I go in spurts. Somethings i get all "i need to prep for the end" sometimes I live care free and wear sandals all day not giving it a second thought. Anyways, I'm on another lets prepare kick.

Ok so I've been watching the walking dead I found it just the other day on netflix. omfg awesome. Love things like 28 days later and what not. I found this BBC show on netflix called Survivors. Watched all of season one yesterday. If you like the walking dead you'll love Survivors.

Ok so to the point of my post. I got a bug up my *** and started putting together some stuff. After an hour of reorganizing I ended up with 4 backpacks of stuff, a duffle bag, a bucket, 2 rifles, a shot gun and two pistols. I can't seam to taper down the supplies. Bah.

In the end it's just going to be me and my dog. I need to taper it down but idk.

scarville

10-18-2011, 1:57 PM

I feel your pain...

When I started planning a BOB I ended up with enough stuff to outfit a six month expedition to the African interior.

dezertracer18

10-18-2011, 3:18 PM

Im just about to place an order for my backpack to carry everything i possibly can and its taken me about 2 months too pull the trigger...my two biggest reasons on spending so much on 1 pack is solely to be able to carry as much gear as possible comfortably. My reasons for elberstock
1.rifle scabbard
2.5000CI
3.Molle webbing
4.Front/top loading which makes organizing easy.
http://www.eberlestock.com/
www.mysteryranch.com/site/index.html
Check out there packs there some serious coin but you gotta think how are you gonna be able to hoof all that gear if a pack rips.

2. Get a back pack for your dog... I just bought one for my golden retriever about a month ago and she loves it..she feels like shes got a job and ontop of that she can hold her own weight.
Check out these packs i am super pleased with the build of the one i got from them.
http://www.ruffwear.com/

stix213

10-18-2011, 3:23 PM

Put it all on your back, and you'll figure it out quick :p That's how I was with backpacking. A lot of the same thinking goes into it as far as planning with limited weight constraints.

itisagoodname

10-18-2011, 4:52 PM

Damn, now i have to get a BOB for the dog, totally forgot that as an option. He should be good for another 25lbs. 6 month husky/malamute/wolf and he's already ~75 lbs.

Im just about to place an order for my backpack to carry everything i possibly can and its taken me about 2 months too pull the trigger...my two biggest reasons on spending so much on 1 pack is solely to be able to carry as much gear as possible comfortably. My reasons for elberstock
1.rifle scabbard
2.5000CI
3.Molle webbing
4.Front/top loading which makes organizing easy.
http://www.eberlestock.com/
www.mysteryranch.com/site/index.html
Check out there packs there some serious coin but you gotta think how are you gonna be able to hoof all that gear if a pack rips.

2. Get a back pack for your dog... I just bought one for my golden retriever about a month ago and she loves it..she feels like shes got a job and ontop of that she can hold her own weight.
Check out these packs i am super pleased with the build of the one i got from them.
http://www.ruffwear.com/

Darklyte27

10-18-2011, 6:06 PM

the idea of the bag is good, but carrying it with your hand is bad. you need your hands free, so a backpack has always been the better idea.
So i also dislike the bug out bags you see at most stores.

bsg

10-18-2011, 6:14 PM

have you begun "pack animal" training for your dog yet? your favorite pooch can assist you with some of the things you may have to carry... should you have to bug out in a SHTF situation.

good luck with the bug up your ***.

INJUNTOM

10-18-2011, 6:22 PM

Screw the bag. I live a block from a river, so I hope to find food and water there if it's still usable. Beyond that I will save the last bullet for myself, and don't plan to leave any bullets behind...

TonyKat

10-18-2011, 6:36 PM

This is what I'm talking about. Total weight of the 5 bags, bucket, and guns is 131.4 lbs that's not realistic for 1 person and his dog.

http://i.imgur.com/uvCCy.png

whlgun

10-18-2011, 6:39 PM

Honestly a BOB is more then just a bag its what you plan on taking with yourself to survive. I cant fit all of that in one bag.

bsg

10-18-2011, 9:04 PM

This is what I'm talking about. Total weight of the 5 bags, bucket, and guns is 131.4 lbs that's not realistic for 1 person and his dog.

http://i.imgur.com/uvCCy.png

have you considered the Henry AR-7 Survival Rifle?

EL_NinO619

10-18-2011, 9:56 PM

Looks like you need a friend..:)

testosteroneOD

10-18-2011, 10:14 PM

If you don't mind..what all do you have in those bags?

I'm in the process of planning a B.O.B and G.H.B

problemchild

10-18-2011, 10:34 PM

No bag for me just something to put on my trailer hitch.

http://www.michaelkdickson.com/oldsite/PETERSEN%20EVENT/GI4G9246.jpg

slam128

10-18-2011, 10:48 PM

I've been watching Dual Survivor on netflix and it's amazing how little they have and still survive with what they can scavenge along the way. Sometime it might be best to just pack enough for good mobility instead of a huge backpack that can weigh you down if you really need to bug out. Carrying all that stuff might end up jeopardizing you if things start getting hairy.

Caliyanks

10-19-2011, 10:17 AM

If it cant fit in my Ruck, it aint going. Think of it this way, if you had to leave right now, right this second without warning, and you had a bag full on stuff by the door, what do you want in that bag. And then put it on your back and go for a 5 mile hike or so. When you wake up in the morning how do you fell about your stuff now? Just saying, 22 years Army and I'm a prepper as well. But you have to keep it real. Good Luck. I'm good for a long time with whats in my ruck now. (don't forget the signicant other and their pack. It may be a little different).

MudCamper

10-19-2011, 10:21 AM

I feel your pain...

When I started planning a BOB I ended up with enough stuff to outfit a six month expedition to the African interior.

Not a problem. Organize it into different tiers. on-foot-BoB, in-vehicle-kit, and bug-in-kit. Then use whichever one you can if/when needed.

But you have to keep it real.

Exactly. And real disasters usually involve advance notice, and an automobile is better than hoofin it. Of course, if you live in metropolitan California, then hoofin it may be a reality if The Big One hits. So be prepared for anything.

QQQ

10-19-2011, 12:13 PM

Hoofin' it to where?

BOB's are worthless if you don't have a clear, safe, accessible destination in mind.
Unless, of course, you simply plan to use your BOB to BO to the local FEMA camp, where they'll take most of your stuff away anyways.

Better to make sure that you have enough to hunker down at home and work towards developing a solid retreat plan, then making your BOB.

But the fact that you're even thinking about preparedness at all puts you ahead of most people, so keep it up!

dezertracer18

10-19-2011, 2:39 PM

Damn, now i have to get a BOB for the dog, totally forgot that as an option. He should be good for another 25lbs. 6 month husky/malamute/wolf and he's already ~75 lbs.

yup one more thing to add to the list definately worth while in my opinion though check them out online. The one i bought is built pretty dang tough and doesnt slide all over the place when adjusted on there torso correctly. plus its got 4 huge pockets to easily organize stuff in including 2 hydration bladders...no joke.

itisagoodname

10-19-2011, 3:51 PM

yup one more thing to add to the list definately worth while in my opinion though check them out online. The one i bought is built pretty dang tough and doesnt slide all over the place when adjusted on there torso correctly. plus its got 4 huge pockets to easily organize stuff in including 2 hydration bladders...no joke.

I had picked up one bag a while back thinking he'd grow into it but the more i look at it i don't like how its made. It doesn't have hydration packs either and he's a very furry, thirsty pup.

Now what i don't know is what to do with that damn li'l Pomeranian... I am 150% sure that dog would not stop barking and in a Zombie outbreak i'd have to just toss him to the horde and run.

Dutch3

10-19-2011, 4:13 PM

Using what you have assembled, start a list of things you don't need.

1) Sandals
2)...

.

TonyKat

10-19-2011, 5:47 PM

I'm thinking about picking up one of these and building onto it with pouches and the mentality of if it doesn't fit on the vest I don't need it. Once I feel it's complete then I can start looking at a rucksack as an additional resource should the situation allow.

This is what I'm talking about. Total weight of the 5 bags, bucket, and guns is 131.4 lbs that's not realistic for 1 person and his dog.

http://i.imgur.com/uvCCy.png

I love it, but one tech question, how many arms do you have to carry and shoot those 3 long guns and the pistol? I was always a one on the hip and one over the shoulder sort of guy, but was wondering how you would do it :43:

Seriously though looks like you have a start to a bug out vehicle prep. Not a bad idea. Like some others said maybe you have stages, like person, car, group and so on.

itisagoodname

10-20-2011, 9:58 AM

I love it, but one tech question, how many arms do you have to carry and shoot those 3 long guns and the pistol? I was always a one on the hip and one over the shoulder sort of guy, but was wondering how you would do it :43:

Seriously though looks like you have a start to a bug out vehicle prep. Not a bad idea. Like some others said maybe you have stages, like person, car, group and so on.

I wonder about this as well... I have an AR, a Mossberg, and a CZ75 9mm. The AR is heavier than i'd like it with its bull barrel... my next build will be a lightweight rifle. Plus all the heavy 5.56 ammo to carry.

In reality though i think it would make more sense to carry a fishing rod, a shotgun for bird hunting, and a sidearm for protection. I dont think i'd be all that quiet with all that gear trying to do any other sort of hunting.

I need to pick up one of those "tactical" shovels. If camping were a necessity i sure as hell wouldnt want to leave all my gear sitting out, i'm building some underground storage

cc56

10-20-2011, 1:26 PM

It is funny you brought up the show "survivors" I loved that show. Sadly just to let you know, they leave the show with a cliff hanger, and there is going to be NOOO 3rd season!! It is almost not worth watching because of the disappointment at the end.

el scorcho

10-20-2011, 10:22 PM

for those of you with holsters...do you keep your load out (mag pouches, mags, holster) ready on your belt and your belt already on a pair of pants? I'd think that it would take too long in an emergency or some sort of SHTF scenario to fiddle with putting all your doodads on a belt then onto your pants :p

it just occurred to me while reading this thread that I should have a pair of pants ready with belt, holster, mag pouch.

Anti-Hero

10-20-2011, 10:28 PM

You need to trim that stash WAYYYYY down. Too many guns = too much ammo = too much weight. I'd carry less weapons, and more water, food, blankets, toiletries, etc.

Darklyte27

10-21-2011, 5:56 AM

if you want a plate carrier,

http://www.cheaperthandirt.com/Molle365-1.html

http://cdn1.cheaperthandirt.com/ctd_images/bgprod/MOLLE-365.jpg
got mine in multicam for more $. 60-100$
plates come in a few days.
good bang for the buck carrier.

Since my plans evolve around Bugging IN at our home, with our home loaded with plenty of food/Water/Medical/Weapons and gear for living without electricity from the grid, my only BOB is what I call a GHB..Get home bag.

And it travels in my car. The only good reason for this is a major earthquake here in La La land. If mid-day and I am 37 miles from home while a 9.1 cuts off watermains, gas lines, electricity, bridges, overpasses and fires are raging around the Southland, I will be living in my car the first night.

After than, I may be required to hoof it home. A small backpack with water/food/flashlite and ONE handgun is what I have.

Also a rain PONCHO that will cover my holstered GLOCK 20.
And a good pair of shoes.

Thats about it. Just to get home.

Be well
Bob

thomashoward

10-21-2011, 8:25 AM

Wow...131 pounds..?...

Since my plans evolve around Bugging IN at our home, with our home loaded with plenty of food/Water/Medical/Weapons and gear for living without electricity from the grid, my only BOB is what I call a GHB..Get home bag.

And it travels in my car. The only good reason for this is a major earthquake here in La La land. If mid-day and I am 37 miles from home while a 9.1 cuts off watermains, gas lines, electricity, bridges, overpasses and fires are raging around the Southland, I will be living in my car the first night.

After than, I may be required to hoof it home. A small backpack with water/food/flashlite and ONE handgun is what I have.

Also a rain PONCHO that will cover my holstered GLOCK 20.
And a good pair of shoes.

Thats about it. Just to get home.

Be well
Bob

+1000 get home, bug in.

scarville

10-21-2011, 8:42 AM

Not a problem. Organize it into different tiers. on-foot-BoB, in-vehicle-kit, and bug-in-kit. Then use whichever one you can if/when needed.
That is pretty much what I am doing. I was pretty amazed at the stuff I figured was essential. It was a bit of a sobering experience.
BOB's are worthless if you don't have a clear, safe, accessible destination in mind.
I think people tend to get stuck on the Bug Out part. I generally refer to my BOB as simply a "three day bag" or a "three day walkabout bag" because it has what I think I need to travel three days in my AO -- regardless of whether that three days is here-to-there or there-and-back.

d4v0s

10-21-2011, 10:14 AM

So I do not mean to thread jack, but what about communications? The piece i have been dealing with is how could I communicate reliably with family and such while trying to make it home. I have a GHB (get home bag, basics for 72 hour survival and getting my ***** home in the event of an emergency.)

Walkie Talkies are less than reliable, I am curious about what you guys use? I have a pair of 20 mile range motorolas, what do you guys plan on using? I am thinking, massive earthquake, turn on the radios and make a plan on how to get home..

thenodnarb

10-21-2011, 12:06 PM

scarville and oceanbob hit the nail on the head. OP seems to have assembled a kit of what he would want if he could never return home again. A BOB, GHB or three day pack has certain limitations to it be its definition. A BOB gets you to your BOL. If your BOL is a 5 day walk, then your bag needs to be able to get you there. If its an 8 hour drive, then you need a vehicle with fuel, spares etc to get you there. A GHB gets you home. It should probably include comms, food, overnight supplies, extra cloths etc. Its just what you need to tide you over 'til you get home or have to walk home. a three day pack is just that. Mine is geared towards outdoor survival since I am nearly always in/near the woods. My gear includes water, food, firestarters, first aid, a single pistol with 100 rounds and mags, various small items, TP, Crank Radio/flashlight/phone charger, Flashlights(small but powerful ones), dry bags, rain jacket, bla bla bla. I also change it up based on the seasons. If its summer, I ditch the giant coat that I keep with my bag in my car(i'm almost always near my car. That's how I get places :) )

The point is: decide what you want your bug out bag to be able to do for you, then with those requirements in mind, design your bag with the least amount of things necessary for you to be able to do that. It sounds like you are preparing for TEOTWAWKI and you are going to bug out to the hills somewhere. In that case I suggest you keep your gear at home, ready to go into a vehicle, and pack yourself a GHB for worst case scenarios when even the vehicle doesn't work to get you home. And remember that bugging in is your most likely scenario in most situations, so don't get too tied up in the bug out bag.

johnthomas

10-21-2011, 12:16 PM

If you don't mind..what all do you have in those bags?

I'm in the process of planning a B.O.B and G.H.B

He won't admit it, the biggest, heavy looking bag is filled with ladies underwear and only weighs 3 pounds, lol. There was a guy on George Nori the other night talking about everything one needs. He suggested a place like he has near a small farming community. His family is already there with 1 year supply of 30 year shelf life food for 10 people, medical supplies, guns and ammo, clothes, communications, alternate power, everything to grow and raise their own food. This guy is an author and has more money than he knows what to do with, so for him, it is feasible. He said there is a small town 20 miles away and a bigger town 50 miles away.

TheChief

10-21-2011, 12:53 PM

For those like me, with out a destination, the bags are of a different focus as thenodnarb pointed out. They are a "I'm Never Coming Home" bag or INCH. These are much larger and heavier and are an attempt by people to provide some resources to go for an extended period of time. No, you are not going to live off your back for two weeks or go Grizzly Adams in the back mountains but it does give you options.

I have brought this up in other threads and some people think we are needlessly adding more bag types but they really are different.

A BOB originated from the 72 hour bag which is why so many of us say you need three days worth of supplies in your BOB. In truth you need the supplies that work for you and that let you sleep soundly at night.

For me...I see the BOB as a quick grab bag to get out of the house for a short term emergency; such as a house or forest fire, chemical spill from a derailed train, tsunami, or some other unexpected local emergency where you need to leave right dang now. The expectation is society and the rule of law still exists but you need to have some things available to go. For me this includes all my critical documents, cash, some power bars, water, maps, weapon, light, radio, and a few other items. It fits in a 35l bag with room to spare.

For someone with a destination, the BOB would include all the supplies neccessary to get them there whether its a 1, 3, or 7 day trip. So the BOB is what you make of it.

As to the weapons:

I would carry a small concealed carry and full size pistol and a rifle. My wife would carry a full size pistol and shotgun with a variety of ammo (bird, slugs, defense). The ammo would be what is loaded in the magazines which is around 300+ rounds of ammo all told. I figure if I can't get something done with one load of ammo, I likely wont need to worry about running out as I will be dead or can scavenge from the other team's losers.

Carrying of the weapons openly would be dependant upon the conditions of the road but I see starting out with pistols and long arms (broken down) in the packs and only carrying the concealed pistol. As the situation changed, they would come out. The pistols would ride in thigh holsters with mag pouches and the long arms on slings with bandoleers.

I am debating about adding a silenced 22lr pistol with a small holo sight. Seriously! Ammo is light and it could be used for hunting tree rats without advertising the fact to everyone in the vicinity.

TonyKat

10-21-2011, 1:22 PM

So I do not mean to thread jack, but what about communications? The piece i have been dealing with is how could I communicate reliably with family and such while trying to make it home. I have a GHB (get home bag, basics for 72 hour survival and getting my ***** home in the event of an emergency.)

Walkie Talkies are less than reliable, I am curious about what you guys use? I have a pair of 20 mile range motorolas, what do you guys plan on using? I am thinking, massive earthquake, turn on the radios and make a plan on how to get home..

This is what I have http://www.amazon.com/Tri-Band-Yaesu-VX-6R-Submersible-Transceiver/dp/B004ESEW6C

http://ecx.images-amazon.com/images/I/41dlHpAH8wL.jpg

Chaparral

10-21-2011, 8:23 PM

I ditched the shotgun. 1911, Marlin 795 or CZ 452 (smaller and lighter than the 10/22) and an AR build for me. I have all the super lightweight stuff from my mountaineering days that has stood the test of time. I'd probably include a fat tire mountain bike with rack trunk and paniers and push the thing with my lumbar pack on if i had to bug out and never return home. My destination is 500 miles away tho... not fun.

BRUNO1911

10-21-2011, 9:47 PM

Has anybody heard or use a "Hellcat/Alice Pack" http://www.survivalistboards.com/showthread.php?t=47472

FYI/Carry the essentials (firearm/ammo,first aid,tools,Thomas Guide ;) flashlight/s,72 hr food supply/MRE's) acquire the rest as needed from the abandoned suite cases/bags left by the hordes running away on the "DAY AFTER" :reddevil:

Just my personal insight
Be safe,have fun!

SDM44

10-21-2011, 9:48 PM

Too many guns = too much ammo = too much weight.

I agree with this, and also never understood why some people want to take 2-3 different types/calibers of rifles, or 2-3 different types/calibers of handguns. In the end, you're just carrying more weight around with all of that extra ammo.

I see very few people carry similar pistols when they want to carry multiple pistols. For me, I would wear my G19 on my holster and keep my 'backup' G26 in my BOB.... or I could always do it the other way around, as both guns fit in my IWB and OWB holsters. But also I carry 1 caliber, and both can use the same mags. It's as if I'm carrying the same amount of mags and ammo, but I have 2 different guns to use it in. If not the same manufacturer handgun, then at least the same caliber handgun.

dhyayi

10-22-2011, 7:46 PM

This is what I have http://www.amazon.com/Tri-Band-Yaesu-VX-6R-Submersible-Transceiver/dp/B004ESEW6C

http://ecx.images-amazon.com/images/I/41dlHpAH8wL.jpg

Im going to buy this, but it is currently available. :(

223556

10-22-2011, 8:44 PM

In the same boat.
I have thought of different scenarios and tailored my BOB to be pretty much all of the above.
If time also in a situation and I had to leave home I would definetly grab alot more stuff.

Stoic Bacchanal

10-29-2011, 9:42 AM

I'm not sure if people so far haven't mention knives because they are a given in a SHTF situation but having a good long knife and a quality multitool are going to be very very useful.

FashionBiff

10-29-2011, 2:47 PM

Yea do not forget the pups, the fish are sushi the reptiles are food or just let them go. As for packing your dog make sure you do not pack them to heavy, now I do not know what that is. My wife's dog weighs 12#s and can barley carry his own cr@p.
On another note, for those of us who have had to BO for a fire and stay out because the National Guard was blocking access to our homes/ property just need basic supplies and toiletries. Thats why you need supplies in your car and at home, and you can not always be too prepared but you can have to much stuff. My kits are basic and let me get to water supply and post up there, the house is ideal but in So Cal that is not always an option.
I really want to have BOB only guns. For me I am thinking AR7 22LR rifle and a browning or rugger pistol. The main reason I desire a pistol is for protection, while camping or hiking. My original plan was an AR with 5.56 and 22 LR uppers with a G19 but that's much weight. If I have a car and am at home great but on foot forget about it.
All I can say is I hope none of us never need this stuff but better to have it just in case.

Rhythm of Life

10-29-2011, 2:52 PM

If you think you have too much go camping for 1 week with your gear, you'll learn how little you actually NEED.

Remember wants vs needs, it plays a vital role.

b-ran

10-29-2011, 3:42 PM

Hoofin' it to where?

BOB's are worthless if you don't have a clear, safe, accessible destination in mind.
Unless, of course, you simply plan to use your BOB to BO to the local FEMA camp, where they'll take most of your stuff away anyways.

Better to make sure that you have enough to hunker down at home and work towards developing a solid retreat plan, then making your BOB.

But the fact that you're even thinking about preparedness at all puts you ahead of most people, so keep it up!

I can give you 1 word why a BOB is absolutely necessary. Fire. Always have a bag in your vehicle, if you go to work and you get a call that your house is on fire, you will have only the clothes on your back and whats in your car left. Also if you plan to "bug in" which is what most will do, it only takes 1 Molotov cocktail to make you leave in a hurry. I don't care how much security you have or how many guns or how thick of a steel door you have, unless your house is fire proof, your f%^$ed. Have a bag ready to go in a hurry, you might not have time do plan anything. You might only have time to grab 1 bag as you are making sure all other life forms are getting out alive. HAVE A BUGOUT BAG READY!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Salty

11-16-2011, 6:21 PM

Read about ultralight backpacking and people like Emma "Grandma" Gatewood and Ray Jardine, then ask yourself if what you really need is more stuff, or more knowledge and practice.

Do you really need a cooking pot, AND an eating bowl? Could you ditch that big thick sleeping bag in favor of a thinner-lighter one and simply sleep in your clothes? Is that big ol' camp stove and those fuel canisters really necessary, or could you just cook over a fire or find some coffee cans on your way out of civilization to make a wood stove out of? Do you really need a weeks worth of clothes, or can you simply wash what you have or go stanky? Are you going to need a trunk full of water (that will eventually run out), or will boiling, tabs, or filters work? Do you really need a 10lb Rambo knife, or will a Leatherman do? How about that commando shovel? WTF are you gonna do with that than a potting trowel, rock, or small log can't do?

You're surviving here, not going on a car camping vacation.

When buying gear, also remember that a lot of the hunter / car camping / zombie survival stuff is decades behind when it comes to size and weight. Items meant for hikers, backpackers, kayakers, climbers, etc, tend to be much lighter and just overall better products.

MrsFS

11-16-2011, 6:46 PM

Tonykat check out the show Jericho on netflix. Still working my way through the season and a half. Bummed that is was cancelled.
I plan for a GHB so if I had to walk home from work 15miles (may be longer if dodging main roads). Having a verbalized plan ahead of time is important if communications are down. We also have a plan of where to meet up if we can't stay in SoCal and we are separated.
As far as a camping stove, I have heard those, .99 cent foot tall candle can heat small cans of food (less weight to carry).
I am also trying to skill build. It's great if you have the stuff, but it doesn't matter if you don't know how to use it.
Still working on adding a firearm.

Salty

11-17-2011, 2:33 PM

I've also heard those candles are worthless (not enough heat to boil water, etc,) although I've never tried one. :confused:

Again though, unless you're bugging out to a boat or barren desert landscape, I question why you need any kind of stove, sans MAYBE a backpacking wood stove. But again, you can likely find some cans, rocks, random metal, etc, to make one on your own, or just cook over an open fire. I can't imagine too many places where there isn't stuff to burn. Wood, paper, upholstery, etc, etc, etc.

Now if you're bugging in, a camping stove, BBQ, backyard fire ring, etc, all sound like great ideas as we're not worrying about weight and space.

OHOD

11-17-2011, 4:42 PM

I have a backpack that I use year round for camping. This is my BOB.
This BOB weighs in at 35 lbs.

I agree with the above post regarding camping. The more you camp, the more you know what you really need for short-midterm stays away from home. Also- the key to reducing your BOB and long-term emergency packs is knowledge. The more you KNOW about how to build, forage, hunt, cook, salvage water, and find/build shelter, the less you need to carry. Nature provides, and the Dude abides :)

OHOD

11-17-2011, 4:49 PM

I've also heard those candles are worthless (not enough heat to boil water, etc,) although I've never tried one. :confused:

Again though, unless you're bugging out to a boat or barren desert landscape, I question why you need any kind of stove, sans MAYBE a backpacking wood stove. But again, you can likely find some cans, rocks, random metal, etc, to make one on your own, or just cook over an open fire. I can't imagine too many places where there isn't stuff to burn. Wood, paper, upholstery, etc, etc, etc.

Now if you're bugging in, a camping stove, BBQ, backyard fire ring, etc, all sound like great ideas as we're not worrying about weight and space.

Cooking fires leave a trace when you move on.
Say you stay the night in the valley as your moving to the mountains. You make a small fire to cook your dinner or heat water.
If someone is following you, the ashes say "I was here and I cooked something"

Small backpacking stoves do not leave a trace.
For example
MSR Pocket rocket.
Isopropane fuel cannister.

Set it up, cook, take it down. No evidence.

There is definitely a place for the small backpacking stove.

OHOD

11-17-2011, 4:50 PM

I agree with the above post regarding camping. The more you camp, the more you know what you really need for short-midterm stays away from home. Also- the key to reducing your BOB and long-term emergency packs is knowledge. The more you KNOW about how to build, forage, hunt, cook, salvage water, and find/build shelter, the less you need to carry. Nature provides, and the Dude abides :)

Well said.
I have a GHB in my truck.

My BOB is used every time I go camping.

Salty

11-18-2011, 6:35 PM

Cooking fires leave a trace when you move on.
Say you stay the night in the valley as your moving to the mountains. You make a small fire to cook your dinner or heat water.
If someone is following you, the ashes say "I was here and I cooked something"

Small backpacking stoves do not leave a trace.
For example
MSR Pocket rocket.
Isopropane fuel cannister.

Set it up, cook, take it down. No evidence.

There is definitely a place for the small backpacking stove.

Not really something I'd personally worry too much about. The lighter your kit and the more experienced you are, the faster you're gonna move. Even .25mph faster makes a noticeable difference over the course of a day, let alone multiple days. Either way, I think the probability that you'll run out of fuel is significantly higher than the probability that someone will go on a multi-day stalking excursion trying to track you down. They're gonna have your foot prints either way, so I don't see what much of a difference it makes.

I'd also argue that you really don't need four different firearms to bug out. Pick one or two and be done with it. The added weight of all those guns and ammo is again gonna do more harm than good.

ElToro

11-19-2011, 2:21 PM

i have plenty of gear at home and am prepared for bad stuff once i make it home. wife and 2 small kids are always home. i work in san fran and live in the outer eat bay. if STHF when I'm at work, I'm in for a long walk. in my desk drawer at work i keep an innoccous backpack with a water bladder and a few gallons of fresh water. in my bag i have a change of cpants and some old boots and socks and a heavy hoodie ( i wear business outfit daily) and a ball cap of the local pro team some shelter provisions and some candy bars and a few cans of sardines/oysters /spam (protein and metal for future use) . also a leatherman and some matches and candles and a LED flashlight and small FAK. if SHTF when at work my plan is to fill the bladder with fresh water at the office and change clothes and take as much water as i can with me get the bag and head home. im prepared that it may be a 2 day trip. of course i dont have a gun because i cant leave one at work and it would be the end of my career if caught with one. if one of the major bridges goes out its head south to nearest friends or parents house. if a bridge is still open its head east to get home. i take BART everyday so my car is parked at the train station. i do keep some gear in my car. my work bag doesnt weigh much and just sits until it is hopefully never used. i rotate out the water and canned meat every 6 months or so. easy enough to just walk in the door at work with that and nobody even says anything. my plan is to not look like a business man wearing uncomfortable shoes and clothes but to change into normal street clothes and blend in and vamoose..

any suggestions for adding ? maybe a wool beanie for an outdoor sleepover and wool longjohns. maybe a safety orange vest that weighs nothing and costs little ? chemical light sticks ? again im looking at least 1 night overnight and possibly 2 to hike the 30-40 miles as the crow flies trip home. and while it doesnt snow here it could get really cold in the winter

in the bay area i fear a major quake or a terrorist event (dirty bomb)

Richard Erichsen

11-20-2011, 10:39 AM

Hoofin' it to where?

BOB's are worthless if you don't have a clear, safe, accessible destination in mind.
Unless, of course, you simply plan to use your BOB to BO to the local FEMA camp, where they'll take most of your stuff away anyways.

Better to make sure that you have enough to hunker down at home and work towards developing a solid retreat plan, then making your BOB.

But the fact that you're even thinking about preparedness at all puts you ahead of most people, so keep it up!

QQQ +100

A major flaw in most folks planning is not having multiple paths to multiple locations since any one of them could become inaccessible after a geographically or statistically probable event in CA: 1) Wildfires 2) Earthquakes 3) infectious disease outbreak

Any of these events, if large enough in scale, can lead to public disorder, loss of utilities and impassible roadways. There is a limit to how many supplies you can pack into a vehicle and its dramatically less if you carry it on your back.

How useful is a BOB when you can't even get out of your driveway because the traffic is backed up all the way onto your street and in all directions for 10 miles? At least one of the Plan X options needs to include sticking it out where you already are until you assess your immediate risks are too great to stay put.

Your house/apartment will at least have far more space for supplies than any car or bag could carry. If you don't smell smoke or see the flames, it may not be a good idea to leave. If it's a viral outbreak - you are exposing yourself to infection. After a major earthquake, you may not be able to traverse your local roadways to get out of your neighborhood with several hundred thousand people trying to do the same thing you are. Aftershocks can continue to heap on the damage and topple already damaged structures, including bridges and overpasses. Never assume you are going to be aware of an event before everyone else is, there is a good chance you may become aware right when everyone else does which means your options could be a lot more limited than your plan accounted for. Once again, did the reasons to leave really outweigh the reasons to stay put?

If you carry a lot of firearms and ammo (this is a gun board after all), you just displaced a lot of water that you'll now have to find on your way. Medical supplies don't usually weigh much, but they are usually quite bulky for their mass and are worth their weight in gold. Do you have any antibiotics in that pack? How complete is your first aid kit anyway? A scratch from falling or slipping because your pack was too heavy and you were tired is inconvenient on a normal hike a few miles from civilization in more stable times, but a minor injury could become lethal under these circumstances and more so if you are alone with no one to aid you. This is another consideration in "bug out" - who has your back?

After mindset, water is the key to surviving any of these major disasters. If the water available is not verifiable clean (color, smell, taste - testers indicate presence of toxins or microbes) and you don't have a way to carry a lot of it, you will need supplies to purify it and be well practiced in doing so. You don't want your first time using iodine, filters or other methods to be in the thick of it, dehydrated only to suddenly realize the instruction manual is missing, the label has fallen off or your vision is too blurry and your head pounding too severely to read it even if you had it. Some water treatment processes known to be effective with certain contaminants are also time consuming. You'll need to be able to automatically recognize how long it's going to take to filter and decontaminate a particular water supply and have test strips you know how to use to verify if the purification was successful.

In the summer months, packing a huge pack in the summer heat results in at least 2 gallons of water per person per day, not including water for cleaning your body (even with a towel dab and squirt for toothbrushing, it adds up fast). I don't think anyone needs a reminder as to just how heavy 4+ gallons of water is and that's just enough for one person for two days when you are exerting yourself in the heat.

You are literally carrying lead when you carry ammo, and something had to give (less food, less water, fewer medical supplies, fewer clothes, etc.) to carry several hundred rounds of ammunition in your favorite caliber(s). If you actually had to use any of it, could you reach it? Whats the plan to get your weapon out and engage in a firefight when you have 100+ lbs on your back and most of your next reload is deep in the pack? Is it even realistic you would last more than a few minutes under these conditions if you failed to recognize the danger you crossing into, weapons and ammo or not? If it came right down to it - drop your pack and escape with your life! The very act of dropping your overflow of heavy items or even your whole pack may slow down any aggressive pursuit, assuming the motivation for the assault is for the supplies you are carrying. A big backback is broadcasting the same thing a large SUV with supplies strapped to the roof and visible through the windows: "I have a lot of stuff to steal!"

An exposed weapon might deter some attacks by a lone adversary or someone not similarly armed, but it may have the opposite effect if outnumbered as you can reasonably guarantee if you are alone and on foot. Once again, was it wise to leave your original position to be exposed, in the open and possibly cut off from any of several possible destinations, including where you just came from?

How far are you going? Where are you going? How long can you last between point of origin and your destination? What happens if you lose some of those supplies? What supplies do you have where you are going? What's plan B, C, D and E if A fails completely or proves impossible to even start? Is it too late to go back the way you came if you are finding all reasonable paths closed to you?

Buying packs and gear is all fine and good, but the planning (which is free) is where 99% of the attention needs to go. Without a comprehensive plan, what are you buying and why? You might have been better off using your funds to upgrade your doors and windows, investing in a bore-hole well if you live in an area you can obtain one, adding sealable containers and food packing materials to your pantry or garage and coming up with a plan involving neighbors and nearby friends. Bug out should be a LAST resort with all the risks weighed out, not a knee jerk reaction to an event.

R

jmsenk

11-20-2011, 11:04 AM

any suggestions for adding ? maybe a wool beanie for an outdoor sleepover and wool longjohns. maybe a safety orange vest that weighs nothing and costs little ? chemical light sticks ? again im looking at least 1 night overnight and possibly 2 to hike the 30-40 miles as the crow flies trip home. and while it doesnt snow here it could get really cold in the winter

in the bay area i fear a major quake or a terrorist event (dirty bomb)

Not sure what is included in your shelter provisions, but if you don't have it, you might want to pick up an emergency space blanket. they weigh next to nothing, cost is negligible, and I have spent many a cold night nice and toasty underneath one. for a few dollars more (litterally, like $4) you can buy one with grommets and a subduded color on one side that work quite well as a shelter in itself (combined with bungee cords, etc.)

Also, if you're going to be marching 30-40 miles over two days (as the crow flies... so think more like 50-60 miles) and you're not used to making those kinds of movements then make sure your FAK includes stuff for blisters and swollen feet, and at least one extra pair of socks. I can tell you from experience, when on a long movement, there is nothing that feels quite as good as changing to a fresh pair of socks. It will bring you back to life.

You may have it as part of your daily carry (I do) but a tactical folder would be of use in addition to your leatherman. an assisted opening blade clipped to your pocket can save your *** in a situation where you need it - especially since carrying a gun is practically impossible in this state, while a leatherman would be too cumbersome and time consuming to use.

ElToro

11-20-2011, 2:03 PM

thanks i will throw one of my spyderco's in the bag and i do have one of those heavier duty space blankets with green on one side. the flimsy foil ones are worthless. i will also throw another pair of socks in and upgrade my FAK. also will ad a roll of TP

lacking a gun makes me concerned about getting home in a SHTF situation but its walk or nothing in the event of a major earthquake and staying in downtown SF for an extended period even if its hanging out at a co -workers place that lives in the city is an option but getting home to my family is the priority. i could see SF and oakland going up in riots if something bad happens. look how they act when its relatively good times

Salty

11-23-2011, 6:39 PM

How complete is your first aid kit anyway?

This is definitely something for everyone to think about, whether it's in your car, at home, on your boat, in your bugout bag, etc. As someone trained in search and rescue, nothing irritates me more than a first aid kit full of nothing but band-aids! Unfortunately, this accounts for most small commercially available first aid kits. Band-aids are great, but nine times out of ten if all you need is a band-aid, YOU AREN'T GOING TO DIE! Your number 1 supply should be gloves (that you know fit you), and those should be the first thing you see when you open your kit. Use them. Next should be life saving gear (and knowledge) like gauze pads (lots of them), a knowledge of pressure points used to stop bleeding, a tourniquet (you NEED training to use this), a space blanket to prevent hypothermia, benadryl, a spare epipen if anyone in your likely party needs one, etc. Next work on mobility, you want to get out of here right? Splints, moleskin, sling, etc. Being stranded in the wrong place may in fact kill you. After you've got all that covered, THEN start lookin' at band-aids, poison oak soap, asprin, tweezers, etc.

Note: I understand that the small cuts and scrapes typically treated by band-aids can potentially become fatal if infected, etc, but they are far far less likely to than something like say... arterial spray... work on that first.

fourXfour

11-23-2011, 8:06 PM

This is a great thread. I never knew what INCH bag meant. I definitely will start re-organizing my gear. Most of my bags are dedicated to just ammo or just MRE's. An INCH bag setup will need some work.

1. Get Home Bag for the car. Spare ammo for my EDC (compact firearm), FAK, MRE, water, basic survival kit and extra clothes. Fairly light if I have to walk.

2. Bug Out Bag - Additional supplies for a temporary evacuation. Shoulder weapon of choice and a full size handgun. Possibly discreet transportation of firearms

3. INCH bag - Full on survival gear. Camping supplies and hunting supplies. More of a focus on .22LR and Shotgun rounds for hunting needs in addition to your defensive firearms. Basics in a pack if you have to walk or as much as you can load into a vehicle.

chris

11-23-2011, 9:15 PM

Also, if you're going to be marching 30-40 miles over two days (as the crow flies... so think more like 50-60 miles) and you're not used to making those kinds of movements then make sure your FAK includes stuff for blisters and swollen feet, and at least one extra pair of socks. I can tell you from experience, when on a long movement, there is nothing that feels quite as good as changing to a fresh pair of socks. It will bring you back to life.

what i used to do to my old green jungle boots and yes i said green jungle boots is use duct tape on the heel. it would reduce friction on my heels. but also guys and gals invest in good boot socks they alone will make your day no matter what you are doing.

jmsenk

12-01-2011, 12:34 AM

what i used to do to my old green jungle boots and yes i said green jungle boots is use duct tape on the heel. it would reduce friction on my heels. but also guys and gals invest in good boot socks they alone will make your day no matter what you are doing.

I wore the Green Jungles back when I was a 17 yr old PVT jmsenk, pre black beret, pre war on terror, training to fight communists (I still hate those guys) back when it was "Be all you can be" etc. etc. (Sorry, I joined up in Jan 2000... I'm not THAT old) and our cure-all was electrical tape - typically down the achilles and on the toes (these were MY problem areas, and they're different for everyone) my old Platoon Sergeant (Panama Ranger... oh boy did he have some stories) told me never to use Duct Tape, and silly me, I never asked why not.

Packy14

12-01-2011, 12:55 AM

i have 3 bug-out-bags... one at home, one in the car, one in the gf's car...because the bag is no good if you don't have it with you or you can't get to it. If your only bag is in the car..what if your garage collapses... what if you're not in your car but the sig other's? They constantly evolve, but they do so in parallel. My latest idea is to go with one ammo caliber for all handguns, so I can shoot it and so can she; I picked 9mm. My new bag is the blackhawk X-1 raptor (her car has a smaller one that is similar) for house and my car. have fun.

Salty

12-01-2011, 4:18 PM

I don't really have blister problems, but the modern standard for hikers seems to be "moleskin".

Realistically though, someone who is not used to hiking 15-20 miles a day or doing a crap ton of exercise is not going to hike 15-20 miles a day out of the blue. Depending on pack weight, fitness level, foot comfort, etc, a person like that may be lucky to do even just 10 mile. Not sure what ElToro's experience level is, but it's just something worth mentioning for anyone planning out a long route.

jmsenk

12-02-2011, 11:36 AM

I don't really have blister problems, but the modern standard for hikers seems to be "moleskin".

Realistically though, someone who is not used to hiking 15-20 miles a day or doing a crap ton of exercise is not going to hike 15-20 miles a day out of the blue. Depending on pack weight, fitness level, foot comfort, etc, a person like that may be lucky to do even just 10 mile. Not sure what ElToro's experience level is, but it's just something worth mentioning for anyone planning out a long route.

Very true - I have used moleskin before, but had an issue with it not sticking too well when I sweat, and then it just turns into a big blister producing ball on my foot. They're good for padding around existing blisters after a long hike, but if I'm marching again, i'll cover it with more tape to keep it in place.

And yes, no one is going to just step out with a pack and cover 20 miles without being prepared before hand. A lot of "regular" people (meaning not preppers, soldiers, backpackers, etc.) assume that hiking with a pack might as well be walking. Nope, not even close. if you're not used to it, it will wear you out in a heartbeat, you'll work muscles you didn't even know you had, and if you push hard, the next day you won't even be able to move.

The best option I would say in an emergency situation, or one where you have to cover 30+ miles to get home, is to do it in spurts. Go 3 or 4 miles and then stop. drop your pack and plan your next route. Cache it (hide it) and get to some high ground to see what you can see. get your wind back, and keep going. Find a good place to camp out and take a nap (OPSEC permitting) during the heat of the day, and then keep pushing later. 12-15 miles a day is still going to kick your ***, but it is a lot more manageable in 4-5 mile incriments. It will keep you alert and focused, instead of just zombie walking and putting one foot in front of the other. Think of it as security halts like on a patrol, so you don't stumble blindly into a bad situation.

Total weight is only 10-12 lbs with food, water, fuel, and spare clothes

BigCat

01-24-2012, 7:59 PM

As a member of another site that will remained unmentioned as im not sure of CalGuns Rules of advertising other sites, after you find burried the acronym thread for that site (took me months to learn your guy's acronyms here) there are several bags/packs you can make.

A BOB (Bun Out Bag)/GHB (Get Home Bag) is generally considered a 72 hour bag that covers your basic essentials. Food, Water, Shelter. Generally you can carry 72 hours worth of food on your person. 72 hours of water weighs a lot, so water covers a way to collect, store, and purify water. Shelter is shelter from the elements, could include a trash bag that can serve many purposes one of which im sure you all are aware of is a rain poncho. extra cold weather gear depending on the time of year and your location, a hat/sunscreen/sunglasses if you are in a very sunny/hot environment, an emergency shelter of some sorts to keep rain/sun off of you. The shelter usually includes some sort of paracord, duct tape, and or a fire starting kit (matches/flint and steel, and tinder/wetfire/cotton ball in petroleum jelly.

On top of the basic necessities, people include basic tools such as a multitool, light, radio, etc. in their BOBs. Also navigation is big as you need to be able to get from point A to B reliably. Some, depending on their AO (Area of Operation) will carry personal protection, this usually includes a pistol/ammo concealed. The school of thought is to not look all tacticool looking like you are prepared, but to be as grey man and blend in as possible. Hard to do with 6 bags and guns hanging off you or tac vests and lots of ammo.

Im guilty of not being so grey man as I am on a budget and have bought lots of Mil Sup gear. So I will most likely move to my BOL at night to hopefully not be seen by as many people and use less water.

Realistically thats what you need to SURVIVE for 72 hours or how you can realistically Bug Out. What most of your are talking about is a INCH bag, or Im Never Coming Home bag. This is an end of the world bag usually weighing way more than any one person can carry and would have to be carried by a horse/car/atv to a BOL (bug out location) where you would reestablish your own since of civilization. But a BOB is ultimately meant to get you to a BOL where you can hopefully store most of your INCH items. The Flip side to a BOL is to Bug In and stock up your home (usually the plan for people living in large urban cities or dont own/know people with rural property). In which case you wouldnt make an INCH bag you would fortify your home.

So my advice to the OP (Original Poster) would be to concentrate on where you would go in a Zombie/End of the World/PAW (Post Apocalyptic War) and make a bag that would get you from point A to B and Store your End of the World supplies at a BOL. If you want more information on a community of like minded individuals, I would be happy to point you in the direction of a very big, helpful, and friendly community. the last 2 only apply if you are asking how to be better prepared, not ask for a place to crash when the time comes.

WokMaster1

01-24-2012, 9:04 PM

i have plenty of gear at home and am prepared for bad stuff once i make it home. wife and 2 small kids are always home. i work in san fran and live in the outer eat bay. if STHF when I'm at work, I'm in for a long walk. in my desk drawer at work i keep an innoccous backpack with a water bladder and a few gallons of fresh water. in my bag i have a change of cpants and some old boots and socks and a heavy hoodie ( i wear business outfit daily) and a ball cap of the local pro team some shelter provisions and some candy bars and a few cans of sardines/oysters /spam (protein and metal for future use) . also a leatherman and some matches and candles and a LED flashlight and small FAK. if SHTF when at work my plan is to fill the bladder with fresh water at the office and change clothes and take as much water as i can with me get the bag and head home. im prepared that it may be a 2 day trip. of course i dont have a gun because i cant leave one at work and it would be the end of my career if caught with one. if one of the major bridges goes out its head south to nearest friends or parents house. if a bridge is still open its head east to get home. i take BART everyday so my car is parked at the train station. i do keep some gear in my car. my work bag doesnt weigh much and just sits until it is hopefully never used. i rotate out the water and canned meat every 6 months or so. easy enough to just walk in the door at work with that and nobody even says anything. my plan is to not look like a business man wearing uncomfortable shoes and clothes but to change into normal street clothes and blend in and vamoose..

any suggestions for adding ? maybe a wool beanie for an outdoor sleepover and wool longjohns. maybe a safety orange vest that weighs nothing and costs little ? chemical light sticks ? again im looking at least 1 night overnight and possibly 2 to hike the 30-40 miles as the crow flies trip home. and while it doesnt snow here it could get really cold in the winter

in the bay area i fear a major quake or a terrorist event (dirty bomb)

ElToro, you & I are on the same boat. I work in SF & live in West CoCo. We should pull our resources together & work as a team. Shoot me a PM if you are interested.