Reaserch may have shown YOUR pasture lacking in vital vitamins or minerals but mine are just fine thank you.

Before you attempt to load your horse with something it may not need test the pasture. Just because a research result showed one thing under certain cercumstances does not mean it applies in areas with differend peramiters.

I agree with the above.

Quote:

Suuuuuuuuure 32 % is reallly low. 32% is 32% just because you feed less of it does not alter the content. By your reasoning you are saying "lets not spread what I plan to have today in lets say in sugur in candies and other food and lets put it all in ONE cup and down it all at once so my poor kidneys get a hugh shock".

Once again less quantity does NOT reduce the quality.

I HIGHLY disagree here. OF COURSE it alters the content. If you feed LESS of something, then the horse will get less. Percentage is percentage. What your horse actually CONSUMES is what matters.

So, if you're giving your horse 20 lbs of 8% protein hay or pasture a day, then that horse is getting 1.6 lbs of protein.

If your horse is getting 1 lbs of 32% protein RB, then he's getting another 5 OUNCES of protein.

If your horse is getting 5 lbs of 12% protein sweet feed, then he's getting another 9-10 OUNCES of protein.

Which is the lower protein diet then? Why, the RB diet!!

Yes, high protein DIETS are not good for some horses. But the WHOLE DIET must be high in protein. Like if you were giving your horse 15 lbs a day of straight Alfalfa hay at 17% protein plus 6 lbs a day of a high performance grain/feed that was 16% protein, then yes, that would be bad. Your horse would be consuming about 3 1/2 lbs of protein a day.

However, if you're feeding 20 lbs of grass hay with 1 lb of a Ration Balancer, then your horse is only getting about 1 3/4 lbs of protein daily. That is quiet low.

Yes, high protein DIETS are not good for some horses. But the WHOLE DIET must be high in protein. Like if you were giving your horse 15 lbs a day of straight Alfalfa hay at 17% protein plus 6 lbs a day of a high performance grain/feed that was 16% protein, then yes, that would be bad. Your horse would be consuming about 3 1/2 lbs of protein a day.

The actual protein CONCENTRATION would be 16.5 and concentration is what I am arguing not the amount.

However, if you're feeding 20 lbs of grass hay with 1 lb of a Ration Balancer, then your horse is only getting about 1 3/4 lbs of protein daily. That is quiet low.

Sorry but no matter how you slice it putting in any feed with very high level of protein is a shock to the kidneys.

Case in point...I put my horse at a place where he was being fed 4 flakes of hay daily along with regular grain at 10%. They were told the hay was high in protein..................and it was after some suspicious things happening it was tested and came up at 28% protein level. Now by your reasoning that is a better feed program than if he got 9 flakes of hay at 12% protein.

Fortunately all the horses recovered but their urine was a gashly color and one was very, very sick.

spyder do the math ... it speaks for itself figure the GRAMS of protien ... then we'll talk

You are so hung up on the % that you don't get the conversions at all

5 lbs of 12% is .6lbs of protien 212 grams
1lb at 32% is .32lbs of protien 113 grams of protien

You are dealing with quantity and I am dealing with quality. Since horses need to have food in their stomachs I would rather feed more (quantity) than give them a smaller dose of overly rich food that will hit their kidneys at the (to me ) toxic level of protein.

Spyder, my point is THE CONCENTRATION DOES NOT MATTER! A high protein diet is the amount your horse CONSUMES total, for the WHOLE DAY. 1 lb of a 32% protein feed is NOT a high protein diet when fed with Timothy or Grass hay and no other grains or feeds, PERIOD. I am sorry you're not getting it, but there it is, plain and simple. I'm not sure how else to explain it.

You are dealing with quantity and I am dealing with quality. Since horses need to have food in their stomachs I would rather feed more (quantity) than give them a smaller dose of overly rich food that will hit their kidneys at the (to me ) toxic level of protein.

YES!! EXACTLY!!! That is the WHOLE REASON Peggy and I push supplements or ration balancers. It is MUCH healthier for the horse to get MORE HAY, or beet pulp, or hay pellets, and LESS feed, grains, or concentrates. It is exponentially healthier for a horse to consume 90% of his diet in forage, hay, or hay products, with 10% or less in grain products.

Also, to get to a toxic level of protein, a horse would have to 6-10 lbs of a 32% feed a day for an extended period of time. 1-2 lbs is the recommended level.

Spyder, my point is THE CONCENTRATION DOES NOT MATTER! A high protein diet is the amount your horse CONSUMES total, for the WHOLE DAY. 1 lb of a 32% protein feed is NOT a high protein diet when fed with Timothy or Grass hay and no other grains or feeds, PERIOD. I am sorry you're not getting it, but there it is, plain and simple. I'm not sure how else to explain it.

You are also not getting it.

I saw your idea of 1 lb of high level concentration done daily. And over a month we all breathed a sigh of relief that all horses survived.

Sorry but a RB is simply not needed for every horse out there and putting big bold letters to make it seem like it is the only idea that is viable is a little over the top don't you think.

People can make choices the last I read so there is no period about it.

Can we please keep this on track?
I know that the percentages are important, but i was looking for different types of ration balancers to feed my horses, not get into a whole debate as to why someone should/shouldn't feed a RB.

Thank you Peggy for taking the time out to help me, and to hotreddun and L2R for helping me as well.

I saw your idea of 1 lb of high level concentration done daily. And over a month we all breathed a sigh of relief that all horses survived.

Sorry but a RB is simply not needed for every horse out there and putting big bold letters to make it seem like it is the only idea that is viable is a little over the top don't you think.

People can make choices the last I read so there is no period about it.

I don't feed a ration balancer either. I prefer alfalfa pellets (which are 15-17% protein) and a vitamin supplement. However, I feed more AP that I would an RB, coming out to nearly the same protein content. How is that any different?

How is 1 lb of RB any different to a horse than 6-8 lbs of sweet feed? It's the same nutrients, the same amount of protein (or less really, in the case of an RB). The ration balancer has less sugar and starch, which are FAR worse for the horse than a little extra protein...

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