Jason Allen –Three different regimes have tried this former first-rounder at safety and all three concluded he wasn’t intelligent enough to appropriately diagnose plays at a high level. But considering the Trifecta primarily uses Allen as a backup nickel back and special teams contributor, what’s the harm in giving him one morechance at safety, the position he excelled at in his college career at Tennessee. It’s not like they are banking on Jason Allen being a regular contributor.

I voted no. I think JA has found a home as a nickel and dime CB, and we need him in that spot right now, as if Will Allen gets hurt, JA is our only viable replacement for that nickel slot.

Wed Mar 17, 2010 3:47 pm

Iceberg85

Phinfever All Pro

Joined: Tue Jan 12, 2010 3:15 pmPosts: 291Location: Shelbyville, IN

Re: Should Sparano move Jason Allen back to safety?

we should have dropped this first round contract that we are paying for a special teams player

_________________

Wed Mar 17, 2010 7:33 pm

NFLJunkie

Phinfever Blog Writer - Thursdays

Joined: Wed Jan 13, 2010 10:47 amPosts: 6254

Re: Should Sparano move Jason Allen back to safety?

Allen has shown nothing but promise when given the opportunity. The problem is he can't seem to find the field. Every coach he has had in the NFL expressed surprise at how well he plays when they've had to play him due to injury. Otherwise, he would've never sniffed the field. That's the big puzzle. He has size, speed and is a ball hawk. I think he would eventually thrive at FS.

Wed Mar 17, 2010 10:48 pm

Big Dave

Phinfever Owner/Admin

Joined: Tue Jan 12, 2010 9:41 amPosts: 10227Location: Raleigh, NC

Re: Should Sparano move Jason Allen back to safety?

Phins Rock wrote:

I voted no. I think JA has found a home as a nickel and dime CB

That's a good point, JP, but I went with a "yes" on this. I think too much of his play-making ability is left on the sideline. With Will Allen back, I think he will see a smaller role this year and see the field even less.

Well, he filled in for Vontae after he broke his wrist in the Steelers game and JA did a fine job.

This past yr, Allen has shown better ball skills than he has in the previous 3 seasons..combined.

So unless they just feel he needs to be in the mix at FS, leave him at Cb.

Thu Mar 18, 2010 7:45 am

Finhead

Phinfever Legend

Joined: Sun Feb 07, 2010 9:39 amPosts: 2061Location: Houston, Texas

Re: Should Sparano move Jason Allen back to safety?

I agree that Miami should give him a shot at safety while he is still on our roster as it certainly wont hurt.

On the other hand, he has had PLENTY of opportunities to see the field and people seem to be so high up on him, yet every regime seems to say the same thing and that is the comments about him not playing so smart.

Give him another chance, so we can either be pleasantly surprised that over three years later our former number one draft pick actually lived up to those lofty expectations.

He either has the ability or he doesnt. If he doesnt see the field this year, perhaps people will stop bringing his name up.

I think JUNKIE named one of his kids after Jason Allen!!!

Thu Mar 18, 2010 4:04 pm

Iowafin

Phinfever Legend

Joined: Thu Jan 14, 2010 2:55 pmPosts: 5439

Re: Should Sparano move Jason Allen back to safety?

NFLJunkie wrote:

Allen has shown nothing but promise when given the opportunity. The problem is he can't seem to find the field. Every coach he has had in the NFL expressed surprise at how well he plays when they've had to play him due to injury. Otherwise, he would've never sniffed the field. That's the big puzzle. He has size, speed and is a ball hawk. I think he would eventually thrive at FS.

Poor practice player?

_________________

Thu Mar 18, 2010 4:21 pm

NFLJunkie

Phinfever Blog Writer - Thursdays

Joined: Wed Jan 13, 2010 10:47 amPosts: 6254

Re: Should Sparano move Jason Allen back to safety?

Finhead wrote:

I agree that Miami should give him a shot at safety while he is still on our roster as it certainly wont hurt.

On the other hand, he has had PLENTY of opportunities to see the field and people seem to be so high up on him, yet every regime seems to say the same thing and that is the comments about him not playing so smart.

Give him another chance, so we can either be pleasantly surprised that over three years later our former number one draft pick actually lived up to those lofty expectations.

He either has the ability or he doesnt. If he doesnt see the field this year, perhaps people will stop bringing his name up.

I think JUNKIE named one of his kids after Jason Allen!!!

Jason Allen Ramey...hmmmm

Thu Mar 18, 2010 8:40 pm

NFLJunkie

Phinfever Blog Writer - Thursdays

Joined: Wed Jan 13, 2010 10:47 amPosts: 6254

Re: Should Sparano move Jason Allen back to safety?

Iowafin wrote:

NFLJunkie wrote:

Allen has shown nothing but promise when given the opportunity. The problem is he can't seem to find the field. Every coach he has had in the NFL expressed surprise at how well he plays when they've had to play him due to injury. Otherwise, he would've never sniffed the field. That's the big puzzle. He has size, speed and is a ball hawk. I think he would eventually thrive at FS.

Poor practice player?

I'm going to say slow upstairs. His ability takes over on the field when he doesn't have to think about what he's doing. Playing nickle, or corner, keeps it simple for him. Safety has quite a few different roles depending upon the defense. At CB its either man or zone.

Thu Mar 18, 2010 8:42 pm

Lokki

Phinfever Starter

Joined: Tue Jan 12, 2010 11:46 amPosts: 192Location: Biloxi, MS

Re: Should Sparano move Jason Allen back to safety?

Nah, leave Jason where he is. Just get Eric Berry.

_________________

Two-thirds of the earth is covered by water. The rest is covered by Vontae Davis.

Fri Mar 19, 2010 6:11 pm

JerryD

Phinfever Rookie

Joined: Sun Jan 17, 2010 12:34 amPosts: 32

Re: Should Sparano move Jason Allen back to safety?

Wow, if y'all are going to start Jason Allen, its going to be another looong year & a high draft pick next year. Jason couldn't beat out Gibril Wilson & other weak contenders. (BTW, I think Jason was the only Gibril fan last year ... he loved that diluted safety gene pool.)

Jason's got some value, picked up a few Nickels, played some decent Special Teams, & is a replacement in a pinch.

I think a better poll would be how many years will Jason Allen be able to hold a roster spot!!

There's quite a few guys that are holding roster spots due to thin roster talent. As our team improves, I figure we'll lose about half of our present roster by the time we get good. Teddy, Channing, Vernon, & co. ... we loved ya man!! tick tick tick

Sat Mar 20, 2010 10:38 pm

Dphins4me

2014 Survival Champ

Joined: Tue Jan 12, 2010 3:23 pmPosts: 5652

Re: Should Sparano move Jason Allen back to safety?

JerryD wrote:

Wow, if y'all are going to start Jason Allen, its going to be another looong year & a high draft pick next year. Jason couldn't beat out Gibril Wilson & other weak contenders.

Please explain when Jason went up against Gibril last year? Allen played CB last year. Gibril was a safety. Two different positions.

Sat Mar 20, 2010 10:48 pm

padre31

Phinfever Starter

Joined: Tue Jan 12, 2010 6:05 pmPosts: 188

Re: Should Sparano move Jason Allen back to safety?

Jason Allen was Ted Ginn before there was Ted Ginn.

Leave him at Cb with Nate Jones gone he will play more as a nickel with maybe Will Allen moving to Free safety.

Sat Mar 20, 2010 11:24 pm

Big Dave

Phinfever Owner/Admin

Joined: Tue Jan 12, 2010 9:41 amPosts: 10227Location: Raleigh, NC

Re: Should Sparano move Jason Allen back to safety?

padre31 wrote:

maybe Will Allen moving to Free safety.

I would be surprised if he is asked to move to safety, and he probably would fight the move. He's still a very good cornerback. I guess it depends on how he comes back from his injury.

Why is it that so many people think that we can just "move" a guy from CB to FS? I see this suggestion at least 3 times a week.

"Let's move Sean Smith to FS (even though he showed amply last season that he can't tackle worth a darn)."

"Let's move Vontae Davis to FS (even though he has never been anything other than a CB)"

"Let's move Will Allen to FS (even though he is WAY too small and doesn't tackle well enough to be the last guy)."

"Let's move Jason Allen to FS (even though he hasn't been able to see the field much under 3 separate regimes, including the one that drafted him in the 1st round specifically to play FS)."

It doesn't work that way in the non-madden world guys.

_________________A good RB is nice, a good QB even better, but it's best to be able to stop someone first.

Sun Mar 21, 2010 3:55 pm

NFLJunkie

Phinfever Blog Writer - Thursdays

Joined: Wed Jan 13, 2010 10:47 amPosts: 6254

Re: Should Sparano move Jason Allen back to safety?

Okay kind of a random thought be has anyone thought that Sean Smith would make an excellent FS. The guy is tall, plays the ball well, has great hands and decent coverage skills. My head tells me move him to FS, move Will Allen back to CB and leave JA as the nickle.

Last edited by NFLJunkie on Sun Mar 21, 2010 5:11 pm, edited 2 times in total.

Sun Mar 21, 2010 5:07 pm

NFLJunkie

Phinfever Blog Writer - Thursdays

Joined: Wed Jan 13, 2010 10:47 amPosts: 6254

Re: Should Sparano move Jason Allen back to safety?

Quote:

eleaf wrote:

Why is it that so many people think that we can just "move" a guy from CB to FS? I see this suggestion at least 3 times a week.

"Let's move Sean Smith to FS (even though he showed amply last season that he can't tackle worth a darn)."

"Let's move Vontae Davis to FS (even though he has never been anything other than a CB)"

"Let's move Will Allen to FS (even though he is WAY too small and doesn't tackle well enough to be the last guy)."

"Let's move Jason Allen to FS (even though he hasn't been able to see the field much under 3 separate regimes, including the one that drafted him in the 1st round specifically to play FS)."

It doesn't work that way in the non-madden world guys.

I guess if Bill Belichick thought the way you do Troy Brown would've never seen the field as a FS and NE wouldn't have won a superbowl that season. Not that all experiments work but successful coaches are good at finding what positions best fit a players strengths despite what position they've played most of their career.

Sun Mar 21, 2010 5:09 pm

Iowafin

Phinfever Legend

Joined: Thu Jan 14, 2010 2:55 pmPosts: 5439

Re: Should Sparano move Jason Allen back to safety?

NFLJunkie wrote:

Quote:

eleaf wrote:

Why is it that so many people think that we can just "move" a guy from CB to FS? I see this suggestion at least 3 times a week.

"Let's move Sean Smith to FS (even though he showed amply last season that he can't tackle worth a darn)."

"Let's move Vontae Davis to FS (even though he has never been anything other than a CB)"

"Let's move Will Allen to FS (even though he is WAY too small and doesn't tackle well enough to be the last guy)."

"Let's move Jason Allen to FS (even though he hasn't been able to see the field much under 3 separate regimes, including the one that drafted him in the 1st round specifically to play FS)."

It doesn't work that way in the non-madden world guys.

I guess if Bill Belichick thought the way you do Troy Brown would've never seen the field as a FS and NE wouldn't have won a superbowl that season. Not that all experiments work but successful coaches are good at finding what positions best fit a players strengths despite what position they've played most of their career.

Troy Brown never played FS, he was a nickelback and was put there out of necessity in the middle of the season with injuries....not taught how to do it at the beginning of the offseason so that the team could ignore the position and go elsewhere with free agency and draft picks.

Get your facts straight, then create an argument that is actually relevant.

_________________

Sun Mar 21, 2010 6:49 pm

JerryD

Phinfever Rookie

Joined: Sun Jan 17, 2010 12:34 amPosts: 32

Re: Should Sparano move Jason Allen back to safety?

Dphins4me wrote:

JerryD wrote:

Wow, if y'all are going to start Jason Allen, its going to be another looong year & a high draft pick next year. Jason couldn't beat out Gibril Wilson & other weak contenders.

Please explain when Jason went up against Gibril last year? Allen played CB last year. Gibril was a safety. Two different positions.

Yowser, but that's what the thread is about ... moving Jason to Safety yet another time. The coaches thought bringing in Gibril (cut by everyone) was a better gambit than moving Jason back to Safety.

Jason was drafted as a Safety. ATTEMPTED to play plenty of Safety. Moved to CB. Moved back to Safety. Moved back to CB. Jason played Nickel last year & filled in at CB.

What is Jason a CB or Safety? Seems to be a hermaphroDB, with a bulls-eye on his forehead ... all the QBs target him. Thus my comment, his Roster Spot is not long for our Phins. tick tick tick.

Sun Mar 21, 2010 10:19 pm

Dphins4me

2014 Survival Champ

Joined: Tue Jan 12, 2010 3:23 pmPosts: 5652

Re: Should Sparano move Jason Allen back to safety?

eleaf wrote:

"Let's move Jason Allen to FS (even though he hasn't been able to see the field much under 3 separate regimes, including the one that drafted him in the 1st round specifically to play FS).".

If Allen was drafted to specifically play FS, then why did he start his rookie campaign being moved from CB to S then back to CB?

Mon Mar 22, 2010 5:46 am

Dphins4me

2014 Survival Champ

Joined: Tue Jan 12, 2010 3:23 pmPosts: 5652

Re: Should Sparano move Jason Allen back to safety?

JerryD wrote:

Yowser, but that's what the thread is about ... moving Jason to Safety yet another time. The coaches thought bringing in Gibril (cut by everyone) was a better gambit than moving Jason back to Safety.

Gibril had been cut by the Raiders. Not everyone. Wilson came to Miami as a fine S. He probably still is when he is playing at SS. Not FS.

JerryD wrote:

Jason was drafted as a Safety. ATTEMPTED to play plenty of Safety. Moved to CB. Moved back to Safety. Moved back to CB. Jason played Nickel last year & filled in at CB.

He was drafted as a CB. Saban moved him to S for a little over a week after injuries hit Miami's S.

Mon Mar 22, 2010 5:52 am

NFLJunkie

Phinfever Blog Writer - Thursdays

Joined: Wed Jan 13, 2010 10:47 amPosts: 6254

Re: Should Sparano move Jason Allen back to safety?

Quote:

Get your facts straight, then create an argument that is actually relevant.

Don't be dense. Does it matter whether Troy Brown a WR played safety or CB as it pertains to the argument?

Mon Mar 22, 2010 9:10 am

eleaf

Phinfever Legend

Joined: Wed Jan 13, 2010 1:49 amPosts: 4147Location: The Bluegrass

Re: Should Sparano move Jason Allen back to safety?

Dphins4me wrote:

JerryD wrote:

Yowser, but that's what the thread is about ... moving Jason to Safety yet another time. The coaches thought bringing in Gibril (cut by everyone) was a better gambit than moving Jason back to Safety.

Gibril had been cut by the Raiders. Not everyone. Wilson came to Miami as a fine S. He probably still is when he is playing at SS. Not FS.

JerryD wrote:

Jason was drafted as a Safety. ATTEMPTED to play plenty of Safety. Moved to CB. Moved back to Safety. Moved back to CB. Jason played Nickel last year & filled in at CB.

He was drafted as a CB. Saban moved him to S for a little over a week after injuries hit Miami's S.

The other way around.

He was moved to CB because of injuries by Saban.

Then back to FS by Cameron because of injuries in 2007.

Then back to CB by the Trifecta because apparently he doesn't have it upstairs to play FS in this league.

All that said, he was drafted to play FS.

_________________A good RB is nice, a good QB even better, but it's best to be able to stop someone first.

Mon Mar 22, 2010 1:43 pm

Iowafin

Phinfever Legend

Joined: Thu Jan 14, 2010 2:55 pmPosts: 5439

Re: Should Sparano move Jason Allen back to safety?

NFLJunkie wrote:

Quote:

Get your facts straight, then create an argument that is actually relevant.

Don't be dense. Does it matter whether Troy Brown a WR played safety or CB as it pertains to the argument?

Your argument doesn't fit because you failed to realize that Brown was put there due to injuries in the middle of the season. This thread is suggesting moving Allen to safety before the season starts for reasons that stem from being able to draft another cornerback, fill a need at safety, or just so he can get more playing time. Neither of which have anything to do with the situation with Brown in New England. So yes, getting your facts straight is not a "dense" thing to ask you to do.

_________________

Mon Mar 22, 2010 3:16 pm

padre31

Phinfever Starter

Joined: Tue Jan 12, 2010 6:05 pmPosts: 188

Re: Should Sparano move Jason Allen back to safety?

Big Dave wrote:

padre31 wrote:

maybe Will Allen moving to Free safety.

I would be surprised if he is asked to move to safety, and he probably would fight the move. He's still a very good cornerback. I guess it depends on how he comes back from his injury.

Well, I suspect Will Allen will be the nickel at least, if he wants to start again FS may be his best bet.