Porn Copyright Troll's New Tactic: Maybe Public Humiliation Will Magically Make People Pay

from the well,-that's-one-strategy dept

It's no secret that the real strategy of many of the porn companies who have turned into copyright trolls is to use public shame into the game as a way to pressure people into settling. As per usual, these companies almost never follow through on actual lawsuits against people. They do just enough to get ISPs to cough up identifying information and threaten to file the lawsuit. In some cases, the threat of having to fight a lawsuit is enough to make people settle (even if they're innocent). However, often enough, it seems that the companies know that merely the possible embarrassment from publicly claiming someone downloaded porn will make them settle. It seems that one German copyright troll, Urmann and Colleagues (U+C) is skipping the legal middleman, and is just going to start posting information it's collected on people it accuses of infringement directly on its website, hoping this will create incentives to pay up, without the company having to go through any actual legal process. Of course, threatening to expose information about you unless you pay up, sure sounds an awful lot like extortion...

The article also notes that some legal experts believe that this move will violate Germany's (somewhat strict) privacy laws. Either way, U+C claims that it has a list of 150,000 people who it wants to pay up. I actually wonder if a list quite that large actually makes it counterproductive. When you're in the company of so many people, perhaps it's not quite so embarrassing... Of course, given that, perhaps it's not surprising that U+C has indicated elsewhere that it's going to be releasing the info in drips and drabs, and will be targeting those who have the most to lose if it's exposed that they were downloading hardcore porn.

According to comments an Urmann insider made to Wochenblatt, the law firm is planning to target the most vulnerable people first – those with IP addresses registered to churches, police stations and – quite unbelievably – the embassies of Arab countries.

German Privacy Laws

" It seems that one German copyright troll, Urmann and Colleagues (U+C) is skipping the legal middleman, and is just going to start posting information it's collected on people it accuses of infringement directly on its website, hoping this will create incentives to pay up, without the company having to go through any actual legal process. Of course, threatening to expose information about you unless you pay up, sure sounds an awful lot like extortion... "

Oh they are breaking FOUR major laws in Germany concerning Blackmail (public humiliation bit), Privacy Rights (Rember how the German Courts reacted to Google's street view), Liable (falsely accusing private citizens is a huge no no), and as Mike Masick rightly concluded it to be, extortion. It's not wide to do any of those 4 in Germany.

In the German Court of Law, minimum charged would amount to 50 years in prison.

Seriously?

Public humiliation? Porn is more popular and mainstream than ever. There really is no humiliation associated with it. Even celebrities like Rihanna openly admit to liking porn. Anyone who thinks there is shame or humiliation to be associated with it must be stuck in a 1950s time warp.

Re: Re: Seriously?

Re: Seriously?

To be clear, we're not talking just heterosexual porn. More than likely, the people being blackmailed here will be said to have watched hardcore homosexual or transsexual porn, or any of a dozen fetishes that would, at the very least, raise some eyebrows among your peers.

Re: Re: Seriously?

Re: Seriously?

While YOU may feel there is nothing wrong with porn, many people do (not saying I do, just saying) AND many more of THOSE people prefer to have their "public" image be that of a mainstream, conservative person....finding out about their private penchant for porn, SM, bondage, etc WOULD cause them significant embarassment....although Karma may argue they deserve it.

i personally would have thought that going after those that are relied on to bring prosecutions, the police and the courts, is not the best of ideas. hopefully, this will seriously backfire. what is desperately needed is a new law alright. one that exposes this practice for the extortion it is and then stops it dead!

Re: Re: Re: Re: Seriously?

Well, I guess I could have put it a different way. My point was that porn has become more widely accepted (and more widely available) and liking porn isn't considered as "shameful" as it once was. (Though Rikuo has a good point, one I should have made.)
And let's be honest...is there anyone here who DOESN'T like porn in one form or another? Is there anyone here who doesn't have some porn?

Re: Re: Seriously?

I THINK this is the same company in Germany that was sending notices to random claiming they owed the phone company money. It was always small amounts and reportedly many people paid them. I have one somewhere in my files, but I am to busy(lazy) to look. I sent them an email that if they could prove I owed money, I would pay. Never heard back from them.

Re:

Re: Re: Re: Re: Seriously?

Actually, I would think anyone born in the 50's would have more of a late 60's/early 70's view of porn since they would have been much too young to even think much about porn in the 50's. The parents of the 50's babies would be the one's with the 50's outlook.

IIRC and you'll have to forgive me if I misspeak, this is the Country where companies would hire lawyers to sue on the behalf of corporations who were being ripped off. Take people to court, get the settlements, and then send a tiny check to the corporation.
Then there were the filesharing shakedowns, that evolved into porn shakedowns. One of the largest firms was thrown out of court when it was revealed they tried to hide known flaws in their IP gathering tech, and then a partner lawfirm sued them for being mislead.
They then exported this game to the UK then the US.
But somewhere in the middle of this 2 more fun things happened.
1 - As was covered on Techdirt, a woman who no longer owned a computer was sued for having downloaded a movie and the court ruled on the flimsy evidence she must be guilty because this nice company said so.
2 - There was a company trying to sell of alleged "debts" owed from settlement shakedown letters that people refused to pay to debt collectors pretending they were real debts because they claimed it had to be true without needing a court.

This is what the future looks like for us. A new wave of copyright shakedown has hit the UK, after the ACS:Law fiasco someone started up again. It will get exported here and it will clog the courts with cases of dubious merit all in an attempt to keep porn producers from accepting the business changed. Their losses are not from filesharing but from the simple fact that you can record HD video on a phone, put it on a tubesite and make some serious bank if you can get a following. The days of $60 a tape porn are over, and being well known for suing people interested in your material just makes them look elsewhere for new content... who don't charge or charge much less and offer much more.

The Cartels must be crying themselves sick, seeing the porn companies able to clean up in this market and doing what the years of litigation they tried could not do.

The average porn producer gets around $200-$250ish per settlement... the average settlement is in the $3000-$3500 range. They can not see they are destroying their market completely, but sit back smug and secure in their belief they stuck it to the pirates... and it only destroyed the company faster.

"According to comments an Urmann insider made to Wochenblatt, the law firm is planning to target the most vulnerable people first – those with IP addresses registered to churches, police stations and – quite unbelievably – the embassies of Arab countries."

Re:

Re: Re:

Please answer honestly, briefly, and without attempting to deflect or distract.

1) Do you think that this amounts to "a little" public shaming, rather than life / career / relationship threatening disclosure?

It a public shaming. It may have serious consequences. Too bad that those who chose to illegally download didn't think of the consequences. But I suppose if they're adult enough to watch porn, then they're adult enough to deal with the consequences of the illegal behavior.

2) Do you honestly and whole halfheartedly support this approach?

I'm going to interpret the a wholeheartedly. Yes. Piracy apologists have done everything imaginable to prevent the enforcement of IP rights. Now your boss/mother/wife/minister is going to find out you are a law breaker and a serious fan of "Chubby White Boyz Gone Wild"

3) Especially considering there is no judicial process involved at all?
Who cares? The judicial process favors the criminal not the property owner and is not required here.

4) Since porn is ridiculously profitable, if 100% of the people getting it would pay for it, how much would the price decrease?

Who knows? Maybe it would stay the same and you'd get a decent script or production values.

Re: Re: Re: German Privacy Laws

Re: Re: German Privacy Laws

I was refering to the porn company :-) See the thing is about German Law, and unlike the US, once a ruling has been established it becomes the law. In Germany rules are rules and they must be followed. No matter what.

Re: Re: German Privacy Laws

Youre right, I'm not an expert in German law. I extrapolated the interpretation of those laws based upon the actions mentioned in the article and compared them to things that are not only against the law in Germany, but are also very severely punished.

Re: Re: Re: Re: German Privacy Laws

Re: Re: Re: German Privacy Laws

Here's the problem. It is lawful to publish names associated with lawsuits, those names are a matter of public record.

If the producer of "Oily Asses III" contacted you and said that unless you paid them $5000 they'd tell your boss (and/or the world) that you illegally downloaded it, that is unlawful. However, if the producer files a lawsuit against you for illegally downloading "Oily Asses III", then it is a matter of public record. This is called t-r-a-n-s-p-a-r-e-n-c-y. No hidden legal proceedings. It's all out there in the public where it belongs, right? Something that Techdirtbags only seem to embrace transparency when it suits them.

Re: Re: Re: Re: German Privacy Laws

First: I see there is no real reason to actually try to talk to you as you blatantly ignore the obvious. Also, you are using personal attacks trying to rebuttal mine and others' points. So I'm really not inclined to talk to you until you correct those behaviors.

Second: Notice I knew what you were by your comments...a troll. You do nothing but harrass people until they see as you do. Take a personal tip from me, and don't troll and maybe you could learn how to get a proper counterpoint.

Please keep in mind that I am only trying to help you make better at your arguments than your usual name calling. Name calling never works in a well thought put argument. If you know the answer, answer it the best to your knowledge. As it has been demonstrated below, an AC had stated his opinion without name calling and calling people out. People were inclined to help him clarify his statement for better understanding all around.

So if you really want to make a proper rebuttal, do it, but please do it without name calling (it is quite useless), and it only gets you labeled as a troll depending on how you use your name calling.

Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: German Privacy Laws

One, I'm not related to that AC

Two:

First: I see there is no real reason to actually try to talk to you as you blatantly ignore the obvious. Also, you are using personal attacks trying to rebuttal mine and others' points. So I'm really not inclined to talk to you until you correct those behaviors.

Second: Notice I knew what you were by your comments...a troll. You do nothing but harrass people until they see as you do. Take a personal tip from me, and don't troll and maybe you could learn how to get a proper counterpoint.

Please keep in mind that I am only trying to help you make better at your arguments than your usual name calling. Name calling never works in a well thought put argument. If you know the answer, answer it the best to your knowledge. As it has been demonstrated below, an AC had stated his opinion without name calling and calling people out. People were inclined to help him clarify his statement for better understanding all around.

So if you really want to make a proper rebuttal, do it, but please do it without name calling (it is quite useless), and it only gets you labeled as a troll depending on how you use your name calling.

Re: Re: Re: Re:

It is considered blackmail in Germany.

And:

First: I see there is no real reason to actually try to talk to you as you blatantly ignore the obvious. Also, you are using personal attacks trying to rebuttal mine and others' points. So I'm really not inclined to talk to you until you correct those behaviors.

Second: Notice I knew what you were by your comments...a troll. You do nothing but harrass people until they see as you do. Take a personal tip from me, and don't troll and maybe you could learn how to get a proper counterpoint.

Please keep in mind that I am only trying to help you make better at your arguments than your usual name calling. Name calling never works in a well thought out argument. If you know the answer, answer it the best to your knowledge. As it has been demonstrated below, an AC had stated his opinion without name calling and calling people out. People were inclined to help him clarify his statement for better understanding all around.

So if you really want to make a proper rebuttal, do it, but please do it without name calling (it is quite useless), and it only gets you labeled as a troll depending on how you use your name calling.

Re: Why are people pirating porn anyway?

Because, as you surely know, "piracy" is not easy to tell. I mean, people download lots of porn files from random sources. If you think they know (or care) whether they are "pireted" or just "free" you're badly wrong.

Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Seriously?

how this is possible...

I think you should add some more information about how this threat is legally possible in Germany:
U+C most probably don't plan to claim that someone, say Max Mustermann, has illegally downloaded porn, all they are going to do is to publish a list of their legal opponents. But as this law firm has specialized in copyright infringement and its clients mainly are porn companies, you can guess what it means that Max Mustermann is their opponent...
Publishing a list of legal opponents has been ruled to be allowed for self-advertising - using this as a threat against opponents has never been intended by politicians or courts.
I think this makes it even harder to fight against false accusations - because even if a court rules that Max Mustermann is innocent, Max Mustermann still has been a legal opponent of U+C.

Re: Re: Re:

I have no data to back me up, but from the tons of free legal sources of porn out there, it's my gut feeling that the decimation of the industry has - at least to some not-insignificant-extent - been at the hands of amateur porn. Another source of problems probably comes at hands of the porn companies' own marketing efforts. Let's face it, the only way to market this product is to give out free samples. Collect enough free samples, and you no longer need the product. Ever eat lunch at a Costco before?

Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Seriously?

Hello proxy/sock puppet AC

First: I see there is no real reason to actually try to talk to you as you blatantly ignore the obvious. Also, you are using personal attacks trying to rebuttal mine and others' points. So I'm really not inclined to talk to you until you correct those behaviors.

Second: Notice I knew what you were by your comments...a troll. You do nothing but harrass people until they see as you do. Take a personal tip from me, and don't troll and maybe you could learn how to get a proper counterpoint.

Please keep in mind that I am only trying to help you make better at your arguments than your usual name calling. Derp Trolling never works in a well thought out argument like this. If you know the answer, answer it the best to your knowledge. As it has been demonstrated below, an AC had stated his opinion without name calling and calling people out. People were inclined to help him clarify his statement for better understanding all around.

So if you really want to make a comment don't derp troll. It makes you easier to point to as a butthurt troll.

Extortion

I see that nobody has realised what is happening yet, everyone knows it is illegal to do what they say they are going to do, they have lawyers that will have told them it is not possible and that they will probably end up in jail if they release even one persons details.
This is just a weak threat to all of those they are sending letters to, it is something they hope will encourage people to pay up without a fight or even any court interference. If this is said in a letter to just one of those accused they would be in court so fast there heads would spin, so they release this story and use the public outcry to make those people they are conning pay up and Techdirt and many other sites are helping them by publishing this story.

Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: German Privacy Laws

I admit that the sentencing in years of prison time was pulled out of my arse there, but I did ask a friend about it whose father recently gained US citizenship to the US. He told me (in his heavy German accent) that blackmail in Germany, is very illegal.

As for the AC's tramspersncy argument....in spite of the fact it can be revealed to the public is irrelevant because the porn company won't release it if they get what they want....hence extortion and blackmail. I am no expert, but I do know that extortion blackmail is illegal in Germany and is severely punished.

Inspect Porn

Here is a $50,000 idea for one of you entrepreneurs (did I get that spelled correctly?) out there. As I was sitting in my yard, watching box elder bugs (there are insects, folks) hook up (back-to-back... ususally) and vigorously pursue what must be ecstacy for bugs, I was thinking that if people actually paid $1 a click on some guys web site to watch a a cartoon cow moo, then surely these same folks would watch the work of an enterprising young drop-out with an average video cam making short clips of insects going about the propagation of their kind. Just a thought.

If Julian "I didn't rape those girls" Assange published this list on Wikileaks as some sort of secret document, you would be praising him for it. You would even praise him if he used the existance of the document to blackmail people on the list to donating to the cause or otherwise unblocking funding - say he found the christian CEO of a credit card or payment company on that list.

Deja vu?

Re:

The difference is that Assange hasn't threatened to release lists of names that embarrass people if he doesn't get what he wants. He just releases documents from government documents. Although a lot of the stuff he has released is questionable on whether he should have let it be, he hadn't dangled it in front of the politicians' faces to gain a profit or to recover from a poor business model.