paizo.com Recent Posts in So, when are we going to see a fix to Combat Maneuvers?paizo.com Recent Posts in So, when are we going to see a fix to Combat Maneuvers?2012-11-05T10:01:49Z2012-11-05T10:01:49ZRe: Forums/Pathfinder RPG: General Discussion: So, when are we going to see a fix to Combat Maneuvers?Quandaryhttp://paizo.com/threads/rzs2p4dr&page=3?So-when-are-we-going-to-see-a-fix-to-Combat#1062012-11-06T00:24:27Z2012-11-06T00:24:27Z<div class="messageboard-quotee">Quote:</div><blockquote>She also is treated as one size larger than her actual size when determining whether she can grapple or be grappled by another creature.</blockquote><p>well, what size you are CAN determine whether or not a specific CMB check/CMD stat is effective at achieving/stopping a grapple, i.e. based on the Size Bonus to CMB/CMD, although I feel like they would have stated that directly if that was the intent.
<p>regardless of that aspect, the class ability is still useful for determining whether you can grapple or be grappled by another creature when GRAB is play, which almost always has Size limitations. in other words, it can make you flat out immune to being Grappled via Grab for many monsters, and if you yourself gain Grab somehow, you can use it for more enemies. </p>
<p>i'm not sure about the Size Bonus aspect, if that's intended the wording should really have just stated that more clearly (e.g. 'your Size category is treated as one size larger when Grappling, including CMB/CMD calculations as well as Grab limitations'). If applying to CMB/CMD is not intended, just mentioning the Grab size limitation directly would probably have been better understood.</p>Quote:She also is treated as one size larger than her actual size when determining whether she can grapple or be grappled by another creature.
well, what size you are CAN determine whether or not a specific CMB check/CMD stat is effective at achieving/stopping a grapple, i.e. based on the Size Bonus to CMB/CMD, although I feel like they would have stated that directly if that was the intent. regardless of that aspect, the class ability is still useful for determining whether you can grapple...Quandary2012-11-06T00:24:27ZRe: Forums/Pathfinder RPG: General Discussion: So, when are we going to see a fix to Combat Maneuvers?Serumhttp://paizo.com/threads/rzs2p4dr&page=3?So-when-are-we-going-to-see-a-fix-to-Combat#1052012-11-06T00:04:21Z2012-11-06T00:04:21Z<div class="messageboard-quotee">Bruno Breakbone wrote:</div><blockquote> <div class="messageboard-quotee">Serum wrote:</div><blockquote> Perhaps Bruno should look at the grapple combat maneuver in the CRB. </blockquote><p>Bruno only have access to D20PFSRD and Paizo SRD at work as even Bruno too weak to carry physical CRB.
<p>http://www.d20pfsrd.com/gamemastering/combat#TOC-Grapple</p>
<p>http://paizo.com/pathfinderRPG/prd/combat.html#grapple</p>
<p>No size limits on grapple. </blockquote><p>Interesting. Colour me confused on the archetype.Bruno Breakbone wrote:Serum wrote: Perhaps Bruno should look at the grapple combat maneuver in the CRB.
Bruno only have access to D20PFSRD and Paizo SRD at work as even Bruno too weak to carry physical CRB. http://www.d20pfsrd.com/gamemastering/combat#TOC-Grapple
http://paizo.com/pathfinderRPG/prd/combat.html#grapple
No size limits on grapple. Interesting. Colour me confused on the archetype.Serum2012-11-06T00:04:21ZRe: Forums/Pathfinder RPG: General Discussion: So, when are we going to see a fix to Combat Maneuvers?Serumhttp://paizo.com/threads/rzs2p4dr&page=3?So-when-are-we-going-to-see-a-fix-to-Combat#1042012-11-06T00:03:44Z2012-11-06T00:03:44Z<div class="messageboard-quotee">Bruno Breakbone wrote:</div><blockquote> <div class="messageboard-quotee">Serum wrote:</div><blockquote> Perhaps Bruno should look at the grapple combat maneuver in the CRB. </blockquote><p>Bruno only have access to D20PFSRD and Paizo SRD at work as even Bruno too weak to carry physical CRB.
<p>http://www.d20pfsrd.com/gamemastering/combat#TOC-Grapple</p>
<p>http://paizo.com/pathfinderRPG/prd/combat.html#grapple</p>
<p>No size limits on grapple. </blockquote><p>Colour me confused.Bruno Breakbone wrote:Serum wrote: Perhaps Bruno should look at the grapple combat maneuver in the CRB.
Bruno only have access to D20PFSRD and Paizo SRD at work as even Bruno too weak to carry physical CRB. http://www.d20pfsrd.com/gamemastering/combat#TOC-Grapple
http://paizo.com/pathfinderRPG/prd/combat.html#grapple
No size limits on grapple. Colour me confused.Serum2012-11-06T00:03:44ZRe: Forums/Pathfinder RPG: General Discussion: So, when are we going to see a fix to Combat Maneuvers?Bruno Breakbone (alias of Sammy T)http://paizo.com/threads/rzs2p4dr&page=3?So-when-are-we-going-to-see-a-fix-to-Combat#1032012-11-05T23:17:11Z2012-11-05T23:17:11Z<div class="messageboard-quotee">Serum wrote:</div><blockquote> Perhaps Bruno should look at the grapple combat maneuver in the CRB. </blockquote><p>Bruno only have access to D20PFSRD and Paizo SRD at work as even Bruno too weak to carry physical CRB.
<p>http://www.d20pfsrd.com/gamemastering/combat#TOC-Grapple</p>
<p>http://paizo.com/pathfinderRPG/prd/combat.html#grapple</p>
<p>No size limits on grapple.</p>Serum wrote:Perhaps Bruno should look at the grapple combat maneuver in the CRB.
Bruno only have access to D20PFSRD and Paizo SRD at work as even Bruno too weak to carry physical CRB. http://www.d20pfsrd.com/gamemastering/combat#TOC-Grapple
http://paizo.com/pathfinderRPG/prd/combat.html#grapple
No size limits on grapple.Bruno Breakbone (alias of Sammy T)2012-11-05T23:17:11ZRe: Forums/Pathfinder RPG: General Discussion: So, when are we going to see a fix to Combat Maneuvers?shallowsoulhttp://paizo.com/threads/rzs2p4dr&page=3?So-when-are-we-going-to-see-a-fix-to-Combat#1022012-11-05T22:58:26Z2012-11-05T22:58:26Z<div class="messageboard-quotee">voska66 wrote:</div><blockquote> <div class="messageboard-quotee">shallowsoul wrote:</div><blockquote> <div class="messageboard-quotee">Cold Napalm wrote:</div><blockquote> <div class="messageboard-quotee">JrK wrote:</div><blockquote> We're not going to see fixes because the devs aren't really interested in that as long as people keep buying their stuff. </blockquote><p>The devs aren't all that interested because it's not reallu an issue.
<p>10 ranks+5 stat+3 in class+6 skill focus+5 magic item = +29 acrobatics. And that is nowhere near what you raise the skill up to if you really wanted to...this is just one feat and one 2500 GP item and having a decent relivant stat. That can more then handily deal with a CR 10 critter that SS monk is having issues with.</p>
<p>The CMB/CMD disparity is actually a lot harder to deal with...but not as much as you would think if you make use of all the various bonuses available to you (UMD is your friend here).</p>
<p>The issue with lowering the CMD is that as it stands now, those who have even the basics of system mastery would utterly destroy those numbers with what is available now. As it stands now, you need just the basics for a skill or about mid levels for the CMB...but a system can't be balanced for somebody who has no idea what the hell they are doing (and it can't be balanced for people who have the system mastery of a god either). So honestly I think the CMB requires a bit more system mastery then I am happy with (but that should be adjusted by raising CMB...not lowering CMD) but for skills...yeah it's still a joke how easy it is to get skill values up there. </blockquote><p>Look at the investment you had to make to get that +29. We all know it's possible to do it but look at what you have to put into it for such a small return.
<p>I could see needing to do this with certain monsters because of what they are but a lot of monsters just have a high CMD almost for the hell of it. </blockquote>2500 GP and a feat doesn't seem like big investment to me. </blockquote><p>Depends on what class you are talking about. Anything outside of Monk and Fighter need all the feats they can get, and the same goes for 2500 gold.voska66 wrote:shallowsoul wrote: Cold Napalm wrote: JrK wrote: We're not going to see fixes because the devs aren't really interested in that as long as people keep buying their stuff.
The devs aren't all that interested because it's not reallu an issue. 10 ranks+5 stat+3 in class+6 skill focus+5 magic item = +29 acrobatics. And that is nowhere near what you raise the skill up to if you really wanted to...this is just one feat and one 2500 GP item and having a decent relivant stat. That can...shallowsoul2012-11-05T22:58:26ZRe: Forums/Pathfinder RPG: General Discussion: So, when are we going to see a fix to Combat Maneuvers?voska66http://paizo.com/threads/rzs2p4dr&page=3?So-when-are-we-going-to-see-a-fix-to-Combat#1012012-11-05T22:45:55Z2012-11-05T22:45:55Z<div class="messageboard-quotee">shallowsoul wrote:</div><blockquote> <div class="messageboard-quotee">Cold Napalm wrote:</div><blockquote> <div class="messageboard-quotee">JrK wrote:</div><blockquote> We're not going to see fixes because the devs aren't really interested in that as long as people keep buying their stuff. </blockquote><p>The devs aren't all that interested because it's not reallu an issue.
<p>10 ranks+5 stat+3 in class+6 skill focus+5 magic item = +29 acrobatics. And that is nowhere near what you raise the skill up to if you really wanted to...this is just one feat and one 2500 GP item and having a decent relivant stat. That can more then handily deal with a CR 10 critter that SS monk is having issues with.</p>
<p>The CMB/CMD disparity is actually a lot harder to deal with...but not as much as you would think if you make use of all the various bonuses available to you (UMD is your friend here).</p>
<p>The issue with lowering the CMD is that as it stands now, those who have even the basics of system mastery would utterly destroy those numbers with what is available now. As it stands now, you need just the basics for a skill or about mid levels for the CMB...but a system can't be balanced for somebody who has no idea what the hell they are doing (and it can't be balanced for people who have the system mastery of a god either). So honestly I think the CMB requires a bit more system mastery then I am happy with (but that should be adjusted by raising CMB...not lowering CMD) but for skills...yeah it's still a joke how easy it is to get skill values up there. </blockquote><p>Look at the investment you had to make to get that +29. We all know it's possible to do it but look at what you have to put into it for such a small return.
<p>I could see needing to do this with certain monsters because of what they are but a lot of monsters just have a high CMD almost for the hell of it. </blockquote><p>2500 GP and a feat doesn't seem like big investment to me.shallowsoul wrote:Cold Napalm wrote: JrK wrote: We're not going to see fixes because the devs aren't really interested in that as long as people keep buying their stuff.
The devs aren't all that interested because it's not reallu an issue. 10 ranks+5 stat+3 in class+6 skill focus+5 magic item = +29 acrobatics. And that is nowhere near what you raise the skill up to if you really wanted to...this is just one feat and one 2500 GP item and having a decent relivant stat. That can more then...voska662012-11-05T22:45:55Z