I was just wondering - because, in my opinion, they were not the same.
I read somewhere that Tadukhipa arrived in Egypt when she was about 5-6 years old. So we know that:
- Akhenaten ruled Egypt for 15-16 years,
- Tutanhamon died when he was about 18-20
- So Tut started his rule when he was 9-11
- May Akhenaten was about 37, when he died. So, Tut born when Akhenaten was 26 - 27. In the seventh or sixth year of Akhenaten's rule.
So, if Kiya, Tut's mother was Tadukhipa, she had to be 11 or maybe 12 when she gave life to Tutankhamon. It's too early for an Egyptian, too, or not? Please share me your thoughts in text, too.
Greetings:

Not necessarily! Firstly, repugnant as it may seem to us I don't think egyptians considered anything wrong with bearing children at this age as long as they were physically able to. Think of the princess meketaten who possible died in childbirth. I think she was about 12???? Can anyone back that up?

Also you are forgetting the tree year reign of Smenkhare. Maybe Tut was born 7 years before the end of Akhenaten's reign in whcih case his Tudakhipa would have been about 15, more than old enough.

And whose to say Tudakhipa married Akhenaten as soon as she entered Egypt. Maybe they waited until she was a little older. Do we have any definite dates for Tudakhipa's entry into Egypt.

I didn't forgot Smenkhare - I'm one of the people who thinks he had a joint rule with Akhenaten in the rebel pharaoh's last two years. But that's possible, too, if not but I simply hate that theory that Smenkhare was Nefertiti. And I read Tadukhipa first married with king Amenhotep III - she brought the god Ishtar to heal him, but just some weeks or probably months after, he died. But that's true what you said about bearing children young.

So, if Kiya, Tut's mother was Tadukhipa, she had to be 11 or maybe 12 when she gave life to Tutankhamon. It's too early for an Egyptian, too, or not?

It's not at all unusual. Mothers in ancient Egypt were often only about 12 years old; husbands were often young teenagers. To this day people in the Middle East tend to mature physically (i.e., reach puberty) faster than many Westerners.

This was a time when people were lucky to live 40 years; many died at about age 35. Consequently people married very young and produced a family as soon as possible, and to the ancients this was all quite normal. Ancient Egypt suffered a significant infant mortality rate (in our own exhibit at the Field Museum we have the mummies of two babies and five toddlers, none older than 5 or 6), so it was sometimes necessary to have many children.

The royals tended to be married off at particularly young ages, and for two reasons: (1) to establish the pharaoh on the throne, and his wife along with him; and (2) to start producing children as soon as they were physically able to do so, always hoping for male heirs to the throne. Tutankhamun was about 8 or 9 when he ascended to the throne in 1334 BCE; almost a thousand years ealier Pepi II, last pharaoh of the Old Kingdom, was only around 6 when he was crowned.

Joined:Mon May 09, 2005 9:22 amPosts:574Location: The palace of Tutness!

This is what I read in a book by Nicholas Reeves, called "The Complete Tutankhamun":

Kiya was a Mitannian princess sent to Akhetaten to marry Akhenaten to unite the two countries (Possibly, something close to this, or as a gift to Akhenaten.). She changed her name to Kiya after arriving in Egypt, though, I don't know if Akhenaten gave her that name when they married or not. And so, she gives birth to Smenkhare, then Tut, then maybe died right after Tut was born, since she fell out of favor in year 12 (?) Of Akhenaten, when her reliefs were replaced by Meritaten and Nefertiti (?).

This is me trying to remember what I read...this was a library book, mind you, and from my school before I graduated, no less!! If anyone wants to correct me on this, do so please.

By the way, Lostris, I LOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOVE your Akhenaten picture in your signature!!!

That's essentially correct, Tutness. The foreign origins is one of the believable theories for Kiya and Reeves does a good job defending it. I have that book myself. The other equally plausible theory is that she hails from Akhmim; her name is similar linguistically to other courtiers who we're quite certain came from there.

Joined:Mon May 09, 2005 9:22 amPosts:574Location: The palace of Tutness!

Yay, I'm....sort of right?! I didn't know that you had that book!! I need to buy it, and refresh my memory a little bit! That's another interesting theory, by the way, kmt. Akmim? I didn't read about that...

Oh my, I have far too many books! I love libraries (Chicago has some great ones, especially the main branch, which is HUGE), but I dare not check out any books on ancient Egypt. I'm the kind of guy who likes to write notes in all the margins, and I don't want the library police to have to come and hunt down my arse!

Joined:Mon May 09, 2005 9:22 amPosts:574Location: The palace of Tutness!

kmt_sesh wrote:

Oh my, I have far too many books! I love libraries (Chicago has some great ones, especially the main branch, which is HUGE), but I dare not check out any books on ancient Egypt. I'm the kind of guy who likes to write notes in all the margins, and I don't want the library police to have to come and hunt down my arse!

The Libraries have thier own police now?!?! Since when...? That's news to me! I wish I had a lot of books, though...that's why I'm gonna work at Border's!!

The Libraries have thier own police now?!?! Since when...? That's news to me! I wish I had a lot of books, though...that's why I'm gonna work at Border's!!

I was thinking of that episode of Seinfeld with that corny library "detective." The only thing the library will really do is send you a nice bill to replace the book.

I hope you get that job at Borders. It's my favorite bookstore. There's one on my way home from work, and another just down the road from me...plus another one I pass by whenever I go to visit my sister (she lives a few miles away from me).

I think the Borders bosses purposely put three of their stores in locations so convenient to me because they know I'm a chump who can't resist stopping just to see if they have anything decent about ancient Egypt. And they know when they do have something new, I'm likely to buy it!

Joined:Mon May 09, 2005 9:22 amPosts:574Location: The palace of Tutness!

Ah, yes, I seem to recall that episode.... Been a long time since I've seen it, though.

Thanks!! I hope I get the job, too....I just need to pick my lazy self up out there and get an interview!!! You know, it's funny...Waldenbooks, Barnes and Noble, and Boreders here in Tampa all know me by name, and if you were to ask them about me, they'd say, "Oh. yeah....that's Heather. She's usually reading Japanese manga on the floor of the aisle, or reading something about Tut or some Egyptian books on the floor of that aisle--you can't miss her!!" And yes...I tend to sit on the floor, or in a chair if they have it or if one is available.

Joined:Mon May 09, 2005 9:22 amPosts:574Location: The palace of Tutness!

kmt_sesh wrote:

For that matter, if Borders would throw in some beanbag chairs or a few comfortable recliners, they'd have to call the police to get me out of there!

I'd be there after closing, reading then sleeping on the recliners or beanbag chairs, only to be banned from the store the next day. Ok....that's a BAD idea. If I was banned from bookstores, I'd faint and die. X_X It would be nothing but a terrible nightmare....

I'd be there after closing, reading then sleeping on the recliners or beanbag chairs, only to be banned from the store the next day.

I wrote that bit about the beanbag chairs because way back in ancient times when I was in high school, our school library gave beanbag chairs a try. One of my best friends fell asleep in one of them and proceeded to snore very loudly. The beanbag chairs were gone by the end of the week.

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