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Thursday, December 3, 2015

Please do not be deceived by political correctness! Allah is a demon and Muhammad was a bloodthirsty, demon-possessed warlord. Islam is not a religion of peace! It's the religion of tyranny, dividing humanity into either the House of Islam (those subject to Islam) and the House of War (those who must be subjugated to Islam).

47 comments:

Elsewhere, in multiple places, it was reported that among his friends he was know by nickname "Noahide". Of course, he along with many others was murdered by an Islamic terrorist and this is grievous , but he was not Jewish, but of Greek descent. (But the point is that Gentiles in Messianic Movement regularly refer to themselves as "Messianic Jews".)

Peter, you should correct the title of your post for honesty sake. He was born Greek Orthodox (as confirmed by his relative, Ruthann Panco) and it doesn't make him a Jew, Messianic or otherwise, simply because attended a messianic congregation.

But yes, the West is once again in a war with Islam. The West is internally sick and suicidal and digs itself deeper and deeper into the Islamic hole and leftism. And at the same time, much of the West is growing more and more anti-Israel (including the current "president" of the U.S.). I don't believe that West's current problem with Islamic inundation can be separated with how it treated the Jews in the last two thousand years and especially in the last world war and how it treats Jews, that is Israel, today. I believe there's a strong connection and it will not correct itself anytime soon.

Change the title? Based on what evidence? Oh, right because you said it. So I guess I'll have to change it today and then tomorrow when you say "No,wait, I guess he was a Jew" then I'll change the title again and every day I'll devote some time to updating the title of this post to reflect your current beliefs regarding this man's ethnicity.

Everyone else is outraged about the terrorist attack. BUT YOU'RE OUTRAGED BECAUSE YOU SUSPECT THIS VICTIM MAY NOT HAVE BEEN JEWISH. Good grief! How backwards is that?

"But yes, the West is once again in a war with Islam. The West is internally sick and suicidal and digs itself deeper and deeper into the Islamic hole and leftism. And at the same time, much of the West is growing more and more anti-Israel (including the current "president" of the U.S.). I don't believe that West's current problem with Islamic inundation can be separated with how it treated the Jews in the last two thousand years and especially in the last world war and how it treats Jews, that is Israel, today. I believe there's a strong connection and it will not correct itself anytime soon."

"Until last year, Thalasinos contributed to the conservative blog Big Dog, where he wrote under the name “Noahide,” the website’s administrator said in a blog post."http://www.latimes.com/local/lanow/la-me-52-year-old-colton-resident-killed-in-san-bernardino-massacre-20151203-story.html

"Ruthann Panco: This man was a part of my family. Why is his religion being questioned? FYI he was raised Greek Orthodox and converted to the Jewish faith. He was threatened an killed by a radical nut case and his wife. He has two sons that no longer have a father. His death is senseless. Btw he was messaonic before he converted to being Jewish." (NOTE: He was messianic till the day he died and converted to nothing).http://www.timesofisrael.com/jewish-victim-of-california-attack-had-argued-with-shooter-about-islam/

"According to one friend, he had been a health inspector and according to another he had been born Catholic and then became a believer in Messianic Judaism.... Authorities have not released any motive for the shooting, or suggested an intended target. Thalasnos was a practitioner of Messianic Judaism, and there was a point in his life where he belonged to a movement called Noachidism. His posts included several that compared Muslims to Nazis."http://www.onlysimchas.com/news/22077/terror-victim-was-ardent-zionist-but-not-jewish

So, are you going to fix your tite? If you read the comments on many sites, you will see that a lot of Jews are upset that this guy is being portrayed as a Jew. His wife gives interviews where she says "we are Messianic Jews", when he was in fact part of a Christian sect that really tries to get Jews become Jesus-worshipers.

I am sorry about this man's death and deaths of other people at the hands of Muslim murderers. There's little I myself can do about organized Islamic terrorism directed at non-Muslims (other than feel outraged), but there are many things I can do to stop spiritual destruction of my people who are deceived every day into converting to a man-god-worshiping religion, to which hundreds of thousands of Jews have been lost over the centuries and to this day.

Tonight at 11 - a sometimes-over-the-top One-Law blogger users the term "Messianic Jew" in a way that doesn't agree with an angry Internet counter-missionary pundit who hates Yeshua, Messianics, and all things related! Angry Internet counter-missionary expresses his anger on the Internet! One-Law blogger expresses his anger at the anger!

In other news, the sun rose this morning, and it is planning on setting this afternoon.

Terms like "Messianic Jew" or "Messianic Judaism," and who gets to claim them, are dependent on context - namely, the opinions of whoever controls the forum in which the discussion is happening. Maybe they shouldn't be, but this is how the world works.

Gene is free to call him whatever he wants - Gentile, Messianic Gentile, Dirty Goy who Makes Israel Idolatrous, whatever - on his tiny corner of the Internet. Peter is free to use the terms as he wishes on his tiny corner of the Internet, and he's chosen "Messianic Jew." No matter how frustrating it might be, neither has any say over the other.

In Messianic synagogues, he will be honored - some will call him Messianic Jew, some will call him Messianic Gentile. In mainstream synagogues, he may be ignored. He likely will not be referred to as a Jew. Some will vilify him for stealing Jewish identity. Each venue is in control of how it defines and uses, or does not use, these sorts of terms, whether people external to the venue like it or not.

For anyone in the infinitesimal spheres of One Law or Counter-Missionary to whine that secular, mainstream publications do or do not refer to a Messianic Jew, or a Messianic Gentile, as "Jew" or "Messianic" or anything else, is just ridiculous. Likewise, to rave when the other camp does *exactly* what one would expect of the other camp is equally pointless.

His wife identifies him as a Messianic Jew. Does that fit Peter's definition of it? Probably. Does it fit Gene's? No. But the publications didn't ask either of you, or any other particular Jewish group, to bless their definitions.

Likewise, Peter's blog (another "publication") didn't ask Gene - but Gene saw fit to rant about it anyway. In the face of mass, senseless death, nitpicking about labeling the race of the murder victim is the issue on which Gene thought he should spend his time pontificating, for us all to read. Now *that's* the sort of priorities in life that will really show people that renouncing Yeshua leads to being a better person!

Likewise, I'm sure Gene, in his "publication" will not ask Peter how to refer to the victim. Neither will budge for the other, and both are just guys with Wordpress sites anyway.

But bloggers, man...bloggers will fight over anything.

People are dead. The fact that this discussion about race is even *happening* is utterly shameful and disgusting. I know Peter doesn't like to censor comments, but wow, man. In this case, I would have nipped this whole exchange in the bud.

But, nobody asked me about whether to censor the discussion, so I'll leave it at once sentence rather than raving back and forth about this blog's policies.

Anonymous, looks like you are tired of the whole internet thing. Feel free to sign off. Internet today is a battle ground for ideas, ideas which make real impact in the real world. From ISIS posting their gruesome videos and rants, to presidential candidates making themselves known to the masses, to media posting deceptive news narratives, to missionaries and well-financed missionary organizations creating hundreds of sites and blogs targeting assimilated Jews and a few dedicated Jews who try to undo their damage, our words on the internet today matter a great deal. I have many stories about my own blog efforts changing real lives of many real people in the real world.

This is not a discussion about "race". Jews are not a "race". This particular discussion about truth or rather lack there off in the so called messianic world.

Oh, and like millions of other Americans, I am SICK TO DEATH of the political correctness that is chocking this nation. You are feel free to say what you want, but don't rant about someone challenging you on it because the "wrong timing" offends your sensibilities.

If you want to talk about how the Internet works, let's discuss communication protocols and server configuration. Let's talk about the kinds of encryption that let the oppressed in dictatorial countries express the ideas you mention without getting beheaded. Let's talk about protecting those who use social media to speak up against inhumanities of violence. Until then, lectures on the nature of the Internet are unnecessary.

Like you, and like Peter, I have a website into which I've invested a little time. I'd like to convince myself that it matters, too. But if I do, I should get over myself. When you say that words on the Internet matter, you're right. But this is for major high-traffic sites. CNN. BBC. HuffPo. For ISIS, the dark and dirty corners of the Tor network. For those who think like you? Jews for Judaism. Singer. But blogs? Blogs are the Harlequin Publishing of the web. They're dime a dozen, and every blogger is convinced that *his* blog is the exception. You feel that it matters, just like I feel, or want to feel, that my website matters. Sure, there's the whole, "If I convince just one person," thing, and that's fine, but statistically....nope. Buckets in the ocean.

So yes, words on the Internet matter. The ones you mentioned, sure. But they're the Major Leagues and this is Sandlot ball. They're Pepsico, and we have a lemonade stand. By all means, enjoy your lemonade stand. I enjoy mine. And I like Peter's. There's nothing wrong with them. But when we say "words on the Internet matter," let's not forget that we're the lemonade stands in the electronic neighborhood.

But that's not the point. The point isn't even that you guys are having the same old tired fight, using the same old tired tropes.

The issue is that in the face of fourteen dead - you choose to fight over THIS. Whether to call one of them a Jew or a Goy. Call it race. Call it ethnicity. Fight over terminology. You fight over this. In the face of death, *this* is your priority. It's sickening, sir. If you goal is to reach Jews to prepare them to defend against the claims of Messianics...well, whether you're right or wrong, the fact that you prioritize *this* discussion in the face of mass murder would utterly destroy your credibility in the eyes of most of the Jews I know. This is what you choose to discuss in these circumstances....very twisted.

"But blogs? Blogs are the Harlequin Publishing of the web. They're dime a dozen, and every blogger is convinced that *his* blog is the exception. You feel that it matters, just like I feel, or want to feel, that my website matters. "

My target audience is VERY niche and I get good traffic. So, may be your blog means nothing, but my makes a real difference (meaning, people who reach out to me personally after reading it).

"This is what you choose to discuss in these circumstances....very twisted."

Stop with the feigned outrage already. You should really glance at the comments by other Jews on news articles where this person is identified as a 'Messianic Jew". Jews know full well the destructive effect Christian outfits targeting Jews have had on the weakest Jews among us. We all feel sympathy of this man and his family as we would for any human being murdered by Islamists. This doesn't take away from the fact the religious steam he was part of targets weak Jews specifically for conversion to idolatry and has destroyed far more Jewish lives and families, including future potential generations of Jews that will never be born, than ISIS terrorists could ever hope to do.

A very niche audience - every Jew who's ever been the target of evangelism? Millions? Every Jew? No, your target isn't so niche...but if you convince yourself it is, then you convince yourself that you're having greater impact upon it.

As I said, "every blogger is convinced that *his* blog is the exception..."

You've certainly made your little website into a noble quest, and you the white knight who will save infinite legions of Jews from non existence at the hands of the evil, evil Christians. .....exactly the blogger mindset I mention. Others have it. I'm not trying to single you out. There are at least three of us in this discussion (out of three so far) that have it to some degree or other. Yet of course you don't think you have it - that's inherent in the mindset.

Also, I didn't say you didn't feel sympathy for this man. I'm criticizing you, but I'm not going *that* far. I don't think you're utterly heartless. But your *priority,* over and above the tragedy, is that everyone conform to your particulars of ethnic and religious identification. Sure, people are upset. I get that. But 24 hours after the bodies hit the floor, *this* is the discussion you choose to have. If you don't see how that's a problem, that's sick. Not just "bad," but legitimately ill. I said your priorities were screwed up, and that this would destroy your credibility. I stand by it.

Scroll down to the bottom of the article, right above words "Times staff writer Laura J. Nelson contributed to this report." read this: 'Until last year, Thalasinos contributed to the conservative blog Big Dog, where he wrote under the name “Noahide,” the website’s administrator said in a blog post."

"The rest are not "evidence" of him not being Jewish. Hearsay and speculation is not evidence."

Comments from his relatives (Ruthann Panco) are a "speculation"?

You are in denial. Messianic Gentiles lie about being "Jewish" all the time. Just the other day you posted about a "Orthodox Messianic Jew" with a penchant of dressing like a priest and Dan, who knew him personally, exposed him as a deceiver. The Messianic Movement is a deceptive entity - they need to be to suck ignorant Jews in unawares.

"And I'm upset as an American that our people were killed by Islamists! Show some respect! "

Jews are being stabbed and murdered by Islamists almost every day in Israel. But you are not being too upset about the destruction Christianity and the "Messianic Movement" has caused to so many Jews by pulling into idolatry, cutting them off from G-d and their people, spiritually destroying them.

Anonymous,I think it would be better to say that Gene is not mentally ill— instead, he is full of bitterness and sin. Gene does not understand that Moses wrote about Elohim’s eternal existence in tri-unity and, while ignoring and distorting the Scripture, presents mankind’s lies as G-d’s truths.

On a hopeful note, Gene is doing the same things that Apostle Paul would have done prior to his conversion to Messianic Judaism on the road to Damascus.

As it is, Gene lives dangerously like someone the Apostle Peter wrote about to whom "It would be better for them not to have known the way of righteousness, than having known it, to turn away from the holy commandment handed on to them. It has happened to them according to the true proverb, "A dog returns to its own vomit," and, "A sow, after washing, returns to wallowing in the mire." [2 Peter 2:21-22]

We should pray that Gene may turn from his sin towards the Father’s loving forgiveness through the Messiah, L-RD Yeshua, while there is still an ‘accepted time’— and not be like one who ultimately "rejects the Good News and does not consider himself worthy of eternal life." [Acts 13:46]

Better to live as a Jew in the world that wants Jews and Judaism wiped out and replaced with [fill in the blanks of your religion], than to live with false and smug NT-quoting self-assurance that comes from believing in a dead man-god idol who granted you a free ticket to eternal bliss with him.

You call Gene bitter because he's simply making a point about who is Jewish and who isn't? Wow. You know what I think? I think the people who argue against the Torah, it's rules, it's boundaries, etc, are the ones who are truly bitter inside. Those who live with idolatry while knowing in the back of their heads that the Torah condemns what they're doing are the ones living in bitterness and sin because they're looking for acceptance by actually observant Jews and will never get it unless they change.

I think the bitterness lies in those, and therefore they hypocritically accuse actually observant Jews as bitter all because we don't accept you. Christianity, Islam, and their adherents have the most hate for the Jewish people. It's derived from the fact that Jews don't accept their false religions.

Gene, my dear friend, why do your words seek to find hatred where none exists? Neither I nor Peter want any Jew wiped out— rather, we both would desire to be like HaShem, Who calls for all the unrighteous [Jews and Gentiles] to come to His only Redeemer, L-RD Yeshua, for cleansing of sin.

If many Jews are offended by the L-rd's 'cornerstone' or 'stumbling block'-- it was HaShem Who warned them, not me:

"He will be a holy place; for both Israel and Judah he will be a stone that causes people to stumble and a rock that makes them fall. And for the people of Jerusalem he will be a trap and a snare." [Isaiah 8:14]

The scripture you pulled out of context, Kavi, doesn't mention any messiah, any certainly not any man-g-d - just the G-d of Israel. In fact, the verses right before it warn Jews not to fear anything that other people fear (i.e. Jesus and other false gods), only the G-d of Israel is to be feared alone. This scripture testifies against your idolatrous beliefs.

Kavi - you want all Jews to leave the only G-d of the Universe to become idol-worshipers like yourself, to place their faith and their lives in the hands of a dead man-god idol, in your ba'al who doesn't save. Should I have warm and fuzzy feelings about it? You may mean well, but your desires for Jews only spell disaster for any of them who are ignorant enough to be entrapped in your idolatry. You give them poison thinking it is candy - none of your good intentions will change the fact that your poison kills.

Gene,As much as you would zealously conform yourself to the likeness of the Apostle Paul prior to his conversion to Messianic Judaism, I should also zealously persist to think about you and pray for Elohim's redemption of your soul [and others like you].

May you receive redemptive shalom with the Ancient of Days through L-RD Yeshua

Only tyrants try to suppress other people's points of view. As a Virginian, I'm not too keen on tyrants. As an American, I value free speech--especially the free expression of religious ideas (even the "off topic" ones). Also, I'm not in any way threatened by opposing points of view.

If you want censorship, I suggest you move to North Korea or one of the Islamic countries.

Remi,Moses spoke of Elohim's complex unity on multiple occasions-- otherwise, we are faced with seemingly contradictory texts such as Deuteronomy 4 and the Exodus 6:3

At Mt. Sinai all Israel, just like Moses, was not allowed to directly see the Ancient of Days— YET, we find that, just like a friend, Moses spoke ‘face to face’ with the LORD [who is LORD Yeshua, the Son of G-d].

"we find that, just like a friend, Moses spoke ‘face to face’ with the LORD [who is LORD Yeshua, the Son of G-d]."

Kavi... something doesn't quite add up. So, you mean to tell us that Jesus was already incarnated in a physical body (even before the whole Mary thing) and this is what allowed Moses to see what otherwise no mortal could see and live? And what happened just a short time earlier when G-d told Moses that he couldn't see Him and live - did G-d slip into the "Jesus mode" the second time around (and He couldn't do that the first time He talked to Moses)?

Let's look at it from a different point.. let's assume God forbid and one of the deciest was Gene Shlomovitch...what would they have written? Gene, a one time jew, who converted to messianic Judaism and then had an about face and reteruned to Judaism again... Giving his past jumping from religion to religion he probably was preperring to jump into Budhism right before ho died...you see, everythig is relevant...

Dan, for a Jew to return to Judaism (from secularism, atheism, Christianity, Bhuddism, you name it) is called teshuvah / repentance, not "jumping from religion to religion". Teshuvah is a very biblical concept, you know, one that Hashem strongly encourages. Certainly nothing deserving a ridicule.

"Applying these teachings to government immigration policy implies desperation to justify an indefensible position. "

Jason, on the contrary, per gospel accounts, Jesus was very much a political figure - a "king". He was a pacifist (although his crew carried swords!), and refused to resist political authorities of the day and (supposedly) willingly suffered abuse at the hands of foreign occupiers.

Of course, at the time (that is before his promotion by Paul), Jesus was nothing special - many other failed messianic claimants and countless other Jewish rebels against Rome suffered the exact same fate as Jesus. They, however, did so without any fanfare and especially deification. His "indescribable suffering" was no worse than those of many thousands of others, and perhaps even far less than most of those who were executed the way he did, since instead of dying for days and days as was the fate of many, Jesus, as the NT purports, died within mere hours. For no one but himself.

"So when Yeshua taught his followers to turn the other cheek, you purport he was actually advancing an open immigration policy for his kingdom?"

No, Jason, I think this was actually an attempt by the church scribes who penned the NT to appease Rome by portraying Christians as harmless to their political rule (since Rome didn't take kindly to the idea that a man other than Cesar was the object of Christian worship). Jesus was thus portrayed as interested only in a "kingdom not of this world". Jews were portrayed as both his enemies and enemies of Rome, since they wanted to re-establish Jewish sovereignty while Christians were submissive to the Roman rule. As history shows, Christianity really wasn't a threat to Rome after all (unlike the rebellious Jews). Rome came to appreciate the submissive feature of Christianity because it allowed for greater control of all the various groups within its domain (except for the stubborn Jews, of course), and soon it adopted Christianity as its official religion.

"How have you come to know so much about the life, death, teachings, and followers of Yeshua?"

Hey, Jason, why don't you read Lamentations 3 (where this verse appears) in context. It's "lamentations" of the Jewish people about being punished by G-d for their sins.

Notable excerpts:

"Why should the living complain when punished for their sins?"

"You have covered yourself with anger and pursued us; you have slain without pity.... All our enemies have opened their mouths wide against us. We have suffered terror and pitfalls, ruin and destruction."

The NT scribes have used this verse out of context, perverted it to preach non-resistance to evil-doers and loving one's wicked enemies.

Hi Jason, what makes you so sure that Jesus is the messiah? I know you are going to a messianic congregation and I would guess that you believe all Jews must accept Jesus. On the other hand, I believe that worshipping Jesus is pure idolatry. When G-d said not to worship anything else than Himself, and not worship anything that the Jewish forefather did not know, why are you so sure that worshipping Jesus is not a deception of the new testament writer. How can you be so sure that the new testament is inspired, when it contradict the Tanakh.

I used to believe in Yeshua, and sometimes had doubts about the trinity and worshipping Jesus. I used to say to myself "well, if Jesus is not the messiah, then there is no hope for me". And one day, I talked to an orthodox rabbi and I said that I believe the god of the Bible. I knew there was this still small voice saying "That's not what he believes, he believe you worship a dead man!" Then I went to check the other side of the coin.

Now, if you say to me "you must acknowledge Jesus if not you will burn in hell forever", I can assure you that I am 100% sure and there is not a doubt in my mind that Jesus was not the messiah and worshipping him is against what G-d said. That there was not one single prophecy that he fulfilled. That echad means one (and that's the primary meaning, there is nothing mystical about it and that that all explanation that you can find are plain and simple excuses to worship 3 gods).

Hope that your new testament would allow you to check the claims of Jesus, but unfortunately, everything written in it tells you not to doubt Jesus. 1 John 2:22. I am afraid that the fear of hell and your commitment for Jesus does not allow you to see clearly, just like me when I still believe in Jesus.

For non-convert gentiles, the proper term is Messianic Gentile. A certain Rabbi proposed a legitimate conversion rite for Messianic Gentiles, what this proposed conversion rite involves is similar to Catechumenate found in the Catholic and Orthodox traditions, but modeled after conversion for Mainstream Judaism. What this involves is accepting Jewish Law (Kashrut, Shabbat, holiday observance, etc) and being circumcised/pricked by the knife if already circumcised, in addition to 6-12 months of Jewish education. Where as Gentiles attending synagogue do not have to keep all of the Torah Law, if they wish to convert they must live as the Jewish members of the Synagogue. This path will be discouraged under the Rabbi's proposal, and should only be taken by those who are willing to live the Law, or those marrying a Jew.

I think that "Christian" is a good term - why throw away a New Testament term for Gentiles who converted to Christianity? Because it was tainted? Well, many Protestants think that Catholics, who call themselves "Christians", are not "real Christians", but that doesn't stop the Protestants from still identifying as Christians.

Instead of coming up with new labels, perhaps these Christians should try to redeem the New Testament designation of Jesus-worshipers, if they feel it needs redeeming that is.

I think that is a fair thought. Many of the Gentiles calling themselves Jews without going through any Rites or Rituals of Conversion are what is hurting the movement. Although, I do think the term Messianic Gentile would be appropriate to describe denomination (such as Baptist, Methodist, Catholic, etc) if the need to do so arises.

“They have turned aside quickly out of the way which I commanded them. They have made themselves a molded calf, and worshiped it and sacrificed to it, and said, ‘This is your god, O Israel, that brought you out of the land of Egypt!’ ””‭‭Exodus‬ ‭32:8‬ ‭NKJV‬‬

...and...

“Then David said to all the assembly, “Now bless the LORD your God.” So all the assembly blessed the LORD God of their fathers, and bowed their heads and prostrated themselves before the LORD and the king.”‭‭I Chronicles‬ ‭29:20‬ ‭NKJV‬‬

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σέβονταί = sébomai, worship, personally esteem; revere, venerate

“Hypocrites! Well did Isaiah prophesy about you, saying: ‘These people draw near to Me with their mouth, And honor Me with their lips, But their heart is far from Me. And in vain they worship Me, Teaching as doctrines the commandments of men.’ ””‭‭Matthew‬ ‭15:7-9‬ ‭NKJV

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προσκυνῆσαι = proskynēsai, "kiss toward", kiss the ground, worship

“saying, “Where is He who has been born King of the Jews? For we have seen His star in the East and have come to worship Him.””‭‭Matthew‬ ‭2:2‬ ‭NKJV