Bath to Tile Shower Conversion

Hello, I've read some of the posts on the this and really love the feel and advice. So I thought I would join.

Although I've read as much as I could I haven't found something that directly described my situation but have definitely gained some insight.

I live in an apartment and own, we have an ensuite washroom and there used to be a tub there. We are in the process of changing it to a tile shower - hence title of post. Anyway I know about the whole underlay, PVC coating, concrete wall sheets, etc. But where I lack lots of DIY is plumbing knowledge.

I will not be installing a shower 'base' and will pour concrete at 1/4" for every 1' of length -- making my own base. The concrete slab is cut right through, and my P-Trap is in the neighbours apartment below me. I have also already bought the membrane for the floor, and will line the backeboard with lining as well.

My problem here is the overflow. How you you go about removing the overflow (cap overflow, pour into concrete, raise drain??) and whats the most efficient way of tie-ing into the existing plumbing.

Is removing the p-trap and bringing it all back up the only way? What drains do I have as options? Which one would be the best to use?

Good Idea checking on some plumbing advice. First off that is the old tub works you have there. You P-Trap is below the back overflow side closest to the wall. You will need to remove the fire stopping that surrounds this piping and cut out that old bath overflow and waste section. We find a Dremel and 20 cut off blades works well for tight quarters. I showed the process somewhere here one day.

Those walls. Which are yours and which are your neighbours? Remeber that multi family reno's you need fire rated processes - often fireboard is required behind backer board. So in your case you might need fire board, then your shower liner and then concrete board.

I would use a cast iron clamping drain. Watts makes one. Zurn has one. ACO makes one (and some great linear drains for across that back wall).

Make sure you understand firecodes for your walls and floor penetrations and make sure you remove that old plumbing. The process is difficult and takes me most times 1-3 hours depending on how steady my hand is and how big the through hole is. Hilti makes great fireproofing products for the repairs.

Thanks for the reply, the only walls that are not mine are: top and bottom, and far 5ft wall that runs parallel to the 'lip'. I will lay durock over the 2x4 and also lay it with membrane. I have seen this and I know its not standard practice it will suffice. But just for next time what is the officially used material?

As for fire ratings -- the removed tub liner and drywall, wasn't fire rated. The Durock I used has is fire rated, so the walls are not a problem... again before the reno there was regular drywall in there. The floor where the concrete and piping drain meeting point is is a little more of a concern. That hole needs to be fire-rated. Any suggestions for what to put there? There will be concrete on top of the hole but I dont think it will be enough. Could I fill it with a sturdier insulation?

So cut after the ptrap -- dremel amazing IDEA! thank you. Beats getting a grinder through the gap :/ Linear drains would be nice but are too pricey around here. I will stick with a square and butt it up against the tiles.

Mike I sell ACO linear drains and provide one hour design for all my clients. I prefer these drains since any waterproofing process can be used with them (as long as they are approved).

Your drain will need to be quite close to the short wall of the shower. So your rubber liner is going to go crazy. If you can after the firestopping is removed see how much room you have to bring the drain closer away from the wall. Often we can sit the new drain to the front edge of the hole in the concrete floor.

We drive in a few pins (1/4" Galvanized pipe rod) into the sides of these holes after the fireblocking work is done.

I would need to know a lot of information to pick the best approach for you. Once you remove the firestopping and get the old tub works removed let us know how things look and we can re asses.

This is awesome advice. Thank you so much Terry. You've made me realize things I would have realized on a day when I'm just trying to move ahead with the project and would have kept getting 'stuck', and we all know thats not fun.

Tucked corner, Pig ear, got it -- those are the easy parts no

I will update you with pictures in about 30 minutes when I get back to apartment, I would have loved to purchase from you maybe if you have a supplier in toronto?

Again thanks for the help its been awesome. Couple more q's sparked.... This 1.5" noble company thing is used for low piping, could I fold up the edge to get the drain right up against the wall? Once I cut existing could I add an elbow to bring it more toward the center? or does the ptrap have to stay a p with no elbows in it?

Mike what are the measurements of this shower with the existing walls and curb in place?

Careful how much pressure you apply to those pipes when removing the old tub's drain. You also don't want to send done large chunks of firestopping and concrete when you bust through. We have on occasion gone through from below and then repaired and repainted the neighbors ceiling. Do they have a Hilti shop near you? I go in to buy just what I need for each job since the product needs to be fresh and the material is pricy. Prepare to drop about $60.00-$100.00 to properly firestop and repair the old through hole.

FWIW, in the US, codes PROHIBIT anyone but a licensed plumber to work on any multi-family construction - IOW, the homeowner CANNOT do the plumbing (and often electrical) work himself UNLESS he is a licensed tradesman. I do not know how building permits and this sort of thing works in Canada, but would expect a reasonably sized city like Toronto is probably similar to the US codes.

It isn't clear to me that you have the fine details of a shower construction down. There are LOTS of different approved methods, but the details on each of them must be followed, and mixing and matching or short-changing even one detail can compromise the integrity of the thing. While it isn't actually hard, it is VERY detail oriented. You don't want to be trying to reinvent the wheel here...there's a reason why only certain methods are approved.

If you're building a conventional, backerboard, liner equipped shower...the shower pan isn't really 'poured', it is shaped with deck mud, then the liner is installed (the liner MUST be sloped to the drain), then another layer of deck mud is installed parallel to the sloped pan and liner, then you can tile. There are details on how to cut, seal, and shape the liner over the curb, how high that liner must be, and how to get a tileable surface on the curb without compromising the waterproofing (you CANNOT just nail or screw cbu onto the top and sides of the liner and expect it to be waterproof!).

Canada has some specific rules on how to build a shower, and the TCNA handbook is also, I think, acceptable as a standard in Canada. Each of them outlines multiple ways to build a quality, leakproof shower. You need to become familiar with one or more of those documents.

I should shove a ball in the drain right? And fill it to an inch and see water escapes. Why do you want to see a picture of the flood test? I have another problem, I've silicone everything and only have one small leak in the corner @ glass frame no biggy. But because of the awesome design (not) of the shower column the spray is directed straight toward the door! And the lip (unsloped) when I open the door water sitting on the pours out! Rubber bumper is the only way at this point right? Sigh? Can you help me?

I should shove a ball in the drain right? And fill it to an inch and see water escapes. Why do you want to see a picture of the flood test? I have another problem, I've silicone everything and only have one small leak in the corner @ glass frame no biggy. But because of the awesome design (not) of the shower column the spray is directed straight toward the door! And the lip (unsloped) when I open the door water sitting on the pours out! Rubber bumper is the only way at this point right? Sigh? Can you help me?

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I like to see them to know they where done. It also shows other DIYers that the step is not hard and easy to preform.

Any way to drill a weep hole somewhere to let some water drain away?

Any way to add some flat bar stock to the frame on an angle so it makes no room for water to sit there?

I find this so interesting. Remember how our local expert of all things (Big Red Shoe) says linking to the JB forum is a tit for tat? Here in this post you can see Jim answering plumbing questions on John's forum. No link to Terry's Forum. Just Jim taking info he learns here and posting it there. I see this all the time.