Old-Salt

LE

Just picked up this comment on the BEEB web site
"North Korea must choose either to have a future or to have nuclear weapons "but it cannot have them both", top US negotiator Christopher Hill said."

Er uhm, know I know I live in the backyard of beyond but just what is Uncle Sam propossing ?
Nuc um?
Invade?
Tell Dear Leader ta send his troops guarding Buck house and empty all the malingers from Hospital wards to stag on with the Chelsea Pensioners ?
john
Baffled in Bangkok.

This is all about trying to prop up a failing stalinist tyranny. Old Kim, is totally out there and loves his trappings of power. The state is on the verge of collapse and GB is hoping that more sanctions etc will make the process evolve even quicker. However, the North Koreans have shown that they are willing to take it to the brink and I for one suspect they will detonate a nuke.........after that, all bets are off

War Hero

This is all about trying to prop up a failing stalinist tyranny. Old Kim, is totally out there and loves his trappings of power. The state is on the verge of collapse and GB is hoping that more sanctions etc will make the process evolve even quicker. However, the North Koreans have shown that they are willing to take it to the brink and I for one suspect they will detonate a nuke.........after that, all bets are off

The US does have interest in this situation ,as we all do ,but What is Japan's reaction going to be ? Japan will more than likely rearm. They have been a economic superpower for 20 or 30 years , now they will become a military power. After the end of WWII we had the West pitted against the Soviet Union and its communist allies . Than just the one superpower and now the emergence of regional powers. It looks like a pre WWII world, except nations are armed with nuclear weapons .........after that, all bets are off .

LE

I can picture the first test, with dignitaries lined up, and the missile roars off the test pad, malfunctions, comes roaring back to earth annihilates half the country...

Would anybody notice any difference?

"As we moved slowly through the outskirts of the town we passed row after row of little grey slum houses running at right angles to the embankment. At the back of one of the houses a young woman was kneeling on the stones, poking a stick up the leaden waste-pipe which ran from the sink inside and which I suppose was blocked. I had time to see everything about her - her sacking apron, her clumsy clogs, her arms reddened by the cold. She looked up as the train passed, and I was almost near enough to catch her eye." Orwell, The Road to Wigan Pier

Old-Salt

The North Koreans will never do anything serious, not because of Nato, the Yanks, Japs ect, but because of the Chinese. This is all international posturing, to be used as a bargaining chip once the six nation talks start back up.

Kim knows full well that if he tries to start a ruckus (especially a nuclear one) in the Chineseâs corner of the world they will flatten him like the fist of an angry god.

This may still happen or has happen and no one told us, but I think it's a underground test.

The North Koreans will never do anything serious, not because of Nato, the Yanks, Japs ect, but because of the Chinese. This is all international posturing, to be used as a bargaining chip once the six nation talks start back up.

Kim knows full well that if he tries to start a ruckus (especially a nuclear one) in the Chineseâs corner of the world they will flatten him like the fist of an angry god.

WHILE the rest of the world looks to Beijing to stop North Korea from exploding a nuclear bomb, a leading Chinese analyst says it is too late - China cannot act without doing worse harm to its own interests.

"Basically, our country's work of persuasion with the (Democratic People's Republic of Korea) in the 12 years that the DPRK developed its nuclear program had been a failure," writes highly regarded Shen Dingli, of Shanghai's Fudan University

LE

From what I understand, we are talking something fairly crude and hopefully too big to fit onto current DPRK missiles (which should keep the Japanese a smidge happier). South Korea, though will probably be (a) going 'oh sh1t' or similar or more likely (b) 'SEE! We told you he was a nutter'.
The Chinese are maybe backpedalling a bit and trying to disassociate with a throwback regime as they go all market forces and fluffy towards the West, but they still have the military capability to flatten DPRK in about ten minutes IIRC.

Anyone see a parallel here? Regional Dictator Nutter type, wants to be regarded as big player, claims to have military capabilities that he may or may not have, who gets taken seriously by the big players and .....

LE

In that case may I suggest a nice cottage in North Korea for your next holiday... this might open thy eyes to one or two differences...

You of course may save on a return ticket...

"As we moved slowly through the outskirts of the town we passed row after row of little grey slum houses running at right angles to the embankment. At the back of one of the houses a young woman was kneeling on the stones, poking a stick up the leaden waste-pipe which ran from the sink inside and which I suppose was blocked. I had time to see everything about her - her sacking apron, her clumsy clogs, her arms reddened by the cold. She looked up as the train passed, and I was almost near enough to catch her eye." Orwell, The Road to Wigan Pier

Old-Salt

Thank God the Army's not overstretched, or I'd be really worried! Seriously, there's not a whole lot the West can do about it. Sanctions are of limted use since half the people are eating grass anyway. And no matter how bad it gets, Kim and his inner circle wil never go hungry. Military action is a non-starter; even the American military only has so many troops to g around. We'ed probably be limited to a TA Company, the ATC and the cast of Ultimate Force. While DPRK has close to a million men and arms, tough, well trained and brainwashed from birth.
The only good news is that Kim is not stupid enough to endanger his luxurious lifestyle by chucking nukes at South Korea or Japan. He does'nt give a fcuk about his people, but he knows that if he uses WMD's in anger, China or America will wipe his worthless little country off the face of the earth.
If there is a test of a nuclear weapon it will be for internal propganda and, more importantly, to put pressure on the West.

LE

Just picked up this comment on the BEEB web site
"North Korea must choose either to have a future or to have nuclear weapons "but it cannot have them both", top US negotiator Christopher Hill said."

Er uhm, know I know I live in the backyard of beyond but just what is Uncle Sam propossing ?
Nuc um?
Invade?
Tell Dear Leader ta send his troops guarding Buck house and empty all the malingers from Hospital wards to stag on with the Chelsea Pensioners ?
john
Baffled in Bangkok.

I have a really hard time believing that the Chinese would allow an attack on it's backyard yard be it conventional or otherwise.How would the Brits react if Russia invaded Ireland?Or even France?

The ultimate solution IMHO is for the Chinese (under the auspices of international agreements ) and the S Koreans (without US troops) to invade N Korea from the North and South in a lightning blitzkrieg like operation.Get rid of old boy Kim Ill, install a puppet regime to oversee reconstruction ,build a framework for a reunion with the South and then pave the way for withdrawing US troops from the south.

And they better do it quick before the N Koreans see my genius suggestion and take measures to counter it.

Sail on, O Ship of State!
Sail on, O UNION, strong and great!
Humanity with all its fears,
With all the hopes of future years,
Is hanging breathless on thy fate!