Here's a post with an interesting suggestion for BAs. http://forums.lotro.com/showthread.p...67#post6829367. That does seem nice. What do other BA's think? I can't help but feel it is a tad overpowered, perhaps. But here are some more ideas and suggestions to share with other BA's, and to generally start a debate on what could be changed/improved for us.

1. The quoted poster above is definitely correct when he says that cooldowns need to change. Very often during a long fight you will reach a point where pretty much ALL skills are on cooldown, and you are left spamming Strong Pull as it's the only one available. How often would a Freep class encounter a situation when he or she ran out of skills to use? Even if this problem ever arose, many (if not all) freep classes have a skill which can effectively reset certain cooldowns. Not so for Creeps. Why? I believe we should have this ability.

Another solution to address this, at least for us BAs, would be to simply add one or two more skills to our rotation, as noted below...

2. We see many incoming freep DoTs these days. Multiple DoTs, long-duration DoTs, stackable DoTs, and unpottable DoTs. It needs balancing. It so needs balancing. So I want a new non-induction Ranged attack that would deliver a long-duration bleed. Call it, say, 'Deadly Barb'. A serious, heavy bleed which cannot be potted.

I am left puzzled and disappointed at how under-developed creeps really are compared to our rich and privileged freep counterparts. There is a variety of 'Enhanced' skills that improve existing skills - but only with the expenditure of valuable trait slots. Creeps are quite restricted in what builds they can achieve. I would like to see certain 'Enhanced' skills attributed to you automatically and by default through rank, that don’t require a trait slot. Freeps get numerous 'Improved' versions of skills they already possess, which they get simply through reaching a certain level, and don't require a special trait. For example:

3. Remove the trait ‘Enhanced: Hindering Shot’, and simply apply the added duration slow to the base skill when you achieve, say, Rank 7 or whatever. Without this special trait the slow lasts - compared to default freep slows - for an absolutely pitiful 8 seconds. It is really frustrating that in order to compete and have a useful skill like this we are forced to expend a trait slot (which I don't any longer with Hindering shot, in favour of something more valuable). Same can be said for many other 'Enhanced' skills. Field Promotion on War-Leaders is another chief offender.

4. DoTs again. We need more DoTs! Add a Damage-over-time affect to 'No You Don't'. I love this skill. Would love it even more if it applied a few damage ticks as well. Nothing op, just something mild would be okay, in the order of 200-300 damage every 4 seconds for 20 seconds.

5. Screaming Shafts is not a much used, or much valued skill. In fact it hardly gets used except when all other skills are on cooldown (see no. 1 above) The damage is meh, at best. It cannot be used on the run in Skirmisher, and the long animation is even more compounded by the induction. To improve it, I visualize either removing the induction, making it a Skirmisher stance skill (usable on the move), or make it a fast skill with quicker animation – or increase its 3 ranged attacks to 4, thus increasing the overall damage output. Any one of these ideas would bring this poor and often neglected skill back into a BA's regular skill rotation.

6. Finally, something I would love to see implemented for not just BA, but all creep classes. And that is a single skill - each - that would deliver a separate, and unique Damage type. Like a creep version of the freeps' Beleriand dmg. Maybe every creep could have one skill that damages with this type, a unique and cunningly nasty type, which bypasses not just Audacity, but both physical and tactical mitigation. Nor can it be blocked/parried/evaded. Nothing massively op - certainly not a 'Revenge' or a 'Vital Target' or 'Devastating Strikes'. Just a regular medium-damaging skill, one skill per class, on a long duration. It would be ‘special’ only in that freeps' already heavy stacked mitigations cannot defend against it.

Jun 24 2013, 06:46 PM

Tangaar

Indeed The skills cooldowns are horrible atm.
BA is meant to be a burst dps class but in order to burst dps your target you must have available VT revenge and a pretty good luck for a dev crit on both.
The skill i mentioned in the other thread would be quite handy in thems of dps and debufing.I would be really glad if such a skill could be added for HD...r10 requirement :rolleyes:

The traits now....atleast 70% of them are a must these days...making most of them useless and in other ways...kind of a joke(Fire dmg trait for example)

Some crit chance or multiplier on the second and third hits of screaming shafts would be nice too

And to the above poster...hmm you mentioned dots...how comes BA has no poison arrow skill ?
BUT if devs are willing to add a skill i would highly recommend the one i will post again below

Show No mercy!Fast
Ranged skill

When your target has less than a
half of their morale you unleash an extremely
damaging arrow with high critical chance.

1,970 Common Damage

-50% incoming healing modifierDuration: 15s

Cost: 125 power

Cooldown: 30s

Jun 25 2013, 03:49 AM

jadacakai

Agreed!
Needs.
BA needs a good dot.
BA needs less CD's more skills for rotation.
BA needs a damage type that isnt redundant.
BA needs an overhaul on "Screaming Shafts" and "Death Blossom" both do 1/10th of a bad hunters dps.

Wants.
Sick of my BAs dps cut in half by LMS spammable debuffs, purple pot removes only if its the only LM dot. If hunters got -50% ranged dps from weavers..OMG the tears! So either reduce/remove or add to creepside.

Blackarrows need their traits fixed and scaled. Skirmisher Stance is useless, the dps is ridiculous. Enhanced Skill: Steadfast Barrage is still bugged. Know people who buy the trait just to see that does not work...
I am content if they fix all problems that update after update still not fixed.

I would like to see some proper escape skills, MT is useless nowadays because since U10 70% of the Freep population are Tactical damage based classes.

Jun 26 2013, 09:39 PM

Galadhol

I pretty much agree with most of the posts here. Cooldowns and particular skills which are nowhere near as effective as they should be. Also our lack of effective skills make our dps rotation pretty boring. After tangleshot, revenge and VT are on cd we're pretty much tickling our foes. Unless we happen to get him run through all snares and stand in fire trap! I'm not asking for ba's to become penshot machine guns like Hunters are, instead, what I'm asking for is bit more variety.

- I've always been hoping that cooldown of Tangleshot would be reduced to half of it's current 20 sec duration.
- Screaming Shafts should be buffed up a notch in my opinion.
- Punct. Target could reduce cd of Vital Target a bit more or Vital Target should have 1min and 30sec cd instead of 2min(CD reduce could be added to improved version of the skill(This might be bit too much, but only testing will tell)).
- Flaming Arrow dot could be bit more damaging. Most freeps don't even bother to pot it as it's so weak.
- Explosive Arrow needs to be buffed.
- Some BA traits could be reworked a bit. Not to mention all creep traits should be reworked, but thats a whole different topic.
- Resistance and Avoidance boosts are currently completely useless. Could use some buffing up to make them usefull.
- Enchanced Hindering shot: For gods sake, just remove this trait and add the extra duration to the skill without having to trait for it...
- Penetrating Arrows: Instead of affecting block chance, it could instead be used to bypassing opponents mitigations.
- Enchanced Headshot: Could affect the cd of that skill. Let's say reduce it by 10-15secs.
- Couple of new skills, atleast one DoT. Or Flaming Arrow could be uncurable?
No comment on other traits.

And obviously, creep traits in general need alot of modifications in my opinion.

My 2 cents. I apologize for mistakes, it's pretty late here but I feel the need to contribute somehow.

EDIT: I kinda like the idea of adding inc healing debuff to a new DoT skill, would do wonders since most of freep classes can outheal our dps with ease. Just to force them to do something else and not just turtling our pitiful dps...

Jun 27 2013, 12:45 AM

Gauntlord

Blackarrow skills

Maybe february this year, I came to the forums, tying to give new ideas about the blackarrow class.
I agree with most of your thoughts about what is needed to improve it. I also think we need a skill to cause the effect "silence". A simple skill called "shut up, dude" or "neck shot" with which we deliver a precise arrow to the neck of our enemy so they can not talk due to blood in their throat. Maybe a long induction one 2-3 secs, 10-15 secs duration, 45 secs cd. Also I really believe we could deal acid damage, as spiders. Maybe a trait giving a new skill. This new skill would give us the chance to switch between fire damage or acid damage on the battle itself. This would change the way freeps protect themselves against the specific damage type we deal, because most BAs use "feel the burn" trait. The damage we make against a champ, a guardian or a captain with strong pull is a joke. As stated before when everything is on cooldown, we should have a skill called time out, ths one would allow a BA to take a nap while waiting for VT to be available again. The skill offers also a beverage to the freep we are fighting against. So they do not feel so uncomfortable while the loooooong delay.
In conclusion, two damage sets, one fire based, mainly burst damage and the other one acid damage, basically DOTs.

Jun 27 2013, 01:17 PM

Gwyndor

Another idea to combat the terrible cooldown issue would be a skill that effectively resets our cooldowns. I mean why not? Freeps have this function.

Let's call it 'Urgency', on a 5m or even 10m cd would be fine. This skill will reset the cooldown of, for argument's sake, Flaming Arrow, Vital Target, Headshot, and Revenge. At the same time the inductions for all induction skills get reduced by a small amount, say 30% (like a BA version of Needful Haste). Maybe a bit overpowered in regards to resetting VT and Revenge, but even without these it would be a useful skill.

Jun 27 2013, 02:10 PM

Tangaar

No no...
I will have to disagree with 2 things from the posters

Having a skill that resets skills wont help with the cd problems we have...
And i dont want 1 more trait for different dmg type..(once again in the closed beta i will burn my butt to find the bugs from this :p)

Anw i agree with everythin else

Aug 08 2013, 06:33 PM

Reshi

This is a thought I had on a whim while juggling the problems BAs have with CDs in my head, and by no means have I thought long enough about it to have worked out details and implications, but...
What if more of our skills functioned like Improved Puncture Target (IPT)(reducing the downtime of higher damage, longer CD skills)?

Currently we only have one notably long CD with VT and a bunch of midrange ones that, once blown, leave us with nerf darts thrown from a slingshot.

I think it would be nifty if there could be different tiers to this effect, for example: strong pull reducing the active CD of IPT by 1/1.5/2 seconds, which in turn reduces the CD of VT.

Or any combination of the above, though currently we don't have many low CD base skills aside from strong pull. I'm thinking to add variety an argument could be made to reduce the base CD of IPT to go with some manner of the set.

Once again I haven't thought this through at length and am just throwing this out there so take this with a grain of salt, but I feel this could be a neat class mechanic in an otherwise 'see button mash button' class. This would give more purpose to our otherwise useless 'filler' skills while also providing a more dynamic combat experience by having to make choices on which CDs you want back faster instead of twiddling thumbs while waiting for the standard rotation to be back.

Thoughts?

Aug 08 2013, 11:33 PM

Tharvendall

Quote:

Originally Posted by Reshi

Thoughts?

It is a nice idea but then they would have to implement the same stuff on all other classes, but as far as i heard we'll see some changes after HD launches and the apparent, "Freep revamp"

I'm quite happy on how it's looking right now, or maybe i've just got used to how bad it actually is, who knows..
I still wish for a tactical evade skill, and maybe something like a short sprint like freeps have, Adrenaline Rush maybe? >D

Aug 09 2013, 06:36 AM

Areya121

Quote:

Originally Posted by Tharvendall

It is a nice idea but then they would have to implement the same stuff on all other classes, but as far as i heard we'll see some changes after HD launches and the apparent, "Freep revamp"

I'm quite happy on how it's looking right now, or maybe i've just got used to how bad it actually is, who knows..
I still wish for a tactical evade skill, and maybe something like a short sprint like freeps have, Adrenaline Rush maybe? >D

You cant evade tactical attacks. It would be a +Resist skill i think. Most BA's are kinda stupid anyway, i play a minstrel since MoM and even now you have rank 11+ BA's pop moving target as soon as they see me, without seeming to know its utterly useless.

Aug 09 2013, 01:54 PM

Tharvendall

Quote:

Originally Posted by Areya121

You cant evade tactical attacks. It would be a +Resist skill i think. Most BA's are kinda stupid anyway, i play a minstrel since MoM and even now you have rank 11+ BA's pop moving target as soon as they see me, without seeming to know its utterly useless.

Personally i've started moving MT out of my skill set, because most of the time i end up clashing with a Tactical class, and when i end up in a 1v1 against a Physical i like to keep things interesting so i try not to use Get a Grip or MT, unless things go very pear-shaped.

That would help BAs against Tactical Classes, while not making them untouchable in RvR

Evade and Resistance at the same time would be OP because:
a) Not even support classes have 30s "You can't touch me" skills and non-support classes should have weaker skills
b) While Tactical Classes can heal turtle, many physical classes need to be able to land a stun/daze to stand a chance against a MT using BA in every somewhat balanced environment

Aug 09 2013, 03:58 PM

Ghosttaker

Quote:

Originally Posted by Tharvendall

Personally i've started moving MT out of my skill set, because most of the time i end up clashing with a Tactical class, and when i end up in a 1v1 against a Physical i like to keep things interesting so i try not to use Get a Grip or MT, unless things go very pear-shaped.

So in general you do ok against physical classes in 1v1 situations?

Aug 09 2013, 03:59 PM

Ghosttaker

Quote:

Originally Posted by Gwyndor

Another idea to combat the terrible cooldown issue would be a skill that effectively resets our cooldowns. I mean why not? Freeps have this function.

Let's call it 'Urgency', on a 5m or even 10m cd would be fine. This skill will reset the cooldown of, for argument's sake, Flaming Arrow, Vital Target, Headshot, and Revenge. At the same time the inductions for all induction skills get reduced by a small amount, say 30% (like a BA version of Needful Haste). Maybe a bit overpowered in regards to resetting VT and Revenge, but even without these it would be a useful skill.

Which Freep classes have resets for their cooldowns? Do you know what the cooldown on the cooldown resets are?

Aug 09 2013, 08:06 PM

Reshi

Quote:

Originally Posted by Ghosttaker

Which Freep classes have resets for their cooldowns? Do you know what the cooldown on the cooldown resets are?

Cappies can reset their defeat response CDs with a trait for Time of Need.

Cry of the Chorus will bring minstrels back up to peak fighting shape instantly.

Not so much a reset, but Wardens get Defiant Challenge every 2 minutes with the legacy.

Champs and RKs don't need CD resets.

I may have left a couple out.

Aug 09 2013, 08:48 PM

Tharvendall

Quote:

Originally Posted by Ghosttaker

So in general you do ok against physical classes in 1v1 situations?

More or less, yeah. Depends on how lucky i am at certain moments >D

Aug 09 2013, 09:21 PM

Reshi

Quote:

Originally Posted by Ghosttaker

So in general you do ok against physical classes in 1v1 situations?

Honestly, a well-built and well-played BA should be able to take on most melee freeps easily enough. For the freeps who actually know what they're doing, however, you will hardly stand a chance. With the level of gear swapping and procs, LI modifications, rank buffs and innate class skills and traits, a top freep player should never lose to a well-played BA unless said BA slow kites like an #### (which will not work against burgs/wardens) or gets very lucky with the RNG.

This^ Except for the fire dot, 20 second duration with a 20 second cooldown seems fairly reasonable to me.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Tangaar

Some crit chance or multiplier on the second and third hits of screaming shafts would be nice too

Wouldn't be opposed to this either or possibly making it like Ferocious strikes on a champion, each hit adds damage compared to the one before it.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Tangaar

BUT if devs are willing to add a skill i would highly recommend the one i will post again below

Show No mercy!Fast
Ranged skill

When your target has less than a
half of their morale you unleash an extremely
damaging arrow with high critical chance.

1,970 Common Damage

-50% incoming healing modifierDuration: 15s

Cost: 125 power

Cooldown: 30s

This I'm going to have to disagree with but I'll show a slightly more reasonable version because I do like the idea of this skill.

When your target has less than a
half of their morale you unleash a damaging arrow with high critical chance.

970 Common Damage

-25% incoming healing modifierDuration: 15s

Cost: 125 power

Cooldown: 30s

Before you shoot it down right away, because I believe I saw you post this in another post saying that it would simply overwrite the Reaver Dev-strike buff but instead since it is a nerfed version allowing it to stack WITH the Reaver Dev-strike buff making it a solid -75% incoming healing buff against said freep. This would allow further control over the overdone freep healing and level the playing field with the freepside stacking healing debuffs. I.E Wardens, Burgs, RKs, Hunters.

Aug 13 2013, 05:50 PM

Tangaar

TBH i still stand strong to the -50%inc heal and ,1900 -+ dmg
Apart from debuff i want it to act as a chain hit with the BA finishers

Your version as you said is for raid purposes...id rather get more things for soloing tbh.Just my taste

We all know A LOT of heal nerfs will happen in the HD...thats why i wanted to see how it would go like that

Aug 13 2013, 07:10 PM

TackyFailz

Quote:

Originally Posted by Tangaar

TBH i still stand strong to the -50%inc heal and ,1900 -+ dmg
Apart from debuff i want it to act as a chain hit with the BA finishers

Your version as you said is for raid purposes...id rather get more things for soloing tbh.Just my taste

We all know A LOT of heal nerfs will happen in the HD...thats why i wanted to see how it would go like that

Though it would extremely benefit in raid purposes I actually meant it for soloing. The idea of being able to 3 shot someone after they hit half with that skill, VT/Revenge just seems in the realm of freepdom. Besides certain classes simply outhealing BAs after the burst is done the BA I feel is in a pretty solid spot.

The skill itself, would really only be noticeably useful against Minis and Water-lore spamming LMs, but in my experience if the mini actually lets me get them to half I normally have it in the bag and VS a LM if they are even moderately good while Water-lorespamming being very ANTI BA in the first place chances are you would have no shot with your version of said skill anyway.

Though if you're thinking of this skill for Helm's deep you may very well have the right idea. I haven't done much homework on it nor do I plan to put any stock into it due to the travesty the game has come to the past 2 years and the skimmed through thought of Big battles only detours me more so.

Aug 13 2013, 07:20 PM

spelunker

Quote:

Originally Posted by Tangaar

We all know A LOT of heal nerfs will happen in the HD...thats why i wanted to see how it would go like that

what makes you say this?

Aug 14 2013, 03:11 AM

Tangaar

Quote:

Originally Posted by spelunker

what makes you say this?

They said that they would revamp all freep classes from traits to treelines
Also devs said(even before HD announcement) that they wanted to make the classes having true base

Choose DPS or survivalbility

Aug 14 2013, 03:33 AM

spelunker

Quote:

Originally Posted by Tangaar

They said that they would revamp all freep classes from traits to treelines
Also devs said(even before HD announcement) that they wanted to make the classes having true base

Choose DPS or survivalbility

ehhh, thats really only two or three freep classes that will see a major impact. I thought you were suggesting overall healing capacities were going to be limited in some way, which is a far bigger issue (much as everyone loves to hate on shield wardens, WL stacking LMs, and Healspamming minis in WS).