Yes, I know. I'm planning a post on it. He's right that the mesorah from antiquity is that the world is 5770 years old. However, the mesorah from antiquity is also that the earth is stationary, the heavens are a dome, and the kidneys make decisions.

Eilu v'eilu. Most people are bothered by the science questions. More educated people are bothered by DH etc.

With regard to the archeology project - I read one of the books in manuscript a few years back. It was appalling. I'm afraid that this project is not going to be convincing to people who are intellectually honest and have a good understanding of this topic.

"Intellectually honest" in this context usually means one thing:Not being capable of suspending the (often pre-mature)judgment of human investigation for the authority of Jewish tradition.That is the essence of ALL conflicts of Modern Scholarship with Traditional Judaism.

For a comprehensive critique of Heifetz, see these articles on talkreason (fair warning: They are from an anti-Orthodox site)-http://www.talkreason.org/articles/fixing1.cfmhttp://www.talkreason.org/articles/fixing2.cfm

For a more successful attempt see "Jewish History in Conflict: A Study of the Major Discrepancy Between Rabbinic and Conventional Chronology" by Mitchell First.

See the following letter to the Hakirah Journal, by the aforementioned author, found here (pages 22-23):http://www.hakirah.org/Vol%204%20Letters.pdf

To quote, "All of this suggests that what we have in Seder Olam is not a purposeful rearrangement of conventional chronology, but an erroneous chronology by R. Yose based on insufficient sources: the limited data provided in the Bible and insufficient other sources."

I'm having second thoughts about treating the teaching about the kidneys literally. When the Torah taught that one should "not follow his heart," is that to be taken literally? Why take literally the teaching about the kidneys, but not about the heart?

I'm not sure why we're treating R' Schwab's words as gospel. It is well known that Rav Schwab was heavily influenced by, and was attracted to, Eastern European Judaism, which generally speaking is less rationalist than Western European Judaism.

Have you seen the Sichas Chullin on this? IIRC, he brings contradictions to the pesukim from Zohar and elsewhere; he says that that the heart is the seat of spiritual feelings, and the mind, physical thought.

R. Kellner states that:"On God's existence, the creation of the cosmos, Sinaitic revelation, providence, prophecy, miracles, efficacy of prayer, the special relationship of God to the Jewish people, divine reward and punishment, etc., science seems to have little definite to say to us, and it appears to me, is not likely to have much to say in the foreseeable future."

Science needs a falsifiable hypothesis in order to be able to function. What Kellner is saying is that many of Torah's hypotheses have been falsified. As they become falsified, we are to interpret these passages and thoughts as metaphorical. This is a practical and utilitarian approach.

An important question of our times is: Since many of Torah's falsifiable claims HAVE been falsified, to what level should we depend on Torah's unfalsifiable claims [such as most of those listed in the above quotation].

Or, for that matter, what's to be made of "historical" material that can be falsified through the discovery of valid "witnesses" [ancient documents, textual analysis, and so on].

It seems to me that R. Kellner makes an unreasoned leap of faith in his assertions that one must not question the literal nature of the revelation of Torah and prophecy in order to live the observant life [as I interpret him doing in "Must A Jew Have To Believe Anything"].Sincerely,Gary Goldwater

I tend to doubt that Professor Kellner would be pleased to be referred to as "Rabbi" (which is what I assume the R. stands for), even if he does have smicha. I could be wrong, but that is my feeling as someone who knows him personally.

Why did Rabbi Schwab change his position re Seder Olam and the "missing" 150 years. He originally gave reasons for the missing time such as it was left out on purpose to confuse the interpretation of Daniel

What do charedi rabbinic leaders have to say about the problem of poverty in the charedi community? David Lichtenstein has a radio show in...

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