I only know what God says in the bible in terms of the invasion of
Israel in the last days by Gog/Magog...which definitely includes Iran
(Persia). And just look at what is going on. Iran is trying to get
a nuke to destroy Israel. It is so blatant. How can you miss that?

So Douggie, do you believe that God supports Israel even though it has killed thousands of innocent people?

I told you that I would keep asking you this until you answer, even if it means pursuing you on a different thread!

Sigh....

Back in the days of Pharoah, God backed Israel. The leader of Egypt, Pharoah, made a decision to go against God's will concerning Israel. And all of the first born of Egypt died as a result. How many of those thousands upon thousands were innocent children? Who's god was greater - the god of Pharoah or the Holy One of Israel?

It is your religion and the leadership of the muslim countries that has resulted in thousands upon thousands of innocent deaths on both sides... because Islam has gone against the will of God concerning Israel - just like Pharoah. History is repeating itself.

Even so, God judges individuals according to what they have done with Jesus. There are Christians living in Iran, Syria, and all the other muslim countries, who have eternal life the same as those living in the bible belt in the USA.

As Christians, our inheritance is Jesus, not a piece of land. The world and everything in it is going to be destroyed some day, but Jesus's words will last forever. Mohamed's words are going to last until Gog/Magog. If you read your bible without the blinders then you would see that. What we are seeing before our very eyes is shaping up to be God's judgment against Islam. It is not just the Palestinians against the Israeli's. It is Islam versus the Bible. Israel doesn't lose in Ezekiel 38/39. It is those attacking Muslim nations that do. That's what I am trying to get you to see.

Back in the days of Pharoah, God backed Israel. The
leader of Egypt, Pharoah, made a decision to go against God's will
concerning Israel. And all of the first born of Egypt died as a
result. How many of those thousands upon thousands were innocent
children? Who's god was greater - the god of Pharoah or the Holy One
of Israel?

It is your religion and the leadership of the
muslim countries that has resulted in thousands upon thousands of
innocent deaths on both sides... because Islam has gone against the will
of God concerning Israel - just like Pharoah. History is repeating
itself.

Even so, God judges individuals according to what they
have done with Jesus. There are Christians living in Iran, Syria, and
all the other muslim countries, who have eternal life the same as those
living in the bible belt in the USA.

As Christians, our
inheritance is Jesus, not a piece of land. The world and everything
in it is going to be destroyed some day, but Jesus's words will last
forever. Mohamed's words are going to last until Gog/Magog. If you
read your bible without the blinders then you would see that. What we
are seeing before our very eyes is shaping up to be God's judgment
against Islam. It is not just the Palestinians against the Israeli's.
It is Islam versus the Bible. Israel doesn't lose in Ezekiel 38/39.
It is those attacking Muslim nations that do. That's what I am trying
to get you to see.

I am still not getting an answer, just a lot of nonsense rambling and then a touch of tu quoque fallacies. You clearly do not want to answer the question because you know how it will make you look and how it will make your belief in God look. I gave you many chances, but you have not provided a clear answer. Thank you for showing your true nature to all who read your responses!

Say: "Truly, my prayer and my service of sacrifice, my life and my death, are (all) for Allah, the Cherisher of the Worlds. (Surat al-Anaam: 162)

Back in the days of Pharoah, God backed Israel. The
leader of Egypt, Pharoah, made a decision to go against God's will
concerning Israel. And all of the first born of Egypt died as a
result. How many of those thousands upon thousands were innocent
children? Who's god was greater - the god of Pharoah or the Holy One
of Israel?

It is your religion and the leadership of the
muslim countries that has resulted in thousands upon thousands of
innocent deaths on both sides... because Islam has gone against the will
of God concerning Israel - just like Pharoah. History is repeating
itself.

Even so, God judges individuals according to what they
have done with Jesus. There are Christians living in Iran, Syria, and
all the other muslim countries, who have eternal life the same as those
living in the bible belt in the USA.

As Christians, our
inheritance is Jesus, not a piece of land. The world and everything
in it is going to be destroyed some day, but Jesus's words will last
forever. Mohamed's words are going to last until Gog/Magog. If you
read your bible without the blinders then you would see that. What we
are seeing before our very eyes is shaping up to be God's judgment
against Islam. It is not just the Palestinians against the Israeli's.
It is Islam versus the Bible. Israel doesn't lose in Ezekiel 38/39.
It is those attacking Muslim nations that do. That's what I am trying
to get you to see.

I am still not getting an answer, just a lot of nonsense rambling and then a touch of tu quoque fallacies. You clearly do not want to answer the question because you know how it will make you look and how it will make your belief in God look. I gave you many chances, but you have not provided a clear answer. Thank you for showing your true nature to all who read your responses!

Say: "Truly, my prayer and my service of sacrifice, my life and my death, are (all) for Allah, the Cherisher of the Worlds. (Surat al-Anaam: 162)

Doug,I wanted to show you that "the day of the Lord" as portrayed in Zecharian 14, that will come with the rape of women is not how we percieve the day of the Lord in Islam.As far as "Salvation is of the Jews" as the Bible says remains a question. Let me ask you this: A Jew, who lives today or say yesterday and died with their current belief which is in denial of Jesus, tell me if you can, what chance of salvation he/she has?

Hi Hasan, , fair question. According to one gentleman I was listening to on internet radio, he said "a person is responsible for the truth which has been revealed to them." That gentleman was Tovia Singer, on radio Israel,a counter(Christian)missionary rabbi. Nonetheless, I agree with him in principle.

If a Jew, or anyone for that matter, has heard the gospel a sufficient number of times to grasp it, and yet harden their hearts not to receive it and die in that state... then they are eternally lost.

On the other hand, some one who has never heard the gospel a sufficent number of time to grasp it, or perhaps they have a mental impairment, or not of the accountable age, such as a baby or child or young person... then they are not eternally lost soley on that basis.

Regarding the able adults, in Christianity, there is a generally accepted line of thought that God will be able to read the intent of that person's heart - of what they would have done with the gospel had they had the opportunity. And God will treat them accordingly.

The children, young persons, mentally impaired, and the like are, in Christianity, generally thought to receive eternal life by what Jesus did for them - whether they grasp it or not.

By the way let me correct you, Muslims don't want to destroy Israel. They are only against injustice and occupation of their land by those who took it from them. If someone kick you out of your home what would you do to get it back, specially when the snatcher turns bad? I could write more to make you dizzy but that's not my way. The truth has to be said clearly, and that's it. Peace my friend, Hasan

Hasan, you are touching on a never ending argument of "who's justified"....

I only know what God says in the bible in terms of the invasion of Israel in the last days by Gog/Magog...which definitely includes Iran (Persia). And just look at what is going on. Iran is trying to get a nuke to destroy Israel. It is so blatant. How can you miss that?

I understand that not 100% of muslims want to destroy Israel - it is that other 99% (my percentages may be a little off) that I am talking about . I mean just look at Israel's neighbors. How can you say they don't want Israel destroyed? In 1948, Israel declared itself to be a nation again - the next day all of the neighboring Arab states in the region declared war on Israel.

Isn't there something in Islam, that if land is ever taken by Muslims, and if that land should afterwards fall out of Muslims hands, that Muslims cannot rest until that land returns to Muslim control? Isn't that one of the factors, we are talking about?

Doug L.

Hi Dough,its not about arguing, for me its about facts and truth and no compromise, zero tolerance. The Day of the Lord will not come " with the rape" of women as the Biblical quote suggests.I have read Gospel, and many of people I personally know and met who knew it as they were Christians before but now Muslims. I respected Gospel more before when I did not know it then now after knowing what it holds. I still respect it as its holy to many, but I have no doubt that in its present shape it is God's word revised and re-written by man. I still would like your direct answer to my previous question.As far as talking about, "who started first" there is no end in sight for us. What is clear, however is that we did not have problem Iran getting A tech in the time of Shah, now that a religious govt is in power we have a problem. Israel was created out of Palestine, its a fact. Jews had their most glorious and peaceful days under Muslim Spain that they don't have even now under Israel.Anyway, politics gets people in trouble, we should avoid it and it will not save us from the hell fire, but the truth will. I guess we agree on that? And by that I don't mean someone's catchy phrase, rather what we discover through our God given capabilities, logic and highest standards of judgment criteria in separating the truth from what is not.

Hasan

Edited by honeto - 26 April 2010 at 8:28pm

39:64 Proclaim: Is it some one other than God that you order me to worship, O you ignorant ones?"

To me the most important part where Muslims and Christians agree is that our universe and the life of every human being has a deeper purpose and meaning. Our universe is not blind, nor is it pitiless or indifferent. It is bursting with evolutionary possibilities because God made the universe in such a wonderful way which even allows men and women to understand it and uncover its secrets.

A religion that's intolerant of other religions can't be the world's best religion --Abdel Samad
Great minds discuss ideas. Average minds discuss events. Small minds discuss people--Eleanor Roosevelt

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