I've had my doubts/suspicions about certain players being multis but never bothered to file a C&A report against them because I honestly figured they would be too shifty to get caught. I thought back to instances where players would come up with a story(true or fabricated?) about how it was all just a big misunderstanding and they were simply housemates, brothers, etc..

My point is that couldn't any person caught with multiple accounts use the "flatmate" excuse or the "ignorance plea" regarding sitting if they were convincing enough? A lot of multi accounts get busted because they deny it and of course when the evidence is provided it's an open and shut case but those accounts that come up with an excuse that wouldn't fool a 4th grade schoolteacher, they get off the hook.

I suppose I might start a suggestion regarding a way to prevent a person with a good story having a better chance of beating a C&A than a person who pleads the 5th, ect, but those types of suggestions tend to be flooded by cronies of the people who have gotten away with this sort of thing and show an arguably falsely negative response. It seems to me like a no-brainer that if you're flatmates/brothers using the same IP that you would check with CC before you start logging from the same computer, not after you get accused of being a multi, especially if the veteran person sharing the computer is all too familiar with the site's policy on multis.

Funkyterrance wrote:I've had my doubts/suspicions about certain players being multis but never bothered to file a C&A report against them because I honestly figured they would be too shifty to get caught. I thought back to instances where players would come up with a story(true or fabricated?) about how it was all just a big misunderstanding and they were simply housemates, brothers, etc..

My point is that couldn't any person caught with multiple accounts use the "flatmate" excuse or the "ignorance plea" regarding sitting if they were convincing enough? A lot of multi accounts get busted because they deny it and of course when the evidence is provided it's an open and shut case but those accounts that come up with an excuse that wouldn't fool a 4th grade schoolteacher, they get off the hook.

I suppose I might start a suggestion regarding a way to prevent a person with a good story having a better chance of beating a C&A than a person who pleads the 5th, ect, but those types of suggestions tend to be flooded by cronies of the people who have gotten away with this sort of thing and show an arguably falsely negative response. It seems to me like a no-brainer that if you're flatmates/brothers using the same IP that you would check with CC before you start logging from the same computer, not after you get accused of being a multi, especially if the veteran person sharing the computer is all too familiar with the site's policy on multis.

If you know or suspect someone to be a multi and fail to report it, don't you think that is a disservice to the community as a whole? Do you not see yourself as complicit in their behavior? REPORT them all. I haven't had a good read in those threads in a while!!!!! It's not like you have to apologize if you are wrong or anything

SaMejoHn wrote: If you know or suspect someone to be a multi and fail to report it, don't you think that is a disservice to the community as a whole? Do you not see yourself as complicit in their behavior?

I think this all depends.It depends on how well-liked the person is, how willing they are to lie and how much proof you have. How many C&A reports are filled with people outraged that someone has reported their long time friend for something they couldn't possibly have done? It seems like it's ok to report a noob cook but just don't report anyone with any sort of reputation on the site or you are going to get flamed the hell out. I'm as anti-cheater as the next guy, if not more, but I'd rather have a system where I don't have to publicly call someone out and suffer the consequences.

SaMejoHn wrote: If you know or suspect someone to be a multi and fail to report it, don't you think that is a disservice to the community as a whole? Do you not see yourself as complicit in their behavior?

I think this all depends.It depends on how well-liked the person is, how willing they are to lie and how much proof you have. How many C&A reports are filled with people outraged that someone has reported their long time friend for something they couldn't possibly have done? It seems like it's ok to report a noob cook but just don't report anyone with any sort of reputation on the site or you are going to get flamed the hell out. I'm as anti-cheater as the next guy, if not more, but I'd rather have a system where I don't have to publicly call someone out and suffer the consequences.

I hate that too. lol i remember this guy accused some clan mates of mine of sd. Now, as the thread went on it became painfully clear he was just mad at losing a high game. Now of course I read all of this and refrained from commenting and read silently. Now same guy writes another report with no new evidence and i could not help but comment. So i ask "havent you learned from last accusation" or something of that nature. Then i was attacked by the notorious troll "gillipig" because ,i, someone who never post in c&a suddenly pops up to defend his clannie. Never mind the fact that my clan is so big that both myself and sirjohn13 had not made each others' acquaintances prior to Gillipig informing us that we are in the same clan. so it goes both ways, i posted in annoyance of someone wasting C&A mods time rather than from an unconditional defense of a clan member yet i've seen what you are referring to numerous times when the accuser is badgered because the accused is a friend. But really all that is unavoidable, don't think much can be done about it.

SaMejoHn wrote: I hate that too. lol i remember this guy accused some clan mates of mine of sd. Now, as the thread went on it became painfully clear he was just mad at losing a high game. Now of course I read all of this and refrained from commenting and read silently. Now same guy writes another report with no new evidence and i could not help but comment. So i ask "havent you learned from last accusation" or something of that nature. Then i was attacked by the notorious troll "gillipig" because ,i, someone who never post in c&a suddenly pops up to defend his clannie. Never mind the fact that my clan is so big that both myself and sirjohn13 had not made each others' acquaintances prior to Gillipig informing us that we are in the same clan. so it goes both ways, i posted in annoyance of someone wasting C&A mods time rather than from an unconditional defense of a clan member yet i've seen what you are referring to numerous times when the accuser is badgered because the accused is a friend. But really all that is unavoidable, don't think much can be done about it.

Yes, very true that it works both ways. I can see your point.

I'm wondering, hypothetically, what would happen if every multi were clever enough to just claim that their housemate was playing from the same IP? I also think that giving the benefit of the doubt to one player while not to the other simply because the first player is more clever is a conundrum of sorts. Makes one think that maybe people who have C&A cases against them should be appointed CC lawyers if they cannot "afford" to defend themselves.

you can't catch em all....so I am never surprised when it doesn't go my way or the way everyone thought. I read just about every post in the c and a, but don't comment often because I am not involved in many. Sometimes I wished they would hold new posters hands through the process because if they make a badly worded post with a lot of ambiguity the report is never followed up on and the player feels like they were the idiot for even trying.

jsnyder748 wrote:Sometimes I wished they would hold new posters hands through the process because if they make a badly worded post with a lot of ambiguity the report is never followed up on and the player feels like they were the idiot for even trying.

Yeah, this is the sort of thing I was referring to in my lawyer comment only from the defense instead of the offense.

If a new player knew their "rights" a little better, they would have the same chance as a more experienced player of getting off the hook which I think is only fair. The newbies tend to get ripped to shreds while the older/more experienced players who really should know better tend to get off more lightly. It seems a little backwards.

SaMejoHn wrote: If you know or suspect someone to be a multi and fail to report it, don't you think that is a disservice to the community as a whole? Do you not see yourself as complicit in their behavior?

I think this all depends.It depends on how well-liked the person is, how willing they are to lie and how much proof you have. How many C&A reports are filled with people outraged that someone has reported their long time friend for something they couldn't possibly have done? It seems like it's ok to report a noob cook but just don't report anyone with any sort of reputation on the site or you are going to get flamed the hell out. I'm as anti-cheater as the next guy, if not more, but I'd rather have a system where I don't have to publicly call someone out and suffer the consequences.

I think the process is pretty straight forward but it is like the directions for putting a bike together, nobody reads them.

[quote="snyder748]because if they make a badly worded post with a lot of ambiguity the report is never followed up on and the player feels like they were the idiot for even trying.[/quote]

I have asked many time for more information on SD cases and I get answers like, look at the number of games the play together, they are from the same country. Shouldn't the accuser provide some reasoning behind their accusation when it involves SD?

Evil Semp wrote:I think the process is pretty straight forward but it is like the directions for putting a bike together, nobody reads them.

LOL.I don't think I realized you could just PM someone, ES. That definitely will affect my reporting of those "borderline" cases in the futre. Thanks.

Please don't copy and paste the whole scoreboard. At least leave your name and mine off the list.

haha ^^ oh, im on the scoreboard

I know you try to help them ES and there is only so much you can do. It must be frustrating to get 2-3 dumb posts a day that make no sense from people who don't know whats going on. And like you said people don't even take the time to read how to post....I mean...when you click "post" it gives you the exact format and tells you what to do yet people still don't get it.

You know what a person seems like when they appear to be obsessed with identifying the mechanisms of cheating, delusionally paranoid about the edge-case cheating potential in every site rule or ruling, and fanatically zealous about accusing anyone and everyone of being a cheater?

They seem like they might be a closet cheater, or at least looking to learn the ropes.

Foxglove wrote:You know what a person seems like when they appear to be obsessed with identifying the mechanisms of cheating, delusionally paranoid about the edge-case cheating potential in every site rule or ruling, and fanatically zealous about accusing anyone and everyone of being a cheater?

They seem like they might be a closet cheater, or at least looking to learn the ropes.

You can PM any of us on the MH team. We have all received PMs outside of cases and look into them. You can PM us if you have questions about procedure, if you are not sure if a situation is cheating but want to double, check, anything really.

deathcomesrippin wrote:You can PM any of us on the MH team. We have all received PMs outside of cases and look into them. You can PM us if you have questions about procedure, if you are not sure if a situation is cheating but want to double, check, anything really.