Primary Navigation

Re: : [wifdiscussion] Pact garrisons

Wait, the Italian units teleport because they re in German controlled hexes within 3 hexes of the Soviet border if/when they become at war with the USSR? That

Message 1 of 7
, Jul 1, 2010

0 Attachment

Wait, the Italian units teleport because they're in German controlled hexes
within 3 hexes of the Soviet border if/when they become at war with the
USSR? That doesn't sound right.

My understanding is that if Italian units are at any point at war with the
USSR and are in German controlled territory (assuming Germany/USSR are
neutral), they provide carte blanche for the Soviets to end the pact at
will, as a violation of the pact (having a belligerent nation near the
border). This also applies if Italian air units then attack (tactical or
strategic) the USSR, either taking off or landing into German controlled
hexes. Same deal for Germany if the Allies somehow contrive to have British
units (at war with Germany) near the border.

If Italian (at war with USSR) units are in hexes within an Italian
controlled Lithuania, there is no effect on garrison ratios or the
Nazi-Soviet pact. They are within Italian controlled territory, and provide
neither benefit to the Germans, nor provocation (per RAW) to the Soviets.
The impulse after a single Italian land/air unit moves into German
controlled territory within 3 hexes of the border, the Soviets can break the
pact with no US entry, and without actually declaring war on Germany. If
Italy is not at war with USSR, they can have units wherever they want, with
the understanding that, if the USSR declares war on Italy, they can
immediately break the Nazi-Soviet pact if any now belligerent Italian units
are in German-controlled hexes within 3 hexes of the German/Soviet border.

That's my understanding of the Nazi-Soviet pact, and non-aggression pacts in
general.

>
>
>
> If IT troops are within 3 hexes of the common border in German controlled
> hexes, and the USSR becomes at war with Italy while the N-S Pact is still in
> place, then the aforementioned Italian units teleport so that they are not
> within 3 hexes of the common border. If the IT troops are in an Italian
> controlled Lithuania, then there is no teleportation because the hexes are
> not German controlled.
>
> So, as you outline it the USSR cannot break the Pact because the IT units
> cannot approach the border.
>
> I agree that the IT units do not provide any garrison benefit.
>
> Steve B.
>

Wait, the Italian units teleport because they're in German controlled hexes
within 3 hexes of the Soviet border if/when they become at war with the
USSR? That doesn't sound right.

My understanding is that if Italian units are at any point at war with the
USSR and are in German controlled territory (assuming Germany/USSR are
neutral), they provide carte blanche for the Soviets to end the pact at
will, as a violation of the pact (having a belligerent nation near the
border). This also applies if Italian air units then attack (tactical or
strategic) the USSR, either taking off or landing into German controlled
hexes. Same deal for Germany if the Allies somehow contrive to have British
units (at war with Germany) near the border.

If Italian (at war with USSR) units are in hexes within an Italian
controlled Lithuania, there is no effect on garrison ratios or the
Nazi-Soviet pact. They are within Italian controlled territory, and provide
neither benefit to the Germans, nor provocation (per RAW) to the Soviets.
The impulse after a single Italian land/air unit moves into German
controlled territory within 3 hexes of the border, the Soviets can break the
pact with no US entry, and without actually declaring war on Germany. If
Italy is not at war with USSR, they can have units wherever they want, with
the understanding that, if the USSR declares war on Italy, they can
immediately break the Nazi-Soviet pact if any now belligerent Italian units
are in German-controlled hexes within 3 hexes of the German/Soviet border.

That's my understanding of the Nazi-Soviet pact, and non-aggression pacts in
general.

>
>
>
> If IT troops are within 3 hexes of the common border in German controlled
> hexes, and the USSR becomes at war with Italy while the N-S Pact is still in
> place, then the aforementioned Italian units teleport so that they are not
> within 3 hexes of the common border. If the IT troops are in an Italian
> controlled Lithuania, then there is no teleportation because the hexes are
> not German controlled.
>
> So, as you outline it the USSR cannot break the Pact because the IT units
> cannot approach the border.
>
> I agree that the IT units do not provide any garrison benefit.
>
> Steve B.
>

[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

lavisj

Mike here is the rule in question (on neutrality pact 9.5) Effect of neutrality pacts After you enter into a neutrality pact with a major power, units

Message 3 of 7
, Jul 1, 2010

0 Attachment

Mike here is the rule in question (on neutrality pact 9.5)

"Effect of neutrality pacts
After you enter into a neutrality pact with a major power, units controlled by other major powers on your side cannot enter hexes that are part of your common border with that major power if they are at war with that other major power. If they are in the common border already, move them immediately to the nearest friendly hex not in the common border in which they can legally stack.
"

Jerome

Your message has been successfully submitted and would be delivered to recipients shortly.