The train is certainly on the tracks. Drama on the Snyder front started from the reaction to Man of Steel and things rapidly escalated from there. The studio got cold feet on BvS and SSquad and that's where things started to unravel and ultimately got worse. Other than that and Affleck's rehab and personal problems, Wonder Woman was a smash hit where Jenkins has begun working on the sequel and James Wann's Aquaman had a smooth production. Shazam! is next to start filming after the Snyder-era so the train is rolling. We are just heading into the post Snyder/JL phase under a new DC Films banner they announced not too long ago. I'm still iffy on WB and I'm losing faith in them but that is counteracted by the loads of talent they represent with Jenkins, Wann and Reeves honing down some important DC films going forward.

He left on his own accord, and it sounds like he used his daughters death as an excuse.

Wow, you sure are living up to your name, RWFart. WB pushed Zack out, no question. Zack was on the hot-seat after BvS where the studio was close to firing him, but they followed through anyway. Even before BvS released, Zack always intended for JL to be lighter in tone and Chris Terrio confirmed such things when talking about how MoS-JL was one saga and how the middle film is always the darkest and how he wanted to redeem that notion by lightening up JL, so that was always the plan with Zack onboard. WB once again panicked and once tragedy struck, they used Zack's daughter as fodder to let him take a 2 week absence. WB basically Jeff Scott Soto'ed Snyder during this time, bringing in Whedon to humor the absolute fuck out of his cut and Marvel-ize the film to make it more audience friendly. Zack saw the writing on the wall and stepped down. His posts on Vero can connect the dots with what he was liking along with his son. Whedon reshot most of the film and added in mind-numbing and insulting dialogue that did nothing but hurt the films importance as one saga. When you try to Marvelize a Snyder film, the end result is embarassing and WB has egg on their face because of it.

Trying to blame Wheldon for this shitshow after the critical disasters to this point is like blaming your backup QB you brought in for the last 2 minutes of the game and not being able to overcome a 24 point deficit. But everyone needs a fall guy I guess.

Bahahaha! You're so out of tune with what really went on I almost want every DC Film to be divisive enough so you can come in here and make yourself look even more like a fool. The fall guy? WHEDON?! You're high. When Whedon was brought on, everybody had Whedon's nutsack in their mouth and went on about how he was the savior and how his vision was going to finally land with the critics. Even top bloggers and critics within' the industry predicted WAY beforehand that if JL were to fail, it would be pinned on Snyder's shoulders. If JL were to be a hit with the critics? Guess who would get the messiah credit? JOSS WHEDON. Zack Snyder has been the fall guy for awhile now regarding many things that took place during WB's band of misfits behind the scenes. Whedon was always going to be looked at as the saving grace. All he did was write some comical dialogue, reshoot unnecessary scenes proving his inferior nature as a director, took his ball and went home. He did some really good things but the majority of the stuff that stuck out like a sore thumb, things that people are complaining about, is 110% Joss Whedon.

Let's just move on and start talking about how awesome and epic Aquaman is going to be.

All of a sudden, you sure do have a lot to say. The cat got your tongue once Wonder Woman was slaying left and right when her film was in theaters. If WB gets out of Wann's way, I expect Aquaman to be one badass movie from top to bottom and give DC their identity by adjusting back to making craftable solo features. I also expect your post count to plummet givin' how if Aquaman does well, you'll be MIA from this thread, locking yourself in the closet on your Kindle Fire binge watching DC movies as yet another Marvel film escaped your mind from how forgettable they are givin' the tumbleweeds in that thread as we speak.

Because for the most part Marvel makes overrated, vanilla and forgettable comedies while WB is currently batting .200 in their band of behind the scenes retarded misfits.

Pretty quiet in the Marvel thread because there's not page after page of excuse making for shitty films.

Your comparison of Snyder and JSS would be accurate if JSS had issued a statement that he was leaving the band because of a family tragedy or had actually quit the band, which I don't think happened. One article I read stated that insiders said Snyder's version was "unwatchable". I would find it and post it, but you guys don't even believe the insider who stated the reason Snyder left that "v" posted.

I posted here that I liked the WW movie, I just don't feel the need to drone on and on about it. That also helps explain the inactivity in the Marvel thread. Fact is Marvel is getting ready to close the book on some great characters that people have know and loved for 10 years and put out what 20 successful movies? Then there's D.C.

Seven Wishes wrote:"Abysmal? He's the most proactive President since Clinton, and he's bringing much-needed change for the better to a nation that has been tyrannized by the worst President since Hoover."- 7 Wishes on Pres. Obama

S2M wrote:Bothered with it? I've read the entire series at least 20 times since 1977. The books were great. And honestly, isn't EVERY fantasy series a LOTR rip-off?

Meanwhile, Ray Feist can't find a home for his Rift War Saga, which puts not only Shannara to shame - but GoT as well.

I meant bothered with the series, not the books. Doesn't it begin with Elfstones, not Sword?

No, not every fantasy series apes LOTR. Maybe HIGH fantasy can't help it, because of all the quest business, but dark fantasy like Moorcock's Elric books and REH's Conan saga (not to mention Solomon Kane, Bran Mak Morn and Kull) are all unique. Then you have great science fantasy like Roger Zelazny's Chronicles of Amber. Same for Karl Edward Wagner's books of Kane, which begin as what seems like standard sword & sorcery but then progresses up to the present, and then the future.

And I'm still waiting for somebody to make a movie or miniseries (a la The Expanse) of Joe Haldeman's The Forever War. It gets optioned, but nothing happens.

Wendy & Richard Pini's Elfquest almost became a movie, but didn't get past preproduction.

S2M wrote:Bothered with it? I've read the entire series at least 20 times since 1977. The books were great. And honestly, isn't EVERY fantasy series a LOTR rip-off?

Meanwhile, Ray Feist can't find a home for his Rift War Saga, which puts not only Shannara to shame - but GoT as well.

I meant bothered with the series, not the books. Doesn't it begin with Elfstones, not Sword?

No, not every fantasy series apes LOTR. Maybe HIGH fantasy can't help it, because of all the quest business, but dark fantasy like Moorcock's Elric books and REH's Conan saga (not to mention Solomon Kane, Bran Mak Morn and Kull) are all unique. Then you have great science fantasy like Roger Zelazny's Chronicles of Amber. Same for Karl Edward Wagner's books of Kane, which begin as what seems like standard sword & sorcery but then progresses up to the present, and then the future.

And I'm still waiting for somebody to make a movie or miniseries (a la The Expanse) of Joe Haldeman's The Forever War. It gets optioned, but nothing happens.

Wendy & Richard Pini's Elfquest almost became a movie, but didn't get past preproduction.

It does start with Elfstones...and get this...the reason they started with Book 2 is they thought book one was too much like LOTR.

The series fails on some many levels. It's anachronistic within its own lore. The costumes are lame, the dialogue has been dumbed down with teen-speech. And they've added characters, love triangles, and LGBT shit.

It feels rushed, jv, and hackneyed. It's feels like the WB network on roids.

RedWingFan wrote:Pretty quiet in the Marvel thread because there's not page after page of excuse making for shitty films.

No. It's because there's nothing worth talking about. 95% of the MCU stuff are forgettable where nothing is there to debate about because it's vanilla. When you put out 20 successful films, 16 being safe setups to Avenger films that are basically the same thing, then it's a result of the fast food analogy. Satisfying going in, but a grab and go drive through window. The "inactivity" proves that.

I just don't feel the need to drone on and on about it.

Then don't. Nobody is forcing you to post in here.

Then there's D.C.

DC's not going anywhere, no matter the critical or BO disappointments in the CBM boom. They'll find their stride. The Snyder saga was a misfire, but they got the goods to capitalize on. They'll figure it out.

One article I read stated that insiders said Snyder's version was "unwatchable". I would find it and post it, but you guys don't even believe the insider who stated the reason Snyder left that "v" posted.

You mean the same execs who gave Batman v Superman a standing ovation and then chopped it up anyway? K.

Seven Wishes wrote:"Abysmal? He's the most proactive President since Clinton, and he's bringing much-needed change for the better to a nation that has been tyrannized by the worst President since Hoover."- 7 Wishes on Pres. Obama

Bro, this film didn't have a goddamn chance. This serves WB right and they have major egg on their face. They announced a new DC Films Banner IN THE MIDDLE OF JUSTICE LEAGUE'S NON-EXISTANT marketing. Ben Affleck and execs came out and publicy said that Wonder Woman's success takes pressure off of JL to perform. When you say that stuff outloud, they knew what was coming. Producers admitted to going home after filming on set and chugging alcohol. It was a shitshow and their PR suffered from it. As soon as Zack stepped down, WB halted marketing and barely pushed the thing because they basically re-shot the film with Joss's influence. In that article, this is what stuck out:

Through that prism, you can argue that WB and friends would have been better off just letting Zack Snyder make whatever movie he wanted to make. But, in hindsight, I would argue that the choice was either to delay Justice League and dump Zack Snyder right after Batman v Superman debuted to withering reviews and poor legs or just let Snyder make the movie he wanted to make with the full knowledge that this would be the end of the first arc of the DC Films story. But the error was in trying to have it both ways.

I've been saying this forever.

Well, that and the skewed notion of the DC Films brand being saved, not by Batman and Superman, but by Wonder Woman and Aquaman.

I said Superman and Batman will always survive whatver it is thrown at them. They've had their cinematic peaks in Hollywood spanning over multiple decades. It was going to be Wonder Woman that needed to hit the most. Aquaman has that same opportunity to hit. James Wan is the real deal, just like Jenkins. Wonder Woman and/or Aquaman's success simply helps Batman and Superman in this case. Fans always made fun of WB for being scared to rely on their other heros other than Superman and Batman. Well, now look. Wonder Woman is apart of that Trinity and is exactly what the franchise needed. Aquaman has a great chance if WB just allows Wan to do his thing.

One of my posts back in July of 2016. I guess some things never change, eh?

I agree to an extent of the outcome. There's no arguing the division, but what gets me heated is the studio's involvement to panic at the last second, playing it too safe to the point of spiking the chances of ruining Snyder's film, which was the last thing his career needed at this point. All we hear is how WB and the DCEU is a "Director/visual driven" studio but then you hear about BvS not meeting their "expectations" when it's the studio's fingerprints that are all over the finished product.

From what I read (I'm waiting for the physical copy of the UC) most of the UC really does quench MOST of the problems people (especially the critics) had with BvS from a technical film standpoint. The issues are still there overall, no movie is perfect, but the UC really does offer a movie that would have done 2X better than the theatrical release and that's what is frustrating. I said it before that I trust Snyder and his team around him. I just still have a lack of trust with WB to be a studio of their word and let the director release what he/she intends to release.

#Justice League third weekend: 59.7% drop. Not a bad hold, nearly identical to Fantastic Beasts' 3rd weekend drop(-59.8%). If it keeps following Fantastic Beasts' drops, it would end with $243M. Legs aren't too bad. But of course after the low opening it would have needed more than just "not too bad" legs to reach a respectable final total.