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PROFESSOR: Before we move on
to the rest of the topics,
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00:00:24,010 --> 00:00:26,740
maybe just some administrative
stuff about the next
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assignment.
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00:00:28,470 --> 00:00:31,940
So the idea is to model
a system, right?
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So the idea is to pick some
sort of dual system.
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00:00:34,600 --> 00:00:37,690
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In the past people have picked
stuff like applying for
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college because they knew
all about that.
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People have talked about any
type of idea, you know,
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00:00:50,400 --> 00:00:52,050
running a nuclear reactor
or something.
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Specifically there's a--
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00:00:54,655 --> 00:00:59,438
but hey, any of you nuclear
science majors?--
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oh, perfect.
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00:01:02,070 --> 00:01:05,674
One of my favorite Apple II
games was actually nuclear
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00:01:05,674 --> 00:01:09,119
reactor simulation, and
it always melted down.
24
00:01:09,119 --> 00:01:12,430
That's why it was fun.
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00:01:12,430 --> 00:01:18,930
But pick a real world system
to start modeling.
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00:01:18,930 --> 00:01:20,240
Obviously, you're trying
to find the fun.
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00:01:20,240 --> 00:01:22,100
Obviously, you're trying to make
something that people are
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00:01:22,100 --> 00:01:24,450
going to enjoy playing.
29
00:01:24,450 --> 00:01:27,510
But the idea is to start from
a slightly different place
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00:01:27,510 --> 00:01:31,590
from where we had in the
first assignment.
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00:01:31,590 --> 00:01:34,080
Now a couple of you guys already
did that for the first
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00:01:34,080 --> 00:01:34,600
assignment, though.
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00:01:34,600 --> 00:01:37,490
I mean things like picking
up girls at a party.
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00:01:37,490 --> 00:01:40,620
You know, modeling real
systems and things.
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00:01:40,620 --> 00:01:43,958
Still haven't played yet,
a genealogy game yet.
36
00:01:43,958 --> 00:01:46,303
So, we're going to
play next March.
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00:01:46,303 --> 00:01:47,553
So [UNINTELLIGIBLE].
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00:01:47,553 --> 00:01:50,530
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00:01:50,530 --> 00:01:53,530
The survival horror game, I
would say it's not a real
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00:01:53,530 --> 00:01:56,565
world system.
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00:01:56,565 --> 00:01:59,466
It was a system.
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00:01:59,466 --> 00:02:02,410
Horror, wizards, trolls.
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00:02:02,410 --> 00:02:06,470
So, yeah, pick something within
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00:02:06,470 --> 00:02:11,620
games negotiating around--
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00:02:11,620 --> 00:02:16,220
like negotiating greenhouse gas
emissions, that was one
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00:02:16,220 --> 00:02:18,160
which was really, really
cutthroat.
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That's what probably
you imagine.
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00:02:21,350 --> 00:02:23,282
Actually I'll try to get
that team to come in
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00:02:23,282 --> 00:02:23,350
later in the semester.
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00:02:23,350 --> 00:02:25,670
They did this and like talk
about their card game.
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It was a freshman team
on Terrascope.
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00:02:29,490 --> 00:02:33,320
Let's see, On Wednesday, we're
going to do the usual
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00:02:33,320 --> 00:02:35,780
brainstorming inside of
the second half of the
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upper-class.
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You know, everybody throw
out your ideas.
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Come in with a bunch of ideas,
we'll try to build on that.
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But this time around you're
allowed to actually
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pre-build your team.
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You're allowed to ask people,
hey, you guys
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want to work together?
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You don't actually have to
figure it out on the spot if
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you don't want to.
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I don't really care how you do
it, as long as by Friday you
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know who your team is.
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And who's on your team.
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Team sizes are the same.
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So, any questions?
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AUDIENCE: Are we allowed to
simulate things that aren't
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from this era?
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PROFESSOR: Yeah, like
normal history?
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AUDIENCE: Yeah.
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PROFESSOR: OK, not from
like the future.
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[INTERPOSING VOICES]
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PROFESSOR: Yeah, I'm serious.
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This is how I think
[INAUDIBLE].
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OK, yes, absolutely there are
no historical stuff--
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but you do have some
liberties.
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I'm not saying that your game
has to be a faithful
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simulation.
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You can even build your model
simulation [INAUDIBLE].
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But it doesn't have to be a
faithful simulation, that's
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certainly a poor design.
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But, you know, in a sense you're
trying to capture the
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spirit of it.
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If the point is, I'm running
a nuclear reactor.
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And you can sort of capture
the, oh my God, it's so
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00:03:52,123 --> 00:03:55,954
dangerous , or the, oh my God,
it's so boring aspect of it.
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Have you actually put the
nuclear reactor--
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AUDIENCE:: Well, like,
what's there.
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00:04:00,000 --> 00:04:03,230
And I know the mechanics of
it, I think, were there.
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PROFESSOR: I have been told it's
not necessarily the most
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00:04:05,620 --> 00:04:06,350
exciting job in the world.
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00:04:06,350 --> 00:04:08,750
AUDIENCE: No, you just sit there
and do your homework.
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00:04:08,750 --> 00:04:11,835
And every once in a
while you look up.
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00:04:11,835 --> 00:04:14,510
Very reasonable.
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00:04:14,510 --> 00:04:16,010
And you get paid for it.
99
00:04:16,010 --> 00:04:17,985
Like $12 or $13 an hour.
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00:04:17,985 --> 00:04:21,364
PROFESSOR: So if your whole idea
of the game is let's try
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00:04:21,364 --> 00:04:24,940
to get as much homework done
without letting [INAUDIBLE].
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00:04:24,940 --> 00:04:27,700
That might be more entertaining
than just looking
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00:04:27,700 --> 00:04:28,950
[INAUDIBLE].
104
00:04:28,950 --> 00:04:32,820
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00:04:32,820 --> 00:04:35,725
But I got my problems in then.
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00:04:35,725 --> 00:04:37,630
AUDIENCE: [UNINTELLIGIBLE].
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00:04:37,630 --> 00:04:38,880
You have to do [UNINTELLIGIBLE].
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00:04:38,880 --> 00:04:42,220
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[INTERPOSING VOICES]
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00:04:43,470 --> 00:04:52,542
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00:04:52,542 --> 00:04:54,880
PROFESSOR: And besides, I think
we still have a time
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00:04:54,880 --> 00:04:56,950
limit, like half an hour.
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00:04:56,950 --> 00:04:58,390
It's not [INAUDIBLE]
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00:04:58,390 --> 00:05:01,550
homework, it's really
easy homework.
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00:05:01,550 --> 00:05:04,050
Really not homework.
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00:05:04,050 --> 00:05:08,300
Let's see, just a reminder for
everyone who has been falling
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00:05:08,300 --> 00:05:10,270
off on the foreign posts, please
make sure that you keep
118
00:05:10,270 --> 00:05:10,980
up on your foreign posts.
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00:05:10,980 --> 00:05:15,030
Those things actually do
affect your grade.
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00:05:15,030 --> 00:05:15,570
[UNINTELLIGIBLE]
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00:05:15,570 --> 00:05:18,760
one person, not one team.
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00:05:18,760 --> 00:05:21,610
If you have any--
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00:05:21,610 --> 00:05:24,910
since we're in between reading
assignments right now, you can
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00:05:24,910 --> 00:05:25,770
write about the assignment.
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00:05:25,770 --> 00:05:28,900
But if you wrote up something,
let's say a reflection on how
126
00:05:28,900 --> 00:05:31,680
the class assignment
went, that's fine.
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00:05:31,680 --> 00:05:34,052
We're not expecting more than
one foreign post a week.
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00:05:34,052 --> 00:05:36,010
Of course, feel free to comment
on other people's
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00:05:36,010 --> 00:05:38,520
foreign posts as well.
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00:05:38,520 --> 00:05:40,890
If a discussion or a point has
been raised that's kind of
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00:05:40,890 --> 00:05:43,420
interesting, you want to kind
of develop on that.
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00:05:43,420 --> 00:05:44,870
Put some thought into it.
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00:05:44,870 --> 00:05:46,715
Write something interesting
you're going to keep on the
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00:05:46,715 --> 00:05:49,720
compilation, that counts too.
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00:05:49,720 --> 00:05:50,985
And that's fine.
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00:05:50,985 --> 00:05:54,130
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00:05:54,130 --> 00:05:55,490
OK, so puzzles.
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00:05:55,490 --> 00:05:59,090
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00:05:59,090 --> 00:06:03,600
So Brenda's, before we start
with Brenda's, let's start
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00:06:03,600 --> 00:06:04,990
with Scott's.
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00:06:04,990 --> 00:06:08,520
What were some of the
definitions, or some of the
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00:06:08,520 --> 00:06:12,310
things that Scott's game was
mentioning, that were good for
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00:06:12,310 --> 00:06:16,810
puzzle design
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00:06:16,810 --> 00:06:19,810
AUDIENCE: The book or
not in the book?
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00:06:19,810 --> 00:06:24,310
PROFESSOR: This was
on the web page.
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00:06:24,310 --> 00:06:24,805
[INTERPOSING VOICES]
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00:06:24,805 --> 00:06:29,130
AUDIENCE: --and had
the right answer.
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00:06:29,130 --> 00:06:30,380
[UNINTELLIGIBLE].
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00:06:30,380 --> 00:06:32,292
150
00:06:32,292 --> 00:06:37,550
PROFESSOR: He didn't really
differentiate between puzzles
151
00:06:37,550 --> 00:06:42,226
that could be generated like a
pseudo-GUI or something, where
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00:06:42,226 --> 00:06:44,760
you kind of have an algorithm
that lets you
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00:06:44,760 --> 00:06:46,970
create multiple puzzles.
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00:06:46,970 --> 00:06:51,180
But as long as that particular
iteration had one answer.
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00:06:51,180 --> 00:06:53,530
So that was really there.
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00:06:53,530 --> 00:06:55,250
Anything else you remember?
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00:06:55,250 --> 00:06:56,792
AUDIENCE: Tactical difficulty.
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00:06:56,792 --> 00:07:01,555
Make it accessible but
not super easy.
159
00:07:01,555 --> 00:07:03,835
I think targeting a
specific audience.
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00:07:03,835 --> 00:07:08,180
It was also the ability to
change difficulty, it was
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00:07:08,180 --> 00:07:11,050
dynamic difficulty.
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00:07:11,050 --> 00:07:16,650
So some areas may actually be
easier settings, and then
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00:07:16,650 --> 00:07:18,850
actually what they want to
be is harder settings.
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00:07:18,850 --> 00:07:20,240
PROFESSOR: I think that
was Brenda's.
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00:07:20,240 --> 00:07:22,420
But, yeah, am I wrong?
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00:07:22,420 --> 00:07:25,898
AUDIENCE: There's also the
distinction between types of
167
00:07:25,898 --> 00:07:26,370
difficulty.
168
00:07:26,370 --> 00:07:29,400
Things where, you know, the
letter puzzle you had at the
169
00:07:29,400 --> 00:07:32,765
beginning where it requires
thinking about
170
00:07:32,765 --> 00:07:35,960
it, figuring it out.
171
00:07:35,960 --> 00:07:37,600
It was patients versus
something else.
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00:07:37,600 --> 00:07:39,365
I can't remember what
the editor used.
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00:07:39,365 --> 00:07:41,610
But then you have things like
mazes and locations where you
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00:07:41,610 --> 00:07:45,610
have to be very careful, and
separate your way through.
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00:07:45,610 --> 00:07:49,500
PROFESSOR: And sometimes they
bring in information from
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00:07:49,500 --> 00:07:49,990
other domains.
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00:07:49,990 --> 00:07:52,770
From outside the puzzle, it's
not just like all the
178
00:07:52,770 --> 00:07:57,320
information that you currently
need in the puzzle.
179
00:07:57,320 --> 00:07:59,340
But the interesting thing
about the puzzle that he
180
00:07:59,340 --> 00:08:03,050
particularly shows, is that he
shows a range of different
181
00:08:03,050 --> 00:08:04,530
ways to actually solve it.
182
00:08:04,530 --> 00:08:06,720
None of which are actually
satisfying except for the
183
00:08:06,720 --> 00:08:07,680
final answer.
184
00:08:07,680 --> 00:08:10,515
Which irritated me,
I'm telling you.
185
00:08:10,515 --> 00:08:13,100
I'm not giving you
another puzzle.
186
00:08:13,100 --> 00:08:15,440
[UNINTELLIGIBLE]
187
00:08:15,440 --> 00:08:19,060
But it's kind of interesting to
think about, actually, what
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00:08:19,060 --> 00:08:21,420
audience it's for those kinds
of specific puzzles.
189
00:08:21,420 --> 00:08:23,500
I mean, there are magazines
out of there like Games
190
00:08:23,500 --> 00:08:27,670
magazine in particular, but
sometimes you see stuff
191
00:08:27,670 --> 00:08:31,150
nestled into magazines that
are not just about games.
192
00:08:31,150 --> 00:08:34,177
You see stuff like crossword
puzzles in newspapers and
193
00:08:34,177 --> 00:08:34,880
things like that.
194
00:08:34,880 --> 00:08:41,260
And now things like Sudoku and
all that are way more popular
195
00:08:41,260 --> 00:08:43,510
that are meant to be really
in mass audience.
196
00:08:43,510 --> 00:08:46,230
Whereas a magazine that is
specifically targeted at
197
00:08:46,230 --> 00:08:48,380
puzzle enthusiasts can
be super hardcore.
198
00:08:48,380 --> 00:08:51,270
With puzzles through the whole
magazine then you can have a
199
00:08:51,270 --> 00:08:54,480
whole range of different
difficulties in there.
200
00:08:54,480 --> 00:08:56,744
The assumption that you can
solve something not so hard.
201
00:08:56,744 --> 00:09:02,050
AUDIENCE: I'm kind of
interested, does anybody know
202
00:09:02,050 --> 00:09:06,000
how people in newspapers
generate crossword puzzles and
203
00:09:06,000 --> 00:09:06,940
Sudoku puzzles?
204
00:09:06,940 --> 00:09:11,110
Does anybody know what the
actual process behind that is?
205
00:09:11,110 --> 00:09:13,530
I mean, I can imagine
how you might do it.
206
00:09:13,530 --> 00:09:15,730
You might start with the filled
out thing and then
207
00:09:15,730 --> 00:09:17,815
remove bits to get
your Sudoku.
208
00:09:17,815 --> 00:09:21,990
Or you might brute force,
dictionary search to come up
209
00:09:21,990 --> 00:09:23,950
with words which fit together in
order to form a crossword.
210
00:09:23,950 --> 00:09:26,820
AUDIENCE: What they do with
Sudoku now is, they have some
211
00:09:26,820 --> 00:09:27,830
computer algorithm--
212
00:09:27,830 --> 00:09:29,940
and it has scales
of difficulty--
213
00:09:29,940 --> 00:09:37,775
and it generates a random Sudoku
puzzle from your input.
214
00:09:37,775 --> 00:09:39,790
AUDIENCE: Sudoku is solved
enough that you can actually
215
00:09:39,790 --> 00:09:42,660
just algorithmically generate
[INAUDIBLE].
216
00:09:42,660 --> 00:09:46,360
An actual numerical
difficulty.
217
00:09:46,360 --> 00:09:51,990
You scale it from 1 to 10, 10
being where where there's like
218
00:09:51,990 --> 00:09:53,650
literally only one step
to take in each point.
219
00:09:53,650 --> 00:09:58,720
AUDIENCE: The one that took them
three months to solve.
220
00:09:58,720 --> 00:10:02,190
AUDIENCE: But like crosswords,
there's people who actually
221
00:10:02,190 --> 00:10:04,242
just get paid to sit down
and generate those.
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00:10:04,242 --> 00:10:07,190
223
00:10:07,190 --> 00:10:10,360
AUDIENCE: I know that Premiere
takes submissions from other
224
00:10:10,360 --> 00:10:13,580
people and they're edited
by [INAUDIBLE].
225
00:10:13,580 --> 00:10:15,484
And then people submit
that and he kind of
226
00:10:15,484 --> 00:10:18,010
like steps it up.
227
00:10:18,010 --> 00:10:19,660
AUDIENCE: So he kind of
228
00:10:19,660 --> 00:10:22,710
crowdsources crossword puzzles.
229
00:10:22,710 --> 00:10:25,070
[INTERPOSING VOICES]
230
00:10:25,070 --> 00:10:29,890
PROFESSOR: But the difficulty
in a crossword puzzles isn't
231
00:10:29,890 --> 00:10:34,170
just in the geometrically
how the words go.
232
00:10:34,170 --> 00:10:37,200
The specific clues that they
give you can be more or less
233
00:10:37,200 --> 00:10:38,440
obfuscated in some ways.
234
00:10:38,440 --> 00:10:40,280
And New York Times, in
particular, is super
235
00:10:40,280 --> 00:10:41,670
irritating with this.
236
00:10:41,670 --> 00:10:45,760
They'll give you two words with
no grammatical context
237
00:10:45,760 --> 00:10:47,588
about how they're supposed
to fit in.
238
00:10:47,588 --> 00:10:50,330
239
00:10:50,330 --> 00:10:55,640
So you can actually compare it
to see how they're difficulty
240
00:10:55,640 --> 00:10:57,230
scaling just by looking
at the clues.
241
00:10:57,230 --> 00:10:59,044
Not even looking at
the puzzle itself.
242
00:10:59,044 --> 00:11:02,800
And I thought the other thing
about crosswords is, just to
243
00:11:02,800 --> 00:11:05,420
bring up a point that we talked
about in the earlier
244
00:11:05,420 --> 00:11:08,770
class, the crosswords,
[UNINTELLIGIBLE]
245
00:11:08,770 --> 00:11:11,080
that these are dependent
upon the redundancy
246
00:11:11,080 --> 00:11:13,020
of the English language.
247
00:11:13,020 --> 00:11:17,170
You don't see every single
letter of a word in order to
248
00:11:17,170 --> 00:11:18,330
figure out what the word is.
249
00:11:18,330 --> 00:11:20,250
So that if it's a word that you
couldn't otherwise have
250
00:11:20,250 --> 00:11:23,265
gotten from a clue, you can
still get just by seeing the
251
00:11:23,265 --> 00:11:23,880
letters that are available.
252
00:11:23,880 --> 00:11:26,660
Because the English language is
kind of about [INAUDIBLE],
253
00:11:26,660 --> 00:11:28,220
redundant information.
254
00:11:28,220 --> 00:11:31,620
If you dropped every single
vowel in a sentence, you could
255
00:11:31,620 --> 00:11:34,522
probably still make out
what that sentence is.
256
00:11:34,522 --> 00:11:37,736
And you don't necessarily
get that with Chinese.
257
00:11:37,736 --> 00:11:40,630
258
00:11:40,630 --> 00:11:43,365
How many folks here
have, [INAUDIBLE].
259
00:11:43,365 --> 00:11:45,470
There are probably other
languages here where like
260
00:11:45,470 --> 00:11:48,635
every single character means a
word or something like that.
261
00:11:48,635 --> 00:11:51,116
AUDIENCE: Hebrew has
no vowels, right?
262
00:11:51,116 --> 00:11:55,070
AUDIENCE: Well, they do up until
third grade and we start
263
00:11:55,070 --> 00:11:56,140
dropping them after that.
264
00:11:56,140 --> 00:11:58,790
So it's basically, because it
is understandable without
265
00:11:58,790 --> 00:12:01,300
vowels, you eventually
just stop using them.
266
00:12:01,300 --> 00:12:02,970
PROFESSOR: So that's
interesting.
267
00:12:02,970 --> 00:12:06,300
If you had a crossword in
Hebrew, where you were
268
00:12:06,300 --> 00:12:08,530
expected to write in the words
with vowels, you probably
269
00:12:08,530 --> 00:12:14,433
could actually do one very
similar to an English one.
270
00:12:14,433 --> 00:12:16,650
AUDIENCE: It's difficult because
the vowels in Hebrew
271
00:12:16,650 --> 00:12:19,010
are attached to a letter, not
a separate character.
272
00:12:19,010 --> 00:12:21,370
They're just down at the bottom
of the lower letter.
273
00:12:21,370 --> 00:12:22,620
[INTERPOSING VOICES]
274
00:12:22,620 --> 00:12:27,880
275
00:12:27,880 --> 00:12:31,110
AUDIENCE: Another thing, in a
crossword the letter can make
276
00:12:31,110 --> 00:12:32,757
a different sound in both.
277
00:12:32,757 --> 00:12:35,052
[INTERPOSING VOICES]
278
00:12:35,052 --> 00:12:38,250
AUDIENCE: Because a "v"
could be vo, or va, or
279
00:12:38,250 --> 00:12:39,710
ve, you don't know.
280
00:12:39,710 --> 00:12:40,940
You only know by context.
281
00:12:40,940 --> 00:12:41,940
[UNINTELLIGIBLE]
282
00:12:41,940 --> 00:12:43,940
like "c" could be sss or ca.
283
00:12:43,940 --> 00:12:45,320
Like a hard or soft c.
284
00:12:45,320 --> 00:12:47,576
Or "g" could be ga or ja.
285
00:12:47,576 --> 00:12:51,170
PROFESSOR: That is true, but
although in English in
286
00:12:51,170 --> 00:12:56,110
particular the phonetic meaning,
the way how a certain
287
00:12:56,110 --> 00:13:00,397
word is pronounced isn't
necessarily essential for
288
00:13:00,397 --> 00:13:01,540
solving a crossword puzzle.
289
00:13:01,540 --> 00:13:03,520
Unless the clues happen
to be phonetic clues.
290
00:13:03,520 --> 00:13:05,710
You know, sounds like a fish.
291
00:13:05,710 --> 00:13:09,060
292
00:13:09,060 --> 00:13:12,700
So that may not come in so much
to play when it comes to
293
00:13:12,700 --> 00:13:15,290
finishing a part of it.
294
00:13:15,290 --> 00:13:17,445
Jason, you had your hand up
earlier about Sudoku.
295
00:13:17,445 --> 00:13:20,190
JASON: It was a comment about
the algorithmic [INAUDIBLE].
296
00:13:20,190 --> 00:13:23,773
PROFESSOR: Also, one thing
about algorithmic, about
297
00:13:23,773 --> 00:13:27,310
Sudoku difficulty, a lot of
it comes from the selected
298
00:13:27,310 --> 00:13:27,875
removal of numbers.
299
00:13:27,875 --> 00:13:31,770
There's not what is the final
pattern going to look like
300
00:13:31,770 --> 00:13:33,520
that's actually the
difficulty.
301
00:13:33,520 --> 00:13:36,660
It's how do we remove the
numbers in a way that gives
302
00:13:36,660 --> 00:13:41,900
multiple possible answers or
multiple possible dead ends,
303
00:13:41,900 --> 00:13:45,690
because really there's
only one solution.
304
00:13:45,690 --> 00:13:47,420
I'm not actually familiar
with the algorithm with
305
00:13:47,420 --> 00:13:48,200
which it does so.
306
00:13:48,200 --> 00:13:49,880
But it seems to be very clear
that there are at least two
307
00:13:49,880 --> 00:13:50,130
algorithms.
308
00:13:50,130 --> 00:13:54,910
One of which is very easy,
which is just provide a
309
00:13:54,910 --> 00:13:57,080
legitimate Sudoku solution.
310
00:13:57,080 --> 00:13:59,280
And then the one that is
slightly harder is now which
311
00:13:59,280 --> 00:14:00,760
number is to be removed so
that's it's still solvable.
312
00:14:00,760 --> 00:14:03,780
313
00:14:03,780 --> 00:14:05,030
PROFESSOR:: Have you
all played Picross?
314
00:14:05,030 --> 00:14:08,040
315
00:14:08,040 --> 00:14:10,685
Someone want to describe it
for the folks who aren't
316
00:14:10,685 --> 00:14:12,625
familiar with it?
317
00:14:12,625 --> 00:14:17,475
We can use the white
board if--
318
00:14:17,475 --> 00:14:19,415
sure.
319
00:14:19,415 --> 00:14:23,650
AUDIENCE: I think the green
one works better.
320
00:14:23,650 --> 00:14:25,600
I remember green is
better than black.
321
00:14:25,600 --> 00:14:28,405
NICK: I'm really only familiar
with the [INAUDIBLE]
322
00:14:28,405 --> 00:14:30,345
3D [UNINTELLIGIBLE].
323
00:14:30,345 --> 00:14:34,710
324
00:14:34,710 --> 00:14:37,012
AUDIENCE:: Sorry to put you on
the spot Nick, as always.
325
00:14:37,012 --> 00:14:40,788
NICK: [UNINTELLIGIBLE]
326
00:14:40,788 --> 00:14:45,324
Here you'll have
written poems.
327
00:14:45,324 --> 00:14:49,992
And then they all have something
[INAUDIBLE].
328
00:14:49,992 --> 00:14:51,560
AUDIENCE: Oh, this.
329
00:14:51,560 --> 00:14:54,560
330
00:14:54,560 --> 00:14:57,288
This one where you spell
in the blocks.
331
00:14:57,288 --> 00:15:01,610
NICK: And then given bits of
information, we have to work
332
00:15:01,610 --> 00:15:04,063
out which of these blocks
is built and
333
00:15:04,063 --> 00:15:05,460
which can be removed.
334
00:15:05,460 --> 00:15:09,340
So the idea is the number tells
you the number of blocks
335
00:15:09,340 --> 00:15:14,285
in that row or column which
has a filled block in it.
336
00:15:14,285 --> 00:15:19,060
So in this case, nothing
is in it's column.
337
00:15:19,060 --> 00:15:23,562
This column and that column
have nothing in it.
338
00:15:23,562 --> 00:15:27,936
And this is probably not
actually a very good example
339
00:15:27,936 --> 00:15:31,270
because I just pulled the
numbers out of my head.
340
00:15:31,270 --> 00:15:35,410
AUDIENCE: Then you have the
sums are not the same.
341
00:15:35,410 --> 00:15:38,160
NICK: So it's not going to work,
but you get the idea.
342
00:15:38,160 --> 00:15:40,800
And things can get more
complicated, traditionally
343
00:15:40,800 --> 00:15:44,055
there's just, I think,
three that are names.
344
00:15:44,055 --> 00:15:45,533
That's there a connected
block of three.
345
00:15:45,533 --> 00:15:48,431
So, for instance, this,
that, and that.
346
00:15:48,431 --> 00:15:49,710
And I thought it had
to be broken.
347
00:15:49,710 --> 00:15:53,515
But if there's a three which,
I think, is in a square or
348
00:15:53,515 --> 00:15:56,025
something along these lines,
that means there are three in
349
00:15:56,025 --> 00:15:56,940
that column.
350
00:15:56,940 --> 00:15:59,480
But there's a gap in
there somewhere.
351
00:15:59,480 --> 00:16:03,360
And then if it's like a three
inch circle or something else
352
00:16:03,360 --> 00:16:03,820
complicated like that.
353
00:16:03,820 --> 00:16:05,650
Then that means that there are
three but they all have gaps
354
00:16:05,650 --> 00:16:06,732
between them.
355
00:16:06,732 --> 00:16:09,335
AUDIENCE: But I've also seen
versions where they have just
356
00:16:09,335 --> 00:16:10,760
a list of numbers.
357
00:16:10,760 --> 00:16:12,470
And those are the--
358
00:16:12,470 --> 00:16:15,072
there are [INAUDIBLE] blocks
of that length.
359
00:16:15,072 --> 00:16:19,000
PROFESSOR: So if there's four in
a column you might say two,
360
00:16:19,000 --> 00:16:20,020
three, five.
361
00:16:20,020 --> 00:16:22,260
Which means there is a block of
two, followed by a block of
362
00:16:22,260 --> 00:16:23,674
three, followed by
a block of five.
363
00:16:23,674 --> 00:16:25,884
AUDIENCE: And they have to
have a gap between them.
364
00:16:25,884 --> 00:16:27,390
PROFESSOR: And they will have to
have a gap in between them.
365
00:16:27,390 --> 00:16:29,413
So it's not like you can
actually get a block of eight
366
00:16:29,413 --> 00:16:29,965
in there somewhere.
367
00:16:29,965 --> 00:16:35,420
But the whole idea is that
you've got this information
368
00:16:35,420 --> 00:16:37,021
that is actually redundant.
369
00:16:37,021 --> 00:16:39,598
You've got more information in
there than you necessarily
370
00:16:39,598 --> 00:16:43,001
need to be able to figure out
which box and the situation to
371
00:16:43,001 --> 00:16:43,604
be filled in.
372
00:16:43,604 --> 00:16:45,185
Whether this should be empty.
373
00:16:45,185 --> 00:16:48,635
But it's presented to you
in this obfuscated way.
374
00:16:48,635 --> 00:16:52,630
The evidence, the clues that are
given to you in a way that
375
00:16:52,630 --> 00:16:55,750
requires you to perform these
algorithms in order to figure
376
00:16:55,750 --> 00:16:56,840
out which ones should
be changed.
377
00:16:56,840 --> 00:16:58,380
And usually that's an algorithm
378
00:16:58,380 --> 00:17:00,070
you can use to solve.
379
00:17:00,070 --> 00:17:03,960
Although, I think Kim was the
one that was talking about
380
00:17:03,960 --> 00:17:05,210
pattern matching.
381
00:17:05,210 --> 00:17:07,470
382
00:17:07,470 --> 00:17:11,434
But eventually as you get good
at these things, you start to
383
00:17:11,434 --> 00:17:13,505
recognize patterns
right of the bat.
384
00:17:13,505 --> 00:17:14,270
Like, that's a zero.
385
00:17:14,270 --> 00:17:16,800
So that entire row is empty.
386
00:17:16,800 --> 00:17:19,612
That's the sort of thing
that I do that becomes
387
00:17:19,612 --> 00:17:20,862
automatic for you.
388
00:17:20,862 --> 00:17:25,645
389
00:17:25,645 --> 00:17:28,210
AUDIENCE: So, let's see.
390
00:17:28,210 --> 00:17:31,490
I don't have much left more to
talk about Scott [INAUDIBLE].
391
00:17:31,490 --> 00:17:36,884
Now these are, these are
more generated stuff.
392
00:17:36,884 --> 00:17:39,880
[UNINTELLIGIBLE].
393
00:17:39,880 --> 00:17:46,750
So this basically is along the
lines of what Scott [? Pim ?]
394
00:17:46,750 --> 00:17:48,040
is talking about.
395
00:17:48,040 --> 00:17:50,613
But obviously this is more
physical not the pen and paper
396
00:17:50,613 --> 00:17:51,084
kind of thing.
397
00:17:51,084 --> 00:17:52,968
AUDIENCE: Will you
print up a copy?
398
00:17:52,968 --> 00:17:54,852
PROFESSOR: Oh, you
want the copy?
399
00:17:54,852 --> 00:17:58,080
No, because I just want
you to look at this.
400
00:17:58,080 --> 00:18:00,336
Look at this first, don't
look at that.
401
00:18:00,336 --> 00:18:02,135
Don't look at that.
402
00:18:02,135 --> 00:18:06,390
So the basic idea is, let me
just start with one, you get a
403
00:18:06,390 --> 00:18:10,455
card that is actually
a puzzle.
404
00:18:10,455 --> 00:18:13,245
I wish we were doing these
outside now, because we're
405
00:18:13,245 --> 00:18:15,240
going to zoom this out.
406
00:18:15,240 --> 00:18:17,670
But the puzzle basically just
tells you how you are supposed
407
00:18:17,670 --> 00:18:19,620
to set up your board
initially.
408
00:18:19,620 --> 00:18:24,010
So, there's a-- oops
wrong [INAUDIBLE].
409
00:18:24,010 --> 00:18:25,490
There's a green guy there.
410
00:18:25,490 --> 00:18:26,960
There's a green guy there.
411
00:18:26,960 --> 00:18:29,690
This is supposed to be an easy
puzzle, I hope it is.
412
00:18:29,690 --> 00:18:32,028
Because I'm getting
bad at this.
413
00:18:32,028 --> 00:18:35,352
Red guy go to [INAUDIBLE]
414
00:18:35,352 --> 00:18:36,530
I think.
415
00:18:36,530 --> 00:18:39,000
Yeah, and that's the puzzle.
416
00:18:39,000 --> 00:18:41,850
And there's one little
square on it, and
417
00:18:41,850 --> 00:18:43,130
that you have to check.
418
00:18:43,130 --> 00:18:48,340
419
00:18:48,340 --> 00:18:53,700
So the basic idea is you
tip over the pieces so
420
00:18:53,700 --> 00:18:55,740
that the guy moves.
421
00:18:55,740 --> 00:18:58,160
And you don't want to be tipping
over the pieces in a
422
00:18:58,160 --> 00:19:03,180
way where the white guy
can't move anymore.
423
00:19:03,180 --> 00:19:06,540
424
00:19:06,540 --> 00:19:09,670
AUDIENCE: Yeah, so you're
tipping over things to make a
425
00:19:09,670 --> 00:19:10,980
path that he can walk
along, right.
426
00:19:10,980 --> 00:19:12,830
AUDIENCE: If I make a
closed loop, he has
427
00:19:12,830 --> 00:19:13,480
to touch every piece?
428
00:19:13,480 --> 00:19:15,520
AUDIENCE: I think he just
has to get to this one.
429
00:19:15,520 --> 00:19:16,860
PROFESSOR: Yeah, you have
to get to the red one.
430
00:19:16,860 --> 00:19:19,590
AUDIENCE: There's a plus mark.
431
00:19:19,590 --> 00:19:20,840
[INTERPOSING VOICES]
432
00:19:20,840 --> 00:19:22,525
433
00:19:22,525 --> 00:19:25,220
PROFESSOR: I'm not exactly sure
how to solve this one.
434
00:19:25,220 --> 00:19:28,370
AUDIENCE: Yellow that way,
green, yellow that way.
435
00:19:28,370 --> 00:19:32,032
AUDIENCE: Wait, you're allowed
to tip him over?
436
00:19:32,032 --> 00:19:33,330
How do you die?
437
00:19:33,330 --> 00:19:36,570
PROFESSOR: My understanding is
that he needs to fall onto
438
00:19:36,570 --> 00:19:38,370
another piece, actually.
439
00:19:38,370 --> 00:19:40,905
So let me just confirm I set
this up right, actually.
440
00:19:40,905 --> 00:19:41,690
Yeah, I did.
441
00:19:41,690 --> 00:19:43,680
AUDIENCE: No, so you push
the yellow that way.
442
00:19:43,680 --> 00:19:44,780
And then the green that way.
443
00:19:44,780 --> 00:19:45,760
And the other green that way.
444
00:19:45,760 --> 00:19:47,680
AUDIENCE: So put the
yellow ones first?
445
00:19:47,680 --> 00:19:49,140
AUDIENCE: So do the
green ones first.
446
00:19:49,140 --> 00:19:49,970
AUDIENCE: Yeah, I don't
actually have the
447
00:19:49,970 --> 00:19:52,218
rules for the guy.
448
00:19:52,218 --> 00:19:53,468
[INTERPOSING VOICES]
449
00:19:53,468 --> 00:19:56,412
450
00:19:56,412 --> 00:19:58,230
AUDIENCE: How does he fall?
451
00:19:58,230 --> 00:19:59,480
[INTERPOSING VOICES]
452
00:19:59,480 --> 00:20:01,590
453
00:20:01,590 --> 00:20:06,160
PROFESSOR: He's actually allowed
to move on anything
454
00:20:06,160 --> 00:20:08,340
that's contiguously connected.
455
00:20:08,340 --> 00:20:12,770
So, as long as you can
continuously connect up to
456
00:20:12,770 --> 00:20:14,160
this, you're fine.
457
00:20:14,160 --> 00:20:15,940
[INTERPOSING VOICES]
458
00:20:15,940 --> 00:20:18,310
AUDIENCE: 10: So tip
that first green.
459
00:20:18,310 --> 00:20:19,560
No, other one.
460
00:20:19,560 --> 00:20:22,380
461
00:20:22,380 --> 00:20:25,555
And then form a path, right
now, if you tip that.
462
00:20:25,555 --> 00:20:27,836
Oh, there's a hole.
463
00:20:27,836 --> 00:20:30,110
AUDIENCE: 11: Are you sure tip
them over means more brown
464
00:20:30,110 --> 00:20:31,065
spot and not--
465
00:20:31,065 --> 00:20:32,920
AUDIENCE: 12: Well, if doesn't
then you can't reach
466
00:20:32,920 --> 00:20:33,620
the red after it.
467
00:20:33,620 --> 00:20:36,220
PROFESSOR: Yeah, I am absolutely
sure it means that
468
00:20:36,220 --> 00:20:38,770
you're supposed to tip it
over in a way that--
469
00:20:38,770 --> 00:20:41,440
[INTERPOSING VOICES]
470
00:20:41,440 --> 00:20:43,530
AUDIENCE: 13: Tip the
yellow one first.
471
00:20:43,530 --> 00:20:45,520
Then move the guy out
to the green.
472
00:20:45,520 --> 00:20:47,420
Then tip over the green.
473
00:20:47,420 --> 00:20:48,670
[INTERPOSING VOICES]
474
00:20:48,670 --> 00:20:55,610
475
00:20:55,610 --> 00:20:58,257
PROFESSOR: That is why it's
supposed to begin a
476
00:20:58,257 --> 00:21:00,045
[UNINTELLIGIBLE].
477
00:21:00,045 --> 00:21:01,503
You can actually do it.
478
00:21:01,503 --> 00:21:03,800
This is why this
is puzzle one.
479
00:21:03,800 --> 00:21:06,270
AUDIENCE: 14: You can even
fall on top of anything?
480
00:21:06,270 --> 00:21:08,490
That's bizarre.
481
00:21:08,490 --> 00:21:09,740
[INTERPOSING VOICES]
482
00:21:09,740 --> 00:21:18,225
483
00:21:18,225 --> 00:21:20,750
PROFESSOR: But, you know, this
is not entirely unlike the
484
00:21:20,750 --> 00:21:22,020
kind of puzzle that
Scott does.
485
00:21:22,020 --> 00:21:26,860
I mean, sure, this is one
particular piece of plastic
486
00:21:26,860 --> 00:21:29,570
that the game is designed
to work with.
487
00:21:29,570 --> 00:21:31,735
But basically it's just
like a book, right?
488
00:21:31,735 --> 00:21:35,120
It's like a book of puzzles.
489
00:21:35,120 --> 00:21:39,095
So there are also solutions in
here, but I find the solutions
490
00:21:39,095 --> 00:21:41,873
harder to read.
491
00:21:41,873 --> 00:21:43,040
AUDIENCE: The [UNINTELLIGIBLE]
492
00:21:43,040 --> 00:21:44,825
was in the book.
493
00:21:44,825 --> 00:21:45,800
PROFESSOR: It was in
Brenda's book?
494
00:21:45,800 --> 00:21:46,320
AUDIENCE: Yeah.
495
00:21:46,320 --> 00:21:50,700
PROFESSOR: So, actually, that's
probably a good excuse
496
00:21:50,700 --> 00:21:53,380
to switch over to Brenda's.
497
00:21:53,380 --> 00:21:55,102
Well, actually, before
that I want to take
498
00:21:55,102 --> 00:21:57,706
a look at the tangrams.
499
00:21:57,706 --> 00:21:58,956
Everyone play the tangrams?
500
00:21:58,956 --> 00:22:02,100
501
00:22:02,100 --> 00:22:04,808
So, the basic idea is you've
got these shapes.
502
00:22:04,808 --> 00:22:08,055
Does this one get
in, like this?
503
00:22:08,055 --> 00:22:13,980
You've got these shapes, and if
you assemble them right as
504
00:22:13,980 --> 00:22:16,950
is usually described on the
side of the box somewhere.
505
00:22:16,950 --> 00:22:18,420
Where the heck?
506
00:22:18,420 --> 00:22:20,380
AUDIENCE: It's on the inside.
507
00:22:20,380 --> 00:22:24,040
PROFESSOR: I've got a big
picture on the side.
508
00:22:24,040 --> 00:22:28,430
Is that you can actually fit
all of these shapes inside
509
00:22:28,430 --> 00:22:29,530
that square.
510
00:22:29,530 --> 00:22:33,472
So these are basically just a
square that's been divided in
511
00:22:33,472 --> 00:22:36,530
a specific way.
512
00:22:36,530 --> 00:22:41,820
So once I've got this assembled
everyone can just
513
00:22:41,820 --> 00:22:43,142
pass this around.
514
00:22:43,142 --> 00:22:47,370
Anyone who has already seen
it can pass it on.
515
00:22:47,370 --> 00:22:51,080
That one doesn't fit very
well, but it works.
516
00:22:51,080 --> 00:22:52,480
Hey, that's, ta da.
517
00:22:52,480 --> 00:22:55,110
OK, so this is the basic side.
518
00:22:55,110 --> 00:22:58,690
519
00:22:58,690 --> 00:23:02,410
Now this is how it's been sold,
at least, is that this
520
00:23:02,410 --> 00:23:03,730
is actually a calendar.
521
00:23:03,730 --> 00:23:08,260
So every day you get
a different shape.
522
00:23:08,260 --> 00:23:10,200
It's a cute little thing.
523
00:23:10,200 --> 00:23:12,780
It's a pretty rudimentary
geometrical shape.
524
00:23:12,780 --> 00:23:15,035
Some of them have, I think
this is supposed to be a
525
00:23:15,035 --> 00:23:16,340
sphynx or something.
526
00:23:16,340 --> 00:23:20,164
It looks like a frog.
527
00:23:20,164 --> 00:23:22,108
This looks like a
Pac Man thing.
528
00:23:22,108 --> 00:23:30,460
529
00:23:30,460 --> 00:23:35,455
So the idea is that you
rearrange those particular
530
00:23:35,455 --> 00:23:37,780
shapes into all of these
different shapes.
531
00:23:37,780 --> 00:23:44,260
And you could play the game
without getting these puzzle
532
00:23:44,260 --> 00:23:44,970
solutions, right?
533
00:23:44,970 --> 00:23:48,770
And it talks a lot about, if
you've got a toy that's worth
534
00:23:48,770 --> 00:23:51,408
playing with, you've got the
beginning of something that
535
00:23:51,408 --> 00:23:52,650
might make a good game.
536
00:23:52,650 --> 00:23:52,818
The nice thing about tipover
is that it's kind of fun to
537
00:23:52,818 --> 00:23:54,068
tip over things.
538
00:23:54,068 --> 00:23:56,850
539
00:23:56,850 --> 00:23:59,435
And the thing about tangrams
is that I actually had more
540
00:23:59,435 --> 00:24:01,260
fun playing with tangrams than
trying to solve specific
541
00:24:01,260 --> 00:24:03,440
problems just by just trying
to rearrange these.
542
00:24:03,440 --> 00:24:06,210
Who hasn't seen these before?
543
00:24:06,210 --> 00:24:08,750
[INTERPOSING VOICES]
544
00:24:08,750 --> 00:24:09,580
AUDIENCE: Kind of
embarrassing.
545
00:24:09,580 --> 00:24:13,420
AUDIENCE: You should be
ashamed of yourself.
546
00:24:13,420 --> 00:24:15,936
And all the work that
you did is gone.
547
00:24:15,936 --> 00:24:19,212
548
00:24:19,212 --> 00:24:22,600
PROFESSOR: But the thing is,
as a toy it doesn't really
549
00:24:22,600 --> 00:24:23,140
matter, right?
550
00:24:23,140 --> 00:24:27,940
Because it's just a certain
piece of anything.
551
00:24:27,940 --> 00:24:30,785
And you kind of want to take it
apart and make new shapes
552
00:24:30,785 --> 00:24:34,860
with it, like a little house.
553
00:24:34,860 --> 00:24:38,260
So if you've got something
that's kind of fun to fiddle
554
00:24:38,260 --> 00:24:41,960
with to begin with, you've got
possibly the beginning of a
555
00:24:41,960 --> 00:24:43,552
game in general.
556
00:24:43,552 --> 00:24:47,120
But the way how Scott was
talking about it, there's this
557
00:24:47,120 --> 00:24:49,490
intermediate step where
it's a puzzle.
558
00:24:49,490 --> 00:24:51,940
It's a toy with a specific
solution that you're
559
00:24:51,940 --> 00:24:52,820
trying to get to.
560
00:24:52,820 --> 00:24:56,330
And a game is kind of one step
beyond that where now there is
561
00:24:56,330 --> 00:24:59,010
multiple solutions
and competitive.
562
00:24:59,010 --> 00:25:01,420
At least, that's how
he's describing it.
563
00:25:01,420 --> 00:25:02,866
He's not really a
game theorist.
564
00:25:02,866 --> 00:25:03,830
He just works with puzzles.
565
00:25:03,830 --> 00:25:07,070
AUDIENCE: He talks about it
in terms of a goal, right?
566
00:25:07,070 --> 00:25:08,910
So then with a toy that you
don't have a goal with them.
567
00:25:08,910 --> 00:25:11,910
With a puzzle, you have one
goal with no interaction.
568
00:25:11,910 --> 00:25:14,330
And then a game is
with interaction.
569
00:25:14,330 --> 00:25:17,120
PROFESSOR: And possibly multiple
goals as well.
570
00:25:17,120 --> 00:25:20,190
But again it becomes more and
more directed as toys
571
00:25:20,190 --> 00:25:22,310
are very free form.
572
00:25:22,310 --> 00:25:25,680
So there are people who describe
games, like the Sims
573
00:25:25,680 --> 00:25:27,490
for instance, as
actually toys.
574
00:25:27,490 --> 00:25:30,300
In the same way that you
describe a doll house as a
575
00:25:30,300 --> 00:25:33,760
toy, they're saying it's kind of
like a digital doll house.
576
00:25:33,760 --> 00:25:37,010
But later versions of the
Sims added more and
577
00:25:37,010 --> 00:25:37,980
more specific goals.
578
00:25:37,980 --> 00:25:41,090
Like now you have to throw a
party with at least five
579
00:25:41,090 --> 00:25:42,490
people in it.
580
00:25:42,490 --> 00:25:46,440
Or you have to attain
career level five or
581
00:25:46,440 --> 00:25:47,468
something like that.
582
00:25:47,468 --> 00:25:50,744
I can't remember exactly
how they measured it.
583
00:25:50,744 --> 00:25:53,170
But that kind of has a goal.
584
00:25:53,170 --> 00:25:55,585
We are going to give more and
more specific things for you
585
00:25:55,585 --> 00:25:56,420
to work towards.
586
00:25:56,420 --> 00:26:00,320
But the Sims is very careful
not to lose it's toy sense.
587
00:26:00,320 --> 00:26:01,760
This adds up.
588
00:26:01,760 --> 00:26:04,983
If you really want to just dick
around with these guys,
589
00:26:04,983 --> 00:26:06,530
go right ahead.
590
00:26:06,530 --> 00:26:11,540
Just play around with them
and see what happens.
591
00:26:11,540 --> 00:26:15,280
AUDIENCE: Why is there a
distinction for physical
592
00:26:15,280 --> 00:26:17,830
objects between toys and games,
but for like video
593
00:26:17,830 --> 00:26:21,700
games-- like Mindcraft it is
technically still a game but--
594
00:26:21,700 --> 00:26:23,880
PROFESSOR: It kind of
has different modes.
595
00:26:23,880 --> 00:26:24,330
Yeah.
596
00:26:24,330 --> 00:26:26,400
AUDIENCE: I guess it has
different modes, but it's more
597
00:26:26,400 --> 00:26:26,890
of a toy, I think.
598
00:26:26,890 --> 00:26:30,020
PROFESSOR: I would say that's
entirely marketing.
599
00:26:30,020 --> 00:26:34,170
The only reason is people
haven't figured out how to
600
00:26:34,170 --> 00:26:35,570
sell digital toys.
601
00:26:35,570 --> 00:26:41,380
And there are games aisles in
like Best Buy and so, well,
602
00:26:41,380 --> 00:26:43,160
this is a fun thing we're
going to put it
603
00:26:43,160 --> 00:26:44,210
into the game section.
604
00:26:44,210 --> 00:26:45,310
Everyone starts calling
it games.
605
00:26:45,310 --> 00:26:46,980
And that's kind of the same
thing with the Sims.
606
00:26:46,980 --> 00:26:49,800
It's that really the Sims should
be it's own genre, but
607
00:26:49,800 --> 00:26:52,066
you can't sell it's own
genre that well.
608
00:26:52,066 --> 00:26:53,316
[INAUDIBLE]
609
00:26:53,316 --> 00:26:55,890
610
00:26:55,890 --> 00:26:57,324
Was there a hand over here?
611
00:26:57,324 --> 00:27:00,680
612
00:27:00,680 --> 00:27:05,120
OK, so let's start
with Brenda's--
613
00:27:05,120 --> 00:27:07,760
614
00:27:07,760 --> 00:27:11,996
if it stops reading, so let's
just move on to Brenda's.
615
00:27:11,996 --> 00:27:14,790
And she's very specific about
the kinds of puzzles that
616
00:27:14,790 --> 00:27:15,530
she's talking about.
617
00:27:15,530 --> 00:27:19,950
Is that these things that get in
the way of a very specific
618
00:27:19,950 --> 00:27:21,690
narrative experience
that a game wants
619
00:27:21,690 --> 00:27:24,070
to guide you through.
620
00:27:24,070 --> 00:27:27,950
She describes them more as
roadblocks than anything else.
621
00:27:27,950 --> 00:27:31,180
But, you know, things to make
the challenge higher, but
622
00:27:31,180 --> 00:27:33,150
possibly so high that no
one is going to be
623
00:27:33,150 --> 00:27:35,010
able to get past them.
624
00:27:35,010 --> 00:27:37,307
Some of her examples are things
that come up as, sort
625
00:27:37,307 --> 00:27:40,450
of, intermittent but optional
mechanics like
626
00:27:40,450 --> 00:27:43,140
hacking in Bio Shop.
627
00:27:43,140 --> 00:27:45,450
And sometimes there are things
that you have to solve,
628
00:27:45,450 --> 00:27:47,445
especially in adventure games.
629
00:27:47,445 --> 00:27:49,690
There's this, you have to
combine this object with that
630
00:27:49,690 --> 00:27:52,050
object and bring it to
a specific location.
631
00:27:52,050 --> 00:27:58,407
And then now you can proceed
with whatever narrative
632
00:27:58,407 --> 00:27:58,896
they've got.
633
00:27:58,896 --> 00:28:04,350
AUDIENCE: She had this specific
axe to grind against
634
00:28:04,350 --> 00:28:07,675
puzzles having meaningful
rewards or not being
635
00:28:07,675 --> 00:28:08,560
completely bought in.
636
00:28:08,560 --> 00:28:12,200
So, for instance, she says you
should never have a puzzle
637
00:28:12,200 --> 00:28:14,320
being required to open a door.
638
00:28:14,320 --> 00:28:17,300
She said, solve a puzzle and
then get some kind of tangible
639
00:28:17,300 --> 00:28:19,510
reward like loot or something.
640
00:28:19,510 --> 00:28:24,240
This is after I just spent the
bus ride to New York City
641
00:28:24,240 --> 00:28:25,570
playing Professor Layton's.
642
00:28:25,570 --> 00:28:28,450
643
00:28:28,450 --> 00:28:32,278
Which was nonstop, with on the
door, it's got a lock on it,
644
00:28:32,278 --> 00:28:33,528
looks like a puzzle.
645
00:28:33,528 --> 00:28:36,030
646
00:28:36,030 --> 00:28:38,792
So I wasn't entirely to sure
what to make of that.
647
00:28:38,792 --> 00:28:41,210
I thought that my Professor
Layton experience was fine,
648
00:28:41,210 --> 00:28:45,510
and I didn't need to get fat
Layton loot from some
649
00:28:45,510 --> 00:28:46,470
[INAUDIBLE].
650
00:28:46,470 --> 00:28:50,760
PROFESSOR: That's actually
something, and there's a
651
00:28:50,760 --> 00:28:53,140
really good article actually
written by
652
00:28:53,140 --> 00:28:55,250
Clara over in our lab.
653
00:28:55,250 --> 00:28:58,255
Actually, it wasn't an article,
it was the transcript
654
00:28:58,255 --> 00:29:00,700
of a talk that she gave
at Austin University--
655
00:29:00,700 --> 00:29:02,760
I'll send on the link
to everyone--
656
00:29:02,760 --> 00:29:05,650
about how you can integrate, and
why you should integrate,
657
00:29:05,650 --> 00:29:08,260
puzzles really, really well
into the narrative.
658
00:29:08,260 --> 00:29:11,040
It's like really why is there
a puzzle in your game at all
659
00:29:11,040 --> 00:29:14,470
unless it's been integrated
into the narrative?
660
00:29:14,470 --> 00:29:18,750
And Brenda seems to be, sort
of, providing a cautionary
661
00:29:18,750 --> 00:29:19,990
tale of the--
662
00:29:19,990 --> 00:29:23,570
But if you do it badly, no one
can get on with the story.
663
00:29:23,570 --> 00:29:25,150
No one can enjoy the
rest of the game.
664
00:29:25,150 --> 00:29:27,770
It becomes this one thing that
prevents you from proceeding?
665
00:29:27,770 --> 00:29:31,260
Is there anyone who
had that moment?
666
00:29:31,260 --> 00:29:31,530
Yeah.
667
00:29:31,530 --> 00:29:33,748
AUDIENCE: About five
minutes into Mist.
668
00:29:33,748 --> 00:29:43,330
669
00:29:43,330 --> 00:29:44,270
I don't know.
670
00:29:44,270 --> 00:29:47,770
It had some sort of cool live
action video and stuff.
671
00:29:47,770 --> 00:29:49,810
And it looked like it could
be an interesting story.
672
00:29:49,810 --> 00:29:51,594
That's kind using technological
prowess of
673
00:29:51,594 --> 00:29:54,050
integrating video into 3D.
674
00:29:54,050 --> 00:29:56,396
And then suddenly I looked
in to the picture
675
00:29:56,396 --> 00:29:57,322
and I was on an island.
676
00:29:57,322 --> 00:29:59,637
And then there was nothing
happening and I had to turn
677
00:29:59,637 --> 00:30:00,563
things to face each other.
678
00:30:00,563 --> 00:30:04,070
And I couldn't figure it out.
679
00:30:04,070 --> 00:30:07,620
AUDIENCE: When I originally
played The Legend of Zelda.
680
00:30:07,620 --> 00:30:09,730
The original one.
681
00:30:09,730 --> 00:30:13,960
So they don't tell you
anything pretty much.
682
00:30:13,960 --> 00:30:17,620
And so the temples, you just
walk around the sun, then it's
683
00:30:17,620 --> 00:30:19,850
like, OK, there's a
tree and a forest.
684
00:30:19,850 --> 00:30:22,580
You're supposed to
burn [INAUDIBLE]
685
00:30:22,580 --> 00:30:27,070
and there's the entrance to
this temple that you can't
686
00:30:27,070 --> 00:30:29,350
proceed until you
do this thing.
687
00:30:29,350 --> 00:30:33,750
And so, it's just like, how am
I supposed to know that I'm
688
00:30:33,750 --> 00:30:35,720
supposed to burn this particular
tree in the middle
689
00:30:35,720 --> 00:30:36,750
of this huge map?
690
00:30:36,750 --> 00:30:40,230
PROFESSOR: Did you beat
any of the other--
691
00:30:40,230 --> 00:30:41,340
AUDIENCE: Yeah, and they
didn't say anything.
692
00:30:41,340 --> 00:30:43,320
PROFESSOR: No, I mean
the other Zeldas?
693
00:30:43,320 --> 00:30:46,040
AUDIENCE: Yeah, actually
yesterday we [INAUDIBLE].
694
00:30:46,040 --> 00:30:48,660
695
00:30:48,660 --> 00:30:51,510
AUDIENCE: I was just saying,
so the interesting thing is
696
00:30:51,510 --> 00:30:54,096
most people nowadays they end
up playing, like the Ocarina
697
00:30:54,096 --> 00:30:56,740
of Time, Majora's Mask, they
are moving backwards.
698
00:30:56,740 --> 00:30:59,115
So they end up playing the
first Zelda after having
699
00:30:59,115 --> 00:31:00,470
played these old ones.
700
00:31:00,470 --> 00:31:02,610
So you sort of know that you're
expected to do these
701
00:31:02,610 --> 00:31:05,520
random things to get
like across.
702
00:31:05,520 --> 00:31:07,670
So I feel like it's easier
for people, but then--
703
00:31:07,670 --> 00:31:09,490
AUDIENCE: But with the
original Zelda--
704
00:31:09,490 --> 00:31:14,086
you know how in new ones they
have, let's say, a wall that
705
00:31:14,086 --> 00:31:14,840
you can blow up.
706
00:31:14,840 --> 00:31:17,150
It's discolored or something.
707
00:31:17,150 --> 00:31:20,510
In this one every tree looks
exactly the same.
708
00:31:20,510 --> 00:31:21,840
They use the same stripes.
709
00:31:21,840 --> 00:31:23,760
AUDIENCE: If I remember
correctly, though, it's placed
710
00:31:23,760 --> 00:31:26,920
such that it's in the center
of your screen, right?
711
00:31:26,920 --> 00:31:28,475
So it does look a little
bit different.
712
00:31:28,475 --> 00:31:31,450
AUDIENCE: No, it was
just a random tree.
713
00:31:31,450 --> 00:31:35,830
It was just a whole
bunch of trees.
714
00:31:35,830 --> 00:31:41,520
And so you just really have to
get, whatever a type of thing
715
00:31:41,520 --> 00:31:44,010
to burn it-- a specific one--
716
00:31:44,010 --> 00:31:45,390
and burn it.
717
00:31:45,390 --> 00:31:47,630
AUDIENCE: I remember it was
a little suspicious.
718
00:31:47,630 --> 00:31:51,510
Because I think there was a one
tile column, you kind of
719
00:31:51,510 --> 00:31:54,180
navigate around just
this loop.
720
00:31:54,180 --> 00:31:56,350
You just entered and--
721
00:31:56,350 --> 00:31:57,506
AUDIENCE: That's suspicious.
722
00:31:57,506 --> 00:32:02,470
AUDIENCE: And I'll feel very
frustrated by games that
723
00:32:02,470 --> 00:32:04,830
require walk-throughs in
order to play them.
724
00:32:04,830 --> 00:32:07,720
PROFESSOR: Sure, and that was
the other thing that she
725
00:32:07,720 --> 00:32:09,230
suggested some game
designers do.
726
00:32:09,230 --> 00:32:13,480
They put the solution
in the Prima Guide.
727
00:32:13,480 --> 00:32:15,485
So that you have to buy the
Prima Guide in order to
728
00:32:15,485 --> 00:32:16,880
[INAUDIBLE].
729
00:32:16,880 --> 00:32:19,890
AUDIENCE: Does Prima have
a deal with the--
730
00:32:19,890 --> 00:32:22,550
PROFESSOR: Oh, they must have.
731
00:32:22,550 --> 00:32:26,786
AUDIENCE: They say "official"
on the top for a reason.
732
00:32:26,786 --> 00:32:31,470
AUDIENCE: It's also ironic,
because modern Zelda games,
733
00:32:31,470 --> 00:32:34,520
it's very obvious that you have
to use this or that item.
734
00:32:34,520 --> 00:32:35,625
AUDIENCE: You've got a key.
735
00:32:35,625 --> 00:32:36,270
Use this key to open.
736
00:32:36,270 --> 00:32:38,110
AUDIENCE: Oh, you got this
item in the dungeon.
737
00:32:38,110 --> 00:32:40,640
You have to use this item
to kill the boss.
738
00:32:40,640 --> 00:32:42,480
That sort of thing.
739
00:32:42,480 --> 00:32:43,950
It's blatant.
740
00:32:43,950 --> 00:32:45,940
AUDIENCE: Well, for people who
are really, really hopeless,
741
00:32:45,940 --> 00:32:47,930
there's that little fairy.
742
00:32:47,930 --> 00:32:49,688
[INTERPOSING VOICES]
743
00:32:49,688 --> 00:32:55,300
PROFESSOR: They're usually less
useful than you think.
744
00:32:55,300 --> 00:32:58,590
So one big difference between
the old Zelda games and the
745
00:32:58,590 --> 00:33:01,380
new Zelda games is just this
continual refinement in their
746
00:33:01,380 --> 00:33:02,970
user interface.
747
00:33:02,970 --> 00:33:09,880
And it goes all the way from
little things like the notes
748
00:33:09,880 --> 00:33:11,650
that you hear when you
find a new dungeon.
749
00:33:11,650 --> 00:33:16,462
And exactly when, precisely,
you hear the sound of, you
750
00:33:16,462 --> 00:33:18,201
know, too da loo--
751
00:33:18,201 --> 00:33:20,943
at least I think that's
how it sounds.
752
00:33:20,943 --> 00:33:25,080
You know, as a clue that now
you have opened a door.
753
00:33:25,080 --> 00:33:28,600
That's one of those things
that, if you look at post
754
00:33:28,600 --> 00:33:29,030
[INAUDIBLE]
755
00:33:29,030 --> 00:33:29,950
Ocarina of Time.
756
00:33:29,950 --> 00:33:33,090
I think there's a couple on
Gamasutra, exactly when that
757
00:33:33,090 --> 00:33:35,367
sounds plays is a decision
that was
758
00:33:35,367 --> 00:33:36,920
very carefully designed.
759
00:33:36,920 --> 00:33:39,750
And it seems to me that in
digital puzzles those kinds
760
00:33:39,750 --> 00:33:42,620
of, especially in some sort of
narrative structure like in
761
00:33:42,620 --> 00:33:45,680
Ocarina, that's the big problem
762
00:33:45,680 --> 00:33:46,470
that you have to solve.
763
00:33:46,470 --> 00:33:47,660
You have to give enough clues.
764
00:33:47,660 --> 00:33:49,880
You have to give enough
UI feedback.
765
00:33:49,880 --> 00:33:53,600
And you have to think about your
UI so hard in a way that
766
00:33:53,600 --> 00:33:56,190
is going to make it possible
so that we get all the
767
00:33:56,190 --> 00:33:56,910
information [INAUDIBLE].
768
00:33:56,910 --> 00:34:01,580
So, say that burning fire tree
situation, if there is nowhere
769
00:34:01,580 --> 00:34:04,615
else in the world where you can
get that information, then
770
00:34:04,615 --> 00:34:05,690
it's back inside puzzle.
771
00:34:05,690 --> 00:34:09,010
If there is a guy in--
772
00:34:09,010 --> 00:34:09,850
I can't remember Zelda I--
773
00:34:09,850 --> 00:34:12,699
but there is a guy who actually
tells you that that's
774
00:34:12,699 --> 00:34:13,949
the tree that you
need to burn.
775
00:34:13,949 --> 00:34:16,627
But if it's not obvious,
especially for someone who
776
00:34:16,627 --> 00:34:18,730
hasn't encountered that guy,
that that's where you get that
777
00:34:18,730 --> 00:34:20,750
information it's still a
bad designed puzzle.
778
00:34:20,750 --> 00:34:23,260
Even though now there's
a solution.
779
00:34:23,260 --> 00:34:27,000
But thinking about, and some
examples will be in a lot of
780
00:34:27,000 --> 00:34:30,645
tech space adventures as well
as text heavy graphical
781
00:34:30,645 --> 00:34:31,610
adventures.
782
00:34:31,610 --> 00:34:35,260
You have a, I can't solve this
puzzle, but what my character
783
00:34:35,260 --> 00:34:39,090
says to the player about why you
can't solve the puzzle is
784
00:34:39,090 --> 00:34:40,250
itself a clue.
785
00:34:40,250 --> 00:34:44,218
It's like, hm, I must not
have the right item.
786
00:34:44,218 --> 00:34:46,110
Maybe there's something
else I can use.
787
00:34:46,110 --> 00:34:48,016
That's a huge clue.
788
00:34:48,016 --> 00:34:50,553
AUDIENCE: I feel like digital
popular games have gotten
789
00:34:50,553 --> 00:34:56,120
really good at integrating hint
systems in recent years.
790
00:34:56,120 --> 00:34:59,420
But I can't think of any
physical puzzles that I've
791
00:34:59,420 --> 00:35:05,465
come across that may just not
have quite been up to speed
792
00:35:05,465 --> 00:35:06,685
with crossword puzzles.
793
00:35:06,685 --> 00:35:11,690
That have that kind of not
totally revealing the solution
794
00:35:11,690 --> 00:35:14,002
but giving you a gradual
hint which can help
795
00:35:14,002 --> 00:35:15,496
you figure it out.
796
00:35:15,496 --> 00:35:20,560
AUDIENCE: Well, mystery puzzles
kind of do that.
797
00:35:20,560 --> 00:35:21,810
[INTERPOSING VOICES]
798
00:35:21,810 --> 00:35:23,930
799
00:35:23,930 --> 00:35:26,515
PROFESSOR: Describe the mystery
puzzle for folks who
800
00:35:26,515 --> 00:35:26,920
don't have--
801
00:35:26,920 --> 00:35:30,740
AUDIENCE: It's basically, it's
a competition run by MIT over
802
00:35:30,740 --> 00:35:34,890
IAP where teams of people
compete to solve a bunch of
803
00:35:34,890 --> 00:35:38,085
puzzles, like 70 puzzles, that
kind of build on each other.
804
00:35:38,085 --> 00:35:40,310
So you have, say,
20 base puzzles.
805
00:35:40,310 --> 00:35:41,947
And if you solve those
20 puzzles you
806
00:35:41,947 --> 00:35:43,255
get 20 words as solutions.
807
00:35:43,255 --> 00:35:45,860
And then those 20 words become
a new puzzle, and that's the
808
00:35:45,860 --> 00:35:46,790
meta-puzzle.
809
00:35:46,790 --> 00:35:48,460
And it kind of keeps them like
that for a couple layers.
810
00:35:48,460 --> 00:35:50,770
But the point is the winning
team from the previous year
811
00:35:50,770 --> 00:35:52,950
writes the next year's
mystery hunt.
812
00:35:52,950 --> 00:35:55,310
So you get all kinds of varying
puzzles of varying
813
00:35:55,310 --> 00:35:57,610
difficulties and styles.
814
00:35:57,610 --> 00:36:00,060
A very well-designed puzzle
actually does that, because
815
00:36:00,060 --> 00:36:01,530
you have this thing
called, flavor--
816
00:36:01,530 --> 00:36:03,840
Oh, I guess I should say that
the puzzles aren't like Sudoku
817
00:36:03,840 --> 00:36:05,300
or crosswords.
818
00:36:05,300 --> 00:36:07,730
You literally just get something
on a screen or
819
00:36:07,730 --> 00:36:09,580
something on a piece of paper,
and you have to figure out
820
00:36:09,580 --> 00:36:10,190
what to do with it.
821
00:36:10,190 --> 00:36:11,861
You're not given any
instructions for how to solve
822
00:36:11,861 --> 00:36:12,750
it whatsoever.
823
00:36:12,750 --> 00:36:15,780
And the only clues you get are
either by the title of the
824
00:36:15,780 --> 00:36:18,970
puzzle, by the group of puzzles
that it's in, or by
825
00:36:18,970 --> 00:36:20,610
this thing called flavor text.
826
00:36:20,610 --> 00:36:23,480
Which is like, they say some
kind of random phrase that
827
00:36:23,480 --> 00:36:25,360
seems to not have anything
to do with anything.
828
00:36:25,360 --> 00:36:28,140
But that kind of gives you a
clue about what to do in the
829
00:36:28,140 --> 00:36:29,846
thick of this puzzle.
830
00:36:29,846 --> 00:36:31,680
So that's kind of like what
you were describing.
831
00:36:31,680 --> 00:36:33,380
AUDIENCE: That's interesting,
because it's really
832
00:36:33,380 --> 00:36:36,022
challenging when you don't have
any mechanism for giving
833
00:36:36,022 --> 00:36:39,860
feedback to the person who
is working a puzzle.
834
00:36:39,860 --> 00:36:42,860
In Zelda, or what have you, you
can see that they've spent
835
00:36:42,860 --> 00:36:46,410
a long time dicking around.
836
00:36:46,410 --> 00:36:49,551
PROFESSOR: It's kind of a
double-edged sword, in that
837
00:36:49,551 --> 00:36:51,380
particular case, because you
have so many mechanisms and
838
00:36:51,380 --> 00:36:57,050
now you're expected to use all
of them in a game like that.
839
00:36:57,050 --> 00:37:00,386
You use sound, you have to use
contextual buttons, you have
840
00:37:00,386 --> 00:37:02,896
to use the inventory.
841
00:37:02,896 --> 00:37:06,180
The position of the player
matters or something.
842
00:37:06,180 --> 00:37:09,182
I've seen games where the main
clues is what is the character
843
00:37:09,182 --> 00:37:11,270
looking at, for instance.
844
00:37:11,270 --> 00:37:13,333
And you walk around, why does my
character keep looking that
845
00:37:13,333 --> 00:37:14,660
way every time something
happens?
846
00:37:14,660 --> 00:37:15,750
Oh, that's because--
847
00:37:15,750 --> 00:37:17,470
you know.
848
00:37:17,470 --> 00:37:22,490
So, yeah, as far as of a lot of
physical stuff, I would say
849
00:37:22,490 --> 00:37:26,120
that one of the reasons is
they're just starting to build
850
00:37:26,120 --> 00:37:27,420
these physical games
from toys.
851
00:37:27,420 --> 00:37:31,080
852
00:37:31,080 --> 00:37:34,490
A lot of the importance is,
a lot of things you could
853
00:37:34,490 --> 00:37:37,650
possibly do, are kind of built
into the physical object.
854
00:37:37,650 --> 00:37:40,650
And if you're building a puzzle
based on what you could
855
00:37:40,650 --> 00:37:44,920
do with these things as a toy,
then you're necessarily
856
00:37:44,920 --> 00:37:48,772
already using the constraints of
what you can do with it as
857
00:37:48,772 --> 00:37:52,546
a toy in order to create
the puzzle.
858
00:37:52,546 --> 00:37:55,480
859
00:37:55,480 --> 00:37:59,080
This might be a good exercise
actually, if time--
860
00:37:59,080 --> 00:38:00,490
we could take a shot at this.
861
00:38:00,490 --> 00:38:01,930
And just by, you know, trying
to come up with
862
00:38:01,930 --> 00:38:03,080
a puzzle and see.
863
00:38:03,080 --> 00:38:06,870
But instead of imagining one
in a digital space, try to
864
00:38:06,870 --> 00:38:07,620
imagine one in a
physical space.
865
00:38:07,620 --> 00:38:12,680
Because I suspect what you
actually get is, you get a
866
00:38:12,680 --> 00:38:14,880
free language with
physical puzzles.
867
00:38:14,880 --> 00:38:18,998
Because things physically have
interactions that we
868
00:38:18,998 --> 00:38:21,413
[INAUDIBLE] from a
digital puzzle.
869
00:38:21,413 --> 00:38:26,170
ADAM: I feel like Coral Reef
or something, and that's a
870
00:38:26,170 --> 00:38:30,770
game where like the puzzle--
871
00:38:30,770 --> 00:38:33,480
I mean obviously it's still a
digital game-- but the puzzles
872
00:38:33,480 --> 00:38:34,610
are very much physical
puzzles.
873
00:38:34,610 --> 00:38:37,310
Like you kind of have
an idea about what--
874
00:38:37,310 --> 00:38:39,940
has Patrick played Portal,
of course?
875
00:38:39,940 --> 00:38:42,390
Or know the idea?
876
00:38:42,390 --> 00:38:46,540
I mean, you have these two
portals and you understand
877
00:38:46,540 --> 00:38:48,310
what the physics is
going to be like.
878
00:38:48,310 --> 00:38:50,590
So the puzzles aren't
frustrating in the sense that
879
00:38:50,590 --> 00:38:52,635
it's like, oh, you realize
there's this
880
00:38:52,635 --> 00:38:53,420
random statue here.
881
00:38:53,420 --> 00:38:56,610
And if you pull the lever it
raises the water level or
882
00:38:56,610 --> 00:38:59,680
something like that.
883
00:38:59,680 --> 00:39:01,610
But it's very intuitive.
884
00:39:01,610 --> 00:39:04,800
It feels like a physical puzzle
in a sense that I know
885
00:39:04,800 --> 00:39:06,900
what will happen if I do this.
886
00:39:06,900 --> 00:39:09,470
And I just figure out how to
put the pieces together.
887
00:39:09,470 --> 00:39:12,290
And also Portal what I think it
does a really good job of,
888
00:39:12,290 --> 00:39:15,720
as well as some physical
puzzles do, is having a
889
00:39:15,720 --> 00:39:16,545
learning curve.
890
00:39:16,545 --> 00:39:20,430
Like Tangram will have some
basic puzzles, or I'm sure the
891
00:39:20,430 --> 00:39:21,691
falling thing, a lot
of them do it.
892
00:39:21,691 --> 00:39:25,255
Physical puzzle things where you
like, I don't know, how to
893
00:39:25,255 --> 00:39:28,240
jump over pieces or whatever,
have basic levels--
894
00:39:28,240 --> 00:39:30,260
basic boards--
895
00:39:30,260 --> 00:39:32,810
where they show you various
techniques.
896
00:39:32,810 --> 00:39:34,410
And you only have to figure out
one technique, and it's
897
00:39:34,410 --> 00:39:35,460
very obvious what
you have to do.
898
00:39:35,460 --> 00:39:37,530
And later on you have to
use those techniques.
899
00:39:37,530 --> 00:39:40,530
PROFESSOR: Well in Tickle Her,
this particular example does
900
00:39:40,530 --> 00:39:42,520
something that multiple portals
does really well.
901
00:39:42,520 --> 00:39:45,710
Is that the very first puzzle
that we did earlier only has
902
00:39:45,710 --> 00:39:46,650
one solution.
903
00:39:46,650 --> 00:39:50,185
And you do not get that solution
unless you understand
904
00:39:50,185 --> 00:39:51,550
all the mechanics of the game.
905
00:39:51,550 --> 00:39:53,110
But we tried to solve
it a whole bunch
906
00:39:53,110 --> 00:39:53,430
of different times.
907
00:39:53,430 --> 00:39:55,220
And it's like because we didn't
quite understand the
908
00:39:55,220 --> 00:39:57,868
rules, we couldn't get it
until we understood the
909
00:39:57,868 --> 00:39:58,760
mechanics of the game.
910
00:39:58,760 --> 00:40:00,150
Now we can suddenly solve it.
911
00:40:00,150 --> 00:40:03,767
So from puzzle number two
onwards, we can't be confident
912
00:40:03,767 --> 00:40:05,138
unless you know it.
913
00:40:05,138 --> 00:40:06,970
Portal, and even--
914
00:40:06,970 --> 00:40:09,210
actually just about any
well-designed game-- but I
915
00:40:09,210 --> 00:40:11,160
would say Portal is a fine
example-- if you've beaten a
916
00:40:11,160 --> 00:40:13,490
game, you can play through the
game again with developer
917
00:40:13,490 --> 00:40:15,640
commentary.
918
00:40:15,640 --> 00:40:19,780
And when you show that, you
actually realize that every
919
00:40:19,780 --> 00:40:24,070
single fairly intuitive physical
thing that you pick
920
00:40:24,070 --> 00:40:26,490
up in the game had to
be taught to you.
921
00:40:26,490 --> 00:40:28,700
And they've designed the
level very clearly.
922
00:40:28,700 --> 00:40:30,920
So right in the beginning of
the game, if folks can't
923
00:40:30,920 --> 00:40:33,950
remember, you're trapped
in the middle cell.
924
00:40:33,950 --> 00:40:41,410
And the GlaDOS talk to you, and
a portal opens and you can
925
00:40:41,410 --> 00:40:42,230
walk through it.
926
00:40:42,230 --> 00:40:44,935
What do you see out of the
first portal that opens?
927
00:40:44,935 --> 00:40:46,830
AUDIENCE: You see yourself
going into the other one.
928
00:40:46,830 --> 00:40:47,800
PROFESSOR: You see
yourself going
929
00:40:47,800 --> 00:40:48,720
through the other portal.
930
00:40:48,720 --> 00:40:53,180
And it's like, they force you
to have to look at what the
931
00:40:53,180 --> 00:40:55,390
basic game mechanic is going
to be before you can do
932
00:40:55,390 --> 00:40:57,580
anything else that's productive
in the game.
933
00:40:57,580 --> 00:40:59,440
You know, you can pick
up the radio, but--
934
00:40:59,440 --> 00:41:02,230
935
00:41:02,230 --> 00:41:06,130
So that was a design decision.
936
00:41:06,130 --> 00:41:08,860
They could have decided
not to make it.
937
00:41:08,860 --> 00:41:10,690
They could have just made you
go through that into a
938
00:41:10,690 --> 00:41:14,130
different room, and the learning
opportunity would
939
00:41:14,130 --> 00:41:16,050
have dissolved right there.
940
00:41:16,050 --> 00:41:19,335
So if you've got a copy of
Portal, I would suggest go
941
00:41:19,335 --> 00:41:21,490
back and page through
the commentaries
942
00:41:21,490 --> 00:41:23,670
because they are hilarious.
943
00:41:23,670 --> 00:41:28,350
And you're also rereading good
form, demonstrating in this
944
00:41:28,350 --> 00:41:30,390
room, this is what we had
to do in order to
945
00:41:30,390 --> 00:41:32,025
make people get it.
946
00:41:32,025 --> 00:41:35,490
I'm also thinking of games like
Mario World I where you
947
00:41:35,490 --> 00:41:39,332
don't get very far on
this kind of basic
948
00:41:39,332 --> 00:41:41,020
game mechanics now.
949
00:41:41,020 --> 00:41:44,682
But they make it really gentle
in that I don't think there
950
00:41:44,682 --> 00:41:47,880
are any hits that instantly
kill you.
951
00:41:47,880 --> 00:41:50,340
AUDIENCE: That's exactly what
I was thinking in Mario.
952
00:41:50,340 --> 00:41:53,195
In the first Gamasutra article
we read on late-game
953
00:41:53,195 --> 00:41:56,042
abstractions, we read
about a Mario world.
954
00:41:56,042 --> 00:41:59,444
He's like, we expect the same
kind of actions, key the
955
00:41:59,444 --> 00:42:00,902
system, all the time-jumping.
956
00:42:00,902 --> 00:42:03,818
And I guess you can kind of
look at different things
957
00:42:03,818 --> 00:42:04,790
there, like double-jumping.
958
00:42:04,790 --> 00:42:06,248
And things like that in
a specific puzzle.
959
00:42:06,248 --> 00:42:08,010
And the physical [INAUDIBLE]
also.
960
00:42:08,010 --> 00:42:11,380
PROFESSOR: I mean a lot of
Mario's worlds are laid out
961
00:42:11,380 --> 00:42:13,980
basically as spatial
puzzles, right?
962
00:42:13,980 --> 00:42:16,680
It's like you know you have to
get there, but you don't know
963
00:42:16,680 --> 00:42:19,075
exactly how you're going to use
all of the mechanics that
964
00:42:19,075 --> 00:42:19,844
you've got.
965
00:42:19,844 --> 00:42:25,220
AUDIENCE: In Mario 64, I think
their way of solving the
966
00:42:25,220 --> 00:42:28,355
impasse problem of not locking
up all the content in the game
967
00:42:28,355 --> 00:42:30,520
because of the one puzzle you
can't get, they're giving you
968
00:42:30,520 --> 00:42:33,680
so much to do that even if they
don't really tell you--
969
00:42:33,680 --> 00:42:36,106
even if a good 30%, 40% are
going to remain mysterious to
970
00:42:36,106 --> 00:42:38,050
you, you're not really going
to figure them out--
971
00:42:38,050 --> 00:42:40,800
there's so much [INAUDIBLE]
between, you never walked off
972
00:42:40,800 --> 00:42:42,106
with a significant amount
of content.
973
00:42:42,106 --> 00:42:45,170
PROFESSOR: So if you've got a
hub-like structure you can do
974
00:42:45,170 --> 00:42:48,360
any one of five different things
at any given time.
975
00:42:48,360 --> 00:42:51,960
Plus you have some secondary
solutions, like you can always
976
00:42:51,960 --> 00:42:54,450
go back to a world that you've
been to before and try to
977
00:42:54,450 --> 00:42:56,780
collect all the stars,
for instance.
978
00:42:56,780 --> 00:42:59,700
I think that's kind of what
Brenda was kind of indicating.
979
00:42:59,700 --> 00:43:03,630
You don't necessarily want, if
you're putting puzzles in your
980
00:43:03,630 --> 00:43:05,870
game, she was advocating for--
981
00:43:05,870 --> 00:43:08,860
Brenda and Ian were
advocating for--
982
00:43:08,860 --> 00:43:13,160
something that wouldn't
necessarily progress
983
00:43:13,160 --> 00:43:14,390
on to the next one.
984
00:43:14,390 --> 00:43:20,220
But I think that's not
a requirement.
985
00:43:20,220 --> 00:43:23,400
I think that's a, if you want to
make your life easier, this
986
00:43:23,400 --> 00:43:24,225
is what you do.
987
00:43:24,225 --> 00:43:27,600
If you decide that you're up to
the task, you can achieve
988
00:43:27,600 --> 00:43:30,980
some really amazing effects
by having your puzzles
989
00:43:30,980 --> 00:43:33,075
narratively incorporate it.
990
00:43:33,075 --> 00:43:36,340
991
00:43:36,340 --> 00:43:38,840
Has anyone heard of the game
called Eternal Darkness?
992
00:43:38,840 --> 00:43:44,235
It's a sort of Lovecraftian
horror game on the GameCube.
993
00:43:44,235 --> 00:43:47,200
I'll sort of describe it, but
basically the whole basic idea
994
00:43:47,200 --> 00:43:52,180
is that you have four gods all
warring against each other.
995
00:43:52,180 --> 00:43:54,450
Three of them hate one of them,
but then those three
996
00:43:54,450 --> 00:43:55,480
also hate each other.
997
00:43:55,480 --> 00:43:58,750
And most of the puzzles are
just sort of understanding
998
00:43:58,750 --> 00:44:03,010
that there is this
mystical object.
999
00:44:03,010 --> 00:44:06,310
One god defeats another god
defeats another god in a rock,
1000
00:44:06,310 --> 00:44:07,300
paper, scissors circle.
1001
00:44:07,300 --> 00:44:10,500
And all of them hate this
one other [INAUDIBLE].
1002
00:44:10,500 --> 00:44:14,900
So early on in the game there
is actually a puzzle, there
1003
00:44:14,900 --> 00:44:17,100
are actually a number of
different puzzles, where you
1004
00:44:17,100 --> 00:44:18,020
see the symbols of these gods.
1005
00:44:18,020 --> 00:44:19,602
And you have to kind
of rearrange them
1006
00:44:19,602 --> 00:44:21,190
in the correct order.
1007
00:44:21,190 --> 00:44:23,800
And the rest of the game is all
going to be variations of
1008
00:44:23,800 --> 00:44:26,320
understanding what these
gods do to each other.
1009
00:44:26,320 --> 00:44:29,000
So those are all puzzles
that inform you of
1010
00:44:29,000 --> 00:44:32,132
how the world works.
1011
00:44:32,132 --> 00:44:34,640
And that kind of works
in two ways.
1012
00:44:34,640 --> 00:44:37,195
One, information that you've
already gathered about the
1013
00:44:37,195 --> 00:44:39,390
world-- about how this
world works--
1014
00:44:39,390 --> 00:44:42,390
gives you clues on how
to beat the puzzles.
1015
00:44:42,390 --> 00:44:44,650
Beating the puzzles, finding the
solutions for the clues,
1016
00:44:44,650 --> 00:44:46,810
gives you information about
how the world works.
1017
00:44:46,810 --> 00:44:49,740
And that's kind of like the
holy grail for a puzzle
1018
00:44:49,740 --> 00:44:52,710
designer in a digital game, is
that you're going to design a
1019
00:44:52,710 --> 00:44:55,130
puzzle that's going to reinforce
how the world works.
1020
00:44:55,130 --> 00:44:57,535
There's a chap--
1021
00:44:57,535 --> 00:45:00,175
who gave a talk, and I believe
his name is Jeff Howard.
1022
00:45:00,175 --> 00:45:05,290
He came to Camp [INAUDIBLE]
and gave a talk last year.
1023
00:45:05,290 --> 00:45:11,240
And he makes this case that
games, and the logic that you
1024
00:45:11,240 --> 00:45:19,750
present in games, do basically
the equivalent of what magic
1025
00:45:19,750 --> 00:45:22,370
systems actually do
in the real world.
1026
00:45:22,370 --> 00:45:28,530
What people like cultists or
astrologers do is they
1027
00:45:28,530 --> 00:45:35,340
basically give you logics
that explain how the
1028
00:45:35,340 --> 00:45:36,750
world is going to work.
1029
00:45:36,750 --> 00:45:39,012
And while that may not
necessarily be obvious, but if
1030
00:45:39,012 --> 00:45:41,420
it is viewed as a whole
knowledge you'll be able to
1031
00:45:41,420 --> 00:45:42,520
understand how it's [INAUDIBLE]
in you.
1032
00:45:42,520 --> 00:45:46,081
But more importantly you'd be
able to do things in the world
1033
00:45:46,081 --> 00:45:50,250
that allow you to accomplish
things that you wouldn't
1034
00:45:50,250 --> 00:45:51,420
otherwise do.
1035
00:45:51,420 --> 00:45:54,690
Learning a game is very much
like that, it's like I don't
1036
00:45:54,690 --> 00:45:56,580
know how this world works but
if I understood these
1037
00:45:56,580 --> 00:45:58,520
particular rules I
could be able to
1038
00:45:58,520 --> 00:46:01,180
accomplish greater things.
1039
00:46:01,180 --> 00:46:04,210
And puzzles can be one
of those things where
1040
00:46:04,210 --> 00:46:05,390
it becomes a test.
1041
00:46:05,390 --> 00:46:07,560
And it becomes a test of, just
exactly how well do you
1042
00:46:07,560 --> 00:46:08,850
understand this?
1043
00:46:08,850 --> 00:46:14,010
Even if it is like in a combat
game like Quake or God of War
1044
00:46:14,010 --> 00:46:15,030
or something.
1045
00:46:15,030 --> 00:46:17,710
I can understand how the combat
system basically works
1046
00:46:17,710 --> 00:46:20,088
if I just keep mashing the
x button or something.
1047
00:46:20,088 --> 00:46:23,200
Or just shoot everything
with rockets.
1048
00:46:23,200 --> 00:46:25,430
But if I really, really
understand the combat system,
1049
00:46:25,430 --> 00:46:27,390
I might be able to hit something
that I wouldn't
1050
00:46:27,390 --> 00:46:31,926
necessarily be able to hit.
1051
00:46:31,926 --> 00:46:36,900
I might be able to take down a
horde of enemies instead of
1052
00:46:36,900 --> 00:46:39,220
hitting them down
one at a time.
1053
00:46:39,220 --> 00:46:40,670
I might be able to
beat a boss.
1054
00:46:40,670 --> 00:46:43,940
And actually a lot of boss
battles in digital games are
1055
00:46:43,940 --> 00:46:44,760
actually puzzles.
1056
00:46:44,760 --> 00:46:48,700
There's not, how well do you
generally react, it's can you
1057
00:46:48,700 --> 00:46:50,740
figure out the pattern.
1058
00:46:50,740 --> 00:46:54,360
But that pattern doesn't mean
anything unless [INAUDIBLE]
1059
00:46:54,360 --> 00:46:57,370
how all your other combat
skills work.
1060
00:46:57,370 --> 00:47:01,930
So a boss battle in Zelda only
makes sense if you figured out
1061
00:47:01,930 --> 00:47:04,420
how that one item that you
picked up in that dungeon
1062
00:47:04,420 --> 00:47:07,010
works really, really well.
1063
00:47:07,010 --> 00:47:08,320
OK, it shoots fire.
1064
00:47:08,320 --> 00:47:11,890
That means that not only does it
hurt them from distance, it
1065
00:47:11,890 --> 00:47:14,110
also lights some of the
things on fire.
1066
00:47:14,110 --> 00:47:16,880
And that's what I'll tell the
boss, basically, is combining
1067
00:47:16,880 --> 00:47:19,700
this leaders ability
to hook up.
1068
00:47:19,700 --> 00:47:22,050
Like everything else that
you've done before
1069
00:47:22,050 --> 00:47:23,120
into taking it out.
1070
00:47:23,120 --> 00:47:26,015
That's why boss battles, that
always kind of puzzled me.
1071
00:47:26,015 --> 00:47:28,997
1072
00:47:28,997 --> 00:47:31,500
AUDIENCE: One thing I wanted
to say, before I get going,
1073
00:47:31,500 --> 00:47:34,210
you were asking about hints
and a physical puzzle.
1074
00:47:34,210 --> 00:47:38,240
The one thing that jumped to my
mind was a couple years ago
1075
00:47:38,240 --> 00:47:39,370
the weekly Day--
1076
00:47:39,370 --> 00:47:41,040
I don't know if anyone
reads it, it's like
1077
00:47:41,040 --> 00:47:42,030
a free Boston newspaper.
1078
00:47:42,030 --> 00:47:43,373
And they always have
crossword puzzles.
1079
00:47:43,373 --> 00:47:47,240
For the longest time they were
thematic, and so you would
1080
00:47:47,240 --> 00:47:49,260
have a guest crossword.
1081
00:47:49,260 --> 00:47:52,143
The first one I ever
did was Hulk Hogan.
1082
00:47:52,143 --> 00:47:55,800
So all of the hints in the
crossword puzzles are related
1083
00:47:55,800 --> 00:47:56,640
to Hulk Hogan.
1084
00:47:56,640 --> 00:47:59,320
So it's a question of, not what
does this mean to me but
1085
00:47:59,320 --> 00:48:02,740
what would it mean
to Hulk Hogan?
1086
00:48:02,740 --> 00:48:05,480
And they don't do it anymore,
which is really depressing,
1087
00:48:05,480 --> 00:48:08,560
because every week it was
something different and it was
1088
00:48:08,560 --> 00:48:10,735
like a built-in hand
write as you went.
1089
00:48:10,735 --> 00:48:13,465
You didn't just pick them out
literally, you have to kind of
1090
00:48:13,465 --> 00:48:13,920
contextualize it.
1091
00:48:13,920 --> 00:48:16,450
PROFESSOR: You can think about
all the things that come with
1092
00:48:16,450 --> 00:48:19,890
the puzzle, that potential
hook, [INAUDIBLE].
1093
00:48:19,890 --> 00:48:22,808
Like a title, like a data
text-- as you were
1094
00:48:22,808 --> 00:48:27,740
describing-- the fact that you
get in puzzle and mystery
1095
00:48:27,740 --> 00:48:29,490
crimes, they may be
[UNINTELLIGIBLE] and they may
1096
00:48:29,490 --> 00:48:32,830
be disillusioned but it lies
on a different puzzle.
1097
00:48:32,830 --> 00:48:35,630
Not the one I'm currently
looking at right now, because
1098
00:48:35,630 --> 00:48:36,880
that's how [UNINTELLIGIBLE].
1099
00:48:36,880 --> 00:48:41,860
1100
00:48:41,860 --> 00:48:46,290
Metal Gear Solid has a really,
really bizarre one where--
1101
00:48:46,290 --> 00:48:48,145
AUDIENCE: Look in
the back case.
1102
00:48:48,145 --> 00:48:50,890
PROFESSOR: Where they tell you,
oh, there's a specific
1103
00:48:50,890 --> 00:48:52,750
radio frequency that you need.
1104
00:48:52,750 --> 00:48:53,780
It's written in the
back of box.
1105
00:48:53,780 --> 00:48:56,560
And it's like, the
back of the box?
1106
00:48:56,560 --> 00:48:57,556
AUDIENCE: [INAUDIBLE]
1107
00:48:57,556 --> 00:48:58,060
Anti-piracy.
1108
00:48:58,060 --> 00:49:00,920
PROFESSOR: Yes, but it's
still a puzzle.
1109
00:49:00,920 --> 00:49:02,485
And I was like, I know
how to solve that.
1110
00:49:02,485 --> 00:49:05,800
I mean, it was pretty obvious,
because maybe it's just me,
1111
00:49:05,800 --> 00:49:09,200
because it about half an hour
to figure that one out.
1112
00:49:09,200 --> 00:49:10,180
It took me some effort.
1113
00:49:10,180 --> 00:49:12,750
AUDIENCE: I mean Metal
Gear Solid a lot of
1114
00:49:12,750 --> 00:49:14,200
meta-puzzles like that.
1115
00:49:14,200 --> 00:49:17,910
Like when you fought Psycho
Mantis for the first time.
1116
00:49:17,910 --> 00:49:20,925
Well, so the scene you had to do
is you went to unplug your
1117
00:49:20,925 --> 00:49:22,610
controller and plug it into
the second port because he
1118
00:49:22,610 --> 00:49:24,620
would read your movements.
1119
00:49:24,620 --> 00:49:28,850
And it was this cool, physical
layer of it where you're
1120
00:49:28,850 --> 00:49:29,490
playing the game.
1121
00:49:29,490 --> 00:49:31,510
Then you realize I have to
interact with the physical
1122
00:49:31,510 --> 00:49:33,420
world so that he can't
see what I'm doing.
1123
00:49:33,420 --> 00:49:36,100
PROFESSOR: But that one
[? cannot do, ?]
1124
00:49:36,100 --> 00:49:40,770
because in that particular
example that one gave you a
1125
00:49:40,770 --> 00:49:44,600
very big clue because right at
the beginning of that match
1126
00:49:44,600 --> 00:49:46,920
that boss tells you to put your
control on the ground.
1127
00:49:46,920 --> 00:49:48,860
And he says, I'm going
to control this
1128
00:49:48,860 --> 00:49:49,840
controller with my mind.
1129
00:49:49,840 --> 00:49:52,210
And actually, just
[INAUDIBLE].
1130
00:49:52,210 --> 00:49:53,810
AUDIENCE: That's only if
you have dualtech.
1131
00:49:53,810 --> 00:49:57,480
So, because on PlayStation,
if you didn't he just
1132
00:49:57,480 --> 00:49:58,390
ignored that part.
1133
00:49:58,390 --> 00:50:00,750
And you didn't get
that clue at all.
1134
00:50:00,750 --> 00:50:02,695
PROFESSOR: Yeah, and
that's a problem.
1135
00:50:02,695 --> 00:50:04,536
But it's still very cool.
1136
00:50:04,536 --> 00:50:09,060
AUDIENCE: There were other
clues, like you would talk
1137
00:50:09,060 --> 00:50:11,830
about how you had been playing
certain games by reading saves
1138
00:50:11,830 --> 00:50:13,920
on your [INAUDIBLE].
1139
00:50:13,920 --> 00:50:15,590
At least not in Castlevania.
1140
00:50:15,590 --> 00:50:17,630
I just remember being like--
1141
00:50:17,630 --> 00:50:17,895
[INAUDIBLE].
1142
00:50:17,895 --> 00:50:22,390
PROFESSOR: So basically it's
giving you a clue that there's
1143
00:50:22,390 --> 00:50:24,310
got to be something better
about the way that you're
1144
00:50:24,310 --> 00:50:25,296
currently playing.
1145
00:50:25,296 --> 00:50:29,130
The funny thing about the radio
channel is that one
1146
00:50:29,130 --> 00:50:31,050
really did not give you
any clue that there
1147
00:50:31,050 --> 00:50:31,630
was something better.
1148
00:50:31,630 --> 00:50:34,130
It just told you about
the back of the box.
1149
00:50:34,130 --> 00:50:38,672
It was like, it didn't tell you
the back of the video game
1150
00:50:38,672 --> 00:50:39,550
case, right.
1151
00:50:39,550 --> 00:50:40,870
It's not going to be
that specific.
1152
00:50:40,870 --> 00:50:43,800
AUDIENCE: It said CD
case, specifically.
1153
00:50:43,800 --> 00:50:47,394
I was really confused, because I
think mine came in a slip of
1154
00:50:47,394 --> 00:50:48,602
paper or something.
1155
00:50:48,602 --> 00:50:50,650
AUDIENCE: Yeah, if you buy
it used or something.
1156
00:50:50,650 --> 00:50:53,590
PROFESSOR: Yeah, so it's
anti-used game
1157
00:50:53,590 --> 00:50:54,560
protection, as well.
1158
00:50:54,560 --> 00:50:58,176
But yeah, mine was I think I
actually said on the back of
1159
00:50:58,176 --> 00:51:00,384
the CD case, but I was playing
like a [INAUDIBLE] or
1160
00:51:00,384 --> 00:51:03,040
something and that came
in the DVD case.
1161
00:51:03,040 --> 00:51:05,680
So I didn't make a connection.
1162
00:51:05,680 --> 00:51:10,010
But if you look at the back of
it, you see what the radio
1163
00:51:10,010 --> 00:51:14,090
frequency is in the
screenshot.
1164
00:51:14,090 --> 00:51:17,590
One of the eight screenshots
that they show to demonstrate
1165
00:51:17,590 --> 00:51:20,180
this is what the game is all
about, there's the number and
1166
00:51:20,180 --> 00:51:21,660
it's just right in there.
1167
00:51:21,660 --> 00:51:24,380
And then key it in.
1168
00:51:24,380 --> 00:51:27,665
AUDIENCE: Has anyone played any
of those breakout games?
1169
00:51:27,665 --> 00:51:30,830
Where it's lock you in a
room and you have to--
1170
00:51:30,830 --> 00:51:33,316
[INTERPOSING VOICES]
1171
00:51:33,316 --> 00:51:36,910
AUDIENCE: Yeah, you find the
thing, you find a slip of
1172
00:51:36,910 --> 00:51:38,300
paper and escape [INAUDIBLE].
1173
00:51:38,300 --> 00:51:42,670
PROFESSOR: So, actually
who doesn't know
1174
00:51:42,670 --> 00:51:43,976
what these are about?
1175
00:51:43,976 --> 00:51:44,892
Escape the room.
1176
00:51:44,892 --> 00:51:49,764
OK, so escape the room--
actually, could we bring up
1177
00:51:49,764 --> 00:51:51,210
something on your computer?
1178
00:51:51,210 --> 00:51:52,656
AUDIENCE: I have to go
grab the video thing.
1179
00:51:52,656 --> 00:51:54,102
PROFESSOR: Oh, the
video cable.
1180
00:51:54,102 --> 00:51:55,820
AUDIENCE: It's back there
in my office.
1181
00:51:55,820 --> 00:51:57,519
PROFESSOR: Oh, OK cool.
1182
00:51:57,519 --> 00:52:00,200
Call [? Becky ?] to send it.
1183
00:52:00,200 --> 00:52:02,420
Escape the room games are
typically flash games.
1184
00:52:02,420 --> 00:52:07,150
And they're kind of like
adventure games because
1185
00:52:07,150 --> 00:52:10,250
there's usually only one room,
although sometimes you have
1186
00:52:10,250 --> 00:52:10,720
multiple rooms.
1187
00:52:10,720 --> 00:52:12,870
It's a much smaller world
in most adventure games.
1188
00:52:12,870 --> 00:52:14,100
But the basic idea
is the same.
1189
00:52:14,100 --> 00:52:20,390
You pick up objects, you use
objects in a room, and you try
1190
00:52:20,390 --> 00:52:21,050
to make things happen.
1191
00:52:21,050 --> 00:52:24,490
You know, if you haven't made
anything, you are not
1192
00:52:24,490 --> 00:52:25,360
progressing in the game.
1193
00:52:25,360 --> 00:52:27,560
If you made something happen,
you are almost always making
1194
00:52:27,560 --> 00:52:29,870
forward progress in the game.
1195
00:52:29,870 --> 00:52:33,965
And there is, actually, a guide
for playing adventure
1196
00:52:33,965 --> 00:52:38,850
games written by Roberta
Williams, who did the Original
1197
00:52:38,850 --> 00:52:39,480
King's Quest series.
1198
00:52:39,480 --> 00:52:43,640
And her guide is like, pick-up
everything, go everywhere, use
1199
00:52:43,640 --> 00:52:46,020
everything on everything.
1200
00:52:46,020 --> 00:52:47,450
That's actually what escape
the room really is.
1201
00:52:47,450 --> 00:52:49,460
But there's a little bit more to
escape the room games, but
1202
00:52:49,460 --> 00:52:51,420
there's just not that many
things that you can explore.
1203
00:52:51,420 --> 00:52:55,120
That's the idea is that you're
stuck in a room.
1204
00:52:55,120 --> 00:52:58,485
And basically it comes down
to just use everything on
1205
00:52:58,485 --> 00:53:01,440
everything until you figure
out what comes up.
1206
00:53:01,440 --> 00:53:04,860
Rarely is it logical, often
pretty entertaining, because
1207
00:53:04,860 --> 00:53:05,530
they're animation heavy.
1208
00:53:05,530 --> 00:53:07,470
So every time you do something
right, you
1209
00:53:07,470 --> 00:53:08,520
get some crazy animation.
1210
00:53:08,520 --> 00:53:12,410
I put the fish into
the mail slot and
1211
00:53:12,410 --> 00:53:15,490
out appears an octopus.
1212
00:53:15,490 --> 00:53:17,870
It's fun to watch.
1213
00:53:17,870 --> 00:53:22,210
For us, the kind of
comparatively opposite of
1214
00:53:22,210 --> 00:53:25,040
those are the Grow games.
1215
00:53:25,040 --> 00:53:28,870
And they're a series of
games called Grow.
1216
00:53:28,870 --> 00:53:30,840
I think the guy who does them
is called Eyezmaze.
1217
00:53:30,840 --> 00:53:34,070
1218
00:53:34,070 --> 00:53:40,280
And the whole basic idea is that
imagine that you have a
1219
00:53:40,280 --> 00:53:41,850
flower pot.
1220
00:53:41,850 --> 00:53:44,705
And every time you
add something to
1221
00:53:44,705 --> 00:53:46,260
it something happens.
1222
00:53:46,260 --> 00:53:49,077
But the order in which you are
adding things to it makes
1223
00:53:49,077 --> 00:53:50,210
different things happen.
1224
00:53:50,210 --> 00:53:54,680
And there are solutions,
basically, in making the
1225
00:53:54,680 --> 00:53:59,490
optimal number of things happen
if you do it right.
1226
00:53:59,490 --> 00:54:03,920
So what you can do is not
a mystery at all.
1227
00:54:03,920 --> 00:54:07,470
You have these six things that
I could add to my pot.
1228
00:54:07,470 --> 00:54:11,050
And I know those are the only
six things I could add.
1229
00:54:11,050 --> 00:54:14,030
The question is what
order do I do them?
1230
00:54:14,030 --> 00:54:15,830
And doing them in different
orders give
1231
00:54:15,830 --> 00:54:19,160
you different results.
1232
00:54:19,160 --> 00:54:23,750
And I feel that these two genres
are kind of linked, but
1233
00:54:23,750 --> 00:54:26,060
they're playing off very
different things.
1234
00:54:26,060 --> 00:54:28,090
One of them is, I don't know
what I'm going to do.
1235
00:54:28,090 --> 00:54:31,710
But I know that whatever I do
has got to leave this space.
1236
00:54:31,710 --> 00:54:33,810
And the other one is very much,
I know exactly what I
1237
00:54:33,810 --> 00:54:37,462
can possibly do, I just don't
know what order to do them in.
1238
00:54:37,462 --> 00:54:39,430
So a couple of puzzles
that you see online.
1239
00:54:39,430 --> 00:54:43,830
These are fairly encapsulated
things.
1240
00:54:43,830 --> 00:54:45,712
One game is one series
of puzzles.
1241
00:54:45,712 --> 00:54:48,142
There's not like a
professor-made encyclopedia
1242
00:54:48,142 --> 00:54:49,392
puzzle kind of thing.
1243
00:54:49,392 --> 00:54:54,460
1244
00:54:54,460 --> 00:54:56,420
What time is it?
1245
00:54:56,420 --> 00:55:01,075
OK, I think I'm actually going
to grab a few more puzzles and
1246
00:55:01,075 --> 00:55:01,690
bring them in.
1247
00:55:01,690 --> 00:55:05,360
But I do actually want to try
to see whether we can put
1248
00:55:05,360 --> 00:55:07,540
together a list of the kinds
of puzzles that we haven't
1249
00:55:07,540 --> 00:55:09,430
talked about today.
1250
00:55:09,430 --> 00:55:11,260
These could be physical puzzles,
these could be
1251
00:55:11,260 --> 00:55:14,700
puzzles that you've seen in
a book by their genre.
1252
00:55:14,700 --> 00:55:17,550
Logic puzzles, you know, of a
certain kind that you either
1253
00:55:17,550 --> 00:55:20,270
really, really like or you
really, really loathe.
1254
00:55:20,270 --> 00:55:23,283
And just break up
in groups of--
1255
00:55:23,283 --> 00:55:27,046
three, six, nine, Heather
[INAUDIBLE], ten, eleven,
1256
00:55:27,046 --> 00:55:30,648
twelve, seventeen people.
1257
00:55:30,648 --> 00:55:32,121
Seventeen people?
1258
00:55:32,121 --> 00:55:34,085
That doesn't divide at all.
1259
00:55:34,085 --> 00:55:41,020
1260
00:55:41,020 --> 00:55:42,330
OK, two or three.
1261
00:55:42,330 --> 00:55:44,430
Groups of two or three
and just like--
1262
00:55:44,430 --> 00:55:45,965
AUDIENCE: Jason should
be back.
1263
00:55:45,965 --> 00:55:48,630
PROFESSOR: OK, all right,
then groups of three.
1264
00:55:48,630 --> 00:55:54,485
1265
00:55:54,485 --> 00:55:56,080
How about we--
1266
00:55:56,080 --> 00:55:58,634
just like--
1267
00:55:58,634 --> 00:56:00,360
you know, just a couple of
puzzles that we haven't
1268
00:56:00,360 --> 00:56:04,670
discussed and a description
about what they're like.
1269
00:56:04,670 --> 00:56:07,715
And we'll quickly run through
the class to sort of give
1270
00:56:07,715 --> 00:56:11,030
everyone an idea of what--
1271
00:56:11,030 --> 00:56:14,980
As a toy, playing with a Rubik's
Cube is more fun than
1272
00:56:14,980 --> 00:56:16,530
the algorithm to solve it.
1273
00:56:16,530 --> 00:56:18,252
That's not fun at all,
in my opinion.
1274
00:56:18,252 --> 00:56:21,030
AUDIENCE: It's fascinating,
you can also solve it.
1275
00:56:21,030 --> 00:56:23,013
But it's [INAUDIBLE],
very tempting when
1276
00:56:23,013 --> 00:56:24,486
you look at it also.
1277
00:56:24,486 --> 00:56:27,923
1278
00:56:27,923 --> 00:56:30,869
AUDIENCE: So, one of the things
you were talking about
1279
00:56:30,869 --> 00:56:34,797
was interactive fiction.
1280
00:56:34,797 --> 00:56:36,280
Text adventures.
1281
00:56:36,280 --> 00:56:40,882
And how sometimes they could
be considered just like if
1282
00:56:40,882 --> 00:56:43,056
you're playing a regular
adventure game but just with
1283
00:56:43,056 --> 00:56:44,042
text instead.
1284
00:56:44,042 --> 00:56:48,600
And so the puzzle could be how
you interact with the world,
1285
00:56:48,600 --> 00:56:51,540
or it could be trying to figure
out what actions are
1286
00:56:51,540 --> 00:56:53,110
available to the user.
1287
00:56:53,110 --> 00:56:54,950
Like sometimes not all
actions are there.
1288
00:56:54,950 --> 00:57:00,510
But also in some games the
nature of text gives you
1289
00:57:00,510 --> 00:57:02,250
different ways to
have a puzzle.
1290
00:57:02,250 --> 00:57:05,800
Like in Lost Pig, because
you're playing an orc he
1291
00:57:05,800 --> 00:57:08,440
doesn't know English
very well.
1292
00:57:08,440 --> 00:57:12,498
Or doesn't have full control of
language, so you're trying
1293
00:57:12,498 --> 00:57:14,161
to decipher his words
to figure out what
1294
00:57:14,161 --> 00:57:15,991
he's actually seeing.
1295
00:57:15,991 --> 00:57:18,005
PROFESSOR: Do you have an
example you can do?
1296
00:57:18,005 --> 00:57:19,775
To give with that to
make it clearer?
1297
00:57:19,775 --> 00:57:20,660
Because I haven't played it.
1298
00:57:20,660 --> 00:57:24,320
AUDIENCE: In that game, there
is one part where he's
1299
00:57:24,320 --> 00:57:27,500
describing a box and
it has a slot.
1300
00:57:27,500 --> 00:57:30,790
And you put something in it
and then it gives you
1301
00:57:30,790 --> 00:57:31,120
something out.
1302
00:57:31,120 --> 00:57:32,740
But the way he's describing it,
you don't really know what
1303
00:57:32,740 --> 00:57:34,672
he's describing until you
realize he's talking about a
1304
00:57:34,672 --> 00:57:36,675
vending machine.
1305
00:57:36,675 --> 00:57:42,260
He describes it as a tall
box with a slot in it.
1306
00:57:42,260 --> 00:57:44,110
And another example we were
talking about was the game
1307
00:57:44,110 --> 00:57:49,870
Aisle, which is you're this
guy in a grocery store.
1308
00:57:49,870 --> 00:57:53,250
And it gives you this
big prologue.
1309
00:57:53,250 --> 00:57:55,440
And you have one action
that you can do.
1310
00:57:55,440 --> 00:57:58,700
So after you type in your one
action, it tells you what
1311
00:57:58,700 --> 00:58:01,780
happens and gives
you an epilogue.
1312
00:58:01,780 --> 00:58:03,990
And then the game starts over.
1313
00:58:03,990 --> 00:58:07,490
But then using the information
from that epilogue, you have a
1314
00:58:07,490 --> 00:58:09,560
different choice of actions
that you can take and
1315
00:58:09,560 --> 00:58:10,770
different key words to use.
1316
00:58:10,770 --> 00:58:14,752
And so by playing it over and
over you're uncovering more of
1317
00:58:14,752 --> 00:58:17,630
the story until you
get somewhere.
1318
00:58:17,630 --> 00:58:19,390
[INTERPOSING VOICES]
1319
00:58:19,390 --> 00:58:20,270
AUDIENCE: Aisle.
1320
00:58:20,270 --> 00:58:27,206
A-I-S-L-E.
1321
00:58:27,206 --> 00:58:32,170
AUDIENCE: We also thought about
puzzles that were games
1322
00:58:32,170 --> 00:58:34,250
put into a very contrived
scenario.
1323
00:58:34,250 --> 00:58:37,250
Like bridge puzzles, or chess
puzzles, or back when the
1324
00:58:37,250 --> 00:58:39,700
Duelist magazine still existed
they had Magic
1325
00:58:39,700 --> 00:58:40,680
the Gathering puzzles.
1326
00:58:40,680 --> 00:58:42,637
PROFESSOR: So like
chess puzzles are
1327
00:58:42,637 --> 00:58:43,780
like, here's this board.
1328
00:58:43,780 --> 00:58:46,210
What was the move that
led to this board.
1329
00:58:46,210 --> 00:58:49,640
AUDIENCE: Or like, black
to win in three moves.
1330
00:58:49,640 --> 00:58:51,110
Something like that.
1331
00:58:51,110 --> 00:58:54,040
PROFESSOR: So that's like, you
are now placing additional
1332
00:58:54,040 --> 00:58:56,620
constraints on the game.
1333
00:58:56,620 --> 00:58:57,940
AUDIENCE: Yeah, exactly.
1334
00:58:57,940 --> 00:59:00,630
It already puts you in a
situation like, pretend you're
1335
00:59:00,630 --> 00:59:01,490
in this game.
1336
00:59:01,490 --> 00:59:04,220
Now, we promise you there's a
way you can automatically win,
1337
00:59:04,220 --> 00:59:07,255
you have to find it.
1338
00:59:07,255 --> 00:59:10,876
PROFESSOR: There's a number of
computer games like ChuChu
1339
00:59:10,876 --> 00:59:12,700
Rocket and everything
where it does like
1340
00:59:12,700 --> 00:59:14,008
completely separate modes.
1341
00:59:14,008 --> 00:59:17,880
1342
00:59:17,880 --> 00:59:21,130
ChuChu Rocket is a frenetic
both player--
1343
00:59:21,130 --> 00:59:24,800
AUDIENCE: It's a mice-herding
game.
1344
00:59:24,800 --> 00:59:27,750
You have to get them
into rocket ships,
1345
00:59:27,750 --> 00:59:29,000
so they go in space.
1346
00:59:29,000 --> 00:59:31,222
1347
00:59:31,222 --> 00:59:32,980
It was for the Dreamcast.
1348
00:59:32,980 --> 00:59:34,230
It's so good.
1349
00:59:34,230 --> 00:59:37,230
1350
00:59:37,230 --> 00:59:38,180
The idea's really simple.
1351
00:59:38,180 --> 00:59:40,486
A bunch of mice wander around
the streets, and each player
1352
00:59:40,486 --> 00:59:41,930
gets to place three arrows.
1353
00:59:41,930 --> 00:59:43,525
And when the mice run
under the arrow
1354
00:59:43,525 --> 00:59:44,705
they follow the arrow.
1355
00:59:44,705 --> 00:59:47,010
So you want to get all your mice
on your ship, and want to
1356
00:59:47,010 --> 00:59:48,880
get the cats on the other ship
so that they eat their mice.
1357
00:59:48,880 --> 00:59:52,090
PROFESSOR: In puzzle-mode, you
have three arrows in these
1358
00:59:52,090 --> 00:59:52,735
particular directions.
1359
00:59:52,735 --> 00:59:55,308
But the way you place them, you
have as much time as you
1360
00:59:55,308 --> 00:59:57,070
want, but there's only
one right answer.
1361
00:59:57,070 --> 00:59:58,790
And that immediately shows you
the difference between a game
1362
00:59:58,790 --> 00:59:59,030
and puzzle.
1363
00:59:59,030 --> 00:59:59,990
Right there.
1364
00:59:59,990 --> 01:00:03,350
Even though they are all
in the same package.
1365
01:00:03,350 --> 01:00:07,720
AUDIENCE: So, first off I don't
like jigsaw puzzles, but
1366
01:00:07,720 --> 01:00:10,070
Michelle loves them.
1367
01:00:10,070 --> 01:00:12,390
And then we also talked
about whodunit's.
1368
01:00:12,390 --> 01:00:15,190
And I really love whodunit's
because you have to pay
1369
01:00:15,190 --> 01:00:16,820
attention to the detail
in the stories.
1370
01:00:16,820 --> 01:00:18,990
Like the one thing that--
1371
01:00:18,990 --> 01:00:21,690
I guess the example that we
were talking about is, if
1372
01:00:21,690 --> 01:00:24,480
there's a mailman and it happens
to be on a Sunday, he
1373
01:00:24,480 --> 01:00:25,290
probably committed the crime.
1374
01:00:25,290 --> 01:00:26,860
Because they don't have
mail on Sundays.
1375
01:00:26,860 --> 01:00:28,675
And it's like small
details like that.
1376
01:00:28,675 --> 01:00:30,995
PROFESSOR: Are you talking about
mystery books or just
1377
01:00:30,995 --> 01:00:31,995
like little paragraphs?
1378
01:00:31,995 --> 01:00:34,302
AUDIENCE: Well, it's usually
like a story.
1379
01:00:34,302 --> 01:00:36,360
And they say, oh, here's the
scenario, here's the
1380
01:00:36,360 --> 01:00:39,188
background story, who
is the murderer?
1381
01:00:39,188 --> 01:00:43,571
PROFESSOR: They compare it
though, [INAUDIBLE].
1382
01:00:43,571 --> 01:00:46,725
AUDIENCE: People have parties
like that, like full-on
1383
01:00:46,725 --> 01:00:47,060
whodunit parties.
1384
01:00:47,060 --> 01:00:48,430
AUDIENCE: That's very true.
1385
01:00:48,430 --> 01:00:50,366
I didn't see who was talking
for a second.
1386
01:00:50,366 --> 01:00:54,240
1387
01:00:54,240 --> 01:00:55,490
Who's talking?
1388
01:00:55,490 --> 01:01:02,610
1389
01:01:02,610 --> 01:01:06,620
AUDIENCE: Another puzzle we
came up with, was the ones
1390
01:01:06,620 --> 01:01:09,725
that you did in elementary
school with like the big grid.
1391
01:01:09,725 --> 01:01:12,350
And you would have someone's
name, and maybe their favorite
1392
01:01:12,350 --> 01:01:14,693
food, that you would give them
a bunch of clues and you have
1393
01:01:14,693 --> 01:01:15,760
to match them.
1394
01:01:15,760 --> 01:01:17,640
Yes, with something like the
checks and the xs and stuff.
1395
01:01:17,640 --> 01:01:21,045
PROFESSOR: So, that's just
generally called logic
1396
01:01:21,045 --> 01:01:22,400
puzzles, I believe.
1397
01:01:22,400 --> 01:01:26,540
It's just you are given the
incomplete set of information
1398
01:01:26,540 --> 01:01:30,331
but enough constraints that you
can figure out the rest of
1399
01:01:30,331 --> 01:01:31,450
the information.
1400
01:01:31,450 --> 01:01:34,870
And really the way to solve it
is just write everybody's
1401
01:01:34,870 --> 01:01:39,440
name, all the characters that
you're given in the prose.
1402
01:01:39,440 --> 01:01:41,400
Write down all the characters
on one column.
1403
01:01:41,400 --> 01:01:43,770
Write down all the things you're
trying to figure out,
1404
01:01:43,770 --> 01:01:46,662
like who's wearing what colored
shirt, for instance,
1405
01:01:46,662 --> 01:01:49,080
so just write out all the colors
on the other column.
1406
01:01:49,080 --> 01:01:52,540
And just by the process of
elimination, just figuring
1407
01:01:52,540 --> 01:01:56,610
out, usually the answers
are mutually exclusive.
1408
01:01:56,610 --> 01:01:59,772
So if somebody is wearing a red
shirt, can not be wearing
1409
01:01:59,772 --> 01:02:02,128
a green shirt.
1410
01:02:02,128 --> 01:02:07,584
AUDIENCE: So part of the much
harder ones are every fourth
1411
01:02:07,584 --> 01:02:08,576
statement is false.
1412
01:02:08,576 --> 01:02:11,056
Like you don't know if one
statement is definitely false.
1413
01:02:11,056 --> 01:02:12,792
And I've seen one where
every statement is
1414
01:02:12,792 --> 01:02:14,032
false except for one.
1415
01:02:14,032 --> 01:02:17,860
And I can bring in my book and
there's like [INAUDIBLE].
1416
01:02:17,860 --> 01:02:23,452
PROFESSOR: The worst version
of it is figuring out how
1417
01:02:23,452 --> 01:02:25,444
puzzles see people
in the world.
1418
01:02:25,444 --> 01:02:29,926
1419
01:02:29,926 --> 01:02:32,416
AUDIENCE: They wouldn't fix it
before because he pushed it
1420
01:02:32,416 --> 01:02:33,666
out last week.
1421
01:02:33,666 --> 01:02:36,948
1422
01:02:36,948 --> 01:02:38,766
PROFESSOR: You guys want
to throw in any?
1423
01:02:38,766 --> 01:02:42,715
AUDIENCE: Sure, we started by
trying to think of all the
1424
01:02:42,715 --> 01:02:44,170
puzzles that we really
dislike.
1425
01:02:44,170 --> 01:02:47,080
And we came up with
a couple here.
1426
01:02:47,080 --> 01:02:49,505
The sliding square puzzles, you
know where you have like--
1427
01:02:49,505 --> 01:02:52,420
1428
01:02:52,420 --> 01:02:55,069
Basically just a variation on
a jigsaw puzzle where the
1429
01:02:55,069 --> 01:02:57,803
rules are more constrained.
1430
01:02:57,803 --> 01:02:59,791
I don't like jigsaw
puzzles either.
1431
01:02:59,791 --> 01:03:03,270
So we're like-minded there.
1432
01:03:03,270 --> 01:03:05,258
And then John had a couple.
1433
01:03:05,258 --> 01:03:08,737
I guess there's a Light's
Out puzzle.
1434
01:03:08,737 --> 01:03:14,204
Inside the image you touch
certain areas and [INAUDIBLE].
1435
01:03:14,204 --> 01:03:17,640
PROFESSOR: So you've got like
a grid of buttons and every
1436
01:03:17,640 --> 01:03:23,085
button you push will invert all
those neighboring buttons.
1437
01:03:23,085 --> 01:03:26,830
Like implanting the top button,
left and right, will--
1438
01:03:26,830 --> 01:03:28,080
[UNINTELLIGIBLE].
1439
01:03:28,080 --> 01:03:29,954
1440
01:03:29,954 --> 01:03:34,924
AUDIENCE: And then I guess
I already described the
1441
01:03:34,924 --> 01:03:36,070
concentric circle thing.
1442
01:03:36,070 --> 01:03:38,481
Yeah, their puzzles are similar
that we're taking an
1443
01:03:38,481 --> 01:03:40,270
action on one item
in the scene.
1444
01:03:40,270 --> 01:03:42,982
These are incredibly difficult,
the concentric
1445
01:03:42,982 --> 01:03:45,994
circle ones, will have
an effect on other
1446
01:03:45,994 --> 01:03:47,850
things in the system.
1447
01:03:47,850 --> 01:03:52,061
And typically these are used in
games where there will be a
1448
01:03:52,061 --> 01:03:55,260
center podium with a pathway
leading off.
1449
01:03:55,260 --> 01:03:56,760
On one side of the podium,
then there will be a
1450
01:03:56,760 --> 01:03:59,821
concentric circle around the
concentric ring with a pathway
1451
01:03:59,821 --> 01:04:01,533
off of that ring and
another interval.
1452
01:04:01,533 --> 01:04:05,498
Then more and more circles to
each side and you get to
1453
01:04:05,498 --> 01:04:08,746
rotate individual circles and
that will rotate the other
1454
01:04:08,746 --> 01:04:09,674
circles different ways.
1455
01:04:09,674 --> 01:04:10,975
And you need to create
a pathway.
1456
01:04:10,975 --> 01:04:12,310
AUDIENCE: Every time I
rotate one, something
1457
01:04:12,310 --> 01:04:13,535
else is going to rotate.
1458
01:04:13,535 --> 01:04:17,720
AUDIENCE: Then it's always
going right before you're
1459
01:04:17,720 --> 01:04:19,100
[INAUDIBLE].
1460
01:04:19,100 --> 01:04:23,062
AUDIENCE: I guess three of those
are examples of games
1461
01:04:23,062 --> 01:04:26,020
where you have to take action
on an environment, but your
1462
01:04:26,020 --> 01:04:28,732
action has direct effects
throughout the environment.
1463
01:04:28,732 --> 01:04:32,018
And it's just really annoying
figuring out
1464
01:04:32,018 --> 01:04:33,190
how to optimize that.
1465
01:04:33,190 --> 01:04:35,020
PROFESSOR: But they are
predictable effects.
1466
01:04:35,020 --> 01:04:37,225
It's like every time I rotate
this one left, that one's
1467
01:04:37,225 --> 01:04:39,960
going to rotate right.
1468
01:04:39,960 --> 01:04:42,290
AUDIENCE: I think it's kind of
funny how the context has a
1469
01:04:42,290 --> 01:04:44,490
lot to do with whether these
puzzles are annoying or not.
1470
01:04:44,490 --> 01:04:47,911
Because I do enjoy Professor
Layton quite a bit.
1471
01:04:47,911 --> 01:04:54,170
And it's the most, through an
arbitrary character in order
1472
01:04:54,170 --> 01:04:57,040
to justifying that you're
trying [INAUDIBLE].
1473
01:04:57,040 --> 01:04:58,393
It's just fun.
1474
01:04:58,393 --> 01:05:01,045
Your intention on even playing
the game is that you're going
1475
01:05:01,045 --> 01:05:01,570
to be solving puzzles.
1476
01:05:01,570 --> 01:05:03,340
Not as [INAUDIBLE].
1477
01:05:03,340 --> 01:05:03,700
[INTERPOSING VOICES]
1478
01:05:03,700 --> 01:05:08,880
AUDIENCE: Also, the way that is
presented makes it funny in
1479
01:05:08,880 --> 01:05:09,850
that as well, right.
1480
01:05:09,850 --> 01:05:12,705
So the mafia goons come up to
you and say, we're going to
1481
01:05:12,705 --> 01:05:14,660
stop you from coming in here
unless you solve this puzzle.
1482
01:05:14,660 --> 01:05:17,392
1483
01:05:17,392 --> 01:05:20,780
Shouldn't you just shoot me?
1484
01:05:20,780 --> 01:05:22,420
It would solve all
your problems.
1485
01:05:22,420 --> 01:05:23,740
No, no, solve this puzzle.
1486
01:05:23,740 --> 01:05:26,542
1487
01:05:26,542 --> 01:05:30,750
PROFESSOR: It's like they're
making fun of themselves even.
1488
01:05:30,750 --> 01:05:32,000
All right, cool.
1489
01:05:32,000 --> 01:05:34,735
1490
01:05:34,735 --> 01:05:37,475
AUDIENCE: I'm not sure if we
really commented on what we
1491
01:05:37,475 --> 01:05:38,670
liked or didn't like.
1492
01:05:38,670 --> 01:05:42,415
But some things that we came
up with that haven't been
1493
01:05:42,415 --> 01:05:46,880
brought up yet are cryptics,
which are kind of a
1494
01:05:46,880 --> 01:05:52,780
combination between crosswords
and riddles, riddles,
1495
01:05:52,780 --> 01:05:54,740
combinatory games as
a puzzle apparatus.
1496
01:05:54,740 --> 01:05:57,270
1497
01:05:57,270 --> 01:06:00,636
Logic puzzles in general, not
just like typical logic
1498
01:06:00,636 --> 01:06:01,450
puzzles like that.
1499
01:06:01,450 --> 01:06:07,280
You can have state machines,
or Sudoku, or any type of
1500
01:06:07,280 --> 01:06:08,710
numerical puzzle.
1501
01:06:08,710 --> 01:06:12,340
We also want to differentiate
that a lot of those games, or
1502
01:06:12,340 --> 01:06:13,670
some of those games,
are spatially
1503
01:06:13,670 --> 01:06:15,020
oriented and some aren't.
1504
01:06:15,020 --> 01:06:17,010
Which we thought was an
important aspect, but not
1505
01:06:17,010 --> 01:06:19,590
necessarily definitive of a
completely different genre.
1506
01:06:19,590 --> 01:06:21,830
PROFESSOR: I'm not sure I've
seen a state machine puzzle,
1507
01:06:21,830 --> 01:06:24,702
actually, outside of a computer
science textbook.
1508
01:06:24,702 --> 01:06:26,094
AUDIENCE: I know some.
1509
01:06:26,094 --> 01:06:28,916
PROFESSOR: I'll never ask you.
1510
01:06:28,916 --> 01:06:30,850
I expect it's going to
be more involved than
1511
01:06:30,850 --> 01:06:33,470
we have time for.
1512
01:06:33,470 --> 01:06:36,340
By combinatory puzzles
you mean stuff like--
1513
01:06:36,340 --> 01:06:38,450
AUDIENCE: Combinatory games.
1514
01:06:38,450 --> 01:06:42,260
All the games that fall under
combinatory game theory.
1515
01:06:42,260 --> 01:06:44,590
AUDIENCE: Like Nim's.
1516
01:06:44,590 --> 01:06:47,400
[INAUDIBLE]
1517
01:06:47,400 --> 01:06:51,110
AUDIENCE: These are sort of
exploration, so games where
1518
01:06:51,110 --> 01:06:56,690
you have to see everything
around you to know what is
1519
01:06:56,690 --> 01:06:58,900
available for use.
1520
01:06:58,900 --> 01:07:00,600
On the [INAUDIBLE]
1521
01:07:00,600 --> 01:07:02,995
so in the book they
talked about
1522
01:07:02,995 --> 01:07:06,530
actually Zelda, and just--
1523
01:07:06,530 --> 01:07:10,780
So a situation in a game that
I didn't like is, you're
1524
01:07:10,780 --> 01:07:14,270
playing a game and something
happens you don't step too
1525
01:07:14,270 --> 01:07:15,640
fast or something.
1526
01:07:15,640 --> 01:07:17,820
And because of that,
you get too inert.
1527
01:07:17,820 --> 01:07:20,960
You're in a spot where you don't
have the tools necessary
1528
01:07:20,960 --> 01:07:23,140
to beat the enemy right
in front of you.
1529
01:07:23,140 --> 01:07:25,990
But you also are trapped
and can't go back.
1530
01:07:25,990 --> 01:07:27,420
It happened to me one time.
1531
01:07:27,420 --> 01:07:30,005
It was the Star Wars: Knights
of the Old Republic.
1532
01:07:30,005 --> 01:07:34,390
1533
01:07:34,390 --> 01:07:37,530
There's an enemy, you couldn't
go forward, and there was a
1534
01:07:37,530 --> 01:07:39,800
cliff so you couldn't
get back up.
1535
01:07:39,800 --> 01:07:43,550
And so, since I couldn't do
anything I was forced to
1536
01:07:43,550 --> 01:07:46,410
completely go back
to the last save.
1537
01:07:46,410 --> 01:07:50,652
PROFESSOR: But is that a puzzle,
or is that just a bug?
1538
01:07:50,652 --> 01:07:55,130
AUDIENCE: I mean, it's time
worth expiration and
1539
01:07:55,130 --> 01:07:57,010
it's an item use.
1540
01:07:57,010 --> 01:08:00,360
So you need to get an
item to go ahead.
1541
01:08:00,360 --> 01:08:04,185
If you have this item, then
the enemy that you--
1542
01:08:04,185 --> 01:08:06,650
I think it was like a Rancor
or something--
1543
01:08:06,650 --> 01:08:08,950
you could beat the Rancor or at
least put it to sleep and
1544
01:08:08,950 --> 01:08:09,970
walk by it.
1545
01:08:09,970 --> 01:08:13,340
But without it, you had
to try and beat it or
1546
01:08:13,340 --> 01:08:15,480
it would kill you.
1547
01:08:15,480 --> 01:08:19,569
PROFESSOR: OK, so it was a
item that would have made
1548
01:08:19,569 --> 01:08:21,270
combat easier, basically.
1549
01:08:21,270 --> 01:08:25,990
But they kind of made it
this one way with--
1550
01:08:25,990 --> 01:08:27,010
yeah.
1551
01:08:27,010 --> 01:08:29,136
So you see a lot of puzzle games
where they have easy
1552
01:08:29,136 --> 01:08:29,930
reset, right.
1553
01:08:29,930 --> 01:08:32,875
And it's like you can stop
trying to solve it and you
1554
01:08:32,875 --> 01:08:35,485
really screw up something along
the way You hit reset
1555
01:08:35,485 --> 01:08:36,970
and go right back to
the beginning.
1556
01:08:36,970 --> 01:08:40,435
Nice that the Republic
has no easy reset.
1557
01:08:40,435 --> 01:08:42,167
You live with the consequences,
I guess that's
1558
01:08:42,167 --> 01:08:43,900
what they were trying
to go for.
1559
01:08:43,900 --> 01:08:48,688
AUDIENCE: All right,
so we've also had a
1560
01:08:48,688 --> 01:08:50,770
loathing sliding puzzles--
1561
01:08:50,770 --> 01:08:52,731
AUDIENCE: Either with numbers or
pictures, both of them are
1562
01:08:52,731 --> 01:08:55,540
equally annoying.
1563
01:08:55,540 --> 01:09:00,829
But, on the other hand,
Alec loves Rush Hour.
1564
01:09:00,829 --> 01:09:03,170
AUDIENCE: It's the traffic red
light game where you have to
1565
01:09:03,170 --> 01:09:06,186
fly cars out of the way
to form a path.
1566
01:09:06,186 --> 01:09:08,951
AUDIENCE: In Professor Layton
there are an awful lot of
1567
01:09:08,951 --> 01:09:12,270
sliding puzzles that have
differently shaped pieces, or
1568
01:09:12,270 --> 01:09:14,069
oddly shaped pieces.
1569
01:09:14,069 --> 01:09:18,200
Which is slightly more
interesting, or less annoying
1570
01:09:18,200 --> 01:09:22,520
than regular sliding puzzles
but it's still incredibly
1571
01:09:22,520 --> 01:09:22,820
frustrating.
1572
01:09:22,820 --> 01:09:24,769
AUDIENCE: Well, I think the
difference there is that when
1573
01:09:24,769 --> 01:09:27,189
you have differently
sized pieces--
1574
01:09:27,189 --> 01:09:29,310
When you're doing just like a
sliding puzzle where you're
1575
01:09:29,310 --> 01:09:32,010
trying to recreate an image
there's definite patterns that
1576
01:09:32,010 --> 01:09:33,800
you keep using over and over
again, because you're just
1577
01:09:33,800 --> 01:09:36,520
like a rotating spaces.
1578
01:09:36,520 --> 01:09:37,700
So it's not actually
interesting.
1579
01:09:37,700 --> 01:09:39,899
Whereas Rush Hour you actually
have to think
1580
01:09:39,899 --> 01:09:41,840
about things fit together.
1581
01:09:41,840 --> 01:09:43,800
So one other puzzle type that
we haven't really mentioned,
1582
01:09:43,800 --> 01:09:47,350
that I actually really enjoy,
is pictographic puzzles.
1583
01:09:47,350 --> 01:09:50,689
Where it relies on sort of your
association with visual
1584
01:09:50,689 --> 01:09:52,979
images and wordplay and stuff.
1585
01:09:52,979 --> 01:09:56,580
Like, for example, you'll have
a puzzle that's just an image
1586
01:09:56,580 --> 01:10:02,210
of an eyeball, a bumblebee,
and a screen shot of Judi
1587
01:10:02,210 --> 01:10:05,090
Dench in a James Bond movie.
1588
01:10:05,090 --> 01:10:09,390
And the idea is it's IBM.
1589
01:10:09,390 --> 01:10:12,310
So I love puzzles like that.
1590
01:10:12,310 --> 01:10:13,560
[INTERPOSING VOICES]
1591
01:10:13,560 --> 01:10:15,130
1592
01:10:15,130 --> 01:10:17,760
AUDIENCE: Yeah, so stuff like
that where it relies on
1593
01:10:17,760 --> 01:10:20,820
someone, like a human being,
actually associating
1594
01:10:20,820 --> 01:10:23,490
information with something
visual.
1595
01:10:23,490 --> 01:10:26,290
Rather than it being just a
straight modern puzzle where
1596
01:10:26,290 --> 01:10:30,337
you have this information and
you use this to derive the
1597
01:10:30,337 --> 01:10:30,880
rest of the information.
1598
01:10:30,880 --> 01:10:35,110
PROFESSOR: There's R-E-B-U-S,
and of course those are very
1599
01:10:35,110 --> 01:10:37,935
language focused even though
they're image-based.
1600
01:10:37,935 --> 01:10:41,476
AUDIENCE: What one has the two
lines and then [INAUDIBLE] in
1601
01:10:41,476 --> 01:10:42,260
the middle?
1602
01:10:42,260 --> 01:10:44,470
AUDIENCE: Well, things
like that, yeah.
1603
01:10:44,470 --> 01:10:47,340
PROFESSOR: You had Rebus where
you are trying to basically
1604
01:10:47,340 --> 01:10:48,420
reconstruct a sentence.
1605
01:10:48,420 --> 01:10:53,060
And then I forget what's the
classification of puzzles
1606
01:10:53,060 --> 01:10:56,693
where you're given a certain
lead of images and you're
1607
01:10:56,693 --> 01:10:58,052
trying to write enough.
1608
01:10:58,052 --> 01:11:05,790
But if I wrote it in--
1609
01:11:05,790 --> 01:11:10,882
this is not a good puzzle but
just to give an example-- if I
1610
01:11:10,882 --> 01:11:14,470
put [INAUDIBLE].
1611
01:11:14,470 --> 01:11:18,950
1612
01:11:18,950 --> 01:11:22,640
I think there is a specific word
for these kind of things.
1613
01:11:22,640 --> 01:11:24,781
But the whole idea is you're
trying to reconstruct these
1614
01:11:24,781 --> 01:11:26,900
sayings or these [INAUDIBLE]
1615
01:11:26,900 --> 01:11:28,295
from individual theories.
1616
01:11:28,295 --> 01:11:32,180
1617
01:11:32,180 --> 01:11:39,236
So I mean, these are usually
spatial to begin with.
1618
01:11:39,236 --> 01:11:41,447
I think there was a whole
game show in the '80s
1619
01:11:41,447 --> 01:11:42,790
that was just all--
1620
01:11:42,790 --> 01:11:45,590
[INTERPOSING VOICES]
1621
01:11:45,590 --> 01:11:47,954
AUDIENCE: Australia had
a show called Catch
1622
01:11:47,954 --> 01:11:49,415
Phrase which was--
1623
01:11:49,415 --> 01:11:51,850
AUDIENCE: Yeah, I think Catch
Phrase was the show.
1624
01:11:51,850 --> 01:11:56,770
AUDIENCE: So we wrote a B-list
of different types of puzzles,
1625
01:11:56,770 --> 01:11:59,770
so let's just run
through them.
1626
01:11:59,770 --> 01:12:00,750
All right, we've got
lots of different
1627
01:12:00,750 --> 01:12:01,900
sliding puzzle variants.
1628
01:12:01,900 --> 01:12:04,315
We've got hidden object finding,
the variance on
1629
01:12:04,315 --> 01:12:08,560
Where's Waldo and then it's
kind of [INAUDIBLE].
1630
01:12:08,560 --> 01:12:13,165
We have riddles, various kinds
of logic puzzles, particularly
1631
01:12:13,165 --> 01:12:16,170
two of which we've
mentioned before.
1632
01:12:16,170 --> 01:12:17,760
Several people, witnesses,
give statements.
1633
01:12:17,760 --> 01:12:19,376
One of them is a liar,
which one's the liar.
1634
01:12:19,376 --> 01:12:21,756
So find the hidden
sinister person.
1635
01:12:21,756 --> 01:12:25,700
And then there's the figment
property x is next to figment
1636
01:12:25,700 --> 01:12:28,030
property y, what order
are they sitting in?
1637
01:12:28,030 --> 01:12:28,992
That kind of puzzle.
1638
01:12:28,992 --> 01:12:33,330
There's a million of them
in Professor Layton.
1639
01:12:33,330 --> 01:12:37,890
There's these kinds
of unraveling, or
1640
01:12:37,890 --> 01:12:39,570
reverse-engineering
type, puzzles.
1641
01:12:39,570 --> 01:12:43,110
Where some system has been
permuted and you have to
1642
01:12:43,110 --> 01:12:44,750
restore it to its
original state.
1643
01:12:44,750 --> 01:12:47,908
Which Rubik's Cube is like the
canonical example, I guess.
1644
01:12:47,908 --> 01:12:50,830
But then there's a bunch of
other different good ones.
1645
01:12:50,830 --> 01:12:52,679
PROFESSOR: I mean that chess
games is kind of in that
1646
01:12:52,679 --> 01:12:53,752
category too.
1647
01:12:53,752 --> 01:12:58,850
AUDIENCE: There's tile rotation
and swapping puzzles.
1648
01:12:58,850 --> 01:13:01,690
One example of this is Bioshock
hacking, but then
1649
01:13:01,690 --> 01:13:05,875
there are 1 million other
variations on exchanging tiles
1650
01:13:05,875 --> 01:13:08,470
or swapping them around
or this kind of thing.
1651
01:13:08,470 --> 01:13:11,732
Lots of different kinds
of math puzzles.
1652
01:13:11,732 --> 01:13:14,575
This particular word
transformation puzzle type
1653
01:13:14,575 --> 01:13:17,750
that I used to see all the time
when I was a kid, where
1654
01:13:17,750 --> 01:13:22,480
by changing one letter or word
per step, you had to transform
1655
01:13:22,480 --> 01:13:24,610
one word into another.
1656
01:13:24,610 --> 01:13:32,890
Mazes, jigsaw puzzles, code
breaking nobody mentioned yet.
1657
01:13:32,890 --> 01:13:38,360
And then also, these kind of
full experiment type puzzles.
1658
01:13:38,360 --> 01:13:40,660
I don't know how else
you categorize them.
1659
01:13:40,660 --> 01:13:41,797
PROFESSOR: Give us an example.
1660
01:13:41,797 --> 01:13:49,480
AUDIENCE: All right, so I'm
trying to remember how this
1661
01:13:49,480 --> 01:13:52,400
works but I think it is--
1662
01:13:52,400 --> 01:13:55,780
this one popped up on Day(9)s
podcast the other day.
1663
01:13:55,780 --> 01:13:59,245
I only give it because otherwise
if I get it wrong
1664
01:13:59,245 --> 01:14:02,490
then people will go oh my God,
and try and puzzle it out.
1665
01:14:02,490 --> 01:14:04,860
So it has to do with the piece
of string and burning.
1666
01:14:04,860 --> 01:14:06,666
AUDIENCE: Oh, the 13 minutes?
1667
01:14:06,666 --> 01:14:10,681
AUDIENCE: Yeah, do you remember
exactly how it goes?
1668
01:14:10,681 --> 01:14:13,536
AUDIENCE: OK, you have
two pieces of string.
1669
01:14:13,536 --> 01:14:17,030
You know that the whole string
takes an hour to burn but it's
1670
01:14:17,030 --> 01:14:18,280
not linear.
1671
01:14:18,280 --> 01:14:20,200
1672
01:14:20,200 --> 01:14:23,130
You have an infinite supply of
matches, how can you measure
1673
01:14:23,130 --> 01:14:26,560
15 minutes with this string?
1674
01:14:26,560 --> 01:14:29,990
AUDIENCE: One of those lateral
thinking puzzles.
1675
01:14:29,990 --> 01:14:35,380
AUDIENCE: I would classify
this under riddles, but--
1676
01:14:35,380 --> 01:14:37,570
[INTERPOSING VOICES]
1677
01:14:37,570 --> 01:14:40,402
AUDIENCE: Let them go, but
they both take an hour--
1678
01:14:40,402 --> 01:14:41,818
[INAUDIBLE]
1679
01:14:41,818 --> 01:14:44,178
but they both take an hour
to burn, non-linearly.
1680
01:14:44,178 --> 01:14:48,310
AUDIENCE: Couldn't you just be
lighting matches the entire
1681
01:14:48,310 --> 01:14:50,350
time, and see how many matches
you can burn an hour.
1682
01:14:50,350 --> 01:14:52,005
After that, just take four
to that number--
1683
01:14:52,005 --> 01:14:56,160
1684
01:14:56,160 --> 01:14:57,470
AUDIENCE: Then how are
you going to measure
1685
01:14:57,470 --> 01:14:59,250
that original hour?
1686
01:14:59,250 --> 01:14:59,743
[INAUDIBLE]
1687
01:14:59,743 --> 01:15:02,577
AUDIENCE: But you know that
the thing takes an hour to
1688
01:15:02,577 --> 01:15:03,200
burn, yeah?
1689
01:15:03,200 --> 01:15:04,577
AUDIENCE: The whole thing.
1690
01:15:04,577 --> 01:15:06,767
PROFESSOR: It will take slightly
longer than the
1691
01:15:06,767 --> 01:15:10,410
amount of time it takes
to get to class.
1692
01:15:10,410 --> 01:15:11,310
We close by then.
1693
01:15:11,310 --> 01:15:12,250
It would be nice to give
people time to
1694
01:15:12,250 --> 01:15:13,870
think about it too.
1695
01:15:13,870 --> 01:15:15,970
So answer on Wednesday.
1696
01:15:15,970 --> 01:15:19,027