Lsherm:BarkingUnicorn: ''We think it is better for the congregation to provide the funding, if a brother has no independent means, than for you, the public, to pay through Legal Aid.''

Well, if those are the only two alternatives, I agree. Let the taxpayers off the hook if they were on it.

Yeah, they get a defense either way, but only one way means the church has to pay for it.

Every nun and monk is on some form of dole. One of the first things I learned in the monastery. The moment you enter, you are signed up for medicaid, at the very least. Monasteries don't buy insurance, and the monks and nuns have no visible means of support. Taxpayers are on the hook every day for those leeches.

Meanwhile, the monasteries rake in tons of cash from well-meaning but gullible Catholics.

Benevolent Misanthrope:Lsherm: BarkingUnicorn: ''We think it is better for the congregation to provide the funding, if a brother has no independent means, than for you, the public, to pay through Legal Aid.''

Well, if those are the only two alternatives, I agree. Let the taxpayers off the hook if they were on it.

Yeah, they get a defense either way, but only one way means the church has to pay for it.

Every nun and monk is on some form of dole. One of the first things I learned in the monastery. The moment you enter, you are signed up for medicaid, at the very least. Monasteries don't buy insurance, and the monks and nuns have no visible means of support. Taxpayers are on the hook every day for those leeches.

Meanwhile, the monasteries rake in tons of cash from well-meaning but gullible Catholics.

Lsherm:Benevolent Misanthrope: Lsherm: BarkingUnicorn: ''We think it is better for the congregation to provide the funding, if a brother has no independent means, than for you, the public, to pay through Legal Aid.''

Well, if those are the only two alternatives, I agree. Let the taxpayers off the hook if they were on it.

Yeah, they get a defense either way, but only one way means the church has to pay for it.

Every nun and monk is on some form of dole. One of the first things I learned in the monastery. The moment you enter, you are signed up for medicaid, at the very least. Monasteries don't buy insurance, and the monks and nuns have no visible means of support. Taxpayers are on the hook every day for those leeches.

Meanwhile, the monasteries rake in tons of cash from well-meaning but gullible Catholics.

Monasteries are signing up women now?

Yes. Women's cloistered contemplative communities are calling themselves monasteries now. "Convent" is outdated. "Monk" is also a unisex term, at least among those in monasteries.

Benevolent Misanthrope:Lsherm: Benevolent Misanthrope: Lsherm: BarkingUnicorn: ''We think it is better for the congregation to provide the funding, if a brother has no independent means, than for you, the public, to pay through Legal Aid.''

Well, if those are the only two alternatives, I agree. Let the taxpayers off the hook if they were on it.

Yeah, they get a defense either way, but only one way means the church has to pay for it.

Every nun and monk is on some form of dole. One of the first things I learned in the monastery. The moment you enter, you are signed up for medicaid, at the very least. Monasteries don't buy insurance, and the monks and nuns have no visible means of support. Taxpayers are on the hook every day for those leeches.

Meanwhile, the monasteries rake in tons of cash from well-meaning but gullible Catholics.

Monasteries are signing up women now?

Yes. Women's cloistered contemplative communities are calling themselves monasteries now. "Convent" is outdated. "Monk" is also a unisex term, at least among those in monasteries.

Huh, didn't know that. My aunt is a nun, but she still uses convent. However, she's also 82, so maybe it's a generational thing.

Lsherm:Benevolent Misanthrope: Lsherm: Benevolent Misanthrope: Lsherm: BarkingUnicorn: ''We think it is better for the congregation to provide the funding, if a brother has no independent means, than for you, the public, to pay through Legal Aid.''

Well, if those are the only two alternatives, I agree. Let the taxpayers off the hook if they were on it.

Yeah, they get a defense either way, but only one way means the church has to pay for it.

Every nun and monk is on some form of dole. One of the first things I learned in the monastery. The moment you enter, you are signed up for medicaid, at the very least. Monasteries don't buy insurance, and the monks and nuns have no visible means of support. Taxpayers are on the hook every day for those leeches.

Meanwhile, the monasteries rake in tons of cash from well-meaning but gullible Catholics.

Monasteries are signing up women now?

Yes. Women's cloistered contemplative communities are calling themselves monasteries now. "Convent" is outdated. "Monk" is also a unisex term, at least among those in monasteries.

Huh, didn't know that. My aunt is a nun, but she still uses convent. However, she's also 82, so maybe it's a generational thing.

Quite possibly. It's definitely a post-Vatican II thing, and IIRC very recent (by monastic standards, like 10 years or so). It could also be a matter of which order - I know the Trappistines do it, and other Benedictines I met... but come to think of it, I think I saw some Dominicans who still use "convent". Of course, some of them may also use "convent" with seculars, since that's the term used outside of the monastery. It's a complex set of social rules.

Mugato:It's one thing to be religious and believe...whatever but how do you people actually give money to the Catholic Church?

It's like paying taxes - some of it goes to good stuff, some of it bad. In the long run, I like to believe the majority of it goes to the good stuff.

Also, Catholic churches (at least the ones I've been a member of) sometimes take up two collections in mass - one for the parish, which sends part of the funds to the Vatican, and another for a specific charitable order, which uses the money for charity. So if you have a beef with the church government you can avoid giving to it if you want to.

Benevolent Misanthrope:Every nun and monk is on some form of dole. One of the first things I learned in the monastery. The moment you enter, you are signed up for medicaid, at the very least. Monasteries don't buy insurance, and the monks and nuns have no visible means of support. Taxpayers are on the hook every day for those leeches.

I've also heard, from multiple sources, that Hasidic Jews are almost all on government assistance because they spend their time studying the Torah, Talmud, and other Jewish literature. And yet oddly enough, religious people taking advantage of the system to spend their time in religious activities is never discussed when the concept of "welfare reform" comes up.

Sudo_Make_Me_A_Sandwich:Benevolent Misanthrope: Every nun and monk is on some form of dole. One of the first things I learned in the monastery. The moment you enter, you are signed up for medicaid, at the very least. Monasteries don't buy insurance, and the monks and nuns have no visible means of support. Taxpayers are on the hook every day for those leeches.

I've also heard, from multiple sources, that Hasidic Jews are almost all on government assistance because they spend their time studying the Torah, Talmud, and other Jewish literature. And yet oddly enough, religious people taking advantage of the system to spend their time in religious activities is never discussed when the concept of "welfare reform" comes up.

Very strange.

Not really. No one is going to go after the nuns - there's that whole "anything done in the name of Christianity is good" thing. And outside of New York, there aren't many Hasidim.

google the huge dollars the roman catholic church has spent worldwide directly due to child abuse. the amount is staggering. and if your local diocese needs a new roof or money to feed the school children it's too bad, raise the funds yourself. if there really is a heaven and a hell boy howdy a lot of church people have got a horrible eternity coming their way.

Hmmm..the clergy defending the men who have already been tried and convicted, and are up on new charges...hmm...seems to me that they might have some dirt on people above them in the church, and the dirty ones feel they have to keep shelling out cash to protect themselves. But who knows, it's all pretty sick.

AverageAmericanGuy:The reluctance of the Obama administration to go after these priests and put them away for a long time is saddening.

How many more boys will need to be raped before our government takes steps to solve this issue?

/Seriously, what do you want the administration to do? The Catholic church is a powerful state unto itself, with tons of cash, lobbyists, and connections in the house, senate, and pretty much all levels of the US government. They have too many God fearing powerful people on their side to do anything. So actively going against the church is like taking on Social Security, which is like grabbing the third rail. You touch it , you die. Political suicide.

Given how horrible it would be to be falsely accused of molesting children, I think the Church has the duty to its priests to ensure they have a competent defence, and their money can buy much better lawyers than the priest would get on legal aid. And this includes appealing decisions until they are exhausted.

However, once the priest has been convicted on on charge and they're now defending second, third or fourth charges, then yes, the church really should be stepping aside.

Lsherm:Farxist Marxist: I'm looking forward to the day that I read about a priest being killed by an irate parent/sibling/parishioner/cop whoever. Perhaps a symbolic upside-down crucifixion.

Here you go:

Link

Not death, but a good ass-beating:

Link

Feel better? Is your sense of justice avenged?

And St. Peter was crucified upside-down. It's symbolic of a religious sacrifice, not a punishment.

Why the hell would or should it be until every single pedo priest AND the farking crime aiding and abetting Vatican are made to answer for their disgusting crimes??!! What a piece of shiat question to ask.

Bit'O'Gristle:AverageAmericanGuy: The reluctance of the Obama administration to go after these priests and put them away for a long time is saddening.

How many more boys will need to be raped before our government takes steps to solve this issue?

/Seriously, what do you want the administration to do? The Catholic church is a powerful state unto itself, with tons of cash, lobbyists, and connections in the house, senate, and pretty much all levels of the US government. They have too many God fearing powerful people on their side to do anything. So actively going against the church is like taking on Social Security, which is like grabbing the third rail. You touch it , you die. Political suicide.

Around here (Australia), not so much. The prime minister (that's "president" to you yanks) has just announced a sweeping public enquiry into sexual abuse in the church, with strong bi-partisan support - which is a surprisingly good result, considering that the leader of the opposition attended a Jesuit school and actually entered a seminary to study for the priesthood prior to taking up politics: Link

/I guess now we need to see if she is serious enough to appoint a commissioner who will get the job done rather than just aiding and abetting the existing cover-up to protect their political colleagues...

ansius:Given how horrible it would be to be falsely accused of molesting children, I think the Church has the duty to its priests to ensure they have a competent defence, and their money can buy much better lawyers than the priest would get on legal aid. And this includes appealing decisions until they are exhausted.

However, once the priest has been convicted on on charge and they're now defending second, third or fourth charges, then yes, the church really should be stepping aside.

As an aside though, the Cardinal in Australia, George Pell, has been quoted as saying that abortion is a greater crime than child molestation.

Ah, crap, here we go again. Contraception, abortion, the death penalty and euthanasia are all against God's will for an individual. Pedophilia and other affairs by priests violate the vow of Chasity, and they (by Church law) should be defrocked and excommunicated. Why these people are protected by the Church, I have no justification.

fusillade762:Marcus Aurelius: Best has had at least five court battles funded by the Christian Brothers dating back to 1996, including multiple trials on multiple counts of indecent assault and buggery

I'd love to be a part of an organization that continues to care for me and fight for my well-being, even after I've done something wrong in reality or in the judgment of a court. Not sure why this is a rallying cry against Catholic leadership. It is possible to be wholeheartedly against sexual crimes whilst caring for the brothers who have been accused or who have gone astray. That may include legal counsel.

Not that I believe these people are all or even mostly innocent, or that the only motivation behind providing defense is the care for the brethren. It might just be grandstanding or firewalling or PR work.

Not that being married is a guarantee against pedophilia, but I think many of us have the sense that married priests are going to become increasingly common, especially because parishioners will be more likely to trust them.

Eve L. Koont:Why the hell would or should it be until every single pedo priest AND the farking crime aiding and abetting Vatican are made to answer for their disgusting crimes??!! What a piece of shiat question to ask.

BoxOfBees:I'd love to be a part of an organization that continues to care for me and fight for my well-being, even after I've done something wrong in reality or in the judgment of a court. Not sure why this is a rallying cry against Catholic leadership. It is possible to be wholeheartedly against sexual crimes whilst caring for the brothers who have been accused or who have gone astray. That may include legal counsel.

Not that I believe these people are all or even mostly innocent, or that the only motivation behind providing defense is the care for the brethren. It might just be grandstanding or firewalling or PR work.

Not that being married is a guarantee against pedophilia, but I think many of us have the sense that married priests are going to become increasingly common, especially because parishioners will be more likely to trust them.

/not Roman Catholic. yet.

Well, married clergy will eventually happen, one thing that Martin Luther was right about. A lot of Church services are carried about with Deacons, who are allowed to be married, But a priest breaking his vows? That's a different story.

simplicimus:Ah, crap, here we go again. Contraception, abortion, the death penalty and euthanasia are all against God's will for an individual my personal religious beliefs. Pedophilia and other affairs by priests violate the vow of Chasity, and they (by Church law) should be defrocked and excommunicated. Why these people are protected by the Church, I have no justification.

I happen to think God LOVES contraception and euthanasia. And I think She's at least ok with abortion, if not a big fan.

Why is your interpretation of God's will (or Ratzinger's interpretation) any more valid than my own? By what argument would you convince a rational, impartial party to agree with your views instead of mine?

Or did you simply forget to preface your statement with "The official Catholic position is that ...."?