the world needs now
What the world needs now
Is a new Frank Sinatra so I can get you in bed

What the world needs now
What the world needs now
Is another folk singer like I need a hole in my head

Re: What happend to fragrance community.

Originally Posted by BradW

Sounds like solid advice to me. However, it amazes me how often a new reviewer jumps right into the thick of things with rare niche reviews. I think there is pressure to impress the community by buying and reviewing expensive niche frags, even if you haven't reviewed many designers. I feel that in order to appreciate niche, you need to have the foundation of designer. How can you say, for example, how great L'Humaniste is if you haven't tried Edition Blanche or Eau Savage? So, there must be a balance on being credible and also, of being willing to retread the waters with your opinions on classics like Cool Water and Drakkar Noir.

Honestly, I think you're way over-thinking it.

It's youtube, not The New York Times. If I want expert opinions, I'll go to the experts. I don't mean that as a slam against youtube reviews. I really enjoy youtube reviews. A great review, IMHO, is one where the reviewer turns on the camera and gives HIS or HER own thoughts on how a scent smells and how it wears rather than trying to tell me what I may think.

Re: What happend to fragrance community.

It's youtube, not The New York Times. If I want expert opinions, I'll go to the experts.

I suppose this was a motivation for reviewing fragrances. Look at Luca Turin. Are his opinions the final word on what is good or bad? The best advice would be to find a reviewer with similar taste and take their opinions the most seriously. However, even better advice is this. The only sure way to know what is good or bad is to test for yourself. Some fragrances that I purchased had almost no reviews when I bought them. That gives me the satisfaction of having one of the only available reviews for a fragrance, basenotes, youtube, or otherwise. So, perhaps the satisfaction is more indulgent than anything. Like someone mentioned, not really the best way to obtain fame and fortune in this world. Perhaps I should stop buying fragrances and invest in scratch-off lottery tickets. More likely to get rich that way

Re: What happend to fragrance community.

I know that Youtube has its followers and detracters. I, personally don't watch. As was said by a previous poster I want to go to the true experts. Not the "alleged" experts, like Turin, Sanchez etc. I would rather come here to BN and read. I have more confidence in the views of BNers.

Fragrances for me are fun and actually some of the best fun I've had in my life with some of the most outstanding folks I've ever met. I just hate it when I see negativity get involved in any way. We have such a unique hobby and as far as I'm concerned I'm thankful for anyone that shares the same passion as me in this hobby as there are few of us in this world. The first year I started this hobby, the world of people I discovered were truly like none other. People of character, class and hearts....beautiful people. As time has gone on I have seen the bad and it's disappointing but as with any community and the world in general, that's just the way it is. I hope it stays to a minimum and urge everyone to try and find the positive in everything, enjoy each other, smile and have fun :-)

Re: What happend to fragrance community.

I've really never understood what YouTube adds to reviewing a scent, beyond what you get from reading written reviews here and at other places. At least here you can quickly scan dozens of reviews of one scent in a couple of minutes, and get an idea of the diversity of opinion - which has to be far less time consuming than doing the same on YouTube.
Cheers,
Renato

Re: What happend to fragrance community.

Originally Posted by Renato

I've really never understood what YouTube adds to reviewing a scent, beyond what you get from reading written reviews here and at other places. At least here you can quickly scan dozens of reviews of one scent in a couple of minutes, and get an idea of the diversity of opinion - which has to be far less time consuming doing the same on YouTube.
Cheers,
Renato

Exactly, and when the novelty value wore off, it was time to exit stage right. LOL.

Re: What happend to fragrance community.

When I first started to really become passionate about fragrances, I used YouTube as a way to get suggestions on what's good, what's bad, etc. I think what led me to follow YouTube reviews, was realizing that I was not alone. That there were others out there who were just as passionate about fragrances as I am. Its not common to meet people on a daily basis who own more than even 3 bottles of perfume, especially not males. Telling people that you are willing(and have already) to spend more than even $100 on any one fragrance will get you snickers, head shakes, and scornful comments about your priorities. You may say "well don't discuss your passion with anyone". Think of when you first became enamored with fragrances. The feel, and look, of your first bottle of niche. All you want to do is share your experience! I say all that to say this, YouTube puts a face with the review. Although the reviews can be extremely annoying, newbies can see the reaction to the first sniff, the facial expression made when smelling a "5 star fragrance" or a "total scrubber". It puts their mind at ease and introduces them to whole new olfactory journey filled with knowledge and excitement that they never thought possible. Lastly, YouTube brought me to basenotes! I very rarely watch YouTube videos now and get 99% of my knowledge of a fragrance or genre from the great folks here at basenotes, but PLEASE YouTube reviewers, keep doing your thing. I guarantee your videos are guiding the beginning of someone's fragrance journey right now...