Comments on: Will Quentin get a greater suspension because Greinke was injured? Doubtful.http://hardballtalk.nbcsports.com/2013/04/12/will-quentin-get-a-greater-suspension-because-greinke-was-injured-doubtful/
Baseball. Baseball. And then a bit more baseball.Sun, 02 Aug 2015 21:29:09 +0000hourly1http://wordpress.com/By: blabidiblahttp://hardballtalk.nbcsports.com/2013/04/12/will-quentin-get-a-greater-suspension-because-greinke-was-injured-doubtful/comment-page-1/#comment-475409
Mon, 15 Apr 2013 15:01:44 +0000http://hardballtalk.nbcsports.com/?p=395658#comment-475409Don’t you just hate it when you need to explain a joke?
]]>By: jollyjoker2http://hardballtalk.nbcsports.com/2013/04/12/will-quentin-get-a-greater-suspension-because-greinke-was-injured-doubtful/comment-page-2/#comment-474535
Sat, 13 Apr 2013 19:04:47 +0000http://hardballtalk.nbcsports.com/?p=395658#comment-474535He should be kicked out for more than 10 games. My issue is he gets hit most of anyone in mlb on a per at bat basis by far. He stands on the plate. Then, when he gets hit he charges the mound? really! …What a wuss. This isn’t sportsmanship so he shouldn’t be treated that way.
]]>By: manchestermiraclehttp://hardballtalk.nbcsports.com/2013/04/12/will-quentin-get-a-greater-suspension-because-greinke-was-injured-doubtful/comment-page-1/#comment-474321
Sat, 13 Apr 2013 13:24:29 +0000http://hardballtalk.nbcsports.com/?p=395658#comment-474321Yes, god forbid a team should utilize its assets and try to compete. Good thing one of the Dodgers’ best players got hurt, because those bastards deserve it for acting like they actually want to win.
]]>By: bigharoldhttp://hardballtalk.nbcsports.com/2013/04/12/will-quentin-get-a-greater-suspension-because-greinke-was-injured-doubtful/comment-page-2/#comment-474070
Sat, 13 Apr 2013 01:52:34 +0000http://hardballtalk.nbcsports.com/?p=395658#comment-474070“Nettles got off…wait for it…because he was a yankee.”

Just the perks of being a Yankee I guess.

]]>By: theskinsmanhttp://hardballtalk.nbcsports.com/2013/04/12/will-quentin-get-a-greater-suspension-because-greinke-was-injured-doubtful/comment-page-2/#comment-473992
Fri, 12 Apr 2013 23:19:10 +0000http://hardballtalk.nbcsports.com/?p=395658#comment-473992Nettles got off…wait for it…because he was a yankee. Just like Roidger got away with throwing a broken bat at Piazza.
]]>By: wolfmagic2012http://hardballtalk.nbcsports.com/2013/04/12/will-quentin-get-a-greater-suspension-because-greinke-was-injured-doubtful/comment-page-2/#comment-473925
Fri, 12 Apr 2013 21:45:33 +0000http://hardballtalk.nbcsports.com/?p=395658#comment-473925If you hurt someone, you get an assault charge. If you really hurt someone, it escalates: assault & battery; aggravated assault & battery…etc. To say that MLB only sanctions the act of charging the mound and not the consequence of the act is not only stupid, but unjust.
]]>By: theSC1320http://hardballtalk.nbcsports.com/2013/04/12/will-quentin-get-a-greater-suspension-because-greinke-was-injured-doubtful/comment-page-1/#comment-473894
Fri, 12 Apr 2013 21:06:58 +0000http://hardballtalk.nbcsports.com/?p=395658#comment-473894Batters don’t have much opportunity to “accidentily let one slip” and tag a pitcher in the course of a game. Hard slides at second, inside the bag at first, and hard into the catcher are about as close as one can get away with. Rarely the opportunity to “target” the pitcher in a pre-meditated way, like a pitcher can a batter.

And…yup I agree, manager most likely will argue whatever side necessary to win the game.

]]>By: bigharoldhttp://hardballtalk.nbcsports.com/2013/04/12/will-quentin-get-a-greater-suspension-because-greinke-was-injured-doubtful/comment-page-2/#comment-473892
Fri, 12 Apr 2013 21:06:14 +0000http://hardballtalk.nbcsports.com/?p=395658#comment-473892“He wasn’t over the plate and he couldn’t get out of the way.”

No, it wasn’t over the plate but it was neither that far inside nor that high.

Look at the video, it hit him in the arm. And, we’re talking about a guy that lead the NL last year in HBP, 17, and only had 340 PA. He lead the AL the year before with 23 HBP with only 483 PA. How is it that a guy that doesn’t even plat full time leads in HBP two years in a row? Perhaps it’s him?

]]>By: steelcitywhittyhttp://hardballtalk.nbcsports.com/2013/04/12/will-quentin-get-a-greater-suspension-because-greinke-was-injured-doubtful/comment-page-2/#comment-473857
Fri, 12 Apr 2013 20:44:24 +0000http://hardballtalk.nbcsports.com/?p=395658#comment-473857Solve the problem like the NBA – anyone who leaves the bench gets a suspension. Stops bench brawls completely. This way when a player charges the mound he will have to take into account that at best he will be outnumbered atleast 3 to 1 and at worst 6 to 1. These kinds of odds should further reduce mound charging.
]]>By: emosnarhttp://hardballtalk.nbcsports.com/2013/04/12/will-quentin-get-a-greater-suspension-because-greinke-was-injured-doubtful/comment-page-2/#comment-473850
Fri, 12 Apr 2013 20:35:52 +0000http://hardballtalk.nbcsports.com/?p=395658#comment-473850Nothing but a Bunch of THUGS!!!! I say suspend all of them for the season and fine their asses.. A shame on society. Smh.
]]>By: jdnyhttp://hardballtalk.nbcsports.com/2013/04/12/will-quentin-get-a-greater-suspension-because-greinke-was-injured-doubtful/comment-page-2/#comment-473841
Fri, 12 Apr 2013 20:22:13 +0000http://hardballtalk.nbcsports.com/?p=395658#comment-473841You’re assuming he threw at him on purpose. Well, that would be part of the guidelines. If it’s deemed intentional, as a pitcher you’re suspended 14 days (3 starts?).

I think there is a general consensus in MLB that you don’t intentionally throw at someone’s head. You’re more likely as a pitcher to piss off your own teammates if you were dumb enough to do that because then they become targets.

No system is perfect but watching MLB players turn the game in WWE is a joke. If they want to fight, go play hockey.

]]>By: bigharoldhttp://hardballtalk.nbcsports.com/2013/04/12/will-quentin-get-a-greater-suspension-because-greinke-was-injured-doubtful/comment-page-2/#comment-473834
Fri, 12 Apr 2013 20:14:40 +0000http://hardballtalk.nbcsports.com/?p=395658#comment-473834“There’s a good chance that there was a standing order by Mattingly to throw at a Padre.”

That is nothing more than baseless speculation and you are still completely ignoring why he’d wait till it was a 3-2 count. You provided nothing to support your contention that Grienke deliberately threw at Quentin. And, if there was a standing order to “throw at a Parde” , .. which goes against everything I’m aware of about Mattingly, .. why not just hit him and get it over with? And, there is no way you can make a case that Mattingly deliberately risked Greinke.

Every bit of the circumstances surrounding this incident, the score, the count, the fact that the pitcher in question is a highly valued part of the rotation, (to say nothing of what they are paying him), the fact that the pitch though high and tight wasn’t that high and tight indicates that it was just a pitch that got away from Greinke. And, side from actually hitting him, four seasons ago where do you get that Greinke has ” .. thrown at him multiple times.”?

Quentin over reacted, was unprofessional and his actions, .. that is in no way a valid part of the game, .. got a player injured. His punishment should be significantly greater than say Youkilis’ punishment when he took a run at Porcello. Sanctions should have consequences commensurate with the with action and the results, .. intended or otherwise. And, although I wouldn’t go as far as suspending him as long as Greinke is out, a 5 -6 games is nothing. If you hold that “He deserves what he got.”, even if you ignore all the evidence to the contrary, then Quentin should be suspended as long as Greinke is on the DL, .. because that would be what he deserves.

MLB will like give him a suspension that after all the wrangling will be in the 6 game area. In most cases that would be sufficient for charging the mound but not here. The visual evidence and circumstance prove that this was nothing more than a run of the mill HBP and the only result should have been Quentin taking first base. It got out of hand not because Greinke threw at Quentin nor because he was “jawing” at him. It got out of hand because Quentin was unprofessional. All that macho BS about Greinke knowing better the next time is just that, BS. Had Quentin really wanted to get even with him he’d have kept his mouth shut, took his base and hit the ball hard off him the next time up. That’s how real pros do it.

]]>By: greysolonhttp://hardballtalk.nbcsports.com/2013/04/12/will-quentin-get-a-greater-suspension-because-greinke-was-injured-doubtful/comment-page-1/#comment-473825
Fri, 12 Apr 2013 20:08:05 +0000http://hardballtalk.nbcsports.com/?p=395658#comment-473825In the real world, if someone throws a hard object at another person’s head and then talks smack– that person deserves what he gets.
]]>By: richyballgamehttp://hardballtalk.nbcsports.com/2013/04/12/will-quentin-get-a-greater-suspension-because-greinke-was-injured-doubtful/comment-page-2/#comment-473808
Fri, 12 Apr 2013 19:45:07 +0000http://hardballtalk.nbcsports.com/?p=395658#comment-473808I get what you mean,but the bad blood between Grienke and Quentin goes back to their AL Central days.
]]>By: greysolonhttp://hardballtalk.nbcsports.com/2013/04/12/will-quentin-get-a-greater-suspension-because-greinke-was-injured-doubtful/comment-page-2/#comment-473778
Fri, 12 Apr 2013 19:15:21 +0000http://hardballtalk.nbcsports.com/?p=395658#comment-473778He wasn’t over the plate and he couldn’t get out of the way. Greinke has hit him several times, including throwing at his head. Greinke caused this and got what he deserved. If you can’t defend yourself– don’t throw at a guy and don’t talk smack. Seems to me that Quentin took it easy on the guy.
]]>By: greysolonhttp://hardballtalk.nbcsports.com/2013/04/12/will-quentin-get-a-greater-suspension-because-greinke-was-injured-doubtful/comment-page-2/#comment-473773
Fri, 12 Apr 2013 19:10:56 +0000http://hardballtalk.nbcsports.com/?p=395658#comment-473773So, free pass to the pitcher but shackle the guy who gets his head thrown at?

Here’s an idea– You throw at my head, I break your arm.

]]>By: greysolonhttp://hardballtalk.nbcsports.com/2013/04/12/will-quentin-get-a-greater-suspension-because-greinke-was-injured-doubtful/comment-page-2/#comment-473770
Fri, 12 Apr 2013 19:08:35 +0000http://hardballtalk.nbcsports.com/?p=395658#comment-473770There’s a good chance that there was a standing order by Mattingly to throw at a Padre. And Greinke apparently doesn’t like Quentin, having thrown at him multiple times. Greinke then chose that moment– which would have been not so bad except he decided to mouth off afterwards. He deserves what he got.

Here’s guessing next time he will think twice about throwing at someone. I KNOW he will think twice about jawing at someone.

]]>By: dcarroll73http://hardballtalk.nbcsports.com/2013/04/12/will-quentin-get-a-greater-suspension-because-greinke-was-injured-doubtful/comment-page-2/#comment-473753
Fri, 12 Apr 2013 18:56:42 +0000http://hardballtalk.nbcsports.com/?p=395658#comment-473753uschawk, I’m with you on this. For a reference point, I’ve been a Giants fan for 60+ years, and I am still on the Dodgers side of this one. Those teams are going to be playing a LOT more games this season, and there are other ways than a suspension to put this d-bag out for longer than Greinke. Hey, I grew up in the era when every time Mays hit a homer you knew he was getting thrown at next at bat. Willie could make an amazing bailout to avoid the pitch, and that usually made him rather determined in that batter’s box. If he did get hit, he was a threat to steal second. So in effect you gave him a double to punish him for hitting that homer? God, I miss watching that man play.
]]>By: uschawkhttp://hardballtalk.nbcsports.com/2013/04/12/will-quentin-get-a-greater-suspension-because-greinke-was-injured-doubtful/comment-page-2/#comment-473710
Fri, 12 Apr 2013 18:17:40 +0000http://hardballtalk.nbcsports.com/?p=395658#comment-473710greysolon – Apr 12, 2013 at 12:50 PM

Greinke’s own fault. He should have just shut his mouth and left well enough alone. 170 pounds and all mouth.

And maybe Mattingly should be allowed to manage until Greinke comes back, as Zack was following Mattingly’s stupid orders.

Thank you greysolon for the stupidest post of the day…well done. If you think Mattingly told his pitcher to bean someone in a 1 run game then you are not smart and you definitely don’t think that Don is smart. Also when Greinke hit him and Quentin who gets beaned more then anyone starts walking to the mound what’s he supposed to do? They’re competitors, I would have been pissed to if he came at me, the ball barely skid off of his forearm. It probably didn’t even hurt the guy. Total D-bag move by Quentin and the Dodgers should throw at him everytime in their next series. If you don’t like being beaned don’t stand on top of the plate or actually try to move out of the way.

]]>By: bigharoldhttp://hardballtalk.nbcsports.com/2013/04/12/will-quentin-get-a-greater-suspension-because-greinke-was-injured-doubtful/comment-page-1/#comment-473698
Fri, 12 Apr 2013 18:05:37 +0000http://hardballtalk.nbcsports.com/?p=395658#comment-473698There is a difference between being hurt by the unintended pitch that gets away and one losing ones control and deliberately breaking the rules, .. charging the mound and starting a brawl. Unless there is a reasonable assumption that the pitcher intentionally threw at a player a pitcher is not subject any form of sanction.

But, to answer your question, Mattingly, .. or any manger for that matter, .. could and would easily argue both sides depending on the actions of their player.

That was a normal baseball occurrence. Charging the mound because one got away from him is at least unprofessional.

]]>By: bigharoldhttp://hardballtalk.nbcsports.com/2013/04/12/will-quentin-get-a-greater-suspension-because-greinke-was-injured-doubtful/comment-page-1/#comment-473681
Fri, 12 Apr 2013 17:52:11 +0000http://hardballtalk.nbcsports.com/?p=395658#comment-473681“I doubt Donny D-Bag would feel the same if Kemp charged the mound and one of the Padres pitchers were hurt.”

Except Kemp didn’t did he? He acted like a grown up and a professional and took his base. And, the pitch at Kemp was high and further inside.

]]>By: mckludgehttp://hardballtalk.nbcsports.com/2013/04/12/will-quentin-get-a-greater-suspension-because-greinke-was-injured-doubtful/comment-page-1/#comment-473677
Fri, 12 Apr 2013 17:51:23 +0000http://hardballtalk.nbcsports.com/?p=395658#comment-473677It may be impossible to read the mind of a player, but intent can be reasonably inferred through a whole variety of means and evidence. It’s what our justice system does all the time.

Staying with the hockey front, can you doubt the intention of Marty McSorley when he knocked out Donald Brashear in 2000? Or Todd Bertuzzi knocking out Steve Moore in 2004? Bertuzzi may not have wanted to knock Moore out of hockey forever, but he certainly intended to injure him. Why else would you sucker punch someone in the back of the head?

Had Quentin been hurt by that pitch that would have been the result of normal baseball play. Players getting hit while unfortunate happens.

“.. throw your gloves down you take responsibility for yourself in that situation.”

Except he didn’t throw his glove to the ground until after Quentin started his charge. In effect he was preparing for the inevitable.

The pitch got him on the on the back of the arm and wasn’t nearly as high or inside as the one thrown at Kemp, that he managed to get out of the way of. Quentin should have acted like a professional and kept his mouth shut and took his base.

Deliberately throwing at a player is one thing, one getting away from a pitcher is completely another. Considering the point of the game, the score and the count there seems to be no evidence that he was trying to hit Quentin. And, if that was his intent, why did he bother throw 5 pitches to get it to a 3-2 count? Quentin bares complete responsibility for this injury because HE insisted on fighting.

]]>By: jdnyhttp://hardballtalk.nbcsports.com/2013/04/12/will-quentin-get-a-greater-suspension-because-greinke-was-injured-doubtful/comment-page-2/#comment-473663
Fri, 12 Apr 2013 17:37:14 +0000http://hardballtalk.nbcsports.com/?p=395658#comment-473663Maybe it’s time for MLB to actually write a suspension “guideline” so that everyone’s on the same page. Charge the mound? 7 days. Aggravating circumstance – causes injury – double the penalty. Supplemental discipline for additional circumstances (brought the bat to the mound, third time this season, etc.). This way the players know going in they will have a week off. If you put it in the rules, the arbitrator has less options.

These guys aren’t hockey players. they shouldn’t be charging anyone. And not that I’m condoning anything but if you stand over the plate, you’re going to get hit. Suck it up and take your base.

]]>By: gloccamorrahttp://hardballtalk.nbcsports.com/2013/04/12/will-quentin-get-a-greater-suspension-because-greinke-was-injured-doubtful/comment-page-1/#comment-473645
Fri, 12 Apr 2013 17:24:14 +0000http://hardballtalk.nbcsports.com/?p=395658#comment-473645Forget the count and game situation being any reason no to “intentionally hit a batter. The batter is a power hitter who has already hit 3 homers against Greinke, and on a 3-2 pitch would have had to put one over the plate or thrown a ball and put him on. Hitting him is the same as a walk, and sends a message – augmented by Greinke mouthing off. The umpire undoubtedly heard what was said, so we may find out eventually. Until the Commish speaks, it’s all conjecture.
]]>By: mudhead123http://hardballtalk.nbcsports.com/2013/04/12/will-quentin-get-a-greater-suspension-because-greinke-was-injured-doubtful/comment-page-2/#comment-473639
Fri, 12 Apr 2013 17:21:23 +0000http://hardballtalk.nbcsports.com/?p=395658#comment-473639Funny Quentin gets hits all the time and decided to charge the mound when it’s a pitcher that appears to be 16.
]]>By: bigharoldhttp://hardballtalk.nbcsports.com/2013/04/12/will-quentin-get-a-greater-suspension-because-greinke-was-injured-doubtful/comment-page-2/#comment-473637
Fri, 12 Apr 2013 17:19:24 +0000http://hardballtalk.nbcsports.com/?p=395658#comment-473637You’re assuming that he was ordered to throw at Quentin. There doesn’t seem to be much evidence of that. It was a 3-2 count. Why throw 5 pitches before you deliberately hit a guy that you’ve been ordered to hit? Why have one of ones best and highest paid pitchers on the mound to do the hitting? It couldn’t wait until a reliever was in?

The pitch wasn’t as bad as the one Kemp got out of the way of Quentin just didn’t. I assume that it was just one that got away from Grenike. The difference is there is a lot more logic and circumstantial evidence to support my assumption.

]]>By: bigharoldhttp://hardballtalk.nbcsports.com/2013/04/12/will-quentin-get-a-greater-suspension-because-greinke-was-injured-doubtful/comment-page-2/#comment-473622
Fri, 12 Apr 2013 17:11:17 +0000http://hardballtalk.nbcsports.com/?p=395658#comment-473622“1. If Quentin had done the exact same thing and no injury had occured, would we be even having this conversation? ”

Yeah but the injury did occur and as was pointed out MLB tends to suspend players based on what is easier to defend rather than what is appropriate. Is that fair? I would think in most cases yes but not in all. Is it fair in this case, all things considered no.

“2. If this had been some other AAAA scrub reliever that this had happened to, would there be this much attention given to it?”

Sure it’s getting more attention but so what? It won’t really affect anything.

” If we decide we should punish by injury, CC Sabathia should have never pitched in the playoffs last year as he broke Markakis’ wrist,…”

That is a false analogy. Markakis’ injury was the result of normal baseball play. Sometimes guys get hit, unfortunate but it happens. There was never any suggestion that it was intentional nor did it lead to an altercation ejection or disciplinary action. Greinke’s injury was the result of Quentin completely losing control and he would have been ejected just for that action. While baseball brawls happen, that it not normal and are considered infractions that subject all parties to possible disciplinary action.

Unless less of course you’re Graig Nettles smacking around Bill Spaceman Lee. But, that was a different era and Lee was/is a jackass.