I'm sure there will be some survivers, it would be crazy not to keep a few of the better people, Starmer himself was in it!

On the other hand, there are some very strong people on the backbench that couldn't or wouldn't work with Corbyn, so we could have the best of both worlds.

So strong that they spent their time undermining the leader and so we ended up with with a buffoon, advised by a crook, leading the country in the biggest crisis for 80 years.

Which current MP has the longest record of rebellion against their party leader?

By rebellion, do you mean voting with their conscience such as opposing benefit cuts and the war in Iraq, or leaking stuff to the press and taking part in mass resignations and leadership challenges when the Tories were at their weakest?

Is it principled voting with conscience when Corbyn does it (a lot), and undermining the leader when others do it? Is voting against the whip one of those irregular verbs?

I really can’t remember when Corbyn deliberately undermined the leadership by telling journalists how bad the leader was and smearing the leader. If you can think of any articles where Corbyn attacked the leader, it would be interesting to read them. Maybe we could contrast it with Hilary Benin’s speech as a senior shadow cabinet member, or the coordinated resignations and vote of no confidence? Can you remind me how many times Corbyn voted for no confidence in the Labour leader? I’m sure you’ve got the number at your finger tips.

Was Corbyn justified every time he challenged the Labour leader? Do you hold Corbyn to his own standards?

You seem unable to understand the difference between voting with your conscience and deliberately undermining the leadership. That’s not surprising, based on your posting history.

Why did Corbyn challenge the PM for the Labour leadership in 2002, less than 12 months after the British people elected him with a landslide? What do you think of Corbyn's view that there should be annual leadership elections?

I'm sure there will be some survivers, it would be crazy not to keep a few of the better people, Starmer himself was in it!

On the other hand, there are some very strong people on the backbench that couldn't or wouldn't work with Corbyn, so we could have the best of both worlds.

So strong that they spent their time undermining the leader and so we ended up with with a buffoon, advised by a crook, leading the country in the biggest crisis for 80 years.

Which current MP has the longest record of rebellion against their party leader?

By rebellion, do you mean voting with their conscience such as opposing benefit cuts and the war in Iraq, or leaking stuff to the press and taking part in mass resignations and leadership challenges when the Tories were at their weakest?

Is it principled voting with conscience when Corbyn does it (a lot), and undermining the leader when others do it? Is voting against the whip one of those irregular verbs?

I really can’t remember when Corbyn deliberately undermined the leadership by telling journalists how bad the leader was and smearing the leader. If you can think of any articles where Corbyn attacked the leader, it would be interesting to read them. Maybe we could contrast it with Hilary Benin’s speech as a senior shadow cabinet member, or the coordinated resignations and vote of no confidence? Can you remind me how many times Corbyn voted for no confidence in the Labour leader? I’m sure you’ve got the number at your finger tips.

Was Corbyn justified every time he challenged the Labour leader? Do you hold Corbyn to his own standards?

You seem unable to understand the difference between voting with your conscience and deliberately undermining the leadership. That’s not surprising, based on your posting history.

Why did Corbyn challenge the PM for the Labour leadership in 2002, less than 12 months after the British people elected him with a landslide? What do you think of Corbyn's view that there should be annual leadership elections?

Can we please save this argument for another thread, and just discuss the topic the OP raised?

I'm sure there will be some survivers, it would be crazy not to keep a few of the better people, Starmer himself was in it!

On the other hand, there are some very strong people on the backbench that couldn't or wouldn't work with Corbyn, so we could have the best of both worlds.

So strong that they spent their time undermining the leader and so we ended up with with a buffoon, advised by a crook, leading the country in the biggest crisis for 80 years.

Which current MP has the longest record of rebellion against their party leader?

By rebellion, do you mean voting with their conscience such as opposing benefit cuts and the war in Iraq, or leaking stuff to the press and taking part in mass resignations and leadership challenges when the Tories were at their weakest?

Is it principled voting with conscience when Corbyn does it (a lot), and undermining the leader when others do it? Is voting against the whip one of those irregular verbs?

I really can’t remember when Corbyn deliberately undermined the leadership by telling journalists how bad the leader was and smearing the leader. If you can think of any articles where Corbyn attacked the leader, it would be interesting to read them. Maybe we could contrast it with Hilary Benin’s speech as a senior shadow cabinet member, or the coordinated resignations and vote of no confidence? Can you remind me how many times Corbyn voted for no confidence in the Labour leader? I’m sure you’ve got the number at your finger tips.

Was Corbyn justified every time he challenged the Labour leader? Do you hold Corbyn to his own standards?

You seem unable to understand the difference between voting with your conscience and deliberately undermining the leadership. That’s not surprising, based on your posting history.

Why did Corbyn challenge the PM for the Labour leadership in 2002, less than 12 months after the British people elected him with a landslide? What do you think of Corbyn's view that there should be annual leadership elections?

Can we please save this argument for another thread, and just discuss the topic the OP raised?

Smudge's dad accused the possible new shadow ministers of disloyalty. Raise the issue with him.

I'd like to see Stella Creasy and Wes Streeting in the cabinet, two very effective and competent politicians, who can appeal to floating voters.

I guess RLB needs to stay for unity reasons, but keep her away from any job related to the economy of business, she has no credibility on these.

Thornberry has to remain in her current role. Keep Dawn Butler around as well.

I'd like to see Raynor contiue in education, as well as being deputy leader.

Burgon and Gardiner should be sent to the backbenches.

Yvette Cooper to be shadow Home Secretary, she would eat Patel for breakfast.

Hillary Benn could be a good shout for chancellor.

Pity there's no Owen Smith given his proven ability to work with both Houses. We should be looking at people who can work with bodies outside their comfort zone. Cooper stands out for her cross-party work last year. Any others?

Hilary Benn was a potential leader, but totally destroyed his reputation with his disloyalty. I wouldn't trust him an inch and neither should any potential leader. He has the morals of a Priti Patel.

Verb: to vote against the whip (irregular)

Jeremy Corbyn votes according to his conscience.
Hilary Benn is disloyal to his leader.

Give it a rest
We know you don't like Corbyn

I actually don't care all that much about Corbyn. I dislike the hypocrisy of his supporters. Not everyone can be a success, or be right about everything. But they can at least be consistent, applying to themselves the standards they demand of others. You accuse Hilary Benn of disloyalty. Because he opposed a man who is statistically the most disloyal MP in the current Parliament.

Hilary Benn was a potential leader, but totally destroyed his reputation with his disloyalty. I wouldn't trust him an inch and neither should any potential leader. He has the morals of a Priti Patel.

Verb: to vote against the whip (irregular)

Jeremy Corbyn votes according to his conscience.
Hilary Benn is disloyal to his leader.

Give it a rest
We know you don't like Corbyn

I actually don't care all that much about Corbyn. I dislike the hypocrisy of his supporters. Not everyone can be a success, or be right about everything. But they can at least be consistent, applying to themselves the standards they demand of others. You accuse Hilary Benn of disloyalty. Because he opposed a man who is statistically the most disloyal MP in the current Parliament.

It's interesting that you mention hypocrisy.

You've criticised Corbyn supporters for supposedly saying they'd rather have 'Boris than Tony'.

Yet I've asked you on numerous occasions and you've steadfastly refused to deny that you'd 'rather have Boris than Jeremy'

Hilary Benn was a potential leader, but totally destroyed his reputation with his disloyalty. I wouldn't trust him an inch and neither should any potential leader. He has the morals of a Priti Patel.

Yes, and i lost all faith in him when he wanted to bomb the hell out of Syria cheered on by Tory war Pigs in Parliament,that was a sickening sight.

He didn't want to bomb Syria or its population. He - and a majority of MPs - wanted to take out ISIS terrorists *in* Syria. That's an important difference. Terrorists should be removed wherever they are. Crossing the border from Iraq into Syria shouldn't offer them any protection.

Benn's speech was one of the best in Parliament in recent years. What was sickening was Labour excusing terrorist training camps.

Hilary Benn was a potential leader, but totally destroyed his reputation with his disloyalty. I wouldn't trust him an inch and neither should any potential leader. He has the morals of a Priti Patel.

Yes, and i lost all faith in him when he wanted to bomb the hell out of Syria cheered on by Tory war Pigs in Parliament,that was a sickening sight.

He didn't want to bomb Syria or its population. He - and a majority of MPs - wanted to take out ISIS terrorists *in* Syria. That's an important difference. Terrorists should be removed wherever they are. Crossing the border from Iraq into Syria shouldn't offer them any protection.

Benn's speech was one of the best in Parliament in recent years. What was sickening was Labour excusing terrorist training camps.

For a start they have no business bombing ANYTHING in Syria,also along with those American gangsters they would have been bombing Syrian infrastructure,and thats what they have done,if they wanted to fight Isis in Syria they should have asked the Syrian government if they wanted help,instead our Government with some other Countries have been helping terrorists in Syria,they are still doing it.

Hilary Benn was a potential leader, but totally destroyed his reputation with his disloyalty. I wouldn't trust him an inch and neither should any potential leader. He has the morals of a Priti Patel.

Yes, and i lost all faith in him when he wanted to bomb the hell out of Syria cheered on by Tory war Pigs in Parliament,that was a sickening sight.

He didn't want to bomb Syria or its population. He - and a majority of MPs - wanted to take out ISIS terrorists *in* Syria. That's an important difference. Terrorists should be removed wherever they are. Crossing the border from Iraq into Syria shouldn't offer them any protection.

Benn's speech was one of the best in Parliament in recent years. What was sickening was Labour excusing terrorist training camps.

For a start they have no business bombing ANYTHING in Syria,also along with those American gangsters they would have been bombing Syrian infrastructure,and thats what they have done,if they wanted to fight Isis in Syria they should have asked the Syrian government if they wanted help,instead our Government with some other Countries have been helping terrorists in Syria,they are still doing it.

Hilary Benn was a potential leader, but totally destroyed his reputation with his disloyalty. I wouldn't trust him an inch and neither should any potential leader. He has the morals of a Priti Patel.

Yes, and i lost all faith in him when he wanted to bomb the hell out of Syria cheered on by Tory war Pigs in Parliament,that was a sickening sight.

He didn't want to bomb Syria or its population. He - and a majority of MPs - wanted to take out ISIS terrorists *in* Syria. That's an important difference. Terrorists should be removed wherever they are. Crossing the border from Iraq into Syria shouldn't offer them any protection.

Benn's speech was one of the best in Parliament in recent years. What was sickening was Labour excusing terrorist training camps.

For a start they have no business bombing ANYTHING in Syria,also along with those American gangsters they would have been bombing Syrian infrastructure,and thats what they have done,if they wanted to fight Isis in Syria they should have asked the Syrian government if they wanted help,instead our Government with some other Countries have been helping terrorists in Syria,they are still doing it.

What do you think of the Russian intervention in Syria?

I think it was the right thing to do,they could have done it sooner if asked by the Syrian government,if they had not given help with their air force in 2015 the black flag of ISIS would be flying over Damascus right now,it would have been a blood bath in Damascus with severed heads on every street corner,make no mistake about that.