Yeah, that article, while including the disclaimer "while we are no friends of the Iranian regime", includes lots of fun claims.

For example, they tout the Iranian's ability to keep the "glove-vanes" working "decades after the USN gave up due to excessive maintenance needs"... while ignoring that the USN simply said that the vanes provided virtually no actual benefit, and therefore didn't justify spending the money to keep them working. Thus, Iran is spending money just on a useless show item.

At the same time, those "amazing Iranian engineers" seem to have replaced the original retractable refueling probe with a fixed one... no mention of this "cost vs benefit" choice being a triumph of Iranian good sense.

The article claims they have "reverse-engineered" the AIM-54 Phoenix, and that it is still in service. However, the only recent photos of any missiles on the aircraft show what looks like AIM-7 Sparrows (there aren't even any photos showing empty AIM-54 belly "pallets".

“…Science as it is really practiced, caught up in the turmoil of personalities, with Truth always out of reach, and truths too often limping along, wounded in the turf wars and drive-bys of gangs of Ph.D.-totin’ grant-heads.”
Orson Scott Card: “Future on Ice”

I give them high marks for still having any flyable - which, so far as I am aware, they do have a few.

Whether they are anywhere near their original capability is another question. That I rather doubt.

The Iranians are very good at slapping new coats of paint on old equipment, taking them around the circuit and making rather grandiose claims about them.

"Do not blame Caesar, blame the people of Rome who have so enthusiastically acclaimed and adored him and rejoiced in their loss of freedom and danced in his path and given him triumphal processions. Blame the people who hail him when he speaks in the Forum of the new wonderful good society which shall now be Rome's, interpreted to mean more money, more ease, more security, and more living fatly at the expense of the industrious." --

Challenging but not miraculous, sources i have found state that the Iranians have 10 to 30 airframes available at any time, which is reasonable. The Iranians fired all there Phoenix in the iran-Iraq war, many at MiG-25 also tried to bring down Iraqi missiles. Saddam liked to fire a few at Terhan every day and swarms on special occasions.

They are still a wildcard. No one knows what other blackmarket technology they have integrated into them. Think of how many F-14 Tomcat experts became unemployed when the Navy retired them. I am sure for the right $$ expertise can be rented. Iran is not to be compared with some backwater Arab country like Saudi or Oman that does not have innate technical capabilities. Iranians are pretty clever people, and they have a very large pool of educated technical people. Plus add some Russian assistance (many say the SU-27 has some F-14 features) and you can do quite a bit. Who knows what turbine parts are manufactured under the guise or civil aircraft engines and end up in F-14's. I would not even put it past them to reverse engineer the AIM-54.. that would be a scary wildcard... imagine if Israel attacked and 30-40 F-14's launched waves of AIM-54's at them.. In either case I miss the F-14.. it is the only true Top Gun. A magnificent plane with no equal in capability today for long range interdiction (except the SU which also is huge and has similarly long legs)

Iran reverse engineered the F-5 (1960's light fighter) and is making a few. From the numbers I get the impression that they are hand making them one at a time. So I think its likely they have some F-14's in flying conditions but only with massive manhours on upkeep per hour in the air.

AegisFC wrote:AIM-54 is very obsolete by now. It was built to take otu Soviet bombers, not a dog fighting missile.
Seriously stop trolling.

It has pretty large control surfaces for a missile that was not designed to take on fighters... no it is not a dogfighting missile, it is probably the first BVR missile and is similar in capability to the new air breathing AAMs just arriving now like the Meteor, although it is much larger due to older tech. Bullets are pretty obsolete as well, but they sure can kill!!!

It has pretty large control surfaces for a missile that was not designed to take on fighters... no it is not a dogfighting missile, it is probably the first BVR missile and is similar in capability to the new air breathing AAMs just arriving now like the Meteor, although it is much larger due to older tech. Bullets are pretty obsolete as well, but they sure can kill!!!

Sometimes it is better to be silent and thought a fool, than to open your mouth and remove all doubt.

The operative question is this: do the Iranian Tomcats retain an *effective* BVR capability vs. US or Israeli aircraft, especially F-15s, that we need to worry about? Or in a hypothetical fight would they last no longer than the Iraqi air force did in '91?

"My political opinions lean more and more to Anarchy (philosophically understood, meaning abolition of control not whiskered men with bombs) … The most improper job of any man is bossing other men. Not one in a million is fit for it, and least of all those who seek the opportunity " -- JRR Tolkien

IcelofAngeln wrote:The operative question is this: do the Iranian Tomcats retain an *effective* BVR capability vs. US or Israeli aircraft, especially F-15s, that we need to worry about? Or in a hypothetical fight would they last no longer than the Iraqi air force did in '91?

The answer is a definite maybe. The Iranians seem to use the F-14 as a sort of AEW platform rather than a fighter. The WSO vectors their MiG-29s into position for the attack. We have to think that the MiGs have at least AA-10s and AA-11s. The AA-10s are very good missiles and even with the MiG-29s radar deficiencies they are a potent weapon. I would not completely discount the IRIAF on this. That's why Israel wants us in on the attack. They want B-2s or at least B-1s which are less vulnerable then their own F-15s.

It has pretty large control surfaces for a missile that was not designed to take on fighters... no it is not a dogfighting missile, it is probably the first BVR missile and is similar in capability to the new air breathing AAMs just arriving now like the Meteor, although it is much larger due to older tech. Bullets are pretty obsolete as well, but they sure can kill!!!

Sometimes it is better to be silent and thought a fool, than to open your mouth and remove all doubt.

You may think me a fool, but I think I know what everyone else that read your comment is thinking about YOU...lol (hint hint it starts with "A")

IcelofAngeln wrote:The operative question is this: do the Iranian Tomcats retain an *effective* BVR capability vs. US or Israeli aircraft, especially F-15s, that we need to worry about? Or in a hypothetical fight would they last no longer than the Iraqi air force did in '91?

The answer is a definite maybe. The Iranians seem to use the F-14 as a sort of AEW platform rather than a fighter. The WSO vectors their MiG-29s into position for the attack. We have to think that the MiGs have at least AA-10s and AA-11s. The AA-10s are very good missiles and even with the MiG-29s radar deficiencies they are a potent weapon. I would not completely discount the IRIAF on this. That's why Israel wants us in on the attack. They want B-2s or at least B-1s which are less vulnerable then their own F-15s.

Well done.. so many words to say "I have no idea but need to make myself sound more knowledgeable then I am"

mnztr: If you had any idea who you were talking to, you'd apologise PDQ. You've started an argument about the F-14 from someone who flew them. Pretty sure I know what we're all thinking, hint hint, it's about you and it's not flattering..

I did not start an argument. The AIM-54 was never used in combat as far as anyone can tell except by the Iranians.. and they used it against fighters and fighter bombers. So frankly even if this guy flew F-14's I don't think he has much actual real combat use experience of this weapons system for the reason that no one except the Iranians do. Perhaps if he flew F-14s for the Iranians against Iraq he could be entitled to his arrogant tone.

Here is an account of some Iranian/Iraqi engagements...they sound credible....and if you think missiles are only used for their specific envelope, I was told by a Canadian Forces officer they were trained to to Harpoon missiles for long range engagements against aircraft (longest range SAM they have is Sea Sparrow). The account includes use of the AIM-54 against a fighter at a range less then 10 miles.

It has pretty large control surfaces for a missile that was not designed to take on fighters... no it is not a dogfighting missile, it is probably the first BVR missile and is similar in capability to the new air breathing AAMs just arriving now like the Meteor, although it is much larger due to older tech. Bullets are pretty obsolete as well, but they sure can kill!!!

Sometimes it is better to be silent and thought a fool, than to open your mouth and remove all doubt.

You may think me a fool, but I think I know what everyone else that read your comment is thinking about YOU...lol (hint hint it starts with "A")

An experienced pilot with time in both the F4 and F14 ? Wabpilot's one of the good guys, he's good plenty of experience doing the stuff that counts.

The Iranians almost certainly don't have any working AIM-54 and the way we can tell that is because there are a number of shots of them flying around with a modified HAWK missile under a wing - there's no way you'd be hanging a 1960's circa SARH missile of an F14 if they had a supply of home built AIM-54's.

It's nice that they're still flying F14's but I'd be more impressed if they'd sourced some Su-27's to replace them by now.

No-one's taking any of the work that the Iranians have done lightly here, they've done well to keep anything in the air in the face of sanctions but a lot of the claims being made are simply unsupportable.