What it comes down to at the end of the day is how someone's body responds. I have seen dirty bulks, clean bulks, some with the same ratio, some with 20%crap foods 80%good foods ect you can analise it all you want but it's what works for the individual.

Rule of thumb should always be do it as healthy as you can. A kid I have gotten to know who works mon-thurs & has a 3 day wkend every week eats very clean while on work days & like crap over his wkend, yet has one of the best physics I ve seen locally. Again this works for him...

"Don't fall for that crap that people are peddling on the message boards, in magazines or on TV. Get your shit in order, and get your training in order. Start kicking ass, and take out the crap that doesn't matter" Jim Wendler

If we are still talking about what we are eating (?!) when I am bulking I eat a lot of kimchi in olive oil. I usually make it with a lot of carrots. If I eat that with a lot of oil then it ensures I absorb a lot ov Vitamin A, which i believe is essential for gaining muscle.

MattSxvx wrote:Yah I can't read her blog because of all the food porn she posts. especially whatever that protein ice cream voodoo stuff is.

I'll take this all as a compliment. Funny thing is, I'm only eating 2,000 calories a day and have stayed around 121-122.5 for the past four weeks. Imagine what's going to happen when I actually decide to bulk.

I don't like the term bulking, but maybe that's just a personal thing. To me the term implies getting big fast, which I don't think it should be if you are after quality gains, optimal digestion and general health & wellness.

I always look at the guys from the 60's and 70's ~ Zane, Nubret, Padilla. They really didn't look vastly different in their offseason than what they did when they were getting ready for a competition; some of them even grew into a competition, adding bodyweight & size leading up to the show! They might only add a few pounds of bodyweight a year but their physiques looked amazing and they never had to contend with bloating, gas etc etc that is part and parcel of todays bulking habits.

For me, if I'm trying to add bodyweight I'll look to eat denser foods (both weight wise & caloric), eat maybe 50-100cals more with each meal and add in an extra meal/shake each day.

Agree with the above^ all these ideas as to how to do whatever fad diet.....just bloody eat!!!

"Don't fall for that crap that people are peddling on the message boards, in magazines or on TV. Get your shit in order, and get your training in order. Start kicking ass, and take out the crap that doesn't matter" Jim Wendler

veggiesasquatch wrote:Agree with the above^ all these ideas as to how to do whatever fad diet.....just bloody eat!!!

I think saying "just bloody eat" is a little bit different than what James is saying as just eating "whatever" and eating 50-100 calories more than usual will produce different results. Not that I wholly disagree with you. I think we're actually both on the same page, for the most part, since I find fad diets ludicrous - it's all about the individual and how their body reacts to certain eating practices. Which is why I think tracking your macros is important and I don't think that's a "diet" (and I think this is where we disagree), it just helps people out - not just in terms of fat gain, muscle gain, etc. but just in how they live their lives every day. I mean, some people don't realize that they're fatigued because they don't react well to a low-carb or low-fat diet until they start tracking their intake and see the difference in how they feel, you know?

But, anyway, I do think the term "bulking" doesn't really fit any more since most people are leery of the "dirty" bulk and want to minimize their fat gain while putting on mass. I'd rather say I'm "gaining" since that could apply to my numbers in the gym and on the scale.

I've never counted a macro nor will I. It's really simple, if you want to gain 1.5-2g protein per pound of body weight, as many carbs as you can get down your neck & some fats. I'll have to put up some pics on my photo blog. If you want to get big it's simple, eat big but you do it as clean as Possible, I have not actually said other wise? I ve mentioned peoples habits but i havent said "eat rubbish"? If your doing it with clean food, seriously what's there to worry over? If you think your gaining to much fat, you skim off carbs & work on reducing what you don't like. Tweaking the diet.

I'm not trying to be a bodybuilder or am I after a certain "look" so I'm never gonna be bothered about visible this & the muscle popping out. I'm not in the slightest cut, im there to move the barbell & to move weight you need to gain weight. There will always be a genetic freak who looks normal & can lift heavy but you can't use them as a bench mark. Big lifters are big guys/women.

I'm sure if I was a bodybuilder & wanted my "summer look" I'd be all for counting this & that but my muscle/mass & strength gains come from being able to move a barbell & to do so I worry more over have I eaten enough, not what have I eaten enough of. In all honestly my diets pretty boring, plain rice, pasta, steamed veg. My other half always rags at me for bland food.

I found gaining easy so maybe that's why, along with my strength mentality I seeNo need in counting calories or macros. But as Long as foods are of good quality your already winning.

I won't detract on bodybuilder for how strict a competion diet is, it's hard but I have written diets for people with macro counting ect it works for them...for me I just want to move a heavier barbell:)

How's the training going anyway?

"Don't fall for that crap that people are peddling on the message boards, in magazines or on TV. Get your shit in order, and get your training in order. Start kicking ass, and take out the crap that doesn't matter" Jim Wendler

Also when I said "just bloody eat" I wasn't implying you should be eating shit foods...simply eat more of good grub

"Don't fall for that crap that people are peddling on the message boards, in magazines or on TV. Get your shit in order, and get your training in order. Start kicking ass, and take out the crap that doesn't matter" Jim Wendler

veggiesasquatch wrote:If your doing it with clean food, seriously what's there to worry over? If you think your gaining to much fat, you skim off carbs & work on reducing what you don't like. Tweaking the diet.

I think we'll just have to agree to disagree because I don't like calling foods "clean" or "dirty" - it creates a certain stigma and makes it sound like certain foods have 'super' properties to them that prevent them from making someone gain weight. I mean, yeah, 2,000 calories of spinach is a lot harder to consume than 2,000 calories worth of peanut butter but it's still about calories in and calories out.

I'm not trying to be a bodybuilder or am I after a certain "look" so I'm never gonna be bothered about visible this & the muscle popping out. I'm not in the slightest cut, im there to move the barbell & to move weight you need to gain weight. There will always be a genetic freak who looks normal & can lift heavy but you can't use them as a bench mark. Big lifters are big guys/women.

I do totally agree with you here, though, and this definitely made me think a lot about my goals. I personally don't ever want to do bodybuilding competitions and really want to work toward doing raw powerlifting so, I suppose, my macro tracking isn't a necessity.It has, however, helped me out a lot with my undereating, figuring out how much I actually do need to be eating to get stronger, and what kind of foods work best for helping me perform in the gym. For example, I was eating 1,800 calories a day with really high protein/moderate carbs for a while but the scale wasn't going up in the gym and I was crashing half-way through sessions so I started eating 2,000 with lowered protein and higher carbs. Gym performance improved but now my weight's still the same as it was in December so I'll probably be upping my calories again.

How's the training going anyway?

Training's going great, actually. Steady increases in all of my big lifts and I definitely feel stronger - which is awesome.