Webb calls for end to most affirmative action programs, criticizes 'myth' of white dominance

Updated 4:21 p.m.
Just as race issues have returned to the forefront of political debate, Virginia Sen. James Webb (D) on Friday reiterated his opposition to some affirmative action programs and suggested that white Americans are being "marginalized" by current government policies.

In a Wall Street Journal op-ed headlined "Diversity and the Myth of White Privilege," Webb writes: "Forty years ago, as the United States experienced the civil rights movement, the supposed monolith of White Anglo-Saxon Protestant dominance served as the whipping post for almost every debate about power and status in America. After a full generation of such debate, WASP elites have fallen by the wayside and a plethora of government-enforced diversity policies have marginalized many white workers."

This is not a new topic for Webb, whose complicated views on race-based programs were an issue in his 2006 Senate campaign, when some of his fellow Democrats complained that Webb sounded like a Republican. In a 2000 book review, also published in the Wall Street Journal, Webb wrote that affirmative action "has within one generation brought about a permeating state-sponsored racism that is as odious as the Jim Crow laws it sought to countermand."

Webb has said he supports some preferential programs for African Americans but not for other ethnic and immigrant groups. He reiterated that point in Friday's op-ed.

"I have dedicated my political career to bringing fairness to America's economic system and to our work force, regardless of what people look like or where they may worship," Webb writes. "Unfortunately, present-day diversity programs work against that notion, having expanded so far beyond their original purpose that they now favor anyone who does not happen to be white."

Webb's latest airing of his views comes during a week when racial issues have dominated the headlines, after the firing of Agriculture Department official Shirley Sherrod sparked heated debates on alleged "reverse racism" and whether the Obama administration -- and society as a whole -- is capable of engaging in mature discussions of racial issues without descending into acrimony.

Asked whether Webb's latest piece was prompted by the racial controversies of recent days, Webb spokesman Will Jenkins said Webb would let the article speak for itself.

Though Webb's position on affirmative action has long been known, at least one prominent Virginia Democrat -- former Gov. L. Douglas Wilder -- was highly critical of Friday's column.

"If it's not for the civil rights movement and diversity programs, he would not be a United States senator today," Wilder told the Associated Press, referring to Webb's 2006 victory with the help of minority voters. "Things are tough enough without having people you thought were friends do things like this."

Webb makes no such allegation in Friday's column, though he does complain that immigrants who have come to America in recent decades "have frequently been the beneficiaries of special government programs. The same cannot be said of many hard-working white Americans, including those whose roots in America go back more than 200 years."

Webb notes that, "[c]ontrary to assumptions in the law, white America is hardly a monolith." This is also a frequent topic for the Virginia senator. He authored a well-received book, "Born Fighting," that focused on "how the Scots-Irish shaped America." And in yet another Wall Street Journal column, a 1995 piece titled, "In Defense of Joe Six Pack," Webb pointed out that there were huge variations in income and educational status among white Americans.

He argued then that "less-advantaged white cultures by and large did the most to lay out the infrastructure of this country, quite often suffering educational and professional regression as they tamed the wilderness, built the towns, roads and schools, and initiated a democratic way of life that later white cultures were able to take advantage of without paying the price of pioneering. Today they have the least, socio-economically, to show for these contributions." Webb even claimed "the prospect of a class war is genuine" among those who have felt left behind by government policies.

Now that he's in the Senate, Webb is advocating a significant shift in government priorities when it comes to race.

"Where should we go from here?" Webb asks in Friday's piece. "Beyond our continuing obligation to assist those African-Americans still in need, government-directed diversity programs should end. Nondiscrimination laws should be applied equally among all citizens, including those who happen to be white."

This whole debacle is a shame. I certainly lost respect for news organizations. I think they are almost equivalent to our intelligence community, at least under the Bush Admin. I just cannot believe of all people they choose to attack an innocent woman with an outstanding record, all for the cause of the AGENDA. What agenda, one might ask. The conservative agenda to oust Obama. Because this is what this whole thing is about. Come on people how many colored incidents have we had following this same show, the tape, the news, and the scandal. Check out this article that looks at the bigger picture, check it out...it's worth the read

I am minority and I have always hated the way we divided americans into afro-american, hispanic-american, etc. Someone tried to label me this once and I said, "No I am not that. I am an american. period. I was born here." They saw the term american as white, only! Ridiculous!

I feel the same way about affirmative action. I resent that I busted my butt in college, only to have people believe I got there only because of the affirmitive action laws.

I want to be clear. I know that when these laws came into being it was important. But it has not really changed the way some people treat other people. What has changed is the ability for minorities and others to challenge that treatment. Every person who is wronged has a right to sue.

Affirmative action can and is used by some slackers as an excuse for their own failures. Lets end it and remove the excuse by some white people to feel resentful. Its an idea whose time has come to an end, I think.

I hate this guy. I can't wait for 2012 for a Democrat to kick his ass in the primary. All he's done since being in office is expand offshore drilling to Virginia, slow down health care reform, support DADT, and this crap.

Racism is a trump card too often pulled out to rally voters. Reality is that society shuffles into groups with which people identify. It is perhaps more a "fan" mentality but due to the history of "race" or "religion" and clear identity of those groups they become the focal point. Why it is not accepted that "racism" on a go forward basis, is a two-way street when whites and blacks are concerned amazes me. Blacks can and are at time racist against whites and as the hispanic and asian populations grow in the U.S., the black - white history will get further and further back in rear view mirror. I was discriminated against in the late 1970's on admission applications to medical school since I was a white male. Later the Bakke decision tried to right the wrong of reverse discrimination. Unfortunately, there are not enough Bakke like cases coming to court. America thrived and will thrive on "performance" and "merit". Fairness under the law is paramount to our success, however, fairness under the law does not mean everyone "gets" the same unless they pay for it and earn it. We will not maintain our stature in the world trying to make everyone in the country have the same "net worth". There will always be a monetary caste system based on merit and performance. Racism and the practice of it either direction (white versus black OR black versus white) or any racism cannot be tolerated even though it is unlikely to disappear. I felt a victim of "racism" (anti-white) in the 1970's and I see it re-emerging now as a means to draw viewership in a saturated media market.

You put an R next to his name and his career would be toast after this. WaPo and their MSM allies would have made sure of it. Mr. Pershing would have all kinds of quotes from Civil Rights organizations, including the NAACP, condemning Webb's piece. He would have already interviewed Democratic leaders across the state of Virginia and nationally, with quotes implying that Webb is a racist. The camera chasers Sharpton and Jackson would already have interviews lined up on MSNBC. Speaking of which, considering how sensitive Keith Olbermann and his White crew at MSNBC have been regarding this issue, I wonder what they have in store for Webb tonight. Can't wait to see.

I can't tell if he is talking about affirmative employment in general or in the Fed government. But any agency or company that has ONLY White men at the top has a problem, no matter what Mr. Webb says.

As for the Fed government, Blacks are over represented, and White women and Hispanics are way under-represented, compared to their numbers in the general (private and public) workforce. Makes me wonder if Mr. Webb has ever seen the numbers.

What race-based programs? Name them.
The poster Fadler wrote, "Race is a trump card pulled out to rally voters"
So is affirmative action.I don't know a black person that knows a black person benefitting from any affirmative action programs.It's a wedge issue.

The lack of historical perspective on the part of whites like Jim Webb and minorities who take on the false stigma of inferiority is literally breathtaking:

Glossing over the rape, mass murder, pillage, and enslavement of tens of millions of black and brown people (not just for one generation, but for over five hundred years) - not to mention the dessication of large swaths of the earth's resources -- by calling it the "pioneering spirit" is one obvious example of historical myopia.

And on the part of some minorities, failing to understand the socio-political dimensions of Affirmative Action -- that it acts as a 'ceiling' rather than a 'floor' on minority achievement by enabling employers to discriminate freely as long as they fulfill a nominal quota is another such example. For all of those who think Obama ascended because of an unfair advantage, if you were to apply the same competency standard to the three presidents preceding him, you'd have to conclude that Obama is overqualified for the job.

Furthermore the pervasive belief that somehow civil rights era legislation has disadvantaged whites - -who as a group have not only become much wealthier in absolute terms since that time, but relatively more wealthy than the ethnic groups supposedly benefitted by civil rights -- is further proof of the lack of vision and common sense among the punditry and its audience.

Sadly, affirmative action programs tend to discriminate the most against people who are classified as Asians or " poor whites". They often benefit middle and upper class people who are classified as belonging to "disadvantaged minority races" and not actual poor people that fit in those categories.

Race itself is imaginary, with no biological basis, it is merely a set of categories set up by racists to further the interests of an artificial group they named. In our mixed-race present, the definitions are even more blurred. It feels quite racist to consider questions like what precise set of origins classify one as falling into a particular group, like the guy in South Africa who had to divorce his wife when their marriage became illegal after he was reclassified as being white. What we call "black", someone in Kenya would laugh at. These racist race labels are meaningless, except in the minds of racists. That's the true deep understanding any intelligent person must draw from the situation. Stop pretending like it matters.

Whazzis, Blacks are overrepresented....How? Where? Check the latest unemployment figures, the only thing that blacks overrepresent is in unemployment numbers. So you're wrong.
Hispanics and white women are underrepresented? Do you have a reference or statistics to prove your points?
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You say you can't tell what he's talking about, neither can he.
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Both Webb and you need to remember also, a significant amount of whites are anti-government, so they are going to resist gov't help, gov't remedies, etc. Perhaps, this is why, if true, whites appear to be underrepresented.
Comedian Bill Maher always points out how he is perplexed by poor whites who vote against their own interests as Republicans. So am I, the gov't wishes to help these folks, but they are anti-gov't-what can you do?

So before whites go 'woe is us', remember many of you hate the government.

I wish that Jim Webb represented me instead of "that joke" of a senator Ben Cardin. Enough of "playing" to the blacks! Jim is right on with his comments.. We have given the blacks enough in this country.. Why are so many blacks unemployed? simply because most of them have no skills, very little purpose, little or no education (many have no real desire to be educated)-what do they expect- give them a job because they are black? let them earn it instead of being handed one. Let them fight for a job like a white person.Latino's another story....
Great

Wow!! I was generally unaware of his views on this topic. The only surprise here for me is that it came from a sitting senator - but it is generally a commonly held belief even among white voters that in some ways, you could justify Affirmation Action for African-Americans because of slavery. Like the Scot-Irish he apparently speaks of, African-Americans contributed mightily to the industrial-manufacturing base that built this country. Webb appears to be saying what is said in private across many white homes - that with the exception of descendants of African-American slaves, I would add Native Americans, affirmation action programs should be limited and curtailed. I think his timing on the topic was pretty bad and suspect that it is the kind of thing that cost him the VP slot on Obama's ticket.

I don't think marginalized is the right word to use. How many members of minority groups are in Congress? On the Supreme Court? CEOs of major corporations and industries? It still looks like most power positions are held by white guys. However, he's right about poorer whites being somehow left out when government goodies are distributed.

White is the minority ! If you don't see this your blind . Whites are discriminated in the work force because when non whites get the managing positions they only hire there own ! And it will have a affect on you some day so don't be surprised .

Webb is perfectly right in pointing out that there are big differences in the circumstances and opportunities among whites. Most poor people are white, and not enough is done to help them.

But if someone or something is keeping them down, it's not what little is being done to help minority groups. Poor whites are more likely to be exploited by the wealthier whites of their own communities (see Joe Bageant's DeerHunting with Jesus for a report from the inside.)

So the other part of Webb's tale is reverse race-baiting. Appeal to the whites who feel aggrieved at their fortunes and name a scape-goat: affirmative action.

I'm white, I've lived through the great era of affirmative action, and I've never been left out because I wasn't black enough. I can't say my experience is universal, but I don't see the evidence in my life or the lives of others I've known.

There have been a few cases that where made into a cause celebre with the manufacture of much hot air. It doesn't seem very systematic.

Webb needs to back up his charges; otherwise he's just playing demagogue. The fact that he had to turn to the uber-right Wall Street Journal editorial pages to publish this opinion pretty much proves my point.

I wish that Jim Webb represented me instead of "that joke" of a senator Ben Cardin. Enough of "playing" to the blacks! Jim is right on with his comments.. We have given the blacks enough in this country.. Why are so many blacks unemployed? simply because most of them have no skills, very little purpose, little or no education (many have no real desire to be educated)-what do they expect- give them a job because they are black? let them earn it instead of being handed one. Let them fight for a job like a white person.Latino's another story....
Great

Posted by: rsmith5588 | July 23, 2010 1:34 PM | Report abuse
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Excuse Me smith. if you would take the time to learn facts you would know that most blacks work everyday just like you whether its 1,2, or 3 jobs to make ends meet. The media and whites who like to perpetrate the myth that all blacks don't work or welfare queens ,etc. just want to beleive that cause you are afraid for some reason that blacks are taking something away from you. I'm sure you probably work around/with blacks everyday. People get it together as long as whites continue to divide and scare other whites this is what you'll have...We are ALL suffering though this time of recession and we all want and need the same things just different colors. take a page from Ms. Sherrod get over yourself and think of reconcilliation with others not like you

You guys need to read more closely. He's NOT even saying that African-Americans are undeserving. He's saying largely that other ethnic groups are. So, I don't think his viewpoint is nuanced at all. The trouble with him though, is that he has to explain how all them rich, white dudes from Goldman Sachs, Enron, etc. absconded with such money and why he voted to bailout a LOT of white folks who brought the country to ruins - some were probably even of Scot-Irish heritage - a lot I'm sure.

Webb I don’t know what world you live in but look at your fellow colleagues (Senators and Congressman); Supreme Court; Fortune 500 executives; TV news; print media; state government executives; federal government executives; etc., etc., etc. Whites still hold the majority of these positions.

I do think Webb is trying to make a sophisticated argument, but he totally screwed the pooch when he said that white dominance is a myth. Look on the boards of investment banks, look in the C-suites of defense contractors and you will know that white dominance is alive and well.

What he should have said is that any preference programs should be class-based and not race-based. Ironic that he should come out with a confusing statement in the same week that Shirley Sherrod ran into the race buzzsaw. Listen to her entire speech about aiding a white farmer and she says she concluded that helping people should be based on their need, not their race.

Also, Webb needs to get over the whole "Scots-Irish built the country, took the risks and then others reaped the benefits" mantra. This comes very close to the position of the No Nothing nativists of the 1840s and 1850s.

Webb's an Annapolis grad and a highly decorated combat Marine. I would expect better from him.

Oh, man. I'm white, and it's so tough! Like ... I can't even begin to tell you how hard it is, being white and all. It's so hard I can't even come up with examples of being discriminated against! See how much I'm suffering?

MY people built this country! NOT the slaves. NOT the Chinese, brought in for the express purpose of building the railroads. No, MY people. Just like I'm so flustered that I can't think of ways I suffer from discrimination, I also can't think of what my people built. See how racist everyone is being against me?

Mr. Webb offers scant evidence for his belief that whites are being marginalized. Meanwhile there is plenty of evidence of discrimination against minorities, particularly African-Americans. Try to compete against "Todd" or "Beth" in landing a job interview if your name happens to be "Tyrone" or "Vanessa."

And it's absolutely laughable to believe that a generation of civil rights laws has somehow erased the racial hatred of centuries.

A great topic for a classroomSeminar. But in the real world Many Corporations would not hire and advance Blacks and other minorities without some Diversity Programs.
It was not too long ago the Black Guys could play QuaterBack. We had an owner right here in Washington DC who insisted that no N's would aever play for his team
After the Supreme Court handed down Brown v Board many jurisdictions closed their schools rather than comply with the Court's decision.
We may have a Black President but this is still America. A Black Man no matter how many Degrees he has still cant catch a Cab after daek.
SO if Sern Webb think that we have reached that point in this society he is sadly mistaken
He was never on the outside looking in

I trust Senator Webb and I agree with his conclusions on Affirmative Action.

I believe that White Americans are being marginalized by many of the Affirmative Action programs and that Black Americans' accomplishments are being disparaged or dimissed because of the "perceived" edge that many of theses Affirmative Action Programs purport to give minorites.

I didn't find Webb's arguments particularly nuanced at all. In reading this kind of opinion piece, it's important not to lose sight of the big picture.
To refer to "white dominance" as a "myth" is absolutely absurd. It is without a doubt one of the most stupid claims I've ever seen.
To give just one example, something like 25% of young blacks (late teens through twenties) are in jail at any point in time....
Posted by: dougd1
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so, white dominance is why so many blacks are incarcerated?!? what about the families and communities these men come from? they were raised right, but whity jailed them to maintain dominance?

The White House is anti-white middle American. Obama is happy to serve the white elites, he has hired many of them. He is halfway in support of the poor white. But middle class whites, you are in Obama's cross hairs and he will homogenize you with the masses if he can.

I do not know what to make of Webb. One commenter said he slowed health care down and I complain that he did not slow it down enough as in force a true bipartisan bill. Webb could have done that.
.

Posted by: nicekid
I would just like to point out that Jim Webb, on this subject, is an idiot. He has no earthly idea what he's talking about.
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I strongly disagree with your entire post. Senator Webb is a fine and descent man, a patriot, and a darn good politician that is about good & just governing. Had this been Senator Allen saying this I would have been filled with distrust. I think it is time "We" Black Americans begin letting go a lot of theses Affirmative Actions Programs. We as a people have accomplished a lot and the right-wingers notwithstanding, we are seen as great contributors to the building of our great country America.

Something all us normal christian non socialists and communists in Dixie have known for the past 50 years. As he says it (Affirmative Action, so-called civil rights and so-called voting rights laws) is the reason for the division in our country and only serves the goals and motives of those wishing to destroy America. Separate but Equal is the only solution. As we said all along Governor George Wallace was right to stand behind the people of Alabama and the rest of the South when he tried to tell the world you cannot have two Gods as a matter of speaking and so we cannot have two sets of laws, one for the socialists and communists and one for the Christian American. The Consititution must be a one for all and all for one document and States Rights allows the people to run their States as they wish and if it does not suit a particular group or race, etc then there are planes, trains, and boats leaving every day from that State.

I grew up in a Southwestern state. I am Anglo, but I always loved Spanish and Mexico and Mexicans. But with Affirmative Action, Reverse Descrimination, and the protests by "Latinos" against the Arizona immigration law, I have begun to hate Spanish, hate Mexico, and hate Mexicans - and this is coming on top of what was already a great dislike for blacks because of reverse descrimination. (I am so sick and tired of hearing how you suffered for several hundred years! This usually comes from black Ph.D's who have had every opportunity to succeed in this country. They're not suffering from anything!) Do you think I'm alone here? No, no, no! Not at all. Look at what's happening this country now. Whites are pushing back against People of Color! There is no more apologizing for anything. Thanks, Obama! Thanks, Stupid Liberals!

Sen. Webb is on point in historically pointing out the history behind original Affirmative Action programs. His assertion to end these programs is equally correct. However, I cannot vouchsafe for his sidebar pointing out the length of "residence" of certain folks compared to others. This is completely irrelevant. Sounds very nativist. Talk about people using a trump card. It makes no matter to me, and I hope to all my fellow Americans, whether I or my family has lived in the U.S. thirty or three-hundred years. Unfortunately, this kind of rhetorical flourish is exactly what creates the alienation Webb laments.

"Masedgination" definition= "the blending of negro's and whites" a comendable / noble endeavour involving all sorts and colors, but with only one exception,= the american negro with slave history ancestors, color is used as a defender aspect against every and all discrepencies by american negro's, the 1964 civil rights law was enacted to avoid anarchy by africans wanting repairations for slavery! the american way is no more viable,the seperation between africans and whites must be accomplished by deviding america to seperate along the lines of "mason/dixon" history demarcation, alternatively, Haiti is the answer, let the africans in america do in haiti what they do here !

Though I disagree with Webb's points, I do agree that affirmative action should end. I say it from the desire to achieve mutual respect among the different ethnic and racial categories, as deliberately altering admission or acceptance standards for certain groups of people inevitably creates resentment in the "more powerful" and degrades the "less powerful". It doesn't really serve minorities in the true sense-- they end up chronically short on skills (and getting a pat on the head), sometimes socially or professionally maladjusted, and disrespected by classmates or colleagues because it's a given that they've been accepted at a lower standard. As a minority, you lose respect as well as the opportunity to gain the actual hard skills you need in order to really be successful.

As long as you maintain different standards for a select few, you'll disenfranchise both the "powerful" and the "less-powerful". The powerful will resent the less-powerful, and the less-powerful will lose the respect of the more-powerful. On the other hand, if you hold everyone to the same standard, you can allow the really talented, successful minorities to shine, without the insulting assumption that they were shooed in despite their inferior educational or professional achievement. I'd say that the latter is more empowering and bound to create more harmony. Affirmative action is only setting up the "powerful" to resent/disdain and the "less-powerful" to be complacement in its under-achieving state.

Some of the very powerful (educated, wealthy, salient) minorities in this country worked their way up through financial, cultural, linguistic, and legal barriers to gain the respect of the powerful majority. Though initially in small numbers (or still in small numbers), their authentic successes led to their communities' eventual empowerment and acceptance.

Jim Webb is a truth to power speaker because he don't need the job; that's what got him elected. I might actually vote for the guy this time. The problem with race-based affirmative action is that it rewards people for the color of their skin, so they can't overcome that stigma no matter how well they might perform.

First. Read the op-ed piece then comment. The posts here demonstrate the problem. Senator Webb's is pointing out the obvious. Red-neck and hillbilly jokes testify to the history he is addressing. Both poor Whites and Blacks have suffered under the boot of power. Racism was and still is a useful tool to keep these two groups apart. The consequence of Slavery and discrimination have to be addressed but lets lift up our eyes to the larger issue. Though many poor Whites ethnic groups were eventually allowed to assimilate, at the beginning they faced discrimination and subjugation. One of the first thing each new White ethnic group learned was the inferiority of Blacks. No matter how hard they had it, it was worse for the Blacks. A history build on this foundation is poisonous. We need a reconciliation project like the one done in South Africa. Think of what would happen if these two groups joined in a shared future. Currently, there is nothing in our culture that is trying to bring them together. In fact, everything is set up to keep them separated. Each is the boogie man for the opposing group. Meanwhile the the poor are left to languish separately. The arguments in these posts support the status quo on the left and right. Our cowardice on the subject of Race is our inability to see beyond our own self-serving perspectives to a unified vision where we share the future.

It shows how America has such an obsession with race that Webb fails to mention ending Affirmative Action programs based on gender. Statistic wise females now graduate high school and college in greater numbers. Furthermore, the recession has mainly targeted men, yet no mention of that by Webb

Sen. Webb's opinion piece is titled, "Diversity and the Myth of White Privilege."

Yet this WP blog is headlined, "Webb criticizes 'myth' of white dominance." The WP has arbitrarily changed "privilege" to "dominance".

The two words are NOT synonyms. What sloppy writing and/or editing in the WP!

Webb, by confining his historical focus almost entirely to economic indicators, makes a reasonable case that the majority of southern whites have not enjoyed economic "privilege" relative to blacks.

But Webb's careful argument is mangled, becoming simply fatuous, when his central concept is misrepresented in this headline.

No one with a basic awareness of American history--i.e., of the constitutionally authorized enslavement of blacks, followed by legal segregation and Jim Crow laws, exemplary lynchings, exclusion by force from voter registration lists, real-estate "redlining" in cities, etc., etc., etc.--could think to argue that white "dominance" was a "myth". Legally and socially, if not economically, ALL white southerners belonged to a "dominant" class. During much of this country's 234-year history, other minority groups (Native American, Asian, Hispanic) were also "dominated" by an almost entirely white power structure .

Webb, in offering his views of how best to deal with the troubled legacy of that dominance, makes some valid points. His main point is that the idea of generalized white economic "privilege" is a myth.

Why did you, Ben Pershing, change Webb's language (thus his meaning, to those who didn't go on to read further) to something else?

Does this guy leave his house. I see rich white people every day. I see rich white people running Wall Street, Main Street, and all the other streets in this country. White priviledge is still alive and well. I'll be glad when its called American priviledge instead of white priviledge. white people are so privilidges that they elected a black president just to show the world that they could take a vacation and still be in charge. You dont have to be sitting in the white house to be running the country. Money and greed runs America, not color. And who has all the money...White people. I guess that was an oxymoron. So yes, white people run this country. I'm just trying to get some crumbs off of the table to feed my family. Yours truly...The Modern Day Slave.

He can't be serious. Despite two years of college, my father (b. 1927) couldn't gain admittance to the craftsmen unions to obtain the better jobs in Chicago to support his family of five. So he, and many like him, were relegated to working on marginal projects at lesser pay. We knew what it was like to go without heating (and other necessities) in the North's harsh winters. So one or two generations of our population is disadvantaged...how about the legacy of fractured families that still exists for many more. Seems that Webb is only concerned with the convenient truth.

While you are at it, get moving in Congress to end brining refugees to the US who live off of hard-working taxpayers,
close the doors to all immigration until we get our country's financial situtation
under control.

We are bankrupt as a country, yet we allow
immigrants to enter the US who live off of hard-working taxpayers?

This bleeding-heart crap has to come to an end. Why should we pay for education,
food, housing, transporation, etc. for refugees/immigrants when we cannot take care of our own? This is outrageous,
and Congress has to stop this madness.

Repeal the 14th Amendement while you are
at it.

Note: three families of refugees have moved into my community. Do they work?
No. Do they have cellphones? Yes. Do taxpayers pay for their keep? Yes.

We are not same country as we were when
we were the "new" land. Immigrants came to this country with skills and a desire to work and achieve their dreams.

Immigrants today come to our country with their hands out and thanks to many non-profit organization, are taught how to
get as much money as possible off of the backs of US hard-working taxpayers.

It's 2010 and we STILL have firsts: First Black President, First Black Forbes 50 CEO, First Black Woman Representative from a Southern state's jurisdiction, etc. 60 years after Brown, 50 years after Civil Rights legislation, and we're STILL talking about "Firsts!!" That's the problem here America. IF you weren't still using race in manipulative and constraining ways, there wouldn't be a need for affirmative-action programs (for any race).

And you posters MUST all be ignorant, talking about affirmative-action and african-americans (Jim Webb definitely is). The NUMBER ONE beneficiary to affirmative-action policies is none other than WHITE WOMEN!

Here's the problem, white people in America (not all, but many) are still twisting and misstating what affirmative-action is supposed to be about. And for Webb to say it's hurting whites is completely asinine. And this fool is a U.S. Senator. With leaders like these, no wonder the U.S. is quickly become a banana republic. Here's some advice for you people (you too Sen. Webb), go CRACK A BOOK and learn something before spewing nonsense out of your mouths and keyboards.

"less-advantaged white cultures by and large did the most to lay out the infrastructure of this country..." Senator Webb obviously forgets the Native Americans who had a thriving culture in "America" before the Europeans arrived. Not to mention the use of "imported" African slaves and Japanese used to build railroads in the West. Every ethnicity and culture in "American" has a claim to marginalization. In my opinion, the Senator's argument does little to advance the goal of equalizing access to economic opportunity.

Is there not a difference between nondiscrimination and affirmative action? I feel like affirmative action was all about getting once-discriminated-against minorities back up to speed with white people. Some QUICK research (rough and dirty, admittedly):

US Population (Wikipedia):
79.8% White
15.4% Hispanic
12.8% African American
4.5% Asian American

Call me crazy, but that *quick* evidence tends to lead me to believe we're as up to speed as we can probably get (given the constant influx of immigrants into the US).

The term 'racist' thrown at Sen. Webb is ridiculous. There's a difference between making a process *fair* and giving someone a leg up. If anything, giving one person a leg up is only going to upset those who are not so lucky.

Webb's article does make sense. It's now 2010, almost a half century since the Great Society, the War on Poverty and Affirmative Action, all intended to redress the wrongs of southern Jim Crow laws and other national-level discrimination. But persistent programs and policies which advance the interest of one ethnic group over others are unnecessary and inconsistent with 21st Century American values. Many of those social engineering programs proved fiscal dry holes, in fact making social and economic conditions worse for the intended beneficiaries.

As a black male, I agree with Webb that there needs to be a change in diversity programs, but not for the reasons he described. Government, businesses and educational institutions do not realize that achieving diversity is very difficult, and I do not mean soley on race. I have learned that though it is admirable to seek diversity, it is better to build an organization or team based on fit and qaulifications no matter the race, ethnicity or gender, and in doing so, diversity comes on its own. In contrast, President Obama has black, white, Jewish, gay, straight, male and female people in his camp, but I would contend there is not much diversity there when practically all those people are Harvard alumni and/or come from similar backgrounds despite their skin color. White people, just like all people, should be included in diversity. A white male coming into an organization can add to the diversity just as a black man coming into the organization. They could have come from the same economic background and could have the same education. What possibly makes them different,and therefore creates diversity, are their values and beliefs. Diversity is no longer about skin color. It is about ideaologies.

The trouble with Jim Webb though, is that he has to explain how all them rich, white dudes from Goldman Sachs, Enron, etc. absconded with such money and why he voted to bailout a LOT of white folks who brought the country to ruins - some were probably even of Scot-Irish heritage - a lot I'm sure.

Instead of getting rid of affirmative action, I think we should just move it from being race based, to based on a history of economic deprivation.
If your family and American forefathers have been economically disadvantaged (poor) then steps should be taken to promote higher education through grants and lower cost loans.
There are plenty of Blacks in this country who do not need any special help and at the same time there are countless whites (like in appallachia) whose families have suffered economically historically.

He lost me completely when he said affirmative action was the same as Jim Crow. Seriously dude?

I begin with the a simple premise. Obama is President, but our country still has a long way to go before we achieve racial equality and a color-blind society. Even as a black man, I'm willing to agree with the conservatives (many of whom I consider to be closet and not-so-closet racists), AA is not the perfect solution. It is inherently racist. However, the ills of the past have created an unbalanced playing field in this country. AA is an attempt to balance it out. Unless someone can come up with a better solution, deal with it. It's really hilarious to me to see the emotional outrage displayed by white folks over this issue. When you compare AA to the lifetimes and centuries of racism and imbalance most black folk have been and continute to be subjected to, this issue becomes completely absurd.

Interesting considering the political party of choice that Sen. Webb belongs to, also happens to be the political party of the Attorney General. Who does not believe blacks are capable of committing racist crimes, despite the overwhelming evidence day in and day out that they do so against at least Asians.

Webb's views are, in my liberal opinion, right. "Affirmative Action" laws should primarily be used to provide redress for historically disadvantaged communities, and not merely for any applicant who is non-white.

But Webb makes it sound like there's a zero-sum game in opportunities among disadvantaged communities. The truth is that there is no poor white v. poor Hispanic tradeoff. There is a poor white problem AND a poor Hispanic problem, and sicking one against another isn't going to fix it.

Webb needs to be vocal that Diversity is about valuing and uplifting both the white Christian farmer in Nebraska and the Hmong refugee. Diversity isn't a battlefield, but a discussion.

Can we just treat everyone fairly and judge people based on their own work and talents? Is that really too much to ask? Seriously, what's with this new fascination with race? Is it because Obama got elected? A bi-racial man gets elected president and all of a sudden the world is equal, racism (from any group towards any group) doesn't exist? Judge a man on his character, not his skin color and this wouldn't be a problem at all. I hate to say it though, but "white people," you guys started this mess. Well, not you guys pesonally, but your ancestors. It'd be nice if we could've left this stuff in 1865, but we couldn't, Jim Crow had to come along for the ride into the 1970's.

I didn't vote for Jim Webb the first time. I will rectify that mistake when he runs for the Senate again.
We need to start looking at people as people instead of politically convenient categorizations of people.

What race-based programs? Name them.
The poster Fadler wrote, "Race is a trump card pulled out to rally voters"
So is affirmative action.I don't know a black person that knows a black person benefitting from any affirmative action programs.It's a wedge issue.

There are some that believe that any black person who accomplishes anything only did so because of affirmative action. I really don't know where they get this stuff from. Affirmative action has helped women more than anyone else. You still primarily only see black men on the basketball court or football field.

A lot of comments here are living proof that aff. action is still needed.
The amount of disdain, hatred&racism oozing from some posts is nauseating to the max.

I am not even mentioning those that want "apartheid" in America..How sick&twisted is that.

If You don't like the way it is, or feel Your white TeutProt status endangered, You are free to leave. Buy an island or something and make Your own "Apartheid". The rest of us Americans are just fine being "Americans" whatever colour or religion.

Shame we cannot make Webb black for, say, a year, and send him job-hunting under a different name. What an awakening that would be.

There is no evidence that reverse discrimination exists.
Washington is still largely a white male bastion. Corporate America likewise. T.V. land likewise, The world of doctors likewise.
Did all the black sportsmen playing football, basketball, get on their teams via affirmative action?. Is the American music scene which is powered by black artists, which also powers the fashion industry achieve their goals via affirmative action?.
The mystery about poor white people has allways been, why do they vote against their own interests when they vote Republican?. So you might say poor black people are just smarter than poor white people when it comes the the voting booth.

I wonder if Sen. Webb's are based on research studies or some sort of verifiable documentation or are merely personal opinions or feelings. Whatever his views are, unless he can back up his positions w/carefully researched evidence, I don't find his viewpoints very credible.

I can certainly understand the frustration, and it makes sense. We've gotten better, but no we haven't reached the point of equality, not until there is equal representation. I don't think we will reach that point by simply letting the issue be. Affirmative action is the quicker option by comparison, to get to that point.

African Americans have long history of significantly helping to build this country, and being under-represented by comparison to that of even poor whites.

We've come a long way, but there's still work to do when it comes to bringing out more equality and less discrimination whether by class, race, age, political association, gender, etc you name it. It all still exists to this day. There's disproportionate neglect which supports an advantage to those on the other end in each of these categories.

I am in support of all programs to combat the inequality, in an effort TO bring about more equality. Racial discrimination is only part of the Discrimination issue.

As far as affirmative action is concerned, it should be active. Rather than people losing their spots, however, More Room should be made for other applicants alongside them. I say, Make Room and Add Seats to those prestigious colleges. Add more space to those buildings for the cause.

Several years ago, I was riding to work as a "slug" and topic of affirmative action came up. I told the other two individuals in the car that I believe the U.S. could abolish affirmative action. Not only because people had become more fair in their practices but there are too many watch groups, National Urban League, NAACP, EEO, etc., to call out unfair, prejudicial acts. The other two participants in the conversation disagreed with me and cited that the U.S. was not ready yet. I am a black American, they were white Americans, telling me, the U.S. was not ready to abolish affirmative action yet. Let me add, two mature white Americans, at least in their mid to late 30s. I believe the gentleman was in his early 40s. Over time, I have experienced subtle prejudice, observed it, observed how "cliques" exclude those who do not look, act or believe as they do.

Jim Webb was the Secretary of the Navy under President Reagan. He is a closet republican who KNEW being a republican in 2006 would hurt his chances of being elected. This is why he is a democrat, and the only reason he is. He is a conservative with views that only see issues from his perspective, the eyes of a hard-working, well-to-do white man. He does not see how it can be tough when barriers are placed in front of you because of how you look. He has no idea what it is like to not be part of the "clique" and receive the benefits of that clique just because of how you look. Bold words for the democratic senator. I guess he does not want minority votes in Virginia going forward. His words could have been better stated.

@moebius22 and sachancp,
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I agree with you two-to a point. Women, not just white women have been the chief beneficiaries of many social justice movements. Just look in healthcare at private MDs offices. With the exception of male doctors-every office is almost entirely women-the receptionists, call centers, billing department and other office staff. At hospitals,it's pretty much the same-Women have locked down all the office jobs. Go to gov't offices(ie.,the local DMV), women have the majority of those jobs as well. Go to supermarkets, yep that's right, majority women. Go to Walmart, K-mart, Sears, JC Penney- pretty much all women. Where else, oh yeah, Comcast's customer service desks are manned (womanned?) almost entirely by females at Michigan Ave. For me to see businesses that have more than 2 males working there-I have to go the auto mechanic.
I'm not picking on women ( I love em'-why would I do that?)just making my personal observations that they benefit richly, from social programs designed to encourage employment.
I'll give a personal example-I'm unemployed, though I have 19 years of experience in healthcare and have been to 2 colleges and Strayer. My female cousin dropped out of high school in the 12th grade, but through some single mother social program-she got a job paying 22/hr. that she kept, until getting tired of the job. Now, she has another gov't job, while I can't buy a job.

I'm black and agree with Webb. It's ridiculous that recent immigrants from the Caribbean, Africa, Latin America etc. and their children are beneficiaries of these program. They were not discriminated against.

The programs should be done away and replaced with programs that target needy black, white, and other Americans whose families have been here for generations.

I worked at one of DC's behemoth non-profits that prides itself on diversity. I was standing in line in the cafeteria. An African American manager was speaking to her friend about an interviewee who had come in that morning.

"I only called her because her name sounded black," she remarked to her friend, and continued to say she was shocked when white woman showed up for the interview.

"Are you going to hire her?" her friend asked.

"LORD no!" the manager exclaimed, and chuckled saying she had another candidate who she was sure was black coming in the next morning.

True story. Imagine if that conversation had taken place between 2 white managers over a black candidate. They probably would not have been speaking so candidly in the workplace cafeteria about it, that's for sure.

The non-profit starts with an A, and caters to the elderly. And discrimination in hiring.

I'm a liberal Democrat, and I believe that we need to take a closer look at our diversity policies. It has allowed the type of discrimation I overheard above to not only proliferate, but to not even be considered wrong or shameful, and ANY discrimination is wrong.

And if you are saying I should have gone to HR about this incident, you have obviously never worked for this non-profit.

Thank you Senator Webb for first speaking out about the need for prison reform (as some posters have written about here, but seemingly unaware that this is an issue that Senator Webb is leading on) and now this. Those who would label Senator Webb a racist are proving a point- that we throw that term around so willingly now that it prevents society from having an honest conversation about programs like AA. Thank you, Senator Webb, for engaging folks on this issue and not calling those who disagree with you 'racist'.

I worked at one of DC's behemoth non-profits that prides itself on diversity. I was standing in line in the cafeteria. An African American manager was speaking to her friend about an interviewee who had come in that morning.

"I only called her because her name sounded black," she remarked to her friend, and continued to say she was shocked when white woman showed up for the interview.

"Are you going to hire her?" her friend asked.

"LORD no!" the manager exclaimed, and chuckled saying she had another candidate who she was sure was black coming in the next morning.

True story. Imagine if that conversation had taken place between 2 white managers over a black candidate. They probably would not have been speaking so candidly in the workplace cafeteria about it, that's for sure.

The non-profit starts with an A, and caters to the elderly. And discrimination in hiring.

I'm a liberal Democrat, and I believe that we need to take a closer look at our diversity policies. It has allowed the type of discrimation I overheard above to not only proliferate, but to not even be considered wrong or shameful, and ANY discrimination is wrong.

And if you are saying I should have gone to HR about this incident, you have obviously never worked for this non-profit.

I think the government has become suspect on multiple fronts with its wide array of preferential treatment to a variety of constituents; including big business, which gets all kinds of tax breaks that small business doesn't get. I would like to see Webb lead a movement that forces government to honor the equal protection under the law clause of the constitution and simnplify everything from the tax code to regulation.

Jim Webb was the Secretary of the Navy under President Reagan. He is a closet republican who KNEW being a republican in 2006 would hurt his chances of being elected. This is why he is a democrat, and the only reason he is. He is a conservative with views that only see issues from his perspective, the eyes of a hard-working, well-to-do white man. He does not see how it can be tough when barriers are placed in front of you because of how you look. He has no idea what it is like to not be part of the "clique" and receive the benefits of that clique just because of how you look. Bold words for the democratic senator. I guess he does not want minority votes in Virginia going forward. His words could have been better stated.
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If Senator Webb is a closet Republican then he is the kind of Republican I like. There are several good Republican Senators I trust to phase out many of the Affirmatice Action Programs but because the leadership of the Republican party is so infested by hate filled race baiters and racial opprotunists, that the trustworthy Republicans would no be able to gain enough creditability with the People to get anything done.

Well said! However I hate what he has voted for.. (lock step w/ Pelosi) I am curious as to what specific "preferential programs" he would like to keep for African Americans.. Enough is Enough! Hire the best and most qualified individuals for jobs - accept the best candidates for schools (not necessarily white people!) I have witnessed the poor performance in the Federal/State/Local workforce. You want a clear example – Look at Metro! Content of character, intelligence and analytical thinking should be the measurements.. The lib*tards know the "Bell Curve" was accurate.. that's why they want to hold on to these special entitlement "programs" for blacks..

Perhaps Senator Webb doesn't realize that any kind of quota system is illegal. It seems he's creating a stawman argument here and pandering to right wing white people. It's a shame. I thought he really was a thoughtful, compassionate person. He's just another politician.

I thought that a decade or more ago the courts found that giving preference based on race was unconstitutional. I thought the only constitutional kind of affirmative action was merely publicizing in minority communities and organizations those job or educational opportunities that minorities typically did not apply for. That special effort is justified because without contacts in the organization they did not have the networking word-of-mouth notification responsible for making qualified people aware of job opportunities.

Quotas to make a work force or university's demographics mirror that of the general population should never be permissible or take precedence over ability. Nevertheless, federal managers were under pressure to achieve that same result, without formally setting quotas. That practice should be better controlled to ensure that everyone has equal opportunity. Otherwise there will be suspicion that a person of color got a position that he or she is not really qualified for.

The various laws that require the Census to collect ethnic and racial data (in arbitrary non-scientific categories that do not even include all who suffer discriminatory bias), if once justified to even the playing field, have outlived the the Constitutional contortion they cause. Preferential treatment is inherently unfair treatment, whether it applies to one ethnicity or another, and is not "equal protection under the law."

Someone should review what the various laws are that require the collection of such data. As Shirley Sherrod (the Agriculture Department employee in the news) pointed out, it is often poverty not ethnicity that discriminates, the children of the "haves" being given greater opportunities than the "have-nots."

I WAS WORKING AT THE ASSOCIATION OF AMERICAN MEDICAL COLLEGES WHEN AN AFFIRMATIVE ACTION CASE ATTEMPTED TO SUE THE AAMC. A YOUNG MAN WHO WAS WHITE, CLAIMED THAT HE WAS A VICTIM OF THAT ACTION, BECAUSE HE HAD BEEN DENIED ACCEPTANCE IN TO MED SCHOOLS HE APPLIED TO IN ORDER TO KEEP SPACES AVAILABLE FOR BLACKS. AS RIDICULOUS AS IT SOUNDS, HE SUCCESSFULLY PROVED HE WAS RIGHT. I UNDERSTAND WHAT WEBB IS SAYING, HOWEVER, SOME WHITES, LIKE THE ONES IN KENTUCKY, NEED THE LAW TO DO WHAT'S FAIR AND RIGHT. AND YES, THE WHITE ESTABLISHMENT VIEWED BY MINORITIES SEEM MONOLITHIC BECAUSE WE KNOW WHO'S IN CHARGE OF EVERYTHING.

The week hasn't even finished and we're still talking about race. But not just race this time -- fairness in the workplace for hiring all types of minorities, including women and war veterans (of which Mr. Webb is one).

I'm not sure that Sen. Webb has thought this through. How on earth would he enact it?

There's no way to prevent immigrants from getting into the best colleges, other than to falsely raise the scores of less qualified whites and blacks. No way to prevent immigrants from getting the best jobs, as long as they're more qualified.

Anyone who uses the term "lib*tard" in a statement does not have a large enough IQ for any part of his or her statement to be seriously considered.

Intelligent people consider and respect other viewpoints, and have the ability to express their own viewpoint on a subject without resorting to insults and stereotypes. Insults and stereotypes are the crutch of those who lack adequate intellectual resources for intelligent discourse.

But then again, I'm only a liberal -- with a B.A. from a respected Virginia college, and a Master's from GWU. But as a "lib*tard", what could I possibly know?

I work with a half a dozen black women, from Jamaica, Dominican Republic, Alabama, New Jersey. One of them is a bit of a slouch. The rest work their b***s off. A few of them have some occupational weaknesses stemming from their upbringing, as most of us do, but they have hit the ground running in this company. And yes, they got here through affirmative action.

The folks who don't need affirmative action are Asians/ Pacific Islanders. What's that, anyway? Their ancestors weren't enslaved, weren't responsible for building William and Mary University (today's news), weren't systematically kept from everything good this country has to offer for 300 years.

If anyone should be considered a minority deserving of some TLC, it should be women, who were given the vote in 1920, even after black men got theirs in 1870.

...libtards. What a terrible thing to type. I am a well educated, highly skilled liberal worker with a tendency to care about those around me. And don't think for a second that because I show this kindness sometimes that I am weak. This libtard will knock you straight out.

Choose your words more carefully. You never know who is listening or what they will do.

Part of the great popular success (i.e., political support by most Americans) was possible because New Deal Programs did NOT address race directly, but instead addressed NEED. Social Security coverage and benefits, for example, were and are color-blind. We'd be in a better place now if our focus was social programs based on economic needs, not ethnicity. College grants/scholarships, job training programs, housing--whatever: leave ethnicity out of it.

I agree with Senator Webb. During my working career, I saw many East Indian, Korean, Hispanics and women form 8a companies and get preferential treatment in government contracts and end up selling their companies for millions of dollars. These people were in no way underprivileged or discriminated against. We should narrow the 8a classification to blacks born in this country.

I applaud Senator Webb in making this statement. Our view on diversity currently is counter productive. How can we expect to get past the issues of race in the workplace, and education, by educating and making decisions based on categories defined by ethnicity and race? This identification of separate and different groups will always breed completion and disdain between them. It doesn’t matter what you look like. This is America. But the age old American practice of giving preferential treatment to status-candidates based on race, and other sorts of physical identifiers, means that the work force and student body do not necessarily favor the most capable or brightest minds, and breed jelousy and contempt between groups. I'll be happy if Webb helps change our societal views from us vs. them, to just US.

The hate minions of the Left will be curbed on this because Webb is a Democrat, but they will still do a mini George Allen. Webb should add an immigration moratorium and a complete roll back of the entire DOJ civil rights complex which is itself ethnic cleansing of whites.

Time for the Affirmative Action Party to end. I give Webb some credit for this, but he needs to do more on this and on an immigration moratorium including ending H-1b.

What a disappointment. Webb may not be a racist, but here he shows himself to be something worse - a despicable opportunist who plays to white resentment to boost his own power. It's saddening that in this day and age, too many whites believe consciously or unconsciously that skin color connotes status, or that it should do so. Just last month I heard someone describe an old car as "not fit for a white man to ride in." The implied message Webb is sending to such people is that it's the black man's fault that they're poor.

Any program designed to give someone of color or sex is a discriminatory law and should be stricken from the books. He makes perfect sense and VA should consider this as an option to move forward. As long as people as protected they will not advance. Anyone that calls this racism is an id10t and not worth the time to debate. Ignorance is bliss and some people are just too blissful…..

The primary impediment to minorities getting hired today is that businesses change rapidly. They hire and fire to survive. The days of 40-year careers with the same emplouyer are over. In many companies, being there five years makes you an old timer. Personnel flexibility is a key competitive advantage.

Many people in business management are familiar with examples of minorities who were fired or not promoted for reasons having nothing to do with discrimination and sued or threatened to sue under civil rights laws. Employment lawyers routinely advise business people that they have to document non-discriminatory reasons. Usually a documenting a pattern of employee issues is better than one incident. The lawyers don't put it this way, but employers understand that in essence that means the employer has to prove its not guilty, rather than the employee having to prove guilt.

No one forgets being the target of such a law suit or threatened law suit. It's just easier to hire someone you know you can fire whenever you want without documentation.

To the extent disrimination still exists, the primary reason is that business people crave flexibility. Their employment lawyers tell them that the 1960s civil rights laws impede their flexibility in hiring and promotion. Business people hate having to call a lawyer every time they want to make a personnel decision. It's expensive and time consuming.

The smaller a company is, the more important such flexibility becomes. WE all know that small to mid-sized companies create the nmost jobs. Big companies are expanding outside the US. That may be good for a black guy in Africa, but it dosn't do anything for your neighbor down the street.

Human nature searches for the easiest pathway. The biggest advantage a 25 year old white guy has in getting a job these days is that, if he doesn't work out as planned, you can rid of him in an instant. That's a big competitive advantage. It's an advantage that well meaning laws have taken away from black people.

We may not like that, but life is about reality, not how we would like things to be.

In Politics, the only rule is survival.
Sen. Webb appears to be staking out his territory in Virginia. It is sad to think that this will only lead him to lose those voters that considered him a genuine Democrat, and not a closet Republican. I personally am offended by his views.

Affirmative Action policies have not marginalized whites. They have equalized whites with non-white Americans and that is too much for many whites to stand for since they know how badly they have treated and still treat non-white Americans.

Affirmative action is just buying votes, and hallowed tradition. Constanting ascribing one's deficiencies to racism and constantly calling whites racist because they aren't black is just a way of scaring blacks to maintain their solidarity. Anyone who is a member of the great white monolith can tell you it is a great big free-for-all where it is mostly every man or women for him/herself and everyone who is very successful usually has to work very hard and make hard and difficult decisions and choices all the time. It is much easier to find a political short cut, and it is a tradition too.

The primary impediment to minorities getting hired today is that businesses change rapidly. They hire and fire to survive. The days of 40-year careers with the same emplouyer are over. In many companies, being there five years makes you an old timer. Personnel flexibility is a key competitive advantage.

Many people in business management are familiar with examples of minorities who were fired or not promoted for reasons having nothing to do with discrimination and sued or threatened to sue under civil rights laws. Employment lawyers routinely advise business people that they have to document non-discriminatory reasons. Usually a documenting a pattern of employee issues is better than one incident. The lawyers don't put it this way, but employers understand that in essence that means the employer has to prove its not guilty, rather than the employee having to prove guilt.

No one forgets being the target of such a law suit or threatened law suit. It's just easier to hire someone you know you can fire whenever you want without documentation.

To the extent disrimination still exists, the primary reason is that business people crave flexibility. Their employment lawyers tell them that the 1960s civil rights laws impede their flexibility in hiring and promotion. Business people hate having to call a lawyer every time they want to make a personnel decision. It's expensive and time consuming.

The smaller a company is, the more important such flexibility becomes. WE all know that small to mid-sized companies create the nmost jobs. Big companies are expanding outside the US. That may be good for a black guy in Africa, but it dosn't do anything for your neighbor down the street.

Human nature searches for the easiest pathway. The biggest advantage a 25 year old white guy has in getting a job these days is that, if he doesn't work out as planned, you can rid of him in an instant. That's a big competitive advantage. It's an advantage that well meaning laws have taken away from black people.

We may not like that, but life is about reality, not how we would like things to be.

I worked for a company a few years ago that subcontracted for the government. My job was to purchase printing and mailing services from printers in the Washington D.C. area. I was instructed that my company, as a contractor, had to follow government guidelines to only give the printing and mailing contract to a printing business that was woman or minority owned, even if they were more expensive.

A lot of contractors will put their business partially in their wife's name, or will taken on a "silent" minority partner, in order to qualify for these contracts, and get away with charging more for the same services.

As if there were a shortage of white guys on Wall Street and in our financial sector stealing from the American taxpayer's money.

This "reduce diversity" argument is clearly a tactical distractor in the national forum.

Two trillion to Iraq.

Endless trillions into Afghanistan.

750 billion illegal gifts of public funds to Hank's friends in banking.

More people thinking the same way is not going to solve our problems.

Giving people credit for the economic obstacles they've overcome, as well as the racial ones is fine, but don't go off on a tangent when we have major structural defects to repair in order to avoid collapse.

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AP/SAN DIEGO — A Mexican law enforcement official who worked with U.S. authorities was charged with passing along classified information to drug traffickers and arranging the arrests of his drug boss' rivals, according to an indictment unsealed Friday.

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And the key difference between Mexican corruption and US corruption is that Mexico has not yet institutionalized its corruption to the degree the US has.

Our banks, bailed out with taxpayer money, like BofA, Wachovia, Wells Fargo openly launder the money of the cartels.

Our banks, bailed out with 750 Billion in taxpayer funds, direct their credit card divisions to charge the poor working still that buys discounted groceries at Wall Mart, to collect 27% interest on any balance that taxpayer may have on consumer credit.

This while those same banks are receiving 0% money funded by the taxpayer from the Fed.

This while those same banks are paying retired people who have worked and saved all their lives, 2% on their CD's.

This while paying themselves millions in bonuses.

Take a good look at institutionalized corruption.

It's destroying the US economy and political system.

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WPO "The government's "pay czar" announced Friday that 17 companies benefiting from federal bailout money handed out $1.6 billion in excess executive compensation at the height of the financial crisis."

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Ya' know, the actual money they stole is really incidental to the larger problem these over-payments document.

Granted, this is TARP money, so these excessive salary disbursements represent illegal gifts of public funds.

But that's not where the gravitas of these errors rests.

For those of us who live on the west coast, the bad judgment of these bozos in banking goes far beyond their salaries.

The brilliant leaders of bailed out banks such as BofA, Wells Fargo, Wachovia, laundered the Mexican drug cartels money, facilitating an unprecedented reign of violence in Mexico which threatens to expand north.

Over 25,000 killings in Mexico in the past few years. 183 decapitations.

And fueling the fire are the overpaid bankers and traders who don't bother to do banking or trading but have turned to stealing from their customers in overcharges and associating with criminal elements to keep the flow of excessive salaries flowing their way.

People, read what he said. He says some diversity programs should remain, especially with respect to blacks. He wants to end diversity programs that give preference to immigrants, including recently arrived Asians and Africans:

"Beyond our continuing obligation to assist those African-Americans still in need, government-directed diversity programs should end."

So all you who are just jumping for joy at the chance to slam blacks, it looks like that part will remain, if Mr. Webb has his way. (Which I doubt he will.)

Jim Webb may not be a blatant racist, but his logic and reasoning do suggest he has biased views, perhaps based upon his own background. We all come from somewhere.

Hey, I'm white, and male and come from an economically challenging background. I went to college and had to drop out as Reagan gutted student financial aid. I've worked blue collar work much of my life, proud of the work I've done.

There were folk of ethnic background that got more government support than I did, but that isn't reverse racism. To call it that is simply not true. The fact is, the people who qualify for such 'affirmative action' benefits are people who are unfairly penalized by the enduring racial inequality in our nation. It's still here folks. Stop denying it. If you don't see it, it's because your eyes are closed to it and what you really want is to deny justice for some money you think will come back to you.

Now, if you really cared about reverse racism, you'd be taking about providing the basic social safetynet of services that would give every citizen an even chance.

That would include excellent schools for every American child, and safe neighbourhoods surrounding them. You have affluent schools in the burbs who have money to squander and you've inner city schools that can't afford text books. Cut the shi+.
That would include; universal health care, adequate higher educational benefits, adequate career training, yup, all paid for by the state, because the free market policies have created an underemployed underclass that is not paid enough to provide the basics for themselves.

The underclass isn't just people of color, though they are a disproportionately impoverished. America has been living this same disgusting lie since I was in college, over thirty years ago. Reagan ran on the lie, Bush 41 and Bush 43 ran on the lie. The lie is that America is a meritocracy, where all you have to do is work hard and you will succeed. That isn't true. The truth is, if you come from an above median background, your opportunities are many and if you come from a sub median background, your opportunities are few. Educational opportunities, employment opportunities, the opportunity to walk down your block without getting shot.

Jim Webb is right about one thing, the playing fields needs to be levelled for all Americans. Then, we will have a meritocracy where truly the best, most qualified person attains the success they deserve. Think of it this way, say ya got a football game and one team has the best equipment and coaches and cheerleaders. The other team, the got nothing, no pads, no helmets, no coachs - they got cheerleaders though, that they have. Would you call that a fair game? If the well heeled team paid for the poor teams equipment, so they could play a fair game, would you call that socialism? What if the poor team were to reimburse the well off? Still socialism? What if, the poor team played as well as the well off team so contributed to growing the pie for all?

Good for Senator Webb. Of course, many of the lemmings won't get it, but honestly they have themselves to blame. The same folks who voted for him because of his anti-Bushism in 2006 are now calling him racist because they simply are unable or unwilling to see the forest for the trees. From a practical standpoint, this practiaclly guarantees his re-election in 2012 as well. Virginia is not as blue as some would have us think.

I would tend to agree with Webb, but I think some assistance programs should be continued for disadvantaged Native Americans as well as blacks.

A tempting alternative would simply be to base the programs on income - and ignore race. At first glance this would seem to be a sincere effort to break the cycle of poverty and it would appear to offer the same opportunity for all races. In actual fact however, I think the program would soon be overrun by those who voluntarily came to the country illegally - the least deserving IMO.

I am white and I am a decendant of slaves. My ancestors came from what we now call Europe. For well over 3000 years the ancients conquored people, regardless of race, and eslaved them. As a person of full European background, there's no way that at some point from at least 500BC to 1500AD, that one of my direct line ancestors had not been enslaved. Either by Greeks, Romans, Parthians, Huns, Gauls, Celts, or any other ethic group pillaging Europe for well over two thousand years.

Nondiscrimination laws should be applied equally among all citizens, including those who happen to be white."
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100% CORRECT!!!! The fact that the Frank Ricci case, a firefighter who was denied a promation because he was white, was won by only a 5-4 margin in the Supreme Court is a disgrace. Webb is right but will Obama and the Dems listen to him? I doubt it.

As a white man myself, I've observed that "reverse discrimination" allegations usually amount to some whites and some men not being accorded the status they think they deserve. The reality is that discrimination against women and non-whites is still far more massive. Even the poorest white man still has advantages over others based on his skin color and gender. Many studies show discrimination in recruitment based even on the names, where the ones that are perceived as sounding "white" being favored over ones that sound African-American or "foreign."

Federal diversity programs now primarily benefit new immigrants over whites and even black Americans, their original beneficiaries, wrote Webb, D-Va.

"In an odd historical twist that all Americans see but few can understand, many programs allow recently arrived immigrants to move ahead of similarly situated whites whose families have been in the country for generations," he wrote.

"The injustices endured by black Americans at the hands of their own government have no parallel in our history, not only during the period of slavery but also in the Jim Crow era that followed," he wrote.

Immigrants from Asia, Latin America and Africa in recent decades knew no such discrimination from the government, he wrote, "and in fact have frequently been the beneficiaries of special government programs. The same cannot be said of many hardworking white Americans, including those whose roots in America go back more than 200 years."

He has a point, but one wonders why he writes this, and why now? Politicians don't do things like this for no reason. And it's usually a political reason. (No, duh, huh?)

Webb is getting desperate. He supported the very unpopular $1,500,000,000,000.00 government deficit, the health care boondoggle, the union stimulus at the expense of future generations, and the expansion of government. He has obeyed Harry Reid's wishes and he has hardly been the maverick he said he would be. I'd say he's a good representation of why Washington fails.

The most discriminated people in america are white males,there are job openings in some companies where white males can put in their application but the job is going to a so called minority person no matter how smart and educated the white guy is,it's wrong but it goes on and nothing is done about and it's only going to get worse but let the shoe be on the other foot and the minority would be crying and screaming about being discrimated against and the politicians and media would have a field day.

"Whazzis, Blacks are overrepresented....How? Where? Check the latest unemployment figures, the only thing that blacks overrepresent is in unemployment numbers. So you're wrong.
Hispanics and white women are underrepresented? Do you have a reference or statistics to prove your points?
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You say you can't tell what he's talking about, neither can he.
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Both Webb and you need to remember also, a significant amount of whites are anti-government, so they are going to resist gov't help, gov't remedies, etc. Perhaps, this is why, if true, whites appear to be underrepresented.
Comedian Bill Maher always points out how he is perplexed by poor whites who vote against their own interests as Republicans. So am I, the gov't wishes to help these folks, but they are anti-gov't-what can you do?
So before whites go 'woe is us', remember many of you hate the government.
Posted by: ArmchairM | July 23, 2010 1:15 PM | Report abuse "

right now obama is hiting only blacks in the goverment and one day you may need help and be turned down because you are latino or white...
and yes black unemployment is high, why, because obama's plan doesn't call for helping the street black...
in fact politically it helps him if they remain angry...
blame it on the white and latino man

This is the same old race baiting divisive tactic blame it on the minoirty. Blacks have the highest unemployment rates, their the last hired and the first fired. Admission to graduated and professional schools have dropped precipitously. Blacks don't benefit from white privilege. If a poor black and poor white shows up for a job the white is likely to get it. Give me a break Webb. We are in difficult times brought about by the rich most of whom are white while the middle class is fading fast. Don't start race baiting. We've had enough of that with the Tea Party. I expected better from you.

The Democratic Party lives in a fantasy world. For once, a Democrat seems to understand this. The Affirmative Action policies that the Democrats have foisted on us all are tearing the nation apart at the seems. And besides, it is clearly unconstitutional to enact preference policies based on race.

After 50 years of paying reparations to the black community, it's time to end all race based discrimination in America.

Sen Webb should be congratulated for telling the truth. I commend his courage. In this country which is considered the greatest country, everybody should be treated equally irrespective of color or race or ethnic background. In my experience of over 50 years in four countries I have seen that all these quotas and reservations etc are snatched by very affluent class and never a deserved class. So by removing this affirmation class at least there will be more opportunities for all American Citizens. If the Employers were forced to follow the rule 1.US Citizens, first 2. Green Card Holders(legal immigrants) second and 3. th rest, there will be plenty of jobs to everyone. The big companies bypass the rules using L Visas and H Visas to reduce the cost and thus create more unemployment for US Citizens and Legal Immigrants.This is illegal. The Federal Govt should strictly enforce the Law on these big companies. Sen Webb is a practical senator and not a vote getter. He is courageous.

Thank you Sen. Webb. Finally, someone with the courage to take this conversation beyond skin color. There is no way possible to make folks whole if we don't stop using public policy to create second-class citizens. Make everyone whole so this nation can come together and move forward. Thank you Sen. Webb, that took a lot of political courage.

"Enough of "playing" to the blacks! Jim is right on with his comments.. We have given the blacks enough in this country.. Why are so many blacks unemployed? simply because most of them have no skills, very little purpose, little or no education (many have no real desire to be educated)-what do they expect- give them a job because they are black? let them earn it instead of being handed one. Let them fight for a job like a white person."
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Whoever wrote this is a racist, plain and simple. Let's examine why. In the article, Webb states that "poor whites" are often affected by Affirmative Action. By poor whites, I am assuming that he is referring to what most people call trailer trash. Poor, rural, uneducated white people. I have one question: What jobs are these people being denied? trash pick up? janitorial positions? leaf blower? Gas station attendants? Seriously, there aren't even that many black people in the same area with "poor whites". I honestly doubt that a poor white person would be competing for the same job as a middle class black person (someone who might actually benefit from a little AA, especially in the white, corporate environment). I honestly don't see that many poor whites at my job doing any job of significance...the high paying jobs (the ones that AA may help a qualified black person who otherwise would get looked over because of their skin color) are usually filled by well-to-do or middle class white people.

Honestly, the cry of "reverse racism" is a joke. White people weren't enslaved in this country and should enjoy the life-long benefits that come with that. There aren't obstacles placed in front of a white man in this country because of his skin color. For a black man, there are plenty. Then you have racists like the author of the above statement that seem to believe that AA allows uneducated, unqualified black people into positions of significance. The whole reason behind the program is to allow qualified applicants a fair chance.

To assume that "blacks" benefit from AA is to assume that all black people are from the same social backgrounds. More BS....there are wealthy black people and there are poor black people. The only thing we share is that we are all the descendants of American slaves. Just as there are poor whites, there are poor blacks and I doubt the poor black people are fairing any better than the poor white ones.

In my opinion AA can go away, I don't think it's needed. It just gives racist white people something to cry about....they can't stand anything that helps black people get a "leg up". Of course they wouldn't, they still don't see any problem with American Slavery, Segregation or Jim Crow. But, then again, inferior people always need someone to oppress and look down upon....otherwise they wouldn't be able to feel good about their false superiority.

work in a federal position in an office full of well qualified - seasoned blacks (6 to 10+ years on the job)...a position became open. The white guy called his friend (a white woman) from another state - on the other side of the U.S. to fill the job.
nobody said anything because they fear retribution. We do need our jobs.
Racism doesn't exist?
Tell it to somebody who hasn't experienced it.

"Hardworking white Americans"? Webb sounds as if he's been brainwashed by some of my elderly relatives, who really believe that all blacks and Hispanics want to live off the dole while driving Cadillacs.

And who has all the money...White people. I'm just trying to get some crumbs off of the table to feed my family. Yours truly...The Modern Day Slave.
Posted by: darrin_burton
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Yeah well Oprah, Tiger, Lebron, JayZ and millions of other Black people are doing just fine... If you are living off crumbs it has nothing to do with race.. it has to do with you not being smart enough or talented enough or working hard enough.. same as everyone else Black or WHITE struggling in America...

I am not sure Senator Webb knows the difference between discrimination and Affirmative Action. Also his position on retaining Don't Ask Don't Tell suggests his desire to live as a Hetrosexual White Wealthy Male and the hell with everyone else!

I am not sure Senator Webb knows the difference between discrimination and Affirmative Action. Also his position on retaining Don't Ask Don't Tell suggests his desire to live as a Heterosexual White Wealthy Male and the hell with everyone else!

Finally- a rational Democrat. Close upon the inauguration of affirmative action programs for blacks, came Mexican-Americans, and then women. It does no favor to "minorities" to judge them differently from other Americans. I am a member of one of those minorities and celebrate the fact that I worked and studied hard, attended a great university graduating with honors on the same level field as everyone at that school. Liberals simply do not understand that favoritism is condescending and implies that the recipient of their charity demeans the recipient and the group he belongs to.

But, then again, inferior people always need someone to oppress and look down upon....otherwise they wouldn't be able to feel good about their false superiority.
Posted by: massmedia77
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Don't look now but what you said is pretty racist itself...

@rsmith5588,
President Lincoln is often credited with a quote from Confucious, which states, "it is better to remain quiet and have people think you are stupid, than to open your mouth and confirm it." Racism and white dominance does exist in this country. Unfortunately, while in the minority, a significant percentage of blacks use racism as an excuse for their shortcomings. Conversely, that same percentage of whites cry, "I didn't have anything to do with that" and refuse to realize that they are the BENEFICIARY of over 500 yrs of slavery, oppression, jim crow, segregation, violence, etc.

What did you have to fight for, what did you build. This country was built on the backs of minorities. If not for the infusion of black soldiers in WWII the US might not have had enough time to build the atom bomb.

I'll take my college-educated and physically superior body down to Baltimore City and tell my cousins to get it together. While you're over in Anne Arundel Co.visiting your cousins, you and your sister (whom you married in W. Va) can tell the rest of the trailer trash you still have a debt to be paid.
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I wish that Jim Webb represented me instead of "that joke" of a senator Ben Cardin. Enough of "playing" to the blacks! Jim is right on with his comments.. We have given the blacks enough in this country.. Why are so many blacks unemployed? simply because most of them have no skills, very little purpose, little or no education (many have no real desire to be educated)-what do they expect- give them a job because they are black? let them earn it instead of being handed one. Let them fight for a job like a white person.Latino's another story....
Great

Nice that he can talk about it. It's no longer a black and white issue but an issue of money. Seriously if men and women of all colors simply understand that the pursuit of happiness is just that.

Now we may not get the exact job he thought he would get because the hiring manager had a friend or former associate they wanted to hire. That happened to this WHITE man and when I thought I was going to get my dream job, I was shut out at the end because the VP selected a former BLACK coworker he trusted more for the position. Reverse that situation and you have people crying racism, see it as is and you start to see reality. Unfortunately people don't like living in the real world.

Pretty laughable stuff from Webb. Whites are not a monolith, but somehow if they are not front and center in everything, then it is because some immigrant or person of color took it away from their "hard working" selves. Of course, because no one else works hard or struggles in life. A**hat...

Looks to me, from most of the comments, that everyone is reacting in the exact manner in which Webb has wished. He and many other Democrats, including the Obama administration, are setting up class warfare. It's straight out of the Statest's handbook (the Communist Manifesto). He never says anything about doing away with Affimative Action for Blacks yet everyone wants to argue for and against black/white racism. Don't be fooled. He instead wants to "help" poor people of every race. Yes, a new (to most Americans who have not studied history) "us against them" strategy.

It's funny, the goal of every American is to pull himself up by the bootstraps, climb the corporate ladder and achieve the American dream. Yet once we get there we're excoriated as being a robber barron, preying on the poor unfortunate little people.

This is how it all started when the Bolsheviks took over in Russia. Be prepared. There will be a lot more of this to come unless we put and end to in November.

It's not diversity or AA programs that are locking out poor whites. Many poor whites cannot get into top universities due to the many special exemptions for upper class WASPS. Exemptions such as: children of alumni, fraterity/soriority associations, high donors, to name a few. These all go to less qualified upper class whites i.e George Bush, at the expense of lower class whites.

Diversity policies exist because institutional racism persists. Primary evidence of this can be seen in the achievement gap between minority high school students and their white peers, EVEN WHEN CORRECTED FOR SOCIOECONOMIC STATUS. Why are our smartest, highest-scoring minority students from well-to-do backgrounds still being outperformed by white students? Why are our poorest minority students fairing worse than our poorest white students on standardized tests? Until race is no longer a predictor of academic success, programs must be kept in place to level the playing field.

And in yet another Wall Street Journal column, a 1995 piece titled, "In Defense of Joe Six Pack," Webb pointed out that there were huge variations in income and educational status among white Americans.

He argued then that "less-advantaged white cultures by and large did the most to lay out the infrastructure of this country, quite often suffering educational and professional regression as they tamed the wilderness, built the towns, roads and schools, and initiated a democratic way of life that later white cultures were able to take advantage of without paying the price of pioneering.

~~~
Webb intentionally forgets to mention that the reasons there are huge variations in income and educational status among white Americans is because that is what Republicans have been striving for all alone and then trying to use affirmative action programs as the reasons why.

No, Senator Webb, the real problem in income and educational statues isn't because of blacks or affirmative action programs.

It is the Corporate Right-Wing Establishment that has been creating these divides and variations between:

1. the rich whites and the poor and middle class blacks & whites.
2. educated whites and uneducated blacks & whites.
3. White people of all statuses have had every opportunity to get an education long before these affirmative action programs came to be. Therefore, the real question is, why didn't they? Why blame blacks and affirmative action programs on something that you already had access to.

It is the Republican Party who has been disfranchising and manipulating whites, poor people and uneducated people, regardless of their skin color for decades.

The Republican party has been destroying the financial wealth, or the lack there of, of poor and middle class people for several decades now & they do not give a damn about the public education system in which both poor and middle class whites and blacks attend.

So, Jim Webb don't pretend you don't know any of this just because you claim to be a Democrat.

Maybe, you would be best served over in the Republican party. Because, as Wilder stated above, you sure do sound like one.

Like the radical left wing nut Mark Warner, Jim Webb is a global liberal who has long advocated mass amnesty for illegal aliens in the USA and, as with all of Obama's radical left wing programs, has and will continually vote the left wing Party line when asked to do so by the Prince of Thieves, Harry Reid. When Webb ran in VA in 2006, Council LaRaza, MALDEF and Mexicans without Borders endorsed and lobbied for him because Webb promised them, and the illegals they represent, their fair share of Affirmative Action entitlements. As we all know, LaRaza leadership has been adamantly vocal about their rights to rape U.S. AA entitlement programs - "Once we are in power, we, LaRaza, will take what we want" is a famous divisive quote by Mayor Villarosa. Webb now sees, that after the last elections in VA, citizens aren't buying his or Obama's liberal agenda much less LaRaza's self centered drive for amnesty and welfare. Thus, for political purposes, Webb now attempts to pander to a potential new welfare group - the "crackers" as the Black Panthers call them. Like all Democrats, Webb is reaching out to promise more spending on welfare. The truth is Affirmative Action is a divisive discriminatory ethnic-based program long overdue for reform or cessation, which will never happen under Obama's and the Democrats Redistribution of Wealth agenda. Those who support it must question their true intent - if the program is race based, isn't their advocacy racist? But, Jim Webb is only playing politics with the issue in an attempt to be perceived by conservative voters as an objective thinker and a "fair and balanced" all inclusive candidate in 2012 when in fact he will only expand entitlements, not cancel them, and along with Reid and Obama and Warner, go on anaother spending spree in doing so instead of creating jobs for his poorer costiuents by curtailing the flow of imported guest workers and illegals. Unfortunately for Jim Webb, his radical left wing actions over the last two years have spoken louder than his words.

This is how it all started when the Bolsheviks took over in Russia. Be prepared. There will be a lot more of this to come unless we put and end to in November.

Posted by: Love-em-or-leave-town
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Seriously, you should thank God that you live in a country where you can be this stupid and paranoid and have access to a computer. If you actually ever lived in a country where your rights were lost, you wouldn't last a minute. I am sick to death of you morons with your "bolshevik" B.S. and your "commie" crap. You f**kers do not have the slightest idea what is going on - you are ripe pickings for GOP - you idiots vote against your interests time and time again because of your myopic, bigoted view of things.

He argued then that "less-advantaged white cultures by and large did the most to lay out the infrastructure of this country, quite often suffering educational and professional regression as they tamed the wilderness, built the towns, roads and schools, and initiated a democratic way of life that later white cultures were able to take advantage of without paying the price of pioneering.
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yeah but at least they werent forced to do it and benefitted from it!!!! My ancestors were forced to work for free and made many white people in this country rich. The entire economy of the south was built on slavery. Gimme a f!@#% break! Honestly, I'm ambivalent on affirmative action, and I'm not entirely in defense of it. It just seems as if Webb is ignoring some crucial facts in making his argument.

What Sen. Webb does not address is the argument that white privilege lifts all white boats. While it is true that there is a loose class system within white America, past and present discrimination based on skin color hasn't been a headwind on the success of any of those classes. However, at this point in the nation's history, it seems to me that preferences based primarily on socioeconomic background would accomplish the goals of affirmative action and help to quell white resentment, which is certainly at a peak in the wake of President Obama's election. I also believe this is something that could be accomplished with a coalition of Republicans and moderate Democrats -- that is, if Republicans weren't bent on a strategy of complete noncooperation.

I look forward to my death because I am so sick of the importance of skin color and hair texture. Why didn't God make us all one color? Hispanic is not a race of people. There are many white Hispanics and there are a lot of black Hispanics, then you have the mulatto and Mestizo Hispanics. I look forward to my death.

Affirmative Action programs based on College and Jobs are too late. Affirmative action should focus on pre-k and kindergarten, on elementary and high school, to assure that every child has an equal experience, an equal education and an equal chance. After that, let progress be based on merit.

Senator Webb is sadly mistaken. He makes these claims because he has not experienced the systematic racist that has existed in our country. I am not a person that blames everything on racism however to make the claim that affirmative action hurts poor whites is simply false. To say that affirmation action causes racial problems is amusing to me. There were racial problems in the country before affirmative action existed. Also, has he forgotten that this country was built in from the beginning with slave labor and that these slaves and their family were denied educational and economic opportunity has extended to today. Is he really that naive?

Posted by: bscoleman | July 23, 2010 5:26 PM | Report abuse
Senator Webb is sadly mistaken. He makes these claims because he has not experienced the systematic racist that has existed in our country. I am not a person that blames everything on racism however to make the claim that affirmative action hurts poor whites is simply false.

Is this YOUR OPINION or fact. If it’s fact post some links proving your point. The fact is, he’s correct and you are wrong….

I cannot take any thing this guy says seriously. Any one who left the Reagan Administration because it was not hawkish enough but then became the darling of the anti-war movement should not be trusted. He is probably worried that the political pendulum is swinging back to the conservative side so throws a bone to white voters by saying he wants to eliminate racial preferences.

Webb seems to a political charlatan of the worst order. Sort of like the Charlie Crist of Virginia. Whatever it takes to stay popular and get reelected in 2012.

I reject his premise "that white dominance is a myth". He is a sitting US Senator openly advocating for white people. If he were Black and advocating for blacks,he would be drummed out of office. Even the first black President can't talk about race unless he's pandering to whites and here this guy, a Senator, is a racial advocate for whites.

He can be a white peoples advocate, but he clearly can't effectively serve as a US Senator for all Virginians.

I reject his premise "that white dominance is a myth". He is a sitting US Senator openly advocating for white people. If he were Black and advocating for blacks,he would be drummed out of office. Even the first black President can't talk about race unless he's pandering to whites and here this guy, a Senator, is a racial advocate for whites.
He can be a white peoples advocate, but he clearly can't effectively serve as a US Senator for all Virginians.
Posted by: wlbillops | July 23, 2010 5:38 PM | Report abuse
You are aware that Obama in fact is NOT the first black president. The first man elected as the leader of the US was a black man. John Hanson. George Washington was in fact the 8th leader (president) of the US. I guess you also have never heard of the NAACP, The United Negro College Fund or many other groups based solely on RACE. He’s not advocating anything other than the fact that THESE PROGRAMS do not work. And appear to disadvantage others…

I think it is important to put what Webb said into some context, view the timing and climate of today. I agree that affirmative action programs need to be altered and phased out. The reason I say this is because as an African American, I think diversity programs and affirmative action programs stigmatize minorities. I makes some people believe that minorities can only get positions in the workplace, admission to college without affirmative action and not based on merit. I would rather be fired because I didn't perform well than to get hired just because I am black. I believe when that is done, it lowers expectations for me and it is racist to suggest that I don't have any merits, so just hire me to avoid reprisals from laws. I'm not as concerned much about reverse racism because minorities are still small in number in regards to whites. It should lead people to wonder what are Webb's intentions for suggest such a policy. Is it to maintain the support of white working class voters and independents in Virginia? Because in this politically toxic time, President Obama and other Democrats have seen their support among white voters decline. Obama won 39% of the white vote in Virginia and that support is probably in the 25-30 percent range. Maybe Webb is worried about his 2012 re-election bid or he maybe he is thinking about issuing a presidential primary challenge to Obama if Obama's popularity is very low still in 2011-2012.
He may risk losing black and hispanic voters and women who may see affirmative action programs as necessary because discrimination in hiring still exist. I think this policy may play in the hand of some conservatives and whites who believe that there is a sense of reverse racism now or that whites have lost their dominate standing in the United States.

Who of us can forget the Affirmative Actions laws that gave jobs to minorities over whites for decades? For me - it was most of my adult life. To what end? Over thirty years later, we continue to hand out "reparations" to minorities. This will never end.

What protection is afford the white part of me? There is none.

So, I watched "The Human Family Tree" and with great glee will claim that I am black, white, brown, and any other box on the form.

To NOT claim this - is to help this government continue with its enabling, codependent acts of discrimination against one race - EuroAmericans.

Posted by: wlbillops | July 23, 2010 5:38 PM | Report abuse
He’s not advocating anything other than the fact that THESE PROGRAMS do not work. And appear to disadvantage others…
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Where are the empiracle studies that the programs don't work and just who don't they work for? What he's forgetting and apparently you don't know, just because you can't see white privilege in this country, it exists. It exists every time a white person gets the benefit of the doubt over a black person. It exists every time a white person can turn an issue back around on the offended party, lie about it and be believed. It exists every time an under qualified white male gets a position over a more than qualified black male or female. It happens every time white people are paid disproportionately more than their black counter parts. Please don't talk to me about being disadvantaged when I have to walk around every day in my black skin in this country.

Webb's point is interesting with regard to the question of whether immigrants should benefit from affirmative action. Unfortunately, he also whitewashes history. He discusses the economic devastation of the South and the low educational attainment, but he never explains why. The Jim Crow south would rather close schools than educate black children. They would rather have no services than services that blacks could use as well. This kind of attitude continues on in the South today. You see that in the health care debate and the tea party.

OMG, but you know I knew he had it in him...I had been wondered how he had changed his colors so much over time..."the most to build the infrastructure????"...how about a couple of hundred years of slave labor...yeah, affirmative action is really putting a dent in the job prospects of "his" people - all those african-americans taking jobs in spite of the fact that unemployment in the african-american community is at historic highs...wondering what he has in store for women

To all those who have ravaged Sen. Webb above: READ THE ORIGINAL ARTICLE. He adds context, commentary, examples, and justification for his beliefs.

Sometimes those so hell-bent on believing one ideology will refuse to open their eyes to other people and other ideas. Bill Maher is the perfect example - someone who preaches stupidity and belittlement because of a lack of understanding.

After reading the actual column Webb wrote, maybe then your comments won't sound like you're writing from the office of Malik Zulu Shabbazz (whom I've met at a speech he did at my college...creepy character).

I am black, foreign born and can understand elements of his arguments. But race relations (and racism) in America is an uneven road. The big problem of institutional racism (mostly against blacks) continues even from black on black - A black man is more likely to expected to be a criminal. However, government programs that seek to reward people based on their race could also engender irritation. Shirley Sherrod's arguement that its about class is right - a universal truth.

It is important to note however, that America is by no means unique nor is the black-white divide the most profound in the world. People are bound to be people, and that includes racism (ethnicism/castism etc) and other prejudices.

The challenge in America stems from the very recent history of not just slavery, but segregation and in recent times, the selfish decision by a portion of the political class to fan the embers of racism for political gains.

If the right wingers (not people on the street, but talk show hosts and politicians) could just make some efforts to put the country first and tamp down the racial undertone in their comments and political actions, the nation and its people (of all color will benefit).

Indeed race is a delicate issue in America - as it is all over the world (if you care to substitute race for whatever people use to divide themselves elsewhere - ethnicity, religion, etc). And it is indeed healthy to have a national conversation about it (America talks) - But those who claim leadership must also understand the responsibilities - People like Glenn Beck, Rush Limbaugh, Sarah Palin, Michelle Bachmann and even Jim Webb (not accusing him of anything) should be consider how their words ring in the ears of those who hear them.

This column has certainly hit a nerve with a wide cross-section of individuals - myself included. My son, applying to graduate schools for a future PhD in chemistry, pharmacologic research, tried without success to obtain an undergraduate research position at several outstanding universities in the US this summer - spoiler alert -they all indeed announced on their respective websites a preference for women and/or minority candidates. He watched the rolling list of acceptances pass him by, finding 8 of 10 spots at his choice school filled by women - and one by a black student at his school whom he had tutored, tried to and was unable to pass on lab proficiency working with complicated testing equipment as well as having a GPA of less than 3.0. My son is head lab tech, even working with professors' equipment proficiency and has a double major math/chemistry GPA approaching 4.0 with stellar recommendations. His problem? Checking White Male on the admissions application - then I'm sure he was tossed to the bottom of the pile. Don't worry for now, though - he is having a paper he co-authored accepted by a chemical journal - very timely as well, as it concerns chemical dispersant theory. He had no boxes to check. At least not until spring for the masters/PhD program. I'll get back to you on that. He's very young to feel that his merits count much less than affirmative action programs.

I am an African American, and I did not grow up in a household that benefited from any social welfare programs. I attended private schools. When I went to college it was based on my own merits, as far as I know, I don't recall there being a place on the application that asked, "what is your race"? To that I would have answered "human".

Were we rich, no. Just an average middle class family.

The history of slavery and the jim crow south, that DOES include Virginia, is why you have the civil rights act and mandated diversity programs. In Obama's journey to the White House, I saw first hand, that this nation has progressed some, but left alone, would digress right back into that good ole' boy ideology that white is right and if you black step back mentality.

Were it not for the civil rights movement there would BE no Barrack Obama, there would BE no Clarence Thomas, for that matter.

We need to limit the application of preference in areas where such application, in this day, is unnecessary. However, today is not the day to render them all irrelevant.

Believe me, even among liberals is a vile nasty racist element that looks down upon anything other than white as being inferior. I have seen that first hand as well.

If poor whites should be considered a class that diversity mandates should include, then make the case and see it done. However, until America grows up, removing those measures that even the playing field would be regressive.

In short, folks just don't know how to act.

Many in White America must understand that it is their general behavior that makes minorities apprehensive to let go of programs set up to level the playing field. They refuse to acknowledge, much less, repudiate the racist antics of some of the members of the tea party, instead, they embrace them and denigrate those that call them out. In the face of that do you really think that an African American would feel comfortable relaxing laws that protect them from the marginalization that they would face should those type of citizens be allowed to have it their way?

"...he (Webb) does complain that immigrants who have come to America in recent decades "have frequently been the beneficiaries of special government programs. The same cannot be said of many hard-working white Americans, including those whose roots in America go back more than 200 years."
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The words of a true demagogue. Notice that he doesn't give one single example of all this largesse allegedly dispensed profligately and irresponsibly to millions of illegal aliens. All while long suffering, tolerant and generous white people work three jobs to make ends meet and then, to add insult to injury, get not one whit of government assistance when they're hurting and in need.

What this guy is, is a demagogue who either purposefully or in ignorance sews seeds of racial dissension by pitting one race against another. By lies. With no facts, whatsoever. The demagogue does this by telling the lower strata of one race, the white race, that they're suffering because of all the government help given to another race, but not to them.

It's a message worthy of Hitler. It's despicable in its ignorance and in its clear intention to fan the flames of racial hatred.

The corporations, the wealthy, the right wing are winning the war against the middle class. They divide and conquer and Webb is their servant. And truth doesn't matter, at least to him.

Racism is just a trump card. It doesn't exist, though people love to play it. Since there is no racism, anyone claiming to see racism anywhere is just full of baloney, and I will call them on it -- "You are playing the RACE CARD!" There is no such thing. You are full of baloney. That's meant to be ironic, but maybe few will get it.

1. African Americans still need certain protections given the still-rampant racism and discrimination running through our culture. One need look no further than Andrew Breitbart and the "tea partiers" to see how common it still is.

2. Jim Webb however is also right that poor whites have been overlooked, and they need lots of help too, for a very different reason. Nobody's looking at their skin and saying, "uhhh, well, you seem to know how to do the work but you won't fit in in this company because, um, you're not our kind...". It's more about the unending cycle of poverty and low education for these people. Too many of them end up getting sucked into watching FoxNews, for instance, which only further dumbs them down and has them voting for people who hold them in nothing but contempt.

The Democratic party is the only major political party who can help both groups. There's no reason for these two groups to be at odds with each other. Maybe they think they are fighting over scarce resources. But they really should be fighting against the GOP-Corporate complex that exploits them both.

I sure hope poor whites begin to think their way out of the self-defeating FauxNews-GOP trap, and learn to stand up for themselves.

I wish Sen.Webb would explain that to the minorities that are denied jobs in shops on my job. They routinely find ways to keep their work areas lily white. I love it, when privileged white men tell me that racism is dead. How the heck would they know?

I think Senator Webb is on the right track. The worst person you can be in this country is a single white male. Diversity has robbed more than a generation of white males of their right to work or to advance.

This has needed saying for a long, long time. Affirmative Action is, and has always been about racial preferences. This is downright silly when it comes to offering job preferences to immigrants. It also is silly to apply preferences to the children of sucessful, upper middle class African Americans. The only way to apply this dubious idea in a way consistent with American Values it to apply preferences to financially disadvantaged people.

Jim Webb finally dares to say what has been obvious for decades. Reverse discrimination is real. I have been told during job searches and when I missed promotions that others were chosen for "diversity" reasons. Translation: white males need not apply. I am the first in my family to get a college degree, although I have ancestors who fought in the Revolution and Civil War. After my first degree -- financed by working my way through college and with family help only -- I managed to get a second degree at Oxford University. But this was the 1970s and scholarship aid went mainly to women and minorities. I financed my Oxford education with student loans and summer jobs. I have bristled to see candidates from newly-arrived immigrant families get the admissions and financial aid, on the presumption they're somehow disadvantaged because of skin color. If Jim Webb were running for president, I'd vote for him in an instant. We need more leaders willing to speak the truth, with military experience like Webb.

Affirmative Action does hurt black folks because it gives white folks a reason to blame black folks for their own short comings.
I am a black man and I can not think of one job that I recieved because of Affirmative Action. I can tell you though that in most of my jobs I was usually one of possibly 2 or 3 black men in the office. So if you think that affirmative action is taking 'your' jobs away, from my perspective it would only be 2-3 out of 50 to 60 positions.
I do believe that Affirmative Action should be based on economic situations instead of race.
The 'quota' folks get so upset at is just a buzz word to inflame and convince white folks that a 'minority' is getting 'their' job(s). But ask yourself, what makes the job yours?
I have seen plenty of young inexperienced white folks get a job because they went to the same prep school or they're family friends with someone. How about ending that affirmative action?
The folks who scream about class warfare don't get it. Class warfare isn't about to be started, it has been going on the whole time. When this country started only male landowners could vote. Slavery. Immigrants coming from europe were treated like crap when they got here. Jews were discriminated against. The Asians were treated like criminals at one point. Latinos are the new 'scurge' today.
But remember who throughout all these times were the constant preceived evil. All the other folks were able to assimilate. Ask yourself why of all the groups above are blacks the only group not able to be accepted? We have been here the longest, yet we are still marginalized and our greviences dismissed?

Ah! The 'Macaca' moment part deux. What a tangled Webb we weave when set out to reelect.

What exactly are these 'government programs' that favor people of color? Please enumerate.

Forty years ago, it was White Men and when 'affirmative action' came into vogue, it got a few black women ('2 pointers') and a few black men ('1 pointers') a leg up. But the real mantle passed to White Women (also 1 pointers).

The Supreme court is 7 whites and 2 'colored' (well Clarence is actually not black all through).

The Senate has two Asian-Americans (both from Hawaii), one African American and 1 Hispanic who is also white.

There are only 4 African American CEOs for the Fortune 500 companies. Wall Street has Vikram Pandit.

Only a white guy can be a racial advocate for whites and a sitting US Senator. If Jim Webb were black man advocating for blacks, many whites would want him impeached and removed from office. Can minorities in Virginia trust this man to represent them fairly? I wouldn't.

There is a post above by vm56 that may be entirely true, and all the instances quoted may be true, and the incompetent Black applicant chosen over the white applicant with clearly superior qualifications could have happened.

But I doubt it.

I am white. I am very well educated. I have had this argument over the dinner table with my Republican parents and my Republican relatives and my parents' far right wing reactionary, racist, anti-semitic country club friends, since the 1960's.

I also know this: this right wing story, intended to do nothing more than inflame racial hatred, keeps repeating itself over and over, decade after decade.

And notice: all they are, are anecdotes. No law suits, no facts that we can all look at, no objective studies, no statements from higher education, just anecdotes.

This is a tale that has NEVER, NEVER EVER been affirmed. This tale of incompetent Blacks taking places, any places, that whites should have filled by merit equals the tales of the Medieval Europe where pogroms were justified because Jews had horns and ate babies.

There is one way to settle to this: show us the facts. Not the stories, but objective studies with facts that back up these fantastic allegations.

When aggrieved opinion replaces thoughtful debate, and emotion washes away facts, what is left are decisions based on wishful thinking.

When people act this way, they inevitably find themselves heading down the gloomy road of regret.

When governments act in this way, it inevitably leads to pain, suffering, and bloodshed.

The media used to have a role in tempering hot heads. Now it throws fuel to the fire. It seems the only way the media can make a profit these days is by inciting the spirit and inflaming people's passions.

Make NO mistake. this is a road to ruin. Profit the day, lose tomorrow.

This isn't about liberals "eating" liberals, it is about a debate that cast it's net upon the entire diaspora of political persuasions. I, a liberal, for instance, don't, and never have, believed that welfare is working and that it needs to be overhauled. I believe that, as it is, far too many people become dependent upon it to the disservice of themselves and their progeny. The problem it, those what wish to overhaul it, are the same ones that cast a shadow of racist sentiment. It isn't their desire to reorganize it to make it humane yet not addictive, they just wish to close shop and cast those dependent upon it, majority white I might add, to the wayside.

We will never get very far in this country with respect to civil rights, equal rights and diversity, until there exist in this country a general sense of trust that those making these decisions genuinely care about the best interests of those most impacted by it. Until that happens, you will time and time again meet a strong wall of resistance.

You will never get anywhere by saying on one hand that you wish better for a welfare mother than to be dependent on the low subsistence that she is afforded under the current welfare system, but then, on the other hand, your rhetoric suggest that you despise her, see her as a dredge and wish that she didn't exist. That is the apprehensive that you experience in this country when politicians attempt to touch preference programs, affirmative action, the civil rights or voting rights act.

That we have formal laws to protect what appears to be obvious rights speaks its own volume on what Americans are capable of left to their own devices.

If these comments had been made by Sarah Palin, the Post would have it front page headlines and NBC would have it the lead story of the day talking about the Palin/Tea Party racism! Well that would be the lead story unless obama was calling a federal worker to apologize for someone losing his parking space then of course that would be the main story.

Senator Webb has my support l00%. He's an honest, decent representative of the people. He describes the "myth of white privilege" accurately. I returned to college recently to take a few courses, and have been amazed at the anti-white comments. Diversity is worshipped, and no effort is made to fairly treat low socio-economic whites. Any new immigrant has more rights immediately than native-born.

Sadly the facts do not support Senator Webb's contentions that white people (especially male) are being marginalized. As a professional city planner and attorney focused on fair housing issues, I must categorically reject the Senator's use of the Big Lie. Our research -- and that of other neutral parties -- consistently confirm that African Americans and Hispanics continue to face serious levels of discrimination in purchasing and renting housing and in obtaining mortgages.

For example, in every jurisdiction around the nation for which we have conducted an Analysis of Impediments to Fair Housing Choice, the Home Mortgage Disclosure Act data clearly shows that the highest income African Americans and Hispanics are denied a mortgage more often than the poorest whites. I realize that's a dramatic short hand way of showing the levels of discrimination in mortgage lending. The bottom line is that in every income category Blacks and Hispanics have the lowest rates of mortgage approval and the highest rates of denial. We've carefully examined all the reasons for denial by race and by income and can find no explanation for these differences other than racial/ethnic discrimination.

With the nation's schools returning to the levels of segregation that existed prior to Brown v. Board of Education in the mid-1950s, there is little doubt that it is the African American and the Hispanic who is marginalized today.

The sad fact is that while considerable progress has been made to curtail racial and ethnic discrimination in housing, education, and employment since the 1950s, it will take many more generations to bring it to an end. Senator Webb's outright lies do not help.

We cannot expect to wipe out 300 years of slavery, 100 years of Jim Crow, and 50 years of half-hearted largely unenforced civil rights, fair housing, and fair employment laws in just a generation or two. A huge portion of white America continues to fight these laws. The Republican/Tea Party has built itself on its opposition to ending racial discrimination. It will take many more generations for our great nation to overcome the damage of the past 400 years. And as long as officials such as Senator Webb continue to spread the Big Lie that it's white people who are marginalized in America today, it will take far longer than anybody imagined to extend the full benefits of living in America to the descendants of America's greatest shame, slavery.

Affirmative action has for the most part worked. In the case of governments which had legally discriminated it was absolutely necessary in the years following the passage of the Civil Rights Act.

In the case of businesses, it was prudent and intelligent action to remediate any past discrimination - forty years ago.

Now, 'affirmative action' has become a war cry and justification for racists who once thought there was nothing better than affirmative action which favored whites. That is to say States Rights, Segregation, Jim Crown - you know, outright racism which made race more important than competence, intelligence or personality.

Affirmative action as a government policy has become counter productive.

webb is trying to attract back the independent white vote...
doing so may lose him the black vote...
unless of course he thinks the blacks won't mind...
also there is a possibility that he is just talking...
to take no action ever...

My experience growing up in the South, was that Blacks suffered more than whites. Although progress has been made there is still work left to do. I am also concerned that when you are not actively correcting a problem there is the possibility that tide would reverse. However, fixing affirmative action has many problems.

1) People who are high achieving minorities are not given credit for their work.

2) Picking a winner helps a tiny number of people and ignores the vast majority. The statistical change in Black economic comparison has been made worse by immigration and especially immigration from developed urban areas that promote higher education.

4) Recent immigrants have suffered from discrimination, but this is no way similar to the experience of Blacks in the South during the Civil Rights movement.

5) This recession affects everyone. There are less safety nets and we need to get people back to work.

Maybe we should end affirmative action and work harder on economic action in general. It addresses more people and works at building a future instead of repairing history. Right now that's what the country needs.

'Where should we go from here? Beyond our continuing obligation to assist those African-Americans still in need, government-directed diversity programs should end.'

So Webb does want AA program, just not all of them.

And its 'White Privilege' not your title 'White Dominance'

It is as if WP is purposely recasting Webb's position in the worse possible light. They wouldn't do that, would they?

Webb's point is solid. He wants to continue to have AA programs for poor Black American because of the history of
Slavery which is unique to Black American. I would also include Native American too. But everyone else should not apply.

Now if we want AA program to help all poor Americans to create better lives, I am all that too.

So rather than argue over whether all racial minorities in the US get to share AA programs meant to address the legacy of Slavery. Why not agree on a AA program that will assist all poor Americans.

Sen. Webb's opinion piece is titled, "Diversity and the Myth of White Privilege."

Yet this WP blog is headlined, "Webb criticizes 'myth' of white dominance." The WP has arbitrarily changed "privilege" to "dominance".

The two words are NOT synonyms. What sloppy writing and/or editing in the WP!

Webb, by confining his historical focus almost entirely to economic indicators, makes a reasonable case that the majority of southern whites have not enjoyed economic "privilege" relative to blacks.

But Webb's careful argument is mangled, becoming simply fatuous, when his central concept is misrepresented in this headline.

No one with a basic awareness of American history--i.e., of the constitutionally authorized enslavement of blacks, followed by legal segregation and Jim Crow laws, exemplary lynchings, exclusion by force from voter registration lists, real-estate "redlining" in cities, etc., etc., etc.--could think to argue that white "dominance" was a "myth". Legally and socially, if not economically, ALL white southerners belonged to a "dominant" class. During much of this country's 234-year history, other minority groups (Native American, Asian, Hispanic) were also "dominated" by an almost entirely white power structure .

Webb, in offering his views of how best to deal with the troubled legacy of that dominance, makes some valid points. His main point is that the idea of generalized white economic "privilege" is a myth.

Why did you, Ben Pershing, change Webb's language (thus his meaning, to those who didn't go on to read further) to something else?

This Webb guy should be kicked out of government period. Whites committed genocide by wiping out the native tribes, and then proceeded to traffic in human lives- slavery. When whites are being used as slaves, bought and sold, beaten, raped, lynched,etc. then I will feel sorry for them. At that time I will say we need to do something about the way whites are treated in this country. Until then, if a white person gets passed by for a job GOOD! Now you know about .01% of how it felt when your people did (and still do) much worse things to non whites. You have your own people to blame not anyone else.

Senator Webb is absolutely right on this... I work for the federal government and have loss in competition to former H1B visa participants for managerial/policy positions because someone admired their technical skill or their willingness to be subservient. This make native Americans vulnerable just because they speak out and say what is on their minds. This scary, like trusting a foreign born individual over a native Amerian for a security or intelligence positon...

Senator Webb is absolutely right on this... I work for the federal government and have loss in competition to former H1B visa participants for managerial/policy positions because someone admired their technical skill or their willingness to be subservient. This make native Americans vulnerable just because they speak out and say what is on their minds. This scary, like trusting a foreign born individual over a native Amerian for a security or intelligence position...

What race-based programs? Name them.
The poster Fadler wrote, "Race is a trump card pulled out to rally voters"
So is affirmative action.I don't know a black person that knows a black person benefitting from any affirmative action programs.It's a wedge issue.

===========

This is about the most sensible comment to this article by Senator Webb. Reading through the article, I kept asking myself: When is he going to illustrate with an example of a diversity program that benefits a minority over and above whites. None was cited. An opinion written out of wishful thinking and not based on facts are just what they are: fantasies of a wandering mind.

Those of us who work in the field know that a minority has no iota of advantage over a white man or the women. If anything, he is a wide disadvantage. A white male has about 80-90 percent chance of being hired for an important position than a minority male, about 40 to 50 percent chance over a white woman and 60 to 70 percent chance of being hired over a balck or minority woman.

And to say that this has changed in any form under the Obama administration is just ludicrous. All what you need to do is look at Obama's Security Council and show me a black man or minority on it. Even his choice as Attorney-General, a black man, is being marginalized by the white boys: Rahm Emanuel and the gang in the White House and a host of others who cannot fathom that a blackman, irrespective of his competence, is the nation's AG. As a matter of fact, only a fool will not see that President Obama has done more to cater to the interests of his mama's race (Aryan) to that of his father (black) since he came into office. What more evidence do you need than the shameful firing of Ms. Sherrod this week?

Americans say we should not label people based on the color of their skin. There are "African" Americans, "Asian" Americans, "Hispanic" Americans, yet the press continues to call European Americans just plain old "white". That says it all right there.

Posted by: midas20874
__________________________________________
An example of proof is the hiring practices of the local police and fire departments. The majority white counties in MD and VA have an inordinately high percentage of black and Latino personnel. AA is just another way of disenfranchising the majority.

Let's be honest, as much as leftists would like to pretend that discriminating against whites cleanses their slavery, segregation, Jim Crow past and Robert Byrd and Harry "Negro Dialect" present, it really just cements their legacy as racists.

That does it for me. Webb just lost my support. I donated and voted for him last time, but no more. And I'm white. He's sounding more and more like he's switched back to being a Repuke. I'll help any decent, real Democratic when Webb's up for reelection. Period.

Webb is right when stating that only some groups should receive preferential treatment. If any group should, it would be blacks who were brought here against their will. Hispanics, however, should not since many of them are criminals by being here. They do not deserve preferential treatment, especially when it is paid for by citizens.

Lincoln freed the slaves and in doing that enslaved the poor and weak.

Not to batter Virginia with the obvious, but the South lost the Civil War (true, I saw the tweet). This means the North won, and I assure you the Yankees were firm believers in poor people and had lots of them too. For every redneck Georgia sheriff running a speed trap there is a crooked New Hampshire accountant with Jim Crow envy.

When jobs are scarce, employers just have too much power over the poor, and the States have too little power over them.

Did most of the posters who are slamming Webb read the op-ed piece in the WSJ? Or are you just reading the post's analysis of the article. Before bashing him (or supporting him for that matter) you should read the op-ed because no matter how you slice it, an analysis of the piece is not going to be completely objective. It will be tinged with some sort of bias. Read the article and then make a judgement. Personally, I thought it was very interesting and he demonstrated a good understanding of history in making his arguments.

Webb is a kook tool -- poor guy, was it in Rolling Stone (the home of the Indie armie wannabe) where he said his abuse at the Naval Academy was justifiable becasue how else would he learn to deal with an enemy -- right -- your peers are your enemy -- lol --- and he said that right before he said women didn't belong in the army or some such other garbage -- now he's going after black people -- he's an fing nut -- maybe he took too much abuse at the Naval acadmey...

Yes!,Yes, yes, Webb is accurately describing the history of this country in a way few if any elected politicians have the courage to do. White culture is not monolithic any more than black culture. The peoples who built this country are being shunted aside in a way that will only lead to consternation and conflict.

He clinically proposes that some programs be kept specifically for African Americans- the real victims of centuries of exploitation and discrimination in this country but the more recent immigrant groups have no claim on affirmative action programs. This is exactly correct. And is the way forward for all Americans.

Enough with these HB1 visa's and quota's-especially now with unemployment being as high as it is. Lower the unnecessary high level of immigration, even a moratorium would not be inappropriate. That's not racist, not xenophobic, its protecting the American people and culture. Give the country time to adjust to these new cultures and give these new groups time to assimilate.

As an African American- I'd say "Webb for President" if that's the only way for his proposals to be implemented.

Seems we in America take this legacy heritage thing a bit too far. I was born in America.... and while my ancestory goes back to Russia...I no more consider myself Russian than the man in the moon. Surely if your first or second generation of any heritage... then you have to play on that... but if you've never set foot into the country of your origin... then you are of American heritage... Come into the 21st century... and realize your roots are in America.. adopt American ways... adopt the American language... its what it means to be American after all.

As an African American woman who received many benefits from diversity. I think they should "drop" many of the programs. African Americans have made enough strides to begin to compete on talent, brains and hard work and pass that knowledge on to their children.

Senator Webb seems sincere but very misguided, almost troubled. He was elected to represent his constituents but seems more interested in expressing his personal views. What state interest is served by his making his personal opinions known on affirmative action? This is not leadership. It is time for him to go.

Ah, you Democrats were SO in love with this guy when he was elected. The way he stood up to Pres. Bush on the war. How's that looking now? Your buddy Obama still won't get out of Afghanistan or Iraq and Senator Webb thinks he's a Republican now. Now who will you vote for when he comes up for reelection?

webb is up for reelection in 2012, the same year obama is up for reelection...
webb gets it that without the white independent vote, the vote that wants fairness for all and tired of being attacked by the left, he can't be reelected...
and as obama proves himself the afrocentric racist that he is...
he will be gone that same year too...

Webb is pandering to the tea party at this point... I read the original WSJ editorial he wrote. It contained not one word about historic economic discrimination in this country toward women and Native Americans. Nice try by Webb to keep hold of the right wing male vote, but he lost me...

BTW, I've met and spoken to Webb. He's arrogant and bullying in person.

I read many of the views above and I read the same old misinformation and misunderstanding about Affirmative Action I have read and heard since the 60's interspersed with some racist comments. My take is simple -Show me the data. If the data supports Senator Webb I am interested; if it doesn't {and the statistics I am seeing don't) then I would say it is political opportunism.

I was discussing mandatory term limits recently and it struck me we'd have to do without Jim Webb. Forget term limits. I'm proud that the Commonwealth of Virginia has chosen him for the senate and hope he'll continue to serve with the honesty, dignity and care he has demonstrated so far.

If we accept instead the view that the real gaps in our society are now based less on race than on need, we run into some other challenges. First, there is the knee-jerk reflex of many people to oppose any needs-based programs as "socialism". Ironically, in my experience the loudest of these opponents come from two camps made up of people who would not logically be on the same side. The first group is made up of people with enormous financial wealth and power, and who claim "foul" anytime anyone wants to take any of their accumulated power. Of course, there are many generous people among the rich and powerful, but we have only to look at the financial mess we are in, and who began it, to know that too many would complain if they had to put off for six months buying their sixth limo.

The other group is made up of people who work like mad for their food and housing and regard any shift in economic wealth as coming after their hard-won livelihoods. A lot of these people are among those who are crying out loudest against government right now. Same motive as the first group -- hold onto what I have, and you're on your own, Jack -- but a lot more understandable. Many of these people became the so-called "Reagan Democrats".

These two groups are the Republican base, although in truth the Republican policy-makers serve only the first group. If the Democrats could pry the two groups apart, then we all might be able to realign and face the true problem of class; but we like to think that unlike, say, England, ours is a society that is not separated by anything as "un-American" as class.

I don't know if Senator Webb thinks this, too, and is just inept or awkward at expressing it, or if he really doesn't "get" it. But his column at least serves to get the conversation out there.

Quota based employment policies have no place in modern society.
We should have progressed beyond that.
Unnecessary help, fostered by black leaders who have made it a business to keep the black people down and dependent on them shuold be thrown out!
Maintaining low expectations of the black people will ensure they will never improve!
Expect more and you will get more!
But is has to be the People (black and white) that bring it about, not the govenment!!

want to kill the tea party- pass a law only whites can work in A federal state government B fire and police dept. presto with a clear mandate for apartheid in place, no tea party. my personal anecdotal story i love to tell. i once worked printing t shirts, about two million on a 14 head M&R. for more than a year the boss would keep bringing me these white trash hillbillies, inked up scum, their whole life was borrow some money to get drunk. finally after 12 or maybe 20 i walked into the office and told the boss, one more white lazy scumbag and i'll quit, get me a mexican preferably and older one. joe flores stayed with me for three years, learned everything i knew and then some. when i quit he took my place and is still there. every social dynamic for the next decade is going to center on- can the white trash keep control of this society. can they force their hillbilly evangelicalism on this population. see baby boomers are all they have left, without them whites make up mybe 45% of the population.i vote for the african american and the tejano. now i going to go look at the obit pages from the dallas morning news and count the newly dead. we need a counter like the one that runs the national debt in times square. we could then all rejoice as we watch the death toll accumulate one white trash hillbilly by one.

Exhibit One of why affirmative action is needed. LUKE RUSSERT of MSNBC. Two years out of college; his father dies at the office (NBC); and his late father's friends and colleagues at NBC offer the young, inexperienced and recently graduated Luke a job as a reporter covering Capitol Hill. How many young recently graduated minorites would get such an opportunity? Isn't this the same way many white firemen and policeman got heir jobs in the Northeast and Midwest? Maybe the good Senator from Virginia should address/tackle croynism and nepotism. The white man's version of affirmative action.

Jim Web, you just got my vote. In my younger years I have watched and listened to minorities tell supervisors what they will and won't do. I have been interviewed by minority personal that had no intention of hiring me and have went so far as instigating conflict to make sure they didn't have to consider me for the position. I have seen minorities come and go with no intention of holding down or keeping a good job. And then to hear their leaders or people that speak for them say that they have a long way to go? I don't think they understand that even in white dominated communities its hard to get a good job and hard to raise a family.
One more thing that Jim Web didn't mention in his column was that there was more reverse race discrimination in America today than there ever was, and its the biggest problem in race relations in this country. It is my conclusion that the world was naturally segregated to control race relations. Mixing race and ethic groups is a precursor to war and unrest. I could wonder if John Wilkes Booth knew what he was doing and what his ethnic group or religion was?

I know Webbs district well and it has a lot of stringy haired obviously malnourished whites. They get lots of state and federal aid. They get supported by other people's taxes. What black people are taking their jobs?

When more individuals begin understanding that each of us creates our own reality based upon our beliefs they will see that this entire controversary is meaningless.
Millions already understand this and, each day, more remember what we were born knowing and trained away from as we were told to listen to those outside of ourselves for guidance.
Most individuals have so many limiting beliefs it holds them in place. It is not any force outside of themselves creating their reality; it is their own thoughts and beliefs. No one else has any control over how you think or what you believe. Any belief you hold can be changed by you if you deliberately apply yourself to changing it. A belief is just a thought you keep thinking so if your current beliefs do not serve you think other thoughts that will. Eventually you will begin to believe the thoughts you have deliberately chosen instead of those fed to you by those around you and in the media, all of whom have their own agenda and few of whom understand that you create your own reality.
This conversation is totally unnecessary. It is based upon false premise after false premise and as long as individuals believe those false premises it will continue.
Look at your own life and see if it does not reflect your thoughts back to you. See if it does not give you what you have focused your attention upon (whether it was wanted or unwanted). It is where you focus your attention that determines what life serves you; not what you want or do not want. Focus on wanted and that is what life will deliver. This is true in all things, in your work, in your releationshps, in your health, in your fun, everywhere in your life. No Exceptions.
If you look at each major religion, at its basis (not at the way man has adjusted it to serve his needs over time) you will see that what I have written is supported there.
This knowledge is available to all today and being communicated clearly. Seek and you shall find.

lol omg Webb is the first white person on the face of the earth to have a set of balls and speak the truth.
Fine example of what he is saying;I am a license electricion with over 20 years exp, i applied for a city job who is already 80% african american, and quess what? I lost out on the job of an electrician for the city to an african american who did not have his license and had only worked in the trade for 2 months.
Ummm they said the needed to hire more minorities and omg I'M Creek Idian!!!!!!