I live for things like this. I must admit to knowing nothing about this Bill, but certainly you are not saying that anyone who can get to this country regardless of how they get here should be granted "full rights". I would be interested in how this would play out and what the implications of such a policy would be.

Ninja, If by
"I would be interested in how this would play out and what the implications of such a policy would be" you mean this is a pretty tricky issue, I'd have to agree it will be interestng to see how it plays out.

the shoemaker is facist? They hate people with different faces than them?
Just because you're unable to respond to him intelligently doesn't mean you have to resort to an ad hominem attack.
btw I was under the impression that this was a musical and not a politrickal forum.

IT SEEMS IF YOU TRY TO SPEAK W/REASON ON THIS YOU ARE IMMEDIATELY LABELED "RACIST" OR "IGNORANT" BY SOME , BUT A LOT OF PEOPLE WAIT A LONG TIME ON THE LIST TO COME HERE LEGALLY, INCLUDING MEXICANS. ISN'T IT JUST A LITTLE UNFAIR TO THEM FOR PEOPLE WHO DON'T HONOR OUR LAWS LIKE THEY DO TO GET THE SAME BENEFITS. IT IN THE END ALL COMES DOWN TO TOO MANY PEOPLE COMING IN TOO FAST FOR ANY NATION TO ABSORB THEM, REGARDLESS OF NATIONALITY OR RACE. WE CAN'T BUILD SCHOOLS, HOSPITALS, PROVIDE SERVICES FAST ENOUGH WHEN WE HAVE MILLIONS OF PEOPLE COMING EVERY YEAR, AND ESPECIALLY WHEN THE MAJORITY OF IILEGAL OR "UNDOCUMENTED" ARE POOR WHO DON'T PAY MUCH BACK INTO THE SYSTEM. ITS UNFORTUNATE TO HAVE TO SAY THAT, BUT ITS THE TRUTH. PLUS THE PEOPLE WHO COME HERE "ILLEGALLY" GET SCREWED THEMSELVES BECAUSE THERE ARE ALWAYS PEOPLE COMING IN WHO WILL WORK CHEAPER THAN THEM, SO THE CYCLE OF POVERTY IS VERY DIFFICULT TO BREAK. PLUS MEXICO ACTUALLY DEPENDS ON THEIR FORMER CITIZENS LIVING A FOREIGN SENDING MONEY BACK HOME TO KEEP ITS ECONOMY AFLOAT. SO YOU SEE, THE ISSUE ISN'T AS SIMPLE AS "FULL RIGHTS FOR ALL IMMIGRANTS"

On March 2, 2006 , the Southern California based coalition "March 25 Coalition Against HR4437" held a press conference to announce a major mass mobilization against the passage of the Sensenbrenner Bill, to be held in downtown Los Angeles on Saturday March 25, 2006. The march expected to be the largest in the country to date will also demand an integral, comprehensive and family oriented immigration reform that will lead to the legalization and eventual citizenship for the 12 million undocumented immigrants in this country.

The Coalition calls on all immigrants and all Californians of all colors and creeds, labor, clergy, community and political organizations, students and youth to protest, make their voices heard and galvanize the movement for humane immigration reform all the way to Washington DC. The US Senate is expected to begin debate on the Senate floor on March 27.

The Coalition publicly calls on and invites Mayor Antonio Villaraigoza, LA Council President Eric Garcetti, Assembly Speaker Fabian Nunez, and Senators Gil Cedillo and Gloria Romero to join and repudiate the "wall of shame" and the criminalization of immigrants as felons proposed in the House approved "Border Protection and Antiterrorist and Illegal Immigration Control Act" on Dec. 15, 2005. The coalition leaders also makes a special call to all the members of the wide and popular Spanish language media and progressive media to assist them in making MARCH 25 the largest demonstration in support of immigrant workers and their families in recent history.

well, these immigrants do work that most amerikans won't, AND dem get dem taxes taken outta what dem earn but nevah get any of it back cas dem cyaan file fi returns, being "illegal." now what is wrong wit dat picture?

--
blessid love
ras danny
higher reasoning reggae time
KBOO Portland, Full Strength Community Radio
*Love is a net that catches hearts like fish.*
-Muhammad Ali
*I don't like reggae, I love it*

Hell, if we're gonna open the borders to all commers, lets do the thing right and bring in 12 Billion Chinese for our cheap labor needs...Mexicans want $10 an hour or more while the Chinese will be more then happy to work a full day for $10.

The only thing I ask is that those who employ cheap imported labor pay all their associated housing, education, and health care needs...and at the same time, also pay for the environmental impact and infrastructure additions needed to support all these people.

NOT TO GET TOO FAR OFF THE REGGAE FORUM HERE, BUT NO HUMAN BEING IS ILLEGAL, YOUR POSITION IS CALLED AMNESTY AND IT WILL KILL THIS COUNTRY AND OPEN UP A FLOODGATE OF PEOPLE WANTING TO COME HERE TO ALSO GET AMNESTY. THIS IS NOT A SOLUTION, AS TO NOT JUST LEGALIZE EVERYONE BUT EVEN TO MAKE THEM A CITIZEN. WE NEED TO HELP STRENGTHEN MEXICO'S ECONOMY SO PEOPLE WILL WANT AND BE ABLE TO GET A JOB THERE. AND WHAT ARE YOU TALKING ABOUT "MURDEROUS" WALLS AND DEATH? DOES MS-13 AND ALL THE MURDEROUS GANGS TERRORIZING COMMUNITIES WHO ARE 90+% ILLEGAL WORRY YOU AT ALL? PLEASE LOOK AT THE WHOLE ISSUE INSTEAD OF CLINGING TO THE SAME OLD TIRED CLICHES AND COMING UP WITH FARFETCHED LUNACIES.

Danny sey: well, these immigrants do work that most amerikans won't, AND dem get dem taxes taken outta what dem earn but nevah get any of it back cas dem cyaan file fi returns, being "illegal." now what is wrong wit dat picture?
.......................................................................................

Whats wrong with that picture is that many many immigrants work on a cash only basis, and thus, pay no income tax. My neighbor who is in the construction business says when he needs drywall installers, pretty much the only people available are illegals who require $200 per day...CASH.

-pablo, the push is for granting permanent residency not amnesty.
-murderous walls and death refers to the u.s.-mexico border and the efforts to build a wall from san diego to texas. do you know how many people have died in their journey to reach the so-called "promised land"?
-not all immigrants are from marra salvatrucha 13 gang pablo, there are 12+ million undocumented immigrants in the u.s.

reggae music and jah message pushes for human rights and this is a world festival so i think it is appropriate to post this on here by informing the reggae community on what is happening with immigrants in the u.s. this bill would make it a felony to be here illegaly and also make a felony to provide any type of service to an "illegal".

Not sure why myself but I can imagine that it came about when illegals came in and undercut the gringos on wages and probably worked harder then the gringos as well, so the gringos got cut out and left that line of work and went into some other trade or line of work...then the wages crept back up to $200 per day cash with the work dominated by immigrant subcontracters.

I dont think anyone knows how many illegals are in this country let alone how many are paying income taxes. And I believe there are ways they can file and get a refund if they so desired.

And you need to live and work in a region such as Southern California to understand and experience the impact of massive illegal immigration.

The only reason Americans won't do certain types of work is because the pay is not high enuff. People think they are getting a cheap head of lettuce but they forget all the costs associated with the health, education and welfare of these workers and and their families borne by the taxpayer. And no way is the poor lettuce picker paying for all these services in taxes. For example, it cost $10,000 a year just to send one child to school here in California.

"Whats wrong with that picture is that many many immigrants work on a cash only basis, and thus, pay no income tax. My neighbor who is in the construction business says when he needs drywall installers, pretty much the only people available are illegals who require $200 per day...CASH."

That is true rhythmwize in many cases. But keep in mind that the OVERWHELMING MAJORITY of immagrants are paid so little that no income taxes would be due at all, so there is no significant loss of income taxes by the government. These immigrants go on to buy things and pay taxes on said items just like you and me. My suspicion is that the income taxes NOT paid on account of working on a cash basis is EXCEEDED by the amount of income taxes withheld from individuals working for a pay check, who never file to get their withholdings returned to them.

Bush and all his Republican business cronies love this flood of immigration and cheap labor to drive down business costs and boost profits.

Poor people could care less since they dont pay taxes and immigrant rights advocates have a cause to celebrate.

The people that are burdened with the costs of massive immigration are the middle class taxpayers and furthermore, the whole quality of life and standard of living diminishes for almost everyone except for the new immigrants and people getting rich off of cheap labor.

I say close the borders with whatever means necessary and grant amnesty and eventually citizenship in due time to those who came in illegally, making them pay a heavy penalty in higher income taxes for jumping in front of the line of people waiting legally to immigrate. Criminals, scam artists and tax dodgers get booted out.

"I say close the borders with whatever means necessary and grant amnesty and eventually citizenship in due time to those who came in illegally, making them pay a heavy penalty in higher income taxes for jumping in front of the line of people waiting legally to immigrate. Criminals, scam artists and tax dodgers get booted out."

I'm fine with that as long as you also include all those Criminal, Scam Artist and Tax dodging folks who are employing immigrant labourers....

To me, kicking out the illegal immigrants without punishing those who wilfully employ them is lick busting johnny for having bought a nickle bag on the corner and giving the drug dealer a free pass

Maybe we should start looking at the reasons that everybody wants to leave their home to come here. Maybe we should ask why it is that if you are born on one side of an imaginary line you will have every oppurtunity that can be imagined but if you are born only a few miles away on the other side of an imaginary line than you are destined for a life of poverty. As far as I'm concered I have no more right to live here than someone born in Mexico, Guatemala, El Salvador, or China for that matter. If you think it's overcrowded move somewhere thats not so crowded. Just because you were born in the United States doesn't somehow mean your civil rights are more important than someone born outside our imginary lines.

solid: you live up to your name yet again! boom bless you. And I remember Pete Wilson, he taxed snacks.

for anyone who thinks this is an inappropriate post:
remember SNWMF mc Doug Green who said last year, on the main stage, he had a dream of a new country called Pacifica that included Washington, Oregon, California and Baja.