39 Responses

It is not a “pure accident” when you intentionally lift a gun and point it at someone. Whether she thought it was loaded or not. How can we teach our young its not okay to play with guns, when they see this and her lawyer stating police do not need to be involved. Give me a break. What about the guys poor family? If people are asking for the woman who killed those poor ladies with the SUV, they better be screaming for this girl to be charged too.

This was not an “accident”. A “mistake” would be closer. They’re prosecuting that little 12 year old boy who accidentally shot his playmate, but this lady shouldn’t be prosecuted or punished? Unless she’s developmentally delayed in some way, she is fully accountable for this.

Ignorance is often underestimated. Sheer, mind-boggling stupidity is rampant in our society. The question is, is ignorance and/or complete and utter lack of common sense a crime?

I’ve had a gun pointed at me head “jokingly”. The person simply had no experience whatsoever with firearms of any kind. Holding a gun was completely outside of his experience. He thought that since it wasn’t loaded, it wasn’t dangerous.

If stupidity leads to personal harm, is it a crime or an accident? It it is a crime, then society will simply break down. If it is an accident then we have no alternative than to lament the repercussions and move on.

I would think that to label something a crime, it must have intent. I could hit someone with my car and kill them by accident. I could also drink and drive, and get in the car and do the same. One is an accident, the other an intentional disregard for the law that lead directly to a death. One would be punishable, the other an unfortunate accident.

Do we really want to punish idiocy the same way we would punish intentional criminal acts? I personally don’t think so.

But AlbanyDude, if I got in my car, turned it on, and floored the gas pedal, striking and killing someone – but then I said “well, I thought it didn’t have any gas in it” would you consider that an accident or a criminal act? If it’s an accident, I can just go on my merry way with a person dead in the ground? All because I’m stupid?

Re: 21 yr. old Woman shoots boyfriend:
How do young people live a life today? Hanging out –farting with a gun like it was toy. Some young people don’t have a pot to P..in but have a gun. Come on. All in all I am sorry for this young man’s
family, even Ms. Ortiz.

Again, that would be an intentional act. A reasonable person would understand that if the car started, it has gas in it and that if you floor the gas pedal, the car moves. An unloaded gun cannot reasonably kill someone. A person who knows guns knows that you should treat it like it’s loaded, but not everyone knows guns. I’m not advocating leaving the scene of an accident either.

If you make a mistake, and an accident occurs, you shouldn’t be automatically persecuted the same way a guy who intentionally murdered someone. That’s all I am saying.

The world is a tragic place. There is enough evil, enough callous indifference to human (and animal) life, enough hate and enough cold and dead souls in this world to punish without adding people with good hearts who make mistakes to the list.

AlbanyDude, what did you do when your friend held a gun to your head in jest?
Guns are not toys, period. If you cannot understand that, then you shouldn’t be allowed anywhere near the thing. It’s very simple, you should never point a gun without intending to kill.

I understand your point but yes studity can lead to crime! People who are murders are at some level mentally unstable or else they wouldn’t do it; but that does not relieve them of the crime.

She needs to be charged and held accountable. I don’t know what charge or jail time should be involved if any, but she pointed the gun and pulled the trigger. She didn’t have intent to kill; okay then that’s what the lawyer needs to prove, which is probably going to be a bit difficult. I feel for her family and his.

I counter that a reasonable person knows not to point a gun at someone and pull the trigger. I have never been around guns, and never even seen one in real life, but I know enough not to point one at someone’s head and pull the trigger. I don’t even like kids playing with cap guns or bb guns. Most children know not to point a gun at someone’s head and pull the trigger. You said it yourself – it was a mistake – NOT an accident. I feel bad for her. She didn’t mean to do it. But she still killed someone. The anguish she’s feeling is her punishment, but there needs to be some other consequence as well. I’m not saying put her away for 25 years, but she can’t just walk away from this either.

Ann, to answer your question, I cowered in fear while swearing at him and ducking, bobbing and weaving.

He would not have meant to shoot me. My own experience was only an example of how some people simply don’t understand the danger. If he had shot me, and I didn’t die, I would not have pressed charges and I would have been a very unfriendly witness to the prosecutor if someone had charged him with something.

He made a mistake, and an accident happened. That is all. I would fight to make sure that his life wasn’t ruined because of a mistake.

I would hope that society would treat him with the forgiveness and understanding I (the victim in this example) would have.

She should be charged, and she should do time. Anyone with a brain knows that any time you pick up a firearm, you ALWAYS handle it as if it is loaded, even if you KNOW that it is not. You don’t put your finger NEAR the trigger unless you are intending to shoot it for real. You always hold it so it is pointing at the floor, never towards another person. Like Ann says in Post #9, firearms are not toys.

Tom: Hitler…Manson…Stalin oh and 99.9% of all serial killers who are middle aged white men. If your point is that that certain ethnic groups have a moral deficency then we white folks are right up at the top….

#17 must be one of those white liberals that drive around Delmar and Clifton PARK in their hybrids with Obama -Biden stickers on the car!! They are so pure and good in their thoughts in actions-mostly because they have never walked the streets of Schenectady or Albany.

Now his family doesn’t want her at the funeral. I wonder why? maybe because she pointed a gun at his face and pulled the trigger!

It does “seem” (we don’t really know the whole story) that this was unintentional, but the lawyer’s comment is asinine. “Nothing to see here folks. Woman just shot her boyfriend. She was joking; she actually hates guns, so no need to investigate! Nothing to see.”

She points a gun at someone’s head and pulls the trigger. Gaspar claims it was just an accident and that the law should not be involved. Even the greatest of story tellers, Terry Kindlon, would not make such an outrageous statement.

If this was an accident and no laws should be involved, then wait for that woman who drove erratically while wearing her husbands sandals and on medication killing three women to say it was an “accident.”

Scary society out there if everything is an accident and excused totally. A message still needs to be sent and charges still need to be brought on to this woman playing with a gun and pointing to her boyfriend’s head.

We also don’t know the details. It was date night. They could have been role playing! Maybe they had done the same thing 100 times before. We don’t know.

If she is punished for this tragic accident (if it was one), are we getting justice or vengeance?

It is so easy for us, those not involved personally, to cast our judgements from on high. These are people. I feel terrible for the family and friends who have suffered a loss, but if there is justice to be done let it be done with compassion and understanding.

There was no intent. There was no premeditation. There was nothing (I’m assuming, not being privy to the exact details save for these articles) to indicate a crime was comitted.

What is a crime? Cheney shot a guy in the face a while back He wasn’t persecuted for a mistake and he KNEW the gun was in fact loaded. This was not even a gun crime, as the gun was legally obtained and owned.

§ 125.15 Manslaughter in the second degree.
A person is guilty of manslaughter in the second degree when:
1. He recklessly causes the death of another person; or
2. He commits upon a female an abortional act which causes her death,
unless such abortional act is justifiable pursuant to subdivision three
of section 125.05; or
3. He intentionally causes or aids another person to commit suicide.
Manslaughter in the second degree is a class C felony.

Albany Dude, Ortiz was charged with Manslaughter 2nd. If we cant agree that pointing a gun at someone and pulling the trigger is reckless, well , we are doomed.