Biking videos...dipping my toe

I'm about to take delivery of a Drift HD and realise that I know absolutely nothing about making videos/setting the camera up/best position for shots/etc.

I'm starting to think blowing my bonus on a camera for filming biking stuff may not have been quite as good an idea as it sounded when I hit 'purchase'!

Anyway, I've watched a fair amount of Youtube videos and I'm still stuck. I've had a shot of a video myself and basically set the camera up on my chest and hit record...then felt mightily unimpressed with the result - http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=U0HD5eTkdWY - the full thing is 42 minutes!

I need to have a plan for a shooting angle both on the bike/on me and I guess from the ground with me going by.

I'm not expecting to get this perfect first time out but can anyone share any hints/tips/advice?

I've read that filming in 1080 makes the rider ride faster than he actually was (going by my video I can confirm that - I'm nowhere near that fast!) - so I'm going to assume 720 gives a more realistic sense of speed.

For playback online is 1080 worth it? It appears to take up not quite twice the amount of space but given the quality of my riding/filming and presentation media, I suspect 720 would be fine, is that the case?

What about frame rate? I'm assuming the higher the better so would 60fps be best?

What about position of camera? On the chest it was very unobtrusive and seemed to work well but given the fact I'm got arms thinner than a strand of spaghetti, the footage makes me look like a very lanky streak of P - so what difference does a helmet-mounted camera make? If it is mounted on the bike, where is best? Seatpost is tempting as I'm guessing I could easily rotate it to also point backwards and catch the view looking backwards.

So I'm not expecting to be a pro at this but it will allow me to waste more time after biking instead of parenting but any advice would be appreciated, thanks.

Oh also, how does the music thing work? When uploading to YouTube can I ask for it to link to the tune to be downloaded or does YouTube do this automagically? Or does it get blocked instantly?

Anyone? I'm not looking to get more folk watching my video...it's utter mince, but shows the sort of 'starting point' to give an idea of how clueless I am...it's more info on the best settings for the camera...the HD stuff is no doubt brilliant but as the footage is going to be watched via YouTube then is 1080 the best setting for my videos?

Well - I ain't no magician / expert at all - I quite liked the vid but eh first part could have done with being broken up a bit more and its nice to have someone in shot ahead of you. Also a backwards pointing camera and someone behind you.

helmet mounted is good as well -

The bit I didn't like was the fish eye bit looking down as you went over ayres rock?

So - 3 mins or so max befoer I ge tbored, break up the shots a bit and cut out boring bits, use multiple camera angles adntry to get someone else in shot some of the time.

Dont really know anything sbout this kinda thing but have watched a lot of vids!
Some background noise would have been nice- tyres crunching on the gravel, that sort of thing..
Apart from that not too bad!
Edit- think the comment about having a rider in front is a good one..

720 + 30fps - quality still good and file sizes are significantly smaller (especially if videos are 40+ mins long). 60fps is better if wanting to use slo-mo. The sped up 1080 thing is probably down to how the footage was exported or where/how it was uploaded.

I'm not familiar with the mounting options on the Drift (use a gopro), but you'll have a rough idea of the positions you like form watching other vids - just take a day and try to mimic them or think of new ones. Watch your footage back, make any adjustments to the angles and try again. It's crap when you get home and realise the camera was too low/high.

edit: watched your movie (initially put off by the 42 minute thing ) - you can add your own song in most editing software - what did you use?

Thanks very much for the comments...the video I uploaded was all I had - I was billy nae mates and had no one else to film...I've read elsewhere that 1080 appears to speed up the ride...going by the footage, I'm not convinced I was going that fast so I think there is a degree of accuracy there - could be the fish-eye lens as well perhaps?

I'm expecting my next few attempts will be better...it was pure luck I got that angle on the chest mount but the beauty with the Drift is it has a screen that shows what it is filming so set up should be easier in that respect.

Not sure I'm ready to dabble with slow-mo yet so will leave that for later.

Thanks also for the suggestions on what would improve that actual video - it wasn't what I was after but it is all very useful...the backing track thing is more my 'worry' about getting it blocked due to some copyright issue so it is more how I work with the music and use it.

I think the Drift comes with some mounts to fit to the bike so I'll hopefully be capturing other riders in the shot which should make the footage a bit more entertaining...all comes down to the edit but thanks very much for the pointers...all will be put to good use.

I filmed the whole ride, so apart from editing out the fireroad section, I've got a movie of the entire red route at Laggan...which comes to 42 minutes - but I'm not planning on uploading that as even I get bored watching it!

Just one tip from me...you only need to record at 30fps, the human eye cannot perceive anything faster than that. The 60fps setting is so you can record at 60, import at 30 and get super smooth slowmotion without your editing software going bonkers and jerky or trying to make infill frames...just a tip.

I have to say that this kind of stuff is like looking at pictures of other peoples kids for me: pointless and tedious. If you edit it down more and have a bit more of the "action" in there, it could be good though.

As a side point though, what's the soundtrack? Sounds like Camera Obscura with american accents.

Here's my latest bike video: https://vimeo.com/39667530
That is like a million different angles but IMO is what keeps it interesting.

Generally speaking I would say though you don't need that many angles just never stay on one too long. Pick some music that fits the riding. While editing edit to the style of the music and riding. So fast gnarly riding pick some fast music and edit fast with loads of cuts... etc etc I'm really into drum and bass and would love to use some of my favorite tunes but it just won't go with my type of riding so I leave it alone and pick something that suites.

Generally you will get far better results on sunny days than cloudy days.

Try to tell a story. Have a bit of you getting to the trail, or maybe getting your pads on, or lubing your chain whatever it is it needs to tell people you are at the start of your ride. Then have a middle bit, where you are riding and "looking rad bro!", then have an end of the story where you "book end" the ride and have a beer, get in the car, whatever.

60fps is not just a difference for smooth slow mo. If you shoot at 30 fps on most "sports cams" that is giving you a shutter speed of 1/30th of a second. If you shoot at 60fps its giving you a shutter speed of 1/60th of a second. There is a debate that 1/30th can actually make you footage seem smoother as the more blury (technical term) each frame actually the smoothy the video looks. Kind of counter intuitive but that's the argument. On the flip side the rolling shutter effect is less noticeable at 1/60th of a second than 1/30th so filming at 60 fps can give you less rolling shutter. Google rolling shutter if you don't know what it means I cba to explain it now.

The reason that 1080p gives a different feel to 720p in terms of "speed" is that a lot of these cameras will have a different field of view with different resolutions. For example on the GoPro HD (what I use) the 720p setting has the full field of view where as the 1080p setting "sees" a more narrow view and is not as wide angled. In this case though the effect would be the reverse of what you say and 720p would seem quicker as there is "more stuff" passing through the screen in the same amount of time.

I always shoot in 720p unless I'm specifically not. 720p is my go to resolution as most people don't watch web video in full screen anyway and so there is really no point shooting any higher. In all honesty you could probably shoot in 640x480 in 4:3 and no one would give a shit.

If any of these 2 posts are a bit garbled then apologies I'm pretty pissed, specially for a school night.

I'm with Stevomcd - chest/headcam is pretty boring, it's only worth watching if you want to do a little trail research.

It's much more effort to set the camera up and ride past it but it makes for a much better film. Also it's all about the editing, anyone who makes videos / films will tell you that only a fraction of the footage makes it into the edit. Also it's more interesting if there is a personal element (eg short comments from riders, some panoramic shots etc) or some background scene setting.

Composite - so do you always use the 720 60fps on the gopro as your standard? I note you did for your posted film (which was ace btw). Then import and edit at 60fps? Interesting, I'll give it a go, I had always been told that was unnecessary but I do like the idea of reducing the rolling shutter effect.

I would also posit that a good mounting system is the most important aspect of creating a good 'moving' film. I find having a fixed 'constant' in the frame often helps - a bit of frame, part of a fork etc..

Convert the 60fps mp4 in to 60fps Apple Pro Res422 (a full frame format that can play natively in Final Cut Pro)

Then open the file in Cinema Tools and Conform it to 30fps. All this changes is the meta data that tells any players or editor software what the fps of the clip is. It doesn't actually change any of the frames.

Then pull it into a Final Cut Pro Sequence (or project) that is set to be 30fps at 720p. When you drop the clip onto the timeline it appears to be playing at half speed.

On the majority of clips I will then change the speed of its play back to 200% so it appears normal. Any thing I want in half speed slow mo I leave as is. Anything I want at 25% slow mo I reduce the play back speed to 50%. This still give pretty smooth slow mo in Final Cut Pro and is the equivalent of recording at 120fps

If you want to get super slow mo (equivalent to 1000fps) then you can either use a plugin like Twixtor or use Motion's Optical flow feature but mileage will vary depending on the exact footage.
If you have the latest version of iMovie (I don't) it has a feature for reducing rolling shutter. I have seen some demos of what it can do and was surprisingly impressed with actually how well it works.

I shot this in a couple of afternoons a year or so ago, on my own, just using a digital compact and a Gorillapod.

The quality is mince, the editing could be tighter, and my riding is pedestrian to say the least, but I think it gives you a much better idea of what the trail is actually like than a comparable headcam video (below).

Opinions are like what again I found all the faffing about and use of effects OTT on yours - 40 seconds into the film and no MTBing yet.

Perhaps 15seconds of faffage would have been enough? I do have a very low tolerance for faffage tho - not a critism - just an opinion. I don't want to see you sorting your camelback out.

I'm interested in this sort of feedback. The thing I'm trying to do with my videos now is to tell a story and to capture the feel of a ride. This really does emphasis the point about audience that was made by billysugger. I generally make this stuff because I enjoy documenting what I'm up to and really me in 10-20 years is the only intended audience (at the moment anyway). It's nice to share though and if people can be inspired/entertained in some way by videos the way I have been, then all the better. I'm surprised 40seconds would actually be long enough to cause someone to point it out but fair enough. If the title bit wasn't there it would only be something like 25secs faffage, which I guess may have been OK?

I'm interested in the point about to many effects as actually there is almost zero effects, only really the slight "film burn" bits on the section when I have the camera on the telescopic pole. The rest of it is pretty much all "creative cropping". Is this what went over board for you? To many different views? Personally I don't think I would ever do something in quite this style again. I think a couple of split screen shots can be cool but I certainly wouldn't use it as much as I have here.

Dave, much cheapness and the camera has a screen to ensure everything is framed.

I have done video editing at work so have an idea of what I'm doing there...but it is a very basic idea. Thanks for the feedback, all useful stuff.

As mentioned, the video I posted was my first and only had me to film so I'm agreeing about how dull it appears. Rear mounted sounds worth a shot and I'm not discounting mounting the camera somewhere and I ride past. I'm not a good rider, don't have any skills or tricks so the 'story' will primarily be me filming my riding...hopefully over time it will show progression.

Thanks for the suggestions, tips and the videos posted...all worth a watch, cheers.

TJ, I was going to edit it down but it is so boring just watching it myself is problematic. great idea, I'll use it as a learning piece, thanks.

No idea what the music is...YouTube offered me the ability to add a track and that was the only rock song...it might mention it lower down the page.

loved the soundtrack, very well matched to the vid. melodic and soulful, good beat

i also really like the split screen stuff, although i agree less would be more. totally see why you did it though as it takes practice to get it right! loved the transition at 1min too - looked slick.

again the multiple angles worked well but maybe a bit too many but again you need to experiment. one thing i definitely noticed while making my vid was the lack of viewpoints. if i'm going to make a "good " vid i'll have to put lots more thought into the camerawork than simply wearing the chest mount and riding around.

i've also noticed my chest footage can make people feel seasick move around far too much!