It's easy to see how Stan the Man was the more charismatic of the two titans, because Jack was a veritable Warren Beatty in interviews! Stammering, pregnant pauses, and low-key as a corpse. His personality was the polar opposite of his energetic, page-blasting, high concept, GENIUS artwork.

Here's an interesting rundown of Shellhead's early years during the height of the Cold War. I came of age during the later David Michelinie/John Romita Jr./Bob Layton run but it's always great to delve into the Silver Age Iron Man:

Ditko is all sour grapes. While his hand in the creation of Spider-Man is undoubtedly important there are three truths in the matter here:

1.) It took him over 30 years to step forward and respond to Stan Lee's moniker of sole creator. Where was he the rest of the time? Ditko was a notorious recluse, left the book over the true identity of the Green Goblin. Sounds like someone wants to rewrite history.

2.) The Lee/Ditko era existed in the time when characters were made property by the comic, not the creators, so Lee stepping forward as the sole creator was as much a business decision as anything else. Stan The Man is the FRONTMAN for Marvel. Anyone taking him half as seriously as Tony The Tiger or Joe Camel needs to get their brains checked.

3.) The only people who care - fans - already know Ditko was involved, so any mud-slinging or "they're trying to bury the truth" or thumbing their nose at Lee just comes off in the worst taste possible. (Funny how no one slings shit over Ditko claiming to have created The Green Goblin without Lee)

The Lee/Ditko era existed in the time when characters were made property by the comic

Ya don’t got us here, effendi – as Howard would say:

Hah?????

so Lee stepping forward as the sole creator was as much a business decision as anything else

HAH!!!???!!! – The Sequel.

If you’re referring to the obligatory Work for Hire bit, that was (and remains) industry-corporate, which Smiley had nothing to do with whatsoever.

Mind you, the most (in)famous example is Lee’s well-known tale how astonished he was when he got The King’s penciled pages back and saw this guy surfing through the cosmos. To paraphrase, when asked for an explanation, Mr. Kirby’s sensationally solid rationalization was that an entity like Galactus would have to employ a sentry to scout ahead for him.

This led to Mr. Lee(ber)'s habitual brilliantly-belated admission about The Surfer’s creation, which he was all too happy to partake in but had absolutely zip to do with.

Yeah, Marvel owns the character and Mr. Lee certainly contributed significantly to its popular/commercial and historical legacy - but who’s the actual Creator?

Granted, it’s not as arguably cut and dried as in Spidey's case (tho ye Writer-Editor also has admitted he was definitely influenced by “The Spider” pulp-hero).

So we got no absolute answers, tho Deepening the Questions is infinitely more intriquing.

Maybe it was on the DC thread, but I'd mentioned how much artist Gene Day's work meant to me as a child, so I've been reading his and scribe Doug Moench's run on Master of Kung Fu. This stuff is more James Bond than Amazing Spider-Man, with mercifully few encroachments from the "proper" Marvel Universe heroes, something that didn't happen much on this book and not at all IIRC during the Moench-Day run...

With Comic Con going on, I'm sure this thread will be slammed with posts! This will be *THE* topic!!! Fans'll be pumped up to talk about Jack Kirby and John Romita and Steve Ditko and maybe even Herb Trimpe!

With Comic Con going on, I'm sure this thread will be slammed with posts! This will be *THE* topic!!! Fans'll be pumped up to talk about Jack Kirby and John Romita and Steve Ditko and maybe even Herb Trimpe!

I can't wait!

Herb Trimpe sure is an acquired taste...

His blocky, square jawed and , well, squared everything style, left me cold for the longest time. Then one day browsing some old issues it finally clicked with me and I appreciated his odd poses and well crafted pencils.

Kirby will always be Kirby and damn fabulous. I'm currently rereading the Fourth World Omnibus volumes, and recently traded out to pick up both The Demon and OMAC hardcovers. The Demon is great stuff and still holds up well...OMAC - not so much.

With OMAC, although some of the mad Kirby genius is still there, it felt, more than in any other series, that he was just going for a page count. The stories seem to all have solid ideas, but the execution was lackluster, normally just being a lead in to fight scenes. It is nice to have these collected, but, one can see why it didn't make it to 10 issues.

I'm waiting patiently for Marvel to collect his 2001 series ( I remember getting these off the rack at Innes Street Drug soooo many years back) and for DC to collect Kamandi in Omnibus style editions... anything other than the thin, overpriced Archive hardbacks. Kirby only stayed with Kamandi for 40 some issues, his entire run really needs a better collection

With Comic Con going on, I'm sure this thread will be slammed with posts! This will be *THE* topic!!! Fans'll be pumped up to talk about Jack Kirby and John Romita and Steve Ditko and maybe even Herb Trimpe!

I can't wait!

Herb Trimpe sure is an acquired taste...

His blocky, square jawed and , well, squared everything style, left me cold for the longest time. Then one day browsing some old issues it finally clicked with me and I appreciated his odd poses and well crafted pencils.

Hence my use of "maybe even Herb Trimpe"! However, your description of Trimpe's work could well be applied to Kirby. I always admired his big, bold concepts, especially in the FF, but I grew up during the era of Byrne and Perez, so it took me some time to enjoy the vastly different art of guys like Kirby and Trimpe.

Tru, Mr. Trimpe’s artwork did take some getting used to, but we always put the general resistance to his style as simply being (initially) uncomfortable with an artist whose personal imprint harked back to an earlier era in comics less overtly dynamic than the Silver Age wizards we’d been weaned on.

As to that, since both Mr. Perez

and Mr. Byrne (especially) had truly impressive runs on The World’s Greatest Comic,

anyone beginning their inaugural exposures with those gents was a wunnerful preview

Yes, Kirby didn't click for me back in my early readership days and sadly I was late to the party, not really warming to Kirby until the 80's. I was more a Neal Adams guy back then. Gil Kane was always brilliant for me, his amazingly fluid poses and ropy action pulled me in from the start.

But Kirby, even when he writing is at it's worst, has concepts that are still intoxicating and keep you coming back for more.