&quot;Never wanted your approval, never wanted your acceptance. Never wanted to be anything but me&quot; LOG

Join Date: Sep 2008

Location: Buffalo, New York

Posts: 4,561

Quote:

Originally Posted by Butcher of Birth

I understand from Ravenheart that England's rules of free speech do not reach into allowing you say inflammatory things to incite rage, hate, anger, or violence in people. I personally wish the United States would adopt this due in part to the West Boro Church who picket the funerals of dead soldiers with signs reading "GOD HATES FAGS", etc.

We have the right to free speech everywhere. Not just in America, not just in England but everywhere. We are born with those rights. You can say whatever you want no matter how hateful it maybe. Even if someones speech incites violence no one can do anything about it until they actually do something violent. Your rights can only be turned into privleges if you cause physical harm to someone. Do I agree with people who incite violence or the things the West Boro Church has said? No. But I can't stop them from saying the things they say.

I personally wish the United States would adopt this due in part to the West Boro Church who picket the funerals of dead soldiers with signs reading "GOD HATES FAGS", etc.

I pray you never hold a position of power in our government. Ever. That was just a fucking retarded thing to say.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Indestructible

We are born with those rights. You can say whatever you want no matter how hateful it maybe.

I can actually see what you're getting at here, but I can't get behind it. That's a very black-and-white, immature way of looking at the world. Let's be pragmatic: we aren't born with shit. Our laws we've been raised up on and live under give us those rights. Of course, I'm kind of a nihilistic bastard, so take that as you will.

The idea has it's merits. Not to say that I personally agree with it but there are many 'free' places where certain things you say can be punishable by law. I'm living in one right now and I personally don't feel that it's much different from the freedom of speech we have in America. Yes, I prefer the American model but I don't think Logan's idea is anything close to retarded.

Quote:

Originally Posted by jd091

I can actually see what you're getting at here, but I can't get behind it. That's a very black-and-white, immature way of looking at the world. Let's be pragmatic: we aren't born with shit. Our laws we've been raised up on and live under give us those rights. Of course, I'm kind of a nihilistic bastard, so take that as you will.

I think you hit the nail on the head. You could argue that we are indeed born with the inalienable human right to the freedom of speech but even so it's clear that the laws we create are what actually allow us to utilize those rights, be they inalienable or no.

Yes, I prefer the American model but I don't think Logan's idea is anything close to retarded.

Logan hasn't commented here; that was Butcher of Birth.

Come on; I don't care how much you hate them, those Westboro people have every right to do that, and should have that right. It's what's made this country great for so long, and the second you limit that right for anyone (aka, the shit we did to our speech rights in WWI), you go against the most essential values this country holds.

&quot;Never wanted your approval, never wanted your acceptance. Never wanted to be anything but me&quot; LOG

Join Date: Sep 2008

Location: Buffalo, New York

Posts: 4,561

Quote:

Originally Posted by jd091

Come on; I don't care how much you hate them, those Westboro people have every right to do that, and should have that right. It's what's made this country great for so long, and the second you limit that right for anyone (aka, the shit we did to our speech rights in WWI), you go against the most essential values this country holds.

That is a much better (and expressive) method of doing it. But protesting a funeral? That's just classless.

I don't blame the troops for anything, they were decived just like the rest of us. I abhor war but I support anyone who would do what they think is right to defend their country. Problem is they were trapped in the lie, the real enemy is not overseas but here at home. If you want to fight an enemy don't go over seas killing other troops just as innocent as you. Stay home, help restore law and freedom back to America. Help bring us back to the founding principles that started this country and made it great. That is how you bring down the enemy, don't fight wars use peace. We have a chance to do this, and our goals will not be short lived like the founders were. We have a chance to bring this country back to freedom and keep it forever.