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I know a forum where the question of questionable water treatment devices was raised. The thread is still alive almost a year later with a couple hundred replies from every wacko salesman in the industry. Those that believe, believe and all the science, logic, or proof will not deter them. They are an awful lot like liberals

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believers. how about the bible thumpers (christians). now there is a bunch. but to the wise i've walked on water. so send all your money to brother bob reid, po box 277, fulton, in 46931-0277. praise jesus. lol. breid................

Comment

what I would like to see a true independent laboratory tests, that would either prove it to be effective or "voodoo".

all I know is that magnetism has effects on most products, and living and not living things, and how it makes things behave.

when I was in high school, I did some experiments with magnetism and plants,

I set up a magnet field, with some iron bars wrapped with copper wire, and hooked to a door bell transformer, I at first made a ring, and it was attached to a stand with two rings, the next time I conducted the experiment, I make a rack with 4 bars that were horizontal,
the first I put the plants in the rings the second I place a number of plants with in the bars, one placed about 3" up and the nest about 9" up,

I used beans, and corn, and a few other that I do not remember now,

on some plants it stunted there growth, on some they nearly grew them selfs to death, long spindly and on one there was nearly no effect,

what does this have with water softening, probably nothing, but
magnetism or AC frequency has some effect on things,

some times I wish I could have some frequency generators and tried different frequency's other than 60 cycles,

when I was at the state science fair I know NASA was taking notes on the experiment,

I to this day do not know what was the cause of the different growth rates, in the plants over the nonmagnitized plants, that were out side of the field, was it that minerals were effected, or what, I do not know. and what research I have looked since I have found very little.

I know they make magnet wraps for race horses, for injurers, and there are companies that do the same for human aces and pains as well, I know of a few who use some of the magnetic items and claim they help in pain and healing.

When I had a MRI on my knee that I tore up I could feel the magnetism passing through the injured area, and have talked to others that have said the same.

some think that the magnet fields is what guides the birds on migration,

what I would like as said before is some true independent documentation on the subject,
as I know that some AC fields appear to affect things that one would not think they should,

look at micro waves, they heat food and water,

some claim that if one microwaves water and used it to water plants that it effects the plants, (I have not tried it), I am not ready to say it is all rubbish, but I do not have one yet so I am not convinced to part with money, so I do not necessary believe as of yet,
but I do know AC frequencies can effect things. and I am guessing that DC magnetism does to,

Push sticks/blocks Save Fingers
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
"The true measure of a man is how he treats someone who can do him absolutely no good."
attributed to Samuel Johnson
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
PUBLIC NOTICE: Due to recent budget cuts, the rising cost of electricity, gas, and oil...plus the current state of the economy............the light at the end of the tunnel, has been turned off.

but you may say that frequencies, and magnetism does not not affect non living,

yes it does, we have Iron a mineral metal that is very effected by magnetism, we have other conductive minerals such as copper and gold silver and other that magnetism will move the electrons on there molecules, we have minerals (basicly a sand) in transistors and electronics that work as switches and makes computers possible,

Now I am not saying that all are effected but there are ones that are effected, and it is easily effected, when electricity passes through copper there is not a distinguishable difference to me at least to be able to see it passing through,
and some are more effected and some are less, take the mixtures (called stainless steel) some is magnetic and some is not, some is only when it broke off the original piece,

so saying that calcium and magnesium and other minerals are not affected in some way, could be saying the world is flat, today,
are they affected or not I do not know,

Push sticks/blocks Save Fingers
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
"The true measure of a man is how he treats someone who can do him absolutely no good."
attributed to Samuel Johnson
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
PUBLIC NOTICE: Due to recent budget cuts, the rising cost of electricity, gas, and oil...plus the current state of the economy............the light at the end of the tunnel, has been turned off.

Comment

I'm not saying that your high school experiments were invalid or that birds don't navigate by magnetism. I really don't know much about plants or birds or instinctive behavior. It may well be. I do know that any legitimate scientific research has to include statistical studies, control populations and be repeatable by other people in other places. There are good reasons for these requirements. Remember "cold fusion"? Big uproar.... never been demonstrated since. I'm sure the original guys saw something. They just didn't see what they thought they were seeing.

I do know that historically there is a long tradition of charlatans that will trump up all manners of pseudo-science to separate people from their money.

Magnets are popular for this. There are magnetic bracelets and other things that have been claimed to cure everything from rheumatism to cancer. People - honest ones - swear that they alleviate pain. Or do they alleviate pain because the wearer believes that they do? I know I have my opinions on this question. If they worked, as demonstrated by statistical double blind testing, the pharmaceutical companies would have the FDA declare them "prescription-only" and you would have to pay $100 for a $2 magnet. But it's not happenieng, after 20 years of claims.

There are magnets that you attach to your fuel line that are supposed to improve your mileage. Where is the extra energy coming from? The lab tests prove it works. Which really only proves that lab tests can be faked. It's a lot like the famous "100 mpg carburetor" from the 50's & 60's, and the related urban myths that the oil companies had the inventor killed. Well, sorry to say that you can't get energy out of fuel that isn't there to start with, and you can't violate the laws of thermodynamics. You don't see universities testing these things because the universities have bigger fish to fry and can't afford to waste resources on stuff where the physics doesn't even make sense.

I was involved at UCLA in the development of hydrogen fuels for IC engines and various tests of gasoline additives in the late 1970's. You still hear about these things today and while there have been advances, many of the problems we faced then are still problems today. But they get worked on because the basic physics and chemistry makes sense.

A regular old softener works because the the Ca, Mg and other ions are taken out of the water by an ion exchange process that is pretty simple. Where does the hardness go in this device? After it leaves the device does it somehow "remember" and "choose" not to precipitate out? Hmmmmm.

Do you ever wonder why legitimate inovation is accepted but this oddball stuff remains on the fringe forever? My bet is that this gizmo will never catch on! We shall see. I don't know more than anyone else.... just my opinion & prognostication.

I do believe that Innovation is good. Hucksterism and pushing snake oil, though, should be a crime.