Ballots to remain uncounted in MI and Stein blocked in Philly. Guest: Election integrity, law expert Paul Lehto says this proves 'only option is to get it right on Election Night'. Also: Trump taps climate denier, fossil-fuel tool for EPA...

As I haven't had much (if any) time to focus on it since last Tuesday's election, I just wanted to toss in for now, here on Veterans Day, that I find it hard to believe that many of those vets, to whom we ought a great debt, would have risked their lives to fight to remove individual freedom, personal liberties, and hard fought rights for any American.

Thus, what may have happened in this state last Tuesday, when voters apparently voted in favor of Prop 8 to remove the right to marriage equality for same-sex couples, is an embarrassment and a reminder of why rights should never be put up for popular vote. The U.S. Constitution --- and presumably the CA Constitution, which will be amended by this proposition, if it's allowed to stand --- is meant to protect and guarantee the rights of the minority from the tyranny of the majority.

Had it been placed on the ballot for a popular vote in the 1800's, slavery would likely have been approved by the electorate as well. That wouldn't have made the right to live free of enslavement in these United States any more correct than removing the right for same-sex couples to share all of the benefits (whatever they may be) of marriage that every other couple in America has the right to enjoy.

What a shameful disgrace. It will not stand. But it remains an extraordinary embarrassment that so many still have to go to such lengths in order to guarantee their individual rights and freedoms in 2008...particularly after all that we've been through in this nation.

Happy Veterans Day to all. And thank you to all of those who have served. Your sacrifice will not have been in vain.

UPDATE: Protest rallies against Prop 8 are planned all over the country this Saturday. Please help keep America free by joining one of them in your town, if you can. More details here...

That was much more graceful than I managed. I was furious. Now I'm sad, and embarrassed, and frustrated that that there are so many idiots in my state who were sucked in by advertising dollars by the Mormon church and Blackwater.

Another veteran denied here. I would like to say that the passage of Prop 8 would have been only a small step to our rights and freedom.
A personal friend of mine is in an eleven year partnered relationship with an illegal status immigrant.
Even with Prop 8 passing and they marrying; they would continue to have to live in fear of the partner being sent back; because the gay marriage would not automatically allowed citizenship. They have lived in love and horrific fear of this happening and of their financial lives being destroyed as well. For those that think these decisions do not cause pain and suffering, consider yourself responsible. Years of living like this in our country, in America; it is shameful. They are not the only gay couple in this circumstance, and while straight couples can who marry an immigrant can afford to be insensitive and self righteous; know that you are causing such agony that you obviously do not know what you do.
Thank you Brad.

Somewhat OT, but since it's Veterans Day, I ask everyone to read this article "Saxby Chambliss Seeks Deferment From Runoff --- Cites 'Bum Knee'" at HuffPo. The article is about the Senate runoff in GA and our efforts to dethrone the incumbent who most likely stole his seat in 2002 according to studies done after that highly suspect race was decided on Diebold voting machines [after GA SoS 2002 Cathy Cox installed the machines 100% across GA.]

Part of Sissy Shameless' record:

Chambliss Voted Against the New GI Bill for Veterans of the Wars in Iraq and Afghanistan.

Chambliss Has Voted Against Veterans Programs at Least 23 Times Since Joining the Senate

Chambliss Voted Against Additional Funding to Research Traumatic Brain Injury--thee "Signature Wound" of the Iraq War.

Chambliss Opposed the Webb Amendment Guaranteeing Troops Time At Home Between Deployments

Chambliss Repeatedly Voted Against Additional Funding to Give the Men & Women in Uniform the Armor and Equipment They Need.

ActBlue has finally added Jim Martin to their list - any donation, however small, will be a big help for Martin to win this runoff.

Well said, Brad. I'm not gay, just a tired old widower, but I'm a veteran, and my brothers and sisters when I served were just that, brothers and sisters, and only that. I heard some news today that made me want to go burn down a Catholic Bishop's residence, jewels and all, but of course I won't do that. When will they ever learn...

I think that many people believe that gays should be allowed to marry (equal status if not marriage), they don't believe that teachers should teach students that gay marriage is a terrific alternative to heterosexual marriage.

The thing is that once you approve this - you inherit all sorts of other questions... and they need answers.

As a vertern I dont agree with the notion that because of our service we must disagree with the Prop 8 decision. As a person who served his country and defended it on multiple shore I must say that our role is not fight for any freedom in people wish to engage( IE. Drugs, Gay Marrige). We support our Consitution and our Democracy. The freedom to choose our leaders and make our laws is what we fight for. Prop 8 was voted on and in a majority decided. Even though we may not agree with the outcome , as Verterns we must respect our Democray.

I enjoyed the photo slideshow of the Prague Chicken Festival from the link you gave us Election night [when we were outrageously giddy from all the anxiety!] You're blessed to live in such a beautiful country. It reminds me of the landscape I grew up in before strip malls and McMansions destroyed it.

I'm against the language used when describing amendments to the Constitution [or other propositions] on our ballots. The legalese used is designed to confuse and subvert the will and intent of the voter.

For example, last year I asked all the people working my polling place to decipher an amendment up for the vote and not a one of them could. I asked them how they could vote on the issue if they didn't understand the language --- they scratched their heads and agreed with me it needed to be changed. BUT ... they head already voted. DUH.

I think we should all raise a stink about it and insist they use common language everyone can understand.

Just for clarity, passage of Prop 8 would BAN the right to marriage equality in CA, as per an amendment to the state's Constitution.

Your confusion, that passage would have allowed it [the CA Supreme Court already determined that banning it violates the CA Constitution, hence the supporters move to create a Constitutional amendment to take away the rights of people via Prop 8], was likely not yours only, and probably one of the reasons that it seems to have so far passed...as based on the ballots that have been tabulated so far, anyway.

As a vertern I dont agree with the notion that because of our service we must disagree with the Prop 8 decision.

First, thank you for service. Secondly, I agree that you don't have to agree with any notion you are not inclined to. That's your right that I would defend with my life.

However...

As a person who served his country and defended it on multiple shore I must say that our role is not fight for any freedom in people wish to engage( IE. Drugs, Gay Marrige). We support our Consitution and our Democracy.

Actually, my understanding is that you took an oath to defend the Constitution and that "democracy" had nothing to do with your oath. A veteran is free to correct me on that, of course.

As such, one of the bedrock principles of the Constitution is equal justice under the law. Denying some people freedoms, while allowing it to others, is decidedly in violation of that Constitution.

The freedom to choose our leaders and make our laws is what we fight for. Prop 8 was voted on and in a majority decided. Even though we may not agree with the outcome , as Verterns we must respect our Democray.

Once again, I thank you for your service. But you may wish to review both the oath you took when you signed up, and the Constitution you swore to protect and defend.

ScandalMgr: Thank you so much for that link! PERFECT action to ward off the Prop 8 willies; great way to strike, LEGALLY, at the heart of this most insidious, unconstitutional initiative. What a disgusting use (and yes, fully intended) of G.W.'s "Faith Based Initiative" tax exemption--exactly what I was afraid of.

No wonder we had SKYWRITING over the Hollywood Hills that read: "VOTE YES ON PROP 8"! I was disgusted on so many levels, I didn't have the time to name them all. ScandalMgr's above connecting some dots I had forgot!

(While I was typing this post, was listening to Peter B./ just played a great song called, "If gays can't get married, then straights can't divorce." HhehHHEAA! Seems the least of fair n' square compromises to me!)

This is terrible!! Marriage was created by the church NOT the STATE!! No they shouldn't be allowed to be married! Not in my religion and none that I know of. Separation of church and state.

The great Einstein said that War is fought by murderers not heros. So to say that you murdered others makes you deserving of a gay marriage. What? Be happy that you didn't kill someone in the U.S. your ass would be in Jail. Marriage is a union under GOD not under a government. Get REAL!

If gay people need a piece of paper to make them happy than get a piece of paper. Don't desicrate my beliefs because you feel left out. My uncle is gay and no I don't care if your gay. Be happy with what you do have.

Siegfried and Roy, through the exercise of their judgement, decided that it was safe to have a nightclub act of performing tigers with no barriers between them and the audience. The result was tragic.

Matthew Shephard was unable to see past the smiling shark teeth of his attackers to be and left the bar willingly with them. Again, a supreme tragedy (personally, I believe his attackers deserve the death penalty). His mother said he was like a sweet kid. Perhaps he was a permanent kid, a permanent 9 or 10 year old with the judgement to match.

What if for a significant percentage of gays, their gayness is simply a secondary characteristic of a personality-wide arrested development? Including their personality, judgement and sexuality? Paglia terms this the Peter Pan Syndrome.

Should Seigfrid, Roy, Matthew Shephard have/have had the right to adopt? Absolutely not, they lacked the judgemental capabilities to be responsible parents.

IMO, gays should have all the other "marriage rights" but I don't think this is simply a discrimination situation.

#24 said: My friends have gone to Iraq and have come back a shell of a man, and for what?

For starters, they were sent to Iraq to fight a war based on lies - a proven fact.

Secondly, the election fraud via voting machines [owned by the same political party that sent so many of our young people to Iraq to fight a war based on nothing but lies and greed] serves to make uninformed people believe the majority supported that war.

I do not understand why the rights of some of this state’s citizens was placed on a ballot for people to vote their prejudices. When given the opportunity, people will vote their prejudices, pure and simple. Looking at the Prop and how it was written — which was sooo confusing — and the idea that a Proposition was used to change the state’s Constitution to deny rights to some of its tax paying citizens represented, IMHO, a “Fail Whale” from the start. Basically, it was destined to pass, it did, no surprise there.

Before I launch into my rant and rage against the machine let me first state I am an African American lesbian, homeowner, and one who voted “No on 8.” I felt stupid voting on something so ridiculous but I did and that’s that. However, I do know a lesbian couple who missed the point altogether by voting “Yes on 8″ because they did not quite understand Yes meant No and No meant Yes. I am a firm believer where there is one, there are others. This lesbian interracial couple are two smart women with advanced degrees but they found the wording of the Prop — confusing.

ES&S financier, BILLIONAIRE Howard Ahmanson? Kira, I should have known! After 2 years of poking around ES*S's sickly, smelly underbelly- -of course he would be the source of this un-American undermining of the Constitution(s)! In the Sarasota case, I saw some shit from ES&S's legal team that turned my (metaphoric) balls inside out from shock and awe.

..."We all know Blackwater, but Ahmanson has two claims to fame. He was the main financier of election machine company ES&S and he is also a raving Christian Reconstructionist, a member of the group that believes the country's laws should come from the bible, and that homosexuals, among others, should be executed..."

Woah! That vital information needs to be blasted through megaphones on every street corner in California, Florida, and Arizona. Has anyone contacted the 'no on 8' org to make damn sure they're aware of this before the G/L community becomes radically, racially divided? How can we make sure this Kooky Looney King Pin Psychopath is held accountable by the newly-charged, opposing grassroots movement?

I think Bowen de-certified their asses, right? So ES&S could not have had any direct hand in the election process or the actual counting or recording of the prop 8 VOTES--could they? Are ES&S machines still in use in California? If so (I know if FL we still have some touchscreens in use for "disabled" voters)--if so, anyone know how many ES&S machines of any kind were used and where?

In Western Civilization, marriage was observed strictly as a social contract--no religious ceremony, no clergy present--until approximately the beginning of the 2nd millennium, and church weddings as we know them did not exist before the 16th century.

And there are apparently recorded (though rare) instances of the term "marriage" referring to same-sex unions during the Roman Empire.

Well, there ya' go. Six million voters on the rolls(potentially)in 14 California jurisdictions voting for or against this unlawful proposition on a voting system financed by a Neo-Christian-Fundamentalist-Billionaire-Wacko-Extremist.

This should be posted as priority across the blogosphere--in big, bold, red-letter font. An action alert should be issued. (Or maybe we can get the 'no on prop 8' folks to use some of that 36 million in their coiffers to SKYWRITE IT.

# 30 David Nobel, there are apparently recorded (though rare) instances of the term "marriage" referring to same-sex unions during the Roman Empire. Yes I have read of that too, it was more common than we think.
We have had same sex marriage in Canada since 2005 and I have not heard nor read of any negative vibes from anyone. The world hasn't ended! Isn't it ironic that two same sex people who love each other are a threat to "marriage". I don't get it.
I personally think homosexuals should be entitled to the same ball and chain as heterosexuals

Brad reported four million ballots uncounted before victory was declared/ misplaced memory cards/ and thousands of calls from California to the EPC reporting problems with the machines on election day.

Do we know how many of these complaints were specifically due to ES&S machine "malfunction"?
Does the EPC data cover that without having to cross-check for the specific problematic systems reported?

A commenter in that bradblog thread cited 2.7 million of those votes coming from L.A...?

From "Between the Lines News", pridsource.com dated Nov. 12th:
"...The margin of victory for the Yes on 8 side has actually shrunk since No on Prop 8 officials conceded last Thursday. According to the Secretary of State's office, as of the morning of Nov. 10, 5,668,960 voters supported Proposition 8, while 5,173,113 voted against it last Tuesday. The difference is 495,847 votes...

"...The Times did not suggest that the as yet uncounted votes could close the margin and change the result of the voting. 'In order to reverse that result,' said the Times, 'opponents of the measure would have to win just more than 59 percent of the uncounted ballots' and so far, they've won only 47.6 percent of them."http://www.pridesource.c...icle.shtml?article=32950

Are there any citizens tracking the ballot chain of custody procedures? Do the no on 8 peeps have official designated observer status?

There were 86 reports of machine malfunction in California on election day out of roughly 1,800 calls. 38 of those originated in Los Angeles, by far the highest percentage of overall reported problems statewide. The second highest percentage of "voting equipment" problems reported were from San Francisco (8) and San Diego (8).

If ES&S is at the helm here in Los Angeles (the largest voting block in the country) AND tabulates the votes for San Francisco, and ALSO had financial ties to the proposition's original billionaire backer--then this should DEFINITELY be entered into evidence in any of the upcoming legal efforts to overturn.

Is anyone, other than our Brad and VR, reporting or suggesting that prop 8 may NOT have been decided by said 70% of black voters?
Is that stat just another divisive lie?...
Who is looking at that data? And can they make the GLBT community aware of these very disturbing election "trends" asap?

Florida voted in a Constitutional Ammendment that is much worse than Prop 8 in that it not only takes away gays right to wed, but it maeks any domestic partnership invalid. Like, say, if two old people want to have a civil union for economic or medical reasons, that would be invalid.
Prop 8 is getting all the attention, but the Florida law will have repurcussions on many unions, not just gay. I'm just curious why no one is giving it any attention.

Jeannie, that 70% of the black vote thing might be a dirty trick. Where did that poll come from? I haven't checked it out, but I'm very suspicious.

Remember the Brooks Bros. riot? In this case, send an inflammatory report through the AP designed to cause dissension between 2 minority factions of the Democratic Party. That would make both sides look bad and lower the general population's respect for both, thus making a stronger case for Prop 8.

The survey of 2,240 California voters was conducted for AP by Edison Media Research and Mitofsky International. Most were interviewed in a random sample of 30 precincts statewide Tuesday; 765 who voted early or absentee were interviewed by landline telephone over the last week. Results for the full sample were subject to sampling error of plus or minus 3 percentage points, higher for subgroups.

Ah, poetic justice....heckuvajob there 'loyal bushies'
Focus on the Family forced to make layoffs after spending $600,000 to defeat marriage equality.»
Colorado Independent reports that Focus on the Family “is poised to announce major layoffs to its Colorado Springs-based ministry and media empire today.” The layoffs come after the right-wing group spent more than $600,000 to defeat marriage equality in California. Praising the passage of Prop. 8, the group said that the measure “helps protect millions of children from radical indoctrination in the homosexual lifestyle.” The group also touted its involvement collecting signatures and gathering donations, patting itself on the back for being “integrally involved” in the fight against marriage equality.

Just like Prop 22 was overturned, this one looks like it's headed back to the CA State Supreme Court!

Top Court in California Will Review Proposition 8
New York Times - 3 hours ago
By JESSE MCKINLEY SAN FRANCISCO - Responding to pleas for legal clarity from those on both sides of the issue, the California Supreme Court said Wednesday that it would take up the case of whether a voter-approved ban on same-sex unions was ...
California court to hear gay marriage ban case Reuters
State Supreme Court will hear challenges to Prop. 8 San Diego Union Tribune
San Francisco Chronicle - Los Angeles Times - The Associated Press
all 1,246 news articles »