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As far as I can tell, the "standard" edition of C.P.E. Bach's "Essay on the True Art of Playing Keyboard Instruments" (the Mitchell translation) is still under copyright, but I'm curious if there's some other public domain translation in existence somewhere online.

This page supposedly has a free-download button. It didn't work for me, but it might for you. (It seems I just don't have a needed 'plug-in.')

That just links to the Mitchell translation, which the OP said was under copyright. Don't worry, Mark: You're not really missing an important plugin. Everything about that page, from "Download the Password" to "Just Complete a Survey, Win Free Books," screams SCAM.

kcostell, I looked for a while, and I couldn't find one. Is it possible that Mitchell's is the first English translation? imslp has the original German and a French translation.

I have the Norton edition of this book in paperback, but I don't remember paying $53.00 for it, as I see it listed on Barnes and Amazon. Maybe I have just mercifully forgotten.

There is the public library; there are inter-library loans. All, free of charge, except that you have to give the books back. They could make the obstacles in your path melt away, like snow in July.

Let's face it, building a music library costs some bucks--- but who can deny that the wisdom of C.P.E Bach is worth that much sticker shock, and maybe more.

Secondhand bookstores could relieve your purse of some of its distress. They can also surprise the browser with some excellent works which are now out of print. Quite a few appear never to have been opened. (Not mine--- I get my money's worth out of them, even if it comes to the point of scotch tape).

Some of these days, I would like to find a bookstore which specializes in music: books, scores, and CDs. A pipedream, I suppose.

Some of these days, I would like to find a bookstore which specializes in music: books, scores, and CDs. A pipedream, I suppose.

It just so happens that many such bookstores exist, one of the most famous being the Juilliard Bookstore, towards which a larger percentage of my income goes than I'd probably care to find out. I'm sure that you can find one in your area, or if not, you can always order things online from Juilliard.

That's my point. Nobody seems to have checked out whether or not this or any translation is under a valid copyright.

No, we have different points.

Mitchell's translation is from 1948, which is modern for a work written in the mid-18th century. I'm perfectly willing to believe that this translation is still under copyright. My question is: where are the previous English translations?

laguna_greg
1000 Post Club Member
Registered: 04/02/13
Posts: 1505
Loc: guess where in CA and WA

You're right, there must be other earlier translations available. Even still, copyright endures for the life of the author + 50 years. When did the translator die? If he passed before the mid-60s, you're in luck.

laguna_greg
1000 Post Club Member
Registered: 04/02/13
Posts: 1505
Loc: guess where in CA and WA

Hi B,

I read it for the first about 35 years ago.

Please let me gently correct you. Everybody refers to this book, even singers. My first piano teacher had me read the chapters on ornaments when I did my first Bach suite. It was discussed at length during a class I took on harpsichord literature and performance in college.

I thought the OP might actually try to get sections of it to use somehow.

BDB:The Bach Versuch is quite useful for people who want to play music that was written 200 or so years ago. Reading treatises written last year on music from the classical period to the present day will not help anyone play any music of the Baroque and Galant period.

As for your comment about learning German, presumably you yourself read everything of interest in the original language?

I am sure that there are a great many treatises written recently that would give them more useful to most people playing music of the Baroque and Galant period today than their own efforts trying to understand the literature of that period. Even among the tiny minority of people who play any of that music, I would suspect that very few read any literature about it, though. It would take rather dogged determination to slog through any 200 year old technical German treatise even in translation. People who do read it today do not read it for the reasons that Bach would have expected the people who were reading it then to have had. Bach was writing for the wannabe Beyonces and Lady Gagas of his time, who are decidedly not the people who read it today.

I can afford to buy a translation if I am interested enough to read something in a language that I do not know. I was curious enough about that book to buy a copy years ago when it showed up at a used book store. My skills with foreign languages are not as sharp as I might like, but I do have a little familiarity with some of them, including German. If I were a scholar in early 18th century music, though, I would want to be better at the German of that time, and the French, Italian, and English as well.

laguna_greg
1000 Post Club Member
Registered: 04/02/13
Posts: 1505
Loc: guess where in CA and WA

Hi B,

I think we wouldn't agree about who is actually a singer. Beyonce has a lovely voice but doesn't sing all that well or seriously. Lady Gaga has no voice and is no singer at all, and so the comparison is not apt.

BDB:The Bach Versuch is quite useful for people who want to play music that was written 200 or so years ago. Reading treatises written last year on music from the classical period to the present day will not help anyone play any music of the Baroque and Galant period.

As for your comment about learning German, presumably you yourself read everything of interest in the original language?

I have the impression that there are some relatively recent books on Baroque performance practice. I don't think the Bach is the only source of information available for those who are interested in the subject.

That's my point. Nobody seems to have checked out whether or not this or any translation is under a valid copyright.

No, we have different points.

Mitchell's translation is from 1948, which is modern for a work written in the mid-18th century. I'm perfectly willing to believe that this translation is still under copyright. My question is: where are the previous English translations?

I thought I had posted something about this, but something happened to my post and it got lost.

In a review of the Mitchell translation I found in a musicological journal (from shortly after the translation was published), it said it was the first complete English translation.

People need to remember that the HIP thing really got going in earnest around the middle of the 20th century, and so finding translations of source materials from before that time is going to be hit and miss.

Mark_C
Yikes! 10000 Post Club Member
Registered: 11/11/09
Posts: 20004
Loc: New York

Originally Posted By: BDB

I think that you and I have different understanding of "everybody". I doubt that singers like Lady Gaga or Beyonce have ever referred to it.....

If anything you understate it. Relatively few people have ever referred to it -- pianists, singers, whatever.

Presumably he didn't mean "everybody" literally, so I'm not complaining that it's not literally accurate. But it's not close.

I'm a very serious pianist who has studied music and pianism way more than the average bear .....and I've never referred to it (and have never seen it). The only way I know anything of what's in there is that I've seen portions quoted occasionally, including a couple of times on this site. BTW I don't disagree that it's a historically significant work.

laguna_greg
1000 Post Club Member
Registered: 04/02/13
Posts: 1505
Loc: guess where in CA and WA

Originally Posted By: wr

Originally Posted By: sandalholme

BDB:The Bach Versuch is quite useful for people who want to play music that was written 200 or so years ago. Reading treatises written last year on music from the classical period to the present day will not help anyone play any music of the Baroque and Galant period.

As for your comment about learning German, presumably you yourself read everything of interest in the original language?

I have the impression that there are some relatively recent books on Baroque performance practice. I don't think the Bach is the only source of information available for those who are interested in the subject.

Hi Wr,

That's very true. And those more contemporary works all reference C.P.E. Bach and his essay.

laguna_greg
1000 Post Club Member
Registered: 04/02/13
Posts: 1505
Loc: guess where in CA and WA

Hi BDB,

"Even among the tiny minority of people who play any of that music, I would suspect that very few read any literature about it, though. It would take rather dogged determination to slog through any 200 year old technical German treatise even in translation."

That "minority" is not so tiny, considering just how many other works use this essay as a source, and how many people play or listen to Bach in the world.

Look, if you want to justify your willful ignorance on this count by not picking up a book which you seem very proud not to have read, have at it. I guess playing music of this period is not important to you. Your disdain for such an effort is very well expressed.

But you're not impressing me or anyone. And it's not charming.

And don't compare the Bach family to Lady Gaga. Comparing one of the great seminal geniuses of the last 1,000 years of European Art music to idiots who can't sing, and wear cone bras and panty sets to sell tickets, shows that your opinion is worthless.

BDB:The Bach Versuch is quite useful for people who want to play music that was written 200 or so years ago. Reading treatises written last year on music from the classical period to the present day will not help anyone play any music of the Baroque and Galant period.

As for your comment about learning German, presumably you yourself read everything of interest in the original language?

I have the impression that there are some relatively recent books on Baroque performance practice. I don't think the Bach is the only source of information available for those who are interested in the subject.

That's very true. And those more contemporary works all reference C.P.E. Bach and his essay.

Of course. And they reference other material as well, which provides a broader outlook than a single source can.