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The Classic valve will work fine but if your fingers can walk fast, the Classic will drop off. Then we will see people upgrading like mad to the X Valve.

Garf

Originally Posted by longi

Question, will you be to use either the Classic valve or the RT/X-vlave? As the Classic works at a slightly higher pressure? If so, would the LPR be a preset reg, or say a 2 position reg as an example? (I'm probably getting way a head of myself here!)

The frames will be commerically manufactured to allow all components to bolt into it only one way. This makes for easier assembly and servicing.

The LPR and actuator cylinder will be custom made by us and bolts into the frame. Currently LPRs that are being used float around in frame cavity because it was never made for it.

The frames will be sold either with an LPR pre-installed in the frame or without for those that want to use an external on the ASA (and can be added later).

Our frames work like the ones that are being custom modified for you right now. The only difference is our frames will be commercially produced and both the LPR and actuator cylinder and other components will be custom made to fit like a glove into it.

Garf

Originally Posted by Accident

just out of curiousity, when will you release details on how exactly your frame works? will it use the same basic principle many a DIY'er has been running on? (three way and a spring return actuator) or are you going to hold off on posting technical details until the first run starts to ship?

and are you planing on using another companies lpr standard when mounted internaly? or are you going to use your own model? (just wondering if there will be a place to stuff a scm3 in the frame)

i shot the 68super @ IAO back in 04. it works. they had a booth next to the FBM guys where crazy was doing the lasering on site.

Originally Posted by G-Force Tech

Our 68Super prototype was debuted at IAO many years ago. It was a double tube pneumatic marker. The videos show the 68Super shooting and the integrated body pneumatics. There was shootdown during the video which was from the air chamber not recharging fast enough.

The 68Super has since been redesigned as the S1 with a single tube but we decided not to release it.

As to specs, the trigger pull will be the same as the one you see in the video. We had another video show the trigger being actuated by a drinking straw.

Our company also made upgrades for the Autocockers and Matrix in the past.

We are not about to go to production for a pneumatic Mag frame not knowing if the Mag owners would even consider it unless we do our research first. Just producing a prototype frame just to show you is costly.

What would be important at this stage is, do Mag owners prefer traditional 45 style frames or vertical frames? We can not copy the AGD style triggers as they are copyright designs.

We are targeting a release time frame in a few months. Most of the development work is already done. Just need to mill up a frame and fit components into it, final testing and tweeking for maximum performance

I really hope this comes to market as I would scoop one up without hesitation. But I still think its awful dangerous to build up this much hype months before you even have a production model to show. "A couple of months" sounds vague. And as I read on there is still a lot of work to be done.

This line of marketing has had a "make or break" effect on PB manufacturers in the past. But I do marketing for a living and I know if you overpromise and dont deliver there will be a lynching.

if you could get it done and in decent #'s, atleast 200-300 frames by december that would be great.

when you start getting into spring 08 timeframes i think youl notice interest will drop off drasticly.

i think alot of people just want a nice mag frame upgrade that they dont have to wait for a year +.

and not to diss coolhand, or devil or those that have tried and been making their home pneu conversions but for me personaly to wait a year + with nothing to show just isnt acceptable. People want to pay for something and have it within 2 weeks.

and as said as much as weve been jerked around i dont think anyone wants to wait much longer.

also im interested in what the specs of the frame would be when they are released.

triggerweight(activation weight), max rof, etc

(not directed at geforce)too bad people cant work together these days to release a product people want but isntead want to fight over legalities and exclusive rights.

if you could get it done and in decent #'s, atleast 200-300 frames by december that would be great.

when you start getting into spring 08 timeframes i think youl notice interest will drop off drasticly.

i think alot of people just want a nice mag frame upgrade that they dont have to wait for a year +.

I think what you are missing is the fact that you get a say BEFORE it goes to production. Just as Tom tried/did in the past. If you want production kept secrete so you don't have to anticipate the new product, you get what they THINK you want.

Personally, I think the frame will sale regardless of when they come out. But, this is a niche market so the speed in which they do sale will be the real issue. Theres little doubt in my mind that they will eventually sale every frame made, it just may take a while.

While it is nice to see someone taking this on from a production stand point, vs a Hobby.

As the owner of the hAir Mag I love this gun to death, it has been a flawless marker, and has kiled many many a fool and a few unweary refs

I would suggest that you plan on some electronics upgrade path, this will give the product some room to grow.

-Robert

That would be awesome. If they didn't sell them as and EP upgrade, but made it possible to add the board, noid, switch and even eyes at a later time. I sure as heck would buy one. I'll probably buy one anyhow but a lot faster if I could turn it into an electro pneumatic at home with ease.

Actually, on second thought, I like the idea of no batteries. If this frame performs really well I might not have the need for electronics. It would be great to have that as an option though.

it is my opinion that the G-Force patent is covered by the PTP patent claims. What's not covered by the PTP patent is certainly covered by the DW patent and anything else that might have slipped through the cracks is covered by all the so-called PRIOR ART some of you people keep on bringing up.

How come no hue and cry over this one? How come no claims that they got a patent for something that's existed for years? How come no Vector or Reflex cocker talk in regards to this patent issue? How come all you guys are running to buy one, sight unseen, info unseen, and not screaming and crying about how awful it is that these guys are going to stop everyone from making their own DIY pneumags?

How Come?

Oh, and btw - considering that their issue date is just around the same time that various DIY info was pulled off the web and others claimed they were threatened with C&Ds, how come no one suspects that these guys might be behind it?

REMEMBER: Steve does not work for PTP. Steve's opinions may not be the same as those expressed by PTP. Steve's opinions ARE NOT the official position of PTP. Steve's opinions on intellectual property matters are those of an individual who has worked in the field for over ten years, but they are not the opinion of an attorney.

it is my opinion that the G-Force patent is covered by the PTP patent claims. What's not covered by the PTP patent is certainly covered by the DW patent and anything else that might have slipped through the cracks is covered by all the so-called PRIOR ART some of you people keep on bringing up.

How come no hue and cry over this one? How come no claims that they got a patent for something that's existed for years? How come no Vector or Reflex cocker talk in regards to this patent issue? How come all you guys are running to buy one, sight unseen, info unseen, and not screaming and crying about how awful it is that these guys are going to stop everyone from making their own DIY pneumags?

How Come?

Oh, and btw - considering that their issue date is just around the same time that various DIY info was pulled off the web and others claimed they were threatened with C&Ds, how come no one suspects that these guys might be behind it?

REMEMBER: Steve does not work for PTP. Steve's opinions may not be the same as those expressed by PTP. Steve's opinions ARE NOT the official position of PTP. Steve's opinions on intellectual property matters are those of an individual who has worked in the field for over ten years, but they are not the opinion of an attorney.

Good points. Watch in a year when these frames haven't come out yet. Everyone in this thread will have done a complete 180* and G-Force will be the new company to blame.

I wonder if they were indeed the ones who pulled the DIY info off the web.

How come no hue and cry over this one? How come no claims that they got a patent for something that's existed for years? How come no Vector or Reflex cocker talk in regards to this patent issue? How come all you guys are running to buy one, sight unseen, info unseen, and not screaming and crying about how awful it is that these guys are going to stop everyone from making their own DIY pneumags?

How Come?

I think because people don't really care about the patents, they just want the product. They may discuss the patents and argue about them, but only because that's all they have. At this point I doubt anybody cares who brings them to market, whether it's a DIY kit, DW or PTP, they will sell (At least in niche numbers)

how come no one suspects that these guys might be behind it?

Well, I can say first hand they weren't the ones that gave me a " friendly warning" years ago about a DIY kit I was going to sell.