Tamia, in the area just before the pillar room is a NPC and near him is a chest which contains all kinds of spells including the four you need to lower the pillar. Make sure you have DAMAGE magica (not drain magica).

Now cast your distance spells from the corridor:1) fire2) frost

Then go up close to the pillar and touch the pillar while casting:3) damage magica4) fortify magica

Oldman, to change your fame/infamy ratings all you have to do is take off the cowl. You now have a dual personality. From now on do all your crimes while wearing the cowl and the Gray Fox part of you gets all the bounties. Take it off and you will be as pure as the driven snow. I've just let all my bounties accumulate under Gray Owl without paying any off since there is no point. You will always have a minimum of 500 bounty. You can still pray at altars without the cowl. Check that whitish box on p.183 of your SG.

Thanks guys! You were right. I looked closely at the discriptions and found what I needed in the chest. Then I touched the pillar. I wasn't doing that either. I'm currently in the depths of this haunted place. Now I'm finding plenty of ectoplasm!

Is anyone trying to be good here? I suddenly discovered I had a bounty of 40 and was horrified so I went back to a saved game. It seems I had struck a count- he got in the way! I haven't joined the theives guild yet or the brotherhood. That duel personality sounds pretty good, but I'll probably look in to the thieves guild when I'm further along. There is so much to do!

Oh, woe! I am well and truly trapped in the Dagon Shrine. I have killed almost everyone, but I need a key to get out and I can't find who has it! There are only about 4 little jittery acolytes hiding in a passage and in another save I had killed them but they didn't have it. I'm afraid this is a stuck spot for me. It surely is a long part of the game to replay the whole thing.

I'm doing the "Lifting the Veil" quest out of Bruma for the Countess to get the Draconian Madstone. I've made it all the way to the Pale Pass and fought my way through a bunch of trolls to the bottom. But I can't find the elven ruins! Can anyone point me in the right direction? When I go to the end of the valley I see some ruins near a frozen pond, but no entrance. The picture in the SG looks like there's an archway. I haven't seen it anywhere.

Jean, that is a difficult door to find. It does not look like those white pillars lying on the ground. It is actually a brown door with an arch and it is fairly well camouphlaged. If I remember correctly it is not near the centre pond. It is NW of it ... I think.

Peggy, I checked my SG and the only reference to keys is doorkeeper in the first level called Lake Arrius Cavern. If you are playng it safe you can give him the proper countersign and he will open the door for you, or, you can kill him and take the key. If you are in the Dagon Shrine level the exit is in the NE corner of the room. If you are in the Living Quarters level the exit is at the southern end. Hope that helps.

Oblivion improves on Morrowind insofar as it's far more difficult to kill someone you'll need for a quest later on simply by walking into the the wrong cave at the wrong time.

In Morrowind I squelched a couple of quests by doing just that - venturing into a cave, being attacked, and killing everything in sight. In Oblivion they've made it so that the characters you need aren't in the cave or ruin until you have the quest in your log. So you can explore caves and ruin to your heart's content in Oblivion. And so long as I have carrying capacity I will go in and explore just about any place that takes my fancy.

I did get out of the shrine using lockpick. Just kept reloading until I got it right. I missed the guy at the front gate, or the key at any rate. I killed my way through. Just couldn't get into pretending to be one of those guys!

Haven't played any yet so may give it an hour or so before bed. Nipomo, I go in if I am not in the midst of a quest. So some I have found but not explored which has created a bit of a problem because I should have marked (with a blue arrow) the ones I did complete so I don't keep going back to the same ones, or skipping some I have missed.

AARGH!! I returned to the game for a little play before bed and guess what? I am still stuck in the shrine. The lock I was so proud to have picked was on a hard chest and there I stood becoming more and more claustrophobic in these caves.

I went back to an old save and re-entered the Mystic Dawn area and replayed the entire shrine section but still have not found the key. Maybe tomorrow!! Or I'll just back out of this for now and wait til I'm a powerful enough mage to blast through that rock wall! (By the way, is there a secret to that,perhaps)? I am too weary to pursue that thought tonight.

PeggyH has mentioned placing a blue arrow on the map. Way back I did that by holding down left shift and clicking left mouse on the map. Would you believe it will not work that way now - in fact haven't been able to place a blue arrow for a loooong time.

Help appreciated please.

Alice - way behind everyone else, as usual.

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Angels are friends who lift you off your feet when your wings have forgotten how to fly.

I have spent two days looking for the secret to that blasted exit and suddenly found it by accident. What a ding-a-ling. My advice when looking for the exit from Dagon Shrine is slow down, keep your eyes open and use a torch!