Liz vs Mary Cheney on Marriage Equality

It seems there’s a bit of a fight breaking out in the Cheney family. Senate candidate Liz, hereinafter referred to as the Evil Daughter, is not in favor of marriage equality, while Mary, who is IN a same-sex marriage, is criticizing her for taking that position.

Posting on Facebook on Friday evening, Mary Cheney, who is gay and married her longtime partner last year, wrote: “For the record, I love my sister, but she is dead wrong on the issue of marriage.”

Their father, former Vice President Dick Cheney, supports same-sex marriage, and the younger Cheney echoed some of his language on the issue when she added, “Freedom means freedom for everyone.”…

Earlier Friday, Liz Cheney revealed her position on same-sex marriage, a topic she has kept relatively quiet about since declaring her candidacy in July against incumbent Senator Mike Enzi, Republican of Wyoming.

“I am not pro-gay marriage,” Liz Cheney said in a statement responding to an apparent push poll against her in Wyoming. “I believe the issue of marriage must be decided by the states, and by the people in the states, not by judges and not even by legislators, but by the people themselves.”

That’s a complete copout position (as it was when Obama took it last year), made even worse by this completely arbitrary notion that this one issue shouldn’t even be decided by our elected representatives but only by popular vote. That isn’t just a copout position, it’s one that is invariably hypocritical — one only takes it if they think they’ll win a popular vote. If their position would lose a popular vote, they’ll magically decide that’s not a good idea.

““I believe the issue of marriage must be decided by the states, and by the people in the states, not by judges and not even by legislators, but by the people themselves.”

“And, furthermore, I believe that each individual marriage of Unpopular Minorities be vetted and approved by a Majority of the People. I believe that history bends towards justice, and plan to fight it every step of the way.”

doublereed“Wow. Why is her sister such a cowardly bitch?”

Look, family is important, but this is politics. Chip off the old block, she is. With commitment like she’s got, she’ll be out committing war crimes in no time.

matty1

I suspect she doesn’t really care but is angling for the votes of the more committed bigots, notice she avoids actually saying “I think this is wrong” to allow herself an out if the popular vote did go the other way.

Not that this makes putting political convenience above your own sister any better. Hint, if you are in a news story with Dick Cheney and he comes off as the good guy you know you are doing something very wrong.

http://motherwell.livejournal.com/ Raging Bee

Their father, former Vice President Dick Cheney, supports same-sex marriage…

How, exactly? Has he used any of his considerable prestige within the GOP to pressure even ONE of his fellow Republicans to stop screaming stupid hateful bullshit about people like his daughter? Has he ever got in any teatard’s face and publicly dared him to keep on demonizing his daughter when her dad was in reach?

Reginald Selkirk

“… but by the people themselves.”

So if two of “the people themselves” decided to get gay-married, I guess she’d be for it?

http://www.gregory-gadow.net Gregory in Seattle

“I believe the issue of marriage must be decided by the states, and by the people in the states, not by judges and not even by legislators, but by the people themselves.”

So she thinks that Loving v. Virginia should be rolled back until the people in Mississippi, Virginia and Alabama decide that interracial marriages are acceptable? That Utah should be allowed to have plural marriages as Mormon scripture requires? That she’s be happy if the people of a state say that only marriages blessed by the Catholic Church are legal?

Chiroptera

Their father, former Vice President Dick Cheney, supports same-sex marriage….

And remember, that only happened after he was no longer an elected political official.

It seems that political expediency runs in the family.

John Pieret

At least Rob Portman (hardly my favorite politician) had the guts to put his own family before his political ambitions. Which is not to say that he should be lauded for it … it shouldn’t have had to take a personal connection in order for him to support equality. But is does illustrate just how low on the political food chain Lizzy is.

cptdoom

Has he used any of his considerable prestige within the GOP to pressure even ONE of his fellow Republicans to stop screaming stupid hateful bullshit about people like his daughter? Has he ever got in any teatard’s face and publicly dared him to keep on demonizing his daughter when her dad was in reach?

I can’t believe I am defending Darth Cheney, but my understanding is he did lobby some GOP legislators in MD to get marriage to pass the legislature last year. Other than that, I know of nothing.

Of course, even his not-as-evil daughter didn’t seem to mind the “let the people” decide mantra when she was head of VP Operations for the 2004 Bush/Cheney campaign and they were actively getting the fundie voters out by placing anti-gay hate amendments on dozens of state ballots. She was such a fierce defender of her father and his puppet President that she even helped coordinate the campaign’s official, and officially bullsh*t, response to John Kerry’s “outing” of her during the last debate in 2004 (Cheney was the official liaison from Coors to the LGBT community in the late 90s when the brewery was trying to overcome a boycott, so was known to be gay). She didn’t seem so concerned about LGBT rights at that time.

But then again, she’s proven that laws that impact little people don’t really affect her. So she could fight against LGBT rights in her own Commonwealth of VA, but then use her money to go across the Potomac to have her children and get married, thus obtaining the protections she helped deny others. I don’t think she’s much better than Liz.

http://motherwell.livejournal.com/ Raging Bee

“I believe the issue of marriage must be decided by the states, and by the people in the states, not by judges and not even by legislators, but by the people themselves.”

How else do the people decide anything, if not through their ELECTED lawmakers? The only other way I see for “the people” to decide is by mob rule. Is that what Lizzy is advocating here?

And why the fuck is she referring to “the people in the states?” Which other people is she trying to exclude? Or is she trying to imply that “the people” have to decide at the state-government level only?

http://denkeensechtna.blogspot.com Deen

So according to Liz Chaney, gay marriage should be decided by popular referendum only? Even if she did honestly believe that (although I fail to see why she would), the logical follow up question should have been “And how would you vote in such a referendum?”

Personally, I’d say that removing any government bans on same-sex marriage is letting the people decide. After gay marriage is legal, every person can decide for themselves to marry a person of the same sex or not. How much more “let the people decide” can you get than that?

http://motherwell.livejournal.com/ Raging Bee

…my understanding is he did lobby some GOP legislators in MD to get marriage to pass the legislature last year. Other than that, I know of nothing.

That’s IT?! The former co-president of the USA, the guy who pretty much made up all of the intel that got us into the Iraq war, couldn’t do anything more than lobby a few guys in ONE state-house? Surely the Office of Special Plans could have dug up something that would have convinced more Republicans than that. This guy got us into a totally unnecessary war, but he couldn’t get his own party to NOT attack or demonize a group of people who had done no wrong?

Of course, even his not-as-evil daughter didn’t seem to mind the “let the people” decide mantra when she was head of VP Operations for the 2004 Bush/Cheney campaign and they were actively getting the fundie voters out by placing anti-gay hate amendments on dozens of state ballots. She was such a fierce defender of her father and his puppet President that she even helped coordinate the campaign’s official, and officially bullsh*t, response to John Kerry’s “outing” of her during the last debate in 2004…

Yeah, Mary’s hands aren’t totally clean either: her daddy offered her the standard authoritarian deal — “you support the family, and the family will protect you from whatever evil we inflict on ordinary people” — and she took the deal instead of standing up and saying “this is wrong and you know it!”

brucegee1962

Here’s a really sad fact: Liz happens to be extremely fond of her nieces — Mary’s daughters. She just doesn’t want them to have two legal parents.

colnago80

Re Raging Bee the Fairfax fumbler @ #13

Actually, Cheney’s lobbying convinced 2 Rethuglican legislators to change their votes to aye. Sans those 2 aye votes, the measure would have gone down to defeat, which would have been a black eye for the governor. O’Malley owes Cheney big time.

colnago80

Re brucegee 1962 @ #14

It should be noted that Lizzie was very careful to avoid saying anything about her sister. The news media in Wyoming should be all over her to comment on her sister’s situation.

Though I’m not a TV watcher, I am envisioning the dysfunctional and self-parodying Cheney family as the subject of a sitcom or perhaps a reality show. Can’t think of a title at the moment….any suggestions?

http://motherwell.livejournal.com/ Raging Bee

O’Malley owes Cheney big time.

Owes him what? Uncritical acceptance of everything Cheney says from now on?

And what does O’Malley owe Cheney for? A tiny bit of effort to get two Republicans — of FAR lower status than himself — to change one vote on a proposal that was already popular in an already-blue state? That’s even less courage than Cheney showed when he was advocating the Iraq war! I’ll start thanking Cheney when he does some REAL work, like taking on his party’s entire establishment over the same issue.

chilidog99

Cat fight!

(Someone had to say it, don’t deny that you thought it)

colnago80

Re Raging Bee @ #19

O’Malley, who has some presidential ambitions, absolutely had to have the measure pass as it had failed the previous year. Sans Cheney, it don’t pass. If it don’t pass, bye bye any chance at the White House.

I know this is difficult for Bee but the devil must sometimes be given his due.

http://motherwell.livejournal.com/ Raging Bee

If it don’t pass, bye bye any chance at the White House.

Bullshit — supporters of gay marriage would have given him credit for being on the right side, while blaming the Republicans for their obstructionism; and opponents will hate him for it whether the bill passed or not. Cheney’s tiny efforts will have no effect at all at O’Malley’s chance (or lack thereof) at the White House.

rory

@Quodlibet,

Call it ‘Those Fuckers.’ That’s usually what I think when I hear references to the Cheney family.

Michael Heath

Liz Cheney states:

I believe the issue of marriage must be decided by the states, and by the people in the states, not by judges and not even by legislators, but by the people themselves.

Liz Cheney’s argument is in direct contradiction to the equal protection clause of the 14th Amendment. We’d all be far better off if we all started our response to her within this context. Especially given her electoral aspirations.

Ms. Cheney, if elected to office, how much energy would you put into repealing the 14th Amendment so states would have more power to deny some of the people in their jurisdiction equal protection of their inalienable rights under the law? Ms. Cheney, why do you think it’s OK for a simple majority to deny extend government power in order to deny some individuals their liberty rights while the law protects those same rights for privileged others?

eric

@11:

And why the fuck is she referring to “the people in the states?”

That’s a pretty clear reference to not wanting the Obama administration or Congress to decide the issue at the federal level. The people not in the states would refer to the federal government.

Subtext: they know they’ve lost the war, now they are down to trying to win battles.

howardhershey

Hey Sis! I want everybody and his or her brother to have a say about your marriage. Except you and your wife. You don’t count.

colnago80

Re Raging Bee

The problem is that, despite having a large Democratic majority in the Maryland lower house, O’Malley couldn’t convince a number of Democrats in Prince Georges Co.to vote aye because of the heavy opposition of Afro-American (PG County is majority Afro-American) in that jurisdiction to SSM, strongly influenced by Afro-American ministers therein. The rap would have been that he was a weak sister who couldn’t even convince members of his own party to vote aye. Compare that with Andrew Cuomo, another potential candidate, who was able to get SSM through the New York legislature despite the vehement opposition of the Raping Children Church.

It’s all perception. Had the measure failed a second time, he would have been accused of not trying hard enough (a not altogether unwarranted criticism as his support for the measure was a bit tepid).

Moggie

Quodlibet:

Though I’m not a TV watcher, I am envisioning the dysfunctional and self-parodying Cheney family as the subject of a sitcom or perhaps a reality show. Can’t think of a title at the moment….any suggestions?

You don’t know Dick. Or maybe Everybody loves Dick.

http://motherwell.livejournal.com/ Raging Bee

…a not altogether unwarranted criticism as his support for the measure was a bit tepid…

And that would count against him with or without Cheney’s help. In fact, his dependence on Cheney could count against him, even if it got him what he wanted — unless, of course, he could make it look like he strong-armed Cheney, which I consider very unlikely.