I will not have an abortion because I have absolutely no reason to have one. If I became pregnant and it wasn't planned, I'd say "oh well, we were going to have kids anyway someday" and be very happy because a child is a gift from God.

I'm very glad you wouldn't have an abortion , but that's not what I asked you. I'll ask it again.

"You have said that you believe that abortion is murder. If your belief is true, do you think that abortion should be legal?"

Simply elucidating the issue, for it to be murder the foetus has to be considered a human being. Defining human life is a very subjective affair, if we are shaping policy then it must be done carefully - so the idea of sacred human life or a soul must be left out as those concepts are not based in reality.

Within a society if one violates the rights or liberties of other people then they will be deprived of my liberties in some way; not all petty thieves will be killed (that isn't proportional) but an appropriate punishment is applied; determining the nature of the crime and the punishment can't be done on the basis of gut feeling morality but logic and reason - the no harm principle is much better than any holy tome to those ends.

This is a little embarrassing. I screwed up big time. I usually don't discuss abortion in public. I was trying to make the case for a secular state and said something I really shouldn't have said. Oops.

Originally posted by 80sU2isBest There are a number of valid reasons not enough people adopt, including the possibility that some, as you suggested, take a prolife stance but don't really care about kids when it comes right down to it. But there's so much more that maybe you ahven't even considered; maybe there's not enough people who can afford to adopt a child, or maybe there's too much red tape...the list of possibilities could go on and on and on...

Those are more or less the same reasons why some people end up having abortions.

Originally posted by Justin24 Well if Abortion is not murder then executing someone is not murder but a form of punishment.

Different' an execution is a punishment for a human being who has violated the rights or liberties of other people, it is the ultimate deprivation of liberty. A foetus is not a human being; does not enjoy those rights or liberties to begin with and is a case of the mother removing a growth from her body.

Originally posted by A_Wanderer Different' an execution is a punishment for a human being who has violated the rights or liberties of other people, it is the ultimate deprivation of liberty. A foetus is not a human being; does not enjoy those rights or liberties to begin with and is a case of the mother removing a growth from her body.

You call this a growth? A baby with ears, eys, a nose, fingers a brain, heart, heart lungs etc... a growth and not human??

The way I see it. When we are in the womb it's like the apple from the tree. Once we are born we are then born into sin. But this is just my belife and with many faiths out there, it could be a tall tale from the bible?