BREAKING: Ohio State Attacker a Somali Refugee UPDATED

UPDATE: To the surprise of well, no one, Abdul Artan’s attack at Ohio State University today was, in fact, motivated by religion.

Artan was born in Somalia and living in the United States as a legal permanent resident. Investigators discovered a message he posted on a Facebook page before the attack in which he expressed anger about the treatment of Muslims around the world, according to reports from multiple news outlets, citing unidentified law enforcement officials.

Artan was enrolled at Columbus State Community College from the fall semester of 2014 through the summer semester of 2016, according to college spokesman Allen Kraus.

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The now-dead suspect in the Ohio State rampage is a Somali refugee named Abdul Artan. The 18-year-old OSU student had come to America under Obama in 2014 per NBC News. He’s a legal resident of the United States, though not a citizen. Officials have made it clear that the attack had been planned in advance deliberate in nature. It certainly seems reasonable to assume there’s a Muslim terror angle to the attack, especially as the Buckeye rampage shares similar characteristics to terror attacks in Israel of late.

Palestinian attacks against Israelis

The attacks carried out by Palestinians against Israelis often appear to be spontaneous and opportunistic. Many are undertaken by young, unmarried Palestinians. The most common weapon used is a kitchen knife. The second most common is the family car.

Reports by witnesses now seem to indicate that a group of students had assembled outside an Ohio State building in response to a fire alarm. The suspect then plowed his SUV car into the group, exited the vehicle, and began knifing bystanders. Of course, with Ohio State adamantly standing by it’s “gun-free” campus policy prohibiting legally licensed students, faculty and staff from carrying firearms, there initially was no good guy with a gun to stop the rampaging attack.

UPDATED: The vehicle registered to Ali Mohammed.

A police officer rolled up a minute or so later and told the individual, “Drop it a and get down or I’ll shoot.” The attacker failed to heed the commands and was shot dead (see above photo), ending the rapage.

Ten people were taken to hospitals and one suspect was dead after a chaotic car-and-knife attack at Ohio State University on Monday morning, officials said.

The incident was initially reported as an “active shooter” situation, but the suspect did not shoot anyone. Instead, he crashed their car into a crowd and attacked victims with a knife, witnesses and law enforcement officials told NBC News.

A police officer was on the scene within a minute and shot the suspect dead. His name was not released, but law enforcement officials told NBC News he was an Ohio State student, a Somali refugee who was a legal resident of the United States.

The motive was unknown, but officials said the attack was clearly deliberate and may have been planned in advance.

You are projecting 21st century concepts into 18th Century American thought. The Founding Fathers were all in favor of diversity but in the 18th and 19th Century that meant Europeans because that was where civilization was. Europe was a continent of warring nation states until 1945. The conflicts were visceral as anybody with German parents in 1917 could tell you.

The corosive multiculturalism that we see today is not a product of immigration. It is all internally generated by home grown socialists.

The corosive multiculturalism that we see today is not a product of immigration. It is all internally generated by home grown socialists.”
-Thank you. The anti-American sentiment here didn’t start in Syria, or Mexico, but in Berkley and NYU.

From where I sit, racial diversity is so minor as to be meaningless in this context. Ben Carson or Charles Paine, and all their friends are welcome to move in next door to me tomorrow. Someone who does not speak my language, does not expect to work for a living, but does expect to have the latest iphone and the most trendy sneakers, as well as free health care for himself and all his wives, and whose religion tells him to kill everybody *not* of his religion, now, THAT concept of diversity, I can see the equation being true.

I used to have no problem with anyones race or religion! Hell, they could be purple and worship Dog Crap for all I care. But when you start to try to FORCE me and others to submit to your sick mind, then I have a problem!!!!!

Yes. But other than that, the people are pretty much homogeneous. And that is due to 20th century liberalism (which is a mental disorder). I doubt the Vikings would have tolerated other races, except as slaves, captives and prizes.

> I doubt the Vikings would have tolerated other races, except as slaves, captives and prizes.

You’d be surprised, actually. Vikings weren’t particularly racist. Most pagan European people weren’t actually (which is ironic given the present association between neo-pagans and racial theories). Your extended family mattered much more than any sort of broad ethnic affiliation. It didn’t happen on a large scale mostly because of how difficult long-distance travel was in that period – but there were plenty of marriages between adjacent cultures, even when they were ethnically distinct. For example, the Norse heavily intermarried with Finnic people. And Eastern Slavs intermarried with the same in the north, as well as Turkic steppe nomads (like Khazars and Cumans) in the south.

For Norse specifically, they just happened to be living on such outskirts of the world that they didn’t have many neighbors in general, much less ethnically distinct neighbors (except the aforementioned Finns). And there were no economic reasons to travel to Scandinavia – it was backwater with horrible climate, little farmable land, and little in terms of produced goods that would fetch a good price elsewhere if exported. So pretty much the only long-distance contact would be when Vikings would go out to raid distant lands (which they’d do for all these same reasons) – and, of course, such contact is inherently biased in favor of “slaves, captives and prizes”.

The origin of modern European racial theories lies with Christianity. It was that original distinction between Christians and pagans, pretty strictly enforced (no intermarriage without conversion etc), that first established the hard boundary. As the entire Europe became Christianized, the concepts of European ethnic and Christian cultural identities became intermixed (which is how completely ethnically and linguistically unrelated people like Hungarians and Finns got lumped into that predominantly Indo-European arrangement). Then apply several centuries of conflict with the Islamic world, and (re)discovery of Africa and the Americas with their distinctive people – all pagans! – and there you have the forging of the singular “white” identity.

They didn’t conquer “lesser peoples”. They conquered anyone they could conquer who had better land, including other Norse, other Germanic people (e.g. they conquered numerous Anglo kingdoms in Britain), and other “white” people in general.

Like I said, the only reason why they’re so uniform in appearance is because most of their contacts with the rest of the world were through conquest (because they didn’t have anything worth trading for; trade is usually what encourages large-scale exchange of population, and the corresponding assimilation), and because all of their close neighbors were very similar to them in appearance. If you look at where they raided, it was almost entirely other Germanic people, and occasional Celts and Slavs. Well, and Finns, which they did heavily assimilate.

They didn’t have any Africans or Asians to raid – too far away to be worthwhile. But it didn’t prevent the occasional odd traveler from being assimilated into the society, forcibly or otherwise. There weren’t really any cultural obstacles to that. If you had something that would be seen as worthwhile to the extended family / clan – e.g. warrior prowess, or “personal luck” (hamingja), or important connections – you’d be readily assimilated, if you wanted to (obviously, assimilation here means adhering to local customs, paying tribute to the local gods, learning the language and all that). All that mattered to the clan was the accumulation of power / wealth / connections to use to dominate other clans. It didn’t matter where it came from.

Vikings didn’t apply concepts like “strength” (although they’d more often speak of “luck” – look up hamingja) to ethnicities; they applied them to specific people, or families.

So yes, if you were conquered and became a thrall, then you, personally, and your seed, were weak and/or unlucky. Possibly, it implied that your extended family was unlucky, especially if many of them suffered the same fate. It didn’t imply anything about your skin color or the ethnic group you belonged to.

AND WE ARE ALREADY THINKING UP NEW AND EXCITING WAYS TO TAKE MORE AWAY FROM THEM.

Hillary cannot provide (no longer has any influence to peddle) and she has already taken payment for it. So she has floated Chelsea, and now they are trying to shoe-horn in FING GUN GRABBER Petraeus so that he can provide certain deliverables to the POS’s that Hillary sold them to. I imagine that those foreign and domestic bad-actors are worse collections agents than “the Mob”.

This philosophy that attacks upon the west by Muslims will stop only when we kill a sufficiently large number of Muslims in an organized campaign to make them fear us. I estimate the number required to be somewhere between 10 and 30 million, which I arrive at through extrapolation of previous numbers killed by the west in order to deliver the message.

What is clearly seen from reading a history of Islam and their relations with the west is that they never respect the west or Europeans, and they will not cease their predations upon the west until and unless the Europeans slaughter Muslims in numbers so large that even the most fervent and suicidal Muslims say “Hmmm. This hasn’t worked out for us.”

We, the United States, are new to this game. We came of age as a nation in the three hundred years or so that has been the nadir of Islam, following their defeat at Vienna in 1683 through their ultimate decline by the end of WWI, then through the years from WWI to the Arab Oil Embargo of 1973. In that time, Islam was in a retrograde posture, struggling with internal strife and unable to deal with a militarily strong west. Even at the final gasp of what was left of the caliphate system in Turkey, however, the Muslims took it upon themselves to slaughter, rape and starve over a million Christian Armenians.

We have been absurdly lucky as a nation. Our weakness is that we have a great historical ignorance of the history of Islam, with only the Marine Corps Hymn to remind us that we’ve dealt with Muslims before as a nation. Most politicians don’t even know what the phase “…to the shores of Tripoli…” refers to in the USMC Hymn. (To be fair, most politicians don’t know any other lines from the USMC Hymn). We should thank the Almighty that the Marines at take the effort to learn history…

Our political leaders, as well as our populace, have the attention span of a goldfish (“Every trip around the bowl is a new experience!”) and the foresight of a pocket gopher. To our credit, the First Amendment allows us to express un-PC perspectives on this situation, whereas in Europe, their leaders are undertaking active censorship of real, factual news of Muslim atrocities, especially in Germany & Sweden.

Well said. I would add the forgotten footnote in the history books where the Committee of Union and Progress (Young Turks regime) also slaughtered about a half million Chaldean Christians and about a quarter million Greek Christians in 1915. Armenians were just the largest group. Likely over two million Christians in a country of twenty million slaughtered in about six months time.

So just start killing tens of millions of random muslims? Maybe the women and children first? They would be easier and more efficient. Do we have to kill them, ot is just rape and torture enough?
Or is there a spcific sovereign country you would like to invade? How many billions should we spend? How many American deaths are acceptable?
How close do we get to war with a other major global power before we stop? Or is turning this into WW3 an acceptable scenario?
Do you volunteer your family to die first? For America?

Stoney Man, please cite the “constitutional usurpations” that muslims have achived against America.
And I’ll continue to support our entire Constitution, including the Bill of Rights, against anyone of any race or religion who seeks to destroy it for any reason.
I’ll never wake up from that. If you’ve given up on those ideals, America isn’t the country for you. Feel free to let yourself out.

Our culture of democracy prevents us, in good conscience, from slaughtering them. It’s not in our DNA nor our faiths. The ONLY viable solution is to minimize the culling of our non Islamic citizens through armed self defense. Deny Muslims immigration to the US and begin a process of assimilation into western culture for the ones here, while ending all federal subsidies to Muslim communities.

As for Marines, we’ve killed Muzzies for years cause they kill us. As for DG, he’s spot on, America has no idea what’s headed this way. Truth is we can prevent it without reducing ourselves to the likes of them.

JWT: I do not want war. I was opposed to George W. Bush because of his outrageous wars, and I despised Hillary Clinton for her seeming desire to rush to war with Russia.

The thing about Muslims and Islam is not about faith and it is not about religion. It’s about Sharia (which is actually faith and religion and governance). Someone who believes in Sharia cannot assimilate into a society that has a government. It is fundamentally incompatible with their belief system. Someone who believes in Sharia expressly believes that there can be no authority other than God. They cannot follow man’s laws, as it is blasphemy before God. They cannot respect the laws of the USA that conflict with Sharia, as that would be elevating man’s laws above God’s laws.

So how do you peacefully assimilate and integrate a society into your own society, that believes they are ordained from God and mandated by God to destroy your form of government and subjugate you?

You can’t. It’s impossible. So either Sharia has got to go (i.e., they must renounce it), or they’ve got to go (be deported). There is no other alternative. Well, I mean, there is one, which is they take over and enforce Sharia on everyone, but let’s just say that I would be in favor of war over that outcome.

I like this pretty well, except for the number of dead it would take to change the course of events. My estimate would be most easily stated as “all of them”, but that is not accurate. What I really mean is that you could no longer find one, since no one would ever again admit to being muslim, as he would be killed on the spot. Those remaining can rewrite the Koran and rename the religion, they would be needing all new preachers anyway since the would all have mysteriously disappeared. I would guess between 100 and 300 million. But the world is overpopulated and muslims are working hard at increasing that overpopulation, so it would all be good.

Stoney Man, if that’s how you saw the Patriot Act, then may your chains rest lightly on your chest. I saw it as: Cause-bedwetting statist demand government keep us safe=Effect-government happily taking our rights and our property.
It’s people like you that got the Patriot Act passed.

Well, I’m going to go by past experience and say that my perspective and say that my point of view is very similar to yours. Other than you know a whole lot more than I do about guns. And history. And engineering. But I do know the Marine Corps hymn.

Seeing as Trump is now President-Elect, a candidate who I supported with a lot of time and money, I’m curious as to what more the AI should do. I’ve asked the cop haters what I can do to improve police relations and accountability, with disappointing results.

Besides giving money to pro-gun agencies and candidates, supporting enhanced BG checks from terrorist nations, arguing with dolts on FB about the dangers of Islam, supporting immigration reform and deportation, what else can and should be done?

I don’t even think we need immigration reform. At least not new laws. We just need to enforce the ones we have, and rescend unconstitutional executive orders that violate our laws.
As far as refugees from Syria and other war torn areas, I’m against it and I always have been. They should stay in their country and fight. I would entertain a considerarion for children, but thats about it.
I’m all about America first. I just can’t stand the “muslim boggieman, kill em all” crap.

Its easy to tap into the dark side of our brain stem, much easier to cull than finding non violent means to solve the problem. Trouble with Muslims is the wall around the Mosque and the mallalleable mind. Islam can only change from within, similair to the Protestant Reformation and we’ll have to work through the stacked bodies until the faith can control itself.

The Founders didn’t limit immigration in any way. All it took to become an American citizen under the very first laws was to reside in the country for 10 years and pay taxes; and yes, you had to be white. But residence was available to anyone who had the means to travel here in the first place – no visas, no limit on duration of stay.

It wasn’t until the middle of the 19th century that they started to talk about restricting immigrants that were “culturally incompatible”; and the first group so targeted were Catholics, especially the Irish (but even then it was not via laws, though such were advocated by some). Next one was Chinese, because they are “stealing jobs”. Then, everyone non-white, because “America is a white nation”.

The first law that prohibited entry to any category of people (Asian contract workers, to be specific) was the Page Act of 1875. So it took 100 years to get from the “all men are created equal” to there. Until 1875, there was no such thing as “illegal immigrant” in US.

“[When] the [Virginia] bill for establishing religious freedom… was finally passed,… a singular proposition proved that its protection of opinion was meant to be universal. Where the preamble declares that coercion is a departure from the plan of the holy author of our religion, an amendment was proposed, by inserting the word “Jesus Christ,” so that it should read “a departure from the plan of Jesus Christ, the holy author of our religion.” The insertion was rejected by a great majority, in proof that they meant to comprehend within the mantle of its protection the Jew and the Gentile, the Christian and Mahometan, the Hindoo and infidel of every denomination.” –Thomas Jefferson: Autobiography, 1821.

Virginia. Former colony of His Majesty King George the Third. Late a state of the union of the United States. The Virginia constitution pertained to Virginia alone.

How we forget the difference in political perception of the founders, who were not citizens of political subdivisions (precincts) of the national government of the United States, and of ourselves, today.

Roof was raised “racist killer”. I have had some indoctrination in lutheran beliefs (love thy god and hate all catholics), and never heard about deifying mass murder. Maybe it was a secret at the time.

Well, clearly, we need immigration control, because this was caused by an immigrant.
And we need knife control, because it was caused by a knife.
And we need car control, because it was caused by a car.

The insanity is apparent.

Near as I can tell, we have a case of a Muslim immigrant who went to Pakistan, then moved here legally, and committed murders because he was upset at America’s interference in Muslim countries.

What do you think this will do for the national conversation about Trump’s call for “extreme vetting”?

And to think, Hillary wanted to increase our intake of Syrian refugees by 550%… no questions asked.

Trump says a lot of things that sound insane, but maybe it’s just his delivery, because when you peel back the bombastedness and the pomposity, he usually ends up kind of on the right side of the issues… we’re not going to have knife control, we can’t have car control, but it’s screamingly obvious that we need some level of immigration control. If someone chants “death to America”, we shouldn’t let ’em in. How insane would you have to be, to disagree with that?

Not hardly. You were wrong with the Houston shooter. Not muslim or religious at all, parents were hindu, committed the shooting while wearing nazi regalia.
You also missed the shooting of the police officers, saying it was muslim terrorists, when it was another American black man. You claimed that it was BLM and basically the same thing.
If you just scream jihad every time, eventually you’ll be right. But most of the time, you’ll be wrong.

Right now there are a number of people upset about who this was and disappointed about who this was not. People were praying that this was a white Christian with a gun. What is even worse is there are still some of them that will use this as a reason to call for restrictions on your rights no matter the fact of this act of terror.

Shannon Watts was (at least, until she blocked me) going on and on about this event to push gun control, never mind that 1) OSU is a gun-free zone and 2) the attacker didn’t use a gun. So yeah, definitely still calling for a restriction on our rights.

The school issued an active shooter alert. So in this case, the media wasn’t necessarily inaccurate in their reporting. It seems academia takes it for granted that an emergency response must involve a threat with a gun.

The school issued an “active shooter alert” because “active stabber” isn’t in their vocabulary, let alone their automated alert system. In their precious little left-wing echo chamber, they have never entertained the thought that weapons other than guns can and have been used to commit mass murder.

It’s worse than that….gun grabbers find gun violence is acceptable in gangland and the inner-city, just so long as people who go where the gun-grabbers hang out aren’t allowed to pose the threat of a gun at their favorite shops.

This is just another example of gun-happy Americans. The attacker only had a knife, and the cop on the scene used his gun, instead of non-lethal measures. Gun against knife is just not fair; just not right that shooting and killing someone is the go-to means of dealing with a dispute.

You’re obviously ignorant to what a man with a knife can do. A knife welding Muslim psycho can cover almost 50 feet of ground and stab you in the neck before you can even draw a weapon. So it’s not being gun happy you dumbass it’s called being smart and don’t the world a favor!!

The Muslim world has been convulsed by a particular kind of social movement called a “revitalization movement” (see below), a consequence of which has been the weaponizing of a significant portion of traditional/fundamentalist Muslims who gain status from attacking non-believers.

From Infoplease:

“revitalization movement, political-religious movements promising deliverance from deprivation, the elimination of foreign domination, and a new interpretation of the human condition based on traditional cultural values, common in societies undergoing severe stress associated with colonial conquest and intense class or racial exploitation.”

Even if you don’t believe race plays a siginificant role in behavior, nobody can deny that middle eastern countries are particularly hostile toward the United States at the moment. Taking refugees from there would be like taking refugees from Berlin during WWII. The United States doesn’t really have any moral obligation to take them either. Yes, the whole situation is our mess, but we should be paying reparations and helping them rebuild rather than taking them in and opening the country to such attacks.

“Our” mess? Couldn’t possibly be a mess whose roots lie in the arbitrary borders created by the Sykes-Picoult agreement that divided up the Ottoman Empire after WWI, could it? Or the beginnings of the Muslim Brotherhood in Egypt, created in part by 2 German spies in WWI in an attempt to disrupt British operations there? The modern concept of terroristic jihad was largely created by them. But of course, let’s blame the US for all of the problems in the middle east and the rest of the world.

Oh come on. Even if other western countries set up the powder charges, the united states was unquestionably the one who blew the whole thing up with the invasion of Iraq. The U.S. is to blame for a good portion of it.

Reducing gun violence is as simple as taking away the guns. How could it be simpler? Yes, bad guys will always be bad, but reducing the amount of guns makes it harder for EVERYBODY to get a gun. How many mass stabbings have you heard of in countries with tight gun control laws compared to mass shootings in the US?﻿

“Reducing gun violence is as simple as taking away the guns” and replacing them with knives. Then you can take away the knives and replace them with clubs, then take away the clubs and amputate everybody’s hands.

Why are you so focused on gun violence rather that violence? You honestly believe that objects cause violence rather than people?

“Yes, bad guys will always be bad, but reducing the amount of guns makes it harder for EVERYBODY to get a gun”

Listen, dumbass, a gun is what SAVED these people! It was an officer with a gun who stopped a murderous rampage.

If you had your way, the officer wouldn’t have had a gun, and so he would have had to fight off a knife-wielding maniac with, what, a bobby’s billy club?

Guns Save Lives. That’s what they’re for. I’ve got dozens of ’em, and their only purpose is to protect me and mine. Guns SAVE lives. Ban guns, and we go back to the days where the big and strong (and armed) can bully and badger the rest of us. No thanks.

As if we didn’t have enough native-born nutjobs like Dylann Roof in our country, we import them from the Third World by the boatload (or the truckload).

Is the nation’s need for people to clean the toilets of the wealthy so acute that we need to open our borders wide enough for the mentally unhinged and Islamic zealots to flood in along with the merely tired and poor?

If I hear this “tired and poor” bit one more time I’ll, well, do nothing. But how a 20th century social activist agitating for ever-more immigration came to tag our immigration strategy as a search for more of the world’s tired and poor astounds me. We want the world’s intelligent, ambitious, and law abiding. The tired and poor can stay where they are.

No, it isn’t any longer an issue of labor market economics or “need.” There are millions enough from the central and south American countries who flood the market with cheap labor for the purposes of the elites.

The real reason for this flood of “refugees” from the middle east (as well as from central/south America) is the same as it is in Europe: The pay-as-you-go welfare systems are looking at a demographic collapse in the next 10 to 20 years. Schemes like Social Security are basically Ponzi schemes, which require ever-increasing numbers of young(er) workers paying into the system in order to support the people who are drawing on the system.

All western democracies, as well as Japan, have these sorts of “pay-go” schemes, and they’re all in trouble. In Japan, they’ve not imported people to deal with their shortfalls – they’ve just gone from a debt level of 90% debt:GDP to 235% debt:GDP in order to fund their system(s). Since most of their debt is held by their own citizens, it’s holding up – for now.

No doubt the authorities are diligently searching for a motive behind the random and unprovoked attack by the Somali student. In a break with longstanding policy, the FBI has yet to issue a statement assuring us the incident has nothing to do with terrorism. Five bucks says the motive is pronounced “Allahu akbar!”

Some of the big scary ones have 30 gallon gas tanks. Nobody NEEDS 30 gallons, you can get everything done with 10. Why 10? It’s arbitrary, and it sounds like a pretty number. It’s still double digits, even. I think 90% of Americans will agree with us.

“praying for Ohio State. Crazy this has become the norm in today’s society”

My friend posted this and it made me super annoyed as we knew nothing about what happened. Also depending on what happened this is exactly the norm depending on which society you live in. Chicago perhaps? Or Israel for another?

As risky as it was to read her comments while I’m trying to eat lunch, I did go to the Shannon Watts Twitter feed and sure enough, huge capitalizing on this event, how lucky we are that he did not have a gun, almost gleeful that it was a knife attack, etc. etc. Happy I’m sure that it was a police officer that was there immediately to stop the carnage.

He was not there as a result of a regular dispatch to this crisis, he was already very near because a fire response was checking out a gas leak. If this had been a “regular” police response, two or three minutes delay, imagine how many more people could have been stabbed

We may not hear it because a cop did the shooting, but I have heard it argued before that if we had eliminated guns in our society, no one would have died there. That was attempting to fight CC, but the same logic could argue to disarm cops. No one would have died! Maybe another 100-200 disfigured for life, millions and millions of dollars in medical fees, more millions trying and incarcerating the punk for the rest of his life.

Wonder what the left of center Snowflakes in that messed up Facility are going to be defending the Terrorists act with there today? Believe there will be a lot of concealed carry on that campus from here on out. I wouldn’t ever go on that campus again without being armed if there are Muslims there. Don’t give much of a shit if you gentle reader thinks that makes me something other than a very pissed off American but the facts say he is a Muslim Terrorist.

I’m pissed almost as much with the people who run that place as I am with the idiots who let him and his family into my country with their cultural biases in the first damn place, to say nothing of the attacker himself.

Islam is a political ideology masquerading as a religion with millions of twisted followers hell bent on killing every Christian in the world….first. Then the other religions of the world in some kind of order second. Think that is BS? Read their book yourself and then tell me what you think.

I will have nothing to do with any of them because if they admit they believe the Koran and follow it, I’m a first priority target to kill as an unrepentant Infidel. They will not rest until the whole world is Muslim and we are their slaves.

I have lived a long fruitful life and am a surviving Combat Vet who recently I’ve adopted what I call the “Chief Crazy Horse’s” battle philosophy. That is what you ask?…..simple…..”Today is a good day to die.”

Crazy Horse, War Chief of the Lakota Sioux battle legends is credited with screaming that as he jumped on his war pony after exhorting his warriors to go kill Custer and his 225 mounted troops who had just rode down off the hills there above the Little Big Horn River Mt. into Crazy Horse’s end of a camp with around 5000 plains Indians from various tribes – June 26, 1876. A real dumb ass move considering his Crow scouts had been warning him for days about the size of the camp.

I find it settling for me. Are you ready to deal with this? None of us are going to avoid this….don’t BS yourselves in the slightest. It has gone way to long.

So fruitcake 18-yr-old Somali student pulls fire alarm, gets in car and watches until students evacuating due to fire alarm form up where he knows they will because he’s a student. Rams his car into them, gets out and starts slashing with a knife. Officer responding to fire alarm pulls up and tells him to quit, then drops him. This all took one (1) minute. A couple minutes later the panic alarm goes out on the school’s notification system, and police from thousands of miles away begin responding to a dead kid. Right *now* the news media is still completely focused on this absolutely nothing story. We have to hear all about what the ATF is doing, maybe they thought he was drunk, since he did not have a firearm. But on, and on, and on, without even a break to mention how many were murdered in Chicago today. The guy was an Islamic extremist terrorist, is enjoying his gaggle of Virginians as we speak, dead and gone, fvck him and move on.

OK, if you are using this to call out race, you are human garbage.
If you are using this tragedy as a means to advance your political agenda, you are also human garbage.

I’m a gun owner. This likely could not have been avoided, but we won’t know for awhile. A good guy with a gun was very nearby and intervened quickly and well. Kudos to OSU and Law Enforcement that ended this decisively and swiftly.

If you’re a white supremacist, you’ve been fooled. There is biologically no such thing as race, you’ve been lied to.

Biological races within a species do exist, but as far as humans go, they don’t really correspond to what people traditionally perceive as races (i.e. there’s no “biological white race” or “biological black race” or “biological Asian race”).

About the only conventional human “race” that actually corresponds to something identifiable as race on biological level are Australian Aborigines – which also shows what’s necessary to form a “real” race (which is about 45 thousand years of nearly complete isolation).

On the other hand, if you took the conventional definition, and tried to somehow shoehorn it onto genetics, you’d get really weird results. For example, if blacks are a single race, then everyone non-black is also a single race, except for Australians (because genetic differences between Europeans and Asians are far smaller than between various African peoples). On the other hand, if whites are a single race, then there about half dozen other races in Asia, and hundreds of races in Africa (all different from each other as much as each of them is from whites).

There are ways to pick specific genetic markers (out of many more actually available) such that they would cluster along the lines of conventional races. But, of course, the pick in this case is guided by the initial assumption – you could just as well assume other, completely different, races, and there would be equally valid genetic markers that would cluster accordingly.

In practice, what this all means is that race is fundamentally a cultural convention, with prominent (to human perception) phenotype markers, like skin color or eye shape, used as rough heuristics derived from that convention.

This also explains why racial classifications vary depending on cultural context – in US and most of the rest of the Americas, for example, “Hispanic” is often seen as a distinct race, but it is not treated as such in Europe and elsewhere. Why? Because in the Americas, Hispanic ancestry generally correlates with a different cultural background from non-Hispanic, due to the history of the continent, while in Europe that is not the case.

It all makes a lot of sense when you remember that basically the entire population of the world outside of Africa are descendants of small groups of people from Africa. Each group represented a small slice of the whole genetically diverse pie, and so is much more genetically homogeneous. Africa itself, meanwhile, remained that crazy Petri dish where the entire original gene pool is at play (including those genes that Eurasian migrants carried, but excluding mutations that they have developed since leaving… though of course those were often reintroduced later by back migrations).

Another way to look at it is that Africa has been inhabited by humans and their ancestors for millions of years, while all other regions are populated much more recently (under 100k years). So there has been a lot more mixing going inside Africa to diversify the gene pool.

This doesn’t scare me too much. I’m much more likely to get killed by some deer running out in front of my car.

But, then again, I train and carry a gun for the same reason I wear a seatbelt… so I’m prepared for the unusual event and don’t have to be afraid that some guy might come at me with a knife and I won’t have any option but to hope I’m faster than him.

And America, a good christian nation, sent its army to Vietnam and over the course of a ten year long war killed at least two million people. There are some that think that estimate is quite low. Region wide the estimate is 5 million. We count approximately 1400 still missing in action. The Vietnamese count 300,000. Please show me the moral high ground we are holding onto.

The enemy isn’t Islam, it’s Salafism. What many in the gun community fail to realize is the diversity of Islamic sects and schools of thought. The vast majority of these are benign (unless mixed with government, in which case all religions become tyrannical), but Salafism is the exception. This puritanical ideology that is the cause of the vast majority of terrorism in today’s world. Al Qaeda, Daesh, Al Shaba, etc are all rooted in it. Because of their literal interpretation of the Quran, Salafis heavily encourages violence against anyone opposing them, especially westerners. Unfortunately, these violent sentiments have spread across the world in the Sunni communities, largely due to Saudi Arabian influence and money poured into mosques and community centers across the world, especially in Europe, Canada and the US. If we want to combat terrorism, we cannot target all of Islam, rather we must focus on reducing Wahhabi influence over sunnis in the west and counter Saudi influence. Refugees should also be screened for such radical sentiments as well.

Your analysis is on target. What people here identify as “Islam”, “Muslims”, etc, might be simple shorthand for the perverted belief system you described. Whatever the identifier, the solution remains unchanged: elimination of the threat. In 1300 years, conversation has failed to alter anything.

I definitely see the need for militarily destroying our terrorist enemies, but we have to understand that today’a threat needs to be fought on an ideological basis more than the use of force. I daresay the rise of Salafi sentiments among sunnis is due to Bush’s foolishness regarding foreign policy and Obama’s continuation of those policies. If we want to ensure Sunni moderation in the long term, we have to end Daesh and stop active interventionism after the conflict. On the home front, as I said before, if we want to ensure victory and stop lone wolf attacks, we need to go after the mosques and religious leaders taking Saudi cash. Targeting the Sunni communities as a whole won’t do anything but increase resentment, but properly targeting pro Saudi community leaders will help significantly.

The Crusades were a RESPONSE to Islam intrusion/incursion/attack. A death cult will not be amenable to persuasion. When a religion declares that the Great Spirit demands believers annihilate unbelievers, persuasion leaves them no viable avenue to eternal life. Can some be talked-into a peaceful co-existence with the rest of humanity? Maybe. But faith in logic and reason as the key to renewed thinking of an entire religion is worse than misplaced. Bluntly, Evil does not quake before soaring intellect, and life-changing rhetoric.

“The Crusades” are more generally known as war over Jerusalem and the Middle East. Few actually know there were 12 “crusades”, who was involved, or where they occurred. It is the generally known “Crusades” to which I speak. The Salfaists do not need external force to cause them to attack the rest of humanity. Bush doesn’t matter, Clinton didn’t matter, Carter didn’t matter. The radicalized Islamic murderers are self-actualized, self-incentivized. The West did not/does not provide provocation.

Elimination of threat is impossible so long as there remains state sponsorship of it. Salafism wouldn’t be spreading like wildfire, if not for thousands of Salafi madrasa openly teaching it throughout the world, and openly funded by the money from countries like Saudi Arabia and Qatar. And we give them the money to do so by buying oil and gas from them, and look the other way when they spend it.

You want to uproot Salafism? Then Saudi Arabia must be destroyed as a nation-state. Do that, and 90% of those madrasa will close in a year; and with them, the stream of new recruits will trickle down to much more manageable levels.

Unfortunately, as much as Pro2@ supporters would promote “campus carry, nationwide CCW, or just plain exercise your 2nd amendment rights without asking for government, or police permissions.” The responding Police will treat the armed defender, or defenders as immediate threats no matter what! With the excuses of “going home after there shift by any mean necessary, or can’t tell good guys from bad guys, or ONLY the police will be armed–through job entitlements…” That would have to change…Full independent civilian reviews boards would need to be instituted…And a complete ban on Law enforcement: Police Unions—prohibition in public services….

To brand all Somalis or all Muslims as terrorists is to behave like the gun grabbers. To them, we are all murderers. Most of us just haven’t found a victim yet. The percentage of Muslims who commit acts of terrorism is tiny just like the percentage of gun owners who commit violent crimes.

There is no way, such as banning Muslim immigration or restricting firearms ownership, to stop terrorism wholesale. It can only be done retail, that is, one terrorist at a time. That takes individuals, whether they be police officers or private citizens, with the tools and skills to stop the terrorists in their tracks as soon as they begin an attack.

Wayne LaPierre was ridiculed for saying, “It takes a good guy with a gun.” That’s what it took at Ohio State. Had there not been a police officer nearby, there would have been more victims. A private citizen, armed with a 5-shot revolver and no spare ammunition, could have done equally well.

“To brand all Somalis or all Muslims as terrorists is to behave like the gun grabbers. To them, we are all murderers. Most of us just haven’t found a victim yet. The percentage of Muslims who commit acts of terrorism is tiny just like the percentage of gun owners who commit violent crimes.”

I find it more dangerous to turn a blind eye to their ideology that specifically calls for the death of those that aren’t Muslim — Jews, for example.

You can create a very simple questionnaire that will very quickly ID any Muslim unfit to be in America.

1. Are you for or against the death of Jews?
If for, and given the opportunity to act on your beliefs, would you?
2. Are you for or against the death of non-Muslims?
If for, and given the opportunity to act on your beliefs, would you?
3. What would you do if someone drew a satiristic cartoon of the Prophet in your presence?
4. What would you do if someone said something inappropriate about the Prophet in your presence?
5. What would you do if one of your children became a Christian?
6. What would you do if one of your children came out is homosexual?
7. Do you renounce any teachings in the Koran that call for the death or mistreatment of any non-Muslims?

Here in United States, we do not condone violence or any actions that will put in danger it’s citizens.

This person will now demonstrate #3 and #4 right now in front of you. Keep your hands visible at all times.

Percentages aside, there is a big difference between muslims and gun owners as groups. Muslims commit their terrorist attacks BECAUSE of islam, whereas gun owners don’t go shooting people because of their gun ownership.

So, a person that is no longer interested in abiding by Western laws and ideologies asserts his country-of-origin’s code of conduct on the American public and then gets shot by a good guy American with a gun for safety non-compliance.

How is this not a pro gun-win?

I grew up overseas and graduated from a US-funded private high school in Islamabad Pakistan (I lived all over Asia and some parts of the Middle East — Foreign Service brat). And I can count on both hands all the rich Pakistani nationals I personally knew of that bad-mouthed America all the while having no problems being hypocrites and coming to the US for college and all the other benefits.

I’m not saying you need to love America to be here, but really, if you can’t behave like a respectable adult while reaping the benefits of the country you are currently in (or are going to), you can stay home. And if you act like a mongoloid in the US with your weapon and ideology of your choice, you will reap what you sow.

Sure, JWT, the “Muslim Immigrants” are just poor, misunderstood innocents that we should welcome with ‘open arms.’ Sure. They absolutely are not an invading army with no inclination to assimilation into our culture at all.

You need to wake the eff up, sir. Head in the sand is no way to go through life. And I don’t care about the 0.00001% Muslims you have met that you have deemed “ok.” Read some history and learn the truth of your belief in Magic Dirt Theory.