Going Old School: Frank Tieri on 'Punisher Noir'

Punisher Noir #1, page 1
At the New York Comic Con, Frank Tieri was named as one of the writers
who will be expanding and exploring Marvel’s “Noir” line this summer
with the five issue Punisher: Noir miniseries (with art by Paul Azaceta).

We spoke with the writer about the coming project, and his “Noir” take on a character that’s pretty noir to begin with.

Newsarama: Ok, Frank, I just have to get this out of the way
first: The phrase that’s been connected to this project after your
appearance at the Mondo Marvel panel at NYCC is… nipple cutting?! Care
to explain?

Frank Tieri: Heh. Oh that. Yeah, well, it’s the Punisher—it is
what it is. And maybe you might say I got a bit over exuberant while
explaining what to expect from the book.

So, what is it exactly they can expect then? It’s obviously going to be
violent—and by violent I mean ridiculously over-the-top violent in a
way only a Punisher comic really gets away with. And just to give you
an idea of some of what I’m talking about …Somebody gets eaten alive by
alligators at the Bronx Zoo. Somebody else literally gets torn in half
on an amusement park ride at Coney Island. Another guy gets his nuts
blown off with a grenade.

… and yeah, somebody loses a nipple by issue #3.

NRAMA: Ouch. So ok, in your view, what does adapting a character
into the "Noir" Marvel Universe mean? What are the ground rules of the
"Noir" projects as they were explained to you?

Punisher Noir #1, page 2
FT: Let’s be honest here… as far as having to adapt a Marvel
character into the Noir Universe, I certainly didn’t draw the short
straw, you know? I mean, the Punisher was practically made for
something like this. Guns, gangsters, the violence we already talked
about—I don’t care what the era is, this kind of stuff is not exactly
foreign to the Punisher, if you know what I’m saying.

NRAMA: Exactly. As you say, more specifically with the Punisher
- he seems rather easy to fit into that milieu. Do you start with his
origin, or do you just start with him at some point in his career?

FT: We sort of do both as we jump around in eras a bit with this
series. Our story actually kicks off with a huge battle scene-- the
Meuse- Argonne Offensive, to be precise-- during World War I, then we
jump ahead to the late 1920’s for what amounts to the Punisher’s origin
and then we find ourselves in the early 1930’s, by which time he’s in
full fledged Punisher mode.

NRAMA: Who is this Punisher? Still Frank Castle, and still basically the same guy and outlook?

FT: Yes and no.

Punisher Noir #1, page 3
The story of Frank Castle, to me, can essentially be boiled down to one
phrase: it’s a story about loss and a man’s response to that loss.
(Intense though that response may be, as we all well know) That was the
thing that Axel stressed to me about this project—yes, we can fiddle
with his character a bit, tweak his origin, change his supporting cast
and surroundings, etc. But at the end of the day, what is at the core
of a Punisher story must remain intact, and that’s very much the case
here.

NRAMA: So what gets the ball rolling here in the first issue? What’s the series about?

FT: If you set aside all the nipple cutting and genital
exploding I spoke about earlier, believe it or not, this is a story
about a father and son. Yeah, you heard me right.

Our story begins when Frank Castlione, a widowed veteran of World War
I, returns home to the Bronx to find he has the difficult task of
raising his son Frankie all by himself there waiting for him. Frankie’s
not necessarily a bad kid per se, but he’s gotten involved with a
street gang and this brings him into conflict with his old man.

The thing is, they had better get their acts together soon because
Dutch Schultz is about to hit town and their lives will never be the
same again.

Punisher Noir, page 4
NRAMA: So Schultz is the main villain of the piece? What was
that like—using a real life historical figure as the foil for this
series?

FT: Well, if you think about it, who would the Punisher be
tangling with if you plopped him back then in the 20’s and 30’s? The
likes of Al Capone, Lucky Luciano, Legs Diamond… and yeah, certainly
Dutch Schultz. In fact, I’d say if you look at the life of the
historical Dutch, he’s practically tailor made to be a Punisher
villain. He was psychotic, ill tempered and extremely violent—and I
don’t think it’s much of a stretch at all that he would actually do the
stuff we have him doing in this series.

That’s the thing when you use a real person like Dutch. Yes, this is
entertainment and no, this isn’t a documentary, but you still want to
keep as close to the actual history whenever you can. So what we’ve
done here is weave our Punisher in and out of the actual events of
Dutch’s life the best that we could while staying true to who Dutch was
and how he lived his life. It’s a bit tricky, but I think we came off
with a nice balance between entertainment and fact.

NRAMA: Who else is in the miniseries with the Punisher? Are
there "Noir" interpretations of people in the Punisher's world that
modern-day fans would know or pick up on? A Microchip analogue? A
Barracuda?

Punisher Noir #1, page 11
FT: Definitely. It was one of the really fun things about doing
a project like this—the little winks we can give to the audience. So
you’ll see our version of the Russian pop up during WWI. You’ll see
Jigsaw working as a hitman for Al Capone (the gag is that the main
reason “Scarface” Al likes to use Jigsaw is because he’s the only guy
with a face more $%^&ed up than his own). And we’ve got Barracuda
as muscle for Bumpy Johnson over in Harlem.

But it’s not just the villains. You’ll even find a version of Soap,
who’s sort of an Elliot Ness type who’s one of the only people to
believe a Punisher actually exists, and Mr Bumpo, who works for the
Castliones in their grocery store and eats probably just as much as he
sells.

NRAMA: What was it like working with Paul Azaceta?

FT: Really great. Sometimes you get paired up in this business
with artists who don’t necessarily fit your style, but that’s
definitely not the case here. Paul brings a grim and gritty style
that’s perfect for a project like this and for what I bring to the
table. I honestly think this project’s going to make this guy a star.

NRAMA: Once again, you're writing the - if not "bad guy," then
the "not good" guy. But the Punisher is no villain - he walks the line.
What's the appeal of a character with such a tight moral code? It
almost seems...limiting...

FT: It’s really a misconception that I only like to write
villains. Yeah, it’s a niche I’ve sort carved out for myself over the
years, but I’ve also done a fair amount of work with characters like
Wolverine, Batman, Iron man and the Hulk, just to name a few. The thing
that all those characters have in common with the villains I write is
flaws—all those characters I mentioned are flawed in some way, shape or
form. All those characters have issues or parts about them that make
them every bit as flawed—sometimes more so—as the rest of us.

And it’s flaws that attract me to a character like the Punisher. Frank
Castle is fighting a fight he can never truly win. No matter how many
mobsters or criminals he wipes out, he can never ever really get them
all, there’ll always be the next guy on the horizon to take their
place. And if we’re going to really get to the core of all this, what
started this whole insane mission off in the first place, no matter
what he does, nothing will ever bring his family back. Nothing can ever
make up for their loss. And yet, he still goes on—stubborn, determined,
obsessed—and if that’s not a great character to write, I don’t know
what is.

Punisher Noir #1, page 17
NRAMA: We've seen many shades of the Punisher, from his earliest
days to Garth's MAX work. Temperament-wise, where does this one fit in?

FT: You know, I think because Garth had such a definitive take
on this character, the inevitable comparison will always come up
whenever anyone does the Punisher from now on. But really, this project
should be regarded as it’s own separate animal—different origin,
different environment, different goals. With that in mind, he’s not as
cold as Garth’s Punisher, I’d say. He’s determined, don’t get me wrong,
but you get the idea that once he finishes off Dutch and Jigsaw and the
rest, that might just be enough for him.

But then again, not to give it away, but the ending of the series may have you believe otherwise, so…

NRAMA: Last shout for people wondering if they should give this a try?

FT: Think of this as sort of like if they if they cast Dirty Harry in Once Upon a Time in America and threw in a touching father/son story for some reason.