No, I’m not completely on the opposite page as you here. I think there’s some nuance to work through but for a large portion of what you’re saying…we agree.

I do note, for accuracy’s sake, that Somalia was not a Clintonian enterprise. George H.W. Bush sent the U.S. military there a couple weeks before the inauguration in what a cynic would suspect was a clear attempt to start the Clinton Presidency on a sour note.

But to that, I suspect you would say — “then why didn’t Clinton just pull the troops right out on day one”? And for that, I have no good answer. The guy was a conservadem…not my cup of tea…he got my vote, as Obama did, by being the least bad of all the bad choices.

As to what we did in 91, here’s the thing — Iraq invaded Kuwait and was making quite a show of preparing to invade Saudi Arabia. We had treaty obligations with Kuwait, but those aside…what would you have suggested as an alternate plan? I am not asking this for any reason but a desire to learn. I am stymied. Kuwaitis were being tortured and murdered. Saddam Hussein was planning to gain control of Saudi oil and possibly perpetrate additional human rights violations farther down the peninsula.

I really don’t like the neocon answer to all that. No, not one bit. I am not sure the Paultards have anything but “pie in the sky” answers either — if they have answers at all.

He ordered the bombing and he and those that dropped the bombs killed these people.

intentionally bombed civilians who were known to be unarmed.

Are you saying the bomb let loose all by itself from the bottom of a plane?

Would you say the best plan would have been for us to simply get the hell out of Kuwait and Saudi Arabia?

The best plan would have been NOT to even be there.

While the 1991 Gulf War might have been necessary for the single purpose of liberating Kuwait from Iraqi occupation

Why do you believe it is necessary to involve oneself in an affair not of our concern?

I cannot blame the military for shooting back.

Would you equally claim

“I can’t blame the murderer for shooting back at the victims he was trying to kill, because – hey, the victims are shooting at him while he is trying to kill them! It must be the victims fault for the shooting!”

Anything you might say after the above is so much dirty water down the drain. Too bad, because I actually enjoy reading this blog, but silly trolls are really not much fun. They just annoy because they know it teases. Ah well, I’m sure eventually you’ll move on and find another playpen.

What nation did Bill Clinton attack? If you’re referring to the Balkan intervention, you and I are probably pretty close to being on the same page. I blasted Clinton at the time for getting the United States embroiled in what I was certain would be a bloodbath. My thinking was that World War One began there, the Serbian-Russian link is a substantial one and I really wasn’t sure I wanted my country — with or without NATO and the UN — tweaking Russia, especially as she was feeling her way after the fall of Communism.

On paper and logically, I still think I was right. If, after a thousand years, Europe is incapable of policing Europe, then what are WE doing there?

In hindsight, though I haven’t changed my view, I cannot argue with th results. Not a single US serviceman or woman died as a result of enemy fire in the Balkans. Accidental deaths and suicides occurred, but were dramatically few — in comparision with Iraq.

As to dropping bombs on women and children, I think the last President to actually issue such an order was Nixon. The Decider’s war of choice in Iraq certainly was immoral, unjustified and brutal. But I don’t know of a single instance where he — or the military — intentionally bombed civilians who were known to be unarmed. That said, the death toll among Iraqi civilians is astronomical. What was the death toll among Serbian civilians as a result of US/NATO bombs?

Of course, you may also be referring to Clinton’s continuation of H.W. Bush “no fly zone” policies. Would you say the best plan would have been for us to simply get the hell out of Kuwait and Saudi Arabia? If so, I’m delighted to finally find something you and I agree on. While the 1991 Gulf War might have been necessary for the single purpose of liberating Kuwait from Iraqi occupation…the same question as with the Balkans remains. When are countries going to state behaving as regionally responsible actors? If Kuwait is invaded and subject to human rights abuses (beyond what the Royal Family was already inflicting on their people — ), then why could the Saudis, Turks, Syrians and a non-Western coalition liberate her? (We know why, of course — because they knew we would do it FOR them…though some of them deserve a modicum of credit for actually participating in ODS.)

But since the no fly zones were in place, and since Clinton lacked the political will or capital to end our attempt at Gulf hegemony, I cannot blame the military for shooting back.

The rocket attacks ordered by Clinton on Sudan and Afghanistan were based on mediocre intel — and were intended to take out Osama bin Laden. They were at least as justified as the original invasion of Afghanistan by The Decider in 2002. I tend to be isolationist and very much appreciate the Libertarian position — up until the United States is actually attacked. Then, I want the enemy prevented from ever doing so again.

Tragically, The Decider took his eye off the ball in Afghanistan and with a close election against a decorated war veteran coming, he opted for war number two — which was 1000% unjustified and totally counterproductive.

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