Skye1013 wrote:I can't really comment on the average mana used per pull, but from what I've been reading, spirit stacking isn't as vital for disc thanks to Rapture (which benefits more from Int.) EJ actually did some maths that shows using GHeal w/ Inner Focus on cd actually provides better healing return for the roughly the same mana cost as using just Heal. Penance should be used pretty much on CD and unless you're a raid healer, which is one of discs weaker points, PW:S should only be used to maintain Rapture, which severely reduces the need to stack Mastery (that's probably a run-on sentence, but hopefully my point still gets through XD.) I know this may not be completely helpful to your question, but might give you some ideas of things you can try.

Unfortunately I'm only limited to 5 mans now and that basically counts as raid healing with the group acting like moths. I know that rapture is great mana return, but damn is it hard to time it so that a shield breaks when the CD is up. I'll give the whole "stick to gheal with IF" bit a shot when servers come up. Still a tad nervous of healing somebody in a heroic that wants to aoe everything in greens.

I actually have an addon to tell me when the cd is up. What I was referring to is when I have to, or am able to, cast multiple shields on people taking what "seems" to be regular damage. One will break before rapture goes off and with 1k left on the shield it sits there and they don't take damage again. Then I have to wait for the next shield to break before rapture procs again.

Basically I'm wanting to have rapture on CD perpetually so I don't "waste" and potential regen from it and get the most out of my shields as I can. And I mean waste in the same sense that if you are at full mana you're wasting your spirit regen.

Levantine wrote:ITT: Nika being an arse and forgetting to spec a mandatory healing Priest talent.

Shhhhh!

/snicker

Brekkie:Tanks are like shitty DPS. And healers are like REALLY distracted DPSAmirya:Why yes, your penis is longer than his because you hit 30k dps in the first 10 seconds. But guess what? That raid boss has a dick bigger than your ego. Flex:I don't make mistakes. I execute carefully planned strategic group wipes.Levie:(in /g) It's weird, I have a collar and I dont know where I got it from, Worgen are kinky!Levie:Drunk Lev goes and does what he pleases just to annoy sober Lev.Sagara:You see, you need to *spread* the bun before you insert the hot dog.

I'm resurrecting this thread since I raid as disc, and I'd like to add my perspective on some things mentioned in this thread (I'm still sad at times that I haven't raided with my prot paladin in a year). I have a mix of heroic and raid gear, so this should give you an idea a snapshot of what it's like part way through progression.

Normally I tend to use a Archangel/Atonement build that takes Soul Warding and Train of Thought (preference to ToT). This gives me the flexibility to use multiple PW:S in a short span, the ability to use Smite for melee/tank cover as needed, and a boost to the effectiveness of the IF+GHeal macro when I need it. Sometimes, though, I will be tasked with tank healing, and then I will swap in Strength of Soul for Atonement and drop Archangel for Darkness.

Soul Warding: You want it. Once you are working in heroic/raid level gearing, maintaining several bubbles is viable. Additionally, shield spamming is still viable for expected AoE--you just have to be more intelligent about planning for it due to the long Rapture CD. I prefer it to Surge of Light as at my level of gearing the absorb exceeds the output of Flash Heal (39k shield vs. 25k FH) , and I rarely find myself in a position of needing to chain Flash Heals on a single target (mostly due to an intact healing team that's been together for over 10 months now). The lone exception thus far is the Chimaeron fight, but I cop out and spec to Holy for it.

Strength of Soul is a very strong situational talent. If you are tasked with covering a tank, it will increase the number of shields you can place on your target if you're dropping GHeals on them(which you should be). I drop it, though, if I am being tasked with raid healing, as it's viability diminishes rapidly if you aren't focusing on a few select targets to heal.

bldavis wrote:if you are in heavy aoe healing (which you shouldnt be as disc, but shit happens) then the PoH glyph is really nice

You absolutely should be aoe healing as disc. Granted Disc aoe healing doesn't have the multitude of options that Holy does, it's still viable. PoH always procs Divine Aegis (which benefits from mastery), and the healing it does warrants not only usage but also getting the glyph. PoH and the resultant DA procs usually accounts for ~30% of my healing done in a given fight. Also, depending on your raid group, Atonement won't hit everyone since ranged tend to wander away, so for me PoH becomes the go-to raid heal for those individuals. I also boost PoH by coupling it to Power Infusion on a macro, much as I link Inner Focus with GHeal.

As for stats, I aim to soft-cap haste when raid buffed (assuming a high BT up-time). After that I focus on Intellect, Crit, and Mastery since, as levantine mentioned, the synergy between them is highly effective for Disc specs. The more you crit, the more DA procs you get and the stronger your Mastery stat becomes. If I am tank healing, I grab more haste by getting Darkness and sacrificing Archangel. I'm generally too lazy to reforge for haste in those case, though doing so would certainly help.

http://www.wowhead.com/talent#bfGorRsbcRMochM:qVcodqz0M is the build I generally use. I glyph Mass Dispel rather than Smite because for two reasons. First, using Holy Fire is a dps/heal loss over straight Smite spamming. With the changes to Holy Fire in 4.1, though, this will need re-evaluation. Second, after years of reduced cast time for Mass Dispel, I simply feel impotent if I don't have the reduced cast time. I also take Levitate so I can watch unsuspecting raid members float off of the elevator in BWD and into the lava pool. (Protip for Holy: If you cast Levitate at the top of the arch of a Body and Soul boosted jump off the elevator, you can float across the entire pool and land at the steps leading to Atramedes).

Last edited by Halcya on Thu Mar 24, 2011 2:09 pm, edited 1 time in total.

daemonym wrote:I have a question of my own for disc. I'm running my space goat through normal mode dungeons to get a feel for the UI and spec. All of my other toons I use only 1-2 addons in order to help me play better. However even in grim batol with a level 85 tank in all tank gear and an acceptable spec I tend to drop 20-30k mana per pull.

All of my gear has spirit on it minus one with an int trink and a spirit trink. I'm gemming for straight int and picking up the occasional socket bonus with either spirit or mastery gems.

I checked recount on a few random pulls and saw I did only a few thousand over healing which translated into wasting half of a greater heal while "most" of my shields broke. The last 1-2 tend not to be fully used up, but they're always put onto melee that stand in cleaves and assorted bad stuff.

My question really is am I doing something wrong or is spending that much mana on your average pull normal ish?

From this and your other posts I don't think you are doing anything wrong per se so much as you have dps which are taking avoidable damage. This, coupled with your gear level, should have you 20% down on mana for each pull. Getting your dps to be more mindful of their positioning should alleviate a lot of it.

Halcya wrote:a position of needing to chain Flash Heals on a single target

Granted, I just started playing my disc priest again, but it's my understanding that GHeal is better than spam FHeal.

Is this not the case?

Fetzie wrote:The Defias Brotherhood is back, and this time they are acting as racketeers in Goldshire. Anybody wishing to dance for money must now pay them protection money or be charged triple the normal amount when repairing.

No, GH is always better than flash heal. You absolutely should never find yourself in the position where having to chain more than one flash is ever the right way to heal. If you do, either you or your group is doing something horrendously wrong.

Put it this way, in that Deadmines we did a while ago I never had to cast more than a single flash heal. I agree that SoS is an okay situational talent (i.e. you know you're going to be tank healing 90% of the time), but I've yet to come into a situation where I found shield spamming to be a more attractive option than PoH spam to warrant picking up Soul Warding.

Surge of Light is also horrible. Always. Especially as disc. I'd drop it in my Holy spec too if there were better things to put the points in at that level (there aren't).

surge of light is decent as holy if you get a proc right when your tank starts taking heavy damage

other than that, i dont even use FoL

Brekkie:Tanks are like shitty DPS. And healers are like REALLY distracted DPSAmirya:Why yes, your penis is longer than his because you hit 30k dps in the first 10 seconds. But guess what? That raid boss has a dick bigger than your ego. Flex:I don't make mistakes. I execute carefully planned strategic group wipes.Levie:(in /g) It's weird, I have a collar and I dont know where I got it from, Worgen are kinky!Levie:Drunk Lev goes and does what he pleases just to annoy sober Lev.Sagara:You see, you need to *spread* the bun before you insert the hot dog.

Levantine wrote:I don't like RNG in my healing. It's also the reason I believe crit to be absolutely worthless as a stat on healer gear.

did i say i liked it?its just nice when it happens to proc

Brekkie:Tanks are like shitty DPS. And healers are like REALLY distracted DPSAmirya:Why yes, your penis is longer than his because you hit 30k dps in the first 10 seconds. But guess what? That raid boss has a dick bigger than your ego. Flex:I don't make mistakes. I execute carefully planned strategic group wipes.Levie:(in /g) It's weird, I have a collar and I dont know where I got it from, Worgen are kinky!Levie:Drunk Lev goes and does what he pleases just to annoy sober Lev.Sagara:You see, you need to *spread* the bun before you insert the hot dog.

I thought I'd read on EJ that that was the way to do it, but that haste and mastery became interchangeable at certain levels...

I've kind of been going for haste over spirit for two reasons... generally spirit is already on the gear already and secondly because I really don't like slower heals (which probably isn't really justifiable).

However, one of the best healers I've ever known told me they actually preferred crit on their disc gear because of divine aegis (which they indicated was usually in their top three heals on Recount - IF I REMEMBER CORRECTLY).

i really cant say anything as i am a holy priest..so ya...levie? or any other disc?

Brekkie:Tanks are like shitty DPS. And healers are like REALLY distracted DPSAmirya:Why yes, your penis is longer than his because you hit 30k dps in the first 10 seconds. But guess what? That raid boss has a dick bigger than your ego. Flex:I don't make mistakes. I execute carefully planned strategic group wipes.Levie:(in /g) It's weird, I have a collar and I dont know where I got it from, Worgen are kinky!Levie:Drunk Lev goes and does what he pleases just to annoy sober Lev.Sagara:You see, you need to *spread* the bun before you insert the hot dog.

Last time I checked Disc was fairly apathetic when it came to secondary stats. There was no clear winner for them like there was for holy, and they all kinda made the others more effective. My rule of thumb would have been to keep them about equal through reforging unless I felt lacking in a certain area eg haste.

There has been a lot of discussion about secondary stats, and really for Disc it comes down to whichever you feel most comfortable with.

Spirit is less needed due to Rapture (which is getting a slight buff according to the last bits I read on MMO-champion) and Shadowfiend/Hymn of Hope (both become better through Int and potentially Haste)

Haste is nice to increase your throughput, but does little for mana conservation (though I believe allows HoH to tick faster, which allows you to get back to healing quicker, and should increase your SF attack speed.)

Crit procs Divine Aegis, which becomes more powerful with Mastery, but potentially causes overheal from some spells.

Mastery is good for PoH (guaranteed DA) and PW:S builds.

I believe the general consensus is to try and keep them fairly balanced for Disc. PW:S spammers (which isn't really the best way to do things anymore) would want Mastery > Crit > Haste. PoH favors Haste > Mastery > Crit. GHeal would be similar to PoH (since Crit potentially makes for a lot of overheal, though the DA bubble can be quite nice.) Smite builds would likely want Haste > Crit > Mastery (more damage done = more healing/shorter fights).

I guess (if my assumptions are correct) Haste is the most favored stat (minus PW:S spammers) and Mastery/Crit would be determined more by your specific healing style, though there really aren't any clear winners.